Oct. 3, 2009, 12:03 p.m. CST
That just looks bad all around. The Smallville premiere may have been interesting if they hadn't tried to cram so much into it. The large amount of subplots made everything rushed and at times seemed like a clip show, with key bits missing.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:05 p.m. CST
by Booster Gold Lives
...but in today's age of DVR, TiVo, on-demand, and DVD sales/rentals, how much do Nielsens factor these days into a network's decision to keep a show around or axe it?
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:05 p.m. CST
I don't watch any of those shows, but I'm still rooting for Dollhouse and Smallville.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:14 p.m. CST
At this rate, there's not going to be anything coming across the Big Pond for me to watch soon! Please don't say all I'm going to get are bloody Merlin and Primeval...
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:18 p.m. CST
I know Smallville didn't air in NYC because baseball was on instead. It will air in primetime tonight. What is the effect on the ratings, and do the Fri numbers get a revision after this airing?
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:18 p.m. CST
Finally gave it a go thanks to the boxset being released for a nifty £17 here in the U.K. Big Whedon fan (got into his stuff backwards really - Firefly, then Angel instead of Buffy which I figured was tweenie shite - blew me away with the dark places it went to when I finally got it). After reading all the to-ing and fro-ing from the fans and haters over Dollhouse, glad I gave it a go. Loving it so far, halfway through Season 1. <p> <p> Not pure pedigree Whedon yet, but decent enough. But by Christ was that "Echo as backing singer" episode a bit load of arse.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:23 p.m. CST
by Jamie McBain
Does this mean, that Fox will cancel it soon?
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:27 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:28 p.m. CST
the straight viewer numbers - like 2.1 million for Dollhouse instead of the audience share? Never got the audience share thing.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:29 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:31 p.m. CST
by The Fly on the Wall
The dumbass CW took one of the shows the network was built on and put in the "death slot" of Friday nights. It isn't the quality of the show I assure you. If you hate the show you will still hate it. If you like the show this season is pretty damn good. It's no wonder that the WB and now the CW are failing. There is a bunch of fucking morons working over there.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:45 p.m. CST
I realize I am stating the obvious, but the growing numbers are in DVR/online viewing, yet it seems a show's success MUST be tied to people willing to stop their lives at a specific time each night. Personally, we only watch one program as it airs - NCIS - and either DVR or use Hulu for the other 10 or so we bother to watch every week. This morning, I have watched Fringe, Smallville and FastForward, because I actually have other things I do on Thursday and Friday nights.
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:47 p.m. CST
is working. The braintrust held meetings and decided how to best backdoor the show to death. "Hmm, what can we do to destroy one of our highest rated and most popular show for the past 8 years?" "I have an idea! Lets bury it on a night when the vast majority of people don't watch tv!" "Man, you deserve a promotion! We will have the ratings on the floor in a week or two...just you wait!"
Oct. 3, 2009, 12:51 p.m. CST
in addition to the Neilsons? I'm curious how they compare.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:04 p.m. CST
...puppies dressed as cats!
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:08 p.m. CST
whether the Nielson ratings are accurate or not, they still seem to play a big factor in whether a film gets canceled or renewed. but if anything good comes out of this, it means that Smallville will be facing the chopping block. the show has been an embarrassment since the end of the fifth season. hell, it was starting to go downhill after that stupid "Lana being possessed by a witch" arc.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:08 p.m. CST
I was really digging Dollhouse.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:27 p.m. CST
No, the show has had a few bad episodes and bad story arcs, like ALL other long running shows. Since season 5 there have been (mostly) excellent shows with a few embarrassingly bad one (Like Aqua). Season 7 and 8 were better than 5.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:28 p.m. CST
People don't care about programming dvrs. People want to watch tv when they want to watch it. Hulu makes more sense.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:30 p.m. CST
by The Fly on the Wall
....Glenn the tool is being, well, a tool. Season 6, 7 & 8 were all pretty damn good, actually.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:31 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:31 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:31 p.m. CST
Zap2it does millions of viewers, why can't good ole AICN? I hope Whedon realizes that Dollhouse is a Deadhouse with numbers like that (lowered expectations or not... jesus christ!) so he should wrap things up. No cliffhanger! Personally, Epitaph One was so poetic I wish the series HADN'T come back.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:32 p.m. CST
What we're seeing now is the corpse twitching while it inflates with noxious gasses. It will soon join basic cable in the undeath of becoming an amorphous, bad reality show-producing blob. Game over, folks.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:38 p.m. CST
One of the most beloved Tv shows of all time. The finale is still the most viewed show of all time. I watched every episode, religiously. <p> Objectively speaking, the last season was embarrassingly bad. The penultimate season was almost as bad. They should have ended the program 2 years before they did, but it remained high in the ratings despite it's poor quality. <p> M*A*S*H like Smallville lived through good times and bad, and no matter what the fans stood by it. No show is perfect, but they are still great entertainment.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:40 p.m. CST
Despite some interesting post "landmark show" concepts nothing's clicking for all kinds of reasons and you can only imagine the development deals will start to dry up for Joss...sad stuff.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:46 p.m. CST
what's not to like about Smallville [except Clueless Clark]? it has lots of pretty people, pointless plots and the entire DC Universe... Whedon i great with quirky, humorous material. Dollhouse is proving that he can't do slick Alias-type shows
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:58 p.m. CST
Its failure will mean few others will take a chance on something different. And that's a shame.
Oct. 3, 2009, 1:59 p.m. CST
At least it was never THIS bad, and not only that, it was better written and better acted. <p> Seriously, though, I haven't watched any Dollhouse yet althought the last few episode of the first season were pretty decent. This seaons the episods are sitting on my DVR. I'll say this again, they should have focused on Agent Paul Ballard and introduced the mystery and conspiracy of the Dollhouse little by little as HE figured it out and make us question his perceptions and ideas like his fellow FBI. BUT, because Whedon has a hardon for Dushku, he had to tell the story from the freakin' WRONG point of view. Really, this could have been an awesome story. Guy's shouldn't let their dicks get in the way of a good story. A hot girl (at least from his perspective) isnt' always the best way to begin a story.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:06 p.m. CST
by The Fly on the Wall
The show kept getting better. I have no idea why FOX was always trying to kill it.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:09 p.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
The way things are going, by the time Lost finishes its run next spring there may be nothing left for me to watch on network television.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:19 p.m. CST
by Margot Tenenbaum
I think Whedon's voice works best coming out of teenagers. Everything he's done with adults (Alien: Resurrection, Firefly/Serenity & Dollhouse) makes me cringe. The one exception is the Angel series, which I think was a perfect synthesis of David Greenwalt & Whedon's sensibilities. It's my favorite work of Whedon's. <p>Chris Carter needed Glen Morgan, Darin Morgan & James Wong and Joss Whedon needs a David Greenwalt, IMO. <p>The Whedon apologists say that it was some sort of writerly masterstroke that he showed us the Dollhouse from the side of the bad guys but it played more like the creators didn't get what the show was really about. That showed especially in how underwritten the POVs of Ballard and Boyd Langton were. <p>By the way Herc, I love that your making these ratings posts. It's better than giving every single show its own talkback.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:34 p.m. CST
And I doubt many people were watching the big Met-National game.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:40 p.m. CST
Does not take DVR into account, no matter what BS others are saying. I taped both shows and haven't watched them yet and plan to tonight.<br><br> Because I was OUT on Friday night, the worst night for television.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:41 p.m. CST
I agree with you about about Dollhouse, but I really believe Firefly/Serenity were Whedon's peak as far as storytelling and characters(cringe-worthy? really?). I hope we don't have to wait as long for his next project after Dollhouse kicks the bucket. Nothing really matches the dramatic/fun tone of a great Whedon show, as evidenced by Dollhouse completely missing that balance.
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:42 p.m. CST
...are past their prime, and Medium is made for idiots - why are any of these ratings surprising?
Oct. 3, 2009, 2:57 p.m. CST
Firefly was Whedon's peak. I don't see how it's cring worthy. Sure, some of the episodes are better than others, but what TV show isn't like that? <p> Again, the wrong turn was taken with Dollhouse making Dushku/Echo its primary Point of View, whereas it should have been Ballard. They approached the conspiracy of the Dollhouse bassackwards.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3 p.m. CST
@Margaret agreed. Dollhouse doesn't know what it wants to be. it was set up to be an Alias-type show by way of Joe 90/The Matrix and 15 episodes later it still can't find its focus. i suspect one of the main problems is that Eliza Dushku is a producer of this show. this is her vehicle and she has to have a significant amount of face-time ... it's not like Whedon can say "let's do an Amy Acker episode!"
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:08 p.m. CST
hows it looking for Heroes? we have to wait ages for it here in the UK...
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:09 p.m. CST
me love Firely also. the bounty hunter in "Objects in Motion" is one of the creepiest villains in sci fi. as i type this, i just realised how disappointed i am in Dollhouse ... btw Topher is an unwelcome refugee from Buffyverse who needs to be devoured by a hellhound real soon
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:10 p.m. CST
as regards Whedon, does anyone else wonder what would of happened had TerminatorSCC not been canceled? i find myself thinking it would have suffered a similar fate...
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:18 p.m. CST
now I want my cookie.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:24 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:30 p.m. CST
...and they dumped it on Friday at 9 PM. It just hasn't been made official yet.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:31 p.m. CST
It premiered last night and not only did AICN diss it, but the neilsons did too?
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:31 p.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
...I agree with you almost completely. I'm still watching Dollhouse and though there are moments that indicate there is a good show waiting to be found, that's not enough when we're more than a season in. And yes, for all the admirable devotion of its small group of fans I too found Firefly to be the nadir of Whedon's television work. It was an uneven, sort of half-hearted pastiche of Mike Resnick's space-western novels of the Inner Frontier, to the point where I wonder, if the series had been allowed to continue, whether the arc for Summer Glau's character would have been a direct take on that of the little girl in the extraordinary Oracle trilogy. I'm no stickler for hard sci-fi, and Firefly clearly wasn't aspiring to be hard sci-fi, but the complete lack of knowledge of anything even vaguely relating to science led to some of the more embarrassing gaffes since the Logan's Run series. And the tone was absolutely unfortunate. Adults do sometimes act, especially in matters romantic, like teenagers. But all adults do not always act, in all instances romantic, like teenagers. Love Buffy 1-5 and Angel 3-5, though. Doctor Horrible, too, for that matter. I'll always be willing to give Whedon a look, and in most cases, as is still the case with Dollhouse, a longer look than I'll give most people.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:33 p.m. CST
and other stupidity killed "bionic woman" which had a lot of potential. Sometimes TV execs are retarded beyond measure.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:39 p.m. CST
I can already see it. Senator Perrin is going to be the first senator taken over by Rossum for investigating them. They're going to imprint him with the head of Rossum's wedge and begin their takeover of the entire world.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:40 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:40 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:43 p.m. CST
And I say that as someone who loved the second year. It was an amazing year: it was conspiracies on steroids. But the amazing season ender left the series with no place to go. It was like going out on a binge and then waking up the next morning surrounded by total devastation. So there is that and the sin of giving the world Final Destination.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:45 p.m. CST
Between dvd's and tivo who watches anything live anymore? I haven't watched a live tv show in six years.
Oct. 3, 2009, 3:58 p.m. CST
Of course they are meaningful, but I agree, so are the numbers. I have this vision of family viewing where given a family of five, one member gets up and leaves the room. <p> "Stop, Delta, do not leave! Do you not understand what havoc you wreak upon Dollhouse's rating share? For heaven's sake, you are a college sophomore and Dollhouse needs you! Think about what this means to Golf, Hotel, India and other family members."
Oct. 3, 2009, 4:16 p.m. CST
If it's going anywhere with Rossum plot, then it should have got moving there faster. <P> Eliza as a mother was done well by her. But it hardly made sense, really, in the series concept. How long was she supposed to be raising the baby (good actor, that baby)? <P> And stop with the imprinting that goes awry. If the Dollhouse has that many breakdowns, it would have never been in business. <P> It's all too vague. At least indicate that the characters know what they're doing, even if the audiences are kept guessing.
Oct. 3, 2009, 4:31 p.m. CST
by Jamie McBain
We knew thee well. Thanks to the internet, and digital cable, network TV, is all but a ghost.
Oct. 3, 2009, 4:32 p.m. CST
fall 40% on a given week? Of course not, they understand sales will go up and down. Of course, if something stays CONSISTENTLY at 40% lower sales than it was originally doing, then you think about getting rid of it.
Oct. 3, 2009, 4:39 p.m. CST
of course all shows have their great episodes and their piss-poor ones. Season 5 started off great with the little homages to the Chris Reeve movies, but the rest of the season underwhelmed, and it only got worse in subsequent seasons. the only real upside of the series after Season 5 was the inclusion of the Green Arrow, and Justin Hartley should get his own Green Arrow spinoff series. since we probably won't ever see another live-action Batman series, a Green Arrow series would probably be the next best thing at this point. but just watching Smallville post-Season 5 has given me a feeling that they're dragging the show out long after it should have been over. Clark should be in the cape by now, but the producers and writers keep cockteasing us by putting him in Metropolis minus the cape or the Clark Kent disguise, making him the "red blue blur", and now the black-clad "blur." they keep beating around the Superman bush and it's getting tiresome. would it kill them to at least have him wear the glasses to make it at least somewhat believable that people won't eventually identify Clark Kent as Superman? and what makes it even more apparent that the show has run out of steam was the departure of Michael Rosenbaum (whose Lex was awesome and a highlight of the show) and the fact that they keep having to drag more and more DC characters into the show to keep the show even remotely interesting. the inclusion of Supergirl really went nowhere, and involving Doomsday and the whole "Jekyll and Hyde" approach was derivative and disappointing, since they pretty much had to keep him in the shadows to compensate for the fact that it's just a guy in a suit. yes, that's more of a fault of the budget that a television show is restricted to, but if you're gonna do a character like Doomsday, you better go all-out and impress the audience. and if you can't do that, then leave an effects-heavy character like him to the movies.
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:13 p.m. CST
I'd love to know what proportion of viewing is done online and by recording. Whether this is actually possible to find out is another matter. I just get the feeling that the majority of viewing is still done 'live' and that live views of a Thursday night show will always outnumber the total views - by all methods - of a show broadcast on Friday.<p>Besides, overnight ratings may not fully reflect the total number of viewers, but they still give a good view of the most popular shows since most programmes will have roughly the same proportion of online/DVR viewers compared to the 'live' figures. Also, overnights are the most useful figures for advertisers since the live audience is most likely to watch the ads.
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:15 p.m. CST
there is too many genre tv shows up against each other. Networks need to spread the wealth, and move some of these shows to another night.
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:18 p.m. CST
House and Bones are the same stuff every week.
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:30 p.m. CST
by Dark Doom
Jesus Christ on a fucking crutch, the no cape, no tights gimmick is TIRED, TIRED TIRED. 9 fucking seasons? Fuck Kent, give me 'SUPERMAN' with that cool big ass "S" in the middle of his spandex red, blue caped suit. DUH- ratings!!! and jesus I'm a Mets fans but Mets and Nats over smallvile? Shit I watched clone wars...
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:31 p.m. CST
by Dark Doom
Oct. 3, 2009, 5:48 p.m. CST
The season opener was great and this week's episode was pretty good too.
Oct. 3, 2009, 6:14 p.m. CST
It is BAD on every level. That's why I am watching it! It's the show that gives me the best laughs. But I am amazed with all the Wendon apologists trying to convince themselves and others that this is a good show. Maaaan, the blindness, the sheer blindness of some people.
Oct. 3, 2009, 6:49 p.m. CST
Seriously, if all those shows got such low ratings which show had the highest rating? That means hardly anyone was watching anything. So the ratings don't matter at all. It should not signal a death knell for any of these shows. If they maintain their respective ratings and don't drop further.
Oct. 3, 2009, 7:03 p.m. CST
How low would it go? Would it score in the negatives? That would be fucking awesome. I actually really like the show, but those ratings are just shockingly low. How low can you go? Can it reach a 0.2 by the end of season 3? That would rule.
Oct. 3, 2009, 7:50 p.m. CST
Seriously? Who the fuck are these people? I'm not upset I just want to know who's these people are. We need a This Film Not Yet Rated documentary about this shit.
Oct. 3, 2009, 7:59 p.m. CST
till March 2010 for Breaking Bad season 3.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8 p.m. CST
then you just don't like Superman.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:01 p.m. CST
...on a night that young people clearly do not tune in to network television? 7 million people watched CBS's shows, despite the comparatively dismal 18-49 year old demo. I know other viewers aren't as desired, but hell... take a share of what's there.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:02 p.m. CST
Yes, people watch shows in other ways but all the network cares about is how much advertising dollars it can get from a show and in which demos. It doesn't give a crap if you DVR a show and skip the ads.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:19 p.m. CST
Hardly anyone watches the CW. It's like the SyFy channel. If you get a 1. whatever you stay on for years.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:31 p.m. CST
The CW and Fox have there heads so far up the own ass it is not even funny! They have destroyed many great shows before there time! Examples Angel and Firefly! They should have given Terminator TSCC one season to at least finish the storyline and or improve. Smallville and Dollhouse need to be on a Tusedays and or Thursday where there going to be watched I bet a lot of DVR's are recording these shows as well!
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:42 p.m. CST
I think the big problem with season 2 is that Echo is the least interesting character when she should be the most interesting. Also, Dushku is being asked to act beyond her abilities. She can do some things well but she is just not capable of pulling off a believable dramatic moment without it seeming melodramatic or cheesy.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:49 p.m. CST
Dollhouse down? no shit. it got buried on Fri. I didn't even know it had started up. Advertising for it is shit as well. Dead in the water.
Oct. 3, 2009, 8:57 p.m. CST
by The StarWolf
I tuned in to DOLLHOUSE just long enough to hear characters in the pilot episode flat-out ADMIT how silly the premise was, and that it made no sense. I tuned out after that. What I can't understand is why anyone else would keep watching after they admitted their show was ridiculous.
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:10 p.m. CST
I stopped watching Smallville last year and thought I would give it a go this season. Wow, bad idea. Clark running around in all black and a trenchcoat with a white "S" on his shirt? Lame. At LEAST keep the red and blue color scheme. <p> Dollhouse season 2 started strong but did anyone see the recent episode? It sucked big time. The maternal instinct is stronger than the chair? They didn't think of that beforehand? Wow, just dumb. And they just LET Whiskey drive off into the sunset last week? WTF?
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:16 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:31 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:37 p.m. CST
But Herc never put THAT in his column.
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:46 p.m. CST
The kind of comic geek that prefers Top Cow over say, Fantagraphics - The type that likes comics were all the females keep there backs arched all the time. <br /> Eliza Dushku is like a female Keanu Reeves. (Little Wooden Girl) <br /> It's no real surprise that nobody is watching Mallhouse.
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:46 p.m. CST
The demo rating is all that matters. A show that has 20 million viewers but pulls a 3.4 in the demo is not doing as well as a show that has 12 million viewers and gets a 4.5 in the demo.
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:53 p.m. CST
I can watch any show at my leisure, but I have to suffer through commercials for Ciallis.
Oct. 3, 2009, 9:57 p.m. CST
I mean so bad I felt like they were saying "ha, cancel Firefly and keep THIS shit? See how shitty it can get!" Honestly, Dollhouse isn't as good as any of Whedon's past shows, and it's actually lamer than Dushku's Tru Calling to be honest. I'm disappointed. I guess I should be glad for that, since obviously the net is determined to rub it in that the show didn't do great ratings and all but demanding it be cancelled. Bitches. Wait, I'm supposed to agree...I guess I just don't like the way everyone on line is making the fucking ratings and calling on cancellations into a fucking blood sport. You're all bastards!
Oct. 3, 2009, 10:07 p.m. CST
They're hitting (although barely in some cases) some key themes and it's actually improved some. If they got rid of the juvenile/"cute" dialog and all-round silly stuff, got rid of the counterproductive faux lighting, tightened up the stories, made a committment/announcement about Kent becoming Superman and moved the show from the Friday Death Slot it'd see a ratings boost.<BR><BR> I saw my first Dollhouse ep since early on in Season 1 and I don't get what Whedon expects us to like about the show... He needs to stock dicking around with these lame, doesn't-matter-if-I-miss-it stories and give us a reason to tune in every week.
Oct. 3, 2009, 10:10 p.m. CST
The Rockford Files, The Partridge Family, Sanford and Son, The Odd Couple, The Brady Bunch, Miami Vice, Falcon Crest, Diff'rent Strokes, Law and Order: SVU
Oct. 3, 2009, 10:11 p.m. CST
now they have the perfect.<p>I hate giving excuses but Dollhouse is saddle with the worse lead-ins in television history! I actually watch them before Dollhouse and SHIT, not one laugh! I mean it!<p>Smallville is also a victim of Friday nights where people are renting DVDs or going out!<p>I expect cancellation news pretty soon!
Oct. 3, 2009, 10:19 p.m. CST
Oct. 3, 2009, 10:25 p.m. CST
It's usually much more creative than what passes for entertainment on other shows. They try to play around with the concept as much as possible and while not every episode is a winner, it's still worth the watch.
Oct. 3, 2009, 11:03 p.m. CST
I say it when it works for a show I like, I say it when it works against a show I dislike. The N.Ratings are an outdated system to track viewers from years ago. The system was created when all they had to track was two hundred sets and kapow, they have their numbers. Nowadays? With online viewing offered from the shows website, secondary websites like hulu, illegal means like torrents and ninja, ect.., and viewers who are just as interested as the 'live' viewers tuning in Sunday to a show that came out days ago, how can you even begin to balance?
Oct. 3, 2009, 11:04 p.m. CST
That guy rules.
Oct. 3, 2009, 11:06 p.m. CST
is too good for that piece of crap show
Oct. 3, 2009, 11:07 p.m. CST
...and bring back TERMINATOR: THE SARAH CONNOR CHRONICLES, dammit! At least for another thirteen episodes.
Oct. 3, 2009, 11:53 p.m. CST
Where go Sci-Fi shows go to die. Sad.
Oct. 4, 2009, midnight CST
by Nick Michalak
I regularly work on Friday nights now. I only can TiVo my programs. I do watch Smallville & Dollhouse as soon as I get home, but it might be another day or two before I watch "Law & Order." Many shows I do watch live, but also TiVo them, just in case. Fact is, and I KNOW the networks don't want to hear this, but whether I'm watching live or via TiVo, I don't pay commercials any attention. They don't sell anything to me. I'm not going to buy what they're selling, even if I had the money to buy it. Advertising for the last ten years or so has been so terribly ineffective, anyway. Companies spend MILLIONS of dollars on marketing, and it does nothing for me. Most people find commercials annoying and obnoxious to begin with, to say nothing about endearing them to the product. Seriously, when was the last time a TV commercial motivated you to go purchase anything? I know people who don't bother watching TV at all. They wait for the DVD season sets, and watch the entire series that way. But all in all, TV executives are self-destructive to their own networks. They schedule genre programs in the WORST places, cancel them, and keep around the crap shows. Primetime network TV is soon going to be a graveyard filled with trash programming, and their ratings will be 100% in the shit.
Oct. 4, 2009, 12:05 a.m. CST
by Nick Michalak
And I still haven't forgiven Fox for cancelling Brimstone ten years ago. And when did that air? Friday night @ 8 PM ET. Goto the following URL to see all the shows that died in Fox's Friday night death slot: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday_night_death_slot#Fox
Oct. 4, 2009, 12:16 a.m. CST
Dollhouse is basically over right now. The network and the studio were really into this new 'cheaper show' idea but after seeing the ratings and the stuff in the pipeline they have basically run out of patience.<p>It doesn't appear that they are going to stop shooting but there are more than a few folks who would have no problem with doing that right now. The show is literally dead in the water.<p>I personally don't know what and how much Whedon himself has been told but the talk at the top has been pretty loud.<p>Sorry fans.
Oct. 4, 2009, 12:55 a.m. CST
If the CW is so adamant about killing off Smallville, put him in the suit and let him fly!<P>Let Clark be a Man for once in his life.
Oct. 4, 2009, 1:10 a.m. CST
Americans apparently no longer watch television on Friday. Seems it's become a bad, bad night all around.<p> Maybe this is a good thing? I mean, maybe people are just engaged in other activities? Like late dinners or X-Box or BDSM?<p> I dig "Dollhouse" but didn't get a chance to watch it live because I was working. Watched it Saturdaym though, on Hulu and thought the first ep. was pretty good, not great. How about grabbing people by the throat a little, Joss, eh? How about punching them in the face with stories they "need to see"? Because like last year, the first episode really didn't pique my interest. I've now watched the second episode, which was much better, but Joss you really needed to produce a grab-the-audience-by-the-balls introduction.<p> Tried, I think, but it just needed more. More action, more weirdness, maybe. He's trying to use restraint, which is fine, but he really needs to pull out the sodering iron and shove it, white-hot, up people's asses till they scream. That's how you get ratings on Friday night.<p> I hope the series ends well this season. I've actually quite enjoyed it.
Oct. 4, 2009, 1:22 a.m. CST
by Chief Joseph
Jett Lucas 93, no one gives a damn about your dad's action figure commercial (AKA Clone Wars.)<br> PS: I cheered when your character died in Revenge of the Sith.
Oct. 4, 2009, 2:16 a.m. CST
by Bass Ackwards
Then they would cancel it. They don't have to go through some silly maneuvering to justify it.
Oct. 4, 2009, 2:31 a.m. CST
Shit can change by the time the final ratings arrive, but Herc will not post those ratings. This is why the ratings system is antiquated, and the networks need to find a new way to get money from advertisers. Seriously, this all comes down to these apes thinking that these ratings represent who watches what at what time at what date and what time. The rating system is dead. If they want to revive. Let people sign up over at Nelsen online, and keep a book that way. Until they open up the process to more people. These ratings mean jack and shit.
Oct. 4, 2009, 2:52 a.m. CST
If you watch the show on Hulu, or on your DVR, the networks KNOW you aren't in the ratings, but that's ok, because they don't care. It would be a mistake to count you in.<p> It barely matters how many people like the show. It matters how many people sit through the commercials.
Oct. 4, 2009, 6:39 a.m. CST
Networks are now basically running 5 days a week. We need OTA 1) for emergencies (like Katrina or earthquakes, when phone and cable lines get mangled) to get emergency info; 2) a public option to keep cable companies from jacking up prices too high. 3) to give poor people access to information.
Oct. 4, 2009, 7:10 a.m. CST
Oh man, that show was awesome. Have you ever gone to the website of the creators and looked through the breakdowns of the rest of season ones episodes? That show could have been something special. I hope the rumors of a movie reboot are true.
Oct. 4, 2009, 7:13 a.m. CST
Put some sport or a movie on instead. <p> Save your shows for another night and/or go with mid season replacements. <p> Syfy pick up Dollhouse.
Oct. 4, 2009, 7:18 a.m. CST
Firefly would have been on cable, and gone for 3 seasons. <p> Dollhouse would also be on cable and Amy Acker would be the main star. <p> Smallville would have changed its name to Metropolis 4 seasons ago or just ended <p>
Oct. 4, 2009, 8:04 a.m. CST
keep Dollhouse on Friday nights. You think they would have realized that one of the reasons it was failing was because of when it airs. Hopefully they realize that no matter what they put in that slot, it won't perform well. Who watches tv on Friday nights?
Oct. 4, 2009, 8:04 a.m. CST
This is your punishment for trashing T:TSCC
Oct. 4, 2009, 9:59 a.m. CST
After Dollhouse crashes and burns, Whedon should pitch a Firefly reboot. Fillion should be availble because Castle will only last half a season. Set it five years after Serenity. Mal is the only one left after everyone leaving or dying on him. He's hit rock bottom and is a drunk with a crewless Firefly. Have one of the original crew (Jane prefferably) find him and snap him out of it. They decide to put together an all-new crew and give it another try.
Oct. 4, 2009, 10:11 a.m. CST
Because I usually like to be out of the house doing things.
Oct. 4, 2009, 10:33 a.m. CST
If they got rid of the juvenile/"cute" dialog and all-round silly stuff, got rid of the counterproductive faux lighting" couldnt agree more veritasses. The dialogue is so bad its cringeworthy. Chloe has been using these stupid pop culture metaphors rather than words since season 2 and its really annoying. if someone goes back in time she'll say "hes gone all marty mcfly" or if someone goes mad "dont go all Jack Nicholson Shining"..she does it often and its really annoying and stupid. And the lighting makes it look like a nineties soap eg the young and the restless or something. How can any superman fan like what they did to Doomsday,Jor-el,Jimmy(hated that guy) and now Zod. I hate this show its so bland but occasionally download purely for Erica Durance's UNBELIEVABLE hotness.They used to complain at the beginning that it was repetitive with the "Monster of the week format" but those firsat two seasons put the next 7 to shame.(unless your a girl under 14 or have a low I.Q)
Oct. 4, 2009, 10:51 a.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
...with just a couple small changes. Jane has been transformed by means of sinister experimentation into some type of space ape (still voiced by Baldwin). And instead of just an "all new" crew they get an all girl crew. You could reboot Firefly and BJ and the Bear at the same time. The Claude Akins villain role would be played by Ian McShane.
Oct. 4, 2009, 10:57 a.m. CST
As I have said on numerous occasions, the 18-49 demographic is non-existent on Friday night, as it is during most of the week. And they certainly don't sit home on that night after a long day at work or school to watch "Dateline", as is indicated in the numbers. Who does sit home and watch TV on Friday? Children under 12 and people over 50, that's who, because they are either too young to go out or too old to care. How about some real numbers? How about a listing from the people who actually watch TV? Not only would the advertisers get more for their money but networks would be able to program better. If you are an advertiser you should take a long hard look at your marketing strategy.
Oct. 4, 2009, 12:45 p.m. CST
Rating truly don't matter with this show, which is why it's still being dumped on Friday with two bullshit sitcoms for a lead-in, one of which (Til Death) was handed to the Fox Network on a very cheap silver platter so that it can get into syndication. The show simply needs to have some sort of a first-run airing on TV so they can throw together Dollhouse DVD sets to sell. The network itself won't make as much money from this, which is why they'll only stand for it so long, but the Fox Studios production company will want to keep it on as long as possible so there will be more product to sell down the line. Seriously, if you like the show, don't panic at these numbers. They're being incredibly patient with it specifically because they hope it will generate a fanbase from DVDs the way Firefly did. (And make no mistake, Firefly was NOT a beloved cult classic while it aired or for a while after it was cancelled; it was panned by as many critics as it was praised, and a substantial portion of Whedon's fanbase detested the show's existence because it was pulling his attention away from Buffy and Angel. Dollhouse is actually much more well-received right now than Firefly was a year after its premiere.)
Oct. 4, 2009, 12:48 p.m. CST
Anyone notice that they're not even giving the show a "Previously on Dollhouse" segment before each episode now? They aren't even trying to get new viewers up to speed anymore. They're just letting it air as-is, because they know that when people are watching the DVDs later they'll already be up to speed.
Oct. 4, 2009, 2:29 p.m. CST
by JT Kirk
First Saturday, and now clearly they just need to stop programming for Friday too. Nobody is watching broadcast television on Fridays now, everything is niched out to cable. Numb3rs, really, a crime procedural with a twist? Gee, we don't have THAT every other day of the fucking week. And both Medium and the graveyard of Jennifer Love Hewitt's youth on the same night? Middle aged women don't need to tune in twice now, I suppose. Oh, Law & Order, there's something new, that'll really bring in the credibility. The sad part is, L&O is actually trying to be good, trying new things, but it just feels like the beeping is slowing and the plug is halfway out of the socket. You look at clever stuff like Psych and Clone Wars, then you look at the broadcast networks for anything new going for that same quality, and there's nothing. There's the procedural drama ripoff of Psych, but no comedic hours of on-message series. No sweeping adventures, nothing to bring an audience back to the television.
Oct. 4, 2009, 3:15 p.m. CST
by Media Messiah
I said that a week ago, your very words--that this is clearly Fox' business model with regard to Dollhouse now--they simply don't care about the show other than using it to attract DVD sales, the reason why they need to at least give the second season a partial first run...as they did with the first season. When I posted my view on AICN last week, some people immediately attacked me, and said I was just throwing-out unfounded conspiracy theories, but when you analyze Fox' business strategies surrounding Dollhouse, they just don't make any sense, unless, they are doing exactly what I assumed? I am very good with pattern recognition; You see, when something doesn't openly make sense, and perfectly otherwise reasonable people, if not brilliant people, are engaging in it, well then, it makes sense to someone, somewhere withn that group--thusly, one's curious actions have to be by design, not by accident, or negligence, for some secreted reason...and DVD sales and rentals, and supplying digital media content, ala Tivo, and Hulu, are that very reason.
Oct. 4, 2009, 3:16 p.m. CST
This last episode was very 'cerebral' in that Eliza didn't get her usual tart-mode cameo; the scenes with Whiskey and Topher were very nicely done, too. A different rhythm for the show, and one that tells me that Joss&Co are trying to continue the arc and not just go for the cheap thrills every week. <p> <p> I like what they're doing; whether the spot ratings will give the show any support remains to be seen. So far, they haven't although Friday's isn't a picnic for any of the new (or even returning) productions!
Oct. 4, 2009, 3:21 p.m. CST
by Red Ned Lynch
...not that Dollhouse being canceled would end Whedon's career in the way you are suggesting, but...yeah, I think he would probably make pretty good softcore skinemax style movies. Sort of like the mid-eighties Tanya Roberts/Sandahl Bergman/early Shannon Tweed ones, with sort of wiggy plots and quirky characters to go with the on-screen groping. He's certainly always had an eye for good looking actresses and off the top of my head I can't think of one he didn't make look better in what he made than they've looked in anything else they've done. Almost too bad that he'll have more legitimate work to do for the foreseeable future. See, he just bought himself a fair piece of goodwill with Doctor Horrible, more than he would lose if Dollhouse goes under, especially considering how pleasantly compliant he's been to his Fox overlords. Will he get a golden ticket, big budgets and unlimited artistic control? No. Is he even two consecutive failures from not getting in the door? Also no, unless they are remarkably big ones.
Oct. 4, 2009, 4:39 p.m. CST
.. is not because of your Dollhouse theories. It's your excessive use of commas to break up your endless run-on sentences. Your posts are unreadable. You've been warned about this twice now. My patience has limits.
Oct. 4, 2009, 5:09 p.m. CST
The people producing TV series are paid to produce. If they fail to deliver gripping entertainment from beginning to end, fire them and bring in new talent. Whedon had his chance. He has failed. Terminate him with extreme prejudice.
Oct. 4, 2009, 7:05 p.m. CST
I want to see letterman's and Obrian's numbers. That's the time when people get home from whatever they were doing.
Oct. 4, 2009, 8:50 p.m. CST
<p>Seriously who has the money to go out every Friday? What sort of job do you people have that you can afford to do that every week. I want to know so I can switch careers.<p> <p>I work for the state and can't afford that. Does everyone here live with their parents or something.<p> <p>My wife and I go out maybe twice a month. And never on Friday's to many jackasses outside. Usually teenagers, and no I'm not 50, I'm 31.<p> <p>I just hate teenagers. You do too. If you are a teenager you hate yourself, and you should because you suck.<p> <p>You have no job, get high all day (thanks to stealing out your mom's purse), harass the elderly, talk on your phones and text in movies, and curse loudly in public. No wonder your fathers don't love you.<p> Look everyone I just made 12 new strippers/pornstars, and 6 cutters. My job is done.
Oct. 4, 2009, 9:52 p.m. CST
by Media Messiah
You are focused, not on the content of my writing, no matter how legitimate my points may be, or are, rather, the simple thrust of your comments toward me, is where I place my commas and page breaks? That is a sign of OCD...having nothing to do with a serious debate about anything regarding the subject matter at hand which is Dollhouse, its story structure, and the ratings. If you don't like how I write my posts, inthe future, you are invited not to read them.
Oct. 4, 2009, 10:14 p.m. CST
Only reason I have continued to watch is because they HAVE to be close to wrapping it up, and I've come this far...just creeping along to the finish line with it. Now that the ratings are in the complete toilet (exclusively caused by the move to Friday and the endorsement of vampires instead), hopefully this'll be the last season, Clark will finally become the iconic Superman and they can sorta go out on a normal note... I will say, I still don't have much hope that the CW won't just try a season finale cliffhanger in the effort to get renewed and just leave us all hanging once they're canceled...
Oct. 5, 2009, 8:22 a.m. CST
...going on about T:SCC in relation to Dollhouse. No one is going to put up money for more espiodes of this show, not with the T4 movie failing to set the BO alight. You people need to move on. As for Dollhouse, it is dying because of many reasons, one of which is that is not very good.
Oct. 5, 2009, 10:35 a.m. CST
We can all forget about a Buffy spin-off about Failth happening thanks to this shitty Dollhouse show. Alas, Dushku now has two failed shows under her belt as a lead, and this last pairing of her and Whedon will not inspire any network execs to try it again on a Faith show anytime soon, or probably never. They should have just made that show, since it would have been the one with the best chance to succeed, and would have had a built in fanbase. Instead, we get Dollhouse. Trying to add Summer Glau to this crap is just a slap in the face to the Sarah Conner fans. Dollhouse should never have been renewed in the first place. The show started decently but bled nielson ratings every week, and had a season finale that ended with a collosal thud. The show had no momentem of any kind going into a second season, creatively or commercially. meanwhile, Sarah Conner did. The exec that decided to renew this garbage should be fired immediately. Even a moron could have predicted this show would debut to miserable numbers, and they will only get worse with each passing week until November, when the show will finally and mercifully be yanked from the air in time for sweeps. Just my two cents though. -J.
Oct. 5, 2009, 10:44 a.m. CST
I finally got around to watching Epitaph One. My fucking god that was awesome. Talk about complete badassery. This show has so much potential to be cool. I really hope they don't blow it this season.
Oct. 5, 2009, 12:40 p.m. CST
by The Gipper
Already mentioned -- The Rockford Files, The Partridge Family, Sanford and Son, The Odd Couple, The Brady Bunch, Miami Vice, Falcon Crest, Diff'rent Strokes, Law and Order: SVU, Dallas. Don't forget Dukes of Hazard, Incredible Hulk, Knight Rider and THE X-FILES.
Oct. 5, 2009, 1:01 p.m. CST
has sex with Megan Fox. he wins.
Oct. 5, 2009, 4:09 p.m. CST
instead of using it to sell the DVD. People might have seen there's a larger story going on.
Oct. 5, 2009, 4:48 p.m. CST
Universal Studios has replaced its two top movie executives in an apparent effort to reverse the box-office slump prompted by a series of costly commercial failures. <P> Universal Studios President and Chief Operating Officer Ron Meyer said Monday that Universal Pictures co-chairs Marc Shmuger and David Linde were stepping down. <P> The two will be replaced with Adam Fogelson, who is the studio's marketing chief, and Donna Langley, the studio's president for production. <P> Meyer says Langley will report to Fogelson as she continues to oversee all production. <P> Shmuger and Linde were released following a summer of high-profile films that delivered disappointing returns, such as "Land of the Lost" and "Funny People."
Oct. 5, 2009, 9:52 p.m. CST
I mean shit. Fox buried Firefly. Surely this can't happen again!!