Comics

McG Still Thinks He's Making TERMINATOR Movies??

Published at: Dec. 7, 2009, 3:07 p.m. CST by merrick

Merrick here...

Tech issue updating site today necessitate super-brief updates. Apologies.

TERMINATOR SALVATION hit Blu-Ray and standard DVD last week (HERE). Director McG recently conducted a TERMINATOR SALVATION BD Live event (viewers can watch their Blu-Rays at home while interacting w/ filmmakers live, via a chat-like structure). During the conversation, he indicated an intent to make two more TERMINATOR films. He didn't account for how he would remain attached to these potential projects given that the current holders of TERMINATOR rights are about to auction them off. Also, between TSAL only doing aiight at the box office (didn't make tons, didn't totally die)...and the film's tepid-to-negative reception by audiences...McG remaining attached to further TERMINATOR films would seem a tough argument to make at best. Evidently, McG is also attributed with sharing the following sublime insight into filmmaking during the chat: "There's two elements that go into filmmaking. There's sound, and there's the picture.". Should we give him the benefit of the doubt & assume this statement was intended to be taken in some greater context? Probably not. More details HERE.
--- Follow Merrick on Twitter! ---


Readers Talkback

comments powered by Disqus
    + Expand All
  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:36 p.m. CST

    Where are all the people who hated the movie?

    by Fortunesfool

    He asked at one point. 'I wanted to talk to them'<p>Um, They didn't buy the BluRay dipshit!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:37 p.m. CST

    McG

    by Sin_Happens

    Please die of Ebola or something..

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:37 p.m. CST

    Oh god...

    by FlickaPoo

    ...and I'd reverse that order..."there's the picture and there's the sound".<P>GET IT RIGHT.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:38 p.m. CST

    We want Terminator Tarintino.

    by SonicRiver

    Seriously, How long is it going to be before Quentin buys the rights?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:38 p.m. CST

    No more terminator movies please!

    by eoneon

    Esp. W/McG at the helm

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:40 p.m. CST

    TERM SAL was DECENT but not quite a good movie

    by Derek Wildstarr

    The whole unnecessarily elaborate plot of trying to "lure" jon connor to save reese was lame in my opinion.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST

    I'm all for this!!

    by ShogunMaster

    I'd love to see a movie where McG gets Terminated...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST

    I intend to make sweet love to Kate Beckinsdale...

    by HarryCalder

    ...let's see if I or McG accomplish our respective tasks sooner...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST

    I give McG that...

    by tomimt

    he did arrange his soundies and picsies in an reasonably fun order with his Charlies Angels clickies. Haven't seen TS or any other wonderously rabidly changing images he has made though.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST

    If McG wants to talk to the people who hates his movie

    by fiester

    Just have him log on here.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:43 p.m. CST

    McG is no Michael Bay

    by Tell_Your_Mom_I_Said_Hi

    But he wants to be.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Merrick is an IDIOT

    by Proman1984

    And his take is a "moo" point. It's not even his.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:45 p.m. CST

    There's one element that goes into writing a novel.

    by RayPatterson

    There's words.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:47 p.m. CST

    What a moron

    by Chuck_Chuckwalla

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:48 p.m. CST

    Everybody i know who saw it hated it

    by awepittance

    i can't say i knew anyone who thought it was better than Terminator 3, which is basically saying it's abominable.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:51 p.m. CST

    I can handle that for you, awepittance.

    by NinjaRap

    It was definitely better than T3. Definitely. Not remotely as good as the first two movies or the TV series, and full of plot and logic holes, but whatever, still better than 3. As for the quote Merrick tried to mock, I think McG was trying to illustrate that not enough people realize that sound is 50% of a movie experience - people take it for granted. But anyway.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:52 p.m. CST

    Try him at the Hague

    by EvilEvolutionist

    McG (what a name!) should be tried at the Hague over what he did to the Terminator franchise.

  • This is why you fail.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:53 p.m. CST

    Terminator Salvation > Terminator 3: RotM

    by Argentino

    That's all. I've always wanted to to the ">" thing. Also X3 > Wolverine. Wow, fells good. My next goal: first posting

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:53 p.m. CST

    Apart from other things, it suffered

    by Dingbatty

    mostly from too many protagonists.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:53 p.m. CST

    McGerk

    by BoRock_A_Boomer

    Go away

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:54 p.m. CST

    Salvation wasn't all bad.

    by Azlam Orlandu

    I enjoyed it far less than Star Trek, but far more than Transformers 2 this Summer.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:55 p.m. CST

    I am not sure why Micheal bay gets kicked around so much..

    by emeraldboy

    or bret ratner. I loathed the rush hour series as much as the next person. thanks to chris tucker. I thought red Dragon looked good and the first series of prison break was excellent. the star of which was undoubtedly that actor who is now in private practice. Ratner´s movies have a certain flair. bay does destruction better then most but I would like him to try a low key approach. Something that will suprise his detractors.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:55 p.m. CST

    Terminator 3> Terminator Salvation BY FAR

    by JKrow21

    Terminator Salvation was not a good movie...not TERRIBLE...but that's only because of Bale.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:55 p.m. CST

    MCG IS A STUPID CUNT!!!FACT!!!

    by TehCreepyThinMan

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:57 p.m. CST

    He's a bit of a twat, no?

    by V'Shael

    I think he's forgotten that PLOT and STORY and SCRIPT all matter a great deal if a movie is to be a success.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 2:59 p.m. CST

    Everyone I know Liked T4

    by MilkFromACow

    I stand by the subject. I think everyone I know that saw the movie either liked it or thought it was really good. Good action, interesting story and characters. NOT any sort of rehash. The Ahnuld cameo was awesome too. None of you can possibly tell me this was worse than the heaping mess that was Transformers 2. That was unwatchable. T4 was good popcorn fun!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3 p.m. CST

    Finally saw Salvation

    by Neosamurai85

    The squishy Total Recall terminator was well acted, and the kid playing Connors Dad nailed it. Everything else about the movie, I hated. No action filming chops at all, stupid Terminators back handing everyone, silly plot twists, lots of stupid... HATED IT. I often feel fanboys have excessive hate, but McG bashing is something I can really get behind after sitting through that.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:03 p.m. CST

    Fair enough

    by estacado1

    And forgot lights as the third thing. Don't let your DP mess with the lights.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:05 p.m. CST

    T:TSCC > Terminator 3+4

    by Alientoast

    Primarily because T:TSCC makes it so 3 + 4 never happened!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:05 p.m. CST

    terminator 3 is better

    by mrgreentheplant

    because it was actually fun. yes, perhaps too much fun (too jokey, no gravity to any of the scenes except the end, etc.) but it at least felt like a terminator movie. not black hawk down with robots. which isnt a bad concept, just don't call it terminator 4.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:06 p.m. CST

    T4 had some stupid moments ...

    by ganda1f

    But it wasn't as insultingly stupid as T3. I *hated* T3, whereas I can live with Salvation.<br>I still think the real problem with Salvation wasn't even McG's directing (although he didn't help) but rather the piecemeal script. Without the writers strike maybe they would have had more time to churn out a half decent rewrite, rather than the rush job that wound up on screen.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:06 p.m. CST

    that bd live conversation was hilarious

    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

    i cant wait for uwe boll to do one!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:08 p.m. CST

    I'd rather take lessons in filmmaking from a mute-deaf-blind hob

    by AsimovLives

    ... who had never seen a movie in his whole life then from McG.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:09 p.m. CST

    Truer words never spoken, Alientoast.

    by NinjaRap

    ganda1f is also correct.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:10 p.m. CST

    T3 definintely better than T4

    by thot

    Saw T4 last night, rented it from Hollywood Video. It was pretty much what I expected. Lots of pretty cool big-budget action scenes interspersed with some semblance of a story. I found it to be quite hollow. The first three installments were made the more interesting by delving much deeper into the human psyche and strong human relationships. They had a sort of profundity that is totally missing from T4. I'm a Bale fan, but thought he was miscast as Connor. The highlight was most certainly the Arnold 'cameo'. Cool. As for a T5, I'm up for it but they'd better do something to recapture the depth and spirit of the first three. If I had to choose, I would choose T3 over T4 anyday.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:10 p.m. CST

    You guys can't to see how good TF2 was.

    by estacado1

    Of all the "FUN" movies this year, at the top is a tie between TF2 and 2012. GI Joe wasn't as FUN as advertised here. The only FUN part of Salvation was seeing CG Schwarzenegger.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:12 p.m. CST

    Put a fork in the Terminator. It's done.

    by Royston Lodge

    I don't care if Stanley Kubrick himself came back from the dead and was attached to make another Terminator movie, there really aren't any more great stories to be told in that universe. Any new Terminator stories, no matter how much skill is poured into them, will only be "ok". Not great. It's done. Past its prime. Ceased to be. Let it go, man. Just let it go.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:13 p.m. CST

    I saw McG in Toronto this past summer...

    by MR. MURDOCH

    ...while taking that itty-bitty ferry across the water to the new compact airport they've built on the island, to catch a short flight down to Newark. You remember that god-awful moment in HIGHLANDER 2 where Sean Connery dies for a SECOND TIME? He's about to get sliced up by this enormous motor-fan that is descending, and as he is using the mysterious, entirely unexplained power of "The Quickening," he tells Chris Lambert and the very hot Virginia Madsen: "Most people have a full measure of life... and most people just watch it slowly drip away. But if you can summon it all up... at one time... in one place... you can accomplish something... glorious." Anyway, I was getting on the ferry, he was coming off. I noticed McGoober, we made eye contact, and I concentrated my eyes really hard for one sustained dirty look, as to convey: "Yeah, bud, I saw your movie -- and you know what? It was shit on a hot dog stick, and you should go back to school." Even with his limited "sound and picture" philosophy, I think he got my point.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:15 p.m. CST

    Franchise-Killer

    by FloobyNooby

    It was Clooney's Batman. This year's been so lousy I didn't return to the cinema till Saw 6 came out (a guilty pleasure, chicken soup movie for me). Even after cutting the guy some slack because there was going to be a major toy lineup, there's no excuse for the whole audience (where I saw it) laughing at the idea of a vet doing a heart transplant op on the M*A*S*H set. Keep that man away, but hold onto the crew. Even the guy with the lights. It looked good, at least.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:17 p.m. CST

    The next Terminator movie? REMAKE.

    by NinjaRap

    You know it's inevitable. Just watch Platinum Dunes buy the rights...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:18 p.m. CST

    re: estacado1

    by yourSTEPDADDY

    TF2 was very FUN! GI Joe... so borin I walked out the theater to buy a overpriced "slurpie"... so in hindsight dont listen to AICN reviews... and cursin, racist-ishly, humpin robots are COOL

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:18 p.m. CST

    He won't 'be back.'

    by WickedJester

    /badarniequotejoke

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:20 p.m. CST

    Arnold and Cameron or nothing!

    by ABking

    If Summit or Sony get the rights, it's SCHWARZENEGGER & CAMERON or nothing!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:20 p.m. CST

    If you're attempt to revive a franchis leads to auction..

    by WickedJester

    There's probably a good chance you won't be asked back by the new property owners.<br><br>If one contractor fucked up your roof, you're probably not going to ask him to come back for the repairs.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:20 p.m. CST

    If you're attemp to revive a franchise leads to it's auction sal

    by WickedJester

    There's probably a good chance you won't be asked back by the new property owners.<br><br>If one contractor fucked up your roof, you're probably not going to ask him to come back for the repairs.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:21 p.m. CST

    Wow fucked it up twice.

    by WickedJester

    If you're attempt to revive a franchise leads to it's auction sale**

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:22 p.m. CST

    Awesome!

    by Kontarsky

    As long as it's still future and not some dipshit in London piece, OH YEAAAAH. I liked this film, though the Director's Cut was nothing more than a sad ripoff to screw over the minority of fanboys that liked this film. Fuck you for that, McG. Didn't spend a cent on this film as a result, as much as I like it.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:23 p.m. CST

    I guess the difference with the films was ...

    by ganda1f

    ... I felt genuinely insulted by T3 very early on (with the stripper glasses, followed by the magic-car-controlling-abilities of the 'Terminatrix'. WTF?)<br><br>T4 only really got in my face at the end, with the out of the blue heart transplant and the we-are-a-franchise-the-fight-goes-on-voiceover.<br><br>Oh, and everyone looked so damned healthy. Isn't this a post-nuclear wasteland?<br><br>Still, the first few acts of Salvation still hold up for me. Largely due to the performances working, the solid design work on the early-model terminators, and the action scenes holding together well.<br><br>The Terminator series has first and foremost been about desperate action chase scenes with characters we like, and Salvation delivered that until the last act.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:23 p.m. CST

    You Salvation defenders...

    by DarthCorleone

    ...have seen the first two films, right? You are aware that the movie is supposed to include ruthless, relentless robots that actually terminate human beings, right? What a joke and complete betrayal of the menacing spirit of the original films (yes, including the third one, in spite of its flaws).

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:23 p.m. CST

    Mc fucking G

    by xile1c

    and Michael Fucking Bay are both James Cameron wannabes, and neverwillbes. They both think really cool effects are the only thing that matters in a film, but they don't mean SHIT without emotional attachment to a story.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Whoever buys the Termonator franchise...

    by Linguo_IS_Dead

    Is likely gonna reboot it in some fashion, losing all actors/director/producers in order to keep costs down and refresh the series. McG sucks anyways...seriously, Charlie's Angels...c'mon MAN!!!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:25 p.m. CST

    The Movie made No Fucking Sense.

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    Worthington's Terminator seemed way more advanced than the T-800s, which at the beginning of the movie explained they were just going into production. The whole site gets nuked but he has no problems crawling out of a hole the size of a reactor. In the end, the Helena-Burton-Carter computer says that he's succeeded where all other Terminators have failed by killing Connor, but that makes no sense because the T800 and Reese have yet to be sent back in time...and how the fuck did they know that Kyle Reese is the father?!! I'm pretty much just scratching the surface here, without even getting into a discussion about a heart transplant in the middle of the fucking desert. I rarely like to heap on Fanboy hate, but this movie made me want to set myself on fire.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:25 p.m. CST

    ganda1f...

    by DarthCorleone

    "...first and foremost been about desperate action chase scenes with characters we like..."<br><br> Yes, and where's the "desperation" in Salvation? They throw Kyle Reese in a prison, for pete's sake. They slap John Connor around rather than just grabbing him and crushing his windpipe. It's completely lacking credibility.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:26 p.m. CST

    I like the way he compared T:S to Te Dark Knight

    by SithMenace

    What a self involved egotistical douche. Seriously, he sounds like he's worse quality than his shitty movies.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:27 p.m. CST

    McG is a just a Brett Ratner Clone

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    if Brett Ratner was douche-y enough to call himself McRat.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:29 p.m. CST

    Sam Worthington...

    by Dharma4

    ...Was the only redeeming character and actor in Terminator: Salvation. And yes, SithMenace, he is a egotistical douche and nothing less.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:29 p.m. CST

    And as far as T3 goes

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    It at least tried to adhere to previously established cannon. And Nick Stahl was a better John Connor. Bale was basically the same character from Reign of Fire.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:30 p.m. CST

    T:S looked and felt like...

    by Christopher3

    A TV movie, right down to the senseless plot, indifferent dialogue, rote, bloodless action and the B/C-list cast. I think this franchise is officially dead.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Moon Bloodgoods tits were terrible.

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    And her whole subplot was retarded.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:36 p.m. CST

    Some people think TS was better than T3?

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    Scary world.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:38 p.m. CST

    T:5 could be good with a good director

    by SithMenace

    like McTiernan or Donner. <p>Imagine if Spielberg did T:5 and took a sci-fi Saving Private Ryan approach. Dear Lord that would be special. But we probably have more of a chance of seeing him do a Bond film.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:38 p.m. CST

    DarthCorleone, those scenes you mention

    by ganda1f

    ...are all in the third act, where I admit the film was starting to fall apart.<br><br>The early scenes hung together quite well IMHO. Basically the films Stupid output started rising markedly the minute Helena B. Carter arrived and explained the plot.<br><br>To clarify my position: T:Salvation is a deeply flawed movie, but is still a far better product than T3.<br><br>I still find Salvation enjoyable for the majority of it's running time, whereas I find T3 unwatchable from about 10 minutes in.<br><br>Regardless of the quality of the sequels (and how we argue about 'which was worst'), at least we always have the greatness of the first two films to fall back on.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:43 p.m. CST

    TakingScorpiosCalls

    by HarryCalder

    It is, indeed...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:45 p.m. CST

    SithMenace

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    Imagine if I went back in time and had Sophia Loren sit on my face. Try to be realistic, dude.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:45 p.m. CST

    Im not sure McG understands the concept of a script

    by IndustryKiller!

    That thing that has words that the actors speak and the director uses as a guidepost. And how that's actually is an essential, nay, the MOST essential, element of a film. Seriously what kind of delusional prick is this guy. It's almost hard to blame him since he seems so innocent in his complete and utter idiocy. How the fuck do guys like this succeed on what basically seems like being a broad personality? I mean fine he's engaging at cocktail parties to people who apparently have no sense of annoyance, but why would you ever trust your money to this fuckin guy? I guess it's why Hollywood is the worst run business int eh world.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:48 p.m. CST

    HarryCalder

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    This is a foreboding sign to the 2012 apocalypse then.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:49 p.m. CST

    Talk to the hand and robocars??

    by Billyeveryteen

    T3 was far more insulting.<p>At least TS had a better Sentinal then that pos X3. Say goodbye to Sam after he meh-us's us with Avatar.<p>Termabikes are cool.

  • That movie was awful. Why couldn't they have gone with Skynet coming back from the future long after it's original war with man had been concluded downloaded into a new Terminator carrying John's cloned heart. It then gives the current Skynet the ability to have FUCKING BLUE LASER BEAMS and Time Travel along with saving John Connor on that medical contraption in it's old fortress rather than some cot in the middle of Lancaster California, while the Past Skynet watches in dumb-foundery. Throw in the some retarded twist forcing John Conner to consider the decision in sending all the Terminators back trying kill his past self along with his protectors to save that Future. Then he gets a CGI Arnold as a pet and we got Terminator 5 and 6 to look forward to. TA-DA a fucking movie trilogy instead of it all being sold to Dubai.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:55 p.m. CST

    WickedJester....

    by Damned if I can login

    Hate to say it bro, but your 3rd attempt can be grouped with the first two. The contractions should not have been used...<p>you're = you are<p>it's = it is<p>Although my track record of proofreading speaks for itself...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:57 p.m. CST

    ...the conversation.

    by OnO

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:58 p.m. CST

    I love the rigourous takedowns applied to SALVATION...

    by BurnHollywood

    ...Some of them applied by staunch defenders of STAR TREK ("Mr. Spock I presume?") and AVATAR ("Let's use fuel that costs trillions of dollars PER GRAM to acquire rocks that cost millions of dollars PER KILOGRAM!").<p> Movie was 'salright. Definitely better in tone than TERMINATOR 3 and it's "nudge, nudge, wink, wink" jokey bullshit.<p> As with Abrams and Cameron, McG needs to run his stories through, I dunno, a REAL SF writer maybe.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 3:58 p.m. CST

    OnO

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    You just blew my mind. And not in a good way.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4 p.m. CST

    Was this movie affected by the Writers Strike?

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    And have we finally seen the last effects of that terrible period in holywood? T4, Wolverine, TF2, even Star Trek were hurt by poor plotting.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:04 p.m. CST

    In fairness to McG

    by Rob0729

    Christian Bale probably fucked up this movie as much as him. Bale was originally approached to play the Marcus character, but Bale wanted to play John Connor and had Chris Nolan's brother beef up the Connor role. That probably fucked up the script as much as McG fucked up the movie. A lot of the Connor scenes do seem tacked on and unneccessary.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:04 p.m. CST

    Anybody who thinks T3 is worst then T4...

    by AsimovLives

    ... is just nuts. I can sympathise if you went on watching T3 already hating it, because that was my disposition too when i went to watch it kicking ans creaming. But something happened, i was sold 15 minutes in. While it's hardly of the same caliber of the Cameron's movie,s it's a valiant effort, adn clearly one could see the filmmaker was makign it out of devotion and love for the material mroe then just a mere paycheck. Which is all that Terminator 4 feels like, a whole paycheck job from a director too desperate to make a franchise starter and forgot to make a movie proper. And for the paycheck. T3 at least looked like a real movie that belongs to the Terminator fracnhise, T4 looks like something the cat brough in.<br><br>Still, all said and done, and despiste all the shit said at it (and rightly so), there's worst movies made this year which makes T4 not look so bad in comparison, and i finally saw them: Transformers 2 and 2012. Fortunatly, and unlike for T4, i didn't payed to watch them. And i still wanted my money back.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:04 p.m. CST

    stupid fuckin trash.

    by future help

    worse of the franchise. made me angry how much it shit on the originals.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:07 p.m. CST

    What a new director should do

    by Rob0729

    Totally ignore T3 and T4 and state it right off the bat. What we need is to see the relationship of Connor and Kyle Reese. We need to see John's struggle of trying to prepare Kyle to be a warrior and ultimately being prepared for his suicide mission to go back in time. Seeing Connor's struggle to deal with the fact that he is training his father to die so he can be born is what can make any more sequels remotely interesting. I think that is what McG failed to realize by making this story more about Marcus and now pitching sequels that ditch the whole sending Kyle back in time all together.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:08 p.m. CST

    hate it

    by ciroslive

    Terminator 3 wasnt the greatest but it was fun. Salvation was just dark depressing and dull. The action was alright but it was a waste of everyone involved.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:12 p.m. CST

    The problem is not Bale as Connor

    by AsimovLives

    In principle, Bale as Conner is heavensend. The problem was the assclown they chosed to be the director. This guy barely had the minerals to shoot a silly girl-power action-comedy, which completly coasted on he charms of the 3 leading ladies, Grispin Glover's deranged charisma and Demi Moore's 40s hotness. Given him a more serious movie to tackle, like the Terminator saga, which, for all the funny moments is a pretty dour and depressing series of movies, and al he could do was to try to compete with Michael Bay on the big robots detartment. That's the extent of McG's vision for the Terminator saga, to rip off one of Michael Bay's worst movie.<br><br>Bale as Connor in the hands of a really good director could had gone places. It would had been mana from Cinema Heaven. But they hired this assclown of a "director". T4 was doomed the moment McG was hired as director. And if the movie doesn't prove that to you, you are fucking insane!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:12 p.m. CST

    Next Terminator...

    by andrew coleman

    Needs to be rated R and actually have warfare in it. Simple as that. TS didn't feel like a war movie and that's what it should have been. It also was filled with plot holes that didn't have to be there. Is it just me or does it seem like these guys go out of there way to make bad movies. It's real fucking simple, make it a war movie, make it R you don't need twists or anything like that the story has already been made for you. How the fuck did you screw it up so bad? Oh well next time maybe you guys can wake up and do it right.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:13 p.m. CST

    I hated T3 and T4 about evenly actually

    by Rob0729

    T3 at least redeemed itself at the end with a strong ending. It was still a horrible parody of T2 with arguably the best actor who has played John Connor doing the worst performance of John Connor. Yes, I think Nick Stahl is a better actor than Christian Bale, but you wouldn't know it based on their John Connor portrayals.<br><br> Granted the best performance of John Connor is the guy who plays future post defeating Skynet version of John Connor from T2 played by Michael Edwards and he has no lines.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:16 p.m. CST

    Terminator Salvation was okay

    by HagCeli

    Way better than T3, for sure.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:16 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Rob0729

    My point was not that Bale is a bad actor or that he couldn't have done a better job with a more competent director. My point is he had Jonathan Nolan fuck the script even worse than it was to beef up the John Connor role. In fact, I think he and the movie would have been far better if he just took the Marcus role and didn't fuck with the script. The script was horrible and part of it was random useless scenes for John Connor.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:16 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by BurnHollywood

    T3 was a retread of T2, with a new Terminator (the T-X) that was actually inferior to the T-1000, which was plainly Cameron's ultimate model (even the "T-1000000" from his 3D ride was just a scaled up T-1000). It's only value (if you can call it that) was in kicking the can down the road for the franchise, by having Judgment Day take place anyway...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:17 p.m. CST

    JacksBloatedPayroll. Wait I gotta arm chair directoral

    by OnO

    Don't get me started with TF2. How hard would have had been to just focus on say the Constructicons led by the Fallen as a group of Minors strandedon earth trying to save Cybertron rather all those moronic 13 Primes and robot heaven horse crap. After Optimus Prime beats down the lead Constructicon in the opening sequence where it escapes by say a SPACE BRIDGE which acts as a plot device to build up the new villains mystique. It would have been in the Fallen's interest to resurrect Megatron along with the Tank and Helicopter robots to defeat the Autobots at the forest and pyramid battle. I hated this years summer movies. Just pay the good writers and editors what they want next time HOLLYWOOD.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:17 p.m. CST

    Why do (some) people hate TS?

    by marineboy

    T4/TS whatever really wasn't that bad - and simply p*sses all over Transformers2 which, let's face it, was the biggest Hollywood turd of recent years... (despite making stupid money...sadly...f*cking teens)

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:18 p.m. CST

    ciroslive, the problem is not the dark and depressing

    by AsimovLives

    In fact, the movei WASN'T dark and depressing enough. McG got scared, like a little pussy, from those alements that do maketh the Terminator series what they are. There's mroe darkness in the short segments that depict the future word in the first 3 terminator mvoies then the whole fucking T4. In fac,t if T4 has a major problem, is how sunny it all is. That's the look of the world that suffered total nuclear armageddon? Bullshit!! This rebels, they were extremely well equiped!! Where they got all that equipment and vehicles? All those helis and airplanes? A fucking nucelar submarine?? Where they get all the fuel to power the helis and aircrafts? And all that nice imaculate combat gear? Give me a fucking break!! T4 had a problem, but dark and depressing was not some of that because it hadn't enough of those to be a proper Terminator story. In T4, the armageddon never looked a nicer place.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:18 p.m. CST

    DEATHLY HALLOWS TEASER AND TRAILER LINK

    by ZombieHeathLedger

    http://tinyurl.com/yb6ujal

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:19 p.m. CST

    Rob0729

    by AsimovLives

    If you ask me, the problem is not that the role was expanded, but that the script was so bad to begin with that there was no way to SALVAGE it, no matter how talented Nolan and Bale are.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:20 p.m. CST

    and the fucking director didn't helped.

    by AsimovLives

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:20 p.m. CST

    marineboy

    by Rob0729

    Transformers 2 sucked royally, but Transformers is not exactly a classic sci fi movie like Terminator or Terminator 2 are. I didn't really care for the first Transformer movie so I don't care how bad Bay fucked up the sequel. <br><br> In the first post Judgment Day Terminator, people wanted something that would at least be decent enough continuation of the first two.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:20 p.m. CST

    I dont hate Terminator Salvation

    by Shaner Jedi

    But I don't love it or even really like it either.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:21 p.m. CST

    T:Sal: Mediocre Action Movie, Terrible Terminator Movie

    by Crow3711

    The tracking shot after the nuke...awesome. A few other scenes..pretty sweet. Most of everything else...drab, lifeless, and worst of all pointless. A pointless story to tell in the context of the Terminator franchise. Everything that happened meant nothing in the larger scheme of things. I didn't despise watching it, but it wasn't a good movie.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:21 p.m. CST

    BurnHollywood

    by AsimovLives

    T2 is a retreead to The Terminator. So fucking what? If you are retreading, at least do it with some elegance. T2 did that in spades, and T3 handled it well. T4, i don't know what the fuck that shit was supposed to be. Mad Max with evil robots? Give me a fucking break!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:23 p.m. CST

    One of my favorite parts of T4:

    by KillDozer

    John Connor's entire unit falls for a trap and is completely wiped out at the beginning of the movie and when he finally gets to the command submarine the guys in charge give him an important new mission because his unit is the best!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:23 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Rob0729

    The problem was, they made the script worse because the original script was a story about Marcus and what they did looks like they just tacked on a lot of useless scenes with Connor and gave Connor a lot of Marcus' action. It just fucked up the mess even more. <br><br> Nolan should have rewrote the whole script all together if he was going to fuck with it. To just beef up the Connor role was the wrong way to go. It just made a bad idea even worse.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:24 p.m. CST

    Another proof of McG's lameness

    by AsimovLives

    Seems to this assclown, the futher dark image for a global apocalypse he can think of is a cleaner version of Mad Max 2. This is his great vision for the Treminator fracnhise, as a Mad Max but with the protagonists going around in a lot of still operational aircrafts? I piss on his vision, you know? I piss on it. This is Terminator: The Early Years? More like The Clown Years. Terminator 4: The Nice Apocalypse.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:24 p.m. CST

    T-3 was the worst

    by YoyodynePropulsionSystems

    Salvation came up waaaay short, but T3 is almost unwatchable. From Arnold's funny glasses, to Nick Stahl's horrid rendition of John Conner, I can barely watch it. Salvation reminds me of what the characters might be doing during the days in between when actual movie footage goes on...like it should have been a comic run in between the real movies. I'm all for more terminator, but McG had his chance and should not try again.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:25 p.m. CST

    And I thought T3...

    by KillDozer

    was pretty enjoyable. The sunglasses/talk to the hand business didn't bug me cause I thought it was just poking fun at the 2nd movie (Hasta La Vista, baby) and the remote-controlled cars didn't bug me cause it resulted in a pretty fun car chase. <p>Also, the ending was great.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:25 p.m. CST

    ganda1f...

    by DarthCorleone

    Yeah, I agree the majority of those missteps are in act three. However, Reese's kidnapping happened in act two, the terminators in general were snatching up prisoners ("terminators" taking prisoners?!?) very early in the film, and - I believe, although I have no desire to revisit the film to confirm it - that a terminator tosses Connor in that very first action sequence that opens the future story. But, yeah, you're right, neither are good movies. I just think the third is infinitely more faithful to the spirit of the narrative in the first two films, regardless of what point the specific flaws lost you.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:26 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by BurnHollywood

    "In fact, the movie WASN'T dark and depressing enough."<p> You may want to follow up with my comments on the AVATAR Weaver TB (had no idea there would be a SALVATION TB today)...I went into some detail as to why I thought SALVATION was a logical "middle period" film taking place between Judgment Day and the T1/T2 "Future War" scenario where Skynet is fully on its game.<p> What's nice is, McG or not, such a movie could still be made without another of those tedious Hollywood "reboots" happening. The plot of SALVATION doesn't obstruct that scenario.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:27 p.m. CST

    "A fucking nucelar submarine???"

    by Rob0729

    I have a feeling that might have been a Jonathan Nolan addition. It is one of the unneccessary tacked on Connor scenes I was talking about. It really seems that that was added when Bale took the Connor role and they needed to give him something to do.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:28 p.m. CST

    Rob0729

    by AsimovLives

    How to unfuck something that was already fucked? I doubt Nolan could had re-writen the script, on account they were already filming when he was hired. In such conditions, Nolan could only patch things up. and frankly, i don't see neither Nolan nor Bale's involvement as part of the problem of the fucking movie. Maybe if the fucking director had knew what he should had done, and maybe if he had detected way before that connor should had beenthe lead and not some marginalc haracter that will not return again, then maybe if he knew what he was doing, and had detected that story problem, instead of the movie's star, then maybe this shit would had gone better, don't you think? bt then again, he's McG, hardly the miracle worker, is he?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:29 p.m. CST

    KillDozer

    by BurnHollywood

    You missed the part where the doomed commander of that mission reminds Conner that he's not in charge.<p> Try again.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:30 p.m. CST

    part 5 needs FAT TERMINATORS

    by turketron_2

    You heard me. Their extra fat can be used to house extra weapons if time travel is involved...<p> Oh, and Salvation was just... mediocre.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:32 p.m. CST

    BurnHollywood

    by AsimovLives

    The future in Terminator 4 SHOULD EVENBE DARKER, then the future shown in the other Terminator movies, because it was years before, and thus, many years little after the nuclear holocaut. As such, the Earth would be even worst, not looking chipper. It should be something out of THE ROAD, only worst. McG, with his vision of Earth so soon after the apocalypse, is something out of MARY POPPINS. This fucker can't imagine anythign darker then a nicer mellow version of the future as if a nice version of Mad Max. This fucker can't imagine anything even sesembling a nuclear wasteland that doens't look like something seen from a few minutes mile drive from LA.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:34 p.m. CST

    turketron_2

    by AsimovLives

    Mediocre? You're too kind to it. Try calling it "shit" instead.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:37 p.m. CST

    This year was a disgrace!!

    by AsimovLives

    Watchmen, Terminator 4, Wolverine, Star Trek In Name Only, Transformers 2 and 2012. What a fucking display!! What a fucking disgrace! What a calamity! What a fucking year!! Fuck, i can't remember any other fucking year with so many stupid, dumb, shitty movies like this one! God fucking shit, man! Unbelievable!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:38 p.m. CST

    Still haven't seen T4! Don't wanna know...

    by ToMonicker

    How fucking bad it is because I had already pegged it as crap when they pushed out a mutherfucking TOY line for kiddies, with goddamn Terminator Skull Helmets(admittedly, kinda cool, but for KIDS?) and shitty looking figures across the board; cheap and dumb. The PG13 straightjacket which is the WRONG direction for Terminator, hell, a good Terminator movie should be knocking on NC-17's door, not fucking PrettyGoodThirtweenie. At this point, I'd rather see the damn TV show come back, it was far more interesting... Get that sucker back on, on a cable network, and go freaking DARK. Have JC turn into a Terminatin' Collaborator seemingly TERMINATED himself by Sarah Connor and go from there. ;-) Oh, yeah, definitely have a douchey character named like, Mc D, Mc C, of even Mc T and have him royally eviscerated at some point. Alright, I'm done being silly. And yeah, I hated the robo car shit in T3, I don't care if it's somewhat plausible in the slightly near future, it sucked.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:40 p.m. CST

    McG's vision of the nuclear apocalypse is...

    by AsimovLives

    ... a world without herbal medicine shops and pay-TV.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:41 p.m. CST

    turketron_2: Damn right!

    by Royston Lodge

    Making Terminators that look like muscle-builders or supermodels isn't very inconspicuous. The next model of Terminator should be played by Ethan Suplee!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:42 p.m. CST

    there's two elements that go in tb'ers

    by Meadowe

    Virginity and time. Lots and lots of time

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:46 p.m. CST

    If you like T4, fine...

    by Neosamurai85

    but using Revenge of the Fallen's utter brain raping shittiness as a defense for why T4 is a good movie is bull shit. When it comes to sucking, that's like reasoning that having your guts pulled out your ass by a pool drain isn't so bad compared to falling into the event horizon of a fucking black hole. No, it's not so bad, but it dosn't make the pool drain suck any less. T4, TF2, "if the film stinks, just don't go!"

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:48 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by HarryCalder

    Speaking of The Road, I saw that this weekend, and per the "movies that make you cry" TB topic last week, I'm adding that one to my list. Feeling more up for Graveyard of the Fireflies after all, per your excellent suggestion.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:56 p.m. CST

    TERMINATION does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    I truly hope TERMINATOR: SALVATION is the first 'act' in a new Terminator Future War trilogy.<p> I want to see Bale rising through the ranks, from Special Ops squad leader as he is in this movie through to the leader of the resistance. I want to see the grimness of the situation and near-eradication of mankind. I want to see plasma rifles and hunter killers rolling across skulls.<p> What true sci-fi fan doesn't?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:56 p.m. CST

    Well, the guy's stupid enough to refer to himself as "McG"

    by Fa_Tass_DinoMolester

    And even if it was his name since he was a kid, ya know what...CHANGE IT! You're not a McDonald's meal, for Christ's sake! So, are we really taken aback at anything this kook has to say?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:58 p.m. CST

    Here's what you get from McG when asked to make a movie:

    by TedKordLives

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:58 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Pass directorial duties onto another if you like. Keep the 'look', keep Bale, keep the incredible fx and stunt team (who did a superb job - anyone who says different is a liar or hasn't seen the film) and make the next part in the trilogy.<p> I'll be there.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 4:58 p.m. CST

    Neosamurai85, couldn't have said it better

    by MattmanReturns

    Thank you. Just because Salvation is a less shitty film than Transformers 2 doesn't mean it's not a shitty film.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5 p.m. CST

    Agree with cobrai kai

    by Adelai Niska

    they STILL haven't given us the REAL future war with skulls everywhere and plasma guns. I hated Salvation, but want more future stuff. <p> I would personally say T3 is better than TS if only because it has Arnold and restored the whole timeline so that Judgement Day happens. At the end of T2 there was a kind of grandfather paradox where a machine had gone back and killed skynet, so at least T3 had SOME sort of impact on the franchise. Salvation basically explained Conner's scar and told us to wait another 11 years before 2029.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:02 p.m. CST

    I think there's more going on here...

    by Rakafraker

    ...than just not liking the film.<p>I think that many of you just don't like that McGuinty calls himself McG (I thought he was African-American too), and that Arnold wasn't in T:S, rather than just the fact that the film was less-than-stellar. I was hoping for more too, but at least it was better than T3 and TF2, IMHO.<p>I work in film as well, and I see the extreme hard work that goes into making a film (yes, even shitty ones), and it's unfair to heap things like how DVDs are produced and merchandising on the director.<p>I'm not going to apologize for McGuinty, but will defend what a director (especially of a major film) has to go through to even have a film made in the first place.<p>It wouldn't kill you know-it-alls to find out how movies get made and who's job it is to do what before you spout your crap.<p>All said, I think McGuinty deserves another crack at it. I think he might have learned his lesson, plus I know he has some great ideas that could work (not that I'm Akiv-um-JettL).<p>So, get off yer asses and find out what it really takes to make a film, then you can bitch intelligently.<p>Like we used to do on this site.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:02 p.m. CST

    It wasn't that bad

    by Toonol

    It just wasn't good. It was about on par with T3... and better than a lot of other recent blockbusters. Its mediocrity is just highlighted by how it pales in comparison to T1 and T2.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:03 p.m. CST

    Ditched Idea

    by FloobyNooby

    Wasn't there a version of the script where Connor died and they put his skin on a Terminator? Amazing idea! Why'd they drop it? Watch the future war scenes in T2, All he needs is a red glow behind his eyes.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:03 p.m. CST

    COCAINE'S A HELL OF A DRUG...

    by SeXX ED

    ... as evidenced by this delusional fucking anti-artist. McG and Ratner should be fucking shot dead.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:03 p.m. CST

    Wasn'

    by Charlie_Allnut

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:03 p.m. CST

    HarryCalder

    by AsimovLives

    What blows my mind about GRAVEYARD OF FIREFLIES is that the movie was made in mind for a children audience. Which begs the question that the japanese kids must be one emotionally though motherfuckers. Or, as i think it's the cas,e Japanese believes that sotries and movies should, mostly, be cathartic more then the escapist stuff we in the west prefer.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:04 p.m. CST

    sotries = stories

    by AsimovLives

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:04 p.m. CST

    Enough with the Terminator franchise, let it die

    by barnaby jones

    Then let some newbie remake it 20 -30 years time.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:05 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Repost attack...<p> Why do people say TERMINATOR SALVATION didn't advance the series?<p> T1, T2, and T3 all warned us that Judgement Day was coming, and all presented identical plots of 'protectee bonding with a protector whilst pursued by villain'. Hmmm, perhaps not so much advancing the plot as recycling it, but okay...<p> TERMINATOR SALVATION shows us the future. It shows the resistance struggling against Skynet. Developing and testing a new weapon. It shows how Skynet treats the human survivors and how their masterplan is unfolding. A whole arsenal of new machines. How the fuck is that NOT advancement????

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:06 p.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    Treu SF-fans woud had prefered that the start of that supposed trilogy would had been any gfucking good, instead of the travesty we got. No good thing can came out for such bad foundations. Name one good fracnhise/saga that started with a really bad movie.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:06 p.m. CST

    Wasn't terrible but...

    by Charlie_Allnut

    Was more of a mediocre sci fi movie with great action scenes...it didn't feel related to the other movies - it really felt like it was taking place in a different universe. If you didn't call it a Terminator movie it would have gone down easier. I still can't get over how well equipped and clean the resistance was... I'm good with no more of these being made - give me some ORIGINAL sci fi action!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:07 p.m. CST

    Dead, Rehashed, Real Soon

    by FloobyNooby

    20 - 30 years? It'll be nowhere near that long, going on current trends.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:07 p.m. CST

    T:S vs TROTF

    by Adelai Niska

    I know that Transformers 2 was WAY worse than Terminator 4, but honestly, TS was more of a let down. When Michael Bay makes a shitty, racially insensitive movie with no characters who matter, so what? When Christian Bale and Micheal Ironside make a hollow, pointless Terminator future war movie it feels like a huge opportunity was lost.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:08 p.m. CST

    Why it advanced nothing...

    by Adelai Niska

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:09 p.m. CST

    Rakafraker, he could call himself "McShit" for all I care

    by MattmanReturns

    His movies suck. His self-given nickname just happens to be a product of his childlike mind.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:13 p.m. CST

    Why it advanced nothing...

    by Adelai Niska

    (like my accidental post advanced nothing) <p> We all know that John Conner lives until 2029. He smashes Skynet's main forces and almost wins the war, and lives long enough to send Kyle Reese back in time and reprogram a couple of Arnold models. WE KNOW THIS ALREADY. <p> a real future war movie should have dealt with the whole Reese thing and then, after reese goes back, the audience doesn't know what will happen next. Only after JC does his predestined duties will the movies have tension because we don't if he will live or not. Doing a movie set in 2018 is pointless because there is no tension. Reese will live. Conner will live. Machines will not be vanquished. The only way the movie could have worked is through a very-well-thought out analysis of how this world works and lives. We didn't get that. We got a cool chase, a cool CGI Arnold, and not much else.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:13 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Rakafraker, at last someone speaking with a modicum of knowledge and intelligence.<p> It takes the blood, sweat and tears of *hundreds* of individuals to make a movie on this scale.<p> A lot of people did great work on this movie. Including the late great Stan Winston. A true legend. Including Michael Ironside. Including Christian Bale, Helena Bonham Carter, and hundreds of others of respected artisans.<p> From the trolling going on at AICN and led by Harry you'd think the film was the work of one man and one man alone. Simply not true.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:15 p.m. CST

    the movie could've been waaaaay better, the things I h8d most

    by Meadowe

    Were the little girl and the harvester (or should I say the harvester's head). It's like he was trying to hard to make this with Christopher Nolan's Batman in mind. He kept saying how we should look @ this as Batman Begins, he tried to say Jonathan Nolan from The Dark Knight was on board, he got Christian bale, heq, he even gave him a utility belt in the form of a little mute mulatto looking girl. "Well now that I've got Christian bale who kiqed butt in begins and will prolly do so in The Dark Knight, what other bat element can I get? I know! If I gave him a utility belt that would be too much of a ripoff, so instead ill have a mulatto lookin little girl with a big untamed afro just showing up @ all the right moments with all the tools they need to survive! Perfeqt!" That said, I was very excited by the trailer (I downloaded it and watch it along with Jennifer's body on our ps3). Of course the fliq didn't live up to the hype. It showed so much promise, I seriously hope jim cam buys the rights so he can make a future war movie ending with John Connor sending Kyle Reese back. That's the only thing that'll make sense, but that's just wishful thinking admittedly.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:18 p.m. CST

    Internet Hate is Silly

    by bueno_bob

    I waited until T:S was in the budget theater based on reading a bunch of internet hate here. Thus, I rationalized that by spending $2.00 on a ticket, I couldn't be hurt much. I enjoyed it much more than T2 or T3. Much more engaging and the lack of Arnold was exactly what Terminator desperately needed as a franchise, in my opinion. And I had a great time. And I thought the story was kinda different, but still cool. And I thought Chris Bale did a great job, as did Sam Worthington. It was a fine movie and I look forward to seeing more.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:18 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    "No good thing can came out for such bad foundations. Name one good fracnhise/saga that started with a really bad movie."<p> Asimov, well that's an easy one which you of all people should know. STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:19 p.m. CST

    I had an open mind

    by SmokingRobot

    But this guy has proved himself to be an egotistical no-talent hack. Repeatedly.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:22 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    bueno_bob, well said. Although I personally think T2 was better than TS, even though T2's storyline was a retread of T1.<p> Taken on its own merit SALVATION was a good serious-minded sci fi action flick though.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:24 p.m. CST

    District 9 was one of best of this year!

    by BlackBriar

    Mcg is such a Douche! I hear Sony is going to buy The Franchise. 1st step change the director!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:30 p.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by bueno_bob

    Cheers, man. Good to know that not everybody is eager to jump on the "This sucks/That sucks/You suck/He sucks/She sucks/etc sucks" mentality that seems to permeate this place.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:30 p.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by bueno_bob

    Cheers, man. Good to know that not everybody is eager to jump on the "This sucks/That sucks/You suck/He sucks/She sucks/etc sucks" mentality that seems to permeate this place.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:31 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by HarryCalder

    Yeah, for sure, the Japanese, a society that has lived through a nuclear attack, have turned out far differently than we have... (tying it all back to Terminator...) Maybe that's what's made much of their "children's" entertainment more meaningful than a lot of shit passed off as "adult" to us.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:32 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    "You Salvation defenders..." by DarthCorleone Dec 7th, 2009 03:23:46 PM <p> "...have seen the first two films, right? You are aware that the movie is supposed to include ruthless, relentless robots that actually terminate human beings, right?" <p> Um... that's exactly what TS did include.<p> And I have seen the first two films, many times. Enough to know that the second one features a 'ruthless' Terminator that quips at the audience "I need a vacation" and gives a thumbs up as it's lowered into lava.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:33 p.m. CST

    there still *some* potential left

    by Meadowe

    Like I said, we haven't really seen (on film, idk about tscc) John Connor's relationship to Kyle Reese. Obviously Reese became a badazz in his own right, but I'd like to see John Connor struggling whether or not to send him on certain missions. Also attempting to bond with him. Reese looking up to John as this warrior and thinking that John thinks of him as just a protege, but on the flip side John being impressed with Reese's skills and already sees the warrior he will become. And maybe a scene where Reese knows he's been seleqted to go back because he knows he's John Connor's father? Or maybe not; I do like the scenes in t1 where Reese speaks fondly of John as a comrade and leader and *seemingly* oblivious that John Connor is his son.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:36 p.m. CST

    McG SUCKS COCK BY CHOICE!

    by Force_McCockin

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:38 p.m. CST

    rakafraker...

    by mrgreentheplant

    i'm sure peter jackson, alfonso cuaron, christopher nolan, katherine bigelow, and sam raimi worked hard to get their big budget films made. i'm sure movies like spider-man 2, harry potter 3, and the dark knight faced tremendous pressure from their audiences and studios. i'm sure hundreds or thousands of people had to be mobilized to make successful films in those franchises too. you're right, it's hard work to get a movie made at all, especially one that takes years and hundreds of thousands of dollars. douchey nicknames aside, the bottom line is that if McG had spent a little more time working on the story and a little less on his pissing contest with michael bay, he could've, and should've, made a better film. fighting valiently to get WB to keep in his tits shots instead of characterization is what separates McG from the nolans and cuarons of the world. we can't keep crediting filmmakers just for making movies. that's their job. we'd cut McG a little more slack if he was good at his job. the cheap shots at his name are used, i believe, out of spite that someone could trash a franchise that was seminal for many of us growing up. that's my take, at least.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:44 p.m. CST

    T4 was fun, not amazing

    by Player01

    You know, it gave me 2 hours of entertainment at the movies. That's enough for me. I don't need every single move to be a life changing event.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:44 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Meadowe, yes totally agree. Take the two lead dynamic of TS and apply it to the second act of the trilogy.<p> Only this time the two leads are Connor and Reese - father and son - only Connor the son is the older and superior. What an interesting dynamic that would be. One never seen before.<p> In the right hands there is still SO MUCH potential in this future war trilogy.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:47 p.m. CST

    "I need a vacation..."

    by HarryCalder

    CobraKai - As much as I LOVE T2, I must admit, those two moments - and only those two - totally blow. The only minor irritants in an otherwise almost perfect action movie.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:50 p.m. CST

    Actually the the team wipeout...

    by Player01

    ...at the beginning was pretty good. The whole shot with the helicopter going up... then coming down was quite entertaining.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:50 p.m. CST

    How old will Connor be this time?

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Will anyone care?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:53 p.m. CST

    T5

    by Jared

    Isn't Neill Blomkamp the obvious person to direct. What am I missing?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:56 p.m. CST

    Need R rating, also give Arnie back his penis

    by Nem_Wan

    I finally watched T4 on iTunes and CG Arnie, who was otherwise pretty convincing, had no penis, like a Ken doll. Did the Governator sign off on that goofiness?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:56 p.m. CST

    McG....

    by Miles_Teg

    Is a fucking genius. No one could have made me love T3 more than he did by making Terminator Salvation.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 5:58 p.m. CST

    McG is welcome to the tired Terminator 'franchise'

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave

    Papa's got a brand new bag.<p>By 'Papa', I mean James Cameron (the hardest working man in showbusiness), and by 'Bag', I mean the Avatar universe.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6 p.m. CST

    You're all sheep...

    by Astronomnz

    I don't give a fuck what any of you kids say. That opening battle with the chopper in the satellite dish field, on the big screen, was amazing. Anyone who denies this doesn't deserve to watch films.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6 p.m. CST

    I so hope this franchise continues...

    by darthwaz1

    Seriously, they could hire better writers, director and what not- but if there's not a continuation of this than it's a REMAKE OF THE FIRST MOVIE!! I hope fans realize this and stop bashing T4 so hard- no matter how many problems you have with the movie it's lightyears better than a remake of part one would be! wake the fuck up!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:03 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Tenenbaum - please let that come to pass.<p> Nem_Wan, they digitally lazer scanned every last inch of the Governator to ensure fidelity. Apparently that's just how he is. Never take steroids kids.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:05 p.m. CST

    The future depicted in T-Salvation is highly inaccurate

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave

    Writers didn't do their homework, and being set in 2018 doesn't cut it. The skies should be darkened, even during daylight, due to nuclaer fallout and dust covering the sun. There should be numerous skulls littering the ground. These were not the consequences of a coming war and extermination, but Judgment Day itself. T-800's should not exist in 2018 - Reese in T1, "These are new" - only shoehorned in to provide an Arnold cameo. And why exactly is Worthington's model- some part human/cyborg hybrid - seemingly more advanced than far later T models? Absolute crap, and you could tell the nitwits who wrote, produced, and directed, just made it up as they went along.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:07 p.m. CST

    Astronomnz

    by lockesbrokenleg

    I thought the action in TS was really, really, good. At least you could SEE the action, as opposed to Transformers where it looks like Conan O Brien is the camera operator.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:08 p.m. CST

    Terminator Salvation

    by thebastard

    Honestly, I had avoided watching this movie for a while despite wanting to see a Terminator movie on the big screen. I just watched it last night and I was surprised and impressed, I was keeping my expectations low thinking of T3. Despite a few things, I thought were a little forced, this has my seal of approval as a Terminator sequel.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:09 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    "That opening battle with the chopper in the satellite dish field, on the big screen, was amazing. Anyone who denies this doesn't deserve to watch films." Astronomnz<p> Amen, brother. McG may have said a gaffe about 'picture and sound' but fuck me, if the visuals and sound fx in that one sequence aren't ASTOUNDING.<p> Makes me wonder if any of the 'flaming turd' haters actually saw the film or if they're just going on Harry's word?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:09 p.m. CST

    terminator rights for auction

    by thebastard

    I heard Joss Whedon has put down the only bid for the Terminator rights. I wonder what he'd do with them...

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:15 p.m. CST

    KillDozer

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    "John Connor's entire unit falls for a trap and is completely wiped out at the beginning of the movie and when he finally gets to the command submarine the guys in charge give him an important new mission because his unit is the best! <p> Hahahahah you made my day.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:16 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Repost attack pt.2<p> Okay, im loathe to do this because every movie requires some 'suspension of disbelief' but here's a cut and paste of the Terminator wiki answers.<p> *DONT READ IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE FILM THERE ARE SPOILERS*<p> Q: How is Skynet aware of past attempts by it to kill John Connor? Did the Series T-X in Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines somehow provide advance knowledge of the future to Skynet? <p> A: It is possible that the T-X supplied this information to Skynet during its mission; however, as seen in the film, Skynet had access to the internet and it is possible it had uncovered evidence of the attempted termination of Sarah Connor and the attempted termination of John Connor. <p> Q: Where was Marcus Wright "stored" after his execution? <p> A: He was present in the Skynet VLA that was destroyed at the beginning of the movie. He is briefly shown lying on a gurney as John and his team pass by. If his flesh was sufficiently supplied with nutrients, it is entirely possible he was there the whole 15 years. <p> Q: Does the advanced timeline indicate that Skynet used additional time traveling missions outside of established canon in order to advance its own development? <p> A: It is possible; however, it's just as likely that the T-X simply uploaded data into Skynet while she was in the past to hasten the development of machines similar to what Serena Burns did when she was in the past helping with Skynet development in T2: Infiltrator.<p> Q: How "advanced" are the medical capabilities of the Resistance, considering they were able to successfully complete a heart transplant surgical procedure under "Third World" medical conditions? <p> A: Hot, dry environments are fairly sterile most commonly and impromptu transplants and major surgeries are performed quite frequently in desert environments without too many complications. We must also assume that the medics involved were most likely applying "First World" techniques as best they could, and that patients had a very strong will to live. <p> Q: If Skynet knows that in order for John Connor to be conceived Kyle Reese must travel back in time, why doesn't Skynet decide to not create Time Displacement Equipment? This would make it impossible for Kyle to impregnate Sarah Connor and thus John Connor would never exist. <p> A: There is still the possibility that the original John Connor was actually fathered by someone else prior to the first Kyle Reese time travel incident. See Predestination paradox. Also if Skynet doesn't send back the T-800 their advancement is significantly slowed due to the direct acquisition of terminator parts by Cyberdyne Systems as a result of the incursion to terminate Sarah Connor. <p> Q:How does Skynet know who Kyle Reese is in the first place? If it knew he was John Connor's father, couldn't Skynet just kill Kyle Reese when he was captured? <p> A: Killing Kyle would likely only create another timeline instead of wiping out the existence of John Connor immediately. Also, judging from the fact that the T-600 takes Kyle to the experiment hall, Skynet might want to kill Kyle by using him as a guinea pig. In another words, "Killing two birds with one stone" by killing the father of its enemy and by getting valuable data related to human anatomy. <p> Q: How come the molten steel melted the T-800 in the film Terminator 2: Judgment Day, but it doesn't in Terminator Salvation"?<p> A1: It is possible that the molten steel did not have enough time to act on the endoskeleton (which has also been suggested by McG); though it is also possible there wasn't enough molten steel to do any damage. <p> Q: Why do the T-600s only have rubber skin on their faces, as opposed to their entire body? And why are they dressed in rags which clearly expose their cybernetic components? Wouldn't it be obvious to Skynet that such a careless disguise would never fool a human? <p> A: It can be simply due to the weathering, which causes the rubber skin or clothes wear out or possibly battle damage. <p> Q How come the machines attacked Marcus before he met Blair, but when he was in Skynet Central, nobody attacked him? <p> A1: Skynet had, most likely, cut his connection in order to assist with his infiltration. It is possible that his connection to the artificial intelligence wasn't reestablished until after he had been discovered as a machine or until he had been scanned at Skynet Central's perimeter. <p>

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:17 p.m. CST

    The Nice Apocalypse

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    Nice one Asimov

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:17 p.m. CST

    The next one Bale should fight his Mom

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    Who is revealed to be the personification of Skynet!!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:18 p.m. CST

    Proman1984

    by MikeTheSpike

    I like your style.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:21 p.m. CST

    McG sucked the epicness from the battle scenes.

    by Onin Solstice

    McG's TS is so lame and boring compared what Cameron had in mind. I mean seriously the 3 minutes of flashback scenes in T1-2 were supremely more exciting and epic than McG's 90 minute debacle.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:26 p.m. CST

    T3's car chase by itself was more satisfying

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    than all of TS.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:28 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Onin, I'd have been fascinated to see James Cameron future war Terminator movie but James Cameron didn't want to do it. Simple as that.<p> He wanted to make a cartoon/live action 3D extravaganza for half a billion dollars.<p> Whether he was a fool or a genius... Well - we will find out in a couple of weeks I guess.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:29 p.m. CST

    T1's future war scenes

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    Are unparalleled in terms of how bleak they are, not even T2's future war portions which already have a videogamish tinge to them are like that. The rawness, Orwellian, also using every pre-CGI special effect and blending them together into a seamless thing is far better than CGI porn.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:33 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    One day CGI porn might give me photoreal footage of my dick between Monica Belluci and Salma Hayek's tits.<p> We need MORE investment in CGI porn godammit!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:36 p.m. CST

    OnO

    by JacksBloatedPayroll

    I need a rape kit for my mind after that one.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:39 p.m. CST

    Merrick is a Fucking Retard Vol. 46 Appendix 7

    by Tall_Boy66

    "the film's tepid-to-negative reception by audiences" which is, once again, Merrick speaking from no position of authority whatsoever and presenting his intellectually devoid opinion, which was possibly formed due to severe brain damage as a child, as fact.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:39 p.m. CST

    MehcG, Terminator: Borenation

    by Jaka

    That's all I got, really.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:39 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Rob0729

    Christian Bale was hired before production and part of his contract had him to have his own script doctor (Nolan) rewrite the script. This happened months before they even hired an actor to play Marcus (for the longest time it was supposed to Josh Brolin although they ended up hiring Sam Worthington after Brolin passed. Supposably he passed after he saw Nolan's rewrites and probably because he saw the part cut down. <br><br> I know it is sacrilidge to blame Bale or anyone name Nolan on this site for anything, but it seems pretty clear that the rewrites were half assed.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:42 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    I feel like this thread has turned me into the 'anti Asimov'.<p> Where he makes negative comments about a film that probably doesn't deserve such hate. I make positive comments about a film that probably doesn't deserve such love.<p> Better run before I get called goat fucker - je ne regrette rien!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:45 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives Cont

    by Rob0729

    What you might be thinking about with the rewrites during production was the fact that the ending was leaked on line (including this site) that Connor would die and that his skin would be grafted to Marcus' exoskeleton which forced Nolan and McG to rewrite the entire 3rd act.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:55 p.m. CST

    Sorry gang, TS sucked.

    by Kief_Ledger

    <p>From the bevy of plot holes to the little girl who was a walking satchel, the film was a mess. Admittedly, the chase was well done, but McG botched the ending with that bullshit of the roboterminator flying 50 feet in the air, tying around the ships's wing, and destroying it. Who thought that was a good idea? Bale also didn't do the film any favors with his over the top performance. Along with the dull subplot with Moon, I really find it hard to see how people can defend the film. McG doesn't deserve another shot; he should go back to making camp filled actioners that everyone takes with a grain of salt. It's clear through four movies that he simply can't put any weight behind his stories.</p> As far as who should take over is concerned, I'd love to see Cuaron get a shot, even though that is highly unlikely. Hell, even Leterrier could pull off a better job then McG

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:55 p.m. CST

    Re: mrgreentheplant

    by Neosamurai85

    Well put. I couldn't give a fig what McG called himself. (I mean, Christ, I call myself fucking Neosamurai85... doesn't exactly roll off the tongue.) Though rakafraker's point wasn't particularly aimed at me, let me clearify that when I said earlier that I hated everything but two acting performances (and in fairness some of the other supporting actors didn't do bad either), I meant that in many ways on the creative front. I meant the screenplay, the cinematographer, the director, the composer and yes, I didn't even like the set design (the trench warfare mise-en-scene of the original(s) evoked the technological shock of the first World War. T4 evoked... Transformers.) And even there I hold it against the director and producers, because it is their job to say something when it dosen't look right, to see short comings and fire asses, to find good asses in the first place, and to direct them--to tap into those asses to produce quality entertainment. So yes, there were good stunt men who worked hard, but they were not shot well doing their hard work. There were great carpenters and set builders, but they were asked to build sets without imagination. There were lots of great things that many people did, but they were not utilized well in my opinion, so when I say everything sucks or I hated everything, I mean how it looked and sounded, how McG showed it all, shot it all and edited it all, and accepted a sub-par script to do it with. I studied film in college. I've tried to make films and even made a few. I've worked on films too, running in between takes to add more blood. I've worked in theater too. I know how hard the people work whose names do not get plastered all over the title as "A ______ film," like it were some novel that they wrote all by themselves, and I don't hold them accountable for what some dumbass does with all their hard work. If a set piece falls over due to the carpenter's negligence, then I blame the carpenter. If the set cook give half the cast food poisoning, it's his fault too. If the grip dosen't blind an actor, I don't credit him or her with making the film good, but the key grip is a fool for not hiring him or her again, even if the actual film tanks.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 6:56 p.m. CST

    I did enjoy T4....

    by pdennett316

    It was decent, but I think I enjoyed it purely because I was expecting such a travesty that it couldn't possibly live down to my expectations. <p> That's not to say I think McG should direct again, or that there should be two other movies. Get Cameron back - however much it takes - and lets get the future war seen in 1 and 2 done right, leading up to the point when Connor sends back Reese. Could even do a brief epilogue to show his death at the hands of the Arnie-bot from T3, but ultimately Skynet falls. <p> I think we deserve to see it, 3 hours should do the trick. Oh, and fuck the Sarah Connor Chronicles....T3 happened, and it's ending was superb. Judgement Day has to happen, and it happened nicely in the 3rd. <p> Ranked from best to worst.....<p> 1,2,3 and 4.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7 p.m. CST

    one question: if Salvation takes place in LA

    by awepittance

    why do we never see any of the iconic shots that Cameron showed so many times in Terminator 1 or 2 with the cars all bombed in gridlock traffic with piles of human skulls? the landscape at best looked like a very half-assed version of Road Warrior/beyond thunderdome but resembled nothing of Cameron's vision. And don't tell me 'its because it took place 10 years earlier'. This landscape in T: salvation looks absolutely nothing like a post nuclear winter.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:01 p.m. CST

    All I'm saying is...

    by TedKordLives

    If your bad guy is gonna be an evil computer, it's GOT TO have an intelligent plan. A logical plan. Skynet's plan to lure its second most wanted by holding its FIRST most wanted is dumb. A Terminator factory with only one working Terminator in it is dumber. <P> T4 the movie has a lot in common with an actual Terminator: It's soulless and artificial.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:02 p.m. CST

    re: Rex Carsalot

    by awepittance

    " T3 at least fit, albeit awkwardly, in the established mythos - T4 looks like an entirely different genre tacked on, with some guy named "John Connor" moping around in a dirty, annoying future." couldn't have said it better myself. It was a very awkward sequel, but i kind of see it as the 'Army of Darkness' of the terminator franchise, lots of flaws but still fits within the confines of the unvierse. T salvation does not feel at all like it takes place in that sam universe for me, whether it be the misplaced Resident Evil 3 like aesthetics of the post apocalyptic landscape or Bale's atrocious line delivery. I can't blame him entirely though, the lines int he script he was asked to deliver seemed written by a middle school student.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:04 p.m. CST

    Tall_Boy66

    by MikeTheSpike

    Your name, too, is written in the pages of my good book.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:04 p.m. CST

    Man, you guys sound like "comic book guy"

    by sith_rising

    I thought it was ok. Not as good as 1 or 2, but better than 3.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:06 p.m. CST

    HA, HA, HA, HA, HA!!!

    by Mr. Nice Gaius

    Quote: "There's two elements that go into filmmaking. There's sound, and there's the picture.".<P>Gee, McG. Who knew!<P>I think we've got our latest AICN catchphrase-meme. Come on, somebody get it going.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:07 p.m. CST

    Blame the writers

    by Son of the Suns

    I recently rented T4 and thought it was generally entertaining. It looked great, the action was decently shot and it never dragged. The biggest problem I have is with the storytelling. Did the plot make any sense? I don't think the writers got it, at all. If Marcus can be programmed to lead Conner to Reese then they could have got him to shoot conner in the face at first chance. There's a massive failure in logic right there. Other issues, why give Skynet a face? Why humanise it? It's always been far scarier being something we can't see or understand. Don't the writers understand this? There was no real cliffhanger. I didn't even think it was clear whether skynet was dead or not. Weak writing.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:18 p.m. CST

    T4 was surprisingly decent.

    by Stifler's Mom

    SOOO much better than Transformers, GI Joe, Wolverine, and most of the other dreck that made money this summer. I know a LOT of people who saw it, most are reasonably intelligent, and most were pleasantly surprised. But for some reason, this site tries to suggest that Star Trek is the new Citizen Kane and T4 is a cinematic crime.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:21 p.m. CST

    lol sith rising

    by Jaka

    That's the only voice I can hear in my head while reading this talkback now. Damn you! lol

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:26 p.m. CST

    I don't blame Mcg, would you refuse that job?

    by awepittance

    we should start talking shit about who wrote it, i can get on board with that

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:27 p.m. CST

    There are two elements that go into comic book production:

    by TedKordLives

    There's the writing, and there's the drawing.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:28 p.m. CST

    There are two elements that go into cooking:

    by TedKordLives

    There's the food, and there's the stove.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:30 p.m. CST

    Terminator: Salvation

    by Caerdwyn

    TSAL (isn't that a brand of cookware?) was enjoyable, for me. I didn't get on my high horse and expect a T1 or T2 level of quality, because you won't get that without A) Cameron and B) a great script. T4 had neither. It was, thankfully, for the most part better than T3. Say what you will about McG, but he's making movies and he's not making tripe like Beverly Hills Chihuahua 2. And the BD Live commentary wasn't for film snobs, I'm sure the guy dumbed it down bigtime for the average 13 year old with their BluRay player.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:31 p.m. CST

    Dear McG:

    by TedKordLives

    There are two elements to getting the fuck out: There's your legs, and there's the fucking door. <P> Don't let it hit you on the way out.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:38 p.m. CST

    I'm not sure what to think

    by Larry Sellers

    The lighting was excellent. But I think it's best that the (canon?) franchise continue in some other form. DTV CGI films? If only they had made T4 right after T3 as they originally planned because most of T3 was a nice bridge from the "Fuck Fate" ending of T2 to the "Fate fucked us" ending of T3. T4 lacked a lot of things and I'm wondering if the franchise is even worth salvaging after that. It wasn't awful but it definitely could've been better had they gone beyond sounds and pictures.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:42 p.m. CST

    The Key Grip also did fine job...

    by Royston Lodge

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:45 p.m. CST

    There are two elements that go into being McG:

    by TheUmpireStrokesBach

    There's the gargantuan ego, and there's the total lack of anything resembling a soul.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:46 p.m. CST

    Finally saw Terminator: Salvation this week. My thoughts:

    by DVader

    McG is a GREAT director for hire. But his ideas are just flat out stupid. Seeing the movie, it really was not that bad. It had some very exciting parts, it made the Terminator a scary, relentless killing machine once again, and had they not RUINED it in the trailers, the surprise that Marcus was a machine would have been a fantastic twist. <p> But it was entirely too stupid that Skynet knew who Kyle Reese was. Couldn't he just have been an ordinary guy kidnapped by the machines, and Connor only finds out he's gone when he mentions to Marcus that he (the Terminators) killed his father Kyle Reese? That was just dumb using him as bait bc it MAKES NO SENSE. <p> Also, now that I've seen the movie, McG's original ending flat out SUCKS. The studio didn't use your idea, not bc its "too black" or "too bleak" (Connor dies, they take Connor's skin off and put it on Marcus' machine body, Marcus awakes and kills everyone). They didn't use your idea bc its just fucking stupid and makes no sense at all based on what we know of the series. <p> Also, your ideas for the sequel? Taking place in our present? Just dumb, man. You're a good director using other people's material, but limit your input man. Focus instead on more cool sequences like that helicopter crash. Leave the thinking to smarter storytellers.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:46 p.m. CST

    You guys know the writers of TS also wrote T3, right?

    by Kief_Ledger

    Everything kind of makes sense now, doesn't it?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:47 p.m. CST

    McG Avatared the Terminator franchise....

    by jaysin420

    with this shit movie.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:54 p.m. CST

    If he hadn't pussied out because of negative reaction...

    by Shermdawg

    ...to the leaked ending, we might've had something to look forward to. I'm not saying the blame should be placed soley on us for the film's quality, but we certainly are partly to blame. <br><br> If only something like that had happened during X3's production, when news of Scott and Chuck's death broke.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 7:59 p.m. CST

    Moon Bloodgood should be Bloody Awful.

    by lockesbrokenleg

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:09 p.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai...

    by DarthCorleone

    You don't like "I need a vacation" and the thumbs-up. Fair enough. I think they are appropriate comic relief for an extremely serious morality play. Terminator 2 still has about one thousand times the cold-bloodedness of Salvation. In the first two films, you can't let Arnold's original machine or Patrick's T-1000 within a foot of you, because it simply means instant death. Does that Terminator Wiki explain why terminators in Salvation suddenly resort to tossing people they are trying to kill instead of just killing them?<br><br>As for the possibility for a different father of John Connor, I'm just not buying it. The poetry of the first film and Kyle's relationship with Sarah is the paradox. They throw that out only at the cost of alienating me and other fans.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:11 p.m. CST

    McG forgot to add

    by Bellam

    FACE ACTING!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:11 p.m. CST

    T3 and X3

    by Jaka

    First, I must have missed something when I watched T3. Because I thought it was just a complete piece of crap from beginning to end. I'm willing to watch it again, though. <br><br>Shermdawg - I HONESTLY just didn't believe that they would off Chuck like that. I mean, I read about it. Sure. But my brain just went, "naaaaah. That can't be right/true." Most pointless movie death of the decade. Hah! A new category.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:14 p.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by BurnHollywood

    Good posts all. Glad somebody's trying to think for themselves on this movie instead of toeing the line.<p> I'm really amazed that a substantial number of posters still don't get a major part of the SALVATION timeline: THIS IS THE SECOND TIME AROUND! Post-time "loops", remember?!<p> So it's not a stretch of the imagination to see that Skynet was able to assess its past failures. Also not hard to figure out Kyle Reese's relationship to John Conner...go figure, he turns up in Los Angeles exactly nine months before Conner is born and his arrest and interrogation are part of the LAPD's records. There's also any information Sarah might have leaked while she was institutionalized.<p> As it is, SALVATION introduced one major plot change...the T-800 is substantially tougher this time around. It took four direct grenade hits to the single pipe bomb that destroyed the original...if it goes back to '84 in *this* timeline, neither Kyle nor Sarah will have a chance against it.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:15 p.m. CST

    Also, Skynet knowing about Reese is far from stupid.

    by Shermdawg

    When you take into account the original ending, the fact that he inadvertently caused the initial events that led to the creation of Skynet, and us not knowing if Skynet was able to collect data from the models they sent through time, it's not that big of a plot hole. Just something that got fucked up with the switch and people not fully understanding the timeline of the films.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:20 p.m. CST

    Its sad, really.

    by Miles_Teg

    Being better than Transformers 2, GI Joe, and Wolverine is not a sign of quality. Its a sign of being the new shit that isn't quite as smelly as the old shit or swarming with flies yet.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:25 p.m. CST

    Problem with TS

    by Hipshot

    Is that the first two movies were written by a brilliant man who knows how to thread genuine emotion through spectacle. The third film at least had the fun of seeing an incredibly charismatic star getting a paycheck. It was "all right" but traded on the memory of the first two. And it WAS fun to watch Arnold slapped around by a woman. The fourth? A bare step up from DTV-level. The answer? They need a real script from a writer who has the stones to take the Terminator world by the throat and shake it, hard. McG was barely adequate, and without either a great script, a great idea, or a great star the movie was grim, no "fun" at all, and composed of spectacle without much entertainment value. I'll watch it one more time to be sure, but Jeeze...I've seen T2 a dozen times, and will probably watch it a dozen more. Cameron is a heavy hitter: writer, director, effects whiz, action choreographer. Hard to compensate for all that. McG should be kept miles away from the franchise.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:29 p.m. CST

    I son't get how people say TS is worse than T3.

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Good fucking Gods. You people get hard ons over Inglorious Basterds.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:30 p.m. CST

    This movie sucked donkey balls...

    by SwedishChef

    I mean..the Terminator finally gets a hold of John Connor and what does he do? Toss him around a few times. Yeah..but an efficient killer. And giving Skynet a voice so that she can deliver it's devious plan ala Dr. Evil. This movie sucked. That is all.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:33 p.m. CST

    Hipshot

    by Jaka

    I'm bored right now, so please go say all that stuff about Cameron in the Avatar thread. I dare yah! Muahahaahahaaa!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:36 p.m. CST

    McG should emulate Long Island Goo Spew

    by keylimepirate

    That's right! Google Long Island Goo Spew! McG guy should move into the realm of Digital Cave Paintings. He's got the energy to put more up on the screen than he does. This is a link that shows how it's done. He could really do something with the webisode format, much like Key Lime Productions has done. Check it: http://www.youtube.com/user/keylimeproductions

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:38 p.m. CST

    Speaking of paradoxes...

    by BurnHollywood

    I'm loving some of these bizarre assessments of the series...the future in SALVATION wasn't dark enough, but it also wasn't "fun" and needed "humor". T3 is acknowledged as a blatant retread of T2 with some lame sight gags mixed in, and that's somehow still better than a flawed attempt that tries to take the series seriously again.<p> If you guys could at least stick with Linda Hamilton's assessment, that the T1/T2 movies are "complete", and that any further developments are just cashing in, I could at least buy into that...exonerating T3 at T:S's expense just makes you sound excruciatingly superficial.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:38 p.m. CST

    www.tinyurl.com

    by Jaka

    At least spam creatively.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:42 p.m. CST

    No, Skynet knowing about Reese is stupid and unneeded

    by DVader

    It doesn't make any sense as to why Skynet knows about Reese. Doesn't make any sense at all, as far as I can figure. <p> But it makes sense if you know the original ending? I guess, but the general public doesn't know the original ending (and I'm unclear as to which ending you're talking about), so really, it still continues to not make sense.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:44 p.m. CST

    T3 v. TS

    by TedKordLives

    T3: The future Mrs. John Conner learns of her destiny and begins taking those first steps towards becoming the hardened warrior she will have to become. <P> TS: Mrs. John Conner stands around in the background, not saying too much. <P> I'd watch a Mostow film over a McG movie any day of the week.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:47 p.m. CST

    I thought your wrote "her density"

    by Jaka

    It was more funny that way.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:53 p.m. CST

    Jaka

    by TedKordLives

    If I had been speaking those words, I WOULD have said 'her density'. <P> Because it IS funnier that way.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:56 p.m. CST

    DVader, guess you weren't one of the fanboys that bitched.

    by Shermdawg

    John was supposed to die, Marcus was supposed to pose as him.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 8:59 p.m. CST

    I did know that ending, Sherm I thought you meant another

    by DVader

    I don't understand how Skynet knowing about Kyle Reese makes sense with the original ending of Marcus posing as Connor. <p> Which is a better ending than McG's retarded idea, where after this surgery takes place, Marcus-Connor then kills everyone around him. Stupid, stupid, stupid *shakes head*.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:04 p.m. CST

    Merrick and Quint are predictable Geek Sheep

    by Tall_Boy66

    Whatever they think is the majority opinion of the rabid Geek Mainstream they'll mindlessly go along with it because they have no opinion of their own aside from appearing Ain't It Cool.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:04 p.m. CST

    I just din't like the ending of TS

    by lockesbrokenleg

    It would have been cool if they finally wrapped everything up. Killed all the robots. But, once again, they had to stretch it.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:05 p.m. CST

    There's two elements that go into making McG...

    by Napolean Solo

    There's Mc, and there's the G."

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:05 p.m. CST

    They have to stretch it, Lockes

    by DVader

    So that we get older Kyle's description of the future where the T-800's have laser guns and we fight back with our own laser guns on a ground made of human skulls. <p> Course, McG wants to ignore that future and instead bring the fight back to the present... which is just retarded and immature.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:08 p.m. CST

    Actually that would've made perfect sense to have...

    by Shermdawg

    ...Robot John kill everyone thus ending the cycle, preventing Skynet's creation, and saving the world from man. However, what I heard was the few that knew about Marcus posing as John would keep the secret to keep their hope alive.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:09 p.m. CST

    McG talks up a real nice game.

    by The_Genteel_Gentile

    But he can't hack it when he gets passed the ball. Dude's a giant con man plain and simple. In fact in that respect, and ONLY that respect, I almost admire him, save for him also being a pariah totally devoid of any integrity who used his hustle know-how and shamelessness to insinuate himself into a position to defecate all over the Terminator franchise and thusly an integral part of my childhood. So yeah, that pretty much negates any admiration.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:10 p.m. CST

    As for Skynet knowing about Reese

    by Tall_Boy66

    It gives them a continuity-out, so that it never quite happened this way (same deal with Marcus) the first time around, it's like Spock and Nero going through the Red Matter black hole and destroying the Kelvin. Things were changed and it isn't going to play out the same way this time around. The way you can see about it, it's after Sarah and John destroyed Cyberdyne in the early 90s, it just pushed Judgement Day back to 2004. Possibly the T-X probably wasn't even in the original continuity but Sarah and John and "Uncle Bob" fucked that up real good. So Marcus Wright & Skynet knowing about Reese are two new things in the timeline. In the end, there's so many multiple timelines in the Terminator series (they even addressed this on the TV show) that you can write your own ending whatever way you want. In one timeline the story ends with Terminator 2, in another timeline it goes to Sarah Connor Chronicles, in another timeline it goes to Terminator Salvation, etc. etc.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:12 p.m. CST

    New animated Doctor Who "Dreamland" is out...

    by MisterE

    ...if you know where to look.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:13 p.m. CST

    And, as much as I like Salvation, McG's T5 sounds awful

    by Tall_Boy66

    I want more future war movie, not basically Transformers With Terminators in the Present. Keep Macrus dead, he's good as a one-off character.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:14 p.m. CST

    But Shermdog, that time-logic doesn't make sense

    by DVader

    If we suggest that Marcus-Connor killing everyone, including Reese, means that Skynet isn't created bc Reese can't go back in time... then what, Skynet just disappears? Or are we talking about an alternate timeline is created? Either way, that's not something we'd see in the movie, is it? It just means in one world, everything's ok, but in THIS one, the important one we've invested so much time into, everything just went to shit. <p> Also, if we entertain that idea that this ending means Skynet isn't created... then it really throws a wrench into that whole "Why the fuck didn't Skynet just kill Kyle Reese to make sure John Connor wasn't created?" question.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:16 p.m. CST

    T4 was a disaster of Highlander 2 proportions...

    by lemitch

    nuff said

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:20 p.m. CST

    Skynet would disappear yes.

    by Shermdawg

    In the corrected timeline. In the one presented in the film, who knows? I never heard about that ending, if that was even a ending they were planning, however, that would present the idea of a civil war within the Skynet collective...which would've been fairly retarded without proper setup.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:22 p.m. CST

    The TV series timeline was pretty decent in season one

    by lockesbrokenleg

    In a few episodes we saw Reese in the future with the lazer guns, etc. You could say those are the sequels to this movie. But, they never wrapped it up there, either.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:24 p.m. CST

    Also regarding why they didn't just kill Kyle in that scenario..

    by Shermdawg

    Without or until there was a reason to send a T-800 back to kill Sarah, there was no reason to worry about Kyle.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:26 p.m. CST

    Terminator: Rise Of The Machines

    by ewokstew

    Is a masterpiece compared to Salvation. McG needs to stick to music videos. Truly.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:26 p.m. CST

    T:SCC had alternate timelines within alternate timelines

    by Tall_Boy66

    By the time they hit season 2, Reese was confronting a guy who tortured him in Jessie's timeline, but tortured Jessie in his timeline. And the fact that the entire series is an alternate timeline to Terminator 2. So it makes sense that Terminator Salvation the timeline would be different from what happened before because of all the time-travel jibbery-do shenanigans, hence Marcus Wright, Skynet knowing Reese, the T-RIP being created earlier than it should have been.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:29 p.m. CST

    McG mentions that ending to Drew at HitFix

    by DVader

    There's a video of him saying it, and you can see the look on Moriarty's face where he's thinking "That's the dumbest idea I've ever heard," but he knows he can't blurt that out and ruin the interview. <p> But, if Skynet disappears when Marcus-Connor kills Kyle, then Skynet should have KILLED KYLE REESE when they had him (in T:S) so that John Connor, the leader of the resistance, would have disappeared, thus ensuring their victory.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:32 p.m. CST

    Nothing in the present would've changed.

    by Shermdawg

    Quit thinking Back to the Future. That timeline would continue on regardless.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Why don't the Terminators realize that THEY are

    by lockesbrokenleg

    the ones should terminate because they were the ones who caused all this multiple timeline shit. I think they tried to do that in T 2 when Older John sends back Arnie.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:35 p.m. CST

    They did kill Reese in the original, original script

    by Tall_Boy66

    I can't be arsed to find it, but Chud has a write-up about Terminator Salvation and Reese and that kid were killed by the Machines, and Marcus traveled back in time to save them (and he did) and then Connor only shows up at the very end of the movie, is promptly killed, and Marcus becomes Connor. No Marcus Kills Everybody, just Marcus/Connor. Which I think is just stupid overall and I like the "Salvation" (quite literally) ending more. The whole series is about machines becoming more human, and a machine (Marcus) saving Connor (the future of humanity) sort of gets the underlying theme of the series more than either of the Marcus-is-Connor endings.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:38 p.m. CST

    I don't think you're seeing my point, Sherm

    by DVader

    I'm equating Marcus-Connor killing Kyle Reese to Skynet killing Kyle Reese. Either both have repercussions in the timeline we are watching, or both have repercussions in an alternate timeline, which since its one we are not watching, it doesn't matter one bit what happens to it. Therefore, there is nothing poetic about Marcus-Connor killing Kyle Reese at the end and ensuring that Skynet is never built. Bc Skynet is still standing in the only timeline we have invested in.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:39 p.m. CST

    There are two elements to making water:

    by TedKordLives

    There's Hydrogen, and there's oxygen.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:45 p.m. CST

    I was so surprised

    by kafka07

    that I didn't hate Terminator Salvation, when I rented the dvd and saw it for the first time last week. A very sloppy film. But a good deal of fun action scenes, and even thought Bale was pretty good. But I still keep thinking, why did they even make this film, and how could they think about making more?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:47 p.m. CST

    Reboots aren't always poetic.

    by Shermdawg

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:51 p.m. CST

    What you described was poetic

    by DVader

    Yes, I'm complimenting you =). The way you described McG's ending was by saying it would've "made perfect sense", and obviously that is what I take issue with and what I've been debating with you. I think it makes no sense at all.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:52 p.m. CST

    Or Comprehensible, it seems.

    by TedKordLives

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:54 p.m. CST

    Well, this talkback certainly proves one thing

    by Jaka

    There is clearly still interest in Terminator films. For me, not so much as I really hated T3 and haven't tried TS yet. But I never would have thought this post would get so many responses, or that there would be so many disparate views of what I thought was a pretty simple concept. Interesting, to be sure.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 9:56 p.m. CST

    Stand fast DVader!

    by TedKordLives

    Give them not an inch!

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:09 p.m. CST

    Think of it this way, if they had went with evil Marcus...

    by Shermdawg

    ...all bets are off on what could happen, thus leading to two more films (or most likely killing the series dead) so far from what we expect from this series...unless someone else stepped up to the plate, found a way back and stopped that particular event from taking place. But that just would've been unnecessary. The current Salvation, could probably be redeemed upon continuation, but as of now it feels kinda pointless. They should've stuck to their guns and went with Good Cyber-Connor. In that scenario, as well as the current one it does makes sense that Kyle is kept alive. It just depends on two things, what the motive of Skynet are, and what reasons Kyle has to go back in time. And considering this was just a first entry to a bigger story regardless of which story that ended up being, we don't have enough info to say it doesn't make sense.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Can't take him seriously

    by RogueWarrior65

    Sorry, but I can't take anyone who wants to be called McG seriously.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:27 p.m. CST

    Blame that on his mother.

    by Shermdawg

    And it's much more memorable than "Joseph McGinty".

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:38 p.m. CST

    Hacks shouldn't be allowed on established franchises

    by lavatory love machine

    you should have at least one universally acclaimed movie before getting a job like that

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:39 p.m. CST

    Having Arnie in T3 was it's one saving grace

    by RequisiteMonkey

    Very bad movie. T4 was horrid. Nothing redeeming about it. Hey McG! you can't possibly resurrect Terminator to its former glory, not even by an inch. Deal with it. Why do all our favorite movies have to be beaten like dead horses (like the Friday the 13th franchise)? So are we going to get Lord of the Rings Part X, or Indiana Jones Part 19?)

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 10:47 p.m. CST

    BurnHollywood...

    by KillDozer

    No shit he's not in charge. He's got nothing to be in charge of. They're all dead. That's why I found it funny. (can't believe I have to explain that)<p>And the main reason I think Salvation was fucking horrible (which has already been mentioned several times, I think) is that Terminators are built to terminate. If you find Connor or Reese, you kill fucking kill them on the spot. That's one of the reasons they're scary. Terminators don't have elaborate plans that give you time to figure out how to get away. They just kill you immediately. Even Terminator 3 managed to do that right for the most part.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:39 p.m. CST

    Really, Terminators kill on sight?

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Why did they bother gathering up humans in TS then? Why does the female Terminator even bother with fighting Arnold and go straight for the kid?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:43 p.m. CST

    KillDozer

    by BurnHollywood

    "No shit he's not in charge. He's got nothing to be in charge of. They're all dead. That's why I found it funny. (can't believe I have to explain that)"<p> Sometimes I think people actually work at missing the point. Maybe all caps will help...I dunno: JOHN CONNOR WAS NOT HEADING UP THE MOVIE'S INITIAL MISSION. It was led by another Ops guy. Which undermines your point that he fucked up...it wasn't his mission to fuck up. Or does the military rely on democracy or unanimity in decision-making these days?<p> "Terminators don't have elaborate plans that give you time to figure out how to get away. They just kill you immediately."<p> Three times Skynet sent back three radically different Terminators, three times it failed. Little wonder if it wanted to be a bit more elaborate this time around...seems clear the direct approach wasn't working.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:46 p.m. CST

    Jack's Bloated Payroll...

    by Homer Sexual

    You pointed out the exact logic flaws I noticed when I saw TS this weekend. <p> Also had the whole Road Warrior Updated vibe in spades. <p> Also, Christian Bale didn't used to talk that way in every role. <p> But I didn't NOT like it. It kept my interest. Would go see a T5.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:49 p.m. CST

    Dear McDouche...

    by CaptainAngry

    ...When even the people who (kind of/sort of) liked your movie are quick to note it's actually not that good...your movie probably sucked.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:51 p.m. CST

    I hate to...

    by CaptainAngry

    ...double post but one other (among many) stupid things leapt out at me when watching TS...why the hell would the T-101 at the end kick Conner around like that? Wouldn't he just, you know, grab him and crunch his skull? The End?

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:54 p.m. CST

    the bullshit reshot ending ruined it for me.

    by BMacSmith

    they should have had the balls to keep it the way it was. instead they ended up with a clumsy nonsensical one.

  • Dec. 7, 2009, 11:56 p.m. CST

    This is all just nitpicking

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Most people never complain about the acting or action in TS, but they'll argue endlessly about some dumb thing.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:01 a.m. CST

    The only good thing was Sam Worthington and that kid who played

    by Evangelion217

    Everything else sucked balls!!!!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:12 a.m. CST

    yeah the acting was fine, but the plot was dumb

    by BMacSmith

    and just another tease of a big future war movie we'll never get.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:16 a.m. CST

    Biggest Sin In Salvation: Expository Head Syndrome

    by Autodidact

    The lamest fucking trend in sci-fi movies over the past ten years has been the Expository Head or Expository Little Girl Hologram syndrome. We get Helena Bonham Carter with her freaky hairline staring directly at the camera, dragging things down with exposition and raping the idea of a faceless computer network at the same time. I don't care if it was just manipulation, find another way to write and show that aspect of things. The floating head representing the computer has been the gayest shit around since Power Rangers.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:24 a.m. CST

    i just love how Sam's character just gave up his heart

    by BMacSmith

    i mean how fucking bad is that writing? Like someone is just gonna donate their heart to some jackass (who you already saved once) out of the blue. Connor even tried to kill him just before!<p> Sam: "yo, dude. you know what? i've lived long enough. i'm kinda over it. even though you seem like a real asshat that doesnt know what he's doing, the other three movies say you are this big symbol of the resistance, so you can have my heart. bye, ya'll!"

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:25 a.m. CST

    T3 Great on Balance.. The Fucking World Gets Nuked At The End

    by Autodidact

    When you nuke the entire world at the end of your movie, with some pretty damn cool shots not to mention, the movie would have to star Carrot Top and retarded Rosie O'Donnel for me to not give it major points. <p>I for one dig Nick Stah'ls performance. I think he does tortured, permanently stressed survivalist loner very well. Surely once the character holed up with Kate Brewster he'd butch up a bit, but at the start of T3 he's been living for years just waiting for the other shoe to drop. I hate the name Kate Brewster by the way. First it sounds too cutesy matching meter with John Connor. Second it makes me think of Punky Brewster when I'm trying to watch a Terminator movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:27 a.m. CST

    It wasn't really that bad...

    by bubcus

    I did reluctantly see it in the theater and the movie was "okay." But that's it. It was "okay." Not terrible, not intolerable, but not great.<BR><BR> The only sequence I can say I really liked is the interaction between Skynet and the hybrid guy. It was brief but it brought a smile to my face.<BR><BR> On the flip side, the movie didn't get dark enough. And I don't mean this to sound like the outcome of the scene should have been different but when that group of guys were trying to gang up on the one girl, the scene played out like a farce. She was smiling when dealing with them and seeming not to take it seriously. It came across cheesy and non-threatening.<BR><BR> Ultimately, T1 & T2 still rule. T3 was so-so but cartoony and T4 was stylish but sort of bland.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:28 a.m. CST

    TIME FOR A REBOOT!!! You know its gonna happen...

    by LabattsBleu

    and IF they hire the right director and have GOOD writers, I could see the next movie being potentially great...<br><br> but i just see the studio screwing it up again...<br><br> please, no McGinty...sorry dude, you had your chance and the movie, imo, was awful...

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:29 a.m. CST

    ^Heck I'll Defend That... He Was Already Executed

    by Autodidact

    The guy had already made his peace and accepted death in his own way. Also, they don't show it but I'm pretty sure he lost his dick and balls, or at least the ability to achieve erection, in the process of becoming a prototype infiltrator.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:30 a.m. CST

    Hands off McG!

    by Citizen Sane

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Autodidact

    by BurnHollywood

    That WAS the lamest trend...the NEW lamest trend is taking seventeen-year-old cartoons like FERNGULLY, rendering them in CGI and declaring them "game changers"...

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Good to see Merrick being completely impartial towards this

    by Bruce of all Trades

    Fuck McG.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:34 a.m. CST

    ^^ Meant to add... Redemption

    by Autodidact

    It was supposed to be a theme. Sacrifice brings redemption, and delivers salvation. Some shit like that. Remember the guy was a death row convict who knew he deserved death the first time.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:37 a.m. CST

    Autodidact

    by BMacSmith

    ha i guess that could work... nah. no way. i mean at least if they showed him as being suicidal or not really giving a shit i could buy it. but the whole movie he's searching out whats happening and never once gives the impression that he wants to die.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:38 a.m. CST

    dont need no reboot dont need nothing

    by WickedJacob

    T1 & 2 are awesome. lets leave it alone now.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:43 a.m. CST

    I can't believe ANYBODY...

    by Citizen Sane

    ..actually thought that movie was any good.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:46 a.m. CST

    What about the crane shot where he screams in anguish?

    by Autodidact

    There's a ham-fisted THIS IS IMPORTANT shot of Max screaming in anguish as he realizes that what he thought may be a second chance at life is in fact a ghoulish resurrection? It was the focal point of the trailers. Too subtle for you?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:46 a.m. CST

    The TV series just made it worse

    by Toonol

    The fact that a FOX show was more interesting, better acted, and smarter than a $150 million dollar movie really should get somebody fired.<p> And... the show had BRIAN GREEN turning in a better performance than CHRISTIAN BALE did in the movie. How the hell does THAT happen?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:53 a.m. CST

    Bale Ruined The Movie

    by Autodidact

    I truly believe it would have been a better movie if Bale had just stayed the fuck away. I also don't really dig him as Batman. There were scenes in T:S that felt pointless, like they were there just to give him screen time. One of the dumbest fucking scenes is the one where they're sitting out in the open desert watching an HK off in the distance. Okay, it's not that long after Judgement Day, so Skynet is not at full strength and still has some tricks to learn. But are we to believe that those HKs didn't have long range thermal and night vision already, going back to when they were part of US military research?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:55 a.m. CST

    btw, i still think he can get erections

    by BMacSmith

    probably super Terminator erections. the cock and balls would be needed to disguise him as a human.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:59 a.m. CST

    Now we're dissing Bale?

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Really, and this from the same crowd that kisses Kevin Smith's ass?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:23 a.m. CST

    McG's not that bad

    by darthvedder81

    He's no genius but he's got some action chops. Some editing problems aside TSAL was way truer to the Terminator universe than T3 (and Cameron said he LIKED that one). A smarter filmmaker would have realized this story was about Marcus Wright and NOT the dull John Connor. Still I was entertained.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:27 a.m. CST

    Forget Terminator

    by hallmitchell

    No one cares. I never saw three. I will never see four. Move On!!!!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:27 a.m. CST

    We are done professionally

    by hallmitchell

    Only good thing to come out of that picture.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:28 a.m. CST

    2009 - Worst blockbuster year EVER

    by hallmitchell

    Watchmen sucked, Wolverine, T4, Transformers 2 - I point blank refuse to see.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:42 a.m. CST

    If McG Directs, can I BE McG

    by gusradio

    ?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:45 a.m. CST

    Terminator's sucked since one

    by lockesbrokenleg

    The first one was a cult classic, the second one was a mainstream success, the third was awful. Fourth was passable. Shitty franchise.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:51 a.m. CST

    I quite liked it.

    by Kaitain

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:54 a.m. CST

    I liked it.

    by JADSTERSDAD

    I'll say it again. The hate it out of all proportion. T3 was fine too. Not in the league of the first two, but then neither were many Moore Bonds in the league of the early ones. Still enjoyable. Still Bond. People need to get real. Transformers....that was way worse. Paranormal Activity? Overrated. It's just fun to hate McG. Give the guy a break.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:20 a.m. CST

    I liked it too

    by MegaBeth

    I enjoyed T4 alot better than T3. I thought T3 was horrible. I'm not saying T4 was perfect, but it wasn't the worst of the series. In my opinion.. from best to worst.. T1, T2, T4 and then T3.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:23 a.m. CST

    Nick Stahl *WAS* a better John Connor than Bale

    by Tall_Boy66

    I totally admit that. Bale is just doing his Batman voice and, try try as he might, the "Fucking Unprofessional!!" rant just HANGS over every fame of his entire performance. Stahl was probably the most complex portrayal as a guy who was running away from his destiny and was forced into it at the end. Even though they killed off Sarah Connor for pure salary reasons, I thought leaving him alone made his story stronger because he was alone. and Stahl's John Connor was a positively juicy role with some depth to it as opposed to Bale just "GRRR!! FUCKING DISTRACTING!!!" I like both Terminator 3 and Salvation (neither are the piece of great moviemaking as Terminator 2, though) but I'll admit when it comes to Connors, Stahl was the best one we got.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:33 a.m. CST

    Eeeeeehhh, I don't know.

    by BKirckof

    I didn't hate T4. I didn't like T4. But I respected what McG did with the film. The action scenes were really good, I though. My real problems with the movie lied within the half baked script they decided to shoot with. It just was not on par with what JC used to shoot his efforts. Hell, the script for T4 was worse than what they used for T3. As for McG directing future installments. I wouldn't be completely opposed to it. Could they find somebody better for the job? Of course. Yet, when I re-watched his effort for a second time I came to appreciate what he accomplished once things went boom. The guy can direct the ever loving s**t out of an action scene. This is undeniable. It's just everything else he needs help with. Characters. Performances. Giant, glaring, instantly recognizable plot holes. Bale's Batman voice seeping into every scene. The breezy, weightless pace. Bottom line, while McG didn't totally win me over with T4, the movie wasn't the slow-motion train wreck I initially imagined when I heard his name attached to the project. In other words, providing he learned from the mistakes he committed with his first effort, yea, I wouldn't mind seeing McG take another swing at the franchise.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:46 a.m. CST

    T3 also had Kristanna Loken's ass

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    Which was so shaped and meaty i would use as a pillow.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3 a.m. CST

    With all of these complaints...

    by Azlam Orlandu

    ...it's a wonder that any of you enjoy anything at all. Terminator is not Star Wars or Trek in terms of the size of its scope or universe. To tear apart its cannon in such a manner borders on obsession. Some of you fuckers really need to get out and find things in life to worry about over Bale and McG.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:13 a.m. CST

    Azlam Orlandu

    by BMacSmith

    shut the fuck up

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:13 a.m. CST

    Give McG some credit

    by gusborwig

    He did a decent job. I actually liked Salvation. The story was pretty good. Even the CGI cameo by Schwarzenegger was awesome to see. Whoever buys the rights should put him on the list of directors to consider for the next movie. Personally I'd like to see a sequel where he has to fight to send Kyle and a T-101 through the time displacement field. It would make the whole saga come full circle back to the first film.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:42 a.m. CST

    Rakafraker

    by AsimovLives

    I love your kind of fallacy reasoning. Next time, try to aply that to the auto industry, and never ever dare to criticise a car if you can't build one.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:48 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    Only in a retard universe would STAR TREK: THE MOTION PCITURE be confused with a bad movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:52 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    And taken on it's own, Terminator: Salvation is a cliché ridden, unimaginative, dumb, stupid, useless action movie disguised as SF, in which the director is so beret of imagination he came up with the very first nice apocalypse i ever seen in the history of cinema, a future world ravaged by athe nuclear fires which looks no worst then any country region outside of LA in actuality.<br><br>Friend, you are ruining your hard won build reputation by defending this exacrable piece of shit, dude. I'm not recognizing you.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:56 a.m. CST

    As for Terminator: Salvation's so called tepid results

    by AsimovLives

    T:S made at the box office only less 20 millions then Star Trek In Name Only. but STINO is allowed to be hailed as a HUGE SUCESS, while T:S is a commercial failure? Listen, i fucking hate T:S, but it's stupid to give to it a failure it didn't had. The movie's failure has nothing to do with box office. Why people like Merrick keep on this accountant attitude to justify their likes and dislikes?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:04 a.m. CST

    I dont blame McG

    by Drsambeckett1984

    It was Bale that ruined the film, just by being in it!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:11 a.m. CST

    bwa-haha-ha-ha, Asimov no friends with Cobra anymore

    by Tall_Boy66

    Holy shit, you are one stuck up your ass cockmuch, eh? "Friend, you are ruining your hard won build reputation" hahahahahahaha. So he disappointed you? Are you this judgmental when you sit down to breakfast for a glass of JINO (Juice in name only)? God, you're pathetic.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:15 a.m. CST

    Hey Asimov

    by kwisatzhaderach

    Somebody tried to say TMP was a bad movie? Morons. <p> All I can say about Salvation is that I was entertained looking at Bryce Dallas Howard's immaculate make-up. Certainly appropriate for a post-holocaust world. <p> One of the worst movies I have ever seen, with one of the worst opening scenes in movie history. To the talkbacker above that thinks its a better movie than T2: just end your life now, really.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:15 a.m. CST

    Tall_Boy66

    by AsimovLives

    Dude, easy. I have been agreeingwith everythign you ahve said in here, dude. Everything. We are on the same side. and what i said to Cobra-Kai was in the spirit of friendship. I just stated that i'm bewildered by his unexpected defense of T:S. Becasue never in a million years i would ever iamgine he would do such a thing. There's nothing in what i recallfrom his part postings that would make me even dream he would defend this piece of shit.<br><br>And let me repeat this again: i agree with everything you have said about T4 so far. I'm one of the people on your side of the trenches, man.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:20 a.m. CST

    I'll hand it to McG

    by smackfu

    I really did like his post apocalyptic outdoor scenes, and Anton Yelchin did a downright spooky Kyle Reese. I just thought the two leads ruined the film, Christian Bale's Connor just comes off as a prick, and Sam Worthington's character, and acting, were exceptionally corny.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:25 a.m. CST

    The "McG" is a clue to understant...

    by AsimovLives

    ... the type of person who McG is. A guy who in his adult life still goes for nickname they gave him when he was a todler? Like many, i though the first time i learn his name that he was some black dude who made big on the music video and decided to give himself asome dumb "street kool" name, like that guy Hype Williams. When i discovered he is some suburbian whitey, i couldn't stop laughing!<br><br>I meran, in your adult lfe and you chose to call yourself McG as your PROFESSIONAL NAME?? Dude, let people call McG if they are if your close acquiantance, like your friends and collegues. But as a professional name? Does this clown even dreams how stupid "A McG Film" reads? Who the fuck will ever take anything this guy seriously? It might boderline work for a Charlie's Angels movie, but for a mroe serious minded piec eof entertaiment like the Terminator saga, it's absurd. It's inviting derising and mockery on it's own. Couldn't this stupid idiot change his professional name? Is he that egomanic?<br><br>I mean, lets all play a game of using our childhood nicks as attach them to movies, and see how fuckign silly ity all looks. I was called Carlitos when i was a child. Let's see:<br>MOBY DICK, A Carlitos Film<br>Doesn't look great, does it? No, it looks fucking dumb!<br><br>Soemone above said that somebody using McG as a professional name reflects a childish personality. I fully agree. This egomanic is to full of himself, he's superior to use a name. This fool is as misguided as they come. But whosrt are the even more idiots who though he would be a c«good choice for the Terminator fracnhise. Those idiots deserve to have gone to bankrupcy. Maybe if they had hired a really good director that could made a really good movie, then maybe they they would had the motherof all moneymaking franchises. Fucking asses!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:30 a.m. CST

    smackfu

    by AsimovLives

    You loved the NICE APOCALYPSE? The future nuclear war ravaged world that didn't looked any worst then any normal everyday outside of LA? A nuclear war ravaged world which looks much cleaner and nicer then anything ever shown in any Mad Max movie? When youthink of post-apocalypse nuclear wasteland, that's how you see it, as portaited in Terminator Salvation? How does it even match with the future shown in the previous Terminator movies, specially the first?<br><br>It took me to this talkback to realise there's people who actually like the McG's Marry Poppins Nice Apocalypse. Watch any news about the balkan war, how Sarajevo looked after the ordinary ordinance bombings, and it looks 100 times more devastated and apocalyptical then anything that McG pulled on his Nice Apocalypse vision.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:33 a.m. CST

    People loving the McG's Nice Apocalypse

    by AsimovLives

    Unbelievable! You want some tea and scones with your Nice Apocalypse? The movie should evenhad some road signs saying "Keep The Apocalypse Civilized". "Don't litter the Apocalypse". "This Apocalypse is also yours, don't litter". The first ever litter-less Apocaypse in the whole history of cinema.<br><br>Fucking ass!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:34 a.m. CST

    Apocalypse Nice: A McG Film

    by AsimovLives

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:38 a.m. CST

    If they make another

    by Drsambeckett1984

    focus it on Kyle Reese, Anton Yelchin was the only person to come out of T-Sal with any dignity.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:57 a.m. CST

    sound + picture + SOME FUCKIN PROFESSIONAL LIGHTING.

    by alice133

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:09 a.m. CST

    Asimov does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    "Only in a retard universe would STAR TREK: THE MOTION PCITURE be confused with a bad movie." Asimov<p> Okay. This is off-topic and i'd like to add that none of the following are my words, this is from Wikipedia. You've been lectured on the difference between 'subjective' and 'objective' opinion before Asimov - so hopefully you will appreciate this as an 'objective' opinion the world in general has about STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE...<p> Released in North America on December 7, 1979, Star Trek: The Motion Picture received mixed reviews from critics, many of whom criticized the film for its lack of action and over-reliance on special effects. The final production cost ballooned to approximately $46 million. The film earned $139 million worldwide, falling short of studio expectations.<p> Critical response<p> The Motion Picture met with disappointing reviews from critics;[144] a 2001 retrospective for the BBC described the film as a critical failure.[145] Gary Arnold and Judith Martin of The Washington Post felt that the plot was too thin to support the length of the film, although Martin felt that compared to similar films such as 2001: A Space Odyssey, Star Wars, and Alien, The Motion Picture's pretense was "slightly cleverer".[146] Time's Harold Livingston wrote that the film consisted of spaceships that "take an unconscionable amount of time to get anywhere, and nothing of dramatic or human interest happens along the way". Livingston also lamented the lack of "boldly characterized" antagonists and battle scenes that made Star Wars fun; instead, viewers were presented with lots of talk, "much of it in impenetrable spaceflight jargon".[147] David Denby said that the slow movement of ships through space was "no longer surprising and elegant" after films such as 2001: A Space Odyssey, and that much of the action consisted of the crew's reacting to things occurring on the viewscreen, which the New York Magazine critic considered to be "like watching someone else watch television".

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:17 a.m. CST

    Brett Ratner! The perfect person after McG.

    by Damien Chowder

    And we will have Tucker fucking Jackie Chan in the ass while Chan is shouting "Flied Lice!! Bwack Bwean Sauce!!" All the while Tucker will be pulling Chinese eyes to the audience. <p> In walks a fucking Terminator and fucking shoots Jackie Chan and Chris Tucker Brandon Lee style! <p> Honour is restored for the Chinese people and Black people.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:23 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    I measure Star Trek:TMP quality not on the box office results, but as a movie on it's own. And as a movie on it's own, it owns. Maybe the movie is not one of those super-fast feed up action movie nonsenses that so beloved this day and age, but it works, marvelously as a more classical type of SF movie. That it went 2001 instead of Star Wars is a testement to the filmmakers who made it who still kept it lcose to the spirit of the TOS then to any audience ass kissing fashion of the moment. they had big ass marvelous special effects, they didn't anythign else to kiss audience's ass, and went for integrity instead. That alone makes me admire the movie.<br><br>And then there's the filmmaking quality on display. Call me an old fart, but i still can see quality filmmaking in a older mvoie that is not called Star Wars, Jaws or Lawrence Of Arabia, to name the AICN usual suspects. Sudffice to say, the guy in charge of directing it was Robert Wise, who really had the chops to make movies, and who lerned making movies by actually making them in a very long career which started as editor on CITIZEN KANE. Instead of this assclown Jar Jar Abrams everybody is so enamorated who learned filmmaking in the cereals. Ans speaking of the devil, taken into account inflaction, there's no major difference between the box office results of ST:TMP and STINO, with the difference that ST:TMP cost less to make then STINO. But ST:TMP is the box office loser! Yeah, right!! such a loser, they decided to keep on making more Star Trek movies! Yeah, that's the sure sign of a loser franchise starter movie! ST:TMP is a good movie, it did good at the box office, and it did good as a movie. You have every right to not like it, of course. and it's your loss. Even fucking Jar Jar Abrams likes it! Think about that next time you decide to bash it in favour of STINO. fucking Abrams even admits to have based and taken scenes from ST:TMP for his movie as hommage, the only time he actually hommages Star Trek. He says so in his audio comentary. So there.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:25 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Asi, in your mind TMP is a fantastic movie, but the majority of critics were disappoined in it.<p> In my mind (and if you scroll up through this thread many other guys feel the same way too) TERMINATOR SALVATION was a decent movie, but I also recognize that the majority of critics were disappointed in it.<p> Just accept that some of us sci-fi action fans got a kick out of it and move on. No need to keep throwing mud. One post saying why you didnt like it is fine, but why start a hate campaign?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:26 a.m. CST

    Give it to Joss Whedon

    by Obscura

    noone will go see it, but it'd be an awesome movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:27 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Drsambeckett1984

    You really think TMP kept close TOS, I cannot agree with that at all. <P> While I am not a hater of that film, I think it has some lovely real Sci Fi Moments. But it is onee of the weaker Star treks, the characters are all ove the place and story is just bizarre.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:27 a.m. CST

    And any body who mistakes ST:TMP for a tv movie is stupid

    by AsimovLives

    Very stupid. ST:TMP is a movei clearly made for to be seen in the theaters. It's a MOTION PICTURE. There's ntothing in the way it was shot and edited that's TV like. It's a fully cinema movie, deliberatly made for the big screen. That's why they hired ROBERT WISE to direct it, a guy who came from the heydays of cinerama and the big screen epics. The same dude who directed the extravaganzas like The Sound Of Music and inteligent spectacular movies like THE SAND PEBBLES. Bascially,when they hired soembody fo direct ST:TMP, they went for someone who made THEATER SPECTACULAR MOVIES, not TV shows.<br><br>Anybody complaining that ST:TMP is just a Tv movie is a fucking idiotic moron who just wanted to say some dumb shit smart-ass retarded bullshit to look fancy on the priting press. He's a fucking moron and no mistake. This people are as adept to understand movies as they are for quantum mechanics. Fucking asses!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:29 a.m. CST

    Drsambeckett1984

    by AsimovLives

    At the very least, in ST:TMP they went where no man had gone before. "Where No Man Had Gone Before". Does that ring a bell, concerning Star Trek? Hum?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:36 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    "ST:TMP is a good movie, it did good at the box office, and it did good as a movie."<p> The facts (critical and commercial reception) simply do not back that statement up.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:40 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    Well, you see, the way i udnerstand it, you got a kick out of T4 not because it's a SF movie, but because it's an action movie. an action movie diguised as SF. The kind he have had for quite some time, and which has overrun SF, at least the one made in Hollywood. The truth of the matter is, if you are an action junkie, you might be more easy on T4 because it fills all the cliches of the genre and then some. It's business as usual for the over-bloated action movie stravaganza. But as a Sf mvoie, it fails miserably on all levels, starting with the ideas. Something which no previous Terminator movie, not even the unjustly maligned Terminator 3l, did before. Each and every one of those had at least some novel concept to the idea of the free-will/determinism of time travwel, among the whole action carnage. T4 is the kind of dumb action movie bullshit which the filmmakers were too cool for school to even put a though to it, and did their best to rip off not Cameron's work, but Michael Bay's. When a fucking terminator mvoie has mroe to do with a Bay movie then a Cameron, something is just terribly fuckign wrong!<br><br>Pardon me if i'm not as an enthusiast for big dumb action movies as you are, but i fuckign dead tired of that bullshit now. Every fuckign one of them looks the same, all the same beats, all the same moments, all of them looking more like videogames then movies. If i want to play a videogame i buy one, i dont' go to the movies, thank you very much.<br><br>ST:TMP is a movie. The Terminator and T2 is a movie. T3 mannaged to be a movie. T4 is a videogame. T4 is such a failure, i have seen more cinematic quality in any GRAND THEF AUTO game then i could ever dream to hope to find in the McG's abomination.<br><br>And realy, if you love that Nice Apoocalypse stuff in McG's folly, i don't nkow what to say. The Safe Nice Apocalypse gerne, they should start that genre, they already have it figured out with McG's whateverthefuckthatshitissupposedtobe movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:42 a.m. CST

    More Nice Apocalypse movies!!!

    by AsimovLives

    It's the Emp Apocalypse, for the Twilight crowd! Have apocalypse movies, but don't be harsh onits looks, so that people don't feel upset with the imagery.<br><br>Next, people will create Nice Holocauts movies, where nothing bad happens to the jews during the holocaut, so not to hurt the sesebilities of movie audiences and allow people to enjoy the kick ass big action stuff.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:49 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    The critical mauling of people who said dumb shit about the movie don't compel me to revise my view of ST:TMP as the good movie it is. And the box offcie fact is that the movie made money to Paramount, it 3 times supassed it's budget, hardly the measure of a financial failure. If Paramount decided, in their idioticy, that the only acceptable results would be same box office results of Star Wars, it's their fault if they considered the movie below expectations. The movei also happened at the same time there was a change in the administration of Paramoutn,a dn the new people did their best to make the last regime, which green-lighted ST:TMP, to look bad. All new regimes at studios do this, to the point soemtimes they even saboutage the mvoie's advertizement with little promotion, to kick downthe former dudes so they can look better and the saviors of the studio. Politics.<br><br>So, what is the reason why ST:TMP is mistaken as a bad movie? Fallacious interpretation of the box offcie, and complaisn that the movie is more Star Trek and less Star Wars. I'm sorry, but i wipe my as on both that bullshit. But no matter, the people who complaiend that there was not enough Star Wars in Star Trek got their wishes with STINO. I bet it was worth the wait. Fucking asses!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:51 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Asi, I like you but if you put as much thought and energy into praising a film you did like as you do slamming a film you don't like then you might find more friends round here!<p> And for the record I enjoyed ST: TMP, T:SALVATION *and* STINO as you call it. Yes! I enjoyed 'em all! I WIIIIIIN!!!!!!!!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:54 a.m. CST

    There's an untapped market for NICE APOCALYPSE movies

    by AsimovLives

    If AICN is any indication, there should be more Nice Apocalypse movies being made. Who cares about a minimum realistic depiction of a post-nuclear war apocalypse ravaged wasteland? Who needs that shit? No, we need NICE APOCALYPSE movies, where things look much much better and much much cleaner then the most clean Mad Max rip off movie ever made. So that the gruesome doesn't distract from the big ass action stuff. NICE APOCALYPSE NOW!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:57 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    You never saw me talk about any of the Nolan's BAtman movies, have you? You would see me as passionate about those movies i love as i am abotut he shit i fell disgusted. Becasue the point here is that I'M PASSIONATE ABOUT MOVIES. MOVIES! CINEMA! You know what i'm saying, friend?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:59 a.m. CST

    Cobra--Kai

    by AsimovLives

    There's no win in enjoying bad dumb movies. Eventually it all will came back and bite you in the ass.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:02 a.m. CST

    APOCALYPSE NICE NOW

    by AsimovLives

    Courtesy of McG, so that you don't get distracted from the big action stuff. Aint he considered? Aint he NICE?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:04 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Drsambeckett1984

    I will accept that, TMP truly did go where no man had gone before, but that doesnt connect with auidences. <P> My only real problem with TMP is the strange characterisations of pretty much everyone, it isnt a bad movie by any stretch, but it is and never shall be Wrath Of Khan. Or The Voyage Home. Or The Undiscovered Country. Or Generations. Or First Contact. <P> But it is still a good chunk of Sci Fi, probably the most sci fi Trek ever made in fact.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:08 a.m. CST

    I hope in McG's T4 Part 2

    by AsimovLives

    The machines finally realsie the way to win over the humans is to bomb the fuel depots and cruipple them on their dependence on helicoppters and hellcat airplanes. Becasue of all the ideas i had gotten from the future as glimped by the otehr Terminator movies, never once i would ever dreamed the humans were that well equiped with combat and personal carrier vehicles. In fac,t McG's mvoie makes the humans very fucking lame, because with such superior equpment and they didn't won the machines right at the start, when they had even more of the superior weaponry tech stuff? What did the humans did at the start of the war, seated on their asses? I mean, the weater outside is not too bad, it's nothign worst then any sunny day aroudn LA, so what kepe them from going after the machiens when they were in their infancy of their empire building? The humansdid nothign so to give the machines a fighting chance? They were good sports?<br><br>Nothing in the McG Turdminator movie makes a lick of sense. Nothign makes any fuckign sense. And i'm supposed to find that bullshit entertaining? McG can shove his Nice Apocalyptse up his ass!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:17 a.m. CST

    Drsambeckett1984

    by AsimovLives

    I find lot sof characterization going on in ST:TMP. Thing is, and like in most Robert Wise movies, he's not on the nose about it. He goes subtle for many moments, trusting the audiences can catch up on the very time of thing that part helped made the 70s cinema what is considered the 70s cinema: subtle characterization. Yes, subtle characterization, it's there on ST:TMP. Problem was, audiences back then had been so flabergasted by Star Wars, they wanted more of the same. More Star Wars, more Star Wars, more Star Wars. Wrath Of Khan benefited from the dust had already settled down a bit and allow a more adventure-like Star Trek movie to be accepted. But it's sad that ST:TMP gets punished and bashed for the very thing that made Star Trek it's own thing, Star Trek.<br><br>And the fucking cokeheads idiots who complained about ST:TMP being boring are the same retards who complained the same about Blade Runner and The Thing. They can kiss my ass!! History already proved the supporters of those two later movies to be in the right. It will just take a little longer for ST:TMP to get it's must deserved justice. It' already started.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:44 a.m. CST

    McG must stay the fuck away from the TERMINATOR franchise...

    by Motoko Kusanagi

    ...or we'll get another PG-13 shitfest.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:56 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Drsambeckett1984

    You and I will always disagree about the new Star Trek. <P> But we can both agree that TMP is a good film and it dared to be different, it has a great soundtrack too! As a movie it is far from perfect but hardly deserves the scorn heaped upon it.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:21 a.m. CST

    Just picture Saving Private Ryan

    by SithMenace

    or any halfway decent war movie with Terminators as the bad guys instead of Nazis. That's it, that's all T:4 had to be. Instead it was fucked up by a payday loving hack with no understanding or love for the source material, no clue as to what makes a movie engaging and no idea how to direct or control actors.<p>It takes a special, special man to fuck Christian Bale's geek credibility up, but McG managed to do just that.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:31 a.m. CST

    I actually enjoyed TSAL

    by vezner2007

    It wasn't as good as T1 or T2 but it was still a fun ride. Since it doesn't look like Cameron is going to return to the series, I'm hoping MCG makes more because I'd like to see the story finished.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:32 a.m. CST

    vezner2007

    by SithMenace

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:35 a.m. CST

    Sorry, I'm a retard

    by SithMenace

    Anyway, what i was trying to say is that I hope McG gets replaces with a competent director and we get a competent screenwriter and Bale, if he comes back, gets his shit together.<p>If McG get rehired for the next film(s), I think I speak for alot of people when I say "I'm out". Period.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:45 a.m. CST

    Give Terminator to Ridley Scott

    by Abominable Snowcone

    so he can show us how it's done.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:54 a.m. CST

    There was no hopelessness in T:S

    by BendersShinyAss

    One thing i always felt from the terminator film (including 3) and the TV show, was a real sense of struggle. the machines are outmatched in everyway. death is always on the doorstep. characters die, no one is safe. John connor was the hope that for the remaining people. the whole world was obliterated except for a strong few who banded together at all costs. <p>Skynet knew this, hense the reason to go back in time and kill him. the machines arent rational - they're total mayhem and ultimate destruction. thats all they are. As gay as T3 was, at least it tried to continue the mythos and had the balls to end on a downer.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:03 a.m. CST

    Downer endings kick ass

    by Abominable Snowcone

    I'd like to see "happily ever after" drop dead forever

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:11 a.m. CST

    That's the thing i like the most about T3

    by AsimovLives

    DEspiste being the first 3 Terminator movies that hangs more on comedy, it still felt the need to be part of the whole mood that the first two movies created. and thus, there's that amazing, ass kicker, unexpectedly bleak ending. That ending made the movie more then anythign else. Everythign that went before gets to be seen in a whole new line. Things that wee before goofy or lightweight gain a new dramatic weight, thanks to the ending. T3 did some things right, but what it did brillantly was the ending. And you know, a great ending ALWAYS saves a movie, while a good movie can be completly fucked up by a bad ending. In amny ways, T3 is the most abnormal movie, one that goes completly agaisntthe grain, one that which the end far supasses the begining. most holylwood movies today have good beginings but then fuck up more and more as they go along, to the point the ending is a complete show of fuck up to low hell.<br><br>For the ending alone, i'll always defend T3. Specially against those who want to bash in ther attempt at support as defense of the complete horrid bullshit that is that T4 piece of crap.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:13 a.m. CST

    Always happy to watch Blade Runner or The Thing..

    by Billyeveryteen

    Over and over again.<p>Star Trek TMP? Not so much...

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:21 a.m. CST

    BendersShinyAss made an excelent point

    by AsimovLives

    In all of the previous Terminator movies, there's always a tangeble sense of despair and hopelessness. There is alwayus this sense that the machines are this close to win,a nd it takes the heros's com+plete effort, determination and sacrifice to live another day. and that's the point of the whole Terminator saga. To fight to live another day.<br><br>The Terminator saga had been, so far, then most stoic of the Hollywood mega-franchises. It's the one where there'sd never apromise of a happy jolly ending. All the good things, all victories are extremely hard earned, with blood, tears and sacrifice. Everything hurts. Things are gloomy and depressing. There an ongoing sense of fatalism in the Terminator sagas. And none is harder then the first movie, where basically the "hapy ending" of the mvoei is that Sarah Connor mannaged to survive so that she can birth the future savior of mankind, the one who, after decades of complete despair and genocidial war, mannages a near pyrric desperate victory. And the future world that's shown is a complete dumb of a future, all dirt, rusted, ruins, mud, cindered bones, ash, trash! The Terminator saga is very bleak BY IT'S OWN NATURE. That's how it is.<br><br>But now we have this hack boy, this guy who cut his teeth from hip hop MTV videos and Charlie Angles movies, and this guy is telling us how a Terminator should really be. He's showing us how to have fun at a Terminator movie. and that is by delivering lots and lots of "XPLOSIONS'" and lots and lots of action scenes that amount to nothing at all dramatically and advance nothing to the story, and all set in the cleanest post-apocalpyse world ever created for a movie. And i'm supposed to find this bullshit fun? THE FUCK I DO! Fuck this shit, man! Fuck this Nice Apocalypse bullshit! Fuck McG! And fuck those who though he was a good choice for this saga! Who the fuck are this assclowns, anyway? Fucking asses!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:22 a.m. CST

    Billyeveryteen

    by AsimovLives

    Your loss, dude. But it's good to know you have he love for Blade Runner and The Thing.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:24 a.m. CST

    A Ridley Scott's Terminator?

    by AsimovLives

    I could even imagine Scott saying "me doing a terminator movie? Cameron eats my sloppy seconds, not me his".<br><br>I kid, of course, From what i gathered, Scott and Cameron have nothing but great mutual respect for each other. To the point that Cameron wanted to write and produce an alien movie for Scott to direct.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:35 a.m. CST

    BurnHollywood...

    by KillDozer

    Whose to say how McG's crazy movie military does things? Apparently, according to you, they're cool with taking the commander of an elite unit and sending him off to be just another random ground trooper with a decidedly less elite unit. How does that make sense?<p>"We need one more warm body for this mission!"<p>"Well, we've got John Connor, commander of the Elite Unit (whose men are currently unavailable for this mission for some reason)or any other soldier."<p>"Connor it is!"

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:48 a.m. CST

    I'd rather see an end to the tv show

    by Drsambeckett1984

    It ended on an awesome cliffhanger, and should still be on tv! <P> I dont hate T3, it has some good parts as well as that killer ending. I also prefered Nick Stahl as Connor.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:50 a.m. CST

    The weird thing about John Connor in T4is that...

    by AsimovLives

    ... from the other Termionator movies, we get the notion that Connor was the leader of the resistance from day one. The was the very guy who created it. But in T4, he's still climbing ranks??<br><br>What McG tried to do with Terminator is what Jar Jar Abrams tried with Star Trek, both doing lip service to the previous instalements but in truth doing a reboot. I call this tactic the coward's reboot. Instead of pulling a Chiristopher nolan and do a real reboot, where everythign was started anew, thos two assclowns decide to do this hybrid mosntruosity, in which tires to be a continuation of what went before while at the same time a new start. And out cames this disjointed messy piece of shit. Truly, 2009 was the Year Of The Over-Egomaniac Clueless Hack.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:51 a.m. CST

    Some "Two Elements" crap...

    by pdennett316

    From Michael Bay - "There's two elements to sex - coke and hookers" <p> From Tiger Woods - "There's two elements to the perfect escape - avoid the hydrant, void the tree". <p>

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:53 a.m. CST

    awesome news...now let's see t800 v humans

    by krod

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:04 a.m. CST

    Funny that McG named sound before image

    by AsimovLives

    Whjat's even funnier is people saying that his T4 movie looks great. That's great cinematography? You know what, Bale was right, that DP should had his lights trashed. That's good cinematography? That piece of overabused cliché? The shit that passes for good cinematography this days! Unbelievable!! Fucking ass!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:07 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by Drsambeckett1984

    Maybe it has something to do with schewed and fucked up timelines, like the TV show? <P> Not making excuses for it though. And any excuse to bash Star Trek huh?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:08 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives...

    by KillDozer

    That bugged me about T4, too. Here's a guy who has unique knowledge about the future of mankind and some of the tools the enemy will use to try and destroy humanity. His journey in the 2nd and 3rd movies has been to come to terms with his destiny while learning the skills he needs to be a leader and by the end of the third movie we finally see him as a leader starting to unite the survivors in the Resistance effort. It's like McG saw the earlier movies and the only thing he came away with regarding Connor's character was that he liked talking into microphones.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:11 a.m. CST

    oof...

    by KillDozer

    I wrote that last post while being interrupted by several work phone calls. Sorry it's so disjointed, but I think you get the point:<p>McG just tossed pretty much everything we knew about Connor's character out the window and made him some insubordinate asshole who likes broadcasting lame speeches over the radio.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:13 a.m. CST

    Asimov

    by SithMenace

    At least Abrams' Trek tried to explain the differences (Successfully or unsuccessfully, depending on who you talk to, but at least they made the attempt), whereas McG's film just said fuck it.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:41 a.m. CST

    AsimovLives/KillDozer

    by BurnHollywood

    You're not thinking logically, same as those who slam the movie for all the leftover equipment aren't (you think the military DOESN'T stockpile weaponry in bunkers? Or that a nuclear sub couldn't easily survive a conflict?).<p> While Connor's a charismatic natural leader with an oracular view of future events, the survivors are initially going to look to the surviving military leadership for guidance, as represented by General Ashdown and his international peers. Whatever else Connor was, a ranking military officer he WASN'T. I don't think a rap sheet counts.<p> One of the things I really liked about SALVATION was the intermediate period it depicted ...Skynet has not yet implemented its "Future War" final solution, and Connor is still distinguishing himself in battle. Even Marcus makes sense...unable to create a fully autonomous Terminator yet, Skynet settled for what it thought was the next best thing...a human/machine hybrid.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:49 a.m. CST

    Nothing but praise for trek

    by BendersShinyAss

    Felt like i was reuinited with long lost family.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:02 a.m. CST

    If Sony buys the rights can they get James Cameron?

    by johnnyg korrupt

    Is there any fucking way James Cameron can get back on this? Come on Jim....Avatar looks like the worst parts of Episode 1 with Jar Jar on Naboo and the Aussie bloke has as much charisma as a rock. Make the film everyone wants to see with Arnie

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:05 a.m. CST

    BendersShinyAss

    by SithMenace

    I agree. Unlike T:S Trek was highly entertaining and had great characters portrayed by more than capable actors. A couple of script problems aside, I thought it was a great film and easily my favorite since TWOK.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:12 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    BurnHollywood, you talk sense. It's not rocket science, it's simple logic. You understand. I understand.<p> But to the dopey haters saying 'where'd the jets and subs come from' I have to say...<p> WHAT DONT YOU FUCKING UNDERSTAND?!!?.<p> Amateurs.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:23 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Knobules, have you even seen the film? Every single thing you just posted is inaccurate in some way. That's part of why you suck.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:26 a.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Knobules, sorry dude that was rude of me. And you were actually correct about the 'pretty explosion'. It's creepy but there is something strangely beautiful about a mushroom cloud isn't there....

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:29 a.m. CST

    BurnHollywood

    by AsimovLives

    The military stockpile equipment in bunkers??? What for? In case the worldis overrun by zombies? Not evne during the cxold war that was that big of a stockpile inside bunkers. Eventually it was known that the bunker stockpilying was a fallacy, it would matter nothing in the event of a real nuclear war, in which the afterward would just be a big cinder pile of which the tanks and airplanes would be compeltly useless... if there way anybody left to operate them. and today? There ar eno bunkers with stockpiled equipement. not in this time of war in Iraq and Afghanistan, where everythignis needed to be at hand, and not cozy stockpiled in some deep cavern in the mountains.<br><br>You know what 's illogical? Defending this piece of shit of a movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:35 a.m. CST

    Military and military hardware...

    by KillDozer

    is one of the reasons why this movie sucked so bad. Skynet is a military AI designed to take control of all military assets. It knows where all the equipment is kept, it knows where all the airstrips are, where the subs are located, it intercepts all military communications...that's why it has free reign to fuck everything up so badly and why it takes someone outside of the military chain (like a civilian with the right training and knowledge of the enemy) to take charge of a resistance made up of the fraction of humanity that's still alive.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:37 a.m. CST

    BurnHollywood, That is actually a lot more interesting

    by Spacezilla

    When you explain T4 in this way. I guess I can appreciate this idea that went into this. <P>Personally I was just hoping to get a fun Future War movie that looked like the beginning of T2, or the future scenes of the TV show (The show was way cooler Terminator then 3 or 4). But, I thought ok at least there will be a lot of robot fighting so that will be sweet. Well no, there really wasn't<P> Having said that, I think its better then 3 because for what robots we do see, specifically the T 600 and T 800 models, they are WAYYY more in the spirit of the T 800 and T 1000 ones from 1 and 2 respectively. <P> The biggest reason I would say 4 is better then 3 is because we got to see full on fucking Endoskeleton coming right the fuck to get you again. I love the visual of Endoskeleton Terminator doing what the fuck it does best. I can easily argue that seeing the T 800 full on Endoskeleton look coming for Sarah was far cooler then anything ithe T 1000 or TX whatever dumbshit that Terminator cunts number was. I just love seeing them. T2's best moment for me was the bieginning and seeing the and seeing the army of Terminator Endoskeletons killing humans and shooting fucking lasers. At least there was some Terminator endoskeleton goodness in T 4. Not anywhere close to the level of cool found in the beginning of T2 but made T4 a lot better then 3 for me. I stand by that shit.<P> Oh and speaking of music, in T 3 you get that fucking deal breaker unwatchable moment when Arnold is robbing that gas station market and the music playing is the gayest shit ever. "He's a funky man he's funky Funky" s the T 800 goes from the market to locking Kate back into the truck. The music actually gets really loud to emphasize that you are suppose to be sucking cock to really understand how cool all the gay shit is in the movie. T4 said fuck that. That shit was gay. We will fuck your ears instead with Guns N' Fucking Roses again. Seriously that shit in T4 was greatness. And speaking of greatness <P> Chinese Democracy is a goddamn masterpiece. Suck it T3 loving cocksuckers. <p> and having said all that, T4 kind of sucked.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:39 a.m. CST

    Asimov - you know what i dont get?

    by BendersShinyAss

    Everything you say of TS is valid. I've even found myself agreeing with some of your other film likes and dislikes ... yet when you start jabbering on about how bad trek is i find myself wondering if we even saw the same film? <p>I mean, I've got enough Trek memorabilia, DVD's, comics, artwork, novels & even scripts to know that Trek 09 was an absolute winner.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:42 a.m. CST

    T4 was a fine and enjoyable movie

    by billybigbollocks

    It didn't really fit in with the previous 3 though in tone or content or character. I think it deserved a better critical and financial reception though, and ironically the 'lead' was completely upstaged by the terminator..oh hang on, that's happened before yes?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:44 a.m. CST

    T3 FUCKING SUCKED

    by CaptainAxis

    And if you take off your nostalgia glasses, T1 and T2 aren't that great either. T1 was cool and original for its time, but it features some atrocious acting and it just looks dated. T2 was the template for Michael Bay movies with lots of pointless explosions, lifeless action, and grating "comedy" bits between a boy and his robot. T3 took the worst parts of both movies and slapped together a steaming shit sandwich. TS actually tried to do something different and gave me some exciting action scenes, as well as a thematic element about man against machine.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:46 a.m. CST

    CaptainAxis -

    by BendersShinyAss

    right, got it... T1 & T2 = shit. TS exciting and deep

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:55 a.m. CST

    BendersShinyAss

    by Drsambeckett1984

    Dont even bother trying to argue Star Trek with Asi, I too agree with almost everything he says. <P> But I loved the new Star Trek, I personally think anyone who didnt is crazy. <P> Terminator Salvation sucks big hairy monkey balls, until they are bone dry.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:04 a.m. CST

    Didn't say they were shit, did I?

    by CaptainAxis

    Not every movie has to be either THE MOST AWESOMEST MOVIE EVERRRRR or a massive hunk of shit, you know. T1 and T2 aren't shit, but they aren't flawless masterworks as many of you feel. They suffer from the same criticisms lots of you are throwing at TS. To each their own, unless you're seriously trying to argue that T3 is better than TS. In that case, you're just fucking retarded and should probably stop discussing film.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:11 a.m. CST

    I don't see how anyone that likes TOS

    by SithMenace

    could dislike Star Trek '09. It almost makes me think that most of the detractors aren't TOS fans at all, but rather TNG fans that are pissed that TNG's shitty 4 movie run was cut short.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:13 a.m. CST

    Star Trek: The Motion Picture is good sci-fi...

    by p0llk4t

    ...and AsimoGivesGoatHead is still the biggest douche on these boards. Which automatically puts him in the running for biggest douche in the universe.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:22 a.m. CST

    Kill me now

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave

    "T1 and T2 aren't that great either. T1 was cool and original for its time, but it features some atrocious acting and it just looks dated. T2 was the template for Michael Bay movies with lots of pointless explosions, lifeless action, and grating "comedy" bits between a boy and his robot."<p>Just when I thought I'd heard every kind of idiotic comment in TB, there always come along something new to top them.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:26 a.m. CST

    It's hilarious how T2 3D: Battle Across Time,

    by Turd_Has_Risen_From_The_Grave

    a theme park ride at Universal Studios, directed by James Cameron, has more imagination and excitement in its 15 minutes than the entirety of T3 and Terminator Salvation put together.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:47 a.m. CST

    LOL, not suprised

    by Ryanbraun14

    McG: "There's two elements that go into filmmaking. There's sound, and there's the picture."<br><br>Makes sense, because that movie had NO story. What the FUCK was he thinking by basically making this new character, who ultimately served no purpose, the star of the movie??? There was NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING that I wanted to see in T:S. How did John Connor get the position he did? Terminator: The sarah connor chronicles, actually examined John Connor and the mythology. There could have been soooo many good stories to tell in that movie but none of them were used. The movie is completely un-rewatchable. Action scene after action scene. Pointless movie, and a massive supply of untapped potential. Bring the tv show back!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 11:58 a.m. CST

    DVader that was the original ending?

    by Meadowe

    I heard about John Connor's skin being put on Marcus, but was Marcus really supposed to wake up and kill everyone? I never heard that before. Anyone care to go into more detail PLEEEEEEEASE?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:13 p.m. CST

    Huh. IMDb lists T5 as in development...

    by Jaka

    ...under James Cameron. Now, that doesn't really MEAN anything. But I thought it was interesting. <br><br> ST:TMP is good science fiction, but it's boring as hell. I'm a ginormous Trekkie, too, so I'm not just trying to be hateful or anything. That movie is a frickin' snoozefest.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:22 p.m. CST

    lol, and The Terminator is starting right now!

    by Jaka

    On one of the Encore channels - I'ma watch it.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 12:42 p.m. CST

    Nothing beats the first one. period!

    by Stalkeye

    Shit, like Escape from NY, I never thought termy would be hold such a place in my heart.pleasant suprise, both films were.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1 p.m. CST

    BendersShinyAss

    by AsimovLives

    Everythingi get right about the other movies is from the same reason i bash, and rightly so, the STINO bullshit. The thing is, it's not my problem. I udnerstand waht STINO really is. you guys who still like and defend it, youa re all mesmerized by the pretty lights. But ASTINO is a really bad movie. As bad as it gets. Sorry if i sound so harsh on it, friend. But no matter, we agree on many other things, and that what really matters the most. and we are on the same side on the T:S debacle. Soldier on, mate.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:03 p.m. CST

    McG...

    by Zahaladeen

    ...fails at life. McG! So bad. Laughably bad. He drew the worst performances out of everyone in that film and slapped together a wretched PG-13 popcorn flick that had so many holes in the plot it looked as if it were attacked by ravenous moths. McG! How this fucking mo-mo was allowed to direct is beyond me. Honestly. He couldn't direct traffic without fucking it up. McG!* *I wanted to include his name throughout my post in the same way this self-congradulatory asshat put his name in the opening credits of that shit-sack movie he used to bury the Terminator franchise. McG is a dried up stinky dick licker. I hope you read this and get fucked.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:06 p.m. CST

    Drsambeckett1984

    by AsimovLives

    And i think anybody who mistakes STINO for a good movie is suffering from some form of momentary madness. They act normal like and fine, abut you mention STINo, and they go foundie on Jar Jar Abrams. I can even picture the whole people who defend and hold STINO in high regard in some church building and they chanting in loud voices: "JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS!JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS! JAR JAR ABRAMS!"... ad infinitum.<br>It's like some god damn evangelical church meetingf. In fact, i compare the people who love STINO with the fundie evangelicals, this people who fully belive in a lie, in something with no resemblance to reality and which goes against all evidence and reason.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:10 p.m. CST

    Jaka

    by AsimovLives

    You know what i found very boring? Jar Jar Abram's STINO. When i see a movie made by the oldest cliches known in Holylwood, setrved with characters which are not characters but walking cliches, in a plot that makes no fucking logic and sense, all served with over-edited hysterical editing, all shot in super-close ups and with the stupidiest visual gimickry ever - the lense flares -, that is what bores the shit out of me. Compared to that, ST:TMP is a day at the races.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:10 p.m. CST

    Oh man the music in this movie is awful

    by Jaka

    But I hate most of the synthesized scores from 80s movies. Ladyhawke is the absolute WORST!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:13 p.m. CST

    p0llk4t

    by AsimovLives

    A sheep like you should be careful who you call a goat fucker. Just in case it's true. A sheep like you wouldn't stand a chance.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:15 p.m. CST

    Jaka

    by AsimovLives

    Don0t even mention the score of Ladyhawk. That shit is beyond descrioption! I want to forget i ever heard that shit.<br><br>But man, there's many electronic scores form the 80s which are charming. Risky Business, Tron, Blade Runner, The Hitcher, The Missing, The Bounty, to name a few, have all great charming electronic scores.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:17 p.m. CST

    SithMenace

    by AsimovLives

    It's because i like TOS that is ONE of the reason i rightly dislike that STINO piece of shit. One reason among many.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:18 p.m. CST

    T4 = Just a boring, unimaginative waste of film...

    by Mrhazard

    Terminator was one of my favorite movie franchises (just because of the first two films) but I think it's time to 'pull the plug'...<p>Somebody will probably reboot it years from now anyway but I've pretty much lost all interest for this series...

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:21 p.m. CST

    Star Trek

    by SithMenace

    is more than just pretty lights, it's great characters. I don't know how the people that hate that movie can't see what a good job they did with the characters, and isn't that what great Star Trek has always been about?<p>Sorry that there weren't any interstellar wars between the Klingons and the Kardashians in Star Trek '09, that's probably why the haters missed the point.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:22 p.m. CST

    Asimov

    by SithMenace

    Please tell me five solid reasons you hated Star Trek '09.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:23 p.m. CST

    Salvation was EASILY the third best film in the series...

    by Peter Franks

    search your feelings, you know it to be true. Aside from the last 5 minutes of T3, the movie is just a half-assed rehash of the previous (far superior) two. Salvation gets so much more hate than it deserves.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:27 p.m. CST

    Peter

    by SithMenace

    IMO T:S was a DOA POS. LOL.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:32 p.m. CST

    "between the Klingons and the Kardashians"

    by Jaka

    LMAO. My problem with ST09 is just that it's a lame ass re-boot. It's a well established story with a well established timeline (10 movies, over 500 books and counting, and I have no idea how many comic books). There was no need to flippantly disregard all the history to RE-tell an already well told story. It was unimaginative and unnecessary. My argument has always been, and ONLY been, that they needed to have enough imagination to move the story FORWARD. However, I don't want to get into all that. I just wanted to say that " a war between the Klingons and the Kardashians" cracked me the hell up!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:37 p.m. CST

    Spacezilla

    by BurnHollywood

    Thanks, and you make a good point...this was the first movie in the series where we could at least see an endoskeleton in all its glory since the big reveal in T1, whose stop-motion looks fairly antiquated by CGI standards (not Cameron's fault, he did the best he could).<p> I'm not in love with this movie, but I think it got a shittier rap than it deserved...it was intended to be the opening movie of a new trilogy, and it was serviceable in that mode, IMHO.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:39 p.m. CST

    McG as MC

    by Guy Grand

    I've read that McG is actually slated to be a speaker and introduce a screening of the sublime, groundbreaking, and iconic masterpiece, "The Graduate," this month at LA's Skirball Center. Mike Nichols...if you read this, please get on a plane, fly out here, and kick McG and whoever else programmed this event in the Skirballs. What's next? Uwe Boll presenting "Sophie's Choice?"

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 1:41 p.m. CST

    Film opinions are personal around here...

    by Cellar Door

    Dont even play yo. Your appreciation of movie X offends me. My appreciation of movie Y offends you. What to do when opinions differ?<p>Simple.<p>WAR!!!!!!!!!!<p>Hence my more civilized suggestion of Battle Royale 2000 (soon to be the new, improved version: Battle Royale 2010) where we can gather to do great bodily harm to those we simply cannot stomach having their own opinion.<p>Some of the shaved geeks here at aicn made quite the spectacle when Dr. Uwe dropped the first gauntlet..and that man is nothing if not an inverse genius so here we are...full circle...<p>BATTLE ROYALE 2000!!!!!!<p>Fans of T1,T2 in this corner...fans of T3,T4 in that corner (if you like all of them or none of them or at least aren't absolute in your opinions on them, beat feet immediately and stop fucking up the drama dude!)

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:19 p.m. CST

    In reading his view...

    by cheyne_stoking_DMS

    of his Red Dawn remake: "Call of Duty like." Such an asshole.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:26 p.m. CST

    SithMenace

    by AsimovLives

    I find great characters in Star Trek when i watch TOS. STINO, not so much. Unless you mistake the Nu Kirk, who is a punk ass good for nothing irirtating nob who gets aroundin life through sheer luck and neopotism, and who spends the whole movie getting punched and beaten up by everybody and their granny. that's a great character? And this emo version of Spock who has nothing alien about him but the pointed ears. That's a great character? Boles spends half the time repeating dialogue form the TOS Tv show. That's great characters? Chekov is reduced to a blablering incompreensible psudo-russian who suddently became Will Crusher when the plot needs. That's a great character? Sulu forgets to mention, until the very last second, that he has no compab experience tha the only weapon he's good at is a sword. That's a great character? Uhura gets to be in the kewl ship because she pressures he boyfriend to put her pretty ass in. That's a great character? andwhat about the amazing fuckign villain the movies has, hem? What a fucking great character! I'd love to see you try to defend that! Yeah, STINO is choked full of great characters... IN FUCKING HELL!<br><br>God's sake, just admit you don't know why the fuck you like STINO, don't invent reasons that are not there. You love the movie ON FAITH! That's it.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:28 p.m. CST

    Red Dawn remake

    by AsimovLives

    That's just completly wrong on ways it's not even funny to mention! What the fuck are this people thinking? My only hope is that John Milius got payed a really fat paycheck.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:31 p.m. CST

    Fareal

    by AsimovLives

    Her also forgot story, didn't he? Small wonder his Terminator movie sucked so much. Seems McG is like some geeks, he thinks what made the Terminators movie great is that is has action set pieces. When in fact, what made them great, and made them stood from the pack of the other action movies stravaganzas, was the story and characters. Even the 3rd movie bothered with that, and made it's best to have an impactful and dramatic ending to hsow some merit to be in the same company of the hallowed predecessors. And what did the 4th movie tried to do to made an impact? To steal onme of the Transformers from Michael Bay's movie. Fucking ass!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:36 p.m. CST

    Peter Franks

    by AsimovLives

    I searched my feelings and they told me that T4 is an unredeamable piec eof shit, and anybody who tries to put any of the 3 previous movies below it is a fool. Search your feeling,s you know this to be true.<br><br>No, better yet, fuck the feelings, search YOUR MIND! Because this is what has been terribly absented lately at AICN. It's all this emo feellings searching bullshit, and no reasoning and use of mind and reason and rationality. Thinking with your feeling sis the same as thinking with your ass, the end result is all a pile of shit! Use your feelings for love, not for thinking!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 2:52 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives...

    by Rakafraker

    You are so manic. How many posts in how many hours? In EVERY TB??? You must have a lot of time on your hands.<p>You know, at first I defended you, or more accurately, your right to have an opinion. Now I see why most people here dislike you.<p>My bitch was that people blame a director for producer's faults. These people don't know who's job it is to do what in a film's production.<p>You truly are a sad, pathetic, manic little beast.<p>P.S. Don't bother leaving me one of your overwrought diatribes, I won't check this TB again.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:14 p.m. CST

    AsimovLives

    by CaptainAxis

    Please explain what you found redeemable about T3 and why you don't bash it as a pile of shit? I just bought the T3 Blu-ray and watched it last night, so it's very fresh in my mind. And it fucking blew, especially in comparison to TS. The tone was all over the map - it's goofy comedy in several scenes and tries to be serious in others. Arnold was more cartoonish than ever as he looks like he can barely keep a straight face. The streets of LA (or wherever they're supposed to be) are basically deserted day and night so that when we get all the pretty explosions and pointless action, nobody gets hurt. It's the definition of a cash-in sequel for Arnold and the filmmakers, and it's fucking offensive that anyone could defend it.<br> <br> But please, go right ahead and defend this brainless piece of crap.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:16 p.m. CST

    Whoa Asimov, calm down

    by SithMenace

    Seriously dude, it's only a movie. I see how you picked the absolute worst case for each character, I'm not surprised. <p> Kirk had the rebellious but brilliant attitude in TOS as well, it's just that this time he grew up without a father and needed to discover who he is. Completely reasonable. When he got his ass kicked it was by a)4 humans, b)a huge Romulan, c)an angry Vulcan. It's not like Chekov beat him up. Btw, he got his ass kicked in TOS as well, but was usually saved by either his brain or the crew.<p>Spock I have to agree with you about, I wasn't crazy about Quinto. But then again, who could really do that role as well as Nimoy?<p>Not sure who Boles is but I think you mean Bones. Bones was dead on and Urban pulled off the cranky but likable personality and then some. Not sure what you mean about half his lines quoting the show, but then again, it is TOS, so his lines would be like the original. Are you now complaining it's TOO MUCH like TOS?<p>In TOS Chekov was young and brilliant with a heavy Russian accent. In ST '09 Chekov was young and brilliant with a heavy Russian accent. Not sure what the problem is here.<p>What are you talking about Sulu forgets to mention he has no combat experience except fencing? This is the way it went...Kirk asked anyone on the ship if they had combat experience. Sulu said yes, Kirk said let's go. Time was running out, was Sulu supposed to type a resume for him? Then, when they got a minute to talk, Kirk ASKED FOR A LITTLE MORE DETAIL. Sulu said fencing. Kirk got worried. Completely reasonable, as Sulu felt that he needed to step up to the plate regardless of the type of training.<p>Uhura was a brilliant xenolinguist, and when she was not assigned to the top ship, she went to the person responsible for ship assignments, who happened to be her boyfriend, and listed her credentials. You make it sound like she went to Spock and said "Uhhh, put me on cause I'm your girlfriend". Wrong.<p>Nero was a perfectly fine villain. Not the greatest, but not the worst. If there was a more complicated villain they wouldn't have been able to spend the much needed time fleshing out the main characters. <p>I know why I like Star Trek '09 Asimov, it's because they nailed the characters. It's because it was funny and exciting. It's because Abrams had the balls to do something different and succeeded. It's because we finally got Kirk, Spock and McCoy back. It's because these characters won't die with the original actors. It's because we didn't have to sit through a halfassed TNG Wrath of Khan rip-off with lame boring, characters. But mostly, it's because I love TOS and I'm happy it's back.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:21 p.m. CST

    Why T:S isn't the shitfest you say it is...

    by Cellar Door

    Not remotely because it's great as a Terminator movie. Not remotely cause it's a great summer action movie like the old days.<p>No.<p>I like to think of it as not a total shitfest as because I think it's what someone like Michael Bay is going for...if Bay was successful.<p>Outside of random and mindless hotness (Megan Fox) these movies are bereft of story and character development but heavy on effects and, for lack of better description, WTF moments of suckage/kewlness.<p>If you watch Transformers and pull out the bulk of the non-fighting set pieces, you'd have a decent if almost unwatchable manic action movie of perceivable depth.<p>In watching T:S, I think I realized that for an action driven movie, that McG basically did an exemplary job in making a mindless but yet still worthy of the title "action" movie. Same as what you'd have left from Bay's crap if you boiled down all of the gags and bullshit and annoying characters.<p>Haven't seen T2:RofF so can't say but I once saw McG as a "poor man's" Michael Bay and now I see McG as a coke-less, not quite as fucking manic batshit nuts, but basically the same, as Michael Bay.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Nailed the characters...

    by Jaka

    ...to the wall and launched projectile weapons at them. If that's what you meant, sure. If you mean they resemble the already existing tv series, movies and books. Well, wrong. And there really isn't an argument for it. Only Karl Urban gets remotely close to the previous established character archetypes.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:35 p.m. CST

    I disagree Jaka

    by SithMenace

    I love the TOS characters as much as anyone, and I think the new characters are great (except spock, I wasn't crazy about Quinto). They got the basic feel of the characters without resorting to imitations of the original actors, which would have been disasterous.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:48 p.m. CST

    Is Michael Bay really a cokehead?

    by SithMenace

    I always see people say how he's coked out, but is there anything to support this? The only place I've ever heard it is on forums.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 3:55 p.m. CST

    Part of the reason I'm so kind on Salvation ...

    by ganda1f

    After thinking about it, part of the reason why I'm a bit more forgiving of Salvation is that it didn't try to be a direct continuation/sequel of the first two films.<br><br>During the third Terminator film, the presence of Arnie and the fact that this was continuing the story of T2 kept reminding me of it's inadequacies, and the fact that it basically craps all over the end of T2.<br><br>Whereas Salvation, whilst it called back to the first two (three?) films frequently, didn't seem like a half-assed comedy hour imitation.<br><br>The lesson here is, if you're going to create a sequel to a James Cameron film, don't try to imitate him. You'll come out looking like the poorer cousin, and I won't buy any of your movies on DVD or Blu-Ray. <br><br>(I'm sure that the movie studios' are quaking in their boots at the prospect of me not buying their movies.)

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:12 p.m. CST

    ST: TMP The most sci-fi Mainstream Movie

    by Autodidact

    Not counting 2001, it's hard to think of a big budget Hollywood movie that was more hardcore sci-fi than The Motion Picture. I think the movie's great but even I can admit it's got some editing and pacing issues. Every scene goes on like 25% too long, same problem PJ's King Kong has imo.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:13 p.m. CST

    Rakafraker

    by AsimovLives

    Today it wa an holiday in my coutnry. How's that for an excuse, smarty-pants?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:31 p.m. CST

    Q!

    by AsimovLives

    Oh yeah, the tired old cliche of the fatherless kid who grew up without a father and thus became a punk ass dumb stupid teen fuck up idiot. How many times i have seen that bullshit onscreen? Asnwer: TOO MANY FUCKING TIMES. And always in dumb stupid movies. It's easy characterization for lazy ass untalented hacks. How the fuck people don't start laughing at this shit when it shows onscreen is beyond me.<br><br>And you know what blows my mind? Is the golden lost oportunities they missed with the fatherless Kirk scenario. I mean, Kirk mommy marries an upstanding great guy. Kirk dad dies heroically. It means the guys automatically became an hero figure for Kirky to emulate and be inspired. And what the movie does? It turns him into those instant just-add-water emo middle class pretending to be rebelious punk ass nothing! Oh, wow, i'm so fucking impressed! Great fucking characterization there! And there's more to come!<br><br>So, Kirk Mommy was great at chosing ehr first hubby. And for hubby number two, what she does? She marries a guy that alienates the young Kirk? What the fuck happened to the woman? She lost her capacity to get a good man for husband? Seh got lucky the first time? I mean, she's not an hag or soemthing, she's played by top hottie Jennifer Morrison. she has the kilelr looks, and she was so right for the first hubby. Fails at the second and marries a jerk that alienates youg kirk enough to revenge and take the stepfather's car? What kind of bullshit is this? What the fuck is this? Kirk is Snow White now? GIVE ME A FUCKING BREAK!!<br><br>And i leave the ebst for last: So, now that Kirk mommy is a widow, wouldn't she in her grive grativate to the good freinds she and her dead husbad had? And who was his best friend? CAPTAIN PIKE. Wouldn't it be logical that in a universe where Kirk grows orphan of father, his mother would remarry to Captain Pike? Thus, we would get a movie where a kirk would had a fatehr as a hero, and his new father would be Captain Pike. Kirk would had two academy heroes toc all a father. with such great father figures to look up to, Kirk would grow up to be as a great man as he was in the TOS, if not even greater.<br><br>The fucking moronic incompetent filmamkers who made the STINO piece of shit dln't evne understand the potential of the scenarios they create. Instead, they went for the easy way out cliche ville route. and i'm suppsoed to be awed and imrpessed by their "eeforts"? The fuck i am. THE FUCK I AM! They are retarded, they created a retarded story, and their movie is shit! there's not a single fuckign minute in that exacrable piec eof shit that doesn't remind me i'm watching a fuckign god-awful movie made by complete retards. And that i'm not going to mistake for a good movie EVER!<br><br>And that's just a telling detail, among the inumerous retarded shit this movie is infested with. Yeah, great fucking movie that STINO pice of shit is! Right!<br><br>No, i'm not pointing at the character's flaws. I'm point at the characterization's flaws, courtesy of the retards who made this movie. The whole characters are a bunch of walking flaws, denoting the compelte incompetent of the assclowns who made the fucking movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:34 p.m. CST

    Ops, sorry about that

    by AsimovLives

    Normal programming resuming.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 4:45 p.m. CST

    Autodidact

    by AsimovLives

    While i enjoy the fact you like ST:TMP, and you rightly see it as a rare example of a complete and rare case of Hollywood making a full on SF movies (instead of the action/SF hybrids they mostly do), you are wrong in one thing: the movi works, and is good because of the lenght of the scenes. The scenes ar enot 25% longer then they shoudl be, they are the exact lenght they should be. Courtesy of Robert Wise, which in case you don't know, started as an editor. He was considered one of the finest editors in movies, and when he directed he had an esquisite notion of editing while still filmming. He edited while shooting.<br>The pacing that ST:TMP has is the pacingthe story nand the mvoie needs to tell that story. To rush into a story like that would be folly. It woud be stupid. Robert Wise was not stupid. He did what he had to do for that movie to be right. a faster pacing to that movie would ruin the mood, and this is a story where mood is king and emperor.<br><br>If people get bored watching it, it's their problem, not the movie. If they ar etoo conditioned to super-fast paced movies they can no longer appreciate a slower paced movie, it's their problem, not the movie. And certainly, it's not that fuckign piece of hack retardness that is Jar Jar Abrams that is going to show how to edit a movie over Robert Wise. robert Wise was a real filmmaker. Jar Jar Abrams is a fucking executive that con his wa to directing thanks to backstage studio politics, and con his way into the hearts of geeks because keep on self-promotiong like there's no tomorrow. sor,y but me, i rather stick to someone like Robert Wise, the truly talented filmmakers.<br><br>ST:TMP IS A STAR TREK MOVIE. Jar Jar Abrams STINO is a bad cliché infested dumb action movie made as a Star Wars rip off calling itself Star Trek. Guess which movie i like best.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:32 p.m. CST

    Let me get this straight, Asi...

    by TedKordLives

    It's a holiday over there and THIS is how you spend it? Come on, man, go out and DO something. Please?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:44 p.m. CST

    most people on here just hate everything

    by Kammich

    seriously, i like living in my dull-minded little bubble. my sheer obliviousness to all things intellectual has allowed me to enjoy movies like Star Trek and Terminator Salvation at a very surface level. and when I see movies I really don't like, i just discard them. i don't spend 6 months inciting internet message board guerrilla warfare on the filmmakers and fan bases.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 5:52 p.m. CST

    I know, seriously Kammich

    by SithMenace

    It's been 7 months since Star Trek came out but Asimov is angrier than ever. And on his day off too. That dude really needs to take a pill or something. Lol.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:10 p.m. CST

    Asimov. lol.

    by SithMenace

    Dude, really, take some of that energy and put it into something worthwhile.<p>So the fatherless kid is a cliche? How about the middle aged man with the mid-life crisis? That's a cliche but that's exactly what TWOK did.<p>Pike became Kirk's hero/savior/father figure regardless. That's alot of what this movie was about, Kirk finding his way and Pike being a huge part of it. And Kirk wasn't "stupid" and an "idiot", he was a "genius level repeat offender". Next time pay attention to the movie instead of seething with misplaced hatred. <p>So the movie sucks because Kirk's mother didn't hook up with Pike? LOL.<p>Yeah, the filmakers are retarded, but you've been raving on the internet for 7 months about a movie you hate. And then you spend your day off doing it. Seriously, dude, see a professional.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:54 p.m. CST

    SithMenace

    by TakingScorpiosCalls

    It's pretty established he snorts coke off of hooker's asses. Although not on the level of Brett Ratner's depraved orgies.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 6:58 p.m. CST

    Take a Goat to Work is a holiday in Portugal?

    by DrMorbius

    Will it be The Shat, or the aptly named #2 (Riker)? ALINO ALINO ALINO ALINO ALINO ALINO ALINO ALINO

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:08 p.m. CST

    I hate, literally, everything.

    by TedKordLives

    I hate that I'm typing these words (which I also hate) right now. <P> I hate the internet and my computer. I hate my fingers.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 7:54 p.m. CST

    2 things I loved in SALVATION:

    by CountryBoy

    1)the helicopter/mushroom cloud scene 2)the harvester scene Just based on those, I can't hate McG...

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:01 p.m. CST

    Kammich, these cunts on here HATE everything!

    by ZodNotGod

    If the Lord Jesus himself came down off the cross and conversed with each and everyone of these haters and guranteed them a place in heaven, they would bith till they were blue in the face about the blood on the carpet. NOTHING SATISFIES THESE PEOPLE. T3 is better than T2 and Salvation is not bad at all. McG's only sin really is his dumb name and "Charlie's Angels" film rape. He was attached to do "Superman Returns" at one time, but backed out because he wanted the film shot in America, as he felt Supes was a piece of Americana and to film in Australia would cheapen the character. The kid is in my cool book for that.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:20 p.m. CST

    I'm greedy, no choosing for me!

    by ZodNotGod

    WOW! I'm lucky, in my geek circles, I don't have to choose. I love "Star Trek: The Motion Picture" and I love the latest incarnation. So good not to have to choose!!!!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:21 p.m. CST

    Actually Zod

    by TedKordLives

    McG couldn't get on the plane to Australia because he's afraid of flying. That's why he bailed on the movie. Look it up, I'm completely serious.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:21 p.m. CST

    The fatherless kid cliche didn't bother me...

    by Jaka

    ...so much as the fact that Kirk already had a well established back story. One that is contained in several of what are widely considered some of the best Trek books ever written. Oh, but this is a re-boot, so that doesn't count. Siiiiiiigh.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 8:41 p.m. CST

    mcg is a better director

    by Ash_Williams

    than james cameron ever was.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:33 p.m. CST

    DrMorbius what does the AL stand for?

    by Meadowe

    Cuz im assuming ino=in name only?

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:39 p.m. CST

    Salvation was boring

    by batzilla

    It was kind of just...gray to me. The color, story, acting, action...just kind of a dull shade of gray. I wouldn't watch it again that's for sure.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:43 p.m. CST

    Meadowe..

    by DrMorbius

    AsimovLivesInNameOnly=ALINO

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 9:56 p.m. CST

    DrMorbius thanks

    by Meadowe

    First that diqblood guy now everyone's fave "alleged" goat lover. Will someone name themselves M3@dow3 next? Cuz that would roq!

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:01 p.m. CST

    T4 wasn't very good...

    by The_Crimson_King

    the ending left me with an overwhelming feeling of "meh"

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:13 p.m. CST

    It's not that ST:TMP was a bad movie

    by rogueleader66

    It just wasn't a very interesting movie. It was an big budget remake of TOS episode "The Changeling" which was, IMO, better. It was well made, had awesome effects and you can see a lot of care went into making it. It just didn't hold my interest, not because of it's 2001 type of feel which was fine, I, honestly was just bored, as was a lot of the other Trekkies I saw it with. <P>Not a bad movie by any means, just a blah movie.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:32 p.m. CST

    Star Trek

    by Toonol

    Gosh, it sure was a successful, popular, critically acclaimed movie. It also served to give JJ Abrams a LOT more clout in Hollywood.<p> Just wanted to remind everybody.

  • Dec. 8, 2009, 10:59 p.m. CST

    Toonol, two words...

    by Jaka

    Twilight Saga. Popularity does not equal quality. And clout in Hollyweird just means you made somebody else a lot of money.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 12:03 a.m. CST

    Meadowe- T4's original ending

    by DVader

    Just google McG Drew McWeeney Hitfix interview and the video should pop up. Its amazing that he thought that ending was a good idea.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 12:36 a.m. CST

    thanks vader, btw.....

    by Meadowe

    Didn't you used to have a period after your name? Or maybe you forgoot your login info haha.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 1:34 a.m. CST

    T:S vs STINO

    by BendersShinyAss

    I can't remember a damn thing about T:S -- so i guess im not the best person to be posting this. but even Asi will admit to seeing the film several times in the cinema, and buying the blu-ray (or DVD) and watching it both with and without commentary. <p>Asimov.... I bet you've even donea flick thru just to certain bits you felt the need to watch again. <p>admit it, you LOVE and ADORE the new trek. I mean, I fucking loath Nemesis the way you claim to loath jar jars trek..... but I've only seen nemesis once. and when reviewing i simply say 'it was fucked up' ..... <p>done

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 1:35 a.m. CST

    i was talking about trek above

    by BendersShinyAss

    sorry... fatigue. i'm going now. <p>but my point still stands... Asimov loves star trek. Let him have his rants. He's a bigger fan than all of you

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 2:41 a.m. CST

    As terrible..

    by Miles_Teg

    As Nick Stahl was as John Connor, Christian Bale did a fine job of screwing it up himself. If I was in the resistance, fuck If I'd follow the asshole whose only volume seems to be scream and panic.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 5:35 a.m. CST

    Everyone on this site secretly liked the movie

    by Nabster

    nerds are nerds.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 6:37 a.m. CST

    Jaka

    by SithMenace

    You didn't seriously compare Trek '09 to Twilight, right? Yeah, they both made alot of money and yeah, gross is not an interpretation of quality, but for Christ's sake, look at the reviews. Twilight is at 28% on RT, while Trek was one of the best reviewed movies of the year, 95%.That's ridiculously high for any film, but for a sci-fi movie that's almost unheard of.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 6:55 a.m. CST

    WTF T3>T4 thats a lot of suck MCG

    by army_of_the_twelve_monkeys

    Ok I couldnt be bothered seeing T4 after reading enough smack talk about it, but really some people on here are saying that T3 > T4 Seriously T3 sucked hairy monkey balls Furlong's Connor was a smart little badass and we all wanted to be him when I was 11... Nick Stahl was a whining DOUCHEBAG... Future leader of the resistance, NOT A FUCKING GLIMMER! I could take a reprogrammed 'nice' terminator in T2, him shooting out kneecaps ("He'll live") was still badass, but in T3 he was PUSSYFIED. When he was struggling against his programming near the end, that bit where he's trying to kill JC... man I havent laughed so much at arnie since Mr Freeze... Seriously it would have to be a stinking pile of rectal prolapse foxshit to be worse than that film. It CANT be worse surely... SURELY??????

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 10:05 a.m. CST

    Meadowe- I did have a period after my name

    by DVader

    And I found my old name, D.Vader, blocked after I chastised Harry and Capone for their terrible "A Christmas Carol" reviews. Dunno if it was just coincidence or if someone really got upset and decided to block me bt not out and out ban me. <p> I asked Quint for help and initially he said he would, but then he started ignoring every email I sent him for a month. Sent Harry an email too. Surprise surprise that I got no response. So I got tired of the ineffective AICN staff and just made this new name. But I'd rather have D.Vader back, as I've had that one since 1997 and it just feels more comfortable.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 12:19 p.m. CST

    arnie might be running the

    by emeraldboy

    mpaa. very soon.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 12:38 p.m. CST

    interesting, DVader

    by Meadowe

    I remember way back when seeing harry on entertainment tonight or access hollywood, talking about how he had seen the then unreleased star wars episode II. He described it like a covert mission or something. Anyway I figured if this dude could see it early his site must be really cool, so that's when I first started cheqing it out. My pops wouldn't let me post though (I was like 6). Anyway I would cheq back in every now and then, I had really not cared about posting my musings and opinions anymore and it wasn't until this summer that I got the itch back. It was during the whole harry "wtf this fox reviewer reviewd the leaked wolverine footage, he's saying it's easier to understand than The Dark Knight, he should be fired" fiasco. And of course people were like "headgeek wtf you saw aotc illegally why you tryin to get homey fired for, that's so hypocritiqal". And that reminded me of my first exposure to harry, and by the time I had time to go try to post that freakin tb was looooooong so I said forget it, everything I wanted to say had been said so many times. Personally I thought it was kinda hypocritiqal, but hey this is his site so he can run it how he wants. And admittedly I'm hypocritiqal on some shtuff so that's why I didn't say anything. Anyway sucks you aren't able to get your period (hee hee!) I haven't seen the mcg video about the ending because I haven't been on a pc since Sunday (I usually post on aic from my phone) but I saw the tb that drew linked to from hitfix, it was dated 6.2008 yet I barely recognized any names despite it being only a year and a half ago, so I kinda feel bad that you've had your period (hee hee!) since 97 and aren't getting it back anytime soon. Btw harry if you're reading this are you on any dvd's I know of, I've only seen you on norton's incredible hulk screening on the special features.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 1:38 p.m. CST

    Actually...

    by Marathoner

    T4 was damn good - no director should attempt to follow-up Cameron, however, even as he's derided in other forums, as that director will never be able to meet expectations. McG = Fincher.

  • Dec. 9, 2009, 5:52 p.m. CST

    Marathoner, you might be onto something.

    by ganda1f

    In comparing Alien 3 to T4.<br><br>Much like T4, Alien 3 suffered from script and rewrite problems. Different circumstances (Producers and stars vs. writers strike) but it still goes to show that:<br><br> a) Making a film with an incomplete script with a wobbly ending, and<br><br>b)Following up a James Cameron film are two things guaranteed to make you film look worse than it really is.

Top Talkbacks