Cool News
Hey Arizona, Don't Fuck With This Mexican... MACHETE has some Cinco De Mayo words for you!!! Now in 720p!
Hey folks, Harry here and earlier today Robert Rodriguez and Danny Trejo dropped by my house with a package. Rodriguez is calling this his "Illegal" trailer. You see, Robert talked Fox into letting him put together a Cinco De Mayo message for ARIZONA - given. Well, the way things are in Arizona at this moment - it is kinda insane that there is a movie that was shot over a year ago waiting to be released that is about - THIS EXACT ISSUE... but if, Danny Trejo and buddies went Revolution Wacko as a result.
Make no bones about it, this is a pure Mexploitation film, but like real exploitation at its height, that shit was pulled straight out of the headlines, even sometimes slightly before the headlines were the headlines. Frankly - that's just kinda cool. We've all known about this silly fun project of Robert's for a while, but then... an entire fucking state just goes fucking nuts... And us being Texans - we're usually quite aware of the lunacy of our surroundings here. But really, ARIZONA... what the hell?
For your pure enjoyment here you go my friends, Happy CINCO DE MAYO! Spread this Everywhere!!!
Now in 720p!!!
Readers Talkback
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As a Tucsonan who moved to Austin, I am embarrassed for my former home state. I can't wait to see this!
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Pretty awesome cast there.
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May 5, 2010, 3:30 a.m. CST
De Niro and Seagal in the same movie?
by The Guy Who Slept Through Everything.
Ge the fuck out of here!
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...we know from the Grindhouse trailer. The "introducing Don Johnson" gag was lame, though.
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Yeah, this trailer pretty much kicks ass.
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I've seen some wild promotional studio stunts in the past, but setting up the passage of a law to promote a film takes the cake.
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Harry, cut the liberal bitching and moaning. All of you assholes seem to think that we can just allow millions of undocumented people to infiltrate this country and leach off it. Every day our people are getting murdered by criminalien thugs and drug dealers. I guess that doesn't matter to fat liberal jackass nerds.
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"where are my wife and daughters?" guess this one won't get an X rating. :(
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That was cool!
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cmown!
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2 ex-LOST cast members in the same trailer
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so everyone who comes here illegally is a thug drug dealer?
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Motherfucker. Yes!
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And I was saying yes to the awesome trailer not you JaviT.
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Are people that come here "illegally" law breakers?
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Not everyone who comes here illegally is a drug dealer or a thug. But everyone who comes here illegally IS a criminal because they're breaking the law by doing so. And they should be subject to legal action. They're called ILLEGALS for a reason. Machete looks cool tho.
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Danny Trejo = Conan the Cimmerian.
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ABSOLUTELY FUCKING BRILLIANT!
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what he said
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May 5, 2010, 4:34 a.m. CST
Why my Friend Roger Ebert is Dead Wrong about Name Dropping
by EddieMurphysLaugh
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... this is the shit right here!!!!
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This is gonna be outrageous! Can't wait. Oh yeah, Fuck Arizona! Piece of shit, racist shithole. Back in the late 80's, U2 wouldn't play there 'cause they wouldn't acknowledge Martin Luther King Day? This isn't their 1st rodeo, people. MACHETE 4 Presidente!
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enforce the law !
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this looks all kinds of awesome. In fact, let the countdown begin. This may well be the best movie I've seen in years...and NICE blending of the old with the new. Fuck Kickass and all the shit thats supposed to appeal to real fanboys...this movie is heaven for fans of Trejo and exploitation cinema. Viva Machete!!!!!!
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This has left me with a strange, confusing mix of emotions.
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amazing. <p>AMAZING! Robert De Niro as a redneck politician? And Don Johnson and Steven Seagal and Jeff Fahey and Jessica Alba and Lindsay Lohan? Fuck. Me.
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Please eventually set Troublemaker up as a sort of Roger Corman Film School so I can come and make real movies with you. I will work for free, and work very very hard to create art and real counterculture cinema. I write scripts and can learn very quickly to do pretty much anything. Thank you.
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Badass!!!
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did they happen to mention when the Planet Terror/Death Proof double feature blu ray will ever come out?
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Up next on Turner Classic Movies...
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ROFL!!! Perfect.
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Strangely....the weakest part of that trailer appears to be De Niro. Seems like he's phoning it in. The rest of the it looks great.
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I seriously can't wait for this. It's hard to believe that it actually got made.
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and said Rothman made him an offer he couldn't refuse
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May 5, 2010, 6:01 a.m. CST
THAT LOOKS FUCKING GREAT!!! GLAD RR GOT RID OF THE SCRATCHES....
by TehCreepyThinMan
I was worried that he was going to make Machete look like Planet Terror with all the fake scratches and print fuck ups that IMHO detracted from that movie. Anyway, Machete looks like nice R-rated fun for the whole family. The only problem is that I doubt that Michelle Rodriguez, Jessica Alba or Lindsay Lohan get naked for this. RR should have just hired some porn actresses.
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I'd like to know.
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May 5, 2010, 6:08 a.m. CST
OH AND TELL RR TO MOVE HIS ASS ON SIN CITY 2 & 3 KNOWLES!!!
by TehCreepyThinMan
It's been five cunting years since that masterpiece came out and it's pisses me right the fuck off that we STILL haven't got any sequels.
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May 5, 2010, 6:17 a.m. CST
ALSO, NO FUCKING OBIT FOR JAMIE GILLIS? FUCK YOU KNOWLES!!!
by TehCreepyThinMan
I can't believe that I just found out that porn legend Jamie Gillis died on February 19th of this year from melanoma. Well, I guess that when AICN can't be bothered to do a obit on Ed McMahon, a WW2 vet and 30 year co-host of The Tonight Show, it stands to reason that you wouldn't care about the death of a someone who portrayed a mentally disturbed man that sexually assaulted women by administering enemas in the 1976 porno classic Waterpower. Jamie Gillis R.I.P. AICN F.U.C.K.Y.O.U.
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I can't wait
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the objection is NOT illegals..its profiling based on race..yeah..how the fuck would you like it? pick your own fruits and do your own dirty work then redneck fuckwits.
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Now thats what you call a trailer....Looks cool..
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This looks like a fun ride, can't wait!
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I've written a screenplay for it and am looking for feedback. Find it at: http://tinyurl.com/378ew9n
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can't wait.
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this looks awesome!
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Scalp them.
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Golden. GOLDEN I SAY!
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Redneck DeNiro. Steven F'n Seagal. (Will he use his Seagal-Vision?) Fuckin' A.
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of the word ILLEGAL does a mentally capable adult NOT understand? Sheesh. Besides, MAYBE the Messiah will FINALLY enact some enhanced FEDERALLY RUN border control as a result. Arizona's budget will never be able to hold up under the costs associated with this legislation in the long run anyway.
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"The border crossed us?" That's terrible.<p> Still, I'm looking forward to this. You need only say Danny Trejo and I'll hand over $10
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on American politics with a trailer to a movie? <p> That's a hell of an argument there. <p> "What about Health Care Mr. Trejo?" <p> "Uhhh, watch the trailer to Home Alone 2."
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You know what I like
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It's early.
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how insane is it to actually empower the police to do their jobs? it's such an insane concept that wow man you are right theyr just going crazy over there.
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THis trailer is the best yet.
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Can't wait to see what happens with his career!
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This is a dream come true.
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Obvious. Caucasian. Bullsh*t. Thanks, Harry, for being one of very few white men (and you are very white) that I think Machete would call "hermano".
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do any of you morons understand that the AZ bill mirrors FEDERAL LAW??? and god forbid if you punks had a work ethic and had parents that made you work at a young age like working in restaurant or picking fruit, maybe we wouldnt hear the nonsense of who will do these god awful jobs...go smoke your weed and have a shitty K/D ratio on Halo
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congratulations rodriguez
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perhaps you should just hand over your country to the Canadians. We'll do our best to get you re-instated into the Commonwealth. It's for your own good...
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Politics of the real situation aside - the film has gotta be a success, it looks too damn good a time to fail. I'm willing to bet Lohan's hoping it makes a lot of bank, it's about her only hope of getting other projects to hire her now.
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Some Lohan/Alba lesbo action would make this the greatest movie ever.
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It's been YEARS, and you are still bitching about it? Harry's not changing, so suck it, bitches. <p> Movie looks awesome, btw. How is it that Michelle Rodriguez manages to get HOTTER with each passing year?
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IT HAS COME TO PASS!
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machete se ve que va a estar buena. se ve mejor que el trailer aunque prefiero el calvo que le dispara a machete y lo que le pasa despues. buen trabajo!!
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Mattheius2783 is absolutely correct. This AZ law you're all screaming about has been a Federal law since the 1950s. The problem is the Feds don't enforce it, so AZ says fine, we'll codify it as state law and enforce it ourselves. Nobody can be forced to show their ID as they're playing in the park with their kids or shopping in the supermarket, so calm the fuck down. You'd have to already be detained for cause having nothing to do with your status before anyone can demand to see proof of citizenship. You're all coming off like a bunch of screaming nincompoops.
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NT I rarely visit this site these days, since there are so many others that are so much better. Harry's rampant ignorant liberalism is the main reason why. I want to know about cool news. Not some fat fuck's idiot politics.
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Lol I mean c'mon, it's hard to beat that. Great stuff! ;D
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And I think this new law is needed. Pennsylvania is now discussing this as they have issues with illegals as well. Oh and it's not just illegals from Mexico and other South American countries. You have Chinese and Russians coming into this country illegal. It's not a race thing. Only people who are ignorant are trying to turn it into a racial profiling problem. The problem is I agree that police will use racial profiling more in AZ because the majority of the illegals are hispanic. In New York City there are a lot of illegals that are white, black, etc etc. Either way I can't wait to see Machete!! Now where are our Sin City sequels?
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Just you wait....
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Everyone is pulling the racist card and claiming racial profiling. Time to read the actual law. It works the same way as most seat belt laws. They only ask if you are pulled over or stopped for doing something else first. They do not go around asking randomly as some would have you believe. AS for the profiling comments, when a black man robs a bank, do you go around looking for a white man just to not seem racist. That would be stupid and a major waste of time. If you are trying to crack down on Illegal Mexicans crossing the border, are you going to look for Germans as well to make it seem fair? That would be stupid and a waste of time. You are going to look for Mexicans as those are who you are trying to stop. Time for this country to use some common sense and stop the Racist crap that the left has been pushing anytime the don't agree with anything.
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It is the application of the law that is disturbing.... What constitutes probable cause? The potential for profiling is there unfortunately....
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On the one hand, it is a simple fact that the Arizona law simply mirrors the unenforced federal law.<p> It's also true that, when you share a border with an unstable, violence-prone nation, it's incumbent upon you to defend that border.<p> On the other hand, ever taken a look at how hard it is for a hard-working, non-parasitic individual to LEGALLY immigrate to the United States? It's crazy. There is no good reason to make it harder for WORKERS to immigrate.<p> http://tinyurl.com/5rarwo<p> At the end of the day, going by the Federal government's actions, the Feds are AGAINST legal immigration and FOR illegal immigration.<p> It's just ass-backwards.
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cant wait for this friggin movie
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Robert Rodriguez will never work with whatshisface...the comic book guy, who wrote the graphic novel, ever again. Creative differences, egos, and whatnot.
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Luckily, there is an entire web site devoted to that question:<p> www.probablecause.org
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Police can only ask for identification/proof of citizenship in conjunction with another violation... ie running a red light, etc. Also, the person who is pulled over reserves the right to sue the police department if they've been harassed. So, what's the big deal? I doubt this video will generate any press... because Robert Rodriguez isn't relevant anymore. If this trailer was a skit on Will Ferrell's "Funny or Die" site then it might have caused waves. I'm just surprised Lindsay Lohan was sober enough to do this film.
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May 5, 2010, 9:23 a.m. CST
What idiot protestors demand to be allowed to break the law?
by Kentuckian
1. The "papers please" nonsense is hysterical. The AZ law does NOT allow police to stop anyone on suspicion of illegal immigrant status, but requires the same probable cause as is extant. 2. Illegal immigrants protesting because they are not given the "right" to break the law is insane. 3. We should make it easier to immigrate legally, but must enforce the immigration laws and secure the borders.
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And another thing, talk about one's "civil" liberty's being shit on, what about ACTUAL citizens who civil liberties have been shit on buy these leaches who suck the out of the tax pot with free schooling, healthcare, housing, food etc. not to mention 1/3rd of all prisoners we pay for are illegals...and what do they do when they finally earn a buck...send it back home...if illegals are so great why the hell is their country a hell hole? anyways this movie will still be great...
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May 5, 2010, 9:26 a.m. CST
There's also a great little documentary on probable cause...
by Royston Lodge
"10 Rules For Dealing With The Police"<p> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmrbNLt7Om8 (remove spaces as required)<p> Produced by a couple of former CATO Institute interns. That's correct, right-wingers!
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Long interview with Danny about his roles going back to the mid-80s. This movie looks bad-ass, and I love the Frost Bank Tower (known to me as the Austin Ghostbusters Building) in the background of Michelle Rodriguez's sniping.
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ARIZONA will look like Disneyland in comparison. I really can't understand what the protest is about? You want to ALLOW illegal immigrants in your state/country? The ones who leech off resources paid for by hard working tax paying citizens?
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for some thing or the other.
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I would gladly pick my own fruit and do my own dirty work if it meant cleansing my neighborhood of the uneducated, filthy, CRIME COMMITTING pieces of shit that have totally RUINED my city. The fact that they are Mexican has nothing do with it. They could be non English speaking Germans for all I care. Even as I type this the stink of chicken shit is drifting through my window from the 2 "farms" I am forced to live between (in the middle of a goddamn metropolitan city!!) It's not Doctors and Lawyers crossing our borders, it's lower - lower class peasants (and as a nice bonus a chunk of them are violent criminals!)I just want to live in a nice neighborhood and be able to actually communicate with my neighbors.<p> But I guess that makes me a racist redneck.
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I'm Hispanic.
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May 5, 2010, 9:39 a.m. CST
In Mexico it's illegal for non-citizens to DISCUSS Mexican polit
by Royston Lodge
According to Mexico's "General Law of the Population":<p> - Noncitizens cannot "in any way participate in the political affairs of the country." A plethora of Mexican statutes enacted by its congress limit the participation of foreign nationals and companies in everything from investment, education, mining and civil aviation to electric energy and firearms. Foreigners have severely limited private property and employment rights.<p> - The Mexican government will bar foreigners if they upset "the equilibrium of the national demographics."<p> - If outsiders do not enhance the country's "economic or national interests" or are "not found to be physically or mentally healthy," they are not welcome. Neither are those who show "contempt against national sovereignty or security." They must not be economic burdens on society and must have clean criminal histories. Those seeking to obtain Mexican citizenship must show a birth certificate, provide a bank statement proving economic independence, pass an exam and prove they can provide their own health care.<p> - Illegal entry into the country is equivalent to a felony punishable by two years' imprisonment. Document fraud is subject to fine and imprisonment; so is alien marriage fraud. Evading deportation is a serious crime; illegal re-entry after deportation is punishable by ten years' imprisonment. Foreigners may be kicked out of the country without due process and the endless bites at the litigation apple that illegal aliens are afforded in the United States (see, for example, President Obama's illegal alien aunt -- a fugitive from deportation for eight years who is awaiting a second decision on her previously rejected asylum claim). <p> - Law enforcement officials at all levels -- by national mandate -- must cooperate to enforce immigration laws, including illegal alien arrests and deportations. The Mexican military is also required to assist in immigration enforcement operations. Native-born Mexicans are empowered to make citizens' arrests of illegal aliens and turn them in to authorities. <p> - Mexico's National Catalog of Foreigners tracks all outside tourists and foreign nationals. A National Population Registry tracks and verifies the identity of every member of the population, who must carry a citizens' identity card. Visitors who do not possess proper documents and identification are subject to arrest as illegal aliens.<p> (Source: http://tinyurl.com/29pekus )
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Rey Mystero.... papers please...!
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Looks a lot like Planet Terror in style. Hope he can bring in some unique style tricks to this film. Off course this project is 10 times more awesome than anything coming out except for Predators and Inception.
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Then go complain about how the government doesn't work. Sigh.
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I generally think that your overall argument is solid.... But please do not bring other nations' laws into dicussions concerning US policy. At some point we have to agree that different nations and cultures have different ideologies that are just as valid as US doctrine.
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May 5, 2010, 9:41 a.m. CST
classicgamenerd: You'll have to move to a hyper-liberal area.
by Royston Lodge
The cities that enforce municipal laws and regulations prohibiting that sort of thing tend to be the richer, hyper-liberal towns that like to regulate every moment of their residents' lives.
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i forgot liberals love free speech only if you agree with their alice and wonderland bizzaro world bullshit point of view...
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May 5, 2010, 9:43 a.m. CST
Darfur: My point is that the Mexican government has been...
by Royston Lodge
...extremely critical of Arizona's law.<p> http://tinyurl.com/26rcsqr<p> Of course, I forgot to mention that.
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grindhouse solidarity!
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Mexico's immigration policy is harsher than the U.S. <br> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12250584/ <br> "If Arnold Schwarzenegger had migrated to Mexico instead of the United States, he couldn’t be a governor. If Argentina native Sergio Villanueva, firefighter hero of the Sept. 11 attacks, had moved to Tecate instead of New York, he wouldn’t have been allowed on the force. Even as Mexico presses the United States to grant unrestricted citizenship to millions of undocumented Mexican migrants, its officials at times calling U.S. policies “xenophobic,” Mexico places daunting limitations on anyone born outside its territory. In the United States, only two posts — the presidency and vice presidency — are reserved for the native born. In Mexico, non-natives are banned from those and thousands of other jobs, even if they are legal, naturalized citizens."
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Ah Taco Bell!
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Must you guys bring politics into everything?
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Given? Given what? Edit man, edit. You. Do. Not. Make. Sense.
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Amazing, I tells ya
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so many ignorant, white trash rednecks on this site. Illegal immigration is a problem. Arizona's solution is outrageous and unconstitutional. You want to stop illegal immigration? Have strict liability and heavy fines imposed on companies employing anyone under the table. Abusiness that cannot survive without slave labor does not deserve to exist. Also, raise the minimum wage and benefits.
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It's not like we're talking about the 2,700 page monstrosity known as Obamacare. That made War & Peace look like a leaflet and was written in legalese that even Congress couldn't comprehend. And for those of you who've read the Arizona law(which obviously excludes Harry, the Hollywood left, most of the media, and a bunch of politicians), it clearly states that THERE CAN BE NO RACIAL PROFILING! They even went back and added stronger language to emphasize that. If you support open borders, fine. Just say it. Don't play the "race card" or "civil rights card" because you don't have the stones to admit it.
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last time i checked the constitution doesn't apply to ILLEGALS...oh and dumbass if you raise the minimum wage the cost of everything will go up, companies have the make up that difference of a labor cost increase with a product cost increase...do you really think it's a skilled job to flip burgers at mcdonalds and that person should be paid $20 an hour...give me a break
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last time i checked the constitution doesn't apply to ILLEGALS...oh and dumbass if you raise the minimum wage the cost of everything will go up, companies have the make up that difference of a labor cost increase with a product cost increase...do you really think it's a skilled job to flip burgers at mcdonalds and that person should be paid $20 an hour...give me a break
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Every Mexican may have an entire knife store under his coat, I guess.
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Will we see someone in the crowd wearing a green jacket and sporting a mohawk when he gives his big outdoor speech? <p> And Don Johnson is in this?! <p> And there's a confirmation- Jeff Fahey IS in the movie! <p> Lindsay Lohan can fuck right off. Bitch.
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And how much of it was reshot I wonder?
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She would have NEVER EVER taken a role in a Rodriguez movie had her career not gone so far down the shitter and had she not blown her entire fortune on nose-poison. <p> The chick is a desperate crack-whore at this stage in the game.
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Obviously aren't thinking hard enough about it. And if you're a conservative Republican, I don't understand how you can't see how antithetical it is to your beliefs. That is the government intruding on YOUR lives. That is the government basically saying it is okay at any time to ask YOU for your papers as if you live in Communist Russia. And if you forgot them at home? Guess what- you're going to jail. I hope your employers understand and don't fire you for not showing up for work that day. <p> I sure hope the tide doesn't turn one day and the majority of immigrants look like white Europeans. Or that its not the Irish again who are persecuted. Or the Italians. <p> Yes, we need to stop the massive influx of illegal immigrants, but this isn't the best way. It borders on unconstitutional, and its dangerous. Illegal immigrants won't report crimes to the police anymore for fear they will be deported. You know who they will turn to instead? The gangs. The Mexican Mafia. That's how it worked in the past. That's how it will work now. Its a bad, bad move. <p> Anyway, my two cents.
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And makes Chubby Rain.
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Your take on the AZ bill is simply wrong. No AZ LEO can stop anyone just to "see their papers." Have you ever been pulled over for speeding? I guarantee you they ask for a driver's license 100% of the time. That does not make this Stalinist Russia or Nazi Germany...
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Said nothing about the police needing "cause" to ask for ID and proof of citizenship. In fact, it required police to ask that of ANYONE they suspected of being an illegal. It had absolutely NOTHING to do with the suspect doing something wrong until the "liberal retards" complained and the lawmakers made that addendum. So think about that.
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I will gladly admit it. But everything I'd read and heard about the law said that it wasn't until after all the complaints came out that they changed the law to say you could only ask for papers if the person was suspected of an offense.
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One of the greatest tie ins I have seen in a long time. This should be in almost every theater. The media heat on it would be great.
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1. This trailer fucking rocked.<p> 2. When's the last time the police invented "cause" to harass anyone? Oh yeah. EVERY FUCKING HOUR.
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The original bill used the term "Legal Contact". It was acknowledged that this term was overly-ambiguous, so it has been amended.<p> Complaining about the language in a bill that is NOT being passed in order to demonize a bill that IS being passed is demagoguery.
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The people championing the bill now were still championing it then when it was way worse. You could have been asked for papers if you reported a crime, and that's not right and makes things more dangerous for everyone in the community. <p> I'm not demonizing the bill, I'm just saying I still think its the wrong approach and needs more work. Yes, if you're arrested, you SHOULD be asked for proof of citizenship. When this bill came out, I was amazed that the police couldn't do that before. But the language of the bill can still be improved.
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May 5, 2010, 10:41 a.m. CST
The things you complain about in the bill, are NOT in the bill
by Kentuckian
...and never were. This movie looks like fun, though.
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I agree, the movie does look like a lot of fun. And I really don't want to turn this into a big debate about the bill. I'd rather discuss the movie and how much Lindsay Lohan sucks. But are you sure those things were never in the bill originally? The bill as it stands now STILL says an officer may arrest someone without a warrant if he "has probable cause to believe that the person has committed any public offense that makes the person removable from the United States."<p> You know what's a public offense? Being in the country illegally. Unless I'm misinterpreting this, it looks like the bill says an officer can arrest someone simply bc he suspects they are here illegally. In other words, the person doesn't have to commit a crime. He only need speak a different language and the cop has everything he needs to go ask for papers. Am I wrong here?
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Moron fuck conservatives
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Look, I grew up in East San Jose. All of my high school friends were Mexican. I've worked washing dishes in the mall, on construction crews, and in other places with almost all-mexican crews and most of them illegal.<p>They just want to work, and support their families. They are good folks, for the most part.<p>However, there's not denying that lots of drugs, lots of gangs, lots of killers come over too...<p>I heard a statistic, not sure if it's true, but that more US Citizens are killed by illegals each year than were killed in both the Iraq and Afghan wars COMBINED!<p>If true, this is unacceptable. Something must be done.<p>The AZ bill has some merit and those people are pissed. It's not just the old rancher who was killed on his own property by an illegal, but some of those gangs are doing car-jackings and stuff in the suburbs, and in some reported cases throwing out a car seat with A BABY INSIDE! <p>Something has to be done...<p>And it ain't Obama's "Imagration Reform" (translate: amnesty)that adds 10 mil new Democrat voters....
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Chickenshit scumbag Liberal
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Can you imagine the blowback if cops in 'Zona did what some fear... round up folks without probable cause? Ain't happening, and the bill makes clear it must not happen.
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But I guess that was the point.
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We have different countries on the Earth for reasons. We have different states in the US for reasons. Not everyone wants to live the exact same way, and almost everyone desires some say in how the laws are enforced in their community/city/state/country...
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Its alright as long as your considered basically a good person. Hey, I'm poor and want a better life. So it's ok that I disregard certain laws correct? <p> Ok, I pick shoplifting. from now on I can shoplift at my leisure and if ANYBODY has anything negative to say about it they will be considered racist and treated like hate mongers.
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...it's RR. Here's hoping he has success in that venture...
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Why don't you Cro-mag shit-stains stand by your convictions and go discuss politics where it matters, like on the streets where you might make a difference, instead of the comments section of a goofy film site about a Mexploitation film. Even the most intelligent, eloquent argument for either side of the issue sounds like infantile vomit because AICN isn't the place for it. Wise up, dummies
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I would argue that a shoplifter is not a good person. You're not even making sense, hombre.
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This movie is a perfect example of why the US is still great. The government passes a law and we get to give them shit without getting shot! What more can you ask for!
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cut off. Nobody is saying it's ok for illegals to break the law. If they do I'll boot them out my damn self. But this bill essentially gives the cops free reign to arrest anyone they want just to get them out of the country, whether they deserve to be or not. Cops make up probably cause on a daily basis.
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Some people would<p> What if I was penniless and stealing food from Wal Mart to feed my family?
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"Nobody is saying it's ok for illegals to break the law"<P> THEY'RE BREAKING THE LAW BY JUST BEING HERE!!<p> Make up your mind, is it ok to break the law or not??
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this was their land for over 4 thousand years before we murdered their ancestors for it a couple hundred years ago. they have more of a moral claim to it than we do. say what you want about not wanting them back, but get off the goddamn fucking high moral horse about it and stop calling someone a criminal for trying to survive.
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That just cured my depression. The world needs this movie!
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we killed how many tens of thousands of people to overthrow another country? who's idea was that? oh, yeah, i remember, the same fucking morons who support the arizona law. to them it's stay out of our country brow skins, but don't mind us invading yours and utterly destroying it.
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we killed how many tens of thousands of people to overthrow another country? who's idea was that? oh, yeah, i remember, the same fucking morons who support the arizona law. to them it's stay out of our country brow skins, but don't mind us invading yours and utterly destroying it.
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all subhumans, go to the back of the site.
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They could blow up Wal-Mart and I'd be happy.
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It's not ok to break the law. If they are here illegally and break the law, fuck'em. But it's also not ok to ascertain who is here illegally based on how they look, which is what this bill opens the door for. If you doubt that fact, you are in serious denial.
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Illegal aliens = Bad<p> Bill = Wrong step in right direction.
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that's just a rule of thumb. i mean it in the cinematic sense. hollywood loves shooting jews. with cameras.
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... in Raising Arizona except A) Stupider B) A lot more racist and C) A lot less funny.
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but these spammers need to get lost. I don't want your damn Jordan's!!!!
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Does anyone here really think that the government is going to do anything about the border? I don't think they are ever going to do shit. How many companies and businesses cheaply hire illegal immigrants? How many of these companies and businesses give money to politicians? How many politicans do we know that screw over everyone else, and does exactly what the people who line their pockets want them to do? We bitch about the government, but what about all these businesses and companies who hire illegal immigrants?
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Illegal is not a race - if a bunch of Irish-Italians were coming across the border from Mexico then they should be asking for their green cards to. Sorry, liberal nut jobs, coming into the country illegally is a crime and if the police have probable cause then they should be allowed to ask to see a green card. There's a right way to become a citizen, until then, maybe you'll have to hire a miad or gardner for more than two bucks an hour.
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And the media spin on this bill is insane. It's not racist. It's a cry for help because the Federal Government isn't doing shit about the human trafficking and drugs that pour across the border every day. I love Mexicans, the food, the women and the culture. Most Arizonans agree. We all live in harmony here. About 50% of our police force is Hispanic btw. The national media is twisting this shit so badly.
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Mexicans are taking over, let's impregnate the white women and all the right winger daughters. that's what's gonna happen. forget about this law. were talking who is who here, what came first. america doesn't even know. hahahaha
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just redneck trolling assholes who live nowhere near Arizona. I can't wait to get back to my fuckwad crazy Texas, cause Arizona sucks. These Mesa suburban assholes are nervous and twitchy about every little goddamn thing and it shows. And so many fake blondes in this state as well. Fuck sheriff Joe Arpaio and fuck the few on this site bitching about liberals. You don't like it, create a right wing movie review site. The rest of us have moved into the next century.
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...and your editorializing about Arizona's new law is bullshit typical of coddling liberal idiocy. This web site should be about movies irrespective of politics, not trumping for ILLEGAL immigrants who are violent and parasitic leeches sucking the teet of government subsidized by taxpayers' money. Look at California. How's its fiscal outlook? And I'm in Utah where Sheriff Deputy was murdered by a couple of illegals, as well as recent murder of a 19-year old West Salt Lake resident who was taking care of her grandmother. All done by illegals and their cohorts. Harry and Robert Rodriguez, you better pray Texas doesn't pass its own identical law, and you thank God Rick Perry, despite his claim of hard-right leaning, would veto the bill. And it's Texas's responsibility to take care of illegal immigration, efficiently or not. No surprise Austin is a sanctuary city. I support Arizona law because we LEGAL American citizens are sick of the crisis compounding, and you spit on those you disagree with just because you're a goddamn Jacobin liberal. The accurate equivalent of a modern liberal is Communist, and Communists are obnoxious about their political belief. La Raza, MEChA, Brown Berets, etc. And hey Robert Rodridguez, settle in Mexico if you feel so patriotic about Mexico but not America yet want to stay in America for the glory of American dream. Hypocrite.
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You make a good point but you failed to address anything I said in my last post.
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They were here for 4,000 years? I think you need to read some history books. Or you can go to Wikipedia and look up "Conquistador". Here is a nice one for you. "Cook and Borak of the University of Berkeley claim that the population in Mexico declined from 25.2 million in 1518 to 700 thousand people in 1623, less than 3% of the original population." I'm not going to defend how the Native Americans were treated in the U.S., but what the Spanish did in Central and South America was basically genocide.
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That was pure bliss! I cannot wait to see this flick!!!!!
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That's the most random cast I've ever seen in a film. Oh yeah, let's not forget that director Bob Clark (Porkys, Christmas Story etc) was killed by a drunk illegal alien who crossed lanes and hit him head on. Just remembered that tragedy with this talkback.
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I love how people say they are against the law because it profiles people and they ask, how would you like it? and then like there is all this hate based on some kind of preconceived idea of who holds a certain political opinion - i.e. white trash redneck, etc. Oh and speaking of hypocrites, check out Mexico's immigration policies: http://tiny.cc/633k3 Who is it that is always talking about race, seeking to make racial divisions? Is it conservatives? Is it those who seek a secure border? Its not. Its continually the left who bring it up, they can't let it go, they can't see past it. I don't care about race, I care about right and wrong - about character - and its the same with every conservative I know. We talk issues. We talk laws and governence and common sense, and we are called racists, morons, bigots, rednecks.
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What do you think those people were that came over on the mayflower! They were called immigrants
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The Arizona law is a mirror of Federal Law. Is Federal Law racist? Harry is so far left wing moronic that he believes anything MSNBC tells him to believe.
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Mexican law states that they can bar foreigners if they upset the "equilibrium of national demographics", yet their Presidente whines like a baby when America even begins to try to control it's borders. The Mexican government would love nothing more than to transfer their entire impoverished, oppressed indigenous underclass over to America.
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Yes, yes. We were all immigrants, ad nauseum. I don't know anybody - anybody, anywhere who is saying close out borders, keep em out! We just want immigrants to be legal, to be documented. Perhaps we need to look how difficult it is to come her legally, and reform those laws, but until then we should (and our Enforecment should be able too) enforce our borders and our laws.
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May 5, 2010, 12:21 p.m. CST
Lighten the fuck up AICN conservatives
by Giant_Dick_Bag_Filled_With_Taco_Meat
It's just a fuckin' movie for fuck's sake that happens to be timely.<br><br>They started making this shit way before this Arizona law was a gleam in that state's eye.<br><br>If you can't enjoy something like this because it doesn't conform to your political ideology than I feel sorry for you. Jesus, I bet some of you are the same assholes who refused to watch Avatar because it was "typical Hollywood liberal garbage".<br><br>Lighten the fuck up already.
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...I say fuck Arizona Republican Governor Jan Brewer and the Arizona Republican controlled lawmakers who made and passed this highly flawed bill WITHOUT the support of Arizonans through the process of an actual vote. However, as Mattheius2783 rightly points out, it is ALREADY a FEDERAL law that it is ILLEGAL to be in the United States ILLEGALLY. Arizona passed the bill to do something on a State level because the US Government has done NOTHING about the flow of illegal immigration on a federal level...which is shameful considering that Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano was formerly the Governor of our state. However, if Arizona, by passing this admittedly flawed bill, can promote actual discussion by people around this country about the problems inherent with illegal immigration, I'm all for it. Are we just supposed to do nothing? Are we just supposed to say "Millions of people came to this country legally and became naturalized citizens. But you came thru a hole in the fence, so you are welcome to increase the debt this state is already in because of the taxes you do not pay despite the services you are provided?” Something needs to be done...on SOME level. Have you people, Harry included, actually even read the bill? People will not be able to be stopped on our streets because they look like they may be here illegally. But that bastion of intelligencia, music artist Shakira, came to town to wag her finger and said so. So it must be true right? The truth is that, if, in the investigation of a crime, the police feel that there may be a reason to question the identity of a suspect then they can be asked for identification to prove who they are. Further, if this line of questioning (of a criminal suspect) then leads the police to be believe that the person is here illegally they can be detained on that basis. Does that mean that Arizona suddenly becomes a Gestapo state where requests of "Papers please" will be an incident of fearful importance outside the examination of criminal activity? No, it means for example, that you need to carry your state approved drivers license in your pocket...which you are supposed to do if you are pulled over driving a vehicle, anyway. But then, I believe you should always carry your identification on you…what if you were run over by a car for crying out loud…you may not be able to speak, so it might be nice to be able to be identifiable in some way, right? But no…“Oh, these monsters want us to have to carry I.D. We're human beings! Can't you just leave us in peace to be here illegally? Boo hoo hoo.” What it comes down to is, if you have done nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear. (Spoken like a true white 43-year old American, I know.) Oh well, Arizona went through the same kind of shit when our Republican Governor (the late Evan Mecham, who thought it was fine to call black children "Pickaninnys", and thought the government was shooting laser beam listening devices at his home) threw out Martin Luther King Day after it was created by his democratic predecessor, because he felt King didn’t deserve a holiday. U2 gave us a bunch of shit on that one...but clearer heads finally prevaled and we (the people) finally were able to vote MLK Day into law. Jeez...the DC Snipers killed a victim here, the 911 masterminds tried to get flight (but not landing) training here, Timothy McVeigh was here practicing how to blow shit up here. Now we have to put up with another shaming visit from Al Sharpton! Hasn't Arizona been through enough?
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it's not what you say that gets you called a racist or a moron or a bigot. it's what you do. you being conservatives. you have gay sex but then equate gay people to pedophiles. you say you want small government but you always massively expand government when you are in power. you question the religion and birthplace of president Obama. just to name a few. you give yourself your reputation by your own actions.
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Why is every article twisted into some hippie-dippie liberal nonsense opinion piece on this site? Machete looks really cool but Harry has to throw his political opinion in there. Texas is as "good ol boy" as any state in the nation. Actors and directors are usually the most uneducated people on the planet so why is their opinion worth anything again? Oh yeah, because they're creative, rich and superior to everyone else. I forgot. Talk about movies and keep your political ramblings at home. Please.....
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Machete is back, baby! HE KNOWS THE SCORE
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May 5, 2010, 12:30 p.m. CST
"directors are usually the most uneducated people on the planet"
by D.Vader
I'll disagree with you there, Quake II.
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"Machete" look likes it will be a lot of fun!
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pretty much make racial profiling legal and encouraged. THAT's what's wrong with them. Also Harry do you reread your posts? "but if, Danny Trejo and buddies went Revolution Wacko as a result." Makes sense. I'll be there opening day for this! Robert DeNiro? Had no idea!
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who gives a shit if most illegals in the country are hard working family oriented people, they are still milking the system dry because they dont pay taxes yet reap the benefits of healthcare schooling and every other freebie the government hands out, why the hell you think california is so fuckd financially???
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I would say that directors are infinately more talented and intelligent than actors. Maybe that statement was too broad but I do hate that Hollywood constantly voices their opinion about politics. Let the criminals (politicians) run the country and actors/directors go use your imagination and entertain me. If I want political views, I'll watch the news.
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...and are persecuted again, don't worry, we know how to handle it... get a load of ax handles and crack a load of heads!
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Viva la revolution!
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That was the best thing about the Grindhouse Machete trailer.
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Hells Yesssss.
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Or a Mexicant?
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May 5, 2010, 1:09 p.m. CST
it's amazing that anyone has a problem with the Arizona law
by TheFifthCylon
So it's now against the law to be in the country illegally. Well, YEAH. DUH. It was before, too. Thus the "being in the country illegally" part. It's about time someone started enforcing the law. Thumbs up, Arizona! But this movie looks great. It's a lot of fun. Who cares if it's "message" is wrong? The Gecko Bros were criminals, too.
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Looking forward to this film. I love Danny Trejo, I love RR. However, too many people are going nuts over this AZ legislation. All the law does is direct local law enforcement to enforce the FEDERAL law. It is not the neo-fascist state mentality. Leave AZ alone. Instead, blame the federal government that seems to want to redistribute wealth more than protect the sovereignty of the national borders. P.S. A nice little note related to Cinco de Mayo, if it were not for the US pressuring France to get the heck out around 1864-67, they would all be speaking French right now.
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That's right you fucking heard me man Jesus get the fuck off that cloud you had your turn it's Rodriguez's shot he knows what us motherfuckers want!!! We Want Don Johnson!!!
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You must live miserable and unbearable lives. Always kicking crying and screaming about a liberal bias in everything you see.
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May 5, 2010, 1:20 p.m. CST
fuck you, aintitcoolnews.com. and fuck you Danny trejo- go back
by THE_ONE_MAN_GANG
If Harry Knowles was born and raised, and lived in Mexico,this website would not be around . and Danny trejo, you ugly fuck, you would not be who you are if it wasnt for the USA. Period. this country is the land of opportunity, and the mexicans want to exploit that, become a legal citizen, like everyone else had to.
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Awooga!!nice
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The number one reason I hear about Arizona's passing of this law is that they were being pushed too far by the cartels and their drug trafficking, human trafficking, and their kidnapping and murdering of innocents. In fact they have a really high kidnapping rate. But.....how does this law combat that exactly? It's not like the cartels really care that the people they sneak over get caught after they've done their part. They get their money from that on the other side of the border.
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Sorry, not liking it compared to the original trailer. Casting Alba, De Niro, Lohan is a mistake and totally ruins the Grindhouse vibe for me. All there scenes seem out of place. Steven Seagal, however, is a stroke of genius...And I don't get that whole "border crossed us thing either". I'm sure at some point in history, yes, there were Mexicans living in the south before the borders were created, but that would of been hundreds of years ago. Anyone alive today was born either here, or there, and if you're from there, you have to cross the border to get here. Makes no sense. It's just a catchy phrase.
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You guys all act like, "Well, I'm a liberal and my friends are liberal, so everybody must be liberal except for those rednecks in the South." Douchebags. If you guys went unchecked America would be nothing but anarchist and socialist and you'd have to revolt just to have your freedom back. My favorite too is how "radical" you guys are to be liberals. Sheesh, the whole media supports every move you make. Want to be radical? Be conservative.
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...I've reached new levels of incredulity when it comes to people's lack of basic logic.<p> The equation of wanting people to enter the country (any country) in an orderly, safe, measurable way to being a racist simply knocks me on my ass!<p> That leap of logic is over a chasm that Evil Knievel wouldn't even dare... maybe that metaphor is something you can get your head around Harry.<p> But man that trailer is PURE GOLD! It truly rocks! The cast is awesome. Too awesome really. I'm wondering if the movie could live up to the awesomeness in that trailer.
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Robert Deniro as Rick Perry? Seagal as the henchman? Michelle Rodriguez's body tight as hell! This movie is all kinds of break my foot off in your ass - so take your racist, redneck, white supremacist, back-assward, short-sighted, uninformed, fux news, palinite political views and shove them up your ass - along with a MACHETE if you can fit it! And "the BORDER crossed us" makes perfect sense you f*cking Tbag Dbag. Alba plays an ICE agent. Pay attention next time.
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I dont charge 125 for septic. I think that is too high.
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And everybody is full of shit. That appears to be the populist message for today.<P>Steady on.
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And I must say, Michelle Rodriguez looked hotter than she's ever been in this trailer. About time she showed off the awesome body that she has.
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and realise that one of the most beautiful things about your country is the immigrants. You're only colorful culture is there!<p>Arizona = Racists!
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that's a herpies sandwich if I've ever seen one.
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No shit.<p> So tell me Einstein, which do you prefer...having good Mexican people come over here so we can under pay them like cheap dogs to do shitty jobs, keep treating them like second class citizens creating animosity? <p> Or would you like to have them come over and have all of the dignity and respect of coming safely and legally and having access to student loans, opportunities for education etc and establishing solid futures for their families generations to come?<p> Think about it asshole.
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in a film where the script is awful or where he is parodying the godfather 20,000th time. Look the world over is having problems with immigration. it is the reason why gordon will leave his position as pm after losing the election for his party. though he seems to have found his passion in the last two days. Ireland I can tell you has not dealt with immigration at all. there has been no debate. no discussion. the irish govt loathes nigerians and is distrustfull of them, a woman cooked up a story about her two daughters would be subjected to Female Genital mutilation if she was deported back to nigeria. it would have been fine accept her story was a load of crap. there was huge debate in ireland about her story, her accurate her claims were FGN. Pamela is still fighting the irish state to stop her deportation. the irish govt kicked out all chinese workers and fastracked the deportations of any chinese student who turned up in ireland on thier own. this was after a series of students were enouraged to come to ireland to study english under false pretences. the english colleges were unregulated and so when these students came looking for work as had been promised, these students came to find that not only was there no work but these colleges didnt exist. the liberals in ireland called the then minister for justice a racist. McDowell was only doing his job. there were the afghans who took shelter in the attick of a church. one of them was linked to the taliban. the media found out about all this. and the liberals werent happy especially about the story connecting one the group to the taliban. So the current govt refuses to have a debate on immigartion. racists are stupid. Nick griffin is a good example. he is the leader of the facist BNP. The only people he wouldnt throw out were the irish because erm "as we know ireland is still part of britain" yet fear of foreigners will make people vote for that suited thug. I read the heads of the finance bill 2010 and I couldnt believe when I saw that as part of the bill the irish govt intends to introduce fiscal sharia law. and the govt plans to build islamic centers. then finally there is very important debate about who runs schools in ireland Church or State. The secularists want the church removed from all schools. there are 2 million practicing catholics and they want thier children tought in catholic schools. finally As in america as elsewhere and in the uk and ireland you hear the following line. they are taking our jobs. well they are taking our jobs because we( irish, english, american, australian and so on) dont want to certain jobs. so immigrants will do the jobs we dont want to do. I am sick of hearing stupid socialist leaning people. irish, american, english, australian etc, wanted to go to uni and become educated people. The dont want the low paid jobs. sorry about the length of this post. But it is not just americas problem. its a worldwide one......
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I hope every white character is evil, just to further annoy people who can't take a joke.
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Holy fucking christ does that look just awesome. WOW whoever said 2010 was going to be a bad year for movies can just shut the fuck up right now. Expendables, Tron Legacy and this. Goddamn.
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With a big statue of Machete in front of it? Seriously immigration should be embraced and made to serve the good of the people. We're not really running out of space in this country.
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And you know we don't agree on much.<p> It's a worldwide problem. People need to be guided to assimilate into the culture and community they are immigrating to. Simple. They don't have to deny their heritage or ethnicity...just assimilate. Hell, that's one of the best things about America...we are lucky to have such an infinitely diverse tapestry of people here. American culture is EVERYBODY! Come on over and join the club.<p> But you know what? Your going to have to stand in line motherfucker. Just like Disneyland. You can't cut in line at the movies or Disneyland, you should expect such quality control at the fucking border eh?
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That's why the white people there act like they've never seen colored folk before.
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... I'll still be there opening day. This looks beyond awesome.
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It's not that we( irish, english, american, australian and so on) dont want to do certain jobs.<p> We just don't want to do them for $3.00 an hour.<p> And therein lies the whole problem.
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You sound like a bigot to me.<p> Do you use the phrase "uppity" too?
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May 5, 2010, 2:16 p.m. CST
I really can't believe liberals are actually coming out
by Coughlins Laws
against this law. You are saying you are FOR people breaking the law. How do you sleep at night. How come, as an American Citizen, born in New York, I have to have an ID or Driver's License wherever I go, but illegal aliens don't? A white immigrant from Europe has to produce their papers at all times, why can't people from Mexico? I have to produce my ID several times a day. If I want to drive my car, I have to have ID. To cash a check, I have to have ID. To get in a night club, I have to have ID. Hell, sometimes just to buy cough syrup, I have to have ID. But somehow, it's too much of a burden to carry ID if you live in Arizona?
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Michelle Rodriguez...everything is fun until she shows up and can't even act in a spoof of a badly acted movie.
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and Obama. It's amazing how much damage Obama's socialist agenda has done to the popularity of the once great Democrat Party. From shoving Health Care down the throats of the the American people against their will, to coming out against a law that over 60% of Americans support and only 36% are against, it's refreshing to see you guys show your true colors to the rest of America, this way they won't make the same mistake of voting your guys back in next November...
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...with the sunlit cross on his face. "I'll see what I can do." Coolness.
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The irony of my comment with the use of the term colored folk it that's what people in the Midwest most likely use when they see one. "Hey, Marlene, look at that colored fella over yonder...hyuk hyuk hyuk" <p> I do get tired of having to explain my comments at this site, however...should I define irony, too?
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http://www.vbs.tv/watch/the-vice-guide-to-film--2/mexican-narco-cinema-part-1-of-3
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You know, the irony of calling everyone a racist and a bigot over the most innocuous comments?<p> Seems like that may have been lost on you.
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Hey, maybe if you fucking inbred shitkickers weren't soo fucking lazy then there wouldn't be any jobs out there for Mexican’s. Then there is the fact that you cunts still rely on slave labor like your confederate fuckstick ancestors. Or should that be incestors since none of your family tree’s fork. Everything that is wrong with the USA comes from the South, otherwise known as America’s asshole.
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Hey Danny and Robert... when should I expect your movie that portrays corrupt Mexican officials raping and beating illegals from Honduras and Portugal, or just turning a blind eye while the drug cartels kidnap them for either ransom, or to put to work in their pot fields? Never? Yeah big fucking surprise you fucking hypocrites. Go back to your shithole of a country if things are so wonderful and rosey there, and stop fucking bitching about the one that made you both rich. It took me 8 years to become a legal citizen, and I busted my ass off to do it the right way, so I'll be damned if I'm going to feel sorry for a bunch of lazy fucking illegals who want what I have without earning it.
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It's not my fault that you're one of the unfunny and unintelligent talkbackers who thinks he's funny and brilliant and that people actually give a shit what he says. No, you're one of the shitstains who talks but has nothing worth reading. <p> So the fact that you tried to say something ironic and failed is your fault, really. Not mine. You should go to the local pub and tell a joke, and then call the bar folk idiots for not getting your brilliant joke. No, really...go...that way we won't have to read your worthless comments in talkbacks for a few hours.
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What did your hapless party give us? The worst recession since the great depression, an unnecessary war in Iraq. The Patriot Act, decimation of the real estate and financial markets, a massive entitlement medicare prescription bill wasn't paid for. I can go on and on, your party fucking sucks dude. You had your chance, and you guys blew it.
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May 5, 2010, 2:36 p.m. CST
DON'T BLAME THE MEXICAN'S, BLAME THOSE WHO HIRE THEM!!!
by TehCreepyThinMan
For all of your flag waving bullshit, you right wing cunts don't seem to chuffed over good old white boys hiring illegals when there are plenty of fat trailer trash to do those jobs. But of course the real reason you rant about the Mexican's is becaause you're racist asswipes, always have been and always will.
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May 5, 2010, 2:37 p.m. CST
Shark Boy & Lava Girl, Spy Kids 3-D, Shorts, Grindhouse...
by Dick Testicle
When was the last time Rodriguez made a movie that people actually went to?
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Not being nuanced enough to grasp someone responding with irony to your ironic comment sounds like a "you" problem.<p> And I find that ironic.
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everyone is complaining about the new law in arizona...I havent heard one word about the farmer that got killed by illegals running drugs on his property..Its unfortunate that a few bad seeds have screwed everything up, but there has to be something done about the problem..and at this time, there was no solution being persued or presented...therefore, you get what has happened. Lets face it..it is a problem..and its costing both sides.
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May 5, 2010, 2:41 p.m. CST
Coughlins Laws (aka: guy who doesn't know what a casualty is)
by HoboCode
The VAST majority of Americans want healthcare reform and the ones that don't are too fucking brainwashed or ignorant to know better. If Obama's healthcare reform has been perceived to be wildly unpopular it is due to Faux News' lying and propaganda, and the fact that the bill didn't reform ENOUGH (i.e. a public option). doesn't mean Democrats are going to stop supporting Obama. You poor pathetic dying breed. I really do feel sorry for you.
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of prosperity under Bush and unemployment was under 5% almost his entire term. Since Obama's been elected, unemployment has skyrocketed to 10% (17% if you count those who've given up looking), and he has spent more in two years than Bush did in 8 years. So, I don't see how you think the Bush years were worse than what's going on right now. As far as CreepyMan, way to have an adult conversation about a serious issue. If you're not mature enough to have a rational conversation with coherent thoughts, maybe you should stay out of political discussions. But like I said, I realize that you probably are just a spoiled college kid who doesn't work yet. Some day you will understand the realities of life. Until then, you're a child...
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May 5, 2010, 2:45 p.m. CST
Hey Killb, the Sherrifs are now saying an American killed him.
by Ganymede3001
Arizona rancher's killing not random? The Arizona Daily Star is quoting an unnamed source as saying that Cochise County Sheriff Larry Dever is investigating someone in United States -- not in Mexico -- as a suspect in the murder of rancher Rob Krentz. The Star, quoting "high ranking government officials", also says the murder was not random. Krentz's murder has fueled outrage over our porous border and likely played a part in the passage of Senate Bill 1070. From day one, everyone has assumed that the murderer was a drug runner, in part because of a garbled radio call from Krentz that mentioned "illegal alien," in part because law enforcement said they tracked his killer's footprints 20 miles to the Mexican border. http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/LaurieRoberts/80068
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You seem unable to break out of your cocoon and gather information from sources other than ultra-liberals who defend this President at all costs. You're just plain wrong. The Health Care Law was an obamination that the vast majority of those in this country were against because we understand that the government ALWAYS (IN EVERY SINGLE CASE) spends more than they promise. This Law will result in rationing, higher premiums, crippling debt, and doctor shortages. Congratulations, though, the President got it through anyway with his Chicago Thug Tactics and backroom deals, and bribes. You should be proud of your leader...
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Jessica Alba finally admits she's Latina! Welcome mi hermana.
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of Canada? Are you proud of your Health Care Rationing up there and your months long waits for surgeries? Have you ever crossed the border for Health Care or used cheap, knock-off meds that an American company had to spend billions and billions developing?
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"And introducing: Don Johnson" <p> That's fucking inspired right there! Heh.
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Glenn Beck is calling you back to the bunker, sport. Hop to it!
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Who hire all the illegals so that they can save money. Its the American way, right? Whatever helps the business, right? All of you KNOW people just like this, whether you like to admit it or not. Restaurant owners, construction companies, lawn care, maintenance, panting companies- they all do it.
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Once I waded through 3 yr old tantrum portion of your post.<p> You've got it...go after the businesses who hire them! You're dead right. The illegals are just good hard working people who want to take care of their family just like you and me. I don't blame them one bit for coming here illegally. I would too. In a heartbeat!<p> But wait, the sheriff of Arizona sweeps those businesses and they get fined big time. This practice is labeled fascist and racist. I imagine you would call it that too. So which is it Brainiac?<p> Continue to let Mexicans be exploited by asshole businesses and corporations as cheap, second class labor?<p> That's pretty much what you're advocating since anything else would be racist right? Looks like you've painted yourself into a corner between a choice of "slave labor" (your words) and racism(your loose an always applicable definition of it). <p> Hyperbole can be a real bitch eh?<p> I'd be curious to read your reasoned response but instead, I'll expect a tirade of insults and expletives in 3...2...1...
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Obama inherited of all Bush's problems. If Bush was in office right now. He'd be having the same problems as Obama. If not worse. Every president in history leaves his baggage behind for the next president. I also hate the ridiculous statement that when Bush was in office, we were better protected. Well yeah because for 6 years after 911 we were on extra high alert, but as time goes by we let our guard down once in a while.
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Until- holy shit- they hit their high when Obama was elected into office! <p> Crazy, but I guess we'll just blame Obama instead of the guy who was in office before he took the oath. <p> Come on Coughlins, you're smarter than that.
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Like 90% of the Fox News staff.
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This looks amazing! I will be there on day ONE! I have posted this link, and am turning my friends on to this AWESOME trailer!BTW...Arizona is WAY off base with this new "law". It should be repealed.
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Bush entered the White House with a 4% unemployment rate, and left with a 8.1% rate. Obama INHERITED the 8.1 % rate which now stands at 9.5%, after about 15 months in office. Now, by my math that means that unemployment DOUBLED under Bush, while Obama's only been in office for about 15 months to fix the mess, not 2 years like your faulty math states " he has spent more in two years than Bush did in 8 years." But why should I be surprised by a mouth breather like you.
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"It's also true that, when you share a border with an unstable, violence-prone nation, it's incumbent upon you to defend that border." <p> Ill bet the Canadians feel the same way.
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"...recognizes a driver's license from another state as proof that one is not "an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States," but only if that state "requires proof of legal residence in the United States before issuance." According to this fairly recent summary, about half a dozen states don't. So Latino drivers from, say, Michigan could be in for a real hassle if they happen to be pulled over in Arizona, even if they are native-born U.S. citizens. Considering that a perfectly legal visitor from Mexico was nabbed by Arpaio's deputies and detained for almost nine hours even though he presented several forms of ID, including a valid visa, Latinos from states that don't meet Arizona's criteria probably should carry a passport." -- Reason.com<P>Food for thought. And I don't know of one non-conservative person who is "for people breaking the law" when it comes to the topic of illegal immigrants. That's utter bullshit and a total distortion.
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I can't remember...aren't you from the UK?
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The fanboys don't know which way to turn. "The shit looks cool, but it's going against my beliefs...my head asplode!"
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I remember the glory days when the geeks dominated these boards. Oh well, you can go fuck yourself! I am so delighted that they made this movie.
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We may as well throw your ass in the klink along with them.
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it's hard to take anyone serious about the health care bill when they use the polls showing a majority don't like the health care bill... but don't bother to admit that a large portion of them wanted a public option or single payer... if you ask how many people approve of the bill or would like a public option or single payer then the polls flip the other way to a majority on the democrats side.
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Bullshit polls that just happen to favor Fox News agenda. Yeah what are the chances that every single Fox news poll is against Obama. Wow amazing! The stars align every time lol.
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Nope, here in U.S.
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OK, cool. For some reason, I thought you were from the UK.
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...he offers no solution for the millions of people who break into our country and deplete our social service resources. <p>It would be fantastic to have immigration laws in the United States that are similar to the harsh immigration laws in Mexico. Unfortunately, a third of Mexico's GDP comes directly from the United States. So, I don't think that they will be fixing it any time soon. </p> <p>Ironically, if US law resembled Mexico's laws -- the people would protest it as being "racist." </p> I don't care WHAT you look like (heck, I am African American), but if you are going to come into this country, USE THE FRONT DOOR! You have no "right" to complain about our laws if you aren't even a citizen of our nation and you have entered this nation illegally!
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...because you know that the rest of us will be paying for YOUR health care under the current messy legislation.
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Rutger Hauer's Hobo With A Shotgun will redefine the American Crime Drama. "At least he's only killing the dirty cops!" "We're *ALL* dirty cops!"
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Film tells Mexicans to attack white people. lol.
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This trailer to me is just meh - except for Michelle Rodriguez who's the cat's meow. Nobody better profile her except moi. <P> As for Arizona. I feel for this state. I hear horror stories about the crime rate there. It's not fair that our fellow Americans in this state have to bear the burden of the illegal immigration problem. <P> I'm very much pro-immigration and frankly that means legal immigration. Millions upon millions of people have gone through the process of joining our country legally. And that's great. It's fair. That's how it should be. Prove your loyalty to America and desire to be a citizen, and let's roll out the welcome mat. <P> What we need to do is immediately close the borders, just wall them up but good and tight. Stop the influx. <P> Provide some measure of amnesty - for a window of time to all the illegals already here and register them - except for those who have criminal records. Not eligible. <P> Enact legislation that creates a special class of immigrants for them. Give them a road towards legal immigrant status. Tax them at slightly higher, flat (no deductibles, exemptions, etc.) rates so they immediately contribute to society with a guarantee of rights to stay and work, and a path towards citizenship. <P> I understand both sides on AZ's new law. Both have their points. But you have to admit it is not an easy problem to deal with and feathers will be ruffled. I don't condone racial profiling but frankly even many Hispanics who actually live in AZ and TX agree that something must be done. Forget what Shakira and George Lopez say. They're just talking out their asses.
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Looks great, having fun. Michelle Rodriguez with an eye patch looks badass. And even Don Johnson looks cool. I´m in. Dont forget De Niro and Trejo worked together in Heat, motherfuckers.
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From the L.A. Times (I believe these stats would be much different if the border wasn't left WIDE open and good people could come out of the shadows.)<p> . 40% of all workers in L.A. County ( L.A. County has 10.2 million people) are working for cash and not paying taxes. This is because they are predominantly illegal immigrants, working without a green card.<p> 2. 95% of warrants for murder in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens.<p> 3. 75% of people on the most wanted list in Los Angeles are illegal aliens.<p> 4. Over 2/3 of all births in Los Angeles County are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal, whose births were paid for by US taxpayers.<p> 5. Nearly 25% of all inmates in California detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally.<p> 6. Over 300,000 illegal aliens in Los Angeles County are living in garages.<p> 7. The FBI reports half of all gang members in Los Angeles are most likely illegal aliens from south of the border.<p> 8. Nearly 60% of all occupants of HUD properties are illegal immigrants. 9. 21 radio stations in L.A. are Spanish Speaking.<p> 10. In L.A. County 5.1 million people speak English, 3.9 million speak Spanish. (There are 10.2 million people in L.A. County ).<p> (All of the above are from the Los Angeles Times) Less than 2% of illegal aliens are picking our crops, but 29% are on welfare.<p> Over 70% of the United States ‘ annual population growth results from immigration and over 90% in California, Florida , and New York . <p> 29% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens.<p>
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Ive worked in a warehouse full of mexicans for over 10 years and have to say any law being enforced to curb these people who want the opportunities we have and the financial help our poor have but dont want to be american officially or culturally is a good thing. For every mexican who wants to strive for legal status there are 10 who couldn't give a fuck, dont care about learning english, and hanging mexican flags in the back windows of their cars. If I moved to another country, especially illegally, I sure as fuck wouldn't put a american flag in my window like a big fuck you to the locals. That would make me a TWAT. Most of these people would be happy working and living here just like they did back in mexico, accepting welfare from americans trying to "help the unfortunates", but scoffing at them behind their backs. Ignoring the ACTUAL LAWS in place and labelling whites as racists. I am not racist but I do hate certain points some cultures bring with them. Mexicans are taught the man is always right and to serve the husband and not question the son. I see mexican men who dont work come and checkup on their women everyday to make sure theyre not fucking around on them, and on paydays they show up so their wife can hand them the check they earned. I have had mexican friends throughout the years and not one has contradicted any thoughts I have towards the other mexicans. One of my friends used to call the trashy mexicans beaners when he talked about them. He told me that there are mexicans and there are beaners. And its fucking true guys. I lived, and worked with these people for years and there are alot of them who fit into the beaner catagory. Who really honestly dont deserve to be here. When someone calls someone else a mexican as an offhanded insult, its not because mexican is a fuuny word. I applaud any attempt to clean up the widespread crime of illegal residence. Alot even deserve whatever help we can give to get them legal. But as far as im concerned when it comes to the "beaners", those motherfuckers can go back. Movie looks pretty awesome though. I agree that line about the border crossed us is pretty fucking stupid, but rest looks kick ass. Holy fuck Michelle Rodriguez is hot, fuck Jessica Alba.
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...and a recent study showed that 1/6 of the prison population is comprised of illegal immigrants. At a cost of $59,000 a year per inmate -- that is a heck of a lot of money! <p> Add to this the fact that the hospitals in California are going bankrupt between Obamacare and requirements to extend services to EVERYONE (including illegal immigrants), then you can understand the "common sense" sentiment that something must be done. </p> This state (and this nation) cannot afford to just let all of the illegal immigrants in (no matter their nationality) just to make certain ethnicities happy -- especially when, statistically speaking, those ethnic groups contribute the least to the tax income of this nation.
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...our opinions converge and we actually agree on something. It may happen with the regularity of Haley's comet...but it does happen. ;)<p> Cheers.
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so...firing all teachers who have accents and getting rid of all drivers ed. manuals that aren't in English is for illegals only? BULLSHIT!!! you absolute ignorant racist fucks. They should move everyone who thinks like that to Arizona, move the people who DON'T think like that out, and the turn the state into a goddamned crater
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Fifth of May celebrates the mexican victory at the battle of Puebla.<br><br>The real Mexican Independence day is 16th Of Setember, which is called "Grito de Dolores" (translates somewhat as The Day Of Sorrows). that's the true independence day of Mexico. Fifth Of May is not even an official celebration (holiday) in Mexico.
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Agreed. Nothing should ever be a clear left/right issue. God knows I'm a lefty. But this issue screams gray.
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That actually made some fukken sense. I'm fukken stunned. <p> chrism - you are still a dickless wonder.
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Lindsey must have needed cash for coke
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...and the illegal immigrant who stole it said this in his defense, "If 'la negrita' (little female black girl) wanted to keep her car, she should have purchased an alarm." The car was never recovered, and our tax dollars are feeding and housing this scumbag before he is deported back to Mexico...where he will likely return and do it again.
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And to pay for more people to patrol it.
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...then you are contributing to illegal immigration. Good luck with that. Jessica Alba is one fine Mexican.
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Sorry, but my dick is the one thing that liberals haven't been able to steal from me. :-) <p>However, I am sure that intelligent responses still tend to leave you with a sense of "wonder." Then again, so does 2nd grade mathematics. </p> ;-)
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those stats ring true to the type of shit goes on in my community. stereotypes are only exaggerations of the truths of certain peoples and mexicans dont get a bad rap because were all racist, they get it from actions and lifestyles they live. Some people call me fat but I dont blame that on them. They shouldn't say it but I should also get my fat ass up and exercise more. Its called responsibility and alot lf these motherfuckers need to take some.
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In the U.S. at least<p> Like St. Patrick's day...a "holiday" for idiots.
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Even Lib Warrior agreed with me. Fukk me.
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That's the only reason this day gets any play here in the states.
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...only 2% of Mexican immigrants have EVER picked fruits and vegetables from the fields (according to a study in the LA Times...as mentioned by DoctorWho? earlier). Yet 28% of illegal immigrants are mooching off of tax welfare system that is supposed to be provided ONLY to US citizens.
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That means you must have a dick, wow, a wonder indeed.
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Im at home sitting on my ass, not getting paid cause of cinco fucking de mayo. I have to take a day of for a holiday which isnt mine. AND I LOVE FUCKING HOLIDAYS!!!
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"...a sense of wonder"<p> I was thinking the same thing! Aren't we talking common sense here?<p> But hey, take the emotion and talking points away, inject some critical thinking and whoa... they're stunned.
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that is all true. that is why the migrant workers to come and do those jobs. what I find stupfying are the comments made by Trade Union leaders and the parties that support them. To give another example. A few years Before becoming leader of the uk, pm or soon to be ex pm, made an noxious statement, If I become PM I will make this pledge I will gaurantee british jobs for british workers" that comment was made at Trade Union Conference" and brown didnt know that the comment had been picked up. last year there was a demo at a totale refinery and the facist BNP were only to happy to remind the PM of that il-fated and stupid comment. But this was the same pm who called a fellow labour supporter a bigot=, for raising concerns on immigration. bnp are very and exploting tensions. So are liberals by the way. We have a gasbag called joe higgins who is a leader of the socialist party in ireland and is an mep. he hates captilism.
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this isn't "common sense" this is FLAT OUT FUCKING RACISM. They are rounding up ALL Hispanics and only keeping the illegal immigrants. They are FIRING TEACHERS WITH ACCENTS and REMOVING DRIVING TEXTBOOKS THAT ARE NOT IN ENGLISH. This is aimed at ALL HISPANICS because they will ALL suffer because of this.
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I find that very interesting. Although I do pride myself on reading the international news, I don't dig into it that deeply, so it's cool to get your perspective.<p>
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So should we just tear down the plaque on the Statue of Liberty and put up a "Stay the fuck out" sign?
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Let's all kelebrate!
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Good post.
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maybe some of them will be pushed to become an american citizen and we will all be better for it.
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Speaking of which, whatever happened to those Minutemen guys? Are any of them still building fences and standing guard along the southern border? Considering all the recent militia activity in the USA, you'd think that some of those rowdy yahoos would be down there standing a post.<P>*snark*
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I hear they're casting for a remake of "Quest For Fire".<p> You guys may have a good shot at that.
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Lettuce jumps off the ground and lands in the supermarket. Oranges fall off the tree and do the same. Grapes fly off the vineyard. Right. In the words of the fine woman you'll never fuck: You betcha.
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Oh, what a clever little bigot you are. Please explain to me how this ISN'T racism. No fair going to Rush Limbaugh or Glen Beck's website to wait for them to tell you what to think!
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was made long ago. And while I agree our morales should sway in that direction, there are overpopulated poor culturally segregated cities everywhere in america and I think more of a filter needs to be put in place to maybe weed out those who just want to sponge off those morales. W hen the plaque was written people had to learn english and bits of our culture too. They werent just funneled in and given benefits because america loves the poor. They were made to learn tools and skills to help them help themselves and america. Not just themselves.
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DNA tests showed she is almost 90% european descent. How does that make her mexican in any way? She is probably even more european blooded then i am, and i was born in the continent.
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<i>Are people that come here "illegally" law breakers? </i> Read carefully the question you asked - you will find the answer. Hint: look up the word "illegal".
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May 5, 2010, 4:08 p.m. CST
Wow -- people on here are actually against the Arizona Law?
by TheFifthCylon
fucking morons.
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They're not rounding up LEGAL citizens and deporting them. Wouldn't they target ALL hispanics ...or is this "partial racism"? "50% racism"?? Your either a racist or you're not.<p> Win.
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I always liked him in his many supporting roles, but it's gonna be nice to see him in a lead, kicking all kinds of ass....even Segal's?<br><br> <i>Feliz Cinco De Mayo!</i>
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Yeah, what DID happen to those guys?
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Yes she is 90% European but 120% smokin, bombshell hot! So she gets a pass.<p> You have her DNA tests? That's just weird.
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I was not excited for this at all. I thought it was a very dumb idea. But it looks badass.
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That originally, the new law said police have to ask for ID on anyone they suspect of being illegal. And those of you supporting the law KNOW that many of those who still support it now supported it then. You may say that the current law doesn't say that, sure there are protections now, etc etc... <p> But that doesn't mean there weren't a lot of people on here championing that law and now understanding the grave consequences of it.
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THEY ARE ROUNDING UP LEGAL CITIZENS WHO ARE HISPANIC!!! THEY JUST DON'T GET TO KEEP THEM. HOW DO YOU DEFEND FIRING TEACHERS WHO HAVE ACCENTS?!?!?! ARE THEY ALL ILLEGAL??!?! NO. THEY WOULD ABSOLUTELY KEEP THEM ALL IN JAIL IF THEY COULD!!!
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when will hollywood make a movie about a white guy going ape shit on a whole bunch of Mexicans? Oh that's right....NEVER! FUCK THIS FILM's MESSAGE! Racism is only ok when it is against the oppressive white man. They are called ILLEGALS for a reason stupid. Great marketing though -- make sure the government supported illegals pay tax dollars for this movie alright... not to mention the slave trade that is going on with illegals. Progressivism must die.
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You'd think Harry wrote my last post. Apologies people. The "now" in the last sentence should be "not". And well... Ugh I don't feel like rewriting. Let's pretend this didn't happen and move along.
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I fucking concur as all fuck. The racism label gets thrown around too much on any contradiction of any subject when the majority of one race is involved. This isnt a case of trying to shit on the mexicans but rather of a type of person in america that should be doing something differently. ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS
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Or are you just an idiot? The movie isn't about a Mexican going apeshit on a bunch of white guys. Its about a Mexican getting double-crossed and getting revenge on the dude who set him up. Its your typical revenge story, good lord. <p> This movie has NOTHING to do with the Arizona law except for the opening "This is for you" bullshit. That's all it is. You guys freaking out and cursing Rodriguez and Trejo just look like a bunch of idiots.
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Didn't anybody else think that the shot of a Macbook was very out of place? Isn't this supposed to play in the 70s?
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is reason to be suspicious they might be a criminal solely on their race is pretty much the definition of racist. but fuck all that Machete looks too good to be true. can it live up to how excited I am?? probably not but I can't wait to see it
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If you want to watch a white guy killing Mexicans...watch the first 1/3 of Predator. But you're not going to see a whole lot of that in Predators. Guess who stars in it?
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please list all the freedoms liberals have stolen from you?? and then list all the marvellous liberties bestowed upon you by the freedom loving conservatives? I am curious to see what fox news have told you has been taken away.you fucking knob.
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...watch the last 1/3 of Commando.
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If you could get into a giant tortilla and do some hardcore meat and bean mixing with one of the feisty ladies in this movie who would it be? My hot sauce is on Michelle Rodriguez.
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Sure I do. And I had concerns about that too. I'm glad they fixed because I feel much better about it.<p> However, even with those misgivings my attitude was: What in the hell do you expect!? Bush, McCain,Kennedy...all of Washington has dropped the ball on this clusterfuck and now *gasp* Someone took a stand? No shit.<p> People who don't live in the southwest don't realize that almost every night on the news there are stories of human trafficking, drop houses, torture,very,very organized drug trafficking and violence etc. It's a mess.<p> Now, get stopped for something...show your drivers license. We ALL have to. Inconvenienced? Fuck you.<p> A lot of good Mexican people suffer because of these things.<p> And while were at... crackdown (and I mean big time!) on corporations and businesses hiring illegals. <p> It will never happen. <p> My 2 cents.
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...one sucks balls the way it's written. A lot of you need to read up on what is actually happening before commenting. This law, much like the Patriot Act, has the REAL possibility of creating precedents that will affect the way law enforcement is allowed to treat CITIZENS of this fine country. Get educated, damn it! Racial profiling and/or stereotyping is fucking evil and wrong. Always. Once again, I support immigration reform. I live in California and very much think it's needed with a quickness. But the bill in Arizona is all kinds of backasswardly evil. If you need any further proof of that, just look at how Texans are reacting. (Heh. Had to throw that in there.) <P>This movie looks WAY cooler than I was expecting. Really interested in checking it out now.
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joe higgins is only happy to parrot his line about Working people. I dont know who these working people. Joe doesnt like it when the media challenges this. he is one of the most humourless people i have ever heard. Both Uk and ireland in the same boat. both countries are goverend by unelected leaders. there are 166 td's. like the uk we have heard the electoral reform nonsense for years. We will have leaders debates in ireland at some stage. the memo went out to leaders and they all rejected the memo. Fianna fail have screwed the irish economy twice over 30 years. they deserve to booted out on thier assess. they will be. Uk and Ireland have more in common then people think.
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Did Rodriguez really have to shit on his hat by having Machete go all political? The bill isn't racist as opposed to what Mexico does? HA! I'll be there opening night for this action buffet. Speaking of buffets, Seagal sure hasn't let up on them any, but it works for him as a villain. Alba is only good naked.
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excellent call slappy. If Republicans want to pretend that all of the cops in Arizona have radar that detects ONLY illegal immigrants and ALL illegal immigrants (not just hispanics). Then...whatever...but there is NO way to take removing any and all things of other languages out of Arizona as anything BUT racism.
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Looks like crap.
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Here's something that may not have not been taught to you in grade school.<p> America is a melting pot. <p> Immigrants come here to assimilate. the best way to assimilate os to learn the national language. (In this case English). <p> Immigrants in countries who don't speak the language are willfully segregating themselves as second class citizens.<p> For the sake of immigrant children (their ability to be successful) and for the sake of the larger society, immersion in the language of the country, meaning English in America, is mandatory.<p> Ballots should not be printed in any language other than English. If one cannot understand English, one is probably not sufficiently knowledgeable to vote intelligently in an English-speaking country.<p> These are logical, and well-thought out reasons devised by people smarter than you. Your knee-jerk racism reflex is your issue.<p> No one is saying you can't speak Spanish, Chinese, Erdu or whatever. But dammit learn the language. <p> Or perhaps you prefer divided societies over unity?
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Father is Mexican-American. Many Mexicans are of European descent obviously so DNA tests are gonna show that lol.
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"Now, get stopped for something...show your drivers license. We ALL have to. Inconvenienced? Fuck you." If that was what was happening that wouldn't be a problem with ME at all....it's just NOT. They are being stopped based solely on the "fact" that someone thinks they might be legal...and a driver's license isn't proof enough. Someone was arrested for failing to have his BIRTH CERTIFICATE on him!
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truth
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I crossed the border of your atmosphere, humans. watcha gonna do about that? yeah. that's what I thought
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I think they should learn English too. I just think they should have a right to drive a fucking car too. You also keep avoiding the other fact THEY ARE FIRING TEACHERS WHO HAVE ACCENTS
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This is gonna be great!
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...Hot Girls 99.9999% Of Us Will Never Get. That's all that really matters.
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A film that had greats hopes and aspirations, wanted to be epic...but didnt give enough time to explain the story for each character. Thus, fell flat on its ass and felt like a hurried mess.
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that shit is AWfUL!!!
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It's called research.
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Yeah. That dude was not what the ladies would call a gentle lover.
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Ain't these folks ever heard of cultural friggin relativism?
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"Teachers who aren’t deemed fluent can’t be in classrooms where students are still learning English, meaning many veteran teachers are taking classes to improve their English—and if that doesn’t work, facing a move to a higher grade where English learners are fewer; about 12.5% of the state's public-school students are considered "English Language Learners."<p> Some of the pronunciation problems the Department of Education notes: violet is “biolet” and think is “tink.” <p> Yep, pure hate on display. It's clear that the lawmakers here just hate those damn, dirty brown skinned immigrants.<p> You know, if I moved to France and took French classes I would really not want to be taught by a teacher who spoke French with say...a Korean accent. <p> Does that really make me a racist?
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What did you make for dinner?
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whats the name of that Micheal douglas film with barbata hershey and robert Duvall.
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... the kind of BALLS recreated for a single movie were put into solving more of Mexico's economic and crime problems, this wouldn't be an issue in the first place. Even if that's a naive statement and the problems are just insurmountable, it STILL does not make it a moral imperative for the U.S. to play doormat. Whether it does or not, it seems America's supposed to respect other cultures and peoples' sovereignty, but not dare try to protect the integrity of its own. I don't have one ounce of respect for a president like Mexico's that seems to exert more energy into making sure his citizens can just escape their problems and move to the United States instead of actually stepping up and helping them solve their own. In any case, the whining about this new Arizona "law" is pathetic to begin with because, as many of its protesters have pointed out, most of it isn't even legal (i.e., the state can't give itself what are Federal enforcement rights) and what is only encourages the enforcement of existing law. And as far as racial profiling goes, particularly in law enforcement, nobody ever complains about the stereotypically white, male serial killer - even though there are an increasing number of serial killers that do NOT match that stereotype. Frankly, I don't have a problem with it, either - "if the shoe fits," I say, regardless of the race, even if it's my own - otherwise, law enforcement becomes unnecessarily difficult and crime prevention practically impossible. It's absurd to promote the recognition and tolerance of DIFFERENCES, cultural or otherwise, and to have sciences and disciplines that deal in social and racial demographics, anthropology, etc., yet not put that knowledge and those disciplines to the most obvious and constructive use to actually PROTECT what we're supposed to be respecting and appreciating. What's even more naive is to think that by trying not to profile, you're going to somehow reduce corruption and influence more tolerance. It's been tried, and clearly, the result has been the exact OPPOSITE. In the end, at worst, the law is unconstitutional and will probably never amount to anything - at the least, it's language without substance - in either case, it's a lightning rod that shouldn't even work and people, most of whom know this, are protesting it for the attention and because they have nothing better to do. Anyway, if you think I'm wrong, that I'm some ignorant racist, then by all means, proceed. All you're doing is keeping alive the underlying problems and solving absolutely NOTHING.
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the ones who fled that tyranny turned up in North america and europe. were they given a group hug when they turned in North america and europe. they were treated as german and stripped of their culture and identity. yet nobody talks of this.
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May 5, 2010, 5:51 p.m. CST
the following is regarded by many as the best song ever written.
by emeraldboy
about modern ireland. or ireland ever. Chorus: Banana Republic Septic Isle Screaming in the Suffering sea It sounds like crying (crying, crying) Everywhere I go, oh yeah Everywhere I see The black and blue uniforms Police and priests And I wonder do you wonder While you're sleeping with your whore That sharing beds with history Is like a-licking running sores Forty shades of green yeah Sixty shades of red Heroes going cheap these days Price; a bullet in the head Banana Republic Septic Isle Suffer in the Screaming sea It sounds like dying (dying, dying) Everywhere I go, oh yeah Everywhere I see The black and blue uniforms Police and priests Take your hand and lead you Up a garden path Let me stand aside here And watch you pass Striking up a soldier's song I know that tune It begs too many questions And answers too Banana Republic Septic Isle Suffer in the Screaming sea It sounds like dying (dying, dying) Everywhere I go, oh yeah Everywhere I see The black and blue uniforms Police and priests The purple and the pinstripe Mutely shake their heads A silense shrieking volumes A violence worse than they condemn Stab you in the back yeah Laughing in your face Glad to see the place again It's a pity nothing's changed Banana Republic Septic Isle Suffer in the Screaming sea It sounds like dying Everywhere I go Everywhere I see The black and blue uniforms Police and priests
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Can't wait to see this flick! Let's stop fucking around and secure the border, most of you are right not all illegals are murderers or drug dealers but all of them are here ILLEGALLY! Immigrants are always welcome, Illegal Immigrants are not!
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I said it.
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Bullshit. Mexicans are a cross of Spaniards and American Indians, they get no racial claim to live in the United States as natives. I don't see any of them scrambling to take up residence in Spain illegally. Drive through Mexico sometime and see what great pride they take in upkeep and cleanliness. Then cruise through Van Nuys or North Hollywood and see the similarities. Yeah...that's what I want to see more of in this country, for sure. I LOVED living in North Hollywood and waking up to fucking pounding mariachi music every 8:00am, which all sounds exactly the fucking same through apartment walls... Forgive me for not having any sympathy whatsoever for illegal immigrants. The government has made it HARDER on people here legally and trying to get their green cards, visas and citizenship...while illegals coast by under the radar. The border didn't cross any of you. You don't get to claim reparations for events that took place hundreds of years ago.
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are being arrested in Arizona for walking down the street? Probably not many. <p> Anyone who says "this law isn't racist, they're called ILLEGAL for a reason", obviously lives in a fantasy world. There will inevitably be a racist component to how this law is carried out, because racism exists, simply put. I agree that illegal immigration is a problem, but this isn't the way to solve it. The popular defense of this law could just as easily be utilized to justify camps. "They're here ILLEGALLY, they don't have any rights. round 'em up!" This isn't alarmist or disproportionate. It's one small step away. <p> Beyond any specifics of this issue, concerning details of the law, or the particular races involved, the fact is that this isn't how things are done in America. If you claim to love America, you should hate this law. That is, if you actually understand what it means to be American.
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If you read up on our country's history you would know that there were Mexicans living in California, Arizona, and Texas before the U.S. obtained the land from Mexico. So that's where this whole idea of "the border crossed us" stems from. Although my parents got here illegally, they're now citizens thanks to the 1986 amnesty and are proud Americans who abide by the laws and pay their taxes. I was born here and this is as much my country as it is anyone else's born here.
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Scroll up a little higher to the stats I posted from the L.A. Times and compare that to Canadian illegals (of which I know many).<p> If you can't figure out why this might be a problem than just forget it.
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In the left corner I see a lot of knee jerk cries of "RACISTS!" which is truly the lowest form of argument. On the right I see some well reasoned statistics, but then for everyone one of those I see some idiot like PorkChop spewing stuff about Mariachi music all sounding the same (THAT'S RACIST!) LOL. <P> It is worth noting that 61% of Americans polled think this law is either on the right track or doesn't go far enough. So whether the ivory tower liberals want to admit it or not, this country has a serious issue and problem on their hands, and neither Clinton, nor Bush, nor Obama have addressed this mounting insanity. <P>But meanwhile there are leaders like Anthony Villaregosa, the poon hunting mayor of LA, calling any and all who oppose full amnesty for all illegals, to be absolute racists. When the rhetoric starts to mount on both sides, it gets real hard for those reasonable to stand up and find a solution.
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by expecting people to obey the law. Laws are broken all the time! (I think this is even pointed out sagely in the trailer.) And doesn't it sound nice to just welcome all illegal aliens into the country and offer them education, access to healthcare, and all the other benefits of US citizens? Don't get so caught up in economic considerations and questions about how a few Mexicans who aren't paying taxes in the US are hurting the US. It sounds much nicer to just welcome them in, and the rest of us should just learn Spanish. Doesn't that sound nice? Forget money and numbers and statistics. Just think of what sounds nice.
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I'm there.
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should be made into a poster, just sayin'
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by the fact that literally MILLIONS of their citizens are risking their lives to escape their country? I hope the Mexican government has found a scapegoat (the US, somehow?) that allows them to sleep at night despite having a citizenry that constantly, desperately, relentlessly wants to escape Mexico for America. Maybe like a homely wretch of a woman struggling to maintain her dignity as her husband repeatedly cheats with the hot next door neighbor, and everyone in the neighborhood knows about it.
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When surrounded by a hostile Indian tribe, Tonto looked at the Lone Ranger and said, "What do you mean, what do WE do now, paleface?"<p>Actually, nothing reminds me of that. I just like that old joke.
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Unfortunately it will do nothing to illuminate someone who makes fuckstick accusations and idiotic rants. You have to remember that they aren't interested in history, and somehow believe the U.S.A. is an only an offshoot of Europe and that indigenous peoples are 'invading' their purity.
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...and when all of the illegal immigrants are "taken care of". I'm sure you'll move on to the actual citizens because, everyone knows that birth certificates are faked all the time....Just look at Obama...he's black so he must be foreign....and with a name like that...you know...not a good old American name like Cletus or Billybob..he's gotta be one uh them thar freedom hatin' terrorists from Nigeria or sumthin...so yeah...since all of those documents are faked...You'll be wanting to round up all hispanics in short order you FUCKING HATEFUL BIGOTS
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Even better than THANKSGIVING.
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about the law. ireland. last week a major criminal was gunned down in dublin pub while having a pint. he was out on bail. this is a man who was inmplicated in 15 gangland murders. ireland is country where underage kids can get legal highs in headshops. and finally where arrogant pricks like sean fitzpatrick can run an entire economy into the ground. as this is a film site. no more bourne movies please. bourne ultimatum was dreadful.
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The Mexican government even publishes a pamphlet on how to cross the US border and remain undetected.<p> http://tinyurl.com/yzc7fqd
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Don't listen to any anti-immigration bullshit unless it comes from a native American (no, they are not called Indians...that was Columbus' bad.) Or, in the immortal words of Jack White, "Why don't you kick yourself out, you're an immigrant, too."
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...either side of the immigration law argument. The problem is the precedents this law will set for the future. Allowing the government to take away more of what little actual freedom we have remaining. Big brother is watching.
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Really. We have 3 Topsy Turvy tomato plants and a really nice herb garden on the roof. Organic, no pesticides. Delicious and nutritious. Other stuff we get from Fairway.
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Good news: "Kick-Ass 2: Balls To The Wall" has been greenlit. That's all I care about on Cinco De Fucking Mayo.
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I pick my own veggies also. They come in handy little cans, reasonably priced, and I can store them for almost ever!
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May 5, 2010, 6:53 p.m. CST
Who'd have thought that a silly exploitation movie
by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave
could inspire such fervent political debate?
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That's cool, but if you gotta buy packaged veg try going for the frozen stuff. I hear they're more nutritious, better for ya.
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Never claimed it wasn't a problem. in fact, I did hint at illegal immigration being a problem when I wrote "I agree that illegal immigration is a problem." <p> I know it was a bit vague, but I was commenting on the racial aspect of what's going on. There are Mexican Canadians too, you know. I was talking about white Canadians passing for American in Arizona.
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can they be transferred or fired because they say "y'all" and "A'hm fixin ta"..?
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STOP EVERY MOTHERFUCKER AND CHECK THEIR PAPERS.
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you got my little joke!
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Oh no no no. They just can't sound like they're from another country see. They are perfectly allowed to sound like cousin fuckin' meth addicts.
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May 5, 2010, 6:58 p.m. CST
Not only are they going to steal your jobs
by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave
and leech off state welfare, they're also going to mutilate you with a multitude of sharp implements!<p>Arnold was right: close the fucking borders!
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American geared shite; i'll pass
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... you might want to start by reading this: http://hackerhaus.com/2010/04/30/sb1070/
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I might just have to go see this ..
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No facts here please. Just innuendo and hysteria thank you very much.
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It doesn't matter where your DNA came from poor folks will do anything to survive. It's not the fault of illegals coming into this country that Mexico is a corrupted state. There are Mexicans that want to stay in Mexico who want to make businesses and are industrious but can't do a damn thing because of the bureaucracy there. I don't particularly like people breaking the law but aren't companies or individuals that hire illegals not partly to blame? Shouldn't they be doing hard time too?
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I am pretty sure we are all Earthlings
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http://tinyurl.com/2eax5xy read "According to the recently passed anti-immigration law SB 1070, a police officer may detain anyone of who he has “reasonable suspicion” of being an illegal alien"
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They damn sure better deport his ass back to Rigel 12.
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...and they had to kill a hell of a lot of natives, and use a hell of a lot of slaves to do so. Now that it's finally built, these freeloaders want to come in here and take what our enterprising forefathers created (with slaves)? It's unjust I tell you. <p> Maybe America should build a really big mote. No fence....build large waterways where the American borders were. And then only allow legal immigrants from various countries in, if, and only if, they speak English and have a skill or trade we can use. Otherwise...fuck the world. We will slowly branch out and occupy all lands that own raw materials and resources we need. The rest can be nuked. <p> Amirite? That's what America stands for....amirite?
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What does the South have anything to do with the AZ immigration law? You are the racist you dumb fuck!!! You hate people because they live in the South and you want to be so kind and generous to be people coming into the country illegally. What an idiot.
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There are plenty of liberal democrats who also employ and profit from the work of illegals.
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SO YOU SAY: "Not everyone who comes here illegally is a drug dealer or a thug. But everyone who comes here illegally IS a criminal because they're breaking the law by doing so." Well, then everyone who speeds and drinks and drives and parks on handicap parking spaces, etc is also a criminal... you too are breaking the law... so everytime you go 1 mile above the speed limit label yourself as a criminal.
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A lot of conservative hypocritical racist trolls posting today.
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1: This looks fucking awesome. 2: The dumb fucks bitching about the liberal hate for Arizona's horseshit law need to realize something: We're not pissed because cops are being told they can detain illegal aliens. We're pissed because cops are being told they can detain ANYONE who doesn't produce their fucking papers. If a cop decides you're suspicious, it doesn't matter if every one of your fucking ancestors got here on the goddamn Mayflower, they can keep you in fucking jail until you get them a copy of your birth certificate. So take your bullshit "wah wah, we're beinz invadedz!" assclownery and shut the fuck up. If you don't get why having to show the cops you're fucking papers just to go about your day is horse-shit, we should deport your dumb ass because you are not a goddamn American.
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Enough said.
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how does one give you an internet standing ovation sir?
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I fully support the idea of a totally right-wing state. Let the scumbags enact all kinds of racist short-sighted laws, and just sit back and watch the place become a bankrupt nightmare shit-hole Klansman's wet-dream.
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You guys should actually read the bill before you go quoting less than credible sources. <p> I just recently saw a network news station saying anyone can be stopped at any time. Why would you think the media would say that?.. when the actual bill amendment :<p> Changes “lawful contact” to “lawful stop, detention or arrest.” <p> Stipulates that a lawful stop, detention or arrest must be in the enforcement of any other law or ordinance of a county, city or town or this state.<p> Stipulates that a reasonable attempt must be made, when practicable, to determine the immigration status of a person, except if the determination may hinder or obstruct an investigation when reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien and is unlawfully present in the U.S.<p> It took me 5 seconds to look that up but some lazy, "unbiased" tv reporter bitch couldn't even do that.<p> I don't care if you don't agree. But don't lie.
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HOW DO I EMBED THIS VIDEO TO SHARE ON AUSTIndaze
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...that the sad decline of AICN into irrelevancy and the toilet-bowl spiral of the talkbacks into migraine inducing hatefulness and misinformed eruptions of lazy-minded bile is directly correlated to the general increase in contributions from scumbag dittohead talkbackers.
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I want to shake your hand, and wash your mouth out with soap. Well done sir!
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http://tinyurl.com/2eax5xy ...IS AN ACCOUNT OF AN ACTUAL PERSON WHO WAS STOPPED ON SUSPICION OF BEING ILLEGAL...NOTHING MORE..How the fuck hard is that to figure it out? Plus, anyone who has any brains at all can see that the whole "no racial profiling" thing is said with a wink.
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Some of you are just plain uneducated or you're being purposefully difficult. Time to move to fucking Canada.
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Hear, hear. Exhibit A: Father Coughlins Laws. He's like the new AnimalStructure and shit.
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I didn't say that liberals stole "freedoms" from me...although the increasing amount of government regulation of the private sector is making it begin to seem that way -- plus the fact that the town where I live just banned plastic bags, styrofoam, water bottles, and 75% of the grass in our yards. OF course, the increasing amount of money that is taken from my paycheck to pay for the services of people who don't work is disappointing too. <p>However, illegal immigration is a different matter altogether. We have a group of people who entered this nation ILLEGALLY. While a small portion came here to work (2%), most of them broke into this nation in order to take advantage of the services and welfare programs meant for US citizens and paid for by taxpayers like us. This drives up the cost of those services...and requires that our taxes go up to pay for them. In addition, a large portion of the criminal prison population is comprised of illegal immigrants (25+% in California alone). At an average of $55,000 per year per inmate, that is a lot of money from taxpayers.
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Does racism exist in Arizona? <p> Is racism a method by which a dominant culture oppresses a minority within its borders? <p> Whether or not there are cultural aspects and rights of both groups to be considered and respected, and real grievance by the dominant culture, and examples by which the minority group has exploited the liberal laws and taken advantage of loopholes and the like, Is racism still wrong? <p> Is it reasonable to assume that laws and lawmakers are fallible, and that it's the duty of the citizen to remain vigilant when it comes to protecting the rights of all? <p> If you've answered 'yes' to any or all of these questions, step right up! You're clearly a loony liberal moonbat, please collect your complimentary tinfoil hat on your way to the gate, your boarding pass for the flight to the communist country of your choice is waiting for you at the counter.
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Judges are looking for:<p> Posts displaying the least factual data. (Points deducted for empirical data included by mistake or not effectively suppressed.)<p> Posts motivated by pure emotionalism. (Points deducted for any display of critical thinking)<p> Posts designed to highlight by inference, ones all inclusive compassion and empathy by labeling anyone who differs as racists. (Bonus points for effectively concealing their 'white guilt' and insecurity as the truly hateful fuckers who would never even have dinner with someone of Mexican descent)<p> Posts which never address specifics, explain, elaborate nor budge from a monolithic, black and white thinking process. (Bonus points for platitudes)<p> Ebonic...looks like you covered most of these in just the last couple of postings. Your on trajectory for the Gold medal! Stay tuned.
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"Despite our sound debunking last spring of ten "facts" on immigration sourced to The Times, the list still makes the occasional blog post and e-mail round" http: //opinion.latimes.com/opinionla/2007/02/some_memes_neve.html
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If you're THAT mad about the $55,000 average per inmate that tax payers pay, I'll assume that you've murdered THE ENTIRE PREVIOUS ADMINISTRATION (Bush and his flunkies)for the BILLIONS that these unnecessary wars have cost us....No? but you're also mad about healthcare?!?! So you're willing to pay for a war (hey we get to treat MORE brown people like crap...Hell, we even get to rape and murder them.), but you aren't willing to pay for sick children to get medical attention?
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This country is nuts!
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Does racism exist in America?<p> Um...YES! <p> Why don't you tell me where racism DOESN'T exist. <p> Where there's people, there's ignorance. You can't separate the two any more than you can separate wetness from water.
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50 time harder than that AZ law. But no ones in the street there trying to help Guatamalans get away with it! Which is a reaonable law btw!
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I hate the L.A. Times and thought at least they had some credibility left to them.<p> This is why news papers are dying. Who do you trust? <p> Did they high ball or low ball the stats. My guess? High ball. Hmmmmm and why would they skew those numbers I wonder.Hmmmm? Do me a favor and link me the debunking of the stats.
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The sad thing too, is that no one in this country realizes how hard it is to immigrate legally. It's incredibly expensive, and studies have shown that only a small fraction of people who were born an bred American could pass the tests.
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You talk about credibility yet post stuff debunked in 2006. Great job!
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MNG, if only there was a way to put certain TBer's on "ignore," these TB's might be worth the trouble, but lately, I'm realizing how much more enjoyable life is without wading into these cesspools. But I'll still wade in every now and then for old time's sake, and in TB's like this, to casually remind people like AnimalStructure of what horrible human beings they truly are. Anything else isn't worth the blood pressure, though. Witness DocWho up there. Why anyone would want to engage in that dead end conversation, I've stopped wondering.
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Open borders right? <p> How about fixing the clusterfuck bureaucracy and streamline it to make it more effective.<p> Nah! <p> That would be bigoted.
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it's evident that humans that are different can't get along, so lets just seperate everybody like they did back in the good old 40's. maybe then some white baseball players would get a chance
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DoctorWho? doesn't read the articles anyone posts. He just makes up how he has read them and how they are all "liberally biased"
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People understand the word "illegal" just fine. It's the other word, "legal", and how it applies to certain folks that seems to be at issue. Unfortunately, some have gone out of their way to misrepresent that in order to make cheap political jabs.
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Gee, pardon me if I'm not giving Arizona due credit for immediately backpedaling on their horeshit law by amending it so it's slightly less fucking insane.
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That was classic. Looks like DoctorWho just won his own award for dumbest commenter in this talkback, LOL. <p> It fits under the category he created of "Posts displaying the least factual data."
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that you don't like, then you'll go with the 'facts' that have been proven wrong? Did you even read the article?
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All my ancestors signed in at the island and learned the language out of COURTESY
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May 5, 2010, 8:27 p.m. CST
Petard meet the Hoist! Doctorwho "It's a tight race for dumbest
by Dirk_The_Amoeba
...poster on AICN" <p>*snicker* *snicker* <p> Well played Kingbozo
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I think making it easier to immigrate would be fantastic. I don't think open borders are the answer at all. I am very much against illegal immigration, but 1.)I understand why it's done 2.)I think pulling people over for having brown skin in Arizona is a COMPLETELY bullshit racist law. And before you tell me again what the law says...remember that "pulling people over for having brown skin in Arizona" is the REALITY of the law
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He's got no papers…
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And he can take everyone else who has been quoting his numbers with him
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--you realize that the Arizona law means cops can detain citizens until they produce their papers, too, right? You, yourself, if you get pulled over in Arizona a cop could decide you seem suspicious and ask for your papers. And if you don't have them on you, you're going to be detained until you can produce them. Hope you know where you birth certificate is, 'cause your ID doesn't cut it.
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...that you simply cannot state you argument (any argument) with clarity, nor rely on the strength of your ideas. This is the problem with many far out leftys like you. You aren't used to arguing your ideas because you live in an echo chamber of people and media who only agree with you. <p> Diversity of thought is a wonderful thing ya know?<p>Sure... dismiss me with insults. I don't care if you you disagree. It bothers me not one whit. But state your case man. <p> If your argument is solid it will withstand scrutiny...even if I don't agree, I would respect it. My guess is it is a house of cards as usual.
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The account you link to is just the blogosphere gossip mill, which alters stories from one link to the next. Read the original story in the legitimate news source (not fearmonger Rachel Maddow, who has clearly taken a page from Glenn Beck in scaring her viewers with hysterical comparisons of AZ to Nazis). In the original story the person was not stopped for being suspicion of being an illegal, it was a weight check truck stop. The officers who questioned and detained the guy were not from the AZ police, they were FEDERAL I.C.E. customs agents. Their policy of asking for a birth certificate (which I agree is over the line) is a policy they have had way before the AZ law, and the AZ law doesn't even take effect until a few months from now. The ban on racial profiling in the law is not a "wink" it is very explicit and will be enforced or else the state of AZ would be deluged with lawsuits from US citizens/residents. People who drive with their driver's license and/or speak english like you would if you're a legal resident, have got nothing to worry about.
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Apparently, the Talkbacker known as "_Matheus_" has created a "Power Mod" (?) script or something that allows you to block Talkbackers from your browser. Folks have been using it fairly extensively over in the LOST threads (avoidance of spoilers, trolls, etc.).<P>Personally, I would never do that. As lowsy as this place has become, it's still AICN TALKBACK!!! I'd rather see everything/everyone and judge as I see fit. Besides, I'm gearing up for TB retirement anyway. What do I care. :^)<P>As for DoctorWho?, I've actually had some good conversations with him in the past. He appears to be way more sensible than AnimalPiperBalls or Father Coughlins. However, I've learned that EVERY Talkbacker is capable of escalating their presence and views in direct response to the subject at hand. And naturally, a politically-themed thread is ripe for this kind of fervor. I don't really seem to have the stomach for it like I used to in the past. It all gets to be so repetitive that...unless someone is really willing to listen...it's really just a waste of time.
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Why is there a mass exodus from Mexico? Conditions bad? Infrastruture sucks? Change begins at home. <p> Trejo seems to be admitting "Yeah my country sucks and were going to kill to get in yours." - Through his movie, I'm assuming that's not his rational, thought out opinion. <p> Mexico needs a stable government, incorruptable law enforcement, and citizens willing to make it a better place to live. <p> Seriously. Answer me this: Why don't Mexicans want to improve Mexico? You're just going to jump ship and say fuck it, we tried? Did you?
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I wish people would do things the right way first, this is the states way of stopping the flow of Mexicans inward. Scare tactics. it's mean,yes. but hey so is milking the states tax payer money to feed your kids.
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You have misstated many "facts" about immigration. You, sir, are the one who has a "house of cards" argument. Showing made up facts (we call those LIES), and telling us what you think the law says...really shouldn't hold up much longer.
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Most of us are perfectly capable of arguing our ideas clearly and with clarity. But when you're dealing with a bunch of jackoffs either so stupid or so racist that they would see this godawful law as anything other than a fetid piece of trash, why bother? Funny, but I don't see much hope of rationally convincing people who--when their bullshit statistics are pointed out to be bullshit--lose respect for the news organization that *didn't* print that bullshit.
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I'm sort of dissapointed they took out the scratches that were part of the "fake trailer" in GRINDHOUSE. I was hoping they would keep that look, because it gives this kind of film a lot of personality. Granted, I still think this film will kick ass, but with the scratches it could've kicked EXTRA ass.
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The burden of proof is on the accuser. You've given no substantiated evidence of your claims. The majority of your accusations have been disproven by reasonably credible sources. You have not done the same. Your arguments have not withstood scrutiny. Your offering uninformed opinions that come across as reactionary and are only based on spurious research.
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"People who drive with their driver's license and/or speak english like you would if you're a legal resident, have got nothing to worry about." You mean people who speak with an accent? And as for the lawsuits...I assure you they will be coming to AZ in WAVES!
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We must full hold this in our view, take it in, savor it for a moment, and commit it to memory. In the midst of another heated political debate at this site, a talkback with racial overtones no less, one talkbacker in particular is quite obnoxiously posting comments and some statistics to back those comments up. He keeps referring to these statistics when criticizing the opinion of others, and notes their own lack of research or statistical facts. He carries on for a while and even compiles a list of criteria for a dumbest poster award for this talkback....and then wins that award!!! LOL <p> This is a moment to be savored. This goes down in AICN talkback annals.
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Goldmine!
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The idea that right-wingers are all experts in research and us liberals just listen to who we believe is absolutely fucking absurd. Right wingers listen to Rush and Glen Beck as their thorough research on the subject and that's all they care to hear.
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The L.A. Times printed that story and were totally debunked some months later.<p> Out of the 10, I only see 5 of which are debunked. What' up?<p> My guess the Times skewed (intentionally or not) the others as well.<p> Cool. I hope those numbers are much, much lower. Or are they higher?<p> Truth first. My opinion comes second.<p> You guys act as if I skewed the numbers myself. <p> I posted those numbers to show the fucked up consequences of illegal immigration. Does anyone care that Mexicans are being treated like second class citizens?
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"Does anyone care that Mexicans are being treated like second class citizens?" hahahahahahahahaha you yourself are fully supporting a law that is doing JUST THAT
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Not to be a douche
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skimn, I live in Alabama and took Spanish in high school. Our Spanish teacher was from super-deep redneck Sylacauga, AL, and she would say things like "Buenos dias, ya'll!"! It was funny and I failed that class.
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I love how people who keep arguing for the ILLEGAL immigrants like to throw out lines such as "Well, you go pick fruit". Nice to know they are okay with exploiting people as an underpaid labor class. "Americans are too good for those jobs, but we'll put those Mexican's to work, by golly."
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Isn't Alba supposed to be his daughter? Also do Mexicans bleed black? This shit looks retarded, perhaps not as retarded as Predators.
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Then he can go back to the time period he so desperately wants to be apart of and leave us 2010 folk alone.
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The immigrations law is going to turn AZ into a conservative state and a "bankrupt nightmare"... oh, you mean unlike that liberal haven of California, right?
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...and non-citizens. This is the point, damn it! It allows law enforcement to fuck with you because you don't look "right". Not because you've done something, or even because you look suspicious. Just a simple, "hey, he's brown, let's check him out". Or, "gee, that accent sounds Hispanic, lets check his papers." That's some Nazi bullshit! This is America people! We are free to not be fucked with in this manner. Gaaaah!
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I think the whole "they's takin jobs frum us real 'mericans" is bullshit anyway. Most of them take jobs that none of you, nor anyone you know, would touch with a ten foot pole.
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The Times DID NOT print those stats. You fell for an internet myth hook line and sinker. The numbers you posted are false.
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Geezus. Did you fail 'cause you made fun of her accent?
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As opposed to how they're being treated now? Get your head out.<p>
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"liberal haven of California, right?" Yeah California is a shithole... oh wait their governor is, get this, A REPUBLICAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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California was bankrupt and going down the crapper well before Arnie took over.
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You're right...they ARE being treated as second class citizens now, but I fail to see who rounding them up because they look like they might be illegal helps them AT ALL?!?!?
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May 5, 2010, 9:14 p.m. CST
Careful Jaka, you don't want to address logical counterpoints —
by blakindigo
Cerebus hates logic.
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...my bad. (walks away mumbling to self, kicking rocks...)
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Posting a link from the L.A. Times (which used to the clout of the N.Y. Times long ago) which turns out to have been debunked?<p> Or wildly blurting out how they're FIRING TEACHERS WITH ACCENTS?<p> Damn, at least I was reaching fo a credible source haha.<p> But hey, the humor is not lost on me. Truth first. Always.
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i pay for my own health insurance, thank you. i own a video game studio. i won't be taking a penny from you or anyone else. i celebrated the day the health care bill passed. see, i care about my neighbors. i believe in looking out for my neighbor in their time of need. that's the kind of society i want to live in. i don't expect it to be free, but helping people in need has never been free. but when i was taught the story of the good samaritan in sunday school... i took it to heart.
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give it a shot here: http://tinyurl.com/378ew9n
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"...rounding them up because they look like they might be illegal"<p> Dude, you mean like the Japanese during WW2? Do you really expect that?
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True enough..except that they have had a REPUBLICAN governor since 1983
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...is that we are actually three or four state smooshed into one. Northern CA, the greater Bay Area, Southern CA and the central valley are all very different places. Different in as many ways as you could imagine.
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no. I think they will arrest many legal Hispanic Americans based on race (Though possibly under the guise of a "routine traffic stop". Make them jump through ridiculous hoops to prove their citizenship (which no one who isn't Hispanic will EVER deal with) and then send them on their way after finally getting enough "proof" after several days with not even so much as an apology
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than the generic brunette dude in this trailer.why RR could not get the same guy for the movie?<br /><p>anyway if there is a 3some with lohan,alba and rodriguez the movie will break Avatar's records.think about it mr RR.
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Ahnold is a RINO. Although he started off in the right direction, when the voters went all Greece and decided they'd rather go bankrupt than be responsible, he did what any unprincipled pol would do and turned left. Now he thinks his craphole of a state deserves a bailout. Let 'em fry.
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Do you believe any cop can tell the difference between somebody from Mexico and Spain? Or Mexico and Columbia? (I have many friends from there, they sound and look quite "Spanish"). How about a Brazilian speaking Portuguese, or even a tanned, dark haired Italian man? They can both sound very "Spanish". Siiiigh. I think I need to stop checking this talkback. lol Best part of all this is I'm watching the Spurs/Suns game. The Suns are wearing their Los Suns uniforms in solidarity with the Spanish people in their community. Their owner has been vocally against the bill. A protest and march is going on right now just up the street from the game. The only people pushing this thing are the INTERIM Governor and John freakin' McCain.
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Has it mostly right. I'd always thought the borders were the Feds' job, but if you read the Constitution, it doesn't say that. Though honestly, we should just pass a bill that's parity with Mexico's illegal immigration laws and be done with it.
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so since he's done a shitty job he's a RINO...awesome
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If I went to Europe or something, wouldn't I have to have paperwork or passports and such stating that I was from another country? And wouldn't I have to have those available to be checked? Yeah, thought so.
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...and from what he told me, any good cop is not going to waste his time with extra paper work and red tape unless they KNOW they're onto something.<p> It takes away from the calls which are priority.<p> Are you of the mindset that all or most cops are racist?
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Yes, if you had done something illegal or suspicious. Not just because you looked a certain way. It's not at all the same thing.
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Well then you should meet a whole lot more cops. Have you ever watched any of the plethora of reality tv shows about cops these days? Shit, one of them is even based in Arizona right now. There is no paperwork involved in a cop checking you out. None. Zero. That's why we have laws in America that protect citizens from being unlawfully harassed by them.
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Meaning dry zone.
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...should have left the doors to the arena wide-open and let anyone who gets in to stay for the game.
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Sin City 2? There was talk of it a long time ago.
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...so that doesn't really work. And why should he do that, anyway? There's a very diverse group of paying customers there right now having a great time.
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That there are people on this site who are actually open to discussion and are thinking things logically. Sure there are your typical right-wing and left-wing morons, but I'm glad to see people actually thinking this thing through.
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Fuck the system. Vote 3rd party.
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I'm responding to the process of detaining people at the station for 7 hours while immigration checks their status.<p> They can pull you over for anything,anytime. That's nothing new.
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I was actually thinking about that in a round about way just recently. Wondering how badly The Spirit hurt the eventual box office returns on that movie, and if they might actually be waiting a bit to let that disaster get further from our minds. RR is making movies outside the studio system, but they still need the money to make it. The Spirit is not going to encourage "the money" to give them a bunch of cash to make another movie that looks the same way. I'd like to think Sin City, RR and Frank Miller have enough built in audience to rectify that situation, but I'm not sure they do. That's what I was thinking about...
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Ah, but you see, this IS something new. Because they actually CAN'T pull you over for anything at any time. By law they've got to have a "reason". They can fabricate that reason, but that is the way the laws are written. This bill allows that reason to be your skin color and/or accent. And it's not even about pull over - it's any time, any place.
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So Sin City 2 is in permanent limbo...unless these 2 can kiss and make up. I forget the details, but I think Miller assumed he knew more about filmmaking than he really did. Spirit proved he was wrong. Maybe if he loses some of the ego now they might kiss and make up.
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Black Dynamite made 279,000 worldwide. I hope they aren't expecting to make much money with this, because it's clear there isn't much audience for these types of films beyond cinephiles.
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in my opinion. i think that the problem lies in allowing people to sue the police if they think they aren't going after illegals. that is where this law crosses over into racism. it's the people who don't like their neighbors and call the cops to check if they are illegals and then sue when the cops blow them off. and in typical racist style... they pay the cops so they are really just suing themselves. morons.
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What you don't get is that Republican and Democrat mean nothing anymore in politics. Arnie is NOT a Conservative - he is in fact proven to be a Progressive Liberal based on his Green agendas, his willingess to spend and dole out money to pet projects and special interest groups, and his wife is Kennedy. (nuff said) Now look at the state of Utah where the conservative politicians actually have been able to keep the state from going to crap - unlike Caleefornia. By the way - how's that skyrocketing tax (have to pay the interest groups) helping California's economy to grow?
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...to HAVE a debate with you on this topic, or any other "political" subject. There's no point to it. At least not online. Maybe if we were talking in person, having a beer, this would be worthwhile. But on an AICN talkback, it's pointless. I didn't address you, and I don't care to refute your argument. I'm just throwing in two pithy cents and going back to more fulfilling activities. <p> And MNG, I hear ya, I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for AICN and Harry and the gang, but as for regular Talkback participation, I'm pretty much over it. There are greener online pastures. It's nice to see the old names, I'll probably keep stopping by to check into what's going on, but as for locking horns and scoring TB points, I've happily got better things to concern myself with. Though it's fun to get a little taste now and again, and crack up at the infinite wit of the collective geek mind. Old habits and all that.
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Like America. There's lots of diverse people here too having a great time.<p> But what about the less fortunate who could not get tickets?<p> Sure, the vendors would be overrun and they will raise the hot dog prices because of the increased demand. Yes, some people would have to sit on cold, concrete steps whole others get comfy cushioned seats. And yes, those people will resent those with the cushy seats and there may be confrontations and security will have to be more visible etc.<p> Isn't this kinda what he's advocating?
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When will you ignorant naive Americans learn that you have no power anymore. The longer you stay in denial that Obama is our puppet fascist dictator the better it is for us. We want the illigal thug criminals who cant speak english and listen to shitty music to infect your country. the more illegals the faster we can destroy America. They will vote for our puppet dictators because we give them foodstamps and wellfare for sitting around drinking budweiser fucking and creating millions of more mexicans. who will all vote for our foodstamp puppedents. Death to America, up with the New World Order. Better start learning spanish, slaves.
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...I hadn't heard that. Most unfortunate. But, ya know, The Spirit probably hurt a lot of peoples feelings. lol
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Aaaaaaand.... I'm out! Nice chattin' folks. Peace.
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It's like saying mentally challenged when you mean retarded or differently abled instead of disabled. Either way my solution is to build a fucking wall and end this shit once and for all. Then we don't have to argue about it anymore and it will create jobs!
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I'd gladly be pulled over, frisked, worked over, you name it. But they don't, and that's the story of my life.
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I don't need to fork over cash to Robert R and his liberal b.s.
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And I'll gladly buy the first round.<p> And believe me, I empathize with the weariness of it all sometimes. Today, I had the time and inclination to jump into the pit. But damn it can be exausting!
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political correctness is for pussies who are afraid to call shit what it is because someone might cry.
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Wow!
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Now it's only applicable during lawful stops. Take that for what it is.<p> I wasn't really on board until that was fixed.
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If you don't follow the rules there are consequences. I'm sorry that your country is a shit hole but don't come here and make a shit hole out of ours too. To all the legal immigrants I welcome you and your culture.
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Suck my dick! (Or "chupa mi pinga" for the retard in ya!)
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unless you are leaving the planet, nothing you say matters. everyone will receive TOTAL FUCKING DESTRUCTION.
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Yeah, can't have that. Like counterfeiting - that's a federal crime. Hey, wait, there's a state law, too. But isn't the currency a Constitutionally mandated function of the federal government? Oh, right, it is. Guess Arizona needs to stop enforcing counterfeiting. So, if you get some funny money call the Secret Service 'cause Arizona wouldn't want to overstep its bounds.<p>And kidnapping, that's a federal crime, right? Yeah, matter of fact, it is. So, guess what Juan, Miguel, Lupe, and Consuela - the next time poor little Pedro y Alejandro are being held by "coyotes" for some money for smuggling their law-breaking ass into the country, don't you dare fucking call the LOCALS 'cause that's none of their goddamned business. Just get on the ol' horn to the FBI and I'm sure that they'll have somebody over to help you out REAL soon. Yeah, about 370 kidnappings a year in Phoenix (OF illegals BY illegals), but I'm positive that the FBI is chomping at the bit to take that off the hands of the locals who have "no business enforcing federal law."
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Even if you might be a dittohead, you're definitely not one of the scumbags. And in a hive of scum and villainy like this, that is always appreciated.
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...and Rodriguez had been talking about directing Sin City 2 again this year....so it may be on again. The word about the two of them fighting and not wanting to work together was back before The Spirit came out. Guess things changed since then.
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Kidnapping isn't a federal crime until you cross state lines. But hey, why let inconsequential things like details and facts get in the way of a good tirade?
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...who the fuck would want to have a beer with THAT guy? This place is about as lucid a forum for serious discussion as public transportation sometimes.
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Fucking please! I have to show MY papers every time I'm pulled over - it's called a fucking drivers' license and half these motherfuckers DON'T have 'em.<p>Ohs noes, them there illegals is gonna have to shows a valid driver's license?!?!?! Racism!!!!<p>See, what most don't understand about the Arizona law is that, prior to its implementation, some city and counties in Arizona did one thing and others did something else. Some cities were "sanctuary cities" (Mesa, Chandler, Phoenix) and some weren't. Some LEOs (law enforcement officers) asked for identification then contacted ICE for verification (Maricopa County) and some didn't.<p>WHAAAAAAT?!?!?! Asking and verifying?!?!?!? Why that's racist and discriminatory and racial profiling?!?!?!<p>Well, guess what - your federal government, ICE, and their ACCESS program disagree. They train local LEOs in how to properly and without discrimination check suspects for citizenship.<p>Now, I know it may come as a big fucking shock to some on the left, but their *IS* a common sense, legal, and non-discriminatory way to do this stuff.<p>Assume for a moment there's been a car accident and the cops show up at the scene. They ask for identification. One person provides a valid state-issued driver's license and proof of insurance. The other guy:<p>1) Doesn't have a license.<p>2) Doesn't have insurance.<p>3) Speaks poor English.<p>4) Can't provide a valid social security number.<p>5) Can't tell you where in the U.S. he was born.<p>If all these things occur (as they do to California, Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, and Texas cops every day)...<p>YOU MIGHT BE AN ILLEGAL!!!<p>So, what happens then? Oh, a complete travesty! A real discriminatory thing. You're held until you can prove who you are.<p>Now I know that may seem crazy and draconian to some of you, but I myself once left my driver's license at home when traveling out of state. (Actually, left it at the boarding gate for the airlines.) When I was pulled over while driving and couldn't produce my drivers license... I WAS HELD UNTIL MY D.L. COULD BE VERIFIED!!!!<p>And, finally, I find it pretty fucking strange that the side, group, and party which insists that we ALL produce our INSURANCE "papers" is suddenly against producing documentation. Hey, I know! When I file my taxes in a few years and am asked for proof of insurance, I'll scream RACISM, DISCRIMINATION, NAZI, NAZI, NAZI!!!
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Of treating criminals as criminals with a proper dose of "punishment fit the crime" mixed in... And make no mistake, illegal immigrants are criminals... But what concerns me is how overzealous enforcment by well-meaning officers (not to mention the abusive 1 in a 1000 fuckheads) leading to brown-skinned Americans... and in Arizona brown skin and American citizenship can go back generations... having to prove who the are.
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And it looks pretty awful...your typical MTV-style horror film remake. They are churning these out like a factory: <p> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_W_ZX4b20M
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NO AMNESTY!!!It was done in 1986 and only made the problem worse. Get back in line if you want to become a U.S. citizen. Cutting people who are poor and waiting in line isn't right.
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Comparing the requirement for "papers" to a driver's liscense is silly and short-sighted. A DL (and car insurance, for the most part) specifically relates to the operation of a vehicle and while it is not easy to do so, it is not required to get by as an American.<p>Also, be careful bringing up the language issue. There are folks from New Jersey to Arkansas who have more trouble with English than some immagrants. :)
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IN PIECES!!!!
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Gets me deported due to mangled grammar and sentence structure. I'm blaming Harry! :)
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<p>...about the new AZ legislation...</p> <p>I am not weighing in one way or the other, but there are definitely a lot of people on here who have no real idea what the bill says</p> <p>Here it is, first off...</p> <p>http://tinyurl.com/22sb2jx</p> <p>1. All this talk about "probable cause" is moot. The issues with this bill have to do with section 2, sub-section b, which starts on page 1, line 20. "Probable cause" is not mentioned, because that is not what we are talking about here. We are talking about "reasonable suspicion", which is a step below probable cause on the legal scale, and is absolutely not the same thing. Look them up.</p> <p>2.When a police officer has reasonable suspicion that an individual is engaged in illegal activity (which in this case would be being in this country illegally), he DOES have a right to approach, temporarily detain, question and search the individual in question. This is called a "Terry stop", after the SCOTUS case Terry v. Ohio. So we are not talking about asking someone for an ID during the course of a traffic stop. Reasonable suspicion absolutely gives the police a right to question and search you, so the issue with this bill is, what creates reasonable suspicion that an individual is in this country illegally? It is not defined.</p> <p>3.Race, nationality, etc., absolutely CAN be a factor in determining whether or not there is reasonable suspicion that someone is here illegally. Lines 30-34 explicitly state that police "may not solely consider race, color or national origin". "Solely" is the key. It does not say "may not consider race, etc., at all"...it says that cannot be the sole reason. As long as the officer in question observes something else that also arouses suspicion, he/she absolutely can factor in race, etc. According to the language in the bill itself, that simply cannot be the sole cause for reasonable suspicion. Again, the other things that law enforcement might be looking for are not defined. Most reasonable people--Republicans and Democrats--who have issues with this bill simply want to know what police are going to be looking for, because they want to make sure that American citizens of Latin descent are not going to be subject to unnecessary Terry stops simply because they "look" like they might be illegal immigrants. I for one, would like to know what other factors the police will be taking into consideration when trying to determine whether or not there is reasonable suspicion.</p>
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Movie looks like it'll be as dull, "tongue-in-cheek" and soulless as Sin City. You know how a movie can pay homage to old movies you remember fondly? By not being crap.
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May 5, 2010, 11:11 p.m. CST
Harry, you're such a mindless tool like so many libs
by SierraTangoFoxtrotUniform
You and your hipster ilk sicken me. You people are akin to Nazis with your propaganda and your hatred of free speech. Go die.
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...wants people who hate free speech to go and die. It's irony overload.
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Machete: "So ... ju married mang?" <P> Summer: "Yeah. Crazy, huh?" <P> *Cut to Summer's head flying through the air*
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I, too, have read the bill and it's admirable that you've done so. However, maybe you did that at the expense of paying attention to the news.<p>1) In 11-1051(B) The phrase “lawful contact” has been changed to “lawful stop, detention or arrest” and it added that said “stop, detention, or arrest” must be “in the enforcement of any other law or ordinance of a county, city or town or this state.”<p>2) See 1) - "“stop, detention, or arrest” must be “in the enforcement of any other law or ordinance of a county, city or town or this state.” That negates your reasonable suspicion of being in the country illegally. By the way, a "Terry stop" has a pretty long legal precedent establishing under what circumstances one may be stopped and asked to produce identification and "reasonable suspicion" was the court's criteria then and subsequent cases have upheld it and extended it (Hilbel).<p>3) Again, it's great you read the bill, but you should watch the news. The word "solely" was struck from the bill on Friday (and signed by Brewer). The passage now reads "may not consider race, color or national origin," solely is gone. So, if solely was the key, then the whole thing is now "unlocked."<p>And, since you asked "what other factors the police will be taking into consideration when trying to determine whether or not there is reasonable suspicion," let me say it again - no driver's license or identification, no insurance, no social security number, can't provide a place of birth, speaking with an accent, in the car with seventeen other people who ALSO can't provide any documents or information.<p>Look, this "reasonable suspicion" is not exactly the bugaboo that one might think. "Reasonable suspicion" has been used in our courts since always and forever. It's an integral part of our judicial system and just 'cause some people find the concept of a "reasonable man" to be mysterious and perplexing doesn't mean that it is.<p>If "reasonable suspicion" can be used in a "Terry stop" on me, then it can sure be used on anyone else, right? Including an illegal and a non-illegal. And, guess what - when you're LEGAL you produce your driver's license and, presto, all is done.<p>Out of curiosity myself (seriously), who are these mysterious citizens driving around and committing OTHER crimes (speeding, broken tail light, running a stop sign, etc. - remember: the law amended now 'cause they must be committing some OTHER crime) without identification who can't prove who they are and who are horribly offended that they have to do what any of the rest of us have to do EVERY SINGLE TIME WE'RE STOPPED?
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Keep on coming with the blanket statement against all liberals, even though you may have no idea what I truly believe.
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Joe Arpaio in Maricopa Arizona has been doing EXACTLY what this law says for about two years. He pulls over for ANOTHER crime then asks for i.d. If they can't produce identification or somehow establish their identity, he takes 'em in until they can. See, if they're citizens of these here good ol' United States of America, they can produce i.d. or documentation or their i.d. can be confirmed pretty quickly with a couple of checks. But, if they can't, he turns 'em over to ICE, the federal government, the immigration enforcement agency, and it's all in Uncle Sam's hands.<p>Now the big bad 'Bama's Justice Department someone feels that this is unfair or something, so Eric Holder (Attorney General) has been investigating Arpaio's practices for over a year now for illegality or civil rights violations and guess what --- nothing, zip, zilch, nada! They can't find anything wrong or any violations to charge Arpaio with.<p>This bill (AZ1070) essentially makes law for ALL of Arizona what Arpaio's been doing for years in Maricopa County without any civil rights violations or the Fed being able to drum up squat.
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May 5, 2010, 11:36 p.m. CST
Sierra, it isn't liberals who try to censor rap and heavy metal.
by ganymede3010
It's the inbred bible belt conservatives whom you support.
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Until last August, I lived in California my entire life. And nowhere, at no point, was my life or job or anyone's life or job that I've known been threatened by some brown people. As a matter of fact, they have done nothing but contribute to what little of the state is left. Every single anti-Mexican stance I've seen has been based in sheer misinformation. It's ridiculous, and I don't think anybody should be able to comment until they've experienced it. They are not taking our jobs, they are not taking our freedoms, and hey, if Arizona wants to continue with their "this illegal immigrant murdered this here family," they need to bring up another dozen cases where crimes were committed by legal, tax-paying American (and yes, white) citizens. And I've spent some time in Arizona, and it's messsssssed up.
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Unfortunately, they've already got their own (failed) state. They just refuse to stay in it.<p>Mexico is the kid you put in time out who keeps leaving the corner.<p>Diego, what are you doing?!?! Get back in the corner! I *just* put you there!<p>Si, Senor.<p>Five minutes later, Diego is right back.
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Seriously, I want to see what people like about it. But I've been there cumulatively for five months, and I've had a shitload of problems there. Care to direct me toward some equality?
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We need it in 3D now!!!
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<p>You're right, I have not seen any news stories covering any amendments that were attached to the bill other than the changes in the house version I linked to. I am on a number of deadlines, and with the exception of wasting time on sites like this, have done nothing but work and sleep for the last several days. So you do, in fact, have my number on that one. Do you by any chance have a link to said "final version"? Not doubting you, just curious to read it as I was not aware of those additional changes.</p> <p>As for reasonable suspicion, I am fully aware that it is not something that was made up for this law. Unlike probable cause, the legal concept of reasonable suspicion is something that is fairly nebulous and is really designed to work as the result of a well-trained law enforcement professional's instincts and level-headed judgment in the field. Of course any one of us can be subject to a lawful Terry stop assuming the police have reasonable suspicion that we are engaged in illegal activity; again, the question I had was exactly what arouses reasonable suspicion with regard to immigration status?</p> <p>Now assuming that all those changes you refer to are accurate (and I will), then it is no longer a question of Terry stops because of reasonable suspicion with regard to immigration status, because as you point out, the amendments make it clear that said “stop, detention, or arrest” must be “in the enforcement of any other law or ordinance of a county, city or town or this state.” So I stand corrected because it looks like the Terry stop issue--which was really my big issue--is actually what is moot.</p> <p>Finally, if the amended passage does indeed read "may not consider race, color or national origin", then that is all I wanted in the first place, and that's all good by me.</p> <p>It looks like all my issues with the bill have been resolved: that doesn't change the fact that said issues were 100% legit, but if the language I took issue with has been changed, I am ok with it now.</p> <p>For the record, I am certainly not pro-illegal immigration. But I am also not pro-American citizens being unjustly harassed, which is what the original senate and house versions of this bill would undoubtedly resulted in.</p> <p>Now, I would like to see legislation, on a federal level, that takes a much more hard-line approach in terms of penalizing the people who employ illegals...I would like to see possible jail time for said employers...because I think the easiest way to keep people from entering this country illegally looking for work is to make sure they won't be able to find any when they get here.</p>
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I'm not one for adrenaline-infused, CGI-laden borefests, so I rarely if ever look forward to new films. But I loved Planet Terror, and IMO the scratches made the movie so much fun and interesting in my eyes, and it took me back to those grindhouse films I saw growing up when my crazy grandpa took me to see as a little girl. That said, I wouldn't want Rodriguez repating himself look-wise with this movie, cause that would be boring. Last movie I went to see in a theatre was incidentally, the GH double-feature. Looks like it will be Rodriguez putting my ass again on that same seat with Machete.
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Never mind that this country was founded by immigrants. “Give me your tired, your hungry, your poor, I'll piss on them. That's what the statue of bigotry says.” -Lou Reed.
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I love Mexicans. Seriously. I love Mexican culture (social not political). I love talking Spanish to 'em. I love shopping in Mexican markets, and listening to Mexican music when I'm in the mood.<p>(Seriously, one of my all-time favorite songs is "Estupido Romantico" by Mazz. In my top fifty, I think. Actually, listening to it again right now. Video's on Youtube.)<p>I think Latina chicks are effin' hot as hell and I loves my Mexican brothers!<p>Matter of fact and seriously, I used to joke all the time with Mexicans out here that "yo soy un gringo de la cintura arriba, un negro de la cintura abajo, pero un Mexicano en mi corazon!" (I'm a gringo from the waist up, a negro from the waist down, but a Mexican in my heart!) They cracked up over that shit.<p>Heck, I even kinda like the Mexican "bangers." I find that shit fascinating and the movie "American Me" is bad ass.<p>For real, dude, I'll even occasionally throw on the Mexican channels out here and watch the telenovelas (HOT chicks and over-the-top storylines and acting) or the news or talk shows or (late night) those crazy Mexican movies with all the shooting and the chicks running around in lingerie and crap. Those movies are AWESOME! The homeliest, chunkiest, mustachioed actor in the bunch is usually the hero and kicks all kind of ass before he gets the girl.<p>Yes, I love Mexicans, but law-breaking is law-breaking. I don't care what the excuse is or the explanation or the sympathy or the what-the-fuck-ever. You broke the law and took the place of THOUSANDS and MILLIONS who are waiting THEIR place in line.<p>I'm not "anti-Mexican," but I am anti-illegal alien.<p>I live in California, too (though not my entire life). Here's one of MY illegal stories (true story):<p>After we'd been out here two or three years, my wife woke up one morning to go to work or school (I can't remember which) and I was still at home playing on the computer.<p>Suddenly, the door burst open and she rushed back into our apartment.<p>"Where did I park my car last night," she said. I told her and we both walked out to where the car had been. The car was gone.<p>We called the police and the insurance and went on about our way, waiting for the settlement on our car.<p>One month later, just as insurance was about to settle (literally, they'd called us to come pick up the check the next day), my wife got a call at her office (dental assistant by now). The caller said that he was with L.A. County Sheriff's Department, Auto Theft, and that her car had been found and was at an towing yard and that we could come claim the vehicle.<p>My wife called the insurance company and, the next day, we went out to see the car. We thought that we'd get the vehicle back and MAYBE have to do some repairs - windows, locks, ignition, that sort of thing.<p>Instead, we were surprised to find the car STRIPPED! And, when I say STRIPPED, I mean EVERYTHING. I could stick my head through the car's window and look from the rear tail lights to the dash; everything was gone - seats, carpeting, dash, console, EVE-RY-FUCKING-THING!<p>The car now had Mexican license plates and was littered in the back with Mexican soda bottles and snack food wrappers. Also, some empty Mexican medicine bottles.<p>Huh, I thought. So, I'm thinking maybe a MEXICAN stole my car?<p>And it stank like bleach. Lots and lots of bleach.<p>And, weirdly, there was a car battery sitting in the floor of the vehicle where the passenger seat had been. It was attached to two cables that ran from the terminal out the passenger window and under the hood.<p>I asked the tow yard guy what the fuck was going on. He told us that they thought the thieves were trying to blow up the car when they ditched it.<p>"They?" I asked.<p>"Yeah, they," he said.<p>Seems that that not only did the cops and the tow guy respond to the found car, but the Fire Department as well. They really thought that the battery was part of a bomb.<p>Then the tow guy asked us if we saw the message inside.<p>Message?<p>He told us to stick our heads back in the car while he flipped down the passenger and driver's sun visors. Written across them, in red Magic marker and Spanish, was the following:<p>¡Precaución! ¡No entre! ¡Cuarentena! ¡Virus peligroso!<p>Translation for the low-life-piece-of-shit impaired: "Caution! Do not enter! Quarantine! Dangerous virus!"<p>WHAT... THE... FUCK!<p>We had no clue what was going on and neither did the tow guy, but we left and called the insurance company and told 'em to come look at the car themselves, that it was pretty much totaled and we thought we'd soon have our money.<p>Au contraire, mon ami!<p>The next day, at work again, my wife get's ANOTHER phone call. This time from the L.A. County Sheriff's Department, Homicide Division. My wife thought it was a joke, but the detective told her that he was serious - the insurance company couldn't have the car 'cause it was the scene of a homicide and being impounded.<p>He revealed that the car had been stolen by three illegal alien drug dealers who'd used the car to run drugs back and forth across the border (California border, this time). Two of the guys had a falling out with a third. They'd driven out to the desert, the odd-man-out in the passenger seat. When they got out where nobody was around, the guy in the back seat had claimed that he needed to piss. So he got out, pissed, walked back up to the passenger side and shot his unfortunate companion through the passenger window. Multiple, multiple times. Very, very dead.<p>Unfortunately, what these Mensa (Mencia?) candidates didn't count on was that bullets don't always stop in the person you're shooting. One of the bullets went right through the "dead man riding" and into the driver!<p>They dumped the dead Juan Doe-Dee-Doe into the desert and drove the injured guy to a hospital. The shooter then dropped his companion off and went to get rid of the car.<p>In fact, the car had been stripped and sprayed with bleach to get rid of evidence. The cables HAD been hooked up to the car's engine in the vain hope that it would burn. The Magic marker message was also in the vain hope that, when the car was found, authorities would hose the car down, further obliterating any evidence inside.<p>All this was related to the cops by the gunshot illegal alien in the hospital.<p>The fugitive shooter was quickly caught and we had to go down to the LAPD evidence impound to review the car with the LA deputy to identify what was ours and what wasn't. A pretty easy job as all the stuff left (Mexican sodas, wrappers, meds, etc.) was theirs.<p>While chatting with the deputy and learning that story, he told us that at least EIGHTY PERCENT of his work involved illegal aliens in some way - perpetrators, victims, witnesses.<p>So that's one of my illegal stories. You've lived out here all your life and you've got nothing like that? Wow. Lucky guy.<p>Am I saying all Mexicans are like the drug-running asses that stole that car? Absolutely not.<p>What I am saying is that you can't run a country with porous borders, fueling murders, kidnappings, and drug-running BOTH WAYS, and expect that everything is gonna work itself out just fine.
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and it shows
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Are we really going to throw out the "who was here first?" Card? If that's the case then it was the Aussies. <br> http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/975468/posts <br> http://www.scienceblog.com/cms/node/4017 <br> The "who was here first" card is just as fallacious as the "race" card in an argument.
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Try this for the amendment stuff:<p>http://tiny.cc/8cm35<p>And:<p>http://tiny.cc/cnx85<p>When they (legislative bodies) amend laws, they don't reproduce the entire text of the law; they just say "the word 'solely' shall be struck from yada yada yada" and "the words 'legal contact' shall be struck from yada yada yada and replaced with blah blah blah."<p>And I understand the busy and stuff and I'm glad that you, like me, at least read the bill. So many are getting so heated up and they haven't even read it (or the amendments) nor do they know that "i.d. check" goes on all the time and it's been going on in Arizona and now it's just codified.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/sci/tech/430944.stm <br> "The first Americans were descended from Australian aborigines, according to evidence in a new BBC documentary."
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http://tinyurl.com/y2r38qc - READ THE ACTUAL BILL Law enforcement can't just accuse someone of being illegal, they have to have reasonable suspicion and on top of that need to have already stopped them for another unrelated crime. And even when they think that person is illegal, they have to clear it first with the Federal government. And don't bring up the race issue because honestly, it's never been about that. The fact that a lot illegals come from Mexico is just testament to how shitty the Mexican government is; AND MEXICO HAS TOUGHER IMMIGRATION POLICIES THAN WE DO!! And whoever says that illegals 'contribute' to our country, are fucking retarded becaus the fact that they're undocumented means that they aren't obligated to pay taxes, which every LEGAL citizen of the country has to. So when you go work an eight hour job five to seven days a week (eight if you're a beatle) and get your paycheck with a % taken out in taxes, that goes to to govt which uses it for whatever they (should) need, and when they're done 'borrowing' it they give it back (or at least a percentage anyway). But illegal immigrants (for the most part) don't pay into taxes, and thusly become a black-hole in which our money isn't fully accounted for. That's part of th reason why California is in the shitter right now.
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But nobody I know is against LEGAL immigrants. As I said, I love Mexicans. What I'm against is ILLEGAL immigrants. What part of ILLEGAL do you not understand?<p>See, you may not be aware but a guy named "Fast Faisal" Shithead/Shahzad, a naturalized citizen who went through the whole LEGAL immigration process, just tried to set off a bomb in Times Square.<p>Personally, if we can't catch the ones who use LEGAL channels to come here, I sure as shit don't want to even consider the ILLEGAL opportunities.
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<p>I actually just did a little search of my own and turned up AZ HB 2162, which is the bill that contains the amendments you are referring to (and obviously what you linked to, as well). So I do indeed stand corrected.</p> <p>As for being reasonable...you know, politics is important stuff...it does have a lot to do with our daily lives...and it makes it a lot easier to express concerns when:</p> <P>1. They are reasonable and legitimate.</P> <P>2. You do not express them by screaming, generalizing, resorting to hyperbolic straw man arguments, etc.</P> <P>3. I do realize this is AICN, so let me just close by saying THOR'S SUIT IS MADE OF FUCKING RUBBER?! FUCK THAT MOVIE!!! DIE HOLLYWOOD ASSHOLES!! DIE!!!</P>
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May 6, 2010, 12:10 a.m. CST
Ohhhh...there are many reasons why CA is in the shitter...
by Lenny Nero
...that has nothing to do with illegal immigrants. Live here for 25 years and you'll figure it out.
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I hear ya!
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I never said that illegal immigrants were the cause of Cali being "in the shitter." In fact, I never said we were. (Though, we are.)<p>I've lived out here ten years now and, I don't know, this place is a fucking circus, crazy and fun and scary and cool all at the same time. I can't tell that much has changed in a decade, but I'm sure that you, as someone who's been here twenty-five years, have seen a lot of changes.<p>Hopefully, California will still be around for me in fifteen more years! ;-)
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"Immigration and the Alien Gang Epidemic: Problems and Solutions Testimony of Heather Mac Donald, Senior Fellow, Manhattan Institute for Policy Research, before the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Immigration, Border Security, and Claims" <br> http://www.manhattan-institute.org/html/mac_donald04-13-05.htm <br> So, the stats aren't false. They're just not credited properly.
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Liberals don't try and censor rap and metal? Are you serious? Were you even alive during the Tipper Gore / Parents Music Resource Center witch trials? Both sides were involved.
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this bites.
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Tipper Gore and the Tipper Sticker <br> http://crm114.com/algore/tipper.html
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And fuck the L.A. Times. It's not like it was Wikipedia or something. Go figure.<p> I remember when that P.M.R.C. stuff hit the fan in the 80's and my man Zappa and others took it straight to Congress. Dee Snider, John Denver...it was quite an uproar. YouTube Frank Zappa on the old CNN show Crossfire (that was a great show and they should really bring that format back)...talking about censorship and the P.M.R.C. Great stuff!
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...and I throat fucked that bitch into oblivion. You betcha, guys and gals!
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They're correct on the immigration issue (which is really a labor law issue in disguise). The idea that this gets taken out on the individuals rather than the BUSINESS OWNERS who hire them is the real crime. I still want to see Machete though.
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Speaking as a transplanted New Yorker who moved to California 16 years ago...which is more than enough time to witness this state going downhill firsthand...I would agree that trying to blame ALL of California's woes on illegals is stupid. On the other hand, they obviously have a MAJOR detrimental impact on the state considering that a fiscal study conducted about a year ago, which was reported in the LA TIMES among other outlets, showed that roughly 25 cents of EVERY California tax dollar was spent on -- yes, you guessed it -- costs directly created by illegals (school, hospital, social services, etc) that the LEGAL residents of California have to pick up the tab on.<p>It's bad enough that the fucks in Sacramento can't balance a budget, but it would certainly be a bit easier when you realize a full fucking QUARTER of the state budget is money being laid out for people that are here ILLEGALLY.
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They all seem like some sort of weird cult now. Have they always been like that?
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No one would insinuate that you hate Mexicans or any other race, dude. You loved the Thor pic... clearly nothing can offend you :P
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Think about it: From William F. Buckley to Glen Beck. Wow. Just...wow.
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I'm more excited about Jeff Fahey being in this than anyone else. Dude needs to be in more movies. Seriously. And damn it was hard seeing him go out the way he did on LOST.
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as soon as the Republicans gain power again they'll be doing the exact same shit Beck is complaining about. well by the time that happens the USA will have probably collapsed by then because all the illigal mexicans sucked the taxes dry for food stamps and hospital bills for the millions of mexican babies
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And the crazies on the fringe are attracting people pissed with the regular, non-crazy conservatives.
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@juansanchez: yeh, that was the lamest part of the trailer, alba is a cringeworthy actress. but grindhouse/exploitation is definitely back! and not just in american cinema, ive noticed especially japanese cinema producing a whole slew of "gore-sploitation" flicks in the last few years. australia too has had a few great ones. are we entering another golden age of great trash cinema??!!
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I think he may be using the word cross to mean angry, in which case you could read it as, "We didn't anger the border, the border angered us."
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It's a movie...it was made before the law passed...it happens to deal with illegals. Would anyone care about this if Arizona wasn't in the news right now? As for the 'Message to Arizona' at the start of the trailer...it worked...got everyone chattering like upset schoolgirls... Leave your politics at the door. If you don't want to see it don't see it.
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this looks crap. it looks like a spot-fest with nothing holding the story together. AICN will prob give it a great review.... What a load of shit.
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This movie is going to kick all sorts of ass. Im there first showing.
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Fat Steven did this instead of the expendables?
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Like EZ-Pass, but for peoples.
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For every person you gain, you lose someone like me. I was actually excited to see this, now I won't.
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— who now want to see this. Some were 'ify' but now are gung-ho. And, I was down from jump, because of Danny Trejo.
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Really, since this ad came out yesterday you polled a bunch of folks who were iffy on it but because the ad injects politics are now solid locks to go see the film? Yeah, that sounds real.
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They are a complete waste of time and film. Because movies like machete are aimed at the idiots of society, it will be applauded and not condemned for being racist trash.
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This traile,r however, doesn't inspire much confidence. I fear this movie will be one of those where the idea and concept is much better then the execution. Bascially, like every movie in Robert Rodriguez's carrer.<br><br>They should had made SHE-WOLF OF THE THIRD REICH instead. Nicholas Cage as Fun Manchu!!!!
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Best casting ever!
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The Expendables is going to suck. Just you wait.
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It's funny that all these smaller government advocates now support required ID on your person at all times. Actually it's more sad than funny.
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Just comparing the action in Machete vs. Expendables trailers...this looks far superior.
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Where everyone had their ID's tatooed to their wrist? Welcome to Arizona, Not Sure.
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It's Cool!
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Unless we get pulled over. Then I don't know you from Adam.
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Three, actually. Fahey, Rodriguez, and don't forget Cheech.
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if it means less brown people.
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and not in a retro way. looks like days of our lives in some scenes
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If illegal people want amnesty for committing a federal felony (yes, it is), then I want to rob one bank and be given amnesty. Just one.
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I can't wait to see it, but the trailer in Grindhouse, made it look more like an aged film with the scratches and all. This looks like a straight to dvd movie filmed on a VHS camera. So they could've done more with the look of the movie. But it looks pretty fun. Can't wait to see it.
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Whether leftists call themselves "progressives," "liberals," "communists," "socialists," "National Socialists," or any other moniker, their ideology is aggressively anti-American. Thomas Jefferson said this about leftists: "These men have no right to office. If a [leftist] be in office, anywhere, and it be known to the President, the oath he has taken to support the Constitution imperiously requires the instantaneous dismissing of such officer; and I hold the President criminal if he permitted such to remain."
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Do I need to point out that the "the border crossed us" bit was a riff on Spike Lee's "Malcolm X", where Denzel Washington said "We didn't land on Plymouth Rock - Plymouth Rock landed on us"?
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Your [leftist] was originally "monarchist". A leftist at least believes in a majority rule democracy. A monarchist was a crown loyalist. How does this translate? Please explain.
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Just for kicks, let's turn that around 180 degrees:<P>All Right-Wingers are Enemies of the United States<P>Why? Well, since fascist-conservatives don't believe in progress, they are more than willing to continue living in a world of shit.<P>Gives me a chuckle.
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Just move up here with us white and black people. Let the Mexicans have Arizona and New Mexico. IT'S A FUCKING DESERT!
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excuse me
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The spectrum from left to right was and is related to the amount of central government control. Totalitarianism on the extreme left, anarchy on the extreme right. Closer to the center, "monarchists" were on the left favoring strong central government. Jefferson and the other founders of America were on the right, favoring greater individual liberty.
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Your gainsay post makes no sense. The right in America seek to preserve and defend liberty, which leads to a better world. The left seek to fundamentally change what made America great, via strong central government rule which leads to less individual freedom. Right = liberty; Left = tyranny.
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Oh, it makes perfect sense. Give it a moment and think about it.<P>Quote: "The left seek to fundamentally change what made America great, via strong central government rule which leads to less individual freedom. Right = liberty; Left = tyranny."<P>Once again, we see a gross distortion of the US political scale as only an AICN Talkbacker can provide. Ponderous.
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Fucking twitter twats.
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For one, there are too many of them. For every one illegal deported, there are 10 to take his place. We need to attack what motivates illegal immigration. These would be 2 things: Too many unethical businesses hiring illegals, and the fact the Mexico is a practically a third world country. There needs to be more enforcemnt and harsher penalties to those that hire illegals ( or undocumenteds, whatever). As for Mexico I say divert our forces in Iraq and send them to mexico. At least the soldiers can fly home for the weekend. But we also have to be realistic, most illegals are doing jobs nobody wants to do anyways. America's foundation was built the upon the bodies of immigrants toiling in horrible conditons for little or no pay.
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I'm seeing a whole lot of "waaah" in this talkback. Shut the fuck up. We're getting Machete.
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your posts reek of loony Beckian word-soup propaganda. I'm amazed you can spell, actually, most of your Tea Party brethren seem to have trouble with that. Also, calling a liberal (progressive, whatever) an enemy of the state is something your conservative grandpa would be ashamed of. America is big enough, complicated enough, and beautiful enough to be more than one thing at the same time. Not everyone that disagrees with you is an enemy, you uptight nerd.
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No, he didn't. You gullible schmuck.
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I'll get labeled some narrow definition of leftist according to my post to Kentuckian; my politics will be explained, my mental faculties will be questioned, my moral and ethical standing will be criticized, possibly the fact of my manhood impunged...
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Anarchists are almost universally considered extreme leftists, you tool. Your one-dimensional description of the left/right divide is inadequate and out-dated, failing to recognize that the fact that social and economic political ideologies work on different spectra. While a broad description of political "left" and "right" is possible on as little as two dimensions, your single axis of totalitarianism vs. anarchy is *totally fucking stupid*.
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anyone who is so deeply entrenched in the contemporary definition of what 'right' and 'left' means right now, as of the last few years, claiming Jefferson as their own clearly doesn't understand that politics is an organic creature, evolving and changing over time. It's like when people are really surprised to find out that Lincoln was a Republican. "but, but, he freed the slaves!" Yes dear, a Republican wasn't the same thing back then as it is now. Jefferson would have been appalled at the fringe right of the conservative movement today, and you know it.
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once again, well said.
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Let's allow you anti-American leftists to obfuscate the political spectrum to avoid the obvious truth about yourselves for a moment, and focus on this fact: Leftists hate America. Oh, but you say, "I love America." And you also want to FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE America away from its foundational core. Try this, if you have any person in your life whom you love: tell that person you love them, and that you want to fundamentally change them. Then prepare to get slapped, deservedly so.
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back in November 2005. And I'm a white guy from Canada, driving a car with Canadian plates. Good thing I always carry full ID (license, registration, passport, paid-up credit cards) when I'm in Amerika. We United Empire Loyalists are just going to have to go down there and clear up these border issues...
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Colonial Williamsberg was confiscated from United Empire Loyalists who were forces to flee to Canada. Well, the CHICKENS ARE COMIN' HOME TO ROOST Y'ALL!!! CANUCK POWER!!!!!!<p> ;-)
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The guy who will continue to spout off nonsense without really responding to your post.
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The right can equal tyranny too!
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The promotional end of Machete certainly isn't pulling any punches. I wouldn't want to get on the wrong side of filmmakers like this.
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i just invented a flying car! fancy a ride?
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...I'd like to say that I'm in favor of the Arizona law. If that means I have to carry around my papers, then so be it. Its no different from me carrying my driver's license.<p> "You want my papers officer? Here you go..... Yes officer, I am of Persian descent.... Yes officer, I do realize my name makes me sound like one of those Muslim terrorist wankers... As you can see officer, this proves I am legal. Run along now, that's a good little copper."
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I don't suppose you will ever actually see this, but I call bs on what you said -- see you just made sweeping, condeming generalizations and assumptions...based on? I don't know what. See all the time I hear about how racist we are, all these things we do...but you know that isn't me, I know that much. There is always these like examples of "conservative x did this to a homosexual, or conservative y spouted hate speech. But those are the crazies. Like the people right here on this forum, that I suppose you could call liberal calling for all conservatives to be killed - the don't represent any kind of majority or general consensus of thought. They are whacko. Its like I said, none of the conservatives I know are racist in the least. And as far as "conservatives" increasing govt - don't mistake Republicans for conservatives. They might be more conservative than the dems, but lately, especially that last idiot in the Oval Office they have been very liberal in thier tendencies.
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America is always changing. Time passes, attitudes change, the times change, politics change, everything changes. I've considered myself more or less a political conservative all my life, but many of my views are now considered quite left of center, though when I was younger the distinction was less harsh. What happened? Oh sure, as I got older, maybe I mellowed out a bit on some things, got a little less strident, maybe I'm a little less tolerant of some things now, but I think the world, and America also changed. my sphere of political understanding and the political realities of America are never in total harmony, the overlap is always blurring, shifting, redefining itself. I'm at least old enough now to understand and accept that the two spheres will never align perfectly, and I'm ok with that. There will always be things about this country that I will be ashamed of, that I will consider my duty as a citizen to resist, but at the end of the day I still believe its the best country in the world. Not in spite of this, but because of it. <p> I don't expect America to bend to my will, because there are 300 million people here, not all of them are required to agree with me on everything before I'll accept America for who she is. One of the things that makes America great is that we can disagree, passionately, and both our opinions, no matter how at odds are equally valid. Our right to speak our opinions to one another is even enshrined in our most fundamental laws. <p> So who really hates America, Kentuckian? Which one of us accepts that there will always be things we would like to change, but also accepts that in the final definition that imperfection is part of America's inherent beauty? Which one of us sees enemies around every corner, agents of destruction within our own borders, interlopers, impostors, combatants masquerading as fellow citizens, traitors deceiving the dwindling population of 'real Americans'? Tell me Kentuckian, if things are as bad as you make them out to be, and all these anti-American Americans are all around you, if you hate the left so much (and whoever else you don't consider 'real' Americans) how much can you really love this country? Sounds to me like who you consider authentically American is a smaller and smaller minority every day. Sounds to me like you're the one who hates what America actually is, and instead want to hold onto some Norman Rockwell dream of what you imagine it once was. Where is your pride? <p> So, I ask you again, who hates America?
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Tell me, do you love America so much you want to undo all those "fundamental changes" to our constitution? Bring back slavery, nix a woman's right to vote, and forget about that nasty equal protection clause? Well, shit, those are just the *new* amendments! Lets go back before we "fundamentally changed" our country with the first ten. Fucking Bill of Rights, screwing up our perfect and wonderful Constitution! The really fucking hilarious thing is that jerk-offs like you only call it *changing* the country when it's the left doing it. When the *right* tries to do away with the first fucking amendment, that's fine. In the fifties we change the pledge of allegiance to add the words "Under God" and that's okay. But if a leftist wants to take it out--well, shit, they're trying to CHANGE AMERICA! When right-wing hacks advocate torture despite *the explicit text* of the fourth fucking amendment, that's PATRIOTISM. When they try to give America an official language despite the country's multicultural history, that's PATRIOTISM. When they want to deny equal protection under the law to gays despite the promise that all people are created equal, that's PATRIOTISM. When they undermine the free market by giving huge subsidies to the oil industry or allow health insurance companies to operate as monopolies, that's PATRIOTISM. What a load of fetid elephant dung. Here's a fucking clue, dipshit: There isn't a single goddamn thing in the Constitution that keeps the government from providing healthcare (Guess who started the first public healthcare in this country? JOHN FUCKING ADAMS) or saying that America has to be a white, English-speaking nation (you have any idea how much of this fucking country we bought from France? Spain? Russia?) or saying that this is a Christian nation (The Treaty of Tripoli unequivocally states we are not--passed unanimously by the Senate in fucking 1797) or any of the other horseshit scared conservatives bitch and moan about 'cause they really really REALLY want to be special.
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You have such a way with words. I am a big fan. I still want to wash your mouth out with soap, but I'm just glad you're around. <p> "JOHN FUCKING ADAMS." Shit motherfucker, you made me laugh.
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May 6, 2010, 12:18 p.m. CST
I haven't read the new law, but what does it say that's so hatea
by Marksman91
Look, before you assume anything, I'm Venezuelan, and no, I'm not living in the U.S (though I did for 3 years, but that was a long time ago), so I'm KIND of well-known with American culture and what to expect from people depending on which state I am, but nevertheless, I still haven't read this law, because frankly I don't have the time. Now, WHAT is it that they changed so radically that's making people angry as hell? I don't understand what's so bad about "criminalizing" illegal immigrants. Isn't being an illegal immigrant already breaking the law and therefore already makes one a criminal? What the hell's so drastically bad about the new law?
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Sound-Minded Talkbackers win. Fatality.
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Cheers. Nice to have you around providing the sane counterpoint, too. ;)
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Doubtless there's a fringe who would like nothing more than to revert America back to the days of white domination, slavery and women's subjugation. <P> Not me though. I mean, there are *some* days I feel that way, but it's rare. Mostly it's because I had a rough commute.
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What's so bad about the law, essentially: 1: Police can detain (i.e. put in jail) anyone the stop if they have a "reasonable suspicion" the person is an illegal immigrant. That means they can put an American citizen in jail if that citizen can't provide their birth certificate. 2: It allows appearance, accent, and race to be used to judge "reasonable suspicion", meaning that a cop doesn't really need much evidence--essentially being non-white or having an accent is enough. The cops aren't supposed to use *only* these factors, but, you know, a lot of people don't exactly trust cops. Plenty of cops are great people, but some of them are racist pricks and this gives them a lot of power. 3: Perhaps most stupidly, the law allows citizens to *sue the government* if they think not enough is being done about illegal immigration. All you need is a few nationalist crackpots to waste millions of taxpayer dollars forcing a town, a county, or a police department to defend themselves against wild accusations. And if you're at all familiar with this country, you know there are plenty of racist crackpots who'll be happy to sue their town for the crime of having too many hispanics in it.
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Good point. But I think it's a good idea to ask so that those people will identify themselves so we can all point and laugh.
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You think that National Socialism, AKA, Nazism, is left wing? You have to be the most ignorant fool i ever seen in here. And that's something!<br><br>And the founding fathers of USA were radical left wingers, they went agaisnt the normalicy of the day, meaning, monarchies, and instaured a democracy. You couldn't be more left winger then to be a believer in democracy, back then. Deal with it.
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That some Republicans are proposing to strip citizenship away from persons (like Faisal Shahzad) who have association with *foreign* terror organizations. "Foreign" being the operative word. <P> Frankly, I'm for stripping citizenship/rights from anyone who supports terrorist activities here - be they Al Qaeda, Taliban, or Hutaree.
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... your rigth wingers will destroy your country. A few more George W. Bushs, and you will be like India, if not worst. Be advised.
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As much as the Republican and conservatives want to paint those who are against the bill as believing this- that illegal aliens aren't doing something illegal- its just simply not true.
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Republicans won't make America like India...because India is full of brown people.
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Good point. You don't get much more striking fucking hypocrisy than on the rightwing hysteria over how we've treat Shahzad so far vs. their total silence on how we treated McVey.
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don't think of illegal aliens as criminals. That's the problem. Go read the dailykos or The Huffington Post, watch MSNBC anchors, read The New York Times, or listen to rantings from Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and Charles Barkley. even though they are a small minority of thought, they like to paint a broadbrush of the vast majority of Americans and call us racist for simply wanting our laws enforced. Listen to all the bullshit about illegals doing jobs "Americans refuse to do". I've seen MSNBC anchors say that they don't want illegal immigrants called illegal. They use meaningless words like "undocumented workers". Don't even try with your bullshit that the American Left doesn't think illegals are criminals. They don't. The stance ofr most on the Left is for full amnesty for ALL illegals...
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into a movie? Next up a movie about the Progressive insurance chick. On another note I was wondering if Mexico wants illegal Guatemalans in their country.
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You have a point, EXCEPT that those beliefs - that illegals aren't really illegal - is held by a minority of Liberals. Every Liberal in this talkback feels differently, including yours truly. <P> And I support amnesty with strict guidelines, like a probation period of, say, 3 to 5 years with no criminal activity before getting full legal immigrant status. Amnesty is the only practical solution given the enormous numbers of illegals here.
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i don't know a single liberal who doesn't think that being in our country without permission is not against our laws. not a single one. but our laws are made by us and they are fluid and flawed. so, we are not ready to use the dismissive label 'criminal' when referring to 'everyone' who is here in this country without our permission. why? because a lot of them are desperately trying to save their lives and it's a greater 'crime' for us to blame them for trying to do that. does it gel well with our orderly way of doing things? no. it doesn't. but most of them are good people who's only crime is trying to survive. it's like saying that someone who steals bread to keep from starving to death is a thief. well, do you have to label them with the 'thief' label when referring to them or can we maybe focus on how they are starving to death. liberals understand that sometimes people break our laws to try to survive and we simply feel that the priority in that situation is helping someone in trouble instead of justing throwing the book at them and calling them a criminal. it's about priorities. it's about recognizing that life is complicated. were jews fleeing from nazis criminals for crossing borders without permission? according to you. what about africans who's parents have been slaughtered in front of them? can they sneak into america? what about mexicans who live in a dump literally? can they sneak into america? or should they just go back and dig thru the trash? liberals support law and order, but we also belief in compassion and priorities. and the fact that we only own this land because we say so and we have a military strong enough to keep anyone else from taking it. it's not like we are entitled to this land. we can have some humanity about people who are just trying to survive.
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according to you. doesn't belong above. i forgot to delete that as part of a different sentence. i'm not saying you think it was a crime for jews to flee over borders to escape genocide from nazis.
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...immigration laws, building a fence or deporting them. None at all. I simply think THIS bill is badly flawed and will set DANGEROUS precedents for future state and federal laws.
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Unfortunately I know some people like that. I don't like them. And they smell.
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You KNOW Perry is itching to do the same thing. Harry had better start carrying his papers.
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These "illegals," as you conservative pricks so callously call them, are human beings. I know it can be confusing sometimes, what with the brown skin and the accents. Not only are these people the same as you and me, they deserve to be treated with some remote semblance of fucking respect. Regardless of their citizenship status, or from which border they came from. Undocumented migrants are just that, immigrants in search of a better life in the land of opportunity. They come here just as our forefathers did in search of something more. Remember life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? In the meantime, they mow your lawns, they fix your roof, and they serve you Taco Bell at the goddamn drive thru. How about you hypocrites practice just a tiny little bit of the compassion that your supposed lord and savior actually taught? That guy you worship and are constantly beating the rest of us over the head with? Jesus, right? Remember him? "Love your neighbor as yourself." [Matthew 22:39] "So in everything, do to others as you would have them do to you." [Matthew 7:12.] "If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven." [Matthew 19:21] "But when you give a feast, invite the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed, because they cannot repay you. You will be repaid at the resurrection of the just." [Luke 14:13 &14.] Yeah, many Mexicans love him too. So much so that they actually name their children after him. You do realize that there's more in that book that you claim to love so much than just taking rights away from gay people and women who need abortions, right? Until Arizona can pull it's collective head out of it's conservative ass... Not one dime, not one peso, not one visit to the state as long as SB1070 stands. Oh, and happy Cinco de Mayo...racist assholes.
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Amen.
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i was raised in a conservative home. nearly all of my very large family are conservative. i was conservative until my mid 20s. now in my 30s i am basically a moderate liberal. probably pretty close to where obama is. now... i know that conservatives are not the exceptional dumb shits or assholes that give them a bad reputation... no more than liberals being the exceptional dumb shits or assholes that give them a bad reputation. but the problem with conservatives is that your biggest representatives are hypocritical judgmental dumb shits and/or assholes. sarah palin? really? not only is she a dumb shit but she believes that jesus is coming back to destroy most of the people of the world. rush and beck are shock jocks with more political influence than any elected conservatives. sure, we have over the top keith olberman, but he isn't even close to being anywhere near having any real power. conservatives brought the country bush jr and he ran it into the ground. you can try to run away from that but everyone knows the score. sorry.
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Is the fact that it IS a minority who might believe being an illegal alien is not a crime, but the other side of the spectrum tries to paint the situation so that its EVERYONE on the left who believes it. <p> Hell, you JUST did it yourself when you said this: "Don't even try with your bullshit that the American Left doesn't think illegals are criminals. They don't. The stance ofr most on the Left is for full amnesty for ALL illegals..." <p> I mean, seriously? Come on, wise up.
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"...they like to paint a broadbrush of the vast majority of Americans and call us racist for simply wanting our laws enforced." <p> Uhhh no. Stop acting like the people you are criticizing. No one is calling you or the bill racist bc you "simply want the laws enforced". That's bullshit and you know it. They're calling the bill racist bc, in its first incarnation, it pretty much ALLOWED FOR RACIAL PROFILING. Good lord, you're thick-headed. Just like Fox News, trying to twist the facts and ignore the truth to fit your agenda and make yourself out to be the victim. All you have to say is "They're calling us racist only bc we want the laws enforced! BooHOO!" <p> Yeah, way to avoid the real fucking issue.
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The Amendments to the Constitution come about via an established process, and become part of the "foundational core" of this country. Modern leftists are trying to bring about fundamental changes AGAINST the constitutional processes. They are, as I said, aggressively anti-American.
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That's pretty much what a LOT of the people who are against this bill are saying. But of course, the other side doesn't want to let everyone else know that. Its much easier to say you're against it just because you're liberal and you don't want the laws enforced. Its not so cut and dry. Its not so cut and dry that the supporters are racist either, of course.
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I have a dear friend from Mexico. She is here legally, and is going through the process to legally become a citizen. Why should she and every other legal immigrant be made chumps by those who break the law?
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Blah blah blah -ignoring every response and reply that may prove me wrong- blah blah blah more babbling without evidence or proof, blah blah.
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You are fucked up. People like you will destroy America.
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Please explain this statement: <p> "Modern leftists are trying to bring about fundamental changes AGAINST the constitutional processes. They are, as I said, aggressively anti-American." <p> Who's doing what now? This is absolute nonsense. You may as well have written: "Chicken, trampoline, stargate, whippleball!!" <p> If you're just going to smash away at your keyboard without trying to adhere to the basic rules of internet ranting, ie: having your sentences make sense in english, then go eat your crackers and watch your stories. No more from you, weirdo.
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great post.
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wow! i see red neck racist hate- mongers r everywhere nowdays!i have never seen so much ignorance on this site since the news on the n.w.a film and Machete...and i thought us film makers/film geeks were more intelligent.
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Quote: "Modern leftists are trying to bring about fundamental changes AGAINST the constitutional processes. They are, as I said, aggressively anti-American."<P>Seriously...what the fuck are you babbling about?
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<P>on both sides of this debate. but I am going to have to agree with Mr. Peter Franks above.</P> <P>For my own part, I say lock up the drug smugglers. But if someone is here illegally, and all they are doing is trying to put food on the table, then I am not going to say one word in protest.</P> <P>When it comes to rendering unto Ceasar or unto God, God trumps Ceasar.</P>
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...or reading them anyways..I almost never participate. Here's my two cents...(worth even less).I don't think this law is racist, but I do think this law is the absolute wrong way to go about this. It's backwards to me. The first step is to seal off the borders. Build a wall (yes I think a wall would work), more personnel on the border, or whatever...something more than what is there now. THEN deal with the people that are here. I understand the compassion people have for the poor folks that are here trying to escape a terrible terrible place. And we need that compassion. I know that they are breaking the law...but the guy painting some guys roof so he can feed his family is not the same as the drug runners...they just aren't. However since that will never happen..AZ decided that they needed to do something...and this is the result. Again, I don't think it's racist, but it is tough. It has to be tough, it's just gotten too far out of control. I also think no matter what kind of action anyone decides to take will be called racist...its too easy to play that card. I think the more you use that as an excuse to do nothing, the more the really bad crimes get out of control (kidnapping, drugs, etc...), and the more that harms the decent folks just trying to survive.
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You mean like the amendment against gay marriage that conservatives tried to drum up support for under the Bush Administration? You know, the one that would have written homophobic bigotry into our "foundational core"? Yeah, that was "Right = liberty" in action right there.
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trying to put food on the table? with foodstamps and wellfare and free e.r. visits by pregnant mexican chicks pumping out more mexicans? theres so many wetbacks now i go to the grocery store and cant understand what the fuckin food is. what the fuck is a chilapa de punta chinka de gringos?
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I remember when that ridiculous attempt popped up riiiiight around election time in an attempt to get more Republican seats in congress. Because of course the Democrats were going to say "no, that's a stupid law that infringes on our freedoms" while all the other side had to say was "See! They're unpatriotic! Vote for us!" and the stupid pple of America would agree.
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<P>"what the fuck is a chilapa de punta chinka de gringos?"</P> <P>Usually, if I can't identify what's on the plate, I don't eat it. Good line though.</P>
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Thank you, Pussywhatever, for reminding us that actual racists are at least funny. You go, girl!
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you'll find that reasonable, fair minded thoughtfulness won't get you very far around these parts. Oh, and by the way, Kentuckian thinks you're destroying America. Just fyi.
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What's good for the goose is OMFG TREASON BLAAAAAHHHRHGHGHGH!!!! for the gander.
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yeah...I know...I hate destroying america...I think anyone so black and white on either side is bound to be wrong. I'm a mostly conservative kind of guy, and I think Kentuckian raises some good points on the subject...but I hate this "your destroying america" that people get into. If either side had their way completely, then we'd be fucked...
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Thinking that anyone with leftist beliefs wants amnesty for every illegal <br> <br> is the new "Liberals don't support our troops"? <br> <br> I guess I'll just quote something that you cultists used to say so much during the Bush administration in regards to the lot of you "conservatives"... <br> <br> "America. Love it or leave it."
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The problem with ppl like Kentuckian raising good points is that since he's such a cross-eyed lunatic whatever sense he makes is completely polluted by his blind hatred of anyone who isn't exactly like him. As always, zb.brox illustrates this the best way possible with his last post. <p> I'm more or less a conservative dude too, but that doesn't mean that when the left makes a good point I'm going to ignore them, or worse, smite them with my broadsword like some people. Can't we all just get along?
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...there would be no AICN talk backs...or at leas we'd all have to actually talk about the movies...yikes!! On that note...Machete looks hilarious.
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I'd just like to point out that we've given "amnesty" to illegal aliens before. And who signed the bill? Notorious liberal icon Ronald fucking Reagan.
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LOL! Yeah, nothing offends me. Certainly not honest, hardworking Mexican-Americans and those who are here legally. Call me crazy.
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Regarding the Thor pic, yeah, I like it. I think the actor looks about as good as could be expected. I certainly don't want the dude they cast to be wearing a fake fucking Viking beard 'cause we know how fake beards turn out - just ask David Geffen.<p>And regarding Thor's suit, well, I'm older than ten and I remember the whining and complaints on here about the X-Men outfits, too.
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What's your point about Reagan? Nobody said the guy was perfect or that he didn't make some mistakes. In exchange for allowing aliens to stay, Reagan decided, border security and enforcement of immigration laws would be greatly strengthened — in particular, through sanctions against employers who hired illegal immigrants. If jobs were the attraction for illegal immigrants, then cutting off that option was crucial.<p>But like all liberal bait-and-switch plans, the enforcement ideas never happened and the 1986 act did not solve our illegal immigration problem. From the start, there was widespread document fraud by applicants. Unsurprisingly, the number of people applying for amnesty far exceeded projections. And there proved to be a failure of political will in enforcing new laws against employers or for strengthening the borders. (Imagine that.)<p>After a six-month slowdown that followed passage of the legislation, illegal immigration returned to normal levels and continued unabated. Ultimately, some 2.7 million people were granted amnesty, and many who were not stayed anyway, forming the nucleus of today's unauthorized population of 12 million to 20 million.<p>So, you understand all that, right? You understand that 2.7 million in 1986 far exceeded the estimates THEN and is the proverbial "drop in the bucket" compared to today's numbers of FOUR to SEVEN TIMES that number. You understood all that and just left it out in the vain hope of convincing some moron that since Reagan did it with 15%-25% of today's numbers and never got the enforcement provisions implemented we should repeat the mistake today. Of course, you did.
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That don't mean I'm for 'em. Obama breathes air, but that don't mean I'm against it. Seriously, honest to God, zb.brox, what were you trying to do there? I really don't understand. Do you think that conservatives think Reagan did no wrong? You're very mistaken.<p>While most conservatives adore "that notorious liberal icon Ronald fucking Reagan," we do admit that he made mistakes.<p>Like trusting Democrats on things like "enforcement" and "border security" and "getting tough on employers" and "balancing the budget." Reagan trusted those putrid sacks of shit far too much and many of us today won't make the same mistake.<p>I wouldn't trust a liberal myself as far as I could shit him out.
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Not Geffen. Sorry Geffen. Very, very sorry.
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Kentuckian, how can you talk out of your mouth and ass at the same time?
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<p>Good point about Reagan. And that was a totally political move by the way...he didn't do it because he thought it was right: he did it to hurt the unions, and thus, hurt the Democrats, since organized labor is typically the group most hurt by low-wage workers (just look at the construction industry).</p> <p>He also did it because he found common ground with many of the illegals at the time on socially conservative/religious issues, and thought he could count on those folks to support Republicans at the polls (and the fact that a Republican president signed amnesty into law didn't hurt).</p> <p>This AZ bill is no different: it is a political ploy, not meant to truly resolve any issues. This is something that the Republican majority running the state of AZ (which is in huge trouble economically) can point to during election season and say "See, we're trying to fix things!"</p> <p>It also allows them to take a swipe at Obama: "We've asked for the federal government to help us and they won't!"...even though the federal government under Bush didn't help either.</p> <p>Finally, it helps them to fire up their base, which in AZ is white baby boomers.</p>
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/06/jim-sanders-craigslist-di_n_566124.html
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Jesus fucking Christ, you read a lot into my comment. How about you actually read the context of the goddamn discussion and check out the fact that I'm clearly responding to some jackoff moron whose sniveling anti-liberal rants included the usual horseshit "OMFG, liberal fucking love amnesty!" canard. You know who fucking loves amnesty? Right-wing corporate interests who want to make sure their steady supply of cheap labor doesn't fucking dry up. But every poorly-informed lackwit like Kentuckian drags out amnesty to batter liberals with as if they don't have a giant fucking log in their eye.
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Reagan didn't make a mistake: it was a calculated political move that worked out well with regard to what the real goals were. It has only recently backfired for the Republican party because of all the racially-tinged anti-immigrant talk from party leadership over the last few years.
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And, for a Daily Double, I'll see 'em at an actual drive-in movie theatre!
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Excellent post. The Republican party is in a real bind with the immigration issue, because the free-trade corporatist wing of the party is all for as much cheap labor as they can get (hence why Bush was fairly "soft" in immigration), but the rabid nativist contingent is all for a fucking lockdown. Not to mention that Republican politicians, like Reagan, still want to be able to mine the relatively socially-conservative Latino block. For now, guess Arizona's decided to throw a bone to the nativists. That's a short-term strategy at best.
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I guess I sort of agree with you in as these things might be all a political move. And no...W didn't do anything for this issue, nor is Obama. That's no excuse for either of them really. Maybe this AZ law will force new candidates to be more proactive in taking a stand one way or another. Also...I'm not anti-immigrant..I'm anti-illegal immigrant...so there's a difference...and no matter how much you want to make it an issue of people being racist..it's just not. Not that there isn't racism...it's just not what it's about. The left is crying "The rightwingers are nothing but a bunch a racists" as much as the right is yelling out "OMFG, liberal fucking love amnesty!". It's so irritating..cause I don't think either one of them is true. but Neither side is able to drop it.
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Haha I was just messing around about Thor. The actor IS spot on, and I'm sure he'll look good on the big screen. <br> <br> And really illegal immigration can't be blamed on Dems or Reps. The problem began with or before the Reagen administration, and no one since has done much to remedy it. <br> <br> But more power to the lot of you that wish to discuss partisan politics... <br> <br> I, myself, am an indie because I've never been part of a gang in my life... and I don't wish to start now.
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Better music and sometimes better movies.
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The problem with the racism thing is that the racist/nativist angle is as big an issue as the law-and-order or economic issues. That certainly doesn't mean that *you* are a racist or that everyone on the right is a racist. But when people on the right get behind a law that empowers racists and propagates racism simply because it also happens to accomplish something they want, I think that's a pretty serious fucking problem for those people. The "because the feds did nothing, Arizona had to do something!" argument doesn't hold water. Okay, so they had to do something--did that something have to be quite so shockingly un-American? So poorly thought out that they amended it all of a week later? Come on, man. I'm a vegetarian fan of animal rights, but I'm willing to admit that PETA is a bunch of nutbags. More conservatives should be willing to do the same about the growing streak of insanity in their party.
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Bush didn't do anything to stop illegal immigration because, as zb.brox pointed out, big business loves cheap labor, and the Republican party loves big business. And Obama sure as hell isn't going to do anything...not while he can sit back and watch the Republicans shoot themselves in the foot with the Latino voting bloc, the vast majority of whom will probably now flock to Democratic candidates because Republicans have turned immigration into an identity-politics wedge issue. So, yes, I absolutely think the whole thing is totally political. And I don't think I called anyone racist...I didn't mean to...what I said was the Republican leadership has been spouting a lot of racially-tinged rhetoric of late (last few years in particular). I don't mean racially-tinged to mean racist.
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We're meeting tomorrow! HOLY SHIT!
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<p>"The left is crying "The rightwingers are nothing but a bunch a racists" as much as the right is yelling out "OMFG, liberal fucking love amnesty!". It's so irritating..cause I don't think either one of them is true. but Neither side is able to drop it."</p> <p>I agree that the screaming, knee-jerk reactionaries on the far Left and far Right are extremely annoying. Honestly, I kind of blame the mainstream media for the way that political discourse has descended into hyperbolic tantrums and name-calling. I think its the 24 hour cable news cycle (and also the internet) that are to blame. Cable news channels need to keep people watching all the time, so they can sell commercial slots.</p> <p>The best way to do that is either to create controversy by putting on two opposing, knucklehead "experts" who say ridiculous shit to each other and create the illusion of a debate where there really isn't one among reasonable individuals (for example, come on, is anyone really *against* energy independence?), or by preaching to the choir (think Olbermann and Beck). </p>
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Some people take grindhouse REALLY seriously. Between Trejo and those psycho twins on BREAKING BAD, it was a matter of either passing legislation, or sleeping with one eye open.
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on both sides...anyone who disagrees with that is probably one of those loons. The thing is I just don't think the law is racist...and those amendments were put in more to clarify what was already there...no matter how anyone wants to get rid of illegals in this country, it will be called "racist" simply because it's getting rid of people from another country. There's is simply nothing anyone could do that people wont' call racist. Like I said before, I support the law..but think it's back asswards way of going about the issue. I think stopping people coming over illegally by securing borders is the first step...but that would be racist too...or it would be called that. Nobody wants to be labeled that way and so nobody does anything. After a while it gets out of control to the point where you HAVE to do something hard like this law. Now...I also agree that politicians are in the pockets of corporations that abuse illegals...and as soon as we deport the illegals in our jails we can clear some room for those crooks.
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You honestly don't see the difference in "racism" between border security and *detaining people who "look like" illegal immigrants*?
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I was more talking about people in general calling right wingers racist..no you in particular...I understand your well-reasoned your point of view...I respectively disagree. I don't think Obama is doing nothing just so he can watch the republicans implode on themselves....I think he realizes that any position he takes on it will be a bad move...he's kind of fucked either way. SO he's just not saying anything. I would still argue both sides are using this issue to gain votes...not just the right.
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Lemon pledge, that is...<p> http://tinyurl.com/2ewm7nc
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Both Repukes and Democraps are to blame. I fucking despise most politicians and both political parties. I tend to lean a little more conservative right than liberal left, but, truth be told, I think they're all shit-eating fucking maggots more interested in stoking the fires for their own political gain than anything else - both sides.
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<p>The original senate version of the bill placed no restrictions on racial profiling and allowed police to Terry stop people as long as they had reasonable suspicion that they might be in the country illegally.</p> <p>The house version put some restrictions on the level of profiling that would be tolerated, but still allowed it so long as it was not the sole reason for the Terry stop, which was also still allowed.</p> <p>As Bicycle Sharer pointed out last night, the final, amended bill prohibits any kind of profiling, and also does not allow Terry stops on the basis of reasonable suspicion with regard to immigration status at all...so it is a MUCH better bill.</p> <p>But the first two versions DEFINITELY gave cover to racists who want to harass Latinos.</p> <p>Now, you might call me a conspiracy theorist, but I think a lot of white AZ Republicans would have been thrilled if this law caused huge throngs of American citizens of Latin descent to move out of the state over fear that they might be unjustly harassed, since "Mexicans" moving out of certain neighborhoods would probably cause property values to go up...and so much of AZ's economy has been based on white retirees moving there...</p>
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but "look like" illegal immigrants can mean more than just skin color. If you pull someone over a van for speeding, and that person has 20 crammed in the back of the van, and none of them have any sort of ID...that is reasonable suspicion...regardless of skin color. The law is clear that you can't detain someone based on race. There are bad police officers...no doubt...and if they act in a way not according to the law they will get the shit sued out of them. If the law were actually the way people are interpreting it...then yeah...it would be racist...but it's not that way.
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I did read the above. I got no truck with racists, but, like I said, even in the context of the above discussion with the Kentuckian, I think Reagan thought like a lot of folks today - just this one time and we'll REALLY lock down the borders and stick it to the employers.<p>Some liberals DO want amnesty. Some conservatives ALSO want amnesty. For some of them, it serves their sick purposes. For others, they think like Reagan did in '86 - it's a compassionate middle-ground and we'll REALLY, REALLY, REALLY enforce the border and stick it to the employers. The only problem with that line of thinking is that we've seen the errors inherent in it before.<p>Personally, I'm not 100% against the line of reasoning that illegals are here and that they obviously are needed. My solution to that (which takes into account their lawbreaking) is this --- fucking round 'em up (or let 'em deport themselves) and, for every one we deport, we bring in one who's been standing in line waiting on the legal way to do it. Goodbye, Juan! Hello, Francisco! Goodbye, Lupe! Hello, Maria!
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well...yeah...no doubt there a racists out there who can't wait to get Mexicans out of their state...no doubt...but I don't think that's a majority...and I the amendments to the law are way better...and it's good thing...I agree that the first version of the law was ambiguous...but not so people had more power to harass...or maybe it was..I don't know (I'd like to think not)...but tanks to protesters the amendments were added making it better, thus the need for difference of opinion. I kind of agree with you that the original bill gave way to racial profiling...but not for the sake of racial profiling...
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I agree it means *more* than skin color, but the question for me is: Does this law allow racists a greater opportunity to abuse minorities? And I think very clearly it does. The law actually is *not* clear that you can't detain someone based on race. What is says is that you can't detain them *only* on race. That is a very thin layer of protection--do you think there is a single racist cop who couldn't come up with some secondary reason for fucking with an American citizen who happened to look Hispanic, speak with an accent, or fly a Mexican flag?
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Gawd, I'd like to make a run across her border before escaping into the wilds of her barrio...
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Out of interest, how much money and time are you willing to spend rounding up 12 million illegal aliens rather than giving them an incentive to identify themselves? Here's what I think: If you want to stem the tide of illegal immigration, go after employers. Employing undocumented workers is just as illegal as crossing the border, and it's a hell of a lot easier to go after the employers.
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I think those racist cops have been doing that for a long time...this law allows those people to be sued. SO that's a good thing.
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go after people who employ illegals also...
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<p>"I agree it means *more* than skin color, but the question for me is: Does this law allow racists a greater opportunity to abuse minorities? And I think very clearly it does. The law actually is *not* clear that you can't detain someone based on race. What is says is that you can't detain them *only* on race."</p> <p>Actually, you're wrong (and so was I when TBS and I were discussing this last night on this very Talkback). You are referring to the house version of the bill which was signed into law (as was I), but it was very quickly amended to make it clear that race could not be a factor at all. Look up AZ HB 2162: it contains the amendments that remove profiling altogether.
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How does it allow them to be sued? It makes it perfectly legal to do that. It actually allows them to be sued for *not* doing it aggressively enough.
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But I would say it doesn't go after the employers nearly hard enough. If jail time were a very real possibility for someone employing undocumented workers, I bet you would see that practice shrink exponentially. Thus far, the only threats are fines and loss of business license. Jail is scarier.
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Why, that wouldn't be Robert Rodriguez, Danny Trejo and AICN inciting (gasp) politically motivated violence, would it? Where's the outrage? I guess it's short a few too many peaceful, middle class old white people. Going after Tea Partiers and not shit like this is why our media has developed such a reputation as biased pussies. Get some fucking perspective, America.
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Ah, my apologies, the revised version does make that protection a lot stronger. However, this does not change the fundamental problem that officers are given discretion to detain anyone who can't produce their papers, regardless of citizenship, and that that clearly empowers racially biased cops to abuse the system as long as they can think of an excuse.
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--are never going to change as long as they make more money breaking the law than they lose paying fines, it's that simple.
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To be honest with you..I just kind of assumed that if you are a victim of racial profiling anywhere..you can sue..it may not be specified in that law...I'll go back to it...that's not to say that law says you can sue someone for not aggressively racially profiling someone...it just means if you report something...and they don't do anything about it ...you can sue...it's an incentive for them to do their job
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yep...I wish it did include jail time..or at the very least such an enormous fine that it would be more worthwhile to pay people a decent wage. I 100% agree with you there.
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... you must mean driver's license. Because that's what the bill requires you to produce. In other words, as a white guy, I'm being racially profiled every day when I make a credit card purchase.
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I'm kinda insulted by your conspiracy theory there. I've got white Republican family in Arizona. I've also got Hispanic conservative friends there, too. Both of 'em support that bill and not because they want property values to go up.<p>Quite simply, they get to turn on their local tv news and see the news stories on drop houses raided, kidnappings of illegals by illegals, officers shot, ranchers murdered, cops hit by drunken illegals who've been deported MULTIPLE times, and drugs captured en route to somewhere every single night. Now, that ain't in any way to say that ALL Mexicans (illegal aliens or not) are doing the above shit, but the same "coyotes" who run Mexicans across the border ARE the ones who shoot ranchers and cops and kidnap their own migrant charges for more money. Arizona already has state penalties for human smuggling and, while its made some difference I hear, Arizonans feel like more can be done.<p>So, if you'll excuse the analogy (and it's a poor one, but it makes the point), imagine that illegals are stolen property or cocaine. Up till now, Arizona only took the stolen property or cocaine away from you; the only real punishment went to the "fence" or the dealer (i.e., the human smuggling "coyote"). Now, Arizona has decided to punish you for HAVING cocaine (being an illegal) in order to hopefully stop the demand (desire to be in Arizona).<p>And as I started to note before, some places in Arizona (Maricopa County) already do this; others don't (Chandler, Mesa) and simply refuse to, becoming sanctuary cities. The reason for this law, I'm told, was because of that - to create some uniformity across the state and reduce the "demand" to be in Arizona.<p>And regarding property values - honestly, while retirees in Arizona are everywhere, they do tend to congregate in certain areas (Sun Lakes, Sun City) while illegals congregate in South Phoenix and clearing them up in South Phoenix won't do squat for property values in Sun Lakes and Sun City, 25 miles away.<p>Do a Google search for South Phoenix. The second listing down is about the "gang war" there. The first listing is Wikipedia and will tell you about the area's reputation.<p>Seriously not even sure why one needs a "conspiracy theory" about this. The law is pretty clear (especially as amended) and the politicians who support it have been pretty outspoken about why they did it - to end the flow of illegals (and drugs, etc.) into Arizona. Why do you need a "conspiracy theory" on top of that?
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How fucked are we as a country when you got to look for a conspiracy theory behind enforcing a law that already exists federally? ;-)
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all right...I need to go outside or something...you guys seem like good people...I appreciate the decent conversation...people who I disagree with are way more fun and worthwhile than finding people I agree with all the time. I'm out for a little while..I wish I could do this all day (I think I did actually)...but I gotta get some fresh air...haha..also..quit ruining America :P...later friends.
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Well, first, of course you can sue for wrongful arrest, but here's the thing: prove it. How do you prove you were detained because of your race? Even white people who aren't overtly racist get all pissy as soon as a black person or hispanic "plays the race card" anyway. I guarantee you, the first person in Arizona who sues a cop for racially profiling them will be ridiculed to high-heaven over it. Second, do we get to sue cops for not doing enough to enforce any other law? I mean, Jesus, every time some crackpot sees a brown-skinned person and decides they must be a border-crosser the police have to worry if they don't check up on this Hispanic-guy-walking-at-night phenomenon they're gonna get sued. That's just crazy.
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You mean *Arizona* driver's license. And you realize not everyone has one of those, right?
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Stiff fuckin' punishments. In Arizona, they have an employee verification law that the same crowd that's moaning and crying about this law moaned and cried about. It's called EEVP, Employment Eligibility Verification Program, and requires that anyone working in Arizona be checked against the Social Security Administration for a valid ss# and that the number matches the name given. There are pretty strict penalties (though not strict enough, in my opinion) for failure to comply. Penalties for intentionally or knowingly hiring or employing illegal immigrants are severe. Employers face mandatory suspension of their business licenses for first offenses and permanent revocation of their business licenses for second offenses.<p>Of course, like I said, the same whiney bitches who are falsely stirring up lies about this law, did the same thing about that one and they're actually suing the counties of Arizona over this. See, you think these guys (who RIGHT NOW are claiming that we should hit the employers) REALLY think that? Let me help. From aclu.org:<p>"A coalition of civil rights groups filed a new lawsuit in a Phoenix federal court today charging that the so-called Legal Arizona Workers Act unlawfully requires businesses to participate in a flawed work authorization verification database, lacks due process protections, improperly threatens businesses with a “business death penalty” that interferes with federal law, and would lead to discrimination against workers who are perceived as being foreign born." (http://tiny.cc/0tldb).<p>So, Arizona FIRST did what the pro-illegal crowd NOW claims they want and the pro-illegal crowd sued. Why? Because they (left and right, though, in this case, definitely left) don't want enforcement, period. They don't want employers to have to verify or to be penalized and they don't want stiffer punishment for illegals ("Illegals protest over felony provision" - http://tiny.cc/9dkzf) and they don't want 'em deported or even asked to prove their citizenship. This shit is a rigged shell game by them - whichever option you pick (employer verification and sanctions, stiffer penalties for illegals themselves, simple verification of your right to be here during a traffic stop) is ALWAYS the wrong option and you should've picked one of the others. Until you do, of course, then it's the OTHER choices.<p>They lost that lawsuit, by the way, in the Ninth Circuit and Arizona uses e-Verify.<p>To answer your question, personally, like I said, I'd like some super strict penalties on employers (including those who pick up "day laborers" at the corner) and some stiffer penalties on the illegals themselves.<p>For employers, start seizing some fucking assets and watch how quickly this shit turns around. Even for day laborers - start seizing the vehicle Whitey McMannerson uses to pick up day laborers for his weekend project and watch how quickly this turns around.<p>For illegals themselves, provide another form of "amnesty" - turn yourself in and be prepared to deport (and we bring in a lawful one for every one we deport) and we won't throw you in prison in six months when we catch you 'cause it's now a felony to be here illegally.<p>That's what I would do. Is that harsh on employers and illegals? Yup. But is it racist? Nope. 'Cause I'd bring a Mexican in for every Mexican who turns himself in and gets deported.<p>I've said it before and I'll say it again - I love Mexicans.<p>But I despise Mexico. That country is a corrupt shit hole that's on the brink of collapse partly because of the U.S. "blind eye" approach to illegal immigration.<p>What would twelve to twenty million returning Mexicans do to the political structure of that country? Hopefully, clean it up.
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What are you saying, zb.brox? That you have to produce an Arizona driver's license in Arizona? Incorrect. I'm in Arizona occasionally and I produce a CALIFORNIA driver's license and go on about my merry way. (Well, both times I was pulled over, anyway.)
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Out of state driver's licenses are not considered proof of residence for the purposes of this law. If you get detained with an out-of-state license, you need to figure out how to get your passport or birth certificate over there.
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"Here's the thing: prove it."<p>http://tiny.cc/slqeb <p>And: <p>http://tiny.cc/hkvn0 <p>And: <p>http://tiny.cc/t5aex <p>And: <p>http://tiny.cc/skzzk <p>And: <p>http://tiny.cc/7yut2 <p>And: <p>http://tiny.cc/gegre <p>That's from one page of Google searching for "wrongful arrest lawsuit." I could go on, but I'm sure that you get the idea. "Proving" wrongful arrest is not exactly the crazy impossibility that you're seemingly implying.
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"Going after Tea-parrtiers blah, blah blah." <br> <br> Teabaggers have been know to carry AR-15's and other firearms to their supposedly "peaceful" protests. <br> <br> I don't see any semi-automatic or automatic firearms in this talkback. <br> <br> Don't get me wrong. I'm all for the right to bear arms (one of my Conservative beliefs), but walking around to protests carrying them and/or being paranoid that a Dem Pres is going to take them away is borderline paranoid/schizophrenic. <br> <br> Remember that "Soccor Mom" that insisted on carrying her little handgun to her childrens' games? It didn't come in too handy when her husband blew her face off in their home. <br> <br> But it matched her shoes and her earrings pretty good though, didn't it?
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Strapping a legal, empty AR-15 on your back, or rioting in several cities over the weekend and destroying businesses and causing ACTUAL violence (yes, that happened)?
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"Out of state driver's licenses are not considered proof of residence for the purposes of this law." Do you ever get tired of making me look good? ;-)<p>From THE REVISED BILL ITSELF - HB2162:<p>"A PERSON IS PRESUMED TO NOT BE AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES IF THE PERSON PROVIDES TO THE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OR AGENCY ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:<p>1. A VALID ARIZONA DRIVER LICENSE.<p>2. A VALID ARIZONA NONOPERATING IDENTIFICATION LICENSE.<p>3. A VALID TRIBAL ENROLLMENT CARD OR OTHER FORM OF TRIBAL IDENTIFICATION.<p>4. IF THE ENTITY REQUIRES PROOF OF LEGAL PRESENCE IN THE UNITED STATES BEFORE ISSUANCE, ANY VALID UNITED STATES FEDERAL, STATE OR LOCAL GOVERNMENT ISSUED IDENTIFICATION.<p>Hmmm? "Any valid united states federal, state, or local government issued identification if the entity requires proof of legal residence in the United States before issuance."<p>Fuck, that's weird. To my untrained ears, that sound EXACTLY like out of state driver's licenses ARE considered proof of residence for the purposes of this law if the issuing state requires proof of residence.
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Remember that knife-wielding man who attacked people at a Family Dollar store in Memphis, Tennessee on May 5 of this year? He was trying to attack numerous people with his knife. But the final victim, armed with a handgun due to the Tennessee Handgun Permit for concealed carry in public, successfully defended himself and his two daughters, killing his attacker in the parking lot. Yeah, that knife didn't come in too handy when the man blew the knife-wielder away in the parking lot, but that concealed carry handgun sure as shit was useful. ;-)
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Behrooz, Behrooz is on fiyah! We don't need no water...
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Ah, excellent. And I agree with that entirely. All I'm saying is that bringing firearms (clearly) as a means of intimidation at a political rally is absurd. <br> <br> And it IS great to hear that someone carrying a concealed weapon had the good sense and training to use it for it's intended purpose... as opposed to wearing it as an clothing accessory. <br> <br> However... if that's what Bloody was talking about, I fail to see the connection as I wasn't condemning the use of firearms by any means :-D
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You need but ask. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgAJw8Aln2E http://bossip.com/241327/mexicans-riot-after-arizona-passes-racist-bill-allowing-one-time-to-ask-for-papers-video/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieR3mCVnIqk&feature=related http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=36703
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May 6, 2010, 5:53 p.m. CST
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =JgAJw8Aln2E
by Blood_Bubbles_in_Bathwater
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http://bossip.com/241327/mexic ans-riot-after-arizona-passes- racist-bill-allowing-one-time- to-ask-for-papers-video/
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http://tinyurl.com/2c8se2e <p> http://tinyurl.com/247s5w2 <p> http://tinyurl.com/2fsm8y4 <p> http://tinyurl.com/22wjrka <p>How's that, Jaime? Riotous enough? Bottles thrown, people attacked, threats made.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =ieR3mCVnIqk&feature=related
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http://www.humanevents.com/art icle.php?id=36703
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A cursory Google search will reveal plenty more, that's just a taste. Have at it.
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But I gotta go. This has been real and it's been fun, but...<p>Oh, who am I kidding? This HAS been real fun. Talk to y'all later.
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Serious as fuck, I'm waiting for the gun-toting Tea Party to run into the bottle-throwing pro-illegals. That shit should be one for the record books! I would fucking pay BIG money to see that fucking match up go down! Walton Goggins and crew vs. Machete y amigos!
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Very interesting, thank you for the link. And much respect for backing up your points. <br> <br> I can't say that I agree with THESE assholes either. At least the police where there to respond accordingly.
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Hahaha. That's something that I would LOVE to see. Also something that both parties could agree on. <br> <br> Where's the Wishmaster when you need him?
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You know what's batshit? We in AZ have been paying billions of dollars dealing with illegal immigration for years, and the Federal Government hasn't done a damn thing about it. The amount of crime here in Arizona related to illegals is getting worse, and the Federal government just shrugs when we try to bill them. Our law in AZ is a lot fairer than the equivilent Mexican laws. Under the arguments of the SB 1070 people, no one is qualified to arrest someone who is here illegally. No other country is expected to look the other way when people flood across their border; why should we? And, Robert Rodriguez, you arrogant numb fuck, tell you what. Why don't YOU go to Mexico illegally, and see how you fare? They will throw your prima donna ass in prison, and it won't have a fucking thing to do with the color of your skin - Mexico treats ALL illegal aliens as FELONS. The AZ law just reaffirms Federal law and makes it a state misdemeanor. Arizona's fed up with illegal immigrants - of any color. And we're fed up with whiney douchebags like you. You don't pay our taxes.
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... at first I thought you were going to be one of these tone deaf, "everyone's just racist" simpletons, but I see now that you want a genuine conversation. I appreciate that you're open like that, this being the internet and all. Much respect to you, too.
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... so you guys can bet she doesn't like having this conversation with me. But she's semi-reasonable about it, so I can't complain too much.
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You are now forever indebted to me. This is awesome.
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And it's certainly refreshing to talk with people on aicn that may not share precisely the same beliefs, but are nonetheless rational human beings :)
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