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Here's a sneak peek at that extra BATMAN BEGINS footage to air today (Wed.) during Smallville!

Batman is cool bu Variety reports Kelsey Grammar as the Beast!!! by ChorleyFM	May 18th, 2005 07:04:06 AM
He has the voice, and he is a big guy. Come on someone post this.
First. by Jluca96	May 18th, 2005 07:07:28 AM
Post.Ever.
Guess Beast will be all CGI then.... by Aust1n	May 18th, 2005 07:18:33 AM
X3 couldn't look worse at this point.
For those who have QT7 goto to this URL by rkbentley	May 18th, 2005 07:23:35 AM
http://raincloud.warnerbros.co m/wbmovies/batmanbegins/teaser _clip/teaser_clip_hi.mov
To Quote South Park/Team America by John-Locke	May 18th, 2005 07:39:10 AM
The hours approaching, just give it your best You got to reach your prime. That
Actually I really liked this clip by John-Locke	May 18th, 2005 07:44:30 AM
It's lack of music stopped it from becoming South Park/Team America parody but it was close. There haven't been enough Ninjas in movies since the 80's with those awful but slightly entertaining American Ninja films starring Michael Dudikoff. Bring on the Batman Ninjas.
Kelsey Grammar as BEAST? by TodayzSpecial	May 18th, 2005 07:57:47 AM
What a load of horse poop! Terrible casting. http://www.darkhorizons.com/ne ws05/050518h.php
Liam Neeson, the new Connery? by CuervoJones	May 18th, 2005 07:58:41 AM
In the last years he is playing all those "master" characters.
I thought all these Kelsey Grammar as Beast posts I've been seei by John-Locke	May 18th, 2005 08:03:34 AM
Nope, they actually have cast Sideshow Bob as the great Blue and Hairy one. His voice is pretty perfect but I don't like it. X3 doesn't need comic relief and thats what this sounds like to me.
Interesting by abcdefz1	May 18th, 2005 08:09:50 AM
It does look like a standard montage in a lot of ways, but there is something interesting: clearly, it picks up the "haunted man" theme Nolan is very good at. The way this is cut almost makes it look as though Bruce is haunted by even his training. If it's at the same place as it is in the script, it's a present tense scene, so... I just like the psychology of it. This is a guy who clearly can't let go and move on.
Grammar by Jubba	May 18th, 2005 08:10:52 AM
He's a hairy man to begin with, maybe they will just paint him blue. The only hairier comedian they could have chosen would be Robin Williams and let's be glad they didn't.
reminds me of when the first cast keaton as batman by Mr Cairo	May 18th, 2005 08:11:00 AM
we were all up in arms and look how well that turned out , dont write of kelsey grammar yet he might be good.
Oh Man it's true i just checked Variety website Kelsey Grammar i by DANZIGG	May 18th, 2005 08:26:17 AM
C'mon Harry put it on the website
Bring it on... by RowanM	May 18th, 2005 08:28:11 AM
You know....I'll go take a look at ROTS, but Batman Begins.....This is what I'm looking forward to.
The Kelsey Grammar casting is fine. He is a good, obviously int by Barry Egan	May 18th, 2005 09:15:47 AM
I am curious why he would do the role, which should require tons of time in uncomfortable makeup. After 11 years doing Frasier, he can't possibly need the money.
Grammar... by Jubba	May 18th, 2005 09:31:54 AM
to Barry Egan: He might actually enjoy acting or maybe he enjoys comics. Just because he has money doesn't mean he should retire from the biz. There may be enough CG to limit the makeup/prosthetics so that it's bearable...though I remember that John Rys-Davies (sp?) was allergic to the prosthetics he wore for the whole time they were filming him as Gimli for Lord of the Rings. Some people are just devoted to their work I suppose.
Re: Barry Egan "After 11 years doing Frasier, he can't possibly by John-Locke	May 18th, 2005 09:39:22 AM
It's fricking huge, I'm talking William Randolph Hearst/Charles Foster Kane/Xanadu/Micheal Jackson/Neverland Size Huge. A property that size would need a constant suply of cash to keep it warm and clean. You can never have too much money I suppose.
Threadjack!!! by John-Locke	May 18th, 2005 09:42:39 AM
Please give us a Kelsey Grammar X3 TB Guys? wadda you say uh? me no lika havin to threadjack cos that Batman clip ruled.
Who cares about effin' Kelsey Grammer casting?! Did you not see by Jon_Snow	May 18th, 2005 09:46:03 AM

Does Grammar still have a coke problem? by rev_skarekroe	May 18th, 2005 09:51:36 AM
Maybe he DOES need the money.
Psyched about Begins by Sci_Fi_Wasabe	May 18th, 2005 09:52:41 AM
I'll be playing along with my Ninja Bruce Wayne action figure in the theater! Actually, I am liking a lot of what I'm seeing from the previews and such, but still wish the suit looked less like what came before. And based on the trailers, who doesn't know Bruce is Batman? Obviously Morgan Freeman'a character will since he's providing the bat equipment (wasn't Fox an account or something in the books). Ducard will, Al Ghul probably will (at least he does in the comics). And regarding Kelsey Grammer, the guy has a terrific voice and hopefully they won't go comic with it (although situational humor would be ok...ala Wolverine's comic moments). Alan Cumming is known as a comic actor and did pretty well as nightcrawler. CG Beast or stunt double in suit with Kelsey's voice (can't see Frasier as nimble gymnast-boy, furry or not).
Agreed.. by Gym	May 18th, 2005 09:57:00 AM
Like Sci_Fi_Wasabe said, i reckon they'll do a hellboy on it and just do his voice, and have a different actor in the suit. So who should be the physical presence, then?
Just saw ROTS last night... hopefully Batman Begins can wash thi by so sorry	May 18th, 2005 10:00:52 AM
what an aweful, aweful movie. Please God let BBegins be good. I can't take another let down like that...
I stand by my guarded optimism... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 10:24:01 AM
...concerning Batman Begins. If they can tell the story it seems they're trying to tell without getting too bogged down by the romance element and keep the suit mostly in shadow, it could be quite good. KG as the Beast (the KGBeast, get it? A Batman segue!) could also turn out very well. Humor is an intrinsic part of that character, and it's very much the same kind of humor that the Frasier character elicited on Cheers (goofy looking guy uses intellectualism to inflate himself and compensate for self-esteem issues amongst folks who largely don't get him... so they laugh at him and he laughs at them, but he's crying on the inside). If they handle the visual aspects of it well, he could "own" the role.
Quicktime 7 by Titus05	May 18th, 2005 10:45:44 AM
when the hell is Quicktime 7 gonna be released for Windows already??...Quicktime 7 sounds awesome and they need to stop hoarding it for Mac users...if they want mainstream acceptance of that new video codec then they must release it for Windows ASAP...I want to be able to view those high def trailers on the Quicktime site
Way to threadjack, guys. by I Dunno	May 18th, 2005 10:47:37 AM
Jebus, with the Kelsey Grammar shiat already. And of course the obligatory jab at Star Wars, no TB on any subject would be complete without that. I agree about the romance thing. I know it's unheard of but I'd prefer it if for once there wasn't a romantic interest in one of these movies. You know she's just going to get kidnapped at the end.
this clips shows how seriously they took this movie by bostonjh	May 18th, 2005 10:48:31 AM
The problem with the Keaton Batman, and pretty much any Batman, is the exact opposite problem of most comic movies. With Superman it's easy to make you believe he's Superman 'cause they can show him flying or lifting cars and such. With Batman you pretty much just have to accept that a guy can put on a suit, buy a bunch of toys, and be a terror to the criminal element. And even that's not so threatening when he's basically just beating up muggers most of the time. But this one is actually going to show you HOW and WHY he's intimidating by making you understand how he hides, what his weapons are, and why you should be scared shitless he might be there even if you can't see him. It's gonna rock.
liam better than Connery by OriginalThinker	May 18th, 2005 10:53:09 AM
Look at all the films he has done, plus the training sequence looks awesome, nolan will do this film justice. I will start counting the days for this one right after I see star wars tonight and tomorrow.
Kelsey Grammar could do really good. by DOGSOUP	May 18th, 2005 10:54:02 AM
C'mon people, Beast would ALWAYS throw out the comedic bits when the shit was getting heavy for the team. Haven't you people been reading the comics? Even when Genosha was wiped clean by Cassandra Nova he still made gallow's humor to keep everyone sane. Don't write him off just because you can't see Frasier being Beast-imagine a transformation ala Mystique or Nightcrawler and just as blue.
Beastly Grammer. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 10:54:08 AM
Like this idea. But wouldn't the actor need to be a little more young and athletic?
The Beast is going to flip his viper in a ditch. by HypeEndsHere	May 18th, 2005 10:58:02 AM
that is all.
Joaquin Phoenix? Angus McFadden? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 10:59:20 AM
Mandy Patankin? Oliver Platt? Vincent D'onofrio? Viggo Mortenson? John Lithgo? Jake Webber? William Fichner? Kelsey just seems a little old but I love the fact it's not some pretty boy.
I hope this means that the Beast will do a lot of coke and hang by FluffyUnbound	May 18th, 2005 11:01:43 AM
That would be an X3 I could get behind.
I Dunno, my "obligatory jab at sw" was on topic... by so sorry	May 18th, 2005 11:09:11 AM
in that I hope and pray that BB (topic) is better than ROTS. Sorry if i didn't expand. and believe me, after you see ROtS, you'll be jabbing too...
What I'd like to see ... by DennisMM	May 18th, 2005 11:15:53 AM
Is a Beast similar to the recent portrayal of the character. He's humorous but mostly studious, academic and a bit fussy. Plus, that cat face, the glasses and the three big fingers on each hand would be wicked cool!
Three fingered? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 11:23:08 AM
I thought that was Nightcrawler? But yes. Definately needs to be the recent cat/bear version in order to distinguish him from Kurt Wagner. Wouldn't surprise me if they changed his colour too. Orange?
what you're likely to get is Kelsey as a normal guy for 10 minut by HypeEndsHere	May 18th, 2005 11:23:34 AM
then the accident and a CGI furry blue Beast voiced by Grammer. similar to Abe Sapien in Hellboy voiced by Frasier's brother.
BATMAN by ClarkK82	May 18th, 2005 11:37:16 AM
BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN BATMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!! NOT KELSEY GRAMAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WAIT FOR YOR OWN TALK BACK!!! I mean its interesting news, but dowsn anyone remember how pissed off the OC talkbackers would get when the WB fans overran their talk backs. Plus, didn't anyone see the clip, this movie looks awesome, lets talk about THAT.
and by dowsn I mean doesn't by ClarkK82	May 18th, 2005 11:38:04 AM

Maybe they could do a crossover film where Abe Sapien and Beast by FluffyUnbound	May 18th, 2005 11:38:37 AM
OK, I'm done making really lame Kelsey Grammer jokes now. Carry on.
Kelsey... by stlfilmwire	May 18th, 2005 11:47:08 AM
Although I don't like him, his voice would be perfect... but I thought Beast appeared as a human in X-Men... or am I wrong?
You know who'll be in the theater with pants around ankles? Ant by Boris the Blade	May 18th, 2005 11:47:49 AM
Anyone see his Cribs episode? Man, if I were him, I woulda passed on that opp. When you got guys showing the bowling alleys and full court b-ball in their homes, a 5x10 cement hole "pool" just doesn't cut it. Think he had enough pics of himself up? I wish he put on the batman cowl he displayed so I could laugh even more at his C-list status.
Smallville is still on the air? by Eshu	May 18th, 2005 11:49:21 AM
For some stange reason I thought they had cancelled the show?
Rutger Hauer by LocTite	May 18th, 2005 12:17:16 PM
He's the only reason i will be watching Batman Begins......but ffs...he prolly will be onscreen only for a few minutes :/
I just had to use google to figure out who the hell Antonio Saba by FluffyUnbound	May 18th, 2005 12:37:40 PM
What's below C-list?
Batman Begins To Look More And More Like Shit by embrypotzebra721	May 18th, 2005 12:45:22 PM
Everyday. Warner Bros. sucks.
What yellow text? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 12:50:41 PM
Couldn't find anything to click.
And Katie Holmes' Nipples by embrypotzebra721	May 18th, 2005 12:51:35 PM
better be in this thing a lot longer than Rutger Hauer... 's.
What yellow text? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 12:52:56 PM
Couldn't find anything to click.
This is a very new Batman, indeed. by Magunga	May 18th, 2005 01:01:08 PM
I love the grittiness of it all. Batman always seemed a little goofy to me before. Even Burton's Gothic Batman was a little too sterile for my tastes. I am intringued...
Please tell me you just didn't say HOLY SNEAK PEEK BAT-VIEWERS by Orionsangels	May 18th, 2005 01:13:56 PM
When will batman be able to escape that idiotic robin line from the TV show?
On the day we get more Batman begins... by chrth	May 18th, 2005 01:28:07 PM
The Riddler Ends: http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBI Z/TV/05/18/obit.gorshin.ap/ind ex.html
What happened to Frank Gorshin? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 01:44:35 PM
And who was he in Twelve Monkeys?
Darth Vader and the New World Order by Jar Jar Boinks	May 18th, 2005 01:45:49 PM
READ IT: http://www.infowars.com/articl es/ps/darth_nwo.htm
'stolen from Spiderman pictures'? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 01:47:00 PM
How do you mean? Kind of advanced spandex?
Frank Gorshin aka "The Riddler" is dead of lung cancer R.I.P. by Ye Not Guilty	May 18th, 2005 01:49:14 PM
Just saw it in the news.
Kelsey Grammer Cast As Beast in X3 by Fuckleberry Hinn	May 18th, 2005 02:00:33 PM
I'm conflicted about this news.
Rest in peace, Frank by Edward_nygma	May 18th, 2005 02:05:18 PM
From one Edward Nygma to another other, God bless. As for the Kelsey Grammer thing, brilliant casting. Hope they give him a big ol' furry body suit rather than CG him though. Like Mr Hyde in LXG. That movie sucked balls but i thought Hyde looked really cool.
Obviously. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 02:05:26 PM

Frasier Mcoy. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 02:12:17 PM
Predominately pleased with this casting but how are they going to convey his ability? He's probably the most physical mutant of the Xmen. How can an actor in his fifties and no discernable athletic abilities portray that. Would definately prefer a blue Chewbacca suit but I can't see anything other than an entirely CG creation. Unless they compose Grammer's face onto a stunt actor's body. Kind of Abe Dooku.
That's got to be Ra's. by Darksider	May 18th, 2005 02:18:48 PM
Liam Neeson is awesome. Qui Gon Who? Kelsey as the Beast! Never saw that coming. I'm pretty sure Hank McCoy was in X-Men or X2 as a younger guy with black hair. Ah, who cares? Bring on the blue fur.
Come on, 'mack... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 02:28:08 PM
...you know the idea of the suit being an obvious improvement over Keaton's and my still wanting them to keep it mostly in shadow are not diametrically opposed concepts. Batman's suit, regardless of what version you prefer, ALWAYS looks better/more menacing/less silly in shadow. It's about silhouettes and their intimidation effect. Any villain with any balls, if he sees either the Fat Man suit from Dead End or the rubber muscle suit from this movie in full light is going to be overcome first with the urge to laugh (at least before the guy in the suit kicks his ass). I'm not contradicting myself or violating any logical boundaries by saying: If this is the suit we've got, I'm fine with it - it's better than the last one - and think it would look even better filmed mostly in shadow. Go ahead and give yourself a minute to wrap your brain around that while I change subjects. About Frank Gorshin... man, but that sucks! He was immensely talented and managed to make a pretty silly, ineffectual villain (at least as traditionally portrayed in the comics) actually seem menacing on an otherwise silly and ineffectual show (the 60s Batman show really raped the character, if you're looking for a depiction to hate on 'mack). And he was always a fun addition to the cast of any movie, usually bringing vast depth and entertainment value to even the smallest of parts. You'll be missed, Frank.
Star Wars Sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! by Swarmy	May 18th, 2005 02:46:19 PM
Well, actually I haven't seen the new movie yet but it's been a few posts since somebody bashed Star Wars and I was getting nervous. What's this 'Batman' movie thingy I've been hearing about anyways?
Compare and Contrast by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 02:52:49 PM
Helps to form an opinion when you see both concepts together. Nolan's-http://www.comicon.com /thebeat/images/bale-costume-1 .jpg and purists. http://www.abfab.co.uk/Fancy_D ress_ShowPic.asp?ImgName=Batma n%20TM&ImgSrc=RB15273
New Batman One-Sheet. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 02:57:53 PM
http://pub.tv2.no/multimedia/T V2/archive/00176/afp_fathers_4 _justi_176818a.jpg
The juvenile pot shots... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 03:11:16 PM
...aren't helping your case any, 'mack. But, since we're there already, I'll ask the guy who's throwing the word "retarded" around so much if you honestly think a Batman suit, done in the style of the Spider-Man suit from the Sony pictures, would NOT look somewhat foolish in black and grey, blue and grey or whatever combination of colors they chose? If your answer is an honest "yes," then I'd like to show you a very nice yard in my neighborhood where we could string up your leash and you'd have lots of room to run and dig. I promise no one will touch your ears.
No opinion as yet. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 03:11:48 PM
I've personally been strangely underwhelmed by what I've seen so far.
Slight tangent, by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 03:18:09 PM
but what's the general consensous on the new Superman suit? Same? Too much of a departure from an already classic design or an acceptable adaptation for a more believable mood?
can't we all get along and focus our hatred on ROTS? by so sorry	May 18th, 2005 03:18:49 PM

Hey, Moviemack, You Scrumptious Crumbcake, You! by Magunga	May 18th, 2005 03:24:43 PM
There are great things about the earlier incarnations of Batman, to be sure, with two exceptions I needn't point out. However, the measure of their strengths and weaknesses is entirely relative to the period in which the were created and the viewer's own tastes. In saying that, there will very likely be things about this movie that the vast majority of the viewing public will not like. There are definitely causes for alarm, as almost anyone who's seen "Blade: Trinity" will tell you. At the same time, there are some interesting questions about the character that have, as yet, been largely been ignored in earlier versions that seem to be addressed in "Batman Begins." I'll hold off on my ultimate judgement of the film until after I have seen it and had time to properly weigh the pros and cons. Keep doin' your thing, though. It's precious.
Trevor G, you ask a... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 03:31:05 PM
...good question. And I think I can even relate it to the topic at hand. From what I've seen, the new Supes suit is pretty much what you get when they apply Spider-Man costume-making technology to the classic design worn by Chris Reeve. A lot of folks REALLY don't like it (which could be another cautionary argument against letting them apply the same technique to the bat-suit). There's a lot of "It looks gay" going around, but I can't be sure how much of that is latent homophobia from fanboys resentful that Singer "abandoned" the X-movies to make Superman Returns. Personally I think it looks okay. It isn't as cool looking to me as the simple body stocking and boots that Reeve wore, but I guess they wanted to make the suit seem more modern or darker for some reason. It's not my ideal (they could've just used the old one or one made just like it), but the rather stylized look of it hasn't put me off being curious about how the movie will turn out. Your idea of not forming opinions about a movie's quality before seeing it is a sound one. I'd stick with it if I were you. Even my guarded optimism about Batman Begins does set me up for a possible fall, however short, if it turns out to be the abhorrent shitpile moviemack has prophesied. But it's a chance I'm willing to take if I get to be even remotely enthused about seeing Batman on the big screen again.
Re: Moviemack by Darth Busey	May 18th, 2005 03:33:48 PM
Wow, you REALLY are at the wrong website, then. This place is 98% die-hard SW fanboys.
Oh, 'mack... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 03:38:27 PM
...you silly wabbit. Are you really impinging my credibility based on a joke I made at my own expense (you should try it sometime, it's far more satisfying than the losing battle you're fighting to be taken oh-so-seriously)? I think anyone who reads the arguments you try to cleverly distort to fit your bizarre world view will see that what I and others are trying to do is reason with you. Specifically, we're looking for a reason not to dismiss you as a loon. You really are one to talk about defending "what we know" versus "what we haven't seen," given the way you've frothed and foamed at this film since reading that early draft of the leaked script (which apparently comprises the sum total of what you know). Coming from you, that logic isn't merely circuitous, it's positively dizzy. Oh, and I ran into you-know-who again the other day, by the way. He sends you his best, as always. He is ever so Fond of yoU.
Childe Roland by MasterWhedon	May 18th, 2005 03:38:42 PM
I couldn't agree with you more. I think the Superman suit is fine. Not the best ever, but it fits the spirit of the character and maintains much of the tradition. As does, I would say, the Begins suit for Batman. The very reason the Adam West/Collara suit isn't practical in a "real" Batman movie is 'cause the damn guy doesn't have any superpowers. He depends on gadgets and the damn suit itself IS a gadget!! It would need to be padded, to be bullet proof so that Batman could go out night after night and actually stand a chance of coming home in one piece. Is it a little clunky? Yeah. But it's a lot more practical than a guy running around in tights.
BLINK! BLINK! by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 03:48:09 PM
Pardon the moment of stunned silence, 'mack, but does that mean you're actually going to SEE this movie?
Unanswered Questions by Magunga	May 18th, 2005 03:55:21 PM
I'm not looking for definitive answers as to who Batman is or why he does all the absurd things he does. I would simply like to see these issues addressed. Even crappy movies can propose intriguing ideas.
There are plenty of clues, 'mack... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 04:02:41 PM
...but you seem to believe there's no mystery to be solved. Whatever floats your boat. You're the ONLY person I know who is not only willing to dismiss this movie completely without seeing it, but who has made it his personal mission to convince the rest of the world he can predict the future. You've been given the same information everyone else has, yet there are many who remain anywhere form cautiously optimistic to outright excited about the movie. You're insisting with every post that only your opinion of what we've all seen, heard and, yes, even read, is valid. That's just nuts... especially given the flaws in your thought processes, which you've already revealed through your rants. Keep in mind, I've never championed this movie on its merits as good cinema. I haven't seen it and am fully aware that it could be bad as easily as it could be good. What I've done at every turn and will continue to do is point out the absurdity of your absulte certitude that the movie will be abyssmal because it isn't Batman the way you personally want to see him. Someone trusted this vision of the character enough to grant the filmmaker the right to make the movie. How shocking that no one thought to consult you, the Ultimate Expert on All Things Batty. It's called life, 'mack. What is, is. Deal with it (or, in this case, at least wait for it to happen when there's nothing you can do to stop it) and move on. Or you could spend every minute between now and opening night being perceived as a whiny, irrational, raging nutball. Your call.
Did you hate Batman & Robin with the same gusto? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 04:11:29 PM
Before or after you watched it, I'm not partial.
Moviemack: by Shigeru	May 18th, 2005 04:15:21 PM
You are the definition of played out, son.
Supderman by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 04:17:26 PM
I find the Superman suit a little obvious in the way it mimicks the Spiderman suit. The Fantastic Four people have gone the same way and I sort of expect that repackaging from a film by Tim Story but I thought Singer might be a little more courageous in his work. Still, I am looking forward to this more than Batman Begins.
So, your argument... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 04:26:15 PM
...in a nutshell is that nobody can prove to you the movie won't suck, therefore it is clearly guilty of sucking? Please tell me you ignore those jury duty summons when they come. I'm not trying to prove how wrong you will be. That's silly. I'm telling you how wrong you are for insisting you are right before the facts are in. You're holding a movie you haven't seen to standards that don't exist anywhere except your head. That's cuckoo. I really just want you to come out and admit that you are not even willing to give this movie a chance to be good because it isn't looking like it's going to be the movie you wanted. That would be fun for me and therapeutic for you, I think.
Very True, Moviemack, Very True... by Magunga	May 18th, 2005 04:27:15 PM
...although it would be foolish to label a movie as "crappy" or "fuckin' awesome!" when one has not yet seen it. Would you not agree?
The Beast is pretty Acrobatic by Trik	May 18th, 2005 04:28:31 PM
Seeing as how stars are expected to do their own wire work these days. The first stunt will kill or cripple ol' man Grammar. Problem solved.
Just watched World's Finest.(Thank you for the link Whedon) by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 04:29:13 PM
Admiration for Collara but World's Finest is shite. And not for the low budget. It's like those eighties early nineties superhero films of The Flash and Captain America. This should be held up as an answer to 'why can't film makers stay faithful to the source'.
Sign the CRISPIN GLOVER AS The Joker Petition! by RIVERO	May 18th, 2005 04:29:28 PM
Glover would be perfect: http://www.petitiononline.com/ qp2d1234/petition.html
Acrobatic? by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 04:33:39 PM
Understatment. He's supposed to be some kind Uber Gorilla. Like I said before they must have to go with combination of suit CG and face replacing.
No RIV. Justin Theroux. by Trevor Goodchild	May 18th, 2005 04:34:46 PM

Rest in Peace FRANK GORSHIN -- greatest Batman villain of all ti by Kikstad	May 18th, 2005 04:46:30 PM
Frank Gorshin has passed away. May he rest in peace. You know the guy was ultra-talented to take a two-bit character and transform him into a great villain. The Riddler was a C-grade character and Gorshin's energy and skill made him truly memorable.
Frasier and CGI Beast? by Eshu	May 18th, 2005 04:55:29 PM
Beast really doesn
Moviemack, this is way beyond whether you'll end up being right by DocPazuzu	May 18th, 2005 04:56:06 PM
At this point you've become just another legend in the long, illustrious line of AICN sideshow freaks. Surely you must have understood by now that nobody is in the slightest bit interested in your opinions regarding the film or Batman in general. I'm willing to bet just about anything that a large portion if not the majority of talkbackers who see a new Batman Begins article only pop in to watch you rant and hopefully get dragged into another amusing flame war of attrition. Now, before you launch into a tirade about how pathetic we are for doing that, I invite you to take a look at yourself: your entire reason for being here is to bash BB. I say this even though you might actually post on other TB's because you have become so synonomous with BB talkbacks that if you actually have posted elsewhere, nobody has noticed. Also, you doggedly post your rants despite knowing full well that nobody gives a rat's ass. Nothing you post is ever taken seriously by anyone - whether you have valid points or not. Certainly you must know this. And in so knowing, what in God's name motivates you to keep going through your impotent circus act? I'm assuming you deep down want to convince people of something, but everything you say and do alienates even the most potentially sympathetic ear out there. What will you do once the film is out? How will you live? Where will you go? Who ARE you? (Go on... say it. You know you want to say it.)
If Crispin Glover becomes the Joker, you'll get a Joker about as by xXMr_BoJaNgLeSXx	May 18th, 2005 05:08:09 PM
Sure he LOOKED cool. But he was a bitch.
Frank Gorshin by HarrisonsDad	May 18th, 2005 05:11:12 PM
Since Harry (or Herc) doesn't see fit to put up an obit for Frank, I've had the honor of posting one on my blog http://leftofcentrist.blogspot .com/
"I just get big laughs at this. I love chapping your asses." by DocPazuzu	May 18th, 2005 05:11:19 PM
Whatever floats your boat, chief...
And the story is bad... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 05:16:53 PM
...because you didn't like it, right? Because it didn't depict Batman the way you believe he ought to be depicted. It all comes back to your subjective opinion of the story, which you got from an early draft of a leaked script. That may or may not be the script they shot. Despite any evidence you believe you see in the trailers, you can't say for certain the script has remained unchanged. And your opinion of a bad story may (and I'm betting does) differ from other people's opinions of what makes a good or bad story. There have been some great stories in the comic books. There have been some truly crappy ones as well. But they're all Batman stories blessed by DC itself. And, of course, others my have really liked those crappy stories without having been told to by some marketing conspiracy or sheep instinct. It's all a matter of taste. So, you see, even after the movie comes out, you won't be proven right or wrong. Some folks may share your predetermined opinion (although theirs will be more valid for having seen the movie) while others will have enjoyed the film. Will their individual feelings be wrong because they don't agree with you? Of course not. Because, again, they will have seen the film and will have an idea as to what they're talking about. You will still be willfully ignorant and, presumably, content to be so.
"He takes Viagra for HIS relevance." by DocPazuzu	May 18th, 2005 05:37:52 PM
I'd respond to that if I knew what it meant.
I've never once tried to prove... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 06:02:31 PM
...the movie was good, 'mack. That appears to be why you can't handle the discussion. I don't have to present an opposite view (which would be very easy to stand against, from your perspective, I suppose) to show that the view you've embraced is irrational and underinformed. But spin on. Watching you chase your own tail is pretty entertaining.
Moviemack, your sarcastic comments and jabs are oh-so-witty and by Swarmy	May 18th, 2005 06:21:52 PM
I like cake.
I don't have to show... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 06:42:17 PM
...what is a matter of public record and what you freely admit. The former being that the film has not been released yet and no one has come forward on this board to say they've had an advance screening. The latter being your insistence that you will not see this movie. Hence, you will never have first-hand knowledge of the finished film and will not know what you are talking about even after it's been out for weeks. You're your own worst logical enemy, 'mack. I'm just enjoying the show.
Joker by superman-2	May 18th, 2005 07:02:04 PM
Not that i want to but the joker should be danny houston, his performances are more odd and sinister like the dkr comics than anyones . trust me its the best choice...................
Holy crap enough already! by ClarkK82	May 18th, 2005 07:03:38 PM
Give it up with the damn Glover for Joker petition. IT WOULD NOT WORK EVEN IF PEOPLE SIGNED IT!!! And adding it to every freaking talk balk thread is getting really damn annoying. I'm starting to think that Rivero is Glover, his agent, or his mom. The guy must really need the work. GIVE IT UP!!!
Testy, testy... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 07:07:34 PM
...aren't you, 'mack? Does that mean you're running out of faux logic? When did I say there haven't been advance screenings? I said it hasn't been released yet. It hasn't (a point made to reiterate that you have not seen the movie). I said no one has come forward on this site to say they've seen it. They haven't. So you're still proceeding from what you read in that leaked script and what you can piece together from trailers and toys. All of my facts are still very straight and your opinion is still based on a movie you haven't seen. Seems the jack is on the other ass and you are still talking out of it.
by brinkeguthrie	May 18th, 2005 07:22:58 PM
clip is 1:16, not 2:00. what am i missing?
run time by brinkeguthrie	May 18th, 2005 07:28:51 PM
lets try again. clip for BMB seems to be 1:16 not 2:00. am i looking in the wrong place? and why wont the webmaster write back so I can change my password TO SOMETHING I CAN REMEMBER?????????
You can change your password from the talkback screen. by FluffyUnbound	May 18th, 2005 07:34:38 PM
Click the little button at the bottom of the message list that says "Talkback" and you'll see a link that says "To change your user ID or password, click here".
BMB site is screwy by brinkeguthrie	May 18th, 2005 07:35:57 PM
http://www2.warnerbros.com/bat manbegins/flash/index.html click on partners and look at the logos- all latin and they link to Google. huh?
Anyway, Back to X-Men: Who Should be Angel & Kitty? by Fuckleberry Hinn	May 18th, 2005 07:36:29 PM
Really, how much is there to say about a Batman trailer? If AICN is asleep at the wheel and can't open a Beast/Frasier thread, then we have no choice but to hijack. So I'm warming to the idea of Kelsey Grammer as Beast. He has the voice, intelligence, and demeanor to pull it off really, really well. As for the physique - I'll leave that to movie magic. He's spot-on for Beast in many ways - I hate to admit it. Everyone else I can think of only fits by body type. Kelsey fits by personality, which is more important. So who should play Angel? I cast my vote for Paul Walker. Hhhhhot. Kitty? I'm not seeing that Lost chick as Kitty. At all. Kitty should be a small, dark-haired teenager. Not a twentysomething California Beach Bunny. Lindsey Lohan? Gambit? Actually, I never liked that character. I hope he doesn't make the cut. And they should recast Rogue and Cyclops. And if Halle gets pissy, call Angela Bassett.
I love Grammar for Beast by Gheorghe Zamfir	May 18th, 2005 07:59:05 PM
I see a few people are worried about the guy being there only for comic relief, we should remember that the guy is an actor though, not just Frasier, he went to Juliard and has done Shakespeare on Broadway, so his casting isn't at all indicative of making the Beast some jokey one-liner kind of role (not saying it won't be, just that I wouldn't assume it). And as much as I wish Bassett had been cast right from the beginning, I hope there's no recasting, just doesn't vibe well with continuity - though I realize its already been done to an extent with Jubilee and Beast (and sidenote, I hope we see that chick from X2 playing Jubilee return, cause, well, she's hot), those are minor enough to forgive, recasting out roles like Storm or Cyclops would just be too noticeably jarring (why recast Rogue though?). I'd rather just see characters written out rather then recast, its a large enough cast to get away with that anyways.
Keep going, 'mack... by Childe Roland	May 18th, 2005 08:42:19 PM
...you're doing a fabulous job of making yourself look like a raving moron. When you eventually discover the difference between a fact and an opinion (assuming your junior high school ever gets around to that), you're going to be pretty embarrassed. Have fun in the meantime, though.
password by brinkeguthrie	May 18th, 2005 09:06:29 PM
Thanks for the help on the password.
So, the full footage just aired... by adambalm	May 18th, 2005 09:35:36 PM
Anf fuck Smallville up it's chocolate cocket for making me sit through that.
Batman preview by Darth Mulder	May 18th, 2005 09:39:46 PM
Every time I see a new preview for this film I get more excited than I was before.I will be going to see ROTS in about an hour and I hope I see a preview for Fantastic Four that can get me even half as excited for that as I am for Batman Begins.
by adambalm	May 18th, 2005 09:40:00 PM
cocket=socket. And I still can't believe they're showing this much of the movie a month in advance. Also they showed the new DC comics logo reel thingy.
So What! by BangoTango	May 18th, 2005 09:46:23 PM
I wasn't impressed at all. This footage was suppose to get me excited. It failed. For some reason Chris Nolan is being prasied for returning Batman to Batman. Excuss me, but as anyone seen any of his movies. . . they are all long and boring! Wake up people, this movie is going to be a gigantic bottle of slepping pills.
so what? by DVDGUY	May 18th, 2005 09:52:44 PM
Nolan's films long and boring? Go back to watching Batman and Robin.
So What! by brinkeguthrie	May 18th, 2005 09:58:52 PM
slepping pills? spellcheck much?
So What! Part 2 by BangoTango	May 18th, 2005 10:02:31 PM
Oh that's a very good comeback DVDGUY! Throw in the Batman and Robin reference, ah that's original. I tell ya what. Instead of assuming that I'm a fan of that awful movie, why don't you come up with a better response to my comment.
When did this air? by Gheorghe Zamfir	May 18th, 2005 10:07:19 PM
West coast here, don't make me watch Smallville, first half hour, last half hour, what's the general window I have to tune in to catch this?
by BangoTango	May 18th, 2005 10:08:41 PM
It looks like I've offended a couple of Nolan fans. By the way, I don't have time to spellcheck. . .I'm too busy answering to intelligent(sarcasm, just in case you missed it)people like yourself.
Sure, BangoTango by DVDGUY	May 18th, 2005 10:14:24 PM
Nolan's films are long and boring? How about fresh, innovative, complex, and thought-provoking films? I made the Batman and Robin reference because anyone who loathes Nolan's films most likely don't like to be challenged to think while watching a movie. I don't see how you can ask for a better comment when all you said is that the movie will be a gigantic bottle of slepping pills
Zamfir by adambalm	May 18th, 2005 10:27:12 PM
It's at the very end of Smallville, so I'd start watching at the 1 hr 15 minute mark.
At the end?! Thanks Adam by Gheorghe Zamfir	May 18th, 2005 10:42:03 PM
You just saved an hour of my life.
Moviemack is right! This karate kid shit is embarrassing by Rant Breath	May 18th, 2005 11:12:44 PM
Let me get this straight. Ras Al Ghul and company spoon feed Bruce Wayne into becoming Batman. Totally unacceptable! Oh yeah, the batsuit looks like shit. How could you Nolan. We trusted you.
The ten minute preview was awesome! by superman05	May 19th, 2005 12:42:15 AM
The ten minute preview after smallville was awesome! I love Bale's Batman voice. I am so psyched about this movie. I can't wait. The rubber suit WORKS.
I've figured it out: Moviemack is Tim Burton's kid. by Jon_Snow	May 19th, 2005 01:01:35 AM
Its the only thing that could possibly explain this guys tireless crusade against this film. Hey, the project isn't without flaws, but certainly not enough to justify the treatment Moviemack serves up to Nolan and company. But if he were in truth Burton's kid (I would even speculate on Schumacher, but I doubt that schmuck could knock a chick up) it would explain alot. Moviemack is worried that Nolan going to ruin daddy's legacy. That HAS to be it.
Meh by Ribbons	May 19th, 2005 01:15:31 AM
The ninjas appearing out of nowhere was pretty cool, the rest of the clip was pretty lame.
THE TRAINMAN IS THE JOKER by zerep	May 19th, 2005 01:29:58 AM
Everyone gotta consider Bruce Spence AKA "The Trainman" from the Matrix Revolutions as the possible Joker in the Batman movie sequel...that guy is creepy looking.
zerep by Ribbons	May 19th, 2005 01:37:32 AM
You're joking, right?
moviemack by aikimoe	May 19th, 2005 01:55:21 AM
You've made me curious, damn you. Could you provide a short list of fantasy/sci-fi/action movies that you liked?
They played the new DC logo and it was awesome! Look out Marvel. by Valorific	May 19th, 2005 02:24:57 AM

moviemack, you may well be right.... by Rain_Dog	May 19th, 2005 03:01:32 AM
But Jesus, go and get some fresh air, willya? You're gonna give yourself an ulcer.
Mack WIN!!!! On account that everyone else has moved on to diffe by Swarmy	May 19th, 2005 06:18:22 AM
Hooray!!!! I was rooting for him all along!!!
Valorific by Ribbons	May 19th, 2005 06:26:58 AM
I know, man. Seeing the DC logo gave me "douche-chills" (not really).
I was surprised... by adambalm	May 19th, 2005 08:45:50 AM
...by how much the DC logo reel is an exact carbon copy of Marvel's. Showing a few pages of the old comics and then the reveal of the logo at the end. Oh wait, nevermind. That's actually not that bad. And that sentence had bad grammar. Oh, and just to threadjack the talkback even more, the new Fantastic Four trailer was fucking tedious paint-by-numbers story-telling.
You guys are insane by Dreth	May 19th, 2005 09:41:01 AM
All you exist for is hating something. Give it a rest. I personally felt that the Batman Begins preview was better and TRUER to the spirit of the character than any other comic movie. Yeah, that includes Xmen and Spider-Man movies. Who cares if they change the origin a bit? If you had a brain, you'd realize that some of these iconic characters are nothing but modern day american folklore. Updated myths. Ever study folklore or myths? Notice that things change a bit? No different than comics translated to books or movies. It's merely an interpretation. I've been reading Batman comics for over 30 years. The vast majority, like all comics, simply aren't that good. Sure, there are exceptions. I've read the original Bob Kane comics. I've suffered through the Batman/Batwoman go to alien worlds horror. I rejoiced when Neal Adams drew the Darkknight Detective. Batman changes. So, shut the fuck up, sit back, and enjoy the ride, haters. Sheesh.
Kinda cool... by Kid Z	May 19th, 2005 10:34:29 AM
... too bad that Batsuit looks so shitty...
actually yours is the myth by adambalm	May 19th, 2005 11:24:27 AM
"Freaking kids. I have a masters degree in folklore and mythology..." -Simpsons comic book guy. Actually I have studied myths. I'm not too sure you have. The great fanboy pastime is to impart more meaning to something than already exists. Most mythology study is rooted in outdated freudian obscurantism, case in point Otto Rank, Carl Jung and Joseph Campbell. Fanboys always cite the latter thinking it makes their entertainment somehow profound and important. This was parodied fantastically in Daniel Clowe's (The guy who did Ghost World for most of you) "Pussey!" A better source of myth studies is Ariadne's Clue by Anthony Stevens and some parts of Edward O. Wilson's Consilience which go into the evolutionary biology of myths. Some reading on Dennett and others in the field of cognitive neuroscience would be helpful too, but I digress. In any event, superheroes fail to qualify as myths in two important functions of myths, that all myths have. 1) the cosmological explanation or myth as a function of explaining the creation of the world or the foundation of a city (I.e. Romulus and Remus founding Rome, creation myths such as the book of genesis). To function as this myth, the myth must be believed. This is why X-Files was closer to being real mythology than Superman. And 2) As a justification for the existence of a tribe or ethnic group and justify the order of that society (Why those in power deserve to be in power, and why you should follow their instructions) Sometimes these two functions are interchangable. Superheroes do have several functions of myth (Some such as Spider-Man show the pedagogical or life-step function for instance, to guide someone into adulthood.) But because everyone knows these are made up stories, they do not qualify as myths. Superheroes instead fall under the status of folk heroes such as Paul Bunyan and Robin Hood, which basically is to say it's just another form of entertainment, same as fairy tales or any other story told around a fire for fun, but not on the level of myth.
hmmm... by aikimoe	May 19th, 2005 12:24:12 PM
...that's a good list, moviemack, but...the first two Batman movies? If you meant the "Mask of the Phantasm" and "World's Finest," we'd be in agreement, but...the first two Batman movies? I mean, I can see where you're coming from in terms of this new one, it sounds like they're trying too much, but did the first one even have a script? I thought they made it up as they went along.
Yeah, NewYorkKid! You stick it to Marvel! by Ribbons	May 19th, 2005 08:13:56 PM
And people say Marvel fans are the dumb ones? "They've gotten so fuckin' cocky and not "their" fucking up!" Yes, I'm getting douche-chills just thinking about it.
Dreth by Ribbons	May 19th, 2005 08:25:58 PM
I'd be almost willing to believe you there if I didn't think that a lot of the "changes" made to Batman were not, in fact, evolution of character, but focus grouped, studio enforced bullcrap. When Batman has to give up everything for a girl he barely knows and probably doesn't get to know all that well during the movie so that producers can rest easy knowing they've proven their hero isn't "gay" or (worse) "a nerd." Changes made for those reasons are vile as far as I'm concerned, hence the negative response. You can enjoy all you want, just keep your righteous, unconditional love of this movie your problem and not mine.
Question about the suit by scape away	May 19th, 2005 08:48:47 PM
Everyone is always complaining about the suit, but I want to know one thing. What would you do? What kind of Batman suit can really "work" in live action?
I like this suit by aikimoe	May 19th, 2005 10:44:45 PM
http://www.cgnetworks.com/gall erycrits/7630/7630_1114378611. jpg
that 10 min preview kicked a$$ by blackthought	May 19th, 2005 11:38:59 PM
i loved every inch.....i'm supremely excited......ninjas too!
Piece of advice for Nolan, Goyer, & the WB by lynxpro	May 20th, 2005 01:05:02 AM
Hey Chris Nolan, David Goyer, and the rest of Warner Bros. You wanna know who your best choice would be to portray The Joker in Batman Begins 2? Check out British actor (yes, another one of them) Christopher Eccleston. That's right, the star of the British smash hit Doctor Who. Look at the guy's mug. He's got the menacing grin down pat. Check out his nose. And his ears. And guess what? This guy can act! Big time. He's what you are looking for in the role of The Joker. And in America, he's pretty much unknown, so he is a tabla rasa to the American audience, which is something you guys have been striving for with the characters to start them again fresh. Word on the street is that he'll be in "The Da Vinci Code." He's is perfect for the role. And get this...if his accent is off, dub his vocals with Mark Hamill's voice. Trust me, it'll work either way. And its a better choice than Crispin Glover who brings all the BTTF baggage with him, or Adrian Brody who isn't scary at all. You took my advice with Ra's Al Ghul with the villain of this flick, so take this free advice too. I want a set invite though...
..... by Ribbons	May 20th, 2005 01:14:20 AM
.....what?
Loved everything about the preview EXCEPT... by Mrhazard666	May 20th, 2005 09:48:13 AM
The scene with Katie Holmes (who looked too boring and dull for my tastes; they should've gotten a more interesting female lead)... Also I hated Bale's "Bat-voice" during the same scene... It sounded waaaaay too forced and exaggerated... It didn't seem so bad in other parts like when he talked to Gordon tho... Besides that everything else was near perfect... Can't until the release date...
God Bless Moviemack! by ComicBookGeek77	May 20th, 2005 11:30:21 AM

God Bless Moviemack! by ComicBookGeek77	May 20th, 2005 11:38:02 AM
It's been awhile since I've been on these boards. I recently saw a Batman Begins trailer so I decided to come by to get any new info. I ALSO specifically came by to see if the mack was still at it...and he is! And you know what? I agree with EVERY word he says. It just makes sense. I've read the script, it blows. This entire production blows. These dumbfucks were given an opportunity to redeem this franchise and I believe they've failed. Admit it, you deluded douchebags, Movie Mack is right.
yeah, but... by aikimoe	May 20th, 2005 12:01:44 PM
Moviemack thinks the first Batman movie was good. Doesn't that disqualify him? ;)
Aikimoe by lynxpro	May 20th, 2005 02:17:29 PM
Perhaps MovieMack is actually Michael Keaton.
or the ghost of Warren Skaaren by aikimoe	May 20th, 2005 03:16:28 PM

Or Michael Gough by Ribbons	May 21st, 2005 12:16:05 PM
That guy got the shaft
Moviemack can... by tango fett	May 21st, 2005 08:45:46 PM
SHOVE IT FOR HIS RELEVANCE! (woah, does that even MEAN anything?). Fuck off, the movie looks pretty damn cool. Also contrary to others, RotS was great, great enough to become my 2nd favorite in the series (let the bashing be gentle) except the Darth Vader NOOOOOOOOOOOOO line was HORRIBLE. peathe out.

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Here's a sneak peek at that extra BATMAN BEGINS footage to air today (Wed.) during Smallville!

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