Movie News

Quint has a theory about a certain spoilery plot point in The Avengers he wants to share...

Published at: May 12, 2012, 5:52 a.m. CST by quint

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here. I think enough time has passed since the release of The Avengers that I can open up a discussion about a certain plot line that has been occupying a little space in the back of my mind since seeing the film.

This is a spoilery pondering, so if you somehow ignored the big red box around this article’s headline consider this your last warning that you may not want to continue if you happen to be one of the 27 people left in this world that has yet to see The Avengers.

There were a lot of surprises in Joss Whedon’s The Avengers. The stinger at the end, promising an even more epic Avengers 2, is one. Mark Ruffalo’s low-key, but fantastic turn as Banner (and, it should be noted, the Hulk as well since he mo-capped every bit of “The Other Guy”) is another.

One surprise that wasn’t so pleasant was the death of key figure in the Marvel universe. It’s a great moment, the character in question gets to show amazing heroics and even a little humor in the face of a painful passing. His death means something and caused gasps in both screenings I’ve been at.

But something has been gnawing at the back my mind since seeing this moment, so I’d like to vocalize it, if I may.

I don’t think Agent Coulson is dead and, further, I don’t think it should be looked at as a cop out should my theory prove to be correct.

 

 

Forgive me if this is something that has already been discussed ad nauseam in the talkback and the overall geek community. I have not seen such discussions, but I admittedly haven’t been looking very hard.

Let’s take a step back and look at his big scene. It has everything a great death scene for a beloved character should have. Loki becomes even more horrible for killing Coulson, long described as Marvel Films’ “glue,” his death means something to the story and Coulson gets to go out packing a wallop with that big ass gun he dug up. He gets his moment and doesn’t go out like a bitch.

In fact he believes in The Avengers so much that his final words are about his sacrifice finally getting them to work together as a team, one final moment where he gets to be Marvel’s glue.

On the surface, it’s a noble death and seems pretty damn final. There’s no doubt in my mind that Agent Coulson slips away before the medical team gets there.

So, why don’t I take this scene at face value? It seems pretty evident he dies, right?

What makes me question it isn’t that whole sequence, but something that happens later in the movie. It’s those bloody Captain America cards that give me pause. Nick Fury uses them as a symbol to give our mourning group of superheroes the push that Coulson hoped his death would achieve, to make them put their egos aside and come together as a fighting unit.

The trouble is Fury is fudging the truth a bit here. Agent Hill informs us that those cards were not in Agent Coulson’s pocket, but in his locker. Fury decided it wasn’t enough that Coulson died at Loki’s hands; that Fury needed something to underline his sacrifice, something that reminded both Tony Stark and Steve Rogers at what was truly lost when Coulson died. Phil Coulson wasn’t just a good agent, but a good soul, an enthusiastic fan and someone who had total faith in this team solving the world-threatening problem facing all of humanity.

Here’s the rub: If Fury was willing to tell a little lie to manipulate his bickering team of superheroes, what makes us think he wouldn’t tell a bigger one?

 

 

Think about it. Coulson slipped away right when the medical team got there and everything that follows we don’t see. We have to take it on Fury’s word that the medical team couldn’t save him.

Let’s ignore the fact that we’re in a comic book world where almost any death can be reversed. This cloaked hovering battleship is top of the line tech. SHIELD itself has every resource at its disposal, seemingly unlimited funds and access to just about any piece of tech known or unknown by mankind.

It’s not out of the realm of possibility that this medical team has resources they’d need to save a man punctured through the chest.

We know that good ol’ Phil wasn’t hit in the heart or else he wouldn’t have lived long enough to blast Loki through the wall and tell Fury to make his death count. So he most likely had a punctured lung. Granted, he’s not going to be feeling very good, but it’s a survivable wound, especially if a crackerjack medical team with a state of the art sick bay at their disposal were there within minutes of the wound being inflicted.

For the sake of argument, say I’m right and Agent Coulson pops up in Iron Man 3 or The Avengers 2 with a sheepish smile and an apology for not being dead on his lips. Wouldn’t that negate the impact of his sacrifice in The Avengers?

I’m very critical of cop outs in storytelling. It’s a huge pet peeve of mine. If you make a big decision and don’t stick to it I’m the first one that gets pissed off about it. After years of swearing off Marvel comics the Civil War storyline brought me back. Shit was going down, shit they couldn’t walk back like Spider-Man revealing his secret identity to the public.

I naively started to become invested again, spoiled by Robert Kirkman’s Walking Dead books that might tease a little bit, but never seem to have any problem committing to their bigger decisions. Then what do they do? Pull some Mephesto rewriting of history shit right after The Civil War is over and that was it for me. They couldn’t even give Peter Parker being outed a year. Then Cap came back to life and I was done with these books again.

If there are never any consequences, then the drama doesn’t work and I can’t invest in a story emotionally. When I first began to consider that Agent Coulson might not be dead my initial reaction wasn’t pretty for just those reasons.

However, the more I thought about it, the more intrigued by the idea I became. Instead of seeing it as a cheap emotional cop out I began to see it as a weakness in the Avengers as a team.

If the series follows Star Wars, Lord of the Rings and just about any definition of the three act structure, Avengers 2 is going to be a darker film. The heroes are going to be going up against a ruthless adversary in Thanos, they’re going to be tested as a group like never before. Their strength is in being united, however the seeds of distrust are already being sown in the first film with Fury hiding SHIELD’s development of Hydra/Tesseract-inspired weaponry.

I don’t think that deception is quite group-splitting enough, especially since it’s clear that Fury was doing everything in his power to keep the council from unleashing weapons of mass destruction.

However, deceiving the group, making them all think a good friend had died in order to manipulate them into doing what he wanted would be a huge blow to their already shaky trust in Nick Fury.

This deception opens up some really fertile, dramatic ground for The Avengers to deal with and, in a way, is even more interesting than the stakes having been raised by Coulson’s death.

That’s why I wouldn’t view it as a cop out if my theory pans out. If it was all set up to explore the impact of distrust within a combat unit when they can’t trust their commander, then I think it could be worth the deception by Whedon and Co. In a way, Fury would have betrayed us, the audience, as well, which makes us immediately empathize with Stark and Rogers, who would be the most furious at the manipulation.

Or maybe I just love Clark Gregg’s portrayal of Agent Coulson too much and am in a state of denial, pulling at straws no matter how flimsy to give me hope that I’ll see Phil Coulson on the screen again.

Time will tell, but I wanted to throw that out there, get it out of the ol’ brainpan so I can stop obsessing over it.

Maybe I’m wrong. Coulson could be truly and permanently gone and that’ll be okay because his death wasn’t wasted and it was executed extremely well by Whedon and his crew. But maybe I’m right… just maybe…

 

Photo by @ramdonomo.

-Eric Vespe
”Quint”
quint@aintitcool.com
Follow Me On Twitter

Readers Talkback

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  • May 12, 2012, 5:59 a.m. CST

    No...FLYNN LIVES damnit!

    by tylerzero

  • May 12, 2012, 6:04 a.m. CST

    coulson as jarvis ?

    by r1g0r

    this movie made the first mention of the ubiquitous LMD technology from the comics. clark looks amazingly like the butler from the comics. clark seems VERY unphased by losing his job. hmmm...

  • May 12, 2012, 6:05 a.m. CST

    2nd

    by kingralphuk

    and I still disliked The Avengers. One word for those of you who justify it as being a great film because of the box office it has..........Titanic.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:06 a.m. CST

    *ugh*

    by chronicallydepressedlemming

    I suppose unless you saw his entrails being spread across the floor he must be alive right? Fuck me I hate this fan-fiction shit. It's "syfo-dias sounds a bit like sidious" all over again. He's dead. He had a good death. He's dead. Just because you liked him doesn't mean he's alive. He's dead. Him being alive would cheapen the whole thing. He's dead.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:06 a.m. CST

    Coulson lives!

    by TheMadTitan

    He's also in the new, (but crap), Spidey cartoon.

  • That, and it showed Nick Fury could lose control and have a fuck up on his hands. I think you're reading to much into it.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:07 a.m. CST

    He's dead Jim.

    by UltimaRex

    They didn't show any more because A) it's a PG-13 and B) time constraints. The deleted scenes will be interesting...

  • May 12, 2012, 6:08 a.m. CST

    If they are going to bring him back....

    by whofan71

    I would have prefered they have set that up in the "after the credits" scene in some clever, funny way. I think it would have washed down better like that rather than trying to sneak him in halfway thru the second movie.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:08 a.m. CST

    that death scene has the corniest

    by JAMF

    dialogue i've ever heard which is probably why you're in denial. "sorry BOSS the guy RABBITED!" "just stay AWAKE!" "eyes on ME!" "i'm CLOCKIN' out!" "NOT an option!" "it's OKAY BOSS!" reminds me of nick frost's death scene in shaun of the dead. but where was fury's "NOOOOOOOO!!!!"

  • May 12, 2012, 6:09 a.m. CST

    Could have gone something like...

    by whofan71

    Fury walks into a hospital room. You don't see Coulson, but you hear him ask "did it work" or something like that. Fury says that it did, and Coulson warns him about how pissed they are going to be.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:09 a.m. CST

    I'm of two minds about this.

    by davidwebb

    On one hand, he should absolutely stay dead. Bringing him back would absolutely negate doing it in the first place, make it seem like a cheap bit of plotting. On the other, we're talking about Marvel here. They've been killing characters and bringing them back for fifty years. So long as they don't go over the top and make him the new Winter Soldier or something. Have him disappear abroad for a year or two, quietly recruiting for the Initiative. Clark Gregg is all kinds of awesome too, so any kind of return would be a welcome one.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:14 a.m. CST

    the reason he's staying dead is because 'how I met your mother' chick

    by chronicallydepressedlemming

    is replacing him the future movies.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:15 a.m. CST

    had the same thoughts

    by stvnhthr

    Walking out of the theater I had the same thoughts. The rule is if you don't see the body (and that doesn't ever really apply with comics) you can't be sure seeing a death means the character is dead. It was left either way-he could come back or be dead. That got me wondering, what if Coulson became a new character-you have a military man who would sacrifice anything to become a hero. What if he was offered the chance to be "born again" or have his body be used in a new super soldier program. What if the program screwed him up and he became like Nuke from Frank Miller's Born Again. All the pieces are there for a sympathetic fallen hero/villain.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:17 a.m. CST

    Bring Syrio-Forel as well

    by Wyrdy the Gerbil

    I wouldn't feel cheated if Coulson was brought back,we didn't see him die so the possibility has to be there

  • May 12, 2012, 6:34 a.m. CST

    It's like you've never heard of Joss at all!

    by MemBirdman

    He kills people for plot points. It's what he does. Maybe Colson comes back (and also would have no problem with it as I've loved Gregg since Sports Night), but gun to my head, I think he's dead-dead.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:35 a.m. CST

    It was a great scene..

    by bohdi71

    Joss excells at those darker moments, he's not afraid to kill of major characters...

  • May 12, 2012, 6:40 a.m. CST

    He served his purpose

    by Logan_1973

    And that purpose ended when the team finally assembled. Let's not cheapen his efforts with a lame ressurrection.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:42 a.m. CST

    Starks throwaway line about a LIFE MODEL DECOY

    by V'Shael

    would be another way out. All it takes is to introduce LMD's into the mainstream marvel movies.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:44 a.m. CST

    Corny Dialogue?

    by symon

    Well, it does sound like shit with jamf's ridiculously random EMPHASIS! And his last line isn't "It's okay boss." He said "It's okay boss, this would never have worked if they didn't have something..." (to avenge) Moron.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:47 a.m. CST

    by sugar_tits

    I'm so bored with people thinking Fury faked his death because of the cards. The blood on the cards showed how, when everyone was emotional over losing Coulson, he was already using it to further his agenda, despite him being closer to Coulson then any of them. Undoing the death would negate the whole thing, and would be pointless!

  • May 12, 2012, 6:53 a.m. CST

    Vision

    by Perceptor

    My buddy and I have discussed this and it's possible that Pym is on S.H.I.E.L.D.'s medical staff and it's possible that perhaps we've already seen who it is that may play Vision onscreen. Imagine what kind of emotional effect Vision would have on the rest of the team. He would be Coulson but much colder. It would be akin to how Robocop was Alex Murphy and though he had memories of his past life, his current state prevented others from relating to him.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:01 a.m. CST

    Maybe WASH lives.

    by johnnybronto

    .... no.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:02 a.m. CST

    Vision wouldntbe a bad fit

    by j2talk

  • May 12, 2012, 7:09 a.m. CST

    Had the same thought today

    by Glen

    I had the same thought last night. Understanding that Fantastic 4 and Human Torch are w/ Fox, not Disney, for now. I started thinking about how they would work Vision into the movie Universe. Edgar Wright is doing Ant-Man (due out 2014). Pym created Ultron then Ultron goes rogue. He creates Vision to kill Pym. Vision was created with the mind of (then dead) Wonder Man and the body of the original Human Torch android. Yes, I know that's not the Human Torch in the FF, but that's potentially a legal battle U loose, so if you can't use Torch in Disney movies hmmmm... So what if the plot for Ant-Man introduces Vision as a bad guy, initially (like in the comic). Hank and Janet fight him and during the film he discovers the truth behind his creation and realizes that Ultron is manipulating him and then helps out Hank and Janet (or The Avengers in Avengers 3, perhaps) fight Ultron (like in the comic)? Could Marvel have thought this far in advance for the films in casting... Here's a comparison I made: http://www.flickr.com/photos/78374092@N03/7181419790/in/photostream Notice how close the face is??? Thoughts?

  • May 12, 2012, 7:15 a.m. CST

    captain marvel....

    by vicmackey1268

    Duh.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:20 a.m. CST

    Jesus Christ he's dead.

    by Brice Gilbert

    Get over it.

  • Someone up above mentioned Vision. That'd be cool. I think Pym'll show up next time too.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:24 a.m. CST

    TWO-FACE IS ALIVE

    by MERV

    Yeah but nah but yeah...the way the coin falls on the good side and shit and yeah... Coulson is dead. Or he's on an island somewhere with Bambi's mum.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:29 a.m. CST

    Quint, great theory.

    by Greg McCambley

    And you're not the only one believing that Coulson isn't really gone. Something else that struck me when I watched the Avengers was Tony's mention of Life Model Decoys. Anyone who knows SHIELD history in the comics knows LMDs were the backbone of the agency. Since Tony tells us that LMDs exist in the Avengers movie universe, it makes me wonder if SHIELD already has them. If that is the case, then that opens yet another wide range of possibilities. For example, what if Agent Coulson, the glue holding the Avengers together, turns out never to have existed at all? What if he was always a constructed ID put together by Fury (and Fury alone) for the sole purpose of uniting the Avengers? Imagine their reactions if this was ever discovered. Just a thought.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:30 a.m. CST

    I want to see Taskmaster.

    by Greg McCambley

    That is all.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:33 a.m. CST

    LMD

    by jimbojones123

    Thought Fury was using one when he got shot. Am 100% sure Coulson was using one. Fury has been killed so many times in the comics. Maybe more than any other character in comic history just to end up as a LMD.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:34 a.m. CST

    Uh no, he's dead.

    by vadakinX

    This is ridiculous. Go back and watch the film (seriously, do it. It's awesome) and watch the death scene. Look how long Whedon holds the shot when Coulson dies. It's twice as long as it needs to be. Why? Because Whedon is making a statement that this guy is dead. D.E.D. I mean D.E.A.D. In fact I remember watching it and thinking that it was starting to get a little uncomfortable because the shot went on for so long.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:36 a.m. CST

    People saying Whedon kills off characters

    by TBYITBSITBH

    *Spoilers to follow for Buffy, Angel, and their comics* yeah, he does - but then he's brought em back a few times, too. Which sometimes was fine and other times felt cheap, or at least cheapened the stakes going forwards. I mean he killed and resurrected Buffy! and I was ok with that cos a) the season 5 finale is epic, and b) it set up a lot of great stuff for subsequent seasons, and c) what else was he gonna do? hah (although if anyone could continue a show called Buffy The Vampire Slayer with no Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I guess it'd be Whedon.) Also, people dicussing LMDs - indeed, don't forget the Buffy-bot, who stood in for Buffy before she came back. Whedon also killed and resurrected Spike. And though Fred is adamantly, irrevocably killed in Angel, I believe Joss intended for her to come back in some fashion if they got season 6 greenlit. And this is a person whose SOUL was supposedly obliterated, but there ya go. So. Yeah. It being written by Whedon isn't necessarily the best argument that he's dead-dead for good dead hah. IMO ;) bringing Coulson back as Vision or something cool would be fine I think, having him just turn up as Coulson going SURPRISE! would be cheap and shitty. Esp if it's done in the next Avengers movie - over the course of a series is one thing but resurrecting a character in a movie is gonna mean nobody will buy any other death in that said movie. Which I for one hope there is, cos...STAKES, man! ya gotta have em

  • May 12, 2012, 7:36 a.m. CST

    honestly.. i had the same thought

    by mcgillj

    When Coulson is wounded he says "make it count". They cut to the bridge.. everything else is only what Fury says. I like Coulson. I do, but there is some value in this theory. Although i think we have to worry more about the mysterious council than Fury.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:37 a.m. CST

    Coulson's girlfriend is a cellist.

    by Volllllume3

    Which is a known cellist in the world of the Avengers? Wanda Maximoff a.k.a. The Scarlet Witch. It's so painfully obvious that Coulson's going to become Vision. And they need some new blood if they ever want to take on Thanos. Unless they severely underpower him.

  • And it would be a cop out. Joss always kills the fan favorite characters. I'm still not over Wesley Wyndham-Pryce.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:55 a.m. CST

    Clark Gregg as VISION...

    by Mikey Wood

    ...is an AWESOME idea. PHIL COULSON as VISION is incredibly stupid. They already teased Horton's Human Torch android in IRON MAN 2, there was that throwaway line about "life model duplicates" which, like all throw-away lines in these big comic book movies will be latched onto by geekdom and scrutinized eight ways to Thursday, but MAYBE... Maybe the LMD's are variations of the android tech and they use one of Coulson to develop VISION? That would be pretty neat.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:07 a.m. CST

    @volllllume3 I like the connections you're drawing.

    by pizzatheface

    Joss Whedon knows his Marvel comics. The line "court death" on the stinger shows this. Who else would smile at the chance to literally "court death"?

  • May 12, 2012, 8:14 a.m. CST

    Three words: LIFE MODEL DECOY

    by Chris

  • May 12, 2012, 8:17 a.m. CST

    He's not coming back. R.I.P

    by Cobb05

    That's why Cobie Smulders was in the movie, to pass the torch to. To have him come back is stupid. He went out in a blaze of glory. He got the Avengers to avenge him. He are a nice arc. If you bring him back, it makes there be no consiquences. If people can just come back, there's no drama. Just like if Han did die in Empire, it would've made a huge impact on Jedi. You lose someone you like and it makes you want the bad guys to pay.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:17 a.m. CST

    LMD

    by Dazzler69

    Right that's the easy way to bring him back, or that he is one, or made like a line up of them to be disposable. Life model decoys.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:18 a.m. CST

    by MikeTheSpike

    "Quint has a theory"? How is this a theory? It's just some baseless hunch you have.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:22 a.m. CST

    @Mikeywood & @volllllume3 (re: Vision)

    by Glen

    I think Coulson makes complete sense in the the MOVIE Universe (see my post above). Especially in Ant-Man. Here's the comparison I made: http://www.flickr.com/photos/78374092@N03/7181419790/in/photostream Faces are very close. @Mikeywood I don't recall Witch playing cello. I could be wrong. The only character that played was Kate Bishop, and that'd be kinda sick as she was a teen. lol

  • May 12, 2012, 8:26 a.m. CST

    come back as vision(spoiler)

    by klytusnotdead

    And he haphazardly attacks Thanos with his new found powers, only to have Thanos kill him again just like in Infinity.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:29 a.m. CST

    Thanos must be going after the infinity gauntlet

    by Cobb05

    Cause if he already had it and goes up against the Avengers, they wouldn't be able to stop him. I read somewhere that in this Marvel universe, Odin is the one who is behind everything. He sent the Teseract to Earth in Captain America and he sends the gauntlet to Earth in the Avengers. But the interesting thing is maybe they didn't mean this Avengers movie. Maybe they meant the sequel. I looked it up. Branagh said it. It's on the tribal page for Thor on imdb.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:39 a.m. CST

    Professor Horton's Android ...

    by VideoVorlon

    ... was already seen in the background of the World's Fair scene in Captain America: The First Avenger. Just add Coulson and you have the Vision.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:43 a.m. CST

    agent coulson isnt dead. hes uncle ben!!

    by vulturess

    who said coulson is human?

  • May 12, 2012, 8:44 a.m. CST

    Coulson will be back, and Loki will redeem himself.

    by Ironhelix

    Sheesh, are you guys new here?

  • May 12, 2012, 8:46 a.m. CST

    He'll be back

    by The Funketeer

    Marvel just introduced him both in the comic books and on the Ultimate Spider-Man animated series and they're all about synergy right now. I loved Avengers but his death was one of the little things that bothered me. I got what they were going for but if he was going to come back, he should have done it at the end of the movie, not in another one.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:53 a.m. CST

    Infinity Gauntlet already turned up in Thor, right?

    by veteran_of_mu

    And with that you can have Coulson, alive, dead, or turned into any superhero you like. And ... I like him as Vision.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:55 a.m. CST

    Coulson "dying" was a Marvel call more Vision proof?

    by Glen

    Read the quote from Joss here... http://io9.com/5909088/joss-whedon-explains-why-he-had-to-do-unspeakable-things-to-one-character-on-the-avengers

  • May 12, 2012, 8:59 a.m. CST

    I don't recall...

    by Pimpi_Longjohnson

    Fury actually saying he was "dead", only that he was "down" and "gone". Leaves some wriggle room for a return if they choose.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:02 a.m. CST

    No he's deader than corduroy.

    by Dolmes

    And he asked for more money this time round due to having a larger role. Robert Downey Jr. don't come cheap you know.

  • But seriously, I liked Coulson, but I rather him remain dead. Death in comics have become a cheap, meaningless gimmick as you know the character will be revived sooner or later in a contrived way. I don't want that for the Marvel movies.

  • When I watched it last Friday on opening night I took Coulson's death at face value and was pretty bummed about it. However, on a second viewing I concluded that the door is open for them to bring Coulson back. Now it's time for people to start peppering Whedon with, "Is Coulson really dead, or is Nick Fury faking it?" questions. Let the games begin.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:22 a.m. CST

    I'm with you Quint ...

    by DrMorbius

    Not on the Coulson dead or alive thing ... but with Marvel, and comics in general ... The Spiderman BRAND NEW DAY, BRAVE NEW WORLD (or whatever it was called) was the last straw ... like my navel ...I'm outie ...

  • May 12, 2012, 9:24 a.m. CST

    He's DEADer than Zed

    by GulDucati

    He's dead, Whedon just wanted us to have this fanboy bickering about it.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:26 a.m. CST

    Why he's not alive:

    by chronicallydepressedlemming

    He's a minor character. Just because he got a line or two in the other movies does not make him on par with the Avengers themselves. Marvel were not going to let the writers kill off a major character, but there needed to be a sacrifice to move the plot forward. Whedon can write great dialogue for characters minor or major to make you like them. Coulson was a minor character that got in the spotlight to make you care enough about him, so that when he died IT MATTERED. Just enough to make the plot work and for us to believe the Avengers cared he was dead. That's his entire role, which is why we were getting the girl SHIELD agent thrown at us a lot. They were trickling the next Coulson to us.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:46 a.m. CST

    Buffy´s Mom Lives

    by CuervoJones

  • May 12, 2012, 9:47 a.m. CST

    That guy who said *Jesus Christ, he's dead*

    by gotilk

    The irony, I think you missed it.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:47 a.m. CST

    Anyanka Lives!

    by CuervoJones

  • May 12, 2012, 9:51 a.m. CST

    They mentioned Colson dating a cellist TWICE in the move.

    by dixieflyer

    There is no doubt in my mind Vision and Scarlet Witch are going to be in Avengers 2 and Colson will be Vision.....after the Ant Man movie...of course.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:56 a.m. CST

    Egh. I'm also split on this.

    by Larry Sellers

    I know this might be completely moot, but Gregg is signed for more movies. This could mean nothing, because that contract was back during Iron Man 2 or something. What irks me about Coulson living is that while I would welcome the character's return, I wouldn't be thrilled about the explanation. No matter what it is. It had better be a major fucking plot point if they're going to cheapen something that set in motion the final act of the first movie.

  • May 12, 2012, 10:11 a.m. CST

    HOLY SHIT - NICK FURY SAID HE "LOST HIS GOOD EYE"!!!

    by Darth Philbin

    ...REGARDING COULSON'S DEATH!!! EYESIGHT = VISION!!! HOLY FUCKING SHITCOCKS I AM A FAT NERD!!!

  • May 12, 2012, 10:13 a.m. CST

    xander lying to buffy

    by alcool9968

    Reminds me of the infamous lie Xander tells Buffy during season 2 right before she confronts Angel, when he says that Willow's message to her was "kick his ass" instead of revealing that they were going to recurse Angel (her plan of action could have changed then, but then of course she ends up killing him right after he is re-souled)

  • May 12, 2012, 10:13 a.m. CST

    He's DEFINITELY dead

    by 2soon2eat

    He could still come back as Vision, or some kind of android or an on-line simulation. But his death is not part of some conspiracy...

  • May 12, 2012, 10:22 a.m. CST

    tylerzero

    by Franck

    I can confirm. Alive and well. Question is... Define L.I.F.E. in the Tron Universe.

  • May 12, 2012, 10:24 a.m. CST

    Coulson will be alive after the Gods resuscitate him

    by Franck

    Hmmm...let me think of a God that would fit the profile. Obviously.

  • I think he's dead, but a decoy was made that may return as The Vision.

  • May 12, 2012, 10:39 a.m. CST

    Coulson will be an avatar for Captain Marvel...

    by Dlgothv

    He'll be resurrected in A2, help fight Thanos, and those events will lead to A3 - a Kree/Skrull/Sh'iar war with the Earth caught in the middle. Just my prediction...

  • http ://tinyurl. com/72stdwn 1.) He states that he's signed for six pictures, but... 2.) He confirms he will *not* be in any of the upcoming individual sequels, and... 3.) He gets squirmy and nervous about answering which new movies he will be in, making a joke that the studio would kill him. It's pretty convincing that he's going to be Vision. You're welcome.

  • May 12, 2012, 10:40 a.m. CST

    Heres a point you missed, Quint

    by Logan_1973

    He needs to stay dead because the Let's Do It For Phil is the battle cry which should resonant thru future films. Bring him back that goes away. What do they have to fight for then?

  • May 12, 2012, 10:43 a.m. CST

    Coulson is an LMD

    by leroyspoboys

    Always has been. That theory has been around for years as an explanation as to how he can be in so many films at once. He'll show up in Avengers 2. Neither SHIELD nor Coulson are necessary to tie the single character films together anymore, everyone knows they'll all be pointing towards 'A2' anyway. (Yes 'A2' or 'A²' will be the teaser poster at next years Comic-Con, count on it).

  • May 12, 2012, 10:47 a.m. CST

    Oh he's dead...

    by Juaners

    On thing Joss Whedon isn't afraid to do is kill off characters, if you have any doubt just watch Buffy or Angle or Firefly or hell even Dr. Horrible. Each will prove the man loves to make you care about a character only to kill them off. Normally I would agree it would be a cheat (although they've laid the ground work with all of Fury's half truths) but since I like the character so much it would be on I would welcome.

  • I've always thought he was just a government stooge and I never paid much attention to his character in any of the other films nor his death in this. In fact everyone in SHEILD is kind of a dick in every iteration I've seen involving them and perhaps Avengers was the first time I've seen any attempt to portray them as anything but government stooges, and totally incompetent and yet overconfident compared to the superbeings they vainly attempt to either imprison, kill or manipulate.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:15 a.m. CST

    Coulson will be back.

    by Mark

    for the simple reason hes signed by Marvel to do 2 or 3 more movies. We will be seeing him again in some form.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:23 a.m. CST

    My take or wish

    by Marc

    They can set his return, tease it for several movies, and make it worth it! The vision could work but if he pops up in the next movie this loses weight. And he WILL come back, im sure of it, they created a big chance to use this strongly!

  • May 12, 2012, 11:26 a.m. CST

    LMD was the first thing that popped into my head in the theater

    by zombieslayer

    But I really like the Vision theory as well.

  • There's an interview with him online somewhere where he talks about it. It was one of the things Marvel told him the film had to contain.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:40 a.m. CST

    The Dialogue was cheesy for the WHOLE film

    by nyjman8028

    I know I'm part of the minority on this one, but Joss Whedon I feel constantly has cheesy dialogue throughout his work. I've never been one to connect to any of his work because of this. I saw the Avengers and yes it was fun movie with a lot of great action, but it is not the best superhero movie ever personally. But taking it as it was, a fun summer action film I did enjoy it. But the cheesy dialogue definitely took me out of the film from time to time.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:40 a.m. CST

    He'll be back

    by NoahTall

    He will be back and it won't cheapen anything. Right now many people may feel that Coulson not being dead would be a cheat that would cheapen the movie, and it is. But a year or two years from now whenever it is he shows up again very few people will feel that way. The immediacy of the death will be gone so the most universal reaction will likely be "Oh good, they brought back somebody I like." Spock came back, the fans didn't abandon Star Trek in droves. Time heals all wounds. Even a spear to the chest. Though it might not heal an arrow to the knee.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:45 a.m. CST

    Given who Thanos' mistress is, anything is possible

    by rsswope

    To mess with the Avengers next time around.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:45 a.m. CST

    He's not really dead, as long as we remember him.

    by Angry Mike

  • May 12, 2012, 12:03 p.m. CST

    If he's dead why bother with the card lie scene at all?

    by Dubster32

    Coulson points out they need a reason for them all to work together , next we see Fury lying about the card. He's obviously not dead.

  • May 12, 2012, 12:10 p.m. CST

    I agree with Quint and many talkbackers here...

    by Lloyd Fenton

    The actor will portray a cinematic version of the Vision.The android will have Coulson's featuures, and maybe some memories. Coulson is dead, but he liked and respected the Avengers, this will carry over to his android form. The clues are there, the cellist girlfriend dialouge was included for a reason, the "I lost my one good eye". And he's signed on for more movies. Coulson will not be back, but his form will and the Vision will be colder and although not completely devoid of emotion, it will not be the same character. See you can have your cake and eat it too!

  • May 12, 2012, 12:29 p.m. CST

    That's a lot of typing for something that's wrong

    by DBCOOPER

    No way he comes back.

  • May 12, 2012, 12:31 p.m. CST

    Why he lies...(dubster32)

    by DBCOOPER

    It's obvious he tells a white lie about the cards in order to give them an extra push.

  • May 12, 2012, 12:34 p.m. CST

    I agree with Quint I think he is, but not as Coulson. Coulson is dead.

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 12, 2012, 12:36 p.m. CST

    Interesting theory Quint....sounds plausable...but time will tell

    by DementedCaver

  • Oh wait....

  • May 12, 2012, 12:44 p.m. CST

    They will use a Lazarus Pit, of course.

    by tomandshell

  • May 12, 2012, 12:57 p.m. CST

    I hope he lives

    by damned-dirty-ape

    Simply because of the fact that I was totally bored by Cobie Smulders character. She might be nice to look at but she makes a piss poor replacement.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:14 p.m. CST

    remmber everyone said coulson was actually a

    by JAMF

    skrull??? yeah, the chances of him being alive are exactly fuck all.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:20 p.m. CST

    quint, you mean "crack" medical team, not "crackerjack"

    by Monnie Knapp

    A cracker jack team would be a pile of fuck-ups.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:34 p.m. CST

    Maybe

    by Phil Black

    But I frankly don't care either way and I'm pretty surprised it's provoked such an essay! The film was overlong due to padding by non-Superheroes guff so I'd like to see a sequel which is genuinely "relentless" or certainly less flabby around the midsection...

  • May 12, 2012, 1:35 p.m. CST

    by Bruce Simmons

    I'm with 'v'shael' on this one... At first, when Stark answered the phone that this was his Life Model Decoy (LMD), eh, that was funny. The moment Coulson went down, my mind went right to that line. That line that came out of the blue. And why? Was it just a line? Or was there meaning... a warning? A spoiler or lifeline of hope for a moment later on. And Coulson just... 'stopped' So yes, I'm hoping it was a trick because he's been one of the mainstays in almost all the Marvel films... well, except for the Stan Lee cameos that is. 'Nuff Said!!!

  • May 12, 2012, 1:38 p.m. CST

    Whedon stabs people through the chest: it's what he does.

    by zom-bot.com

    still, I always thought they were working toward Coulson becoming or sectretly already being Vision anyway.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:38 p.m. CST

    Had this exact theory in the theater...

    by yesiamaplant

    ...but much like my thought that Harvey Dent may have been given a sham funeral and secretly locked away in Arkham at the end of The Dark Knight, its just ship building. If they decided to go this route in future films it would be as an afterthought---no one made this movie with the intention of Coulson coming back, and the clues are just wishful thinking. I also disagree that Coulson's death was used effectively. Thor and Hulk had no idea Coulson bought it and showed up anyway, and the movie made it clear that Cap, Romanov and Barton would have shown up with or without the death motivation. The only person who "needed" the push was Stark so I consider it a waste. Coulson was too good a character to spend on one member of an ensemble cast---they should have found another way.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:40 p.m. CST

    I'm hopeing Coulson was an LMD!!! Why? Cause of Stark's earlier line

    by Bruce Simmons

    Yea, when Tony Stark first answered the phone that he was a Life Model Decoy (LMD) I didn't think anything of it. As soon as Coulson died, I went right back to that line. And now I'm hoping! Aside from Stan Lee, Coulson has been close to one of the mainstays in most of the recent Marvel movies! 'Nuff Said.

  • May 12, 2012, 1:40 p.m. CST

    and did everyone miss Whedon denying it was his idea?

    by yesiamaplant

    http://splashpage.mtv.com/2012/05/10/joss-whedon-avengers-death/ It would have happened whether Whedon was involved or not. He just didn't object is all. And neither did Clark Gregg for that matter, but that's just because he's a stand up guy.

  • ...But hey that's just me! Maybe there are grown ups that find grown up stuff too grown up and like kids movies more. What the hell do i know i just like girls and beer, you go for it pal!!

  • May 12, 2012, 2:13 p.m. CST

    Good stuff.

    by Chris Moody

    This is more "comic book" tradition than anything...and I like it.

  • May 12, 2012, 2:18 p.m. CST

    The post-credits coda scene in Iron Man 3

    by supertoyslast

    It just has to be a scene showing the return of Coulson.

  • May 12, 2012, 2:24 p.m. CST

    drstrangerlove

    by oisin5199

    then why are you here? You do know what site you're on, right? though I think it's funny that Quint's going through a whole emotional process with this - initially getting angry over his own completely speculative theory.

  • He may be dead. He may not be. But we don't know either for certain. No visual evidence of his death or burial, only Fury's hasty testimony to go on, earlier mention of LMD, cellist girlfiend - none of that is proof he's alive, but all of it is enough to believe he's not *definitely* dead. No way all of that is just a coincidence. My theory is that they're doing this in a way that leaves their options open. If it suits them to bring him back, they can. If it doesn't, they don't have to. If they want a Coulston Vision or LMD Coulston, or just to bring back the real guy and claim it was a LMD that was killed, well now they can do any of it. They're having some fun with it, honestly. Who knows where, if anywhere, they'll take it from here. I hope they keep him around in some capacity.

  • May 12, 2012, 3:13 p.m. CST

    dead characters coming back for sequels

    by Raymond Shaw

    You thought they were dead...but they came back... Frankenstein, Godzilla, Barbarossa, Crank, Ripley, Gandalf, Clark Griswold, Spock, that guy in Blade, Jason, snooze...

  • Seriously, the way I would bring him back is though a time travel story where they fight one their best villians — Kang! Then the sequel could be "The Wrath of Kang."

  • May 12, 2012, 3:26 p.m. CST

    Coulson Will Become Vision or Ultron

    by Jeff

    Great theory, Quint. Marvel is not done with the character. I've been thinking about this since I saw the movie on opening night.

  • May 12, 2012, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Sometimes they come back

    by rakesh patel

    Unfortunately in Joss world people, and they die well. I still get teary eyed over Fred's death and Wesley's death, and Cordelia in Angel, gutted over Book and Wash in Firefly. Joyce and Anya in Buffy. Blllard in Dollhouse not so much. Ya gotta remember though, like Illyria, sometimes they come back. Dammit. I'm going to have to a do a buffy and angel marathon again.

  • May 12, 2012, 3:33 p.m. CST

    agreed, and fairly obvious too....

    by misnomer

  • May 12, 2012, 3:43 p.m. CST

    either he's alive or he's dead, or the cops got him, or they don't

    by jules windex

  • May 12, 2012, 3:49 p.m. CST

    Captain America Comes back to life?

    by eternia_dwell

    THAT'S what got you to stop reading? Besides the enormous amounts of hints, clues, and story structure that suggested he never died in the first place, that got you to quit? Then you clearly never read Brubaker's Cap and you're just another lame poser that pretends to like comics. Typical, gotta fake your "geek cred" so other people that read this site like you. The amount of stupid drivel like this is nuts. Here, Ed Brubaker goes out of his way to write over 3 years of set-up for the "Death of Captain America" story and you think it's cheap because you're too lazy to actually read it? How seriously dumb is that? "I heard Obi Wan comes back as a force ghost in Empire Strikes back and they get a muppet to be a Jedi. Ugh, that sounds stupid. I won't even bother with watching it." Quint is so fucking fake. Quote me.

  • May 12, 2012, 4:07 p.m. CST

    Post credits scene after Iron Man 3...

    by Lloyd Fenton

    Tony walks down the hallway of an underground Shield facility, escorted by an agent. He complains that Fury should be paying him for any consultation that he needs, and that he was about to take a much needed vacation in the Carribean with Miss. Potts. He enters a room that has Nick Fury and various scientists. He begins giving shit to Fury. Fury says "We need your help on various tech upgrades to an important project. Sorry for the inconvienence, but I think you'll find it worth your while." He reveals a Vision like android with Coulson's features. "Oh my God is that..." says Stark. "No it isn't," replies Fury. "Well not entirely..." Scientists adjust various computer controls and an audible power up hum is heard. Stark goes in closer to look at the features and the eyes of the android suddenly open, computer android eyes, and a familiar voice with electronic over tones says simply, "Hello, Mr. Stark". fade out

  • May 12, 2012, 4:11 p.m. CST

    Coulson would make a perfect Vision. Get it done Marvel.

    by elgato73

    No one ever really dies in the funny books anyway.

  • May 12, 2012, 4:12 p.m. CST

    It's....

    by Dead_Geek

    ... just a f*cking movie.

  • May 12, 2012, 4:36 p.m. CST

    "His name is Phillip Coulson. His name is Phillip Coulson. His name is..."

    by Randy_of_AFTimes

    Friends and I talked about this right after we saw it. My belief that Coulson can be brought back is because of how that scene goes: -Coulson slumps. -Time slows down as med team arrives. -Fury calls over the radio that Coulson is "down" or something or other. -Hill says she'll send a med team. -Fury says they're already there. "They called it." At no time is the word "dead" ever used! So it works on bringing him back and Fury is a manipulative enough bastard to completely fake the death to get them together. As for Vision or LMD, maybe the Phil that was killed WAS an LMD. And how would Fury know where the cards were? Time will tell...

  • May 12, 2012, 4:41 p.m. CST

    Hey, Quint!

    by Aiden Blackwell

    Firstly, props for being one of the most literate, ego-restrained and connected writers on this site. Your Hobbit set reports are fantastic, and I'm sure I'm not the only person who is looking forward to more of them. [syntax; insert text: 'Fuck off talkbackers who think I want to suck Quint's dick. I don't! end text.] That said, you may be right about Coulson. You may be wrong too. Cool ideas though! [syntax; insert text: 'Fuck off talkbackers who think I want to suck Quint's dick and finger his ass. I don't! end text.] But... Man... Irrespective of the wondrous diversity of tastes which defines the passionate global fan community, and irrespective of individual fans' preferences... there is only one valid Avengers discussion topic... That being- we should ALL be sending donations to a paypal account so that Sir Joss Whedon has a $1000 hooker sucking his dick, EVERY SINGLE DAY FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE for what he has done in the past, and for what he has now, magnificently, gifted to us all in the here and now! Joss Whedon... Excelsior!

  • May 12, 2012, 5:10 p.m. CST

    Coulson is Vision!!

    by Peter Ram

    the memory of coulson will live on as vision.this will start with Iron man 3 and stark dealing with his alcoholism due to the death of coulson and the growing responsibility of being a hero.

  • May 12, 2012, 5:17 p.m. CST

    Thor didn't know? Thor watched his brother

    by Cartagia

    ram that staff straight through his friends back.

  • May 12, 2012, 5:24 p.m. CST

    badwulf12969 RE: Bucky..

    by notspock2

    We saw Bucky fall into Icy Waters... I'd put money on him not being dead...

  • BW even mentions "He got 2 of ours" referring to the mind control. And she obviously knew Coulson quite well, ie. phone call in interrogation scene

  • 1. Fury would rather not toss Coulson's corpse onto the table.<p><p> 2. Fury needed something for the team to avenge.<p><p> 3. Fury knew everyone knew about Coulson's Captain America card collection, so the cards (which were in themselves a symbol of how great the Avengers really are) were used as a symbol of how much Coulson counted on the Avengers (after being soaked in blood).<p><p> 4. Fury ultimately knew the Avengers would forget about Coulson anyway so it was a throw-away catalyst. After all, THEY DIDN'T EVEN HAVE A FUNERAL FOR THE POOR GUY.

  • May 12, 2012, 5:37 p.m. CST

    NO FUNERAL = AVENGERS NO CARE ABOUT COULSON

    by aceattorney

    Also, see my post above.

  • May 12, 2012, 5:49 p.m. CST

    a whole article about that??

    by chargester

    Neither cool nor realistic. In fact it'd take a dump on the Avengers movie and the movie-verse if he's alive. And for no reason whatsoever. I thought you were gonna talk about maybe the Mind Gem powering the glowstick of destiny. It's the right color.

  • May 12, 2012, 5:57 p.m. CST

    Scarlet Witch...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...won't be appearing in an Avengers movie any time soon. In the comics, she was introduced in the X-Men, therefore Marvel do not own the movie rights to her. Sob sob.

  • May 12, 2012, 6:03 p.m. CST

    If it ain't Uncle Ben, it's not dead

    by thelordofhell

    Marvel rule #2

  • May 12, 2012, 6:28 p.m. CST

    Coulson's deader than Gwen Stacy. Oh, wait . . .

    by elmo

  • OR they COULD always bring him back as The Vision--that could be pretty cool & he'd get to fight alongside his hero, CA

  • May 12, 2012, 6:51 p.m. CST

    Jesus Christ

    by Doc Martigan

    Reading way too much into it. Do they actually need to start having a medical team come in, work him for 10 minutes, leave, call the medical examiner, wait the 45 minutes for him to show up and officially pronounce him? "But the M.E. WORKS for Nick Fury!!!" So now we have to see the body taken to the morgue, sit in a cooler and await an autopsy. What is it going to take for you people to actually take a death scene at face value? He fucking croaked. ON SCREEN. You've watched enough movies. You know how this works. This isn't the comics, and if they start fucking up the movies by retconning deaths, I'm out.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:29 p.m. CST

    kingralphuk

    by The Cheese Grommitt

    Hey Phuk Phace, I really don't mean to insult you but when some one demonstrates their limited comprehension in a public forum I have to metaphorically shake them by their lapels. The big box office is not why the Avengers is a great movie. The Box office is big because the majority of viewers are returning for repeat viewings...why BECAUSE THEY THINK ITS GREAT!!!! You probably do not do well with those problem solving equations in school. It's fine that you did not like it but don't look for support or validation for your opinion. Except the fact you are in the minority, embrace it. Let the rest of us love the holy shit out of the film. It doesn't make you less or more.

  • May 12, 2012, 7:43 p.m. CST

    Clearly...

    by Hipshot

    They can bring him back if they wanna.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:02 p.m. CST

    Coulson's death.

    by Michael Edwards

    It was the one thing about the movie I did not like. Oh, and if the Scarlet Witch does show up in the next one, please let her be played by Joanne Kelly from Warehouse 13.

  • May 12, 2012, 8:15 p.m. CST

    I entirely agree...

    by Peppino_Squeezebox

    ...I've been trying to convince my friends he's alive! The camera pauses much too long on the empty area previously occupied by Coulson's body. Why are we focusing on a blood-smear on a wall by a vent? If the powers-that-be were really going for an audience-oriented emotional punch, it would have been a shot of Coulson's dead-yet-at-peace-for-the-greater-good-looking corpse...like in every other movie...EVER. Although it was given a second of sad music accompanied by sad looks, Coulson's death wasn't given the amount of gravity a blockbuster like this demands. Quint's right, it's all about what Fury does with Coulson's "death".

  • May 12, 2012, 8:17 p.m. CST

    If Picard can survive a spear through the torso...

    by DocOpticus

    Then Coulson can! But really he should be ded...

  • May 12, 2012, 8:21 p.m. CST

    Spock died in TWOK, dammit!

    by KnowItAllFromCali

    *sniff*

  • What too implausible? He won't be the same guy, and maybe just scattered partial memories. Clark Gregg has to eat, too!

  • Tony walks down the hallway of an underground Shield facility, escorted by an agent. He complains that Fury should be paying him for any consultation that he needs, and that he was about to take a much needed vacation in the Carribean with Miss. Potts. He enters a room that has Nick Fury and various scientists. He begins giving shit to Fury. Fury says "We need your help on various tech upgrades to an important project. Sorry for the inconvienence, but I think you'll find it worth your while." He reveals a Vision like android with Coulson's features. "Oh my God is that..." says Stark. "No it isn't," replies Fury. "Well not entirely..." Stark is introduced to Henry Pym, head of Sheild's AI branch, who adjusts various computer controls and an audible power up hum is heard. Stark goes in closer to look at the features and the eyes of the android suddenly open, computer android eyes, and a familiar voice with electronic over tones says simply, "Hello, Mr. Stark". fade out

  • May 12, 2012, 9:23 p.m. CST

    Orhers who stay dead in comicdom

    by Hesiod2k7

    Bruce Wayne's parents; Jor El; The Comedian; Captain Marvel? (The one who died of cancer).

  • May 12, 2012, 9:24 p.m. CST

    @maxwell's hammer/Scarlet Witch in Avengers

    by Wally_West

    Kevin Feige specifically said that Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver can be used in the Avengers and the X-Men both, and that Fox and Marvel have specific agreement: "Another update on Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver and the deal with FOX. FEIGE: We both have them. There's a specific arrangement with those two characters that would allow us to use them with "Avengers," but not discuss or reference their mutant or Magneto-related lineage. They can use them as mutants and as Magneto's relatives, but cannot have anything to do with "The Avengers." http: //www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/GraphicCity/news/?a=59048

  • May 12, 2012, 9:25 p.m. CST

    Thor's blood on Loki's knife.....

    by Dead_Geek

    ... the blade has Thors blood on it. Thor Clone next movie!

  • May 12, 2012, 9:25 p.m. CST

    A Godzilla Squad movie, please.

    by Hesiod2k7

    Just license Godzilla and you're good to go. Use Red Ronin too!

  • May 12, 2012, 9:54 p.m. CST

    They use Pym particles to shrink Godzilla.

    by Hesiod2k7

    The Godzilla Squad would be a PERFECT S.H.I.E.L.D. Movie.

  • May 12, 2012, 9:54 p.m. CST

    errr... or heel of my shoe... whoops

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 12, 2012, 10:04 p.m. CST

    COULSON, MAR-VELL, THANOS, VISION

    by VICTORY

    THANOS: We know that Whedon fell in love with the Avengers when he read Jim Starlin's magnificent Thanos two-parter that appeared in Avengers annual 7 and Marvel Two In One annual 2. Joss could adapt that story without Spider-Man and the Thing, he can't use them anyway, but he needs ADAM WARLOCK and the Kree CAPTAIN MARVEL. Is it too much coincidence that Marvel Comics is reviving Mar-Vell, dead since 1984, this month? Warlock has been a member of the GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY, a cosmic super-team with a movie currently in pre-production. It would make sense that Thanos is the villain there first. THE COUNCIL: They almost nuked New York and our heroes. Did Tony Stark find out about them when he hacked S.H.I.E.L.D.'s mainframe? What will they do next against Fury, SHIELD and the Avengers? Is AGENT COULSON truly dead? Yes, we saw him die, but there was no funeral. Death in comic-books is a rather impermanent concept. Why does it have to be any different in comic-book movies? STARK TOWER: Looks like it will become Avengers tower. THREAT: Thanos' henchman threatened Loki, that if he failed to return the cosmic cube, there would be a reckoning. Will they follow him and the cube to Asgard? NEWBIES: Is there room for more Avengers? We all hope so. NICK FURY expects escalation, so he'll be recruiting some more heroes, specially now that 5 of the 6 heroes will be developed further in their own movies. On the map in Iron Man 2, SHIELD had identified hot spots of super human activity in Africa (BLACK PANTHER), and in the Atlantic ocean (SUB-MARINER?). On the other hand, we saw the original HUMAN TORCH android in Captain America: The First Avenger and we know that WAR MACHINE is out there too. Everyone expects ANT-MAN & the WASP to be in the sequel, and a lot of fans root for the VISION, because he is very cool, and also if he is around ULTRON can't be far behind. We found out two weeks ago that the SCARLET WITCH and QUICKSILVER can be used by both Marvel Studios and Fox, so they are also in the running. But... how much is too much?

  • May 12, 2012, 10:50 p.m. CST

    Coulson could be back in a BLACK WIDOW, HAWKEYE or NICK FURY movie

    by Mace Tofu

    that all take place before his Death in THE AVENGERS. No big deal for him to pop up in the other Avengers origin tales we haven't seen yet.

  • May 12, 2012, 10:55 p.m. CST

    What the MCU has done...

    by Lloyd Fenton

    Marvel Studios has taken the concept of an interactive universe to work like a well run comic book company. Kevin Feige with advice from his workmates has painted character beats in very broad strokes, things they need to happen etc. The individual comicbooks/movies are allowed to be developed by a talented group of artists writers etc. to develop a story. Along with gab seesions among the filmakerfans of what do with the character.Specific beats have to be hit. The map of superhuman activity in Ironman 2 shows sites for, Ironman, Hulk, Captain America, Thor, Black Panther, Namor, and Red Skull. They might use these characters, in potential new films or they might change direction if something else works and sparks sales. Andnow they are a comicbookmovies company with 4 proven titles to put out. Avengers, Ironman, Thor and Captain America. Plenty of room within those 4 franchises to cross-pollinate and use some of the other characters in Marvels vaults. More superheros equals more box office... simple really

  • May 12, 2012, 11:26 p.m. CST

    Quint, Coulson is dead...

    by zinc_chameleon

    and that's because it's clear from her screen time that Maria Hill is going to be promoted. She will figure much more prominently in Avengers 2.

  • May 12, 2012, 11:28 p.m. CST

    i believe Namor and Black Panther are owned by Fox

    by oisin5199

    under the Fantastic Four license.

  • May 13, 2012, 12:15 a.m. CST

    Remember the days when good guys died in movies?

    by 2mules4sistersarah

    Dirty Dozen, Magnificent Seven, Guns of Navarone,etc? Not everyone lives. Coulson was a soldier who died on the battlefield fighting for a just cause and something he believed in. Honor his memory and death with dignity by letting him stay dead. Don't cheapen it with a cheap plot trick.

  • May 13, 2012, 12:23 a.m. CST

    Eva green for scarlet witch. That is all.

    by dahveed1972

  • May 13, 2012, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Another Plot Point

    by ripper t. jones

    Ok, maybe I missed something but...The scene where Thor breaks out of the containment cell before it crashes, after he escapes he goes to retrieve Mjolnir but it just sits there. Thor flexes his fist in confusion. What was that about? Was it explained? Did I miss something?

  • May 13, 2012, 12:34 a.m. CST

    Here's MY Theory on Coulson's Death...

    by Cheif Brody

    He has a son...an Army MP home from Afganistan...named Phil, Jr. Shows up at the memorial ceremony with every one present. Has a heart to heart with Fury...vows to avenge his father's death...Laughed off at first by Fury...Cap remembers the senior Coulson's devotion to SHEILD & The Avengers, and of course, the bloody trading cards...and decides to take young Coulson, a fellow soldier, under his wing...and finally convinces Fury to make him an Agent. Fury is convinced and wipes his prior military obligations clear when he sees Coulson's son face off with a skeptical Hawkeye and more than holds his own. <p> New, younger, hipper, Agent Coulson is born...and so is a possible love interest for Agent Hill. After a freak accident catches both of them of guard...Hill eventually becomes WASP...and Coulson, Jr becomes Ant Man in Avengers 3...because Hawkeye & Black Widow will bite it together in Avengers 2. <p> End of Theory.

  • May 13, 2012, 12:49 a.m. CST

    ripper t....

    by Cheif Brody

    My take on that was...the longer Thor spends time away from Asgard...the more "mortal" he becomes. Could be setting up a plot point for Avengers 2...or Thor 2. Take yer pick.

  • May 13, 2012, 12:50 a.m. CST

    Nick Fury:

    by OZarr

  • May 13, 2012, 1:01 a.m. CST

    Fury: *I lost my one good eye* - Vision

    by DidntPullOutInTimeCop

    dating a cellist. Enough for me.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:02 a.m. CST

    Nick Fury: "Coulson is down." Down is not Dead!

    by OZarr

    I re-watched the Avengers today after reading this, and I think your right. COULSON LIVES!! Nick Fury tells the team that, "Coulson is down." and then the med teams haul him away. They never stated he's dead, just down. Down could mean anything. I am sure S.H.E.I.L.D has an advance medical bay on that ship of theirs with some top notch doctors on stand by.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:46 a.m. CST

    jediozar...Fury says the med teams "Called It"

    by Cheif Brody

    meaning...they pronounced him dead. As Quint stated...he could have been lying about that to inspire the team when they needed it most...but that is a super douche thing to do. He could have just said "I can't lie...it doesn't look good", and prolly gotten the same amount of heartstrings tugged. <p> I don't think Whedon would play games like that. Coulson served his purpose...and let's face it...somebody NOT in a superhero costume had ta die.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:52 a.m. CST

    A bit of Clark Gregg trivia for you guys...

    by ChickenStu

    Did you know that A - He's a screenwriter who wrote "What Lies Beneath", the supernatural thriller starring Harrison Ford, Michelle Pfeiffer and directed by Robert Zemeckis? B - He's married to Dirty Dancing's Jennifer Grey?

  • May 13, 2012, 2:06 a.m. CST

    Let him stay dead. He was a leech anyway

    by chien_sale

  • May 13, 2012, 2:34 a.m. CST

    Maybe you have too much time on your hands.

    by Ben Fong-Torres

    Lame theory.

  • May 13, 2012, 3:24 a.m. CST

    No I think Coulson is dead.

    by kabookieslap

    He was the glue that got them together, but he was also the thing that caused them to Avenge and become the Avengers. His character is no longer needed, but his picture will probably be up and highly regarded at Avengers headquarters. Newbie's may ask "Who is that guy?" and the Avengers will walk by and look at him as one of them that was lost. I don't think he is coming back as he was just human, and his death scene was what it was to mean something to future movies.

  • May 13, 2012, 4:11 a.m. CST

    In Avengers 2, (Major Spoiler Alert)

    by Xen11

    Thor dies.

  • May 13, 2012, 4:15 a.m. CST

    Vision, The Infinity Gauntlet, and Missing Chess Pieces

    by Monty Cristo

    I love that Quint posted this. My mind has been reeling at the possibilities since seeing the movie, complete with the various hints (I'm assuming) dropped (face scanning, cellist girlfriend, Coulson's more pronounced childlike sense of wonder and admiration for great heroes, "my one good eye"). I don't think it's a huge leap to think that SHIELD would resist in allowing it's prototype ultra-LMD to leech off of the not-yet-braindead synapses of Phil Coulson's brain. Whether any of that happens or not, I would be surprised to not see Vision pop up by the time the Infinity Gauntlet Free For All goes down, namely because Marvel Studios lacks access to a certain key figure from my beloved Infinity Gauntlet crossover series: The Silver Surfer. Who will serve as the not-human and not-godly third to Adam Warlock and Doctor Strange? Probably Vision, considering the options. I could be completely wrong, but if they plan to stage that particularly iconic sequence of the conflict, Doctor Strange would not be out in the vast expanse of space with just one person. He would have backup, a being much like the Silver Surfer: sentient, but not quite human. He's said publicly that we will be introduced to the Marvel Movieverse's cosmic side through the eyes of Doctor Strange, and I know he shares a similar ardent passion for the character that I harbor as well. It makes me dizzy just thinking that Dormammu could figure into Avengers 2 as well, by extension. What if The Gauntlet and Thanos don't figure as the focus of Avengers 2 and instead Ultron pops up...and the Infinity Gauntlet comes later? Jesus, now I need to lay down. What wonderful toys they're playing with. I can't wait to see what Kevin Feige and his various co-conspirators are cooking up for us, even if I'm completely wrong about all of this.

  • May 13, 2012, 4:20 a.m. CST

    Coulson is still alive in the new Spidey toon.

    by Bedknobs and Boomsticks

    And is in the books, as well. Are we on stage three, anger and bargaining?

  • May 13, 2012, 4:22 a.m. CST

    Or they'll resurrect him as Starfox.

    by Bedknobs and Boomsticks

    He'll have pointy hair and be really horny.

  • May 13, 2012, 5:45 a.m. CST

    Coulson. He aint dead, if for no other reason than...

    by tailhook

    if he were, this wouldn't be fucking Marvel. If they find a way to work him into a story arc that will work well, they'll write him in with about 15 seconds of transitionary dialogue and that'll be that. Not realistic? SUPERHERO FILM NATCH.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:50 a.m. CST

    Was the movie written by Joss Whedon? Then Coulson is dead!

    by Clavius

    JW has no compunction about offing a character if it serves the story. Hell, he'd whack Tony Stark if it was a logical progression of the story arc. (granted, not likely) That's one reason I liked The Avengers. Given that Whedon was in charge (and i am not a koolaid swilling Whedonite) I really felt no one was safe. I loved Agent Coulson, he had a kind of cool-yet dorky badassery about him. Even though he looked like an accountant, his quiet demeanor left you feeling that fucking with him was a REALLY bad idea. Much as I liked him, I really hope they don't pull a lame ass "search for Coulson" and Fal-Tor-Pan his ass back into the movies. It would kill the emotional resonance of his death in the first film.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:59 a.m. CST

    Swe don't need...

    by Mikey Wood

    ...a BLACK WIDOW solo movie. Or a HAWKEYE solo movie. OR a Nick Fury solo movie. I think the roles those characters play in these movies and in the capacity they appear are just fine.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:59 a.m. CST

    WE don't need, that is...

    by Mikey Wood

    What we DO need is an edit function.

  • May 13, 2012, 8:05 a.m. CST

    Agreed, A solo Black Widow movie isn't necessary.

    by Clavius

    The ony way I'd want a solo Black Widow movie is if it's two hours of her masturbating in the shower. Otherwise, I'm good.

  • Yes, it COULD happen. A lot of really shitty plot twists COULD happen. Just ask yourself... If Coulson is a Life Model Decoy (the cheesiest of all SHIELD tech), why wouldn't they explain to the audience what one is? All we got is Tony Stark quite LITERALLY making fun of the idea. How would Coulson even know that Loki was going to conveniently break out of that prison? Do you know how much ridiculous fucking foresight that would take? Remember, Thor had to open the door and then take a swing at him RIGHT THAT SECOND. How would Coulson or Nick Fury even know that Loki would do that? If Coulson wasn't really dying, why wouldn't he reveal his last words BEFORE he died? Why would they struggle to figure out what he was trying to say when he could have spat it out first and THEN died? If that's not the real Coulson, where the fuck is the real Coulson? Was he reading a magazine in the basement? The truth is, Nick Fury is a guy willing to do bad things to get good results. The point of the scene with the Captain America cards was to show that Nick Fury was willing to steal the cards out of Coulson's locker and smear them on his bloody corpse just to get results. Clark Gregg has five Avengers movies under his belt. That's more than any other actor. He's probably not that stressed out because he had a really good run at it. Now it's Colbie Smoldering's turn at bat. Give it up.

  • May 13, 2012, 8:34 a.m. CST

    Maybe Coulson is with the cellist in Portland?

    by Steve

    Tony tells Coulson he's going to fly him there when they walk onto the deck of the hellicarrier. But, that would mean Tony is in on it.

  • May 13, 2012, 10:25 a.m. CST

    Umm...yep, you are delusional

    by ATARI

  • May 13, 2012, 10:54 a.m. CST

    Avengers passes $1 BILLION.

    by UltimaRex

    "Grown up" enough for you now drstrangerlove?

  • May 13, 2012, 10:57 a.m. CST

    Coulson is dead as in TDK's Harvey Dent dead!

    by Stalkeye

    End of story. To bring him back would be a disservice to the Movie's plot arc.

  • May 13, 2012, 11:03 a.m. CST

    Civil War/Skrull storyline in Avengers EMH series?

    by Stalkeye

    hmmm...

  • May 13, 2012, 11:04 a.m. CST

    I second, bring on Taskmaster!!

    by Stalkeye

  • May 13, 2012, 11:07 a.m. CST

    They did talk a lot about the cellist in Portland...

    by jackofhearts29

    Anyway, it was mentioned a couple of times. Also, re: Odin being behind everything: everyone saw his two ravens flying around the Thor/Loki mountain scene, right? Just saw it again last night and my brain is processing new things. Pretty much every throwaway line is seeming to have multiple layers of meaning now. I know, this is geek insanity... it feels nice though!

  • May 13, 2012, 11:17 a.m. CST

    iron man 3

    by william

    Clark gregg was in talks to join the cast of iron man 3 at one point. I do not know if this was before they decided to kill him or not or whether this is going to be for playing a lmd or the vision.

  • So stupid movie.

  • May 13, 2012, 11:25 a.m. CST

    Why Coulson/Vision makes sense

    by Toons

    I agree he´s definitely dead, but it makes perfect sense to bring him back as Vision: 1) Clark Gregg is signed on for more movies. 2) When asked what he´d do with a sequel, Whedon said it´d deal with more personal, "smaller" matters (I´m paraphrasing here) Coulson´s death and "resurrection" would certainly fit, thematically. 3) Thanos being there means Death will be a major theme. Again, thematically, it fits. 4) The Ant-man movie means Pym will probably show up in Avengers 2. His history with Ultron/Vision is well known. 5) Pretty important (and I don´t think anybody mentioned it): the only way I can think of making an intangible android work in the Marvel movie universe is making him some sort of nanotech, so he can phase and whatnot. Which is exactly the kind of technology "Extremis" (which IM3 is based on) deals with. 6) C´mon, the guy would make a perfect Vision. Seriously.

  • Look, I know this is spam. But I've been coming here since before gordon had a beer and cheated on his wife, and before Kiera Knightly was a sexy tomboy beanpole. I made a film. For 10 grand. Its up for free on YOUTUBE in glorious 1080P. All I ask is that you give it a shot. I can best describe it as white trash Shakespeare. Its a grim little character drama about a heavy metal loving/guitar shredding meth dealer and his flunky cousin who inhabit a trailer in central oregon. It's called THE WOLFMAN's HAMMER. You can see the trailer here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfKochjSsus and the full film here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjLWrxRlmXE I know this is a hustle but it's an honest one. I'm 26 years old and this is my first feature film and I can guarantee that it's one of the best looking, most emotionally effective movies made for that budget. Thanks and take care, -Brad

  • ... but if Coulson's really dead, Fury was just being a dick.

  • May 13, 2012, 11:42 a.m. CST

    Sorry Quint

    by Chris Bridges

    Marvel is in the business of rehashing old super-heros, not creating new ones. Coulson is dead because he's the only character they could kill that was familiar enough for the fan's to give a shit, yet not fuck with the hero's cannon. FACT!!!

  • May 13, 2012, 11:59 a.m. CST

    All of the Avengers will die in 2...

    by TopHat

    Its part of the Thanos storyline. They'll come back towards the end, of course. Which will leave a good portion of the movie ...about SHIELD. Ewww. I don't like that. Maybe they'll only kill SOME of the Avengers. Which will leave a few left trying to figure out what to do. That might valudate an appearance/introduction to Vision. Or, at least Pym.

  • C'mon, they're gonna go with something original and they'd better hope and pray and pay Whedon to do it. LMD Coulson would be alright but pointless, it would be far better if Fury had totally manipulated the team - as he said he did - but with a colossal lie.

  • May 13, 2012, 12:56 p.m. CST

    The Avengers BO

    by Have_Penis_Will_Travel

    Total Lifetime Grosses Domestic: $373,182,000 37.2% + Foreign: $628,900,000 62.8% -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- = Worldwide: $1,002,082,000 Has any other movie reached 1 bil this quickly? Oh and those figures are from box office mojo so I have no idea how accurate they are

  • It has grossed US$373 millions in merely 8 days. My predictions that The Avengers would make something between 350 and 400 bucks by this Sunday were right. Is still early to tell if it can top Avatar, but it is most certain that it will become the second highest grossing movie of all time (not counting inflation of course).

  • May 13, 2012, 1:19 p.m. CST

    Definitely Vision

    by Anita Hummer

    It fits with the direction that the MCU is moving. Other studios were pussies and never went all in with many of the characters. Fox didn't have the balls to have a real Galactus. The MCU is going all in and Vision is one of the most difficult superheros to translate to the screen. He is green and red and has a big fucking cape and his superpower is kind of esoteric. He was always one of my favorites and follows a line that includes Cmdr Data from the Trek and Daneel Olivaw from the Asimov novels: to whit the android that tries to become human. How they fit the pieces together is probably yet to be determined but they do give outlines to writers and directors and let them just make it happen. Over the next 2 or 3 years we get Ant Man, probably Dr. Strange and hopefully the Inhumans. Of course they will have the Balls to go with Vision and Clark Gregg has earned the right to actually be a Superhero, which is the thing that just takes the cake. Fox and Sony just don't have the balls for it. I'll bet that the new spidey will suck balls. They just don't respect either the material or the audience enough to do it right. Star Wars is among the most successfull franchises in the history of film and it isn't grounded in reality, why do they have to force that horseshit on our Superheros. Long Live Kevin Feige, Excelsior!

  • For those keeping score: Fox: Daredevil X-Men Fantastic Four Sony (Columbia): Spider-Man Ghost Rider Universal: Sub-Mariner Your Momma Blade and Punisher recently reverted back to Marvel.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:29 p.m. CST

    Fantastic piece, Quint. SEQUEL! THREE ACT STRUCTURE! PYM vs. CAP!

    by The Real McClane

    I was really interested in Quint's theory about a trilogy with the classic three-act "darker part two" structure. Realistically, I'm not sure you could find a bigger antagonist than Thanos & his hilarious gauntlet. I'm no screenwriter, but if I laid this bitch out, I'd save the death-loving purple guy for the last act with more hints of him & a smooth build-up in part two. If Whedon is interested in digging up some interesting personal conflict for the next go-round, I'd be desperately pushing the infamous Hank Pym & Wasp dynamic. In Mark Millar's run on THE ULTIMATES, Pym and Wasp's horribly abusive relationship (and Captain America's fascinating involvement as the 1940's hero boyfriend) made for some damn interesting storytelling. ...Plus, that Cap-vs-Pym construction site brawl was f'n incredible. Millar also explored some interesting territory with his take on The Defenders, which would actually be kind of hilarious on film. The obsession-driven fans getting Captain America tattoos, Stark goatees and Hulk T-shirts at the end of THE AVENGERS would naturally give birth to a wannabe superhero phenomenon. Ultimately, though, I think Ultron would be a pretty fantastic way to go for the sequel. Throw in some Thanos involvement somehow, a little spousal abuse and leave Coulson right where he is. While a comeback would be a pretty cool element to the story, I think martyrdom best suits the narrative. Anybody mention Quicksilver yet? That dick-head effeminate bastard would be a pretty hilarious addition.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:42 p.m. CST

    Coulson will be the Vision. Just my opinion, but I know I'm right

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • Universal may have let their option lapse. They do, however, still own the rights to your momma.

  • One Transformers movie in one lifetime was enough, thanks.

  • May 13, 2012, 1:56 p.m. CST

    Scarlet Witch a cellist? Where & When?

    by Dead_Kate_Moss

    Tell me!

  • May 13, 2012, 1:57 p.m. CST

    Kevin Feige RULES!!!

    by CoolFrood

    Kevin Feige's face must hurt from all the smiling he surely does as he plots and plans the future of Marvel comics...

  • May 13, 2012, 2:02 p.m. CST

    Before there was Thanos and his Gauntlet

    by Have_Penis_Will_Travel

    There was Thanos and The Cosmic Cube Shield has a cube (or used to. I'm one of the 27) Thanos want's it so hell come to earf to get it and ends up clashing with The Avengers

  • May 13, 2012, 2:26 p.m. CST

    Avengers is ahead of Avatar's pace

    by Hesiod2k7

    The only thing hat will keep it from beating Avatar's box office is much better competition this Summer. Although, I think it's a lock to beat The Dark Knight. Over $100 million in its second weekend? Un-believable.

  • May 13, 2012, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Iron Man 3

    by Sean Kennedy

    I haven't read through all the talkbacks so forgive me if someone else brought this up already. From what little we know of the plot IM3 is going to introduce the extremis virus into the continuity. Obviously in the comics it basically turned Tony into a living computer. Depending on how extremis is used in the movie it is possible it could be used as a way of not only bringing Coulson back but turning him into Vision as well.

  • May 13, 2012, 2:47 p.m. CST

    The Guardians of te Galaxy are idiotic

    by Hesiod2k7

    A movie with Rocket Racoon? Are you fougging kidding me?

  • May 13, 2012, 2:49 p.m. CST

    sakenned

    by Toons

    Yup, I mentioned that in my comment above...I agree with you, there might be a connection there! :)

  • May 13, 2012, 2:53 p.m. CST

    Toons

    by Sean Kennedy

    Yup... Now I see it. As they say, great minds...

  • May 13, 2012, 2:54 p.m. CST

    Second highest grossing?

    by Red Ned Lynch

    I would agree that it is hard to believe that The Avengers will not pass Dark Knight to get the number three slot, but it's a mighty big jump (another 120 million...from 533 to 658) to reach Titanic. The Avengers is at 373 now, which means 160 to pass DK. And yeah, that's a given. The only question is whether it will take two or three weeks (maybe four if Battleship pulls a Transformers...I sure hope it doesn't) to do it. But the big openings over the next four weeks are Battleship, MiB3, Snow White and Prometheus, and all of them are going to pull better numbers than Dark Shadows. I was rooting for Dark Knight to take number two from Titanic and I'm rooting for the Avengers to as well, but the last part of that climb isn't nearly as easy as it looks.

  • May 13, 2012, 3:07 p.m. CST

    Of course when Dark Knight came out...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...it would have been taking number one... ...but you know what I mean.

  • after to film an additional scene(s). Was the after-the-credits meal that scene? Or was it something else (or was it just a joke)?

  • May 13, 2012, 3:51 p.m. CST

    He's an LMD. A Life Model Decoy.

    by technosnob

    I don't care if it's cheesy, I want him back.

  • *raises fists in the air in anger*

  • May 13, 2012, 3:56 p.m. CST

    Vader, I think she is back as Gender_Bender

    by jim

    The fact that she's not around is quite telling. Maybe the DVD will have the version of the movie that's 85 minutes of people standing around talking and 10 minutes of action. Of course, having been banned I think that means all her old posts are gone so she can reply "I never said that" confident no one can serve up that crow. You know the old saying "even a broken clock is right twice a day". With her it is apropos. Saying the same thing over and over about everything: sometimes she'll be right and sometimes she'll be wrong. Maybe her head exploded when the movie was embraced by both the "fangeeks" and the "normals". Like a logic bomb to her very narrow and extremely biased world view. "That's not the way the world works!" kaboom

  • Brilliant, Big Jim. I'd like to think so. The idea of a logic bomb causing that girl's head to explode in a theater just brings a smile to my face.

  • May 13, 2012, 4:04 p.m. CST

    but I've changed my evil ways and quit posting after drinking Vodka.

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 13, 2012, 4:12 p.m. CST

    They needed a reason.

    by jackofhearts29

    And that reason was... Vodka. Or in my case, tequila. Never drink and post, kids!

  • May 13, 2012, 4:19 p.m. CST

    Coulson Lives. We Sleep.

    by LizardMan

  • Had to quit the stuff

  • May 13, 2012, 4:35 p.m. CST

    And without it you're just fucking dull

    by Dead_Kate_Moss

    I just skip your posts

  • "I don't remember what I did" They remember everything "I shouldn't have slept with that guy, I was drunk , I didn't know what I was doing" They knew exactly what they were doing "I don't understand why I have mono" Because you are a whore and a fucking idiot "I'm not responsible for my actions because I drank" You are completely responsible "I have the biggest hangover, I feel awful" Because you're a fucking idiot

  • May 13, 2012, 4:48 p.m. CST

    Well, this thread certainly has gone off topic

    by jim

    I blame the booze

  • May 13, 2012, 5:04 p.m. CST

    Coulson was killed to make room for Maria Hill

    by Crooooooow

    Sad but true.

  • but thats primarily because it faces jack and squat when it comes to competition. This year is an Atrocious year for movies. You have a couple of heavy hitters(spider-man, TDKR, Hobbit, Avengers, Hunger Games), AND NOT MUCH ELSE. Great summers are defined by the width and breadth of their movies, not a couple of standouts in the midst of a pile of shit. There is honestly nothing to look forward to until the start of July. Battleship? Haha. MIB? Like we needed another one of those. Dark Shadows? Dead on Arrival.

  • that was some good vodka, retard loser quims, blow me while I shit!

  • May 13, 2012, 5:28 p.m. CST

    i'm saying he's dead...but

    by Drew

    will definitely be making some more appearances through flashbacks or someone or thing pretending to be him.

  • May 13, 2012, 5:30 p.m. CST

    He's dead.

    by Yelsaeb

    That is all.

  • May 13, 2012, 5:46 p.m. CST

    brad_m_elmore...

    by Immortal_Fish

    Gordon had a beer and CHEETED on his wife. Bad form, sir! Bad form! But DAMN! Saw that trailer and I'm more than interested. I usually don't care for anything based on the Devil's Rejects subculture, but those camera angles sold me. Acting appears sincere, especially the lead. I don't get the use of a hammer, since guitars are often referred to as axes, so that's some potential lost subtext. This still looks better than what Fearnet makes me rummage thru. Will watch the full thing tonight and looking forward to it. Thank you.

  • Why are we so sure that Thanos's cameo promises a "more epic AVENGERS 2?" The teaser at the end of IRON MAN and THOR led into AVENGERS. **BUT** the teaser at the end of IRON MAN 2 led into THOR. What we know about the next THOR movie is slight, but we have been informed that it will be more "cosmic." I think it's just as likely that Thanos will be the villain of THOR 2 as it is AVENGERS 2. What a great way to build hype for the THOR sequel too, instead of viewing it as a disposable place-holder as we wait for the next AVENGERS movie (like the mediocre IRON MAN 2 was).

  • May 13, 2012, 5:55 p.m. CST

    Also - Powers Boothe

    by JonQuixote

    Anyone else notice the "one of these things is not like the other" casting with Fury's cadre of bosses? Anyone else notice that the depiction of these mysterious bureaucrats looks a lot like The Commission and/or The Secret Empire? I'll bet you $1 this pays off in the next CAPTAIN AMERICA movie. Powers Boothe as the proxy for the Red Skull (or some other Nazi/Hydra manipulator) in a storyline that's some variation of the Nixon/Secret Empire or "Man With Steve Rogers' Face" arcs (which were kind of the same thing anyway).

  • May 13, 2012, 6:02 p.m. CST

    Your facts are wrong, Quint. He was stabbed thru the heart

    by Logan_1973

    Just saw it for the 2nd time, and its clear.

  • May 13, 2012, 6:25 p.m. CST

    But were Thor or Banner that emotionally invested in Coulson?

    by simpledao4

  • May 13, 2012, 6:28 p.m. CST

    jonquixote may be on to something-

    by simpledao4

  • May 13, 2012, 6:40 p.m. CST

    Nah.

    by Prior Walter

  • Iron Man has J.A.R.V.I.S., War Machine has C.O.U.L.S.O.N. I'm digging the Vision idea, though.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:01 p.m. CST

    I thought the same thing

    by Greyhawk Grognard

    When they mentioned that the cards weren't in Coulson's pocket, that set up the notion that if Nick Fury could lie about that, he could lie about Coulson being dead. I won't be a bit surprised when Coulson shows up in Iron Man 3.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:04 p.m. CST

    I fully believe Coulson is dead. Furty wasn't lying. But...

    by D.Vader

    I believe Coulson is too much of a good character for the Marvel Universe movies to let go this easily. Which is why I strongly believe he may come back as Vision. Makes total sense. And I dig it.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:09 p.m. CST

    He's the Vision, fucktards! (takes another shot of vodka)

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 13, 2012, 7:18 p.m. CST

    Ripper T Jones, re: Thor and Mjolnir

    by D.Vader

    I took that scene to show its a moment of weakness for everyone on the team. They lost Coulson, Loki got away, and the Helicarrier had been damaged. Thor was having a moment of self-doubt, just like the rest, and as a result, Mjolnir wasn't responding to him as it should. Then Thor said "fuck that" and grabbed Mjolnir and showed it who's boss.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:29 p.m. CST

    Please bring him back..

    by wadi77

    Agent Phil Coulson is the man responsible of assembling the Avengers. "The Glue".

  • May 13, 2012, 7:37 p.m. CST

    Dead

    by Party_Animal_IV

    For some reason I didn't think he was really dead either, but I didn't have any theory as to why. I just didn't buy that he was really dead and gone. Something just didn't ring true. Guess we'll find out sooner or later.

  • May 13, 2012, 7:44 p.m. CST

    I was thinking the same thing after the scene

    by Marc

    Once the comment was made about the cards being in Coulson's locker, I thought the same thing. It leaves the door open to bring him back if they want to.

  • May 13, 2012, 8:01 p.m. CST

    He is not dead

    by mitt

    I had dinner with Bob Downey yesterday, along with his lovely wife Susan, and we had a wonderful time. The Vichyssoise was "formidable". Being a huge fan of this profitable franchise I naturally brought up the topic of this heart-wrenching death scene that concerns and troubles us all. I asked Bob directly and he assured me, in no uncertain terms, that Dr. Phil is NOT DEAD!!! What a relief for me, my lovely wife Ann, and our fine children. Come next November when we finally take back our country from those Loki loving Liberals I plan to offer Bob a very significant position in my govenment, and he has promised me one of those iron suits. Together we can make this happen. CallMeMittster

  • May 13, 2012, 8:11 p.m. CST

    Thor/Mjolnir scene, and a few other questions

    by BlackBauer0320

    After seeing it a second time last night, that scene also had me a bit perplexed. I too wondered what the significance of showing Thor reaching for Mjolnir with a confused flex of of his hand meant. What had me even more baffled though was when they next show him "powering up," it's been about ten minutes since the above mentioned scene. In that time frame, we've had a scene with Fury, Cap, and Stark, the scene with Black Widow and Hawkeye, and the scene in which all of them band together and sneak off onto a plane. I'm not generally a continuity snob, but are we just supposed to assume Thor spent that entire time reaching for Mjolnir? Very bizarre, I felt. Another question - right before the helicarrier gets hijacked, the team is all fighting in the laboratory. Right before the initial explosion, Banner looks at the tracking progress/program for the Tesseract and says "Oh my god." Is this because he realized that it was there on the ship that Hawkeye et. all showed up in? Was unclear about that one.

  • May 13, 2012, 8:33 p.m. CST

    Thor/Mjolnir scene re: cheif brody, d. vader, blackbauer0320

    by ripper t. jones

    Thanks guys for your input. For the life of me I couldnt find a clear cut explination. All that you have posed seem perfectly viable. Thanks again.

  • May 13, 2012, 8:59 p.m. CST

    Bringing Coulson Back...

    by Bishamon

    I don't think it would be a letdown to bring Coulson back because the movie never really established that he was the reason for the Avengers finally coming together. If anything the thing that unified them was Loki and the fact that he was manipulating them to turn against each other. That's what actually gives Stark the push in that scene where he and Cap are talking about Coulson's death. The only mention to "avenging" is when when Stark clearly says, "If we can't protect the Earth you can be damm sure we will Avenge it." No mention of avenging Coulson's death. I was never certain of his death either, so I am convinced with all these references that he could back back as the Vision.

  • May 13, 2012, 9:16 p.m. CST

    Sure thing, Ripper T Jones

    by D.Vader

    Of all characters in the movie, I thought Thor got the shortest amount of attention. That's not a slight on the movie, mind you, just an observation on a fact that had to be true about one of them. That moment where Thor can't retrieve Mjolnir... I think that happens around the same time as Stark and Cap learning about Coulson... Black Widow and Hawkeye having their heart to heart over how many people have died at their hands... Banner waking up in the demolished warehouse. They all happen one after the other, if I remember correctly. So it makes sense that Thor would, at that moment, after facing possible imminent death for a demigod at the hands of the brother he couldn't stop (because of his own bull-headedness), have a moment of self-doubt where Mjolnir didn't react to him. Its in the same vein of Peter Parker losing his powers in Spider-Man 2 because of the conflict and stress of having to be two people at once. That's my explanation anyway. As far as the movie narrative goes, its a dark time for every character. How do you make a God go through a moment comparable to that of the others? The answer is to make him unsure of his own power and make him doubt himself, make him fear that he is once again unworthy of his power.

  • May 13, 2012, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Another possibility: Coulsen possesses Michelle Pfieffer's body??

    by MARCEL_THE_NEGRO_PROJECTIONIST

    I mean, it happened before, it could happen again!

  • May 13, 2012, 11:53 p.m. CST

    He was dating a cellist.

    by Wheel99

    Vision and Scarlet Witch are a couple. Scarlet Witch was a Cellist.......... Dun Dun Dun!!!

  • May 13, 2012, 11:59 p.m. CST

    J'onn J'onzz + Red Tornado = The Vision

    by Crimson Dynamo

  • t seemed important enough for him to retweet

  • May 14, 2012, 1:58 a.m. CST

    Coulson as Vision

    by leroyspoboys

    Coulson will be back, and as an LMD (you might get a a cool shot with multiple Coulsons in the same scene kicking ass), but you'll never see the Vision on the big screen. To do Vision justice you'd also have to introduce Ultron and Wonder Man. Coulson is no Simon Williams. You might see Ultron at some stage (possibly in one of the individual films, most likely an Iron Man that also introduces Pym), but you'll never see Wonder Man. He's just too goofy a character with a goofy name. And his powers don't add anything 'new' to the overall mix. He's basically an immortal Cap, with the strength of Thor, and can fly. Whoop-de-do. And to introduce Wonder Man and be true to his prigin (as they mostly have with the others) you'd have to have Zemo, Enchantress and the Masters of Evil in the same film. Not gonna happen. Hence: No Vision. The rest... Thanos will be in in Thor 2, trying to get his hands on the Cube again, but end up in the end escaping with the Infinity Gauntlet which we've all seen in Odin's trophy room. Cue Avengers 2: INFINITY [Gauntlet] Avengers 2 will only add Hank Pym to the mix. Janet will be a background character. By the time they get around to Avengers 3, a lot more properties will be back in Marvel's hands or revenue sharing deals will be struck so they can do a decent job on: Avengers 3: [Secret] WAR

  • May 14, 2012, 2:33 a.m. CST

    Again Scarlet Witch, Cellist?

    by Dead_Kate_Moss

    Where & When or you're just making it up!

  • May 14, 2012, 2:39 a.m. CST

    i am really disappointed by this article

    by yourSTEPDADDY

    when i saw there was a theory, for some reason, i expected something new or original. everyone has been speculating if coulson is alive or not. hundreds has mentioned coulson being vision. and many others say "shut the hell up, coulson is dead" i expected this kinda bait article from other contributors, but not quint. anyhoo, yea, i agree with what you said.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:47 a.m. CST

    blackbauer0320 re: Banner and the Tesseract location

    by Greg McCambley

    After I watched that scene when the Tesseract was located, I found it clear that his "Oh My God" was because the Tesseract showed up in New York. Add to that the fact that he and Stark had been working for some time (and Stark no doubt spoke about his new building), and he probably guessed that Stark's building was the location. Later, when Stark realised it, he figured correctly that Banner had already figured it out.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:52 a.m. CST

    The first thing I thought

    by hst666

    when they cut away to the Avengers' reactions and Nick Fury saying they could not save him was that Coulson was still alive. Nick would totally have manipulated them. Certainly possible. Also possible he's really dead. Lots of people insisted Two-Face was dead dead at the end of The Drak Knight as well. Did not seem likely to me at the time and Eckhardt's involvement in the new movie suggest I was right.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:55 a.m. CST

    Jesus Fuck, Quint.

    by Half-Baked-Goggle-Box-Do-Gooder

    You sound like your Tea Party sign-up kit arrived in the mail. How much is Ron Paul PAYING you to spread this silly bullshit around ?

  • May 14, 2012, 6:05 a.m. CST

    Not Ultron....

    by the1980mutant

    Im 99% sure he aint dead, hell in the last frame it looks like him. Plus we all know he signed to 6 pics, Damn nerds, come on, he's alive! Nick Fury already lied about his death. That being said, we are prolly getting an Adam Warlock/Guardians of the Universe movie which Feigne said he was going to do anyway. Nova will be pour Silver Surfer, MARVEL has to proceed with who they have, so we'll get Thanos in part TWO and look for Infinity gems in eacj movie. Hell, its our conjecture that Loki had a gem, it would explain why they were whiggin out on the helicarrier when Loki was still imprisoned...think about it..... Just sayin.

  • May 14, 2012, 6:09 a.m. CST

    Avengers has passed Dark Knight

    by Hipshot

    At the International box office. Oops!

  • May 14, 2012, 6:10 a.m. CST

    AWWW...

    by Johnny Wrong

    ...did Quinty's boyfriend die in the ickle fillum? There there, Quinty. It's all gonna be OK. But he is dead. You have to get to grips with that.

  • May 14, 2012, 6:29 a.m. CST

    Assume that

    by Larry Jay

    There never really was a "Phil Coulson" and that throughout the previous episodes leading up to "The Avengers" he has been and ALWAYS WAS an LMD. The reference to the tech was dropped for a reason. Consider that the "unflappable" Phil "Coulson" never smiles, never cracks a joke, never panics in the face of adversity. Sits patiently for hours (or days) waiting for an appointment with Stark. The only time he exhibits ANY humanity is in his first meeting with Cap which could have been scripted and programmed to make Cap sympathetic to the LMD. The device is a Life Model DECOY. It is intended to distract and mislead you. Whether enemy or friend. For all we know, the "real" Phil Coulson could be operating the device by telepresence. Not a stretch from technologies that currently exist. If he was never alive, he can always be brought back.

  • May 14, 2012, 6:38 a.m. CST

    Oh and the vision

    by Larry Jay

    Is already part of the movie Marvel Universe. See Captain America and the Stark Expo and the display tha says "The Amazing Synthetic Man" or something to that effect.

  • May 14, 2012, 7:30 a.m. CST

    Damn, Darth Philbin I think you nailed it. I remember the quote, but didn't

    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    think about it that way until you just hit it. I dub thee King of the Nerds, and Lord of the Geeks.

  • May 14, 2012, 7:41 a.m. CST

    And the ticking clock wasn't silent after he died!

    by tonagan

    Sorry, I got that confused with Tony's death on 24.

  • May 14, 2012, 8:03 a.m. CST

    I would agree that Agent Coulson has left the building

    by impossibledreamers

    The theory about him tying the films together, even though Fury makes all those cameo appearances holds true and with Avengers finally gathered and doing their job - he has effectively done his. Also, do note the addition of Maria Hill who will likely now function as our connection to Fury in the field. So, not only has Coulson job's ended but they have a solid replacement.

  • May 14, 2012, 8:08 a.m. CST

    You guys are thinking way too much on Vision

    by D.Vader

    Having Vision in the movies does NOT require Ultron, Pym, or Wonder Man.

  • So I can absolutely see this being the case.

  • You can argue that the comics don't count, or that transplanting pieces of personality don't count, but the fact is, Whedon couldn't fully commit to killing this character.

  • Personally, I'm not certain why the comic book character THE VISION is called "The Vision"...but in the movie world, he could be called that because of his "vision" of his belief in the team coming together. There is so much buzz and fanboy desire to see Coulson become the Vision...I would not be surprised if he does. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the scientist who helps make it happen was Dr. Henry Pym.

  • In the Marvel universe, The Vision's body is the repurposed android body of the original Human Torch (who we all saw on display at the World's Fair in Captain America...the story is pretty convoluted. So...the Vision is/can be a very natural segue for the next movie with Pym using Coulson's brain patterns for the Vision.

  • I'm not a super comic nerd, so I don't have any real emotion toward the character of agent Coulson. I seriously didn't consider him anything more than a typical "government type" character who was just there to tell the main characters when someone had escaped, or when some big threat was headed their way. It doesn't help that the dude playing Coulson is one of those actors who shows up everywhere, but you never know who he is. Y'know a guy who can't ever carry a movie but usually hangs out in the background while Will Smith battles the aliens. Anyway I guess I'm saying dead, not dead, I really don't care.

  • I didn't think of The Vision though.

  • May 14, 2012, 9:24 a.m. CST

    @aaronius

    by sapno_krei

    Funny thing is, Coulson was created for the first IRON MAN movie, and did not originate from the comics.

  • May 14, 2012, 9:52 a.m. CST

    TIMES UP - SCARLET WITCH HAS NEVER PLAYED THE CELLO

    by Dead_Kate_Moss

    Funny how one person says it and so many people are like... 'oh yeah, she does! ' (secretly "I can't remember that, but fuck it, I'll repeat the lie anyway.'

  • May 14, 2012, 9:57 a.m. CST

    You're all missing it...

    by Excronimuss

    In the USA maybe they redubbed the dialogue, but here in Australia his last words to Fury were along the lines of "we've been kidding ourselves. It was never going to work". In other words, the Avengers Initiative was a longshot that wasn't going to work because of the egos and fractious nature of the individual supes. So Coulson died thinking the idea of the team was a failure. And the "team" were already up in arms that SHIELD/Fury had hidden agendas. So Fury throwing the blood spattered cards on the table was a lie. His saying "Coulsen died believing in you guys" was ALSO a LIE. This couple of sentences established Nick Fury as a pragmatic man willing to do whatever it takes to get his own way. In other words, Nick is not to be trusted. To me that was good storytelling, a few words revealing a lot about a particular character and motivation.

  • May 14, 2012, 10:02 a.m. CST

    Pym, Ultron, Wonder Man, The Vision

    by Barron34

    These are all classic second and third tier Avengers characters, so I think that Whedon and Feige could be more flexible about their origins. Cap, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk are all first tier characters, so their movie versions had to hew pretty close to Marvel Canon. With Pym and the Vision and so on, I think that you could deviate from their original stories a bit without pissing off too many Marvel purists (I am a life-long Marvel-lite since childhood, but understand that the movies might diverge from the comics). I think that Pym should be brought into the Avengers. I also think his wife, Janet Pym, should be brought in with his character if even just to get another female hero into the movies. Ultron is a major Avengers villain, and you can't use Ultron properly without setting up the story of his creator, Dr. Hank Pym. The Vision is another core Avengers character, but would be difficult to portray properly. The idea of "down-loading" Agent Coulson's mind into an android body and him becoming the Vision would be a deviation from canon, but I have no objection to it, and it actually makes a strange sort of sense. Also, I think that the guy who plays Coulson could manage to play the Vision well. Lastly, I think Wonder Man is a fairly extraneous character, but I would like to see a bunch of thirid-tier characters eventually do cameos, just because it would be neat to see them on-screen. I was a fan of Wonder Man's as a kid, mainly because I would have liked to have had his powers. I can imagine Nathan Fillion playing him. He was kind of a superficial but regular guy who had very strong powers.

  • May 14, 2012, 10:10 a.m. CST

    Yeah and Darth Maul will come back as a fucking cyborg

    by Jaster Mareel

    Let. It. Go.

  • May 14, 2012, 10:20 a.m. CST

    Bring him back....

    by closeencounter

    Please?

  • May 14, 2012, 10:46 a.m. CST

    But Darth Maul DID come back as a cyborg

    by D.Vader

  • May 14, 2012, 10:53 a.m. CST

    Gotta remember Whedon WILL kill off main characters though

    by Kremzeek

    Maybe it's been said already (I admit I didn't read the entire TB), but you've got to remember that Joss Whedon is notorious for permanently killing off main characters. Granted, I realize the Marvel film world is much larger than Whedon and his one movie. I know there are a lot of cogs turning - a lot of planning and lead-up that went into this. So, with that in mind, I can definitely see how Coulson's death may not have been solely due to Whedon. However, Whedon is exactly the type of guy to say, "Hey, Disney, I want to kill off Coulson because I think the film needs that emotionally beat. It's important." And then Disney says... agrees. Definitely could've happened that way. But we'll see. It's fun to theorize, but it really needs to be pointed out that Whedon has done this plenty of times before - most infamously with Wash on Firefly. So, it's highly likely Coulson is actually dead.

  • May 14, 2012, 10:59 a.m. CST

    Jim Starlin interview with LA Times.

    by Hesiod2k7

    http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/05/11/avengers-spoiler-special-mystery-villains-creator-speaks-out/ Lots of very interesting stuff.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:22 a.m. CST

    Whedon Deaths

    by ripper t. jones

    Seems to me that Mr. Whedon is developing the trademark of killing off the audience surrogate in his movies. ***spoilers*** ie: Wash in Serenity, The Black Guard in Cabin in the Woods and now Coulson in the Avengers. ***end spoilers*** But then who knows if Coulsons death was Marvel mandated or not.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:30 a.m. CST

    Rights to marvel Characters

    by Notliw

    Where do yo go to look up what studio has rights to marvel characters? I'm curious who has rights to characters like Black Panther and Luke Cage. I hope the studios take note on not insulting the viewers intelligence and not take liberties with the characters. There's a reason they've withstood the test of time.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:31 a.m. CST

    I wonder why

    by Buddapest

    they opted to do the very first Marvel one-shot mini film centered around Coulson...? Seems like they were building his cred up for some reason; maybe he's not human. He seemed a little too good to be true in "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to Albuquerque"...and then, when he died in Avengers, the way his eyes shut seemed mechanical, and Fury didn't even shut them. Fury referred to Coulson as "my only good eye," and what is an eye good for but, say, "Vision"?

  • May 14, 2012, 11:32 a.m. CST

    Dead.

    by jgsugden

    This may be Marvel, but it is also Joss Whedon. Sacrifice must mean something. You don't just come back and jump into the action again. There is not enough time in a movie series to bring back Coulson, even when you could the 15 or so movies that may add up to Avengers 2 and 3. Does that mean the actor is done in the Marvel Universe? Not necessarily. Stark mentioned one option: Life Model Decoy - a Marvel/Shield mainstay. A second option is to upgrade him to a main character that wears make-up: He'd make a good Vision (and any similarities between Coulson and Vision could be explained if Stark has any influence on the creation of Vision). Finally - Flashbacks. RIP is Rest in Peace. Let him.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:48 a.m. CST

    Whedon comments on Coulson's death. Pretty definitive.

    by BadMrWonka

    "In our first meeting Kevin Feige said, this is what we're gonna do and I said, 'Oh but you have to go out there and tell everybody that it was your idea because this is going to get me so much shit. Because they are all going to be like, 'Oh he did it again!' It was stipulated from the beginning, and I completely agree that it was the right thing to do, and so did Clark. Who said in the early days, when I was busy apologizing for it, 'In a movie like this, with what's going on if there isn't some toll, it's just irresponsible story telling.'"

  • May 14, 2012, 11:52 a.m. CST

    Breakdown of which studios have marvel character rights:

    by Hesiod2k7

    http://screenrant.com/marvel-comics-movies-characters-carl-6766/

  • May 14, 2012, 11:57 a.m. CST

    Joss Whedon Didn't Write The Story

    by Dead_Kate_Moss

    Zak Penn wrote the story. Whedon rewrote the screenplay. Coulson was probably dead in Penn's story. But never mind about that, someone prove to me this shit about Wanda playing the cello!!!

  • May 14, 2012, 12:01 p.m. CST

    I hope he comes back as The Vision...

    by Blue_Demon

    Having Loki kill an LMD is a cop-out on the level of "It was all a dream!" Having him come back as The Vision, with all the moral problems it would cause for Stark and Company would be a great device for more tension. And finally...I loved that Thanos moment. When the Chitauri leader says that anyone foolish enough to attack earth "courts death" and Thanos turns and smiles...man, I was grinning ear to ear.

  • May 14, 2012, 12:13 p.m. CST

    ridiculous..he's dead..deal with it.

    by FleshMachine

    d-e-a-d.

  • May 14, 2012, 12:22 p.m. CST

    @hesiod2k7

    by Notliw

    Thanks for the link. Looks like we COULD get a Power Man & Iron Fist (Buddy Cop?) movie. I was surprised to see that Power Pack was even mentioned. I see potential in that one.

  • May 14, 2012, 12:28 p.m. CST

    of course Coulson is still alive!

    by joee60

    Coulson's "last words" to Nick Fury that it was too bad they couldn't get (the Avengers Initiative) to work, then his perceived death unites them! The Playing Cards in his locker, not in his pocket like Fury said. The Movie did everything but reveal Coulson alive and well at the End. It wasn't a Cop Out; it was all plotted out.

  • May 14, 2012, 12:57 p.m. CST

    Zak pen only got credit for writing the story...

    by riskebiz

    ...Joss threw out everything, EVERYTHING, that Zak had done. But Zak was paid, so he gets a credit. But nothing Zak contributed ended up on screen.

  • May 14, 2012, 12:58 p.m. CST

    Coulson = LMD?

    by tk863

    Consider that Tony Stark used the "Life Model Decoy" term in his Loki confrontation - was it just used for fanboy/geek service, or to indicate that LMDs are indeed existing in the MU on screen? If so, is it possible that the "real" Coulson is alive, and his LMD was shish-kabobbed by Loki, and Fury is deceiving the Avengers by not revealing Coulson's death was actually that of an LMD? That's where my money is on this...

  • May 14, 2012, 1:07 p.m. CST

    Worried about Thanos storyline...

    by riskebiz

    Okay, so the same Chitauri are the threat, but instead of it being Loki heading them it'll be Thanos? Doesn't that feel a bit redundant? And if it's all outer-spacey...does that make it less grounded? Yeah, I've read the Infinity Gauntlet and all that. I've never thought of Thanos as an "Avengers" villain. I thought of him as Thanos VS. Every-Hero-Marvel-Has. Personally, I would like the Ultron...or Korvac (with Jude Law as Korvac).

  • May 14, 2012, 1:28 p.m. CST

    I'm there baby!

    by UltraTron

  • May 14, 2012, 1:34 p.m. CST

    Vision

    by know mad

    Just to put my thoughts out there, it seems to me that if we were to see Vision, the most logical path in the Marvel Cinematic Universe as it exists today is for Tony to make an android body for Jarvis. And Ultron? The discarded nanotech from IM3 evolves into sentient Ultron.

  • May 14, 2012, 2:32 p.m. CST

    He was a Life Model Decoy

    by joevfx

    Think about it. Fury uses them in the comics all the time, he is never actually the real nick fury, and Stark actually dropped the Life Model Decoy line in the beginning of the movie with coulson at start tower. He is totally an android and will be back and be the reason the avengers turn against shield, cause they were manipulated and can't trust them.

  • May 14, 2012, 2:37 p.m. CST

    Swing and a miss, Gmork

    by JohnnyKrypton

    "A cracker jack team would be a pile of fuck-ups." Er...no. 'Crackerjack' means top quality.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:22 p.m. CST

    Ultron...

    by Blue_Demon

    I remember reading an old interview with John Byrne where he said that every time Avengers ran into Ultron he would be "Ultron 6" or 7 or whatever. He said that Ultron was the only character whose name told you how many times his ass had been kicked.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:23 p.m. CST

    Original Human Torch

    by sobrien

    What if he were more than a LMD? What if he were the Original Human Torch? That would explain his attachment to Captain America, it would make him the like Ultron servant(s) that is seen in many of the cartoon versions of the Avengers. It would let him be the Vision from the comic continuity. He always seemed a little mechanical and humorless. (In the most charming and endearing way.)

  • May 14, 2012, 3:36 p.m. CST

    Coulson was a worthless character to begin with

    by Rupee88

    well not worthless but he won't be missed. And I think the Earth getting fucked in the ass was enough motivation for the Avengers to come together and fight..they didn't need some dude dying who they didn't even know that well...love the film but that one plot device was weak

  • May 14, 2012, 3:45 p.m. CST

    @sapno_krei

    by AARONIUS

    Ah, well there you go. If he wasn't even in the comic books, I don't really see what all the fuss over his death is about. Thanks for the info. Now I don't have to waste my time scouring every comic shop from east to west looking for Iron Man issue# whatever featuring Agt. Coulson's first appearance lol.

  • May 14, 2012, 3:59 p.m. CST

    joe60: "It was never going to work...

    by JonQuixote

    unless they had something to...(arrrgh)" The word Coulson died before he spat out was "Avenge" (and thank goodness - total cheese, there). Which, of course, doesn't really answer the (in my opinion, stupid) question of whether or not he's really dead (he is). But there's no clue in that comment. He either dies or Fury makes it look like he dies (he dies) - but either way the Avengers now have something to, well, you know.

  • May 14, 2012, 4:16 p.m. CST

    In the Marvel Comics Kate Bishop is the cellist... look it up

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 14, 2012, 4:18 p.m. CST

    So yep Wanda/Scarlet Witch does not play cello

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • May 14, 2012, 4:30 p.m. CST

    Not Wanda/Scarlet Witch...

    by Lloyd Fenton

  • So you fat baby boomers who still pine to be superheroes are so excited that the avengers has a chance to beat avatar for box office king, as if that was the greatest moment in your life, proving you dont have one. I hope it does just so we don't have any suicides from any of you for at least one more day. I read on one of the hunger games threads(cant remember who - you'll check for me) one guy exclaiming "yah 12 year old girls eat it"(LOL). As if the avengers were mature fare. As if it was an alternative and finally they were making films for adults again. As if white males were under-represented in movies and Hollywood no longer catered to your constituency and you were finally getting relief. If that sac of shit who no doubt speaks for the majority here knew what irony meant he wouldn't have said that regarding men and superhero films which are made for 5 year old kids. We all know why you fat bastards hate avatar and it isnt because of its plot which you claim is unoriginal. Like there was any originality in anything least of all the avengers. The chitauri are boring garbage meant to be combustible characters for your heroes. The action sequence they are in doesnt anywhere match avatar's and in many ways tries to mimic it, but turns into a yawnfest instead. Say weren't they trying to open a portal in one of the transformers movies? Can't remember they all look the same. Who isn't trying to open a portal anyway. Then they are just going to throw stupid robots at you for filler. Thor end - bot, Ironman - bots, avengers - yeah they all are bots .Next X-men films umhhh I'm guessing bots. Had any other films did this shit you losers would have pointed it out. No we all no why you hate avatar. It's because you're fat murderservative nazi conservacocksuckers who grow more conservative with age and weight. You love your soldier stories and demand their point of view as if they were the nobility of this world and are fully invested in that propoganda machine. Had Cameron made the navi blue vampires and the villans you'd be sucking his cock. You call environmental messages liberal bs and wished the indigenous people would be nuked from orbit. You can't even be original in your own lines. You wish cameron would go back and make another terminator movie or true lies and aliens. You are the cliches. We all know you have a disease just come out and say it.

  • May 14, 2012, 4:59 p.m. CST

    LIFE MODEL DECOY

    by Chuck_Cobra

    Would be an excellent way of showing Fury's manipulation. And they teased at it with Tony Stark's throw away line. Coulson didn't die. It was the decoy! :)

  • May 14, 2012, 6:29 p.m. CST

    "I am a leaf on the wind. Watch how I--"

    by Joelseph01

    Coulson is dead. Joss isn't cheap like that.

  • May 14, 2012, 6:44 p.m. CST

    Nope, Clark Gregg says he's dead.

    by Dkev00

    http://to.ly/dtmR

  • May 14, 2012, 6:46 p.m. CST

    by Rob Taylor

    We all worked it out... Marvel knew we would, and there's FA wrong with that... Gregg deserves a larger role and as Vision he gets it, were they really gonna cast Alan Rickman? No! As for Wonder Man... The Rock, as a UFC/Wrestler who "owns" the world, but is hiding his powers... Fury blackmails him... If you smell...

  • May 14, 2012, 6:50 p.m. CST

    Coulson becomes Captain Mar-Vell and kicks Thanos' ass.

    by Bob Cryptonight

    Kree shmee....

  • May 14, 2012, 7:08 p.m. CST

    I have a theory....

    by Terence James

    Get out more. It's not healthy to think this hard about a summer movie.

  • May 14, 2012, 7:27 p.m. CST

    Quint, you weren't playing attention

    by LordJiggy

    If you didn't immediately catch that it was only Fury's voice announcing the death. And I agree...if it's a bait n' switch (Spock Dies! Spock Lives! Spock Directs the Next Movie), it really would drain a lot of emotional weight out of the movie and a minor character who also gave the movie (and a lot of the characters) heart.

  • May 14, 2012, 7:38 p.m. CST

    I've got a theory!

    by Fico

    It doesn't matter...what can't we face if we're together? What's in this place that we can't weather? There's nothing we can't face...except for bunnies

  • May 14, 2012, 7:55 p.m. CST

    Coulson as the Vision is a load of crap!

    by Norm3

    Coulson is not the Vision. Never was never will be movie clueless fanboy geeks! Read the damn comic book for change movie only posers!

  • May 14, 2012, 9:03 p.m. CST

    He will return...as Adam Warlock!!!!

    by King Conan

    mark my words people.

  • May 14, 2012, 9:27 p.m. CST

    thoughts on coulson

    by clyhrrs

    just saw avengers 4 2nd time. loved it again. guys, 4 the record, joss whedon is gonna do what joss whedon is gonna do.....we can all theorize. and i dont mind if coulson stays dead....but who stays dead in comic-books anyway, let alone comic-book-movies? what does stark say when coulson calls him on the phone? " This is a Life Model Decoy of Tony Stark. Please leave a message" i think Coulson is dead, but they bring him back its because the fanboys want him back, and thats how they'll "resurrect" him.... possibly they'll bring in ultron,extremis ( i hear extremis will be in iron man 3 anyway), hank pym, AND the vision , and use the LMD tech to string it all together. or whedon may bring in the swordsman instead....im holding out 4 adam warlock ( who else should take out thanos?)

  • May 14, 2012, 10:18 p.m. CST

    Life Model Decoy Yo'

    by happybunni

  • May 14, 2012, 10:22 p.m. CST

    Agreed.

    by Lain Of The Net

    Nick gets things done.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:05 p.m. CST

    Wow i think Sagamanus is angry

    by Mark

    he must like the blue people in avatar a lot. As in he has cartoon porn of them and spanks the monkey to them, a lot. Avatar is a good movie the Avengers is a good movie The dark Knight is a good movie. All were very enjoyable and put together really well. Calling everyone that liked the Avengers fat lazy over the hill neocon nazis its whats truly pathetic dude. Its a very well put together enjoyable movie get the fuck over yourself.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:17 p.m. CST

    @macraider

    by sagamanus

    Lol angry. I'm not a baby booming dinosaur whose nostalgia has to be serviced every minute of everyday like the ppl on this forum. Where they think superhero movies should rule the world because they hate anything to do with films that are suppsedly for women(titanic) or anti military and soldier(avatar). When they pretend to be apolitical, but in actuality are overweight conservatives that never grew up. As for avatar porn I doubt there is a computer that has more terabytes of porn involving children and family members than yours. PS Ill direct you toward the Jenny Craig website if you can't find it

  • May 14, 2012, 11:34 p.m. CST

    sagamanus

    by Mark

    did you miss the part were i said i thought avatar was a good movie? i also thought titanic was a good movie? so what does that make me? i like a wide spectrum of movies, but i guess because i also liked the Avengers im some kind of fat over the hill neocon nazi that also looks at child porn? I simply thought it was a fun movie. like i said get over your self, your nothing but an assclown that thinks very highly of himself. stereotyping an entire group of people just because they like a movie is simply lame. I guess we should only enjoy movies that have deep insight and altruistic motives that make us feel bad about ourselves. Or maybe people just want to see fun escapist movies occassionally, you fucking dipshit.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:45 p.m. CST

    @totalreality re: facescanning comment

    by adeceasedfan

    Yes, I am an idiot. Thanks for pointing that out, asshole ;) Now my theory is shot.

  • May 14, 2012, 11:47 p.m. CST

    Valhalla, anyone?

    by CreamCheeseAlchemist

    That way he gets a cameo but we don't have to see Nick Fury doing something as creepy as giving a cyborg the face of a dead friend/co-worker... And I'm still more sad that Mattel's current He-Man line just killed off Man@Arms...

  • May 14, 2012, 11:52 p.m. CST

    @macraider

    by sagamanus

    You sound angry mac and too much cheese. Are there problems at home? Did you get a new gf and have to go through the long process of introducing her to your small penis(Which only your mom likes btw)?

  • May 14, 2012, 11:55 p.m. CST

    @macraider

    by sagamanus

    Oh and who cares if your diff than everyone else on the forum. Then you wouldn't have needed to respond to my original post. Because clearly I have only encountered the type I was talking about.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:01 a.m. CST

    Lol

    by Mark

    Thats all you got huh, mom and penis putdowns, i thought you were the big thinker of deep thoughts and we were all braindead nazis? go back to watching your cartoon porn trollboy, your boring me now.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:13 a.m. CST

    Fuck All Of You!

    by Queefer Sutherland

    Just fuck you fucking fuckers.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:33 a.m. CST

    His name was Agent Coulson

    by hubdizzle

  • May 15, 2012, 5:27 a.m. CST

    The cellist is...Squirrel Girl! Anyhow, writing Coulson

    by Bedknobs and Boomsticks

    attempting to take on Loki was idiotic. Totally out of character.

  • May 15, 2012, 8:23 a.m. CST

    The character should be dead

    by Samuel Fulmer

    It's not like they killed off Thor or Captain America in the movie. If they can't stick to their guns on this one, then they should just give up.

  • May 15, 2012, 9:54 a.m. CST

    The Vision seems obvious

    by alpha

    Movies and TV can deviate from the comics sometimes for the better (Walking Dead keeping Shane alive for 2 seasons for instance). The Vision is a great character and the actor resembles him enough that it could work. The current Avengers cast isn't sustainable for any long term but adding Vision, Scarlet Witch and a couple of others over the next couple of films could make it a long term viable franchise.

  • May 15, 2012, 10:55 a.m. CST

    @macraider

    by sagamanus

    Lol. You're pathetic as I thought.Opening with a masturbation comment then wondering why someone would do the same. Had you not put that in we could have remained civil, but of course you couldn't resist. You're embarassing.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:03 p.m. CST

    No One Mentioned Cosmic Cube is at Project Pegasus

    by Tthenomad

    I hate posting here....but lets see who was kept at project Pegasus.... Subjects Aleksei Sytsevich (Rhino) Ulysses Klaw (Klaw) Maxwell Dillon (Electro) Karla Sofen (Moonstone) Marcus Daniels (Blackout) Silas King (Solarr) Bres Robert Hunter (Nitro) Terrence Sorenson (Equinox) Hubert and Pinky Fusser (Fusion) Robert Frank, Jr (Nuklo) Wundarr the Aquarian Thundra Alison Blaire (Dazzler) Kl'rt (Captain Marvel) - The Super-Skrull in disguise Angler Ronald English (Atom Smasher) - His corpse was examined by the Project. Kayla Ballantine Fletcher Traynor (Biohazard) Mark Scarlotti (Blacklash) Joseph Cartelli (Blue Shield) Brotherhood of Mutants Robots Magneto Robot Mastermind Robot Quicksilver Robot William "Willie" Evans William Foster (Giant-Man) Incandescent Man Voletta Todd (Ion) Jack Hart (Jack of Hearts) Kismet Psigns of the Times 14 33 99 107 Wendell Vaughn (Quasar) Squadron Supreme Arcanna Jones (Arcanna) William "Billy" Roberts (Doctor Spectrum) Harold Danforth (Haywire) Mark Milton (Hyperion) Zarda (Power Princess) Raleigh Lund (Shape) Linda Lewis (Skylark) Stanley Stewart (Whizzer) Mortimer Toynbee (Toad) Prof. Alton Francis Vibreaux (Vibro) Vision Vector (Simon Utrecht) - Incarcerated at Project Pegasus. Badly beaten by Darkhawk when he tries to escape. X-Ray (James "Jimmy" Darnell) - Incarcerated at Project Pegasus. Tries to escape with Vector but is confronted by Nova

  • May 15, 2012, 12:04 p.m. CST

    Civil discussion? lol

    by Mark

    You call everyone that liked a movie nazi's and then you talk about a civil discussion? Considering 93% of the 100's of millions of people WORLDWIDE have enjoyed the Avengers, you painting them with a brush as nazis is ludicrous at best. Ive seen the movie twice and there were people of every age, sex, and race in the theater all enjoying the movie. But i guess blacks, jews, hispanics, orientals and women are all nazi's also. You probably havent even seen the movie if your spouting that kind of hogwash. Whats embarrassing is when you open your mouth to speak or type big words you dont understand on a keyboard. Sometimes a movie is just a movie and sometimes they can even just be fun. Not everything has to have some deep meaning or sinister undertones moron.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:14 p.m. CST

    I don't know about this so much but

    by MainMan2001

    Saw Avengers again last night and it was way Better a second time around. The last 3 rd if the film is utterly brilliant and the best part. I mean from the shield aircraft attack until the end is pure comic book extasty. Def runs long at points but nothing major. Like 10mins cut out. Great film. The second will be better though.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:31 p.m. CST

    @macraider

    by sagamanus

    WTF are you even talking about? My original statement opened with the heading that it was decent. Lol are you a level reader? You put up a straw man argument when I'm adressing the morons on this forum and their stupid underlying nonsense regarding avatar and their desire to have it beat out with a superhero film you fat bastard. Then you start talking about 'not everything has to be a serious film'. Huh? That would be like saying 'not everything has to concern the Crimean war' it makes no god damn sense. Since I never even mentioned whether a film has to have deep meaning or not. You put up another argument you were having in that small world you call a brain again.

  • You're obviously referring to Fred, who never came back. We got Illyria "lying" and pretending to be Fred, but once Fred's soul disentigrated we never saw or heard from the real Fred again.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:37 p.m. CST

    At the moron again Lol

    by sagamanus

    You prove how stupid you really are whwn you say"But i guess blacks, jews, hispanics, orientals and women are all nazi's also". since I was the one who brought up the fact that the ppl on this stupid forum hate titanic because it's "feminine' and they're so much more man then everyone else watching so called sdult movies. They dismiss the twilight films again as female garbage but retreat into superhero films as adult male fare. This shit mnakes me laugh. You've proven to be in the same category. I guess it'll take a few more posts to reveal what you really think.

  • May 15, 2012, 12:44 p.m. CST

    He's dead dude

    by Patch

    LIVE IN THE NOW!

  • May 15, 2012, 12:51 p.m. CST

    Lol

    by Mark

    what i really think is your a complete moron that makes no sense whatsoever.

  • I thought you were bored of me. Lol. Idiots always come back to the trough

  • May 15, 2012, 1:33 p.m. CST

    The bigger Scribe Sin would be leaving him dead

    by lettersoftransit

    When you are just one of the writers on a serialized story or franchise, it can be a bit of bad form to amp up the emotion of your story by robbing from the future installments -- e.g. by tipping a secret or emotional touchstone that is supposed to occur later. Or... and this is a big one, by killing a character who is so core to the series that you leave future writers (and audience members) without that character in the future. Will future Avengers-related films be as good without Coulson? Will any SHIELD movie be as good? Arguably, no. But it's also a cheat to have fake deaths. So, I agree that the point of the cards scene reflects numerous discussions behind the scenes about how to have it both ways... yeah they killed him and didn't really kill him, but they gave the audience all the info it needed to realize that he hadn't really died, so it's not a cheat, either. My daughter figured this out so quickly she was already spouting this theory while the film was rolling and had to be shushed. Then the asshole that shushed her had to have his ass kicked, because rude or not, she's my daughter.

  • May 15, 2012, 1:41 p.m. CST

    He will be the Vision

    by Aaron Mcdermott

    Lets face it, his face is perfect. It would represent a big departure from the Vision's origin story, however.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:20 p.m. CST

    What if Dr. Steven Strange is his surgeon?

    by Muuka

    WHAT IF!!!!!!

  • May 15, 2012, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Pym/Stark

    by Felix

    An insecure an anxious Simon Pegg as Hank Pym would be the perfect counterpoint to RDJ's suave and super cool Tony Stark. Opposite ends of the genius inventor spectrum. I'd love to see Hank in the next Avengers with a Ultron/Vision storyline that runs through Iron Man 3 and Ant-Man. I was sort of disappointed to see Thanos teased at the end of Avengers.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:35 p.m. CST

    So... the Vision is Coulson, and Scarlet Witch played the cello.

    by Triple_J_72

    I think you've all lost your fucking minds.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:38 p.m. CST

    Got the same impression.

    by nonsensical

    The entire movie I expected Coulson to hobble his way onto the bridge, or Fury to tell him it worked. I felt the death was a necessary tool to bring the team together, but I also felt like it was another of Fury's manipulations. Even before Hill informs Cap, Stark and the audience that those cards were in Clouson's locker, I felt like his death was too fast. Medics arrived on screen just after he lost consciousness. Fury informs the whole team that Coulson is down. Hill orders medics to the scene and Fury tells her that they are there while he moves from the scene. Seconds later he informs everyone that Coulson is gone. That the medics called it and he's dead. While watching that moment I felt like Fury was on the move. It was clear later that he stopped at Coulson's locker. This left me feeling like he would pop up again in the movie at any time. He didn't but that nagged at me through the whole rest of the film. Still, the return of Coulson wouldn't surprise me. I'd enjoy it immensely but it wouldn't surprise me.

  • May 15, 2012, 3:45 p.m. CST

    I had fun reading these posts...

    by jellypop

    but I have conclude that you all have too much time on your hands. Anyone told their Mum they love her lately? Go outside and run free!!

  • May 15, 2012, 4:18 p.m. CST

    Deathlok

    by sabrefox

    You heard it hear first. That is all.

  • May 15, 2012, 4:58 p.m. CST

    This article is pathetic.

    by Queefer Sutherland

    He's dead. Stop being a fucking fanboy and deal with it. What is it about fucking fanboys that makes them incapable of dealing with real in science fiction. Fucking Sci Fi shows and movies are always robbing their work by giving it apparent emotional resonance, then stealing away that deepness with some cheap resurrection trick. Whedon is guilty of this himself, but you can tell when he's really killed off somebody, and COULSON IS DEAD!! Just like James T. Kirk is DEAD!!! Let them BOTH stay dead!

  • May 15, 2012, 5:43 p.m. CST

    Norwegian blue Coulson

    by Can_I_Get_Any_Of_You_Cunts_A_Drink

    Fuck mate. He's dead. Great movie death. Say no to hologram Coulson or an Adam Lambert Coulson in Avengers 2. The cards were to get Cap's moral compass pointing the direction that Fury needed it to point, because he's fucking good at his job. He's dead. He was great. Purpose = served. World saved. Thanks for coming. Joss is boss.

  • He rarely does it permanently. He writes great death scenes but so often he makes it not permanent that it loses all effect. More than that, it promotes the idea that NO death is permanent. As I mentioned above, he went to great lengths to assure us that a character is permanently dead on Angel -- he HAD to because the idea of permanent death was long gone in the Buffyverse by that point. And then he STILL brought the character back to a degree.

  • May 15, 2012, 9:36 p.m. CST

    Maybe they have a Lazarus pit or resurrection ship or something.

    by ReportAbuse

  • May 16, 2012, 12:38 a.m. CST

    The real reason Coulson SHOULD be alive . . .

    by follyway

    I have to say i agree 100% with the reasoning of those laying out the case for Coulson never dying. In fact, the emotion of that part of the film never worked for me because I thought it was so transparent that Coulson didn't die the first time I say it opening day. From the mention of LMD's, Fury saying he was down(not dead or gone) before the medical team even touched him, the scene about the bloody cards; I didn't have "doubts" about his death I never even considered he was really dead. All that aside though they really should let him live, and not just because we all love the guy and it would be neat. More importantly we need a wedge between SHIELD and the Avengers as a whole and Captain America in particular. The whole "Ultimates" thing was a cool way of forming the avengers in the movies but they cannot continue to simply be a group of mercenaries working for a shadowy government agency. They need to be above that, and separate from that . . .especially Cap. As great as it was to see Cap giving orders during the final act, all that respect goes away if he doesn't become completely autonomous from SHIELD. It's been said that Cap 2 will be a SHIELD heavy film, but they cannot simply have Rogers continue to be the super "soldier" and follow Fury's orders. Captain America can't and shouldn't be SHIELD's best agent, he has to stand on his own and decide who he is, what he stands for and who he will become in the 21st century. Caulson's fandom of Cap is literally his only emotional connection in the modern world outside the other Avengers, and I feel like Fury's deception about his death would be one of the few things that would resonate with Cap enough for him to make a break with Fury and SHIELD and become his own man . . . more than just a soldier taking orders. Beyond Cap, Fury faking Coulson's death would affect all the Avengers emotionally and be enough of a deception to potentially completely break ties with Fury and SHIELD. Cap would have to define himself as his own man, Avengers tower would be necessary if the support of SHIELD is gone, it could create an interesting dynamic as people like Widow & Hawkeye chose sides and you could even set up a recruitment dynamic as the Avengers and SHIELD each try to recruit new "supers" . . . and then of course Thanos shows up in one of these movies and fucks everyone's universe up. Plus it would be a blast to see that Coulson reveal, wouldn't it? How am I wrong here?

  • May 17, 2012, 1:50 a.m. CST

    by Switters42

    The Vision theory is dead-on AND Gregg signed on for Iron Man 3 last year. I think that pretty much wraps it up.

  • May 17, 2012, 7:54 a.m. CST

    TONY STARK BUILT THIS IN A CAVE!!!!

    by aegri_mentis

    I give you the Coulson may be dead. I just can't imagine that his brain/essence/memories/big toe can't be used as the driver for Vision. However, that does give us two "robot guys" for either IM3 or Avengers 2, which seemed to be the problem with IM2 (War Machine just confused the hell out of anyone who wasn't a comic fan). On a side note, I think Marvel may have taken a misstep with the order of the movies. Now we are looking at IM3 being before the last two Avengers movies. Unless they plan on IM4, it's going to give them a character that is not going to have a stand alone movie between the last two Avengers movies. Should have been: TIH Iron Man Thor Captian 'Merica Avengers TIH 2 (I wish) Iron Man 2 Thor 2 Captian America 2 Avengers2 TIH 3 (sigh) Iron Man 3 Thor 3 CA 3 Avengers 3 Instead, IM will be wrapped up before Avengers 2.

  • and ultimately renders the characters self sacrifice meaningless. Soap Operas had a similar gimmick with the "evil twin".

  • May 19, 2012, 1:38 p.m. CST

    COULSON FAKE DEATH WOULD BE A PUSSY MOVE

    by DukieMichaelNamondRandy

    seriously? That movie had the BALLS to do that, and to back track on it just for some cheap fan service is fucking STUPID

  • May 20, 2012, 4:34 p.m. CST

    The VISION!

    by Mack

    am i the ONLY ONE who sees this for what it really is?! this is the VISION IN THE MAKING!

  • May 22, 2012, 7:44 p.m. CST

    Vision for sure

    by Matt

    It would be stupid not to