Cool News
Massawyrm believes that REPO MEN must have owned the rights to LOGAN'S RUN, which is the only reason it stole so much from it
Hola all. Massawyrm here.
If you haven’t seen REPO THE GENETIC OPERA; if you haven’t seen LOGAN’S RUN; if you haven’t seen BRAZIL; if you haven’t seen BLADE RUNNER; if you haven’t seen OLDBOY; if you haven’t seen TOTAL RECALL; if you haven’t seen PULP FICTION; if you haven’t seen TRAINSPOTTING; if you have never read a William Gibson novel; then you might actually like REPO MEN. Unfortunately for me, I have done all of these things. And it made me hate REPO MEN; and that’s kind of sad, as it really is a well-made, well-acted, beautifully shot film.
This film isn’t just derivative; it is recklessly derivative - stealing its ideas, its power and its set pieces from other, better films. Now, I’ll give it REPO: THE GENETIC OPERA. I believe there is a universe in which novelist and screenwriter Eric Garcia could have been completely ignorant of the stage play and the similarly themed material. But in truth, REPO MEN owes less to its faster on the draw cousin than it does for painfully ripping off LOGAN’S RUN; and that’s really where this film goes off the rails. Set in a dark cyberpunk future that looks like a cleaner version of BLADE RUNNER – ergo, every future city ever seen in anime – two best friends (Jude Law and Forest Whitaker) run around collecting on people past their due date, cracking jokes and feeling superior because of their adherence to the law. But when fate puts one of our repo men (Jude Law) up for collection, guess who goes on the run with a beautiful woman in tow (also, conveniently on the run)?
I’ll give you three guesses as to who the company sends after their delinquent agent, but you’re only going to need one. This movie is so painfully fucking predictable that every moment is telegraphed by the one before it. And if that weren’t bad enough, it also steals a number of classic, immortal scenes from other, better movies and almost seems to wink at the audience with their inclusion. But just as the movie seems to be getting good, and it has run out of tired ideas that it has tried to present as original, the action gears up and they give a subtle nudge to remind you of an earlier scene – a nudge that will force those paying careful attention to do a little mental math and realize that the rules of the movie have changed. And that’s where my face went firmly into my palm.
No. Those clever viewers are not wrong. It really IS that kind of movie.
Is there ANYTHING you haven’t seen done better somewhere else? Yes. One scene; one perfect, hilarious scene involving a little girl that almost made it worth watching the entire film. Almost. It’s not that I can’t enjoy a derivative film. But speculative fiction and sci-fi are graded on a different curve. You can tell a familiar story to us, even a paint-by-numbers one, if the ideas you are playing around with are fresh enough. The more patently alien the ideas being presented are, the more mundane we’ll accept a story to be – and vice versa. But we’ve seen these ideas before; we know the story by heart; worst of all we also know the twist. Three strikes and you’re out.
But if that weren’t bad enough, the film also doesn’t fully understand how to handle its moral dilemma. It sets up a universe that doesn’t make a damn lick of sense. We’re supposed to accept a universe so wildly corrupt and out of control that repo men can murder people on the streets without legal penalty – required only by law to ask out loud if the repossessed would like an ambulance waiting – and that the industry is designed in a manner that it doesn’t profit off of someone who pays their units off, and that everyone is just pretty much okay with this. I’ll buy that shit in a tongue in cheek cult opera, but not in a piece that aims to be profound speculative fiction. Just wait until you begin questioning why someone hurt on the job by faulty equipment needs to pay a unit off themselves and clearly has never heard of workman’s comp or lawyers. Yeah, they really didn’t think this through so much as they wanted the events to serve telling their story.
One of the things that worked about LOGAN’S RUN is that Logan runs not because he turns 30 – but because he discovers the whole system is bullshit; that he was lied to and his job was unnecessary. There is nothing like that here. Our protagonist knows he’s a murderer; his point of view only changes when he’s on the receiving end of the equipment and caught in payments he can’t make. The system isn’t bullshit; the movie’s moral compass is.
And it is a damn shame. Law and Whitaker bring their A-game. Both are fantastic, each treating this like it is high quality, top grade speculative fiction that is about to blow our minds. But it can’t blow our minds, because our minds were already blown by this shit twenty, maybe thirty years ago. It’s hard to be left reeling from shit that THE MATRIX had to avoid ripping off. Oh, yeah, it kind of rips off THE MATRIX too.
I’ll say this: director Miguel Sapochnik did an incredible job making this film. The look is great, the action all works, and the performances from even minor actors are all spot on. There are shots in this movie that are evocative, original and wonderful to look at. Sure, his vision of a future city is about as dated and weak as they come – but he knows how to tell a story; even a bad one. I’d love to see what this guy can do with a script containing a shred of originality. I’m sure it could be pretty bad ass.
But this is garbage only digestible by those who are not already sci-fi literate. I’m sure the average cinemagoer doesn’t even remember LOGAN’S RUN and never saw REPO: THE GENETIC OPERA. They also won’t catch the OLDBOY reference. But odds are, that’s not you. This was a complete and utter waste of my time, and it probably is of yours as well.
Until next time friends, smoke ‘em if ya got ‘em.
Massawyrm
Got something for the Wyrm? Mail it here.
-
+ Expand All
-
;)
I doubt the fact that this movie half-inches plot points will be too big a problem for me so long as it adds up to a cohesive whole. And I've gotta do my part as a geek by rooting for fun scifi action movies... Especially if they're as well made as this one looks. -
oh. damn...
-
You are praising the director and the actors, and the action but you think the movie fails because it is derivative? Hello, Avatar anyone?
-
YET FUCKING AVATAR GETS FELLATED BY AICN??? A double standard in the air maybe?
-
because they know that they have a rehash going on. I get a Equaliberum, The Matrix, Logan's Run vibe.
and Jude Law...meh. -
Or so I thought until you pointed out the complete failure to have the Law character realize the immorality of his old job. Now, this is kinda ruined for me.
Maybe I can enjoy it as a "dumb" movie. -
In the book he runs because he 21. Please don't dumb the story down because you saw that gay fucking movie version of it. It was shit.
Read a book. -
i'll see when i watch the movie. as you say though, the average cinema goer probably hasn't seen all those things.
-
And Beaks cleared up the R:TGO comparison here: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/43628
-
"The system isn’t bullshit; the movie’s moral compass is."
This happens ALL THE TIME in real life... people don't care about/understand the problem until they are on the receiving end of it, and even then many are capable of comparmentalizing their involvement ("I was just doing my job" etc). That's not a hard pill to swallow at all, and it certainly doesn't mean that "the system" is fine and dandy. By the way, District 9 did the EXACT SAME thing. The main character felt no sympathy towards the aliens, showed signs of a feeling of superiority even, and when he was thick in the shit of it, if you will (sorry, don't want to spoil it), then suddenly it was "bad". No remorse for anything before though.
Haven't seen the movie yet, but I just had to pick apart that little bit of logic there. Also, agreed with the others who say that it's a little hypocritical to lambast this movie only for its unoriginality yet Avatar gets put up on a pedastal. -
But Logan's Run was a GREAT book. The movie is the one guilty of what you accuse it of. Not that it isn't what you meant. But Switz is right. And I'll never forget the impact that book had on me and the non-impact the film had. Even though it was a fun experience at the time. It was so hard to come by truly half decent real sci-fi films back then.
-
The movie, not so much. Okay, Jerry Goldsmith's score is exceptional. The carousel sequence is terrific. And Jenny Agutter looks hot.
-
REALLY good, observant point. District 9 DID do the exact same thing. (having not seen Repo Men, I cannot say for sure though) But I say Avatar gets a pass because it was just so damned immersive and just impressive as hell to watch. But I'll disagree about that with some sharp people with great taste for decades. Doesn't offend me anymore.
-
...I also thought of Logan's Run. so it's derivative. But does it have Jenny Agutter's ass?
-
Other than comparing it to loads of other things and using the word "hate", that's actually a relatively positive review.
-
Massa,I won't watch this turd, so please just tell me the rip-off.I must know.
-
America can only do rehash's or remakes or borrow from other stuff
-
Great book, great movie. Just different. And yeah I agree on the comments about this films character arc - doesn't sound unrealistic, most people don't give a shit until it's their ass on the receiving end. Exactly like the awesome District 9 and Wikus. This film sounds like shit but I don't think that plot point is valid criticism.
-
...everybody runs.
-
Mar 17, 2010 10:01:41 AM CDT
I'd like to clean out Jenny's Agutter.
by nomoredirtyjokespleaseweareyanks
I spanked it to her many times.
-
make it stop.
-
No new movies for me this week. Sad face.
-
Way to call them out on it. If bad reviews were given to all unoriginal movies then there would be no good reviews here.
-
So then you don't like anything derivative? Don't like Quentin Tarantino movies? Hated Avatar? You're ridiculous. If this movie is good, then its good, no matter how much it stole from other movies. Just b/c Logan's Run was a great movie, doesn't mean that this can't also be good.
-
she needs a few courses in recurring Sci-Fi themes. and god knows she's never going to see any of the better movies it rips off.
-
How have they not fixed the glaring typo in that ad yet? It's been days?
-
You'd write that he was "paying Homage"
-
The trailer's pretty much telegraph what the entire movie's gonna be about.
So, ya know, there ya go... -
...It would be on AICN top ten list... if Night directed it, EVERYONE WOULD HATE IT...
-
Yeah, when I watched the trailer it looked like an obvious Logan's Run rip-off - particularly how much fun fun they were having hunting down their targets. Then I figured "Okay, Jude Law is going to get an implant and suddenly side with them" - and sure enough, it did. And then, oh no, shit got real! I didn't realize we were hunting down human beings! Logan's Run did it pretty masterfully - especially how much fun they were having hunting down those trying to avoid their fate. York was really good in that movie, as was Burton.
-
For the dude that asked, they completely rip-off the corridor hammer fight. But, like Massa said it is actually pretty good and brutal. All the action is well choreographed and makes Law and Whitaker look bad-ass.
Unless you pay attention to the 2 or 3 hints, the ending will actually take you by surprise. Pretty dark actually. -
I think as long as something isn't just a combination of two recent well-known films it counts as original enough for me. Everything is based on something. New movies are based on old movies, old movies are based on books, books are based on folklore, folklore is based on things that happened yadda yadda yadda.
-
This arbitrary standard should, by definition, make the reviewer hate about 98.3% of Tarantino where the material was written and directed by Q (Jackie Brown notwithstanding).
-
are you saying the fight scene in REPO MEN is better than Oldboy? Because that scene kicks all kind of ass.
-
... installment with the same premise that was published in the early 80's?
-
Of course stories are inspired by other stories. It's always happened that way. But the way it's being done now is shameful. It's outright theft, without any cleverness or reverence, just pillaging. Make it louder, shinier, and pretend your sources never existed. Be shameless, and take as much as you want, and then take credit for how "good" it is.Pathetic. I won't be going near this film.
-
Sort of like Pandorum that was a copy of a bunch of other SyFy horror movies and The Descent but well made and even better then some (Event Horizon). HOPEFULLY this is better then Repo the shit opera.
-
It's come time to either accept the CUT-PASTE-REARRANGE of high concept wanna-be blockbusters, or stay away from the theater. Of course Massa can't do that, it being his job and all, but I can.
-
Mar 17, 2010 1:31:31 PM CDT
Massa called my issue: No way you can just kill without conseque
by stormwatcher
Didn't pay so we murder you? no lawyers? People would say, holy shit! I'll pay till they kill me? Uh...I'll try accupunture.
-
I LOL at that moment in the ads where he's standing there with a knife in each hand, obviously trying to look awesome.
-
I want to see it !
-
Gods bless you, Massa!!!!! I saw a sneak preview of this last night and I've spent about 8 hours since then trying to convey, to both my fellow OPERA fans and to the wider world of movie geeks--everything that is wrong with it. And I welcome you and everyone else to read it, if you wish, at http://blogs.myspace.com/azrepo But you seriously NAILED it, far more wittily and less verbosely than I did. While I have some quibbles with your take on the acting and the direction, they are just that: quibbles. I'm going to direct every single person who reads my review--and all of my friends in the "Opera" community--to your page. Because, really--after yours, there's nothing more to say about it. To steal a page from my own review, I predict less than ten million opening, bad word of mouth, no repeat business, and an extremely swift ride from first run to discount theatre to five dollar bin at Wal Mart. TESTIFY!!!!!!
-
I wasn't sure if this movie would be worth my time, but after reading your review I'm now convinced it is.
Based on your review it actually sounds like a Tarantino like distillation of everything its creators love about the Sci-Fi genre, not a shameless rip-off.
I HATED Repo: The Genetic Opera, mainly because it didn't do anything good with its few original ideas and the songs veered into musical territory that induces involuntary cringing and/or vomiting. -
I think i just felt a couple of synapses in my brain fire that hasnt been active since the eighties. I seem to have a very vague memory of a Dredd coming with the same premise like MooseMalloy suggested.
-
Well, not better than Oldboy but still pretty good.
-
a sum of derivative parts. thats what movies are now.
still...I can't take Jude Law seriously as any kind of intimidating figure. He's teeny and has a femme accent. -
I don't think it ever came out on DVD, but the Logan's Run TV series was better than the film in most respects. I believe some of the writers worked on Star Trek (D.C. Fontana springs to mind).
-
please?
-
I saw Repo Men last night at a screening. Went in with low expectations because the concept seemed like a rip-off to me (but not a rip-off of any of the films mentioned above). My thoughts were "how are they going to stretch Monty Python's 'Liver Donor' sketch to feature length?" I found the film to have well-designed effects, excellent acting and direction and that the plot over-all held together rather well. But, then again, I try to not carry too much baggage into a movie theater when watching a new movie because... truly... how many un-derivative movies are there left these days? Every movie - with few exceptions - is a mash-up of what's happened before in cinema on one level or another.
-
"I've heard complaints that it was unoriginal and I can thankfully say those complaints are bullshit. I love LOGANS RUN and this really feels like LOGANS RUN to me, originality isnt coming up with something new but also having an original TAKE on the material. and I had to fight back tears the entire time also something about my wife ive shoehorned in. Also jizz"
That will be his review. -
be a problem sadly. Younger generations don't know shit about music, books, culture, films, etc. Lets be honest most young'ens don't even know about the grudge history and that was just 15yrs ago. How are they gonna know about Logans Run or The Opera?
-
i.e. a shameless rip-off of half-a-dozen old science fiction movies no one in the teenage audience will have ever seen.
-
massa's review is legit except the movie is still very good, despite it not being all that original.
massa seems to be hung up on the movie's reo men pays homage too. -
Mar 18, 2010 3:57:49 AM CDT
Funny how Massa is so upset that this movie stole ideas...
by asimovlives
... from other existing movies, but was so cool about it with JJ Abrams's FRAUD TREK and how it stole left and right from SW and, to a lesser extent, The Wrath Of Kahn. And badly, i might add. God, how i love to catch this little hypocrisies!
-
Says the arch-fucking-hypocrite himself. Remind me again how much you wanked over AvP:Rectum. Also, the only thing you "catch" is a young goat that isn't savvy enough to escape from your sweaty paws. Fucking twat.
-
Mar 18, 2010 4:12:04 AM CDT
From the same site and reviewer which kisses the asses of
by asimovlives
... such hacks as Michael Bay and Jj Abrams, they complain about a derivative movie. Now they are superior to that? i love this stuff, i really do. To quote from Kurt Vonnegut Jr, i had to laugh.
-
and go kill yourself already, motherfucker waster of oxygen.
-
... and have any tolerance for Michael Bay movies have forteit any right to complain about derivative movies.
-
Mar 18, 2010 4:59:30 AM CDT
I've started to read your posts in the voice of Mr. Garrison, As
by lost jarv
It makes them much more amusing. Are you also a closet homosexual with a glove puppet that you call "mr. goat"?
-
Yet has to find bullshit psuedo intellectual theories to justify liking the dumber than a sack of rocks Avatar. I can't wait for the Portuguese economy to finally collapse so you have to commit teary-eyed cannibalism on your "harem" to survive.
-
2kg Goat(scrag end, chops and/or shoulder meat)
3 large tomatoes, skinned and roughly chopped
3 garlic cloves, bashed, then roughly chopped
2 onions, finely chopped
1–2 Scotch bonnet chillies, deseeded and finely chopped
a few good sprigs of thyme (or 1 tsp dried thyme)
a good bunch of coriander (leaves and roots)
2 tbsp HP sauce (optional but very authentic)
50g clarified butter (or use a good cooking oil)
salt
For the Jamaican curry blend:
1 tbsp coriander seeds
1 tbsp black peppercorns
12 cardamom pods
tbsp fenugreek seeds
1 cinnamon stick
1 tbsp ground ginger
1 tbsp ground turmeric There you go, don't say I never do anything for you. -
Just to see how it rips everything off.
-
It makes him feel less virgin.
-
and asks for seconds... up in his fucking ass!
-
... by Michael Bay and JJ Abrams and be made their bitch. With a big anthropomorphic blue cat chewing at his useless limp dick.
-
Only a fucking delusional idiot with no understanding of movies other the just fact action bullshit, aka, a nerd, would like that shit. Ence, the movie is fucking NERD TREK. For once, rape target Lost Jerk was right. As a reward, he will get what he always dream: getting fucked in the ass by Jj Abrams, and be used as sloppy seconds to Michael Bay.
-
with his own pathetic existence.
-
Mar 18, 2010 5:50:50 AM CDT
Lost Jerkl how does it feel,,now to have a whole talkback
by asimovlives
derailed for the sake of personal feud between two talkbacks, hem? How does it fell now, motherfucker? Go kill yourself, you useless fucking piece of shit. Die already.
-
Hindsight is always 20/20, of course, but i should had known, when i decided to give that fucking hack a chance with The Island. I should had known better. Still, i fell for all that talk about "he's no longer making a movie for Jerry Bruckheimer, he's making a movie for Steven Spielberg, Spielberg will reign in his worst excess, will hold his hand and help him make a good movie, blablabla blabla". And i bought that shit. I bought that shit! Should had known better, but dammit, i wanted to believe that even an hack has a chance of redemption under the fight tutelage. How naive i was! Should had known better! What a fucking piece of shit THE ISLAND is, it's like a smart movie for morons. small wonder, Bob Orci and his charactless buddy were responsible for writing that retard crap.
-
... you might as well be derivative of proper good movies. As Francis ford coppola once said, if you got to steal, steal from the best. The way i see it, it's better to make a derivitive movie based on Blade Runner, Oldboy, Brazil or Total Recall, then to derivative on some Michael Bay bullshit.
-
Mar 18, 2010 6:30:59 AM CDT
Duncan Jones' MOON could also be considered derivative...
by asimovlives
... and yet it's one hell of a good movie. I guess what seperates a deriviative film from one that's fille with hommage and references is the quality of the filmmakers, ad their dedication to the movie, that they believe the movie they are making, instead of it just being some hack job they do only for the money.
-
to making an actual movie, and it's only mediocre at best.
-
Indeed.
-
...I have railed against derivative films, and the endless sequence of remakes, but I think part of the problem is that the nature of "audience memory" has changed. It used to be that if the film you were stealing from was FORTY YEARS OLD, you could steal from it secure in the knowledge that most of the audience would not have ever even seen the film and TO THEM, the material was fresh. These days, unless you're Tarantino and steal from Asian flicks no one has actually seen, you can't get away with stealing because everyone in the audience has seen Logan's Run, and a lot of them owned the VHS tape or DVD at one time or another. So it may be that modern filmmakers aren't stealing any more than they ever have; we just actually can see the source material now, because we OWN it.
-
Mar 18, 2010 8:58:50 AM CDT
One of the things that worked about LOGAN’S RUN...
by damned if i can login
Wait Massa....I thought Logan's age indicator was advanced so that he could run, in order for him to infiltrate the underground movement related to Sanctuary. Along the way he discovered the BS.
-
I think you are very right about what you said above. In the days before VHS and DVD, it was easier for movie geek directors like Coppolla and Lucas and spielberg and De Palma to make refences to other older movies, and only other filmmakers and movie critics would notice them. Today it's harder, for the very reasons you said above.You alos hinted to another good point, in that Holywood remaking older movies is nothing new. As you must be very well aware, THE MALTESE FALCON was a SECOND remake of the original movie based on same crime book story in the space of less then 10 years.I don't have a problem with filmmakers making references to older movies in their movies. In some ways, it's even cute, it's like we are watching a movie made by a fellow movie geek. It's quite a nice feeling to see a director who watched and likes the same movies you do, it's as if we are talking the same language, we understand the same shorthand. Usually filmmakers like that can project a bit of their soul to the movies they make, even if they are just a little low budget exploitation-like movie.
-
You know that sometimes you make some good points....
Then you start on about emo hair, JJ, Fraud Trek, and Losties and then I fucking hate you.
Go build a fucking website for that shit and save it here. -
One of my rightful problem with FRAUD TREK is that it's emo. I fucking hate the emo shit.
-
Have you ever actually seen a naked woman, you sad freak?
-
Since when did that happen?
-
JJ Abrams's FRAUD TREK is the TWILIGHT of science fiction. No more, no less. Star Trek turned teen emo shit. When you people want to understand how thr fuck can anyboduy like such tripe as TWLIGHT, all you need to do is remmeber how and why you like FRAUD TREK. Same thing, same arguments, same bullshit.
-
Mar 18, 2010 11:39:37 AM CDT
Are you or have you been entertained by any TRANSFORMERS movie?
by asimovlives
If yes, then you forfeited any right to criticise any movie on the grounds of derivativeness.
-
There has always been some sort of love interest in the Star Trek movies and shows. Thats nothing new. And the personal relationships were the same as they were on the show.
-
The movies built on the TV show, which began with the crew fully formed and comfortable with each other. Wouldn't an origin story have to deal more with personality clashes and dealing with "emo" problems since everybody's still trying to figure out who they are and how they relate to each other?
-
Why is water wet? How should I explain to you the very fucking obvious?
-
Does that mean you can't?
-
C'mon! C'mon, man! You know better then this. The problem, as you very well know, is not that there's drama or romance, because yes, there has been that in spades in Star Trek since the begining, as it should. No, the problem is the TYPE of drama, or should i call it, the fucking cheap ass teen melodrama bullshit shoved in FRAUD TREK, and it's dumb teen TV melodrama bullshit presentation in the aforementioned FRAUD TREK "movie". The melodrama is crap, and the presentation is incompetent and crap. No better then in any TWILIGHT movie. JJ Abrams's TWILIGHT TREK indeed.
-
It means i can. But it means i can't do it in a one line nonsense, the way the DRRAUD TREK groupies can to defend their movie. Like the same way in describing why water is wet. To say water is wet is what's called an axiom, in that it's a self-evident. It's possible to explain why water is wet, but you would need to talk about such subjects as surface tension, molecular grouping, surface to mass ratio, molecular physics and chemistry, and you would even need maths to construct a cohesive explanation. but is it really needed all that to say why water is wet? Same thing with FRAUD TREK, it's awfulness as a movie is self-evident. It's possible to explain, in detail, why it all fails. But it's a long explanation. It's long becaus eof how many things are wrong with that movie, which is, everything but the cast. a movie that has a screw up for each minute of onscreen, many times more then one per minute. But there is no need to go even to much details to why the movie fucking fails. There is not evne need to bring much about Star Trek to describe and understand why the fucking movie fails so miserable. The mor eimportant reaons are even generic, the type why any movie fails regardless of genre or what franchise it belongs. But the truth is, the problems the movie have are self-evident. One needs to be in a severe harsh case of denial to not see them.
-
Speaking strictly as a struggling dark fantasy/horror funny book creator, unoriginality happens. It just does. As the scripture goes, "There is nothing new under the sun." And I'm sure that sentiment wasn't new when it was written down. I really don't have any serious interest in this flick. Checking off a list, however, of all the stories it was borrowed from doesn't turn me off to the movie. It turns me off to the review. The kind of dismissive or snobbish attitude behind a review like this always seeps into the zeitgeist of a culture, making any would-be artist (already an insecure lot second guess themselves until any idea they've come with is just shelved. I know the standard response to such an observation is merely to say that you can use any genre convention, "just put an original spin on it." But let's be fair. There aren't many, if any, original spins left in the post-modern world. In fact, should someone even stumble on such a spin, it was probably by accident. Thus, art becomes much like playing with legos. All the ideas are there, laid out before you. They already exist. So, you connect ideas till they make a shape you enjoy. But to make it relatable, pleasing or interesting, familiarity is required. Anything too alien doesn't engross an audience, at least not one of any notable size or sanity. So, we are stuck with doing the best we can with what we have at our immediate disposal to continue to enrich our culture. Criticizing art or pop culture as unoriginal for the sake of it, (or even for the high-minded ideal of making art better)more often than not, only ensures nothing new or interesting will ever exist.--By the way, I stole all of that.
-
Okay, let's just focus on the teen gawdawful romance aspect, aka Twilight. The elements in ST that pertain to this would be Spock-Uhura, Kirk-Uhura, and...hmmm, can't think of any others. Now, as for Kirk, his character has always been a cocksman; he's bagging every green-skinned chick on the show, and so that aspect seemed in keeping with the original show. Obviously his attempts are amatuerish at best, but again he's not polished and smooth as he would be if a) he'd had more practice; b) he had the self-confidence of being a successful starship captain, and possibly c) he'd had his father's presence to give him guidance about dealing with women. Admittedly the last reason is tenuous, but seemed to be in keeping with both the original tone of the series Abrams was trying to capture, and the reboot aspect he used to freshen it up.
As for Uhura-Spock, that did bother me a little, forcing a romance that wasn't even hinted at originally. But it was a small part of the movie and the action more than made up for that. So I let it pass. I'm not a trekkie at all; I prefer Star Wars (OT), but a rollicking ride like ST was roundly entertaining, and I just don't get the virulent response. However, I await your response which will undoubtedly clear up my erroneous attitude. -
The problem in JJ's FRAUD TREK is that he completly misundestood Kirk. Kirk was not a thich-headed smart-ass rufian that became smart, quite the contrary, he used to be a nerd that manned up. In his own words, as seen in the episode "Shore Leave", he was a stack of book with legs, until one academy college keep pesting him so much that he finally gained the guts and courage to face him once and for all, and thus was born Kirk the ass kicker. The point about Kirk was always that he is a fighting gentleman. Notice how in the original series, he's always quoting form the classics, he knows references in the quick, he's leraned, refined, smart, quick witted. And this is not stuff you learn just because you get older, you have to have a predisposition to this, it's a character traint, a personality trait, a predisposition. He's suave sophisticated man who also can kick ass. In FRAUD TREK, he's a fucking barfly without any sophistication to him. If JJ Abrams was so desperate to have a Mary Sue in his movie, he should had created his own fictional character and have him run around the enterprise, and not bastardazation of a character which well known characteristics, the very ones which made him endearing and a classic.Spock is now an emotional mommy boy bitch. Gone is everythign that amde him alein and interesting, now all we have is a human with poitned ears. They mananged to make Spock dull and uninteresting, a feat i never though possible.Uhura is now reduced to be petulant anoying princess who pouts and bitches if she doesn't go with the cool kids in the cool car. Gone is the sophisticated, classy, stylish, intelligent Uhura of old and now traded with this anoying personality-devoid teen princess whore. They might as well have called her Whorehura.Yes, i think i see what's the cruz of the problem withy your too easy acceptance of JJ Abram's FRAUD TREK. That you are such a fan of SW. you are content because you have seen a movie which is everything but Star Trek, a movie which is, in fac,t everythign but in name another Star Wars movie. This is no mere quip, it's true, FRAUD TREK is Star trek removed of eveerythign that made it Star Trek and turned into Star Wars. And as proof all you need is to listen to the DVd audio comentary, where JJ Abrams and his hack croonies can't help mentioning Star Wars references every 5 to 10 minutes of the movie's two hour running time. All major reference andinspirations cames from Star Wars, almost nothing from Star Trek. The only Star Trek thing that is inthe movie is just the title, characters names, and a 1/4rd of the plot stolen from THE WRATH OF KAHN and it's decaffed Kahn-lite villain. The rest is all Star Wars.I guess that you as a SW fan you might find it amusing and exciting to have the other major SF franchise turned into another Star Wars. What i see is that now Star Trek lost it's own identity, thanks to JJ Abrams and his merry group of hacks. Now, all the major SF franchises are homogenized, they are now all look and feel the same. Well, ask me why i think that sucks! Star Wars should be Star Wars, and Star Trek should be Star Trek. By turning Star Trek into Star Wars, JJ Abrams not only proves his complete ignorance and, worst of all, disrespect to ST, but he also shows a monstrous ego here he uses a movie as his own plaything, to play as his will, instead of doing what the job demands.That combination of crass ignorance, disrespect, thick-headness, and unchecked ego is completly evident in the finished movie.FRAUD TREK is not just that but also a terrible movie made in the fashion of a terrible style of filmmaking à lá Michael Bay, taking sway and decharacterizing and robbing Star Trek of what was once it's unique style and it's own identity. And that, i don't think it's cool.
-
Yeah, it's such a shame, because, you know, STAR TREK'S "identity" was being upheld by such quality B&B projects as "Voyager", "Insurrection", "Nemesis", and "Deep Space Baby--er, 5, er 9". I totally see your point that Trek was so not needing a complete makeover after 20 mediocre hack years.
-
But FRAUD TREK is not supposed to be about Voyager, TNG and DS9, is it? It's supposed to be about TOS. So why do people keep on bringing those other series up? FRAUD TREK is to be compared to TOS and TOS only. There's no Captain Janeway, Picard or Sisko in FRAUD TREK, is there? But there is a Kirk, a Spock, a Uhura, a McCoy, Chekov, a Sulu, a Pike.... and i wonder from which show they came from? Oh yeah, TOS!So, no use to bring the other shows to justify FRAUD TREK's mishandlings and mistakes and fuck ups. Two wrongs do not make a right. If Voyager and the later ST:TNG movies fucked up, they did it on their own acord, it's on their own head, and their wrongs do not make right the wrongs of FRAUD TREK.Did the Star Trek universe needed an overhaul? Yeah, i guess it did. I'm not at all opposed to the idea of a reboot of classic TOS Trek, quite the contrary. I even like the notion of the classic characters at the Academy, to see advantures set in that time of their lifes. But what FRAUD TREK did is not the way to do that. In fact, what FRAUD TREK did is the exact way it shouldn't be done. JJ Abrams and his fans might be delusional in thinking that they pulled with that "movie" what Christopher Nolan and Ronald D. Moore did with, respectively, Batman Begins and Battlestar Galactica new series, but in fact, FRAUD TREK is the exact opposite of what those two aforementioned shows did. And not to mention that FRAUD TREK dumbed down it's franchise, when those two other shows smarted up theirs. There's no comparison.And on the subject of dumbing down, this is one of the worst mistakes and errors made by FRAUD TREK. Star Trek used to have this general image of a thinking man's SF. Despiste the ocasional descent to goofiness and idioticy, Star Trek always aimed at being, or at least tried to sell itself, as a thinking man's SF. FRAUD TREK is "Spock's Brain" made into feature lenght movie. At least "Spock's Brain" mercifully runs for a short time of 40 minutes.
-
I suspect you're the type who has to bash his point into the ground whether anyone's listening or not, because you know you're right and you want to scream it to the heavens--and hey, I have my moments of that too--but I know where I stand on this, it's pretty diametrically opposite of you, and you're not going to change my mind, so I think I'm just going to opt out with the phrase "agree to disagree", and suggest that you ponder the "IDIC" concept a bit more. Best wishes.
-
How many movies follow this same basic plot? Not just Logan's Run.
-
So, that means you like movies that dumb down once smart franchises, and you like incoherent stories whose plot makes no sense whatsoever, the plot advances thanks to impossible coincidences and deus ex machinas and characters act just to advance to the plot's dead ends? Because that's the diametrical position from mine, which you claim to be yours. And this my posts has nothing to do with proselytising, but about talking about what's there.
-
No, I just don't feel like debating the matter further with someone who not only already knows they are right but feels the need to prove it, especially by making assumptions about my taste and opinions, including the fact that anyone who disagrees with them must be a moron. Thank you, good bye, troll.
-
and Logan's Run is a good movie, I saw it as a kid on VHS and loved it, especially naked Jenny Agutter, it's cheesy and very, very 70's, but that's what's cool about it
-
So, you have no arguments, is that it? Always the argumentless call others trolls when they can't talk the talk.
-
Keep proving my point. I didn't come on this board to argue about Star Trek in the first place. I had all my arguments about that movie a year ago when it came out. It seems that YOU still have something to prove. Again, proving my point. When the sequel comes out in 2 years, we can come back it it, kay? So really, get over it till then. And take a laxative, you'll feel better.
-
"I'm a nerd and now I'm gonna complain that Avatar was unoriginal because if my movies don't reinvent the wheel they suck!"
Repo is a BLATANT rip-off. Not to mention it's the exact same plot of a movie that came out last year. When watching Avatar, you never get the feeling like "I've seen this before". Most people bring up Dances With Wolves, which is valid sure, but that came out in 1990 not 2009. Nothing wrong with updating stories for new generations. Plus Avatars story is OLD as humanity...it's been around for ages and told a million times. Organ harvesting? Not so much. And plus with all of the talk about Avatar being unorginal, I can't name any other sci-fi movies with a CGI blue alien romance at the center of a film that is considered live action. That in itself is a HUGE narrative breakthrough. -
I don't even think this thing will hit $6m on its opening weekend. Another fine day in the recent history of Universal. But hey, I bet Leno will LOVE this movie!
Readers Talkback
User Login
Top Talkbacks
- Whitney Houston 1963 - 2012 -- 439 total posts 165 posts
- WTF HOLLYWOOD: SOLARBABIES -- 144 total posts 142 posts
- Herc’s Seen Tonight’s Return Of THE WALKING DEAD!! Discuss Also DOWNTON ABBEY, FEAR FACTOR, PAN AM, ONCE, SIMPSONS, DYNAMITE, LUCK, SHAMELESS, BAIT CAR, THE GRAMMYS And More!! Sunday Is Sweeps Day 11!! -- 153 total posts 138 posts
- Avid Comic Reader Hercules Does Battle With Tedium During Kevin Smith’s COMIC BOOK MEN! -- 55 total posts 47 posts
- There's a STAR TREK video game that is going to lead into JJ's STAR TREK 2 apparently... -- 196 total posts 45 posts
- If the Behind the Scenes Pics of the Day drops her pen, pick it up, but don’t look at her legs or else it will be on your record. -- 60 total posts 36 posts
- New JUDGE DREDD post production footage pops up -- 127 total posts 36 posts
- I am The Behind the Scenes Pics of the Day! No, I’m the Behind the Scenes Pic of the Day! -- 35 total posts 35 posts
- To Commemorate The 3D Release Of STAR WARS EPISODE I: THE PHANTOM MENACE, George Lucas Wants You To Know...Greedo Shoots First!! -- 513 total posts 29 posts
- The Sensorties Revisit The Friday Docback (And Still Smell)!! DOCTOR WHO Story #7 Again, The Coming Of Season/Series 7, And More!! -- 117 total posts 26 posts