Also I think BSG has held itself together much better than any Abrams production, but that's a matter of opinion. However, JJ Abrams fatal flaw (not being able to finish off interesting premises) is well established with two series now.

I don't necessarily even mean to jump on Abrams too much. Super talented guy, but I just wish he could finish that final mile in his works to create true greatness. It could just be the current way TV is setup that's hurting him, but it's still a shame to see that potential wasted (that annoys me more than anything about him).

Star Trek show Prime Directive. tinyurl.com/38fcbn

Loved the fact that Cally & Chief live in the exact same bunk as Helo & Athena.

I actually thought it was a good episode. Could've done without the airlock, but hey, it wasn't that bad. It was nice seeing Adama acting consistent to his character for once.

Ok, no one mentioned this in the TB, so I have to ask: was Adama in bed with a chick at the start of the episode?

Chromedome said something nice about me *blush*

And its got to be Roslin for Cylon/ Its the on;y one that could make sense (maybe Cottle too). It cant be another Glactica crew member.

And poop - I thought 3.16 was the Maelstrom episode. ah well, bring on next week.

As for the Pleasure Ship, I imagine the whole point of it was for one to travel between the colonies in a leisurely manner. Consider our own solar system: it takes two hours at the speed of light to reach the Pluto Formerly Known As a Planet. Who needs a pleasure ship when travelling just 5 minutes between colonies? My guess is that FTL became standard starship design after the Cylon War for emergency/attack reasons.

also, there are other planets that were colonized. the people weren't all on caprica, there were lots of other planets. then some got split off behind the cylon's enemy lines and whatnot.

As for the discussion involving FTL technology, I think the central issue at the beginning was that the Galactica was/is OLD and probably had not "jumped" in quite sometime. When they were forced to start making moves after the original attack, it made the crew anxious. And let's not forget that Adama requested a jump into the Ragnar Anchorage which, apparently, was an incredibly risky maneuver.

Red Ned Lynch probably has some further thoughts on this. FTL technology hasn't really been "explained" like say...Warp Drive. But we do know that some ships in the Fleet have a more limited jump range than the Galactica. Even still, the Cylons have better FTL capabilities altogether.

Talk about your positive reinforcement!

Fleet FTL:I think have heard them make the point early on that many ships in the fleet have "limited" jump capability, and even earlier on that those crews were not proficient with jumping. Would make sense that a basic FTL capability would be installed as a safety precaution. Even a Pleasure Ship could have an in-flight emergency and need to someplace fast.

lame. star trek was at its best when it minimised that stuff and worked within the framework it had already established, even if it was built on bullshit. well, heres battlestar galactica. they're basically us, in space. they wear suits, use paper, fire missiles and machine guns, they use telephones. its all designed to seem as realistic as possible. but its gotta have ftl travel and space fighters and a robotic enemy! ok. then we'll do those things in a basic fashion, and that will be all. no technobabbling it up. it exists, and thats all there is. what are you even complaining about anyway? you like starwars? know how hyperdrive works? blasters? lightsabres? no. they're just there to let the story be told. this is why olmos does the show and why it earns accolades, even if its losing viewers. no aliens, no rubber masks, no lasers. if you cant see why thats important, then theres little point continuing.

second. you cant enlist everyone. they and we covered this ages ago. if you're all dictated to by the military, wheres the human freedom you're fighting to defend and continue? may as well turn around and run to the cylons with open arms. besides which, what if your draftees dont like it. gonna shoot them? throw them in jail? thank gods you people aren't in charge of anybody.

thirdly, new rule: posters who post consecutive bashings of whatever the topic is, seemingly taking a break only to consider what next to complain about, get ignored. what are you here for? heres a thing; every weekend i have friends over and we watch the tv i downloaded via dvr. we choose what series to watch. HEROES was chosen when it started. i quickly got bored of it after a few weeks but everyone else liked it so i carried on. recently, i've been so bored of it i set it playing for them and leave the room to cook or clean. i find it stultifyingly slow; the characters are hateful; theres not enough action, especially considering youve got folks with superpowers; and characters suffer from what the ones on lost do, to whit, they live in a fucking haze of non-communication, blinding self interest and inability to make connections, hence despite intertwined lives and meeting occasionally, they are unaware of each other or events, and i find it really irritating watching them piss entire episodes away on their lonesome. sometimes i read the talkbacks about it here. and i'll write a big post about what i dont like and what they need to change. then i think "what the fuck?" and delete it all and go away. because i don't want to be one of those guys. now why do i do that, and yet, you trolls dont?

As for the population breeding, I think they are, as already mentioned, in the red. However, I believe that part of their goal with finding Earth is to integrate with that population ... the "better start having babies" line is more of a "in case we don't find Earth" conditional. Frankly, I think if they lose another 5-10,000 people, they need to outlaw marriage and start creating breeding stocks to ensure the future of the populace.

That could be a fun filler episode.

Or do they mean it will "have" direction after next week? Man, how I wanted to love this show. How disappointed I've been after the mini-series. Galactica successfully avoided the "Hero Cliche", but became one giant "Emo Cliche"... There is not one likeable character on the show. I would hate to hang out with any of them because they'd want to drag you into their whiney, downer worlds of lost loves, guilty pasts or political debate. I enjoy almost every other aspect of the show (I guess why I still watch), but the general slow moving storylines and the characters (not to mention the horrendous acting…ugh…it’s like a cable show. Oh…wait…) just kill the show for me. And that is 80% of any sci-fi show. Character, story, pacing…anyone of those falter, no matter what your effects budget is, you’re dead in the water. It's nearly better to watch with the sound off.

Some were bitching about Star Trek, Star Wars and other movies/shows that use 'bullshit science'. Yep, I understand, but those high-fantasy elements may be silly, but those shows and movies actually told stories and had likeable characters planted firmly in coherent and (many) classic stories. FIREFLY is the only other space faring sci-fi series I can think of off hand, I'm sure there are others, that has no aliens, lasers (aside from one laser pistol that was considered a military-class advanced weapon and scared the crap out of anyone facing off against it), and the other usual trappings of sci-fi. Sadly, it didn't last long due to being on network television. In the time it did last, it had great characters in spades! Semi-"Hero Cliche" stories, but was never, EVER a slow, plodding, "Emo Cliche" as Galactica became.

I know the show has a lot of fans and I think that's terrific and I hope the show continues to bring you the grocery list of goods you enjoy from it. But I can't help but compare Galactica to FARSCAPE in the way that hardcore sci-fi fans watch, support, and defend the show in such a ferverent, nearly hostile way simply because the shows are science fiction and are/were the only space faring sci-fi on television at the time.

But Baltar has Shiny Chrome Ones.... seems to work with they cylon ladies...

Chrome Beats Brass, Chrome Beats Brass!

dstrbo! - Seelix is looking pretty hot these days. Or course, I'm biased due to my short-hair fetish...

Over at battlestarwiki.org (the link is http://tinyurl.com/ypegnp)it is reported that Jen Halley has Aaron Douglas' full endorsement.

According the report, Douglas thought her character had potential and he worked with her, so it makes sense to see them in an episode like this...This could have been his plan all along. :-)

BTW, that Seelix info in Herc's post was totally wrong. C'mon, Herc, we expect better!

After the past couple of weeks, I now find myself stoked again. Great television. And to think..."Maelstrom" is on its way...

After huddling beneath a crushing avalanche of snow for the past several days I was pleasantly surprised to find BSG a refreshing coda to an otherwise stultifying weekend. Clearly the writers are hard at work to find ways to keep Baltar the series troublemaker. With his craven sense of wounded superiority and penchant for Cylon threesomes, Baltar's an unlikely hero of the common man, but for a guy locked in a cell with a mattress I suppose it's the best he can do. Anybody shocked that the poster boy of Cylon collaboration could amass any popular support in the fleet is clearly ignoring the present circumstance in US politics in which an otherwise utterly discredited president retains the rock-solid support of 30% of the population. Sorry to dip my toe into politics there -- if I've offended your particular political beliefs, please consider me pre-chastened and move along. One wonders who Baltar's lawyer is, since it doesn't appear to be Adama Jr.

I thought the central conflict of the episode between lower class workers and the bureaucratic elite was unintentionally ironic, since nobody paid any attention to the plight of the Tylium miners until one of "the good ones", Chief Tyrol, became involved. The happy ending came across as very deus ex machina. I possess a blinding white hatred for the president, who 30 minutes into the episode lacks any compassion or accommodation whatsoever, but right at the end turns a dazzling 180 and becomes the picture of sense and reason. If something changed the president's mind it must have been pure sorcery because nothing else seems to explain it. Maybe I'll just put it down to the magic of having a fellow series regular, Chief Tyrol, involved in the labor dispute. (She couldn't relate to the leader of the refinery workers when he was just a guest star.) Overall I thought the central premise was interesting, and if it was a bit filler-y, it was more fun than watching various characters cast longing glances at each other in a bar.

My favorite story thread of all was Seelix's promotion to pilot. That one got me right *there* since I'm a former deckswab (or current-day military equivalent) myself. If filler episodes are necessary, I won't mind as much if they're more like this one. One wonders whether they're showing these filler eps in any particular order, though. Aside from a random line of dialogue here and there, they're pretty much interchangeable.

for the record, I'm not a democrat, does that just blow your fucking mind or what?! Morons like you always think you know what everyone else is thinking. Read your previous post, the one I mocked you for, and ask yourself if there's anything in there that a thinking person might find offensive, democrat or otherwise. Jeezuz.

Here's the reason. Seelix's involvement in the Circle shows she steely and dangerous and it signals that "Hell is coming" with her IMO.

But there's probably going to be an added twist. At least there should be because that's way too easy IMHO.

Any how tonight's episode really was the best in a while.

Lesson - no one wants to be treated as a second class citizen. After a while, they get sick of it and rebel/strike/etc.

Good question.

Adama: I'm sending Tyrol back over to you.

Roslin: Again?!?

Adama: Yes, well, I feel he has legitimate complaints. In addition, you might want to be nice to him.

Roslin: And why's that?

Adama: Because I threatened to have Cally executed.

Roslin: Oh.

I liked this episode, but it's hard to call it good for reasons others have mentioned. Roslin's inconsistencies were more a sign of weak writing than anything else. And the fact that everyone else gets the kid glove treatment, but when Tyrol stands up, Adama threatens to kill his wife??? Although, I suppose that's more an argument against the rest of the series.

I was laughing at Baltar's manifesto. It really does kind of sum up all the other manifestos out there. I was also thinking WTF when Callie quoted from it. Execution orders aside, she was resistance. And she's spiteful. It's almost unbelievable that she would warm to him enough to read it.

Roslin needs to go as president. I love Mary McDonnel but Roslin is not very good. When confronted with a real problem, she doesn't try to fix it. That kind of politics is par for the course in the real world, but given their very survival is on the line, I'm thinking, she's just a school teacher. Zarek wouldn't have let this problem fester.

I'd like to see an episode where someone proposes creating a new cylon labor force to deal with these problems. Given their labor shortages, it's just a matter of time before it threatens their survival. And they do know how to make them. If they scaled back the AI enough, it can be argued the risk is reasonable. Imagine if one of those tillium engineers had created a few to help out and they just found out about it in this ep. Could they really afford to shut them down out of principle, despite the desperate need?

The episode dealt with an issue most shows never have the balls to address: upper versus lower class lifestyles and the sacrifices, reconciliations, and social patterns associated with each.

Roslin and Adama dealt with the situation in exactly the right way, in my opinion. They couldn't afford a general strike since there was a good chance they'd run out of fuel and be destoyed. Therefore they had to force the issue and be uncompromising. But, to their credit, they actually listened to Chief after he called a strike and decided to vary the workload among classes. A beautiful and hard-fought solution on both sides.

Now we'll see if it works.

Reading these TBs about BSG reminds me of stories that came out of the polar expeditions in the 1800s. You have a small party of people who voyage out to the middle of nowhere carrying their food on their backs in what was at the time the geographic region most actively hostile to human life. Temps at negative 80 degrees and no available fuel, food, or water (you can't survive on ice and snow... it takes too much energy for your stomach to melt it). Something goes wrong and now everyone's trapped, with tempers fraying, zero resources, and no hope of rescue. The only way to get to safety is a forced march through hundreds or thousands of miles of wasteland. People start to drop like flies from exhaustion, dehydration, disease, injury and malnutrition. Infighting saps the will of the survivors. Sounds a bit like Galactica's premise, but Galactica is in worse straits. They're not there by choice, they were driven from their homes. There's no safe place to return to, only the hope of one (Earth). They're pursued by evil robots who want to kill them (most of the time). And they're living in little metal bubbles floating in space, without even oxygen to breathe if something goes wrong.

Galactica's fleet has been extremely lucky to find planets like Kobol, New Caprica and Algae Temple Planet to restore resources, because otherwise it's hard to imagine how they could have survived for so long. So, given the dire situation the fleet is in, it's good to see stories lately that return the focus to survival rather than melodrama and political infighting. The polar explorers had their share of histrionics, but life and death was always the biggest problem they faced. When BSG focuses on the human side, it seems to lose track of these larger issues of survival when the viewing audience, including myself, have not. Tension decreases dramatically if the characters are more worried about political popularity and who's dating whom -- it means, in spite of everything RDM said about the original series setting up a tragic premise and then ignoring it -- that things really aren't that bad. Anyway, I'm glad to see episodes that return the show's focus to the realities of survival in space and the quest for Earth.

Yorkshire has always had the label of working class, salt of the earth, call a spade a spade, last of the summer wine, James Herriott sort of people. Funny that James should chose that accent to show that side of colonial life. Bit like putting on a Southern white trash accent.

Southern drawl is quite nice, but Southern trailer park os not.

I'll shut up now!

We have had the Dire Prediction from Zarek (?) about what will happen if Baltar is given a trial, and this ep seemed largely to be set up for that.

I agree with others who note that it is odd for Callie and others to buy-in to Baltar's book. It would seem reasonable for people working 18 hour days for year(s) in the bowels of a refinery ship, but Callie oughta be so biased against Baltar, as should have the Chief, that even if Baltar speaks the truth on a rare occasion, they should automatically dismiss him.

seems like a lot of energy SHOULD have been expended finding out WHO was helping Baltar get the pages out of his cell.

The Seelix story is an interesting surprise, and looks like it will be fun to see where it goes.

Bring On the Maelstrom!!!

a powerful whirlpool; a large, swirling body of water

I am gettin dizzy with anticipation!

Di rect to DVD movie sounds pretty certain

Spin-off series confirmed

but if she did, that would be mighty fine by me!

Confused Cheers to you....

Thanks for the definition of maelstrom, too. BTW another definition is "A violent or turbulent situation" (to be honest, I never would have looked it up if it wasn't for your post). Still, both meanings reveal that bad things are a'comin'!

However, I don't think that the Hybrid is at all the one from the promos who "will discover that they are a cylon". The Hybrid will be one of the Final Five, and we will likely not learn that this season.

This season, I am still into the Trinity Theory: The One Who Dies, The One Who Discovers They are A Cylon, and the One Who Finds Earth will all be ONE person. That person will Die, find themselves UPloaded to the Final Five in the real Temple (not the vision temple), and that Temple will be On Earth. (I think the Final Five are ON Earth).

Lots of pointing at Starbuck as that person, probably misdirection, but it would fit well enough.

And if ultimately I am proven wrong on the Hybrid Theory (won't know for sure until All Five are known) then I have reserved the handle NoHybrids to use thenceforth.

And, NoHubris, you are welcome for the link, and the definition for Maestrom you provided sounds much better suited, sir!

Cheers

One has to wonder why they changed it. Well "one" doesn't have to, but I do! :-)

After Adama threatened to put Callie against a bulkhead and shoot her :) , the Chief crumbled and ended the strike. Adama then told the Chief he had an appointment with Roslin to discuss worlers rights. There he got drunk.

Frackin' A.

Good, nay excellent episode. Really struck a chord with this working class lad. TV Sci-Fi doesn't have a good track record with social justice and equality; Babylon 5 tried it a few times ("By Any Means Necessary"), but JMS can't avoid writing his working class grunts as giant fucking cliches.

I haven't been impressed with Espenson's Galactica writing, but she knocked this one out of the park. And don't forget co-writer Anne Cofell Saunders' contribution; she was responsible for the brilliance of season two's Pegasus.