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FAHRENHEIT 9/11 review

Coooooooool. More bashing ensues..... :-) by phanboi	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:40:15 PM
BRING IT FUKKIN ON!
I'll see it, but I really hate Moore by 3rdrate	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:40:31 PM
Though I more often than not agree with what Moore is fighting for, I really really hate how he often presents it. However, I make it a point to see a film before I attack it in any way, so I'll be there.
"It is clear that he wants you, all of you to watch this film an by AICN fanboy dork	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:41:01 PM
People who have differing opinions than Michael Moore are people who he'll dismiss faster than a salad. This is a guy who expresses disbelief when someone who shares his politics (Roger Ebert) points out the factual mistakes of Bowling For Columbine, who calls James Woods a bad person because Woods thought Moore's Oscar tirade was disrespectful. Anyone who isn't anti-Bush is basically just part of his large shit list. He doesn't respect the opposide side of where he stands (and sinks if he stands there for too long), so saying he wants people to voice anger at him as long as they care about something is like saying AICN talkbackers are well-behaved, well-adjusted individuals.
THANK YOU by Maleyj1	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:43:14 PM

I've been in some brutal talkbacks, but these are always the har by 007-11	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:47:16 PM
This will be one damn interesting election. I live in Dallas and whether you know it or not it's quite the republican stronghold. Even so i've seen a lot more Kerry bumper stickers and signs than I ever saw for Gore. Bush may just have to work for the vote in Texas. I know that the closer to the Gulf of Mexico you get the more support for Bush wanes. Like I said, the numbers should be very intesresting.
Harry...Kepp your fat ass political views out of an "Entertainme by spidey2k	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:48:47 PM
Like the title says. I didn't realize that this website was taking promoting "political" propaganda. Shame on you Harry. Keep politics of of your site.
In the words of The Human Torch by AlgertMopper	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:49:01 PM
FLAME ON!
political views by bluelou_boyle	Jun 22nd, 2004 04:58:35 PM
I'm not sure how you can keep political views out of a review of this film. Harry doesn't normally shove it down our throats. I supported the war (and Bush), from the UK it looked as though he was giving the UN a kick up the backside. But if this film points out the errors of policy since the war, an possibly before, then that is good. For example, the recent 'memo' news makes it look like this administration (or at least Cheney and Rumsfeld) considered the use of torture, or wanted to know how far they could take it. That is plain wrong. With a 'ticking bomb', maybe. But where do you draw the line ? My point is, you don't have to agree / disagree with everything Moore says. If only he would acknowledge another viewpoint. His valid points are overshadowed by his blind hatred of Bush. Both Clintons and Kerry agree with some of Bush's actions - but does he go after them with such venom ?
Who cares? by rev_skarekroe	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:00:58 PM
Where's the review of "1 Night In Paris"? sk
Can't Wait to See the Movie by bushsux	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:08:22 PM
I love it, the conservatives are already whining about how Harry is a liberal and should keep his views to himself on this sit because it's primarily "entertainment" oriented. Ahh, the old "shut up and sing" argument. Conservatives like to use this everytime someone famous that people listen to speaks out against their silly causes like stripping gays of their rights and bombing random countries. Ofcourse, if Arnold Shwarzenegger, an actor with absolutely NO PUBLIC SERVICE RESUME, wants to run for govenor of the largest, most populous state in the country, bring it on! Reagan, a god to Republicans, anti-christ to the rest of the country and world, was, an actor and celebrity. When will these little boys grow up!?!
Bowlingfortruth.com by Kingdaddy	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:17:21 PM
Thought Roger and Me was a really interesting film. Bowling for Columbine was just a bunch of grandstanding though. Check out Bowlingfortruth.com to see the manipulation Moore uses to present "his" vision - not necessarily the truth. 911 is the same bullshit - his agenda gets in the way of actually presenting the truth. What a shame, because the guy has talent.
Its not a documentary, its a hatchet job.. by wewoodson	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:20:54 PM
Michael Moore has no respect for the truth or the political process, and is a walking soundbite. Here is a nice article (in a liberal on-line magazine) by a fellow liberal documentarian. It pretty clearly describes how F-9/11 is grossly internally inconsistent, and extremely loose with the facts. Please note the author of the article is also very anti-Bush. Of course, none of that changes the fact that its still very effective "propoganda" and bashes someone Harry despises. So who cares if its sways the political process? If a republic put out such baseless crap, Harry would be apoplectic. http://politics.slate.msn.com/ id/2102723/
Bush Family by Porkfist	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:28:08 PM
Moore is going too easy on these Anunnaki bastards. Look at the history of the Bush family, the downward moral spiral of American foreign policy, the ties to big business, the blatant lies, etc. Anyone who supports this kind of elitist, tyrannical imperialism is either ignorant or evil ... or both. wake up.
I always enjoy reading the talkbacks for 9/11... by SaintofKillers	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:30:06 PM
I'll miss them when this movie is old news. Anyway, wether you like Moore or hate him, at least he gets a response, at least he gets people interested in politics and debate, and thats a good thing.
My dream by SaintofKillers	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:34:49 PM
One day I'll actually say something interesting and worth reading on this site, curse you damned magical trousers, you plauge always with your incesent buffalo immitations! Sorry for wasting your time everyone, go back to your political debate.
If only Disney had "sabotaged" Errol... by JBDemented	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:35:10 PM
Fog of War was an amazing documentary that made a powerful political statement while remaining true to the genre. Its possible to do, it just takes a great filmmaker. I enjoyed Roger and Me and Bowling...but unfortunatley Moore has lost his credibility and thats a shame. The real shame is that Fog of War didn't get the attention it deserved.
left and right aren't THAT different by apfrance	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:35:24 PM
I can't stand morons like Michael Moore and his equally annoying nemesis Rush Limbaugh. Their one sided arguments never stand up in the face of intelligent debate, so neither of them submit themselves to debate. Both of them end up insignificant, preaching only to their own choir and galvanizing the opposition to support their candidate even more. As a conservative myself, I think that liberals have a right to disagree with the way Republicans want to run the country, but rampages like these which claim Bush is a self-centered asshole who doesn't care about his country are unfair and unethical. Moore's and Limbaugh's claims that Bush and Kerry, respectively, are useless individuals unable to run the country are silly when compared to the long and valuable service both have provided to this country.
right you are by StanTheMan	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:44:24 PM
Hi Harry (and all others), I am German, and I have been to filmschool. We analyzed some of the propaganda clips that were done in other countries, just like in the US. The manipulative power of montage is just so incredible, it's unbelievable. On the other hand, there has been the same manipulation by the Nazis, and I have to say that we Germans needed You Allieds, needed you bitterly, to bomb us free from the Nazis. They were our people, of course, but brainwashed zombies in most cases (not the common soldier, he was just subjugated to a complex system of peer pressure), and knew what they were playing at. Thank you America, England, France and Russia! (I'm just 31 and never lived through it, but my parents were both born in the war) So, after this little patriotic tirade, let me say I can't wait for Farenheit 911 to open! I think it will show how the Bush administration uses the same kind of propaganda machinery as the Nazis did. And people will not like it. I am sure of it: This blatant idiot is history! Greetings from Munich in Bavaria, Stan The Man!
Remember When? by Doug Exeter	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:47:40 PM
Remember when going to the movies was fun, and you didn't have to put up with thinly disguised political agendas and propaganda? I'll be glad when this movie is done and time marches on. I like Michael Moore, but I also like George W. Bush. He's my President, and if John Kerry becomes my President in November, then I will support him as best I can. America needs to think long and hard about the prevailing undercurrent of cynicism that is so prevalent at the moment. Jesus said that a house that's divided against itself cannot stand. Don't misunderstand me, Jesus isn't going to come and nuke America, because I believe that He wants the House to stand. But it's up to us to make it stand. There are those who hate Bush (Michael Moore, George Soros, etc.) and those who adore Bush. It's okay not to agree with someone, but it's not okay to disrespect them. Respect is something that can be earned and that we can choose to give even when it isn't earned.
Let me get this straight... by Aragorn II	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:47:44 PM
You compare this film to WHY WE FIGHT, which was a blatant lie to the American people on many important levels, and then you endorse it? Is the fact that you believe we are being lied to by our government enough of a justification for supporting our being lied to by someone else in retaliation? Weak, Harry. Michael Moore is doing nothing more than taking advantage of the fact that most Americans are naive enough to believe that a film labeled as a 'documentary' is based primarily in fact. To quote the director himself, "Shame on you". Bush may not be the greatest president ever, but this film does nothing but lower the level of political discourse in our country. It certainly won't create an intelligent dialogue based on the facts. It's a shame we can't discuss the issues of the day without distorting them and making them into intentionally hurtful weapons. It just sucks.
"At this point, a vote for Bush is a character flaw." by Stanley Spector	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:49:16 PM

Remeber, W's Grandpappy Grave robbed.... by RickSlamu2	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:51:01 PM
the SKULL of native American Cheif Gerrionemo and took it back to The skull and Bones tomb at that one university. (The name escapes me for a monent) Now i don't know about you people, But grave robbing? These are the values of the Bush Family? If this is the tip of the ice berg we can see above water, how big is it below water? What's W hideing from us? OF course all what would go a lond way to makeing me more trusting is if the Bush twins posed for playboy or penthouse when they turned 18! Then we'd know 2 Bush's who have nothing to hide. Becides Bush twins are like the Hilton sisters! They are just WANTING THE ATTENTION!!!
Harry likes Michael Moore because he's fat. by Batutta	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:51:53 PM
Just like he fawns over that other fat-ass Guillermo DelToro. I don't buy Harry's propaganda is necessary line of thought, because it means good propoganda will be countered by bad propoganda, and so on, until the truth is rendered irrelevant.
Truth in Propaganda by Ribbons	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:52:31 PM
It's technically impossible for propaganda to be the truth, I'm pretty sure. What you mean to say, Harry, is that pieces of the story fall away as history progresses and all that the world at large remembers IS the propaganda. That doesn't make it the truth. All things considered, I would like to see Bush out of office, and I guess the only way to fight fire (censorship in the news) is with fire (Fahrenheit 9/11), so to speak, but let's not make any bones about the integrity of this movie. I'm not going to carry the conversation much further than this, because I'm pretty sure you're going to have to weather your own browbeating of sorts but, needless to say, I think you made your mind up about this film before you went to see it.
Bushsux, shove it up your ass. Turns out Schwartzeneggars a fuck by Triumph poops!	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:57:11 PM
And I say that as a Californian resident. In fact, a recent LA TIMES poll (in fact, literally EVERY California newspaper poll) finds that for as truly horrible and down in the gutter as Gray Davis' numbers were when he was recalled, Arnold is the direct OPPOSITE and flying high in positive numbers. He's riding an amazing wave of approval and for the first time in more than a decade, the overwhelming majority of Californians feel the state is heading in a better direction. Fucking Arnold rules, so when idiots like you point out that he had "no experience" just remember there are PLENTY of voters who actually find that a PLUS in a candidate, since they feel then that they're getting a free thinker (and in the case of Arnold, a truly self-made man) rather than a career politician who sells-out at the first offer. Amend the Constitution! Arnie for Prez!
Nice review but... by CrimandEvil	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:58:11 PM
Too bad none of Moore's "facts" are correct (atleast most of them). I think I'll catch this movie on DVD, no need to waste my money seeing it in theaters.
BUSH DID CARRY TRAVIS COUNTY! by Mad_Aliens	Jun 22nd, 2004 05:58:57 PM
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/20 00/results/TX/227/
Hitch's Deconstruction of F911 by HillaryLovesMe	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:08:06 PM
http://slate.msn.com/id/210272 3/ Money quotes: (quote)With Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11, however, an entirely new note has been struck. Here we glimpse a possible fusion between the turgid routines of MoveOn.org and the filmic standards, if not exactly the filmic skills, of Sergei Eisenstein or Leni Riefenstahl. To describe this film as dishonest and demagogic would almost be to promote those terms to the level of respectability. To describe this film as a piece of crap would be to run the risk of a discourse that would never again rise above the excremental. To describe it as an exercise in facile crowd-pleasing would be too obvious. Fahrenheit 9/11 is a sinister exercise in moral frivolity, crudely disguised as an exercise in seriousness. It is also a spectacle of abject political cowardice masking itself as a demonstration of "dissenting" bravery.(endquote) ***************(quote)In late 2002, almost a year after the al-Qaida assault on American society, I had an onstage debate with Michael Moore at the Telluride Film Festival. In the course of this exchange, he stated his view that Osama Bin Laden should be considered innocent until proven guilty. This was, he said, the American way. The intervention in Afghanistan, he maintained, had been at least to that extent unjustified. Something
Human cost of War by rutan07	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:09:35 PM
Maybe I am from a different plant and have been watching television that is the complete opposite of what every one else has been seeing. Because in the world I live in when I turn on the news it is covered, wall to wall, with stories of dead soliders, with interviews of burned American fighters and with horribly mauled Iraq women and children. The news I see does nothing but show the terrible cost of this war and the news I watch completely ignores anything good that Americans have done over in Iraq. Thank God then that I have friends in the Marines and Army who have been over in Iraq and can tell me the truth and not give me the distorted lies that come from NBC, CBS, ABC, CNBC, MSNBC, CNN, AIR AMERICA, and of course, Micheal Moore. What those who have served in this war say is that things are bad, that is true, but what we really never hear is about schools being built by soliders, parks being made by Marine, and the thousands of Iraq citizens who love us. Sure some hate us, hate us a lot, but where are the stories of the others who don't...gosh I never see that on television. Harry also asks why we are fighting this war, well I think we fight it because though we may fail sometimes on the whole America is trying to do right by the people of Iraq instead of dominating them, killing them, and taking away their freedom like good old Saddam deliberately did.
This election year will suck!!! by Sheik Yerbouti	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:16:34 PM
In my opinion this election year is going to go down as another low turn out snoozefest and who ever wins will be the turd who floated to the top. The problem? Well there are Bush haters, no doubt there, and there are KoolAid drinking Bush supporters, Moore and Harry included, but are there really that many Kerry supporters, people who would follow this guy no matter who he was running against. I don't think so, this is not unlike the election in 96 when Dole hardly electrified the right, but conservatives hated Clinton so much they were ready to vote for Bobby just to see Billary take a hike. Of course that didn't seem to work, because you have those in the middle, who when there doesn't seem to be a clear cut winner, goes with what they know. The only slight advantage I give to Kerry's chances over how Dole fared, is that Bush bashing seems to be at an all time high, compared with just the Limbaugh onslaught against Clinton in 96. The reason I suspect is that this time when there is a President who is divisive you have a media who's natural bias leads them to want to show more about how much people hate Bush and why they hate him. I am not playing the Liberal Media conspiracy card, which equals the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy that Billary was so worried about, but I am saying that there is quite a bit more media coverage regarding anti-Bush than perhaps during the anti-Clinton years.
Wow! I looked in and just realized that this is the very first r by Robofag	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:18:42 PM
Alright, now I feel like a whore... But still I don't know why there's so many people that hate Moore. He`s a brillant director that can be both informative and sarcastic at the same time, and he's not scared to blast the ELITE for what they do. Anybody saw a lot of documentaries which were funny and educative at the same time? I'm sure not... And this film is not propaganda for John Kerry as prez, since Moore has never been on the side of Democrats either (actually he DID directed some popular documentaries under the Clinton administration! )
Correction: Moore and Harry are the KoolAid drinking Democratic by Sheik Yerbouti	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:24:52 PM

RE: The incredible revelations in this film by KCMOSHer	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:31:12 PM
Man, this sounds like it's chock full of amazing, never-before-seen footage. Apparently, people get HURT in WAR!!! My God, we had no idea!!! There's also OIL in the middle east! Holy moley, I'd have never known! Golly gee willickers, not EVERY soldier over there is a good hearted boy scout looking to do good! Man oh man, I am SO glad we have Michael Moore to explain these things to us. Oh, and Harry? That was a VERY admirable try. Comparing Moore to Capra and all. The difference is, Capra has talent. Moore is a talentless lying fucktard who doesn't make 'arguments', he screeches like a harpy until the other side blanches or ignore him. Please oh please spare us any further comparisons of Michael Moore to real, talented filmmakers. It's really a waste of time and an insult to those of us who appreciate film.
F 9/11 IS FULL OF HOLES! Moore by BRING IT ON!	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:31:42 PM
Moore
MICHAEL MOORE by BRING IT ON!	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:32:05 PM
Anyone can manipulate folks, but it takes a special kind of craven, evil personality to manipulate a poor woman
THE TERRORIST by BRING IT ON!	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:32:47 PM
HEZBOLLAH & ME
Shut up. by Hellboy	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:39:21 PM
All of you. :)
This movie isn't going to matter folks. Wait til the debates, Bu by banshee	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:40:07 PM

AIR AMERICA is proof that liberals have no intellectual basis fo by aceattorney	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:42:53 PM
Generally speaking, of course.
APPEALS BOARD UPHOLDS R RATING FOR 'FAHRENHEIT'... by Moore_and_Harry	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:48:20 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmp l=story&cid=493&u=/ap/20040622 /ap_en_mo/film_fahrenheit_9_11 _rating_1&printer=1
Now commence with the leftist wailing and moaning and gnashing o by BRING IT ON!	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:53:48 PM
Bada Bing!
Christopher Hitchens Review: http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/ by SaltyJacques	Jun 22nd, 2004 06:59:06 PM
Great review of the movie. Hitchens pokes some serious holes in the film. I hope Moore has the cojones to take Hitchens up on his debate offer. Hitchens would mop the floor with him. http://slate.msn.com/id/210272 3/
Take Moore's New film, REAPLACE the Words Geroge Bush with FILTH by Moore_and_Harry	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:03:06 PM
Heil mien Harry - We will remove the infestation
"At this point, a quote from Janeane Garoffalo is a character fl by GriffenMill	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:07:49 PM
Remember when she was funny? Yeah, me either....
Are there actually still Republicans coming to this site?? by TedSallis	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:08:16 PM
Wha dont all uv yoo rite weeng 'regular guys' boycott all uv those evul Holleewud films...Yoo culd start yore own republikan movee studeeo with broose willus and arrrnold!
A REAL review from a famous Leftist journalist... by Dagan	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:16:25 PM
http://slate.msn.com/id/210272 3/ fighting words Unfairenheit 9/11 The lies of Michael Moore. By Christopher Hitchens Posted Monday, June 21, 2004, at 12:26 PM PT One of the many problems with the American left, and indeed of the American left, has been its image and self-image as something rather too solemn, mirthless, herbivorous, dull, monochrome, righteous, and boring. How many times, in my old days at The Nation magazine, did I hear wistful and semienvious ruminations? Where was the radical Firing Line show? Who will be our Rush Limbaugh? I used privately to hope that the emphasis, if the comrades ever got around to it, would be on the first of those and not the second. But the meetings themselves were so mind-numbing and lugubrious that I thought the danger of success on either front was infinitely slight. Nonetheless, it seems that an answer to this long-felt need is finally beginning to emerge. I exempt Al Franken's unintentionally funny Air America network, to which I gave a couple of interviews in its early days. There, one could hear the reassuring noise of collapsing scenery and tripped-over wires and be reminded once again that correct politics and smooth media presentation are not even distant cousins. With Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11, however, an entirely new note has been struck. Here we glimpse a possible fusion between the turgid routines of MoveOn.org and the filmic standards, if not exactly the filmic skills, of Sergei Eisenstein or Leni Riefenstahl. To describe this film as dishonest and demagogic would almost be to promote those terms to the level of respectability. To describe this film as a piece of crap would be to run the risk of a discourse that would never again rise above the excremental. To describe it as an exercise in facile crowd-pleasing would be too obvious. Fahrenheit 9/11 is a sinister exercise in moral frivolity, crudely disguised as an exercise in seriousness. It is also a spectacle of abject political cowardice masking itself as a demonstration of "dissenting" bravery. In late 2002, almost a year after the al-Qaida assault on American society, I had an onstage debate with Michael Moore at the Telluride Film Festival. In the course of this exchange, he stated his view that Osama Bin Laden should be considered innocent until proven guilty. This was, he said, the American way. The intervention in Afghanistan, he maintained, had been at least to that extent unjustified. Something
Save 83% off Retail when you buy Harry Knowels literary outing " by Moore_and_Harry	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:17:48 PM
I think I will wait this title is in the "STEAL ME" stack in front of 1/2 price book stores
OMG Save 89% off Retail when you buy Harry Knowels literary outi by Moore_and_Harry	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:20:16 PM
Oh my.....
Why we vote? by BDT	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:36:55 PM
I am personally skeptical of our new "electronic" voting systems. Seems like another scam to fool Americans into believing that we actually reelect Bush. Can't wait to see this movie. I like to weed through propaganda on both sides and figure out what I think is right. It is very cool that there is now a mass entertainment propoganda to meet the deluge of pro Bush cr*p that we've been subjected to from every media outlet for the past 4 years. If anyone has any doubt about Bush, take a look at the GOP website for an eye-opener.
The truth and so-called "facts" are subjective.. by MrBlack321	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:43:44 PM
Therefore the concept of propoganda being used can initially pose a moral or ethical dilemma in that one must decide whether or not to use purely "facts" when advocating or informing etc. The reality of this issue is that a fact alone cannot create meaning, it is up to the subjective interpretation of people, THAT is what causes opinions to be made up or actions to occur. People are influenced all of their lives, the usually experience political socialization (a process wherein an individual is influenced by his/her environment, so much so that beliefs and opinions are formed as a result), and then have the ability to screen, out of the vast amount of opinions being spewed daily at them, what they WANT to hear. They can be selective, they can grasp on to their opinions and refuse to consider opposing beliefs. The point here is that people have many external influences that they cannot control bombarding them for their whole lives, therefore to be dissatisfied with the ethics of propoganda is not only invalid, it is hypocritical, because every sentence you speak has the possibility of being interpreted differently from the way it was meant, every word can possibly influence a random man to begin thinking about killing and push him over the edge, who knows. Therefore it is up to the individual, each and every one, to make important decisions that may play a part in deciding important fates in the future- fates like those of other human lives, entire countries or economies, and the state of the environment. So whether or not a filmmaker like Michael Moore strictly adheres to what his opposers claim are facts is an irrelevancy. He manipulates to create his subjective interpretation of what is going on- his artistic (yes there is art somewhere in there) vision. I know people who read that statement will either agree fervently or disagree fervently- FORGET ABOUT THAT FOR A SECOND, CALM DOWN, POUR SOME ICE WATER ON YOUR CROTCH! What I will say now IS relevant- thinking and acting for the greater good, having forsight and intelligence is what is important in these figures and everyone else, because we all have the ability to influence. I know, THEY have their own interests to look after, THEY are close-minded and continually spout THEIR views, BUT it is THEY, THEM, THOSE who decide fates of lives, of countries and economies. My belief is this- if we all become so suspicious that belief in anything is no longer possible, if we see a scandal that disillusions us to the point of apathy, THEY have WON (After reading through what I wrote I wanted to add that, in my opinion, being led to the point of killing is just as bad, but that may be too idealistic a view). WHAT the FCK is the POINT OF LIVING in THE UNITED STATES, WITH THE FREEDOM TO VOTE, AND NOTE VOTE?! IT IS SELF-DEFEATING TO THINK THAT OUR GOVERNMENT IS ENTIRELY CORRUPT (IT IS COMPOSED OF INDIVIDUALS, NOT ROBOTS), GET OUT THERE AND VOTE FOR A DIFFERENT CANDIDATE, OR GET OUT THERE AND RUN YOURSELF, OR GET OUT THERE AND START A REVOLUTION, BUT GET THE FCK OFF OF YOUR COUCH OR CHAIR, STOP WATCHING SURVIVOR 8000 OR PLAYING COUNTER-STRIKE FOR TEN HOURS A DAY, AND EXPRESS YOUR OPINION IN A WAY THAT MAKES CHANGE. It's up to YOU and your own ability to reason and consider, each individual plays a role in the fate of the world, morality and ethics do exist within the human race, both have the ability to sustain us somewhat, they are embedded within all that rhetoric and violence and despondency, somewhere. At least Moore is SPARKING something instead of deadening the populace with snore-inducing and redundant rhetoric (remember the T.S. Eliot poem "The Hollow Men"...). Consider this- if you're not sure about what you're being told over the news, remember that many MANY individuals were involved in bringing you that news. Consider that. Still suspicious? Call the news station or the paper, ask them about it. Get in contact with a local representative or senator, event try to write the White House if you want to. There are many things to do to affirm the FACT that HUMAN BEINGS are HUMAN BEINGS- we are all in this together, alive together, thinking and wondering together, so remember that unless machines rule us and control us, there will always be people in these times of conflict and mistrust, and nothing can influence a person better than another person. So think, consider, feel, and try to change things for the better. (Most people are by and large good and well-intentioned, even if their beliefs may appear otherwise)
Lack of graphic war footage is because the large majority of Ame by SexyBeast	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:45:53 PM
Bush isn't trying to hide the realities of war, but many Americans are weak. They don't have the backbone they had 70 years ago.
Let's have Moore wacked. by ZeedarTeretz	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:52:10 PM
http://www.celebrityhitlist.co m/main.php?section=indexm&type =mooremichael
Or if that's not your style, how about we put a hit on Bush? by ZeedarTeretz	Jun 22nd, 2004 07:53:14 PM
http://www.celebrityhitlist.co m/main.php?section=indexb&type =bushgeorgewalker
The real issue here is why didn't Moore have vampires or werewol by Uncle Stan	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:07:03 PM

Christopher Hitchens, George W. Bush, Michael Moore, Harry Knowl by LesterB	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:09:59 PM
Christopher Hitchens is not a leftist. That's just about the most absurd thing I've ever seen written in a talkback that was meant to be taken seriously (with Arnie for Prez running close behind). Hitchens is practically a neoconservative. He's been screaming about deposing Saddam Hussein for most of a decade. He's even written books about it. Of course he's going to be critical of this film! It defies what has been the center of his political philosophy, which is how he makes his living, for the last ten years of his life. Hitchens is more worried about his legacy and livelihood than whether or not Michael Moore has made a good film. On that point, I don't know because I haven't seen it yet. I thought "Roger & Me" was a masterpiece, but I thought "Bowling for Columbine" was pretty much very simple anti-gun propaganda. I don't expect anything more than that from Moore this time around. However, that being said, Thomas Paine's "Common Sense" was a brilliant piece of wartime propaganda that helped lead to the independence of this country that now stands at a crossroads. Did the ends justify the means? You tell me. I consider Michael Moore a flawed patriot. I believe that he has a true love for this country that is occasionally hung up by his own tendency to self-promote. If there's a war in this country between the Red States and the Blue States, there's another war going on in Michael Moore's head between genuine patriotism and the culture of celebrity. Bush is Moore's worst enemy. The further our esteemed leader drives the wedge between rich and poor, Christians and non-Christians, gays and straights, hawks and doves, the more vitriolic and out-of-control Moore becomes. Of course, the English thought that John Adams was vitriolic and out-of-control too. Because he was. We are at a crossroads here, people, and I don't know how many Americans realize that. Bush tries to work his corporate connections and wield the power of the bully pulpit to censor the news. He bullied Disney into dropping Moore's film - it was a fucking Gestapo tactic! We should be screaming at the top of our lungs about this subtle act of censorship. Red flags should have gone up the first time Ari Fleischer went on TV and told us to watch what we say. This is Michael Moore's way of telling Ari Fleischer to go fuck himself, thank you very much, and I'll say whatever I damn well please. There is no question in my mind that if the Constitution was not structured as brilliantly as it is, Bush would declare himself President-for-Life, dissolve Congress, and make an attempt to dominate the world. Fortunately, that's not something we have to worry about (at least not right now). The censorship, the secrecy, the arrogance of this White House is stunning. Unprecedented. Read John Dean's book "Worse than Watergate". George Bush thinks he's been ordained by God to lead the United States to victory. For Christ's sake, that's like something Saddam would say! Torture memos, Abu Ghraib, an alliance with the fucking Saudis! The Saudi royal family is a bunch of gangsters. Everyone else in the world knows this. You honestly believe Bush doesn't? In short, Michael Moore is throwing everything but the kitchen sink at George W. Bush, just like Paine and Adams did at George III 250 years ago, so I think I'll forgive him if he goes a little over-the-top in the process. Incidentally, since the Dubya supporters in the house are labeling me a pansy-assed liberal right now, I voted for John McCain in 2000. Now HE would have been a great President. He sure wouldn't have gone into Iraq without sufficient evidence of WMDs. He might have wanted to, but he wouldn't have. And now we're in a mess and we have to stay and fix it and it's all George W. Bush's fault. This nation's reputation, stature, and morale has already been damaged by our little Iraqi adventure. The failure to kick Bush out on his ass would be a tragic mistake that would lead to further and absolutely unprecedented damage, because to give him four more years is to give him free reign. He won't have another election to worry about. He'll be able to do pretty much whatever he wants, and do it with impunity. I'm voting for John Kerry even though he's by no means a prize because to vote for anybody else would be to vote for Bush. The election's going to be too close. So go, Mike, go. Go on wit' yo bad self. I'm rooting for "Fahrenheit 9/11" to break fucking records. And hey - everybody be nice to Harry, okay? You don't like him, get off the site. And to the idiots who are telling him not to bring politics into his review ... well, you're idiots, like I just said. How do you not bring politics into a review of a movie about politics? Jesus Christ, sometimes I think I'm living in Bizarro World...
You know, the more you bash this flick, the more it sounds like by Terry_1978	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:14:18 PM
Honestly, if what the man is doing is just spouting off garbage, then you shouldn't have any problem with the flick, it'll speak for itself when it tanks. The way some of you are fighting with all your soul against it makes it seem like perhaps old Mike has unearthed something you don't want unearthed.
Both Sides Now by Apple Pie	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:20:12 PM
Harry, you should really keep your political opinions to yourself, by stroking this you are no better than Moore using the same vehicle in media to present your/his agenda. Do some homework and you will find Moore is as corrupt as those he accuses of the same! Mr. Bush is our President and he deserves our respect and allegiance, if I could give it to Clinton I can certainly give it to our current President - if you don't like it - leave, no one is stopping you. I am however losing respect for you and will be taking my own advice.
OK Harry wins, I don't care anymore. by FluffyUnbound	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:21:14 PM
I can't keep arguing the same points on talkback after talkback. Just go see the damn movie if you want to, it doesn't matter anyway. // I have ranted in the past about the fact that the internet has poisoned human relations by allowing too many people too much access to the thoughts and opinions of too many of their fellow men. I also think that the internet helps kill the hope of reform, because if you talk to enough people in enough places on the internet you'll realize that not only is no one ever going to change their mind about any subject, ever, but that even if by some miracle people DID start changing their minds there are just too many people and too many boards, and it's too many arguments to have, and there's always somebody knew who thinks the same stupid shit the guy five minutes ago thought. It's like an intellectual Dawn of the Dead [Romero version] where they JUST KEEP COMING until reaching an end and giving up is a mercy. You think your vote doesn't count? It does, but so does everyone else's, and unless you're Herakles you will never clean out enough of the stable to get the shit that is the public mind to move.
oh dear God, ReaganDarthDeath is here too... by nuprin	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:25:44 PM
...get ready for some hate-mongering, everyone...
Harry , please stop .... by Hausi	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:32:36 PM
"Michael Moore shows the viewer how this isn
Thank you, LesterB, for giving me a new point to argue about. T by FluffyUnbound	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:36:39 PM
Anyone who thinks that Christopher Hitchens is NOT a leftist is almost unbearably uninformed. How about reading "No One Left To Lie To", where Hitchens launches an anti-Clinton tirade, because Clinton passed too much legislation that Republicans wanted, like welfare reform, and wasn't liberal enough. Read "The Trial of Henry Kissinger" where Hitchens calls for Vietnam-era politicians to be tried for war crimes. Read any of the material he published in Mother Jones and The Nation in the last 20 years. It's bizarre how someone can carry water for progressivism for decades but if they don't toe the line on ONE issue, they're immediately "essentially a neo-con". You people are priceless. Or is the real issue here simply that you have no idea who Hitchens is, and have no political memory longer than the last 12 months, and therefore believe that everyone who was pro-war must be on the right?
Good review harry by TheDarkJoker	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:39:20 PM
Even though you admitted to being a liberal, you viewed this movie from an independent view and saw it as a film. And that independence is the way for a better america!!!
Moviemack: "(votes don't count) And I thought the last President by Big Dumb Ape	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:52:11 PM
Wow. Yet another holdover year 2000 crybaby who still can't deal with the reality that Gore LOST and was, quite frankly, a shitty candidate and God knows how fucked up the world would be right now had HE been in charge post 9/11. Well, least clods like Moviemack have geek movies to lose themselves in. Deal with it, you bitches -- Bush WON the Florida election. Even recounts by the major news organizations showed that. And he's going to win in November AGAIN...so I guess we can all look forward to 4 more years of you assholes whining like the clueless clods you are.
The problem with propaganda Harry is.... by NFLRefugee	Jun 22nd, 2004 08:58:52 PM
that its not true. I don't like Bush but does anyone have a problem that what Moore is doing is essentially what Bush is doing: Lying to the people to promote their agenda? I know, I know, Bush's lies aren't as deadly as Moore's but it is irresponsible of Moore to promote this film as history. It is not. And it is not satire. It is Moore trying to rewrite history to promote his agenda. It troubles me.
Who the hell cares? FAHRENHEIT will have good opening weekend fo by Commando Cody	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:07:59 PM
Seriously -- get a grip, people. Those on the Left will flock to this to support their love child Moore, thus helping its box office. Hell, be prepared for those on the Left to champion this all the way to best picture just so fucking Hollywood can shine its liberal ways yet again. Those on the Right will protest it and will stay away in droves. Protest it, do what makes them happy to vilify it. Those in the middle...well, some will go, others will say the hell with it, who wants the headache of seeing such a piece of shit and will choose to see New York get flooded and ice aged again or make some such decision at the multiplex. FAHRENHEIT will get press for a few days as flavor of the moment...then SPIDERMAN 2 hits and will blow the box office doors off the hinges. And given that media outlets love their "news of the day" or more important, want to play to trends to make them money, you can bet that SPIDERMAN 2 coverage will drown out Moore after his initial weekend. Come November, NO ONE -- unless they're truly a brainless idiot -- will vote based on Michael Moore's shitfest. They'll vote based on their POCKETBOOK the same way they always do. And since the economy HAS now had 10 straight months of economic expansion and it's predicted that the majority of job numbers lost post 9/11 will be replaced (if not exceeded by November) it's a good bet people just might be feeling their wallets ARE doing all right and stick with Bush. God I hope so, because fucking Kerry, as a handpuppet with drunk Ted Kennedy's hand up his ass, will tax everything he sees in sight and be a truly shitty Commander in Chief. If Kerry wins, look for him to put in place a foreign policy that calls for us to surrender to fucking France...
Several comments by asantiago72	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:10:49 PM
Those who say that Harry must shut up about the subject, should remember that this is his site, and it is free. So, if you don't like his political views, go somewhere else.***** Those who say that Kerry is "a pussy", implying that Bush is not, should remember that when it was time to walk the walk and not talk the talk, one went to war and the other used family connections to dodge real service. ** As to Moore himself, well, I am not a fan of his, precisely because I disapprove of any kind of propaganda (no matter if their final objectives are close to mine). Nevertheless, Bush supporters that (suddenly)want full objectivity should remember Bush's own rethorical excesses. I particularly disapproved how he used to fall on anybody who did not agree with him (you are either with liberty and democracy or not, the evil axis, old Europe, etcetera) **** And in general, people, if you can only defend your point of view with oneliners or insults , it might be time for you to start reading and watching less tv.
Mission Accomplished! by Vanderschloss	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:14:13 PM
How many times do Bush and his cronies have to get caught lying to you before you realize they are liars - not to mention murderers, Rapturists and ultimately suckers of Satan's cock? I don't need Michael Moore to tell me this. The proof is out there, from numerous, perfectly credible news sources, laid before us in the most obvious smorgasboard of bullshit ever. If you can't read between the lines, please watch The Daily Show rerun tonight (7pm PST) where both Cheney and Bush passionately deny that they ever made specifically-worded claims about Al Qaeda's ties to Iraq, only to be refuted by videotape of them saying these things verbatim. All politicians are liars to some degree, sure. But these Bush guys are FUCKING EVIL and they're determined to bring about Armageddon with their fundamentalist/manifest destiny vision. If that's what America's all about, then fuck America and fuck you.
Exciting Debate! by Jervis Tetch	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:16:01 PM
But you know in a week the whole site's going to go apeshit for Spider-Man 2. Let's set our priorities, here, huh? P.S. Propaganda is for dumb people. If you're smart, you see through it. Isn't everybody here smart? So you want to fool dumb people to get Kerry elected? Isn't that cynical and corrupt? P.P.S. Richard Nixon and Lyndon Johnson made this current crowd look like nothing, corrupt power-wise. You could look it up.
This talkback is freakin' huge so if someone else mentioned it s by ewokstew	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:19:27 PM
Ray Bradbury is a little pissed off Moore is using this title for his movie because it comes to close to that of Fahrenheit 451. He's insisting that Mr. Moore rename his documentary. Maybe because of the still-in-development-hell remake movie that may soon see the light of day? Actually...maybe, never. Darn fine novel, though.
nytimes article on movie by mansala	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:25:07 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06 /20/movies/20SHEN.html
Propaganda rules. by PassionPlayer	Jun 22nd, 2004 09:43:44 PM
http://www.liberalpropaganda.o rg
Gosh if only Capra would have... by corvette63	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:10:30 PM
made a film about not re-electing FDR or Truman. Wouldn't that have made people vote! I guess with the Nazis and Commies gone the only enemies we Americans have left are ourselves. Oh yeah...and those guys who like to crash planes into our buildings, blow up our ships, blow up our embassy, blow up trains, and behead people like its Bastille Day. I always found Moore to be entertaining but it is telling that there is no room in his films for opposing views. I guess that could never be said for AICN. LOL!
Harry never should have reviewed 911 by sanderson	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:25:19 PM
Harry, you never should have reviewed M-n-M's filmed with the copywrite-infringed title. Now that you have exposed yourself as an unabashed Bush-hating leftist, you've lost the respect of your centrist and right-leaning readers.
Moore is a carnival barker by TPS	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:35:08 PM
masqurading as the almighty OZ. There are so many fallacies and contridictions within this film yet Moore skillfully manipulates the willing viewer into seeing his "logic" no matter what evidence there is against it. For example, Moore states that it's mighty suspicious, given the ties between the Bush and Bin Laden families, that the members of the Bin Laden family are flown out of the states immediately following the attacks. Richard Clarke as well as the 9/11 commission have both come forth that Clarke was the man responsible for these flights. Clark is otherwise portrayed as the uncompromising hero in the film by Moore. Odd, but oh well, LOOK!!! BUSH IS GOLFING PEOPLE!!!! The same liberals who rant about the sheep following the Bush policies are the same who slavishly follow Moore's "logic" without regard for facts. -The majority of pacifists either belong to obscure religious sects or are simply humanitarians who object to taking life and prefer not to follow their thoughts beyond that point. But there is a minority of intellectual pacifists, whose real though unacknowledged motive appears to be hatred of western democracy and admiration for totalitarianism. Pacifist propaganda usually boils down to saying that one side is as bad as the other, but if one looks closely at the writing of the younger intellectual pacifists, one finds that they do not by any means express impartial disapproval but are directed almost entirely against Britain and the United States
Activism, not propaganda by NNNOOO!!!	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:45:51 PM
Yes, WHY WE FIGHT was propaganda-- a government-sponsored project, and a military assignment for Frank Capra. "Propaganda" is what you see every night when you turn on Fox News. To Bush's regret, there are still some parts of the Constitution that allow American citizens the right to criticize their government. Agree with his sentiments or not, Moore is an ACTIVIST, not a propagandist.
"Harry doesn't normally shove it down our throats." by Junior Frenger	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:53:26 PM
Huh...Wha?!?!? Bluelou, you really don't visit this site much do you.
micheal moore by lars1775	Jun 22nd, 2004 10:56:55 PM
Whether it's a propaganda film or not, whether it's anti bush or not, you people forget one thing; "A society willing to trade a little bit of freedom for a little bit of security, deserves neither and will lose both." -Benjamin Franklin
Take a teenager to the movies! by Simon Moon	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:06:47 PM
Since this movie is rated "R", once I am at the theater, I will offer to be a "guardian" to any teenager under 17 who wants to watch this film. It's the intelligent version of buying an underage kid beer.
Why the hell do people on the Left pick on FOX NEWS? Seriously, by Commando Cody	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:14:08 PM
Seriously, that's MAJOR penis envy. Comparable to the way France WISHES it was an actual world power and DREAMS it could have the stature and class of America. Look, if you truly believe Fox news is slanted and biased, here's an earthshaking newsflash for you: you can turn the dial and watch CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC, ABC, John Stewart on Comedy Central or however you want to get your news, which would also include listening to the radio and -- gasp! -- READING whichever newspaper or news magazine you like. Which isn't even tough any more in this day and age when they're all essentially accessible online. Hell, if you don't like the NY POST because (like Fox) being Rupert Murdoch-owned you feel it's too Right leaning, then call up Dailynews.com or NewYorkTimes.com or whatever the hell regional paper you DO like. Bottom line, you Leftist assholes that go after Fox News for "propaganda spreading" conspicuously had your mouths shut back when CNN -- aka the Clinton News Network -- was on top of the heap and was the primary news outlet. Funny how you didn't complain about bias THEN. Bottom line, people will watch and read and listen to what they choose to read based on their leanings which is their RIGHT. Last I looked around, it's still a free country and thus I have the right to watch or listen to or read WHICHEVER news outlet I want. But for crying out loud, you can't blame Fox News or Richard Ailles for simply being successful at what they do. I mean, if there are so many Left wing news junkies who feel their viewpoints or their "slanted coverage" is being shut out, then they should simply flock to those stations that DO cater to their views. Which is interesting, considering CNN's ratings are waaaaaaaaaaaay down and Air America a late night joke for being such a disaster. Personally, I love how Al Franken likes to beat his chest like the dumbass he is saying he's more popular than Bill O'Reilly and that more people listen to him -- which would be a statistical miracle (and improbability) given that O'Reilly is syndicated in over 400 major markets while Air America is in a whopping...yes, count 'em...15. So quit the Fox News bitching. You don't like it, watch something else. But shut the hell up if other people do CHOOSE to watch it. Or is cultural tyrrany and what we get to see part of the liberal agenda? (Well, actually it is as demonstrated by Hollywood and now FAHRENHEIT 9/11). Fuck you idiot that come down on Fox News. They do a great job and I intend to keep getting my Laurie Dhue fix. YUMMM!
Moore is a documentarian... by Roger Thornhill	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:14:56 PM
All documentaries manipulate to one degree or another, yet there are all still documentaries. Some documentarians have a strong viewpoint like Errol Morris, Leni Riefenstahl, Robert Flaherty, and yes Michael Moore while the more banal ones produce standard documentaries for the history channel or discovery. It is these documentarians with strong and often times flawed viewpoints like Riefenstahl that make their films so compelling. Most educated viewers should go into a documentary hoping to be provoked intellectually, but should certainly not believe everything they see. Rather, they should come away from the film interested in learning more about the subject matter of the film. And for those advocating that Michael Moore makes propaganda films I have this to say: One man's propaganda is another man's truth. Labeling a film as propaganda is insufficient because not only is "propaganda" not a genre, but it is almost impossible for everyone to universially agree that a picture is propaganda. I'm sure there are many neo-Nazis who consider Riefenstahl's Triumph of the Will an accurate portrait of the Third Reich and its ideals.
When will moore and the rest of the liberals come up with reason by Retrace	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:26:17 PM
Because there are no good reasons to vote for Kerry. Even the hollywood elite buying out screenings of this movie this weekend to build the hype and jack up the box office isn't going to help this garbage....it will be forgotten in a couple weeks.
I am Michael Moore -- my film was created to pimp the spirits of by Triumph poops!	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:32:06 PM
Moore has stated this is NOT a documentary, but his opinion piece. So if it gets nominated for Best Documentary will he turn it down? Ha! Not likely. The odds of fat boy actually keeping his word is...well, about as likely as him using these little things called "facts" in his fucked-up films. Heaven forbid Moore would turn down another opportunity to make himself rich off the sufferings and blood of others -- much like he's now pimping the spirits of 9/11 to fatten his own wallet for his own fame and fortune. Moore should be ashamed of himself -- no, forget that, the man is an unfeeling asshole. Here's hoping he just eats one too many burgers this week and his fucking fat ass just explodes.
why? by lars1775	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:43:29 PM
why is it that "penis envy" a freudian term used to categorize women who were frustrated by mens advantage in the world of business and general life has been misstrued by "cody" to denote someone who is envious of the size of ones penis? France won our revolution for us, we "dissed" them in theirs, they still won without our help. Fox news should be followed by the word"entertainment". they are made fun of because they have no basis in fact except that bush is jesus(yes, not capitalized). Join the army and request a tour in Iraq if you are so pissed, America has become the British empire we so hated not 220 years ago. All of you Tories need to leave this country. HOY HOY Lars
Moore may twist the truth, but not as bad as Bush...OUR PRESIDEN by hans_delbruck	Jun 22nd, 2004 11:50:40 PM
Bush's entire presidency has been a bunch of lies or distortions of the truth for political gain. Other than what everyone knows already about Iraq...look no further than his earth day message of all the good he's done for the environment.
...then by golly by Darth_Bald	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:05:21 AM
"If Michael Moore
Holy hop-scotching Mailer clones on the corner of Penguin and Bl by Neosamurai85	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:05:37 AM
Ok, before Harry
Thanks for the reminder Neosamarai by Darth_Bald	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:11:47 AM
I meant to include this: http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_ About_Bowling.html
moore is more by lars1775	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:19:08 AM
Charleton heston is a goddamn hero. He answers questions when asked, and leaves when he feels they may be hurtful to his reputation. Goddamn hero. Why can't we all agree that we have problems and we need to get over them as a country, not as a divided bunch of high school dropouts arguing over whether acid or ecstasy is the better drug.Noone in this forum can tell me any historical fact, and i don't think i'm the most inteligent person in the world, but give me something more than"my daddy sez jezuz is thu answer to awl prawblems so ahm safe in heaven". God doesn't care for idiots, and the christian religion is a perfect example, it's a middle eastern religion,not a mid class white america religion, think about how many times the bible has been changed. you just don't know
Fox news by Sicuv Uyall	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:20:50 AM
I had a good response to dickhead Bushsux, but put the wrong password, and erased when I tried to return to the page. Anyway, if you thing Fox News is too biased to the right, wait till you check out Newsmax.com. What crock of shit that is.
Now i know youve lost it Harry ! by Raptorman101	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:23:26 AM
Comparing Moore to Capra.....You need some professional help and I suggest you dont delay in getting some !
Nicole21... by Roger Thornhill	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:24:19 AM
You failed to make a compelling arguement that Michael Moore is not a documentarian based on what I had written previously. You argued that because of his lies he not a documentarian. However, I stated that all documentaries manipulate the facts in order to suit the documentarian's point-of-view, even the most minor of documentaries engage in this. Documentarians choose what shots will be in their films and what shots will not, thus they are making a conscious decision about what is in their film and what is not. I'm not arguing that Moore speaks the truth, but I am arguing that he, like all documentarians, chooses what will be in his film and what won't. Now having said that, how is Moore NOT a documentarian?
Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son by Smash Drama	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:41:03 AM
My problem with the political discourse today is simply this: Harry and his ilk say that Big Macs suck and we should order a Whopper instead. Okay, WHY should I buy a Whopper? Because it's NOT a Big Mac. Yeah, okay, but WHY should I buy a Whopper? BECAUSE BIG MACS TASTE LIKE SHIT! Well, what does a Whopper taste like? WHO CARES, I DON'T KNOW, IT DOESN'T TASTE LIKE A BIG MAC!!!! DIDN'T YOU SEE THAT TWO HOUR DOCUMENTARY MICHAEL MOORE MADE ABOUT HOW FRICKING HORRIBLE AND GOD AWFUL BIG MACS ARE???? Yeah, but I'm not going to blindly order a Whopper instead unless you give me a REASON to be FOR SOMETHING, not just AGAINST something.
Seriously, what would Bush have to do by Vern	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:44:38 AM
for you guys to admit that he's a bad president? Would he have to actually break into your house, cut off a baby's head and jerk off into your mom's face? Would he have to ban Superman comics? Does it really take more than letting a fucking plan hit the Pentagon (!!!) and losing two wars, to convince Americans that maybe, just maybe, this administration is not exactly "strong on defense"? I honestly believe that Bush and Cheney could rape ten women on TV wearing suits made out of human fetuses and all the Republicans in congress (even McCain, I'm afraid) would figure out a way to explain it. And those of us who said, "Wait a minute, was I imagining it or did I just see Bush and Cheney rape ten women on TV? And were they wearing what I thought they were wearing?" would be called a bunch of "conspiracy theorists" "spewing hatred." Note how just in these two talkbacks, probably a few hundred thousand words have been written about the "lies" and "hatred" and "venom" and "holes" and "deception" and "propaganda" in the movie - a movie that NONE of you fuckers have even seen! And proudly declare you do not plan to see! Is it possible that maybe you just aren't willing to admit that the sky is fucking blue? It is absolutely freaking amazing that your brains can jump through that many hoops to explain it away. So good job everybody, I guess.
I got your political answers right here pal.... by castaway	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:56:06 AM
Moore and Bush, well their both fucking liars as far as I'm concerned. I have read recently that Moore made an unflattering 9/11 comment in the past that would put him in the same asshole parthenon as Jerry "I fucked my mother and enjoyed it" Falwell and Rush "Get the pills" Limbaugh (Falwell for his own 9/11 comments and Limbaugh for his inhuman Abu Ghraib comments). You want real hard truth facts, skip this pile of shit and demand that your local theater acquire the documentary "Control Room" about Al-Jazeera television, the news network that Rumsfeld claims is pro-Al Quaida (sp) or something, it may be more boring than Fahrenheit but Control Room has yet to have a handful of non-Republican movie critics poke holes in any of its falsehoods unlike Fahrenheit.
ebonic by The Killer-Goat	Jun 23rd, 2004 12:59:49 AM
I would agree with most of your points except for one reality: while it's obvious we are done with the Cold War, we still don't have that utopian, egalitarian planet. If push came to shove, I'd keep my feet firmly planted on Terra America. The terrorists certainly shoved pretty hard. When some noisy sonofabitch from the Middle East decides to continue exercising his vocal right to broadcast anti-American intentions, threatening my wife and child, you better believe I will whole-heartedly endorse a pre-emptive strike, by any means necessary. My family are worth more to me than some fanatics with a suicidal/homicidal mantra. In the end, that is all I could really care about. Shallow, maybe, in light of yours and Nicole's observations, but very true. *********** Iraq, unfortunately, seems a sad example of 'collateral damage' being used to further reinforce the opposing principles of either 'side'.
The best part of all this: When Bush wins in November and being by Triumph poops!	Jun 23rd, 2004 01:02:35 AM
Can't wait. Talk about posts that will be great to put up. And just think of all that Liberal ass election night that will be primed for a royal ass whooping and public mocking, as election night shows yet again how Libs can only be losers in life...
Holy technological karmetic censorship BATMAT!!! (Thoughts on po by Neosamurai85	Jun 23rd, 2004 01:04:43 AM
O-K! Where was I? Oh yeah
Oh and one last thing..... by castaway	Jun 23rd, 2004 01:05:52 AM
Harry, being a supreme liberal I know you love Fahrenheit 9/11, and me, even though I'm mostly conservative, I will give up some time to give Moore's little magnum opus a try. But will you PLEASE GIVE ONE ARTICLE'S WORTH OF YOUR TIME TO THE LITTLE KNOWN DOCUMENTARY MICHAEL MOORE HATES AMERICA?!!? This little piece will most certainly not get the multi-billion dollar push Fahrenheit is getting, and since for that reason it might be considered the epitomie of indie film right now (no ads everywhere and what not)it should get a LITTLE notice. Just one article that is all I ask. That's been one of the great things about your website Harry. Without it I would have never heard of movies like Battle Royale amongst many others I cannot think of at this moment. I respect your political convictions but please give a smidgen of time to the other side. I'd like to close by saying that I have seen Moore's face everywhere now, in all forms of media, for the past month in preparation for this documentary. It's because of this I think we can expect him to get a light skewering from the boys of South Park just like Mel "pray for your deliverance" Gibson got in that episode "The Passion of the Jew".
Fat bastards think alike by AlwaysThere	Jun 23rd, 2004 01:11:30 AM
Damn shame
Risks by Jervis Tetch	Jun 23rd, 2004 01:19:17 AM
1. For those of of you hoping that Moore's film "converts" votes against Bush that don't exist already, thus far, he may be turning off more swing votes than he's attracting. Why: Cuz he's fat. People are BIASED against fat people. Even fat people are biased against fat people. Swing voters see Michael Moore's bulbous unshaven face and body hanging out and figure he has no self-discipline, self-control, self-respect, or self-esteem, and so his movie picks up a bad vibe on general principles. Thus, the more Moore is seen promoting his film, the better chances he offers Bush to pick up some votes. 2. Harry ends up painted with the same brush, too, cuz he's fatter than Moore. 3. Harry, in aligning himself not simply with the liberal side of the street but with Ted friggin' Rall, starts to concern Hollywood bigwigs who were feeding Harry info, stuff, and perks. Remember, Harry: they aren't liberal about making their money. If "Hanoi Harry" becomes a poison endorsement for studio movie product , the gravy train ends now. It looks like the gravy train is already ending. This site is always scooped by about four others. Photos, leads, go to other sites first. Hollywood is worried by you, Harry. GWB can't hurt you, but the wealthiest corporations of Hollywood can - and will. I'm just trying to help.
I Love These "Discussions" by Cpt. Matt	Jun 23rd, 2004 02:15:54 AM
You can almost see all the political extremists types spitting, sputter and foaming all over their keyboards, typing so furiously that they can barely spell. Its hilarious.
"He doesn by Junior Frenger	Jun 23rd, 2004 03:49:16 AM
Yeah...sure, Harold. Michael Moore proved with BFC that he's willing to manipulate and distort the facts to his own self serving needs. The irony here is that he's no better than his own arch nemesis Dubya. Kerry and Bush are both nothing but propped up puppets for special interest groups. You won't see me voting for either of these clowns.
Love to hate him or hate to love him... by pieeye	Jun 23rd, 2004 03:56:03 AM
Michael Moore is one of the most important figures to come out as a victim of the Corporate Engine that has been consuming this great country of ours. I think it has become popular to hate him, if only for his now infamous Oscar speech, but Goddammit!!! It is his right, just as it is your right to write in this talkback. Many people were opposed to the way he treated Charleton Heston. They cited that he is suffering from Alzheimers, but nonetheless, Michael Moore had the right to question him. Charleton Heston was the supreme representative of the NRA and he had to be prepared to answer those questions. Yes it is true, Michael Moore knows how to piss people off. He pisses off those who do not want to accept the truth of the matter, who dont want to accept that our goverment has had any role in the death of billions, that want to blindly deny that the "Great Ronald Regan" died with the blood of countless Innocent Guatemalans who were killed by U.S. trained death squads on his frail hands. Yes, this shit has been going on for a long time my friends. Yet here we have a man who believes so much in his country that he shows us how we can make a difference, how we can change this seemingly endless cycle,... but all people want to do is gripe about him and hate him only because they know that deep in their hearts they hate themselves for letting these things happen. Nonetheless, you ultimately have the right to make the decision... you have seen the reports coming in. Our soldiers are dying for the sins of our President. Next thing you know, you will be drafted and on your way to fight next to those who have seen enough death and destruction to drive all sense of love and compassion away. God forbid that we see your name on a wall in comemoration of that atrocity called Gulf War 2. God forbid that we suffer the same fate we have suffered over and over again. Let us hope we have learned from History, becasue if we havent then we need to get ready for what is coming to us.
Lars1775: "France won our revolution for us, we dissed them in t by Triumph poops!	Jun 23rd, 2004 03:59:07 AM
Now THAT'S the funniest shit I've read on the boards yet, right up their with the Liberal lies being said to support Michael Moore. Hope you're doing stand-up comedy somewhere Lars with knee slappers like that. France is and always has been one nation of surrendering-prone idiots. And no matter what you say about their help in the American Revolution, there's no question the USA has paid them back in spades by continually saving their asses EVERY time since then and continually bailed their butts out. Why? Because they just flat out suck militarily.
Pieeye: "Many people were opposed to the way he treated Charleto by Triumph poops!	Jun 23rd, 2004 04:06:40 AM
No, Pieeye, what pissed people off is that in BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE Moore took comments Heston made at an NRA meeting and edited them into the film as if to make it seem that he was making them RIGHT AFTER the Columbine shooting, as if Heston or any gun owners had no feelings about what had happened - when in fact Heston's speech was more than a year later. But again, what's new? Now you have Moore editing FAHRENHEIT to make it look like Bush does nothing but play golf juxtaposed against war footage. As if fucking Clinton never played golf...or worse, how about Michael Moore editing the footage of Clinton getting his dicked sucked by Monica and juxtaposing THAT with the arrivals in the country (and under Clinton's nose) of the actual 9/11 conspirators...or we can juxtapose Clinton shooting his load on Monica's blue dress with shots of the hijackers taking their piloting lessons (also done under Clinton's nose). Gee, this "documentary" filmmaking stuff is pretty fucking easy when you do it the Michael Moore way...
Nice review, shame about the talkbackers (as usual) by afraidoffans	Jun 23rd, 2004 04:41:48 AM
I can
Sad, Harry... by Icarus2004	Jun 23rd, 2004 05:39:10 AM
Propaganda is not the truth, as you so clearly explained it when talking about "WHY WE FIGHT". Now, it is really sad that you point out in your review the very facts that make Michael Moore's "Farenheit 9/11" such worthless crap, and then turn around and give it such glowing praise. If you set out to make a documentary (specially if you are sure about your being on the side of "the TRUTH", as Moore pathetically claims), then you don't need to distort the facts, or edit them to show what you want them, distorting what the specific clip and/or newscast actually had to say to suit your purpose. That is not a documentary, but a work of fiction. And a bad, derivative piece of fiction at that, due to the fact that it lacks any original thought. I normally enjoy your reviews but I truly believe you are letting your political views blind you into giving praise to this hack. President Bush has done more for this country than the likes of M. Moore will ever be able to claim for themselves. If you agree or disagree with him is cool, a matter of your own political views and upraising, I suppose. Distorting facts like Moore does in his movie, is (again, as you so clearly put it) propaganda,and badly done propaganda at that. It should never be allowed to be called a "Documentary", when the only thing it "documents" is Moore's own twisted political views. Shame on you, baby.
The Truth Is... by JWolf	Jun 23rd, 2004 06:27:21 AM
Moore's work won't change the minds of those who watch it. All it will do is galvanize the opinions of those individuals who disagree. If Mr. Moore's primary goal is to get more people to the polls, I think he will succeed by encouraging an avalanche... of Republican voters.
GAHAHAHAHAAH by Konrad	Jun 23rd, 2004 06:28:14 AM
Oh can we really trust a positive review about F911 from the same man who gave Van Helsing glowing reviews? Your reviews are irrelevant as your movie career will be Harry.
i'm not a bush fan, but..... by tazber	Jun 23rd, 2004 07:06:07 AM
come on!!! people are being decapitated by these crazy militants!!! i mean, didn't that stop like in the middle ages? Whether we should have gone in to iraq or not is a mute point now. we're there and in it up to our eyeballs. no getting out now-for better or worse. my point is, moore should have used better journalistic judgement in his film. Free speech is one of our greatest liberties, but it does carry some responsibility. noe is the time for support of our troops and providing safety for the iraqis. Moore is simply pouring gas on an already burning fire. un-necessary to the utmost.
To Mr. Fuck... by Icarus2004	Jun 23rd, 2004 07:28:21 AM
You so incredibly deluded that I frankly can't understand which reality you have been living in (or what kind of old tennis shoes have you been smoking). "Liked it, mostly 'cuz you liked the movie and you didn't have to run in circles to admit it." Liking it is not the problem, and i don't blame Harry for saying it. To each his own. Comparing Michael Moore with frank Capra, well, there's a huge stretch of the imagination. "I particularly like all the sentences with the words 'BUSH' and 'NAZI' in them. Good job, Bush is a Nazi." If I am to believe that you TRULY believe this, I would recomend you to go pick up a couple of history books and find out what "nazism" really was, and what it meant. Obviously, the descriptions you've been getting are not the real ones. Again, come back to reality. The world might be able to welcome you back. "I don't particularly agree with most things Michael Moore says, (MOSTLY ON GUN CONTROL, because Moore is rich and doesn't live in my neighborhood.)" Good of you to notice some of Moore's "sincere hypocrisy"...but let's move on... "But, he's spot on about Bush and the lying, spineless, thieving, murdering, warmongering, baby killing, cocksucking motherfucker is probably going to get elected again. Why? Because, no one cares." Wrong, Bud. He will probably be re-elected because people DO care about murdering barbarians coming to our land and commiting cold-blooded murder. Because he has actually done something to stop these slimy scumbags that have spent hundreds of years murdering each other, spent years murdering our people abroad, and have now decided to bring war to our shores. Bush didn't declare war on them without reason and on a whim; he declared war on them to keep 9/11 from happening again, and the people of the United States (other than the millionaires in Hollywood, including Moore) actually understand that...and respect it. Don't be deceived by what the media tells you these days about the feelings of this country toward Bush. They said the same about Reagan, and he won on a landslide. "No one thinks they can make a difference. Most people can't even be bothered to think bigger thoughts than their own petty bullshit." Do I detect a bit of projection here? Sorry, dude, but I know a LOT of people that KNOW they can make a difference. I count myself among them. And I believe that people like Michael Moore just hate a country I happen to love and be proud of. I choose to make a difference just by not paying for a ticket to watch this drivel. "Why is that? BECAUSE THEY'VE WON YOU IGNORANT, LAZY FUCKING MAGGOTS!!! Yes, in the end, it really DOESN'T MATTER if you vote or not. The cocksuckers have been fucking us for too long and hey, let's face it, the people of America are a GOOD FUCK and what do you do when you find a good fuck? YOU KEEP FUCKING! The cocksuckers are too used to good sex and they're not going to give it up." Mmmmmmm...even if I still think that voting DOES matter, it does seem that you have a few problems of your own. It's ok. After reading your "enlightened" words on this post, I rather you didn't vote at all. Just keep thinking that way. It will take you far. "Unfortunately most people can't wake up long enough to see the line of people waiting to get a turn in their ass to think, "Hey, this is America, I don't have to take this."" Actually, they did this already...right after 9/11. No matter how many America bashers are out there, this IS America, and we DON'T have to take this. Even now it feels damned good to say it out loud. "TOO LATE FUCKERS! It's too far gone. Anyone who has anything to say is stygmatized by a nearly STATE OWNED MEDIA and written off as a crack pot." If you have ANY inclination to think that the media (CBS, NBC, The New York Times, etc) are really "state owned" and back the government (specially the Bush White House) on everything they want, MAN!, you really have some serious issues! Either (1) You haven't read anything else since that good "Jack and Jill" book you borrowed in 1st grade, or (2) You are farther out there in La-La Land that we could have possibly imagined. Either way, go read a newspaper, for pete's sake, ANY newspaper. Maybe if you see how wrong you are on this particular point it will drive you to revisit some of your other delusions. "he police can do whatever they want. The Justice system has been completely overtaken." Are you really living in this country? You're not writing from France, are you? "Face it, people, you've all fallen asleep at the wheel and the fuckers have come in, put on nice suits and turned America into an evil empire. THAT'S RIGHT, FUCKERS! AMERICA IS IN FACT THE FUCKING BAD GUY!!!!" Oh, the old rallying "Evil-Empire" cry of the "Hate-America First" sector of the left. Hell, man. If you had not said THAT, I could have never guessed it by listening to you talk. "Why? How did this happen? Because, everyone let themselves be talked into believing they didn't matter." Speak for yourself, bud. Mmmm, to think of it, you already have. "Well, it's too late now. The damage is done. And the funny part? Now, you TRULY don't matter. Congratulations, fuckwits. Oh, you better run, I think there's some fucking reality show you may be missing. That's what's really important isn't it?" Well, if you manage to tear yourself away from those "reality shows", do come back and visit us on this planet we like to call Earth. We'll return the favor and visit you in La-La Land if we get the time after we send Kerry back to the Senate. Good luck.
Lights, is that some kind of trick question? by FluffyUnbound	Jun 23rd, 2004 07:30:29 AM
You're quite right, I announce the uselessness of discourse maybe once a day. And then come right back as soon as something else I read clicks in my head. This is because I can't help myself. How do you think I'm so sure that the excessive garrulousness of our society is an insuperable problem? Because even when I realize it I can't resist it. And by the way, depending on the mythological figure involved, I tend to naturally think of the Greek rather than the Roman name. In this instance, I just happened to think of the Greek one. Actually, the pomposity kicked in when I used the "k" version of the spelling instead of the "c" version. I hate when people do that - except when I do it too.
TAZBER: I'm not a Bush fan, but... by Icarus2004	Jun 23rd, 2004 07:33:30 AM
Very well said. Thank you.
GIVE US MORE POLITICS HARRY by bushsux	Jun 23rd, 2004 07:52:54 AM
I'm going to take the position and say that there isn't enough politics on this site. There isn't enough discussion of politics in America in general. That's what the conservatives like, for the other 90% to have their heads in the sand obsessing over movies and sports. Sure, I love movies and sports, but I also love this country. Fuck the conservatives in '04!
Did anyone else catch that episode of Sealab 2021? by Azlam Orlandu	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:08:50 AM
I swear it was Harry in that episode. -Az
Damn Harry, Moore really must be the best damn thing since Dorit by bokes	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:11:23 AM

Bush shite by ScaryJim	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:16:10 AM
I really don't understand how after all that has happened in the last 2 years that people can't have made their own mind up about Bush, I do appreciate michael moore and if his documentary works as a rallying call then good for it . I am hoping that he has misjudged the American people and that after these 2 wars (yes remember the other one in afghanistan where you didn't catch the bad guy? )everyone knows how corrupt and manipulative this Government is, I'm not even going to give facts it all speaks for itself - I cannot understand this argument that Bush is the president of America and you must support him. It is attitudes like this - thinking that one man is bigger than your own country that gives power to people like him . I, a white man in the UK am also ready to punish my leader for his role in all of this, i hope common sense prevails in both our countries. We have been manipulated by fear and tension for too long and I for one hate that Bush and Blair have actually peddled this xenophobia and got away with it.
George W. Bush HATES America by Mentok	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:17:31 AM
People say it about Moore all the time, with no proof, so I thought it was fair to say it about Dubya.
POINT/COUNTERPOINT Harry or Moore: Who has bigger poopstains? by bokes	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:18:08 AM
Now here is a true debate. At the end of today, June 23rd, I will tally the votes and announce the ummm... victor.
Bush is going to win, and there's not a damn thing you libs can by Darth Rosenberg	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:45:15 AM
I really relish all the Bush bashing you liberal, lardasses throw his way. The bottom line is conservative people like me, with money and ambition, are the ones that get off of our asses and vote. You liberals can talk a good game, but when it comes to writing a check, or having your mom drive you to your voting precinct, your will evaporates. Thanks for being who you are, and ensuring people like me will be in power for years to come.
This Mike Moore fan would like to give a heart-felt THANK YOU to by TallScott	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:45:56 AM
We could not have done it without ya! Honestly if it was not fo all of the ranting and raving, website making and foaming mouth attention that this movie as gotten I really doubt that it would have gotten the near one thousand theaters to Book it! Heck Its already sold out in NYC and Philly! If it was not for you guys Disney MIGHT would still have the rights to it and it would have not been released this week! There is nothing like showing the butt ugly in the right wing that will make people flock to the left like they are to Moore's film. Every time liar O'Reilly will start by saying " Im an Indipendant...Then insert trashing of the left and/or Moore here " Thats just another Cha-CHING to a cash register in a theater somewhere! ( He did wonders for Al Franken! )So Keep on Keeping on! Get as ugly as you wanna be! Call Moore fat even though im SURE your such a stud sitting there at the keyboard with your trusty bag of free-tos handy and attack the man and not the issues like a good little republican. Call your fellow Americans Traitors for doing nothing but speaking out even though you people did not have a problem with it when Clinton was Pres. Mmmm Dont your own medcine taste good?.. Ill bet it does! And help keep that press bought and paid for! If the press had been asking REAL questions then Moore would not have needed to make the film that is giving you people fits! Lord knows the more the press climbs up the GOP ass then the more people like bad ol Mike Moore will speak out! ( Hey did you know that GW's Brother Neil is now on Chinas payroll and has a fondness for Asian hookers? Or how about hottie Jeri Ryans Republican husband and the group sex? Ill Bet if they were Democrats you would Know! Huh? ) Oh and I pray to god that some of you brownshirts will be there at the theater to start shit cuase I will call every local news channel with my trusty cell phone to help give the film MORE free publicty! Thanks Agian! Keep showing the ugly and hatefull cause it will be your downfall!
Ah, the Jack Ryan story. by FluffyUnbound	Jun 23rd, 2004 08:54:14 AM
So apparently this guy is going to lose shot at a Senate seat because he used to like to take Jeri to strip clubs and make her blow him while he watched the strippers. This raises an interesting question that only Jack can answer: WAS IT WORTH IT? I would have to guess "yes", but I would like to hear HIS answer.
Tallscott, you libs are going down in November. I'll look for yo by Triumph poops!	Jun 23rd, 2004 09:04:02 AM
The one person who got it the MOST right of late in this now long, long Talkback is JWOLF who wrote "If Mr. Moore's primary goal is to get more people to the polls, I think he will succeed by encouraging an avalanche... of Republican voters." He's dead-on right. Moore's psychotic rantings and spoiled sport tantrums and boorish behavior and his total lack of truthfullness AND the fact that he's a fat ugly bastard that people would just assume shit on will only help to mobilize the right in even larger numbers AND help push more and more moderates towards Bush as they whisper under their breath, "What the fuck is WRONG with the Left? They're raving lunatics! This isn't about an election anymore, they're just a party of hate now. All because they STILL can't accept they LOST back in 2000. Who the hell could EVER trust them to run the country? They're like fucking babies." And you know what? You pathetic losers on the Left ARE fucking whiny babies. Can't wait to hear your whining for ANOTHER 4 years...
"The study of propaganda has been a part of my life as far back by K0NY	Jun 23rd, 2004 09:06:17 AM
I love that every movie review penned by Harry involves the revelation that the film's subject matter has been one of his passions since birth. Perhaps instead of wasting money on whacking Moore, who's too busy listening to the din of his own voice to notice the real issues, we should kick in some bucks to get Harry serious councelling. It could help him with the "MAN IN RUBBER SUIT!" issues and all the others that must have spawned in a childhood full of Hentai and Propaganda viewing.
A vote for dubya IS a character flaw... by willowx1013	Jun 23rd, 2004 09:26:47 AM
You have to be brain dead if you think that Bush has done even a half decent job as president. Voting that ass out of the whitehouse will benefit us all, security-wise and financially. Bush doesn't care about us, the bottom 3/4 of the country, he only cares about him and all of HIS friends getting rich off of us. I'm not endorsing Kerry but I am going to give him my vote because Bush is the WORST president this country has ever seen. As far as the film goes, haven't seen but am dying too. In my opinion it sounds like this is just counter-propoganda: counter to the usual shit we're told by the government and the scared shitless conservative media. Soon, when that texas grown dope is sent packing(and he will be), it will be us the Liberals who will saying to you: "If you don't like this country, you can get the hell out!" because America is a Liberal country at it's core.
propoganda thats all this is by ZO	Jun 23rd, 2004 09:57:38 AM
and should have no place here thanks for ur bizarro views harry
Americans!! Your fucking rights are being taken away!!!!! by pieeye	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:03:06 AM
Did someone shoot you all with a dumbass gun??!! For the love of God!!! Unbeknownst to many of you ranting fuckers, The U.S. Senate approved an amendment that increases the fine for a single indecency incident to a maximum of $3 million a DAY!! Check it out right here: http://www.fmqb.com/Article.as p?id=29015 Why did you not know about this?? Because Senator Brownback succeeded it having this amendment attached to a $447 Billion Defense Department Funding Bill! It happened right under your nose, and none of you heard about it because it was hidden and hardly any papers covered it. Think about what this means for you...do you want to revert back to the constipated 50's? Listening to Gee Wiz! and Aw Golly Gosh! bullshit to keep the truth from your virgin ears!!!??? Wake up America!!! For the sake of all that is right and true. Howard Stern has declared that as soon as Bush signs this bill, his show will be over and off the air!!! Think about what this means about your freedom of speech. This website could be shut down, you wont have a venue to spue your beliefs about movies or politics or whatever, and mark my words that is exactly what we are in for!!! This is a tragic time for all Americans at home and Abroad!
Michael Moore Lies. Period. by doctordebug	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:03:35 AM
Michael Moore lies. The left knows it, they just don't care because his lies stroke their ideology. Its the political equivalent of autoerotic asphyxiation... the only problem is they are going to take the whole country with them if we are not careful. I think that the radical left in this country is actually worse than the German rank and file during WWII - at least the german people had the faint excuse that they had no news source to let them know the misdeeds of the Nazis. The far left in this country know full well that the asault on GWB and the right in general is foisted on a whore's bed of lies - but the ends justify the means, right? For the record, here is what that evil GWB has done to this country: 1) After the 9/11 attack immolated more than 3,000 people and caused billions of dollars of damages, his administration moved quickly to prevent a stock market meltdown which could well have led to another global depression. His calm public handling of the crisis was counterpointed beautifully by the firm private hand he used to convince the major trading houses not to dump stock. As a result of this, and his subsequent tax cuts, we have the most robust economy since his Dad was in office, and it has not hit the top of the curve yet. 2) The day of the attack, he took the unprecendented (and, at the time, controversial) step of shutting down the airports. This stopped the next planned wave of attacks and saved thousands of people's lives. 3) We quickly attacked Afghanistan, destroying most of Al Qaeda's support structure and leadership. 4) We then attacked Iraq, eliminating the regime that was the most likely to give the remaining Al Qaeda organization a home and support. We knew from the Russians that Iraq was already planning terrorist attacks on America and its interests abroad, the ready-made fanatics remaining from Al Qaeda (with which Iraq already had ties) would have been too good for them to pass up. If Buch had done nothing more than these three things, I would consider his presidency to be an incredible success. I did not even include the fact that he stopped the practice of free intern blowjobs in the oval office, the fact that he has restored the dignity of the Oval Office is evident to anyone who seriously looks. I sum up with a conversation I had with an 18 year old friend of my son who had anti-Bush stickers all over his car. I pressed him on why he hated Bush, and he hemmed and hawed for awhile about the war, but gave no real answers. Finally, he blurted out "Well he's just like my dad". And there you have the basis for the left's hatred of Bush... they cannot stand the idea of anyone taking a higher ground and telling them what is right and what is wrong.
Question to the Republican Conservative Bush Fox supporters... by zsasz	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:08:53 AM
Why is it alright for Conservative pundits with huge media outlets ala Hannity/O'Reiley/Limbaugh to tell us the news with their own political spins on it but its not alright for Michael Moore to do so? Both sides lie, manipulate the truth and flat out forget to tell news stories so it puts there position in a better light...why is't there a call from the Bushites to have 100% accuracy in regards to reporting the news?
IM SICK OF LIFE by SIR-SLEDGE450	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:09:12 AM
It now seems like every day im being force fed anti-bush crap by this obese,ginger prick...and this review just adds to things. I once respected moore,i thought he was a voice that stood out in a countryc ran by idiots. But now,im just plain bored of al this.BORED.BORED.BORED.Bitchin g like mad at each other,over political views that in the end dont matter.Moore is basically a showman, who,although we all hate him,will undoubtedly get bums in seats.Which is very very sad.
Propaganda definition by TOHO inc.	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:13:25 AM
"Most documentaries, especially the best ones, have an opinion and argue for it. Even those that pretend to be objective reflect the filmmaker's point of view. Moviegoers should observe the bias, take it into account and decide if the film supports it or not." Roger Ebert Unless the Democratic Party is paying for this it's not Propaganda as I believe your inference is... It DOES qualify as wartime propaganda... The previous wartime prop in the review fits in Both... In otherwords: I don't (as far as I know) see that Moore is a tool of the Democrats... I do see that he shares much of the same opinions (kind of like Ann Coulter) and is an independent (use this word to irritate) "thinker" and "filmmaker" so I cut him way more slack. It's nice that the Rep. PR machine has to be party organized and the Dem effort is largely independent and thus disorganized. This movie I understand slams Gore right at the beginning. Look forward to it. EBERT: http://www.suntimes.com/output /eb-feature/cst-ftr-moore18.ht ml The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause. Material disseminated by the advocates or opponents of a doctrine or cause: wartime propaganda.
propeganda by ScaryJim	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:14:19 AM
FFS i'd rather see u Bush lovers creaming yourselves at the wonder of his supremeness than hear another lamo say it's just propeganda ' and we should all get back to talking about fucking spiderman 2 and it's relative benefits to society and not bring politics into a discussion, I spit in the face of any lamer that just wants to have a nice little discussion about how crap alien vs predator will be and sit on the fence about something that has meaning. I'm certainly not a bush fan but ffs stand up and be counted for whatever u believe in (even though ur wrong :0)) if u don't want to talk politics why be in a forum about a political film ? now sod of back to Batman begins where u belong!
you even read that? should have said NOT Propaganda by TOHO inc.	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:16:23 AM
hmmm.
mr fuck by ScaryJim	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:20:46 AM
Mr fuck for president plz
Triumph Poops! So?! by pieeye	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:23:28 AM
(By the way, if you are a fan of truimph the insult comic dog,read my last post and kiss his dog ass goodbye!) So Triumph Poops, I think that what you are frightened of is that someone is actually making movies that have opinions that differ from your beliefs. I dont claim to believe everything Moore says because any intelligent person would make their own judgements about what they see or read. I was raised around guns, I own a couple of guns too. Michael Moore's film did not change my mind about owning Guns, but it did help me understand to what extent we abuse guns in this country. You cannot retort with telling me that Moore lies , because quite frankly Bush does the same thing only on his end it actually affects us as a nation. To the one who said that Bush is just a figure head. You are absolutely wrong!!! Bush has the power to sign bills that can affect us emmediately!! and with the republicans running the senate, we can all be sure that another four years will turn this country into a dumb and mute country who survives solely on fast food and reality shows!
toho by ScaryJim	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:24:53 AM
That wasn't aimed at u i was slamming people saying Harry shouldn't have brought politics into it, i wrote before i saw ur post up there.
The TRVTH About F9/11... by BiffBolt	Jun 23rd, 2004 10:30:37 AM
...or something like that. All of you promoting the 'Truth About Bowling' webpage, Hitchens' review et al are as dim as the most brainless Moore promotors here. You are not going

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FAHRENHEIT 9/11 review