Cool News
BATMAN BEYOND dvd delayed
Hey folks... I'm getting and have been getting a ton of feedback about the delay of the BATMAN BEYOND: RETURN OF THE JOKER dvd... and tons of speculation that Warners is 'butchering' it or that there were production problems and on and on and on. The letter you see from Ghibli-San below is typical of the letters I have been receiving. I do know Paul Dini... and about 2 weeks ago I called him to find out what was happening... as that was when I very first heard about the delay. Paul was not at liberty to be able to discuss what was going on. It has been delayed till I believe December 12th (day after my birthday!). Paul wouldn't say a word to me about the film, the subsequent dvd or anything concerning the release of RETURN OF THE JOKER. His sole words concerning this were "NO COMMENT." Having read his script a few months back, I do know what elements made me concerned that there MIGHT be some studio entanglements concerning the film. BUT I DO NOT KNOW FOR CERTAIN WHAT THOSE MAY BE. If Paul's script is what was filmed... I can say that in the day of the HAYS CODE, it would have passed with flying colors as... anyone that had committed evil or wrong... is punished. But we now live in a world of unspoken rules and regulations where writers, directors, actors... the creative types don't have a set of rules... until they have finished... and that is when the world from up above strikes down upon them. Let us hope that as little as possible is done to this dvd or... at the very least... that we may eventually see a complete untouched COLLECTOR'S EDITION that won't be marketed to children but to us adults (who technically buy most of this stuff anyway!)
Harry, please please please find more out about this, but I've heard that
they are holding back the Batman Beyond DVD to CUT OUT SOME OF THE VIOLENCE!!
(it was reported on DH)NOOOOOOOOO PLEASE DON'T LET THEM WATER DOWN THE
GODDAMNED MOVIE!! NOOOOO!! I know you are friends with Paul Dini, I saw you
guys hangin' out at the San Diego Comic-Con, please contact him and find out
what the FUCK is going on!! Make sure those bastdards don't censor the
goddamned movie!! We need this!! Besides, little kids won't be buying it as
much as us the true fucking geeks!!
Ghibli-San on aicn
-
+ Expand All
-
It worked for Mononoke and I hope it worked for this. I really want to see this film in its original form. Why dont they just release two versions?
-
I really, REALLY hope that they don't screw with this film. The reviews i have seen so far have made me very excited, and it would be a damn shame to see it tampered with by soul-less, coward studio suits.
-
Maybe they aren't censoring the film. Maybe they're just waiting till after the election is over, and all the politicians are done criticizing the entertainment industry for another four years. God, I hope that is the case, because I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT TO SEE THIS MOVIE, AND I WANT TO SEE IT COMPLETE AND UNCUT, THE WAY IT WAS MEANT TO BE SEEN!
-
I also heard the rumor about it being cut, from two different people in one day.
While I can see WB -
too keep this travasty from happeneing? I mean it's not like this is a #$%^ing theater release, this is home #$%@#ing video for gossake! the studio has already decided that they dont want to cough up the cash to show this film as it _should_ be (in a theator) and we have to be content with a home release... this being the case they need to keep their God damn hands off it.
if they butcher the film at this point they have spit on the entire audiance. -
Oct 02, 2000 10:24:43 PM CDT
I don't feel like going on a big spiel about editing and Batman
by miracleman
Bah.
-
Jesus this Ghibli-San has a foul mouth. I don't want this kind of garbagey language on the ain't it cool news. PLEASE put trash where it belongs, in the gutter, especially if there is a trash can in the gutter.
Just kidding boys actually I agree don't short shift the violence on the batman cartoons. Come on you fuckers, do your job and release the movie. thanks warners, Vern -
Why, why, why? I'm sick and tired of seeing this happen. All of a sudden, with the media as the new scapegoat, film makers and artists of all mediums have to bow before the big players on Capitol Hill or parent groups who blame the media as the sole shaper of a child's behavior. Oy vey. So what if it happens to be a cartoon that has dark and/or violent moments? It's not like this Batman Beyond movie is an animated re-telling of Pasolini's "Salo: 120 days of Sodom" or anything. I hope that there was just a big glitch with the first batch of discs and this here Batman Beyond movie remains intact. If not, we'll all have to do something in protest. I suggest starting a great big truckin' convoy across the states! Let's go huntin' bears, Rubber Duck. Fer sure, fer sure. We gotta great big convoy rockin' through the night. We gotta great big convoy, ain't she a beautiful sight? C'mon and join our convoy, ain't nothing gonna get in our way. We're gonna roll this truckin' convoy across the USA (in protest of Warner Bros, of course). CONVOOOY
-
WB sucks dick for nickels! uh...I mean, what can we do to stop this?? I want to add my name to a list and have someone send it in to WB to show them we're against this and refuse to pay for a lesser, edited version. So could you enable us to do that, Harry? or anyone out there? The separate post is appreciated, but talk-backing endlessly will get us nowhere. So, I say we start a petition. Who's with me!??
-
...could be in order here. I just want to ask this... how many parents are going to buy their kids the DVD of BBROTJ so that 10 year olds can appreciate the better image quality and extras? Not many, I think, mostly kids are going to be watching the VHS version (maybe I'm wrong though). But it's my opinion that the DVD would be aimed at mature collectors, so why not censor the VHS version and keep the DVD as is? Huh? Or let the DVD contain both versions by the use of seamless branching technology, with the toned-down one being the default, while the harder version must be accessed through a menu setting. Final option would be to release two versions but it just seems silly and would confuse the buying public. If someone sets up some sort of e-mail campaign or petition, I'll definitely be there to sign it. But like the Mononoke campaign; nice, polite, sensible letters and dot shouty abusive ones. But first we need to know if it is actually being cut... and we don't know FOR SURE yet.
-
JavaDevil, usually I'd agree with you when it comes to Jumping the gun but this sounds pretty legit to me. Sounds like something really needs to be done. Some kind of Parental lock feature wouldn't be hard to add to the DVD, and they could easily fit two versions of a 76 minute movie on one DVD.
-
Now I understand that all we have at this point is just a rumor, and a pretty strong " NO COMMENT" from Mr. Dini. But given the current political climate of violence in the movies and the argument there in,and Warner Brothers history of screwing with a character that has
generated millions of dollars for them. Is it too much to ask that the suits try to have a little sack and relaese the orginal version of the movie.
Not to mention that this is a total slap in the face of Mr. Dini and the other very talented people who have given us the real fans the one true "Dark Knight", and started a rebirth of the anamation dept. that was Warner Bros. I was very much looking foward to the release of this video mainly in part because of Dini's excellent work in the past, and the darker tone that the movie was orginally supposed to have. But I guess now that it not going to happen. Thank you Warner Bros. for bowing to public pressure. Can let us make up our own minds!!! -
"Toning down the violence?" What the HELL is that all about?! Paul Dini must be throwing fits about this! Does this mean that the DVD version, which is supposed to have deleted scenes, has to suffer too?! Why? Because corporate liberals want to blame the media for what's wrong with disturbed kids these days? Yeah, I'm sure those gun-totting kids at Columbine where purely driven by video games and movies. . . forget what was happening in thier lives. Forget about how bad things were going for them. Forget that they were probably facing serious troubles in thier existances. I'm sure they went on a killing spree because the local arcade's version of House of the Dead 2 had the red blood turned on. God damn the WB! I don't care if they DID give us Iron Giant, or the Batman/Superman Adventures. More and more, they seem to only care about franchising and brain-washing kids into buying stupid toys and playing cards. They've forgotten that the real appeal the Batman series ever had was that it could tell GOOD stories every now and then, not their selection of action figures. After reading this, I will now CANCEL my pre-order for the Return of the Joker DVD! C-A-N-C-E-L-E-D!!! I sure hope you're happy, you asses!
-
Yeah, I remember reading somewhere that right when the gov't Tabacco lawsuits ended, someone commented that they wouldn't be surprised that the entertainment industry was the next to be targeted for litigation. We saw the start of that a few weeks ago with the Congressional hearing on violence in the media. MY biggest complaint is that individuals are expecting America to censor itself for the sake of THEIR children. They want television to be their kids' babysitter rather than taking the stand of monitoring what their kids are watching on their own.
-
...and it kicks ass! I won't spoil the story for anyone, but the film has LOTS of violence. (It's VERY sick and twisted Joker violence, too! Cool!) The screener I saw was unrated; if I had to rate it myself, I'd say it should be PG. It's definitely NOT for the kiddies! (But the geeks will eat it up...I did!) To see the screener, just make friends with your local videostore clerk: they've got the goods...
-
I have ignored the reviews, other than to read that this film is really good. I have tried not to find out what happens in the film, and I don't want to know now. So please don't give away any secrets if you know them.
Personnally I can't understand why they would censor this movie.
The live action movies were pg-13.
I really can't see this movie getting a rating above that. Look at the excellent episode of the Batman animated series "Over the Edge". There is a scene in that I felt was surprisingly brutal for kidsWB. Anyone who has seen the episode know the scene I am refering to (the one in flashback) However, it was an excellent episode. Is the Batman Beyond movie really more brutal than that?
I hope that we get the film as the creators intended. Still it could be worse. It could be like the Gen13 animated movie that Kevin Alteri (I think) did and is still locked up in a vault somewhere.
-
. . . I'm also miffed about this damned delay! They've been promising a Halloween release all year, and now they're pushing it back. If the delay was justified, like actual improvments on sound, or musical score, then I'd be more than gung-ho about the whole thing. But, with no signs of any kind of real re-touchings and the warnings of some strong editing in the air, I don't think I want to fork-over $24.99 just yet. I'll wait until I KNOW I'm getting the full, un-tampered version of the movie I've been waiting for all year.
-
...you think they give a flying fuck about a animated Batman movie? Hell no. Those fuckers at Warner aren't fans, they're either all a bunch of old men who have no creativity in their bones (or ever did), or they're a bunch of business school kids with no creativity in their bones (or ever did). Either way, Batman is screwed.
-
I actually got a note from Amazon saying that BB would be delayed and I could cancel if I like. I simply wrote back and said that I would still like the DVD, but *only* if it was the original, uncut version I've been reading about. After all, Amazon wants to make a buck, they could put pressure on WB for us. Another point to mention is that most, if not all, pre-orders have probably come from people who've read reviews on this and other sites. That is, reviews of the non-censored version. I say cancel away. If the WB realises that most of their pre-orders are being shut down, they'll wise up pretty quick. (As for whether or not this is rumor or fact. Well, given that Harry knows Paul I'm pretty sure he would give more than a "no comment" if it were changes in the sound mix, etc.)
-
So glad I was able to obtain a copy of this film a week or so ago... Having watched it, I gotta say I can't see how they'll chop it up; The intense, tragic elements are pivotal to the story... I gotta say this film has had me quite sad whenever I think about it, it's got an epic element on par with other BATMAN events such as the recent death of Gordon's wife, the crippling of Barabara Gordon, or the death of Robin #2...
My uninformed guess on the delay would be that if they put it out now, it's a clear target for politicians to attack before the election, I mean, the fact that I got a press copy in a full kit and all that tells me it's all set to go... With them now waiting a couple of months, they'll clear the election...
Anyway, I'll inform Harry if I hear anything not said elsewhere.... Sean Jordan ZENtertainment.com -
Oct 03, 2000 6:16:30 AM CDT
If this is is true then is just goes to show you how the suits g
by tallscott
sorry for name calling its just my 2 cents
-
Is this really definite? Is that how you spell definite?
Nothings been confirmed yet, but i will just say that cutting and watering it down is really not helping opening up the adult market, never mind the fact that theres no good reason.
Wasn't the origional edit meant to be quite disturbing anyway?: The extra footage must be really twisted or in bad taste then, cos otherwise, to do what has been rumoured would abosolute BULLSHIT!!!
No, actually it would suck anyway.
-
Oct 03, 2000 7:06:27 AM CDT
Batman Beyond is marketed to kids. Editing needed to be done.
by studio suit
The bottom line is that this show is for kids, say 7-15 years of age. It comes on Saturday morning and on Kids WB, because kids are the ones who watch it! Why? Because it is a cartoon, and that is who watches cartoons. KIDS! Yeah sure a few of you no life geeks watch it religously as well, but the studio is not about to allow this film to be filled with blood, guts and violence, that is better suited for a rated R film, just because some geeky adults want it to be. WB knows that most of the money is going to be coming from parents who will shell out the cash to buy this for their kids. However, as soon as they get word of how violent it really is, they will not buy it. This would mean catastrohe for the studio. So this is why some changes have to be made. The studio could care less about what a few whiney geeks think, because they can't have it their way. WB must tone it down for the audience the movie is intended for, the kids. This is the safest way to secure a good profit margin. Plus, kids today do not need any extra help in learning violence. So, grow up. It is a cartton intended for kids. It is not the end of the world. And, if some of you think that it is, I really feel sorry for your pathetic lives.
-
but I am GENUINELY a british movie&comicbook geek who has the rare privelidge of working as a critic and reporter in the film industy. I cant say anymore or my anonymity will be under threat. I have spoken to powerful people at WB and they genuinely DO NOT CARE about fans of comicbooks or Dinifans. They think you are cretins there to line their pockets. If the presence of PAul Dini might shift a few units they will go for it. Otherwise they would have gone for the guys who did the He-Man cartoons.
Just dont buy the fucking thing. -
You know, every other movie news site seems to be aware that it's not just the dvd, but the video release as well... and yes, there's a video release. But I don't see THAT anywhere in this "news" post.
-
Sad to say, but I think this is just the tip of the iceberg. It seems that it's easier to blame Hollywood for the ills of society rather than trust parents to monitor what their little kids are watching and make sure that it's appropriate. Now, even those of us who are adults will be treated like under-age kids and forced to watch censored, watered down tripe. I agree that movies with graphic violence and explicit sex shouldn't be marketed for kids, but something's clearly wrong when Hollywood executives and political pressure control artistic content. Let the storytellers tell their stories, without the interference of marketers, studio bigwigs, politicians and business men! Peace out. DOWN WITH CENSORSHIP!
-
What the *&%#! I have been hearing and reading about this DVD for months...I have gotten darn near orgasmic thinking about the infamous flashback sequence, the violence, the darker, more sinister joker...and now you tell be that the "Batman and Robin" studio is going to cut and delay what might have been the best thing to happen to Batman fans since 1992 when the original series aired? $*&^ my ^$#%! I spit on warner bros! They aren't even worth typing in caps anymore! Please let there be a special edition...please let us see the film the way it was meant to be! Someone with power...hear this! THE ONLY WAY YOU WILL EVER MAKE MONEY FROM THIS IS IF YOU MARKET IT THE WAY IT IS INTENDED...YOU AREN'T SELLING TO KIDS YOU FOOLS, YOU ARE SELLING TO BATMAN FANS! WE ARE HUNGRY AND WE CRAVE SOMETHING REALLY GOOD! GET IT RIGHT YOU FILTHY SONS OF ....
-
Just a clarification from my earlier post. There is no blood or gore, or anything explicitly graphic about the violence in this film. However, people do die; one scene in particular is what's causing WB to clench their butts in anticipation of the uproar. (Comparisons to Columbine are apparent, and dare I say it, somewhat appropriate.) Should the film be edited? Absolutely NOT! It's perfect as it is, and is an excellent addition to the Batman mythos. WB needs to be careful how the film is marketed, however. This film, in its current state, should not be marketed to kids under 10. In fact, 12 + is more apt. Will I buy it? Sure; would I let my young kids see it? No way...
-
A story on comicscontinuum.com says According to a WB representative, the film's delay is for added features for the DVD and to make it a holiday release.
As much as I'd like to believe that the DVD will have the uncut version, I seriously doubt that the WB is going to release that without some kind of pressure from fans. -
Hey WB... slap a warning label on that sucker and SHIP IT AS YOU INTENDED!! Harry, if you post some names and addresses, I'm sure we can get all activist on WB's ass!! Personally, I'm tired of all these baby boomers complaining and trying to dumb down all arts and entertainment. (I hate to break it to you boomers, but the world is NOT a safe place for your kids! It's a toxic place run by toxic people. If you were worried about child safety, you should never have squeezed out those pups of yours in the first place. Most of your kids are going to wind up in jail anyway, serving the corporations that now run the prisons. Maybe you should've done something about THAT instead of whining about cartoons...)
-
This whole censorship crap is pissing me off but what can I do alone. If this is set in stone then I think we should do something simmilar to Mononoke.
Anyways my question is that if anyone knows where I can get a copy of the script of this movie or if anyone would like to tell me the stuff that might be censored? I mean, if they mess up the whole scene of what happened to Batman and the rest on their last fight with the Joker i am gonna be pissed.
Thanx -
Oct 03, 2000 11:34:52 AM CDT
Hell, yes, let's have that studio address and the sign-up sheet
by the killer-goat
A proper petition (which I'd wholeheartedly sign myself and 12 other friends for) should reflect why suits all-too quickly bow to the practical and logical approach, to butcher a great piece of animation in order to please the general (but not bigger) census audience that fails to shake off the "all-cartoons-should-be-Bible-safe" marketing misconception.
StudioSuit makes an interesting presentation for it, but one could make an argument to compare the level of violence in a direct-to-DVD movie with little more than scattered screenings (which applaud for the depth of story and characters, NOT for any degree of violence --hint, suits)to the current running Batman Beyond tv series, (and the many succesfully received japanimation series on Cartoon Network, I might add), to find that the tv stories held their own with some dark, gritty themes that could test the censorship community if not for the strong sense of morals and virtues underlined subtly in each episode.
Okay, perhaps an extreme degree of violence could be tweaked to allow a rating that appeals to an even broader audience for the sake of promoting such a cool show. But the practice of blatantly cutting quality effort out of the film, instead of re-adaptation under the original teams' guidance, makes for lousy Studio image and loses faith from a supportive audience --who rely on animation studios to back good work-- and loses confidence from prospectively GREAT talent (ie: Dini, Timm, etc).
StudioSuit and others, don't forget that "geeks" out there show their support of great talent and studio features and some broadcast to nationwide audiences. "Geeks" are parents, too. The wise ones watch WITH and FOR their kids. To presume favor to a supposed lowest common denominator of parents assumed to indifferently sit their children's butts in front of anything "industry-approved" is not a proactive or even supportive approach to measuring "appropriate" subject matter. There's too much ambiguous dictation regarding what's allowed on ratings and what isn't.
WB will edit because what the 80-something censorboard members dictates as "proper" for being out of touch of current media circulation. It's just a shame it comes at a cost of all the work the artists, writers and producers did to get the movie to this point, which is what Harry underscored. Why release 2 different versions of the movie when, as elections prove, it's better to make the first presentation the safer one seen nationwide when first-time released.
There's no denying that the american studios may not be obliged to be as experienced or accomodating to the various genres of animation, as in Japan (or even a few in Europe). But they might have less foreign imports to syndicate if Studiosuit et al took hints regarding artistic-production support from some of our international partners...
-
Hey! As the guy who wrote a review for this sucker on this site I gotta say that I was pretty disturbed to learn that they might be cutting stuff. Key word MIGHT! I personally think that they are doing this to move it back for the Christmas holiday release date. I always thought that October was a silly time (despite Halloween) to release it as you KNOW all the people who would want it would be foaming at the mouth by Christmas time to get their hands on a copy. Therefore, this may be a smart move on the part of the WB executives so that they may be able to rake in the big greenbacks from this straight to video release. Of course it would be immensly stupid for them to release an edited version now that they've sent out screener copies. I mean, the fans will now know that what they're getting is a hacked up wannabe of what could have been. Having seen it I should say that it might be too intense for little kids (around eight or nine) to watch but that's what parents are for: to decide whether they should let their kids watch it. And to be quite honest it's not material that is going to traumatize a kid for life and send them into a Jeffrey Dahmer like craze. It would just be something that they would remember as being scary as heck which actually might be fun for a kid. Kind of like The Shining commercials on TV were to me as a little kid. But, really, when we've got moronic parents taking kids to see the Exorcist in a dark theatre (I know, those kids ruined my showing)shouldn't we be passing legislation against the PARENTS who subject these kids to that stuff and NOT the people that make them? Personally, I think they should release TWO versions with HUGE ratings on the front so the parents KNOW what they're getting into. Kind of like what FOX is doing with the Escaflowne series on video. They have a FOX KIDS version and a version of the original so true fans can see it without torturing their children with cartoon madness. Of course, like I said before, this is in no way going to guarentee that some idiot parent will pick up the wrong one and start crying like a stuck pig about how the immoral bat has scarred their little precious. So, yes, if they do release an edited version I think that we should all call for a BOYCOTT. But if they cut what I think they are going to cut it could make it even MORE disturbing without them realising it. Remember, sometimes NOT showing stuff is scarier than showing stuff. Anyway I'm cyked 'cause I've got my copy and if they do hack it up,man, it'll be worth GOLD!!!!
-
I'd like to think that our country has reached the level of maturity that other nations have, like Japan for instance. But then I keep hearing and seeing bullsh*t like this. And it's the Liberal's on this bandwagon folks. They need to show that they are moral after defending Clinton's sexual escapades the past 8 years....what a bunch of a-holes. "It's video games, it's TV, it's guns, etc." HELLO? It's YOUR LACK OF PARENTING!!! God, these suits make me want to go 'Bobby Knight' on them...
-
Does anyone have an address for WB? I've hit their web page but of course there is no e-mail section. Anyway a hard copy letter has a much bigger impact. This is crap! This DVD was for me, not my 4 year old son. Put it out on VHS for the kids with the campy batman. I want the Dark Knight and an evil Joker. As much as it's good to vent here letters need to flood WB for anyone to take any kind of notice.
-
We can write all the protest letters we want or send all the e-mail we want or rally all we want -- the only sure-fire way to make Warner Bros. (and Hollywood in general) notice is to boycott their product when they piss us off. We're the customers, and if we don't like what Hollywood is dishing out, then we shouldn't give them our money. I was planning on buying THE RETURN OF THE JOKER DVD too, but if it's released and those who've seen the screener report that scenes were cut out, then I refuse to purchase it. It's really simple, folks. Forget all that talk about morality -- it's all about the benjamins. The Almighty Dollar governs Washington and Hollywood, so don't be naive in thinking otherwise. Parents who feel that movies are too violent or explicit have the power to boycott products just as easily. Folks are trying to use the entertainment industry as scapegoats for social problems. "Ban Harry Potter books! Edit violent Roadrunner cartoons! Don't show villains hurting innocent people! Don't show heroes beating up the bad guys!" Give me a break. There are enough problems in this world without wasting time worrying about censoring a freaking cartoon that was okay a couple of months ago but is suddenly deemed problematic because we're a month away from Election Day. FIGHT CENSORSHIP!
-
Well, it's a small consolation, but the screenplay should still have the full version. Is that still due out in October. Amazon and B&N.com both say September 2000. What the junk is that?
-
Hey, maybe the suits and censors will add Bat Mite! Oh boy, Oh boy, Oh boy, Oh boy! (Please mix in a heavy dose of sarcasm and cynicism to this post)
-
I'm sorry, but somebody mentioned this above in talkback. Where do I begin? I own a DVD Player but most people do not. VHS is not a dead format because it still maintains a profitable interest. When Laserdisc became popular did the VHS format come to an end? No. That day is still very far from now.
-
I am so sick and tired of people thinking that "just because it's animated, it's for kids." Sadly, here in the United States, studio execs do handle thier animated projects that way, but in the past decade, animated shows have become more cerebral and story-based. Animation is a form of story telling, not eye-candy for the week minded. Yes, some episodes of the Batman Animated series have been weak, but have you ever seen episodes like "It's Never Too Late" or "Heart of Ice?" They're GOOD stories that can appeal to ANYONE who watches it. ANYONE! Not just little kids. Why not just get an open mind about some things before you decide to criticize us for enjoying semi-quality programing?
-
Oct 03, 2000 2:48:05 PM CDT
WB could just be delaying until Congress ends its current Sessio
by keeper
What with all the hearings surrounding media violence and all they could have merely decided to lay low until then.
-
I'll bet my bottom dollar that this is a direct result of the Gore/Lieberman attacks on Hollywood... I tell ya, these guys (not to mention little miss "rock lyrics" Tipper) are the bane of the first amendmant. -
As some have mentioned above, what the real issue here is money. You want to stifle these bastard suits? DO NOT BUY BATMAN BEYOND: ROTJ. it is that simple. Letter writing is nice and they change their minds for a little while but they'll do it again. I repeat, DO NOT BUY THIS MOVIE. If someone has the screener, start copying it and sending it out as a bootleg; put it on the web; do whatever you have to do to get as many free copies in to our hands. This is our final stand. DO NOT BUY THIS MOVIE. If I have to stand on line and tell people not to buy it I will. Cancel your orders on amazon or wherever the fuck you bought it because this is truly the beginning of the end for this kind of shit. We should be tired of being raped and taken advantage of buy these uncreative soulless pukes. We are the customer, we are always right. Fuck WB. Fuck the politics. This is censorship plain and simple and truly more of the same facist bullshit thrown at us lonely peasants. i am willing to organize over this one. If anyone is willing say so in TB and I'll find a way to get us together and move on this.
DO NOT BUY ANYTHING FROM WB or WATCH ANYTHING from WB. I know it will be hard, but encourage others to do the same.
Thanks.
Dan -
Conservatives and rightwing extremists have been attacking the media for ages! Don't place all the blame on Lieberman. Censorship sucks, no matter which side of the political spectrum you're on.
-
Oct 03, 2000 3:22:42 PM CDT
Editing is NOT always bad (unlike the Joker... he's ALWAYS bad..
by thanosx
Let's all calm down now. First, there is no verification that this is actually happening, and second, if it is, it might not be for the worst.
Just last year, David Fincher had to cut out a couple of seconds of footage from Fight Club because some people thought it was too violent (let's forget for a second who these people were). Well, he did. And after having the opportunity to see the "edited" version, Fincher actually made a more powerful movie, by letting the audience imagine the horrors of the fighting (much like the whole "I haven't been fucked that good since grade school" replacing "I want to have your abortion" debacle).
Editing is not bad. It is a necessary part of the creative process. Sure, we may disagree with the people that pressure directors and other creative types to cut the "pureness" of the first cut... but we need that. We don't want a bunch of yes-men in the studios. We want people that propose serious questions about film that the filmmakers must deal with and work with creatively, otherwise we'll end up with something like Cimino's "Heaven's Gate." The movie was atrocious, the script was worse, yet did the bigwigs say anything? Nooooo... they were all too caught up in the sanctity and infallibility of the creative director. Well, you know what? There is no such thing as the sanctity and infallibility of the director. Even Hitchcock and Ford have admitted that some of their greatest achievements in film would not have been possible if they were given card blanche, but they needed the stern eye of the studio. If a director is truly great, criticism will helm him or her refine their vision and find different, perhaps even better ways to present a story. And you know what? If a director can't keep his or her film's integrity because an extra 15 frames has to be cut... the film didn't have much integrity to begin with.
I wish Paul Dini good luck, and I hope, whether this is true or not, that his efforts will produce some of the most innovative and creative techniques we've yet seen in animation. -
Exactly. Al Gore and that fucking NAZI Lieberman are the two most misguided selfish fucks on the planet. It's called freedom of speech, it's called doing the right thing. It's called truth, justice and the American fucking way. Yeah that's right, that's what I learn from Superheros: truth, justice, strength, honor. Something GORE and LEIBERPOOPS are lacking. I learned a sense of values from superheros, not senseless harmful violence!
-
Oct 03, 2000 4:34:43 PM CDT
Someone please tell those fuckers in Washington that VIOLENT MOV
by mthiel
I'm really tired of this shit. People STILL think the Columbine shootings (the most overrated news event of 1999) were caused by DOOM and NATURAL BORN KILLERS. It wasn't, you dumb fucks. The jocks teased the boys until they decided their life was not worth living anymore and decided to fight back. We have evidence that theseboys had GUNS IN THEIR BEDROOMS and we are blaming the media???? Not the parents or the bullies? No, it was the movies, games like DOOM and QUAKE, the Kosovo bombings (what did the bombings have to do with the shootings anyway?), and the Internet (this is totally moronic...THE INTERNET DOES NOT CAUSE PEOPLE TO KILL YOU FUCKING MORONS!!!)! We should not CENSOR our arts because of 3 or 4 school shootings in the past few years. We should have a "Million Fanboy March" to END CENSORSHIP and NOT HAMPER CREATIVE FREEDOM because people believe the media is the cause for youth violence, even though VIOLENCE IN OUR YOUTH IS GOING DOWN!!!!!
-
Oh great lets all deside out of protest to not buy this movie. Great idea except for one little point. THE WILL NEVER MAKE ANOTHER ONE! Guys if it gets cut petition for a uncut version on DVD or something. Don't just deside it's a good idea not to buy it. I for one would like to see more of these full length Batman movies. Write to them your anger but support the movie for what it is, A fanboy wet dream.
-
When will people learn that trying to please everybody (all demographics) is never going to work. Either specialize it or don't frickin' do it. Movie executives...will you please learn from mistakes like Episode 1, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, and Spawn. Let the Darkness rules....RULES!!! and I have renewed hope with Frank Miller and that director in the next installment. NO MORE KID-IFICATION!!!! (New word for today!)
-
if I was a kid again I WOULD BE JUST AS PISSED OFF!!!! Kids are smarter than you think ;)
Peace out YO!!! -
This is bad anyone can tell that but I don't think we need to attack the politions. It's a fucking election year for crist sakes we should've known it was gonna happened, hell this country was built by quakers who were obsessied with values. and as far as the batman: mask of the phantasm goes I was 10 when it came out and I loved it i own and still watch it. yeah my mom was alittle uneasy about it but she still ecepted and she watched it with me. Suits at Warner Bros. just dont understand children cuz even if they do have them they do they probably dont pay attention to them. Its how life is hopefully it wont be edited but I guess we'll find out. Oh any by the way Stonehelper never call a jew a nazi you dickless cock sucking fuck cuz it might piss a another jew off and he like you mr. stonefucker is entitled to their oppion. suits make their own choices.
-
First off, it's called spell check. "Politions" is really spelled politicians. And more importantly, and this is SOOOO completely off topic, I apologize everyone, but Lieberman is a bit of a Nazi, regardless of his heritage. And never forget, that the Nazis were a horrible group of people that did unspeakable things to Jews and non Jews (i.e. Russians and Catholics -- who incidentally were killed in numbers that far outweigh the number of Jews killed, not that that lessens the impact, but that part of history does effect all of us, not just Jews) and more related to the topic -- the Nazis carried out all of their vicious hate crimes, propaganda and VIOLENCE all without the aid of cable, the internet and other forms of advanced media. And Azrael, who said I wasn't Jewish myself? Think.
-
Oct 03, 2000 5:38:52 PM CDT
Stay silent part two...more on topic, but pay attention Silent b
by stonehelper
It's most ironic that you tell me to stay quiet because Lieberdouche is entitled to his opinion...because everyone is entitled to their opinion, according to you, except me. Interesting logic.
BACK TO THE TOPIC...
Yes, someone mentioned that not buying the movie will result in never seeing another one of these again. You are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. Thus, our hands are tied. However, someone else mentioned something of a "Million Fanboy March." I think this is the most appropriate solution, since the letter writing is getting a little tedious, no? I for one would like to see every Scooby Doo episode released on DVD, for example, and it would be tough for all of us with our special interests to write a letter every single time we need something.
I say let's march -- because this goes WAY beyond (pardon the pun) just a Batman movie. Albeit a most excellent one.
-
I think we'll all feel a little sheepish if this isn't about the violence. Ooops.
But fuck it - LET MARCH ANYWAY!!!!! -
Vhy has no vun menchuned me for da part of Bruce Vayne? I don't have ein acchent anymore, I've got der build und I'm no schpring chicken. Everybody keeps talking about Charlton Heston, und Buzz Maverik told me Chuck shot off der tip of his schnitzle this morning. Mein schnitzle is schtill in vun piece. Chust ask Mahria ... vell, maybe you bettah not do dat, she gets kind of pissy about dose tings. She von't let me schmoke mein cigahs in der house, but I'm not vhipped. If I don't get der part, it's okay. I'm in talks mit Quentin Tarantino for der lead in his Vorld Var II movie. I vill be playink a character named Colonel Klink, who I underschtand is der leader of some ragtag band of commandos behind enemy lines, or someting like dat.
-
I love that quote. If only we had the WB place to write to. There's a WB building in Toronto... don't know the place. Harry must be able to find that out,right? Paul Dini sounds a fair bit pissed from that "NO COMMENT" speech on the same movie he should be hyping. let's get out a ****ing petition already enough talk!!!
-
er...woman.
-
Oct 03, 2000 6:44:17 PM CDT
THANOS X THIS IS NOT EDITING THIS IS CENSORSHIP! THEY ARE TWO DI
by superhero
I have seen this video and it stands perfect the way it is! We are NOT talking about editing a picture we are talking about taking parts out of an already COMPLETED piece to avoid controversy. While I have said it may be a bit too intense for some young children I DO NOT think it should be cut! This is an AWESOME animated piece that may lose a lot of its power if it is mollified just to save several lazy parents the trouble of not edjucating themselves as to whether or not it is suitable for THEIR CHILD! Why should those of us who want to see entertainment with powerful moments of intensity and emotion be denied seeing that so that a group of squamish, responsibilty avoiding parents can feel safe that they will NOT HAVE to do the job that they SHOULD be doing: keeping an eye on their kids. If parents don't want their kids to see violence than why do I see little kids at screenings of FIGHT CLUB, THE MATRIX, and yes THE EXORCIST! This isn't about not letting a director go willy nilly and spend inordinate amounts of money and talent on a film that will be mediocre. This is about a great piece of entertainment that may suffer because the moral majority must have their way when they are by no means even close to being the REAL MAJORITY. This has happened before and it will happen again but that does not mean that it is right and we should stand up against it. I mean not advertising rated R movies before nine PM? This is ridiculous! So what happens now? Will studios stop making R movies because they won't be able to advertise them as much therefore not getting the audience numbers that they want? Will studios veer away from R movies like they do NC-17 movies now? Will they only try to make PG-13 and below? THINK ABOUT IT! It really isn't so unbelievable! Now all we'll get is crap like She's All That! Does anyone REALLY think that this will stop younger people from going to see a rated R movie? WAKE UP!!!!! This is the REAL WORLD! I agree, we should organize. So if anyone is into that say so in the talkback and we can contact each other. We should have a rally! The link above won't work because I had to change my e-mail address but let me know and I'll contact YOU!!!!! I live in LA so if we can do something here that'd be great! Let's do this!!! Let's fight CENSORSHIP!!!!
-
Go to videopipeline.com and search under 'bat'. There is a poor quality trailer lasting 1.43 minutes that plays with mediaplayer v.7 Enjoy, and then fume.
-
Wow that IS cool looking! Hey here is a thought why don't the powers of be just release a Not Rated version for "us" and a Rated version for the kids like they did with the Spawn Animated Series?? Reason is probably cuz they don't want to watch the NR version fly off the shelves and be proved WRONG. B.S. like this topic just shows we have a long way to go to get to the same serious level of animation status of the Japanese. No censorship! ;)
-
Oct 03, 2000 8:52:59 PM CDT
Studio Suit: The Voice of Reason Amidst a Cacophony of Misguided
by village idiot
Although the more I read it, the more it sounds like he may just be doing some sarcastic rabble-rousing, Studio Suit is right! Read his post again. (Read it again. . .for the first time!) He's the real enemy here, not the Nazis! (Let's get him!) Rational capitalism. Fah! Damn that Adam Smith. The WB is merely taking its Lawn Darts off the market. This is not to suggest that anyone will necessarily have their feet impaled by the content of The Return of the Joker; however, as a marketing strategy geared towards their target demographic, it makes perfect sense. (Plus, we live in a culture saturated with violent images, blah, blah, blah, and all the rest of that annoying PC crap that is especially odious because it's fundamentally true.) Ah, but then again, what do I know? I'm just an idiot.
-
If we have recieved confirmation that ROTJ will be censored, please do a public service and take your screeners of te uncut version, digitize it as a movie file, and place it on the Internet using Scour or IMesh. Make the uncut version available to the REAL FANS! Just a suggestion...
-
IF they're not planning on releasing an Uncut version of the movie, I can see A LOT of people going out and doing what mthiel suggested in his post, about Scour.net. I'm sure the uncut version is going to be available all over the place. I've heard nothing but good things about this movie, and while Superhero might be right and it might make the movie a little more freaky if they cut the stuff out... That still wouldn't be Dini, Timm, and Burnett's movie and thats the movie I want to see.
-
I think that this is an excellent idea, but let's just hold out and make sure that the DVD has been delayed to alter the violent scenes instead of something far more acceptable like using the added time to add features, etc...
What happened to Dick Grayson in the Batman Beyond universe? Is he dead? I haven't seen the movie so I don't know how the joker's still alive, but it doesn't seem right that Terry McGuinnes is the bat to take him down. I'm hoping that Bruce Wayne still has a "Joker" up his sleave. -
Typical pandering for votes! Get up and attack Hollywood during the day ("...give them six months to clean up their act"), and then kiss their asses and take their special interest money the following night ("we would never become censors").
How a (formerly) decent man like Leiberman could ever ally himself with Gore (and embrace his policies) is beyond me. Then again, Leiberman was hitting Hollywood a lot anyway.
I consider the Batman Beyond butchery to be the first victim of censorship from a Gore-Leiberman wannabe administration. November will make sure that it's the last.
Stupid hypocrites!
-Phil
PS- This is especially ironic considering that one Batman Beyond episode implied that Gore would be the next president (Max quizzing Terry on late 20th C presidents). GAG! -
Politics need to stay out of Hollywood!!! I'm kinda pissed I'm going to miss some great ass-kicking action!!!
-
Oct 03, 2000 11:21:02 PM CDT
It's Bi-Partican guys...don't use this as a dig at whichever can
by andy travis
Yep, Gore/Lieberman have been high-profile on this topic in recent months, but republican congressman have said the same thing for awhile now, too. The fact is that to most people "animated" means "for kids", same with comics. Yeah, WB suits are scum-bags, that's nothing new. No matter which politican wins this November, this issue will remain long after the race is over.
-
hay stonehelper sorry about earlier but I just get alittle up tight about that stuff it was in the heat of passion and i applogize (yes that probably spelled wrong) but like you said back to the issue at hand. I agree with the idea of a march too art has always been and will always be a selective taste. I don't think its right to tell us what we are suppose to like and dislike. WB should have know the complication of having one of the most darkest characters in history as a kiddie show. Batman Is and will always be one of the most complex characters and if WB is fucking that up (yes we should really keep in mind that we don't have it confirmed) then like you guys said dont buy but get the real thing on line and then just piss those guys off cuz they always hate losing a few bucks.
-
No!...spellcheck...not...working...I'm...blacking...outtt...
-
I have a 14 minute video store promo tape and it clearly states on there that this thing is for kids between the ages of 6-12(give or take a couple of years). They give those ages about 500 times on it and the damn book that came with it.
-
My god... you're a complete fool.
VHS is still used more than DVD, VHS still allows recording which DVD doesn't. I prefer DVD. Most people DON'T.
If VHS is dead, then I guess so is regular TV. After all, that HDTV stuff has just completely replaced it, right?
Oh yeah, except that's a load of shit. -
Express.com has a higher quality trailer on the ROTJ DVD information page.
Also be sure to voice your displeasure with any possible edits at:
http://www.warnerbros.com/pages/messageboard/board.jsp?board=-536882600 -
I just watched the trailer at www.express.com and I must say, despite the shitty resolution of the downloaded trailer, I am very, VERY impressed with what I saw. Warner Brothers, please don't cut a second out of this immenent masterpiece. After hearing nothing but raving reviews over it, surely you can't risk cutting out a single moment in this film. Yes, film. I don't care who your intended audience is for this movie. It will be well-recieved by many Batman fans like myself who see all of the animated episodes as works of art and good story-telling. That's what makes this series such a success, not your toy lines. I very much hope that the delay is only for last-minute improvments, and that these rumors of censoring are false. In the very least, give us both a rated, and un-rated version so that we may pick-and-choose for ourselves.
-
Oct 04, 2000 2:21:52 AM CDT
Didn't they start editing the violence out of Bugs Bunny cartoon
by cruel shoes
-
Oct 04, 2000 4:08:35 AM CDT
Yeah, you never see that dog shoot himself at the end of that ca
by andy travis
I remember when that happened. Strange world.
-
If anyone could send me a copy of the screener I would pay them whatever amount of money they ask. Now, if I get my hands on a copy I will make sure to make millions of copys for everyone who doesn't want a watered down crap version of this movie for FREE. I do distribute fansubs so I can make a hefty amount of copies in a short amount of time. Just email me and lets see what happens
-
There is an excellent quality trailer on this unofficial site. it is better than the ones on harrys and dh sites. the address is
www.angelfire.com/de/quinn -
Don't think for a moment that just because this is a cartoon we're talking about it doesn't matter. Whether it's comic books, or movies, or whatever medium, censorship in any form is wrong. If an artist wants to tell a particular story, it's wrong for others to make him or her CHANGE that story to fit someone else's notions of morality. Because if we allow it, then what's to prevent them from stopping YOU or ME from speaking what's on our minds. It's one thing to protect kids from harm, but we must be careful and battle censorship whenever it rears it's ugly head. There are many other avenues to pursue in order to protect kids -- first and foremost being parental supervision. A lot of parents today use TV and videos as "babysitters", they just turn on the boobtube or pop in a video and let their kids vegitate without supervision. Sorry, but the answer is that parents should know what their kids are watching and make judgment calls about what's appropriate for their kids and what's not. That should not be the responsibility of the government or of the entertainment business. Batman fans are not just 6-12 years old. They should not censor the film-makers vision to appease certain special interest groups. FIGHT CENSORSHIP IN ALL ITS FORMS. If you think this is a trivial issue, then you, my friend, are missing the bigger picture.
-
especially when it's done for the benefit of five year olds...
-
I too would kill for a bootleg copy of the movie and would solemnly swear to distribute the copy to oters. I am willing to offer Monetary compensation to any one who is willing to give me a copy however I believe that it should be a public service to distribute any copy available freely. Anyway.....WB sucks!!
-
but not as much as the WB is sucking right now. I'd love a copy. I'm willing to pay a lot if its a good copy.
-
I for one REFUSE to buy a chopped up hunk of shit version of this film. I would like to get a copy of the press screener if anyone wants to sell me one. Fuck WB.
-
i have a copy of the unrated tape email me if interested in purchase or trade har1523@cs.com
Readers Talkback
User Login
Top Talkbacks
- Whitney Houston 1963 - 2012 -- 439 total posts 165 posts
- WTF HOLLYWOOD: SOLARBABIES -- 144 total posts 142 posts
- Herc’s Seen Tonight’s Return Of THE WALKING DEAD!! Discuss Also DOWNTON ABBEY, FEAR FACTOR, PAN AM, ONCE, SIMPSONS, DYNAMITE, LUCK, SHAMELESS, BAIT CAR, THE GRAMMYS And More!! Sunday Is Sweeps Day 11!! -- 153 total posts 138 posts
- Avid Comic Reader Hercules Does Battle With Tedium During Kevin Smith’s COMIC BOOK MEN! -- 55 total posts 47 posts
- There's a STAR TREK video game that is going to lead into JJ's STAR TREK 2 apparently... -- 196 total posts 45 posts
- If the Behind the Scenes Pics of the Day drops her pen, pick it up, but don’t look at her legs or else it will be on your record. -- 60 total posts 36 posts
- New JUDGE DREDD post production footage pops up -- 127 total posts 36 posts
- I am The Behind the Scenes Pics of the Day! No, I’m the Behind the Scenes Pic of the Day! -- 35 total posts 35 posts
- To Commemorate The 3D Release Of STAR WARS EPISODE I: THE PHANTOM MENACE, George Lucas Wants You To Know...Greedo Shoots First!! -- 513 total posts 29 posts
- The Sensorties Revisit The Friday Docback (And Still Smell)!! DOCTOR WHO Story #7 Again, The Coming Of Season/Series 7, And More!! -- 117 total posts 26 posts