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Details on KISS OF THE DRAGON... Way Cool

Kung Fu... by SupremeON	Feb 11th, 2001 08:05:05 AM
Is becoming the centerpoint of AICN.
'cause Besson always makes the most phenomenal movies by JonQuixote	Feb 11th, 2001 08:05:57 AM
Like The Big Blue, and The Messenger.
wow, this does sound cool. by mcface	Feb 11th, 2001 08:06:01 AM
well, now I'm looking forward to this movie.
am i first? by indy4ever	Feb 11th, 2001 08:06:11 AM
jet lee is cool, anyway.
this site DOES pay too much attention to kung fu.... by BYOBkenobi	Feb 11th, 2001 09:22:07 AM
dont get me wrong, kung fu is cool, but these are movies that might not ever see a release domestically. they will get a video relaese, but most people forget about it before that time comes. i think this website needs a little restructuring. all the posts are just thrown on a main page with no direction, and i always end up clicking on something that is a bad read because of some fanboy drooling over the POSSIBILITIES in the movie. NOT what is scripted or filmed. is asking for some credibility too much?
Fingers cross for KOD by pinoy	Feb 11th, 2001 09:51:18 AM
Jet fighting 3 women... hmm very Jackie Chan fighting 3 women in Armour of God. Jet fighting 20 cops with batton... he did this before with My Father Is Hero.. hopefully they wont undercrank this movie like they did that. It seems like Jet is using old fight scenes from his films.. I hope I'm wrong because this is the reason why Jet Li films are so boring sometimes, you see the same fight scenes over and over again. Looking forward to KOD.. hopefully it wont be as disapointing as RMD.
Jet Li does kick ass.... but no one can beat the master by RoninKengo	Feb 11th, 2001 10:39:18 AM
I'm not denying Jet Li's martial arts skills... but no one will ever outdo Bruce Lee. It will be weird... a Hong Kong style action movie directed by a French dood. He is a good director, but I'm a little doubtful... oh well I'm sure it will be a cool movie... sounds cool. RoninKengo
you can never get too much kung fu by devil0509	Feb 11th, 2001 11:03:28 AM
Which is why the American action genre is just about dead. Bloated, slow white boys simply can't compete with the talent that Asia has released.
Well.... by iaido	Feb 11th, 2001 11:12:20 AM
i'm getting tierd of people continuing to say it a Luc Beson directed movie becasue its not. Besson produced the movie. Regardless, "European" and "kung fu", doesnt sit well with me. The two dont exactly go together very well, so i'm not getting my hopes up over a largely European produced, written, directed, and filmed kung fu movie.
"... but no one will ever outdo Bruce Lee" Er.....I'm SORRY??? by Sergio Kidmark	Feb 11th, 2001 11:25:46 AM
What ARE you talking about mate? No one will ever beat Bruce Lee? Have you SEEN any of Bruce Lee's movies recently? Or are you just arbitrarily mythologising Bruce Lee like everyone else does? Look - there is no doubt Bruce Lee was a master of martial arts....but please, anyone who is sitting there going 'Bruce Lee is the master'...go and watch Enter The Dragon, followed swiftly by Once upon a time in China (1,2 or 3)....or any other of Jet Li's movies to be honest. Jet PISSES on Bruce's abilities (and no, I'm not a Jet Li fanatic, I'm just not in denial)....yes, a lot of his work is wire assisted, but a lot is just Jet - and the guy can do things with his body (and weaponry) that old Bruce couldn't have dreamed of....STOP MYTHOLOGISING BRUCE LEE! He passed on his throne a LONG time ago.
THIS IS A HOLLYWOOD FILM. IT WILL BE RELEASED IN THE USA by Wesley Snipes	Feb 11th, 2001 12:21:17 PM
It was bankrolled by Fox. It is to be one of it's major summer "tentpole" films. July release. So Hollywood blockbuster + geek-out genre + cinema badass = Strong justification for AICN's continued coverage.
Oops by Wesley Snipes	Feb 11th, 2001 12:22:47 PM
My bad. It may have been bankrolled by Gaumont. But Fox is definitely distributing it in North America and has positioned it to be a big summer hit. Also, I used "it's" instead of "its". ;)
Donnie yen by CTHDowns	Feb 11th, 2001 12:49:45 PM
nuff said
This will kick much buttocks! by Psyclops	Feb 11th, 2001 02:01:03 PM
Besson rocks! 'The Professional' is still one of my favorite movies (nice animation, Harry!) so this is sure to kick ass! Hey Harry, review 'Hannibal' already!
Enter the Dragon sucked... by Jackass	Feb 11th, 2001 02:52:44 PM
I'm a huge kung fu fan and when I finally watched Dragon, I thought it was rather poor. The 70s look just didn't do it for me and the fights were rather bland. I just don't really like Lee's fighting style. Yes, he was a badass, but I didn't like his onscreen persona in this movie or any others. I, too, believe he has been glamourized as time has passed. I was weened on Jackie Chan and Jet Li so maybe that has something to do with it.
fighting cops with batons??? YES! by mooncake	Feb 11th, 2001 02:56:19 PM
oh i can't wait to see this movie! back to the old days of pure kinetic fighting scene's. i've had enough of those fancy smancy bullet time, ridiculous MTV style action scnene's. even bitches like in charlie's angels try to pretend they can do kung fu! no no i want to see some old fashioned, fluid kung fu fighting where people REALLY know how to do it instead of making mere poses! yes back to the good old days of FIST OF LEGEND. Kiss Of The Dragon might just be it! ^_^
This Movie Definitely Isn't Set In The Rampart Division of LA, I by Buzz Maverik	Feb 11th, 2001 04:14:17 PM
"Jesus, guys! That Chinese guy just kicked the shit out of 16 of our brother officers! Do you think we ought to also attack him with our sticks?" "Fuck no! Let's shoot his ass!" "I dunno. Seems pretty fast. Do you think he could dodge the rounds?" "With all four of us firing our automatics at once? Only if this is a fucking movie, man." BLAM! BLAM! BLAM! BLAM! "See! I was right. We should have shot him to begin with." "Okay, okay. I'll get the plant gun." "Hey, I heard this dead clown got into a fight with three women." "Big deal. If he'd got into bed with three women I'd be impressed." "You hungry? They just opened a new Krispy Kreme down the street."
With one exception, Buzz. . . by doubledowndick	Feb 11th, 2001 04:38:16 PM
Do you really think that L.A. cops would not know that a new Krispy Kreme opened down the street?
About Bruce Lee... by crimsonrage	Feb 11th, 2001 07:22:52 PM
...to say that Jet Li is a better fighter than Bruce Lee based upon their movies is ridiculous. If Bruce Lee had worked in the biz' longer, with better fight choreographers and such, I'm sure he would dazzle us with his physical prowess. Just remember that it is a movie, and doesn't necessarily reflect the fighter's ability to the full extent.
Yuen Kwai by Fat Paul	Feb 11th, 2001 07:31:11 PM
Corey Yuen just plain isn't very good. Not that he's exactly bad at what he does, it's just that he's involved in REAL BAD movies. Especially with Jet Li. Every bad Jet Li movie I've seen was a Yuen Kwai picture. Fong Sai Yuk, Bodyguard from Beijing, Romeo Must Die... bad, bad, bad.
Yuen Kwai not that bad by Wesley Snipes	Feb 11th, 2001 08:56:28 PM
Fong Sai Yuk is actually considered one of Jet's best. It's hilarious and has some decent fights. I agree though - many of Yuen Kwai's films suck. Enter the Eagles is a recent stinker. In particular, he's not the best choreographer in the world especially when it comes to hand-to-hand fighting with no obvious wire-assisted flying. But on occasion he has some nice moments... High Risk, Eastern Condors, Righting Wrongs.
You Wanna Fight!? Fight Me!! by solstiss	Feb 12th, 2001 02:56:48 AM
Martial arts is dominating Hollywood action movies. It seems US film-makers have finally caught on to the sheer kinetic thrill of hand-to-hand combat. Let's face it, some of the best Hollywood action films of recent years would have been nothing without the martial arts/asian influence: Face/Off, The Matrix, Charlies Angels (the kung fu saved that picture, man)... And surely the world knows by now that the entire Star Wars storyline is nothing more than a traditional asian martial arts tale dressed up with lasers and spaceships?
Bruce Lee/Jet Li by Siu-Loong	Feb 12th, 2001 08:22:54 AM
To the uninformed.. Jet Li's films like Once Upon a Time In China and Fist of Legend make extremely liberal use of performance enhancers such as under-cranking and wire-work. In fact that scene in Romeo Must Die where Jet flies around the warehouse kicking everyone is damn embarrassing. One thing that so many people still love about Bruce Lee is that he kept the fakery to a minimum, and there would've been none at all were it up to him. Bruce Lee could DO waht he said he could. ANYONE can look passable with the right special effects. Look at Michelle Yeoh and Chow Yun Fat- They know dick about martial arts aside from what they've learned on a movie set.
Don't Diss Michelle Yeoh and CYF by solstiss	Feb 12th, 2001 10:03:14 AM
They are not true martial artists - they are ACTORS. Bruce Lee was a great fighter - a master no less - but he was a SHIT actor and that's the truth. Michelle Yeoh trained for 5 months to get those moves down for Crouching Tiger. She could kick your puny ass into the middle of the next century.
Ass-kicking.. by Siu-Loong	Feb 12th, 2001 01:44:46 PM
Since you need to get insulting Soltiss, I could nail you, Michelle Yeoh AND Chow Yun Fat to the wall at once. I'd be happy to give you all of the info you need to contact me and prove this. Michelle Yeoh has gone on record stating that she is not a true martial artist. It's only the jerk-off fans that want to make something of her that she's not. As for acting, Lee was better and far more dynamic than Anyone you can name in the Hong Kong action genre. Contact me by e-mail if you want to continue this any further.
Jet Li kicking Pascal Gentil's arse??? by Ashen Shugar	Feb 12th, 2001 01:58:38 PM
Pascal gentil is Tae Kwon do world champion and (only, but because of the referee...) bronze medal at the last olympics : He's a 2 meters tall black guy who would in the real world beat Jet Li's little ass in 2 secs. No comment about realism in kung fu movies!
real or not real by IronRabbit	Feb 12th, 2001 02:42:35 PM
Poison Ivy hints at an important point. Movies are all fantasy. wirework or not, they are choreographed. Of course people will always argue about who would win a real fight between Jet Li and Jackie Chan or Donnie Yen or Bruce Lee. But it doesn't really matter as far as the movie is concerned. "Is Fist of Legend better than Enter the Dragon?" is a better question. Steven Segal might actually be a good fighter, for all we know. Jiu Jitsu seems to be the most effective style in full-contact competitions. But Steven Segal's movies suck because 1. He's a bad actor. and 2. Akido and Jiu Jitsu are boring to watch when compared to Kung Fu. Chow Yun Fat may not be able to beat Jet Li in a real fight, but he is always so cool, and he was convincing as a master fencer in CTHD. Does real martial arts mastery mean you will make a great action movie? No, but it helps.
Bruce Lee Acting by IronRabbit	Feb 12th, 2001 03:07:33 PM
Siu-Loong, I have to disagree. Bruce Lee was not a better actor than Chow Yun Fat. It's not that Bruce acted poorly, but can you imagine him doing The King and I well?
Chow Yun Fat vs Bruce Lee Acting Wise by Cinemama	Feb 12th, 2001 03:40:47 PM
1st off, as far as I know, CTHD was only CYF's 2nd martial arts role, the other being in The Postman Strikes Back. He's known as a master movie gunman. 2ndly, Bruce Lee might have done OK in Anna and the King but I don't think he could have managed the goofy comedic roles Chow has done or even the more dramatic roles. In Prison on File 2, I cried when Chow's mother died and she wasn't even in the movie! He was just so sad.
I agree, Cinemama by IronRabbit	Feb 12th, 2001 04:00:33 PM
Comparing Bruce Lee and Chow Yun Fat is sort of an apples vs. oranges comparison. But Siu-Loong's statement was "As for acting, Lee was better and far more dynamic than Anyone you can name in the Hong Kong action genre." And that is just wrong. You are right, maybe Bruce Lee could have done okay with The King and I, I'm sorry we will never know, but I don't believe that he could have done it as well as Chow Yun Fat did. Chow Yun Fat has range, he has presence, he is dynamic, and he is cool. He is a better actor then Bruce Lee was.
Jet and Bruce by Saraputra	Feb 12th, 2001 04:26:57 PM
Bruce was always stripped to the waist...notice Jet Li never takes off his shirt anymore?
Bruce vs Chow.. by Siu-Loong	Feb 12th, 2001 04:48:18 PM
Folks you really need to rise above these bs pop-culture boxes that people are fit into. Chow Yun Fat is good. But he plays the same role in every film. Bruce in his 4.5 films approached each of those limited roles differently. I'm curious as to just what it is you guys have seen Chow do that you're convinced that Bruce couldn't had he lived. I'll bet you guys also wouldn't have figured Jerry Lewis capable of his performance in The King of Comedy either.
huh? by IronRabbit	Feb 12th, 2001 05:12:07 PM
Which word didn't you understand? I'm not sterotyping anyone. And don't assume you know what I think of Jerry Lewis either.
Exactly... Huh? by Siu-Loong	Feb 12th, 2001 05:39:25 PM
Did I single you out, Iron Rabbit? Apparently you didn't understand what I said..
folks by IronRabbit	Feb 12th, 2001 06:02:21 PM
There are only 2 of us saying Chow is a better actor. So when you address "folks" you indicate you are talking to both of us. We were both pretty clear as to what we thought Bruce was not capable of doing as well as Chow has done. Cinemama said comedy and conveying sadness (my paraphrase.) I said the role of the King of Siam in The King and I (a.k.a Anna and the King) as one example. You accuse us of putting Bruce in a box. I say you are full of beans.
more on the Lee/Li deal by onemonkdown	Feb 12th, 2001 06:12:01 PM
I thought I'd step in and fan the flames of the Bruce Lee vs. Jet Li situation. The fact is that Bruce Lee worked under primitive conditions. He didn't have the fancy cinematography or MTV-style film editing that modern movies have, so of course his films aren't going to look as flashy as modern HK films. But as for Bruce's abilities vs. Jet's, this is easily solved. There is a scene in Way of the Dragon in which Bruce jumps straight up into the air and kicks out an overhead light. He does this without a trampoline or cables. He just jumps up and does it. I doubt that Jet could do this without a stuntman, cables, and a few computer special effects in post-production. Keep in mind that Jet used stunt doubles extensively throughout his run as Wong Fei Hung in the Once Upon a Time in China series. Matter of fact, the guy who played Cub Foot in OUTIC 3 WAS Jet's stunt double. And as for saying that Bruce Lee couldn't act, I have to bring up Way of the Dragon again. In this film Bruce proves that he is capable of playing more than a badass with a sneer. I am sure that given time he would have broadened his roles. I have a lot of respect and admiration for Jet Li and Jackie Chan, and all the modern guys - I pretty much like all of HK's kung fu movies, because they all have something to offer. But dissing Bruce Lee is just wrong. Without him I doubt this forum would even be discussing a kung-fu movie, because they probably would never have gotten mainstream appeal in the US.
Chow plays "the same guy?" by Dagan	Feb 12th, 2001 07:51:36 PM
Anybody who says this has obviously only seen a handful of Chow Yun-Fat movies. The guy has done everything from the reserved, zen martial artist in CTHD to outlandishly energetic comedy riffs. And even in the more well-known films in the west, the John Woo stuff, his roles are very different - is he at all the same in Once a Thief as he is in The Killer? Regardless, Chow Yun-Fat is a STAR - a movie star leading man... The thing about stars of that type, is that their personalities are so strong that the audience just wants to see THEM. A star gets people used to the habit of seeing THEM perform, and because of their strong leading man star quality they come through every time - but that's exactly what the audience wants, and that's exactly why they are stars. Think Bogart, Grant, Jimmy Stewart... Those guys were "the same" even in widely varied roles... They were "the same" because you were always conscious of them in the parts. Chow Yun-Fat is definitely in that mold. A pure star.
Bruce vs. Jet - missing the point... by Dagan	Feb 12th, 2001 08:03:34 PM
I'm a big fan of both, but I think many here are missing the point in the discussion... To me, the point is this - I don't care who would win in a "real" fight. Movies ARE fantasy, and what matters is the MOVIE you see onscreen, not any "real life" stuff. So, for WHATEVER reasons, Jet Li has made FAR better films than Bruce. And that's the point. Yes, Bruce worked in a different time, with limited special effects, etc. But none of that matters - physicality isn't the issue, the issue is: How good is the movie? First off, OUATIC is far and a away better than anything Bruce ever did on every level. Enter the Dragon is defitely Bruce's best film, and it's great fun... But let's be honest. It's an okay story with a great score, bad acting and fight scenes that don't stand up. When I say bad acting that's not a slam - the acting in the film is part of its cheesy charm, but neither story nor acting nor directing are anything special in Enter the Dragon - there's plenty of films out there with as much "charm" in those departments. What's left are the fight scenes, which were revolutionary in their day, but today are pretty lame. Be honest - if Jet Li came out today with a movie that had the exact same fights from Enter the Dragon everybody would be talking how awful the fight scenes were compared to his other work. It just doesn't hold up anymore. Eighty percent of the fight scenes in Enter the Dragon are simply Bruce Lee doing a high kick or face punch and knocking a guy out in one blow, then doing the same to the next guy, then the next, etc. All coming at him one at a time, he hits them in a very standard way, they fall... Yawn. Maybe it's more "realistic" but who cares? It's nothing compared to today's standards. Jackie's fight scenes blow his off the screen - take your pic for style - hyper-intense and realistic or farcical and prop-heavy, Jackie's done them all, and all better than Bruce. Jet has done fantasy stuff that blows Bruce away, too. Choreography is much more complex, as are moves, combinations, etc. And most of the time people don't attack one at a time, like in Jackie's movies, where the choreography is so ingenious that even though it's often totally fantastical he still somehow makes it flow "logically". Sorry, but Jackie and Jet have outclassed Bruce in the fight scene department a trillion times over, and anybody who can't admit that is just hanging on. Whatever the reasons - it doesn't matter, because in the end it's what happens on screen that counts. Whoever would win in real life doesn't matter, either. And if Bruce had made movies that had great directing, acting and plotting that'd be different, because you could argue the films were better than today for that reason... But he didn't. Both Jet and Jackie have outclassed him in that department many times, too(especially Jet with the OUATIC series). So what do you have with Bruce's best film? A cheesy fun ride with outdated fight scenes - without Bruce's spectacular charisma, there wouldn't be much point in watching it today really. You can argue that Bruce has more charisma than the other two, but that alone doesn't justify an argument that his movies are better, or that he's still "the master of kung fu films"... Because he's not - not with story, not with acting, and definitely not with fight scenes. Show anybody who's never seen a martial arts film - somebody who knows nothing about Bruce or anybody else... Show them a clip of a Jackie fight and one of a Bruce fight... Which one do you honestly think they'd say was better? Of course, they'd say Jackie's was far and a way better. Any honest Kung Fu fan should just fess up and admit it.
Bruce vs Jet the sequel by onemonkdown	Feb 12th, 2001 08:52:54 PM
Dagan, your points are well-taken. Bruce's movies can't compete with Jet and Jackie's modern ones. That's what I meant when I said Bruce was working under primitive conditions. Hong Kong filmmaking at the time was nothing like it is now. How do you think Jackie and Jet's movies would look, if they had been made back then? I mean, look at Jackie's first films. They're horrible! But given time and the evolution of HK filmmaking - an evolution that Bruce Lee wasn't there for - Jackie was able to make much better movies. And I agree, it's irrelevant who would be the better fighter in "real life." The fact is, Bruce Lee somehow encaspulated an almost mythic vibe - he has affected and inspired more people in the West than Jackie or Jet ever will. This is why Bruce is still considered the "Master of Kung Fu Movies" in the West, and probably always will be. Because he was at the right place at the right time, had the right looks, had the right style. He was also in the perfect place to launch a career in Hollywood - not having to overcome the stumbling block of not being able to speak English. Jackie and Jet might be famous, but Bruce is legendary. Surely this is because he died young, before anyone could see him slow down, but the fact remains. It's like Jimi Hendrix compared to modern guitarists - in the minds of most rock fans, no one will ever compare. Just take a look at such books as the Tao of Bruce Lee, to see the effect he has had on people, an effect that Jackie or Jet have yet to have on the American conscious. Don't get me wrong, though. I love Jackie, and I love Jet. And yes, their movies are better than Bruce's, because they had more money and more possibilities. Because they had knowledgeable, experienced people working on them. Bruce didn't have this. Before he made his films, Jimmy Wang Yu kung-fu movies were the rage in Hong Kong, and take one look at the choreography in those and match that up against Bruce's - you'll see what he gave kung fu films. That's all I'm saying.
One more thing.... by onemonkdown	Feb 12th, 2001 09:09:19 PM
I forgot to mention in my last post that mostly I was talking about Bruce's HK films. Enter the Dragon, of course, was Hollywood funded and had a bigger (though not that large) budget than any film Bruce had ever done. However, it had an American director who botched most of the fight scenes - this is why Enter was never as popular in Asia as it is in the States. And yeah, the writing and acting in it leave a lot to be desired. It doesn't help matters that Bruce disappears for a good portion of the film, once John Saxon's character is introduced. But most Bruce Lee fans (myself included) consider Way of the Dragon to be Bruce's best movie, anyway. You should judge him by that one, because he wrote it and directed it. Game of Death (Bruce's version, not the piss-poor fiasco that was released after his death) promised to be his best. A Bruce documentary will be released in either April or August called Warrior's Journey which will include for the first time ever 30 minutes of footage that Bruce filmed for Game of Death. Only 10 minutes of this footage was used in the 1978 Game of Death, and from the pics I've seen of this footage, it looks to be great.
Clint Eastwood Could Take by Buzz Maverik	Feb 12th, 2001 11:45:03 PM

Now, That Was Surreal. I Was Gonna Type "Clint Eastwood Could Ta by Buzz Maverik	Feb 12th, 2001 11:47:42 PM
How could Clint take these guys? Guns. I'm talkin' guns! And if he ran out of ammo or got disarmed, he'd take 'em by kicking their asses!
boxes.. by Siu-Loong	Feb 13th, 2001 02:49:30 AM
Okay Iron Rabbit, NOW I'm singling you out. You say Bruce couldn't have done The King of Siam, then in the next sentence you say you're not putting him in a box. Well, by saying this you DID put him in a box. Besides all of this, I have seen every actor that took on this "challenging" role, from Rex Harrison to Yul Brynner (AMC just showed the movie on Saturday) to Chow, and I'll tell you- It's not a very difficult role. Hell, I could play the King of Siam. But check out Bruce Lee in "Longstreet" or the interview that he shot with Pierre Burton back in 1971 for that matter. He could've easily done The King of Siam. Here's another point for you to ponder. The reason I say that Bruce Lee was a great actor is that he took four essentially non-existant roles and made them into classics which people still love nearly thirty years later. These powerful roles you so love Chow Yun Fat in were MADE to be such. The directors he's worked with thrive on creating these Big characters. Lee's directors were only interested in making movies with as much fighting as possible. I wonder how Chow would've done if given not a script to work with, but merely a vague outline as was Lee. As for fight sequences I'll say what I said to someone else yesterday: It all depends on what you like. Sure, I watch Jet Li's films and enjoy them. Jackie Chan rarely actually fights in his films these days, but they are still sort of fun. But they are really just eye-candy. I have alot of trouble believing two guys who are flying around on wires and taking alot of self-conscious poses are really trying to kill each other. Bruce Lee vs. Chuck Norris- Bruce Lee vs. Kareem Abdul Jabbar- those guys looked like they were really trying to kill each other. And to the one who said Bruce Lee's fights consist of the same movements- if you mean in that he punches with his hands and kicks with his feet, yeah- Bruce and everyone else does that. But if actually look at the fight scenes -for example the dungeon scene in Enter The Dragon he doesn't repeat the same techniques over and over. He does something different to each new opponent. If you mean that the fights were somewhat easy for him-They WERE that easy. In fact, in real life he could beat those guys even easier than in the freakin' movies! Andmind you severalof them proved this point on the set. One guy ended up with shattered ribs within seconds. Finally, when I refer to this stuff as pop-culture bs I mean that it's "hip" to think that so many of these HK films are some sort of high-art. I saw this film "Fearless Fighters" that Harry was so enthralled over years back, and all I can say is that my friends and I were laughing all the way through that overblown piece of sh*t. And not laughing WITH the movie either.
OK I may have come across a little harsh there. by solstiss	Feb 13th, 2001 02:53:21 AM
Basically all I
Clint Eastwood Is 118 Years Old. Which Proves How Tough He Is. by Buzz Maverik	Feb 13th, 2001 11:28:47 AM
Clint is so old that when he was born kung fu hadn't even been invented yet. The amazing thing is, he can still take these guys.
Clint Eastwood Is 118 Years Old. Which Proves How Tough He Is. by Buzz Maverik	Feb 13th, 2001 11:30:20 AM
Clint is so old that when he was born kung fu hadn't even been invented yet. The amazing thing is, he can still take these guys.
Clint Eastwood Is So Tough That When You Try To Tell People How by Buzz Maverik	Feb 13th, 2001 11:43:49 AM

Jet : the best in the biz! by Jac-MovieBuff	Feb 13th, 2001 12:04:23 PM
After reading several comments about this whole Jel Li vs. Bruce Lee vs. Chow vs. Clint (???, allow me to add to the discussion...because I just can't frickin' resist! Dagan is 110% correct in his comparison between Lee and Li, and about Chow and about Jackie. Listen to what he says folks! It's dead-on accurate! And about the whole Clint Eastwood thing (sigh), look I love the guy too, but let's mix him into the discussion of asian martial artists. He's arguably the face most associated with the word "tough", and anybody disagreeing with that better go watch "The Unforgiven" again! Nonetheless, if you want to discuss Clint in this context, compare and contrast him to Chow! At least they have something in common (i.e. guns, violence, etc.) within their respective film careers. But I digress, back to Jet. Flat out, he's the best in the business of making killer martial arts movies. In every interview, every conversation, the man is an impeccable professional. He looks at his movies as a way to open the world up to martial arts and, in turn, help to preserve the art form. FYI, I highly recommend his official website (he even answers fanmail there!). That's all for now!
Oh, is THAT what you call it? by Siu-Loong	Feb 13th, 2001 05:42:20 PM
Martial arts? So- should people just buy the wires and train themselves at home, or does Jet supply proper instruction on his website? Jet's form of martial art, Wu-Shu(at least as he practiced it) is more performance art than self-defense, as at the time, Mao had out-lawed any true martial art training in Mainland China, because he saw it as a religious practice. Jet IS talented. But martial arts in films does not begin or end with him. Every time I see one of his films, I know it could be done better. And Dagan doesn't know jacksh*t about martial arts or films if all he can appreciate is Jet Li with his special effects team behind him. And niether do you. It's like saying that a woman can only be beautiful if she's blonde and has the required amount of silicon in her breasts.
Jet /Bruce/Clint............. by Aqua	Feb 13th, 2001 06:50:33 PM
Bruce Lee was a legend in his own time, what he started is now being continued with style and panache, using techniques that were not around in Bruce's day. Jet Li does have something that Bruce did not, he has grace and fluidity combined with speed, perhaps because Wushu is a "performance art" it needs to be visually pleasing. To say it is not used for self defence is misleading, fighting is what it was originally intended for, and I think Jet demonstrates that fact. As for Clint we all know he can beat anyone, he only needs the words "Are you feeling lucky punk".
Enough.. by Siu-Loong	Feb 13th, 2001 07:59:26 PM
I suppose I could sit here for the rest of my natural life replying everytime a new person comes along and shows just how little they know about martial arts. I guess we can thank Jet & Jackie for all of the misrepresentation Kung-Fu has received. What Jet Li does is in no way "new" techniques that weren't around when Bruce Lee was alive. Bruce Lee knew them himself. He just didn't take them seriously. The fact of the matter is that Chinese Kung-fu (Or Wu-Shu) is many centuries old, and what Jet does is,in fact pretty damn ancient. But- the Chinese Wu-Shu association diluted it to focus less on the fighting techniques (As well asthemore spiritual aspects) and more of the performance techniques so that it would be 1. Easier to learn- 2. Easier to understand by the uneducated viewer. & 3. Wouldn't defy Mao's laws against religious practice, which is what Martial art becomes for the serious practioner. It's not at all misleading to say that it isn't really fighting technique- It's dead on accurate. A Shaolin Priest (A real one, not one of these performers in robes that tour the world these days)once said as much after watching Jet Li and his then teammates in action. Can Jet fight? Probably so- but what he does on film is not fighting technique, and he'd be crushed by any real fighter if he tried to use them.
Bruce vs Li debate!! . I can't resist joining in! by shoryuken	Feb 14th, 2001 09:53:10 AM
Bruce has his appeal. Li has his appeal. Siu Long, I will have to agree with you more though, being an avid martial arts practitioner. Anywayz, Bruce, from my opinion, has tremendous acting ability. He full of dynamic personality, and always makes a presence. To me, that is the way I see it, but others may see more in Li, things that I don't see. So, I guess just a matter of opinion. Except the guy above Siu Long said that Jet is faster and more graceful than Lee. To that guy, I have to say he is an idiot. He better watch those movies again and get the facts straight. Although Jet is fast and graceful, Bruce's moves, maybe simple, but way way more graceful and fast Jet. The movies, same thing, Bruce's movies has a certain appeal to some, like me and not to others. While jet captured the audience with super fancy beautiful moves. And the flying around and fighting with such fancy moves, is almost fighting ballet, is much essense with chinese martial arts legends and culture. In that, it is truly wonderful. However, in the world of martial arts, if you care about this part,...Bruce Lee would have beaten the CRaP out of Jet Li in no less than a minute. probably more like half a minute. Bruce, revolutionalized martial arts. He did not waste time, and went straight to the heart of martial arts in his philosphies. If you have read up on his martial art philosphies, you would really have an appreciation for him. he was way, way ahead of his time. He did REAL martial arts. That may be where he lost appeal to some of Jet's audience. He was too real in the movies, maybe? In real life, he was even more real. He looked at a situation and didn't look at what was the BEST LOOKING way to beat an opponent, he looked at WHAT WAS THE QUICKEST WAY, AND SURE TO WORK. Bruce Lee was the biggest martial art addict, training almost 24 hours a day, and trained for real situations all the time. He lived, breathed, and ate martial arts. Jet, however, I know almost nothing of his fighting ability in real life. No tournaments or competitions, or streetfights or anything...so I cannot say anything about his true fighting ability, cuz i don't know anythin on it.
Also.... by shoryuken	Feb 14th, 2001 10:00:32 AM
If you gonna argue against my above post about Jet Li vs. Bruce Lee in martial arts...don't even mention Jet's training in that dancing Wu Shu stuff.
Stop! by illusion blossom	Apr 24th, 2001 03:25:59 PM
All of you people, stop fighting and arguing on who is the best. It doesn't matter at all. If someone says that Bruce Lee, Jackie Chen or anybody sucks, it doesn't matter. It is the opinion of that person. Just ignore them, if they say Bruce Lee suck, so what! If they said that Jet li is a crappy martial artist it doesn't really matter! So stop fighting.
Why discuss all these? by denghao	May 4th, 2001 01:06:08 AM
I think all the martial arts movie are produced through sheer hardwork, and since I had been following Jet Li's movie so many years ago, I think he is a dedicated actor and also since some people here kept saying about Jet relying on all those wires and special effects crew, think again... maybe you all should watch his first few movies...all are free from special effects and plain kick-ass kung fu--and THAT was when he was 17 ... I suggest that for those who wants to comment on Jet Li's martial arts abilities, just go to his official homepage at jetli.com and see what he has achieved throughout his life as a martial artist, THEN see what you can say about this great guy!

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