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You’re just jealous because The Behind the Scenes Pic of the Day is a genuine freak and you have to wear a mask!
Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with today’s Behind the Scenes Pic!
Tim Burton’s Batman Returns is a bizarre flick and man did I eat up that weirdness when I was a kid. I vividly remember reading seeing this film and being excited to see Paul Reubens show up. This was after the whole porno theater scandal and I was pissed that they pulled Pee-Wee’s Playhouse, so it was pretty awesome seeing him show up as The Penguin’s papa. I didn’t even make the Pee-Wee’s Big Adventure/Tim Burton connection until much later.
Danny DeVito and Christopher Walken as bad guys, super-sexy Michelle Pfeiffer in skin-tight leather, an army of cute little missile-launching penguins and a tone even darker and weirder than the first Batman film… you can’t go too wrong with this one. It’s a bit sloppier than the first, but I’ll always dig it.
Thanks once again to Pat Barnett for sending this one along.
If you have a behind the scenes shot you’d like to submit to this column, you can email me at quint@aintitcool.com.
Tomorrow’s pic chills out.
-Eric Vespe
”Quint”
quint@aintitcool.com
Follow Me On Twitter
Click here to visit the complete compilation of previous Behind the Scenes images, Page Two
Readers Talkback
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TWAT!
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he straps a bomb to him and throws him down a manhole? I thought he never killed?
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infowars.com
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The bomb and the fall killed him.
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A cowl is cool. A helmet is part of a penis. You win Timmy.
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It's against his moral code to kill anyone so the joker kills 100 people and then he catches him and locks him up.he breaks out of Arkham and kills 100 more people. So Batman catches him again and back to Arkham and another escape and another 100 people dead. Just stupid and why these superhero characters will always be kiddy fare. I loved Avengers but it's not much better in a whole lot of ways.
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Even Keaton admitted it was only "Ok." Campy shit with tons of corny dialogue and lame villains all over the place. Batman's introduction is him simply getting out of the batmobile. Lazy, lame, and the start of the downward trend of batman films, until Nolan came along that is.
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July 14, 2012, 12:40 p.m. CST
STAY AWAY FROM COMICBOOKMOVIES.COM, posting HUGE spoilers!!!
by notcher
Full description of the ending is up!
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One weird-ass movie. Hardly qualifies as a Batman film. The penguin thing was unforgivably ludicrous. The first Burton flick was far superior. LOVE the Batmobile though!
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July 14, 2012, 12:41 p.m. CST
The best thing you can say about Burton's "Batman" is that it could have been worse.
by Snookeroo
Then "Batman Returns" proved it.
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Seriously, Batman, Batman Returns, Forever and even batman & Robin are brilliantly fun films. I was the perfect age. Batman is one of my favorite movies of all time. Top 20 for sure. It change me. I was beyond excited for that film. It also pushed my comic book obsession over the edge. I'm forever an addict now. lol. Great photo.
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This isn't a website about politics. Keep your dumbass opinions to yourself.
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Great casting there, Tim.
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I mean, in the first one, other than bombing the shit out of the axis chemical plant and tossing a bunch of the Jokers goons off a bell tower, he flat out tells The Joker, "I am going to kill you"
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I looked, and oh, what a crock of baloney!
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July 14, 2012, 12:52 p.m. CST
I dig the movie, the early 90's nostalgia makes it even better
by cgih8r
and I like a Batman who avoids killing but is open to making exceptions when he has to. That's what good cops have to do every day.
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Like, REALLY hate this movie. Like "Batman and Robin," "Superman Returns," and "Green Lantern" hated. Burton proved, once again, that he never read any of the comics. That was a point he drove home during the first crappy Batman movie. There were so many bullshit moments, even for a "comic book movie." So Selina falls out of a skyscraper, gets licked back to life by cats, puts on heels and can suddenly do acrobatic moves and jump around? The fuck? Batman has super strength and actually punches through the bottom of a steel plated car while in a seated position, never mind the lack of physics involved here...Batman kills people all over the place, such as burning a guy with Batmobile afterburners. After Batman rips off his mask in front of Walken (the fuck??), and Walken starts shooting Selina over and over, what is Batman doing? He's standing the fuck around watching his lady love zombie get shot! And penguins with rockets on their backs...ugh. This movie just made me so fucking mad. Still does. Thank goodness Nolan came around with the amazing Batman Begins (which I think is better than TDK).
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July 14, 2012, 12:53 p.m. CST
I love love love Batman Returns. Never understand the hate.
by JediRob
This will always be my Batman.
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was right at that age, she's for ever burned in my brain.
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Damn she was sexy in Batman Returns. Anytime I see a pic of that costume I just wanna shoot my goo all over her.
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You just never know this close if someone posts somethind real, don't want to spoil this motherfucker!
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July 14, 2012, 1:04 p.m. CST
One thing that brought Returns down was the set design.
by Christian Sylvain
Anton Furst's work on the '89 batman brought a sense of scale and artistic grit to Gotham City that was never recaptured in the sequels. Returns in particular too often looks like it's being filmed on a soundstage. Not a bad sequel, but certainly an odd mix of campy material with gothic imagery and tone. A common problem with a lot of Burton's films.
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Not trying to be a dick, just sayin'.
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July 14, 2012, 1:19 p.m. CST
I love all things Batman. Of the films, this is second only to Batman Begins for me...
by ThulsaBoom
...Batman Returns is the most gothic, perfectly casted, and smoothly executed Batman film. Danny Devito is the most haunting, pitch perfect penguin we will ever get, and Michelle Pfeiffer is ICONIC. I give the nod to Keaton every time as Batman, but I do prefer Bale as Bruce Wayne. This film also has two and a half villains and none of them get short-changed, which has been a serious challenge for every 2+ villain, comic movie since. Pretty sure The Dark Knight Rises will own all previous attempts though. Looks perfect.
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Does anyone remember the McDonalds commercials for the electricity-draining power plant sub plot that ended up on the cutting room floor? Also, this was an uneven film that could have been great, such is life Keaton was a great Batman for me but I never bought his Bruce
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Put Michelle Pfeiffer in ANY catsuit TODAY, and she wins hands down, no contest. I'm definately excited for Nolan's TDKR, but with respect to Ms. Hathaway or any other actresses, Pfeiffer's movement conveys more of Catwoman's sexiness, danger, and overall physical agility. Shouldn't judge having not yet seen TDKR but... Just Sayin'
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FACT!
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July 14, 2012, 1:27 p.m. CST
The thing I loved about this flick was the shades of grey that the characters had
by DementedCaver
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Wow, man, you must be INCREDIBLY ignorant. Did you even complete first grade? Other than enjoying looking at Catwoman, I thought this film was a fucking travesty.
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In the first film the villians had the colours while Batman was just black. Then Catwoman and Penguin showed up in black and it just didn't fit. It made me wonder if the circus was just an afterthought.
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Ledger's performance saved The Dark Knight, but Nolan can not do action (nor plausibility) if his life counted on it. *formerly RedWhiteNegro*
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July 14, 2012, 1:35 p.m. CST
And of cours there's the usual idiot complaining about Batman killing
by Carl
Way to know your source material nimrod.
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We'd have Captain Jack Depp in the cowl, I'm not sure that I'd be able to live in this world if that happened.
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I know my Batman source material "nimrod." I'm aware that he killed in his first appearances in 1939, and even carried a gun in 1940. Modern Batman conventions don't have him killing for any reason because "he's seen enough killing." If your "nimrod" comment was addressed to me, kindly retract it. I know it's easy to hide behind a keyboard and insult. That's what the internet is for, and this site has that reputation.
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oh wait sorry wrong movie.
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July 14, 2012, 1:49 p.m. CST
No you're still a nimrod, because you admitted that some versions of Batman have him kill
by Carl
Nimrod buttwhipe cunt.
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July 14, 2012, 1:51 p.m. CST
And if you want to meet me in person come to Bethlehem,PA and email this addy when there:
by Carl
nanaharas@hotmail.com. I'll be glad to call you plenty of things to your face. No prob.
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July 14, 2012, 2:04 p.m. CST
When you look at how close the studio ceiling is to the top of the set . . .
by Jeff Myers
This explains the APPALLING editing of the fight scenes between Batman and Catwoman on the roof top - as Burton tried to frame the shot without showing the roof. Nothing flows. And there isn't a single shot in the film that looks like it was made outdoors - most evident in the tiny 'crowd' scenes. Thousands of visual mistakes, dreadful script, inconsistent characters, the usual OTT Burton soup, not enough budget. But the best Penguin - Catwoman characterization ever.
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July 14, 2012, 2:11 p.m. CST
Did like parts of it when I saw it when it came out...
by TheBigFuckinLebowski
But my general feeling was that it looked cheap, with no scale or grandeur, and that the penguin was just too disgusting... When I look at it today, I just don't like it anymore. It's nasty, dark and depressing. It lost the sense of fun and adventure that the first one had. Now I can pinpoint the problem: Too "Tim-Burton-esque", not enough "Batman-esque".
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Batman Returns is my personal favorite Batman film. That's not to say that it's the best Batman film, but it is my personal favorite. Walken, Keaton and Pfeiffer are all fantastic, and the movie is completely quotable.
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I could have blood gushing out of my nose...
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July 14, 2012, 2:38 p.m. CST
I like it ... Bit it WAS too dark and generally depressing ... Plus it started the trend of villains being more important than Batman.
by GINGE_MUPPET
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Things like that were awesome but the sets, especially gotham city ext.'s looked like a jumbled mess which shumacher amped up to a million for the next 2.
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July 14, 2012, 2:52 p.m. CST
Horrible movie... just utter crap. Sure, I liked it when I was 8. That should be the only reason to like this one. BLECH!!! HATE HATE HAAAATE the Burton Batmans! I would prefer Batman Forever to that crap!
by MariusXe
Thank heavens for Nolan!
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July 14, 2012, 2:59 p.m. CST
The fact that Batman Returns looked studio bound was a plus, not a minus
by Turd_Is_Floating_Underneath_The_Gravy
It was Burton's intentional tribute to German Expressionism, and the noticeable fakery contributed greatly to the surreal mood and atmosphere of the film. The art direction in BR is superb. At least Burton's movies had some visual flair, unlike Nolan's. Under Nolan's direction, Gotham doesn't look the post-industrial gothic hellhole it should do, but an ordinary, bland, white collar city (the exception being parts of Batman Begins) - because all he did was film live in Chicago and New York with no dressing up, and shot all in broad daylight to boot.
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I have only seen it like 3 times and have no real interest in watching it again any time soon.
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July 14, 2012, 3:10 p.m. CST
This one was really dumb with the tech and action... some examples
by Autodidact
1. The self-directed batarang... just dumb and poorly executed in the movie 2. The sides popping off the Batmobile... I suppose in a way this is a variation on the Batpod. But again to me it seemed stupid and just so "Hollywood" like how do we modify the Batmobile in such a way that our union carpenters can mock the shit up affordably? 3. Penguin hijacks the Batmobile.. this whole sequence is lame.. the low-point of the entire Batman series (including Batman & Robin) comes in the payoff to this sequence when Batman does some DJ scratching, with a CD no less, and smiles to himself. You know, the way Batman does. 4. The first action sequence, the big "trailer moment" that was used as a stinger, where Batman uses the grapple gun to rip a piece of concrete from the wall and knock out a thug with it. Just dumb. 5. Penguin's penguin-launched missile attack. Fucking retarded. I realize Burton was going for something, but it just doesn't jibe with me overall. I can rewatch the first Burton Batman, and Batman Forever, and Batman Begins lots... but this one leaves me cold.
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TDK and Begins tied for 1st
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July 14, 2012, 3:16 p.m. CST
@Gravy-Turd. The visual flair of Burton's films IS his strongest point. And I'm a fan of German expressionism. But . .
by Jeff Myers
I'm talking about the really bad flow of editing in many of the action scenes. Catwoman/Batman rooftop scene, the choice of angles and rapid cuts make no logical connection for the eye. They look as if the actors may not have been in the same scene together or Burton's omitted crucial parts. There is no rapid cutting of any kind in Expressionism. This speed/misdirection, approach seems to have increased since the advent of MTV/music video's.
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Just a few years ago, people here were raging about Batman and Robin, and how it derailed the franchise. You geeks are funny.
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July 14, 2012, 3:24 p.m. CST
Batman Returns is one of those movies I never want to watch...
by photoboy
... but when I do actually watch it I really enjoy it! I never really noticed how trippy it was when I first saw it. While it is a bit silly, it was still much more serious than the Adam West incarnation. It's only since Nolan's reboot that I've noticed how weird it is!
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July 14, 2012, 3:31 p.m. CST
I didn't say the editing in BR was inspired by German expressionism, just the set design and lighting
by Turd_Is_Floating_Underneath_The_Gravy
Maybe some of the performances as well. It's true that Burton can't direct action any better than Nolan; however, it baffles me to see people bashing the look of this film. It's one of the coolest looking, and downright weird, studio films of the past two decades.
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Batman Returns is the second-best superhero movie ever made—just below The Dark Knight. I can understand die-hard Batman fans not liking it, though. Taken as a Batman movie it's questionable... taken as a Burton movie, it's a near-masterpeice. It's the best of his big-budget blockbuster movies by far.
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Penguins in the sewer. Penguins in the sewer that raise a baby. The Crime Circus? Really? The main villain being Mr. Macy. Catwoman, revived from death by alley cats! A giant duckmobile. Stupidity abounds in this thing. It was all style, no substance. It's tone was so inconsistent. One scene we have a whimsical crime circus, the nest we have gruesome death and murder. This movie was garbage when I was 13, and it's garbage now. Yes, it's pretty to look at. But that's all. No substance. It takes campy, and paints it with a dark pallet, but it's still camp.
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July 14, 2012, 4:01 p.m. CST
fuck it you guys - get back in the Total Recall BTS thread!!
by CARTMANEZ
im sick of fuckin Batman. batman this, dark knight that blah blah blah...i got Batknight coming out my fuckin ears!
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And that isn't a bad thing. Looking back... they kinda suck.
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The movie is all about appearances hiding true identity, and what the strain and consequences of keeping a dual identity in check. EVERY main character in the movie, besides Chip, is playing with that dual nature. Schreck (one of my favorite Walken performances) is a business man upfront, criminal behind closed doors. Penguin, really and truly a monster, but running for Mayor...and the movie pulls a nice trick with the subterfuge of him finding his parents. Looking back, it's a bit hackneyed, but, back when I first watched it, it worked. Catwoman, a shy, self-depricating woman who suddenly finds an inner strength and vengence. And Batman, of course, dealing with issues of being a crimefighter. The movie even plays with the duality of media and how things can be perceived that are not actually true. Yeah, there are the hokey parts to it. The Catwoman transformation. You're not sure if she's being resuscitated or if something more ethereal is going on, but, to me, it's Burton, he does quirk.. it works for me. This movie has a weird sexual fetish undertone running through it, too. Which is VERY Miller. The fetishistic lifestyle of being a vigilante or a 'super' villian. I think there's no denying that a lot of young men probably started puberty in a dark movie theater, while Michelle Pfiefer was writing on that bed. I dunno, to me, I think this was the only Batman movie where you can look at it, and instantly tell that Burton did it. It LOOKS like a Burton film. And it's fun. The dialouge is fun and jaunty, and I'm a huge sucker for the masquerade scene where Selena and Bruce discover their alter egos. And Selena starts tearing and whispers.."Does this mean we have to start fighting?" Yeah...I just dig this movie.
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You have to look at this movie in the context of its time. In its day, it was not considered campy or silly at all. People thought it was really, really black. No one else was treating superheros in a dark, edgy way. Tim Burton really went out on a limb... I still say that it's the weirdest movie ever to become a huge summer blockbuster. It's not an action movie... it's a gothic horror movie combined with an absurdist comedy.
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but writing is pretty sexy too. :)
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July 14, 2012, 4:09 p.m. CST
The chemistry between Keaton's Batman and Catwoman is great!
by xbagboy
Not a perfect movie but still prefer Keaton's Batman to Bale's.
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...throws a guy down the belltower at the end.
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To the guy who said "batman's enterance is just him getting out the batmobile", well yeah, but his enterance is a big fight. The tradeoff between Burton and the studio on this one was Burton gets to do his weird expressionist superhero film, and they get more of an action picture than the first one.
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- Penguin = outcasted, weird orphan with a subterranean domain - Max Shreck - Billionaire playboy with dark secrets - Catwoman - crazed, cowelled vigilante The characters in essence are the core of the expressionistic streak of the film.
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You are so right. This movie is all about people not being who they say they are. In a perverse way, Catwoman and Batman totally hit it off when they're in their consumes... the problems only start to occur when they meet each other as thier actual selves. And yes... the sexual undertones are disturbing. I don't understand the people who hate this movie. It's one of those rare big-budget Hollywood films with genuine artistry, originality, and imagination.
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There is a huge political element to this movie, which ties into the theme of wearing masks. The Penguin is a serial killer who murders children, but by manipulating the media and taking advantage of a billionaire patron, he fools Gotham City into thinking that he is a great guy. To bring him down, Bruce Wayne is forced to manipulate media and technology, too.
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Great picture. Max Shreck. The character name tells you all you need to know about this movie. Walken's hairdo was hilarious. Waaah, Batman killed someone! Boo fucking hoo. Heroes shouldn't kill, unless they're paid for by our tax dollars? Spare me. Burton's Batman may have gone too far for some, but it was a reaction to the goofy Adam West show. At least Batman isn't growling like a fucking werewolf.
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... even if the ending is kind of crap. Burton at least *tried* to tell a legitimate story without sneering at the audience in every single frame (just, say, 45% of the frames)...
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the re-introduction of bruce/batman sitting silent in his living room until the signal appears batman missing, shooting the wall and ripping the cement to bust the guys head. (reused as the truck scene in tdk) the circus gang idea. (so burton could have more clowns) the bomb in the pants. christopher walken selena having a nervous breakdown and becoming catwoman. penguin biting burt's nose. the fact that he's a penguin like because of mutation i kinda liked, but the penguin raising seems too coincidential. the way batman takes care of each vilain in as little moves as possible. christmas. the comic book reality. the very end with catwoman. the danny elfman score
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At the top of that list I would add the opening silent montage with Paul Reubins as the Penguin's father. Could be one of the greatest opening sequences of all time.
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July 14, 2012, 5:20 p.m. CST
Said it before: Burton's Batman eventually gets you to Nolan's
by smudgewhat
Burton's movies are products of what the audience would accept at the time and they got the ball rolling on Batman as a dark hero. Even down to some basic costume design concepts refined by Nolan. Much prefer the Nolan ones but Burton's have soft space in my bat logo heart.
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July 14, 2012, 5:20 p.m. CST
Not a 5 star film, but has dated better than the 89 original
by Mark Jones
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July 14, 2012, 5:22 p.m. CST
If the penguins raised The Penguin
by Turd_Is_Floating_Underneath_The_Gravy
How did he learn to speak English?
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How in the hell does falling several stories out of a skyscraper, hitting the snow-covered ground and getting licked back to life by cats endow an ordinary woman with martial arts and acrobatic skills? Oh yeah, and also turn her into a homicidal maniac who's bulletproof.
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when he was a circus freak as a young child. Don't know how he got from the penguins to the carnival, though.
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The mood and the tone are magnificent. Batman Returns is dark and twistet but on the other hand simply beautiful. Shame on Warner for not allowing burton to fulfill his vision.
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... by a long shot. One of my very favourite films, in fact. Bizarre, gothic, dark, funny, camp and disturbing in fairly equal measures. The 'birth of Catwoman' scene is properly awesome "hell here"!).
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July 14, 2012, 6:36 p.m. CST
the opening was great, pee wee and simone back together again with their hideous flipper son. so they ditch him in the sewers.
by crazy4dragons13
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July 14, 2012, 6:49 p.m. CST
I know I'm going to get burned for this - but it's a fact - at least in my house
by Jeff Myers
As flawed as they are, I must have watched Burton's Batman films at least 50 - 60 times between them. There's a crazed Gothic, operatic, unreality to them. Elfman's score is superb (back before he cloned himself endlessly.) Sam Hamm's dialogue is etched into my psyche. I must have watched Nolan's Batman films . . . twice. To me, they have lots of realism . . but no rewatch value.
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Why would ANYBODY want to go to Bethlehem, PA of all places? Aren't people trying to leave there? I've been to Iraq, the first time by volunteer. Yet I wouldn't volunteer to go to Bethlehem, PA. Especially when I live 5 minutes from the beach in San Diego. I know you're trying to bait me, which is what mouth breathers do. Have fun in Bethlehem, PA doing whatever the fuck it is people do over there to have fun. I'll keep enjoying the gorgeous Pacific Ocean in 72 degree San Diego weather.
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my favorite Batman movie. period.
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the chemistry between Keaton and Pfeiffer. It's the only thing about Burton's Batman movies that has a pulse.
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Everyone in it is awesome. The dynamic between Bruce and his love interest is intriguing and realistically played, and the sets alone are worth the price of admission. Plus it has Walken.
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Batman doesn't kill! (even though he did in the original Bob Kane comics) It was too much about the villains! (even though each one represents a different aspect of Bruce Wayne's psyche) Catwoman and Penguin weren't exactly like their comic versions so it sucks! (even though the comic versions wouldn't have worked in Burton's fairty tale interpretation) Waaah! Waaah! I love listening to them whine . . .
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Sorry, that's how I feel. This movie is awesome, and the Academy didn't have to balls to nominate Michelle Pfeiffer and instead chose to give her nomination to a film nobody saw nor cared about. And are you REALLY going to defend this story over Schumacher's travesties? Who, when asked why he was going more "camp" with the series, responded "They're based on COMIC books, not TRAGEDY books. Of course they're silly films." Yeah, a story based on a guy who sees his parents gunned down and killed in front of him is great "comic" fodder. Then came the nipple suits... And as far as "Batman Begins", great film, just.. well, it takes WAY too long for Batman to begin. This movie is excellent in so many ways. And you can tell me until you're blue in the face that I'm dead wrong. Thing is, like all works of art, a film is subjective. You bring to it what you like. I liked. You didn't. Doesn't make either one of use superior or stupid. It means we like different stuff. 'Nuff said.
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July 15, 2012, 2:10 a.m. CST
Ah yes, the only Batman series I consider of any worth to caped crusader fans.
by Ted Knight
Bale is a sad substitute for the sterling and most convincing performance of Batman/Bruce Wayne ever committed to celluloid: Michael "by God" Keaton!
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Burton's Batman movie is a terrible aberration in most respects. From the ground up, the movie was miscast and it's clear that the idiot Burton had no understanding of the Batman character. The ONLY good thing about that movie was the impressive production design. Gotham city looked great, and the Batmobile concept was nice.
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July 15, 2012, 11:44 a.m. CST
I'm still waiting for a Batman film that is not about Bruce Wayne's personal life... even Nolan makes it all to personal and about being Bruce Wayne
by Autodidact
I wish we could have a BATMAN movie not a movie about BRUCE WAYNE AND HIS GIRLFRIENDS.
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July 15, 2012, 11:45 a.m. CST
Watching TDK last night I noticed two very superficial things
by Autodidact
1. Bruce and Harvey have the exact same hairstyle 2. Maggie Gyllenhall is so unsexy it's almost comical
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In my runup to TDKR, I'm watching some of my other favorite Batman projects. I ran both BATMAN '89 and BR yesterday. I have to say that both films suffer from underdeveloped scripts and the slopiness that Quint mentions, but they are filled with interesting visuals and ideas. BR in particular is such a beautifully shot movie, with gorgeous work by Stefan Czapsky. BATMAN is dull looking by comparision. The duality is wonderfully explored in Michelle Pfeiffer's schiziod version of Catwoman, and Michael Keaton's near psychotic version of Bats. I love how insecure he seems as Bruce, but suddenly becomes this cruel badass when he puts on the costume(of course, only bad guys suffer because of his psychosis; Keaton's Batman is as noble as any other version of the character when it comes to helping innocent civilians and children) . If these films had tighter scripts, they would work so much better today. Nolan has left me spoiled with his outstanding storytelling and characterization, but Burton's films do have an interesting thing or two to say about Batman.
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If someone else didn't already mention it, Batman doesn't just stand idly by when Schreck shoots Selina. He himself was just shot, and is temporarily down while Selina and Max have their mutual nervous breakdowns.
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I like Batman a bit more disturbed.. not in an emotional way, more in an irrational-pursuit-of-justice-by-punching-people way. Bale doesn't seem to have an actual dark side.
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fair enough. But I stand by my other points on the movie. Color me NOT A FAN of BR.
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July 15, 2012, 7:13 p.m. CST
Batman Returns was god-awful. That's why WB got Schumacher for part 3, which was even worse!
by bat725
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...was that Batman Returns did not sell enough toys. The film was awesome and made a HUGE amount of money, but Burton had created a rather perverse movie aimed at adults, and that didn't fit in with McDonald's Happy Meal tie-ins.
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All of Burton's movies, with the sole exception of Edward Scissorhands, have major script problems. In certain films, like Batman Returns, the disjointed storytelling contributes to a dreamlike, hallucinatory feel. But script problems have marred his entire career. He's still a genius, though.
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July 16, 2012, 9:18 a.m. CST
And by not telling the origin...it allowed Nolan to come along later and tell it in a very interesting way w/o feeling "done" ahem Amazing Spidey ahem....
by Dogmatic
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