Ain't It Cool News (

Hercules Declares Fox’s
DOLLHOUSE The Season’s
Most Improved Series!!

I am – Hercules!!
I remember barely bothering to tune into Joss Whedon’s “Buffy The Vampire Slayer” during its first season on The WB. By the third episode of its second season it became my favorite show. Whedon’s “Dollhouse” isn’t my favorite show, but tonight’s installment makes me judge it (for the moment) the season’s most improved. Titled “Vow,” the second season premiere of “Dollhouse” is funny, suspenseful, sexy and willing to kick around more than a few Very Big Ideas. Combined with the series’ terrific “lost” episode (“Epitaph One”), “Vow” roughly triples my investment in this series’ fate. Hints of what awaits: * Three months have elapsed between 1.12 and 2.1. Not as much time as between 1.12 and “Epitaph One.” But still. * This season’s Big Bad may or may not be one Sen. David Perrin (Alexis Denisof, who played Wesley Wyndham-Pryce on “Buffy the Vampire Slayer” and “Angel”). Perrin also may or may not be the season’s Big Good. 2.1 fails to specify Sen. Perrin’s party affiliation. We don’t see much of him this week, which tells me he’ll be around for a while. * Claire Saunders' existential crisis (turns out she’s FAKE!) means a BIG Amy Acker episode tonight before she wanders off to her role on ABC’s midseason ensemble drama “Happy Town.” (My understanding is Acker will recur twice more on “Dollhouse” this season even as she stars on the other series.) * 2.1's teaser and first act likely contain the series’ funniest 12 minutes to date. * Sierra is a fleeting highlight, looking for a few moments like she just wandered off the “Mad Men” set. * There’s a lot more to Adelle and Paul’s first-season-ending “arrangement” than a lot of viewers may suspect. * Tahmoh Penikett’s “Battlestar Galactica” co-star Jamie Bamber (who’s only half-American) uses his Brit accent. The two former CAGs share a big scene near episode’s end. * “Epitaph One” vet Felicia Day does not turn up in 2.1, but Whedon says he hopes to bring her back later in the season. Day shot a sequence set in 2019 (or thereabout) that was to open season two, but it was scrapped; Whedon felt the footage may have overcomplicated an already complex episode.

The 2.1 screener went out to critics with a letter. Here it is, in case need something to kill time while “Brothers” is on.
September 1, 2009 Dear Press Member: You hold in your delicate paws a rough cut of “Vows,” the first episode of the second season of DOLLHOUSE, premiering Friday, Sept. 25 on FOX. More importantly, you also hold a free t-shirt! So that’s a thumbs-up right there, no? I mean, do you even have to watch the show? It’s clearly t-shirt-tastic! Did “Grey’s Anatomy” send you a shirt? They did? (Did they send any extra? I’d kill.) Meanwhile, DOLLHOUSE. Like a man with the bright-eyed euphoria of narrowly escaped death, DOLLHOUSE is coming back from a hilariously unexpected non-cancellation with a verve, a joy and a visceral excitement that borders on manic. We’re psyched. This is the show we want to make. The twisty lives of the Dollhouse peeps are truckin’ along, and ECHO (Eliza Dushku) is going through one of her fresher Hells. Some things have changed. We’re shooting in HD with a new crew, for a look that’s more lush and exciting – and faster, so we can achieve more visually and give more time to the actors. (and OMG, Olivia’s hair! Very key.) Some things have not. To refresh, Echo has been rescued from ALPHA (who is still at large) after having all her former personas dumped into her brain all at once. PAUL BALLARD (Tahmoh Penikett) has agreed to work with the Dollhouse in exchange for NOVEMBER’s (Miracle Laurie) freedom. DR. SAUNDERS (Amy Acker) has discovered she is actually an Active, designate “Whiskey,” who was designed by TOPHER (Fran Kranz) to replace the doctor Alpha murdered. And ADELLE (Olivia Williams) has gotten a fabulous haircut. We hope you enjoy our happy little tale. If you don’t: t-shirt… so soft… so sleepy… Yours, etc. -joss
9 p.m. Friday. Fox.
Follow Herc on Twitter!!

Buffy: Season Eight!!

Worf And Data In HD And Shipping Now!! Less Than $11 Per Blu-ray Trek Movie!!
Readers Talkback
comments powered by Disqus
    + Expand All
  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:55 a.m. CST

    Sorry but it must be said

    by Melvin_Pelvis

    no big surprise on that declaration<p> remember don't use bleach on your t-shirt

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:55 a.m. CST

    Cue haters in 3..2..1..

    by theGoldbergV

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:55 a.m. CST

    Cue haters in 3..2..1..

    by theGoldbergV

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:57 a.m. CST

    But I only ressed ENTER once

    by theGoldbergV

    and of course Dollhouse is cool. Don't beleive the anti-hype, the last half of s1 is GOLD.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:57 a.m. CST


    by Gee Redbeard

    Dollhouse picked up some much need steam towards the end of last season. Let's hope it keeps it up.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:58 a.m. CST

    Needed obviously

    by Gee Redbeard

    Not "need". Screw you lack of edit button.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:04 a.m. CST

    PHOTOSHOP COMPETITION: a face for herc

    by Castiel

    winner gets a no prize.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:12 a.m. CST

    I found Dollhouse extraordinary.


    I couldn't figure out why anyone would bag on it (except for the episode involving Adelle's friend being imprinted on Echo to figure out which family member killed her. Only boring ep in the season, I thought.) My girlfriend and I watched whole discs of the show in one sitting, and we thought the writing was great, the concepts were outstanding, the performances were top-notch. I think it fits right in with the TV rennaissance of this decade. It's a really good time for well-written series, and Dollhouse is among them. I can't wait to see S2.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:13 a.m. CST

    I like the way you think, Castiel.


  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:28 a.m. CST

    If Joss Whedon is so talented...

    by darthsynn

    Why doesn't Hollywood just hand him every property they have? Let him remake the Star Wars prequels. Give him the next Batman movie. Make him the new Pope. I'm sure he is working on cures for AIDS and cancer. Do you think he could wipe out the national debt? Bring peace to the Middle East? I wonder if he knows where Jimmy Hoffa is buried? Is it possible Joss Whedon is God?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:29 a.m. CST

    Whedon is an atheist

    by theGoldbergV

    so if he was God he would have very low self esteem.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:35 a.m. CST

    i got nothing

    by Castiel

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:37 a.m. CST

    let's try that again : herc face

    by Castiel

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:43 a.m. CST

    So much for the wheelchair

    by kesoze4

    Nice bump. Never seen that move on AICN before.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:55 a.m. CST

    Eliza is only kind of hot....

    by Fart_Master_Flex

    Amazing face and a great rack. However, from the waste down....lots of dissapointment. Skinny legs and no ass to speak of. Oh yeah, I love the show though. Wait, what was this about?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:57 a.m. CST

    Epitaph did A LOT to reassure me.

    by V'Shael

    He knows what he's doing with this show. And it's a slow-burn. It's not a gimic wig-of-the-week alias clone. <p> The only downside now, is whether Eliza has the acting chops to carry it off convincingly. About that, I am yet to be convinced.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:25 a.m. CST

    New and improved Dullhouse?

    by ISleptWithKathyBatesAndAllThatIGotWasThisStupidTalkbackName

    I would try again after reading Herc's glowing recommendation but then I remembered.... this is Herc-KissJossWhedon'sBumhole-ules we're talking about here.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:47 a.m. CST

    Herc, Better Than Smallville?

    by KentButabi

    Have you seen it yet?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:57 a.m. CST

    As a designer I can say...

    by PessimusGrime

    ...The show definitely has the best logo this season. Haven't watched it because I didn't hear good things... maybe I'll catch it now, though.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:13 a.m. CST

    Improved or not....

    by lock67ca

    As long as Fox keeps it on Friday, it won't last long. I loved the last few eps of Season 1, but I'm weary of dedicating myself to another good show that's going to get the rug yanked out from under it.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:19 a.m. CST

    Still not completely sold.

    by CatVutt

    Lots of Season One was very much the bitter taste of ASS, but I was also very encouraged by the later episodes and Epitaph One. If the Hooker-of-the-week episodes are gone, and we're most focused on an ongoing arc, then I'm willing to ride it out.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:05 a.m. CST

    I like it, always did

    by Drsambeckett1984

    But it doesnt grab my interest in the same way Smallville and Supernatural do,

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:06 a.m. CST

    show is on a roll

    by altoandando

    so psyched for this!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:19 a.m. CST

    I'm skipping this to watch T:SCC...oh, wait....

    by MJohnson


  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Just finished season one this week

    by VikingQuestFan42

    Maybe it's cause I watched them all at a straight shot, but I thought this was a fantastic show. I mean, it had more monster of the week episodes then I typically like, but once they started to reveal the OVERALL story and where it is leading I became invested. And ALPHA is one of the sickest villains on television in a long time. Really hope they stick this one out.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:30 a.m. CST


    by Mooly

    Is it too early for all the Supernatural fans who seem to swarm the dollhouse threads? Anyway, glad this show is back and I'm REALLY glad Fox is letting Whedon make HIS show instead of their bastardized version of it. While I thought the first season was hated on WAY too much, it was certainly not his finest work. I can't wait for this new season and expect big things.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:36 a.m. CST

    Herc's Mom's House...

    by Billy Oblivion

    looks nice in the picture. I watched last season but was unimpressed until Alpha showed up. Still didn't care for the show, but Tudyk was terrific. However, the Lost episode really grabbed me. If they take the show that direction and give it some balls, I'm in for the duration.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:40 a.m. CST

    Pick nose, play guitar, pick nose, play guitar...

    by Disgruntled_Chinaman

    A day in the life of Joss "I used to do Buffy!" Whedon... Was Castiel banned?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:41 a.m. CST

    I'm hoping it's good. But . . .

    by kabong

    if there is the slightest smell of "We don't know what we're doing but we got the contract so let's keep doing it," I'm out.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:49 a.m. CST

    The casting is a sign of weakness.

    by CarmillaVonDoom

    All these "security blankets" from previous Whedon's like they don't even let other people audition. Happy Family, happy family

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:54 a.m. CST

    Looking forward to this, season one was watchable

    by JettL93

    was never a must see show, but still entertaining... what i'm really excited for is smallville..where the F is the talkback for that?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:03 a.m. CST

    So wheres the Smallville talkback?

    by paburrows

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:06 a.m. CST

    Have they changed the theme tune?

    by theGoldbergV

    Nah nah nah, nah nah, nah nah nah, nah naaah. Rubbish. Only the dink, dink, dink dink dink dink bit at the end is any good.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:07 a.m. CST

    Fuck Dollhouse, Bring back Terminator!

    by Eyegore

    They killed The Sarah Conner Chronicles for this shit, and I refuse to fucking watch it ever again. I'm holding a lifelong grudge against Fox and this show as payback. Never forget!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:13 a.m. CST

    Smallville Talkback!!!!!!

    by Drsambeckett1984

    Fucking right, we need one of those right now! How come shit as shit Heroes got one, a show that limps from episode to episode where Smallville is in its 9th season, and going strong. <P> Come AICN, pull your fingers out your arses and give the people what they want! And a supernatural talkback too!!!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:15 a.m. CST


    by Jarimor

    I am not quite sure how he is only half-English if he was born in England and was raised and studied in England. It's not like he is putting on an accent, that is his accent. I thought the latter half of the first season of Dollhouse was excellent and I have high hopes that it will grow even better this season now Whedon has free reign to have a season arc. Though it is most likely Fox will cancel it anyways.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:18 a.m. CST

    How dare you all speak ill of Saint Joss

    by Josstossesthesalad

    Everyone knows Joss Whedon is your true God. His inane banter makes geeks cream their pants. Who else could put a dumbass phrase like "See you latte" after a teenage girl kills (insert monster) with a coffee cup or other such dumbassery. Ah, I can't even be sarcastic anymore. Joss Whedon is an overrated hack. Does anyone find it odd that this fucker got his start writing shows about underage girls? Seriously though, this show is boring and most watch because the geek messiah Joss Whedon writes it? Prove me wrong.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:25 a.m. CST

    looking fwd to it!

    by the__natural74

    Season 1 finished so strong compared to the start. I think the concept of the Dollhouse sounded great on paper, but unfortunately created a show where we couldn't get to know the main character(s). In the beginning, I felt Boyd was our real main protagonist...and he was awesome!<br><br> There were plenty of solid eps in the beginning too, and I didn't mind the weekly stand-alones. That being said, it got great over the final 5 eps, with "Briar Rose" being my favourite.<br><br> But I swear I'm the only one who didn't care for "Epitaph One" at all. It was boring, useless and didn't really feature the main characters of the show. To me, it felt like "fan fiction", and while it was neat to jump ahead to see what could happen, I think it's only purpose was to wrap up a cancelled series. Absolutely the right decision to avoid airing it.<br><br> There were a couple of neat moments with Topher and the "new" Victor...but really it had no real value to the next season and killed any momentum gained leading up to "Omega".<br><br> I rented the discs to watch it, but found the on-set extras FAR MORE interesting than the extra episode. Watch those while you're getting ready for tonight!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:53 a.m. CST

    Smallville talkbacks, round the back of Macdonalds

    by Bobman46

    Bring cheersburgers and chat

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:56 a.m. CST

    The casting is a gimmick

    by buffywrestling

    but I think it's a little harsh to call it a "weakness". I think they are all strong actors. Movie directors do it all the time.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:17 a.m. CST

    Whedon go this start on "Roseanne"

    by buffywrestling

    Not Buffy. If your gonna effectively troll, the best ones have a bit on truth in them, just like all good lies.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:18 a.m. CST

    I wish we had more Talkbacks

    by buffywrestling

    that has pictures of Herc in his boxer shorts in them.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:25 a.m. CST


    by Aquatarkusman

    Wow! He's like a million times more awesome than I had previously thought!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:28 a.m. CST

    Sorry I forgot about Roseanne, my bad

    by Josstossesthesalad

    Seriously, I did forget. Anyway, all of his shows are pretty much the same. I did enjoy Firefly, but it seems to me that the concept of a Western in space has been done numerous times. As for Dollhouse, it really is boring and most watch it because the geek messiah Joss Whedon writes it. That was my point and sorry for the screwup.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:32 a.m. CST


    by Josstossesthesalad

    There are a whole lot of people that make a show not just one super writer. I also have a problem with him "executive producing" season 8 of Buffy in the comic. Isn't that the job of an editor? He plasters his name over all of the issues, even the ones he doesn't write. I just think he is overrated. I want him to write something different. Firefly is the closest thing he has done.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:49 a.m. CST

    I've said before: One person's "one note"

    by buffywrestling

    is another person's Auteur. The problem with being a Showrunner is you get all the blame or all the credit; it just goes with the territory. <p> I think Scott Allie is the editor, & Whedon just reads, possibly tweaks, for the comics, but it's being marketed as Season 8 and the continuation of the TV series, hence the weird "producing" credit. Which just got picked up for the next Season 9 run, I believe.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:54 a.m. CST

    Can't Wait

    by Cobbio

    Thanks for the preview and the low-res, pec-enhancing photo, Herc! You are the man.<p> I'm really looking forward to tonight's season-opening episode. The show has had time to sink in, and the cast additions, especially Denisov and Bamber, already have me holding my breath. If Whedon and his writers and directors pull their shit together this season, as I expect them to do, I have a feeling this could be an ass-kicking addition to my week. I'll likely watch every episode, live with friends or on Hulu.<p> Can't wait to see how this story unfolds.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:55 a.m. CST

    See your point

    by Josstossesthesalad

    But still it seems like a marketing gimmick to get people to read the comics, which isn't working for any comics company. It just bugs me when a "big shot" writer like Whedon, Ellis, Piccoult, or anyone with Hollywood credit thinks they can save comics with late books and gimmicks like Season 8-9. It's the same problem people have with George Lucas. They say he wants to make money. Sure he does, but he gets his stuff out on time and he isn't "executive producing" the novels and comics. As a culture, we just give Whedon too much credit for his work, when it's not just him.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:57 a.m. CST


    by I_Sharted

    You're a brave man to have a username like that. I totally agree with you of course but Herc's a nerd raging asshole when it comes to Joss Whedon. You should've called yourself HerctossesJosssalad.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:58 a.m. CST

    I agree about Herc's mom's house.

    by I_Sharted

    It does look rather nice and it's good to see that he came out of the basement for a quick picture.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 12:09 p.m. CST

    So Joss is indulging in BSG fan-fic now?

    by Raymar

    So sad.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 12:11 p.m. CST

    It's a total marketing gimmick, just like

    by buffywrestling

    the casting in Dollhouse. But where as the marketing of the comic was probably more of a business decision, the casting is a more personal one.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 12:17 p.m. CST

    Although I was wrong to imply he

    by buffywrestling

    doesn't write any of the comic issues. He did at the beginning & has a 4 issue arc coming up. That might make the "producing" credit make more sense. I don't know if Lucas himself has written in any other media form in the Star Wars universe other than the movies.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 12:52 p.m. CST

    Interesting interview back in March

    by buffywrestling <p> It's getting some play now & I'm gonna pull a BSB & post the whole thing, for people who like to talk about the premise & not just blanket bash. <p> /start Dollhouse is back tonight, and you can be sure that I'll be in front of my television, worrying about Echo, sort of rooting for Adelle and sort of being ashamed of it, and hoping the ratings get better because Fran Kranz really doesn't need something else he's part of to be cancelled or not make enough money and I'd sort of like for him to continue having a career. But 9pm is a long time from now, you guys. And so, to keep you busy until then, I have a special post. Last March, Joss Whedon was kind enough to take some time out of shooting The Cabin in the Woods to email me some very entertaining and thoughtful answers to questions I had about the show, for a piece I was working on for The Atlantic (keep in mind, only a few episodes had aired, and I was largely pursuing the human trafficking metaphor). I didn't get to use very much of his responses, but here they are, for your reading pleasure: <p> Alyssa: Human trafficking has become, for lack of a better word, a fairly popular subject for movies and documentaries in the past several years—and combating trafficking was a major priority of the Bush administration. How much did you consider you consider the politics surrounding trafficking when you designed Paul Ballard’s character? <p> Whedon: Trafficking is the lowest and most appalling crime perpetrated in any country not currently at war. So of course it makes popular fiction. Drugs are passé, murder is solved once a week on half the shows on TV… we always need to get more extreme. And here is a crime with classic foreign villains – with actual mustaches to twirl, desperate young female victims – the morality is genuinely simple and it’s a timeless American story: the captivity narrative. This is not to be callous, but the awful reality has a kind of fictional glamour to it. We can be outraged and moved but never feel it’s too close to home. <p> The people at Equality Now have been fighting human trafficking and sex tours for years without any real support. In fact, when I pitched Dollhouse to the staff there, one of them objected to the character of Ballard, saying a helpful FBI agent would be an unforgivable myth. For more stories to be told – for altruistic or sensationalist reasons – is to increase awareness and can only, I think, be helpful. <p> Alyssa: More broadly, can you talk about Dollhouse’s take on trafficking and prostitution? We know from the pilot that Caroline was in desperate when she signed up to become a Doll, but the episodes that have been aired so far show Echo enjoying her assignments. Is that ambiguity intentional, or will a clearer perspective emerge throughout the subsequent episodes? <p> Whedon: Now, having said the above, let me be clear that Dollhouse was never meant to be about trafficking. It was meant to be about power, desire, identity, and sexuality. I knew from the start that prostitution was part of the package, but that is something I was interested in exploring in a removed, fantastical setting. I don’t believe there’s anything wrong with people paying for sex IN THEORY. And what I was interested in was the desires people would have if they could create a true sexual narrative for themselves, to give the act context. It wasn’t until later in the process that I woke up in the middle of the night and thought “this is trafficking”. My response to that was to try and show both sides – the reality of trafficking and the fantasy of the Dollhouse, to show their differences AND similarities. To come at it head on. The Dollhouse fantasy is a dark one, but the darkness is more about why people give up their lives and what people with control over them will do. It’s still a fantasy. To have Paul Ballard say “It’s the same as trafficking” and try to link it to actual criminals was deliberate – like so many others, I wanted to do some stories about actual trafficking. Partly as narrative inoculation: “We’re not them!” and partly for the same reasons as everyone else. We didn’t get as far into that as we’d hoped – there’s been a lot of adjusting. <p> Alyssa: Obviously, you’re skating around a raft of major political and moral issues in Dollhouse, but thus far, the show’s very much a piece of genre fiction. Do you contemplate doing episodes that have a greater sense of realism? Can you see doing an episode the examines the realities of prostitution, for example, more literally like you do with the social work system and low-wage service work in Season 6 of Buffy? <p> Whedon: Some. Not too much, because the moral gray areas in the show are already lacking in white, and the show would become depressing beyond repair if it was all about the seamy side of life. That’s what SVU is for. (I love SVU, by the way.) <p> Alyssa: One recurring theme I’ve noticed in some of your work is that women who resist coercion, whether it’s sexual or otherwise, have to be prepared to respond with violence. They’re usually competent at fighting back, but your female characters seem to be at risk a lot of the time. Is that just a function of the characters and the situations they’re in? Or is reflection of violence against women in society? Or an argument about how women should protect themselves? <p> Whedon: All of the above? I write primarily about women. I write primarily horror and adventure stories. At some point, the hero’s gotta be put down. But then there is an amazing amount of unbelievable shit happening to women all over the world every single day. A lot to cull from – and to fight against. I don’t write politically, but if any woman tells me she gained strength from or identified with a character of mine, I am going to be pretty screamingly chuffed. <p> Alyssa: One of the things I enjoyed most about Buffy was the fact that the show is deeply grounded in a community we get to know very well—at the end of the show, Sunnydale’s destruction feels like a major loss. Will we see an expansion of the world that Dollhouse is set in, beyond the house itself? I know you’ve been asked how viewers are supposed to get attached to Echo when she’s a different person every episode, but what role does setting play in grounding the show? <p> Whedon: The world will expand. Oh holy boy will the world expand. And then, unless our ratings tick up a bit, it will very suddenly contract. /end

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 1:41 p.m. CST

    The show couldn't have been any worse

    by Xiphos_2

    so a slight improvment would seem like a giant gain in quality. Why can't Fox handle Sci fi? All thier sci fi shows from last season stunk. Out of all of them at least Dollhouse had some sort of pulse and had the best looking cast so I guess from that point of view it was decent.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:23 p.m. CST

    Is it watchable if you skipped all S1 but pilot?

    by Himbo

    Cause I lost subsequent episodes off the the TiVo.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:27 p.m. CST

    Finally, I Saw Epitaph One

    by Media Messiah

    "Epitaph One" has some very clever moments and strong writing...but it is also very choppy...and that weakens certain story elements that should be easily understood, and readily comprehended by the viewer--which often, they are not? The best of the episode is its second half, which rocks with fun and scary twists and turns--and of course, Joss Whedon's almost now patented sucker punch moments. The choppiness of the script...and editing lessens the impact of the episode, leaving "Man On The Street" still standing as the best episode of Dollhouse, to date. <BR><BR>I also saw the infamous Dollhouse pilot which is somewhat buried on disk 4 of the Dollhouse Season One DVD set. I have to admit it--it is a much better pilot than the Fox mandated new pilot...and the rough scene of Eliza Dushku...that I often complained about plays largely without incident...meaning, it plays well. I showed it to my Mom, and she loves Dollhouse...and the entire concept, as a whole. For me, the show still has its rough the story could be entirely more linear, for the series overall--it's too bysantine with its technologies...and story elements to be of the best service to itself, and to its audience. In other words, it needs to be more clear within its mission statement--and that would be communicate its story in a more effortless way to the audience.<BR><BR>Finally, two things...I was very, very disappoint with the behind the scenes footage I saw of the show. The majority of Joss Whedon's staff, crew, and writing team, is white. I think I only counted one or two minorities, including his sister in-law...who were working behind the scenes as an employees of the show. I have grown-up in Los Angeles and other areas of California, and it has certainly been more enthnically diverse than that--much more!!! Where are the Blacks, Latinos, the Indians, Pacific Islanders, Middle Easterners, and Asians...etc., save for the one or two that I saw onset--it seemed like an intentional apartheid??? Surely you can do better Joss...and terms of your hiring practices, behind the scenes? This is disturbing to see, since Joss has been an advocate for the human rights of women? Well, a part of that moment, was born, and has been supported by the Civil Rights Movement...for all--how about reflecting that onset? "We have a Black (racially mixed) President", as you mentioned in a recent episode of Dollhouse, but few minorities work behind the scenes of the very same show--a show bold enough to make such a statement--one which was meant to evoke irony in the minds of viewers--but no such boldness is reflected behind the scenes???<BR><BR>One more thing before I go...Joss' brother, I think Jed...and his wife, did a great song that concludes Epitaph is really special--a song in fact, that Mrs. Whedon sings...and she is quite terms of her vocal skills. That song is deeply moving...and lovely. The quality is as professional as you can get--I know, as I am a song writer...and know elite production when I hear it. Dr. Horrible's tracks where well as this song--very impressive indeed!!! <BR><BR>PS: I am looking forward to tonight's episode--may it rock!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:33 p.m. CST

    Herc, didn't you say that about Fringe?

    by lockesbrokenleg

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:34 p.m. CST

    Herc is Whedon's biggest cheerleader..

    by daveyf

    One must assume they're lovers.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:48 p.m. CST

    That's Dr. Horrible's Tracks Were

    by Media Messiah

    Sorry for the typos. Dyslexia is a bitch sometimes, but she is a wonder mistress too--my greatest muse!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 2:55 p.m. CST


    by buffywrestling

    I don't think it'll be that much of a problem. The premise isn't that hard to follow - even though it may seem difficult to *some* & I have other theories on to why that is - but it's not rocket science. It's more of a character driven premise that a plotty driven premise at this point. However, things looks like they are taking more of a mythology approach for the rest of S2. After this premiere episode, I think they'll focus on keeping the few viewers that they have rather then trying to gain new ones.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 3:08 p.m. CST

    Every time someone mentions Dr. Horrible

    by lockesbrokenleg

    I keep thinking it's one of those credit card commercials.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Spoiler from Bamber interview @ LA Times

    by buffywrestling

    Spoiler alert! <p> <p> <p> <p> No Seriously. <p> <p> <p> Bamber: No, I really don't know where they're headed. Tahmoh said they had a few problems last year and wanted to make it a bit more of an arc this season, and that there would be two different timelines going on. <p> Two different timelines??? That's...not what they were selling before. Then again Joss kinda vagued that up in interviews after Epitaph 1. I wonder if this just a case of a guest star getting confuddled? Cause otherwise....woah.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:03 p.m. CST

    T:SCC Blue Ballz

    by Alientoast

    Until they give us some closure on one of the worst cases of Sci-Fi blueballs since the Farscape regular series finale, I will not watch!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:09 p.m. CST


    by buffywrestling

    So did you get scammed into giving up money for a rolling billboard too?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:18 p.m. CST

    @Media Messiah

    by theGoldbergV

    "it's too bysantine with its technologies...and story elements to be of the best service to itself, and to its audience. In other words, it needs to be more clear within its mission statement." <p><p>I could say the same about your previous sentence. How is it too "byzantine"? And I'm not sure you can make any definitive analysis of hiring practices on Dollhouse based on a DVD extra. The ending song was good though.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:33 p.m. CST

    @Media Messiah : I disagree about the byzantine nature.

    by V'Shael

    If it had been a broadcast episode, I might agree with you. But this was an episode they KNEW was going to be on DVD only. Anyone interested in it, would be able to see it multiple times. This meant they could afford to layer the episode with multiple levels of complexity, to reward repeat viewing.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:40 p.m. CST

    Like we can trust Herc on Whedon

    by liesandpicturesofalsolies

    The show has gone from terrible to mediorce, I shall inform the internet!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 4:50 p.m. CST

    Is this article a duplicate?

    by felwithe

    I swear I've seen it before, even the "Cue haters in 3...2...1..." comment at the top. But the timestamps on all the comments say it was posted today. Weird.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:05 p.m. CST

    Is this article a duplicate? =

    by buffywrestling

    Did I fall asleep? Felwithe is an active whose retaining his memories! The third flower is green! <p> (Kidding; Dollhouse influx is taking over today. Yeah, it's pretty much a duplicate.)

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:31 p.m. CST

    New opening credits tonight

    by buffywrestling

    or so I've heard.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:35 p.m. CST

    Palm Pre?

    by crtjester20

    So Herc I'm gonna guess from the pic that's the Palm Pre you're using? What do ya think of it?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:46 p.m. CST

    You've got to give credit to Joss...

    by Naughty

    for getting Alexis Denisof a job and away from the baby nursery! I swear, Denisof has the strangest attitude when it come to working.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:49 p.m. CST


    by NoQuarter

    I've heard rumors about new credits as well, but nothing concrete. Do you happen to have a link that says there will be new credits? In any case, I really hope it's true.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:49 p.m. CST

    Stupid sticking keys!

    by Naughty

    I mean "comes" not "come"!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 5:55 p.m. CST

    No links; just tweets

    by buffywrestling

    They say the music is the same though. Find out in 2 hours!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6 p.m. CST


    by theGoldbergV

    The article's a duplicate from when Herc reviewed his preview copy, my commment at the top, (Cue haters...) is, I thought, my own. Of course if the tech is loose on the web, maybe I was channeling someone else. Epitaph Two right here!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:03 p.m. CST

    Holy Shit, Clone Wars starts Oct 2

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Thank Gods.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:06 p.m. CST


    by Naughty

    When I said "credit" I meant Joss got Alexis to go back to work. Although on the Emmy red carpet, he told E!News Kristin that he's probably not going to work very much, because he hates being away from the baby. He acts like he is the childs mother, or a single father. I just think his "stay-at-home" attitude is just strange for a married American male.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:16 p.m. CST

    Huh? Wha? Huh?

    by buffywrestling

    Who are you talking to? Are you Naughty & NoQuarter? Maybe the tech is loose! <p> But since you asked, I think it's kinda cute, in a Kevin Ferderline kind of way. He knows who makes the money :P

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:32 p.m. CST

    V'Shael: Yes...Perhaps You Are Correct?

    by Media Messiah

    I'm just glad to see Joss and his Think Tank, known as Mutant Enemy, doing just about they are very compelling, and as I always say, Joss is the new Rod Serling...and perhaps, the new Spielberg...that is, if given the chance to really shine by the industry. BTW...listen to the commentary by his brother and sister it is great stuff!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:38 p.m. CST

    Ah, Mediah Messiah, always good for a laugh

    by lockesbrokenleg

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:38 p.m. CST

    already seen that pic

    by punto

    how about one without the shirt now, Herc?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:41 p.m. CST

    TheGoldbergV: I Think That I Am Right

    by Media Messiah

    Yes, my sentence was awfully bysantine...and I apologize for that. As far as the behind the scenes footage, it was self explanatory about who was onset, and who was not--now, if Joss, or Mutant Enemy, would like to correct me if I am wrong, I am open to hear it...and I will promptly apologize. I was raised on Hollywood sets though, and this is the way it always was--often all, or 99 percent fo the staffs, writers, and crews, were...Caucasian???

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:41 p.m. CST

    Going to watch Smallville

    by Melvin_Pelvis

    have a greater investment in it<br> no dvr, so maybe catch up with whore story of the week on hulu<p> btw how could sierra run? what with the guy who sold her into slavery cornholing her at least every other night

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:43 p.m. CST

    Oh, BTW...That Song

    by Media Messiah

    That piano line is hauntingly beautiful!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 6:49 p.m. CST


    by fain88

    Ready for this premiere. Epitaph One: ridiculously amazing. Let's do this.<br> <br> PS: I am so very happy TV is back.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:21 p.m. CST

    I Thought Alexis Was English?

    by Media Messiah

    I know a guy from Europe who acts just like him...he's Mr. Mom...and is more mother to his new baby, than the actual mom, although he does have to work. As far as Alexis, I could have sworn that he is English?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:21 p.m. CST

    Ah! I'm watching Spaced on dvd

    by buffywrestling

    (10th birthday after all) & Oliva Williams (Adelle) just showed up to yell at Simon Pegg! My circle of genre televison is now complete.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:23 p.m. CST

    Alexis was born in Maryland

    by buffywrestling

    Way to be wrong, MM.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:25 p.m. CST


    by boosebaster


  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:26 p.m. CST


    by boosebaster

    Don't even think MM said the thing. Fuck it. I'm hammered, I'll shout at that twat if I want to. :)

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:29 p.m. CST

    Where is the Smallville talkback??

    by Acid_Frio

    It's on right now....and no advanced reviews????

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:34 p.m. CST

    Color me surprised.

    by Swoomustdie

    Herc crotch-nuzzles Whedon, entire community replies 'Saw that one from a mile away'.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:34 p.m. CST

    Buffywrestling: I Had No Idea...

    by Media Messiah

    ...nor was it a big deal to me either way? All I know is, he's got a lovely wife. Lucky bastard!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:34 p.m. CST

    Media Messiah: nope he's American

    by NoQuarter

    While I generally like to take every opportunity to bash you for being an insufferable and unjustifiably smug idiot, I will give you a pass on not knowing that Alexis Denisof is an American. But that's ONLY because his acting was so good in the role of Wesley Wyndham-Price that it's an easy mistake to make.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:36 p.m. CST

    Boosebaster: Huh???

    by Media Messiah

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:40 p.m. CST

    NoQuarter: He Is A Very Good Actor

    by Media Messiah

    Since he and his wife like to spend a lot of time in Britain...I just assumed he was English.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:49 p.m. CST

    Ha! This TB is fucked

    by buffywrestling

    Mistaken identies all around then!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 7:59 p.m. CST

    Beware: Posting frenzy starts now

    by buffywrestling

    Spoilers crossing.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:03 p.m. CST

    Tempura Joe

    by buffywrestling

    Such a lonely soul. New credits = all Echo

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:05 p.m. CST

    In watching the Dollhouse Credits....

    by lfhlaw

    All the scenes in the opening for Dollhouse now are just Eliza Dushku. None of the other imprints. Why?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:10 p.m. CST

    Wow, could not look away from Whiskey

    by buffywrestling

    "My entire existance was made up by a sociopath in a sweater vest." The Bride of Frankenstein insert was VERY apt.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:13 p.m. CST

    Ballard doing push-ups

    by buffywrestling

    during the sex montage - I probably shouldn't be laughing at that.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:18 p.m. CST

    ....And the plumbing

    by buffywrestling

    Gross. Why is it that Echo can be disgusting and I don't have a problem with it yet that douche says something gross and it bugs me.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:24 p.m. CST

    Isn't the Dollhouse the Big Bad of the season?

    by commiepinko

    Is this the most morally gray, non-reality, show on TV?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:25 p.m. CST

    Women Being Disgusting Is Rather Sexy...

    by Media Messiah being disgusting is...creepy. It's a double standard, but a good one--most of the time!!! Well, unless the disgusting is consentual...and on equal terms, which rules out hiring a prostitute or a stripper. Yes, if we are talking a couple, doing disgusting things together, and nobody gets hurt, then...disgusting is, disgustingly hot!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:29 p.m. CST

    Post-it from the Isle of Lesbos

    by buffywrestling

    Echo remembering Whiskey when she was getting her "plumbing" examined. Ballard & Adelle are laying things on the line; no dancing around each other like his interaction with Boyd.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:30 p.m. CST

    Does Topher live in the computer room?

    by buffywrestling

    Of course he does.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:33 p.m. CST

    So far, so good.

    by CatVutt

    Barring a meltdown in the second half, this is enough to keep me watching for at least a few more episodes. <p> And if somebody could give the fucking endlessly delusional and tedious fuck Media Mess a quick shove into a woodchipper, I would greatly appreciate it.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:36 p.m. CST

    Topher & Whiskey's scene was amazing

    by buffywrestling

    Kinda speechless.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:36 p.m. CST

    PS: Sex...If It Is Done Right...

    by Media Messiah

    ...should be disgusting--making love, however, that should be pretty, beautiful, kind, nurturing, and...something else entirely. Sex, however, is the F- word...and should be just that, in all its fully glory. If you can wake-up one morning, and honestly say to yourself..."What I just did...was absolutely disgusting...and I am disgusted with myself, and my partner!"...well, you just did the F-word correctly--if not, you were just playing at it, and you get graded the other F-word for Failure!!! I prefer to wake-up completely...and utterly, disgusted. It may be devilish...but it sure is Heavenly!!!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:38 p.m. CST

    Uh, yeah.

    by CatVutt

    Trust me, none of think for one fucking minute that you've had anything resembling sex. So shut the fuck up.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:39 p.m. CST

    Smallville was pretty good

    by KentButabi

    Less cheesy dialogue this time and sharp FX. Still don't understand why everyone things Brian Autin Green is so great, though. Perhaps next episode will enlighten me?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:40 p.m. CST

    Bad time to glitch

    by buffywrestling

    Baaad time.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:45 p.m. CST

    Do you have a better plan?

    by buffywrestling

    No but I have a worse one. Hee!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:50 p.m. CST

    CatVutt: You Talkin' To Me???

    by Media Messiah

    I'll have you know that Choclate Woman gave me fisting rights...right on Ain't Cool News, for all to see. And you think I'm not good with the ladies? My powers of seduction are infamous.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:51 p.m. CST

    Oh, MM, shut the fuck up.

    by lockesbrokenleg

    you overrated shit.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:55 p.m. CST


    by CatVutt

    The tool doesn't warrant any rating at all. It just drones on and on in a little bubble of self-delusion. It should be put to sleep to keep from bothering people.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:55 p.m. CST

    I don't see this drawing in new viewers.

    by tonagan

    I know that's not the indicator of a good show but, ratings-wise, it's probably not good.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 8:57 p.m. CST

    Actually, you're right.

    by CatVutt

    It's definitely an improvement to me, but a new viewer is hardly likely to get excited about anything here.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9 p.m. CST


    by CatVutt

    I REALLY hope that the next episode is a hell of a lot better than that teaser made it look.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:01 p.m. CST

    Lockesbrokenleg: I Think Somebody...

    by Media Messiah jealous? I won't fight you back. True visionaries, and lovers, and often destroyed for their art and epic loves. I guess, I am a martyr of love...and of great principle--so is the tale of Greek, and often Shakespearean, Tragedy...that is my life, I suppose? Please...cast the first stone! There is great romance in being made a martyr, even an overrated one. I am richly flattered, because I do it all for art...and love.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:03 p.m. CST

    Speaking of duplicates

    by buffywrestling

    Some nice synergy there when Ballard becomes Echo's handler. Really interesting on how the downlaod of Dr.Saunders doesn't want to give up Whiskey's body - an almost complete reversal of Echo's position of wanting to find Caroline & everyone else she's ever been. Last season's Ghost kinda raised some questions about a dead person being downloaded into an active and Dr. Saunders took that a bit further.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:04 p.m. CST

    Amended--Lockesbrokenleg & Catnip: I Think Somebody...

    by Media Messiah jealous? I won't fight you back. True visionaries, and lovers, are often destroyed for their art and epic loves. I guess, I am a martyr of love...and of great principle--so is the tale of Greek, and often Shakespearean, Tragedy...that is my life, I suppose? Please...cast the first stone! There is great romance in being made a martyr, even an overrated one. I am richly flattered, because I do it all...for art...and love.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:05 p.m. CST

    I don't think they are looking for new viewers

    by buffywrestling


  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:08 p.m. CST

    MM: Snap out of it

    by buffywrestling

    Your crazy is dialed up to eleven. Go outside for a walk or something. Jesus.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:15 p.m. CST

    Kobe: I Said Couples

    by Media Messiah

    ...not sleazy pick-ups. Re-read my writing. I am talking about two people on equal levels of consent, and trust...who love each other--or at least, like each other. In order to keep any relationship hot, you had better bring the fantasy and eroticism into the bedroom, kitchen, on the stairs, in the shower, or wherever (?), cause if you don't, your mate will find it elsewhere, and perhaps, so will you? Even Kevin Bacon...echoed this view in a recent interview...and you'll note, he is a happily married man.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:17 p.m. CST

    Not just improved, but impressive

    by cookepuss

    Whedon & Co have turned the entire show a full 180 in just one episode. VERY impressive. <p> <p> - Saunder scenes with Topher were... Wow. This is the type of stuff I expected out of season 1.<p> - Echo shifting personalities and becoming a total badass... Whedon heard our cries for more action.<p> - The revelation that Echo KNOWS she's an active, remembers her personalities, and is determined uncover more secrets.... Now we're cookin'. Actual plot. An actual direction for the show.<p> - Sierra & Victor... If it weren't for the fact that their real personalities are being subverted, this burgeoning romance would even be 100% sweet.<p> <p> Just about every aspect of this show has improved. Even Dushku's acting seems to be a bit more spot on this season. The knowing wink about trust & falling asleep seems to carry more weight now than last season.<p> <p> Fox needs to give this show a serious push. It is not only just improved, it has a chance of becoming as classic as Buffy. The characters are all now starting to come in into their own and a real direction for the entire show is starting to shape up.<p> <p> So far, this is one of the better openers for a returning show this season. Not sure what the ratings are going to be in the Friday death slot, but, creatively, Dollhouse's future looks very bright right now.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:24 p.m. CST

    Buffywrestling: Kind Is More Like It

    by Media Messiah

    I must go now. Have a nice evening all. I could spend my time issuing assailing words back...but I am too kind to do so. I wish you well, though, as I know...most people should not be characterized by their indifferent, or cold moments.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:42 p.m. CST

    everything but the Whiskey subplot was generic.

    by howlermonkey

    How many times are we going to see Echo get put into that same situation? Echo gets put in an engagement, something goes horribly wrong. Multiple times throughout the series. Wouldn't they have, realistically, put her in the attic and got a new doll by now? What makes Echo so special? To me she really seems like the weakest link of the group. This show would benefit far more if Echo wasn't the "main" character. Just like on Buffy, the supporting characters are really what drive the show, Echo and her adventures with secret agent Ballard are just kind of what all the rest of these really awesome characters all orbit around, and it's quickly becoming the worst part of the show. I know I sound a little jaded, but I was just pretty let down by this episode. I was expecting them to pull out all the stops and it was just...another Dollhouse.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 9:43 p.m. CST

    No one cares about this except Buffywrestling and MM

    by ulcer

    you know I'm right.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    Slow talkback,

    by lockesbrokenleg

    MM hasn't insulted anyone in a half hour.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:43 p.m. CST

    PS: Buffywrestling

    by Media Messiah

    You posted an interview featuring Joss Whedon--did you not? One where Whedon was quoted as saying: "I don’t believe there’s anything wrong with people paying for sex (prostitution) IN THEORY." Well, I simply said that "disgusting" should be equal in the balance of power in the bedroom...and prostitution creates an imbalance, as disgusting things happen in prostitution; as it is all about what is sleazy and disgusting. I feel, however, that it is perfectly fine--that disgusting, that is, between to equals in a relationship--and yet, you attacked me for it--this, while saying earlier: "Why is it that Echo can be disgusting, and I don't have a problem with it?" <BR><BR>It is good to see that the United States of still alive, and perfectly well.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:45 p.m. CST

    STARGATE UNIVERSE starts oct 2nd

    by DioxholsterReturns

    gonna get popular fast

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 10:56 p.m. CST

    You're absolutely right, howlermonkey

    by Margot Tenenbaum

    The Dichen Lachman doll is much, much better at it. <p>The only thing worse than having the Dollhouse crew act like amoral monsters is having them act like self-aware amoral monsters. That line of Echo's belittling Helo (the audience)'s beliefs about sex? Of course that would be what they programmed her to feel about doing what she does. <p>I hate that Whedon's flimsy-ass justifications (voiced through Echo and Olivia Williams) always stop Paul in his tracks. "Um, Mellie doesn't really remember me and yes, I feel something for Echo and I hope she'll like me when she's restored to normal. If I free her and the rest of the dolls, I'm probably not going to send anyone Christmas cards reminding them of where we met. And I don't really feel bad about that." And then he punches DeWitt in the nose.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:01 p.m. CST

    Fozzy sez just grin & bear it.

    by DreamSeasonBobby

    Dollhouse far from broken, with moments of brilliance (Topher & Whiskey's duet as close to an existentialist diatribe as Fox would ever allow, well, at least since X-files heyday), and this ep ended well. Still, not as strong as final 3 hours of S1. 3 out of 4 stars, find myself awaiting Summer-time in Autumn. Wakawaka, DSB. P.S. That's right, I said diatribe: READ A BOOK!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:11 p.m. CST

    MM: I didn't comment on your comments

    by buffywrestling

    I told you to Go. For. A. Walk. Air the crazy out of your head.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:17 p.m. CST

    Amoral monsters?

    by buffywrestling

    Are you saying the dolls themselves are imoral monsters or Adelle, Topher & Boyd?

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:18 p.m. CST

    Whedon scripted Star Wars would be

    by one_guy_from_andromeda_

    pretty nice, i hope they give him some episodes to write in that. He could give back the series some of its much needed camp. Dollhouse, meh, I'll download it to look at eliza and sierra, but the plot i couldn't care less about, there's just no logic in it.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST

    Buffywrestling: It's Not Crazy To Have A Comment

    by Media Messiah

    My comments are always steamlined, direct, and to the point. You may disagree with them, but that is no reason to call names.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:21 p.m. CST


    by Media Messiah

    ...Tempura Joe is my hero!!!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:23 p.m. CST

    Star Wars never was campy

    by lockesbrokenleg

    That's why it lasted for so long. It's not dated at all.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:26 p.m. CST

    seriously ZZzz-inducing.

    by ulcer

    Echo's storyline == boring, cringe-inducing. The rest: slow, yawn-inducing. And seriously, that montage with Echo making love with one BSG guy while the other BSG guy is doing push ups?? Com'on, this is bad!

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:29 p.m. CST


    by buffywrestling

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:31 p.m. CST

    Lockesbrokenleg: Hello, "Return Of The Jedi"...

    by Media Messiah

    ...and the "Star Wars" prequels are high camp. In fact, they put the word "Campy" back into the dictionary.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:31 p.m. CST

    ulcer, you do care!

    by buffywrestling

    Thank you for your comment :)

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:33 p.m. CST

    "we are lost but we are not gone"

    by ulcer

    Disastrous writing and delivery.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:37 p.m. CST

    I meant DeWitt and the tech guy specifically.

    by Margot Tenenbaum

    But also any lines that come out of any of the Dolls' mouths when they're 'in character' because that's Topher speaking through them.

  • Sept. 25, 2009, 11:39 p.m. CST

    Opening titles

    by Rogue Trooper

    I miss the tilt shift opening titles. Oh and the shot of Echo pulling up her stockings. Haven't watched the rest of the show yet though.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:02 a.m. CST

    Buffy: The Inference Of Using The Word Crazy...

    by Media Messiah aimed at someone else, is calling names. Look, you are nice person, I'm sure, so I'm not trying to start an argument. I have a comic sarcasm about me that can sometimes rub people the wrong-way...and I may be eccentric, but I always tell the truth when I post. rare, so I always try to have integrity--because eventually, it will serve you well--when people realize that they can trust your words, over that of others.<BR><BR>You know, all the things that people say about me--like when they say I have been making up things about my history--the funny thing about that everything that I have said, is all true. Nothing to brag about, really, as show business can be awfully mean, and the only thing I've gotten out of it, is being broke--and being very creative. The latter is nice--but the fore, not so nice...cause, a broken heart, broken dreams, and a lot of wasted effort, comes along with it--and sadly, the rich, the powerful, and famous people which you meet, well, they are only people too--and mostly messed-up, just like everybody else in this fishbowl of a world.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:04 a.m. CST

    Amy Ackers was hot!

    by kbarber29

    Please don't cancel. Please don't cancel!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:07 a.m. CST

    Just Saw The Episode: My Insta Review

    by Media Messiah

    Once is too bysantine for its own good. Joss Whedon has a in-joke somewhere under his sleeve, but he thinks the audience is in on it? The problem is, he gets the in-joke, but he is on the inside looking-out, while most of us are looking at the show from the outside looking in, and we are not getting much of it. The show still manages to keep its audience at an emotional distance--and that is harming all of Whedon's attempts to open-up the show to a wider audience.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:09 a.m. CST

    KBarber29: Agreed About Amy!!!

    by Media Messiah

    In my heart, I would have pulled a Topher with her, but in my brain...I would have pulled a Tempura Joe!!!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:22 a.m. CST

    Yay for no fake accents

    by ArianeB

    After faking an American accent for 5 years Jamie Bamber got to play a Brit, and after faking a British accent for 6 years, Alexis Denisof got to speak like an American. So nobody was faking an accent tonight... well except Aussie Dichen Lachman.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:26 a.m. CST

    I just wanted to say how awesome it is

    by smackfu

    That Superman's 'calling card' is to unnecessarily damage public property.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:27 a.m. CST


    by The 6th Conchord

    This show is an interesting premise, but is BORING. Go have sex or do something FUN with your Friday, people!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:31 a.m. CST

    Buffywrestling, stop asking for pics of me in my undies!

    by Hercules

    I love you, but you are a horny little minx!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:33 a.m. CST

    "Tempura Joe"

    by Hercules

    so fucking funny. I wanted to quote that in the review a month ago but didn't want to ruin it.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:36 a.m. CST

    Telling you you're acting crazy

    by buffywrestling

    isn't the same as name-calling. You really have trouble differentiating things, don't you?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:39 a.m. CST

    Ah! I *knew* that line would have got you!

    by buffywrestling

    Soon as I heard it it, I was thinking, "Herc must have cracked his shit up at Adelle's delivery."

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:41 a.m. CST

    It's also awesome that future generations may

    by smackfu

    refer to Superman as 'The Red Bloobler'

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:44 a.m. CST

    "I know what I know"

    by buffywrestling

    Also a line from Topher that was a nice nod to E1. It's like Whiskey is that catalyst for Topher's eventual condition.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:49 a.m. CST

    Eliza doing a Q & A on Twitter right now

    by buffywrestling

    probably about 10 mins left. @elizadushku

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 1:28 a.m. CST

    Amy Acker should have her own show.

    by sighborg

    Nothing against Eliza, but Acker is a brilliant actress who would do greater justice to the character of Echo. Her scenes in tonites show were the most riveting of the series yet. Someone needs to give her her own show.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 1:37 a.m. CST

    Amy Acker: They Gave Her Echo's Storyline???

    by Media Messiah

    In tonight's episode, Amy's character got all the character development...and emotional expansion that Echo should have had from episode one??? This is the second time I feel in love with Amy--the first, was when she played Fred on "Angel"...and of course, "The Big Bad" that possessed her...and now, she has made me fall in love with her all over again, as the Doctor/Whiskey. This woman knows how to bring a man to his knees--and make him beg for more. She has completely stolen the show from Eliza!!!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 1:39 a.m. CST

    That's...Fell In Love--Sorry!!!

    by Media Messiah

    Ah, typos, the bane of my existence!!!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 1:57 a.m. CST

    Buffywrestling: Chris Brown...Now That's Crazy

    by Media Messiah

    He beats women, and then says..."What's the big deal?" crazy!!! He also claimed to have blacked-out during the attack??? Again, that's crazy!!!<BR><BR>Me, however, I say..."What's wrong with a little spanking, warm chocolate syrup, and whipped cream...with your sex?" That's not crazy-- that's freaky sexy, and in a good way--or better yet, that's crazy like a fox. I'm a sweetheart--perhaps the sweetest person you've ever met? I may be loud, or silly...or even clumsy, but that isn't being insane--that's being a nerd. You should watch "Big Bang Theory" it will inform you a lot about nerds..and the difference between awkwardly sweet/loving, and...crazy. Chris Brown=Crazy, MM=A Frog Prince. Yes, I may be a frog, but I am still a Prince. Ribit!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 2:59 a.m. CST

    Epitaph One was incredible

    by reflecto

    Looking forward to watching last night's premiere on the Tivo.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 2:59 a.m. CST

    Herc: Very Big Ideas

    by buffywrestling

    Was one of those ideas the Creator making his Creation better than himself and willing to question his actions?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 3:07 a.m. CST

    I would really like a transcript of the

    by buffywrestling

    scene between Whiskey & Topher. Felt like a mini-play and I don't think a line was wasted. I especially liked the "You're human", "Don't flatter yourself." exchange. Creation calling out her Creator, Creation tormenting her Creator.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:18 a.m. CST


    by Hercules

    that was one. <p> there's also this much huger idea. What if somebody tapped you on your Buffywrestling shoulder right how and said, "Hi. You've only existed about 20 minutes. Those 25 years of memories you think you have are a lie. You're in somebody else's body that we have to return in three years. That nerd over there created your mind and that nice English lady over there can impulsively wipe you out of existence at any time at her whim, and never give her decision to do so a second thought. <p>Imagine how you'd feel. <p>I'd be inclined to hop in a car and flee.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:29 a.m. CST

    and yes

    by Hercules

    I thought it hilarious that Adelle seemed to feel only pity for the batter-obsessed anchorman. Most TV writers would go for the safe "laugh" and have a character shudder with disdain or ridicule or revulsion at the thought of poor Tempura Joe. I found her pity infinitely funnier. "Such a lonely soul."

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:32 a.m. CST


    by Hercules

    I called "Kings" the best new NBC of last season and posted many stories about it.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:53 a.m. CST

    for those who claim that's my mom's house

    by Hercules

    If it is, I must say she is one shitty housekeeper. <p>But it's not. My parents and I have lived in separate, non-adjacent states for the last quarter century.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:57 a.m. CST


    by Mr. Zeddemore

    Where's the Supernatural talkback? <p> Even if you dislike the show, this is a GEEK-THEMED SITE. Not for SNL and the like that are mainstream entertainment. It's for Supernaturals and Smallville's that appeal to us. And would, in turn, merit discussion with equals lots of TB space which merits advertising money. Am I getting through to you? At all?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 8:15 a.m. CST

    "Fuckin Stilettos"

    by RainesMaker

    was I the only one that heard that? FCC wasa a asleep at teh wheel...hahaha

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Hercules: On Your Explanation Of The Predicament Of A Doll

    by Media Messiah

    Herc--You Said: <BR><BR>That was one. There's also this much huger idea. What if somebody tapped you on your Buffywrestling shoulder right now...and said, "Hi. You've only existed about 20 minutes. Those 25 years of memories you think you have are a lie. You're in somebody else's body that we have to return in three years. That nerd over there created your mind and that nice English lady over there can impulsively wipe you out of existence at her whim, and never give her decision to do so a second thought." <BR><BR> Imagine how you'd feel? <BR><BR> I'd be inclined to hop in a car and flee. <BR><BR> MM--I Say:<BR><BR>You are exactly right, and that point-of-view should have been the thrust of the show. What we saw of Amy Acker's (Doctor/Whiskey) storyline, should have been Echo's storyline. The horror of Amy's character, should have been Echo's realization and horror, and hence, should have led to her taking action on her behalf, and perhaps on the behalf of the other actives--instead, we have seen none of that??? At the beginning of the series, they started with a concept, a very good one, but don't seemed to have work-out the story narrative before launching into the show--and really cracked the story??? Joss promised us that he had finally cracked the story, this season, and finally found the series, but by the looks of Friday's episode. it appears like that isn't the case? The episode was well done, but I could have done without the gangster...and Echo marrying him??? Do you know how long that would have taken her and Ballard to set him up for a marriage??? It would have been better if she just played a high class call girl...or a stripper, who managed to get close to the mobster as his playing to his sexual appetites, some perhaps twisted, something that would have taken a matter of minutes, hours, or days? Not months--or over a year, or longer, as it would have taken to unnecessarily lure a person into marriage, especially a smart high powered gangster who appears to be untouchable--and would do extensive background checks and daily/nightly recon on a girl he let into his life as a potential wife?<BR><BR>These kinds of ridiculous side stories, dressed-up as main story focuses...leave the series as an empty vessel? The heart of the episode was found in Amy Acker's character, and her story arc, and that of Topher--all a B Story??? How does a B-Story become richer and more developed, and defined, emotionally, as well as dialogue wise, than the A-Story??? I would have caught that at the first script reading and said give the B-story to Echo...and make it the A-Story!!! <BR><BR>My ultimate point is this: You explained to Buffywrestling, all the motivation that Echo should just a paragraph, and a few sentences--only, it seems that you were refering to Amy Acker's Doctor/Whiskey character, and one being in her shoes...and the development of her story arc in last night's episode. Well, my point is...again, that should be Echo's story arc, and her mission statement. She should have become self realized by first--believing she was someone else, and then, learning the horror of the fact that everything she knew is a lie--including elements of her entire life--and deciding to run, rather than be mind wiped...out of existence--which would, in-effect, be a form of death for her self realized she would know that she was inhabiting someone else's body. Your breakdown of that story element is fascinating...but Joss and crew, as brilliant as they are...seem to be missing their very own self created, and fascinating story elements...and choosing to forward worthless stories that see Echo marrying throw away gangsters instead???

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 9:38 a.m. CST

    Thanks For The Twitter Head's Up

    by Media Messiah

    I don't have phone texting service so--I guess I can't Twitter? But it was nice to know that Eliza was available to her fans that way.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 9:55 a.m. CST

    still pissed about TSCC

    by potter4eva

    Still pissed they canceled Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles....Stupid ass Fox people I don't find this show interesting in the least

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 10:39 a.m. CST

    Free Zeddemore!

    by Mavra Chang

    Can the ban!

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:16 a.m. CST

    was definetely Fuckin Stilletos

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:17 a.m. CST

    dollhouse is slowly growing on me

    by palewook

    didn't care for season 1, unknown how i'll feel about season, doubt dollhouse sees a season 3. <P> i keep watching for the time being because of all the talent involved in the show.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:18 a.m. CST

    Could you still love a whore ?

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    In the case of Echo she doesnt know what she does, but Ballard does.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:20 a.m. CST

    Eliza looked great in the wedding underwear

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    who is the lucky guy banging her these days?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:34 a.m. CST

    Loved it especially the Dr Saunders/Whiskey scenes

    by Tacom

    Amy Acker rocked. The part where she doesn't want to be imprinted with her old personality because she didn't want to "die" was incredible. It's a shame she's not going to be a regular. Media-Messiah, a lot of RETURN OF THE JEDI might have been camp but Luke's final attack against Vader after with the choir music going is one of the all time great SW moments. Plus the space battle was fucking great.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:37 a.m. CST

    by DerLanghaarige

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:42 a.m. CST

    Lockesbrokenleg vs Media Messiah

    by Xiphos_2

    Which one is nuttier and more of a virgin?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:45 a.m. CST

    Locke's for the virgin media for the nuttier

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:47 a.m. CST

    My reaction to This Herkimer story as w/ the rest-

    by Sal_Bando

    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz<p> Dushku is cute <p> zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:48 a.m. CST

    Xiphos, what did Locks and Mammaries do again????

    by Sal_Bando

    --something about a goat and sharing the load-?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:50 a.m. CST

    Unfortunate Premier

    by _Maltheus_

    <p>It was enough to keep my interest up, but it was way to muddled to bring in new viewers. It would have made a better second episode, IMO. By the time this show finally gets up to speed, it will have been canceled.</p> <p>As for Acker and Dushku, I always thought Acker should have been the star. She always has been the much better actress. Prettier too IMO.</p>

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 11:50 a.m. CST

    If Dollhouse was on cable tv

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Amy Acker would be the lead, very talented actress, with great range <p> Eliza, great body

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:12 p.m. CST

    Does anybody else just love the fact that Topher

    by NoQuarter

    sleeps in the server room? Seems very appropriate.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:26 p.m. CST

    Stargate is better than this pile of shit

    by DioxholsterReturns

    joss whedon went crazy by doing crap like this. i wish fox would cancel it already.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 12:38 p.m. CST


    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Looking forward to hearing your insightful and thoughtful views. <p> You, locke's and media all in the same TB, we really are privellaged

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 1:28 p.m. CST

    ratings were worse for this season premiere than last years

    by palewook

    spells no season 3 if it happens for next 2 weeks.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 2:26 p.m. CST

    Well, no big improvements on DOLLHOUSE yet.

    by SpyGuy

    Amy Acker was easily the highlight of last night's episode and it was fun to see Jamie Bamber using his natural accent that makes him sound a lot like Gaius Baltar, but other than that, DOLLHOUSE still has nothing going for it. I honestly can't think of a single character worth saving, especially now that Adelle hacked her hair off and looks considerably less hot than she did last season.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 2:50 p.m. CST

    Ratings are the same as where they left off

    by lagomorph

    when they renewed the show for a second Season. So I'm not convinced the execs are going to be that surprised when the numbers roll in. It's not like Fox has been big pimpin' the return. The episode itself was great tv. The timing of Echo's personality glitch before the second act break was fantastic and a surprise. I even liked how Paul Ballard manipulated that to his advantage. Lots of little character moments added to the whole experience. Like when Adelle lingered on Victor or when Saunders suggested that she was never worth fixing to Adelle since she had never received a similar expensive treatment. Also when Whiskey started to go for the scalpel before snatching up a lollipop and keeping it for herself. Not to mention the great exchanges bewteen her and Topher. I want to be critical but I can't really complain about this episode and it left me eager to see more. I'm willing to roll with the A Story they chose for Echo and see where it fits into the Season's arc as I did last season. I thought the payoff last season of Caroline having to answer to her own body was fascinating.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 2:55 p.m. CST

    MM rambles on about nothing.

    by lockesbrokenleg

    And the net laughs.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 3:19 p.m. CST

    So...will they be getting a new doctor?

    by theGoldbergV

    Nice way to write out Whiskey. Now it means her next appearance will have instant drama. The people that suggest the characters on this show are all worthless must be watching a different thing to me. Agree with lagomorph, nice character moments throughout this ep. Intrigued to see where it goes from here. <p><p>Anyone know how the DVD sales are? Dollhouse has been sold to UK tv and the boxsets seem to be selling well over here. Is it possible that FOX may overlook the low ratings?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 3:28 p.m. CST

    lockes and Messiah are enemies?

    by TheJokesOnUs

    I guess it's my prejudice that assumes two insane retards that post nonstop fucking garbage would be great pals. Although given the ultimatum of banishing one and keeping the other, I'd keep Messiah. At least he seems relatively harmless and I love hearing about his surefire megahit movie ideas. Reminds me of classic JDanielP before he blew his brains out or whatever happened.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 3:49 p.m. CST

    ratings / lago

    by palewook

    Dollhouse season 2 premiere 1.6/3 and a 1.0 rating in the 18-49 demo. <p>Dollhouse series 1 premiere 4.72 million viewers and a 2.0 rating

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 4:11 p.m. CST

    I say ban Jokesonus - he's a complete douche

    by lockesbrokenleg

    who would rather argue about Citzen Kane for hours on end, when no one else gives a shit.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:31 p.m. CST

    Lockesbrokenleg: My Ramblings, As You Call Them...

    by Media Messiah

    ...are well thought-out. Besides, what are you talking about, don't you hate all things Joss Whedon??? I love me some Whedon, and I would like to see him succeed in all his ventures, but when I find flaw, I try to point it out, hoping he'll fix these things if there is enough of a consensus among fans. My writings on this subject, have been clearly understood by those intelligent enough to read them--and comprehend the wider meanings. They have been deliberate, and mostly well written despite my dyslexia and my eye disease, and I am thankful for that. <BR><BR>I understand how to round a story, and how to crack stories. You may call it rambling if you want, but you never give anyone a positive is only attack, attack, attack.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:37 p.m. CST

    TheJokesOnUs: Do You Know Why I Have...

    by Media Messiah

    ...a surefire attitude, because I have witnessed friends, and acquaintances--with surefire attitudes, about what they believed would, or could be, surefire hits, who actually went on to make surefire hits. Most of these people are millionaires, and I know an exec who is a billionaire, or in that league...and a family of billionaires. I figure, if they can make it, why not me???

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:53 p.m. CST

    The Ratings Drop: Look To Dollhouse's Lead-In

    by Media Messiah

    You can't match-up a family comedy show...with a completely different audience demographic...if you wish to get high ratings!!! "Dollhouse" needs a lead-in like "American Idol", "The Simpsons", or "Family Guy", as you will have some of the same demo...who will watch the show. You don't have that with the current lead-in series--a comedy about a Black family. As soon as that show goes off, its audience changes the channel. Dollhouse needs a lead-in series that will attract a meanstream audience!!! How Fox keeps messing this up, and how Whedon keeps allowing them to...boggles the mind?

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:53 p.m. CST

    Finally Got to Watch the Episode

    by fain88

    and damn! Some very nice stuff.<br> <br> I agree with whoever above said it didn't feel new-viewer friendly, and I'll add that the first half of the episode almost felt rushed. Like if there'd been another 10 minutes to play with, there would have been a better 'intro'. <br> <br> But the Whiskey/Topher scene, and the Echo/Ballard scene at the end, wow wow wee wow! Amazing performances, even from Eliza.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:54 p.m. CST

    I never said I hated Joss

    by lockesbrokenleg

    I don't mind Firefly at all, but it's over hyped on sci fi boards everywhere as Gods Gift to Sci Fi.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 5:57 p.m. CST


    by fain88

    growing to love the character of Topher. His sleeping in the Dollhouse, apart from the analogue to Dr. Saunders/Whiskey never leaving the Dollhouse, also could be seen as the first step down the road we saw him on in Epitaph One. Interesting, no?<br> <br> There's so much that can happen with this show; I just wish they'd say 'fuck it' and spring forward to incorporate Epitaph One and do that whole massive, over-arching story with this season ('cause if ratings don't pick up, they might not get the chance).

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:11 p.m. CST

    It Looks Like Our Debating Is Over--No Matter What

    by Media Messiah

    You can try to lead a horse to water...but that doesn't mean he'll follow you, or drink that water? The ratings are so bad, the show can't survive, unless Fox moves the show...or gives it a lead-in that can attract a sizable audience, and immediately. Joss has been slow to react to the show's problems...and slow at changing course to address those problems--in a demonstrative, and powerfully blunt, effective manner. I think it's over for "Dollhouse" now? "Send in the clowns--wait, they're already"...<BR><BR>Well, you know the rest.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 6:59 p.m. CST


    by TheJokesOnUs

    Who are these friends of yours? Have you heard of any of them? Listen, it's like James Gunn said, people in the industry aren't in it to say no to people. They are dying to get to the next hot prospect in order to make them lots of money. You've been talking about this slasher film for ages now. Have you actually written it yet? Do you have a script you are showing to people? If not, you're all talk.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 7:34 p.m. CST

    I Know Them Through Close Family Members...

    by Media Messiah

    ...and they are quite real...and often very selfish--these friends and acquaintences, that I have mentioned. I have a script, one that I could send to them. The matriarch of that family is very close to someone, who, if you knew who they are, it would blow your mind...but they aren't offering, and I am not asking, based upon what I have witnessed my brother go through with them--and he has some level of fame. I mentioned in a past post, that this business can be cruel and heartbreaking. My brother should be a multi-millionaire right now--but this business has its conspiracies, and two sets of books, and they will dare you to sue them for money that they steal from you---and sometimes, you may find yourself getting very serious death threats that groups like the FBI are informed about, but don't care to do anything the mafia helps the U.S. government to make trillions of dollars each year--hence, they don't give a damn! BTW...the writer of "Flashdance" and "Basic Instinct", he complained openly, I think to The LA Times, that Michael Ovitz... threatened to have his his "foot soldiers come gunning for him up Sunset"...something that was picked-up by all the media about 16 years ago (?)--well, Ovitz admitted to it, but said that he was just joking. Trust me, these people don't joke.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 8:46 p.m. CST

    MM you need to realize that pictures you see in People Magazine

    by Xiphos_2

    Aren't your family right? Nor are they your friends. They don't know you, they have never met you and a restraining order doesn't equal love. Thorozine, its your best bet crazy. It might be your only one.

  • Sept. 26, 2009, 10:06 p.m. CST

    Okay...I'll Just Say This, And I Will Never Mention It...

    by Media Messiah

    ...again. Look-up the Bohemian Club on your search engines. Now, you may ask how I know about it? You'll just have to fill-in the blanks for yourselves. BTW, it too, is real. Call me crazy all you want, or assume that I am pulling your collective legs, you guys aren't mature enough for me to share any information of import, beyond what I have already spoken about. Bye for now--close of subject.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 12:10 a.m. CST

    After Epitaph 1 this was a major snoozefest

    by McKrakalaka

    I have to agree with many above posters that this is quite possibly the WORST way to start a season - If they are trying to gather any new viewers, they totally missed the boat. After being mostly disappointed with season 1, especially in the over the top 1.12, I broke down and watched the unaired 1.13 - wow - amazing! I totally thought that they were going to switch things up with this season and start right off in 2019 - instead we are back to snoozeville - and while I was engaged when in the dollhouse itself and enjoyed the Topher scenes, and the development of whiskey, whenever we switch to Dushku in whatever Charlie's angel persona she is in this week, I find myself totally unengaged - the deeper, darker, and more brilliant aspects that touch on immortality and the human condition get sacrificed for ridiculously poorly written "mystery/action" scenes that have been done to death - the worst part about season one is that you could almost ALWAYS predict exactly what was going to happen, and again tonight, I said to my wife, "Echo better not grab a letter opener and try to open a drawer!" It seems like they either don't care about echo in character scenes, and just do that to make Dushku dress in scantily clad outfits, or they purposely use overused visual tropes and detective scenario's for some kind of writer's table laugh on the audience? I was hoping for more sci-fi and less nancy drew/Matlock/Macguyver scenarios. I think that was it for me.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 1:32 a.m. CST

    @Media Messiah : Bohemian Grove

    by V'Shael

    Is a COMPLETE non sequiter to what you were actually asked about. Also, Bohemian Grove, and their ceremony of care, is little more than a summer camp for rich fucks. Non members have made it in to the grove while it was in session. Are you sure you didn't mean the Bilderberg Group? No one gets in there uninvited and its a much more serious affair.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 1:42 a.m. CST

    "The Cremation Of Caring", You Mean

    by Media Messiah

    Other than correcting the name of the ceremony, I have nothing else to say about it. Perhaps that was a test by you? End of conversation about this, permanently! Have a nice night.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 6:37 a.m. CST

    @Media Messiah

    by V'Shael

    Good grief, whether it's caring or care is irrelevant. <p> You were asked "Who are these friends of yours? Have we heard of any of them?" and you responded with some story about the Bohemian Grove, and then implied that knowing about the Grove was somehow indicative: "you may ask how I know about it?" <p> My point is, it's not a secret. It's common information. You can see the grove on Google Earth for fucks sake. And as I said, security at the grove is not even particularly tight. (Or at least it wasn't a few years ago when Jon Ronson just walked in.) <p>So how do you know about it? You have access to a web browser. D'uh!

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 9:49 a.m. CST


    by buffywrestling

    Did you watch Vows or did you give up on it? What did you think?

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 11:35 a.m. CST

    MM Just when I think you can't be more crazy

    by Xiphos_2

    You throw out Bohemian Grove as some sort of trump card?. Why not the council on foreign relations or The Trilateral Commision, the Freemasons or the friggin Illuminati for christs sake! Or what ever wet dream turns the crank of conspiratards or crazy nutbags like yourself. Thorozine NOW.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 1:21 p.m. CST

    @Buffywrestling : Vows

    by V'Shael

    I liked it. I think they're really beginning to make the themes of the show more visible and more mainstream (in terms of what is identity). I think some of the dialog was a bit too on the nose, such as the Alzheimers reference, but perhaps it needed to be that blatant. <p> I think some people will never *get* the show, because they think it should be something else, and it never will be. They'll go away unsatisfied. Which is a shame. Because this level of philosophy in what is essentially a sci fi show, is usually only found in the pulp novels of the 60's, by Philip Dick or some other counter-culture type like Vonnegut. <p> If they can stay on the air, I think this show will become something very special. On the other hand, if studio interference makes them change it to some Alias clone or Joe90 remake, then it will sink like the proverbial lead balloon.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 1:39 p.m. CST

    @Xiphos_2: conspiritards

    by V'Shael

    Xiphos, we've all had to upwardly adjust our estimates of the crazy. As you could probably guess, obsession with clandestine groups is another well known symptom. <p> He tried to bring up the Carlyle Group in a previous talkback, again making the assumption that no one knew this *shocking* information. <p> You can't explain anything to these people. Yes, mega-rich people are often amoral bastards who are out for themselves, and wield enormous power over elected officials. D'uh! But obsessing about their *evil* plans? That's like going to Rome for a holiday and being concerned that the mafia are going to whack you.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 1:53 p.m. CST

    Believe What You Will

    by Media Messiah

    If you believe I'm crazy, that's just fine; it is best that you do. Anyway, this show is cancelled.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 2:12 p.m. CST

    V'Shael: I Have Told You, And Others About...

    by Media Messiah

    ...David Bowie...openly, and I have told you about The New Kids, and "Entourage"--also, openly. Bowie BTW is a billionaire, and the richest rock star in the world--no one equals him--still you all doubt me--as a collective, so why would I name anyone else...when I will be met with the same response? Each time I tell you a truth, I am assailed? It's "Groundhog Day", so why repeat the process??? You guys can't take me seriously, and I understand that impulse, as you don't know me--but that creates a situation where I can't take you seriously, as every response to my good faith writings, by you and others, has been an open mean-spirited personal attack on my good character. Thusly, you don't deserve any further information from me, as you have not earned it, hence, you will not get anymore affirmations. Go ahead, keep living your lives thinking that famous, powerful, and rich people only exist on television...or as reported on in magazines and newspapers. They are real people, with real lives...and they just happened to get lucky, or have been ruthless, and or, greedy enough, to get to the top of their fields. Big deal really, everybody dies...and so-called fame, power, and wealth...can't save you from that--just look at Michael Jackson; all that pain and effort, all for nothing???

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 2:43 p.m. CST

    @MM: you have NO credibility

    by V'Shael

    When you claim I work for FOX and you will get me fired... And when called on your bull shit you try to claim it was a Psy-op. You nut.

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 4:12 p.m. CST

    Good idea MM pull an Eric Cartman

    by Xiphos_2

    take your ball and go the asylum, where you can get some much needed help crazy.<p>

  • Sept. 27, 2009, 5:28 p.m. CST

    You Trio Of Fruitloops Can Have This Talkback

    by Media Messiah

    It is about to be cancelled along with this show!!! Enjoy what's left of it.

  • Sept. 28, 2009, 1:14 a.m. CST

    once again like a vampire he retreats

    by V'Shael

    from the harsh light of sanity and facts, but we know he'll return anon.

  • Sept. 28, 2009, 2:17 p.m. CST


    by boosebaster

    About my drunken antics t'other night, what the fuck! I didn't even remember posting.

  • Sept. 28, 2009, 8:50 p.m. CST

    Boosebaster: You Have Nothing To Be Sorry About

    by Media Messiah

    You were drinking...but I was under the influence of something else--having a broken heart. Everything I wrote was accurate, "Dollhouse" could be so much more streamlined in its execution and story arc--that said, I was also being mean, on this, and another Talkback, toward the folks at Mutant Enemy. I guess it was displaced sadness, over missing my girl? I sincerely apologize. Sadness can be infinite.