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Shane Black talks direction of Iron Man 3 and whether or not to expect more Marvel cameos!
Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with juicy tidbits about Shane Black, Robert Downey Jr. and Marvel's approach to Iron Man 3 from Black's very own mouth!
I'll let our eyes and ours on the ground, Krullboy, give you the scoop and come back to discuss after:
Hey Harry--
I spent the weekend at the Omaha Film Festival where Shane Black was one of the featured panelists. He spent the weekend talking about his beginnings, his screenwriting process, and his opinions on various films and scripts he has been involved with over the years. Eventually, Iron Man 3 was brought up.
Some highlights:
He is scheduled to meet with Robert Downey Jr. this week when he returns to L.A. Downey will be contributing to the story and Shane will be writing it in addition to directing.
The studio was not happy with the direction Iron Man 2 took. Iron Man 3 will not be another "two men in iron suits fighting each other" film. Instead, it will be more like a Tom Clancy-thriller, with Iron Man fighting real world villians.
Iron Man 3 will be made after The Avengers and will not feature any other heroes from the Marvel Universe. Marvel is only doing crossover characters to lead up to The Avengers, and once that film is released, the plan is to go back to self-containted single-character stories.
You may call me Krullboy.
One, Marvel should be commended for going with Shane Black. I'm sure Downey had a little something something to do with the move, but it's an inspired choice that, if he's allowed to thrive within the system, should result in a fantastic flick.
Two, Black writing the script as well is great news, especially if he's working in collaboration with Downey.
Thirdly, taking Iron Man in a more political thriller direction is a fantastic choice. And methinks The Mandarin would make a great international baddie, yeah? I could see Black going with a more Nolan-ish take on him... less magic and more real-world threat. And we already know that Favreau has peppered references to him into the first two films (The Ten Rings, etc).
I am a little bummed at the absolute decision to stop crossing over franchises post-Avengers. One of the great things about the books and the ability to play in the Marvel Universe is that all these different stories and characters are happening in one reality (or multiple realities if that goddamned Watcher has anything to say about it).
So, that's the latest. Can't wait to see what Black and Downey bang out!
Thanks for the update, Krullboy. Watch them fingers next time you toss that Glaive!
-Quint
quint@aintitcool.com
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bring on the ten rings organization
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Now I regret not going.... I can't believe my little screenplay about the Loch Ness Monster made their top 9 www.caesarandotto.com
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"...more like a Tom Clancy-thriller"? Sounds pretty awesome but I still don't get it why the hate for IM2?
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before Christopher Nolan and we managed to get some really entertaining flicks in spite of the fact.
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I love the cameos. Please don't ice that.
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So, no more crossovers means no more Avengers films? That seems short-sighted...
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March 7, 2011, 1:59 a.m. CST
Did you remember to check that this event actually happened this time?
by little_lebowski
Because after the whole Matrix sequel debacle, I think a little fact checking wouldn't be bad.
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March 7, 2011, 2:06 a.m. CST
Marvel Studios is not happy with the direction they forced Iron Man 2 to take..
by Jobacca
Thats classic. Everything that went wrong with IM2 was a result of Marvel's meddling. I'm sure Fav thought he'd have a free hand to direct the film himself after the success of the first Iron Man. Hope Shane Black is prepared to bend over and take it with a smile once filming starts.....
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Shane should be writing original specs, not whoring for the studios. Last Action Hero anyone? Not only that, but all of his other previously-announced projects sounded a lot more interesting than Iron Man 3. What happened to his untitled horror movie? To Cold Warrior? To his Doc Savage script? Apparently he did some work on Battle Los Angeles. Meh. Get back to writing originals Mister Black.
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March 7, 2011, 2:38 a.m. CST
went too far in one direction so they go too far in the other - typical
by chargester
I officially got no reason to look forward to this movie apparently.
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It actually felt like a film as opposed to the glorified 100 million dollar TV pilot that they passed off as Iron Man. I was still disappointed that we still get to see Iron Man being Iron Man in that they opened the film with a court case about Iron Man blowing stuff up instead of showing us. This lead me to believe that Marvel are the most tight arse film company on the planet in that they give us three action scene films.
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that Shane is writing than I am that he is directing (although KKBB is a great movie). I am hoping it will have the Ten Rings organization and I hope that future films include super-powered people including the Mandarin.
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For Fuck's sake, they set a sequel date two years in the future against Favreau's desires. Marvel totally fucked that film.
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Hope that remake never happens too.
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... it wasn't great, there was a lot wrong with it - but it was pretty fucking far from being shit. If you guys think that was a shit film you've been seriously spoiled over your young lives.
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It's not Favreau's franchise - it's Marvels. It's not a question of 'doing things against his desires' - he was hired to do a job. That doesn't mean he doesn't have any investment in it, but at the end of the day it's Marvel's franchise, and if they want a release date two years in the future then they will fucking do it - and Favreau's acceptance would be great, but it is not a condition. That is all.
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I don't mean that as an insult to Black or "Krullboy". It's just that Black was put on the spot and just came up with what was on his mind at the time. I'm not buying the Clancy-esque approach and nothing is set in stone. Btw, who the fuck will be Stark's chauffeur if Favreau isn't involved!?
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A techno-loving futurist like Stark, should have his mind kind of shattered by the Avengers movie. Thor, Norse Gods, Skrulls, the cosmic cube, all that shit. All of that would be an excellent reason for him to hit the bottle in a big way. Bring on the alcoholism storyline, because Tony is no longer the biggest fish in a small pond. He is now a very small fish in a pond that was an ocean all along. Then with the 10 rings organisation doing their thing, under the Mandarin, let the solution be that Tony actually realises the rings are alien tech. No other person in the Iron Man suit would have made that connection, but Tony does because he's seen aliens and knows about how their tech works, and thus the events of the Avengers movie allow him to triumph in the third Iron Man movie. I think you'd cover all the bases doing it like that.
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it wasn't a patch on the first, and it had plot holes that were fucking huge, but as entertaining summer popcorn flick, it was just fine.
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March 7, 2011, 3:14 a.m. CST
Fuck, I would have really liked an Arcane Magic Mandarin
by IndustryKiller!
Comic book movies get in trouble when they start apologizing for being fantastic, and despite it's reputation, Batman Begins suffers from a ton of that. Why can't this Marvel universe be full of magic? I would not say Favreu constructed an overly grounded world int eh first two Iron Man films. I think, witht he right tone and structure, you could go as far as having a Fin Fang FOom climax for a Mandarin iron Man, that would be fucking awesome.
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Make him a kingpin style SPECTRE boss or something, fine - but no magic rings please. It's ludicrous, and doesn't fit. I have no problems with aliens however.
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Not ACTUAL magic. So you could go that direction by your standards. I fail to see how that is less ridiculous than arcane magic though, or why none of this fits in the IM Universe, which never seemed remotely realistic to me. I mean what does a superhero film have to have to not be erring toward the Nolan-esque? Superheroes flying around everywhere? geez, it's fucking comic books, and part of what makes them so wonderful is their expansive universe of all kinds of fantastic awesomeness.
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If Black thinks that IM3 is just going to be a stand alone Iron Man film with no other involvement or mention of Cap, Thor, the Avengers, Shield, Nick Fury, Agent Coulson, Black Widow, the Cosmic Cube, Hydra, Loki, Skrulls, Skree, or anybody else that's going to be in that Avengers' film, then he's got another thing coming. After Avengers, every single damn Marvel film coming from Disney is going to be peppered with that stuff. How could it not be? And if you don't put in that stuff, your audience is going to be thinking, "where's Cap, Thor, the Avengers, etc?" DC/Warners is the company that does not want to do crossover stories with major implications on each subsequent film that comes out. Marvel is making that kind of stuff their bread and butter. To completely disregard it after The Avengers would be just plain dumb.
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they understood balance, but the studio is an idiot. Marvel is all about crossovers and cameos and variety in character and genre (including the supernatural). But the extra villains and heroes shouldn't be star turns in a movie; instead they should exist in Bond opening vignette -style and montage. But it would be great to see the different armored foes withe their distinct quirks, colors and themes (take Beetle for instance). Oddly they decided to get away from armor in Whiplash/Blacklash and put him in armor anyway.
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...Why is everyone on it? Dude hasn't done much. Do you guys know him, and he's convinced you with his vision? I'm starting to think you all are a bunch of f*cking hipsters.
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The only part I like of the film is the intro in Russian when Ivan's father says "Vanya." Rest of film? What the fuck happened? What was I watching? Whatever it was, it was a disjointed mess. I won't be watching the third unless the goddamn MANDARIN is the villain! Collin Chou + Mandarin = perfect casting. http://www.imdb.com/media/rm2556532224/tt0865556 He already was the Mandarin more or less and has the skills to play the part. Search your heart, you know this to be true.
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March 7, 2011, 4:23 a.m. CST
Iron Man 2 was horrible when comparing it to the first. Compared to Yoga Bear its the Godfather
by ndally
So anyone who says "you can't call Iron Man 2 shit compared to all the other garbage movies out there" well yes you can because it's all relative. The first one was pretty good so when we expect pretty good or even better than it's fair to say this sequel was garbage. It had to few action scenes like buddy above said AND Don Cheadle was fucking HORRIBLE. Don Cheadle was worse than Terrance Howard. He seemed to short and weak, he has a pussy voice and his acting felt like he was reading lines. Don't even get me started on that idiotic science experiment that leads to Tony creating a new element. That was just insanely dumb. Robert Downey Jr was annoying this time around. Sure I can appreciate his witty quips but it's like he takes nothing seriously. I still think they made a huge mistake at the end of #1 when he decides to tell the world he is Iron Man. I don't care if it did or did not happen in the comics it just takes some of the fun out when all the characters know who the superhero is and you don't get that double identity thing going ala Spiderman 2. Also the music in both films SUCK!!!! Why can't Superhero films have iconic scores anymore? The best Superhero score made within the last 10 years is both Hulk movies. They had excellent music and some king of theme. Iron Man is the perfect Super-Hero to have a great theme you can hum like Superman or Burtons Batman. So Shane Black if you are reading this rambling post please hire a composer with some balls who can write a good theme. Oh and kill of Don Cheadle. Anyone else think Cheadle was awful in Iron Man 2? One more thing I don't get is the first Iron Man had more action scenes and cost 180 million according to box office mojo yet Iron Man 2 cost 210 million. Where did all that money go? That lame car race sequence which was 2 minutes long? Or the End with the horrible CGI? I cant beleive Iron Man 2 was given a pass by most of the staff on this site. It's on par with Spider-Man 3 for me but at least Spider-Man 3 had action.
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OK, not sure how that contradicts anything I said. You are absolutely correct it is Marvel's film and of course they call all the shots. They just made poor decisions. I said Jon Favreau was being scape-goated - i.e., the blame for the problems with IM2 are being laid at Favreau's feet. The problems of IM2 were due to Marvel's actions, not Favreau's.
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"Downey will be contributing to the story" -- It's over. And as for the direction of Iron Man 2 - Marvel always blames their previous films as a momentary lack of judgement - they said he same thing about Spiderman 2 - these fucking films are the Steven Seagal movies of this generation.
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In his original origin he came across an alien ship that appeared to be powered by various stones. He fashioned the stones into ten rings, each with a separate power. It doesn't have to have magic at all.
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I still think Shane Black's absence from any of the Lethal Weapon sequels is a big part of why none of the three follow ups even came close to matching the original. Jon Favreau was on a pretty good streak with Made Men, Zathura and Iron Man. He dropped the ball with Iron Man 2, though. I just couldn't get into it.<br /> <br /> Hopefully, Shane can bring some real bite back to the franchise. I loved "Kiss, Kiss, Bang, Bang".
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The problem with Iron-Man 2 wasn't all the Avengers crossover but rather than lame as hell Tony is dying until he's magically saved by an element that his dad magically inserted Da Vinco code style in a model. You take that out and you have a pretty tight film. I'm also not taking the 'no cameos' thing literally. I think they mean that there will be no Thor flying around swinging a giant hammer towards the screen in 3-D to have cameo. There'll be references I'm sure.
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Is that Tony's father apparently had begun work on a better arc reactor even before he had invented the first fucking arc reactor. Moreover, the only improvement the better arc reactor seems to have is that it doesn't poison you when you use it as a replacement for your heart. Man, that pappa Stark really knew how to cover his bases.
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He wasn't even ATTEMPTING a character. Just same slick Sam jackson that he plays in every other god damn film. You could tell he also didn't want to let Downey steal the scenes, so he tried to out quip him. It failed.
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March 7, 2011, 5:11 a.m. CST
Bruce Willis should have played Nick Fury. Sam Jackson is only cool to suburban white people.
by Professor_Monster
Marvel is a garbage dump. I was looking over pics of the Red Skull and noticed there are no swastika on his uniform or any of the WW2 enemy?!? WTF? All we're going to get is the hydra octopus? Are these the same type of "real world" threats that Iron Man will be facing? The company is a joke. How about making some good movies so you don't have to apologize for the previous ones? No. No. That would take real producers, not money men.
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that every Marvel film isn't an opportunity to introduce more characters. Fans aren't stupid (most of them, anyway) and saw how Spider-Man 3 shoehorned too many characters into a film–characters that in comics continuity would not necessarily work that well together–so why would they go and make the same mistake? No, one character per film is a good thing, till there's another big event, in which case you introduce the main characters via their own films (if Marvel's current plans are the benchmark) then follow-up with the Big Kahuna of all superhero movies. And while I have not yet read any of the comments prior yet, I happened to notice some Sam Jackson Nick Fury hate. The role is his, and short of something happening serious enough to break his contract, he's going to be Nick Fury and people need to let it go. Sam Jackson does really well with the role, so when people are complaining I wonder what it is that really is bothering them.
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with a lead who's more depressing buffoon than hero. That was a good arc in the comics, but it would really slog down a movie.
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March 7, 2011, 6:57 a.m. CST
With Shane Black IM3 is going to be a lot better than that pos IM2 fuckfest
by KilliK
FACT
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With the Mandarin! A Fu Man Chu inspired evil magician with ten rings of power! And that book was often filled with other superhero cameo's! I have a Ghost Rider Iron Man team team up somewhere... Or How about Iron Man Extremis? Where ironMan fights a super man taken over by a computer virus. Iron Man blasting bad guys, flying into battle against The Wrecking Crew? (secret wars) Well they got a better idea. Make it more "realistic" I want my supervillians with my superheros and the more fantasy the better.
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handle big blockbuster movies, with loads of SFX, do you guys honestly think any major and minor studio will give a 1st time director the full reins with a massive blockbuster wihtout providing them with a team that pretty much covers SFX sound etc without the director having to dealwith it all
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I want Iron Man to actually fight people and not people in metal suits either.
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March 7, 2011, 7:07 a.m. CST
I bet Iron Man 2's problem IS because of Downey's involvement in the script. Favreau had to accomodate them, but ruined the movie in the process.
by Se7en
Downey : I want this, I want that. Favreau : sigh.
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I like how it wasn't all action, but a character study of Iron Man and Stark. I am on board for whomever is nervous about Downey contributing to the story. When that happens, you have a 50/50 shot of the material becoming garbage.
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March 7, 2011, 7:12 a.m. CST
Since we are getting Thor in the cinematic MU is too much to ask for
by KilliK
Mandarin for the new bad guy in IM3? If Marvel's reasoning for not using him as a villain,is that they dont want to offend the asians because the character is a politically incorrect stereotype of an older era,then they should follow DC's example where they re-imagined Bane by changing his race from Latin into that of white Causcasian in order not to offend the South Americans,especially now with the immigration problem in the USA,and do the exact same thing. But you need guts to do that,right?
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This sounds like a good direction. Bring down the silliness/camp factor. This is a property that people will be angry no matter what happens.
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Not a good way to start my week, Marvel. I'm not buying it though. If The Avengers movie ends up being a wild success, how could you not continue to pepper your movies with cameos of other Marvel characters??? We're all supposed to believe that after whatever threat they defeat in The Avengers, everyone goes back to their solitary lives and never talk to each other again? Not buying it. At all.
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March 7, 2011, 7:23 a.m. CST
The Studio has a real fucking nerve from the sounds of things
by Smack_Teddy
but ok... alright... ok....
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Marvel sells comics and toys, I somehow doubt they (along w Disney) will make this a series a la 24. If anything, they'll try to shoehorn some intrigue into another story that end with Stark punching something w his iron fists. And that's what these movies are supposed to be!
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IM vs FirePower. nuff said.
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Wait...what??? I didn't think so. Was it as good as the first? no, but still better than some other sequels, especially superhero ones. I take this news with a grain of salt. No other crossovers with other superheroes? If this was produced by Fox, that would happen, but Marvel is producing Iron Man. Have Cap teach Tony some fighting moves so he doesn't always rely on the armor. What will happen to Rhodey/War Machine? It's too soon for Black to say what exactly will/won't be in IM3. I'm a little disappointed that Favreau won't be back. The fact he did such great work with the first 2 and playing Happy was great. Overall, I hope this isn't a repeat of X3, by changing directioon too much.
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March 7, 2011, 7:30 a.m. CST
IM2 was not excellent.it was piece of shit,trash,garbage,fuckfest,
by KilliK
cowa-fucking-piece-of-dog-shit,this movie is diarrhea coming out of Fauvreu's dick.
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stale, turgid, beige, I like the 'thriller' angle but could it be a thriller set in a recognisable MU please? War Machine kinda has to be in it, they set him up and lets face it he's never getting his own flick. Manderin would be perfect but it still needs mad action with crazy superhero shit. IM2 was good and gets better with multiple watchings.
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March 7, 2011, 7:34 a.m. CST
To those that don't seem to get it, the films will start working like the original comics did...
by Chewtoy
Iron Man, Cap and Thor will have solo adventures in their own series, while coming together in Avengers films to deal with an interconnected universe. If Avengers does well, there will definitely be an Avengers 2. I just suspect that future Avengers films may become a way to launch individual character franchises than the other way around. There would probably still be little references in the backgrounds... Stark Industries logos, and definitely SHIELD, for instance. If Avengers goes well, they might increase things to name dropping or other direct references, but they'll want to keep the uniqueness of the characters coming together to make the next Avengers an Event film again. Otherwise, you go from having 4 franchises to 1 franchise with 4 titles. The Tom Clancy bit is exactly what they should do with Iron Man for 2 reasons: 1, the terrorist stuff from the first film was what worked the best out of both movies, and 2, for the person complaining that the audience will expect the other heroes to show up and help, if the shit hits the fan while Iron Man is in Singapore, nobody is going to expect Cap or Thor are right there to lend a hand.
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SUPERHERO/VILLAIN CAMEOS = MORE TOY MERCHANDISING. superhero/supervillain cameos pad weak, underdeveloped story/plot and geek audience doesnt notice bcuz geek audience is placed in euphoric state of bliss. im3= fury+shield+whatever else.
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damn sure wasn't one in IMII. And for the love of god, bring back Terrance Howard. Don Cheadle does not fit into the Iron Man universe and has zero chemistry with Downey, despite being an otherwise phenomenal actor.
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so I don't get the hate. They're both fun summer movies. And do we really want an Iron Man movie anything like a Tom Clancy book? If the Avengers makes a shit ton of money I cant see this no more other characters thing lasting long.
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With my absolute control of the market for tiny, peeled and canned orange slices, I... shall rule the WORLD! All will quake before me!
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How exactly are all these mega-multi-picture deals that some of these actors have signed up for going to happen if they are not crossing over in some fashion? If Avengers makes a killing (which it will) there will be an Avengers 2. Now, there may be some roster changes, but there's gotta be a few of the heavy hitters involved at least. There is no way that Marvel can resist the temptation to pepper in some heroes here and there.
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March 7, 2011, 8:15 a.m. CST
"The studio was not happy with the direction Iron Man 2 took
by Rupee88
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March 7, 2011, 8:16 a.m. CST
"The studio was not happy with the direction Iron Man 2 took"
by Rupee88
lol....some lies are just too funny. The studio is the one that rushed it into production with an incomplete shitty script as a quick cash grab. It worked of course. They are smart at making money off a dumb audience.
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Or else we are headed for Superman Lex like villains.
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We love everything about a piece of news especially if they give us exclusive interviews. Iron Man is not Nick Fury, he should be fighting industrialists and other men in suits or maybe some fantastic characters like Mandarin or Fing Fang Foom. No cameos is big loss since the point of these films is to show a universe.
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I enjoyed both Iron Man films but I did think they needed to get beyond the frothy superhero hi-jinks of a pair of CGI mechs battling each other. For me the most entertaining scenes were the human scenes. In particular I liked the scenes where Tony is constructing his proto-suit and then later his other suits. In Iron Man 2 I liked the court room scene where the government is trying to steal his tech. I'd like to see more of that stuff. I think a more interesting and political approach coupled with a human villain is the way to go. The Mandarin makes sense, he's Iron Man's Joker after all. I just hope they don't go for a "Fuck yeah" Americana movie extolling the virtues of industrialism and not giving a shit about the global consequences. I want some sort of political reckoning and understanding to happen in this one, I want to see Iron Man become more than a fucking action figure with funny lines and convenient product placement. Just make it a film that doesn't insult its adult audience. Iron Man 2, while entertaining, felt like a total brain freeze, while Iron Man managed to find the balance. Oh and bring back Sam Rockwell for more Hammer because he was easily the best thing in 2.
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wait till you see it dubbed in Mainland China. The dubbing is so much better in Thailand. I miss L.A. Come to think of it, in IM3 you may see Mandarin speaking.. Mandarin(eating Mandarin oranges too).
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I can't wait for this and think it's gonna be the best Iron Man movie for some reason. I love the direction they are taking and Shane Black is an amazing writer(his 90s work is unmatched in terms of Hollywood action/thrillers e.g. The Last BoyScott, Lethal Weapons, ect) I loved the first one for it's carefree fun. It was a great summer movie. The 2nd one was amazing and just as good as the original until the 1hr mark and then it became pretty shitty. Right after, the race car sequence everything became too much at once, way too long, and totally not focused. It wanted to be four movies at once. The ending was utter video game nonsense.
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March 7, 2011, 9:03 a.m. CST
Ok. IM2 SUCKED BECAUSE OF THAT LAME "new element" DISCOVERY, DON CHEADLE AND THE MUSIC
by ndally
Oh and Tony acts like Jon Stewart from the daily show. I'm all for witty remarks but common at least show some kind of emotion besides "witty ironic quip that sounds improvised"
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March 7, 2011, 9:06 a.m. CST
OH AND LACK OF ACTION. 2.5 actions scenes cost 210 million?? Whaa?
by ndally
Where did that money go? Certainly wasn't the music budget. I want a god damn superhero theme i can hum besides Superman or '80s Batman
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They just poorly handled whip lash and created another boring machine vs machine battle at the end. Not a deal breaker but kind of annoying considering it did feel rushed out the door.
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March 7, 2011, 9:17 a.m. CST
I thought the Mandarin was Alien Tech based no Magic! Then again I havent read a book with the Mandarin in 20 years.
by MRJONZ72
But if I do remember correctly why is that so hard to translate in a movie universe when we getting Thor and apparently the Skrulls in The Avengers!
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March 7, 2011, 9:21 a.m. CST
EDIT: I thought the Mandarin rings were Alien Tech based and not Magic! Then again I havent read a book with the Mandarin in 20 years.
by MRJONZ72
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Calm down, you nutty Englishman.
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...can KINGDOM COME be far behind? That would absolutely rule the day. As for a JLA movie, I'm all for having it be animated like the online DC universe game. That would be amazing to watch.</p> <p> Most DC animated films are better than their live-action films and leagues ahead of the Marvel animated movies.
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in the comis and he has his rings infused in his spine,so Marvel could use this version if they want to have him as the new villain.
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March 7, 2011, 9:29 a.m. CST
Exactly, once Thor is introduced, and we see Iron Man next to him.
by Super Joker
It will mean the likes of The Mandarin will work without having to mess around with his character. If anything Thor will do a lot to 'open up' the Marvel Studios movies and let the audience get to grips with seeing "magic" from other worlds and "science" that is a little more closer to home co-existing quite well. If anything Thor and The Avengers movies will do a lot to lift the lid off the likes of the Hulk, Iron Man and Captain America franchises, or at least allow them to incorporate more abstract ideas without having to explain everything with science or something. I think Thor is a more important film than people realise. Depending on how they're received they'll either help or hinder future movies as executives will find faith in magic superheroes and villains if those projects work out, or lose it entirely if they bomb.
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March 7, 2011, 9:34 a.m. CST
So we can have a thunder god with a magic hammer, but rings with special abilities is too much?
by brokentusk
No one wants an IRON MAN political thriller. You might think you do, but you don't.
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Is there a reason AICN readers are so negative about everything? I read comments at other sites too, and there's a bit more balance and actual REASONS given for liking or not liking something other than: 'It's Gay' or 'Total crap'or' Overrated' or ;Hack'. I was trying to figure out why 'The cape' got cancelled (I was smart enough not to bother watching that one) and it took 75 posts before anyone could give me an explanation of WHY it 'sucked'. Anyway, Iron Man 2 was a decent movie.
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Here at AICN, it's tradition to shit on a movie and NOT give a reason of why you think that. Get with the program!
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I'm shocked that so many people didn't like IM2. I thought it was decent, though I also thought that some things were a bit ham fisted and over the top (the showdown with all the drones at the end and the superconductor constructed in a day or two down in the garage). Otherwise, I thought it was a solid movie and a good development of the character, including the boozing and realizing what a dick he was.</p> <p> Before THE DARK KNIGHT, plenty of people may have objected to a more cerebral Batman, but look how utterly amazing that movie was. I loved the action, but I equally loved the dialog and themes running throughout. It's always been a bit cheesy that Batman won't kill anyone, but that's the character from the comics.</p> <p> Personally, I'm glad to see studios taking superheroes seriously. We should be happy at the turn things are taking. Yes, the studios are still mucking things up (such as changing the character of Hal Jordan in the upcoming GREEN LANTERN movie to a joking wuss striving to develop a backbone), but at least the budgets and story are there to make up for the quibbles.
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March 7, 2011, 10:23 a.m. CST
It's got to be Mandarin - wasn't it referenced in the first movie
by Andy Pandy
as a terrorist organization?
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Apparently, IM will be able to completely cut himself off from any ramifications of allying himself with a group of super heroes the likes of which the world has never seen before after they save the planet from from an evil Asgardin lord and a massive alien invasion! Go for it tiger blood...Winning!
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wouldn't it be wise to subtly gear audiences up for that film? do think that it was lame the way IM2 just repeated the ending of part 1 though..a guy steals Starks technology, builds a robot suit, and they duke it out...lame.
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March 7, 2011, 11:20 a.m. CST
Marvel has been known to make some stupid decisions before
by deelzbub
add this to the list
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...so getting our panties in a bunch right now about tone and story and all that seems a bit unnecessary. Let's just wait and see what happens.
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Don't get me wrong, I like Don Cheadle, but he was wrong for this role. Terrence and Robert had great chemistry.
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March 7, 2011, 11:53 a.m. CST
At *least* throw in references to other characters and situations
by D.Vader
Throw us fanboys a bone somewhere.
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Lemme guess, IronMan vs The Iron Patriot? No crossovers? Uh, Pass!
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BORING. We want Manderin you morons. These suits never understand shit it seems. They pushed Fav to make a fast and messy IM2 and then blame him for it? Then they decide no Iron Man needs to be more like The Dark Knight... The ultra real take on things can really only work for Batman. No Iron Man needs super villains not more terrorists with machine guns.
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I'm not sure that's true at all. I think there were enough very loud people who made a big deal about Widow and Fury in Iron Man II. Most people I know had no problem with them, or any of the Avengers stuff in Iron Man 2. In fact we all felt it really enhanced the movie. Removing the cross-overs and cameos from the Marvel Cinematic Universe completely negates one of the prime reasons for setting it up in the first place! Hopefully this is just Marvel overreacting and giving Downey Jnr some room to do what he wants with Iron Man. If this is true then the Marvel Studios movies just got a whole lot less interesting for me and they should stop calling these films part of the "Marvel Cinematic Universe", because they just killed it off, before it was even fully formed.
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March 7, 2011, 12:57 p.m. CST
Doesn't Black realize that one of the best scenes from the IronMan films were..
by Stalkeye
...the post credits in which SMJ made his debut as Nick Fury and had given Stark and offer to join The Avengers? Or what about the discovery of Mojinir in new mexico? Shame on you Shane! Let's get Jon back in his saddle post Cowboys and Aliens cause I'm not impressed by what Black has to offer. Fuck This Shit!
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It's kind of a tradition in the comics. Not only that but the comraderie is cool. If you have a superpower (or supersuit) it just makes sense to help other colleagues and peers. Using the cross-over thing for now just to promote The Avengers movie seems kind of lame now.
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I don't get it. Did they really say that about Spidey 2? I thought that Spider-man 2 is still widely accepted as one of the best comic book movies ever. Spidey 2 and X-Men 2 (along with Blade 1&2) are still by FAR my fave Marvel flicks. Has Marvel begun to snub it?
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Come on... isn't the Mandarin just a little... Fu Manchuish? Might as well have a villain called the Yerrow Craw.
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sorry.
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About ten minutes after they finish counting the first weekends money from Avengers the sequel (nay, trilogy since "that was what they intended all along") will be greenlighted. They say that the crossovers will stop but we all know that's bullshit. Money calls the shots and if Avengers makes monster bank it will be mined as many times as they can get away with it and that will include the cameos and post-credit teasers that we've seen so far.
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After Avengers takes in a billion dollars, and it might, there will be other crossovers. Shane Black might think he has a little autonomy, but he he doesnt.
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That was fantastic.
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Followed by SM 1, X-Men and X-Men 2.
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It was one of the worst movies of 2010. It was like, Hey, the first movie was good, so now we can afford to just fuck around and pick the audience's pockets. Fucking abominable in plot, character, story and execution. Everybody involved should have worn a paper bag over their heads for a week after its release.
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what does that mean? are they going to just ignore the comic book universe? Does a character like Mandarin fit into a Tom Clancy thrilleresque universe? Why do they think going in a Tom Clancy kind of direction will fix what was wrong with Iron Man 2? Me No Get It.
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But sadly we know that will never happen.
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March 7, 2011, 2:26 p.m. CST
I Sony even allowed to mention other Marvel characters in the SM films?
by SithMenace
Or show them in the background?
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and then he showed me his electro-blast ring, upside down.
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How about "and this giant fag with a hammer". I always thought it would be cool if Raimi somehow did a flashback to the Secret Wars and showed Peter finding the symbiote as chaos unfolds behind him, maybe with silhouetted superheroes. I know that's just shitty pipe dreams now, but I thought it would have been better than the literally 1 in 6 billion chance of the symbiote touching down right next to an unmasked superhero.
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No more crossovers? No more supervillains? No offense, but Iron Man vs the Afghani terrorists in the first movie was the most groan-inducing part of that movie. The only Tom Clancy book that made a good movie was Hunt For Red October, so unless Iron Man will be fighting suddenly resurrected Soviet bad guys, YAWN to this. Honestly, supervillains and crossovers were NOT what was wrong with Ironman 2. I would just say that Mickey Roarke paired with a OCP-esque Sam Rockwell wasn't a fascinating pair of villains is all, and Stark himself was too damned depressed what him fucking DYING and all. That's what was wrong, forced angst, not the fun comic book elements!
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... the plots of the GameCube X-men games were miles better than the dreary dreck of any of the three movies (or Wolverine); and the Marvel Ultimate Alliance games I played on the Xbox 360 (#1 for extraterrestrial peril and #2 for a decent political thriller adaptation of Civil War) are ten times as dense and exciting as the Iron Mans.
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With all this build up to "The Avengers"... it seems silly to me to go back to strictly stand alone stuff afterwards. Marvel should keep the universe going with cameos galore...
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March 7, 2011, 3:28 p.m. CST
Aren't we getting ahead of ourselves here?
by HarryKnowlesNonExistentInceptionReview
My guess is at least two, if not all three of the big superhero movies this year are going to bomb or at least underperform. I'm guessing Captain America: Not Captain A_____a and Green Lantern (sad to say, love the character, hate the movie-destroying douche they hired to portray him) with Thor being the unexpected win and moneymaker. Next year is Whedon's Avengers and he's been in shaky territory since Buffy and that was like a decade ago and Zach Snyder's Superman, both of which have a high likelihood of tanking. Then it's the Dark Night Gets a Boner (Sorry, but DK Rises is the worst title EVER) and even Nolan can't pull a third win out of his ass. No franchise in history has ever had a successful, non-sucky third installment. It's like a new band's sophomore slump, the sucky second album, except with films, it's always the third movie, so maybe it's a "junior slump"? Whatever. Anyway, after that, I don't think there's going to be much interest in superhero films for awhile and a lot of stuff will likely get put on the back burner, i. e. Iron Man 3. And anyway, IR 2 was horrible, I tried to watch it 3, count 'em, THREE times and fell asleep or was bored into turning off the Blu-Ray each time. Why do we need another? The first one was great and can't be topped, why bother. That said, I don't blame Favreau, I blame the suits, the clowns who could look at Dante's Inferno and ask, "could the Dante character have a CGI talking dog as sort of a comic foil and companion, and can the dog also be gay?" Good luck Shane Black, but chances are, if the suits f'd over Favreau, who turned in a huge money-maker and didn't get an iota of cred for it, the same suits are going to positively ream you hollow.
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in my opinion.
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Don't forget about The Amazing Spider-Man. Between that and The Dark Knight Rises, 2012 is probably going to be the better year for superhero films.
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Is kind of like me having sex. A lot of build up, but when the good part comes along, the parts we want to get to...it seemed like it was over in 3 minutes...but I still enjoyed it. Just could have been som much better. I like a movie like a slow burn. Take your time making me care...but the payoff better be satisfying. Once IM2 got the final showdown...it seemed like I yawned and missed it (kind of like my girlfriend). Anyways...I'd like more of a thriller Iron Man movie like promised above...
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but as a film as a whole it sucked. Just stating the obvious here. carry on.
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March 7, 2011, 3:37 p.m. CST
And I'm not looking forward to Johnston or Whedon's films
by SithMenace
I don't like anything either one of them has done.
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I've watched Spiderman 3 3 times. I love it haha.
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I don't see Thor performing that well - if it does, great, but nobody in the general populace knows what the fuck Thor as a character is about, and the trailer gives us an underwhelming look at some flirtatious douche in the desert who looks great but says little of consequence...the Asgard scenes look like a glossy chunk or personality-free CGI intersperced with a generic looking creature straight out of Straship Troopers. Something about it screams mid-80's fantasy flick on a budget. More expensive, but still cruddy. Thor needs to be sprawling, epic, and this just looks cheesy - but I hope I'm proved wrong. As a non-American, I'd say Captain America will perform well both here, and surprise people by doing the same overseas. As for Green Lantern, man, I agree about that one-note wonder Ryan Reynolds...filling in the blanks with his performance here, well, at least in the few minutes we've seen. Completely divorced from the character as I know it, but again...should reserve complete and utter slamming till the frigging thing opens.
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I've read more than once that Avengers is going to be a triology of films - most of the cast is already signed up for three Avengers films as well as their respective trilogies. Chris Evans mentioned that in a recent interview.
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March 7, 2011, 4:54 p.m. CST
No more Sam Jackson cameos? No more hammy performances?
by HollywoodHellraiser
GREAT!!!! Sign me up! Now get Howard back and make IM3 a kickass film!
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Wasn't it the studio that forced Jon to pushed IM2 into that direction??? Looks like Marvel is up to its old tricks of blaming everyone but themselves! Guess that means RDJ is next on their shit list!
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If Avengers flops, then they don't have to break any promises about sequels they had planned. The Avengers is a risk. It could tank, it could get critically panned. It might not. I think what they're trying to do is manoeuvre into a position of being able to cut bad brands loose without harming their stronger franchises. The other advantage is that it keeps the hype machine focussed on The Avengers as it could be the only one. They probably want to do several in reality, and will do if it's a hit. If Avengers is a hit we'll see a sequel, no doubt about it.
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March 7, 2011, 5:10 p.m. CST
I also wish Marvel Studios could somehow get Spidey, X-Men and the Fantastic Four rights back.
by Super Joker
I just want to see what Marvel are capable of with their strongest characters. The Marvel Studios versions will become the "official" ones over time, it's a shame that Spidey and X-Men in particular will never be part of that. For me I still consider the Spidey/XMen/FF films to be somewhat bootlegged versions.
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But it did renew my appreciation of Scarlett's ass. When she was helping Stark get ready for his party? That catsuit entrance in the doughnut shop? Good god. Off to Youtube I go.
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after the excellent setup from IM. Don't get me wrong as I thought IM2 was good but it merely tread water instead of breaking new ground.
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March 7, 2011, 7:17 p.m. CST
WAIT A MINUTE! COULD THIS BE.....? YES... YES, IT IS! ITS REALLY AN AICN SCOOP!
by J-Dizzle
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Iron Man has plenty of good, workable rogues that would work in this type of film. Madame Masque, Living Laser, and Ghost all come immediately to mind, plus you can always bring back Hammer. Plus, Hydra may be taken, but you could always use AIM.
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I'm interested in the Avengers movie because it seems kind of like an experiment to me... but I'm not one of the fans who's been clamoring for a Wolverine/Spider-Man crossover on film. There's just not enough time per film to devote to each character's rules/problems/villains (yes it takes you longer to watch a movie than it takes to read a comic book -- hopefully -- but there's at least one of those a month as opposed to 3 years). Also, if they're not interesting enough to carry their own movie, then they probably shouldn't be in one. Anyway Shane Black is awesome and I'm looking forward to this movie no matter what they say about it.
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I'll be happy. He must be one of Favreau's buddies. Doesn't fit the movies at all.
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Plot, characters, script, acting, action, actors, sets, it was all complete rubbish. Dumb, aimless, empty, a complete waste of time. And I say this as someone who loved the first one. IM's not Tom Clancy or James Bond. Downey may want to play James Bond, or some modern techno Sherlock Holmes, but that's not IM. As unexpectedly brilliant as the first IM film was, the franchise couldn't escape the inherent limitation: IM's not a very deep character, and his world is not all that intriguing for the most part. Both the utterly worthless IM2 and the proposed direction for this one seem desperate, like a way to wring something out of the property that isn't there. But good luck to these guys in getting away from gimmicks and coming up with something solid. Leave out Jackson and Johansson, bring back Howard if you can, and give us a good adventure story. There probably isn't much mileage left in this thing, so give us a respectable action-fantasy, preferably with the Mandarin, and go out on a high note.
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But I didn't think it was awful. There was just too much going on to feel satisfied by it all. You got the government trying to claim the IM suit, Justin Hammer trying to develop his own, Ivan Vanko attacking things, Pepper taking over Stark Ent, conflict with Rhodey, Stark anticipating his death because of the ARC reactor in his chest.... and when it was all resolved I just felt shortchanged. As if not one thing was important enough for the movie to focus on. They have a cheap 2 minute fight with Whiplash in the last 10 minutes and I'm supposed to feel like they won? If they had focused on making Rourke's Vanko a convincing villain rather than forcing him in here and there when RDJ was riffing on camera, it might have been better. The film just lacked focus. It almost reminded me of Ocean's 12: the cast & director feel so comfy that they forget they're supposed to be filming a coherent film. As for IM fighting "real world" villains? Really? After Loki and the Skrulls?
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March 7, 2011, 11:11 p.m. CST
Wow Nolan-ism is the 'nothing' in the Neverending story...
by Toruk_Makto
Sucking the magic and joy out of fantasy universes everywhere. I can't wait to see what universe it strikes next...
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That was a great, solid story. I know Tony Stark ain't out as IM in that, but they could make it work
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i'm getting to be a bit of an apostate on superhero movies in general; too many of them suck. Inception might have just paved the way for a little cyberpunk. Here's why Wolverine sucked: idiotic to do a straight origin story--much more interesting would have been the story of Wolvie riding off to Alaska to figure out where the hell he came from. And IM2 sucked in part because the 'snappy dialogue' actually sucked. the dialogue during the ride in the humvee at the start of IM1 kicked the entire IM2 script. Just 'cause RDjr's got the snappy deliver doesn't mean what he's saying is any good, and just 'cause he and Paltrow talk over each other doesn't mean this is Altman quality. crossovers would work much better in a tv series. just not enough time in an action flick to fill it full of random superdudes.
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So the lesson learned from Iron Man 2, is to place a character who is a Zillionaire Engineering Genius who fights crime in a brightly colored robot suit...into a Tom Clancy type thriller? (Smacks forehead and rolls eyes). It's no coincidence that one of the most popular parts of Iron Man 1 was when Nick Fury showed up and named dropped The Avengers.
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this is stupid
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All that does is bring the action closer to the action and style of the first film. Not that big a deal. The best action scene (as short as it was) in IM2 was the race track scene. The rest got repetitive. I was excited for sort of a "Demon in a Bottle"/"Armor Wars" story line, but it was too much story for one movie and not enough of either.
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Scarlett enters an empty room dressed in a skintight black leather catsuit (slightly unzipped) and carrying a jar of marbles. She spills the jar of marbles on the floor. She then bends over slowly and picks a marble up and drops it back in the jar. She then bends down for another. Film from many different angles and air for ninety minutes...
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on getting all there properties under one movie studio buying back the rights to the X-men Daredevil, F4, Punisher, and Spiderman.
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He just told the press that Batman's nemesis is gonna be an old school villain, and it didn't sound like he was talking about Catwoman. I also didn't think it was Bane, since he came along in the last 20 years or so. So it sounds like there's gonna be 3 villains in the movie.
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and surely not Penguin, the mafia boss?
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Live as one of them, Kal-El, to discover where your strength and your power are needed. Always hold in your heart the pride of your special heritage. They can be a great people, Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you... my only son. ~Jor-El, Superman: The Movie (1978)
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My guess is they wanna have separate "franchises", not just one big Avengers story. So they make separate character movies, with no real crossovers, but with references to the Marvel Universe. Then they pick the most fitting (highest grossing?) ones to be in Avengers 2,3,4- 100. Kinda like the comics, in a way...
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June 13, 2011, 8:36 p.m. CST
YOU GO SHANE BLACK! BRING BACK THE ACTION MOVIE GENRE!!!!
by IronEagle74
It's been dead for about 20 years.
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I know of no movies where mutiple villains worked.
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