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Plurst!
by TheRealMoriarty
Nov 24th, 2006
12:19:43 AM
Allow me both to say first, and to call you a plant. Plurst, indeed, Herc. Plurst indeed.
Phlecond
by scrivener
Nov 24th, 2006
12:32:45 AM
*sigh* More political Masters of Horror episodes. yay.
This year's season
by Fish Tank
Nov 24th, 2006
12:36:05 AM
The Damned Thing: Horrible, shot well but disengaging and pointless | Family: Great except for the guy actor who sucked, loved Wendt and the blond wife | The V Word: Solid first 20 mins, bad after that - repetitive | Sounds Like: Terrrrible, this guy did The Machinist? and suffered severely from "who cares" and "boooooring". Mori - the ONLY episode I liked from last year was yours, and that's not because this is your thread. Homecoming (or whatever the zombie soldier one was) was the worst. ALL episodes suffer from not knowing how to pace themselves over that 1hr10mins. It's a sad sign when I find I really don't give a shit about what's going to happen. For some reason they (for the most part) feel like 30-40 minute shows padded to make that mandatory time-fill. I look forward to yours Mori - don't let me down.
I don't have SHOWTIME
by YackBacker
Nov 24th, 2006
12:43:35 AM
So I can't comment on whether I liked this or not. To be honest, I have nothing to say at all. Um, congratulaions, perhaps? Yeah, but in reality, I don't care either way. As Moe Syzlak once said "I am a well-wisher in that I wish you no specific harm."
Yack...
by TheRealMoriarty
Nov 24th, 2006
12:45:19 AM
... I'll accept that.

Scrivener... this is not a political episode. It is not HOMECOMING. I promise.

Thank science for that.
by scrivener
Nov 24th, 2006
01:00:16 AM
Homecoming was fucking terrible. I'm Tivoing this just for you, Moriarty. Well, and because Ron Perlman is in it.
Dexter
by Darth Fabulous
Nov 24th, 2006
01:17:29 AM
Yack...you should get Showtime for Dexter alone...Julie Benz is...well, she's hot dammit.
Pretty good episode
by krodnoc
Nov 24th, 2006
03:07:20 AM
Andrew Deane screened this episode at the Dublin Horrorthon almost a month ago. It's good. Goes all nuts towards the end. Reminded me of The Thing in some ways.
Moriarty writing Mortal Kombat 3?
by Shivv
Nov 24th, 2006
03:20:40 AM
At least according to IMDB he is. I hope they pay a lot. If you're gonna make a crappy movie you might as well get paid well to do it.
Darth Fabulous
by YackBacker
Nov 24th, 2006
03:25:45 AM
I just caught an episode of DEXTER on the Showtime website. Very good show. And Benz is indeed hot. Your opinion is now trusted in my house, Lord Fabulous.
More Swan/McWeeny/Carpenter goodness!
by bb6634
Nov 24th, 2006
03:36:42 AM
Can't wait! Anyone know if Lucky Mckee will be returning for season 2? Loved 'Sick Girl'.
Personally I found Cigarette Burns...
by Sledge Hammer
Nov 24th, 2006
05:53:53 AM
...to be the most disappointing episode of the first season. That's not to say it was horrible, but as a long time Carpenter fanatic I wanted it to be great, but instead it turned out to be very mediocre, with only the always cool Udo Kier being a notable highlight. The story was solid, if very derivative of some much better things, but much of the dialogue was just plain clunky, and some of it, ye gods, was "how you americans say"...outright awful and way too cliched.

That said, it was still better than Sick Girl, Chocolate, Jenifer and Fair-Haired Child at least, and about on part with Dreams In The Witch House, landing it about the middle of last season's episodes quality wise for me.

Be interesting to see how this season's ep turns out...

Sorry, you lost me at Season 1
by MKiro
Nov 24th, 2006
06:17:19 AM
The series was the most overrated, disappointing, turgid load of trash I've ever wasted my precious time on. The only half-decent episode was Miike's ... and that wasn't even broadcast originally. So, I'm sorry; I'm not even going to give Season 2 a ghost of a chance. I could be doing far more valuable things with my time... such as picking fluff from my navel, sucking the toe-jam from my feet or even de-worming the dog.... manually.
I thought Ciggy Burns was the bollocks...
by abiggerboat
Nov 24th, 2006
06:56:34 AM
Hopefully Pro-Life will just as good. I too would like to see more horror served up 'Carpenter style'. Tell you what would be good, another 'body bags' style segmented horror film - presented again by JC himself, maybe even with 'OBI' and good old 'Moriarty' writing a part?! Just my opinion!!
Substitute 'the' with 'self-indulgent' in the above
by MKiro
Nov 24th, 2006
07:00:23 AM
And that's my own opinion
Deer Woman and Sick Girl...
by Frijole
Nov 24th, 2006
07:12:45 AM
were the best episodes of Season 1 (my my eyes and ears). I haven't written Moriarty off as a writer, but CIGARETTE BURNS wasn't nearly as clever as it thought it was, and probably below VILLAGE OF THE DAMNED in the Carpenter catalog.
Oh and...
by Frijole
Nov 24th, 2006
07:15:44 AM
I actually started getting angry whenever a character said "Le Fin Absolue du Monde". Yes, yes... I know that is the title of the movie being sought... but after the 327th time hearing it (usually in a ridiculously exxagerated accent), I was ready to go Elvis on my TV.
Sounds Interesting
by stvnhthr
Nov 24th, 2006
07:39:16 AM
I am pro-life, and I hate it when the popular media constantly shows us as whackos, that being said I have to admit I'm not too excited to hear the pro-choicers are getting a turn in the hot seat. Sometimes turn around is fair play, but not in this case. It really won't change anyone's mind and usually detracts from the significance of the issue. Best of luck to Moriarty anyways and I'll give it a watch once it hits dvd.
Congrats on the Success Mori...
by RobFromBackEast
Nov 24th, 2006
07:41:21 AM
Looking forward to this.
We have a TB for this, but not Scrubs?!?
by chrth
Nov 24th, 2006
07:44:13 AM
DAMN YOU HERC!
saw it...
by Buffalo500
Nov 24th, 2006
08:11:41 AM
...at the Horrorthon and I enjoyed it, a few Carpenter elements in there, notably the siege of the clinic and also The Thing reference towards the end. Drew ,did you specifically write this for Carpenter?
No Lucky McKee in Season 2
by godoffireinhell
Nov 24th, 2006
08:22:22 AM
He's not returning.
Best Eps
by Black Satin 2
Nov 24th, 2006
08:31:47 AM
I thought Cigarrette Burns and Sick Girl were pretty good, and Fair Hairred Child had some good effects, but I agree with the person up top. These shows need to be better paced or they should end around the 45 minute mark. They seem very stuffed at 50.
Good luck guys
by Darth_Valinorean
Nov 24th, 2006
09:29:17 AM
... I really want this episode to kick some ass and I wish you well and great success. So far, MoH has been Masters of Ho-hum. I am hoping you guys take it where it needs to go. And congratulations and getting this out there.
kidding right?
by aroundtime
Nov 24th, 2006
11:03:39 AM
you are kidding about the whole pro life thing right? Because of the whole "its the year 2006 and its barbaric to force someone to have a child" thing. Why would you even bring that issue up before the episode even airs. I wanted to watch it for fun horror, not insane old world issues. Let the show speak for itself next time.
I liked Cigarette Burns a lot
by KnightShift
Nov 24th, 2006
12:14:46 PM
It wasn't entirely *perfect* but it was still one of the more innovative - and disturbing - horror stories that I'd seen in awhile. Now I'm intrigued by Pro-Life's synopsis and that it's got Ron Perlman in it. Too bad I don't have Showtime :-(
this episode has a clear PRO ABORTION message
by godoffireinhell
Nov 24th, 2006
12:30:51 PM
Cigarette Burns was (at least for me) one of the few great episodes from the first Masters of Horror Season. For Pro-Life, Carpenter has reunited with the same writers (Drew McWeeney and Scott Swan) and puts out something that resembles a sort of "Best of". Elements and citations from The Thing, Assault on Precinct 13, Prince of Darkness and Christine are nicley integrated in the episode, but what really sucks is the obvious ProAbortion Message. Don't get me wrong, i'm ok with abortion, but when the message comes like this ... oh boy, that hurts. Be prepared for a big, big letdown.
About Cigarette Burns...
by MacGuffin
Nov 24th, 2006
12:41:52 PM
I really loved the idea of a film that drove people bat shit insane, but I found that the story had one major flaw: Why would Udo Keir's character care so much about a stupid film print (no matter how "special" it was) when he has a GOD DAMNED FALLEN ANGEL locked up in his house?!! Not to mention that he treats this being, who could unrefutably prove the existence of God, like a sideshow freak. How rediculous is it that he has this thing chained to a spinning platform and lit with colorful lights? I don't know if that was the choice of the writers or of the director, but personally I would have at least had Udo's character keep the Angel in a shadowy prison-like room in the mansion's basement, and not fully reveal him until the end. I feel like his introduction near the beginning ruined a potentially good surprise. That's my $.02
Did you ever notice...
by vivavitalogy
Nov 24th, 2006
01:39:06 PM
the people for late term abortion also want to "pull out" of Iraq?
I didn't forget! That's why I'm skipping it.
by BannedOnTheRun
Nov 24th, 2006
02:31:25 PM
Har har! I keed. Like billions of others, I don't even get Showtime.
Vivavitalogy:
by DoodlyDingDongTickTock
Nov 24th, 2006
03:08:58 PM
Pulling out is immediate abortion. Not late term. We've lost Iraq and perpetuated more decades of violence and terrorism. The only thing left to do is leave. Fuck the troops, fuck unwanted babies. That's my $.02
"Baby Fuck! Baby Fuck! It's AWWWWWWRIIIGHT!!!"
by godoffireinhell
Nov 24th, 2006
06:31:47 PM
That's a quote from a Japanese comic called MAI-CHAN'S DAILY LIFE by Waita Uziga. Somehow that just came to mind.
Meh...
by moogu2
Nov 24th, 2006
10:02:02 PM
That was pretty "meh". Ron Perhlman was great, but the rest of the cast sucked. Also the story was full of plot holes and cliches. I also don't understand the message: We should allow abortion, in case someone gives birth to a demonic spawn child? Also why did the father spend so much time sucking out the insides of the head doctor, when he could have been "saving the child", the entire point of him breaking in and killing people.
I gave it a shot and....i regret it
by StrokerX
Nov 24th, 2006
10:08:03 PM
I mean...for real? It was like a cheap remake of The Omen...why did we need a cheap remake of The Omen? Why did it take them so long to get inside the hostpital? How many times did she yell, "I feel it!!! Its coming!!" like 12? Why does a lizard skinned, horned demon have a crab baby? Why did the guard have half his head shot off..only to show him lying on the ground with head intact? Why was the doctor not screaming when Ron was sucking the juice outta him? People really get paid to do this stuff? wow
Ummm...
by leeVSbenway
Nov 24th, 2006
10:35:40 PM
...this season is really, really bad. I'm surprised no one ever mentions the best episode of season one, PICK ME UP was fuckin' awesome.
W-T-F
by TopHat
Nov 24th, 2006
11:27:06 PM
Sooo ...all babies that don't get aborted are demons? That's why Pro-Choice people are right? Pro-Life people aren't doing God's will, they're doing the will of a demon that looks like Tim Curry from LEGEND?! ...Actually, I thought it was a cool set-up; not knowing what's going on and all, but, you didn't have Emmanuelle Vaugier get naked and moan for several minutes ...and that is unforgivable.
I like Moriarty, not so keen on McWeeny
by hktelemacher
Nov 25th, 2006
01:30:42 AM
That the lines are blurring is scrambling my brain. I actually just watched CIGARETTE BURNS today for the first time and was disappointed. It was equal parts what, 8MM, NINTH GATE, IN THE MOUTH OF MADNESS? Wait, didn't Carpenter direct that too? I know it started out as a feature length script and maybe something (a lot) was lost in the scaling down for both runtime and budget, but that little flick actually made me sad. A lot of potential. Nice little premise, a little been there done that, but hey - I was on board despite the derivative conceit. The investigation was boring, the horror forced and unimaginative - but I could forgive that had the ending satisfied. I wanted to like it, but it just plodded along. I'd call it predictable but I didn't predict it would play out in suchan obvious way. My armchair critique is that the guys have a good sense of the macabre and the unknown, had some good bits here and there, but I never really felt like they turned up the heat on any of it. I understood why the Reedus character had the backstory haunting and daunting him, but it didn't fit, was underdeveloped and then overwrought. I liked the intestines in the projector, but kept thinking he was cutting off his cock and was actually disappointed when he didn't. Thought about doing mine, then watched the Dante episode instead. Same difference.
Teh Suck.
by Sleeperkid
Nov 25th, 2006
02:59:12 AM
As much as I didn't want this to suck...I'm afraid it pretty much did. Lots of it had nothing to do with the script (the set design looked like something a kid came up with in his garage...especially in scenes featuring the secretary's desk), but a lot WAS due to the inept screenplay and bad directing (Carpenter...what happened??). Nice to see the budget drop so low you never see Pearlman or his youngest son go to their deaths...and when the actual demon popped out I half expected a GWAR song to kick in. Better luck next time, I gues...
Is there anything more ironic
by 2LeggedFreak
Nov 25th, 2006
03:45:30 AM
Than a guy who can do superb, detailed intelligent reviews of others work but then has a total blindspot to the crap he writes himself.
Yep, it was awful...
by Sledge Hammer
Nov 25th, 2006
04:17:02 AM
...I'm honestly sorry to say. And Carpenter seriously needs to sever all ties with you guys as soon as possible, directing crap like this is just dragging his rep even further down into the mud. If he can't get any good stuff to work on, or get any of his own stuff funded anymore (which is a crime by the way) then maybe he should just retire and rest on his laurels and all the great films he's already given the world. Keeping his foot in only to be reduced to making stuff like this isn't helping anyone.
I agree...
by GiveMeAnFinBreak
Nov 25th, 2006
09:47:38 AM
Carpenter oughta kick these scrubs to the curb. That was just painful. Beyond the initial concept, which could have been a really cool b-movie scenario, the ep seems to've been botched at every turn. Well, aside from that big ass demon. He was pretty cool... but his actions were retarded, he was absolutely ZERO fucking menace, and those special effects where he popped up out of the ground and grabbed people were fucking retarded.
Don't quit your day jobs, guys
by DynamixRo
Nov 25th, 2006
10:14:21 AM
Or is writing bad scripts actually what you do for a living, in which case more power to you. Seriously, it was a very poor episode. I thought "Cigarette Burns" was way overrated but I was definitely one of the better first season episodes. Not that that's saying much. Although it "borrowed" elements from 8mm, In the Mouth of Madness and a few others, at least it had a certain style and mystery to it. But this...what was the damn point? Just a pointless storyline and a waste of Ron Perlman's talent. Masters of Horror is mostly a pretext to show off cool gory effects on TV. One of the few episodes I did enjoy was this season's "Family", which was pretty damn good. Seems like that's just an exception, though.
Hey Moriarity.....
by Ultron ver 2.0
Nov 25th, 2006
10:40:08 AM
Has there been discussion of The Grave Dancers? I just saw the trailer and it looks pretty cool, and actually scary. I didn't pull up anything when I searched AICN.
Grave Dancers is pretty cool....
by Jarek
Nov 25th, 2006
11:23:51 AM
.....right up until the overblown bad-CGI filled ending.... In many ways it felt a lot like the House on Haunted Hill remake: lots of good traditional scares and FX, but then a horribly overproduced ending. Still, after this and The Convent, director is one to watch.
This season SUCKS!!! Reason - too soft...
by ComputerGuy68
Nov 25th, 2006
12:07:49 PM
and no skin! After last week I'm about ready to give up on this mess. I will watch this one tonight, and if it's as bad as the rest of the season it's over - Done deal, pal, done deal..
Moriatry
by Puñeta
Nov 25th, 2006
12:48:16 PM
That was an awful episode, and the thing i hated about it the most was the preaching for pro-choice, what a ridiculous episode.Now im not saying i would write a better script, god knows i would be awful at writing one, but i can say that your episode sucked hard.
i don't get how everyone is saying this season is bad..
by Jarek
Nov 25th, 2006
01:24:05 PM
There are two pretty damned good episodes so far..... Family and Sounds Like were both above average I thought (though some of the acting in Family was a little weak).
wow
by Buffalo500
Nov 25th, 2006
01:35:20 PM
it's amazing how much hatred this episode has generated. Is it because people expect a JC film to be a classic every time? is it because of peoples political views? maybe it just feels great to be negative? I enjoyed it a lot, it certainly was not the mess that most people here are making out.
Confused
by stvnhthr
Nov 25th, 2006
01:37:19 PM
So after stating in the review that this episode was mocking the radical pro-choice crowd, it turns out it actually is just another low blow aimed at those who hold a pro-life view and strongly supports pro-choice? Real classy, why am I not surprised?
Don't be confused...
by GiveMeAnFinBreak
Nov 25th, 2006
01:58:55 PM
Not even those guys seemed to have any fucking idea what direction they wanted to take this in. They pussed out and started chasing their own tails. I could see where they were really trying to be subtle, to make this more than your average gore-fest... they really think they're artists... but, I just don't think they know how. Poor misguided kids. Congrats to them for getting it made, I guess... condolences to the rest of us for having watched it.
Too bad this episode couldn't have been aborted
by evilbaby
Nov 25th, 2006
02:16:32 PM
Seriously, I enjoyed "Cigarette Burns" quite a bit. I thought Carpenter was bringing some of that old school style of his back with the creepy atmosphere and the like so I was looking forward to this episode quite a bit. Sadly it seems like Carpenter has been sucked into the black hole known as Masters of Horror. The episode was AWFUL, the performances were atrocious (especially the pregnant girl) and the sound FX when the crab(?) baby came out bordered on the campy side. VERY disappointed.
Wow, great way to paint with the broad brush
by Immortal_Fish
Nov 25th, 2006
02:27:10 PM
My daughter needs either me or the wife's written approval to get a tooth filling or to have a wart removed. Despite the possible physical damage or potential mental damage, my daughter doesn't need such approval when having a fetus aborted. Furthermore, if another adult traffics my daughter across state lines in order to skirt the law and my parental obligation, their action is not crimminal. This is wrong. But I certainly wouldn't stoop to such a low level as Perlman did here. And if my daughter was carrying hellspawn, I'd be first in line greasing up the hacksaw.

For what it's worth, in hope to stave off the loopy left of TB, I'm pro choice the way Europe is pro choice. We on the right are always being told to look to Europe for guidance. Take a look into the abortion laws of England and France. You may be surprised that it is nothing like the no-holds-barred approach that is practiced here in the US.

OBTW
by Immortal_Fish
Nov 25th, 2006
02:39:11 PM
The episode accomplished what it set out to do, even though it was C-grade horror comic book fodder. Granted, such a forum can be quite provoking some times, yet this politically based MoH episode required the viewer to be one of the flock, or easily convinced at the very least. I'm one of the few that enjoyed Cigarette Burns despite it's few flaws. Meanwhile, this episode was a flaw with too few moments that I wouldn't consider 'inspired' yet I will settle for that description for lack of a better word. Better luck next time, Mori.
Thing is...
by Sledge Hammer
Nov 25th, 2006
03:59:06 PM
...I personally am one of the pro choice flock (though not to a crazy or fanatical shove my views down someone elses throat extent), but I still thought this episode royally sucked ass.

Last season was overall very damn mediocre, this season so far is, amazingly, even worse, and yet this episode still manages to be one of the absolute worst MOH episodes yet.

To say this with full knowledge that my man John Carpenter directed this gives me not an ounce of joy at all, but that still doesn't stop it from being true. :-/

The only film critics that can make flicks...
by Mattapooh
Nov 25th, 2006
07:44:49 PM
... are Bernardo Bertolucci and Dario Argento. Sorry, but Cigarette Burns had an interesting premise, but god-awful presentation. It looked cheap, the actors were awful, the dialogue was weak, the entire thing came out worthless and boring. Granted, the screenplay and directing would've been commendable coming from a group of kids who just got out of film school, but two guys who've been writing for over ten years together? And JOHN FUCKING CARPENTER? Let's face it, most people went in because of Carpenter's name and came out disappointed. I'm all for creative freedom, but that script could've been really good and just came off as flat. Not a bad flick by any means, but also far from a good one. Keep pounding away and hopefully we'll see something pulled off well in the future.
That was really bad, dude.
by MattCG
Nov 25th, 2006
08:45:45 PM
Seriously.
Leftist episodes appear to be the weakest of them
by Immortal_Fish
Nov 25th, 2006
08:56:52 PM
Put your political leanings aside for a moment and come to terms with shit smelling like shit.

Coming Home, despite being awful, was counter-intuitive/counter-prod uctive to the left agenda. Briefly, dead soldiers came back to life to vote. Presumedly to protest why they were sent to war. And when they arose and voted -- they died again LONG BEFORE their votes were tallied. Whelp, so much for those Diebold controversies (surprisingly quiet this past year). You do the math.

Wow! Now that was CRAPTACULAR!
by Triumph poops!
Nov 25th, 2006
09:02:40 PM
I won't even bother going into the whole argument of "what" Mori and his writing partner were trying to say about abortion in this episode. Whatever the hell their message was, it got buried in an episode that made NO sense anyway. Seriously, basic logic went out the window early in this thing. As someone above noted, what the hell is Ron Perlman EVER doing that makes sense? Let me see if I have this right -- He's driven and determined, so much so that he's willing to resort to violence and use guns to storm an abortion clinic to get his daughter, he knows the clock is ticking from the moment he arrives AND fires the first shot...yet suddenly he has all the time in the world to stop and give bloated speeches and even more inane, has time to waste sucking out the guts of the doctor. Riiiight, like that makes any sense. Say as opposed to him actually securing the building (since he now knows that particular doctor is down and no longer a threat) and making sure NO ONE ELSE in the building (say the actual frigging security guard!) will likewise pose any REAL threats or distractions. As I said, logic here was just whack start to finish. But aside from actual story holes, the BIGGEST thing that sunk this episode was Carpenter's truly shitty direction. Wow! Talk about CRAPTACULAR. Everything shot in bright light...no mood or menace AT ALL to anything, including even the demon which at least had some decent makeup work...hell, there were no uses of creative camera angles. Everything was as basic and as truly vanilla as you could get. The whole thing felt like it was shot by a film school student -- that is, a NINTH GRADE HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT using a $300 camcorder his parents got him for his birthday at Costco. Some people here have said Carpenter needs to get away from Mori and his partner. Actually I think it's the other way around since at least they were trying to do "something" with their script ideas. I don't think they actually succeeded since both this and CIGARETTE BURNS have story holes big enough to drive an Optimus Prime Transformer's truck through, but at least they tried. But both times now, in terms of actual direction and execution of the episodes at hand, Carpenter has clearly just been going through the motions, I assume to collect a check. After watching this shitfest the other night, I can't even believe we're talking about the same guy who directed HALLOWEEN, THE FOG and THE THING. Even on a basic level of killing time watching some TV, this was just one utterly amazing waste of an hour of anyone's life.
While I agree that this was an ASS HORRIBLE episode
by godoffireinhell
Nov 25th, 2006
09:04:14 PM
I don't think it was the McWeeny/Swan script that made it so very bad. Sure, the script was far from brilliant but I think in the right hands it could have been turned into a decent little flick. IMO the worst thing about PRO-LIFE was actually John Carpenter's direction or rather lack of it. Unlike last season's CIGARETTE BURNS, this episode had no style, no atmosphere and was overall just bland. There's at least one huge continuity error in an effects shot, the set design is pathetic and what's up with this abortion clinic staffed by about 5 people?!? I don't know what was wrong with Carpenter when he made this but he can't have been himself. I hope he either redeems himself with whatever he does next (producing terrible remakes of his movies doesn't count) or stays away from directing for good before he embarrassed himself further.
other critics who make/made good movies
by hktelemacher
Nov 25th, 2006
10:37:15 PM
Peter Bogdanovich and Francois Truffaut (as well as most everyone else who came out of Cahiers at the time) made some undisputed classics. And Roger Ebert wrote with the best when it was for Russ Meyer.
Cody Carpenter
by dpc01
Nov 25th, 2006
11:22:40 PM
John's son (I think) did the music score, as well as on Cigarette Burns, and while on that episode he did a reasonable job, on this one I kept fixating on how undramatic and dull the music was. Horror, more than most genres, is just killed by bad scoring, not usually a problem with John C., who in features does his own music. A big problem here, though.
hmm...
by Jarek
Nov 25th, 2006
11:30:20 PM
I didn't thing it was that bad... it wasn't as good as Cigarette Burns, but it's no where near as horrible as everyone is making it out to be. Ending is a bit weak though.
Keep the horror free of the political shite
by slone13
Nov 26th, 2006
11:06:11 AM
At least if it's going to be as ham fisted as it is in Masters of Horror. I don't watch these shows to get preached to.
Huh...
by GiveMeAnFinBreak
Nov 26th, 2006
11:23:35 AM
Still no response from the guys. Come to think of it, they're probably just as blown away at how shitty the whole thing was. Maybe it didn't hit them 'till the episode aired. Apparently Showtime knew, as they released no clips or stills of the episode leading up to it's premiere, which they've done for every other episode of the series. Y'know, kinda like how they don't screen certain movies (X3, for starters) for critics because they know if word gets out how fucking awful their film is, nobody'll see it opening weekend and it just won't make ANY money.
I'm just... speechless, Mori.
by Roguewriter
Nov 26th, 2006
11:49:03 AM
I'd like to read your original script, sir. Simply because I have enough faith in you after "Cigarette Burns" to believe you wrote something much more complete and smartly concluded than this dreadful, pointless, turgid mess I watched last night on Showtime. It's too late for Carpenter -- he's lost me forever as a True Believer. Now tell me this was his fault, and keep my hopes high for your work on RACE WITH THE DEVIL, will you? (Honestly... I'm just overcome with astonishment at how truly embarrassingly horrible that episode was. Sorry, Mori...)
Crap by any other name...
by Shub-Wankalot
Nov 26th, 2006
12:42:25 PM
Unfortunately, someone forgot to torch the script and bury the film--a good thousand feet under. Oh yeah, pro-lifers are just as whacko, if not more so...and I'm leaning more so...
What is so crazy about a
by moviequotewhore
Nov 26th, 2006
04:49:21 PM
What is so crazy about a parent wanting consent on any planned medical procedure on a minor aged child? I could see if there was a life or death situation and a doctor had to do an emergency procedure. However, any procedure that is planned should be planned with the parents consent. Would you want your kid to have his/her gallbladder..or one of his/ kidneys removed without your consent? I realize implication of abortion is different from those situations, but it is still a medical procedure. Suppose if there were complications...
No director...
by Sledge Hammer
Nov 26th, 2006
05:52:24 PM
...could have saved that script and story. Not without a major rewrite throwing away pretty much all of it and starting over anyway. And when are you gonna get a chance to do that on a tv show schedule? As such I'm not surprised that Carpenter phoned it in (a little disappointed, but not surprised), I mean if this is what you had to work with would you bother making the effort? Probably not. Add to which man is probably depressed as Hell that this bottom of the basement kind of shit is all he gets offered these days as well...Depressing on all counts really.
Pro-Life
by Black Satin 2
Nov 26th, 2006
06:56:55 PM
I felt the episode didn't have a solid premise. Do you notice a trend on these shows? People, usually girls, are running in a forest where they are picked up, abducted, or nearly ran over (See Jenifer, Fair Haired Child, Deer Woman) and they have a tale or a situation where the poor sap or saps are drawn into. I wish they could change that once. Also, I thought the father Ron Perlman played wasn't so much in the wrong. He wanted his daughter back and they, the abortion clinic held her hostage, even though he took things to extremes. In the end, the 'voices' he was listening to directing his actions were the excuse he used to commit the real acts of violence in the story. Heck, when the 'father' showed up, I wasn't surprised at all. After this, I'm ready to look at Miike's Imprint which was also about abortions and was extremely more hardcore.
Woot!
by TheRealMoriarty
Nov 26th, 2006
10:53:35 PM
Well, then. A guy takes a few day off to eat some turkey, and the whole time his ears are a-burnin', and lookit why!

If you guys would really like to have a chat about this, I'm up for it. If you just want to tell me I suck, I think the point's been made significantly by this point in the thread.

Before we start, though, you can maybe click here if you want to read the shooting draft of PRO-LIFE.

Whatever the case, thanks for watching and for your hopefully honest feedback to the film. I appreciate you spending even that much time on it.

Ooops...
by TheRealMoriarty
Nov 26th, 2006
10:56:43 PM
... didn't do the hotlink right in the last talkback.

Here's my blog link, where the script is located. If the talkback software automatically puts a break in the link, just fix it:

http://moriartylabs.typepad .com/all_my_lies_are_always_wi /

Cavities and warts are not abortions
by westwood13
Nov 26th, 2006
11:15:43 PM
I shudder at the idea of debating this here, but come on, be serious. Very few teenage girls are disowned by their families and kicked out of their homes for having a wart. When 14-year-old girls are so afraid of telling their parents that they have a cavitiy that they start drilling their own teeth, maybe then we can consider this a valid comparison. Bottom line: Communicate with your daughter, make her feel safe in telling you anything so that she'll WANT to tell you if she's pregnant. If you don't, no law in the world will MAKE her tell you if she doesn't want to. All the law can do is prevent her from going to a safe, legitimate doctor if she decides she wants an abortion and can't tell you about it.
Gotta say...
by Sledge Hammer
Nov 27th, 2006
12:00:02 AM
I respect Mori for stepping up and into the heat on here, and putting his work on display for all to judge, especially after such a backlash. It doesn't change my mind at all about the (lack of) quality of the episode in question or the writing behind it, but that's just my own opinion, however I do rate the move of him standing by his work, for good or for bad.
Now that's good satire
by BannedOnTheRun
Nov 27th, 2006
03:29:29 AM
The subtle political message of "Homecoming" was a bit obtuse and nuanced for my intellect.
political messages
by ZO
Nov 27th, 2006
08:19:20 AM
arent good for horror its writers trying to relive the 60's. the glory days for liberals
Thanks for sharing the script, Mori.
by Roguewriter
Nov 27th, 2006
10:57:44 AM
It reads like a bullet... I just think the story derailed badly in the final third. The fact that we don't get to see The Father tear Dwayne to pieces?! We see a lot of needless gore and violence (the reluctant son shooting the bystander outside -- twice, no less, despite his verbal uncertainty about his father's madcap plans) but we don't get to see Big Ron Perlman torn to bits? C'mon!! And why doesn't The Father kill Angelique for murdering its offspring? Just didn't work for me. Still loved "Cig Burns" -- you're batting .500, sir! So where the hell's RACE WITH THE DEVIL already? =)
Moriarty - you're an enigma
by Fish Tank
Nov 27th, 2006
01:49:36 PM
You are far and away my/the most respected critic on this site. It is your candor, insight and intelligent writing that I have come to admire. I believe that if this ep. was done by someone else, you would have torn into them, and most likely bashed it for all the reasons that the above posters have pointed out - though politically you can't bash it as it's a meal ticket. I agree with all of the talkbackers on the negatives. It could have been better with severe editing and some plot logic fixes. Now - as an aside, I'm interested in how the whole process works. Do you and your writing partner have equal say? Does one of you lead and the other edit? How do you sell the scripts to MoH? How did you and Carpenter come to work together? Why are they remaking The Thing, and what does he think of it?
Somebody TinyUrl that script link, please!
by godoffireinhell
Nov 27th, 2006
03:22:13 PM
I can't get that shit to work and I'm curious to see if it is indeed Carpenter who deserves the main blame for this episode's suckage.
Re: Fish Tank
by godoffireinhell
Nov 27th, 2006
03:22:43 PM
I can answer your last two questions. The people working on MOH are working on it because they're friends with Mick Garris. Moriarty has been friends with Mick Garris for many years and therefore was able to pitch some script ideas for a potential episode. CIGARETTE BURNS got chosen, he and Swan wrote it and then they showed it to the directors. Carpenter loved the script so much he decided to make it his contribution. And because that worked quite well they worked together on season two's PRO LIFE... which didn't work so well.
Thanks godoffireinhell (n/t)
by Fish Tank
Nov 27th, 2006
09:37:40 PM
_______
Mori = Ed Wood...Carpenter = Lugosi
by Bob Cryptonight
Nov 27th, 2006
11:50:58 PM
That's really what these two "horror" efforts suggest. I'm serious.
MCWEENY=UWE BOLL OF SCREENWRITING
by Travis Pickle
Nov 28th, 2006
03:49:18 AM
But at least Uwe Boll's in shape. John Carpenter should box Mcweeny in a ring until Drew's cheesy demon baby pops out of his hamburger. You have to damn a place like Hollywood that craps on a genius like Carpenter and leaves him defenseless to desperate hacks like Mcweeny. But on the bright side, we now have a new gold standard of bad screenwriting. Move over Manos, here's PRO LIFE!!!!
Your hyperbole is misplaced, Pickle
by Roguewriter
Nov 28th, 2006
02:39:52 PM
Here I am, talking to a guy who calls himself "Pickle." Sheesh. Don't go comparing Mori to Uwe Boll. Jesus, overdramatize much? Pisher.
Agreed w/ chicky...
by Roguewriter
Nov 29th, 2006
08:59:45 AM
I didn't like the conclusion of the tale, but Carpenter really coulda brought the scary more effectively. It felt like the script wanted to "Jaws" the monster, keep it hidden in shadow most of the time, and that would have gone a LONG way toward a decent creep-factor. I get the feeling Showtime's MASTERS OF HORROR concept is to slap whatever simplistic stuff up there it can get, so long as each ep is heavy on the porn-gore (i.e., the double-tap to the escaping father, the headshot for the security guard). Neither of those moments was necessary to the logical flow of the tale -- I much rather would have seen the demise of Dwayne and the last of his sons (where DID that poor bastard go, anyway?) than these tertiary characters. The Chris Walas school of gore FX ("stop the action! look at my icky, icky creation!!") isn't what I expect from a series ballsy enough to call itself MASTERS of Horror -- I want much darker, disturbing and creepazoidal storytelling. "Cigarette Burns" and a couple other season one eps were pretty close to the mark, but nothing this season is keeping me tuned in. Here's hoping there's good stuff in the near future. (And I still need to put the Miike episode on my Netflix list -- anyone consider that one a worthy rental?)
westwood13, re: "Cavities and warts"
by Immortal_Fish
Nov 29th, 2006
06:36:37 PM
You're right. A fetus should not be equated with a cavity or a wart. And that is the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT. What we are discussing is not a mild discomfort or blemish to casually discard. We are talking about a potential person that might hold the cure for cancer for all we know.

It is a parent's obligation to shepherd a child to adulthood. Part of that is coaching a child though traumatic experiences. Traumatic experiences such as abortion.

Now, granted, there is a percentage of parents that will physically or mentally abuse their pregnant daughter on being told that she is pregnant. And every time legislation is brought forth that would allow her to approach private counsel with a judge it is smacked down by leftists. Note that I don't write Democrats. I write leftists. The same people that smack down legislation that would prevent an adult from transporting a minor across state lines to circumvent state laws regarding parental consent.

I mentioned this earlier, but it apparently fell on deaf ears (or eyes, as it were). We're constantly told by the left (again, not Dems) to look to Europe for guidance. In England, you can get an abortion up to the fourth month, after which you need approval by a doctor. In France, you can get an abortion up to the third month, after which you need approval by a doctor. Don't focus on the fact that you'd need a doctor's okay. Focus on how the ultra liberal French is more strict than the American friendly England!

But bottom line, there you need doctor approval after a certain time. Here you don't. In America, a woman at the end of her third trimester can be giving birth in a room next to another woman at the same term that is undergoing partial birth abortion, where the child is alive for all but seconds. Is she giving birth or removing a wart/filling a cavity?

the problem with MOH...
by dimnix
Nov 30th, 2006
05:43:59 AM
...keep in mind I havent seen any season 2 episodes. But in season 1, the thing that affected every episode and is out of the hands of the screenwriters and directors - it's the photography. They need to fire that D.O.P. Bland, TV-like, no atmosphere. But regardless of the bad vibe in here, I'm looking forward to checking out Pro-Life whenever it airs here. I thought Cigarette Burns managed to be genuinely unsettling, and I love me my Carpenter.
westwood13, re: "Cavities and warts"
by Immortal_Fish
Dec 1st, 2006
07:48:07 PM
Damn, I hate revisiting TB and piling on previously commented posts, but I forgot to mention something earlier.

Give a teen an out and they'll take it. If you don't understand this, then you're not a parent or you're not a teen.

Analogy time. Anyone see Heroes on NBC? Claire doesn't want to tell her dad about her ability. She isn't pregnant and there is no immediate consequence of her informing him, yet the reluctance is there. Talk about euphamism. As a tenured father I can tell you folks in earnest -- there is no parential engineering possible that can circumvent a child's tenacity in circumventing accountability.

If you don't understand this, then you are not a parent.

Why was this talkback so hard to find?
by Penetron
Dec 21st, 2006
06:46:55 AM
I spent hours searching for this talkback so that I can say that this show was bad. There! My life is complete. Now I can go back to grading papers.
Why was this talkback so hard to find?
by Penetron
Dec 21st, 2006
06:48:33 AM
I spent hours searching for this talkback so that I can say that this show was bad. There my life is complete. Now I can go back to grading papers.
I too must add my thoughts
by FatherMcGruder
Dec 23rd, 2006
06:39:27 AM
I didn't have any trouble finding the talkback, I just typed "Masters of Horror" into the search engine and it was the first that popped up. Anyhoo, one glaring thing that no one mentioned, and has been bugging the hell out of me, is cell phones. Is this supposed to have taken place in 1987 or something? What the hell does it matter these days if you cut the phone wires? Come on people! Or is this abortion clinic located somewhere in the Canadian wilderness? I know no one will ever read this, it's been to long. Nevertheless, if some soul happens across my message, take heed! Think about it! Then double your anger at the inanity of this episode.
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