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I say we take off and nuke The Behind the Scenes Pic of the Day from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.
Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with today’s Behind the Scenes Pic!
As I put the finishing touches on this seriously epic AICN Legends interview with Michael Biehn I’ve been getting in a Cameron-y kind of mood, so while it is Hitchcock’s birthday today we’re going to celebrate that on Monday and spend our weekend with Jim Cameron.
Aliens is my favorite Cameron movie. I love almost everything he has done, Terminator 2 was the first movie I saw more than once in a theater, The Abyss made me cry (alright, it still makes me cry), Terminator, True Lies and Titanic are all films I dearly enjoy. And I like Avatar, too. Wait, has anybody ever noticed that Cameron only makes A and T feature films? Piranha 2 doesn’t count. Avatar, Abyss, Aliens, Terminator, Terminator 2, True Lies, Titanic. Weeiiirrdddd.
Okay, back to reality. Aliens is my favorite. To the point where when I interviewed Cameron for the first time he did say to me “You know, I directed other movies besides Aliens…” I heart that movie, what can I say?
So, today let’s look at Cameron on the set with some grunts (no offense), including a concerned-looking Hudson. I could be mistaken, but that doesn’t look like a film camera on his shoulder. Perhaps he’s operating the camera for the Space Marine’s video cam link-ups?
Whatever he’s doing, it’s awesome because it’s Aliens and James Cameron! Enjoy the pic!
If you have a behind the scenes shot you’d like to submit to this column, you can email me at quint@aintitcool.com.
Tomorrow’s behind the scenes pic is from another Cameron sequel, but probably not the one you’re thinking of...
-Quint
quint@aintitcool.com
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Click here to visit the complete compilation of previous Behind the Scenes images, Page One
Click here to visit the complete compilation of previous Behind the Scenes images, Page Two!
Readers Talkback
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and I really do. I always felt we needed another film in Ridley's world before we moved away to the more futuristic vision. Luckily now we're getting it.
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We all know this to be true.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 7:33 p.m. CST
I've been honored to be dear friends with Jim for over 3 decades now
by JettL93
The man is just so full of creativity. What he did with my terminator, aliens and titanic scripts was just amazing
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Right there with you. Only Cameron movie for me with the best mix of what he does-heart, spectacle, horror. And the best characters-Ripley, Hicks, Bishop, Newt, Hudson, Burke, etc. I wasn't allowed to see it when it came out,cuz I was 9(later snuck it on HBO) but I had a Starlog special dossier on all the marines that prepped me for the flick. Still my favorite.
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Fact.
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he directed part 2, correct?
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The script for Titanic was crap. The dialogue was terrible. I would pin that screenplay on Cameron too, if I were you. It's still the only best picture Oscar winner not to be nominated for a screenplay Oscar.
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Any word of an Abyss: Special Edition Blu-ray in the works? It narrowly edges out Aliens as my favorite Cameron film. Michael Biehn's explosive decompression scene is absolutely fucking pucker inducing. Awesome BTS shot, by the way.
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Interesting way of putting it
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Both are great movies you really don't have to be a stereotypical nerd and think one is better then the other you can like both it's all right.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 7:51 p.m. CST
Some Secret Info I Can Pass On to Quint From Someone Who Worked In The Home Video Industry Far Too Long: Titles Beginning At the Front & End of the Alphabet Rent Best!
by The Reluctant Austinite
Quint, this is something only a geek would know from working in videostores during the boom of the home video rental market when Cameron made most of his hit films. When customers would come into a video rental store, they would head straight for the New Release wall. That's why store owners would create a maze of other sections of older titles that customers had to navigate to get to the New Releases. The first thing you would notice if you looked carefully at the New Release titles is that an overwhemling number of them start either with the letters A through C or D and R,S,T and the end of the alphabet. The reason smart film makers like Cameron would do this during that time period js that most people start at one end of the New Release wall or the other when choosing titles to rent. They often have a number of titles to rent already in mind; generally 1 to 3. When they pick up that many, they stop browsing and head to check out. So it benefits your movie to be one of the first titles they see when they start looking and the best way to do is to NOT be in the middle. Be in the front, no matter which end the customer starts at. Knowledge gleaned from a wasted youth.
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Biehn in The Abyss is seriously underrated. Slicing his hand and pulling the chain waiting for Virgil to come up behind him.
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Despite the insane hostility between Horner & Cameron/Herd, they got a Best Score nomination for Aliens. In any event, Benni made a good aux musical choice at BNAT12: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kkxo4tAV6CI
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there goes our salvage
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Aug. 13, 2011, 8:14 p.m. CST
One of the rare sequel films that was as good as the first
by Arcangel2020
I am totally with you Quint on loving Jim Cameron's "Aliens"! This is a film that is a rarity where it's just as good as it's predecesor. In fact, I personally think there is nothing after this film...meaning, all the other Alien films made after it don't and shouldn't even exist since each film afterwards was so heartbreakingly wretched and pieces of film shit. It's a shame that no one ever envisioned and brought to life the Dark Horse Comic's Alien/Aliens storylines...those were some pretty cool comics worthy of the Alien/Aliens name! I also really enjoy watching the Directors cut of this film, the added scenes that were deleted in the Theatrical release, make sense and make it all that much more enjoyable to watch again and again. I really like this behind the scenes pic...it's not one I have seen before and I get a kick out of the look on Bill Paxton's face in this photo too. Keep up the good work with this collum, it's my favorite here on AICN!
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prometheus will be > aliens also.
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are still two of my favorite movies. True Lies was fun, T2 was fantastic, T1 fascinating, Avatar was neat, and I even appreciated Titanic. Battle Angel Alita is listed for 2016 according to IMDB and I am crossing my fingers that that will be brilliant. * * * As to the Alien and Aliens debate, I don't look at one better than the other. I view one as the best space horror ever and the other as one of the best space action movies ever. They're different but equally brilliant.
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I've heard people complaining that they needed to go the route of the Dark Horse comics, but those were essentially just rehashes of everything that made Aliens great. And sequels that just try to repeat what came before seldom work. Alien 3 was a bit of a mess (I still like it), but at least it was diffenent. If anything, too similar to the first one. Great sequels like Aliens, T2, Empire, Godfather II, Short Circuit 2, generally approach the material in a completely new way. Even more space marines blasting even more xenoporphs wasn't what the Alien franchise needed. Alien 3 did its thing and (for the general audience) failed. At least it did its own thing. Alien Ressurection just plain sucked. And yes, I was kidding about Short Circuit 2.
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Alien was good but Aliens kicked its ass. You need air. Time to get out of your parents basement.
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And to pop that particular cherry, I couldn't have asked for anything better. Love the making-of footage for this as well. Him making that dude get some gloves is hilarious. To me, it seems the resistance he had on that set somehow pushed him to produce a flick of pure unadulterated bad-assedness. Would have been nice if some of that could have been brought to the table for AVATAR quite honestly. I mean, why is it that this sort of cinematic alchemy seems to occur at a vastly greater frequency when a reasonably gifted director who is hungry is met with various challenges, and not nearly as often when these same dudes post-success have a gigantic budget and an army of technicians at their command? IMO AVATWO and other future films of that ilk would do well to start having certain limitations imposed from the outset or something. Maybe some kind of budgetary restraints or a reduction of crew size or both would do the trick (I don't fucking know)? In the end I guess I'm just advocating for just about anything that might help foster more creative solutions to common problems and potentially catalyze much more unique story/aesthetic developments that could never occur when something's been fast-tracked down the assembly line. Oh and...ALIENS fucking rocks.
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William Gibson, Eric Red, David Twohy, Vincent Ward-any more? Some featured Ripley, the Gibson one had Hicks and Bishop kicking ass while Ripley was in hypersleep. The screenplay for Alien Resurrection synthesized a lot of the cool ideas tossed around in these scripts and the Dark Horse comics(Corporation and military using people to breed xenomorphs, effect of genetic engineering on them) but the production was a mess.
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that may be, but where will he get eggs?
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I'll even take a 3 Stooges pic with Curley Joe picture?
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They're both excellent idea men, and can come up with the broad strokes of a film's universe and story very well. But both should be allowed nowhere within reach of a word processor to be able to write out the details. GOD AWFUL at dialogue (& to a certain extent, character)
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Been on set for 16 hours! Game over, man, game over!
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Aug. 13, 2011, 9:37 p.m. CST
Are you gonna have another Cameron BTS pic On Tuesday for HIS Birthday?
by LlGHTST0RMER
August 16th. Iron Jim turns 57.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 9:45 p.m. CST
I remember seeing that pic of Cameron on the Aliens set waaaay back in 1986 in Starlog Magazine.
by Karl Hungus
And yes, Alien is vastly superior to Aliens. Even James Cameron admits that.
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I have never liked any of his movies other than True Lies. why in gods name did they keep shooting the T-1000 even though they knew it would do diddly shit to him, if you want to see a good Titanic movie see A Night to Remember. Avatar was dances with wolves with blue people an the whole stupid USB hair thing just irked me everyone of his movie I hope for a good one and other than True Lies i have been disappointed
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Ha, ha. I'm so witty.
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One of the most quotable films evar. Good BTS pic.
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If you're going to say that Cameron can't write dialogue, then do it in a TITANIC or AVATAR talkback where at least you can actually make an argument. But in an ALIENS talkback? Pretty much every single sentence in the screenplay is memorable. I could fast forward through that movie, randomly stop anywhere, type the first line I hear into a talkback, and 90%+ of AICN regulars would know that it's from ALIENS. Hudson: "Hey Vasquez, you ever been mistaken for a man"? Vasquez: "No.......have you"? Awesome.
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I remember the first time I saw it, back to back with the first one. Do we still have such experiences in modern movies? I dont think so
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Have yet to ever see Resurrection all the way through. I liked the grit of Alien 3, and Charles Dutton was the shit. What turned me off that whole movie were the very first scenes. The funeral of Newt was very sad, and very powerful, but having her not survive the crash just ruined EVERYTHING sacrificed in Aliens. All Ripley did in Aliens (Get away from her you bitch!) was all for nothing, because of the opening of 3. No sir, I don't like it. The original is just the original and great for all of that. I didn't even mind Stephen King's one problem with it. The toughest chick in space almost dies for her love of her cat. Fuck cats. LOL
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Aug. 13, 2011, 10:46 p.m. CST
Best sequel of all time - ALIEN & ALIENS are the perfect motion picture marriage
by Jason
With it so hard to make a great trilogy (EVER), perhaps the perfect balance lies in 2 stories only (STAR WARS & ESB, GODFATHER 1 & 2, X-MEN 1 & 2, DIE HARD 1 & 3). By the time you get to the 3rd story, one must either make it 'bigger' & badder, or rehash what's already been done. Where was the ALIEN universe supposed to go at the end of ALIENS? A bigger colony? Earth, perhaps? A king?? Probably not. With what (d)evolved into the awfulness that was ALIEN 3, Ridley Scott's original classic and James Cameron's follow-up conclusion are, I think, the best 2-story trilogy ever made. That being said, very curious about PROMETHEUS...
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Aug. 13, 2011, 10:50 p.m. CST
Cameron's camera looks like the video cameras of the day.
by Jay Eyler
Aliens was obviously shot on film, but I think you're right, the camera in this BTS looks like all the video cameras I used in news and sports coverage back in the day (which was a Wednesday, by the way. Fun fact.) I'd guess it was either used to get the look of the Marines' helmet cams properly scratchy, or for getting live video of the set for reference before shooting. Those were considered very small and lightweight cameras at the time. Small men and women still complained. I lugged them up and down the sidelines for college football and basketball games. Took some strength believe it or not with all the cables hanging off you. But I digress.
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Aliens is easily the best genre mash-up in movie history. Combines horror, action, sci-fi, drama and comedy better than any other film I can think of. Anyone who says that Alien is "vastly superior" to Aliens, is talking out of their ass.
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Game over man! Game over!
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grease this rat-fuck son of a bitch right now!
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You can see all of the analog fuzz on the helmet cam, very cool technique. Is that James Remar on the left there?
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Aug. 13, 2011, 11:32 p.m. CST
He can thank this movie for being able to go "way over budget",and for the ego to match.
by Ted Knight
Ever notice everything since has been a SFX heavy spectacular? Back then, he was known for bringing the good on a shoestring, as he did with Terminator and this.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 11:35 p.m. CST
This little girl survived longer than that with no weapons and no training!
by Voice O. Reason
Why don't you put HER in charge?!
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Me too, man. God, that ending was shit!
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were also used in Halo (1st one) to almost the same effect. Actually, Halo just might have been an homage/love letter to Cameron's Aliens entirely.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 11:39 p.m. CST
What the hell are we supposed to use man? Harsh language?
by Tom Vidovich
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Aug. 13, 2011, 11:39 p.m. CST
no offense brother geeks but why is it that cameron
by theonecalledshoe
looks like jim henson. just an observation.
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Aug. 13, 2011, 11:51 p.m. CST
Cameron stood on the shoulders of a giant to create this movie, and never gave Heinlein a line of credit.
by Ted Knight
Everything about the space marines in Aliens was copied from Heinlein. The drop ship. The fact that "everyone drops" and there's no one left on board the orbiting ship. The lines about the "bug hunt." Cameron stood on the shoulders of a giant to create this movie, and never gave Heinlein a line of credit.
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lets face it, he lost it. His mental stability finally shattered in the final fire-fight. He didn't deserve to live because he wasn't thinking rationally only reacting with wild emotion which led him to be reckless. Hicks tried to call him back to follow the planned exit strategy, but he pushed forward. R.I.P. Hudson, you crazy bastard.
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And I bought it on VHS when it came out. $80!
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on the right with the baseball cap? Ya' know, the suspect in the leather bars?
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They got away from the xenomorphs and ran very very fast so they didn't get blowed up. <p> That's what I'm going to pitch. I'm hopping on the sequel train, whoo whoo!
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:36 a.m. CST
Definitely one of the best sequels ever, an incrdible feat. ESB, Mad Max 2, Aliens. What else compares?
by kevred
I'm sure there's another genius sequel I'm forgetting. If anyone has other suggestions, please weigh in.
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It's ALWAYS "all right" and never "alright" you fucking hack. Jesus. Learn your craft, fuckface.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:47 a.m. CST
"I say we take off and nuke " should have been how Avatar Ended
by Saen
I hope thats in Avatar 2, they come back pissed and Nuke the giant tree from Orbit!
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Visually, it looked great, and the story really was pretty engaging. But what kept yanking me out was the TERRIBLE foley usage. It was one of those retarded "more real then real" applications that just kills the moment for me. If you watch the film and actually pay attention, the world outside of the viewframe doesn't exist. There's no ambient, and once something passes out of frame, it no longer matters. I think the worst example is during the truck/tanker scene right before the foundry, but it's constant thru the entire film. If there was something I wish could be done, is I wish Cameron would go back for a special edition blu-ray release of T-2, and redo ALL the foley so it doesn't suck so bad. :(
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I imagine you could add THE GODFATHER PART II, WRATH OF KHAN, THE DARK KNIGHT and maybe TEMPLE OF DOOM to that list. Unless I'm forgetting a couple myself, it does seem that the perceived quality of most sequels plummets quite drastically by comparison. Hope somebody can come up with some more titles though. It'd be sad to realize the list could really be that short.
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They had a midnight screening of Aliens while I was in college, and I went with a buddy who'd never seen it before. All through the part where the marines are in the aliens' lair and Ripley has to save them, he's yappin' and yappin' at me. It was kind of annoying. I kept wishing he'd shut up. I realized later he was scared shitless and the verbal diarrhea was just his way of dealing with it! He admitted as much when the scene ended. That alone made this particular viewing much more enjoyable than those times I'd watched it alone on cable (although those were pretty awesome too). Some movies you just gotta watch with an audience to get the full effect.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 1:31 a.m. CST
How do I get out of this chickenshit outfit?
by highfunctioningsociopath
I guess she don't like the cornbread either.
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Combined!!! Yeah, I said it. It had to be said. It's my favorite film, and I think the greatest American film ever made.
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Regard ALIENS as one of my favourite, if not all-time favourite, films of all-time. And when I hear from someone I know that they haven't seen this classic gem of a film then I readily insist that they - WE - watch it. Even better when it gets a screening at one of the re-run cinemas here in town. In the audience, there's always the usual ratio of fans of the film mixed in with those who haven't scene it. Love watching the reactions of the uninitiated during scenes such as Burke moving closer to the cylinders containing the face huggers in the med-lab, or when the aliens trip the motion trackers for the first time near the reactor core, or when Newt is grabbed in the water. Brilliant scenes, brilliant movie.
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Wow, that's a tough one. In fact, it's easier to make a list of sequels that FAILED to live up to the original. Beverly Hills Cop - Nope, Ghostbusters - Nope, RoboCop - Nope, Die Hard - Close, French Connection - Nope, Jaws - Nope, Fletch - Nope, Creepshow - Nope, Men In Black - Who cares?, Riddick - Nope, Karate Kid - Nope, Teen Wolf - Nope, Fright Night - Nope, The Sting - Nope, The Fly - Nope, Caddyshack - Nope, Miss Congeniality - Fuck You, Smokey and the Bandit - Huh?, Matrix - Nope, ...my head hurts from recounting such unmitigated garbage. There was one such gem recently that I would consider stronger than it's progenitor and the winner is: Hellboy 2, A pretty solid sequel. Sorry, the options are limited to say the least.
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Aliens rocked. Avatar was just a mess. Great visuals, but my god, I was so mad at myself for sitting through the entire thing. I kept telling myself, that it might start getting better...it only got worse...
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Hey man, I don't want to rain on your parade, but we're not going to last 17 hours. Those things are gonna come in here, just like they did before...and they're gonna come in here, and they're gonna come in here and they're gonna get us!
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Aug. 14, 2011, 2:32 a.m. CST
I may not keep up with current events, but we just got our asses kicked!
by Ted Knight
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JAMES CAMERON.NUFF SAID.
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No internet, no "teaser" trailer 12 months before it opens, no massively annoying media campaign, just one grainy b&w photo in the paper, then went in Saturday 13th 1986 (just, as i wasnt 18) into the enormous screen 1, the Odeon, Liverpool and watched it knowing virtually nothing. Best movie i've ever watched in the cinema.
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I heard that!
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then i should remember to tweet him happy birthday.and ask him when the fuck are we going to get the Bluray special edition of the Abyss which happens to be his best and my favorite movie of his.
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are you still here, havent seen you in ages. how you can be friends with a grown man for over 3 decades when you were born in 93 is a little strange...
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the shots of the video-feeds of the Marines.Notice that in his other hand is holding the small light that the Marines had on their shoulders?
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Aliens is one of the few movies where the original theatrical cut is superior to the director's cut. The director's cut gives too away much by taking us to LV426 before the Marines get there. It kills a lot of the suspense and is completely unnecessary. The other better theatrical cut is Apocalypse Now.
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That is something I really miss about the pre-internet, pre-mass media cable and satellite conglomerates bombarding us night and day with trailers, promotional tie-ins, and enough interviews to suck the mystery, that could be created with a minimalist approach, right out of our imaginations. It seem market execs only know one promotional strategy these days - OVERKILL!
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Aug. 14, 2011, 3:20 a.m. CST
ALIEN'S>THE TERMINATOR>T2>AVATAR>TITANIC>THE ABYSS>TRUE LIES>PIRANHA 2!!!FACT!!!
by CreepyThinMan
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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGHHHH FFSSSSSSS
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No way was that unmitigated garbage, for the simple fact that it had another great performance from Hackman. Getting drunk with the bartender, doped out reminiscing of Mickey Mantle, the scene of him talking about how close the French put his desk near the shitter; there's some dam fine acting in those scenes.
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kabong, actually Burke doesnt survive. There is a brief deleted scene that shows Ripley meeting him on her way looking for Newt at the end. He begs to die and she gives him a grenade. It doesnt really add anything and Burkes acting is pretty poor too so I guess it wasnt added back even to the extended edition. If you're curious you can see it here though: http://tinyurl.com/3utdqqe
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But they're two completely different beasts - one is a dark atmospheric 70s horror movie, the other is a dark atmospheric 80s action movie. I love 'em both, but Alien is a better fit for my love zone. Aliens is a fantastic film, but a shitty sequel. Christ, I've said that a few times.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:12 a.m. CST
Cameron - the best sci-fi filmmaker of the past 30 years
by kwisatzhaderach
There is no one else. Kubrick had one, Ridley Scott had two. But Cameron has five. The Terminator, Aliens, The Abyss Special edition, Terminator 2 and Avatar. What a fucking incredible line-up. Sure, Cameron is dealing with the 'pulpier' aspects of sci-fi as opposed to the more existential take by Kubrick and Scott but you can't deny the fact that nobody does sci-fi like Cameron.
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Throw in Strange Days too, as it's basically a Cameron film.
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Can't wait for the Legends interview with Biehn. And i'll finally fork out for a blu-ray player when The Abyss is released.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:19 a.m. CST
we've had this discussion before, but Hudson didn't bitch out
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
at the end, he finally pulled himself together and faced his fears.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:21 a.m. CST
RE: ALIEN'S>THE TERMINATOR>T2>AVATAR>TITANIC>THE ABYSS>TRUE LIES>PIRANHA 2!!!FACT!!!
by Stalkeye
I couldn't agree more.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:27 a.m. CST
Agreed with the director's cut showing too much of LV426
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
but that's about it. I'd want the rest kept in. The sentry gun scenes are really fucking tense. As for what's better, like everyone has said: Alien and Aliens are completely different beasts and can't really be fairly compared. However, if I was being marooned on a desert island with a laserdisc player and one film, i'd be hoping Aliens is the film i'm left with.
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it's both a fantastic film and sequel. Fucking Fact!
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Burke deleted scene is also a case of Big Jim screwing the pooch as far as the 'science' of the Aliens goes. In the original the face hugger took what, a couple of days to impregnate John Hurt? In ALIENS Burke has supposedly been carried off, cocooned into the wall, face hugged, and had the face hugger come off, all in about 20 minutes? I know it's 'only a movie' but some of us like a bit of science in our science fiction!
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When i was a kid, i don't know what age, i rented aliens, thinking it was the first movie and i was so blown away i watched it twice in a row. I have never ever ever ever done that since. brilliant film and the sequel is better. this is a fact.
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Look like im stuck here eating coconuts for the next few months. Hey at least i've got a laserdisc of ALIENS, let's whack that sucker on. Wait where's the plug socket??! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
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..my tastes lean more toward JC's Aliens. High stress situations accompanied by amusing dialog, great model spx (courtesy of the legendary Stan Winston) a memorable ensemble cast and to top it off, Horner's sountrack is one of my all time favorites. (Aliens' soundtrack works very well with games like Dead Space and Dark Void via XBox's custom soundtrack option.) Great film that should be in everyone's Blu-Ray collection. Alongside Alien, of course. (0:'
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What about Spielberg? Certainly a contender for the title you suggest; Close Encounters, ET, AI, Minority Report, Jurrasic Park - and that's only the hard sci-fi that he directed. And Strange Days was awful. imo
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Aliens is an action/horror masterpiece. For me, basically, Aliens is more rewatchable and thus the superior film. Plus, I have a gripe with Alien. The part in where the captain is attacked in the air duct has not aged very well. Well it's good up until the part where it cuts to the guy in the rubber alien outfit with outstretched arms, which looks like something out of a haunted house.
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Dark Knight The Empire Strikes Back Star trek 2 The Godfather part 2 Mad Max 2 Terminator 2 The Bourne Supremecy Xmen 2 Superman 2 Toy Story 2 Spiderman 2 Evil Dead 2
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Never really did it for me - when I first saw it I and the marines were getting owned in the plant, I remember thinking 'hold on - isn't that the music from Star Trek II?' It's not bad, just a bit flat. It doesn't help that I think Trek II is Horner's best soundtrack - everything after that was just derivative. You know it's a Horner soundtrack when you hear... the wobbly trumpets!!!!
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Assuming Prometheus is great, this will be the perfect Alien trilogy. Honorable mention: Alien 3
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early japanese laserdisc players can run on enzymes produced in the fermentation process
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iwasinjuniorhigh, ha! I love that desert island metaphor. My ten movies would be CITIZEN KANE, THE GODFATHER, etc Then you'd be sitting on that desert island sobbing. WHY DIDNT I CHOOSE ANY PORN!!!!
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Aug. 14, 2011, 6:03 a.m. CST
Wheres The Behind The Scenes for Substitute II? Treat gotta Eat!!!!
by SmokieGeezer
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your first choice of a movie will always be a porno.it is logical as Spock would have said.
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They're comin' outta the goddamn walls! Let's book!
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besides if we are talking about Alien biology here ,we can safely assume,without the risk of contradictions and plotholes, that when the Alien hive is under attack and a lot of Aliens are killed,the impregnation cycle accelerates in order to compensate for the loses and to help the hive avoid complete extinction. after all the Alien's biology is all about survival,and the Alien does evolve and adapts to the environment that it has to survive through,so there is no reason not to say that its reproduction cycle adapts too in order for the species to survive. dont you agree?
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Generally I prefer the directors cut, but I think the proper way to see Aliens for the very first time is via the theatrical cut. I remember seeing a special cut of Aliens on TV back in the day. It had the scene in which Burke informs Ripley of her daughter and all the sentry gun stuff. It actually worked really well, striking a perfect balance between the two cuts we have now. I really wish that Cameron had included this TV cut in the Blu-ray of Aliens released this past autumn.
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a very underrated actor and he deserved a nomination for his performance in the Abyss.
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They can bill me.
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killik, I guess that's one possible explanation but I think with science fiction and fantasy films you can have supernatural otherworldly aspects and the audience will buy them - as long as they are presented with consistency. This scene of Burke having an alien inside him, after only 20 minutes being captured is not consistent with the previous movie. It's not even consistent with the earlier part of this movie. Where we see a colonist get chest bursted, and we see Newt captured (she has been far longer than 20 minutes and isnt even face hugged yet). I think Cameron did well to totally cut it. I also think this is the geekiest most pedantic post ive ever contributed to aicn.
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Prometheus is not what I was expecting to save the franchise, but given how far off the rails the series had gone (AvP, PWS Anderson?! Really!?), I'll take a unique vision from Ridley Scott with an open mind!
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i just saw it,and yeah Jim did the right thing for not including it.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 7:11 a.m. CST
bohdi71, not a bad list although I prefer The Godfather over
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
the sequel. Sure part 2 was great, but I was just not that into having the family move to Nevada. You think mafia (never uttered in the book or movie) you think New York and Italy. Here's another for you: Lethal Weapon 2.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 7:14 a.m. CST
I was too young to see Alien on the big screen. Aliens on the other hand.....
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
Both are great. The sequel is as good if not better than the original. It's a tough call. Aliens is of course more action, while the original is more suspense and horror in space. It doesn't matter. They're both great.
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for doing something wrong in the shooting.He is ready to burst into tears.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 7:51 a.m. CST
bohdi71 not a bad list..but I'm definetly taking Superman II off the list
by MRJONZ72
I definetly prefer Supes I...I think I will give Godfather 1 a slight edge over the Godfather 2. most of the movies on the list are a toss up for me..could go either way..except for X-men 2 and Star Trek 2..those I def prefer over the original another sequel I def prefer over the original is Hellboy 2
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Damn near flawless movie. It's kind of sad that since 1987 only hand full of movies are better action/sci-fi than this.
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Funny seeing your name first thing this morning. I just started rereading "Farewell, My Lovely" last night on my kindle...
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What we saw in "Alien" was eggs that birthed little aliens that could capture humans. We never saw them impregnate a human, or lay an egg. Seems to me he just filled in the gap.
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Finally got to see my beloved movie on my plasma 50" HDTV the way it was meant to be seen. My God people, it was fucking gorgeous. If you own HDTV and a Blu-Ray, there's no question, buy the fucking movie.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:12 a.m. CST
All right, sweethearts, what are you waiting for?
by Inexplicable_Nuclear_Balls
Breakfast in bed? Another glorious day in the Corps! A day in the Marine Corps is like a day on the farm. Every meal's a banquet! Every paycheck a fortune! Every formation a parade! I LOVE the Corps! I get so tired of the "which Alien is better" nonsense. They're both amazing films and you absolutely cannot compare one to the other.Cameron didn't recycle the the original plot like so many sequels do. There was no way to make the aliens as scary as Ridley's since they had been fully revealed and you knew what was coming. Those of you who say Aliens sucks, what would you have done for a sequel?
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:18 a.m. CST
All right, sweethearts, what are you waiting for?
by Inexplicable_Nuclear_Balls
Breakfast in bed? Another glorious day in the Corps! A day in the Marine Corps is like a day on the farm. Every meal's a banquet! Every paycheck a fortune! Every formation a parade! I LOVE the Corps! Both films are amazing, there's no way to compare one to the other as the tone is very different. Those of you why say Aliens sucks, what would you have done for a sequel?
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No doubt Aliens is the greatest sci-fi/action film of all time. Its been one of my favorite films since I seen it on HBO back in the day. But I've always thought it made no sense that they use this huge space ship like the Sulaco to transport just ten marines to the alien planet and then leave no else aboard. What if they encountered some huge unexpected enemy force, what if their one means of getting off the planet unexpectedly crashed? They'd been in some real pretty shit then. I know that Cameron had a limited budget and also having fewer marines increased the tension in the story but it still irks me. I kinda of got my wish to see a huge military force on an alien planet in Avatar but they ended up getting their asses handed to them by a bunch of Stone Age blue people. Huh? Now imagine what Cameron could have done on Aliens with the technology and budget of Avatar.
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I thought my first post was gone so I re-wrote it differently. Oh well.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:29 a.m. CST
=their asses handed to them by a bunch of Stone Age blue people. =
by KilliK
WRONG. it was the planet which defeated the humans.Until the moment when all the Pandorian animals attacked the humans,the marines had almost obliterated the Navi.
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only 10marines in that huge spaceship seemed a bit weird. but then again in Alien you have a gigantic cargo spaceship which was controlled only by 7 people.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:34 a.m. CST
@kwisatzhaderach Kubrick did just one science fiction, but he also did a fantasy - where Tom Cruise was straight.
by highfunctioningsociopath
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...Would have been a much more interesting, (although probably less likeable) Hicks - I'd love to have seen what Remar would have done with the role. (Though Cameron was probably right to lose him.). Remar's great.
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no,have you? Yeah Cameron doesnt know how to write a good script,indeed.
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I can't keep it straight, but I think Cameron himself feels that the Aliens director's cut was only for the fans, and the theatrical release is the movie as he would choose for you to watch it. Or do I have that backwards? I think that's why there's "special editions" of T2 and Aliens but only The Abyss really has a "director's cut"? About the extra footage in Aliens.. the extended cut shows too much of Hadley's Hope, undercutting the tension of the reveal after the marine's land. The sentry gun scene shows too many aliens getting killed, undercutting the alien threat. The scene where Ripley cries about her daughter early on slows things down too much and is too direct in showing Ripley's feelings. Finally the part where Hicks and Ripley exchange first names undercuts the specialness of the "show me everything" scene and is just damn corny. I also don't think Ripley would pause for half-a-second to fulfill some self-serving mating function... her mating drive would be fixated on rescuing Newt at that point in the story (she has just strapped up and is heading for the elevator... the moment with Hicks really kills the thread of tension and momentum for me).
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:44 a.m. CST
@killik At the end of the dayThe blue space hippies won that fight
by Roninf5
WRONG. it was the planet which defeated the humans
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Although I can see why the water wall sequence would be cut out. The movie is tighter without it.
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Gah, I pluralized with an apostrophe. Pure typo.... I realize you never pluralize with an apostrophe.
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There had only been 1 preview on tv I saw a few days earlier. Practically no warning and I must have missed the starlog. So I'm in total disbelief that I'm actually seeing a sequel to alien. Then the marines come across the biggest acid burn -looks like somebody bagged one of riply's bad boys. Well. I shit my pants right then. I remembered the acid drip scene from the first film. I think looks like somebody bagged one of riply's scene may very well be the greatest foreshadowing moment in film history. The audience who had seen the 1st movie suddenly understood that they were in for something much bigger than the first film. Greatest sequel in history
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learn the difference.
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I realise no one in this talkback has seen a movie made before 1970 but ever heard of a film called Bride of fuckin' Frankenstein?
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That's interesting. Except why would a filmmaker give a shit whether or not someone rents his film from Blockbuster? You understand they get no money from the rental itself, but from the sale of the DVD or tape. So once it's on the wall, Cameron doesn't care where. By the way, I've always hated Blockbuster, and take such guilty sadistic pleasure in watching them go down one by one, with increasingly desperate posters on the few survivors. I feel like a Palestinian on 9/11 when I walk past one of those places. I want to rush up to the idiots who still rent there, shake them and say, "You don't have to do this anymore! Join the 21st century!" But I don't do that, and they go home to watch their Adam Sandler movie or whatever the fuck these people do.
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I agree, if you've seen Alien the big acid burn lets you know the characters are in a very bad place... and I think the whole sequence from drop-ship to finding Newt is just about the most effective "spatial orientation" I've seen in a movie.
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you can argue as much as you want about the scenes concerning the sentry guns or the events in the colony before the discovery of the alien ship,but the scene where Ripley learns about her dead daughter IS absolutely necessary for her character development AND for the emotional relationship with Newt,which eventually lead to our stronger connection with those two characters. In fact,i am very surprised that Cameron did included this character defining scene in his theatrical run. My guess is that if he put it,then he had to add the scenes with Newt and her parents as well, in order to flesh more her character and strengthen further her dramatic situation when she is found alone and her upcoming emotional connection with Ripley Now go think some insulting remark to come back at me,since this is the only thing you are good about,boy.
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Did you guys know they re-used a bunch of the factory set/location from Aliens while making the first Batman film?
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In fact I think the whole movie would be stronger thematically if they took that scene further and explored the implications of menopause.
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Die Hard 3 sucked ass! I always thought Jurassic Park 3 or if 4 ever gets made, they should just copy the whole Marine thing. I know people would compare the two, but i still think it would be awesome under the right director.
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After The Thin Man and A Shot In The Dark (sequel to The Pink Panther).
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Since we are talking about horror movies how about Evil Dead 2? although there is a dispute about whether it is a remake or a sequel,it completely surpasses the original in every aspect. There is also the opinion that Hellraiser 2 is better than the first movie.I dont know maybe,i like both films. Dawn of the Dead is considered by many as the superior sequel from the original. and i suppose there are other horror movies which are better than their predecessors but i cant quite remember right now.
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but instead of marines ,there were hunters?
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And wasn't it presented as the result of ripley asking Burke to investigate? Feels like something out of a whole other movie to me.. a TV movie with Meredith Baxter Birney, which I know is your favourite kind of movie since you seem to place priority on characters and emotions in your action/sci-fi viewing. I do like the trompe l'oeil effect of the filming in the scene, starting tight on Ripley against the video wall so that it appears as though she might be sitting in a park on Earth. If they cut out the earlier dialogue bits and had this scene be the singular reveal of Ripley's lost daughter and her resulting feelings, I might be more accepting of it. You tampon (with cum on the one end).
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But it was a good deletion decision by JC.
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I forgot about that. I hated JP2 so much I haven't seen it since the theatre.
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Yes, he did acknowledge Heinlen's influence. He said '[See] Starship Troopers, if you want to see where Aliens was inspired.' Meaning the book, as he said the film was 'not great ... the original story by Heinlein is pretty serious.' http://alienseries.blogspot.com/2011/03/i-love-corps.html
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Aug. 14, 2011, 10:45 a.m. CST
also the 'It's a bug hunt' is a direct reference to Heinlen's work
by KilliK
and if i remember correctly Cameron has said that he put that line,because he considered his movie to exist in the same universe of the book.
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I think the first two Evil Deads are about on par, they're quite difficult to compare considering they're trying to do different things really and they both succeed admirably (much like Alien and Aliens). I think I prefer Dawn of the Dead to Night but they're both classics so it's arguable. Curse of the Cat People is an interesting early horror sequel, very atmospheric as were most of the Val Lewton films.
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getting it together and acting as a hero.Sorry Big Jim i love you,i consider you the greatest action/scifi director but in Hudson's care you are completely wrong. Hudson in his last scene acted like a little bitch who had completely lost it,dooming himself to his death and risking the lives of the rest.no hero at all. Maybe that wasnt you intended to depict,but the scene didnt play as you described. IF you had Hudson telling Hicks,to take the others and run to the dropship,while he would stay there in the room,shooting aliens,in order to buy them some time,then yeah he would have died as a hero because he would have sacrificed himself. but anyway.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 10:55 a.m. CST
Speaking of sequels, I was in a "Temple of Doom" mood last night.
by welcometothepartypal
It was the first time I watched since I upgraded my whole system. And I gotta say, they did a great job with the DVD. On my Blu ray player in 1080p/50inch, I swear it was a blu ray disc. I couldn't believe the audio/video quality. Granted I was 3 screwdrivers in, but still.
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Killik your need for explicit tags on character arcs really undermines your self-touted feel for storytelling.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 10:56 a.m. CST
I don't consider The Abyss Theatrical to be a finished film...
by tailhook
when you have to completely cut the entire ending and story to the film due to time and budget constraints. In a lot of ways I wish the theatrical version never existed at all and the Special Edition was simply called The Abyss. To this day most people have never seen the Special Edition which is sad.
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It's not about that. It's that Cambo turned the saga in a very very different direction. The direction works but it was a general dumbing down of the mythology. The Alien mythos became summer action / violent blockbuster as opposed to a further exploration of the 'perfect organism.' Dong get me wrong I LOVE Aliens, it's just not as intelligent as the first film and uses (recycles) some of the same plot devices. Alien3 did none of these things. I think I'll prefer Prometheus over ALIENS.
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clean it,convert it into 3D and release it again in the theaters for the new generation.i bet it will be a hit this time and the audience will learn about his underrated masterpiece. Which is ironic,that Cameron's best movie happens to be his least known.hell even Piranhas 2 is more popular although he never really directed it.
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Just watched the special edition director's cut for the first time a couple months ago, it's the only version that should exist. And like some others have said, we need a bluray version. The DVD is looks terrible even upgraded.
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some scenes,at least in Raiders,have been cgi-replaced in the dvd version,right? i was going to buy the whole trilogy,but when i learned about this i was too angry to even bother to buy it.damn you Lucas.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 11:21 a.m. CST
killik, you I heard something like that a while ago.
by welcometothepartypal
May that's why "Temple" looks so good, to match those shot's. But whatever Lucas did must of been pretty subtle cuz I really couldn't tell. Unlike "Star Wars". That guy should've just stopped making movies after "Last Crusade". Remember back in the day, how we all just sat in awe of his work. Now anytime I see or hear him, I just roll my eyes. Anyway I don't want to get on an anti Lucas kick again. Aliens ROCKS!!!!!
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...if only Alan Silvestri could be contracted to re-score the extended ending. Temp tracks (from "The Seventh Sign" among others, if I recall correctly) were used to cover the restored footage, and the disparity in the music painfullyapparent. Worst -- for me at least -- is the loss of Silvestri's score in the shot of the alien ship going up the cliff wall, approaching DeepCore. How about it, Cameron? Throw Alan a bone and let him finish the movie's score!
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Aug. 14, 2011, 11:33 a.m. CST
abyss d.cut is why we have d.cuts and BTS footage. Abyss d.cut should place third in any camron list
by clarntoon
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_sFW8grQtU it is obvious that the cgi is inferior to the original cut.it doesnt improve anything,instead it makes it look worse.why Lucas,why?
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http://jimsmash.blogspot.com/2007/08/alienss-recasting.html<P> I would take a Belladonna dvd with me to the island, good call..<P> I love the Special Edition, but I can see why many of the cuts were made. The sentry guns do downplay the Alien threat by showing how many are killed, but this is more than made up for by the threat of just how many of them there were, and how intelligent they are. The idea that all they have left is 50 rounds on one gun and could not survive another all-out assault raises the stakes somewhat.<P> Biehn should have been nominated for The Abyss. He plays it note perfectly. He blows everyone else out of the water (and then implodes in it).
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...has ever-so-slightly tainted the brilliance of Aliens for me over the years. This is why David Fincher must die....
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Aug. 14, 2011, 11:51 a.m. CST
Bill that little girl just out acted you with no previous credits or actor training...
by DougMcKenzie
Why don't you put her above title!
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If you poke around his site, he's working on a goal to fill a small bookshelf entirely with copies of the ALIENS novelization. I can get behind a kooky idea like that.
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...and I never got why they didn't follow it. 1) Alien - A single alien kills the crew and Ripley barely escapes with her life. 2) Aliens - A small military unit goes after roughly 100 and is devastated but survivors manage to get back to earth. 3) Alien 3/War/Earth War/Insurrection or whatever you want to call it. The cat (Jonesy) has the Alien embryo. They return to Earth and the cat escapes, gestates and an Army of Aliens grows in hidden places on Earth. You have the horror of discovering their caves, the small scale action of the first team encounters and finally a grand scale battle of multiple Queens, fighter ships, bad ass Military tech all while Ripley and Newt struggle under the protections of Hicks. Hicks finally realizes the Military is in service to the corps and the three of them do what have to be done, take over the command center from the military with the help of Ripley's new found respect for "Synthetic Humans" who cannot allow harm to come to humans through inaction. They fire off the nukes and while earth is devastated, the remaining Aliens are mopped up by the last of the true military loyal to Hicks. The fact that the third movie undid all of the struggles of Aliens by killing Newt and Hicks in the manner it did made it intolerable to me as a sequel. I would have preferred a new actor and actresses for Hicks and Newt to the dismissal of the characters and Ripley's struggles.
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Aug. 14, 2011, noon CST
killik, Thanks for that, were there many more that you know of?
by welcometothepartypal
I mean the scene did look crisp and clean, but it didn't really matter. Anyway if things like that were the extent of what he did, they don't really take you out of the movie(ie, Han stepping on Jabba's tail). I'm not saying you should go out and buy them, but I take it you like these flix. Do what do, cuz I refuse to give that guy more of my money. Rent from the library for free and burn the fuckers.
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One of my many favorite lines but not one of the most quoted... sooooo chilling coming from Newt.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:06 p.m. CST
nice movie whiskeylips, i'll rebuild the Delorean, you do the hard part.
by welcometothepartypal
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:11 p.m. CST
Alien3 is Terrrrrible but seems to be apologizing.
by Seven_of_Borgnine
"We here on pre-production and on set and in post all love Alien as much as you do... and we all went to film school so we could do a good job. But this movie is fucked up, we know. We just work here, sorry."
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:11 p.m. CST
(Cool Aliens photo, btw) FYI: New Prometheus Set Pics and Patrick Wilson joins the cast
by AlienFanatic
Hadn't seen this news yet, but I found an article here: http://www.hollywoodnews.com/2011/08/13/prometheus-set-pics-leaked-patrick-wilson-joins-cast/
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http://www.alienprequelnews.com/2011/08/exclusive-prometheus-finishes-shooting.html (That's where the Hollywoodnews pics come from.) Looks like a lot of props and stuff.
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That's why I love you guys (and girls). Eternal fountain of geek knowledge. That's certainly satisfying, for me anyways, that Jimbo gave the proper credit where it was due. I actually believe Cameron did a better job interpreting a few of Heinlein's ideas than Verhoeven Starship Troopers did. I enjoy Starship Troopers but it wasn't even close to the books conveyed meaning.
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The summer of 1987 I did three things, mainly: Play sports, watch Aliens, and think about Aliens. And at that age much of thinking about Aliens equated to shitting my pants in terror thinking about 'what if those things were real?'. I spent a lot of time thinking about the story itself on a meta-level, something I'd never done before to that point in life (I was pretty young). It's just such a tight script that I obsessively went over the story and explored possibilities in my mind. Even to the point where I dedicated a single legal notepad to writing my own "Alien 3" story which OF COURSE started with the escape craft crashing into the ocean on Earth with stowaway eggs. I think that was kind of an *obvious* way to take it, and maybe it's not always best to do the obvious thing. When I try to imagine what an Alien 3 set on earth would have looked and felt like if made at the same time as the real Alien 3, it doesn't look good. It resembles Demolition Man.
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Spring 2012, Colonial Marines comes out after more than ten years of stop-start development. It's going to be the most faithful-to-ALIENS Alien game yet. My game boner is totally rock-hard for it. Last year's AVP (3) game had amazing character models for the aliens and preds, and that's about it. That game is one of the best examples of why PC gamers hate many console ports. It's not snobbery, it's not fanboyism or any dumb shit. It's because console-centric designs and play styles feel damn clunky on a PC.
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Come to think of it my idea for Alien3 as a kid was to have the Sulaco crash into the ocean and have a sort of combine Aliens with Poseidon Adventure, another movie I was fairly obsessed with at the time.
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Aliens is a good action flick that has Aliens in it. Alien is a classic scary movie.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:24 p.m. CST
I dont have much faith on that game,especially after the DNF fiasco.
by KilliK
it will probably be good,but nothing special. The AvP was decent at least in the PS3 where i played it but nothing new after the last AvP.
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Without a doubt. I prefer Alien, but only because I prefer the mood, atmosphere, and production design...but Aliens is all anyone can ask for from a sequel. I actually prefer the theatrical cut, primarily because the derelict looked like a pile of junk. In Alien it was ancient and incredibly weird, but in the sequel it looked cheap and flimsy. The info on Ripleys daughter was important and should not have been cut, but everything else in the DC is superfluous.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 12:37 p.m. CST
DNF took 15 years to come out but was only dev'ed for 15 months
by Autodidact
True fact if you look at the story of the actual released game. Everything from between 1996 - 2009 was tossed or ignored. It was the ultimate cynical name cash-in, taking advantage of fans and nostalgia. Also, the 3D Realms guys pretty much admit they were never really developing the game and pretty much on permanent vacation as far as Duke was concerned... in that regard, they're geniuses. Colonial Marines on the other hand has been mutating and shifting but has been a more conventional long-term AAA development cycle, taking so long because they're trying to make a great game. I have faith the game will be awesome, based on recent interviews with the dev.
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I saw aliens young, so I never considered how awesome the "bagged" line was. You're right.
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ALIENS is wholly awesome, and will always be Cameron's best. Great action/horror roller-coaster ride.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 1 p.m. CST
AVP's did suck, but the Alien/Predator hybrid was a cool concept.
by welcometothepartypal
Every time I saw the Mcfarlane toy version in the store, I would just hold it and think what cool figure, should I get it? uhhhhh no the movie sucked. I did that for a couple of years until it was gone. Every now and then I go to Ebay and do the same damn thing. Is there a name for this kind of illness?
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i really want this game to turn out great.The last Alien game i really enjoyed was Alien Trilogy in the PS1 and before that the action-scrollers from Team17 (or was it the Bitmap Brothers?)
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It's just a fact that before 1970 sequels were just not en vogue. Probably had something to do with an abundance of creativity and originality back in them days. Announcing a sequel in the Golden Age would have, in most cases, been met with condescending scorn or treated with b-movie indifference unlike today where you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a pitch for a sequel, but anyhoo I digress. Bride of Frankenstein was without a doubt an amazing sequel but better? That is arguable since both are considered supreme horror classics. Same goes for the Thin Man and Shot in the Dark, the first ones were not too shabby, but you definitely gave good examples of sequels done right.
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He freaked out when waiting for action. But once it began, he was a badass. I know fighters exactly like that: can't handle waiting, but hell on wheels once the bell rings.
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I'm pretty sure I read an interview with Cameron some time back and he said all the Marines personalities were based on real life Marines his brother had served with. My favorite Aliens trivia is that Jenette Goldstein supposedly showed up for her audition thinking the movie was about illegal aliens and had dressed accordingly. Paxton actually addresses this in the movie.
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Only man in history to fight an Alien, Predator and Terminator.
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You're fucking up the quotes man and you do not do that with A L I E N S. You're missing "come in here" and it's "Maybe you haven't been keeping up..." That said. Not bad...for a human.
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They all killed him onscreen, too. (nobody be pedantic and say he's not dead when he disappears in ALIENS)
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when he disappears into the floor. Doesn't come across on screen though.
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I remembered it as Bill Paxton who gets his guts punched out, but Paxton's character just runs away..
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Yeah, you are correct. My apologies. I need to rectify this heresy with a marathon viewing of both the theatrical and directors cuts of Alien and Aliens. And you sound like you have an iron clad memory of all things Aliens so, "Why don't we put you in charge?!" ...um, of correcting any future embarrassing Aliens misquotes.
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Has there ever been a more pilot-y pilot character in a movie? (no).
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Aliens sequel - like whiskeylips i always imagined A3 wud be set on a Blade Runner style earth of the future (ive always considered blade runner tobe set in the Aliensverse) Ripleys ultimate fear come true. and having her fighting the aliens with hicks and newt i remember seeing A3 and coming out the theatre and hearing some guy go 'oh man theyve fucked Aliens up'
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No I'm not up to the job and you better just start dealing with it, stargrove! Listen to me! stargrove, just deal with it, because we need you and I'm sick of your bullshit. And we all talk about Hudson getting his shit together but no one ever mentions Gorman. Sure he fucked up big time but at the end went out hardcore. Probably out of guilt more than heroics but still he redeems himself.
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No there hasn't. We're in the pipe, five by five. Rough air ahead, we're in for some chop. Hmm, where is choppah?
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Bishop...
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Aug. 14, 2011, 3:23 p.m. CST
BTW, great book out on Lance Henriksen called "Not Bad for a Human"
by AlienFanatic
I just picked it up for my Kindle and I've read a bit so far, but it seems like a fascinating read. If you're a fan of Lance's work, including Aliens, you'll probably get a kick out of it. He seems to be just as complex as the characters he portrays onscreen.
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...with the interview with Paul Reiser where he reckoned the audience would associate more closely with Burke, as the rest of the cast were either the "tough hombre" marines or Ripley who was maternal but possibly crazy. even at the time I thought what version of the script have you been reading Paul.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:11 p.m. CST
I get the impression Lance is one hard motherfucker
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
and Dead Man confirms it. Love the double contact lenses he wanted Bishop to wear.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 4:14 p.m. CST
love to hear more from you guys who were around when it came out
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
like how much you knew, what was available pre-internet in terms of insider knowledge etc. I first saw it aged nine when I sneaked down to record it on vcr in 89. It ended when Ripley hit the airlock controls and for years I didn't get to see the last bits.
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jus' messin' wit' ya
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Good points made in this thread by many. Just had to add if you haven't seen THE ABYSS special edition.. then you NEED to see THE ABYSS special edition. If you're an ALIENS fan and you havent seen this film then check it out. It's by a mile the closest film James Cameron has made tonally to ALIENS... and depending on which way the wind is blowing on that particular day it might even be a BETTER film than ALIENS. Massive improvement on the theatrical cut. I speak the truth.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 5:51 p.m. CST
Yeah, the theatrical Abyss should just be withdrawn
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
Noticed that Monk (one of Coffey's team) stayed good mates with Ed Harris; he played Henriksen's brother in Appaloosa.
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Great guy. Gave me all the time in the world.
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The aliens themselves...they look like bulky stunt guys in suits as opposed to the lanky, menacing looking single alien in the first movie and it dimishes their impact, they seem much more like props than organic life forms...dont get me wrong, ALIENS is a great film, but its a slight step down from the first movie.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 7:57 p.m. CST
I always thought ALIENS was better. I was always wrong.
by Subtitles_Off
I re-watched them both last year. ALIEN is much, much, much better. ALIENS is a great adventure picture. The original orbits in a whole different solar system.
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Aliens is a perfect movie. As is the original Terminator, and The Abyss. (Both versions!) That hat trick of all time classic sci fi movies made Cameron my favourite director for many, many years. And I still think he's THE best director of action sequences around. Probably always will be too..
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He loves him some T&A.
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I don't think any of the crew-turned-into-eggs backstory comes across in Scott's film (without deleted scenes), and the egg imagery in the film's trailer and poster is obviously just that.
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so it trumps Alien by default.
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Aug. 14, 2011, 9:51 p.m. CST
Yeah the whole people turning into eggs thing was not in the original theatrical release or any of the televised showings..
by MRJONZ72
i first saw it on laser disc and then on integrated into the 2003 Directors cut on DVD..Scott says his preferred version is the theatrical cut even tho he made a DC (go figure) and granted his intention was to have the victims turning into eggs (which I do like and probably prefer that idea) but gives his reason why he cut that one scene out. Anyway since its not there in the theatrical cut..and pretty much the theatrical cut is the only version folks had seen up to that point, don't find it fair to say that Cameron changed the life-cycle.
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I thought the exact same thing back in 1986 when I saw ALIENS. They looked like guys in black spandex, which was confirmed by photos in Starlog. Cameron's aliens were guys wearing leotards with bony attachments glued on, NOT the full suit and lanky appearance from the first film. Plus missing the dome cranium. Cameron's aliens looked cheap and NOT terrifying.
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yeah
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It's my favourite movie if I'm honest, so nobody attack me for criticizing such a damned awesome movie. But when that first marine gets grabbed by the xenomorph, it looks retarded. The alien sort of crosses it's arms over her chest and then they both levitate out of frame, clearly on a wire. I don't know if the alien is meant to be lifting them by his tail, but it looks really goofy.
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Jesus H christ, I'm becoming illiterate as I get older. I have never had a problem with "its" before but it keeps coming up.
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The original design of the alien is the most artistic and striking, both repulsive and erotic. And the alien is like a terrifying statue come to life in a nightmare ... you see it move only in close-ups or shadow for the most part. Cameron's udpated design looks meaner and more dangerous. And it moves quickly and strongly. It's the difference between looking MENACING ... you wouldn't *go near* the alien in Alien ... and looking DANGEROUS ... the aliens in Aliens are going to rip you the fuck apart on sight, it's clear.
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The creature in Alien was smooth and glistening, with a sort of crystalline finish which represented the idea of a perfect organism. The creature in Aliens is covered in grilles and grates and hoses, representing the "machinery of death" aspect of the Vietnam allegory. /I heart Alien fanwankery
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One of the coolest quotes of all time in my opinion. There's numerous reports of Cameron being a tyrant on set, and I even saw him on 60 minutes where he showed off a hat that said HMFIC (Head Motha Fucka In Charge) and seemed kind of proud of his reputation, and since Bill Paxton who said the above quote has probably been in the most movies with jc (I could be wrong about that) I wonder what he has to say, or said about it.
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Hard to believe that the sentry gun scene was not in the theatrical release, what a badass scene!
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Yes, of course, but Aliens is still terrific.
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1. Most of the marines' first name initials are the same as the actor playing them. 2. The genlocked marine cam display text (mission time etc) is from a BBC Model B micro, double height, mode 7. This is the same text that was used in the British teletext system for two decades. (A sort of steam-powered internet.) 3. Two of the Aliens cast did voice acting work for "Star Fleet", aka "X-Bomber".
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I remember one of the classic "TV dubs" of The Terminator in which Paxton's line of, "Fuck YOU, asshole!" was overdubbed with, "Eat this, scum!" Although actually the thing that made it even better was that the emphasis was all wrong. It wasn't so much, "Eat this, scum!" as "Eat this *scum*!", as though Dubbed Paxton were suggesting that he had a small pile of edible scum and was recommending that Arnie give it a try.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 4:09 a.m. CST
He looks like his (under)pants are hugging, twisting, sqeezing and chaffing around his nutsack
by alexander
and everytime he tries to tell someone Jim and his crew are just like "Nah Sorry Mate don't speak Chinese!" Or, yeah, he's getting in character
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Aug. 15, 2011, 5:34 a.m. CST
Loved the Aliens reference with the forklift in Breaking Bad
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
last night!
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One bit I didn't like as well was the added line when Ripley poses the question "so who's laying these eggs?", and they actually start talking about the possibility of the queen. Much better for the question to be left unanswered until the reveal at the end. I'm torn on the scene with the motion trackers and the hamster though...
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without some tard saying "___" is better than "___". Can't you mongoloids ever just discuss one or the other?
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Aug. 15, 2011, 8:02 a.m. CST
sounds like nightarrows don't like the cornbread, either
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
just kidding, bud. I agree with you.
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"Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?" "No, have you." Three simple words, yet the best put down ever.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 8:06 a.m. CST
nightarrows, let's get real. Anytime anyone discusses any movie
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
that has a sequel, prequel, or is part of a series there's a natural tendency to discuss the differences, compare, and yes have favorites.
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"My favourite" does not necessarily equal "better". Alien is the better film, ALIENS is my favourite movie.
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First off, my favorite does not equal your favorite. It's opinion. But yes, I agree. Alien was something new. Not that an alien monster attacking a ship was new, but the way it was done. How it attacked, the physical appearance of the monster, the whole metamorphesis (sp?). Alien is a better movie because of all these. Aliens is a great shoot 'em up in space. I like it better because I have more fun with it because of the humor, action, and acting. In Alien there's only one mood, and that is scared. In Aliens we see the whole gamut.
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It's been promised for a few months now.
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There is a natural tendency to discuss, but when something is posted from one movie there are always the "the other movie is better" lines, and then the circle continues. It's not so much the discussion as the same-old same-old I get tired of. The movies aren't new anymore and the arguments have been made over and over... I thought this thread would be aimed squarely at the photo presented, but I should have known better! iwasinjuniorhighdickhead: LOL I do in fact like cornbread, but that was a great pull!
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They're both top of the line classics and each contributed significantly to the current vocabulary of film. A better example would be the TF movies. They are shit, all 3. #1 being relatively less shit than #2 and #3 doesn't make it not shit. They're all shit. And I love them.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 9:11 a.m. CST
Not me, I refuse to see Transformers 3 until DVD because
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
Revenge of the Fallen was the largest turd ever created. The lowest point was having an old robot fart a parachute.
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On the plus side I have learned something new from this talkback. I didn't know that Remar was in this originally. James Remar is just badass in everything he does. It's not a muscle-bound type of badassness either. It's attitude, and subtlety.
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He looks too much like Bishop. They have very similar lower faces. Could this have been part of the creative differences?
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Aug. 15, 2011, 9:21 a.m. CST
Plus they also have low, similar sounding voices.
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
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Aug. 15, 2011, 9:24 a.m. CST
Remar was in full blown drug abuse mode at the time
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
i'd imagine that had more than a little to do with it. Mind you, it's a Jim Cameron set, so it's entirely possible Remar did nothing wrong except not click with Cameron.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 9:26 a.m. CST
grammaton, did a robot really fart a parachute?
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
i'm laughing anyway. It sounds too bad for words.
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The Warriors. He had the best line in that movie too.
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just like the other scene with the large acid hole on the floor.the director gives you a hint of things to come. That's why Cameron knows how to write a script.Nothing in it is wasted,every detail has a purpose and connects with each other throughout the story. Like the scene with Ed Harris's ring in the toilet in the Abyss. or the scene in Avatar while Quaritch is talking to Jake the first time in his mech,where apart from the dialog and the interaction between the 2 characters,you also get a visual hint that Quaritch knows very well how to use those mechs and that this one belongs to him.which also explains why it is found later in his ship when it explodes. But yeah Cameron doesnt know how to write good scripts because they dont get oscar nominations.aha.
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Is still so damned effectively creepy. All of the walls and moisture in there, awesome set design!
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The whole colony scene from landing through to the atmosphere processor is awesome, in a way it's my favourite part of the film. I think there is one extra little bit from the DC where Riley is outside the colony, and has to steel herself before going in, which I would keep.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 11:30 a.m. CST
autodidact, it doesn't matter if the aliens in "ALIENS" looked meaner
by Billy_D_Williams
and more menacing...the design and build of the suits look cheap and thrown together...you could see the seams...thus diminishing any design attributes. Even the queen looks like a gigantic prop...the aliens in Cameron's movie simply dont hold a candle to the brilliant design and practical build of the original alien. Part of it was Cameron's vision and the budget he had to work with. The movie cost $18 million but should have cost twice that amount for the vision Cameron had. Alot of the FX in Aliens is wonderful, but it has alot of rough edges and not in a good way...it skirts dangerously close to the cheap, Roger Corman look from the B-pictures Cameron worked on earlier. The seamless ugly elegance from the first movie simply could not be matched. It's like the difference between Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back...Star Wars is a great movie, but it hasn't aged well because of the B-movie looking cheapness of the costumes and FX, as a result of the low budget. Cameron used alot of tricks he picked up from his Roger Corman days to make ALIENS at that limited budget, and they were clever, but they were cheap looking and it rubbed off on ALIENS and knocked it down a peg...the raggedy looking alien costumes being the worse victim. And this is why ALIEN is the superior film, among other reasons.
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After the ship crashes that was to take them all back to the big ship, Burke in all his wisdom says, "Why don't we build a fire and sing some songs?' Worst line ever!
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The aliens in ALIENS look better then in ALIEN. The alien in ALIEN really didn't seem like much of a threat unless you happened to walk right into the fucking thing. In ALIENS they're climbing on walls, pounding on doors, getting into the ducts, dropping out of ceilings. Those fuckers want you ass. Bad. And my original point. The creature in alien looks like a 8 foot tall skinny dude in a costume(though a great costume it is). ALIENS, they come off like extraterrestrial insects. There's nothing human about them.
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Aliens was the first time (and maybe the last time) I sat down in a theater, the movie started and then suddenly it was 2 1/2 hours later. I was literally stunned. I was 18 and a movie fan but not a geek. This movie changed that. I had to know who the director was. I had to know how they did that. How did they grab me by the neck and growl, "you're coming with me!" and just throw me around and make me forget the real world for so long? Cameron had me from that day on.
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But ALIENS creatures look much better in motion, thanks to the updated suit construction. And the use of stuntmen, wire-work, better puppeteering, and a few camera tricks. There are a couple shots in ALIEN that really don't look great, mainly when the creature is attacking Lambert at the end. And the one time you see it move quickly it really looks like a guy in a suit to me. Any time you see the alien move in Aliens, it looks pretty damn eery and scary. I also highly disagree about the alien queen. She doesn't look like a puppet to me. She has a few puppet like moments in the more subtle aspects of her motion, but the overall effect in wide shots is just frightening to me.
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i'm talking about the SUIT dude, the suits in ALIENS look shoddy and thrown together, you can see fucking seams! the designs were pretty decent though. but the design becomes pointless once you spot the seams...and when you spot the seams the threat diminishes.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 12:14 p.m. CST
not to mention the LOOK of the aliens were of short stocky stunt men
by Billy_D_Williams
not the organic lifeform seen in the first film...
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I think you're the one who's confused.
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You should know that the making of a movie is not only about setting your cameras,but involves a lot of decision of budgetary nature.and not only that but also the fact that the director to make decisions according to the needs and challenges of his movie. Not only Cameron had to work with a specific,limited budget,but he was also making an eniterly different movie than the original one.And as such his movie presented new,different difficulties.The talkbackers above pointed out some of those,like ie that the film has a lot of action moments with the aliens running,climbing walls,grabbing the marines,etc. Which means,as a director your first concern shouldnt be if the alien looks organic or not like in the first movie,but that the alien design and consequently the suit,need to be more flexible,more ergonomic for its operator to use,etc You dont like the suit in Aliens,fine,but sometimes you should put yourself in the director's position before judging his choices for his film.
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because it's shot and lit with care...you dont see any seams, they gave that alien tender loving care. listen, I'm not shitting on Cameron's film, but the reality is he made that movie in the spirit of the B-picture Corman style he learned his craft from...the great script and performances is what saved that movie...but Cameron shot it kind of run and gun, down and dirty, so the makeup of the suits and FX suffered a bit for that...not everything was shot with the kind of care you see in his later films like The Abyss, T2 and True Lies... he made a wonderful film under the circumstances, which were an unfairly low budget and time constraints, but those circumstances contribute to the "coming apart at the seams" feeling of the film's physical look, which skirts the line of B-picture cheapness. THAT is what im talking about
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so i'll settle for that. The only time I noticed human features was the scene where an alien is scuttling down the air vent, and I was too busy being worried for Vasquez at that point.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 12:43 p.m. CST
Greatest Twofer One-Two Punch I ever saw.
by Half-Baked-Goggle-Box-Do-Gooder
Local shithouse showed an Opening Night Double Feature of "ALIENS" and Cronenberg's "The Fly". Top THAT, motherfuckers.
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ONE alien dammit.one alien.not 4 that Cameron had to work with,which he also had to make them look like hundreds. as i said two completely different movie with their own completely different challenges.
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Ummm, you do know that Burke is joking (in exasperation) when he says that line, right?
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i prefaced what i said with the challenges Cameron was under with such an ambitious film, but all we're left with is the FILM, not the story of how it was made...and in ALIENS, the creatures and FX look borderline cheap and thrown together...Cameron brilliantly off-sets this by keeping the pace quick and relentless...it's the same trick Lucas used for A New Hope to off-set that film's limited budget and the cheapness of the FX and costumes, etc. But at the end of the day, after being scared shitless by ALIENS for years, I am viewing the film in a broader context, and noticing the "look"...it happens with every film...the initial impact loses its power over time and you're left with the production elements which you study more closely...there's nothing wrong with that and its why filmmakers take EXTREME PAINS in imposing a solid look for every film...Cameron WAS NOT ABLE TO DO THIS for ALIENS, because of the beforementioned budget limitations. So the initial visceral impact, which is what wowed audiences back in the day (especially before dvd and blu-ray where every detail is now noticeable), is not able to save the film, so it's knocked down a few pegs and therefore inferior to Ridley's film, which WAS painstankingly cared for in terms of the visuals. Cameron got a shitty deal, it's not fair, it sucks, but it is what it is. And I'm judging the FILM, not his productions problems.
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But it isn't really necessary. It fills in gaps that an audience member could manage himself. Cameron was justified in trimming this from the original cut. I like some of the SE's extra scenes, but not all of them. The extra discussion of the queen I would cut, and the entire scene with the Jordens in the rover would be better off excised; it looks cheap, and adds nothing to the story. Sentry gun sequence is good, though.
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"The human eye needs very few pixels of information to register an object" or something like that while talking about his shoddy care for the alien suits...so even he admits the suits are not that great and the seams are visible, but he's admitting he used the relentless pace to off-set and hide the flaws...that works great during initial theatrical release when all you have is the big screen experience but when you have home video and especially dvd and blu-ray, Cameron's quote comes back to bite him the ass...because the human eye is also very good at detecting flaws, and after mulitple viewings, the flaws in the suits add up.
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What movie are you watching? Compare it to any other movie in 1986.... compare it to the original Alien.... you're smoking crack. You're just plain wrong. The effects in ALIENS still hold up.
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thrown together and cheap in comparison to the first movie, is what i should have said...obviously its not a high school stage production, but the budget was too low for what they were trying to do.
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One of the biggest flaws is seeing the stunt double for Bishop in the floor grabbing Newt as she is being sucked into the hanger after the Ripley/Queen fight. How did they miss that?
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Aug. 15, 2011, 1:33 p.m. CST
Name one effect besides the suits that looks better in ALIEN than it does in ALIENS......
by Autodidact
Ignoring our disagreement about the suits themselves, what effect used in both movies looks better in ALIEN than it does in ALIENS? I can't think of one... the model work in ALIENS is much better... the puppets in Aliens are better... the cyborg effects are better and more convincing in Aliens... shall I go on? And ALIENS had that awesome 80s FX animation for lightning/electricity. I love the way lightning looks in 80s movies, especially with a bit of interactive lighting.
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Sorry when I think Cameron+robots my mind always goes to cyborgs.
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I don't think they look cheap, certainly for the time. But the look of the movie does NOT hold up as well as Alien for the most part. I watched both on Blu-Ray recently. Both have flaws (and I mean that only in the sense of "things that DON'T look look as though the movie could have been made yesterday"), but overall Alien does look better imo. Alien is lit better, and the quality of the sets is better. Together with the superb cast in "Alien", it means that the film feels real and engaging in a way that exceeds Aliens. It has better repeat viewing capacity a quarter of a century on. Alien does have its flaws (and Blu-Ray is brutal at showing up any small flaws). Some of the shots of the Nostomo in space now look a tad wobbly...they're actually done in a very simple way, using pre-Star Wars technology. (The model is great, though, so most of the time the shots still look terrific.) A few of the shots on the planetoid surface look like sets when viewed with the aggressive crispness of Blu-Ray (although Scott's wise decision to add smoke to everything helps ameliorate these issues). And the "fourth act" where the Alien gets blown out of the airlock provides the one cheap-looking shot of the entire movie. (That whole sequence was shot in a rush at short notice; the original plan was to have the movie end after the Nostromo detonated.) But many scenes still look fucking magnificent. The Nostromo interiors are wonderful. The alien derelict looks great. The face-hugger looks better and much more organic/real than the ones in Cameron's movie. The set in which Brett meets his end is stunning. Aliens has high production values throughout most of the movie, by 1986 standards, but there are some cheap-looking moments. There's some unconvincing compositing at times when the dropship descends. The rovers on LV-426 lack weight and believability in the SE scenes. None of the sets look quite as good as those in "Alien", and the creatures aren't as interesting/polished-looking (although I don't agree that they look like cheap men-in-suits). I do actually quite like the way that the warriors in "Aliens" move in an interesting way and make much greater use of the tail as part of that movement. There's something about them that is almost marine-like, octopus-like. The way they unfurl into life in sub-level 3, and when rising out of the water to abduct Newt. The creature in "Alien" hides in wait. It's more like a spider. It broods, it thinks, it is patient. In "Aliens" they are more like hunters, coming at you, for you, swarming to get in and kill you or capture you. They are more mobile and fluid creatures. They seem like a different caste. (Maybe they are.) There are also some slightly weak backscreen projection shots when Ripley is firing her grenades in the queen's nest. Not quite up to snuff. But the final battle with the queen on the Sulaco still holds up extremely well. Weaver sells it, but the loader and the queen both look real, and they both look good. One other I really liked about "Alien": the "technobabble" didn't actually sound like technobabble. It sounded very real and believable. The dialogue in general is more pseudo-documentary in style than "Aliens". That increases the sense of realism and immersion about the film. The flipside is that "Alien" doesn't have the reams of great one-liners that "Aliens" does.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 1:45 p.m. CST
Name one effect that looks better in ALIEN than it does in ALIENS
by Keith
Facehugger.
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Compare the sequence where Kane approaches and looks into the egg in "Alien" with the one where the egg opens near Newt in "Aliens". In "Alien" you think you're looking at a genuine organic object. In "Aliens" you think you're looking at a special effect. Even the way the facehugger starts to crawl out of the egg looks a bit crap.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 1:49 p.m. CST
Name one effect besides the suits that looks better in ALIEN than it does in ALIENS......
by Billy_D_Williams
uh, the facehugger the eggs the baby chestburster and the aliens themselves are the main attraction, and the alien looks a hundred times better in the first movie i just named four of the main ingredients of these movies i win alot of the model work is pretty good, but the suits look terrible in comparison to the first movie
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Aug. 15, 2011, 1:50 p.m. CST
iwasinjuniorhighdickhead, yeah it did. You missed it?
by Grammaton Cleric Binks
When they find Jetfire in the air museum. They think he's an autobot, but he's a decepticon, then he starts talking about choice. Blah, blah, blah, and at one point he farts a parachute.
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i love ALIENS, great film, but it's not as good as the first one, which is what im trying to get at
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in ALIEN, when Kane is inspecting the egg, you can even see some kind of liquid dripping UPWARDS...that really freaked people out back in '79....the eggs look way better in ALIEN
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I still disagree on everything but the eggs. The eggs did look better in ALIEN. The upwards dripping never made sense to me... what, do the eggs reverse local gravity or something?
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I actually like the FX work on the chestburster in "Aliens", although the scene isn't as impressive overall because you don't really care about the random colonist. The shot in "Alien" where the chestburster legs it off down the kitchen table does look a bit weak when examined closely. But the scene as a whole is still stunningly good. You really buy into it. Hurt does a great job, and the best thing about that scene is the sound. The weird, inhuman guttural noise Kane makes as his chest cavity starts to get ripped (one assumes). And for me the thing I love the most is that Kane's screams are silenced for the final second before eruption. He's still thrashing around, as though trying to scream, but he's no longer making any sound. I'm not sure why, but that is freakily cool.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:09 p.m. CST
One of the things I thought was kinda cool...we at least 15 years ago is finding out they only had 6 aliens
by MRJONZ72
and making it appear that there was a lot more..it was cool finding that out a long time ago..probably not as cool now lol.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:14 p.m. CST
^ It's still cool. ... Facehuggers look way better in ALIENS
by Autodidact
Again, it's probably down to whether you care about examining the prop/suit/gag in a still frame or whether you care how it works in the shots. The ALIENS facehuggers are fearsome, repulsive, and convincing. The ALIEN facehugger never moves aside from constricting around Kane's neck and falling from the ceiling.
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i will have no problem with Promethues being PG13 as Alien and Aliens (along with the likes of T1, T2 and Blade Runner) would be PG-13 if made today that is all out
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:41 p.m. CST
they should show Alien and Aliens as part of a saturday morning kids only double bill
by CARTMANEZ
i could take my kid, drop him off at the cinema for 5 hours of PG13 Alien coolness whilst i hit the bars... PG13 rocks!
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:44 p.m. CST
*the guy narrating the tv spots for Promethues next summer* - "'PROMETHUES...A RIDLEY SCOTT FILM...RATED PG13'"
by CARTMANEZ
in cinemas now
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way better in A2. I cant wait to see how the facehuggers in Half-Life will look like when,well,the movie is made.
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mouth in order not to buy his tongue or swallow it backwards? they usually do this when someone is in this kind of a seizure.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:48 p.m. CST
what do Harry Potter, Spiderman, Transformers, GI Joe, Care Bears, Alien, Die Hard, Terminator and Predator have in common?
by CARTMANEZ
rated PG13
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fake.especially the way it run off the table.sorry but that scene and the other when the Alien 'hangs' Dallas in the shaft tunnel were always looked terrible even when i saw the movie for the first time.
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i think so!
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Aug. 15, 2011, 2:55 p.m. CST
*me at the cinema next summer* - "Hi one for Madagascar 3 and my 13 year old son would like one to Promethues please"
by CARTMANEZ
certainly sir that will be $PG.13 please
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No way, meng. (Shakes head.) Granted, the FHs in Aliens are more ambitious in their scope. They have to crawl and run around, which they didn't in Alien. (Although I actually prefer the idea of the FH doing little other than leaping out of the egg onto a host.) But the facehugger in the first movie looks far more real to me. Cameron's facehuggers look rubbery and faintly silly. Perhaps, though, one of the main differences in the way I perceive them is that the facehugger you see in Alien is 100% successful. It has one job to do, and it does it flawlessly. The facehuggers you see in Aliens are all failures.
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was like a gigantic chicken egg (it even cracks) and not the organic one in the movie? what gives?
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What do you mean by this?
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They fail very consistently, lol.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 3 p.m. CST
There was alwasy one shot SFX wise that always bugged me in Alien is when Parker dies..the fake head is pretty bad
by MRJONZ72
Dont expect it to be perfect..but the skin tone, the afro on the dummy, the hairline, the plastic look..I probably saw the movie for the first time in the mid 80's..and that was one glaring thing that caught my eye and just think how much even worse it looks when pause. But still both Alien and Aliens still two of my favorite films of all time.
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and then Ash started poking it with his pencil,didnt looked rubbery at all to you? are you kidding me? The facehugger in the glass case trying to hug Burke looked like it was a real,alive one and it was moving the whole time,whereas in the first movie you just saw it stuck in Kane's face. I am sorry,say anything you want about the alien suits,but the facehugger in A2 was way better.period.
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when Dallas gets killed by the Alien.he turns his head,and suddenly the Alien apears from the shadow while extending its hands towards him.It looked like a man in a monster suit trying to give him a hug,which i suppose that's how the scene happened in reality.
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head on the table,with milk running from his mouth, was also pretty obvious that it was a movie effect.but what was worse in that scene was the transition between the frame when Ripley puts an obvious replica of Ash's head on the table,to the frame when you clearly see that Ash's head is now the actor's head while he is siting under the table. I am sorry guys but Alien is not your perfect movie regarding its technical aspect.It has many pretty obvious flaws,but are forgivable since this movies and its sequel remain all-time masterpieces.
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Yep, noticed that immediately when I first saw Die Hard. Had listened to Horner's soundtrack album many times in 87 and 88. "Resolution and Hyperspace", if memory serves. Both Aliens soundtracks have very interesting stories to them. Both involved the director and composer almost coming to blows. Both of them use Goldsmith cues from other movies. (Alien uses Goldsmith's earlier score from "Freud" during the Dallas/air shaft sequence. "Aliens" re-uses Goldsmith's piece written for the death of Parker and Lambert in "Alien" when the queen is chasing Ripley towards the elevator.) And Horner's cue "Bishop's Countdown" is possibly the most widely-used temp trailer track of all time. In both cases, the composer reconciled with the director and scored at least one more of his movies, but in Goldsmith's case the experience for Scott on "Legend" was even worse than on "Alien", and he never worked with him again.
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"Ash started poking it with his pencil,didnt looked rubbery at all to you?" Nope. Watched this scene yesterday, in fact. Looks bloody brilliant. Looks like a real (dead) organism. Looks like it has a proper skeleton. Cameron's facehuggers look virtually boneless. The reflex twitch of the legs is fantastic. And the autopsy looks totally real. In that shot and in the case of the thing pulsating inside the egg, it's no doubt due to the fact that Scott used real organic material. (Cow's stomach and oysters respectively.)
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That's back to front. Cow's stomach in egg, oysters forming facehugger underside in autopsy.
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Yeah, the wobbling suddenly ending is quite noticeable. They should probably have tried to cover that with a more forgiving edit.
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Yeah, that's an interesting one. It became an iconic image despite bearing no resemblance to the movie egg. I believe that at the time they hadn't finalized the design/production or something like that?
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It's true that when you've seen the film several times that moment does start to look a little odd. And yet it still works for me. And when you watch the movie with somebody who's never seen it before (as I have done three times), they always shit their pants at that moment. The movement is important, and it's really effective, even if it seems a bit strange.
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They try a spoon at one point, but it doesn't stay. Certainly there's nothing blocking the sound. It's more as though Kane's vocal system has failed because his chest is completely fucked. Works brilliantly.
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The alien killing Dallas in the tunnel. Like Killik --- It annoys me to no end. The outstretched arms are just silly... like what you do to your wife when you want to scare her in the dark. That's the only moment I don't forgive. Yes, Ash's head on the table has that very choppy edit... but I can live with it. The Dallas vs Alien in tunnel could have easily been solved with a menacing sneer instead of the haunted-house 'boo' motion. That said... I still take Alien over Aliens. And I fuckin' love me some Aliens. Two great movies... both are endlessly re-watchable.
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Fuck me? Fuck YOU!
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Fuck me? Fuck YOU!
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*whoever brought up Henriksen and Dead man gets bonus points* is that okay with you, AICN?!?!?! fuckin cunts.
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the whole movie aliens condensed into Rap , sounds awful? is in fact awesome http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcLTaMpRl2o
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Well, remember that the alien wasn't trying to kill Dallas. It was capturing him. Even without the cocooning scene, this is still reasonably clear: "No blood. No Dallas."
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there were actually TWO aliens on board the Nostromo - the one hugging Dallas was the PG13 alien who didnt want to harm Dallas - unlike its R rated brother who wanted to rip Dallas' head off
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The Alien in Alien hardly moves when it's creeping up to Lambert and Parker at the end. It's pretty much got its arms out for another hug.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 5:14 p.m. CST
i always thought an AvP movie would be like an Aliens 'II'
by CARTMANEZ
before it got made i always figured an Alien v Predator movie would basically be a sequel to Aliens in so far as tone and setting - i figured theyd set it post Aliens or Alien 3 (way before A4) with the Colonial Marines stunk in the middle of the AvP war on some planet as in the Dark Horse comic series not what we got from good ol PWSA eh? in fact i think the AvP films were basically remakes of the first 2 Alien films - with Predators stuck in there for good measure: 'Alien' v Predator - tried to be 'Alien' (with a little bit of 'Aliens' and Predator 2 at the end), same design of the Aliens from Scotts film, similar set up/scenes - finding a 'signal' leading them to the alien, whaling station/underground pyamid = Derelict ship etc 'Aliens' v Predator: Requiem just flat out tried to be 'Aliens' - similar set up/scenes - people go missing sparks the whole thing, the APC, the hive, the end getting away from nuclear explosion, Cameron style aliens with the scream
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The dead facehugger does look like it is a made of rubber when Ash is examining it.in fact whenever i see it in that scene,it always gives me the impression that it is a used condom shaped as an alien thing. Later when Ash is doing the autopsy on it,yes the facehugger does look a lot more organic,but then again we are talking about an immobile object here.It is not that difficult (i suppose) to make it look like a real organism. Which brings us to your next argument.you say that the facehuggers look boneless.Again i will point to you the scene when the facehuggers is slowly climbing the table behind Ripley.you can clearly see using its detailed finger-like legs to climb the table. How exactly does this look to you that the facehugger doesnt have bones? or how about when we see it running on the floor? You can hear the cracks of its legs while touching the floor.if that doesnt give you the impression that the facehuggers has bones,then what does? Besides making a practical effect look like a real alien organism is not only about its textures and how real-life they look.It is also about how it moves,how interacts with the characters and the environment because if anything else,life is all about movement. And you yourself confirm this by correctly mentioning the reflex twitch and how the inside of the egg pulses.They are small details but very effective ones in helping the audience perceive the alien as a real one. But whereas in Alien you have an alien facehugger twitching and pulsing,in Aliens you have facehuggers trying to 'kiss' while hitting the glass to break free,attacking Ripley and Newt,sneaking behind Ripley,running on the floor or walking slowly on the roof,grabbing Ripley's neck with its tail and so on. In Alien you have Ash making an autopsy on an oyster. see my point? The facehugger in A1 might look more organic,but in A2 they look more alive.
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I'm pretty sure a facehugger is like a walking pair of lungs with a choking tentacle and very long arthropoidal legs/fingers for gripping. There's even on-screen footage that makes it look like the fingers are hard on the outside (when ash cuts it with the laser). It's kinda like a more solid octopus.. The full-grown xenomorph doesn't have a skeleton... it has an exoskeleton... so it stands to reason that the pupal/larval stages would not have bones either.
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You are almost right that this specific scene starts to lose its initial impact after repeating again,but not when viewed for the first time. But when someone like Billy d Williams criticizes the alien suits in Aliens,because he notices their seams when watching the movie in his vhs,i dont see any reason why a similar complaint cant be made for that scene. I dont know about about,but for me when something works successfully only once but never again,is at least a disappointment.
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that's my impression too.it has an exoskeleton and legs like the crabs ,not a skeleton.
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the screams you hear from her,are because she is being raped not killed. well that's what some fans insist that it does.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 5:44 p.m. CST
when you really think about it..A L I E N is some creepy shit...probably the creepiest scariest movie ever made
by CARTMANEZ
not so much now as theres been Alien cuddly toys and on lunch boxes and the PG13 AvP and the horrendous AvP 2 and the awful sequels A3 and A4 etc etc but at the time - going to see it not knowing jack except that egg poster and knowing its hard R rated - Weaver total unknown, Scott unknown director etc and your sitting there - esp the first half from when we get A L I E N slowly appearing with the eerie score, the wake up, the signal, the planetoid, derelict, space jockey, eggs in the massive cargo and then that frickin yellow Spider crab thing jumping out on Kanes face - leading to the chest burst scene everything so real looking and the performances so real world etc adding to the realism almost the sense of thats what space travel and any bizarre alien life WOULD be like...totally 'alien' not star trek or star wars im really hopeful that kind of stuff/feel/atmosphere will get explored again in Prometheues (with a hard R rating of course) the whole alien(s) stalking people on spaceships/colonies/prisons/arctic pyramids/small mid west towns has been done to death - time for something new and more Sci Fi HR Giger atmospheric based than the bog standard alien slasher flicks...it’s the first half of Alien that really interests me- not so much the rest where it basically turns into a slasher flick with an alien instead of Mike Myers (although - at the time it mustve been incredibally tense)
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You know that the shot of the tail between "Lambert's" legs is actually Brett's legs, right? It was shot as part of the scene where the alien kills Brett in the cooling tower. You can even see that it's Brett's blue jeans rather than Lambert's off-white slacks. The Brett leg shot was re-edited into the attack on Lambert. Certainly makes it more sinister, and you can't tell it's a man's legs. It was a big surprise for Veronica Lambert when she saw the theatrical cut for the first time.
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apart from the stuntman-in-the-floor bit at the end. I was amazed that it could be done on such a low budget. Maybe I need to see it on bluray to notice.<P> Grammaton, i've not seen Transformers 2 and 3, but it is certainly entertaining to hear of Bay's batshit lunacy second hand; my mind's impression of a jet robot farting a parachute is probably way funnier than it could ever be in reality.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 5:53 p.m. CST
@cartmanez well Cameron and Del Toro tried to make the Mountains of Madness
by KilliK
but HW got too scared to invest 200m on a R-Rated horror movie so we are never going to see it.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 5:54 p.m. CST
worth mentioning again, did anyone see the Aliens riff in Breaking Bad?
by IWasInJuniorHighDickhead
involving a drum, a forklift and 'where d'ya want it?'. A great little nod to Aliens.
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damn you Ridley,i thought you had more guts.what happened man and you changed it? heh.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 6:01 p.m. CST
killik - im still angry about MOM being cancelled....cancel Lone Ranger ok but Mountains of fuckin Madness?! FUCK NO!
by CARTMANEZ
that was one movie was was waiting for. its kind of sounds like Promethues might be someway similar i dunno. have to wait and see. (im avoiding too many spoilers for that baby) i guess AvP wasnt a million miles away from MOM either LOL (my god did i just say that?..) they may as well have done MOM - hard R, 200m...i mean they plough miiliions into other stuff that has FAIL written all over it so why not something that ok may do well to break even but will actually be so frickin awesome it hurts
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Remember that also the Prometheus movie started with a 200m budget but eventually it was cut down. HW has changed its business policy,now they care to give that amount of money for movies which have the possibility to turn into franchises (ieTRON ffs).They consider the expensive original horror films a risky investment thus their sole interesting on remaking familiar horror franchises. The only thing that i hope for,is that if Prometheus turns to be a big hit,then there is slight possibility that HW will eventually make the MOM movie,with a smaller budget ofc. Anyway,time will tell.
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Aug. 15, 2011, 6:23 p.m. CST
if Pacific Rim and Promethues hit big then maybe we get MOM in 2014
by CARTMANEZ
sounded like it was *this* close to shooting...they just need some reassurance it wont go all Cowboys and Aliens by similar stuff and GDTs film being hits... damn it sucks so much it didnt go ahead instead of Pacific Rim... Promethues in 2012 and then MOM in 2013 was too good to be true i guess
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That is literally the only movie this year that non-movie people have said to me "Don't you thin that looks good!?" FUCK NO I DON'T
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Yeah, I get that he's capturing Dallas more then flat-out murdering him... but it's still a pose-y type thing that just comes off as silly. It could have been done much better. Still love the movie though. Introducing a teenage family member to it tonight... along with JC's The Thing and a myriad of other sci-fi/horror classics she has no idea exists.
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My new favorite word :D
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Aug. 15, 2011, 10:54 p.m. CST
THE HUGGING AL JOELSON '' MAMMY! '' ALIEN ALWAYS DID BUG ME....
by Astronut
For the 95% right Ridley got, there were just a couple of things I deem as imperfect in A L I E N. The hugging scene and the Ash head on the table transitions. For the hugging scene all he had to do was cut about 1 second before the alien came to a stop and that would be fixed. The Ash head thing is not so easily fixed. Otherwise a MASTERFUL film!
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"the Dallas tunnel hug" If they did a George Lucas style touch-up of Alien and replaced that moment with an alien pouncing on Dallas or something, I would not be against it. Try to fix the poor edit of Ash's head on the table. Maybe use the original score? Those are minor flaws although the hug scene almost kills that entire portion of the movie for me. It's a shame though that movies today are pumped out on an assembly line without the attention to detail and realism that Alien has. Look at the ship they're on, there's a lot of wear and tear and aging, with nicely textured surfaces. The face-hugger looks more alive than any CG creature could. The creature model looks really fantastic with the translucent skin. Those were my thoughts after watching it again recently. Although I turned it off before the end. The Alien gets into the escape pod then Ripley ejects him out into space, right?
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I wish him good health and all the best for his upcoming projects.
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this is so awesome. why dont they do a full length comic?! : http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryRoom.asp?GSub=37499
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that sequence is so terrifying the alien could have been masturbating and you'd still shit your pants.
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before it cuts to Ian Holms' real head it looks ridiculous, but that's maybe 2 flaws in an otherwise perfect film. Even the music is brilliant. ALIENS is not perfect it has too many things going against it, mainly its falling-apart-at-the seams-production-value, the bulky stunt guys in suits look, shoddy compositing in places...it's a very good film, but Cameron has done better work. ALIEN is Ridley's best film.
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"Veronica Lambert " Sorry, I do that all the time. Senility approaching, no doubt. I meant "Veronica Cartwright".
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for T1, T2, Blade Runner and the Alien movies. They have too much blood and swearing. There is not a lot of blood compared to many movies, but too much for a PG-13. Just a little bit of editing, and a couple less "fucks" would do the trick, though.
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I usually think meta-data like rating, runtime, etc. are irrelevant and merely emerge from the story being told. And it's weird discussion of them with repsect to any correlation to quality tends to irk me. But in the case of an ALIEN movie though... I'd really like to see an R rating. They need to throw F-bombs around and show people getting ripped up without cutting away.
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there is no way Alien, Aliens, T1, T2 or Blade Runner would ever be PG13 today. Those babys are HARD R all the way! i guess with a load of cuts - im talking hacked to bits and pussyfied beyound recognition - and yeah then they maybe PG13 im just hoping Promethues and now Blade Runner 2 maintain the R ratings cmon! you can doit Ridley!!
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