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Hercules Says
ARROW Misses!!
“Arrow,” a new CW series based on DC Comics’ popular Green Arrow superhero character, comes to us from Greg Berlanti, the longtime “Dawson’s Creek” showrunner who wrote both ABC’s “No Ordinary Family” superhero series and the big-screen “Green Lantern” movie (also based on a popular DC comics franchise).
This is not the Green Arrow who became a regular character on “Smallville.” This Ollie Queen never met Clark Kent and, indeed, appears to exist in a world without superpowers.
In this version of the tale, zillioniare Queen not only learned his archery skills while shipwrecked five years on a remote island, he also apparently invented an arrow that can drain bank accounts of millions of dollars. Hopefully it doesn’t fall into the wrong hands.
Queen also appears to have grown quite adept at parkour.
Queen is so good with his bow that multiple bad guys toting machine guns find themselves runnig away from him.
The guy who plays Queen looks like he does a lot of sit-ups.
I love Denny O’Neil’s comic book Green Arrow. But even with the stunning Willa Holland as kid sister Speedy, I don’t see myself bothering with a second episode.
… competently-made ... well-done for what it's trying to be. Perhaps in time it'll find its own distinct take on Green Arrow, even if it's not exactly what O'Neill, Grell and other writers did with him on the page. …
... pretty watchable, even for those who tune in agenda-free. …
... with executive producers Greg Berlanti ("Green Lantern"), Marc Guggenheim ("FlashForward"), Andrew Kreisberg ("Warehouse 13," "The Vampire Diaries") and David Nutter ("Smallville," "Supernatural," "Game of Thrones"), the quality of "Arrow" is not surprising. …
... There is absolutely nothing new about anything seen here — including Ollie’s “Hamlet”-like oedipal issues about his mother’s remarriage and the pomposity that lurks on every parapet in comic-book movies and TV shows — and yet “Arrow” has nice aim. Grade: B- …
The San Francisco Chronicle says:
... pure, action-packed fun worthy of the kind of longevity that "Smallville" enjoyed for 10 seasons …
The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette says:
... hits its target as an OK comic book-inspired show. …
... If that all sounds a little silly and yet fairly dark, it is. Both the tone of the pilot, in which this superhero is a killer and another character commits suicide, and the show’s look — it rains atmospherically on the island, at sea, and in Starling City — set a grim mood, even as Amell’s stilted narration keeps it in slightly cartoonish territory. …
... Granted, it's all standard superhero stuff. But the action scenes are well-handled, the emotions and the characters mostly ring true, and the plot offers enough twists to keep you intrigued. …
... proves to be both on-brand and entertaining -- if you turn off the snark detector and downplay the need for plausibility or logic. …
... there's only so much action an hourlong drama can afford, and the characters necessary to sustain the series are, initially, strictly two-dimensional …
8 p.m. Wednesday. The CW.
Readers Talkback
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Oct. 10, 2012, 2:04 p.m. CST
he also apparently invented an arrow that can drain bank accounts of millions of dollars
by ROBRAM89
This is a joke, right?
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Combine this tv show with the terrible New 52 version of Green Arrow, and you have green crapola. How can you have Oliver Queen without a beard? Kevin Smith's Quiver is my personal favourite Green Arrow story.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 2:06 p.m. CST
I'm just wondering if you're a superhero who doesn't kill people, arrows are kinda Not a Good Idea
by Al
like, how many times can he pin somebody to a wall with their shirt. What if they're wearing a tank top? Also, I'm sure getting an arrow through your knee could be really life threatening.
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Well, I know that I used to be an adventurer like him, then I took an arrow in the knee.
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he does kill.
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lost my head there for a second...
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No boxing glove arrow = No deal.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 3:05 p.m. CST
There is nobody who is going to being surprised when this show flops.
by Broderick
I remember shaking my head when I first heard about this and again when I saw a commercial for it. I never watched more than a handful of Smallville episodes, but I can see how at least spinning off from that could have had potential.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 3:10 p.m. CST
If they are going to use a lot of B and C level heroes, I am in.
by shutupfanboy
Its probably too Dark Knight for Ollie, liberal hippie, but the idea we are getting better version of Deadshot, Huntress, Canary and Deathstroke, I am in. I do wish they got the guy from Smallville back, but I have no desire to deal with all that Chloe shit.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 4:42 p.m. CST
Fuck the CW. I will never watch anything they do again.
by Raptor Jesus
Season ten of Smallville. Enough said.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 5:26 p.m. CST
what happened to all the reviews that raved about the pilot?
by oisin5199
Many were saying this was the best new show of the fall. I'll give it a chance. It's gotta be better than Beauty and the Beast. btw, new shows I'm giving a shot this fall (it's a short list): Revolution Last Resort Elementary Arrow
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Are really excited about this. Allof the characters they are throwing in at the beginning of the season. In costume even makes it ten times better than smallville on its best day.
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and will it be all about appealing to the teenage girl demo with love triangles and sappy dialogue?
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Arrow. Is that supposed to be "modern" and "edgy" or something? Why not do a Superman series and call it "Man"? Or a Wonder Woman show called "Woman"?
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Season ten? More like Season Everything of Smallville. the CW is shit. Greg Berlanti is shit. This is going to be shit squared.
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I was very standoffish when I first heard about it and after reading all the promo interviews. I mostly checked it out because it's based on a comic book. I have to say that I very much enjoyed it.
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But apparently, me and the critics of TV completely disagree on everything, because Revolution is the biggest piece of crap iv'e ever seen that has so much good potential. J.J Abrams, Jon Favreau!? C'mon, guys, get it together! But, about Arrow, I think it's gonna be one of the best new show seasons of fall TV.
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Amell did a great job and Cassidy is always good.
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Arrow had a great start.
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It was actually pretty good. I'm glad they went the Year One route.
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OK...the ONLY thing on the CW that any sane adult non-16 year old girl would be interested in. It didnt feature My Little Ponies or Ballerinas though,so I understand why Herc didnt dig it. It also wasnt written by anyone that worked on Buffy the Vampire Slayer,so I'm sure he deducted some points for that as well. I'll be tuning in for the season....
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Oct. 10, 2012, 9:36 p.m. CST
I thought this was pretty good but the promo for nest week
by jupiterjim
Looked cheesy as hell...I am hooked
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on the level of the best of Joss Whedon's shows, so I'm going to keep checking it out. Andrew Kreisberg used to write Green Arrow comics and did a pretty solid job so it's got that going for it which is nice.
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When he shoots his trick arrows, they don't fly back and accidentally hit him or kill an unintended victim causing him to grieve for the next six episodes. If it is like Smallville, he probably doesn't even know how to load his own bow. someone else needed to invent an automatic arrow loader for him. Let us know if it is any good. If his world is one with no super-powered villains or freaky crazy ones then what's the point? No ninjas, please.
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I liked: People get killed; he has no qualms about killing. It's fairly believable. I did not like: Ineffective bullets. Bank-account draining arrow - seriously, how? Five years on an island should lead to: Psychosis. Malnutrition (He must have found naturally growing protein supplements) Basic failures in use of language It should not lead to: The physique of a lean wrestler Extreme martial arts skills Peerless hacking ability (I presume he was actually a feckless waste of space before he got there, not a member of Anonymous) Wholesale theft from Nolan's Batman - acting the dick to the only woman you genuinely care about, who is also a crusading lawyer??? People in their early twenties with the skills, knowledge, responsibilities and salaries of people in their early forties. Gruff, D-bag policeman. Green-stripe and a hood, to protect one of the most well known identities in the city??? Evil Mom. Criminal misuse of Colin Salmon. The man was nearly the first black James Bond, for chrissake. I don't mind dark and gritty, and I don't mind a fantastic take on a superhero using 'archery' but I can't see them both working in the same world. Plus, the whole Evil conspiracy/working through a list of bad guys thing is poor. Why did he let the main bad guy live, at the end - signalling he was finished with him, by lining him out of his ridiculous list, but had no problem slaughtering all his goons? There are some serious issues with all this, and they come from an attitude of "What would be cool" and "Don't worry, the audience will go with it/are stupid". Stand this next to Person of Interest, and just see the difference in quality.
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Oct. 10, 2012, 10:56 p.m. CST
I dug it..well definetly give it a chance and fountainsofbain it's very understandable why the police man is a gruff/dbag.
by MRJONZ72
Oliver could use a better "Mask" tho..not buying the eye pain which I didnt even realize he was wearing until the assualt on the main bad guys buisness scene and he got knocked out. I hope we learn that dude had some sort of fighting/parkour skill before he got on the island or maybe he met someone on the island that trained..him I'm all for suspension of disbelief..but it is straining it just a touch.
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A martial artist. He is an expert at parkour. Makes survivor man look like a pussy. A millionaire playboy with a cold heart. A conniving matriarch. A sister named Speedy that is already doing drugs. Fairly decent acting and art direction. The script was slightly lacking and by the numbers. The fight scenes were too tightly edited. I am not a fan of shaky cam and quick cuts. With a little bit of character developement and tighter filming, Arrow could easily blast on all eight.
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I smell a Batman Begins-style "cyclical villain trains our hero and will return to menace said hero" overly obvious connecting tissue riff on Slade Wilson having had a hand in the acquisition of some of that skill set. <P> I also wonder if they'll pull a Lost-style staging of Ollie's being found with him having had some pad time to acquire some of his newfound smarts (providing it isn't built into his pre-island backstory somehow). <P> It looked good and moved well enough (and I surprised that Amell wasn't quite as wooden as I had him pegged to be). As Wednesday night isn't all that packed with TV and it's a fairly watchable lead-in to Supernatural, I may possibly last out the season.
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It either needs to REALLY tighten some screws, or else it needs to develop a less po-faced sense of fun, and go balls out. I will grant, it looks like it had the potential to do that... it just doesn't seem like it is. As to being trained by some dude on the island, that would only open up even more very pressing questions. Once you're in the corner, you have to hope the paint dries before you starve... or climb out the window and paint a totally different floor somewhere else, Lost-style. As to the gruff police-guy; I caught on, once I realised how everyone was related, but I think they got the order in which information was revealed badly wrong. It's just another cliche/borrowed plot element, and he came on far too strong. He didn't buy the story about the guy in the hood, but then he also clearly didn't think that Queen did it himself, so what, exactly, was his theory as to how three, very dangerous, kidnappers ended up dead? And I think his dad shooting that guy, and then himself was pretty psychotic... there is a serious issue with this shows sense of morality, as I mentioned.
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It's definitely darker than I expected, and I think it has potential. I'm in.
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no way in hell that this many angry assholes of AICN would like this. EVEN FUCKING DARK KNIGHT DOESN'T HAVE THIS MANY PEOPLE LIKING IT. SHENANIGANS! SHENANIGANS!
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Amell has definite screen presence and it moved at a good healthy pace. They really reigned in the melodrama and stuck to the Year One storyline--a wise choice. Not really a bad actor in the bunch either, everyone was competent to great. Can't wait for China White next week! (They need a real domino mask though--the face paint ain't workin')
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I just want to point out that even though I enjoyed the show very much, and I'm willing to suspend my beliefs, that it does only go but so far. They're going to have to establish that maybe he wasn't totally alone on that island. He can fight and took out a group of armed guards. There's no way he learned that on his own in five years. Also that maybe his father's journal had the banking information for seperate off shore accounts that his wife did not know about.
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And I've always been a massive fan of the Grell run so I'm not unfamiliar with the character. I think the changes made were fine. And the acting was - surprisingly - not abhorrent. I'll definitely be tuning in for S01E02... (...and wait patiently for an appearance by Shado.)
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Oct. 11, 2012, 8:53 a.m. CST
Not watching this show provided me with the time to have a heartfelt reunion with my grandpa.
by Metroid_Fetish
I never wanted to go looking for the shovel because I knew it would take an hour to find.
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Oct. 11, 2012, 9:01 a.m. CST
royston lodge - how you can have Green Arrow without a beard
by DoctorTom
Simple. He didn't have one for the first 28 years of his existence in comics. He wasn't exactly rocking the beard either in Smallville. The only question now is will we see him using a boxing glove arrow at any point.
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Was entertaining - I wasn't expecting Shakespeare. It's a CW superhero show! The creators have already said that there will be extensive flashbacks to the five years on the island. So obviously a lot of stuff went down there. The acting was good enough - and they managed to do a bunch of callouts to canon like "Speedy" and "Dinah Lance." Gotta give it a chance - if Smallville can last as long as it did, then this show deserves a chance to establish itself...
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even before I learned of the name "Ollie Queen."
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lol.
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While the Queen mansion looked a bit like the Luther mansion from Smallville, that's where the similarities end. The parkour-inflected fight scenes were some of the best I've seen on tv recently. He's a guy who shoots arrows who actually injures and kills people (I'm looking at you Smallville Green Arrow). And I kinda loved it that his "island identity" looked the most like a superhero, and that identity is what he draws on. Neat from a psychological perspective. Yes, it totally rips off Batman Begins, but you have a definitely different vibe from that with the mother still alive and apparently sketchy. I wish I was a bit more familiar with the Green Arrow comics so I could get the references more, especially since everything's downplayed and not "superhero"ish. I do agree that the endgame with the money is a bit thin. Wouldn't authorities notice that all these people who Hunt screwed over suddenly had all this money when Hunt lost 40 mil? Maybe it's emphasizing the Robin Hood thing, but it doesn't seem very practical. Still, I'm intrigued and will keep watching. And I still think Supernatural and Nikita are worth watching and I'm not a teenage girl.
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Oct. 11, 2012, 11:13 a.m. CST
re: "an arrow that can drain bank accounts of millions of dollars"
by buggerbugger
Ah yes, the fabled "spouse arrow"...
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I mean honestly, how is it any more outlandish than the stuff the funnybooks have come up with over the years?
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Good cast, good pacing, just enough bg info to intrigue. <p> It can fill the gap on TV sked left by "Human Target" a few years ago. <p> The implausibilities can be forgiven by fans of comic books. <p> I am a subscriber to Green Arrow (Superman, Aquaman, Daredevil).
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Oct. 11, 2012, 12:23 p.m. CST
Yea that was terrible. So let us ask the question. WHY IS DC HANDLED SO GAY??? (exceptions for Nolan Batmanverse)
by the Green Gargantua
All my gay friends prefer DC characters, FACT. All DC properties are handled very Gay in TV and film so what is the deal?
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ARROW beats Smallville hands down..right from the start...I thought it was also cool that you saw "Deathstroke's" mask or a stick in the burning stand at the begining(sp)..or did you miss that??..duh...probably... And it had so many little points(not an arrow reference..lol) of notice throughout the show..little things you saw on the backgrounds and things that were said..etc etc.. And im not gonna bring myself to the point of bringing myself down to the level's of haters on here..loved arrow..thats it... Also..you can like Revolution too..its ok..you can do it..I loved revolution too..and its already been picked up so..there ya go... I also like "VEGAS" also..great cast..and story..The only one that still has to air is tonight..and thats "Beauty and the beast"..not gonna comment on this one till I see it...but here's to hope..peace..
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Deathstrokes mask ON a stick is what I ment to say...whoops..lol
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Honestly it was NOT that bad. I was a bit disappointed we weren't seeing a spin off of the Ollie on Smallville. but.. as it all goes, this makes more sense as this is supposed to be his first year "off the island". Honestly.. did they EVER really even cover that on Smallville at all? Honestly.. and yeah, the whole trick bank account draining arrow is silly.. anymore than an arrow with a boxing glove? But.. I KNEW something was up when they bad guy says "you missed" and he says "did I?" Honestly.. the biggest issue I had over all was the voice overs.. they just totally sounded out of character.. and WRONG for the show. Outside of that, I can't say I had any major complaints. I'll at least give the show a handful of episodes before really making a call on it. I was actually surprised that it worked as well as it did, period. Although I admit to not knowing alot about his comic origins.. so that may work in favor of new comers to the show and not so much to hard core comic fans.
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I'm also subscriber to Superman, Aquaman, and am in to the Mark Waid Daredevil. I admit I've had a little trouble getting into the Green Arrow New 52 version, but we'll see.
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I'll give it chance...if it lasts a full season. But, I have to LOL at all the 'positivity' posted here. No way in hell that's all for real. There's gotta be more plants in here than a BioDome greenhouse.
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That Deadshot taught him how to fight on the island, given that his mask was there in the opening with an arrow through it's eye. So I guess that answers that "flaw". I can handle an arrowhead with the ability to wirelessly connect with nearby computer networks and deliver a specific bank account draining virus. It hardly stretches credibility.
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This was CW/WB showing us that it cannot handle live action DC properties. Dc Showcase 10 minute spot is still the best GA has been on any screen. This could have been spectacular 'out of the park good' but instead we have generic CW output For those who think I'm trolling take a step back, watch that short again, watch Young Justice to see how DCU characters should be handled on screen This was Nolanite garbage where there was no real need to ape the trilogy it could have set up its own identity. Ironically the fight scenes were way better than the bat- trilogy
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That was a fun little show for the first season, then they had to go fucking with it and add that shitty female co-owner/whatever character. Plus they ditched the excellent theme music for another pile of shit. No wonder it's gone now. What was my point? Oh, yeah... guess I need to give Arrow a shot (pun not intended until I realized how terrible it was, and now it is intended). Is the first ep available online yet?
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Not that I care. Bravo, Jercules. It's about time you realized it is a worthy genre of merit. I'm astonished how we live during a time when Marvel has proven that millions can be made when the fantastic elements of the source material are embraced, yet DC insists on shackling their characters into a 'realistic' universe.
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Ok had arrow clocked in my dvr when i woke up from my sleep after I got in from work in the morning. right before supernatural. So i tune in and after an hour when it's all said and done im like...it's ok. It has some cool parts, like green arrow killing people. Great presents a dark and edgy vibe to the hero. But no blood? wtf? supernatural can do it. c'mon dont be pussies WB! Also it had ollie making no jokes, he was too damn serious to me. I mean ollie makes jokes, wisecracks, very peter parker like during the fight scenes. none of that was there. I get it, it's year one he's all business but i would like to see some of that smartass remarks. They didnt delve deep into his training and how he learned all the moves and how he learned how to shoot arrows. Seems like also the boat crash was deliberate and maybe his mother planned it, but from what i remember in the comics BOTH his parents died in the crash, wtf is this shit? Starling City? it's supposed to be star city! You have a show set in the DC universe and yet no mention of any people with super powers... WTF???? Will anyone Flash, Clark kent drop by uninvited later. You have a grown ass man who needs a babysitter ex military type guy, but yet he's a grown ass man he should probably be left alone to do what he wants. He doesnt need any protection. Trust me on that one. Not feeling the hood with no mask, stupidest shit ive seen. if im killing people im gonna wear a mask, like ya know there are camera's everywhere with facial recognition technology, sooner or later he would be found out. put on a mask goddamit!
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What I like: good choices in the actors and their roles, good action scenes. What I didn't like: not very plausible scenarios. I think the show tried to run with too many story threads, which in turn, meant cutting corners in the script on "how/why" things are as they are. I'm not against, a 'hacking arrow'. But, how does a kid who was a party hardy, rich boy with no cares in the world except to get laid, get to be able to have such gadgets? after all, it's pretty high tech, he was literally lost for 5 yrs on a deserted island with no tech, nothing. In the show, he's so far seen as a solo act. So, something has to give. They should have taken a page from "Batman Begins", Nolan had it right in that movie. How did Batman get all these gadgets? the suit? etc.., everything was plausible.
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Oct. 11, 2012, 10:58 p.m. CST
Horse shit, Nikita is the best (only good) thing on the CW right now
by Cash907
Fuck Arrow.
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Oct. 11, 2012, 11:19 p.m. CST
Why did Herc shit on this so bad? This was actually a lot of fun.
by prof_zoom
Way better than anything on Smallville or the recent new52 GA.
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Oct. 12, 2012, 12:24 a.m. CST
There are so many plants on this thread - it's beginning to smell like a greenhouse
by migmog
THE CW actually believe that all this greenery will put us off deconstructing another DC live action fail A wasted opportunity to make a great show
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"Arrow" ep has been released on CWTV.com, if available in your region. <p> Wednesday's premiere of "Arrow," the superhero drama based on DC Comics' Green Arrow, was the most-watched show on The CW in three years, attracting 4.02 million viewers. <p> Starring Stephen Amell ("Hung"), the series centers on wealthy young bad boy Oliver Queen, who after being marooned on a remote island for five years returns to Starling City with a mastery of the bow and a determination to make a difference. <p> "Arrow" represented the network's highest-rated premiere since the hit supernatural drama "The Vampire Diaries" debuted to an audience of 4.91 million in September 2009. It also tied NBC's competing Wednesday comedies "Animal Practice" and "Guys With Kids" in overall viewers and in the 18-49 demographics, scoring a 1.3 rating/4 share. <p> The drama also helped to lift "Supernatural" to its best overall ratings in two years, with 2.6 million viewers.
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Ha! It's like 1999 all over again. How quaint!
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It has potential to get better, for sure. But right now it just feels like "The Cape" pretending that it's "The Dark Knight". It needs to gain a sense of humor. The characters are far too wooden. I'll give it a few episodes to try and find it's feet, but I'm giving up if the characters don't improve.
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I thought it had a lot of potential, and had no problem killing people left, right, and centre. Yup, I'll keep on at this for a while. Total Batman ripoff, but thats no bad thing.
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Remember when stuff in comics was fun?
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Oct. 12, 2012, 10:12 a.m. CST
HATED every single moment of SMALLVILLE (and TRUST me...I tried)...
by Mikey Wood
...but ARROW was...eh. It still suffers from that "CW" sensibility that just doesn't jive with mine. I'll give it a chance, though.
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Deathstroke, not Deadshot.
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BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SAME SHOW!
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As for people who are disappointed about not learning every detail of his time on that island - maybe give it more than one episode. Clearly there's alot that happened there that I'm assuming will be addressed. This with Supernatural following it make for a good night for the CW (before Arrow, Supernatural was the only CW show I watched). I look forward to seeing more of Arrow.
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Oct. 13, 2012, 3:50 p.m. CST
i enjoyed it was alright i guess not 2 bad perhaps
by qwsdqwedq sdbcjhdwiuvdh
better than the sanitized smallville: we have a vigilante who actually kills, his father commits suicide, while his sister seems 2 b a drug addict. and as for the techno-arrow responsible for the transfer of funds: thats not 2 difficult 2 believe in this day and age, just an arrow equipped with a wifi transceiver, remotely controlled to trigger. the techno-geeks among us would realize thats possible - and besides its a tv show 4 cryin out loud ! finally, i really hope that dina laurel lance becomes the black canary, and his sister, Speedy. it would really suck if they didnt
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is also very difficult to disguise in practice, as arrow, it's very distinct, even in the comix it makes no sense that he can get away with it coz how many men sport robin-hood-like facial hair?
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ya bond has Q 2 provide him and school him in the l8est gadgets and tech - its not believable that olive queen did all that by himself - there must b a Q lurking in the shadows
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Oct. 14, 2012, 4:01 p.m. CST
liked the pilot. Should have been a double feature origin story.
by Richard L. Rhodes
bring it on....
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that catters to the girls and fags. so you have a male sidekick to Arrow who's kinda faggy.
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