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AICN COMICS SHOOT THE MESSENGER: Q&@ w NEIL GAIMAN! PREVIEWS: GLC, DMZ, WILCATS! OPINIONS ARE LIKE @$$HOLES: BUG ON $3.99!

Men with targets for faces. by Shan	Dec 8th, 2008 05:26:50 AM
Still freak me out.
"No, not even a little bit." by sean bean	Dec 8th, 2008 05:53:30 AM
Ha ha, I love Neil Gaiman.
the sad thing is by DrLektor	Dec 8th, 2008 06:19:40 AM
The big two, DC especially as Didio recently had a bit of a rant, will continue to blame illegal downloads, they have to increase the price to cover the loss made by downloads, failing to realise that an increase in price just encourages more file sharing. The solution should be yes, dropping the quality of paper and making comics affordable again, when you have event after event asking you to buy 10 comics extra a month to follow the story, comic buyers are forced to ignore other works to keep up, Blue Beetle is a prime example, fantastic series that just got axed because it couldn't cover the sales needed. Or how about fixing the official online downloads, offering them at a reasonable price and slowly bringing the digital content into legitimate territory? After all, Itunes is doing great business.
stupid movie execs by Redmantle	Dec 8th, 2008 06:24:58 AM
They're way too stupid to get the appeal of sandman, because they will never actually read it. Idiots. It only sells more and more every year but, "would never make a good movie 'cause there's no good guys and bad guys". I read David Mamet's "Bambi vs. Godzilla" and if you all want a good idea about the idiocy of movie execs, check it out. Friggin idiots.
The pug nose gorilla faced chewbacca? by V'Shael	Dec 8th, 2008 07:19:18 AM
That's why the comic was 30 cents or whatever. Comics sucked. (j/k)
GREEN LANTERN Books Are The Best Comix Going These Days by LaserPants	Dec 8th, 2008 07:27:08 AM
At least from the Big Two. Hands down, the best. Nothing stupid happens, nothing gimicky, just straight up awesome, smart storytelling and action. Anyone not reading them is really missing out on what superhero comix can be and do...
gimmicks vs price vs out dated model by palewook	Dec 8th, 2008 07:58:52 AM
marvel/dc need to realize that gimmick runs, like Batman RIP and Marvel's Secret Invasion can backfire. just because something is an event and creates sales, it may not prolong future sales. if a gimmick run is a poor story or not received well, it can hurt future sales of that title. is printing spider-man 3x a month really helping? or losing customers. price. as cost goes up, sales go down. simple economics. and the economy being what it is, will be real easy to price these titles out of most their current audience's monthly budgets. out-dated business models can kill industries. just ask the music business. refusing to move into a digitial distribution model in the 90s allowed a generation to grow up on mp3s and now they've raised their kids on mp3s. marvel and dc need to embrace the digital distribution models, make it main stream, affordable, and control it. not let it out of their control.
I'm done by Laserhead	Dec 8th, 2008 08:06:46 AM
That's it; I'm buying Batman #683, and then no more monthlies. From now on I'll just shoplift trades from Barnes & Noble. It's really, really easy.
Don't forget your sombrero. by eggart	Dec 8th, 2008 08:18:52 AM
Or your fake mustache. They will never see through your clever disguise. Or notice all the trade paperbacks missing and review the security tapes.
The demise of print media by rock-me Amodeo	Dec 8th, 2008 08:50:03 AM
I admit, as a fanboy who has held literally tens of thousands of comics in my palsied (okay, not really palsied, it's just one of those words you pick up from 70 issues of Marv Wolfman's TOMB OF DRACULA) hands, there is a thrill for me in physically purchasing and reading a comic book. But the kids today don't have that muscle memory, that physical and cultural touchstone, and they may NEVER have that. Whoever made the point about kids being raised on MP3s was spot-on. I mean, look at the struggles that traditional newspapers are having. Its the same struggle. They are clinging to an outdated business model and ambitions that are too high. The Big Four networks had to re-adjust everything when cable television ate much of their market share. Now comics need to do the same thing that newspapers need to do, or die (ironically, just like Morpheus.) The advantage here is that comics are not news. They're pop culture: they can take advantage of huge money in licensing to supplement their primary media. Think of comic books as "loss-leaders", that is, the underpriced thing that gets people into the "store." The more people that are hooked on the loss-leader, the more money they can make on back-end stuff, like bedsheets, bobbleheads, lunchboxes (do kids still use lunchboxes?) movies, etc, etc. Sandman bedsheets. I would have bought them. As long as they didn't feature, you know, The Corinthian, or folks from the Cereal Convention story, and such.
$3.99? Put a fork in me... by Psynapse	Dec 8th, 2008 09:05:24 AM
because at that juncture I am well and truly done. To the Trade-Wait Mobile!
Movie executives aren't stupid by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 09:20:21 AM
They are actually very smart and REALISTS. They make products with the idea that they will SELL to a public that is largely comprised of complete fucking morons. If YOU think Sandman would make a good movie that would sell a shit ton of movie tickets to an American audience, then YOU are the stupid one and live in a complete fantasy world. Sandman would make a shit movie. SHIT. It isn't written in a cinematic way. It doesn't have a "filmic" arc. Maybe it'd make a good TV show, but not really. Honestly, I think there are some things which just work best as books. Sandman is one of those things.
I don't read Comics by yodalovesyou	Dec 8th, 2008 09:22:23 AM
But the pictures are nice.
You want to know why I don't read Green Lantern? by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 09:24:36 AM
Maybe you don't... Well TOO BAD! Anyway, honestly... I hate aliens. I just hate sci-fi aliens. I hate their three toed feet and bumpy forheads and gelatinous bodies... I HATE Aliens. I loved it when Hal Jordan killed all those little bastards. I hate them. I am totally about Humanity. If Star Wars was real, I'd totally join the Empire and laugh as I tasered Wookies and sent Jawas and Gungans to work in the Salt Mines. I'd love to firebomb a Ewok camp. LOVE IT! Now, I've read a lot of the recent Green Lantern trades and they're good, I'm not saying that they aren't, its just... I fucking hate aliens. Earth First!
Joenathan by most excellent ninja	Dec 8th, 2008 09:28:06 AM
Fucking specist. The Red Lantern Corps will show up and break your face.
Haven't you seen TV, Ninja? by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 09:29:13 AM
Humanity ALWAYS beats the stupid Aliens. Either due to our extreme adaptibility or our knowledge of what it means to love. HUMANS UBER ALLES!
I don't think the scanners make any bucks off their work by Ye Not Guilty	Dec 8th, 2008 09:44:38 AM
I download the scans of the comics. I admit it. I also buy comics and TBPs. I spend a lot of money every month (as in over $100 every month) supporting the industry, but let's face it, it would be prohibitively expensive to read everything I want to read even at $2.99 an issue, so lots of times I will read the scans on my computer and then pick up the TPB when it is released. But I don't think the scanners are making "a quick buck" off of their work. From what I can tell, they pay for the comics and then scan them and release them for free. Maybe I am wrong and someone is paying them to scan all this stuff, but I don't think so. But $3.99 a comic is just too much. I mean, does anybody think Marvel Apes was worth $3.99 an issue? I can find those issues in the clearance bin right now for half price. And then there are the delays between issues. It has been three months since the last issue of Shazam was released, and that's a Johnny DC title, for cryin' out loud.
$3.99 by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 09:48:51 AM
I won't quit comics, but it will certainly make me more discerning. I'll always make my weekly trip, as long as I'm able. There is a part of me, though, that thinks comics, much like movie rental, is a dying industry in its current form and there's just nothing you can do about it. Comics will change because they have to. If that means more trades, if that means on-line, then thats just the way the world goes. The unfortuanate casualty in this is the LCS, just like the local video store, and I will miss them, but you know what else I miss? Making mix tapes, but that time is over. We are dinosaurs, gentleman and our world is slowly growing colder.
Basic Economics, by Ambush Bug.. by The Nihilist	Dec 8th, 2008 09:50:01 AM
...yes, you raise the price of anything--ESPECIALLY DURING A RECESSION--fewer people are going to buy it, particularly a luxury item like comics. Might be OK if you're marketing a narrow interest product like Rolex watches, but comic book companies would presumably like to sell comics to everybody. Raising prices isn't the way to do it. Note also that this can be applied to the cost of everything...including the cost of work and investment, i.e. taxes. Make work and investing "more expensive" by taxing it at a higher rate and people will simply do less of it. Are you listening, Oh incoming Magic Negro?
idea by teethgnasher	Dec 8th, 2008 09:52:41 AM
Release a digital download of the issue via i-Tunes or similar. Then release a trade or hardcover down the road so people have something to hold and place on a bookshelf.
I will spend $400 on by teethgnasher	Dec 8th, 2008 09:59:17 AM
a replica of Captain America's Shield or Iron Man's helmet, but I won't purchase a monthly comic book. I normally wait for a trade. $2.99 for a regular comic book is too much. I have a lot of disposable income, but I won't spend it on a monthly book.
eggart by Laserhead	Dec 8th, 2008 10:03:52 AM
You can't arrest or convict for shoplifting based on video or any other kind of footage. In fact, the person has to be stopped and confronted before leaving the store, and even in that case, you could just deny and walk around whatever clerk is impeding your progress. Give it a shot. The publisher still gets their money, and B&N takes an insurance hit.
I wish I had a Captain America replica Shield, by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 10:04:23 AM
I'd use it to make room on the elevator in the mornings.
Cram that cardstock cover up your ass! by Skulboy	Dec 8th, 2008 10:09:56 AM
I too enjoy my comics in monthly installments, but to be honest, very few comics I read these days are worth $4. This price hike is just going to mean that I'll be leaving the LCS with less and less books each week. I too have been collecting since the 70's and work as an artist because of it so it make me sad/angry that before long I'll soon be down to a handful of comics per month. I agree, cheaper paper and get rid of those damn cardstock covers to keep the price down. Please.
I don't want cheaper paper. by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 10:13:39 AM
I like the current paper and I'm willing to pay for it. Cheap paper sucks. We had cheap paper for fifty years and I'm tired of the yellowing, smeary shit.
Pricing perspective from an indie comic guy by GrantChastain	Dec 8th, 2008 10:29:15 AM
Hi guys. Grant Chastain here. You may remember me from such comics as "Corrective Measures" from Arcana Comics, or perhaps not. Either way, here's my take on the situation. This hobby we have? The weekly comic book store visit punctuated by the smell of old back-issues and the sound of fanboys arguing about which supermega crossover is lamest? Those days and those times are changing. Fans are increasingly headed towards the self-contained graphic novel because they're cheaper and contain entire story arcs. Publishers are increasingly headed towards the self-contained graphic novel because the margins are a hell of a lot better than the old ink-and-staples, and allow for easier packaging when optioning the source into other media like TV and movies. Indie publishers like me and the folks I run with have very few options when it comes to gaining an audience and recomping our initial printing, promotional and distribution costs. If you're not aware of how much it costs simply to be listed in Diamond's catalog -- and there are plenty of folks that think Diamond is produced solely on advertising revenue, the silly gits -- look it up sometime. The cost you give away to simply find your book in the "back half" of Diamond is a substantial amount and it can certainly discourage folks from producing their own series. In order to recomp those costs, books need to sell at around the $3-$4 clip, which is unfortunate. But there are so many hands in the cookie jar that it's hard to buck the trend and produce a book at a loss. But them's the economics of the situation. When I used to produce single issues, even at print-on-demand shops, charging $2.99 per basically enabled me to break even. Indie publishers know the trend is killing the goose that lays golden eggs, but there's literally no way around it with single-issue sales. Anyway, my two cents and an extra $2.98 will buy you a cup of Starbucks. Take my opinions for what they're worth.
This dates me a bit... by The Eskimo	Dec 8th, 2008 10:30:45 AM
...but I quit buying comics round the time the went from regular $1.25 to $1.75. I was so pissed at a .50 cents increase that I just refused to buy from Marvel anymore after 10 years of collecting ASM. (They were .65 when I started BTW). I agree with the above comment that the answer is to go back to the old paper and quit with all the gimmicky cover art. Oh, and made subscriptions REALLY worth it again...istead of saving only like $9 in a year!
This seems like a good time to ask for guidence by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 10:50:11 AM
from follow comic readers. First, a little history... I've been a comic book fan all of my life. I grew up on Silver Age comics (and frankly, they're still my passion -- I'm a collector thereof). But my interest in comics has really waxed and waned since around the eighties -- I still picked up an issue or two here and there, but not with any kind of intensity. Lately, the comic fever has taken me again, and I've tried to dive back into the comics scene. This weekend I made a trip to the local comic shop and was -- I must admit -- simply overwhelmed at the number of companies/titles available. It's simply staggering. The number of titles for Secret Invasion alone is incredible! Some observations: • The card stock covers and slick paper -- at least in my opinion -- do not enhance the experience enough to merit the price hike. In fact in many cases, the paper stock made it harder to read the book. • In virtually every comic I purchased, there's hardly three good pages of story -- the rest of the book is excessive splash pages and empty panels. After all, these aren't movies, they're books. • Some of the artwork is simply beautiful; too much of the artwork is way, way overworked (I'm a professional graphic artist, so I have some experience in that arena). I would like to ask for the AICN community's advice here -- if someone (like myself) is reintroducing themselves to the genre, what are the best titles to concentrate on?(I like both Marvel and DC stable of characters, but I tend to lean towards the DC universe -- I know nothing about other companies' properties). What are the best trade collections that will bring me up to speed with the current state of affairs -- the current universes? Thanks for any advice.
Hobby? by teethgnasher	Dec 8th, 2008 10:53:03 AM
Does the average reader really oollect comicbooks and back issues? I think the hobby of collecting back issues is dying. Not quite dead yet, but slowly dying.
Sandman as a Television Series by mukhtabi	Dec 8th, 2008 10:56:53 AM
Would work very well with a very serious CAVEAT: It would have to be done for a network that shows nudity, does not censor profanity, and would be willing to put out 2 -3 million per episode for a hybrid media cinematic televisual experience - I'm talking animation blended with live action work. I have personally been stewing and contemplating this idea for YEARS. I earned in A for my final project in Producing Film and Video in grad school for a seminal treatment of one of the stories from Endless Nights as a pilot for such a series. It could be done, if there existed a premier cable network that could put out that kind of money. Any ideas?
It really comes down to... by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 10:56:59 AM
deciding if its worth it to you to continue with this hobby, because really... do you honestly think there is ever going to be a DECREASE in comics? Come on. Its never, ever, ever going to happen. EVER. A corporation decreasing profits? No way. So, how much do you want to be up on the latest? How much is it worth it to you to come here every week and discuss? Would you be able to stand waiting for months at a time for the trades? These are the questions you should be asking yourself, because discussing alternatives for companies to explore in order to bring down their prices is a big waste of time.
Snook by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:09:31 AM
I don't know if, in todays Big 2 universe, that there is really a main trade or two that is required. DC is a mess continuity wise and alternatively Marvel is very tight. Both situations leave someone just coming back, like yourself, in the basic same situation. So I think the answer is really... pick a spot, dive in and start swimming. But can I recommend: Umbrella Academy Old Man Logan (current run of Wolverine and while isn't in trades yet, is lots of fun) The Walking Dead Captain America #1 to current by Brubaker Planetary < br>The Twelve (also not in trades yet) Alias Nextw ave Just to start you off.
"Oh incoming Magic Negro?" Really!?!? by Psynapse	Dec 8th, 2008 11:10:39 AM
Please kill yourself now, do it for the children.
Thats... by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:11:45 AM
Nextwave... not Nextw ave. Also, The Twelve kind of got mashed in with Planetary. Damn AICN TBs...
Psynapse by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:12:53 AM
Don't acknowledge fuckers like that.
Having no problem with the $3.99 price by mrfan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:12:59 AM
Just produce some good comics.
snook by palewook	Dec 8th, 2008 11:19:08 AM
"if someone (like myself) is reintroducing themselves to the genre, what are the best titles to concentrate on?" i came back to comic books in the past 5 years after about a 20 year void. I can say a lot of the 90s stuff is pointless. and most of the 00 stuff is fluff. things that have caught my attention and respect: JMS Silver Surfer Requiem, Garth Ennis Max Punisher series, World War Hulk (the whole collection), and Hack Slash The Series.
I've given up on printed comics by sean bean	Dec 8th, 2008 11:19:44 AM
They take up too much space. I used to buy 4 or 5 titles a week but I simply don't want to have piles of comics lying around anymore. I had boxes and boxes when I was growing up but they got tossed by my mum somewhere along the line and I didn't really care. I have recollected the ones I still want to read in trades or downloads. I would much rather have .cbr files on my hard drive or on CDs than the paper comics. Also, I don't live near a comic store. For me, downloading pirate comics is not so much a price issue as a convenience one. If there were a legal way to download the latest Marvel/DC comics on a Wednesday I would do it. But there isn't.
They're just making it easier... by RenoNevada2000	Dec 8th, 2008 11:24:06 AM
I was looking at next year as a time I would be cutting back on the amount I spent on comics each month. It's a decision that grows organically out of the end of FINAL CRISIS, the fact I am only reading POWERS from Marvel and the fact that after 30 years, I'm just not getting the same thrill I used to. (Some books, like GREEN LANTERN and JSA, being the exception.) While a three decade's habit is tough to break, a dollar price hike will certainly help me stick to my guns. New York Comic Con should be interesting this year with Quesada and DiDio trying to justify all this...
Joenathan's excellent picks notwithstanding by rock-me Amodeo	Dec 8th, 2008 11:29:30 AM
I don't think those would bring a relative newbie back into the state of the union. For Marvel, just take a look at the trades for CIVIL WAR and WORLD WAR HULK, then the ILLUMINATI series, and then you're ready for the Skrull Invasion. For DC, you have to be a little more selective to see what's going on, because I would not blithly condemn anyone to read all of COUNTDOWN or 52. In fact, it you REALLY want to get to the heart of DC, where things really started to change, you should pick up Meltzers IDENTITY CRISIS. That's where things really began to change. Then get someone to tell you about COUNTDOWN, but don't wast your money on that or 52. But DO pick up any of the recent trades on Green Lanterns' SINESTRO WAR, and maybe Batman FATHER AND SON, then wait for current Morrison Magnum Opus to finish and get it. Oh, if you want to actually enjoy reading something, pick up Simone's SINISTER or SECRET SIX, as well as the last few Simone penned BIRD'S OF PREY. That's should give you a good flavor of what's up.
It stopped being a hobby for me by DrLektor	Dec 8th, 2008 11:31:13 AM
when I realised I wasn't reading the stuff I was collecting anymore. I had a decent pull list of about 10 titles per week but then I kept putting off reading certain comics, leaving them in an ever growing pile. I'd hate it when I'd miss an issue but started to get bored actually reading them. I had a moment of clarity and dropped everything. It literally put me off comics for about a year. I weighed up the precious few silver age and worthy comics I had against the seemingly endless boxes of X-Dudes and Spider-Fellah and I thought "fuck this". But if I sell, who's going to buy it all? The Marvel zombie is slowly starving to death, Johnny DC is forced to work as a prostitute to pay for a fix... and the stories just aren't worth 4 bucks a time.
I think all graphic novels would generally increase quality... by stones_throw	Dec 8th, 2008 11:35:16 AM
Let's face it: in the vast majority of cases, Marvel and DC have clearly forgotten how to do readable, fun and timely monthly comics. That's why sales are so low and prices are so high. The best stuff is coming out from publishers like Dark Horse and Mike Mignola, who does all miniseries, or series like CRIMINAL that are designed for the collection and have that level of thought and effort put into them. How about Brian K. Vaughan or Eduardo Risso's recent WOLVERINE miniseries? Or ALL STAR SUPERMAN for that matter? Moving to a more limited, standalone format would force the Big Two to focus on a wider audience for the bookstore market, and make sure what they're putting out is quality, if that much time and money is going to be invested in it. Kind of like how miniseries at the Big Two used to be an event, rather than just more fodder. Plus, graphic novels would kill off this obnoxious crossover event culture. I mean, the Wasp is the big death in SECRET INVASION? The only Marvel character to never have been popular, ever, with anyone?
Rock Me by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:36:09 AM
I didn't go that route, because it seemed like he'd have to spend ALOT of money on trades just to get caught up, whichever company he chooses, and since he seems to be kind of story and art focused, I thought just some plain old good books would be a better place to start back in, as a healthy amount of Marvel's continuity heavy stuff and DC's scattershot all over the place stuff is... mmm... not always top shelf quality, you know?
Snookeroo by stones_throw	Dec 8th, 2008 11:40:47 AM
Have you read Alan Moore's ABC stuff, like PROMETHEA or LEAGUE OF EXTRAORDINARY GENTLEMEN? It's basically Alan Moore writing his own line of comics (published through Wildstorm) around the time of the Millennium, then he got pissed off with DC in his usual fashion when Jim Lee sold Wildstorm to 'em. It's enough to get anyone back into comics. Moore's someone else who's moving to all independently published longform graphic novels, like LOST GIRLS and forthcoming LoEG volumes.
Yeah, I do by rock-me Amodeo	Dec 8th, 2008 11:40:57 AM
The thing is, if someone wants to know what to read that brings them up to speed on how DC and Marvel runs its universes, THAT stack does not necessarily contain stuff that I LIKE (like Identity Crisis and about half of WWH and Civil War), but it IS an accurate portrayal. Now, if someone asks me for stuff that they would actually ENJOY reading, well, that stack would be different. Quality always seems to be the exception. sigh
I think Stones is right by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:48:03 AM
trades are the way to go, because the thing that has always killed big stories for me is that the very next issue just keeps going. There's never a sense of closure, the book just keeps going. I think I prefer books like Umbrella Academy because they have a story, they start it and they end it and then we all get a bit of time to live with it and digest it. It seems special and exciting then. I've always found Batman's trade stories much more enjoyable then the monthlies and I think its because of the endings. The Wasp's death wasn;t the point, the Dark Illuminati and return of the Supervillian was the point.
Rock Me... by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 11:50:16 AM
True... I just have a hard time recommending things that I enjoy, but fully acknowledge that perhaps I have a higher tolerance for its failings than a new person might.
Joenathan by Psynapse	Dec 8th, 2008 11:58:09 AM
My opinion doesn't require your endorsement. Never has, never will. ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’
Psynapse by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 12:04:06 PM
And all people like that require is to rile up one person who doesn't realize that their riling up is the entire point, but then... thats your hallmark, isn't it? Also, Edmond Burke never actually said that quote.
I don't mind waiting for trades by teethgnasher	Dec 8th, 2008 12:58:29 PM
And I don't generally buy that many. 1-2 a month.
Dear Rere (aka Joenathan) by Psynapse	Dec 8th, 2008 01:06:16 PM
1. Yet again, you think yours is the ONLY correct opinion in any given situation. There's a term for that: 'petty tyrant'. 2. Never said he did. Just can't resist attempting to put words in other people's mouths now can you? 3. The fake attempt at a mature attitude is most amusing coming from you of all people.
Am I the only one that hates Richie Rich? by Continentalop	Dec 8th, 2008 01:11:28 PM
I always found him to be a pampered, oblivious little brat, who is always flaunting money he never earned in everyone's faces. He seems to have been created to give credence to raising the death tax, or maybe even bringing back communism.
prices by NinjaChampion	Dec 8th, 2008 01:17:39 PM
Maybe a solution would be going back to newsprint to make the printing cheaper. Also make it cheaper to subscribe, that way print runs could be larger, which would also make the price better. Also cut out all the variant covers. I know this is just a way to get people to buy multiple versions of the same thing but I'm sure a lot of collectors have grown wise to this and only buy one version. If a story line is good enough then go ahead and reprint it on better paper with enhanced coloring and a new cover.
You don't buy comics to read and enjoy them. by cookylamoo	Dec 8th, 2008 01:28:51 PM
You but them so you can read them and the go online and bitch and moan about what hacks Grant Morrison and Brian Michael Bendis are. Comics aren't about Super-Heroes anymore, they're about "Events" and your comic book is like a ticket to a football game.
How do you "but" a comic? by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 01:43:18 PM
Also, remind me to never borrow any of your comics...
Thanks for the advice! by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 01:44:47 PM
Joenathan -- I'm particularly intrigued by your Capt. America suggestion. In fact, this was one of the titles I was considering, (since I'm a long-time Cap fan)but didn't know where to start. Thanks! Palewook -- I've watched the WW Hulk conversations on line, but didn't know if it was worth picking up. Thanks for the suggestion; I'm going to see what I can find concerning back issues of this. Rock-Me Amodeo -- I don't know if I know enough about the current stream of affairs to be able to gather back Identity issues, but I'll definitely investigate. From what I've seen in the AICN talkbacks, Green Lantern is DEFINITELY on my new buy list. Thanks! Stones-Throw -- Alan Moore wrote a couple of my favorite Superman stories of all time (Superman is my favorite character BTW). But I haven't read any of his independent stuff. I'll check out the titles you suggested. Thanks! Thanks again for everyone's help -- this certainly gives me a good reference point to start from.
Keen Observation by cookylamoo	Dec 8th, 2008 01:50:12 PM
From someone who can't even spell his own name.
I always bought comics to keep the women away... by rock-me Amodeo	Dec 8th, 2008 01:51:16 PM
...because, you know, they were always beating down my door otherwise.
Snookeroo by steverodgers	Dec 8th, 2008 01:51:40 PM
If Superman is your favorite, go out and grab some snacks, and All Star Superman by Morrison/Quitely and just revel in the goodness.
Snook by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 02:19:45 PM
Brubaker's run restarted the title at #1 and every issue since (I think there's 40-50 now, somewhere around there.) has been completely worth it. If Cap is one of your favorites, then this is the best he's been since the Captain america and the Falcon days.
Touche cookylamoo, by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 02:20:37 PM
Touche
Steverodgers by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 02:21:50 PM
Actually, All Star Superman is one of the main influences for drawing me back into the fray. I had read so many positives about the series from the AICN talkbackers that I bought the whole series off ebay. I loved the series so much that I started experimenting with other titles. But, as I mentioned before, things have changed so much that my purchases have just kind of been a crap shoot. And at $4 to $5 a pop, I have to be a little more selective -- plus, I just don't have the time to devote to this as I'd like. Thank you for the advice! If there are other Superman titles that you'd recommend, I'd be especially interested.
Joenathan by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 02:26:49 PM
Is the Brubaker run available in any kind of collection, or would I just have to buy back issues as availability allows?
Snook by Joenathan	Dec 8th, 2008 02:29:10 PM
There's an omnibus of the first 25, I think and trades that go pretty much current. They're all on Amazon.
Joenathan by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 02:35:25 PM
I'll check my local comics dealer for the omnibus (he has an incredible inventory, and I'd like to support the cause). If he doesn't have it, I'll check out Amazon. This is a definite buy for me -- thanks very much.
Snook/Superman by steverodgers	Dec 8th, 2008 02:44:30 PM
That is the only Superman comic i've read in years, so I am not sure if there is anything else out there that is worth your time and dollar. One can hope.
To bring prices down by Shigeru	Dec 8th, 2008 02:54:51 PM
Try not making 90% of your ads in books in-house, stupid, waste of space "embrace change" shit
Bastards... by RinRockRock	Dec 8th, 2008 03:05:58 PM
Yeah this price hike just sucks. I just starting reading comics again last year after a long break and 3.99 is not going to keep me around. I'll keep buying some core titles monthly but I can get the rest on ebay or an online seller at .99 only a few months later. I can wait thanks.
You mean Bullwinkle and Rocky aren't by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 03:07:32 PM
hocking Cheerios anymore? Wow -- I HAVE been out of it. Heh.
I miss the hostess ads by Continentalop	Dec 8th, 2008 03:22:00 PM
I mean, they made the best villain. Hotshot, The Printout Man, Icemaster, The Demolition Derby...am I the only one who remembers "Bad Hair" Dayna?
I wonder how many DC comics by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 03:34:56 PM
are worth hundreds of dollars less today because they had a .25 coupon for Pallisades Amusement Park clipped out?
Go after Archie McPhee by cookylamoo	Dec 8th, 2008 04:41:37 PM
He still makes X-Ray Specs and that sort of thing. Spencer Gifts is another good potential advertiser.
Are Sea Moneys still around? by Continentalop	Dec 8th, 2008 05:16:43 PM
Maybe you can get them to advertise again.
Ambush Bug by Snookeroo	Dec 8th, 2008 06:19:09 PM
In response to your article, just a few observations: I agree. In tough economic times, raising the price of a non-essential item like a comic book is probably not a safe trend. My breath is taken away at the price tag on some of these things (especially when you start looking at "polystone" statues and so forth). But then again, when I started buying comics they were .12 each (but minimum wage was $1.20, so I guess it's all relative). You asked for suggestions to the comic book companies. Here's a few ideas: • Focus on fewer titles, and make those comics a better value. I'd gladly pay $5 for a comic if it has a whole story in it, rather than 3 panels of story and twenty pages of "slow motion" panels. Take a look at the Green Lantern page you posted. It's outstanding artwork, but one entire page is spent on Guardians saying "yes". That's a lot of artwork expense that doesn't advance the story a hell of a lot. To a previous point of mine -- these are comics, not movies. You don't need 24 frames for one second of info. • Cookylamoo made a great point -- comics aren't written to tell stories anymore; they're all "event" driven. VERY incrementally. That's ok once in a while, but if every story features the cataclysmic end of the universe as we know it, plus every character in the stable, it gets a little stale. I understand the marketing behind such a move, but at $3 and up per issue, it takes a fortune to read a story that used to be contained in a handful of issues, if not under one cover. • I can see why some titles are not hitting their deadlines -- they're unbelievably detailed. I don't know how they pump that kind of work out in one month. However, more often than not, I'm seeing a lot more work than is merited -- often to the detriment of the story. And that kind of artwork isn't cheap; so amp down a little -- not everything has to be rendered in 3-D. Try the Julius Shwartz concept; make covers that intrigue your buyers. I was astounded during my trip to the comic store this weekend at how many issues simply feature posing characters. Again, I think the companies have gotten so caught up in exquisite execution that they've forgotten to be interesting. That may work for your existing fanbase, but doesn't draw in potential new buyers.
I sincerely hope... by Organs	Dec 8th, 2008 07:52:00 PM
...that Sandman never makes it to any kind of visual medium, be it motion picture, TV series, or IMAX experience, or what-have-you. The thing is, some stories are better left in their home mediums. Movies are typically ninety minutes to two hours, sometimes two and a half hours. They typically have a familiar flow, plot outline, protagonists, supporting characters, antagonists... and the whole thing is so typical. Not to mention anyone can count on one hand the number of film adaptations that were adapted faithfully from the source material. The beauty of novels and comic books is there's no restraint on length or content. If "Batman: The Killing Joke" was made into a visual medium, it'd probably only be an hour long. Not to mention any film or TV producer would cringe at marketing a Batman story where a girl is shot through her spine, stripped nude, and photographed for a madman's personal use. Also, you can get (what is typically referred to as) a graphic novel like "Watchmen" or the many volumes of "Sandman" and you can savor them and read them at your own pace. If "Watchmen" were faithfully adapted to film (and I'm certain it hasn't been), it would be at least twelve hours long. "V for Vendetta" rightfully should have been much longer as well. It just goes to show that, for something to be made from a book, comic, or campfire story to film, it's going to be truncated and tweaked into something barely resembling the source material. Ultimately, Neil Gaiman is a boon of a creative artist. It'll be a very long while--I think--before we get another artist of his caliber started anew in the comic and/or literary industries.
Snookeroo by most excellent ninja	Dec 9th, 2008 12:56:52 AM
Damn, you know you may have been reading comics for decades but only last year did the greatest story emerge from them. Sinestro Corps War. The greatest Star Wars story since Empire(no it isn't a star wars universe story, just an analogy). Green Lantern is the book of the decade maybe last decade too.
First comic story that ended? by krushjudgement	Dec 9th, 2008 01:27:54 AM
I think not. Don't get me wrong, Sandman is amazing, but there were other stories that ended. For instance, Dave Sim announced very early exactly when Cerebus would be ending. (It happened to be after Sandman's ending, but it was announced before.) Other examples? Squadron Supreme. Watchmen! Half of Alan Moore's projects! You get the idea...
Sandman ending by offscauta	Dec 9th, 2008 03:59:02 AM
What I think he's refering to is that Sandman was the first ongoing monthly that a big publisher allowed to end. There have always been comic mini series, but before Sandman when a creator left a book they just got somebody else to write it. The fact that DC didn't just hire a new guy to continue Sandman was quite a big deal at the time.
Sandman ending (part 2) by offscauta	Dec 9th, 2008 04:00:10 AM
The surprising thing being that they let it end even though it was selling well.
Comics Have Already Changed by Buzz Maverik	Dec 9th, 2008 07:14:48 AM
The medium changes all the time. Anybody who has ever taken a break from comics can tell you that. I'm pretty much on a permanent break from comics. Not because of the price, but because reviewing comics exposes you to all the medium's flaws and if you want to keep liking the medium itself, you have to step away from the product. If you look at the original @$$holes, only Bug and Sleazy are left and they are a very different Bug and Sleazy than when we started...okay, Sleazy is pretty much the same, but...
Event Comics by Buzz Maverik	Dec 9th, 2008 07:19:49 AM
The polybagged dual variant metallic covered comics of the late '00s. Sorta makes you wanna crank up the ol' Wayback machine and go back to the time when trendy comics simply meant a bunch of monster and horror titles with heavy rendering and big lettering. I'm not sure about these new guys Doug Moench and Mike Ploog, but that werewolf comic rocked!
I'll keep the Event Comics, if by Joenathan	Dec 9th, 2008 09:01:22 AM
it means I get three dimensional characters as well. I think you guys take it too seriously if the "flaws" of comics drives you away. The only thing that drives me from a book is poor art or story. And if that happens, I just find a new book more to my liking. Its just that simple.
Snookeroo by Fuzzyjefe	Dec 9th, 2008 09:36:51 AM
Late piece of advice: if you love good ol' superheroics, try 'Invincible' from Image. There are 8 trades out & that'll get you within 8 or 9 issues of caught up. Awesome superhero action & contstant surprises. It's a really fresh take on classic superheroics.
Final Crisis #5 looks EPIC!!!!!! by most excellent ninja	Dec 9th, 2008 10:43:48 AM
Holy shit. The Gods of Apokalips not counting on Hal Jordan coming to fuck them up sounds amazing. It's up to DC's new big guns, the Green Lanterns to save the day. Had to be. The Blackest Night is around the corner.
Most excellent ninja by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 10:47:58 AM
I've heard all kinds of rave reviews about Green Lantern/Sinestro Corps, etc. Green Lantern is an all-time fav (can't believe it wasn't made into a movie years ago); the reviews I've seen here on AICN are very exciting; it's definitely one of the titles I'll be picking up. Fuzzyjefe -- thanks for the recommendation; I'll check it out. However, I've had several really great suggestions that I'm investigating already, and I can tell I'm going to have to mortgage the house to get caught up. I was looking up the Brubaker Cap A stories, and that title alone is going to cost me around 100 Washington's to get up to speed. But hell's bells, what a great problem to have, eh?
No doubt Snookeroo by Fuzzyjefe	Dec 9th, 2008 11:08:59 AM
It's a good time to be a comic reader if you can afford it. I read more titles than I really should without reading a single main universe superhero book from either Marvel or DC. There's something for just about any taste. Welcome back.
The Nihilist by frozen01	Dec 9th, 2008 11:22:30 AM
Basic Economics. HAH. People won't STOP WORKING because their taxes have gone up. They can't just go to their bosses and say, "Well, Obama raised my taxes, so can I only work 30 hours from now on?" The response would either be "No" or "Pack up your stuff and get out of here". And most people can't just quit working, no matter which tax bracket they're in. They have houses and cars to pay for, children to clothe and feed. Even business owners wouldn't decrease their productivity just because their taxes went up, because that lost productivity will cost them more money in the end! What, do you think they're just going to be like "Well, my taxes are a little higher, I give up! Better close up shop!" Please, don't insult our collective intelligence. You've taken the model applied to spending on "luxury" items during a recession (people will buy less and will not pay more for the same items they used to buy) and applied it to your own argument for income vs. taxes vs. productivity (people will supposedly decrease their productivity because their taxes are higher)? And you're lecturing US about "basic economics"?
Talk about your coincidences... by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 11:38:21 AM
I'm from the Midwest, but this summer I just happened to be in San Diego (first time in decades) a week BEFORE Comic Con. Ah, if only I'd been there one week later. Ships in the night, cheri. Ships in the night.
My current suggestion list by Bluejack	Dec 9th, 2008 12:18:39 PM
1. Annihilation and Annihilation:Conquest,2. Nova, 3.Immortal Iron Fist, 4. Bru's Cap Run, 5. Invincible, 6. Fables, 7. Walking Dead, 8. Secret Six, 9. Thunderbolts, 10. Dynamo 5. These are all good reads!
Suggestions part 2 by Bluejack	Dec 9th, 2008 12:21:13 PM
I've fallen away from DC. I was a huge JLA fan from Morrison's reboot on, but recently it is just fluffy cotton candy posing. I like most of the Avengers stuff but that can be pretty convoluted at this point.
On Trades by optimous_douche	Dec 9th, 2008 12:26:11 PM
From a cost perspective is there really a benefit to trades??? I totally get it from a story perspective, because you get the complete arc. But cost wise, it just doesn't add up for me. Most trades clock in at about 5 issues for $15 or $20 bucks. Call me dense, but wouldn't it be the same as the weekly buy?
Ug, no editing! by Bluejack	Dec 9th, 2008 12:32:48 PM
convoluted for jumping on atthis point. You would need to go all the way back to New Avengers before Secret Invasion to know what the hell was going on.
optimous_douche by Shigeru	Dec 9th, 2008 12:44:20 PM
nearly every single trade is 6 or more issues. none are 5.
Ok, I have to ask the really stupid question by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 01:07:57 PM
When we're referencing "trades", that is actually reprints of back issues under one cover that carry one storyline, correct? That's what I've been assuming, but I want to make sure that's correct before I amble on in complete ignorance. What is the difference between that and an omnibus?
Bluejack by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 01:14:33 PM
Thanks -- your suggestions confirm some titles for me, since they have been mentioned a couple of times before. These are on my buy list: Bru's Cap A, Invincible, and Secret Six (I have the original Secret Six from 1968 -- issues 1,2, and 5 -- and yes, I DID buy them off the spinner rack when they were new). I'm interested to see how the title was updated.
Snookeroo by Fuzzyjefe	Dec 9th, 2008 01:27:23 PM
You are correct. Trades are collections of several issues. There are occaisionally single stories done in that format; see Alan Moore's last League of Extraordinary Gentlemen: the Black Dossier, or Azzarillo's Joker just released. But these are few and far between these days.
FYI: The Fables pilot is gonna tank by Psynapse	Dec 9th, 2008 01:41:45 PM
"Stu Zicherman and Raven Metzner, the duo who penned the Jennifer Garner-starring “Elektra” and have been tapped to write a screenplay for “Deathlok,” are scripting the “Fables” pilot." Uhh...yeah. Sadly I actually watched that twitching abortion on a DVD rental. A six-legged Go Nagai vagina demon with my grandmother's face coming out of the quim couldn't make me want to rip my eyes out more than rancid piece of shit did.
"than that rancid piece of shit" by Psynapse	Dec 9th, 2008 01:43:22 PM
Goddamn lack of an edit feature.....
Snook by Joenathan	Dec 9th, 2008 02:41:14 PM
An Omnibus is just a REALLY big trade.
Actually, Psynapse... by SleazyG.	Dec 9th, 2008 02:54:10 PM
...I still think "Elektra" is a better movie than "Daredevil". Seriously.
Yo Sleazy... by Psynapse	Dec 9th, 2008 03:47:16 PM
That's like comparing a solid turd to diarrhea. F'reals.
Elektra and price rape. by The Heathen	Dec 9th, 2008 03:48:53 PM
Sleazy, love ya man, but Elektra is far worse than DD, but to be fair it is like choosing what flavor of doo doo is better. Elektra is on par with Ghost Rider as the worst of the Marvel movies I'd say. Debate! $3.99? Fuck you Marvel and DC. I know a thing or two about printing costs and it's more than robbery charging even $2.99, much less $3.99. I'm out for the most part. I'll get my Geoff Johns issues and Walking Dead and maybe something like Batman to keep somewhat in the loop, but it's going to be trade waiting for me from here on out. Trade waiting in itself is a pain in the ass. I don't know how many versions (paperback, HC, absolute/omnibus, 6 issue arcs, 12 issue collection, ie.) there will be and how available they will be when I want to purchase. I like HC mega collections personally. For instance, I'd like to have the Sinestro Corps War in one nice HC collection. It doesn't have to be an absolute (that would be cool though), but I don't want to buy 2-3 smaller volumes of it. So the comic book companies also need to get their collections organized too, but that isn't likely to happen. I'm with my Cogs on this whole thing. Arghh. Shig, the little Iron Man and Hulk ponchos they are shelling in the Marvel in house ads annoy me the most. They also look like Axel Alonso just took a cheap digital camera home and took a picture of his kid and used that. Good day @$$holes!
Sometimes diarrhea's preferable to a solid turd. by SleazyG.	Dec 9th, 2008 04:20:36 PM
At least when you're on the giving end...
I'd still rather watch "Elektra"... by SleazyG.	Dec 9th, 2008 04:22:21 PM
...than either of the FF movies--dear god did they suck. And "Ghost Rider" becomes even worse on the second viewing. And the third. I dunno, man..."Elektra" was bad, but it wasn't "Rise Of The Silver Surfer" bad...
Rise of the Silver Surfer vs. Elektra by The Heathen	Dec 9th, 2008 04:31:54 PM
Okay, I didn't have it in me to watch Ghost Rider more than once. Same for Elektra. However, I found that the first FF movie lowered that expectations so much that I actually enjoyed the second one on a popcorn level. I watched it once in theaters and once on HBO and didn't hate it either time. It's not good, but it is better than Ghost Rider and Elektra. I think it's better than DD too, but that's not saying much. I dunno man, Elektra is just so horribly bad. Ghost Rider… ughhh. Yep.
Having stepped out of the way-back machine by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 04:38:40 PM
here's what I'm looking at for a first-glance pull list: •Captain America #1 to current by Brubaker •World War Hulk •Sinestro Corps War/Green Lantern •Invincible � �Secret Six Follow up with: •ILLUMINATI LoEG From what I've been able to discern, 52, Countdown, and identity Crisis are just too damn extensive to try to catch up on. I dunno -- the list I have already looks like 6 months' investment and a car payment, so I'll just have to see. Thanks very much everyone for your help -- am I missing anything vital?
Snookeroo---- by Fuzzyjefe	Dec 9th, 2008 04:46:20 PM
You're gonna have a nice welcome back with that list. I pimped Invincible, so you know where I stand on that. I'll back up everyone that's praised the Lantern books--they have been kick ass for a while (thanks to my brother for letting me read those). Couldn't really comment on the other titles, but usually if it's praised by most on this talkback, it's usually quality. You, my good man, are about to belly up to a veritable feast of comic riches.
Fuzzyjefe by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 05:46:18 PM
My one regret is that it doesn't look like Superman is front line in the quality war; but if these titles are anything like All Star Superman, I can't wait!
No offense, TheHeathen... re: printing costs by GrantChastain	Dec 9th, 2008 08:28:12 PM
Printing costs are only a small slice of the entire cost of producing a comic, especially if you're a big house like Marvel or DC. In addition to printing cost, you have to factor in the distribution costs (Diamond takes at least half your cover if you're a small pub, and even Marvel & DC are paying a significant chunk directly to them); the human cost (i.e., you have to pay your artists and writers, unless you're a smaller house that's willing to weather shitloads of bad press); and the advertising and promotional cost (meaning any ads or promotional materials for books that are about to hit shelves). These things are all not free and must be paid out from the revenue earned on producing the books themselves. If you think making comic books is as easy as slapping Spidey's face on a front cover and then sitting back and counting the ducats, I'm sorry to have to break this all to you. Just because you've got a cousin that works for Quebecor or you know a couple print-on-demand places doesn't make you an expert. Like Jim Breuer said in "Half Baked", it's, like, way more complicated than that. Bottom line: Are Marvel & DC making profits? You'd better hope so, or that's the end of the whole comics gravy train. But as I said in a previous post, the rising costs of comics are due to a lot of mitigating market factors, and most of the factors are transparent to the reader. You only notice when the cover price goes up.
Comics were originally considered throw-away material by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 08:57:51 PM
because they were used as a way to keep the rollers clean between "real" runs of press. Reprints of the Sunday funnies; that kind of thing, of course -- no original material. Nobody ever dreamed at that time that a comic would become a whole industry unto itself.
Way -back-machine? by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:08:19 PM
You sure you don't mean future machine? Are those bullet points in a talkback and some weird question mark diamond thingers? How Snookeroo how?
steverodgers by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 09:35:29 PM
Simple -- just hold down the alt key and type 0149 -- voila! bullets •
testing by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:36:46 PM

testing 2 by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:37:45 PM
bullets
CRAP! by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:38:40 PM
bullets
sigh by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:39:04 PM

Sorry Everyone by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 09:42:33 PM
I'm going to go into an old Talkback and figure this shit out.
SR by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 10:17:19 PM
Click the curser as if you were going to type a letter. The curser will be flashing, as usual. Hold down the alt key, and type 0149 (while holding down the alt key) -- then let off the alt key. Try that and see if it works! • For a Windows machine, not a Mac, btw.
SR by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 10:19:15 PM
NOTE: that's ZERO 149, not "O" 149.
by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 10:33:44 PM

Snook by steverodgers	Dec 9th, 2008 10:35:01 PM
You are the master! I blaming my computer even though its clearly user error.
SR by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 10:43:06 PM
If all else fails, go to: start programs ac cessories system tools character map select teh bullet, cut and paste. Voila! Good luck!
dammit this TB needs an edit feature by Snookeroo	Dec 9th, 2008 10:43:48 PM

offscauta by krushjudgement	Dec 10th, 2008 02:48:09 PM
That makes sense. I'm a moron.
Captain America by Bluejack	Dec 10th, 2008 02:48:57 PM
This isn't your old style Cap, Snook. The title is very cerebral at times and you have to read a few issues to get the tone of the stories. I think of them as spy/war stories with cap and bucky as the stars. I've been going back and reading Brubaker's older work, and he is amazing. I need to start reading 'Criminal' but my pull list is just getting too long for this economy.

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