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AICN COMICS REVIEWS CIVIL WAR! THE WALKING DEAD! A TON OF CHEAP SHOTS! AND MORE!!!!

Hey look! by Shigeru	Sep 27th, 2006 09:12:43 PM
More Cog presence... congrats Heathen! Great column @$$'s!
Yeah - how about that Ultimate Spidey 100 by Toxic Frog	Sep 27th, 2006 09:16:20 PM
HOLY CRAP. This series is everything that's good about Spider-man, and a brutal reminder about how spectacularly Marvel has destroyed one of their best characters in the regular books. Thanks to Bendis and Bagley for making the best Spidey comics in over 10 years. Thanks to Marvel for otherwise ruining my favorite character.
Wow. Great reviews, guys. by dregmobile	Sep 27th, 2006 09:29:11 PM
And an especially well written review from Prof. Challenger for the 4th Civil War instalment. You touched on a lot of things I never really stopped to think about. Only recently I began to notice the ice-cold, unemotional treatment given to the saga, and you're absolutely right that, while it may impress in terms of making some great, tense action scenes, it could also inhibit new readers (like me) chances of connecting with the characters. I personally don't mind it. I figure it's just a 'style'. I am enjoying the series, but maybe because I'm in my first year of reading Marvel comics and have less investment in the characters ... *** The Nextwave collection I will grab when that hits paperback. Looking forward to it ... *** Again, great work guys!
11 Cheap shots! by loodabagel	Sep 27th, 2006 09:33:02 PM
But they weren't the ones I wanted. Nyah! Nah, I'm just kiddin'. You guys are allright.
Humphrey Lee, I am calling you out for... by loodabagel	Sep 27th, 2006 09:41:36 PM
An Astonishing X-Men debate. Dangererous was great. Issue 7 was the best issue ever. Also, go back and reread issue 15. The Wolverine mind warp was terrifying.
FUCK THE CIVIL WAR! by DOGSOUP	Sep 27th, 2006 09:42:13 PM
Most Spot On Comic Review to date. FUCK YOU QUESADA FOR ALLOWING THIS SHIT. I'm not buying your fucking crap anymore. You lost me and I'm sure I'm not the only one....
Spidey 100 by dino_hardbody	Sep 27th, 2006 09:53:07 PM
Was a fucking rip. for some reason I thought I was gonna see some sort of conclusion. Oh well. Seeing Gwen do her new tang was kinda cool but Petes dad stuff was corny and baloney. BUT, Supes #565, WOW, man, i cannot believe how much that thing sucked! Wow! And Action in almost worse. Anybody read that last storyline? The one about the umm...guy trying to sell earth? No, it was people. He was trying to sell people. Who cares. Ultimates v2 #12! I think it was cool. I have to go back and re-read 'em all cuz I cannot for the life of me remember who any of the new people are/were. Didn't Ultimates #11 and #12 end the EXACT SAME WAY? It's ok yo. At least shite happened and I was entertained. Wasp sucks.
oh! by dino_hardbody	Sep 27th, 2006 09:55:21 PM
and I bought 2 copies of Superman #565! It was an accident but still, it hurts like hell.
Great column @$$es by The Heathen	Sep 27th, 2006 10:08:49 PM
First off, Prof. that was one of the best reviews I've read in a long time and I think you nailed it. It's such a damn shame that this has to happen, but it is. I'm sick of all the anger too. Lately it helps to have something like Mogwai's, Auto Rock on in the background when reading anything Civil War just to make it more depressing or at least legitimately moving and not corn hashed. Thanks, Shig! Of course the never nude line was all you my man! I'd say more, but my lazy butt hasn't picked up Astonishing, Walking Dead, Superman, X-Men: First Class or GLC yet. But I did enjoy the heck out of the first three Green Lantern Corps though. Glad the site seems to be working better too! Let's all week it Cogs. ; )
The interesting thing about CIVIL WAR is... by Negative Man	Sep 27th, 2006 10:19:02 PM
The cross-over and sister comics is that they tend to add a ton more to the story than the main title. It's like the core title is simply a spine to the rest of the body. Namor having sleeper cells around the world. Wolverine uncovering part of the conspiricy that created the Stamford incident. The Thunderbolts creating a super-villian army. Ms. Marvel hunting down other heroes. The personal stories of the effects of the war on The New Avengers. Red Skull infiltration of S.H.I.E.L.D. in Captain America. The return of the TRUE Thor in Fantastic Four... So many of the cross/sister titles have key information that paints a fairly epic and ambitious picture for the future of the Marvelverse. I'm enjoying the ride thus far.
Now I never have to read a Marvel Comic again by UES	Sep 27th, 2006 10:20:01 PM
The Civil War review summed up my feelings perfectly. If that is what Reed Richards has become, I am now rooting hard for Dr. Doom. Reed is not the equivalent of Doom. He is WORSE than Doom, I never saw Doom murder his friends over a policy diagreement that provided Doom with no personal benefit. I might be willing to buy Iron Man as a villain, but Iron Man fighting Captain America, without even a moment of self-reflection? Other than Plot Point # 49B, why the fuck are Iron Man and Mr. Fantastic willing to risk it all and kill their pals over some retarded law that's probably unconstitutional anyway? Forget reading a Marvel Comic, has the writer ever been to America? The Patriot Act is pretty controversial but Russ Feingold didn't kill Ann Coulter because of their disagreement over it. Infinite Crisis was not great, but at least it didn't have Flash and Green Lantern teaming up to gang-rape Wonder Woman because she suports Bush's wiretaps. This isn't edgy or a commentary, it's character abuse. Can't imagine the motive for this trainwreck, unless Marvel is preparing to close down the original Universe and switch everythig over to "Ultimate". DC, on the other hand, offers 52, which is pretty good, has had some clever surprises, and ships fucking WEEKLY, not once every six months.
Best comic I read today? by loodabagel	Sep 27th, 2006 10:28:56 PM
Yesterday's For Better or For Worse. Grampa had a stroke. Funniest thing I've seen in a newspaper since that Funky Winkerbein where they had sex.
NEXT WAVE! by chrth	Sep 27th, 2006 10:43:48 PM
Even though I have the comics, I'll be buying the THB when it becomes a TPB. Issue 8 arrived today, and unlike issue 6, this one delivered on its first part. The Bloodstones were one mixed-up family. And the Captain? Well, let's just say he's your hero.
Awesome CW review by vich1	Sep 27th, 2006 10:44:39 PM
You stated how I've felt about this whole storyline but haven't been able to put into words.
Go Heathen!!! by Thalya	Sep 27th, 2006 10:46:04 PM
w00t!!! Wayda go Cog!
So Prof. Challenger, tell us how you really feel about by chrth	Sep 27th, 2006 10:50:22 PM
CW4. I think you pulled too many punches in your review.
Pardon my French, but... why no fucking Captain America by GiggityGoo	Sep 27th, 2006 10:54:57 PM
Does not ONE of the @ssholes love the world's greatest superhero as much as I do? Cap is my fave, and no one - AICN, Newsarama, CHUD - seems to give him "top shelf review" status. And the comic's the best it's been since... since... Jebus... since the Waid/Garney run(s). Come ON, guys! Give ol' Wing-head a break!
I was going to avoid Civil War... by loodabagel	Sep 27th, 2006 11:02:31 PM
and read it when it got collected, but all the props the Proffessor's review's gotten made me look at what's going on. That was one nice review. Worth any "surprise" it might have given away.
I'm totally stealing Grampa Challenger's idea by mortsleam	Sep 27th, 2006 11:04:12 PM
A series about an elite handpicked group of serial killers, brought together by the government to fight terrorism and kill random people has to be the best idea I've heard in a long time. Certainly much better than this Civil War nonsense. It'll be like Exiles mixed with League of Extraordinary Gentlemen mixed the Cereal Convention from Sandman. I can't wait to see who plays Dahmer in the movie version. I'm pulling for Matt Damon.
Civil War is awesome. by goonie	Sep 27th, 2006 11:16:54 PM
I don't get all the bitching about Civil War. Fans (like me) always complain that these huge crossover events never have any real impact on anything. Civil War is well-written, well-drawn, and , four issues in, has already made several profound effects on the Marvel Universe. While I am not thrilled with everything (I agree Goliath's death was lame and pointless), I am excited to see how the storyline progresses.
And just to comment.. by Thalya	Sep 27th, 2006 11:18:27 PM
Prof C wrote his review with incredible eloquence and restraint, much more than I know I'm capable of. Civil War is precisely why I haven't even so much as picked up Astonishing X-Men after the first arc, let alone any Marvel book, after I became aware of Marvel's editorial ways nigh on two years ago when I went to my first con. The House of Ideas clearly needs its house in order. At least DC realizes it is currently only one tiny piece of a legacy continuum, and that it has to be custodians of its characters, because that's what's going to earn its fanbase's trust. On the other side of things, Civil War and Mark Millar are what happen when you allow your BDS (Bush Derangement Syndrome) to continue festering far beyond healthy limits (as if it's healthy to begin with). They bragged about how it was going to be fair and balanced? Why is it always a big oppressive government out to get the little guy, whose job it is to make the big bad see the light? It was cliche when The Matrix came out, and nothing but a fetish thereafter. I don't understand the need in the general culture to relentlessly focus on that incredibly narrow angle of things and then try to make everything fit that model, as if that's the only way some people know how inflate themselves: by distorting and degrading others into what they want them to be. Sorry for the political rant, but this thematic undercurrent in pop culture really bugs me and I just don't get it. Some will probably say that it's art imitating life and I should take my blinders off. I think that view is narrow and paranoid and full of the same self-satisfied smugness that drove an episode of South Park last spring. Life's not black and white, there's nuance, and we're all fallible, so none of us have a monopoly on right and wrong. Not asking for agreement, just venting.
And on a completely unrelated tangent.. by Thalya	Sep 27th, 2006 11:19:58 PM
Jean Loring and The Spectre did it before Infinite Crisis. Where's the baby? It's OYL already. Will it attend preschool with Selina Kyle's kid?
Re: CW, I wanna see how it ends... by ComputerGuy68	Sep 27th, 2006 11:42:02 PM
this is going to get even more ugly before it's over. And Negative Man, you are correct, the other titles work very well with CW, much better than IC did...
Awesome review, Prof. Challenger by Ribbons	Sep 27th, 2006 11:48:58 PM
And I'm usually quick to defend Marvel punching bags around here. I'm sure that someone involved with the event is reading your review, and I'm sure they're ignoring it or kvetching about how unappreciative the "vocal minority" is, but they shouldn't, because everything you said is right on the money. If any of them care more about the characters than they do about money, they ought to think about that.
Check out that Heathen by El Vale	Sep 28th, 2006 12:11:54 AM
He's on FIRE! Actually i hope he's not. But isn't that nice about his reviews? He's a great man, he also taught me this: Bet you feel inadequate now!
Astonishing X-Men is still awesome by DOGSOUP	Sep 28th, 2006 12:14:58 AM
“Yeahbuhwhat?"
I don't know, Thalya ... by dregmobile	Sep 28th, 2006 12:44:40 AM
I keep looking at the shelf of DC comics, and titles like the following just look boring. I can't even pick them up to scan them: Supergirl, Atom, Flash, Aquaman, Blue Beetle, Omac ... and 52 ... no way am I buying into that after being let down by IC. Whereas Marvel's plethora of tie-in's with Civil War has the excitement (for me) equivalent of a season of 24. The only DC titles I bother with now are JLA, Superman/Batman, JLA: Classified, and now this Mystery in Space deal. Marvel may be raping their characters, but at least it's more exciting than DC's nation of tidy superheroics. Although I really should be grabbing Morrison's Batman ... and ION and GL do look pretty cool ...
Meet Reed Mengele, Leader of the Fantastic Four by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 12:49:24 AM
Yeah, what the fuck happened here? Who the hell is in charge here? Reed can't wait to build his super secret "42" prison camp so he can advance his experiments??? What The...I say,What the FUCK was Marvel thinking???? Reed's all excited to imprison fellow super-heroes so he can test his super-prison camp???? So Reed is now a modern day Nazi Scientist? What??? WHAT???? This is ridiculous? Did anyone at Marvel READ this f'n book before they published it? Captain America and Iron Man kicking the crap out of each other worse than they ever would any members of their individual rogues galleries??? I sure wish Cap would smack the Red Skull around like that...then maybe the Skull would think twice about coming back for a second beating! What the hell is going on at Marvel??? I mean, I agree with Prof. that IC was incompetent but Civil War is just AWFUL...AWFUL! These aren't heroes...they're scumbags...super scumbags!!!
Read Amazing Spider-Man 535 by dregmobile	Sep 28th, 2006 12:53:45 AM
It has Reed's reasoning behind why he is doing what he is doing. And dear God, I will never look at a cone of ice cream the same way ever again. sobs
ANOTHER new batgirl??? by CarmillaVonDoom	Sep 28th, 2006 01:11:42 AM
UGH...what was the resolution for the last, mute "Batgirl" anyhow? Babs wasn't the first, but she IS the ONLY Batgirl, just like Bruce is Batman, and Clark is Superman, etc.
CW is way better than you give credit by RocketJew	Sep 28th, 2006 01:26:41 AM
I think Prof.Challenger has issues With Mark Millar's Writing in General, at least when it has effect on the 616 universe. This comic is the typical Mark Millar affair. You either embrace it as it is, or you don't. I personally love it. I still have small problems, namely the reactivation of long time forgotten Goliath just so can die at the first oppurtune moment. But his death still has importantance as a device, cause now someone fucked up and someone's gonna get the blame. As well as that, would you have it that all character's get a heroically significantly dragged out moment of courage when they die? cause i don't, it gets kind of boring after the millionth time. Sometimes when a person dies, it's sudden and it's senseless, that's just the way it is. I know people have problems with the Pro-reg side's methods. Such as God-clones, interdimensional prisons, cape killer units, The New New Thunderbolts and other such nastiness. But then you have to remember that Reed, Pym and especially Stark are all futurists, and as far as i remember, futurists have always been the kind of Scientists who come up with this kind of shit in a war. I think you need to actually read the CW as a cohesive 'event', Because last time i checked it was a Marvel Comics Event. Reading the satellite comics does tend to enrich the whole thing. (well most do anyway) As for Cap calling Stark a 'pampered punk', that's just trash talk. It's funny. Plus, i'm pretty sure that's not the worst that Millar's had Cap come out with, as i'm sure the French will attest to. At the end of the day, i'm eagerly awaiting the next installment Eagerly. Although haters may still wanna check out this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I mage:Nextwave_issue_11.jpeg
A Hearty Giffen "BWAHAHAHAHA" by Pogue__Mahone	Sep 28th, 2006 01:44:36 AM
Okay... so I go check out that Nextwave pic that RocketJew mentions above and, Damn! Do I not laugh out loud!??! I hope that is in fact the actual cover to the comic because it sums up the brilliance that is this series. They way it's selfreferential and silly and - goddamn it! - FUN!!! Amidst the gloom and doom (and utter utter bullshit) that is The Civil War, we have this comic. So. There's ONE thing that Marvel is doing right. Is anyone else looking forward to Whedon taking over 'Runaways'? I am.
That's pretty funny. by dregmobile	Sep 28th, 2006 01:52:23 AM
Had trouble getting to it, though. Also here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wi ki/Nextwave
Yeah, but... by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 02:00:20 AM
...sure, but if sometimes deaths are quick and unfabulous, then how come the "big" superheroes never die that way? I mean let's not pretend we're being true to life here, or even rational, especially when Iron Man and Mr. Fantastic are using a gang of super-powered serial killers as enforcers. If you're going to re-introduce a character, then don't do it just for the sake of killing him. And if you are going to re-introduce him just for the sake of killing him, don't be so callous about it. Because it's so obvious that the characters themselves are all second bananas to Millar's bombastic storylines.
Astonishing X-Men is, and always will be, GREAT! by Zardoz	Sep 28th, 2006 02:03:58 AM
I've loved, loved, LOVED, every single issue of Whedon and Cassady's run on the book. These are the X-Men that I grew up with, and the humor and allusions to stories and events and characters that I know and love is priceless! C'mon! Who didn't shout with giddy-glee when they saw the final panel of issue #15? Kitty doing Wolverine's pose in the sewers from Uncanny #132? Geek-gasm! Whedon's the man, I'm his bitch and AXM is THE SHIT!! (And Cassady's art rulz, too!) As to CW, I'm enjoying it so far, but I'm mostly curious where it's all headed. (Iron Man beating the crap out of Cap was pretty fucked up, yo!) I just don't see how, after these guys have ripped each other new assholes they're gonna get back together on the same teams and play nice with each other again. (Which is, I guess, the point of the whole thing) I mean, can't we all just get along...?
Ok point taken by RocketJew	Sep 28th, 2006 02:23:29 AM
I do seem to Remember that Carnage's Death was a little sudden. But I understand what your saying Ribbons. Of course Captain America isn't gonna be taken out by a random scrap of shrapnel between the eyes. Marvel simply wouldn't let one of their top gun go out like that, that's bad business. But for B, and C lister's that is the case sometimes. Personally, thats what i like about them. It makes the stakes so much sweeter when you like a certain C-list character and you know he might be collateral in an upcoming event. Not all super heroes can go out careening into a kree spaceship whilst grappling a jet propelled alien screaming "Not like this! Like This!" Although you should check out 'The Punisher kills the Marvel Universe' by Ennis. It takes a quite lighthanded approach to killing off your beloved Marvel Heroes.
As for Tony's new Thunderbolts. by RocketJew	Sep 28th, 2006 02:35:00 AM
Dear christ. Name me one character in the Marvel U who hasn't at one point enlisted the help of super Villians, that's the whole point of the Thunderbolts. Although, Bullseye is evil to the core, there is no way he will reform. But Venom and Tasky have been, if not 'good', at least humane at times.
All Millar's writing is shallow by Steve Rogers	Sep 28th, 2006 03:21:04 AM
He is a high-concept kind of guy where he give momentum to a particular pitch - "oh yeah, like all the heroes having a war, cool" - but he cannot do decent emotional depth or characterisation. as the review pointed out, all his characters have the same voice (his, I assume) and this, combined with the bending of each character to fit into the plot (the clone Thor killing is terrible) is what makes the series a clunky, awkward read.
CW is may be the worst event in comics history by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 04:58:48 AM
I have never seen such wholesale raping of characters in the name of the almighty dollar in my entire life. Its disgusting how they have completely changed characters without even pretending to justify their action in the context of decades of character developement. If I were writing Spider Man after CW's conclusion I would make the whole thing a dream Peter wakes up from on the first page and never mention it again. that's all it deserves. It's as if the entire creative team at Marvel said "Fuck it we're sick of these characters let's just burn them at the stake" and did everything they could to fundamentally deconstruct everything we love about them without a single justifying factor in a single one of their storylines. The sick thing is is that there are comic nerds out there so god damned brainwashed and dumb that they actually buy this. If you think CW is well done you are an idiot, it's as simple as that. moreover you obviously hate these characters if you enjoy watching them act as if they are all on day 20 of a crystal meth binge. One of the most telling events was right in the beginning when Stark has that team go after Captain America, they confront him and think they killed him (they obviously didnt) and when they radio back they seem elated at Captian Americas death. That means Stark ordered Captain America captured dead or alive right off the bat. Jesus fucking Christ. That would be like Colin Powell sexpressing concern against the war in Iraq and George Bush having him executed in a public forum. Not to mention the biggest event in Marvel history was kicked off by some random accident at some school someplace. The 616 is a world in which catastrophic events happen constantly, and instead of making up something that would actually shake the foundations of this world they invent some quickie bullshit just to get it out of the way. The whole storyline is violently flawed from the very top to the very bottom with almost no redeeming factors coming out of anything in it. If you read the buildup to Spider Mans unmasking the only logical conclusion one can come to is that he did it because of a latent homosexual crush on Tony Stark. That's literally about as much as they give you for his motivation. And considering every single thing about Peter Parkers history would make it a fact that he would absolutely never do something like reveal his identity which he has been busting his ass for 40 years to protect what else can one assume? And the first person to come up with some apologist bullshit like "Maybe he just got sick of hiding his identity" gets kicked in the teeth.
Mark Millar is the Michael Bay of comic writers by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 05:02:35 AM
I think that would be the best way to describe him. Absolutely cannot move a story along unless hes making something go BANG. A blowhard of hte worst kind, so intent to leave his stamp on comics that he dive to any level of bullshit to dig up drama where hes not clever enough to write it for real.
Civil War makes me consider dropping every Marvel book by stones_throw	Sep 28th, 2006 05:07:48 AM
...but Slott's She-Hulk and ru's Daredevil should keep me from that. I cannot BELIEVE what Millar and co are doing to these characters! Great review Prof. Challenger
And about the political undercurrent of CW by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 05:12:25 AM
It is a complete failure even as political allegory. First of all it's too god damn blatant and in your face a Bush adminisration criticsm to be clever or insightful. It doesn't just allude to the political climate of today, it slams it in your face. There is no subtext whatsoever, what you see with CW is what you get. it's as if the bitches at Marvel said "Gee everyone is making fun of the president, we should do that too" and then wrote the first, most obvious, Mickey Mouse version of events that popped into their minds. mind you this is coming from a liberal who loves him some Bush bashing. I get it guys Tony Stark is Bush robbing America of it's civil right and Captain America is the American spirit fighting back in the face of adversity. is that it? that all you got? Any helpful insights to add to the table perhaps? Didn't think so.
The Walking Dead by Karl Childers	Sep 28th, 2006 05:58:13 AM
I stopped collecting single issues for the same reason.
what "Civil War" says about Capt. America by the G-man	Sep 28th, 2006 07:26:58 AM
do you know what "Civil War" says about Capt. America? That, deep down inside, he hates mutants. Think about it. For years now, the Marvel U's version of the goverment has tried to not only register mutants, but hunt them down and kill them (see, eg, the Sentinals). And, during all that time, Cap never got sufficiently pissed off to rebel against the government. However, as soon as a few of his non-mutant buddies are asked to register, something far less onerous than regularly demanded of mutants, suddenly Cap goes apeshit about "civil liberties." In other words, the way this story is rewriting the Marvel U, Cap had no problems with his goverment violating people civil rights...as long as those people were "dirty muties."
I can't believe people still read these reviews! by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 07:53:47 AM
Popped back in to see if they had improved at all since the last time I bothered readint these out less than a week after everyone has already read them?g them . . .oh a year ago (ish . .) And jesus, these are badly written. And still haven't even figured out a way to get them our less than a week after everyone has read their books and are on to the new ones? There are plenty of far better comic-review/critic sites on the web people shold be heading to. These are crap.
Hellpop by rev_skarekroe	Sep 28th, 2006 08:06:28 AM
The reviews aren't nearly as badly written as your post, buddy.
Well, the Firestorm review... by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 08:38:44 AM
...was originally written in the form of a letter. Preface it with "Dear @$$holes - " and it'll make a bit more sense.
So glad the Hulk isn't in CW by Meglos	Sep 28th, 2006 08:54:51 AM
I shudder to think what Millar would do to my favorite Marvel character.
Hellpop by Thalya	Sep 28th, 2006 08:58:35 AM
Beware the wrath of the Cogs, troll.
Irresponsible critic by monkeymafia	Sep 28th, 2006 09:00:19 AM
What an awful unevenly biased review of Civil War. "I didn't read any of the books because I didn't want to, but I read this one and it doesn't make sense and I hate it" Hmmm... That's like Harry saying "I didn't see 'Must Love Dogs' but I caught the trailer and it is the worst movie ever made... Do your job and stop being so angry that the world changes around you even though you may still be wearing the same tighty-whities
I have never read a comic book in my life by godzillasushi	Sep 28th, 2006 09:08:30 AM
but I know of these superheroes. Its a bummer that they would kill any of them, and have them be killed by other heroes. Just as an outsider, it sounds intriguing but does killing other characters mean they will never return?
rev_skarekroe/Thalya HA by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 09:15:34 AM
1. I'm -thankfully- not trying to pretend my reviews are worth reading. AICN has a lot of worthy reviewer/critics but the @$$es are an obviously inexperienced bunch who need to either stop writing these fanboy rants or commit to becoming better critics who can put their work out on time. 2. There is nothing I fear less in the world than Talkbacks threats/warnings. Is anyone with a negative opinion a troll? Did I insult you first?
No fear and yet, Hellpop... by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 09:28:07 AM
...yet, you must respond. Curious.
Hellpop by EveryoneSucksButMe	Sep 28th, 2006 09:30:09 AM
The reason they review books that have already come out is that they buy the books with their own money after they ship, just as you and I would do. They admit they are not professional. They don't get paid, and mainly just do this for fun, from what I understand. Hope this information helps you.
yeah I get it by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 09:33:42 AM
Wow, a civil response, thanks EveryoneSucksButMe. I get that they are not professionals and do it for fun, I just dont think they are good enough to be published on such a large site, or worth reading (and no, I haven't read them for a long time frankly). I wish there were better or worth reading, I really do. Why do I respond? Well . . . It's fun. And I am on a break. Who needs a better reason to kill 3 minutes?
the CW 4 Review by moscow3055	Sep 28th, 2006 09:34:23 AM
I actually agree with a lot of the points stated but an effective reviewer can be critical without pulling a "clerks II" thing...
My Own Money: Sixty Buck this week alone by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 09:36:25 AM
Which is why I'm dropping the three titles mentioned above, though I'll flip through Flash and probably check out the upcoming Dwayne McDuffie Firestorm issues. By then, I estimate it'll be too late to save Firestorm from cancellation, but what's a fan to do, really.
Hear me out, Humphrey... by loodabagel	Sep 28th, 2006 09:43:54 AM
I am not an idiot, and I'm still waiting When I say I want to have a debate, want to have a good one. I will not call you a pedophile. Yes I 'm sure you exaggerated a little, but I'm pretty sure we still need a meeting of the minds here.
60 a week? by loodabagel	Sep 28th, 2006 09:51:47 AM
Really? That's like 20 comics a week, which translates to about 70 per month? Holy crap. Those are some bog numbers.
cookymaloo by Thalya	Sep 28th, 2006 09:53:22 AM
Whatever happened to doing the right thing? With great power comes great responsibility, huh?
$60 this week, $10 last week by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 10:00:18 AM
This week (I have a flight tonight) I bought: JLA #2, Secret Six #4, Birds of Prey #98 (missed it last week), Blue Beetle #7, SG&T Legion of Super-Heroes #22, 52 #21, Shadowpact #5 (missed it last week), Teen Titans #39, Eternals #3, She Hulk #12, Checkmate #6, War of the Worlds: Second Wave #6, CW: Frontline #6, Nextwave #8, Supergirl #10, Action Comics #842 / 843, Batman #657, and the latest The Walking Dead TPB.
The Spiderman Tie-ins have been pretty good... by loodabagel	Sep 28th, 2006 10:01:01 AM
I'd really like Amazing if I could try to accept how evil Iron Man is.
Futurist equals fascism? by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 10:13:39 AM
Um, I don't think so. First of all, CW is not a WAR. No one has actually declared war on each other...at least in the crappy books I've read. It's just superheroes fighting each other as always. Except now they are doing it without any kind of morality. Second...so if there is a war...Reed Richards is suddenly going to use his skills in a way that is completely and totally uncharacteristic? Meaning build prisons for his friends? I don't care what kind of explanation an issue of Spider-Crap gives...Reed as Marvel's answer to Mengle is completely WRONG! Stop trying to justify crappy characterization in one of the most wrong-headed Marvel crossovers in Marvel's history...and that's saying a LOT! And stop claiming that Civil War is good because it is "change". It's change all right but it's BADLY written and BADLY thought out...if even thought out at all. It's not that fans don't want change it's that the change here is completely irrational, cruel, an, frankly,unintelligent.
Who would have thought… by The Heathen	Sep 28th, 2006 10:34:17 AM
that Bendis' New Avengers issues would be way better than Civil War and HoM? Not me, but he's proved us wrong so far. They have great revovling art and characterization that doesn't feel out of place. But, Civil War, although pretty, is going to leave the taste of a dead skunk in your mouth and that's not going to be easy to get rid of. I'm actually appreciateing HoM more than Civil War now because I can just say 'meh' to Civil War because it's more or less the same universe besides the mutant thing, but there are still more X books than ever, so it really isn't that effective. Anyway, Civil War has fucked itself so tightly into a corner that the only thing that makes sense (because nothing in the series does) is for Wanda to appear and say, "No more bullshit, rewind the timeline however many years and let's make up… oh, and Wolverine smokes again too." But that's not likely… then again? I also really don't care for the Ultimate line, but when the idea of having that takeover as the main Marvel starts making sense then you know the 'House of Ideas' is in bad shape. Hellpop, rev_skarekroe said it best, "The reviews aren't nearly as badly written as your post, buddy." Why post if you don't care? Flee. I wish Millar the best with his Crohns, but c'mon Mark, wha the hell? It all goes back to that Wizard interview when the writers and editors are coming up with 'ideas' and Jeph Loeb said that fans would be outraged and at least 80% of people would not like it. "GOLD!!! Let's do it, not only the one, but all of em!!! Fuck it!!!" End rant. I love you, Vale. ; ) Thanks, Thalya! wOOp, wOOt yourself.
Lame CW review by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 10:42:59 AM
When any kind review starts off with something like, "If I was not reviewing comics for AICN, I would not have read this comic,” any responsible reader looking for real criticism would stop reading. It's the equivalent of saying, “I hate jazz, but here’s my review of this Coleman reissue.” “Spielberg makes me choke with his pompous crap fests but since I have to you review movies here you go...” “I can’t stand crude humor. Just let me preface that before I get into my review of Clerks 2.” How about someone who was one the fence about CW reviewing #4? Or someone who at least read 1-3? Compare/contrast? Perhaps the main players look pissed because they are and are supposed to be. Perhaps Colossus’ death isn’t pointless because, well, it isn’t. I’ve been reading the series and I can feel why Cap is pissed. I can feel the characters responses being organic, not simply puppet motions. I can feel the whole plot as something that deserves a series. Superhero registration. Makes sense to me – seems like it’s something that would be brought up in this universe. Interesting even – and not just Uncle Moneybags’ scheme to shake things up and buy more cigars. Lame CW review. If you don’t like the show change the channel, and if you don’t, well then, don't bitch to me about it.
reactionary fanboys by spidercoz	Sep 28th, 2006 10:50:25 AM
"Oh my god, comics are different than when I was a kid! Oh my god, these people need to be burned at the stake!" Do you actually read this shit you write? Seriously, how about some even-handedness from YOUR editorial staff. Where's the reviews from people who are into Civil War? I've read about 80% of the CW stuff so far, I've picked up several titles just because they were tie-ins, and I've been intrigued and astonished by it more than any comic run that's been out in the last decade and a half. It's beautiful. Why the hell do you think it's called CIVIL WAR? Both sides are convinced they're right. Both sides have resorted to doing extremely out-of-character and horrific things in support of that belief. Both sides have seen the results and are beginning to doubt their convictions. Both sides are going to regret this whole shit ever happened. And something insidious lurks at the heart of the matter. Sounds kinda like reality. And that's what comics, and pop culture in general, are, reflections of reality. Complaining about it because it's different, the whole world is different, asswad. Adapt. That's what our beloved characters are trying to do. Obviously it's not easy for them, reading any of the core Spidey books hammers that point rather effectively. Choices were made, consequences have to be dealt with. The shit's been building for years, didn't you notice? It had to explode sooner or later. And if you've only read the CW limited, you're missing HUGE chunks of the picture. Personally, I think Front Line has been the best part of the story so far, followed by ASM and Wolverine. All the little details, character motivations, and individual perspectives have made this series a total mindfuck to read. And if you can't handle that, well, sorry. That's your own misfortune. Me, I can't wait to read the Cap and Iron Man tie-ins.
spidercoz by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 10:54:36 AM
I second that. for the most part.
where are the reviews from folks who like civil war? by Firedrake	Sep 28th, 2006 11:24:37 AM
Apparently those sad souls can't tear themselves away from their relentless rodent fucking to write a review. I'm actually kind of glad, because really, who really cares what such deluded asshats think? Yes, that's a bit over the top, but frankly I have no patience for apologists of this shit writing. As for horrific or out of character actions, why is it that really on the fascist, er..., government side is doing those. The rebels are pretty much doing what they always have done, going after villians and helping folks. The whole "which side are you on" is kinda silly when it's so obviously skewed. The tie ins also suffer from serious craptastic writing. Heroes for Hire's ending nearly had me projetile vomitting all over that sad piece of festering trash. I could care less if it's "different" if it's at least good and doesn't basically have characters going against everything they've believed in and fought for their entire histories for the length of this run of literary diarreha.
Boy am I glad I toned down rants this week. by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 11:27:28 AM
You talkbackers are really taking it to the CW#4 review. Look, you've got to read past Prof. C's first sentence; he explains his rationale right there in the next paragraph; it's his duty to read these comics and to let you know if they're schlock or not. Anyway, though I'm not actively buying CW (I am picking up Frontline and New Avengers), I have faith that all of these extreme personalities we're seeing are going to end up being due to some form of manipulation. I smell Hate Monger. Then-again, as the internet can easily show you, I read a lot of 52 and am prone to see conspiracy where there is none.
I think Millar's a BIG OL' FAKER. by Dave_F	Sep 28th, 2006 11:29:30 AM
You know, what with the Crohn's Disease and all? The evidence for this unprovoked attack? I'm glad you asked! For starters, the guy is a CONSUMATE practical joker (Google his email prank on Ed Brubaker). Millar's also one of the modern masters of fan manipulation - sort of a foul-mouthed Stan Lee for our times. And then there's the fact that he loves the shock stuff. Think about the "Face it, Tiger" condom line in TROUBLE or the ass-fuck ending of WANTED. You're telling me this isn't a guy who likes screwing with readers? Add it all up and it becomes obvious. His Crohn's Disease? The best meta-prank since the days of Andy Kaufman. It's genius, really. The perfect sympathy-getter, the perfect excuse for lateness, and he even picked a disease that no one's ever heard of so he can make up the symptoms as he goes. He's like Micah Ian Wright, only without the getting-busted! Now that...that there is one wily Scotsman. (I'm going to hell for this post. Even though I'm kidding. Hell. Me. Together. Like Anton Arcane in that issue of SWAMP THING, bugs and everything)
Dave!!! by Thalya	Sep 28th, 2006 11:38:31 AM
Look everyone, Dave's back! Hi Dave!
No cheerfulness, Thalya. by Dave_F	Sep 28th, 2006 11:45:15 AM
I'm TRYING to be controversial! (hi)
Spidercoz, you buy 80% of Civil War stuff... by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 11:55:09 AM
And YOU'RE the one who's unbiased???? Please...get over your Marvel Zombie sychophantic Quesada ass-kissing point of view. Try and see past your love of everything that Marvel spoon feeds you. You paid money for that stuff??? You are the one I'm supposed to listen to with reason? Um, I don't think so..."Sounds kinda like reality." Hey jackass...it's NOT reality! It's a comic book! It's not different! It's more of the same nihilistic storytelling that we've gotten in THE ULTIMATES...which is where it belongs! If you honestly think that Reed buidling a prison camp or Iron Man trying to kill Captain America are just "resorting to doing extremely out-of-character and horrific things in support of that belief." then you know less about characterization and the characters in Civil War than Millar does. These so-called heroes are now acting like out and out VILLAINS. You're telling me that Tony Stark would enlist the help of BULLSEYE to stop Capatain America? Really? A psychotic killer over a man who has saved the United States and probably the world probably hundreds of times? This isn't change it's bastardization....Change is Staczynski revealing Peter's identity to Aunt May and repairing his and MJ's marriage with some great, well thought out writing. Bastardization is having Gwen Stacy sleep with Norman Osborn and have his bastard love children. Civil War is part of the latter. Sorry you can't get over the hype to see past it but, well, you did blow your hard earned cash on Civil War so you're the choir they're preaching to anyway. Sucker.
I wondered when the the fanboys would show up. by WarpedElements	Sep 28th, 2006 12:02:25 PM
I used to be a huge fanboy myself. Picked up anything with X- in the title. Loved the huge crossover events and i still have TPBs for everything from Secret Wars to everything having to do with HoM and Decimation. But unlike the fanboys who attack the review, and even degenerate into name calling simply because they disagree. The reviewer simply goes over the material, and you hope they're unbiased, and you agree or disagree. You don't fly into a rage of "OMG IT'S TEH LEET! YOU MUST LOVE TEH GIANT CROSSOVEROMGWTFBBQ". If you disagree, don't slink back to "well they're rodent fuckers", try and rationalize why you think it's great other than "IT'S A GREAT SPECTACLE OF GREATNESS AND IT MAKES YOU THINK! POLITICAL MESSAGE OMG!". Why not take a few breaths, relax, and try to understand where Prof is coming from, and then try to counter said point with, logic, experience, whatever. And if worse comes to worse, just down a few shots of liquid plumber and ensure you never have to suffer a big bad mean review.
Cabin Boy,,,for someone who read all of Civil War 1-4.. by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 12:03:43 PM
You'd think you could get GOLIATH'S name right. Goliath was the one who was killed, not Colossus. Maybe you should read those books more carefully before you criticize anyone's review who actually carefully READ the book and remembers the names of the characters and what happened to them...I'm just sayin' is all...
i've enjoyed every issue of civil war, sue me by waggy	Sep 28th, 2006 12:28:08 PM
yes, i think some of the pro-reg heroes are acting out of character, but i really don't see any of this alleged "longterm damage" being done to them (whereas i thought there was plenty of that in id crisis). ten years from now people will be whining about the event books going on then, and how they don't make books like civil war any more. don't believe me? i see message board posts from people nostalgic for the clone saga all the time. ok, so that may not help my argument much, but my point is you always see the most complaining for whatever is being published at the moment and everything that came before is viewed through rose-colored glasses
superhero by spidercoz	Sep 28th, 2006 12:29:52 PM
Damn dude, you'd think I have an emotional stake in what you think with all that venom you just spouted. Not only are you completely wrong about me, which stands to reason, you have no idea who I am, or if I even exist, but you're wrong about the story. Acting like villains, perhaps, but they're being compelled to do so, whether it be from a legal standpoint or a personal conviction. Tony Stark views the SHRA as the next logical step in superhuman integration into society. He thinks it will lead to a greater good. He's probably wrong. Steve Rogers thinks that the underlying fabric of what the country stands for has been put to the torch and everything will collapse. He's probably wrong. Peter Parker thought he was doing the best thing for his family and his country. He's probably wrong. Reed Richards has always put the cold scientific viewpoint before the human one, he's probably wrong. Everyone in the story has been written faithfully to the character, that's why a lot of them are beginning to have doubts, on both sides. The characters are having to reexamine their convictions in the face of a changing world where those convictions are no longer sufficient. Iron Man thinks he's trying to save Cap from himself, Cap thinks he's the last true American, they're both probably wrong. And they're both definitely being manipulated. And did I not state that it's a REFLECTION of reality? Our world changed for the worse, why shouldn't their's? Keeping the status quo for 40+ years was starting to bore me, I'm glad they're shaking the shit out of things. If you don't like it, don't like it, I couldn't care less. But spewing these insults and derision at me, a complete stranger, is simply flamebait of the highest order and not only nullifies any legitimate argument you may have had, it makes you appear as little more than a silly cock crowing on his own dunghill.
Keep it up by Prof Challenger	Sep 28th, 2006 12:43:49 PM
CIVIL WAR in the Talkbacks is exactly what I was shootin' for. Now we can get a bunch of cutesy little graphic sigs peppering the internet with "I'm With Prof" or "I'm With Cabin Boy." Then maybe Spider-Man can walk up to Heathen and crush his skull like a ripe tomato. Heroes for the 21st century I tell ya.
Hey Prof.. by Thalya	Sep 28th, 2006 12:44:21 PM
I think your review hit a nerve. It's getting quoted in full on Newsarama boards already. Really great job, btw. A great piece of writing in and of itself.
Destroy the Original Universe by PleasureB4Business	Sep 28th, 2006 12:52:08 PM
Best case scenario for Marvel is that the next "event" series puts all the "classic characters" into jeopardy and they hire Whedon on to do an Ultimate line. Millar was great on Ultimate Xmen, but then they over-streched him, he's no Bendis. Ultimate is kicking the original Universe's ass. Bendis and Whedon know that character makes plot, but so few execs are listening.
Prof's review by moscow3055	Sep 28th, 2006 01:02:33 PM
It may have been great writing (maybe), but can we call it an essay instead of a review? Just seems like an actual reviewer needs to show some impartiality and prof really seemed to come into this loaded for bear.
Dare I say it...? by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 01:05:47 PM
Are there Marvel plants on this TalkBack? Lots of names I certainly haven't seen before. Maybe that's just because they're (totally unbiased) goobers who are only here because they were linked to this article from angry fanboys on Superherohype or Newsarama or WizardWorld. You talk about how little Prof. Challenger cares for comics and how his review shouldn't "count" because of that, even though there's no internal logic behind such an accusation whatsoever, but I think the fact that he's passionate enough about the characters and what they represent means that he cares a great deal more about them than any of you tools. If you like "Civil War," that's your deal, but try to explain why either innocuously or elouqently instead of going "Oooooh, I'm a whiny fanboy, comics aren't like they used to be, they're more awesomer and I don't like them waaaaa." Trying to drown out Prof.'s review with a bunch of obnoxious garbage does you no favors.
regarding plant status by moscow3055	Sep 28th, 2006 01:11:02 PM
LMAO...not a plant here just a lazy SOB who has taken one too many classes in Literary criticism. And actually totally agree with Prof's main points...just think they'd carry more weight if they didn't use phrases like turdpile...and yes i know that's not a direct quote...
superhero... by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 01:15:12 PM
Sorry about that Colossus/Goliath thing, that was a total blunder. Hopefully you saw past it and got my point. Which is not to say that The Prof. doesn’t have very valid points – he does and I did read the review. But my point is that I don’t necessarily want to read reviews from people who go into something with absolutely no interest in it – nay, disdain for it. In most publications reviews don’t get handed to people who have animosity towards the subject matter. That’s all. I can totally understand why someone wouldn’t like CW based on principle. But for that person to write the review here for #4 just rubs me the wrong way. I’d rather hear what one of the other @$$holes has to say else has to say – do a double team review or something. It’s not like it isn’t worthy of a good, “Jane, you ignorant slut” reply.
"If I was not reviewing comics for AICN... by nofate	Sep 28th, 2006 01:16:26 PM
I would not have read this comic." Thank you, really. That statement spared me wasting 20 or so minutes reading your over- analysed, cliched bitching of why Civil War is this and not that, this person is acting out of character, this would never have happenned if they knew the history. WAKE THE FUCK UP PEOPLE! We bitch and bitch about the big two not willing to take a risk outside of the status quo and then anytime a story like this comes out, wah wah wah!
Dave sure is huggable when being controversial by El Vale	Sep 28th, 2006 01:22:04 PM
Oh wait, he's not! He's totally cheating on us in bath house-like talkbacks far away from here sobs That said, he does have a point about Crohns not being a real disease and stuff.
Cabin Boy by Prof Challenger	Sep 28th, 2006 01:23:09 PM
Believe me. If what I had to say (or the way I said it) about CIVIL WAR is bothering you, I can assure you that the rest of the team here would likely have caused your head to explode. In our communications back and forth last week, I don't remember any of them supporting that comic. And they're a LOT angrier personalitities than ol' "grampaw" here. :)
I'd fuck Spider-Man up. by The Heathen	Sep 28th, 2006 01:29:58 PM
Crush my head? Bah!!! What was that thing we talked about a few months ago regarding the capabilities of his spider sense? Could he sense a sniper a thousand yards away? A bomb? Er, anyway, looks like Prof's review is also helping to kick this here talkback to the number one spot too! Kudos. I'm with Prof. ; ) Ribbons, interesting point about the Marvel plants. That makes sense when thought about. Stranger things have happened, like Reed Richards cloning a Thor god clone while manipulating his mind and building a prison camp for his buddies, but still, possibly. Dave_F!!! It's Dave (albeit a controversial Dave). How's it been. THe Cogs were talking about you in the mansion the other day.
spidercoz...wrong again... by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 01:31:26 PM
"Everyone in the story has been written faithfully to the character" No they haven't. But if you can't see that then I know I'm not going to convice you either way since you bought 80 % of the books so far. Plus, I love how everyone keeps sayin the Marvel world is changing...so a school of kids gets blown up and that changes everything? Remember...9-11 happened in the Marvel U and I didn't see any heroes running into Afghanistan to fight the good fight. What about all of those times Doom blew up a building or the Red Skull sent a rampaging robot through NYC? That didn't freak people out enough to have the heroes go take out the villains for good? OK, but a villain, a VILLAIN blows up a school because some teen heroes are after him but NOW all the Marvel heroes decide they should turn on each other because of it??? Nope...not buyin' it! Not at all. ESPECIALLY Reed Richards turining into Mengele. Reed was always detached but he was more about working on tech and gadgets not experimenting on people...
I'd love to have every single @$$hole review CW4. by The Heathen	Sep 28th, 2006 01:36:31 PM
That would be a roundtable for the ages. I say do it. It's not like you guy's wouldn't have enough to say.
Spidercos, why you are violently wrong by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 01:37:59 PM
"Both sides are convinced they're right. Both sides have resorted to doing extremely out-of-character and horrific things in support of that belief. Both sides have seen the results and are beginning to doubt their convictions. Both sides are going to regret this whole shit ever happened. And something insidious lurks at the heart of the matter. Sounds kinda like reality." First of all none of that is an argument in defense of how these characters are acting. most of these characters have been around since at least the 60's, and they have, with a few blips here and there, remained largely the same while the world has gone through tons of changes. When the world makes a shift you don't go ahead and change the character you change the world that character lives in and watch them react to it. Well you might say "yeah they have been the same characters for 40 years its time to make a change" Fine. Make a change. But for the love of god and all that is holy make it even the slightest bit real. Some of these characters are acting with complete disregard for what we know for a fact is their basic foundation of beliefs. What exactly has happened to these characters to make them behave like this? Certainly nothing in Civil War would justify it. For Reed Richards to be acting like he is it would take something catastrophic, like the death of Sue. It's like Dwight Eisenhower becoming president after being the ultimate WWII hero and then declaring marshal law on America and becoming a dictator. I'm assuming when you say "Sounds kinda like reality" I'm assuming you are refering to the Bush administration. Yeah CW does sound kinda like that (trasparently, uninsightfully so)But Bush was a man who clearly even before the presidency was clearly an incompetant man who erred toward very seedy tactics to get what he wanted, anyone with a brain could see that. Iron Man on the other hand has been a consumate hero, I mean he was the leader of the Avengers for Chrissakes. What would have possessed the heads at Marvel to make him the catalyst for all this other than "hey he's a rich guy and the horrible men running our country now are rich....clearly Tony Stark is a bad guy!" This entire awful idea is flawed from the start given that no one would have supported Stark, that's been proven true considering anyone who does has to do wildly out of character things for it to be justified. If the American government demanded super heroes reveal their identity the superhero world would respond overwhelmingly and simply refuse and the government would be powerless to do anything about it and that's just the way it would be. you're "And their probably wrong" explaination for these characters actions arent any sort of explaination. Basically what you said was "these characters are doing what they are doing cause they think its whats best". Well no shit sherlock, the question is WHY do they think its whats best. Reed Richards always takes the scientific approach? Yeah but he doesnt do it, knowing and willingly, at the expense of lives. he has always been a very good guy who puts good before science. you make him sound like some cold hearted nerd disconnected from society and sociopathic. Hes one of the greatest heroes of all time he wouldnt all of the sudden devolve into some inhuman "SCIENCE IS GOD" monster. Thats Doctor Doom, not Reed Richards. And Peters "Hes doing whats he think is best for his family". Boy what insight Spidercos. Why exactly does he think its best for his family? hes knows damn well that there are incredible consequences that will never go away, ever. That there are people who will stop at nothing to destroy him to the point where Aunt May and Mary jane would be in incredible danger simply stepping out onto the street. not to mention Mary Jane has an acting career that would be destroyed. SO why would Peter, being the smart guy we know he is, choose clearly the wrong path with no reason whatsoever to do so? Throwing away years and years of what he always believed was the right thing to do for those he loved? Who knows, nothing int he comic explained it. And Tony Stark, dont even get me started. hes now one of the most manipulative villains in the Marvel universe and there is no way to make him anything but. they have not even attempted an explaination for his actions. Its as simple and cold as that. And telling Superhero he is wrong just because he insulted you is asinine. This isnt a stilted presidential debate. its a talkback and if someone insults you suck it up, and if they have a better argument (which superhero does) that doesn't change because he lost his temper.
"In MOST publications..." by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 01:40:41 PM
"...reviews don't get handed to people with animosity [/antipathy] towards the subject matter." And you're basing that on...?
Prof, your review was COMPLETELY on the money... by stones_throw	Sep 28th, 2006 01:46:02 PM
Civil War is just nasty and destructive writing. Anyone who thinks Reed Richards would break up with his WIFE for forty years and start building concentration camps for fell ow heroes over a POLITICAL ISSUE is a moron. And Reed was never scientifically detached or cold in the slightest! The true characterisation of Reed is an intrepid and heroic (if occasionally absent minded) explorer who always puts FAMILY first. He'd only retreat when he was building a weapon to defeat Galactus or someone. Stan Lee always wrote him as a riff on the archetypal hero.
THANK YOU, Superhero by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 01:46:58 PM
I've been saying that since hte beginning. This "stamford Incident" (the fact that the Marvel writers refer to it in such a grandios fasion just shows their self crongratulating hubris) WOuld in no way justifies the events of Civil War. Catastrophic thing happen constantly in the Marvel Universe and this is hte one that breaks its back? no fucking way. A few years ago kang made hte entire city of Washington disappear and no one batted an eye.
grampaw by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 01:47:06 PM
I didn’t get into this wanting to defend CW, even though I do enjoy the series and think the premise is ripe for good storytelling – I just didn’t like the place the review was coming from. I will admit that it surprises me if none or next to none of the @$$holes enjoys these books. There’s soooo many books out there far far worse than CW (not that that’s a ringing endorsement to pick something up). But I mean, I think the art alone in these things is worth picking them up for. Be that as it may, I’d still like to hear another @$$holes take on it.
I will say that the art in Civil War is great... by superhero	Sep 28th, 2006 01:50:57 PM
But the coloring...OH, the coloring...way too dark...but it's a dark book so what do I know. There I said something positive about it. Now leave me alone...:O)
In Talkback Civil War, I'm with Buzz Maverick! by rev_skarekroe	Sep 28th, 2006 01:52:57 PM
Mostly because, like me, he probably hasn't bothered to read any of the books related to this event.
Marvel editorial can kiss my ass by El Vale	Sep 28th, 2006 02:01:49 PM
Do these people even know what they're doing to me? They're pissing me off! Alonso and Millar and the rest, fucking Al Quesada is what they are. Filthy scum, have they no shame? I wish i could kill them a lot so that they would die and burn in the fiery pits of hell.
Ribbons by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 02:03:38 PM
Any publication really. You'll notice that in Spin, Rolling Stone, NYTimes, Pitchfork, LATimes, whathaveyou, that the same person generally reviews the same type of thing. If it's a horror movie, the horror movie guy will review it. If it's a techno album, the guy who likes techno will review the album, and so on. Stephen Holden isn't going to review the new korean genre movie, probably Dargis will. Trust me, they don't just pick them out of a hat.
By the way by El Vale	Sep 28th, 2006 02:04:15 PM
What is this Civil War all the kids are talking about?
Ah, but... by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 02:24:44 PM
...you're talking about how their experience with the genre might make their review more informed. I mean, guys like A.O. Scott review disparate genres, provided they're "big releases." Same with Rob Sheffield for Rolling Stone. In Prof. Challenger's case, I wouldn't argure that he doesn't know what he's talking about. That he doesn't like what he's talking about is another matter entirely. You're not required to like the material you're reviewing.
this is why I prefer close-ended stories by oisin5199	Sep 28th, 2006 02:32:12 PM
like Sandman. All this bitching over 40-60 years of character continuity. Well, fuck continuity. Do you really want to see a character never change over 40 years?! That's some boring shit, if you ask me. Nowadays, instead of seeing the same old shit retread or freaking out because a writer changes your beloved characters, I always prefer stories that actually end, especially when it's a good story and you don't want to see another writer fuck it up. You know, when a character stays dead. With Civil War, the attempt may not be successful, but why the hell not try to make superheroes relevant to today? To mess with the status quo. I'm surprised at how conservative so many comic readers here are (and I don't mean politically, I mean in the sense of wanting things to stay the way they've always been). And to the poster waaay above there, futurism does usually equal fascism. Look at Marinetti and the Italian futurists. They loved war and fully supported Mussolini.
oisin by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 02:37:28 PM
That's sorta why I like Bendis, to be honest. He likes to shake up the status quo, but he seems to place more of an emphasis on characters than Millar does. Then again, he'd probably write Reed Richards the same way as Millar, so I don't know.
Crohn's disease and Astonishin X-Men by xsi kal	Sep 28th, 2006 02:37:43 PM
..is not all that funny, because it does exist. (I have it) Anyway, I love Joss Whedon, and I'm a long-time X-men reader, but I've found the last couple of story arcs sort of hard to follow. Maybe it's the whole Cassandra angle and the fact that I cannot remember what happened to him/it the first time since that initial arc was brought to us courtesy of Morrison and his halluciongenic drugs? Hard to say. I do like the character moments, but I am increasingly thinking this may be a series I just have to read all at once and see if it clicks better with me. I've enjoyed the Civil War crossover event, but it really hsa killed any desire for me to read (or care) about some of the figures in it (Reed and Tony, for starters). It's also the type of in-your-face storytelling that seems more suited to the Ultimate universe than the existing one.... still, an interesting read, regardless.
Yes and No by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 02:39:32 PM
Of course not, but if A.O. Scott knows he's not going to like a movie -- I doubt he'd review it. Comparing the review staff og the NYTimes against the @$$holes isn't really fair I guess. My bad. I don't know how these guys decide what gets reviewed and who reviews it. Maybe that's something worth discussing. There probably have been movies that A.O. Scott has wanted to rip to shreds but knowing that he's coming at it from a negative point of view he'll let a third stringer take the assignment. None of the main staff there reviewed Jackass 2 and there's probably a good reason for that -- they probably didn't want to see it. Prof. didn't want to read CW #4, so maybe he shouldn't have reviewed it.
not to open another can of worms by oisin5199	Sep 28th, 2006 02:39:32 PM
but here's a quote from Bendis, in reference to his Stan Lee meets Dr. Strange story featuring the Impossible Man, who complains that he doesn't recognize the Marvel universe post-House of M and Civil War: "There was a letter that came my way that said, ’If Stan knew what you were up to he would be sickened.’ But he does know and Joe [Joe Quesada] has said that if you really look at what Stan did while he was Editor In Chief, if he was still Editor In Chief you wouldn’t even recognize the Marvel Universe. He changed stuff so much and so often. In our craziest day, he was more much more ’tear it up and knock it down’ than any of us." Just in case anyone was feeling nostalgic.
whatever by spidercoz	Sep 28th, 2006 02:39:48 PM
Violently wrong even...damn, I hope I didn't kill a schoolyard full of kids. But whatever. Like it, don't like it, I don't care. I like it, I like the story, I like how it's evolving, and I'm really interested to see what happens next, especially because, as keeps being repeated, a lot of the whys have yet to be addressed. Initially I really didn't think much of the idea. I thought it was just yet another in a long series of huge mega-Marvel crossovers, most of which have been irritating at best. Didn't follow HoM, but I turned from X-titles a long time ago for just that reason. Didn't follow Avengers Disassembled, just don't care. And when I first heard about Civil War, I thought great, now they're going to fuck up everything. And I was right. But I'm enjoying how they're fucking it up. Really didn't think it'd turn out like it is. It's a refreshing kick-in-the-nuts to Marvel continuity. It's reminiscent of the 3rd season of Enterprise (shut up, I liked that show), the whole fucking Xindi arc. It started out as heavy-handed, socio-political, "with us or against us" propagandist bullshit, but eventually they came to the realization that both sides were being used and had a common enemy. I see something like that happening here. And to that end I will continue reading 80% of the CW titles, still can't force myself to care about the other 20%. But I do look forward to it ending so I can go back to just getting my 5-6 titles a month. I also look forward to Spidey telling Tony to get stuffed, like he should have when he was asked to join the New Avengers in the first place. I'll say no more on the topic.
This really does make me forget all the House of M... by DOGSOUP	Sep 28th, 2006 02:41:58 PM
...bullshit. I thought the Scarlet Witch making 90% of the worlds mutants was a boardroom decision. "Too many mutants!" "I smell an event!". That's nothing compared to "Sales are down!" "Lets kill some characters and shock everyone by making our silver age heros evil evil fucks!" "I smell an event!" As Bill Hicks said! "SUCK SATANS COCK! SWALLOW THAT BLACK WORM JIZM DOWN YOUR THROAT!" I bet by the end of this there will be some Watcher bullshit that resets everything right like none of it ever happened because Marvel can't continue the regular titles with Reed as a divorced Nazi fuck, either Cap or Iron man being dead (which is the logical conclusion to thier fight), and villans being allowed to run fucking amok on superhero leashes. This is the writing equivilent of the early 90's with poly bagged-multiple variant-chromium-glow in the dark- collecter card included-pop up- edible-hologram covers. Gimmick with no substance to back it up.
Looks like I've kissed your ass Psynapse! by nofate	Sep 28th, 2006 02:55:38 PM
And it tastes like chiclets. Hard, chewy and loses flavor after couple of bites :^O
So how about all those OTHER Reviews? by Squashua	Sep 28th, 2006 02:57:46 PM
Ambush Bug really goes off on Shadowpact #4...
CW by Tito Trinidad	Sep 28th, 2006 03:00:22 PM
I can't really see how this is an "everybody is being used" type of situation seeing as how nobody on Cap's side has cloned or murdered a fellow superhero. I won't buy this crap until they bring the Hulk back so he can start putting his foot in everybody's ass who supports Iron Man. And have Namor send Reed a home video of him slapping his dick upside Sue's forehead. Bet that cat would start acting in character then!
Only worthwhile CW book is Wolverine by George Newman	Sep 28th, 2006 03:02:36 PM
Wolverine has been great and i have previously never really liked reading his solo book.
ULTIMATES maybe a little too violent...? by George Newman	Sep 28th, 2006 03:08:42 PM
I think the Ultimates went a bit too far with issue 12. How can they just kill off an entire rogues gallery? Is the ever going to be a regular ongoing series? How can that be accomplished if they continue to kill the villians?. I don't think Abomination even got to throw a punch in his entire Ult. Universe life. suuuuucks. I just want this story arch to be over. The surprises are over, now it's just being dragged out. Millar probably could have finished the book with this issue if they had just cut out all the pages in which the villains were killed. . . . Bring on Joe Mad! He jaded and scarred me for years, but I think the wounds have healed.
"reviews don't get handed to people with animosity" by The Heathen	Sep 28th, 2006 03:08:46 PM
Yeah, tell that to all the critics who've seen every Uwe Boll film buddy. "Dissing it AS a review? YOU'RE the dumbass, dumbass..." I agree with Psynapse and Prof… and Magneto. He was right.
ULTIMATES maybe a little too violent...? by George Newman	Sep 28th, 2006 03:09:18 PM
I think the Ultimates went a bit too far with issue 12. How can they just kill off an entire rogues gallery? Is the ever going to be a regular ongoing series? How can that be accomplished if they continue to kill the villians?. I don't think Abomination even got to throw a punch in his entire Ult. Universe life. suuuuucks. I just want this story arch to be over. The surprises are over, now it's just being dragged out. Millar probably could have finished the book with this issue if they had just cut out all the pages in which the villains were killed. . . . Bring on Joe Mad! He jaded and scarred me for years, but I think the wounds have healed.
oisin by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 03:11:30 PM
If you'll notice in my post that mentioned Bendis in the first place, changes in and of themselves aren't what annoy me.
I'd pay good money... by Firedrake	Sep 28th, 2006 03:16:08 PM
... to see that Namor/Sue home video.
Psynapse by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 03:21:51 PM
It's hilarious that a few sentences written by a complete stranger that disagrees about some Comic Book reviews has made you so angry. Pretty pathetic when you think about it. But you sure as hell made me laugh, so I think it was worth it! Now back to your mom's basement with you. (can't wait to see if another complete stranger decides to have a tirade over nothing! I really kinda hope someone does.)
holey sheeite by Shigeru	Sep 28th, 2006 03:22:50 PM
civil war. serious business. Al Quesada. lol.
Man... by El Vale	Sep 28th, 2006 03:24:39 PM
Bendis owes Millar a BIG BIG hug.
Do not feed the troll. by Thalya	Sep 28th, 2006 03:28:12 PM
Repeat: do not feed the troll. Move along. Move along, people.
Hellpop by Shigeru	Sep 28th, 2006 03:28:13 PM
for someone who doesn't give a damn you sure do post a lot. nice knowin ya.
my bad, T by Shigeru	Sep 28th, 2006 03:31:02 PM
i phail
Marvel is the comics equivalent of the NationalEnquirer by IndustryKiller!	Sep 28th, 2006 03:31:04 PM
Just one sensationalist bullshit storyline after the next. But Im glad all the intelligent people hate CW. Because if people were getting behind this en masse it would truly be a sign of the apocalypse. And I hate it when people try to play the "You are afraid of change!" card. That's horseshit, change whatever you want, just make it fucking logical and within the parameters of the established character, other wise its not a caharacter cahnge, it's a shocking money making scheme. You wanna break up Reed and Sue Richards? Thats fine, I could see how you could make that very relevant to the curent 60% divorce rate times. Just make it fucking logical, not because Reed Richards randomly wakes up as Doctor Doom one morning. And nothing changes that fact that if the American government decided to implement a registration act Superheroes would politely refuse as a whole and the government would be forced to back down. And Joe Quesada saying that shit about Stan Lee...whatever. Quesada can tell himself whatever he wants to help him sleep at night to keep his mind off the soul he so obviously sold. Remember we are talking about a man so arrogant he designed that laughably awful new Spider Man costume and forced everyone to use it. The sickening thing is people are getting paid to churn out entertainment this fucking horrible. With lowest common denominator writers like Mark Millar at the helm Marvel has become the "Fear Factor" of the comic book world.
xsi kal... by Dave_F	Sep 28th, 2006 03:34:07 PM
...hopefully it goes without saying that I wasn't really meaning to make light of a serious disease. Just a little mockery at Millar's expense, and given his love of practical jokes, I figure it'd probably wash off his back. Or at least provoke nothing more than a Chapelle-style, "I'm rich, bitch!"
Cabin Boy by dan grendel	Sep 28th, 2006 03:37:23 PM
You will have to take my word for it, as another @$$hole. We did indeed discuss it before hand, and NONE of us liked the issue. If you bother to look at what Prof wrote in full, you'll see that he says he was avoiding CIVIL WAR on his own because his "interest is tepid," not because he has a grudge against it. His grudge is against Infinite Crisis. That he chose to read it and review it anyway speaks to his sense of duty as a reviewer, not that he went in with preconceptions. As a matter of fact, he says that his skimming of earlier issues left him with the impression that the "writing was competent." Doesn't sound like hate to me. Sounds like neutrality, which is where you want to be coming from. I think you are reading what you want into this instead of carefully reading it. And yes, Prof's take on CW #4 was the least angry out of all of us.
Shigeru by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 03:40:24 PM
Thayla is right, I only respond when someone addresses me. (Notice how many times I've insulted anyone personally, and how many times ive been personally insulted. . . interesting) Not that it will keep me up at night . . . Why do I post and return? It is hilarious to me! Defending bad writing (it really is) and getting vulgar and angry so fast over nothing! HA!
The Problem With Civil War by Baytor	Sep 28th, 2006 03:41:56 PM
Is really the problem with every Cross-Over Event released since the mid-80s. They're hitting exactly the same notes over and over again with these cross-overs and it's not so much that time is passing us by, it's that someone keeps remaking "My Sharona" over and over again... and sooner or later, you get really tired of it. In defense of Civil War, it's probably got one of the most coherent through-lines of any cross-over event I've read. Not brilliantly written or anything, but it tells its story without requiring me to read a bunch of other books to make sense of why this or that is happening. People complain about the characterization, but it's not as though Mr. Fantastic's reasons are illuminated in some other book... his reasons are pretty much inscrutible to everyone reading the thing. If you accept that, the core Civil War series is telling you everything you need to know about the story. Main thing I can't figure out are the deaths of all the "beloved" characters, most of which who haven't been particularly beloved in two or three decades. Most of the folks I'm seeing getting really excited by Civil War or Infinite Crisis seem to be relatively young fans, people who haven't been hardcore fans 25 years ago, so the selection of notable deaths being folks like Black Goliath and Blue Beetle seems like they're targetting the wrong fanbase... although it might be explained by the Internet. Older fans, who aren't bothering to enjoy the series, bitch about it on message boards, creating controversy... which fuels the appearance that said death is controversial and interesting. But they really aren't doing anything vaguely novel. It was a hell of a lot more hardcore in the mid-80s when characters like The Flash or Supergirl were in the cross-hairs, despite decades of publishing history or movies about them. There's just something so safe about killing Black Goliath... really, who cares about him? Why would anyone who isn't a hardcore comic fan of over 20 years care that Blue Beetle got killed? Or the fake Superboy? It's just the companies going down low enough on the pecking order to find a controverial victim, but not so high up that it actually interfers with the characters with high media profiles.
I'll add (and finish with) by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 03:44:13 PM
I didn't come in to aggrivate, I came in genuinely wondering why people read reviews (critiques, whatever) that are really really badly made, especially when good ones are available a click away. It's like a bunch of bad fan fiction man, really! Maybe it will be better in a year, (or gone) . . . I'll check back then ;)
I LOVE CIVIL WAR by BilboRing	Sep 28th, 2006 03:46:51 PM
I am a huge huge Spidey fan too. Civil War is changing things but it is making it interesting. It is not perfect but I am enjoying the ride. The new Amazing Spider-Man makes CW better.
Re: Hellpop '...I'll check back then ;)" by Darth Kal-El	Sep 28th, 2006 03:51:27 PM
or dont. if you dont like it dont read the column. im glad it doesnt keep you up at night but its good to know its still going to have u checking back in a year. if other columns or boards are only a click away why dont u just click....away.you wont be missed
CIVIL WAR Is Great! by Buzz Maverik	Sep 28th, 2006 03:54:07 PM
Mr. Blue and the Grey each believe their side is right. I say that the death of Harper's Ferry wasn't gratuitous. The American Universe will never be the same. I do have a problem with the sympathetic portrayal of the Massa. That guy was always a louse! To lay all the blame on Overseer was just controversy for controversies sake. I still say the Profiteer is behind it all!
CW Would Be Better If Millar, Quesada&Co Read Comics... by Buzz Maverik	Sep 28th, 2006 03:56:36 PM
...other than the ones they were personally involved in.
lmao @ Al Queseda by moscow3055	Sep 28th, 2006 03:58:42 PM
Funniest damn thing I've read all week...and i read the news reports regarding Terrel Owens...
Pimpin' of the Sea by Tito Trinidad	Sep 28th, 2006 03:59:42 PM
Namor: What's my NAAAME! Sue: NAAMOOOOOAAAAH!! Namor: WHAT? Sue: I mean PRINCE NAMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHGOOOOD!! (Turns invisible) Namor: Ah shit!! Whew! That's a wrap baby!!
Thanks Grendel by The Cabin Boy	Sep 28th, 2006 04:01:03 PM
I guess you're right in that I probably was placing a lot of the IC ranting that was in his review onto CW. And I agree in some respects -- I wouldn't put the writing up to much higher regard, but it is enough to make me a fan of the series. Another thing I think that's going on with me is that I find it hard to judge the series on it's own merits as I haven't actually read it on it's own (which I think I'll do after it's run its course). I've been reading these CWs as they've come along in between all the other crossover issues. And I have read each and every one (thanks to Comicopia and they're fabulous employees working the pull lists). So it's all together in my head -- the good and the not so good -- and so far it has all come out as being a very cool story. But I'll still say I'd like to hear the review from one of yous @$$holes who didn't just skim the previous issues. Anyway, I'm kind of over it. Time has washed most of my nerd rage away. And not to sound too kiss-assey, but thanks for the response and keep up the good work here. You guys and Thor at CHUD are what got me back into comics a few years back.
Hellpop.... by GreatA'Tuin	Sep 28th, 2006 04:02:02 PM
Shut up. I could be more insulting, or go further with the set up, but honestly I'm not really going to bother. Not that it's a waste of my time. I live to make the small realize their insignifigance, but you'll read this, think of a half assed witty comeback, post it and wait for me to respond. So, go ahead. Fire off first. It'll be like giving the kid with athesma (sp?) a head start in gym class. Go on, you can do it. We all believe in you. You just have to believe in yourself.
On another note.... by moscow3055	Sep 28th, 2006 04:06:58 PM
Can't we just summarize the whole problem with the mega-crossover events as being they're designed to make money first...tell a decent story second? Honestly i find it really hard to believe that any product from the big two doesn't involve SERIOUS editorial control (I actually like the note card crack by prof). I mean any event which effects their merchandises "sellability" could cost them major bucks. I blame it on the Success of the Spider-Man and Xmen movies. The comics are just a tangent to where the big bucks are...or I could be terribly wrong of course. Wouldn't it be a kick for the Civil War book to set up the marvel U to match more closely whatever movies they have coming out? BTW...spidey is in the iron man armor post civil-war...i'd bet my dog on it.
AAhhhh it wouldnt be a complete TB without... by DOGSOUP	Sep 28th, 2006 04:23:51 PM
...a lame ass flame war over egos that really don't matter. No really, Civil War sucks the shitsmeared asshole of a dirty crackwhore.
Dave... by xsi kal	Sep 28th, 2006 04:27:55 PM
Yep, I got that. Just wanted to point out it's a crappy disease to have, (though by no means one of the worst). :) Hell, if Millar wants to share his millions with me, I'll be happy to ape Chapelle too! :) ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------------------ ------------------- [I hate not having line breaks] On another note entirely, I was thinking about how Iron Man has become the devil thanks to Civil War, (with Reed Richards as his diabolical evil genius henchman), and found it humorous that Marvel's editorial staff is busy assassinating Iron Man's character when there's a feature film for that character on the horizon. Oops!
Civil War blows by Reelheed	Sep 28th, 2006 04:39:04 PM
As a marvel reader I feel i need to read these books to make sense of wtf is going on in the universe. I dont mind the changes but the whole thing is too compressed. Prof C is right to say that Reed Richards has had his moral core, his very character, flipped 180. But I wouldn't have a problem with that if it really felt that there was any justification for it or even if there was a long enough period of gradual change. The spidey unmasking does feel right but everything else feels utterly wrong. Even down to minor points (cable walks out on cap after 1 battle, the stamford mum pops in give tony props whilst checking out goliaths funeral, the sheer idea of any marvel hero agreeing to clone thor) it urks. Its rushed and its stupid. Hopefully it will all be a house of M style What If? cos they're ripping their own hearts out.
The "divine apocalypse that is my fury" by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 04:58:59 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHA ok, hehe, seriously, I'm out now . . . ha! feel free to come and get me Uwe Boll style anytime Psynapse! hehe too cute.
Die Mark Milliar! by SPECTRE Agent	Sep 28th, 2006 05:40:04 PM
While the term Anti-American is thrown around too often, I can honestly say that he hates the U.S. How he is still working after that "Holocaust" Wolverine issue is something I'll never understand...
Boll by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 05:41:32 PM
Come one man, get the reference! Think hard!
Don't give up! by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 06:05:48 PM
Think of the reference! What did Boll do to the critics who panned him? Think damn it! It's a totally AICN worthy reference!
Civil War BS by Sanctum1972	Sep 28th, 2006 06:13:15 PM
I wanted to agree with the review on it and not only that when Marvel began the seeds for the storyline, I do remember Joe Quesada and some other creator (Bendis or Millar) telling the audience that there is NO mastermind behind the whole thing... When, apparently...the Stamford Incident is Marvel's blatant and transparent attempt to show how clever they are creating their own "9-11" for Superheroes and then say there is no conspiracy when I have to say...BS on their part. The 9-11 conspiracy on other websites is still debated these days. I believe Joe Quesada and his staff LIED. How could a professional Editor in Chief DENY a mastermind involved in the storyline when it's so blatantly obvious that it is an 'Avengers' story..think about it: 1. It involves Captain America and Iron Man 2. Hulk is not on Earth 3. Thor is not around...yet Interesting is'nt it? Are'nt they the original avengers though? Why do I have a hunch that it's a pathetic 'rehash' of the storyline "Acts of Vengeance" mixed in with the "9-11" like situation and the Patriot Act? Is Marvel that dumb that the real Thor would go along with the mortals? If I were Millar, Thor would've arrived with fury and destroy the government in no time flat and telling a god what to do and to register would be extremely insulting to him. Do I think Red Skull is behind this? You bet. Loki? Don't put it past him..I'm sure he had a hand in this, too. I'm sure it's a collaboration of A.I.M. and Hydra, Red Skull and probably Loki..or maybe The Leader (enemy of the Hulk). Too obvious, yes? Someone, a local comic book creator, claimed that he knows for a fact that the Marvel writers and editors plan the 'big' events more than a year in advance. Would you like to know something funny and disgusting? It took them a year or so just to create one cluster*uck of a mini-series. One year to plan this one major screw up on CW #4. How can they plan this for so long with enough time to iron out kinks and let this cliche of a plot be allowed? Is Marvel trying to create a new angle of an 'anti-hero' Dr. Doom by going against Reed? Is CW their way of spinning things around? My recommendation? I think you should post a huge F-U to Marvel on AICN and tell readers why they should'nt read CW anymore because Joe and his staff LIED about the 'mastermind' part, insulting the readers' intelligence. I think they denied this at the Chicago Comic Con (Wizard World)..if I'm not mistaken. But I do remember the denial very vividly. All Joe could've said was "No comment". Simple as that. But he had to go and deny it. Iron Man as a villain? If he hates what he's doing...I greatly suspect he's being blackmailed by someone doing the dirty deed. Ask yourself this...if Marvel wants Spider-Man's identity to go back to private status...will he have to kill "Peter Parker" to fake his death? Change it to Ben Reilly? OR do the magical thing of mind-wiping everyone's memories. Hmmm...what would be the obvious solution to the whole thing if Marvel wants to reverse the whole thing? If I'm not mistaken, does'nt Thor's hammer allow him to travel through time if he spins it fast enough, besides dimensional travel? If he can do that...then travelling through time to kill the Establishment Law by executing certain people OR talking Iron Man out of it would be the way to go. And yet the conspiracy was uncovered by Woverine in his own book but not acknowledged by the CW mini-series. What the hell is going on? So...I pity the fool in the Marvel Universe who crosses paths with Hulk and Thor....maybe Magneto. Am I angry at the way CW is written? Yes, I blame the writers for the juvenile attempts to 'popularize' controversy by touching on '9-11' with pseudo-intellectualism on the issues of the Patriot Act, etc. If Marvel claims to have a plan for the ending, then this screw up of CW #4 proves they're hypocrites and full of $hit. Who is Marvel trying to insult and fool? The older readers or the kids? Do they think we're 14 years old without a brain?
Is Boll That Guy Who Beat Up The Critics? by Buzz Maverik	Sep 28th, 2006 06:39:36 PM
Boxing exhibition at the Toronto film festival. He beat up some guy named Jeff supposedly from AICN, probably under a code name. I know he's German, but that's just Hollywood macho, which is bullshit. Think of Steve Carrell as Michael in THE OFFICE, "that's how we fought in the streets" and you've got Hollywood tough (except that Mr. Carrell knows it's funny and it's a character he's playing). So are you saying that if somebody doesn't like CIVIL WAR that they should be beat up? That doesn't speak too highly in your faith in the quality of CIVIL WAR if somebody has to be forced to like it. It seems like if CIVIL WAR were really all that good, people wouldn't have to have their asses kicked before they wrote good reviews. And that's what this is all about. It has nothing to do with the quality of the writing in the reviews. Prof could have written in the same style but if he'd been pro-CIVIL WAR and pro-Millar, you'd be telling him what a great review it is and how he's such a good writer. You know, it was a filmmaker, not a critic, but John Milius himself who said that every time a director makes a bad movie, he should have a little cut on his face. I'm in the Milius camp, which is why I'd never be stupid enough to stand there and box with anyone. Really, if boxing proves quality and talent, Mike Tyson should be writing CIVIL WAR.
Mike Tyson's releasing a collection of poems next month by Ribbons	Sep 28th, 2006 06:43:59 PM
...it's called "I Wanna Eat Your Children" and features all of the best work from his "Blue" Period. I've already pre-ordered MY copy!
hellpop by Darth Kal-El	Sep 28th, 2006 07:13:20 PM
the thing about it is that even though yes psy and some of the others came out swinging hard it doesnt change the fact that you decided to pop in on a column that you dislike just to say how much you dislike. thats negative troll shit and you know it. now you try to hide behind the whole 'i dont really care, you guys are all basement dwellers thing'. i know for a fact that not a single one of the people who has responded to your negativism is a mouth breathing basement dweller. thats beside the point but i wanted to make it known. you came in and said you didnt understand why people keep reading these reviews since theyre(in your opinion) bad writing or whatever. well alright,duly noted that u think that. is there any other reason your still around? im asking because i like to hang out in this board and talk comics or whatever with people who want to have an intelligent discussion and not treat this board like any other on aicn. if u want to join the discussion please by all means go ahead. if your only here to spout negative comments then leave. we dont want you here.
I can't believe how the energy spent writing about CW by chrth	Sep 28th, 2006 07:22:27 PM
What a waste. Just read Next Wave.
Damn, that should read 'how much' by chrth	Sep 28th, 2006 07:24:04 PM
Pay no attention to the rest of this post. Testing Testing
Nextwave Theme song!!! by DOGSOUP	Sep 28th, 2006 07:24:23 PM
http://tinyurl.com/fxed5 "Just pick up the phone and call! - - NEXTWAVE! Wooawoaah"
DOGSOUP! YOU RULE! by chrth	Sep 28th, 2006 07:31:14 PM
Captain! His Name is the Captain!
Wow, this is still going on. by Hellpop	Sep 28th, 2006 07:42:57 PM
Heh. Awesome. . . . Well, nothing else to do right now . . . . 1.) I came here hoping the reviews wouldn't suck. See, i hadn't bothered reading them for quite a while. So my objective wasn't to come be a "troll" and be overtly negative. Thing is, I read a bunch of really bad reviews (badly written that is) and I'm sure I wasn't the only one to say s

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