Movie News

Heard some rumors on THE DARK KNIGHT RISES that sound interesting...

Published at: Dec. 4, 2010, 2:25 a.m. CST

Hey folks, Harry here with the latest bit of info I've gathered on THE DARK KNIGHT RISES... How reliable is this? Well, we'll see, right. For now, take this as pure rumor, but don't be too surprised if I'm right. I'll call my source on this, "Clayface" - It seems that Chris & Jonathan Nolan and that David Goyer have been digging deep for the villain. In fact, Batman first went up against this guy in 1940 in the pages of Detective Comics. The word is, Tom Hardy is playing Dr. Hugo Strange, who has a bit of an obsession surrounding The Batman. Strange how common that seems to be in Gotham. In fact - it seems that Nolan and crew are exploiting that great PREY arc that was written by Doug Moench and illustrated by the great Paul Gulacy and Terry Austin - and ran from September of 1990 to February 1991. I remember the storyline right after Clayface spilt the slightest details. This is actually, just about the most perfect storyline to start up, given where DARK KNIGHT left off. It involves a Taskforce out to get BATMAN headed by Gary Oldman's Gordon. I love the idea of Tom Hardy playing Hugo Strange, who plots to kill and takeover being The Batman, himself. In the comics, the attack on Batman is multi-faceted and extremely psychological, as that is why Hugo has the Dr. in front of his name. It brings the Fear Gas back in a very effective manner. And well, seek out the issues if you want to ... oh, just read a great yarn. I'm fairly positive that this team is putting their own particular spin on it - but how many of you want to see a crazy fucking Tom Hardy dressing up like Batman? I know I do. I'm fairly jazzed about... this, um, rumor. Let's see what happens...

Readers Talkback

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  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:27 a.m. CST

    Can't wait

    by Double M

    Already sounds better than this Cap and Lantern Shite

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:19 a.m. CST

    If this is true, that sounds awesome

    by DeanCubed

    And with that, I'm officially going DARK on the Dark Knight Rises. No more spoilers for me!! Also: Third?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:29 a.m. CST

    Sweet Deal

    by res8323

    Sounds good to me.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:30 a.m. CST

    first and foremost

    by ttomato

    dr. hugo strange, check. return or fear gas. check. batman 3 on track for goodness.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:20 a.m. CST

    fucking promising

    by Ogmios_the_Eloquent

    that idea rocks.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:21 a.m. CST

    I hope that……

    by Tyrawrr

    Tom Hardy can get the "Batman" voice Bale has maliciously developed because that would be comic gold.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:23 a.m. CST

    meh...seems rehashed

    by killianx

    I mean elements of that story run through the first 2 movies...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:23 a.m. CST

    This is FUCKING OLD

    by christophermoltosante

    And heres the proof http://batman-news. com/2010/11/16/rumor-is-tom-hardy-playing-hugo-strange-in-the-dark-knight-rises/

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:39 a.m. CST

    Umm I already heard the Tom Hardy as Hugo Strange rumor

    by MRJONZ72

    About 2 or 3 weeks ago..that is all.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:39 a.m. CST

    Prey was one of the more memorable Batman stories

    by tjrmusic

    It would be great to see elements of it in the next film

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:40 a.m. CST

    who the hell is Tom Hardy

    by tailhook

    People never had to ask that about Heath Ledger. Why is it comic book movies seem to be casting nobodies as heroes/villains? You have Andrew 'he's from across the pond?' Garfield as Spider-man and now this nobody as a lead villain. You'd think with all that TDK money they made and with what they'll spend on this new film, you'd think they could spend hire someone with some name recognition.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:51 a.m. CST

    I didn't see that hit...

    by HEADGEEK

    but I was shown 'proof' in a manner of speaking that convinced me to go with this.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:51 a.m. CST

    tailhook

    by HEADGEEK

    if you don't know who Tom Hardy is, you're the idiot

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:52 a.m. CST

    tailhook

    by DrGoodspeed

    Go watch Bronson.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:44 a.m. CST

    Harry

    by DrGoodspeed

    That sounds absolutely awesome. I hope your source was right. I also pray that Dent isn't dead like so many seem to think.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:54 a.m. CST

    Exciting news, indeed,,,

    by kisskissbangbang

    I can't believe I missed Prey, given my fondness for Moench/Gulacy work ever since they did Master of Kung Fu together. On the other hand, I did read the first modern appearance of Hugo Strange when Steve Englehart brought him back for his classic run, and it's a great story. (In fact, it was the one that broke me of buying exclusively Marvel, because it was just too good; I had to buy it!) So this gets a big thumbs up from me, especially since it's the storyline that introduces Silver St. Cloud, who I previously suggested for the girlfriend role in DKR. Mix her in with Hugo Strange and Talia, and I'm a happy camper. And since the stories in the book Prey appeared in usually ran 5 issues or so, it's probably better suited to film adaptation than the 2 issue Englehart story. <p> My only qualm is (and this is probably groundless) the possible squawking from Marvel about a major figure named Dr. Strange in the movie. But since DC still publishes stories with Captain Marvel, and is only barred from using the name for a title, DC is probably in the clear.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:45 a.m. CST

    Harry

    by DrGoodspeed

    That sounds absolutely awesome. I hope your source was right. I also pray that Dent isn't dead like so many seem to think.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:57 a.m. CST

    Tailhook

    by christophermoltosante

    Bronson Inception Mad Max The Dark Knight Rises Black Hawk Down Layer Cake Sweeny Todd Rocknrolla …............ Start watching something other than comic book movies & porn

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:01 a.m. CST

    I'm with DeanCubed

    by MonkeySeeMonkeyDoMonkeyWillDestroyYou

    No more spoilers for me... And, this sounds all kinds of awsome, if true... Bring the new Batman movie!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:09 a.m. CST

    Yes!!

    by Duty

    I just pulled my PREY and gonna read it up again! I hear the Tom Hardy thing but this is the first I have heard PREY!!!! Legends of the Dark Knight rule!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:01 a.m. CST

    Clayface

    by CuervoJones

    I love the first Clayface, that actor who kills people that makes stupid remakes of classic horror movies.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:12 a.m. CST

    How can Harvey Dent not be Dead?

    by Duty

    Really??

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:14 a.m. CST

    Batman v Batman?

    by Pigdog

    Now I would pay to watch that. Hope they play on the idea that Batman is a symbol and not exclusive to one person. Also it's Nolans last so it wouldn't surprise me if he kills Wayne off. It wouldn't damage the franchise, they reboot shit all the time these days anyway.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:07 a.m. CST

    And Strange wins!! hahahah

    by Duty

    then Tom Hardy would take over as the Batman!! hahahahaha I love it!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:17 a.m. CST

    Prey was a complete ripoff of Kraven's Last Hunt

    by chien_sale

    Kraven "wanting to become the Spider" and dressing like Spider-Man.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:31 a.m. CST

    Sounds great...

    by BurnHollywood

    Interesting "new" territory, with a damned good actor.<p> What's more, Catwoman "debuts" in this story...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:28 a.m. CST

    christophermoltosante - link not working

    by John Johnson

    And even if this is "old" news...it's not confirmed...give Harry a break...he makes this site for geeks like us...if you are looking at other stuff...that for your knowledge....don't take it out on him. Any who... A. Eckhart told MTV there is no Two-Face for sure. :( Too bad...I figured the funeral was just for Harvery Dent and now he was completely Two-Face...o well. source - http://www.superherohype.com/news/articles/111637-eckhart-confirms-no-two-face-in-the-dark-knight-rises

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:54 a.m. CST

    The Grey Ghost

    by Box_Bruceleitner

    They should do that story line from the Animated Series and have Adam West reprise the role, EPIC!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:55 a.m. CST

    God, I hope not

    by Trancer

    This just sounds way too gimicky. It's the kind of plot that works great in a comic, but would be a fucking mess in a "real world"-based movie. It's also too much of a tangent from the arc Nolan & Co. have established. Can you honestly see that storyline having anything even remotely like the kind of effortless flow that "The Dark Knight" had? It just seems way too clunky.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:57 a.m. CST

    Bring back Ra's

    by captainxenu

    Considering that they want to bring the story full circle, why aren't they bringing back Ra's as the villian, rejuventated by the Lazarus pit... oh, and have Talia.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:48 a.m. CST

    YO!

    by my liege

    Sounds way better than The Dark Knight, tbh.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:49 a.m. CST

    Batman-News.com heard the same thing...

    by BatmanNewsCom

    Hey, I heard the same thing about 3 weeks ago: http://batman-news.com/2010/11/16/rumor-is-tom-hardy-playing-hugo-strange-in-the-dark-knight-rises/ I'm glad you've heard something similar, I really hope this turns out to be true!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:51 a.m. CST

    Hardy was good in Inception, but hardly bit time exciting.

    by JuanSanchez

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:02 a.m. CST

    Hardy was fine in Inception, but hardly exciting.

    by JuanSanchez

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:05 a.m. CST

    BRONSON vs THE BATMAN

    by marshallwtoneil

    The finalé sees Tom Hardy piss on Christian Bale in the middle of fucking nowhere.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:05 a.m. CST

    Oh please, no more stupid "fear gas"

    by BenBraddock

    Or Scarecrow, for that matter. Been there, done that..

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:20 a.m. CST

    If this is true what is the link to the title?

    by dastickboy

    Does Strange convince Batman that Harvey Dent has indeed returned from the dead - The Dark Knight rises?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:45 a.m. CST

    i really hope

    by Aquanaut

    they have catwoman in there too. i like my villains to be visually interesting..at least when it comes to batman.<p>a bald guy with a beard does not have near the appeal of a guy in a purple suit and clown makeup, or even a guy that looks like a penguin.<p>there's a reason that characters like joker, penguin, riddler and catwoman became so popular with mainstream audiences where characters like ra's al ghul did not. even after batman begins most people can't remember the characters name. scarecrow, on the other hand..i have no doubt that the movie will be good either way..

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:36 a.m. CST

    hunting batman???

    by chainsaw_shawn

    will not end good for anyone!!! Good luck!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:49 a.m. CST

    Yeah this rumor is close to a month old

    by elsewhere

    Still love the idea and hope it's true. I think it's the perfect direction and ending to this trilogy.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:56 a.m. CST

    Star Trek Nemesis

    by Murchmo

    Tom Hardy did a lot with a little in Inception. I've been waiting for him to blow up since Nemesis. That movie had issues but Tom Hardy was solid opposite Jean Luc.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:47 a.m. CST

    No more Fear Gas, please

    by Ditko

    It just sounds so old and tired now. They need to have Batman fight something new, like his own hidden hoosexuality and his thing with plastic. Maybe bring the old nipples back and have Bruce cross the thin line.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:58 a.m. CST

    @ captainxenu

    by awesomebri

    Who says there needs to be a lazarus pit. Did we see Ra's body? Anyway I think I am in the minority who doesn't like this rumor, seems like more of the same that we already got in BB & TDK. We want something new right?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:12 a.m. CST

    @ captainxenu

    by awesomebri

    Who says there needs to be a lazarus pit. Did we see Ra's body? Anyway, i think i am in the minority here but I dont like this rumor at all. Seems like more of the same that we got in BB with scarecrow, a dr who uses fear toxin, and in TDK with a guy obsessed with Batman. We want something new right? I'd be surprised if this is true. Nolan will as usual give us something we haven't seen before and were not expecting.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:31 a.m. CST

    Sounds good... but not more fucking Scarecrow

    by photoboy

    I can't stand Cillian Murphy he's too effeminate.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:45 a.m. CST

    Jesus Christ HARRY

    by RaptorJesus

    This information is at least a week old, maybe two. What the fuck happened to this site, that used to have news FIRST?<p>Hell, you can go to pretty much any other news site and see news that will be posted hours, maybe a day later here. WTF?<p>As for the news, it is a rumour at best, but the rumour has nothing to do with Tom Hardy playing Hugo Strange. Tha is a LEAP that you made yourself, certainly not a rumour, just SPECULATION. The fact is we have no idea who Tom Hardy will be playing.<p>

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:46 a.m. CST

    We have the same source! The internet. Three weeks ago.

    by ISleptWithKathyBatesAndAllThatIGotWasThisStupidTalkbackName

    Hurrah! My source was reliable!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:48 a.m. CST

    As for the news

    by RaptorJesus

    I like that idea, but don't think Scarecrow should be brought back at all. It's only because Nolan is so fucking nepotistic that he is in it at all.<p>Given Nolan's idiotic choices to kill of villains (at Batmans hand at least once, not true to the character AT ALL), I am not so enthused about seeing a legendary villain brought to screen just to be killed.<p>Honestly, for the third movie I would like to see some aspects of Blind Justice...of course that's made harder since they made Ducard a fucking pseudonym.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:49 a.m. CST

    Also, AsimovLives

    by RaptorJesus

    You are not fit to call yourself a Batman fan.<p>These comics are well made and entertaining, but they are increasingly less true to the character, and have several problems that any true fan of the comics should be might pissed of by.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:41 a.m. CST

    Goes from The Joker to Hugo Strange....greeeaaat

    by IndustryKiller!

    I'm sorry but I don't really see how this is terribly exciting, or somehow better conceptually than the Riddler.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:45 a.m. CST

    is this a joke? we knew this weeks ago

    by JAMF

    we've been discussing it in every batman thread, including that bogus 'the joker is gonna be in the next film' one. you really are fucking useless man. everyone go to superherohype for this kinda stuff. aicn's a waste of time.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6 a.m. CST

    Yawn. How about a villain who can present a physical challenge

    by The Krypton Kid

    such as Bane.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:01 a.m. CST

    Yeah, I thought this was confirmed

    by ApneicMonkey

    A couple of weeks ago...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:03 a.m. CST

    This is OLD news....Sheesh

    by scrote

  • It was the groundbreaking run on Detective Comics 471-479 that had Hugo Strange which inspired 'Prey'.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:54 a.m. CST

    started it in 1977.

    by Se7en

    http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=43478&GSub=5854

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:05 a.m. CST

    Heard some rumors....

    by scrote

    there might be something NEW on the Ain't It Cool website...will tell ya about it next year...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:05 a.m. CST

    started it in 1977.

    by Se7en

    http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=43478&GSub=5854

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:05 a.m. CST

    Disproved weeks ago

    by DanboJohnJ

    something to do with a viral campain for a graphic novel or a game and they ran with it...,or so i was told

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:16 a.m. CST

    ....Not to sound like the token dick

    by GE

    but this really is VERY old news. I've barely been keeping up with movie news, but I heard about this a week ago or more.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:17 a.m. CST

    I heard this back before Thanksgiving as well...

    by Chewtoy

    ...and the storyline does sound kind of like Kraven's Last Hunt, but mostly in very broad strokes. Not having read the comic, I can't say if it's anything more than that.<p> Oh, and the idea that The Dark Knight had some kind of effortless flow is surprising to me. I feel that film lurches along on the barest of pretenses. It's a collection of interesting scenes strung together so as to make you ignore the rickety structure holding them together.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:09 a.m. CST

    The Krypton Kid

    by RaptorJesus

    I would love to see Bane as he was in the comics (i.e. a cold calculating genius, not a puppet) but I don't know that Venom would really fit in the world of the comics. We didn't get Joker Venom, so normal Venom seems unlikely. Of course, the Batman:Venom storyarc could be pretty awesome...in fact I would like to see that. <p>Just have Bats be overpowered by a group of criminals, and try to take Venom to be a better crimefighter.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:11 a.m. CST

    Chewtoy

    by GE

    Can't agree more about the "rickety structure" and I really like the film. Its a mish-mash of barely related scenes wherein batman has the smallest of reasons for moving between any of them.<P><P>Strange considering his other output. His structure is usually impeccable.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:28 a.m. CST

    read about this on slashfilm

    by elgato73

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:29 a.m. CST

    WEEKS AGO!!!

    by elgato73

    Jesus, Harry! You're site is fucked up beyond all comprehension.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:30 a.m. CST

    Deliberately perverse...

    by BiggusDickus

    This Nolan bloke is a cock.<p> We all want Catwoman. Catwoman would work without resorting to girl-in-leather titilation. Hell, give us Huntress replacing the Bat a la 'No Man's Land'. Give us the Riddler like he was in 'Arkham Asylum'. Give us Batgirl even - but no, Big Chris has to go with the obscure just to show what an 'edgy outsider' he is.<p>Fucking 'Doctor' Hugo Strange. Shove this up your fucking arse, Nolan. Every bean you made on the last one was down to mornid curiosity over Heath Ledger and I sincerely hope this is the movie that bursts you bubble, you tool.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:20 a.m. CST

    Weak sauce!

    by bat725

    I'm done with Nolan. Let him and Bale wrap up their "realistic" Batman saga, and get the fuck on out of here.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:32 a.m. CST

    And how fucking hard would it be...

    by BiggusDickus

    ...for this site to have a bastard edit function Harry? Even my site has one and it's only fucking HTML and Wordpress, you knob.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:33 a.m. CST

    Yeah, fuck Nolan and his "realistic" Batman

    by bat725

    I just want this guy and Christian dog-barking Bale to be done already. Let someone like Sam Raimi give us some real Batman movies with villains like Clayface, Manbat, and Killer Croc!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:34 a.m. CST

    Trancer

    by ihatetalkbacks

    they were looking for Batman in the second film - they have a few mug shots like the yeti as possibles. Batman is also beleived by the populace to have killed so must be brought to justice - does not seem to far from "the arc" (its not an arc its a stroy point) that has been in other films. Means there can be still important Gordon story as he has to tread a fine line in terms of hiding/finding Batman. I hope the fear gas is bag - it gave rise to some great subtle effects, like thye flame mouthed batman and all in one melted mask/face.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:39 a.m. CST

    In order for Strange to hunt Batman

    by ihatetalkbacks

    Batman has to be hunting a villain so this will have 2. It will measn that he is often compromised too having to cover himslef and those that help him... this creates drama with out having to top the destructiopn of Dark Knight.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:33 a.m. CST

    This is the kinda rumor I dig...

    by scrote

    ...Greg Nicotero may be making his directorial debut adapting J.R. Lansdale's The Drive-In... <p> oh and uh, 'giggle'...<p> On a side note Tom Hardy would be pretty awesome in Bats...the man can act...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:42 a.m. CST

    PEOPLE COMPLAINING ABOUT LATE NEWS...

    by Talkbackschmucks

    Some of us haven't got all the time in the world to trawl through god knows however many sites everyday to get info on movies we are interested in. I haven't read it before so let me say a big 'THANK YOU' for this news. Sounds cool. Whup-dee-fuckin' doo to all you cunts that read it somewhere else [probably while you were in your parents basement shitting into a bucket that your momma was holding for you]. Quite why you feel the need to brag about it is beyond me.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:44 a.m. CST

    know whacha mean ace...mine too

    by scrote

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:56 a.m. CST

    howe cool is that...all my posts are going back in time!

    by scrote

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:56 a.m. CST

    bat725

    by RaptorJesus

    Fuck no, we have cartoons for that. Batman *SHOULD* be realistic, he is a realistic man using realistic skills and methods in an unrealistic universe. We should establish realistic batman first, and then put him in a JLA movie merging green lantern and superman into the same universe....except DC doesn't have a brain and Nolan like an imbecile is going to fuck that up so it can't happen.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:52 a.m. CST

    Green Lantern = Speed Racer box office

    by BiggusDickus

    A step too far for the non-geeks.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:06 a.m. CST

    On a side note...

    by scrote

    anyone know that Campbell Scott, not Martin Sheen is playing Parker's dad? <p> interesting casting...didn't think Scott was that old.<p> For all the bitching about Nolan, I can't think of anyone who'd make a better rounding off to this franchise. Can you guys?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:58 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by BiggusDickus

    I may be just a twat carping on a website, but Batgirl - done as in the No Man's Land arc would work. Someone filling in for the bat while he's in exile eventually forcing him to surface.<p>Wanna actually talk about this or just trade insults?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6 a.m. CST

    Harry - never mind the 'edit' function

    by BiggusDickus

    ..how about just having the posts appear in chronological order?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:10 a.m. CST

    This sounds exactly like a plot Nolan would use

    by rollermonkey

    Especially for the continuity from Dark Knight: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_Prey

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:21 a.m. CST

    The Prey story line includes Catwoman

    by rollermonkey

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_Prey

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:22 a.m. CST

    No, I've decided...

    by BiggusDickus

    Give every third film in a franchise to Brett Ratner.<p>That is all.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:22 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    I spoke too harshly. The guy is anything but, clearly talented and a great filmmaker. Still, locking Batman out of the greater DC universe, especially for the reasons he gave, can only be considered a stupid move.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:22 a.m. CST

    I find it hard to believe...

    by Astronut

    that Nolan is going to use the same plot device from the first film ie; fear gas. In fact I'll go so far as to say "no fucking way he would do that." I'm sure this final installment will be good since Nolan has proven he can deliver the goods -- but I will be very disappointed if he does not give us a physical challenge this time. We need to see Batman fight someone who can really fuck him up. Didn't some big ass villain break Batmans spine or something back in the day? Anyone remember this?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:27 a.m. CST

    Sounds great. And Hardy can do crazy

    by smudgewhat

    Just need to make sure he stays just enough reigned in by Nolan.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:30 a.m. CST

    I guessed this months ago

    by Ivan_Mtl

    Although I didn't specifically cite the excellent Doug Moench/Paul Gulacy PREY series, I did speculate that the movie was probably going to focus on the hunt for the Batman by the Gotham City police force who believe him to be responsible for the murder of Harvey Dent. I thought he would be captured, unmasked, and forced to stand trial. He would then be declared criminally insane by Dr. Hugo Strange - Gotham's leading criminal/forensic psychiatrist, and sent to Arkham Asylum where he would have to contend with criminals that he helped put away (such as the Scarecrow, who we would learn was a protoge of Hugo Strange). Meanwhile, a new figure has assumed the mantle of crime boss in Gotham's underworld, and I speculated that it would be HARVEY DENT, which would clear Bruce Wayne/Batman of a murder charge which, in fact, never took place. I'm obviously wrong on the last point since I don't know how Catwoman (who, I believe, does appear in PREY... although I could be wrong) figures into the story. Still, it does seem the logical, and very "Nolan-esque", way to go.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:43 a.m. CST

    Astronut...

    by scrote

    wasn't that Bane?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:53 a.m. CST

    Scrote Bill Campbel is 51

    by MRJONZ72

    The Rocketeer came out 17 years ago...so I was guessing he was in the 40 to 45 range..but I just looked it up.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:48 a.m. CST

    If there is a Joker cameo...

    by Ivan_Mtl

    I would love to see the series end with a much older Batman/Bruce Wayne playing cards with the Joker in Arkham Asylum. It would be a nice little nod to Alan Moore's THE KILLING JOKE, but probably not going to happen.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:01 a.m. CST

    MrJonz

    by scrote

    ...not Bill: Campbell. Campbell Scott. Jesus, btw, I can't believe it was that long since The Rocketeer came out.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:03 a.m. CST

    Anyhow...

    by scrote

    it's Peter's dad he's playing apparantly...Sheen's still playing Parker's Uncle Ben. My bad...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:04 a.m. CST

    @scrote: awesome!

    by TBYITBSITBH

    thatd be fuckin kickass. Source? wish someone would do the hap n leonard books too though!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:04 a.m. CST

    Hugo Strange.

    by hallmitchell

    Good idea. Very Nolan! Two guys running around Gotham dressed as Batman. Go with it and alternative.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:05 a.m. CST

    Scrote; my fault dude.

    by MRJONZ72

    The guy from that Dying Young movie with Julia Roberts that came out around 91 or 92?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:08 a.m. CST

    Scrote: Oh okay I just seen that as well over at Latino Review

    by MRJONZ72

    But cool cool..I stop reading books on the regular int he early 90's right before the how Peter clone thing..wasnt it found out that his parents were spys or something?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:10 a.m. CST

    Talkbackschmucks...

    by Ribbons

    ...first of all, it makes just about as much sense as "bragging" about your ignorance. But I do agree that the "Ain't It Old News" schtick whenever something a TalkBacker read somewhere else pops up gets pretty tiresome. In this case I think a little razzing is in order, though, since Harry passed it off as a scoop when it's been floating around online for almost a month ( inyurl.com/23w9k2p ). Anyway, I'm not going to dwell on it too much, since I'm sure Latino Review, who've never gotten over the whole Cloverfield/Star Trek fiasco in 2007, will do more than enough of that for all of us.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:22 a.m. CST

    Yeah MRJONZ72

    by scrote

    ... I heard that too. Ain't picked up a Spidey book in years now.Gf made me throw out most of my comic book stuff, though I get away with the odd graphic novel. Scott's a pretty good actor that just seems to have slipped through the cracks since Dying Young...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:26 a.m. CST

    TBYIT

    by scrote

    ...was reading IMDB about the supposed Darabont firing thing on the Walking dead.<p>http: //insidetv.ew.com/2010/12/03/walking-dead-darabont-hurd-writers/<p> take out the space after the http:<p> check it out,man. Love Lansdale's stuff...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:17 a.m. CST

    PROTO-GOBLIN

    by Crusher Creel

    ...now Hugo Strange? Talk about some fucking villains no one fucking gives a shit about holy fuck

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:28 a.m. CST

    I would like to propose a new rule

    by Neosamurai85

    As much as complaining about news being old is annoying, it's really annoying when you don't even bother to LINK to where you read about it three weeks or two months or however long ago. You want to gripe, show us the article that broke the news (I'm all for credit where credit is due). Otherwise, you just come off as pissing in the wind.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:42 a.m. CST

    And yes...

    by Neosamurai85

    I'm aware that christophermoltosante did that. I'm saying that's the model (more or less).

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:43 a.m. CST

    Maybe Tom Hardy will have a better Batman costume. LOL

    by JDanielP

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... <P>What's it take to design and create a BAD ASS BATMAN COSTUME??? Give me some crayons and I can show you how, for cryin' out loud!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:44 a.m. CST

    Scrote

    by Astronut

    Yeah it was Bane, huh. Anyway, Nolan is too clever too creative to use fear gas again. I mean really?? Fear gas?? Again?? If anything, he might have this as a sidecar event but no WAY is he going out like that as a main plot device for the final chapter. Who the fuck wants a repeat of that??? This movie has to do better than that to top TDK.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:49 a.m. CST

    Astronut

    by MRJONZ72

    Yes that was Bane in the Knightfall storyline.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:52 a.m. CST

    Sounds great

    by FlyingToupee

    Strange is one of the truly great Batman villains. His first storyline that ran from late 1939 into mid 1940 is a classic. And Englehart's "Strange Apparitions" stories were the inspiration for "Prey". Terrific news if true. I just hope Catwoman is added to the mix.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:52 a.m. CST

    JDanielP

    by MRJONZ72

    What I always wanted to see was the WETA designs/customs for the failed JL movie. I think WETA is one of best out there..damn come someone leak us some pics.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:52 a.m. CST

    JDanielP

    by MRJONZ72

    What I always wanted to see was the WETA designs/customs for the failed JL movie. I think WETA is one of best out there..damn come someone leak us some pics.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:53 a.m. CST

    Another thing...

    by JDanielP

    I've yet to see a P.O.V. camera shot/visualization of Batman with (very much) exaggerated ears and cape, due to the effects of fear gas/toxin. Batman's EXAGGERATED imagery has been captured via comic book artists for decades, but STILL has yet to be captured on film. Maybe THIS movie will (finally) be it. --Nolan, you are a LUCKY man!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:55 a.m. CST

    MRJONZ72

    by JDanielP

    Oh, yes. I would LOVE to see those designs!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:57 a.m. CST

    MRJONZ72...

    by kisskissbangbang

    Pete's parents being agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. was established in a Spider-Man Annual (no. 5, I think) way back in the Sixties, when Stan and Johnny Romita were doing the book. But it was almost never referenced till the last decade or two.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:08 a.m. CST

    I worry about how this will end.

    by Kevin Holsinger

    They decided to go with a realistic take on Batman, which was good.<P>They decided to go with a realistic take on vigilantism, which was good.<P>But realistically, you can't have a vigilante operating in the middle of a major, American city.<P>In the real world, Batman would have to be shut down permanently. Yet I have a hard time imagining they're going to go this road.<P>Ah well. It's Nolan. He'll make this work somehow.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:11 a.m. CST

    in Tailhook's defense...

    by TheHumanBurrito

    ....he's kinda right. FILM NERDS likely know who Tom Hardy is, but as someone who is primarily surrounded by the average moviegoer, I assure you he is absolutely right with "who the hell is Tom Hardy?", because that is what the average person has to say about his casting. Ledger was an A list leading man in successful popcorn movies. Tom Hardy, while great and I'm excited about this too, is not the kind of name that people know nor has he been THE star of anything huge.<p> JDanielP, draw some up and link us to them, I'm very curious.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:13 a.m. CST

    Sorry, MRJONZ....

    by kisskissbangbang

    My answer to your post ended up right behind your question instead of in order. God knows where this one will show up.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:32 a.m. CST

    ihatetalkbacks

    by Trancer

    Wasn't so much the Batman task-force idea I had a problem with - that would actually work great (in fact, would almost be required given the end of TDK). It was more the Hugo Strange aspect that seems like a giant monkey wrench in an otherwise well-oiled machine. Don't get me wrong, after TDK, I've got faith in Nolan's ability to pull off whatever story arc they decide on, but having Strange out to surreptitiously kill and take the place of Batman still seems really clunky imho, and definitely a lot lower on the "Scale of Epic-ness" than TDK's storyline. To me, it feels like that would be heading solidly into "Spiderman III" territory. Of course if they do go that route, I'll be more than happy to be proved wrong.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:28 a.m. CST

    this rumor is weeks old

    by themidnighter23

    and not true.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:39 a.m. CST

    AICN scooped again

    by xile1c

    This is OLD, you guys. Places like EW.com and MTV's Splash Page are scooping this site just about every day now. Sad to see how far this site has fallen.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:43 a.m. CST

    After a bunch of flawless films....

    by Nomoredirtyanything

    I think I'll trust in Nolan. <p> My perfect world <p> = <p> A alive Hitchcock, Christopher Nolan, The Coen Brothers and Close Encounter-era Spielberg only being able to make films for me kind of like Kim Jong Il(sic?) and his grand kidnapping/movie vision. <p> Wow, that dream was somewhat Harry-like in it's incoherentness... but what a dream...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:43 a.m. CST

    TheHumanBurrito: Who knew Christian Bale?

    by onezeroone

    Other than film nerds when he was made Batman? Even American Psycho wasn't as mainstream as we'd like to think it was. Tom Hardy's name may not be familiar, but the moment folks see his face they will remember him as the guy in INCEPTION, which was bigger than any movie Bale did before BATMAN BEGINS [not counting brilliant Empire of the Sun].

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:44 a.m. CST

    lol @ aint it a month old news.

    by alice133

    srsly. lol.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:37 a.m. CST

    Saw "Bronson", Have zero complaints about Tom Hardy

    by jawsfan

    He was as good in "Bronson" as Ledger was as The Joker in "TDK", and maybe even better. If Nolan [shit, does it HAVE to be Nolan directing this one?] lets Hardy run wild, this could be fun.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:48 a.m. CST

    Even if Hardy doesn't OD before the release...

    by jawsfan

    this could still be fun.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:40 a.m. CST

    Neosamurai85: per your "new rule"

    by Chewtoy

    Just google "hardy Hugo strange" and take your pick from the many, many results dated before Thanksgiving.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:42 a.m. CST

    Microwaved Leftovers

    by tomandshell

    The villain was using fear gas in Batman Begins. People were dressing up like Batman in The Dark Knight. I'd like to think that Nolan can find something fresher than this to wrap his final Batfilm around.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:59 a.m. CST

    If it is clayface

    by RainesMaker

    It'll just be a guy that can disguise himself, not a guy actually made of clay.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:01 a.m. CST

    If true, I hope they re-release the TPB

    by MrD

    Prey's been out of print for some time, and it's one of my favorite Batman tales.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:06 a.m. CST

    Also in Tailhook's defense

    by scallywagthedog

    Although most of us are familiar with many actors' names/faces, I still have to Google search pics to see who AICN articles are referring to sometimes. Unlike this site, Superherohype & CBM usually post pics with an article. It'd be nice if AICN did this as a simple courtesy. It's not like it'd slow down page loading that much. But then again, the way this site's been acting the last couple of days...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10 a.m. CST

    Where can I buy Prey online...

    by PapaKin

    for less that $600!?! Seriously, can only find it at Amazon and they are mighty proud of it.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:12 a.m. CST

    AICN SCOOP: Frank Gorshin to play the Riddler on ABC's Batman TV

    by Drunken Busboy

    Take that you bastards at JoBlo! ;)

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:04 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:04 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:04 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:14 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:15 a.m. CST

    LOL... OLD NEWS!!! I read this last week. Google it.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:05 a.m. CST

    There has to be another villain.

    by the Green Gargantua

    Even if Strange is the main baddy

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:06 a.m. CST

    Not being a dick... I don't know why it reposted 4 times.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:07 a.m. CST

    Tom Hardy's Greatest Roll!

    by NIGHTWINGKEN

    Praetor Shinzon from Star Trek: Nemesis

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:19 a.m. CST

    Graphic Novel....?

    by RumTally

    Check out the fuckin' prices on Amazon! Just shy of $500.00!?!?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:12 a.m. CST

    AICN EXCLUSIVE!

    by bigpale

    Rumors swirling that Moore/Braga may kill off Cpt. Kirk in the upcoming Star Trek movie, tentatively title "Generations."

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:24 a.m. CST

    This movie is not set in Gotham City!

    by SnootyBoots

    i.e. Chicago. Which is where Nolan's previous Batmans were shot. Which is where he spent part of his youth. Which is why he chose Chicago. Because he knows the city. And knows it's perfect for Gotham City. And I think most of us would agree with him. New Orleans is a money saving move I doubt he's is real happy with. You'd think a guy who's made as much money for Warner Bros. as Nolan has would be able to shoot his movie where I assume he wants to. But I guess not. Doesn't bode well for the look and feel of the movie, I reckon.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:18 a.m. CST

    Here's the real question...

    by BarryConvex

    Are we going to get the comic version of Strange (which looks like a ripped James Lipton) or are we going to get Tom Hardy looking like Tom Hardy?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:24 a.m. CST

    LOL drunken busboy

    by scrote

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:35 a.m. CST

    Besides the fair gas Hugo Strange also

    by room23storeblogspotcom

    turned criminals and billionares into zombies that did what he asked. He also ran a hospital in both the comic & the Animated Series that Bruce Wayne checked into and he was able to find out that Bruce was the Batman. He then had an auction with the Pinguin, The Joker and other villians for the identity. I kind of like the auction idea, Batman manages to evade the police and somehow gets radiation poisoning or something while trying to escape. So he checks himself into Hugo Stranges secret hospital and Hugo finds out that he's Batman and so Hugo has an auction with various villians whose goal is to reveal his identity to the police thus taking away Batmans one way to hide from the police. So somehow Batman has to fix things and preserve his own name and at the same time streal the eveidence that Strange has.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:35 a.m. CST

    Yet ANOTHER post that's gone back in time

    by scrote

    ...wtf's goin' on here?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:35 a.m. CST

    Not tryin to be a dick, don't know why it resposted.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:28 a.m. CST

    fair = fear

    by room23storeblogspotcom

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:37 a.m. CST

    What the?? it reposted again! weird.

    by chadiwack

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:39 a.m. CST

    fair = fear

    by room23storeblogspotcom

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:42 a.m. CST

    I agree with scallywagthedog

    by room23storeblogspotcom

    I also have to do an Google image search when actors names are dropped here.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:42 a.m. CST

    breaking news alert!!

    by epicac

    michael jackson has a new album of unreleased material coming out! ...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:44 a.m. CST

    Here's the real question...

    by BarryConvex

    Are we going to get a comic accurate version of Strange (which looks like a ripped James Lipton) or are going to just get Tom Hardy looking like Tom Hardy?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:35 a.m. CST

    PREY was sequelized

    by Subtitles_Off

    by the same creative team in a series called TERROR which included bits for Scarecrow and Catwoman.<P>Since there have been rumors Nolan plans on using a female villain, too, maybe his story will incorporate elements of both.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:47 a.m. CST

    AICN: King of Ain't It Jumbled Talkbacks...

    by scrote

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:51 a.m. CST

    Itr's really called "Rises" ?

    by MurderMostFowl

    if this were anyone other than Nolan, I would hurl.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:59 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    The problem is, his reasoning is ridiculous. You only have to look at the comics or other media which handle bats in a realistic way to see that they can go together perfectly.<p>Given that Nolan has fucked up essential core concepts such as letting bats let people die, no detective aspect/work training, no grace etc...It isn't like he is being terribly true to the characters anyway. All in all Nolans Batman is starting to feel a whole lot like Batman, and a lot more like a special forces soldier gone rogue.<p>There is absolutely no reason that the Batman series of movies could be kept realistic focusing on personal struggles and realistic villains, while acknowledging the presence of meta humans, even if just a wink, to allow for a proper JLA movie. To deliberatly exclude it as Nolan has stated....well that's just bs.<p>Despite the misgivings this Batman is Watchable, and I don't want to see batman reimagined yet again on the big screen just so we can finally have a DC cinematic universe, all because Nolan refuses to accept that Batman works well with wither more powerful characters.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:06 p.m. CST

    Gordon's Task Force

    by Subtitles_Off

    Jim Gordon: "We need special forces to bring this Batman in! We can't have him running around! He might save my son again!"<P> Rookie: "Um, didn't Batman just save 50 people and stop SWAT from making asses of themselves?"<P>Gordon: "He might not deserve to be brought in, but he needs to be brought in."<br><br><br> PREY was sequelized in the comics in a story called TERROR, which also had bits for Catwoman and Scarecrow, so maybe Nolan intends to incorporate elements from both.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:59 a.m. CST

    Batman DOESN'T mesh well with superheroes.

    by Subtitles_Off

    Those JLA and event-comic stories that have him running around with Wonder Woman and Superman are stoopid.<P>Nolan's wrong about almost everything else with his Batman-in-name-only, but on that point, he's right on.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:59 a.m. CST

    I have to read Prey. I would have prefered Dark Victory

    by shutupfanboy

    Yet, someone had to off himself and Nolan seems totally against Two-Face coming back. I am on the fence about Hugo Strange, he had a few good moments, but he is a not a big bad. I am also not sold on Clayface either as an ordinary guy. I guess if they arrest him, it allows them to have the "Batman" they killed Dent. The fear gas sounds like its going to be used to keep Bruce out of it for awhile or allow for camoes from the past in his delusion. I think it can be a good movie, but I doubt it will live up to fan expectations.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:11 p.m. CST

    "Ripped James Lipton"

    by Subtitles_Off

    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!<P>Right on!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:11 p.m. CST

    The comics handle Batman realistically???

    by Monolith_Jones

    Nothing in any any media has handled Batman "realistically", and they shouldn't.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:13 p.m. CST

    Batman DOESN'T work well with superheroes.

    by Subtitles_Off

    All those JLA and comic-event stories that have him running around with Superman and Wonder Woman are pretty stoopid. Nolan's wrong about nearly everything with his Batman-in-name-only, but on that point, he's dead right.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:17 p.m. CST

    Praise the Lord

    by crazybubba

    for the Nolans. Saving me from comics to silver screen hell. I will never stop grumbling about the lousy job Hollywood is doing in making movies of beloved comic book characters. Their batting under .100

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:20 p.m. CST

    I have read Prey. Would have liked Dark Victory

    by shutupfanboy

    Freaks vs. gangsters now that the gangs are all, but dead. Introducing new villains and Robin. Instead they go with another psychological examination of Bruce. It also sounds like Kraven's Last Hunt which is one of the best Spidey stories of all time. The more I hear about this and Nolan's Superman, the more I get worried.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:26 p.m. CST

    Let's have Dr. Hugo Reyes instead... <P>(a cross-over!)

    by Tigger Tales

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:29 p.m. CST

    I'd love to see JOSIAH WORMWOOD from the animated series

    by Jesiah

    Even if it's just a cameo, just because of the name similarities and also I liked the cape and cowl thing and why Josiah Wormwood's employeer wanted Batman's cape and cowl at the end.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:23 a.m. CST

    Why can't they do something fans want to see?

    by guitar_dudester91

    Youwent with the joker, do something known that we'll like. Fuck man, being original and being boring don't have to be the same thing.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:34 p.m. CST

    I think it's a terrible idea...

    by sonnyfern

    You follow up THE JOKER...with...WHO? I don't know, I just don't see this working. The problem is people keep acting like the new Batman movies were some kind of realistic take on the material and they WEREN'T. They still had badguys with crazy ass plans to destroy gotham, even having a big ultimate plan at the end. I would've loved to see Nolans take on The Penguin or The Riddler...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:35 p.m. CST

    HAS TOM HARDY GOTTEN HIS TEETH FIXED SINCE ST: NEMESIS?

    by Darth Busey

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:25 a.m. CST

    I want to see Batman WIN for once

    by Ghostpirate

    I loved Dark Knight. But I don't think I love this idea for "Rises" Batman got his ass handed to him through all of Dark Knight. Can he not be the bad ass he is supposed to be in the next one? I want to see him learn from the mistakes he made with Joker and finally become the character we are used to. I'm not interested in MORE copycat or Scarecrow story lines.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 12:36 p.m. CST

    Harry, please continue to post your news

    by Double M

    Many of us do not have the time to scour the internet at all hours of the night to find new bits of information, and rely solely on your updates. Keep up the good work buddy.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:52 p.m. CST

    not being funny

    by murren

    but that news/rumour hit went Tom Hardy was revealed to be in the film.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:06 p.m. CST

    No morons clamoring for Harley Quinn?

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    The saddest fanboy stupidity on the planet

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:17 p.m. CST

    Don't judge Harry for this!!

    by kafka07

    except that his only fault is delivering the info as if we haven't heard this rumor yet, because obviously it's an old one, by about a month now. Perhaps Harry heard the rumor from one of his own sources, and not just merely the internet, but he didn't say. Nonetheless it is an interesting rumor that would make a great story to end this trilogy.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:13 p.m. CST

    Hardy was in Rocknrolla?

    by Flip63Hole

    Man, I've seen four movies he's been in and have no idea who he is. Though I think I may have walked out of Inception before his character was introduced, who knows... Was he the character that said all the exposition about the dream stuff?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:26 p.m. CST

    Batman vs "Batman"?

    by thot

    Interesting angle. Could it be that Nolan is setting it up so that "Batman" is revealed to be Dr. Hugo Strange (upon his death, of course), thus allowing Bruce Wayne to retire, having never been unmasked. Therefore Batman saves Gotham and sacrifices "himself" in the process. I would love to see that.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 1:23 p.m. CST

    If this is the only site you go to for news, you miss out

    by SithMenace

    Still nothing about Darabont firing the writing team for The Walking Dead, and now peter parker's parents have been cast in the new movie. Yeah, that's right, his parents.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:51 p.m. CST

    Harley Quinn?

    by BiggusDickus

    Katee Sackhoff would be perfect!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:52 p.m. CST

    What

    by Yelsaeb

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:55 p.m. CST

    What'd I tell ya?

    by Yelsaeb

    Knew Hugo Strange was going to be it. He just seems like such the obvious villian for Nolan's realistic Batman. And sorry about the double post. Didn't mean to hit enter.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:55 p.m. CST

    These rumors are all guesswork

    by MattmanReturns

    One of them will inevitably turn out to be true, but that will only be because somebody guessed right, and then Harry will claim "See! We pointed it out first!". Nevermind the multitude of rumors that have been wrong.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:05 p.m. CST

    Sort out your life Harry

    by SithMenace

    Get your goddamn site working right, and stop ignoring things that are obviously cool news.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:09 p.m. CST

    So Old It's Growing Mold and Becoming Sentient

    by Tall_Boy66

    But it made me go and download the Prey arc. First issue is kinda cool.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:11 p.m. CST

    I'm hoping for DeadShot...

    by BlackBriar

    Hopefully!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:29 p.m. CST

    JESUS!!!!!!

    by notcher

    Enough with the fucking "I hope Harvey Dent isn't dead" BULLSHIT!!! He's dead, bringing him back would be Tim Burton retarded!!!! Get over it!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:32 p.m. CST

    On this "new" old news!!!

    by notcher

    I dig it, bring it on!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 2:33 p.m. CST

    Notcher

    by SithMenace

    He could just as easily be alive as dead. Yes, there was a funeral for Harvey Dent at the end, because Dent was dead. But Two-Face could be alive and well in Arkham. I'm pretty sure Nolan has said as much.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Anyone but Catwoman - seriously she's worse than The Riddler

    by Dislodged

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:46 p.m. CST

    Bleeding Cooled

    by richiejohnston

    November 21st and 22nd... http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/11/21/some-people-seem-to-think-they-know-who-the-villains-are-in-the-dark-knight-rises/ http://www.bleedingcool.com/2010/11/22/speculator-corner-legends-of-the-dark-knight-11-15/

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 3:40 p.m. CST

    HATE the title

    by ChickenStu

    I think they should've called it "Once Upon A Time In Gotham City". Not grabbing you? Sleep on it.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:54 p.m. CST

    I'm calling this rumor "bullshit"

    by Continentalop

    It's been around for a couple of weeks but it feels like a rumor that has taken off with a life of its self. Think about it: Nolan will follow up the Joker and Two-Face, two of Batman's greatest and most important foes, with a villain who no one knows, is just an old man with glasses and a hunchback, and whose only importance is that he is his first recurring villain (if you ignore Dr. Death and the Monk). <P> Hell, the guy appeared three times in the early 40s and then was forgotten for 30 years until he was brought back, and since then he has only been used rarely. I just don't see him being used at all. <P> Strike this as fanboy wish syndrome IMO.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:58 p.m. CST

    Slightly OT: Inception Bluray Combo Pack - $17.99 preorder on Am

    by Biffs_Pleasure_Paradise

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 4:59 p.m. CST

    Amazon

    by Biffs_Pleasure_Paradise

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:20 p.m. CST

    This is not the comic book Batman

    by Continentalop

    Look, I like Nolan's TDK, I'm just not an adamant fan like some people. However, one thing I do respect what Nolan is doing is he is moving Batman away from the comic book version and instead actually "regressing" him into what influenced the character: Pulp Heroes from the 1930s. Doc Savage, the Shadow, The Spider, and such. Nolan's Batman has less to do with super-heroes and more to do with a modern retelling of a modern day version of Zorro. <P> So, having said that, forget about a lot of the stuff in the comic books you liked or look at as canon. Does not exist in Nolan's version. No Lazarus Pit, no Joker Venom, no Red Hood, no Venom roids, no JLA or team up with Superman, no Batman family. <P> Also, don't expect to see a lot of the villains you guys are crazing for. Most of them are purely comic book constructs and can only exist in a comic book/super-hero universe where everyone wears a mask. I imagine Nolan will select someone colorful, yes (at least more colorful than a poor man's version of Prof. Moriarty which is what Hugo Strange originally was) and chose an arch-criminal over a supervillain. Once again that makes me believe that he'll chose either Penguin or Catwoman or maybe both as villains in the next one. <p> I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:24 p.m. CST

    What happened to the female bad 'guy'??

    by moonlightdrive

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:26 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by Continentalop

    Ace, first off I think the Scarecrow at least fits a pattern with Nolan's vision of TDK that I don't think Prof. Hugo Strange does. The Scarecrow is believable while at the same time he is larger than life. He possess at least some "theatrics" that Strange does not possess. <P> If you use the original Prof. Hugo Strange you have a Prof. Moriarty clone. Pulp elements yes, but also very mundane for Batman. If you use the one from Prey you have a character more fitting for a psychological thriller, and not the kind of "super-hero writ realistic" that Nolan has been going for. <P> And I'm not underestimating Nolan, I am just predicting. Making an intelligent guess. Maybe he will use Prof. Hugo Strange but for now it is a baseless rumor and I am pointing out why I think it is just a rumor and why I don't think he would use him. <P> I mean if a rumor said he was using Crazy Quilt would you buy it, even if AICN said it was true? No, you would point out why you think it isn't true.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:30 p.m. CST

    Sounds great

    by Eliywahoo

    Much better than the other rumors I have heard circulating around. Really surprised by this idea but very happy. If this is the case I imagine a worthy predecessor to The Dark Knight.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:31 p.m. CST

    This is really old news.

    by Mostholy

    Seriously -- this came out like a month ago. If you can't keep on top of current events, hire more people.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:42 p.m. CST

    Also Scarecrow was used in the original movie

    by Continentalop

    Where the draw was a new vision of Batman. The villains were not that big of draw. TDK the draw was Nolan's reinterpretation of the Joker and to a lesser extant Two-Face. <P> Yes Nolan is a big enough draw on his own nowadays, but still part of the draw is how will he reinterpret Batman's rogue gallery, and for most people Prof. Hugo Strange isn't one of the guys they are waiting for him to do his stuff with. Who would be excited by that? And as much as Nolan is an artist, he is also an entertainer and understands giving the audience what they want to see. <P> Like I said, it just seems like a hunch that Strange won't be the villain. It doesn't really fit Nolan's pattern IMO.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:17 p.m. CST

    Batman Vs Sewer King

    by veteran_of_mu

    Sewer King lives in the sewers and commands an army of orphaned children. Let Richie-Rich see how the other half lives.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:27 p.m. CST

    jeez

    by lead_sharp

    how old is this?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:33 p.m. CST

    Sce of Wands, despite your eloquently worded post

    by SithMenace

    I'll remain civil since I don't use internet anonymity as an excuse to act like a tool.<p>It may have been in the script, but it was never mentioned in the movie. Why not? If it wasn't filmed it's not canon, period. Isn't it possible Nolan wanted to leave TDK open to possibilities and speculation, so he purposely left that open ended? Batman fell from the same height, yet ran afterwards. Also, Maroni, and he lived. <p>No one can be absolutely sure (which unbelievably, includes you), until Nolan says "he's dead". <p>And just so we're straight, I'm not saying he's alive, I'm saying it wouldn't be out of the realm of believability. Rachael coming back, that would be a different story.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:33 p.m. CST

    That would be, Ace of wands, not Sce

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:42 p.m. CST

    So I guess its no surprise the REAL movie title is

    by vrblknch

    SHADOW OF THE BAT

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 6:42 p.m. CST

    The case for Catwoman is now much stronger

    by performingmonkey

    If they are, indeed, going for a 'Prey'-influenced storyline then it would be easy to integrate Selina Kyle. Of course, it's up to the Nolans whether they feel they can put their own stamp on the character. It would be difficult to beat Michelle Pfeiffer and that costume.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 5:47 p.m. CST

    not hating the idea

    by deelzbub

    at least we don't get a villian we've seen before and have to sit thru another repeat origin story.<P> Would have preferred Killer Croc or something horrific

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:08 p.m. CST

    Would've preferred Nolan's take on Bane

    by Kammich

    If this is true, I'm mildly disappointed. Hardy is so damn good, and I think Nolan could've crafted one hell of a Bane story. But, I've read "Prey" and its a very logical jumping-off point after TDK... but beyond a "jumping-off point," I truly, truly doubt Nolan retains much of the original story. Strange boils down to a quacky sex-starved weirdo who hypnotizes a brute cop to don a SAMURAI SUIT and cut people up with swords to frame Batman. Does any of that sound even remotely plausible for one of Nolan's films...? No, I don't think so either. My guess is that only the bare elements are retained, those being: Batman, Strange, Gordon's task force, and Catwoman. bingo bango.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:12 p.m. CST

    I hope this isn't true...

    by UTexLex

    Thew villains in the new Batfilms have been quite weak. Joker was top-notch, but killing off Two-Face after 5 minutes?!? Having the Scarecrow "in costume" for less than that?!? Batman has the best villains of any comic book. It was a shame the trilogy didn't utilize them (again, except for Joker). I'll look forward to the reboot in 2019.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:19 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    You did not read what I wrote dude. First of all, it clearly is not set in our world due to the presence of Gotham, what matters is that it is realistic, and it mostly is.<p>My point above was that much like the comics (DC, not Batman) his solo adventures can be realistic, and his JLA adventures more sci-fyish. There does not have to be a contradiction.<p>I don't need Nolan to give winks to the larger universe in his films, but to actively rule it out and close the trilogy....it's a damn shame, and a bloody stupid move.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:23 p.m. CST

    What happened to the heroic Batman?

    by Bot-Bot

    What Nolan seems to be doing is deconstructing Batman to the point of making all the villains the "super" part of the superhero myth, and turning Batman into an ordinary, brooding schlepp with self-conflicting ideals. How are we ever going to either cheer for this guy, or want to follow his story arc? <P> This is the problem with taking comic book stories and characters, and bringing them as close to the "real" world as possible. Look at how Iron Man managed to balance real-world concerns with the exaggerated world of comics, and managed to make the hero someone we liked and cared about. Nolan's Batman is one hair away from looking ridiculous in his costume because he's not larger than life. He's just a guy in a goofy costume, who may as well just dress in SWAT gear. <p> The Dark Knight was more a police action film than a superhero comic book movie. I fear the next film will tip it even more in that direction.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:37 p.m. CST

    Ahhh, Moench and Gulacy had one of the

    by glodene

    greatest artistic and iconic runs in comicbook history with their Shang Chi: Master of Kung Fu series with Marvel during the mid 70's...Especially issues 38 - 50. Highly recommended!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:48 p.m. CST

    Can't believe it but today I got to act as Nolan's defender

    by Continentalop

    Like I've said before Nolan's big inspiration doesn't seem to be The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, The Killing Joke & Batman: Year One (Goyer who was the main writer on BB is another story) but the original Golden Age stories by Kane, Finger & Robinson. The plot of TDK is pretty much the same plotline as the two Joker stories in Batman #1. <p> I think his Two-Face is similarly influenced by the 1940s version. That Harvey Dent also had a short story arc (only 3 8-page stories in 3 comics) before his career as Two-Face was over. Sure Two-Face imposters would show up every couple of years, and Dent temporarily reverted back, but for almost 30-some years the original Two-Face had a very short crimewave because the original writers covered his character arc. <P> Nolan did a similar thing. He's done Dent's arc. Let Two-Face rest.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:57 p.m. CST

    catwoman

    by redkamel

    why do people have such a boner for catwoman? She is a boring villain. Whoop de doo she steals jewels. Also, there is this weird cognitive dissonance where people complain how they hate Nolans batman for being realistic, when it being realistic is what makes it successful. The freak villains are nowhere near as interesting as when he has to do actual detective work or psychological battles.<p>making movies with the goofy villains is what led to Batman Returns.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:03 p.m. CST

    Hi, ContinentalOp...

    by kisskissbangbang

    nice to run into you again, since we had this discussion once before. <p> This time though, I found myself agreeing with you right up to the end, and then disagreeing again. I'm not even sure it's a deep disagreement, more just a different prediction. <p> Your post "This is not the comic book Batman" seems perceptive and spot on to me. I'd agree that Nolan's Bats is more a pulp figure than a superhero, and I'll even concede that the Scarecrow & the Joker are pulp-flamboyant in a way my nominees, Hugo Strange and Talia, aren't. (To be sure, Dr. Strange originally injected a serum into people that turned them into monsters, which is flamboyant, but not in an especially realistic way; and Nolan, as you point out, is all about the realism, too.)<p> And yet I still find myself pulling back from your dismissal of Hugo-as-villain. I think this is because (as I said in an earlier post above)I came to the character in his modern reintoduction by Englehart & Rogers; and while you mention the 40s version and the Prey version, this version you don't address.<p> And this version is why Dr. Hugo Strange matters, and not an also-ran or nobody like Signalman or Killer Moth; Because neither of those guys [POSSIBLE SPOILERS FOR 35_YEAR_OLD COMICS] learned The Batman's secrets, and more, died defending them. Earlier, someone mentioned Hugo's plan to auction off The Batman's identity. But politician Rupert "Boss" Thorne doesn't want to play fair; his goons follow Hugo and beat him senseless. But Strange refuses to yield; "To learn The Batman's secrets, you must triumph over The Batman, not me. I will not--betray--" Strange then dies, and a hood walks away muttering, "What a nut! You'd almost think HE was The Batman!" [END SPOILERS]<p> This scene made a big impression on me. Hugo's perverse adoration of his opponent (In lines that hint at the climax, he says, "Of course Bruce Wayne is The Batman! He must rule the city by day as well as by night! Almost I could...But no, that would be fatal.")is his downfall. I've been trying to think why I didn't read Prey when it came out despite liking the creators, and now I'm sure it was because I thought any return of Strange would be anticlimactic after that, would ruin one of my favorite Batman stories. But since he's never appeared in the movies, that's not a problem, and I want to see that scene unfold in the new film. (Yeah, I'm just another fanboy, though I hope one with some taste.) <p> But cool as I still find all that, I've got to admit you've got a point. For all that I'd love to see Hugo, Talia & Silver, there's a certain flamboyance deficit there. To fill that, I boldly predict (but braced to fail) that The Scarecrow will be used. Why? First off, it's clear Nolan likes Cillian's work, since he appeared in Inception. But mainly, it's because he appeared in the first two, and he's still alive. People say, do something new; but these aren't the Bond movies, each one sufficient unto itself. It's a real trilogy, like Lord of the Rings, of which no one I know complained that Sauron & Gollum were old news, and they wanted a new villain. Nolan has said he wants to build on elements from the previous films, and if Strange somehow builds on The Scarecrow, using him or his gas in his plan in some way, and Talia builds on Ras 'al Ghul, then he's got what he wants. Hugo wanting to be Batman also builds on the idea of other Batmen from TDK, showing that in some sense the idea of Batman is even bigger than Batman himself (a point Grant Morrison seems to be making in his current Batman run); it reinforces the notion of escalation from BB; and it also serves to give us a sacrificial Batman to redeem the rep of the real one, as someone pointed out above. I trust Nolan to do all this inventively enough to make it feel like an amplification of previous aspects, and not just a reprise. Of course, that's just me. I may be wrong. We shall see.<p> One last thing: when we discussed this before, I suggested Nolan was his own draw now, and coupled with Batman's appeal, that was enough. After all, he just made $800 million worldwide for Warner Bros. with Inception, and he said the studio gave him no notes on the project. How many directors can say that? Warner Bros. then asked him to help them revamp Superman; it's clear he's their fair-haired boy (at least till he fails). You seem to grant this in your "Also Scarecrow..." post, but then add that he's an entertainer as well as an artist, and understands the wisdom of giving people what they want. You're surely right he's an entertainer on some level, or he wouldn't want to do a Bond movie. But what do the people want? Judging from comments when the six-actress list was released, they (or many of them) want The Catwoman. That would be a crowd-pleasing move to cover your bets with, but a cat burgler, however hot, seems an inadequate menace to Gotham after the first two movies. If Talia wants to pick up where her father left off, that would seem to supply plenty of menace, and promise some level of sexual tension, too, given their previous comics history. So I don't think we'll be seeing Selina, and I can't see the Penguin, either; but that's a post for another day. This is long enough, already. But it's been fun, and you're a thoughtful and courteous disputant, which makes me want to be the same. Hope I succeeded. Cheers.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:06 p.m. CST

    Is anyone talking about the actual news or just how old it is?

    by WickedJester

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:30 p.m. CST

    Wasn't this reported weeks ago

    by Barrock

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 7:27 p.m. CST

    obsessions with Batman

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Am I the only one who finds that criminals becoming obsessed with the dark knight a little too creepy such as the plotline mentioned above or even the Joker/Batman duality? I would much prefer batman fighting villains who don't "need" him, I don't care if that makes me a plebian who doesn't "Get" the beautiful cosmic theme of the hero villian dualism.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:47 p.m. CST

    christophermoltisanti & friends...

    by BatFanFever

    ...are just promoting Chris' site batman-news, and they are full of crap. That story on his site came from a fan who just lifted a rumor being talked about by fans on ANOTHER site. If they wanna push the issue, I'll provide a link directly to where the first posts on the site they lurk from this past SUMMER claiming Hugo Strange was the villain and that it's based on "Prey". Then that discussion eventually went on to note that Mark Millar said he heard who the villain was, and that it's someone from the comics he read as a kid -- and back in June, Millar explicitly said Englehart's run were the comics he read as a kid. The fans on that other site found the interview where Millar talked about Englehart, and they emailed it to one another, and one of them sent it to Chris along with the other theories, and Chris ran it as an "exclusive". So if you wanna say "big deal Harry, batman-news said this a month ago" then I'll tell YOU you can shut up now, because you heard it only because it was a damn FAN THEORY discussed in detail on another site before your stupid batman-news took the fan speculation and ran it as an "exclusive". Don't talk trash to another site about their valid sources and stories when the site you link to and boast about is full of shit and ripping off fan theories from other sites, dummies. Chris, you make yourself look even more shameless when you run around promoting your own site like this by talking trash at Harry and others after your own outrageous behavior. And you batman-news fans coming here with multiple usernames to promote that site and talk trash at Harry etc, you look really stupid if you act like this to promote a story lifted from another site's fan discussions and promoted as an "exclusive".

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 8:58 p.m. CST

    Here's the "evidence"

    by BatFanFever

    Here's the interview in which Millar mentions Englehart from his childhood: http://www.avclub.com/articles/mark-millar,40126/ That's from April of this year. Not long ago, Millar used Twitter to say he'd been told who the villain is in the film, and that it's a villain from the comics he read as a kid. Depending on whether Millar really heard anything and if what he heard was true or not, then this might be some strong circumstantial evidence in favor of the theory Hugo Strange is in the film. This interview and the link to Millar's other comments was part of a discussion on another site the day before batman-news ran their story, and then the link was spread as "proof" among some fans via email, and then a few hours later the same day batman-news ran their story claiming a source told them it's Hugo Strange. Batman-news also claims their source told them Riddler isn't in the film and passed on the name of two actresses up for the role before those names were public, but those two bits of information were ALSO the subject of discussion among the SAME PEOPLE on that other site a few weeks before. Batman-news has a source who is just a guy lurking two other sites and then passing along theories from a few people on those sites, which then get run as "exclusive" stories from a "source" on batman-news. If you guys wanna keep talking trash to Harry and going all over the Internet to fan sites continuing to spread that b.s. story on batman-news to help that dude promote his site in this manner, then you'll find that you are being followed and countered everywhere, and each time you respond by talking more trash then additional information will be posted out of necessity to prove how shameless that site has been in the past. I suspect your buddy at batman-news doesn't want the shameful information to be spread far and wide among fans, does he? But keep up this crap against Harry and other sites, and it'll be simply necessary to prove how disreputable your buddy is, and trust me it'll be very embarrassing. Your choice.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:19 p.m. CST

    so much for killer moth

    by Star Hump

    oh well

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:01 p.m. CST

    WHY DID THEY PRONOUNCE RA'S AS RAZZ?

    by Meadowe

    that's what I didn't get about begins...are they gonna call Talia Tuh-lee-yuh if she appears in tdkr?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:13 p.m. CST

    DID ANYONE HAVE ANY MALFUNCTION WITH THEIR POST?

    by Meadowe

    I expeqted to see my post after BrainDrain's Metroplis is New York post, but instead it ended up being under BatFanFever's....well at least it let me post my little inquiry.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:12 p.m. CST

    Dent fell and died, Batman fell and lived...So?

    by GLENN_THE_TOOL

    People act like that gives Dent a reason to survive the fall, but it really doesn't. There was a story in the news a while back about two window washers in NYC who fell 40 stories. one died yet the other miraculously survived. is it out of the realm of possibility for Dent to have survived the fall? no. but just because Batman survived the fall doesn't mean that Dent had to survive it too. that doesn't rule out the possibility that Dent might come back in future films if they continue the story Nolan as set in place, but as fat a Nolan and Aaron Eckhart are concerned, Dent is dead.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:23 p.m. CST

    ITS OK, GEORGE LUCAS CAN BRING BACK LEDGER TO THE SCREEN

    by Punisherthunder

    So he can be back. They need a good f/x heavy villain for once. Who the hell cares about Hugo Strange. Killer Croc!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 9:44 p.m. CST

    I heard this awhile back.

    by rabidfnark

    Glad to hear that's gotten a little more concrete. Personally, I love the Idea of Tom Hardy as Hugo Strange. But I'd also like to see the Scarecrow back (however briefly)for a hat trick. Go Team Nolan Go!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:54 p.m. CST

    Doesn't Hugo Strange create big monsterous men?

    by cookylamoo

    That could be cool.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:54 p.m. CST

    Doesn't Hugo Strange create big monsterous men?

    by cookylamoo

    That could be cool.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:58 p.m. CST

    Yep, my last post seemed to travel back in time

    by rabidfnark

    this one might, as well. This a Response to Meadowe's 10:13:48 post. Let's see what happens. Drum Roll Please...

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:59 p.m. CST

    Well,

    by rabidfnark

    That was anticlimactic.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:05 p.m. CST

    dent's out.

    by paynoattentiontothemanbehindthecurtain

    http://on.mtv.com/hrpWUW

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:06 p.m. CST

    cookylamoo...

    by kisskissbangbang

    He did indeed, in the Golden and Silver Age. But apparently, postCrisis (or after '86, put another way), he doesn't. It doesn't really sound like it'd fit well with Nolan's more realistic version, either. Sorry.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:12 p.m. CST

    SOUNDS PRETTY LAME

    by Sovikos

    Some 5th rate villian it seems like. Waste of time if you ask me. Bring in a real villian, that people actually know about. Not someone, even fanboys haven't even heard of. FUCK JUST CAST COBRA COMMANDER as JOKER FOR GOD's SAKE!

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 10:04 p.m. CST

    cookylamoo, hold my comment...

    by kisskissbangbang

    Just remembered Matt Wagner's Batman & The Monster Men from a few years ago, which features Hugo Strange, and which Wikipedia says is set after Batman: Year One, which is definitely canon. So--I'm not sure. Haven't read Prey, but it certainly doesn't sound like it has any Monster Men based on what I've read about it. Perhaps someone else knows more...?

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:33 p.m. CST

    I'd rather Bane, Azrael, and Talia

    by clupula

    but Hugo Strange could work too. Admittedly, I see him more as a secondary villain, but whatever. I would rather this be true than Nolan just go the easy way and put Catwoman in the film or something fucking stupid like that.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:50 p.m. CST

    Hugo Strange? This is not going to do well.

    by jedimast3r

    No matter how good it is. The masses will not go to see a villian they don't know. Look at the vast box office discrepancy between Begins and TDK. <p>Box Office aside, from a 30-year comic enthusiast's point of view, and someone who has loved Batman since he could barely speak as a child, Hugo Strange is one of the most boring, worthless choices for a villian. <p>Color me less excited about this, and definitely not in with the midnight showing crowd on something so incredibly yawn worthy. If I were the Nolan's I would pick a more recognizable villian.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Can't outdo TDK

    by disfigurehead

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:34 a.m. CST

    Sounds fucking stupid

    by Colonel Activity

    because there is no Shaquille O'Neal as KAZAAM! the rapping genie.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:34 p.m. CST

    Anyone claiming to know plot at this point

    by Teddy Artery

    is a liar. Pay no attention to the arm-wavers and attention-seekers.

  • Dec. 4, 2010, 11:56 p.m. CST

    Hugo Strange? Almost as boring as Ras Al Ghul....

    by Jobacca

    Jesus...the best damn rogues gallery in literature and we get one movie with Liam Nesson playing the worlds most boring version of Ras Al Ghul(no immortality,no hot daughter,no Ubu,and now an entire movie featuring Hugo Fucking Strange??? You've got to be shitting me. Catwoman better be in this and she better be hot. And give Bale a fucking Ricola before every line reading. The best part of the last movie was Heath Ledger and Aaron Eckhart...and all I;ve heard the last few days is about how neither of them are coming back because it wouldnt be "appropriate"...even though those are the villains this movie deserves even if they arent the ones it needs because the audience wants what it needs but doesnt deserve. Jesus...thank god the Adam West Batman is back airing in re-runs.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:45 a.m. CST

    Batman: Nemesis....

    by sonnyhooper

    ....or the dark knight ri2es? question is.... tom hardy gonna shave his head for this, or not? hugo is bald after all. i don't shiv.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:55 a.m. CST

    I kind of like the idea of Hugo Strange

    by room23storeblogspotcom

    I felt that the best part of Batman Begins was the use of Ras Al Gul and Scarecrow, in fact while I enjoyed TDK I was at first disapointed that we were retreading two villians that tons of creators have already done, but Nolan di well with Joker, I was a little disapointed at how rushed and forced Two Face was though, it could have bushed into the third movie before killing him. But that aside Its nice to hear about the possibility of seeing another villian that doesn't really get the attention that the big guys get.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:58 a.m. CST

    source = EVERY OTHER SITE FOR WEEKS

    by Larry Sellers

    I'm not usually one to point out how slow AICN is with news. But man this has been floating around a while.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:22 a.m. CST

    It's going to be funny when Hardy turns

    by Larry Sellers

    out to just be a reporter or accountant they made up for the movie.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:04 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands, lol

    by SithMenace

    All I can say is wow, you're way too excitable. It wasn't in the movie, so your insider script knowledge is null and void. Btw, you're an idiot if you think Rachael's death and Harvey's (apparent) death are the same thing. But nice try. Now go take a xanax, lol.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 5:43 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    I know Gotham is a nick name for NYC, It's where I'm from. However Gotham in the movies is cleaqrly fucking not NYC. It is clearly fucking a copy of Chiacgo on the east coast called Gotham, with their own Police force the GPD.<p> As I said, there is nothing that we have seen in the movies that would contradict the presence of superman or green lantern. The other heroes tend to deal with bigger, more epic battles that match their powers, while Batmans battles tend to be more personal/closer to the ground, as in the movies.<p>My point is that Having Nolans Batman in a JLA movie would not hurt the Nolan bat movies in any way, and it is retarded for him to lock out the possibility of someone more capable* than he to do that.<p>By more capable I mean putting realistic batman in a slightly less unrealistic universe, something he does not think he is able to do.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 5:52 a.m. CST

    Yes! I suggested this months ago

    by Chain

    I said they should have Strange as the villain and go with the Prey storyline. And mix in Talia with some elements of "Son of the Demon". (i.e. the seduction,sex and pregnancy) as the love interest/primary villain that brings the story full circle.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 6:05 a.m. CST

    I would cast Lithgow as Hugo Strange

    by Chain

    he has the look and the skills. just put him in some glasses and he's ready.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 6:45 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by Yeti

    Metrolpolis was actually based on Toronto (of all things).

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 8:10 a.m. CST

    The Mad Monk, Dr Death..

    by RobinP

    Early Batman is rife with classic non-costume villains. But what would REALLY impress me would be a Batman tale, from the late 30s, set in that period. How cool would THAT be?

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:44 a.m. CST

    Gordon was very publically made commisioner

    by ihatetalkbacks

    in the last film as was the corruption and to a smaller degree the pollitics and city hall. Strange can work as a counter to Gordon. Civillian in the police that is railing against corruption about not finding batman. He will be searching for him against Gordon. There will be a more classic villain that will be the main story. Wayne Manor has also been st up, Cat woman hinted at. Ive said before I would like a female robin like the one in TDK graphic novel to remind Bruce what he was and what he has lost, but not a romantic interest. Could Strange not interview a dtermined and locked up Scarecrow who has worked out who batman is and then gains his confidence and gets the fear gas, or even set him up as his luitenant. In all the other films one villain has been liked to the other in a sly way. Ras used Scarecrow, Twoface was made by Joker.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:49 a.m. CST

    Trancer

    by ihatetalkbacks

    I see what you mean that its a big flashing MacGuffin in gthe plot. Maybe he will be obsessed but not actually want to be the Batman. He may just hold a mirror up to him and say he is as mad as the masked villians, as joker did in the graphic novel, which cannot happen in the film as Heath Ledger is dead. Batman has gradually been reduced in stature in the films, maybe Nolan wants Bruce Wayne to eventually ahve to give up being the batman as the only noble thing he can do (thus still keeping the legacy and ideal alive)

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:11 a.m. CST

    arkhaminmate has the correct screen name.

    by UltraTron

    Maybe they'll let him out when he finally understands inception. The funniest thing is he'll deliberately try to not like it or understand it now as a defense against his ignorance

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:18 a.m. CST

    Batman is "The Dark Knight"

    by chainsaw_shawn

    That name has stuck with batman since it's inception! IT's catchy and fits him perfectly. I'd prefer "Rise of the Dark Knight" more than anything. Also like i said before Hunting THE BATMAN WILL NOT END GOOD FOR ANYONE!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:32 a.m. CST

    Yeah...Tom Hardy probably WONT be a known character

    by Jobacca

    Remember who everyone was assuming that Michael Anthony Hall was going to be a big-name Bat-character? Maybe even The Riddler? And then they made him a no-name reporter even though they could have easily made him Jack Ryder? Fuck Nolan!!!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:10 a.m. CST

    UltraTron

    by blunted666

    I didn't think it was as great as The Dark Knight, or it was as good as Casino Royale or the best Bourne flicks as far as modern espionage. Clearly though his "everybody knows" comment is ridiculous... the film is immensely beloved by most

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:16 a.m. CST

    Jobacca I'm not a Nolan nut-hugger by any stretch

    by Continentalop

    (save for Memento - brilliant modern noir) but I will say this in his defense, he isn't he isn't making the modern DCU Batman. He is adapting the Golden Age Batman into modern times, the, Bob Kane/Bill FInger/Jerry Robinson Batman. A character who exist in his own separate universe without all the baggage of the rest of the DCU. <P> And personally I prefer that. Why saddle his with characters and a universe that will play no part in his stories, and will confuse or have no significance to the audience save for a few fanboys who go nuts at the mentioning of Jack Ryder or Ivy City or whatever? Why bog him down with a continuity that doesn't have any part in this version's story? <p>

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:37 a.m. CST

    If you go back and read Prey

    by LookWhosTalkbackingNow

    it becomes obvious that there is a Nolan Batman film there. You can hear the Hans Zimmer playing in the background as you meet Dr. Strange and Gordon gets forced into dreating the Task Force with him. If you haven't read it and you're just talking out of your ass, you might want to check it out just because there is a chance you might enjoy it.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:40 a.m. CST

    RaptorJesus by Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    Dude, are you retarded?<p> You quoe me where I mentioned BATMAN IN A JLA MOVIE, and then ingore than and reply as though I had said SUPERMAN IN A BATMAN MOVIE.<p> Two different things. I acknowledge Superman MAY NOT work in the batman movies, but that should have no bearing on Batman in a JLA or Superman movie.<p>Are you picking up what I'm putting down? Get it? Got it? Good.<p> Then you talk some shit about giant typewriters. No. I love realistic Batman, and the character portrayed in our world as closely as possible. Nolan as done that, but without keeping the character intact. I still can't get over him allowing Ra's to die, that isn't Batman.<p>What I am saying is that Batman in the bat movies can be realistic and only deal with things that affect normal people, but he can still be the same character in a world in which we see more aspects of the world in the batman movies, such as kryptonite.<p>And why the fuck are you trying to educate me about gotham and metroplis? I know all that shit, and have read ALL the batman comics (easy with torrents). <p>The point I am making, is that our versions of Batman are not contradictory, at all.<p> "that doesn't mean that the version of Batman that you would like to see can't be done by some other director once Nolan's run is finished"<p>It does if Nolan locks people out of our universe, which going by what he has said in interviews it sure seems like it. But hey, if a different director takes over and can blend the movies without needing a third reboot, then that would be awesome.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:31 a.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    Also sorry for getting angry, i.e. my tone....not a great day so far. No call for it and I apologize.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:41 a.m. CST

    more about Prey

    by LookWhosTalkbackingNow

    Prey even discusses the psychological aspects of Batman in the same way that Nolan approaches the story. Strange attacks Batman on television as being obsessed and a sort of nut job and makes Batman doubt himself. It's really cool. Meanwhile, Strange actually IS the nut because he's dressing up as Batman. I think the real threat here is if Nolan DOESN'T stick to the source material. That being said, there is no way it can ever top the last one.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:43 a.m. CST

    Also, Catwoman is in Prey so...

    by LookWhosTalkbackingNow

    the retards who say this means there can be no Catwoman are misinformed. Although, I would bet they leave Catwoman out.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:54 a.m. CST

    Mr. Thau Please...

    by FlyingToupee

    ...please create in CGI Heath Ledger Joker rules the world.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:56 a.m. CST

    Hugo Strange may be in this....

    by Dr Farragammo

    But he sure as shit can't be the main villain. You can go from lesser known (to non comic readers) villains like Ra's and Scarecrow to Joker, but you can't go back to an even more obscure villain without it feeling lackluster. I think 2 face is definitely coming back to be the main baddie. He could have easily been knocked out at the end and have snuck away in the ruckus of the cops chasing Batman. A little cheating perhaps, but that's never stopped a villain being resurrected before. The should have gone with the Riddler though. Make him into sick ass Zodiac Killer style terrorist. As consumed by order and structure as Joker was by chaos and to (finally) give Bats a chance to finally show off his detective skills in a film. Given Nolan's love of a goody mystery I'm surprised he didn't go that route.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:10 p.m. CST

    Soooooooo Continentalop

    by KilliK

    if it turns out that the villain will be Hugo Strange and not the Penguin you were so persistently insisting that it will be,are you going to admit that you were completely wrong the whole time?<br /> <p>hehahohehaho

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:15 p.m. CST

    and personally i am 99% certain that the rumor about

    by KilliK

    Hugo Strange and the Prey story is true,because the exploration of the human identity and the mind tricks were always Nolan favorite territory of exploration in his flicks.<br /> <p>In fact,and i mentioned it in another talkback, it wouldnt surprise me if Nolan's new DK movie is going to be in the style of Batman meets Inception,which doesnt intrigue me a lot since i found Inception a total disappointment.<br /> <p>at least i can hope that we will get a fine ass-shot of Catwoman's buttcheeks in leather.unless ofc Nolan as a British proves to be too gay to do even that...sigh...

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Greetings KissKissBangBang

    by Continentalop

    I'm don't mind you have a different prediction, after all they are just that predictions and educated guesses so it is very easy one or both of us could be wrong. But I will say I just have a "hunch" why Nolan will go with Catwoman and/or Penguin over someone like Hugo Strange (BTW the Strange Apparitions story line from the 70s was awesome; Englehart had a great run during that period). <p> One thing I have noticed about Nolan's Batman is a big change from Begins to The Dark Knight. In BB there is plenty of references and characters from modern comic books (Falcone, Mr. Zsasz, Leob, Henri Ducard, etc) and many scenes taken from Batman Year: One or the Boy Who Fell and other comics from the modern era (1980’s) on. The Dark Knight, however, did not make many if any references to modern characters or comics and only had a couple of scenes that were probably influenced by modern comics (the Joker’s changing origin obviously influence by Alan Moore’s The Killing Joke). There was no inside jokes or references like we saw in BB. The only non-costumed character who was introduced in TDK with a comic book counterpart was Sal Maroni, a character who first appeared in 1943 as part of the original Two-Face origin story. And I also noted that while BB’s plot is pieced together from many modern origin stories of Batman, especially Batman: Year One, TDK is pretty much adapted from the Joker’s first appearance from 1940 with only a few things taken or adapted from the Killing Joke or The Long Halloween. BB was obviously much more based and influenced by modern comics while TDK was much more influenced by a Golden Age comic. <P> The reason for this change is because I think Goyer had less of an influence on TDK than he did BB. Goyer is also the one who I believe bases most of his ideas on modern Batman stories. Nolan’s TDK was much more based on Batman #1, 1940 (don’t believe me, compare TDK with Joker’s two stories in Batman #1 and you’ll see that they almost line up exactly plot point for plot point, beat for beat). And even his Two-Face seems heavily influenced by the Golden Age Two-Face in the idea that he has only a very limited story line and a definitive end. <P> This gives me the idea that Nolan doesn’t want to just make adaptations of modern Batman stories but instead he wants to make his own mark, and to do that he is going back to Kane & Fingers original stories and seeing what the intent was. So I don’t expect to see any modern retelling of Knightfall or Strange Apparations or Prey or whatever. <P> Also Goyer is the one who has said he wants use less well known foes and in BB he used two foes not well known to mainstream audiences but beloved by fanboys. TDK however, used two better known foes, and while they are both well-liked by modern fans one thing people over looks is that both characters are Golden Age Batman foes. Ra’s al Ghul appeared ‘69 I believe, and while Scarecrow is a GA foe his use of fear gas didn’t appear until the 70s. The Joker and Two-Face from TDK, however, are both very much based (but obviously updated) versions of the characters in the GA (in fact Nolan has said as much in interviews). <P> Once again this leads me to believe that the Nolans are looking at the Golden Age Batman for inspiration over the modern era, unlike Goyer. So having said that it also leads me to believe they would choose other major GA foes to be the villains in the next Batman film. So who is left from his Golden Age rogues gallery? Well Prof. Hugo Strange, yes, but even more likely is either Catwoman or the Penguin or both. <P> Sure Hugo Strange appeared in 1940, but he was an experiment, an attempt at making an arch-foe for Batman using elements from master criminals from earlier literature like Prof. Moriarty, Dr. Quartz and Dr. Mabuse. And as an experiment he failed, hence why they had him die in his third appearance and not reappear until the 1970s, where he underwent a number of reinterpretations (psychiatrist instead of crime lord/mad scientist). <p> Catwoman and Penguin however were successful attempts at creating Batman foes back then, not only because they have passed the test of time, lasting up to now, but also because they reappeared again and again in the Golden Age. Penguin had the second most appearances in the GA after the Joker, and Catwoman had the third. Joker, Penguin and Catwoman were easily Batman’s top three foes until Crisis. Catwoman was easily the most important female in Batman’s life back then (and probably still is) and the Penguin might not have been Batman’s arch-nemesis like the Joker, he wasn’t far behind and like the Joker represented concepts and ideas opposite of what Batman represented. <P> I also think Nolan might go with those two because if he has read their Golden Age appearances he will see how easily adaptable both are to his vision/Batman universe, and while recognizable they are also so very unlike and different from the modern versions, giving Nolan plenty of room to work with (especially Penguin, who is a character people have completely screwed up in the modern era and don’t seem to understand what he represents). <P> I could be wrong, but those are the reasons I don’t think Hugo Strange will be selected and why I think the Nolans will go with Catwoman and/or the Penguin. I guess we'll have to wait to see that we were both wrong and that it is going to be Ten-Eye Man. <P> Take care.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:27 p.m. CST

    Of course I will Killik

    by Continentalop

    I've said in the past I will readily admit it. Part of my pushing Penguin is admitted wishful thinking because I think he is a great character destroyed by bad writing over the last couple of decades. If Hugo Strange is the villain I will of course admit I was wrong. <P> HOWEVER, I don't believe this rumor at all. It sounds like a rumor turned into fact because of fanboy echo chamber. I’m still convinced that Catwoman and/or Penguin will be in the next one, and I just have a hunch the Nolans will surprise everyone and have the Penguin. <p> Besides, as TDK proves, the Nolan's actually don't like basing stuff on modern/well-known Batman stories. They want to make their own mark and I can't see them adapting another person's story like "Prey".

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:32 a.m. CST

    but Nolan did got a lot of elements from other famous bats

    by KilliK

    comic stories.Year One and Long Halloween comes to my mind for the first batman movie,although you can say that Goyer might be responsible about that for the most part.<br /> <p>Continentalop do you think we are going to have a twist like with Ra As in the first movie,ie Strange loses his mind will trying to find Batman's identity and becomes the Penguin?

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:08 p.m. CST

    Conti that's not true.Nolan has inserted many elements

    by KilliK

    from other classic Batman comic stories in his films.Year One and Long Halloween comes to my mind for BB,although you could say that Goyer might have been responsible for the insertion of those influences for the most part,since TDK without Goyer does have a more original story.<br /> <p>Conti do you think that there is a chance in case Strange is indeed the movie villain,that we are going to get a major twist like we did with Ras Al in the first movie: ie Strange loses his mind while trying to discover Batman's secret identity and at the end he becomes the Penguin or the Riddler thus leaving a hint for the 4th movie?<br />

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 12:15 p.m. CST

    Venom

    by rahtard

    If Nolan wanted to go dark he would use the Venom storyline from LODK, where Batman gets hooked on pain killers. But he won't. FOr all this dark, realism crap he still goes Hollywood with these movies and contradicts every move he makes. If he wanted dark and real, the citizens of Gotham would have blown up the convicts and Joker would have blown up the citizens leaving Batman in a situation where he would have to question his own existence. But no, we had to get the whole "everyone is good" BS which if it were true, if the people of Gotham, even its criminals, were somehow decent, there would be no need for a Batman. Nolan needs to actually read real philosophy, mythology and psych books rather than the "For Dummys" versions he reads. You can't create a black and white character and a black and white world, then try to use the Sam Rami technique of everyone has a choice, even the villan, its human nature to eventually chose to do what's right. I can't wait for 5 years when someone else comes along and creates a Batman movie that's closer to Kane's vision and is set in the 30's or crap, I would enjoy a Batman that's at least set in the DC universe for once.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:39 p.m. CST

    If this rumor is true...

    by rbatty024

    then I have no problem with it. People seem hesitant because Dr. Hugo Strange isn't the kind of larger than life villain that The Joker is, but I'm confident that Nolan can transform him into something even larger than he was in the comics. Batman has many great villains, and I for one want to see someone new on the screen.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:57 p.m. CST

    Ace, Re: Toronto

    by Continentalop

    Shuster was born in Canada and lived in Toronto. He based the look of the city on Toronto at times. <P> Also, before Superman was said to live in Metropolis the writers though of him living in Cleveland because that is where Siegel was from and were Shuster was living when they created the character. He was "moved" to Metropolis later when he became bigger. <P> Clark Kent, mild mannered reporter for the Daily Star in Cleveland...ugh.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:15 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    You're still not getting the point I made, kiddo.<p> Those heroes may not work in a batman movie, but the other way around is fine. i.e., batman in a JLA or superman or green lantern movie, exactly as portrayed in nolans films, are perfectly fine.<p>All nolan has done is setup a semi realistic city that was horribly corrupt, and a billionaire using state of the art technology to fight crime as a symbol. There is not a single fucking thing in Nolan's movies that would negate the existence of one of the superpowered heroes.<p>Our visions of Batman are not contradictory, you're don't understand that a compeltely realistic batman can exist in a world with other unrealistic heroes.<p>I really think you should go and read some of the comics, and then come back. If you read the monthy Batman or Detective Comics imprint, you will see a realistic batman, solving crimes and hunting criminals as in Nolans movies.<p>Yet, if you read a JLA title, or the Superman/Batman title or whatever, you will see THAT VERY SAME BATMAN, STILL REALISTIC, fighting crime alongside the other powered heroes.<p>One of the main reasons this works is because a) Bruce Wayne funds the JLA, and b)Batman is the brains of the operation, and his contribution is often greater than the sum of the other heroes powers.<p>If you still disagree, then I would like you to a) give specific examples of things in Nolan's universe that would negate the existence of superpowered humans, and b) explain why Superman, Green Lantern could not be handled in a semi-realistic way that would not clash with realistic Batman.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:15 p.m. CST

    Is this site eating anyone elses comments?

    by RaptorJesus

    As per subject

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:28 p.m. CST

    Killik

    by Continentalop

    Yes, Nolan does have some elements from other comics in TDK, but not nearly as many as BB (which like I said I look at as being more of Goyer's influence) and not nearly as many references or use of names from Batman comics. In TDK I can think of only three things taken from modern comics: <P> Joker's "multiple-choice origin" (taken from The Killing Joke). <P> Two-Face as a vigilante trying to get revenge (The Long Halloween) <P> And when Batman rescues Gordon's son, a variation of the climax Year One when Batman rescues Gordon's infant son from Falcone's nephew. <P> Besides those, I didn't recognize any other modern elements that were taken whole cloth (maybe he used stuff I am not familiar with). I did however, recognize a lot from Batman #1. <P> As if Prof. Strange is the villain, I don't know what he will be like. So far besides Ra's al Ghul the villains have been pretty recognizable adaptations from the comic book versions, and Ra seems to be have changed mostly because he really isn't compatible with the Nolan's version of Batman (hard to have an immortal foe and a Lazarus pit in a "realistic" Batman universe). So I really am not sure how they would do Prof. Hugo Strange unless they had him be a shrink like he is now instead of a Prof. Moriarty-clone/Mad Scientist like he originally was. I don't think they'll have him become Riddler or Penguin just because Nolan seems to like to keep the characters separate and not tinker too much (based on only two movies I admit). <P> I will say this, even though I don't think Strange is the best choice, I think he could work. If he is used though I bet they would bring in another more flamboyant villain (besides Catwoman) because he just doesn't have the theatrics that a Riddler, Joker, Two-Face, Penguin or even Killer Croc has. So while I am rooting for the Penguin, I could easily accept Hugo Strange and see him being adapted.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 1:19 p.m. CST

    Killik

    by Continentalop

    Yes, Nolan does have some elements from other comics in TDK, but not nearly as many as BB (which like I said I look at as being more of Goyer's influence) and not nearly as many references or use of names from Batman comics. In TDK I can think of only three things taken from modern comics: <P> Joker's "multiple-choice origin" (taken from The Killing Joke). <P> Two-Face as a vigilante trying to get revenge (The Long Halloween) <P> And when Batman rescues Gordon's son, a variation of the climax Year One when Batman rescues Gordon's infant son from Falcone's nephew. <P> Besides those, I didn't recognize any other modern elements that were taken whole cloth (maybe he used stuff I am not familiar with). I did however, recognize a lot from Batman #1. <P> As if Prof. Strange is the villain, I don't know what he will be like. So far besides Ra's al Ghul the villains have been pretty recognizable adaptations from the comic book versions, and Ra seems to be have changed mostly because he really isn't compatible with the Nolan's version of Batman (hard to have an immortal foe and a Lazarus pit in a "realistic" Batman universe). So I really am not sure how they would do Prof. Hugo Strange unless they had him be a shrink like he is now instead of a Prof. Moriarty-clone/Mad Scientist like he originally was. I don't think they'll have him become Riddler or Penguin just because Nolan seems to like to keep the characters separate and not tinker too much (based on only two movies I admit). <P> I will say this, even though I don't think Strange is the best choice, I think he could work. If he is used though I bet they would bring in another more flamboyant villain (besides Catwoman) because he just doesn't have the theatrics that a Riddler, Joker, Two-Face, Penguin or even Killer Croc has. So while I am rooting for the Penguin, I could easily accept Hugo Strange and see him being adapted.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:31 p.m. CST

    Raptor Jesus

    by rbatty024

    I see where you are coming from, but I have to disagree. Certainly in the comics a realistic street wise Batman can coexist with cosmic level superheroes. But, comic books are a different medium than film, and they allow the reader to suspend disbelief in a manner that's different from film. Unlike the comic books where there is a pre-established history of supernatural and alien superheroes, Nolan's universe has never hinted at such things. If he were to introduce these ideas, then it would be jarring for the audience, to say the least. An audience will assume that a world is similar to their own unless told otherwise, and if they are told the world they are viewing is vastly different from their own late in the game, then they're going to feel cheated, or they just won't buy it.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:32 p.m. CST

    Raptor Jesus

    by rbatty024

    I see where you are coming from, but I have to disagree. Certainly in the comics a realistic street wise Batman can coexist with cosmic level superheroes. But, comic books are a different medium than film, and they allow the reader to suspend disbelief in a manner that's different from film. Unlike the comic books where there is a pre-established history of supernatural and alien superheroes, Nolan's universe has never hinted at such things. If he were to introduce these ideas, then it would be jarring for the audience, to say the least. An audience will assume that a world is similar to their own unless told otherwise, and if they are told the world they are viewing is vastly different from their own late in the game, then they're going to feel cheated, or they just won't buy it.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:42 p.m. CST

    rbatty024

    by RaptorJesus

    I just don't think it should be ruled out. Look at the new GL movie..., all it would take is a minor reference to Gotham or Bruce Wayne, a newspaper or something. Same in the new Superman movie. In the next Batman movie, simply have a mention of metropolis.<p>All I am saying is, it doesn't have to be ruled out, and it is easy to give little winks hints that it is a shared universe, setting the stage for later crossovers.<p>Do you really think a background newspaper article referencing the Green Lantern saving someone in Coast City, or even better referencing a weird streak in the sky just outside of coast city?<p>That way there the next batman movie could be set just before the green lantern movie, so it wouldn't even have to acknowledge GL in the movie but could be setup awesomely for a crossover.<p>I have not found much written about this, but found this interesting: http://bit.ly/eJElVw

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2 p.m. CST

    It does sound very possible to be true.

    by AsimovLives

    I can see how the Nolans can conceive of making Hugo Strange into a more "real" villain like they did with The Joker before. I find this news very plausible.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 3:17 p.m. CST

    guys, admit it, you didn't see this coming

    by AsimovLives

    All you guys who say what should and shouldn't be in the next Batman movie never though up of Hugo Stange. It was alla bout the usuala suspects, the riddler, the return of Ghas, his daughter Thalia, some even mentioned such outlandish characters as Mr Freeze and Croc, characters who don't belong at all in the Nolanverse. So the Nolans come up with an unexpected vilalin, they go ebyond the obvious. Of course, some sore elbowed geeks. The Nolans again go beyond the obvious and pull an expected thing. Can't wait for the next movie. I just wish they changed the title, that's all.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 3:21 p.m. CST

    RaptorJesus

    by AsimovLives

    I'm a fan of the movies, and i love the way Nolan has made them. And many Batman fans concur. So deal with your problem with the Batman's movies. It will be nigh on impossible to match in quality what Nolan has done with his Batman movies, much less surpass it. If you dn't like the Noaln's Batman movie,s it's your loss. Beside,s there has been countless variations of the Batman story since it started. Yiou ar enot the wll kwojgn fan of all Batman, you are a fan of a one interation of Batman. Mine is Nolan's, and i'm extremaly happy with that.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 3:23 p.m. CST

    Nolan's Batman v. his other films

    by BoyNamedSue

    It's interesting to me how Nolan strives to make these Batman movies as realistic as possible....yet some of his other movies (Inception) take place in a Sci-Fi fantasy world....Not that I have a problem with that. I'm just observing.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 3:32 p.m. CST

    Asi, I'm still saying this is bullshit

    by Continentalop

    The more I think about it the more I detect bullshit. <p> This rumor popped up on the Internet with no reliable sources and no one to confirm it, and no credible site has carried it. <p> Now Harry says he has a source but doesn't disclose the "proof", making me think that: a) he's covering his ass in case this rumor turns out to be true since it popped up on some other site and he doesn't want AICN is irreverent; and if itsnt true he can just point out it was a "rumor" and still profit from the traffic. <p> If Hugo Strange is the villain Harry didn't find out from inside source but a lucky guess. And I'm still willing to wager it isn't Strange. If I'm wrong I'll change my handle to "Conti_was_wrong_about_Hugo_Strange."

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 3:42 p.m. CST

    Am I retarded?

    by Wolfman Nards

    I've reread Harry's post like 5 times. Is the "Clay Face" the villain or is Harry's source? Kind of confusing...

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:53 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by RaptorJesus

    I love Nolans Batman films for what they are, and certainly enjoy them. My problem is that he has largely betrayed the character, and what we see on screen is very far from Batman. No detective aspect, letting people die, etc.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:04 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by RaptorJesus

    I just made a reply to you, but it went back in time to 2:53pm

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:05 p.m. CST

    PENISFRAPPLE

    by Colonel Activity

    This movie suffers from a lack of not enough/too much penisfrapple. For example, Brad Childress could not coach the Vikings because of his penisfrappling.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 2:55 p.m. CST

    RaptorJesus and AssimovLives

    by Sicuv Uyall

    Where else can we get 2 huge douchebags like these guys?? Where? Where I ask??

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:11 p.m. CST

    Gotta go back in time!!

    by Sicuv Uyall

    check this out 2:11 PM Whats the time on the right?

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:12 p.m. CST

    Never mind

    by Sicuv Uyall

    2:12 PM Pacific time

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:13 p.m. CST

    Another dumbfuck is here...

    by Sicuv Uyall

    2 above me

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:19 p.m. CST

    We have the power of time travel...

    by Continentalop

    ...and we are wasting it on debating the new Batman film. <p> We should warn the world about Hitler, 9/11 or at least stop the Star Wars prequels.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:45 p.m. CST

    Continentalop

    by RaptorJesus

    It's only about a 2 hour window....what can we have changed in the last 2 hours?

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:46 p.m. CST

    Asi noticing your time traveling comments

    by Continentalop

    I don't think the question is if the Nolans can make him a realistic foe - Strange already was a realistic foe - but can they make him a dynamic enough foe to follow up Scarecrow, Joker & Two-Face. Nolan might be doing a "realistic" Batman, but his foes have all had a comic book/larger than life quality to them. A realistic Strange lacks that, making me think this rumor is bs. <p> Plus going by the assumption that Tom Hardy is going to play him, I can't see it. Hardy has the wrong looks, age and even presence for character like Strange. It just seems preposterous.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:49 p.m. CST

    RaptorJesus

    by Continentalop

    At least tell me who to bet on for today's games.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 5 p.m. CST

    @Continentalop

    by BatFanFever

    The evidence is pretty strong that all of these stories started due to fan speculation on message boards and was just taken by some lame fans playing dress-up as insiders. But I don't think there's any reason to keep talking smack at Harry, anyone familiar with how the rumor mill works knows that rumors in the media end up getting picked up and spread by industry folks as well if there's enough noise and momentum. Harry's source may have just heard the rumors, saw the bogus stories about Strange, and got an email from some exec at WB claiming to know the film is from "Prey" simply because sometimes execs will see these b.s. rumors and assume it's true and pass it on. I'm betting Harry's source either showed him an industry email seeming to confirm Hugo Strange and "Prey", or maybe someone showed Harry that exact Millar combo of statements I mentioned previously. Regardless, no reason to assume or claim Harry and AICN are b.s.ing about this, when there's ample examples of valid sources getting bad info and passing it on without bad intentions. This speculation has been around since SUMMER, and these stories keep harking back to fan speculation on the same few sites over and over, and from in fact the same couple of people over and over. That, and the previous example of Strange claims just taking fan theories and spreading them as "inside info", is plenty of reason to start doubting these stories are true.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 4:11 p.m. CST

    @BatFanFever

    by Continentalop

    The only reason I talk smack about Harry is that there has been a consistent history by him to post Nolan Batman stories whenever traffic to the site gets slow. <p> I'm sure Harry was more than willing to look past how unlikely this rumor is just so he could post a Nolan Batman story (and I'm admitting it worked since he suckered me here thanks to this story).

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 6:01 p.m. CST

    Anyone here notice

    by Colonel Activity

    that Harry's kinda out of shape and not very handsome? Just saying. Penisfrapple.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 6:10 p.m. CST

    Raptor Jesus

    by ihatetalkbacks

    You cannot prove a negative. There is no "proof" that there is no Supoerman etc in the Nolan Batman as you cannot prove something that does not exist. But there is never a mention of Superman, if the police were hunting him there would be a "Why do we get a Batman when Metropolis gets Superman" or "Why dont we ask Superman to hunt for the Batman" No one in the film for a moment thinks Batman may have super-powers, if super powers ever existed with other super heros they would assume he could have them too. They assume he does everything through training and technology. Why go to such lengths explaining the tumbler, his voice covering mic, radio headset, memory fibre cape, when it could be done as the mind of a genius in a film with genuine superpowered superheros. I think the films are realistic and set in our universe with the usual suspension of disbelief that we have when we see any film. All films have coincidences in them, some are written to help tell a coherent story in two hours others are deliberate. Is Terms of Edearment set in another universe because there is a lot of silly stuff in that. TDK even gets rid of some of the more fantastical real world elemnts for the first film such as Wayne Industries tower and the monorail to further ground it in our reality.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:16 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    You're right, you're not understanding a very simple concept. There is no dichotomy. As per the comics, you have a realistic batman in a universe with less realistic heroes. It works, and it works well, because batman in his own stories is limited to dealing with realistic shit, and only when with his super friends does he help to combat the more unrealistic stuff.<p>Sorry, but comics are directly relevant here. They are the perfect analogy, since what you think is impossible has actually been done perfectly.<p>Lets try this again and hope you get it this time: WHile superheroes may not work in nolans batverse, there is no reason nolans batman would not work in other dc based movies. Get it? Got it? Good.<p><p> Now, as per your answers. <p> I have to wonder if you are just wearing blinders, or are actually that dense.<p> Point 1: Nolans batverse is not our world exactly, just a world quite similar to ours.<br /> Point 2: We don't know that there are no metahumans in Nolan's batverse. You don't see superman flying around in issues of batman, yet he still exists in that universe. Oddly enough, this does not hurt the realism of batman in his own comic!<br /> Point 3: Nolans Batman is very young, so the emergence of green lantern or superman at a later stage would be fine.<br /> Point 4: The existence of acknowledgement of such beings would not negate what has been shown so far, at all. imagine if in TDK there was a TV in the background with a new report about an odd crash in the desert outside coast city...would that have ruined things for you? If so, that's very sad. <p> You seem to think that super powered beings CAN'T exist in nolans batverse, simply because they have not been shown on screen so far. This is a logical fallacy. As long as Nolan does not screw things up and DC plans things right, we will hopefully be shown just how they do exist in that shared universe.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:21 p.m. CST

    ihatetalkbacks

    by RaptorJesus

    I get what you're saying, and agree with you. I'm not saying we should do it right now, I'm saying if they do things correctly with the new superman gl, then they can be acknowledged in TDKR, without having to be the focus.<p>I've also never understood the whole argument that Batman can't work in a world with superman because there would be no need for Batman. Batman is a DETECTIVE, something Nolan thought was fine to ingore about the character. Batman also was on the scene long before Supes, and so was already a legend of sorts. <p> Have him detect and have his personal realistic battles in his movie, then have superman lifting islands or going into space or getting shot in the eye in his movie, then in a crossover movie have batman solving a crime using his skills and knowledge while supes does the heavy physical. It can work, and it can work amazingly, it's just the blind nolan fanbois who have blinders on and a poor understanding of the characters.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:35 p.m. CST

    Nolan's Batman isn't the real world

    by rahtard

    No one puts on a cape and a mask and magically has their voice turned into something that sounds like a pit bull choking on its own shit.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 7:44 p.m. CST

    RaptorJesus

    by Continentalop

    I hate commenting on this because it feels like everyone is picking on, however I will say this: <P> I am a big fan of the idea of a World's Finest Movie, a cinematic team up of Batman & Superman. However, I don't think NOW is the time because it does go against the tone Nolan is trying to establish. <P> Batman/Superman first appeared in a co-existing universe in 1940 as honorary members of the JSA, but had no part in the adventure. It was a glorified cameo role. They actually never teamed up until 1954. That is some 15-years of adventures before they crossed over to each other's world. And before they did team up they had a very different tone than they do now. <P> I believe Nolan is trying to recapture the spirit of the Golden Age Batman, who is much more a pulp crime fighter than a superhero. He is more Bat-Man than he is Batman, if you know what I mean. And because of that, I think the idea, even outside of Nolan's Batman movies, would destroy the tone he is going for. The idea that a GL or Superman existing in the same universe would undermine the "realism" and pulp atmosphere that Nolan is going for. It's like having Flash Gordon meeting Doc Savage - sure, it is a pulp magazine dream team up, but Doc Savage's universe in the 1930s is very incompatible with Gordon's and vise versa. An Elseworld's style team up is feasible, but even that would undermine the "realism" Nolan is striving for and it also would be looked at as canon, opening a Pandora's box for the DCU to invade Gotham (taking it even further away from a pulpish style of Batman). <P> When Nolan is done doing the "origin" and early earls of Batman, some other director can move him past being The Bat-Man and have his start being Batman, a superhero. When that happens I fully expect to see him teaming up with Superman and even the JLA, and probably have the whole Bat-Family show up (bring on Ace, the Bat-Hound!).

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 8:41 p.m. CST

    How to do a Justice League movie

    by clupula

    Simply change the chronology a bit, so that Batman is the first actual superhero. Green Lantern hasn't happened yet, Clark Kent hasn't started being Superman yet. Batman thinks he's completely alone in the world, saving his city. No mention of any other DC heroes need ever be mentioned in a Batman movie.<BR><BR>In Green Lantern, just mention that there's some sort of vigilante in Gotham City. No one has to even actually mention it. Just put it on a newspaper. And then in Superman, just reference the two. Then you can have a Justice League movie where the first fifteen-to-twenty minutes of the movie ties all the different movies together. Show Christian Bale Bruce Wayne reading a newspaper telling Alfred he thinks the Superman story is bullshit, only for him to turn around and see Superman flying outside his window. Introduce Wonder Woman in the movie. Make the villain something huge that it would take all of them to fight, like Darkseid. That's how you do a Justice League movie without ever making the Nolan Batman films seem unrealistic.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 8:43 p.m. CST

    Oh and keep Martian Manhunter

    by clupula

    and Aquaman out of it. There's only so much suspension of disbelief an audience will have. When you start bringing in characters from Mars and Atlantis, people are going to roll their eyes.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:05 p.m. CST

    Who says Hugo Strange will be the ONLY villain?

    by Rodie

    If he is indeed in TDKR...As Strange and Gotham PD are hunting for Batman, Batman will also be trying to stop another villain. Batman/Bruce cannot just be on the run the whole movie. He also has to have his own goals and another foe to vanquish. I think we're looking at Strange and a 2nd villain, and also Catwoman not as a villain, but more like a flawed femme fatale who may aid Batman at times but also may thwart him at times too.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:16 p.m. CST

    Fuck Catwoman

    by clupula

    Talia should be in this. And I as I said before, I see Strange as a secondary villain. I could see him working in a movie with Bane, honestly. In fact, it'd be pretty funny if the movie DOES have Hugo Strange, but Tom Hardy is not playing him. After seeing Bronson, I could very easily imagine Hardy as Bane. Strange...I see more as someone said before, like a John Lithgow type.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:21 p.m. CST

    !BATMAN NEED MORE MEXICAN WRESTLER ACTION!

    by BurnHollywood

    SAY !SI! TO ACTION! SAY !SI! TO SENOR BANE!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:21 p.m. CST

    tailhook is right

    by Foucault

    We need a more attractive actor and a flashier villain. I'd go with The Penguin or Electro or Morbius.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 8:14 p.m. CST

    No, Foucalt, we need !BANE!

    by BurnHollywood

    A villain should look cool, and there's NOTHING cooler than luchadores!<p> Okay, I'll stop now. Fuck Bane.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:27 p.m. CST

    Electro or Morbius

    by clupula

    are Spiderman villains.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:31 p.m. CST

    How can someone claim to be a Batman fan...

    by Continentalop

    ...and not like Catwoman? Catwoman is a classic AND important character from Batman's history. <p> To say you want Bane over Catwoman in a Batman film is like saying you love the King Arthur myths but you want to replace Morgan Le Fay with a Mexican wrestler.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 8:27 p.m. CST

    Nolan picks lame ass villains, Ledger saved his movie

    by Onin Solstice

    Strange? Great, this is even lamer than Neesons snoozefest take on Ras Al Ghul. Give Death Ledger credit for seeing these flaws and injecting some life into the francise.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 9:09 p.m. CST

    Remember, in EXCALIBUR,

    by Subtitles_Off

    when "Arthur" was wearing the armor with all the sparkly light all over it and then that Luchador jumped out, and you thought, "Wow, what defuck? Was that just a Luchador?" And the buddy you were sitting next to kind of spilled popcorn all over the seat in front of him and yelled, "Yes! yes! That was a fucking Luchador!" And when you left the theater you couldn't stop giggling over what a mindfukk experience it was, seeing King Arhur chop the head off a Luchador?<P>Good times.<P>Nolan's making another Batman movie? <P>Good. Another thing to cause me pain for the rest of my life.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:22 p.m. CST

    This time travel is fun.

    by Subtitles_Off

    I respond to 'Lop's post before he even makes it.<P>No wonder Bruce Wayne decided to surf the giant time vagina!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:24 p.m. CST

    No one says Strange would be the only villain.

    by Subtitles_Off

    It's a fukken Nolan movie. There will be at least three villains, and none of them will be central to the plot.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:26 p.m. CST

    You know what RISES needs?

    by Subtitles_Off

    Besides a new title so it doesn't sound like a porno or a "Dr. Phibes" reboot?<P>Luchadors!<P>Mean, fukken luchadors.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:28 p.m. CST

    Bane. Only one thing could be worse than Bane.

    by Subtitles_Off

    Hush.<P>Scratch that. Only TWO things could be worse than Bane.<P>Talia Al Ghul and Hush.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:46 p.m. CST

    Subtitles_Off

    by Rodie

    I've read on AICN talkbacks and other boards many people complain about Hugo Strange, and my point is that many of them don't even consider the fact that there's about a 100% chance there will be another villain besides him when they shoot off their complaints. Its fun to talk about the possibilities of what might happen in TDKR, but it seems silly to me that some people are already upset or disappointed with the Strange rumors at this stage of the game.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:56 p.m. CST

    I hate Catwoman

    by clupula

    because Catwoman is a fucking jewel thief, whose only redeeming quality is that she is physically attractive! She's never been a threat to the city. She's never been a deep character. She's never been anything more than eye candy.<BR><BR>Talia, on the other hand, is a ruthless woman whose love for Bruce Wayne is the only thing stopping her from killing him. Her love for Bruce and her feelings about her father often cause her to be torn. That's what makes her an interesting character. Catwoman is a shite sandwich in a pretty wrapper. Talia is not just a great female foil for Batman, but the mother of his child and the daughter of one of his greatest enemies. There's so much more you could do with Talia, storywise, than fucking Catwoman, especially in Nolan's universe. Oooh...she's going to steal a diamond! Better call Batman right away!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:08 p.m. CST

    I want Talia as the sole villainess...

    by lynxpro

    Talia should be the overall villain who is using Strange to destroy Batman. She should be doing it out of loyalty to her [thought to be dead] father but then she falls in love with Batman and helps him defeat Strange before disappearing and breaking Bruce's heart. That's how it should go down. And I have to bring this up, back when Aronfsky was the studio's pick to do the Batman films, I was the sole person on AICN posting that it should instead be a trilogy of films with Ra's Al Ghul as the overall villain. Catwoman should be a tease for a possible fourth film if Warner's throws the Nolans/Goyer/Bale enough cash to continue...

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:10 p.m. CST

    As for Two Face...

    by lynxpro

    Nolan's just fucking with us. The Harvey Dent persona is dead while Two Face is alive and locked up secretly in Arkham waiting to reappear in another sequel or two.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:27 p.m. CST

    TOM HARDY AS AZRAEL WOULD BE COO' IMO...HERE'S ONE SCENARIO

    by Meadowe

    In the context of the nolanverse, he could be some guy that has his dad show up at his door dying in an Azrael costume, and is revealed to be the next in the long line of assassins from an old religious order. Since the wounds his father suffered were kinda public (and resulted in the aqcidental death of a reporter Bruce was dating) Batman is of course investigating. While Tom could be training his body to perform the duties his mind has been conditioned from birth to accomplish, Bruce faces a bit of a quandry: the chiq he was seeing was just a cover (like the prima ballerina in The Dark Knight) and he really never cared for her until she passed away. When pressed for a comment, Bruce goes on record to say how much he loved her, etc. but feels bad that he really didn't care for her until she became a victim of violence. Because of her death, the publiq and private personas of Bruce Wayne starts to bleed together, making for a distraqted Batman. Since Azrael has been hypnotized from birth and been planted with suggestions all his life, Nolan may like this angle (Inception). It could have some coo' hallucination scenes from Az's pov. Because Bruce is distraqted he asks Azrael to bat for him so to speak, while he figues shtuff out. Azrael crosses the line etc. and Bruce picks up the cape and cowl once again to stop him. Anyway, I hope tdkrises will be good, because that title leaves soooo much to be desired.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:29 p.m. CST

    FUCK HUGO STRANGE

    by The_Black_Vegetable

    I Seriously dont want that jackoff to be the villain in this when there is so many many more villains that are more interesting and better suited to Nolans Batman style. FUCK THE DOCTOR FUCK HIM IN HIS UNINTERESING FACE

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:36 p.m. CST

    <p><p>CATWOMAN WOULD BE PURR-FECT<p><p>

    by DrMorbius

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:44 p.m. CST

    Prey is NOT a ripoff

    by loopyfiasco

    I think its a little wack to claim that Prey is a rip. Especially since Hugo Strange was dressing up in the cape & cowl in the 70's and Kraven was wearing the spider undies in 87.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 12:01 a.m. CST

    what about BLACK MASK?

    by lynxpro

    If Batman has been pushed underground due to the events of TDK, shouldn't crime be up in Gotham? Shouldn't someone like Black Mask have taken over the syndicates during this time already? Maybe Maroni survived TDK.

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 10:57 p.m. CST

    Prey? I still would like YEAR 2!!!!!

    by darthSaul666

    Batman goes evil and carries a handgun would be the SHIIIITTTTT!!! Hell Year 2 was a story from Batman from 1941 before the GN by Mike Barr and Todd McFarlane!!!!

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:03 p.m. CST

    JLA/Supes wink in a Batman film?

    by darthSaul666

    You all remember the last time Warner Bros. tried that in a Batman film was Batman and Robin!!!!! Opening "This is why Superman works alone!!!" The cross referencing could be avenue for massively cheesy backfire...

  • Dec. 5, 2010, 11:07 p.m. CST

    Penguin would be cool

    by darthSaul666

    But not the freaky ninja turtle sewer living mutant that Tim Burton made him into.... That was really off the mark with canon!!!

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 12:18 a.m. CST

    What is up with the post?!??!?!?!

    by darthSaul666

    TECH SUPPORT!!!!!!

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 12:41 a.m. CST

    MATCHES MALONE ANYONE? HERE'S ANOTHER SCENARIO

    by Meadowe

    I thinq it would be kinda coo' to see Bruce donning some disguises in tdkr....Bruce as Matches is making a "business deal" with one of Gotham's denizens, they figure out he's not who he claims, chases him down somewhere dark, but instead of finding matches they find Batman. Figuring out that matches IS Batman, the denizen describes matches malone's features to someone (hugo, whoever) and even with Bruce's disguise, they figure someone has to be banqrolling Batman's operation and needs a mad amount of cash, and even though Bruce only has some of "malone's" features, he does have the necessary finances and hugo or whoever begins to bait wayne to see if he is Batman, and bruce's responses to the bait questions lead the villain to discover Bruce is Bats. Hilarity ensues.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 12:49 a.m. CST

    so will Bale's Batman "retire" in this?

    by The_Ritty

    If Hugo is eventually outed as the bat? Seems like their going for a closure with this film and series.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 1:51 a.m. CST

    clupula, in all politeness I think you're way off and wrong

    by Continentalop

    First off, I would ask you not to disparage the mother of Batman’s child. And no, I don’t mean Talia. She is only the mother of his modern day child, Damian, until that somehow gets retconned or conveniently forgotten. If you think that the “Son of the Bat” is actually going to stay around or be a significant character in the Batman comics in 10 or 20 years, I would have to say I think you’re delusional. In 30 years he’ll be as well remembered as Spider-Man’s daughter May is now (who?). <P> By the mother of Batman’s child I mean Catwoman, who was the mother of Helena Wayne (Huntress) in Earth-2 before Crisis and was most likely the mother of Batman Jr. in the Super-sons stories set on Earth E. Yeah, those have been wiped out as out of continuity now and forgotten, but guess what, so will Damian Wayne, so bringing up how important Talia is by saying she is the mother of Bruce’s child is a moot point. She is only more important NOW in the fleeting world of comic books where things change every five years but great characters and stories last for 40-70 years. It’s like saying Lady Gaga is a more important artist than Janis Joplin or Aretha Franklin because more people know about her nowadays - just says people don’t have much historical depth. In fact Talia is so important that when Neil Gaimon did his “Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader” he had her speak at his wake...oh, wait. Nope, that was Catwoman, who always been THE lady in Batman’s life. <p> As for her Catwoman being just a jewel thief and not being a threat to the city, you’re right - which is what makes her great. You obviously don’t understand the point of Catwoman. She isn’t another mass murderer like the Joker or Two-Face, she is someone who exist in the grey between criminal and anti-hero. Someone who challenges Batman in a different way than his other foes do: Joker challenges his morality (his refusal to kill), the Penguin his intelligence, the Riddler his Detective skills (solving a riddle is like solving a mystery), etc. Catwoman challenges his belief system and his ideas of what is right and wrong. She is someone who commits crimes but is obviously not as evil as other villains, raising a moral dilemma for Batman what he should do about her. Especially when she sometimes helps him or gets involved in cases involving obviously evil and dangerous criminals who much more deserve Batman’s attention. <P> The quintessential Catwoman story would be Catwoman stealing something for a more dangerous criminal and Batman getting involved. So obviously Catwoman wouldn’t be the number one villain, but she would be someone who could either hamper or help Batman, depending on the circumstances. <p> And to complain about Catwoman not being tough enough to fight Batman is also stupid because really Batman’s great foes never were a physical challenge for him and never should be. His great arch-foe the Joker is no match for him and only gets the upper hand by surprise or when he is at a disadvantage and only for a moment, and can only survive so long against Batman because he uses henchmen to run interference. No, Batman’s foes are meant to challenge his intellect and mind more than his body because Batman is crime/detective fiction above all else. His first stories were based on Shadow detective stories, and not on Kung Fu movies. <P> And like all good crime fiction, there is a place for a femme fatale like Catwoman. To not like Catwoman is akin to not liking the Femme Fatales in movies like the Maltese Falcon, Murder My Sweet, Double Indemnity or Body Heat, or to not like Bond girls like Pussy Galore. Sorry, but Catwoman is one of the best Batman characters ever and superior to Talia al Ghul in every way, the Tori Spelling of Batman comics (only known because of her rich/powerful dad, who is just a poor man’s Fu Manchu anyways).

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 2:54 a.m. CST

    BoyNamedSue,GeneralJSJackson and the rest

    by KilliK

    1.I will make another observation: Unless i am mistaken,have you noticed that Nolan has never personally set his foot on comiccon or in some other geek event/show/interview to promote his Bat-movies? <br /> <p>Nolan is a geek alright but it always seemed to me that he is not that much fond of the super-hero comic-book genre.I believe that he is trying his hardest to make Batman more realistic so that he looks less cartoon-ish,less childish,less ridiculous.After all he is supposed to be a serious director ,right?<br /> <p>2.The biggest unrealistic and most ludicrous thing in TDK is the ferries sequence where people in the brink of their doom,they simply sit down and they quietly vote to decide who dies.<br /> <p>You simply cant take the movie seriously after that,because in the real world people simply DONT react and act like that when they face their imminent death.<br /> <p>Nolan might wanted to make some kind of a social commentary for the audience and a response to Joker's nihilistic attitude,and i am fine with that but please my dear Nolanoids dont try next time to put the word realism and Nolaverse together,ok?<br /> <p>3.From a business perspective,the most logical thing to do is to use the most popular assets of your commercial property,so that you can attract more consumers in this case moviegoers.<br /> <p>And i dont believe that WB will let so easily Nolan to have his own way with the villains of his new movie,and use some obscure character who is only known to the most hardcore comic fans simply because he wants to completely differentiate his own take on the Batman universe from the rest previous artists.<br /> <p>Regardless of how powerful Nolan is right now,it makes sense to expect that the execs will demand from him to have the more popular comic characters in his film so that they can promote it more efficiently,and improve the chance of becoming a major hit like TDK was.<br /> <p>I am thinking that i at the end,despite of what Nolan will do with his Strange character,we are going to get a major and popular villain in the movie.And i am not talking about Catwoman,although she might be in the movie too,because her previous movie disaster has harmed her marketing credentials.<br /> <p>Penguin,Riddler,2-Face,Black Mask someone from those characters will be in this movie either as a merged character with Strange or a stand-alone.after all Hollywood is business and nothing else.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 2:58 a.m. CST

    can we have Olivia Wilde as Cat-woman?

    by KilliK

    please mr Nolan? pleeeeeeeeeeease?

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:14 a.m. CST

    Sicuv Uyall, you should be called Scurvy

    by AsimovLives

    Anoying unsympathetic dumbass.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:26 a.m. CST

    rbatty024

    by AsimovLives

    I agree wityh you. Since BATMAN BEGINS the nolan movies established a Batman universe where there is no hint or clue that there are sueprnatural things or superhero-like stuff. The films, fantasy acting stuff that they are, are still more into that verissimilitude mood. As you very well put it, to introduce more superhero-like characters or supernatural characters in the nolanverse would be a tremendous change of style and it would be jarring to say the least. The movies as a series would became decharacterized, they would lose internal consistency. And that's the worst thing that can happen to a film franchise. This is why the James bond series have constantly "rebooted" itself into more pausible more down to earth films whenever the movies went too far into into the big world villian with secret bases scheming for worlddomination territory. For every MOONRAKER the Bond movies would go, they would make a FOR YOUR EYES ONLY throwback to more down to Earth stories. Also, remember when they changed pace with the superman movies and went from Superman II into the overtly comedy of Suprman III, and how jarring that was.<br><br>I say, and in this i think we agree, the Nolan Batman movies have this "realistic" or should i say verissimiliar to our world mood to it, and they should be consistent. If some people dislike it, though luck. All they have to do is wait until Nolan leaves the Bat movies for good. Then they might have all the supernatural villains like Killer Croc to their delight. With some luck, they might even get the Joel Schummaker neon covered visuals to go with it. Me, i'm very stasified with the way nolan has made his Batman movies. Very, very satisfied. For me, his IS Batman and i accept no substitutes.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:40 a.m. CST

    KilliK

    by AsimovLives

    I have to say, we are on acreement there. Olivia Wilde is a great choice for Catwoman indeed. And she's a pretty good actress too, she's just not (great) looks. That or Emily Blunt.<br><br>Man, i have a really weak spot for Blunt. She got this close to be cast as Rachael Dawes in BATMAN BEGINS, but the studios imposed Katie Holmes instead, because back then holmes was a bigger name (the irony of that nowdays doesn't escape me).<br><br>Or if none of this fine young ladies are chosen, then my alternative choice would be Imogen Poots. If the name means nothing to you, she played the female lead in 28 WEEKS LATER and was the "witch" in Neil Marhsall's CENTURION. She is gorgeaus beyond words (she looks very much like Scarlett Johansson) and is a damn good actress too. And she's english, which would be in tune to Nolan's filling the cast of Brits in his Bat movies.<br><br>My dark horse choice would be australian actress Ivonne Strahoski. We already know she can handle action stuff, looks great in thigh dresses, and she is a gorgeaus goddess. Damn good actress too.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:47 a.m. CST

    acreement = agreement

    by AsimovLives

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:58 a.m. CST

    KilliK

    by AsimovLives

    As for TDK might not be realistic about the way the characters behaved in the Ferry sequence, well, maybe that's true. But the movie wa smaking a point. And rarely people complain about movies making a point, they take it in stride. Why they then sudently decide to make up in arms agaisnt the point of a movie in nolan's films is a bit strange. It happens again in INCEPTION. OK, allow me to offer an example of when a movie made a point which diverged from what was already establishe din that very franchoise: in Abrams Trek, the movie time and again makes a point that fate is an important constant in the universe. The whole movie is about fate. It's fate that makes Kirk, evn in his asshole good for nothing version in that movie, to be a starship captain. fate makes Spock and kirk friends despiste the two start in the most shaky ground spossible. Fate brings every of the TOS characters into the Enterprise. Fate constantly brings this characters together. And almost everybody were very cool with tha,t even though in the TOS fate was not somehting that had any to do with the stories, in fact the show took pains to deny the existenc eof fate and everything was to do with choice. So, people get cool with Abrams injecting an incredibly unrealistic version of fate into the movie, but people piss if nolan is optimistic about human nature? Look, i'm not as optimistic about human nature as Nolan seems to be, but in the context of the story told in TDK, it works. It's the perfect counterpoint to the Joker's nihilism and misanthropy. It works for me, even though i might not agree philosophically. This is the thing i dig about movie,s i can enjoy a movie which might not share my own personla beliefs and convictions. I don't want to limit myself that much. I mean, i'm an atheist and one of my favorite movies of all times is THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST. Look at what i would be missing out if i would only limit myself to my own atheism for the movies. I couldn't even like THE EXORCIST, for goodness sake!

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:07 a.m. CST

    clupula

    by AsimovLives

    Maybe they could put some Thalia characteristics to Catwoman. They did put some Riddler in the Joker in TDK. Nolan sems to be inspired by the comcis but not limited by them. There is an amount of reinvention in the way he has portaited the characters in his Nolan movies. While they retain some well known classic characteritics, they also are presented anew, so that they became intriguing and with a certain element of new, a tleast for me. Sinc ei'm not na hardcore fan of the Batman comics, i can be cool with that approach. But more importantly, because they are presented in smart, intelligently writen and presented in damn good movies. So, why not make a Catwoman that is soemthing more then just a catburglair? Why not make Catwoman into a sort of mirror version of Bruce Wayne himself? Start her as a jewel thief with shallow egotistical motives, but then through tragedy and loss she becames a dark mirror of Batman's vigilantism, without the strong moral center that Bruce Wayne has.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:18 a.m. CST

    Meadowe

    by RaptorJesus

    Matches Malones is exactly what I was hoping for in TDK, and was sorely disappointed. One of my biggest issues is that Nolan has completely ignored that the character is a detective.<p>Honestly we will be lucky in TDKR if he even has the computer analyze something.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:19 a.m. CST

    The Peguin notion also has a lot of potential

    by AsimovLives

    So much so that nolan almost put him in TDK. Our friend ContinentalLop has been very verhement in the idea of a nolan style Pinguin to the movie,s and i say i agree with him. A Penguin in the Nolan style would be a cool character, the ultimate mafia boss villain. And it almost happened. But in the end the Nolan brothers decided that TDK already had a lot of characters, and cuts had to be made.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:22 a.m. CST

    RaptorJesus

    by AsimovLives

    Actually, i would love to see even less recourse to thecno stuff and computers in Batman's detective work. I'd like to see more down and dirty gumshoe detective work for Batman. All that computer stuff might loo shiny and stuff, but it's just one more of that CSI crap that makes me detest that series so much.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:43 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by RaptorJesus

    Agreed compeltely, but that is never going to happen. Nolan has completly ignored the detective aspect of the character. It should have been obvious when they made Ducard a pseudonym. All we got in TDK was hims awing away a piece of the wall and a computer analyzing it.....no actual detective work.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:52 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives RE your reply to rbatty024

    by RaptorJesus

    Where in the hell do you get the idea that people who don't want Nolan's batman limited to his own universe want a less realistic universe? I don't want villains like Clayface or whatever (although I think croc is a bad example as he could be handled in a realistic way, i.e. toned down as he doesnt really have powers), I still want everything to be as realistic as possible.<p>It's such bullshit that people make the bullshit jump that wanting batman to crossover with other heroes means wanting a completely unrealistic universe.<p>Look at the Superman Returns. It was clearly set in our universe, except with the difference of superman, kryptonite and metropolis existing. Now, Singer did not want to make that movie as realistic as Nolan does his films, but it can be done. Those who think it is impossible have an amazing lack of vision.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 8:24 a.m. CST

    Hugo Strange

    by templar

    The problem with sequels and “trequels”, is that they usually rehash what happened in the first movie. I hope it this isnt the case with Batman Rises, though I doubt it will be. I think Nolan sees his Batman franchise as one big issue broken up into 3 respective parts. Something akin to the Lord of the Rings trilogy. One massive story splintered into 3 movies. I like how the theme of “escalation” flows from Batman Begins to the Dark Knight. Bruce Wayne started something in the 1st movie and it’s something he’s not even initially aware of until the 2nd film when he confronts the Joker. The Joker even tells him “You started something here and there’s no going back”. To me, that line smacks of the creation of the rogues gallery. The next movie is really going to be interesting. I always liked Hugo Strange; reason being, he was the only one to ever uncover Batmans true identity, save for the riddler of course at the end of Hush. And that was only because he was submerged in a lazarus pit and had an epiphany as to who Batman really was.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 8:25 a.m. CST

    Hugo Strange

    by templar

    The problem with sequels and “trequels”, is that they usually rehash what happened in the first movie. I hope it this isnt the case with Batman Rises, though I doubt it will be. I think Nolan sees his Batman franchise as one big issue broken up into 3 respective parts. Something akin to the Lord of the Rings trilogy. One massive story splintered into 3 movies. I like how the theme of “escalation” flows from Batman Begins to the Dark Knight. Bruce Wayne started something in the 1st movie and it’s something he’s not even initially aware of until the 2nd film when he confronts the Joker. The Joker even tells him “You started something here and there’s no going back”. To me, that line smacks of the creation of the rogues gallery. The next movie is really going to be interesting. I always liked Hugo Strange; reason being, he was the only one to ever uncover Batmans true identity, save for the riddler of course at the end of Hush. And that was only because he was submerged in a lazarus pit and had an epiphany as to who Batman really was.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 9:26 a.m. CST

    Nolan's Take is Great

    by nicegoogly

    I loved Blind Justice, RaptorJesus, but the whole mind switch device does not really fit into realistic Batman. Love the line about his doctor asking him about what clearly appeared to be hundreds of healed broken bones. Asimov, IGN called this months ago. He is a fringe character that has never had any real physical presence in the comics to pose a true threat to Batman. I agree that some of the detective peices were discarded in favor of crimefightingnin the films. The CSI parts of The Dark Knight I felt acknowledged the modern detective. See two films still have Batman trying to figure out his role. In the first film he wanted to be a symbol. In the second film he made that symbol a person in Harvey, and like Ra's told, a person can be corrupted. One thing that bugs me is how so many people, even on this board misunderstood the ending. Batman did not take responsibility fornHarvey's death. That was credited to the Joker and the report was that he died in the hospital. Batman took repsoibility for the murders Harvey committed. They were the murders of a crooked cop and several mobsters. They appear to be viglante killings. This works out for Batman since not only the Joker, but even Eric Roberts knew and said everyone knew that Batman does not kill people. Now they believe that Batman will kill criminals. It restore the fear that Batman needs to keep the criminals in check. It would make no sense if they believe he is a murderer, just like them. Why would he fight crime and why would they fear him?

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 10:49 a.m. CST

    ContinentalOp. I just have time enough...

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...to say how impressed I am that you know who Dr. Quartz is. You are a true student of the field. <p> Might have time to get back into the game tonight, if comments on this are still being made. See you then.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:57 a.m. CST

    templar

    by RaptorJesus

    Quite a few people have worked out Batman's identity. Catwoman, Ras, Bane, Hush, Dr Hurt, etc

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 12:17 p.m. CST

    nicegoogly

    by RaptorJesus

    Agreed completely that the mind switch device does not fit, and should have said obviously I would not want that included. I think just the manhunt aspects are interesting though.<p>I would much rather have some aspects of the Venokm story, I think that could be mighty interesting....Batman looking to improve himself after blaming himself for a girl dying and going too far.<p>Not sure what you mean when referring to the detective stuff. The mdoern detective is still a DETECTIVE, with the advantage of mdoern tools. He still has to think, the tools dont just do everything for him. How apt you mention CSI, which is exactly what TDK mirrored, what with the absence of ANY detecting.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 1 p.m. CST

    What can I say KKBB...

    by Continentalop

    ...I'm actually more interested in what influenced comics nowadays than I am in comic books themselves. I like to see what inspires things. <p> Dime novels, Penny Dreadfuls, Pulp stories, hard boiled, comic strips, I'm intrigued by all of them. Which is why I know, deep in my heart, that Penguin and Catwoman are needed in the next one (sorry, I had to throw that in there).

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 1:01 p.m. CST

    To Sir Asimov Lives ....

    by JackGraham

    Well hello old chap. Being the good gentleman that I am, I thought I ought to let you know that your package of your world famous Portuguese chouriço smoky mama baby sausage arrived in excellent condition today. I thought for a moment that you had forgot to send me this beautiful delicacy but alas, it is here and now travelling at a rather speedy rate through my digestive tract and i presume in a few hours it will have reached my poop shoot and then no sooner has it arrived that I will proceed t flush it into oblivio forever, until the next batch you send me. Many thanks Asimov. p.s unstoppable is terrible.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 2:08 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    You have to be kidding trying to support the detective work in TDK. Batman is the worlds greatest detective, and we did not see that on screen at all. The Nolan version of Batman relied on Lucious Fox to solve problems for him or had a high tech computer give him his magical answer. NOT ONCE DID WE SEE HIM DOING ANY DETECTING.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 2:29 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    "I don't think that anyone here is saying that you can't have a realistic film with Superman in it, or Green Lantern or any other flying fucking asshole for that matter- I KNOW that I'm not saying that"<p> That's exactly what your saying fool.<p> Your point is basically that even though you can have a realistic superman movie or whatever, it would not be realistic enough to be in Nolans universe. Which is idiocy. I asked you to give reasons as to anything in NOlans films that would actually negate the existence of superman or whatever, and you fucking can't, because there isnt.<p>You don't have a leg to stand on logically, and you're just arguing from emotion because you PERSONALLY don't want to see superman or whatever in Nolan's stories. That's quite a different thing from saying that they wouldn't work, when they clearly would.<p>The whole point I made was that I hope Nolan is not dumb enough to actively lock out the possibility. If he doesn't want to or is unable to branch the universes, fine, but don't be selfish and lock out other people from being able to do it.<p>Lastly, I really suggest you pick up some fucking comics and get a clue for the characters and the many worlds they live in, as you have no fucking clue.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:03 p.m. CST

    Venom

    by nicegoogly

    Venom was an interesting story line and would be more tolerable than Scarecrow gas. LOTDK stuck to reality a bit more than the other books, and was considered an "Elseworlds" type of universe, but not exactly. I know I was a bit confusing about the CSI stuff, I was trying to type fast on my iPad (which is nearly impossible). I mentioned CSI specifically because that is what modern pop culture equates with being a detective. We don't watch Columbo gumshoes any more. If there is a detective show of any sort with that type of mentality, it is The Mentalist or Lie to Me, both shows are equal amounts of cheese and hamfistedness. The Dark Knight had Batman using not only Wayne Enterprises to look into Lau, but we had that whole bullet thing (which I felt was overkill in that regard, it just looked really cool). I agree 100% that they need to show that Batman has this great detective intellect that is supposed to rival the deductive reasoning abilities of Sherlock Holmes. According to the comic books, he studied with the world's greatest detectives as well as the world's greatest martial artists. The computer stuff was a little lazy or at least did not pay homage to that part of the Batman legend. Please note, I am a bigger fan of Batman Begins than the Dark Knight. Ra's was always my favorite villain. I think people are very protective of The Dark Knight just like people wanted to see him in gray and blue tights before the movie was getting any buzz. I am a Batfan, not a Batfanboy. The recent comic book offering have been a bit off.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:18 p.m. CST

    Superman

    by nicegoogly

    First, RaptorJesus qualifies as a true Batfan. I know he has been getting shit from all sides today, but he knows his Batman. To make a reference to Blind Justice (although it was issue 598-600 in Detective Comics) and know it was Ducards first appearance means you know your Batman. Second, I agree that there is nothing that prevents the existence of Superman in Nolan's Batman universe. I could see Bale's Batman having the same initial reaction to the Boy Scout. He will be gruff, treat him poorly because Superman will have no frame of reference to understand someone like Batman. Even with his Kryptonian intellect (a more recent invention in the Superman mythos) Batman was always smarter than him. This Nolan Batman could easily be hiding his jealousy or feelings of inadequacy in these traits. Could we add him somewhere? Yes. It is a perfect fit? No. One of the other problems is that we are looking at Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern and trying to put him in this universe. That is not going to work. Honestly, I am looking forward to green lantern, but I don't expect substance from the movie. You can give metahumans more humanity. Look at Watchman. Say what you will about it being a direct translation of the source material (I thought it was great under the circumstances) but these superheroes felt just as real as the humans Nite Owl and Rorschach.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 3:24 p.m. CST

    There really wasn't much Detective work in TDK

    by Continentalop

    What Bruce Wayne did was INVESTIGATION and INTELLIGENCE work, not DETECTING. And I'm not trying to be pedantic, I'm just pointing out an observation in Nolan's Batman movies. <P> In TDK and BB Batman relies heavily on computers, his wealth and access to advanced technology to solve crimes. The ballistic work and use of irradiated money was good police work and forensics, but it wasn't DETECTIVE work for the simple reason that Batman wasn't required to use his own intelligence to piece something together and solve a mystery. DETECTIVE FICTION requires a MYSTERY to solve, and so far their has been little mystery in Nolan's Batman movies (other than the odd clue left by Joker or what Scarecrow is up to).. <P> OF course a big part of that has to do with the choice of villains. In the first movie there was not enough time to have an actual mystery involving Scarecrow and Ra's al Ghul's plot, and in the second movie neither Joker or this version of Two-Face supplied much of a mystery. Joker wants you to know he did it and wants you to know where he is going to strike next, negating any sort of Detective work because there is no mystery. Even when Batman had to figure out where he was it wasn't based on clues for him to solve but an advanced piece of technology/ <P> That is one of the reasons why I want -surprise, surprise - the Penguin in the next movie because he is a villain that demands Batman do Detective work. Unlike the Joker, the classic Penguin story is him trying to pull off a crime WITHOUT Batman's knowledge and Batman having to figure out who the culprit was. Batman must first off investigate and figure it was the Penguin, and then solve the mystery of what the Penguin is up to next. <P>

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:20 p.m. CST

    nicegoogly

    by RaptorJesus

    Thanks for the compliments man. Agree with much of what you wrote. RE Ryan Reynolds as GL though... again, I think that would work well in a JLA movie which would be balanced, and agree he would be out of place in a the current films.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:34 p.m. CST

    No, Superman does NOT easily fit into Nolan's Batman Films

    by BatFanFever

    The claim that because in the comics a "realistic" Batman can exist alongside "unrealistic" characters, this can be translated into Nolan's films, is illogical. Firstly, the comic book Batman is not "realistic" -- nor is Nolan's Batman, but it TRIES to SEEM realistic, and is far more in the vein of illusionary realism than any comic book featuring Batman and Superman and magic and aliens in the same universe. Secondly, when you get so angry and denounce us for saying that your assertion of Superman as fitting into Nolan's Batman world is akin to Clayface etc, your denials are exactly the sort of thing you keep saying is NOT true when WE point it out regarding Superman. Tell me the logic of your argument, when you insist there's no reason a "realistic" Batman can't exist with "unrealistic" characters like Superman and the Green Lantern, and then also arguing that this DOESN'T include Clayface. Because "realistic" Batman in the comics is alongside "unrealistic" Clayface, now isn't it. Yep, he is. So you should kind of lay off the loud complaints that we are unfairly linking these things -- it's your own argument that links them. There is very clear and logical reasoning behind denying Superman a spot in Nolan's Batman films -- the ONLY place we are really talking about, at least here anyway (although some folks do of course also want Batman removed from the DCU, but that's another matter and not what's been said here). Saying "what in the films would prevent Superman from existing" isn't a valid argument, any more than it's valid of me to say "prove an invisible unicorn isn't sitting beside me right now" and then insist that you can't prove it reasonably enough to deny it's validity as a realistic option (you can, if "proof" means "logic" and "history" and "how things really are"). "The Godfather" didn't have anything in it that would contradict the appearance of a rocket ship from Krypton crashing and bringing Superman to Earth, either. The question is whether or not an alien who looks just like us but who flies around and is indestructible and shoots heat vision from his eyes and has X-ray vision is in fact fitting in a film that so far has attempted NOT to go too far beyond the boundaries of a world that seems as close to our own as possible and that tries to keep the amount of overt fantasy to a minimum. Yes, ninjas are not exactly "realistic", sonar vision from cell phones is not really "realistic", but the most implausible elements in the films are made to SEEM plausible and like they are something that MIGHT exist in our world without TOO much suspension of disbelief. Why? Because they do not go beyond what most people would think of as possible in our world as it exists now. Would our understanding of reality, of science, of life, etc have to change in order for ninja martial artists to really exist? No. Does the sonar-vision technology go beyond the realm of what we might be able to accomplish with forms of existing technology applied differently? No (this has been debated, but at least a few sites featured detailed explanations of how this could in fact be achieved using existing technologies). Nolan's Batman isn't in a world that contains things that, as far as our own real world tells us right now, could NOT exist. Superman, as far as everything we logically know right now, could not exist. No, however much some fans might insist that advanced alien civilizations could send a ship here with a humanoid who possesses massive strength and can fly etc, that is not in fact plausible. Firstly, the real test is BASED ON WHAT WE KNOW is it possible, and right now from what we know there are no known advanced civilizations on other planets, and X-ray vision makes no sense whatsoever (many people have tried to come up with "realistic" explanations, but so far none have really succeeded at all). Flying, too, is out the window (excuse the pun). If you cannot see why an alien flying and shooting heat from his eyes and seeing through walls etc is an entirely different kind of "suspension of disbelief" as compared to what's required to believe Wayne Enterprises managed to use phone satellites and GPS and Google Maps and sound-imaging to produce a city-wide sonar system, then I don't think there's going to be much point in trying to have further discussion about what is or is not really "plausible" or "realistic." Just about any film or story you could possibly name that involves even the most outlandish elements and unrealistic characters probably at some point also includes at least ONE person or animal that IS basically realistic -- that doesn't mean that therefore any story with realistic characters can logically fit unrealistic ones into the story as well. Can the JLA or Superman's OWN films include Batman? Of course. But just because it works in THAT direction doesn't mean it works the other way around, and for all of the accusations of logical fallacies etc directed at those saying Superman won't fit in Nolan's films, the truth is that the arguments favoring Superman fitting into Nolan's films are the ones full of illogical assertions and assumptions. Nobody says you have to LIKE or PREFER Nolan's films with only Batman, or that you are "wrong" for liking or preferring it etc -- the issue is whether preference will be argued to be "how it really is" when it doesn't make sense. And in this instance, any claim that Nolan's Batman films could logically incorporate Superman, without fundamentally altering the nature of Nolan's Batman world, is not accurate or logical.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 4:43 p.m. CST

    Wow, that's a big frigging block

    by BatFanFever

    Not sure why my paragraphs won't separate. Sorry for the monster block attack.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 5:37 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    RE your reply to Continentalop -- Jesus dude. That's just sad. There was NO indication that Batman has a detective skillset or is even inclined that way in the movies, none at all. Nolan's Batman is someone who is depednent on others to solve the problems, so he can then go be the muscle.<p>Whenever people have dismissed Batman as a rich kid with toys....that is exactly what Nolan has given us. Normally we can defend his will and intellect and skill set....but not with Nolan's Batman.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 5:51 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by RaptorJesus

    It might not be what you MEANT to say, but it is certainly what you are saying, as any sane objectiv observer would agree. If it is not what you MEANT to say, then you need to improve your grasp of the language.<p>I get what you're saying about suspension of disbelief, and don't consider it relevant, at all. You're still arguing about super beings in a Nolan Batman film, which has nothing to do with anything. I am saying having them in the same universe and then the NOLAN BATMAN IN A SHARE UNIVERSE FILM IS ABSOLUTELY FINE.<p>I know that's hard for you to understand, but try real hard and think about it, and you might just understand the difference.<p>UNfortunatly you are probably right that the cast won't appear in a film Nolan does not direct, which is a fucking shame. It's a fucking shame that he had to have such a limited vision, and that the movies and character will not be able to grow to their full potential - which would require the shared universe.<p>As for your childish comment about comics vs cinema..., what you don't understand is that their is a high level of crossover between the two. What often works in comcis can work in cinema, and the points I have made above are equally valid for both.<p>It's OK though. You can keep suspending your disbelief and keep telling yourself Nolans universe is exactly the same as our world (actually thats just delusional) while I and others realize NOlans Batman....is basically not fucking Batman.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 5:53 p.m. CST

    Ace of Wands

    by Continentalop

    I guess you didn't understand what I was saying. Probably my fault for being to vague. <P> I meant Batman is not a detective as per the DETECTIVE GENRE. Yes, he is an investigator but so far Nolan's movies has been more police procedural than Detective stories. And while Cops can be in the detective genre, it isn't always the case (THE SHIELD is a Police Procedural show, it is not however a Detective show). <P> Batman has always been part of the Detective Genre. Not every story obviously, but the majority of them yes. His first story was "Case of the Chemical Syndicate" and that clearly establishes him as a detective character who solves crimes, not just fights them. <P> OF course, I will say it again, I think the choice of foes prevented Nolan from making him a Detective. The Joker in TDK is very much the Joker from Batman #1 and other classic stories such as "Joker's Five Part Revenge", "Case of the Laughing Fish" and "Sign of the Joker." A character who is less concerned with creating a mystery for Batman to solve than he is with creating a ticking time bomb Batman must race to stop. The Joker in TDK is more terrorist than criminal so I don't think Batman was pushed to used classic detective skills but instead just be a crime-fighter. <P> Now, if the Riddler, Penguin or even Prof. Hugo Strange is in the next one and Batman doesn't do some detecting, than I will complain.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 5:56 p.m. CST

    BatFanFever

    by RaptorJesus

    Dude, that is a huge block of text. I will read it later and get back to you, and give you a worthy reply. Cheers.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 6:02 p.m. CST

    Continentalop

    by RaptorJesus

    I am preparing to enjoy the next bat movie, but also preparing to be disapointed. The more I think about the first 2 and think how far from the characters they are and how much they are screwing up....I get disapointed.<p>I liken the situation to Terminator 3. I enjoyed that while I watched it, but it was only after leaving and thinking about it that I realized how much stuff they screwed up and that it wasn't loyal to the first 2 at all.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 6:31 p.m. CST

    RJ, I really have no expectations

    by Continentalop

    I could easily see the next one being great, mediocre or terrible. Right now I am just intrigued by who they are thinking of casting and what villain they select. To me that the most important part of whether or not I like the movie anyways. If Nolan decides to go with Hush I have a strong feeling I'll dislike the movie no matter how well made or acted it is.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 6:50 p.m. CST

    NOLAN OFF SUPERMAN

    by chien_sale

    Why doesn't this site have the news? Are you guys getting old?

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 6:58 p.m. CST

    OK, one more thing: Allegory

    by Continentalop

    The most important aspect IMO of Nolan's Batman series hasn't been the theme of the films (Fear, Escalation) but instead the allegorical nature of the films. Each one has represented something that was very important on on the national/world consciousness when they were released. <P> Batman Begins was very much about terrorism and 9/11 (replacing planes with a train). TDK was a metaphor for the occupation of Iraq, with the Joker standing in for Zarqawi. <P> What major event is now on the world's mind? The economy. That is why I believe the Penguin should be the villain in the next one, because he is the best choice amongst Batman's villains of being the one to represent the greed and corruption of some of the uber wealthy in this country. I mean, I think the Penguin could represent this easily in the context of a superhero crime story: <P> http://tinyurl.com/2c56h8y

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 9:27 p.m. CST

    A new term: charismatic megavillains...

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...While catching up on the comments, I suddenly flashed on the phrase "charismatic megafauna", which wildlife activists use to describe the largest & most appealing endangered animals. Such activists often complain that if you're the last snow leopard, the world will make sure your remaining days are rich and full; but if you're the last red-bellied stinkbug, nobody (except a few entomologists) really gives a damn what happens to you. Read "fanboys" for "entomologists", and that's the argument in this talkback. Cast a charismatic megavillain like Catwoman, and the days of DKR will be long in the land; cast Hugo Strange, and you'll hear nothing but crickets countrywide (red-bellied crickets, no doubt). I myself think Nolan can bump Hugo up to the kilofauna level, at least, but whatever the case, I thought this might be an amusing analogy and a catchy phrase. "Charismatic megavillain..." Sort of rolls right off the tongue, doesn't it? <p> Back to catching up...(I've been sick the past two days, and really need some sleep, but I'll see if I can't squeeze in another couple of comments before hitting the sheets...)

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 9:55 p.m. CST

    @RaptorJesus, that's not consistent at all...

    by BatFanFever

    <p>RaptorJesus, you said:</p> <p>"I get what you're saying about suspension of disbelief, and don't consider it relevant, at all. You're still arguing about super beings in a Nolan Batman film, which has nothing to do with anything. I am saying having them in the same universe and then the NOLAN BATMAN IN A SHARE UNIVERSE FILM IS ABSOLUTELY FINE.",</p> <p>So, you're saying that you AREN'T talking about Superman being in the Nolanverse, you're just talking about the Nolan Batman appearing in a SEPARATE joint film or something, right?</p> <p>Okay, then WHY did you say THIS earlier:</p> <p>"Your point is basically that even though you can have a realistic superman movie or whatever, it would not be realistic enough to be in Nolans universe. Which is idiocy. I asked you to give reasons as to anything in NOlans films that would actually negate the existence of superman or whatever, and you fucking can't, because there isnt."</p> <p>That's CLEARLY an argument from you that Nolan's film COULD include Superman without violating their internal logic and illusionary realism. So it's false for you to now claim that the realism etc stuff isn't "relevant" or that it "has nothing to do with anything" when it in fact was exactly what you said previously.</p> <p>You're switching your argument, which would be fine (because in the course of a debate sometimes our points get clearer even to ourselves, and we realize we were too broad or too narrow at first etc) if you weren't acting like Ace of Wands is dumb or a jerk or something for supposedly "not getting" what you're really saying when in fact he DID get what you actually factually DID say.</p> <p>Moreover, I still think that taking Nolan's actual Batman from his films and that world and putting them into a film with Superman and other such things is a bad idea -- those types of films NEED a Batman who in fact is a characterization MEANT to coexist with aliens and magic and superhumans etc. And using literally THE Batman from Nolan's films implies a LINK between the Batman films and that other hypothetical aliens & magic world, which inherently impacts and reflects on the Nolan films and their world.</p> <p>There's no REASON to do that, it is not internally consistent, and people like you who want Batman with Superman etc would in fact be having a disservice done to you if the Batman you got was one more grounded in illusionary realism. Because let's face it, the Batman from TDK is not someone who would last long in any situation that required the involvement of an invincible flying alien who shoots lasers from his eyes.</p> <p>There would need to be a REASON for Batman to be there, right? Because this threat needed more than just the indestructible flying alien with laser-eyes, it also needed Batman to HELP the superhuman alien, right? Okay -- what threat that is too much for SUPERMAN to handle alone is going to suddenly become manageable because the Batman from TDK showed up to help?</p> <p>I love Nolan's films, Batman is my favorite character, but I also objectively know that the version I like and that's in the Nolan films doesn't fit into the sort of tales you like because this Batman would get decapitated or burned alive in the first few seconds, and that's a horrible eight second cameo to put in a superhero film, isn't it?<p> </p>A JL film or Superman-Batman team up film needs the Batman from Morrison's run -- that's a pretty solid Batman who demonstrated why he can kick it with superpowered aliens, in part because honestly he's portrayed as kind of faux-super himself (a normal human even at the height of physical and mental perfection would've been dead early in "Final Crisis"). So keep Nolan's Batman out of it -- Superman would ruin those films' sense of illusionary realism, and the Nolan Batman in any Superman film would go insane from shock or die too quickly to be of use. :)

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Just realized...

    by kisskissbangbang

    Penguins _are_ endangered, charismatic megafauna. Notion fits better than I thought. And given Man-Bat, Catman, Killer Croc, Killer Moth, and other animal-themed Bat-villains, the fit keeps getting better...Although Spider-Man's rogue's gallery would be the best fit of all... <p> What'd you say this medicine I'm taking was again?

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 10:04 p.m. CST

    Continentalop

    by Rodie

    I like your train of thought, and do agree that the economy and large forces of finance and industry could be an intriguing backdrop for some of the themes and plot of TDKR to hang. If this is the case, I'd like to see as Strange and Gotham PD are hunting Batman, Bruce/Batman is trying to infiltrate Black Mask's organization which is not a traditional mob, but a SECRET SOCIETY like the illuminati, ultra-rich, ultra-powerful elite of Gotham who are orchestrating things to keep Gotham corrupt and the poor poor...also they'll need to be killing people two and Batman has to stop it, but maybe Bruce becomes a "member" to take it down from within?

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 10:17 p.m. CST

    Op, Ras is not a poor man's Fu Manchu...

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...Dr. Tzin-Tzin is a poor man's Fu Manchu.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 10:28 p.m. CST

    Killik...

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...which of these characters doesn't belong with the others? "Penguin, Riddler, 2-Face, Black Mask" You think Warner will force Nolan to use "a major and popular villain" like Black Mask? Who outside fandom has ever heard of Black Mask? No one. Don't just take my word for it; ask any of your non-comics-reading friends. They'll look at you as if you'd just told them the new villain was Maxie Zeus (now _there's_ an idea...).

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:02 p.m. CST

    You're _so_ wrong about Damien, Op...

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...and I was getting worried we might run out of things to disagree about. I understand, I didn't like him either when he first showed up; but six months later, I loved the little bastard. On the other hand, I hated Jason Todd from the beginning, and still do. But Damien is Jason Todd done right. I don't think he'll be retconned, and if he is, I think he'll be retconned back in eventually (that's assuming comics still exist in any format a couple of decades from now). However, while I don't agree with you on Talia either, I had to laugh when you suggested she was the Tori Spelling of Batman villainesses. Brutal, man, brutal.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:20 p.m. CST

    'Lop is NEVER wrong.

    by Subtitles_Off

    Talia IS the Tori Spelling of the Batman comics, and Damien is a useless little s#!t that will be forgotten once grant Morrison is off the Bat-books and writers are once more free to write about Batman instead of sci-fi nonsense with Dick in Daddy's suit.<P>The comics are gimmcky and stoopid right now, and they can't be fixed without a complete ret-con. My prediction? Damien exists on Earth#What-Defuck along with Zebra Batman and The Ten-Eyed Man.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:21 p.m. CST

    What? Still no Dandy Don obit?

    by Subtitles_Off

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:34 p.m. CST

    One last point, Op....

    by kisskissbangbang

    ...I'm tiring out, even though I want to say more about Ras & Talia (basically that they've been around for more than half of the Bat's 70 year career and are still quite prominent, unlike Johnny Witts, say...but more on this later, perhaps.)What I did want to ask you was about the Penguin. I can't deny he's one of the big ones, but he's a character I have trouble taking seriously. Perhaps it's residue from the TV show, but I find it hard to think of a comics portrayal to put against that. (He does show in my beloved Englehart run, but that was also a Robin-comes-home-from-college story, and what I remember best from it is Dick taking all the clues, reaching what seems the logical conclusion, then learning he's wrong as Bats interprets them correctly and stops Cobblepot, showing Dick that he has a way to go before he can match Bruce.)And the less said about the movie version, the better. My first impulse would be a complete overhaul, a cruel businessman with just the nickname left (like Tom DeLay's was "The Hammer"), perhaps indicating he's a cold, cold bird. But that's a confession of total defeat; if you throw everything out, you might as well create a new villain. Do you have a favorite Penguin story as a model to be used? What's your take on the character and the source of his appeal? You don't have to make up a plotline, as some here do, but if you could sketch your vision of the dude and how to make him a serious threat, I'd be most interested.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:44 p.m. CST

    I thought you'd like that one Subs

    by Continentalop

    How are you doing my man? And we are no longer time traveling in this TB like Batlander with the magic time vagina.

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:46 p.m. CST

    Subtitles Off,we're too far apart on this...

    by kisskissbangbang

    to talk meaningfully about it, I'm afraid. I think Morrison's run is one of the great ones, and I don't see either of us convincing each other on the subject. On the other hand, all that's in the past, and Grant's going in a whole new direction now. You don't think you'll like this one any better? <p> And why should Dandy Don get an obit when Jill Clayburgh didn't? This isn't ESPN after all...

  • Dec. 6, 2010, 11:58 p.m. CST

    I don't mind that you like Damien KKBB

    by Continentalop

    Batman has such a long history and so many different supporting characters everyone differs over who they like and who they don't like. So I can't hold it against you for liking Ra's, Talia or Damien wayne when I like "failed" characters like Prof. Hugo Strange, Clayface I, Signal Man and Calendar Girl. <P> However, the thing I HATE about Damien isn't really about him, it is about the time period he is operating in. And that thing is @%!#ing CONTINUITY. <P> DC, and especially Batman and Superman, should never be like Marvel, yet here we are with Batman in a shared larger universe and everyone worrying about continuity and canon, even here on this TB. <P> In the old days I could chose to ignore Damien Wayne because I knew that in three or four years he would be gone, and that he would only be in one of the two Batman comic books. But not nowadays. Now, not only is he all present, he is also constantly referred to and will be referred to for years to come until he IS retconned out. <P> Like I said, in the old days you could chose to ignore Bat-Hound or Bat-Mite or not, depending on your own personal taste. But with CONTINUITY every Batman story is official and must be respected and accepted. Bullshit, IMHO, I like the old Batdays when he was like a character from a tall tale or life story from an unreliable biography. <P> Also, because of CONTINUITY, all these IMPORTANT events have been happening, giving unnatural and artificial to characters. Penguin is a loser, unlike Bane who "Broke The Bat!"; Catwoman is lame and not as important as Talia, because she is mother of his child. I say once again "bullsh*t!" Penguin didn't have to "break the Bat" to become important because he ALREADY WAS IMPORTANT. 60 some years before that event and countless adaptations, and lasting power, prove his importance. Bane is just a guy who needed a quick gimmick to get noticed, as with many of the rest of these new breed of "important characters." <P> So nothing against the little Damien boy personally (although I am personally not a fan of Wayne having a ninja/assassin son who is now part of a family business and taking Batman one step further away from Crime Pulp fiction towards straight up superheroics) but I like my Batman comics nebulous and I like it when characters prove themselves by lasting the test of time instead of having greatness thrusted upon them by modern writers and fans. <P> And yes, I know I sound like an old curmudgeon (especially considering how rambling this must be...:)

  • Dec. 9, 2010, 10:23 a.m. CST

    huh, ok....

    by iDrinkYourMexicanCoke

    but they already sort of addressed the "copycat" thing in Dark Knight. Seems a bit like treading back over something we've seen already and basing a whole plot around it.

  • Dec. 9, 2010, 11:13 a.m. CST

    by BatFanFever

    <p>^Oh, for the love of God, DaChrisman, just stop it. Your shameless self-promotion and spreading that link to your false story is ridiculous.</p> <p>Have you stopped stealing the entire layout and administrator's name from other sites now? Glad to hear it!</p> <p>But your posting of false claims about a "source" with an "exclusive" who was right on other things is sad when you took it from fan speculation posted on two message boards on other sites. Your rumor about Strange, about the Riddler, and about Hathaway & Weisz all came from one single fan's posts on other message board sites.</p> <p>It's terrible of you to post stories with fake sourcing and misleading fans, and to keep spreading it all over even after you've been called out for it. You could've just admitted to everyone that your "source" is just a fan offering speculation, but instead you keep pretending it's some kind of inside-info you heard from a source with some kind of access to real info, but it's not and you know it and we all know it.</p> <p>The fact you used to literally copy and paste another entire site onto your attempted site, and even called yourself by another guy's name, is proof enough of your credibility. Now you offer up fake stories with fake sources you lifted from fans off fan-site message boards, and won't stop running all over the web posting links to try and drive up your site traffic. Yeah, remember how obsessive you act about your site traffic on other message boards like SHH, and your little charts you post and how excited you are to try and get more traffic than that site you tried to steal and that you are now obsessed with getting back at by trying to "take" their members and traffic?</p> <p>It's really, really weird behavior, and legit sites and serious fans need to stop feeding into your behavior, it hurts all fans when fake stories spread and sites claim fake sources to try and fool their members and fans.</p> That batman-news story came a few hours after "DaChrisman" (or whatever name you use for yourself today) saw a fan post information about the theory over on SHH and BOF. The fan had just gotten information about Mark Millar's tweet and an interview from April of this year that was strong circumstantial evidence Hugo Strange is the next villain. Those posts and a few PMs (were you by any chance getting any of the PMs on that, too, "DaChrisman?") came shortly before batman-news started claiming a "source" gave him the "exclusive" info.</p> <p>The story also said the "source" knew about the Riddler and Anne Hathaway & Rachel Weisz, but both claims were also posted on the same message boards by the fan who passed on the theory about Hugo Strange being a sure-thing in the next film.</p> <p>And guess who is a frequent poster and reader on SHH? DaChrisman, who frantically promotes his site there and can't post on another site's message boards without including direct links to his own site constantly. Was it by any chance you or one of your obsessive fan-friends who pretended to be a PR person from WB and sent that fake "leak" about "Prey" to some sites, too? Just asking, since so much else of this rumor-mill and your previous terrible behavior make you and all of this so very suspicious.</p> <p>The bottom line is, this all started when a guy with a history of stealing other sites (taking the masthead and images and layout and links and even the site operator's screenname) shows up on a message board and then a few hours later posts a fan's message board theory as a story claiming a valid "source" gave said it. The claims all are the same as that same fan's statements, all on the same one or two sites.</p> <p>And the only other supposed scoop batman-news ever posted turned out to be garbage, when the claim about WB scouting locations in New Orleans and a "friend" trying to get a job on the production in New Orleans turned out to be bogus as well. You tried to spin it like it wasn't totally disproven, didn't ya? But nope, sorry, whether some guys at WB personally thought New Orleans was a good spot to save production costs, there was no scouting or any move in that direction at all, no action was taken that way, and it's bad of you to not just outright admit your story and claims on that were just wrong.</p> <p>You can keep running around posting your links and trying to claim you "called it" or whatever, but from now on consider yourself on notice that you'll be called out when you post links to stories making bogus claims with bogus "sources."</p> <p>Nobody outside of the Nolans, Goyer, and maybe one or two producers had any remote idea at all about anything regarding the story of this film. The script wasn't even finished until the last few days, people. If you think there are any real "sources" with any real "leaks" or informed claims about the villains or story, you live in a fantasy world. It's all just personal opinion, with no real evidence at all, and no real "sources" at all. Stop pretending otherwise, "DaChrisman." And fans of "DaChrisman," wake the hell up and stop letting this guy make you all delusional. Why are you sticking up for someone who wasn't honest with you, and who has such bad past behavior?</p> <p>Harry, whether or not it turns out Hugo Strange is in the movie and if Prey is the inspiration, do know that the Prey rumor started from a fake "source" as well, and that the rumor about Prey was also lifted from a fan message board, from posts by the same people involved in the other things lifted off message boards that I've been talking about.</p> <p>Do you think there's a real chance that just a couple of people's personal ideas, before there was any information about it whatsoever, just by chance turned out to all be exactly right? Or is it more likely that, since the rest was all taken from fan speculation by the same two dudes on two sites over and over so far, that this rumor is just part of the same thing happening yet again? What makes more sense to you, and to everyone else reading this?</p> <p>If it's all really true, the rumors aren't correct because of any real sources, it's just luck and chance. We all act so pissed off when stupid rumors about Eddie Murphy get reported in the press, and we act like we hate the stupidity of out-of-control rumor-mongering, but that's exactly what's happened here and so many people are helping it and perpetrating the fraud. Why won't legitimate sites and fans stop adding to this, and tell everyone this is dubious at best and that it originated from very dubious or outright dishonest "sources"? The denunciation and debunking needs to be just as damn loud as the initial screaming to spread this story like wildfire.</p>

  • Dec. 9, 2010, 12:07 p.m. CST

    Woah, site acting weird...

    by BatFanFever

    Sorry, when I first came to the thread all posts were gone except one by "DaChrisman" from batman-news again, so I posted that thing there because it seemed only his initial "look at me! look at me, everybody!" post was left. Harry, feel free to erase my last post, since it's not necessary if all the other posts aren't erased. Sorry. Continentalop, I simply think that once again the answer is that you can say this and that scene represent this and that from real life, but it's no more true than if I point out that the show "The Lone Gunmen" was literally obviously about 9/11. I mean, the plot was about the hijacking of an airliner to crash it into the World Trade Center, and it aired in 2001. Only problem is, it aired in March, 6 months before 9/11. Likewise, the Die-Hard films or The Siege (terror attacks on NYC) or Wrong is Right (a 1982 film about a presidential administration planting bombs in the WTC and blaming the attack on Arab terrorists) or issue #596 of The Adventures of Superman which was published on September 12, 2001, and featured a surprise alien attack that included imagery depicting the strike on Metropolis towers like the WTC but also literally the TV footage of the WTC with both buildings smashed with gaping holes. Were those things all obviously influenced by 9/11, since they are so clearly mirroring the events and social fears etc related to the relevant issues as well? That last one is shocking, a comic containing 9/11 imagery from a surprise attack and published the day after the actual 9/11 attacks, huh? But of course it's all unrelated, all of those films came out prior to 9/11. The book Final Jihad in fact contained multiple shockingly accurate predictions -- firstly a rental-truck bomb attack by domestic terrorists against the Oklahoma City Federal Building, and in the end Islamic fundamentalist terrorists trained on flight simulators who use multiple airplanes to crash them into buildings. And it was written by Michael Keating, brother of Oklahoma Governor Frank Keating (governor during the Tim McVeigh attack on the Federal Building). Talk about relevant and clearly arising from an artist influenced overtly by world events, right? Problem is, it was written in 1992 and published in the early-to-mid 1990s. If you take a work of art, assume it reflects a certain set of political realities or events or views etc, and you look for those things in it, you will probably find it. But why assume that the artist's worldview and influences around him are the same as the things around YOU? Nolan is British. Why aren't you viewing the film through the filter of the historical and current-event realities of the UK in relation to Northern Ireland, for example? More to the point, too much of the film is, as I already noted, overtly lifted from comics and storylines that predate 9/11 anyway. They are in the film because that was the story they lifted from. Car chases are in the film because car chases and big shootout chases are pretty much a staple of action genres and comics. The mob is the mob and comprised of guys like that because that's what the mob is and that's how it's largely portrayed in the comics from which the film took inspiration. The fact that we can so easily point to the most obvious comic book source material influences, none of which is post-9/11, is the most glaring evidence that any supposed nuanced this-and-that comparison to literal real-world events just doesn't hold up. If we can see the film is comprised of these elements right out of the comics, it makes no sense to assert they are modern incarnations of literal people and events and convoys etc. Of course artists, and anyone else for that matter, is influenced by things around them and their own world perspective etc, but so are viewers of the art. And lacking knowledge of what precise events did or did not influence the artist, I'm inclined to look at the evidence showing clearly that it was adapted from source material predating and unrelated to the events you mention, and likewise I believe Nolan and others when they insist the film is not a literal representation for those things and that only the most vague thematic relationship exists. I don't presume to know people's minds and subconscious more than they know it themselves, especially when the very assertion itself inherently means you have to accept that it includes your own filtered vision of the film/art/etc through your own experiences and looking for things you recognize as related to and arising from your own world. That's why we can take a film, look for comparisons to this or that, and find them. Can you find in Battlestar Galactica the comparisons to modern events? Sure. You can also find the more literal and consistent comparison to Mormon belief and history, since Gary Larson was a Mormon and incorporated a ton of Mormon belief and teachings and names and history etc into the entire storyline and characters, which was retained a great deal in the new series. Is it most likely that the creators of the new series indeed incorporated some modern elements you recognized precisely because they are relevant and make the story more accessible and recognizable to modern audiences? Yep. But does that mean that those elements make it easier and more likely for viewers to find much more such comparisons than might really exist elsewhere? Probably. And is that likely something that is true in most film and art, and that kind of makes a lot of logical sense? I think so. So I feel some elements, which I already mentioned previously, did indeed exist as themes and comparisons in TDK. But I think that the further we get beyond those broader comparisons of themes, and into claims of more literal and specific assertions that "X represents Y, and person-A is a stand-in for person-B" the more we are into the realm of what the viewer interprets into the film rather than any valid assertion that we know Nolan's mind and know he meant those literal comparisons.

  • Dec. 9, 2010, 12:08 p.m. CST

    Woah, site acting weird...

    by BatFanFever

    Sorry, when I first came to the thread all posts were gone except one by "DaChrisman" from batman-news again, so I posted that thing there because it seemed only his initial "look at me! look at me, everybody!" post was left. Harry, feel free to erase my last post, since it's not necessary if all the other posts aren't erased. Sorry. Continentalop, I simply think that once again the answer is that you can say this and that scene represent this and that from real life, but it's no more true than if I point out that the show "The Lone Gunmen" was literally obviously about 9/11. I mean, the plot was about the hijacking of an airliner to crash it into the World Trade Center, and it aired in 2001. Only problem is, it aired in March, 6 months before 9/11. Likewise, the Die-Hard films or The Siege (terror attacks on NYC) or Wrong is Right (a 1982 film about a presidential administration planting bombs in the WTC and blaming the attack on Arab terrorists) or issue #596 of The Adventures of Superman which was published on September 12, 2001, and featured a surprise alien attack that included imagery depicting the strike on Metropolis towers like the WTC but also literally the TV footage of the WTC with both buildings smashed with gaping holes. Were those things all obviously influenced by 9/11, since they are so clearly mirroring the events and social fears etc related to the relevant issues as well? That last one is shocking, a comic containing 9/11 imagery from a surprise attack and published the day after the actual 9/11 attacks, huh? But of course it's all unrelated, all of those films came out prior to 9/11. The book Final Jihad in fact contained multiple shockingly accurate predictions -- firstly a rental-truck bomb attack by domestic terrorists against the Oklahoma City Federal Building, and in the end Islamic fundamentalist terrorists trained on flight simulators who use multiple airplanes to crash them into buildings. And it was written by Michael Keating, brother of Oklahoma Governor Frank Keating (governor during the Tim McVeigh attack on the Federal Building). Talk about relevant and clearly arising from an artist influenced overtly by world events, right? Problem is, it was written in 1992 and published in the early-to-mid 1990s. If you take a work of art, assume it reflects a certain set of political realities or events or views etc, and you look for those things in it, you will probably find it. But why assume that the artist's worldview and influences around him are the same as the things around YOU? Nolan is British. Why aren't you viewing the film through the filter of the historical and current-event realities of the UK in relation to Northern Ireland, for example? More to the point, too much of the film is, as I already noted, overtly lifted from comics and storylines that predate 9/11 anyway. They are in the film because that was the story they lifted from. Car chases are in the film because car chases and big shootout chases are pretty much a staple of action genres and comics. The mob is the mob and comprised of guys like that because that's what the mob is and that's how it's largely portrayed in the comics from which the film took inspiration. The fact that we can so easily point to the most obvious comic book source material influences, none of which is post-9/11, is the most glaring evidence that any supposed nuanced this-and-that comparison to literal real-world events just doesn't hold up. If we can see the film is comprised of these elements right out of the comics, it makes no sense to assert they are modern incarnations of literal people and events and convoys etc. Of course artists, and anyone else for that matter, is influenced by things around them and their own world perspective etc, but so are viewers of the art. And lacking knowledge of what precise events did or did not influence the artist, I'm inclined to look at the evidence showing clearly that it was adapted from source material predating and unrelated to the events you mention, and likewise I believe Nolan and others when they insist the film is not a literal representation for those things and that only the most vague thematic relationship exists. I don't presume to know people's minds and subconscious more than they know it themselves, especially when the very assertion itself inherently means you have to accept that it includes your own filtered vision of the film/art/etc through your own experiences and looking for things you recognize as related to and arising from your own world. That's why we can take a film, look for comparisons to this or that, and find them. Can you find in Battlestar Galactica the comparisons to modern events? Sure. You can also find the more literal and consistent comparison to Mormon belief and history, since Gary Larson was a Mormon and incorporated a ton of Mormon belief and teachings and names and history etc into the entire storyline and characters, which was retained a great deal in the new series. Is it most likely that the creators of the new series indeed incorporated some modern elements you recognized precisely because they are relevant and make the story more accessible and recognizable to modern audiences? Yep. But does that mean that those elements make it easier and more likely for viewers to find much more such comparisons than might really exist elsewhere? Probably. And is that likely something that is true in most film and art, and that kind of makes a lot of logical sense? I think so. So I feel some elements, which I already mentioned previously, did indeed exist as themes and comparisons in TDK. But I think that the further we get beyond those broader comparisons of themes, and into claims of more literal and specific assertions that "X represents Y, and person-A is a stand-in for person-B" the more we are into the realm of what the viewer interprets into the film rather than any valid assertion that we know Nolan's mind and know he meant those literal comparisons.