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AICN COMICS! @$$Holes Review SUPERMAN/BATMAN, FANTASTIC FOUR, ABADAZAD, RUNAWAYS, and Vroom

Yeah, that FF reveal was pretty predictable, wasn't it? by SpyGuy	Mar 24th, 2004 08:38:37 AM
When "Hereafter" began, I thought to myself, "Hey, wouldn't it be cool if the FF bumped into Jack Kirby while strolling through Heaven?" In fact, I think I mentioned this in the last FF talkback. The natural jump from there, of course, was to think about ANIMAL MAN #26 and realize that God was going to be depicted as Jack Kirby. Why? Because frankly there wasn't much of a choice for Mark Waid. Oh, he could've depicted God as some bodiless spirit or energy form, but the Jack Kirby approach...That automatically deflects any kind of potential controversy. I mean, what comic fan is going to be pissed that Jack Kirby is God, given his status as one of the all-time comic book greats? Plus, it's very sweet and sentimental, and a nice way to pay tribute to Jack. In the process, though, it would have been nice if Waid had given Grant Morrison credit as well...
JLA/Avengers #4.... by Diello	Mar 24th, 2004 08:48:48 AM
Anyone have any idea when it's finally supposed to come out?
JLA/Avengers Out Next week by holidill	Mar 24th, 2004 08:52:21 AM
I saw a copy of it in DC's Sneak Peak. It will be out next week. One of the best storytelling arcs in any comics was Animal Man 1-26. I thought the whole story was fantastic. Kudos to Grant Morrisson. Actually I think it was Grant Morrisson's first writing I have ever read.
"Ennis's PREACHER... that book's take on religion was superior t by Daddylonghead	Mar 24th, 2004 09:02:20 AM
Ouch, ouch, ouch. The worst thing is, you're right, and I say that as someone who thinks PREACHER (with the exception of the "sex detectives" concept, which I acknowledge to be twisted genius) is a bunch of unconvincing, pointless chest-pounding crap. Just say the words, though: Sex detectives. Rolls off the tongue. Sex detectives. Sex detectives. In other news, I more or less agree with Socko's conclusions: Sim's insanity--and make no mistake, that's what it is; the John Doe journals is a wonderfully apt comparison-- fatally sabotaged what should have been the greatest achievement in comics.
Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammo by Bashful Bry	Mar 24th, 2004 09:08:24 AM
Look, I love the hell outta Preacher, but to say it reveals any real "take on religion" is kind of... lame. It comments on loyalty, betrayal, forgiveness, and much of the human condition that TOUCHES on religion, yes, but the character of Ennis' "God" is (deliberately, I think, but maybe not) a joke. It's the least sophisticated thing about the comic, and that's fine, but it hardly makes him C.S. Lewis. Sim, on the other hand, while espousing all kinds of crazy ideas, is (y'know) espousing IDEAS! Original, wild ideas... that really aren't so hateful. Except for the hateful bits.
Greatest storytelling achievement in comics? by Daddylonghead	Mar 24th, 2004 09:10:25 AM
Easy: Jaime Hernandez' ongoing Hoppers saga (Sorry, Beto). Even though the new Love & Rockets isn't (yet) as good as the best of the old, it's still better than just about anything out there. Xaime's the total package: Art to die for... Ink lines so clean you could cut yourself on them, Jesus... an uncanny grasp of psychology, a sly sense of humor, a genuine love for women & men, a wide-ranging grasp of social strata, from the insanely rich to the train-hopping 'bos... Xaime's achievement is untouchable on just about every level, and that's the stone cold bottom line. His "Whoa Nelly!" 3-part series is also the greatest 3-part series acheievement in comics. Sorry to ride the guy's jock, but I'm only telling it like it is.
So the Fantastic Four met their Creator. by rev_skarekroe	Mar 24th, 2004 09:57:48 AM
What a wonderfully original idea! I've never seen that before. Except in "Animal Man". And "Cerebus". And "Ambush Bug". And old issues of "Fantastic Four" from the '60's. Oh, bugger it all, it's a stupid, cliche! sk
Cerebus by rev_skarekroe	Mar 24th, 2004 10:16:52 AM
"Guys" - This book is going to look REALLY dated to future readers. Many of the analogues presented are other self-publishers, some of whom (like Rick Veitch) are no longer in business. Also, the Marty Feldman character is actually an analogue of an analogue, since Sim based him on a character from the comic "Starchild". As for the other books, eh. They're really for completists (like me) only. sk
greatest achievement in storytelling..? by gamyharns	Mar 24th, 2004 10:51:14 AM
CRISIS. Peter David on HULK. Claremont /Byrne and later just Claremont on X-MEN. Alan Moore on Swamp Thing. I like all these . hard to pick just one.
what about.... by gamyharns	Mar 24th, 2004 10:58:05 AM
Geoff Johns making JSA what it is today? Kevin Smith lighting the fire back under DD and GREEN ARROW? lots of things to consider...time spent (CEREBUS),impact on industry(DARK KNIGHT), era(S.H.I.E.L.D.) etc........
I flipped through issue 300 of Cerbus - pretty cool by Tall_Boy	Mar 24th, 2004 11:00:33 AM
I didn't know what the hell was going on aside from that he's supposed to die. So that last few pages when he's in heaven screaming angrily "GODDDDDDD!!!" while being pulled into the light was one of the cooler things I've seen in awhile.
I think the greatest storytelling run is: by walnutr113	Mar 24th, 2004 06:04:03 PM

Damn I entered when I should have tabbed by walnutr113	Mar 24th, 2004 06:07:45 PM
Lee and Kirbys entire FF run. I mean come on its hard to imagine the concept of the Marvel Universe if it werent for this fondation, flagship (FF) series. You got guest appearences and first appearences and reappearences of Doc Doom, the Hulk, Spidey, X Men, Namor, Averngers, Inhumans, Adam Warlock, Daredevil, the Negative Zone, Unstable Molocules, and (oh crap almost forgot) Galactus and the Silver Surfer. Comics at their finest: The kids and adults can enjoy them
Hmm by BillEmic	Mar 24th, 2004 06:15:17 PM
What about THE AGE OF APOCALYPSE? C'mon, that has to go down as one of the best comic runs of all time. No? Oh...well...yeah, Watchmen is pretty darn good.
Right on, Cormorant by Homer Sexual	Mar 24th, 2004 06:28:00 PM
About the final Morrison New X-Men. It was very, very disappointing after a run that I thoroughly enjoyed (with exception of Assault on Weapon X). Also, I (A huge fan of Powers) quit buying Daredevil last month because, like you said, I haven't enjoyed it in a long time. So I'm going to pick up Runaways today on your recommendation. Hopefully it will be better than the Ostrander Aquaman fill-in issues, which were less than I was led to believe.
Its been a long time, boys... by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 24th, 2004 06:40:29 PM
Good to see at least two good comics reviewed for once. Walking Dead = Great. Same with Runaways. Really, I'm enjoying the hell out Fables currently. You drones should review that. For my money, though, no one, NO ONE beats Bendis and Morrison, those two are the best writers comics have to offer. And I'm happy to report the Avengers are still lame for BBQing in the superhero outfits.
Daredevil by Nincumpoop	Mar 24th, 2004 06:50:53 PM
I will admit I do not enjoy the copy machine that Maleev uses for his art, but his art is still very suited for the dark tone of the book that I enjoy. I believe that DD is the best book out and you guys constantly bash it. Nobody has done as much with a character as Bendis has with DD, His writing is continually edgy and dialog is superb. Bendis is easily the most gifted writer in comic books to day. He single handedly got me into reading comics again. Now I don't mind a different point of veiw every now and again, but I still have a hard time reading your reviews of DD, for they seem to be written by 1: A person who doesn't seem to like Marvel, 2: A person who can't appreciate the complicated character of Daredevil, and 3: A Bendis hater. Why have this same review time after time, come to think of it why do I keep reading it. "Nevertheless make mine Marvel"
Daredevil by Nincumpoop	Mar 24th, 2004 06:52:12 PM
I will admit I do not enjoy the copy machine that Maleev uses for his art, but his art is still very suited for the dark tone of the book that I enjoy. I believe that DD is the best book out and you guys constantly bash it. Nobody has done as much with a character as Bendis has with DD, His writing is continually edgy and dialog is superb. Bendis is easily the most gifted writer in comic books to day. He single handedly got me into reading comics again. Now I don't mind a different point of veiw every now and again, but I still have a hard time reading your reviews of DD, for they seem to be written by 1: A person who doesn't seem to like Marvel, 2: A person who can't appreciate the complicated character of Daredevil, and 3: A Bendis hater. Why have this same review time after time, come to think of it why do I keep reading it. "Nevertheless make mine Marvel"
Daredevil by Nincumpoop	Mar 24th, 2004 06:52:54 PM
I will admit I do not enjoy the copy machine that Maleev uses for his art, but his art is still very suited for the dark tone of the book that I enjoy. I believe that DD is the best book out and you guys constantly bash it. Nobody has done as much with a character as Bendis has with DD, His writing is continually edgy and dialog is superb. Bendis is easily the most gifted writer in comic books to day. He single handedly got me into reading comics again. Now I don't mind a different point of veiw every now and again, but I still have a hard time reading your reviews of DD, for they seem to be written by 1: A person who doesn't seem to like Marvel, 2: A person who can't appreciate the complicated character of Daredevil, and 3: A Bendis hater. Why have this same review time after time, come to think of it why do I keep reading it. Nevertheless, "Make mine Marvel"
Bendis Rules! Coromant Drools! by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 24th, 2004 07:01:23 PM
I've said it before and I'll say it again. ITs only due to Bendis that I got into Spiderman and Daredevil. Bendis does best what comics need: Good ideas meeting strong characters. All you old ass, whiny "I wish Image's die cut glory days were back so I could salivate over the big boobies and men in tight pants hitting each other" need to go find those boring status quo books and don't read Bendis. He's just too good for you.
It's not that we like Image, Qwerty. by SleazyG.	Mar 24th, 2004 07:56:16 PM
And I like Bendis, honestly. I loved ALIAS and I'm reading THE PULSE. But Daredevil always has been, and always should be, an exciting book. The guy's a world-class gymnast and hand-to-hand combatant. That should mean some kick-ass panels of him swinging, leaping, punching, flipping, kicking...instead we get issue after issue of talk, talk, talk. I like talking. I like Bendis' dialogue. But he's a Daredevil, not The Conversationalist. Shit, we're supposed to believe this guy singlehandedly cleaned up Hell's Kitchen, but we don't get to see any of it. We just hear about it. "Awww, man, you shoulda seen it! Then he did this and this and this..." Hey, how about this? IT'S A COMIC BOOK. We COULDA seen it, if only they'd SHOWED it to us. You can do anything in a comic book, and in superhero comics you should. DD shouldn't be Image-level fluff, but there should be some adventure and danger, not just people talking each other to sleep. I'm not saying it should all be pointless punch'n'kick, but it shouldn't be all talk, either. It's a balance we're looking for. I shudder to think how many word balloons we're gonna end up with on a team title like AVENGERS, but then again Bendis has done pretty well on ULTIMATE X-MEN, so I'm willing to give it a shot. I think what a lot of talkbackers are missing is that we've said over and over we like Bendis, and we like Marvel, and we like DD. It's just that his writing doesn't quite seem to be suited to DD.
Bug to Nincompoop by Ambush Bug	Mar 24th, 2004 08:18:15 PM
Well, NCP, since you took the time to write out your likes and dislikes concerning DD in an intelligent and well-supported manner, I'll retort with a semi-cohesive and partially intelligent response and I'll try to be as impartial as possible. Those of you who think that there's a vast consiracy at @-hole HQ against comicbookdom's present god on high, Bendis, should calm down a bit. There are those of us @$$holes who do think that the guy is overrated. There are those of us who think he can do no wrong. There are also those of us who realize the guy for his exceptional writing talents, but can look past all of that and criticize his work; citing negative AND positive aspects. That's kind of our job. Just because we are a bit more passionate about it in our reviews, doesn't mean that we are not looking at the work objectively. We're @$$holes. Our reviews are passionate and straight from the heart. It's what we do. I've written two reviews that I would categorize as commentaries on Bendis' slow pacing and inaction tales (the Blah, Blah and Zzzzz Reviews). I know, to a lot of people, if a view is given, extreme characteristics are attrubuted to the reviewer (take a look at Querty's inane claim that because Corm disliked a Bendis issue, he must yearn for the days of Image's return to glory). Open your minds a bit folks. I recognize that Bendis is an excellent writer. He is probably the best writer of dialog out there today. But the guy has problems with pacing and needs an editor badly. Being the star-fuckers that they are, Marvel would rather let Bendis crap ad nauseum on the page than actually do the editorial work to reign him in and tell a tight story. That's bad editing. The thing is, that's the opposite of what Marvel wants. Bendis is probably being pressured by the higher ups at Marvel to stretch out his stories in order to sell more issues and the eventual meaty trade (other creators in the industry have admitted to Marvel's influence in stretching out their stories). That's good marketing, but still pretty shitty to us fans. OR Bendis may be stretching out his own stories in order to get a fatter paycheck if he is being paid by the issue. That's all well and good for the guy getting the check, but once again, the fans get the shaft. Either way, I can't blame Marvel or Bendis for doing this since they aren't doing this for shits and giggles but for a profit, but as a reader, I'm feeling gypped. And I'm calling them on it. Now, Nincompoop, you say "Nobody has done as much with a character as Bendis has with DD." And I call bullshit on that. Try a little known guy named Frank Miller who wrote the best stuff in his career with DD. Try Ann Nicocienti(sp?) who took over after Miller left and kept the momentum running high. These two creators did just as much, if not more, with the character. NOw, if you're talking about within the last five years, you may have a point. The difference between Bendis and Miller/Nicocienti is that the latter never forgot about Daredevil. Those writer put Matt through holy hell and still managed to throw in a bit of action here and there. GOd forbid, I don't want an issue long slugfest. All I'd like would be for Matt to suit up and be the hero he was for thirty years prior to Bendis' belief that the spandex aspect of the character wasn't interesting. Corm is right. The interrogation scene was good the first two times I read it, but after four of them, I'm wondering if Bendis' One Trick Pony may be ready for the glue truck. And then NCP, you say "Now I don't mind a different point of veiw every now and again, but I still have a hard time reading your reviews of DD, for they seem to be written by 1: A person who doesn't seem to like Marvel," Not true. I've gone on the record as stating that Fantastic Four, Runaways, 1602, and Supreme Power are easily some of the best comics out there today. There's that extreme set of viewpoints being applied again. Open you mind. Just because we don't like your baby, doesn't mean we hate babies. "2: A person who can't appreciate the complicated character of Daredevil" Not true again. DD has always been complicated. I appreciated him through Miller and Nicocenti and can appreciate what Bendis is trying to do, but I'm not blinded to his failings in that task. If you read about every third DD issue, you might see something happen. Unfortunately, there are two issues in between and these issues are like the one we got last week. Filler. Drawn out. And useless. It doesn't have to be all action, but some action should be nice. An issue like the last month's with Matt fighting the Yakuza should not be the break in the norm. A quiet issue should. Somewhere along the line, this changed and comics are suffering for it. Sorry for the rant, but you Bendis folks like that sort of thing, don't you.
Daredevil by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 24th, 2004 08:28:54 PM
I'm surprised that I have to remind you that Daredevil is more than a two fisted acrobat, he's also a Lawyer. The duality of the vigilante and the lawyer is what drives this book and sometimes that means more talking than punching. And frankly I find shrewd manipulations and crafty interactions just as, if not more, exciting than the fights. You see, the pictures don't move. At all. So when I'm reading a comic I breeze through the fight scenes. But the dialogue, the interactions, the subtle changes in the pictures of the characters? There is more story there than any fight scene ever. Also Bendis has obviously realized something that is usually avoided by most writers on a long term continuity comic (mostly due to ever switching creative teams) and that is: How long can this moron in tights keep beating up muggers before at best it becomes futile and at worst he becomes just as bad the evil he stalks. Daredevil and Bendis are doing what most net nerd comic tards whine and moan that they want to have happen: The Hero is taking active steps to change things. Good or Bad he is taking steps. Punch outs on rooftops and alleys, while occasionally fun, accomplish nothing. Taking shadow control of a crime ridden neighborhood allowing it to grow and florish? Thats an accomplishment. But doing this may lead to the one thing comic fans really dread besides school dances: Daredevil being no longer needed. Retiring. What the hero always claims to want, regardless of what their very apparent psyches say. Imagine that. Daredevil truly giving up the cowl, his job done, his neighborhood safe. Horrifying, simply horrifying. Imagine that: closure. Closure to a comic book tale. Jesus Christ, what an earth shattering concept. An end. Perhaps comic geeks fear it so much because it could symbolize an end to their eternal childhood, as well. Or maybe I'm reading too much into it and the real answer is much more simple. You jerks have terrible taste... still.
Querty, Querty, Querty... by Ambush Bug	Mar 24th, 2004 08:40:20 PM
Do you actually believe that is going to happen? That DD will hang up the tights and after Bendis gets bored with the title, the book will cease to be? C'mon. This is comics. Who is Bendis trying to fool? There will always be a Daredevil because DD sells. End of story. Any "difinitive" DD story that Bendis churns out isn't going to be the end of the story once he leaves. DD will be around when Bendis is nothing more than a footnote in comics history. Was anyone but Querty actually buying into the notion that Matt gave has given this up for good? Are Bendis fans that naive?
According to international copyright law, the FF's sole creator by FrankDrebin	Mar 24th, 2004 08:46:22 PM
...which was the reason for Jolly Jack leaving Marvel (for a time), and decades of legal injustice. But, anyway, FF #511 ends with "To Be Continued". I'm guessing that probably just refers to the series as a whole, and not this particular storyline.
Ambush Bug, Ambush Bug, Ambush Bug by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 24th, 2004 09:04:32 PM
I believe Daredevil will be allowed closure and give up his cowl as much as I believe Jean Grey is dead. I understand how it works. When Bendis is gone, a new creator will come on board promising a "bold new direction" which will really just amount to the opposite focus from the last team, throw out all previous continuity, most likely including the return of Karen Page and who cares whatelse. Of course he won't? Why? The fundamental flaw of comics. They just keep going and going and going and going. You could read the best, smartest, most compelling, most action packed arc ever and then when its over shit just starts back up again. No closure. Thats why I advocate the dropping of the pamphlet and going to Trade length. A yearly, bi-yearly graphic novel. A self contained story with a beginning and an end that doesn't have to time to the previous 400 million issues. All, I'm saying is status quo is boring, lame and over done. At least Bendis is going some where else. Did you really want to read a rehash of Frank holy, holy, holy bullshit? I don't. I read it and liked it the first time.
all this stuff by sideshowbob	Mar 24th, 2004 10:23:19 PM
Sweet to see Ann Nocenti/ John Romita Jr's run on Daredevil mentioned here, just when I was thinking of my favorite storytelling runs. Is it the best ever? Nope. Not even the best Daredevil. But for me it was the right team, right book, right time in my life. Great stuff. Course I also like Bendis's DD. I like letting the plot simmer here, rather than boil. I agree he could use an editor, and has gone back to the interregation well too many times (hysterical that he even snuck it into "Secret Wars"!) That said, I'm probably the only person here who hates his work on Ultimate Spider Man--where that style doesn't do it for me. Ambush Bug, I like your work, man, but your "Blah, Blah" and "Zzzz" reviews are extreme reviews, and that's why you get an extreme reaction. I am in the same boat as Nincompoop, where I stopped buying cominc books for a while in the 90s because the quality got so atrocious. And Bendis is one of the writers (along with Morrison & Milligan) that brought me back into the fold. Of course, now that I'm back, I've discovered better stuff than Bendis...like Runaways. Now THAT is comic book storytelling. A bit heavy on the 1 and 2 page panels, but a plot that moves, characters that feel real, and lots of twists and turns that serve the story, not a story that serves the twist and turns (if that makes sense). Plus, it's the only book my wife looks forward to more than me, so in a small way it's improved my marraige. Nuff said.
Bug to sideshowbob by Ambush Bug	Mar 24th, 2004 10:55:13 PM
Thanks for the kind words. Sure, the ZZZ and the Blah, Blah's are extreme. I don't mind an extreme reaction. Better than no reaction at all. Ann Nicocenti's DD is near and to my heart too. Loved the DD goes to hell stuff. Loved Bullett, SHotgun, Typhoid Mary stuff. Loved the showdown with Blob and Pyro stuff. Nicocenti wasn't the deepest writer, but she had the mammoth task of following Miller and she proved she had what it took to keep the book entertaining. It was the right team, right book, right time for me too. I'm looking forward to reviewing Nicocenti's new BATMAN special. Maybe in the review, I'll spell her name right.
I didn't want to like SUPERMAN/BATMAN #8...but I did. by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 12:59:09 AM
Loeb's Silver Age leg-humpery gets my goat sometimes, but he can still push my "neat!" buttons. Batman scuba diving for Kryptonite meteorites is cool. Naked Supergirl is cool (I need to look up those translations). Turner's shiny art at least has the semblance of cool in its slickness, even if the guy's line quality is shaky and blobby (see also Todd McFarlane). And the scene where Batman admits there's a job for Superman about two second before the shit hits the fan...DAMN cool. Of course, I was having a pretty good time with Loeb's first story arc until Luthor inexplicaply went super-nutso and a Composite Superman/Batman giant robot punched a meteor. Village Idiot's right as rain about the overlapping narratives undermining the story, but for now, I'm proceeding on this arc with caution. It opened kinda...neat.
Uh, hello? Little love for STAN LEE here? by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 01:06:29 AM
I've mostly lost interest in Waid's FF, but I read this latest issue - it was pretty good. It was heartfelt. It did have a powerhouse emotional last panel. But I couldn't help but feel that Stan Lee got snubbed what with Jack Kirby being God. Sure, Waid threw him a bone - had Jack talking to Stan on the phone like they were co-rulers of the universe...but who was the guy we actually SAW? Who was the guy INTERRACTING with our heroes? Kirby. And, my friends, you'll find no bigger fan of Kirby than myself, but I think Stan got a little snubbed there. Both guys were integral to the FF equation, and honestly, to pick one over the other as the "core" creator just seems...well...arbitrary.
I wanted to like Supes/Bats, but I hate it. by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 01:17:00 AM
Really. This book just stinks, top to bottom. Stupid stories, weak-as-hell dialogue, heavy-handed dueling internal monologues, lousy ideas like a teenage kid from Japan to replace a character pointlessly killed off by Loeb in his lousy BATMAN run last year...and that's not counting the fourth or fifth "new" Supergirl introduced in the last half-dozen years. I've been buying it because these stories were supposed to have major ramifications on the DCU. Unfortunately, they're all majorly crappy. I'm done with this shit. I usually give a title six issues. I gave it eight, and I hate myself for it.
I'd love to be shockingly original and obscure in picking a grea by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 01:19:19 AM
The thematic depth, the humanity of the characters, the utterly sublime interaction of all disparate storylines, the disclipline and power of the nine-panel-grid, Dave Gibbons' ability to draw anything with conviction, the use of supportive text pages, the epigraphs, the sheer length of the story (12 issues - no padding)...it's just the best there is, period.
Daredevil yet again! by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 01:23:33 AM
Glad to hear I'm not alone in liking, even loving the current DD, esp. the latest issue. I was actually gonna tell Ambush Bug to open his mind concerning Bendis' run, but apparently he wants me to open my mind too. Open it to dumbed down punch, kick, punch "world-class gymnast" stuff? As Matt Murdoch said to Luke Cage "If you wanna keep punching drug dealers in the face at basketball courts, go ahead..." Matt's decision regarding running Hell's Kitchen and everything else that has happened recently in the book has shown him (and Bendis I believe) to be a true Daredevil if you'll excuse the pun. And you know what? The concept of the man (or woman) behind the mask or cowl being more interesting than the actual hero is an essentially Marvel one. Isn't that what made (and continues to make!) Marvel so freaking grand? I'm not saying I never wanna see DD suit up again...but I am not about to complain when the book is this good. The scene where Milla describes how a blind person feels someone's face to recognize them...and how Matt's father's face was shattered by that bullet... THAT is a reason why Bendis does a great job. He can ellicit powerful emotions within me the reader even when I've heard that origin story a million times. And the last panel of Matt crying...that to me was where we found out that Matt had all these emotional walls and posturing...to convince himself that he WAS the man without fear. And that was where somebody as simple as Ben Urich broke through all of them to whats at the core of Matt. I grieved with him.
So...did anyone like that last arc of Morrison's NEW X-MEN? An by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 01:28:37 AM
It reeked of acid and an ego-stroke for Morrison what with starring roles for all of HIS characters at the expense of the characters fans actually give a crap about. Or am I wrong? Was anyone jonesed for the return of Cassandra Nova, for the son (or was it grandson?) of Beak, and for some forgettable Brit guy and his pet Sentinel? Frick, what a depressingly convoluted resolution to an oft-terrific run. Morrison lovers, can you convince me of its greatness? Tell me or be exiled to the Black Bug Room.
Morrison New X Men by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 01:36:09 AM
Yeah I was waiting and waiting for the run to be all epic and tie everything together...you know the U Men and Cassandra and Xorn and Pheonix and everything...and I have to admit the Xorn turning out to be Magneto thing and subsequent Magneto freaking the fuck out stuff was good...but 150 years in the future?! WTF is right. Ooh! As an added bonus we get freaking Marc Silvestri!! I really want all male characters to look like Ripclaw and all females to look like LIEFIELD drew them. gah. Want a great Morrison story? READ THE FILTH. Good stuff...still wrapping my head around it.
DD plot holes by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 01:46:04 AM
Anyone remember those lawsuits? Now that Matt's exposed himself, doesn't he owe people some apologies? And a shitload of money? How many people would write him off entirely since he's lied his entire life to them? I'd like to point out, for all of you who think this is a more "sensible" or "realistic" approach to fighting crime that, well, YOU"RE WRONG. Why? Because it makes Matt a CRIMINAL, that's why, and he therefore needs to be judged as harshly as those he's fighting. As for this "he's not just Daredevil, he's also a lawyer" argument, again: WRONG. Once Matt came forward, and became "Kingpin of Hell's Kitchen", you know what else he'd become? FUCKING DISBARRED, that's what. Nobody needed to go talk to Foggy at the offices of Nelson and Murdock last issue, CUZ IT WOULD BE THE OFFICES OF NELSON. Fucking PERIOD. You don't even need to break any laws to get disbarred--just do something that can be considered demeaning to the profession. If you're a woman, and you turn up on a "Girls Gone Wild" tape, they can disbar you. Push over a two-ton limo? MY ASS--not even if he was really torqued off. Trust me, there've been several other problems, but these are just a few. Bendis has some great ideas and fantastic dialogue. The scenes Shigeru described are a large part of why I stick with it--because there is some great writing here, and there are some great moments. But when the writer says you shouldn't think too much about the stories or the details because he admits he screws up(even when referencing his own stories), why do you continue to fawn? Is the talk, talk, talk really what DD is about? I'm not saying it should be all-punchup all the time. I'm saying it's been 92% talk, 8% action, and that's horsecrap. More like 65% or 70% talk would be ideal. I hate Kevin Smith as a comic book writer, but look at his arc on DD, the only mainstream thing he's done I liked: it had angst, emotion, great scenes and moments, lots and lots of dialogue--AND it had action and unexpected twists. It's beyond me why every time we turn a critical eye on something and say "this part is good, this part isn't" some of you blow a gasket. Believe it or not, no writer is perfect--not even your favorite writer. Not even The Comic Gods. Jack Kirby, Stan Lee, Alan Moore, Grant Morrison--I love 'em all, but shit, EVERYBODY knows they've all written some stinkers. Don't believe me? Then you either haven't done your homework or you're incapable of critical thinking.
Enough of this fucking abstract talk about DAREDEVIL's merits. R by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 01:54:31 AM
C'mon Bendis-ites - did you not even cringe a touch when you realized half the current issue would be devoted to yet another interrogation scene? Stephen King gets his balls busted (and rightly so) for over-writing when he gives over a whole chapter to describe a character that ultimately ends up irrelevant to the story - well Bendis just did the same goddamn thing with this nobody Yakuza schmuck. And the entirety of Ben Urich's extended narrative of the previous two issues is rendered IDIOTIC by the fact that there's no way on God's green earth that Milla would've sat through all his anecdotes when she just wanted to know where the fuck her hubby was. Bendis all but highlighted this himself when, after two issues of Urich talking Milla's ear off, she told him, "I don
I post too much... by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 01:56:39 AM
But hey SleazyG, didn't Matt just reveal himself to the people in that seedy bar...all of which were criminals and are staying mum about the unmasking? That's what Ben Urich said. Otherwise well said about everybody having stinkers and such.
Yeah, Silvestri blew on NEW X-MEN. by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 01:58:29 AM
Just about every other artist Morrison worked with on the series was in some way progressive, and along comes Silvestri for the grand finale and suddenly its a return to the artistic idiocy of the '90s. I tell ya, I would've WAITED the necessary time for Quitely to do one last arc and bring a nice cyclical quality to the whole thing. Instead we get goddamn Silvestri. What, was Stephen Platt busy?
Platt with TWO T's!! by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 02:05:32 AM
omfg you just mentioned Stephen Platt...I just shit myself.
I've been saving the Platt-as-punchline reference for a special by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 02:11:30 AM
Thank you for noticing, and be sure to tune back in to AICN in ten years when I expect to be working a lot of "Crucifer" jokes.
Speaking of Mark "Suckage" Silvestri and Stephen "What the fuck by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 02:24:18 AM
...the return you've all been waiting for: PITT! Woo hoo! Boy, I was soooo stoked this week to hear he was returning (I believe to the Wildstorm U., but I could be wrong. I mean, seriously: who the FUCK was clamoring for the return of the great Dale Keown's greatest (read: only) creation? Anyone? Bueller?
I think some other folks know, Shigeru... by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 02:36:27 AM
...way I figure it, if the FBI knows, there's gotta be some federal attorneys who are aware. The odds of them not fully intending to disbar and crucify Matt Murdock? Pretty freakin' low. It's an absolute certainty. See, this is why a lot of comic book writers know not to go down the "real world" route--it inevitably leads to real-world problems with their writing. It's a very difficult balance to strike. With a character like Jessica Jones, who Bendis created, there were no preexisting expectations for the character, and so his writing works really well. On DD, with all of his history and background and tradition, it works less well. And when you start to introduce so many flaws in the internal logic of the story, character, and genre, it inevitably causes trouble. Batman is a character that has done grim, gritty, real-world, street-level stuff for years while still keeping one foot firmly planted in capedom. That's the balancing act needed in DD, and it's just not happening right now. Too much "real world" defeats the purpose of cape stories. If I want "real world" comics, I'll read crime noir comics, or all the good indie slice-of-life stuff out there that doesn't have superheroics shoehorned in. Good superhero comics are about the balance: enough real world to make us care about and relate to the characters, but enough of the fantastic to make them exciting. If the LOTR series had all that hobbity "golly, it's a big scary world, thank goodness we have each other" stuff without cutting to scenes of serious ass-kicking on a regular basis, it woulda been maddening. That's what DD is right now: too much hobbity crap, not enough ass-kicking.
bleh by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 03:07:40 AM
uhh you had me until the hobbity part. I guess I could go on about how the ass kicking is empty and soulless without the hobbity crap (is hobbit crap small? Perhaps in pellets?!? Makes one wonder) But I'm tired. And yes I forgot about the FBI. But that brings up a lot of shit...like, why would they go after DD if he is a force of good and happy bunnyness? They are keeping it on the DL, yo... I am enjoying the spice it brings to this intriguing mix. If you wanna nitpick little fleas out of a dead dogs butt, go talk to a hobbit. Did I mention I'm tired? And I don't think DD is taking the overly "realistic" approach, and definately should NOT be judged by that litmus, for the nature of the very medium seperates us and it, and although it might be a tad more "realistic" (due in no small part to Maleev's STEPHEN PLATT'S BALL KICKING AND THEN BURNING art) than most books, it still has a dude with superpowers, comprende? I'm tired.
To Cormorant: I absolutely agree with you that Lee was as essent by FrankDrebin	Mar 25th, 2004 03:39:53 AM
When I mentioned "legal injustice", I just meant that the courts held that only the writer is the creator of a comic book (instead of the writer and artist being co-creators). Like Lennon & McCartney, Lee & Kirby balanced each other. Kirby elevated Lee's soap opera stories, and Lee kept Kirby's cosmic nonsense in check. On his own, Kirby created some books that, while great looking, were completely incomprehensible (DEVIL DINOSAUR, SILVER STAR, THE ETERNALS, 2001/MACHINE MAN, CAPTAIN VICTORY). It was Lee's "ordinary" writing that made it possible for readers to relate to Kirby's "spaced-out" characters. But, on his own, Lee gives us STRIPPERELLA. 'Nuff said!
I wanted to like SUPERMAN/BATMAN, but I hate Sleazy G. by Village Idiot	Mar 25th, 2004 03:45:20 AM
Isn't it funny the way that worked?_____I'm surpised to seesuch an attack on something I sorta like, but then again, maybe you're seeing something I'm not. Let's take a closer look at your critique, and see what we come up with______"Stupid stories": A giant kryptonite asteroid heading towards Earth while Luthor has a meltdown. Another (ostensible) Kryptonian touches down on Earth. I'll grant that stuff like Luthor somehow thinking he can convince the world that Superman is somehow responsible for the asteroid is not that great, and generally speaking, we're not talking about the works of Marcel Proust here, but I don't think the stories are egregiously stupid, especially #8, the one I reviewed. Rather, it's full blown, big fat comic fantasy. Certainly not to everyone's tastes, but not fault either. Not even close._______"Weak-as-hell dialog": I'm not really sure what you're talking about here. I mean, I could almost see where you were coming from with the "stupid stories" deal, but I really don't think calling the dialog in SUPERMAN/BATMAN weak is a fair cop. Maybe you have something specific in mind? I think the dialog's fine.______"Heavy-handed dueling internal monologues": Well, we all know how I feel about that one. If anything kills this book for me, that's it._______"Lousy ideas like a teenage kid...": What so lousy about that? A Japanese technological savant is somehow less valid than a mute hunchback? And isn't calling the story "lousy" and "stupid" kinda redundant? Are you padding your argument?? How dare you._______"...and that's not counting the fourth or fifth "new" Supergirl introduced in the last half-dozen years." Well, it's only the third, but that's really beside the point. The real point is: who cares? Peter David's Kara was around for 5 issues, the brunette Supergirl is already gone and forgotten. It's not like you're going to have any trouble mixing them up. It's not like you even miss any of them. If Loeb can present a good story, which it seems like he's on the road to doing, and the other Supergirls are off the map, who cares if she's the third in 6 years? Unless you've simply run out of things to complain about._______SUPERMAN/BATMAN isn't a perfect book; like I've said a million times (even in this post) the internal dialog captions give me apoplexy. But I don't think it's nearly as "crappy" as you're making it out to be. And in fact, #8 was good fun.
Read Runaway goddamnit by BerrySara	Mar 25th, 2004 03:54:47 AM
Like the review pretty much said, read Runaways. It's pretty much the only worthwhile thing Marvel's put out in the last 5 years. It's pathedic that this company's KeWl iDeZ fRoM tHe HoUz Of IdEz!!!111 are to revamp to hell everything we're already been over for the last 30 years. Do we need another damn SpiderMan book? Is there ever going to be a fucking X-Men quota? Marvel actually puts together something original, with fantastic art work which is also original (More than one body type for the female figure? A radical concept no doubt) and fantastic writing (it's Vaughn and it's fantasticly lovely, weaving in and out from humor to drama with easy) and it sells... 20,000 copies? Only? I have the urge to like strangle everyone not reading the comic. At least get the TPB coming out in two weeks, it's like $7. That's a whopping $1.20~ish an issue.
Sleazy G: Fool or Uninformed? You decide. by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 04:54:23 AM
"As for this "he's not just Daredevil, he's also a lawyer" argument, again: WRONG. Once Matt came forward, and became "Kingpin of Hell's Kitchen", you know what else he'd become? FUCKING DISBARRED, that's what. Nobody needed to go talk to Foggy at the offices of Nelson and Murdock last issue, CUZ IT WOULD BE THE OFFICES OF NELSON. Fucking PERIOD." Oh, sorry. Wrong answer. Good try though. You seem to be forgetting one tiny little thing. No, its not you wiener, its the fact that no one Officially knows Matt has unmasked. Many criminals know, but no one will testify to it. Its called Plausible deniability. So, he can go on with his life and at night run Hell's Kitchen with an iron fist. Because no one actually knows. How do I know this: BECAUSE OF THE ISSUE WHERE THE FACT THAT NO ONE WOULD TALK ABOUT IT WAS THE FOCUS OF THE ENTIRE FUCKING ISSUE! Oops, looks like someone didn't do their homework...
"it inevitably leads to real-world problems with their writing." by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 04:59:38 AM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Whew, thats funny. "Real World" problems. no such thing. Why? Because the story is about a superhero. Ask yourself this, there Mr. "real World" Legal expert. Can you imagine the sheer size of the wrongful death suit Foggy would bring against the government were they to officially unmask him? Please, lets try to keep fiction seperated from reality, if you can.
Corm by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 05:12:54 AM
I haven't read the last X-Men yet, but I did like the setting of the story. Post Apocalyptic is something the X-men can always be counted on for. I didn't like the short shift he gave the "new" characters though. It really doesn't surprise me that Morrison did what he did. I always got the feeling that he didn't like most of the X characters anyway, which is way he replaced most of them with his own. Morrison is good, but sometimes, yes he has a tendency to meander and get lost in his own ideas. Admit it though, the army of Crawlers? That was kick ass. **** As for Bendis, I have no problem with his dialogue or the way he framed the story. I don't know people have a problem with extended dialogue. If you're into pretty pictures instead of reading, stay away from Bendis's work. How long do you think that table conversation took anyway? 15 minutes? Come on. Its not like he took her on a walking tour of the city, just trying to wrap his head around the situation. Urich is a blowhard anyway. Bendis, like every writer, wants to tell stories their way. How else can you think to get this info across? The hook of it is the punch at the end. Same with 21 Grams. Would you have been as involved in the flick if you weren't watching wondering what the fuck was going on? I won't claim Bendis does no wrong. Any writer can, I just think he and Morrison and Ellis produce the best stuff. Along with the Runaways, Fables and 100 bullets people and Chynna Clugston-Major, of course. Bottom line, I'm tired of go nowhere fist fights. I won't stories with beginnings, middles, and ends. These folks provide that. And really, come on, IMPROVE his stories? Piss off, the guy is not only the most prolific, but even if you don't like him you have to admit hes in the top 5% of the industry easy. IMPROVE his stories, shut the fuck up. shame on you and your arrogance.
Cerebus Rules by fevriul	Mar 25th, 2004 08:40:00 AM
I suggest the reviewer find whichever it was that relieved him of his testicles and ask for them back. Why the fuck are these fucking MTV rejects reviewing Cerebus, get yourself an attasion span, and a fucking clue while your at it. Idiot!
Watchmen is fantastic, but my vote is for the Sandman... by gigaloff	Mar 25th, 2004 09:00:39 AM
...THE KINDLY ONES in particular. The climax of that story made bawl like a baby, and no other comic has ever affected me like that. You have to read the entire series up to that point to fully appreciate it, however.
Even if ONLY criminals know that Matt is DD he could be disbarre by the G-man	Mar 25th, 2004 09:07:03 AM
Attorneys are disbarred in NYS through administrative tribunals, not courts of law. Generally, the process is that the local Grievance Committee receives a written complaint from another attorney or member of the public. The Committee investigates and contacts the suspect attorney. The attorney is required to answer the charges (no Fifth Amendment here) and if he doesn't, he defaults. If the committee feels that there is enough evidence to proceed to a full hearing, they conduct one. Again, Matt would have to testify at it. The committee then renders a decision. If they vote to disbar or suspend, Matt could appeal to the NYS Supreme Court Appellate Division. However, at that point he's pretty much appealing only the penalty not the findings. As a practical matter it is not impossible for a person to be disbarred on the testimony of a criminal: criminal defense attorneys, for example, get disbarred on complaints from unhappy clients. Furthermore, you need remember this: just because those guys were in a seedy bar frequented by criminals does not mean that they were ALL convicted criminals. Some might have never been convicted. Some might have been hangers on like a bartender. And any of them might want to contact the newspaper that Matt sued in the hopes of a pay out. Finally, there comes a point where enough people come forward with the same, or similar, stories that the grievance committee would have to sit up and take notice. So don't assume that Matt is home free here.
Wrongful death suit for unmasking by the G-man	Mar 25th, 2004 09:13:37 AM
Qwerty, what makes you think that the Government would be subject to a wrongful death suit for unmasking Matt? Just because certain super-criminals might then attack Matt? I doubt it. In order to establish wrongful death, Foggy would have to establish a proximate cause between the unmasking and the death, and the government would, of course, argue that the acts of (for example) Stilt-man in bludgeoning Matt with a giant leg acted as an intervening act which was the actual proximate cause of his death. Furthermore, if you think about it, the government "unmasks" criminals everyday (mobsters, serial killers, child molesters), some of whom might be killed (in prison for example) after the unmasking. However, you never see, for instance, Jeffrey Dahmers' family suing the government for convicting him and putting him in prison where he got killed. Finally, there is no likely cause of action for wrongful death in Matt's case because he has no heirs. The people who have a right to bring a wrongful death suit are the family members of the deceased, not the friends or co-workers thereof. Since Matt has no family, there's no one to bring a wrongful death suit.
stan lee wasn't there by sideshowbob	Mar 25th, 2004 09:25:07 AM
Because he's freakin alive! Or at least that's what my reaction to it was. Kirby was there because they were in heaven and Kirby's dead (even if they did paint him as God). The whole thing reminded me of Chuck Jones vs. Daffy Duck with the giant eraser, and it lost me. The same week that Ultimate FF lost me as well...a 6 or 8 page Mole Man monolgue? Who's writing this thing anyway? Oh...
I was waiting to buy the Morrison/SIlvestri trade... by sideshowbob	Mar 25th, 2004 09:43:32 AM
But based on what I've read here I think I'll save my money. I do have to say that I really liked the characters Grant Morisson introduced into the X-Men, and strongly disagree with anyone who says otherwise. Yeah, I get the sense he didn't like the existing characters so much either (truth be told, I haven't liked them much for ages, and I grew up on them). But his portayal of teenagers, particularly the "special ed" class I thought truly brought the X-Men back to their roots. The Lee/Kirby X-Men were freaks, they were outcasts. There was something very anti-establishment and "punk rock" about them that hasn't been fully recaptured with subsequent waves of teens introduced since (not either edition of New Mutants, not Generation X, god forbid Lila Cheney, or Shadowcat, Jubilee, etc). Maybe this is just my interpretation of the original team. But Morisson brought back the freak aspect
Daredevil and Society by Cathar	Mar 25th, 2004 09:52:59 AM
Quick note from a irst time and probably last time poster. The Underworld may know that Daredevil reigns over Hell's Kitchen, but it is evident that mainstream society holds the lawyer Matt Murdock in high regards - with the polls showing that he'd win if he decided to run for New York. It seems unlikely now that Murdock would be disbarred at this stage of the game. He poured millions of dollars into the restoration of the Kitchen and in doing so, built himself an unassailable reputation. On a personal note, I am really enjoying the Bendis' work on Daredevil and it is the sole reason I returned to reading comics. Maybe it is just me, but I don't find the writing style inane or boring in the slightest and if Mark S. Johnson would die, it could even make a good movie.
Very impressive the G Man. Great posts! by Ambush Bug	Mar 25th, 2004 09:56:43 AM
Can you represent me in my next DUI charge?
Stan Lee...ALIVE? by Dave_F	Mar 25th, 2004 10:21:35 AM
Holy shit, Sideshow, in all the theorizing about the meta nature of the FF story, this simple and obvious reason for Stan not being in Heaven completely escaped me! Good call. And I'll give the Kirby-as-God concept this: Kirby was a famously modest, gentlemanly guy - pretty ideal for a presentation of the Almighty - whereas the God-as-loveable-huckster Stan Lee version might not be so instantly charming.
Best Run on A Series EVER by devilinhelsinki	Mar 25th, 2004 10:57:42 AM
Watchmen and Morrison's Run on Animal Man are fantastic, but for my money I would have to say the best comics series ever was Starman. James Robinson wrote the entire series from start to finish. His run was 81 issues(along with specials, annuals, and realted mini-series) that made every issue a joy. At the time this series was being produced, I had pretty much quit buying comics, but I still bought Starman. And after the series ended, I re-read it from start to finish. Twice. And it is truly awesome. EVERY issue is great. And the best part is how he introduces concepts and characters in the early issues and continues to weave them through the entire series. By the time you finish reading it, you're amazed by the way he had EVERYTHING planned out from the beginning, and how it all comes together at the end. Imagine the way Moore wrote Watchmen, but intead of being only twelve issues, seeing it stretched across 80 plus. Truly an amazing achievement. It is truly a travesty that this book doesn't get more recognition.
fevriul, ladies and gentlemen. by rev_skarekroe	Mar 25th, 2004 10:58:08 AM
The kind of guy who gives us Cerebus fans a good name! sk
Qwerty, that's kinda my point. by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 11:47:34 AM
Of course the "real world" and the world inside of Marvel comics should be kept as far apart from each other as possible. It's exactly the problem I have with a lot of what's going on in DD, Captain America and a few other titles. I'm not the one taking DD down that road, though, or defending it as the word of God; I'm the one taking issue with it and pointing out the inherent flaws. That was what I said in my posts, only summed up more succinctly. So, uh, thanks for agreeing with me.
Cormorant's Specific Criticisms Responded To by devilinhelsinki	Mar 25th, 2004 12:05:49 PM
Corm, I think that you're problem is that you want old-school DD storylines. You want DD fighting the hand and having battle after battle after battle with the Kingpin. It's been done. How many times does DD need to take on the Hand or Kingpin, win/lose, and have questions about his worthiness or about how he's been manipulated. It's been done. It's been done well, most specifically by Frank Miller, but it's been done. I think that Bendis has moved DD into a different territory. He's trying to something different. DD has become more like a TV show, a sort of Law and Order:DD. And, personally, I like his take. If you compare DD to the structure of TV show, it makes sense. The interrogation scenes aren't just about the criminals, they're also about the cops. Bendis is trying to flesh out the agents, as well as the criminals, who are becoming a larger part of the supporting cast of characters in this book. So, no this is not a "bad call," it's character deveolpment. Also, the Urich exposition to Milla, serves multiple purposes. The first is an exercise in non-linear storytelling. I like the fact that instead of dragging out DD taking over as the new Kingpin for like a year, we're shown that it already happened. Second, it's Ben's way of getting things staright in his head, as well as him making sure that Milla knows EVERYTHING that her husband has done, even things that she might have been blind to (pun intended). And last, do you really think that they're conversation took that long? Just because it took two months to tell in comic book form, in reality that same conversation probably took 15 minutes, half an hour tops. And for as long as Milla has not seen Matt/DD, that's not a very long time. Also, think about Ben Urich's cahracter. He's a newspaper man, not Slam Bradley or something. Has he ever been more than a man of words, really? When has he ever been a man of action? Even in Born Again, he fought the Kingpin with his writing, but only after MUCH internal deliberaion. So, no, it wasn't "a frame to hide her big secret," but frame to use an interesting storytelling technique, which also showed, to me, that Bendis gets Urich. Although, you called it contrived, I found it well done. And as for another "bad call" by Bendis , by having Milla say that "she didn't care about all of this," what else was she suppossed to say? "Thank you for telling me that my husband might have gone nutso?" That's something that she doesn't/can't admit to herself, because what would that mean about their marriage? The criticisms you bring up (constantly) in my mind are actually pluses. To each his own I guess, but I suggest that if you have problems with this book on a month to month basis, why not wait then for the storyline to finish, or review the trades. I guess that I must just be more patient, because I get the book every month, and I appreciate the way the story moves and reveals itself, rather than complaining that not enough happened in that one issue. I like looking forward to next month, and would not trade the structure that Bendis has brought to the book for the post-Ann Nocenti years for all the tea in China. Give Bendis time to tell his stories, and in the end, 10 years from now, I'll bet you'll be pining for fro the glory days of the Bendis written DD, when Chuck Austen is writing it.
So Murdock essentially bought off the people of NYC? by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 12:20:12 PM
And that's your defense of what's going on and why it works? Uh, that doesn't really work either. It just means that Matt is one more criminal using good works in the public eye to cover up his highly illegal activities, which again is too much "real world" stuff that introduces to many potential problems. Just for the record, I again say: the FBI, seeing this happen, would without question incorporate it into their case. The government kinda likes high-profile prosecutions of people who are well-known to the press, especially when they have been blatantly and illegal abusing their power to break the law. I'm sorry, but once you open the door and go down this road you have to really go down this road, and it just causes too many problems.
A Tab of New X-Men by creepyCritic	Mar 25th, 2004 12:55:03 PM
I don't look at Silvestri as one of the problems of 90s art. Perhaps he represents the 90s to your mind, but his art was far better than the majority of crappists stealing a paycheck in that era. Comparing him with the disciples of Liefeld and their 9 panels in 22 pages, 15-words-of-dialogue (7 of which were 'AWESOME!') glory is a bit unfair. I thought his work on this last X-Men arc was pretty solid - good pacing, good compositions, could even bear the Wolverine's homoerotic bluejeans-as-spandex-look. My problem with the final arc was the writing. It just felt like in Morrison's run, he kept turning up the volume to see if anyone would complain. Nobody did and by the end his run, it was no longer music, it was just noise. Correct me if I'm wrong but Magneto's destruction of Manhattan stands uncorrected in the Marvel universe...? Am I wrong about that? I was waiting for the last storyline to somehow reverse that, but it never did. THAT'S where you need an editor - to say, "Hey, we need Spidey to worry about paying his rent this month, not genocide. Ixnay on the Estructionday of Anhattanmay." Maybe they corrected this, though, and I just wasn't paying enough attention. If not, where do you go from there? Does their volume go to 11?
word by Shigeru	Mar 25th, 2004 01:04:28 PM
Uh I...like...to...read ...Daredevil. Chill.
Vote for the Superman film cast www.youcastit.com by Boondock	Mar 25th, 2004 03:11:53 PM
You can vote for who you think should play all the parts.
Ann NOCENTI, ok? by Homer Sexual	Mar 25th, 2004 06:50:04 PM
I thought I was the only one who loved Ann NOCENTI's run on DD--those issues are great! Intelligent and still well-paced. As I mentioned before, I no longer buy Bendis' DD because I didn't enjoy reading it, but every comic doesn't have to be for everyone, so to those who like it---more power to you! And now that I've read Runaways, I must agree that, although it took a lot of flipping back and forth, by the end of issue #13, I was hooked! And Silvestri's characters still reek of late-80's early 90's style, and his characters don't have noses. But his art isn't the main reason this issue sucked. It just sucked, very very much. Latest Avengers shows that Austen is still muy, muy lame. PS. IMO, Wanted is quickly losing steam. Opinions?
I count at least four Supergirls in the last half dozen years: by SleazyG.	Mar 25th, 2004 06:59:13 PM
Linda Danvers, who headlined the title SUPERGIRL until it was cancelled a year ago. The alternate-dimension SG introduced in the final storyline of that series. the brunette SG, who we've supposedly "already forgotten about", even though she was IN BATMAN/SUPERMAN's first story arc. This new Darryl Hannah From Space chick. I don't even know if I missed any more or not, cuz I don't follow the S-titles religiously, but that's at least four right there. Not counting replacement S-man Steel's daughter or niece or whateverthehell. Sorry, but it sounds to me like editorial's screwing up SG worse than Wonder Girl/Donna Troy/Darkstar/Troia/whatever, and Loeb having two Supergirls in this book that are completely different from the two in the SG book a year ago doesn't really help matters. Neither does the crap writing.
G-man by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 07:36:30 PM
You bore me, you ideas are nonsensical. Why? Because you're talking about a comic and trying to reconcile it with everyday life. You're talking about a comic's plot points and more so you're extrapolating on comic plot points that will never be addressed. The point is: that doing that is retarded. Don't be a Sleazy G. Let it go. You don't like the book, don't read it.
New X-Men not so new. by Fantomex	Mar 25th, 2004 07:54:23 PM
I didn't like the last arc either, but not because of the characters. I loved the idea of a re-educated Cassandra Nova and the Human/Sentinel relationship. But the arc was simply poorly written. He had a nice idea with Sublime, but instead of building on it he simply used 3 issues to show us this world (yes, the future is awful...) then springs the whole thing at the end with the predictable Phoenix ending. Through in Fantomex and the Cuckos for no good reason and absolutely no explanation (HOW are they weapon whatever-number?) I'll still buy the hardcover (because I loved Morrison so far and I'm a somewhat completist) but a very disappointing ending to one of the greatest comic runs ever.
But Qwerty... by vroom socko	Mar 25th, 2004 07:55:23 PM
Isn't that the whole point of the story, that it's about a comic book character that Bendis is trying to reconcile with everyday life? *** Man, I've missed your rants Qwerty. Welcome back. I'd invite you to the @$$hole BBQ, but everyone's going to be in costume.
Vroom, return to us by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 09:22:51 PM
"I'd invite you to the @$$hole BBQ, but everyone's going to be in costume." Fuck that shit, I look really stupid drinking beer through the slit and forget about hot dogs. I don't think Bendis is pushing Daredevil into real life, he's pushing him forward as a character. Making the hero actually DO something. A radical concept and apparently too much for some people...
Kirby is GOD? by Napoleon Park	Mar 25th, 2004 09:32:12 PM
The FF go to heaven and meet God and He's Jack Kirby? That's cute. That's sweet. And it's sorta similar but not exactly the same as Grant Morrison and Animal Man discussing the nature of reality. Which is a bit like, but not the same as, Kilgore Trout meeting Kurt Vonnegut, Jr. at the end of Breakfast Of Champions way back in 1972. Nothing new under the sun, and if there is, comic books is probably the wrong place to go looking for it.
Qwerty, in a remarkable coincidence... by the G-man	Mar 25th, 2004 09:35:26 PM
I read your post to me while listening to Ben Folds' "the Battle of Who Could Care Less." Talk about the perfect soundtrack to your post.
rev_skarekroe, a good argument for post natal abortion by fevriul	Mar 25th, 2004 09:38:51 PM

fevriul, a good argument for my Branch Davidian comparison. by vroom socko	Mar 25th, 2004 09:43:41 PM
Promise that when you're in the compound up in the Northwest Territories with Dave and the rest of his lemmings, you'll think of me.
I'm right here, Qwerty. by vroom socko	Mar 25th, 2004 09:50:09 PM
Hey, I'm one of the few @$$holes that loves what Bendis is doing on Daredevil. DD has always been more of a noir book, and while I don't think that this sort of story would fit, say, Spidey, I think that it works with Matt and his life. Having said that, I do think that Bendis does overuse the whole "interrogation" bit. Not that I dislike it, just that I think it should be reined in a little. And you're BBQ prejudice is your loss. Sure, It's not going to be comfortable sitting by the pool while dressed as the Swordsman, but we're pit roasting a whole pig. That's good eats, man.
G-man by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 25th, 2004 10:00:51 PM
I'm really hurt by your comment. Oh wait, no, I don't care. Eat some poop. And remember that I laugh at you and your easy abandoning of your arguement. ** Vroom, you think you got it rough, try socializing dressed as Darkhawk. People just dislike you and it sucks...
Okay, okay, I wanted to hate Sleazy, but I love him like Chris by Village Idiot	Mar 25th, 2004 10:39:44 PM
Sleazy, in your original post, you said "Supergirls INTRODUCED in a half dozen years." There's only been the three introduced -- Linda Danvers was around since the early nineties. Hate to whittle it down to technicalities, but the only thing that really matters is winning, right?
The Passion of Kirby. by Napoleon Park	Mar 25th, 2004 10:54:18 PM
Actually, giving the whole "Kirby's in Heaven and Stan isn't because Stan's not dead" theory some more thought and drawing the "Kirby is GOD" theory out a bit more, I guess if God came to Earth as Jack Kirby then it was his mistreatment by Marvel that was his martyrdom. He certainly had his disciples and followers, and considering there's a regularly published fan magazine still coming out dedicated to him ten years after his death, he seems to have inspired something of a devoted following. Still, Saint Jack had it kinda easy compared to the way Archie crucified Dan De Carlo...
Various Points: by Shigeru	Mar 26th, 2004 12:51:12 AM
Heh a New X Men hater by Fantomex...heh. #1: Wasn't it not Cassandra but...crap I forget her name..Ernst! yeah. maybe I should read the last issue... Michael Turner exists as a sucessful artist because of three little words folks: MAS TUR BATION. Can he not draw a freaking run without a motherfucking chick?!?! Gee big surprise Soulfire won out... and him on SUPES/BATS...um, WONDER WOMAN AND SUPERGIRL show up!! How convenient! The early 90's artist of today. Can anybody else not tell him, David Finch and Silvestri apart?
vroom socko, a good argument that the education system is failin by fevriul	Mar 26th, 2004 06:31:16 AM
Good god man, did you even protest when they took your Balls? Did you even Scream? Biggest pussy whipped fuckers in creation, and has the goddamn cheek to call Dave sim mad...cretin. Hurry up off home I here yah momma calling you.
fevriul... by vroom socko	Mar 26th, 2004 07:45:20 AM
What is your obsession with my genitals? Every post you've made has mentioned my gonads in some respect. Do you, perhaps, want to see them? Maybe even... touch them? I wouldn't doubt that you may even want to stick out your tounge and... But no, I wouldn't allow that. After all, that thing's been up Dave Sim's asshole. Who knows what diseases it's carrying. How about this; unless you're going to offer something other than blind rhetoric, feel free to fuck off.
I'm just shocked that the TalkBack order has been maintained her by Dave_F	Mar 26th, 2004 03:39:09 PM
I'd actually written up a Cheap Shot recommendation of the book, but in the cutthroat game of comic reviewing, Cheap Shots are superceded by full reviews. And that bastard Sleazy G kneecapped me quite nicely. Good review, Sleaze-man, and timely considering the book is on somewhat shakey grounds. Like I said last time I reviewed RUNAWAYS - it might not be perfect, but when it's on (and it usually IS), it's as close as comicdom's gotten to the energy and youthful vibe of a show like BUFFY. BUFFY in its heyday no less - not the sixth and seventh season stuff. Cool to see that others here are digging it - Sideshowbob, Qwerty, BerrySara, and now HomerSexual in this TalkBack alone. Spread the word and buy the trade! With a man named HomerSexual on our side, how can we lose?
Alright. Daredevil. First to Qwerty... by Dave_F	Mar 26th, 2004 04:40:19 PM
Qwerty writes: >>If you're into pretty pictures instead of reading, stay away from Bendis's work.
DAREDEVIL response to SeeThroughThis... by Dave_F	Mar 26th, 2004 06:02:51 PM
SeeThrough writes: >>Let me get this straight, you don't believe it's possible for Milla to listen to Urich talking about her husband all that time, but you have no problem accepting a blind man fighting a squad of sword-welding assassins?!?>I didn't cringe when there was another interrogation scene in "Daredevil" any more than when I constantly saw all those ninjas during Miller's run. Why? Because I'm enjoying the story.
Bendis by Nincumpoop	Mar 26th, 2004 06:39:45 PM
Here is the thing you guys, Bendis on Daredevil isn't your cup of tea you. The direction we have DD in now is gritty and dark. It has "noir" flavor to it, like other fellow posters have said. Bendis has done it this way to be different and appealling to those that have grown out of just sock'em up action. Shit as much as I seem to be suckin' on Bendis' junk. The guy can write my flavor of stuff...Wew that sounds bad. Whatever, even though Bendis' may not hold the same type of history Miller's stuff does with me personally. (Grew up on it, and love it.) Bendis, in my humble opinion is a writing better stories about DD, and has taken Daredevil to a new height. (And I do realize people might break out the, pitchforks and torches on my ass for saying that.)
Ninja Interrogation by Nincumpoop	Mar 26th, 2004 06:48:48 PM
I agree the interogation scene has happened a little much, but maybe he is using to create a new characters. I mean it is a good way to show these Agents and the supposed Yakuza badass at the same time. He only has so much time to create these guys, and it makes sense to do it in following the story. Just chill.
Sorry by Nincumpoop	Mar 26th, 2004 06:53:15 PM
Sorry for the many grammatical errors, I am a Fireman and rarely use a PC so I type like 15 words a frickin' minute. I know I suck.
SeeThrough... by Dave_F	Mar 27th, 2004 03:01:20 AM
Milla sitting through two hours (or however long it was supposed to be) of Ben Urich describing the entire past year of Matt Murdock's life...only to have her respond, in effect, "I don't care about any of that, I just want to know where he IS!"...is bad writing. It makes no sense for her character to have waited through all that shit, especially if Ben already knows that she knows a lot of this stuff (and I can only assume he did, because he spilled a TON of insider info about DD). I've no problem with Bendis's story structuring in general, and I often think he paces his chapters such that he ends on some of the best cliffhangers in comics. But this wasn't one of them. This was a mystery that existed only to propel Urich's exposition, until such time as the mystery was revealed and the exposition suddenly became illogical. If all you're taking from my criticisms is that I think Frank Miller should come back, then it's time to work on the reading comprehension, pally.
Aaaaaand....DAREDEVIL response to Devilinhelsinki... by Dave_F	Mar 27th, 2004 03:41:34 AM
Devilinhelsinki writes: >>Corm, I think that you're problem is that you want old-school DD storylines.>How many times does DD need to take on the Hand or Kingpin, win/lose, and have questions about his worthiness or about how he's been manipulated. It's been done. It's been done well, most specifically by Frank Miller, but it's been done. >Bendis is trying to flesh out the agents, as well as the criminals, who are becoming a larger part of the supporting cast of characters in this book. So, no this is not a "bad call," it's character development.>Also, the Urich exposition to Milla, serves multiple purposes. The first is an exercise in non-linear storytelling.>Second, it's Ben's way of getting things straight in his head, as well as him making sure that Milla knows EVERYTHING that her husband has done, even things that she might have been blind to (pun intended).
Enough About Bendis! by Willie Garvin	Mar 27th, 2004 04:14:46 AM
You guys should realize that you're both right and let it go. Bendis' DD is one of the few comics I've read consistently over the last couple of years. Not because I think it's so great, but because it's one of the few comics the drug store down the street gets in on a regular basis and I can stand there and read it for free. Comics are expensive these days, you know. Cormorant concedes that Bendis is good with dialogue, and I agree. Also, in these days of the five minute read comic, I'm not going to complain about the amount of it, since as long as it's interesting, that amounts to value for money in my opinion ( if I was buying the comic that is ). The problem I think in Bendis and other otherwise good Marvel writers is with redundancy and unnecessary digression ( I'm looking at you, Bruce Jones ) The feeling I get from DD and other titles like Hulk ( except that seems to actually be wrapping up it's storyline, but I'm not sure since I bailed on that one awhile back. ) is that the writers do know where they want to go with the story, but don't know how long they're going to be on the book so things get streeetched out so they can wrap everything up when they exit. Maybe it's also a way to keep from getting suddenly shit-canned, since ending your main storyline could be seen as an excuse for a changing of the creative guard by the higher-ups. I mean Bruce Jones had the fugitive on the run thing twenty years ago with Somerset Holmes ( an awesome book, and looking back, incredibly prescient in the way it practically invented the modern Marvel Method of cinematic storytelling. Check it out and you'll agree. ) The thing about Somerset Holmes though, was it told it's story in six issues. So did Frank Miller in Born Again. Does anyone doubt that Daredevil wouldn't have benefited under Bendis by actually having him make his points quickly and then get out? This is the problem with wanting to shake up the status quo I guess. You potentially write yourself out of a job. Not that I think Bendis would be hurting for another gig obviously, but you get what I'm saying. It's hard to let go. On the topic of best story arcs ever, I'd put the stone tablet story from the Lee/Romita/Buscema/Mooney Spider-Man at the top of my list. It's amazing what a MacGuffin can do to make a comic story seem logically motivated. Top it off with a great ironic ending, and then a two issue epilogue with the Lizard at his scariest, and the Human Torch at his most obnoxious, and it's my pick for the best story about the best character in comics.
Willie speaks wisely... by Dave_F	Mar 27th, 2004 04:50:12 AM
Nevertheless, good TalkBack guys. Nice to see the quasi-coherant discussions that can result when the TalkBack order doesn't get effed up.
Re: vroom socko, What genitals by fevriul	Mar 27th, 2004 07:00:23 AM
You don't have them mate, your momma took them off you, for being a fucktard, The woman deserves a medal, stops you from breeding. Listen you don't like critic then tough fucking shite. My good your entire review of cerebus basically comes down to Dave sims hates women, has secret deviant behaviour, probably a rapists if pushed and also a secret right wing religous nutcase. Its was a jack ass review written by a fucking MTV, ten second attension span goldfish, without the IQ. Get back to reading comopolitan, and getting in touch with your female side. Fuck sake I thought new Man tosspots like you had been culled. Feel free to take your head, shove it up your arse and get in touch with your inner muppet.
Bendis Is A Good Writer. But, Qwerty... by Buzz Maverik	Mar 27th, 2004 07:57:08 AM
...everything you've written here is straight from Bendis interviews. These aren't opinions, man, they're ventriloquism. I can understand Bendis having self-serving ideas about his work but what do YOU get out of it?
Buzz by Qwerty_Uiop	Mar 27th, 2004 03:18:45 PM
I've never read a Bendis interview, if that helps any, but if I'm saying the same things about his work that he does, then I must be getting it at least. But I'll explain it in greater detail if you wish. Ahem... What I get from a Bendis comic by Qwerty Uiop. Well, simply put I am more involved in his stories. There are issues that he leaves in a cliffhanger where I've actually said outloud: "Oh shit, hows he get out of this?" And maybe thats what I love. His stories are fresh enough where I don't easily dissect them in the first 5 minutes/5 pages, you know? Like a good episode of Buffy or Martin's Songs of Ice and Fire series, there are actually surprises hidden with genuine tension and excitement. Do you get that in Outsiders or Danger Girl or Loeb/Lee's run of Batman? Uh... fuck no. Bendis takes old ideas, classic set ups and spins them enough to freshen them up. To me, thats the best of both worlds. Enjoyment and surprises. Thats what I get from it. ** Corm, don't mistake, I like the fights, I'm all for them, but only if they have a purpose. If its just one more in a long line of fist fights that never advance the situation or story, then thats lame and most superhero comics suffer from this. Also, Alias blows, the only reason to watch is Jack Bristow, but its not that big a reason. Don't waste your time.
My inner muppet would be gonzo by Shigeru	Mar 27th, 2004 03:33:47 PM
I have no idea what that means. But anyways, on the topic of streching stories out: Is it just poor planning? Is that why Ultimate Six became 7 issues long? I know it must be tough to plan out stories like 20 issues in advance, but that was a mini series. And I will say that losing his job is the last thing on Bendis' mind when he's writing his 236 Marvel books (all of which I love...) Marvel firing him would be the equivalent of shooting themselves in the jugular. He's pretty secure in his job standing, and I think Jemas was quoted as saying he'd have a hard time saying no to anything Bendis brought up. The guy only writes like half the top ten selling comics in the industry, right? So is it for the money? Uh that's a tad cynical, even for a sarcastic ass chap like myself. I think that the dues Bendis has paid in the 13? years he was trying to break into comics have made him a pretty honest guy who wouldn't do something like that. Besides, he's already freaking rich as shit.
I was under the impression Sim was a PUBLIC right wing religous by vroom socko	Mar 28th, 2004 01:43:34 AM
You know what you don't seem to understand, fevriul? I don't give a shit about that. That's not my beef with the book. If you actually paid attention, what I don't like about the final hundred is that much of GOING HOME is redundant, and that LATTER DAYS is neither funny, not fun, and at times it isn't even a comic book. I also lavished a whole lot of praise on Sim in my first three installments: first in http://www.aintitcool.com/disp lay.cgi?id=16760 then in http://www.aintitcool.com/disp lay.cgi?id=16835#9 and finally in http://www.aintitcool.com/disp lay.cgi?id=16937#8 A hell of a lot of his work there was damn innovative, funny as all hell, and a credit to the medium. But I dared, I DARED to think that not everything he's done is perfect, and for that I'm a balless pussy-man? At least I'm not a homogonized drone boy who can't think for himself. You'd better head on back to Dave's place, he's got a tall glass of Kool-Aid waiting for you.
Re: vroom socko by fevriul	Mar 29th, 2004 07:49:10 AM
Church and State, were suberb start to Finish So was Jaka's Story and Cerebus Melmonth was not to my tastes, as for the others they were up to the usual quality but did not reach the heights he had perviously. My beef with you, is your pandering to PC culture, for all your supposed critical review of the books, its cazn be summed as in, He hates women, wanted to Rape his wife, not enough Spandex hero's. Cerebus is a story about an Ardvark and his life. Unless you have interviewed the man, and no his personal views on women, religion etc, then just shut the fuck up. I know in America you may be alble to get away with that shit, but in good old blighty your arse would be sued for Libel! As for Fanboy, Damn right I'm a fan, no I don't think all of his work was the best, but then again its not my character my book, or my vision, its his, you can't dip in and out of it, its the whole, not 10 second snapshots. I suggest you keep reviewing spande and stick to it.
RE: fevriul by vroom socko	Mar 29th, 2004 04:37:30 PM
My beef with you, is your pandering to PC culture, for all your supposed critical review of the books, its cazn be summed as in, He hates women, wanted to Rape his wife, not enough Spandex hero's. When did I ever comment on the spandex factor in CEREBUS? Most of my comments on the first two hundred can be summed up "as in," Sim's a fantasticly innovative artist. Unless you have interviewed the man, and no his personal views on women, religion etc, then just shut the fuck up. you mean I personally have to interview him? I've read dozens of interviews with him, and more to the point I've read his annotations. I've read Tangents. It's safe to say that I know something of his views on women.

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