Annette Kellerman Hangs With THE STRANGE ONES- The Directors And Talent Behind The SXSW '17 Standout

A few weeks back during SXSW '17 I had the wonderful opportunity to talk about THE STRANGE ONES with directors Lauren Wolkstein and Christopher Radcliff as well as the film's stars Alex Pettyfer and newcomer James Freedson-Jackson. The film is about the mysterious relationship between a pair of brothers whose story about going on a camping trip together becomes questionable as more details about their plight are slowly revealed throughout the film. I really dug the slow burn drama and had many questions about crafting such an intense film from each of their perspectives. I hope you enjoy our discussion!

Annette Kellerman: Good morning everyone! Thanks so much for getting up so early and meeting with me so we can talk about THE STRANGE ONES. I guess, first off, I'd like to ask Alex what it was like working with a young actor.

Alex Pettyfer: A kiddo!

Kellerman: Yes. Did that inform your performance? Did it give you more fuel, did it make you hold back, or none of the above? Does that inform your performance at all, working with a youngster?

Pettyfer: Working with James was a great experience. It's kind of weird because I started off around his age, and I remember working with people who were senior to me and feeling very naive to what I was doing. And then now, I've been working 12, 15 years, and it's so nice to work with James who has raw talent. I really enjoyed the experience. Total pain in the ass off set...(everyone laughs) but his performance in the movie speaks for itself. Have you seen the film?

Kellerman: Yeah. He's incredible.

Pettyfer: I mean, look at him. I always call him- and I probably shouldn't give him so much expectation- a mini River Phoenix or a mini Jimmy Dean. Give us the pose! (James strikes a "serious look" pose)

Kellerman: That is very River! (more laughs) James, how was it for you working on such a serious film?

Pettyfer: Wait, you're not gonna ask me about being a serious actor? Oh, I see how this is going! Wow! (big laughs around the room)

Kellerman: I mean at such a tender age! How is it dealing with such heavy subject matter?

James Freedson-Jackson: I enjoy it more than I do comedy. I mean, I'd rather do this. It's more truthful. When you're doing [drama], it gives you more respect for you because these characters rely on you to portray them in a sort of way. It's up to you. It's your job to get their story out. So, I'd actually rather do that than comedy.

Kellerman: As directors and writers, how do you maintain such an ominous- yet not overtly hitting you over the head with it- tone throughout the film?

Christopher Radcliff: It was our biggest priority in all the decision making that go into making a movie- your shot list, the storyboards, the angle at which you shoot something, what lens you're going to use, the sound design.

Lauren Wolkstein: Every single element goes back to tone for us.

Radcliff: We knew that the film would only work if it the balance was so tight- you had to strike just the right balance the whole time, or otherwise if the story pushes the audience too far in one direction you would lose that. So, a lot of our decision making was based on, are we giving too much? Are we giving too little? Do we need a little bit more?

Wolkstein: It was a constant conversation.

Kellerman: Where did this story come from?

Wolkstein: It's based on a short that we made that premiered at Sundance in 2011, kind of loosely based off of several true crimes that we were researching at the time, some kidnapping stories. And it kind of turned into this amalgam of crimes we were researching, and we were really fascinated with the complexity of the relationships in those kidnapping stories.

Kellerman: Alex, I'm sure a lot of scripts come your way. What drew you to this particular story and this character?

Pettyfer: I think the story was compelling and it was different than things I had done in the past. After I met Lauren and Chris and hearing their vision of what they wanted the film to be, I think films like that aren't really made to often. As a creative, you want to be a part of new concept and new ideas. Not literally new ideas, but new ideas in film making, and I think that the creative exploration of what those two wanted to achieve, I wanted to be a part of.

Kellerman: Can you talk about casting? (Lauren points to James) Yeah- how did that come about?

Wolkstein: We have an amazing casting director that we work with all the time named Jessica Daniels out of New York. She brought in James for an audition, and he really blew us away with one of the scenes in particular- the scene in the hotel lobby. Which is a very hard scene to pull off.

Kellerman: Pretty intense.

Radcliff: Casting was interesting. For James' role we knew we had to find a kid the right age, like 13 or 14, and a lot of kids that age you just don't know yet. They haven't done a whole lot yet, and James was one of the more experienced people we looked at. He had a really innate understanding of the material upon the first read, and so it was an amazing discovery for us.

Wolkstein: Raw talent. (to James) It's true. You came in and you were so mature too.

Radcliff: The casting was really great too because casting Alex was also kind of a discovery for us because, again it was such a weird balance we had to create between the two of them, and for Alex's part we really needed someone who could satisfy several different versions of the character that the audience would vacillate between while watching the movie. So he needed to be very charismatic, very appealing, very handsome- he's kind of an object of desire, but he's also like a father figure, but also a creepy and potentially scary guy, and Alex was so perfect for all those different things.

Pettyfer: I'm not so sure I should take that as a compliment! (everyone laughs)

Radcliff: You have range dude!

Pettyfer: Most actors would be like, yeah I have range. But myself, with my insecurities I don't know!

Kellerman: And how is that for both of you- to keep from getting too spoilerish I'll pose the question to both of you- as far as playing potentially duplicitous characters, do you play it straight, or are you trying to reveal anything under the surface?

Pettyfer: I think it comes down to Lauren and Chris and how they shoot it. The great thing about the collaboration of all of us is that when you're in good hands, they really manipulate the audience and how you feel with visuals. So, I just think it makes our job easier.

Freedson-Jackson: Yeah, Sam is a very complex character, and you're actually not sure what it is about this kid. Whether he's manipulating or whether he's innocent. Whether he needs the father figure, or whether he's manipulating many situations at the same time. You don't know about this kid, and throughout the entire movie you're supposed to be putting all the puzzle pieces together. I think of the hard things about that was trying to put two different emotions in the same character at the same time. Sure, it was hard. It was challenging but at the same time it was nothing I'd ever done before. It was extremely fun and new, and I loved it.

Kellerman: Are there any specific inspirations you guys drew from?

Wolkstein: Yeah. Chris and I are fans of a lot of the same movies.

Pettyfer: Wasn't the LEGO MOVIE a big influence?

Wolkstein: Oh yeah, LEGO MOVIE, BATMAN LEGO MOVIE. (everyone laughs) We are huge fans of 3 WOMEN, a lot of Altman movies. We were taken by Peter Weir's PICNIC AT HANGING ROCK and the kind of unknowing-ness going on in that movie. The mystery of both of those films and the surreality of the mundane situations that they present.

Radcliff: Our concern was posing a question rather than providing an answer. We wanted to make a movie that asked a question that is more intriguing and dramatic than the answer would be. So, a lot of our favorite movies are question movies rather than answer movies.

Wolkstein: That provoke an audience to talk about them.

Radcliff: Right. To create a dialogue between the movie and the audience. Your invited in to think about it, ponder it and come up with different readings about it. In that way, we feel like a film can expand and grow in your head a little bit.

Wolkstein: And that really excited us for the life of a film too, to have a conversation around it.

Pettyfer: Altman had such a great career. A vast career. She [Wolkstein] whispered to me that POPEYE was one of her big inspirations (big laughs again). Did you know that they shot in Malta?

Kellerman: Yes! And apparently the set still exists?!

Pettyfer: Yes! The set still exists!

Radcliff: Are you serious? That's amazing!

Kellerman: That whole shanty town is still there, right?

Pettyfer: My friend went there and they walked around the set in Malta.

Kellerman: That is so cool. Harry, the Headgeek of AICN actually screened a 35mm print of Altman's POPEYE a few years back...I wish I could say it held up, but it's still an interesting film. Altman was actually at SXSW several years ago with PRAIRIE HOME COMPANION, and we were all just [jaw drops].

Wolkstein: He's a hero.

Kellerman: Incredible. [To Alex and James] Do you guys have any particular inspiration you drew on for this film?

Pettyfer: Inspiration, as in a movie?

Kellerman: You know, like Williams' Popeye? [more laughs] Did you draw from any actors or performances?

Pettyfer: I think it's hard for an actor to say that they don't draw inspiration from another actor or films that they've seen, but as a character point of view, you always want to have realism from your own experience. So, there's films that I love where actors have done great performances that are inspirational, but I think you want to be authentic to what you're doing otherwise you are just mimicking.

Freedson-Jackson: That's what I was gonna say.

Kellerman: What he said! What is the big take away you'd like people to come away with?

Wolkstein: I think what we were talking about earlier- just to have a discussion around it and hopefully have those multiple interpretations that they really believe in. Their interpretation of it, and want to discuss it with other people who have different interpretations.

Radcliff: But also to be engrossed by the ambiguity, and to have a clear emotional response to the movie. If it's something that they intellectually continue to think over.

Wolkstein: A visceral response to the film.

Radcliff: We want the film to be an experience that is deeply felt emotionally, and also intriguing and fascinating from a logical perspective.

Wolkstein: To really care for Sam and what he's going through and experiencing.

Radcliff: Regardless of what you might think about him- is he good, is he bad?

Pettyfer: What I love about the movie with what you guys have done- and I say this in developing what I'm doing- is that you never want to have questions answered. It's like a real Kubrick thing. You can imply, but you want to leave the audience having their own perspective. I think what worked beautifully about this film is everyone walks out with their own interpretation of what the film is.

Freedson-Jackson: Yeah, I think I told Lauren this yesterday...what she does is different than everybody else. Her and Chris- what they do and decide to make when they do a film is different than what everybody else is doing. Throughout human history all the people who do that succeed. It takes new things to become inspiration for others.

Kellerman: How is your dynamic as far as directing together? How does that work?

Wolkstein: It's really good.

Radcliff: It's good, yeah. We met in film school, and have known each other forever.

Wolkstein: Over ten years.

Radcliff: We have similar sensibilities and tastes in terms of what movies we like and how we approach directing.

Wolkstein: We talk about films and the language of cinema.

Radcliff: We get excited by the same things, and I think that is key to our collaboration. We'll each have ideas about how we want to shoot something or how a scene should unfold, and we're kind of automatically excited by the same approach.

Wolkstein: The most fun process for us is the design of the film. And then on set it's just executing that and working with you guys [point to actors].

Pettyfer: The scenes that you story boarded?

Wolkstein: All the scenes that were red flags for production- the fire, the car accident...

Radcliff: The gun shooting, stuff like that.

Wolkstein: ...were things that we needed to be very clear how we were gonna do it.

Radcliff: We had no time, so we had to know exactly what we needed before we got on set. The schedule was so tight.

Wolkstein: We shot listed everything like that.

Pettyfer: Did the gun scene turn out the way that you story boarded it?

Radcliff: Pretty much, yeah. It's close. It's a little different, but it's very close.

Pettyfer: Which is interesting because it felt very organic.

Radcliff: Cool. That's what we wanted.

Kellerman: The gun scene- the shooting out in the woods?

Pettyfer: There was direction, but kind of no direction. Like, here's the placement of where we need you to be, then gave us...I think that's the most beautiful part of working with you guys. You give us the space to work in.

Kellerman: I guess with a small cast, it's also more intimate. It gives them more room to do a scene like that? Alex, how was that for you. Like, here's a gun, now go shoot in the woods.

Pettyfer: It's probably more a question for them. It's like when you have your shot lists, is that more for fall back safety, or did you stick with most of that?

Kellerman: Like a blueprint.

Radcliff: It's a blueprint. It really helps if you edit as well, because you have to really think about...

Pettyfer: The story.

Radcliff: The story, but also visually what you need to go from shot to shot. So from our perspective we would be like, this is the action we need to cover in the shot and he can do whatever he wants in that as long as we get the beginning and end pieces. Then we can stitch it together.

Pettyfer: Was that subject to the location? Is that what you saw? Or did you have a rough shot list before?

Wolkstein: Yep. We did the shot list before, and then when we found the locations we adjusted it to the location. We're constantly adjusting the shot list. Even the night before.

Radcliff: Because we had to keep cutting shots since we had so little time.

Kellerman: But you still knew what you had to have.

Radcliff: Yes. Very thought through.

Wolkstein: What was so great about collaborating with them is that they brought so much more than what we could have thought in the shot list, and because we had done that blueprint we were able to be more flexible and adapt to what you guys bring to it and still have the same structure.

Kellerman: So you allow yourself to deviate some from the original plan, but maintain the same general structure.

Freedson-Jackson: I think when Alex said that what they're trying to do when they were directing and they didn't tell us anything- they just said, "Shoot the gun, go out." [everyone laughs] No, seriously, it was to make it more natural, and that really came through. When you watch it, it's very natural. Like, this would happen in this situation.

Kellerman: There's definitely an underlying uneasiness about it.

Freedson-Jackson: They didn't block it as much, instead just told us what was going on in the scene, and then we got to do what we wanted with it naturally. And I thought that was really helpful, and I think that's really helpful when directors do that because it makes acting for the actors easier and more natural.

Radcliff: It makes it easier for us too because a lot of the time they actually had really great ideas about how they would block themselves or what they would naturally do, so it allows us to...[laughs] not have to come up with all of that. Or just force them to stick to our plan, because we can always adjust the camera and get whatever is the most real for them. Like, Alex in particular had a lot of really organic fluidity. The shooting scene, we did change a lot of it based on what you thought your characters actions and reactions evolved.

Wolkstein: Yeah, and the same with the scene between you two on the couch. That was very organic because of what you brought to it.

Pettyfer: I think what's so beautiful [turns to me] Sorry, I'm like taking over here. [more laughs]

Kellerman: No! I think its really interesting to hear your questions as well. I prefer the conversation style rather than me just shooting questions at everyone.

Pettyfer: I think it's beautiful how you start wide and come in. It [the shot] was never here, here, here, and here. It's very specific about the way you shot it. Because I think that you did a lot of steady shots like that with zoom. There was a lot of fluidity with camera movement, and I think that's what created that ambiguous eerie feeling.

Kellerman: Right. That sense of uneasiness that pervades the whole picture.

Pettyfer: But when you come to cut, because you have pretty much set two shots up in the scene, you're just doing the cut through performance? Because it's hard to pace that when you're editing.

Wolkstein: The performance is the most important thing.

Pettyfer: But what I'm saying is finding pace in the movie, it must be hard to find pace in the editing room when you've specifically set out with a shot list that is very specific to here, here...or like when you watch the scene when we're on the couch it's up and it's down.

Kellerman: So if you have that blueprint it allows you to edit around the performances.

Pettyfer: But I'm talking about the pacing of the film. Because the pacing is really beautiful.

Kellerman: It really is.

Wolkstein: That was something that took awhile for us to find in the edit.

Kellerman: It's sort of a slow burn, but something important is happening in every frame.

Pettyfer: Because sometimes you have to lose things to create that.

Radcliff: I mean pacing...pacing for the movie is in the editing process. Doing different cuts. Finding the pace of the cut is in the editing process. When we put on our editing hats, it's all about every scene has a rhythm, and then every sequence, and then the whole movie has a certain rhythm. So it's finding the best pieces of what you've shot, the best performances, but then making sure that they also work pacing wise.

Wolkstein: And that it has the shot progression you need dramatically.

Radcliff: And they're not mutually exclusive. Like, usually the performance also works best for the pace because we respond to it in that way. If it feels good, then it usually also works for the pacing. It sounds complicated, but its also very natural and organic as far as what works.

Kellerman: Totally. And you kept the score and sound design very minimal. Obviously that was intentional.

Wolkstein: Definitely by design.

Pettyfer: I think where I was coming from is when you do movies sometimes people want to have a lot of coverage in the scenes to have options of how the scene will shape. What I think is specific and beautiful about what you did with the film, is because you have this set vision, it was was very minimalistic in what you shot and very specific. Which created this eerie feeling.

Wolkstein: We didn't want to do too much coverage because we knew what we wanted and didn't want to overwhelm.

Pettyfer: It's probably very nerve racking as a film maker to be like...

Wolkstein: This is it.

Pettyfer: This is it. This is the shot, we don't have anything else, and if it doesn't work in the edit there's no going back. And excuse my language, but it's very ballsy.

Kellerman: Well, I think that is a great ending point because I'm afraid it's times up for me! I really truly enjoyed this conversation about your process with the film. Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy day. So nice to meet you all.

And so ends my lovely conversation with film makers and talent behind THE STRANGE ONES. There's no word yet on the film's release, but definitely be on the look out for this intense and surprising dramatic feature from Radcliff and Wolkstein. I'm really looking forward to seeing what this directing pair does in the future.

Rebecca Elliott

aka Annette Kellerman