Either way, the world needs more Superman movies.

In Bizarro universe.

Also the promotional tie in's this time were realistic (Hulk shilling for GNC health products throughout the month of June and July). I think they did what needed to be done to make the movie a success.

It's still a stupid ending but it drives me crazy that people look at it that way.

Leterrier's Hulk was good but he sounds a little giddy. I might be more circumspect in his position, you don't want to sound like an ass.

I don't know if a origin story would be a great idea, because the Donner film did so many things right, but they could give it a shot, maybe with setting up braniac for the sequel.

Superman is a hero made for the big screen, I have no idea how Singer could screw it up so much in Superman Returns. I mean, you got a hero that can do incredible things and what do you do? Make him carry a huge rock. Fucking awesome...

But yeah, Incredible Hulk is way overrated here. Its all flash no soul. The complete opposite of Superman Returns, which had a good concept but it lacked the spectacle and an formidable adversary for Supes. Lex is great and all, but hes been done already.

A Supes movie needs to take notes from Spiderman 2, great action, with great drama, in great balance. In my opinion Spiderman 2 is the best superhero film so far.

SM2 has great action scenes, BB is lacking in that department.

BB does have better characters, but the plot is a bit dopey. It's all great and good till the microwave thing starts. And it could pass if they made the 1st half of the film less serious, but the 2nd half is full of cheesy one-liners and the quality of the story takes a nosedive.

I said this earlier on these boards somewhere, but you can't base a movie so much in reality, and make a movie that takes itself so seriously, only to go to a completely unrealistic scenario and silly one-liners in the 2nd half. Where SM2 is silly and doesn't take itself one bit serious from the 1st frame.

Also the villains in BB cant compare to Doc. Ock in SM2.

I still love BB, it's the best superhero origin story, and I am really, REALLY looking forward to TDK.

I wish everybody (including Mark Millar) would just shut the fuck up and let Singer do his sequel. Does no one remember X2? Singer can bring it for a sequel, and now that he's got his Donner fetish out of the way, he can go forward with a new vitality, and bring on some Brainiac and Metallo. And I don't really want a Mark Millar Superman - let him stick to Kick Ass, and all his cynical revisionist superhero stuff - there's a place for that. Hell, if anything have him write the Avengers movie, since Ultimates was the best Marvel stuff he did. But keep him away from Superman. I agree with whoever said we don't need a 'hard-edged' Superman. Superman is not about being 'hard-edged' - it's about hope, nostalgia, and wonder, which Singer's first film had plenty of. So just lay off and let Singer do his thing.

The best Luthor example has been ongoing for years now...Rosenbaum's Luthor portrayal on Smallville; arguably the only brilliantly good thing in that series. And for the love of Christmas, big boobs, and edible panties, no more god damn bullshit Real Estate plots...please?

Damn, I miss Deadwood. Damn you surfers for brainwashing the writer!

Fuck Hollywood too. And Scriptgirl is a butterfaced chubbette. Definite two-bagger there.

However, I won't mind seeing Bosworth replaced with Rachel McAdams.

It was a Superman movie. Not THE Superman movie. You can say at least it was a continuation of the type of Superman created by the Donnor movie, which itself isn't really THE Superman. THE Superman doesn't really exist, given all the years and different interpretations from different storytellers.

Anyways, loved the film, have seen it maybe a dozen times now, and loved it more the last time I saw it than I did the first time. So, yeah, hope Singer's on board for the "Wrath of Kahn" sequel ... thus confirming that Superman Returns is the Star Trek: The Motion Picture of the "franchise."

Wolf at the Door, you're exactly right. This was an interpretation of Superman, not THE Superman because it doesn't exist. Except for the sloppiness in how they got there storywise, I actually loved the kid idea (maybe because I'm a new parent myself). Why is this soooo hard for people to get? Lois and her husband and her kid are what Kal-El cannot have but longs for. Supes' relationship with his father is similarly problematic, and Singer was drawing a parallel between Kal/Jor-EL and the kid/Clark, and how Clark's story is of the adopted child who never knew his father, even though that father is a huge presence in his life. And showing how James Marsden's character is a kind of Superman to his family, questioning the reason and purpose of a superhero in this day and age. Sure, the Lex thing and the land plot was stupid, and I'd also prefer the version of the character who's smart and tough and not obviously a criminal (like Smallville or the animated series). But so much was right. In many ways, the first movie felt like it was laying a lot of groundwork: redefine Supes in today's day and age, have him work through his Lois issues so that he can have a more mature relationship with her, etc. I really think so many people didn't like the movie because they didn't like seeing Supes deal with issues of growing up, relationships, and fatherhood. The deity is too human. But now he can move on and deal with the deity stuff again (angry god or whatever) and start working with power again. Just let Singer do the sequel and quit bitching.

He'd change Supes costume, his character (expect street lingo), his origin, his villains and he'd probably get Supes to take a piss on John Turturro or some other awesome actor of Turturros caliber.

If this thing happens by some freak accident, I name this film SINO and am getting copyrights on that.

But at the risk of turning this TB into something it's not, I'll refrain from my personal reasons...let's just say that the guy is a fucking douchebag...and, in my personal opinion, he needs to just go away and be a carpenter or maybe a plumber...

About Mark Millar, this comment by Warren Ellis at a recent convention says it all - Ellis told a crowd about a recent email from Millar: "Hi, Warren! I've been wanking into a big pile of cash all night!"

I'm not aware of any difficulties with the production but there were many purely 'ass' ideas in the script and I would have thought Singer to be able to go, "Wait a moment...you've got Superman getting beat up by Luthor's henchman due to the kryptonite continent one minute and then Supes picking up that giant kryptonie-infused continent in the next?" and then send in for re-writes or some new more capable screenwriters.

Me? I would have put it more like, "Are you buttmites fucking serious??! You're actually writing Kumar beating the shit out of Superman into my god damn script, you wanker assholes!?!?! Somebody get someone who was at least alive during the Donner film...someone who sees how Supes should be in film!!!" (as I think Supes is perfect in the 1st Donner film, not anybody else...especially Luthor, even with Hackman's genius performance...but I think Donner got Supes down just right and is the main reason Superman: The Movie is heralded as one of the greatest comic-book movies...perhaps).

Yes X1 was done on the cheap, but what was the excuse for SR? Reboot!

We saw what he could do with X-Men, which respected some of the origins but not a whole lot, yet it worked since there are so much to chose from that a little bit of tweaking was accepted by the fan base.

With Superman he got Lane to risk the life of her kid, lex got a fortune that in a way which would never stand a chance in court (movie or not got to keep that sort of thing in check); White was .. well without a soul; Olsen was right out of a 50's movie and probably the biggest virgin on earth (even The Beauty and the Geek geeks looked at the character and went "At least I'm not that much of an idiot!"; Superman and Clark were the most secondary character of a movie based on them; the story was copied right from the first two movies and a bunch of comic covers (which means NO STORY!); and the rest was even worse.

I can give credit to Spacey for his interpretation of Lex, it was great, actually the only good thing about the whole movie..

Letterier did great with Hulk, even if it wasn't a total reboot he made it worked on so many levels. He could do great things with this one also.

Aller Louis, accepte le poste!

Bale won't stick around forever, he's probably gone after his Bat trilogy is done. And JLA still needs to cast its own Batman also. You'll let the PERFECT Batman candidate and the only actor fans won't revolt against, be miscast as Superman??