June 7, 2010, 12:30 a.m. CST
Will someone put this retard out of his misery?
June 7, 2010, 12:35 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 12:35 a.m. CST
Jonathan Nolan: "No."
June 7, 2010, 12:44 a.m. CST
... he admits to ripping off the X-Men.<p></p> ... and even then it's still a NO
June 7, 2010, 12:44 a.m. CST
That is all.
June 7, 2010, 12:50 a.m. CST
Can I have a job doing the same exact thing. Just long enough to finish up what I was doing when you fired me. C'mon, it'll be great, I'll do what you fired me for and you can pay me. How about it?
June 7, 2010, 12:50 a.m. CST
best luck with that. Most of the cast doesn't want to come back except Greg Grunberg...man's gotta eat.
June 7, 2010, 12:52 a.m. CST
Besides, I wanna know the end Kring had in mind.
June 7, 2010, 12:54 a.m. CST
or a 13 ep order for a half season, Then he wanted a made for TV movie. Now he wants a mini-series. <br /> <br /> Just see if your artist is still available and wrap it up in a graphic novel. <br /> <br /> That way the shows dozens of loyal viewers can find out how they planned to resolve the "the public knows people with powers exist" cliffhanger without ever putting anyone in a costume or having them fight crime or use their powers much. <br /> <br /> And this is coming from someone who was a regular in the season one talkbacks and thought season four was actually the show at it's best ever. <br /> <br /> Cue the Roy Orbison record. "It's Over."
June 7, 2010, 12:56 a.m. CST
After the first season. Just a constant reshuffling of motivations. It would be nice to see another try at something like this, but wait a while and do it with a different show runner. The idea could still be very successful, but the show can't be so damn immobile.
June 7, 2010, 12:57 a.m. CST
who is upset by the end of Heroes. Remember all those big campaigns for Jericho, FNL, etc... well, Heroes didn't have one. In fact, the reaction has mostly been "Good, it sucked." But it seems like Kring does seem to think there was this huge outpouring and NBC is gonna have no choice. Hell, if NBC is gonna bring back anything as a mini, it'll be Law and Order.. not a show that's been their albatross for 3 seasons.
June 7, 2010, 1:05 a.m. CST
While we're at it. Or whatever that Blind Cop show was. Or the new Knight Rider.
June 7, 2010, 1:06 a.m. CST
then I would be interested. The show went from great, to just ok, to barely above just ok, to total suck. Let it die.
June 7, 2010, 1:19 a.m. CST
Heroes has been on a downward spiral since season 1. Great concept for a show, but did they make it compelling and interesting? No. The coolness of the show faded completely.
June 7, 2010, 1:23 a.m. CST
Think this is a good idea, at least to end it - just hope of kring does it he doesnt leave it open ended hoping it will go back to series, as it wont since he screwed it up in the first place!
June 7, 2010, 1:23 a.m. CST
He is such a clueless fucktard.
June 7, 2010, 1:40 a.m. CST
We don't want to see Heroes hiding.
June 7, 2010, 1:45 a.m. CST
If people dislike Heroes, fine. <p> It's the 'we hate it, so it sucks' attitude that bugs me. Elitism is pathetic no matter where it comes from. It implies people who did enjoy the show (like me) are idiots. Which is rather insulting.
June 7, 2010, 1:46 a.m. CST
It's drama, dude. You start with them hiding, end with them kicking ass in the open. If they start kicking ass in the open, where's the conflict? Or the connection to S4, when they wanted to be left alone?
June 7, 2010, 1:49 a.m. CST
Peter, in Heaven, runs into Nathan, who brings Peter to a special church full of all the other characters. Everybody hugs. Pan up to a painting that depicts everybody hugging. The End.
June 7, 2010, 2:15 a.m. CST
They will kill off all the women and make Sylar a nice guy in the end.<p> Seriously though I try never to talk about Heroes because just the mention of it makes me want to list out the endless ways the show destroyed itself. 1) Making Peter and Claire related 2) Killing off the painter and his gf 3) Not killing off Sylar after season 1...argh. Will stop here.
June 7, 2010, 2:23 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 2:55 a.m. CST
Thanks for bringing back the 'Lost' hurt.
June 7, 2010, 3:19 a.m. CST
Otherwise it will be a blow to his ego AND his wallet when they laugh him out the door.
June 7, 2010, 3:38 a.m. CST
jericho was loads better than heroes at the end and even they couldnt get any more eps out of the network people. just do it in comics, i'm reading jericho season 3 and its pretty cool seeing the actors in comic style. <p>i actually had no idea grandpappy ADAMA was in jericho till i recognised him in the comic and went AHA!
June 7, 2010, 3:58 a.m. CST
The first season of Heroes wasn't that good in the first place... the season finale contradicts what we already learned.
June 7, 2010, 4:07 a.m. CST
Considering that even in Season 1 every great episode was followed by 3 or 4 boring ones where nothing happened and the whole stories moved in circles, every season should have been just a string of 2 - 4 TV movies.
June 7, 2010, 4:34 a.m. CST
Season 1's "Dark" Hiro was one of the best things they could have done. The blade, full control of his powers, slight paranoia... They should have figured a way to get him back to that point. Instead, we get YATAAAA almost every. single. season. It was "cute" the first few episodes, but come on... And then the whole Peter taking that irish chick and then dumping her in an alternate timeline (if I remember correctly). Sloppy writing.
June 7, 2010, 4:40 a.m. CST
by JT Kirk
I liked Crossing Jordan pretty much the entire run. But Heroes crapped out after season 1 when the underlying notion behind everything shifted. That crapass season 1 finale wasn't much to look at either. But clearly there was no idea where to go with it after season 1, no statement to make, no reflection on society and the cliches we all play in it.
June 7, 2010, 5:02 a.m. CST
the show tanked. They should have killed off Sylar and continued on with a new bad ass instead of using this 1 guy the whole way through the series and having him go from bad to good every few episodes.
June 7, 2010, 5:05 a.m. CST
clueless, hack writing.
June 7, 2010, 5:15 a.m. CST
by Dradis Contact
Everyone in India speaks English, even the small child playing in the street and not sitting in a school. Why not Hindi? I guess they didn't want everyone to think Dr. Suresh was an a-rab.
June 7, 2010, 5:38 a.m. CST
It's a match made in lowest-common-denominator heaven! Shoot for the Middle! Dancing Hiros!
June 7, 2010, 5:38 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 5:39 a.m. CST
As for the people in India speaking English, remember season 2 were everyone was speaking Spanish and Japanese then the ratings started to get lower while people bitched about those foreign characters? Yeah, Americans are fairly racist even in their TV watching. They would have been off the air if they went with the original pilot with Matt's Muslim terrorist friend being a special and turning to the good side.
June 7, 2010, 5:43 a.m. CST
High point of the series - end of season 1, watching all of the heroes come together to fight Sylar. Watching Nathan step into the fray to save his brother. Watching Peter nearly kick the crap out of Sylar. Lowest point of the series - when Peter, Nathan and Sylar duke it out BEHIND A CLOSED DOOR IN A HOTEL ROOM!! There was SO much potential with this show, but they just wasted it. They could have developed the schism between the old heroes, developed a Justice League/Legion of Doom scenario. Instead they created 4 seasons with plot holes galore. Peter lost a girl in time, they constantly killed the interesting heroes (D.L., Niki, Adam, Dana and the lovely Elle). So much wasted potential. And then they gave powers to Mohinder and Ando, but they never really utilized them. And why in the hell would you limit Peter to ONE power? Seriously? Four years wasted.
June 7, 2010, 5:48 a.m. CST
I would be happy for more Heroes, just as long as they planned their seasons out in advance, got new writers and didn't let Kring near the show. His interview at Onion AV Club is like a how-to guide into making terrible television. Heroes has always seemed like such a fixable show, but it never seemed like a show that was even trying to tell a story that had an end game. Does the Marvel Universe need to be wrapped up in a mini series?
June 7, 2010, 6:03 a.m. CST
Do I take it that Herc hated Lost's ending?
June 7, 2010, 6:34 a.m. CST
No, but seriously, the guy burgled turds. It's weird. This reeks of desperation. And burgled turds.
June 7, 2010, 6:38 a.m. CST
So far I just know a bunch of stuff the event isn't. That's not marketing. That's the equivalent of saying, "come over I'm making dinner, I'm not making turkey, or chicken, or steak. I'm not making salad either". Well....tell me what you ARE making, or I'm not coming over. For all I know, at this pooimt, tour making rocky mountain oysters boiled in cat hair. Get it together NBC. You already fucked Kings thru shit marketing.
June 7, 2010, 6:41 a.m. CST
How can you consider the end of season 1 a high point? It directly contradicts all that went before it.
June 7, 2010, 6:43 a.m. CST
by maxwell's hammer
Herc already opened the can of worms, so I feel I can go there...<BR> <BR> LOST fans are apparently less racist and have better attention spans: they did entire episodes in Korean for pete's sake!
June 7, 2010, 6:47 a.m. CST
Am guessing that it is revealled that there is a guy from the future who is godlike who is behind it all, and that guy is none other than Patton Oswalt, but then it is revealed that there is a god whol lives on earth who is higher than Patton and that is Joss Whedon. <p> In all seriousness, rewatched the Lost ending , still love it, answered enough and left me enough to ponder on. Wasn't as vague as Sopranos, wasnt as silly as BSG with that bit in their future tacked on right at the end (our present). <p> But back to your obsession, Herc, was really happy with the buffy and Angel endings. In a parallel universe Eliza dushku and Fox would have realised that she isn't an actor with great range and made a Faith TV Series. Amy Acker would have been the star of AMC's Dollhouse. Whilst I am dreaming, also in that parallel universe Y The Last Man and Preacher would already be on HBO and Carnivle would have got a third series. <p> Oh sorry should also talk about Heroes, well it had a showrunner that actually knew what to do after season 1, maybe got some advice from JMS, or JMS would have convinced them to make a series based on Rising Stars instead.
June 7, 2010, 6:52 a.m. CST
How does the season 1 finale contradict everything that came before it? The only thing that came before it was the rest of the FIRST SEASON!
June 7, 2010, 6:54 a.m. CST
. . . and if that's what you're alluding too (that the entire first season sucked), then I disagree. The first 3-4 episodes of Heroes was rough . . . extremely rough. But after that, it definitely found its footing and picked up the pace.
June 7, 2010, 6:55 a.m. CST
Peter is killed by glass to the brain a few episodes before, Claire pulls it out & he revives. Yet now, she can't shoot him. What, afraid you might kill him despite your knowledge of your own healing abilities & aware of his? Similarly Sylar does nothing about Hiros banzai charge. The super-hearing, telekenesis powered bad-guy who previously caught, froze, broke Hiros sword does absolutely nothing to stop the attack.
June 7, 2010, 6:58 a.m. CST
But I've not watch season 1 since it aired. You could probably add, why didn't Peter just fly away (As, you know, he can fly).
June 7, 2010, 7:12 a.m. CST
by Seth Cohen
fuck you kring... you only know how to run a show one way... into the ground
June 7, 2010, 7:17 a.m. CST
Remember first half of season 1 Sylar gained a photographic memory? To what end, he was in Mohinders apartment though seemingly recalls none of what he saw (The notice board, etc.). Anyway... you get my point, Heroes never was that good in the first place. They would occasionally have some neat episodes for sure, but for a coherent storyline it was laughable.
June 7, 2010, 7:40 a.m. CST
We don't have to bag on the Heroes gang anymore. Given how oblivious they seem, I know it looks improbable, but one year they're gonna wake up and realize what they did with the opportunities, and it'll haunt them for the rest of their days. Night and day, it will eat away at them. ps. How novel: Big, sweeping changes in the Heroes world. They sure didn't do that before. Heroes is the one show it's OK to hate on.
June 7, 2010, 7:40 a.m. CST
Can someone either hit him with a rolled up newspaper or rub his nose in a pile of unsold Heroes season dvds?
June 7, 2010, 7:50 a.m. CST
Peter didnt just fly away and explode all by himself because, as they clearly stated, he could only use one power at a time...
June 7, 2010, 7:58 a.m. CST
I've had enough, thanks. What a disappointing series.
June 7, 2010, 8:31 a.m. CST
Fucking shame.<p>Was fun, for a season.
June 7, 2010, 8:33 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 8:36 a.m. CST
that's why I suffered through 1.5 seasons, to see if they ever realized the potential. Too many characters, no cohesive and coherent storyline, no main character to build the show around...yeah, pretty much a how-to on poor writing.
June 7, 2010, 8:36 a.m. CST
Characters didn't betray how they'd been previously set up and written, it had an interesting and memorable villain, the writers didn't totally forget about the Heroes real lives, ie, Peter was a paramedic again. No one played the idiot character just to move the plot forward, something everyone was guilty of in season 2 and 3.
June 7, 2010, 8:36 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 8:37 a.m. CST
I start to hulk out when I even think about the abortion that was the finale.
June 7, 2010, 8:41 a.m. CST
That's pretty damn funny.
June 7, 2010, 8:44 a.m. CST
Just imagine the battle between Miracle Man and Kid Miracleman in London, that was truly apocalyptic, the horror!
June 7, 2010, 8:48 a.m. CST
for season 2
June 7, 2010, 8:51 a.m. CST
The five people who still care will lap it up and it will be considerably less expensive.
June 7, 2010, 8:53 a.m. CST
The idea isn't even original.
June 7, 2010, 8:57 a.m. CST
You know this to be true.
June 7, 2010, 9 a.m. CST
about how a major character would be killed off, that it would be "huge". Then it turns out to be Nathan, a character who had been killed at the end of the previous season. Not really a "huge" "major death". I'm guessing the writer of the article hadn't watched the show since the first season. Honestly, how was Nathan's "death" anything other than the logical conclusion to a stupid storyline. Even the attempts at manufacturing hype about the show in its later seasons was lame.
June 7, 2010, 9:03 a.m. CST
Was emotionally satisfying and the best way they could have done it, especially compared to the very quick way it was handled in the Season 3 finale. I was very impressed with the resolution to that subplot this past season.
June 7, 2010, 9:04 a.m. CST
by I AM ROCKO
...of Heroes; and I seriously want it back...
June 7, 2010, 9:13 a.m. CST
by Dave I
That said, I have ALMOST no desire to see this. I mean, he had FOUR SEASONS to make it work and, to me at least, once the last two episodes of Season 1 came along and were awful (after such a buildup and an obvious showdown both promised and never delivered) it was more-or-less a nosedive with some interesting moments here-and-there, but largely three+ seasons of disappointment. Although, this is kind of funny; their US ratings over the four years: http://tinyurl.com/26rmsye<p><p>Heroes became like a bad habit. I would find there was nothing else to do, watch it on DVR, and not really care about any of it. I'm feeling apathetic even typing about it.<p><p>I will say, the Bryan Fuller episodes were great. The are probably the last episodes where I felt anything other than bored over. The whole Matt Parkman and Daphne (speedster chick) ending was just very well done, and just a beautiful moment that was so touching and gave Parkman real motivation . . . And then it went back to being terrible.<p><p>It's obvious they moved on. There are at least two super-hero type shows on next season, they had to know last season was a make-or-break situation, and even if they do this and it's great most won't care anyway. If they wanted to save this show, it seems like they should have wrestled control away from Kring, got AMAZING writers involved, and been willing to make consistent, decisive plot & character decisions. They had three years from when things started to go bad to solve the many (and much talked about) problems. What couldn't they do then that they expect to do now? I'll pass.<p><p>-Cheers
June 7, 2010, 9:18 a.m. CST
Must be the fact that nerds got their wish to have a somewhat realistic superhero show and when they realized the story arcs in the show like the ones in comics make no sense, they panned it. Its like the secret is out, coughMarvelcivilwarcough, actually reality based comics blow, kill it now! I liked season 2 a lot due to making it more a global adventure. Season 3 started off good with the Arkham Asylum then died once they brought in the Peterelli father and killed Adam at the same time. The eclipse episodes were their lowest poit. The fugitive storyline was good until they did the swap of Nathan and Sylar. The reason you didn't see the big battle was due to the poor ratings and lack of budget. This past season had some errors, but it did a good job for the most part. Season 2 was also during a strike filled season when their original plan was to let the virus go free and deal with that for the last part of the season which could have made for some good episodes or a lot more prodding. I don't have the hate for this show like other people do since I appreciate they at least tried to do a superhero show and since any show dealing with superpowers, I throw logic aside. I also think there is no fan outcry due to the show ending on a good note. If it was a giant cliffhanger then yeah, people will bitch, but its open ended enough that its ok if we don't see the rest of the adventures. It probably had the best finale of any of the other shows this year including Lost and 24.
June 7, 2010, 9:19 a.m. CST
First, Hiro goes back in time and save Nathan from Sylar. Nathan overjoyed from surviving runs into traffic and is hit by a bus. Sylar having a change of heart then heals Nathan and brings him back to like. Nathan shocked by Sylar's guesture passes out and hits his head on the curb killing him. Sylar then brings him back to life. Meanwhile, Nikki is killed by Sylar. Her twin sister Jackie appears to take revenge who is then killed. This causes their twin sister Sandy to come out of hiding to avenge both sisters who is also killed. Hearing the news of her dead twin sisters, Sue then appears to get revenge. <br><br> While all this is happening, Hiro and Ando are of on a heroic quest when Hiro will yet again seem mentally challenged and both will quote tons of sci-fi and comic book references to pander to the geek crowd.<br><br> Look for some father/daughter tension between Claire and HRG. Peter will sulk for most of the miniseries. Mrs. Petrelli has a big secret that she has kept from her sons for their entire lives. Sylar although undefeatable and indestructable will have his master plans foiled by Peter and the gang anyway.
June 7, 2010, 9:25 a.m. CST
damn, hadn't thought about that for around 2 weeks. What an absolute shocker. Great plot that, man pulls out big plug, man replaces big plug. Lots of crying and showing old clips, non-sensical spiritual bullshit that makes CGI underwater Island shot completely pointless, screen fades to white, Jack dies, the end. Bullshit. <p><p>I dropped out of Heroes in season 3 when Mohinder turned into The Fly. Did see the last one of s4 though, why can't they just leave it at that? Seemed a good enough ending...
June 7, 2010, 9:29 a.m. CST
on HDDVD when it came out. LOVED the show. By season 2, blu-ray had come out, and I wasn't too impressed when I saw it first-run, so I didn't pick it up. Season 3, I was out halfway into it. Once I realised that every few episodes they could just go back in time and fix things, that no one was really in danger, it got lame. Add to that that Peter was a whiny bitch, that Ali Larter had more personalities than Sally Field in Sybil, and a new 'hero' who ran like Quicksilver and looked like that talentless hack Pink, I was done. I kept trying to stay with it, and it kept kicking me in the balls for doing so. It was one good season followed by a slow, painful, drug out death that would make William "Kirk took half an hour to die" Shatner.
June 7, 2010, 9:30 a.m. CST
cut off the last word for some reason
June 7, 2010, 9:30 a.m. CST
But let's move on, shall we?
June 7, 2010, 9:33 a.m. CST
You want to know why people didn't like the show:<br><br> 1.) No one died. As I illuded to in my last post, Nathan died every season only come back. Ali Larter's character died almost as much only to use the twin excuse explain one of the deaths.<br><br> 2.) The use of Sylar. Sylar was a great bad guy in season one, but they shot their load. From then on they didn't know how to use him where he was unkillable and more powerful than all the heros combined, but could never win.<br><br> 3.) Hiro went from endearing to mentally challenged and annoying. They promised an evolved Hiro in season 1 with Future Hiro, but did every they could to stunt his growth as a character including one of the biggest plot crutches on TV - amnesia.<br><br> 4.) Too many characters with many of them the writers had no idea how to use past season one. Yet, they gave them storylines anyway.<br><br> 5.) Repetitive plot point. Mrs. Petreli has an earth shattering secret that affects the entire season every season. Hiro and Ando seem to go on the same types of aventures every year (different storyline, same mission).<br><br> 6.) Weak Big Bads. The first season had Sylar and Linderman. Since, Danko, Daddy Petrelli, and Samuel Sullivan just didn't match up even with great actors playing the roles.<br><br> 7.) They used time travel as a crutch and a way to wipe the slate clean too often. It was a SCI-FI way of having Bobby appear in the show on Dallas type of moments.
June 7, 2010, 9:35 a.m. CST
Which do you regret more? Buying season 1 of Heroes or a HD DVD player?
June 7, 2010, 9:36 a.m. CST
the cover art for the Heroes Season 4 blu ray release, then I'll explain it to you: Hayden's boobs are front and center, getting as much cleavage into the shot as possible, with some other guys in the background. Not complaining (although she's not a very talented actress, at least not so far), just saying that NBC knows if they're going to sell any copies at all it's going to be on the strength of those tiddies.
June 7, 2010, 9:40 a.m. CST
Now THAT made me chuckle. It would have to be Season 1. Chiefly due to the fact that, after blu-ray was declared the winner and HDDVD cancelled, I was able to trade in my XBOX 360 HDDVD Drive to Best Buy and got a $70 gift card for it, so I at least got half value back. You know what I got from them for the HDDVD of Season 1 of Heroes? $8.
June 7, 2010, 9:41 a.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 9:45 a.m. CST
by Dave I
"Must be the fact that nerds got their wish to have a somewhat realistic superhero show and when they realized the story arcs in the show like the ones in comics make no sense, they panned it."<p><p> I think it might have to do with characters being inconsistent, unfulfilled promises (epic Peter vs. Sylar matchups, Future Hiro, etc.), convenient changes of heart ala. Mr. Burns on the Simpsons whenever it helped move the plot along despite making no sense (e.g. Sylar: "I love you Elle, no I feel betrayed by you, no I REALLY love you, no I'm going to kill you despite loving you", Sylar as a bad-then-good-then-bad-now-REALLY-good guy, etc.), contradictions in Hiro's power (can't change the present by going into the past, then he can), the ability to turn anybody into mutant superheroes, the introduction of carnie folk(?!!!!!!) as the main threat, depowering Peter, just ignoring Peter leaving his Irish girlfriend in a bleak post-apocalyptic future, pointless side-treks (Peter & HRG going to find the healer to save Hiro, then getting the healing power only to get rid of it and then forgetting about trying to save Hiro when that seemed the only way to save him, except Sylar saved him because he is pretty gullible for an ultra-powered super-villain), EVERYTHING ridiculous about Ali Larter's characters and ignoring the fact fans didn't like her characters (nothing personal Ali, you're lovely but none of that made much sense from a storytelling standpoint). There's more, but my hands are starting to cramp. And NONE of it had anything to do with Heroes being a reality-based comic-inspired series.<p><p>-Cheers
June 7, 2010, 9:50 a.m. CST
That's what you angry fanboy critics had been clamoring for since season one.
June 7, 2010, 9:56 a.m. CST
Glad you got something back for the HD DVD. You definitely made out better than JVC or Harry.
June 7, 2010, 10 a.m. CST
Read X-Men or the Marvel U from House of M to Siege with in the last three years and you get almost the same amount of inane bullshit that happens in Heroes. Hell, Final Crisis makes Heroes look like Shakespeare.
June 7, 2010, 10:01 a.m. CST
I am a big fan of Robert Knepper, but I hated his character and part of it was his fault. His now you hear it, now you don't Irish accent was distracting. I just never liked the whole Carival storyline and didn't think they took advantage of the backstory they set up for the character. <br><br> As for Peter's depowering, I felt that both he and Sylar were getting too powerful, but I also think their depowering of him was a poor solution to the problem. I don't think it was the biggest problem and definitely not bigger than them making Sylar unkillable, but I didn't like this plot point of him losing his powers and adopting one power at a time aspect.
June 7, 2010, 10:08 a.m. CST
Made a lot of sense and made for interesting situations where you wondered if he would give up his current power for somthing new, if it would be more helpful, etc. I thought it was a great solution. Same goes for putting Sylar in Matt's head. Good way to keep that character in the story and keep Sylar depowered. <p> As for Samuel, I agree about the accent- it confused me- but I loved his character and how he didn't show his hand until the end of the season. I could never figure out his game, but I thought he was a great Magneto-esque Villain. Much better than Papa Petrelli.
June 7, 2010, 10:10 a.m. CST
Gotta say they really dropped da ball on "Heroes", as a die hard fan I wanted 2 slap someone after every episode dis past season,"college Claire" was hella boring, they couldn't decide what they wanted 2 do wit peter so some jackass decides "let's give him his powers back but only 1 at a time" and don't even get me started on Sylar! But havin said all dat I'd prolly watch if this happens just 2 c if they redeem themselves or fall flat on der face, god I hope redemption is in der future
June 7, 2010, 10:18 a.m. CST
I grow more and more fond of the finale with each passing day.
June 7, 2010, 10:26 a.m. CST
by Dave I
I guess my problem with that was two-fold.<p><p>1) The Nature of the Change: It just seemed weird to radically change his nature from a power-sponge to a one-at-a-time thing. That and he lost his power to "daddy" then got it back, but not quite. I just thought any amount of planning would have revealed problems with making him so powerful, especially (or at least) so soon.<p><p>2) They Didn't Depower Sylar: So they depowered the only guy on the same power level as the bad guy, then left said bad guy as a virtual god. Some interesting work with Peter w/ the Haitian's powers, but I'd rather they tried more with two uber-powerful characters (ala. Superman and Zod or similar), then maybe introduce some way that would explain the depowering. Although largely, I just had issues with the whole Daddy Petrelli so that may have soured me on that situation.<p><p>Still, it was their foresight of ten-year-olds that killed it. The idea of Peter was cool, but then he ran into like EVERYBODY that had these godlike powers, and became uber-powerful right away and then they didn't know what to do with him. If they'd given SOME sort of limiters, or written it so the powers faded, or he had to work them over time to get them to function at full capacity, or SOMETHING. Instead, they just decided to greatly depower him, change his powers, and make him grossly inadequate for dealing with Sylar. Then you more or less make Sylar an on-again/off-again hero. Maybe. Sorta. It was how they tied it all together that didn't work for me.<p><p>-Cheers
June 7, 2010, 10:27 a.m. CST
I guess we will have to agree to disagree with those points. I dind't think it was horrible that Peter had so many powers, but I didn't particularly care for it either. I just felt last season was full of missed opportunities and Samuel was one of them.
June 7, 2010, 10:32 a.m. CST
Missed your post and would like to respond now. 1.) No one died. Ok, totally disagree with you there. A ton of people died in this show from Nuclear guy to Speedster to Nathan. If you said there were too many rebirths, yeah maybe, but Nathan was injured in Season 1, he was going to live, but his life was screwed. Season 2 is probably the closest to rebirth minus the swap that you can get. Ali had twins and the first character did die as well as her husband who was another major player. A twin on TV is almost as common as Fox canceling good show, so really thats a white wash. Also happens in comics all the time from Goblin Queen to Ben Reily to Donna Troy. 2.) The use of Sylar. Sorta agree. Sylar should have died at the end of the fugitive storyline. However Star Trek was coming out and they wanted to have him. I think that was more of NBC decision then anything. Yeah, I was bored to death with his wanting to be a Hero in Season 3 and then again in Season 4. Dude's a villain, leave him at that. His best work was manipulating the Hispanics, pure evil. Of course, changing a villain to hero and back again has been done a many a show and does the name Venom ring a bell. 3.) Hiro went from endearing to mentally challenged and annoying. I think the Villains story arc screwed him up to, but by fugitives he was back to normal. I wanted to see Future Hiro as well, but I am ok with him being Old Man Logan or Days of Future Past Logan where we will never see it in modern day, but if we move ahead he is there. Hiro's story arc in Season 4 was pretty great, the out of nowhere cure was stupid, but I just think the doctors were able to cure him then anything supernatural. It happens that a risky surgery does work. As for the amnesia, again there are far worse examples of that on a number of shows and comics at least his was resolved after a few weeks. 4.) Too many characters with many of them the writers had no idea how to use past season one. I disagree with past season one. Season 3 again with Villains was there major problem with adding too many people. Plus, they killed off Mika's Dad who was in season one, so they were starting a man down. They probably didn't need to spend as much time as they did with the Hispanics. They did add 13 new characters, but most of that was through out the season and not all of them made it either. I thought the Season 2 storyline was fairly tight minus Peter losing his GF in the parallel world and no mourning over it. Season 3 was when they went off the deep end with too many characters. 5.) Repetitive plot point. I do agree to a point. Mrs. Peterelli's character is full of lies, so I have no problems with her having as many secrets as she did. It was the level of secrets that got old. Hiro/Ando are R2/C-3P0 or Sam/Frodo, but less gay for each other. They are archtype characters where one is the hero and the other is forced to be the hero due to friendship. So, it makes sense they would be in each other storylines. Hell, Ando was barely around in season 4. 6.) Weak Big Bads. No. Sylar, Adam, Danko and Sullivan are all great villains in their own way. 7.) They used time travel as a crutch. Yes, but what comic or sci-fi show doesn't. I agree the time travel stuff got out of control. It would have been better if Hiro was a teleporter instead of a Time Lord. Again, Season 3 way over did with the constant going back and forth from dark future to present to past. Yet, they calmed that down in fugitives for the most part and used it sparingly in season 4.
June 7, 2010, 10:33 a.m. CST
But you DON'T give HEROES a chance to wrap up.
June 7, 2010, 11:04 a.m. CST
is that bitterness at the Lost ending? I didn't know.
June 7, 2010, 11:06 a.m. CST
I don't mind some more Heroes episodes. The fans are right tho, Peter was kinda lame when he lost all his powers. I don't care that it's better for the character or whatever, he used to be cool.
June 7, 2010, 11:07 a.m. CST
Fair enough, I don't recall that. I would also have accepted "He was concentrating on not exploding you fool" ;O
June 7, 2010, 11:16 a.m. CST
fuck you Evil Herc! fuck you Sandra Bullock!
June 7, 2010, 11:35 a.m. CST
It's NBC. After all of their shitty new shows fail to register even a blip in the ratings, the NBC execs will probably be on their knees, begging for a facefull of Heroes.
June 7, 2010, 11:38 a.m. CST
Everybody hugs in a church as it flys into the sun!!<p>Oh, and Trip gets electrocuted.
June 7, 2010, 11:43 a.m. CST
The Equalizer. Starring Abe Vigoda.
June 7, 2010, 11:45 a.m. CST
Here are my responses:<br><br> 1.) I exaggerated for effect. No one of substance died though. Of all the main characters, only Nathan died and it took like five time of him dying to stick. <br><br> 2.) No response since you agreed. <br><br> 3.) I don't know. I still hated the Hiro storylines past season one. He never grew for me. <br><br> 4.)Mohindar was useless past season two. They didn't know how to use Matt for much of the later years. Nikki was never useful. <br><br> 5.) The problem was Hiro and Ando wasn't that they were always together, it was always that Hiro was always going out on these hero quests with the same doe eye wonderment no matter how much his character has learned.<br><br> 6.) I still believe most of the bad guys were either cookie cutter or rip offs of comic book, TV shows, or movie characters. Only the actors made them slightly better because they did good casting. We have seen the Danko character a hundred times before. Someone already compared Sullivan to Magneto.<br><br> 7.) Time travel is a crutch of sci-fi, but Heroes overused it. They erased large parts of seasons and deaths through it. As someone mentioned in another post, you never had fear that any of the main characters were in danger because they would be resurrected by plot crutches like this.
June 7, 2010, 12:02 p.m. CST
The show did suck rather consistently. The pilot episode was terribly written and then the show got a little better only to fail after season 1 and never recover. Robo0729's points are still quite valid. Sure, some characters died. Usually it was minor characters that either nobody cared about anyway, hot women who at least much of the heterosexual male viewers were have rather had stick around, or characters with powers that would have provided infinite story potential? Like remember the power of suggestion girl? Season 1 was okay with killing big characters in dramatic ways such as the painter, which furthered Sylar's badassery and furthered the story. But They essentially did kill Nathan every season finale only to find a reset button. And there were just way too many reset buttons on the show between multiple characters having the ability to move through time, heal themselves or others, etc. And the show constantly relied on those reset buttons, which is even worse. Then there's the storylines that the writers simply abandoned in the sloppiest of fashions. The little girl, Molly, whose enormously valuable powers served as the McGuffin of the entire first season was more or less adopted by Matt & Suresh only to be forgotten about completely soon after. And then there's Peter's Irish girlfriend who he cared so much about but then conveniently forgot all about and was never mentioned again. These are giant holes in the writing. Then yes, the characters' motivations and behaviors would change on a dime to suit the plots while other characters continue to make the same stupid mistakes again and again as if they'd never learned anything from past episodes. And I'd have no problem with reforming Sylar to keep him around but not his nonsensical switching back and forth. Then there was also the problem of dragging out short storylines to slow plot progression such as the infamous wonder twin storyline. I don't think the audience would have hated those two as much as they did if it had only taken them 2-3 episodes to get from Mexico to New York but it took about 10-13 episodes. That's ridiculous. And then when they finally did kill one of them it was the least offensive of the two. In fact, since at least the last time I watched the show, they still hadn't killed off the other one. The Speedster character I actually like, so of course she had to have been one of the few permanent deaths in the show. Fuck, I hate Heroes.
June 7, 2010, 12:12 p.m. CST
Nobody want to see anymore Heroes. You had one good idea that was exhausted after 22 episodes. since then it was one failure after the other. Yeah I'm sure this time you must have a good idea. I hope NBC politely declines to take the meeting.As the pathetic ass who told the world "Heroes was never going to be Lost" you were right. Now go away and lick the wounds of your utter failure. I have a feeling Greg Berlanti is going to do a much, much better job at real-life superheroes in this fall's "No Ordinary Family". I'm even willing to bet it lasts more seasons than "Heroes"
June 7, 2010, 12:16 p.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
...will be remembered as the first arc driven null sum television show.
June 7, 2010, 12:17 p.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
...Emma Frost. It would have given Ali Larter something to do for the last four years.
June 7, 2010, 12:38 p.m. CST
To put the public "Heroes" in costumes and go straight into Watchmen, Supreme Power territory with it. You could do a whole plot where Sylar is Superman as far as the rest of the world is concerned meanwhile all the other heroes who know his murderous past are waiting for the other shoe to drop. Costumed Heroes are in vogue again so why the hell not, I mean who doesn't want to see Hayden P and Ali Larter in form fitting superhero costumes.
June 7, 2010, 12:53 p.m. CST
"Really? Are we going to risk that? We have enough stuff to [deal with]." They also said things about how they've moved on, using terms like "passed it" and "leapfrogged it". <p>Then they called him a dipshit.
June 7, 2010, 12:54 p.m. CST
shutupfanboy, you can't just paint comics in one broad stroke, anymore that you can paint all television. I know many, many, comics that have been more intricately plotted in ways that make sense, consistent characters with believable depth, and better follow-through and resolution than Heroes. Your argument that 'Heroes is just like comics' is bullshit. It's like bad comics, maybe. The medium of comic books is just as varied as television. Even the superhero genre is more varied than just one type of story.
June 7, 2010, 1:18 p.m. CST
Will that work for Kring? THE 3 coolest characters:Peter Petrelli, Hiro and Sylar. After season1 , we never got the Peter will ALL his powers vs. Sylar with ALL HIS powers. How could the showrunners be that stupid? I would guess the effects budget had alot to do with it, but everyone I know (back in 2007, the last time we talked bout Heroes), wanted a Peter vs. Sylar smackdown. NEVER FUCKING GOT IT.
June 7, 2010, 1:18 p.m. CST
NOW pitch the second episode. WHY ARE YOU IN THE TV BIZ IF YOU CANT THINK OF EPISODIC STORIES?? GO INTO TERRIBLE MOVIES NOW TIM.
June 7, 2010, 1:22 p.m. CST
But it never went anywhere - oh wait Lost didn't either. Wasted my time with both shows. The last ep of heroes was called "brave new world" the same as the next chapter, it was told in seconds, and a fitting end to the series. Unless the finally decide to show "Shenkar" that they always hint at but never do, I hope heroes stays dead.
June 7, 2010, 1:24 p.m. CST
Kring had chance after chance after chance to make this show work, and he blew it almost every time.
June 7, 2010, 1:50 p.m. CST
What a crock.
June 7, 2010, 1:59 p.m. CST
cuz it was fun theorising on it for 5 years but then when you realise the fans put more work into making the mythology work than the writers did, it is a bit of a kick to the balls <P><P>And why was Christain Shepherd's body not in the coffin again?
June 7, 2010, 2:12 p.m. CST
It was finally starting to get interesting! I like Sylar and Peter as Super Best Friends. And I wanna see more of President Michael Dorn!
June 7, 2010, 2:16 p.m. CST
I was looking at lost from a SCIENTIFIC point of view, as the creators have told us to look at it through since I dunno Season 1. I wanted answers to the scientific questions brought up on the island. They royally jerked me around, with the "light of god" BS they pulled. I have already sold my complete lost Blu-ray Collection - Waste of time, money and energy. Heroes was the same way too, the writers were too lethargic to remember what someone else had just written two episodes back sometimes. And then they just abandon plot points all together even worse than lost? Both shows -- total waste of time.
June 7, 2010, 2:23 p.m. CST
I don't know what exactly made you think you should be watching LOST from a strictly scientific point of view, especially the first season.<P> The island was obviously magic from the beginning, when it had monsters and paralyzed people walking and psychics and curing cancer, etc.<P> Not to mention Jack and Locke's man of science man of faith argument.
June 7, 2010, 2:27 p.m. CST
I didn't particularly like the Lost finale. I personally feel they shortshrifted the island resolution (and I don't mean answering unanswered questions, but properly resolving the entire protector of the light/MIB storyline) for sentimental flashbacks in the flashsideways world. But I like the show all the way up to that point.<br><br> As for Heroes, I watched mostly from habit. I lost my passion for the show in season two and even had the final four episodes of last season on my DVD for two months before I actually watched them.
June 7, 2010, 2:29 p.m. CST
was that they ALWAYS said they knew 'what' the smoke monster was and that we would find out at the end of the series. And what did we find out? Well, a man threw his unconscious bother into a cave and out it came. It can take the form of dead people and...well thats it. The water, the flashes, the scanning, blah. Lets just have them all hug in purgatory instead
June 7, 2010, 2:40 p.m. CST
That's the least NBC can do for those of us who have stuck with it from day one.
June 7, 2010, 3:30 p.m. CST
Because the creators NEVER told you to look at it from a scientific approach. You misread or misinterpreted a quote in which the creators said that, in Season One, every bizarro moment also had a rational explanation. They didnt' say they rational explanation was the CORRECT one, mind you, they were saying, and the writer of that article backs this up within the same paragraph, that they took great care for their to be a debate about the science vs faith. But they never said science IS the explanation, only that at that point there WERE scientific explanations.
June 7, 2010, 3:31 p.m. CST
A raging storm of an ID without a body, a wandering mind capable of looking into others' thoughts and taking the forms of dead, soulless bodies. <p> Also, I always assumed Christian Shepherd's body fell out of the coffin as it fell from the plane. That, or the airline never put the body in the coffin, as they had a problem transporting the body back in that particular Season One episode and lied to Jack just to placate him...
June 7, 2010, 3:34 p.m. CST
Do you remember the French movie Brotherhood of the Wolf? Our local theater actually had to put up signs warning people that the movie had subtitles because apparently they had so many people demanding their money back when they realized it wasn't in English.
June 7, 2010, 3:36 p.m. CST
Heroes was a terrible show with a terrible ending. I don't really think Heroes was ever very good to begin with. <br><br> LOST was a great show with a terrible ending. It belongs in history with The X-Files, another watershed series that WAS great, but sadly lost its footing at the end.
June 7, 2010, 3:36 p.m. CST
Or lack thereof- a friend's mother was watching "Team America". It begins in France with French puppets and terrorists speaking to each other. Its obvious the terrorists are speaking gobblety gook like "durka durka muhammed jihad". <p> She turns to her family and says "I'm not watching this movie if its in a foreign language".
June 7, 2010, 3:38 p.m. CST
Cause wow, that show sucks.
June 7, 2010, 3:46 p.m. CST
With all it's flaws, it was still more interesting to watch than this wasteland of teen dramas we're left with post-Lost, and it had a fantastic cast. Christ, I'd rather watch that cast do crossword puzzles than watch half the crap that's on TV.
June 7, 2010, 4:01 p.m. CST
Sounds more like you hated season six. You knew none of those answers were coming, yet you're still bitter. The finale was great, the season mostly sucked.
June 7, 2010, 4:04 p.m. CST
If abc had paid him to
June 7, 2010, 4:39 p.m. CST
on Season Six's final, the Lost series is pretty kick ass.
June 7, 2010, 4:51 p.m. CST
...or wrap-up, or whatever, they were hoping for? Or is this something different that will again have an open ending? And Herc, I do not love your idea for a series ending. No. I do not.
June 7, 2010, 4:53 p.m. CST
were coming all the way to the end. Just gullible I guess
June 7, 2010, 5:11 p.m. CST
The light was Electromagnetic Energy. All we don't know is what would have happened if Jack hadn't put the cork back in. Yup, he pushed the button. <P> And they left that answer unexplained as a metaphor for the universe. The point is we won't ever know the true nature of the universe (you can either believe God exists or not), so what makes life worth living is other people. <p> I don't agree with it, but it was still well done. <p> (Oh, and the flashsideways aren't about an after life. They're a metaphor for your life flashing before your eyes right before you die. That's why it has no time or place and Juliet said stuff from it on her death bed.)
June 7, 2010, 5:16 p.m. CST
wants you to drink the koolaid
June 7, 2010, 5:23 p.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 6:10 p.m. CST
again would be if they wiped away the past few seasons. The show started sucking with the S1 finale so that's where they should go back to. It wouldn't even be hard to do since they have time travelers.
June 7, 2010, 6:37 p.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 7:10 p.m. CST
Nothing original at all. Lets take Lost and mix it with X-Men and other comic book stories. First season was overrated and below average at best.
June 7, 2010, 7:39 p.m. CST
Is NBC going to have to serve him a restraining order?
June 7, 2010, 7:48 p.m. CST
June 7, 2010, 7:52 p.m. CST
by Captain Hollywood
Right on all accounts. Heroes was an episodic show disguised as a serial. Stuff happened, but characters never grew. After season 1 the characters were making the same stupid mistakes they always did. For all it's faults of people calling 24 repetitive it always TRIED to remain somewhat original. Characters GREW throughout the years, and sometime during just one day itself.
June 7, 2010, 8:45 p.m. CST
Monica, a.k.a St.Joan, had so much potential, but was blown up in a fire, and wasted. Typical Kring. Peter neutered to one power. I used to love Heroes, but it became to melodramatic. After season 1 they thought they would outlast Smallville. Like Kevin Spacy as Lex Luthor said: WRONG!
June 7, 2010, 8:50 p.m. CST
Pitching this to another network. It's like getting fired from a job, and trying to get your job back, and you were fired for stealing from the bank you worked at. The bank: You fired Mr. Kring, and the cops are here to take you in.. Kring: But I'll never do it again, I thought the money in the drawer was mine to take, besides, I'll work overtime to pay it back! Give a rest Kring, the party's over!
June 7, 2010, 9:41 p.m. CST
No, No, NO!! <BR><BR> Why is Kring even around? <BR><BR> This talentless, clueless idiot is responsible for the greatest mishandling of a series in entertainment history. Seriously. I can't think of anyone who so F'd up a can't-lose-premise.<BR><BR> He should be selling insurance or cleaning pools or something. <BR><BR>
June 7, 2010, 10:49 p.m. CST
by Chief Joseph
I saw one episode of this at a friend's house. Some white guy in ancient Japan, meanwhile some Mexican broad is driving in a car and kills some Minutemen. Stretched out for an hour. I knew it was shite and never watched it again.
June 7, 2010, 11:11 p.m. CST
Fuck this Heroes shit. How about a LOST miniseries, with Hurley/Ben, answering some questions bitches.
June 7, 2010, 11:52 p.m. CST
In terms of quality and from most interesting to less. There, I said it.
June 7, 2010, 11:52 p.m. CST
with the first season finale. How anyone can call that finale a high point boggles the mind. They built up a showdown and we got maybe less than 5 minutes of one. The minute it ended, I stopped caring about this godforsaken program.
June 8, 2010, 12:04 a.m. CST
potenial does not equal quality. Y'all Flashforward fans needs to admit you just like what the show could've been, not what it actually was.
June 8, 2010, 12:09 a.m. CST
was completely wasted. It was called "Generations", so I thought there would be some epic back story about the previous group of heroes. It seemed to start out that way with the death of Sulu, but it just got sidetracked with the boring twins, irish chick, amnesiac peter, and neutered Sylar. I was expecting it to all tie together somehow, but just never seemed to get there. Many tried to blame the writer's strike but I felt they probably just ended up doing us a favor. The "Villians" and "Fugitives" chapters of the third season were worse than the badly drawn x-men comic strips I drew in my school notebooks in the fifth grade. I saw some potential in the fourth season, but by then I didn't care. I can't even remember how the season ended, so I'm not really pining for a miniseries.
June 8, 2010, 1:09 a.m. CST
She'll be in a shitty romantic comedy before long.
June 8, 2010, 1:19 a.m. CST
HEROES freaking made you want to go back in time and ERASE all that shit! LOST is in another league, dimension, bracket... etc. <p> Let HEROES die. I still have somewhat fond memories of Season 1 up to the finale, but the rest thankfully has faded away.
June 8, 2010, 1:41 a.m. CST
by The Bicycle Sharer
The show that managed to suck worse than the final season of Lost. Quite an accomplishment, guys! You should be proud.
June 8, 2010, 3:29 a.m. CST
that pre-Season 3 launch party.<br /><br />They were talking about how awesome the show was, and yet coming off the end of Season 1 and the aborted piece of shit season 2, it was obvious to many that the show was on its last legs.<br /><br />And yet they were all acting as if they were gods who had single handedly saved tv.<br /><br />Fucking hell was that annoying.
June 8, 2010, 7:53 a.m. CST
Its funny that you mention that, my friends and I drove an hour or so to the theater knowing it would be subtitled. It was opening night and maybe 20 people were there then a bunch of teenagers came in sat in the front row. After ten minutes of them acting like idiots, they must of realized it was only in French and left. Thank God, I fucking hate kids. It was a good movie even with the unnecessary sidekick death. As for Heroes, I admit the show has some flaws probably one or two deep ones, but I would watch a mini-series. Of course, I am ok with the ending as is. I think most of the writers knew it was going to be the end anyway and didn't give it the cliffhanger finale it could have been. Like I said, I don't think there is much of an outcry, because the finale was so good why fuck it up with a mini-series that will probably kill most of the Heroes and make you feel like shit after its done. I don't want another Firefly movie where I feel more depressed after watching the movie then the fact it got canned. Worst epilogue to a show ever.
June 8, 2010, 12:49 p.m. CST
Anyone who can fuck up a show this simple needs to be kept far away from any show ever again. Oooh, they're in hiding? I bet they just wish they could be normal. It's so rough having magic powers.<br /> <br /> As for the de-powering of Peter, yes it was a good move, but not before they gave us at least one Peter-Sylar show down. That's why it felt off.<br /> <br /> My take on Heroes vs Lost: I'd say S1 of Heroes easily beats S3 and S6 of Lost, but that's it.