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Atreides Gnaws On YOUNG HANNNIBAL!!

first! by JediShaft	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:24:00 AM

Not First! by TheMinorityVote	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:29:00 AM
Yay!
Obsession with the mask? by TheDarkShape	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:30:29 AM
Huh? Did I miss the point in Silence of the Lambs, Hannibal, or Red Dragon where Lecter shows some kind of affinity towards the security mask?
"Shades of Episode I" by chrth	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:30:35 AM
That's never a good sign.
Anyhoo... by TheMinorityVote	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:31:10 AM
...sounds interesting (I avoided the spoilers as much as I could though), just fix the damn title. It sounds a dvd featurette.
sounds interesting by THE KNIGHT	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:41:01 AM
Indeed
OBSESSION WITH THE MASK?! by Dannychico	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:41:17 AM
I agree with the above poster. I thought that was always a security measure enforced because of his penchant for using his mouth as a weapon.
Not as good as Manhunter? by thatpeterguy	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:42:57 AM
That movie was a mess. And when you see Brian Cox's performance next to Hopkins it is an embarrassment to Cox. Also, that sounds brutal how he trains with a sword and everything. Why don't they just have him run up those steps in Philly like Rocky did.
Feb 2007? Hott Fuzz is going to kick Hannibal's arse.. by Charlie & Tex	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:42:58 AM
...to the moon and back!
This sounds pretty crappy by Avenger534	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:51:05 AM

Sounds absolutely awful by judderman	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:52:57 AM

To quote noted_sage Dino De Laurentiis by seppukudkurosawa	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:54:58 AM
Just buy a the damn tickets, eh? Damn putzes! I can almost visualise the phony Freudian imagery now...I know what, lets show how Lecter developed a taste for Chianti by having the nasty Soviets always drinking wine in front of starving mini-Lecter and never sharing. I think the faux-Euro-arthouse setting will probably make this worse. I'm not saying all high-minded horror films are terrible, but this all reeks to me of a plot pulled out of Dino's wrinkly Italian ass.
Behind The Mask by topdeckshandy	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:55:04 AM
They're probably stuck with that shonky title, as "Behind The Mask" is the title of the Harris book that's coming out this year. Presumably the movie script has been worked from the galley proofs of the novel. It'll be interesting to see how the book and movie differ. As for my two cents' worth, surely "Before The Mask" mighht have been better, though I agree that there's never been a hint in previous movies or Lecter books that Lecter had a personal thing for face furniture. Mind you, the book of "Hannibal" had Lecter and Starling going off into the sunset together hand-in-hand, so anything's possible. Let's hope they've got a story to tell, rather than just sucking a few more drops of money milk from the saggy tit of a once-decent franchise.
deep breath by Turd Furgeson	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:56:09 AM
Im speachless........ How does something like this get made?????? I just don't get it.... Direct to DVD when they find out how bad it is after the final cut is done......
How do we make Hannibal sympathetic? by Batutta	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:04:33 PM
We have him hunt Nazis!!!...This is ridiculous...What's frightening about Hannibal is that he's so intelligent, what he does seems like a conscious choice, not a compulsion the way it is with most serial killers. Now that's scary. They're going to take all the mystery away from this character until he's as scary as an Abbott and Costello movie.
Coming Soon. Hannibal: 80 years young and still cookin by ZeroCorpse	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:11:41 PM
When will it end? Will we get to see a nice movie about Hannibal killing and eating all the tough old people in his nursing home? Will we be given a Hannibal movie about his days in the merchant marines? How about a nice one called "Hannibal Goes Shopping"? How many Hannibal movies do we NEED, anyway? "Hannibal and the Kid" could be a nice piece about Hannibal adopting a street urchin, and then teaching her to eat people, and then killing and eating her. "Hannibal's New Grove" or maybe "How Hannibal Got His Groove Back" (a two-parter) would be great. Hey, let's just drop down to massive stupidity and start numbering the Hannibal movies. "Hannibal IV: Hannibal Eats Sigfreid & Roy While Penn & Teller Cheer Him On." Would be a sure-fire hit.
You have to be kidding me. by Nate Champion	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:11:51 PM
That wacky Hannibal Lecter... he ate all those people because of THE NAZIS!!!! Yes, now it all makes sense. Now that I know this, I feel much better about the whole story! Jesus christ, De Laurentiis must have had his brain eaten a long time ago to cook up this bullshit. The reason Hannibal Lecter was such a fascinating character in Silence of the Lambs was because WE BARELY KNEW ANYTHING ABOUT HIM!!!!! You've probably heard of it... being MYSTERIOUS or something like that... apparently it's a rare and interesting phenomenon.
Hannibal's New Groove by ZeroCorpse	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:12:31 PM
Although "grove" could work, too.
All Star Hannibal & Robin (age 12) the Boy Wonder by ZeroCorpse	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:17:07 PM
"Hannibal VI: What, Are You Dense? Are You Retarded Or Something? Who The Hell Do You Think I Am? I'm Goddamned Hannibal!" ---- "Hannibal VII: The Really Long Car Ride"
Hannibal IV: The Voyage Home by Avenger534	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:18:24 PM
Save the whales... eat the whalers.
Cast and title... by topdeckshandy	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:22:01 PM
Why not just cast Rob Schneider in "Hannibal Bigalow: Cannibal Gigolo" and have done with it...
You god damned morons. by asleeplessmind	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:28:15 PM
You morons, Hannibal becoming a cannibal because of Nazis is nothing new, it was in the Hannibal book you boneheaded idiots. Hannibal always ate people he found to be disgusting anyway so this isn't some new prequel only thing to get you to sympathize with him.
Bizarre by MaryTylerMorbid	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:30:11 PM

I'm surprised they didn't do that X3 digital "de-aging&# by Osmosis Jones	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:31:45 PM
on Hopkins and had him playing Lecter as a teen.
asleeplessmind by chrth	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:32:30 PM
The novel Hannibal was a piece of shit too.
The Kannibal Kid by Mgmax	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:35:38 PM
"Skin on... skin off."
Hold on...I can't...stop laughing....HAHAHAHAHAHA by Doctor_Sin	Jun 3rd, 2006 12:37:25 PM
So, we now have to jump SEVERAL sharks and turn a minor character not only into a major one, but retrofit the serial-killer as misunderstood/misguided anti-hero? Hohohohohohohohoho!!!! AND Nazis. !!!!!!!!!! AND Samurai swords!!!!!!! Will Hatori Hanzo play a role???? The only thing this is missing is Frozen Undead Nazi Zombies. "Young Hannibal"??? If they wanted to do up a believable serial-killer's childhood, it would be full of abuse, violence, molestation, and mistreatment with plenty of buried psychoses regarding sexual identity. Then that Clownhouse/Powder guy could direct it. But THIS piece of CRAP! Ahhh - it has DeLaurentis fingerprints all over it.
sounds like a roaring rampage of revenge. by irc-Hollywood	Jun 3rd, 2006 01:03:59 PM
i can't wait for a kick ass revenge movie, bring it on!
Silence o't' Lambs is not overrated...it's over play by future help	Jun 3rd, 2006 01:20:17 PM
great movie...it's just that it's played too much on the television. and yes, this new movie sounds like shit. who needs another Nazi flic anyways? (unless thay are Warewolf Nazi's w/ machine guns!
Oh my god by Grendel745	Jun 3rd, 2006 01:24:25 PM
Anyone remember when Hannibal was scary and evil? This sounds almost like it was written by some kids with time to kill and an addiction to Mad Libs. Nazis? Samurai Swords?? WTF??
TITLE............MASK OF HANNIBAL by TheAnomalist	Jun 3rd, 2006 01:33:07 PM
HOW ABOUT "MASK OF HANNIBAL" ? THAT WOULD BE SOMEWHAT COOL RIGHT? "BEHIND THE MASK" SOUNDS LIKE A VH1 SPECIAL. OVERALL HIS ORIGIN DOESNT SOUND VERY INTERESTING. THE CHARACTER WAS TOO INTERESTING TO BE SADDLED INTO SOME LIMP-DICKED REVENGE PLOT- HE DESERVED BETTER. I THINK IT WOULD BE WILD TO GET BRIAN COX TO PLAY HANNIBAL AGAIN IN THE EPILOGUE. MAKE IT SO!
Silence is definitely NOT overrated! by Captain Katanga	Jun 3rd, 2006 01:51:40 PM
They didnt give it the top 5 Oscars for a laugh. And, at the risk of being beaten to a pulp by you lot... I think Manhunter is overrated. Good film, but I just think it has become fashionable to declare it better than Silence just because Michael Mann is so respected these days. I love him too, but he has turned out some average films, especially 20 years ago.
wait, he went from art house movies staring Johansen... by s0nicdeathmonkey	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:04:31 PM
a feburary released 5 sequel?
WTF? This sounds like a Uwe Boll film! by zillabeast	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:07:35 PM
Nazis? Samurais? LMAO this is just too much!
But is Hannibal part of a balance breakfast? by Wolfpack	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:08:28 PM

I hated the movie hannibal by emeraldboy	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:10:41 PM
The first hour of that movie, was good il admit, stylish and italy looked great, then after he guts pozi, the movie descended into a horrible bloodbath and not a very good one either and that whole scene with the brain was unwatchable. over all i found the movie to be one of the most disgusting things i have ever scene. it didnt not deserve it 15 cert in ireland.
I hated the movie hannibal by emeraldboy	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:12:42 PM
The first hour of that movie, was good il admit, stylish and italy looked great, then after he guts pozi, the movie descended into a horrible bloodbath and not a very good one either and that whole scene with the brain was unwatchable. over all i found the movie to be one of the most disgusting things i have ever scene. it didnt not deserve it 15 cert in ireland.
wow, Achilles' brother on AICN... by thebearovingian	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:29:03 PM
what's up, cuz? When'd you get out of uncle Atreus' doghouse for long enough to watch this crap?
hell of a long title by satansteve	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:33:45 PM
I mean "Young Hannibal: Behind the Mask at the Edgewater Multiplex in Edgewater, New Jersey"!? That movie will fail! Perhaps I read it wrong?
Hannibal IV? by crackerfarmboy	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:37:55 PM
Yeah they needed to make this piece of crap...
They Fucked It All Up By Turning Him Into An Anti Hero. by flamingrunt	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:42:45 PM
By now only having him kill those Who deserved it, Instead of the psychotic monster we met in silence who would bite off the tongue of a nurse for no reason, now we have a guy who just kills because hes being hunted or for revenge or because theyre rude. Hes almost a passive psycho, dont do anything wrong to him and he wont do anything wrong to you. By doing this they destroyed the whole reason why he was so scary in the first place. In That there was no reason or motive for why he kills or eats people. He could torture you to death for no other reason than because he wanted to.
Hannibal X: Paint-Sniffing Clowns Attack! by Doctor_Sin	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:54:10 PM

They fucked up Hannibal and Davinci code by... by maximusdecimus	Jun 3rd, 2006 02:57:37 PM
... sticking so rigidly to the novels. Hannibal was just Harris rambling on about his holiday to Florance. Is there actually a book coinciding with this one, anybody know? Delaurentis seems to be tearing the arse out of this whole thing a bit.
personally... by chiahead	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:11:22 PM
I think the mistake they made was thinking that Hannibal as a character wasn't already sympathetic. One of the reasons I liked Lambs and Dragon (didn't see Hannibal or Manhunter) was that despite him clearly being a sick fuck, I totally sympathized with him. Likeability does not always equal "good". Alan Rickman's Sheriff of Nottingham is probably a good example of a character people enjoy but do not LIKE...
So they left out the parts where... by Kid Z	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:13:14 PM
... Hannibal is trained by Kung Fu master Pai Mei (Inspired by the old sensei's favorite meal of fish head stew, Hannibal learns the best way to prepare living human brains) and the showdown at the House of the Blue Leaves (Hannibal dons a bright yellow sweatsuit and shows off his mastery of the exquisite art of the Samurai sword... picking up useful tips on the art of sushi preparation and removing the top of a human head, the better to get at those delicious brains...) Yeesh!
I think the studio entirely missed the point by Kiki Bridges	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:27:38 PM
One, Hannibal is not a good guy. He's an evil mentor that has answers the good guy needs. To get his expertise you need to let him into your life. Evil ensues. Two, the security mask keeps him from eating your face off. He has no love for it. The mask became the film's symbol for Hannibal, not Hannibal's symbol for himself. Reading this synopsis, I have no idea who anyone would enjoy watching in this movie. Seriously. The Young Hitler comparison is apt. Would you feel sorry for one instant seeing Tiny Adolf in a sticky situation. I'd stick him in a bag and throw him in the river.
don't you know who I am? by Cedar_Room	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:30:23 PM
I'm Hannibal Lector nazi bitch
Fine Young Hannibal by Big Bad Clone	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:37:45 PM
Eating people drives me crazy hoo ha hoo like nothing else hoo ha hoo it drives me crazy and I just can't help myself
What did Harry's nephew think of the movie?? by Barry Egan	Jun 3rd, 2006 03:52:00 PM

It's Been A While, But... by CHEWBLACCA	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:01:26 PM
...that's not how I remember Hannibal's origin in Thomas Harris' book. Eh, who cares? I won't go see it, anyway.
Clearly.. by DrLektor	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:08:13 PM
The majority of people here haven't read the Hannibal book. Yes it goes off on an arty kick in Florence but as well as the brutality of Lector it also shows WHY he does it. And you do feel sympathy. The death of his sister is handled superbly, as is his reaction. Her being devoured has played on his mind for decades and it's slowly (no pun intended) eating him inside. It's fucking him up and he's making mistakes. It takes Clarice to bring him to order. The most controversial aspect of the book wasn't the Nazis (why is that so weird anyway? He was born in Lithuania in the 1930's, you're going to ignore the war now?) It was the ending with Starling actually joining him. Apparently the fans hated that so much he changed it for the movie. Now that
if all else fails, have some nazi villains by reckni	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:26:47 PM
Silence was awesome, Hannibal was as bad as the book (actually, the book might be worse), and Red Dragon was unnecessary after the great Manhunter. Love Gong Li, possibly one of my all-time favorites, but c'mon, seriously, why make this movie. Swords??
It would be great if Young Hannibal met Young Einstein by GrandMuffTarkin	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:38:40 PM
Yahoo Serious causes a chemistry explosion, Hannibal prepares Cock Au Vin. Hilarity ensues....
I've always pictured his childhood as Von Tropp-like by durhay	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:45:39 PM
goooood niiiiiiiight!. They should CG Anthony Hopkin's head onto a little boy's body, like that Nike commercial . "Shut your fava bean eatin'head up!"
Did the writer of the books have anything to do with by fiester	Jun 3rd, 2006 04:49:22 PM
this movie?
"Hannibal" the book was fucking great... by BurnHollywood	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:02:55 PM
...If the "fans" hated it, it's because they were sitting there mouths agape like baby birds waiting for the bullshit cliche ending and got an utterly unexpected twist instead. Lightweights. What a shame that the great Ridley Scott had to film that watered-down mess. At least Florence looked pretty...
I Actually Thought Hannibal Was Really Good by Warren Oates	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:09:26 PM
Vastly different from 'Silence,' but I enjoyed its Grand Guignol, operatic tone more than the realistic air of the 'Silence.'
This is nonsense. by godhatesyou	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:12:05 PM
A Samurai Hanibal Lector. Wearing a mask and eating Nazis!
Too soon! by Manatee	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:20:41 PM
I'm still recovering from WWII. This is very insensitive.
The February release is the giveaway. by Orbots Commander	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:32:26 PM
Right away you can place a bet that YOUNG HANNIBAL is a turd. In fact, you can watch a crapfest double feature in February with this flick and GHOST RIDER, back to back. Almost everyone knows that September and February are when studios dump all their junk movies.
Yes Harris DID write this.... by football	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:37:33 PM
... to answer your Q&A, fiester. The book is apparently 480 pages long and is due out on Oct 1st. I'll probably enjoy the book more than the film as I have done with all the others so far. I still think Tom Noonan's Dolarhyde is the creepiest killer i've seen to date and even beats hopkin's oscar winning turn... i think this is the real reason why so many like manhunter over the remake... go figure...
Hannibal's suckage (the book) in a numbered list by chrth	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:44:01 PM
1) Harris is a lousy writer. A lot of his stylistic choices (switching into 2nd person for no goddamned reason, for example) were tolerable in SotL because the story was so good you kind of ignored it and moved on. Hannibal doesn't have that luxury. 2) The point of Hannibal is that he's supposed to be the biggest badass. Trying to create a character more evil than him is just stupid. It reminds me of the shitty SW EU books where they're constantly trying to one-up the movies by creating stupidity like Sunkillers and shit. It's like the writers don't get that they're diminishing the original sources by doing so. 3) I honestly don't care about Clarice joining him at the end of the book, but that could be because I was so disgusted with the book that I had stopped caring. 4) Hannibal Lector is a lot less interesting a character when he's loose than when he's imprisoned. 5) What the fuck was up with the scene on the airplane? What kid whines to get a total stranger's dinner?!? 6) The only good thing about Hannibal: it inspired Scott Tenorman must die.
Apparently...... by godhatesyou	Jun 3rd, 2006 05:46:07 PM
Hannibal wasn't forced to wear his mask in the 'Silence of the Lambs' movie. He got it from a Nazi soldier he killed and smuggled it into his cell up his ass, and the guards were so frightened of him that they wouldn't take it away.
the most fucked up thing about hannibal... by jig98	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:03:46 PM
...was gary oldman.
chrth, scott tenorman must die RIPPED OFF hannibal... by jig98	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:11:20 PM
it was a complete tedious copy of it. besides, it was not the best episode ever, because it was an absolute waste of time. cartman wanted to get revenge on scott tenorman because of the whole bullshit with the pubes. that whole thing was done ten times better in "dazed and confused". and cartman got his revenge by involving radiohead {worst band ever}, chilli and chopping up scott's parents. dull. couldv'e been done a lot more compellingly.
I needed Hannibal to... by thebearovingian	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:14:37 PM
help me find my wallet. And my keys. Long story short, I found my wallet and keys. But the guy's a freak. He wanted me to turn around, arch my back, look towards him and act like a dragon. With his mask on. Ugghhh
Does Inspector Popiel try to capture Hannibal by... by Heywood Jablowme	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:20:25 PM
selling him a set of fancy steak knives to cut people up with? Here's the pitch: And with that you get not only get the food dehydrator and the 25 pc. stainless steel gourmet steak knives but I'll throw in at NO ADDITIONAL CHARGE this state of the art rotisserie cooker, great for slow roasting breasts, thighs, or any vital organs for only $19.95!!! Seriously though, that rotisserie cooker looks fucking awesome at 3 AM after getting home from the bar.
More of the same, but... by DanielKurland	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:35:06 PM
Yes, exactly, the mask is a pop culture reference to Hannibal, it's not his symbol. If he was a superhero, it wouldn't project in the sky like the Bat Signal. The very fact that they may be implying he saw this mask as a child, and that's why it shows up later is ridiculous. It is purely precautionary. And the illogical nature of this inclusion will simply illicit a few "Cools" from the audience, if that. Also, yes, some of the elements of the plot of this film were touched on in the novel of Hannibal, and a novel of this is also being done, which will probably end up being decent. And I agree, Dolarhyde was a FANTASTIC character, the backstory on him with his mom was very Norman Bates-esque, and made me feel genuinely sorry for him.
Magneto and Hannibal by Vynson	Jun 3rd, 2006 06:35:55 PM
We should have young Magneto dealing with the nazis next year too. If young Hannibal leaves him any leftovers. As a side note, we should remember that in the books, Hannibal has an extra finger on each hand. A rare case of polydactyly... perhaps a recessive gene. Perhaps a... mutation?
This sounds as much fun as being kicked in the balls... by Alonzo Mosely	Jun 3rd, 2006 07:20:41 PM
Seriously, Samarai Hannibal vs the wannabe Nazis of doom. Is this a Troma release? Manhunter was a fun 80s movie. Silence was an excellent horror-thriller. The other entries have been shit. This sounds like a rejected Van Damme revenge script rewritten for the 'Hannibal Franchise'...
magneto vs hannibal by Darth_Baltar	Jun 3rd, 2006 07:52:39 PM
love the comparisons Vynson! If only Anthony Hopkins had manifested a slight trace of telekinetic ability in one of the first three films, then we could start up the twilight zone music. hmmmm, may in the tenth sequel we could do a hannibal versus magneto film, only to find the real reason mags wears that helmet is that hanny the canny sautee'd some of his brains first in a forshawdowing of what would become of clarice's protagonist in the third book...
Red Dragon was a boring crapfest by Marduk	Jun 3rd, 2006 07:54:39 PM
Ralph Fiennes. Boo. See my scary slideshow. Zzzzz.
Indiana Jones and the Mask of the Cannibal Nazi Hunter by Doctor_Sin	Jun 3rd, 2006 08:22:58 PM
I didn't even bother with the book Hannibal due to what some of my friends told me about how ridiculous it was. I value their literary opinions.
Just call it "Hannibal the Cannibal." by Christopher3	Jun 3rd, 2006 08:28:23 PM
Red Dragon was a lot better than the second one, but Ralph Fiennes was seriously miscast. Every time other characters kept saying "He's huge/big/muscular" etc. I cracked up.
I can't wait... by UncleEthan	Jun 3rd, 2006 08:33:31 PM
For a movie about an embittered Iraqi 20 something who comes to America to slaughter the men who butchered his family for kicks then returned to their bullshit redneck lives without being sent to prison forever.
Americans... by UncleEthan	Jun 3rd, 2006 08:35:23 PM
The new Nazis. By the way..."Hannible" by Thomas Harris is basically an over the top parody of his earlier work. Like Harris saying to the readers....you want the sick fuck to be the hero...here he is assholes.
Whatever happened to Macaulay Culkin playing Hannibal? by WeirdEd	Jun 3rd, 2006 08:51:11 PM
http://nitti.aintitcool.com/di splay.cgi?id=15963
They're giving us what we want... by darth kubrick	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:05:20 PM

MORE STORIES by darth kubrick	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:07:14 PM
At least they're not waiting 20 years between movies like some other franchises we know. And BTW- Dino is dead. Must have been an ancestor.
Teen Hannibal Lecter: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha by kabong	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:36:59 PM
Movies are crap. I haven't seen District 13 yet. Maybe that will be worth the film on which it is printed.
How about Old Hannibal: 80 and still holdin'... by whereAMeye	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:37:01 PM
A severed tounge! Aieeeee!!!!
Hannibal Two... by occula	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:37:49 PM
Electric Boogaloo! C'mon, guys, dontcha know it? It's the one where Hannibal has to save the local YMCA by putting together a ragtag gang of local breakdancers who show the mean developer and his hot, but rude daughter what community spirit is all about. and then he skull-fucks them all and makes sausage out of their intestines.
Re: Orbots Commander by theBigE	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:45:01 PM
Uhh, Silence of the Lambs and Hannibal both were released in February, weren't they? Kind of blows your theory that only junk gets dumped there - I think they're just sticking with a proven date. Also I believe there is some stipulation regarding the book's release date as well that may affect the movie's date.
Know who I am? by Doc_Strange	Jun 3rd, 2006 09:51:23 PM
I'm the Hannibal, bitch.
UncleEthan by Playhouse	Jun 3rd, 2006 10:05:03 PM
Whoa, whoa. Hold up. What kind of bullshit is Americans... The New Nazis? You better back the fucking truck up on that one.
UncleEthan...did you ever see the 70s film by Doctor_Sin	Jun 3rd, 2006 10:22:28 PM
"Search and Destroy"? It's a pretty crappy (but enjoyable) b-movie with the EXACT plot you mentioned, only set in post-Vietnam America. Now THAT is a film they need to remake - they could do it all post-Iraq and full of wicked sadism and revenge.
Uncle Ethan is a fucking idiot. by Heywood Jablowme	Jun 3rd, 2006 10:28:25 PM
Yep, you read that one right. Granted, we might not have the best rep right now, but Nazis? You're fucking tossed. Take your stupid ass to North Korea and hang out there for a couple of years (if you don't die of starvation first). And back to the subject, since this is "young Hannibal" is this getting marketed to the Gen Y crowd? Finally, a Hannibal Lecter movie for MY generation (insert bending guitar riff here). Complete with a soundtrack featuring Fall Out Boy, The Strokes, and Nickelback, YES!! Hannibal on an early version of the snowboard, perhaps? Costuming, courtesy of Hot Topic? You mean I have to wait until February, dang. I want to see this now.
I will... by UncleEthan	Jun 3rd, 2006 10:30:06 PM
I will be checking that flick out, Doc...as for you Playhouse...take a look at the pictures of blood splattered on the wallsof Hadifa...listen to the words of the children who lost there whole family because some knucklehead Marines watched too many godddamn movies and then back that truck up. We are the bad guys here, Hoss. Make no mistake. If you feel good about what has happened in the last six years then you might have a serious disconnect between your mouth, your brain, and your fuckin' heart.
Blow guy.... by UncleEthan	Jun 3rd, 2006 10:51:56 PM
With a handle like the one you sport in here can you really toss out dispersions on someone elses intelligence...seriously. Jablowme? Is that clever where you come from. You don't think the things being done in ourname are absolutely, unequivocibly evil? You, hoss, need the ethics classes.
Didn't realize you were there, sorry Unc by Heywood Jablowme	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:17:39 PM
Tell you what dipshit, how 'bout we let the investigation play itself out, we come back here and revisit this in a couple of months. From what it looks like right now it's a big "we say, they say" type of deal. God willing it's not My Lai in Iraq. Maybe it will be, but I'll wait for the evidence to play itself out. But one thing I do know is that the soldiers in Iraq are not there to systematically eradicate the inhabitants like you say when you compare them to Nazis. Come on man, don't be that prick. I don't like the war, I think it's a big fat lie that was carried out on a platter of bullshit covered in patriot sauce, but don't call Americans Nazis. I wouldn't even call Bush a Nazi. Ignorant. Arrogant. Deluded. Misinformed (at best). But certainly not a Nazi. Go talk to a soldier who's been there. Listen to their story, then call them a Nazi to their face. If you have the balls to do that then you're a callous fuck and I hope they bitch-slap you. Now quit being a hard-on; and start bad-mouthing this incredibly bad idea for a movie. Come on, it's an easy target and it's fun.
Hannibal has a penchant for Hulk Hogan! by Dannychico	Jun 3rd, 2006 11:17:53 PM
Too soon, I am George the 7th Chicken, and Brandon Routh can't act!
WAIT! How did I miss this shitty plot point???? by Doctor_Sin	Jun 4th, 2006 12:04:28 AM
Hannibal's dad is killed in an aerial firefight/dogfight/whatever by a Nazi plane. Said plane is shot down and crashes...KILLING HANNIBAL'S MOM??? Holy fucking jesus h. christ on a popsicle stick with a side order of fries. This summary has got to be fake. Has to be. No fucking way. This ranks up there with the now-legendary "Gordon has a beer and cheets on his wife" Batman script review. Someone wake me up from this nightmare!
Gordon has a beer and cheets on his wife by Dannychico	Jun 4th, 2006 12:10:21 AM
with Hulk Hogan.
Hulk hogan has an obsession with the mask by Dannychico	Jun 4th, 2006 12:10:38 AM

Okay, Hoss... by Playhouse	Jun 4th, 2006 12:21:07 AM
Don't dare condemn a whole country for the actions of a few idiots. I ain't gonna say we've done some reputable things in the past few years. God knows that's the truth. But don't you dare equate me, my family, my friends and the 99.99% rest of the citizens of this country to Nazis again. If you count yourself among those fucking idiots, then go be guilty and leave the bashing of America out of it. The rest of us don't appreciate it.
Too soon! by Tall_Boy	Jun 4th, 2006 12:49:47 AM
Seriously, there isn't even a book out. Nor will there.
Manhunter was good... by darwinmayflower	Jun 4th, 2006 01:43:47 AM
Red Dragon was uninspired shite. Being close to the material in the book, does not a good movie make. this new attampt at a movie sounds even worse than Ed Norton's bad dye job.
dino says by Spacesheik	Jun 4th, 2006 03:27:27 AM
"You comma see hannibol feelm okay? iz good feelm, you weel lika - dis like fellini with za actione horrore! Ees like my olda filma 'bout the big cochinos - de trocks MAXIMUM OVERDRIVE but wiz terrore, terrore! you weel likes i know dis, like FIRESTARTER but wis ze Lituanian bad villanos and Hannibol he go for revenge, you know..you will like dis."
remember when he licked the steering wheel by jinx_malone	Jun 4th, 2006 04:29:54 AM
in hannibal and he had on this really unflattering wife beater and i was thinking 'aw, come on, don't make anthony hopkins lick a steering wheel and be looking all old and fatted up.' that was the scariest part of hannibal for me.
"Then by godoffireinhell	Jun 4th, 2006 04:52:06 AM
This made me laugh. I'll probably rent this garbage. Oh, and while the eating of his kid sister was indeed in the HANNIBAL novel I hated it there as well. It was shocking, sure, but it also demystified the character and made him a lot less interesting.
Re: Too soon! by godoffireinhell	Jun 4th, 2006 04:56:51 AM
Search for BEHIND THE MASK by Thomas Harris. There is a book and it will be published around the time the film comes out because Harris is now apparently a total Hollywood whore.
I agree - "Behind The Mask" is a dumb title for this. by DarthCorleone	Jun 4th, 2006 05:46:16 AM
Granted, I didn't read this review, because I wanted to avoid spoilers. As mentioned above, he didn't even wear the mask that much. They only stuck it on him when they were transporting him. I guess in this case "mask" could be a metaphor hinting at some deep psychological depths in Hannibal's character, but - while Hannibal is a deep character - he never struck me as a guy who wasn't anything but honest when it came to the bottom line. Yes, he lied at times, but the motive never had nuance to it. It was simple fuck-you malice. Any other portrayal has the potential of diminishing the prior films.
Hannibal was awesome in Silence of the Lambs by CuervoJones	Jun 4th, 2006 05:53:59 AM
But in "Hannibel" he became a clown
Bruce Campbell should play young Hannibal... by Edward_nygma	Jun 4th, 2006 05:54:01 AM
...he can so do this part.
If I must clarify... by UncleEthan	Jun 4th, 2006 07:56:53 AM
I think that George Bush, Dick Cheney, Tony Blair and Donald Rumsfeld should be sent to the Haugue for war crimes. What I meant by new Nazis was not that that actually hold with the ethos of National Socialism...but that Americans and American soldiers in these conflicts are going to be the new go to villians...much like Nazis in films. I don't hold that American soldiers commiting these acts are actual Nazis. They are simply the by product of a training system and home front mentality that justifies and reenforces their cruelty as acceptable and "patriotic". It's not like Bush and his cronnies have sent the best and brightest to kill over there. They have sent whatever they could get.
Thanks Tom by UncleEthan	Jun 4th, 2006 07:58:51 AM
For the shout out on the screen name. You are theonly person who I've ever noticed that got the reference.
We will bash any war criminal nation-state by kabong	Jun 4th, 2006 09:54:37 AM
we want to bash. It's still a free country, and it will be more free when the war criminal regime running it has been brought to justice.
Teen Hannibal Too! by pokadoo	Jun 4th, 2006 10:06:51 AM
"Give. Me. A Keg. of. Fine Chianti!"
How about calling it "Fat Hannibal"? by mattw	Jun 4th, 2006 10:25:06 AM
It could star that lard ass Bryce Dallas Howard.
Pokadoo by Dannychico	Jun 4th, 2006 10:40:49 AM
That was hilarious. Except I believe you're quoting the original teen wolf, not teen wolf too.
kabong by CuervoJones	Jun 4th, 2006 10:48:08 AM
Take the red pill, man.
Hackmeister Dino Delaurentiis.... by bigdickmcgee	Jun 4th, 2006 11:35:00 AM
Is renouned for not understanding the source material. While I love the guy, and he's made some of my favorite (cheesy) movies (Conan, Breakdown, Flash Gordon, Dune), most of his movies are uber-hacky. The guy just doesn't get it. He turned Hannibal Lector in a serial killer version of Spiderman. He's now your friendly neighborhood serial killer - he only kills "bad" people. The guy above who said that totally diminishes his evil is totally right. In silence, he ate a nurse's tongue, slaughtered two guards, bit one guy's face off, carved off the other guy's face, killed a tourist. He's EVIL. That's why he's scary. He'll kill anyone just on a whim, like any crackpot cannibal. Except he's a billion times smarter than Dahmer. "Explaining" his evil and turning the whole thing into Death Wish takes the Hannibal mythos and douses it with a thick stream of urine. It's like showing Freddy Krueger's bad childhood.
In Silence... by bigdickmcgee	Jun 4th, 2006 11:36:23 AM
He also killed the ambulance crew. I guess they were rude.
Why not "The First Course"? by Big Bad Clone	Jun 4th, 2006 11:40:25 AM
or even Hannibal: The First Course. Makes more sense than Behind the Mask as the mask was only a small element forced on him and he wore it for all of five minutes onscreen.
I'm the Hannibal, bitch... by 'Cholera's Ghost	Jun 4th, 2006 12:23:45 PM
I'm gonna kill 'im, I'm gonna eat 'im, then I'm gonna eat his fucking costume. I'ma eat ya with a side of your own PIMP. Oh, and I pretty much agree with bigdick.
Even Lecter needs a MONTAGE!!! by 1908LOL	Jun 4th, 2006 12:26:08 PM
With every shot show a little improvement. To show it all would take too long!!!
Who's playing Hannibal??? No name cast=flop by R.C. the "Wise"	Jun 4th, 2006 12:32:05 PM

Hmmmmmm by flossygomez	Jun 4th, 2006 01:08:54 PM
Monster & Cannibal: The Far Side of the World? I will stupidly go see this because I am so much of an "Avid fan", but I just don't like the idea of Hannibal explained. I much prefer him as a monstrous anomaly and mystery. Kinda like the Force was before it was dissected on an operating table and the midichlorians were found.
Atreides' review is fake, methinks by Vynson	Jun 4th, 2006 01:15:52 PM
This "review" is horseshit. IMDB has a few tidbits about the movie including the fact that Hannibal's parents are eaten by a soldier. The airplane crashing into the mother bit (which sounds amazingly stupid) doesn't happen.
Hannibal: How do I look? Nazi #2: Slammin'! by durhay	Jun 4th, 2006 01:43:21 PM

UncleEthan, what country you from? by StrangeCo	Jun 4th, 2006 02:04:21 PM
Seeing as how you see fit to pre-judge an alleged incident, a seemingly isolated one at that, I assume that you're from a country that didn't send its best and brightest to Iraq so from what nation do you hale? Also, it's certainly not a nation that "supports the troops just not the mission," so speak up. What are you from?
UncleEthan, you're an "American"?!!?!?!? by StrangeCo	Jun 4th, 2006 02:23:35 PM
'Cause that seems to be what you imply when you say things like "done in our name?" Here's the thing, twit: don't dare criticize American troops for not being the "best and brightest" when you, sitting in your mom's basement, jacking off and eating Cheetos while typing on a talkback, can't even spell "H-A-N-N-I-B-A-L" (not "Hannible") or "T-H-E-I-R" (not "there") or "H-A-G-U-E" (not "Haugue") correctly and your mistakes aren't alleged to have occured in the heat of battle (unless you consider trying to "choke that chicken" a "battle royale). Trying using the internet for some actual research into how to actually spell things before spouting ridiculous sophistry like "Americans are the new Nazis" and that the troops aren't our "best and brightest." While I'm on that topic, if YOU with your amazing incite ("the new Nazis") and spelling ability ("Haugue") represent America's "best and brightest," GOD help the United States of America.
Unreadable by The_Deathticle	Jun 4th, 2006 02:26:48 PM
I am going to officially throw my hat into the ring with all those talkbackers who have suggested that Harry bring aboard a real editor for this site. Their only job would be to translate these articles into standard, readable English. That tortured assemblage of words up there passing for a film review actually makes Harry's stuff look like Hemingway by comparison. I tried to diagram one of Atreides's sentences and almost broke my collarbone. That's how bad it is.
UncleEthan, where is Haditha? by StrangeCo	Jun 4th, 2006 02:41:07 PM
Deep in the Sunni triangle, that's where. You do remember the Sunnis, don't you? They're the ones who peopled the Republican Guard and Saddam's military elite and who slaughtered the Shi'ites and Kurds and who have fought the American military every step of the way. They're also the same ones who just "dragged passengers off a bus northeast of Baghdad and killed 21 people, including a dozen high school students," but spared the four Sunni riders. So, yes, let's "listen to the words of the children who lost there (IT'S "T-H-E-I-R," MORON!) whole family" as relayed to us by al-Jazeera (the font of truth and non-partisanship in the world) and condemn all of America and all American troops as Nazis because that's what the best and brightest would do. No way that this could be anything but the Americans fault completely because the Sunnis, every last one of them, has backed America and its occupiers since the start. No way that this could be a set-up or a frame-up or propaganda. No way. Not coming from the Sunnis and al-Jazeera. No way. It must be the evil Americans. Sunnis don't play like that. (BTW, ever notice how Iraq is too dangerous to travel in when insurgent terrorists are blowing shit up and killing folks, but, the second an American "atrocity" may have occured, the world press would crawl over broken glass to get there?) UncleEthan, you're a fucking stereotypical joke!
I'd have rather seen a sequal to Hannibal by DOGSOUP	Jun 4th, 2006 02:42:45 PM
But I guess we have to wait for the guy to write it.....
UncleEthan, you being one of the "best and brightest" by StrangeCo	Jun 4th, 2006 02:50:28 PM
Can surely tell us more about Haditha, right? Like its population of 90,000, only 150 of whom voted in the recent elections. 60 percent (at least) turnout in the rest of the country, but the Sunni insurgent stronghold of Haditha, who loves and supports our military and who are only innocent bystanders when troops roll through could on, could only manage less than 1 percent? I'll bet the real tragedy is that the "Nazis" who make up our military managed to kill the exact 150 who voted in the election and support our military, huh, UncleFucker?
Regarding Behind the Mask (finally) by StrangeCo	Jun 4th, 2006 03:07:08 PM
There's a fine line between exploring the villain's history and making him an anti-hero. Me, I like my villains evil. Explain some stuff but don't make the guy sympathetic. I don't like to sympathize with villains. Take vampires, for instance - evil, bloodsucking monsters NOT tragic, effeminate cocksucking monsters. Dracula was, to paraphrase QT, a mean, motherfuckin' servant of Satan. Period. No romance with Mina Harker and no romance with Jonathan Harker. Just the baddest damned vamp on the planet. Unfortunately, Anthony Hopkins's performance in Silence served to create a "monster" that all the kids could semi- root for in the theaters. This has now inspired two books essentially from HIS point of view (like Interview and Vampire Lestat) - Hannibal and now Behind the Mask. Blech! Like I said, I like to understand my villain's motivation (and Hannibal IS a villain) not sympathize with it. I'll read the book (I've read all the rest), I'll see the movie, but, to me, this Hannibal will exist in another parallel dimension - where effeminate vampires blow each other and lament their tragic existences.
Strange Incite? by Vynson	Jun 4th, 2006 04:33:52 PM
When does the villain ever know they are the villain? When does anyone ever acknowledge that they are doing "evil?" No, we all have more depth than that one-dimensional "I'm just a badass villain" mindset. We all think we are the protagonist and that our actions are right under the circumstances. If you have not observed this much about human nature, strangeco, then you have observed poorly... which might explain why you think "insight" is "incite."
BigE, SOTL was released in the Fall; it was Oscar bait. by Orbots Commander	Jun 4th, 2006 04:52:07 PM

uhhh.... no. by Drunken Rage	Jun 4th, 2006 05:27:50 PM
"Manhunter" is a terrific stand-alone movie which looks bad only in terms of "SoL" getting all the Oscar play. Brian Cox as HL is much spookier because he's much less over-the-top than Anthony Hopkins. He eats the set like he's a rat after home-made cheese. "SoL" is good, just a radically different movie than "Manhunter." "Hannibal" is a shitty book and the movie, surprisingly, is much better. Terrific cinematography, terrific music/sound. Still a shitty movie, though. And I don't give a shit about another movie in this series-- it just reeks of "let's make us some money. Yee-haw!"
Strangeco... by UncleEthan	Jun 4th, 2006 06:20:42 PM
In any sort of debate, even one on the old ass box here, I make it a rule never to attack the individualwith an opinion...just the opinion. You, hoss, are defending the undefendable...seriously. There are atrocities on both sides. Sure. Doesn't make any of them right. How would you feel if we just jumped into Sudan right now. Perhaps we should attack the pesky Saudis. Amnesty International list them as one of the worlds worst offenders...and they don't even have real elections. Oh I forgot. They are holding the money. Paying the right people. So we only attack the people who don't provide our present ruling family with loads of cash. Got ya. I was confused there for a minute and thought you were positioning the United States as the beacon of liberty and justice in the world instead of thugs to the highest bidders. This current war and the current American regimes attempt at global hegemony is a complex issue that really doesn't read well here. No room for annotations or supporting evidence. As for your attempt at wit..."UncleFucker". Really. You seem like a reasonably bright guy. You must have better material than that. Attacking semantics, spelling, and all that jazz...not so good. Sloppy typing and sloppy thinking do not necessarily go together. By the way. I DO actually fuck my Uncle. Seriously. What an asshole that old guy has. Tighter than my nieces....she's seven but she's already getting loose.
Ok, so Hannibal is an anti-hero now by Undead Neverhood	Jun 4th, 2006 06:29:20 PM
Ok I think its safe to say this Hannibal crap has run its course and then some.
Dannychico by pokadoo	Jun 4th, 2006 06:48:14 PM
Thanks man. Yeah, it's definatly from the first one, but i thought it would be funnier that way, since we're talking about crappy, unnecesarry sequels.
Oh Gong, my Gong... by Be like water	Jun 4th, 2006 08:08:36 PM
The only thing that is remotely interesting to me about this movie is the fact that Gong Li is in it. Who looks that good at 40?? I will see anything she's in... Almost. But maybe not this.
Good job guys on uncle ethan.. by whereAMeye	Jun 4th, 2006 11:03:44 PM
or whatever the fuck his name is. Good use of FACTS to prove a point. Yeah, we need to get the hell out of Iraq but we need to finish what we started. I'm against war in general however I don't sit here and bash my country just because of a few asshole soldiers. The media is a joke...that whole abu garib fiasco was because the people in charge were'nt real soldiers but something like national guard reservists....in other words, not professional. A real marine would'nt let that shit happen on their watch however because it's the MILITARY in some capacity the whole fucking media starts pinching helmet and getting excited. I used to hate bill o'reilly with a passion untill I began watching the guy and watching Fox news. I began to look into the internet and read other forms of news beyond the mass media. The bias is real. I would be a total snob and sadly mis-guided if I did'nt believe that there is such a thing as a bad soldier. These guys involved in Haditha will be tried and court marshalled and have their lives ruined not because we want to "save face" or look good to the world...no, we do it because it's the humane and RIGHT thing to do. Think a terrorist or some radical muslim group has to answer to a higher power and take responsibility for their actions? No way in hell. As pointed out above, the media is never over there to showcase the dozens of new schools or facilities or the plight of the iraqi people. The iraqis are not americans.....does that not give them the right to live on their own terms? To decide their own destiny? America has always been called upon to help...we fucked up with the search for WMDs because of a certain pecking order and bad info and intel. Now, the course has been set...we have to go the distance and ensure that some dictator (let's not forget how many families were slaughtered under the rule of saddam....tell that to a liberal. I've read accounts of his rule that still bother me to this day, like about how a family was tortured by saddams secret police and their childs eye plucked out in front of the family....did saddam hold THOSE men accountable? Uncle ethan......did he? Please tell us because I really really want to know) does'nt rise to power again and begin the vicious cycle. Remember, after WWII after the fall of hitler there were suicide bombers and extremists that plagued germany for years....ah, but I guess since that was before anyone was born under the age of 30 it does'nt mean shit. BUT, knowing who wins the coyote ugly contest on shitTV is important. I guess people like uncle ethan are too angry and mind controlled because of the taste of freedom that sickens their stomachs. I call it un- american and downright sociopathic to blame america for EVERYTHING that happens around the world and expect things to happen in a jiffy. Call it ignorance and part of our present day culture of fast food and blackberrys on our sides. History takes time. The past is forever no matter what you think of it. The future is what you make of it. Destiny can be your friend or your worst enemy. Now it's up to america AND Britan and Iraq and other world powers to end this once and for all.
This sounds absolutely Boring!! by MentallyMariah	Jun 5th, 2006 04:17:12 AM
Sitting through this sounds painful...why did they make this again?
Young Lecter: The Legend of Longpig by brycemonkey	Jun 5th, 2006 08:47:49 AM
I've got a bad feeling about this... I'll have the other, other white meat!
UncleEthan, I'M defending the undefendable by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 09:31:49 AM
I'm not defending shit except proper spelling in English and the American soldier from ad hoc stereotyping. While "there are atrocities on both sides," I don't seem to remember your criticizing the other side's atrocities. Nope, just those "Nazi" Americans who aren't the "best and brightest." If neither side is right, hoss, how come you only criticize and attack one of them with pejorative names and sarcastic comments, hmmmm? How would I feel if we just jumped into Sudan right now? WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH CALLING AMERICAN SOLDIERS NAZI IDIOTS?!?!?!? Perhaps we should attack the pesky Saudis, you say. Maybe so, but, again WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH CALLING AMERICAN SOLDIERS NAZI IDIOTS?!?!?!? You are a typical talking points-fed moron. The fact of the matter is, genius, that, like it or not, we ARE in IRAQ, not Sudan, not Saudi Arabia. Your stereotypical invectives were aimed at American soldiers in a particular situation - IRAQ. The precise location of the situation you use to broadly paint America and its soldiers as Nazis was what was purported to have happened in Haditha. As such, I pointed out that the poor folk who you seem to believe, taking their statements as gospel and using them to indict both a nation and its soldiers, are by no means friends of the U.S. or its military. They just might (and what the fuck happened to innocent until PROVEN guilty, jackass) be lying or mistaken. Of course, you've already stereotyped ALL American soldiers and most Americans so the verdicts already in within the dark and twisted thing you call a mind. You betray your moronic sympathies with your ridiculous "Amnesty International vs. the U.S.'s 'ruling family'" argument. It's a tired and silly point that has NOTHING to do with Haditha and your attack on American soldiers. Having no defense and no logic, you choose to TRY to change the subject with some bullshit about Saudi Arabia and the Sudan. What's really humorous though is that like the rest of the ticks that you represent you'd fucking have an embolism if the U.S. actually did what you suggest and attack the Sudan or Saudi Arabia. You try to point out hypocritical positions yet common sense and history prove that the hypocrisy is yours. Your "side" said the same shit ("can't be the world's policeman") during Afghanistan prior to the Iraq invasion. What are we going to do, your cohorts asked, invade the whole Middle East as an "argument" against invading Afghanistan - the liberal "quagmire," at the time. Screamed like ass-raped little biatches when we did what you suggested, didn't you? Here's another one I loved: during the 1990s, you libs loved to defend Clinton (even when HE was dropping bombs on innocent civilians in Iraq) and claimed that no evidence existence to support the many claims that Republicans or conservatives lobbed at him. Where's the proof, you said. When Linda Tripp provided it by taping Lewinsky, you attacked the messenger. Remember that? How the defenders of women's rights attacked the "hideous and fat" Linda Tripp because she provided the evidence against ol' Bill. I'll never forget that "consistent position." That having been said, what the fuck is all this "United States as the beacon of liberty and justice in the world instead of thugs to the highest bidders" bullshit. I didn't defend the U.S. as the beacon of liberty and justice (although me and about 15 million illegal Mexicans might be glad to). Again you try to defend your stupidity by assigning some argument to me that I never made, jakass. All this, however, is beside the point. YOU called American soldiers simple-minded Nazis based on spurious claims by a group of Sunni Arabs (you know, Saddam's boys) in a town that's controlled by insurgent terrorists. You never questioned the claims. You simply used them to malign some hard-working soldiers who defend your right to be a fucking jackhole. Regarding your non-defense of your inability to spell, let me just say this: you called American soldiers "Nazis" and implied that they weren't the "best and brightest" while your intelligent ass sits thousands of miles away misspelling words while within easy reach of a dictionary or, hell, dictionary.com. See, I've no problem with spelling errors. Typos occur. I've just got a problem with using your stereotyping methods to paint whole groups of people with the same brush while attacking that same group's collective intelligence when you can't even fucking spell, nitwit. Pot-smoker, don't call the fucking Ketel-drinker black! THAT'S HYPOCRISY! Nice buzzwords ("this current war,""American regime," and "global hegemony") and funny who this is "a complex issue that really doesn't read well here" when you're the one who brought it up. But you're right. Calling hard-working American soldiers simple-minded Nazis doesn't "read well here." In fact, as far as most are concerned, it doesn't "read well" anywhere. So go back to your Mother Jones talkback where it might "read well." Odd, that I've got plenty of room for "annotations" and "supporting evidence" when I post, but you don't. Must just be a quirk in the system. I've got love for the way this war was fought and I've even less for Bushy, but, by God, I'll not listen to some half-wit attack the American soldier's honor and get away with it.
Oops by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 09:36:55 AM
That's "I've got NO love for the way this war was fought and I've even less for Bushy." See, I make typos, too! That's "NO love for the way this was fought."
Well said, whereAMeye by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 09:40:50 AM
Very well said. Ain't it amazing how the first Bush was criticized during the Clinton administration for "not finishing the job with Saddam" (i.e., killing him) every single time that President Clinton had to deal with that madman yet, when Clinton's successor goes in to "finish the job," he, too, is criticized. Hypocrisy, thy name is liberal! At least in America.
Lemme rephrase that by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 09:41:27 AM
Hypocrisy, thy name is politician! There. That's better.
I have to see it to believe it! by jaxnnux	Jun 5th, 2006 09:52:50 AM
No way would someone make this film. No. Fucking. Way.
Vynson, my error (on the typo) by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 09:59:04 AM
But what the hell does whether or not the villain knows that he's the villain have ANYTHING to do with the fine line between providing motivation and providing sympathy or identification and whether that's acceptable in the genre we're discussing? We all may "have more depth than that one-dimensional 'I'm just a badass villain' mindset," but "we all" aren't the villains in movies. Again, does the concept of the fine line between providing motivation and creating too much sympathy not getting through to you? Especially when it concerns cannibals (Hannibal) who sic serial killers (the Tooth Fairy) on the families of those stopped him (Will Graham) from murdering offensive musicians (the flutist in Red Dragon, I believe). Fewer typographic errors in this response, so are you following me now? I don't believe that cannibalistic serial killers who kill musicians for playing wrong notes, eat them, and then sic other serial killers on the families of the FBI agents who caught them should be made so sympathetic in the viewer or reader's mind as to become anti-heroes. Motivation (why a villain does something - the reason) is different from identification and sympathy. Clear? While "we all" may perceive ourselves to be the protagonist in our own little dramas and writers should remember this when writing the villain's character and providing motivation for him, there is a vast difference in seeing his or her point of view and sympathizing with it to the point of rooting said villain on. Comprendez vous? Human nature is useful to observe and draw upon when creating and writing characters. The facts of life dictate, however, that some humans do evil things for evil reasons. To try to create sympathy and identification with them and their actions is heinous and not something that I enjoy. I believe that sometimes the monster (especially the bloodsucking or cannibalistic ones) should be the monster (not the anti-hero), even if I know the monster's motivation. DO YOU UNDERSTAND NOW OR DID I MISTYPE AGAIN?
To put it another way, Vynson by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 10:05:01 AM
Does a racist KKK serial killer who's wiping out black Americans or Hispanic Americans deserve to be the anti-hero simply by providing the motivation that he "hates minorities?" Woo hoo! Kill 'em, crazy KKK serial killer dude! We know you're only doing this cause a minority killed yo daddy and mammy and et yo sister! Kill them, minorities! Ridiculous? Yes. As ridiculous as implying that it's okay for a cannibalistic serial killer to be the anti-hero because we all "have more depth than that one-dimensional 'I'm just a badass villain' mindset."
Vynson incite by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 10:14:44 AM
I get it now. It took me a moment (I'm not as bright as you American soldier bashers) to realize that you took "incite" from my post to UncleEthan and used it to criticize my position on turning monsters into anti-heroes. You betray yourself, especially when one considers that you didn't even really bother to read the post that you seemingly argued against (the monsters into anti-heroes one). It seems that you took more issue with my response to UncleEthan (since that's where you drew 'incite' from), but chose instead to argue a non-point in another post, that is, whether monsters see themselves as monsters. You, sir, are unmasked. If you have a problem with my defending U.S. soldiers against scrurrilous charges of "Nazism" and "stupidity" then please speak up. Otherwise, don't bother lecturing me on whether or not monsters are people, too.
A few things: by Childe Roland	Jun 5th, 2006 10:30:50 AM
First, "Hannibal" was a middle aged author's literary equivalent of a mid-life crisis, complete with sexual wish fulfillment. Somewhere along the line...probably after Silence racked up all those well-deserved oscars...Harris started identifying more with the character of Hannibal than with any of his protagonists. So he turned Hannibal into this almost super hero type (although, in the movie, I think Hopkins plays him more as a bloodthirsty Bugs Bunny). The first half of the book, in Europe, is exceptionally well written (especially for Harris, who hadn't demonstrated such a gift for description and characterization in his previous works) and the movie actually follows suit. But both fall apart after Hannibal's kidnapping. The funniest thing about the story is the pigs, which are built up for much of the film as these unstoppable engines of evil and destruction. When they're finally released, they eat like one guy and then spend a few pages sniffing around Hannibal's ankles (because he somehow communes with them psychically or something). Anyway, the ending of the book was transparent and completely disrespectful to Clarice's character from Lambs. The movie ended slightly better, but having Clarice's character make more sense showed how very little sense Hannibal made by the end. Next, Cox's Lecktor was much closer to the way he was portrayed in the (first) book. Sorry, but it's true. I would've loved to have seen Cox's take on Lecktor in Silence (not in Hannibal, which was written with Hopkins in mind, I'm sure) because I think it would've been a scarier film. Silence (the film) was an excellent love story, and Hopkins was the perfect actor to play the part (beefed up as it was for the film from the book) that way, but to say Hopkins' portrayal was better or truer than Cox's is simply inaccurate. Different takes ont he source material (Cox - closer to the book in a film that was farther away, Hopkins - a very different, over the top interpretation of the character in a movie more faithful to the source but clearly spun for the romance angle). On the mask thing, Hannibal did pull off Pembry's face in Silence and used it as a mask, so he does have at least some predeliction for them. But I agree, trying to tie the security mask to some infatuation of his is just reaching and lame. Not quite as lame as the whole Iraq thing that got dragged up and flogged in here for no good reason, though. The stupid shit going on in that part of the world has little or nothing to do with the stupid shit going on in this movie.
Childe Roland, well said about the whole Iraq shit by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 11:01:04 AM
I must, however, disagree with your assertion that Harris "started identifying more with the character of Hannibal than with any of his protagonists" after all those Oscars. My understanding of the genesis of the novel "Hannibal" is that it was spawned by Harris's disdain for audience reaction to Hannibal in Silence. He was said to have been dismayed, even outraged, that fan clubs for Hannibal were springing up and some audience members were actually rooting for the serial killer that Harris claimed to despise. Disgusted, he was said to have decided to give audiences exactly what he thought they wanted as a sort of "fuck you" to these fans of the killer. It seems to me that in writing the story, Harris may have crossed the line between providing motivation and becoming sympathetic, even empathetic, to his own monster. As Alanis might say, isn't it ironic? I think that it had less to do with Oscar and more to do with hubris.
Regarding Thomas Harris's mid-life crisis by StrangeCo	Jun 5th, 2006 11:07:40 AM
Unless Harris is going to live to be 118 (Hannibal was published in 1999 when Harris was 59 years old), it's kind of hard to chalk it up to mid-life crisis/sexual wish fulfillment. MAYBE Silence (Harris was 49), but probably not Hannibal. I see it more as the "fuck you" that I read it was at the time it was published and I prefer to chalk Harris's continued fascination with the subject up to hubris, falling for the same sin that he despised - love of Hannibal.
Interesting reading, StrangeCo. by Childe Roland	Jun 5th, 2006 12:24:23 PM
I hadn't been aware of Harris' stated motives for writing Hannibal (suspecting that the love of money was probably chief among them, despite whatever he might've inferred artistically), and while the irony of his falling into the same pattern of behavior as those he claimed to revile is amusing to entertain, I doubt that's what happened. More likely, he got to the part (in the book) where the pigs are finally let loose and just couldn't hink of how to end it, so he effectively nuetered them as a threat and decided to indulge a little associative affectation. My calling it a mid-life crisis wasn't meant to be interpreted literally, as many people (particularly in this day and age where families are started later and people are living longer) have their little comings to terms with the concepts of lost vitality and impending mortality well into their fifties. I don't think anyone can argue against the notion, based on the way those last chapters were written, that Harris was living vicariously through Hannibal, bedding his own (arguably) most popular female protagonist (and Hannibal's former protege) in an act of literary masturbation that really creeps me out more the more I think about it. I'd be curious to know if Harris has ever taught fiction writing and, if so, whether he's been known to diddle his students. Or perhaps he's had something unrequited for a much younger editor or publicist (since this older man/younger woman thhing has been such a recurring theme in his works). Of course, I'm just basing all of this on my experiences of his written works.
Strange plothole... by General_Mortimer	Jun 6th, 2006 01:32:04 AM
Ok, you're starving and you break into a house. You see a 10 year old kid and a baby. Which looks more appetising? Honestly, this sounds so stupid. Mmmm, let's eat a baby, a lot more meat on that! Like a big Turkey!
Hannibal - The Samurai Years?! by Cat_Corporation	Jun 6th, 2006 11:43:39 AM
Gimme a break. What shameless bandwagon jumpery. Sounds like absolute steamin' shite on a plate - avoiddddddddddd!!!
I agree w/ warren oates, HANNIBAL was good by gernblanston67	Jun 6th, 2006 12:36:19 PM
Very stylish, and just enjoyable to watch. I'm a big Silence fan, but Ridley Scott did wonders with crap source material.
Interesting point of view, Childe Roland by StrangeCo	Jun 6th, 2006 05:52:15 PM

Uh, supposed to be some writing in there by StrangeCo	Jun 6th, 2006 05:54:06 PM
I can definitely see where you'd come to those conclusions, especially when I skimmed the ending of Hannibal (read the book 7 years ago) again last night. Ugh! My research doesn't show that Harris taught anywhere. Reporter for the AP then editor then writer.
Ah-ha! That pretty much clinches it, then... by Childe Roland	Jun 6th, 2006 06:16:16 PM
...StrangeCo. I never cared enough about Harris as an author to check into his background (or even read his bio), or I would've seen the journalism connection. Having been a journalist myself, I can attest to the time-honored tradition in newsrooms, where older, more seasoned male reporters and editors mentor and subsequently (or, often, simultaneously) bang the ever-loving-fuck out of many a fresh young female reporter out to cut her literary teeth. While I never took on the editorial mantle, I myself carried on illicit affairs with two such wide-eyed lasses while serving as the senior staff writer at one daily. They were so eager to learn the tricks of the trade...and I was too tired/lazy to go out and meet girls in bars like a normal guy in his late 20s. Good times, good times.
Eh...I'll take a look when by Clio	Nov 10th, 2006 04:52:43 PM
Eh...I'll take a look when it comes out, but it's not something I'll be eagerly awaiting.

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