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JAY LENO’s Second-Quarter Ratings Worst Since 1993!!
I am – Hercules!!
The second-quarter (April through June) ratings for “The Tonight Show With Jay Leno” have hit their lowest level since 1993, the year CBS launched “The Late Show With David Letterman.”
Two weeks ago Letterman and Leno tied in the 18-49 demo for the first time since Leno returned to “Tonight” earlier this year.
In addition, the first 17 weeks of 2010’s “The Tonight Show With Jay Leno” averages in 18-49 well below the first 17 weeks of 2009’s “The Tonight Show With Conan O’Brien.” (Leno isn’t likely to ever catch up to the 35-week complete-series average for O’Brien’s “Tonight,” which saw its ratings skyrocket when viewers learned he was leaving the show.)
Meanwhile, while Leno continues to narrowly beat Letterman most weeks, the return of Leno to “Tonight” apparently hasn’t diminished Letterman’s 18-49 scores. From Deadline Hollywood:
The Late Show is now tracking at demo levels comparable to where Letterman was before O'Brien was replaced. Late Show drew 3.3 million viewers and a 0.9/4 in 18-49, down 7% in viewers and even in 18-49. It was Late Show’s most competitive 2Q position against The Tonight Show in viewers (-746,000) and adults 18-49 (-0.2) since 1995.
The only shows showing second-quarter 18-49 increases at that hour are "Nightline" and "Jimmy Kimmel Live." "Kimmel" was up 10 percent from the same period in 2009.
In 18-49, "Late Night With Jimmy Fallon" was slightly ahead of "The Late Late Show With Craig Ferguson," though "Ferguson" was slightly ahead in total viewers.
Find all of Deadline’s story on the matter here.
Find TV By The Numbers story on the matter here.
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that is all there is to it
COCO 4 LYFE NYUKA -
but who cares?
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Leno sucks
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Move on, Herc. Move on.
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...as soon as I saw it on Deadline. Herc hates Leno yo.
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For nothing more than talkback fussing.
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I wonder if Leno ever wishes he could go back in time, pass on the "Tonight Show" gig, and continue with his edgy material that he showcased so well on "Late Night with David Letterman." Go back and watch those videos on YouTube. Leno is funny, biting, with occasional flares of social commentary. When he took over the "Tonight Show" he had to homogenize his material for Middle America. NBC won't put up with bad numbers, and the whole cycle starts all over again with the search for a new host. Sigh.
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Fuck the network and a big FUCK YOU to Leno!!!!
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Leno hasn't been funny in a decade.
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But I think what he did to Conan sucks.
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The audience games are getting old and shows you the show's writing isn't that good.
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GET OFF TV!!
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I still, to this day cannot see that man's face without feeling nauseous. He stole Letterman's job, but got away with it because he's a "nice guy". But you pull that shit twice, and people start looking elsewhere for entertainment. I can't wait for November.
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Letterman fucked somebody over (an intern) and honed up to it on air. Leno fucked Conan, stole his job and his pride, but never admitted to it. He even had the nerve to say that they both got screwed. What an asshole.
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Jul 02, 2010 12:04:09 AM CDT
I honestly enjoy all the late night hosts depending on my mood
by mponte10006
But Craig Ferguson is clearly the funniest of the pack. His is the only show I make a point of watching, as often as I can. He may very well be the most natural interviewer since Carson, and his monologue is always fresh and hilarious. When Letterman steps down in the next few years, I hope that Craig gets the job, although rumors of Conan hopping over from TBS for that gig seems realistic as well.
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Amazing.
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He must return and Leno must go away or at least be booed off stage while the audience throws lettuce and tomatoes at him
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And so does Letterman
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Both his autobiography, and his Novel especially were great reads.
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From the station that brought you TYLER PERRY!!
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He's a comedian, not a politician -- and not even all politicians wear flag pins. Jesus, I hate that guy.
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May The Tonight Show crumble and fail before our very eyeballs. The classic infamous show Hosted by Johnny Carson. Looks like Jimmy Fallon will take over after Leno says..."Fuck this place, FUCK IT!"
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Cause they show the thing nearly every day.
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with all the cocksucking he does for Amazon, Conan, and SNL.
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You insinuated TBS made him famous, which isn't the case. "From the station that brought you TYLER PERRY'S HOUSE OF PAYNE!!" would've been a far more accurate statement.
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Leno is the image of everything wrong with America, screwing over people with no remorse or even realizing it. The fact that people don't watch anymore is good news for the world.
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so say we all
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because Coughlin's Laws says Leno's ratings are going up, and his opinion is fact.
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Keep them up Herc. Don't listen to anyone with their "Wow Herc let it go blah blah blah". NEVER let it go! I hate Jay Leno so much. But my life is so busy sometimes I forget to hate him. I need these reminders and I sincerely thank you. I'm going to hate him all tomorrow. I fucking hate Leno. I'm going to remind my friends with text messages too and they'll be like "Oh yeah I hate Jay Leno". We need these reminders. God I hate Jay Leno.
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Here we go once more with the same tired narrative spin that has been factually discounted over and over and overand over again in these same talkbacks as Herc-bias gone statistically incorrect.
Seriously..........no amount of your arguement framing is going to get Leno or MacFarlane run off the air.
On to more relevant news.....Whatever happened to a Treme talkback. Seriously dude, you called this one of the best new shows (rightly so) of the season and then post not a single talkback for it.
What gives with that????
Did you like it or not? If you did, where was the fan forum for it????? -
Go to the AICN search box and type "Treme."
Hey! What's that? -
In your face sauron dude!!!!
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I caught his monologue a few days ago and it was much much better than he was before the Conan debacle - funnier, edgier, riskier. Still not good but at least he seems to have learned something.
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...especially the puppets.
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Enjoy your meal, kiddo, because you just got SERVED!
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I know people do, but, he is so grating. He's got this dark set, and it feels like he has 10 people in the audience.
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I would rather get sodomized than watch Leno.
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I think he hates it, too. He calls attention to it ALL the time. "Was this place lit by a cell phone?" "What's up with the 5 hobos we hired to be in the audience today?"
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for ruining, not just Conan's career, but the careers of all the people NBC laid off in order to compensate for the Conan payoff.
F*** Jay for not being a man and going to FOX when he had the chance. -
then it will trail off as the novelty wears off and a months into coco's new show he'll be trailing both Leno and dave. I'm not saying the show won't be good, but having it on TBS is a death curse and it's followed by the george lopez house party which is a terrible show, is it filmed outside because it looks like a mexican BBQ
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Never, NEVER let up on Leno until he's gone. I depend on you to express the disdain, the hate, the absolute loathing I and others feel toward Leno. Somebody has to do it; I salute you, Herc, for your noble service to us lovers of GOOD late-night talk shows. And to those who don't like Herc's Leno-bashing: FUCK OFF!! When you see a thread in Coaxial regarding Leno, DO NOT CLICK ON IT, go elsewhere and read about something that doesn't offend your delicate sensibilities.
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Leno USED to be a funny comic. But he lost his edge or talent for it while doing the show. That was pretty evident during the Kimmel spot. Any one else would have been able to roll with those punches and probably send a few back at Jimmy. But Leno just stood there like a deer in headlights, and has to whine about being "sucker punched" about it later. I've watched a few of Leno's shows she's he's been back and his monologues seem kinda bland. I'm really hoping that Conan's show takes off (or does reasonably well) I would love to see some late shows on cable stations where they can take a few more risks.
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for dead on commetns. Leno always struck me as the type who wanted to be the funny guy in a group and just came across as annoying. Kimmel, Letterman and Conan just seem to do it naturally w/o forcing it
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FIRST!!!
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Jul 02, 2010 9:40:35 AM CDT
The only one who ever laughed ad Leno was Kevin eubanks
by redbull_werewolf
and that was just because Leno had kidnaped his family and for everytime eubanks didn't laugh Leno cut off one of his kid's toes
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Jul 02, 2010 10:15:29 AM CDT
So, basically what you're saying is, Leno STILL beats Letterman?
by coughlins laws
Thanks for the update. Your article SHOULD be touting how in spite of the shallacking Leno took in the press the last 6 months, that he was able to still re-claim his crown as King of Late Night. That's the real headline. And enough with this same, tired 18-49 demo ratings. Show overall ratings. Amount of eyeballs. It's true that 18-49 viewers are rated more, but you're just plain being dishonest by trying to pretend that nobody above 49 matters. Leno's show makes more money than Letterman's show, PERIOD!!! When Conan gets back on TV, he will be in fourth or fifth place behind Leno, Letterman, Nightline, and Jon Stewart/Stephen Colbert. Conan was a ratings disaster and NBC is better off with Leno than with Conan. This is undisputed...
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was NEVER promised The Tonight Show and he never even asked for it until Johnny retired. It's his fault for being too much of a pussy to let NBC know he wanted the job. Also, Conan stole Leno's job, NOT the other way around. Conan wnet to NBC and told them he had other offers and that he would leave, forcing NBC to push Leno out. That sure sounds like Conan stole Leno's job to me. And then when he got Leno's gig, he quickly ruined it by losing 60% of Leno's audience. Now Leno has had to firght for months to get some of that audience back. The only reason he's lost ground is because Conan was so unbelievably bad at his job that he lost most of the loyal audience. And now Conan goes and steals Lopez's 11pm slot. How is that any different than what Conan did to Leno?
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Jul 02, 2010 10:25:50 AM CDT
I doubt Conan's new show will be highly rated at all,
by coughlins laws
even in the beginning. He's on cable, now. Nobody even really knows what channel TBS is. People watch local news at 11pm. Anyone in his core audience will be watching Jon Stewart at 11pm (who is actually funny, sometimes, and can conduct a worthwhile interview). Conan O'Brien just is not a very good talk show host...
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Conan said "If you want to keep me at NBC, I want The Tonight Show". All NBC had to say was "no", but they said yes. And it isn't like they told Jay to take a hike. They gave him FIVE YEARS. It's NBC's show -- they can give it to whoever they want. Jay never owned the show and it wasn't his show. Sure, he was the face of it. But NBC owned it and could do with it whatever they wanted.
Here's what separates Leno from Letterman, Conan, Kimmel, and Ferguson: Offstage and off camera, Letterman, Conan, Ferguson, and Kimmel are funny people. They have a great sense of humor and they know how to be funny instinctively. Leno only knows how to do "bits". Ever watch Leno when he was a guest being interviewed by someone else on an entertainment program (like when he was on Dave's "Late Night" show back in the day? He couldn't be funny in a straight conversation to save his life. He was always rattling off pre-written bits from his comedy stand-up routine. He can deliver a punchline but he isn't anywhere near as instinctively or innately funny as the other four, and it seems to grow more obvious with each passing year. Leno may get good ratings, but Middle America isn't terribly discriminating and doesn't have a particularly sophisticated sense of humor. Great comics like Hicks and Carlin always appealed to smarter and more sophisticated audience members who "got" the jokes. There's not much to "get" with Leno. His humor is largely unsophisticated and unchallenging. You can hear it in his jokes and you can see it in his eyes.)
If you were to sit down to dinner or go to a party or sit on a plane with Letterman, Conan, Kimmel, or Ferguson, any one of them could have you in stitches if they chose to and they could do it just by holding a conversation with you. Leno, however, doesn't hold conversations. He just sits and waits for his turn to speak, and then he rattles of pre-rehearsed jokes like he's doing a monologue for an audience of one.
Do I know this from experience? Yes. -
Jul 02, 2010 10:41:14 AM CDT
I meant to close the parentheses quite a bit earlier than I did.
by jawsfan
Sorry about that.
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Since it was announced five years prior to happening, that has got to be slowest robbery on record.
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Leno HID IN A CLOSET, and you can Letterman a pussy?
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instead of can...you know what I mean...
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but now I think he's the man with the chin himself.
or maybe Tom Cruise
he's a master spin doctor, for sure.
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You seem to become obsessed with certain things. You hate Leno. We get it.
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Old people die everyday.
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Unfortunately television wasn't invented in 1849.
Craig Ferguson = funniest talk show on TV. The fact that he does it with no band, no sidekick and no announcer on a bare bones stage with dim lighting and a wrestling sized audience only makes it better. that he does lame sketches and turns chucks of the hsow over to cheesy hand puppets is better still. That he panders to the youth demo with dopey gimmicks like wearing sneakers or having a mohawk'd skull robot that looks like a villain out of a Paul Gulacy comic is even better. That he insults his audience, his guests and his network. swears constantly, refuses to put nervous starlets at ease, makes most of his guests wait until the last 20 minutes of the show for a brief chat and that even his sexual flirtations with his guests comes off as rote and insincere and the fact that his foreign and aged sense of humor still seems to think that pretending to be gay is somehow funny all simply make him better ad better.
You simply can't make up that sort of anti-social misanthropy - it has to come straight from the heart. Ferguson is nuts, plain and simple, and being the most dangerous man on TV makes him the best, plain and simple.
As far as demographics go, who cares what children under 50 think anyway. You punks all have two choices: get old or die young. Good luck with that. Take your time and enjoy the trip. -
I find him funny sometimes, and I like his interviews. But he's become more and more smug and spends a lot of time pausing to enjoy or outright laugh at his own jokes.
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Letterman was funnier himself back when he had a bare-bones budget like Ferguson. All the pampering and big star living helps to remove the funny. See Leno for example.
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And that piano theme is AWESOME
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Does late night cable have more leeway than late night primetime?
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if Leno's cock tastes like victory?
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well maybe not, but that show is the best thing on late night television..besides the limp dick pill ads.
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Man Leno is the worst. I'm so glad Conado pulled out of that hot mess of a cluster fuck
Can't wait till he's back on -
and perhaps most importanly look at the local ratings BEFORE the Tonight Show and at the ratings for the morning shows....in the end having Leno back is better than having Conan....
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I don't have a dog in this race. I couldn't care less, since I don't watch any of these shows. I think the format itself is dated and overdone. There are now going to be something like 8 of these shows on every single night around the same time. Too much. That said, the Leno bashing is growing tiresome and stale. Every time we see a stupid "Leno's Ratings Down!" post on here, the Leno hater come on and say how unfunny he is and how they haven't watched him in years. If you haven't watched him in years, how could you say whether or not he's funny? I can't say because, honestly, I haven't watched ANY of them in years. Mostly, however, it's stupid because it's all just spewing half-truths. Whether you like it not, Leno is still #1. It keeps getting posted here as if he's some loser and he's lost everything...then we read that he's still on top and still beats Letterman. So...why again would NBC be upset?! Because of ONE demographic? Which Leno narrowly loses and everyone praised Conan for when he narrowly won? I'm not sure I get the correlation. Yeah, it's a prize demographic, but "most viewers" still equals "number one". If Conan has been number one in overall viewers, none of this would have ever happened. Better yet, if Conan had been satisfied where he was and NBC hadn't forced the #1 host in late-night to retire before he wanted to, then tried to move his show to an earlier slot to keep him from kicking their asses on another network at 11:30pm, then none of this would have happened. Essentially, what it seems here, is that Leno is the most popular talk show host, 5 years ago and now, and that pisses everyone off. And, somehow, everyone thinks that everyone else is to blame for Conan's failure except Conan and the fact he didn't get better numbers...which somehow was also everyone else's fault.
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Two words: iphone bashing!!! one of the funniest epsiodes
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You keep claiming Letterman never asked for the job but what sources are you citing? I’ve read several different pieces on the whole drama and Letterman made it pretty clear that he wanted the job, which was certainly expected given his success on the Late Show. Also, you do realize Carson wanted Letterman as well, don’t you? As to the notion that Conan fucked this whole thing up, bear in mind the only reason NBC pulled this shit was because Leno’s primetime ratings were so incredibly low that affiliates were threatening to pull it and NBC wasn’t willing to pay out Leno’s contract. Leno’s failure brought this whole thing crashing down because the man can’t score with anything but his bland late night shtick that caters to the elderly and the stupid. The real irony is that back when Leno first took over the Tonight Show his ratings were shit and NBC stuck with him regardless. Personally, I never had a problem with Jay until this Conan thing and regardless of your own postulations, Leno’s true legacy will be of a man who got a job he didn’t deserve and held onto said job longer than was necessary. I guess if you subscribe to the notion that ratings alone justify mediocrity you might have a point but personally, I can’t get behind the notion that Leno is better than O’Brien because of ratings anymore than I can entertain the idea that American Idol is a better show than The Shield or The Wire.
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He was the fucking permanent guest host for years and worked more nights than Carson for almost 5 years. Letterman NEVER, EVER told NBC he wanted the job. Why should they have given the job to someone who constantly bashed them, was extremely unlikable off camera, and never said he wanted the job. So THAT'S stealing. But, when the weasal Conan O'Brien goes to NBC and says he's leaving unless he gets The Tonight Show, where Leno was Number 1 for 15 years, that's somehow NOT stealing? I just don't get it. NBC obviously made the right choice back in 93 to give The Tonight Show to Leno, and they made the right choice again giving the show back to Leno. He routinely beats Letterman, Nightline, Jimmy Kimmel, Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert, George Lopez, and Conan O'Brien's ratings EVERY SINGLE NIGHT!!! He's better than all these guys. I'm sorry that some of you don't like it, but it's true...
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First of all, I don't care if Carson wanted Letterman to replace him. What does that have to do with anything? It was NBC's show and choice. Carson, RIP, had barely been around for years on his own show. So he wanted Letterman. So, what? I mean, I get why people love Letterman over Leno...but what Carson wanted hardly registers in my mind.
And you can't compare 1993 to 2009. Yeah, NBC gave Leno more time to find ratings. But times are different now. It used to be that ALL shows got more time to find audiences. Also, Leno was merely the guest host for several years. Conan had his OWN TALK SHOW for 16 YEARS! What, NBC moved him an hour earlier and suddenly he deserved 5 years to start all over again and find a new audience? Don't you get it? They were thinking he'd have a built-in audience when he moved to "TTS". His own audience left. It's not that Conan didn't "build an audience", he LOST it. He lost 40% of the viewers BEFORE Leno's stupid 10pm debacle took the airwaves. How is that NBC not "giving him a chance"? If he'd started weak and grown, NBC would've stuck around. But he was losing money and viewers. You think NBC would really have taken all of those risks and then just screwed Conan over to be assholes? No, they were looking at it as a business. Like I said, I don't care for ANY of them. I do not like/dislike any of them more/less than the other. But these are just the numbers. These are just facts. Conan is great, but his own fans didn't follow him...and now they all blame everyone else for it. And they scream how unfair it was. If all of them were actually tuning in to his show, the numbers would've been there...and he still would be, too. Buy why be pissed? Now Conan can have a better show somewhere else, Leno can keep his show, and the world spins the same. Why the hate when there are 47 talk shows on TV to choose from? -
Are the NBC exec gonna can Leno and replace him with a resurrected Johnny Carson???
but in all seriousness, FUCK LENO.
Obrien was a million zillion times better and funnier than hell.
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I've seen a lot of people talking out their ass on this site, but you sir take the crown now. It's pretty obvious that you have NO clue as to what went down when Carson was stepping down. After Johnny's hand picked replacement Joan Rivers fucked things up by doing that show on Fox he picked Letterman to replace him. Letterman was promised the tonight show, but NBC later took back that decision and decided to bring in a fresh face. Letterman got pissed and went off to CBS. And also keep in mind that when Leno took over his rating's were about the same if not worse than Conan's were when he took over. And it didn't change until he landed the interview with Hugh Grant after he got caught with the hooker. This has all been out in the public for years and year. So I don't know where you are getting your information from, but it's obviously from someone who has no idea what the hell they are talking about. And I think Jimmy Kimmel proved that Leno has lost whatever comedic talent he had. Anyone else would have been able to fire a few shots back at Kimmel and not just stand there looking like a total dumb ass.
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If they got it right about Leno hiding in the closet, why would they be wrong about Letterman never asking for the job? As far as Conan goes, I admit it was more NBC fucking up than Conan. You can't blame Conan for wanting the brass ring. But at the same time, he went to NBC Execs behind Leno's back and demanded his job or he'd walk. As far as Leno not deserving his job, he obviously did. Leno crushed Letterman, Dennis Miller, Chevy Chase, Arsenio Hall, Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert, Nightline, George Lopez, etc, etc, etc. As far as who Carson wanted to follow him, who cares. Carson didn't take his job serioulsy the last decade he had it. He only worked 2 or 3 nights a week and took over 10 weeks of vacation a year. Leno got the job and quickly earned the title King of Late Night. Conan is nowhere near as competent a talk show host. As far as someone not earning a talk who, Conan is at the top of the list. He was a comedy writer for only a few years prior and never appeared before a camera (except for a few random background characters on SNL). The guy didn't pay his dues in the business at all before he got the show. He was never a stand-up, never worked clubs, never starred in a show, etc, etc, etc. If anyone didn't deserve The Tonight Show, it was Conan O'Brien...
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@ Coughlins Law.
Never mind the issue of Letterman, but did you just seriously make the statement that Leno is "better" than Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert?
Are you you actually Helen Kushnik posting from the afterlife or aomething?
Once again brainiac, ratings DO NOT equal talent, and the simple fact that Leno may reach more viewers, does NOT make him "better"
The ONLY thing Leno does "better" than Stewart or Colbert, is take teabags from network executives -
Jul 02, 2010 1:34:51 PM CDT
Carson didn't get to pick ANYONE. He's NOT an NBC Exec
by coughlins laws
What Carson wanted was and is irrelevant...
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in the ratings, which is all that matters. Personally, I kind of like Jon Stewart sometimes, despite his Far-Left slant. But Leno beats him in the ratings...
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promised The Tonight Show until AFTER Leno already had it. Your facts are just plain wrong. You should read The Late Shift. If you don't want to read it, watch the movie...
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So somebody else hacked your account and added this to your post?
"He's better than all these guys. I'm sorry that some of you don't like it, but it's true..."
Leno has been a piss poor comedian since the 70's.. His ability to actually make a successful career for himself, despite being so exceedingly "unfunny" is a conundrum
Do I at least admire him for this?
Yes. I admire that he managed to tap into a senile but obviously large target demographic
Does that in any way make up for the fact that he has no acting chops, no stage presence, no interviewing skills, no comic timing or wit what so ever?
No.
Truth is, Leno should be hailed as a shining example to all that despite having no talent, that despite having the ethics of a rabid hyena, that despite all of it, that one can indeed live the American dream.
Leno better than anyone?
Uhh, no. -
Jul 02, 2010 1:56:45 PM CDT
"better" and "funnier" are two different things. As far as
by coughlins laws
ratings go, he IS better than all of them. As far as your line that he has "no stage presence, no acting chops, no interviewing skills, etc", well, obviously more people agree that he does than agree that Letterman does. I really don't see the point you're trying to make. The Late Night audience has spoken, and for 17 years, they have chosen Leno to be the best Late Night Talk Show Host. I'm sorry you don't agree with this, but more people like him than Letterman, Kimmel, Stewart, Colbert, Lopez, Conan, etc, etc, etc. The ratings have spoken...
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Jul 02, 2010 2:06:07 PM CDT
thound3, I love how people like you can't just say that
by coughlins laws
others have different tastes than you. You can't just say that people have different senses of humor. No, you have to insult them. You have to belittle them. Does it make you feel better to say anyone older than you is senile? Also, what about the 18-49 year olds that ARE watching Leno instead of Letterman? He still regularly beats Letterman in this age group, as well. And he beats Stewart/Colbert in this age group. Any insults to throw their way? Does it make you feel good? I guess that's why you enjoy an insult comic like Letterman. It makes you feel better to take cheap shots and assassinate someone's character, going far beyond just good-natured humor...
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That Coughlins, should be all you need to know about the world of Nielsen and the IQ of most TV viewers as a whole
Again, ratings do not equal talent.
As far as show business success goes in terms of overall dollars earned in the industry? I'd be willing to bet Letterman tops Leno... so ratings or otherwise, who's REALLY more successful?
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Can anyone actually name one memorable moment that has occured on his show since Hugh Grant other than his feuds with Conan, Kimmel, etc?
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Leno fanboys use the "victim card"
Looks like the chin taught you all well. -
the show and owns his own production company, Worlwide Pants, which produces The Late, Late Show and did Everybody Loves Raymond. But how do we judge who's better, then? Do you think the same people watching Jersey Shore are watching The Tonight Show? I guess we'll agree to disagree. All I know is, Leno owns Letterman and he has for 17 years. He makes much more money for NBC than Letterman makes for CBS. How else can you judge it?
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Because someone's hero Sarah Palin was the butt of some "cruel jokes" by him.
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Besides Drew Barrymore flashing him and him calling the Palin daughters whores?
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stance you're going to take? OK, I guess there's nothing else to say. If you think it's funny when a 62 year old, sex-obsessed pervert calls the teenage daughter's of a politician sluts and whores on national television, I guess we are just way too different kinds of people. You appear to be happy having no class...
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His first show after 9/11, Madonna interview, Bill O'Reily interview, John McCain not showing up, Heart Attack comeback, Intern sex scandal apology, Farrah Fawcett interview, just to name a few off the top of my head. Oh yeah, and the harpie Palin being "offended" by his jokes, and getting a lot of face time because of her "outrage." And this comes from a casual Letterman viewer. I've probably seen Leno just as much over the years, but can't name one moment other than Hugh Grant. Watching his show is like Groundhog Day, SSDD.
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Jul 02, 2010 2:30:58 PM CDT
Well, thound3, all you can do is personally attack me.
by coughlins laws
Does it really make you feel better about yourself? Does it make you feel superior to others?
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Leno should just make shows about cars..he really is good at it; and Letterman...that mopey fuck is a suicide waiting to happen.But who cares..I work 65+ hours a week and have a wife who needs the sex...no time to stay up and watch these guys anyway.
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actually likes it when a 62 year old pervert calls her 14 year old daughter a whore? So, you wouldn't be offended if the 62 year old pervert said that about your daugher, or your sister? You would enjoy that?
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Leno hasn't been funny since pre-Tonight Show gig (at least some of his old stuff on Youtube isn't bad), and Letterman hasn't since a few years into the CBS run. The only time I ever watch their shows is if I'm completely bored and they happen to have a guest on that I want to see.
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of his sense of humor than Leno has, yet people still pretend they love him. He's a cranky insult-comic at this point, and he only appeals to certain types of people.
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I don't recall that. But hey, I can't see Russia from my window either, so maybe I'm wrong.
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Palin said it? Doesn't that make you the one that's stupid?
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Or did you just disprove youself by flat out saying Letterman called Palin's daughter a whore. I don't remember him callin her that.
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Jul 02, 2010 2:41:17 PM CDT
He said that her daughter got knocked up in the middle
by coughlins laws
of Yankees Stadium by A-Rod. I'm sorry, would that make her just a slut and not a whore?
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Jul 02, 2010 2:42:19 PM CDT
Coughlin doesn't seem to even understand what Letterman said...
by lenny nero
In re: the Palins. Were you one of the people protesting outside of the Ed Sullivan Theatre?
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for a five year 100 million dollar contract. I guess they really haven't learned anything from the past ten years.
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Letterman. Just keep in mind how little class you show when you laugh at sex jokes of the offspring of politicians who don't vote the way you do. It shows what kind of person you are...
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Jul 02, 2010 2:47:36 PM CDT
You're the one that doesn't seem to understand what Letterman
by coughlins laws
said. He said, "Did you see Sarah Palin with her daughter (the 14 year old) at Yankees Stadium today? She got knocked up by A-Rod during the 7th Inning Stretch." So, what did I not understand about that? A sleazy 62 year old pervert, who fucks interns 40 years younger than him, made a joke about Palin's 14 year old daughter getting impregnated by a 35 year old in front of 60,000 people. What don't I get?
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Jul 02, 2010 2:52:59 PM CDT
Seen people kick heroin quicker than Herc getting past "Coco"
by burnhollywood
...And I've seen hairdressers get over a spat quicker, too.
This is what happens when you don't have a mind for relevant politics...you start getting hung up on shit like the Leno/O'Brien affair, or watch AMERICAN IDOL... -
Seems to say more about you then the point you're trying to make about Letterman.
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get back to work. In summary, although I don't even really watch any Late Night anymore, Leno kicks everyone else's asses and he has for 17 years, Letterman is a 62 year old pervert and has regressed to being an insult comic, and Conan never paid his dues in the business and will never be a ratings success because he just doesn't look comfortable hosting a show...
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Jul 02, 2010 2:57:28 PM CDT
Really? That's interesting... I just read that Obama's
by coughlins laws
speeches are only at a seventh grade level while Bush's were at a ninth grade level for his eight years. I guess Obama has to dumb down so his voters will understand him...
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Watch next weeks Leno and Letterman monologues, compare and contrast. I guarantee there's just as much venom in Leno's, he's just doing it with his over the top lispy high pitched voice so it doesn't sound so mean. I would,but I think I'd probably die of boredom.
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It sucks, Jay Leno sucks, and The Tonight Show should have ended with Carson. There few unfunnier people than Jay Leno.
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Jul 02, 2010 2:59:28 PM CDT
BTW, I'm not a big Palin supporter. I hope to God she's
by coughlins laws
not the GOP nominee. However, that doesn't mean it should be open season on trashing her family...
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She's making too much money right now. Why would she give that up. I think she gets her political side out by rallying behind candidates she likes, and I'm guessing her Fox News show is making her some nice cash.
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cracking a joke and a personal attack...
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like Obama was for the Democrats, except hopefully someone a little more qualified for the job.
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in 2012, but now I don't. It's possible she could in 2016, but she would need to get elected to Congress or something. She's not gonna be able to rehabilitate her image among the masses by just appearing on FoxNews. I don't think she'll ever run for office again and she shouldn't...
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I've never thought Leno was funny, and haven't watched NBC since they screwed Conan. Unless they schedule the all nude Drew Barrymore show, I'll probably never watch NBC again.
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Jul 02, 2010 3:06:54 PM CDT
As long as it's not Romney or Huckabee, I'll be happy.
by coughlins laws
It's still too early to tell. We still don't know what's going to happen this midterm. It looks like Republicans will make huge gains but who knows. These Prez races start ridiculously early now...
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Have a talk show where every night it starts out with a different comedian doing a monologue, and then when inteview time comes, someone who is actually skilled at interviewing does that.
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Glad you finally bothered to look up that Letterman line after a few incorrect stabs at it. And Conan never paid his dues? He wrote for SNL and The Simpsons for several years before getting Late Night. It's not like they found the guy in the bottom of a Cracker Jack box or something. As for Leno, well, yeah, his ratings are better. He's the "mainstream"...and not generally appealing to the audience that this site tends to have. You're not gonna convince anyone here; try Entertainment Weekly's site or something.
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I swear everyone I know that voted in the Republican primary in '08 swears they voted for someone else. Sounds fishy to me.
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One minute you're saying that you recognize people have different tastes in comedy, and the next minute you are berating people who prefer Letterman because you are outraged over a joke that you considered to be too much (okay, Bristol Palin isn't a slut who got banged in front of 60,000 folks at Yankee Stadium - she's a teenaged slut who got knocked up by her boyfriend and then went around the country preaching about abstinence). For me the point is simple - I have watched both Leno and Letterman, and I think Letterman is much funnier than Leno. So I watch the Late Show and not the Tonight Show. End of story.
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Here you go: http://tinyurl.com/3yxfchs
He's no saint, to be sure, but he didn't call anyone's daughter a whore (in this case). -
in Iowa and New Hampshire get to decide who runs for President. By John McCain was considered safe and alot of primary voters vote for the guy who's turn it is. By the time the primaries came to my state, it was only McCain and Huckabee left. After South Carolina, almost all the other Republicans dropped out of the race.
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Jul 02, 2010 3:37:18 PM CDT
Battle_Royale, I'm tired of rehashing this, but seriously
by coughlins laws
if you're not calling someone that has sex with a stranger in front of 60,000 people a whore, what ARE you calling them? A virgin? I think you're splitting hairs...
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Sarah Palin went to the Yankee's game with Willow, the 14 year old. Bristol Palin wasn't even in New York City when Letterman made the joke. He apologized later because he thought he was calling the 18 year old (who wasn't there) a slut. He didn't realize that the way he said the joke made it a pedophilia joke. but like I said, if you think pedophilia jokes are funny, all the power to you...
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Jul 02, 2010 3:40:30 PM CDT
You've got such a hard on for the facts, Coughlin
by battle_royale_with_cheese
I'm just presenting the facts. He didn't use the word "whore". You did.
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Jul 02, 2010 3:47:44 PM CDT
Then what was he calling her, then? He said she did something
by coughlins laws
only a slut or a whore would do. Don't you think you're trying to be a little too cute for your own good here? The inference, what I was told by dozens of Palin haters back when this happened, is that it was funny BECAUSE they think the 18 year old (who wasn't even there) was a slut/whore. Isn't that why you think it's funny? Explain why it's funny, then.
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I think it's a weak joke. I'm just saying you said something that wasn't accurate. I'm sorry that you don't like it, but it's true...
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I'm sure you'll crow that you've won some kind of victory, Coughlin, and that's fine.
I just wanted to point out that you are, once again, full of shit. -
Jul 02, 2010 3:59:33 PM CDT
I don't claim any kind of victory. I just think it's sad
by coughlins laws
that you come to the defense of a sleazy 62 year old who fucks interns 40 years younger than him and is sexually obsessed with a politicians daughters. He says Palin looks like a "slutty flight attendant" and makes two sex jokes about her teenage daughters in one week. The only defense I heard was it wasn't a pedophilia joke about the 14 year old, he meant it to be just a slut joke about the 18 year old. And you're coming to his defense because you don't like the way Palin votes. I'm just saying, in 30 years, has he ever made sex jokes about another politician's teenage daughters? Why is he sexually obsessed with Palin? If you don't think it's creepy for a 62 year old pervert, who has sex with his employees that are decades younger than him, to make sexual jokes about a politician's family because he dislikes their policies, well, all the power to you. Just stay away from my kids...
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and he's a giant douche
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Jul 02, 2010 4:03:27 PM CDT
Yeah.....How about an ACTUAL WEEKLY talkback on Treme
by sauronthepowerful
Understood if you're mad at 24 and want to relegate them to breaking news only status, however, despite a couple of intermittant articles on Treme (sporadic at best) how about an actual weekly talkback.
Considerring the fact that it seems that you ACTUALLY LIKE that show..... -
Jul 02, 2010 4:06:13 PM CDT
For example.....(using your own arguement against you)
by sauronthepowerful
3 random, unrelated talkbacks in April and 1 in June hardly counts as weekly support for a show which you were so very high on in its initial run.....
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You're a douchebag. That is all.
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-if you think any older man in a position of power sleeping with someone on his staff is a "pervert", well then I hope you don't have ANY heros in political or professional life in the last century or 2. virtually EVERY rich, powerful dude has had a mistress. (this includes a litany of Republicans as well, who I am sure are heroes of yours) Letterman's situation is hardly unique and is certainly not particularly egregious. so get off the high horse on that one, please.
-the joke about Bristol was perhaps in bad taste, but the FACT remains, he thought he was making fun of Palin's older daughter, WHO ACTUALLY DID GET KNOCKED UP. as soon as he found out the other daughter was at the game, he apologized both on his show and in the press. even as someone who loathes Palin, I admit it was unfortunate, but it was still a simple mistake. if a candidate wants to make abstinence and family values an issue, and can't even control their underage daughter, well, that's hypocrisy. is it fair game for late night jokes? well, maybe, maybe not. but it was a quick-throwaway joke, as much about Alex Rodriguez' philandering as Bristol. it would have made ZERO news except for the fact that there was a mix up with Letterman's writers/researchers and it was Willow at the game and not Bristol. that's it. other than that, no story, and nothing for you to reference ad nauseum. (and please, if you have a reasonable response to that, fine. but don't go on and on with the "well, if you think raping 14 year old is funny, that's your thing" bullshit. thats 6th grade debate nonsense. don't waste my time.
-saying that who Johnny Carson wanted to replace him is irrelevant betrays a COMPLETE lack of understanding of the situation of his retirement. of course he didn't have the "final say" (otherwise, Letterman would have been the replacement) but his opinion carried a lot of weight.
-the fact that Leno has (in general) been a bit friendlier towards conservative politicians (or at least less mean) than Letterman, is, in my opinion, the real reason why you demonize Letterman and support Leno blindly, no matter what corner you paint yourself into. I wish you would just admit that.
-you wrote above: "I love how people like you can't just say that others have different tastes than you. You can't just say that people have different senses of humor."
-this is from your ranting in the "Louie" talkbacks: "I've seen alot of LouisCK's stand-up and he's just not that funny. He is very overrated. [...] He's just not great. His delivery is very droll and he's just not likable."
-I'm all for the talkback hyperbole, and treating your opinion as fact. lord knows you're not the only one that does it. but don't bitch and moan when someone pulls the same card on you, that's just sad.
-you are one of those people who can't accept that a lot of times, even if you WANT something to be true, doesn't make it ACTUALLY true. remember the night of the election? we were all here in the talkbacks, and it was virtually assured that Obama was going to win. EVERYONE knew it. even the people on here spouting racist, horrible hatred for Obama knew it. and who was the only one arguing that McCain was going to win? You, sir. You were absolutely convinced. You had maps, statistics, polls, etc. all spurious, of course, but they were undisputed in your eyes.
so did that experience teach you anything about accepting your own opinions as fact? even a little bit? -
Glad to hear that Leno is failing miserably..couldn't happen to a bigger fucking prick in Hollywood than this guy!
Every negative thing said about this jer/jerk-off is 100% true.
Leno? Just go away..your whiny voice-softball questions to celebs-car fetish-loving ass is annoying and reminds me of nails on a chaulkboard -
Keep feeding that conserva-troll humble pie.
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Jul 02, 2010 5:51:28 PM CDT
Palin joke bad one, Palin plays victim card gets sympathy and mi
by leo54304
as much as possible on facebook and everyone watches to see what happens on Letterman. He stretches it out for a couple nights before apologizing to get ratings. Everybody wins. Oh, when they put a cam on the street to show a handful of people protesting the whole incident was funny.
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I forgot the fucking Tonight Shit even exsisted.
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Jul 02, 2010 5:54:42 PM CDT
Palin was a speaker at a national bowling league conference,
by leo54304
I don't recall that a stepping stone for a presidential bid. She said she had fond memories of going to bowling leagues with her father in Iowa (I think). Problem is, when her dad was bowling in Iowa she was 4 months old.
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even though her church forbids drinking the stuff. That woman will speak almost anywhere for money it seems. You know, the adult entertainment industry has its annual convention in Vegas every year. Maybe they could pay her and speak at the national association of pole dancers. Say its a group for girls working their way thru college.
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She seemed nice. She said hi to me. But, I would never vote for her, lol.
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Is a funny motherfucker. Love that guy. His Russell Brand interview was good shit.
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"You're immature.""No YOU'RE immature.""Oh yeah, well YOU like Palin.""You laugh at sex jokes; clearly you have no class, you low-life Democrat."Blah blah blah. Coughlins Laws, you're an idiot for trying to pull the ol' "Letterman was talking about Palin's 14 year old daugher" trick. It doesn't do much for your case when you either A) didn't have you facts straight in the first place, or B) KNEW the facts about the situation (meaning which daughter was being referred to, which became common, accepted knowledge on all sides after the dust had settled) but said it anyway in hopes that no one would notice and that your clearly biased argument would be furthered. Either way, whatever credibility you were trying to establish went out the window with that one.And to everyone else automatically labeling someone as a "Palin lover" or a "far-right wing lunatic" just because someone exhibits a hint of conservatism... well, you're also idiots. As someone who is fairly middle-of-the-road, I can tell you that not only has someone here furthered the conservative stereotype of intentionally lying and distorting facts to alter public opinion and create dissent and phony outrage, but plenty have also pushed the liberal stereotype of demonizing and generalizing anyone who doesn't agree with them. I understand that Coughlins Laws' shameless disregard for facts seem to warrant such a response, but you have to understand that at the end of the day you're only feeding the whole phony idea of "crazy, immoral, immature liberals ganging up on the sane, moral, mature conservative". Anyway. I have nothing relevant to contribute to the Leno topic. Nothing whatsoever.
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You are utterly pathetic Herc.
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if only I had a time machine to go back to 1994, I might be interested.
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and Nightline beats the both. Maybe the lesson here is more news, less crappy old comedians.
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Gov. Palin announced over the weekend that her 17-year-old unmarried daughter is five months pregnant. And you thought John Edwards was in trouble before! Now he has really done it.
- Jay Leno, on September 2, 2008
You are hearby pwned. -
I wish you were a girl, I would fuck you.
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Thank you, thank you, thank you. I was so wanting to throw that quote at Coughlin. The hypocrisy is unbelievable - the only reason Palin went after Letterman is because she knows he leans left and was trying to tie his hands from making jokes about her or indeed anybody on the right. It was the kind of "Gotcha" bullshit and intimidation that Rove and the Bush administration perfected over 8 years.
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This self-serving prick deserves all the misfortune coming his way.
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Jul 02, 2010 11:47:56 PM CDT
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
by digitalbeachwar
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Karma is a bitch?
So, karma dictates that if one millionaire hates being ousted by another millionaire and then takes back his job from that said millionaire that both millionaires will continue to have TV shows? And that the first millionaire will STILL be #1?
Karma sounds great. Piss people off and still be the most-watched host on late-night television.
Not sure where the downside is. All the people bitching about Leno didn't like him or watch him in the first place.
Karma, indeed.
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Jul 03, 2010 1:19:06 AM CDT
Plug the BP leak with Palin's inflated sense of self-importance.
by soupback
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Coughlins Laws a thing or two in your July 2 4:22 PM post. Well said, very well done. I think you're completely right about Coughlins.
It boggles my mind how anyone can defend someone like Palin so avidly as they do/did. How could they think McCain was going to win on election night? Delusional.
We dodged a major bullet by Obama winning. Palin a hearbeat away from the Oval Office scared me to death (and I'm a moderate Republican... one who couldn't stomach McCain and so voted for Obama). -
TBS is about a step away from the Home Shopping Channel.
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but I find most of his interviews tend to be extremely awkward and uncomfortable.
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How is Letterman a pervert? So what if the woman was in her 20's and he in his 60's? Seriously. She was a consenting adult wasn't she? What he and she chose to do together then was and is none of our business.
About Letterman's joke you are overly obsessed with (to have such rage about it after so much time has passed, I don't get it)... I always took the joke as more of a slam on A-Rod than Palin's daughter (about A-Rod's loose ways). And where do you get that they "did it" in front of the stadium of people? In my mind the supposed event in the joke took place in the locker room in private. I never imagined it out on the field like you have.
Why is anyone engaging in sexual acts apparently a pervert or a slut to you? That's how it seems to me.
And it boggles my mind how anyone can worship Palin so much. I've voted straight Republican all my life but could never bring myself to stand behind Palin. And no it wasn't because she's a woman (I supported and wanted Elizabeth Dole to become President in 2000 instead of Bush). It's because of her HORRID stance on wolf killing, totally un-necessary wolf killing (heaven forbid the elk hunters have a few less elk to shoot each year... oh no, we can't have that now can we?). Also her horrid stance on endangered animals, putting oil and the mighty dollar over living animals and her POOR environmental stances. Then she can't even finish the job, she quits mid-term. How could anyone want to elect that into the White House?? When things got too tough we'd have a President who quits.
I never did like McCain in years past... so I didn't want to vote for him already, but when he makes a radical choice and picks Palin instead of a sensible safe choice of Romney... that was the nail in the coffin. I became an "Obamican" (a Republican voting for Obama).
I pray to God neither Palin or Huckabee gets the nomination. She's scary and he's the biggest snake there is. Nominate her and you hand the election to Obama. And I doubt very much that Huckabee could win either. I don't think ANY current Republican star can beat Obama (though this time the election will be much closer, Obama will barely win is my prediction). Of anyone, I think Romney stands the best chance... but Romney's best shot at being President is after Obama, in 2016. Assuming that Hillary doesn't decide to run again in 2016 that is. -
... in my last reply in this thread. I tried to make it separate paragraphs like others have. How do you do that? Really, I don't know. I even hit return 3 times after each paragraph, but instead it still blended all into a giant lump.
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Jul 03, 2010 2:29:07 AM CDT
NBC fucked up big time by doing what they did to conan
by heisenbergsbluesky
he got nothing but goodwill and 2 of the funniest weeks of television out of this.leno is old he will retire soon meanwhile conan could've been around a good 15 or 20 years.zucker shit the money bed
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I can imagine he moved like the road runner in the cartoons he ran so fast to his computer to post this story. He was probably standing up talking to somebody, heard this news and the next second there was a puff of smoke and a 'vooosh!' noise as he ran to the PC to post this story. All the while there was this big, goofy grin on his face as he was typing this up. Must have been a very good day for him.
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Actually read the article. I had assumed that by the tone of the subject and the urgency in Herc's posting, Letterman was now winning. But he's actually still getting beat by Leno?? How can this be? Man, I didn't realize Letterman was in such a hole! I figured he woulda been kicking Jay's ass by now.
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CBS should fire Dave and hire Conan.
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and he will be as bad as SNL. Even when I work late, I'd rather watch reruns of something on SyFY or Tv land than Leno. I'm at the point where even the 1st year of St-TNG is funnier and more entertaining than Leno.
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... or dies, whichever comes first.
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is that Korea makes really inexpensive Nike knockoffs.
Everything else is just playground shoving -
No amount of comments or begging can override Herc's sycophantic nature...
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Bobcat Goldthwait setting a chair on fire(that's the only one to spring to mind)
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but without the spaces between the characters.If you simply want to do a line break,
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NBC isn't getting rid of "The Tonight Show". What they will do in the future is have an older host with a shorter contract and a tighter leash. There are something like 43 late-night talk shows, it seems. People seem to love this tired old schitck. So, I doubt it will go anywhere..especially not on NBC, where they are still #1, despite these stupid threads that seem to want to tout otherwise.
I'd love to see Conan change things up at TBS, but I have a feeling it will be business as usual. I find it hilarious when people say he's going to kick everyone's ass. Do you really believe that? Sure, his numbers will be big in the beginning. But then what?
When Conan succeeds, it's always because he's so great. When he fails, it's because of someone else. That's how it's been played out now for months. We heard how everyone else was to blame for why Conan's numbers sucked.
Well, everyone was so pissed that Conan had a bad "Lead-In" (excuse me while I puke that people still believe in that dated old myth) with Leno's shitty 10pm debacle. Well, Leno was ALWAYS Conan's lead-in.
Yet no one seems to talk about "lead-ins" now with Conan's new show. His "lead-in" now will be Tyler Perry shows and re-runs of "Family Guy", both of which draw way less numbers than Leno's shit show. What then?
I think it'd be great if Conan hit #1. I just don't see it happening. And we all like to pretend that his "Tonight Show" failed because of everyone else. But isn't it just possible that it failed because his own fans didn't tune in to watch it? He lost 40% of viewers before Leno's shit took the air. How is that Leno's fault?
And please don't try to apply 1993 numbers or logic to the scenario, and please don't try to quote that biased source "The Late Shift" as if it's an encyclopedia or something. I have no dog in this race...I'm actually curious. I've been watching this for months, and what I see is Leno hate from people who don't watch Leno and haven't for years...and praise for Conan and how he can do no wrong and all of his failures are somehow because of someone else.
But, honestly, when you get down to it...wasn't the biggest mistake NBC? And wasn't it really that they forced out the guy who didn't want to leave in the first place?
And, honestly, Leno should have just done a weekly variety show. A "Dean Martin" type gig or something...rather than just "The Tonight Show" at 10pm. Isn't that what we were told was going to happen in the first place? Whatever happened to THAT idea?
And aren't there too many goddamned talk shows?! -
no matter how many of these ratings articles are put up dipshit.
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We've hurt him. And we wish to go on hurting him. We shall leave Leno as he left Conan, as you left Andy; marooned for all eternity in the center of a lame network... buried alive! Buried alive...!
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his show airs at 11:30 and they're in bed by 8.
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i've skimmed these talkbacks and you all are wasting your fucking time... because Herc keeps posting these talkbacks, doing what he does best--putting his onw slant on the issue--over and over, and as a result, everyone here says the same thing over and over... get the fuck over it... besides, this is AINTITCOOL NEWS.. wasn't this site created for the geek/genre stuff? There is nothing "cool" about any of all this. Herc could have created 1,000,000 talkbacks about things worth discussing in the time he has taken to beat this dead horse...
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this is what you get for fucking johnny, you unfunny hack....
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An uneducated, elderly corpse.
die already, and give me your motos. -
No? Then I don't care.
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...now include two shows about losing weight, three Law and Orders, The Marriage Ref, three hours a week of America's Got Talent and a show where barracudas work for a bloated sperm whale? Damn it!
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He needs to eat shit and die. Conan is a genius and Leno will never hold a candle to him. Leno is a douchebag.
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long live the CONAN!
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He came off cold and arrogant.
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Here's why Leno is bombing. The viewers went through a long build up to 2009. Where Conan would replace Leno. It prepared us for the end of Leno. Yeah in the back of our minds we knew about the 10pm Lenoshow, but since Leno said it would be different from the Tonight Show. We didn't take it too seriously. The 5 year focus was on Leno stepping down and giving Conan the crown to the Tonight Show. At the same time. Leno gave the impression he was getting on in years and was winding down. He did his farewell Tonight show. So subcontinental in our minds. Whether we knew it or not. We felt a change in the guards was coming and it was for good. We closed the book on Leno. Now Conan was on top of the mountain. A new era had come. Then suddenly out of no where. It was taken away away from Conan. Hey Leno is back! Forget that 5 year build up. Leno again! It's kind of like passing the 9th grade and then they tell you that you have to repeat it again. It's like if Oprah now said, hey I was kidding. 20 more years of Oprah! What? Oprah you built us up for the end, now you're back for good? We prepared ourselves. We closed the book on you. We're done with you Oprah. That's Leno right now. It feels wrong that he's still on the air hosting the Tonight Show. I just don't watch it. Leno is dead to me. I closed that book on him long time ago. I don't think I'm alone in feeling this way.
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Crazy rumor I heard the other day....comedian George Lopez has a talk show! I know, crazy huh? Apparently he hosts a talk show of some kind on TBS or something. You'd never know since nobody ever talks about it, you never hear anything about it and I think it has an rating of -3 or something. If anybody can confirm this or simply label it urban myth I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
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Is what we like to refer to as poetic justice.
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http://img.timeinc.net/time/magazine/archive/covers/2005/1101050829_400.jpg
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As pissed as George Lopez might be that his show has been bumped back and hour, he at least has to admit Conan taking over his timeslot has been good publicity for him. Before it was announced that Conan would be Lopez's lead in, how many even know Lopez had a talk show, let alone had seen it? He and his until-now unheard of show have been getting a good amount of exposure, which will only increase once O'brien starts his show.
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They'll bump him back and let him linger for while (while still getting crappy ratings) just to avoid the inevitable charges of "racism," then cancel him.
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And Wanda Sykes? Yikes. Who thought that bitch would make a good host?
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"WHEN WE WERE KIDS!!! WE DIDN'T HAVE CELL PHONES!!! NO!!! MY COUSIN PACO AND I USED CANS!!!" Ahh my ears!
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But if you want to see who ended up looking darn good then take a look at the red headed dude.It never mattered to me who won or who has better ratings or deserves a show. It mattered who had the better class.Think about it. What will you remember about each of the players involved. I know who I respect when the dust settles. Pretty easy call.
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sitcom being cancelled? He cried the race card.I explained to him that it wasn't personal. His show just was terrible.
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I don't know. I think years from now I won't necessarily remember it this debacle as "Leno screwed Conan". I think it will be more "Conan had the show but his own fans didn't even tune in and watch. Then, when his show was canceled, they all bitched and whined like babies about it and acted as if they were huge supporters when they couldn't be bothered to watch him on TV. They complained about how he wasn't being treated fairly when they hadn't even bothered to watch his show and were the biggest reason it failed. Then, when he got a new show on basic cable, they praised it for the exact same reasons they vehemently screamed and complained about NBC."
And I'll remember "Leno kept doing the same show I wasn't watching in the first place, just like Letterman kept doing the show I wasn't watching in the first place...and instead of complaining about who is funnier, I admitted that I don't watch any of these shows...just like most of the people complaining about it in the first place. Because, if we did, they'd have bigger ratings than they do." -
We also keep overlooking the fact that the biggest mistake made here in the first place was when NBC tried to force out the guy who was (and is again) the #1 late-night host. The man simply wasn't ready to retire. And he doesn't "owe" anyone a retirement if he doesn't want to take it. And, if he's at #1 again, obviously a majority of late-night viewers are okay with that.
Maybe, instead, there should have been another, better way to placate Conan when he said he wanted "The Tonight Show" in 5 years or he'd walk. NBC's first mistake was cowtowing to the wrong guy, it seems.
And, again, I say this with no favoritism. I honestly don't watch any of the shows. But I've been watching everyone scream and bitch about it while simply sitting back and doing the math. Counting the numbers. In the end, the math seems to say that NBC has made a shitload of mistakes...but the first one came about six years ago when they started pushing out the guy who simply wasn't ready to leave yet. -
It just didn't equal the same amount as regular Tonight Show viewers. It equaled the same amount as Conan's late night viewers. Which was always far below the Tonight show viewers. We had to get the old people on board. The Leno viewers. They never gave Conan the time to grow and get those same Leno viewers.
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Leno is back at #1, Letterman is still at #2, and Conan is going where he belonged in the first place... basic cable hell. What did we learn? Just because you're shrewd enough to negotiate your way into a job, doesn't mean you are actually qualified to be there!
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NBC did not invest in Conan going to 11:30pm because they thought he would "build an audience". They thought that people would STAY there. There was no "building an audience" that needed to be done. Conan was on TV for 16 years before he took over...he was already a household name with primetime specials and DVD sales. He didn't fail to BUILD anything...he LOST what was there.
Now, if Conan's numbers had started low and slowly been growing, then NBC might have stuck it out. As it turns out, Conan LOST the audience that was tuning in from the beginning. Before Leno's shit-show took the air last fall, Conan's show had already lost 40% of its viewers. 40%. I still wait for people to tell me how that is Leno's fault. After Leno came on board, it fell another 20%. But the damage was already done.
The numbers simply don't add up in favor of "Team Coco". It's 2010. People do not watch the same network for 4 hours (which is why the "lead-in" myth is bullshit), nor do they need to "Find" a guy that has been on TV for nearly 2 decades a mere hour later. When all those people tuned out Conan on "The Tonight Show", it had nothing to do with the local news or not "Finding" him. They simply didn't want to watch him and so they went elsewhere.
Otherwise, Letterman would always be #1, because America loves to watch CBS. Including the same tired old people who love to watch Leno.
Look on Avery site. People cheering on Ferguson. No one here claims they watch Ferguson because they watch "CSI" or even because they watch "Letterman". People find the host they want and follow that host. What sucks is the fact that people can't seem to accept the fact that a majority of Americans choose Leno.
And of course numbers do not equate quality or taste. Top ratings doesn't mean something is the top show. But, in the network TV world, the guy with the #1 ratings is going to be the guy who keeps his job. Period. The guy who slips to #3 isn't "owed" anything...despite what we'd like to feel they should be doing for us.
In the end, we all actually won. Everyone got his own late-night show and now every single night we are left with waaaaay too much celebrity yapping on TV.
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I'm not sure how NBC didn't give Conan "Time to grow", considering they gave him a TV show for 16 years.
If any other host had lost 40% of the viewers in the first few months, BEFORE Leno's show took the air, he would have been canceled by October. Conan wasn't even canceled. He was given a choice that he hated and chose to walk. NBC never fired him.
It's not 1993 anymore and TV shows don't slowly build their audiences. We see it here all the time. How many shows are we all fans of that are canceled too soon because the money dictates that networks won't wait around for an audience to find it's way to a show? Late night is no different.
And I'm not sure a network should be expected to lose money on something that has made a profit for 50 years while watching the ratings fall simply because the people who ARE watching think it's unfair that more people aren't.
The entire reason for putting a known name in the position of hosting "The Tonight Show" is so the audience is there in the beginning, not accumulated later. Was it different when Leno took over? Sure. But that was 1993. It just doesn't work that way anymore.
In 2010, "The X-Files" would've been canceled after 13 episodes.
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when it comes to attracting viewers these days, I do think it matters more for late night. Casual viewers, those that tune in depending on who the guest is, are the ones the network relies on lead-ins. Ads during those shows inform, or remind, the viewer that "Tonight, Conan's guests are..." The fewer people that see those promos, the fewer that are enticed to catch the show. The ratings difference most likely wouldn't have saved Conan's job, but a strong lead-in would have made a certain amount of difference.
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sure is alot of butthurt dorks in here making new nics over, and over, and over...
Its just late nite. And if you cant clearly see that leno is a retarded teleprompter reading hackjob...
I think you may be full-on handicapped.
btw coughlins, 1/10 for the trolling attempts, get out of your stankass bedroom every so often. -
Jul 05, 2010 9:32:54 AM CDT
Could it be that perhaps the late night format is too old?
by ricarleite2
It's a 50 year old format, and while it worked very well during Carson's years, perhaps today's world and today's audiences doesn't appreciate this sort of show anymore. I know I don't. Maybe we need something new.
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I've been saying all along that the format is dated and something new is needed. Do we really need 8 different versions of the same type of show all competing against each other in late-night? Surely there are other options to pursue that are just as cheap to produce.
And no, orionsangels, I'm not a "Team NBC" person. As usual, it seems that, if a person doesn't kneel and suck O'Brien cock, that that person is deemed a Leno fan or a backer of all things NBC. But that's not the case. I've said numerous times that NBC made nothing but bad mistakes. I've also said that Leno made stupid mistakes from day one, and shouldn't have put his 10pm debacle on the air. Just because I don't let the numbers get clouded by my own misguided sense of loyalty to a talk show host (mostly because it's trendy right now to do so) doesn't make me a supporter of a different talk show host. Sorry that I let facts and numbers and ratings get in the way of people blindly stroking their love for Conan. -
It was a very good theory about why Conan's loss of less than 20% of his viewers can be blamed on someone else. Sure. I can see that.
I still have yet to hear anyone tell me how Conan losing 40% of his viewers before Leno's 10pm show debuted is somehow anyone's fault but his own.
...And why no one has argued lead-ins until now. I do notice that, if Leno's numbers dip, everyone jumps to say it's because everyone MUST hate Leno and that it just shows how terrible he is and that HIS lead-in numbers obviously have nothing to do with his success or failure. We don't even TALK about Leno's lead-ins...and NEVER have...for over 16 years. I notice the exact same thing in regards to Letterman. When Letterman succeeds, it's all because of HIM an his brilliance. But if Leno succeeds, it's pure luck or because people are stupid, or because of one guest he had in 1994, etc. etc.
I don't care if people hate Leno. I can't tell you how funny he is or is not because, I've admitted, I haven't watched any of them in years. But at least I say so. Half the people here who bash any host follow it up with "I haven't watched him in years". Then how would you know if he's funny or not?
I'm not a fan of hypocrisy. Nor am I a fan of people who blindly parrot for a celebrity. I've criticized both NBC and Leno numerous times...yet the Conan fans never seem to admit that Conan made his own share of mistakes and stupid decisions and, in the end, lost a majority of his viewers on his own, with no blame to go to Leno or how awful 10pm was treating him.
If Conan, however, only lost his viewers after Leno's 10pm clusterfuck, and managed to be in the #1 overall slot while he was on that show, I'd gladly denounce each and every other talk show host there is. I'd be right there saying "Why is Leno coming back if the #1 host is doing so well?" I'd say "Leno failed at 10pm, why should he be awarded Conan's show when Conan is rocking it?"
But that didn't happen. And all I see now is people trying to compare 1993 to 2010 and pretending things don't work that way. And people citing an old, biased book/TV movie...and people going on and on about numbers they like while ignoring the ones they do not. In the end, it reeks of "My guy lost and I don't like that, so waaaaaaah! I'm going to insult everyone for not being just like ME!" Which is HILARIOUS considering it's the same thing we always criticize political hacks for doing.
To see people on here insulting the general public because their guy lost? It's laughable. It's like when a comedian fails and says "The crowd didn't GET me". Maybe they got you but didn't think you were funny. Maybe...just maybe...they don't like you.
When someone DOES say on this site that they are a fan of Leno's, everyone attacks that person. Not just "He's not my thing" or "I don't see how you like him, but fine" or even "You're crazy for liking him". No, the insults are of the typical, pussy internet variety, with assumptions about that person's intelligence or political leanings, or age, etc. I've said numerous times that I'm not a follower of ANY late-night show or host. But the way the Conan fans ACT is what makes me go on the defensive against him.
And it's only a matter of time before this happens again. When Conan debuts in the fall, Herc will likely post some other article, whether Conan actually dominates the ratings or not, touting the triumph of it...or just find another way to lie about how Leno is doing. And people here will go back into "Fuck Leno" mode and insult anyone who simply says they don't care for Conan. Or people like me who couldn't care less for any of them and just looks at the numbers and talks about that. -
I've tried to watch it at least 4 times, and each time I cringe by how bad it is. His interview with Roger Waters elevated him to new heights of suckdom.
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that 'leno' is a back-stabbing asshole. sorry
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You sure have a lot to say for a guy who doesn't really care. Sure, you don't care.... Sure. Just because your whole argument is that Conan fucked up in some imaginary way, that doesn't mean you're Team Leno. Not at all. I don't get what "mistakes" Conan made. He was funny as hell, did his show as he wanted...except for when they asked him to "tone it down". So is it HIS mistake because he did what they told him to do? What was his mistake? Pray tell, clue us all in. Maybe it was that he assumed they would keep their word and GIVE HIM MORE THAN SEVEN MONTHS TO BUILD MORE AUDIENCE. I guess that was really unreasonable of him. I'm sorry...you are pathetically excusing NBC and Leno.
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innit?
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Why do I care what some anonymous guy online thinks about me? I'm positive that, if we put our credentials up against one another, you'd stand there like a sad sack compared to me. I meet novices like you all the time. It means nothing to me.
So think of me as a Leno fan, if you like. Knock yourself out. There you go. Now your life will be complete, right? Now you can say that you one-uppped a guy online today. Oh, congrats! You must be so proud.
I'd just as soon be a Leno fan than be living in denial like so many Conan fans these days. What did Conan do wrong? Well, in regards to his show? Pretty much nothing. It just turns out that he misjudged America and that people didn't really want him in that slot as much as he thought. SO, maybe, his first mistake was bullying NBC into forcing Leno into retirement in the first place. Because, as all of you Conan fans now see, no one was ready for that but Conan's die-hard fans. Everyone else turned away. I know it hurts to see the reality that a majority of people would prefer some guy to the guy YOU prefer...but that's the reality. Now I'm sure you'll grumble about how Leno fans are (insert generic personal attack here based on TV preference)...but that only proves my point.
Dry your tears. All will be well this fall. You can snuggle up at night and watch Conan on TBS...then come on here and whine about NBC some more. You know, that network that was somehow supposed to bleed money for Conan because that's supposedly how things worked in 1993? They ought to still work that way, right? Well, they don't. And I don't know ANY business, TV or otherwise, that would lose money and think they owed it to someone to keep losing money in the hopes that somehow things would change.
I guess at your job people are allowed to fail for seven straight months, despite doing essentially the same job for 16 years before that, huh? Must be nice.
So, there you go, kiddo. Call me a Leno fan. Still doesn't change the fact that you're wrong, have nothing to support any of your arguments (which are just "here's what I WISH would happen" assumptions), and every shred of research on the matter supports what I've been saying. And, again, your boy lost his own audience. If he didn't want his show "watered down", he had no business taking over "The Tonight Show". Wasn't his reasoning all about it's legacy? If so, he should've known from the start they'd clip his wings. And they still didn't FIRE him! They offered him a half hour later. He probably would've been saved if he'd done that. But he went on about the "legacy" of the show and how it shouldn't be on at 12am. Well, the legacy of that show is that it caters to middle-America...not angry hipsters online who take to the message boards when they don't get what they want.
Last Conan said on the matter, he said the show is bigger than the host. So, if he was "watered down", buddy, maybe the problem was never anything other than it was a show he didn't need to be on. You should be happy that he realized that and left, because I imagine TBS will let him do anything he wants. If he wins the ratings (and not just for a week or month), then I'll come on here and say I was wrong. I have absolutely NO problem with that. In fact, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong. If, however, he comes in third place (or even fourth) behind the other shows, I'd like to see the people touting "Team Conan" to simply admit he's not as popular as they wish he were. -
We are, again, in agreement. I've been saying all along that it's a dated format whose time has likely come.
And to Rebeck again, let me say this: I remember Conan's last broadcast. He said that he hates cynicism and for people not to be cynical.
Well, I'm not cynical. I'm merely quoting numbers and stating facts. The fact that you make your snide assumptions and remarks is ironic to me, given that your boy Conan would much rather sit and have coffee with me than he ever will with someone like you. -
"I'm positive that, if we put our credentials up against one another, you'd stand there like a sad sack compared to me. I meet novices like you all the time. It means nothing to me."that might be the saddest thing I've ever read in a talkback. this has to be Coughlin's Laws, doesn't it? I mean, after my post, and the Leno quote about Palin's daughter, there's no way he can show his face in this talkback, right? and the guy's name is "TheRevenge". I mean...seriously.
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Just a guy who knows more about what he's talking about than the guy trying to insult him.
I've been watching these talkbacks for years before I started posting. I always see the same thing: Internet guys making personal attacks at each other and then acting surprised when someone turns around and offers them a little spanking right back with their own rhetoric.
Instead of saying "wow" at me, you should be asking yourself why you didn't say that at Rebeck, who came at me FIRST. But I suppose it's not fun that way...especially not if that guy agrees with you.
I simply pointed out that I'm fairly certain I know more about that which I speak than he does. In the real world, people do that.
If it makes you feel any better, I completely agree with you about the Leno/Palin thing. I honestly tuned out of this talkback whenever it turned in that direction. I just wanted to talk ratings. -
Leno's key demo fizzled out thanks to the inevitability of death and the poor sanitation in American retirement homes.
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You seem to know a lot about this subject. That's wonderful... wonderful if you're playing fair, but I'm not playing fair. I've never liked Leno and I hope and pray he fails! At the same time. I'm a loyal Conan supporter. So It's pretty obvious by now. There's no reasoning with me. I don't care about the details. So save your typing. I say down with Leno!!!!!
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maybe his guests suck.
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...Karma in action! Suck it Jay!
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...Carlos Mencia! A friend of mine hosted a show in Kuwait for the troops with Mencia a few years back. She showed me a video of it on YouTube and I was like, "Geez too bad for that guy what with Conan taking his time slot this fall" She said, no, that's George Lopez who has the talk show on TBS, not Carlos Mencia. It's like, "Damn sorry... two chubby, unfunny Latino dudes, they're like separated conjoined twins or something..."
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Jul 06, 2010 10:56:12 AM CDT
Hey, Leno-haters, go to the Hate Site Huffington Post
by coughlins laws
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Jul 06, 2010 10:59:51 AM CDT
At HPost, there's an article about killing Leno. Right up
by coughlins laws
And no, I don't love Palin. I have no plans to vote for her for anything and I don't want her to run for President. However, Letterman was clearly obsessed with Palin and her daughters. If that's your sort of thing, fine. Laugh all day. You have to admit that Letterman is a pervert, though...
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an employer having sex with an employee 40 years younger than him? An intern (still a child, barely out of college) Really? I hope I never meet someone as sleazy as you. I don't want to know you. As far as Romney running in 2016 after Obama, really? You honestly think the failure Obama is going to win in 2012? Really? That's funnier than anything Letterman's said in years...
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Jul 06, 2010 11:09:41 AM CDT
First of all, if Jay said that, it was clearly about the
by coughlins laws
older daughter and not the 14 year old, making it NOT a pedophile joke like Letterman told. Second of all, it was topical, a joke RIGHT AFTER it happened, not dozens of jokes a year later. Third of all, Leno doesn't call Palin a slut and continue to bring up Palin and her daughters in a sex joke at least once a week, like Letterman did. Forth of all, I am NOT a Palin fan. I admire her for her accomplishments, but I DON'T want her to be President and I won't vote for her in a primary. I don't think she'd make a good President. However, she's STILL more qualified than the guy in there right now...
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NBC's ass for years, ever since Seinfeld, Friends, and Frazier have been gone. However, Leno STILL destroyed Letterman in the ratings, and he beats Letterman now, even though CBS is the Number One Network and NBC is in Forth Place. It's bullshit. Lead-ins mattered alot more 20, 30 years ago when people didn't use remote controls and there were only 13 channels. But now, there are 500 channels, there are DVRs, there is local news for a half hour after the networks shows are over, etc, etc, etc. Letterman has ZERO EXCUSE to be losing to Leno at this point, especially with the beating Leno took in the press the last year. Letterman is the CLEAR LOSER in all of this. Why do so many of you take it so personally?
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...you think two people in a consenting adult relationship is perverted? Sounds like you've got some personal hang-ups of your own that you have yet to overcome.As for 2012, I've yet to see a Republican "leader" step forth in any sort of capacity that would give Obama a worthy opponent in the next election. And if you still think Palin is more qualified than our current President of the United States, then you've got even worse issues than we've all suspected.
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No, I think the real question is, "Why do YOU take it so personally?" Because it clearly has nothing to do with comedy/humor but it has everything to do with perceived political viewpoints. Your continued hammering of these Leno-related Talkbacks is quite extraordinary. The tenacity is as unbelievable as it is bizarre.
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I, unlike some of you, apparently, have a life and was busy this Holiday weekend and when I came back on this talkback saw that once again, alot of people wanted to gang up on me. Well, I din't run away and I wasn't "pwned" (I really question the manhood of anyone that uses this quasi-word). If anyone wants to continue this discussion, I'm right here for awhile...
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Jul 06, 2010 11:32:31 AM CDT
It's NOT just 2 consenting adults, it's and Employer/Employee
by coughlins laws
situation. Most companies don't allow this and most sexual harrassment lawsuits stem from Employers, who have a position of power, pressuring an employee into sexual situtations. It has nothing to do with politics. Do you honestly believe that Leno votes Republican? Of course he doesn't. He said in an interview that he reads Mother Jones magazine (very Left Wing Mag). It has nothing to do with politics.
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time. Watch any interview he does with a politician or news person. It's not really a comedy show any more when he inteviews. He personally insults and takes cheap shots at political enemies.
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Way to state the obvious. So, at worst, it's a questionable professional judgment. But it is something that happens everyday in the American (hell, global) workplace. That doesn't make it perverted.And I wasn't talking about Leno's politics. I was talking about YOURS and why you constantly attack Letterman (who you view as an evil Liberal).
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Jul 06, 2010 11:49:20 AM CDT
Mr. Nice Gaius, just about any Republican can beat Obama
by coughlins laws
He's going to be extremely easy to run against. He already has a really long list of lies/broken promises and he's been a failure at just about everything. His stimulus was a colossal failure, unemployment is hovering around 10% ever since he got in, he passed the EXTREMELY unpopular Health Care overhaul that the majority of Americans want overturned, he's showed an epically sad lack of leadership in getting the Gulf Oil Spill under control and cleaned up, and he's exploded the deficit, adding more in his first 2 years than Bush did in 8 to the National Debt, and will have added more than every President in history combined by the time he's done in 8 years (if he actually won a second term). The funny thing is (if it weren't so sad) is how guys like Michael Moore cried about Bush taking vacation and golfing, and Obama has golfed more times in 18 months than Bush did in 8 years. I think that any of the following can and will beat Obama: Romney, Huckabee, Giuliani, Pawlentey, Gingrich, even John Thune... Obama can give a good speech (even though it was really only one speech he gave over and over again), but now he has a record of horrible governing and a visible inability to make decisions behind him...
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Yep, that's what some comedians do. Especially when they choose to honestly address idiocy and bullshit.As for Letterman's interviews, he's always been known for combative as well as thoughtful and engaging conversations. That's why he's been long considered as the best interviewer in late night programming.
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almost right out of high school when you're a 62 year old man? If you were 40 years old and your daughter just graduated from high school, got an internship at a Late Night Show, and was getting fucked by the married 62 year old boss, you'd be fine with that? Really?
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Jul 06, 2010 11:55:42 AM CDT
No, that's why Letterman has lost audience and people
by coughlins laws
think he's mean. He doesn't even make jokes or tries to be funny. Alot of times he just makes personal attacks. I've seen him do it. Sometimes he doesn't even try to make a joke.
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But I'm glad to see that you've got all your talking points lined up.BTW - did you even see thound3's post at Jul 2nd, 2010
10:20:40 PM? We're all still waiting for your outrage. -
Jul 06, 2010 11:59:39 AM CDT
Mr. Nice Gaius, alot of things happen every day, that
by coughlins laws
doesn't make it right. Murders, rapes, DWI's, incest, etc, etc, etc, happen multiple times every day. what I'm saying is if you do what Letterman did, you are at the very least very creepy, if not a perverted, sexual predator...
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That's about as disingenious a statement as you can make...and you know it is. You're tweaking the details of their relationship to make it sound more salacious than it was.And Letterman has ALWAYS been a crank. So, I don't care if you think he's "mean" (especially when he is calling bullshit). There is no stipulation that says he has to be Captain Fake Smile on every topic and individual. If you don't like it, change the station.
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Jul 06, 2010 12:04:09 PM CDT
I responded to that. Can you NOT read? Do you even read
by coughlins laws
my posts or do you just instinctively attack me?
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Jul 06, 2010 12:05:32 PM CDT
I DO change the channel, like most Late Night viewers
by coughlins laws
That's the point. He's not likable anymore...
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Bullshit. And there was nothing about their relationship that even comes close to that list of offenses you put there. Way to oversell your disapproval of age gap. Good lord.
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You're just so contemptible it boggles the mind. Although, we did agree on the disappointment of LOST. At least we'll always have that...
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Jul 06, 2010 12:13:33 PM CDT
You don't know that. When a man has that kind of power
by coughlins laws
he could pressure a young girl into a sexual relationship. Apparently you don't know that for most sex offenders it's NOT about the sex, it's about power. I'm not insinuating anything. But when you have a powerful multi-millionaire make sexual advances on a college age girl, it's all about power and intimidation. You can't look me in the eye and tell me with 100% certainty that every employee conquest he had was totally consensual and NONE of them felt ANY pressure. Some of them were only a couple of years over the age of consent...
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on me, simply because I disagree with you. You even admit you don't even really read what I write, you just like to make assumptions and personally attack me. Typical...
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Jul 06, 2010 12:25:36 PM CDT
Definition of perverted: 1. changed to or being of an
by coughlins laws
unnatural or abnormal kind 2. turned from what is right; misguided; distorted 3. affected with or caused by perversion perversion: 1. to lead astray morally 2. to turn away from the right course 3. to turn to an improper use 4. to bring to a less excellent state; debase The point is, most of society sees whats wrong when a 62 year old married man has sexual relations with college age girls in his work place. From the 40 year old age difference, to the fact that the girls just barely stopped being teenagers, to the fact that the 62 year old is taking advantage of his position of authority, it's NOT normal behaviour and it rightly should be looked down upon...
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The stench of fail in this talkback is suffocating. How you guys can stomach interacting with Douchimous Maximus aka C-Lawls for this long literally boggles my mind. I have trouble imagining how much of an asshole someone has to be to dedicate their every waking moment to defending a backstabbing, unfunny hack like Leno, but I really don't understand how you guys can keep thoughtfully responding to such inane BS as if he's going to magically become a thinking person after the millionth time being scientifically and inarguably shown to be a complete douche. You may as well argue with that shoe-spam guy, for all the good it does. And MNG, I almost feel like an intervention for you is in order. Don't gaze into the stupidity abyss for too long! -
I'm not sure how Conan is going to beat anyone in the ratings on basic cable when he couldn't do so on a major network and on the most famous talk show in history.
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Didn't you predict McCain to win in the face of all evidence to the contrary? And you are now predicting that just about any Republican can beat Obama? Yippeeeeee!!!!! Obama will win again - I'm so happy!
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as usual, I saw you completely ignored my post about you, as you normally do. it's easier to go back and forth with people yelling at you than to respond to a reasoned critique of your comments and views. I get that. but you are always whining about personal attacks, and when someone writes something in response to claims you've made, you ignore it. kinda sad, isn't it?you were VERY convinced that McCain was going to win, even when it was obvious that he had no chance. so if you're still delusio...er...confident enough that Obama is going to lose in the next election, let's put some cash on it. I will put up $100 that Obama wins. And I will set the bet now, so you get the added bonus of a while for more random shit to happen, possible scandals, etc. I don't care who the nominee is, the bet will stand no matter who it is. as always, you seem sadly unable to differentiate between what you WISH would happen, and what is likely GOING to happen. so here's my chance to make a little money while teaching you a lesson.
you said that the mere thought of Obama winning reelection is hilarious to you. you think its so completely ridiculous? put some money up, kiddo. I'm tired of you making this absurd assertions and then disappearing when you're proven wrong. oh yeah, I remember election night.how about it? got the stones? -
Oh, and you do? Yeah, that little "power and intimidation" conspiracy theory is quite a projection there, buddy. And I like how you keep getting your ages and timelines mixed up with regards to Letterman and Birkitt. Again, as with your provided definition of "perverted", you attempt to paint their relationship as something more outrageous than it was. Man, Hugh Hefner must make you want to put a proverbial gun to your head.
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I know man, I know. Its just that sometimes, one is tempted to stare DOWN the stupidity and myopic bullshit. But that abyss...it can swallow you whole...it does run deep...
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one a kid. They are young adults. Kids wouldn't be allowed to work on a show. Get at least that straight. Funny, how many of them didn't come forward until this guy figured out what was going on. She had a realtionship with him also. Did he force her also into it? How old was he?
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audiences. The real treat of the shows is what goes on behind the scenes rather in front. And we can all read about that on the internet. Maybe they can make another commercial together.
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What's funny is that Jay Leno did end up being the future of television- or at least, the future of The Tonight Show.
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include Leno.
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Don't know which is funnier.
Coughlin's obligitory "I have a life and you don't" comeback or his attempt at trying to state that one joke told by his BFF about an underage female is topical while another about an underage female told by his rival is the dictionary definition of perversion.
I must say CL, your continued myopic ignorance sure makes great entertainment.. maybe you should look into developing a late night show? -
This line had me in stitches: "Forth of all...(???), I am NOT a Palin fan. I admire her for her accomplishments, but I DON'T want her to be President."
You admire her for her WHAT??!! LOL. You gotta' be shittin' me. Did you write that with a straight face? That says everything we need to know about you right there. Oh wait a minute. You must have been referring to her one full term as govern... Oh no. Hmm. -
he decided to run for President, yet you voted for the incompetent failure...
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all summer long until the economic downturn in October. Obama got 20% of the conservative vote, which blamed Bush for turning liberal at the end. Obama was a blank canvas that was anything anyone wanted him to be. He had no record and some people fell in love with him because he could read a good speech off a teleprompter. 2012 will be completely different, now that Obama has a record of failure behind him. He's completely incompetent and appears to not care much about anything other than his few pet projects like Health Care (which the vast majority of the American people didn't want and would like to see overturned). He has lied/broken many campaign promises and hardly anything he's tried has worked. He's a failure so far at just about everything. Anyone who honestly think he's a lock to win is in complete denial...
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besides being Head of the College Newspaper. Tell me what Obama did in the 15 years after he graduated college. Give me an accomplishment from President Teleprompter...
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i didn't vote for him myself, but even to me that seems like somewhat of an accomplishment
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don't know why I bother, since you keep ignoring me, but Obama wrote hundreds of bills while in Senate. he was one of the most prolific senators in history in terms of travel abroad and work with the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. he co-wrote and co-sponsored the transparency act, in 2006 or 7, I forget which, which was a HUGE success.all of this is moot, because you were comparing him to a beauty queen who went to like 4 colleges before graduating, and became mayor of Methville in buttfuck nowhere Alaska, before manipulating her way into the governor's office. the man went to columbia and harvard law before he even did anything I mentioned above.
trying to squeeze some life out of a spurious argument that Obama was unaccomplished, which was laughable in 2008, is really, truly sad.still waiting for you to sack up and take my bet. you're so sure Obama will lose (as you said explicitly above), than put your money where your mouth is. you are always telling us how successful you are, I'm sure you got $100 to risk, yeah? -
She lives where Putin rears his ugly head!
That has to count for something!
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I just rewatched the pilot episode of Studio 60; and I still can't believe they canceled such a smartly written, well acted show, after one season. The reason the ratings weren't there is they gave it a shitty time slot, and then pulled it, for six weeks, starting in March, to air that dung heap called The Black Donnellys. The Black fucking Donnellys?!?!?!?! If they had canceled ER when they should have (several years before they actually did) the Thursday night at 10:00 slot would've saved the show. Instead they eventually gave the 10:00 pm slot entirely to this lantern-jawed freak; and they are still trying to recover, from that colossal screw up. NBC is done.
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...since almost everything you write seems drawn absolutely from a Glenn Beck Alaskan meth fueled masturbatory seizure this is probably futile, but I challenge you to source just two of the absolutely ridiculous claims you made above: That the vast majority of Americans want the Health Care Bill overturned. And I will accept the work of any pollster, even Rasmussen, for this. Not that, for a variety of different reasons, during the stormy passage of the bill, sometimes as high as 52% of the American people were against it (though even this was an outlier) but that a vast majority favor overturning the bill. The second is that 20% of self-identified conservative voted for Obama in the last election. Don't argue, just source and verify. Here's a quick hint. You can't, because you're parroting the lies of people who feel quite confident about disseminating propaganda to their audience because said audience will uncritically believe anything that helps justify their own fear, prejudices and hatreds.
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didn't even complete one term as a US Senator is one of the most prolific in history? Really? Did you type that with a straight face? He was a US Senator a total of 153 working days before he decided he needed to be President. So, after 153 days, you honestly thought he was ready to be President? He's clearly not ready to be President. He's horrible at it.Obama's approval rating is plummeting because of his incompetence. Only diehard Democrats are keeping him afloat: realclearpolitics has his average approval rating at 46% approve, 46.3% disapprove. Gallup has him at 44% in their latest poll, and only 38% among independents. Rassmussen has him at 43% strongly disapprove, and only 26% strongly approve, the worst for any President in their first term since they've done this. It's frankly quite embarrassing how you keep sticking up for this clown who is clearly in over his head and doesn't want to deal with any problems, only his few pet issues. He only seems to really get excited when he's governing against the will of the American people, like shoving Health Care Reform down our throats, even though 80% of the people were satisfied with their care and 60% want Obamacare overturned, or when he's suing a whole state, again, against the will of the people, when over 60% are FOR the Arizona ILLEGAL immigration law. The Federal Government refuses to do it's job, so the state of Arizona is going to do what it can to stop the flood of murders, rapes, and kidknappings by illegal aliens, and Obama decides he's going to side with the illegals over American citizens. Unreal...
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So leno has better ratings than Letterman. BFD. It doesn't make him talented or better.Most Americans prefer to be dumbed down and not think.How else do you explain the success of 2 1/2 Men?
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seen his show briefly in passing. Glenn Beck has a very small audience in the scheme of things. Try again. And just to refresh your memory, over 62 million people voted against Obama, and Obama got 20% of the conservative vote. Do you honestly believe that one single conservative will vote for him again? Let alone, getting all the welfare recipients and homeless people out of their beds/cardboard boxes to vote in 2012...
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Jul 07, 2010 9:00:15 AM CDT
Red Ned Lynch, go read the exit polling if you don't believe me
by coughlins laws
I have never lied about anything here. Why are you too lazy to look it up yourself? The information is available for anyone who wants to find it...
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McCain only got 78% of the conservative vote. Obama got 20% of the conservative vote. How many conservatives do you think will be fooled into voting for Obama again?
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are not funny:
SNL
the following shows were NEVER funny
The Tonight Show with Jay Leno
The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson -
Jul 07, 2010 9:56:02 AM CDT
I'm no longer posting about politics. I don't want to get banned
by coughlins laws
I like to engage in debate whenever someone starts something political, but now it's to the point where we're way off topic. I said what I have to say on the subject. I don't really care that much about Leno, but I'm glad Letterman is losing to him. I just hate when I see what I see as irrational hatred for Leno. To me, it doesn't make sense. If people could leave it at the fact they don't think he's funny, that would be fine. But they continuously go so much further, wishing Jay Leno was dead, insulting anyone who watches him, etc, etc, etc. I don't know how it goes from "I like Conan and Letterman better" to "Jay Leno's fans are inbred mouthbreathers...". Seriously. If you don't like him, don't watch. But Conan O'Brien is NOT the second coming of comedy and Letterman is YEARS past his prime. Leno, whether you guys like it or not, is just more likable and more popular than these other guys, whether you like it or not. PERIOD. He's not a sexual deviant, he's not sexually obsessed with Palin's children, and he's NOT an insult comic. That's all I have to say about that. See you next talkback!!!
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...can I get in on BadMrWonka's bet? I would love to make some cash off your myopic delusions!
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"I just hate when I see what I see as irrational hatred for Leno. "
Retarded phrasing aside, Leno is utterly unfunny and as charismatic as a pile of bloody shit.
Jay is more likeable? On which fucking planet, exactly? -
Smart enough to know he's full of shit, dedicated enough to fly in the face of it.Keep it up Lonesome Roads, we can't quit you.
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Are you an idiot? Or do you not know how to read?
Sexual Deviant? Sexually Obsessed with Palin's kid? Seriously are you unable to actually read? Like the newspaper? I would say these terms are a far cry from the reality of the incidents you are referring to. -
Jul 07, 2010 10:04:37 AM CDT
As far as those of you that are intellectually dishonest,
by coughlins laws
the joke Leno said and the series of jokes Letterman said are completely different. First of all, Leno's joke was aimed at John Edwards and NOT the Palin kid. Edwards was the butt of the joke, NOT the Palin daughter. True, it wasn't that good of taste, but he clearly mentioned the older girl. Second of all, Letterman told a whole series of sex jokes about Palin AND her daughters. He said Palin looked like a "slutty flight attendant" and was talking about Palin's daughter with her at the Yankees game. Anyone that saw her knew she was with the 14 year old at the Yankees Game. Then, all of a sudden, he's talking about the daughter that wasn't there? Really? Does that make sense? Suppose he used the names. "Did you see Sarah Palin at the ballgame with Willow the other day? During the seventh inning strecth, Bristol got knocked up by A-Rod...". Now, does that make sense? To point out the 14 year old, then all of a sudden be talking about the 18 year old? So, the way he said the joke, it was clearly a pedophilia joke. But, even if I grant you that he didn't know which daughter was there (making him or his staff ignorant idiots for not making sure), it was still making a teenager the butt of the joke, a year after it happened. He's obviously sexually obsessed with the Palin's. If that's your thing, by all means, keep watching. Just don't deny what it is that he even admitted himself was a badly worded joke...
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"So, the way he said the joke, it was clearly a pedophilia joke. "
Another magnificent entry in The Quotable Moron, coming to shelves this summer. -
want anyone here to have any clue as to where I am or how to find me. The way I was mercilessly attacked during the 2008 election cycle simply because I vote differently than most of the people here. I don't want anything to do with some of the people here and I don't trust any of them. The way so many of you are intellectually dishonest and simply vulgar people really scares me. I wouldn't put it past alot of the people I've seen on here doing something to try and harm me or my business. So sorry, gambling is illegal at Bushwood, and I NEVER slice. But by all means, go ahead and keep saying to yourself that Obama is doing a good job. Seriously. After the coming bloodbath the Democrats are going to take in the fall because of your failed President, get back to me and tell me you still think Obama's going to win. Now seriously, no more. Got to go...
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"of your failed President"
Like it or not he is YOUR president too. -
they both have teams of writers who make them sound funny.
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Fuck you Herc.
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things like "your President" when Bush was President. Isn't he your President? Did I say he wasn't mine?
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But I voted for Obama and I think he's doing a piss-poor job. If this was a Bush term, my friends and I would probably be stomping around in (faux) outrage. I still would never vote for Palin, though.
Also, did anyone see Louie last night (Coughlin, I'm sure you missed it, as that show undoubtedly offends your delicate sensibilities)? This talkback reminds me of the fight between Nick DiPaulo and and Louis C.K. I hope nobody cuts his hand. -
And his supporters probably own a Snuggie™ and have multiple cats.
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He stated that he was gonna close down GITMO, and didn't...... He stated that he was gonna release those torture-related photos, and didn't..... He continues the rich tradition of unequivical support for Israel... Yes, Obama is the Black Bush.
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I knew Coughlin was a right-wing dolt, but I didn't know he was a cry-baby too! Wah! Wah! Wah! Liberals scare me! They might harm me and my business! I was mercilessly attacked because I voted differently! WAH!!! No wonder you he's so bent out of shape over Letterman's joke. Punk!
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and in 15 mins speech told everyone in the room that he was the boss, his leadership was not probationary and that he and he alone would lead fianna fail into the next election. and after his speech his critics were met with a stoney silence. and today we learnt that respite care services would be cut which lead thousands of people out on to the streets. and what did the leader of the opposition have to say. he criticised the govt for cutting the services for physically disabled and I "mentally challenged people"
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I did call Bush OUR President. Obama is doing a piss poor job, but his is still the President. I know your puusy hurts because Palin's Daughter is a dirty slut that got pregant and Letterman made a joke about it. I know your ass burns because Palin gives you wood and people disrespect her. I know that all you care about is being right and proving others wrong, no matter how retarded to sound in the mean time. Please take the time to develop your own opinions and then keep em to your fucking self.
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Many dismiss Conan's new show because it's on TBS. You seem to forget that TBS is on the basic service tier of virtually every cable and satellite provider. The only potential viewers left out are the rabbit-ears crowd; pretty sure the advertisers aren't too worried about them, and if Conan can sell ads, well - ain't that the name of the game?
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I knew you'd pansy out. but that's fine.and you have to look at what I said, when I used the term "prolific". first of all, I Was talking about his travel overseas and work with the foreign relations committee. I know you're prejudiced and short-sighted, but you can READ, right? you seemed to miss that entirely. the point isn't how much he accomplished in total (some senators are there for 50 years) it's WHAT HE ACCOMPLISHED IN HIS TIME THERE. he authored and co-sponsored more bills in his short tenure than many do in 2 or 3 full terms. he was prolific, that's the definition of the word.it means highly productive.put it this way, if a baseball player hits 20 home runs in the minor leagues, and is called up to the majors, it's because he is PROLIFIC. if a player plays for 20 years in the minor leagues, and over that 20 year span, hits 20 home runs, and THEN gets called up to the majors, it is precisely NOT because he was prolific, he's just put in his time, and paid his dues...which one would YOU want on your team? I'm sorry you didn't understand the word, but a definition is a definition, and a fact is a fact. Obama, in hi short tenure, was prolific. you get it, now?we've had plenty of the same old, white, established career politicians, and it got us into a pretty shitty place as a country. people voted for Obama for fresh ideas, competency and vision. and although you can wave your arms and scream about his "failure", he's going to be re-elected. just as you were COMPLETELY wrong in the last election, you are COMPLETELY wrong about this one. oh and by the bye, Lincoln had served (wait for it) ONE term in the house in total, before being elected president. and guess what the major argument against him was, in the months leading up to the election? "Not enough experience!"I still don't know why I bother, though...you are truly the most myopic person I've ever seen on here.
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forgot to type that.
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Coughlin's!
I haven't seen this much crying since Chris Crocker told the world to "Leave Britney ALONE!"
Maybe you can make a follow up to that mentioning Jay?
Please spare us the delusional semantics of "this really meant that and it was actually directed at"
Bottom line is each comedian performed a joke that involved UNDERAGE females.... That being said, Jay then is every bit as much a perverted pedophile as Dave by YOUR logic.
Ok, you can now resume tap dancing like Gregory Hines in response
Tappity Tap Tappity!
Oh, and maybe later, we can discuss Jay's racism and cultural insensitivity - C'mon, you remember the Dancing Ito's don't cha?
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Boy, you'll stoop to any level to vomit your partisan hackery. 60% do NOT want the Healthcare bill overturned. Rasmussen (which hasn't polled this issue since March) found a way to turn a 43% disapproval rate into a 60% disapproval rate by bullshitting the poll's question. An amalgam of all the current polling trends on this issue show a 45.5% approval rate vs. a 43.7% disapproval rate of the Healthcare bill. And the approval rate is INCREASING daily. It's easy to find this information as its all over the web but I know how hard it is for folks like Rasmussen, FOX News, Ace of Spades, or some other blatantly partisan site to accept this.And as if your slander against Letterman wasn't bad enough, now you're going to join in on the "Obama sides with the illegals and Mexico" meme. Well, there are two concepts you need to familiarize yourself with: The Federal Supremacy Clause and preemptive doctrine. You may even try to familiarize yourself with the DOJ's filing before you spit someone else's opinion about it. Let's just wait and find out how "activist" the SCOTUS is when they review the DOJ's case.Quote: "I've never listened to Glenn Beck once and have only seen his show briefly in passing."Wow, what a conflicting statement. Especially when you consider how you used to challenge people to respond to Beck's claims in the past.Quote: "Glenn Beck has a very small audience in the scheme of things."Yeah well, we can all thank TPTB for the fact that his ratings are dropping faster than the turds out of Rush Limbaugh's mouth.Finally, as Fall and 2012 approach, we'll just have to wait and see how well sensible conservatives fare as they continue to flounder in the morass that is the GOP...which has grown increasingly hampered (and embarrassed) by the anger-blind Tea Party. And if Palin, Romney, Huckabee, Giuliani (!!!), or Gingrich is the best the party can do, they're in trouble.
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and is going to 'save us', or 'save the earth', is an idiot
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humanity is kind of dumb like that. i mean remember how much of an erection obama caused during the election? yeesh.
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You're confusing Coughlin and his ilk by using actual FACTS! STOP IT!!!
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2 elections.
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not reading the DOJ filing when the Attorney General admitted before Congress that he was calling the Arizona law racist even though HE HADN'T EVEN READ THE BILL!!!! As far as Glenn Beck, how am I contradicting myself? I see people on here constantly call him names, but can't seem to come up with one specific thing they are angry about. It's like they are pre-programmed to hate him and don't even know why. Everyone here knows specifically why I don't like this President's policies, yet I challenge some of you to specifically tell me what you find objectionable about someone and most of the time, they can't do it...As far as the polling data, Mr.NiceGaius, keep trying to convince yourself that Obamacare is popular. You seem to be in extreme denial. I know ho dissappointed you must be in the President, most people that voted for him are, but you're treading down the path of ludicrousness. You can't possibly believe what you're typing, can you?And on to the Arizona Law, Obama can't stop lying about it. There is ZERO racial profiling in the law. You have to already have committed a crime for the police to investigate whether you're an illegal or not. They can't just randomly pull over anyone they think looks like an illegal immigrant. And before you condemn the honest, hard working people who have to live among the crime spree caused by illegal aliens near the border (the raping, killing, kidnapping, drug wars, etc), why don't you back off? And yes, there really is no way of looking at this. There are two sides to this, American citizens who want to be protected from illegal immigrants, and the wave of illegal immigrants the Obama Administration has refused to stop. Obama chose to side AGAINST the will of the people of Arizona AND the will of the American people, and decided to take sides with illegal immigrants...
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...by people who actually go through their polling methods and data to find out how they achieved a desired sample/rate.
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Jul 08, 2010 3:03:23 PM CDT
As far as all those who claimed there wouldn't be rationing
by coughlins laws
in Obama's Health Care Takeover, did you see how he just put in a Doctor through a Recess Appointment to run Medicare and Medicaid who FREELY ADMITS he is FOR HEALTH CARE RATIONING? Obama is too much of a pussy to re-open debate that he chose to slide through an appointee to run the two biggest entitlements in the budget while everyone is on vacation and no one is paying attention. He doesn't want the American people to know that everything they said was true about his Health Care bill is really true. Obama and his people said there would be no rationing of care. Another lie. The guy he is slipping in WITHOUT Senate Confirmation, which is Standard Operating Procedure, is all for socialized medicine and Health Care Rationing...
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those of you who are too lazy to vote have to say. And again, they were the most accurate pollster the last 2 elections. They called the 2004 race almost exactly right and they were about the closest in 2008. You see, that kind of proves that their methods are valid. Wouldn't you say accuracy is a good indication of a polls usefulness?
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Quote: "I'm no longer posting about politics. I don't want to get banned." -- "Now seriously, no more. Got to go..."Well, that worked out for ya, didn't it?Be back later to address your other posts.
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a phenom as a US Senator? As a State Senator, he barely showed up and voted present a record number of times. As a US Senator, he decided after only 153 working days that he should be President. Once you start running for President full-time, you in-reality stop being a Senator. So, he was really only a Senator for 2 and a half years before the 2008 election cycle started, 2 years of which he was a junior Senator from his state in the minority party. Then he spent the next 2 years running for President. Do you really think he was concentrating on being a Senator? Honestly? You're the only person I've ever seen make the case that he was an outstanding Senator. I don't even think I've ever seen Liberal Hate Sites like the dailykos make such ridiculous claims. He was very unremarkable. He's a one trick pony. Apparently the only thing he's good at is reading the same stump speech off a teleprompter over and over again. When he's interviewed or is being asked unscripted questions, or his teleprompter breaks, he breaks record for saying, "uh...uh...uh...". the guy is an empty suit who doesn't take his job seriously. He came to do like 3 or 4 pet projects and other than that, he can't seem to be bothered. He not only has refused to get anything done with the oil spill, he's actually golfing more and getting in the way of those that ARE trying to get it under control. But, by all means, keep supporting him. He needs all the help he can get right now. He's a very divisive President and apparently doesn't even care...
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Can't let you state things unchallenged. I know that you usually only consume information that comes unchallenged, but if you want to be an adult and have adult conversations, you have to sometimes expose yourself to differing points of view...
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I give up on you, man. when people make specific, reasoned arguments, using actual data and examples, you just respond with, "Really? You're crazy to think that! Wow!"it's like arguing with an autistic 10 year old. I give up. If you grow some balls and want to take my bet, let me know, otherwise, I'm done wasting my time. You are just another republican drone who has to demonize anything on the left side of the street. it's an old schtick.
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