Oct. 13, 2009, 2:29 p.m. CST
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:34 p.m. CST
...that the movie perfectly captures what it is like to be NINE. someone is either lying, wrong, or incompetent.<P> TYPICAL AICN REPORTING BULLSHIT.
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:38 p.m. CST
...Mr. Beaks fails at birthdays.<P>god I should be working.
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST
Apologies for aging up Max.
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:43 p.m. CST
...if the movie lives up to the descriptions.<P>I'm done being a dick.
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:48 p.m. CST
...run little brethren boy, run!
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:51 p.m. CST
Oct. 13, 2009, 2:59 p.m. CST
...FIRE song No Cars Go that is like this little spooky remnant, or bit of found footage...I couldn't stop watching it for about a week.
Oct. 13, 2009, 3:23 p.m. CST
Every set photo I see is Spike touching, hugging, or carrying the kid actor around. Hope someone's keeping their eyes on that situation:-)
Oct. 13, 2009, 3:24 p.m. CST
by Stunt Vocalist 709
Virtually everyone I have talked with at work are sincerely jazzed to see this. And the age range is impressive. This movie may well do far better B.O. than a film this courageous usually would.
Oct. 13, 2009, 3:26 p.m. CST
by Six Demon Bag
Oct. 13, 2009, 3:30 p.m. CST
...how much she want to see this. Out of the blue, apropos of nothing...she just brought it up.
Oct. 13, 2009, 3:55 p.m. CST
...by default.<P>I will also now start the rumor that Mr. Beaks and I are the same person. That should be fun. <P>As winner, all opinions must be run by me before posting and will be voted on by committee...and I will issue parking passes as I see fit.<P>My official position is that WHERE THE WILD THINGS ARE looks good, possible great, and that this was an informative and inspiring interview. If you disagree, well...you lost. So eat me slowly.
Oct. 13, 2009, 4:17 p.m. CST
...are in my bowels. I should'nt have had Taco Bell for lunch.
Oct. 13, 2009, 4:22 p.m. CST
you're an asshole
Oct. 13, 2009, 4:45 p.m. CST
you're an asshole. in case you are not really the same person as beaks - sorry, i take it back!
Oct. 13, 2009, 5:15 p.m. CST
Oct. 13, 2009, 5:27 p.m. CST
Oct. 13, 2009, 5:30 p.m. CST
another beautiful movie. Where the hell is Lynne Ramsey? Someone please give her money to make another movie.
Oct. 13, 2009, 5:55 p.m. CST
Everyone I've ever met who loves Arcade Fire is a pretentious piece of shit.
Oct. 13, 2009, 6 p.m. CST
http://tinyurl.com/yjhbmld <P> It was hard to find again...this is crappier quality than I remember...sort of a spooky pied piper thing.
Oct. 13, 2009, 6:17 p.m. CST
...may your walkman never eat your beloved KISS tapes.<P>You cuntcake.
Oct. 13, 2009, 6:52 p.m. CST
Oct. 13, 2009, 6:56 p.m. CST
It's not their fault. Geezus, look what happened to Trent Renznor…
Oct. 13, 2009, 7:18 p.m. CST
Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fapFap. Fap. Fap. Fap. Fap fap<p> FAP. <p> Thus, your rotten tomatoes overall AICN critical spooogamatic rating for dis here lovely bowl of Cinematic Haggis. Enjoy.
Oct. 13, 2009, 8:22 p.m. CST
to the Arcade Fire EP version. And both aren't as good as seeing it played live. The Arcade Fire is so awesome live, but they definitely aren't a stadium band. They have to be seen in a place no bigger than the Warfield (SF), Paladium (LA), House of Blues (NOLA), et al.
Oct. 13, 2009, 10:06 p.m. CST
someone just put the music to No Cars Go over it...<p> here's the original:<p> http://tinyurl.com/2s7lk2
Oct. 13, 2009, 11:18 p.m. CST
Oct. 14, 2009, 1:33 a.m. CST
All the music is designed to evoke "the magic of childhood." It's as phony and disingenuinous as everything about this film, from the hipster advertising campaign to the font to the Arcade Fire tuneless tune. It's ugly, angry and depressing - a glum little tantrum by a wanna-be. You can tell from watching the ads. It's filled with phony emotion and phony sentiment. Not a word or image in the trailer rings true. Nine-year-old kids are filled with rage, with hatred. They don't - nor should they - forgive so easily as this movie seems to imply. A little jaunt to the forest and oh-dear-I-miss-home. Goodbye, Scarecrow! I'll miss you most of all! Want to see a real movie about childhood? Watch THE REFLECTING SKIN.
Oct. 14, 2009, 1:35 a.m. CST
Should be "it's ugly, not angry enough and...
Oct. 14, 2009, 1:45 a.m. CST
The problem I have with this story goes well beyond the movie. Feel free to share this with Mr. Jonez or Mr. Maurice S. or whatever. As a kid, I always felt betrayed by the story, like it somehow weakened me. I always thought Max lost something precious during the course of the tale. At the story's beginning, he's strong and rebellious and independent, free to howl and ravage. As the story goes on, he gets wilder and more adventurous - but then, suddenly, he loses that spark. The spirit abandons him and he succumbs to sentiment. He becomes homesick. He wants to go home. What's wrong with him? He's strong out there on the island, free - he can be and do anything, but he trades a whole world of wild LIVING for a pedestrian existence, and nobody will ever know his great adventure except him and the Wild Things. And if the WIld Things are strictly in his imagination, then it's even sadder because Max is delusional. So ... I always felt like it was a very depressing story, and resolved as a kid never EVER to fall into the traps to which Max succumbs - sentiment, feelings for family, the weakness that's CALLED love but is really DEPENDENCE. We all have an opportunity to be wild creatures, fresh and new in our understanding of the world, with an animal's lack of cynicism. Bur I fear this movie, like the book, will end with Max ultimately realixing his animalistic and natural side isn't as good as a warm bed and a hug from his mawmaw. Ugh None of that for me, thanks. I'll be over here climbing trees.
Oct. 14, 2009, 1:47 a.m. CST
MIO MY SON, by Astrid Lundgren. Made into the movie THE LAND OF FARAWAY - terrible film, but it features Christohper Lee fighting Christian Bale, so how bad can it be? Pretty bad, but it still resonates with me. I love the bitter ending, where Mio says that people might think he's a lonely kid sitting at a park bench, but they're wrong! WRONG HE SAYS! He could be on the bench. He could be in the Land. If he IS on the bench, his heart has gone to the Land. He's become an adventurer in his heart no matter WHERE his body lies, and he's done it by abandoning his aunt and uncle and telling them to go fuck off. Great story for kids, IMO.
Oct. 14, 2009, 4:09 a.m. CST
Why oh, why must every ´reviewer´on this site ape Harry´s bloggy anecdotal style. Can you imagine Ebert being so unprofessional in his reviews by starting them off about HIM and what he´s wearing? This is almost as bad as when Quint gave us a 50 word paragraph detailing the minutae of his airport security line routine. UNLESS YOU ARE HARRY, KEEP THE REVIEWS ABOUT THE MOVIES!! Because we don´t give a fuck about anything else, capiche? Vanity, vanity, all is vanity...
Oct. 14, 2009, 5:49 a.m. CST
Oct. 14, 2009, 6:03 a.m. CST
Now I know Spike is really going for the genuine emotions of childhood.
Oct. 14, 2009, 6:32 a.m. CST
Dreamy kids movies or adult movies told from a child's perspective are my favourite genre (nice Ratcatcher name-drop, by the way). Some wise man once said that if humans are sick animals, then adults are sick children, which would make movies like this our antibiotics.<p> The Arcade Fire and their ilk (Neutral Milk Hotel) still sound like a bevy of buskers given record contracts to me. You want good indie? Listen to New Zealand's The Tall Dwarfs.
Oct. 14, 2009, 8:21 a.m. CST
...for teens. Being free and independent and not succumbing to convention, that's a lesson teens and young adults need to digest.<P>Max is nine, and the book is for four to eight year olds. They can't stay where the wild things are yet, they can't survive on their own...they NEED to calm down and return to the family that loves them. And Max's mom does love him...when he returns from the wild rumpus his dinner is waiting for him, and it's "still hot". Not cold, not warm...hot.<P>This story isn't about living or not living a free and wild life with the wild things...that would be for older kids. This book is about a five year old having a tantrum. Suggesting that he stay locked in a tantrum forever is ridiculous...he would be delinquent at best, and psychotic at worst. This story is about harnessing the tantrum...the dangerous and wild emotions, with creative play and imagination...riding out the rage and anger...and finally settling down to life again.<P>The story you describe would be spot on if Max was an adult working in a soul killing cubicle job, or a teenager in an abusive home or something. Max is a little boy. He needs to be able to go to where the wild things are and return safely to the parents or parent that love him.<P>Hell, I can think of quite a few adults who could still use this lesson. They get angry, go to where the wild things are and don't know how to get back...they end up fucking up their lives...beating their girlfriends or kids, smashing their cars...whatever.<P>At first I was going to rip into you talkback style, then I realized you complaint with the book isn't bullshit...it's just that you're describing an older kid's problems. It's interesting that it makes you so angry though...
Oct. 14, 2009, 9:37 a.m. CST
Is the movie what Spike Jonze intended it to be, or did he have to re-shoot or re-edit some of the stuff due to studio pressure? What am I going to see? What he intended, or a compromised version?
Oct. 14, 2009, 10:18 a.m. CST
And did he kick the director's ass like Clooney did?
Oct. 14, 2009, 10:34 a.m. CST
Can't wait to see the movie.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11 a.m. CST
Cyndi Lauper is shedding a tear somewhere.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:24 a.m. CST
according to entertainment weekly, spike jonze did re-shoot some stuff on his and dave eggers' own terms, to flesh out the story a bit. WB wanted to make it more family-friendly and asked for re-shoots, but the re-shoots they did were not related to that. the film has been re-edited since they showed it to the studio...more than 40 times. jonze thinks he has it perfect now and continually says that it is completely his uncompromised "vision" of the story as he envisioned it as a child.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:40 a.m. CST
...he was in Fincher's The Game for like five seconds at the end. He brushed the glass out of Michael Douglas's eyes.
Oct. 14, 2009, 12:25 p.m. CST
I second that Galactic
Oct. 14, 2009, 12:54 p.m. CST
Oct. 14, 2009, 2:12 p.m. CST
Oct. 14, 2009, 3:04 p.m. CST
If you think Arcade Fire is music for douchebags then you both are soulless people indeed.
Oct. 14, 2009, 3:29 p.m. CST
That's my least fave of Fincher's, I'll have to cheq that out. Idk if we have it on dvd but I know we have it on vhs somewhere.
Oct. 14, 2009, 5:09 p.m. CST
This film looks like it is for little children. I see no aliens lazer blasters or space stations. It may be some kind of joke Hmmmmmm
Oct. 14, 2009, 5:49 p.m. CST
Here in Germany the forces that be decided to let the Wild Things open against Avatar in december. How come I'm not convinced this is a clever move? Sure Christmas time is family time, parents take their little ones to the movies, but will anyone except us nerds notice this film even exists? Every little boy will want to see that gargantuan 3D scifi extravaganza everyone will be talking about. Wonder which of the two films I will enjoy more that weekend.
Oct. 14, 2009, 5:57 p.m. CST
I hate you all.
Oct. 14, 2009, 7:07 p.m. CST
I can't stand it. Depending on who you ask you'll get different percentages on how much a movie depends on good music - it usually varies from 50-80% - For spike to send out an invite (the trailer) laced with whiney puss-man music is nothing more than a turn around and run away signal to all people out there who don't do everything they can to cast themselves in counter culture light. I don't want to hear the shit he and that silver spoon racist Sophie (watch Lost in Translation from the POV of the Japanese - which I am)- I don't want to hear their fucking wedding music when I go see one of my all time favorite books put to screen. So fuck this movie - He really only makes one kind and it's not the first time Warner has given assignment to the wrong man (Bryan Singer ruined Superman for years to come). I will give Spike credit where credit is due - out of emo chics - you could have gotten a fat one or an ugly one and seeing how you must weigh 1dollar and some change - you picked correctly
Oct. 14, 2009, 8:32 p.m. CST
Thank you for not ripping in to me. I see no reason for anyone to rip into anyone on a Talkback. It couldn't be less personal a medium.<p><p>I've put what you say into quotes.<p><p>"...for teens. Being free and independent and not succumbing to convention, that's a lesson teens and young adults need to digest."<p><p>I couldn't disagree more with this if I tried. It's too late for teens, especially today. The modern American teenager has already given in to conformity by the time he's 12-13, let alone any older than that. His thought process has completely stopped. He's not capable of a single iota of creative thought. If a kid isn't free and independent by the time he's eight or nine, he's not going to start becoming free and independent when he's older. I encourage you to read a book called THE EMILE, which was the basis for the movie THE WILD CHILD. It's a fascinating study of what kind of necessary steps are required for somone to be a free and clear-thinking person, and how early that has to start. ABSOLUTELY, kids need to learn to be independent of their parents, and early, too. First off, most American parents are totally inept and incapable of raising a child, shouldn't be raising a child, shouldn't be ALLOWED to raise a child. They're just totally not qualified, don't have an active interest in the job ("Hey, look - football's on! And beer's in my hand!") and shouldn't even be permitted to have kids - not that there's any governing body issuing licenses (there ought to be, I sometimes think).<p><p>Plus, consider how many kids in the USA are being brought up by Red State Morons, or Leftist Liberals. Kids especially right now need to be taught to hold people of lesser intellectual value in total and utter contempt, lest they end up being the nice kid in SEARCHING FOR BOBBY FISHER (who, by the way, in real life, lost the tournament to the more professional child he squared off against - the child who was portrayed as a villain in the movie. Why? Because the other kid was PREPARED and DID have contempt for his opponent).<p><p>So, yes, ABSOLUTELY, kids need to learn not to have foolish attachment to their families, and not to fall into the trap of sentimentality. If your parents are awful people, just outright bad people, then absolutely you should learn to be independent of them. And most American parents are awful, awful people.<p><p> "Max is nine, and the book is for four to eight year olds. They can't stay where the wild things are yet, they can't survive on their own...they NEED to calm down and return to the family that loves them. And Max's mom does love him..."<p><p>This presumes, foolishly I think, that these are people who love their kids. You forget that we live in a different time now, where parents don't give a rat's ass about their kids. Ever. And it's a time when parents would rather say "Shhhhhhhhhhhhh" to a child asking inquisitively about the world. "Be quiet, mommy's listening to her iPod, eating Funions and chatting about the weather with a nice man she's going to go home with after too many Mohitos." That's the modern parent, an idiot football jockey or a cougar trying to hide the fact that she has a kid. AMERICAN PARENTS, FOR THE MOST PART, SHOULDN'T HAVE THE JOB. They're too busy with their PS3s and updating their Facebook status and wondering why there are no maps in "the Iraq and such as" to know better. Watch the history interview segments of LENO (I know, it's painful - do it for science). Do you really think those are the exception? Hardly. That's the rule. Not knowing the history of your country. Not knowing what the slogan is on your t-shirt. Not being able to remember your own kid's name half the time. They don't care. They're meth-and-alcohol-addicted idiots walking the corridors of Wal-Mart like zombies. And you say kids should be affectionate to them? Hardly. HARDLY. Given the current state of the American parent, the proudest thing I could think of a kid doing - meaning the thing that would make me think "Wow, that kid knows what he's talking about!" - would be the kid who stares coldly into the eyes of his parents, at four-to-eight, says "I DON'T EVER WANT TO BE LIKE YOU! I HATE YOU!" and starts building a life for himself on an intellectual level that his parents can't match. The greatest gift as a parent I could feel or experience would be for a son or daughter of mine to surpass me on an intellectual level to the point where we had no common frame of refernece to communicate, because he was so far beyond me that I couldn't even rate with him. That's called progress. "Dad/Mom, face it - you have nothing to offer me." Can you imagine the kid who achieves that at four-to-eight? Talk about someone who's accelerating the curve! Talk about someone who's achieving great things. Talk about someone who's going to make a big difference in the world. Wouldn't you want that for your kids? I absolutely positively would. Again, it comes down to contempt, the lack of acceptance of what IS and the demand for what could be. Dissatisfaction has fueled the greatest achievements in the world, in science and industry and art. Nearly universally, great people and great artists were not the ones with phenomenal home life but rather the isolated,the so-called outsiders. They're not outsiders, they're INNOVATORS and they ought to be celebrated in ways their paretns can't even comprehend or understand, let alone participate in. That would be the ultimate expression of pride for me.<p><p>"when he returns from the wild rumpus his dinner is waiting for him, and it's "still hot". Not cold, not warm...hot."<p><p>I always saw that as his parents capitulating in weakness out of missing him. If you're going to punish or reprimand your child, stick to it. Backing down in the end means only that you didn't have the conviction of your beliefs. Going to bed without supper means going to bed without supper. All that I think Max is being taught by his mother and father giving in to him (mostly his mother) is that he can get away with being bad and not face any consequences. While pulling this kind of trick off on one's parents is to be commended (it proves intellectual and sophistication-based superiority), I don't see how this is a show of love. His parents felt guilt over mistreating him and capitulated. Even as a child, I found the double message of this insulting, and I remember feeling nothing but revulsion and disgust for Max's parents for being so wishy-washy AND mean-spirited as to punish him in the first place. Max is clearly better off in the world of the Wild Things, being his own true self.<p><P>"This story isn't about living or not living a free and wild life with the wild things...that would be for older kids. This book is about a five year old having a tantrum. Suggesting that he stay locked in a tantrum forever is ridiculous...he would be delinquent at best, and psychotic at worst."<p><p>I believe rage is the ultimate tool of achievement, myself. Only when you become so dissatisfied with something that you change it have you acted in your own best interest, and what is rage but a total dissatisfaction with everything in your surroundings? If I had kids, I would teach them to use rage as a weapon, as a tool, to bring great power to bear on anyone who would oppress them and to better themselves. Obeying the rule of law and not being psychotic have nothing to do with using rage and being honest with yourself. If I'm a bad parent, don't I deserve that rage? If I was so callous and thoughtless, for instance, as to have a child when I couldn't afford it and the kid now has to live in poverty, shouldn't my son or daughter feel utter rage at me that I brought them into the world without the means to contend with their growth? I've basically given them a massive weight to carry in the race of life in the form of my own abject stupidity. I'd expect nothing less than rage for all the failings of parents to support and promote their kids. People who can't afford children should never, ever have them - and yet it is the poorest who have the most children, the fools. Rage in response to that is JUSTIFIED on the part of the kid, is CORRECT on the part of the kid. And letting go of that rage? That's weakness on a level so profound it disgusts me. Are you really someone who's encouraging kids to FORGIVE? Oh my god, really? Forgiveness has to be one of the most overwrought ideals of our world. If I had a kid, I would teach him right from the start: don't forgive - revenge. Forgiveness only weakens the person doing the forgiving, and strengthens the abuser. And that is a lesson kids need to learn as early in life as possible, to prepare them to go out on their own.<p><p>"The story you describe would be spot on if Max was an adult working in a soul killing cubicle job, or a teenager in an abusive home or something. Max is a little boy. He needs to be able to go to where the wild things are and return safely to the parents or parent that love him."<p><p>Sorry, but I have to respond to this with a little hyperbole: *puke*. Kids need parental love as much as camels need tics. Parents have kids for selfish reasons, most of the time. It's like buying a puppy or a doll for most, the wish for a little mini-me they can mold and shape, or to make them feel less mortal as they enter middle age. Most don't have a valid reason to have a child. Think - is someone who is, say, fit to do nothing more than a retail job going to be creating a worthwhile person in their son or daughter, or one more person to do retail jobs? What is the MOTIVATION for having a kid? a
Oct. 14, 2009, 9:46 p.m. CST
in there. Well done.
Oct. 14, 2009, 9:58 p.m. CST
and I don't know if the generalizations you make for parents hold. I know it's your opinion but, don't you think that there is a large portion of the American public that rejects the notion of enabling the recklessness of youth? Childish rebellion without consequence is only reinforcing the same ideas of a selfish, self-absorbed individual and in turn, that reinforces the same values that they were raised in.<br><br>Rebellion is natural, I think, especially as the need to individuate emerges once puberty sets in. But, Max isn't a teen, he's a child.
Oct. 14, 2009, 10:59 p.m. CST
...bomb at the box office.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST
...AICN? I don't think we are going to agree here, and I have to get up early to make pancakes for my toddler...so this won't compare to your magnificent epistle.<P>Most people I know in the real world think my worldview is pretty dark, but you take the bitter and cynical cake my friend (for a good time pop over to the suicide TB). Your position is certainly consistent, but I think you're straying into unabomber territory.<P>The world is certainly full morons, assholes, and their snot-nosed spawn...always has been, always will be, but a classic like WILD THINGS isn't for them. It's for the vast majority of people who try and often fail to be decent. I stand by my argument that nihilistic rebellion is for older kids...HIS DARK MATERIALS is a decent example.<P>This isn't a very original recommendation, but for an entertaining rant about the fucked up but ultimately useful psychology of fairy tales you might enjoy Bruno Bettelheim's classic THE USES OF ENCHANTMENT. And Bettelheim goes back to the original versions, so you get murder, fratricide, rape, incest, torture, sexual competition and envy of your parents, etc, etc. You'll love it.<P>I think the world is a pretty bad place...but I don't think it's as bad as you do. Good luck with the revolution.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST
- I only got knuckle deep into your post and then it bored me - not saying you are a boring person or that the post itself isn't good - I'm just tired and I felt like posting something back to you before I go to sleep. If we had no "football is on, beer in hand" parents raising children who (I'm with you here) kids who will only reach room temp IQ - then where would we find the future soldiers for this country to send to a sandy place where Pepsi and McDonalds can now be had. I think you're off abut needing to read books on kids falling into creative stagnation if they are not reached by age 9 - that's bullshit. sounds like something written by a New York Jew - you know the kind who drags their kid to museums and teaches them a few catch phrases to blurt out at parties as to seem oh so smart.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:23 p.m. CST
..."ThusSpakeMySpunk". I need glasses.<P>Too much masturbation.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:55 p.m. CST
Your comment about Jews destroys your entire statement. Antisemitism has no place here.
Oct. 14, 2009, 11:55 p.m. CST
THE PHANTOM TOLLBOOTH
Oct. 15, 2009, 1:53 a.m. CST
If you're even half right, I will absolutely fucking loathe this film...i struggled to get through Juno, holding onto my seat desperately trying to ignore the hideously fey earnest limp hipster music that is infesting the planet - most people are so fucking thick they cant tell the difference between earnest (an artifice) and honest. Both the trailers for Wild Things interested me, but i had to turn the sound off...fuck anyone who likes that limp wristed self indulgent poor-me and my little boy feelings bullshit.
Oct. 15, 2009, 1:54 a.m. CST
Oct. 15, 2009, 2:03 a.m. CST
You sound angry Spymunk and surely there is a lot to be angry about. The world can be a fucked up place and that is stressful and frustrating to contend with. <br> But in terms of using anger as a "weapon", I am not sure what you mean. I am sure that you have had the anger of others aimed at you in your time and it probably didn't feel right, regardless of any "intellectual" justification that person may have had. People routinely, in anger, justify the use of physical or verbal violence and that is one of the fucked up things that we encounter in the world. <br> Speaking of bad parents, the anger of parents often takes these violent forms toward their children when they become frustrated that they cannont control them. <br> I think that while it is always a valid thing to feel how we feel, once we start taking it out on other people and justifying it whether we consdier ourselves superior in the situation or not, we lose perspective. When we are angry in a situation, we want to control it, and there are all kinds of versions of what things should be like and when we begin to impose this on others, verbally or physically, it increases the fucked up factor in the world. Think of how many problems arise from people trying to control things to make them how they want them... Think of how many problems are caused by pissed off people seeing the world from only their perspective... <br> I also don't understand what you mean by "intellectual level". Clearly some people are currently not aware of a very large picture of what is going on in the world or at worst, fixated on their own pleasure above considerations of other people. While this can be frustrating to encounter, part of increasing one's awareness, for me, has to do with being able to put things in perspective. I try not to over simplify things and I appreciate the fact that there are good things at all that one can connect to. <br> I think it closes a lot of doors to see onself as "intellectually" superior to others, or just feeling superior in general. It makes one not need to listen or empathize with others and appreciate what they have to offer. Whatever "smart" means to me, it includes figuring out how to get the most out of life, and to that extend it helps to learn how to be chill with people. The more open I am to things, the more good things come my way. If I see someone who thinks they are really "smart" and are very competitive about being "right" about something, I listen to what they have to say, but often in group settings that person is unaware to the extent that they are percieved as being an "asshole", that his or her social style is undermining whatever point they are trying to make. <br> I guess as an adult, I have a different perspective on this than when I was a teenager. There is definitely an ingrained part about being young that makes someone feel like they know everything. I won't say that I was totally innocent of that one. But even though I am under 30, I have been humbled by life enough, to see how little any of us know and how the world is ever revealing itself in a complex, confusing process that takes steps forward and steps back. <br> I have worked with kids all the way from K-12 and there does come a time when kids go through puberty and they think they know everything and want to rebel. That is totally healthly in a way, because they want to make their own choices and find out for themselves. However, in my observation there are very large gaps of things they are not aware of and this can make this stage look very foolish and/or annoying. <br> I feel for the fact that most adolescents still live under the power of their parents and if that is a bad situation, that is a bad situation, but in general teens are worse to each other than their parents are to them. A lot of frustration is taken out a teachers, some who deserve it, some who don't. But mostly, the idea that they know something that adults don't know is just immaturity. The most wise and aware teenagers I have meet have come across as pretty centered and engaged, rather than angry and rebelious. <br> Also, I am not going to idealize small children either. They can be really sweet, but they can also be totally self-absorbed. A tantrum-ing child is not aware of some larger "intellectual" framework having to do with their parents, but typically just frustration at not being able to have something they want (Candy, Toy, TV). Even really good parents and teachers will encounter angry and tearful children. Good parents and teachers help the child put the emotion in perspective and help them ride it out until it passes. <br> That's what makes Where the Wild Things are a story that teaches it models that process of getting overcome by a feeling and then letting that feeling pass. It is teaching a kind of perspective about anger that hopefully can last into the next angry moment. <br> Also, this super long post is my personal reaction to your long post. We probably agree on a good many things and whatever I say that you already know is not me trying to school you on anything or putting my opinion above yours.
Oct. 15, 2009, 2:04 a.m. CST
The deliberate combination of any of these elements and or instruments <p> • Man singing in (fragile) little whispery voice progressing to howing long notes <p> • Woman singing in (fragile) little girl voice <p> • Acoustic and or electric guitars strummed with.. <p> • Cello's sounding mournful <p> • Xylophones, toy pianos etc <p> • Flutes <p> • Moog synthesizer or Theremin <p> • 'Tribal' or traditional world music instruments <p> • Deliberately 'ironic' clever (read retarded) lyrics about how how crazy it is to be alive..or painful to be a middle class teenager/20 something <p> • Lyrical gibberish (becuase they just heard Sgt Peppers and think they discovered it) <p> <p> Tick accordingly as you watch the film...(personally i hope it scores low)
Oct. 15, 2009, 2:07 a.m. CST
• people clapping <p> • singing 'lah lah lah'
Oct. 15, 2009, 7:34 a.m. CST
when you take the pill that lets you know how things really are - but for now... sleep my friend... sleep
Oct. 15, 2009, 8:11 a.m. CST
He's a true artist.
Oct. 15, 2009, 2:22 p.m. CST
truly one of the angriest, craziest posts I've read in a long, long time. "Kids need parental love as much as camels need tics" wow. I'm afraid to ask if you really truly believe that. My guess is that someone didn't get enough hugs as a kid.
Oct. 15, 2009, 4:33 p.m. CST
As opposed to a mouth breathing moron...you can have that crown
Oct. 15, 2009, 8:22 p.m. CST
Let's do a little experiment. You have a kid and raise him with lots of huggy-good-fun-times, play catch with him and tell him about the funny things your pets did when you were little. At the same time, Exhibit B will be a kid who grows up with no parental love or attachment, but has a billion-dollar squad of tutors and teachers, personal fitness trainers, a fleet of G-5 airplanes to take him all over the world to witness firsthand the wonders of Earth, all the money and comfort he could want, a palatial mansion. Then When they're both 19 we'll do a job interview for both of them for a prestigious position and see which one's life worked out better. Sound good?
Oct. 15, 2009, 8:32 p.m. CST
... the decision about which one "did better" will be based ONLY on tangible issues that actually exist. Thus, you can't give any "a baby's smile is the greatest gift of all" answers.
Oct. 15, 2009, 8:32 p.m. CST
... the decision about which one "did better" will be based ONLY on tangible issues that actually exist. Thus, you can't give any "a baby's smile is the greatest gift of all" answers.
Oct. 15, 2009, 8:34 p.m. CST
Fantastic post, man. I'd love to reply but right now I've only got time to tell you that you did a good job. You've got your stuff together, even if we disagree. Did your parents love you? Did they do a good job of showing it?
Oct. 15, 2009, 11:16 p.m. CST
So - Exhibit B would be Michael Jackson and oh... Exhibit A - Steve Jobs (read his book)
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:38 a.m. CST
by Star Hump
has to stop. Sure there are some serious differences, but we're basically twin cultures. We love our beers, our sports and our movies. It's not fair to make the UKers wait two fucking months to watch Hollywood movies. Just ain't right. And conversely, we need more UK movies in wide release in the US. Just something that bugs me. I mean, how hard can it be?
Oct. 16, 2009, 2:20 p.m. CST
by Stunt Vocalist 709
Brilliant and funny Emo Checklist. Best I've seen or heard since "The Grunge Song" by Weezer, I think. If you missed it, here are the lyrics. The music dynamics follow the lyrics: <p> <p>This is the part of the song <p>That's really quiet <p>we play very soft <p>it sounds like a ballad <p> <p>and this is the part <p>where we play real hard <p>it's much louder than at the beginning <p> <p>and we go back <p>to the quiet part,again <p>if the whole song was this way <p>it would be boring <p> <p>so we go back to playing loud <p>it's like the first time <p>but slightly louder <p>this is usually the place <p>where it would be quiet again <p>but we dont wanna to be <p>too predictable <p>predictable <p>predictable
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:40 p.m. CST
*cuts self to paul simon*
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:43 p.m. CST
had me laughing and I haven't heard the tune itself..will check it out What pissed me off, and I think theres a parallel with films here too, is that this kind of music is easily as formulaic as what a lot of people accuse electronic music..or other genres of..yet they mistake it's 'acoustic' nature for somehow being 'honest'. Mentally lazy and predictable means its an artifice..melodrama..which makes it EARNEST..(meaning to SOUND honest). Big difference
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:43 p.m. CST
Wrong...check the list again. Nice try though.
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:45 p.m. CST
he was 40 years early..and never as formulaic. You can only play this game if you get real.
Oct. 16, 2009, 3:49 p.m. CST
Oct. 16, 2009, 5:10 p.m. CST
you got it all wrong buddy.
Oct. 16, 2009, 5:36 p.m. CST
Most of the items on your list correspond directly to that album. But frames of reference are everything.
Oct. 16, 2009, 5:38 p.m. CST
by Stunt Vocalist 709
Thanks. You make more good points. Well-crafted VS Contrived might be another Cliff Notes way of saying it all. I think that perhaps you and I (and others) like the Grunge Song and your Ultimate Hipster EMO Folk Rock Checklist because it pulls away the curtain revealing the Wizard of Lost Coz behind the "cutting edge." <p>BTW, I think you'll agree the phrase "cutting edge" has been over-used and mis-used for decades in music, comedy, and other entertainment. The last truly cutting edge comic was Bill Hicks. Now it's used as much by critics and fans to stroke their own egos as much as to praise their pet flavor of the month.
Oct. 16, 2009, 5:47 p.m. CST
Dude you REALLY dont GET IT. Yes you could pick instruments off that list and find them in all kinds of great music...Paul Simon has a history of singing a particular way and collaborating with ethnic musicians..again i would say ..CHECK THE LIST. He breaks those rules all the times. Listen closer.
Oct. 16, 2009, 5:49 p.m. CST
Bill Hicks, say no more buddy.
Oct. 16, 2009, 6:11 p.m. CST
by Stunt Vocalist 709
Indeed. I am still grateful to him for actually paying attention to my earliest sets in Austin,(1984) and taking the time to talk with me. He appreciated that I had something to say beyond the funny itself, and he encouraged me to take risks. I wish he could see what I'm doing these days. I do think he'd laugh knowingly and shake his head at some of the lame crap I've been told at comedy clubs- in particular I have been asked to use 'dumbed down' material. We both agreed back then that (with some exceptions like Paul Menzel's Comedy Workshops in Houston and Austin) the worst environment for an imaginative comic is the comedy club. Most basically want the same crap recycled in the same way. Which is why: if you ask someone who recently went to a comedy club, "Who did you see?" they usually can't tell you.
Oct. 16, 2009, 6:34 p.m. CST
I'm talking about albums, not artists, and I'm not trying to bring Paul Simon down or bring Indie folk up. Your list corresponds directly with the Graceland album (aside from the lack of howling and gibberish lyrics, which seem to be more of a psychedelic revival thing, rather than the acoustic indie stuff you're talking about). The difference being that Paul Simon did it 20 years before it became a scene. However there will always be trends, and people following them, and people doing new things and people doing old things. You can make a check list for cubism or Rock n' Roll as well. overall you just have to take them for what they are, there will always be movements in art.
Oct. 16, 2009, 7:21 p.m. CST
since my list IS a list of instruments and the way they're played..Let me put it a way you might understand..you're comparing Kelley Clarkson using a cello in one of her tracks and saying..'see Mozart used one too'..The checklist makes sense in a very specific...moreover i would argue Paul Simon represents true folk music, rather than cherry picking sounds and melodies in some attempt to sound sincere..he goes the whole hog..his collaborations with African musicians for example goes way beyond some tosser putting the thud of a tabla or udu in their music for wacky effect. Again you don't get the list at all..he hardly even qualifies. <p>
Oct. 16, 2009, 7:22 p.m. CST
Stunt Vocalist's point with the Weezer song probably demonstrates the idea even better..It's CHEAP tricks...Pantomime masquerading as drama.
Oct. 16, 2009, 7:34 p.m. CST
Thanks for the positive feedback. Nice to see that on the internet, we don't have to see eye to eye but we don't have to be at each other's throats either. <br><br> To answer your questions my parents are divorced and they each had their faults, but ultimately I am grateful for what they did provide for me, especially my mom who I lived with. There are a lot of things that go into raising kids and working on top of that has got to be stressful. I think now that I am an adult, I value them more. Friends and lovers come and go in this life, but family will always be family. Now that they are getting old, they appreciate having someone to be in touch with too and I am glad when I can provide that. <br><br> As far as parents who disown their children or who just irresponsibibly bring life into the world without attempting to provide for it, that's fucked up and probably feeds into a cycle of carelessness and hurt through generations. It's found somewhere in most communities and that's real. It can make one angry to think about or especially angry to find oneself in that position. I feel that. I think most of us are doing the best we can, even if things aren't the way we want them to be.
Oct. 16, 2009, 7:55 p.m. CST
You’re unfortunately looking from a very narrow viewpoint. You’d be amazed at how formulaic much of the popular songwriting was in the 60s. There are always movements in art, there always have been, and for the foreseeable future, there always will be. There were specific RULES for baroque harmony etc. Your argument seems to be that the existence of clichés in a music scene means that songs in the genre are contrived, fake and formulaic, deprived of any real emotion or creativity. That's an extremely simplistic outlook. There have been clichés in all genres of music, and similar checklists could be made for any other scene that has developed. I doubt you would say that Blues is insincere, formulaic or contrived because the vast majority of it uses a 1-IV-V progression with a minor pentatonic scale over it. Just as 20 years from now, people won't be saying indie hipster music was contrived; it will be just another former scene. Your discovery of clichés within indie music doesn’t mean you’ve found a special “man behind the curtain” there have been thousands. Hopefully you’ll understand this time.
Oct. 16, 2009, 7:57 p.m. CST
I'm talking harmonic patters, rhythms, melodies, chord progressions...and instruments.
Oct. 16, 2009, 8:01 p.m. CST
Those instruments have been used constantly in popular music for the last 80 years. It's the way they're used that makes them more or less noticeable or characteristic of a certain genre or scene.
Oct. 17, 2009, 7:34 a.m. CST
If anything you're simply confirming what I'm say...so what if there's contrived music in every genre and time? Did I say any different?...in fact if you read my post you will see that WAS MY POINT (re the reference to pop and electronic music). The point remains there is indeed a particular type of affected folk rock right now..You see to want an award for pointing out the bleedin' obvious and demonstrating a some music knowledge. <p> The list could well include chord patterns, lyrics and progressions. You make a fool of yourself when you claim people won't be claiming indie hipster music wasnt contrived in 20 years when you've just finished pointing out cliches in all genres of music. Contrived remains contrived...sometimes that ends up being funny as in kitsch..often not. <p> I've made a perfectly valid observation, you seem desperate to disprove it...you cant
Oct. 17, 2009, 7:36 a.m. CST
There's plenty of shitty cliched insincere blues..its been mocked enough...wake the hell up...stop namedropping scales and think a little more.
Oct. 17, 2009, 7:37 a.m. CST
I would call yours willfully naive. <p> Which again speaks to my first point.
Oct. 17, 2009, 7:40 a.m. CST
Nobody thought 80's electropop was particularly contrived AT THE TIME. Now if I think emo folk pop is contrived NOW, how the fuck do you think people will hear it when they hear this automaton factory of xylophones and strumming guitars going little then big over and over...Its enough to make fucking Boy George and his gay reggae sound like unique genius.
Oct. 17, 2009, 7:43 a.m. CST
just so this doesnt turn into some pissing war of musical knowledge (which you seem desperate for). Contrived is contrived in any era in any genre. Try to understand that idea...it doesn't all somehow age into fine wine.
Oct. 17, 2009, 9:53 a.m. CST
by Life Proof
You're both missing the point, and completely forgetting that music is not objectively good or bad. Whether or not you think it's contrived, there's going to be someone who doesn't. I really dig The Residents. A lot of people find them annoying...I think the soundtrack for Where The Wild Things Are is annoying. Why is that? Subjectivity. This argument will be fought forever, and you two aren't even articulating it all that well.
Oct. 18, 2009, 2:35 a.m. CST
the 3 most overused words on film talkbacks. Anyways, Can't wait to watch this film. Peace.
Oct. 18, 2009, 1:06 p.m. CST
to all the naysayers. #1 movie in America. Now you have to suck its' dick. Quite a few big mouths saying it was going to tank.
Oct. 18, 2009, 5:50 p.m. CST
It IS tanking, I'm afraid. There's a difference between a $70-80m #1 movie in America and a $30m #1 movie in America. And there's talk it might not even be $30m, but that they're using sneaky sneak-preview calculations where people went to other movies but saw this one to include box-office that doesn't belong to it. With an $80m cost that's usually multiplied by 3x you get roughly $240m that the movie needs to make to break even, and this movie will likely have a staggering 60 percent drop next week as word-of-mouth of bored and fidgety kids floods America's coffee rooms. That means it'll make 30m this weekend, 15m or less next weekend, followed by another big drop, meaning the total box office is going to be somewhere around 70m-80m, meaning it will fall about 160m short of what the studio was hoping it would. This movie has come and now it's gone. Let's move on to something that's good for kids.
Oct. 18, 2009, 7:47 p.m. CST
what is your definition of a "good kid's movie"? because I'm having a hard time understanding your definition of "flop." The film JUST came out on friday. The reviews are coming in as mostly positive. So, while everyone walks into that hyped up 'Paranormal Activity', people are going to be seeing this. Certainly not the shitfest that must be the Jamie Foxx/guy from '300' movie that has been getting shit reviews. It's still early to say if it'll be a HUGE success. Most definitely not a flop.
Oct. 18, 2009, 8:13 p.m. CST
by Stunt Vocalist 709
The good news about the cost/revenue question that was not addressed is both the international B.O. and the DVD revenue. (setting aside other merchandising) Even if the prediction of 160M domestic comes to pass, the other revenue sources should make this more than worthwhile businesswise. Plus, there are the less than tangible payoffs from such a well done film.
Oct. 19, 2009, 3:55 a.m. CST
as opposed to the spectacular job you just did...hey theres nothing even vaguely pretentious about the Residents..its way too fucked up.
Oct. 19, 2009, 3:22 p.m. CST
Really liked it. Didn't find Max annoying in the least. I want to see it again as it's a complex film.
Oct. 19, 2009, 8:34 p.m. CST
Where the Wild Things Are emitted a $32.7 million howl on approximately 5,000 screens at 3,735 sites, including around $3.1 million at 145 IMAX sites. The picture's daily box office pattern suggested that it didn't play like a typical family picture, rising only two percent on Saturday, and the demographics bore this out. According to distributor Warner Bros., the audience composition was 43 percent 18 years and older, 14 percent 12-17 years old, 27 percent parents who had kids under 12, and 16 percent kids under 12, and it was 55 percent female. While Where the Wild Things Are wasn't earth-shattering, it clawed its way into the top tier among debuts for children's book adaptations that aren't Harry Potter and was mightier than Bridge to Terabithia, Jumanji and other comparable titles. The multi-generational popularity of the book and the picture's attention-grabbing style were drivers, but the marketing campaign also distinctly conveyed an exuberant and sentimental trip into the universal experience of childhood, between its squiggly writing to its use of music. (Spymunk adds - both JUMANJI and BRIDGE TO TEREBITHIA were regarded as big failures for their relative studios - look it up).
Oct. 19, 2009, 8:37 p.m. CST
... studios should just stop making any sorts of intelligent movies for kids. They always fail, and I've reconciled with that. I've given up on the American moviegoinng audience, and I think it's time the creative people in the world give up on them, too. Especially the kids - who have reached a point now where they're a lost cause by the time they're three or four, so numbed by mindless anime (yeah, it's mindless - but complex enough that idiot fanboys insist it's brilliant - no, it's horribly-drawn with static animation and motion lines and the plots are nonosensical and so self-reerential they bear no similiarity to the real world whatsoever - nothing for a coherent viewer to grasp). Just put out ranom explosions and farts and snot. That's what the kids want - so give it to them, surrender the ship and start urging your kids to read good books if they're even slightly intelligent. I give up on American cinema with the massive failure of WHERE THE WILD THINGS ARE to find any audience.
Oct. 19, 2009, 9:22 p.m. CST
Ah, but Michael Jackson's handlers were NOT the same things I described. I was talking about a team of people dedicated to the actual well-being of the kid without the vested interest of parents who want something from the kid.