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UPDATED WITH MORE!! Look Upon Leaked Images From The PROMETHEUS Comic-Con Reel!!

 

Merrick again...


Talkbacker "alienfanatic" points us towards Dread Central's source link,  which offers even more screenshots from the PROMETHEUS Comic-Con footage.  A few select shots appear below - click any of them to jump to a large gallery of more pics!

 


 

 

More below...

 

--------------------------------

 

Merrick here...

I'm a bit surprised it took this long, but images from PROMETHEUS' recent Comic-Con reel have now leaked online. 

I'm supposing these were snapped by a courageous and industrious Geek who was particularly sly and and quick on his or her feet while said footage was screened - so the image quality here isn't stellar.  These pics are, however, good enough to give us an intriguing glimpse at the "look" of the Ridley Scott directed ALIENverse saga, which opens next Summer.  And, not surprisingly, there appears to be a healthy portion of ALIEN in the mix. 

CLICK any of the shots below to jump to Dread Central, purveyor of these images, to see a few more shots from the reel.  Thanks to John for pointing us towards these. 

 

--- follow Merrick on Twitter ! ---

Readers Talkback
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  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:41 a.m. CST

    Fourth!

    by googamooga

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:42 a.m. CST

    This is one movie I cannot wait to see.

    by googamooga

    Don't fail me Ridley!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:43 a.m. CST

    Pimp that flamethrower!

    by AsimovLives

    What's an alien movie without a flamethrower? Good to know they are still upholding a beloved tradition.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:43 a.m. CST

    can't wait

    by driftwood

    is that the space jockey platform, minus the space jockey on the second image?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:44 a.m. CST

    Alien eggs??

    by D.Vader

    Now there's something I don't recall being mentioned much in the footage descriptions.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:46 a.m. CST

    Anyone else not need to see the Space Jockey origin?

    by Geronimo Jackson

    Much like I didn't need to see a 10 year old Darth Vader. In the immortal words of Patton Oswalt 'I don't give a shit where the stuff I love comes from, I just love the shit I love'.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:55 a.m. CST

    gennaro, I'd say it is the same platform

    by Inexplicable_Nuclear_Balls

    Do a search for "alien space jockey" and compare the pics. I might actually be a tad excited about this now.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:56 a.m. CST

    This looks friggen' amazing!

    by Jaster

    It looks like the insects from the original script have been replace with little ugnaught creatures, and that's fucking BRILLIANT!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:56 a.m. CST

    Michael Jackson in the 2nd from bottom picture

    by Mr_P

    Bustin some moves!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9 a.m. CST

    Ahhhhhhhhh Shit!

    by Tank Williams

    This will blow my geek mind! Love the sets, and yes the flame thrower is pretty badass!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:01 a.m. CST

    @mr_p: Michael Jackson

    by Carl XVI Gustaf

    That brings some memories back. When I was a kid I thought it was MJ on the cover of ALIENS, carrying a kid. That scares me even more now....

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:05 a.m. CST

    ooooooooooooooooooh!

    by TheIceJ

    Way more 'Alien' vibe than I thought it was going to be. This looks great. I'm now very interested.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:07 a.m. CST

    Is this really based on 'Alien Harvest'?

    by The_Motorcycle_Boy

    That script was woeful. The possibility of that being the basis - and Lindelof's hand - are tempering my excitement for Ridley's return to Sci-Fi. Oh well, at least it will look incredible (unless the 3D fucks it all up).

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:07 a.m. CST

    great pics

    by Righteous Brother

    but I don't really want to know anything about the space jockey - that's one of the best things about Alien......the 'alieness' of it. You look at the Space Jockey and think, 'What the hell is that thing?'

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:08 a.m. CST

    Where's darth_kong and the other Prometheus guys?

    by flax

    Time to get analysing these images.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:12 a.m. CST

    The second image from the top looks like the Derelict Cockpit...

    by Darth_Kong

    I wonder if that inner circular section lowers down and the pilot's chair comes up from underneath or forms or something?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:13 a.m. CST

    Now those DEFINITELY have "Alien" DNA in them

    by AlienFanatic

    I agree with an article (I don't remember which one) that basically calls this an Alien sequel in all but name only. Everything there looks like it's right out of the Alien universe, down to the turntable the Space Jockey was sitting on in the original Alien. I hope it's not based on Alien Harvest, or at least that the draft got a MAJOR rewrite. I read it and lots of it simply wasn't very interesting. (Well written, sure, but not terribly interesting.) I look forward to the final product. It will almost certainly have the most incredible sci-fi visuals we've seen in decades.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:15 a.m. CST

    er...meant "prequel"

    by AlienFanatic

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:15 a.m. CST

    Ok so it's an Alien remake???

    by corplhicks

    haha. these images are very "Alien" like ! I do hope there is some originality in this.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:18 a.m. CST

    Space Jockey

    by IamZardoz

    I agree with the above comment about the "alienness" of the space jockey and I hope this movie doesnt go into the "Irving the Explainer" mode. To me the first half of the first Alien movie was the best of all of it, it really did seem alien to me. I wasnt so much into the monster chasing stuff. As an example, have you ever seen any other space movie where the ship approaching a planet has to make a "roll yaw" so it could orient itself to the horizon of a planet? Thats why I like Ridley Scott.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:18 a.m. CST

    There are TONS more pictures...

    by AlienFanatic

    DreadCentral had a source link that has waaaay more clips than they posted on their website. http://www.use.com/162b028d8fbacc707c6a#photo=1

  • They are just trying to temper expectations from more casual fans who would be pissed there wasn't a ton of xenomorph action right from the beginning. It's definitely the Alien prequel, those shots absolutely prove it. The creature engulfed in flame definitely looks very xenomorphic.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:20 a.m. CST

    Mystery

    by auraboy

    I hope they keep up the mystery. As said above, the reason Alien is far superior to other 'creature in the tunnels' slasher is that weird haunting vibe throughout the film - of not knowing what the hell these things really are. Space is always shown as this great western adventure land, when I saw Alien, it was the first time I got the impression that space was vast, cold and likely to be very fucking scary. Just the shot of the Nostromo closing in on these half-shadowed worlds in the middle of nowhere gives me the creeps to this day. As brilliant as the xenomorph and the hunt through the Nostromo is, the most haunting moment to me is when they leave the space jockey and the camera just holds on it's face in the darkness when the torches move on. That hold just leaves so many questions unanswered and that's what makes Alien genuinely haunting rather than just scary. So looking forward to this - just hope they can leave a few things in the dark. Nothing would spoil Alien more than a trite tied up backstory.

  • At the end of the movie?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:28 a.m. CST

    Wow

    by kwisatzhaderach

    Jon Favreau, JJ Abrams, Michael Bay etc. take note: this is how you make a proper movie. Can't wait.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:30 a.m. CST

    One other thought...a true sequel??

    by IamZardoz

    It is possible this is actually a sequel to the first Alien movie and all this chatter from Scott is disinformation. Forget everything after the first one, this one may even have egg morphing like in the horrifying deleted Dallas/Ripley scene. No Marines, no running cgi dino-aliens, just cold, silent, creepily terrifying space. I sure hope so.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:32 a.m. CST

    alienfanatic

    by kwisatzhaderach

    Thanks for the heads-up. VERY cool.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:38 a.m. CST

    Prequel/Sequel

    by auraboy

    The only downside if it's a prequel is the technology, hypersleep beds, suits etc all look a little more advanced for being set before. But then Alien is one of the few movies that holds up visually these days so it has less to worry about. If Ridley pulls this off it will be brilliant. I hope we'll get a few more moviemakers using less of the bright, overlit, CGI bollocks and focus on some seriously beautiful set building and well designed 'man-in-suit' aliens. CGI is great but c'mon put any CGI alien of the past 20 years up against the Alien Xenomorph and they all fucking lose. Just the shot of the alien turning back on Lambert and floating back to rip her apart - that's not only scary, it's a fucking painting to look at. Forget these grey hued, massive mouthed, weightless CGI beasts that bounce around the screens with a dust matte on to disguise the shit texture mapping. Get a weird shaped guy, stick him in a hand crafted suit and hang him from a ceiling. You know it will look better.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:38 a.m. CST

    It's all there...

    by Hugh G Rekshun

    Alien egg chamber...check Flamethrower...check Creepy Giger interior shots...check Screaming faces...check Space-Jockey platform...check Extreme antipation for this movie...double check

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:40 a.m. CST

    For whiners who want to keep up the mystery...

    by Hugh G Rekshun

    ...don't watch this movie...it's clearly not for you.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:41 a.m. CST

    Nostradamus?

    by thefirerises

    Second pic in the new batch looks almost like a replica of the Nostradamus... what the hell? Some of these shots just look too much like the original film. I guess that's nice and all, but honestly, I just don't think I need this. I've got the Alien blu for that, don't need another take that includes a Space Jockey origin and a bunch of different actors. Seriously, is it just me, or are the concepts at hand really jarring here - one moment its Space Jockey origin, next moment we're told its not too related to Alien, next moment its full-on Space Jockey/origin of man shit, now we're seeing something that not only resembles Alien, but looks like a complete re-shoot in some aspects. Ridley?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:42 a.m. CST

    @imzardoz re: alien morphing

    by AlienFanatic

    God I hope so! I love James Cameron movies, I really do, but the Queen concept really diluted the horror element of the Alien for me. It's one thing to have one, big alien laying tons of eggs and something else entirely for an Alien to have the ability to turn ANYONE into an egg. It's another angle into the "body horror" that was so lauded about the chest-burster sequence from the first film. I mean, if there's a queen and you kill it and all her eggs, you're done with an Alien infestation. But if Aliens can turn victims into eggs, then even one Warrior left alive can rebuild the entire colony. It's like a virus where even one microbe can start a contagion again, and that's terrifying. (In a way, it's as disturbing as the Thing in John Carpenter's original remake.) I'd love to see it revisited, very much. Honestly, though, I have my doubts as to if it would happen. The Alien canon has been so corrupted by the Queen and Alien/Predator hybrid crap from the AVP films that I think Scott would have a hard time reclaiming it. Much of the existing fanbase, who came onboard with Aliens, would be shouting, "Hey! Where's the Queen?!" I expect Scott to deal with fully-formed eggs, and not chestbursters or Warriors. I really doubt we'll see any actual "Aliens" in the movie.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:42 a.m. CST

    Can't wait for 2031!

    by buggerbugger

    The year when we finally get 'Prometheus: The Much Longer and Better Version the Director Wanted You to See in Cinemas Twenty Years Ago, But the Studio Excised 45 Minutes of Material in a Bid for More Showings Per Day'! In a big fucking plastic egg that glow in the dark. Pointlessly.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:49 a.m. CST

    alienfanatic

    by flax

    When you think about it, the deleted egg-morphing scene from Alien doesn't really contradict the Queen revelation in Aliens. There's no reason why the aliens shouldn't form a centralised hive society led by a Queen, but have the additional ability to morph other creatures into eggs in the event that a lone alien is stranded somewhere (which was the case in the first film). My only complaint is that combining the two reproductive methods in one canon is a little messy and lends a sort of cheesy 'they can do anything!' quality to the aliens, but if Ridley wants to include some egg-morphing goodness in Prometheus, that's no reason for him to excise James Cameron's contribution from continuity.

  • This looks AWWWWWSOME.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:52 a.m. CST

    flax - Egg-Morphing Queen Paradox

    by Darth_Kong

    Yeah I thought about that Egg-Morphing Queen Paradox too. I agree with you it could be a little messy but it's not near as bad as Jar Jar Binks was for me. It's something I could live with as a fan. A little to LOOSEY-GOOSEY but I could live with it.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:54 a.m. CST

    One thing I want to know: is H.R. Giger actually involved?

    by AlienFanatic

    Yes, the shots look very much like they have Giger's influence, but I've yet to find a definitive answer as to whether or not he was consulting on the film. As it stands, these look like his work, but there's also a certain lack of biomechanics that make me think it's an imitation of his work. Has anyone found any sources that say, for sure, that Giger's been working with the production team?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:58 a.m. CST

    Mind = Blown

    by Lucky13

    The only question now is to see it in 3D or 2D. The Scott/Giger/Alien universe is so dark and chilling... 2D will probably be the way to go with this one. I'm still a little worried that it will be lit too flatly to help the 3D, even though the pics so far have been pretty stunning (and contrasty) Can't godamn wait.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:59 a.m. CST

    As others noted above, way WAY more Alien-ish

    by Brian Hopper

    than I expected. Which is a potential big positive. If only Jerry Goldsmith was around to score it.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:06 a.m. CST

    Whoa

    by Larry Sellers

    The visual style and set production isn't pandering at all. LOOK AT THOSE SUITS. And the interiors! Classy, respectful...well it at least looks right. Let's have a trailer.

  • We had a good relationship with Giger for many years. We showed him the script for [Prometheus] and he liked it. He's going to work a bit for me with this movie and has been working on a major project that comes in the film.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:07 a.m. CST

    That was a quote from Ridley himself... (above)

    by Astronut

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:10 a.m. CST

    the big secret is

    by emeraldboy

    that they are working on two films. you dont take over seven sound stages just to make one film. Part one will be out next year. with part two to follow if the first one is successful. but part two will be the alien sequel.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:14 a.m. CST

    Those pics looks like BTS shots from one of the original movies...

    by kidicarus

    Which is a very good thing.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:15 a.m. CST

    @M6y Wonder who could pull off a good score?

    by AlienFanatic

    Right now, I don't see that Scott has chosen a composer. I'm not necessarily surprised, but I wonder who could do a good job without being too heavy? Other than the original score by Goldsmith and Horner's score for Aliens, the rest have been entirely forgettable. I did a quick search for "Goldsmith protege" and the one I came up with was Marco Beltrami. I can't say his work has stood out to me, though, and he's already engaged in writing for remake of The Thing. I have to wonder where they'll go with the score on this one. You'd need someone who's good with strings, if the work is subtle. I can't remember any Horner scores that are very subtle. His scores tend to be big and brassy (Avatar, Titanic, etc.) With Lindelof involved, I wonder if they'll look at Michael Giacchino? I thought most of ST 2009 was forgettable, though. The score is such a critical part of a movie like this I hope they get it right.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:15 a.m. CST

    FUCKING BRILLIANT

    by ryan

    Ridley, tear the shit out of filmmaking's asshole with this one PLEASE

  • Chris Farly in case your not picking up on it.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:20 a.m. CST

    @Merrick I think the title is perfect

    by AlienFanatic

    I still respect that Scott is trying to revive a franchise, or so it seems, and to do so he's leaving the baggage at the door. The Alien franchise has been so badly damaged by Alien 3, Resurrection, AVP, and AVP:R that I think it actually hurts the film to be identified with the franchise. If Scott wants to take a side path to tell his story, using only tangential references to the original film, I'm cool with it. Let's just hope the story is good, or all the visuals in the world won't save it.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:21 a.m. CST

    Alien Rising? Dear gods in heaven no!

    by Ciderman

    We so don't need people to turn away from this thinking they have to be in on the whole franchise to enjoy it, to think it's another one of the needless AvP movies, over stretching the mythology to the point that anyone aside from fanboys aren't interested. Prometheus Rising sounds too much like a John Grisham or Peter Benchley novel! Too right as well, that the shots could have been taken bts the original movie, bodes very very well. I wonder who is "dead meat"? The guy/gal who is to be toast first? Will it be the ethnic minority, ie The Irishman? Will they play a Romero and keep the african-american to the end, before he deepthroats a ovi-positor from a facehugger? Can't wait til next year!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:21 a.m. CST

    And yes, Merrick, I know you were teasing...

    by AlienFanatic

    ...but I'm sure that a lot of fans would prefer that they put "Alien" in the title somehow.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:22 a.m. CST

    ...or ALIEN: RISE OF THE XENOMORPH!!

    by Merrick

    Seriously, though. Love how this project seems to be shaping up. Fingers crossed...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:25 a.m. CST

    alienfanatic

    by Merrick

    1) Yes, I was completely teasing as you conjectured. 2) All things being equal, I agree - I'd rather *not* have ALIEN in the title this time around and think PROMETHEUS is a nice title.

  • Maybe AICN can 'borrow' that exclusive too.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:29 a.m. CST

    Yep.

    by Arkhaminmate001

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:30 a.m. CST

    Hope Scot has 1 more masterpiece in him - -

    by D

    cant wait!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:30 a.m. CST

    Definitely a chestburster in the film!

    by Wookie_Weed

    One of the screenshots shows a bioscanner -- "ABDOMINAL". That can only mean one thing. ;-) Or it could mean Charlize is pregnant. Stuff happens in space. Holy crap, I have GOOSEBUMPS, it looks perfect. Loved the original, loved Cameron's sequel... this is the third alien movie we've all been waiting for!! ;-)

  • Those screen shots - even though they are a tad blurry - look dope

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:36 a.m. CST

    Why do they call them chestbursters...

    by Wookie_Weed

    ... when they burst out of people's abdomens? I never got that.

  • Nolan is one of a select few in the new guard of filmmaking who can represent the legends of the past. At least that's how I see it.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:39 a.m. CST

    Hey wookie_weed, check again...

    by googamooga

    They've always burst forth from the chest, hence the name... I think you're just confused by the abdominal thing in that screenshot.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:41 a.m. CST

    So no shots of Naked Charlize Theron?

    by Jobacca

    'Cause that what I REALLY want to see....

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:43 a.m. CST

    re: soundtrack

    by IamZardoz

    The best one I've heard in a long time was the one for "Sunshine". Not sure who did it but it was great. Thats my vote Mr. Scott.

  • Unlike what good ol' George did when he made his prequels... silver, streamlined ships that looked like they never even belonged in the same universe as what we saw in the OT.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:45 a.m. CST

    I hate this kind of operation

    by Suskis

    This movie is going to EXPLAIN all the unknown things that made Alien so great. Today, everything must be explained, because the audience is so stupid that hints are not enough. MYSTERY is 90% of the 1st half of Alien. Scott, as Lucas, is simply going happily to destroy one of his masterpieces. I only pray he won't touch Blade Runner.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:45 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by Darth_Kong

    Yeah, I like how the PADDED WALLS are back.

  • To be honest, I want this film to contradict that. As much as i like Aliens, the inclusion of the Queen sucked the mystery out of the whole *what is this thing?* vibe.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:48 a.m. CST

    i like the look

    by smudgewhat

    hope it's great

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:48 a.m. CST

    Ok so based upon the big collection of pics

    by corplhicks

    Space suits==> they find a ship w eggs a little 5th Element like Chick is alien -human hybrid??? ala ripley overall, the entire collection of stills looks like an Alien remake good cast although Charlize Theron not sure of visuals and lighting and mood look great, very serious, somber and Alien like (I mean Alien 1 (I know there's no such thing)) MY guess is Prometheus is the ship's name And if this spoiler plot is true, then it is partially a rip off of the STTNG episode about ancient superbeings seeding our glaxay with DNA.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:50 a.m. CST

    This photo reminds me of the tunnels and lighting in LEGEND...

    by Darth_Kong

    http://www.use.com/162b028d8fbacc707c6a#photo=3

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:51 a.m. CST

    @suskis I have to disagree with those that want the mystery to remain

    by AlienFanatic

    Honestly, the SJ wasn't that mysterious to me. Yes, there's a question of whether or not it was a benevolent victim or a soldier carrying the eggs as a payload. But I wanted some reassurance that the end of LV427 wasn't the end of the species, and any prequel could establish that the Alien is far more widespread than we expect. I'm cool with it.

  • This is why i make an effort to guard myself from the usual geekasms this movie could give. To contain my enthusiasm.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:58 a.m. CST

    Don't fuck this up Scott.

    by Volllllume3

    Don't you dare fuck this up.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:02 a.m. CST

    Explain away

    by auraboy

    I don't think it's whining to hope this thing raises new questions without just explaining everything. I doubt it will just explain it all away actually. Yeah, I like the mystery, and I'm cool with that background being explored and taken in new directions, it'd just be nice if Ridley kept the whole vibe of 'things we can't understand' rather than having everything wrapped up neatly. I mean 'Alien' just means 'other' - as long as the SJ's don't start chatting and turn out to have human-like motives it will be pretty cool whichever way it goes. By the brief looks here, it suggests they're going with a lot more of the whole bio-mech Giger look for everything. And yeah, return of the padded walls and low ceilings! Love it! I remember the Alien making of where Scott cut 3 feet out of the sets so you'd always see the ceiling in shot to make everything claustrophobic. And the padded walls - well, they look cool. And make sense. Why wouldn't you pad your walls? Heh.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:06 a.m. CST

    Yes yes yes

    by jimmy_009

    Real sci-fi, REAL design.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:07 a.m. CST

    I AM STILL TRIPPING ON THE FACT THAT THE SPACE JOCKY IS AN ANUNAKI FOSSIL

    by the Green Gargantua

    Insane. I wonder if Scott leans towards this theory of how we came to be, Arthur C Clark certainly does.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:07 a.m. CST

    is Theron or Fassbender the android?

    by zom-bot.com

    they both seem very sterile. mayber Theron moreso. i wonder if this crew knows they have an android (such as, to pilot and run operations on things while the rest are in hypersleep)...and it's only after these events that Ash had to be snuck in and pretend to be human. The crew of the nostromo wasn't surprised about the existence of androids, but were surprised when ash turned out to be one. androids by then were already treated with disdain as if they had a history of being untrustworthy.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:07 a.m. CST

    AND THAT THE ANUNAKI CREATED THE ALIENS (and us)

    by the Green Gargantua

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:09 a.m. CST

    BAN-HAMMER

    by Darth_Kong

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:09 a.m. CST

    Alright, I'll start talking about Prometheus again.

    by Darth_Kong

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:09 a.m. CST

    What if this movie is a direct sequel to ALIEN?

    by AsimovLives

    What if this movie is made compeltly in image and tone and mood and style of ALIEN and not even bothering with anything that was brough in to the franchise with ALIENS and the other movies? What if this movie, instead of being a prequel, it's actually a sequel to the first movie and is placed in the time between ALIEN and ALIENS? Wouldn't that be something? I know that the geekry worships at the altar of ALIENS. But for me, a return to the way that the first ALIEN movie made and it's type of mood and slow-burn storyteling would be an extremely welcomed.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:09 a.m. CST

    PROMETHEUS does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    Oh yes! Practical FX , sets and costumes... Im in sci-fi geek heaven. At last a proper science fiction movie not some green screen CG shitfest. Ridley Scott... THE RETURN OF THE KING!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:12 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Asi, if you're looking for a fellow believer who places ALIEN above ALIENS then count me in. I'm not belittling Cameron's hugely entertaining movie but... the original remains in another class.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:15 a.m. CST

    cobra--kai & asimovlives

    by Merrick

    cobra--kai wrote: **Asi, if you're looking for a fellow believer who places ALIEN above ALIENS then count me in.** Me too.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:17 a.m. CST

    A L l E N > A L l E N S

    by Darth_Kong

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:17 a.m. CST

    OMG!!

    by MainMan2001

    These pictures look fucking sick. WOW. This movie is gonna be beyond epic and amazing. Scott is back baby

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:20 a.m. CST

    i'm thinking Theron is the android, and the thief

    by zom-bot.com

    that it's not mankind that fucks things up, but the android (who, looks pretty much like a science officer, to boot)- after all, she probably develops some biomechanoid empathy for this new lifeform, just like Ash did. in that way i hope the two films aren't so similar...but it would be cool if it's not directly a greedy man that fucks up the deal with the Jockeys, but an android (one of man's own creations in his image)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:22 a.m. CST

    A L I E N > BETTER THAN 95% OF ALL OTHER SCI-FI ON FILM

    by Astronut

    How can you deny it?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:25 a.m. CST

    shouldn't this have major spoiler tags?

    by zom-bot.com

    i mean, at least visually? maybe not because it's a soon to be released teaser. i don't know. hope the teaser is as quiet and eerie as the original one was cut. just flashes and shrieks and silence

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:32 a.m. CST

    Looks amazing!

    by Tug

    Even in these bad quality images this movie looks like it's going to kick hard-core sci-fi ass!

  • Right up until after the point where Kane is fired off (love that sound effect)... then it's mainly a monster hide-and-seek game. The ** REAL ** love I have for this film centers on the build-up.... the mystery.... the viber of pure fascination and fear.... I hope this new film gives us that same vibe. I also hope my love for the original — with its awesome air of mystery — is not diminished somehow after seeing this. Any of you guys feel this way? That somehow PROMETHEUS is going to diminish the impact of the orginal...?

  • Nothing will.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:39 a.m. CST

    Ridley Scott = Over-rated

    by SmokingRobot

    It's true. His misses far outnumber his hits. This could go either way.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:43 a.m. CST

    If they get Giacchino to score this i'll kill myself.

    by kwisatzhaderach

    Seriously. Hire somebody new, or get Elliot Goldenthal back, his Alien 3 score was INCREDIBLE.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:47 a.m. CST

    (Glances quickly at Ridley Scott's recent composers)

    by kwisatzhaderach

    I guess it'll be Hans Zimmer, Harry Gregson-Williams or Marc Streitenfeld. Some Lisa Gerard wailing might not be out of place on this one, like the Dead Can Dance cue that showed up at the end of The Mist. Streitenfeld's Robin Hood score was excellent too, if completely ignored for some reason.

  • remove all the space cult bullshit and you had the perfect blend of THING and ALIEN..and it was playable!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:49 a.m. CST

    smokingrobot

    by kwisatzhaderach

    Ridley Scott's misses are better than most other directors hits. 1492 for one is a neglected masterpiece, as is the Kingdom of Heaven Directors Cut.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:49 a.m. CST

    lucky13, you're right. Except - -

    by Astronut

    I just pretend those films never existed. Oh, and Alien 3.

  • I got a feeling.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:52 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by kwisatzhaderach

    The prequel ships are supposed to look different, they're from a completely different society to the outer rim worlds we saw in the original trilogy. Would a queen travel around in a ship that looked like the Millenium Falcon, "a piece of junk" as Luke himself said?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:57 a.m. CST

    Agreed, Astronut

    by Lucky13

    Though, to me, Alien3 has some redeeming value, even if it isn't near the level of Alien or Aliens. It's SOMETHING. Whereas everything that came after was campy, comic-book nonsense directed by jag-offs better suited for puff-daddy music videos.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, noon CST

    kwisatzhaderach, okay I see your point

    by Astronut

    ... but I'm still not a fan of the style he chose. The ships were just one of many disconnects in the prequels he made. They all added up to serious meh. When set pieces, vehicles, etc have a more real-world look to them, we as the audience buy into it more because we can relate to it more. Super glossy, CG-coated stuff takes a lot of the humanity out of a film. I will go to my grave a firm believer in that sentiment. Give me the Nostromo... give me the Millenium Falcon... over glitzy, shiny stuff any day.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:01 p.m. CST

    wOw, I'm seriously impressed.

    by david starling

    Is this a full-circle for Ridley? Sorry, forgive me, I really didn't expect it to look quite like that. I'm really quite excited now!!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:07 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    smokingrobot, below you'll see Ridley Scotts filmography. I count 5 'misses' myself but everyone has different taste - however if you're calling BLACK RAIN a miss then i'll hunt you down and cut off your pinky with a katana...! Prometheus (filming) 2010 Robin Hood 2008 Body of Lies 2007 American Gangster 2006 A Good Year 2005 Kingdom of Heaven 2003 Matchstick Men 2001 Black Hawk Down 2001 Hannibal 2000 Gladiator 1997 G.I. Jane 1996 White Squall 1992 1492: Conquest of Paradise 1991 Thelma & Louise 1989 Black Rain 1987 Someone to Watch Over Me 1985 Legend 1982 Blade Runner 1979 Alien 1977 The Duellists

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:08 p.m. CST

    Yaphet Kotto

    by the Green Gargantua

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:12 p.m. CST

    @alienfanatic I agree with

    by Brian Hopper

    your thoughts on the score. I hadn't thought about it, but you're exactly right: they need someone good with strings, and the brassy Horner would be all wrong. I could see Giacchino, depending on which Giacchino shows up. If it's the Giacchino of the pedestrian score for ST2009, then no! But if it's the Giacchino of the clever and on-point score for Incredibles, then maybe. I've always been fascinated by the tortured history of the Alien score... Goldsmith's dissatisfaction with Ridley Scott's tinkering with his cues and substituting Howard Hanson's piece at the end. Goldsmith even seemed vaguely dismissive of his own work in the film. But the fact is, I can't think of anyone who could match that score's combination of lush and vaguely sad melodic lines and spare, otherwordly creepiness. It's just perfect. Goldsmith was so inventive! On Prometheus, I wish one of these composers would get outside the box a bit like Goldsmith was able to in some of his best scores (including Alien, Apes, etc.)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:15 p.m. CST

    I was afraid of this ...

    by MattHooper

    I think Ridley obviously "gets" about half the reason why people loved that original film so much -- but he clearly doesn't intrinsically get the other half of why his own film was so successful. And that is very sad. I'm sure it will be a "good" movie, but I can tell by what I'm looking at, "great" went out the window. Looks far too much other spacey Sci-Fi films, some of which were Alien-like rip-offs. Nothing really new or original in these images. I see some Alien, some Event Horizon, some Supernova, some Red Planet, some Mission to Mars, some ... He clearly did not spend enough time designing this stuff, due to lack of inspiration. I guess if the Star Wars Prequels had been better, or Kubrick had been around to make another Science Fiction film, Ridley would have had better inspiration. Hope the story is more distinctive that the visuals.

  • I love the look of this film, BUT I must remind myself that Ridley's movies always look fantastic but are rarely good movies anymore. I always viewed him as an excellent visionary & cinematographer.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Scott's work

    by IamZardoz

    Ridley Scott directed two of the three best sci-fi movies ever (Alien, Blade Runner) with Kubrick directing the third. I enjoyed Aliens, Alien 3 and Resurrection but put them on the same level as stuff like Predator, Silent Running, Starship Troopers and the other very good sci-fi movies. All very good but nothing with the impact of the top three. Interesting that I agree exactly with the comment above the best of Alien is right up thru the point of shooting Kane's body out the garbage bay of the Nostromo. The best thing about Alien is the excellent "peek at the future" (like BR) with attention to detail combined with the absolute dread of finding that creepy bizarro derelict space ship and the Space Jockey. Ive got high hopes to be sure.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 12:37 p.m. CST

    You put Alien 3 and Resurrection on par with fucking Predator?

    by Lucky13

    Are you fuckin' daft, man???

  • Ridley will keep us guessing, but I bet the Jockey is released from the center of that platform to kick some of Theron's Yutani ass :)

  • Yes, we agree about the best happening up and through Kane's ejection. Love that you used the word dread, also. That was good. Perfect word. I've seen it and have bowed to its greatness more than 50 times since it came out in theaters. Maybe 60 times, hell I've lost count. But always, to me, Alien is two movies, not one. The first movie is the real thrill of adventure — the anticipation — the thrill of discovery. It is a journey into the unknown, a journey into fear itself. Fascination and dread are great words to describe everything that takes place up through Kane's space funeral. Then there is the second, less fascinating movie: the hide-and-seek monster movie. I do not imply that this part of the film is poor, not by any means, but after being nearly swept up in a whirlwind of shock and awe and fascination at LV-426 and the events leading to that... well... I would have to say the run-from-the-monster part of the film just cannot hope to come close in matching it. It's like having the best cut of filet mignon. After that, everything else is second best. IMO.

  • YEA!!!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1 p.m. CST

    @ Matthooper - So what you're saying is...

    by BradM73

    So you're saying Scott is ripping off movies that ripped off his original Alien movie??

  • This would be a total geekgasm moment :)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:09 p.m. CST

    Alien is not sci-fi

    by Shaner Jedi

    More like a horror film set in space. Still great though.

  • Bone crunching, goo-packed horror. R-rating pls Mr. Fox.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:15 p.m. CST

    Queen Vrs Egg-Morphing

    by Sam Eaton

    I don't see why there can't be a queen and individual egg production. We're talking about an alien life form right? Why wouldn't they be able to reproduce individually as well as have specialized casts such as a queen? Even honey-bees which have a queen can reproduce individually if the queen dies (Yes, they can't produce other females only male drones). If we are talking about a truly alien life form why limit it to an existing terrestrial model? For all we know there are 12 sexes with 3 modes of reproduction. We're talking science fiction here.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:16 p.m. CST

    This is so fucking great. To finally wrap up the story arc.

    by UltraTron

    The original captures confronting the total unknown like no other movie ever made. Ever. And since the story has gone absolutely nowhere in subsequent sequels this is exactly where it should have gone in part 3 just like I always said. This is the story of how the fuck mother knows all about the aliens.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:23 p.m. CST

    @ Matthooper (& Bradm73)

    by AlienFanatic

    I'm with Brad on this one. Event Horizon, Pandorum, Supernova, and Red Planet were all visual riffs on Scott and Giger's original Alien designs. The problem is that all of those other films fell apart (BADLY) in the second act, whereas Alien held together pretty nicely, but mainly because a) audiences hadn't seen a fourth act before b) the adult Alien design was so superb and c) because all of the other films had absolutely shitty ideas to close out the film. (I find Event Horizon easily the most disappointing, mainly because I liked a lot of the cast.) Scott can definitely screw this one up if the first act is creepy but the second act doesn't follow suit. The biggest danger is the 'been there done that' problem if he goes heavy on the Alien references. We've seen the Alien life cycle explained to death. There's little he could do with a chestburster that's new. (Though I'm always willing to believe that a great director can still surprise us.) Let's all hope Ridley has his act together. The last movie of his that I really loved was Gladiator, back in 2000. You can argue that it's not all that, but at the time it was one of the freshest ideas on film. T epic battle at the beginning, with the huge flight of arrows and the pitch-perfect score, still give me goosebumps every time I watch it. If Prometheus doesn't do it for me, well I'm ready to call myself eternally jaded and give up going to the theater. I'm no longer the young buck that can just watch any crap film and be happy, and it seems that 90% of the stuff coming out from everyone else is shit on celluloid. I'm hoping that an old dog still has a few new tricks in him.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:31 p.m. CST

    Is Ron Cobb the production designer?

    by v3d

    Because that second picture looks very much like his designs for ALIEN.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:40 p.m. CST

    Atmosphere

    by fitzcarraldo2

    Digging all the Alien love here. Yeah, Scott established an amazing atmosphere before the action starts, the fly-on-the-wall documentary style filming of the crew eating and talking over each other. And the sheer coldness and bleakness of the universe, they are so far from home and completely alone. When Lambert tries to contact Antarctica traffic control and the signal just radiates away into the vast, uncaring cosmos, thousands of light years from anywhere. Ash's flat "I've never seen anything like it" at the shockingly different alien spacecraft they glimpse through the storm. Just amazing, no-one has done anything like it before or since. Scott had real subtlety back then and dared to take his time to build atmosphere and flesh out characters.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:43 p.m. CST

    @ V3D re: Ron Cobb

    by AlienFanatic

    I was wondering the same thing. At this point, I don't think so. Ron's not listed on the art department staff for the film. The key names I'm seeing are: Julian Caldow (concept illustrator) http://www.krop.com/juliancaldow/ He looks like a creature/environment guy David Vyle Levy (senior concept artist) http://www.vyle-art.com/ He seems to be focused on vehicles and possibly costumes Ivan Weightman (conceptual artist) http://web.me.com/iweightman/Ivan_Weightman_-_Concept_Art_%26_Art_Direction/Ivan_Weightman_concept_art_%26_art_direction_.html Seems like a junior draughtsman whose background is in vehicular design and rapid prototyping. Looks like Prometheus is his first film, but he's also working on Dredd. Karen Wakefield is the senior art director, though I'm not sure that means anything. Dan O'Bannon was, effectively, the art director for Alien, but Giger, Scott, and Cobb pretty much designed the look of the film.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:44 p.m. CST

    RISE OF FEET...?...

    by RowKseat25

    How the hell have you determined that is a classic Alien in that flame? Do tell?... you are tripping... but from seeing these pics your imagination span out... not that there's that much imagination needed... I guess it's all pointing towards a total Alien Universe movie... and all the red herring shite before is just that. Happy it is Ridley's (not forgetting Giger's) Universe and not some other. Just hope it's a lot better than Robin Hood and the baseball cap covering bald-paleted Director still has it in him... this is his chance to blow memories of AVP's away... don't fail us Ridley.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:45 p.m. CST

    cobra-kai and astronut

    by ewokstew

    You say ALIEN > ALIENS...I say you are both my new heroes and know what the f*** is up. I have a friend who's 16 years younger than me and thinks the first AVP is better than ALIEN. Seriously. I think this is one of the untold signs of the Apocalypse.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:47 p.m. CST

    Anyone else noted?...

    by RowKseat25

    That white ceiling interior is same as original Nostromo? Maybe the 'prequel' is all red herring too?... I don't wana see any more, I'm sold, will just await movie...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:47 p.m. CST

    Oh and Steven Messing...

    by AlienFanatic

    but he's listed in almost every film as a digital matte painter, so he's likely going to be the one implementing designs that have been roughed in by the conceptual artists. He's probably painting a lot of the digital terrain, much like the jungles in Avatar and Pirates.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:51 p.m. CST

    Who the hell says Aliens is better then Alien?

    by Lucky13

    I didn't realize it was so noble to say Alien is better. Throw my name on that list too.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 1:58 p.m. CST

    EMERALDBOY...

    by RowKseat25

    Yes that's what I'm guessing... prequel n' sequel... who needs seven sets in today's cgi movie world!... hoping this'll be Ridley's swansong... as his previous movies since Gladiator didn't cut the mu-tard.

  • There has never been anything like it before or since. No question. So real. So believable. So fascinating. I hope he gets it right once again.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:08 p.m. CST

    Fuck me thats good stuff.

    by Keith Maniac

    They're just pictures, but if the film can deliver on the promise those pictures are making, then next Summer cant come quick enough. Its got to be an 'R' though.

  • Kids of today: Hi! I have ADD and I need continuous action and destruction in a film or it's no good! I am proud to say I think I have trained my 13 and 16 year-old sons well. They both laughed walking out of Transformers 2 and one of them said - wow, all style and no substance... big fail...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:10 p.m. CST

    Don't count on it, rowkseat

    by Lucky13

    He's already said he'll be shooting everything in 3D after Prometheus. That insinuates more films. Plus, Kingdom of Heaven and Body of Lies were both solid films. Hell, even Matchstick Men was decent, IIRC. I'll take Ridley's worst before 90% of other director's best shots.

  • He's such a visual guy and he did a masterful job storyboarding the original film. I was wondering if anyone has heard whether he may have done this or not for PROMETHEUS... anyone?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:14 p.m. CST

    Love love love the production design.

    by tradeskilz

    I always worshiped the look of the original Alien movie. The practical lived-in quality of the ship interior. The suits, the gadgets all looked like they were real objects with real functions. The "truckers in space" feel of the blue collar workers on the ship also hit every mark. That is how i envision space travel will actually be like. A couple of academic officer types and the rest of the crew will be regular working men. So far this is looking like it's hitting every high note. Beautiful.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:21 p.m. CST

    Astronut

    by Lucky13

    I think that lovely soul (/sarcasm) Lindelof said that even while he was writing the script, Ridley was having meetings with him, drawing storyboards on napkins, telling him exactly how everything should go... So if I were a betting man, I'd bet on Ridley doing the full-out storyboards himself as well.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:24 p.m. CST

    Great feeling when seeing these pics...

    by Polo Chavez

    ...as though an old friend came back from vacation/training/resting, to beat the shit out of the vile tormentors who fuck with art and taste. I just hope to God that something else (Scott Pilgrim, etc.) that attracts the flies to shit opens at the same time, and takes away from the box office this movie will deserve.

  • the hell - ? I don't get it. ne minute you are praising Ridley. The next minute you say you hope his films' box office is hurt by some other dumb film...? wha

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Ridley scored a homerun with Alien

    by mcgoocain

    It is clearly one of the best outer space science fiction adventure stories ever filmed. I am an expert on such things. It is in the top five best outer space films of all time. I clearly welcome a return to Ridley's vision of outer space, and hope the story is thought provoking this time out, as thought provoking as Alien was eye-candy stimulating and at least twice as exciting. This has me more excited than anything else coming down the pike - and from the stills, it holds much promise of greatness. I hope for the same kind of old-fashioned storytelling that made Alien such a delight.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:48 p.m. CST

    Here's an idea, if you don't like 3-D watch it in 2-D?

    by ganymede3010

    I can't understand why people who don't like 3-D try to force their disdain for it on to others. Every Theater has a 2-D version along with 3-D. You're paying cheaper ticket prices, smaller crowds; so what's there to be so angry about? Maybe it's just me, whenever I'm watching a 2-D movie that has a 3-D version, I can't notice a significant difference in picture quality. So again why do you people care if there's a 3-D version for people like me who like 3-D movies?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:52 p.m. CST

    Please, Aliens destroy's Alien..

    by ganymede3010

    Better performances, better action, more Aliens, plus Bill Paxton's character > every single one in the entire series.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 2:52 p.m. CST

    Original Alien - the alien

    by IamZardoz

    Ive already said why I like the first half over the rest but there are still some great things in the second half. Ever notice you never, ever get a good look at the alien? The best view of him is when he is hanging out the ass of the shuttle trying to sneak back in thru the engine exhaust. Until that time you see most of him getting Lambert but other than that just quick cuts and head shots. How about when Dallas turns around in the tunnel and ...there he is!! Ripley in her skivvies! How about the uniforms? I always wondered if they were wearing original Keapa basketball shoes, very cool. Anyway, enough posting for me for a while.

  • If I didn't know better, I'd believe that these were shots from some lost late-70s sci-fi film. It's a great vibe, and I like it. I hope this film doesn't emphasize it's prequel-ness. That is, I hope it doesn't do all it can to explain everything about the origins of the Aliens and Space Jockey. I want a mostly standalone sci-fi story with this kind of vibe, not a tiresome, we-know-how-it-ends backstory that will inevitably be disappointing and less interesting than the half-formed stories everyone concocts when seeing UNexplained creativity on screen. I think we're starting to realize just how damaging sequel/prequel-itis has become to telling a decent, self-contained story anymore, and how it ruins any feeling of mystery about a film. Now everything has to be kept open-ended at both ends. I don't know how Ridley Scott solves this conundrum, but I hope he does. A new film that's as wonderful visually as Alien was, which does nothing but shine light into all the dark corners, would be a negative contribution to cinema.

  • because you said so many things I agree with... the alien-ness of the original film, the roll yaw/planet entry... etc... awesome, man.

  • So true.

  • Love the concept so far! Looks like Ridley is going for continuity so Prometheus will seamlessly blend into ALIEN. Looks so good already. After all the Alien VS Predator crap, sure feels good to have Ridley at the helm for another quality ALIEN film.

  • Okay, attention whore?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:26 p.m. CST

    Just occurred to me. This can only go one of two ways.

    by Astronut

    I am applying this primarily to all super-fans of the original ALIEN. We have here a case of the original Master returning to his beloved creation. Either this is gonna be a monumental home run worthy of residing on the same shelf as the first film. Or it will be a very big, very painful missed opportunity.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:27 p.m. CST

    @fitzcarraldo2 Well said. Alien is practically

    by Brian Hopper

    a textbook in how to use production design, sets, costumes, cinematography, fx, etc. to achieve a desired atmosphere. Even though I know Alien by heart, turning the lights down and watching it still gives me chills. These little existential echoes that pop up throughout the film are the result of true film artistry at work. There are so many examples, like the sound of Ripley's voice saying "Calling Antarctica traffic control" as we look at the outside of the Nostromo, Kane's burial, etc. The sense of coldness and aloneness the film creates is almost without parallel in films. And while we're genuflecting before the Alien altar, I always like to mention the film's amazing script, with its seven carefully drawn characters, heroic-yet-human touches, fine-tuned depiction of power dynamics, confident use of genre conventions (SF and horror), and incredibly nuanced socioeconomic, gender, philosophical, and psychosexual underpinnings. A model of economy. Just terrific.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:32 p.m. CST

    So do I get my Christmas Wish List or what?

    by Darth_Kong

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:35 p.m. CST

    hey executor. shut the fuck up.

    by Astronut

    darth_kong is my homie.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:39 p.m. CST

    Looks purty...

    by ObiBen

    ...it reall does...Consider my curiosoté piquée.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:44 p.m. CST

    ganymede 3010 - Better performances in Aliens

    by ObiBen

    If by "better" you mean "now with 50% more ham" then yes, you are correct. Anyone pushing a button or lighting a smoke in the first one gives a better performance than anything seen in the second one (don't get me wrong, I do like Aliens and the performances are quite decent....mostly.)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:46 p.m. CST

    tellyhatesperverts

    by flax

    I agree that the inclusion of an Alien Queen in the mythos was a somewhat regrettable decision, but at this point, for Ridley Scott to trash James Cameron's film solely to inject a little mystery back into the first one would be a crime. The Alien series contains one of the greatest horror films ever made, and one of the greatest action films ever made, joined perfectly together in a sublime duology. They're such an amazing and unique combination that I'm fully willing to overlook the little ways in which they undermine each other, if you see what I mean. Retconning one of those great films out of continuity would be a disaster.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:50 p.m. CST

    Haha -- Obiben

    by Lucky13

    "...Mostly" --- Well crafted, sir.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 3:51 p.m. CST

    iamzardoz - Good look at the Alien

    by ObiBen

    No, but we got super closeups of it's wet, dripping telescopic fangs, accompanied by that dentist suction tube sound, and that was more than enough to get the fear going. Sadly the creature got de-balled in the sequels....

  • OMG THIS IS SO TRUE. In ALIENS the actors do well and there are some shining moments but the level of acting varies from good to cringe-worthy. Even more obvious, the dialog is continuously over-the-top ie; Bill Paxton's character and his constant use of the word 'man.' Mot of the acting is heavy handed and ham fisted at times. In A L I E N we are treated to near perfection in filmmaking realism. It's genuine. It looks as if we are voyuers, watching these people interact and behave as real people would in real life. Because of the amazing, talented actors. Almost nothing is over-the-top. The lines are delivered in a totally convincing manner with very few exceptions.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4 p.m. CST

    '' They're dead, alright? Can I go now? '' <-- cringe

    by Astronut

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:04 p.m. CST

    Atmosphere

    by fitzcarraldo2

    This is why I wish Scott would leave this alone. Alien isn't one of the best SF films ever made, it's one of the best films ever made. It's a masterpiece. Making a sequel/prequel will pretty certainly retrospectively dispel some of the awe and wonder of the first film. So even though this does look exciting I still sort of wish Scott would leave this alone. He's not the film-maker he was 30 years ago, he doesn't have the restraint and sublety any more. Leave it alone Ridley, do The Forever War instead.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:05 p.m. CST

    According to this article, Fassbender is the Android

    by LetTheWookieWin

    Take it with however many grains of salt you want http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/blogs/heat-vision/michael-fassbender-star-opposite-noomi-76403

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:10 p.m. CST

    Auraboy

    by Keith

    "CGI is great but c'mon put any CGI alien of the past 20 years up against the Alien Xenomorph and they all fucking lose. Just the shot of the alien turning back on Lambert and floating back to rip her apart - that's not only scary, it's a fucking painting to look at." Agree 100%.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:11 p.m. CST

    Gotta 100% disagree w/Fitz

    by Kremzeek

    When I saw these, I thought... Holy shit, he actually did it! He completely captured the atmosphere, look, feel, and vibe of the original Alien movie. Hell, it even looks like they could've filmed this in the late '70s what with all the bubbled helmets, etc. I love all things 60s and 70s. It's the time period I feel I should've lived in as an adult. I never thought anything other than Dazed & Confused or Virgin Suicides could capture the 70s feel without actually being filmed in the 70s. I esp. never thought Scott could give a prequel the same vibe, but it looks like he DID. And if I can get that impression just from some crappy stillshots, that's saying something. So pumped up for this film. Please, Mr. Scott, please, for the love of all that's holy, deliver the goods!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:13 p.m. CST

    My dick is hard for this shit

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    No other film matters until I've seen this. I'll probably die afterwards, because Alien is where it all started for me.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:17 p.m. CST

    Re: fitzcarraldo2

    by SK229

    Yes, exactly. One of the best FILMS ever made. The more I see it, the more I bow at its Giger-designed alter. I also agree with the poster who mentioned that eerie shot after they pass through the SJ's chamber. Just holding on its face with a slow zoom in (I'm pretty sure it's a zoom, totally different Kubrickian effect)... it really reminded me of something from The Exorcist. I'm pretty excited for this, though... even just from a design perspective, I'd rather see new variations on these designs from the master and his design team themselves than to see the 5,000 watered down copycat. Design in movies has been extremely bad and unoriginal for many years now. You look at the sheer amount of incredible design work in movies like Star Wars, Alien, Blade Runner, Raiders, etc. and then look at the shit we get now, totally unmemorable and unpleasing to the eye... fucking terrible. But the OT really just hit nothing but home runs with ship and interior design... Slave 1, the Death Star, the Falcon, Mos Eisley, Hammerhead and a few of the other cantina aliens, Boba Fett, R2 and Threepio, Cloud City... hell, even seemingly insignificant things like Lando's or Han or Leia's evolving costumes just always FEEL right... They just don't make 'em like they used to, I guess.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:20 p.m. CST

    Release Date

    by warren bishop

    When is this bad boy supposed to be released? It looks like they've finished principal photography - then 4-6 months of post-production maybe. Is it supposed to be released Christmas 2011? Summer 2012? Anyone hear anything about that?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:21 p.m. CST

    ALIEN above ALIENS

    by Keith

    I suspect that the older you get, the more likely you are to come around to this point of view. Aged sixteen, I would have laughed at that idea. I mean, ALIENS just kicks so much ass! I thought of ALIEN sort of like a prequel to Cameron's movie. But ten years later, having watched both movies dozens of times, it was "Alien" that satisfied more than "Aliens". "Aliens"...y'know, I love it, but it doesn't have the extra brilliance that keeps me coming back to "Alien". It's somewhat more mechanical in its plotting, which I find makes rewatches a little more wearying. I don't find new things in it, and retreading the path provides diminishing thrills "Alien" is more about atmosphere and ambience. Even before the rollercoaster begins with the chestburster - or indeed even the facehugger - the slow ride up the chain pull is mesmerising. The sets are just gorgeous, and - crucially - all the actors are first rate. I mean, "Aliens" has Biehn and Paxton supporting Weaver, and they're both cool, but there are many journeymen in that cast, and even though all of them are perfectly competent, the extra quality of Alien's entire cast does make a difference. Fifteen years on from that, there's no question in my mind that Alien is the superior movie. Which is NOT to knock Aliens. I still love the shit out of that movie. But Alien is just sublimely brilliant.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:22 p.m. CST

    Misread Fitz's post...

    by Kremzeek

    Thought you were saying there's no way this film will work. I see now that you're being cautiously optimistic for the most part. I share your worries, and I HATE prequels. Star Wars being the prime example, but that whole thing was horribly executed. And all we've really seen since is more prequels that fuck everything else up. So, initially, I didn't want this film to happen. But man, oh man... this is looking better and better with each new update. And I gotta say, it's so great to actually be excited about a film because it looks GOOD. From my PoV, that's a rare thing these days. I'd say, for me, only about 1 of every 50 movies (including indy, etc) look like they'd have any competent storytelling talent or atmosphere. No one knows how to guide you thru a story anymore. Is there any guarantee Prometheus won't suck? No, of course not. But damn it feels good to see stills from a film and my first thought isn't "Well, this looks like another horribly well done film". I've stopped seeing movies in the theatre for the most part, but this one I'll be buying a ticket.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:23 p.m. CST

    In the pipe 5 by 5

    by tradeskilz

    Oh yeah

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:24 p.m. CST

    Oh, wait, that makes me 41

    by Keith

    Boring conversation anyway...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:25 p.m. CST

    I second that, misterdarcy

    by Kremzeek

    Alien just has so much... well, it's badass. I can't say anything that hasn't already been said about it. I love Alien 1-3 (director's cut is sweet on 3 I think). After that, I have no interest. But Prometheus? Damn. Can't wait.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:26 p.m. CST

    Why does it have to be one movie over the other?

    by googamooga

    I love Alien AND Aliens for different reasons.

  • Check it out. http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=39765.msg1165507#msg1165507

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:27 p.m. CST

    Mental, not all his films

    by white_vader

    There's an amazing concept/board artist named Sylvain Despretz that boards for him sometimes. But yes, Ridley's "Ridleygrams" are fantastic.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:31 p.m. CST

    *looks like another horribly done film*

    by Kremzeek

    eeedddddiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitttttt Grr.

  • Very different types of films, but both executed in about the best and most flawless ways possible with their respective categories. Either one would be a remarkable achievement on its own, but how many times has a film and its sequel, with different creative teams and very different types of stories, achieved such remarkable results in different ways? "Better" between the two is subjective. "Fantastic", for both of them, is essentially inarguable.

  • Ouch.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:36 p.m. CST

    And the "no greenscreen" is a bit deceptive

    by white_vader

    Typical that fanboys latch onto that (the same way they think greenscreen is somehow different and worse than bluescreen in the old days). Moronic. And conveniently forget he talked about using cg but on big cycloramas/screens to get some live interactive lighting. Basically they're just taking the compositing stage out if the progress, and this is all a fancy term for essentially rear projection (I guess there won't be a lot of parallax or they could possibly sync the angle being displayed to the camera live?). You guys should learn something before you open your big mouths. The two-film rumour is nothing new either. And I think 7 stages have been taken up for single films. I'd have to look it up but maybe even the old Star Wars films might have done that.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:40 p.m. CST

    Astronut - Realism

    by ObiBen

    Exactly! The first half of the movie felt like an unscripted documentary on real space truckers. If that level of realism wasn't achieved, the film would never have turned into the classic it became.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:41 p.m. CST

    It's cool to bash ALIENS now?

    by phifty2

    Prefer one over the other, I don't care but where is all this ALIENS hate coming from like it's some half assed shoddy sequel that only upped the action but took away the mystery, horrror and dread? ALIENS is dripping with that hopeless "We're fucked. We're all going to die no matter how much training or weapons we have," vibe. Just because it has action(which takes up about 20 minutes of it's 2 hour 40 minute run time in the DC) in no way negates the threat, hostility, doom and feeling that you're dealing with an amoral killing machine who is totally beyond reasoning with. They kill to live and for no other reason. I'm getting off topic but I get as much and more out of ALIENS. Love ALIEN. Love it! But find more in the sequel and think it, like ESB, is a perfect follow up that outshines the original.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:42 p.m. CST

    iamzardoz: no, you're not, fuckhead!

    by Zardoz

    Why does everyone try and copy my name for this site? I've had it for 12 fucking years, now! There's a reason you couldn't register as "Zardoz", you hack! It's my name, not yours! This happens all the fucking time! Be original, cocksuckers: Get your own name! Jeez!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:42 p.m. CST

    Lucky 13

    by Plathismo

    It isn't just noble to proclaim Alien's superiority--it's a fact. Aliens is one of the best sequels ever made, but superior to Alien it is not. But of course not everyone agrees (my own wife included). Aliens actually borrows a lot more than just the creature and basic mise-en-scene from the original. The third act is entirely copied from Alien, almost beat-for-beat. Just substitute "Newt" for "Cat" and "Atmosphere Processor" for "Nostromo." Double-ending--check. Blasting the baddie into space--check. I guess it's a testimonial to the brilliance of the original, and Cameron's skill as a director, that the same climax works again the second time around.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 4:53 p.m. CST

    plathismo - You commited a cardinal sin...

    by ObiBen

    Prepare to face the wrath and brimstone of the Aliens-better-than-the-Original brethren: Never, ever, come up with Newt as a "surrogate for the cat". Even if the director himself acknowledged this in these exact words. That really put their panties in a ginormous bunch.

  • other than that, freaking LOVE Aliens!!! They're screening it again this fall at a local theater. Saw it there before a couple fo years ago and it was PACKED! Just shows how well that movie holds up. Same with the original Alien, never gets old.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 5:07 p.m. CST

    Oh, I fully agree, Plathismo

    by Lucky13

    I was merely pointing out that I was surprised that so many people were bonding over their shared opinion of Alien being the superior film. I mean... It's like walking outside on a sunny day and saying to your neighbor, "Hey Ed --- the sky, it's fuckin' blue!!!" Ed looks skyward, ponders for a moment and says, "George, you glorious bastard... you're right!" Don't get me wrong, Aliens is great... phenomenal even. But Alien... is fucking A L I E N.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 5:13 p.m. CST

    It looks too much like Alien

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 5:44 p.m. CST

    phifty2

    by ewokstew

    I don't think anyone is really bashing on ALIENS. Like any movie, including ALIEN, there's always something big or small that a person can find to crit if they want. I don't think anyone in their right frame of mind can say ALIENS is a bad film. I think it's just as the years go on ALIENS is aging quicker than ALIEN. That's attributed to at least a couple of things: the film stock Cameron used (grainier than what Scott used on ALIEN, but I heard it was cleaned up nicely on Blu-ray) and Burke's 80's hairstyle and that upturned collar on his jacket. Now, the bulky CRT's in ALIEN don't help it in that respect either, but...ALIENS has that problem as well. The bottom line is both movies are awesome and thank goodness we had Cameron as a follow up to Scott.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 5:47 p.m. CST

    plus feel good that

    by ewokstew

    At least ALIEN - ALIENS people don't have that level of hate that Star Wars original and pre-q uel folks have between them. That's a blood feud right there...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 5:58 p.m. CST

    I'D BE EXCITED IF THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ALIEN!!!FACT!!!

    by CreepyThinMan

  • via the chest-burst Giant Sentient Lifeform in the original Alien, and perhaps that starship, which may be a collective genetic ark seeding worlds with new life. Here's the kicker...after the unfateful demise of the exploration crew in Prometheus, the Nostromo would be re-directed to the crashed site of the starship to investigate. Rest is cinematic history. Well, that's my two cents. Or it's a trap.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 6:09 p.m. CST

    cobra--kai and merrick

    by AsimovLives

    It's great to know i'm not the only one who rates ALIEN above ALIENS. And as cobra--kai, that is not to disparage the rather excelent ALIENS. But it's so good to know others think like me. Thanks a lot, guys. So cool.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 6:13 p.m. CST

    Whenever i watch ALIEN i feel like i'm in movie nirvana.

    by AsimovLives

    Everything single thing in that movie works. No matter how small or aparently insignificant, everything in that movie works. It's beautiful. If Prometheus is half as good as ALIEN, it will be one of the best movies of next year, regardless of genre. And i also vote for the notion of the android being the hero of the movie. Just becasue it's an artificial person doesn't mean it's not a person worth rooting for and be the hero. In fact, androids can be the perfect heroes. They might not be affraid, but they aren't stupid either, as Bishop so well said.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 6:16 p.m. CST

    velvet_sloane

    by AsimovLives

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 6:41 p.m. CST

    Space Jockey Platform above the same as in Alien.

    by DarthRazor

    I don't know if anyone has made this observation yet, but the shot of the circular platform above the flame thrower shot is almost exactly the same as the Space Jockey Platform in the attache video at 1:21-1:29, just without The Jockey and his cannon/gun. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_WJLptNNE

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:01 p.m. CST

    No hate for Aliens here

    by Keith

    It's arguably the greatest FRANCHISE movie of all time. It makes you want to go out and buy models, video games and comics set in the universe it suggests (something not really true of the original). When you think about it, Cameron pulled off something pretty amazing by creating a sequel to "Alien" in which the aliens themselves weren't actually the star. Rather, the colonial marines were. Throw in the queen and the power loader and you have a shit-tonne of awesomeness. But I still think that Alien is the better movie qua movie.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:05 p.m. CST

    Aliens > Alien

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    Alien doesn't have Bill Paxton.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:07 p.m. CST

    On the subject of Alien's greatness

    by Keith

    Is the theatrical trailer for "Alien" the best trailer ever made? It has to be a contender. I invite suggestions for the five best trailers ever made. Don't even have to be for five great movies. (I mean, I think the trailer for "Watchmen" is awesome, even if the movie was only so-so imo.)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:18 p.m. CST

    I recently bought a plush chestburster and plush facehugger

    by sweeneydave

    as the first two stuffed animals of my little boy who will be born next week. My wife is being induced and it's very exciting. The stuffed animals are both actual sized. Although the wife won't allow the facehugger out of the closet (it activates her spider phobia), she's compromised with the chestburster. Currently, it's on top of the dresser, wrapped around the puppy dog lamp (with it's adorable little tiny arms and the extra plush mouth within a mouth).

  • love the return to the design aesthetic

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:19 p.m. CST

    Alien = Horror / Movie Aliens = Action Movie...both brilliant

    by quantize

    always been this way

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:28 p.m. CST

    SweeneyDave

    by Lucky13

    Very cool! But on second thought, have you given consideration that you could be inadvertently ruining your child's chance to be frightened upon his initial viewing of Alien? He'll grow up thinking they're cute, cuddly, little friends and will probably be like 'ahhh, how cute!' when the first face-hugger jumps on poor Mr Hurt. Then again, maybe he'll be ultra-terrified when the once cuddly chestburster makes a bloody mess of ol' John later on. Tough call.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:45 p.m. CST

    Alien v Aliens...

    by huskerdu2

    Alien is a masterpiece of mood and atmosphere made by a film maker walking in the shoes of people like Kubrick. Aliens, by way of contrast, is a fantastically well made (and HUGELY entertaining) movie by a guy who is - to a greater or lesser extent - walking in the shoes of people like Ray Harryhausen. Both come from very different places, but both are terrific examples of what their relative directors do better than anyone. I'll say this as well...Cameron obviously acknowledges Scott's film as a masterpiece, but Scott also acknowledges the Cameron film as being great. Don't be surprised if Prometheus doesn't echo elements of both Alien and Aliens (the terraforming link being an obvious one).

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:47 p.m. CST

    Look great till i remember it's PG-13

    by johnnyg korrupt

    Honestly, how the hell is this meant to be pg 13

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:52 p.m. CST

    Another vote for Alien and Aliens being separate, but equal

    by AlienFanatic

    Taken as an "Alien" movie, I'd have to say I still prefer Alien to Aliens. When I was younger, it was the reverse, but as I've grown older I appreciate the realism, tension, and sheer craftsmanship of the first film more and more. HOWEVER ALIEN and ALIENS are two entirely different films. Alien is a horror movie. Aliens is an action movie. Period. End of story. To compare them directly is foolhardy and misses the point. Both films can exist side by side with almost no overlap. I love the realistic, human characters in Alien and I also love the over-the-top, stereotypical, cigar-chomping badasses of Aliens. Let's stop debating it and just say that we all enjoyed both films. Alien 3 was a missed opportunity (with a bogus brushoff for Newt and Hicks). Alien: Resurrection was a horrid mistake made bearable only because of Sigourney and Ron Perlman. And both AVP films were simply cinematic abortions. K?

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 7:59 p.m. CST

    @misterdarcy Yup, the Alien trailer

    by Brian Hopper

    is certainly on the list of five best trailers ever. I've always thought that. To this day, I remember seeing it as a teenager and people in the audience being transfixed by it. One of the many things I love about the trailer is that it is HONEST as to the theme, tone and content of the film... it conveys both the quiet-creepy-eerie aspect of Alien as well as the sheer-terror aspect. Also, sometimes a trailer can be good but you doubt the movie's quality. With Alien, you knew — you KNEW — this movie is ABSOLUTELY in the killzone. Never ever had a doubt that it would be awesome, and it was. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEVY_lonKf4

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:02 p.m. CST

    Re Alien trailer: And ironically,

    by Brian Hopper

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:04 p.m. CST

    Re Alien trailer: And ironically,

    by Brian Hopper

    the image of the cracking egg with the weird light poking out isn't (of course) even in the film. But it's a great a marketing concept... a single image that conveys so much about the film. Amazing trailer. Amazing film.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:11 p.m. CST

    Alien Vs. Aliens: they both win!

    by Zardoz

    I love both films dearly. I saw the first one in the theater in '79 when I was 9. (yes, I'm fucking OLD! lol!) I had already read the graphic novel that came out before the movie was released and knew everything that was going to happen and it STILL scared the crap out of me! On a side note, I saw it with my Mom, my Uncle and My Aunt. My Uncle, who knew I had already read the comic, made me promise not to spoil the movie for him. As soon as Ripley appears on the screen, I exclaim: "She's the survivor!" (Hey, I was 9!) Needless to say, my Uncle hasn't gone to the movies with me since! I was so eager for Aliens that I read the Alan Dean Foster novelization before the movie came out and I remember being disappointed when certain scenes in the book weren't in the movie. I was so glad when those scenes were eventually included in the extended edition of the film. I saw it with my girlfriend at the time, who wasn't interested in seeing it beforehand, but who became a huge fan after the fact. Alien is a very scary, claustrophobic and atmospheric "haunted house", monster movie, while "Aliens" is a thrilling, action-packed, "defend the fort", roller-coaster ride. They're both fantastic and are iconic films however you classify them. I hope "Prometheus" is up to the high standards that they have already established. (and dare I say it? Exceed them? That would be fantastic!)

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:32 p.m. CST

    i'm excited!

    by NorthTronic

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:34 p.m. CST

    Also, about the Alien trailer...

    by Brian Hopper

    you gotta love how it conveys through image and sound (the otherworldly screeching ping) the sense of the Nostromo being a submarine... as if Alien is a movie about a haunted submarine in space (which it kind of is). When my friends and I saw the trailer, I remember we talked openly about how Alien seemed like a clever union between SF and horror. That sort of genre-bending stuff was not common in the 70s to say the least. ST:TMP = scifi. Halloween = horror. Never the twain shall meet. So you could tell that Alien would be groundbreaking on a number of levels, and it turned out to be just that.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:42 p.m. CST

    Too much Alien.

    by Henri Pouper

    This looks disturbingly like a movie about how Weyland Yutani discovered the alien species (before sending Ripley and co. off to grab some specimens). I did not want to see anything that was more than very vaguely familiar. Almost every one of these pics looks like it was virtually lifted from the first movie. Not a good sign.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:44 p.m. CST

    Fuck off with the Alien > Aliens, Kirk > Picard bullshit

    by Wookie_Weed

    They're two different kinds of beasts, apples and oranges, and both are brilliant in their own right.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:46 p.m. CST

    re: chestbursters

    by Wookie_Weed

    Pretty sure the alien burst from Kane's upper abdomen in Alien, and from Ripley's stomach in Alien3 (of course, they were going for a "pregnancy" vibe, and that film doesn't exist in this dojo). They're more solar-plexus-bursters.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 8:47 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy: "ALIEN above ALIENS"

    by Henri Pouper

    Of course. Just not debatable. Jim Cameron is a roller coaster engineer. Aliens is one of his best roller coasters, maybe his best. But at the end of the day, it's just a thrill ride. Alien is art.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:24 p.m. CST

    Alien trailer and Great Movie Ride

    by SK229

    I always love when you're waiting on line at The Great Movie Ride at MGM (Disney studios... fuck you) and they show all those movie trailers on that huge screen. More than a few times, I've seen everyone get quiet and become transfixed once the Alien trailer comes up... the fucking TRAILER is better than most movies.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Watching GLADIATOR again right now...

    by Astronut

    Ridley. A visual master. What a film!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:40 p.m. CST

    ALIEN re-release a few years ago

    by Sir Loin

    I had the opportunity to take some younger friends to the ALIEN re-release a few years ago, and they had never seen it. In fact, they were born the year it was released. Their reactions were hilariously PRICELESS. I mean, they sat there in silent fear, eyes wide open. Afterward, they had to admit it was far scarier than anything current, and had freaked them out...especially when Ripley finds Dallas and Kane in the deleted scene. I still laugh when I remember the looks on their faces, stone cold horror :D

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 9:54 p.m. CST

    correction

    by Sir Loin

    ...when Ripley finds Dallas and Brett. Oh, for the joy of having an Edit button...

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:32 p.m. CST

    Pulse Rifle > Law Giver. Is that FOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU!?

    by Darth_Kong

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:33 p.m. CST

    SweeneyDave

    by quantize

    Yo kid's gonna think that's his brother when he sees the movie!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 10:51 p.m. CST

    Ripley finding Dallas and Brett

    by IamZardoz

    That has to be one of the most horrifying things Ive ever seen on film. That moaning from Dallas before she sees them. Then she sees they are morphing into goddamn eggs! Arrgghhh! Re Aliens, I liked it as well but as an action movie more than the Alienness of the original. And for "Zardoz" you can piss off as Ive had this nick for just as long. Zardoz speaks to you.

  • Some type of brawl would be cool.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:01 p.m. CST

    IN RIDLEY WE TRUST.

    by Astronut

    I mean it. Every word.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:10 p.m. CST

    It's too bad I have to wait a little longer

    by 420 Boylston St

    to see the R rated version on Blu Ray. I am NOT paying to see the FOX tv version of PROMETHEUS in cinemas! Fucking ridiculous!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:35 p.m. CST

    The fuck you say!

    by Zardoz

    You've had that name for 12 years? You. Are. Full. Of. Shit! Fuck off, you fucking un-original cunt! A liar and a fucking copycat, to boot!

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:38 p.m. CST

    LOL at Dredd comparison

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    As if there was any question that that film could stack up visually or conceptually to a Ridley Scott sci-fi film. So unfair.

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:42 p.m. CST

    Too Alien-y

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

  • Aug. 1, 2011, 11:56 p.m. CST

    This is gonna be fucking amazing.

    by MaxTheSilent

    I love that Ridley Scott has stepped away from cranking out a film a year to really craft something special with this. And if nothing else this movie had Noomilicious in it. Hopefully we get top see her in her undies like Sigourney Weaver in the first film.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:12 a.m. CST

    I hope so

    by 420 Boylston St

    http://io9.com/5826616/new-prometheus-images-provide-a-terrifying-reminder-of-the-original-alien/gallery/5

  • Everyone is great in ALIEN and Harry Dean Stanton and Yaphett Koto give two of the most effortlessly realistic performances I've ever seen. For me, it's those performances that make the movie so believable...and that's what makes ALIEN such a great film. On top of the incredible production design, killer effects, excellent score, brilliant cinematography, etc. etc. The performances keep it grounded. And although I've had fun with really all of the sequels, none of them compare to the original. And I'm super stoked for this new one!

  • Apropos to the time the movies are set, i'll always be this movie's tireless champion.

  • And even those are better then most other director's best jobs. As for the much maligned HANNIBAL, eventually people will start come around and stop being ashamed to admit they like it.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:21 a.m. CST

    While I feel ALIEN and ALIENS were enough...

    by justmyluck

    ... team Ridley seems to have replicated the look of the original well enough. As for the rest....we'll see!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:21 a.m. CST

    Jesus, the AL(l)ENS hate here is shocking

    by lv_426

    A L l E N is art while AL(l)ENS is just a rollercoaster ride and sideshow. Look, I am fine with people saying they like Ridley's film better than Cameron's sequel. What I can't abide is all the talk of de-canonizing the queen from the Alien mythos and things like that. Both films are fucking great, or my name's Fury 161, or even worse, General Perez's Xenomorph-ruptured brain. Aliens captured a lot of the vast and cold timelessness of space. Ripley's 57 year hypersleep anyone? Also, Cameron made the Xenomorphs scary and formidable enemies. The images of the alien warriors blending in with the hive walls and emerging from the shadows to attack the colonial marines. The silhouette of the alien scrambling towards Vasquez in the red-lit airshafts. The sound of the motion tracker signal getting bigger and pulsing more frequently, followed by Hicks checking above the ceiling tiles... all these are just a few examples of Aliens being on par with the tense horror vibe of Alien. Cameron wisely built on what Ridley did in the first film, while adding some new elements to amp the sequel up to an even better level of thrills mixed with expert science fiction world building. I hope I don't have to break out my M41A, flamethrower, and some duct tape galddamnit!!!!!!!!!! Now... onto Prometheus. Pics look great

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:28 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Asi, I think there's some good stuff in HANNIBAL. I actually think the best sequence by far is the big gangland shootout near the start that's really just a scene setter for Clarice Starling and is pretty irrelevant to the rest of the movie. Ultimately Gary Oldman's prosthetics were a little too repugnant, Julianne Moore proved that she's no Jodie Foster - and I wouldnt exactly say that Anthony Hopkins played Lecter as a parody but he was certainly far less scary and intimidating as SILENCE OF THE LAMBS. So I personally count HANNIBAL as a miss (not a stinker tho).

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:30 a.m. CST

    lv_426

    by justmyluck

    Couldn't have said it better!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:36 a.m. CST

    Prometheus definitely has some A L l E N DNA

    by lv_426

    As a huge fan of both Alien and Aliens, I still worry about Prometheus possibly showing too much prequel-ish stuff that could kill a good portion of the mystique of the derelict ship and old Mr. Space Jockey. On the other hand, these picks look so great that I can't not get excited about Ridley's return to both science fiction and the Alien universe. Hopefully he will make The Forever War after Prometheus to give us another sci-fi double wammy to stand with the legendary combo of Alien and Blade Runner being made one after the other. One thing that is completely clear after the release of these pics... Prometheus is definitely the Alien prequel.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:47 a.m. CST

    These are great times to be an A L l E N and AL(l)ENS fan

    by lv_426

    with both Prometheus hitting theaters next summer, and before that in the spring the Aliens: Colonial Marines game is due for Xbox 360/PS3 and the PC. 2012. At least if the world ends in some Roland Emmerich style cataclysm in December 2012, we will have had the chance to experience more great Alien stories.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:54 a.m. CST

    I'm liking this movie less and less

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    I liked it a whole lot better when they were pretending it wasn't an Alien prequel! Who asked for an Alien prequel where they dust off the old Alien sets? I sure as fuck didn't! and this shits PG-13. Lol.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:57 a.m. CST

    of course Aliens is better than Alien

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    A lot of people here are pretentious nerds, they are a sub-species minority. I'd like you dipshits to look James Cameron in the face and tell him he isn't an artist.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:02 a.m. CST

    Is Ridley Scott undermining Cameron's Aliens?

    by Wookie_Weed

    The plot of Prometheus, if we're to believe it's the real deal, undermines everything in Aliens. If Earth corporations knew about the aliens before Acheron was colonised, then why did they build a colony and enormous terraforming plant -- and then send a colonist to check out the derelict spaceship as an afterthought? If they knew about the aliens, then they'd know that if the colony was infected, they were fucked -- no point sending a recon team to check it out. The conspiracy backstory, that Weyland-Yutani knew about the aliens all along, completely undermines every plot point in Aliens and unravels it. Everything in Aliens is contradictory and pointless. This is why the conspiracy backstory annoys me, it pushes Aliens out in the cold, and makes a mockery of Alien as well.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:03 a.m. CST

    Heck, where have I seen prequel backstories screwing up lore...

    by Wookie_Weed

    George Lucas might know.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:04 a.m. CST

    PS I'm waxing rhetorical

    by Wookie_Weed

    I'm hypothesising out loud, not saying definitively that Scott is undermining Aliens. But if Prometheus has the conspiracy backstory... well, I give Scott the benefit of the doubt that he's factored this already. Lindelof however.... >.>

  • And I'm no longer looking at anything to do with Prometheus again. I went into Aliens not knowing a thing about it (except what I'd seen in Alien). I'm doing the same with Prometheus. Right, I have to find a basement to lock myself in for the next year...

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:40 a.m. CST

    cobra--kai

    by AsimovLives

    "Ultimately Gary Oldman's prosthetics were a little too repugnant" Having your face skinned off with the help of a broken glass shard would do that to you, specially if DIY. If anything, the movie underplayed the result.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:51 a.m. CST

    wookie_weed

    by AsimovLives

    "If Earth corporations knew about the aliens before Acheron was colonised, then why did they build a colony and enormous terraforming plant -- and then send a colonist to check out the derelict spaceship as an afterthought?" Ther eis some Fridge Ligic to that, matter of fact. It so happens when corporations change regimes, the more secretive and sensitive stuff gets put off-side and "forgotten". Since it took about 50 years between ALIEN and ALIENS, certainly in that time there had bene a few chang eof regimes at the top aeschelons of the space corporation responsible for both the Acheron's colony and the cargo freighter of the first movie. When there's always change of regime, there's always things that get forgotten and ley wayside. It's not hard ot figure out that something like that is what happened. It was with Ripley's return in ALIENS that somebody probalby dusted off some old records and put 2 + 2 and reignited the corporation's interest in the alien.

  • Supposed that PROMETHEUS just explains and tells the motivations for why the corporation to send the Nostromo to the alien's planet (actually it's a moon orbiting a Jupiter-like gas giant). But that the mystery behind the alien spieces and the space jokey is never adressed or explained? I would be cool with that a lot. But my favorite would be that if PROMETHEUS is a direct sequel to ALIEN, thus making ALIENS the 3rd movie in the saga. That is what i would prefer.

  • Could this be a reference that the movie PROMETHEUS is about some atempt at making an human-alien hybrid? Or better and more relevant yet, an atempt to make a alien from some DNA sample or writen down coding collected from some exo-archeology expedition? The Promethus of legend gave fire of the gods to mankind and make them living beings. Frankestein is the story of a man who wanted ot make life from lifelessness. And Ridley Scott has been giving obscure hints about the new movie called PROMETHEUS having Alien DNA. Intringing possibilities. I'm loving all this mystery.

  • She also revealed that her character has a "big-twist" in the third act.

  • Or is it a reference to what Scott has said about he romantic lesbian subplot of the movie?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:32 a.m. CST

    @asimovlives

    by Wookie_Weed

    Never thought of that, that makes sense. Cheers!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:33 a.m. CST

    Charlize Theron's character is Ellen Ripley's daughter

    by Wookie_Weed

    That's the big twist. You read it here first. ;-)

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:35 a.m. CST

    Actually, Ripley's daughter is a stupid idea

    by Wookie_Weed

    She died an old woman (or was an old woman, been a while since I saw the director's cut of Aliens). But that scene could have been corporate trickery.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:42 a.m. CST

    flax

    by Jonathan Hicks

    I understand what you mean, and the popularity of Aliens would mean that going out of the way to compromise the queen's inclusion in Aliens would be a bad idea, but if Scott aproaches this so that ALIEN fans get to keep their mystery and yet it doesn't kick ALIENS fans in the balls by dismissing what Cameron created then there's no reason why both sides can't co-exist. I love me some ALIENS, it was my first proper cinema experience, but I do prefer the mystery of ALIEN so I'm hoping for more of the atmosphere of the original.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:02 a.m. CST

    I've always gone with ALIENS is a fantastic film but a shitty sequel

    by Jonathan Hicks

    Always worked for me.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:23 a.m. CST

    I've been waiting since 1994 for this film

    by unparanoid_android

    tht was when I saw ALIEN for the first time as a twelve year old. I've wanted a follow up film since then, with Ridely and Giger in that universe and now it's finally fucking here. Thank ou oh geek lords for making this happen. Thank you thank you thank you.

  • Because that is truly how I feel as well. Not many movies can do that to me. ALIEN does things to me on many levels. It fascinates and impresses me to no end. Actually these are my favorite films of the sci-fi/fantasy genre: ALIEN 2001: A Space odyssey Total Recall Wrath of Khan Empire Strikes Back Superman: The Movie TDK If I were to pack a bag with movies for a weekend, these are the ones I would deem as must haves.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:58 a.m. CST

    wookie_weed

    by AsimovLives

    Theron being ripley's daighter makes no sense because today Theron is older then sigourney when she made Alien. Also, as established in ALIENS, ripley's daugher was still a child during the events in ALIEN. Also, there is not a single indication in ALIEN that Ripley is a mother or a wife or a sigle mother. The only hint to a relationship she might had is infered moments and dialogues between her and Dallas the captain, whcih seems they might have had an history together.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:01 a.m. CST

    unparanoid_android

    by AsimovLives

    Imagine what others might be feeling who saw ALIEN much earlier then you. Like me, who saw it for the first time in 1988.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:06 a.m. CST

    wookie_weed

    by flax

    I don't see how Weyland-Yutani's foreknowledge of the creatures undermines ALIENS. What makes you think The Company would hesitate to send hundreds of innocent people to their deaths? They don't seem like the most moral sort. Perhaps Hadley's Hope was built specifically to be overrun by aliens so that The Company could harvest them? I'm having trouble working out the specifics of the scenario in my mind, but I feel like there's a good explanation in there. About Ripley's daughter – I always thought Cameron missed a trick by killing her off rather than bringing her into the story. Not only that, but he specified that the daughter had 'no children mentioned' when she died, effectively ruling out the possibility of Ripley's descendants ever showing up – which especially seems like a mistake considering the efforts Cameron had to go to in order to give Ripley a 'daughter' surrogate. When I was re-watching ALIENS as a teenager, I came up with this daft theory that Ripley's daughter had a son of her own, but she gave him up for adoption due to some psychological issues she had with her mother's abandonment, and that the boy grew up to be Newt's father – making Newt Ripley's great-granddaughter and the Alien Queen Newt's half-sister if you take the genetic absorbtion into account (since the Queen was presumably the one that gestated in Newt's dad). I know it's silly and contrived as hell, but sometimes I still have fun thinking about it.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:53 a.m. CST

    We are surely living in the age of the geek.

    by cucumber

    Wonderful. The 3rd image with the female astronaut looks like a Moebius painting.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:59 a.m. CST

    well I *did* say Ripley's daughter is a stupid idea ;-)

    by Wookie_Weed

    @asimovlives -- well, she had a daughter in Aliens. So are you saying Aliens should be ignored? No reason why Theron can't play Ripley's daughter, if it's set 20+ years after Alien. I still think Aliens will make no sense if Prometheus goes with the "weyland yutani knew all about the aliens on acheron" backstory. The only way it'll make sense is, if you said, the corporation/govt in Prometheus buries their dirty little secret, and sells Acheron real estate to Weyland Yutani. That'd work.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Looks way too real and convincing for me...

    by Ice Paul

    Look at those vehicles and interiors and costumes, it looks like someone has actually made them and that they actually exist and are real and you could touch them... Should have done it all CGI instead, so that it looked like a detailed cartoon, doesn't this guy know anything about sci-fi movies? I'll reserve judgement until I see it, but here's hoping we get some CGI stuff flying around at million miles an hour that we can't follow, that's what I like in my sci-fi.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:45 a.m. CST

    mentaldominance I love it

    by Astronut

    I love what you posted and I think you nailed it on the head extremely well. I'm not a fan of A L I E N, I'm a fanatic. I savor every sequence in the film, every nuance. Ridley painted such a rich, detailed, and, even more importantly, BELIEVABLE world. I've seen it 50, 60 times since Day One in the theater and I am STILL finding new little bits and pieces. I could go on and on for an hours straight talking about what I love in that film. And why I love it. Maybe I'm a bitter old guy but IMO people today just don't have the attention span or the appreciation for detail. I really believe we as a society have become desensitized thanks to the escalation of films with more and more and more and more action. Look at the Michael Bay stuff. All show, no substance. Like a supermodel. Beautiful and shiny and perfect. But it's too perfect. The real world, the real universe, is not perfect. It's dirty and used. A supermodel. All show, no substance. Makes me crazy sometimes when I stop and think about it. I am sooooooo looking forward to June 8th. My biggest hurdle regarding this film is me - - I have to find a way to stop myself from looking at more of the spoilery stuff. On June 8th I want so bad to go in and feel like I did when I was 14...

  • It's so rare to see such passion, such true passion. mostly we get shows of enthusiam in here, which is not exactly the same as passion. As a fellow person who also has deep passions for cinema, here's to you.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:56 a.m. CST

    Equal love for Alien & Aliens here..

    by AnalFissure

    ..both flicks would make my desert island top 10, fo sho. Anyhoo, I'm liking the look of PROMETHEUS thus far...they certainly seemed to have nailed the aesthetic. Fingers crossed it's a return to form for Ridders, as his output of late has been decidedly mediocre.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:58 a.m. CST

    wookie_weed

    by AsimovLives

    I think PROMETHEUS is a prequel to ALIEN. As such, it would not add up if Theron plays Ripley's daughter. However, if PROMETHEUS is set, as i hope it does, between ALIEN and ALIENS, then Theron playing ripley's daughter could work up. It would still be pretty precious, as in, a bit contrived. Daughter of the woman who was a crew of the very ship that visited the alien moon and ship returns to her mother's last known stop is a bit... contrived, perhaps? Not that it couldn't work, if handled right, of course. A daughter who lived the rest of her life obsessed with her mother's disapearence, who became a top executive of the very firm who used to emply her, and uses her status to find the tuth about her mother's disapearence, it does have some cool possibilities to it. Making the whole movie a sort of WHO-DONE-IT set in space, with soemthing of an HAMLET element to it, if you know what i mean. Theron as Ripley's daughter as Hamlet, Ripley as the dead Father King and the company itself as Laertes. And the alien itself would be like a personification of fate, karma and inevitability, the personification of the cosmos, the universe eitself, who's cold and indifferent to the worries, dramas, problems, dreams and ambitions of humans.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 10:02 a.m. CST

    If PROMETHEUS is indeed a two movie thing, as some have sugested...

    by AsimovLives

    ... imagine if the first movei is a prequel to ALIEN and the second is a direct sequel to ALIEN set before ALIENS. Or that both Prometheus movies are set after or before ALIEN. If so, it could mean that ridley would be intended in making HIS OWN ALIEN TRILOGY independent of the sequels that came afterwards his first movie. A Ridley Scott's Alien Trilogy. Independent or semi-independent of the rest of the franchise. Think about it. We would get a Ridley's Alien Trilogy, and then ALIENS would be like the first of the rest of the saga. Wouldn't that be sweet? If this is indeed Ridley Scott's intention, then there's no doubt, the guy is a genious. Now i only hope he can pull off such ambition with a pair of really good movies that don't shame his first ALIEN.

  • It's quite creepy, if one thinks about it. There's just something really wrong going on there.

  • ... because you pretty much make up for that with your love of A L I E N. All is forgiven, sir. haha

  • We finally found a common ground between us, and it couldn't had been cooler. I tip my hat to you, good sir. You're alright, and i'm sorry for all the bad words i have said to you. If only i had knew. I shall now view your liking of Abrams Trek as a quirk of personality, a pritfall you fell in unawares.

  • • phenomenal direction • epic scope (cinematography) • perfect pacing from beginning to end • build-up of mystery • build-up of tension • genuine, first class acting • amazing sounds • perfect soundtrack • great plot • perfect balance of characters • lighting is always just right • plot twists and turns (very important) • fantastic set design • so-real-it's-amazing special effects • superb level of fascinating subject matter • Giger's genius-level innovation • great, believable dialog • shocking level of visual detail and, most importantly... • loads of class Did I miss anything?

  • The funny thing is, i did saw ALIENS before. and i saw it in the theater. And it's still, to this day, the movie i saw the most times in a theater. I was still too young to go watch a movie alone when ALIEN was released. I was already in my midteens when ALIENS came out and i saw it first with the pals and then alone, to allow the movie to sink in. I truly loved ALIENS. That movie was my entry to James Cameron's career, in fact, since i saw THE TERMINATOR afterwars, in a rerun. The thing i connected the most with ALIENS was the mood of nostalgia and melancoly that permeates the whole movie. Despiste all the chessy comedy and the action stuff, it's not an happy and light-weight movie. Only the ending shows some light, and evne then the end credits plays pretty melancolic and heavy. And i always connected with that. A blockbuster actoionfiest doesn't need to be jolly happy to work, and it might evne work better like that. Then, a couple years later i finally saw ALIEN in a VHS tape. And despiste the inferior image quality, i was lbown away by the movie. It blew my mind. Right after i first saw it, i knew for certain that ALIEN was the better movie. I never stoped loving ALIENS, but deifnatly ALIEN was the movie that spoke directly to my soul. And part of my mind-blowing of ALIEN is that by that tiem i was already a major fan of BLADE RUNNER. BR was the very first Ridley Scott movie i ever saw. But i feared watching ALIEN, just in case the movei couldn't hold up to my very favorable opinion of BR. I needed had no such fears, for ALIEN holds up admirable in such company. And right after ALIEN i got to watch THE DUELISTS, It was this 3 movies, seen in a row, that made Ridley Scott become my favorite director. Which he remained so until recently. There's something about ALIEN, more then just all the ovious elements tha tprople bring up, that connects to me, to my soul. The movie is more then the sum of it's parts, if you know what i mean.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 10:45 a.m. CST

    prople = people

    by AsimovLives

  • As you said about ALIEN can be said about BLADE RUNNER, another of Ridley Scott's movie made at that time. In tha,t like BR, ALIEN is a movie that's fille dot the grills with exelent elemrnts, of which you have very well pointed out. But to all that i add the following: the movie is better, it's superior to the sum of all it's excelent parts. It's that unpalpable quality but with one can feel, and that is why i think the movie is the beloved and timeless classic that it is.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 10:56 a.m. CST

    As for the visual quality of ALIEN....

    by AsimovLives

    ... for a long time i used to think that ALIEN was Scott's least visually accomplished movie. Not so much becaus eof the framing, which is suberb, but the pictorial quality of the cinematogrpahy. And all because i new the movie from VHS. Then i saw the movie in DVD and my jaw dropped to the floor. And now i consider the movie to be one of Scott's most beautiful movie he ever made. And this from Scott's career sure means a hell of a lot. Scott is uncable of making anything less then a beautiful movie, but even for his standards ALIEN is gorgeaus.

  • AGREED, asi. Amen, brotha-man. Amen.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:32 a.m. CST

    asimovlives...the dvd???

    by Billy_D_Williams

    The dvd looks like shit compared to the bluray...do yourself a huge favor.

  • it should be easy to duplicate that and tweak it a little.

  • ...in that creepy way that scared me as a kid and has been sampled in countless electronic music....

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:45 a.m. CST

    Alien comes from that magical period of the late 70s to the early 80s...

    by Billy_D_Williams

    right around the time the fantastical in cinema was birthed out of the imaginations of visionaries without being fucked with by clueless, money grubbing producers...Alan Ladd Jr. greenlit not only ALIEN but STAR WARS...the studio guys and producers back then loved movies, knew talent when they saw it, and knew not to stick their noses into things they didn't know much about, like making movies. As a result we got stuff like ALIEN, STAR WARS, ROBOCOP, PLATOON, THE TERMINATOR, ANNIE HALL, ROCKY, E.T., THE THING, etc, etc... Today producers and studio execs are wannabe artisans, when they're merely greedy Harvard and Yale yuppie scum who insert their statistical engineering tactics into the filmmaking process, having everything boiled down to a formula so they feel they are in control of the thing...the result is the film is stifled and never allowed to grow organically from the minds of the writers and directors, and takes on a bland, middle of the road quality making every film feel the same...going to the movies now you get the feeling you're watching the same movie over and over again, merely with different actors...it's because everything from the writing to the direction to the cinematography to the score is part of a hollywood formula dictated by the "suits".

  • I highly doubt that. By admission I would think that she's playing the sleazy corporate suit (she's the Burke of this movie.)

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:50 a.m. CST

    so true billy d......

    by zom-bot.com

    back then the only constraints were time and budget (from the things i read about the making of ALIEN- literally having very short times to film key scenes and then tear down sets) and in a way even that stimulates creativity. MOON is a modern example of that, making the best of your budget.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:52 a.m. CST

    Noomi and Charlize in form fitting spacesuits

    by zom-bot.com

    that alone sold me. talk about sugar and spice.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:54 a.m. CST

    ALIEN: Rise of the Xenophiliac

    by squirtloaf

    ...directed by Lars Von Trier...

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:16 p.m. CST

    Mentaldominance, a very passionate and very long post

    by one9deuce

    about why ALIENS should be more like ALIEN, but I think your kind of missing the point. Why would you want a sequel to be more like the original?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Maybe Charlize is an Android since she's "naked the entire movie"

    by ganymede3010

    http://io9.com/5824324/charlize-theron-and-damon-lindelof-explain-the-deeper-meanings-of-prometheus

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:38 p.m. CST

    Re: Mentaldominance's post

    by Keith

    It's interesting that you mention The Terminator in your post, because I think I have a similar feeling about the relationship between The Terminator and T2: I admit that T2 is by many metrics a very good action movie, but I think it's a terrible sequel to The Terminator that stamps on many things that made the original movie brilliant. Of course, I have to split Cameron into 1984Cameron and 1991Cameron to make the analogy work: "It's like 1984Cameron drew the Mona Lisa and then here comes 1991Cameron and he draws her likeness as a stick figure but he adds tons of color splotches to it and puts a strobe light in front of it and plays loud music and all the people too STUPID to have understood what a masterpiece the original was seem to understand the watered down version more! Why? Because these people are the types who say "Eh... It's just entertainment." " Interestingly, there's a gap of seven years in both cases, and in both cases a lot of people came to the "franchise" through the second movie more than the first, or weren't intimately familiar with the first when they saw the sequel, and thus the problems, inconsistencies and more cartoonish tone didn't bother them as much. And that was definitely the case for me with the Alien movies: although I did see Alien before I saw Aliens (1982 vs 1987), I think I must have seen Aliens ten times before I watched Alien for a second time. Now, with a lot of distance from that period of asymmetric exposure to and love for "Aliens", I can see the loss of quality in certain areas more clearly than I could at the time. But I think (like I suspect is the case with people who love T2) that once the bond is there, it can't be broken. I still love too many things about Aliens for it not to be in my all time top 25, and I would defend it vociferously in a drunken debate, every time. Which, of course, is exactly the position that winds me up about passionate fans of T2 when I criticize that movie, so I get to be my own enemy when flipping the switch between two James Cameron sequels. Having said that, I do think whereas the plot holes and contradictions in T2 actually sink the story on close analysis, it's much easier to accept Aliens as a bona fide (and good) sequel to Alien. You can criticize the production values and tone if you like as being inconsistent, but it's harder to search for plot problems. Okay, so the existence of Ripley's daughter is a bit of a contrivance, but there's nothing inconsistent about it. The changing of the xenomorphs' forms make them more bug-like and disposable, less awesome and hideously lethal, but perhaps (?) they're a slightly different caste, and the Nostromo picked up a particularly nasty, superior form. You have to reach a little, but you can make it work. (Mind you, it annoys me when people have to reach in all directions to make T2 work given what we're told in the first movie.) The single thing in Cameron's movie that has never really made sense to me is the idea that the company didn't know the alien derelict was there. A simple orbital survey with satellites (which would have been done as a matter of course prior to terraforming) would have revealed its existence within hours.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:46 p.m. CST

    tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka

    by Keith

    Ha ha...yes, the sound design on "Alien" is brilliant. Was reading through The Making of Star Wars the other day (highly recommended) and it hit me just how vital Ben Burtt's work was on that movie. Absolutely crucial. Imagine if Star Wars had used the same old stock "science fiction sounds" that had been used for computers, beam weapons etc. up until that point. The movie would have lost an entire layer of quality that was essential for you to buy into the world. As Lucas observed at the time (and the book reminds you that at one point he was a bona fide genius), his intention throughout was to make you feel like you were watching a film shot on location in Mos Eisley and on the Death Star, for you to buy into that universe 100%. The quality of the sound work - and that fact that it all sounded new, that you'd never heard those particular sounds before - made it seem like the film reels had arrived in Earth's orbit from another world. The original "Star Wars" was also hugely influential for "Alien": the battered, lived-in feel of the rebels' equipment and environment (plus that on Tatooine) inspired Scott and his designers immensely. They took the idea of "vérité sci-fi" and ran with it.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 12:54 p.m. CST

    btw, what I want from Prometheus

    by Keith

    ...is not horror, or action. It's science fiction. Not necessarily hard science fiction, but moving in that direction. I would love the film not to be a boogeyman movie, but something a bit slower and more cerebral. A story about first contact with another race. Still creepy - it needs to be creepy - and almost certainly laced with danger and foreboding, but not necessarily about a desperate struggle to escape from monsters. A story about smart people in an unexpected situation having to make crucial decisions. Something a bit closer to "Rendezvous with Rama", perhaps. I doubt that I'll get it, though. But it's one way to ensure that the movie isn't just retreading old ground in the same narrative universe.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:13 p.m. CST

    Looks Fucking Awesome

    by bottombrick

  • Not true at all. Ash ate food with the rest of the crew. You could see some of the stuff when his head came off. Oh. And the milk he drank, too. Or maybe it was a type of milky white android lubricant. Not sure.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:30 p.m. CST

    RE: tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka...

    by Astronut

    If you're referring to the sound we hear in the hallway when Dallas is gaining access to Mother, with his key card then yeah, man — I have always dug that sound!! Thrumming heartbeat-like sound in the lower deck is good too. And the slow rising and falling sound in the science lab is a great one also, yeah. Spooky as FU - ! You guys are nailing so much of what's great about A L I E N I almost feel as if I don't even need to post about it... you guys are speaking for me!!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:45 p.m. CST

    Talking of tikkatakkatikkatokka

    by Keith

    I've always loved the fact that in that opening scene, you're watching the text from the automated VDU display reflected in the faceplate of the helmet left on the chair in the bridge. Why is the helmet there? Presumably for no purpose other than that it's weird and creepy (although perfectly plausible that it would have been left there). Even in the human-made world, it seems alien, otherworldly, a foreshadowing of things to come. Something about it makes us feel uneasy, like it's a creature with its own intelligence assessing what's going on, even though it's just an inanimate object. This is the sign of a film-maker on top of his game.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:55 p.m. CST

    billy_d_williams

    by AsimovLives

    And the DVD looked like god compared to VHS. I have actually seen ALIEN in blu-ray, and yeah, it's glorious. but unlike many, though i recognize that the ol' blu-ray is superrior in image quality, i don't think it's that big a difference. Beside,s the DVd was enough to realise the beauty of the movie. mostly, it was due to the colour scheme in the movie, which in the old VHS was just a misery. The movie looked yellow. In blu-ray, they colour corrected the movie to look like how it did when it was first released. So, i don't need the blu-ray to tell me how beautiful the movie is.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:56 p.m. CST

    zombot, i love the computer talk in ALIEN. It's so bloody cool!

    by AsimovLives

    I just hope that Ridley brings that back for PROMETHEUS. If he does that i'll have a mini-geekasm.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:59 p.m. CST

    The pics have been removed from the original site!

    by Zardoz

    I guess they'll be gone from AICN soon, too?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 1:59 p.m. CST

    mentaldominance

    by AsimovLives

    "I'll always be stirring the shit and causing debates. I'll inject some life into this place. Anyone want that? Vote me in then." Sorry, but i already have that job. And i'm not quitting anytime soon.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2 p.m. CST

    The Alien/Blade Runner Ridleyverse

    by Keith

    He will, of course, have to have somewhere in Prometheus a red and white computer display saying "PURGE".

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:15 p.m. CST

    This is the sign of a film-maker on top of his game.

    by Astronut

    YES. YES INDEED, SIR. Couldn't have said it better myself.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:19 p.m. CST

    RE: I'll always be stirring the shit and causing debates...

    by Astronut

    Debate is what makes these TB boards great. They would suck without it. But stirring shit just to be a prick or just because it's funny and you have nothing better to do is not cool. It's being a troll. There's a difference. Have some couth.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:22 p.m. CST

    one9deuce

    by AsimovLives

    "Why would you want a sequel to be more like the original?" So that the sequel can feel like it belongs to the same universe of the original, pehaps? I suspect the reason why Cameorn went with the 50 years later scenarion is partially because he must have felt he couldn't compete or follow up to the visuals created by Ridley Scott for ALIEN. If so, he was absolutly right, he couldn't. He couldn'tm even make a workable pastiche. Not even Ridley Scott's Tone Scott could, and he's the only other person in the world that has a stile reminescent of Ridley. So, Cameron's clever trick was to set the story futher in time, suficiently enough that he could give a destinctive visual of his own. But Cameron being Cameron, a very clever, smart and inventive guy, he turned one possible weakness into a strenght, and thus was able to make his own movie in his own style. This is what i think of the subject. If i'm right or complelty wrong, i can't tell.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:31 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    "The single thing in Cameron's movie that has never really made sense to me is the idea that the company didn't know the alien derelict was there. A simple orbital survey with satellites (which would have been done as a matter of course prior to terraforming) would have revealed its existence within hours." And who says they haven't? Even from the first movie we get the pciture that the corporation has a pretty poor view of their own blue-collar workers and use them as expensable cattle. On the other hand, it seems that the derelic Alien ship seems to be radar invisible. Remember, in the first movie the only reason why it was found is due to it's beacon. Maybe for human radar technology, the ship reads like as if it's part of the geography of the planet. It is an ALIEN ship, after all. And it seems that soemwhere between the events of the first and second movie, the beacon ceased to boradcast. Probably because of the events of the first movie. Probably what remained of the automatic system from the Alien ship , which was broadcasting the signal as a warning signal, it must have figured out that since the egg chamber had been violated and penetrated (sexual analogies there, how apropos to ALIEN), the porpose of the warning was made obsolete and useless.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:35 p.m. CST

    To throw in my 2 cents on the ALIEN/ALIENS debate...

    by WeylandYutani

    Alien is the superior film of the two IMO. It was the original and set the standard. I love how it set the universe apart from other franchises like Star Wars and Star Trek and rejected the idea that life is abundant and instead established space as a cold, unforgiving lonely place were life is rare. I also love how the original xenomorph was truly alien other than its vaguely bipedal frame (which I assumed was due to evolution encountering similar natural challenges and solving them in similar ways even though human/apes and xenomorphs evolved light years apart). Add to this the creepy idea that Scott/Giger's alien is a hermaphrodite makes it all the more terrifying. Enter Cameron's sequel - and please understand I love the hell out of this film too and for the most part, I see it as a worthy successor, but like what many have stated above, it has problems and has not aged as well as the original IMO. I don't think Cameron's characters are as subtle or nuanced as Scott's and they rely on catch phrases etc. which makes the film fun to quote, but highlights Cameron's skill as an idea guy and not as a strong writer of character or dialogue. I am not a fan of the queen alien either as I think it is a cheap way of raising the stakes for the final act of the film... which BTW, is derivative of the original almost note for note. But in the end, despite these short comings, ALIENS had enough new material and interesting ideas and it was so well put together that the parts that did not work in retrospect are hidden very well by the tight, well paced, action film that surrounds it. And ALIENS is by far the best of the ALIEN sequels/prequels to date. While I think ALIEN 3 has its own set of issues, I actually think it was a good way to end the series (or at least Ripley's story) even if there were flaws such as it being hard to tell one inmate from another, the dodgy FX and the opening that did not make sense... how exactly was there an egg on the Sulaco after the queen ripped herself from her egg sack before entering the ship? If they were going to go that route and knew that they were going to kill Newt off anyway, why not write that Newt had been carrying a parasite all along and that it birthed during hypersleep? However, unlike most fans of the series, I actually like that they killed off Newt and Hicks... it took balls to do that and I personally didn't need Newt in a second story. Add to this that there was the problem of recasting the part, as Carrie Henn would have been too old to reprise her role. Ultimately, this choice pulled the rug out from under the fans in the first five minutes of the film, which is what the original did exceptionally well. I only wish FOX had let Fincher do his thing. Instead we ended up with an interesting mood piece that does not quite hold together and has a muddled narrative due to too many cooks in the kitchen. But at least it ended the story. ALIENS, to my surprise, is also superior Jeunet's fourth installment, which turned out to be completely unnecessary. I think if they were going to continue the ALIEN franchise, they should have introduced an entirely new set of characters. We did not need Ripley to return and that xenomorph/human hybrid was so wrong from concept to design to execution I don't even know where to begin. For a stylist like Jeunet, this film should have been a triumph, but instead the only redeeming thing in the whole film was Kim Flowers' gratuitous ass shot. As for the other Predator tie-in films... there is absolutely nothing to say... other than it was a viable idea that was handled with all the care, skill and grace of an abortion. So as I said, ALIENS is still by far the best sequel/prequel in the series. But I do wonder, after looking at these pics of Prometheus, if Uncle Ridley is on to something? It sure LOOKS right. Although I remember reading a supposed plot synopsis and I must say that the way they tied the Space Jockey to humanity was underwhelming - but who knows if that was legit, or even made it into the shooting script. Like others, I am concerned that this film may take away the tantalizing mystery of the original film. But if they were going to do anything more with the old and weary franchise I can't think of anyone other than Ridley Scott that I'd want at the helm. If he fails, at least it will be an interesting failure. One more thing: Some people have voiced concern and asked why the company always seems to forget that it has had prior contact with the xenomorph? Who said they have forgotten… It is very possible that Carter Burke had access to ALL of the data that the Weyland-Yunani had going back centuries – which can’t be much because every contact with xenomorphs has lead to most (if not all) of the human expedition being lost, so perhaps they only have fragments of information in their files. I suppose it is also equally possible that W-Ys files are incomplete and they could have been lost over time. I’d imagine that this proxy government/corporation is somewhat Kafkaesque and while it has a huge database of saved and classified information; the existence of the alien life form may have been lost in centuries of piled up bureaucracy. Wow... OK. sorry for the way overlong post. I'm done.

  • ... the fact that those hydraulics (or whatever they are) attached to the landing leg look very CG? I'm talking about the landing leg in that one official shot (with the bounding space suit person) released during COMICON... Do you think we are doomed for disappointment when it comes to the effects for Prometheus? I mean, yeah, Ridley's doing some practical sets but he is also certainly using CG, and probably a lot of it... What do you think?

  • Unlike many in here, i don't worship at the altar of Star Wars. However, any praise on the use of sound in SW is beyond deserved. The use of sound in Sw is absolutly brillant. It's the least talked about aspect of that movie, and yet might be the most brillant thing about the movie. Lucas has always been a genious in the use of sound in his movies. He has always ben ahead of everybody else in the sue of sound in films. In fact, there is only one other filmamker who has bene more inventive, original and genail inthe use of sound in films, and that's David Lynch. But tghis two guys are the popes of sound in film. Even today. Berate the prequels all you want, but Lucas care and thoughfulness for sound was not diminished for the prequels. blame him for whatever else, but the man has not lost his touch. It will always be his most genious aspect to his filmmaking, that and editing (it was he who edited RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK, don't forget!). Ridley Scott was very influenced on Lucas's SW. He has said in interviews that when he first saw it, it felt like a revelation. He was making this little historical art-house movie called THE DUELISTS, but wehen he saw SW, he felt that was the movie he should be making. ALIEN was his first chance at that. What's funny about ridley Scott is that the lesson he took from SW was not the most obvious. The obviosu lesson would had been to make a fast-paced adventure movie with lots of lasers shooting and an alien who wopuld be attacking in broad light and shoting fire and thunder from it's arse, and people doing down in fiery battles, and spaceships flying fast and in fury across the universe. But Ridley Scott took an intelligent's man lesson from SW. The lesson was not obvious, but he learned form Lucas the deeper elements from SW that made it popular and attractive to audiences. And he aplied that to ALIEN.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Alien versus Aliens is a stupid debate

    by cool_britannia79

    They are both the standard for their respective genres, being sci-fi, horror, and action. Also, people who have a line break after every sentence want stabbing.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:45 p.m. CST

    asimov

    by Keith

    "Remember, in the first movie the only reason why it was found is due to it's beacon" Well, the suggestion is that nobody's ever been close enough to look. You'll get much larger range with passive rather than active sensing, and this is the case here: they receive an acoustic beacon signal and then get close enough to investigate. They wouldn't have been able to send out active probe signals (radar etc) from millions of miles away. (Well, of course I'm speculating here, i.e. who knows what tech they have?) I'd always assumed that the company believed that a life form might exist and were anxious to get it, but that they didn't know for sure. When you think about it, it doesn't REALLY make that much sense to use the Nostromo crew as a retrieval squad, but I suppose they might have been "the only ship in range" (the standard excuse used in Star Trek). Did the Company already know that the signal existed, or was it that Special Order 937 already existed but it was simply a company-wide protocol (albeit a hidden one) that happened to be activated by the Nostromo's chance encounter with this beacon? There's circumstantial evidence for the former point of view, from the fact that Ash was a late replacement for the usual science officer. But it *might* have been coincidence. In "Aliens", it really DOESN'T make sense to me that Weyland Yutani knew about the ship and the aliens, yet chose to let the humans come in contact with it rather than sending their own scientific teams to collect the tech and the samples. I mean, what a fucking mess of a scenario by contrast, with no advantages. Also, why send a bunch of marines on a rescue mission? If the Company knows what's on the planet, and what must have happened, they would, again, simply send their own science team to mop up and collect. And why would they endanger their own huge investment in the atmosphere processor? Why build it at all on that planet? I don't buy it. The only way to read Alien and Aliens together consistently (which is different from trying to make sense of Alien alone) is that Special Order 937 existed as a general protocol, but that they didn't know about LV-426 specifically, and that the loss of the Nostromo meant that no information was ever transmitted to them. The Nostromo was simply lost in space, for reasons unknown.

  • DANG! Bring it on!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:50 p.m. CST

    Cool, thanks for the kind words, asimov...

    by Astronut

    I did not know any of that stuff about Ridley learning from Lucas or editing Raiders. That was interesting, man. I will keep posting here. There is no PROMETHEUS TB board more current than this one so I am here to stay until that happens. I like trading posts with you and the other amazingly insightful people here. Except for the_choppa. He's a douche.

  • I come pretty late to THE TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE. The first time i saw it was 5 years ago. i'm not kidding. I did knew that the movei had been an influence for Scott. He told in interviews that movie treached him how to make horror in film. for many years that puzzled me, because my perconception of that movie was based more on it's fame then on the movie itself. Then i saw the movie and understood. If you guys ever mannage to play both THE TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE and ALIEN side by side, you will notice that ALIEN follows the former movie beat by beat. It's uncanny. ALIEN uses the same narrative structure of TEXAS. The story structure, the progression of the reveals, the beats, the mood build, the type of mood, the build up of uneasiness, the whole shebang. ALIEN differs in that it adds a fourth act to the story, which TEXAS do not have (one could even say that movie doesn't have a 3rd act!). I do remember that when i first saw THE TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE for the first time, much of my thoughts where "this is like ALIEN!" Of couse, it's the other way arround, since ALIEN came afterwards. Personally, i think that's very cool, since i'm also a big fan of THE TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE (1974). I have awe for that movie.

  • Is it milk from when he had dinner with the rest of the crew? Is it some sort of android lubricant? I * know * that it is actually, literally MILK that Ridley used (it was mentioned in one of the behind-the-scenes clips, milk and glass marbles) but what do you think it is in the movie itself? Don't we also see noodles? I swear Ash eats noodles and drinks wheat appears to be milk at one point during the film.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 2:55 p.m. CST

    The ignorant, revisionist history 'dismissal' of Aliens is a disgrace...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    It would seem the past decade or two of Michael Bay-type crap has truly infected their ability to discerna a truly good movie when they see one. Aliens is a terrific movie, full of great characters, memeorable dialogue, relevant themes, a logical and appropriate expansion of the original, and some of the best paced and most exciting action scenes in cinema history. Anyone who dismisses it as a cheap 'rollercoaster ride' is a moron, period. As for Alien, and it bears repeating, its qualities as art are over-stated. Very over-stated. It's time the balance was re-addressed here.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:04 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    "Aliens is a terrific movie, full of great characters, memorable dialogue, relevant themes, a logical and appropriate expansion of the original, and some of the best paced and most exciting action scenes in cinema history." I agree with all of that. "As for Alien, and it bears repeating, its qualities as art are over-stated." I don't agree with that.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:07 p.m. CST

    Alien = AIP haunted house B-movie with outstanding production design...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    An (admittedly terrific) monster jumping out and saying 'boo!' as it kills the crew one-by-one - and largely cardboard characters, too, if it wasn't for some naturalistic touches a great cast brought to the table. Aliens has far better characters (and character arcs). It has also has something that Alien does not - personal thematic concerns - which Ridley Scott doesn't have in his work, but James Cameron (the so-callled 'rollercoaster engineer') actually does. Alien's glacial pacing, art direction and naturalistic performances give it an implied depth that it doesn't really have and that have fooled a lot of inch-deep fanboy minds. Aliens actually has this stuff on the page. Aliens>Alien (P.S. In actuality I love Alien, but the blind dogma here amongst the geekery needs to be adressed and devil's advocate played).

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:08 p.m. CST

    Ash milk

    by Keith

    "Is it some sort of android lubricant?" I've always assumed so. "Aliens" certainly makes us think so, although that could have been Cameron taking a particular interpretation of the original. Is Ash at least partly biological? There's no blood when his head is knocked off. But does he have sweat, bad breath, everything (very hard to spot)? Does his hair grow? My assumption is that it's bio-fluid of some kind. But there's no definitive answer, to my knowledge. Related: I've always liked the little moment where Ash does a short energetic jog on the spot, seemingly when nobody's looking. Is this perhaps a standard self-maintenance action to keep certain bio-systems working, something like that?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:12 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    Hmmm, I see what you're saying now re: themes, art, etc. I have similar feelings about Blade Runner. But I wouldn't wish to diminish either Alien or BR by taking that point of view. My position is: 1. I think that BR's themes and plot are overrated. 2. BR is one of my five favourite movies of all time. These two are not contradictory. I think that the design of BR, the ambience, the sense of immersion, the emotional connection it makes, the visuals, the soundtrack...all of these things are so overwhelmingly beautiful that the fact that the plot is slighter than some people think simply doesn't matter. It is a stunning piece of cinema.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:24 p.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    About the issue of the CGI, i'm not that terribly concerned, to tell you the truth. Where this soem other filmmaker other then Ridders, i would share your concern. but Scott has been very savvy about the CGI in his movies. Even when they look CGI, there's something in the way he presents them that makes them acceptable and undistracting. He uses CGI as a smart man. Which he is. So, no worries there, friend. Ridders knows what he's doing. And the_choppah is quite alright, ocne you get on his good side. The guy loves VALHALLA RISING, and anybody who loves that movie is my friend. Because that movie it made of total win, to use the current parlour (yeah, i saw THE WICKER MAN too!!).

  • No they aren't. Not at all. A L I E N is very much a work of art. You just need to be able to process that and discern art from average-ness. Anyone can make a film. Not anyone can make a film work on all levels — AND package it in such a beautiful manner. It's eye candy with substance to back it up. It's a slow ride. It's a slow boil to great points of climax, rather than a relentless jam-packed action fest from beginning to end. It's classy. It's all the things many of us have been pointing out in this thread. I stand by the original as one of the very finest pieces of filmmaking produced. Ever. A movie like ALIENS... it's very good but it is not fit to shine the shoes of the original film. Sorry

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:32 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    It actually does make a lot of sense for the company to use the freighter Nostromo in search of of a possible intelligent lifeform. It's quite clearly established from the start in ALIEN that the ships cannot just go on whichever direction they well pelased. There's seem to be a predestination to each ship's travel that cannot be deviated too much. It's a bit like how ships travel in our solar system, they have to follow a pre-defined path adn can't deviate much from it. In the ALIEN universe, the same seem to be true on a larger scale. In Star Trek, the ships sem to be able to waltz about the galalxy jumping form one place ot another, andit seems their major problem is just distance, not direction. In ALIEN, distance and direction are issues. So, that the Nostromo is the closest ship to the beacon and the only one which could deviate enough that it could reach it is actually one of the most plausible and smartest aspect of the story. In fac,t later the movie does point out the costs of such a later deviation: it will take them much, much more time to return home then inicially predicted if they had just stayed on-course. Much to the chagrin of everybody. And to add to that, it seems that in ALIEN, cryosleep is hardly an enjoyable experience, and it's infered that probably the longer the sleeping goes the worst it gets. The way the character wake up fromtheir cryo-slumber in ALEIN, it looks as if they are waking up from the mother of all hangovers. And as anybody who ever had an hangover will know, it's not the most pleasant experience even at the best of circunstances. In ALIEN, the only romanticism to be found in space travel is from Jerry Goldsmit's score.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:32 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    "I think that the design of BR, the ambience, the sense of immersion, the emotional connection it makes, the visuals, the soundtrack...all of these things are so overwhelmingly beautiful that the fact that the plot is slighter than some people think simply doesn't matter." I agree with that, and it could similarly be applied to Alien. Both films are so strong in terms of the purely cinematic that these qualities definitely over-ride, and compensate for, the slender plots. But I definitely think this is a double-edged word also, whether its in the countless feminist, cod-Freudian and even Marxist readings of Alien, and the philosophical and existentialist ones in the case of Blade Runner., all of which are derived (and often purely invented) by the viewer from the overall mood and design aesthetic of either movie. Hence also why a more straight-forward, though expertly crafted, movie like Aliens would be dismissed as a cheap action movie/ thriller by these people, even though it's just a great piece of engaging storytelling all round. And I think that alone qualifies it as a great piece of 'art', art being not just something that should be judged by vague and nebulous qualities. You get the sense that some of the very dogmatic, pro-Alien / Aliens detracting crowd are really responding to something that they have put no real thought into, and which certain qualities of the movies have subconsciously dictated to them what to think - ie. Alien's deliberate and portentious pacing (in contrast to the faster pace of traditional action movies) and self-consciously opulent art direction MUST mean we are in the presence of great art, or that Blade Runner has pretensions towards profundity so that MUST mean it is there.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:33 p.m. CST

    sorry - that should read ' double-edged 'sword' '

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

  • bladrunner mentions that androids/replicants are routinely sent on off world missions. we see this in the alien series. in the alien series, the androids are biomechanical, with semi-organic electrics, pumps, and they 'bleed' white. in bladerunner, they are indistinguishable from humans without several tests or microscopic inspection. so which came first? is bladerunner pre-alien? before a law was passed stating that synths had to be made in a way that could be distinguished- and they had to present themselves as android? (with exception, such as ASH or under company order) or is alien pre-bladerunner? and the androids were not perfected yet? mankind is having to get its ore off world to supply the overcrowded earth? i'd love to see them tied together in a subtle bow.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:41 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    Seem formthe perspective of soembody who prefers ALIEN over aALIENS, i take this as just settingth record straight. Maybe youhave forgot, but for pratically two decades already ALIENS was th deified movie, while alien almost got thrown in teh bogs. ALIENS was god, and ALIEN was barely treated as the prophet who brough it. I say, this appreciation of ALIEN as the better movie, is settign the record straight. Time is the great revealer, and the fact is, ALIEN has aged quite well. ALIEN is like Monica Bellucci, you know she's aged, you know she's older then you, you know she's pushing 50, but you don't car,e you take her as she is right now, and damn if you just don't want to get nasty with her over most twentysomethings. ALIENS is like Kathelyn Turner, you know she used to be hot once, and you remember foundly her time as a babe, but nowdays you can only see glimpses of her once beauty. See her old stuff and you get horny, see her today and no horniness but just kidnness and melancolic memories. My point is, ALIENS was a it movie. It was a it movie for quite a long time. Far mroe then most get. And rightly so. but as mroe time passes, it's now obvious that it's ALIEN who stoods the test of time. Give it ten more years and ALIENS will look as anacronistic as disco. ALIEN will endure and still remain fresh. And it's a question of justice. ALIEN lived too much under the shawdow of it's young brother. But ALIEN is the first born, and it's he who will inherit the Earth. Records are being set straight. As it should. ALIENS is great. ALIEN is magnificent.

  • Jezz, a writer can't write a genuinely interesting character,so what must he do? I know, make a character arc, and voilá, instant charactization. It's trick that i'm getitng mroe and more fed up with. There's no hack that doesn't use it. I could even call it THE BOB ORCI/ALEX KURTZMAN SCHOOL OF SCRIPTWRITING. And frankly, under rare exceptions, it make for very banal and cliched characterizations and plotting. The lack of character arcs, or obvious character arcs in ALIEN actually is a blessing. It means that from the get go you do not know who's the survivor. there's nothing to signal post who's going to get out alive... if any. No one is signaled as the hero or the expendable. In ALIENS, however, there's very little doubts that Ripley will survive. The only tension is if she can get to the little girl on time, and who's going to survive with her. She gets the full hero protagonist treatment, including the obvious death free card. The people who did ALIEN actually knew what they were doing.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 3:58 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    Ash's mysteriosuness as a android certainly is one ofthe most interesitng aspects of ALIEN. In al other regards, he's so close to human that even his coldness to his fellow crew comrads could pass as just him being an asshole. But then, then the game is up, he genuinely shows affection and wish that they get out alive. Actor Ian Jolm has said that he did act like as if Ash was mostly mechanical, and his strange jog seems to imply that he's preventing the freezing of his junction parts. Much like how one lets a car's engine run for a bit before start moving in a very cold morning. However, i would say that there has to be some organic or very close to organic element to him, that coudl fool people for so long, peopel who dealt with him on a daily basis. Remember, the shock that the crew feels that Ash is an andorid is not so much that hes' an android, which seems to be common in the ALIEN universe, but that they were fooled that he was not human. Ripley and Parker seem to know quite well how to operate the inards of an android, to the point they revive him for a short chat. But they weren't prepared for such a great similacrum of a human. Of course, this raises another pickle: why would the corporation put onboard such a sophisticated android on a mere mining operation ship? Possible answer? The corporation wanted to kill two rabbits in one stroke. to get a genuine real mining freight run and to get to check out the alien beacon signal. It makes sense that a corporation would make such a dual goal thing, it's more economic. The corporation always thinks economically.

  • And each would look like photographic art. That's how you know ALIEN is art. It's no small wonder that Staqnley Kubrick's BARRY LYNDON was Ridley Scott's major visual influence in the earlier part of his career. It's quite telling, and ALIEN, amont others, proves that in spades.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:06 p.m. CST

    'Not anyone can make a film work on all levels'...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Alien was never intended to work on many levels of meaning. The fact that it has, through an implied combination of its many elements, is almost incidental. I quote many of the makers themselves on the matter: Giger - 'It may pertain to art for some of its details, but on the whole it is essentially an entertainment film - but a very successful entertainment film.' Scott - 'There's nothing intelligent in Alien. It has absolutely no meaning. It works on a very visceral level and its only point is terror and more terror.' The last quote is a relatively recent one from Scott, from long after the 'myth' of Alien had accrued and the film had taken on weight, much like BR, from its initial release. Seems even Scott isn't buying into all the nonsense that's been attached to his film. Alien was intended as a piece of enetrtainment. It IS a genre film, a horror film designed for thrills. Just because some of its elements transcended that doesn't mean that this should be forgotten. If Alien has any claims to 'art' it is, like Jaws, on a purely visceral and primal level, vis-a-vis Scott's comments above. The film works superbly on that level, as a subconscious cinematic experience. But any more involved claims are - in my not so humble opinion - pap. "It's eye candy with substance to back it up." And the substance is what, in your opinion? "It's a slow ride. It's a slow boil to great points of climax, rather than a relentless jam-packed action fest from beginning to end." So is Aliens. That one didn't come from the Tony Scott/Mikey Bay school of wham-bam-boom. Wtach it again. "It's classy." A vague term thought that is, i would tend to agree (though it was dismissed by the more haughty critics of the time for being a grotesque and tasteless horror movie). But then Aliens wasn't exactly tacky either (an Oscar nominated film for best actress, lest we forget), nor are a lot of the better and more vintage genre movies. Of course, a load of vacuous Oscar-bait type Miramax pictures are also 'classy', so that term is no indication of quality or depth. "I stand by the original as one of the very finest pieces of filmmaking produced." Then you need to broaden your scope beyond genre cinema. "A movie like ALIENS... it's very good but it is not fit to shine the shoes of the original film. Sorry" Aliens is entirely justified in standing alongside its progenitor. It's a superlative genre film, just like Alien is. (note: Aliens can also make claims to 'working on multiple levels, just like Alien. It is by no means just a straightforward, though brilliant, action movie - which would be high praise even by itself since it is the absolute top of its category in that category by itself - but it's aso a vietnam allegory, a feminist tract climaxing with a battle between two mothers, and a story about familial relationships where an isolated woman finds a bond with a new and uncovential nuclear family by film's end. YMMV on the presence of these aspects, but if Alien is allowed to make claims to depth then Aliens should be accorded the same privelege. In fact, I see the themes of Aliens as quite arguable and definitely intended, whereas in Alien it's a lot harder to read a consistent expression of such ideas into its narrative, beyond, of course, the intentional and very effective Freudian and sexual over-tones which work on a much more irrational and primal level).

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:07 p.m. CST

    Sorry for the constant typos. I'm writing in a state of passion.

    by AsimovLives

    This doesn't mean i'm all emotional and excited. i'm quite calm and collected. But ideas are pouring out of my mind and i can't keep up with my writing, so the later suffers. Sorry about that.

  • ALIEN and BLADE RUNNER belongs to each own universe, and it's the better for that. The only unifying thing is just the same director... and the recycling of the "purge" animation.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:13 p.m. CST

    MY GOD IT'S FULL OF STARS

    by angelopoulos

    WOW... This is simply incredible. Haters go elsewhere.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:16 p.m. CST

    Asi, know what shit I'm fed up with?

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    The constant revisionist bullshit that makes people mistake 'Aliens' for a bad or dumb movie. It's almost as if the forthcoming release of Prometheus, the dickheaded trashing of Cameron and Avatar, or just the general mindless state of geek fandom, hating on everything and even attacking previous classics as shit, is inducing this kind of garbage. Or it could be that fanboys have been force-fed drivel for so long that they no longer recognise good movies.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:18 p.m. CST

    Alien and Blade Runner are NOT part of the same universe

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Same Scott design aesthetic, but as I've pointed out before, the time lines are all screwed up and narratively illogical and incompatible.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:22 p.m. CST

    updated technology explained

    by angelopoulos

    I think it's safe to assume that the crew of the prometheus are scientists, so get a much nicer ship to toy around on, where as the Nostromo was a trucking rig and just needed a realtime no-frills system on board for basic life support and navigation/communication. We still have no-frills realtime systems aboard aircraft and military vessels, where as other more scientific or luxury class vessels probably have more bells and whistles in some of their systems. I know that's cheesy, but it kind of makes sense?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:24 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    With one notable exception, nobody in her eis calling AELISN a bad movie. And even that guy i'm refering too, his only caveat is that he thinks ALIENS is a bad sequel to ALEIN, not that it's a bad movie per se. and he does make some valid points. Not that i agree, but i can see his point. Otherwise, everybnody has taken great pains to stress that they love ALIENS. But that they consider ALIEN superior. Nobody is pissing on ALIENS. But tehre was a time when it was fashionable to almsot piss on ALIEN, and people didn't do so out of some modicum acknowldge that without ALIEN there would be no ALIENS. In that regard, the ALIEN fans have been showing far more respect, civility and cortesy toward ALIENS then what a great number of ALIENS fans have been showing to ALIEN. And if some ALIEN fan gets worked up in it's defense and seems to make short subject of ALIENS, i say, they did earned it. After all this years of ALIEN being seen and treated as the poor cousin of the family, the top just blew. Consider it the steam that has been accumulated all this years popping out.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:25 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    There's a suggestion that you feel that there's something of an "emperor's new clothes" about BR (and about Alien). I think I agree with you to some extent. But then, I am always extremely skeptical of the kind of people who try to bring Freud to bear upon every movie. It's the wrong framework of analysis in many cases, and also has its basis in pseudoscientific writings of dubious academic merit that few psychologists have given credence for decades. What I would say though, is that to some extent the analyses of plot and of character arcs are not really the right ones to use in the case of Alien and BR. Those movies are about world immersion more than anything else. Not to the *exclusion* of everything else, I should emphasise: I do love the stories of both, and great direction is evident in both movies to heighten the emotional kick of many moments. But more than anything else, Scott throws you into a world that seems entirely convincing, in almost all respects, and THEN layers a fascinating tale on top of it, with things you've never seen before. (Things you people wouldn't believe.) I thank that is Scott's #1 skill, or certainly it was at the time. Together with Cobb, Mead, Giger and Giraud, he built two narrative universes that were utterly compelling, and mesmeric in their realization. Maybe that's why they bear so many repeat viewings: you can tire of a story more quickly than you can tire of a world.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:26 p.m. CST

    Sorry

    by Keith

    "I thank that is Scott's #1 skill" No, I *think* that is Scott's #1 skill, but I, err, give thanks for it.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:27 p.m. CST

    'ALIENS will look as anacronistic as disco'...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    You are not helping your case with nonsense like that. Despite claims that Aliens is dated, I watched it fairly recently (check out the superb new blu-ray transfer) and it holds up spectacularly well. It still remains the gold standard for intensity and action thrillers. Nothing that has come out since has beaten Aliens in these respects, and it kicks the living shit out of anything released today. Logically, then, it CANNOT be dated. Even in terms of 80's action movies, the film betrays none of the horrible Bruckehimer inspired MTV hints of the age - it's slow paced build (like the original), and well staged action and lack of jingoism sees to that). And of course, it has inspired awhole legion of films and video games, from Halo to The Matrix. It sinfluence is so pervasive, both in its design of military equipment or just in terms of its style and feel as a a narrtive, it is almost taken for granted. Even D9 owes a LOT to Aliens, and Blomkamp admitted this. In order for Aliens to look 'anachronistic' it would have to be bettered or improved on by others of its kind. It hasn't. Not to mention the story and themes are rock-solid and will always be timeless and exciting. Now Alien, I would agree is pretty timeless, but NOT flawless. The FX during the climax do NOT hold up, and yes the cast clearly are dressed and groomed in the manner of the 70's.

  • If all else fails, at least PROMETHEUS will have achieved something very good, to put ALIEN back in the pedestal where it belongs. For that alone PROMETHEUS deserved to have been made.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:29 p.m. CST

    Yes, i guess i kinda like ALIEN.

    by AsimovLives

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:32 p.m. CST

    turd, RE: It's eye candy with substance to back it up...

    by Astronut

    You ask: And the substance is what, in your opinion? My answer: It feels real. Space feels real. The planet feels real. The derelict feels real. The Nostromo feels real. The crew come off as if they were real and not a bunch of actors. While watching the movie, it's as if you were a fly on the wall, watching these seven crew members go about their business. The actors sell it to us more convincingly than probably 90% of any group of actors I've seen on film. For me, the eye candy in this film = the beauty, the detail, and the scope. The substance = the plot line and the level of realism. You can make beautiful stuff. Look at Avatard. Beautiful! But it has no real substance. It is a hollow prop with nothing inside. So yeah, A L I E N = eye candy + substance ALIENS = eye candy + a good, entertaining attempt at substance What's not to get? You would have to concede that the level of pure realism is head and shoulders above that shown in the sequel. With the exception of a couple of effects flubs, A L I E N feels 100% real.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:34 p.m. CST

    Alien and Barry Lyndon...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    I'm sure Scott WAS influenced by Lyndon (and Kubrick in general) when it came to his visual style. Indeed, The Duellist was heavily inspired by BL. But the key difference is depth. Barry Lyndon isn't a conventional genre picture (and for all its fine presentation, so is Alien which its fans - I am one - wil have to accept. Aliens is too, of course, but then I'm not pretending that that one is something other than what it is). BL is a brilliant and uncompromising story far beyond its stunning visuals, with superb insight and probing into human nature, and off-kilter in its use of its style and structure and mood to support and exemplify its themes. In essence, it uses its visual style as a storytelling tool. Alien uses its style as mood and atmosphere only. Alien is wonderful, but not in the same class as BL as a piece of art. Its time the geeks learned the difference.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:35 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by WeylandYutani

    In regards to your point about Weyland-Yutani knowing about the life form and why they sent terraformers there anyway and why Burke requested that the company send someone out to inspect the site instead of a special science team... I assume that W-Y is like a General Electric only x1000 and is not only a corporation but it is also some kind of supra-government. I assume that they have many divisions and even is a parent company to a series of subsidiary outfits. It would be like GEs Jet Engine Division sharing information with its home appliance division... on a purely day to day business level there is no reason for them to share information unless someone asks - especially if it is 60 years old. I assume the same thing happened at W-Y. Sure somewhere in the bowls of their Bio Weapons Division there is a file about some hostile life form that was encountered on some rock called LV-426 some 60 years ago. But if it was not deemed profitable to pursue the issue, the file/data on the Nostromo incident was shelved and forgotten. And who knows what the company is keeping from its own people... do you think in the case of the BP oil spill that the guys on that rig knew about the safely violations and citations that British Petroleum had been hit with in the years leading up to the disaster? Who knows what Van Leuwen and his executives knew or did not know. Perhaps they were telling the truth that there had been several surveys of LV-426 done and they turned up nothing... or perhaps the reports that Van Leuwen saw had the bits about the xenomorph redacted. Or perhaps he was flat out lying. There is definitely a bureaucratic and even a conspiratorial quality to "The Company" where profit is their only motive. Otherwise, they would have told the Nostromo team "collect this thing on LV426, but be careful 'cause we think it has teeth." Instead they only informed MOTHER and Ash - who they programmed. To my mind it is not much of a stretch at all.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:36 p.m. CST

    To clarify...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    This sentence: ' Barry Lyndon isn't a conventional genre picture (and for all its fine presentation, so is Alien which its fans - I am one - wil have to accept. It should have read: 'Alien, for all its fine presentation, IS (a conventional genre movie), and its fans will have to accept this.'

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:40 p.m. CST

    Re: Turd

    by SK229

    Yeah... and The Godfather is just a silly gangster picture. Or at least that's what everyone involved thought it would be based upon the novel and the studio's intentions. It wasn't until the casting, rewriting, music, editing, and all the happy accidents and inspired moments came in and ruined those intentions that it turned into a masterpiece on all levels. Genre doesn't mean simple. Most of the best movies ever made can be called genre. And what the hell is a straight drama anyway? A retelling of Shakespeare? His language was the greatest ever, but the stories themselves were pretty pulpy, once you strip them down. Aside from that, what? I guess the kinds of movies Sam Mendes would make? Did Kubrick ever make a straight drama? Has Scorsese? Maybe Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore, but everything else seems to fall into some kind of genre category that's been done badly many times and then brought up to the level of art. In recent years, just as an example, There Will Be Blood... Paul Thomas Anderson has said on multiple occasions that he sees it as a monster movie. That might be partially in jest, but I'm sure as a measuring stick, he used the tropes of a monster movie quite often. And I think the reason Scott says that is because he has that syndrome of a director who hit it out of the park the first few tries and can't understand why people don't fawn over his more recent work the same way when, from his point-of-view, the recent work is far deeper and more complex and SHOULD resonate deeper than his silly horror picture that was only seeking to entertain. But they just do not, for the most part, and that's something nobody can explain... sometimes all the little parts come together to make the whole greater. I get the feeling the best directors always plan for and want the whole to be greater than the sum, but rarely does it happen. Spielberg and Kubrick and early Scott are a few examples of people who seemed able to keep doing it over and over again during parts of their career. To try to explain what's there, why Alien is a thing of beauty that resonates is the job of a critic. Thank God I'm not a critic... I actually feel sorry for critics. I get to just enjoy the fucking thing with fellow fans and we all know how we feel about it and that the feelings are probably the same even if it seems impossible at times to put it into words. Even if we're all wrong, who really gives a shit? Can't we just enjoy it and annoint it in ways others may not? Does it really take something away from everyone else when there's just so much shit out there... hell, there's so much shit in life itself that the fact we get one movie like Alien, let alone a few dozen of them is one of those things that can make life bearable. Simple enjoyment. Anyway, once a film is done, it doesn't matter what the creators say, it really belongs to the audience at that point. The feelings towards it do, anyway. Whatever Scott says, there are things at work in Alien that suggest a helluva lot about our place in the cosmos. And it's all purely through the aural and visual experience of the film, it has nothing to do with words, as the best of cinema SHOULD be. It's classy because, REGARDLESS OF WHAT SCOTT SAYS, he wasn't trying to make a fun haunted house jaunt... yeah, that's why you cast those all those amazing actors, right? Cause they were all so great in Sleepaway Camp 4 and I Spit On Your Grave. No, he went and put together the best designers, the best actors, and the best crew because he wanted the genre TO TRANSCEND ITS LIMITATIONS. They say it over and over again - they wanted to take the B-picture concept, as was done with The Exorcist, The Godfather, Jaws, The French Connection, hell, even Dog Day Afternoon is about a bunch of bumbling bank robbers at its core... and they wanted to bring it up to the level of an A-picture. At that time, an A picture had a different meaning than it does now and different than it did shortly after 1980. Fortunately, they took it to a whole other unanticipated level and we've been reaping the benefits ever since. Not to jump into the Alien vs. Aliens debate, I love both films, but Alien wins in my book... Aliens I'd place in the same category as Die Hard - two of the greatest action movies ever made. Alien, FOR ME (so as not to confuse this statement with your own opinions, as others so often do), falls into a category called the greatest movies ever made. I put it right up there with Lawrence of Arabia, The Bicycle Thief, Barry Lyndon, Ikiru, and Raging Bull. But I fucking LOVE Aliens... and Die Hard is something I'm actually starting to believe may belong in the greatest movies category, so there's always hope for Aliens on my list. I think it's really fucking hard, if not impossible to write something that great where all the parts work on the audience like the best ride of their lives... the older I get, the more I appreciate how difficult that is to get right, and Die Hard is basically a perfectly scripted film, perfectly told.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:40 p.m. CST

    Asimov

    by Keith

    "But tehre was a time when it was fashionable to almsot piss on ALIEN, and people didn't do so out of some modicum acknowldge that without ALIEN there would be no ALIENS. " I don't remember that myself. I've not encountered active disrespect of Alien. But I certainly remember a time when it was fairly standard to assert that Aliens was an example of "a sequel that tops the original". I thought so myself at the time. But the ageing thing (and the Belucci/Turner analogy, ha ha) is completely right: Aliens now looks like an older movie than Alien. In places (not all places by any means) it looks like a really upmarket TV movie. I still think it's a terrific movie and a terrific sequel. But "Alien" looks like it could have been made yesterday. (btw I think it's still routine to assert that T2 is "a sequel that tops the original", and it's my hope and dream that this too will change in time, albeit for different reasons.)

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:43 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    Allow me to clarify, is you please: Visually, ALIENS is getting more and more dated as time goes by. It's impossible to look at it and not realise right away in which decade it was made. Merely from how it looks. That's what i mean to say about looking as dated as disco. The comparison might have been too blunt, but it dirves the point home: visually, ALIENS is already dated. What is not dated about ALEINS is how the movie, besides it's intrinsic qualities as an entertaiment movie, is that it's a veritable lesson in how to make an action movie. That nobody can take it away. Don't ever make the mistake to think i don't love ALIENS. I do, lots. But i love ALIEN more.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:46 p.m. CST

    And I agree on Barry Lyndon...

    by SK229

    purely on a literary, interpretive level, Barry Lyndon is, of course, a MUCH deeper film than Alien. As are some of the other films I mentioned in my own list. But I still believe a film like Alien, one that cinematically sets out to tell that kind of story and puts you in a place you never thought you'd be in such a way as to be wholly convincing in its realism, has a place on that list. For you, for a movie to be considered one of the greatest of all time, it has to work on certain levels intellectually, but I also think that stuff is there in Alien, even if by accident, in the way it suggests things about our place in the cosmos, the idea that there may be things and events that have happened out there an impossibly long time ago... and that it is cold, hostile, and indifferent. To me, those are big concepts that are gotten across very well in Alien, perhaps as well (certainly visually) as they are in 2001.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:48 p.m. CST

    sk229

    by Keith

    Good post.

  • The only thing that might clue one in that ALIEN was made in a past decade is some computer displays and the space visual effects. And on the subject of the computrer displays in ALIEN, in fact i rather prefer themto the usual visual overboard bulslhitt hat most movies do this days. Scott said the idea about the simplicity of the computer terminal visuals were not just due to the limitatiosn of the technology of the time, but also deliberate in that the porpose is to be merely functional. Which makes sense. To wit: Usually, Hoylwood always has a tendency to put flashy computer visuals intheir mvoie's computer displays. Nowdays it's the hologram/3D visualisatiosn that's fashionable. But that's merely show off bullshit. and it even amkes the mvoies look more dated just a few years down the line. Simplier visuals like shown in ALIEN are always actual because if their functional simplicity. Like how you would see in a jet fighter display. In them, the displays are simplicity itself. Because they show just the info that's needed and nothing else. No show off animations to distract the pilot. To civilians it might look like gibberish, but to a taineed man it packs volume sof suseful information in a non-distracting way, without visual pollution to create misreadings. As such, ALIEN in that regard is still timeless as well. The computer displays in ALIEN just show what the crew needs, and they are traiend professionals to read all those readings and know what's going on without over-explaning distractions. Ridley Scott understood that. He also understood that with that appraoch he was helping make that movie gained a timeless quality which time, as of today, proved him right.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:55 p.m. CST

    Astronut, you are referring to stylistic trappings only

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Yes, Aline does feel, at times, like a quasi-doucmentary, particularly the scenes of the crew sitting around eating and shooting the shit. But that's just an approach, and not content of any description, thiough I certainly like the styel (and it could have been taken further). As for plot - the plot in Alien is nothing special. It carves a conventional path. After the crashed derelict sequence, with its Lovecraftian lip service, we are not presented with a Solaris or 2001 one style psychological science fiction plot line, but ten little indians in space, with a monster stalking the crew like slasher victimes. As old and crude as the hills - but with top-notch execution. In terms of feel,Aliens feels pretty 'real' itself, though, continuing the gritty aesthetic of the originla. It expands the real world feel of the roiginal, showing civilain quarters and the military wing. Just look at scenes like Ripley in her apartment on Gateway for example. Aliens is slow paced itself, with nothing happening for over an hour, just like the originalAll the equipement feel relaistic. The soldiers feel like a real unit. What is this version of Aliens you watched where things are super stylized and uber-slick like a mikey Bay film? You can debate Alien's merits over the sequel in terms of its art direction, etc., but Aliens is an excellent and faithful continuation of this aesthetic, and there is no great chasm of difference on nay noitable level when it comes to these aspects in both films. The fact that some people seem to be taking the negative connotations of action movies, and erroneously applying them to Aliens when they are in fact not present in the movie, seems to be what is creating this false impression. Perhaps they just haven't seen the film for awhile or are remembering it incorrectly. (P.S Regarding 'Avatard' (didn't that ridiculous attempted insult die out amongst the haters about five minutes after the damn thing was released?) - nope, there is plenty of substance, allegory and visual metaphor and themes in that one as well. Don't make me go there -again.)

  • BUT there is that one single set that seems anachronistic, which is the "Mother" room. That alone now looks like something from another era.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 4:57 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by Darth_Kong

    My feelings on AVATAR are just this. It's not my movie. I don't care whether it's GOOD, BAD, or UGLY it just isn't my movie. What I do see when I watch AVATAR though is I wish some of the effects technology had been around when Cameron made ALIENS and I saw a few concepts and ideas used better in AVATAR that I wish he would have used in ALIENS mainly ideas and concepts concerning PHYSICS and the construction of the DROP-SHIP or the SULACO etc. What I'm saying is there are ideas in AVATAR that I wish had been used in ALIENS. It's completely irrelevant of what I think of AVATAR but I'm with you. I love ALIENS but I LOVE ALIEN WAY MORE. I can see stuff in ALIENS that I want to be fixed in terms of execution of concept but I don't want anything changed in ALIEN. It's PERFECT for me. Theatrical or Director's Cut.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5 p.m. CST

    sk229 - impossibly long time ago

    by Keith

    Yeah, this is a very apposite observation. I think my single favourite sequence in Alien (from many candidates) is Kane's descent into the egg chamber. Combined with Goldsmith's unusually whistful score throughout the exploration of the derelict, there is a real feeling of eons having wheeled and passed since that ship crashed, a whisper of the ancients still residing in that old hulk. I guess I like that kind of thing. My favourite moment in the whole LOTR trilogy is the Argonath sequence on the river: it gets absolutely right the feeling that a huge, powerful civilization once stood here, but time has removed it from the world, leaving only echoes and remnants. All very "Ozymandias".

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:10 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    ALIEN is conventional in it's nature but not in it's approach. First of all, even though it was not the first movie to mix space and horror, it was the first in which the emphasis was on horror more then space. But it aslo presented a realistic down to earth presentation of space traveling that was closer to less mainstream movies like SILENT RUNNING then to the usual space movie Made up to that time. It was a dirtied 2001. And then there's the visual quality of the movie. It's never too much to point this out. Literally, until ALEIN was made, no othe rmvoie looked like that. And make that double for a space movie. no single other space movie looked like ALIEN did. This is no exageration. It's literal true. All the people involved in writing ALIEN couldn't believe that movie was made form hteir script. Dan O'Bannon, who grew to hate Ridley Scott due to issues from the script and the whole production problems, after he saw the movie he run to Ridley Scott and hugged him, said all was forgiven and thanked him for the happiest day of his life. It's hard for people today to udnerstand the importance and impact of the visuals that Ridley scott brough to ALIEN. Nowdays, it's kinda common for movies and even TV shows to have flashy visuals. At the tiem ALEIN was made, nobody could evne udnerstand why somebody would even bother to give a sophisticated artistic look to a space monster movie. ALIEN is not just a Michael Bay movie which is "pretty" for pretty sake. The visual quality of ALEIN is part of the movie. It is the movie. The movie can't exist without it. And at the time, it was revolutionary like hell. And then what ridley Scott did afterwards? He made an even more beautiful movie with BLADE RUNNER. Talk about beyond the impossible.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:22 p.m. CST

    weylandyutani

    by AsimovLives

    I pretty much agree with everything you said, and subscribe to the notion that lost sof things that occured in ALIEN were forgottenand kept in some file collecting dust at the bottom of some archive at the same place where the corporation keeps the Ark Of The Covenant. It's so easy for a huge corporation to miss stuff. And considering this is a corporation that deals with extra-solar spacetravel and is multi-divisional, it means that any huge corporation today would be dwarfed by it's immensitude. and as anybody who ever worked in any big institution or firm knows, the burocracy if just monstrous. The easiest thing is for soemthign to get lost in all the shufffle, even if it's properly tagged and archived. From ALIENS, i always assumed that Van Newman is bieng pretty honest in his ignorance of what lies in LV-42. Juast ebcause we are constantly in ripley's shoes throughout the whole mvoie deosn't mean she's always correct in her assuptions about the company. It seems to me that Burke is keeping all he knows about the whole Ripley affair with the alien to himself and is not sharing much with his superiors. It always seem to me he's keeping things close to his chest. Probably because Ripley was his charge, he did soem research and found out about the whole thing about the Nostromo. He must have seen an oportunity for a fast rise, but only if he kept things to himself and not share to his superiors so not to have the thunder stolen from him. As he would think as an executive. Basically, th whole deal about the company interested in the aliens as objects for their bio-weaponry division is Burke's own pet project and his own project to get a promotion, it's his golden ticket, it's his chance to the top. I beleive that witht he deaht of Burke in ALIENS, it also died most of the involvement of the company in the alein affair. That's the vibe i get from ALIENS. Which is contradicted by the 3rd movie, i admit.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:29 p.m. CST

    i'll be sad when this gets bumped off the front page...

    by zom-bot.com

    lots of good comments and ideas in here, and even a few usual shit-stirrers are being respectful..lol

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:35 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    I always took it that the "Mother"'s room contaisn a naked mainframe with a simple screen and keyboard. much like the mainsframes of even today. Have you ever been to a mainframe room? It's quite unglamorous. It really is about a bunch of big upright furniture-looking objects that have lights that flashes a lot. And their mainframes are simplicity itself and so are their command displays, even today. So actually, even in that regard, the mvoeiis nott hat dated. If anything the "Mother" room is quite sexed up compared to even contemporanean reality.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:36 p.m. CST

    Wow this looks fucking awesome

    by Rebel Scumb

    and the crappy picture quality actually adds to the 70s feel

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:38 p.m. CST

    darth_kong

    by AsimovLives

    I know what you mean about Avatar. I also know what you mean about "fixing up2 ALIENS. i feel i haven't seen the definitive best version of ALIENS, which for me sits somewhere between the theatrical cut and the director's cut. As for ALIEN, i see the director's cut more like an exercise in style, which is also the approach of Ridley Scott himself. But in the theatrical cut of ALIEN, there's nothing in it i would change. Not one damn thing. How often can we say this about movies?

  • and TOTALLY redeem yourself. I've been a Ridley Scott fanatic ever since I first saw Blade Runner when I was 12, I have seen every movie he's ever made and I own 90% of them. He can't make a bad movie in my eyes because everything he makes is always visually stunning and that's why I go to movies, I want stunning visuals and moments that give me goosebumps and Ridley usually delivers on both. Even his so called "weak" films still are better than 90% of the films released that year...for god's sake A Good Year introduced me to Marion Cotillard and her bruised ass for which I will always be thankful. But like a lot of people I have been waiting for him to get back into science fiction for a while now. I always hoped it would be some kind of return to the ALIEN universe and when Prometheus was announced I was extremely excited. These pictures are so great I can't even fully process them yet. I LOVE what I'm seeing, it appears he has captured the perfect look, obviously we'll have to see what Lindelof came up with as far as a script but Ridley seems happy with it and if Ridley is happy so am I. It appears this production went by smoothly without much studio bullshit so I'm very hopeful for a stellar final product.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:40 p.m. CST

    Asi - love that point about the displays...

    by SK229

    Just made me rethink doing stupid shit like that in this sci-fi short film I'm making. Thank you. Also, Barry Lyndon just played at the Egyptian in Hollywood not too long ago... too bad I don't live in L.A. anymore! But I did see Alien/Aliens double feature there in October of 2009... yes, 30 years and some change after Alien premiered there. One of the top 5 movie-going experiences of my life.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:40 p.m. CST

    theory about the eggs

    by zom-bot.com

    forget what we know for a second about the alien queen laying eggs. forget what we may hold onto about cocooned people becoming eggs. (in absence of a queen, and assuming a single alien warrior will start to nest instinctively) both are still very plausible and should not conflict..BUT... i think we are going to see something very different with 'eggs' as we know them in PROMETHEUS. and i have the odd feeling- who is to say that all facehuggers implant 'xenomorphs'? what if there were different types of eggs on that ship? they only happened to enter the section and trigger the egg with the xenomorph type, maybe...pure chance. all the eggs could look the same, facehuggers could merely be breeding vehicles for any embryo they are programmed for. the Jockeys are genetic wizards, apparently. what if the reason why the alien's birth is so violent and from the chest is because it was never meant for humans? what if it was designed to impregnate a specific animal- maybe not even by the mouth. instinctively the facehugger seeks the 'warmest closest hole'...? the eggs were carefully sectioned out for some reason. maybe they are just inventoried. maybe they contain different embryos, or at the very least, different breeds of alien. not only does the alien take a little of the 'victim' genetics and 'improve' them, but maybe there are different classes of alien..builder, warrior, queen, etc. has the visual difference in the warriors of ALIENS and the single warrior in ALIEN been addressed? why did the ALIEN have a bubble head but the alien drones of ALIENS go domeless and have exposed skull ridges? was it because they were from a specific queen with a specific head structure? a result of living close to the reactor? was the dome on the original ALIEN an automatic response to being born in space? could it contain air for extended periods in the vacuum of space? (like a human helmet)

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:45 p.m. CST

    Avatar was a nice try

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    Cameron really took the first shot at creating an entirely realized digital world...and for the most part he succeeded, the problem with Avatar as many have pointed out is it was a "who cares?" movie. Yeah it was nice to look at and yeah it was well made, but I honestly couldn't care about a group of cartoon aliens, especially when I'm supposed to route against humans?? that did not work for me at all...and add to it a basic story that wasn't even 1 dimensional, it was a zero depth story. It played more like a special effects demo reel than a full fledged movie. So Cameron gets top marks for ingenuity and creativity, but no marks for any of the other far more important aspects of making a movie. It's why I own the blu-ray and have tried to watch it about 4 times now, can't get passed about 30 minutes, the story is just not engaging.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:46 p.m. CST

    raskolnikov_was_framed

    by AsimovLives

    Thanks for the kind words. Though your title did give me pause for a moment, hehe! Well, count me too as a big time fan of ridley Scott. i'm, so sinc ei first saw BLADE RUNENR in a rerun in 1987. I was 16 thenm, and life was never the same for me after that. Ridley Scott became my god just because of one movie. and then ALIEN happened. And THE DUELISTS. I think nobody can truly call hismelf a Ridley Scott fan and not love THE DUELISTS. I'm sure you will agree with me on that. I'm positive you know what i mean. I'm suprised that you were surpised that i love ALIEN as much i do. I though that would be pretty much a given for anybody who knews me around here. I never see myself as the international man of mystery type, even in here, you know?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:47 p.m. CST

    The Mother room

    by Keith

    I don't have a problem with the Unix-style console. It's the extraneous flashing Christmas tree lights on the wall that seem very 1970s. They appear to have no purpose.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:47 p.m. CST

    Cameron's best movie?

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    Is The Abyss btw

  • ... now i'm quite enthusiastic. I'm making a huge effort to not let myself get carried away with all the new stuff that's been revealed... but i'm not suceeding. I haven't been this excited by a movie-to-be since INCEPTION.

  • Sentry guns: good. Jorden family in lunar rover: bad.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:52 p.m. CST

    I wasn't surprised you liked ALIEN

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    I was surprised how much you LOVE Alien. I don't comment too much on the talkbacks here, but I read almost all of them. I obviously know you from your epic J.J. Abrams rants and I think you don't really give him a fair shake. It becomes redundant sometimes with all the Jar Jar stuff but hey you like what you like. Another discussion for another day haha. But yeah when it comes to ALIEN and this upcoming movie I'm stoked to find some common ground with you and it seems a lot of people here. I have been reading this talkback now for about a day and decided to finally jump in before it's booted off the front page. It depresses me every time I see the date and realize we still have over 10 months for Prometheus...can't get here soon enough

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:56 p.m. CST

    Cameron's best movie

    by Keith

    For me, it's The Terminator. Single best genre movie of the 1980s imo (and that is a tough, tough contest to win). It works both as a lean, efficient chase movie and as a beautiful, sad, poetic, philosophical story about determinism and (emergent) fate.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:58 p.m. CST

    yeah the ALIENS theatrical vs director's

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    I hadn't watched the theatrical cut in a long time until recently, and when I did I had forgotten how much had actually been cut out. I think you need the colony scenes because without them the pacing is off. It's literally "how many colonists"? Oh I dunno whatever number of families...next scene, hey we lost contact with the colonists...it almost made me roll my eyes and go of course you did...it just seemed too quick, when the colony stuff broke that up and made it seem like more time had passed for Ripley since the meeting besides just later that night...and yeah why take out the sentry guns? I also liked the scene with Newt's family because you sympathize with her more knowing it was her father that brought the wrath to the colony and she actually saw the face hugger on him

  • I made friends with a former enemy, and i'm so happy for that. I really gfeel i have gained an nstant cool friend. Yes, that's you, astronut. And it's alldue to you,because it was you who offer the peace pipe, from which i took great pleasure in pipe it down. I have read lots of interesting and intelligent posts from lots of cool people. I have read true passion for film of the likes it's so rare to see in the other talkbacks. Not smart-arsery but genuine love and passion for a movie, and not just ALIEN but others that were also referenced in direct or indirect association. I have read posts from people with other opiniosn in which where presented inteligently and with great civility and respect. Which i find not only inspiring and humbling. I fall to my knees in admiration. I even felt i have somewhat raised above my usual level, and poured my heart and soul in all honesty, in the pure joy that is to share my mind with others. Simply put, this talkback is AWESOME! Thank you, thank you so very much. You guys are the greatest. Thank you all. I'm getting all emotional here. I think i have to go now. i'm going to bed, and i'm going tp pop my DVd of THE MAN WHO FELL TO EARTH, just to keep with the goove of smart cool 70s SF movie, of which i aso include ALIEN. Yeah, a double feature of ALIEN and THE MAN WHO FELL TO EARTH, that would be sweet!! See you all tomorrow, compadres. Tchau.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 5:58 p.m. CST

    think i need to go buy ALIEN tonight

    by zom-bot.com

    i'm ashamed i don't have it- but there are a lot of flicks i don't own because they are on TV so much- and even if edited, i find them comforting and they come on at just the right times in my life. but there is no good reason i don't own it. i guess i've never seen it for sale on it's own...it's always in a three or four pack now, and frankly i don't want the last two alien flicks, and i saw ALIENS so much as a kid i never need to see it again unless something in prometheus will trigger the need.

  • Tchau, compadres. Até amanhã.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:04 p.m. CST

    hey asimovlives:

    by zom-bot.com

    tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka......

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:04 p.m. CST

    The Reason Why I Like The Abyss The Best Of Cameron's Work

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    is because it was basically Cameron's Alien without the monster movie part, it had the best atmosphere of any Cameron film to date, it was mysterious and creepy as hell, it might have helped that the Ocean scares the shit out of me so when they are diving down to the sub at the beginning of the film that still to this day creeps me out beyond belief. and while Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio was really annoying in the beginning I liked how my feelings for her change over the course of the film, she has a really good arc as does Ed Harris. Plus Michael Biehn is always awesome. It had a sense of mystery and awe that no Cameron film has ever touched...I almost wished he had approached Aliens the same way.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:06 p.m. CST

    Alien Blu-ray

    by Keith

    I bought this a couple of months ago, as a stand-alone. I had assumed it would have lots of good extras on it, but it didn't. Is it only the "quadrilogy" mega-pack that has all of the cool documentaries et al?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:11 p.m. CST

    The Anthology Set Is The Best One I Think

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    the making of docs on all 4 Alien films are extremely in depth and the one for Alien is awesome. You'll definitely watch all 4 though, and you'll get really pissed when you find out who was originally in talks to direct Resurrection before they hired ol frenchie to make a joke of it...psst it was Danny Boyle...HUGE missed opportunity there to have an amazing director who has gone on to do great things at the helm of each flick...not to totally kill Jean-Pierre Jeunet but after Resurrection I think it's not un fair to say he hasn't done....much Scott Cameron Fincher Boyle would have been awesome if those had been the four directors

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:21 p.m. CST

    Cameron's best film

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    is Aliens. And specifically the longer, director's cut. On a level of pure excitement, or sustained intensity, no film has came close. The final forty minutes are possibly the greatest pure action direction in cinema history. Those are no small potaotes. Add in the endlessly quotable lines, memorable characters, and emotional heart of the film, plus the fact that it was one of the first films to bring concepts from science fiction novels and anime into the mainstream - the military in space, robotic exoskeletons, etc., and you have a true great. It's a film that 'geek' genre cinema was invented for. And I mean that as a true compliment, and not a backhanded one.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:25 p.m. CST

    I would rank Cameron's films like this

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    and I'll probably get heat for what I put at #2 but sue me 1. The Abyss 2. Titanic 3. Aliens 4. Terminator 2 5. Terminator 6. True Lies 7. Avatar 8. Piranha 2

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:26 p.m. CST

    The Abyss is a great film...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    but it's just a little uneven to rank among the top tiers. And it climaxes too early with the whole drowning/ rescuitation sequence, which is more powereful than waht follows. Also, the climax, even in the special edition, was the one time that Cameron bit off more than he could chew, FX-wise and ambition-wise. Those wave effects are okay, but I'd like to see a Blade Runner-esque Final Cut where Cameron replaces them with modern digital water FX.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:27 p.m. CST

    My feelings on The Abyss

    by Keith

    I saw it opening week in the UK, 1989, Odeon Leicester Square. Read the Card novelization as well. Had the comic books. I've always liked it. But I've never loved it. I don't think the ending works fully. It has some amazing sequences, though. Lots of good stuff. In many ways I think it's the last great practical effects movie. Of course, ironically, it's also the movie that, more than any other, heralded the CGI revolution, with all the tech developed for the water pseudopod sequence. I think the director's cut improves the ending. But it still doesn't really have anywhere to go after Coffey's departure. Also something to look out for: the film has numerous similarities to "2010". Make a list and count 'em off.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:27 p.m. CST

    Speaking of the eggs, you know what I think we might see...?

    by Astronut

    For PROMETHEUS I think we might see the eggs jetisoned off by the millions or shot down on to a planet's surface via a giant chain gun or cannon. Like, maybe the cannon/telescope thing we see in A L I E N...? Maybe? I've had this pictured in my mind ever since I saw the initial spy shot of the giant archway set. Anyhoo, just a thought.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:33 p.m. CST

    My Cameron ranking

    by Keith

    1. The Terminator 2. Aliens 3. The Abyss 4. Titanic 5. Avatar 6. True Lies 7. T2 I'm not counting Piranha as really his movie. And, yes, I know most people like (love) T2. I don't. Never have, never will. I just dislike it too much *as a sequel* to assess its merits as a movie in its own right. I think it's a dreadful sequel, even though so many sequences in the movie are super-slick. Just my opinion.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:35 p.m. CST

    yeah I get that The Abyss won't be many people's favorite

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    but something about it works for me...it must just be my fear of the ocean because the ending when he is sinking into the trench breathing the liquid water makes me feel very claustrophobic and nervous, I actually get that feeling the entire movie and I love getting that feeling

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:43 p.m. CST

    I hope Scott incorporates elements of Aliens into Prometheus...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Just to piss of the Aliens haters, who will no longer be able to try and retroactively wipe Aliens out of canon.... In all serious, though, I hope that he does including, or at least hinting at, the creatures/ bio weapons/ whatever they turn out to be using the Queen and a hive concept as a means to propagate their life cycle. And it would seem that the fact that WY are to have colonised different worlds through terraforming that Scott is acknowledging Aliens (which he regards well, as does Giger who praised the Queen design). Perhaps we will see hints of military or colonial marines also (Noomi Rapace's character was rumored to be a marine). Perhaps they could even fit in Cameron's concept of minature albino 'worker' aliens that would service the queen, and which were dropped after early drafts of Aliens due to cost/ technology.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:47 p.m. CST

    Hehe threads like this are why I keep coming back to AICN

    by AlienFanatic

    Days later the topic is still raging. Now, of course the thread is about 75% Asimov and Astronut, but still there's a lot of passion here ;)

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:48 p.m. CST

    I don't get the sense people want to wipe Aliens from canon

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    I think some people just prefer Alien...I really think that's all it is

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:51 p.m. CST

    My ranking of Cameron's movies...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    1. Aliens 2. T2 3. Avatar 4. The Terminator 5. The Abyss 6. Titanic 7. True Lies I'm sure some people will blanche at putting Avatar above the original Terminator, but fuck 'em. As for Ridley Scott, his top five movies in my opinion would be 1. Alien 2. Blade Runner 3. KoH director's cut 4. Gladiator 5. The Duellists Funny how he made two undeniably great movies but at least two thirds of his output is mediocre. Cameron has done far less, but even the least of his movies is none-the-less very good (True Lies being light-weight but hugely entertaining). Scott's worst films - GI Jane, Hannibal, A Good Year, etc. are absolutely dreadful.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:54 p.m. CST

    Yeah, why the Alien vs. Aliens debate? It is possible to love both

    by Brian Hopper

    Alien and Aliens. I do. Alien is clearly a brilliant work of cinematic art, and as the years go by the term "classic" applies more and more. Aliens is certainly one of the best action films ever made. It's a different kind of "great" from Alien. Saw it the first weekend it came out in Westwood and it's impossible to describe how exciting it was to that audience. One of the great thrill-ride movies, and unusually thoughtful and thematically coherent for an adrenaline-rush film.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 6:58 p.m. CST

    Alien director's cut....

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    I've seen a few people in this talkback give praise to it, but it really isn't a 'director's cut' at all. Fox pushed Scott to create it as a marketing angle for Alien's theatrical re-release in 2004. He himself prefers the original cut. The re-instated egg sequence, in particular, makes no sense the way its been reinserted, with Ripley soemhow ending up in the chamber with Dallas and Brett for no reason at all during the countdown to the Nostromo's destruction. Unlike BR, where the Final Cut was the definitive one, Alien was already perfectly done first time around.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:08 p.m. CST

    yeah that was my main problem with Avatar as well

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    the world looked cool but it didn't look real, so everything that happened while in it didn't affect me at all...I just didn't care...I cared more for the random cartoons in Toon Town in Who Framed Roger Rabbit than I did for these "photoreal" computer creations in Avatar....that's why I am really excited that Ridley did almost all of Prometheus with sets and in camera and not against some massive green screen

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:08 p.m. CST

    Alien vs Aliens debate

    by Keith

    For me, it's no different from having a debate about e.g. "Was Jefferson or Adams the greater US president?" By espousing the virtues of one passionately, it doesn't mean you're trying to diminish the other. It's more an opportunity to explain what it is that you think constitutes true greatness, and why your preferred candidate has more of it than the "opponent". You could back the Jefferson corner in that debate even while acknowledging that Adams was among the finest of men.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:14 p.m. CST

    Cameron never 'caved to media pressure about violence'

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    or political correctness. More unsubstantiated invention. He'd had th idea for T2 back in the mid-80's and Arnold was actually opposed to it at first, thinking that his audience would want to see him 'kill'.This has been corroborate dby many sources. Personally, the idea that the movie is built around a Terminator that doesn't 'terminate' - without sacrificing the charcter's integrity or penchant for brute force and violence - is one of the most subversive and amusing things about it to me. Quite brilliant. Here's another thing - is the fact that Prometheus is highly likely to be PG-13 not disturbing to anyone else? Yes, the pictures look good. But it's going to be all for naught if we get another PG-13 sanitised flick here. And given the subject matter, and the lineage of this series, anything less than R will be disastrous. Has Scott lost his balls?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:18 p.m. CST

    Having a kid in a film is nothing to do with 'Disney'...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    and certainly not when you're making R-rated films. Aliens also had a child actress. In both cases, the films' themes revolved around parental bonds (which is a common them in Cameron's films anyway, and likely to continue when he gets to making Battle Angel). That's a distinct thing from putting a kid in a film to sanitise the material or to attract a younger demographic.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:18 p.m. CST

    HEY, ASIMOVLIVES...

    by Astronut

    tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka PHHPLLLPPLPP TOOOOO-OOOOOOT

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:19 p.m. CST

    it's not highly likely

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    it IS gonna be PG-13. which is fucking weird because these photos sure look like Alien.

  • there have been very profitable R rated films, while they are mostly comedies, I think if the first cut Ridley shows to Fox is perfect, even if it's likely to receive an R rating I bet Fox caves...Gladiator was a huge hit and R...but that was also Dreamworks which is a studio I trust a lot more to leave the creativity to the creative people...the way they hamstringed Fincher on Alien3 was a disgrace

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:20 p.m. CST

    they being Fox

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

  • For more than two years he would get on my last nerve regarding his hatred for Jar Jar Abrams (his nickname for him, not mine) and all things NuTrek. Seemingly, Asi would work his NuTrek hatred into anything and everything he could. But. He showed a different side recently. Asimov, thanks for being so cool. I guess I should take my own advice more often; I have told my kids 100 times that it is easier to love than it is to hate... it's true. Anyhow, take care, Asimov. TTYS!

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:33 p.m. CST

    Avatar's greatest accomplishment WAS that it made you feel

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    an emotional connection to essentially CGI characters. Not only did they look convincingly photo-realistic, the performances had heart and soul, and didn't cross over into that dead-eyed uncanny valley zombie area. Thus you felt outrage and sadness in the narrative when the characters were wronged and their world destroyed, even though they were essentially ones and zeroes. The world has a whole also looked tangible and real - again an accomplishmnt because of the heavy use of CGI, and proof against the lie that CGI is cold, distant and artificial. Not in the right hands it isn't. The whole world of Avatar was warm and emotive and lyrical, inspiring genuine awe. That was the film's most surprising and unexpected quality. Definitely Cameron's most beautiful movie. All this is pretty much inarguable. Avatar was hinging on a knife edge, where if it didn't work on that level people would have just took it as an expensive cartoon (as many of the haters crowed about on seeing the first, unfinished trailer) and the film would have flopped . But it did work, and that is why it was a success. People took it as real, living and breathing world and a 'realistic', serious film. You can like or dislike the movie all you want, but it's undeniable that that was how trhe majority received it.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:36 p.m. CST

    looks amazing

    by Ivor Heath

    cannot wait to see this, 12 months is going to drag

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:36 p.m. CST

    My List of Ridley Scott films

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    I want to present this list just to troll you Blade Runner fanboi nerds. It is truly how I feel. 1. Gladiator 2. Alien 3. GI Jane 4. Thelma and Louis 5. Kingdom of Heaven 6. Robin Hood 7. American Gangster 8. Body of Lies 9. Hannibal 10. Legend 11. Blade Runner Might as well do Cameron too. 1. Aliens 2. Everything else 3. Avatard

  • that would SUCK. hopefully this will be bumped off the list by MORE prometheus news. though i'd settle for batman news.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:40 p.m. CST

    I found Avatar very engaging

    by Keith

    I didn't find that I wanted to see it again, though. Not that my opinion of it changed in retrospect; it's just that nothing in it stuck in my mind making me want to see it again. To some extent, that may just be me getting older: you never have those passionate love affairs with movies you had in your teenage years. But there have been SOME movies in the last decade that I've wanted to see again (and indeed have bought on Blu-ray). For whatever reason, Avatar wasn't among them. Maybe I just felt that without 3D it wouldn't be nearly as much fun? Great cinemagoing experience, though.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:43 p.m. CST

    PG-13 versus R

    by Keith

    What if its subject matter simply doesn't require an R rating, though? I mean, the aforementioned "The Abyss" wasn't an R, because it just wasn't that kind of movie. People seem to be assuming there'll be bitey monsters and human maimings in the plot of Prometheus, but...what if there aren't?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:45 p.m. CST

    Re-inserted egg sequence in Alien

    by Keith

    I don't really mind it one way or the other in terms of content, but my main objection to it is one that I believe was shared by Scott when he first cut the movie together in 1979: it disrupts the pace too much. You're running around frenetically with Ripley, and suddenly you're standing still in that chamber for over a minute. It breaks the flow of the final reel too much imo.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 7:46 p.m. CST

    AICN will ban any further Prometheus news...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    in favor of further glowing reviews of 'Attack the Block'. Cunts.

  • Any movie for adults that wants to be taken seriously should be rated R. The real world is not a PG-13 place. I will be very disappointed if Prometheus is PG-13. What happened to big budget R rated movies anyway? Why can’t we have them anymore? I wanted to see At the Mountains of Madness, damnit.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8 p.m. CST

    mistedarcy, by subject matter I mean

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    the overall dark and sinister tone, the psycho-sexual undertones, and the disturbing and bizarre nature of the Giger-designed alien worlds and races, not necessarily graphic gore -which even the original Alien didn't really have, either. I'm assuming 'Prometheus' contains these elements based on Scott's prior comments, where he described it as a 'really tough, nasty' film and 'the dark side of the moon'. The premise so far disclosed just doesn't sound like something that would be palatable at a PG-13 level at all, on any level, and even the leaked screenshots above reinforce that stance.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:27 p.m. CST

    Scott V. Cameron

    by IamZardoz

    Cameron makes some good movies, Aliens was a good movie, so was the first Terminator and a few others. The Abyss could have been a better movie if there were no shiny happy aliens in it and maybe stuck to the deep ocean exploration/haywire SEAL stuff. Avatar might as well be a Disney cartoon to me. Scott on the other hand has the capability of doing something new and different. Alien and Blade Runner are I believe his best work and I think to of the finest movies of any sort made in the last 50 years. Getting back to eggs, I hope Scott just ignores everything after his movie and just does his story the way he wants. No tying in any other movie storylines, just do his own thing. I trust I will be entertained. Only two movies Im looking forward to, Prometeus and Tinker Tailor.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:29 p.m. CST

    Scott already said that he's filming it with rated R scenes, right?

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:45 p.m. CST

    bumped by news of superman's hair. sigh.

    by zom-bot.com

  • but then again, these Prometheus talkbacks are always the best ones these days. Great to see turd helping out ALIENS. Let me go on record to say that I love Alien and Aliens equally. To me, both films feel like they are in the same fictional universe. I think the key here was that Cameron realized the brilliance of what Sir Ridley created with his masterpiece of sci-fi terror known as Alien, and Big Jim decided to honor that by hiring Ron Cobb as a conceptual designer so that the sets and miniatures would be extremely consistent with the first film. Now, surely Cameron added some new elements and ideas, but overall Aliens works as an equal to Alien because it builds on Alien, but doesn't try to overshadow it. This is evident in the cohesion of the fictional worlds of both films, as well as Cameron being clever to not try to do another single alien hunting people in the dark film, but one with multiple aliens. Thus a film that was of a different genre, but one that also mixed in a healthy dose of the sci-fi/horror of Alien was born. That is why to me, Alien and Aliens stand up next to each other as equals. Alien's naturalistic crew was brilliant, but what Cameron did was also great. Also, adding some more knowledge as to who Ripley was before she went through hell on the Nostromo was a wise move. Keeping her static in Aliens would've been a huge mistake. We got to know a bit more about her by her interactions with Newt, and her desire to save her new surrogate daughter. And on the subject of Newt. What a great character. I don't think a child character in a sci-fi or horror film has been created on the same level as Newt ever, before or since then.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:47 p.m. CST

    Two more set pics...

    by AlienFanatic

    Not really much there, but AVPGalaxy has two more set pics of the egg-shaped canisters and one hallway that's clearly under construction. Just interesting stuff. http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=a73e4fb0a1b80f02811308a8d72c0c41&topic=39795.0

  • Here's the author's FB Page: http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.241655659197140.73194.218947031468003 And it's up for a discounted preorder at Amazon (about $23 for the hardcover). I'm sure it's on B&N and other sites, too, but I'm just an AMZ junkie.

  • of facing the beast again. Alien was more minimal, because they needed minimalism to have enough time and focus on the alien. Aliens worked because now that the alien had been unleashed on audiences, there needed to be a bit more in the character development dept. This is why both films work so brilliantly together as a duology if you will. Ripley survives in both films, but at the end of Aliens she has been through worse, yet comes to a sort of peace, as her life is now about being Newt's mother. Alien, to me was about birth, while Aliens was about motherhood. I think that is brilliant. What really gummed up the works, was Alien 3, the ambitious failure that it is. Even though I can appreciate a lot of what Alien 3 has to offer, it really added nothing that spectacular to the alien mythos, life cycle, or to Ripley. Nothing like the first two films had to offer.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 8:55 p.m. CST

    I'd be shocked if Prometheus isn't PG-13

    by Brian Hopper

    The whole reason to make it (financially) is the hope of turning it into a billion-dollar film internationally, and an R can't do that (or isn't viewed as being able to do it... though the big international success of R-rated Hangover 2 may have them rethinking that). As an aside, what would Alien be rated today? I say the only thing that would make it an R is the chestburster scene, which — even in an age of torture porn crap like Hostel — is still one of the most horrifying things ever put on film. My point is: it still might be possible for Prometheus to rule even if it's a PG-13. That said, I hope it's an R.

  • I loved the Monica Belluci = Alien example, but don't you think that comparing Aliens to an old Kathleen Turner is kinda harsh dude? Like stepping way over the line? How about Aliens is like Diane Lane, for example? But Kathleen Turner? That is just wrong man.

  • I know how those of you feel in regards to the whole Alien vs. Aliens debate. I feel the same way about The Terminator vs. Terminator 2: Judgment Day. Now, I love both Terminator and T2, nearly equally in fact. But in this case, I have to say I like The Terminator just a bit more. I like that it is a bit simpler. The whole trinity of conflict that is Kyle Reese, Sarah Connor, vs the unholy cybernetic demon of Arnold as the T800 terminator is just perfect to me, even though I do also love the family (John and Sarah Connor, along with Arnie) vs. the T1000 in T2. The darker tone of The Terminator. It is just a hair darker than T2. The way the future war flash-forwards seen through Reese's eyes propel the backstory and give us a more personal glimpse into the post nuclear hell that is 2029 L.A. are just more potent to me than T2's epic opening future war sequence. I also love how the photograph of Sarah is shown in the future war, burned, and then ties back into things at the end. That little element just makes the first terminator film stand out a bit more for me. And as much as I love Arnold playing the good guy in T2, having some nice comic relief elements and his whole character arc of learning a bit about what it is to be human... Arnold as the unstoppable assassin of the first film is just so amazing an unique to this day that I can't not give it the gold metal to T2's silver metal. But both are awesome, and I blathered on about this to show that I completely understand where you guys who like Alien over Aliens are coming from. It may happen to be an indirect way by example from a different movie series, but I know what you guys mean. Hopefully this all makes sense.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:12 p.m. CST

    Goddamnit!!!!! This TB has been bumped off the main page

    by lv_426

    It seems that these Prometheus TB's always last about a day at most, then get bumped. Is it because these Prometheus ones end up becoming such epic TB's that the AICN dudes want to get us to move onto new ones?

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:20 p.m. CST

    were still the top count topic

    by zom-bot.com

    as shown in the right column when viewing new TB's

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:24 p.m. CST

    theres a main page?

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    all I look at are the top talkbacks. I sure dont come here for the journalism lol

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:32 p.m. CST

    It absolutely won't be R

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    Yeah Scott will probably make an effort to push his R rated cut, but the studios are not gonna budge. From the looks of these shots, it does look like he got the big budget he was asking for. It's a summer release. The last couple R rated Alien films have been flops. They're gonna try and push this as a PG-13 sci fi action or adventure or rom com or some shit to try and make a profit. Maybe not such bad news. I could see Aliens being PG13 and not losing much impact.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:37 p.m. CST

    raskolnikov_was_framed; I assume you're a Conservative yes?

    by ganymede3010

    I see the same argument from each and every conservative detractor in regards to Avatar.

  • AVP GALAXY link http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=39795.0

  • AVP Galaxy link: http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=39795.0

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:49 p.m. CST

    ganymede3010

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    yeah as far as foreign policy goes and attitude towards the military I am very conservative...as far as social stuff, legalizing weed, gay marriage etc I'm very liberal...I think I'd define myself as more libertarian...I think the government has two roles, protect its citizens and put in place an economic system that gives people the opportunity to succeed, I don't think the government should ever intervene in people's personal lives with regulation over what a person chooses to do in their own home and what a person chooses to do with their money...but my inability to connect with the Navi in Avatar I don't think has anything to do with my political beliefs since I had no problem sympathizing and connecting with the native americans in Dances With Wolves

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:50 p.m. CST

    winona

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    yeah but Aliens would lose about 15 minutes of dialogue, lots of f bombs in that flick

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Ash's blood

    by lv_426

    I always thought it was just what was in the Alienverse's androids. One other thing I liked to postulate was that Ash maybe thought he was a real live human. If you think about it, this type of programming deception would be beneficial for Weyland-Yutani in terms of installing a sleeper agent or mole on a ship. Also, the surprised reaction of Ripley, Lambert, and Parker as to what Ash ended up being, was one of shock. They didn't know, so who is to say that Ash didn't know as well? I actually like this juxtaposition really well. It contrasts nicely with Bishop's android incarnation.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 10:14 p.m. CST

    damn. I do like a lot of F bombs

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:05 p.m. CST

    darth_kong - thanks for the link

    by lv_426

    I am at a loss for words. I don't know what those urns are or what they are for.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:08 p.m. CST

    Cameron has always been anti-military

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    I mean I ranked The Abyss as my favorite Cameron film and that entire film is anti-war and anti-military but it was at least based on some kind of reality...Avatar was the first time Cameron has ever been unfair in his portrayal of the military and to such an extent that I thought it was laughable...but you can find in all his films a certain disdain for military power, maybe with the exception of Titanic and Piranha...I have no problem with it if it's based on some kind of honesty but to think that advanced humans would just carpet bomb some innocent little species without even taking two seconds to give a shit or try another option besides some crazy ass science experiment just didn't ring true to me and took me out of the movie...that's all...end of my talking about movie politics in this talkback unless it's to bitch about Fox wanting to make Prometheus PG-13

  • I think it was mentioned somewhere that the reason for this was that the android would be there as a fail safe against hijackers or in case of some sort of an emergency, or if there was a mutiny or something, the android could probably jack into Mother's system (or whatever computer/AI is running the ship) and take command. I think maybe it was from an interview with Ridley Scott, this tidbit about the android being a fail safe. Anyways, I always liked the idea of a company ship hauling some xenomorph eggs that were recovered from a remote world or another derelict space jockey ship, being hijacked by a crooked salvage crew or mercenaries. After this other crew boards the ship, the android would take over and try to thwart the intruders from stealing the eggs, and thus being exposed to the xenomorph and being used as hosts. Of course, this being an Alien(s) story, the mercs get facehugged and eventually all hell breaks loose. Another cool twist would be the android being just as ruthless and sneaky as Ash was, killing anyone from either crew that threatened the chances of the aliens being killed, blown out the airlock, or in any other way compromised before the ship were to reach its final destination and fall into the hands of Weyland Yutani. Maybe that's not fodder for another Alien film, but it could make for a cool Aliens graphic novel or video game.

  • Aug. 2, 2011, 11:25 p.m. CST

    darth_kong - maybe those urns are like the eggs in a way

    by lv_426

    except they are sort of pods that contain various samples of all the different genetic recipes that the space jockeys have and use. Maybe those urns are fired out of the biomechanoid ships (kinda like some here have suggested that the eggs are launched to a planet's surface) to the surface of a world the jockeys are doing all their god-like terraforming and other things. Maybe there are different strains of xeno_DNA that can be plugged into some other type of biomechanical device to start producing eggs or aliens or other materials? Honestly, I don't know if that really is sensible within the plot of Prometheus. Who knows? I am just throwing whatever comes to mind out there to see what sticks.

  • darth_kong astronut turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy asimovlives Oh shitttttt................. (loads Pulse Rifle).... they're coming out of the goddamn walls!!!!!!!! Fuckkkkkkkkkkkk!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh shit... Harry Knowles is starting to convulse... an alien just burst out of his chest. Quint just got skewered by a xeno's tail. Milky shit is spurtin' outta his neck. Guess what, he's a fuckin' droid man.... Quint's a fuckin' droid... Merrick just blasted five xenos with his smart gun. Oh shit.... acid spraying all over him. Merrick is down goddammit!!!!!!! I'm out of ammo. Shit shit shitttttt!!!!!!!!!!!! Going to grenades. AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Game over man... game over...... :(

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:01 a.m. CST

    Cameron and the military

    by Keith

    I think that Cameron is fascinated by soldiers and military equipment, but distrusts large organizations.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:07 a.m. CST

    Urns

    by Keith

    Scott talked before about liking the concept that the jockey derelict was an interstellar bomber that was lost with its biological weapons cargo aboard. So perhaps the urns are bombs, metal casements for eggs inside. Having said that, this doesn't really tally with having the huge egg chambers inside the craft with the eggs sitting there unencased. Unless they need to be kept in a special environment to be kept alive, and only loaded inside the bomb cases shortly before deployment.

  • That is probably a pretty accurate statement, at least from what I know of how Cameron views the themes of his films. He said something on one of the various T2 DVD releases (there have been a ton over the years) about how he liked the idea of Arnold playing a good/protector terminator in the sequel to illustrate the theme of technology not being evil, but that those in power of it can possibly use it for good or bad. Kinda the notion that a gun is neither good nor evil, but the person who wields it. Anyways, I think this kind of notion of what is the technology being used for and why, is a major theme in a lot of his works... The Terminator / T2 = good vs. evil uses of technology Time travel tech and terminators used by Skynet to send back and kill Sarah and John Connor, but also used by the resistance to send back Reese and T2 Arnold as protectors. Aliens = overconfidence of technology and attempts to tame nature Atmosphere processor bringing breathable air to Acheron, and thus life... but the marines don't respect its power and end up rupturing the cooling systems with their weapons in the hive battle. Also, Burke thinking he can easily impregnate Newt and Ripley and bring an alien specimen back to collect a fat paycheck. Titanic = hubris The overconfidence of the Titanic's designer, funders, and crew... thinking that it is truly an unsinkable ship. Avatar = manipulating a primitive culture with technology vs. understanding and learning to coexist with them Jake Sully being an infiltrator of the Na'vi tribe to force them to move and to gather intel for Quaritch comes into conflict with the science team's efforts to find a peaceful resolution and to find a way to coexist with the Na'vi on Pandora. Also, more of Aliens' disrespect of the natural order because of access to high tech military stuff... so sort of a variation of the Vietnam parallel that Cameron drew on for Aliens.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:45 a.m. CST

    Alien is box office poison

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    they are going to try and trick people into thinking Prometheus is a super hero.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:46 a.m. CST

    genderblender

    by lv_426

    I've thought that they might do something like that too, since the beginning when it was first announced as being titled Prometheus. As far as titles go though, Alien: Prometheus isn't really that bad. I mean, it is clearly the Alien Prequel by the looks of these leaked images. It could be much worse. We might have gotten reboots/remakes of the whole anthology by hack directors with Ripley now being played by some barely pushing-20 year old teeny bopper. I can see it now: Alien: Shadow of the Space Jockey Aliens: Just Another Bug Hunt Alien 3: The Fall of Ripley Alien 4: The Rise of Ripley (instead of Resurrection) and if these were successful, we'd probably get more brilliant sequels... Alien 5: Ripley's Revenge Alien 6: Return of the Space Jockey Alien 7: Dawn of the Planet of the Xenomorphs And don't forget the prequel that fits in between Alien and Aliens... Aliens: The Siege of Hadley's Hope.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 2:02 a.m. CST

    winona_ryders_pussy_juice

    by lv_426

    Then maybe they'll call the sequel Prometheus Rising, and will just make a crazy metafictional adaptation of Robert Anton Wilson's Prometheus Rising? Then again, maybe the Space Jockeys genetically engineered mankind based on the 8-Circuit Model of Consciousness?

  • I don't know what the URNS are either and I don't care. I'm on board. I kinda hope that Prometheus is AMBIGUOUS enough with it's timeline to fit in between A L l E N and A L l E N S. It would be totally cool to fill in that 57 year gap where Ripley is in hypersleep with some kind of story. Something had to have gone on besides just building Hadley's Hope. We'll see.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 5:55 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    Thanks for your last post, friend. I guess we both learned a good important lesson in this talkback, don't you think? tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka PHHPLLLPPLPP TOOOOO-OOOOOOT

  • The more time passes, the more i hate the fucking blue giant cats. The movie's desperate and blunt atempts at portaiting them as noble creatures just had the opposite effect on me. Talk about backlash.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:18 a.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    "To some extent, that may just be me getting older: you never have those passionate love affairs with movies you had in your teenage years." I beg to differ, my friend. There's always some new movie i see recently that spurs my passions, either to hate or love them. There's quite some movies i love and that i'm pasionate about which were made quite recently. VALHALLA RISING is quite a good exmaple of that, a movie i love like my own blood and which i never lost an oportunity to pimp it up in here. As i'm just doing right now. Dude, don't give up, man. i ssume you are a younger fellow them me. I'm 40, and look how passionate i can be about VALHALLA RISING, released in 2010. Age aint shit on this.

  • I seem to recall reading that somewhere. I need a boost this morning. I need to read that quote again. haha (I'm being serious)

  • Damn I need to stop looking at this stuff so I can be surprised. I HAVE ZERO WILLPOWER!!!!!!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:25 a.m. CST

    i bet the urns oranically swell/become eggs.

    by zom-bot.com

    or maybe something infected them? they 'spoiled?'

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:44 a.m. CST

    lv_426

    by AsimovLives

    "but overall Aliens works as an equal to Alien because it builds on Alien, but doesn't try to overshadow it." I donpt think Cameron ever thought he could. Cameron holds ALIEN in very high regard and he has a profund admiration for Ridley Scott and his achievement in ALIEN. I really believe the reason why Cameron went on a very different direction for his ALIENS movie was a deliberate atempt to not compete with Scott's movie, which he felt he couldn't make a movie which could stand in it's shadow or that could compare. So, Cameron took his own direction, made it in a differnt style, used the 50 years time lag to change the look and art direction style, and basically let himself off the hook in a very smart way.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:56 a.m. CST

    lv_426

    by AsimovLives

    The point of my comparison was about faded looks. Diane Lane doesn't have faded looks, she's still quite a stunner. Kathlyn Turner used to be a sutter, a top one. Not anymore. The point of comparison is that ALEINS is very era specific in how it looks. It's an 80s movie through and through. You can't mistake the decade when it was made. On ALIEN, and only going by the looks form the scens with the actors in the Nostromo and in the alien planet, you couldn't guess which decade it was made if you saw the movie cold. You would even think it was made this year. Only the space visual special effects date the movie to it's decade, and nothing else. Thus, it being like Monica Bellucci.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:57 a.m. CST

    I also love THE TERMINATOR more then T2. And i love T2.

    by AsimovLives

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:59 a.m. CST

    zombot

    by AsimovLives

    tikkatikkatikkkatokkatikkachicckatikkachikka PHHPLLLPPLPP TOOOOO-OOOOOOT

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 8:46 a.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by mcgoocain

    It is harder, but not impossible to find the same enthusiasm for great films the older one gets, the same enthusiasm experienced as a wider-eyed teen. With excess exposure to films, and lately, more sameness in films, there is inherently less excitement possible as one film seems too much like the last, or CGI or Shakey cam ruins what could have been a better film. But Ridley's latest seems to hold much promise, and I hope it beomes one of my all-time favorites, as Alien is. I love outer space films, grew up on them, but they are rarely made anymore - at least superior ones. I am 56, so I am a bit jaded. I really want this to be another great film from Ridley - so we can get a lot more space movies in it's wake! I respect your opinions, after seeing your wide taste in films. What did you think of the director's cut of Legend? I found it to be a superior experience - loved how much different it was from the American release with Tangerine Dream music, and I do love Tangerine Dream.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 9:03 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    I never read any interview form Sir Ridley saying he feels the need to out-do Cameron's AVATAR. Such a statement doesn't sound too much like something Ol' Ridders would say. If there's any truth to that, i suspect it might be a coment about the 3d technology and how ther's pressure to futher develop it and push the movies into that type of presentation. Also, to beek pushing the bounderies of what can be done with the technology. That's my interpretation. I could be wrong.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 9:12 a.m. CST

    mcgoocain

    by AsimovLives

    Yeah, Tangerine Dream is cool. Those guys can make cool scores: THIEF, SORCEROR, THE KEEP, RISKY BUSINESS. As for your question above about LEGEND: DIRECTOR'S CUT, well, my answer wil not be exactly short, so bear with me a little, if you please. I assume, from what you wrote, that you are american. I'm portuguese, which means i'm european. This is important to know because in europe the version of the movie LEGEND we got is not that different from the DC version. Basically, the DC is a longer version of the european cut with one or two scenes added. The score was the same. The LEGEND i know always had the Jerry Goldsmith score. Which is brillant. It was only with the DC DVd of LEGEND that i got the oportunity to watch the americna version of LEGEND. And then i finally understood why that movie was so ill regard at your side of the pond. Hell, i would had pissed on the movie as well if that was the only version i knew! But because i only knew the european version, which pardon me is vastly superior to the american, i was always perplexed why the movie was so hated by americans. Later i understood why. The LEGEND: DIRECTOR'S CUT is basically a longer a a bit better version of the version i alsways knew. Which means, i always like the movie, now i like it a little better. In fact, due to it's similiaritudes, the DC can be called the european version, or as i call it, the REAL version of LEGEND. On a side note, i have the Jerry Goldsmith score of LEGEND in a vinyl record i bought back in the day. How cool is that?

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 9:17 a.m. CST

    asimov

    by Astronut

    You know what, you could be right about him referring to out-doing him with 3D.... that might have been what he was getting at....

  • I could have been wrong there.

  • For example, Michael Bay has made a whole career making movies that try to out-do some other movie from some other filmmaker. His earlier movies was him trying ot out-do Cameron, and nowdays he tries to out-do Christopher Nolan. And frankly, all of his movies are shit because of that... among other problems. I think filmmakers should never bother to try to out-do anybody, not even themselves. Just tell the goddam story. Sometimes a movie is better, and more spectacle, if they don't try to out-do anything. Sometimes a movie is better if they even scale down. An example of that? CASINO ROYALE. Compared to DIE ANOTHER DAY, the movie is pretty scaled down. DAD has killer satellites, ice hotels, a invisible aston-Martin, battleing cars, Bond surfing/wind-gliding a glacial wave, a giant airplane, and a climax where half of the korean border is destroyed. Casino Royale is a movie about James Bond preventing an airplane from exploding and then go play poker and crack jokes to the guy who's busting his balls. The most over-the-top thing is a sinking hotel which barely compares to killer satellites, giant airplanes and a border blowing up. And by far it's CASINO ROYALE that gives me the most spectacle. You know what i mean? I hope Ridley Scott doesn't feel no need to out-do AVATAR in his next movie. There's no need of that. Just make a damn good movie, that's all what i ask.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10 a.m. CST

    Urns and Head

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    seem to have debris on top of them which makes me think the site with the giant head and the urns is on earth and underground somewhere and it's where they discover the star charts and tech that allows them to build Prometheus and reach the Space Jockey's...and I don't think that empty platform is the top of the head anymore, I think that's later in the film

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:02 a.m. CST

    Outdoing Avatar

    by Raskolnikov_was_framed

    if Ridley said anything like that knowing what little I do about his sense of humor and dry wit I'd wager that he was just fucking around, tongue in cheek type thing

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:08 a.m. CST

    I agree, asi - although I will say this

    by Astronut

    Spectacle can encompass many things, be it marketing hype, technology used, etc That stuff is side-car. Not important to the strength of the actual film itself. I like the word scope more than spectacle. I do think scope is important. To me, scope is the overall quality of the vision of the director... wide, expansive, impressive sequences... panoramic landscapes... you don't even necessarily need a mammoth budget to have scope in a film. You need a great vision more than anything else. You don't need scope for Harold & Kumar Go to White Castle. But you need it in a film like PROMETHEUS. ALIEN had it big time. Blade Runner had it. Gladiator had it. Avatard had it (although I personally do not like the film). NuTrek had it too (even though I know how much you hate that one, haha). Scope. Not the mouthwash. The VISION. I expect nothing less than that from Ridley and his latest film creation...

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:23 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    Well, Abrams Trek sure did an atmept at scope. you don't blow up two different planets, a star and a whole Federation starfleet if you are not going for that. If anything, that movie has too much scope, which in the end proves to be a problem for the sequel-to-be, if they want to out-do the first movie. That's one of the things i'm critical of that movie.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:26 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    I dig your definition of scope. It does explain why such a little budget movie like VALHALLA RISING, which was made on a 3 million dollars budget, feels more epic and bigger then most blockbusters with with 20-50 times it's budget. While some big budget movie like KING ARTHUR looked like it was shot on somebody's backyard, while it had a nearly 100 million dollars budget.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:26 a.m. CST

    Other films that (love them or hate them) had scope:

    by Astronut

    Star Trek The Motion Picture Superman The Movie The Dark Knight Inception The Matrix 2001: A Space Odyssey (The last one having it by the truckload) Many others of course, but those came to mind just now.

  • The man can't just make a less then beautiful movie. He's just not wired that way. He once said in the audio comentary of THE DUELISTS that it's absurd accusing a movie of being too beautiful. For him, there is no such thing as a too beautiful movie. It's anathema to his way of thinking.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:35 a.m. CST

    astronut

    by AsimovLives

    All those movies you aforementioned i love them a lot. Except Superman, which is more a cas eof enjoyui ng it more then love. Though i do love the first part of the movie set in krypton and Smallville. Had the movie just being that, i would call it a great movie without any irony. As for STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE, it's one of my missions in life in here to promote that movie's awesomeness and greatness for ever and ever and ever. 2001: A SPACE ODDYSSEY is so epic it even has oddyssey in the title. The movie is what it says on the tin.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:38 a.m. CST

    Imagine if you are one of the actors of PROMETHEUS...

    by AsimovLives

    ... and you get a call from your agent and he says "Hey, Ridley Scott called and he wants you t his next movie. And it's an alien movie." Who would say no to that? Who would say no to that? If it happened to me, i would just say yes on the spot. I would play he coffee machine just to be in it.

  • And then there's the rumour of the movie having a lesbian sex scene between Theron and Rapace. Double coolness! It must be good to be the Keanu. The dude has the coolest in the whole world girlfriend right now. Stewart Townsend, you are a loser. Loooooser!!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:57 a.m. CST

    johnny greenwood should score it

    by foree forehead

    the guy that did 'there will be blood'. he's known for that among other things.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 12:43 p.m. CST

    MENTALDOMINANCE should check out ENSEMBLE ECONOMIQUE

    by foree forehead

    their album psychical, if he likes icy synth lines: http://tinyurl.com/2w5umtd

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 12:52 p.m. CST

    mentaldominance, Good to know somebody else also enjoyed THE WARD.

    by AsimovLives

    Yeah, the score was not one of the most memorable things in the movie. But it wasn't bad in itself, so i have no worries about that. And i really love to see Amber Heard in movies. so she being the lead didn't hurt either. The movie is actually smarter then most might give it credit. While the plot itself is not too original, there's thing sin it that actually make more sense then a too fast to judge opinion would indicate. One thing that at the start of the movie puzzled me was why all the female inmates of the ward were all so hot. It was like, evne for holywod standards of casting attractive people, it was just a bit too much. But if we consider how the movie ends, and the explanations given, it actually makes a lot of sense. As for this movie being a Carpenter's giallo, i think evne Carpenter himself said that in an interview. He has always admited that he was very influenced by Argento's thrillers, of which he counts as the most important inspiration fr his HALLOWEEN. and THE WARD is his most blatant and direct hommage to Argento's movies. So, good analisis there, friend.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:01 p.m. CST

    All I know is, I ain't leaving this TB until a new one appears

    by Astronut

    A new one for PROMETHEUS.

  • The reason why i think so is because SOURCE CODE has this very cool movie score which is very reminescent of the scores composed by Michael Small for such 70s paranoid thrillers like THE PARALAX VIEW or the later THE HIDDEN CHAMBER. It was a great idea by Chris P. Bacon and Duncan jones to have their SOURCE CODE have a score which resembled the cool 70s movies that so inspired the later. Since Duncan Jones is a guy of my age, 40, his film references are quite a lot similiar to mine, and thus, i also dig the hell out of that choice for the score. And i think if Chris P. Bacon can make such a sucessful hark back to the 70s style score, i think he would be good for PROMETHEUS. If PROMETHEUS really is a prequel to ALIEN, to have a score reminescent of the 70s scores would make a lot of sense to go withj the visials that Scott if giving to his new movie. And even if PROMETHEUS is set between ALIEN and ALIENS, it still matchs up. It would be good anyway it goes. I really hope the 70s vides that Ridley Scott is giving to his new alien movie is nt just for the art department and visuals but also aplies to the editing and film score. and not to mention, the care that went to scriptwriting in that decade. If that is what really will happen with the movie, i'll be in movie heaven came the release day. I don't even need the movie to be as good as ALIEN to be alright.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:02 p.m. CST

    vides = vibes

    by AsimovLives

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:21 p.m. CST

    MENTAL DOMINANCE should stop referring to himself in the third person...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    since it makes him look like an even bigger cunt than he already is. The Ward is absolutely terrible, by the way. Such a tired and forgettable film. Carpenter hasn't made a half decent movie since In the Mouth of Madness. I had hoped that The Ward would have been a return to form but its clear that Carpenter doesn't give a damn about filmmaking anymore, using his salaries only to fund his beer and basketball games couch potato lifestyle.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:21 p.m. CST

    Keanu Reeves is in Prometheus?!?

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Who knew.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:28 p.m. CST

    Isao Tomita should score Prometheus...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    In case you don't know who that is, he's a pioneering Japanese composer specialising in experimental electronic music using moogs and the like. He was Scott's first choice to score Alien back in the late seventies but the studio wouldn't hire him since he had never scored a movie before. But he sure could have created an eerie and unconventional score for the movie, one which would have matched Giger's disturbing visuals. Although I do love Jerry Goldsmith's score regardless. Bring things full circle and hire this guy, stat. Scott has the clout to do it these days.

  • And your extreme negative opinion of THE WARD is way off mark.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 1:46 p.m. CST

    astronut

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    The quote in question absolutely points towards Scott wanting to compete against Avatar and top it on a visual/ scope level, not just in terms of 3D. It was something like (paraphrasing) "Jim Cameron has really raised the bar with Avatar. He's not going to get away with it!" The not going to get away with it part was in jest, but Scott was sincere, and clearly wants to have a friendly compettition with Cameron - whom he also praised on the BR commentary. And all Avatar haters should thank Cameron and be kissing his boots, because he is the direct reason Ridely is even interested in sci fi again. After seeing tests and footage of Avatar that Cameron showed him during filming, not just of 3D but of the visual possibilities offered by mo-cap, CG environments (and the blending of live action environs with it) and the general rich visual cornucopia and world building, Scott was inspired to return to the genre by the new possibilites opened up by this movie. Previously Scott thought that sci-fi had been played out; now he sees the potential in it again. And Cameron himself was the one who told him to stop fucking around making movies like Robin Hood, and as the guy who made arguably two of the greatest movies in the genre, to return and do what he should be doing. 'The Forever War' was going to be his return to the genre after seeing the Avatar footage, until Prometheus came along. I hope he still makes that movie. As for Prometheus itself, what I want is for it to be what Alien was to Star Wars back in the seventies - the dark, flip side of the exploration and wonder and optimism of that movie. So it could be with Prometheus as to Avatar. Avatar is the pre-eminent space opera of THIS age. Prometheus could serve as its evil twin.

  • Just do it already, Sir Ridders. Please!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 2:10 p.m. CST

    The Ward

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    The only good thing to be said about it is that it's more respectable than the idiotic Sucker Punch, which had a similar initial premise and setting, including the whole 'inexplicably hot actresses in a period mental institution' angle. And The Ward did handle this better than Snyder's wet dream, anachronistic nonsense; true. But I expect better from Carpenter than Zack the Hack's stupidity, so that isn't really much praise. Carpenter's most Giallo-influenced film was, in fact, not one he directed at all: Halloween 2 - though he scripted it and did reshoot large portions of the movie. And the film has plenty of nods to Argento, both in the over the top deaths, close ups of needles and eyes, and overall macabre tone.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 2:13 p.m. CST

    As for Keanu, I kid...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    you actually wrote 'he's in Ridley's next movie'. I know it was a typo, but Keanu would make a good android, no?

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 2:20 p.m. CST

    Scott should follow Prometheus with The Forever War..

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    and it would be destiny if he finally got a crack at Dune, instead of that hack Peter Berg (thankfully not on the project anymore). I was also disappointed that he would no longer be doing 'Blood Meridian'. He would do an excellent job of that, I think.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 2:24 p.m. CST

    Assifuck the fanboy, who woulda thought?

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    giving Carpenter's The Ward a free pass. I haven't seen it, but I bet it sucks! Assifuck's favorite movies of all time: 1. Terminator 3 2. Wyatt Earp 3. The Ward Nice list bro!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Because of this talkback

    by montessaurus

    I bought the special edition of Alien. That's how classic this tb is.

  • If i actually listed my favorite movies, your hack loving mind would blow up. Tool!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 3:45 p.m. CST

    col = cool

    by AsimovLives

  • One could say it kinda spoils what will happen futher in the movie.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 3:50 p.m. CST

    because of this talkback, I'm gonna watch Alien again

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    and during the scenes where I'm mildly bored, I will daydream about the superior Aliens film. Maybe I'll also start a checklist of all the reasons every Michael Bay movie and Star Trek is better than the Ward, and giggle at that assclown Assifuck.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 3:58 p.m. CST

    oh cool- i make fake foreign posters of classic flicks-

    by zom-bot.com

    and O OITAVO PASSAGEIRO would be a great one to make! i only have one ALIEN poster up so far, and it's just english. http://travispitts.imagekind.com/store/Images.aspx/d99490e4-4a1d-4af9-8468-9146d8cc7237/Movie_Posters

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:08 p.m. CST

    Why I want Prometheus to be amazing

    by Jonathan Hicks

    I first saw this movie when I was about 13/14 years old. It was being shown on television and I wanted to watch it but my mum, bless her cotton socks, didn't like the idea of me watching a 'scary movie'. I managed to convince her that I needed to borrow the spare television from the kitchen because there was other stuff I wanted to watch whilst I wrote a story I was working on and so, after much whining, I got the set in my bedroom. This TV was black and white as it was just a small portable television and I settled down, with the sound turned right down, to watch a science fiction movie. Now, science fiction for me was simple - it was Star Wars and Star Trek. Big heroes, big adventures, space battles, princesses, cute bleepy robots and all that kind of shit. So, I sat down expecting a movie about a space monster the heroes had to battle and ultimately defeat. Probably with lasers. As you can tell, I never saw a full trailer for the film and knew what it was about only from reading about it in the TV listings. Safe to say I shit my pants. Not only was I watching this film in the dark I was watching it in black and white! Alien in black and white! Have you seen how many shadows and dark places there are in this film? Black and white only helped to enhance those shadows, turn them even darker. In fact, next time you sit down to watch Alien, turn the colour right down to black and white. You'll see what I mean. Shatpantsville. This movie changed my whole perspective on science fiction movies. I'd seen Blade Runner not long before and I didn't like it, mainly because all I saw was Han Solo running around a badly lit city talking to himself. No fistfights? No lasers? Bullshit! After watching Alien I revisited Blade Runner and saw it in an entirely different way. Now it's one of my favourite films. This was followed by Outland, Silent Running, 2001: A Space Odyssey... all the films I'd dismissed because it didn't emulate Star Wars were now finding their way into my lovetrunk now that I had seen Alien from beginning to end and it had shattered my juvenile concept of what a science fiction film should be. In fact, Alien probably changed my stance on movies in general. It was like a coming of age, a first step into a larger world (ding!), a realisation that quality is not defined by the number of explosions, firefights and robots on the screen. Alien made me grow up. So why should you watch this film? Well, it's simple. This film contains everything a movie needs. - Great direction. The look, feel and atmosphere Ridley Scott invokes is second to none. His use of handheld puts you there, in the ship, with the crew. The man is, without doubt, a genius. - Amazing soundtrack. Even though Jerry Goldsmith highly disliked what was done with his original score, I have to agree with the decision of the film makers to change it. It's haunting and dark. - Incredible performances. The natural, ad-libbed dialogue is fantastic in it's ability to make the conversations feel natural and the character dynamics and interaction is a wonder to behold. There are some scenes that make the movie like a documentary. - Solid special effects. This is pre-CGI and they were on a budget so they made big models, even bigger sets, and played with light, shadows and fog machines. It's an amazing feat. - Amazing concept that sticks in your mind. The Alien is so... well, alien... in what it does and how it does it that you have no earthly conception of it. The unknown - in this case being out in deep space, on a hostile alien world, inside an organic alien starship and being chased by an inconcievable killing machine - is what scares us the most. Sure, it makes us jump but, be honest, any movie can do that. When Darth Vader turns on Luke's lightsabre when they're talking on the Endor base just before he takes him to the Emperor in Episode VI ('VOOOOSH! I see you have constructed a new lightsabre')... That makes me jump. It's not supposed to, but it does. But that jump is fleeting, as it is in most scary flicks, it's the anticipation and the shock itself that makes you giggle nervously. Not so with Alien. You jump and it stays with you! It stays because you're thinking about the reason why you jumped, and what's in store for you next. And you can't predict what is next because the rules have changed. You're not in a high school, or in a haunted house, or in a babysitter's home. You're not in an environment you recognise and which may give you some form of comfort in knowing where things are or what they do. Everything, everything, is different. You're way out of your comfort zone. It's a perfect setting and it makes you feel uncomfortable. That stays with you long after you've seen the movie. I'm not going to address the following films, and I have had the memories of the recent 'VS' movies burned from my brain, but I will stick my neck out with this - As much as I love the sequel 'Aliens', I do feel that James Cameron managed to dispel the horror-inducing mystery of the Alien itself, the aura of the unknown that the first movie created. We had no real-world comparison for what the alien could do, why it did it, it's life cycle, anything. That's what made it terrifying. In Aliens, Cameron decided to take the reveal a step further and he introduced the Alien Queen, laying eggs like an insectoid matriarch, served by her drones and workers. And there you had it, your real-world analogy. Gone was the unknown, the mystery - in a hail of 10mm explosive-tipped caseless standard amour piercing pulse rifle rounds and expletives we saw the alien as an insect hive. A giant ant's nest. They were like bees, or wasps, or termites. The mystery was gone, and with it the horror of the imagination. The alien had been reduced to action sequences and moments where you'd jump from your seat and giggle about it afterwards. The alien had become another scary movie. Alien is my favourite movie. It's my favourite movie because it changed the way I saw not just science fiction but movies as a whole. That's a hell of a thing to happen to a 13 year old boy. If Scott can make me feel like a scared 13-year old with Prometheus then I'll be a happy, and very scared, 40-year old man.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:10 p.m. CST

    winona_ryders_pussy_juice

    by mcgoocain

    Sounds like you need to douche chill the fuck out

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:16 p.m. CST

    on someone suggestion, i'm going to make a new THING poster

    by zom-bot.com

    in german- DAS DING

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:19 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by mcgoocain

    I replied to your post to me but it didn't show up. I mentioned I was very envious of your Legend Soundtrack by Jerry Goldsmith - and added that I bought Jerry's score to Planet of the Apes when it first came out in 1968 and some other blah blah blah about my 9th grade science teacher liking Planet of the Apes more than 2001 because he thought the plot scenario in Planet was more likely to occur in the real world than that of 2001, and how life was so much fun way back then. Anyway, I had this thought to ask you - after his first 4 films,The Duellists, Alien, Blade Runner and Legend, classics all, were you as disappointed with Someone to Watch Over Me as I was? It seemed a big step down for Sir Scott.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:27 p.m. CST

    for me - the best legend score is the tangerine dream version

    by zom-bot.com

    the cut and sound of that version is so much more ominous and gloomy and fantasy... the goldsmith score seems too light (even though it is renaissance appropriate i suppose) and ruins the mood of serious scenes. but maybe because i grew up on the T.D. version for years before i saw the goldsmith version recently. and oh god, when Lily SINGS in that version, it's god awful and brings the film to a halt.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:46 p.m. CST

    zombot

    by AsimovLives

    Your posters are sweet! It reminds me of those old movie poster of the 1920s and 1930s. Very cool. You have an eye for it.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:49 p.m. CST

    zombot

    by AsimovLives

    Almost forgot to tell you this. Just in case you are interested to know, the famous tag line from ALIEN (In space no one can hear you scream", in portuguese it reads as such: "No espaço, ninguém te ouve gritar". And yes, that's a "Ç", it's no typo. It's called a cedilla.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 4:59 p.m. CST

    tellyhatesperverts

    by AsimovLives

    What was ALIEN to you it was BLADE RUNNER to me. Like you felt with ALIEN i felt with BLADE RUNNER: i didn't knew that Sf could be presented like that. In fact, when i first saw BLADE RUNNER, i couldn't imagine a movie could look like that. I had never seen such a beautiful movie like that before, one that combined both the chairoescuro type of photography of the old 1930s and 1940s movies with colour photography. It blew my mind. It's curious that the movies that changed our perceptions of cinema were made by the same director, Ridley Scott. What should that tell us about the man? It's funny you mention your experienc ein turning your Tv colour off and leat be be in black and white to watch a ridley Scott movie, like, in your case, ALIEN. I once did the same with BLADE RUNNER. And just like in ALIEN, it works brillantly. BLADE RUNNER is still a gorgeaus movie to look at in black & white. It even looks as if it had been deliberatly shot in black and white in mind. Which, i think, is a testement to the move's visual excelency. It was my intention to watch ALIEN tonight, as a follow up to my watching of THE MAN WHO FELL TO EARTH yesterday. I think i'll do as you advised and watch it in black and white, just for the coolness of it. And thanks for your very interesting, funny and slaice of life post you offered us there. Great read. Thank you very much, friend.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 5:03 p.m. CST

    zombot

    by AsimovLives

    The Jerry goldsmith's score for LEGEND is too light? only the inicial tunes. when the shit hits the fan, goldsmith's score gets progressively creepy and dark. The music associated with Darkness and his minions is particulary omnious. If i had to venture a gues,s i think you are not all that familiar with Goldsmith's score. I might be in an advantage because i actually own the score, and i sued to listen to it on repeat for days on end back in the day. That score is jsut gorgeaus, and it was actually Goldsmith's own favorite score. He was immensily proud of it, as he should.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 5:07 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by Jonathan Hicks

    Cheers, dude, it's not often I get to drone on about Alien and this TB has been great. I can imagine Blade Runner working exceptionally well in black and white, especially the original version with the Ford voiceover. It'd really capture that 1930s/40s private eye vibe, give it that Mike Hammer feel. Think I'll try that myself!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 5:17 p.m. CST

    mcgoocain

    by AsimovLives

    Your question about SOMEONE TO WATCH OVER ME. Actually, i was not disapointed with SOMEONE TO WATCH OVER ME. I actually liked it a lot at the time. I saw it 3 times in the theater, and one mor time on video. Part of the reason i liked it so much is due to the fantastic opening shot, this aerial shot in which New York never looked so beautiful in film before or since. Also, and though you could acuse the story of being generic, it had never been presented as beautifully as that. For some reason, the movie really connected with me. It's only nowdays that i no longer have such a positive opinion on the movie, but that's because i just watched it too much time, the novelty weared out. The first Ridley Scott movie that actually gave me a sense of disapointment was BLACK RAIN. not because i think it's a bad movie. In fact, it's not. But... it felt inferior to the usual Scott work. It was too... action movie. It felt at times as if it had been his brother tony Scott who had stepped in and shot some of the stuff. And at the time, Tony Scott was my most hated director (my favorite and my most hated filmmakers were brothers). Back then and evne today i fell that BLACK RAIN is a schizofrenic movie. There's part sof it that are brilalnts. When the movie slow downs and let itself breed, it's brillant. When it tries to be an action movie, it disapoints. Maybe today i would be more forgiving to it and like it better, since i haven't seen it for 15 years. Btu i haven't felt in any hurry to revisit it again iny tiem soon. Mind you, i do like the movie, but from Ridley Scott, i expected better, i expected more. i loved THELMA AND LOUISE, and any pantsy fag boy who disses it because it's a "chick flick" can go fuck themselves in their fucking asses. Yeah. The movie is good, and showed another facet of sir Ridders. I loved 1492: CONQUEST OF PARADISE, which for me felt like Ridley Scott returnign to form. The fact that Ridley Scott was reuniting with Vangelis was my awesome moment for me. It was with WHITE SQUALL that i first truly find my first true disapointment with a Scott movie. I was so bloody disapointed! So much! It's not exactly a bad movie. But it's bland. It's banal. It's "what the fuck was he thinking?". The sea scenes are gorgeaus, of course. GI JANE was another disapointment to me as well. There is a better movie trying to get out of that, but the end result is just... useless! Thankfully, Ridders gotr his mojop back with GLADIATOR, and the rest is history. The man is now a powerhouse and one of the most powerful and sucessful directors in today's Holywood. And he and his brother owns the Shepperton Studios, which means anytime a major blockbuster movie wants to shot in england, they pay to ridley for the previledge. Way to go, sir Ridley! P.S.: i told you that back then Tony Scott was my most hated director. and yet even then i really, really loved THE HUNGER. It's by far my favorite Tony Scott movie, and i always loved it since i first saw it.

  • The first DVD editon of ALIEN was my very first DVD. This is not the ALIEN DVd that came with the tetralogy collection (yeah, as if i'm goingto call it by the bullshit work of quadrology. Quadrology my ass!). No, this ALIEN DVD i'm talking about was released a few earlier. One of it's particularities is that it has an auidio comentary by Ridley Scott that's unique and exclusive to it. It's not the same comentary he did for the tetralogy pack, it's a different one, where he's alone and doing a full lenght comentary uninterrupted. fior me, that comentary was all kinds of aawesome. It was a revelation. This was my favorite director talking about he movie he made, and pouring his mind about what made him do the decision in th making of the movie, and telling little anedotes about the shooting of the film. It was as if he was talking to me. It was beyond awesome. Because of that, i became a fan of audio comentaries. so much so, that it has prevented me from buying vanilla DVds and waited for the ones with extras and comentaries. To this day, an audio comentary is my favorite extra on a DVD, or blu-ray for that matter. And it pains me that some directors i love, like De Palma, Lynch and Spielberg, ar enot keen on them. Fortunatly, some unexpected directros which i love are very open and keen on making comentries, like Cronenberg, Scorsese, and most suprisingly Werner Herzog and Alejandro Jodorowski. When even art-house boys like Herzog and Jodoroswki are not snotty enough to refuse an audio comentary, all reasons behind Spielberg's reasons are made null and void. Back to the topic above, suffice to say, i love this my first ALIEN DVD. In fact, i'm going to play it right now. See ya guys tomorrow. Keep the talkback going. Semper alien!

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 5:32 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by mcgoocain

    You made a name/reputation for yourself with the new Star Trek, and suffered much derision for your negative stance. I disagree with you on the new ST, but admire you for sticking to your opinion with such stamina. Your knowledge and appreciation of film, from one lifelong fan to another - is stunning. This is no small compliment coming from me. You are, indeed, one of the good guys. Thanks for sharing with me. I may not always agree with you, even though I do more often than not, but hey, Siskel and Ebert fought like dogs sometimes, but remained dear friends. Keep it up, your writing is very entertaining.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:01 p.m. CST

    LEGEND goldsmith score

    by zom-bot.com

    maybe i didn't give it the chance- i was so unused to the cut i was watching- i think it was the edit more than the music...which was very sacchrine when it needed to be during the scenes with Lily and jack playing in the forest i guess... having grown up wearing out my vhs of the tangerine dream version (which also shows Darkness giving his speech in black light at the beginning- the cut i just watched did not- it only shows his living throne) i guess i am biased to the soundtrack that i know by heart. my girlfriend and i popped in her dvd and were quite let down it was not the edit we grew up with at all. i never realized how vastly different the cuts were and how much a soundtrack can change a film.

  • that sucks. i mean, i understand allowing the con to see it 'first' but why not show the same footage on the official site now and get us fucking STOKED?

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:08 p.m. CST

    Has any following film in the series...

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    depicted the alien as so fearsome to behold that people are paralyzed with fear? It's something that just now made an impression on me, and it's another method that the filmmakers used to express the creature without showing much of it. Everyone in the film is either too scared to escape or attack effectively.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:09 p.m. CST

    You guys need to get a room, seriously

    by WINONA_RYDERS_PUSSY_JUICE

    Assimov has fanboys now!? That's creepy....and gay. Anyways, I just saw this comic and thought it needed to be shared with the AICN talkback trolls. So you're MAD about something on the Internet... http://www.sharenator.com/So_youre_MAD_about_something_on_the_Internet/

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:14 p.m. CST

    oh and the scene with (noomi?) falling to her knees in the doorway?

    by zom-bot.com

    yeah, looks like she's leaving the others because she doesn't feel well, and is that a red spot in the center of her shirt? a little too similar to the scene from ALIEN if you ask me, but whatever- we'll see. i have faith.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:29 p.m. CST

    zombot

    by mcgoocain

    You say: i never realized... how much a (musical)soundtrack can change a film. Truer words were never spoken. Or how much a bad musical soundtrack can render a film useless by being distracting rather than augmenting. There are so many bad films because it is really, really, hard to get all the puzzle pieces to mesh into a superior whole. And, some of the most effective films have a minimalistic, or no score at all - and the effect, when handled properly with all the other puzzle pieces falling into place - has the whole film being riveting, mesmerizing.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:30 p.m. CST

    Alien director's solo commentary

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    was also the first I ever heard. And still one of the best. All Scott's commentaries are very entertaining, even for his lesser movies.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:42 p.m. CST

    Any time Scott addresses the contemporary world

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    the results are mixed at best. He seems to be most engaged when addressing the past or speculative futures. When he moved out of this, particularly in that patchy middle period between Legend and Gladiator, he really stumbled, as if he was attempting to prove that he could do 'serious' dramatic films also, instead of just genre movies, which are all too often looked down on by snobbish mainstream critics, or at least were at that time. He appeared to be trying to transparently carve out a career as a respectable mainstream director., and when you're pursuing that instead of your true passion the cracks are destined to show.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:45 p.m. CST

    hell, has no one mentioned the old 1984 apple ad?

    by zom-bot.com

    that was ridley scott, correct? pretty monumental.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 6:53 p.m. CST

    Black Rain is one of the better 'contemporary' Ridley Scott films...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Mainly because he still shot it in the style of his previous sci fi forays. And the movie is very atmospheric, with Tokyo almost being presented as a real life sister city to the fantasy vision of LA in Blade Runner. Even the scenes where they meet the Yakuza in the steel mill are presented with an Alien-esque industrial aesthetic. The bleached gray landscapes of the Japanese countryside also look appropriately other-worldly. There's a lot to like in that film, and the 80's action elements were even presented more in the manner of the respectable examples of the period - the Die Hards, the Aliens and Walter Hills' films - not in the MTV rock-video inspired style of Bruckheimer or Brother Tony.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:38 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    I'd say that it's almost a waste of his talents to focus on the mundane, like Giger painting a market scene, or Kubrick directing a franchise blockbuster. He's said himself that his strength is in "universes," world building, which futures and historical reenactments lend themselves to.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 7:42 p.m. CST

    Actually, I wouldn't almost say

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    I'd definitely say.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 8:04 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    Final thought here on one of your comments: "Yes, Alien does feel, at times, like a quasi-doucmentary, particularly the scenes of the crew sitting around eating and shooting the shit. But that's just an approach," No. It isn't just an approach. It's attention to detail across the board. Aliens now looks in places like it was shot on sets and sound stages. Alien never does. There's something about that movie that just oozes quality. Maybe it's the film stock, or the lighting, or the quality of the sets. I'm not entirely sure why. But on a Blu-ray, there is absolutely no question that Alien looks much more real than Aliens does. The performances are also better. In terms of consistency, certainly. Everyone in "Alien" puts in a great performance. The more naturalistic dialogue does help. But it's just one aspect of many. I couldn't really tell the difference when I was sixteen. But I can now.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 8:58 p.m. CST

    He directed the Duelists?

    by dahveed1972

    Thats a pretty badass movie. Never knew that. Huh.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 9:07 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Warren Fahy

    Agree on Black Rain. Really great metaphors in the film, as well. The counterfeit plates that show Douglas is willing sell out his country, he's drinking water in the beginning as if to purge himself, the villain who sees the corruption in Nick, the fact that his name is Nick, something he's accused of doing with drug money. And on the other side, it's a critique of Japanese culture's conformism and group identity versus individuality. Plus the film just kicks in the hardcore action scenes.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 10:51 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by PedroM

    here in Brazil, Alien is also called O Oitavo Passageiro, which when I watched it for the first time - back when I was 7 or 8 - made my head explode when I realized they spoiled the movie through its translation.

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 11:04 p.m. CST

    I have an Alien dvd

    by PedroM

    with an isolated sound channel for the soundtrack but cant remember if it has the Ridley Scott commentary. Is is the same

  • Aug. 3, 2011, 11:08 p.m. CST

    A thought just crossed me mind

    by PedroM

    What if, to follow on Prometheus, Ridley Scott was to direct a live action adaption of Metroid, and maybe, somehow, make the metroids and Samus Aran cross over with Prometheus and the Space Jockeys and the Xenomorphs huh.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:28 a.m. CST

    mcgoocain

    by AsimovLives

    Thank you for the kind words, sir. You're alrigth as well. Yeah, i do have some infamy associated with me due to the Abrams Trek thing. I even have anti-fans, like the Pussy guy above. "I mate it, ma! Top of the world" Really, it's just... weird.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:32 a.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    Actually, BLACK RAIN was shot and it is set in Osaka. They do make a big fuzz about it, and did so at the time of release ofthe movie, as if they were proud that they made an american movie which, unlike the commo Holywood cliché, it was not set in Tokyo. Though both cities seem to be pretty similiar in outlook, since both are mostly a concrete jungle.

  • The man excels at making a world for a film. give him a movie in which he has to create a world from the ground up, and he goes crazy with the art department. and the results are always spectacular. It's not that eh can't shoot a contemporanean movie. He can. And he can do that better the most. He can pick up any real life location and present it in a way nobody had done before, and certainly never so beautifully. for example, the way he shot and presented Florence in HANNIBAL. Never that city looked more beautifil on film. It looked as if it had came from his own art department. Of course it helps that he shot it inthe old medieval part of the city, which is fantastic. But in true, he's best at making it all from the ground up. I'm not evne going to use the usual example. Just look at KINGDOM OF HEAVEN. Regardless of what one might think of the movie, if they like it or not, and the historical innacuracies (which has quite some), but one thing is certain: not only the movie looks beautiful, but the world it presents looks inhabited. As if we were really there. That's no medieval movie where we see and say "nice set". No, man, it's there. Scott time traveled and shot on location, if you know what i mean. And as true to historical movies is for SF and the future worlds. Hell, even his AMERICAN GANGSTER, which was set just in the 70s, looked lush like one of his period movies... which it was.

  • Who would ever think that Keith Carradine and Harvey Keitel could play such believable napoleonic hussards?

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:41 a.m. CST

    SEMPER ALIEN!!

    by AsimovLives

    I rewatched the movie yesterday. It's as good as i remember it. My love for it was not diminished, it was just reinvigorated. One interesting thing from rewatching it is that, contrary to popular belief, the word alien is inded used in the movie. The most notorious case is when Dallas, before he goes to the vents with the famethrower, is trying to figure out with Mother what the alien is and what are his odds. One of the questions he types does have the word "alien" in it. And i think i heard one of the characters also use the expression alien at least once. For the most part, they use any other alternative imaginable (it, thing, guest, son-of-a-bitch), but once it's used, or so it seemed to me. Another thing that striked me is the attitude of the crew toward the circunstances that lead them to the alien. It's quite subtle, but if one notices the way the dialogues is writen and the way the actors portait the characters, you will notice that to them is not really a big suprise the notion of an alien lifeform. Whenever they are seeign the alien ship or the alien creatures themselve,s they say something like "I never seen anything like it before". The implication of this phrase is that they have never seen AN ALIEN thing like that before. Extra-terrestrial lifeforms are known in the ALEIN universe. And it's not so uncommon as to be treated with suprise. The suprising thing about the alien is not that's an an extra-terrestrial, but that's it's so peculiar. Another interesting implication form the dialogues and attitude form the characters is that their biggers reaction about the notion they ar going to explore something that looks like it has extra-terrestrial origin is not that it looks like it's from an alien civilization, but that it has a LIVE BEACON. That is the thing that really perks up the interest of most of the crew. The implication is that in this universe, alien artifacts are known, just not one that might imply a still living alien responsible for it. Basically, in this universe, alien artifacts form dead alien civilizations are known. Something that seems still operation and might imply a still living alien civilization is not known, it's a first. And evn ethen we have to consider the non-challant attitude that the two blue-worker characters, Brett and Parker, show to it. They just don't give a toss, and are only motivated on the possibility of losing their shares (money) if they don't go. Again it gives the notion of alien artificats and alien lifeforms being somewhat banal enough for a working guy who's obsessed in returning home and get his paycheck not give a fuck about it. Think about it. The beauty i have always found in Ridley Scott's movies, even in some of his most recent works, is the subtlery he injects to them, always giving tantalizing clues of a bigger world surrounding and beyond what's depicted onscreen. It makes his movies so... alive. And all those who accuse his movies of being cold, clinical and impersonal, namely ALIEN and BLADE RUNNER, can kiss my ass.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 9:38 a.m. CST

    I rewatched ALIEN last night because of this talkback

    by flax

    What a magnificent film. It may not be as much fun to watch as ALIENS, but it certainly stays with you in a way the sequel does not. The desperate coldness and isolation of it all, the mounting dread and panic – Ripley's near-breakdown when the realisation sinks in that she is the last crew member alive is brilliant. The characters feel so real – the dialogue is stuffed with so much incomprehensible (but natural) technobabble that we feel how we would if we were listening to real 'space truckers'. So much terror is embodied by the singular creature – the one with a human skull under its smooth cowl; the one who design and crafting HR Giger personally oversaw. Wonderful. Cameron really undermined the alien by showing dozens of them being gunned down and run over. Not that I'm complaining – ALIENS is still fantastic, and an overload of expendable xenomorphs was a necessary sacrifice to wring a good action film out of the property. I think I'm going to have to put aside childish things and become a man by adding my signature to the 'ALIEN > ALIENS' manifesto.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 12:55 p.m. CST

    mentaldominance, you know the theatrical cut is better?

    by AsimovLives

    That's because ALIEN was made at a time when studios let filmmakers work their magic with little interference. They tried, but filmmakers weere treated as kings, and even a new comer like Scott could still get away with many things done his way. Nowdays, studio accountants think they know mkore about films then filmmakers, and they evne have the courage or the ego to tell them how to make movies. And they have the power to enforce their idioticy on filmmakers. And the more talented and intelligent filmmaker, the more they psubh them around. That's why hacks like Michael Bay and JJ Abrams can do anything, because they think and talk and act like studio accountants, so it's all in the family. Would a movie like ALIEN be made today? Only if they could pull it out with a low budget and a below radar flying like Duncan Jones did with his MOON movie. MOON, a movie in which you cna tell is chockefull of references from ALIEN. Duncan Jones, who never shuts up about how much he loves ALIEN.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 1:04 p.m. CST

    A few word about Zeta Reticuli

    by AsimovLives

    Zeta Reticuli is actually a binary star system. And both stars are very similiar to our sun in all aspects, from mass, size, characteristics, the whole works. The differences are more to do with a deficient in metals compared to our sun. I think that alrady at the time when ALEIN was made that it was known that the Zeta Reticuli are very young, about 2 billion years old (compare to our sun's 5 billion years). I can't tell how much this was deliberate or if it was an happy accident, but this means that the movie's depcition of the alien planet having a primordial atmosphere and a surface that has traces of being very young and with signs of very recent vulcanism, meaning, a very young planet, is actually consistent with what we know and would be plausibvle to accept given the real Zeta Reticuli stars young age. How cool is that? A few years ago, astromoners though they had found a hot jupiter in one of the Zeta Reticuli's stars, but it was later retracted, it had ben a misreading. Well, least we forget, the planet where was the alien ship is a moon of a big gas giant, a Jupiter-like planet. Though fromthe descriptions from the movie adn references to extreme cold, that mother planet would had to be pretty far away from the star, like our own Jupiter or Saturn, and not at all like a hot jupite,r which are gas giasnt who inhabit in very close orbits to their stars, orbits comparable to our solar system's Mercury or even closer.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 1:05 p.m. CST

    i mean to say, "you know why the theatrical cut is better".

    by AsimovLives

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:01 p.m. CST

    'Aliens is for kids'....

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    No, it decidedly isn't. It never was. And anyone who makes such a claim is a fucking idiot. It's an R-rated film for one, and the tone and approach of the film is nothing like a kid's film or a low grade idiot action movie, and is in fact, very faithful to the original. Same slow pace. Same dark atmosphere. Same gritty 'real-tech' environs. All of these SELF-EVIDENT things that people seem to be conveniantly ignoring, or arrogantly dismissing, in a self-serving manner. The fact that you probably watched Aliens as a kid and enjoyed it because it had 'guns and technology and lots of action and lots of other superficial fun stuff' means absolutely nothing. Those were NEVER the real reasons Aliens was truly great in the first place or why it worked as a superlative film, with razor sharp scripting, direction, allegory, strong characters, smart subversion of genre, and countless other aspects. Any idiot can fill a movie with mindless action and cool stuff. To integrate it into a well thought out universe and narrative and cinematic reality is another matter. This sort of critique would be akin to saying Robocop was just a fun kiddy movie because it had lots of 'cool' guns and machinery and action and blood', ignoring the smart satire and black comedy that an adult would recognise. Ditto with Aliens', which was made fidelity and intelligence and respect to the concepts of the original and therefore expanding them. You can tell Cameron was a true student of the original, something that the further franchise -led sequels and spin-off have ignored, focusing only on the most superficial aspects of the series. Shall we dismiss Alien as a child's movie because it isn't a drama about real people and relationships and the human condition, like what is thought of as traditionally 'adult' fare. Alien is just a kiddy monster movie that kids would one time have seen at a Saturday matinee, a story about two-dimensional characters (and a robot!) pursuing an ugly monster with flamethrowers around a spooky environment, with lots of action and suspense and 'boo!' type scares. All kiddy aspects, right?It's not War and Peace after all. No, of course you wouldn't; it's ludicrous. This is all obvious to anyone with half a brain. As for the talk of action figures emananting from this film, it's bunk; in fact, the truth is, there was all sorts of merchandise aimed at children that stemmed from the original Alien, including - yes, that's right - an action figure range. Fox were following Star Wars' lead. Ironically, Aliens had none of this when it was first released, and the merchandise - action figures, model kits, etc - came YEARS later, spurred on by the continued popularity of the series, the Dark Horse Comics line, etc. Instead of continually venerating and rewatching 'Alien' in hermetically sealed backslapping fashion that only serves to re-inforce their views, people really need to actually go back and rewatch the SEQUEL, since many of the negative comments against it hear bear absolutely no resemblance to the actual movie whatsoever. Someone who had never seen Aliens would have a very distorted impression of it from reading that tripe. It seems to be some kind of bizarre reductionism, some loaded argument, where, to inflate Alien's greatness, Aliens has been reduced - I think LV-426 said this above this - to some 'shoddy half-assed sequel that betrayed the original', ignoring its very real qualities. And in some cases, outright misreading or misunderstanding of the concepts of the series - ie. thinking tha the alien in the original was impervious to bullets, so Cameron downgraded them by showing them cut down by gunfire. This is all nothing but fanboy extremism and hyperbole of the worst kind, reducing discussion of cinema to sports rivalry, and an insult to real fans of cinema. For all the passion and thoughtful and intelligent comments in this talkback (and there are some very good ones), this is the kind of embarrassing nonsense that AICN and other geek sites are notorious for, can foster at their very worst, and why they often cannot be taken seriously. This talkback was truly a mixture of the very best and worst that discussion here can encourage. I cannot stress this strongly enough. ALIENS NEEDS TO BE REVISITED. And without bias. The nonsensical trashing of this great film is seriously starting to really piss me off - and make no mistake it is trashing - and a few people in this talkback echoed my sentiments, so I'm clearly not alone in this view. Yes, ALIEN is great (and despite claims to the contrary, it has always been afforded much respect among true film fans, unless you've been keeping the company of fools). We know that. Now it's time to afford ALIENS the respect it is also due. WATCH IT AGAIN.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:18 p.m. CST

    Alien vs. Aliens debate

    by lv_426

    Not to beat a dead horse even further, but in my opinion I don't mind if a film looks dated. In my eyes, I don't see Alien looking like it was shot today and Aliens looking like a crap 80's movie. Also, as far as movies looking dated, I kinda like that they do... at least to some extent. Star Wars looks dated, but in a good way, while something like Logan's Run looks dated in a bad way. Does that make any sense at all? And since we mentioned The Terminator vs. T2, I think one of the reasons I like The Terminator better now, in addition to the darker future stuff tieing in better and the simpler concept of Reese and Sarah running from a single terminator, it is that it is set in the 80's that makes it so fucking cool. The vibes, the music, the overall style and conceptual ideas that the story presents the audience are specific things that came out of a creative mind of the 80's. Same with Star Wars of the late 70's. These films can't be made the same today. Cameron probably would not have come up with The Terminator in the present day. This is why so many remakes don't work. So back to Alien and Aliens. I don't mind that these films aren't as flashy as modern day films. The more realistic colors of Alien, along with Scott's smokey and atmospheric style of that era are just great. Aliens' grainy image and Vietnam allegory along with some digs at that 80's yuppie greed are also great. I like that these films are products of their time. It is what makes them greater as time goes on. They are films that age well, even if you know that they aren't the latest and greatest CGI-infused mega-blockbuster. That is why Aliens doesn't get old for me, nor does Alien. They are two peas in a pod... or two facehuggers in an egg if that works better. So I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on the quality of Aliens in comparison to Alien. In fact, the Alien film that feels extremely dated in terms of screaming which era of cinema it was made in has to be Alien Resurrection. The bad CGI xenomorphs and overdone cinematography stick out like a sore thumb to me.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:25 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by lv_426

    I do find the theatrical cut of Alien better. Of course, the director's cut is greatly appreciated as a cool thing to see for an Alien fan. I was happy to get a copy of it when they released it in 2003 with the quadrilogy set.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:49 p.m. CST

    asimovlives - Zeta Retucli

    by lv_426

    I remember hearing about that supposed gas giant news too. I immediately thought of the possibilities of there being a real LV-426/Acheron type of moon existing. One thing that it reminds me of, in terms of the Alien series having a lasting impact on the face of sci-fi cinema, is that the utter banality of space travel that the crew of the Nostromo and the marines on the Sulaco have. They don't find this cosmic stuff all that amazing. In the Alienverse, exo-planets and extrasolar moons are just potential things to be exploited for profit. This is such a different attitude in comparison to typical space opera, which, while I love a rousing space opera, I find fascinating about the Alien mythology. It makes me think that in the long run, Alien and Aliens might actually become more timeless than something like Star Wars or Star Trek. The attitude we have today towards space as a species is not all that different from that of the characters in the Alien films. Space is cold, dark, and big. There probably aren't a bunch of friendly humanoid civilizations out there, but in fact if there are any at all, they are probably so far and sparsely spread out that we might never cross paths with them. Even in our own solar system, the old optimism of the possibility of there being life anywhere besides maybe Mars or Europa is gone. Alien came at a time when that old space optimism was still alive and thriving, partly due to the space race of the 60's and 70's. Add to that the fact that NASA was just on the brink of sending the Mariner and Viking probes to Mars, which was followed by the utter surprise of just how barren the surface of Mars really was. Those first pictures sent back were probably the first steps towards sobering people's perception of the reality of our solar system, changing it from one of unchecked optimism to one of cautious curiosity and maybe a bit of humble pie doused with a shot of fear. So along comes Alien, not only to twist the idea of what outer space was to most people after the extreme optimism and high adventure of Star Wars and the magical musical UFO's of Close Encounters of the Third Kind, but to say that space is not such a great place for us puny human beings. The cold stark reality of what space and our place in it, featured in Alien as well as 2001: A Space Odyssey, I see as lasting longer through the ages as a cultural milestone than lightsaber duels and galactic empires.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 2:57 p.m. CST

    Back in the day, LV-426 was LB-426 to me

    by lv_426

    because the TV Guide always flubbed that in the description of ALIENS.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:08 p.m. CST

    Thanks for the pro-ALIENS rant turd

    by lv_426

    Know that you have at least one ALIENS mega-fan in support here. Also, anyone who hasn't seen the blu-ray versions of ALIEN and ALIENS needs to do so. ALIEN looks great, as expected. As for ALIENS, Cameron supervised a remastering of ALIENS that cleaned up some of the grain. It is the best the film has ever looked, and the best it will probably ever look. The talk of ALIENS looking dated might be lessened a good deal by the blu-ray. It now looks much better and a bit newer, as there were some odd color timing issues with the old VHS and DVD versions, in addition to the reduction of the heavy grain from the older prints of ALIENS, which was also exasperated by additional video noise that comes with those legacy video formats.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:15 p.m. CST

    mentaldominance

    by flax

    I wasn't dissing ALIEN when I said the characters spoke technobabble. There are many scenes where I just don't know what they mean – they talk about things like 'digital solenoids' and 'protein polysaccharides'. But as I said, it feels natural. That's my point. The space truckers speak how we imagine real space truckers would speak.

  • It is a sci-fi novel that was released in 2001. It is called SHIP OF FOOLS, but Richard Paul Russo. I recommend it because it has a serious, dark, and mysterious vibe to it that is reminiscent of ALIEN. It also excels at building a sense of dread, which is something that I feel ALIEN does better than just about any film ever made. Ship of Fools does it a bit differently, but it has a similar vibe to it. Also, alien artifacts anyone? Ship of Fools has those things too. I think anyone who loves ALIEN and enjoys reading science fiction novels would really dig SHIP OF FOOLS. It is out of print, but it can be found used on Amazon for a reasonable price, or for the Kindle. It is too bad that it is out of print, but I wouldn't be surprised if the publisher were to reprint it in the near future, especially if PROMETHEUS were to become a big hit. http://www.amazon.com/Ship-Fools-2001-publication-Russo/dp/0739416901/ref=tmm_hrd_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=1312489112&sr=1-3 Seriously, check it out if you need something ALIEN-like to tide you over until PROMETHEUS.* * Besides merely watching your DVD or Blu-ray of ALIEN over and over and over again, which I know some of you will do during the course of the next year.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:23 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by flax

    I think you might be referring to one of my earlier comments when you mention 'Cameron downgrading the aliens by having them cut down by gunfire'. I must stress that I never considered the alien impervious to bullets – I'm simply saying that the individual creature in ALIEN is more frightening because it is treated like a singular threat, while the threat in ALIENS is much more diffused, and the creatures themselves drop like flies. As I specified earlier, I love ALIENS and I have no problem with the portrayal of the creatures for the purposes of the more action-heavy film. I know that the one in ALIEN would have died if it had been shot. My point isn't that Cameron retroactively downgraded the entire species, but that the aliens are simply less horrifying when they're dying left right and centre. This is not fanboy extremism but personal preference. I agree with almost everything you have said so far.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:27 p.m. CST

    Recommendations

    by warren bishop

    All of this talk of "Alien", "Prometheus" and "Forever War" has put me in the mood to read some sci-fi. I loved "Dune", "Neuromancer", "Burning Chrome" but haven't really kept up to date, with what's happening in modern sci-fi. Can anyone recommend some good sci-fi novels I can sink my teeth into? Thx.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:27 p.m. CST

    lv_426

    by AsimovLives

    I find the so-called ALIEN: DIRECTOR'S CUT to be a curio. It's fine, it's an interesting experiment, but i never find myself returning to it. Though one can see where Cameron took his inspiration for the captured people trapped in alien goo from. Cameron must have read ALIEN's shooting script when he was preparing his script for ALIENS.

  • It's not stretching to say that ALIEN does feel and is more an adult audience oriented movie. The way teh cahracters act and do, the attention to detail about their professionalism, and no obvious heroics from the characters in dealing with the alien menace do not make forthe typical trappings of a made ofr teen movies. ALIENS, fine as it is, does that that type of heroics, and characters going badass and saying perfectly timed one-liners, and in the end, ripley going Rambo on the aliens to rescue little Newt in the ultimate act of heroism. In ALIEN one can actually think that faced with such a similiar situation, people would react likehow the characters do. In ALIENS, there is so much impossible heroism in that movie that it's movie ehroism. You think it is believable in any way that one woman without extensive military training would go alone to get her surrogate child without any support, and not get completly paralized with utter terror and fear? It's movie heroism. It's fun to watch in a movie, but there's no paralel to reality. ALIENS is a movie's movie. ALIEN i a movie that takes reality as it's inspiration. It's what SF from the 50s/70s so often was, create a fantastic premise and then inject it with reality elements. This is one of the reasons why, excluding Cyberpunk, i prefer the SF of the 70s to the 80s.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:48 p.m. CST

    lv_426

    by warren bishop

    After I asked for recommendations - I saw your post about "Ship of Fools". I ordered it from Amazon. Thanks for the suggestion! I've got a couple hours free this afternoon - so I was going to go to the bookstore. Anything else spring to mind?

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 3:50 p.m. CST

    warrenbishop

    by lv_426

    I just recommended a very ALIEN-like novel called Ship of Fools two posts above you. A happy coincidence maybe? As for some other new sci-fi novels, you said you enjoyed Dune, Neuromancer, and Burning Chrome, so I'll recommend to you a few newer ones that might tickle your fancy. If you liked Neuromancer, check out Altered Carbon by Richard Morgan. Cyberpunk type of universe that is dark, violent, and gritty. Dune... I am trying to think of something similar. I guess something sprawling and space opera-ish would fit the bill. There have been lots of those, so as a fellow Dune fan, I'll just throw out some space operas that I personally enjoyed. These are the first that came to mind: Revelation Space series, or House of Suns, by Alastair Reynolds Hyperion Cantos (starts with a novel called Hyperion), by Dan Simmons Just about anything from Peter F. Hamilton (Night's Dawn trilogy, Pandora's Star, Fallen Dragon) The Culture series, by Iain M. Banks. This is one of my favorite series. It has a good number of books in it, but each one can pretty much be read independent of the other, as it is not just a continuation from book to book of the same characters and storylines. Even though you can pick up anywhere in the collection, I recommend starting with Consider Phlebas or The Player of Games. After reading either or both of those, the other books work much better and make more sense in the grand scheme of things. If you want a little mystery and xeno-archeology in your sci-fi, try some of Jack McDevitt's novels. He has two series that feature this kind of stuff. One starts with a novel called The Engines of God. The other series can be read starting from either A Talent For War, or the novel Polaris. These are fun, space opera mysteries that are breezy reads, but also aren't shallow. Old Man's War, and it's sequels The Ghost Brigades and The Last Colony by John Scalzi are damn good military sci-fi/space opera combos that are reminiscent of Starship Troopers, but way more fun. For something darker and more foreboding like ALIEN, try Ship of Fools (see description in my previous post), or the Revelation Space series. Those both have a darkness and more of a hard sci-fi feel that I think Alien fans would appreciate. If you want something with the bug blasting military in space action of ALIENS, then besides Starship Troopers and The Forever War there is Armor by John Steakley. It is not really new (1984), but it is good stuff in the vein of Aliens.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:01 p.m. CST

    warrenbishop - I am glad you found the Ship of Fools link

    by lv_426

    a few more recommendations you might want to check out: One that sounds cool, although I haven't read it yet, The Quantum Thief. It seems to be getting rave reviews. I plan to check it out soon. Another one that I haven't read yet, but one that is also well reviewed is The Quiet War. It seems to be a sort of space opera set in the solar system, so I am guessing it will have more of a hard science feel to it. There is a sequel called Gardens of the Sun. I've been wanting to check those two out for a while now, as they seem interesting and not exactly your typical space opera. If you want a sci-fi novel that is more action-packed, take a look at The Mirrored Heavens. This one also has a bit of cyberpunk infused into it as well. If you like really cool aliens in your sci-fi, as well as lots of action, check out the work of British author Neal Asher. He creates some really wicked and nasty aliens that seem believable and well thought out. The only problem is his stuff is a bit harder to find here in the states.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:05 p.m. CST

    lv_426

    by warren bishop

    Wow, you are a treasure trove of information! I just ordered "Ship of Fools" from Amazon, and based on your descriptions, I'll probably start by looking for "Altered Carbon" and the Revelation Space books. Thanks again for the suggestions! Very cool of you.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:06 p.m. CST

    Turd, re: Cameron

    by Keith

    "You can tell Cameron was a true student of the original, something that the further franchise -led sequels and spin-off have ignored, focusing only on the most superficial aspects of the series." I agree with this.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:10 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    "You think it is believable in any way that one woman without extensive military training would go alone to get her surrogate child without any support, and not get completly paralized with utter terror and fear?" It is believable. Very much so. That isn't movie heroism by any means. I can tell you that, even in real life, ANY mother would walk into the jaws of hell to save her child, whether they were wracked with unimaginable fear or not. There's been plenty of precedence for this in reality. It's in a woman's biological programming to do so. That part of Aliens couldn't be further from what you stated in terms of believability or truth. And, in fact, it's part of what makes Ripley such an icon of female action heroines. Contrary to the superfiical jibes that she was a female Rambo, Cameron never wrote her this way. She was simply an ordinary women forced into action by extraordinary circumstances, forced to man up. And at heart, a mother, driven to protect her child. Quite the contrast to the way that female action heroes are now often depicted in a way as to arouse teenage boys, specifically in Mikey Bay's horrible films. Cameron undertsands women quite well, and his depiction of Ripley follows suit. Also, as far as a case being made that Aliens was more friendly to a teen audience, that doesn't mean that it was INTENDED for a teen audience. Obviously a lot of people preferred Aliens as kids/ teens simply because it had 'more action', and with no more thought put into it than that. Why should the film itself be penalised for that, or teens used as a yardstick to ascertain the truth about any movie? Teens like a truly great movie like Clockwork Orange for its titilating aspects compltely ignoring why its great, or something like Robocop because its gore and violence is appealing to younger minds. That doesn't mean anything. Come on, we are supposed to be among true film aficionadoes here, not simpletons. Surely we all apprecaite and can analyse films for what they are, and the craft behind them, on a higher level than that?

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:14 p.m. CST

    warrenbishop

    by lv_426

    Well, I'm a sci-fi junkie. If science fiction were an illegal substance, I'd be standing near the playground handing out old tattered sci-fi and fantasy paperbacks to the kids.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:19 p.m. CST

    Appreciated, lv_426...

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    Yes, it does seem there's far too much anti-Aliens bashing in here, so its good to know I'm not alone in defending it to the hilt. And any good movie, as Aliens surely is, deserves to be defended passionately. As I said, a lot of the Aliens bashing appears to be of a very self-serving nature, with people taking pains to appreciate the finer aspects of the original, but simplistically dismissing Aliens as just a dumb shoot-em-up action movie with monsters getting killed and one liners. By that measure Aliens must be on the level of Transformers or GI Joe. I think we all know better than that, and DO know better than that at heart. Anybody of intelligence can see the virtues of Aliens as a piece of filmmaking and exactly the difference in quality and craft between it and fodder of lesser kind. I have no problem with people preferring one film or the other, but give them equal shakes.

  • http://www.amazon.com/Alien-Vault-Definitive-Story-Making/dp/0760341125/ref=sr_1_6?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1312492279&sr=1-6 I am curious to see what this book offers, as I've found The Making of ALIEN book that has been around since 1979 to be pretty good. This new one seems to be a bit fatter (175 pages vs. 112). Hopefully if it is really good, they'll do a similar one for ALIENS and maybe even ALIEN 3.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:34 p.m. CST

    LV

    by Keith

    I liked your post about enjoying watching a movie that seems very much of its time. I know what you mean. I especially like 70s and early 80s horror movies for that reason. I like the streak of nastiness that seems to accompany the slightly run-down, washed-out world that comes from both aged film stock and a genuinely down-at-heel decade (especially in the UK). I like some of the more off-beat stuff such as The Survivor and The Medusa Touch (and of course The Changeling). And like you suggested, I like them in large part BECAUSE they're such period pieces.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:38 p.m. CST

    The only thing wrong with Aliens is

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    all the shit video games that keep ripping it off. Fighting "bugs," and listening to motion tracker sounds isn't novel anymore.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:42 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by AsimovLives

    I knew soembody would come up with some story of some mommy that run over running lava to save his cubs. Dude, let's be frank here. Think of the situation that is prsented in ALIENS. Yougn newt is in the very middle of the alien nest. Filed to the grilsl with the uttermmost badass creatures of the galaxy. Creatures who mannaged to dizimate an entire platoon of highly trained battled hardned professional soldiers. Not only the aleisn decimated, they out-thinked them and put then on the run. Adn to add to all that, the whole region is about to get vapourized by a thermonuclear explosion to big it would make Hiroshima lok like a firecracket. And all this is to happen in less then 15 minutes. And who's going to do the saving? A civilian, somebody who got a crash-training in shooting 30 minutes ago, alone, with no backup. And who has spend the entire movie in the grips of a bad case of surviver guilt and post-traumatic stress disorder. And you are telling me there's some kernel of truth to it? That it can be believable? Dude, it makes for fantastic adventure/action stuff. Is it beleivable as the stuff that was seen in ALIEN? None whatsoever. Not at all. It's fantasy. It's cool fantasy, but it's fantasy. Is it based on a human desire to save a fellow human, specificaly, the human sesire to save children? Yeah. It's based on our most defining qualtiies as a human being, our desire to defend our children. But what happens is not at all believable. Ridpley does what we dream we could do, but can't. In ALIEN, Ridley does what msot of us might could do if for a moment we wouldn't let panic paralise us. ALIEN fantasy is the setting. ALIENS is fantasy through and through. Cool, but unmistakenbly fantasy. Say what tyou will, but what Ridpley does in ALIENS is movie stuff. It's impossible movie stuff. And it's what seperates ALIENS and ALIEN and is so telling of the decades the movies were made. ALIEN was made in the 70s, a decade where evne fantasy Sf put belieable human beings in fantastic settings and mae them act and behave like human beings would, and present all out limitations of what we could and couldn't. ALIENS is a movie of the 80s, when heroes start doing impossible things, nonchallantly going against impossible odds with little fear to show and little doubt in they coming out on top. Sigourney Weaver's excelent acting gives a human dimention to her she-Rambo actions in the climax of the movie that is so absent to all other action heroes of that decade. adn that's where you think "it coudl work". Not it can. It's just Sigourney Weaver's excelent acting that sells you that. But believability does not exist in that sequences. It's stuff like that that all added makes me prefer ALIEN to ALIENS. On a human level, i can relate to what happensin ALEIN. ALIENS is a (fun) thrill ride in which we are presented with fantasy versions of archetype characters which can do things normal humans can't, and they do so because they inhabit a movie's movie universe.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:46 p.m. CST

    flax

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    I wasn't referring to you comment specifically, but ones I've heard used to criticise Aliens before. I've heard people take Ash's line that the alien is 'the perfect organism' literally, as if he meant the alien was virtually invincible (instead of just physiologically 'perfect', able to withstand extremes of vacuum and grow rapidly without much sustenance, or simply with no obvious physical weaknesses). Thus, they think the alien in the original was hinted at being impervious to artillery, and that the sequel showing this line if reasoning as false is a cheapening of the monster. The whole 'hook' that Alien revolved around WAS that the creature could be penetarted and killed by weaponry but that the crew couldn't do so because they were on a ship in space, and any bleeding from the creature's acid blood would have penetrated the hull! So they had to find other ways to dispose of it. It's the same deal with people ascribing all sorts of other intelligence and features to the creature that are really just personal fan interpretation and not provable by any means. I do disagree that killing the Aliens en masse makes them less horrifying, though. It's the sheer relentless number of the creatures in Aliens that makes them terrifying, along with the marine's dwindling resources and artillery in stopping them. That's the 'hook' in Aliens to compensate for the fact that, unlike the first, we are no longer in a tightly compressed environment and now in a sprawling colony complex, where acid eruption isn't an immediate threat. Also, as Cameron himself said in a Starlog magazine interview of the time: 'To a person trapped in a house unarmed, a single madman with a knife might be the most terrifying thing in the world, but to a person in a similar situation accompanied by ten cops armed with guns, it's significantly less terrfiying', ie. it's all relative and so the multitude of monsters - and therefore the number of deaths in defence - in Aliens is a neccesity in upping the threat within the context of that particular situation. There is also the fact that, contrary to other accidental or deliberate misreadings of Aliens in order to criticize its portrayal of the creature, the creatures in the sequel act as intelligently as the one in the original, and even tactically, with a sort of collective 'for the good of the many' hive intelligence. This is shown in the cutting the colony power or the alien crashing the drop ship to prevent the marines' escape (probably hinted at as being a deliberate move), as well as in the sentry gun scenes. The creatures were never depicted as mindless cannon fodder, but kamikazes willing to sacrifce themselves, allowing others to eventually overrun the guns en masse by virtue of their large numbers or until the bullets ran out - all until the sheer number of casualties from the amount of ammo outweighed the benefits of a certain number of aliens sacrificing themselves for the good of the hive. Perhaps the creatures in Aliens are of even greater intelligence as a physic unit than the lone warrior in Alien acting on its own.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 4:56 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    "Anybody of intelligence can see the virtues of Aliens as a piece of filmmaking and exactly the difference in quality and craft between it and fodder of lesser kind." Well, yes, I would now classify Aliens as an 8/10 movie (rock-solid) but give 9.5/10 (masterpiece) to Alien. One thing I was thinking about is that I'd like to see the original theatrical cut of Aliens again. Frankly, I suspect it's a better movie. I just really, REALLY hate the sequence with the Jordens in the rover. It deserves to be on the cutting room floor.

  • whether that be novels, films, comic books, video games, etc.

  • You have to admit the alien is reduced in it's status because in the sequel all it takes to kill one is just a well place couple of shots from a safe distance. In the first movie, ALIEN, the crew can't even scratch the creature before he kills them all except one. In ALIEN, he's unstopable. He is the perfect organism. In the sequel, the alien is a mook that can get killed by numbers by smart-mouthed marines. The alien is so robbed of it's deadly force mystique it becames a threat by numbers. By numbers. Or when one becames big the size of an elephant, like the Queen. I can't help but like the alien better as he's presented in ALIEN. In that movie it's a one creature total nightmare of unstopability.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:16 p.m. CST

    lv_426

    by Jonathan Hicks

    You recommended three authors I always refer new readers to when they ask that question - Simmons, Reynolds and Banks. Their books are complete mindfucks and I love 'em to bits, especially Simmons Hyperion and Endymion stuff. His Ilium and Olympos novels are somewhat out there, too. One book I highly recommend, if you want to be seriously creeped out by a sci-fi universe, is The Carpet Makers by Andreas Eschbach. The final two chapters made my fucking eyes bleed with the enormity of it all.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:20 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by lv_426

    There is also the fact that, contrary to other accidental or deliberate misreadings of Aliens in order to criticize its portrayal of the creature, the creatures in the sequel act as intelligently as the one in the original, and even tactically, with a sort of collective 'for the good of the many' hive intelligence.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:20 p.m. CST

    oopps, used quotations on accident

    by lv_426

    =There is also the fact that, contrary to other accidental or deliberate misreadings of Aliens in order to criticize its portrayal of the creature, the creatures in the sequel act as intelligently as the one in the original, and even tactically, with a sort of collective 'for the good of the many' hive intelligence.= This is something that I love about ALIENS. The aliens are not individualistic. They are all about survival and protecting the hive. That is why when the marines stumble into the nest in the atmosphere processor, the aliens were sleeping or maybe in a deeper state of hibernation. The thing that makes the aliens as a species equally terrifying and fascinating to me is that they can wait us out. They don't seem to count time like we do. This notion is present in both Alien and Aliens, in the sense that the eggs are just sitting there in the bowels of the derelict ship, waiting for some dufus to start poking around in the dark... just like Kane does in the first film, and then the Jordan family in the Aliens director's cut. Another thought... the aliens both exploit lesser prepared species while also probably thriving when coming into contact with a super advanced species. I mean, let's say a much more advanced than human spacefaring species stumbles upon an alien nest or another derelict ship. Maybe they have advanced robotic probes or impenetrable space suits. Instead of the facehugger popping out and eating through the space helmet, maybe these advanced spacefarers take some eggs as souvenirs or specimens for study. Eventually the aliens are going to find a way to breed, even if it is years later when a facehugger finally gets the chance to latch onto some poor creature's face. Either that, or they'd be used by other spacefaring races, as bioweapons. This means the aliens thrive through this method as well. In fact, it is to their benefit to be captured and used as bioweapons. I find that kind of amazing in a cosmic sense. It defies space and time in a way, how this species could crop up throughout time and space. =Perhaps the creatures in Aliens are of even greater intelligence as a physic unit than the lone warrior in Alien acting on its own.= I've always liked this notion, that the aliens sort of gain intelligence in numbers. Didn't Cameron say something along the lines of the queen's intricate head is large and shaped so differently because maybe it is some sort of psychic sensor array? Maybe the queen can sense things beyond what the average drone or warrior aliens can? Maybe she is also the key to tying the hive together with some sort of communication method beyond what we perceive through our admittedly limited five senses?

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:26 p.m. CST

    asimovlives

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    It's not some sentimental fable or 'story of a mommy running over lava to save the cubs', but a quite deliberate and mechanical fact of human behaviour. It is not an exception, and is in fact provable even by scientific research into the maternal programming of human (and animal) females. Read up on it. You've been watching too many movies, unfortunately. Your point about the training of the character with the miltary equipment may have some merit - obviously these things are condensed for the purproses of cinematic narrative - but the psychological motivation is absolutely sound, and you are unlikely to convince me otherwise. And as we can see, Ripley does not set off to rescue newt all gung-ho and Rambo like, but - yes - scared. Yet determined. We see her hyperventilating and clearly terrified, but also dead set on what she has - MUST -do, or she couldn't live with herself. She is forced to confront her fears and move out of her 'comfort zone' by the events of the narrative (this happens gradually over the course of the film in contrast to what you stated). In fact, its sudden, immediate and very real danger of this nature that psychologically often breaks the stranglehold of human procrastination and doubt. Why? Because the body's immediate and reptilian survival (or maternal in this case) instincts are far, far more powerful than any apparent delusions or doubts of the human mind or ego. It's the 'fight or flight' principle in action. This is real world textbbok psychology, not movie logic. It's a realistic depiction of the situation that's at odds with other 80's action films. Your analysis of characters as typical 80's action heroics fodder is way off, also. The characters are quite believable within themselves, as real a military unit as the crew of civilians was in Alien. They are not Schwarzengger types, even in physique, but just hardened and tough. Even the prose description in the script describes them specifically as 'not Supermen' as so many archetypal 80's action characters were. Even the one liners naturally fit into the context of a military unit, full of one-up-manship and good nature ribbing and joshing. There are comparatively few jokes once the situation becomes dire, with even a character like Hudson, who would have been a wise-cracking too-cool-for-school 'bad-ass' character throughout in a Bruckheimer film of the day, breaking down and becoming cowardly. As another example, Hicks is not a barking uber-macho meat-head but a soft-spoken and supportive character. Aliens stands in marked contrast to the typical cheesy 80's action of that time.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:26 p.m. CST

    Asimov

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    They couldn't scratch the creature because they never attacked it, or never had a chance to. They were either paralyzed with fear, or couldn't use the torch because that idiot Lambert was paralyzed with fear. The audience only has Ash's word to go by. But keep in mind the kind of munitions they're using in Aliens. Armor piercing, explosive tip, 10mm rounds, deployed at a cyclic rate. That is heavy duty shit. Pistol rounds have no effect, even at close range, as shown when Vazquez gets cornered in the crawlspace. I think it would have been a pretty cool scene, having the creature in Alien walking right through a flamer blast.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:27 p.m. CST

    deployed at a HIGH cyclic rate

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    I meant

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:31 p.m. CST

    tellyhatesperverts

    by lv_426

    The Carpet Makers sounds really unique. I am going to order a copy. I am surprised I've never heard of it before.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:40 p.m. CST

    Perfect organism

    by Keith

    I always assumed that what Ash meant here was, "This thing is about as dangerous as it could possibly be". Although I've always felt that this tacitly meant, "...for what is essentially an animal". I remember a good debate in a talkback here a while back where I was saying that one of my big problems with Predator was that the creature was simply too powerful. It was The God of Death, and ultimately could only be defeated because of its moral/hunting code. It was extremely intelligent, and had advanced weapons and sensors. Had it chosen to kill all the humans, it could have done so, and they would not have had any chance against it. To me this weakens the film, because the humans don't have true agency in the story. In "Alien", it always felt to me that the humans DID have a chance, but that they underestimated the creature until it was too late. And they were being undermined by Ash. So I don't fully buy Ash's monologue when he says that it can't be stopped. Dallas's plan actually seemed okay; they just don't seem to have thought it through very well given the topology of the air duct system. Ultimately, we see that, yes, it retreats from extreme temperature, and, yes, you can blow it out of a goddamn airlock. Had the humans been smarter or luckier, things might have turned out better. At least, that's my preferred interpretation. I actually don't like the idea that they never stood any chance at all.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:43 p.m. CST

    Aliens theatrical cut vs. the director's cut

    by lv_426

    Overall I prefer the director's cut, but if I were showing the film to someone who had never seen it before, I'd show them the theatrical version first. I like seeing the colony thriving and the trip in the crawler out to the derelict, but the experience of seeing the colony for the first time is a bit more eerie and suspenseful in the theatrical cut. As for the theatrical cut, I think that Cameron should have kept the scenes where Burke informs Ripley of her daughter and the sentry gun stuff. The daughter element seems necessary to really strengthen the relationship Ripley has with Newt. The sentry guns add an element of believability to me. It feels too easy for the survivors to just weld up a few doors and repair the barricade that the colonists made (which was breached by the aliens btw). With the sentry guns, the aliens had to work much harder to get into the colony complex that the marines, Ripley, Burke, and Newt were hunkered down in.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:49 p.m. CST

    notenoughbiehn

    by AsimovLives

    Lambert is not stupid for being paralized with fear. It's actually quite a human thing. she acts the way most humans would. Me, you, everybody in this talkback. By far she's the most believable character. ridpley is extraordinary for the fact that, despiste she is panicking, she still has enough mental fortutude to force herself to run away and still function enough to operate the self-destruct mechanism. Considering what she's facing, her actions are extraordinary. People have suffered and died of coronaries for less. And that's the thing about ALIEN. It's extremely real life believable. In ALIENS, the characters act and behave like 80s movies action heroes. They act like what we which we could do under the circuntances. They act like how we wish he would. In ALIEN, they act like how we really would. It's not Ash words that makes the alien the perfect organism. It is the perfect organism. ahs is not lying. Ash is telling it as it is. He's (It?) putting he cards on the table. People want to defend ALIENS because it's a cool action movie. An unusually smart and very well made one. I love ALIENS. The movie is initself a film school lesson on how to make an action movie with little to no bullshit. And the characters are good, intersting, well dfeveloped,and played well by a bunch of good actors who are not slouching on the job. Nobody takes that merit away form ALIENS. It's there. But ALIENS is a product of the 80s. When the action became more fantastic and impossible, when characters made more and more impossible actions while keeping an aloof attitude, where they coming out on top and winning became the norm to be expected and religiously followed. What seperates it is how fucking good it is.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 5:55 p.m. CST

    Marines in Aliens

    by Keith

    "As another example, Hicks is not a barking uber-macho meat-head but a soft-spoken and supportive character." This is true. And Vasquez was definitely an interesting role, certainly for the time. The only marine who is a bit of a dull cliche is Gorman, the schooled-but-inexperienced officer who fumbles under pressure and never seems on top of what's going on. It might have been more interesting had they gone in another direction, although to some extent the story might simply not have worked if somebody experienced and competent was in charge the whole time. (This is presumably the reason why Charles Xavier is disabled for key stretches of the first two X-Men movies.)

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:01 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy: theatrical cut

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    It's available on both the quadrilogy DVD and the blu-ray, where you have the option of watching either cut. I always liked the colony sequence, though. Admittedly, the sequence does rob some of the surprise of the alien infestation, and some of the supporting cast acting is very B-grade (they probably shot these scenes quickly in contrast to the main unit shoot, and thus they had less time expended on them). But I always liked the general atmosphere of the sequence and the spooky contrast of the busy colony with the deserted corridors later on. I also liked how the 'plot holes' were explained by showing the alien derelict canted on it its side and broken under a lava flow, indirectly suggesting why the beacon had stopped working. Plus, the whole vibe of the sequence fits into the Western genre that Aliens is vaguely echoing in sci if fashion (the abandoned ghost town on the wild frontier under seige from the indians or bad guys, Rio Bravo style), just as Alien itself alluded to the gothic haunted house movies in the horror genre like 'The Old Dark House'. The discovery of the derelict by the Jordans is like the scene in Westerns where the prospectors find the gold mine that will later bring them bad fortune. When I first saw the film- the theatrical version - I always thought it was a cheat that we never saw the colonists and that the events of the colony takeover were only described in exposition! I didn't know about the deleted sequence at that time until the early 90's VHS release of the special edition. Be careful what you wish for, eh? (assuming you find the re-inserted sequence unsatisfactory, that is).

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:02 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy, ALIENS is actually Rambo. To wit:

    by AsimovLives

    James Cameron wrote a script for Rambo 2. But it got heavily re-writen by Stallone, as in, barely nothing remained form Cameron's work. So, when Cameron wrote the script for ALIENS, he reused many of the things that was in his re-writen script. Cameron's Rambo script focures a lot on the group and their dinamics. Rambo was th outside, traumatized by the events prior and during the first movie. For the most part, he would be treated an outside, not one of the guys,and a relic form the vietnam war. Until the shit hit the fan and Rambo showed his coliurs and saved everybody's ass. In Cameron's script, the mission was a group thing. Not as it happend inthe finished movie,where Rambo pratically goes alone. In the original Cameron script, Rambo was part of a team. And as a futher twist tot eh tale, Stallone then reused Cameron's script for his latest Rambo movie. Small suprise, it's a much better movie then the exacrable egofeast shit that is Rambo 2. So, yeah, ALIENS is Rambo. Cameron's rejected Rambo project. In fact, despite all the SF, evne at the day when i saw the movie bvack theni notice that the movie was going Rambo when Ripley goes after Newt. Total Rambo stuff. But by then i was so invested with Ripley's character and i had fallen inlove with Sigourney Weaver that i just went for the ride and didn't mind. a damn good pretty actress will do that to you. But make no mistake: ALIENS is an action movie of it's times, it's Rambo in space, only the rambo is a cute amazon actress with tonnes of talent. A far better creature to admire and engage then Stallone, if you ask me. On a side note, and to also give the devil's it's due, despite ALIENS being at soul an 80s action mvoie, it's not so pure in that it forgets to also play for tension. in fact, for thefirst 40s minutes, and exclusing the military stuff, it plays more like an horror movie. In fact, the action stuff in the movie is quite minoratory to the rest of the screentime. Whcih is one of the reaosnwhy i love it. When people say that ALEINS is a nonstop rollercoaster, i have to think this people have only seen the actions stuff and fast-fowarded all the "boring" stuff where people talked and "nothing" happened. ALIENS can be called a rollercoaster, but it does stop from time to time. In fact, if one ignores the action stuff, beat by beat ALIENS is a repetition of the line of events from ALIEN.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:15 p.m. CST

    Turd

    by Keith

    "I always liked the colony sequence, though. Admittedly, the sequence does rob some of the surprise of the alien infestation, and some of the supporting cast acting is very B-grade (they probably shot these scenes quickly in contrast to the main unit shoot, and thus they had less time expended on them). But I always liked the general atmosphere of the sequence and the spooky contrast of the busy colony with the deserted corridors later on. " That scene is largely fine, although the model work of the rover outside isn't up to snuff. The corridor conversation is perfectly okay. What I would do is cut it right before the Jorden sequence. Show Lydecker and Al discussing Russ Jorden's enquiry about the claim. This establishes that somebody may be heading out and about to trigger a sequence of bad events. But just cut there. Back to earth, back to Ripley, with Gorman and Burke turning up and saying that contact has been lost. Not only would this work well, it would work *better*. The last thing you saw of the colony was a thriving place with workers and kids. The next time you see it, it's without power and with its shutters down. You don't need to see a poorly-acted sequence in a cheap rover with weak-looking effects for your brain to be able to fill in what's happened. It's actually cooler that you don't. There's more latitude to wonder what actually happened: did they send an expedition out to the ship that was encountered? Did they bring eggs back to the colony first? Your imagination is more powerful. In "Alien" Kane's descent was a brilliant scene, and served a purpose. The Jorden rover sequence serves no purpose, and it looks weak/unfinished. In fact, I've had a couple of girlfriends who had never seen Aliens in any form, and when I played the SE I simply pressed the chapter skip button as soon as that scene began.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:17 p.m. CST

    turd_has_risen_from_the_gravy

    by lv_426

    I do also like the contrast between the busy bee colony versus the dead as a crypt version that the marines find later in the film. I've always thought that a film about a similar colony, on another frontier world, would be an interesting storyline for an Alien(s) film. Sort of that The Thing dynamic of a remote settlement being overrun by monsters if you will. I imagine part of the reason the colony on Acheron fell, besides the fact that they didn't have the combat training and weapons of the Colonial Marines, was that they also might not have had as much of an organizational system or chain of command. I like to think that Hadley's Hope didn't see a lot of supply ships, and that the colony has been there long enough that they aren't as hard core about protocol and all that stuff. Then the aliens come along and there would be the obvious power struggles amongst the few alpha dogs of the colony. I just don't want something crass and exploitative like a prequel that shows the fall of Hadley's Hope in a new movie, with a different kid actress playing Newt. Also, you know that they'd have to force in a Colonial Marine character in there too. Some dude who is an ex-marine that accidentally killed all his comrades in an friendly fire incident or something. With a totally different colony on a different exo-planet or moon in a different star system... I think they could do something good with that premise if there are any more Alien films beyond Prometheus. Also, your analysis of Hadley's Hope being in the tradition of the old western frontier town is spot on.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:18 p.m. CST

    Asimov

    by Keith

    "When people say that ALEINS is a nonstop rollercoaster, i have to think this people have only seen the actions stuff and fast-fowarded all the "boring" stuff where people talked and "nothing" happened. " Yep, completely true. Although one can say that a rollercoaster always involves the pull-chain part as well. Similarly, people often assert - falsely - that Star Wars is nonstop action. It opens with a bang, but then it's largely talking and a slow building of the scenario until the arrival at the Death Star, which is halfway through the movie.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:20 p.m. CST

    lv_426

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Gravy

    I believe some of the Dark Horse Comics series and the later novel series that stemmed from these, further explored the idea of the Queen having borderline physic abilities. She could even send visions to people in their dreams, inducing them to form a cult dedicated to freeing her from captivity. Maybe a bit out there, perhaps, but an interesting expansion of some of the things already hinted at in the films (ie, in Aliens we see the Queen telepathically imploring the two guarding warriors to fall back when Ripley threatens the nest with a flamethrower). The idea that the alien race can survive undisturbed for eons, patiently awaiting their chance to breed, is fascinating. The spores in the derelict could have been waiting there for millions, or perhaps billions, of years. One thing I hope Prometheus doesn't do is wrap this aspect up too neatly, and the fact that it only takes place some thirty years prior to Alien is cause for concern. Though, conversely, I don't see how they could do a movie set before the dawn of man and not involving humans at all without making it totally uncommercial and unmarketable (beyond hard core sci fi fans). I hope the scenes in Prometheus that depict the 'beginning of time' (shot in Iceland) will help to give a sense of just how far beyondthe scope of human experience and imaginings the aliens, the space jockeys, and their attitude to time and existence really is.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:27 p.m. CST

    Trivia titbit re: Russ Jorden

    by Keith

    The actor who plays him, Jay Benedict, performed the voice of Shiro Hagen on the very cool (for the time) 80s Japanese sci-fi puppet series Star Fleet (aka Ekkusu Bonbā/X-Bomber). And the voice of John Lee in that show was done by one Mark Ralston, i.e. PFC Drake in Aliens. One thing I remember noticing as a kid (when creating a home-made Aliens strategy game for the C64) was that most of the marines have an initial that is the same as the actor that plays them (i.e. M. Drake - Mark Ralston, A. Apone - Al Matthews, etc).

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:27 p.m. CST

    asimov

    by NotEnoughBiehn

    Yeah, I'm not literally saying Lambert is an idiot, it's just a frustrating scene. But the scene, like the one with Brett, demonstrates a level of fear more profound than that of being confronted with a vicious predator; people have at least tried to get away from a bear or shark. It's Lovecraftian in its dimension, which I believe is intentional. As for Ash: I'm not doubting it's structural perfection or hostility,but we only have his word to go by that they can't kill it. There was no evidence at that point in the series whether or not flame would work. But it wasn't weapons that failed them, it was their nerve, and their luck. I don't defend Aliens. I prefer Alien, but Aliens speaks for itself. The creatures in Aliens don't conjure that level of "cosmic" fear that the first alien did, but I think that is appropriate for the kind of parallels and story Cameron wanted to make. And like I said, 10mm armor piercing, explosive rounds make the playing field a bit more even. I find the discussion, about whether Ripley going back for Newt is believable or not, interesting. Human history can provide examples for and contrary, but what interests me is that it reminds me of an idea that Robert Howard expressed a few times in his Conan tales. That the only recourse left to man in the face of mind-numbing horror is murderous rage. Of course, Ripley ain't no Conan or viking. She was super pissed though, lol.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:31 p.m. CST

    Telepathy

    by Keith

    "in Aliens we see the Queen telepathically imploring the two guarding warriors to fall back when Ripley threatens the nest with a flamethrower" We don't know that for sure. She wheels her head around to look at both. No reason why that can't be a conventional avenue of communication (i.e. gesture).

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:32 p.m. CST

    Turd..

    by orcus

    Orcus believes that the really early DH comics implied the psychic abilities. Now mind you, Orcus hasn't read the first DH Aliens graphic novel in a while, but wasn't that the reason Newt was in the insane asylum? Granted, the comic came out before folks ironed out Alien3, but still. Dang, now ORcus has to go through his comic archives. Grumble grumble

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:33 p.m. CST

    Fall of Hadley's Hope

    by Keith

    "I just don't want something crass and exploitative like a prequel that shows the fall of Hadley's Hope in a new movie, with a different kid actress playing Newt." Could make for a cool video game, though. Strategy/planning/action combo.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 6:38 p.m. CST

    Flame

    by Keith

    "There was no evidence at that point in the series whether or not flame would work." It certainly didn't enjoy the jet of steam onboard the Narcissus.

  • Aug. 4, 2011, 9:45 p.m. CST

    There's a new book out by Giger

    by PedroM

    you can check it out in the publishing house Taschen. It is very limited world wide and very expensive.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 7:12 a.m. CST

    Yes to Giger....and no to the critters!

    by ZodNotGod

    There are NO creatures, (Aliens) in this flick! It's set in the same universe, but no critters will be seen, thank Kirk for that.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 7:59 a.m. CST

    notenoughbiehn

    by AsimovLives

    I have rewatched ALIEN again, two nights in a row, in fact, thanks to this talkback. And i noticed one thing, and this is in reference to your coment that we only have Ash's word about the alien's perfectness and unkillable. When Ripley finally escapes int he Narcisus, the shuttle, but finds the alien there, and her atempt at finaly getting rid of him for good, it plays in a very intersting and unusual way. The alien doesn't attack Ripley. It just sits there, chilling out, just minding his own business. It's Ripley herselt that forces the alien to attack her, in her plan to get rid of it once and for all. and how things play just prove how right Ash was about the alien. Ripley causes an explosive decompression which violently yanks the alien out thrown the airlock. The decompression aline would be mortal, because it would liquify the intenral organs of any known living creature. And the yank would cause such inertia it like being being hit by a truck. but none of that seems to hurt the alien much, since it has the presenc eof spirit and strengh to grab the airdock door-frame and prevents from being spit out to space. Ripley then shot it with a grappling gun. The shot is so strong that it does push away the alien from his grabbing position and hurls it to space. But the inertia of the alien's push is so stong that the grapping gun is yanked form ripley's hand snad get stuck inthe closing airlock door. The alien ricochets back toward the Narcisus and then we see it climbing to the nearest hole the can hide. So, the alien is shot with enough force to push it out and yet the hook itself barely penetrates his "skin" and despiste the violence of the impact of the hook it barely affects his ability to crawl about the exterior the Narcisus. The thing is not evne wounded! Finally, when Ripley realises the hole that the alien hide in is one of the Narcisus's thrusters, she activates them, and the blast is so strong it pushed the alien to space, finally getting rid of it. But if you watch carefully, you will notice that thr blast itself didn't killed the alien. Nor the blast's force not the blast's heat killed the alien. In the end of ALEIN, the alien was never killed. Think about that: the alien of the first movie was never killed. We know it can't suphocate. It can live in space vaccum. Heat and cold, at least in the first movie, can't kill it. Severe trauma can't kill it. The alien is still alive somewhere. Come all the other movies in the franchise and after all those years, and yet somewhere in deep space the alien is still there, probably dormant, in extreme deepest hibertation, in some self-provoqued extreme cryodormancy, waiting for anything to wake it up again. THE ALIEN LIVES. What's supprising is that the sequel to ALIEN didn't had that as it's hook. howeve,r there was a 1980s compure game called Survivor which was that, the alien finds itself catching the hike of a huge spaceship, and we play the alien a it tries to do his thing, getting people, incubating them, laying eggs,and generally killing anybody who crosses it's way. You were the alien. Cool game.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 8:03 a.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    A common mosquito will not kill you, but it sure will anoy you and ruin your sleep at night. The point being, just because the alien gets bugged by the Narcisus' cooling stream jets doesn't mean it could harm it in any serious way. If anything it seems the alien just got pissed off because Ripley molested his contemplation.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 8:10 a.m. CST

    I never took it that the aliens in ALIENS where telephatic.

    by AsimovLives

    Not in the scene when the Queen ORDERS the two other aliens to back off. She nods at them, and it doesn't take a genious to understand, given the circunstances, what she intends. The aliens just do the obvious. In fact, telepathy for me cheapens the aliens. It robs them of their infered inteligence. It there's no telepathy involved, then the aliens are just smart enough to understand circunstances and comunicate sophisticated notions form bebavior and a basic form of verbal comunication (the hisses). It portaits them as sophisticated animals with a high level of intelligence similiar to our wolves, whales and apes, if not more. Maybe even at the level of the first hominids. That impies INTELLIGENCE. Telepathy of some sort would rob them of capacity and necessity for cleverness and understanding. Me, i rather see the aliens as smart costumers. They are cooler that way.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 9:48 a.m. CST

    Getting bugged by something

    by Keith

    We don't get bugged (physically) by anything that isn't potentially harmful to us, unless it's a side-effect of an evolved response to something that could harm us. Mosquitoes certainly CAN be harmful. Parasites are harmful, even if they vary in their severity. We don't like our arm hairs being tickled because evolution has built a broad-brush alert system that suggests insects (or similar) could be crawling over us. The alien appears to shriek in pain and thrash around when the steam is turned on. If the heat weren't harmful to it, it would be strange for such a stealthy, calm creature to respond in such a way. Also, you say that the alien doesn't attack Ripley aboard the narcissus, but it does fling its arm out, alerting her to its presence. Why does it do that?

  • Doubtful he can do it because the creatures have been so cheapened by crappy directors and writers but at least the film will be good.

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 11:06 a.m. CST

    Patton Oswalt might not be be happy, but...

    by alexander

    this will be more Ridley in Space with Aliens than Star Wars Prequels were Star Wars i'll bet

  • Aug. 5, 2011, 3:05 p.m. CST

    misterdarcy

    by AsimovLives

    Why does the alien flings it's arm? Why does he opens his mouth and does nothing with it? He's just chilling out, that's what. Have you sene animals chilling out? They spread their legs, yawns, and do little motions, all without any real porpose. He's jsut there, taking it cool. I mean, really, what threat, according to the alien, Ripley could possess to him? He wouldn't even need to do anything to dominate her. she would starve to death and he wouldn't need to do anything, from his point of view.

  • Now, mid you, Orcus hasn't read them in years, but there were a few story lines where the Aliens were able to induce visions in humans. There were also couple of novels that went along those same lines

  • Yeah, I never really thought that Cameron was suggesting that they were with the queen gesturing towards the two warriors after Ripley seemed to want to burn up the eggs. What I meant more about the telepathy was that the aliens might communicate through some method that is not obvious to us, but not as radical as psychic powers either. Maybe sound or temperature or something along those lines, but they have better receptors for sounds or electrical impulses or whatever they use to communicate in their alien-like ways. I think the Dark Horse comics had suggestions of the aliens having some sort of telepathy though, as turd and Orcus pointed out. I do have to say, that while the Dark Horse Aliens stuff got a little bit weird and off course at times, the first three story arcs were overall pretty great. Back in the day it was Aliens Book One, Aliens Book Two, and Aliens Earth War. Now it appears that Dark Horse changed Newt and Hicks into different characters by a name swap, due to the post-Aliens sequels going in a different direction than the comics. I'd love to see HBO or Showtime produce an Aliens series or miniseries using the first three Dark Horse comic books as their basis/jumping off point. Maybe a few years from now though, so as not to step on Prometheus' toes.

  • Aug. 6, 2011, 12:29 a.m. CST

    Orcus - I need to go read those Dark Horse ALIENS comics soon

    by lv_426

    It has been a long damn time for me as well. I feel that I am about to embark on an Alien/Aliens binge here pretty soon. I've been looking through my copy of The Book of Alien lately. I think I am gonna watch the films, dive into all the behind the scenes stuff on my Alien Anthology set, read the Dark Horse comics, take a gander at Giger's Alien book, and then play some Aliens vs. Predator on the old PS3 (that game got a bum rap I say). Although, I recently nabbed the entire Star Trek movie collection on Blu-ray from Amazon for a steal. So maybe an Alien and Star Trek binge is in order?

  • ... then i'm loving this notion that Scott is making his own Alien trilogy, independent of the rest of the franchise startign with ALIENS. Really, a Scot's ALIEN TRILOGY, how cool would that be? Loads and lots and oodles!

  • Aug. 6, 2011, 6:33 a.m. CST

    I'm also betting Mr Oswalt is aware like everyone else that

    by alexander

    this is not an Alien movie or Prequel, as they have stated clearly from the beggining, and Space Jockey was not the big bad of the origionals, infact he was a corpse, a corpse with a very striking cameo remember? So the Patton analogy doesn't really fit here. Something about the premise and all that... still yes, with the Star Wars saga and Vada and that, well coincimental i guess!

  • Aug. 6, 2011, 6:35 a.m. CST

    these give me a boner

    by alexander

    Sorry I don't have something more thoughtful to contribute. Very exciting...

  • It might have been in one of the Aliens Vs Predator series, but Orcus does remember one of them popping in the midst of a battle and cleaned house with one huge frickin' gun

  • Aug. 7, 2011, 4:42 p.m. CST

    What's a metallic urn?

    by orcus

    Oh about 10 bucks an hour. Yuk yuk yuk

  • Aug. 7, 2011, 7:27 p.m. CST

    mentaldominance, that's not a bad theory about the urns

    by lv_426

    I could see that being what they are for. Also, maybe the eggs are anchored to them, or grow up around these urns? Then when the egg has matured to a certain point, the urn retracts into the floor. It makes sense that the eggs would need to be secured to the floor in some way, being that they're on a starship being hurled through space at God knows what types of speeds.

  • Sort of if the grungier and more industrial sets from ALIEN were infused with a bit of the brighter and more clinical style of the starship interiors of the STAR TREK films/TV shows.

  • Aug. 8, 2011, 6:21 p.m. CST

    Here's some Comic Con Footage...

    by orcus

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LeIce4lc8s

  • Aug. 8, 2011, 7:44 p.m. CST

    My Fan Teaser...

    by angelopoulos

    Here's a link to my teaser using the screen shots and the "Kane's Funeral" music from the original movie... http://youtu.be/_XTcQdd1sXw

  • Aug. 19, 2011, 3:38 p.m. CST

    That was actually good. Bravo!

    by orcus