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Re: That SHAZAM item yesterday.... and well... you'll see.
Hey folks, Harry here. Now some of you may be wondering what happened to the SHAZAM/CAPTAIN MARVEL story from yesterday. Well I deleted it as soon as I heard it wasn't true... which was about 1520 hours (C.S.T.) yesterday. Turns out it was a prank sort of thing...
Aaaaaaah... I see, I hear you saying, "But I thought you said you talked to sources that said they had heard about the scripts before, but that noone you knew had actually read one!"
Well, that was the tricky part. A pair of the easiest screenwriters to acquire copies of their scripts are Andrew Kevin Walker and the Wachowski Brothers... since SEVEN and MATRIX... everything these guys seem to write lands in my or Moriarty's hands faster than you can say my name. But usually we need to know the title in order to ask our sources for it. In this case... where a source 'completely made the story up' there should be no confirmations. In this case... there were.
That still raised hairs on my neck even after I deleted the story, so I continued calling and talking to folks I know in the biz... people that track properties for me and others. And finally when I called Junior Mintz I heard her cute little voice wish me well. Before I could even broach the subject, she went off upon SHAZAM/CAPTAIN MARVEL... Junior Mintz, besides being the greatest Concession Stand Attendee ever, is also a Convention Flirt and Studio Slinktress. Turns out she had once spoken to Alex Ross at some convention in the area of Parts Unknown, and was told how he and his often times partner in crime, Paul Dini, were pursuing the idea of doing an animated SHAZAM/CAPTAIN MARVEL tv series... for which Dini would write and Ross... well apparently Ross had ALREADY done up designs that were incredible. The lovely gal continued to relate the story that unfortunately it seemed the rights were tied up within the Feature division and that Warners was considering the property for possible feature film production.
However, if nothing happens with the property... there is definately interest from Ross and Dini to develop as a television animated property. Personally, my mind boggles at the concept of a Alex Ross designed animated something. I can't even comprehend the total scale of coolness that would reach with Dini alongside. And ol Junior Mintz' New Jersey accent was interrupted with throaty breaths as she was speaking sooo fast.
So while the scooper yesterday was being a horses' behind... and thought he was constructing something ludicrous... in the land of Hollywood ludicrous is upon every utility post and in every office. While the boy thought he was kidding, there was most definately a wolf upon the prowl.
Further investigations continue...
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Nothing is more interesting than readng about the Justice League put in the context of Revelations from the Bible. That fight at the end where Supes takes on Captain Marvel and almost gets is AAAARRRSSSSSSS kicked. Classic and smart. Not every fan boy remembers that Big Blue is also vulnerable to magic. "....dashed by a single bolt of lightning."
Shazam.
And I'm OUT. -
would be great to see, but could never be done live action... It would probably cost more than the gross of "Titanic" to make! But to be made as animated feature, by the same group of brilliant people who produce the New Batman/Superman Adventures, Batman Beyond, Batman:Mask of the Phantasm, and Subzero.... AHHHHH!!! NOW you're talking!!! Just think of the possibilities.....
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They totally ripped off Led Zeppelin. Lenny Wolf thought he was Robert Plant, but he was sadly mistaken.
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Issue #3
Winter 2000
of the magazine Alter-Ego by Roy Thomas has some superb examples of Alex Ross' designs for Captain Marvel. Check it out. -
There I was, rambling about how I would like to see a Preacher HBO TV series yesterday on the SHAZAM talkback and all of a sudden, the story disappears. Oh well, I thought the reason why the story was pulled had to do with the rights to show those pictures of Captain Marvel that were with the story. I guess I was wrong. A Power of Shazam animated series seems more likely than a movie anyway. There's something about The Big Red Cheese and his whole family that is fitting for cartoons, maybe it is because of the big talking tiger or the worm that wants to take over the world. The end of Kingdom Come #3 where Captain Marvel stands over a battered Superman was one of the coolest images I have ever seen in comics. Any series that Alex Ross is creatively involved with has my full attention.
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I suspected it was BS when I read
that Terry Gilliam was interested...
something about that just didn't
ring true. I was just about to
say so in the talkback, when
suddenly the article was gone... -
Apr 25, 2000 11:20:22 AM CDT
There's pretty much unanimous agreement from the fans -- an anim
by superninja
So what's the holdup? The scope if much, much too large for a live-action feature -- not to mention the story would get totally muddled. WB, please give the fans an animated feature film, or at least miniseries on Kids WB by Dini & Co.
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There were a few interesting conversations going on in TalkBack which now are, apparently, deleted. It would've been just as effective to UPDATE the news item from yesterday with the information posted today, in which you admit the story was bogus, Harry. What's the difference? Now all of our BRILLIANT dialogue is lost! Hehehh...
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The scope of Kindom Come was almost too much for the comics. It would take a pretty talented crew to put together something the size of that story for an animated series. Plus the material handled would be kind of hard to pass off as kiddie fare. The Joker kills Lois Lane. Superman bleeds from his ears and attacks Congress. That's some pretty heavy stuff to air right between Pokemon and Pinky and the Brain. I would love to see it, but the only way that series would become a cartoon is if it was majorly toned down. And a G-rated Kingdom Come cartoon is something I would rather not see. Like it or not, the Adventures of Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and Captain Marvel are still going to be geared towards a young audience. Mature themes can be sprinkled in here and there, but KC is a powerful and heavy story. I'll stick with re-reading the books.
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The problem with adapting KC to the screen or as an animated movie was that it was a fanboy's dream. You had a cast of virtually every character in the DC universe; past, present, and future. It was fun to look at the beautifully painted pictures and pick out the different versions of heroes and hidden treasures Ross is well known for. This kind of detail and respect for the fans would be lost in a motion picture format (animated or otherwise). I guess they could just pay attention to the story of the main characters and it wouldn't be bad. But the full spectrum of recognition of DC history and nods to the fans would be lost. I guess I am just a little pissed that the Ambush Bug was no where to be found in Kingdom Come.
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Between this one and the Nightbreed story, it's impossible to have a coherent conversation at all. Not that any of my posts are coherent. Bug, out.
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Has anyone else seen this? It's really good. VERY hard to get a hold of though. I don't think it will ever get released. HA HA HA, just try and get a hold of a copy geeks! (It's ok, I'm one too)
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I took a meeting last year with a guy who was devloping an animated KC movie. It of course fell apart. Which was prob a good thing, considering they were ditching the character of Norman McCay, for twelve-year-old Tim Hunter (from the Books of Magic). Talk a bout a slap in the face for Alex Ross. Let's pray that that Dini and Ross' Power of Shazam! TV project comes thru. I think we've had enough of that phony-baloney Batman Beyond. It's Spider-Man in a Batman suit; and that ain't Batman.
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I took a meeting last year with a guy who was devloping an animated KC movie. It of course fell apart. Which was prob a good thing, considering they were ditching the character of Norman McCay, for twelve-year-old Tim Hunter (from the Books of Magic). Talk a bout a slap in the face for Alex Ross. Let's pray that that Dini and Ross' Power of Shazam! TV project comes thru. I think we've had enough of that phony-baloney Batman Beyond. It's Spider-Man in a Batman suit; and that ain't Batman.
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Oh yeah... Ambush Bug is in Kingdom Come. You just gotta look real close. He's there. Check out the Wizard Alex Ross special if you're stumped.
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Alex Ross and Paul Dini have another large scale, fully painted book like last year's Batman: War on Crime and the previous year's Superman: Peace on Earth on the way for this fall, this time a story about Captain Marvel. I wonder if that scooper was just confused about what Ross and Dini were up to...?
With Dini already writing the movie script for Million Dollar Heroes and Ross booked up for the year (check out his plans for 2000 at http://www.anotheruniverse.com/comics/interviews/alexrossone033100.html), it's hard to imagine the two of them having time to collaborate on an animated series.
That said, Ross is a huge fan of the "animated" style of Bruce Timm and has said he wanted to do an animated style Adventures of Superman special about the first meeting of Cap and Superman. A third season episode of the late, lamented Superman Adventures animated series was supposed to feature Cap, but got cut from the production schedule.
In the current WB superhero adaptation climate (not to mention the distance Ross has taken from DC after the way they handled the awful follow up stories to Kingdom Come), a Kingdom Come or even a JLA animated series or movie seems so unlikely as to be close to impossible. Look how they have mishandled their prime superhero franchise properties and ask yourself if you'd really want to see what they'd do to Kingdom Come in bringing it to the screen. -
My favorite thing about Kingdom Come was when they tried to deny ever having heard Led Zeppelin. Sheah! Right!
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Good point! It's one thing if you're going to rip off a band, but to totally deny that you ever heard of them? Yeesh. At least Whitesnake had the sack to admit they were Zep fans. Hey, I've written this song, it's called "Yesterday", and I think it's going to be a big hit. Paul who? Never heard of the guy.
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You just gave me something to do tonight. Now I have to scour my copies of KC for a glimpse of me and Cheeks.
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Apr 25, 2000 3:40:02 PM CDT
Getting back to my topic from yesterday's deleted story...
by ambush bug
How about a Preacher HBO Tv series? The Preacher comics are screaming to be adapted into live action. A cable station like HBO who churn out excellent series like OZ and The Sopranos would be the perfect place for Jesse Custer and Co. A movie about the series would be nice, but a series would allow the creators to follow the issue by issue format of the series and really flesh out these uber-cool characters. I wannna see Arseface! I wanna see Jesse tell the cops to go fuck themselves and have them actually do it! I wanna see faces blown off by gunshots! I wanna see Starr get his leg eaten by inbred cannibals! I wanna see Cassidy jumping off of the Empire State Building! I wanna see the Allfather falling from the plane onto the chosen one! Garth said the movie was dead. This is the perfect time to re-start an actual series. Sorry, got a little excited, there. Since the posts are so fucked up today, I don't know if this will go to the top or to the bottom or the middle of the page. I give up trying to post today. I'm going to sleep and hopefully things will be better on the flip flop.
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I really didn't like that series, especially coming on the heels of the far more interesting "Marvels". Seems like Mark Waid was trying too hard to have *every* line of dialogue and narration drip with meaning and portent, and that came across as silly and pompous to me. It's definitely possible for superheroes to be taken too seriously, and if ever a project proved that, it's "Kingdom Come". One of the biggest problems for me was how uninvolving the framing device was. That particular narrative contrivance(Spectre=cosmic tour bus for the pastor who must "bear witness") seemed so forced as to be laughable at times. An interesting idea, maybe, but after four issues, annoying. Even Alex Ross's art fell flat for me. His action scenes were muddled and confusing, and I really felt his desire to meticulously showcase every hero in the DC pantheon was more a distraction than an enticement. Working with a small number of iconic heroes and villains in "Marvels" worked really well, but Ross's photorealistic style is ill-suited for vast armadas of heroes and big fight scenes. Oh, and I think Waid's writing is pretty weak too, though I've never thought of him as a good writer to begin with. If you want to write the next "Watchmen", you need to be able to write on the level of Alan Moore - Waid's not even in the ballpark. As for the Captain Marvel connection...like I said in yesterday's deleted Talkback, this guy should never have been transplanted into the DC universe to start with. Read any of C.C. Beck's classic Captain Marvel stories and you'll realize what folly it is to take the character seriously for one minute. And as a central story point in a tale of pending Armageddon? The height of folly. So what did I *like* about it "Kingdom Come"? Well, Ross's designs on all the central characters were great, especially Wonder Woman and Green Lantern. Ummm...other than that, I'm stumped. I admire Waid and Ross's intent, but their follow through left me totally cold.
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I just wanted to point out that according to Wizard magazine last month, Ross and Dini scrapped the Shazam over sized painted book idea for, get this, the Wonder Twins. (contrary to Mister Nobody's post)
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That news item about Ross and Dini dropping Captain Marvel for a Wonder Twins project...it didn't happen to appear anytime near April 1st, did it? I think you've been had, my friend.
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Let me ask everyone a question,
If Kingdom Come was drawn by any other artist would it be as popular as it was? Ihave to say no
Mark Waid's writing was both fanboyish and dull. If not for Alex Ross's excellent work on the book and his terrific sightgags.You would see this series rotting in the quarter bin. For a truly well written comic series check out Alan Moore's V for Vendetta. -
this will NEVER get made, without compromising the existing story, whether you think it's genius or not. Think about it... it's a story that is completely dependant on the continuity of hundreds of characters, most of whom "normal" people (ha ha) have never heard of.
we "got" kingdom come, cause we read millions of comic books involving those characters, so we know why superman and batman don't get along, why captain marvel's so important to the story, and also we know who the hell ORION is. people who haven't ever read a comic book in their life wouldn't have a clue as to what was going on. I think that MARVELS on the other hand would be perfect for a movie, because the story is told through that photogropher, and we never get up close to the heroes themselves. People could relate to this character, and they could watch and understand what's going on without having to read tonnes of comic books beforehand. although, because of the stigma attatched to comic book movies,audiences would probably feel like they were missing something anyway...
BOTTOM LINE: comic books do not translate that well to the silver screen. sad, but true... -
Awwww. A Shazam movie would be soooo cool. Well, mayb not. But my Dad used to read the comic, and I thought it was cool. Never really saw that TV show that was made, but it could be really cool. Apparently the original Captain Marvel was based upon movie star Fred MacMurray anyway, so he's calready got cinema roots!
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I know he's supposed to be playing the tick, but Patrick Warbouten (Puddy on Seinfeld) would make one incredible Capt. Marvel. Shazam!!!!
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