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Euro-reporter Ethan takes a look at ACTION FILMS from a Euro point of view.
Father Geek here with another essay from Ethan, one of our Euro-reporters. He makes some good points in this "limited space" study, but like Edgard I don't agree with everything he says. We put this up as a subject for discussion, NOT as some absolute truth. Try to stay calm and reasonable in your talkbacks, and lets see where this leads us. It should be fun as well as informative. Remember Ethan is a native Europian not an American, he's from a different culture with different experiences than you, and he sees some things a little different, as does our brave Paris Editor Edgard who sprinkled his views thru out Ethan's text. Film criticism is opinion based, not fact. Try to stay to the issues covered here in their story just to keep it simple to follow and not toooooo longwinded. This is NOT the place to extend the debate on the "rewrites of history" controversy (We'll provide one of those spots another day), please stay on subject... and have fun!
Hi there ! Edgard here... A couple of weeks ago, Ethan wrote for Euro AICN a report on European directors working in Hollywood. Following the positive feed-back we had on this, Ethan proposed to go further and look at European in Hollywood action movies...
At first I hesitate because action films are tricky. First because the action films fans are usually very touchy; second because action cinema has changed a lot these last years... and any report on that would be too subjective (in contrast, the 80's were more easy to define : Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Reagan, etc... action films with muscles and no plot, Vietnam war revenge fantasy,etc..). But again, I thought why not ? If Ethan is willing to work on that, let him do it.
I told him : "Remember Ethan, this is not Mission : Difficult, it's Mi..." oh, hell you know the rest !. So here it is, Ethan proposed to look at some actors and directors from Europe who helped to define Hollywood Action Cinema. Remember he made some choices that you will probably disagree with, again we're not here to prove him right or wrong, we're here to hear what YOU think, not in a stupid agressive way but if possible in a smart and educated discussion. Here's Ethan then... (PS : to already launch discussion, I will add my personal comments in Ethan's text)
EUROPEANS IN THE MODERN HOLLYWOOD ACTION CINEMA
At first I hesitate because action films are tricky. First because the action films fans are usually very touchy; second because action cinema has changed a lot these last years... and any report on that would be too subjective (in contrast, the 80's were more easy to define : Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Reagan, etc... action films with muscles and no plot, Vietnam war revenge fantasy,etc..). But again, I thought why not ? If Ethan is willing to work on that, let him do it.
I told him : "Remember Ethan, this is not Mission : Difficult, it's Mi..." oh, hell you know the rest !. So here it is, Ethan proposed to look at some actors and directors from Europe who helped to define Hollywood Action Cinema. Remember he made some choices that you will probably disagree with, again we're not here to prove him right or wrong, we're here to hear what YOU think, not in a stupid agressive way but if possible in a smart and educated discussion. Here's Ethan then... (PS : to already launch discussion, I will add my personal comments in Ethan's text)
EUROPEANS IN THE MODERN HOLLYWOOD ACTION CINEMA
EUROPEANS IN THE MODERN HOLLYWOOD ACTION CINEMA
Action movies are the crucial commercial well for the Hollywood studios.This is why major Hollywood players try hard to maintain a high level of vitality in the genre.Lots of the refreshment for the genre comes from other countries and continents.Right now Hong Kong is under the spotlight but I am affraid that HK directors won`t make a big mark because studios wouldn`t let them transfer their vision on the big screen. Hollywood is only attracted to HK methods of action staging but Tinseltown folks can`t understand HK storytelling. John Woo will probably remain where he belongs,at the top, but the rest of the crowd will hardly be working with full freedom of creation.Tsui Hark,Kirk Wong,Corey Yuen and Wu-Ping will probably remain as substitutes.It is sad but that is the way that Hollywood works -unique HK vision is too edgy for Tinseltown mainstream. Europeans still remain as mainstream favourites since they use the well-accepted storytelling techniques while guys from the HK do things in their own manner. European stars are also a factor in action cinema since Hollywood needs lots of exotic acting talent because many of the top releases are set abroad.
Usually European action stars start off as supporting actors and after that they get leading roles.Three most important European action stars of today that came from European,non-English speaking countries are Arnold Schwarzenegger,Jean Claude Van Damme and Dolph Lundgren. There are of course other stars that fit this profile but only these actors really present an authentic institution in the world of action movies. Other actors don`t develop a unique body of work in the action genre while Schwarzenegger,Van Damme and Lundgren consistently stay true to actioners. This is the story about the Europeans who participated in the shaping of the world of action cinema as we know it.
** EDGARD'S OPINION : I agree here with Ethan about Hong Kong influence; it's there but except John Woo (who has already adapted his style for Hollywood), the other directors will have difficulties going mainstream. You need Americans directors like the Wachowsky to mix the different style and get a good result. As for European influence, that's where I disagree with Ethan... I don't think Europe is influent in that field today. The three actors named here above are icons of the 80's but - in my opinion - are over now as we knew them. BUT try to remember that outside America they have a huge fan base, and wherever they come from, they're from many foreigners still representing Hollywood **
ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER
Schwarzenegger`s acting abilities are limited no matter how he tried to expand them but when he gets to work with the top action directors he performs magic.His rise is connected with different social phenomenons that rocked US since the beginning of the eighties.First of all the feminist movement was spreading in an ambitious way and young suburban males felt that they needed a hero to look up to.Currently available heroes weren`t good enough-Clint Eastwood was good enough to fight Pauline Kael but he couldn`t defend the whole male population of the US. Stallone was on the rise but his first movies were vulnerable to criticism so male Americans needed a new hero.The needed icon came from Austria in the shape of the world`s most muscular athlete.But Arnold also had a brain and he realized that his muscles won`t be competitive forever.His career kicked off to a slow start in the 1970's.It took a crucial turn in 1982 when John Milius chose Arnold for the role of Conan.1982 was the year when Republicans ruled in the States and Milius provided the audience with the ultimate right-wing fantasy.`Conan the Barbarian` was the sword fighting revenge movie that rested most of it`s ideology on the writings of controversial Friedrich Nietzche. After Arnold`s career got boosted by the role of God-less,emotion-less avenger he made a Conan-sequel,a Conan rip-off (Red Sonja) a bunch of classic comic book yarns (Commando,Red Heat,Last Action Hero,Eraser,End of Days) and a fair share of disasters (Raw Deal,The Running Man,Kindergarten Cop,Junior,Batman and Robin,Jingle All The Way).Even though,he will be remembered by genre-defining masterpieces.Those are the movies made by directors that found the way to maximize Arnold`s potential and convert his muscles into an icon. First there was John Milius who managed to turn Austrian Oak into the American right-wing symbol.He was also helped by the fact that at the time,America was ruled by Raoul Walsh`s actor Ronald Reagan.Then came James Cameron whose zeal and storytelling perfectly matched Arnold`s posture in two Terminator pictures and`True Lies`.Cameron really developed Arnold`s actor persona since Schwarzenegger used his guidance to advance from the level of villain to the level of of the most bankable hero.
John McTiernan made two great influences on Arnold Schwarzenegger mythology.First he united Arnold with nature so he could beat the ultimate Atomic Age villain in `Predator` and after that he tried to show that Arnold only lives in popcorn cinema with `Last Action Hero`,the movie that was spoiled by `Columbia Pictures` executives. Finally,Paul Verhoeven created Arnold`s aura of hip, visionary star that is versatile and smart enough to do such witty projects as `Total Recall`.At the same time Ivan Reitman did all he could to destroy Arnold`s legacy with his dumb comedies.Neither Chuck Russell or Joel schumacher succeeded in the attempt to revive Arnold in the nineties.Andrew W.Marlowe`s script for `End of Days`was close to that goal but Peter Hyams once again proved that he is best suited to castrating other people`s ideas.`End of Days` was the school example of the `Post-1995 Scwarzenegger Vehicle` and Hyams managed to lower it on the level of the average mainstream action that won`t be remembered. Sadly,Arnold is 53 now and he has only a couple of big-time action projects left in him because his body will inevitably become an obstacle for his action roles in a couple of years.Roger Spottiswoode`s `6th Day` seems to be a pedestrian fare and `Collateral Damage` doesn`t sound groundbreaking. New Terminator installments sound cool but if you visit the well once too much,the well may get poisoned.If Cameron gets attached then the worries will take a holiday but with Tedi Sarafian (Deran Sarafian`s `Roadflower`) and David Wilson (unknown portion of McTiernan`s `Rollerball` remake) penning the scripts doubts remain. My opinion is that Arnie should fast-track Verhoeven`s `Crusade` and Cameron`s `True Lies`-sequel (with Cameron at the helm if possible) and that after those pics he can retire with great testamental movies.We can add Randall Wallace `With Wings As Eagles` project to this wish list only in case that the screenwriter Wallace gives the directing reins to the likes of Woo,McTiernan or Renny Harlin.
Whatever happens,Arnold Schwarzenegger`s star will shine bright in memories of the movie fans.Let`s just hope Arnie makes a couple more of movies thet will redefine action cinema as we know it. P.S.I hope that rumors of MGM setting up an action comedy for John Woo to direct and Schwarzenegger to star are true. ** EDGARD'S OPINION : Arnold is certainly an icon of the 80's and 90's for action films and I am curious to see if he has still what it takes to deliver a really cool movie. My problem with him is I always saw in him a business man more than an actor... someone who doesn't really take risk (he did it once with the first TERMINATOR but since then he's like Harrison Ford now : doing only things he did before). Even his comedies were constructed around his body. That's Arnold's problem : he's more a "body" than an actor. I know that Talk Backers will hate me for that but I think Stallone was more succesful to show he had acting abilities, that he was not just a "body"; the problem is that Sly is not as good for picking scripts and directors. There's a fun book to read about these icons of the 80's, it's called "Hard Bodies", I don't remember the author, but it explains how Reagan's politics and Hollywood Action Films were close on many levels... very fun to read
JEAN CLAUDE VAN DAMME
There was a short moment in time when Belgian Van Damme seemed destined to take the Hollywood action cinema into the next century.His success wasn`t based on his acting abilities or his choice of scripts.He simply got lucky. Van Damme`s career began in the ranks of martial arts where he became a well known competitor (this fact is controversial since there are rumors that he made up his martial arts career).Then he moved into movies. His first gigs began when Chuck Norris introduced him to the world of Menahem Golan/Yoram Globus-produced genre of `agricultural karate` movies. He slowly went up the ranks through collaboration with people like Albert Pyun (Cyborg),Sheldon Lettich(Double Impact,A.W.O.L) and Sho Koshugi (Black Eagle).His breakthrogh came when `Death Warrant` got released by MGM and `Double Impact` got released by `Columbia`.After `A.W.O.L.` made money for `Universal`,Van Damme finally established himself as the trademark action star.His problem of accented English though limited his appeal to American audience but his overseas popularity was huge(I remember that when `Double Impact` got released in the my homeland all the kids saw it so it became some kind of the communicational and cultural value in my hood).Only problem with Van Damme`s rise was that his movies still weren`t able to generate rich box-office in the US. Still his overseas results were so overwhelming that he soon moved into major releases.Working for majors improved the budget of his pics but his movies remained on the same level of dumbness.His martial arts style wasn`t unique so he wasn`t hip enough for the afficionados that found the solution in Hong Kong watching early Jet Li and already known Jackie Chan.Van Damme`s movies were at the same time too limited for the mainstream audience so he was caught in the gap.Studios weren`t ready to rise the budget because of his low appeal to mainstream audience and they did all they could to soften Van Damme up so he could still be seen by wide public.In the situation when Van damme`s product got too dumb for mainstream audience and too soft for the fans-Sam Raimi popped in. After the dissapointing `Universal Soldier` made by Roland Emmerich which failed to fully use the face-off between Van Damme and Dolph Lundgren came John Woo-directed,Sam Raimi-produced `Hard Target`.This movie is considered to be the best Van Damme flick ever and I think that this feature still holds that crown.We can`t count `Hard Target` among Woo`s top works but this actioner has energy and it completely reinvents Van Damme`s image.Maybe Van damme was a bit lightweight for Woo`s landmark gun action but he made a great job in acrobatic action sequences.Even though MPAA severely cut this movie it made decent money on the box-office. The same year Van Damme participated in Robert Harmon`s `Nowhere to Run` which took him nowhere in terms of the career development. Next year he starred in another Sam Raimi produced actioner named `Timecop`. This movie was made by Peter Hyams and it was as good as it gets when Hyams works with a routine SF/action script.This movie also made a solid gross for `Universal`.Same year `Sony` decided to put up a big budget movie for Van Damme and see how it works out.It went bad because they hired Steven E.De Souza (Commando) to shepherd the screen adaptation of the `Street fighter` video game.This project self-destructed and flopped since it was unwatchably bad.Van Damme managed to rebound a little bit with Peter Hyams-helmed `Die Hard` rip-off `Sudden Death` but in that moment his chances of a great big screen hit were jeopardized.Along came the promising phase of his career that was marked by works with HK masters of the cinema action Tsui Hark and Ringo Lam.Both Hark and Lam came to Hollywood with reputations of great HK authors.Their three Van Damme movies were cool but brutally underwritten.`Knock Off` even managed to present some nice stunts along the way.Van Demme`s outings with Ringo Lam and Tsui Hark were all amjor releases by `Sony` but none of these flicks did neither exceptionally well or bad.His coke problem soon sniffed his career off and he made a come-back to the direct-to-video turf with flops like `Desert Heat` and `Legionairre`.The `Universal Soldier`-sequel did disappointing business in theatres so now Van Damme desperately needs a commercial success.He is allegedly clean now and he is connected with two projects.At `Universal` he is all set to do `Abominable`,the big-foot horror-thriller (IMDB is actually attaching Renny harlin to this project but I doubt that he will sign to do it since he is right now preparing a couple of mainstream big-budget hip-flicks)and this project looks enjoyably trashy.The other project is yet untitled Ringo Lam serial killer pic with Michael Rooker.I will remind you that Ringo Lam presents one of the Hong Kong`s darkest action directors and that he made a couple of memorable Chow Yun fat pics and dark thrillers that were on the verge of the horror genre.Let`s hope that van Damme will revive his big screen career since his movies were at least an opportunity for young action directors to show-off their skills.
** EDGARD'S OPINION : What can I say about Van Damme ? Unfortunately for me he's the only actor from my home country known in Hollywood... Talk about bad image. I think everyone will agree that he can't act and when you read interviews or see him on TV, you can feel he's a dumb ass. But... still I used to watch his films with some pleasure, I enjoy more his films than the one with Steven Seagal for example whom I totally hate. Of course the last Van Damme movie I saw was MAXIMUM RISK so maybe I didn't see the worst yet. In my opinion, Van Damme will soon be totally forgotten... I hardly see how he could make a come-back, but again miracles do happen. The only positive thing about him was he went to HK to get Woo, Lam and Hark... of course only Woo really managed to get out of the "Van Damme" trap, but on paper it was a nice idea **
DOLPH LUNDGREN
As if I can hear talk-backers whining about me mentioning Dolph,but hey I couldn`t help it.He is one of the icons of the eighties action cinema and I got hooked on his style when I was a kid.It is like when you get hooked on milk-you don`t need it when you grow up but you still like it.Thet`s the case with Dolph.There are guys who deserve to be stars more than he does but this doesn`t mean that stardom should elude in such a way.Dolph began his Hollywood career as a late bloomer since he studied chemistry on the University.Actually he came to US with a scholarship that was provided by one of the rich American funds.The job of Grace Jones` bodyguard squeezed him into the movies.He had the misfortune to choose a couple of ill-concieved projects.Even though he managed to make a couple of good movies that can stand on their own even today.He began as almost an extra on John Glen`s 007-outing `A View To A Kill`.After that he was memorable as Rocky`s nemesis in `Rocky 4` which was the example of ultimate Hollywood mainstream camp. Suddenly Lundgren had the first opportunity to burst into stardom with `Masters of the Universe`the big screen incarnation of the toy franchise. He starred as He-Man the main action figure hero.Sadly this Gary Goddard-directed picture went bad and Dolph blew his first big break.James Cameron`s editor Mark Goldblatt hired Lundgren then to do the filmization of the Marvel Comics own `The Punisher`.In my memory this remains as the brutal,slick,cool and pyrotechnic movie in which Dolph faced/off against Oscar winner Lou Gossett Jr. and Dutch Jeroen Krabbe (of Verhoeven fame).Sadly `The Punisher` skipped the theatrical release in the US.The master of `bottom of the barrel schlock` Joseph Zito hired Lundgren to do `Red Scorpion` a really schlocky and violent pic about a KGB top-killer who is out to kill the leader of the anti-Communist rebellion in Angola (where Cubans used to make war remember?).The killer has a change of mind and he ends up chasing down Commies in Angola-so cool.I suggest you to see this one even though you shouldn`t expect to get the mainstream trash we usually consume.After this one he did Craig R.Baxley`s(check his masterpiece `Stone Cold`) `Dark Angel` a.k.a. `I Come in Peace` a slice of cop vs. alien shootout.Lundgren repeated his gig with Gossett Jr. on `Cover-Up` a neat little terrorist B-movie set in Israel.In 1991.came Lundgren`s second best movie ever-Mark L.Lester`s `Showdown in Little Tokyo`.This is the enjoyably schlocky bodycount given to us by `Warner Bros` (their redemption for making scary Meryl Streep stuff).This movie has everything-Dolph jumping over cars,Brandon Lee kicking ass all day long and adorable Tia Carrere as the outcome of all the action.Simply great guilty pleasure. Along came exploiatation `Joshua Tree` which had a couple of competent moments but overall it was a dissapointing helming gig of 007-stunt director Vic Armstrong.In 1995.Lundgren did two pics that were on the verge to bring him back to Hollywood mainstream.Both of these movies failed.The first one was Robert Longo`s `Tri Star` made cyber-punk flop named `Johnny Mnemonic`with Keanu Reeves.The second one was John Sayles-scripted `Men of War`,the mercenary story released by `Miramax`. None of these movies earned money so Dolph was pushed away to the world of `direct-to-video` action movies.In that sphere he made one great movie named `Silent Trigger` and directed by Russell Mulcahy. After this Lundgren remained trapped in the `direct-to-video` world.He was never destined to reach Arnold Schwarzenegger`s stardom but he could have became Arnie`s substitute e.g. Van Damme.It is a paradox that both of these actors fell out of the mainstream after working for majors.This means that majors haven`t got enough flexibility to respect the audience`s need for edgy entertainment.At the same time majors won`t let the independents to show their exploitation flicks in theatres because-hey,they need a million damn screens to give you Mel Gibson fighting for freedom or Denzel Washington boxing in prison.
** EDGARD'S OPINION : Don't know much about Lundgren as I am not a fan. I can only say that I think he has more acting abilities than a Van Damme or a Seagal, but again he's more a "body" actor than a character actor... and him too will probably soon disappear, unless he managed to get more second roles like in JOHNNY MNEMONIC, even if that film sucked I think Lundgren was quite okay in it **
DIRECTORS
There are many European directors doing actioners in Hollywood.I will exclude Brits and other English-speakers since they frequently collaborate with majors in their own homeland.It all sums up to four names-Renny Harlin,Paul Verhoeven,Jan De Bont and Wolfgang Petersen.
RENNY HARLIN
Talk-backers love Renny Harlin.So do I. I think that Renny is on of the greatest living action directors.He is great not just because of his style and editing but also because his rollercoaster rides are well-examined and set.He is the disciple of McTiernan`s `Die hard` school which means that each one of his set-pieces is not only lucrative to the plot but also it has the plot of its own.His movies are dynamic and they are full of energy and wit. I am not saying that all of his movies are masterpieces but most of them are.Remember `Die Hard 2`?`Cliffhanger`?`Long Kiss Goodnight`? These are cool goddamn movies.`Deep Blue Sea` is also important since it took the `Jaws` concept on another level.With this cross-over of `Die Hard`,`Towering Inferno` and `Jaws`,Harlin made a laughing stock out of Spielberg whose dinosaur attrocities look like decaf compared to Colombian coke (when you put them against Harlin`s pic).100% Colombian style of filmmaking won`t stop because Harlin is back with a vengance in this Stallone car racing pic.
PAUL VERHOEVEN
Good old Dutch.When it comes to action Verhoeven delivers the goods with top-notch precisison and cerebral qualities.When he does his movies he`s on fire and you can feel that when you watch `Robocop` or `Total Recall` or `Starship Troopers`.These movies are exceptionally well made and all of them contain great action,stunts and ideology.McTiernan and Cameron gave brains to the modern action cinema but Verhoeven filled it wet dreams and temptations.
JAN DE BONT
Jan De Bont`s reputation of McTiernan`s and Verhoeven`s DP gave him a chance to direct.After the great and intelligent high-octane actioner `Speed` his movies were getting dumber and dumber until they got unwatchable (De Bont`s `Dream Works SKG` phase).This shows that De Bont either isn`t smart enough to catch up with the progress of the film culture or studios force him to do films that have no scripts just concepts.Either way-each time I hear that De Bont is doing something I get scared.
WOLFGANG PETERSEN
Wolfgang is the `as good as it gets` studio hacker that can make a good thing look great and a bad thing seem watchable.When he is interested in the project it feels like magic.Else,see Air Force One`- a castrated script shot by a man who did nothing to save script`s balls.`In the Line of Fire` and `Outbreak` were great but `Air Force One` makes us wonder if Petersen will be as good as we want him to be. I feel that people may miss Brit directors but you have to understand that writing about them requires a lot of research and their influence is doubtful since one can hardly differ Brit commercial cinema from American. Some people also miss Luc Besson but I think that his comic-book inspired opus is finished and I am afraid that he`ll try to do some more mainstream Hollywood fare (historical pics,man vs.nature extravaganzas).His collaboration with Jet Li may prove me wrong.
Ethan
** EDGARD'S FINAL WORD : Ethan is a big fan of Renny Harlin, we all know that now. For me it's different, I feel in-between with that director. If I like all his films (yes, I even found some fun in CUTTHROAT ISLAND), I don't see him as a major action director. Maybe just a good "entertainment maker". Verhoeven is one of my gods so no need to say more. De Bont did SPEED and some cool things in TWISTER but that's it, he should go back to be a DP, there he was really good. And Petersen has great qualities but I am still waiting for a film that can be compared to DAS BOOT...
It's true I wish we could have talked about British directors doing action films here too... Tony and Ridley Scott, Simon West,... many more of course... but Ethan had to make choices. So here's an open call for any of you who wishes to extend this view on European Directors on Action Films : don't complain and send us your texts to OUR PARIS OFFICES !! And thanks to Ethan who worked a lot on this (his text was even longer and I had to make him cut !!
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Interresting article. You know, I think that the only thing missing was perhaps mentioning some of the europien stuntmen/women working in Hollywood (just mention by name, not say anything about them), cause there's lots of 'em. If you ask me, the only action-actor mentioned on this site that doesn't stink is Sylvester Stallone (only mentioned once as "Sly")
Greetings from Norway -
Roland's definitely European. Maybe he's a comic-book pop-pulp formula hack, but if you carefully study his movies you see his style carries influences of Ridley, Cameron, and McTiernan - not merely the obvious Spielberg-Lucas potshots which most critics usually complain about. ..... Britain's Tony Scott makes prettier images than anyone else, although the stories are not always as "human" and intelligent as they could be. No Euro director has ever come close to McTiernan's perfect action style, though Besson's Professional was a worthy masterpiece. A youngish European director who COULD have become good is Danny Cannon... his Young Americans with Harvey Keitel was very stylish. Unfortunately he was not allowed to control the story of Judge Dredd, so that promisingly stylized megabudget movie was turned into a horrible flop by its producers, its writers (including Steven de Souza), and Stallone. Their idiotic egos RUINED any possibility of Danny Cannon telling a good Dredd story. Whoever decided that Dredd needed Rob Schneider as a wisecracking comic sidekick should be dipped in BBQ sauce and fed to Rosie and Oprah. Unfortunately for Danny Cannon, he then elected to direct the sequel to the teen-slasher IKWYDLS, which had a terrible screenplay by Trey Calloway (remember his UPN "ER meets Star Trek" series Mercy Point? EGADS!) This sequel was VERY stylish, but it was also STUPID and NOT SCARY at all. So Danny's not likely to get many more job offers for US studio projects. I love Danny Boyle but he's blown his chances, and so has City of Lost Children's Jeunet, who made a very mediocre Alien 4 with Joss Whedon. (Vincent Ward or William Gibson should have been allowed to tell their story instead, pretending as if Fincher's Alien 3 was just a dream-sequence interruption in the series). Renny Harlin is a hack - he's to directing what Van Damme is to acting. If Harlin doesn't improve, he's going to be going the Russell Mulcahy / Stephen Hopkins route (remember Hopkins, anyone? Wasn't he British?). Paul Anderson (Mortal Kombat, Soldier, Event Horizon)is in just as much trouble, unless Tom Cruise can revive him with Death Race 3000. Regarding Van Damme's stinkeroos, Streetfighter's writer/director Steven de Souza was NOT hired by Sony....rather, SdS was hired by CAPCOM - the video game company...and the movie was then released by Universal. And the Van Damme-Hyams Die Hard ripoff Sudden Death was NOT their idea...that movie was the "brainchild" of the owner of the Pittsburgh hockey franchise, who wanted to shoot a movie in his stadium. What a friggin geek I am.
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Being an American, living in America, and growing up in the late 80s/early 90s, each of these figures was an important part of my filmwatching life...
AND THEN I WENT TO JUNIOR HIGH.
So, time went on, and I started to explore movies beyond the realm of Schwarzenegger and Cameron. Kubrick. Kurosawa. You know, all that stuff that film students watch while they masturbate. Then, a few years later, I stumbled onto a little film called Hard Boiled on late night Encore. To a high school freshman, growing up in the testosterone drenched 80s-90s, it seemed to be nothing new. "Yeah, guys with guns. Gee whiz. [double take] Holy fucking shit, did that guy just slide down a banister on his back?" Now, this isn't to say that Hong Kong cinema is the zenith of story telling or direction, but compared to Hollywood action, they're American fucking Beauty. An irony in that comparison, I think. $20 to anyone who can figure out what Tequila puts in his drink in Hard Boiled. Looks like Alka-Seltzer to me. Anyways, to sum it up, um... Hm. Seems that I've lost my train of thought here. Anyways, congratulations to Harry on becoming an uncle, and congratulations to Father Geek for being promoted Grandfather Geek. -
Emmerich is a director of spectacles. I haven't seen him realize a good action sequence yet... maybe I'll change my mind after seeing The Patriot.
Petersen is and qill probably remain the best of the euro-bunch. He certainly is the best german director working in Hollywood. -
Aren't we forgetting the great action films to come out of NZ?? You know, landmark events like . . . . er . . . . well, there was BATTLETRUCK in 1982. Try to imagine Mad Max, without Mel Gibson, one-twentieth the budget, half-assed script, crap NZ actors looking completely out of their depth as usual (don't believe me? - take a look at the bit-part actors on Xena and Hercules), and a total box office of about NZ$2.95. Oh and Edgard, what's it like in Paris tonight? Is being surrounded by celebrating, drunk, and smug Frenchmen as bad as it sounds? (2-1!!!! ALLEZ FRANCE!! Just kidding). Start running and don't stop till you hit London, I say. I'll take you out to a pub, buy us both a beer, and we can cry into them over how shit Belgium and England were.
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I believe that right now, in America, there's a huge interest in bad-ass special forces, special ops, espionage and that kinda stuff. Maybe it's due to Tom Clancy's influence on the males of America, I don't know. Tons of books and games like Rainbow Six, Rogue Spear, Goldeneye, Syphon Filter, SWAT3D, Metal Gear Solid, etc. They all sell REALLY well. I've also noticed many more Navy SEAL and SWAT specials on TV. Various elite forces are suddenly featured looking badass in flicks by Besson, Bruckheimer, De Bont, and Woo. Therefore, I'm convinced that a Van Damme movie about the famed French counterterrorist team, the GIGN, could be a big hit. They've got the cool factor all tied up: Their outfits and gear look cool as hell. They've got a good real-world rep that might help the film internationally: That successful storming of a terrorist-held airplane which made all the news programs a few years back was excecuted by none other than the GIGN. Finally, they're French! Van Damme (I know he's not from France per se) is better when he plays French. I just think you could make one hell of an action movie with these guys. They operate in the city, too. Heat-style street shootouts. Tense Leon/Professional-style room-clearing scenes. Massive building firefights. The striking image of heavily armed 'gendarmes' silhouetted against sunny Southern France backdrops. Hell, you could even recreate the re-taking of the airplane. Dammit, Harry was raving about a SWAT script that Arnie dropped (in favor of some piece of crap like Eraser or EOD), so Van Damme has a chance to swoop in and make a great hard-action film about a subject that's basically hasn't been done right in Hollywood in years (Delta Force and Navy SEALs blew, as did Bruckheimer's Soldier of Fortune TV BS).
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There is no way in hell Stallone is better than Arnold! Besides "Rocky" and "Cliffhanger" what good movie has Stallone ever been in? I mean sure Arnie's had his stinkers("Last Action Hero" and "Batman and Robin")boy has he had his stinkers!! But, they come nowhere near as bad as Stallones'! Take "Over The Top" for example. Who on the Sweet Lord's Earth thought a movie about arm-wrestling would be a good movie?!?! Who??? And not only that, the guy arm-wrestles to gain custody of his son!!!!!! What's next a film about thumb-wars??? "Hey Yo, I Declare A Thumb War!" And then there is the "Rambo" films, why are we supposed to root for Rambo in "First Blood Part II" when he murdered innocent people in the first one?!?! Did Cameron think when he wrote that script? What about "Stop Or My Mom Will Shoot!"? I don't think I even need to talk about that one! Or what about "Oscar"? Or "Tango&Cash"? Or (God help us) "Rhinestone"? Or "Judge Dredd"? Or "Assassins? Or "Daylight? Or "Cobra? Or all the crappy "Rocky" sequels?Or....well, I could go on and on but I won't. It is unnessecary, I have made my point. Bye.
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There is no way in hell Stallone is better than Arnold! Besides "Rocky" and "Cliffhanger" what good movie has Stallone ever been in? I mean sure Arnie's had his stinkers("Last Action Hero" and "Batman and Robin")boy has he had his stinkers!! But, they come nowhere near as bad as Stallones'! Take "Over The Top" for example. Who on the Sweet Lord's Earth thought a movie about arm-wrestling would be a good movie?!?! Who??? And not only that, the guy arm-wrestles to gain custody of his son!!!!!! What's next a film about thumb-wars??? "Hey Yo, I Declare A Thumb War!" And then there is the "Rambo" films, why are we supposed to root for Rambo in "First Blood Part II" when he murdered innocent people in the first one?!?! Did Cameron think when he wrote that script? What about "Stop Or My Mom Will Shoot!"? I don't think I even need to talk about that one! Or what about "Oscar"? Or "Tango&Cash"? Or (God help us) "Rhinestone"? Or "Judge Dredd"? Or "Assassins? Or "Daylight? Or "Cobra? Or all the crappy "Rocky" sequels?Or....well, I could go on and on but I won't. It is unnessecary, I have made my point. Bye.
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I'm sorry for posting my idiotic opinions twice. I posted once and it didn't show up so I posted again,only to see my post twice. Sorry, I know my views are annoying especially twice. Bye.
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Am I completely alone when I say that this movie should not have been buried by Jurassic Park in 1993? Here you had, about 3 years before Scream was released, a movie that deconstructed everything about action movies (the car chases, the eternal gunplay, cops and robbers, etc.) and then glued them back together into a fun movie. I don't think any star (besides Brando in The Freshman) has so thoroughly mocked and deflated themselves as well as Arnie did. Examples abound: The ad for T2 featuring Sylvester Stallone, the kid telling Arnie that "I'll be back" is in ALL his movies, Arnie stumbling over his own name! What can I say, I enjoyed the hell out of it. Does anyone out there agree with me? Peace.
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What the hell was wrong with "Tango & Cash," crimsonrage? And "Last Action Hero" wasn't that bad . . . the first time I saw it. It was worse after I'd seen it and the action scenes lost their luster. "The Running Man" was good too, I still kinda like that one. I don't think it qualifies as an Ahhnold disaster. I actually liked "Cutthroat Island" (please don't ask me why because I really don't know; I've never been able to think of a reason, I just like it). And no, I'm not a complete idiot based on liking these movies. My favorites are movies like "Unforgiven," "A Simple Plan," and "Fallen." If you're gonna call me an idiot, at least make it because I like these three movies, not because I have an inexplicable affinity for not too great action flicks. I don't think Van Damme is ever going to hit mainstream success, especially after those rumors (?) that he got his ass kicked in a nightclub in New York City. That's hard to live down if you're an action star. And it's not like he's had a stellar movie career up to this point, anyway. Arnold better get on the ball with his aging movie career before he's forced to retire as a guy that lost his ability to make a decent movie. There's my input.
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Jul 03, 2000 1:28:47 AM CDT
Shallow by well-made Stallone stuff: Demolition Man, Rocky 3 &4,
by wesley snipes
Demolition Man is one of Stallone's best movies and pretty much as good as any Schwarzeneggar flick save T2 & Predator (Predator is less ambitious anyway). Demo Man perfectly blends action and comedy, has a clever sci-fi script, and has direction which is stylish yet never so heavy-handed that it gets in the way of the action. Rocky 3 & 4 just work. They get you excited despite the final outcome being known before the start of the movie. Rocky 4 is also waayyy ahead of its time as far as its "MTV" approach to moviemaking goes, with all its music montages and flashy camera/editing tricks. Rambo films.. uh, they're stupid and First Blood Part 2 is an abomination, but Part 3 has some great action scenes. Tango & Cash is another Stallone vehicle that very effectively blends big action with comedy. Frankly, I'd take this over Arnie shit from the same period like Commando and Raw Deal. **** IMHO Arnie's filmography comes off better than Stallone because 1) Arnold happens to have more all-time classics, and 2) Arnold takes less risks and therefore has made fewer truly shitty movies. He seems to choose safe and mediocre over untried and unknown most of the time. Offense gets the glory, but defence wins the game... :)
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Jul 03, 2000 1:30:22 AM CDT
Action Shmaction, don't get me started here 'cause "I'll be baaa
by bari umenema
No offense to Ethan & Edgard, but aren't we in the vaunted New Millenium now where LARGER THAN LIFE 80's and 90's He-Men are considered passe? Wasn't "The Matrix" supposed to point the New Way toward Futuristic Action? Didn't I read about this right here on these Talkback Boards?? 1): Let Arnold Be Arnold! Agreed, give us CRUSADE, TL2, T3, DOC SAVAGE, WINGS OF EAGLES then it'll be time to say "Hasta la vista, big guy; we hardly knew ye." Van Damme and Lungren aren't worth commenting on. Stallone is but he's not European, nevertheless, here goes: the reason Sly wants to do yet another "Rocky" pic is because he struck out in trying to reinvent himself with "Copland" so it's off to the races he goes in "Champs" which will probably be so riddled with cliches it'll be unwatchable after a couple of laps (even with Harlin in the driver's seat). (Rent "Le Mans" or "Grand Prix" if you want to see a kick-ass car racing movie, Le Mans with Steve McQueen in docu-drama real-time style, Grand Prix with James Garner. As for De Bont, he peaked on "Speed" and has been flailing about more-or-less helplessly ever since with the tangled-up "Twister", over-cooked Speed 2: Cruise Control and lethargic "Haunting" of last summer, though I will say that Catherine Zeta Jones was yummy indeed, but then she always is. "Hollow Man" looks very cool so here's hopin' it's Vintage Verhoeven. As for Wolfgang, he's the creme de la creme: "Air Force One" was fantastic fun! "In the Line of Fire" was superb suspense and "Outbreak" was also decent... "Perfect Storm" is majorly cool f/x wise and totally intense in its last hour or so. Emmerich peaked with ID4 and will NEVER -- repeat NEVER -- attain that level of high-octane success again. Next!
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Uh who cares about europe? I mean come on. Really!?! Sure there good at one thing.........starting wars!!!!
Well thats really one countries fault isn't it? And the French BAH who needs em? All they do is whine and bitch about us Americans. And when it comes to war all they do is roll over! Now England is not really that bad, that is if you like the cloudy, rainy gray weather. And there lame ass food. Irelan, Scotland same as England, but different accent. Um Italy is cool cuz of Rome and shit, plus I dont want to mob coming and killin my ass. Um who else is over there? Oh yeah Germany.....now I am German, but there fucked up too. Have you seen some of the fucked up shit that comes out of Germany? There sick Mo Fos. Plus there probably gonna start another war. What else.......the Swiss there cool, except for that whole steeling jewish gold in ww2, well ok they really didnt steel it, but they knew it was stolen. You just know that one day there gonna start some shit and kick all our ass's(spelling??) The Netherlands, and all those countries are just there. Amsterdam...cool.
NOW IF YOU HAVENT FIGURED IT OUT BY NOW I AM JOKEING WITH YOU ALL. I dont want any one to get offended. I my self am German, English, and a little pussy French. but the country I do not like is those damn Canadians, they wanna be America sooooo bad. There just pissed they didnt kick Englands ass when they had the chance, and whats with sayin ABOOT, and not ABOUT?? There not even a real country!!
OKOKOK I know this had nothing to do with Eouropean talent but I just thought it would be funny. I really have nothing agenst and of the said countries!!! I realize with out them America would not exist. Well with out America though Canada would have no culture!!(joke) One good thing about Canida is they have some funny mother fuckers up there, All the kids in the hall, all the people from the Vacant lot, Mike Myers, and a to others. One thing I really dont get is English Comedy! I mean some of Monty Python is funny, but come on what the hell is up with Benny Hill?? Ther funniest thing was the original Whos line is it any way? But then again most the people on that show were Americans, or Canadians....sooooo.
Well I hope no one is really offended by this or any thing!!
peace out love
all of you and
your countries
the_roc -
Besides "Rocky" and "Cliffhanger" the guy has done "Cop Land" and the voice of Weaver in "Antz". And he occationly acts, Arnold can't act.
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I'm not sure but I don't think anybody mentioned Quest! Now, let me just state that I personally think that Van Damme smells like a 83 year old unhygenic trout farmer, well I did until I saw The Quest, which he actually directed!! It's as if he just said "Screw it! I'm gonna just make a kickass kung fu competion film with very little plot get some great martial artists from around the world stick em in a fighting ring and choregraph some cool fights, then I'll ask Roger Moore if he wants to be in it for a laff. And the formula works!! What a class film, the chinese Monkey kung fu guy is amazing, who ever hasn't seen this film go rent now, you will not regret. On a final note, Schwarznegger is an Icon I think he is untouchable with films like Predator and the Terminators just wish he would do Crusade, Sly stallone has only impressed once and that was Rocky but he was playing a punchy boxer, (He would have been cool as Dredd but he took his helmet off and it went downhill from that point) Lundgren, I did actually like Punisher but mainly because of that cool opening Monolgue, "Why is it that the guilty run free, etc." but still he's not really leading man material. Anyway, thats it go see The Quest.
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Oh yeah, and "Demolition Man" and "Stop Or Mum Will Shoot!". Those were good too.
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Allthough I doubt a movie directed by Van Damme don't stink. Anyway, I thought I would give an advice myself. If it is possible, go see "Hamilton". It's a swedish action-film directed by norwegian Harald Zwarts (who's flirting with Hollywood now). I don't know if you can even get your hands on it, but you should. Why? Well, it kicks ass. Peter Stormare plays Hamilton and the bad guy is played by...get ready...Mark Hamill.
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Quest is nothing but a shitty remake of Bloodsport. And that movie kicked some ass.It had an R rating compared the PG-13 action of Quest. All Van Damnit I Suck was doing was trying to cash in by the fact that alot of people havent seen bloodsport so that he could make a movie with no need to come up with an original story. Hell he even wrote Quest. I'm out.
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Thanks for telling the real thruth about "Quest". I've changed my mind and I'm not gonna' see it. Thanks for makin' me not waste my time. By the way, Luc Besson and Gerard Pires' "TAXI" really kicks ass. Thought that just should be said.
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The problem with action films began when action became a genre some time in the 80s. Action should be a component, not an end unto itself. It can be used in Westerns, Crime Dramas, Science Fiction, Fantasy, Horror, etc. When used right, action can help define character and tell the story. James Cameron is particuarily adept at moving a story along with action. The original Die Hard was a good example of telling a story with action. The Die Hard sequels are good examples of a series of WHAMMIES strung together that don't equal jack. The Hong Kong stuff that seemed so great in the early 90s looks like it's going to date badly. Something new needs to come along, hopefully with some brains and respect for the audience and if our European friends can help us out in that department, it would be appreciated.
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How's about you don't listen to either of us seeing as you got no idea who we are and just watch the film and make your own mind up, I'd hate for you to miss out on some class kung fu if your a fan of martial arts in the movies.
And as my user ID suggests I've seen plenty. -
I really can't tell why Harry publishes this guy's articles. He is way below the standard of the other AICN regulars. Moriarty's articles are awesome. They're intelligent, knowledgeable, insightful and well grounded. Harry tends to babble a bit and bring in too much personal stuff, but you can't beat his enhusiasm. But this guy's not on the level. His knowledge is lacking, his English is terrible, and his tastes are questionable. Renny Harlin should get out of Hollywood and do commercials for semitrailers and motorcycles, which would be a better use of his "range" and "depth". His movies exemplify everything detestable about Hollywood. They're ultraviolent, shallow, flashy, and exploitative. Schwarzenegger always enters into projects with the wrong approach: "How much will you pay me" instead of "will it be any good". I adore the first Conan and Predator as well as the Terminators, but you can have the rest for free. Van Damme? Lundgren? Who cares about these 80's straight-to-video stars? Why not do an article on Chuck Norris while you're at it? Today's rising action stars are 20 years younger than these guys, and have the little bonus of actual acting skills. Both Peterson and Verhoeven are great, though.
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Just to clear this up once and for all, everyone in England fucking HATES Benny Hill. EVERYONE.
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Jul 03, 2000 6:17:00 AM CDT
Reverend Dave is right... Last Action Hero is good (Thought it c
by mcbane
The problem with this 'european' influence on Action films article, is that it is crap. I mean these guys just happened to be around. They looked fucking hard holding guns, they were cheap, didn't know about acting guilds, couldn't say the word no and probably didn't bother reading the scripts they were given, because they couldn't or didn't care. However, I agree that their international appeal, was probably what allowed them to become so big. But I beg everyone to ask the question. Why ARE europeans put in films? These guys were LUCKY enough to make big screen heroes. But what about all the other foreigners? Two words. Bad Guys. When was the last bad guy in a film American? I mean can you actually remember? Granted they will be bodyguards or footmen, but NEVER the head honcho. Usually it is scandinavians, or arabs or latinos or weird european speakers with stupid accents threatening god's greatest democracy. And of course, lets not forget the English. Being English myself, I am quite blatantly biased in this respect. But we all know from Hollywood that the English are evil imperialists secretly. And I also know from Braveheart, The Patriot, Rob Roy and Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves, that the English in the past were murderous, child killing rapists. Hey did I say past???
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This guy Ethan has wit but he ain`t got no balls.I mean okay maybe I went over the top once but look at him-he has the right instincts but he ain`t going all the way.
Enter Milius.The greatest living American ideologist.The NRA executive.Cool without a doubt.And while Milius invented people like Arnie and made big American patriotic flicks Emmerich was still trapped in Germany hacking some bad German-US co-productions.Now this German hacker explains Americans what American freedom really is.It`s blasphemy.I mean Emmerich represents the studio system which has Stalinistic and deeply Anti-American methods while Milius fights that system.Let me remind you that Milius invented guys like Zemeckis,Lucas and Spielberg...
I think that also Ethan should have praised Mulcahy more since this guy pulled-off `Silent Trigger` all on his own.
I love Lundgren so kudos to Ethan about him.
Be brave Ethan take it all the way.
God bless
Dima -
Well thats good! I'm glad that you all hate that Limey Bastard!
hows my English slang?Any way I assume your English so I am also happy that you wernt pissed about my post! -
Though it's true Arnold physically is running out of time to do the kinds of films he's done before, I wonder if he has a future as an "elder statesman" figure in action films. Charlton Heston and Sean Connery can pull this off with varying degrees of success. Connery has tremendous charm that doesn't fade no matter how old he gets, though he seems to get stuck in more bad movies than good lately. Heston probably turns off a lot of people because of his political activism, but he still has that piercing gaze and that incredible voice, so if he shows up in a movie now and again, the audience is usually willing. I'm not sure Arnold has these qualities. He could probably play the evil executive or the has-been mentor to a younger star, but would Arnold himself still be a star?
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Did anybody know that Bruce Willis was born in Germany?
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But I wasn't like, oh I'm gonna' see it, anyway. Wasted a lot of time watching "Universal Soldier". It's not like "oh, I'm not gonna' see it cuz any of you said it, when I thought about it, I wouldn't see it. But this is a complete uninteresting and self-sentered posting. What in hell am I doing. Um. Europeans. Right...Casper van Dien. He's gota be European (Just guessing by his name here) OK, maybe he's just done one biggie yet (Starship Troopers), but damnit, one OK flic and actually some acting is better than 40 Arnie-flics with no acting, no soul, no plot, just fighting and exlpotions(who with a bit of luck won't look like basement blow-up crap). OK, this was a stupid input. I'm going to stop it right now.......
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You are SO right about Renny Harlin. By the way, did you star in "Deep Blue Sea"???
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