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Comic-Con: Man of Steel footage debuts! Zack Snyder talks about lack of John Williams theme and Justice League!

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with yet more panel coverage! I’m a geek machine! Granted a kinda glitchy machine considering all the spelling and grammar errors in these reports, but a machine nonetheless.

Let’s look at the Man of Steel panel, shall we? Zack Snyder took the stage and brought up his Superman, Mr. Henry Cavill before showing an extended preview, which I believe he said is different than the teaser, which will for sure be attached to The Dark Knight Rises, by the way.

Let me say up front that going into this panel I was not sold on Henry Cavill playing Superman. He’s not a bad actor, but never really stood out to me and I didn’t really like his look in the publicity stills. I also thought Suckerpunch was a couple hours of Zack Snyder jerking off on the audience, but I do have a deep appreciation of his visual talents and honestly think he did as good of a job as anybody possibly could have in adapting Watchmen for the big screen.

I expected the Superman footage to be big on visual flair, so I was pleasantly surprised to find the stuff he screened to be aimed much more somber legend-building, setting up Superman as a man unsure of his role in our world. There were shots of a kid (possibly young Clark) running around playing in a rural front yard, a red blanket tied around his neck. You don’t see his face, but he ends his running around in the classic hands-on-hips Superman pose.

Kal-El’s voiceover is essentially talking about how his father believes he should keep his powers secret, that people will turn on him and he doesn’t know what to do. I’m not sure which “father” tells him this as we get shots of both Kevin Costner and Clark (Pa Kent showing him the alien ship that he arrived in, which was much more Ridley Scott in design than Richard Donner) and adult Clark face to face with Russell Crowe’s Jor-El (hologram? Looked solid, but it’s gotta be some trickery).

There was a quick shot of Michael Shannon as Zod (which Zack would not ever comment on, calling his character “that guy”, but we all know it’s Zod)… had something, maybe part of a suit that sat on his shoulders, as a life jacket would, a goatee (he is evil afterall) and a short Caesar haircut.

Speaking of Shannon there was also a shot that looked like a scene out of Take Shelter, a huge tornado twirling behind a woman holding a child.

A couple other details stood out to me… there was a shot of Cavill being thrown through a window, back crashing into a giant bank vault door, which looks to be where this publicity still comes from (although that still looks very digital and clean, whereas the footage shown was much more filmick):



When Superman flies up up and away, the atmosphere bends around him when he reaches speed, much like it does a jet. That was pretty cool. There was also a shot of Cavill sans shirt completely on fire as he runs through a burning room, of course not burning himself.

Another sequence featured young Clark Kent on his school bus that gets in an accident, falling off a bridge into water. The kids scream and a voiceover of one of the kid’s mothers says “My daughter saw what Clark did” against a shot of young Clark at the back of the bus, lifting it out of the water as a young girl turns her head and they lock eyes.

There really doesn’t seem to be a lot of trust in Superman in this film. We were shown shots of Supes being walked along military corridors by soldiers with guns at the ready, a bearded Clark Kent looking like a damn lumberjack sitting in the rain, looking conflicted and kind of sad.

Like I mentioned above, it was very much about introducing us to a new Superman, much more in line with the mood of Alex Ross’ more realistic portraits of the man. In that respect it’s much closer to Christopher Nolan’s Batman films tonally.

This is a more restrained Zack Snyder if the footage is any indication. And having gone in not sold on Cavill I’m significantly more intrigued by his portrayal of Kal-El. He’s somehow taking Superman away from the Christopher Reeve mold yet still feeling like Superman. There’s a lot going on in his eyes, the performance very internalized.

Some interesting panel tid-bits:

-When asked about a Justice League movie, Snyder wouldn’t talk too much, but he did say this: “Superman is the jewel in the DC crown and lets just say we're getting his house in order.”

-The footage didn’t feature John Williams’ iconic theme in any form and Snyder confirmed that it won’t appear in this film. He pretty much just said that he didn’t want to set up this whole new cinematic version, making it something separate from the previous films and then go and steal the score. In other words, he wants to cleanly cut the umbilical from the Donner films. Can’t say I blame him, but I hope Hans Zimmer knows just how fucked his position is here. He’s kind of in a damned if you do, damned if you don’t spot. Good luck to you, sir.

-Cavill cited Death of Superman, Return of Superman and Superman: Red Son as where he drew much of his understanding of the character from.

-Someone asked Snyder who would win in a fight, his Superman or Chris Nolan’s Batman. Snyder laughed and said, “Batman is literally awesome, but really? Come on!” gesturing behind him at the giant screen we just watched the footage of Supes flying through the upper atmosphere and crushing safe doors with his body.

Whether the movie turns out good or not, I’m at least impressed with what seems like a new side of Snyder as a director here. He’s going for a tone and feel that will either work in the same way Batman Begins did or won’t suit the big blue Boy Scout at all. I guess we’ll see in a year’s time.

-Eric Vespe
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Readers Talkback
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  • July 15, 2012, 6:39 a.m. CST

    how the fuck does superman shave?

    by mojination

    kryptonite gilette?

  • July 15, 2012, 6:39 a.m. CST


    by pradeep1980

    My life's work is now compete

  • July 15, 2012, 6:41 a.m. CST

    Don Johnson ?

    by pradeep1980

    Eh? Did you mean Costner? Interesting that he didn't confirm Zod as the villain - I think the authorities ie the military will be the real villains - especially as the world is so anti authority these days

  • July 15, 2012, 6:43 a.m. CST

    apologies pradeep1980

    by mojination

    I really don't wanna be *that guy*, but here we are. and yeah, Johnson? What gives??

  • July 15, 2012, 6:44 a.m. CST

    Michael Shannon

    by Mr Soze


  • July 15, 2012, 6:44 a.m. CST

    No optimism left for this project.

    by cock smoker

    Wrong tone, wrong actor, wrong director and another stupid origin story. How do they fuck up Supes on two different projects 7 years apart. Totally depressing news. Tough for even DC lovers to talk this piece of shit up.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:45 a.m. CST

    Movie of 2013.

    by UltimaRex

    Calling it now. This looks more like a Nolan movie than a Snyder one. Calming influence?

  • July 15, 2012, 6:46 a.m. CST


    by pradeep1980

    You are a better man than I am old chap

  • July 15, 2012, 6:47 a.m. CST

    Be good,...

    by Kevin


  • July 15, 2012, 6:47 a.m. CST

    Yes, we fucking know who superman is, no need for ''legend building''

    by Mysterious_Volvo


  • July 15, 2012, 6:49 a.m. CST

    Unrelated but even worse news on WW Z

    by cock smoker

    Story on AP yesterday that Pitt and director marc foster are no longer on speaking terms. All communication is being done thru a third party and they don't talk directly to each other on set. Forget about the rewrite and reshoots for the ending. This one might never see the theatre.

  • God, I love this site.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:53 a.m. CST

    How superman shaves:

    by veteran_of_mu

  • Give it a whirl. We're non-Hollywood.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:55 a.m. CST

    How Superman shaves:

    by Aidil_Afham

    Always thought about that, or how he cuts his hair. But Hancock shows it, he fucking shaved with his fingernails!

  • Some will absolutely fucking LOVE this new take on Superman - say "about TIME the generic blue boyscout was retooled into something more relevant to the modern world and asked relevant questions about the place a man like this would have in the world." Others will spend hour after hour online frothing at the mouth about how Snyder sucks, how Christopher reeve is the bestest Superman ever, how this is all flourish and no substance, how the suit has too much texture, or Superman didn't act like the Superman they grew up with. They'll beat their heads bloody against the keyboard and type their hands to bloody stumps in an effort to convince anyone who will listen just how badly this movie sucks balls, raped their childhood, etc, etc, etc. You know...the average talkbacker. "Wahh, there's no plot!" "Wahhhh! It's not like the Donner films!" "WAHHHH he doesn't have red undies and it wasn't my personal brand of what Superman should be, god forbid anyone ELSE have a different opinion." One thing is for sure though - this, more than Superman Returns (which was generally agreed my most to lack substance) will be the one that will divide audiences. Some people just can't unstaple their asscheeks from the past and accept that Superman needed to be updated to survive as a viable hero, and that Donner's films were good for their time but sadly dated now. Others can appreciate necessary change. Or it could just be so godaweful that we all hate it. But most likely the former than the latter.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:58 a.m. CST

    Volvo - chill

    by DirtyWookie

    For starters, not everyone knows about The Legend 7 year old son knows nothing about Superman, so it's all new to him. Jesus, the last origin story was in 78 when I was fucking 7...Chill out man! Either find a girl or have a wank, but just chill

  • July 15, 2012, 7 a.m. CST

    Snyder Slo Mo = Abrams Lens Flare

    by cock smoker

    Self indulgent pricks.

  • I'm impressed with what I'm seeing so far, I think he's going to make all Superman fans happy this time around. I don't think he's going disappoint anybody. Oh yeah, and by the way, the score played throughout the trailer of "Man of Steel", was the main score from the film, "The Thin Red Line". Zimmer didn't score the music for "Man of Steel" yet, it's still being worked on, so they had to use something else.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:01 a.m. CST

    re: "how the fuck does superman shave?"

    by buggerbugger

    He rubs his face against the cheese-grater material of his new costume. That's the "in-story functionality" that's being mentioned online.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:04 a.m. CST

    No John Williams is most instant fail

    by shutupfanboy

    It was the one thing Superman Returns got right. I am hoping this will be a good film, but it feels like they are shoving Superman I and II.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:04 a.m. CST


    by Valenni

    Since you have seen it, can you post up a full review? Good man.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:04 a.m. CST

    And if

    by Cervantes

  • July 15, 2012, 7:06 a.m. CST

    Batman is the crown jewel of DCU.

    by shutupfanboy

    I mean 3 films that will do over a billion dollars, multiple animated series that won awards and the toy lines. Lets all be reasonable, here.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:07 a.m. CST

    If they don't JLA, they are morons.

    by shutupfanboy

    Shit, I wrote an 80 page script for the League. Granted, its a skeleton script, but it is not the most impossible thing in the world.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:07 a.m. CST

    Re: "shutupfanboy"...

    by brocknroll

    Snyder made it pretty clear at SDCC this is a Superman movie like it's made for the first time. Which means, this film is going to ignore everything from the Reeve/Donner films. That's the whole point, of "Man of Steel". It's a new era.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:10 a.m. CST


    by Aidil_Afham

    You mean updated like how Spiderman did? Everyone was complaining about how everyoe knows Spiderman, the origins, his teen troubles so when the movie came out, yes those things were the worst part of that movie. I admit I enjoyed it but just the parts where full-fledged Spiderman was doing his thing. Even mainstream audiences were groaning at the origin retelling, its just so tired to see no matter how you do it. This one is dangerously teethering on that. One of the criticism the new Spiderman got was "Could it have been done as a continuation or stand alone movie without going back to the origin?" The answer is yes, you have The Lizard, Spidey being mote confident in his abilities and goofin around, even the parents plot could be done without the tiresome spider bite. Could this new Supes do just that? All the lonliness, unsure about the world's view on him, hiding in the population and Zod coming to kick his ass. Yes it could be done with just a simple introduction or flashbacks to his glory days. This constant re-telling wastes time, money, audiences investment in the franchise. The public moved beyond the comic bookiness in these movies, we all know who is Superman.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:13 a.m. CST


    by mukhtabi

    These are great reports. You truly are an awe-inspiring machine. That being said, I am literally dying of anticipation to read what you have to say concerning Pacific Rim, Kaiju, etc. I hope there are pics with that. SO curious as to what and how Guillermo envisions those monsters. Please get on that, as soon as you arise; assuming you actually got some sleep of course.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:17 a.m. CST

    Man of Steel

    by mukhtabi

    I think the reason they keep going back to Origin, is because that's precisely how the comic book industry has done it. Every so often, they remix the origin and go from there. The only time I can recall they really didn't attempt an origin story was with STORMWATCH, when Warren Ellis took over, he just cold cocked the story line and continued it in an awesome and inspiring way. I do think I'd like to see a few non origin first movies for some of these DC characters. Wonder Woman, actually kicking ass. The Flash actually doing whatever the hell it is The Flash does besides move super fast. etc.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:22 a.m. CST

    And yet STILL doesnt answer my question..

    by Thomas

    Where the HELL is my Red Dawn trailer?

  • Who doesn't know Superman's story? Most on Earth do. It's NOT that complicated a backstory. Advanced civilization...planet blows up...last son sent to Earth, blah blah blah. That's not the kind of re-telling I mean. Unless of course Snyder is re-inventing Superman's origins (which would be a very dangerous move on his part - some things you can play with..but his origins are pretty solidly set, with some wiggle room for what Krypton is like, what his parents were like, etc). But Superman, I think, is dead in the water without a massive overhaul at this point. He's become stale...boring...mundane...cliche. I'm not saying make him into a murderous psychopathic god, but he doesn't need to be squeaky clean - he should struggle with morality, as anyone with his powers would - because sometimes, you just have to kill a motherfucker to keep others safe. I think Superman Vs The Elite handled that question well - Snyder could take a page from it. IS that old kind of Superman still relevant? AREN'T there some villains who are just too dangerous to leave alive or try to lock up? WOULD humanity entrust their safety to this guy who in one hand holds the power to destroy entire nations with no real way to stop him? I'm thinking people would not like the idea of someone with that kind of power walking around. But the guy standing there with his hands on his hips spouting off about truth, justice, and the american way is no longer relevant - and the American way is hardly a way of truth and justice all the time. We all know that. Even GOD in the bible got angry and jealous and so forth and killed people - nobody is THAT devoid of temptation. Nobody is THAT good. He should have to struggle - that's what makes him super. Not his powers - but the choices he makes with them.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:23 a.m. CST

    Fuck Snyder, Fuck Nolan and Fuck This Movie.

    by tensticks

  • July 15, 2012, 7:23 a.m. CST

    I thought Supes used his heat vision to shave


    I recall a scene from the animated series where he reflects his heat vision off his bathroom mirror to burn off his facial hair. Does he do something similar when he needs a haircut?

  • July 15, 2012, 7:27 a.m. CST

    Throwing the baby out with the bath water.

    by shutupfanboy

    Even as a reboot, it doesn't mean you need to throw everything. To be fair, they doing Superman I again, but this time Zod is there. Its the origin over again even with the Jor-El warning about interfering in human events. There is really nothing new. Make the suit dark for the nerds who like that shit, but the Williams score and Sups are linked on big screen. Also, I'd take the Elfman score any day over the rather weak and big trumpet of Zimmer in the Nolan films.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:28 a.m. CST


    by Johnboy40

    Didn't they try making the last one a continuation of the Donner movies, just with a different cast/actors? well, if that were the right approach, we wouldn't be getting this one, would we? For mine, Im not 100% sold on this as yet. But I have no problems with someone trying a different approach to superman, cos why the fuck not? It aint the 70s anymore, its 2012. It's a different world, and art will always reflect life.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:30 a.m. CST

    alex ross's "realism"

    by JAMF

    he gives everyone a double chin. that's literally all he does.

  • Superman is an illegal alien. Would he be greeted any other way in the current political environment? Superman is stealing jobs away from real american heroes like Spiderman, Batman, and Captain America..

  • I think Snyder has a good point in if he wants to retool Superman into something different than in the past movies...then it doesnt really make sense to borrow the theme. I LOVE the Williams theme. It is iconic, it is wonderful...but it belongs to THAT version of Superman. I have a feeling this wouldn't fit too well. This doesnt seem to be the squeaky clean goody two-shoes boyscout we are used to (and there have been less than perfectly honorable or moral versions of Superman, you know)... Superman debuted over 70 YEARS AGO. A world war, and a half dozen other major wars have come and gone since then. Men went to the moon, race relations changed, this country changed...the world changed. This is not the world that Superman was born into in the 1930's. Why should Superman become his own cliche? He NEEDS to become a modern Superman to survive as a pop cultural icon. So I know it's hard...but just give it a chance. Yeah, you know what, the Zimmer score probably WONT be as memorable as Williams' score. It would be nearly impossible to beat. But it is a necessary evil, I think. You will always have the Donner films, and...Superman Returns. Should you feel the need to hear that those. People hate change. But change will happen whether you like it or not. So...might as well make peace with it now, before the movie comes out - you aren't getting the theme. If it bothers you that much...don't watch the movie. Don't support it. Nobody is making you watch it. Just don't. And who knows. Maybe Zimmer will work in some musical tribute to the williams theme in there somewhere - just a hint of it.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:34 a.m. CST

    How Superman shaved originally.

    by joelgee

    In the comic books, Superman used to shave by bouncing his heat vision off of something (don't remember) reflective and burning off his facial hair. Nobody remembers this? J

  • July 15, 2012, 7:35 a.m. CST

    "How the fuck does Superman shave?"

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    There was an episode of the 90's animated series where Supes bounced his heat vision off his bathroom mirror and burned off his morning stubble.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:38 a.m. CST

    Whoops, glen_the_tool beat me to it

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    It's still a funny visual. Now cutting his hair...I don't know how the fuck he manages that.

  • Well said, @johnboy40 It's plain and simple. If you do not want a new vision, then stick to your Richard Donner - John Williams Superman, and don't bother watching the new one at all. If what it would takes to satisfy you is someone making the same approach, the same style, the same music, then wouldn't that be the same movie you probably have already seen? Someone has already mentioned, the last origin story of Superman made for movies was back in 1978. I wasn't born back then! I've seen it once and I thought that film was good for when it was out. It's not anymore. Someone said that Superman is becoming stale, boring, and mundane. Isn't this movie what's gonna make it interesting again? Batman was dead on water after that Batman and Robin movie, but look what happened now that someone rebooted it? Why are a lot of people afraid of change? They can call themselves FAIL!

  • July 15, 2012, 7:46 a.m. CST

    glen_the_tool and nasty in the pasty are correct.

    by Crooooooow

    It's also been shown to be how he shaves in the comic.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:46 a.m. CST

    How does Superman shave his balls though?

    by Gary Makin

  • Both are bad. Do we really want to keep seeing rehashes of what has already been? We need to take a chance SOMETIMES. Some movies are just obviously terrible even before they get out of the gate. Others, we think are so aweful and then we're proven wrong. Not always but sometimes. To be honest, I was bent on not seeing The Amazing Spiderman - I thought it was unnecessary, that it just didn't look right, etc, etc...and it wasn't necessary...granted...but out of boredom and perhaps insanity I went to see it for $5, and it was considerably better than I thought. Not GREAT....but not too painful to even sit through. It wont be remembered as the greatest Spiderman movie by any means - the first two are still far better - but it is at least comparable to 3 in some ways....which wasn't as terrible as people like to say. Others, like Total Recall...I simply have no interest in watching a remake that isn't even on Mars and rehashes the exact lines from the first movie while claiming it's so different. So I really am not going to watch that, unless maybe it's online and I'm just that bored that I bootleg the thing.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:56 a.m. CST

    Snyder: John Williams's iconic theme won’t appear in this film

    by buggerbugger

    Star Wars without the Star Wars theme. Jaws without the Jaws theme. Indiana Jones without the Raiders theme. Halloween without the Halloween theme. Psycho without Hermann's shrieking strings. The Twilight Zone without the Twilight Zone theme. The Omen without the Omen theme. Sounds like a bunch of in-name-only crap to me. Take away those themes and you might as well make something else instead of cashing in on the brand name.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:58 a.m. CST


    by Aidil_Afham

    I don't hate change, in fact the reason I liked the new Spiderman and looking foward to Superman is the fresh new take. But I'm really bothered with that 1st movie where they're tryig to establish the character and origin. I'm a fan of how the 2nd Hulk movie handled the origin, with a the intro n few mention of it by the characters. i wish Hollywood could follow the comics structure, one shot and new arcs are introduced, with new take, writing and art that expands the character, and not retellin everything from the start. This new Superman could do that. Whatever thecase, I'm really lookig foward to this despite Zack Snyder with that stupid Sucker Punch. Keep him on a leash and give him materials to work with and he'll do fine.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:58 a.m. CST

    yeah, 'cause remember superman 4

    by mojination

    the quest for peace?* they had a single hair with that weight hanging off it that Lex Hackthor uses to create nuclear man. i mean, the mirror thing makes sense, only his heat vision would be enough to shave, but jeeze you'd have to be careful. *possibly shouldn't be taken as canon...

  • July 15, 2012, 7:59 a.m. CST

    Saw the bootleg trailer before it got taken down

    by Cymbol

    And I thought it was great. I know a lot of people don't like "realism", but to me, that is what made Superman 1 so great. This movie looks to be epic. Hope it is. Superman deserves nothing less.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:01 a.m. CST

    Yes this is a rehash of Batman Begins which is even worse

    by Rupee88

    They can't even come up with an original take on the character and sounds like Nolan is doing the EXACT same thing with Supes as with Bats...just lame. Why don't they just have fun with it like Joss Whedon with Avengers? I guess the easy answer is that they aren't talented enough to do that. Nolan should kiss a picture of Heath Ledger's white ass every day as he owes about 95% of his street cred to him.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:03 a.m. CST

    Superman shaving

    by Rupee88

    Yes you guys bring up a good point because superheroes are by nature goofy and aren't supposed to be "real" and "gritty". Superman is an alien from another planet but looks perfectly human....that alone is just implausible. But wgas and just enjoy the character. No he can't shave and no his suit makes no sense and no he doesn't look like an alien and no it makes no sense how he can fly. So don't try to make the rest of him more "real" because it is a joke.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:08 a.m. CST

    Trailer at


    but not good viewing

  • Fast forward 5 years, and people act as if Zack Snyder is dressing up as Hitler and river dancing at bar mitzvahs while flipping everyone off with one hand and doing a sieg heil with the other. Granted...Sucker Punch was a misfire. As nice as Emily Browning is to look just wasn't a good movie. But I did enjoy 300. I did Enjoy Watchmen (granted I have NO knowledge of the comic at all in either case). So I think I could enjoy this movie. I was wrong about The Amazing Spiderman - it wasn't amazing but it wasn't utter shit either. I'm willing to believe that any assumption I arrive at for this movie at this point might be wrong too, and so I shall reserve final judgment until I actually see it. And so should you.

  • Superman briefly turning into the badguy in "Superman III", he had a little beard growing, not a big one bu it was starting to grow.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:14 a.m. CST


    by wcolbert

  • July 15, 2012, 8:15 a.m. CST


    by Rupee88

    It's not our fault that you weren't bright enough to be able to tell that AMS was going to be a crappy movie. We can make judgement on movies beforehand because we have the cranial capacity to do so more accurately than you can. And I'm saying this will suck. I think it will probably be good and fun, but just because you are clueless doesn't mean everyone else has to be as well.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:17 a.m. CST

    Snyder Slo Mo = Abrams Lens Flare-"self indulgant pricks"?

    by David Smith

    Yea and that fucking Scorsese with his long tracking shots, Nolan with his Massive Imax setpieces, Lynch with his dream sequences, Raimi with his shaky pov cam, Hitchcock with his cross-tracking, Leone with his long close-ups of faces, Speilberg with his reflection shots, etc........, how dare these fockers have their own signatutre shots, they make the movies look soo pretty, i hate the baterds.(for you US folk im being a little ironic)

  • July 15, 2012, 8:18 a.m. CST

    Hold on a hot damn minute

    by maelstrom_ZERO

    Snyder is using Death and Return of Superman as his source material? The comic where rather than having a great story, is about Superman having a 15 page arbitrary slugfest with a heretofore unmentioned villain that manages to kill the supposedly invincible Man of Steel, merely for the sake of DC marketing schemes? And where different stupid versions of Superman return, traipsing about like idiots, while Superman just happens to be taking an extended nap? THAT fucking comic is his source material? Well damn.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:22 a.m. CST

    Re: "maelstrom_zero"

    by brocknroll

    Snyder never said using "Death" and "Return of Superman" as source material of this movie. Henry Cavill said he read those as a way to understand the Superman character, a little better. There's no way this film is adapted from those two comics. They were more research material.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:22 a.m. CST

    We have the cranial capacity

    by wcolbert

    Oh, the irony of that statement. Anyone with any intelligence whatsoever doesn't assume themselves to be correct - they leave the possibility open that they are incorrect. That's part of the scientific method of observing our universe, you know. You form a hypothesis - you don't say "I'm right! I know it all! This for sure is this or that way! Because I R SMART!" Honestly, kid. Go back to bed. You're embarassing yourself. Yes, I know you're looking to troll. Looking for a fight. But I'll not give you the satisfaction. This will be the only thing I have to say to you on that matter. Now if you disagree with me, that's one thing. But to come here trying to insult people's intelligence because they didn't hate a movie you assumed would suck? That truly is freakishly moronic.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:31 a.m. CST


    by Bass Ackwards

    No, maybe give the article another read.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:41 a.m. CST

    fan rotoscope the red shorts

    by firehawk_thexder

    I understand roto-scoping software has come a long way these days. I'm hoping for a fan edit to be available at some point with the red shorts rotoscoped onto cavil's suit.

  • A reality-based Superman? Wanna bet a minimal of 3-4 actions scenes? And those will hardly matched anything we've already seen in the Superman animated series. Prepare to be very disappointed.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:44 a.m. CST

    wcolbert. Nice book you posted this morning.

    by adeceasedfan

    I agree with a lot of your points. I'm ready for a new spin on Superman too. Bring on that trailer. Don't suck...erpunch.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:45 a.m. CST

    BTW, saw the MOS footage and its forgettable and unexciting!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    THE AVENGERS footage from Comic-Con easily kicked its ass!

  • July 15, 2012, 8:51 a.m. CST


    by cock smoker

    I know you are too smart to be comparing hacks like Snyder and Abrams to icons like Scorcese and Hitchcock. Snyder and Abrams are one trick ponies with an eye for visuals but are tone deaf to everything else that matters in a movie.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:56 a.m. CST

    Doesn't matter

    by maelstrom_ZERO

    I know that Snyder's using Death/Return of Superman as a tonal reference. Doesn't matter. Those comics were awful to begin with, and shouldn't be used as any kind of reference at all. Picking one of the more notoriously bad Superman comics as any kind of reference at all is just not a good idea.

  • There is not always a burning need to redesign the wheel, or a fork. And changes in MOS have much to do with legal issues concerning rights to Superman as a character, not any need to make him "fresh" -- whatever that means.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:57 a.m. CST

    @ valenni

    by cock smoker

    If I put a retarded monkey and a bucket of shit in the oven at 400 degrees for two hours I'm pretty sure 99.9% of the time its going to come out tasting and smelling badly. In this instance Snyder is the retarded monkey and the story is the bucket of shit. I just saved you $12. Your welcome.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:03 a.m. CST

    John Williams at work

    by Mike Fornes

  • July 15, 2012, 9:14 a.m. CST

    Same as Batman Begins? In what respect?

    by Chain

    it's an origin story. but that's not exclusive to Begins it's darker ,more serious,more realistic in the way that the public at large would react to something so foreign and unknown. Not really exclusive to Begins. Oh I get it. Nolan is involved and it has a Hans Zimmer score.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:19 a.m. CST

    snyder has no visual sense or talent

    by nephilim138

    he thinks that by putting a bunch of shit on screen, full of movement and speed ramps that it will distract the audience from the lack of story and real direction.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:42 a.m. CST

    "Possibly" young Clark?

    by Fries Against

    Don't be stupid.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:44 a.m. CST

    Hans Zimmer isn't fucked here..

    by richievanderlow

    I don't agree. I think any composer who tried to replace the theme would be screwed, but I don't think that's going to be Zimmer's approach. I think the biggest hurdle is it could be too similar to the style of his compositions for Nolan's Batman films (not saying it will sound like those compositions, but a more ambient approach). But I think that the Nolan Batman approach is still a better route than trying to live up to Williams' theme.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:55 a.m. CST

    The [bootlegged] Trailer is here:

    by Bob Cryptonight

  • July 15, 2012, 10:07 a.m. CST

    Thanks bob cryptonight!

    by batzilla

    I love the music! I can't wait for this! I wonder if this is the same thing we'll see on the Dark Knight Thursday night? Hope so!

  • July 15, 2012, 10:08 a.m. CST

    no john williams is bad?

    by Bouncy X

    this isnt Superman 6, its a reboot so of course they werent gonna use that again, i mean really. its no different than Batman Begins not using elfmans score.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:09 a.m. CST

    Okay,here's a thought df

    by Cervantes

  • July 15, 2012, 10:10 a.m. CST

    casino royale kept judy dench as M.

    by Bouncy X

    so sure storyline wise it was a fresh start but using the actress who played the role in the previous 4 movies keeps some sort of a tie to the original franchise.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:13 a.m. CST

    Casino Royale actually didn't use the Bond theme

    by Bass Ackwards

    Other then playing it over the end credits. But that was because it was a movie about Bond becoming Bond, so they felt he hadnt earned the theme. But just thought I'd throw that out there.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:17 a.m. CST

    They need to KEEP THE JOHN WILLIAMS THEME, it's even

    by Stereotypical Evil Archer

  • July 15, 2012, 10:36 a.m. CST

    Maybe people should have supported Superman Returns...

    by Andrew Coleman

    The comments about this movie confuse me epically. Superman Returns did everything that people seem to be complaining about. They used the score, didn't reboot... Superman was very close to the Donner version... Wait but you all shitted on it. So of course they reboot it. The origin story was told on screen in what 78? Tweens and teens haven't seen that. The Spider-man reboot proved people don't give a shit about seeing the origin again. The complaint about SR was the lack of action... So they amped up the action and brought in Zod. I'm pumped for this movie. I think the hate is misplaced and most of the people bitching are full of shit. If you hate this to the point you're yelling off bull shit before a trailer even, you should have supported Returns, oh wait you hated on that too. So shut the fuck up.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:56 a.m. CST

    THE Theme

    by Sean

    I don't envy Nolan and Snyder having to make the call as to whether or not to include the Williams theme. I absolutely see wanting to make a clean break from the Donner films. BUT ... I agree with the poster above who says the Williams theme is as iconic as the S on his chest. At this point it's part of Superman lore. And it's the single greatest theme ever written. I just don't see how you get away from it. Maybe do what Star Trek did ... save it for the end credits so it feels like a great, earned crowd-pleasing moment.

  • Warner needs to stop choosing the wrong people to handle their Superman projects.

  • July 15, 2012, 11 a.m. CST

    Sorry guys, this isn't the decision of a lifetime.

    by Snookeroo

    It's not like you're planning your 401k, choosing a house or deciding which college to send the kids to. It's $8.50 and two hours of entertainment. Can't believe anyone would not see a movie simply because of a soundtrack, but hey - different strokes, I suppose. And this coming from a mega-Superman fan.

  • Try to beat the great depression and WWII. In fact, that's the point. Make the world around him dark, his villains, that's an excellent idea. Make Superman a beacon for hope, contrast him against his surroundings.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:08 a.m. CST

    I'm fine with change and I like Zimmer but...

    by alpeter3

    The argument that you have to change the music because it's a reboot is total bullshit. People have already mentioned these but I'll restate, Casino Royale was basically a reboot but they kept the Bond theme at the end, because that theme IS JAMES BOND. Just like the beginning "Iris" shot toward the camer was kept in there. Bond needs that theme, reboot or no. And the same goes for the Williams Superman theme. It IS the Superman theme. Now, that said, I like the idea of them waiting until the very end when he discovers who he truly has to be and flies off for them to play the Williams theme. Then they can incorporate that more in the sequels. I really do like Zimmer's music style. I've loved it ever since Crimson Tide. And I have no doubt that his take on Supes will be great. But Supes NEEDS his Williams theme no matter how dark you try to make him. If Nolan, Zimmer, Snyder are watching these boards (I know they aren't BTW), you guys still have plenty of time to incorporate the theme in the end. Please reconsider this move. Elfman's Batman theme was good, but it wasn't so engrained in the Batman mythos that it was needed for the reboot. But I believe William's Superman theme is more like the Bond theme than Elfman's Batman theme in that it's more a part of the character itself than any specific movie.

  • And Snyder mentioning Death of Superman as an inspiration, despite it obviously having nothing to do with what will happen in the film, has more to do with name recognition (for all it's faults, it's one of the most famous comic events ever), than anything else.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:16 a.m. CST


    by Bass Ackwards

    But so what if the theme is just given a nod in the end credits? What difference would that possibly make to the film's flow, tone, feel, etc. I mean at this point your not complaining that the film isn't using the theme, your just complaining that you really really want to hear it.

  • Progress!

  • I thought at first that read, "There really doesn’t seem to be a lot of trust in Superman the film" ^_^

  • July 15, 2012, 11:27 a.m. CST

    cromulent.....same here!

    by Righteous Brother

    Mind you, I think Quint's reporting recently has been pretty difficult to read. Drew McWeeny's coverage over at Hitfix has been much better, mind you he's a better writer than Quint anyway.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:27 a.m. CST

    No John Williams score, no Superman.

    by Franck

    (And I am a huge fan of Hans Zimmer)

  • July 15, 2012, 11:30 a.m. CST


    by Snookeroo

    I'm quite passionate about this character - I've been a huge fan all my life. I have a collection of Action comics going back to #26. I'm one of those that got really torqued because they ditched the red trunks. However, I'm going to see the movie regardless, because of my passion for the character. If I like it, I'll see it again and again; I saw STM 30 times in the theater. I saw Superman 3 once. See how that works? If the score is that big a thing, see something else instead. My point is I see an awful lot of comments on these boards from people mired in amber. It either has to be exactly like something they've experienced before, or nothing. I just don't get that.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:30 a.m. CST

    This looks like a Nolan movie

    by Volllllume3

    Joyless, cold and overexposed?

  • July 15, 2012, 11:33 a.m. CST

    No John Williams? No problem

    by thommcg

    Does anyone lament Danny Elfmans theme not being in Christopher Nolans Batman films? Nah, didn't think so.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:39 a.m. CST

    There is nothing wrong in rebooting and keeping The John Williams Music

    by SmokieGeezer

    Good luck to Hans Zimmer on creating an Iconic theme to match Williams.....

  • July 15, 2012, 11:50 a.m. CST

    by Johnboy40

    *Make Superman a beacon for hope, contrast him against his surroundings.* maybe thats exactly what he is at the end of the movie. But he still has to become that person. what on earth is wrong with them showing that journey? back to the theme, I'm fairly certain that not having Danny Elfman's theme didnt harm Nolan's batman movies. (although it helps that Zimmer's is better, imo) and it aint like Donners version was the first on screen superman is it, so it's noy like it is an intrinsic part of it. Its just the theme used during most of our lifetimes.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:51 a.m. CST

    I hope this movie is a huge hit.

    by Greggers

    I hope this movie comes to redefine Superman for a new generation of fans the way the movie in 1978 did. Donner's movie spoke to the times in which it was made; a film that perhaps was much of a departure from the 50s Superman tv show as Snyder's film will be from it. And classicists, don't worry -- passion and interest for the new versions will not replace the older versions, but indeed, keep the older versions alive. At least that's what I'm hoping because I NEED TO SELL THE HUNDREDS OF GODDAMNED VG/NM SUPERMAN COMICS! WE'RE TALKING 6 LONGBOXES OF BRONZE AGE/MODERN AGE AND I'M STUCK WITH THEM UNLESS I WANT TO TRADE THEM FOR DIMES ON THE DOLLAR UNTIL SOMETHING COMES ALONG, LIKE THIS MOVIE, TO BOOST INTEREST!!! ARGGH!!! So please, fellow nerds, please go easier on the new Superman movie for my sake. I'm asking nicely.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:52 a.m. CST

    taking someone elses music is theft. I'm glad he realizes that.

    by Raptor Jesus

    I wish the director of 'The Artist' was that smart.

  • July 15, 2012, 12:32 p.m. CST

    10 second clip of Superman from the comic con footage

    by Asua

    Can see it here:

  • Zimmer will produce music that is rousing but it just won't be a Superman score. I'm sure it could be used generically in almost any action movie in a cookie cutter type way. I bet Synder thinks that if he doesn't use the John Williams music that sets his movie apart from the others. That means he's missed the point. If Jesus had a theme tune no body would DARE re write it.

  • July 15, 2012, 12:38 p.m. CST

    No red shorts, no ticket money from me...

    by yeah i'm a jerk!

    The costume still looks like dogshit!

  • July 15, 2012, 12:38 p.m. CST

    John Williams theme is in Returns because it was a SEQUEL!!!

    by Cade

    What about that do you people not understand? OF COURSE his theme isn't in this movie. Its not like James Bond. Bond's theme was around since the first film. There's plenty of superman before Donner and crew came along. OF COURSE Supes' origins are explained in this film. It's a COMPLETE REBOOT! If you want Donner and Reeve and Williams, WATCH THOSE MOVIES!!! Why do fanboys have to judge movies before they come out Every. Single. Time? You know what? Just don't see it. It will make loads of money without you... Wait... What am I saying? You'll still go see it a dozen times and buy the blu-ray and watch it hundreds more, and secretly love it but tell everyone how much you hate it. That'll never change. So sad.

  • The real question is, which movie will be better? With a black Perry White, a redhead Lois, and a "Nolan-listic" Superman, I'm thinking SR will edge out MOS.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:05 p.m. CST


    by SlappyBones

  • July 15, 2012, 1:08 p.m. CST

    Superman's sex life...

    by SlappyBones

    Sorry for previous append, hit the Enter key by mistake. Larry Niven's article, "Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex", sums up all we need to know about Superman's sex life. And you thought yours was bad!

  • This will be just as bad as Superman Returns but for different reasons.

  • I always find it fascinating how so many people wrongfully think a Director is responsible for the entire output of a film. Geez, no wonder no one ever remembers writers. Let's remind everyone....if the script sucks no director in the world will ever save it. Sadly for Man of Steel it has Goyer involved. The only bright light is that Christopher Nolan also wrote it with him...these two wrote all 3 Batmans...part 3 also including Chris's brother Jonathan. Goyer on his own sucks. So on paper Man of Steel seems quite promising.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:30 p.m. CST

    I think The Avengers proved audiences wants excitement...

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    good dialouge thats not OOC for their "heroes or villians", and color! Nobody wants a dull, boring Supes looking for his true identity. WTF, this is a Discovery Channel special! Just gives Supes a decent villian, have him save lives, toss shit, catch heavy object, and fly! Really its not that hard.

  • I was disappointed by the absence of the '60s TV Batman theme in Burton's Batman films. It's fucking iconic. I'm not entirely sure if I'm kidding.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:35 p.m. CST

    The Matrix films and Hancock had better Supermen than

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    Superman in his own films! And this Nolan-reality MOS looks to make a worse impression than SR. DC/Warner doesn't get it. This is why MOS is going to fail. Warners is smart in one regard...... The Hobbit!

  • July 15, 2012, 1:40 p.m. CST

    according to sources. snyder didnt talk to geoff johns

    by walt

    johns is supposed to be the feige of the dcu very simply....the wb is still fucked, when it comes to jlu they need to dump the cape

  • I for one am really looking forward to this movie. Why should we want for DC movies to just be like Marvel movies. If you want your comic book movies light, Marvel has you covered. A few different flavors are a good thing for the genre.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:53 p.m. CST

    I see the Batman backlash has started early

    by barnaby jones

    good times. You fucking douche bags.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:57 p.m. CST

    Looking good so far.

    by Yelsaeb

    Nolan is one of those dude's that I trust completely, so if he's behind the movie, I'm behind it.

  • July 15, 2012, 1:59 p.m. CST

    Superheroes are relatable???????

    by donxavier

    It always cracks me up when people want superheroes that are relatable. How the hell can you relate to beings that fly through the cosmos on surfboards or shoot laser from their eyes or can bench press an ocean liner?

  • And let's get one thing straight first, Nolan's Batman films aren't Nolanified, Nolan just brought the character back to what Batman had always been, a regular person fighting crime with high tech gadgets, martial arts, and investigative crime techniques. Batman is not a superhero, he has no super powers. What Nolan did with Batman was nothing original. He just brought the character back to what he has always been in the comics. To Superman, seriously people are bitching about an origin story. Richard Donner's Superman came out in 1978. Once this new one comes out in 2013, it will have been 35 years since a Superman origin story has been told in a movie. Part of the problem with Superman Returns was that it tied itself too much to Richard Donner's Superman. That's why it has become a highly forgettable film. As much as I like Richard Donner's Superman, there are things that don't work in that movie or things that just belonged in that time period of the late 70's which just doesn't translate to today. I mean they made Lois Lane out to be an airhead, with that god awful scene where she couldn't spell out a common word. And Lex Luthor was a dufus criminal who only had 2 complete morons to help him in the crimes he chose to commit. Let's not forget Lex Luthor's plan was unfoiled by one of his moronic cohort's who took the Kryptonite off of Superman, which allowed Superman to save the day. And let's not forget Lex Luthor's big plan of buying up desert land, then setting off an earth quake to dump a part of California in the Ocean. Dumb plan right there, cause even if it worked out, nobody would be moving to a fucking sweltering desert. What made Richard Donner's Superman work was the origin story and Christopher Reeve's masterful performance as Superman. The two major flaws of how stupid they made the characters of Lois Lane and Lex Luthor, kept Richard Donner's film from being a perfect Superman film. And seriously some of these talkbackers are just moron's claiming it's going to be terrible before there has even been a trailer out. It would be different if there was a trailer out there like John Carter and The Amazing Spiderman, where you could just tell those movies lacked soul and basically showed their major flaws in the trailer. But unless you were at Comic Con, nobody has seen a thing from this movie.

  • No other comment.

  • July 15, 2012, 2:20 p.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    I think I'm ready for this. It's possible to do a "realistic" (lol) take on Superman without making him a boyscout who comes off as an anachronistic pussy, or a peeping-tom deadbeat dad. Superman has a clear idea of right and wrong. He will protect all life at all costs. He will act decisively. He can be all business at the drop of a hat, but is generally good-natured and even sensitive, with a warm sense of humor that occasionally dips into surprising sarcasm. You don't have to be a "boy scout" to reflect that, considering that's how Hollywood depicts heroes in general. Treat Superman the character the way you would a protagonist Marine or cop, with the comics legend propped up around it, and it will at least be faithful to the "man" himself. A faithful Golden Age Superman would be awesome onscreen. It would also bomb. I really hope this works and I think it can.

  • Also, Nolan isn't even a hands on producer for this.

  • July 15, 2012, 2:41 p.m. CST

    One tired reposting of an excerpt from Goyer's Superman script, coming up...

    by idonotseekabanning Good ol' Goyer. Good ol' Snyder.

  • July 15, 2012, 2:42 p.m. CST

    Best Supes Movie of the Year...

    by vnv01

    ..will end up being Superman vs. the Elite. The personification of why he does what he does told succinctly in 97 mins. Why is this so hard for Hollywood?

  • July 15, 2012, 3 p.m. CST

    My problem with the Casino Royale comparison..

    by richievanderlow

    The Bond franchise has established that it has this hazy continuity, where the character changes actors and time frames without really 'rebooting'. So the franchise has sort of 'earned' that they can play with changing actors in the main roles, without disrupting the overall continuity, but never addresses that bond has been in existence and hasn't aged in almost 50 years. It's just accepted by the audience. There are few entries that have direct repercussions across movies, and when it does it's pretty vague. Either way, there's a lot of standalone adventures that don't really seem to establish much of a coherent continuity. Some things, like the theme, have remained constant. Superman has had 5 films, all that seemed to be fairly closely related, and the audience really made a statement by the trashing of the Singer installment. A fresh start makes sense, but comparing this to a Bond movie that got around telling the origin story (and never had before) really doesn't seem like a great comparison.

  • July 15, 2012, 3 p.m. CST

    No Williams?! Bad start already...

    by MovieGeekBlog

    It would be like rebooting Indiana Jones, with a different score or having another Star Wars theme without the crawling titles and the iconic music at the front... or another Harry Potter without the Hedwig theme... Mr Snyder, you're in deep trouble now... Surely you can give a fresh look to a movie without fucking up what really worked the first time.... When they rebooted Bond, they didn't change the music!!

  • July 15, 2012, 3:04 p.m. CST


    by Johnboy40

    Surely that's a spoof, a fake. the article seems to says. its called *what if* Do we really think a website would have a copy of the script with Nolan's and Snyder's hand written notes on it?

  • July 15, 2012, 3:10 p.m. CST


    by idonotseekabanning

    I feel sorry for anybody who reads that and thinks it's real. That said, thanks for making absolutely certain no one else will bother to read it. I posted it specifically so no one would bother to read it.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:12 p.m. CST

    sorry dude

    by Johnboy40

    but in my relatively short time posting on here, Ive realised there are some strange people..and I could see some believing its genuine.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:14 p.m. CST

    Geeze some of you people

    by Mike

    I'm so fucking sick of everyone on this site whining about how they don't want another origin story. One guy made an argument to support this point by referencing the new spiderman. That's a terrible, terrible argument because there hasn't been much time at all between the last spiderman and the new one....why is it so hard to understand that the last superman origin was in 19seventyfuckingeight... and all you fanboys already got what you're clamoring for right now and it was a massive disappointment. But the real issue here is that NO--NOT EVERYONE KNOWS THE ORIGIN! One guy posted that his seven year old kid doesn't know anything about Superman, yet you all choose to ignore that simple fact because you're fucking selfish. Kids these days will simply not appreciate the Donner movies because they are extremely dated--maybe not to you guys, but these kids are growing up in a different era. Furthermore, the majority of these origin bashers act like they know the character so well when they're really just basing their opinions off of the film adaptations we have and the occasional fact they had to look up on wikipedia. Comic book fans know that there have been countless new origin stories... birthright was great but I think Geoff Johns topped it with 'Secret Origin' and then there was Earth One which was good for what it was because that's what it was intended to be... In fact, not a SINGLE one of you geniuses has even MENTIONED Earth One. I can completely understand if people didn't like the Earth One take on Superman because it did it's own thing. But if any of you were as knowledgeable about Superman as you claim or ignorantly believe to be, then you'd know that there should be a serious debate going on here about how this new Superman adaptation is sounding a hell of a lot like Earth One and how that scares them. But in order to have what should be a legitimate debate about that, you'd have to know what you're talking about. Instead, you're whining about how this will be all "dark" because that's "nolan's style" and that "it only works for the character of batman." NO IT DOESN'T. Again, if you guys knew what you were talking about, you'd be making your point--your SAME EXACT POINT--by referencing Earth One and how THAT adaptation of Superman sucked because it was too dark. If you all didn't think you know so much better than the general moviegoing public and what they want to see, this rant would be unnecessary, but you all think you know so much that I had to post this because the same exact ignorant comments are being made over and over in every talkback since stories about this movie started coming out. The one thing I want to mention again that might get lost in this rant is something that sounds corny but it's not: THINK OF THE KIDS. This whole 'Everyone knows the story already so don't do an origin' argument is just flat-out wrong... there is ZERO truth to that. But you all live in this little bubble called '' where all these geeks who give comic book fans a bad name whine on and on about everything they have the chance to whine about because that's accepted here... people say things in this bubble that would get your asses kicked in real life... I still fail to see what throwing around the words 'cunt' and 'faggot' or making jokes about Jerry Sandusky's genuinely evil atrocities is so appealing to you idiots. Please, try making a joke at a bar about how Snyder deserves to be locked up in a cell with Sandusky and see what happens, because so many of you are so out of touch with the real world that you need to come here where you can convince yourself that you entitled geeks know better than the average moviegoer because nobody in the real world gives a shit about your opinions

  • July 15, 2012, 3:16 p.m. CST

    People need to get over the John Williams theme.

    by Matt

    Yes, I know that music is great but they want to get away from those old movies. Which, by the way, are fucking terrible.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:18 p.m. CST


    by superman76

    Well freaking said! I am uber excited for this new, fresh origin on my favorite superhero. EVERYTHING I have seen so far has me believing that this will be the Superman that will take the character where he needs to go and blow the movies made THIRTY years ago out of the water.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Well said hercvault

    by Matt

  • July 15, 2012, 3:27 p.m. CST

    zack snyders remake of Dawn of the Dead was excellent.

    by UsultheMahdi

    One misfire and people are ready to hang him. Jeez...

  • July 15, 2012, 3:34 p.m. CST

    Superman shaving

    by Transhuman

    I believe he would use either his heat vision, or he could just pluck that shit out.

  • the backlash was legendary, once it sunk in how very wrong that movie truly was. Most of us really want a great, contemporary take on Superman. I don't think MOS is it.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:47 p.m. CST

    @rupee88... Uhhh...

    by Cade

    Joss Whedon had FIVE movies come before the Avengers that set the characters up.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:51 p.m. CST

    enough with the John Williams theme already!

    by chien_sale

    These are new movies! a new mythos. we're not in 1978 anymore.

  • July 15, 2012, 3:54 p.m. CST

    Needs Williams Theme

    by Pipple

    Does anyone here recall the batman theme from nolan's movies? *crickets chirp* I thought so... ugh...

  • July 15, 2012, 3:59 p.m. CST


    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 3:59 p.m. CST


    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 4 p.m. CST


    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 4 p.m. CST


    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 4:01 p.m. CST

    The casting

    by Paul Paradis

    Sucks balls. Couldn't they find a better Superman, and Michael Shannon IMO is the worst choice ever for Zod.

  • July 15, 2012, 4:03 p.m. CST

    Sorry to yell, but it's NOT THE SAME AS BOND.

    by Cade

    Bond is a whole continuing series, regardless of the fact that it seems to reboot with every new lead actor. It's a strange kind of exception to the rule. Like each Bond kinda stands on its own, and kinda starts all over at the same time.

  • July 15, 2012, 4:05 p.m. CST

    PLUS the Bond theme as been the same FROM THE BEGINNING.

    by Cade

    Nobody got mad when John Williams theme was different that George Reeves' superman...

  • July 15, 2012, 4:15 p.m. CST


    by lead_sharp

    I really agree with the sentiment of mysterious_volvo with a caveat. There may well be a lot of 'iconic' Superman moments in this, cool flying 'crushing safe doors' (?) but there were a lot of 'iconic' moments in Superman Returns as well (eye bouncing bullets, lifting cars ala Action Comics #1, catching the plane, flying above the clouds, floating in orbit and so on) but as much as I liked it, it wasn't a very good Superman movie. It's strengths outplay it's flaws for me and I can really enjoy it but to say it was the Superman movie I (and I'm guessing a lot of people none comic reading as well) wanted is just silly, as reflected by its performance and reception. This is just going to be the same again, Snyder's films are ALWAYS like that, good things buried in mediocre or really bad things. The best film he's ever made was that owl cgi flick that name escapes me.

  • July 15, 2012, 4:16 p.m. CST

    @chien_sale... AMEN!!!

    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 4:20 p.m. CST

    Lots of whiney fucks on here

    by D.Vader

    -- "No John Williams score?!? HOW DARE HE!!!" First off, if that's your attitude, fuck off. I hope you didn't like any of Nolan's Bat-flicks simply bc he didn't use Danny Elfman's iconic theme. --"Not using even a tiny bit of John Williams' music, just a tip of the hat over the end credits, say, is pure arrogance" Absolutely wrong. Such an arrogant statement. -- "Wrong tone, wrong actor, wrong director and another stupid origin story. How do they fuck up Supes on two different projects 7 years apart. Totally depressing news." You haven't seen anything. You're an idiot. -- "Yes this is a rehash of Batman Begins which is even worse They can't even come up with an original take on the character and sounds like Nolan is doing the EXACT same thing with Supes as with Bats...just lame." Uhhh, that's just flat out wrong. This is nothing like Batman Begins, as Batman pretty much figured out his place in the world pretty quickly. He wasn't someone stressing about his purpose in the world and what to do with all of his power like it sounds Superman is doing.

  • July 15, 2012, 4:21 p.m. CST

    In other words, GET OVER IT

    by D.Vader

    If Snyder chose to use the John Williams theme, you fucks would hurly insults at him and accuse him of being unable to make a good story strong enough to draw the audience in, so he had to resort to using nostalgia (through the iconic music) to get you guys to like the movie. Don't argue this point. This is *exactly* what you creeps would say.

  • I have to imagine you guys have zero friends in the real world, bc I don't understand how anyone could want to be around someone who complains about the most mundane stuff like this.

  • July 15, 2012, 4:24 p.m. CST

    You nerds are ALL wrong...the John Williams' theme:

    by Bob Cryptonight

    ....that theme is awesome, I love it, BUT: it puts a very HEAVY yoke around any NEW movie. INDIANA JONES, JAMES BOND, STAR WARS...those movies rely on--DEPEND on--everything staying the same...tone [even Bond retains the same general tone despite the different versions---license to kill, angst and violence, cool devices]...effects...production design..etc. How the hell can you make a new, STAND-ALONE movie if you saddle it with the Williams' theme??? Let someone NEW give it a try. I mean, if you guys had your way, THE BEATLES would have been the BE-ALL and END-ALL of all music! WTF? Christ, let someone else give an interpretation (IMPORTANT NOTE: the comics have functioned this way for DECADES...; DC and MARVEL completely COUNT on different versions appealing to different cultures and eras. In the end it is all about MONEY for the corporations that own these properties...but so what if they want to fuck with the canon?...).

  • July 15, 2012, 4:28 p.m. CST

    Stop. Defending. Shit. Films. you're as bad as the 'whiners'.

    by Farrokh

  • July 15, 2012, 4:39 p.m. CST

    Benedict Cumberbatch for Lex Luthor?

    by Transhuman

    Or maybe Matt Damon?

  • His line about the Williams theme is BS, as a result.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:01 p.m. CST

    I don't have very high hopes for this

    by SteveGoBoom

    Snyder isn't a capable director, he just has an eye for visual flair. Maybe he should be a cinematographer.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:03 p.m. CST

    Re: Kevred - Who ever said General Zod was the main villain?

    by brocknroll

    At SDCC Zack continues to refuse to say whether or not Michael Shannon is actually Zod. Maybe we're in for a big surprise?

  • July 15, 2012, 5:07 p.m. CST

    Hah, thanks pubieforest

    by D.Vader

    It's what I do! Funny name by the way.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:10 p.m. CST

    Kevred, that's not really comparable.

    by D.Vader

    Choosing to not use iconic and nostalgic music from another adaptation of a comic book character but using the same characters from that comic is not quite the same thing. Your argument might as well say "If he wanted to be different than Donner, then why even have Lois Lane?!?"

  • July 15, 2012, 5:23 p.m. CST

    Michael Shannon had no problem talking about being Zod on NPR's Fresh Air

    by iamnicksaicnsn

    So I have no idea why they aren't just talking about the fact that he's Zod.

  • Like other's have said, Superman Returns had the Williams Theme, the Donner love, and it turned out like shit. And if DC never ever allowed a reboot of Superman's story since "everyone should know it already" we wouldn't have had Birthright, which was an amazing Supes story. Is it too soon? Maybe, but considering just how bad Returns was, it's time to try something new.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:27 p.m. CST

    Micheal Shannon discussing Zod in interviews...

    by brocknroll

    I do realize that Shannon has been talking about Zod in interviews quite a lot, but maybe it's a cover up and he's actually playing a different character? Shannon refuses to go into details and he's secretive on a lot of stuff too. After all Micheal was wearing a motion capture suit on the set. Maybe he's actually Brainiac instead?

  • July 15, 2012, 5:30 p.m. CST

    Snyder is...

    by NeverTalksBack

    A waaaay better director than most of you idiots give him credit for. Love the visuals he comes up with. Just because you don't like his style, or most of his movies doesn't mean he's a shitty director. Could just mean most of you are whiny, shitty movie goers, just a thought.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:31 p.m. CST

    shaving, and, the last movie

    by bongo dummy

    Superman uses a piece of his baby rocket as a mirror to shave with? Instead of using a piece of the baby rocket to make a shaver? I think Superman should be able to comprehend and even master a straight edge razor. --- on this movie, smells like smallville. --- on the previous movie: let's see: Superman gets beat up by Lex Luthor on a Kryptonite island where he falls off a Kryptonite cliff into the ocean where he is rescued by the step-father of Superman's bastard child. Then, Superman is medivac'd to the hospital where he stays for a few days. What was that crap? That could have been any lame superhero but they made it Superman. Think of all the freaking things (THINGS!!!!) that could have tried (TRIED!!!!) to kick Superman's ass. And, a schmaltzy actor playing a conniving (not smart, CONNIVING) Lex Luthor, wearing a suit, beats the crap out of a guy who began the movie by taking a nap in outer space. What the fuck? --- That footage this article describes better only be available on the DVD/bluray release. Keep that crap out of the feature. Just stick it on the extras disc.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:39 p.m. CST


    by bongo dummy

    The thing is the origin. should. not. freaking.matter. at. all. It doesn't matter how some dude with god-like powers exists. The mother fucker just does. When you were a kid, did you really need to know any backstory on anything you read or saw. If you saw mother fucking Huck Finn floating on a mother fucking raft with mother fucking John Shaft, you would not ask how they got there, you would just want to mother fucking know where that shit is going. Same with Superman. When it comes down to any story with Superman, just mother fucking get on with it. Don't waste people's mother fucking time with his dead parents or some mother fucking made up 'burden' the mother fucker has on his mother fucking shoulders.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:43 p.m. CST

    Simply Put

    by bongo dummy

    All that Any and Every Superman Story Needs is The Answer to This Question: What the fuck made Clark Kent skip work today? That's it. Any writer who worked on Superman from the late 30s up until the late 70s seemed to get that was all you needed to tell a Superman story.

  • July 15, 2012, 5:49 p.m. CST

    this bound to generate some hate, but

    by jon pertwee

    i really thought the reeve superman's were awful. in fact, the best adaptation of superman has been the animated series. a cg animated superman would work much better than live action. and i too am sick of every superhero movie, even the reboots, throwing in an origin story that takes up the first quarter of the movie.

  • lol wut

  • July 15, 2012, 5:57 p.m. CST

    jon pertwee

    by bongo dummy

    -i really thought the reeve superman's were awful. - they weren't awful. they just aren't as great as people make them out to be. Are they worth watching? If there's absolutely nothing better to do, sure. People should watch them just once. Just like those Star Trek movies. Whether or not they are good or bad ones, you know when they really trying to just make another movie. For no other reason, it is like they just wanted to make another movie featuring the same characters. Long Live the Franchise! But, watching 'em once hasn't killed anyone...yet.

  • July 15, 2012, 6 p.m. CST

    I'm intrigued and looking forward to this.

    by Pat

    Of course Quint has to give his reservations. It's Superman for the 21st century. Enjoy the ride.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:04 p.m. CST

    The out of focus iPhone version of this trailer has me excited!

    by YackBacker

    Excited to get 7 dark & stormies and pop a few valium. Do people still take valium nowadays? Man, that stuff's as old as that John Williams SUPERMAN theme. Move on, kids. Move the fuck on. I'm happy we're cutting ties and moving towards new territory. I love Elfman's BATMAN theme more than anything in Hans Zimmer has done but Zimmer's music accomplishes something different, and something that matches the Nolan films. It's not about replacing what was previously done, it's about doing something distinctive.

  • Its a ridiculous notion. I guess I should be upset the Superman animated series from the 90s didn't use John Williams' music either. Those disrespectful heathens!

  • So I guess I shouldn't be too hard on them, *if* that is in fact what's going on. An "I'd LOVE to hear the Williams' theme somewhere in the new movie," rather than "NOT having the Williams' theme is stupid and disrespectful and this movie will suck!" I could understand that.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:15 p.m. CST

    I'm with Yackbacker. That tiny video looked great!

    by D.Vader

    Maybe it was the Thin Red Line music, but I thought the imagery and tone was spot on!

  • July 15, 2012, 6:21 p.m. CST


    by Mike

    The origin shouldn't matter? Why the hell not? You, like so many idiots here, think that if something doesn't matter to you, then it shouldn't matter to anyone. You know what matters? What a shocking amount of talkbackers don't get? ENTERTAINMENT Yet there are so many sad individuals here who can't grasp the concept of escapism and just having fun watching a movie. You want to know why I want an origin? Because I think it will ENTERTAIN ME. You want to know why I think it will entertain me? Because the launch of 'The Man of Steel' comic book origin story did. Then, years later, Birthright did. Then, years later, Geoff Johns' 'Secret Origin' did. Then, a couple years later, Superman Earth One did. All those stories were worth telling, and here you are on your high horse thinking origin stories don't matter, yet they keep making them in the comics and, you know what? They're great. If your premise that origin stories don't matter is true, then explain to me how each of the Superman origin stories from the comics don't end up identical to each other. You're just another talkbacker who doesn't understand that the Superman origin story has constantly, and will continue to, be approached from different angles that make the origin story worth telling.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:36 p.m. CST

    also bongodummy

    by Mike

    and yes, bongodummy, I do understand the concept of in media res. But the point you're totally missing is that, yes, when you start a story in the middle of things... with a dramatic situation that propels the rest of the story, you can potentially hook the reader or moviegoer and they go along for the ride. HOWEVER, almost all of the time, what makes a great opening and gets the reader or moviegoer committed to the rest of the story, they have questions that they want answered. You're not suggesting just starting in the middle of things--your suggesting that the kids should somehow accept Superman and not wonder 'hey, where did this guy come from and why does he have these powers' You'd be telling those kids to appreciate the story and not ask any of the questions central to the understanding of superman/clark kent/where he came from and why he is like he is. Even the kids who aren't the sharpest kids in the world would leave the movie wondering who the hell this guy in blue is and why they should care about him because the origin gives the moviegoer a reason to care about the main character and even relate to that main character. There are things about Clark Kents earlier life that all kids go through to varying degrees. People want to relate to their heroes--not just watch them beat up bad guys. They want to know WHY he chooses to follow his moral compass and what made him the hero he is today.

  • Then they've found a "realistic" way to homage Superboy. Interesting, I'm actually intrigued now.

  • July 15, 2012, 6:57 p.m. CST

    Superman Theme at Legoland...

    by GeorgieBoy

    During the Fire Safety show, one of the characters hangs from the fire engine's ladder and the Williams Superman theme plays. And yes, the entire crowd *CHEERS* enthusiastically every time. It's a mistake to ignore the music completely. Shoot, even J.J. Trek paid homage to the original Star Trek theme. Something's cannot be separated from the material.

  • ...and the cocky attitude of the directors who make them. It's understandable if you love something it's going to hurt if some guy comes along and says basically "Go back to sleep gramps! This movie ain't for you." Plus, heathen is actually a pretty good term to use for Zack Snyder, a mouth-breather if ever I saw one. God knows why Nolan picked him over someone like Duncan Jones, who was also up for the gig. I don't see what's so bad about directors respecting each other and paying homage while doing their own thing. Jones, for example, cast Scott Bakula as the voice of Gyllenhaal's dad as a cute nod to the concept of Source Code being so close to Quantum Leap. But Snyder and Nolan... bah... I don't know, kids these days. Get off my lawn!

  • July 15, 2012, 7:04 p.m. CST

    Star Trek is not a good comparison, georgieboy

    by D.Vader

    Star Trek was a movie based on the tv show of the same name- it makes sense to use the same theme somewhere. The Superman comics that Man of Steel is based upon, however, does not have theme music attached to it. Therefore, the two are not permanently connected and it makes perfect sense to not use Williams' theme.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:09 p.m. CST

    *an, not and

    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 7:11 p.m. CST

    I bet the next Batman "reboot"...

    by MCVamp

    ...homages the TV theme song. Hey, if a kid is running around in his back yard with a red cape around his neck, don't we assume he's playing "Superman"? What the hell would young Clark Kent be playing?

  • July 15, 2012, 7:16 p.m. CST

    Reginald VelJohnson as Superman..........

    by sullafelix

    would have been a perfect casting choice. Seriously, Donner's Supes 1 was really good, especially the first half. And of course Reeve owned that part. I thought Supes Returns was better than a lot of folks seem to think here. I liked hearing the theme and 'flying' credits. Could have used more kinetic action, true. And Spacey as Lex was miscast. Routh was fine, in my view. I think Snyder will put his mark on this one, for sure. Looking forward to it. Superman is considered by many to be a sort of 'King of the Superheroes', and DC flagship. I don't think they will risk putting out a bad film. They'd probably burn it and start again.

  • That's just how it is. Just sayin'. Strange how some fans will just swallow the party line that directors/producers feed them, that a new story and a fresh start means you can't keep ANY element at all. Very unimaginative, but hey, to each their own.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:25 p.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    If DC was balls-out serious about "world building" (bleh) it'd be the Crimson Avenger.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:31 p.m. CST

    pubie, it's perfectly valid to compare with Bond

    by M. David

    There was a TV adaptation of Bond before the Eon features, but it's the feature film version and its music that people remember. The theme from Superman The Movie is what people have associated with Supes for thirty-plus years. It's the definitive Superman music.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:40 p.m. CST

    Anyone complaining about having no John Williams theme in this movie is an idiot

    by Turd_Is_Floating_Underneath_The_Gravy

    Yes, it was a great theme. So what? This is a new version of Superman. Why would you want any hold-overs at all from the previous films? That's the kind of nonsense that crippled Superman Returns. All that movie was was a big masturbatory love letter to the Donner films, so no matter how good it could have ended up being (and it wasn't very good at all, anyway), if you didn't like the Donner films' approach (and I never much cared for it) then you weren't going to like SR. Some so-called geeks just want to wallow in endless nostalgia through movies and use them as tools to try and relive their childhoods, when things were better, instead of facing their current miserable and pathetic adult existences. We've seen this played out ad nauseam with the reaction to Star Wars over the last fifteen years. Some of the rest of us, on the other hand, actually care more about filmmaking, storytelling, and re-interpreting an iconic and culturally relevant character (which Superman most certainly is). Use of past elements - all past elements - is an impediment to this.

  • Only joking. The idea that it's an indisputable fact that retaining any element from a previous adaptation is an impediment to a successful reinterpretation seems rather hard-line, though. It's subjective opinion, not fact, and depends upon the quality of the film and the talent of those making it. If, for instance, Superman Returns had a good story and tonnes of action, no one would be claiming that using pre-existing music was a problem. The problem with Superman Returns was that it wasn't very good. I think the fact that this is the one element people are arguing about so passionately means a great deal, and has little to do with nostalgia. I wasn't born when the movies came out, for example, but that's one of my favourite scores and it's aged far better than the movie it graces. It's timeless. But regardless, they're going to do what they want, which is their privilege. As long as it's a good film these quibbles don't really matter. I'm pretty certain I won't humming anything Zimmer writes in the shower, though.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:56 p.m. CST

    hercvault_double_exclamation_point-- if it is good

    by bongo dummy

    If the story is good, it can carry the weight without needing to add an extra ton of backstory. Do you think people need to know the origins of James Bond or even James Brown to enjoy the exciting adventures they could have? No. They don't need to know that. It doesn' t matter at all. As for some of the more recent origins stories in the comics: Sure, yeah, there's tons of ways the origin has been retold. Obviously, there's plenty more where that came from just like there were plenty of wacky variations of stories Superman starred in before the need to constantly reinvent the mother fucker became one of the only ways to tell Superman stories. Enough already. It wouldn't matter if aspects of the character's life or origins changed from what ever is considered the latest story bible. If the changes make a good story, sure, surprise everybody. Give Superman a utility jock strap for all I care. Have him use a hidden pocket in his cape to keep his iPhone for all I care. If he wants a box of Kleenex that dispenses at the top of his S symbol, fine. If they want to have become the sole survivor of Krypton with no Phantom Zone, cool. Move on. But, as long as the key story elements are there, it will be fine. Alien. Reporter. Clark Kent. Fighting Crime and not paying attention to the time. A villain who can go toe-to-toe or head-to-head with him. Juggling the double lives. Knowing where the hell he lives and what other superheros are in his world. Being this close to omni-everything (but maybe a vegetarian). It isn't the most difficult formula in the world. But, for the love of God, don't feel the need to show us your work in getting from point A to the mother fucking story.

  • July 15, 2012, 7:58 p.m. CST

    ... And I wouldn't call you an idiot!

    by Cade

  • July 15, 2012, 8:01 p.m. CST

    Michael Shannon

    by Matthew

    he is great on Boardwalk Empire, movie should be worth watching for him alone

  • July 15, 2012, 8:02 p.m. CST

    the problem with the way you are looking at it

    by bongo dummy

    hercvault_double_exclamation_point Is that you think that without the origin there is no mother fucking story. Think about that for a while. Then think about the 100 plus years of recorded and filmed and printed serialized stories people are just accustomed to either liking or not. Getting into them or not. Grooving pretty hard or finding something else to groove pretty hard on. There's too much shit out there from the past one hundred years alone to waste time retreading old ground. Too many options that have been explored. And, you are insisting that they show how they try to reinvent the mother fucking wheel. Ooh. Sounds interesting, using a chisel to chip away instead of another rock?

  • Lois & Clark (ugh) and Smallville. They used Williams' score in Smallville occasionally, and cast actors who'd appeared in the film series in recurring roles, despite the series having no connection with any previous version. It's just a nice thing to do, you know? I really don't see the harm in it. But regardless, I will definitely be watching the new movie and giving it a chance.

  • The John Williams score is one thing I don't mind them changing, as long as they give Superman a heroic theme, not just some BWRRAAANNNNNG, BWRRRAAANNG horns and call it a day.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:11 p.m. CST

    The Loooooooone Ranger!!!!

    by bongo dummy

    I impatiently await the back story on the Lone Ranger. When he was a wee lad, was he afraid of the dark in the Old West? They didn't have nightlights back then. So did he parents give him a mask and convince him that the boogey man wouldn't see him or recognize him if he wore that? Then did his parents get mugged while they took their little ranger to the burlesque show for a well-deserved night out? Were they mugged by a native American who said, I want more than the beads, Kemo-sapiens!? How about that string of pearls, too? Then did he hate the indiginous peoples only to realize they aren't all that bad after all they adopted him as one of their own and told him cool stories to lull him to sleep and during the days taught him how to win gun fights? Did he spend years learning how to ride his horse only to find one that was magical. The only way to tame that horse was to shoot its wings off. Then that man would be able to ride it? So many mother fucking questions. And, I ain't even got to Tonto! Anticipation. Making me just not care.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:17 p.m. CST

    Bitch, Bitch Bitch...

    by Matt

    So much fucking whining over John Williams and Zack Snyder. First of all, Nolan is producing. This isn't going to be sucker punch. If you have seen any of the Comic-Con trailer you would realize this. Second, get the fuck over those old Superman movies because they were shit to begin with! People are always saying how amazing the original is and no one can ever surpass Donner's work. Bullshit. As long as this isn't a requel like Returns was, this movie will SHIT ON THE ORIGINAL!

  • July 15, 2012, 8:17 p.m. CST

    Superman Returns lacked the tone and feel of the original Superman

    by Supermans

    The sequel needed to be more like the original and it was anything but. This new one seems to be moving further away what made the magic of Reeve's portrayal work. Superman is fantasy, and grounding him in a realistic world with toned down powers isn't right. Superman's theme is iconic and the fact that it isn't used at all has completly turned me off from the film. Unfortunately I will go see it as I see every movie. I hope its good but I don't like what I'm hearing.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:33 p.m. CST

    lots of hateful buttholes here!

    by Manuel Lopez

    im sure it's been said before but damn this website is full of assholes who always hate everything and I mean everything, and worst part they know better than established movie directors, actors, writers and artists! John William's score is a classic but it's time to leave it in the past. From the description notes I read this film is looking epic already and mainly, it's different yet still Superman. I can't wait to see it!

  • July 15, 2012, 8:47 p.m. CST

    by Ken Barber

    With his heat vision and a mirror, if memory serves.

  • July 15, 2012, 8:48 p.m. CST

    you kids need to get laid

    by Pipple

    I do to, but daaaaamn if i havent seen all this same shit already 6 years ago. I wish someone told me to get off the computer and go get some bubbly latina ass cuz those are the best women... just sayin...

  • July 15, 2012, 8:58 p.m. CST

    ENOUGH with john williams theme already.

    by knowthyself

    Jesus CHrist move the fuck on. There's no written law that Superman must forever be a slave to that original theme. Batman got a new theme. Spiderman got a new theme. And Superman will get a new fucking theme. Having the god damn theme didn't make Superman Returns any better now did it? Let it the fuck go.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:01 p.m. CST

    superman TAS theme was amazing.

    by knowthyself

    Why is Williams score the only one that gets any credit?

  • July 15, 2012, 9:05 p.m. CST

    Lotsa bitching about John Williams here. Now it's my turn!

    by Lord Haw Haw

    I have no beef at all with the whole Snyder/Cavill/cutting ties/moving the fuck on philosophy at work here. However, the whole John Williams shitcanning has me a little concerned, because the "jewel in the DC crown" deserves a suitably heroic score, does he not? John Williams eats heroic score commissions for breakfast. I've probably said this before, but he's like the McCartney of film composers, and any smart songwriter knows that people like hooks. That, I believe, is John Williams's approach and the reason he's made a name for himself. It's pop songwriting mentality carried over to the big screen. The last original score that made any kind of impression on me was Giacchino's for Brewery Trek: heroic, melodic, a theme you could hum to yourself in an elevator. In other words, something like John Williams would write. The last one before that? "Memoirs of a Geisha", released in 2006, scored by you-know-who. Look, I'm rooting for Hans Zimmer to crank out a killer new Superman theme. It can be done. I mentioned Brewery Trek, and even the ST:TNG theme is a worthy addition to the Star Trek canon. But the odds are against him. Face it, folks: there are a LOT of utterly forgettable pieces of music cluttering up fims these days. Follow what works. "Beverly Hills Cop." "Chariots of Fire." "Miami Vice." "The Bodyguard." Meco made a disco song out of the "Star Wars" theme, for Christ's sake. The lessons are there. "Man of Steel" needs something as good as John Williams gave us. Period. Zach Snyder, fuck with the Superman theme at your peril. DC's watching. "Justice League" is waiting.

  • July 15, 2012, 9:11 p.m. CST

    Dave Letterman spoils ending for Dark Knight Rises...

    by Punisherthunder

  • July 15, 2012, 9:33 p.m. CST

    Howdy Digital Vader!

    by YackBacker

    You're a binary gent! You live in the machine! How you be?

  • Fucking morons on this site think they know everything. GOD, give it at least a trailer release before ripping on it! Fucking idiots are taking over this site!

  • July 15, 2012, 9:50 p.m. CST

    hercvault_double_exclamation_point AND d.vader

    by maxjohnson1971

    Bravo chaps. Good show!! Jolly good!! Jolly good show!!

  • And lots of people will probably pay $ to see it. And the score will win an Oscar. Well... that's if Trent Reznor or someone like that can keep the fuck away for a year.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:04 p.m. CST

    Batman got a new theme.

    by Chairman_Kaga


  • Every piece of news I read about this movie ramps up my excitement for it. Thank god they're not trying to please the fanboys (Aka the whining cunts on here) Superman Returns did exactly that and fell flat on it's face. But hey, at least the credits, Williams music and all, gave you all a massive nerd boner you wanted. It sounds like Snyders Supes isn't relying on your silly nostalgic feelings to make the movie. It's more interested in creating new feelings. I look forward to all the "No Williams theme = fail!" fuckheads to be posting how great they thought the movie was next year. It's not like you guys are ever wrong with your reactionary opinions... My dream would be that they create a trilogy that ends with All-star Superman. I want to see Supes fly into the sun and truly save the world one last time.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:08 p.m. CST

    Use of Williams score would make no sense

    by smudgewhat

    You defeat the purpose of a reboot by using old elements. Which is the same reason I'm not thrilled about Zod.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:09 p.m. CST

    Now that Breaking Bad is over...

    by maxjohnson1971

    All this complaining about not using the Williams score.... All of you complaining need to drop your pants and check for a vagina!! Yes, it's iconic. Yes, it is Superman's "theme". Yes, it will be missed. But you know what else will be missed? Christopher Reeve and Donner and everything else. LET IT GO for fucks sake!! Move on and get over it. This is a new movie that is going to attempt to make Superman relevant and cool again. And as previously noted, most people don't give two shits about the score. Yeah, most people are sheep, but that is besides the point. The music will not break or make the movie. Wait till you get to see the fucking thing before you start to shit all over it. Hey, what if Zimmer comes up with a fucking awesome score for the movie? Stop being such a bunch of fucking pessimists all the time and hope for the best. God damn!!

  • Did someone (Midian) REALLY just suggest that NOT using someone else's music was UNIMAGINATIVE? I'm dying laughing over here.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Bond comparisons don't work

    by D.Vader

    Sorry, but you guys have got to try harder.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:14 p.m. CST

    This movie has absolutely NOTHING to do with the previous films

    by D.Vader

    So it makes sense to NOT USE THE MUSIC FROM THE PREVIOUS FILMS. Get used to it.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:14 p.m. CST

    Midian, midian, midian...

    by D.Vader

    "I think the fact that this is the one element people are arguing about so passionately means a great deal, and has little to do with nostalgia." No. It has *everything* to do with nostalgia. This much is clear.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:17 p.m. CST

    Pissing off the fanboys makes for better films.

    by knowthyself

    Again, Superman Returns has the original theme and it sucked big giant donkey testicles. So fuck the fan service. The more you ignore them the better your movie will be.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:17 p.m. CST


    by D.Vader

    I be good! Just fighting the good fight. How you be?

  • July 15, 2012, 10:18 p.m. CST

    Thankee maxjohnson1971!

    by D.Vader

  • July 15, 2012, 10:45 p.m. CST

    Capt America could be "old fashioned"

    by BizarroJerry

    to borrow an expression from the movie. That film did well, and even a major point of the mega hit Avengers was that he was the straight-laced hero type. Superman doesn't need to be serious and soul-searching TOO much. I don't want him to be bland, but can we at least by the end of this movie have him be happy and confident as Superman? Hell, even Smallville, which often showed Clark struggling with becoming a hero, finding himself, etc, made a point of him being, yes, old fashioned. The "boy scout". Let Batman be dark and disturbed and let Spider-Man be unsure of himself.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:47 p.m. CST

    Midian, your earlier points...

    by D.Vader

    I think you are right that some of this frustration over Williams' theme not being used might come from this reboot fever that has swept Hollywood. I do get that some of these people might feel like "That thing I love, I'm being told, is NOT GOOD ENOUGH for the new movie. And that makes me angry." I get it. "I don't see what's so bad about directors respecting each other and paying homage while doing their own thing. Jones, for example, cast Scott Bakula as the voice of Gyllenhaal's dad as a cute nod to the concept of Source Code being so close to Quantum Leap." Thats cool! I haven't seen the movie, but that's a great little easter egg! As for directors paying homage, yeah its great when it happens! But it doesn't NEED to happen, and that's what I've been arguing against, the people who suggest this movie will suck bc the theme isn't there, or that Snyder is even being *disrespectful* (ridiculous) by not using it. Cute nods and whatnot are fun but not necessary. Using the theme is not necessary. If Zimmer wanted to throw a few strains in there during the credits as a nod, that's fine. But all it will do is remind people of those *other* movies, and that's not quite what the filmmakers want with this one. Because again, the Superman animated series was great and without a Williams' theme too. Its theme was pretty great too. I hope Zimmer comes up with something suitable for this new take on the character.

  • July 15, 2012, 10:54 p.m. CST

    I'm optimistic.

    by Justin Dunne

    It really makes no sense at all to use music from a different film.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:10 p.m. CST

    So, couple questions.....

    by SobchakSecurity

    Well, one was confirmed in the article, that it's of its own independent story/universe etc, and not that the Donner ones. Don't get me wrong, love the Donner ones, but it's been needed to be taken away from that and do something new with it, and that sounds like it has. But, I'm also mostly concerned with, is this another origin story did it seem?, or in terms of the origin aspects, is it more flashback material, and how much of it, if too much or not that much, the amount of time it is focused on or takes place within the story? I must say, this definitley reinvigorated my interest. I had been interested before, from when they announced it, hooray!, and then when basic story ideas/mechanics started to come out, a few yeesh and I don't know about that reactions, and now from this alone, makes me go, sounds VERY promising. And in relation to that, it sounds like the movie has a slightly more cynical tone from what we're used to seeing. The described distrust of him, the army guys having him surrounded with guns?!?!!?, would you describe the tone of what you saw as such? Kind of cynical etc?

  • July 15, 2012, 11:12 p.m. CST

    Oh, and while we're on it....

    by SobchakSecurity

    Williams's Superman score is one of his best and one of my favorites of his, but that theme is moreso associated with the Donner movies, and I think it's time to move away from that. I mean, really? If they were to stay in that universe/take on the character, it seems like it would just be desperatley trying to bank on a sense of nostalgia in some aspects. So, look forward to a new, hopefully classic/as memorable as Williams's score from Hans Zimmer.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:16 p.m. CST


    by maxjohnson1971

    welcome sai.

  • July 15, 2012, 11:31 p.m. CST

    Oh, and few more things.....

    by SobchakSecurity

    How much you want to bet the girl he locks eyes with in the school bus he saves is Lois Lane? I myself am not too crazed about the over-textured costume. The only character it looks good on is Batman. I'm not bitching, tad nitpicky, I just wasn't too crazy about it. I mean, why? The costume is simple enough as is. I'm not even all that bothered by the lack of red tights either. Oh, and how much if at all of the slo-mo seemed to be used? Again, something I just don't see as being necessary to the character. I generally don't mind it, I like Snyder, but he does overuse it. It seemed to work well in 300, I wasn't too crazy about watchmen and the overuse of slo-mo was one of the things that bugged me about it amongst others. If it's one or two scenes or sequences, fine, if it's every other scene used to enhance the action effects and impact, why? What do we need it for? And, I completely agree with what wcolbert said. People do need to chill the fuck out a bit and not so harshly pre-judge some of this as some have. I know I just pre-judged a few things myself, but I'm not on here ripping it a new one, saying it will suck, hoping it will fail either. Like I said before, I asbolutely love the Donner films. They still hold up and are done well. Esp the first one. But, so much has been done and can be done with the character it's time to see more of that done and put it into the cinematic take on the character. I mean, really? You'd want to see Superman 3 and 4, which I liked those actually, whole other issue, and yeah, the substanceless superman returns all over again? It's self a generic clone of the Donner films? Let's wait until we see the trailer(s) to give us a better idea of what this will be before we decide to rip it a new one. I don't think this will divide audiences that much though. Only those who unrealistically pedestalize the previous ones will do such. I think a majority of people out there, esp those who do love the Donner ones, can and will be able to appreciate this new take on it, while still retaining there love and appreciation for the older ones. I mean, why is everyone bashing this if they are? I mean, we've had other re-do's of super hero movies, and were praised and well recieved for the most part. Why is Superman such a, or maybe too much a would be better, Sacred Cow?

  • IM so tired of those discussions like Goku is more powerful than superman, just cause we never see supes actually annihilating with his super godlike powers i hated that in superman returns all he did was lifting heavy objects every time

  • July 16, 2012, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Honestly, KILL SUPERMAN! He's boring because he's invincible.

    by notcher

    But if you kill him, that would make for an emotionally charged fantastic film! Unfortunately it will never happen. And don't say "He's not invincible, kryptonite!" Yeah, he got fucking stabbed by that shit in the last film and Luthor broke it off in his body, thrown off a cliff, then he sank to practically the bottom of the fucking ocean and then lifted a continent up out of the water and threw it into space and still lived. My point is filmmakers treat him like he's invincible. I say kill him! Even if you find some way to bring him back in the next one, kill him for the time being! Come on, we can take it! However, if Batman dies in TDKR you pretty much can't then kill Superman too. We'll know more soon.

  • July 16, 2012, 1:22 a.m. CST

    I have faith in this movie.

    by rakesh patel

    nothing that has been said that makes this sound like its going to be crap. they know it needs to be right, that there's a lot riding on this as a franchise lynchpin and they know that superman is the jewel not of just dc but lets face it, superman is the ultimate comic book hero. i love the John Williams score as much as anyone else. its a fucking rousing theme but since it was used in superman returns, i totally get why its being cut from this movie. this movie is not like the others before it, it want to stand on its own two feet. I cant imaging anything else but the Williams score, but you know its needs something new, give it a chance. to those who say no williams score .. i m not watching the movie.. c'mon man.. really?!?!? you'll get over it. I like the way they are controlling this and drip feeding stuff, its a another fucking year to see this movie! Michael Shannon will kill as zod. They have a all star cast, an all star fucking cast for this one. this is by all means not an indication of how great its going to be, but c'mon peeps give it a fair shot.

  • July 16, 2012, 1:33 a.m. CST

    RE: Superman shaving

    by kdog69

    He uses his heat vision on himself in the mirror to shave. They showed him do it in an episode of Superman The Animated Series.

  • July 16, 2012, 1:48 a.m. CST

    Jesus, the texture won't even show up on screen.

    by Queefer Sutherland

    Fucking stupid whiners.

  • July 16, 2012, 2:51 a.m. CST

    Actually, Sucker Punch had ME jerking off.

    by Queefer Sutherland

    Right there in the theater, front row. Awful movie, but beautiful to look at and a ton of gorgeous girls wearing very little. Stupid or not, it wasn't a bad time at the movies if you had low expectations, and I did. Watchmen, on the other hand, was superb as far as I'm concerned. Doesn't matter what anybody else here thinks. Only my opinions matter.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:13 a.m. CST

    Superman is gay as shit

    by Balkin Flabgurter

    and this will be on par with that flop starring butt queen ryan reynolds.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:52 a.m. CST

    Does anyone remember the shit poured on whedon?

    by bohdi71

    Until he delivered the goods with avengers, wait until you see the movie before giving us your review of it people....

  • July 16, 2012, 6:04 a.m. CST

    WATCHMEN was lifeless

    by CuervoJones

    It was a screensaver.

  • Thanks for the cliche Capt. Obvious...

  • age I was when I first asked this question. No way you made it to adult-hood not knowing this.

  • July 16, 2012, 8:57 a.m. CST

    I'd like hear the theme mixed in there, but...

    by BizarroJerry

    I'm not going to decide whether I like the movie or not because of it. All Superman does not NEED that theme. I think an all new theme is fine, but you could toss in a little bit of it, kind of like how Bond movies use snippets of the original theme. Ya know, one little place to punctuate the action. But honestly, if you have decided you will hate this movie without the Williams theme, you are the worst type of geeky fanboy. The kind that aggravate filmmakers to the point where they want to dismiss any expectations from us geeky but slightly more mentally stable folks.

  • July 16, 2012, 10:06 a.m. CST

    I'm a musician and composer

    by Zappatude

    The truth is, John Williams' (whom I love) scifi/hero/fantasy music works for movies that are heavy-handed in the 1940's serial sense. Very 'marching-to-victory' and sing-songy, which works for movies that don't take themselves too seriously (Star Wars OT, Indiana Jones, even Jaws has a certain camp-reality). If you are a film-maker who wants a story to carry itself without needing the audience bludgeoned with how they should feel by the music, the classic Williams approach is not going to work. I hate going to a movie and being distracted by the music. Either because it's awful (such as the ridiculous choices made in the Iron Man movies), or because, while it may be beautiful MUSIC, it's setting too much of a tone for what's happening onscreen and not allowing my mind the freedom to interpret what I'm seeing, therefore allowing me to react naturally. The best SCORES for movies that are a little more reality-based/heightened reality that work for me are the ones I don't really notice for most of the movie, I just feel as part of the narrative subconsciously. I don't need a musical cue to give me orders on how to feel, nor do I want some annoying lyrics created by my brain while I'm trying to watch a movie ( "Super-Man! Su-oo-uper-Ma-han!" ). I think music in movies is great when it simply implies an atmosphere, be it subtle or raucously pulsating. Zimmer and his staff do a great job for Nolan's vibe, while Williams and Elfman were great for the Spielberg-Lucas-Donnor-Burton popcorn films. I love what Resnor and Ross have done with Fincher's movies. I'm looking forward to a Superman movie that isn't necessarily treated entirely as a popcorn movie nor a rehash of the entire Superman: The Movie plot/theme with an uncomfortable, unnecessary baby-daddy element thrown in. One other factoid: Williams' themes are based on prior works. Lucas gave him examples of historic classical pieces he wanted to infer for certain scenes in Star Wars. He used the theme for the '50s Superman tv show as a jumping-off point for the Donner stuff. This doesn't mean anything negative as much as perhaps shed some proper perspective on his process. Movie Music is something that is very delicate when it comes to doing it right. And when you are creating a new movie about a very old comic book character (as someone above pointed out: comics have no theme music accompanying them), of course you should have music that suits the new vision/tone being set by your presentation. I LOVED the first two Donner movies as a 7 year old kid, but I can't watch them now, lest they break down my warm memories with how badly they hold up over time.

  • Something about Superman I and II, especially the Metropolis stuff, just feels so cemented in a certain time that I absolutely love it.

  • Those are some good comics when you just want big dumb goofy stories about a big superpowered boy scout in red underpants who can fly. I think they really nailed the "boy scout" aspect of Superman in the Donner movies... this is what makes him a hero and a relatable character. You don't have to play up the fact that he's godlike and powerful... that's evident from his feats of godlike power. As a character and in his portrayal he should be clear-eyed and pure of heart.

  • July 16, 2012, 10:52 a.m. CST

    Nobody's perfect. Well, almost nobody...

    by Dan

    Some dumb shit being said up in here.... Reeve's Supes don't hold up? Awful? Fuck off with that- two of my favorite movies of all time and yes- still, they nail it. My 7 y/o nephew digs the shit out of them! As for Williams theme- let's try something new. Superman is not Bond, he doesn't need to be tied to one theme. Batman has different themes, let's see what Zimmer will do.... but since most scores are terrible these days- usually just excuses to fill noise, I have fears....

  • July 16, 2012, 10:54 a.m. CST

    And yes, please disregard the rabid fanboys...

    by Dan

    they turn everything they touch into Kryptonite, (Star Wars!) suck the joy out of every franchise they get near with their stupid nerd-stoliga and obsession with their lame childhoods. Snyder and company need to smack them down and ignore them for dear life.

  • July 16, 2012, 10:58 a.m. CST

    I would say Alan Silvestri would be a good choice....

    by Dan

    but Avengers was forgettable... blah...

  • July 16, 2012, 10:59 a.m. CST

    excuses to fill silence I mean.... errrr.

    by Dan

  • July 16, 2012, 11:02 a.m. CST

    @ autodidact - gets a square!

    by Dan

    Exactly... I love how the first film is three in one- big, broad 70's fantasy/ the home-spun warmth of Smallville and the fast-talking, go, go big city 70's with the His Girl Friday newspaper lingo... perfect!

  • July 16, 2012, 11:21 a.m. CST

    I'm glad Superman Returns exists.

    by knowthyself

    Because every time someone complains about the lack of Williams theme I can point to that awful mess and say, here ya go, that's where your precious nostalgic theme got you now shut the fuck up.

  • July 16, 2012, 11:23 a.m. CST

    Dinners films

    by richievanderlow

    The first two supes movies are very good, but I think they fall a touch short of being definitive. The essence is there, but the deviations arent really faithful to the character. Plenty of room for a new take on the origin. Reeves' Superman/Kent characterization is dead on though, and is certainly the gold standard. Any overall story improvements in Snyder's take have a good chance of being better, but Cavill's Superman does not appear to be better than Reeve's at this point. I'm open, but this appears to be a very different Superman in this one.

  • July 16, 2012, 11:53 a.m. CST

    I think Williams score should be used just once...

    by Dan

    A nice, simple trumpet note of the Krypton theme in the very begining would be sexy...that's it. If nothing is used, I'm not going to throw a baby fit and wish Synder dead.

  • July 16, 2012, 12:03 p.m. CST

    No Duh nuh nuh nuh nuh nuh nuh nuh...

    by bagwanbob


  • July 16, 2012, 1:03 p.m. CST

    Not having the John Williams Score can work...

    by tailhook

    but if you're going that way, you'd better bring it and simply an average big budget movie won't cut it. It needs to be significantly different from everything that came before and yet a well made, entertaining, film. Do that and you can seperate from the past. Do it not and the past will simply overwhelm the production.

  • July 16, 2012, 1:45 p.m. CST

    Again...did everyone forget SUPERMAN RETURNS?

    by knowthyself

    Go jerk off to that POS if you want your williams theme so bad. Jesus CHrist you fanboys are ridiculous.

  • July 16, 2012, 1:48 p.m. CST

    I am NOT sold on Russel Crowe.

    by DoctorWho?

  • fucking hilarious

  • The story, casting, visuals, are more important than the score. To me at least. That's where both these movies fail in one way or another.

  • July 16, 2012, 2:58 p.m. CST

    Be realistic about Zimmer and the theme

    by David_Denmans_Beard

    Zimmer will give it 5 minutes tops to work out a skeletal cue, then pass it through the Zimmer machine and after 12 different composers working under him flesh it out, you'll have it.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:17 p.m. CST

    @d.vader, I'm not buying your argument on 'cutting the cord'

    by kevred

    Zod isn't Lois Lane - he's one of a vast gallery of foes that Supes faces. Using him as the nemesis in Superman II was an arbitrary choice, and now this film just happens to choose the same villain that is the most recognizable of all villains from the Donner films? While also doing another origin story? That may be good or bad, but one thing it most definitely *isn't* is 'cutting the cord'. That makes Snyder's statement disingenuous. Unless there's something radically different that we're not being shown yet, I'd rather he just be honest and say something like, 'we're creating a love letter to what we all know and love about the classic Superman films and comics, while adding some modern touches that open doors to taking this in a new direction.' In the increasingly unlikely circumstance that this doesn't turn out to be Zod - despite even physically looking like Zod - then I will stand somewhat corrected.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:38 p.m. CST

    Fuck you, Snyder

    by TheFifthCylon

    "The footage didn’t feature John Williams’ iconic theme in any form and Snyder confirmed that it won’t appear in this film. He pretty much just said that he didn’t want to set up this whole new cinematic version, making it something separate from the previous films and then go and steal the score. " -- FUCK YOU, Snyder. You NEED that music.

  • I think you're being nitpicky on this point. Just because he goes with Zod as the villain doesn't mean he's trying to emulate Superman 2.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:39 p.m. CST

    @hank henshaw - Superman Returns was AWESOME

    by TheFifthCylon

    Superman Returns was one of the best superhero films of the past decade. Smart, well written and original. Snyder's looks like rehash.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:40 p.m. CST

    If Sucker Punch was SNyder jerking off on me....

    by TheFifthCylon

    ...than I welcome more of his seaman on my face, because Sucker Punch was awesome.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:40 p.m. CST


    by TheFifthCylon

    "Not having the John Williams Score can work..." --- No, it can't.

  • I'm calling it right now: Dave Chappelle for Gus Gorman.

  • July 16, 2012, 3:42 p.m. CST

    Who am I kidding? Man of Steel Rises villain will be Nuclear Man.

    by hank henshaw

  • July 16, 2012, 4 p.m. CST

    Fifth - do you like sailors?

    by MovieManStill

  • I threw up with the "people are afraid of you because you're different" or whatever the line was from the humorless, depressingly serious trailer. Bleeccch.

  • No one in their right mind would make a Superman movie like that, so, that's original.

  • July 16, 2012, 4:55 p.m. CST

    All that I hold dear...

    by animatronicmojo

    ...Really has nothing to do with Superman. Nor do I really much care for Zack Snyder, having only seen the technically impressive, but underwhelming Watchmen. However, I am still very interested in seeing this. <P> First, the origin story, last done on the big screen in '78, is a pretty dramatic tale- especially that beginning part with escaping the exploding alien world. All that can be done much better, especially with today's special effects and without Brando's ridiculous disco-wig. <P> Don't get me wrong, all four of the Christopher Reeve films hold up for me just fine as good, clean, campy corny-as-hell fun. The first one was the best, of course, but it's hardly a perfect movie- and the spinning the Earth backwards in time seems like a terrible happy ending cop-out to me. After doing that, they really painted themselves in a corner with the character. Sure, why not just do that every single time you don't like the outcome of an event, Super-Playing God-Man? <P> I have nothing really kind to say about Super-Man Reruns. In sum, after much moping around and spying on people, a very boring, stalkerish clone of Reeve's Supes gets stabbed by a very boring clone of Hackman's Luthor with that ol' devil Kryptonite, is beaten up homo-erotically and dumped in the ocean to die, but somehow rises up to lift a continent-sized chunk of Kryptonite off the planet and throw it into the sun, before crashing down, and then needing emergency surgery at the hospital. That's "intelligent writing?!" Uhhhooohh-kay. Even if they had made a good movie with SR, it just served to show how this vision of the character does not really work anymore, especially if you don't realize how campy it is. <P> So yeah, a misunderstood, angst-ridden- I am too powerful to exist among these fragile, half-insane humans- Superman, who is treated as what he is by TPTB, a freakishly powerful alien, makes sense to me. <P> You want to see some action and not just more heavy liftin'? Zod (aka a currently unnamed villain with powers comparable to Wonder Boy's) is going to be essential for that. And, I for one, look forward to the spectacle of a Dragonball-Z-style smack-down on the big screen. That, at least, Snyder seems capable of. So far, only about ten minutes at the end of The Matrix 3 and in the middle of The Avengers have even come close. <P> And for JW's iconic score: yeah, it's great, but also: a) not so dissimilar from the scores to Star Wars and Star Trek TNG, and, b) like those, so goddam "catchy" as to be hell-annoying, as in, I can't get it out of my head, even while thinking about it now!

  • July 16, 2012, 5:11 p.m. CST

    Sigh. The point about 'unimaginative'

    by M. David

    I knew as I typed that someone may throw that back in my face, but hoped that the main thrust of my point would be conveyed clearly enough to those intelligent enough to grasp it that it wouldn't be an issue. Sadly not. Obviously, to do something entirely new is more imaginative than rehashing what already exists - that's a given. That should extend to the whole film in that it ought to be a new story about a different chapter in the character's life rather than yet another take on the origin. But that's another argument entirely. My point was addressing the commonly held belief that every reboot can only work if you abandon everything from the past, whether it worked or not; that something 'new' is automatically better and more interesting than anything pre-existing just by it's nature. That notion has become a cliche, and one that filmmakers who try to justify their creative bankruptcy constantly parrot, as do their fans and general audiences who do not care about any movie that isn't current. I believe that approach to a reinterpretation of an existing franchise is unimaginative. That's what I meant. I would rather a director swallow his pride and check his ego, take a look at the hard work of those who came before him and try to analyse what works and what doesn't. Don't impose yourself on the material and deny credit to others purely on reflex. Don't shun something for the sake of shunning it. Don't replace a round wheel with a triangular one just because it's different. But, I don't want to end on a negative note and keep talking around in circles and getting argumentative, each of us dismissing the other's feelings as irrelevant because we disagree with them. People who want John Williams' theme to make an appearance are justified in feeling that, just as those who don't care for it are entitled to say so. We'll have to agree to disagree. As I believe I said in my last comment, irrespective of my feelings on this matter I will be paying to see the film and I will be giving it a chance. It certainly seems less of a lazy cash-in than some other superhero reboots I could mention (if I wanted to poke a different type of hornets' nest, that is)...

  • July 16, 2012, 6:03 p.m. CST


    by idonotseekabanning

    I have a love hate relationship with Zappa. I like that he was inventive and the consummate musician's musician, but he swung his irony like a hammer, and it could get tedious beyond expression. I have a similar love/hate relationship with what you're saying. I can understand where you're coming from when you talk about the greater purpose of scores being that they serve the story serving. I can also agree that they can be obtrusive/invasive, if not handled delicately. From what you say about film scores, I completely believe you're a composer. Your attitude toward composing agrees with what appears to be the current attitude toward composing. Thing is, I miss actually caring about film scores, and modern composers seem to be doing their damnedest to "serve the story" and be forgotten immediately after the movie is over with. When I hear Korngold or Jarre or Herrmann or Morricone or Steiner (yes, even Steiner), I'm immediately transported back to my original viewing experience, and I don't need to see a frame of any of the movies they scored for that to happen. I think that's pretty cool, and I think it's unfortunate film composers are moving away from that. For me, personally, it means less magic. I don't need Williams's score, but I'd like a damned good one that announces itself and doesn't hide behind the visuals. I'm already predisposed to dislike Snyder (I've seen every movie he's directed, and I've wound up bitching about each one), so I'm hoping the score will give me some tiny little thing about the movie to like. I feel bad about being predisposed to dislike Snyder. I'll go in with as open a mind as I can, but it'll be an uphill battle for me just to give this thing a chance.

  • July 16, 2012, 6:32 p.m. CST

    I AM Steampunk Superman

    by matt

    I was the guy who actually ASKED the question about Williams' theme at the WB panel on Saturday, and I have to say that I feel I kinda lobbed him an easy question instead of asking HOW he felt they were going to come up with something as iconic as that Superman theme. "Damned if you do or if you don't" though, I disagree. He may actually come up with something that works BETTER. (I highly doubt it, but anything is possible) I have to agree with Snyder's statement, though. Does that make me HAPPY they are removing it? No, it does not. But I UNDERSTAND it. I am a HUGE Supes fan, and even I can see where the original films need to be distanced from if they want to do something BETTER. I mean, I could think of at least 3 ways they could INCLUDE it and it still be an original Zimmer creation, but hey, I ain't the director. I remain dubious, but hopeful after that footage. And I keep trying to find it online, but to no avail.

  • July 16, 2012, 7:40 p.m. CST

    James Bond keeps the same score, why not superman?

    by john campuzano

  • July 16, 2012, 7:50 p.m. CST

    one of the things about any superman movie

    by bongo dummy

    There was this Simsons bit where Homer kept answering Marge by saying, "Batman is a...." Detective, Scientist, etc. Well, Superman is supposed to be one of those Jack of All Trades, too. Obviously, the Batman movies don't show Batman just sitting around like the cartoons or comics. They don't show him working informants or making his own stuff. But, the Superman movies haven't done a lot of that either. The cartoons have...I'm pretty sure. But, the live-actions ones...not so much. It would be a nice thing to show that he isn't a one trick pony who is a force of Might, you know? If the movie did more of that, maybe they wouldn't add all that superfluous junk, like the flashbacks and the vast amounts of non-action. Or where he catches a projectile or lifts something while flying. Show the dude just being Superman, plugging a volcano, doing the batusi after knocking out a giant robot. Give him one of those montages that just shows Superman working and you'd fill in a lot of blanks for any audience member. And, it might allow for levity and how the character is looked up to or scorned. Focus on that and less on angst or Zod issues and it would be a good show even if it all boils down to one main fight. And not hospitals! Smallville had people in and out of hospitals once a week. It was a medical soap opera! Do I care what it might end up being? I'll wait and see. If it is something campy, I'll be fine with that. If it is serious, that could be good, too. But, if it drags along and focuses on things that ADD to the STORY of modern day Superdude, it better be good.

  • July 17, 2012, 2:03 a.m. CST

    Williams theme is an anoying nuisance ...

    by illegal alien vs sexual predator

    Maybe I should change the ring tone on my cel phone alarm. Theme? Snooze! Theme? Snooze! Repeat.

  • July 17, 2012, 2:20 a.m. CST

    The theme

    by hulkiest

    I love the Williams Superman theme. Loved it as a kid. Still admire and respect it as one of the greatest movie themes of all time. But! Like Williams' other awesome, character-defining themes, it sort of gets old and a bit tiresome with each movie. Ditto Goldsmith's Star Trek March. I don't mind variations, but to hear the same march like clockwork every time Superman flies by or does something heroic, come on! The complainers are like people who MUST drink Diet Coke or MUST wash their car on Friday. Change it up, you know? Give another guy a chance. So, I'm all for a reboot. I'm all for a new composer. JUST NOT HANS ZIMMER! I can't imagine from his the last decade of his film score work that he has it in him to compose an inspiring leitmotif for The Man of Steel. His music boils down to a series of ticking clocks, shrieking Lisa Girard and that muppet who would bang his head on a piano on Sesame Street. In Zimmer's case, several expensive keyboards. Someone mentioned The Thin Red Line's "Journey To The Line." That's a powerfully good theme. It is. IMHO the only one Zimmer ever produced-- for a movie about guys going to die. Could it work in Superman? Sure. But I'm having a hard time imagining Superman rescuing a boat load of passengers with that music playing. I think the guy to go to is the actual soul behind the current Batman music: James Newton Howard. His music is almost consistently excellent-- except of course with Green Lantern. I think he was just doing too many scores and phoned that one in. He has it in him to do Superman well. Possibly James Horner. But Horner just did some of his more interesting, fresher sounding work with Spiderman. So it's doubtful he would bring much to Superman. Horner usually follows up one of his innovative scores with two or three scores that sound exactly like the one that was sort of different. Anyway, Mr. Snyder seems a bit unimaginative where music is concerned. Who else would hire Tyler Bates? So I don't imagine his Superman movie having a score that soars. We'll see. Maybe Zimmer will meditate and find something inside himself that he didn't know he had. Or more likely, he'll contract the theme out to one of his interns and take the credit.

  • It doesn't have to be exactly the same treatment as Ottoman gave it, which wasn't very imaginative and just copied the music verbatim with the smallest adjustments, but you do NEED the theme and if you don't use it, you HAVE FAILED at what you should be doing, making a good Superman movie, not a "we're different, see!" Superman movie. Also, FUCK those who want you not to use it. I am so sick of them! They are what is wrong with movies now, they don't know what good music is and they are fucking goddamned ruining the medium with their tasted or lack thereof! Not using it in any way shape or form is why I have no faith in you, that and Suck or Punch. The goddamned assholes are running this ship into the ground, I am so disappointed in all of you.

  • July 17, 2012, 5:34 a.m. CST

    That's hilarious, Drath

    by D.Vader


  • July 17, 2012, 10:22 a.m. CST

    @mojination Superman shaves with Heat-Vision on a flame resistant mirror.

    by Napolean Solo

    He also uses Krypto-Razors, sold only in Brooklyn.

  • July 17, 2012, 12:02 p.m. CST

    John Williams Superman Theme just sounds sooo dorky these days.

    by Dilox Esp

    Superman! Shummp...-dhun-Dhun-Dhun. Shummp...-dhun-Dhun-Dhun. Shummp...-dhun-Dhun-Dhun. The whole score sounds like an aging british drinking song. Bring me new stuff!

  • ??????To who exactly? A deaf person? An idiot (like you) a modern internet snarky hipster? WHO? Exactly. Just you. Fuck off.

  • July 17, 2012, 4:43 p.m. CST

    John Williams Superman Theme just sounds sooo dorky these days!!!

    by Dilox Esp

    To me. YOU ASS FUCK CLOT!!!!! Seriously. When Sup saves Lois from the helicopter, it used to bring a tear to my eye every time. I even had a video clip of it just to show people how cool it was. But over the years the effect wore off. It was the Williams theme. It just wore out after 30 years. Face it ZodClot. Its over! The Williams theme has completely played out. IT TIRED!!!!

  • July 17, 2012, 5:30 p.m. CST

    The public will HATE this movie

    by pumaman

    mainly based one one simple thing. That William's theme was not in it. They will doom this film if that theme is gone mark my words.

  • July 17, 2012, 5:56 p.m. CST

    dilox esp - nothing wrong with the theme, asspoker...

    by Dan

    I was not clamoring for it to return, but to say it's played out is all kinds of retarded... So has Beethoven's "Ode to Joy" played out for you hipster douchedrinks too? Hmmmm?

  • July 17, 2012, 5:57 p.m. CST

    pumaman - If those fucking Shreks and Madagascars...

    by Dan

    can make money, why not a Superman? I'm not calling it shitty on those levels, but it does have a chance to succeed without being so dramatic.

  • July 18, 2012, 3:27 a.m. CST

    The Superman Theme not in the new Superman Movie = FAIL

    by Supermans

    Simple as that. The Superman Theme should be in the movie during Superman's reveal. The new Voltron cartoon remake lacked the original Voltron theme for much of the first season. Then the fans complained and it was added into the show later on. What a difference it made. The later episodes were so much better because of it.

  • July 18, 2012, 7:35 p.m. CST

    Nice parody of ridiculous talkbackers, Supermans

    by D.Vader