Cool News
So Orson Scott Card Visited The Set Of The ENDER'S GAME Movie...
Rhino Times has posted a very interesting piece from author Orson Scott Card.
The article begins with his thoughts on Joss Whedon's AVENGERS film, but segues towards Card's recent set visit to the now-in-production adaptation of his ENDER'S GAME book.
A few choice quotelets...
I was on the set of Ender's Game last week to record my one line in the movie – a voiceover of a pilot making an announcement to his passengers.
[EDIT]
The scene does not come from the book – very few of the scenes in this movie do – so it was amusing when others asked me how it felt to have my book brought to life. My book was already alive in the mind of every reader. This is writer-director Gavin Hood's movie, so they were his words, and it was his scene.
Regarding Harrison Ford and Asa Butterfield's performances as Colonel Graff and Ender Wiggin (respectively)...
...they were superb. Film acting, especially in closeup, is not about facial expressions. It's about what's going on behind the actors' eyes. And it's about timing.
[EDIT]
...the less they did, the better the scene became. What mattered was the timing – when Ford put his hand on Butterfield's shoulder, how long it took Butterfield to glance at the hand, how long before he looked away and when the hand was withdrawn.
Card continues to discuss the complex wirework rigging necessary to realize Battle Room sequences, the overall appearance of the picture's sets, and evaluates Ford and Butterfield's work in far greater detail. 'Tis a very interesting piece...check it out HERE!
ENDER'S GAME is due in theaters November 2013. Boborci's production blog, now featuring a picture of boborci, is online and regularly updated HERE.
Thanks to AICN reader Greg for the heads up about this!
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Readers Talkback
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. . . – very few of the scenes in this movie do " What in the holy hell is all this about???
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"So let the fans think that they actually care about the characters, or that they liked the story, or that the cool visuals carried the movie. You and I will understand that they are quite wrong." What a self important douche.
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Cant say I blame him. He's being political about it from reading between the lines but he doesn't sound too impressed they've changed it so much. Although he seems happy with the acting so you know, swings and roundabouts. Always thought Ender's Game as a movie would need a lot changed in it though because the denouement is a real cop-out after everything that's gone in the book before it. So I'm hopeful it'll be a decent film. Fingers crossed.
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Oh good...cuz the scenes in the book were terrible
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May 17, 2012, 1:47 p.m. CST
He is a kind of a self important, mormon douchebag, but I really love that book, hope it does not suck.
by the Green Gargantua
More so I hope it kicks Hunger Games so hard in the nuts that they choke. Still have not read Ender's Shadow, heard it is even better though...
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Hope it turns out for the better.
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Sounds like battleship. Too bad they had to hack this one to get it done. I'd be pissed too. Douch or not
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... then Harrison must be becoming a better actor, year after year. He barely speaks.
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Sorry, but it's true. Read it once, shrugged, and moved on.
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...pretty much sums up the guy. Love the books and looking forward to the movies, but you read some of the anti-gay essays this guy has written and you start to realize "man, this guy is kind of a crazy bigot". I will chalk this one up to being able to respect the art without respecting the artist.
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was the mental equivalent of getting punched in the sack multiple times. Waste of time, waste of bandwidth.
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'Ender's Game' is on my list of "best of" books, but Ender's Shadow is now a notch above it. Much better book in my opinion, and it makes you want to go back and read 'Game' with this entire new perspective in your mind.
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Is a POS and he should not be supported, hell bigots are fine he takes it to a whole new level
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The Wolverine movie is hands down one of the worst comic book movies ever made. Every decision was wrong pretty much. Sure that could have been the studio buuuut the direction wasn't exactly great either.
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Speaking of movies, I was on the set of Ender's Game last week to record my one line in the movie – a voiceover of a pilot making an announcement to his passengers. Let me assure you that there is nothing exciting about being a spectator at the filming of a movie. It's hard work, it takes hours to shoot a 30-second scene, things are done over and over, and in between shots there's nothing but ... waiting. However, if you're actually working, it can be intense and fascinating. I sat, off-camera, reading my sole line, which comes in the middle of a scene between Harrison Ford as Col. Graff and Asa Butterfield as Ender Wiggin. The scene does not come from the book – very few of the scenes in this movie do – so it was amusing when others asked me how it felt to have my book brought to life. My book was already alive in the mind of every reader. This is writer-director Gavin Hood's movie, so they were his words, and it was his scene. So what I was concentrating on was how Ford and Butterfield worked with the lines, with the director, with the camera and with each other. If you don't understand what you're seeing, it could look as if they were doing nothing at all. Their line readings were flat (by stage standards) and barely audible (boom mikes picked up sounds that were barely audible 10 feet away). They had almost no facial expressions. And they were superb. Film acting, especially in closeup, is not about facial expressions. It's about what's going on behind the actors' eyes. And it's about timing. The scene got more and more minimal as the takes went on. What had been an arm grab and a shrug became a mere touch on the shoulder and a single glance at the hand. And the less they did, the better the scene became. What mattered was the timing – when Ford put his hand on Butterfield's shoulder, how long it took Butterfield to glance at the hand, how long before he looked away and when the hand was withdrawn. When it comes time to edit the movie, the actors will have given the editor a vast menu of choices to get just the right effect. On the set, however, it was wonderful to see how Ford and Butterfield responded to each other's timing. It was such a delicate dance – and they worked perfectly together. Twice, I saw Ford give a tiny suggestion to Butterfield. The suggestion in both cases was excellent; and in both cases, Butterfield understood completely and executed perfectly. The scene may or may not work as planned; for all I know, it might not end up in the movie. But if it's there, the audience will experience it as reality – we won't stop and think of all the many different ways it could have played. But the actors thought of it, and almost every one of the different ways they played it worked well. The odd thing is that Harrison Ford gets little credit for the brilliance of his acting, because he's so real that audiences think that's just how he is. Nonsense. Ford is a very inward man; everything he does on screen is acting, it's all very, very hard to do, and the fact that you think he's just being himself tells you how outstanding an actor he is. And Butterfield is showing himself to be, not a child actor, but an actor who happens to be young. I've always said that, as a director, I'd rather have smart actors than talented ones, because your smart actors listen and change, and with those who fancy themselves talented, you have to rely on chance to get your performance. Butterfield is smart. That really helps when he's supposed to bring off a preternaturally intelligent character. Actors can easily play dumb, but I've never seen an actor bring off a character that is smarter than he is. He's convincing as Ender Wiggin, so if the movie doesn't work, it won't be Butterfield's fault. Besides that intense time doing offscreen line readings while two fine actors were at work, I got a chance to explore the gorgeous sets designed and built by teams headed by production designers Sean Haworth and Ben Procter. Again, they were not building anything from the book, so I wasn't seeing my ideas brought to life. Their job was to build the scenery dreamed up by Gavin Hood for his story, and they have done a wonderful job. I love looking at well-designed sets – tough enough to be safe for the actors to work on, yet not wasting a dime on anything that won't show on camera. Haworth and Procter are a great team. Haworth was art director on a few films you've heard of – Thor, TRON: Legacy, Avatar, both Transformers movies, Eagle Eye, Men in Black II, Mission Impossible III and many others. And Procter, though newer, worked with Haworth on the most recent of these. The movie Ender's Game is going to look great. But the real challenge has always been the freefall movement of the kids in the battle room. Traditional wire work, as in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon and Spider-Man, simply won't work in the battle room, because wires absolutely depend on gravity. That is, they allow actors to defy gravity, but the gravity is still there, revealed in every movement of the actors. In the battle room, with gravity nullified, there is no up or down. Bodies have to move in ways dependent on inertia, not on gravity. So I always assumed that the battle room would be filmed by animating the human figures and then pasting the actors' face onto the result, figuratively speaking. The trouble is that there are certain fundamental problems that computer animations have not yet solved. There's the walking problem, for instance – most animations don't show footfalls, because it never looks real. Never. Even using motion capture, there's something false in the way animated feet hit the ground and then flex and extend to move the person forward. So there was going to be a constant challenge in showing the characters hitting walls and rebounding. It was going to be fake, and the best we could hope for was that in the editing, the falseness would be minimized. But stunt coordinator Garrett Warren took what he learned from the weightless work he did on Avatar built on it. There is a mechanism used for training gymnasts – a wheel they wear around their waists that allows them to rotate in space while suspended from wires. Warren used this on Avatar, which allows a great deal of apparent freedom of movement in space – once the computer artists have erased the wheel rig, you can't tell that there's any way a wire could have been attached. But this is only the beginning. The illusion of freefall depends on the actors' moving correctly. Where gravity naturally draws their limbs downward, in zero-gravity the arms and legs and heads continue in the direction of the last movement, until something stops them. For the most difficult stunts, Warren brought in dancers from Cirque de Soleil. Being gymnasts by training, they tend to be small – they can bring off the illusion of children's bodies. And they have the strength and training to do constant movements and poses that defy gravity, without ever looking as if they're working hard. But all the children playing these roles had to do wire work themselves. Fitted with the wheel rigs, they were being moved through space like puppets – and at every moment, they had to make sure their "nonvolitional" movements followed the rules of inertia-driven rather than gravity-driven motion. It was agonizing. Human muscles aren't meant to work like that. And Warren was watching everything, playing it back again and again, catching any false movements. Get it wrong? Then you do it again. Oh, how these kids suffered! I'm sure many of them had times when they dreaded each day's work. But human bodies adapt, and by the end of filming, they were all in superb physical shape. They were good at these dancelike movements. They had acquired a complete skill set, along with the required musculature, to perform an art that, with any luck, they will never have to use again. Their suffering on the wires in the battle room helped them bond into a team. On the wires, there were no stars, no grunts. Everybody had to learn the same skills, do the same moves. They were equals. So filming the battle room did the same job for the cast that the battle room itself was intended to do for the young students in the fictional Battle School – form them into cohesive teams. These kids can take such pride in what they learned and what they accomplished. Everything that they were called on to do, they did – with style. Here's the irony. Because Garrett Warren did his work so well, when you watch the movie, you won't ever think, Wow, that was so hard! It will simply look as if they're moving through null-gravity space. You'll be concentrating on the story and the people, not the techniques. But if Garrett Warren doesn't get a special technical Oscar for his achievement on this film, then there truly ain't no justice. I've seen enough of the result to know that he has brought off the miracle of filming zero-gravity while still on planet Earth. And almost everything you'll see in that battle room, real people did. The computers didn't animate it – they merely made the wires and rigs invisible. That's my full report on everything I did and saw during my six hours on the set of the Ender's Game movie. During those hours I saw, to my great pleasure, that it's a happy set – people enjoy their work and take pride in it. That's very important to me. I've seen movie sets where the selfishness and stupidity of the director makes the experience hellish for everyone involved, or where casts and crews tear themselves apart with rivalries and resentments. I wanted Ender's Game to be a joy to work on, so that the kids especially would take away good memories of their time involved in making the movie. And, from what I could see, that's what the community of filmmakers have accomplished.
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People should just lighten the fuck up. Who cares what other people think? What, are we fascists? Everyone should think the same thing?
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May 17, 2012, 2:08 p.m. CST
i like harrison fords scifi comeback with indy 4, cowboys/aliens and now this.
by My_Parts_Are_Showing
not that they are perfect films but it's nice that he's giving what he can before he's 80. anyone know if he's still doing that cowboy vs mobsters movie?
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i've only read the comic book version. u mad orson?
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If so, he's proven he doesn't give a damn about source material. Have never heard of Ender's Game, but feel sorry for those fans with this guy at the helm.
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May 17, 2012, 2:15 p.m. CST
Orson Scott Card comes off as an asshole, and George R.R. Martin comes off as totally cool.
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
I've had a couple beers with Martin, he's a great guy. We talked about cloning human body parts, the NFL, Robert E. Howard, HBO's Rome and the girls walking by; I should have recorded the conversation, for posterity. Pretty sure Card wouldn't even want to get drunk. Arrogant asshole.
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Bigot: a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. One could argue that people who are intolerant of bigotry are they themselves bigots. I find homophobes repugnant, however, I also believe that they are entitled to their beliefs and opinions, so long as they don't try to infringe on other peoples' rights to their own life and life choices.
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May 17, 2012, 2:17 p.m. CST
i eat fish, FOX ruined Wolverine, Gavin Hood is solid, but his opinions and ideas didn't matter to the suits.
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
Hood learned a lot from that experience.
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May 17, 2012, 2:22 p.m. CST
Speaking of homosexuals, what's going on with John Travolta?
by ajit maholtra
Is he one of them?
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And Ender's Game has always been fairly over-rated. Not bad, just not THAT good.
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Last time I checked, slamming someone's religion wasn't really an enlightened thing to do. For instance, try calling someone a "Jew douchebag" and see what happens.
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Anyone saying this book is overrated is a fucking idiot, period. Especially the asshole above who called the book overrated but has only read the comicbook.<p> <p> Is there anything that exists that you assholes don't call overrated?
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So, being Mormon makes one homophobic?
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Normally the religion of said douchebag wouldn't matter, but in this case I think it is important to mention it ONLY because he is constantly "explaining" his bigotry because of what the Church of Latter Day Saints has taught him. His religion is the root cause of why he feels this way and he acknowledges that, and that should be recognized. (He still hasn't answered why HIS religion should be used to dictate the rules of other people outside of his religion, but no religious bigot has ever answered that one.)
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Breaking news....there will not be a sequel/prequel or anything otherwise in regards to a new Travolta Battlefield Earth film. We now return to your regularly scheduled program.
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And I totally agree with him. Actors who make it look easily always get disregarded by many. Ford is no exception. I hate seeing actors "act" because it completely removes me from the scene. It's not over-acting, and it's not necessarily bad, but it just comes off as fake. I rarely get that from Ford. It may not have been a great movie, but I loved him in Cowboys & Aliens. I know it's cool to grow up and trash the people you once respected, but I just don't get that childish mentality. He was brilliant, and best of all subtle, in both Witness and Mosquito Coast. Two underrated gems. Sydney Pollack said something very similar about Ford. You can see it here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdSByA6XYmQ.
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Being homophobic makes you homophobic - although being a Mormon helps, too. I won't give a dime to this piece of shit, and neither should you.
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Seriously? I expected some whittling and fabrication here and there, a la the Harry Potter film series, but this sounds ridiculous. Hopefully Card is exaggerating. What would be the point of adapting the book if you're not going to use THE SCENES? I appreciate the whole 'preserving the spirit, not the details' argument, but it sounds like Hood has really taken it to the next level. I won't be surprised if it turns out they've reworked the ending so that they can use Asa Butterfield in the sequels. Loose adaptations of the Bean and Lusitania stories might be the best we can hope for now. And why does every single article involving Orson Scott Card or Ender's Game have to turn into a gay rights wankfest?
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that's not a criticism, so am I :p Card is a Mormon douche, ummm, fuck it, I'll say it, a lot of Mormons are. Their belief system is arrogant, delusion crap and it cranks out arrogant, delusional people Garbage in, garbage out. But Card can write, Ender's Game was a favorite book of my misspent yute
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Cool; however, many of my friends are Mormon (LDS) and are not only not homophobic, but some of them are in fact homosexual. It's a misunderstanding that being Mormon makes one homophobic or anything of the sort. However, the religion does teach that same-sex relationships aren't the way of God--that isn't something to attack, just like a religion preaching that eating pork is wrong. I've found that the majority of Mormon people are understanding of homosexuality, and that many--while possibly only tollerant--aren't antagonistic. I'm not complete certain of OSC's views, but that doesn't negate his ability to write a good story. He's already received some of my money and as long as he continues to create things of value, I'll continue to pay for them.
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Fair enough, but I think he's doing a disservice to his religion, as it most certainly is not as antagonistic towards homosexuals as the media has made it seem. I'm not saying that Mormons are pro-homosexuality, as they're most certainly not, but I don't think the majority of the religion's members--nor the religion itself--is cruel or antagonistic of the homosexual subject. I could be wrong; it doesn't impact me personally very much.
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May 17, 2012, 3:03 p.m. CST
i hate harrison fords scifi comeback with indy 4, cowboys/aliens and now this.
by Simpsonian
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which parts of said religion you believe or not. It's all or nothing. If you believe a fucking scrap of a sentence in the bible/quran/mormon shit, etc. you have to believe every single other sentence in said book and abide by it. Otherwise, what's the point? You're not a real Christian or Muslim or Mormon if you can pick and choose parts of a religion you like and others you don't. So yes, if you're a Mormon, you're a fucking homophobe.
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. . . and after years and years of hype I gotta say that it is really good. Halfway through and much more intersted in what Ender's 2 siblings are up to . . .
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Oh, I was in no way insinuating that all Mormons think like this guy. My guess is that most of the younger generations are just as progressive as most crazy kids out there today. I have read opinion articles written by other Momons wishing that Card would stop referencing the Church of Latter Day Saints so much when he talks about why he is anti-gay. A good lot of them consider him an embarrassment.
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I think you are wrong. It's too bad that you have that view, because I think it probably locks you into a lot of uncomforatble situations and beliefs. A muslim that eats bacon isn't necessarily no longer a musilm. A mormon that drinks alcohol isn't necessarily no longer mormon. In fact, it's probably quite the opposite--it's a chance to improve and become better within the standings of the religion. I know a lot of mormon people; very few of them claim to be perfect within their religion, but almost all of them claim to hope to be better and work towards their goals. So, a mormon isn't a fucking homophone just because you state as much; some probably are, but your entire premise is pretty flat.
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Cool cool. I haven't heard about that (the last part) but it wouldn't surprise me. Card is also a member of the democratic party, whereas by far most mormons are considered to be conservative or belong to the republican party. Differences can exist within the realm of religion. I for one would prefer he not be adamant in putting down a person or a group for their beliefs, just like he would probably prefer the same of people not to put down his--therein lies the hypocracy, which is something mormon people are taught to be cautious of; be respectful of other's beliefs. It's a damn good guideline.
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Keanu Reeves in Chain Reaction ring a bell? Hello?
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Card believes that "liberals" would literally take over the USA and lead a pogrom against conservatives. He also wrote an article describing himself as a Democrat who was pro-right wing. Who cares what he says he is? He is a right-wing crank and deserves to be ignored.
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God I hope they didn't cut out the sex scene.
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Huh? Right-wing = bad? Intollerance for the win?
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I won! I won! What's the over/under for Harrison Ford finger points in this movie?
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Oh, you're gonna cherry pick the good parts of your religion and ignore the ones you don't like? Bullshit. Try that one with the Pope and see what he has to say about it. If you're Mormon, *at best* you're legitimizing and giving 10% of your income to a creepy and weird organization that is actively and successfully fighting homosexual rights all across the land. Buuuut... I guess it's okay for your friends to do that so long as they don't actually *believe* the parts of their bizarre little Third Testament that encourage it. Right.
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May 17, 2012, 3:50 p.m. CST
...when Ford put his hand on Butterfield's shoulder, how long it took Butterfield to glance at the hand, how long before he looked away and when the hand was withdrawn.
by HoboCode
is this The Jerry Sandusky Story?
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It's tough to take you/anyone serious when there are the following in their posts: 1-A blatant disrespect of the contextual subject, in this case mormon's and their beliefs 2-When you flat out get things wrong about the things you're complaining about The 10% goes towards building churches, helping people in need and many other important and quite honestly understandable things. Calling the religion creepy and weird is just a way of saying you don't understand it, and it doesn't appear as though you'd try. I, for one, subscribe to two religions, and I believe them both to be true. I don't follow the rules of either one 100%, and I don't think that makes me any less of a believer or member. That said, I do understand (I think) where you're coming from, and I can say that a person should be fully invested in their beliefs; but in our world, where things aren't perfect, it's less about that and more about intent and heart.
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I'll say 5 over, 3 under. I'll stick with 4 finger points.
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Who the fuck is Gavin Hood and why the fuck is he fucking this up? It's bad enough they are fucking up WWZ and now this? FUCK I hate Hollywood. Very little scenes from the book? Is this a god damn joke? Yes, by all means let's have the god damn director of the worst X-Men movie (Yes worse than fucking Ratner's) add his own scenes to a brilliantly perfect novel. Are you shitting me? I don't care if this guy directed fucking Tsotsi, god fucking dammit. This is horseshit. The book and this movie deserve better.
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You're a fucking idiot. Hey Hollywood, get this asshole to direct a 2001 remake, pronto.
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May 17, 2012, 4:01 p.m. CST
Proposition Ha8e was funded by the Mormon church. And Card is outspokenly anti-gay. Yes, 2+2= bigot.
by 3774
Despite what any whiny, indignant conservative who protests reality, because they're too stupid to understand concepts taught in any Sociology 101 class. Because statistically, they don't attend college institutions. Because college and higher education is for the 'liberal elite'. Because fear mongering, dehumanization, and moral panic based upon myths and fairy tales is where truth and 'right thinking' is at, right boys? Remember, Vote Mitt Romney : Eviscerate the Proletariat! Don't forget to go fuck yourself on the way out.
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Did he bring his same sex life-partner to the set with him?
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Okay. Thanks.
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Lots of angry people on here...pretty sad. I think it's pretty fair to say that the number of conservatives vs. liberals that attend college is irrelivant, but I don't think it's a heavy number in either direciton. Regardless, conservative mindsets aren't as closed as people tend to rant about, and I think it's actually far more likely to find a tollerant and respectful-of-others conservative than the same from a liberal. I have lots of friends on both sides; most of the time, the intollerence comes from one of the liberal friends. And it doesn't matter; if you can't even have a discussion on a public forum in a respectful manner, you prove pretty quickly to the intelligent readers what kind of a person you are; that's not a compliment.
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I stand corrected. I'm man enought to admit when I'm wrong. I looked into this and you're right.
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God, you are such a wet noodle. Lots of conservative and liberal friends? Right. You're the religious guy (the man who believes in *two* religions!) that nobody - particularly the liberals - is really *friends* friends with. You stick around in the background, neither interesting nor offensive. Sure, they add you on Facebook, but that's about as far as it goes. And as to your two religions? Just try and bring that one up with the heads of your, uh, churches. Gonna guess that they're not going to find it as nifty as you do.
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We're crazy like that
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I just want to know which religions are acceptable to mock. Mormons are clearly okay. Probably Scientologists, too. Jews? Catholics? Or are those grey areas? I know Muslims are off limits, but I need to know where the line is.
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Not wanting to be a jerk, having a diverse group of friends and believing in more than one religion does not make me a wet noodle; I'm too old to pretend that arguing rudely over the internet with people I don't know has any value--I played that game in high school back in the late 90's and it was upsetting and pathetic. I stand by my beliefs--neither of which would get an ounce of respect from almost anyone else here--and I'm doing my best to simply clear the air of ignorance and upset, something I'm clearly failing at doing. I have no problem with whatever anyone here believes, as longs as the facts are kept intact. I could say "Fuck you and your fucking fucked up views, faggot!", but that wouldn't do a damn thing for anyone other than make things even worse. The fact that I'm calm throughout this and would prefer to respect mormons--whether friends of mine or not--and non-mormons--friends or not--shows that I'm merely trying to engage in a very rational and mature discussion. Was I wrong to expect that here? I think so. After more than ten yeras of coming here, I have yet to see anything that would have paved the way for that kind of discussion. But I do expect more out of the average person. Fuck you mormons. Fuck you non-mormons. Fuck you straights. Fuck you gays. Or, let's everyone agree to disagree and try to focus on things that actually matter...whether or not the NBA needs to get after players for flopping.
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Uh... I know PLENTY of GREAT Mormons who are not douchebags. What the FUCK does that have anything to do with his douchebaggery? The guy's a douchebag. Fine. That's HIS personality and how HE interprets things. So, what, are you gonna start throwing about stuff like "BLACK douchebag" or "AMISH Douchebag" or "BUDDHIST Douchebag" or "ASIAN douchebag"? You're talking about self-importance and then you throw out ignorany labels like that? I love hypocrisy.
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May 17, 2012, 5:01 p.m. CST
Oh, and the Mormons were absolutely NOT the only ones backing up Prop8
by Kremzeek
The Catholic Church was also a HUGE backer and advocate. And there were many other church organizations involved as well. If you disagree with them all, fine. I don't really care. But quit the ignorance please.
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'I could say "Fuck you and your fucking fucked up views, faggot!", but that wouldn't do a damn thing for anyone other than make things even worse.' It would also be toothless and meaningless and I would laugh at you, since you're religious and give cover to homophobes and their homophobic religions. There's nothing a man who believes in two religions (count 'em - two!) could say to me about my beliefs that would on any level make me feel bad. He has already lost that one before he sets foot in the room. It'd be like a black guy calling a white guy honkey, or cracker. There's no actual reality to back that up that would hit a nerve on any level. And your whole "let's hold hands and get along" message is pathetic, particularly given the fact that one of the groups (at least) that you evidently find a-okay is dead-set on removing human rights from an entire group of people. Yes, I'm closed-minded for not finding *that* acceptable, like you seem to.
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May 17, 2012, 5:23 p.m. CST
Is ENDER'S GAME thinly-veiled Mormon propaganda bullshit just like that-which-shall-not-be-named (it starts with a T)? Because if it is, I'm bailing.
by Mr. Pricklepants
Also, this dude seems to be just as crazy as that bitch who wrote that-which-shall-not-be-named (it starts with a T). I guess it's a Mormon thing. Well, America. Your next president could be a Mormon. Also, dissing The Avengers does not make you look cool. Although, he did say that he enjoyed it, but he also said it was utterly unbelievable. Well, it's a comic book movie, a superhero movie, dipshit.
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It was not only the Mormon and Catholic Churches...the Black Church is very against same-sex marriage. But liberals don't go to Compton to call them haters. A combination of white guilt/tiny balls keeps them home.
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"There's nothing a man who believes in two religions (count 'em - two!) could say to me about my beliefs that would on any level make me feel bad" You clearly missed the point; I'm not trying to make you feel bad; I'm not trying to change your views either. I was hoping you could be a little accepting of the fact that I have different beliefs and that it's okay to do so. "And your whole "let's hold hands and get along" message is pathetic, particularly given the fact that one of the groups (at least) that you evidently find a-okay is dead-set on removing human rights from an entire group of people." I'm a member of no such group; again, you show you don't understand your own argument. The mormon's believe marriage should be between a man and a woman; that doesn't take away a human right to co-exsist, be in a relationship with, or anything else, rather it states that a church marriage should be between a man and a woman. I'm for gay marriage, but I understand why a religious group would want to protect what they believe is true. If you are going to argue, be much smarter about it and know your shit.
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Tools that spread the 'if only you weren't acting so uncivilized' lie are just exactly that. Tools for enforcing conservative religious order. It goes something like this. 'Yes, I don't believe gays should have the right to adopt, or marry. And yes, countless thousands have been beaten, killed, rendered jobless or homeless, but laws to protect them would be *special rights*. And as a Christian, I *love* them, just not who they are. So of course I'm not a bigot. And you reacting with anger over the intolerance and injustice is only harming you. If you didn't do that, I might change my mind.' I say again. Don't forget to go fuck yourself on the way out. It's a proven fact that the vast majority of people with a higher education are progressive. Hence the 'liberal elite' meme. And it's also a proven fact that the more education you receive, the less likely you are to believe in myths and fairy tales. Including 'god'. For fun, see how many logical fallacies religious and conservative people will throw into the thread. http://www. derailingfordummies. com/complete.html#notlistening
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The LDS church was far and away the biggest single reason Prop 8 passed. And the reason it's so bullshit was that they actively solicited donations from around the country, from people who had nothing to do with California. 3 times as many donations came in from Utah than ANY OTHER STATE. The fact is, The catholic church, and indeed many other religious institutions, issues statements in support of Prop 8, and then sort of left it up to their individual churches to do what they liked. The Mormon Church, on the other hand, had a high-powered, strategic gauntlet of advertising, canvassing, fundraising, and a campaign of disinformation that raised 22 MILLION DOLLARS in support of Prop 8. You take that away, you take away the Prop 8 victory, plain and simple. Well, that and Gavin Newsom's stupid commercial about "Like it or not, it's happening!" That was a huge blunder. Nothing gets frightened conservatives up in arms like having an uppity gay enemy to fight.
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"from people who had nothing to do with California." Probably because what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas but what happens in California spreads like a rash across the country. And yes, that Gavin Nuisance talking that kind of crap was a big help.
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I didn't pick up any mormon stuff in this book...
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Card is mormon; Ender's mom "was" mormon, but isn't devout--if memory serves. It wasn't my intention to get off topic on this, really. I find defending injustice a nice pasttime. As for the movie, I hope it's at least as good to the book as Potter and most of LOTR was.
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Enders Game (and Speaker for the Dead, and Pastwatch) are truly great books. But Card is a cunt.
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We'll skip the first point, because I think there's a mixup there. As to the second, the group to which I'm referring are the Mormons, not your own two churches. If you're cool with Mormon buddies who pay thousands of dollars a year to that organization, well... alright. I'm not. I have contempt for those people. Your argument is incredibly weak. Mormons shouldn't have to recognize gay marriage within their own institution (wrong, but... whatever), but state-sanctioned gay marriage elsewhere is fine? Alright, with you there, but the Mormons themselves sure don't seem to be following that little agreement. But not for thee, I guess.
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May 17, 2012, 6:36 p.m. CST
The mormons had it good at first. Total orgy anything goes with all the best girls of the village. But then..
by UltraTron
the troubles
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certain parts of a specific religion they subscribe to, while at the same time ignoring other elements of the same religion. If, for example, I were to believe that Jesus is the Son of God and died for our sins and that there is a heavenly afterlife awaiting me if I surrender myself to Him etc. , and LIVE MY LIFE according to that personal "truth", why would I also not be following the other parts of the bible which are a little say.. unsavoury? There's some seriously fucked up things going on involving murdering wives for not being virgins, not ever wearing two different fabrics at the same time, etc. If one part if "true" and worth living your life by, then which parts are lies? Which parts should we not follow? The ones we don't like? If your entire belief system hinges on following a set of moral "rules" laid out for you in that book in order to be saved from the fiery pits of Hell when you die, then you simply can't half-ass it. "Intent" means nothing if you don't follow the rules.
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Lately I've been coming across a lot of articles that go "It's fun but it's not high art." No shit. It was a superhero team-up movie that was well-cast, well-written, and exceptionally directed. Apparently it needed deep social commentary or philosophical musings. God forbid a commercial movie should be commercial. It was an event movie that delivered exactly what it promised. Fun. Even the Harry Potter comparison is unwarranted. That final chapter was eight movies in the making. It had a terrific emotional payoff but it took ten years to get there. I can understand not liking the Avengers. I'm sure there are valid arguments against it. I just can't stand the snobbery.
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..."The scene does not come from the book – very few of the scenes in this movie do" <p> I wanted to see the book(s) adapted - not somebody else's version of the story.
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May 17, 2012, 7:45 p.m. CST
Theres a word mormons use for the mating rituals within their community
by ajit maholtra
Wincest.
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Mormon men, you mean.
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after all nolan did for us we revert back to retardation. enjoy it dumb nerds, because tomorrow you will be crying.
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It would require massive overhaul to get it to work
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"Unfortunately, it also means that we'll see more and more and more thrown-together comic book movies with lots of characters that don't belong together, and with stories whose stupidity staggers the imagination." amen to that.
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gag on your own cocks
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May 17, 2012, 8:50 p.m. CST
Mikethespike, you are right. Only the mormon men call it that
by ajit maholtra
The women call it rape lol
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Great book, but a fucking tea party, anti-gay nutter. Look up what he does besides write books. And have you ever read anything the guy says? He's so full of himself the page almost drips with his spooge. I fucking hate him.
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May 17, 2012, 9:25 p.m. CST
Ya know, this talkback clearly shows how hateful and narrowminded most of humanity really is
by Jaka
A Mormon is no different than a Catholic, a Jew, a Muslim or an Atheist; they all choose to believe what they feel most enriches their own lives. Nobody is perfect, everybody has faults and everybody has opinions. But its getting really old seeing how much of them are filled with hatred and bile on the internet. I'm sure if you had the opportunity to be interviewed, or to have people actually care to listen to your opinions, that a good many people would hate you, too. <p> Anyway, I've known a great many Mormons over the course of my life (still do, in fact) and I always found them to be kind, generous people. To an atheist like myself their beliefs and practices are no more befuddling than any other religion.
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May 17, 2012, 9:35 p.m. CST
You claim people generalize about religion, but you generalized all of humanity
by ajit maholtra
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May 17, 2012, 10:12 p.m. CST
Orsen Scott Card (Mormon) went totally crazy after 9/11 becoming a huge fan of George W and hates Obama for the typical Foxnews reasons - guy is dead to me
by slayme
granted he's a hell of a writer - but so is Stephen King - and he's not a right wing loon - in fact King does a LOT to help his local community. Mormons have never been known to be the most sane people though - as Card has proven. Give me King any day! Oh yeah Orsen doesn't like gays and doesn't think they deserve the same rights as the rest of us. Look it up - I was shocked and saddened since his writing is so good. Oh well.
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And if that's the best response you have for what I wrote, then thank you for proving my point.
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May 17, 2012, 10:32 p.m. CST
Ok, you generalized MOST of humanity calling them narrowminded and hateful, and you think you are better than MOST of the people in this talkback
by ajit maholtra
What does that make you?
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May 17, 2012, 10:38 p.m. CST
Mormon population is 15 million, so people in this talkback criticized that many. You criticized most of humanity so that is more than 3.4 billion
by ajit maholtra
Guess who's the bigger bastard?
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...the 2nd Civil war begin? Seems like you ALL have no tolerance or respect for ANYONE who dares to disagree with you, from here. So what if O.S.C is a less than perfect human being? WE ALL ARE!!!! Picasso was a perfect asshole the way he treated ALL of his numerous women. Arty types just excude it as "he was Spanish" or "He was a great artist" but it doesn't change the fact he was very unpleasant to women, including physical abuse. BTW- humor a foreigner - WTF is the "T" reference, written by a woman? I'm thinking one thing but would like confirmation. B
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May 17, 2012, 11:18 p.m. CST
I didn't say I was better than anybody (show me where I did), and I explained, very clearly...
by Jaka
....what was meant by most people being narrowminded and hateful. All you have to do is follow the world news for a couple weeks to get a clear understanding of the point I was making. This talkback, hell, ANY internet forum, is a microcosm of that same nastiness. It's not my problem that you're choosing to ignore that very clear explanation in order to spread more hate. *shrug*
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May 17, 2012, 11:21 p.m. CST
See, that's where you and I are different. I have faith in humanity and see the good in people
by ajit maholtra
You say most of humanity is hateful because of what you see on the news? Then you have bought into the lies of the organizations that want to keep you scared and negative. Unlike you, i don't believe in organizations. I believe in people. You think you are smart but you are blind.
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May 17, 2012, 11:39 p.m. CST
OK, well, I'm not the one angrily interpreting what other people are saying to fit my own point of view
by Jaka
Accusing them of saying things they haven't said. <p> You have no idea what news sources I follow. Really. Absolutely none. <p> Do you really believe that EVERY source of news around the world - print, television and internet - are ALL lying? Do you really believe the world is all sunshine and rainbows? <p> You have no idea how negative or positive I am in my life. No idea at all. You're attacking me because I took the time to voice the opinion that we all have faults and we are all different from one another. Yet I don't see you going out of your way at all to correct any of the people who have so vehemently expressed their hatred of Mormons or others who think something different than they do. <p> I haven't insulted you once, yet you've insulted me directly at least twice, without provocation. <p> I'm not scared of anything. <p> Care to continue?
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All you see is hatred and hostility. I see a group of buddies hanging out and chatting. You should book a nice massage for yourself and get loose.
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I think people really need to stop thinking all Mormons are cookie cutter. I've been Mormon all my life and I've met many great Mormons and I've met some Mormons that are complete assholes. It's no different than in any other walk of life. There are nice Catholics and there are douchebag Catholics; there are nice Atheists and there are douchebag Atheists. Get over it. It's just a religion that believes God and Jesus are separate divine beings and that we humans all have eternal souls that existed prior to this life and will continue afterward in a path of eternal progression. Sure Mormons may have some odd theories and some controversial policies but you'll find that amongst every religion on the planet. Get over it.
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May 18, 2012, 1:36 a.m. CST
For the record, mainstream Judaism has *no* demand of blind mindless faith.
by s0nicdeathmonkey
In fact, there is no one religious hierarchy. You don't have to believe that every story is true or that every story is equal. Hell, all the big heroes in the Torah get in argument with YHWH and *win*. Christianity was formed by Constantine to control and unify the Roman empire in about 300 C.E. so, blind allegiance was useful. Judaism absolutely does not share this trait.
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May 18, 2012, 3:31 a.m. CST
Mormen are DOUCHeBAGS. However Mormon women are usually blond, buxom and usually let me do them anally because of some weird loophole in their made up religion :)
by the Green Gargantua
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May 18, 2012, 3:40 a.m. CST
OSC's almost insane Mormon views make his fiction fascinating
by David Cloverfield
I never read fantasy and science fiction with such strong and honest emphasis on family values. (Especially the Ender sequels and the Alvin series.) His views couldn't be further away from mine, but his work really tears me out of my comfort zone, and from what I expect from sci-fi and fantasy. Most genre heroes pop out from the authors mind, fully grown. There may be a distant mother or father (maybe someone to avenge) but they are not real characters. In OSC's sci-fi Family is pushed into the center. His Speaker for the Dead series reads like a family novel detalining generations, but in an insane science fiction world. Do I hate the things he says about gays? Yes. Are those same views make me interested in his work? Yes. So let the crazy old religious nut vent. It makes him really entertaining.
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That is so completely disingenuous. "Seems like you ALL have no tolerance or respect for ANYONE who dares to disagree with you, from here." Right. If you define a disagreement as disapproval of a situation wherein one group collects 10% of their followers' incomes and uses that money to strip human rights from their fellow citizens, then I guess I *do* disagree with the Church of Mormon. I guess you might even say that I'm an intolerant bigot. Oh wait, no - that's the Mormons. And if you're one of the "good" Mormons? Tough bananas, Binky. Stop giving thousands of dollars to your Church every year, and then we'll see if you have a leg to stand on. It's like saying, "I'm no fan of that Holocaust, but I'm going to give money to the Nazis." No, sorry. Doesn't work like that. You can't financially support this organization and let it do things in your name and then make out as though you're a good guy. Deep down - in that same corner of your soul where you *know* dressing up in fancy underwear, baptizing people's dead relatives without consent and collecting an underground fortress full of genealogical records is fucking weird - you know it's wrong.
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they can live together happily.
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do you go to mcdonalds?
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They barely tolerate a Black Pres. (And he's only HALF BLACK.) But then again, when you have a belief system that involves Magic Underwear and Poligamy,etc that shit's not gonna fly here.
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This movie is going to suck a big giant turd. Sigh. All these years only for this movie to end up in the hands of this hackasaurus rex. Ugh.
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just how much is the question.
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May 18, 2012, 10:36 a.m. CST
Ehh, this movie will bomb, big time. And yet, Orci will still find work!
by Just_Some_Guy
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May 18, 2012, 11:23 a.m. CST
So Orson didn't sound that upset that he's getting screwed.
by impossibledreamers
I mean after all, they buy the title - toss out his work but if the movie sucks - its on him.
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A group of buddies, hanging out, spreading hatred and intolerance. Once again, thank you for proving my point. And once again, stop TELLING ME what I'M doing. More than anything, that is what shows your clear lack of understanding in regards to what is being said here, as well as the world at large. Plus, its annoying.
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May 18, 2012, 11:52 a.m. CST
Hey Bob, believe it or not, if this is not an adaptation of the book...
by Jaka
....as Card is clearly implying, then I have no desire to see the movie. And I'm a huge, I mean HUGE fan of the books. I have ALL OF THEM on a shelf about four feet away from me as I type this.
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May 18, 2012, 12:12 p.m. CST
Only half right? You know that could be interpeted two different ways.
by Just_Some_Guy
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May 18, 2012, 12:13 p.m. CST
EG is a fantastic book. The idea of most of the film not being straight from the book is highly disturbing.
by kevred
I understand that, due to the nature of the storytelling, there would have to be some creativity involved in presenting everything visually. But there's so much essential material in the book that I'd hate to think that much of it is being cut or substituted with other, invented material. I don't like Card's present politics and homophobia more than anyone else, but this is an absolute gem of a book, a classic. Along with 'Speaker for the Dead', it creates a highly unusual tale of childhood, innocence, and understanding, framed against the blunt, harsh limitations of how societies have evolved to function. It deserves a dynamite adaptation that preserves the heart and soul of those gentle observations.
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You keep saying wrong things and then say, thank you for proving my point lol. Now you are claiming to understand the world better than me. Why? Because I wont be simplistic and negative and say most of humanity is hateful and narrow-minded? You and I see the world through different paradigms, but you insist yours is right. That way, when the world shits on you, you can say to the world, thank you for proving me right, lolol.
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May 18, 2012, 12:36 p.m. CST
Let's remake this fucker before the original comes out.
by TheMachinist
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May 18, 2012, 1:24 p.m. CST
boborci, could you please explain what made it necessary to replace most of the book's scenes?
by flax
Particularly in light of the Harry Potter series, which is successful both in its own right and and as a representation of what Rowling wrote? Because to me--someone who truly hopes for ENDER'S GAME and its sequels to receive good adaptations--Card's comments on the script to which you contributed are really concerning.
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I made my point very clearly, several times. I hope you have a good time sitting around with your friends, disparaging other peoples personal decisions this weekend. Peace.
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May 18, 2012, 2:07 p.m. CST
jaka, now you are lying. We all know you read my last post. If you hadn't you wouldn't have responded.
by ajit maholtra
You just cant handle the truth so you are going to pretend you didnt read it.
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..you wouldnt even return to this article to begin with. I feel sorry for this jaka. He has given up on the world.
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May 18, 2012, 3:04 p.m. CST
For a Guy that's supposed to be handling multiple projects, it appears that Bobby has too much time on his hands by frequently posting on the Talkbacks.
by Stalkeye
You should not only be banging out scripts, but banging plenty of hot women due to your fame. yet he's on AICN. mmkayy..
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May 18, 2012, 7:40 p.m. CST
I bet the movie is tailor made to appeal to twilight fans
by dioxholsters ghost
Add a love connection, remove the politics, add the facebook, remove the ugly aliens, add supervillain
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May 18, 2012, 8:22 p.m. CST
ajit_maholtra - lol , nah dude, I still haven't expanded it. Believe it or not, you don't matter to me in the slightest.
by Jaka
Also, why are you so focused on my nuts, dude? I'm coming back to this thread because it's a public forum where I've left comments. Comments addressed to people OTHER than YOU! People like, ya know, the guy producing the movie in question. This is a REALLY simple concept to grasp, yet it seems to be beyond you. <p> Lastly, now you've repeatedly insulted me AND called me a liar. Yeah dude, you're a great human being. We should all be more like you.
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Everything important is in the short story, but it leaves out stuff like the virtual reality world that's influenced by the Buggers and the surviving larva. It's just darker. Unfortunately, the sequels are dependent upon the events of the novel, so that's probably the basis.
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May 18, 2012, 10:15 p.m. CST
What? What happened to your nuts? This jaka is so weird. Also he has been caught lying again
by ajit maholtra
He says he's not reading my comments but he keeps replying to things I said. Like I said why does he keep coming back here if he doesn't want to read my comments, and he gave an answer that he wants to read other peoples comments. But that means he read what I said! I think there's something wrong with this jaka. Something's wrong with his brain.
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both writers whose work is pretty much hated by the fanboys, but they're given property after property of classic sci-fi and comic franchises to fuck up i mean, this guy's IMDB credits... It starts with Xena Warrior Princess and ends with that Elizabeth Banks cuddle fest. I mean, to be fair, Transformers one was a pretty awesome, fun popcorn movie, but... these movies are not sci-fi, they are populist fast food the way Independence Day was. Why the fuck has geek culture ascended this way so we could watch everything dumbed down to USA Network levels?
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May 19, 2012, 11:30 p.m. CST
giant lens flare on the poster of the new Orci/Kutzman movie-
by sasquatch_with_a_swatch_watch
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm1157149952/tt1716777 Jesus... haha Looks like a Target commercial for bedsheets
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