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First?
by GeekyAnimeNerd79Beyotch
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:00:48 AM
Hrmmm?
dune coons
by Fat and Curious
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:00:51 AM
it feels so good
goddamnit you cunt
by Fat and Curious
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:01:06 AM
I was so close
Yeah, this does...
by GeekyAnimeNerd79Beyotch
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:02:03 AM
... sound lazily made. I might go watch it just to see his wife's cooter, though. Question of the day: Is a cooter hot while a baby is sticking out of it?
Geeky...
by Mezzanine
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:07:25 AM
Answer: NO.
omg...
by darrenspool
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:20:07 AM
I knew that Spurlock guy was a total loser, but this sounds like he's perhaps the biggest cunt ever.
Yeah, sounds pretty bad.
by TattooedBillionaire
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:20:50 AM
I liked Super Size Me, though, so there's a good chance I'll still check this one out.
Cooter with a baby sticking out?
by darrenspool
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:21:30 AM
Why would you find that sexy?
RE: Why would you find that sexy?
by GeekyAnimeNerd79Beyotch
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:23:22 AM
I could make so many horrible jokes but I'll just answer truthfully: I don't find it sexy at all. ;-)
How easy is it to get a fat chick into bed?
by MelvintheMopBoy
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:23:35 AM
Piece of cake.
Not Terribly Surprised
by FatherMcGruderKicksAssForTheLord
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:26:55 AM
I thought SuperSize Me boiled down to man eats mostly McDonald's, gets fat & unhealthy ... what a fuckin' news flash!

I wonder if, after this thing goes off with a pop & a fizzle at Sundance, The Weinstein's will still bother running it nationwide.

Does this count as another 'net-hype-flop?

This sounds great!!
by Giant Ape Balls
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:30:38 AM
Truely one of the most horrendous sounding ideas I've heard in a long time. What kind of idiot travels about asking people what they think of America and asking Arabs where Osama Bin Laden is? His ignorance is astounding!!
Not surprised either
by SpencerTrilby
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:32:29 AM
the whole hype was a sad joke, and it seems it fits the movie. It doesn't change the fact that Super-size me was excellent, but it really went to Spurlock's head. Sad.
Sounds like a reverse Borat.
by skywalkerfamily
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:36:52 AM
Is it sexy time.
So what do you think of America?
by theycallmemrglass
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:38:54 AM
Thats what he would probably have asked Osama, if he did by some freaky chance find him.
Glad to hear it's a failure.
by silentbobfan
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:41:20 AM
I thought he was a douche in Super Size Me so this isn't surprising. Eating McDonald's for a month straight makes you sick. Fuckadoodledo, any one with half a brain would know that. I hope this film puts an end to this guy.
Surely you found Bin Laden!
by The Dum Guy
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:57:46 AM
I didn't and don't call me Shirley...
Instead Of Spurlock...
by buster00
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:00:15 AM
...we should have sent Turok. Now HE would've gotten some answers, man.
Harry is an Idiot.
by Sakurai
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:02:50 AM
One of the worst moments in the history of AICN is when Harry posted that original story about this movie and actually considered that the rumors could be true. I was so sickened at such ignorance that I couldnt even post on the talkback saying how stupid it all was. I just threw my hands up into the air and said, "forget it, this is beyond any level of foolishness than I can suffer." Curse Moriarty's well crafted reviews for making me come back to this site.
More important: Burger King stopped selling the Whopper!
by Heckles
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:11:03 AM
Go Spurlock, go, go, go! Douchebag director makes douchebag movie. Do the math.
Here's....
by The Dum Guy
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:19:39 AM
...another look at how some see Spulock's genius,

http://tinyurl. com/2sdj5g

...just go to 'Whiskey'.
^remove space^
by The Dum Guy
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:31:41 AM
http://tinyurl.com/2sdj5g
< br>I don't know how those appear?
Next Documentary:
by FatherMcGruderKicksAssForTheLord
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:32:13 AM
"Needle In A Haystack"

Did he find it? Watch as Morgan rolls up his sleeves and gets "really dusty"! Watch as his wife watches him! Listen to his doctor hyperbolize!

One thing's certain: if his t-shirt rides up, Morgan's asscrack will certainly be itchy from all that chaff!

Sundance '09!

Sakurai
by HEADGEEK
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:40:09 AM
I was just reacting to what the mainstream media was reporting. That the Weinstein's paid $25million based on a few minutes of footage - and that Spurlock's camera man said they had "The Holy Grail" - with a film titled what this film was titled - That the film is a puff masturbation piece using the spector of Osama to attract attention is frankly unforgivable. Morgan Spurlock is clown shoes.
I don't remember seeing that story in mainstream media...
by Kirbymanly
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:00:43 AM
...I read about it first here. And I go to all of the major news websites.
Bin Laden is dead. Has been for some time.
by ELGordo
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:08:33 AM
So this documentary doesn't talk about that. Shameful. Benazir Bhutto talks mentions it in this interview with David Frost.

Check it out. http://tinyurl.com/33ejz4 It's right after the 6 minute mark.

Eating Mcdonals Everyday...
by Redfive!
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:18:18 AM
Is like smoking cigarettes,OF COARSE ITS NOT GOOD FOR YOU.Its been public knowledge for what 20-30 years that fast food is bad and if you eat it all the time YOU WILL GET FAT...Just like lung cancer from smoking,THIS DUDES A HACK.
wait, what did the Weinsteins pay for then?
by BadMrWonka
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:18:24 AM
strange that they would pay for something that was so clearly a disappointment. $25 million is a lot to pay for something that won't do that well on DVD (if it's as boring as it seems to be).

anyone else think something's fishy?

"HE DOESN'T EVEN TRY HARD TO LOOK FOR BIN LADEN"
by Mr Spork
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:24:44 AM
Is the George Bush biopic out already?
you idiots must never have SEEN Supersize Me
by BadMrWonka
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:26:20 AM
of course he knew fast food would be bad for him. the doctors told him, and he already knew it. the point was not just that eating a lot of fast food would be bad for you, but what specifically it did to you.

do you all REMEMBER that the doctors were baffled in the way that his body was reacting, that they were SURPRISED not just that he gained wait, but had significant liver damage, etc.?

and a HUGE part of the film was his condemnation of the food programs in our public schools, and how woefully unhealthy they are, with pizza and hamburgers and fried crap. THAT WAS IMPORTANT!!

you're all just going for the cheap jab, calling him a hack. that movie was important, and it actually did some good in the world. "oh, mcdonalds makes you fat, derr derrr" shut. the. fuck. up.

if this movie is a big fat disappointment, then so be it, and let him have it. but don't give us all a revisionist history of Supersize Me, because you are too dumb to remember what actually happened in it. or too simple-minded to read between the lines and think about issues more deeply than punchlines and whatever garbage you're being fed.

gained wait? blech.
by BadMrWonka
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:28:25 AM
I meant weight, of course.
Whoahahh - Are you not all over-reacting based on one review?
by darth_billy
Jan 22nd, 2008
04:52:55 AM
Let's see what it's really like shall we? I've never been dissapointed with any of the 30 days episodes, which have always taught me a lot about the world. And besides, isn't it a hypothetical question? Where is Osama Bin Ladin?... as in a large chunk of America seems to think that the Middle East is full of Osama Bin types.
Maybe his initial idea was to find him, but then he...
by ricarleite
Jan 22nd, 2008
05:09:01 AM
... figure out it would be to hard and dangerous, and decided just to shoot random stuff - figuring he would profit the same. Kinda sad he killed his career with this one, he should have denied meeting Osama in the first place, so it wouldn't be such a let down when the film was released. Maybe that might inspire Michael Moore to do the same, he might be able to find him and interview him.
rav is ronald mcdonald!
by ironic_name
Jan 22nd, 2008
05:38:09 AM
It does beg the question
by Lost Jarv
Jan 22nd, 2008
05:43:41 AM
what exactly was the money stumped up for.

And no, Mr. Spurlock, no-one outside of your immediate family and friends wants to see your birth video.

Why would you show this?

doesnt sound positive
by palewook
Jan 22nd, 2008
05:52:59 AM
thats for certain
Maybe they left the footage out of Sundance...
by OBSD
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:00:07 AM
....yeah, probably not. Still, it would be interesting if they purposefully left footage of him meeting Bin Laden out until the movie actually hit theaters. It's not gonna happen, but it would be a cool "fuck you" to the bloated Sundance crowd. Even if they were that smart and sneaky, the rest of this film still looks like garbage.
Council for the defense
by Giant Ape Balls
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:02:20 AM
What the fast food companies were claiming was that there food was nutritious and reasonably heathly. He showed through his experiment that it was far from it.
Missing the point it sounds like...
by Scapulawings
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:05:18 AM
Wow, you mean he actually didn't find Osama Bin Laden? Way to fall for the hype guys. You really feel the need to attack someone for NOT trying to track down the world's most wanted terrorist all by himself because some movie biz hype told you he might? Yeah, that's on you. Plus of all the criticism I keep hearing about the movie being juvenile, does anyone on this site care that the review here is completely juvenile itself? "Fucking retarded... totally a big deal." How old are you people? It really just seems like you're taking it out on the movie because the hype fooled you. Grow up. I'm tired how easy it is for people around here to WANT to piss on people. What a bunch of yap...
and also...
by Scapulawings
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:11:42 AM
"So of course the next person he goes to visit is that same general practitioner who gives him some shots and totally makes a big deal about the side effects for every one." That's an absolutely hilarious line to put in a review. It's obvious that you're coming from a place where you outright WANT to hate the movie. That's a terrible way to review... not to mention that in the third paragraph Rav admits that the rumors of all things changed how he felt about the film. Pretty ridiculous.
For a real doc on the roots of al-Qaeda
by Dodgy
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:17:30 AM
Look this up, for free download: http://www.wanttoknow.info/pow erofnightmares#view Some parts are scarily hilarious...
"HE DOESN'T EVEN TRY HARD TO LOOK FOR BIN LADEN"
by redfist
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:20:55 AM
"HE DOESN'T EVEN TRY HARD TO LOOK FOR BIN LADEN" by Mr Spork...... I pissed my pants reading that, thanx!
If he did find Bin Laden it wouldn't...
by mr_sinister7381
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:38:07 AM
be shown at a film festival, y'know? It's not unheard of to hold back scenes when screening for a festival. MAybe the Weinsteins are holding back.
Why do people who make a successful documentary get fat heads?
by Alice Cooper Stalker
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:41:11 AM
Why do people who make one successful documentary get fat heads and do stupdid stuff? I'm putting Michael Moore in here. I really liked Roger & Me. I've hated everything he's done since.
Of course an apologist might say
by seppukudkurosawa
Jan 22nd, 2008
06:56:02 AM
that the title could be read more along the lines of what kind of climate and country birthed a guy like that. "Where's his head at?" But then, I'm not an apologist, so I'd call bullshit to that.

Also, Morgan Spurlock's responsible for the worst title I've heard in years with his other documentary, "What Would Jesus Buy?"
Spurlock is a cock
by classyfredblassy
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:06:21 AM
I am pretty sure if you also ate nothing but Oat Bran and Prune juice for a month, you'd have some health problems there too. When is that movie coming, you lying sac of cock.
Um....
by MJohnson
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:14:10 AM
So, who is writing reviews for this site now? High school students? Can anyone give me a good reason why I should in any way consider a film review containing the phrase "fucking retarded" one to actually pay attention to, let alone dictate how I should feel about a film I haven't seen yet? I mean, totally, this review is, like, way convincing. Maybe we should just do away with the internet altogether, since it condones and encourages "ego-farts" like complete morons getting to see themselves in print online whenever they have some goddamned self-important piece of shite opinion such as this one.
I disagree, BadMrWonka.
by Nice Marmot
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:23:37 AM
Nobody saw Super Size Me and suddenly found out fast food was unhealthy and quit eating it. Anybody that eats fast food at least once a day is ignorant and will most likely never see Super Size Me. And even the super ignorant don't eat fast food for every meal. It's not just a cheap jab at Spurlock. His whole film was becoming a lab rat for shock value. I'll give him some credit though, that piece he did on TV, might have been on Oprah, where he and his wife tried to live on minimum wage was interesting.
Yay, Rav is ACTUALLY working
by Vamp-AICNchat
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:42:01 AM
!!!!!!!
I can't stand Spurlock's missus
by Vamp-AICNchat
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:44:09 AM
The boney biting bitch!
Would the world be a safer place if Bin Laden was caught?
by Vamp-AICNchat
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:47:56 AM
Probably not. Can you imagine all those Jihadist assholes if their 'leader' was caught! Those Jihadist should watch CHARLIE WILSON'S WAR. They also have a short memory when NATO helped the Muslims in the Kasova ethnic cleansing war in 1999.
Not Again with the Jihadists......
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:56:16 AM
As a Muslim I find it morbidly amusing how certain elements of the West make up words that do not exist in the Islamic lexicon such as Jihadist, Islamofacist, Extremist, Fundamentalist, and then try to argue against what brand of Islam is acceptable. Please stop learning about Islam from CNN and Fox. Go to a library and check out some reputable sources on the subject matter instead of sprouting off crap like Vamp...
What exactly...
by Tourist
Jan 22nd, 2008
07:56:26 AM
...Is wrong with the term "Fucking retarded"? Curse words are like seasoning. You elitist faggot, you.
As a muslim...
by Tourist
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:02:29 AM
...You advise is unwanted, because you are a massive fail. Total fail. You believe in a fairy in the clouds. You might want to head to a library and check out some reputable sources on physics or biology or history and stop learning about man and nature from some dick in a towel.
As a Atheist...
by Vamp-AICNchat
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:04:47 AM
...I don't believe in fairytales.
Massive Fail?
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:05:12 AM
What exactly is that? Now I am speaking as an English teacher with a graduate degree in the subject... :)
And All the Respect for You and Your Beliefs:)
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:06:59 AM
It is too bad that in many cases those that claim to be progessive cannot except others having believes contrary to their own...
And All the Respect for You and Your Beliefs:)
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:09:38 AM
It is too bad that in many cases those that claim to be progessive cannot accept others having believes contrary to their own...
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by Vamp-AICNchat
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:15:10 AM
...I have no problem about peoples beliefs but mostly all wars are caused by it. IN MY OPINION, just imagine living 500-5000 years back and you saw a Tsunami, thunder and lightning, solar eclipse, floods, earthquakes, hurricanes etc, you would be excused for thinking that there was a God or something like that - I think some of these phenonema are the cause of religions.
Plant
by johnyaztec
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:21:13 AM
Plant Plant Plant Plant
Fair Enough
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:22:53 AM
I can respect that mate.
DarfurOnTheRocks
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:48:33 AM
Here in the west we don't accept the term "infidel" but the Jihad Johnies sure use it alot. But I guess if we don't use those terms you say don't exist "Islamic lexicon" we won't have to be treated to videos of beheadings, women being stoned to death, or people shot over a cartoon. Thanks for clearing that up.
Darfur
by Lost Jarv
Jan 22nd, 2008
08:59:06 AM
that's because 2 of those words (Extremist and Fundamentalist) are English words that apply to, erm, extremists and fundamentalists of any religion. The other 2 are combination words created by spin doctors
"Morgan Spurlock is clown shoes."
by Mr. Nice Gaius
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:04:04 AM
Ha! You heard it here first, folks!
Spurlock should be careful...Remember Theo van Gogh?
by conspiracy
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:13:34 AM
It may be a piss poor movie...but the quality doesn't seem to be an issue to certain folks...only the subject matter. Best to make bad movies about less deadly, easily offended targets I say.
Correct conspiracy
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:31:52 AM
There are still some Danish Cartoonists in hiding. How fucking stupid is that.
www.aint-it-liberal-propaganda.c om
by uss cygnus
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:36:16 AM
I wonder, Morgan, will you be laughing the next time Al-Qaeda attacks this country? Will it be funny if we haven't caught Bin Laden by then? Traitor.
why exactly is he a traitor?
by Lost Jarv
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:38:58 AM
WOW you really make this movie sound awful
by deliciouscowbell
Jan 22nd, 2008
09:49:23 AM
jesus
Here's what Harry had to say in Dec. about the doc...
by IAmJack'sUserID
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:26:06 AM
Harry here... I don't know how likely this is... and with the news breaking today - there's probably a good chance that Morgan Spurlock is on his way to Gitmo where he will not be tortured for days and days until he gives them every detail of this joke or stunning accomplishment. If he did find Osama... if he did interview with him - then this would be the single most embarrassing failure of the entire Bush Administration... when the McDonald's Diet guy can find Osama... and the entire joint world intelligence forces can't... then there's something extremely fucked up. Then again... it could be a horrifying joke... which would end Morgan's career... But frankly - if he did get it - they shouldn't screen at Sundance. They should PAY-PER-VIEW the damn thing after a massive marketing campaign... cuz the second that footage gets out - and the Weinstein company in the past year has had a horrible series of Internet Pre-Release leaks of entire films - and this would be huge, for the short time that it would be available exclusively in their control. What do you people think about WHERE IN THE WORLD IS OSAMA bin LADEN? ------ I've Been checking this out and allegedly the Weinstein's have dropped 25 million on Spurlock for the movie based on these 15 minutes alone. Now if this is true then it would be the MOTHER of all Documentaries and will have done what the ENTIRE U.S. Goverment couldn't or wouldn't do. There is some speculation about this all being a cocktease but promising something this big and shafting people is like picking up Heather Graham at a bar, looking the way she did in Anger Management, getting her home and finding out she has a cock.
Thanks for the warning...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:26:52 AM
...but I had already realized that this film would be propaganda. I just didn't think that it would be pro-Morgan Spurlock propaganda!
Spurlock's next film:
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:30:51 AM
"In Search of the Lost Ark" -- filmed while he goes through a difficult breakup with aforementioned girlfriend. At the end, there is a disturbing nervous breakdown. *Sigh. What did anyone ever see in this guy, anyway? He made a film about the health disadvantages of McDonalds' fast food that everyone in the world with an IQ of 79 or higher understood anyway. Spurlock is terribly overrated!
Sounds brilliant!
by kikuchiyoboy
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:32:53 AM
The funny thing is what seemd more interesting on this whole page was the TB'r who said that Burger King was no longer selling the whopper.

Man with a camera. It's like Blog The Movie!
Spurlock now DESERVES to go to Gitmo...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:36:09 AM
...because coercing individuals to watch this film is the equivalent to TERRORISTIC TORTURE and CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY! ... ... ... For all of his liberal hatred for corporate greed and governmental commercialism, I think that this dud needs a dose of WAKE ME UP slaps in order to get his mind out of Nancy Pelosi's playbook. I wonder if he was voted "Most Likely to Believe Wild Conspiracy Theories Presented by the Far Left" in his high school yearbook. So far, so bad.
Rambo could find bin ladin.
by Pipple
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:47:30 AM
Rambo could end the war in iraq right now if he wanted to. And what the hell are all the badass green berets doing these days anyway?
Pipple...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
10:58:25 AM
You asked, "And what the hell are all the badass green berets doing these days anyway?" They are dying for the country while liberal-extremist leaders like Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid question their need. Even when things are going well, those "leaders" call the military's effort a "failure." Is there still any question as to why few military men ever vote for the left?
Infidels is a Western term
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:17:08 AM
How you ever heard a Muslim talk about infidels? Nope. They talk about non-believers, as EVERY RELIGION DOES. This infidel business is also a Western trope used in Hollywood in classics such as True Lies and Delta Force et al.. Granted, this is not to say that there are not nut jobs posing as Muslims, but some differentiation would be appreciated. When the IDF butcher Palestinians, we news media does not label them as radical Jews. Yet, a prick who happens to be a Muslim is labeled as a Muslim first rather than an individual criminal.
It dosen't matter if it's Osama or whoever, the fact is...
by ricarleite
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:34:06 AM
Imagine if Spurlock did a documentary called "Where is Jimmy Hoffa?", and someone paid for it 25 million after seeing only 15 minutes, and the camera man said they got the holy grail, and Spurlock did not deny ANY rumors at all about the film, and it ending up being a film about Spurlock going across american asking people where they think Jimmy Hoffa is... Wouldn't you be PISSED?
"Kafir" is the Islamic term.
by Mr. Nice Gaius
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:38:26 AM
Is that differentiation enough for you, DarfurOnTheRocks?
Is this the sequel to Knocked Up?
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:42:14 AM
Spurlock is a putrid pile of poo.
Harry, you need to get a grip on reality...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:50:19 AM
if you really thought that white trash Spurlock character would have been able to somehow accomplish what the entire world has yet to do: find Osama Bin laden.

Your seething hatred for the Bush administration - along with your absolute distrust and disrespect for our government, intelligence agencies and military - have worked you into some sort of reality distortion field.

Spurlock is only capable of making low-brow "documentaries" for the lowest common denominator in society. He is the Maury Povich of documentarians. Followed closely by Michael Moore.

Those two should team up and make the ultimate biased documentary entitled: We Have No Objectivity Or Talent And Are In The Documentary Business For Fortune And Fame, Truth Be Damned.

Yes, it's a long title, but it would be the most truthful film of their pitiful careers.
I always thought it was Afrikaans
by Lost Jarv
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:51:15 AM
well, well ,well. You learn a new thing every day.
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:51:34 AM
ricarleite, it sounds like that Geraldo Rivera bit...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:52:38 AM
Al Capone's vault. Are you old enough to have witnessed that pile of merde? It should have ruined Rivera's career, but sadly it didn't. Just like this cockumentary filmmaker Spurlock. He'll still have a career after this shit hits the screen. He shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a camera ever again, but you know that'll never happen.
i didnt fight in korea to come home
by Lloyd Bonafide the Korean War Veteran
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:56:03 AM
and see documentaries about finding nothing and mcdonalds!!!
Darfur, it seems to me that the IDF gets plenty of...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
11:58:31 AM
bad press. The difference is that they are the legitimate military of a sovereign country rather than radical Islamic scumbags acting on behalf of various terror groups (some being state sponsored, I might add).

Having said that, sometimes the Israeli military and politicians act reprehensibly. I don't want you to think I am of the opinion that they are above criticism.
"They talk about non-believers as EVERY RELIGION DOES"
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:01:38 PM
Forgive me, but most other religions do not openly advocate the oppression and killing of non-believers. Please do not deny that imams and Imams do so on a regular basis.
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:03:52 PM
No one is arguing that there are many good people in Islam. And of course, there are violent extremists in every religion (including Christianity). However, there is an astonishing percentage of the Muslim population who either believe in violence as a means to justify an end OR those who embrace those (by "understanding their rationale") who use violence as a means to justify an end. A gallup poll taken less than four months after 9/11 showed that approximately 30% of international Muslims felt that the acts of 9/11 could possibly be justifiable. This is a stark contrast with how mainstream Christians, Jews or Hindus (etc...) view violent acts by supposed members of their faith. Why? The mainstream Christian faith teaches that violence is NEVER an option (even though a very, very small segment of supposed Christian cults do induce violence), as does Hinduism, Judaism, etc... This was the basis for "non-violent resistance" as practiced by men like Mahatma Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Jr and (or course) Jesus Christ. In Christianity, a nonbeliever is treated with great respect to the point of even servants being instructed to obey their unbelieving masters as if they were working for the Lord. In Islam, non-Muslims are forced to pay a large tax JUST TO LIVE in Muslim lands! There is an undertone of violence that is "accepted" within "mainstream" mosques in Islam. There is a reformation that must take place in which the great majority of Muslims must view violence through the eyes of the innocence. There is no excuse for violence, murder or harming innocent. Even revenge or occupation is not a good excuse. If Palestinians could demonstrate that they are willing to engage in peace talks WITHOUT embracing suicide bombers and stone throwing masses, then perhaps something could be done to help them accomplish their goals in the Middle East. Until then, the rest of the "Kafir" (infidels) will view their situation as being part of self-induced hopelessness. Islam is a religion of peace, even though the followers are prone to accepting violence. If that acceptance or embrace of the rationale behind violence could somehow change, then perhaps something good could be accomplished.
ccchhhrrriiisssm
by hillingdon
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:19:44 PM
Thank you... Someone with a bit of knowledge and sense.... Some of shit I read on this site esp towards people of colour...
how bad does it have to be to get THAT review on AICN?
by fireclown
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:33:22 PM
And for a film with such anti-bush potential, too.
Anchorite, please shut up
by bushsux
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:38:30 PM
Nothing you advocate works. The war in Iraq is a disaster, our economy is going into a recession and the Bin-Ladens and Bushes are laughing all the way to the bank while right-wing ditto heads like you keep busy at it in their mommy's basement. You are a stupid, silly man and should seriously consider giving Dr. Kevorkian a call.
Rambo finds Bin Laden
by BurgerKing
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:46:07 PM
In his new film. Beats McDonalds guy to the punch.
bushsux...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:56:01 PM
Is that you Nancy Pelosi? Harry Reid? Howard Dean? You are the only ones who spoon feeds such hatred toward the media about the war in Iraq. Even when things are going well, you still try to spend it all as a "lost cause." Have you EVER received a single vote from a man in uniform (other than those who play "dress up" like the band members from QUEEN)? I hope that you don't believe all of those outrageous "conspiracy theories" about this war, 9/11 or the Bush Administration. The HATE BUSH rhetoric is getting very old. Such bigotry is based upon rhetoric that is based upon rumor that is based upon gossip that is based upon talking points fed to the media and 527 groups who simply want to spread HATE. Give it a rest, why don't ya?
Bushsux, what are you droning on about?
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
12:57:47 PM
What the hell am I advocating? That Spurlock and Michael Moore stop making movies altogether? That sounds like a helluva good idea to me. Other than that, I promise you nothing I advocate is being implemented in the US. So it can't possibly be my fault that things are in the shitter. Now go back to work on that Oliver Stone movie and pray the writers strike ends before Bush leaves office.
DarfurOnTheRocks, shouldn't you blame:
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:06:30 PM
The pricks who kill and rape and such who claim to do so in the name of Islam? Instead of the people reacting to what they see and hear? Seems to me your problem should be more with them than any one else. And please don't try to push it away as few nutjobs held up in cave. That kind of reality warping is just going to re-enforce the stereotypes you are fighting against.
Islam posits itself as a complete system of life
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:08:33 PM
this idea entails that there are certain conditions where a Muslim is able to take up arms. For example if a foreign power is attempting to subject Muslims to their ideology then they can fight back. Your examples of the peacefulness of other religions is a tad misleading because modern Western thought has separated religion from affairs of the state. What has this done? This has allowed GW Bush to kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqi civilians, while still being considered a good Christian by many in the Bible belt. This has allowed the US to sit by and watch Israel usurp Palestine land AND give the Israeli government loans and weapons... Also I want to underline that yes KAFIR is a arabic word...... but it means NON-BELIEVER, not infidel. History also shows that the tax that is being referred was a token tax, not generally an exorbitant amount of money as generally believed. Palestinians are a disparate people. What would you do when ALL political recourse has failed? Does Israel follow the numerous UN Resolutions? Why is the peaceful Israel continuing to build settlements in the West Bank? The solution is simple: Give them back their land...
DarfurOnTheRocks, what is Dhimmitude?
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:08:45 PM
Please explain, thanks.
Give them back their land...
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:09:59 PM
Worked so well with Gaza. Well, if you like rockets raining down on your head. Good job , Hamas, way to reach for that brass ring.
The Rock-Throwing Palestinian
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:12:54 PM
It is interesting how the image of the rock throwing Palestinian is etched onto the American psyche. Yet somehow the image of the IDF who don't chuck stones but bomb using the latest US weaponry (M1A1 tanks, F-16s, Apaches) glossed over. Even the rhetoric of the rockets of HAMAS is exaggerated to to make it sound as if these primitive weapons are akin to the 300 Nuclear warheads that Israel possesses.
That Sucks...
by VinnyMac666
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:16:00 PM
this review has severely disappointed me.
DarfurOnTheRocks, so using this ideology...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:17:31 PM
...about the proper ability to use violence against those who are trying to "subject" a group to their "ideology," do you not understand how ridiculous it sounds?!? Using this same sort of flawed logic, then another group (like "Christian" America) could BOMB THE HELL out of the entire Middle East because of 9/11. Do you see the flaw in your "logic?" Islam can be a peaceful religion, but this logic is what allows fanatics to turn it into a violence-prone sect. You also justified a "token tax" on non-believers living in Muslim lands, because you said that it was "not generally an exorbitant amount of money." What would happen if "Christian" civilization taxed MUSLIMS just so that they can live? Do you see how stupid this sounds? There is NO SUCH THING as "Muslim land." There is no such thing as "Jewish land." there is not such thing as "Christian land." It is just property. Until we begin to treat our fellow human beings with more dignity and respect than we show to property, then those fanatics within a religion who condone violence will continue to ruin the region for those who do not.
Like Israel is going to nuke the Palestinians...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:18:35 PM
Ha! You don't shit where you eat.
What in the hell did you expect?
by Hervoyel
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:19:38 PM
We're two and a half hours into this guys 15 minutes of fame. Of course he's got nothing.
Dhimmitude is AGAIN not an Islamic Word
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:19:48 PM
Granted there have been many tyrants to have done shit to sully Islam. But these terms such as Dhimmitude has latched on by the likes of Robert Spencer, supposed experts in Islam, to portray Islam in general negatively. Most reasonable people would like to move on and separate the failings of men to their religion. But others with an agenda harp on them. If so, what about the Inquisition? What about the child abuse scandal in the RC church? Of course, these are sick individuals acting outside their religion. BTW: Israel still claims to occupy Gaza and its airspace, this is some freedom isn't it? They also want to keep the best land and fresh water sources for themselves...
DarfurOnTheRocks, who struck first?
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:23:47 PM
In 1989, the modern conflict began when Palestinian youths began throwing rocks at a Orthodox Jewish sect who were attempting to lay a fake, symbolic cornerstone for a new Jewish Temple. The violence escalated, and became what we see every night on the news: Palestinian children and youth being congratulated for throwing rocks at the face of the children of the Jewish "conquerers." Then we see young Palestinian girls blow themselves up on school buses filled with innocent children. How is such violence justified? If an Israeli really shot at an innocent Palestinian, then they should be brought to justice and severely punished. But to claim that suicide bombing is justifiable would make you a fanatical extremist just as evil as Osama bin Laden.
even atheists must concede this point
by ArcadianDS
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:23:51 PM
Every single other religion in the history of mankind has at its core one basic principle: 'dont be an ass to other people.'

Enter Islam where the one basic principle is: 'those who aren't muslims are like cattle. feel free to butcher them. Then beat your women into comas.'

And to jump ahead of all the responses about how the jihadists are misinterpreting the khoran, i'm sorry but no - its the mainstream, peaceful 'progressive muslims' who are misinterpreting their doctrines. Anyone with even a passing, momentary familiarity with it, who has an equally slim familiarity with admitting to truth, would be forced to admit that yes, the khoran is essentially the world's first military handbook.

Understood Peace and Respect is Needed
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:25:01 PM
But people should be able to believe what they want to believe as long as they do not subject there belief on others. The time for taxes is gone as is the time for many things. But the people of the middle east want to live in a certain way. We can criticize that and claim that they are backwards or even barbaric. But as long as they are not shoving their beliefs down our throats I do not see a problem. Morality is subjective. Some feel that homosexuality is immoral, others feel that polygamy is reprehensible...
oh and one addendum
by ArcadianDS
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:25:39 PM
I realize that all religions are full of evil, hateful people. The difference is that in all other religions, the evil hateful people are living in conflict with their core doctrines. Whereas any muslim who is not in the midst of plotting your beheading, is also in conflict with their core doctrines.
@darfurontherocks
by ArcadianDS
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:28:53 PM
Regardless of one's spiritual beliefs or cultural background, religions whose rules mandate that a woman who is raped is to be stoned to death - i think we can all agree that there's something just not correct there. I dont think as a species we should 'let those guys over there do as they wish' when they have laws like that on the books, and while they dont stone women to death, they do in fact issue beatings and lashes to the backs of women who are raped. It happened just last month in Saudi Arabia.

While theyre not subjecting that belief on others, i think its still incumbent upon us to condemn religons and societies with such a disregard for humanity.

Israel is right DarfurOnTheCock
by Hervoyel
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:29:35 PM
There are no Palestinians. There has never been a "Palestine" (and at the rate they're going there never will be). If they'd started work on their new country in 1948 like they were supposed to do then none of this shit would be going down. The problem is the Arabs never wanted a Palestine (and in fact when Jordan did actually take back the West Bank they promptly annexed it and made all the residents Jordanian citizens (until they screwed up and lost it again at which point they magically transformed into Palestinians somehow. Islam is just a religon but it's the only one of the three Abrahamic religons that has yet to be truly brought to heel by civilization and reason. Do you see the Catholic church making countries do what they say anymore? Do you see the Catholic church launching inquisitions anymore (old school inquisitions with torture and killing)? Of course you don't. Catholicism has been "tamed" to the extent that it can be. Likewise with Judaism. Only Islam remains in the 12th fucking century. When muslims finally figure out that their religon needs to be put in it's place then this crap will come to a conclusion. Until then the rest of us get to read about their stonings and their fatwas and all the other shit that takes place when a religon gets complete control of a society.
And yes Islam is one of the world's fastest growing religion?
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:30:04 PM
I love the idea that those evil Palestinians are killing children. Of course the IDF don't throw stones, but fire bullets and missiles at them. This did not start in 1989, this issue stems from the problematic creation of the Jewish State in the 1940's. Everyone needs to work on a 2 state solution and live well. Of course, you probably will try to link Islam with Nazi's now...
How do the Weinsteins stay in business
by skywalkerfamily
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:32:55 PM
with one flop after another?
Dhimmitude
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:34:17 PM
In a recent interview with the head of Hamas, called for a return to Dhimmitude. His reason was there was peace when Christians and jews lived UNDER Islamic rule. But I guess you can jump up and down and say its not and Islamic word.
Islam does not say that a women who is raped is guilty
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:34:46 PM
..or should die. That is what kills me. The stuff about Islam that people say with authority is ridiculous. Has some asshole done it. Probably. Is he acting within the religion: NO.
DhimmiTUDE and the importance placed on it....
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:37:14 PM
Once again we are stuck on dhimmi. Who is doing it today though? Please let me know....
Let's read a history book, shall we?
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:37:34 PM
The land in question has passed hands many times over the last few thousand years.

In the 20th century The League of Nations, the UN and particularly the British did a piss-poor job of handling the partitioning and governance of the land.

Promises were made and broken by the hundreds, both to the Palestinian Arabs and to the Jews. Like quarreling schoolchildren, the Jews and the Palestinians have continued to fight over the land that was promised to them.

But you know what? The Jews are willing to live peacefully, side by side with the Palestinians. The same cannot be said for the Arabs, who want the Jews driven to the sea and the land for themselves.

Whenever the Jews give up land and make concessions to the Arabs, they make little headway towards peaceful coexistence. History bears this out time and again.

I'm sorry, but until the Arabs decide to let the Jews live in Israel - peacefully and without fear of being exterminated - there will continue to be strife and tragedy in the land of Palestine. The Palestinians will continue to be the pawns of the other Arab countries and will suffer as second-class citizens because they can't be trusted by the Israelis. It's one of the horrible tragedies of our times.
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:38:25 PM
...if you love the idea of Palestinians killing children, then you are a fanatical extremist who deserves to have the Muhammed beat out of him! How dare you preach to us about the "proper" use of violence! THERE IS NO PROPER USE OF VIOLENCE! I don't care whether the Jews took the land of the Palestinians in 1948 (even though there was NOT a Palestinian country and many Jews lived in the region too) OR whether this is about Native Americans who had their land taken by Europeans: VIOLENCE AGAINST THE INNOCENT IS NEVER JUSTIFIED!!! You need to face the facts that a great majority of worldwide Muslims (30%) felt that 9/11 was justifiable. Something is wrong when such a huge percentage of adherents to a religion believe in violence. Something is wrong when someone claims that Muslims have a right to murder because of mental influence exerted upon a group. Something is wrong when people value land and religion (not religious freedom, but religious sectarianism) MORE THAN they value the lives of innocent children. How is violence justified? How will anyone with a logical brain ever take someone seriously who displays such fanatically extreme terroristic ideas? You might want to consider rethinking your faith if it calls for such VIOLENCE.
I think that our government is more of a threat...
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:39:56 PM
..to our personal freedoms than the phantom menace of Islam, who simply "do not like the way we live..." I just say that because our personal freedoms and the great Constitution of the US is being raped. Internet and phone records are being scoured. All for what?
Q: Can a Muslim man beat his wife?
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:44:33 PM
A: Yes, as long as he doesn't use his fists. From verse 4:34 of the Quran: "Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in their sleeping places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great." Wow, what a noble passage! *rolls eyes
And Yet YOU give the IDF a free pass...
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:44:38 PM
That is interesting. I like that strawman argument where now I am advocating the killing of innocents! Very shrew debating there...! Violence is horrid. Yet you gloss over US aggression in Iraq also. In fact, it is YOU and justifies IDF aggression by claiming that Palestinians started it by chucking stones in 1989. Of course, that was the rationale to unleash hell on the Palestinians. But of course, Palestinians deserved it....
Oh NO, the classic "let's find violence in Quran" line...
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:46:15 PM
I won't return the favour and do an internet search on the Bible and Torah. :)
Did Ike Beat Tina?
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:46:59 PM
That baaaaaad Christian man!
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:47:09 PM
You said, "Internet and phone records are being scoured. All for what?" Answer: The little "phone tapping" that takes place is a result of the Federal authorities looking for FANATICAL TERRORISTS. Why would you fear that? In fact, it makes the nation a safer place from the evil wackos like Osama bin Laden!
surprised by all the spurlock hate around here
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:47:59 PM
The guy makes a semi-amusing movie about a semi-interesting hypothetical, and the talkbackers go nuts *four and a half years later* because of a tepid (and vapid) review of what sounds to be some other semi-amusing and semi-interesting movie.
Martyr Mouse was Dhimmitude , that who!
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:48:10 PM
"What is being asked, so that the Americans and Zionists will be satisfied with you, is to follow their lead," said Hamzim Al-Sha'arawi, deputy director of Al-Aqsa TV. "We [on this program] have a message, and we understood from the beginning that it is a difficult path ... But we were sure that we had to go this way because this [young] generation needs someone to direct it ... and this generation is the most worthy of the position of leadership," he said. Sha'arawi went on to say that historically, Jews and Christians were "happy" living under Islamic rule. "Therefore, when we talk [on the program] about the mission of the restoration of Islam to its natural [dominant] place, we're calling for justice, and for goodness, and for world love ... so that the Christians will live in peace, and that even the Jews will live in peace and security," he said
Did Hitler kill 6 million Jews?
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:48:19 PM
Yes he did commit genocide on the innocent. That baaaaad Christain man.... or was he a Muslim now?!
The "2 state solution" is fine except....
by Hervoyel
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:48:21 PM
Everytime Israel conceeds land the PINO's move their rocket launchers a few hundred yards closer to their targets. It's a sad, pitiful state of affairs but eventually the rest of the world is going to have to decide to continue living with this shit or just put the Palestinians down for the good of the species. Hey, it sucks but what kind of a society do you think appears after 60 years of life in refugee camps when your "pals" in the rest of the Arab world refuse to take you and think that the best kind foreign aid they can give you is AK-47's and RPG's. Sometimes you got to put a rabid dog down man and that's what the people in Gaza and the West Bank are going to be facing if they don't come join the rest of us in the 21st.
I don't get stripped search at Airports...
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:49:54 PM
Because of the IDF or Ike Turner.
Bloop, you are quoting the Arabic equivalent of 600 Club
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:50:45 PM
That is what you are doing. Can I get some Jerry Falwell quotes please?!
I think the point where you hold up Hitler
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:52:00 PM
As a christian example, is about the point you should go back to your prayer rug, and give thanks to Allah you don't live in shit hole like Syria or the Sudan.
Anyways, thanks for the debate
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:52:16 PM
All the respect to you chaps.
DarfurOnTheRocks, please understand:
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:54:59 PM
While I can't speak as an authority of Hinduism or Judaism, I can say that the New Testament is very pointedly forbids shedding violence against innocent individuals. Judaism rejects a literal interpretation of violence. Some Muslims take the violence in their Quran and take it to heart. They murder in the Name of religion. Do you see the difference? Please understand that I am NOT attacking Islam. However, I am attacking an interpretation of Islam that condones violence against the innocent. That is why there is a very real need for a seperation between Church and State in the Middle East. Unfortunately, the influence of radical clerics in the mosques on Fridays often translate into violence between Saturday through Thursday. Islam needs a reformation. They need their own "Martin Luther" to write and edict that identifies these sort of radical, violent fundamentalistic ideas as outdated HERESY. Any religion that teaches, promotes or condones violence should be considered a dangerous sect. Then again, there isn't much freedom of speech in the Middle East, is there? An attack on violence could be seen as an attack on Islam (as has been the case in the recent past).
On the Muslims-Nazi connection...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:55:15 PM
Grand Mufti of Jerusalem Haj Amin el-Husseini was in cahoots with the Third Reich. Here's a rather long article that details the connection:

"After World War I, the Great Powers of Europe jockeyed for influence in the Middle East's oil fields and trade routes, with France and Britain holding mandates throughout most of the region. In the 1930s, the fascist regimes that arose in Italy and Germany sought greater stakes in the area, and began courting Arab leaders to revolt against their British and French custodians.

Among their many willing accomplices was Jerusalem Mufti Haj Amin el-Husseini, who fled Palestine after agitating against the British during the Arab Revolt of 1936-39. He found refuge in Iraq , another of Her Majesty's mandates , where he again topped the British most wanted list after helping pull the strings behind the Iraqi coup of 1941.

The revolt in Baghdad was orchestrated by Hitler as part of a strategy to squeeze the region between the pincers of Rommel's troops in North Africa, German forces in the Caucuses and pro-Nazi forces in Iraq. However, in June 1941 British troops put down the rebellion and the Mufti escaped via Tehran to Italy and eventually to Berlin.

Once in Berlin, the Mufti received an enthusiastic reception by the "Islamische Zentralinstitut" and the whole Islamic community of Germany, which welcomed him as the "Fuhrer of the Arabic world."

In an introductory speech, he called the Jews the "most fierce enemies of the Muslims" and an "ever corruptive element" in the world. Husseini soon became an honored guest of the Nazi leadership and met on several occasions with Hitler. He personally lobbied the Fuhrer against the plan to let Jews leave Hungary, fearing they would immigrate to Palestine.

He also strongly intervened when Adolf Eichman tried to cut a deal with the British government to exchange German POWs for 5000 Jewish children who also could have fled to Palestine. The Mufti's protests with the SS were successful, as the children were sent to death camps in Poland instead. One German officer noted in his journals that the Mufti would liked to have seen the Jews "preferably all killed."

On a visit to Auschwitz, he reportedly admonished the guards running the gas chambers to work more diligently. Throughout the war, he appeared regularly on German radio broadcasts to the Middle East, preaching his pro-Nazi, anti-Semitic message to the Arab masses back home.

To show gratitude towards his hosts, in 1943 the Mufti traveled several times to Bosnia, where on orders of the SS he recruited the notorious "Hanjar troopers," a special Bosnian Waffen SS company which slaughtered 90% of Bosnia's Jews and burned countless Serbian churches and villages. These Bosnian Muslim recruits rapidly found favor with SS chief Heinrich Himmler, who established a special Mullah Military school in Dresden.

The only condition the Mufti set for his help was that after Hitler won the war, the entire Jewish population in Palestine should be liquidated. After the war, Husseini fled to Switzerland and from there escaped via France to Cairo, where he was warmly received. The Mufti used funds received earlier from the Hitler regime to finance the Nazi-inspired Arab Liberation Army that terrorized Jews in Palestine.

The Arab Embrace of Nazism: Husseini represents the prevalent pro-Nazi posture among the Arab/Muslim world before, during and even after the Holocaust. The Nazi-Arab connection existed even when Adolf Hitler first seized power in Germany in 1933. News of the Nazi takeover was welcomed by the Arab masses with great enthusiasm, as the first congratulatory telegrams Hitler received upon being appointed Chancellor came from the German Consul in Jerusalem, followed by those from several Arab capitals.

Soon afterwards, parties that imitated the National Socialists were founded in many Arab lands, like the "Hisb-el-qaumi-el-suri" (PPS) or Social Nationalist Party in Syria. Its leader, Anton Sa'ada, styled himself the Fuhrer of the Syrian nation, and Hitler became known as "Abu Ali" (In Egypt his name was "Muhammed Haidar").

The banner of the PPS displayed the swastika on a black-white background. Later, a Lebanese branch of the PPS - which still receives its orders from Damascus - was involved in the assassination of Lebanese President Pierre Gemayel.

The most influential party that emulated the Nazis was "Young Egypt," which was founded in October 1933. They had storm troopers, torch processions, and literal translations of Nazi slogans like "One folk, One party, One leader."

Nazi anti-Semitism was replicated, with calls to boycott Jewish businesses and physical attacks on Jews. Britain had a bitter experience with this pro-German mood in Egypt, when the official Egyptian government failed to declare war on the Wehrmacht as German troops were about to conquer Alexandria.

After the war, a member of Young Egypt named Gamal Abdul Nasser was among the officers who led the July 1952 revolution in Egypt. Their first act, following in Hitler's footsteps, was to outlaw all other parties.

Nasser's Egypt became a safe haven for Nazi war criminals, among them the SS General in charge of the murder of Ukrainian Jewry; he became Nasser's bodyguard and close comrade. Alois Brunner, another senior Nazi war criminal, found shelter in Damascus, where he served for many years as senior adviser to the Syrian general staff and still resides today.

Sami al-Joundi, one of the founders of the ruling Syrian Ba'ath Party, recalls: "We were racists. We admired the Nazis. We were immersed in reading Nazi literature and books... We were the first who thought of a translation of Mein Kampf. Anyone who lived in Damascus at that time was witness to the Arab inclination toward Nazism."

These leanings never completely ceased. Hitler's Mein Kampf currently ranks sixth on the best-seller list among Palestinian Arabs.

Luis Al-Haj, translator of the Arabic edition, writes glowingly in the preface about how Hitler's "ideology" and his "theories of nationalism, dictatorship and race are advancing especially within our Arabic States."

When Palestinian police first greeted Arafat in the self-rule areas, they offered the infamous Nazi salute - the right arm raised straight and upward.

The PLO and notably Arafat himself do not make a secret of their source of inspiration. The Grand Mufti el-Husseini is venerated as a hero by the PLO. It should be noted that the PLO's top figure in east Jerusalem today, Faisal Husseini, is the grandson to the Fuhrer's Mufti.

Arafat also considers the Grand Mufti a respected educator and leader, and in 1985 declared it an honor to follow in his footsteps.

Little wonder. In 1951, a close relative of the Mufti named Rahman Abdul Rauf el-Qudwa el-Husseini matriculated to the University of Cairo. The student decided to conceal his true identity and enlisted as "Yasser Arafat."

And there you have it.
As repulsive as Jerry Falwell is...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:56:23 PM
...I don't think that he ever condoned an act of suicide bombing. Try again, Darfur. *sigh
Nazi and Hitler aren't christians words
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:56:55 PM
so I guess they didn't exist, using your logic.
ccchhhrrriiisssm
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:57:12 PM
The social upset over the phone tapping isn't directed at the act of phone tapping per se. It's because the administration authorized phone tapping without judicial oversight, which is illegal. And the reason it is illegal is because it's a really bad idea to allow one branch of government to act secretly and unilaterally like that--there's no way to ensure that the tapping that's being done is for legitimate anti-crime/antiterroristic purposes, and not for illegitimate political or corrupt purposes.

Sure, the administration is staffed full of ethical supermen who would never do anything wrong, but maybe a future administration wouldn't be so super-scrupulous. And that's the point. That's why historically we've made such a big deal of being a nation of "laws not men"--we are attempting to design a system whereby the government is only incentivized to do the right thing. When the executive decides to cut corners on oversight, sure, they might be mildly more effective in catching bad guys, but it opens up the door for all sorts of bad behavior on the part of our own government.

OKAY BOYS HERE WE GO--DARFUR, ANCHORITE, ETC...
by Deus Vult
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:59:18 PM
first off, did the entire subject make it in? if not, who cares. I've read every post in this talkback and I just couldn't not join in.

secondly, if you're not talking about the movie, in this case a total failure of a doc which austin-liberal-harry hoped would continue to embarass the current administration, then you, me and the rest are all gonna get yelled at by mori. SO MORI HERE'S MY POST ON THE MOVIE: bin laden is iran. the mullahs got him leaving tora bora and have held on to him ever since.

thirdly with that outta the way history is not any muslim's side. I HAVE READ NUMEROUS BOOKS ON THE SUBJECT DARFUR...to start I've got a BS in Poli Sci with a focus on international relations. next up add in my undergrad thesis was on the israeli/arab conflict. while doing research on the topic I was introduced to bernard lewis, considered the pre-eminent scholar on islam. AND GUESS WHAT?!? THE GUY'S A JEW!

Sorry so long, but a very interesting read if you're up to it!
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
01:59:48 PM
I think it pretty much sums up why Darfurontherocks is on the losing end of this argument.
OH FOR UNEDITABLE POST'S SAKE HARRY
by Deus Vult
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:00:29 PM
you live in freakin' austin...PLEASE spend a few hundred dollars and hire some outta work programmers to give us the ability to edit our posts or retract those which are entered in error. good lord!
Darfur...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:00:43 PM
...Hitler was actually an atheist and a eugenisist. To call him a "Christian" is like calling Mohammed a Jew. Christianity (with the exception of the Roman Catholic inquisition, crusades, and a few wacko sects) has largely rejected violence because violence is rejected by New Testament scriptures. There are no justifications for violence in the New Testament. I wish that the same could be said from the Quran. But this is not an attack on the Quran. It is an attack upon violent fundamentalists who interpret the Quran as condoning their terrorism.
"Of course, you probably will try to link Islam with Nazi's now.
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:02:12 PM
Uh, yeah.
READY? HERE'S THE REST...
by Deus Vult
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:03:23 PM
in addition to the mass amount of stuff I've read from lewis, who isn't for or against islam as many authors are, I've read stuff from karen armstrong (huge islam apologist) as well as cnn darling reza aslan. finally I read from critical perspective as well, from folks like robert spencer and norman podhoretz. so when it comes to having an educated, well-rounded, historical perspective, no one is more qualified than myself to discuss this topic with you DARFUR...
Falwell just blamed Homosexuals for 9/11
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:03:27 PM
Craziness nonetheless... But I agree with you that innocent civilians should never be killed. Violence is also abhorant. It is not the answer for the problems of the world. Anchorite: If that chap really said what you pasted, then he is not acting as a Muslim. I guess he is just as much a Muslim as Hitler is a Christian....
systemsbroom...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:06:55 PM
I agree with much of what you say. There needs to be judicial oversight. I was simply responding to Darfur's allegation that "phone tapping" is as evil as his rhetorical defense of suicide bombing. Regardless of what the conspiracy theorists claim, the entire rationale behind "phone tapping" is to catch violent criminal behavior BEFORE it happens. The FBI and CIA are not listening to us gossip about Grandma's cookies. They are looking for intelligence that would prevent another 9/11. I could care less if the FBI and CIA are tapping my phone! They would be BORED senseless. Besides, I have nothing to hide. It's like walking through a metal detector in the airport or having our luggage x-rayed. But a terrorist, on the other hand, has quite a bit to hide. A phone tap for him could mean the difference between success and failure and the innocent lives of thousands. That was the difference that I was trying to expose.
Arabic equivalent of 600 Club?
by TheBloop
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:08:05 PM
You just asked for a current example of Dhimmitude, and I gave you an example of an ELECTED LEADER who is calling for it. And what is the 600 club, did Pat Robertson go on a diet?
LOL, you got me :)
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:11:16 PM
I meant, a nation that has implemented dhimmi. Anyways, take care of yourself.
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:11:24 PM
I think that you'll agree, then, that there is a real theology problem when 30% of the world's Muslim population think that 9/11 may have been justified. The same Gallup poll also showed that almost half of the world's Muslim population thought that the US or Israel was part of some conspiracy in regard to 9/11. This is simply INSANE! No wonder why those who are prone to believing such ridiculosu nonsense are prone to embracing violence. While it may not be reflective of all of Islam, it does display that something is very wrong with the big picture. Whether or not this problem originates in the mosque is an entirely different question, but one that needs to be asked.
NOW WITH INTROS OUTTA THE WAY...
by Deus Vult
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:14:20 PM
anchorite you may remember me from the hannibal rising talkback with jjonz, dick nicely and s-mart shopper. ALSO--that talkback is where the concept of "repligin time travel" came from...ANYWAY...

here's the deal darfur...history is never on the side of anyone trying to prove the old or new testament is as bloody as the koran. the old testament is about the hebrews fighting DEFENSIVE wars, the new testament, as far as the version I've read, is about not fighting wars (not even going to address gnostic versions of jesus and the apostles forming a new-age hebrew delta force to take out the temple's high priests).

HOWEVER the koran is about fighting OFFENSIVE wars. for instance; slay the idolators and pagans (hindus, buddhists, etc), slay the people of the book who refuse to convert or pay the jiz'yah (tax on monotheists who live in muslim lands, to include jews, christians, zoroastrians, etc), slay the athiests, slay anyone who doesn't believe in allah and the last day, and most importantly SLAY ANYONE WHO DOESN'T BELIEVE MOHAMMED IS ALLAH'S FINAL AND TRUTH BEARING PROPHET.

does anyone see or find a pattern here? did you know that mohammed was raised around jews and christians and if you really read the history of islam you'll learn he really wanted to be a jew but the hebrews wanted nothing to do with him so they conspired with the arab hindus to kill him. as history shows us they failed. so he simply got angry, copied all the jewish holidays, stories, traditions and rules of living, gave them arab names, and tried to exterminate all jews in arabia and beyond. easy--no history reading required.

thus the precedent was set; all muslims believe muhammed to be the finest human ever and his example to be followed until death. as such all muslims must kill all jews, lest they convert or pay the tax. this is why israel and its muslim neighbors, remnants of palestine included, can NEVER EVER live side by side. jews don't WANT to kill muslims, muslims WANT to kill jews.

lastly, isn't darfur on the rocks and needs to be saved because muslims are killing christians there as they have four the last 1400 years? and these muslims are armed and financed by the saudis? OH YEAH! THAT'S IT!

unless DarfurOnTheRocks you have a different side of the story...

Ever read a Saudi, Syrian or Iranian textbook?
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:20:25 PM
Try reading one if you want to know why children believe that violence is an answer or that 9/11 was part of a US/Israeli conspiracy. The children are indoctrinated in many Muslim primary schools. On Fridays, they go to the mosque for further indoctrination. They counsel with clerics who further indoctrinate them. Their parents encourage them to dream in the fame of martyrdom. Is there any wonder why they are willing to strap bombs to their bodies and kill innocent people? While this is not indicative of the entire Muslim population, it is indicative of a large segment of that population.
ccchhhrrriiisssm
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:22:28 PM
Cool, that's what I figured your argument was. I would caution you against making the blanket statement that the CIA and FBI are only looking for intelligence regarding terrorists. Both agencies (especially the FBI) have a long and rather inglorious history of having abused their authority for political purposes. Again, that's my point: because self-interested jerks *will* exploit a system, it's best to design that system so that it's very difficult to get away with exploiting it. And for members of the public to maintain a healthy suspicion about what the government is up to in their name and with their money.
You are Right: MANY MUSLIMS NEED EDUCATION
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:22:52 PM
Agreed. Violence is seen as such an easy option, that certain Muslims seem to forget the primacy placed on peace. Deus, you take such liberties with the material that you are serving. Each line of the Quran is context sensitive. Muslims were persecuted by the many tribes in Arabia during the birth of the religion. Granted there was a period of Islamic expansion, but Islam was under fire from many empires including the Persian and Roman. Muslims do not want to kill Jews. In fact, some of the first alliances that Islam made were with Jewish tribes. A lot of the problems at the moment concern the politics of the STATE OF ISRAEL. Anyways, I have spent the day chatting, but a lot of your evidence is shaky... Once again, many modern Muslims NEED education and need to think for themselves...
okay okay even I have a job too!
by Deus Vult
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:24:45 PM
Darfur: shaky evidence? you can't say something like that and excuse yourself due to wasting your life away here with us!

on a related note, I have a demo at 230 and must get ready for it. I'll be back later if you or anyone else care to keep talking about this topic, or as long as mori lets us.

Deus Vult
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:26:01 PM
I don't understand why you keep harping on the Koran and, most recently, on the supposed motivations of a centuries-dead nominal prophet. You say that Koran is about fighting offensive wars. Why is that at all relevant, even if it's true? We here in the US start offensive wars, and we don't need any Koran to make it happen. And we are much, much better at it than any of the muslim states.
Man, You're killing Me!
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:29:56 PM
Hopefully, we'll chat later. Take care! :)
Darfur, gimme a friggin' break...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:30:13 PM
Did you read the article? It wasn't "one guy". The Muslims were chin-deep in with the Third Reich. They were very supportive on a grass-roots level, to the point of helping give their region to the Nazis when they came a'knockin'.

They actively and passively helped the Germans defeat the Brits in the Arab countries.

To act as if Muslim collaboration with the Nazis was somehow limited to a single man isn't just wishful thinking...it's insulting to my intelligence. And it goes a long way toward making you look like an ignorant dolt who has nothing but emotional response to bolster his argument. I would hope you are better than that.
The funny thing is...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:34:41 PM
...that the "phone tapping" was used as a "free speech" argument in defense of the actions of Muslim nations. What is "free speech" in Saudi Arabia? What is "free speech" in Syria? It's called "DON'T GET CAUGHT." But I do think that Darfur has admitted that violence can NEVER be condoned in the name of Islam. If a cleric teaches it, he should be banned from teaching. If a parent teaches it, he should be banned from teaching his children. If a school teaches it, the school should be dismantled. But the fact remains that something is terribly wrong in the Islamic world. When 30% of the population feels that 9/11 was justifiable, then that is indicative of the mood and morality of the people. If 50% are willing to believe a wild conspiracy theory, then someone is wrong with the picture. When school textbooks condone violence, religious bigotry, "martyrs," etc... -- then something is wrong with the big picture. While this might not be reflective of all Muslims, this is reflective of a large portion of the population. Either something is wrong with the teachings, or something is wrong with the philosophy upon which the teachings are based. But this is the foremost problem of the Middle East and why so few non-Muslims can reason or respect such attitudes. There seems to be an unwillingness to tackle the perceptions of the population. To do so, so it seems, would be an attack on Islam itself. Do you see this dichotomic dilemma? We are not attacking Islam, we are pointing to a flaw that is ignored within the perception of Muslims.
anchorite
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:37:54 PM
What is with you people? Who cares if "the muslims were chin-deep in with the Third Reich"? So were the Italians and the Japanese for chrissakes!

Yeesh. Look at the population profiles of the "muslim" nations. They're almost entirely populated by people born after--and often *way* after--the second world war.

There's plenty to talk about regarding the islam, the west, and the middle east without resorting to this sort of silly armchair/history channel level of analysis.

system, I was answering Darfur's post...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:45:32 PM
where he said, "Of course, you probably will try to link Islam with Nazi's now..." As if there wasn't a well-documented historical link. There is!

And don't give me that crap about the majority of Muslims being born after WWII. The majority of all people alive today were born after WWII. So, what's your point?

Do you think that the Muslims populating the world today haven't grown up hearing about how the Jews are evil and unworthy? Do you think somehow over the last 60 years anti-semitism in the Muslim communities has abated? Of course not. It's just as prevalent now as it has ever been. Stop making excuses for their horrendous behavior.
WTF is it with "MUSLIM" collaboration with NAZIs?
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:46:28 PM
That is what kills me. Some tyrant, who happens to be a Muslim, sides with Hilter and you go off connecting Islam with Hilter's genocide! Why would you do that unless you WANT to link ISLAM to the Holocaust?! How many Western leaders chose to ignore the NAZI threat?! The British are culpable. The US are culpable. The French and Russians also. Many individuals could forgive the Germans for their role, yet this Mufti is now representative of the entire Muslim nation..... give me a break....
Neither the Italians nor the Japanese extol the virtues...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:49:07 PM
of Hitler and the Third Reich. You still hear that kind of rhetoric from Arab nations. And when's the last time a Japanese or an Italian tried to blow up a synagogue? When's the last time an Italian's car bomb went off in front of a Jerusalem night club? How many Japanese suicide bombers have exploded in front of Tel Aviv pizza parlors? Your words are incredibly insulting, and the sentiment behind them even more so.
It is unfortunate that brainwashing goes on in EVERY religion
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:50:04 PM
Jewish friends tell me of stories that they were told regarding Muslims. Muslims tell me of shit they heard "elders" tell them. Rinse and repeat for everyone. But it seems to me that you just want to tee off against Islam...
Ford's Connection with Hilter?!
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:53:34 PM
He extolled the virtues of Hilter. Why do we let him off the hook? Many consider Henry Ford an anti-Semite. I guess only Muslims are anti-Semites...
Darfur, you are being obtuse...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:54:27 PM
it wasn't one damn man. It was the Arab world. They clearly were in favor of Hitler's policies and the actions of the Nazi regime. They were all for the extermination of the Jews.

There were entire Islamic communities that supported Nazism. Political parties were formed that closely imitated the Nazis. Some exist to this day, such as the Lebanese PPS.

One man? Pull your head out of your arse.
I don't give Henry Ford a break. Or Kennedy...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:57:06 PM
Or Charles Lindburgh. Nor anyone else who was proved to have ties to the Nazis. I never said only Muslims were anti-Semites. But trying to deflect the facts with your ridiculous apologies and excuses makes you look like an ostrich with his head in the sand.
I also never said ALL Muslims are anti-Semites...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
02:58:18 PM
just to be clear. But there is a prevalent cry going on in the Muslim world. One for the blood of the Jew. It needs to stop now. Otherwise, there will NEVER be peace.
DarfurOnTheRocks...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:00:51 PM
While brainwashing goes on in nearly every sect...it is rare that 30% of a world's population will be influenced by it. What is the percentage of Jews, Christians and Hindus that condone violence in the name of religious belief? It is probably less than 1% (or maybe even 1/2 of 1%). Yet 30% of the world's Muslim population felt that 9/11 was justifiable. Even you began your diatribe in this talkback by defending Islamic practice by attacking the supposed views of others. Something is SERIOUSLY WRONG when a third of a religion's practictioners believe that violence against innocent people is justifiable, or when half of the practicioners are susceptible to wild conspiracy theories. The question begs to be asked: Where is this view originating? The origination for such radical and violent beliefs needs to be targeted and dismantled. As you said, there needs to be a reformation in the education of Muslims. This crap is being taught within the textbooks in Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iran, etc... And who is responsbile for what is found in those textbooks? The religious clerics and mullahs. A new "revolution" must take place within Islam that embraces peace and nonviolence over the status quo.
You are being general Anchorite.....
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:03:56 PM
Arab World supporting Nazis? I love how to use the Arab and Muslim identities interchangeably. There are millions of Muslims in China, India, Africa. Did these people support Hilter also? Yet now we get to the heart of the matter in your personal insults. Keep on going with your generalizations. The 50 million Muslims in China hate Jews now....
anchorite (and why not--darfur guy too)
by systemsbroom
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:06:49 PM
Wow. I guess you are right. I was being "incredibly insulting" by suggesting that that this whole weird inquiry into potential backroom associations between nazis and muslims was kinda pointless.

And you are also right that Japanese and Italian people don't blow shit up in Israel. Probably because the Japanese and Italians are by and large wealthy people who live thousands/hundreds of miles from Israel, and aren't in the midst of an asymetrical armed conflict over territory with the afore-mentioned polity. My point is (and was) that none of this has anything to do with nazis.

Anyway, your more recent statement that "the Arab world . . . were all for the extermination of the Jews" is a little far-fetched. I mean, there were only a tiny number of Jewish people living in Arab regions in the first half of the 20th century. I really doubt that the millions of dirt-poor Arabs living there cared about them at all. As opposed to, say, the British, who were a colonial power present in the middle east at the time.

Am I on the right site?!?!
by Brians Life
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:09:14 PM
I love how if you get far enough down on the talkbacks anything is possible.
So, the Arab/Israeli conflict huh? We couldn't start with something a little deeper?

I can't talk religion as I'm an atheist and you're ALL gonna feel REAL silly when you die as far as I'm concerned. That being said, I am rather scholarly on the subjects at hand.....where to start???
ccchhhrrriiisssm, I wish you were right...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:09:37 PM
unfortunately, I believe there is probably a lot more than 1% of the population in any group that believes violence is justifiable in the name of religion. Even today.

But clearly the Islamic world has the most outspoken religious leaders and they have many well-documented accounts of Imams, clerics and other "holy men" calling for violence against non-believers, infidels, Kafirs, whatever.

Venomous rhetoric is taught daily in madrassas and mosques all over the world. It is insidious and it will only lead to a perpetual cycle of violence and hatred between different groups of people who by all accounts should be able to get along peacefully. It is ignorance and fear that controls their lives.
Dont put too much stock in 30% figure
by DarfurOnTheRocks
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:11:07 PM
All that I can say that Muslims are not animals and savages. We like life. We enjoy living. Someone is trying to portray us as sub-human. That is what I am primarily commenting against. See some of the comments before I started my diatribe to see the hate against Muslims. This sort of hate is fashionable nowadays. really that is all I can say. Many people are telling me what I am supposed to be. I am supposed to hate Jews. I don't. I am supposed to beat my wife. I love my wife. I am supposed to like war. I don't like to exercise. I am telling you what I am and what I believe. I am sorry if you are hung up on numbers or what the so-called experts are writing about Islam. Islam is different for sure. We are not savages however. Best regards.
It is definitely an Arab sentiment...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:13:52 PM
however, Muslims in India aren't exactly peaceful either, are they? Or in the Philippines, Indonesia, Europe, etc. This preaching of violence and hate spans wider than Arab countries alone.
The 9/11 being justifiable thing....
by Brians Life
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:14:07 PM
Just so's you know...was crossing the GW on 9/11...afterwards I needed to get out of the country, so I traveled for about 2 months....there is ALOT of international sentiment that it was "about time" regarding Sept. 11th. And, you can't just strip away the context of everything....America is seen as a Pillar of Israel...and rightfully so. We have a very aggressive israel lobby...give them more aid than any other nation. So is it hard to imagine that from a non-American POV that we got a taste of what we have been giving!?! This is NOT my opinion. I know people who died that day.....but you can't say "Almost 50 percent of the VietCong believe that dead American soldiers is a BAD THING....OOOOOOHHHH"
I wish the Cloverfield Monster showed up in Iran
by Puddleglum
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:14:59 PM
does that make me racist?

Do I care?

The Muslims you see on the news screaming for the blood of Jews, etc = the American religious zealots who chant passionate pleas to Dubbya Bush to please, please, please make the US a "Christian nation" and bomb abortion clinics.

The Suicide Bomber Thing...
by Brians Life
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:15:40 PM
Israel invented suicide bombing...and car bombing....well, not Israel, but zionists. Do you think that the first Israeli Army just MADE all the weaponry they fought with??! They stole it from the British.
anchorite
by Puddleglum
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:17:57 PM
I think this sums it all up: "It is ignorance and fear that controls their lives."

This is exactly what leads to persistent conflict around the globe.

Puddlegum....
by Brians Life
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:18:46 PM
do you realize that the majority of Iran is very young and probably just as eager to see Cloverfield as you are!! Do YOU want to be held responsible for the policies of the Bush Administation....so why do we declare Iran as EVIL due to the policies of it's leader!?! Which aren't ever THAT extreme! He has NO control over the Revolutionary Guard....AHHHHH!
The Isaraeli's didn't steal their armaments from the Brits
by Puddleglum
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:21:09 PM
They gave/sold it to them. On the very day Israel was declared a nation, the neighboring Arab nations had already announced and staged they would invade and "destroy" Israel when statehood was officially declared. The Israelis had to get their gear from somewhere.
Excuse me, but actively supporting the worst...
by anchorite
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:21:56 PM
executioners of the Jewish people in the 20th century is s big deal to me.

The British acted horrendously toward the Jews because they wanted to appease their new business partners, the Arabs.

If the Arabs hadn't been so gleefully committed to the notion of the extermination of the Jews and been so vocal in their vehement opposition to letting Jews enter Palestine, a lot more Jews might have survived the Holocaust. So yeah, that is a big deal.

It isn't a pointless observation as you would have us believe, system. It shows the true nature of the Arabs in that region and their feelings toward the Jews. They abhorred them and wanted them nowhere near - preferably they would have liked the Jews to be exterminated.

And that is very much a sentiment that continues on to this day and has massive repercussions on the current situation in the Middle East. Or can't you see that?
The Israel just wants Peace thing....
by Brians Life
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:22:39 PM
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAAHAH.. .oh wait....no, I was right. HAAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHA
Really!?! That's why they've adapted a 10 to 1 blowback policy!?!? That's why Israeli settlers roam armed with automatic weapons and grenades. That's why Palestineans are not aloud on most major roads. that's why the only thing keeping Israels expansionist policies in check is that it needs US support!?!? Israel EXISTS!!! There is no denything that...but the "RIGHT TO EXIST"...why?!! Why should any nation be granted that "right".
Darfur...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
Jan 22nd, 2008
03:23:06 PM
This "30%" is taken from a worldwide Gallup poll that was operated in conjunction with Al Jazeera and several major Arab newspapers in the Middle East. I am a post-graduate student of Public Policy, but I have sat through many International Relations classes. Several of these have been taught by wonderful Muslim professors. However, even they did not have an answer for the problems. None of them have been able (or willing) to identify the root of this violent, radical fundamentalist situation. They simply acknowledge that there is a HUGE PROBLEM. If we keep ignoring the obvious, then the problem will never be dealt with properly. This is not "HATE" for Islam. This is simply the understanding that something is terribly wrong in the Middle East, and there is an embracement of violence (as a solution) that is generally rejected by all other major, mainstream religions. 30% indicated a belief that 9/11 was justified. 50% indicated a belief that the US and Israel were at least partially behind 9/11. And another larger statistic (I cannot remember the exact figure) stated that they believe that violence is justifiable in defense of Islam. Even if the numbers are off, they do illustrate a terrible situation in the Middle East. The textbooks for children iterate such beliefs. The messages from clerics often reflect this attitude. Where is the root of this belief in violence? I hope that it is not in the Quran itself..