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Updated! Seriously, who thinks AN AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN LONDON remake is a good idea?

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here again. I had a source give me a few more details on the below information and it might not be as bad as we think. The source says that there might not be any interest in doing a remake because of a rights issue, something about Universal's ownership of DVD, TV and online rights. What this source hears is Dimension is talking about franchising it. My guess is it wouldn't be a direct sequel like AN AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN PARIS, but rather keeping the werewolves and horror/comedy tone, but moving it around the world. All this is very fluid at the moment, nobody really 100% locked in for any one direction. I like the franchise idea a lot more than a direct remake, personally. Leave well enough alone... but still come play in the same sandbox. Why not? I also received an email from a CG artist offended at what he views are attacks at his profession by little ol' me. I know I've been beating the practical effects drum loudly over the last couple weeks, but I do have a lot of respect for the talent and work ethic of the skilled computer graphic artists slaving away for our entertainment. My personal issue with a remake of AN AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN LONDON is that it's such a practical effects-driven film that that aspect has now become part of the identity of the film. The Oscars essentially invented a category to give Rick Baker a statue for his groundbreaking work on this movie and that gave birth to the make-up Oscar. When CGI reaches its greatest heights it's always (and I underline always) when there's a huge enough budget to support it. Benjamin Button, Kong, Jurassic Park, LOTR, that awesome CGI baby in CHILDREN OF MEN, Iron Man, etc. Unless Dimension was thinking of giving this reported remake an $80 million budget I was always going to be nervous about CGI werewolves. Can someone mention one film where a CG werewolf or werewolf transformation looked anything less than rubbery and ridiculous? I think history is on my side on that one. That doesn't mean that CGI won't make it one day, but right now I have every reason in the world to be skeptical. Add that on top of my own personal preference for practical work over digital and you hopefully get where I'm coming from. I don't want to beat up on the computer wizards who pour their hearts and souls into their work for us. Much like there have been Pixar movies that have surpassed some Disney classics, there have been CGI effects that have outdone anything done by hand. I love and admire great computer effects, but there's something to the old fashioned way of things that speaks to me. Call it nostalgia if you want, but I prefer hand painted mattes to digital mattes, I prefer 35 or 70mm to digital film and I prefer Rick Baker's werewolf work to anything that has ever been done with the creature via CG effects. Those are my tastes. Wow, I better get this soap box out of here. That became a little speech. I should have prepared it better and delivered in a crowded auditorium to roaring applause from the newly impassioned crowd. That's the update as far as I know. If I come across any other tidbits as the project develops I'll make sure to pass them along. Here's the original story below:

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here. Okay, this isn't a done deal, but Bloody-Disgusting has a tipster that tells them Dimension has picked up the remake rights to AN AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN LONDON. I guess John Landis needed the money... But this seems like an enormously huge mistake. I have no interest in seeing a CGI-filled remake of AWIL, which still holds up. With certain films there's an argument that can be made about a new generation not being able to get past a film made in a certain era, like DAWN OF THE DEAD. I don't subscribe to that argument, but I understand it. American Werewolf is just as good today as it was back then, in my opinion. Horror comedy is so delicate that I have trouble believing a new filmmaker, no matter how talented, can catch the same lightning in a bottle that Landis did in the original. This just reeks of a bad idea to me. We'll see if it pans out (BD is usually pretty good on their rumors) and if it actually makes it into production if Dimension does indeed have the remake rights. What do you folks think? -Quint Follow Me On Twitter

Readers Talkback
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  • June 28, 2009, 10:02 p.m. CST

    american werewolf in paris...

    by landosystem

    wasn't that a bad attempt at a remake, and wasn't that enough?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:04 p.m. CST

    This is going to suck high0hell.

    by jae683

    But it is Hollywood.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:05 p.m. CST

    Robocop remake is too far...

    by pencil-man

    ..that's when the dam broke for me. If you think this trend has "officially" gone too far, wait until the remake rights for Star Wars and Godfather get sold. I could give a doodle, personally, about remakes anyway. The originals will always be there to laugh in the face of talentless hacks.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:06 p.m. CST


    by HorrorFan81


  • June 28, 2009, 10:08 p.m. CST

    Why don't they remake films that were BAD the first time?

    by Regicidal_Maniac

    Like Transformers 2? How long til that piece of shit is remade?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:09 p.m. CST

    wow. sucks. pissed about this.

    by future help

    what a great movie experience when i was 13.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:10 p.m. CST

    See You Next Wednesday...

    by Zeegloo

  • June 28, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    Wasn't An American Werewolf in Paris a remake?

    by JuanSanchez

    Tom Everett Scott, Julie Delpy, crappy CG werewolves?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    Billy Mays is dead you heartless bastards...

    by Banzai Rootskibango

    ...a talkback dedicated to a pedophile but none for the man who changed television infomercials as we know them? <P> Shame.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    they wpuld be better off doing a 50 years.

    by future help

    i would feel better. (like the Alien prequel or Thing prequel ...those 2 have a smudge of a chance at least...) Still...this remake shit is so disrespectful and greedy.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    Beware the Moon...

    by BoggyCreekBeast

    because this remake idea BITES!

  • June 28, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    because CG werewolves are convincing as hell!

    by dopepope

    There's nothing like taking a movie that pioneered a movement in SFX history and redoing it with CG mediocrity. Gonna fill the seats for sure.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Remake Wolfen or The Howling or something

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    Both of those films could/should have been better.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:15 p.m. CST

    Movie scared the shit out of me as a little kid.

    by CreasyBear

    When the Nazi pig soldiers surprise the family's mundane evening at home? My big brother had to deal with me pulling my sleeping bag next to his bed for awhile after that. And the pacing of the Moors scene was flawless.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:17 p.m. CST

    Psyched by the 4D Witch

    by animas

    would be a good remake

  • June 28, 2009, 10:22 p.m. CST

    Griffin Dunne and Jenny Agutter

    by ThrowMeTheIdol

    They saved that movie. It was one of those so-so ideas that only worked out great because of chemistry among the actors, there's no way to repeat that.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:23 p.m. CST

    I'm with you on this one, Quint.

    by LoneGun

    This remake is not a good idea. I'd prefer to see an original werewolf film. It's been a while since there was a good one.<p>And THE HOWLING was just fine the way it was, thank you.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:27 p.m. CST

    Hey Hollywood...

    by HotShott

    get a life and an original idea please. kthx.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:28 p.m. CST

    Billy Mays RIP

    by JoeSixPack

    Needs a page at least on Coax

  • June 28, 2009, 10:29 p.m. CST

    Seriously? No more ideas out there?

    by marcspector

    Who the f*ck are these people in the movie business who have no ideas for movies??? GET ANOTHER JOB. Go to school for accounting or something. This is not for you.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:30 p.m. CST

    No worse than Nightmare or Halloween

    by ThePilgrim

    Jaws would be a shock, E.T. would be a shock, Star Wars and Indiana Jones would be shock/too far moments. <P> The sequel to this sucked, so will the remake. <P> Ok so who's the one. Will Ferell, Will Smith, Seth Rogan, Paul Rudd. jona hill Michael Cera, fuck it Put them all in, and salt some John C. Riley as the wolf form of whoever's bit. <P> Who will replace Frank Oz's role? There be no muppet masters here... <P>You could have prevented this with the power of that MS Amulet Quint. You could stopped this.. Don't look at it Marion! Whatever you do, don't open your eyes!

  • June 28, 2009, 10:32 p.m. CST

    Who are the ad wizards...

    by wampa 1

    ...that came up with this one?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:33 p.m. CST

    The whole cast should be big fat hairy cross dressers

    by Barmat

    And speak in German with no translations or subtitles.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:34 p.m. CST

    looking at the evony tits don't care for article.

    by Warcraft


  • June 28, 2009, 10:35 p.m. CST

    There's always been remakes, there's no "craze".

    by Flim Springfield

  • June 28, 2009, 10:38 p.m. CST


    by theDORK

    It was that idiot George Lucas' fault, starting with his idiotic prequels obsession. Which leads me to the following brilliant idea: a REMAKE of The Phantom Menace! This time, who would play Jar Jar or Boss Nass? And who would be the annoying 8 year old little boy who says, "Yippee! I'm gonna be a Jedi!"?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:41 p.m. CST


    by ericthebeef


  • June 28, 2009, 10:42 p.m. CST

    While we are on horror, I saw Drag Me to Hell today

    by IndustryKiller!

    And man that just could not be more overhyped in within the geek community. A huge disappointment. If you think Raimi wasn't constantly pulling punches for the PG-13 rating you are nuts. And why all the terrible CG effects? And for a race against time film there is almost ZERO sense of urgency coming from the protagonist. Just dulla ll the way around. Justin Long was easily the best part of the film and as the only character that registers as a real human being it almost makes me want to see a sequel with him leading.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:43 p.m. CST

    I wrote a great script for a werewolf flick

    by Retlaw Kciuq

    Unfortunately my family won't help me with private loans to go to school to hone my craft and I have no idea how to go about selling the idea. Anyone have any suggestions? In all seriousness, I believe I have THE best thing to come about in horror in sometime. If you like THE FLY, AMERICAN WEREWOLF/LONDON, and DRAG ME TO HELL, you'll like my stuff and I say that with James Cameron confidence.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:46 p.m. CST

    Can I have a piece of toast?

    by zacdilone

  • June 28, 2009, 10:47 p.m. CST

    HAHAHA..Now it has gone too Far?

    by Nuking the Fridge

    How about back in 1998 when they released a "shot for shot" remake of Psycho?

  • June 28, 2009, 10:51 p.m. CST

    IndustryKiller! what?

    by darwinmayflower

    I heartily disagree with you... Drag Me To Hell was fucking awesome! don't you like fun movies? the hype is real. watch it again.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:51 p.m. CST

    These were good remakes....

    by Nuking the Fridge

    NEW ONE ARMED SWORDMAN The FLY CAPE FEAR The DEPARTED BATMAN BEGINS THE INCREDIBLE HULK there may be others but I can't think right now, I need a smoke and veg out on a movie..

  • June 28, 2009, 10:52 p.m. CST

    I'd venture that is hasn't gone far enough...

    by Amy Chasing

    Whoever said that they will remake Star Wars, and The Godfather, and any other film you can think of is probably right. To me remaking classic Danny Kaye films is pointless, but going too far?... Why should I expect any less from Hollywood. It's not going to far, it's exactly in line with their nature.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:53 p.m. CST

    Heyyy why not!

    by drdoom_v

    They miss the point of all these remakes-- so another remake will be as shitty as the rest of them. I won't see it--- and all the retards will talk about how original it is! Hey!!! Maybe there can be a werewolf family! Yeah and the Vampire family from Twilight can make a cameo!! Yjen there can be an epic battle!!yeah! thats it!!!! And we will throw in some hip pop culture refrences! The "kids" sure love that! (They are a bunch of retards anyway!) Record opening at the box office baby! Start lining up now kids!!!

  • June 28, 2009, 10:55 p.m. CST

    Remakes of good movies that are readily

    by CherryValance

    available on DVD make no sense to me. But they keep doing it so I don't see why this should be any different.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:57 p.m. CST


    by jimmy_009

    American Werewolf is the definitive argument against CG horror effects, so what better film to redo with shitty CG werewolves than that? There have NEVER been effective CG werewolves. They ALWAYS look ridiculous whereas the practical effects in American Werewolf remain terrifying and squirm inducing to this day.

  • June 28, 2009, 10:59 p.m. CST

    This has got to be the worst idea...

    by elwood_p_dud

    since the casting of the The Queef as Indiana Jones son in a spectacularly shitty movie. The Queef in IJIV has to be one of the top 5 worst ideas in the last half-century.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:02 p.m. CST

    Sequel was a turd . . .

    by aboriginal

    in the same way Ghostbusters II was a poopfest. No doubt this will teenageafied and tuned for that audience. Leave it alone.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:03 p.m. CST


    by Mullah Omar

    AMERICAN WEREWOLF is pretty cool. I think it sort of peters out at the end, though. Up until then, I really like how quirky it is. <br> <br> What I don't get is why anyone would feel the need to remake AMERICAN WEREWOLF. Is the name recognition really that good? Why is a remake a better idea rather than simply taking a classic horror icon and putting him in a brand new situation? It should be even cheaper than a remake, and I don't see why not having the AMERICAN WEREWOLF in the title affects the box office. Anybody who wants to see a werewolf film is going to see it whether you call it AMERICAN WEREWOLF or whether you call it something like HAIRY KNUCKLES.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:07 p.m. CST

    Well, actually

    by Jawa 007

    it's just as ridiculous as doing a Dawn of the Dead remake. But since Transformers 2 made 400 million dollars worldwide nothing matters anymore. Everything is wrong and satan wins. I'm going back to reading books. At least THE STRAIN is enjoyable.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:07 p.m. CST

    this one is a good idea

    by britney spears rusted clit ring

    NOT. YOU DIRTY MOTHERFUCKERS. Stop already. This movie had such its own atmosphere that any attempt will just be silly. Make a terrible sequel...douche bag whores. Im so sick of it...

  • June 28, 2009, 11:07 p.m. CST


    by britney spears rusted clit ring

    I feel better now

  • June 28, 2009, 11:13 p.m. CST

    Hollywood should remake movies that haven't been made yet.......

    by crackerfarmboy

    Now there's an idea!!!

  • June 28, 2009, 11:16 p.m. CST

    Red Dawn

    by ZooTrain

    There's a movie that does not need a remake. What's next? Wargames? Project X? Iron Eagle?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:16 p.m. CST

    John Landis needs the money all right...

    by TurdontheRun

    With Wacko Jacko dead and buried, Landis won't be getting any of those Thriller royalties he was owed. Coincidence? I think not!<p>Remaking American Werewolf is a terrible, terrible idea, along with re-makes of Nightmare on Elm St., Poltergeist, and the innumerable other re-makes of classic horror movies(not to mention other genres)that we've heard of. Remember those shitty CGI wolfs in that appaling Werewolf in Paris sequel? Who the fuck is greenlighting all this shite? Hollywood is cannibalising itself, and it's embarassing to watch.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:18 p.m. CST

    What if they released a remake, and nobody came to watch it?...

    by Amy Chasing

    War. huh. yeah. What is it good for?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:19 p.m. CST

    That movie is still fucking scary

    by Turd Furgeson

    What a bad idea, seriously. That movie still creeps me out. The best looking warewolf ever!

  • June 28, 2009, 11:19 p.m. CST


    by proper

    this film was on TV last week,watched it all,theres no need...................

  • June 28, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST

    I meant Werewolf

    by Turd Furgeson

    I is edumacated....

  • June 28, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST

    Zac Efron vehicle

    by Melvin_Pelvis

    or some other metro sexual for the no body hair generation

  • June 28, 2009, 11:20 p.m. CST


    by Mike_D

    I can't stress this enough

  • June 28, 2009, 11:21 p.m. CST

    Turd Furgeson

    by britney spears rusted clit ring

    Are you a stupid friend?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:23 p.m. CST

    It was inevitable.

    by Hint_of_Smegma

    And inevitably, like all the recent classic horror remakes, Friday 13th, Halloween, upcoming Nightmare on Elm Street (come on, who really thinks THAT will be any good?) it will be utterly worthless. The original is a classic. A fucking CLASSIC. Leave it the fuck alone.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:25 p.m. CST

    Why, why, why, why, why?

    by D.Vader

    Because An American Werewolf in Paris did so fucking well?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:27 p.m. CST

    Just make a NEW WEREWOLF movie for FUCK'S sake

    by D.Vader

    Hire someone creative, you braindead Hollywood assholes, to write you a good script. <p> Didn't the Underworld flicks make money? Didn't Twilight make a shitload of money? I'm not advocating for films of their quality, merely pointing out two films about classic monsters that made money without needing to be a remake (ignoring the fact that Twilight was a book series, of course). <p> If you producers had ONE iota of intelligence, you'd come up with your own story instead of piggybacking on someone else's genius. <p> Just give me a damn call. I'll help.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:27 p.m. CST

    Only one horror movie left to remake

    by Dapper Swindler

    And it's the only one that ought to be remade....KILLER KLOWNS FROM OUTER SPACE!

  • June 28, 2009, 11:30 p.m. CST

    Yeah great,so which black rap artist can star in it?

    by brock landers baby

  • June 28, 2009, 11:31 p.m. CST

    Wolfman is coming out soon, isn't it?

    by Larry Sellers

    With Benicio? That sounds alright. But I'll always support the idea of rereleases to cash in on classics instead of walking all over what was already a good film. People just seem to be only turned on by new things. A lack of respect and consideration is all that it boils down to. If people stopped buying this remake crap they'll stop selling.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:31 p.m. CST


    by CherryValance

    they can't remake Killer Klowns From Outer Space. You blasheme! *kicks Dapper in his swindler*

  • June 28, 2009, 11:32 p.m. CST


    by CherryValance

    but you already knew that *sigh*

  • June 28, 2009, 11:32 p.m. CST

    I just

    by Cujo_Fugate

    remade a burrito I had for dinner into a turd.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:33 p.m. CST

    Here's an idea folks- DON'T see these shitty remakes

    by D.Vader

    I still haven't seen Halloween or Friday the 13th because I have no fucking interest in shitty remake cash-grabs. I might borrow my friend's DVD one day of F13 because curiosity will get the best of me, but the fact that none of my money will go to support these asshole producers is the real selling point.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:33 p.m. CST

    You know it to be true

    by Dapper Swindler

    God created the very concept of remakes so that Killer Klowns could be remade. That and nothing else. And God gave Rob Zombie a gig as a director so he could direct it - and nothing else.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:34 p.m. CST

    Mike_D, your "NO CGI" comments sound supportive

    by D.Vader

    Of the project in general. I pray that's not the case.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:34 p.m. CST


    by Mullah Omar

    But a sequel, not a remake. <br> <br> The original team made the first film with a Z-level budget and it still looked pretty damned good. They could probably make a worthy sequel just using change they scrounged from producers' couch cushions. <br> <br> If Hollywood insists on digging up every long-dormant franchise, my vote is to get the KILLER KLOWNS back onscreen sooner rather than later.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:35 p.m. CST

    Actually there was no reason to remake DAWN OF THE DEAD

    by Continentalop

    The only elements Zack Snyder kept from the original was the idea of a mall and the idea that dead people have risen and are eating people, and must be shot in the head. None of Romero's social commentary or any of the plot was used. Hell, even the zombies were different. <p> If you liked the ned DOTD, fine, I got no problem with it. But I can see no reason why it had the same title as the original save for a crude attempt to cash in on its cult fame. Zack Snyder's DOTD has nothing to do with Romero's and should of had its own unique title.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:37 p.m. CST

    An American Werewolf is PERFECT!

    by fassbinder79


  • June 28, 2009, 11:39 p.m. CST


    by fassbinder79

    Snyder should never have remade Dawn Of Dead. Another masterpiece. And taking all the social commentary out of it was a BIG FUCKING MISTAKE.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:39 p.m. CST


    by Continentalop

    Saw it on video when I was a kid, fell asleep during it. Any werewolf movie that puts me asleep is prime for a remake.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:40 p.m. CST

    Remake "He's just not that in to you"

    by Falafalguy

  • June 28, 2009, 11:40 p.m. CST

    Remake "He's just not that in to you"

    by Falafalguy

  • June 28, 2009, 11:41 p.m. CST

    DAPPER SWINDLER - You're sick, man.

    by Hint_of_Smegma

    Killer Klowns cannot possibly be topped by any remake, it is a gem. Don't put daft ideas in their tiny mminds for fucks sake. Can you really imagine some douchebag rap group, or Miley Cyrus or some other non-entity being brought in to redo the Dickies theme song? HERESY!!

  • June 28, 2009, 11:43 p.m. CST


    by Continentalop

    I agree. I am not a fan of the remake, but I can understand if Snyder wanted to make his zombie movie he should of just made one without cribbing the DAWN OF THE DEAD name. You put a unique title on your film, and then the damn thing really stands on its own. In fact, DOTD fans like us wouldn't even complain because it doesn't taint the name of a film we love.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:44 p.m. CST


    by Continentalop

    That could probably be remade.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:44 p.m. CST


    by thesinofthesky

    They've finally pushed me over the edge. I'm off to Hollywood. *Grabs rifle, beef jerky, ammo, and pics of hollywood execs* See you on the news.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:45 p.m. CST

    Do you guys think DoD was Snyder's idea?

    by D.Vader

    Wasn't it more like this project? Some studio/producer wanted to remake Dawn of the Dead, hired James Gunn to write it and brought Snyder on board to direct?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:46 p.m. CST

    CONTINENTALOP - Wrong on every level.

    by Hint_of_Smegma

    Snyder gave us a great zombie flick, and purposefully removed those other elements of Romero's classic so it could be judged on its own merit, even if it retained the name.....if he'd tried to top Romero with social commentary, he'd have failed and people would have hated him for it. He took the name but went his own way, and gave us a rollicking good ride. The success of the movie backs that up. Dawn of the Dead 2004 was a classic in it's own right - certainly better than a good 98% of the horror movies made since the turn of the millenium. Brainless, yes. But a lot of fun.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:46 p.m. CST

    No young Jenny Aggutter?

    by The Dark Shite

    Fuck that.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:47 p.m. CST

    Remake The Exorcist with Abigal Breslin

    by Spocko

    and some rapper as the priest. Its just as good as a idea as this shit.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:48 p.m. CST

    You mean the Blaxorcist?

    by D.Vader

  • June 28, 2009, 11:49 p.m. CST

    Great Werewolf Book - should be a movie

    by ElvisPresLeeHorsleyHarveyOswaldOprahWinFreeJackHorkheimer

    S.P. Somtow's - MOONDANCE (Migrating European werewolves clash with Native-American werewolves in the old west.)<br /> It's epic, brilliant, bloody and fucked-up beyond all belief.<br />

  • June 28, 2009, 11:50 p.m. CST

    Moondance sounds fucking awesome!

    by The Dark Shite

    I've gotta check that out!

  • June 28, 2009, 11:50 p.m. CST

    Hint, I have no problem with the movie.

    by Continentalop

    I didn't like it, but I can understand other people did. My only problem was him CRIBBING the title of Dawn of the Dead. Like you said, he wanted it to be judge on its own merits - well, give it an original title then. <p> Like I said, original title means we wouldn't even be having this discussion and the movie itself would be judged by itself instead of being compared to the original.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:51 p.m. CST

    Not another remake....

    by conspiracy

    With the exception of perhaps Pixar...Hollywood is all but dead; a faded, bloated, narcissistic shadow of an industry trading in past glories.</p><p>I used to laugh at the whole.."Avatar will fuck your eyeballs" hyperbole...but now I swear to god I hope it does...SOMEONE needs to inject some life and creativity into this bankrupt town.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:53 p.m. CST

    And you are probably right D. Vader

    by Continentalop

    The name Dawn of the Dead probably wasn't Snyder's idea but some studio executives. He was just a director for hire at that time.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:53 p.m. CST

    Remake Citizen Kane with puff diddy

    by Spocko

    set in Miami and work in a subplot involving vampires. Why not?

  • June 28, 2009, 11:55 p.m. CST

    Except, ContinentalOp...

    by D.Vader

    Everyone would call it a ripoff of Romero's Dawn of the Dead because it is set in a mall. Really, using the same title as the original may have been the safest thing he could have done. <p> However, I very much doubt that's the same case here, that its why the producers are remaking AAWiL. I do not think they have an idea for a werewolf that travels to London, and in order for it to not be called a ripoff, they'll just call it a remake.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:55 p.m. CST

    What's really stupid

    by Zaphod67

    is that most people won't even be aware that it's a remake. I work in a video store & I can't tell you how many kids think Prom Night, Hills Have Eyes, When a Stranger Calls and even Texas Chainsaw Massacre are all original movies. Fuck, I have kids coming in who don't know that there were 10 Star Trek movies preceding this one. When kids come in looking for a horror movie recommendation I often direct them to American Werewolf in London (depending on age)where they as often as not whine that they've never heard of it. Maybe this is what Hollywood Execs are counting on and they crank out shitty remake after shitty remake.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:56 p.m. CST

    CONTINENTALOP - pretty sure the title was a done deal

    by Hint_of_Smegma

    ..before he came on board. Remember, Dawn was his first big deal directing job, I may be wrong but I seem to recall it wasn't his idea, he was brought on to direct and the idea of remaking Dawn was already set in stone. He just set out to make sure it was a good movie, and succeeded. I have to say, he may have people who are disappointed with Watchmen, who don't like Dawn or 300 - but I have to say from my point of view the guys got chops, he's certainly got vision and passion, so I'm happy to hear he's attached to ANY project at the moment. I've loved everything he's thrown at the screen so far. He's got the potential to be a great director as the years go on. Beyond that, I wouldn't hold the fact Dawn got remade against him - if it hadn't been done by him, it would probably have been a pretty awful film. Be thankful at least he did his best to make the fans happy rather than the suits.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:58 p.m. CST


    by kingoflight

    Just remake the godfather and starwars already. Fuck it redo the matrix and lord of the rings

  • June 28, 2009, 11:58 p.m. CST

    How bout An English Werewolf in Toledo?

    by Spocko

    this is probably the course its gonna take anyway.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:58 p.m. CST

    How's that for obvious....

    by D.Vader

    "Really, using the same title as the original may have been the safest thing he could have done." <p> Isn't that the whole point of remakes anyway? What I meant, was this: in the argument for and against remakes, there is usually the opinion that they should just retitle the remake. What I meant was that retitling it would draw even more criticisms because it would be deemed a ripoff. <p> I guess the best thing to do would be to tell everyone its a remake, but change the title in some small way. Something stupid like "Dawn of the Dead: Requiem". <p> In fact, just add Requiem to the end of this remake's title. Problem solved.

  • June 28, 2009, 11:59 p.m. CST

    In defense of Hollywood

    by Continentalop

    I hate the majority of movies nowadays, but I understand why they make the ones they do. Bad economy means no one wants to take a risk, and pretty much all the films they make nowadays has some sort of sellable angle which gives them a little bit of security. <p> I mean, imagine how hard it would be to raise money for a Werewolf movie nowadays. No investors getting to feel comfortable in putting money into that. But you tell him you are remaking AMERICAN WEREWOLF IN LONDON, and point out how the original was a hit and still a popular film, then maybe somebody will feel like it is a good investment. <P> Biggest victim of this recession - us movie goers. We'll be stuck with nothing but remakes, family movies and adaptations of books, comics and toys for awhile.

  • June 29, 2009, midnight CST

    I think its a horrible idea.

    by mitortilla

    So I won't watch it. Unlike all of you who will, and then cry cry cry and then scream scream scream and not exercise your power as consumers.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:01 a.m. CST

    Yes, Snyder was just a director for hire on DoD

    by D.Vader

    He was just a commercial director before that.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:04 a.m. CST

    The dude needed his break

    by mitortilla

    at least that remake gave us 300 and Watchmen, he may have still been giving tours of Universal Studios.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:04 a.m. CST


    by Spocko

    What you say is mostly true. But your making a target of yourself with that title. I will not indulge

  • June 29, 2009, 12:04 a.m. CST

    Remake this and it will flop just like Cursed.

    by hallmitchell

    Don't say i didn't warn you. How much horror comedy has worked. This movie will be crappy CGI. A few Paris Hilton jokes, whiny teens. What a mess!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:08 a.m. CST

    You are exactly right Continentalop

    by mitortilla

    and it happening with all sorts of companies and clients, even with advertising. You will see a big rise in less exciting/weird commercials and more testimonial type direct sell bullshit. I know it from experience.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:08 a.m. CST

    Is it Shakespeare? Can I leave my brain at the door?

    by Trannyformers_Apologist

    Well.. I hope if this movie gets made it is critic proof and breaks box office records.<P>

  • June 29, 2009, 12:08 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:10 a.m. CST

    But D. Vader, why not just say...

    by Continentalop

    ...your film was inspired by Dawn of the Dead and the mall was a homage? I think that would get you more milage than just doing a remake that divides fans. <p> In fact, they probably only kept the mall to keep it somewhat similar to Romero's. I bet they could of lost the mall and no one would of cared - they could have been held up in a school or an office building or a hospital or whatever. The mall didn't play a part like it did in the original.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:11 a.m. CST

    When is this cannibalism going to stop?

    by hallmitchell

    Movies will just end up like the music business.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:11 a.m. CST

    We need to take over HollyWood!!!!!

    by hopeless

    And stop all this remake bullshit...

  • June 29, 2009, 12:13 a.m. CST

    Why don't they just wait to see how the Wolfman goes?

    by hallmitchell

  • June 29, 2009, 12:14 a.m. CST

    Just pick another city.

    by CZ

    Why not make it a trilogy? An American Werewolf in Berlin, Cairo, Budepest, Pamplona, Glasgow! Why London again?!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:14 a.m. CST

    I wouldn't mind a remake of GI JOE: ROC though

    by Continentalop

  • June 29, 2009, 12:17 a.m. CST

    I think those are dangerous waters to test, Conti

    by D.Vader

    Very intriguing though. I don't know if I can say for sure which would be better. I honestly think more fans would consider Snyder's differently-titled zombie film a ripoff of Dawn of the Dead, even if he said it was an homage. That's just how fans work. We'd look into his intentions and think he was just placating us, telling us its an homage so we didn't hate him. There's a thin line between homage and ripoff, one QT dangerously skirted across with Reservoir Dogs, and he was just lucky no one knew of City on Fire. <p> As for "Why a mall?" Because malls are awesome. And you could survive for weeks in there, unlike a school or office building. That's easy. I'd waste all my time in the arcade. If this were the late 90's, I mean.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:22 a.m. CST

    Now "Burning Bright", that sounds promising

    by D.Vader

    And its an original idea in the sense that no one has done it before. Sure, its derivative of the "stalked by a monster" genre of horror like JAWS, and it sounds just like how Spielberg described the kitchen scene of Jurassic Park- that the kids being stalked by 2 raptors should be as dangerous and deadly as if they were stalked by 4 tigers. <p> So, if done right by someone would great vision, the story of a girl and her young brother stalked by a tiger after a hurricane has decimated the area could be great. I'm more interested in that kind of film that this kind of crappy remake. <p> Plus, I love the title's allusion.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:23 a.m. CST

    *with great vision

    by D.Vader

  • June 29, 2009, 12:25 a.m. CST

    William Blake fan, huh D. Vader.

    by Continentalop

  • June 29, 2009, 12:26 a.m. CST

    These soulless bastards must be stopped...

    by Sulla

    Seriously, what the fuck is going on here? These motherfuckers are raping films that are classics, films that should never be touched.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:26 a.m. CST

    You know what *was* a good remake though?

    by D.Vader

    1988's The Blob. That actually did scare me as a kid. Had some great gore effects from what I remember. The makers of that film took a completely ridiculous premise and made it extremely unsettling. I remember having nightmare of seeing half-digested people being painfully dissolved by the Blob. Plus, its got Johnny Drama in it and Shawnee Smith, who I've got a bit of a crush on.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:28 a.m. CST

    Werewolves on Wheels

    by Continentalop

    Now that is a werewolf movie that should be remade.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:28 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:29 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:29 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:29 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:30 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    ...absolutely nothing!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:30 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:30 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:31 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:31 a.m. CST

    Also, about the AWIL transformation

    by Sulla

    It's a beautifully painfull scene, bar none the best werewolf transformation ever shot on film, and to think that some jerk is going to stain that really pisses me off. Only thing that would remotely make me happy about this was if Rick Baker came back to do it. But, even that isn't necessary, just make an original werewolf movie you dolts! Stop fucking around with shit and actually WRITE something new.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:33 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:33 a.m. CST

    Always liked that poem, Conti

    by D.Vader

  • June 29, 2009, 12:33 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    If memory serves correctly,<P>TheHOWLING was the"pioneer"!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:33 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:34 a.m. CST

    I think because of Batman the Animated Series

    by D.Vader

    I distinctly remember an episode of that series in which Batman narrated Blake's poem toward the end. There was some sort of genetically created tiger-like creature in the Frankenstein vein I think.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:34 a.m. CST

    Coming soon to a theater near you: the remake of Drag Me to Hell

    by Yesspaz

    Seriously, it has to happen, right?

  • June 29, 2009, 12:34 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:34 a.m. CST


    by GeneralJackCosmo

    <p>NO</p> <p>If you MUST do anything with this movie, how about a sequel/follow-up that doesn't fucking suck. Get Pegg & Wright, so we can forget about the CGI shitfest that was Paris.</p>

  • June 29, 2009, 12:36 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    "The Howling was just fine the way it was".<P>I second that emotion. I have The Howling first, with AWIL a close second! IMO

  • June 29, 2009, 12:41 a.m. CST


    by simondark

    another stupid fucking idea..

  • June 29, 2009, 12:42 a.m. CST

    Rip offs have always done well D. Vader

    by Continentalop

    Fistful of Dollars ripping of Yojimbo, Friday the 13th ripping of Halloween; The Omen ripping off Rosemary's Baby; and CHAW ripping off Jaws. <p> I think for some reason audience members can handle people ripping off another filmmakers ideas as long as he doesn't try to usurp his place and makes the newer version different enough from the original. I mean, 28 Days Later is a big rip-off of a lot of Romero's ideas but Danny Boyle never had to face the scrutiny that Snyder did because he didn't call his film DAWN OF THE DEAD. <p> Final argument for ripping off - Brian De Palma. He has half-a-dozen movies that are rip offs of Hitchcock movies that can stand on their own. Ripping other people off - it is an American tradition.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:42 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    I'm with you on your post about not paying to see these "remakes".<P>I usually buy a ticket to a movie that deserves my money, and after, I'll check out the crap de rigueur!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:42 a.m. CST


    by Jokerisdaking

    You people, everyone of you bitch about remakes but then 9 out of 10 of you go to see them anyway. Yall dont have the right to complain anymore.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:42 a.m. CST

    I'm sure Harry and the AICN gang will eat it up

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Especially if it has blood and nudity in it.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:44 a.m. CST


    by disfigurehead

    My ass hurts from all of this raping of my childhood.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:45 a.m. CST

    wasn't this already a remake? (kind of)

    by nolan bautista

    Werewwolf of London?..doesnt anybody here read Famous Monsters..bunch of amateurs

  • June 29, 2009, 12:45 a.m. CST

    Get Landis to remake

    by Seph_J

    'The Twilight Zone'. And have a segment which includes the decapitation of an actor and two asian child extras at the blades of a helicopter. I think it's finally time that whole thing was addressed on film.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:47 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    JENNY AGUTTER!<p>Equus, Logans Run, AWIL! Nice!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:48 a.m. CST

    But we don't call some of those ripoffs

    by D.Vader

    Fistful was definitely a remake. The filmmakers just had the balls to change settings and titles. And they didn't remake it to make money, they remade it because it was a great story that would still work if ronin was now a cowyboy outlaw. <p> And The Omen just took the basic idea of Rosemary's Baby and went one step further with it. I wouldn't call that a ripoff either. <p> But I see your point. Back then, you could remake a film and you did so for different reasons. It wasn't brand recognition (as evidenced by the different titles), and that's all today's braindead producers are concerned with- the name, and that's it. That's why we hate hearing these stories, because we know the filmmakers don't give a shit about doing the story or its characters justice. Unless you're a Carpenter or a Jackson or a Cronenberg with a real love and respect for the original (and you're pretty damn creative to boot), we're not going to believe this bullshit.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:48 a.m. CST


    by BenBraddock

  • June 29, 2009, 12:48 a.m. CST

    nolan bautista

    by Continentalop

    American Werewolf in London was not a remake of Werewolf of London. The title was just a direct homage (but I suspect you already knew that and were only being facetious). <p> But for the record, the transformation scene in Werewolf of London (when he transforms while walking behind the pillars) is still my favorite.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:49 a.m. CST


    by supercowbell5THECOWBELLHASSPOKEN

  • June 29, 2009, 12:52 a.m. CST

    The only remakes that have ever gotten my money...

    by D.Vader

    Are King Kong and... and.... and that's it. No Halloween. No Friday the 13th. No Prom Night, Black Christmas, or The Hills Have Eyes. Everything else is for an "HBO On Demand" night.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:56 a.m. CST

    I agree with you D. Vader

    by Continentalop

    I for one love when filmmakers are INSPIRED by another film and want to make something like it. Carpenter was inspired by Rio Bravo so he made Assault on Precinct 13; Lucas and Spielberg were inspired by chapter serials so they made Indiana Jones; Paul Schrader was inspired by The Searchers so he made Taxi Driver, Hardcore and Rolling Thunder; and Tom Holland was inspired by Hammer vampire films so he made Fright Night. <p> Today though we don't get inspired, we get lazy fucks who just want to rip off (in a bad way) other peoples work and the good will their film generates. I understand why Hollywood makes remakes, in a financial/marketing sense, but as a fan of movies God I detest their cowardice.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:56 a.m. CST

    Yeah! Another Suck Ass horror film remake!!!

    by lockesbrokenleg


  • June 29, 2009, 12:56 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    Wasn't Shawnee Smith in one of the SAW movies?

  • June 29, 2009, 12:58 a.m. CST

    I saw My Bloody Valentine 3-D in a theatre

    by Continentalop

    But it was free so that doesn't count. <p> Other than that, I will only see a remake if I think it will be good and there hasn't been any film that fits that criteria for quite awhile.

  • June 29, 2009, 1 a.m. CST


    by SunTzu77


  • June 29, 2009, 1 a.m. CST

    Stop raping my childhood!!!!!!

    by hallowscorp

    Sure, why not water down everything good that was ever produced by anyone. How 'bout that. FUCK YOU!!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 1 a.m. CST

    From now on my remake watching is done on DVD

    by lockesbrokenleg

    or on On Demand. That way I can watch a scene or two of it and then determine if I want to waste a night watching the rest of it.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:01 a.m. CST

    Ditto Conti

    by D.Vader

    If someone I respected was behind this project, I might be slightly more interested. They'd have to do a lot to really get me onboard (some creative ideas, a complete change of location and story, thus negating the title...), but it might be possible for me to be supportive of this project. <p> But then, like you said above, those past "remakes" were all different films in their own rights. The producers of today's remakes are just looking for a quick buck, looking to hire some music video or commercial director who will be easy to boss around. Then they throw some DP on the project to give it a very slick sheen, toss in some Abercrombie models, and voila. Stupid teenager fodder. <p> I've been inspired by a lot of great films, and my little notebook of ideas has a few gems I'm sure would make a good film. But none of them are remakes. <p> Wait I take that back, only one of them is. But that film isn't a classic in any sense of the word.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:03 a.m. CST

    Yes Dr.Morbius

    by D.Vader

    Shawnee Smith was in the first 3 Saw films. <p> My Bloody Valentine- another remake I refused to see. If I had a free pass, though, I wouldn't *pass* it up (snicker). I don't enjoy crapping on films I haven't seen (though I do it a lot with remakes... a bit hypocritical, I know), so I'd watch it.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:04 a.m. CST

    Michael Bay to direct...

    by DrMorbius

    An American TransforWerewolf in London!

  • June 29, 2009, 1:10 a.m. CST

    Shawnee Smith was also on that horrible

    by Continentalop

    reality show "Scream Queens." <p> Remakes and reality shows - is this what American has to resort too?

  • June 29, 2009, 1:11 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    I saw My Bloody Valentine in 3-D the same way. Walking out of one auditorium and as I was passing the one with MBV there was a big box of 3-D glasses, grabbed a pair, went in and checked it out.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:12 a.m. CST

    Star Wars remake

    by dioxholster

    is too too far

  • June 29, 2009, 1:13 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    And BECKER!

  • June 29, 2009, 1:15 a.m. CST

    Careful diox...

    by DrMorbius

    IThey are thinking about a remake of STARGATE!

  • June 29, 2009, 1:18 a.m. CST

    They have already remade Stargate

    by lockesbrokenleg

    Into a couple billion Stargate episodes.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:25 a.m. CST


    by alice 13

    totally belongs to the original.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:35 a.m. CST

    Fuck that. Transformers 2 is begging to be remade instead

    by MediaGold

    Shot for shot remake with McG at the helm.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:37 a.m. CST


    by nolan bautista

    i agree about the transformation scene in the the pillars..i remember seeing that as a kid and thinking : Run! Run! ..before he reaches the last pillar!

  • June 29, 2009, 1:38 a.m. CST

    bad i dea,but i have to say it or no one else will...

    by red_eddie

    ....lie to me jerry!!LIE TO ME! CGI mothafucka CGIIII!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 1:40 a.m. CST


    by itsjust_notcool_anymore_baby

    I tolerated the fuckin crap remakes of halloween,DOTD, last house, f13,etc,etc, ET-FUCKING-CETERA. I'm done with the horror genre! They have the least amount of self respect out of any other game in the business. To the same people who sold the 'Halloween' series over to the 'Scream' series, to the same people who pathetically dressed Vince Vaughn as Norman Bates. FUCK.YOU.VISIONLESS.PRICKS.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:47 a.m. CST

    BTW if anyone thinks...

    by itsjust_notcool_anymore_baby

    the remake will have the slightest chance of being on par with the original. Think again. The original blended comedy w/ horror. I'd like to see a new screenplay even try.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:48 a.m. CST

    by FXArtist

    Horror films are a quick buck. Very few directors, and almost no producers, care about the genre. It's cheap investment with maximum return. Welcome to Hollywood. That's why the best horror films recently have come from overseas - Spain, France, England, Korea and Japan

  • June 29, 2009, 1:55 a.m. CST

    Whose head will Landis be cutting off in this one?

    by Watching_Teri_Hatcher_Take_A_Shit

    It has to be asked. Or will his non-involvement spare the cast?

  • June 29, 2009, 1:57 a.m. CST

    Here's a radical idea for you Hollywood...

    by 69DUDE

    .....why dont you think up an ORIGINAL werewolf movie instead you mindless pieces of fuck!!!!!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:08 a.m. CST

    I have a confession to make...

    by itsjust_notcool_anymore_baby

    On the moors, I was attacked by a lycanthrope, a werewolf. I was murdered, an unnatural death, and now I walk the earth in limbo until the remake curse is lifted.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:10 a.m. CST

    This won't happen.

    by Droogie Alex

    Isn't 'The Wolfman' remake, which deals with the same locale and basic story, getting ready to come out? No need for this one.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:11 a.m. CST

    remake Citizen Kane!

    by wash

    The original is in black and white and not even widescreen! That's dumb and boring. It needs curse words and tits and maybe some blood. Imax and 3d that bitch!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:25 a.m. CST

    Buying the title.

    by Fortunesfool

    Roger Corman was talking about this at the Edinburgh Film fest. He sold the title 'The fast and the furious' and made a nice bit of money on it. Even though it wasn't a remake of his film. Companies just want a title that is recognisable and has an inbuilt audience. <p>Everyone here pisses an moans about every remake that comes along but you all go and pay money to see them. Every ticket you buy is a vote for Hollywood to keep making them. Once the box-office dies, the remakes will die. Hollywood isn't making films to make you happy. They're making films for money. Movies are to Hollywood, what a cheeseburger is Mcdonalds.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:27 a.m. CST

    Tim Buton's Citizen Kane

    by lockesbrokenleg

    With Johnny Depp as Cane, and bouncy songs, and fake skeletons, and Helena Bonham Carter as Rosebud.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:28 a.m. CST

    This one would definitely be naff in comparison.

    by Mr Nicholas

  • June 29, 2009, 2:30 a.m. CST


    by SnapT

  • June 29, 2009, 2:31 a.m. CST

    When the Halloween remake was announced,

    by Mission Code Z

    it was then that I realized that nothing was sacred. No original film is so beloved and cherished as to avoid being remade when there is money to be had. If Citizen Kane had a story marketable enough to the teenybopper crowd, they would greenlight a remake of it as well.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:39 a.m. CST

    Lucas and Speilberg

    by dudemandude

    I can't imagine them selling the rights to any of their intellectual property for remakes or anything else for that matter. Those two guys gobble up properties not sell the ones that got them where they are. Lucas selling off Star Wars?! Never gonna happen.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:41 a.m. CST

    Remake Great Space Coaster

    by dudemandude

    now that's a fuckin' show

  • June 29, 2009, 2:42 a.m. CST

    Great Space Coaster

    by dudemandude

    directed by Michael Bay and soundtrack done by Kenny Loggins would kick ass!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:45 a.m. CST

    The Weinstains are arseholes.

    by Ecto-1

    If they think that they can produce a better film than what Landis did. Considering that their last werewolf effort was Cursed, which was a pile of dog shit, I don't care who they get for this remake, I won't go anywhere near it.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:46 a.m. CST


    by TinSpider


  • June 29, 2009, 2:53 a.m. CST


    by ThePilgrim

    You know we all say we love art, but in the end the good films that survive and find a audiance, yes even those Arty Farty ones. Become Brands. Once it becomes a "Brand" with a following. The System rapes it. Rapes it, Rapes it. <P> Get over it. It's not art, not anymore, It stop being Art the day the T-shirt containing "The Slaughtered Lamb" sign logo was marketed and sold at Hot Topics.<P> <P> It's so artful and.... Blaaaah it's a brand and it cults, and as they say in swingers. It's So Money. Cause Nostalgia sells it all. Everyone wants to relive the adventure! Stupid fucks! <P>Amulet, Amulet, Amulet!!!!<P> Abe and Palmer are next!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:55 a.m. CST

    D. Vader

    by wintocha67

    I'm with ya brother. Never seen any of the remakes or any films with bad ratings. Never seen either Transformers. that's what critics are for, to sift through the crap for you. You've got to set an example, got to demand and pay for quality and nothing less. "Guh, I heard that was awful."

  • June 29, 2009, 3:03 a.m. CST

    only reason for a remake

    by bacci40

    is to put in the song "werewolves of london"....the only thing missing from the soundtrack<P> seriously...fuck hollywood...fuck em hard, fuck them long

  • June 29, 2009, 3:08 a.m. CST




  • June 29, 2009, 3:21 a.m. CST

    Just when you thought Hollywood couldn't get any lower

    by zapano

    I blame Michael Bay, he started this remake craze with the Texas Chainsaw Massacre

  • June 29, 2009, 3:32 a.m. CST

    Let them make the remake....

    by hanselsgig

    Well I say let Dimension remake An American Werewolf in London and THEN we will all see how pathetic it will be against a true classic as the original is. It's important production companies make these shallow remakes so we can be reassured in the first place why the original cannot be beat on any level. AWIL is my all time favorite horror film, it is lightening in a bottle. You cannot get that magic back. Landis made a masterpiece in his prime. There was something magical living through the 80's feeling that magic and atmosphere devoid of today's cynicism that today's films face with modern audiences. So I say bring on the remake. Let them eat humble pie!

  • June 29, 2009, 3:33 a.m. CST

    Fer fecks sake...sacrelidge! Just re-release Landis's

    by KillaKane

    What's the point, CGI transformation, more of the wolf revealed on it's rampage in Piccadilly Circus. I'd only be interested if Baker and Landis were involved, but still pointless, AWIL holds up to this day

  • June 29, 2009, 3:34 a.m. CST

    I was at the screening on Friday

    by Lost Jarv

    and Landis himself said that he'd sold the rights. <P>It's happening.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:43 a.m. CST

    Hey. SuperCowBell!

    by sailingmaster

    They did remake 12 Angry Men. It wasn't bad, but it never had the gravitas of the first one. It wasn't the actors' performances. Everyone did a solid job on the piece with maybe the exception of George C. Scott. He came across to me as an over-the-top version of Lee J. Cobb's original performance. The problem was in the direction. Bad composition, and lots of it.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:55 a.m. CST

    I thought Dimension was dead..

    by Se7en

    Isn't it ?

  • June 29, 2009, 4:05 a.m. CST

    Then again . . .

    by Fletch F. Fletch

    I wouldn't pay money to see a new John Landis movie, either. Talk about coasting on old credibility . . .

  • June 29, 2009, 4:10 a.m. CST

    This is a Brilliant Idea......

    by D o o d

    I think they should cast Nicholas Cage and John Travolta in the leads. Sharon Stone can be the love interest. John Woo should direct it. What do you guys think..?

  • June 29, 2009, 4:10 a.m. CST

    PG Rating FOR THE KIDS

    by fisheater

  • June 29, 2009, 4:13 a.m. CST

    I don't mind remakes

    by deanbarry

    They don't suddenly negate the original. If the remake is a suckage blackhole of horror, slip the original into your player. It won't go away. But the memory of the terrible remake might and you never have to watch it again.

  • June 29, 2009, 4:19 a.m. CST

    I'm outraged.

    by vanchimera

    Not really though. If I don't want to watch it I won't. Novel idea, huh?

  • June 29, 2009, 4:28 a.m. CST

    Needless Remake...yet again. When does it end?

    by Monkey_King

    Try remaking something that had so-so FX shots or a crappy script that needed improvement. Leave this film alone.

  • June 29, 2009, 4:36 a.m. CST


    by pliskin420

    one of the movies that passed the test of time perfectly, is now being remade. me and my brother were just talking how the wolf still looks good, but what the hellya gonna do. They shouldnt use CGI. thats why i think the old one holds up... itll probly come out and be forgotten or not spoken of.

  • June 29, 2009, 4:42 a.m. CST

    Stick to the roads!

    by Pigdog

  • June 29, 2009, 4:47 a.m. CST

    Remake Transformers

    by photoboy

    There are some remakes worth doing. Get rid of Bay and his shit designs and make it faithful this time.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:06 a.m. CST

    Remake Original Star Wars

    by Iceman357

    This way George can make it suck as the prequel does and the originals can have their dignity back... have Ben Affleck play Han Solo... that would make allot of people happy.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:17 a.m. CST

    Let's see if Hollywood has the balls....

    by RobotKing

    to remake The Godfather.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:26 a.m. CST


    by CharlesThomasMathews1978

    In this thing called a “library” there are these things called “books” where they contain objects called “letters” that are arranged to form these things called “words” and if arranged in a certain order these “words” can be used to form “sentences” which gathered to gathered together can be used to make “paragraphs” and if you collect enough of these “paragraphs” then you have this marvelous concept called a “book”. It’s amazing that these “books” have stuff in them called “stories” and these “stories” contain some truly revolutionary concepts such as “plot”, “characterization”, “theme”, “subtext”.<br> <br>Of course I know it’s too much to expect anyone in Hollywood to be able to actually read since California’s Board of Education is a fucking joke and Conservatives have been starving the education system of funds for decades in an effort to turn the entire populous of that State into pig ignorant morons. But the rest of the word is reasonable well educated and as a member of society who has an IQ over 75, I would appreciate that if you can’t get well written, original screenplays from the likes of Bob Orci and Alex Kurtzman then could you at least, just maybe, adapt some of these “books” into movies that might actually be entertaining while not insulting to the intelligence to anyone who knows how to wipe their asshole.<br> <br>Thank you.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:26 a.m. CST


    by kwisatzhaderach

    started off great, The Abyss, T2, Jurassic Park. Now it just dominates everything though. My philosophy: if it can be done for real do it for real. If it can't be done for real then CG. <p> Avatar should be fascinating.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:28 a.m. CST


    by kwisatzhaderach

    What I hated about the new Star Trek was that it was written by two meathead knuckle draggers who completely missed the literary and philosophical nature of Star Trek. <p> Never mind, it made a lot of money and the tweens are happy.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:34 a.m. CST


    by CharlesThomasMathews1978

    And they'll turn it into some faggy emo piece of shit for tweens. NORTH AMERICAN CINEMA IS COMING TO AN END.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:45 a.m. CST


    by TheExterminator

  • June 29, 2009, 5:56 a.m. CST

    kwisatzhaderach, I WANT SOME IDEAS WITH MY ACTION...

    by CharlesThomasMathews1978

    Stupid fucking cunts on the Transformers thread (most of them Don Murphy minions) keep saying “it’s a movie based on a cartoon commercial for toys about robots that turn into vehicles, what do you expect, Shakespeare, just turn your brain off”AAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!<br> <br>The same shit is said about Star Trek which would have been a lot better if it had actually been ABOUT SOMETHING!!! I liked the look of it, I loved THE CAST and there was plenty of action but that’s all there was. No ideas, no concepts, no themes. It was basically a Bond movie. Here’s the villain, he’s got a doomsday device, they have to stop them and THAT’S IT!<br> <br>Action movies, especially Sci-fi oriented ones, DON’T HAVE TO BE BRAINLESS. Terminator 2 is a sci-fi/action masterpiece and that’s because underneath the explosions and effects there was a real story with theme’s and ideas. Terminator Salvation, Star Trek and Transformers are fucking piss poor in comparison, CHRIST, I Robot was a fucking Will Smith movies and even THAT was better then the fucking trash of this summer. Akiva Goldsman even worked on that fucking movie, AKIVA BATMAN & ROBIN MOTHERFUCKING GOLDSMAN, and even he couldn’t fuck it up and that’s because you had Alex Proyas, a Director with some actual vision unlike bay and Abrams who are fucking hacks.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:56 a.m. CST

    A naked american man stole me balloons

    by palpatinefuckedmydog

  • June 29, 2009, 6:13 a.m. CST

    Keep to the road...

    by KelseysNuts

    This is a monumentally bad idea. One of my favorite horror films of all-time -- the transformation scene is unmatched. I showed this film to my kids when they were about 12 and 10 years old. Scared the be-jeezus out them so bad that neither of them will watch werewolf movies to this day (eight years later)!

  • June 29, 2009, 6:13 a.m. CST


    by Pigdog

    Just going off topic. Does anyone know what's happening with the new Dune movie adaption? I watched the David Lynch version the other day and am reading the book now. I would love to see it done justice, is Peter Berg up to it?

  • June 29, 2009, 6:15 a.m. CST

    American Werewolf In West Virginia...

    by Kid Z

    ... because if there were really werewolves, you know they'd be a bunch of wacked-out hillbillies.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:16 a.m. CST


    by CharlesThomasMathews1978

    As Han, Luke and Leah, directed by Michael Bay, scripted by Orci and Kurtzman, C3PO will be voiced by Perez Hilton while R2-D2 will sound like a human beat box and use generic pop songs to covey his emotions. Chewbacca will be a 7 foot tall gangsta with dreadlocks and talk like a fucking cap busting ghetto nigga. Darth Vader will be all CGI and he’ll look like someone covered with crushed beer cans, spray painted black from head to toe. Bruce Willis will play Obi-Wan and give that fucking annoying smirk of his before getting killed by Vader. There wont be a shot that lasts for more the 0.000000012th of a second while dialogue is going to be replaced with explosions that come out of everyone’s mouth except for Leah who will only speaks in sounds of moaning orgasmic pleasure as she rubs her breasts and vagina in every single shot while licking her lips all the fucking time. The score will be provided by Linkin Park, it will be 3 hours long and cost 500 million.<br> <br>If you don’t like the sound of that then you are an elitist snob who expects every movie to be Shakespeare, so you should just shit your brain off as we rape you wallet and your soul.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:21 a.m. CST

    For The Scottish Fans Of This Film (Maybe All Brtitish?)

    by pr1c3y

  • June 29, 2009, 6:21 a.m. CST

    That scene in...

    by Kid Z

    ... American Werewolf in Paris where Julie Delpy jumped off the Eiffel Tower and Tom Everett Scott had time to rig up a makeshift bungee cord, tie it to his legs, secure it to the Tower, jump off, plummet faster than Delpy and catch up to her (hello?, anyone ever heard of Galileo???) and catch her by the ankles, saving her... that ruined the movie for me. Then, I saw the shitty CGI hairless werewolves and it was game over!

  • June 29, 2009, 6:27 a.m. CST

    I'm a CG artist myself...

    by TinSpider

    and i agree with Quint on this one. I've never seen a Werewolf transformation beat Bakers work on AAMIL. Practical effects can look fantastic when done right.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:46 a.m. CST

    Jure remake Citizen Kane and Casablanca already

    by ominus

    what the fuck are u waiting for, Hollywood? well?

  • June 29, 2009, 7:01 a.m. CST


    by ricarleite2

    _"Quatre Rouge, monsieur perde, la banc ganhe" - RWWAAAAARRLLL!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 7:15 a.m. CST

    Dune, btw...

    by V'Shael

    The SF mini-series (the original one) was not a bad adaptation, if you like the novel. <p> Some elements of the David Lynch movie were better, (Francesca Annis is just too beautiful for words) but it's pretty good. <p> The second mini-series, with Susan Sarandon though, was a fucking joke. Avoid like the plague.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:16 a.m. CST

    why not? and citizen kane gets remade in cartoon form

    by ironic_name

    every couple of years. <P> and casablanca was redone as barb wire.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:25 a.m. CST

    Unimaginative Hollywood Hacks

    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    There, does that answer your question?

  • June 29, 2009, 7:29 a.m. CST

    Films should be remade only when the original

    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    doesn't cut the mustard. The first Dune was directed by Alan Smithee because until his version was released (later on video, but not in theaters if I recall correctly) Lynch didn't want his name put on it because his vision was bastardized by the higher ups.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:29 a.m. CST


    by SunTzu77

    There was a rumor back in the day that Ben Affleck and JLO were supposed to remake Casablanca... then Gigli happened. Also, forget remaking the original Star Wars... remake the craptastic Ep I,II, and III.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:31 a.m. CST

    American Werewolf in my Pants

    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    He gets big, growls, and foams at the mouth when he gets excited by the full moon.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:33 a.m. CST

    Well Quint, that new Twilight movie

    by MorganLeafy

    will no doubt be horrendous. However that werewolf in the trailer looked pretty convincing.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:34 a.m. CST

    Worst. Idea. Ever.

    by ScottinDC

    American Werewolf in London is damn near perfect...the effects still hold up; nasty gore; terrific acting and biting sleazy comedy (and even a few genuinely good scares). It remains among my favorite films of all time...a remake is absolutely not needed.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:36 a.m. CST

    An original movie will never happen.

    by jae683

    Hollywood is too concerned with hedging its bets to make anything remotely original anymore.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:40 a.m. CST

    UH?! Isn't the writer's strike over!!!???

    by My best friend

    How about we come up with something original. The only motivation is money.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:40 a.m. CST

    Get Michael Bay to direct!

    by SpyGuy

    If you're going to fuck things up, you might as well go all out and still make yourself $200 million in the process...

  • June 29, 2009, 7:42 a.m. CST

    You pussies went apeshit over a DOTD remake and it was class

    by bongo123

    hell it blew romeros original outa the water and look how high a pedastal you place that flick on ffs, i say go for it, its a classic horror that doesnt put a foot wrong, im all for the chance at seeing the story told in a fresh way afterall Zack's DOTD was a fucking blast

  • June 29, 2009, 7:44 a.m. CST

    Remake Jaws for crikey sakes

    by My best friend

  • June 29, 2009, 7:48 a.m. CST


    by quantize

    talkin out your ass with a blowhorn.. the remake was did fuck all to diminish the original dream on

  • As do all remakes, how in the fuck does watching a remake have any effect on how you feel about the original? If anything it makes you appreciate it even more and when someone as talented as Zack comes along and takes a classic and remakes/reinvents/copies/whateverthefuckyouwannacallit and the new movie turns out to be pretty fucking good and in my opinion better than the original which has dated so badly as to make it near unwatchable (cept for the opening 10mins) then why all the fucking crying on this site, i swear everyone on here does nothing but moan constantly about films even ones not even greenlit ffs, as a movie fan i wanna see original films and i also wanna see all my favourite movies remade as well cause im fucking grown up enough to still love the original and appreciate the newer version, so bring on Alien, The Thing, Escape from Newyork, First Blood, Deliverance etc etc, all great fucking movies with great stories and id rather watch a remake of a classic than some fucking stupid ass attempt at originality

  • June 29, 2009, 8:19 a.m. CST

    Damnit! Sick of fucking remakes!

    by effector12

    Hollywood does it all the time. They ran out of original ideas years ago.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:24 a.m. CST

    authenticity... what? no its fine.

    by JRKerr

    my wolf shrine is huge. I have more wolfman stuff than anything else. I dont think the genre has a holy grail. The Wolf Man, Werewolf of London, She Wolf of London, Wolf, Wolfen, Pact Loups, Curse of the Werewolf (Oliver Reed), all the way up to Spanish film Shiver. It all had something to add. AWIL is cool and all, but letting somebody else play with it isn't going to do anything to my shrine. Even bad wolf flicks like Werewolf of Washington or Werewolf Woman dont diminish it. I'm fine with this news.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:26 a.m. CST

    'better than the original which has dated so badly as to make it

    by quantize

    give up, you're gagging on your own bullshit.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:38 a.m. CST

    CGI ALWAYS look slike shit....

    by Jobacca

    I'm sorry...but the CGI in KONG and LOTR and all those other movies Quint mentioned in his update? Its still shitty CGI...the BEST CGI is still nowhere near as good as the best practical effects.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:44 a.m. CST

    Films I'd like to see remade . . .

    by Nice Marmot

    But with NO CGI. Deadly Eyes, Wolfen, Savage Harvest, Prophecy, The Boogens, and Night of the Lepus w/ Karl Urban in the DeForest Kelley role.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:44 a.m. CST

    As long as its done by the guys who did Underworld

    by Series7

    I won't care, those werewolves rocked John Landis and Bakers ASS!

  • June 29, 2009, 8:46 a.m. CST

    An American Werewolf in...

    by Yeti

    Cairo! Berlin! Moscow! Helsinki! Sydney! Tokyo! Bejing! Mexico City!

  • June 29, 2009, 8:46 a.m. CST

    Guaranteed to Happen

    by ThusSpakeSpymunk

    It might not even have the same title, eventually being called AMERICAN WEREWOLF (though that's a lot of syllables, so maybe it'll just get called THE WEREWOLF or WEREWOLF or maybe ... wait for it ... LYCAN!). The new film will feature slim CW actors, have no actual comedy (other than people referring ot eachother as 'douche' and such), won't feature a zombie best friend, WILL have a love interest (also from the CW), and will be 100-percent Sci-Fi-Channel-Level CGI. The budget will come out around $20m or so, as the studio won't do much to support the film (seeing it's horror). The movie will make $42m in its opening weekend and justify a raft of sequels that will somehow nevertheless go direct-to-video became the studio didn't feel it got a big enough return on its investment. Mark my words.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:46 a.m. CST

    The film that BETTER not be remade . . .

    by Nice Marmot

    JAWS. If this happens, I will stand outside my local theater throwing things at whoever's in line buying tickets.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:46 a.m. CST


    by dagwood

    You are spot on. I am a filmmaker and am constantly proposing the question: why is it that the opening of Blade Runner still to this day looks better than any CGI I have yet to see. CGI looks best when you don't even know it's CGI (in other words, when it doesn't attract attention to itself and scream LOOK AT HOW COOL I AM). Sorry, but I'm not a 13 year old boy. Rick Baker and his ilk are/were light years ahead of most of what's going on today. CGI with rare exceptions (Children of Men is one of them) is shit.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:50 a.m. CST

    Digitial graphics artists

    by Arteska

    get hung out to dry by terrible scripts all the time and are tasked with plugging budget holes that the people above them are too lazy to plug themselves but I'll second most of what Quint has said. It's pathetic how amateurish some movies as little as 10 years old look compared to opticals and mattes that from decades past. It is plainly overused and oftentimes patched in nakedly the point it makes you wonder who is signing off on their inclusion. Because of Jackson's death they replayed thriller over the weekend and it was remarkable to me just how poorly most similar work in the time since measures up. And yeah these remake bozos are killing their own business.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:53 a.m. CST

    Quantize, the original DOTD in its time was brilliant, pure bril

    by bongo123

    Have you watched it recently? A couple of friends of mine hadn’t seen the original Dead trilogy since we were kids so i stuck em on, we missed out on the first one instead opting to watch Dawn & Day and holy fuck mate have both films dated badly, granted Days gore is still fucking top notch and like i said the opening 10mins of Dawn with all the panic going on and society literally falling apart before our very eyes is pretty damn fucking good but everything else is just hard to watch, Romero’s in your face “social commentary” which is fucking ludicrously over the top coupled with piss poor directing, editing and don’t even get me started on the fucking musical score for both films makes for a couple of hours of hilarious piss taking and this is coming from a bunch o big zombie/horror fans. The films unfortunately have aged terribly as i can remember watching these flicks over and over as a teenager thinking they were among the holy grails of horrors instead of the terrible pieces of filmmaking they have become. As for Zack’s remake which we watched afterwards, the quality, scares, tension, etc etc just outshine anything the original had going for it, its not the perfect movie but this laughable romantized view of the original Dawn is pretty fucking lame, only the real “classics” hold up to todays viewing, the likes of the Thing, Alien, Jaws etc, Romero’s unfortunately falls into the same boat as Frightnite for me, fucking great when i was a kid but hilariously stupid now that im an adult.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:53 a.m. CST

    An American Werewolf in Tokyo

    by Anna Valerious

    Yes, I'd definitely support that. Or Merton J. Dingle's idea for "An American Werewolf in Lenningrad".

  • June 29, 2009, 8:56 a.m. CST

    American Werewolf In New York, London, Paris, Munich...

    by Kid Z

    ...Everybody howl about mmm-pop muzik.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:59 a.m. CST

    An American werewolf in Rio

    by Pigdog

  • June 29, 2009, 9:01 a.m. CST

    Werewolf TV Show

    by Kaladrax

    Anyone remember the Werewolf TV show that was part of the original Fox line up. Maybe it's just my youthful recollection but it seemed to be pretty decent for an eighties show. They should remake that!

  • June 29, 2009, 9:08 a.m. CST

    Wow! What a novel idea...a REMAKE! golly

    by DoctorZoidberg

    How bout remaking Transformers 2?

  • June 29, 2009, 9:14 a.m. CST


    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    Chuck Connors, hell yeah!

  • June 29, 2009, 9:15 a.m. CST

    This Would Be Dumb!

    by Real Deal

    A lot of things came together to make this a great film. Not likely to happen again. Besides it's too soon for a film that really holds up as one of the classics. I have zero faith in someone pulling this off correctly at this time.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:19 a.m. CST

    The problem with CGI...

    by fassbinder79 it looks fake as hell. If its a choice between CGI or the old Baker or Bottin effects from the original werewolf or say carpenter's the thing then i'll take the old shit any day of the week. CGI SUCKS!

  • June 29, 2009, 9:21 a.m. CST

    I prefer The Howling...

    by ufoclub1977

    Although American Werewolf is a lot of fun in theory, back in 1981, I saw both, and everyone I knew and myself prefered the werewolves and the transformation in The Howling (which Baker had a lot of input on as well). Landis's way of presenting the transformation and the monster wasn't as cool as the way Dante did it. The Howling was a lot more artistically expressive of a fantastic, scary mood. I watched both countless times on beta back then... and cable... would go straight to a friend's house with cable after school to check out The Howling. I do think a decent werewolf movie could be made today, with a skilled, and scary horror director. Something as serious and expressive as the attitude to The Ring remake.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Tell that CG artist to eat a fucking dick.

    by Harry Weinstein


  • June 29, 2009, 9:25 a.m. CST

    Actually, Quint (re: make-up Oscar),

    by König Lear

    the Academy began awarding make-up Oscars in direct response to the outcry over their lack of formal recognition for the makeup work on The Elephant Man. AWL did have some amazing practical effects; however, they weren't the impetus for the new category.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:32 a.m. CST

    CGI mixed with practical FX

    by Logan_1973

    Say what you will about Bay, but at least he mixes the two. <p>Back on topic: this is a shit idea. Do something original for chrissakes. SO happy the writers are off strike...

  • June 29, 2009, 9:37 a.m. CST

    If this happens...

    by BongSabre

    I will fucking cut someone. Right down their fucking cock. This movie broke my cherry on horror movies, I was 4. It's still my favorite movie of all time. This is such an awful fucking idea, and thank you for fucking up my day.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:52 a.m. CST

    I would rather...

    by Giant Ape Balls

    hammer my scrotum to a chair with a rusty nail than watch another pointless remake.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:56 a.m. CST

    Is "The Wolfman" still all practical effects?

    by the maven

    Seems like I read at /another/ film site that they were dumping Baker's approach for more CGI. If true, that would be a real shame. Rick Baker was born to do the effects for that movie.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:58 a.m. CST

    That CG artist sounds like a complete moron.

    by rbatty024

    Practical effects are always more impressive than CG, if simply because people are at a point where they understand how CG works (green screen plus computer screen), but practical effects still have that magician's secret element: we're never quite certain how they accomplished the trick. Back when CG effects were predominant there were many books at the library explaining how the masters made these effects. These days I doubt anyone is concerned with how CG is created. In fact, most people already know. <p> That's not to say that all CG effects are worthless, just not as intriguing. When CG is coupled with great artistry, it can be a work of magic, like the Lord of the Rings. However, even in those instances CG is usually backed up with practical effects.

  • June 29, 2009, 10 a.m. CST

    I never understood why CGI has such a bad reputation.

    by DerLanghaarige

    I mean, yes, it can look like shit, but so can Stop Motion, Animatronics, Make Up Effects and pretty much every "handmade" effectwork. As much as I love Ray Harryhausen, you can't convince me that any of his work look realistic or, to be more specific, "not fake".<br> Yes, there maybe wasn't a good CGI Werewolf transformation yet. but how many realistic and convincing practical transformations do you know? I know 2: American Werewolf and The Howling. It's not about the tools, it's about the people who use them and the amount of time and money they got.<br>

  • June 29, 2009, 10:01 a.m. CST

    People hated the wheel and fire when it was first discovered too

    by terry1978

    CGI is one of the better f/x tools created for the entertainment industry in the last few decades, but becauses people tend to use it in a shabby or overused manner it gets a bad rap. There are characters and effects done that we have in fiction that could never be achieved in live action flicks without it, so I don't have a hatred for the stuff personally.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:02 a.m. CST

    Sad, sad, sad

    by OfficerJunior

    while a creatively bankrupt Hollywood, wallows in its own recycled garbage. We set in judgement and wag our pot bellied digits at them in a vain attempt to see intellectually supior. But Hollywoods condition is our own doing. No one called bullshit on The Fast and the furious 4, when it dropped the thes and the number. Why? Or Final Destination 4. We lined up around the block to see Halloween, why? Because R. Zombies directorial efforts had been so strong? The transformers franchise is going to make a mint. Why? Because we used to play with them kids. You know what i used to play with a lot when I was a kid? My dick. Cumming Summer 2010 My Dick 2 Revenge of the fallen.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:03 a.m. CST

    Seriously, who thinks ScriptGirl's contributions are a good idea

    by YackBacker

    I don't.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:05 a.m. CST

    FABIO does.

    by AxeEmAll

  • June 29, 2009, 10:05 a.m. CST


    by OfficerJunior

    realizes the folly of misspelling superior following intellectually

  • June 29, 2009, 10:09 a.m. CST

    If they must remake/spin-off.....

    by pdennett316

    Then do it right. Big-ish budget, all practical effects and a decent cast. <p> Might I suggest Seth Green and Topher Grace for the college guys. Both would have to dial it down a bit, but it could work nicely. Get Landis back for it, I doubt anyone else would get the tone right, and end up going too comedy with it. <p> I preferred AWIL over The Howling due to the tone, as well as the crappy Were-Gerbil thing at the end of The Howling; that knocked it down a few points.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:09 a.m. CST

    Fuck Dimension and the Weinsteins

    by skimn

    Aren't they busy enough buying Oscar nominations for their "prestige" pictures?<p>A francise huh? An American Werewolf in Russia? in Bangkok? The Paris edition sucked enough thank you.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:12 a.m. CST

    I think everyone here realizes that CG can be a great tool...

    by rbatty024

    However, it has been misused and abused for the past decade. Directors need to understand that a mixture of CG and practical effects makes for the best looking special effects. My previous post was more about the mystique of practical effects and there lack thereof in CG effects.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:12 a.m. CST


    by OfficerJunior

    I think you're one of two people trying to get Topher Grace into theathers. The other, Topher Grace's assistant manager at the cineplex. That popcorn is not gonna sweep it's self up.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:15 a.m. CST

    Killer Klowns sequel

    by Dapper Swindler

    Okay, I can live with that instead of a remake.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:18 a.m. CST

    Hopefully this means

    by Series7

    We can see an updated/remake of The Stupids, great great under rated film. <P> Also maybe that Blues Brothers 3000 that Landis needs to poop out can happen soon as well.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:20 a.m. CST

    Quint, tell that CG Artist to screw off

    by D.Vader

    There was nothing offensive in your post or derogatory toward CGI artists in your original post. Besides, if he was secure enough with his work and confident in his abilities, he wouldn't have a problem with you wishing for practical effects instead of CG.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:30 a.m. CST

    Modern audiences will hate it....

    by Cellar Door

    Seriously..think about it. If AWiL was released today the biggest scenes would be the transformation and the gore. All of the nuance, mood, and atmosphere of the moors scene, the subway scene, the entire theater/alleyway scenes would be lost on modern audiences and their wide-eyed need to be clobbered over the head with action or fall asleep in the theater.<p>I saw this in the theater as a kid and I remember covering my ears and hiding part of my vision - that's how fucking scary those scenes were and yet, you barely got a glimpse of "the monster" the entire time. Pure pacing and atmosphere and purely brilliant true horror film-making. You can disagree with the overall quality of the film but if the pacing of those scenes are "slow" or "boring" to you, then you're apprently not one to appreciate nuanced, and dare I say "quality" horror. I could be wrong but clever methods of dispatch do not make for even 5 seconds of quality pacing and mood in a horror movie.<p>I'd say AWiL was true 'Lightning in a bottle' filmmaking and not even greater talent than what was originally involved could reproduce the film in any remote stretch of the imagination.<p>But go for it you money grubbing dickheads. You unoriginal types are like slugs..leaving a trail of slime in your wake while the giants whose shoulders you attempt to stand on left trails of ass-kickery.<p>I wonder sometimes if these remake/sequel/prequel obsessives aren't really lost cinema geeks just like us except they don't realize that in their search for the cinema nostalgia of youth, they're green-lighting hollywood into the dirt in terms of quality and compelling cinema in most genres.<p>Congratz on making what finally sounds to be pure ACTION PORN in the form of that Transformers movie so successful. As in nothing beyond "Action" worth watching in Bay's modern work like there's nothing beyond the "Sex" worth watching in actual porn movies. There was more 'story' in the "torture porn" movies a few years back so I say we use this term officially "Action Porn". Love it, or else reveal yourself as having no balls cause action = balls and transformers = action so no-transformers = no-balls! natch!<p>I hope the second week fall-off gives you assholes permanent vertigo and makes you piss yourself randomly.<p>Especially seeing that after years of arguing against the stupidity of insisting upon lowest setting possible for what's considered 'quality', stupid makes a predictable comeback in the form of all of the assholes insisting that you cannot criticize Bay's work until (a) you make your own action-movie blockbuster and earn hundreds of millions of dollars or (b) realize that not every movie ever made is Citizen Kane of The Godfather and stop being insistent that all movies but those 2 movies are shite...or is it that you can't always get Shakespeare?<p>I'm not even sure what I'm *allowed* to think about Bay's work anymore.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:31 a.m. CST

    Yeah I had totally fergot about

    by Series7

    Werewolf in Paris, which had one good scene about how to calm a men down by placing their hands on a memorable place. But I guess Landis has fergot about it as well, just like he fergots about childrens curfews.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:31 a.m. CST

    Subtle CG is good, but when CG is the scene

    by Samuel Fulmer

    It still doesn't look as good as a really well done practical effect.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:32 a.m. CST

    After August will Harvey and Bob

    by Samuel Fulmer

    Still have a studio???

  • June 29, 2009, 10:32 a.m. CST


    by Series7

    The star of That Thing You Don't and American Werewolf In Paris, where is he now?

  • June 29, 2009, 10:33 a.m. CST

    Needs more GIANT PIG

    by GIANT_PIG

    GIANT PIG!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 10:38 a.m. CST

    "I'm sorry I called you Meatloaf...!"

    by Nasty In The Pasty

  • June 29, 2009, 10:54 a.m. CST

    In the Howling/London debate

    by skimn

    I give The Howling a slight edge because of Dante's casting, the sly wolf references, and the classic horror lighting during the transformation. But then London has the great moors scene between Dunne and Naughton, Dunne's undead scenes/make-up, and the See You Next Wednesday actresses' chest. I understand the decision to film the transformation under normal lighting conditions, and Baker's work out details Bottins, but it lacks dramatic tension. And the final werewolf figure always looked like a big burly dog instead of a werewolf.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:59 a.m. CST

    Thank you Quint!!!

    by kateowyn

    For being like the only person in the geek world who still supports 35 and 70 over digital....and practical over overdone me hope.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:02 a.m. CST

    A remake I'm intrigued by: Piranha

    by D.Vader

    I'm not a huge fan of Aja. I liked Haute Tension allright, but never saw his Hills Have Eyes remake. But I'm interested in his Piranha remake simply bc the original is so old and schlocky there is the potential for someone to elevate it to greatness, much like Carpenter did with The Thing. Its got potential. So I'll wait and see before damning that one.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:05 a.m. CST

    The biggest joke about all you guys, and Quint ya eejit

    by half vader

    is that if this was the 70s/Early 80s you would all be echoing the professionals at the time who didn't want to let Baker into the industry in the first place. At first it was no, we won't help, no we won't share, no, you're not in the boys' club. Then when he was in the industry but pushing past the limitations of standard makeup into early animatronics they were all like "what? Get out of here with that robot shit - that's not makeup!" and here we are with you guys essentially doing the SAME thing (makeup vs technological 'cheating' for you numbskulls) 20 something years later by parroting the same CG isn't REAL effects bullshit. <p> REAL effects is whatever gets the fucking job done. Mirrors, Mechanics, Rubber or Rendered. It's the fucking PEOPLE that use them you should be venerating or damning. It's funny how none of you (including you Quint) are aware of how you jump back and forth between simplistic hero worship of a 'name' in Baker and then mindlessly flipflopping back into a subjective vilification of a bloody TECHNIQUE as if THAT'S responsible. Which argument IS it? Make up your minds! Everyone shits on CG in GENERAL because there aren't any heroes they can latch onto - moronic. A computer doesn't do SHIT by itself. A PERSON does the good/bad animation, and even all the secondary stuff like physics/procedural effects have to be purpose-written by a techie and then art-directed by a PERSON. And because you can all say "Baker! Bottin!" you forget that there was a SHITLOAD of BADLY done practical makeup FX back in the day. You forget or aren't even aware or the majority of lumpy built-up prosthetics and awful puppets. But many of you were kids when the CG/digital age arguably started in 89 with The Abyss, so you don't even KNOW what the general level of work was like back then! The divide between cheap budgets and quality stuff with better resources is the SAME now in cg - and the unifying factor is that there isn't enough time allotted to either. <p> In short, most of those commenting here aren't old enough to know shit/don't know enough about oldschool to make a balanced argument, and those who are shouldn't be so fucking disingenuous/should know better. <p> And yeah, the "looks REAL" thing. Be more careful with your semantics. In the old practical stuff people ignore the fact that even if it sort of looked real in the literal sense because it was physically there, it was still generally rooted to the fucking spot (which can mess with characterisation), or the movement it DID have wasn't generally natural/character based but borne from the physical limitations of the mechanics or a hand up it's arse. The way the latex/material could drag the lower part of the face & nose down when moving the mouth and got in the way of a PERFORMANCE. All-or-nothing eyeblinks (or in Dark Crystal's case, half-blinks restricted by the structure and materials). So certainly THAT part of the character didn't 'look' real. And even when CG looks real in a still frame, generally movement give it away too. But people don't generally look at still frames of cg effects. <p> And yet you guys don't even REALISE (admittedly due to Oz's brilliance) that Yoda never said/lipsynced more than "ba ba ba". Or you excuse the militation as part of the 'charm'. Which is fine, but you'd fucking jump all OVER it if some CG creature didn't have a decent amount of mouth movement. All I'm saying is you guys either don't notice or choose to play down the importance of the many drawbacks of the old stuff to concentrate on it's merits. Which is also fine, but you CAN"T change the rules for CG by being more unforgiving without looking like MORONS. Which is exactly what is happening here and in every other TB where these sort of criticisms are ignored. <p> If you ARE talking about the people, then be fair there too. Blame PEOPLE for the lousy CG. And Praise PEOPLE for the good stuff. And what no-one including QUINT seems to acknowledge is that people like Dennis Muren, Phil Tippett, Ken Ralston and John Dykstra are responsible for BOTH the old effects techniques AND the new ones, and brought the same eye for detail and lateral problem-solving to BOTH. <p> ESPECIALLY in CG where most people are using the SAME programs and tools (proprietary code/programs notwithstanding for big houses), it's these same PEOPLE that are the difference between great stuff and the rest of the dross. The SAME as in the old days when everyone had the same basic toolkit and techniques for going to work on an actor's face or making a puppet. Whether it's Muren running the film backward and shooting upside down with dry-for-wet, or him getting past the early limitations of enveloping/tearing geometry by taken the damn frame into photoshop and retouching the problem on a 2-d pixel basis, laterally solving a complicated problem in a simple way, it's the SAME brilliance. Tippet knowing fur should be ticked due to the agouti gene brings the SAME convincing quality whether it's a practical fur suit or an ad for Blockbuster, and other people STILL don't do it, either practically or in cg.. <p> I'm not saying the old stuff was crap. It was brilliant and I love it to bits. I try to be objective enough to not ignore the limitations, because if you can RECOGNISE the drawbacks of something you love you can move on to overcoming them. And you can FAIRLY judge the plusses AND minuses of new techniques. <p> Like I said in the last TB, People were dumping on CG and Benjamin Button BECAUSE it was CG. The joke there was that it was based on the work of Baker and Tsuji's incredible maquettes, and used CG for it's strengths in doing something that COULDN'T be done accurately with makeup. Cannom did the oldschool ADDITIVE stuff. The DD guys did the SUBTRACTIVE effects. And Craig Barron (also one of the greatest of the oldschool guys whose Matte World does better matte effects than EVER - QUINT that's aimed at you) did the amazing digital matte fx work. My argument is all the best approaches were used for the right reasons and toes weren't stepped on. They didn't have to account for Tim Roth's nose (injoke for anyone paying attention). <p> If you're gonna fight, make it a fair fight. Otherwise you need to understand why your bleating is dismissed. Ya buncha ignorant whingers.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:06 a.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    Make it happen.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:11 a.m. CST

    And remember too that CG is aiming even higher

    by half vader

    than practical. Which is why we have the 'uncanny valley' problem. In the old days a lot of stuff went out the window before it was even written into the script (oh we can't actually do that). <p> Which is why the floating mountains that were meant to be in Kubrick's 2001 will finally turn up in Cameron's Avatar.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:12 a.m. CST

    Half Vader, calm down

    by D.Vader

    There are many people here who have said its all about the people who wield the power that makes the difference- not the power itself.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:13 a.m. CST

    Now let's get back to the set of "Too Many Vaders"

    by D.Vader

  • June 29, 2009, 11:14 a.m. CST

    But, you did say what needed to be said

    by D.Vader

  • June 29, 2009, 11:15 a.m. CST

    On a lighter note...

    by half vader

    (I took a breath now and calmed down a bit), I choose to see this Werewolf thing as a continuation in the same vein as Howling: The Marsupials! That's a cool thing, right?!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:18 a.m. CST

    the wheel and fire

    by CherryValance

    haven't really helped if you think about it. Think of all the burnt down houses and witches. And what about all the car accidents. Nah, we could have done without them.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:19 a.m. CST

    I'm a fan of GOOD CGI

    by Logan_1973

    When it works, it really works (LOTR, Transformers, Pirates, Iron Man, PJ's Kong). When it's bad, it's really bad (Spider-man, Van Helsing, Wolverine). The problem seems to lie within the hundreds of FX houses out there. A lot of them just can't deliver, but they're cheap which is why they keep getting hired. You do get what you pay for...

  • June 29, 2009, 11:20 a.m. CST


    by CherryValance

    I think he's on "Southland".

  • June 29, 2009, 11:20 a.m. CST

    AAWIL is a perfect movie....

    by mattb68

    You cannot do anything with AAWIL. It is a perfect movie and still holds up. Plus it's a perfect time capsule for London and what it looked like at the time (ah memories...) Don't fuck with it. On a sidenote, I just watched the "Friday the 13th" remake this weekend or should I say skipped through the chapters to see something original. Let's just say it was back in the netflix envelope pretty quickly. what a load of crap that was. I still have not mustered the energy to check out Zombie's "Halloween" yet as I am such a huge Carpenter fan and I'm scared I'll headbutt the TV in anger. Should I watch it anyway ?

  • June 29, 2009, 11:21 a.m. CST

    No more remakes! Just make sequels.

    by chrismata

    When keeping the original as a launching point, there's already a great foundation for more interesting stories. Also, do away with prequels. I never feel like the characters are in danger because I know they have to live to be in the original movie.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:21 a.m. CST

    D. Vader - true dat.

    by half vader

    I just get a bit overwhelmed when continually asking people to think about their outrageous and uninformed statements and they keep spouting the same shit. Makes me a crabby old nerd. <p> Many many MORE folks just bleat CG is shit than talk about the people. But you're right. I spent so long on my little rant I'm sure I missed many intervening posts. <p> And yes, I'm needed on set (in my newer guise as White)!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:24 a.m. CST

    I agree with everything Quint just said.

    by The Reluctant Austinite

    I've always loved craftsmenship. Who are the leading CGI craftsmen in the field? What are their names? Who are the heroes of the craft that kids can aspire to? When I was younger I wanted to BE Rick Baker or Tom Savini or Ray Harryhausen. I never dreamed of being a corporate employee of a computer company doing CAD.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:27 a.m. CST

    Still holds up?!?

    by Mr.FTW

    How can you say those fx still hold up? They look like a joke today. They may have been ground breaking at one point but that day has come and gone. I bet Rick Baker himself looks back and says "man that looks like crap".<p> I'm not disagreeing that there is a lot of horrible CGI, I mean look at Assylum Films but to say CGI werewolf transformations look rubbery when the transformation in AWIL was rubber and looks like ruber stretching? Come on buddy, the CG werewolf effects in the latest Underworld movie and the in Van Helsing from a few years a go destroy AWIL. If you want to compare old school, The Howling always had a better werewolf transformation and werewolf for my money.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:27 a.m. CST

    So half vader, tell us how you really feel

    by skimn

    But you make some excellent points. Can you imagine a rod puppet Gollum that would work as well as CGI? Or a gelatin appliance that would look as good as Davy Jones did in Pirates? Granted I think those two and King Kong are the best current examples of CGI...ooops forget Benjamin Button also. As stated the tools are only as good as the artist employing them.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:29 a.m. CST

    I heard Landis was the one remaking it.

    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    This is old news, he was the one who opened up all these doors to the remake of this movie. From what I gather he wouldn't allow it be remade by anyone but himself.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:30 a.m. CST

    I do wish Landis had listened to Baker though

    by half vader

    I know Landis was so happy with the main transformation design on AWWIL he overlit it to show it in all it's glory, but I do wish he'd listened to Baker and underlit a bit more. Makeup artists do things like detail,colour and finish for a certain type of lighting. <p> Dick Smith's amazing Sallieri had highlights that were almost fluoro yellow so that they would read in the agreed-upon tungsten/warm/yellowish lighting. It woulda looked like shit if the lighting had changed. That's the sorta thing I'm getting at.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:31 a.m. CST


    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    Watch it, I agree Carpenter's film was amazing, and he loved what Rob took from him and branched off to make a whole new Halloween. Just abandon all Carpenter until the 3rd segment starts, just remember its a Rob Zombie film. You might enjoy it, I did.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:32 a.m. CST

    I think the problem is too many pple yelling "CRAP CGI!"

    by D.Vader

    Like its become a bandwagon to jump on. Its cool to yell "The CGI sucks!" without giving it a real thought. And I don't mean instances where its deserved. Like the CGI plane crash at the end of Air Force One- that looked bad and deserves to be pointed out. <p> But there are far too many instances where a special effect looks great, but you know its a special effect because you know it couldn't be achieved any other way, and so you decry it as "bad". But those people who do so fail to take into account that had that very same effect been achieved with practical effects, the results would still be the same- it would look like a special effect. A good one, but still you'd know its an effect. <p> People just toss around the "crap CGI!" statement too much nowadays. Like people that hate Transformers. They hate the films and then say the films had terrible special effects. If anything, the best part about those films *are* the special effects; they are pretty stellar. <p> People just need some perspective.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:36 a.m. CST

    Speaking of CGI

    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    I think we're entering new ground with it, christ look at 2012.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:38 a.m. CST

    Sorry Skimn

    by half vader

    Calm again now. Just blowing off steam like everyone else I guess. It was Fassbinder's idiotic/myopic post that rolled my eyes up in my head and I missed the posts after that while furiously pecking away... <p> Maybe I shoulda done it in the Transformers TB instead... they even use the c word in there!!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:41 a.m. CST


    by Redmond

    That "idiot George Lucas" could buy and sell you like a cheap Thai hooker a million times over.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:43 a.m. CST

    CGI has just been misued, that's all

    by Redmond

    It's a great tool, but when hacks like Stephen Sommers and Wolfgang Petersen can use CGI to create mass sized crowds then label themselves epic filmmakers in the David Lean tradition, you know something's gone askew.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:44 a.m. CST

    King Kong..whatever your thoughts on the film

    by skimn

    The whole movie is about a special effect, and you have to suspend disbelief quickly, or you'll be thinking, "special effect...special effect...special effect" thoughout the film. And Jackson did that brilliantly.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:45 a.m. CST

    George Lucas Then and Now-

    by Jobacca

    This article about sums it up Fuck CGI....fuck it right up its poorly rendered green-screen ass!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:46 a.m. CST

    Arrggh...article link

    by Jobacca

  • June 29, 2009, 11:46 a.m. CST

    all werewolf movies, cgi or practical

    by mitortilla

    werewolf transformation looks silly and crappy.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:48 a.m. CST


    by HaterofCrap


  • June 29, 2009, 11:48 a.m. CST

    CGI vs practical

    by Moshi

  • June 29, 2009, 11:48 a.m. CST

    D. Vader

    by half vader

    I think I did post in the TF2INO thread that you couldn't even DO a live-action TF movie without CG - and that if you're going to make it like that, push that CG as far as it can go. But yeah. Jesus that flick sucked. I was just sort of amazed (finally watched it last night) how sucky. But yes, that has nothing to do with CG itself. <p> And yeah I keep saying in these TBs that there will NEVER be a time when we will be completely fooled. Ever. Because these movies show us stuff which CAN'T possibly be real. Where our brains are concerned that's both the anachronism AND the fascination. <p> The irony is that's why we GO to movies and are into genre fiction. The idiocy is that these people are COMPLAINING about it! Genre and outrageous fiction have completely taken over mainstream media and the nerds are STILL complaining!! Inherited the Earth - and STILL not happy!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:50 a.m. CST

    I think the main problem with the anti-CGI-movement is...

    by DerLanghaarige

    ...that people only think "CGI = bad", because the good CGI is invisible! They only notice the bad effects, because, well, they are bad and therefore visible!

  • June 29, 2009, 11:57 a.m. CST

    by Moshi

    the reason CGI often looks poor is because the director thinks that he'll get something special, despite a small budget, & shoots his scenes with high hopes. Once the footage is shot, there's no going back if later on the CGI looks ropey. With practcal effects, it's there to see as they shoot, so if it looks bad, they compensate by rethinking the way the scene is shot, ie hide it in shadow, edit around it. That's why Alien looks good, it hides the rubber suit, & Alien 3 looks awful because the animated puppet ( not CG I know, but it follows the same post production principles)was added after the background shots were done. CGI is currently way better than practicle for anything with any movement involved. Tight close ups, practical, everything else is best done with CGI.

  • June 29, 2009, 11:59 a.m. CST

    Half Vader - some excellent points

    by toadkillerdog

    I would argue that CGI started way before 1989 though. The Last Starfighter was the first fully realized all CGI effects movie. And you can go back to Tron for the first really groundbreaking usage. <p> However, I do like your taking people to task for not knowing their history and for parroting the 'company' line bullshit. Kids gotta learn.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:01 p.m. CST

    Stan Winston is dead, thus

    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    we will never see good practical FX again. Fuckin Monster Squad remake... bullshit.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:02 p.m. CST

    Redmond & Jobacca

    by half vader

    Bad analogies, but I get your point. <p> There was crowd replacement/extension in Robert Wise's original The Day the Earth Stood Still. And it was done for exactly the same reason it's done now. Money. They moved the crowd around and did a photochemical quadrupal exposure. Wise couldn't afford what Lean did in foreign countries where they'd work for almost nothing. Nowadays they can't afford to pay shit (or no pay but meals and drinks) like then. In America or elsewhere. <p> Jobacca. same deal. That pic's funny and ironic, but there was more model work in episode 1 than all 3 previous 'old-school' pics combined. That you don't know that says a lot. Also, there's no difference at ALL between greenscreen and what they used to use - bluescreen. Both used in the same way for the same result. On Alien 4 even redscreen was used. On Spiderman everything was shit because the colour of the screen , digital or photochemical is generally predicated by the absence of that colour in the foreground elements they're trying to extract. On Spiderman 1 they were annoyed because they had a red-and-blue costumed guy fighting a green costumed guy! But there's much more latitude with digital. You don't even have to light the screen so much. It used to be blue because there was less grain structure there for a better edge matte.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:03 p.m. CST

    Following Moshi's thinking

    by skimn

    I think why there has been no good CGI werewolves, without looking cartoonish, is because directors think they can show every detail in CGI. They should rely on mood and careful lighting in combination with CGI.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:06 p.m. CST

    There are good CGI Werewolves.

    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    Let us not forget Van Helsing. haha

  • June 29, 2009, 12:08 p.m. CST

    Speaking of CGI Werewolves...

    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    Im curious about the FX in Wolfman coming out. I think it's a nice little mindfuck to see such old films being remade but i'm not enjoying the line up they're rumoring. Next is supposed to be Bride of Frankenstein, I mean come on, that's untouchable. After that is Creature from the Black Lagoon, personally my favorite horror film of all time, wouldn't mind to see a nice fresh take on that.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:08 p.m. CST

    Harry, Rick Baker is heavy into CG now

    by cookepuss

    Before you bang that practical effects drum too loudly, in one artist's name no less, consider the fact that Rick is HEAVILY into CG nowadays. He's a regular contributor to the ZBrush Community, under the name "monstermaker".<p> <p> One such thread by Rick, of many: <p> <p> Rick has also written several CG sculpting tutorial for Gnomon:<p> <p> <p> <p> <p> As a CG artist myself... Give up the ghost Harry. Practical effects are great, but they are also practically limited and can only achieve so much. The technology behind CG is moving so quickly that the need for practical work to achieve photoreality will be gone - on a regular basis - before you know it.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:09 p.m. CST

    CGI does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    "CGI is currently way better than practicle for anything with any movement involved."<p> NO! The reason CGI is shit is because 90% of movies take it too far. They stretch credibility, 'because they can'. Suddenly they have their CGI creations jumping up walls, charging down tunnels, making huge leaps with no adherence to the laws of physics, friction, or gravity. It's 'movement' that comes off worst of all.<p> You know I ROBOT and I AM LEGEND could have been decent dystopic sci-fi movies but they were both fucked up by this sort of thinking.<p> Why have a bunch of CG robots hanging on Will Smith's car and jumping all around the tunnel during a high speed chase? It looked about as real a a fucking Loony Tunes cartoon. Why have those CG plague vampires running up the walls and sucking the drama and reality of the situation away (fuck just give em a bit of make up and red contact lenses like 28 DAYS LATER, save a fortune and looks twice as good). And these are just two of the literally hundreds of genre films that CG has fucked up.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:09 p.m. CST


    by half vader

    Yeah I know, and bits and bobs in Star Wars, Trek 2, even Westworld and so on, but I went with Abyss (and not even Young Sherlock or Willow) as the marker because the unbroken digital line sort of starts there, (and it was in concert with digital compositing - as I recall a scene in Flash Gordon had a single digital composite too). You're right though, I didn't articulate that one very well. The main thrust was in reference to the AICN readers' ages, that we only have to go back to 89 to say they never knew a time before it, and can't accurately comment on beforehand.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:12 p.m. CST


    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    We meet again. I surely agree for the most part of your argument, especially the laws of physics part, but you're not saying that all CGI is bad are you? I've seen some incredible CG myself and I personally love Practical FX. Like I posted earlier, I feel we're entering a new era with CGI, the 2012 trailer kind of led me on to this.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:13 p.m. CST


    by sheepshagger

    this will be

  • June 29, 2009, 12:14 p.m. CST

    Rsanta, before you go bashing harry...

    by D.Vader

    You might want to recheck who wrote this article.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:15 p.m. CST

    Benicio does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    How excited are tb'ers by the forthcoming Benicio Del Toro Wolfman?<p> I'm kinds curious to see it, rather than excited to see it. Not yet sold on Benicico being able to carry a movie. Any opinions?

  • June 29, 2009, 12:20 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    No Dr, I am saying that 90% of CG heavy movies take it too far - they stretch credibility or misuse CG and in that moment, where the effect reveals itself to be false, they lose a little chink of truth from the film.<p> That still leaves 10% of movies that get it right... STARSHIP TROOPERS, T2, LOTR, THE MATRIX, KINGDOM OF HEAVEN, a few off the top of my head.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:22 p.m. CST

    half vader

    by toadkillerdog

    Considering the mean age of AICN readers/posters - which I really am just guessing at based on the comments and level of understanding of various issues shown, it is very surprising that their would be so much negativity towards really good CGI, as opposed to the shitty stuff.<p> I kind of liken it to people saying analog is better than digital for music. In that case I think it comes down to appreciation of turn table and needles, vs the ease and clear sound of digital. I have audiophile friends who will fight to the death proclaiming analog as the best. <p> I think some of it just comes from people wanting to run counter to the conventions of the day. For me, a high end Analog is equal to or slightly superior than digital. But it is still a subjective thing. <p> I think high end CGI is equal to and in some cases superior than practical - but not always. It is subjective.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:28 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    "I think high end CGI is equal to and in some cases superior than practical - but not always. It is subjective." toadkiller, i'd love to see a versus battle between the fantastic CGI shots of Davy Jones tentacle covered face in POTC 2 and a practical effects wiz trying to create the same effect. I think in that particular case the CG might win.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:29 p.m. CST

    There are two kinds of people in this world.

    by The Reluctant Austinite

    Half Vader's argument is very practical. However, I've never felt that AICN was created to be a practical film fan site. There are two kinds of people and two kinds of film fans out there: practicalists and dreamers. Harry and Quint are dreamers (and so am I). The practicalists will be the ones that site "Transformers" $200 million week as a huge success and sign of its ultimate quality and mass appeal. The bottom line matters most to them. Dreamers use a more illusive (and frustrating to practicalists) measuring stick. Dreamers like nostalgia, while practicalists generally HATE the idea of nostalgia; they think old is old and should be discarded for the new and better. Dreamers like to idolize heroes, while the practical side likes success and work better in a structured corporate environment. They don't need Gods to worship, just hardline facts and company ballance books. As kids, dreamers were better at English and Literature and likely not very good at Math and Science, while practicalists were Math and Science wizes and thought interpreting Literature was silly and worthless. Nether side is wrong, it's just two different world views and brain types. I'm one of those that would be very sad to see a world without heroes.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:30 p.m. CST

    WHY Cobra?

    by half vader

    Because certain PEOPLE get all excited. Like my earlier example of Landis getting too excited and blasting the werewolf with light, I, Robot and I am Legend had the same problem. You can make the argument CG had nothing to do with that. And yep as I said, movement in cg AND makeup/animatronics is often the falldown. So either technique is NOT the problem. <p> Although the ONLY thing I would defend about Legend (which I really didn't like - especially the poor-man's CHris Cunnignham/Come to Daddy-which WAS the inspiration-design), is the running about. They DID try it practically, with stuntpeople. They're vampires though. Which means they're running around at night right? Even WITH trained stunties and wires or whatever, there was just no getting around that real people are looking out for obstacles and trying not to break their fucking necks. It. Didn't. Work. But in the script these things ARE literally out for blood. Now which approach serves character and story better? CG. But speaking of that, it's disingenuous to say CG fucked up the adaptation of IAL. The fact that the writers didn't even UNDERSTAND the context and even the meaning of the title will give you a clue. Writers and directors need to step up. Kaufman can do it. Others can't. This why we've been getting superhero movies for the last decade - because the work of combining writing and visuals has been FOR them to a great degree in the source material. <p> I, Robot's biggest problems are a star and writers whose pop-culture ebonics obscure and distract from the central racial/slavery allegory. And the biggest embarrassment for me in that chase even beyond overkill (redundant in a story about killer robots but anyway) is the old cliché of the hero getting out of it by luck/accident. Zero character progression, and as Hitchcock said, action IS character. I have a bias in that example but I think those points are fair. I get your "because they can" thing though. Absolutely.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:33 p.m. CST

    Benicio Del Toro IS Che Wolfman!

    by skimn

    The revolution begins<p><p>at full moon...

  • June 29, 2009, 12:35 p.m. CST

    The anti-CGI strawman.

    by rbatty024

    I don't think anyone is saying we should get rid of a useful tool, just that it is overused and in many cases doesn't look as good as older special effects. The American Werewolf transformation is more realistic looking than anything in Van Helsing, for example. When CGI first became popular in films like Spider-Man it looked like special effects had regressed several decades. <p> However, everyone who is wary of too much CGI pretty much admits that it can be used to great effect if it's in the right hand. Claiming that people are Luddites because they are cautious of a new technology is attacking an argument that isn't being offered.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:39 p.m. CST


    by Dr. Samuel Loomis

    Starship Troopers was amazing, but it kind of fell under the goofy CG at times. Kingdom of Heaven had great CGI I just couldn't get into the movie, it was kind of like Alexander with me, however I made it all the way through KOH I couldnt do it with Alexander.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:42 p.m. CST

    Uhh..someone compared to AWIL to Underworld?

    by ScottinDC

    Series seriously want the Underworld fags to do the remake of American Werewolf in London cuz 'those werewolves kicked Baker's ass'? I HOPE you're being funny. You must. No..I'm certain of it. The CGI in the Underworld films remains some of the lowest budget and cheesiest looking shit ever; I'm not judging the quality of the films - they're semi-guilty pleasures but the CGI? Ass on a stick, mate.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:43 p.m. CST

    Best use of CGI everyone overlooks

    by skimn

    Finchers amazing recreation of '70s era San Fransisco in Zodiac. I think thats the "invisible CGI" someone mentioned earlier.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:45 p.m. CST


    by half vader

    I get your point, but gross oversimplification. My argument may be practical, but I've sited many times why a sequence like the Walker scene from Empire is indefensible even in terms of internal logic, yet still a great and all-time classic sequence because it works for emotional logic. Which is generally more important. <p> Don't lump me in by making a gross oversimplification with the box-office/grosses thing. A huge sign of success? Sure. Mass appeal? Yep. Quality? No fucking way. Shrek made squillions and is a piece of utter shit with hardly any redeeming qualities. Same for Polar Express. Same for Mamma Mia. Your dreamers/practical thing isn't very well thought out. And even the statement about AICN being created to be a 'dreamers' site has nothing necessarily to do with the people who post in the TBs. Harry IS a dreamer. But he can't write for SHIT. Grammar and spelling and even a lucid through-line are abysmal for someone who gets PAID (which is the true definition of professional) to write. It's not even good CONVERSATIONAL writing. I suck at Maths and Science, and topped English and Art. You don't even come off like a dreamer, but you may well be pretty damned stoned! And nostalgia practically defines our generation and why we're in here talking about hundred million dollar movies based on our childhoods. Jay-zus!

  • June 29, 2009, 12:51 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Yeah, I think Verhoeven's a good example of a guy that's produced great work with both practical fx and CGI.<p> I 'believed' in the bugs in STARSHIP TROOPERS, but less so with the Gorilla turning invisible in THE HOLLOW MAN. That was a hugely ambitious shot to try and pull off, and I don't think they quite nailed it.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:55 p.m. CST

    the two main reasons why the original was great...

    by itsjust_notcool_anymore_baby

    chemistry and the humor between the actors (especially the actors who played David and Jack). Also, the transformation scene. Two reasons that will be %100 negated in a fucking remake. I say remake can eat my shit.

  • June 29, 2009, 12:57 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Half Vader, yeah I agree with your points about I ROBOT except for the running bit. You're telling me a dozen stuntmen couldn't run across a stretch of park without it being a health hazard? Just give em 6g of white vader and tell em to run like maniacs. How fucking hard is that? (can I cite the famous 'running zombies' of 28 DAYS LATER again).<p> Action scenes are more believeable and imho more exciting when you can clearly tell its a stuntman rather than CG.

  • June 29, 2009, 1 p.m. CST

    Yeah rbatty but you're contrasting

    by half vader

    the best of oldschool near the end of it's evolution to really awful cg (with the shittiest out-of-context cg camera moves ever) at the ostensible START of it's curve. Apples and oranges dude. <p> And Spidey doing what he does where they make him hit poses from the comics or hit a wall at a rate the laws of physics tell us he can't survive but the characterisation tells us he can is one of those things that will ALWAYS look wrong. Same with the Hulk jumping miles at a time. He did it in the comics and they kept it. But a photoreal being of that size and mass and therefore momentum and inertia can NEVER have that ability. And I don't know if you can make a qualitative statement about things regressing decades when it A) wasn't even an option the old way; and B) is a character thing that will ALWAYS requite a heaping helping of suspension of disbelief. And I have no problem with suspending mine. <p> Also, I would hope that I'm one of those who are cautious but embrace new tech. But there ARE heaps of folk just literally stating CG is shit outright in here, which is what gets me started in every one of these practical FX type Tbs. Cheers.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:01 p.m. CST

    Half Vader, that's just what a practicalist would say.

    by The Reluctant Austinite

    I'm kidding, brotha! I'm not stoned. I've only smoked a hand full of times in my life, and it's really not my thing. Art is a VERY subjective thing, and when mixed with commerse in the way that Hollywood must, it's going to cause lots of arguments. I'm of the school that GCI is a tool, but it isn't the only tool. The best use of CGI is when the film maker has chosen the best tool for each shot and not just decided to use one tool for the whole job. Examples like "Jurassic Park" and "ID4" come to mind. Regardless of what any of us thought of the stories and characters, the effects were mixed using many techniques from CGI to models to animatronics and they were very well mixed.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:10 p.m. CST

    Cobra - yeah I AM saying that

    by half vader

    They're running around at full tilt in an area littered with debris - as dictated by the story. It's not nice soft grassy fields or barren streets obscured by flying newspapers in the foreground to make you think there's shit on the ground (which is really clever IMHO). There's concrete and rusted hulks and crap everywhere as there should be in that bit of IAL. They trashed the scene! But like I said that's the ONLY thing I'll defend. The other stuff sucked arse. Bale would never stand for it. Yeah sure I prefer stunties too. They're awesome. But in those PARTICULAR shots I'm talking about they DID try that way and no it didn't work. <p> And lest you think I have no sense of humour whatsoever, fuck YES someone should have kidnapped the OH&S guy and hooked them up with a bit of the old White Vader. <p> Speaking of which, I don't know why my handle regressed to Half Vader when I'm White Vader these days (in His homour). Don't they get rid of your old handle?

  • June 29, 2009, 1:15 p.m. CST

    I bet in the remake

    by Series7

    There will be a chase scene with a girl running from the werewolf, and some point during the chase they will go through a tunnel or hall and the were wolf will leap from the groud to the side of a wall to the ceiling for an instance and then either back down on the ground or ontop of the girl it is chasing.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:22 p.m. CST


    by Series7

    I've only seen the first Underworld and even then I slept/was drunk for 3/4's of it. Though the word Rhona makes me think that I'll sit through part three when FX poops out an edited for time version sometime within the next year. So I'll let you decide if I was joking or not.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:38 p.m. CST

    Cobra - PS, and Austinite

    by half vader

    Cobra - agreed on the gorilla, but I sorta feel it's also good to stretch past the safe and cautious because then you just solidify what has come before rather than point the way into the future. Same thing with the AWWIL transformation. There's stuff where he's so obviously sticking through the floor. The rubber is really obviously rubber stretching over a hard surface. But if we'd waited for digital removal to facilitate ease of performer movement, and waited for silicon skin to hit it's stride for more convincing look with the stretching then we'd have waited decades longer for something that's completely awesome and you don't really notice anyway the first and most important time. If you're watching the seams at that moment you're not watching the movie. Which is different to watching it all these years later with all our baggage and a detached viewpoint. Yes I make all these practical arguments, but we still need to know when to be critical in the pursuit of excellence in MAKING the film and when to know what's important when WATCHING and feeling the film. Long live Dick Smith, long live Ray Harryhausen! Long live Dennis Muren! <p> And when it's cg it's interesting to note that people rave about Gollum and it's the fantastic performance and animation in concert, and no-one notices in his introductory scene (as I recall, don't quote me verbatim here) that wind and hair may be flying but Gollum's isn't at all (and no, I didn't notice at first either). Which makes no practical/logical sense, but if you're watching THAT then it's getting in the WAY and you just missed a great scene. It's about picking battles. Make his hair move when people won't notice because he's all blurry from moving so much anyway, or spend longer on the split personalitymonologue/dialogue to tweak the tiny stuff? That's what I mean. <p> Austinite, I guess we agree on a lot then after all, just not the B.O. Gross and 2 types thing. On JP the fx were intercut more than mixed, which makes sense because tracking cg onto a practical plate (Galli stampede being the main one) was er, prehistoric compared to now where you can actually mix cg pieces with prosthetic fx like Del Toro likes to do or Terminator 3 & 4. I get what you meant though. But yep - I love the "best of all worlds" approach.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:43 p.m. CST

    Series 7, is the 1st Underworld the one where

    by half vader

    the werewolves run on the walls/ceiling? But don't seem to go any faster by doing so, so why do it at all?! That was so bizarre. Even if it was to look cool while successfully catching her that'd be something. But as it didn't HELP them it just seemed stupid. Am I remembering that right?

  • June 29, 2009, 1:46 p.m. CST

    Half vader

    by Series7

    I think the running on walls/ceilings is just a staple for all monster movies now. I wonder who created it? I think the success of MIB and its car riding on the ceiling of a tunnel scene had a big impact in the world of runing on ceiling, I just don't know.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:49 p.m. CST

    I feel that practical effects and CGI

    by Series7

    Should be treated like the Montagues and Capulets of the movie world and neither shall be seen with the other.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:52 p.m. CST

    Original is GENIUS! a perfect film.

    by FleshMachine

    perfect blend of comedy and horror...great FX...great acting.

  • June 29, 2009, 1:56 p.m. CST

    Dog Soldier Wolves were awesome

    by mitortilla

    I hope they give this movie to Neil Marshall.

  • June 29, 2009, 2 p.m. CST

    Dredd does not exist in this dojo

    by Cobra--Kai

    My vote for the best Romeo & Juliet marriage of practical and CG is LOTR.<p> Doubt if anyone can answer this, but I haven't seen Stallone's JUDGE DREDD for years and am trying to remember - near the start there's a long aerial shot that swoops over Mega City. An fx shot that really wowed me at the time. Is it a practical shot with models or a CG one?

  • June 29, 2009, 2:02 p.m. CST

    The Orcs in Fellowship of the Ring did it...

    by D.Vader

    Back in 2001 (running on ceilings), but I feel like when we first got a glimpse of that in the very first trailer for the film, there were some people saying it looked like it had been influenced by a previous film in which the monsters ran on the ceiling. <p> But I'm drawing a blank as to which film it could have been...

  • June 29, 2009, 2:06 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    EXORCIST 3 had a possessed old lady crawling on the ceiling.<p> Lionel Richie also danced on the ceiling back in the Eighties. I think he's the true innovator.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:09 p.m. CST


    by TedKordLives

    I just re-watched Judge Dredd a few months back and that shot was practical, at least for the most part. Great fucking shot, probably the best thing in the whole movie. <P> Except that all the main characters mock Sly's voice/delivery. That shit's hilarious.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:10 p.m. CST

    Kurosawa Himself Admitted Yojimbo Was A Ripoff

    by mdf2

    Of Dashiell Hammett's *Red Harvest* (and visually inspired by the film version of *The Glass Key*), when a friend once asked him why he never sued *A Fistfull of Dollars* for ripping off *Yojimbo*.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:13 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    Ted, cheers buddy. Yeah I remember that shot as beig mighty impressive, not quite as elegant as the BLADE RUNNER aerial swoop perhaps but far better than the rest of the Dredd movie deserved!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:17 p.m. CST

    Here's the actual story...

    by mdf2

    As it turns out, it was a story that was told by Roger Corman to the late David Carradine, so it may be apocryphal, and if such evidence surfaces to disprove it, I'll freely admit I'm wrong.<P> Carradine mentioned it in his book Spirit of Shaolin.<P> "Let me tell you a story. When FIST FULL OF DOLLARS opened in Tokyo, Kurosawa's friends called him up and said `You must see this picture.'<P> Kurosawa replied, "Yes I understand it is rather like YOJIMBO.'<P> `No, it's not like YOJIMBO; it is YOJIMBO. You have to sue these people.'<P> `I can't sue them,' he responded.<P> `Why not?'<P> `Because,' Kurosawa confessed, `YOJIMBO is Dashiel Hammet's RED HARVEST."<P>

  • June 29, 2009, 2:17 p.m. CST

    by Cobra--Kai

    'Yojimbo' - they had to cut that line of dialogue from the new STAR TREK in case Kurosawa sued.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:20 p.m. CST

    I love Judge Dredd the movie

    by Series7

    I know it sucks but I can't help myself. Demolition Man is better, Sly should re-boot that. Well once Snipes is out of prison. Wait I guess he wouldn't be in a sequel.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:30 p.m. CST

    Cobra Kai, whatchoo mean about Yojimbo in Trek?

    by D.Vader

    I'm not getting the joke or the reference? <p> Maybe I should do a pile of White Vader to help.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:43 p.m. CST

    Joe Johnston's The Wolfman

    by skimn

    Because of his vast experience in the effects field, I hope he keeps the CGI limited to set extension, and let Rick Baker do his thing with the character makeups. Even keep the gore, if any, practical.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:45 p.m. CST


    by skimn

    which I believe his Wolfman will remain a biped, more man than wolf, where most lately have been more animal in nature.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:54 p.m. CST

    Can someone blow-up Hollywood please?

    by HerbWestAustin

    When is the remake of Casablanca starring Shia Lebouf coming out?

  • June 29, 2009, 2:57 p.m. CST

    Joe Johnston's The Wolfman WILL SUCK!

    by Series7

    Because its not going to be directed by the master auetuer behind such perfect movies like One Hour Photo. OR at least thats what Harry told us.

  • June 29, 2009, 2:57 p.m. CST


    by half vader

    There was a big deal made at the time though about a shuttle or something that was really large in frame and CG. Came really close to camera which was a breakthrough (I have a foggy notion it was used as a wipe)... that's my vague memory. I'll have to look at the Cinefex, or my old laserdisc! <p> Dredd sucks, but Chris Cunningham's (he was Chris Halls at the time) animatronic ABC warrior and prosthetic Mean Machine makeup are mega-cool. Halls/Cunningham started out as a bit of a Bisley clone on the comic itself. What's the story/urban legend? He was like 18/19 and head of the art dept/sculpting on Alien 3 or something? Or was it this movie? I have vague recollections he was on Nightbreed too... I need to take my own advice and do the homework. But it's 6 in the morning and time for bed. <p> Of course Alien 3 had a lot of running about on ceilings. What was that? 93? Yes, we must all bow to Lionel Ritchie. Although I don't think he chased down and killed anyone. Not that I recall... <p> Trek-"Yojimbo". That's terrible dude. Dad joke!

  • June 29, 2009, 2:58 p.m. CST


    by Series7

    you mean Transformers 2: Die Harder isn't a Casablanca reboot?

  • June 29, 2009, 3 p.m. CST


    by Glory_Fades_ImMaxFischer

  • June 29, 2009, 3:05 p.m. CST

    The original is a load of shit

    by EdgarWright

    The fucking Paris one is better than the original and that was still crap. Bring on the remake I say. Anyone who still likes the original is a fucking idiot, plain and simple.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:05 p.m. CST

    I mean Landis

    by Series7

    Is a huge tool, so it doesn't really surprise me that he would try to make a buck off of one of the few great things he did.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:09 p.m. CST

    I fucked a werewolf once..

    by dudemandude

    just sayin..

  • June 29, 2009, 3:13 p.m. CST

    Oh. Yojimbo. I get it.

    by D.Vader

    I wonder if Sawyer has called Jin something to that effect in LOST. "Yo, Jinbo!"

  • June 29, 2009, 3:19 p.m. CST

    The original is kind of shitty

    by lockesbrokenleg

    But then again, i always thought werewolves were stupid.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:22 p.m. CST

    I'm nervous about the Wolfman remake

    by half vader

    Because of those stories about guys covering up monitors when Baker was around, and not having asked him at the time to supervise the cg stuff. I hope to God they saw reason in the end and he is consulting. No-one could have more of a commitment to excellence and passion for this particular project than Baker. They can only benefit. I hope they do a Jurassic Park. Tippett was dismayed about the turn to digital and had been doing animatics in stop-motion, but rather than turfing him they used his eye and knowledge and had him train the CG animators about movement and character, and the digital guys also developed a type of naked armature with accelerometers for the stop-motion guys to use so that their work method would be utilised and the information fed into the computers. Great stuff. Best of both worlds, even where the CG was concerned. Although there was no procedural stuff like skin/muscle/fat jiggle and apparently it had to be moved frame-by-frame. Tedious. But worth it and essentially what stop-motion guys would have had to do anyway. <p> And I've said this before too but JP is a great example of the director getting carried away with new toys as I said to Cobra Kai before. The crappy deus-ex-machina ending came because SS was so enamoured that he just HAD to take advantage of the new toy even at the last minute. Which is why we get this total surprise (how DID a t-rex get in there, and so quietly?!) with the rex & raptors. And from the king of telegraphic/buildup. He even telegraphs the raptors, but the rex comes totally out of left field. I had the script breakdown before the film came out and it was supposed to be a sort of powerloader/queen deal with the rex vs earthmoving equipment sort of thing and you can see how it would have played out but we got the "more cg instead". You can just tell it's been shoehorned in there. Really blatant, clunky, and not in keeping with the rest of the film or Spielberg's usual approach. I think I have it in a box somewhere... <p> And Series, it IS Romanek. He also gave us a heap of the greatest music videos of all time. He's used digital FX but in stuff like the Nine Inch Nails Closer video he even used an original hand-wound silent film camera. He's no hack MTV type, whether you like One Hour Photo or not.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:27 p.m. CST

    Did Gus Van Rant think of this?

    by Chief Redcock

    It sounds like one of his crackpot schemes. I'm starting with the maaan in the mirror. . .

  • June 29, 2009, 3:28 p.m. CST

    Half Vader, I believe you're confused

    by D.Vader

    The original Jurassic Park ending had Grant working some construction vehicle to crush the raptors and drop the skeletons on them. I gotta say, though, the Rex surprise was fantastic. Why didn't they hear him coming? Come on, its movie magic. And the Rex came through that same big gaping hole in the side of the building that the 2nd Raptor came from (the one from the power shed). You can see the bright light shining through. <p> Granted, I had to watch the film a few times on home video to work it all out.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:31 p.m. CST

    I don't know about all this

    by Series7

    I do know that I will finally see the movie that Harry's fucking animation is based off of this week.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:38 p.m. CST

    Yeah I know it was Romanek

    by Series7

    And I know about his great music video career, he is part of the great video directors DVD set. I was mocking Harry's fanaticism about him no longer doing the movie. I'm sorry there was just no reason to go ape shit about him leaving the project. <P> Imagine hearing the David Fincher was going to direct something after Alien 3, you wouldn't really care. Sure Romanek is a great music director, but he hasn't done enough with a movie to make me care about him getting replaced yet. I mean check out the credientials of the guy who directed Torque, he is like the greatest music director out there right now. But a good music video director does not always mean they will be great at movies.

  • June 29, 2009, 3:59 p.m. CST

    Fuck CG

    by christian66

    It's become the laziest tool in the paintkit these days. And sorry, physical makeup effects are SUPERIOR in every way to CG makeup effects. That troll in LOTR is going to look like pixel ass in a coupla years while HR Giger's Alien monster will always look fresh and alive. CG has turned most efx movies into cookie-cutter bores.

  • June 29, 2009, 4:08 p.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    Ithink this will be the second remake of Pirahna!

  • June 29, 2009, 4:10 p.m. CST


    by DrMorbius

    Not a debate, just a matter of preference.<P>The HOWLING is my favorite too!!!

  • June 29, 2009, 4:26 p.m. CST

    CG vs Practical Makeup Effects

    by Continentalop

    This is like a crappy version of the old "My Six Dragon Style is superior to your Flying Mantis Kung Fu" arguments you would get on kung fu theatre. <p> CGI and makeup effects are TOOLs, just like how a handheld, steadicam and dolly shots are all TOOLS. It is how you choose to use them that makes them work or not, and a bad director (or a good director making a bad decision) will sometimes chose the wrong tool. Fuck, look at all the bad shaky cam recently - no one is saying we should ban handheld cameras, they are just saying directors are lazy and unimaginative. Well, the same goes for their use of CG.

  • June 29, 2009, 4:58 p.m. CST

    You Can't Remake Perfection !!!!

    by TheThing

    Remaking An American Werewolf in London is an absolutely ridiculous idea, as it simply cannot be improved upon (hence why it's close to my heart and is my favourite movie of all time). Every single time the studios attempt this, it doesn't come off e.g. The Omen (shocking attempt), Psycho, Halloween (terrible remake), etc, etc PLEASE - PROVIDE US WITH SOME ORIGINAL HORROR MOVIES, STOP LOOKING AT THE PAST

  • June 29, 2009, 4:59 p.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    After all, I'm sure that's where it'll shoot.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:01 p.m. CST


    by lockesbrokenleg

  • June 29, 2009, 5:01 p.m. CST

    A cockney Werewolf in New York

    by sheepshagger

    I might watch that

  • June 29, 2009, 5:04 p.m. CST

    For fucks sake...

    by grendel69

    NO. A thousand times NO. This remake insanity MUST stop.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:12 p.m. CST


    by Continentalop

    Cast a rapper, we call it a day.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:25 p.m. CST

    A Republican Werewolf at Woodstock

    by mitortilla

  • June 29, 2009, 5:31 p.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    That's beautiful, Continentalop. Simply beautiful. How the Wayans Brothers didn't think of it first, I'll never know. (Side note: Mos Def cast in a seriously faithful version would work.)

  • June 29, 2009, 5:34 p.m. CST

    I just watched Deep Blu Sea...

    by pdennett316

    And the animatronic sharks were fucking great, but the CG was a huge pile of ass. That came out 6 years after Jurassic Park, and is more proof that it's how talented the artist is that determines the quality of CGI. <p> I like Del Toro's use of CG in creating some of his awesome nightmare visions in Pan's Labyrinth, the CG really helped the practical makeup achieve some horrific looking monsters. <p> I Am Legend however was a joke, stupid fucking stretchy-mouthed bulgy-eyed pieces of garbage. A combo of stuntmen and CGI techniques would have worked well assuming they had some patience to do the work. Wire work could have achieved the stupid jumping and wall-walking shots....that movie featured full on CGI for absolutely no fucking logical reason.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:46 p.m. CST

    They need to remake...

    by HapaPapa72

    Laserblast...alienated, picked-on teen who gets confidence, self-esteem, and a really bad facial transformation after finding some badass alien laser weapon in the desert.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:58 p.m. CST

    It's harmless to do a remake. But...

    by strosmer

    it is futile to try to improve upon the original. Unless the original was complete crap, in which case, please feel free to improve upon it in every aspect, or as needed.<p>End of argument! You may all go to bed now. Or eat your supper if its not too late.

  • June 29, 2009, 5:59 p.m. CST

    Someone update Flash Gordon

    by lockesbrokenleg

    That Sci Fi show was just shit.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:02 p.m. CST

    I am directing a stage version of American Werewolf!

    by DrunkenBusboy

    No BS I got permission from John Landis himself. It will be based on the BBC Radio version written by Dirk Maggs! 3 shows only this Halloween in Freeport, Maine! Admission is FREE! Stay Tuned!

  • June 29, 2009, 6:27 p.m. CST

    What scares me is the potential remake of THE THING

    by blakindigo

    as an all CGI monster fest. I love CG when used appropriately ("Benjamin Button:,"Children of Men") but, the work by Rob Bottin and his team was simply jaw-dropping. The work by the top VFX companies often do miraculous work, I'm just disturbed that most of these classics aren't respected.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:34 p.m. CST

    blakindigo, The Thing WAS a remake!

    by Continentalop

    But I know you know that - you're like a little library of "b" and genre movie facts. But I know what you mean, if they remade John Carpenter's The Thing about a shape-shifting alien. <p> Personally I have no problem with a Thing remake as long as the monster is DIFFERENT. Shit, every 20 some years they should remake it with a new type of monster - vegetable man for the first, shape-shifter for 80s version, and for a new one, I don't know, maybe some kind of creature that transforms you like the monster in Quatermass Experiment.

  • June 29, 2009, 6:50 p.m. CST

    Thanks Continentalop—

    by blakindigo

    —You're no slouch yourself. ;)

  • June 29, 2009, 6:59 p.m. CST

    An American Werewolf in Sex and the City

    by andrew coleman

    I would like to see one of those tear up those hags. Take that either way you like.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:04 p.m. CST


    by MCVamp

    Practically writes itself.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:05 p.m. CST

    Half Vader your long post was gospel-PREACH!!

    by blakindigo

    I agree with almost everything you wrote—although you lost me with the "pop-culture ebonics" bit. Will Smith is actually quite analytical and precise in what he's doing; he doesn't need to pander by using 'hip hop' shorthand because he knows the market well enough.<br><br>I applaud you in standing up for VFX artists who, burdened with tighter deadlines and shrinking budgets still manage to produce high caliber work.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:06 p.m. CST

    an american bad idea in hollywood

    by echobase

    why... why... why ?

  • June 29, 2009, 7:07 p.m. CST

    MCVamp—my God, that's effing brilliant!!

    by blakindigo

  • June 29, 2009, 7:14 p.m. CST

    Landis joins the Sell Your Soul For A Hot Dog Club!

    by venvariants

    Maybe he should do a movie with DeNiro or Pacino now...they are part of that club as well!

  • June 29, 2009, 7:15 p.m. CST

    new WEREWOLF will look like FROM DUSK TILL DAWN

    by Six Demon Bag

    cheesy and utterly forgettable.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:17 p.m. CST

    The bloodline of the remaker must be severed

    by BrandLoyalist

    The Remade will walk the Earth until this is done. Someone draw a pentangle around Brian De Palma! <br><br> A black comic tone and quadrupedal werewolves would constitute a sequel to me... no need to try to mimic Landis' style or any particular scene. A fake dream sequence is NOT required. Also, no need to update the bungee jumping scene from the Paris movie.

  • June 29, 2009, 7:20 p.m. CST

    Get Edgar Wright as director —

    by blakindigo

    That might prove interesting, but really, what direction could a new version of AWWIL take?

  • June 29, 2009, 8 p.m. CST

    I do.

    by Michael_Bay_Rox


  • June 29, 2009, 8:03 p.m. CST

    Who thinks remakes are a good idea?

    by zcapcomkid

    From Robin hood to Robocop, whats next?! Beetlejuice!? Dude, why not just make original movies rather than re-makes..people are going to see the movie as long as that stars face is in why not be original? AND STOP DOING REMAKES!

  • June 29, 2009, 8:10 p.m. CST


    by Crytenboy

    Why the HELL does anyone feel the need to remake this flick? To me, this is a movie that stands the test of time. I must have been 12 or 13 the first time I saw the movie, and it made me laugh and scared the hell out of me at the same time. I saw it again when I was in my 20's, and it produced the same reactions out of me, plus that sweet feeling of nostalgia.Ditto in my 30's. In fact, whenever this movie is on cable or satellite, I will watch it everytime. That creature is one of the best, most original and unique movie monsters of all time. The stuff of fuckin nightmares. More giant wolverine than wolf, and made from plastic, fur, and animatronics. Not a computer in sight. This flick WORKS. Doesn't need CGI, doesn't need revamping or updating, doesn't need a young hip cast...this movie doesn't need a damn thing except to have the DVD lent to folk who haven't seen it. Let the youngsters see that creative and viable horror/gore existed LONG before CGI. I can just see it now......the scene where the were wolf is in the london subway, chasing his victim. Instead of experiencing the victim's terror and the creature's relentlessnes, all by the use of camera angles and motion, going back and forth between the prey and predator, we will get 30 seconds of full on perfectly modeled, excellently rendered fur and realistically animated muscle movement....but the fuckin thing will be SOULESS with dead eyes. CGI for CGI's sake is boring....everyone knows this except for producers. Fuckin' shame. Bullshit like this is the reason that people download torrents instead of going to the cinema.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:11 p.m. CST


    by Mr. Nice Gaius

    Where is Gus Van Rant? And what's the longstanding rivalry between you two all about anyway?

  • June 29, 2009, 8:22 p.m. CST

    Quint your aguments on CGI for this film are right

    by ThePilgrim

    For this films budget it will never reach the quality level required, unless they go Jaws and keep the beasts look a mystery for most of the film. Another sequel. Yeah why not. An American Werewolf in Dubai or something like that.

  • June 29, 2009, 8:26 p.m. CST

    Seriously, who thinks Harry will ever do his DVD reviews...

    by SoylentMean

    ever again?

  • June 29, 2009, 9:08 p.m. CST


    by damiz707

    CGI BLOOD pisses me off every time I see that shit.

  • June 29, 2009, 9:10 p.m. CST

    i think it's a brillian idea to remake this movie

    by SylarTheCylon

    because it will allow the crew, actors and directors to earn money and feed their families. And it will introduce the movie to a new generations, and the geeks of that generation will seek out the original version, and be amazed at the effects of that era. I think this way because i'm not a fucking crybaby who thinks that a new version of a fucking movie will have some sort of effect on my life. Is someone forcing you to watch the fucking thing? FUCK

  • June 29, 2009, 9:15 p.m. CST

    An American Tail: Fievel goes to Paris.

    by mitortilla

  • June 29, 2009, 9:19 p.m. CST

    Harry's still in shock from the Transformers 2

    by lockesbrokenleg

    box office.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:51 p.m. CST

    I've worked in the CGI field before, and personally

    by OutlawsDelejos

    I think it's way over used in film, CG rarely impresses audiences these days.

  • June 29, 2009, 10:51 p.m. CST


    by BringingSexyBack

  • June 30, 2009, 12:16 a.m. CST

    BringingSexyBack...a Werewolf in Koreatown?!

    by conspiracy

    You mean Koreatown out in LA?</p><p>Not much of a horror movie there...That fucker wouldn't stand a chance. If the Sex offenders didn't go full beastiality on him he'd have to avoid gangs of salivating, hungry eyed Koreans carrying big assed spits and armed to the teeth with jars of Kim-chee.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:17 a.m. CST

    An American Werewolf in Bruno

    by half vader

    Or An American Werewolf in Miss Jones (will anyone get that one?)! <p> Cross-licensing FTW!

  • June 30, 2009, 12:23 a.m. CST

    When they gonna remake the 1970s "Gargoyles"?

    by conspiracy

    That fucking movie Rocked hard..when I was like 4. seeing it a few years ago reminded me that the Braless halter tops look needs to make a comeback.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:24 a.m. CST

    "Gargoyles" was awesome

    by Continentalop

    When I was a kid. I am afraid to see it now for fear it won't hold up.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:30 a.m. CST

    Un Hombre lobo de Mexico en Inglewood con Cesar Millan

    by conspiracy

  • June 30, 2009, 12:32 a.m. CST is Cheesy Goodness Conti..

    by conspiracy

    "Look..a winged breeder" How can you go wrong with lines like that?

  • June 30, 2009, 12:35 a.m. CST


    by half vader

    It CAN be done right. Fincher in Zodiac used it well, and for solid reasons.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:39 a.m. CST

    Oh Conti, everyone knows

    by half vader

    my Drunken style is best! <p> And good on ya for the shaky-cam one. I missed that in my rant. Props.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:41 a.m. CST

    An American Gigolo in Paris

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 12:45 a.m. CST

    Yeah I might well be confused D.Vader

    by half vader

    But is that the book ending or the earlier script ending you're talking about (I can't remember the book aside from a river bit that didn't make it into the film)? <p> Anyway the main point was Spielberg, who is well known for the technique of "telegraphing" to build suspense (the concentric ripples being his most famous and the music cue in Jaws), and who used it all through JP (ripples, shadows, raptor clicking, the goat setup, etc etc), abandoned it completely there and it's out of whack. Telegraphing and editing tricks are movie magic too. I'm not talking about suspension of disbelief (see the earlier tirade for that stuff). Just the huge inconsistency of last minute changes because of infatuation overcoming judgement. Which is what Cobra was talking about (he didn't believe it was so blatant with directors if I understood right). It's very different to the telegraphing throughout Jaws then the shock moment (but it's already even accounted for in the framing) where the shark unexpectedly appears behind Scheider. That's all I meant.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:46 a.m. CST


    by DrMorbius got nothin'.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:50 a.m. CST

    An American Gigolo Sticks a Werewolf up his asshole

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 12:53 a.m. CST

    Going to have to go out and see Gargoyles again

    by Continentalop

    Maybe a double feature with Satan's School for Girls.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:53 a.m. CST

    An All American Werewolf in Paris

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 12:54 a.m. CST

    An American Teen Wolf in London

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 12:55 a.m. CST

    Drunken Fu, bah!

    by Continentalop

    That is no match for my Coke and Meth Fu! <p> Prepare to fall before my tweaking fists of fury!

  • June 30, 2009, 12:59 a.m. CST

    An American Werewolf Saves Christmas

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 1:04 a.m. CST

    And I would never tell SS how to suck eggs, just to be clear

    by half vader

    - I'm sure he still thinks that was right, and same with walkie-talkies. I just happen to disagree personally with it. I also don't like all the whizzing around in the mines in LOTR. But I completely concede Jackson did exactly what he intended rather than just because he COULD. The dizzying, sickening ride through an overwhelming, perverted (and inverted!) landscape/hell-hole. Sure, I get it. I'm just more into doing it with composition and editing. But it's not like he wasn't self-aware. Shakeycam just perplexes me most of the time. Especially when they're trying to gild the lily in a dialogue scene. The actors must get really pissed that the director feels they need to fuck around like the performance is not compelling enough or something... Even in Batman begins the whole thing made sense until after the container fight. Misdirection, Confusion, disorientation. Sure, fine. After that scene though it's redundant as a narrative tool. And in general, a fight is choreography and SHOULD be filmed like a dance scene. If you can't tell what they're doing, it's directing wankery. And I don't get it, because pretty much ALL the feedback is that the audience DOESN'T like or enjoy it and they don't know what's happening. Which is very different to millions of morons loving Shrek. Why do so many directors persist? Aaargh! Conti has wound me up again! Aaah! <p> Technically in terms of camera placement and movement I love the Pixar films. No matter how fast the cutting, you ALWAYS know what's going on, and what the geography is. Their stuff is so phenomenal in terms of filmmaking proficiency they make it look so easy. And it's really not!

  • June 30, 2009, 1:20 a.m. CST

    It's too bad they never followed these up with

    by ThePilgrim

    An American Zombie in London & An American Vampire In London. <P> Ed Wood: "Money in the Bank."

  • June 30, 2009, 1:21 a.m. CST

    another shakey cam purist

    by mitortilla

    its a fad, it'll go away, same for lens flare. All new styles get big and then directors will get bored till the new thing comes along.

  • June 30, 2009, 1:25 a.m. CST

    An American Idol in London

    by mitortilla

  • June 30, 2009, 1:39 a.m. CST

    Yeah Blankdingo Will Smith CAN be a great actor

    by half vader

    But he keeps choosing to be a STAR, which is different. <p> And yeah, while it used to be an arcane art that pioneers/grandstanders like Warren Newcombe would shroud in mystery and blackmail the studio itself into submission to protect the artists, one side effect of the modern openness in techniques and drawback of the specificity of current director plaything cg previz is that it makes budget and timing estimates so tight and myopic that effects artists these days are asked to do so much better in so little time with so little prep. Things are incredibly restrictive now, both because of AND irrespective of the advancements in technique. In that aspect it certainly WAS easier in the old days where the requirements were more respected. The other thing is that these days some marketing twit sets an end date and books it into theatres before things have even BEGUN. What an arsehole thing to do, and in no way conducive to quality. When all the CG SUX morons wail and moan they never concede THOSE ones.

  • June 30, 2009, 1:46 a.m. CST

    Remake? Really?

    by darthSaul666

    When is someone just going to make a new original movie about something else? Remakes should be reserved for films that weren't real good in the first place. American Werewolf in London is awesome. The FX are still awesome to watch. Why remake?

  • June 30, 2009, 1:58 a.m. CST


    by half vader

    Well, not really. Lens flare came into common usage in the sixties and seventies indy stuff, mainstream eighties and nineties, went away for a bit (while it terrorised photoshop users), came back and possessedeht body of J.J. Abrams. BUT it actually started in 1950 where Akira Kurosawa used it for narrative effect in Rashomon. <p> Shakeycam and handheld was in use in the silent era, French new wave and right up to now. Not a fad either. Which is another reason the current shakey-crazy stuff is weird. Purist? What are you on about? Pay attention dude!

  • June 30, 2009, 2:05 a.m. CST

    Come to think of it, Rashomon had shakeycam too!

    by half vader

    But again, in service to the narrative, not as a wank.

  • June 30, 2009, 3:04 a.m. CST

    The "problem" with CG! half vader

    by Continentalop

    Is that it has become the lazy filmmakers answer to a problem. It is like the old "we'll fix it in post", instead of actually planning a shot or being clever with the camera, directors and producers are now depending on CGI effects to make up for their bad camera choices or lack of originality. It is easier to go tell a guy at a computer to come up with an effect than try to actually figure out how to shoot something while on set. <p> To many filmmakers do not understand the limitations of CG, just like they also don't understand the limitations of practical effects. You can't get just shoot something and then magically have it look good, it has to be pre-planned and well executed. Hence, that is why Spielberg's GG has always been effective (Jurassic Park's dinosaurs still hold up, as do the effects in War of the Worlds and Minority Report) and why the practical effects of Nolan's TDK and Tomas Alfredson's Let the Right One In work well - all three now how to plan a f'ing shot!

  • June 30, 2009, 3:14 a.m. CST

    To the offended CGI artists

    by Ecto-1

    Even the best CGI with the biggest of budgets always looks like a cartoon. Gollum could have easily been done as a puppet and would have looked much cooler. Imagine the suit that rick baker could have created for Jackson's Kong remake... Kong never looked real in that movie. CGI has killed off a superior art form. Puppets and animatronics are real. They have weight and substance to them that CGI can never have. CGI doesn't even exist except as data in a computer. One's and zero's, that's all it is. Fucking pixels! It would have put stop-motion animation out of business but it has managed to still carve out a niche for itself thanks to people like Tim Burton and Henry Selick. But good puppetry has gone. I'd love to see something like The Dark Crystal made, all with puppets and sets and minatures. But instead we get CGI which is always utterly soulless. I don't care what anyone says. I've never liked it and I never will. You can call it nostalgia, but it's nostalgia for a better way.

  • June 30, 2009, 3:23 a.m. CST

    THANK GOD!! Someone else mentions the Shakeycam

    by blakindigo

    and lens flares in SILENT pictures. Geezus, "Man With a Movie Camera" anyone?<br><br>But, what are other challenges to modern VFX artists. When I grew up I would salivate on anything about Doug Trumbull, the late David Allen, Jim Danforth, of course the late Stan Winston, Rob Bottin, Rick Baker, Dick Smith, the Burmans, etc…etc…Currently, it seems like the industry is facing severe times;a lot of shops have closed—look at an old Cinefex from 1995 and see how many of those shops have been consolidated or just went out of business—and it seems to be a tougher road. Audiences demand more, yet the VFX artist gets less time.<br><br>Although the novelty has worn off for for CG, so many producers assume that it will be a faster process than traditional practical effects or SPFX make–up. I love the integration of both as shown by Del Toro and Peter Jackson and we know they understand the limits of both. But, what goes through some peoples minds are just the nadir of any useful approach to these tools. Would "Jaws" be more effective with a 3D animated shark?<br><br>Also, sometimes the audience honestly doesn't know what they're looking at and assume that it's CG when it's a practical effect or vice-versa: "Zodiac" the directors cut is one of those revealing examples, just as Continentalop mentioned "Minority Report," "Jurassic Park," and "War of the Worlds"(that 720 long take around the car was insane).

  • June 30, 2009, 4:30 a.m. CST

    Hollywood, do WEREWOLF BY NIGHT

    by Continentalop

    It was a sometimes good, many times sub-par comic book that Marvel had in the 70s, and it would meet the criteria of what you want to accomplish (get young people) than a remake of AAWIL in London would. <p> Quick synopsis: a young man turns 18 in Malibu, California and finds out he has inherited the family curse of Lycanthropy, Now he tries to figure out how to lift the curse while locking himself up at night so he doesn't accidentally kill someone. <p> That is it - simple, direct, and you don't have to plunder a beloved movie to make it. Cast Zac Efron for all I care. <p> I expect my consulting fee check in the mail.

  • June 30, 2009, 4:39 a.m. CST

    Sure Conti

    by half vader

    Absolutely right. I would slightly disagree about JP, but not just to be contrary. The daytime stuff actually doesn't hold up that well if you look with an objective eye. The first shot really suffers (although it's a fantastic shot and uses the music perfectly), daytime Rex is a bit rough too, and you must admit if you're totally honest with yourself the stuff everybody says still looks fantastic - the t-rex/car attack uses EVERY trick in the book to cover up the cg - rain, night, debris, you name it. And yes "effective" is a very good word to use. Not perfect, effective. <p> But that's all secondary to how beautifully those shots are set up and choreographed. Magically appearing ravines notwithstanding ! ;) I may be a bit harsh a times, but I still hope I can tell what's important in the scheme of things - and JP was the biggest blow-you-out-of-your-seat experience since the first Star Wars. And it must be said that the cg was no qualitatively better or worse than the animatronics - awesome rex, cool triceratops but also super dodgy spitter and baby hatchling. Spielberg is also great at using boards and more recently pre-vis but then getting to set and turfing it if something better happens on the day. He's prepared so they can get what they wanted, but open and not held back by the same stuff. And he's good enough to account for the newer breed of pre-vis guys who AREN'T trained board artists (who think with a cinematic vocabulary) when they should be. Considering pre-vis offers much better control and conveyance of pace and movement it's shocking how many pre-vis guys DON't understand it having come from a straight techie background. So you need a director who knows EXACTLY what he wants until those guys get a few years under their belt in terms of thinking cinematically. Or you go the Jackson route and do it like a doco where you choreograph stuff and set up your unlimited virtual cameras like the most unfettered documentary of all time. Then you just edit it all together like normal. Both approaches work. But still, it's all about the people. <p> And I agree with you about the outrageous van shot in WOTW - and equally the amazing shot in Children of Men where they worked out how to do it PRACTICALLY! <p> But yeah you're right. The more advanced the tools in the toolbox the more suits and producers and lazy/infatuated directors will think there's a magic red button you push (that they're paying for) and they can just back the creatives further and further into the corner. I hoped the fiasco of The Mummy 2 (you just know the ILM guys were horrified they let that stuff out) would teach them something but nnnnope!

  • June 30, 2009, 4:55 a.m. CST


    by blakindigo

    was at one time optioned by the same company mentioned in the article to do this AWWiL remake.

  • June 30, 2009, 4:56 a.m. CST


    by half vader

    Sorry I mixed up your and Coni's post with the WOTW van shot. Oops. <p> I'd forgotten the name of man with a movie camera. That's the one with the rear-projection in the train station isn't it? <p> The Jaws one is a hard question with all sorts of 'for's and 'against's. Spielberg had such a horrendous time I reckon he'd say go the CG in a heartbeat. The mechanical thing hardly worked, shooting it was a complete bitch and while we can only go on the net result of brilliant compromises that worked for us as audience members with SS pulling every trick in his filmmaking bag to win us over, only ss really knows how much better it might have been had the thing done what it was originally supposed to or if he'd had more workable means at his disposal. That one will go on forever. It's the old restriction forcing creative solutions vs. freedom of unfettered imagination conundrum. Being in a creative role I ALWAYS lament the neutered final product even if audiences or customers love it - I always think "Yeah but it COULD have been so much BETTER!". <p> Yeah I was saying in the Smith TB I think, it's great how Del Toro likes to mix both.

  • June 30, 2009, 4:59 a.m. CST

    Ecto, stop trolling

    by half vader

    or at least read the rest of the TB. Jim Henson himself would be rolling his eyes at your thoughtless myopic statements, and Frank Oz swearing a blue streak at you.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:07 a.m. CST

    Conti, I don't know

    by half vader

    about the whole plundering/raping/sullying a beloved movie school of thought. The original still exists, you can still view it (except maybe for Star Wars with models), it hasn't changed, it's STILL great - to paraphrase Alan Moore. <p> Sometimes I just get selfish, and happy that when the remake comes out I'll get a spanky new better-than-ever version of the "beloved original" on Blu-ray or DVD or whatever. If the new version rocks, then great. If it sucks, I've got a great copy of the original to go back to. It's a win either way as far as I can see. Except maybe for Thunderbirds, where they cropped the originals. Grrr. <p> And +1 btw for Let the Right One In!

  • June 30, 2009, 5:12 a.m. CST

    half vader

    by Continentalop

    I will only disagree with you on the Jaws. I think Jaws was the perfect accident where the Beard just so happened to be working with one of the best editors other, Mother Cutter Verma Fields. Instead of constantly showing the "monster", or shark in this case, we got an exercise in how to imply something through editing and clever cuts and suggestive camera work. It is like a modern Val Lewton movie, but with water replacing shadows.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:18 a.m. CST

    What I don't like about Remakes half vader

    by Continentalop

    is that they are "plundering" the name value of the other movie. And 90% of the time that is all they got going for them. They are not like Carpenter, Cronnenberg or Scorsese who are trying to update a classic, or Peter Jackson who is making something because they loved the original, they are just doing it for crass commercialism. I mean, what was the reason to remake TCM, Halloween, Hills Have Eyes, and Friday the 13th other than to cash in on their name recognition? Wasn't anything new really added to the mythos that made those movies worthwhile? <p> So if a respected filmmaker came in and said I want to remake AAWIL, I would give him the benefit of the doubt, but can't stand to see other people basically coming in and living off the good will generated by other people. I see this as another version of the Fog, where they take an interesting Cult Classic and just lazily throw something together to cash in on it cult classic status.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:19 a.m. CST

    Man With A Movie Camera

    by Continentalop

  • June 30, 2009, 5:23 a.m. CST

    Blakindigo, if they had the rights to Werewolf By Night

    by Continentalop

    Why the FUCK didn't they make that instead of doing a remake of AAWIL?

  • June 30, 2009, 5:29 a.m. CST

    Half Vader, Continentalop—

    by blakindigo

    The mechanical sharks in "Deep Blue Sea" were highly professional ("In Bale's name we Praise…") and I think they would work NOW, because of advances in animatronics. I mean look at "Jurassic Park" and it's stunning work by maestro Stan Winston—and that film is 17 years old! I definitely believe SS would go for practical techniques for the sake of the actors.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:30 a.m. CST

    One last thing half vader

    by Continentalop

    Best argument yet for CG. Remember early sound pictures (not literally of course)? Most filmmakers just had the actors stand around stationary, talking near the hidden mike because they didn't know how to incorporate sound with what they learned the past two-and- decades in regards to camera techniques. It took guys like Alfred Hitchcock, Fritz Lang and William Wellman to show them how to use sound in a movie picture, without sacrificing dolly or camera movement. <p> We currently are at the same stage with CG - few people know how to use it, and employ it like early talking pictures used sound - just have it in there thinking that is what the audience wants.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:31 a.m. CST

    I don't know if the rights expired—

    by blakindigo

    —or if they decided to make "Cursed" instead…<br><br><br><br>…Is that…crickets I hear?

  • June 30, 2009, 5:32 a.m. CST

    Can you two stop calling Steven Spielberg "SS"

    by Continentalop

    It just seems weird to see a Jewish director who made the greatest holocaust movie referred to as "SS". It is freakin' with my my mind! :)

  • June 30, 2009, 5:34 a.m. CST

    Continentalop, THANK YOU for the link!

    by blakindigo

    Half Vader, also the remake/re-imagining of "Solaris" had very well done practical AND digital effects…<br><br>Dammit—I was supposed to be making a point here…

  • June 30, 2009, 5:36 a.m. CST

    Steven Spielberg≠SS

    by blakindigo

    Offense/Irony was NOT intended

  • June 30, 2009, 6 a.m. CST

    Children of Men behind the scenes

    by blakindigo

    I know this is a big tangent, but I think its relevant to the discussion of practical vs CG effects: <br><br>

  • June 30, 2009, 8:14 a.m. CST


    by Johnny Ahab

    I too was a big WWBN fan back in the day. In fact, an early crossover in Marvel Team-Up (#12!) was responsible for exposing me to Spider-man - and I became an immediate Marvel zombie for life. Six years ago, I was hawking scripts out in L.A., and had a series of meetings with the company that owned the rights to WWBN, Crystal Sky. This is the company that made "GHOST RIDER" with Nic Cage, and I saw old copies of WWBN on one of the exec's bookshelves. He told me they were actively developing it and they'd had a script. (They also owned and were developing Deathlok too.) Don't know what ever happened to WWBN, but they did well financially with Ghost Rider. But again, that was 5-6 years back and I've lost touch...

  • June 30, 2009, 8:56 a.m. CST

    SS - nor by me!

    by half vader

    I had a contraction attack I guess. <p> And that wasn't a big tangent Blakindigo, that's exactly the thing I was talking about in the "Sure Conti" WOTW vs COM post! :) <p> And Conti, I completely get your point about plundering name value. I do think the lesser efforts fall away eventually compared to the better, whether remake or original, but your point is valid. So is the sound/cg analogy. <p> You can throw colour vs B&W in there too - the argument was that just as cinematographers were really hitting their stride with what can be done with mood and tone and lighting in black & white (you couldn't get away with a ton of Citizen Kane for example the fake ceilings which were scrims through which they projected light for the set! Holy Crap!), people go all crazy and get distracted by colour when nobody is really used to it yet! Remember the attitude was much more understandable because 2-strip colour came first with it's weird red & blue abstract palette, not full-blown three strip Technicolour! No wonder they were grouchy. <p> Can't really remember much at all about Deep Blue Sea beside that L.L. Cool J and skinny-arse Saffron Burrows were in it. I liked the Solaris remake, but need to watch the original again. Dad showed it to me when I was a kid, so I can't remember a whole lot beside being firmly in Star Wars mode and sorta feeling ripped off with the heady stuff. Stalker is in my queue to watch first though. <p> BTW speaking of Cursed do you guys know if there's a version with any Baker stuff left in? I thought there was and it was mentioned in the making of or something, yet on the version I watch there was nothing in sight. And I watched the whole thing (I knew it was gonna be crap) for the Baker stuff! Grrr! <p> My holy grail is actually to see the aliens Baker did for "Night Skies". I'm sure you know the story behind that one... I wish they'd just snuck 'em into the background of MiB or something. Those things are makeup fx legend, and if you put 'em in a MiB film there'd even be a poetic aspect to it!

  • June 30, 2009, 9 a.m. CST

    Oh and speaking of Man with a Movie Camera

    by half vader

    and Verna Fields, have you guys seen "In the cut", the editing doco? It talks about the early Russian stuff, and also Fields cutting on Jaws. As I recall it was one of those "2 frames more of the shark and it fell to bits" stories. I got it as an extra on the Blu-ray of Bullitt. Cool stuff.

  • June 30, 2009, 9:36 a.m. CST


    by half vader

    I'm not sure if that's a cool or scary story you told, considering Ghost Rider!

  • June 30, 2009, 9:43 a.m. CST

    Half Vader, Jurassic Park's ending...

    by D.Vader

    The original ending, according to storyboards in the "Making of Book" and the "Making of" featurette, show Grant working a small crane and using that to kill the raptors (also using the rex skeletons to help crush them I think). But Spielberg liked the Rex so much, and he wanted to see him in the movie again<p> The original book ending had Grant being stalked by raptors in one of the laboratories where eggs were being incubated surrounded by a very humid mist. Grant hid under the tables and had a syringe full of a fast-acting toxin, which he then stabbed into the tails of the raptors as they walked around him, searching for him.<p> This is all before the other subplot where Grant and Harding and others go into the raptor nests in the volcanic fields.

  • June 30, 2009, 9:43 a.m. CST

    In the cut

    by Series7

    I've seen that. I mainly remember the back and forth interviews with QT and his editor. And how she was like, he is a baby.

  • June 30, 2009, 9:52 a.m. CST

    Ecto - "its all 0's and 1's"

    by skimn

    And so is digital photography, and Michael Mann and old master Sidney Lumet seem to do just fine by it. And film is just chemical reaction of silver nitrates reacting to light..go away with your simplistic argument.

  • June 30, 2009, 10:11 a.m. CST

    In the Cut

    by D.Vader

    I remember that. Its the one where Meg Ryan gets naked and has a lot of sex.

  • June 30, 2009, 10:13 a.m. CST

    are you talking about CUTTING MAGIC?

    by Six Demon Bag

    thats a pretty good doc on do they do that, i'll never know.

  • June 30, 2009, 11:18 a.m. CST

    Actually It's called The Cutting Edge. Sorry!

    by half vader

    Just dug it out. With Walter Murch standing there ready for cuttin' action in his sneakers! Yeah the Tarantino stuff is funny. And the Cameron bit on T2 and "what if we just cut one frame out of 24"! Dunno why I was thinking "In the Cut". I can't usually stand Meg Ryan. Until she did the Parkinson interview where he was drunk/sleazy and she wouldn't stand for it. That was cool. <p> Haven't seen Cutting Magic Demon. Hafta check it out. <p> Visions of Light and Cinematographer Style (which is mainly anecdotal if you like that sort of thing) are cool if you're into that side of things.

  • June 30, 2009, 11:21 a.m. CST

    half V

    by Six Demon Bag

    no you're right--CUTTING EDGE-the Magic of Editing or something like was on encore a few weeks ago..intriguing. amazed at all the shit they have to do..a real talemt that goes unheralded. there a literally thousands of variables to editing and they each have to be perfect for it to work..otherwise we have wrecks like T4.

  • June 30, 2009, 11:21 a.m. CST

    Hey thanks D.Vader!

    by half vader

    for the info. Now I'll have to try to find my version and see if it's the same. It's in a box somewhere...

  • June 30, 2009, 11:50 a.m. CST

    And I also should dig up

    by half vader

    all my old Movie Magic tapes and all the old making ofs, and somehow transfer them to digital. This is making me all nostalgic! Hafta hit up the in-laws (they're old) for a tape player that works!

  • June 30, 2009, 11:54 a.m. CST

    Man I loved me some Movie Magic

    by D.Vader

    On Discovery Channel. I remember being very upset when they stopped making that show. I learned so much from it. I think they tried to bring it back under a new name, "Cinema Secrets", but it didn't last very long. <p> I wonder why they stopped making it? Surely it was a great promotional tool for the movies themselves? I'd love to have that series on DVD.

  • June 30, 2009, 11:57 a.m. CST

    There is a new show on

    by Series7

    Science Channel called, something like The Magic Of Movies. It was pretty good, until Dish Network decided that they wanted me to pay for The Science Channel.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:20 p.m. CST

    D. Vader

    by emeraldboy

    Movie magic was the best show on tv.

  • June 30, 2009, 12:23 p.m. CST

    Fucking Shame if this Happens

    by SupermanEmpire

    I just watched this classic a month stands the test of time, such a phenominal horror film. Please if there is a film God, burn however deciedes to remake this film...burn them and then piss on their ashes. An American Werewolf in London is one of the true needs a remake as much as Micheal Jackson needs a 3rd autopsy at this point. NO FUCKING WAY!

  • June 30, 2009, 12:25 p.m. CST


    by SupermanEmpire

    I mean "WHOMEVER" decides to remake this film.

  • June 30, 2009, 1:49 p.m. CST

    There is like three editing documentaries

    by Continentalop

    "Cutting Edge" is probably the best of them. I think "Invisible Art/Visible Artist" was OK if I remember right, The third one I can't remember the title, and it wasn't that good if I remember right. <p> But the Cutting Edge had some great things in there like Walter Murch saying "editing is really a dance of the eyes", basically expanding an Goddard's old phrase "The easiest cut is a cut on a glance." <p> A great book is Murch's "In the Blink of an Eye."

  • June 30, 2009, 3:45 p.m. CST

    Thanks Half Vader

    by mitortilla

    I did not know that, that's amazing. But what I meant is they're visual fads come and go and come and go. It has just become a fad in itself to make fun of lens flare and shaky cam.

  • June 30, 2009, 4:45 p.m. CST

    Werewolf By Night

    by TedKordLives

    Ya know, I always thought that title sounded better than it read. Imagine the movie trailer guy reading it at the end of a really spooky teaser: night. <P> Creeeeeeepy.

  • June 30, 2009, 5:24 p.m. CST

    movie magic was great...anyone remember LIGHTS CAMERA ACTION?

    by Six Demon Bag

    hosted by Leonard Nimoy back in the day? awesome.

  • June 30, 2009, 9:48 p.m. CST

    "Invisible Art"?

    by half vader

    Is it a matte painting doco - like the book of the same title by Craig Barron (yay!) and Mark Cotta Vaz? Or another editing one? <p> Yeah Murch's book is great. I like how he puts little action figures or whatever next to the monitor to get a better approximation of true scale and how things 'read' on a big screen. I draw little stick figures at the side of my boards. Same thing. For board artists I think it's important to have yourself in the right headspace, seeing as how many of them come from comics - it's all too easy to frame too close because you're used to composing for a few inches or 1:1 on a page or monitor rather than 20 feet tall. And I like the analogy of a blink being like a natural cut. <p> Thanks mitortilla, I sort of see what you're getting at now. Cheers. <p> Lights Camera Action eh? Never saw that one. Just checked it out on youtube - my boy will be into that! <p> Speaking of which, I'm having a great time with my kid at the moment - He's old enough now and I've been watching Raiders, Jurassic Park, Close Encounters, Explorers and stuff like that with him. And he's loving them to bits. He's a big Thunderbirds fan too. My Dad introduced me to Jason and the Argonauts and Seven Samurai, so it's pretty cool to be doing the same thing with my boy too. And both he and my twin girls love the Miyazaki stuff. I'm bringin' em up right! Awww!

  • July 1, 2009, 12:10 a.m. CST

    Six Demon Bag--

    by Bones

    Yeah, that show was on Nickelodeon in the early '80s. I remember seeing the making of Krull, Dune, Rock and Rule and various other films on that show--mixed in with Leonard Nimoy doing practical demonstrations of how various Special Effects concepts work.<p> Great stuff! Nimoy will be at Dragon*Con this year...I'll have to try to bring up that show if I see him...

  • July 1, 2009, 12:13 a.m. CST

    Invisible Art/Visible Artist is another doc

    by Continentalop

    And it is funny because I do the same thing that Murch suggested when I edit. I got a diorama of the Simpson's family sitting on their couch and I usually slid it right up to the monitor (small monitor) to make it look like it is people sitting in the row in front of you. Of course, I realize that the majority of stuff I work on will be viewed at home and not in a theatre, but I like to stay in practice and imagine I am working on a bigger scope. <p> His monkey-man-Frankenstein monster analogy was also good. I pull that out once in awhile on directors and producers (of course, they don't really get the lesson of it).

  • July 1, 2009, 12:13 a.m. CST

    On the subject of remaking American Werewolf...

    by Bones

    It will FAIL.<p> And why? No Jenny Agutter titties.<p> That shower scene set to Moondance by Van Morrison, the Underground Werewolf attack and the Transformation sequence are three of the greatest sequences in modern cinema.

  • July 1, 2009, 1:24 a.m. CST

    Ha ha SImpsons eh?

    by half vader

    Beside the stick-figure boarding thing I mentioned, I do the Murch thing with my monitor too. It has a little Akira Kurosawa. He's even doing the 'framing' motion with his hands. Inspiration and all, you know!

  • July 1, 2009, 1:31 a.m. CST

    Conti maybe you should have Comic Book Guy

    by half vader

    to keep you honest. You know, like "Worst. Edit. Ever."! I do work on a 30" computer monitor but proofing footage or art on a 52" HDTV works well too to give you a sense of a bigger screen. <p> I can't recall the Frankenstein anecdote (although I've got a decent idea) - what was that story again? From the first book, or the "Conversations" one?