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Sadly, not very surprising...
by -guyinthebackrow
Nov 6th, 2008
05:57:33 PM
This looks terrible.
So...already cancelled then...
by Drath
Nov 6th, 2008
05:58:20 PM
I honestly do not know how ANY genre show ever got multiple seasons. Surely the audience that made those old shows successes isn't gone! Networks, you really need to learn how to cultivate your hits or--maybe more to the point--start making DVR and Tivo part of your plan to make money instead of ignoring it.
The show doesn't look very good
by Prior Walter
Nov 6th, 2008
05:59:48 PM
So I'm not surprised. Hopefully I'm wrong because I'd love to see something on TV even half as good as Angel was.
No!
by TrumpyEatsPotatoes
Nov 6th, 2008
06:00:47 PM
No!
i'll still watch, or at least tivo, but...
by coachaaron
Nov 6th, 2008
06:04:49 PM
it's definitely going to get canned fast. i'm a life long whedon fan, i've loved everything he's done but this just doesn't look impressive to me. i can't quite explain why, it might just be the style/look of the footage but it doesn't look great to me. it's sad because whedon is a talented guy who for some reason has trusted fox again? he should go to showtime or hbo and create something that's a little more adult, a little more violent to appeal to his now grown up buffy/angel/firefly core of fans.
Just when you think they'd learned their lesson...
by MrD
Nov 6th, 2008
06:06:46 PM
Let's hope Wheedon was smart enough to write a continuity light first season, and, if the reviews are good, Fox is smart enough to change the time slot BEFORE cancelling it.
FX?
by br1947
Nov 6th, 2008
06:07:31 PM
Why even bother with the night 'o death, just move it to FX on a decent night. Take off the broadcast filter, go hardcore naked Dushku, and run wild!
WOW. Fuck you FOX.
by nalapou
Nov 6th, 2008
06:08:00 PM
Gah!
by RenoNevada2000
Nov 6th, 2008
06:10:21 PM
Fuck you FOX in the ass with the broken end of a telephone pole.
Do Fox executives band together like schoolyard bullies
by skimn
Nov 6th, 2008
06:10:25 PM
and devise ways to entice, then destroy show by Whedon and his cohorts. Firefly, Drive, The Inside, Wonderfalls, etc. Maybe Joss should go to FX. At least he'd get a full season, or at least 13 episodes, on the air.
Gotta agree with O Goncho on this one
by Lyghthouse
Nov 6th, 2008
06:10:47 PM
After how thoroughly Fox shafted Firefly, I can't believe Whedon actually decided to work with them again. This news is, sadly, not the least bit surprising. Oh, and fuck you Fox.
just watched
by frank cotton
Nov 6th, 2008
06:11:36 PM
SERENITY - more like that, and less like this, please.
Nun-na-nah-nah, Nun-na-nah-nah, hey-ay-ay . . .
by gruntybear
Nov 6th, 2008
06:11:50 PM
GOOOOOOOODDBYYYYYEE!!!! Just like before, Fox does it again. Told you so.
Dumb Premise
by LosVientos668
Nov 6th, 2008
06:13:31 PM
This is what happens when Joss sits down with Eliza at lunch and a show pops out. Seriously dumb idea and it shows...I guess Fox thinks so too.
Didn't Joss say he had an idea for a Procedural once?
by Drath
Nov 6th, 2008
06:14:59 PM
It's time to sell out and make a procedural, Joss. CSI Fargo or something. Work in doctors or lawyers and if you must indulge in fantasy include lots of people looking at monitors while a hot couple strips inside a talking car! Quality clearly doesn't matter when shit like Raising the Bar and Knight Rider are the big hits over the likes of Journeyman and Pushing Daisies. Compromise, make something that sells on a brainless level, and then get creative when you have a hit. Also, that fan-made Faith show actually looks good, I'd buy it was real except for shitty graphics and the oddball cast choices (though I could see the guy from Alias working in Buffyverse).
it's over...
by nora inu
Nov 6th, 2008
06:15:54 PM
why the fuck did fox even bother??? did they not know what they were getting into? and why the fuck did joss think that this time would be different!!!! i echo the above comment about sticking on FX. this blows.
Terminator...
by Bouncy X
Nov 6th, 2008
06:23:57 PM
so they go ahead and give it a full season only to dump it on friday? doesnt that defeat the point?
"They've changed. They're not like that anymore"
by Paul T. Ryan
Nov 6th, 2008
06:26:57 PM
I swear, it's like Joss is an abused spouse and FOX is an abusive husband. Why the hell did you pitch ANYTHING to them Joss?????
Why does FOX hate their shows?
by NivekJ
Nov 6th, 2008
06:27:54 PM
Just tell me why. As much shit as people gave Speed Racer and The Happening this past summer, it will NEVER compare to the death throes of "I Want To Believe". No fan of any fictive media has known pain like that. Not even Star Trek V or Star Trek: Nemesis. And it was
Why does FOX hate their shows? Pt. 2
by NivekJ
Nov 6th, 2008
06:29:03 PM
And it was FOX who destroyed Brisco County and Firefly. What next?! Huh? WHAT NEXT?!!
Fox Executives have smallest weiners in Hollywood
by ENAN
Nov 6th, 2008
06:33:14 PM
The show with the most potential gets shafted. Fringe and Terminator are so weak. Eliza and Joss are a powerhouse combo! Faith is one of the best characters in television history. Can you imagine if this show was supported as it should be?
hey here's an idea.....
by earlfist
Nov 6th, 2008
06:36:31 PM
As Whedons career is fast plummetting into the crapper, I wonder if he's considered this.... A movie of that great cult hit series "buffy the vampire slayer" I know nobody ever has ever mentioned this ever before, especially on this site, but it just came to me in a flash of genius! I expect the massive success of the 2nd x files movie will help this get greenlit! I know SMG is probably busy with her dedicated series of straight to video classics. I bet also she is sorely missed by her fellow actors! Anyway just an idea.
Josh "I'll never work with FOX again' Whedon
by Manos
Nov 6th, 2008
06:37:08 PM
Uh huh.
BASTARDS!
by Centipede Damascus
Nov 6th, 2008
06:37:28 PM
Bastard coated bastards with bastard filling!
A Dollhouse TB, right on top of another Dollhouse TB
by Big Jim
Nov 6th, 2008
06:40:46 PM
Has there ever been another show that had so many threads before even one episode has aired?
Why does Whedon go back to Fox?
by aversiontherapy2
Nov 6th, 2008
06:42:33 PM
Then again they have renewed Terminator for another season...
I wonder
by EvilElecBlanket
Nov 6th, 2008
06:51:21 PM
If Fox will have the balls to air 9 or 10 episodes, and then charge $60+ for the DVD because of the un-aired shows.
Dissapointed with FRINGE, I was looking forward to this
by zooch
Nov 6th, 2008
06:59:05 PM
but now it looks D.O.A.
*swear words*
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
07:08:54 PM
NG: Yes. It really is this thing of executives loving the smell of their own urine and urinating on things. And then more execs come in, and they urinate. And then the next round. By the end, they have this thing which just smells like pee, and nobody likes it.

JW: There's really no better way to put it.

TIME, 9/25/05, Interview Neil Gaiman & Joss Whedon

Who's surprised? I mean really? No one, especially Joss Whedon.

But...
by doubleARon
Nov 6th, 2008
07:09:53 PM
It's not the same world as the world that Firefly (semi)launched in. For instance, ad revenue from internet viewing, and a Whedon fanbase that is poised for instant activity (rather than the slowly brewed Browncoats.)

I really love Firefly but never really got into anything else Joss has done. Maybe the fact that Terminator is renewed means that there is some hope with these back-to-back.

Maybe Fox can find a way to make money off these shows, because that's the only thing that will save them.

< / raw optimism >

Friday the 13th
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
07:12:25 PM
(Also the day of Angel's cancellation) I go out Fridays! Who the hell stays in on a Friday??
GORDON RAMSAY'S "HELL'S KITCHEN" STARTS COOKING THURSDAY, JAN. 2
by Series7
Nov 6th, 2008
07:12:38 PM
Is this going to become a year round thing?

Also good to know that they are going to kill of Terminator the TV show as well. That's what you get for voting democrat. Murdoch is gonna fuck you all by destroying anything good.

Whedon just needs to start his own network
by nytivofan
Nov 6th, 2008
07:13:19 PM
Monday: Dollhouse Tuesday: Firefly 2 Wednesday: Slayer School Thurday: Dr. Horrible-The Series Friday-Sunday: reruns of Buffy and Angel
Wait for the DVD.
by LordEnigma
Nov 6th, 2008
07:13:48 PM
I am not even going to bother to watch this series. It stands ZERO chance of surviving because this is FOX FRIDAY NIGHT and not NBC FRIDAY NIGHT. So I thank Joss for giving me another show to love, that's going to be cancelled.
I recently saw Firefly for the first time.
by Deathpool
Nov 6th, 2008
07:21:38 PM
I'm sorry. I'm so, so sorry.
Man that list of shows fox cancelled...
by paulrichard
Nov 6th, 2008
07:24:44 PM
is depressing to look at. Harsh Realm, Millenium and Firefly were all shows I really enjoyed. Didn't Fox also air VR 5 on Friday nights?
TOLD YOU SO
by snowpuff
Nov 6th, 2008
07:31:07 PM
It's been so obvious that this show was toast before it even aired. Whedon wasn't into it, Fox wasn't into it. Production problems, pilot problems, Fox problems, Joss problems.

You can't blame Fox for this one. This show was never going to happen. From the FIRST picture I saw of this show, which showed a bored Eliza Dushku walking through a wide set that looked amazingly like Wolfram & Hart's lobby from Angel... I thought "Jeez, someone is really phoning this in."

You really have to consider that not everyone on Earth is out to get Joss Whedon. This show is a mess.

Snowpuff, over and out!
*high fives Deathpool*
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
07:46:58 PM
Right on, brother. I looked up some of your posts - seemed it was the fanatical "Browncoats" that, let's face it, trolled the talkbacks when Serenity came out that turned you off, yeah? Or was it something else?
Oh balls
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
07:55:43 PM
Someone is suggesting on Whedonesque that the twitter Fox sent out re: scheduling changes had gone out before some people on the show even knew about it. That's fucking terrible. And par for bone munching executives. Slimy dickwhistles.
I lurve Joss, but he's got no one to blame but himself.
by Pennsy
Nov 6th, 2008
07:58:34 PM
Sad, but true.
Set your dvr's or tivo's
by johnnyangel
Nov 6th, 2008
07:59:04 PM
Who watches TV shows at their scheduled times anyway?
It sucks to be us
by johnnyangel
Nov 6th, 2008
08:03:43 PM
A dozen stupid night time soap operas and only one show about robots from the future killing people. Why can't we have more quality TV!!!!
Damn them all to hell
by yodaismyhomie
Nov 6th, 2008
08:16:54 PM
Ok...if Joss creates a show you can expect it to be quality. The earliest ads for Firefly didn't interest me but it was one of the greatest shows ever made. Even the early ads for Buffy (and the abysmal movie they had already made) didn't interest me but I loved the show. Dollhouse will probably be awesome because Joss created it but damn FOX for already signing its death certificate
Well, then what WOULD be a wise choice for FOX friday?
by wackybantha
Nov 6th, 2008
08:43:10 PM
A test pattern? They have to put something on, right?
And on Friday the 13th no less....
by fishpillow
Nov 6th, 2008
08:46:53 PM
Wow
by fishpillow
Nov 6th, 2008
08:47:19 PM
I mean just wow....
Wonder how much of an influence...
by Christopher3
Nov 6th, 2008
08:51:03 PM
Hulu figures have on greenlight. Might explain the decision to reup Terminator.
fuck Fox, fuck them in their stupid asses
by newc0253
Nov 6th, 2008
08:59:19 PM
aren't there other networks or cable channels that are willing to work with Whedon? there's got to be *some* way Whedon can get his stuff on air without being perpetually screwed in the ass by these douchebags.
Fuck.
by robogeek.com
Nov 6th, 2008
09:00:55 PM
Let the mourning commence.
I just don't understand you, Fox...
by Ribbons
Nov 6th, 2008
09:08:27 PM
...no matter who comes and who goes, your network seems to have a knack for putting, per volume, the most interesting shows on the air... and then treating them like shit and inevitably cancelling them.
Anyone remember Drive?
by Series7
Nov 6th, 2008
09:23:17 PM
Yeah me neither.
I like Terminator quite a bit...
by lynxpro
Nov 6th, 2008
09:25:17 PM
It certainly is better than T3 even without Arnold in it. And I am still amazed that Brian Austin Green can actually come off as a bad ass too. As for Fox, I have no faith in the Fox [Broadcasting] Network, but F/X totally kicks ass in its original programming. I didn't think originally that I'd dig *Sons of Anarchy* but I really do. If *The Shield* were to stay on one more season, I'd love to see a cross-over since they share some of the same street gangs [the 1-9ers, for example]. Sure, Jay Karnes has been on both shows as different characters, but that wouldn't stop a shared 'verse considering how many characters Terry O'Quinn played in the Chris Carter 'verse.
fox.com
by johnnysunshine
Nov 6th, 2008
09:36:16 PM
At least this is premiering in a landscape where you can catch the episodes on the internet that you missed cause you have a life on Friday nights. Television needs a new Joss Whedon show and I hope the history of Friday night on Fox doesn't kill this series.
Yeah
by Cobbio
Nov 6th, 2008
09:38:14 PM
Thanks for the update, Herc. I'm not surprised about "Dollhouse," unfortunately. Not because Fox execs were difficult about it this time, but because the footage just doesn't look very good. I'm mostly a big fan of Joss Whedon, and I loved "Firefly," but I question whether Eliza Dushku has the acting chops to pull off a lead role. I hope she'll surprise me, and I'm excited to see the smiles and curves she exudes, but I don't know if she'll last long in a lead role.

I hope I'm wrong, though. I'll be tuning in for the premiere in January.

"Fox’s “Terminator,” whose ratings have plummeted since last sea
by snowpuff
Nov 6th, 2008
09:46:38 PM
Also forgot to mention: As usual, Herc brings us the super objective coverage. Dollhouse, which has had no end of bad news, gets gleeful jubilant press. Terminator, which has actually slightly improved its ratings recently, gets one line and as usual Herc expresses his objective view by simply describing the show in the worst light possible. Apparently, the producers of Terminator SCC didn't send Herc a free hat or something similar. Your readers keep saying they like Terminator, you keep urinating on it.
I'm sick of this "death slot" nonsense
by bravogolfhotel
Nov 6th, 2008
10:07:06 PM
Whedon's apologist base would be handwringing about whatever slot the show got. It remains to be seen whether Fox noted the show to death, but Fridays at 9 represents a real opportunity, because all the networks have given up. ABC is running SUPERNANNY (cheap reality shit), CW has AMERICA'S NEXT TOP MODEL (more cheap reality shit), NBC is running CRUSOE (cheap foreign co-production), and CBS just has reruns. It's not like DOLLHOUSE is going up against CSI and GREY'S ANATOMY.
Prison Break finishes in December or so
by BitterMan23
Nov 6th, 2008
10:09:54 PM
It splits with 24. That's why it started earlier.
But really
by The Pelti
Nov 6th, 2008
10:10:53 PM
For the record, Brisco County, Sliders, and Millenium were not half-season death spiral shows like the rest of these. At one point I had a decade long string of fall seasons in which my favorite new show was cancelled. Fox definitely held the lions share of those, with ABC running a distant second, and I think NBC made the list as well. This is why we need to abandon the multiple season model and make shows more like the rest of the world, 8-15 episode series that are planned out from beginning to end, shot in one go, and aired in full. The writers strike killed a lot of shows, but there were a few that were better for it, Lost was able to kill the filler, Life turned in one of the most perfect half-seasons I've ever seen, and Terminator had a really strong launch. Trying to stretch a story over 24 episodes, which usually takes over 6 months, is just ridiculous. A nice, focused, 2-4 month run makes for better story telling, better performances, and, god willing, much less vapid procedural drivel.
Fox...
by kayleefan
Nov 6th, 2008
10:26:24 PM
you stupid motherf#@%*&$.
snowpuff
by Ribbons
Nov 6th, 2008
10:34:58 PM
What are you, a moron? The whole point of this article was that Herc thinks Fox just put Dollhouse on the chopping block; quite the opposite of "gleeful, jubilant press."
This really look like Whedon's fault
by frozenhamster
Nov 6th, 2008
10:34:59 PM
If you remember correctly the new Fox executives were excited as hell about a new Joss show. But the more they saw of what Joss actually had planned the less they believed in it. Even the writers on the show were having a hard time with it, which is what led to Whedon shutting down production to re-write a bunch of episodes himself. I really think that after Firefly, a show for which he truly created a new universe, his creative energy was sucked dry. And since then he's been spreading himself thin. The only truly great thing he's done since Serenity was Dr. Horrible. The reason? That was the only thing that seemed to come about perfectly naturally. Dollhouse never seemed that way. It always seemed like an excuse to get back into TV and to give Dushku her own show. I sincerely hope it's great, and if it is I hope to God it doesn't get canceled, but if it isn't great and it does get the shaft I won't be surprised, and the only person I'll be disappointed in is Joss.
"Hole in the Wall moves to Sundays"
by jdb1972
Nov 6th, 2008
10:41:44 PM
Because you know that's a show with ratings potential. Geez, a Magic 8-Ball could do the job of a Fox suit. And better.
Something I didn't understand..
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
10:45:37 PM
but I'm beginning to. I was kinda wondering to myself - after Joss's post about the re-working of epiodes to fit the execs standards - why there seemed to be a lack of communication between the two. I mean, it was like he was basically saying, "I sold them something they didn't know they were buying." And I could see that happening when you are buying cheese or something but a television show?

A quote: "He had me at 'hello,' " Reilly said. "I was kinda drunk with the surprise of it all. He laid out the whole concept but I think it was one of those things where I heard every other word of it."

So there you have it. The guy's a drunk. And, this guy, who might like Joss as a person and respect him as a artist, just doesn't understand where he is coming from. Joss - he of the cheeky language short-cutting and dramatic one shots - is a relatively thematic person. He covers serious issues with monster make-up and giddiness and flirtatiousness. Some people only see surface-y things. And if they focus more on the surface of the product, it is easier for them to package. But it makes for shit shows. Even worse news is that the LA Times is saying they had to reworked the 6th episode and are stalled on the 7th and Whedon isn't even on the set anymore because he is constantly re-drafting.

I wasn't really saying much about Dollhouse other than the fact i was exicetd to have Joss back on television. I had my doubts about Eliza's acting and thought that the existentialism Joss was going for was going to be too crazy deep for some. But I wanted crazy deep. Those assholes.

Whedon got his upbeat spin on
by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
11:14:59 PM
the complications, not Herc. And if Herc had posted a new TB to every article that discussed production problems? Super Jim has already complained of two Dollhouse TBs on top of one another and lord knows he ain't the first. A trailer and scheduling changes are news. Herc is one of the only editors on this site who doesn't treat it like his blog (I like blogs but you get my point?)
DVD date ?
by Miyamoto_Musashi
Nov 6th, 2008
11:19:25 PM
For the six aired episodes and the six unaired episodes.

I'm with the abused spouse analogy.

I love his creations, but he needs someone to do his strategy for him.

Is the FOX Network in therapy yet ?
by Miyamoto_Musashi
Nov 6th, 2008
11:21:08 PM
Given the election result, am sure they will be lashing out, and Joss Whedon comes across as very gay (yes I know he is married...) and very liberal.

Am just saying

The Show Should Be Scheduled After American Idol
by Media Messiah
Nov 6th, 2008
11:22:14 PM
If Fox was really serious about the series, they would have placed it behind American Idol, hence the reason this show should have been about college kids who are secret programmable agents, as it would have more easily attracted the American Idol demo. It's called cross promotion...and anchoring!!!

by buffywrestling
Nov 6th, 2008
11:29:07 PM
TV is crap
by Dark Knight Lite
Nov 6th, 2008
11:46:50 PM
and Joss Whedon fits right it. How's that Wonder Woman movie coming?
It's sad..
by Lissa-Triana
Nov 6th, 2008
11:58:16 PM
... how many of those Friday Fox shows I loved and how many of them I mourned when they were canceled. I will watch Dollhouse and I'm sure love every second of it... which knowing FOX will be about 2 or 3 episodes. And then I will give up on them all together. This is their last chance with me.
Fuller back on Heroes? Sure...
by buffywrestling
Nov 7th, 2008
12:18:51 AM
http://tinyurl.com/5zgn4y

I'm going to miss Pushing Daises :(

All of those shows that got canned sucked.
by Duke of Hurl
Nov 7th, 2008
12:31:18 AM
Even Sliders.
I SAID 7 EPISODES MAX-
by alice 13
Nov 7th, 2008
03:12:20 AM
maybe i should change that to 5.
Whedon must have had his memory cleaned!
by zooch
Nov 7th, 2008
03:13:09 AM
to ever to have worked with FOX again!
LOL
by medicinaluser
Nov 7th, 2008
03:25:40 AM
They know he's made a stinker again
Looks like those "Save Dollhouse" dweebs were right...
by MajorMajorMajor
Nov 7th, 2008
03:46:08 AM
Wow. Pretty much says it all doesn't it? When a bunch of fanboys and girls call it months before a show even airs. Fox should perhaps look at their scheduling and advertising practices if they're green-lighting shows that seem almost pre-ordained to get axed. Oh and fuck you, Fox.
I have no sympathy for "battered wife" Whedon
by V'Shael
Nov 7th, 2008
04:34:26 AM
I mean, sure, you gotta feel sorry for the guy, the first time Fox butt-rapes savagely in the bar.

And maybe even the second time.

But there comes a point, as he is shimmying into his slinky red dress, putting on the make up, and telling you that he's going over to Fox's place, that you just go "Hey, it's your funeral dude."

Terminator moves to Friday too????
by V'Shael
Nov 7th, 2008
04:35:24 AM
FUCK! There goes THAT show.
Looks like spring viewing will be light for me
by Jack Burton
Nov 7th, 2008
06:32:26 AM
Dollhouse is DOA, Terminator is obviously on the way out, Pushing Daisies is doubtful to be renewed, Shield is ending, Riches is gone, SoA will be over. The only dramas I'll be watching this spring are BSG, Lost, 24, House, and Fringe. Looks like I'll be catching up on my Netflix que.
ev1ldead : Prison Break ends in Dec/Jan
by V'Shael
Nov 7th, 2008
08:00:26 AM
There are only 16 episodes in Season 4 and then the show is over.

They air episode 13 around December 1st, so I figure they'll have the finale aired before end of Jan.

So now you have your excuse
by ulcer
Nov 7th, 2008
08:24:00 AM
So now you have your excuse for the future cancellation of this apparent turd. Someone to blame because Joss can't possibly have mean a barely average tv series, right? He probably went to Fox because he's doing this one as a favor to a friend. Perhaps you should watch 'my own worse ennemy' instead, it's similar in concept and probably more thrilling to watch. Although in either case, we don't know how long the interest can last.
Joss, leave FOX NOW!! Got to HBO, SHOWTIME, AMC, FX...
by MrFloppy
Nov 7th, 2008
08:40:33 AM
Go cable!
Fuck FOX
by _Maltheus_
Nov 7th, 2008
08:45:10 AM

They're shafting Dollhouse and Terminator, yet they're still throwing their weight around 24 (which is long past the point where it should have been canceled) and Fringe (which even regular viewers aren't that hyped on and couldn't give two shits about). Why did they even approve Dollhouse if they weren't going to support it for a least a few episodes?

As for Terminator, well that's the best show they have right now. I didn't really care about it in its first season, but it's really developed into something good in its second.

So way to go FOX, once you cancel these two shows, I'll have no more reason to watch your network. You suck!!! And the country sucks for now watching Pushing Daisies, but at least its good to hear that Fuller will go back to Heroes if that happens.

Terminator is a mule... I mean that in a good way
by MurderMostFowl
Nov 7th, 2008
09:27:32 AM
I'm sure there's an industry term for that, but I roll my own when I can :)
So, I've watched terminator since its inception and I can't help but praise it for being consistently good... good solid story, interesting characters ( even 90210 boy, though recently I'm getting bored with him, and wishing he would bitchslap his girlfriend ).
What it doesn't have is pointless multiple plottwists like Heroes. It doesn't have endless false suspense like 24 ( or dare I say Lost ). It doesn't have arbitrary plot extending, climax delays like Prison Break ( and Lost ) or retconish, we-planned-it-this way-no-really storylines (chalk another one up for Lost...)
It's a good solid show, and may not be a pretty show horse, but it works hard and gets the job done.
Will be cancelled by the first commercial break of the pilot epi
by TVguy4566
Nov 7th, 2008
09:28:18 AM
I already fully expect this show to suck anyway. From it's inception it look doomed to fail. Just because Eliza Dushku and Joss Whedon wanted to work together again, they should have done something more substantial than a series based on a brainstorming lunch between the two. It is quite clear that they rushed it into production before they had a clear vision of the show.

Unlike Firefly, I think Fox may be giving Whedon a merciful death than showcase a series that looks to be ill-conceived by doing something like pairing it with 24 or Fringe. I don't know if I blame Fox on this one. I have a feeling this show is going to deserve its Friday night timeslot. Maybe even deserve to be paired with Cops on Saturday.
Where's "The Cleveland Show" and "Sit Down, Shut Up"?
by BillBrasky2620
Nov 7th, 2008
09:33:10 AM
I thought both those shows were supposed to be midseason shows. Are we going to have to wait until summer to see them?
A Hercules Haiku
by Aquatarkusman
Nov 7th, 2008
09:43:36 AM
Whedon! Joss Whedon! / Whedon! Joss Whedon! Joss Whedon! / Whedon! Joss Whedon!
I time-shift every series I watch.
by kabong
Nov 7th, 2008
09:49:23 AM
Network scheduling does not affect me.

Technology liberates me from your tentacles, networks.

MUUUUAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHH!

Fox’s So-Called Friday Death Slot
by Big Jim
Nov 7th, 2008
09:49:37 AM
Dark Angel - 2 seasons

Millenium - 3 seasons

Sliders - 5 seasons

And didn't fanboy's heads explode when Fox moved X-Files from Friday to Sunday night, believing it was a terrible decision and they would not follow it to its new night?

ONE PHRASEE
by PyrateBrian
Nov 7th, 2008
10:02:48 AM
GOD I LOVE TIVO!
Gee, Fox if you really think Friday is a good slot
by nam0krut
Nov 7th, 2008
10:13:25 AM
then move House and American Idol to fridays, lets see how well they do then!
A real Whedon haiku
by V'Shael
Nov 7th, 2008
10:20:44 AM
He says he loves me.
Can't hear him, over my screams
So he speaks with fists.
Reply to Big Jim
by Agentcoop007
Nov 7th, 2008
10:50:27 AM
Mr Big Jim, I understand the point you are trying to make, but the fact is..... Sliders didn't stay on Friday nights at FOX for 5 seasons, only 3, and that was mostly because it had X-Files as a lead in for the three months its first season aired in 95, then season 2 & 3 aired back to back over 14 months in 96/97 it lived the rest of its life on sci-fi after that. Millenium took over the hole X-files left after leaving for Sundays (when that show hit mainstream). Dark Angel never did well at Fridays and only lasted two season because of James Camerion. Fridays for Sci-fi shows is a big mistake as its target viewership isn't home to watch, and say what you will about downloads and DVR but TV honcos still look at ratings first. Mark my words, this will kill both shows before May, and fox will just put more reality shows on Fridays where they belong. -Neil-
Hahahahaha!
by thedarklinglord
Nov 7th, 2008
11:04:53 AM
Perfect. The show looks like utter crap and deserves a quick death. Whedon should just stick with milking the dead horse of Buffy in comic form if he can't learn better than to hand his projects over to Fox. I mean, seriously, do they have a contract that entitles them to his soul and, thus, everything he creates in this life, or do they offer him so much money for the initial idea that he abandons all hope of the project having any longevity? Because you'd think that after the way Fox screwed him on Firefly, he'd know better than to sell any of his brainchildren to a network that honestly doesn't believe in the programs they air.

Whedon going back to Fox...it's like a battered wife returning to her abusive husband because he promises this time will be different; there comes a point where you just shake your head at the dumb bitch and pray the asshole kills her and puts her out of her misery already, feeling certain that she deserves it for being so goddamn weak and stupid. If Dollhouse gets cancelled after six episodes, good. It serves Whedon right.
The more Whedon shows I watch...
by Cash907
Nov 7th, 2008
11:23:05 AM
the more I'm starting to think the man deserves what he gets. As much of a creative genius he obviously is, there has to be a darkside to him that we the audience don't see. Fox was heavily behind this series (two hour premier with limited commercial interruptions, huge ad blitz, great timeslot)right up until word got out that they wanted a new pilot. We thought nothing of it seeing how they pulled the same crap with Firefly, but then they axed the original pilot altogether, and now they banish it to Friday night hell, hardly mentioning it at all in the above press release? What could have possibly happened in that short span of a few months to cause such a drastic change, especially in this turbulent television season when getting the most bang for their buck is essential?
Does this timeslot issue matter as much anymore?
by tinkergraphics
Nov 7th, 2008
12:12:09 PM
A larger percentage of people now have DVRs then in past years. If I really want to watch a show it does not matter when it is on.
slot matters: ratings determine survival, dvrs don't help
by chromedome
Nov 7th, 2008
01:15:42 PM
Fox proves once again what utter TOOLS they are--Put the damn shows on nights when viewers are HOME TO WATCH.

If they want to boost Friday night ratings, they should put established shows there with loyal audiences. To put brand new shows there is just stupid. Put the American Idol show on Thu/Fri night--presto--ratings on Friday.

To restore balance, SciFi channel creates Wrestlling Block
by chromedome
Nov 7th, 2008
01:18:59 PM
for Friday nights....

Both networks are so dumb, they must be run by twins separated at birth

so why doesn't Dollhouse get the post-Idol slot
by oisin5199
Nov 7th, 2008
01:35:41 PM
on Wednesday, instead of the Lie to Me which, despite starring Tim Roth, seems like another Mentalist/ Psych/ Raines/ Bones type procedural. Fuck you, Fox.
SESLY WHO WATCHED TV ON FRIDAY NITES?
by dr.bulber
Nov 7th, 2008
01:46:16 PM
whedonites do so this is a perfect place for it.
the time has come to bypass the mainstream networks
by chromedome
Nov 7th, 2008
01:49:40 PM
Direct to DVD should be the path for the truly creative and original: let the networks do "reality" and "competition/elimination" shows, and become synonymous with mediocrity.

Direct to DVD will allow creative control, no on-screen watermarking, branding, and advertising for other shows (SciFi is using up the bottom third of the screen for this crap now), and can reach the audience.

Change the Paradigm!!!

Terminator: TSCC is a marketing tool...
by tiredpm
Nov 7th, 2008
01:49:45 PM
...for the new movie coming out next summer, that's why it was given a full season pick-up. I enjoy the show for what it is, but when it got a pick-up it seemed blatant corporate synergy to me, not faith in a show with deathly ratings.

As for Dollhouse, I think it's time to acknowledge that perhaps the behind the scenes drama is indicative of a troubled show. If there's anyone that can clarify the level of network involvement versus creative issues with the production company I'd love to hear them. Not Whedon-love, just honest assessment.

I do agree that with DVRs being more prevalent the timeslot is less important but it still will determine the shows life or death -- and I'd have to assume death at this time.

When I heard Firefly was gonna air Friday's...
by _Maltheus_
Nov 7th, 2008
01:50:37 PM
...I barely watched it because I knew it was a prelude to a quick cancellation. I didn't really grow to love it till it hit DVD. Hopefully Dollhouse will get several more episodes out of it. But it is the same bullshit, all over again.
Why doesn't Whedon
by I am_NOTREAL
Nov 7th, 2008
01:53:58 PM
try to get a deal going with Showtime or HBO? You may only get one 10 to 13 ep season, but at least you're gonna get that much...probablt won't have the plug yanked after 3 airings (or 2 or 1)
ok, I'm calmer now. Here's why.
by oisin5199
Nov 7th, 2008
01:58:39 PM
Dollhouse would most likely get killed post-Idol. On Fridays, it wouldn't be expected to perform highly as it would on a weekday. Fox are trying to resurrect their X-Files/Millenium type genre programming on Friday. Pairing it with Terminator, which has a full season order will give it a good lead-in. DVRs play a big role in genre programming, and they're probably betting Joss's built-in fanbase will follow it there. BSG was able to hang on to a good audience on Fridays. So it may have a better chance on Friday than it would earlier in the week. This doesn't have to be a disaster. We'll see how it goes. Even if it dies, 6 episodes of a Joss show is better than several seasons of other crap shows.
Whedon is not too bright if he thinks FOX has changed.
by mrfan
Nov 7th, 2008
03:00:17 PM
Also, this show just doesn't look too good. If it goes the same route as Firefly then the fanboys will blaming FOX instead Whedon.
WHY FOX WHY??
by top1tony
Nov 7th, 2008
03:53:30 PM
:{ I HATE YOU FOX
Buffy the Vampire Slayer movie
by frozen01
Nov 7th, 2008
04:18:10 PM
Um, didn't they make one of those already?
frozenhamster
by frozen01
Nov 7th, 2008
04:18:32 PM
Great name :)
Millennium got ass-raped.
by Johnny Smith
Nov 7th, 2008
04:39:16 PM
And apparently, all it needed was a fourth season to finish the story, instead of a shitty, shitty X-Files episode that had nothing to do with Millennium at all.
sci-fi extravaganza
by crazybubba
Nov 7th, 2008
06:33:14 PM
why don't j.j. abrams, joss whedon and chris carter get together and create a super tv show? Seriously why don't the best creators work together more like spielberg and lucas? Is it an ego and creative control thing?
I don't envy anyone on this production
by buffywrestling
Nov 7th, 2008
08:16:01 PM
And what I think the worst of it, is that people aren't going to watch when the show actually airs. Because of the attitude of "Fuck Fox" or abused!Whedon. And the most redonkulous thing, is that no one - NONE OF YOU - have seen one episode. Fans , nor critics. It is one thing when there is an episode given to critics before hand and they trash it. If you trust those critics, then I can see you being all meh.

But nobody knows what the fuck is happening with this show. There are disturbing facty rumours. Nobody gets what Joss is going for. The execs are intervening. There are rewrites. There are delays.

Sometimes I think it is a double edged sword that Joss's fanbase and him self is so interconnected with the internet. He seems aproachable and his fans love him for it. But we crave everything thing behind the scenes. And sometimes it's shit that we just don't want to hear.

But it really doesn't make sense to me to abandon a production before it happens. And I'm not talking about anti-whedon fans, I'm talking about people who have liked his shit.

A critically panned review is one thing, but most of the links I have read over the last 24 hours have tried to put a happy face spin on it (Yay!! sci/fi block). I am cynical and don't buy it. But I am also not going to NOT watch it because of the shit that has gone down. It's pussyfining to let others make a decision for you. Watch and hate it or watch it and love it.

on the subject of Whedon apologists...
by lynxpro
Nov 8th, 2008
12:06:48 AM
Sure, the Whedon apologists are annoying but they aren't half as annoying as the Russell T Davies apologists over in the UK. To them, that wanker is totally responsible for Doctor Who being a success obviously forgetting that the heavy lifting of revising the show was done back in 1996 by Phil Segal, that all the best episodes of the new show are written by Steven Moffat [and not RTD] and that RTD is merely a poor man's Joss Whedon. Of course, if you bring this up, then basically you are accused of a h8 crime because of said writer's orientation even though most would never call into question the writing talents of Chuck Palahniuk, Ryan Murphy, or others of this industry with the same orientation. Then again, they don't write crap.
CAN'T STOP THE SIG---PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!!
by YotzVonFrelnik
Nov 8th, 2008
12:34:13 AM
Things like this make life almost seem hopeless.
Take Dollhouse to CW!
by YotzVonFrelnik
Nov 8th, 2008
12:35:11 AM
Say what you will about The CW... but I'll bet they'd show more respect to Joss.
I disagree bacci
by buffywrestling
Nov 8th, 2008
04:02:24 AM
Not that I think that he couldn't be a good addition. But I think Joss is a bit of Diva. I don't begrudged him this; he knows what he likes. But he doesn't come off like a exec note taking guy. His level of compromise is slim when it comes to the story he wants to tell. And I appreciate his temperment. I would rather watch 40 Dr.Horribles on the net than see him sell out his vision for prime time.
hey photoman
by crazybubba
Nov 8th, 2008
02:23:38 PM
i sure love that mediocre crap he's feeding me. Firefly and Angel....mmmmm tasty.
sure, photoman
by oisin5199
Nov 8th, 2008
02:34:16 PM
because talent always = box office success or ratings. So that new Knight Rider show must be full of talented people because it got a full season order. Keep trying, dude.
Ribbons
by snowpuff
Nov 8th, 2008
03:17:02 PM
Are YOU a moron? Have you never read AICN? Have you NOT noticed that Herc has been relentlessly pushing this show for months? So he posts about the Friday slot - his version of calling something after the horse has already left the barn months ago. Wow.
More problems with Dollhouse, per the LA Times:
by Pennsy
Nov 8th, 2008
04:43:45 PM
Money quote: "On Thursday, it became obvious that the problems persist. Production on the seventh episode, which is supposed to begin (this) Monday, is being delayed at least a day because the script was in 'such bad shape', according to a source who requested anonymity. The script for the sixth episode also had big problems, causing production delays that left the cast and crew very frustrated, the source said."

Rest of the story here: http://tinyurl.com/6da8r3

re: Terminator: TSCC is a marketing tool...
by snowpuff
Nov 8th, 2008
07:01:31 PM
I couldn't agree more with the motivation for the TSCC full order this season. It's too bad, but it obviously is about the franchise, not the show...
Sci-Fi Channel
by lfhlaw
Nov 8th, 2008
08:53:04 PM
I think the Sci-Fi Channel should give him a call up and for him to create a series for their channel. I think they'd give Joss a much better chance to build an audience compared to Fox. Plus it would help build Sci-fi Channels Rep as long as they can finance his series. This beats Sci-fi picking up shows from overseas (Dr. Who, SJ chronicales, Primeval [soon]). And creating cheesy monster animal of the month or weather catastrophe of the month. With BSG ending it's run. I think alot of Joss's shows would have flourished on Sci-Fi Channel. Maybe not get the audience, but at least garner a following. BTW, anyone know what happened to the old Syndicated TV where u could have Conan the barbarian, Xena: Warrior princess, and Andromeda?
lfhlaw
by lynxpro
Nov 9th, 2008
11:57:22 AM
If you think Dollhouse will be better than Doctor Who, then you need to pass that weapons grade THC to another user. When Who returns in 2010, it will be without any scripts from the poor man's Joss Whedon named Russell T Davies. It will be fully helmed and mostly written by Steven Moffat who pretty soon they'll have to rename the Hugo Award in honor of him because he keeps winning the mofo. If one were to compare Moffat to Whedon in layman's terms, it would be like comparing a V-12 engine to a two-stroke. So no, don't go suggesting that SciFi replaces Doctor Who with Whedon's latest flop. Now, if you suggest SciFi add Dollhouse to their line up, then I'd support that but the way its going, it'll end up on G4.
The x-files and the simpsons..
by emeraldboy
Nov 9th, 2008
03:54:15 PM
made fox tv. When the x-files ended after its 9th and awful season. Fox has never had a sci-fi show like it. rightly or wrongly fox grew cold at the thought of doing any more sci-fi. or any show that would last more then one season. there is however the small matter of numbers. if shows are not rating well and private numbers dont stack up. the show will get cancelled. Fox just signed a humungous deal with everyone's fave feiry scot chef gordo. Reality tv pulls in the numbers. American idol get huge numbers. Who will people watch Idol or Dollhouse. idol will win everytime. as will Hells Kitchen. The landscape has changed since buffy, angel, x-files, and king of the hill first arrived on tv. the simpsons wont be around for ever either. it will be over in three years time.
Fox is the problem, Not Whedon
by chromedome
Nov 9th, 2008
05:43:09 PM
Fox wants suits involved in writing scripts, placing products. Whedon's failure is not as a writer, but in giving Fox another chance.

SCREW the Networks--do Direct to DVD.

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