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Will the REAL Jack Ryan please stand up' SUM OF ALL FEARS
Hey there cuddily bear, Harry here. Ya know, typically I try to stand far and wide away from some of the 'campaign issues' that come up in fandom... but ya know what? This was a case where... dammit... the people are right. I remember when Harrison Ford took over the Jack Ryan franchise, I felt it was an unnecessary deal... I loved Alec Baldwin in the first film. I liked how Baldwin didn't feel like an action hero, but like an analyst... which really... that's what Jack Ryan is. When I got the letter from Admiral James Greer regarding his idea to build a campaign to 'bring back Alec Baldwin', my initial thoughts were... "Yea... Riiiight, that's an easy pitch... replace Harrison Ford with Alec Baldwin, there's no way that'd happen!" But ya know what... there is a way. First, let's look at the numbers:
The Hunt For Red October - 120,702,326 domestic with only 59 million (negative + prints and advertising costs)
Patriot Games - 83,216,364 domestic, but with 76 million (negative + prints and advertising costs)
Clear And Present Danger 122,010,252 domestic, but with 73 million (negative + prints and advertising costs)
As you can see, besides the money brought in... the big difference is in costs. There seems to be a 14 million to 17 million dollar difference. That cost is almost all, if not all, Harrison Ford's paycheck. I loved PATRIOT GAMES, beyond just as a movie, it was the last film I saw with my mother before she died. But I didn't care all that much for CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER... BUT... THE HUNT FOR RED OCTOBER ruled the friggin earth. I say... bring back Alec and McTiernan and Poledouris and have at it. Let's see some Jack Ryan doing his thing! And with Alec... you can afford a really strong supporting cast as well!
I'm writing hoping to start some sort of campaign to bring Jack Ryan back to the screen with Alec Baldwin. If Sean Connery did it in 'Diamonds are Forever', I think Baldwin should be given the same courtesy. I think if word starts spreading that Tom Clancy fans want the original Jack Ryan back, Producer Mace Neufeld will have a much better time deciding who will fill the shoes. This franchise is much too valuable for those involved not to consider this. I mean Baldwin's gotta be available and cheaper, give him the $8 million (how much is that worth in movie money nowadays?). Ford did a great job but he's moving on, I think so should we. Baldwin is such a talented actor and the part suits him to a tee, I think he deserves a second shot at the brass ring. What do ya think?
Adm. James Greer (aka John Patrick)
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Red October was far and away the best *movie* of the three, Baldwin or no Baldwin. (where're the Canadian planes when you need them) Patriot Games was pretty good, C&PD was decent at best. I think the numbers you posted reflect that more than anything - Hunt was the second best sub movie ever made. (first, of course, goes to Wolfgang Petersen's masterpiece)
However, I *do* feel Baldwin fit the Ryan role better than Ford did. You can argue that Ford is a better actor (he is) but he's not a better *Ryan*, which is who the story is supposed to be about. -
When I watch Patriot Games or Clear and Present Danger, I say to myself -- hey, this is a good movie. When I watch The Hunt For Red October(which i did today), I can't go five minutes without saying out loud to no one in particular what a spectacular movie it is. I don't just feel that way at the end when I think about what happened, it's EVERY five minutes that something cool enough happens that makes me think this is one of the greatest films made. This is largely due to the performance of Alec Baldwin as Jack Ryan - as many people have said, this character seems to fit him perfectly. I've heard different stories about why the change was made from Baldwin not wanting to continue the series to harrison rejecting the part for Hunt and then basically stealing it from Baldwin after Hunt did so well. I don't know which is true, but what I do know that Baldwin towers over Harrison when it comes to Jack Ryan. Thanks for listening to my rant. I'm going to pop in Red October for another view. I suggest everyone else who has it does the same...
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Alec baldwin is not a star any more. he can not open a movie. even in HUNT it was connery who opend the movie not baldwin. I love Alec as an actor but we have to be realistic. no one will give him the lead in a major actioner.
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Alec has gained quite a bit of weight in the last few years (maybe for a role...?)...He probably hogged down when newly-minted Oscar Hooch was down shooting that Travelogue thing...Anway-he'll lose the lbs...BRING BACK ALEC AS RYAN. -
Jun 12, 2000 2:36:19 AM CDT
I went to see 'Hunt' because it was a cool looking submarine mov
by superninja
Explain U-571? There was no one really worthwhile to carry that film. People like movies about submarines. As for Baldwin returning...no. He's bloated. He's Travolta-bloated. And Harry Ford's Jack Ryan has sucked since Day 1. In fact, I'm not really interested in seeing any more Jack Ryan films, since I don't like Clancy anyway, and I'm thankful that I got the wonderful Hunt For Red October out of it.
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Jun 12, 2000 2:39:42 AM CDT
Btw...I'll give a special prize to anyone who can name a submari
by superninja
Go ahead. Try it. I really don't think you'll come up with anything. And I'm not talking about a film in which a sub "appeared". There is not a single film in the history of cinema about submarines that has failed.
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At least he has something that resembles a passing interest in the art of acting and making movies, unlike auto-pilot Ford. Nobody else has went from such a string of cool and interesting movies, to then make a string of the most bland tepid shite ever. He has totally given up. Look at him passing on TRAFFIC, must have been too much like hard work. Did he do this with his carpentry work too? I wouldn't even want him to do Indy again, the dude has given up man.
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Down Periscope
That wasn't so hard. -
There's my movie critic-style quote for the day. It's true though, "October" is the one great fucking Tom Clancy movie. "Patriot Games" is very good, save for that lamer than lame speedboat chase, and as for "Clear and Present Danger"...well, it had some good moments at least (especially after I played Rainbow Six for the first time and started recognizing characters from the game - holy shit, it's "Ding" Chavez!). Still, "October" stands alone as not only a great Clancy flick, but one of the best action/suspense movies of all time. I join the pro-Baldwin brigade. Bring the tubby man on. Ford, sadly, is just getting a little too old, and seems disinterested anyway. Can Baldwin open a movie by himself? Maybe, maybe not. He's not a *total unknown* though! And if they could somehow re-unite McTiernan ("Thomas Crown Affair" remake was good, dammit!) and Poledouris...you might not need a big scenery-chewing star to draw an audience. Anyway, I'm in. Now what? We write to our respective congressmen?
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This sub flick was so bad I don't even remember the damn title of it. It had the youngest Baldwin (Steven?) in it, and some chick who's name I don't remember. Anyway, they played researchers in some sub, and I remember the movie ending where the top of the sub came up through the ice in the arctic. It was a pretty bad movie that I think was in theatres for about 37 minutes. If only I remember the damn title.
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I'm sure I've written something like this recently, but here goes again ...
I'm not really a big fan of the Jack Ryan flicks. Infact, I'm not. However, I think Red October had a cool brooding atmosphere, mostly with all the Connery bits. As for Alec Baldwin, I think he was the better of the 2 Ryans. He was younger (which I think is important), and he seemed more like the analytical mathematical type. A fish out of water. Harrison Ford brought with him a great sense of "WOW! Harrison Ford will kick butt cos he did in Indy and Star Wars!!!".
Unfortunately Baldwin isn't really a drawcard for a great number of folks. I think it would be a smart move to re-install him for the fans, but maybe another actor is what the studio should go for. Not being a great Jack Ryan fan I can't really pick an actor as a suitable candidate, without you guys "shooting me down in flames". LOL, but I will try. David Duchovny hasn't really got a big screen presence at the moment, but he is certainly popular as Mulder in the X-files (I'm no fan of that show either!). He seems youthful and could definiely pull of the investigative type of character. Also being from a mainly TV background (?), I think he could be affordable and this would allow the studio to employ a major major support cast, quite possibly of the likes of Robert De Niro, Sean Penn, Sigourney Weaver or Jack Nicholson. John McTiernan also seems to be able to direct stuff like this with his eyes closed (though not always successfully). If he couldn't be available maybe a director like Milos Forman, Tony Scott, or Martin Campbell. (I'm not putting these guys all in the same boat, but they would have their own styles of bringing the character to the screen.) So, what's the opinion this Duchovny guy???? -
Baldwin IS Jack Ryan. Ryan is not the tired-looking, finger-waving, washed-up, deteriorating, ex-fan fave old man. Come on Ford, do INDY 4 before you get a heart attack or something!!
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This is a great idea. I've always preferred Alec Baldwin's JR to Harrison Fords. Baldwin made Ryan a real character whose ecentricity shined. Harrison Ford just played himself (which he seems to be doing more and more these days.) H.F. WAS a great film icon, but my interest in his work has waned severely in recent years. I think his admission of 'doing it for the money,' reflects his artistic prowess as an actor. With all the cash he's got, he'd be better of retiring than pretending his acting is still interesting. I admire his candor, but I don't give one wit about seeing his films.
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Jun 12, 2000 4:03:02 AM CDT
ALEC BALDWIN WAS, IS AND WILL ALWAYS BE JACK RYAN. Harrison For
by the tall man
Nuff said.
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Harison was kinda lame in the Jack Ryan Movies. MOVE ON OLD MAN!!!!!!
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Look, not that I don't like Baldwin, or that I prefer Ford, I don't give a rat's ass about that really. But Baldwin didn't really make an impact on me in THFTRO (don't worry, those are the right letters), It was Sean who stole every scene (sometimes it was also Sam Neill, Sometimes it was Darth Vader's Voice). My point is that he didn't really prove to me that he was a better Jack Ryan than Ford (but please observe that I DIDN'T say he was NOT better). okay-doeky, that was my two cents, now, a joke: A priest, a minister and a rabii walk into a bar, the bartender says "what is this?! a fucking joke
?!". ----------Check ya later. -
I see Alec Baldwin. Alec Baldwin IS Jack Ryan. Harrison Ford is Indiana Jones...
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Down Periscope, with Kelsey Grammar. Whats my prize?
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Harrison Ford needs to retire...he doesnt even try...he plays the same guy over and over, with same two expressions on his face.
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Sure-bring him back! I'm all for it! who needs that Huffy-Puffy old foget Harrison Ford anyways? We're talking about a man who has hated every great film he made. Suit up, Alec!
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I can't stand the man....I really can't, nor can I stand any other member of that goof-ball family. It's just not his idiot-politics that I detest him for either. He's such a pompous, arrogant, prick. I'm not even sure that he would want to do it anymore, given the fact that Tom Clancy is a hard-core conservative, whereas Baldwin is a hard-core liberal. It's been about 5 years since I've read the novel, but I remember it as being one of Clancy's more violent books (I hope the movie includes the Super Bowl explosion and John Clark administering severe torture to the bad guys) and Baldwin is into pansy-ass film and Broadway productions now. Please, do not bring back Baldwin.
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Jun 12, 2000 7:58:59 AM CDT
And the money that "Hunt for Red October " had nothing to do wit
by hangdog
Another Clancy flick with Baldwin, but no Connery will flop....Think before you type!
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I'm not a huge fan of Alec Baldwin, but I thought his best role was Jack Ryan. He was stupid to let that one go. As much as I like Harrison Ford, it almost seemed too easy. How many times have we seen Harrison Ford playing a guy who barely makes it through and gets beat up in the process? Every action role he plays is the same. Air Force One, Frantic, etc. I think Alec nailed the part and I would love to see him back.
P.S. I will never forgive them for completely ruining the part of John Clark and then casting Willem Defoe to complete the travesty! -
This guy must be nuts! I won't deny that Baldwin did a good job in HUNT, but Harrison's Jack Ryan is idyllic, it's one of those castings that is just RIGHT; like Stewart for Professor X or Ford for Indiana; how could you POSSIBLY want Baldwin back for this role? Harrison is THE perfect Jack Ryan. And don't give me that analyst crap either; if you've read the books you'll see that Ryan progresses from the "just an analyst" role (which does fit for HUNT) into essentially, a hero. Hell, by the time we get to EXECUTIVE, he's the most powerful man in the free world, kicking ass for the USA and doing what's right and just by the people: in other words, a HERO, just as Harrison plays him. So don't mess with perfection.
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I thounght Baldwin was great and has just been wasted over the past few years on pieces of shit roles.Look at his latest for God's Sakes!Thomas the fecking Tank Engine.The guy's brilliant!Look at his work in the Juror.I'll say no more!
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The studio lost any sense of the franchise when they decided not to shoot Milius` draft of `Clear and Present Danger`.`The Hunt For Red October` was a masterpiece and it rocked the Earth while even `Patriot Games` had lost the right-wing patriotic edge the first movie had.But `Patriot Games` had a certain level of suspense and sheer thrill the third was a huge fiasco like landing in Somalia.It hadn`t preserved the spirit of the book and it under-developed the character of Clark.Since the Clark-spin-off with `Without Remorse` has gone to hell with `Savoy` bankrupcy it is time for the studio to bring back Milius (who is the hero of the American right-wing patriotic cinema and whose `Patriot Games` draft was refused because Harrison Ford appeared too late (?) in the script).I am joining the `Alec Baldwin for Ryan` bandwagon even though I think that AICN can`t change anything because of Harrison Ford`s `Dream Works`-`Amblin` ties that keep every studio on a tight leash.
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This is sad! There is actually a campaign on the internet to see Alec Baldwin in a film role! A new low, even for the internet.
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Make George Clooney the young John Clark -- he can open a movie, he's been a tough military guy before, and he can do ruthless pretty well. I really liked the scene in The Peacekeeper where after the long car chase he walked up to the bad guys who had killed his friend and were trapped in the car and calmly shot them in the head. That's realistic -- smart people don't leave enemies alive behind them.
The Duchovny idea is pretty good, as he's young enough to make SOAF, Debt of Honor and Executive Orders over the next decade. Baldwin is too fat, and too liberal. -
I saw a rumor on the net (on an entertainment reporting web site, not some fanboy's) that Dennis Quaid was in consideration to take over the role of Jack Ryan. Anyone heard about this?
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I read somewhere that Clancy based Jack Ryan on Tom Selleck's Magnum PI character. Anyway, ol' Tom might be an interesting casting choice. Now please excuse me while I put on my asbestos overcoat before I get flamed...
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I never liked Harrison Ford as Jack Ryan. Mostly because it was Harrison Ford playing Harrison Ford. I never bought him as Jack Ryan. Alec Baldwin was the better one in that role and definitely should be brought back ... if he would even consider it.
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I agree with everybody wholeheartedly--Steven Baldwin was the best Jack Ryan ever. Harrison Ford is good, but his unyielding preference for scripts with heavy doses of full-frontal male nudity is beginning to become a turn-off. I say bring back Steven! Hey, you guys remember that scene in Hunt for Red October, when Steven and Pauly Shore snuck into the Biodome and then went bungee-jumping? Jesus, that brought a tear of patriotic pride to my eyes like nothing else, short of a swift and brutal kick to the testicles. So, in short, we must band together, and demand more Steven Baldwins in our cinematic experiences. I have taken a solemn vow to cruelly murder one nun for every non-Baldwin movie that is theatrically released. I hope my fellow geeks will rally behind me in this cause, and soon we will have a Baldwin-rific world!
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I like the Dennis Quaid idea, but he's not a big opener by himself. He looks old enough to be Jack Ryan -- Duchovny is a little too wrinkle-free at this point.
Here's the best idea of all: BILL CLINTON should play Jack Ryan. A dye job and a couple of hundred hours on the Stairmaster and he'd be PERFECT. He has prior President of the United States experience, which will become increasingly important as the books progress. Dennis Quaid can't say THAT. It sure would open a movie to see someone kicking Clinton's ass, even if we knew it was just a stunt double. The Secret Service detail with him would probably work for scale, and so would Clinton if Anne Archer would reprise as Mrs. Ryan. -
I thought they were both pretty good as Jack Ryan. But that's me.
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Just wanted to chime in on the positive for this one, gang. "The Hunt For Red October" was just on TV again this weekend, and it reminded me of the differences between Ford and Baldwin. I loved Ford in "Clear & Present Danger" (especially what he could get done with just his business card). I'd really like to see Baldwin back at it again, though, and get back to more of what the Jack Ryan character is all about. Besides, it might make things easier to get another Ryan picture made if you can shave $12M off the price tag of the lead. - SPYder, out.
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Jun 12, 2000 12:09:35 PM CDT
Alec Baldwin is not only the best Jack Ryan but also the only tr
by jasper stillwell
Just make it so, dammit!!!!
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He brought much of the human dimension to Jack Ryan that Bruce brought to Die Hard. Very cool, fresh and interesting. Not that Harrison doesn't play him human, but he's just damn boring! I cringed YEARS ago when I heard Ford was taking over the roll, not just because of his recent fall from grace. The guy's been on automatic PAY AND PLAY pilot for a decade. All you naysayers are right though. People DID come to see Sean Connery and great special effects etc. THEY CAME BACK BECAUSE OF BALDWIN! I just watched this great film again yesterday, and it cemented the fact that Ford taking over the roll stole from us a very cool, new action adventure franchise. It was a major mistake on Baldwin's part to bicker over cash all those years ago. He should have taken their best offer and cemented himself in the role, but what's done is done. Ford's star is fading fast because he just doesn't give a damn. The HUGE impending financial failure of WHAT LIES BENEATH will reinforce this point in due time. I believe Alec would be willing to work out a few months, tone down, and get hungry for J.R. again - at least I hope he would. Harrison fell into the franchise when he backed out of the super cool NIGHT RIDE DOWN project that eventually stalled and was looking for an "action vehicle". All sounds like standard operating procedure for him. Let him go count his money and bitch about how people still like watching and talking about Han Solo - which god forbid he was only paid hundreds of thousands for instead of millions. What a schmuck. Bring on an actor! F*ck Mr. Commodity.
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Baldwin was always my idea for a perfect Bruce Wayne..his BatMan might be a bit on the Chubby side but its workable.
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Down f-ing Periscope. Okay, but that's the ONLY ONE YOU CAN THINK OF!! Heheheh....Hey, I'm all over George Clooney as Jack Ryan -- I think that's a smashing suggestion! As long as they can keep the head-bobbing to a minimum (which he's been keeping pretty low-key lately). Harry Ford has seemed less-than-human lately in most of his roles. He used to have some vulnerability to him, but now he's just plastic as all get out. I feel nothing when I watch him. Duchovny is sexy and funny as hell, but I have yet to see him not play himself in a movie. Sure, they all do to a degree, but with DD it's so blatant that sometimes you wonder how he can call it "acting". I think Dylan McDermott would be another good choice for Ryan, but I don't know if he could carry the film.
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Clark is the CIA "cleaner" who becomes best friends with Ryan and Ding Chavez's father-in-law. I really didn't think Willem Dafoe was the right guy for Clark in CPD -- Clark is described as a linebacker-sized guy and Willem, while fearsome in his own right (took napalm to kill him in Platoon, remember? Even Tom Berenger couldn't do it alone), has more of that guy-who-really-REALLY-likes-kinves kind of creepiness. In Without Remorse, the John Clark character comes back from Vietnam as an ex-SEAL, falls for a girl in trouble, and when she is killed goes on a fierce vigilante rampage and wipes out the drug dealers of Baltimore....Come to think of it, the video stores are full of movies like that, and in some of them the avenger has really big breasts, something Clooney can't hope to match. Forget it, you're right -- Clooney for Jack Ryan.
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Do bears bear? Do bees be? Well hell yes Baldwin should return to Jack Ryan!
I've been saying this for years. I was honestly very disappointed that Harrison Ford took on this role because he's always played better rogues (Han Solo, Indiana Jones, even that goofy pilot in "Six Days and Seven Nights") than family men (Like Ryan). I can't bear to watch "Clear and Present Danger" without chuckling.
I remember watching Inside the Actor's Studio and Baldwin was asked which character was the closest to himself and he said Jack Ryan! He also remarked that he was very disappointed that he and McTiernan were unable to continue the series. Well, let's write a wrong and get this campaign running! -
As a 22 year veteran of U.S. submarines [4 boats - 1 SSN, 3 SSBNs], I can say that here has NEVER been a wholly accurate U.S. sub movie. Das Boot is the only one that comes close. However, Red October is a damn close second, if you can ignore 2 errors of physics: 1. Subs don't zip around in underwater canyons, they stay well away from the bottom at the depths depicted in Hunt. 2. Any submarine that got hit in the bow with a steaming torpedo - even an inactive one - would be split in two. Ignore those 2 things, and you have a great movie, with the greatest of all Jack Ryans: Alec Baldwin. Alec is a FAR better actor than Harrison Ford. If you doubt me, just rent Glengary Glen Ross. Ford [who I admire} could not have pulled off that role. I say bring back the one true Jack Ryan...Alec Baldwin. One final thing...my friends used to read Tom Clancy books while we were out on patrol...actually reading Red October while underway on a DAMN SUBMARINE! Is that sick, or what?!
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Baldwin is too pretty,too smooth, too flaccid. Can you imagine him telling off the President at the end of CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER? (Or the Indian Prime Minister at the end of EXECUTIVE ORDERS?) Jack Ryan is a fanger-waver like his jingoist creator and like Harrison Ford!
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Baldwin is fat and not the actioneer type anymore. His
politcal beliefs don't jive with
what the Jack Ryan character represents after Harrison was done with it. So unless they push a
cart load of money under Baldwin's face I don't see him doing it.
It's time for something new anyways,
I would like to see Russel Crowe
give it a shot. Ya know there's no way in hell he'd be caught up in this franchise or any other but it has the same odds as seeing Alec
back as Jack Ryan. --Syd. -
I just can't resist posting again on this topic; many of you are against Ford for this role because of the relative sameness with which Ford plays action heroes lately: absolute integrity, pure 100% clean-cut goodguy (such as Air Force 1, the Clancy movies, etc); but you have to understand, THAT'S EXACTLY HOW CLANCY WRITES JACK RYAN. Yes, Ford is too old for the earlier novels, but once you hit Sum of all Fears, Ryan is older, there's not as much action for him directly. So Ford's age is not an issue. Most of you are just pissed about Ford's choices lately: yes, I'll agree that some of his recent movies have been crap, but that DOESN'T mean he shouldn't play Ryan, just as he has in the past: that is, 100% FAITHFUL to the books. Don't let yer contempt for Ford's other roles color your judgement so much: Harrison Ford in "Random Hearts" is not Harrison Ford in a Clancy movie. Do you beleive that Nicholas Cage can never make another Leaving Los Vegas after his Bruckheimer phase ends? Did you beleive Speilburg could never make a good movie after "Hook"? Of course not! Cut the guy a break, he's not the first guy to go for the bigger paycheck. And for the record, Defoe was a VERY GOOD choice for older Clark; for younger Clark, clearly they would have to make another choice. And I think we can all agree that Without Remorse would make a great movie. Again, if you READ THE BOOKS, you will understand these casting decisions!
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I like Defoe because, like old Clark in the books, he is old. In Rainbow Six, for example, he is moving into a more administrative role; he's in his 50s, he's leaving the wetwork to Ding and the rest of them.. but he's still a badass. And in Clear and Present Clark was younger, but Defoe still managed to pull it off in my opinion. Defoe exudes that "old, worn but still a badass" quality. I'm not saying that he's the best choice, but I like him in the role.
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That's right, Leonardio DiCaprio has been cast as Jack Ryan !! Talk amongst yourselves.
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Gray Lady Down.. saw this one in the theaters. I don't know why, I just liked it... more so than any of today's sub films.. and as far as box office.. i don't remember if it had any at all. (hell i was only 10 and didn't think about box office at the time.) as for Jack Ryan.. either one can be cast and would suit me fine. i personally feel that Hunt is a very seperate film from Ford's Ryan films...
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Forget"Sum of All Fears", I think the best Clancy novel is "Without Remorse". I heard someone in Hollywood has the movie rights, but where is the movie?!
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Instead of waiting for someone who's performance in The Hunt for Red October made me dislike him even more than Malice, I'd be looking for a new face. Jack Ryan may not have been an action centered hero in that film, but as the books progressed, he started to be. The novels portray him in fights. I think if Ford had done HFRO, the movie would have been tremendously improved.
I remember the anticipation I had for the film. Eagerly I dragged my parents to see it with me, whooping and cheering of the cool submarine movie with Sean Connery. I also remember walking out of the movie wishing Jack Ryan had made me feel anything besides disappointment.
Seeing it again around the time of Clear and Present Danger, I once again felt the same disappointment. Alec Baldwin has shown he can perform well in certain situations and roles, but he's no Jack Ryan. -
Jun 12, 2000 4:35:36 PM CDT
Alec Baldwin comming back as Jack Ryan have you fan boys lost yo
by 20th century fox
OK....All i see is fan boys screaming how good Alec Baldwin is and how HF is too old taking abd rooles etc... WELL.......Alec Baldwin is shitty actor whos sold his soul to any liberal group you can think of...Can ANY of you pro-Alec baldwin fanboys name his last hit SINCE Hunt For Red October????.......What you cant? Because he taken on the worst roles ever cause he cant act....But I hear you say Alec was so good in HFRO. Yeah TWO WORDS: John McTerian (sp) Alec's carrer is in the shitter he was smart enough to get cast in HFRO. People liked it since it was a good movie....Alec has picked shit movies since then and his carrer has suffered...(Harry your reasoning is flawed: If you fanboys do this campaign then you going to give Mr. Baldwin oversized ego to demand 20 million for SOAF...) If any of you read the books SOAF,CAPD,DOH,EO you know that Jack Ryan has aged and in SOAF hes going through a mid life crisis...) In other words THE CHARACTERS ARE FUCKING GETTING OLDER.... I enjoyed AB in HFRO but know it was a director who beat a good preformance out of that cock sucker...I also enjoyed HF in PG and CAPD since it begins to play into his age...SOAF is perfect for ford but would look ludicrous for Baldwin dont believe me read the book and look at the character....Send all hate mail to bankofkev@hotmail.com
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Tom Clancy lost his writing edge so right now he belongs among the second rate spy novel writers.This is why it will take a lot of work for writers to shape up a script that would fit the modern standards and still keep the conservative spirit.William Wisher would be great but John Milius would be even better.His Ryan must be tough conservative proffessional that makes you proud to be his compatriot.Harrison Ford can`t give you that impression since he keeps the `Amblin` style of acting while being too old for that kind of thing.Baldwin`s return would be a blessing.A good actor for Clark would sure as hell help but even Defoe does the trick.Imagine someone like Dougray Scott as Clark. It sounds like rock`n`roll.Question is,can studio cut Ford`s long contract short?He`s signed for some time and if INDY 4 talks are in progress then I don`t think that `Paramount` wants to enrage ford and his `Amblin` buddies Spielberg and Lucas (who were by the way invented by Milius).So,I guess we`ll have to deal with `Sum of All Fears` which is a nice read but it is outdated and it doesn`t fit the development of the Ryan`s movie persona.First of all,in this book,Ryan doesn`t get involved in any action.Second of all,Dallas Cowboys Stadium really does get blown away by Syrians...This is why some other books would be more apropriate for filming.
`Sum of All Fears` is also a rip-off of the cult Frankenheimer movie `Black Sunday`and it is overall a bad bargain for a feature lenght pic.It could be a nice mini-series.I actually think that no director would make it right within the format found in the book.Akiva Goldsman sure as hell can`t make it work on paper.But if they bring Milius in he`ll probably make a character driven right-wing Ryan pic that will sustain the needed ammount of coolness and grit.With Baldwin in the lead it could even be promising. -
It's not Dallas Cowboy stadium that blows up in the book, its the football stadium in Denver (during the Super Bowl and as the result of an atomic bomb-cool huh?). Who says that Clancy's lost his edge in his writing? Has anybody read "Rainbow Six"? I loved the way Clark handled the villains at the end-it was just too beautiful! The same goes for "Executive Orders". Clancy's newest, "The Bear And The Dragon", is supposed to be out in August, and I'll be the first to buy it. I won't get into the merits of who's the better Jack Ryan, but I still say Baldwin won't come back because the man has such blatant animosity towards conservatives (remember the incident when he freaked out and suggested that conservatives be stoned to death?), which is what Clancy has established himself as (he even dedicated "Executive Orders" to Ronald Reagon, the bane of Baldwin and his ilk). If Ford won't come back, get somebody else. And make a script that Clancy approves of for once!
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Alec doesn't have the box office pull to play Ryan again. In fact, he'd hurt the film. A Clancy film gets a lot of it's box office from conservative America and Alec's managed to really piss them off. His rant on Conan scored well with people who have no interest in watching a Clancy film. Harrison Ford is a liberal but he's been very smart to keep that private so he doesn't alienate any of his potential audience. Alec has repeatedly shot his mouth off about various liberal causes, which is fine if you don't plan on reaching an audience outside of the big cities.
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Jun 12, 2000 7:56:00 PM CDT
This just in Baldwin has signed on for "Sum Of All Fears" for a
by gilmour
For all the scenes that he's not sitting down he will require a stunt double, the man sweats gravy people!!!
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"Sum" would make a great movie but "Debt of Honor" would kick ass. A movie where congress and the pres get blown up after a war with Japan, could it get any better?????? but "Sum" would have to go first and I am willing to play Jack Ryan if asked, call (810) 766-6641 ask for Page and I'll fly out to LA on the next plane, No prob!!
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But I gotta admit... Baldwin WAS a better Jack Ryan...
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At the risk of confusing the Great Unwashed Masses, it would be great if Baldwin played Ryan and Ford played Clark.
Lets face it. Baldwin was great as Ryan. No arguement here. But the guy that played Clark last time was poorly cast. Sorry...
In the book, Clark is a big, scary, physically impossing guy. In SOAF, Clark has aged a bit too. It would be a great role for any actor; especially for Ford who might see it as an acting challenge... -
I'd rather see Rainbow Six. Elite multinational counter-terrorist team that saves the world.
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Okay, I'll admit, I'm a Clancy fanboy. I read most of his books as a younger lad (13, 14, 15) back in grade school when they first came out and was hooked. My interest has waned over the years though. His latest books just haven't grabbed my interest that much as those like Cardinal, Hunt, or Clear and Present. Maybe I'm just not as awed as having every minute detail of a gun or tank described to me anymore.
Personally, I thought Baldwin was great as Ryan. He had the right age, the right "over my head" mentality (either at the director's great work or he really was over his head), and a few other traits.
I can never be sure why I didn't like Patriot or Clear..Danger in the theater. I think the plots just diverged too much from the books but that's to be expected. I remember Clancy complaining about that and Ford since Ford was older than he (and most of us fanboys) thought Ryan would be.
Plus seeing DeFoe as Clark was a bit confusing as well. This was not the rugged person who took a shotgun blast nearly point blank in "Without Remorse" was it? No. Ideally, as a fanboy, I would have thought that Tom Berringer would have made a great Clark. -
Although the guy has quite a radical political personality, I must say he has a far better screen presence. Too often that term is reserved for he who is bigger, has more muscles, and who can look really damn mad (Ford's specialty). But Baldwin never fails to entertain me. His Ryan wasn't John McClane, but closer to Stanley Goodspeed. Now as awesome as it is to see McClane break some Kraut neck, watching Stanley geek around the chaos is far more fun...and a little more realistic. Jack Ryan is not the combat type. He's a smart-ass with enough physicality to go through basic training, but not the kind of human weapon we've come to know Jack Ryan as. He basically commands a desk job. Although Baldwin has had some box office problems, he's the better choice. Stick him in with a good supporting actor, throw in Samuel L. (remember, he WAS in Patriot games) and Anne Archer, and you got a great Clancy film. Also, get McTiernan back!
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I love Harrison Ford as much as the next person, but I'm tired of waiting for him to make up his mind. It's been 6 years since the last Tom Clancy flick. This series should be the American version of 007. "Sum of All Fears" is a killer place to start. Cast either Alec Baldwin (great in Red October) or Dennis Quaid (great actor) as Jack Ryan. Get either McTiernan or Noyce to helm it. Then, in between Ryan films, cast George Clooney or Gary Sinise as Clark and film "Without Remorse" and "Rainbow Six."
As for Harrison Ford, do Indiana Jones 4 for god's sake!! And stop turning down cool projects like "Traffic." -
Try "The Atomic Submarine", the low-budget flick where a sub crashes into a flying suacer under the polar ice cap. Pretty bad, as in more corn than Iowa.
As for Grey Lady Down, check out the original book, "Event 1000" by David Lavallee. Blows the movie away. I read this one while I was a NROTC midshipman studying for the nuke sub corps. Puts the fear of one atmosphere per 33 feet into you real fast. Considering I've also been certified as a research diver, any wonder I'm a big Clive Cussler/Dirt Pitt fan?
I still love the long lost live action version of the old anime movie, "Atragon", about a WWII Japanese sub which is converted into a flying, tunnelling, super sub with a kick butt arsenal(Space Cruiser Yamoto ring a bell?). Not since the Seaview has there been such a cool sub IMHO. -
That was pretty close to exactly what I was about to post. I want the Clancy movies to continue, and soon. Even the weaker efforts had strong plots and some brains to 'em, something that can hardly be said for Bond anymore (or the Mission:Impossible franchise if the criticisms are true - I'm waiting for video). I like your casting suggestions too. LenS mentioned earlier that Baldwin may be such an outspoken liberal that he'll alienate conservative Clancy followers. Maybe, in which case Dennis Quaid seems promising for the role. Whatever the case, I'd like to see this smart action franchise get rolling again. My only concern about "Sum of All Fears" is the same, I believe, that Ford had - script problems. Akiva Goldman's involvement is enough to derail any movie, with such past scripts as "Batman & Robin" and "Lost in Space" to his credit. At least he's adapting a pre-existing work, so hopefully he can't muddle it too badly...right?
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Way back when Savoy still existed, they had the rights to Without Remorse and were going to make it was Gary Sinise in the lead. But then the studio went belly up and Sinise jumped to Ransom.
A few years later, Clancy was trying to revive Without Remorse with Kurt Russell in the lead, but I don't know what ever became of that. -
Hell, let Baldwin do it. Just get a good screenwriter. Hunt for Red October and Patriot Games were good, but Clear and Present Danger was a disappointing movie compared to the book. Jack Ryan was barely featured in the book, and that was just fine, not to mention the fact that Willem Dafoe is NOT John Clark, no way, no how. Good actor, bad casting.
I'd like to see a movie made of Without Remorse. That would rock. -
Oh well, at least some folks thought it might work with David Duchovny as Ryan. Is Dennis Quaid making a Travolta style comeback (as was the case with Pulp Fiction)?
I would rather see Russell Crowe in Blade Runner II than as Ryan. Also make sure Bill Pullman stays away from the Ryan flick. I'm no fan of this Jack Ryan thingy anyway, but I am smart enough to keep Pullman clear!
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This is just a suggestion from someone who does really get into the whole Ryan thing. What's the reaction on Edward Norton playing Ryan? The only thing that I probably wouldn't buy is the fact that he's so young. But apparentrly he's starting to build up quite a reputation in the States for being a quality, human actor. Anyone??
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Ok, I'd would've gone with Baldwin if it was made 5-8 years ago (instead of "C&PD"), but now... nah. I think "Rainbow Six" is the way to go, with Ford (cameo!). Dafoe blew big time - no way is he Clark! Someone older, with more reserved, quiet power - a Mel Gibson type. Ray Cruz did an excellent job as Ding - bring him back, and forget he was killed off in that last abortion of a movie. Or maybe John Leguizamo? Think of the talent you could get for the rest of the "Six" team - tap some European stars, low $$/high exposure.
Oh yeah, that Stephen Baldwin sub movie: "Sub Down" with Gabrielle Anwar. But even worse than that was "Full Fathom Five" with Michael Moriarty. OH MY GOD DID THAT SUCK! Cardboard sets, cardboard acting (only saw it 'cause I worked at Cinemax). -
One, it *did* have a star name, one Sean Connery, maybe you've heard of him, and two, it was (and still is) a great fucking film. Baldwin was an adequate enough Jack Ryan but (like Ford) nothing to shout from the rooftops about in the role, and after his recent batch of film perfs I sure as shit wouldn't be petitioning to get him back in the role for this or any other film. Oh and as for the Ford led Jack Ryan flicks, Patriot Games was a good, solid (if slightly overdone, and now dated) flick, while I thought that Clear And Present Danger was superb and almost as good as Hunt was. Thats my opinion anyways, for what little it's worth.
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Was simply because he had asked for more money on the role, but a little TOO much for what the production wanted to pay. He tried playing a "pay me this or I walk" bit with them, except they in turn said. "Okay. Bye." Harrison Ford, though hired for more than Baldwin's cut during October, was actually hired for much much less than what Baldwin had asked for. Baldwin basically got a little to egotistical, and it bit him.
Now, the man has definitely grown up from that--you can see it in his films and in his interviews. He's a cool guy, but even the cool guys can botch things once in a while.
I also agree with what was written elsewhere that people went to see Sean Connery in October, Baldwin just happened to be there. He won the audience over in the end, mind you, but he didn't lure them there (for the majority, so those of you drawn by Alec Baldwin can't yell at me)
Besides, Harrison Ford has created Ryan's persona, and I for one think he does a good job of it. If Alec Baldwin had stayed in the role, he'd have been pretty good too. But I think this one's set in.
Now, bringing back Michael Keaton to play "Batman." Hmmm... -
LET"S DO IT!! LET"S BRING BACK ALEC BALDWIN!!! I LOVE THE IDEA!! I"VE BEEN WANTING IT FOR A LONG TIME!! FINALLY A WAY FOR ALEC TO REESTABLISH HIMSELF!!
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Why does everyone want to bring back Jack Ryan? The problem with the character was that as the books progressed, he kept on being promoted...up to the President of the United States. A little too unrealistic.
Why has no one ever wanted to do RED STORM RISING. Now there is a good sub book [and the best recruiting poster for the Navy since TOP GUN].
Considering that its all big shiny toys and very little character development, its the perfect computer generated miniseries. -
Worst one I ever saw was Leviathan, with Peter Weller and Amanda Pays. I paid a dollar, and I didn't want my dollar back so much as I wanted the 90 minutes of my life back that I wasted on that dog. It was like "The Thing" meets "The Abyss", except it was very, very stupid. The ONLY thing that was good in the whole movie was the exchange between the bloodless corporate suit on land and the three remaining people on the undersea station, in which she (the suit) apologizes for not getting to them sooner, saying, "I'm sorry I know you've been through hell." The reply is "BEEN? Bitch, we still HERE!" The other 94 minutes and 54 seconds were really, really awful.
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Caution: take with a grain of salt, I'm a tried and true Ford fan. Leave him alone! I LOVED Baldwin in "HUNT", I think Ford nailed it perfectly in "PATRIOT", and either one would have been great in "CLEAR", but Baldwin blew it when he balked at Paramount to do Broadway. I wouldn't mind him returning, but lately he's got an ego and would probably turn his nose up at it. As for Ford, for chrissakes lay off him. Random Hearts? Sucked big time. "6 DAYS"? He was good, the movie wasn't. "AIR FORCE ONE"? The President kicking ass kicked ass. The projects he chooses aren't bad, it's just the end results aren't spectacular. He'll be back to his roguish self in no time, wait and see. Have faith, people.
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Jack Ryan creator prefers the casting of Balwin over Ford, as Ford is much older than the character. MUCH older. Hell, I think that they should replace Harrison Ford for the proposed "Indy IV." Yea, the guy is one of the greatest stars of all time, but if I see him in another action movie, I'm gonna be worried that he's gonna break a hip or something. Give Ryan back to Baldwin and let (are you ready for this?) George Clooney take a shot at Indiana Jones...
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