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Tomorrowland Tonight!!
Sunday's MAD MEN Finale!!

I am – Hercules!! Last week many were laid off, Bert Cooper and Faye Miller quit, and Don helped his first-season mistress back on the horse and explained to the readers of the New York Times that he did not care for the addictive quality of cigarettes. Peggy, I think, might have had the right idea when she suggested simply changing the firm’s name. She and Don will almost certainly soon be working under other auspices somewhere; why not create that “somewhere” themselves? Speculation abounds that Matt Weiner will kill another major character in tonight’s season finale. More in invisotext. The plan perhaps is to kill young Sally Draper, perhaps as Don swings the same kind of last-minute professional triumph that ended season three. AMC is making no new footage available for tonight’s installment, which suggests it’s going to hit the ground running. AMC says of “Tomorrowland”:
Opportunity arises for Don and Peggy.
Episode titles: 4.1 Public Relations 4.2 Christmas Comes But Once A Year 4.3 The Good News 4.4 The Rejected 4.5 The Chrysanthemum and the Sword 4.6 Waldorf Stories 4.7 The Suitcase 4.8 The Summer Man 4.9 The Beautiful Girls 4.10 Hands and Knees 4.11 Chinese Wall 4.12 Blowing Smoke 4.13 Tomorrowland 10 p.m. Sunday. AMC.
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Readers Talkback
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  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:39 a.m. CST

    The best and worst day of the year:

    by pollaxt

    The last MAD MEN for 8 months.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:11 a.m. CST

    looking forward to it..

    by KGB3317

    This has been the best season since the first one. Sally shouldn't die though. I like seeing the 60s from her perspective, just as much as anyone else's. The other kid, Bobby, doesn't do shit. At least Sally moves shit along with her antics.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:12 a.m. CST

    and one more for good measure

    by KGB3317

    ...shit!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:18 a.m. CST

    The Invisotext is scary enough you know its happening

    by Saen

    Poor whats her name.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:26 a.m. CST

    VENTURE BROTHERS TALKBACK!!!

    by Spaderific

    Herc, c'mon man!!! PLEASE?!?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:29 a.m. CST

    Entertainment Weekly says that in tonight's episde: (spoilers)

    by Spaderific

    "Don takes his kids (including Kiernan Shipka's Sally, who's had a breakout season) on a road trip." Sally's inclusion in the road trip = she's gonna die.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 4:13 a.m. CST

    VENTURE BROS is just an animated MAD MEN...

    by BurnHollywood

    ...Let's not be redundant.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 4:19 a.m. CST

    If they pull off that spoiler....

    by LordEnigma

    fuck this show for ripping off GOD DAMN RESCUE ME! Seriously, killing that character off ends the show and completely makes anything that comes after pointless.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:55 a.m. CST

    If a kid dies it will be Bobby

    by InActionMan

    They've gone through three Bobbies and have found absolutely nothing to do with him. Maybe he drowns while Don is banging Megan in the pool house. <P> I found some cool MM related stuff in my search to slake my MM thirst: <P> First an hour long interview with Matt Weiner conducted by Elvis Mitchel of NPR. <P> http://tinyurl.com/26u6cf2 <P> There is audio and video. The Audio is about an hour. The video is only a couple of minutes. <P> A pretty funny MM Parody on You tube. The guy does a pretty good Draper. <P> http://tinyurl.com/26hwj22 <P> GO TEAM DRAPER!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 7:54 a.m. CST

    Killing her would be a big, big, mistake

    by OutsideChance

    ...she's way too good an actress and her character's turned into one of the most interesting on the show.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:09 a.m. CST

    That spoiler

    by Canuck815

    I almost just can't see Weiner wanting to go that route, but then again he usually pulls one on us. She's supposed to die in the 90's after experimenting with drugs and promiscuous sex, dammit! I feel like there would be nothing to gain from killing her, Don already lost his closest person this season (Anna), so character-wise it doesn't seem necessary. Whatever they do I'm sure it'll be interesting.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:19 a.m. CST

    Screw the calendar

    by Xiphos_2

    When Mad Men airs its season finale is when summer is officially over.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:20 a.m. CST

    Wow I really hope it's not Sally

    by MrEkoLetMeLive

    That girl deserves to live long enough to see 1968 and really put her mom through hell.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:21 a.m. CST

    that sally stuff would be too dark

    by therootstheroots

    i keep thinking back to that scene when she watches that person set themselves on fire on tv. But the actress is 10, so to be able to move through the years, maybe this does have to happen.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:23 a.m. CST

    Hope the spoiler is a misdirect

    by Xiphos_2

    Losing Sally would suck the actress and character really came into her own this season and the characters potential for the future is something to look forward to.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:37 a.m. CST

    THIS ISSUE: SOMEBODY DIES

    by Voice O. Reason

    Come on....either Roger kills himself, Joan's husband gets killed by friendly fire, or they find out Bert's helicopter was shot down as he was leaving Korea. But, please, not Sally!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 8:58 a.m. CST

    Sally is necessary as counterpoint...

    by OutsideChance

    Sally's character is there to show how the kids of that era were affected by their parents' lifestyles and the events of the era. Killing her off for shock would eliminate an important aspect of the show's storylines.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:33 a.m. CST

    Glen deserves to be KILL OFF more than Sally!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    Sally has easily asserted herself as a good little actress! Hope the rumours are false!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:36 a.m. CST

    Sally was barely notice until Grandpa Gene...

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    came unto the scene! Afterwards TPTB has really push the actress to her potential!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:54 a.m. CST

    I don't think Peggy suggested they change the firm's name

    by MrD

    She suggested they change the conversation. That's why Don wrote the cigarette ad. Not from conviction,but as strategy.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:55 a.m. CST

    I did not read the spoiler,

    by Greggers

    but, of course, I was able to glean its content from the discussion in this talkback. Which I should have realized was going to happen. Good one, Greggers. <p> In any event, as pollaxt put it, this IS the best/worst day of my tv watching year. I can only imagine what it'll be like with the series finale. I mean, I don't think people have MAD MEN watching parties.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:58 a.m. CST

    Imagine this

    by InActionMan

    Don takes the kids on trip while Betty and Henry move from Ossining to Rye. <P> Don takes Megan with him to help watch the kids. Don gets all horned up watching Megan in her bikini and takes her back to the hotel room for a bang. <P> Don tells Sally to watch her little brothers. Sally does the best she can but, she is only eleven. <P> Being fairly smart she devotes most of her attention to baby Gene. Bobby sleeps with the fishes. <P> This will do a couple of things. It will deepen the rift between Betty and Don. It will cause Betty to blame Sally for the death of Bobby. Sally will be all screwed up thinking she actually was responsible. And it would mirror to some degree Don's guilt feelings over the death of his half brother. <P> I suspect we may get something akin to the end of the second season of BSG when Baltar put his head down and when he lifted it up it was a year later. Don may put his head down and when he raises it up it might be 1968.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:27 a.m. CST

    It's gonna be a looooooooong 8 months...

    by RosemarysBabyDaddy

    But it'll be worth it if next season is as good as this season's been. Hell, I might miss this talkback more than I miss MAD MEN itself. OK, maybe not. But I will miss reading all of the insight on my favorite show. I just hope the inviso-text is wrong. I'm with InActionMan: GO TEAM DRAPER!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:42 a.m. CST

    Killing anoyne in this episode would be gratuitous

    by lowpassat

    Last season ended with Dons professional and personal life in shambles. Sterling Cooper was gone and his wife had left him. So to see this season end with SCDP in shambles and another tragic event in his home life would really be a dissapointing end to this season since its basically exactly how last season ended. But I havent been overly impressed with this season so that might be exactly what happens. I think ending the season on a more positive note with Don maybe realizing that he needs to take control of his life, getting Sally away form her mother, and FINALLY acting on all this interspective crap we have had to tolerate this season would be a better hook for next season than ending it in another professional and personal crapstorm as last season.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:44 a.m. CST

    They'd be losing a damn good actress....

    by lock67ca

    If they kill Sally. She may be only 10, but Kiernan Shipka is more than holding her own against some of the bigger talent on the show. She's one of the best child actors I've seen. Would be a shame to see her go.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:31 a.m. CST

    If anyone dies

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    My money is on Roger. I just can't see them going with Sally, that would alienate a chunk of the audience, possibly including me.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 12:50 p.m. CST

    Fifth season?

    by YouSunkMyBlankenship

    Weiner spoke on campus on USC this past Monday and both him and one of his producers said they haven't gotten a fifth season pick-up yet. It's pretty much guaranteed, but that's straight from his mouth. Probably playing coy, as always.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 12:54 p.m. CST

    The road trip

    by ShabbyBlue

    With all the speculation that they may nab the Disneyworld account because this episode takes place right around the time it the construction of Disneyworld became public knowledge in the press -- I wonder if the road trip Don takes with his kids is to California to meet with Disney and discuss it. It would explain why he brings the kids along... so they can spend time at Disneyland during the trip. It all seems to fit. I also like the speculation last week that Don's newspaper article denouncing tobacco might have impressed Disney who would want to do business with an ad firm that shows greater morals and family values during that era. Who they do business with reflects back on Disney's own "family friendly" image.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 12:57 p.m. CST

    Fifth season!

    by ShabbyBlue

    YouSunkMyBlankenship -- Surely that can't be true. There was a promotional contest on ebay not long ago for someone to bid money toward charity in exchange for a walk-on role in season 5. They couldn't do that kind of promotion if season 5 hadn't even been approved yet. I thought I had heard elsewhere that Mad Men was already picked up for the next season just a few episodes into THIS season, and that Ebay contest all but confirmed it.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 1:12 p.m. CST

    Damn InActionMan...

    by adml_shake

    Thats a pretty good theory. Now you've got me thinking about it.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 1:52 p.m. CST

    Whining About The Season break Wait? Please.

    by Crow3711

    Weren't any of you lost fans? I waited 9 months, every year, for a show to come back that was basically fucking crack. I love Mad Men, best show on tv, but it's not crack. I don't NEED more mad men. I think I learned a form of patience through watching lost that I never even knew existed. There's no such thing as anxiously awaiting in this dojo. Lost stole that from me. Mad men will be back when it's back, and while I look forward to it, I can wait. Anyone else feel this way? Waiting will never be the same again without lost

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:31 p.m. CST

    On the bright side, Crow3711, Mad Men...

    by OutsideChance

    ...will never cop out by switching the focus of the show to two previously unseen characters and then rush an ending that claims Draper was dead for the entire final season.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:33 p.m. CST

    Blahblahblahblah

    by Crow3711

    It was perfect. I wept like a girl. It was perfect then, perfect now, and it'll still be perfect the day I reach the clearing at the en of the path. I'm not an apologist either. I thought lost ended exactly the way it needed to. Not to mention it was about the journey, not the destination. But the destination broke my heart all the same. Perfect.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:35 p.m. CST

    Death?

    by DustinBones

    I don't see it at all, what am I missing? Sally's survived the death of Grampa Gene, the separation, the divorce, what exactly is this great catalyst that I missed? It's not Mad Men's style. A death (anyones) after everything that has happened is supposed to drive Don to get his life in order? Roger is not the suicidal type, Sally neither, an accident? come one, is this really what anyone thinks Mad Men is about? Nothing, nothing at all, has lead me to even consider the death of any major character this season. I will ask once again, what show are you watching?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:44 p.m. CST

    I really can't imagine

    by Rodie

    Weiner killing Sally off. I've tried ever since the rumors started, but I just can's see how or why he would need to do that. He's said in previous interviews that he doesn't want to do this show without John Slatterly (who himself said a week or two ago that Roger doesn't have the backbone to kill himself), so I doubt Roger is going to off himself. Maybe its Betty, but that's still a little harsh. This has been stated as January Jones' last season, but that doesn't mean she won't guest star once or twice in the future. If anyone is going to die, it'll be Bert Cooper IMO. But that doesn't mean it would have to be suicide. The guy is old, and he just quit his firm. What else does he have to live for?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:54 p.m. CST

    Death?-2

    by DustinBones

    The Daily Beast: What did you hope to achieve with Sally this season? Weiner: That episode where Miss Blankenship dies, there was a story about Sally trying to be the perfect woman for her father. She plays house with him and tries to be his girlfriend and his mom and his wife and his daughter. "I'll be good." She tries to be there for him and define him. She's in a world of major confusion… What is her future going to be? I think people would like to assume that she is going to be some radical hippie or something like that. I have my own theories about how that all comes about and hopefully we'll do more [Mad Men] and I'll explain that. I just love the fact that I'm getting to see her grow up and these are the conflicts in her life... My attempt is to try and create an honest portrayal of the way a child perceives the world and to take those feelings very seriously in the story and not make her a prop that gets thrown around between the parents… [She] finds a way to cope, because her mother will not tolerate it unless she's the perfect girl. She's being punished. That's why they're moving… The therapist tells her, she learned how to deal with this narcissistic mother… The idea was that was a survival skill. Taken from: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-10-16/mad-mens-volatile-season/2/

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 2:56 p.m. CST

    I'm Going With Bobby Personally

    by Crow3711

    Only because the event of Bobbie death would have a huge impact on many characters, but at thr same time have very little effect on the show itself you know? He's important in that he exists, but he's rarely featured and never has a storyline. His death would create lots of drama and really rock dons world, but it creates that without getting rid of a character who really matters to the audience or the tone of the show, such as Roger Sally or Betty.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:02 p.m. CST

    A major character death at season's end...

    by ShabbyBlue

    ...has been rumored since halfway into the season. I'm not sure where it specifically originated from, but it spread fast and possible came from someone with inside knowledge. I don't think it's purely fan speculation.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:08 p.m. CST

    I'm Going With Bobby Personally

    by Crow3711

    Only because the event of Bobbie death would have a huge impact on many characters, but at thr same time have very little effect on the show itself you know? He's important in that he exists, but he's rarely featured and never has a storyline. His death would create lots of drama and really rock dons world, but it creates that without getting rid of a character who really matters to the audience or the tone of the show, such as Roger Sally or Betty.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:11 p.m. CST

    My gut tells me its Henry...

    by OutsideChance

    ...Betty decides to move and then her meal ticket croaks. Betty's now a widow and Don has to deal with her reaction and how it affects the kids and his life.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:20 p.m. CST

    i agree about ms shipka

    by brabon300

    its great to watch a child actress grow, and to also know that if she chooses to continue acting, there will be roles for her beyond her childhood years <P>what i like best, is that her parents only allow her to watch the scenes that she is in...which means she is treated like a normal little girl and is fully grounded<P>this has been a very good season....gonna miss the show

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:27 p.m. CST

    If we rule out Roger and Sally

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    Then I'll go with Faye. She is fully invested in Don and Don is still screwing around and just using her. She's in for a huge letdown.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:28 p.m. CST

    Did Rubicon get picked up for a 2nd season?

    by Goon Bighead

    anyone? Bueller?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Not yet Goon

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    Maybe if there's a second season they can explain how come Kale seemed in on the death of Will's father in law, in an early episode, and yet acts like he's on Will's side later.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:34 p.m. CST

    Yea OutsideChance. Fuck Henry

    by Crow3711

    He can die. Creates drama, audience doesn't miss him. I like the actor, don't like the character. Happy to see him die

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:35 p.m. CST

    If Sally TRIED to Kill HERSELF

    by cymbalta4thedevil

    that would make sense given her current emotional volatility & passive agressive relationship with her mother, and lead to a lot of great dramatic scenes between her & her parents next season.<br /><br />If Sally SUCCEEDED in killing herself, I don't think the show would ever recover from that.<br /><br />The idea of a suicidally depressed pre-teen may be too dark even for MAD MEN.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:36 p.m. CST

    Rubicon. Season Two. I Need.

    by Crow3711

    But it's not going to happen. It's honestly too smart. Were lucky mad men caught the mainstreams eye. Rubicon had no chance. It's too good to exist in the world we live in. Breaks my heart.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:38 p.m. CST

    I like the Bobby theory better

    by ShabbyBlue

    With him accidentally dying (perhaps drowning in a hotel pool) while Sally was in charge of watching him and therefore is partly responsible for his death. I recall seeing some behind the scenes photos of Jon Hamm a few weeks ago strolling around what appeared to be a hotel pool. So maybe they take a roadtrip to California so he can meet with Disney, he brings the kids along so they can visit Disneyland, and during their mini-vacation someone dies in a tragic accident soon after he lands the big Disney account. Everything turns around for the better with SCDP in landing this account and Draper is feeling great until a personal family tragedy ends the episode. Hmmmm..... :)

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 3:59 p.m. CST

    The only reason I see for killing off Sally...

    by lock67ca

    ...would be if they were going to make a big jump in the timeline next season. The only options they would have is to kill her off or replace Kiernan Shipka with an older actress, and I think she's too damn good to replace.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 4:47 p.m. CST

    Are they going to Jump Ahead?

    by cymbalta4thedevil

    Weiner needs to either decide right now how many more seasons he wants to do, or leave himself some leeway in case AMC backs an Armored Car full of money up to his house.<br /><br />Nobody wants to see a MAD MEN set in the 70's. Why jump ahead to '68 if there's no reason to. The show isn't set in Chicago or Detroit for example. Everybody wants to see Sally go to Woodstock for some reason, but Peggy is the more likely candidate to get a wild hair to do that.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:19 p.m. CST

    Aren't they doing at least 2 more seasons?

    by ShabbyBlue

    I think Weiner said in a recent interview that they plan to do just 2 more seasons after this one.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:32 p.m. CST

    Mad Man should cleanup at the emmys!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    Seriously nothing on cable have come close to touching it.<p>I suspect Laura "I went to SHO for an easy award" Linney, Glenn Close, The Closer woman, or Toni "I'm overrated" Collette will beat the women on MM.<p>But MM really deserve any honor it receives next year!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:44 p.m. CST

    Hamm Takes The Emmy Next Year

    by Crow3711

    I'd bet my house on it. Cranston isn't in the running next year, and Hamm, as good as he was in the first three seasons, really took it to a new level this year. The Suitcase...holy ballsack. Give this man an award already. No one comes close.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:54 p.m. CST

    Hamm is deserving is Vincent and the actor who plays Lane!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    Anyone who gets cane-slap like that, deserves some kind of award! LOL<p>And how awesome that we all seem to like a child actor like Sally!<p>The geeks and this site reputation for bashing child-actor are sterotypical. But you see IF one can act, nobody gonna bash them for shitty reasons!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 5:54 p.m. CST

    this must be..

    by celebritydave

    the episode where the whole molestation thing comes out!!!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:01 p.m. CST

    celebritydave

    by adml_shake

    why would your family history be part of the show?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:15 p.m. CST

    jesus, don't kill sally...

    by PotSmokinAlien

    that would be brutal!! she's been the best part of this whole season-- it's been fascinating to watch her character come into her own as much as it's been exciting wondering what she'll get up to in the remaining seasons.....<P>roger dying would seem very fitting to me, what with the way he said bye to joan last episode and the way he handled losing Lucky Strike... but if they want to kill Betty, i sure as shit wouldn't miss her. might actually provide an avenue into an interesting custody thing between Don and Henry, there's always been interesting tension between those two....

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:22 p.m. CST

    why on earth

    by Timahh

    is everyone so convinced that someone is always trying to kill themselves?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:27 p.m. CST

    Adml_Shake, good one!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    @ Timahh.<p>I wonder the same thing. It seems thats one of the things that gets a forum 'talking'.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:37 p.m. CST

    Some folks on some forum claim Weiner said someone would die..

    by FracturedLojak

    .. this season. IIRC, the claim was someone "major". I have never seen that quote except for on forums, so take it with a grain of salt.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:40 p.m. CST

    Timahh

    by ShabbyBlue

    Because weeks ago it was rumored that a major character's death would happen at the end of the season, and this has sparked a lot of speculation on who it could be and how/why they would die.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:40 p.m. CST

    celebritydave

    by lock67ca

    For the hundredth time, Weiner has already said neither Betty or Sally was molested. It's a dead issue. Let it go.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 6:42 p.m. CST

    shabby,

    by Timahh

    interesting enough as that is, it just seems that this talkback always has a predilection towards suicide.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:16 p.m. CST

    Please let it be Betty

    by lock67ca

    Dear God, please.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:27 p.m. CST

    The Whiskey!

    by Hercules

    The Doors were founded in Los Angeles in 1965. <p>Megan's friend gave Dick quite the look!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:28 p.m. CST

    I'm watching with..

    by adml_shake

    Butterflies in my stomach. All this happy fun time with Don and the kids....something bad is going to happen

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:40 p.m. CST

    Anna's niece?

    by DustinBones

    what was that look? waiting to see how he responded? or because she doesn't know he's "Don"?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:43 p.m. CST

    Don Draper, you Mad Man!

    by jocutus

    please tell me this is a dream sequence.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:43 p.m. CST

    Holy Shit!

    by DustinBones

    I love me some Megan too!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:44 p.m. CST

    Wtf

    by adml_shake

    Don?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:45 p.m. CST

    Wait, what?

    by Defrost

    I changed the channel for the commercial and came back to this. What is going on?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:50 p.m. CST

    WHAT?

    by volcanopele2

    Umm, what the? He appears to have lost his mind. Don has officially become Roger. He has no one to blame if she turns out to be bat shit crazy like Betty or Roger's wife.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:50 p.m. CST

    Damn what a great show!

    by DustinBones

    Oh shit! the good Dr.!?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:50 p.m. CST

    Spoiler.....defrost

    by adml_shake

    Don popped the question to Megan, she accepted

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:52 p.m. CST

    Anna's neice knows Dick is Don

    by Hercules

    She called him at SCDP to let him know about Anna's passing.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:54 p.m. CST

    Looks we know who will be dying before the hour is up

    by terry1978

    She did not take that well.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Anna's neice knows Dick is Don ...

    by DustinBones

    That's right, thanks.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:56 p.m. CST

    My theory: Megan is a succubus!

    by Raymar

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 9:59 p.m. CST

    Huh!

    by Hercules

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10 p.m. CST

    And Don lies awake . . .

    by jocutus

    . . . thinking "I've made a HUGE mistake".

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10 p.m. CST

    Well at least Sally or Roger didn't die!

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    But I was pushing for Megan by episode end!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:01 p.m. CST

    No abortion

    by Defrost

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:03 p.m. CST

    weak.

    by ghoulstock

    i love this show. love it to death, one of my favorite shows of all time. and i thought this was definitely the best season yet. but man, this was a really weak episode, especially for a season finale. and am i the only one who can't stand megan? the last fifteen minutes episode felt like some weird dream sequence. i kept expecting don to wake up and say "What the..."

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:04 p.m. CST

    this episode felt a little off

    by mikkoscassadine

    Not only Don's engagement but the whole rhythm of this finale felt weird. I wanted to strangle Betty at the beginning of this ep but damn she looked good at the end standing there in the kitchen.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:04 p.m. CST

    Hmmm

    by volcanopele2

    Not sure how to take this season. We have a new Mrs. Draper, but I'm admit I am a bit concerned that he was seduced by eye candy, like his ex-wife. Don and his kids don't need another bat-shit crazy, narcissistic personality like Betty in their lives. But I will say, Megan's not a succubus. That's Roger's wife.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:05 p.m. CST

    I liked it!

    by DustinBones

    Pretty much along the lines of what I expected from a show like this. Beginnings, endings, babies, business.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:06 p.m. CST

    That was.... odd

    by ShabbyBlue

    No Disneyworld account. No major death. But Don rushes into marriage?! Ugh... He doesn't really know this girl, and she sure as hell doesn't know the whole "Dick Whitman" backstory. It's going to create problems next year. And I hope he doesn't push Peggy aside to make this girl the new copyrighter as they suggested. Also... no big surprise that Joan lied about the abortion. Her hubby thinks it's his, and Roger knows it's his... so that's going to create some drama next year. Especially if Joan's hubby dies during Vietnam. Roger may feel obligated to help take care of the kid. Man.. they are setting up some more heavy drama next year. Wish we didn't have to wait 9 months for the next season. :(

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:06 p.m. CST

    THIS ISSUE: NOBODY DIES

    by Voice O. Reason

    Wow, were we wrong.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:07 p.m. CST

    mikkoscassadine

    by adml_shake

    I still think Betty is really in love with Don. She gets so angry with him because she is still carrying a torch for him. To her, Don represented the perfect life. House, kids, husband bringing home the banking and moving up in the business world. Then, it all came crashing down around her.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:08 p.m. CST

    Joan's baby

    by Voice O. Reason

    Maybe it is her husband's baby. He's a doctor for fuck's sake, its not like he can't count to 9.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:09 p.m. CST

    and

    by adml_shake

    I loved the kid telling Betty to her face, what everyone is thinking about her.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:09 p.m. CST

    CALLED IT!

    by LordEnigma

    This entire season has been about finding someone who fits Don's life and now he has found her. Poor Dr. Miller deserved better but when Don ask you to go the extra mile, go the extra mile damn it!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:10 p.m. CST

    ghoulstock

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    I agree with everything you just said.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:11 p.m. CST

    adml_shake

    by mikkoscassadine

    I completely agree. You could see the disappointment when Don told her he was engaged. Great performance by January Jones in that scene.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:11 p.m. CST

    In defense of Megan...

    by Voice O. Reason

    Maybe I put her on a pedestal because Sally likes her so much, but Megan's not going to be another Betty.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:12 p.m. CST

    There was a death! Don was killed and replaced...

    by HollywoodHellraiser

    by a pod person! Hopefully they can find the real Don and wake him up before its too late!<p>BTW, Marriage=DEATH!<p>Just saying!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Blondie failed that test I guess

    by FrodoFraggins

    What a complete dumbass in picking Megan over Dr. Bosoms. In the end he did fail blondie for not passing the test with kids.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:13 p.m. CST

    like her or not

    by pushabutton

    Meghan really is a better fit than Fay. He has to consider the kids too. His look of befuddlement when the kids spilled the milkshake, and she didn't flip out (like their mother would) was priceless, and probably the moment that he decided to propose.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Hope Dr. Miller doesn't go all Fatal Attraction next season

    by ShabbyBlue

    I was halfway expecting her to kill herself at the end of the episode out of dispair, but I hope she doesn't pop up at some point next season to exact revenge either. Don's new marriage is also going to make Betty even more hateful. She's stuck in a miserable life and marriage, and seeing Don move on with his life and find happyness now is just going to make her even more bitter and cruel to Henry and her kids.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:14 p.m. CST

    love has no fury like a woman who knows you're really Dick Whitm

    by mikkoscassadine

    You gotta believe that dumping Dr.Miller is gonna bite Don in the ass eventually but Weiner rarely goes the cheap and easy route.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:15 p.m. CST

    I'm just glad Sally ain't dead

    by Jubs

    Sally's actress needs an EMMY, stat.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:17 p.m. CST

    Uh oh! Dr. Miller knows Don's secret!

    by ShabbyBlue

    Yeah that's right! Dr. Miller knows his dark secret about going AWOL and changing his identity. Hope she doesn't use it as revenge against him next season.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:18 p.m. CST

    Mikkoscassadine

    by adml_shake

    The first thing that went through my mind when he asked Megan was the good doctor spilling the beans about Don's secret. He hurt her pretty bad, she knows how bad this will end up hurting him.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:19 p.m. CST

    season finale was a whole lotta "eh"

    by rainbowtrout1265

    And please no Glenn next season. Any scene with him is wasted time, imo. I agree with the person who said the whole ep just felt a little off.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:22 p.m. CST

    loved Joan and Peggy's commiserating

    by mikkoscassadine

    almost felt like moss ad-libbed that Bullshit line. It came off so naturally brunt.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:23 p.m. CST

    RE: The collective predictions...

    by Voice O. Reason

    ...you guys suck at them. I'm guessing next season will be completely free of Dr. Miller, a psychotic Megan, Sally becoming a hippie, or anyone being molested.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:25 p.m. CST

    Two reasons why Don made the right decision

    by kjmad25

    1) http://tinyu rl.com/27 k9kcj 2) http://t inyurl.com/27k 9kcj

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:29 p.m. CST

    The marriage won't last

    by ShabbyBlue

    Don basically pulled a "Roger" by rushing into marriage with a hot young secretary. He'll get bored with her fast and go back to his frequently cheating as soon as some other woman flirts with him. Nothing about them felt real or right to me. There's no real chemistry there, and they clearly haven't had long enough to get to know each other.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:30 p.m. CST

    Loved the Lines about Megan

    by cymbalta4thedevil

    Not being able to be an Actress because of her Teeth! Hahahaha

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:37 p.m. CST

    Megan may have just saved Sally Drapers life..

    by mr dark

    That kid now has a chance of just possibly having a normal life...I think Megan will be Dons salvation. She is great with the kids and anyone that says she is not a sexy thing has gotta be half blind. Don has surely managed to piss three women off by this episode and break their hearts.. Betty,Faye,and Peggy all have a reason to wish this man some bad mojo..but Don does appear to have found himself a great match...we'll see next season ...all and all one of the best seasons so far...

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:39 p.m. CST

    All because of Betty...

    by Brostradamus

    Is Don trying to get back at Betty by marrying his secretary? She fires their long-time housekeeper and because of this he has to bring along his secretary..who he decides to marry?! So if Betty hadn't fired Carla, Don would not be engaged. Suck it Betty!

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:42 p.m. CST

    Hmm.

    by res8323

    Anyone else think the Rubicon finale was better?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:45 p.m. CST

    Great season, weak finale

    by Chewbacca_Khan

    Actually sort of the mirror of last season with some very weak episodes but an awesome finale.<p><p> I kept waiting for everyone to wake up...

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:54 p.m. CST

    Yeah, this finale was fairly bland and anti-climactic

    by ShabbyBlue

    Last season's finale was so much better, with the brilliant coup to get out of their contracts and start up their own firm. I was fairly disappointed with how events unfolded in this season finale after a great run of episodes that came before it.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 10:57 p.m. CST

    Chewbacca_Khan very observsnt...the tables have been turned..

    by mr dark

    exactly the mirror of last season as far as the Don/Betty relationship world goes...I am glad nobody bit the dust for the finale as I've really liked the entire cast left aboard..I will miss Bert Cooper if he is indeed gone.. saying that I will wait impatiently for next season..

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:09 p.m. CST

    I didn't hate it

    by InActionMan

    but Weiner cannot be happy with Hamm. This was spoiled a month ago when Hamm put those pool side pics up on his web site. I think that's why people are disappointed. <P> This episode seems to infuriate women more. Which may be the point. Peggy and Joan were very displeased.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:15 p.m. CST

    Really think Don is Zellwegger in Jerry Maguire

    by Lionel_Richies_Hipster_Frames

    He's marrying a woman for how she is with his kids. I understand she's hot and he likes fucking her, but I also think the reason he slipped the not yet cold engagement ring on Megan's finger was the moments he witnessed of her and his children. At the end of the day, he's going to wake up and realize marrying someone because they love his kids wasn't the smartest thing to do. I doubt Weiner is going to let Don be happy and faithful with Megan as his wife. I also wouldn't be shocked if he had an affair with Betty while they are both married to other people. There was chemistry between them tonight and I felt before he told Betty he was engaged she was about to open the door for him again. He knew that, so he shut her down with his news. I also do think that Megan will cause Betty to be go over the edge as a hateful person when she sees her children prefer their stepmother and love her. Next season will be something special.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:17 p.m. CST

    Nice! I called the Megan/Marriage 3 episodes ago!

    by Rebel Scumb

    I knew from episode 2 they were going to do something big with Megan, they were name dropping her in every early episode this season even when she wasn't relevant.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:21 p.m. CST

    Namedropping Megan

    by ShabbyBlue

    And yet Roger was like "Who?". I laughed so hard at his initial reaction. :)

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:28 p.m. CST

    Speculation Aboutnds...

    by KDog629

    ...that that was maybe the lamest use of invisotext in the history of this site. Speculation that Sally would be dying did NOT "abound." Mike Ausiello from EW pulled the idea out of his ass and talked about it in a podcast. Everybody else on the EW panel thought it was ludicrous. Is Ausiello's unfounded guessing now considered spoilerific?

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:29 p.m. CST

    Er...abounds

    by KDog629

    Yes, I do know how to spell it.

  • Oct. 17, 2010, 11:42 p.m. CST

    This season is a transitory one...

    by LordEnigma

    and you need to get Don married and have Peggy set up an account all on her own to set up drama for next year. Again, I may be in the minority here, but I like when Don is happy. It's a better show and Dr. Miller will probably fuck him over next year, but Dick Whitman will be free. HE WILL BE FREE!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:10 a.m. CST

    Next season: Custody battle blowout

    by BurnHollywood

    Hope you liked that quiet scene between Betty and Don, because that's the last time those two are ever going to be on good terms...<p> Betty's heading for a nervous breakdown, and Sally's going to get chewed up like hamburger in their crossfire.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:27 a.m. CST

    Worst episode ever

    by ndally

    Jesus. How can you even compare that with last years finale or "the suitcase". Did Weiner make his directorial debut tonight? What a weak episode. I've always hated when people call this a soap operabut with dr.miller I thought we would see an end to dons womanizing ways. Weak. Weak. Weak. I don't even know what to say about that episode. Did that feel like a finale to anyone or just filler? Fuck..this marriage BS was a big fucking mistake. Big mistake. Melo drama and it pains to label it as such. This season was so great with the Honda episode and "the suitcase" fuck I hope Weiners hitting his head off a wall right now. I can't believe what I just watched

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:33 a.m. CST

    Best Talk back

    by cleaningwindows

    Everyone talking about a soap opera. Hope you liked that quiet scene between Betty and Don, because that's the last time those two are ever going to be on good terms... Betty's heading for a nervous breakdown, and Sally's going to get chewed up like hamburger in their crossfire. oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:39 a.m. CST

    My two cents...

    by TopHat

    ...This whole season was about second chances. All of the characters had a second chance to re-do their lives. The most obvious example of this was the new firm. But, by the end of the season finale, they all went back to the same routines; Betty had the opportunity to be with a man who didn't lie to her and genuinely cared for her, but, by the end she obviously wanted to be with Don again, even if it was just for a night. Joan was married and free of Roger and had her own office, but, by the end she was still wheeling the mail cart and apparently has Roger's baby. Don had the chance to be with someone who knew who he really was, but, by the end went right back to his imaginary life as "Don" symbolized by him giving Megan the real Don's ring. Pete was on his way of breaking free of riding other people's coat tails, but, in the end Don had to bail him out finacially and he gets the blame for Don's mistake. They all had numerous chances to do the things that they've all supposedly been yearning to do since the first season, but, in the end, they're right back where they started from. Peggy is the only one who has moved forward and accomplished the things she's wanted; Gotten Don's respect, her own account by herself, and also has gotten involved in a relationship (and even got to talk with Joan like "one of the girls"). Don't you see? The reason why all the episodes up until now felt great and the finale feels anticlimatic is because through the whole season they all had the chance to do something new and exciting (the same way last season's finale felt), but, they didn't. They all fell back into the same routines. That's why the last shot was of the window... just like the last shot of the first episode of the first season.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:56 a.m. CST

    Questions this show is about.

    by Jayemel

    Will Meghan become Betty? Will Don become Roger? Will Peggy become Joan? These are the questions this show is about. <p> Remember The Carousel, the end of season one? This show is about the cycle we live in as Americans and how to break it. The key line in this episode belonged to Henry Francis, saying you can't escape the past, it's always there. Not-so-coincidentally, this entire series has been all about Don coming to terms with who he is. In this season, the middle season in a series of six seasons, Don finally started to tell people who he is, most notably his children. THAT was what the big pause and look from Anna's niece was about. <p> Tomorrowland was a coy play on setting up the players for next season. What were Don's meetings in CA? What will happen with Joan, her and Roger's baby, and her husband in Vietnam? What will happen with Peggy's account? Was Peter's glib line to "are you two getting married" to Peggy and Ken a toss away or foreshadowing? What about the scene where Joan and Peggy bitched in Joan's office? <p> A clear parallel between Joan and Peggy was drawn and from it we can trace the path of the next two seasons. Don's marriage with Meghan fails, as he is not as much himself as he thinks he is (like Betty, she will find out about Dick Whitman and flip out). Ken and Peggy will have a relationship. Joan's husband will die in Vietnam. Roger will eventually commit suicide. And the ultimate question is if Don will follow Roger down that path or realize he loves Peggy and she loves him.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:01 a.m. CST

    Top Hat

    by Jayemel

    You saw the circle too! <p> I agree it's there, but the series isn't over yet. Now we get to see if they realize they're doing the same things.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:02 a.m. CST

    Just finished watching. I'm bummed, but its because that kinda

    by Spaderific

    Seriously, the finale is over and I'm like......so what?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:03 a.m. CST

    cut off my my subject line: that kinda sucked.

    by Spaderific

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:42 a.m. CST

    Loved the finale!

    by Thrillhouse77

    Guess I'm in the minority for loving how "business as usual" it was?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:50 a.m. CST

    I am so split...

    by KGB3317

    on this episode. It felt like I missed 10-15min when Meghan (however you f'ing spell it) woke up in Don's New york apartment. SALLY LIVES!!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:58 a.m. CST

    cleaningwindows

    by BurnHollywood

    This show's a bit like jazz...if I have to explain why it works, you'll never get it. And if you still think it's a "soap opera" at this point, you're really off its map...<p> Go back to your comic books.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:59 a.m. CST

    Venture Brothers tonight was way better

    by Spaderific

    than the Mad Men season finale. Would be nice to have a talkback to discuss the finer points of VB. Just sayin!!!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:11 a.m. CST

    Thrillhouse77

    by BurnHollywood

    Actually, it felt like the "finale" was last week, with Draper's mea culpa, Cooper's exit and the firm's reconfiguration.<p> It seems like things ended on a happy, upbeat note, but consider that title ("Tomorrowland"...Disney's impossibly rosy future) and consider the upheaval of the late 60s. Stormy seas ahead.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:15 a.m. CST

    Even going in without expectations

    by The McPoyle Clan

    based on a stupid rumor (death) or of last season's extravagant finale, this one felt a bit subdued, or a little flat. There were a few zingers from Cosgrove and Joan's hubby (imagine her, hormone enhanced). I had a feeling when Stefanie gave Don Anna's ring, it would be put to use, if not quite that soon, but I won't object to more Megan next season.<p><p>While sitting in a very dull courtroom last week on jury duty, all I could think about was how much the judge resembled Thruxton Spangler, even though he didn't have the same great voice. It's not such a great surprise to see that the Rubicon finale maintained the measured narrative pace the show has had all season, but AMC should damn well greenlight another season to allow the story to continue.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:23 a.m. CST

    And, AMC should spread the wealth

    by The McPoyle Clan

    if the zombie show turns out to be good, that will make four. 4x13=52, which would give us quality TV every week to look forward to if they run each one separately.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:24 a.m. CST

    my favorite season

    by BlackJackBauer2

    and interesting finale, to say the least. <p> Ive said it before and Ill say it again: DON IS A GOT DAMN AIRHEAD! That shit has been getting worse and worse, but recently its just been sloppy writing mistaken as "impulse". ahahah what a fucking goof ball. <p> I was on edge this entire episode because i read a rumor that a major character was gonna die. i was thinking betty's husband, which would have stopped the move, or maybe sally in the pool, and then at the end maybe faye would commit suicide. but nope, no one died. so i was left feeling WTF <p> Don's "Fuck it Im goin deep" attitude in order to be happy seems to be the first sense of this guy finally becoming himself. He has been searching a while. While its no where near realistic, its still liberating. The contrast with Betty is striking. It is also very classic: The divorced man who goes on with his life and is happy when he remarries, the divorced woman who is bitter and spends the rest of her life seeing her ex in every man's face, while also pushing away any friend she might have had. Speaking of which, Carla was gonna WHOOP HER FUCKING ASS! I wish, wish, wish we coulda seen that fight. Carla needed at minimum a speech telling Betty off. More than "someone has to raise those kids". She earned it, I thought. <p> Also loved Joan and Peggy being PISSED, rightfully so. When Don said "she reminds me of you" I was like what a fucking idiot, he doesnt even realize what a douche he is being. Dude is just dumb as fuck one moment, and perceptive as fuck the next. Don flows where ever the wind goes. <p> Now, the next LOGICAL step for how he has been acting would be to get an entirely different profession, but we know thats not gonna happen....so where does next season pick up? I have absolutely NO idea. <p> I REALLY hope they deal with civil rights next year. I dont expect it at all, but fuck man, they have done everything else. Lets see a black copywriter and hear his take on things. <p> Also Faye may go crazy and fuck shit up for him if they bring her back. Remember, she knows his secret. She can hate on him if she wishes.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:25 a.m. CST

    Ausiello is a huge moron

    by Dixie_Twins

    How anybody still pays any mind to his ramblings is a mystery to me.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:29 a.m. CST

    Oh yea ALSO

    by BlackJackBauer2

    Did anyone catch that Don and his fam had breakfast in the same restaurant from Pulp Fiction? I had to laugh at that one, just remembering the scene. <p> "BE COOL HONEY BUNNY! TELL THIS BITCH TO BE COOL!"

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:56 a.m. CST

    does this mean the actress who plays Faye

    by Buck Swoop

    will now be available to reprise her role as Artie Lange's g/f in Beer League 2?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:59 a.m. CST

    Erroneous spoiler affected my watching of the episode

    by Greggers

    and kinda ruined it. <p> I take FULL RESPONSIBILITY for this. It's not like the link from the front page isn't clearly labeled with a spoiler tag. And even though I avoided the inviso-text, it's to be expected that the spoiler would be discussed in the talkback. <p> The problem is that internet discussion has become an almost integral part of the Quality Television Viewing Experience for me. I'm eager to talk/read about it before the show airs, eager to talk/read about it after the show airs. I like the mental engagement. And in all this eagerness it's easy to get careless. Up to now, I've been okay -- there's only been speculation around AICN for this show. But something actually labelled as a "spoiler" seems to carry a little more weight. <p> And so, because I read a spoiler that someone was going to die in the episode -- maybe a kid -- I carried *dread* around with throughout the episode. I saw portents where there were none. To a large degree, I missed the experience that the creators wanted me to have for the episode; the one I probably otherwise would have if I hadn't clicked on this article. <p> The fact that it was a bad spoiler makes things worse: at least if it had been true, the tension I felt while watching the episode might have matched with something creators really were trying to convey. <p> So, I blew it. <p> Next season, no talkbacks.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 3:50 a.m. CST

    BlackJackBauer2

    by brabon300

    that diner is used over and over again....come to los angeles and ill take you there<p>its one of the few 50s style diners left in the area

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 3:53 a.m. CST

    Brabon300

    by YouSunkMyBlankenship

    What diner is it? Was it Bob's in Burbank?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 3:53 a.m. CST

    mikkoscassadine

    by brabon300

    i think it was meant to be off<p>i think the entire last third was meant to knock the audience for a loop<p>we have spent an entire season watching don come to terms with himself...and boom....it was all, to paraphrase peggy.... bullshit

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:02 a.m. CST

    Rubicon and Mad Men

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    Mad Men had a terrific start to the season, the first half dozen episodes were excellent but then it started to falter, around the time they had that silly episode with Don narrating like he was a film noir detective. Rubicon started off pretty shaky and I wasn't sure that I even liked it, but it got better and better and became an excellent show. In the finales they finally crossed paths, with Rubicon's being much better.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:33 a.m. CST

    fuck rubicon

    by brabon300

    watched 5 minutes, got bored

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:40 a.m. CST

    So glad Faye's prediction came to fruitition...

    by DanielKurland

    She totally said Don would be married within the year. I thought this was a fantastic finale though, and just those small scenes like Meaghan NOT exploding at Sally when she spilled her milkshake were great. Also enjoyed Pete's surprise to the engagement, since he saw Don and Faye together earlier. And good for Peggy.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:45 a.m. CST

    And, yeah, it's great that...

    by DanielKurland

    it's Betty's fault that Don got married.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:57 a.m. CST

    I thought Rubicon and Mad Men were both good

    by American Mythos

    I'll admit, I haven't watched Mad Men in seasons past, but I've found myself sticking around after Rubicon and watching MM this season. I think I'll order the previous season blu-rays and catch up before season 5. After reading all the speculation of Sally killing herself, I was holding my breath the entire time (especially since the California hotel had a balcony) and was actually glad when the episode ended without a death. <br> <br> But Rubicon had a very strong finale. I like how season 1 showed the first stage of the conspiracy unfolding, culminating in the *SPOILERS* sinking of the oil tanker--an act of economic terrorism, which was a nice twist from run of the mill angles on shows like 24. Now it's apparent the next stage will be about pinning the attack on Iran, and Will and Miles trying to expose Spangler before he can march the U.S. to war with another country. Spangler is so slick that, even though his friends let him know it's time for him to off himself, I think he'll turn the tables on them. Truxton Spangler has really become my favorite TV villian. Here's hoping for a season 2 for Rubicon. Actually, if AMC has mercy and gives Rubicon a season 2, I think this show could be wrapped up nicely in just two seasons. <br> <br> And for people who bitch about one show or the other, it's really pathetic. I saw this with the lame ass Mad Men vs. Breaking Bad arguments people would get into on the TalkBacks, now we're seeing Rubicon put down every time it's mentioned. Can't we just agree that AMC is a very good network with the best shows on television, or will we engage in the same petty, retarded fucking arguments when The Walking Dead premieres? <br> <br> And if you don't like a show (this goes to Mad Men and Rubicon haters), just say "Eh, it's not my thing," don't make yourself look like a pathetic jackass with stupid comparisons and insults. Like I said, be glad AMC has such a compelling line-up.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:59 a.m. CST

    I guess Don's accountant got him thinking...

    by MrEkoLetMeLive

    "Don't you want to come home one day to see a steak on the table?" Guess so! I loved the look on Don's face when his new fiancee told him his future mother-in-law spoke French. I think it was his first clue that he'd perhaps acted hastily. Isn't Dr. Miller's dad a gangster? I hope Don doesn't end up wearing cement shoes.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:12 a.m. CST

    Meh... But understandable

    by Kitkatatl

    Don is so much more fun when he's married -- his juggling skills are amazing. I was disappointed when Betty got married over the break -- it was too easy -- so now the show gets to start off running next season with Don married, the company doing better and the Vietnam War coming to a head. It should be a great season. As for Joan's baby, I'm sure she fudged the numbers a bit to make the math work for her husband. After all, they didn't have the ability to determine due dates back then with any accuracy so the baby will just be a month "early". I totally see hubby dying in the war anyway, so it really won't matter. They never flushed out his character on purpose. I also think we'll see positive things from Betty. The super-bitch thing has gotten tiresome so it'll be time to switch that up a bit -- perhaps have her be the other woman in Don's life for a change like another poster (above) suggested. All in all a lackluster finale, but it set the stage well for lots of plot twists and drama next season.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:47 a.m. CST

    Greggers...

    by Rex Carsalot

    It's a show. If you feel that kind of dread for a television show, either stop watching tv or start watching things with actual dread. Did you know we're at war? There. There's some real dread for you.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:58 a.m. CST

    Rubicon Finale

    by joee60

    Rubicon was great, but something went wrong with my DVR, and I missed the ending! What happened after the scene on the rooftop once Will found the four-leaf clover?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 6:33 a.m. CST

    joee60

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    Nothing. That was the end. Deliberately ambiguous to give them something to work with if there's a season 2

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 8:06 a.m. CST

    ThrowMeTheIdol

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    Don wasn't narrating that episode, they just used voiceover to let the audience access what he was writing in his journal. Big difference, imo

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 8:14 a.m. CST

    Anyway

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    I did not have any spoilers rolling around in my head, went into the episode free and clear. <p>I thought it was very good, not one of the best of the season, but still a lot of good stuff. Everything about Betty was excellent. They do such a good job with very little, showing her to be incredibly flawed but then somehow eliciting sympathy (at least from me) in the end. Just that shot of her lying down in Sally's bed ... And of course the ending. I think what we're seeing is she bit off more than she can chew with Henry Francis. And he credited her with more than she actually has going for her. She's not ready to be that person, probably never will be - and by that person I mean nearer to an equal with her husband. Because she's such a child, an authoritative asshole like Don makes her more comfortable. <p>I get the sense also that her breakup with Don was basically a hissy fit, a childish tantrum, and now that she's kind of settled down she regrets it. Don revealing he's engaged showed her it's not a game.<p>I'm not sure what to make of the impending marriage to Megan. I'm not thrilled by it but Im keeping an open mind. Faye Miller sure got burned though. Wow.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 8:42 a.m. CST

    Thunderbolt

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    Yes you're right, I used the word narrating wrong. I know what he was doing and it still sucked. For me anyway, obviously many viewers liked it.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 8:52 a.m. CST

    Henry Francis is awesome.

    by HoboCode

    I love how he doesn't put up with Betty's childish bullshit. I'm sure she fucks the frustration out of him every night, but at least he speaks his mind to her when she acts like a bitch.<p> And Glen is a PIMP. So wise beyond his years. Him also telling Betty off KICKED ASS.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 9:10 a.m. CST

    Betty was really pathetic this season.

    by HoboCode

    All of her childish bullshit culminating in her trying to get Don back only for him to tell her he he was engaged to another woman? Painfully pathetic.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 9:13 a.m. CST

    I tried, but checked out this season.

    by fiester

    I just don't give a lick about Don Draper and what hot broad he'll be fucking next anymore.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 9:33 a.m. CST

    fiester

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    Whew! Thanks for letting us know. Everyone who watches the show was waiting on pins and needles to find out if you would like it or not. We were worried you wouldn't give your verdict till after the season, when it was too late! Luckily you posted in the finale TB in the nick of time. Discussing the finale without your contribution would have been excruciating. <p>A note will be made in the ledger, and I think everyone will breathe easier knowing where you stand.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 9:40 a.m. CST

    Don/Dick will never find the right woman

    by Darth_Nader

    That is basically what this is all about. He is two separate people. Don is the businessman. He wants a relationship with a professional (Dr. Hooters), but Dick is the guy craving for a family. I though it was amazing how when Sally spilled the milkshake all of the 'Drapers' were expecting a Betty meltdown, but instead got a gentle "It's ok." Don looked as stunned as the kids. The problem is that Don doesn't have custody of the kids. It's obvious Meghan doesn't fit in his business world now ("get us some ice honey. just kidding." AWESOME!). Two other things, holy crap is Betty a spoiled bitch. She needed a strong personality like Don to keep her in check. And, of course I could sign out without "Yes, they're bigger." *swoon*

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 9:48 a.m. CST

    I'm worried

    by bee152

    What i liked about last season is that it went in a different direction. Am I the only one worried that they will start going into territory we've already been in. What about the "SOAP" factor? Are they taking that slippery slope with Joanie keeping the baby, Don marrying his secretary and Betty being one dimensional the whole season. Betty was totally a psycho muff cabbage the whole season. I felt like she was there just to be an antogonist. WHat i like about the show is that characters will do something dispicable but later we learn why and often will do something to redeem themselves which makes us like them. This never happened with Betty this season. Also I was very impressed with the brief relationship between Ken and Peggy. At the client meeting Ken threw out an idea earning a look from Peggy that put him in his place. NOt only is she asserting herself as an equal to these men she is asserting her superiority. YEt she still can't let go of those old nagging notions that women are supposed to be married and pregnant, i.e. getting upset over Don's engagement. ANd finally while Don, though happy, is back stepping down the same road he's been and previously traveled by Roger, Peggy is seems to be the only one moving forward and progressing. Is Don just a step for Peggy? And last but not least I do not think the show will ever go deep into the hippy culture of the late sixties. It doesn't suit the characters, even Peggy, who are all about business and ego. My 2 cents.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:17 a.m. CST

    Peggy and Ken...

    by DanielKurland

    I too loved that he gave her proper respect. He backed off in the meeting, when he saw he wasn't helping, and he totally shyed away from the credit and properly thanked Peggy for the sale, at the offices.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:27 a.m. CST

    Jesus christ some of you guys are neurotic

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    Who the fuck cares if something on the show might be considered to be "soapy" by ... somebody. Fuck's sake, what difference does it make? If you watch the show, and you have any brain rattling around in your skull, the very idea that it's at all like a soap opera is laughable. Have any of you people ever SEEN an actual soap opera?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:30 a.m. CST

    People who think this finale was a dud are simply wrong.

    by HoboCode

    It was full of great moments that all make perfect sense in the spirit of the show. Don, when forced to confront his past, intitially flirted with self-reflection, but in the end he retreated back to his comfort area of masquerading as a hero, rather than living a life as an actual person. Megan represents that desire for him to continue the facade to which he has grown accustom. <p> I think next season Don will end up fast-tracking Megan up the corporate ladder in order to perpetuate his delusions that she has Peggy's "spark" when in actuality Megan is just another nanny/whore telling Don exactly what he wants to hear and absolving him from actually taking responsibility for his past and present.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:33 a.m. CST

    New predictions!

    by Jubs

    Since Weiner and co. seem to do the complete opposite - or simply not act upon - the predictions made by us, here's what I think is going to happen for next season and beyond. Roger doesn't commit suicide. Don makes his marriage work and never cheats on Megan. Sally grows up to be completely normal, not the teenage rebellion hippie we think she's going to be. Joan's husband comes back safely from Vietnam. Betty gets through her immaturity and insecurity and makes peace w/ herself. Dr. Faye won't get revenge on Don. SCDP survives. Sal never comes back. Ken and Peggy don't hook up. There, I think that covers it.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:37 a.m. CST

    t

    by HoboCode

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:45 a.m. CST

    MEGAN...

    by Weasel

    ...is a real keeper. There's a sincerity and kindness that Ms. Pare brings to the the character that makes her seem different from the cold, mean, brittle women that inhabit the Mad Men universe. God, I hope Draper doesn't mess this up, but in spite of his inner longings and good intentions, I really don't think that the man is capable of sexual fidelity. Even the attempt at such would drive him utterly mad. Still, as I've stated in previous MM talkbacks, I'm hoping that the Megan character endures through the remaining seasons of the show and ends up being the woman to finally humanize the hollow-at-the-core Draper. For reasons that escape me, I'm actually hoping that he ends up having a kid with her - lucky boy or girl to end up with such an incredible Mom!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:46 a.m. CST

    This show is also a brilliant endictment of capitalism.

    by HoboCode

    The central thesis of this show is that this society and culture, and ours for that matter, suffers from the lurking feeling that nothing is ever good enough. The more people have, the more they desire, and thus become dissatisfied wit their lives. And rather than take comfort in what they have or confront their realities, they constantly wish for a magic bullet that will change themselves or their lives.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:48 a.m. CST

    Rex Carsalot

    by Greggers

    So if I talk about how I found a movie exciting, I really shouldn't because of that time I got mugged? Bullshit. Emotional reaction to art is legitimate, and it's why we have art in the first place. Furthermore, there a sense of *degree* implied when we talk about these kinds of things, and we should have to preface every comment along the lines of "I know that people are starving in Sudan right now, but I found Debra Winger's death in TERMS OF ENDEARMENT very moving."

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:49 a.m. CST

    next season...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...I don't think it'll tread on too much previously covered ground. Making Meghan into a new childish, vapid trophy wife would be the boring route, and Weiner rarely goes with anything so obvious. It's far more likely that Meghan will actually turn out to be a GREAT wife and great for Sally, but Don will fuck it up with further womanizing. I think it would be interesting for Meghan to stand up to Don the way Henry keeps calling bullshit on Betty.<BR> <BR> And Joan can fudge the numbers all she wants, but when her baby is born with a shock of snow white hair, the secret will be out!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:51 a.m. CST

    Hobocode, re: MAD MEN and capitalism

    by Greggers

    I agree, and in fact if you look back to talkbacks from the first season, you'll read posts from a young poster named Greggers that made the same observation.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:59 a.m. CST

    I think this episode is very meta

    by InActionMan

    Take a visit over to Television Without Pity which has a lot more ladies than we do here. The majority of the women are beside themselves with hatred for this episode. <P> The bile directed at Megan borders on disturbing. If men were saying these things we would be accused of being the worst misogynists ever. <P> I think the women who watch this show think that Don should pick them or their imagined surrogate Peggy. Christ don't burden poor Peggy with fucking Don as a lover. Peggy should polish her resume and get a job a BBDO or something. Run Peggy Run. <P> I think Weiner may be pointing a finger at the ladies in the audience who will give a pass to a good looking man no matter how despicably he acts. Your not supposed to like Don. He really is a "Dick" but, hey he's handsome so he gets a pass. Some have accused Don of being a sociopath. I don't think that's true but, he is deeply fucked up. At best he could be described as being extremely careless with other people's lives. <P> Peggy will probably have to deal with Don trying to shoehorn Megan into creative next year and he will champion some really shitty ideas of Megan's. Ain't nepotism great.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:02 a.m. CST

    GROUNDHOG DAY

    by Greggers

    In the last scene of the episode, when Don lies awake in bed in the early morning while "I Got You" is playing, I couldn't help but think of GROUNDHOG DAY, and how Don's hasty engagement to Megan and his rush to love with a beautiful woman was him going through his experience with Betty all over again. I don't think Weiner and co. would be that meta, but the thought crossed my mind.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:04 a.m. CST

    Will Megan even be in the next season?

    by photoboy

    Knowing how they like to surprise us, I could easily see the show skipping ahead another year and for her to already be gone for some reason or other.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:08 a.m. CST

    InActionMan

    by HoboCode

    Those women probably wish Don had chosen Faye, who unlike Megan, was an equal that would have genuinely helped Don to deal with his present realities by confronting his past. Megan only represents a regression in Don's growth as a person who takes responsibility for his life.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:17 a.m. CST

    Not sure what to think

    by BizarroJerry

    I've gotten so into this series that while I think the engagement to Megan is ridiculous, I also don't want more heartbreak and bad things happening to these people. I start to dislike a show whose theme is "no one can be happy." Everyone shocked at Megan not losing it in the diner was great. Don and the kids on the exact same page. The kids did deserve a little yelling-at though, didn't they?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:17 a.m. CST

    HoboCode...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...I think that could make a great dynamic for next year. She's absolutely the wrong choice for him as far as his personal growth goes. But she'll be a great, amicable wife who is great with his kids and is supportive in every other way. I like the idea of the charming and upbeat Megan being run through the grinder of hollow faux-love, which is all Don will ever be able to offer her.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:19 a.m. CST

    Hate for Megan

    by BizarroJerry

    I guess I could see that. After all, isn't one of the most anger-inducing things for women a guy getting divorced and marrying some hot, cute little thing much younger than them? Actually, I would probably have to admit I feel the same way. Roger was sort of shown as being a jerk and an idiot for doing basically the same thing. Will this show "allow" Don to be happy in a similar situation?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:24 a.m. CST

    Ken

    by BizarroJerry

    Forgot to add that I think this episode shows us that Ken Cosgrove is quite possibly the only sane person on the show. He says outright his whole life is not this job, and gets confused looks from the other three people who couldn't live without theirs. Notice his really biting insult, "I'm not Pete." In other words, I don't want to exploit my in-laws like him. And naturally, Pete turns this around into an insult at Ken's expense. And Ken didn't even seem to care what his bosses think. Maybe a bad career move, but he doesn't want to be them.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:24 a.m. CST

    Megan will be a great mother

    by Rodie

    to Betty's kids, every few weeks or whatever weekends Don has them, but what about the rest of the time? I think Megan telling Don that she has ambition to "do what you do or what Miss Olsen does," speaks a lot about her character. She's been to college, she's level-headed, organized and multilingual. Megan seems like she's going places whether its with SCDP or another company, I think her career will take off in some way next year. If it's at SCDP, I'm guessing she becomes a writer or works with Harry in the TV department in some way. If it's outside of SCDP I bet her focus on career and success causes tension between her and Don. I don't think they'll have a kid next year, too soon.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:24 a.m. CST

    My only complaint was the transistion...

    by coconutgroves

    From LA back to NY. That was too fast a cut between locales. I think Don is acting glib in response to "moving on" and accepting the truth about his life. I can't see the torment going away and think that Meghan will just be a new problem, not a solution. And the killing Sally comment? Please, as someone else pointed out, she is there to show the parental affect on that generation. Plus, she is a great young actress.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:33 a.m. CST

    mixed feelings on this ep

    by deelzbub

    it was great anyway. I was thinking that all that with the ring was a dream and Don would wake up in a lounge chair with one of his kids floating facefirst down in the pool

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:37 a.m. CST

    Megan is calm and beautiful

    by deelzbub

    and wonderful with his children. And really passes the test (speaking as a man with two small kids). If he's making a mistake, it is he's rushing it. But, that is a mistake he can live with.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:46 a.m. CST

    She's teaching them french, for fuck's sake!

    by deelzbub

    SOLD!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:49 a.m. CST

    Still the best made show on TV

    by veritasses

    By far. Not that there aren't a few small, minor things that might be nit-picked but damn it, this is good.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:52 a.m. CST

    If I had a french teacher like Megan

    by lock67ca

    I would have paid more attention in french class, and actually learned some.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:56 a.m. CST

    Faye vs Megan

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    Faye knows Don's really Dick. Megan doesn't and that is pretty much case closed. <p>It's no coincidence that the last Don saw of Faye, she was urging him to make peace with his double life. Then he quite tellingly tells Megan he feels like himself around her. Meaning, in his case, he feels like the person he's created, Don Draper. Faye more or less became a threat to the existence of "Don Draper". Remember he also tore out and threw away all his journal pages where he seemed to be working towards something, perhaps a resolution of the tension between his two identities. The crisis caused by losing Lucky Strike seems to have sent him scrurrying back into his hole - away from Dick Whitman and back to Don Draper.<p> I think it's clear at this point that if he does have a "good heart", that is more or less his Dick Whitman self. Don Draper is unethical, ambitious; somewhat of a loose cannon.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:56 a.m. CST

    They're not married yet...

    by Lionel_Richies_Hipster_Frames

    ...don't be so sure that the next season shows them as a married couple. That would be the ultimate Weiner psych out to have all the fans imagining what happens when they are married only to open the next season with Megan out of the picture completely. While I do think that Betty's character has turned into a monster, I don't think Weiner is going to lighten upon her. She's his punching bag and he's going to lead her deep into the abyss. I just won't be surprised if she has an affair with Don. The fact that she was ready to fuck him last night before he told her he was engaged set up the fact that she wants more Dick in her life. Pun intended. That's a development that I don't think we should ignore for the next season. Still I do think keeping Megan in the show is probably what they should do as that will torment Betty and create great drama with the kids since they will obviously prefer her to Betty. Last night and this season we all saw how Don is with the kids independent of Betty. If they had to choose who to be with, it would be with their Father...now that he's marrying Maria Von Trap, it's only going to make Betty's descent deeper. I did love that Betty thought he was marrying Bethany Van blowjob. The fact that Betty remembered her name means she's been obsessing over her for quite some time. She wants back what she gave up. I expect a moment between them later in the series where she articulates that to Don.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:19 p.m. CST

    Why are you so sure Dons' "meetings" had anything to do with wor

    by lowpassat

    No one in the office mentions the meetings, no one says "Hey break a leg, we really need this!" Don's not going into it with a great amount of fear that the future of SCDP is on his shoulders, so I dont think they were about work at all. He has to go back to California to deal with the house and makes up the "vacation" excuse to hide it from the people in New York. There are no Disney talks. Maybe, just maybe his meetings were about legally resolving the Dick/Don issue. This brings me to another point on Dick/Don, in the words of Bert Cooper "Who cares!" No one that he has told has really cared, and dont say that Betty left him over it. Her finding out was simply the out she had been looking and waiting for. Bert Cooper didnt care, Faye didnt care, and personally Pete doesnt car. He is concerned that this secret can ruin his career, outside of work he could care less "I dont have to live with your shit over my head!" Will megan be great with the kids? Yes. Will the kids perfer her to Betty? Yes. Will Don take the kids to live with him? No. Will Megan quit working to be their new Mom? No, she has shown atleast a bit of ambition.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:21 p.m. CST

    I'd marry Megan with just as much information...

    by blackmantis

    Hot...sweet...seemingly free of emotional baggage. And sane. Those things are rare to find all in one package.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:25 p.m. CST

    Forgot to add, Faye doesnt "know" anything really

    by lowpassat

    I'm pretty sure Don was vague in what he told her. So heres what she "knows". Don was injured in Korea, somenow (Don nener says he intenionally" swapped the dog tags just that he wanted it to happen) his identy was swapped. I dont think he even told her I'm Dick Whitman, just the first name. So what does she have really and what is she gonna say? Don told her that his realy name is Dick Something and that he was injured in Korea! She is no real threat.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:27 p.m. CST

    And will Don stop cheating on his wife once he's married

    by lock67ca

    No. Assuming he does actually marry Megan. I don't see him telling her the truth about who he really is either. After making progress, in coming to terms with who he really is, he's thrown it all away on an impulsive decision to marry his hot secretary.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:30 p.m. CST

    Quick interview with Weiner about last night's episode

    by Greggers

    http://tiny.cc/2p8tu

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:33 p.m. CST

    blackmantis...

    by BizarroJerry

    I admit that it's terribly cynical of me, but when I see someone so happy and pleasant and comfortable with herself as Megan, I tend to think she's crazy or stupid. Then again, this may simply be my own insanity making me think this.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:40 p.m. CST

    Greggers

    by lock67ca

    Thanks for the link. Jesus, if Weiner can't see Betty for the monstrous nutcase she's turned into, I think he's got some serious "Mommy" issues in his life.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 12:43 p.m. CST

    lowpassat

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    I think you misunderstand me. She knows he's not who he says he is. That's all she needs to know to be a threat, not in some juvenile cloak and dagger sense but in the ways I explained. He can't truly be Don Draper around her because she knows it's partly bullshit. <p>Someone else explain this for me, actually. I'm sure one of you knows what the fuck I'm trying to say.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:05 p.m. CST

    haven't listened to the Weiner interview...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...but concerning Betty, the whole child-psychologist plot this season has been very telling on how he sees her. If Sally were to go around being irrational and petulent (like when Grandpa Gene died) we might be annoyed by her actions, but you wouldn't call her a psychotic bitch. She's a child, and she gets lee-way on acting irrational and petulent.<BR> <BR> The only reason people get so worked up about Betty is because she's supposed to be an adult, not a child. She should know better. But she clearly does not possess the maturity of an adult, and is instead still an irrational and petulent child.<BR> <BR> This season certainly took that notion and showed us a more aggressivly darker side of that immaturity, but the fact remains, whether it was due to her upbringing or society or just some major personality flaws, she's just a little girl who doesn't know what to do.<BR> <BR> Its amazing how Sally can pull some childish bullshit and we all root for her to pull through. Betty does the same stuff and she's a psycho bitch and we hate her. It is kind of disgusting that she would act that way as an adult, but I hope my little analysis makes clear why some of us have a smidgeon of sympathy left for her.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:15 p.m. CST

    To people complaing...

    by ZoeFan

    Have you really watched Mad Men? I think that if one thing is clear about the show, it's if A happens that doesn't mean B will, followed by C. Virtually nothing is packaged perfectly with a nice bow on top. The point of Tomorrowland was not to tie up loose ends, but continue the story. The only real storyline "shocker", and I put quotes on that for a reason, is that Joan kept the baby. Everything else was kept ambiguous. And I believe for the reasoning of story telling.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:29 p.m. CST

    Thunderbolt Ross, Don is around people who know his secret every

    by lowpassat

    What do you mean he can't be Don with her now? It doenst prevent him from being Don around Pete or Bert, and both of them could tear him down harder and faser than Faye. A lot of this season has taken place off screen, I think thats (to me anyway) why season just feels off. We dont know what Dons meetings are about, we dont know what Sally has told her shrink, we didnt know up till this epsiode if Joan had the abortion. I'm not sure if this is good or bad but it leaves the door WIDE open to speculation. At the end of the episode with Joan at the doctor talkig with the other mother my wife looked at me and asked "Well did she do it?". I said I didnt know and that we wont know until next season when they decide to have her rolling a baby stroller into the office to show off the kid or not, or some other random "Hey look Joan did/didnt do it!" scene. I cant decide if thats good writting or just really crappy writting, because it just leaves the door open to whatever drama they want to cook up in future episodes. Ambiguity can only go so far.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:42 p.m. CST

    I liked it

    by MGTHEDJ

    Megan is good with the kids. We saw that when Sally ran into her arms at the office. Sally really likes her because when thy were talking about "Mr. Toad's Wild Ride" Sally said if Megan watches Gene "then Megan can't ride." The milkshake incident, and she's not a blonde, sealed the deal.<p>When was this ep set? Does 10 weeks since Lucky Strike makes it either Columbus Day Weekend or Veteran's Day Weekend? So was the final shot exactly 365 days from the Season Opener?<p>Women doing crazy over Don's decision on the other website means the talk between Betty and Joan was right on the head. Betty is showing to be the "Corporate Ballbusting Bitch" who at 50 will still be single and unfulfilled becuse nothing is perfect. Wendy Wasserstein in her movie "The Heidi Chonicles" had Heidi (read Wendy) ask an ex why he left her. IIRC he replied "You want everything to be a 10, and are never satisfied with a 6. Sometimes a 6 is good enough." Don suffers from this as well. I like Joan's take on the situation as the fact men are so simple.<p>I still say Don was meeting with Disney, and is Topaz what will become "L'eegs"?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 1:50 p.m. CST

    Ambiguity is a great thing

    by ZoeFan

    Only in America must things have a closed end. This show has proven it's story telling ability. Most questions people have will eventually be explained. Take the Dr. Lyle Evans reference that no one knew. It was eventually explained.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:38 p.m. CST

    Only in America?

    by lowpassat

    Yes, everyone in America is some mindless twit that needs everything spelled out out us. I like my TV loud, my beer cold, my homosexuals flaming, and everything explained to me in the lowest common denominator! Hell why am I watching Mad Men anywho, NASCARs on! Give me a break!

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:50 p.m. CST

    So true, you can keep ypur Reality TV

    by lock67ca

    I like shows that actually make me think. Not kill my brain cells.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:53 p.m. CST

    January Jones said a few times

    by Rodie

    that this was her LAST season on Mad Men. That doesn't mean she won't guest star or cameo once or twice in the future, but I think we have to take her word for it (that's a BIG statement to make) and any conjecture about Season 5 has to include very little or no Betty at all. It'll be pretty easy to have a new caregiver/housekeeper escort them to Manhattan for weekends with Don and Megan. It makes be think that we'll skip ahead just a few months and see Don and Megan married an in a new apartment in Manhattan. Megan will be working in some new capacity at SCDP (maybe the TV department with Harry who was woefully underused this season, or a writer under Peggy, or in Joan's old job in charge of the secretaries). I think she'll be a really good wife and mother with just a few hints that she puts her work ambitions ahead of Don on occasion (just as he'll do to her). The tension will be ramped up though because he'll be tempted to cheat on her, and when he does it will sting so much more than when he cheated on Betty because Megan is not a b*tch like Betty is.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 2:57 p.m. CST

    lowpassat...

    by ZoeFan

    Have you read most of the posts? Everyone's pissed that most everything wasn't spelled out for them.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 3:25 p.m. CST

    lopassat

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    Just forget about it. Jesus Christ on a popsicle stick.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 3:45 p.m. CST

    If I had a french teacher like Jessica Pare

    by Jubs

    I would stare at that great rack of hers and wouldn't learn jack all semester. I mean, those Hot Tub Time Machine pics, shhhiiieeeetttt.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:05 p.m. CST

    I'd be that stupid too.

    by _Maltheus_

    Obviously it was a reckless decision to marry someone he barely knew while in the midst of a personal crisis. But she really does seem like a keeper. Although I kind of felt that way about Lilah early on in S2 of Dexter, so my judgment may not be sound on these matters. Having her continue to work at SDCP would be a mistake. Joan and Peggy were just clucking about it to show how catty women can be in the workplace, not as a predictor of where the show is going (I hope).<br /> <br /> As for Joan, did she really keep the baby? Or was she just stalling on telling her husband that she 'lost' it?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:11 p.m. CST

    ZoeFan....

    by lowpassat

    Unless you know the place of birth of most of the people on this board you are making an assumption, and you know what they say about assumptions. Plus, lock67ca if you get most of your intellectual stimulation from a basic cable TV show you aren't really all that better than the rality TV show watchers you seem to think you are above. My point is basically this: There is a lot of this show that we arent privy to and since we dont see or know whats motivating these characters decisions then we have nothing to fall back on other than speculation. And in not showing whats happening the writters seem to be leaving huge holes in the story they can fill in however they want in a future episode. So yes, eventually we will nkow the answers, the problem is that we are given the "problem" then the "solution", and not the work it takes to get there. So yes, I am sure that frutrates a lot of people in ANY country not just us dumb Americans.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:49 p.m. CST

    People "get" the episode

    by rainbowtrout1265

    This just wasn't that great. It was dull, the "surprises" weren't all that surprising, either. Mad Men is the kind of show where you often go, "that was a great episode". Last night just had the feel of an average middle-of-the-season hour. I wasn't the biggest fan of season 3, but the finale really got my interest back up. I wonder if Mad Men will lose some of the small audience they have now?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:49 p.m. CST

    People who think Faye is going to get revenge...

    by Executor

    ...have never been in a relationship. <p>I've told potentially damaging secrets to countless girls, and am the keeper of a number of secrets as well. Neither dumping nor being dumped has ever prompted anyone to seek out exes/friends/police/etc. to rat the other person out. <p>Maybe if you punch someone in the face or fuck their sister, they might be inclined to pay you back, but otherwise if things don't work out...c'est la vie.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 4:56 p.m. CST

    rainbowtrout

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    They might be losing me. Let's face it, Don is a doucebag and I don't want to watch week after week to see him bagging hot chicks. But it was somewhat interesting when it looked like he was being affected by the times and set up for growing and changing. But now he's firmly back hiding from the world behind the mask of Don Draper and is banging a new hot chick so bleah. Really. If they'd just spin off Pete, Joan, Peggy I'd prefer that.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:19 p.m. CST

    Not until I noticed the teeth

    by Bass Ackwards

    Did I finally recognize Pare as the actress who played Slaughtery's daughter on Jack & Bobby, amazing what a hair cut does she looks quite different.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:21 p.m. CST

    I liked it

    by Damer1

    First, I'm sick of the Sally killing herself predictions. It was more likely that Space Aliens would hire SCDP to do an ad campaign prior to their arrival. In so many ways Meagan is the anti-Betty. Beyond the blonde brunette thing there are so many levels that she fulfills that role for Don. In the same sense that Henry was the anti-Don she is the new anti-Betty. I don't think there was any sense of remorse on his part at the end. Time will tell. Quite honestly from the interviews I've watched January Jones is a dead fish. Her vacuousness doesn't seem like much of an act. It would be better if she and Henry were killed in a Bermuda Triangle plane crash and the kids live in the City with Don and Meagan.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 5:45 p.m. CST

    Don won't let Meagan work after they're married

    by krabklaw

    If Don wanted to marry that type, he would have snapped up Faye. Don will very soon want a full-time housewife, and yes, that will cause resentment by Meagan.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 6:11 p.m. CST

    "Don't be upset, its just a milkshake"

    by Bass Ackwards

    Not sure what significance there is to it, but did anyone notice that when she said that, Don's back was turned? She was talking to the kids, but it looked to me like Don thought she was talking to him, the very next scene is the proposal. Just thought that was interesting.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 6:39 p.m. CST

    No Complaints

    by DustinBones

    Mad Men is an adult, intelligent, emotional, and funny show. The best of the current crop, by far. All this talk of suicides, a lame finale, etc., I don't get it. The entire season was one obstacle after another, did anyone really believe they would top off a season like this with some ridiculous tragedy just for the shock value? I was gonna post something like this last night just so I could say "told ya so", but seriously how can someone watch a show like this and expect something so pedestrian, lame and cliche of an ending?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:05 p.m. CST

    people still watch this?

    by DioxholsterRestored

    even after SGU started? wow

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:21 p.m. CST

    The finale was fascinating.

    by Hercules

    The whole season was a guessing game: which hot girl in Don's life would win his post-Betty heart? <p>Jane Sterling's pal Bethany Van Nuys? <br>Don's first SCDP secretary Allison? <br> Anna's niece Stephanie? <br> New consumer expert Faye Miller? <br> Copywriter Peggy Olsen? <br> Office manager Joan Harris? <br> Heroin addict Midge Daniels? <p> And then it turned out to be Megan Calvais, the always-around way-too-hot almost-extra Don seemed to barely notice until Blankenship died? <p> Says a lot about love and life, I say.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:24 p.m. CST

    I kind of like the anti-climactic season finale

    by Royston Lodge

    I mentioned to plenty of people how I like the way True Blood doesn't fool around with big cliffhanger season finales. Each season finale for that show seems like "just another episode", and I kind of like it.<p> In the same way, I kind of like that the season finale for Mad Men this year was a little understated. It sort of suggests the idea that Don has simply resolved to man up, just get on with life and stop worrying so much. No need for contrived drama in the season finale, because the rest of the 60s will provide more than enough drama to go around.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:33 p.m. CST

    And check out the cast of the lesbitastic ...

    by Hercules

    2001 Canadian coming-of-age drama "Lost and Delirious": <p>Jessica Pare <br> Piper Perabo <br> Mischa Barton <br> Emily VanCamp <br>AND <br> Caroline Dhavernas

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:40 p.m. CST

    Royston

    by Bass Ackwards

    Have you been watching different True Blood finales then me? Every finale is a cliffhanger. Not a complaint by the way, as they feel like cliffhangers in the sense the show runners just enjoy the kind of show they're making, and that's part of it. Rather than cliff hangers as a gimmick for all the Lost clones that can't create any other compelling reasons to watch, so they hope using cheap, shallow arcs can make up for all the other cheap, shallow writing. K now I'm a bit of course, just thought your comment that True Blood doesn't use cliff hangers in the finale was weird (TRUE BLOOD SPOILERS: season one left us wondering which character had been killed off, season two had Bill being abducted, and season three had Bill and the Queen about to fight to the death).

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:46 p.m. CST

    The only show that Ive seen deliver a GOOD finale recently

    by AshokForgiven

    ...is Fringe. <br><br> That is all.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 7:56 p.m. CST

    I miss it already

    by DustinBones

    When Betty let Carla go and refused to write a letter of recommendation letter, man I was shocked at Betty. Later when her and Don were together talking in the kitchen at the house I actually felt a little endearment towards her. Great scene, Don realizing, maybe that's what was keeping him up?

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 8:09 p.m. CST

    70 Days

    by Countdown_to_Vader

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 10:38 p.m. CST

    "Says a lot about love and life"

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    With all due respect Herc, mostly I think it just says that Weiner has a boner for the actress who plays Megan.

  • Oct. 18, 2010, 11:57 p.m. CST

    It doesnt add up

    by deelzbub

    Most series try to make it to 100 episodes for syndication. If there's only two more seasons, that's not 100 episodes.

  • Oct. 19, 2010, midnight CST

    I think she might have put it on him in the kitchen

    by deelzbub

    if he'd just had a drink with her, and saved his information for later. Just for old times sake.

  • Oct. 19, 2010, 2:52 a.m. CST

    Most NETWORK series aim for 100

    by Bass Ackwards

    The Shield, Sopranos, Six Feet Under, that's just off the top of my head as far as cable series that had the luxury of defining their own lifespan. 100 isn't the magic number it used to be, DVD and iTunes are the new series syndication.

  • Oct. 19, 2010, 4:04 a.m. CST

    I am glad they didn't go for...

    by WeylandYutani

    the over the top and overly dramatic cliff hanger. <P> For those who have a hate on for the Megan Calvais character and think it makes no sense, you have frame it in Don's terms and Don's world view, not our modern ideas. <P> To me yes, Dr Faye Miller is the better pairing for Don. She challenges him. She is bright. She is perhaps even smarter than Don. She is refined (even if her accent suggests she comes from a modest east coast upbringing... which also closely matches Don's mid west white trash upbringing). She even knows her limitations... she admits she knows nothing, about and does not care to know anything about kids. She is a very different type of psychologist than the other woman we have seen counseling Sally Draper, who clearly understands the mind of a child. <P> In contrast, Don's secretary/fiancee, while too young for him. She too comes from a modest French Canadian upbringing. She is bright, but not particularly clever. She is certainly beautiful, but completely ineffectual. And she does have one trump card: Megan is superb with Don's kids. And while Don is a rather distant closed off man, he does cherish his children. They are important to him and he sees Megan's ability to handle them (probably less because she would make a good step mother and more likely because she is close to being a child herself) as a legitimate quality of her character. <P> And that is the main point Weiner is making about Draper. While a modern man in many ways, still a child of the 40's where a woman's primary job is to care for the children and make a good home. IMO, THIS is why Don has decide to make a go with it with Megan... even if Peggy and the audience realize that the Don/Megan pairing is ridiculous in about every other way. <P> This was a very well constructed season. In general, Mad Men's character development is among the best on series TV.

  • Oct. 19, 2010, 7:14 a.m. CST

    WeylandYutani

    by InActionMan

    Very insightful analysis. <P> I know Weiner has said only six seasons, but I think that may just be a negotiating tactic. Weiner studied under David Chase after all. <P> When the AMC comes to Weiner and says they want two more seasons of their flagship show, Weiner counters that he just can't do it because he has no more story ideas. Of course AMC owns the show and could try to continue it with another show runner but, deep down they know that would be a mistake. <P> So AMC and Weiner dance around each other until a dollar figure is reached they can both live with.

  • Oct. 19, 2010, 7:24 a.m. CST

    69 Days

    by Countdown_to_Vader

  • Oct. 19, 2010, 3:43 p.m. CST

    InActionMan

    by WeylandYutani

    Thx dude. Yeah I hope the series goes a bit longer than 6 seasons too. It is different when a show does a 22 ep full order. But with only 13 episodes a year they could go on longer and still stay fresh IMO. <P> I'd love to see Don and the gang in the 70s... Roger Sterling would be riot!

  • Oct. 20, 2010, 4:30 p.m. CST

    Penultimate = real finale

    by Himbo

    hadn't really though about it until I heard Jon Hamm on Dennis Miller. Penultimate episodes tend to sum the season; Finale's lay the table for next season.

  • Oct. 20, 2010, 4:35 p.m. CST

    herc now that your mad men

    by JaredP

    is over for the season get to the dexter talkbacks on sundays

  • Oct. 26, 2010, 7:44 a.m. CST

    Yes episode was weak and soap operatic

    by Rupee88

    So a new marriage and a new baby...how clever. Very lazy writing and it was out of character for Don to act that chick to marry him while barely knowing her. His IQ was not that low in the past...just not consistent with his past behavior.

  • I believe we will find out about Don's meetings in Season 5.