Ain't It Cool News: The best in movie, TV, DVD, and comic book news.

AICN COMICS SHOOT THE MESSENGER: Q&@ w R.E.B.E.L.S.' Tony Bedard! Spinner Rack previews GLC & HAVOC BRIGADE!

first ! by theplant	Jan 12th, 2009 07:41:17 AM
hahaha
2nd ! by theplant	Jan 12th, 2009 07:41:43 AM
WOAHHHAHAHAHAHA
DAMN you McG by theplant	Jan 12th, 2009 07:42:18 AM
YOU FUCKED UP THE TERMINATOR FRANCHISE WITH THAT RAP SONG
deal wid it cate blanchett by crazybubba	Jan 12th, 2009 07:58:48 AM

R.E.B.E.L.S.? by Rex Carsalot	Jan 12th, 2009 08:51:56 AM
The guy writing this sounds like a giant tool. And I guess with all of DC's energy going towards Green Lantern these days, they couldn't have just done a good L.E.G.I.O.N. title instead.
... by blackthought	Jan 12th, 2009 09:11:31 AM
that is some good art i tell ya.
Did R.E.B.E.L.S. issue #1 come out yet? by Squashua	Jan 12th, 2009 09:54:48 AM
And I missed it?
I don't know... by wampa 1	Jan 12th, 2009 10:02:49 AM
...but it sure smells good!
Wow, another ruthless neo-nazi anti-hero by Snookeroo	Jan 12th, 2009 11:36:54 AM
You never see those in a comic book these days.
Well, at least the characters aren't just striking a pose by Snookeroo	Jan 12th, 2009 11:39:31 AM
on the cover. Whoops.
green lantern corp. by sonnyhooper	Jan 12th, 2009 06:06:12 PM
couple of things. 1) kryb is the creepiest villain in the DCU, bar none. ....and.... 2) i like kyle better than hal.....even though i know i'm not supposed to, i can't help it. the kid has personality.
Actually, I think that Kryb is the SECOND..... by archer1949	Jan 12th, 2009 07:41:23 PM
creepiest. The creepiest is Junior from Secret Six. I agree with you on Kyle vs. Hal, though.
Disagree about Kyle vs. Hal by Continentalop	Jan 12th, 2009 07:54:09 PM
To me Hal has personality. You might not like his personality, but it represents people who are members of elite groups, like SWAT teams, Fireman, SAS, Navy Seal, Special Forces or even Air Force pilots. People who have to EARN their position. Kyle is just an annoying kid representing comic book fans. He was just some kid who was in lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time. He is the comic book equivalent of a lazy kid finding a Air Force Pilot uniform and being allowed to fly an F-16. Not a very good idea.
Kyle is the single best Green Lantern ever. by SleazyG.	Jan 12th, 2009 09:17:48 PM
He's the only one ever to have a well thought out arc from beginning to end, but they've been flailing a bit the last couple of years. Did he start out as a nobody, a half-assed kid who lucked into it and had no idea what he was doing? You bet. But then they spent several years gradually having him learn from his mistakes, change as a person, improve as a Lantern, and grow into a talented, experienced man. He became something much greater than he once was as a result of a believable, organic process. Additionally, his background in comics and graphic arts meant he tended to come up with far more interesting and unusual ring constructs than we were used to. Meanwhile, every other GL ever has remained absolutley static. Hal? Sure, they tried to change him--but every single change was idiotic and worse than the next, until they had to just hit a giant reset button. But now? Sure, Hal's finally starting to learn...a little...but really, he's the same character he's always been. So's John Stewart, and so's Guy Gardner (again, lots of changes followed by a reset). All the other Lanterns are allowed some slight, gradual growth, but nobody's ever had the depth of character and consistent development Kyle has had. Which is why the way they've been spinning their wheels the last coupla years is kind of a bummer: he's Ion, but then he's not, and then he's on some space odyssey, and then he's not, but Kyle's just not getting the attention he deserves lately.
don't get me wrong... by sonnyhooper	Jan 12th, 2009 10:08:41 PM
....i still like hal and i think he has personality. i just like kyle a little bit better. and pretty much for the reasons sleazy outlined. of course, i never read kyle in his own book so maybe that has something to do with it. kyles character development in JLA was just masterfully done by morrison (and later by waid and joe kelly) imo.
Kyle might be a good "character"... by Continentalop	Jan 12th, 2009 11:18:57 PM
...It’s just that he isn't a good Green Lantern. Or I should say, his character doesn't fit that of a Green Lantern. He is the same character as a Spider-Man, Human Torch, Flash (Wally West), Nova, Firestorm, the New Blue Beetle, or pretty any young superhero. He’s a young person who gets powers and learns how to use them, as well as learns the great responsibility of being a hero. That is why Raynor does nothing or me; I’ve seen his character arc before, again and again whenever some young man gets powers. It’s Spider-Man all over again – a metaphor for the Everyman getting powers, wish fulfillment for those who feel weak and helpless. Hal Jordan’s Green Lantern is a different type of wish fulfillment. Instead of being weak and helpless and somehow magically given powers, it is that we are someone strong, smart and/or tough enough to earn or win them on our own instead of being given them. It is the same type of fantasy that Batman, James Bond, John Wayne and Clint Eastwood represent. Plus, what is wrong if Hal is “static”? He isn’t a newcomer or inexperienced person to the game of super heroics but an established pro. We expect green rookies in the NFL to be nervous and awestruck and unable to handle the limelight; we don’t expect 10-12 year vets to have the same problems. Same with Hal Jordan, we don’t want to watch him always sweating over every problem and unsure of himself, because that would be unrealistic. Would you expect to see an experienced fireman or cop sweat every time they were called into duty? Plus, I can think of a lot of characters that don’t really change much who I consider great characters: Sherlock Holmes, James Bond, Phillip Marlowe, Dick Tracy, Tarzan, Columbo…Hell, even Batman. He is essentially the same character he was 70 years ago and no one is complaining.
but isn't that the point... by sonnyhooper	Jan 13th, 2009 04:47:58 AM
....of having a entire GL CORP? so you can have diverse "types" of GLs? sure kyle is not the "typical" GL, but thats a good thing. he breaks the mold. with hal you have a ex-military man who gets "drafted". jon stewart is basically a urban hal, (black jordan?) only ex-USMC instead of the air force. and guy starts to break away a bit by being the "jerk", but in the end is still a "officer" type, basically a cop with a power ring. and then you have kyle who breaks away from all of that. sure maybe he just amounts to peter parker with a power ring, but at least that is a change from everyone who came before him, so it ends up being refreshing imo.
Kyle was never "weak and helpless". by SleazyG.	Jan 13th, 2009 11:44:52 AM
He was just a regular guy, young and unsure of where his life was heading, but he had a decent life he enjoyed. Getting the ring ripped that all away from him, trashing his personal life and killing those closest to him. He suffered a lot because of the ring, and didn't want the responsibility, but eventually grew into the role. Dismissing him as being "the same character" as those you mentioned is kinda silly. I see what you mean to a certain extent, but really--how much variety is there in the world of superheroes? Shit, there's now three iterations of Wolverine and there's been half a dozen members of the Flash family--doesn't mean they're all the same, but doesn't mean they're that different, either. The real difference is in the direction the story takes and the execution of it, and Kyle has had by far the best-executed arc of any GL ever. As for what's wrong with Hal remaining static--well, I like to see at least a little development and change in the characters I read. Granted, some are so iconic they can't be changed much (Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman) but most characters have some room for growth and change. Hal just isn't that iconic--few characters are--so it'd be nice to see him being less static. I guess I also have a problem with him because, well, his main character trait seems to be that he's a real tool. Yeah, he lost his dad, yeah, he's supposedly a maverick--but what he really comes across as is a selfish dick who never listens to anyone else (right or wrong) and is prone to punch first and think fourth. I had little problem buying his conversion to villain because, really, when did he ever put anybody else's feelings above his own? He's never felt like much of a hero or much of a character to me. Hell, sometimes I wish he was a bigger dick, just so he'd feel more like a "space cop" with the same attitude problems and behavioral patterns as many of the actual cops I've encountered. All that said, I'll grant Geoff Johns has done a decent job of making Hal a more interesting character and adding a little depth. But it was largely early on in the series, which has now become so focused on the (grantedly kick-ass) big storylines that the Hal stuff is sidelined slightly, although there was some solid stuff in the recent origin story revamp. Hal has potential for more, but it's only recently been explored at all--unlike Kyle, where it was there from the beginning. Which is why Kyle has always been the best GL around.
But...but...but Kyle got such great attention... by rock-me Amodeo	Jan 13th, 2009 04:21:37 PM
in 52! That was him, right? I can't remember staying awake long enough to really figure it out.
the problem with the GLS's... by sonnyhooper	Jan 13th, 2009 05:10:23 PM
....is that with all of them kicking around the universe some end up getting th short end of the stick just because of the sheer numbers. then you have the problem of fans and writers having to diminish one to prop up another. but the truth ends up being that it's a question of personal taste. for the record here is my top 5 list: 5.guy 4.jon 3.hal 2.kyle 1. KILAWOG search your feelings and know it to be true.
The Hal and Kyle debate by NeoDevilbaneX	Jan 13th, 2009 08:15:07 PM
I've seen this posted on the net and I agree with... much of it. --- Before beginning, I'd like to make a few things clear. One, if you don't like the Hal/Kyle debate, or posts about it, then you don't have to read this one. I happen to like the Hal/Kyle debate, because I enjoy debating things comic related and GL fans are passionate. If you don't want to read this..don't. I'm sure there are plenty of posts on each message board that you check that you don't read from disinterest...simply make this one of them. Two, I don't consider this post trolling or flame bait. I consider trolling when you say things JUST to start a fight. These are actually my feelings on the subject and someone not agreeing with them doesn't make them flame bait. It just makes them different than yours. Three, I'm going to avoid using the word "hate" because even though I know when I say I "hate" Hal I mean it more as an expression, but apparently some MB posters only speak literally and feel the need to post how it's stupid to hate a fictional character, and I literally loathe those responses. Finally...just to avoid a lot of the over used insults I get here....I'm 34 and married, and prior to marriage I always had girlfriends. That said, let me say that the reason I felt the need to write this (aside from being bored at work ) was because after over a year of posting my various feeling on the Hal/Kyle debates (actually over 10 years) I'm still often told I "just" dislike the character Hal Jordan. This isn't true. I didn't put a bunch of superhero names in a hat and decide whoever I pulled out I would dislike. I dislike Hal as a fictional character because of legitimate reasons that I've developed over decades of reading the character (including collect his book through a HUGE chunk of the 80's). They may not be your feelings about the character, but that alone doesn't negate my opinions. It is these opinions, and my knowledge of Hal's past sales, that have caused me to come up with this theory: "Hal doesn't sell well over long periods. His numbers will drop to the point of cancellation within the next few years." That's my theory. Are Hal's sales great now? Awesome! But...his return was heavily hyped and he has a writer (Geoff Johns) who could put "Brother Power the Geek" in the Top 10 for at least one issue. However, this won't last. It is like many characters that go through a period of major hype. Iron Man and Fantastic Four sold well for awhile after the "Heroes Reborn" saga, but both books dropped back to their regular numbers after the hype was over. Ka-zar sold really well...when mark Waid and Andy Kubert were on it, and then what? His numbers dropped to the numbers a Ka-zar book would normally generate. And even with both these advantages, Hal had already lost something like 54% of the books readers in its first year. That's not a leveling off. That's a drop. Granted the first issue posted high enough numbers that the book is still doing really well, but that is a BIG drop off. It lost over 2,000 readers a single month alone...a year in. Why? Again, my theory is "Hal doesn't sell". His return, the hype, the creative team, it's made people forget that for now, but that will die down eventually, and he'll be back on the verge of cancellation or having to undergo a major re-direction. Why? Because that's what always happens with Hal. Now as for why this is constantly happening to Hal...I have my theories on this too. Now before I begin posting those, you may ask why I want to post these opinions/theories on Hal. Good question. I dislike several superheroes, why post about Hal. I'll admit...it's because Hal replaced my boy Kyle as the main DCU GL. That's why I'm arguing about Hal and not Wolverine, Silver Surfer, or any of the other heroes I don't like. BUT that doesn't mean I'm JUST picking on Hal. I have legitimate reasons I don't like Hal that date back to before Kyle was created. Hal is just getting my attention because he is in my boy's seat. However I'm not making up reasons just because I like Kyle better. Anyway, as for why I feel Hal doesn't sell...I think it has to do with the fact he has no personality besides that of a generic superhero personality. To better explain this, I'm going to quote something said about Hawkman's powers from a website called seanbaby.com: "If you're a Super Friend, being able to fly is like being able to break a graham cracker along the line...Don't get me wrong. Flying is pretty cool. But if you're a super hero, it might as well be the ability to read." What 'seanbaby' is saying about Hawkman's main superpower is exactly how I see Hal's personality in a world of superheroes. To be a superhero a character must have certain traits: sense of justice, willingness to put ones self at risk, etc. After that, it is the traits the characters have BESIDES those that makes then interesting as individuals. Hal doesn't have any of these. He's a throwback to the pre-Lee/Kirby days of big chinned grinning cardboard cutout superheroes distinguishable only by their costumes and hair coloring. Nowhere is this better shown than in the much ballyhooed speech Hal gives in 'Rebirth' where he describes why he's different from the other GL's. In the speech he says how you can tell the ring constructs of the other GL's (Kyle, John, and Guy) are affected by their personalities, but not Hal's. Why? Because Hal does "just what needs to done". EXACTLY! Hal only does what a generic superhero would do BEFORE you added an actual personality to him. His ring isn't affected by his personality because there is nothing about his personality that isn't covered in the list of generic superhero traits. Oh...and then he punches Batman. That's the new way to do characterization for Hal. First over-explain things he does that all other superheroes do, then have him punch someone to stress how macho he is, despite the fact it's out of character. Look the current JLA's #1 with Roy talking about Hal. First Roy says only one person taught him to be fearless...Hal! This makes no sense. Roy grew up surrounded by superheroes, all of whom acted as brave as Hal. Second...it literally makes no sense. You can't teach someone to be fearless. You can teach them to overcome fear, sure, but teach them how to never experience it? Huh? That makes no sense. Plus, Hal was born without fear. It wasn't something he picked up. Oh, and then he threatens to fight Roy. And now Hal has been almost entirely replaced by John Stewart on JLA. And speaking of the born without fear thing, it embodies another problem with Hal as a character. He's too perfect. And by that I mean he's literally a character who is already at the end of his arc. He has nothing to achieve. He is the best GL, he is confident, he is a respected hero, he's fearless, etc. Individually, these traits can be fine, but together, and in a character who was born with them, where is Hal's arc? Where is his internal drive or conflict? Easy...he has none. He's already at the stage that usually comes at the end of a character arc. Due to this a lot of dopey things have to be done to Hal to try and make him have a personality, as perfect characters can't drive stories with their personality (or as Denny O'Neil said about Hal, he's a character that needs to write around, not written about). Currently those things are things like Hal having to deal with the judgments of his fellow heroes (i.e. Batman) and the recently found GL's for his time as Parallax...which could actually be interesting except for one thing: Hal was never Parallax. Parallax was giant yellow cockroach controlling Hal. Hal actually did NOTHING wrong (how could he? He's perfect) so it's actually those other people (Batman and the not-dead-GL's) that have something to overcome (i.e their prejudice towards Hal) and hence the ones with the actual character arcs in this tale. This is just one example of the balancing act of how to make Hal interesting without infringing upon the perfection inherent in the character, which is dealt with by him having to occasionally act uncharacteristically, like punching people out of nowhere, or acting uncharacteristically stupid as in his POW storyline. I mean, if you want to play Hal as someone who wouldn't take his ring on a test flight because it kills his buzz, fine, but not taking it on a mission where it could come in handy with helping his OTHER soldiers, that's just stupid, which is not a trait of Hal's. But again, they have to decide what they want to do with Hal first, then decide how to get him there (even if it is uncharacteristic) because perfect, flawless, fearless characters don't really drive stories. I mean, they could if they didn't have a magic wishing ring that would do whatever they want as then the conflict would be between this hero and finding a way to accomplish his goals (ala Indiana Jones), but the ring negates that, so we're left with a character with no shortcomings as a character and giant deus ex machina wrapped around his finger to negate any outer conflicts he may face. Which brings me to the mantra Geoff Jones is repeating through all his interviews about Hal...that the great thing about Hal is (unlike Batman) he doesn't plan...he just jumps right into things and then thinks his way out of it. This too could be interesting if not for, again, the fact has the power ring, so when he does think of what to do...voila...it's right there, and two...it's not true. Like the teaching Roy to be fearless thing, and the Rebirth "My personality is my lack of personality" speech, this is all smoke and mirrors. Nicely written but essentially meaningless. All heroes jump into things and then figure their way out. Even Batman. Does Bats make plans? Sure...when he knows what's going to hit him, which is only like 5% of the time, or if the story has to do with the fact Batman is a control freak (ala Waid's "Tower of Babel" storyline in JLA), but mostly he, like most superheroes, await for the threats to reveal themselves, then jumps into battle. Like most superheroes. Like Hal. Now I know a lot of you will say Hal isn't perfect, and use his often rebelling against the Guardians as proof, but it isn't. Hal only rebels when the Guardians are wrong, making him perfect again. Am I saying he should not rebel when the Guardians are wrong? No. I'm just saying it doesn't prove he's not perfect, and also...it's something every superhero would have, hence backing up the generic superhero personality thing. The one time he was wrong with his rebellion, it wasn't him...it was the big bug. The other time, he was drunk...and now that's retconned away. Also, I know many will argue I'm someone who only likes brooding characters, but that's not the case and would only be something said to try and blow off my actual arguments. I like all kinds of character, funny, brooding, flirty, mysterious, daring, whiny, obnoxious....whatever. I'm not saying Hal isn't "dark" enough or "reflective" enough...I'm saying he isn't ANYTHING enough and that affects the character. It makes him uninteresting. It causes his books to fail numerous times. And it will rear its head again, and the books sales will reflect that.....again. Hal is nothing but a cardboard cutout superhero with no internal conflict to drive the story personally and too much power to get into any situations he can't get out of. Not if writers like Geoff Johns aren't at least interested in the challenge. In a world full of superheroes, he's generic, and that makes him dull, and as the hype dies down and nostalgia gives way people will remember why they didn't collect Hal in the past and his books numbers will drop, and in a few short years he will be on the verge of cancellation or needing to be revamped. Big events like the Sinestro Corps War and Blackest Night will get people excited about Green Lantern....but not do a thing for Hal. He merely attends these events and any additional attention he receives is only residual, and otherwise only serve as delightful (temporary) distractions to take our eyes off the ball. Smoke and mirrors again, taking our eyes off the ball. For a bit. I know it like I know at that point Wizard will stop sucking up and do an article on whether or not DC made a mistake bringing back Hal as GL. That is my theory.
FINAL CRISIS #6 First Review - fate of The Dark Knight by most excellent ninja	Jan 14th, 2009 04:16:40 AM
http://handofmessi.blogspot.co m/ http://tinyurl.com/8yvuzg

Talkbacks

AICN COMICS SHOOT THE MESSENGER: Q&@ w R.E.B.E.L.S.' Tony Bedard! Spinner Rack previews GLC & HAVOC BRIGADE!

User login

Quick Talkback

Talkbacks