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Will J.J. & Co. Reset The TREK Universe In One Of Their Movies?? Use A TOS Story?? Both?? Neither?? Oh, The Madness!!
Merrick here...
A cautionary note: it's very easy to read too much into Greenwood's comment below, so take all of this as fodder for discussion/harebrained theorizing more than an advancement of fact.
This said, in a recent interview with the Examiner, the consistently badass Bruce Greenwood (criminally underutilized as Pike in the new TREK movie) may've opened up a ginormous can o' hydras.
EXAMINER: What would you like to see happen in any of the sequels?
GREENWOOD: I think these guys are clever enough to do at least two more and have the final one do a really hard dovetail into the beginning of [the storylines] for the original ["Star Trek"] series. My expectations are very high for them. The only thing I’d like to see, from a personal standpoint, is the mentor relationship between Kirk and Pike to continue.
...said Greenwood in THIS INTERVIEW with Examiner.
"a really hard dovetail into the beginning of [the storylines] for the original ["Star Trek"] series. " Hmmmmmmm.....
The first question that pops to mind, is: will Abrams & Co. have to make any structural/mechanical adjustments to their altered timeline if they're gonna be doing "hard dovetails" into storylines which might, in theory, not even exist in the alternate timeline/universe they're in?
Does the phrasing of Greenwood's statement not infer that The Original Series somehow unfolds/exists as a separate point in time/distinct events from the current Abramsverse? How is changed timeline reconciled with "Original Series" events (if at all)?
Doesn't some kind of change have to happen? In the current film, doesn't Spocklet say that its character's destinies are altered/they'll lead different lives/whatever? How do "altered destinies" match up with established TOS stories w/o some kind of shake-up to bridge the two? Seems like something has to happen to "reset" or at least "re-calibrate" the divergent realities if storyline are going to dovetail..."hard"...
Or, am I wrong?
Am I reading too much into the statement?
Or...???
Fun food for thought...
GREENWOOD: I think these guys are clever enough to do at least two more and have the final one do a really hard dovetail into the beginning of [the storylines] for the original ["Star Trek"] series. My expectations are very high for them. The only thing I’d like to see, from a personal standpoint, is the mentor relationship between Kirk and Pike to continue.
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No doubt these guys will have something special planned. They're masters.
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I've never been first before.
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...and c'mon Merrick - would ALL of us want to see the phaser rifle just one more time?
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Greenwood sounds like he's just brainstorming.
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Shit...I would!!!
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They may happen differently, but many of them still could.
If they don't involve Vulcan or the Romulans, there's nothing from preventing it from happening.
If they DO involve either Vulcan or Romulans, they could happen differently :) -
Since they through a bunch of easter eggs in the first one, I expect we will see certain people and events unfold earlier then later. A young Jean-Luc and cadet Tuvok will probably show up. They already hinted at Khan in earlier interview, but I expect with Vulcan destroyed the Klingons will smell blood. A giant Klingon war would be awesome to see as well as one movie dealing with exploration and through Khan or Q into it. I just hope the hell they stay away from the Borg that would make no sense. They way they created this new universe, the sky is the limit.
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Praise the maker!
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...for the next film, I want to see some fucking Klingons!
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most of the stories could just repeat themselves, except where vulcan is concerned, because, you know, a super saiyan blew it up.
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After all, he states it's simply what he'd like to see. He has no idea if he'll even be in the sequels, so he'd have no idea whether or not the films could or couldn't dovetail into the orignal series.
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Not even the cast realizes that what they're acting in is an alternate universe. Not only wouldn't the timeline probably not have any of the same events, it certainly wouldn't dovetail neatly into the original stories like there was no alternate timeline to begin with. Fucking stupid way to reboot a series. If they wanted to do a TRUE reboot they should have just done that, without bringing the original timeline into the fray at all. It's done ALL THE TIME. Bringing in the original timeline as part of this multiverse is a fucking mess and the whole thing will become a big game of spot the differences. Fuck new Trek.
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Not infer. That is all.
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Why can't they just do an alternate take on a classic TOS story. The first sequel could conceivably be an exanded version of one or two original episodes. Open the sequel halfway trhough an adventure with Kirck and McCoy trapped on a Mirror Universe Enterprise, fighting beareded Spock and knife wielding Uhura to get to the transport room where Scotty is waing to beam them back to their own universe. It would be like the first 20 minutes similar to Bond or Indy. Then the main adventure kicks in where the Enterprise comes across the Botany Bay..lost in space. Khan!!!
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He never said the films are in the same universe as the original series. He said he'd LIKE to see the final film somehow connect to the original series. There's a very big difference there.
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The recent film was super wack and TOS wasn't any better.
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for when your rabbit has to go poop.
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Empty speculation by an ACTOR who just wants some extra publicity, which is going to result in a nerd-argument of monumental proportions which probably dominate the talkbacks with the same nonsensical banter you all brought to Harrys review of Wolverine. In the words of the Bluths, Harry has "made a huge mistake." Prepare for the dumbest talkback ever.
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is how they all came together, and spock and kirk's backgrounds...and the fact that there is no more vulcan.
other than that, they could pretty much start doing episodes now no differently then they did in TOS. IN FACT if events had not unfolded the way the did in the movie, there would never be a Scotty on the enterprise. so, not much has changed in the big picture -
Well said. Why Abrams elected to go with all this "alternate timeline" bullshit is beyond me.
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I'm off to find a girlfriend.....
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...and I couldn't make it through the whole thing. Get to work on The Dark Tower films, J.J.!
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That guy 'reviewed' Wolverine without having seen it? That was funny.
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Also It would be more than just events that involve Vulcan due to the fact NERO attacked George Kirk's ship and a lot of people died that weren't suppose to including George Kirk. So anything and everything could be different.
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May 29, 2009 11:05:04 AM CDT
I would love to see William Shatner in the next movie ...
by unfaithfullyyours
I posted this idea once before but think about it: The movie has to deal with the consequences of being promoted too fast, doesn't it? Isn't hat a logical next step? What if Kirk isn't ready? And what if something horrible happens? Can you imagine if they killed Sulu or Uhura? And what if whatever happens has ramifications for Kirk's entire career? And you have flashforwards to an older Pine-Kirk, as played by William Shatner. Wouldn't that be cool? You don't even have to go back to the time travel well. And if you wanted to get really loopy you could bring Nimoy back to play an older Quinto-Spock. The possibilities are endless! That's why I, for one, am so much more excited for the next movie than this one. Who the hell knows what's going to happen?
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i hadn't even thought of that..wow, he has the mannerisms and accent, but does he have the chops anymore? can he pronounce 'corinthian' just so?
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I'm sure the Trek fans can answer this (I am one but haven't got the answer) - why is this an alternative universe rather than simply the same universe altered? Did Spock and Nero not travel back in time to a different point in the same universe or did they travel both to a different universe and back in time? Simply the act of going back in time causing a new universe wouldn't seem to be consistent with previous Star Trek but I don't know...
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If Abrams is saying that Spock traveled into an alternate universe (ala the evil goutee universe) IN ADDITION TO traveling into the past, then the premise for this new reboot truly is retarded. I thought the movie was about a new timeline that erases everything that happened before, which was pretty bold if nothing else. But if reboot is a story in which Spock Prime goes to some random parallel universe of the infinite ones that are out there and helps a random version of his crew, while Nero gets revenge on a Vulcan that has nothing to do with the Vulcans that screwed him over, then this reboot is just too ridiculous to stomach.If there is any inside info to what this actor is saying, perhaps it will mean that they're going to have the new crew help Spock Prime save Vulcan and fix the timeline sometime in the next two movie. Hopefully, Nimoy will be around long enough to do that.
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The opening scene should be the Enterprise discovering it and recognizing it as an old DY-100 class ship. Kirk says he would like to beam over and explore it. Then Spock steps in and reminds him of the new regulation Starfleet enacted after the Nero/Narada incidents requiring the immediate destruction of any vessel that may be out of place in time. Kirk grumbles about Spock quoting regulations as he orders Chekov to destroy it with a single photon torpedo. Then they continue on their mission as planned.
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please disperse
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Oh, just fuck off with this bullshit already. Jesus, Moses, Mary and Joseph...
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May 29, 2009 11:09:26 AM CDT
just because the actors are diff, does not mean 'alternate'
by zom-bot.com
i mean, jesus christ, jj did a damn good job casting contemporary look and act alikes (except chekov, wtf)...they can't clone the old actors. we have to suspend our disbelief and think that the new batch IS the old batch, younger. that's the point. everything else, sets, costumes, phasers, are just redesigned because of our times...and because there is actually a BUDGET. it makes alot more sense than saying these people exist in an alternate reality where everyone looks a little off but is the exact same person, soul-wise, as in the universe next door.
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Not just here, but in all of the other new Trek TBs...life is easier when you don't obsess over shit. Enjoy the movie for what it is -- or don't -- and then move on. You still have the wonder of DVD to behold the original series if you just can't let go. Christ.
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There's absolutely no reason to think it's an alternate universe other than the fact that they pulled it out of their ass and said the term a couple times in the movie. I thought they were just playing fast and loose with terminalogy of an alternate timeline. If they truly meant that he went into an an alternate universe, then this reboot is truly a farce. It has no bearing on the Star Trek universe we grew up with (other than explaining where Spock disappeared to in the end) and a potentially flatulent connection with the characters we know. What's next? A movie in which Uhura Prime accidentally travels to the possible alternate parallel universe where the entire crew is overweight and Kirk has a speech impediment?
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YES, it is very stupid. But you're not supposed to say that. The critics have spoken, it's AWESOME!!! The fact that even now people still have no clue as to what they watched or what the implications are, including the actors in the movie, suggests that the whole concept is a clusterfuck designed for one thing only: to make money from people who aren't Trek fans. People come back to a movie again and again because of one thing: story. And this one had a shitty one. Even people that I know that enjoyed it have said so. They basically have sold out the entire series to reach the lowest common denominator.
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Might have liked it more if not for the gushing, drooling raves it got on this site. Harry had such a boner for this movie that the whole thing seems pretty "meh" once we actually saw it.
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May 29, 2009 11:18:58 AM CDT
So this is how 40 years of Canon is wiped out, to thunderous app
by kiss_your_past_goodbye
I have yet to comment on the new film yet, hoping to get my thoughts away from "colorful metaphors" and keep it civil. I left the theater saddened and two weeks later now I'm just highly offended. This film has taken four complete series (TOS, TNG, DS9 & VGR) and wiped them out of existance . . . and yet the absolute worst Trek ever, that being ENTERPRISE, remained untouched. As Denis Leary would say, "Explain that to me God!"
The marketing was unnecessarily insulting "Not your father's Trek", the science & story dumbed down to a fifth grade retention level, and tell me something . . . in TOS Chekov wasn't in the first season, correct? In the "original" time line, Kirk is the youngest Capt. in Federation history (at 35 I believe, at least according to Riker as he was always wanting to beat that record, at least early on), so if Kirk was at least 35 in TOS and Chekov is roughly 20-25 in TOS when he first shows up . . . why are they around the same age in the new movie?
Other things that truly annoy and unsult me: In the new movie, the Enterprise is being pulled into the blackhole "thing" and are at full warp to try to escape, but they aren't getting anywhere, right? So they eject the warp core (why that design is SO different from EVERY warp core in Trek history remains a mystery) to collapse the black hole "thing", so why weren't they immediately sucked in once they dropped out of warp? Impulse is exponentially slower than warp speed, right?
Also, what are the odds of two people being dropped off on a single planet by two different ships some time apart and yet still manage to be within walking distance of each other?
Also, when Scotty & Kirk are beamed back aboard the Enterprise (don't even get me started on THAT nonsense) and Scotty ends up in an amusement park water ride, shouldn't Scotty have died instantly upon materializing? I mean, the water in the space he beamed into didn't just disappear, right? He would have fused with it, which should have killed him . . . ?
There's so much more, but I don't want to bore everyone. Thanks for reading.
-"I weep for the future."
-"Moral dilemmas and social commentary are too dated and boring, let's just blow lots of shit up!" - Hollywood -
They've fucked the show up good and hard, let it fucking die already.
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Use your damn imagination, you lazy fucks. The original series alone had so many inconsistancies and contradictions and actors playing multiple roles (Mark Lenard). The actors in this movie look different from the originals because they aren't the same fucking actors, you loser. The only thing that would make you happy is if ILM took the lazer-scanned heads of the actors from Star Trek IV and created digital copies of them and the whole thing was performance capture.
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I hate it when people post shit like "So-n-So should play So-n-So". With that being said Dwayne (no longer The Rock) Johnson should play Khan. God, I'm such a hypocrite.
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New stories. End of.
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Read talkbacks for years, just started posting, I'll figure out how to do paragraphs better next time. Again . . .
I have yet to comment on the new film yet, hoping to get my thoughts away from "colorful metaphors" and keep it civil. I left the theater saddened and two weeks later now I'm just highly offended. This film has taken four complete series (TOS, TNG, DS9 & VGR) and wiped them out of existance . . . and yet the absolute worst Trek ever, that being ENTERPRISE, remained untouched. As Denis Leary would say, "Explain that to me God!"
The marketing was unnecessarily insulting "Not your father's Trek", the science & story dumbed down to a fifth grade retention level, and tell me something . . . in TOS Chekov wasn't in the first season, correct? In the "original" time line, Kirk is the youngest Capt. in Federation history (at 35 I believe, at least according to Riker as he was always wanting to beat that record, at least early on), so if Kirk was at least 35 in TOS and Chekov is roughly 20-25 in TOS when he first shows up . . . why are they around the same age in the new movie?
Other things that truly annoy and unsult me: In the new movie, the Enterprise is being pulled into the blackhole "thing" and are at full warp to try to escape, but they aren't getting anywhere, right? So they eject the warp core(s?) (why that design is SO different from EVERY warp core in Trek history remains a mystery) to collapse the black hole "thing", so why weren't they immediately sucked in once they dropped out of warp? Impulse is exponentially slower than warp speed, right?
Also, what are the odds of two people being dropped off on a single planet by two different ships some time apart and yet still manage to be within walking distance of each other?
Also, when Scotty & Kirk are beamed back aboard the Enterprise (don't even get me started on THAT nonsense) and Scotty ends up in an amusement park water ride, shouldn't Scotty have died instantly upon materializing? I mean, the water in the space he beamed into didn't just disappear, right? He would have fused with it, which should have killed him . . . ?
There's so much more, but I don't want to bore everyone. Thanks for reading.
-"I weep for the future."
-"Moral dilemmas and social commentary are too dated and boring, let's just blow lots of shit up!" - Hollywood
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how to write intelligent Trek which respects the canon. So expecting them to somehow have it make sense in a later movie, is retarded.
This version of Trek, is like the Adam West version of Batman. Just with special effects.
Enjoy your retarded plot-less Trek, and stop hoping it will all make sense some day, because it won't.
Now Scotty, beam some shark repellant spray over to the Whale probe there. -
I'm also pretty sure the "alternate" universe/timeline term was used was so that the bitches whining about canon and the sacred 40 years of what came before aren't threatened and you don't cry all the way back down to the basement.
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the AICN cock boys have maintained it is. It is a 7/10 film. Sets things up for future films but is by no means the finished product. Lots of good stuff, lots of bad stuff too.
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You wrote: "Why Abrams elected to go with all this "alternate timeline" bullshit is beyond me."
Then you are very limited in intelligence. -
May 29, 2009 11:25:30 AM CDT
Oh, by the way, all you diehards who are complaining about...
by stifler's mom
...the new film "wiping out" the original timelines need to "get a life" as Bill Shatner would say. It's only one fucking movie. An underwhelming one at that. I didn't love it either, but do you really think JJ, Paramount, or even Gene Rodenberry would give a flying fart with your technical issues?
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This is the most moronic talkback I've ever seen. And that's saying something!
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You can literally tell any story you want in the Trek universe. That's the great thing about it. Just because the last movies and shows sucked doesn't reflect poorly on the Trek universe, it reflects poorly on the producers of the show that don't know what to do with it. Fortunately they are still coming out with good Trek books by authors that actually understand what makes Trek good. Likewise Star Trek Online looks fuckin' amazing. I have no doubt that there will be more Trek series in the future, and more movies. The Trek universe is too well conceived and openended. It'll just take some people that know how to tell good stories. I was hoping that was J.J. Abrhams, but that Nero/Alternate Timeline/Revenge bullshit was garbage that probably set back a GOOD new show or movie another 10 years since the producers will want to ride the money train into the ground.
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you create the line break by typing (but with no underscores)
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"Why Abrams elected to go with all this "alternate timeline" bullshit is beyond me."
That's easy. Take all the baggage of the TOS,TNG,DS9,VOY,ENT, all the movie except ST, and try to make a movie for everyone that fits into canon, ignoring the fact that TV Trek has made or ignored changes to canon constantly over the years. Couldn't be done. An alternate timeline is a great idea. No baggage, familiar characters, new situations. That's all win baby. -
but without the spaces -
Fuck off. You didn't even say why you think it's a good idea. I can point to a dozen reasons why it's retarded and completely unnecessary.
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You know, for people who adore Star Trek and it's triumph of "limitless possibilities", most of you guys can't think beyond what you know. Hey remember all those episodes where super-powerful alien tests the human race to see if we're up to snuff? Well, you would be the fuck losing it for us. Here's an idea, you whining bitch, why don't YOU try boldly going where YOU haven't gone before and think about the real final frontier of using your damned imagination?
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You wrote: "I left the theater saddened and two weeks later now I'm just highly offended."
Dude...that's fucking pathetic. It's a movie. That's all--a movie. You're OFFENDED? Give me a fucking break.
And where did you get the idea Kirk and Chekov are the same age in this film? Chekov is 17 and Kirk is in his late 29s. This film takes place in 2258, five years before the first year of TOS, when Chekov was 22 and Kirk was 34. There's no discrepancy, age-wise, so relax. Plus, just because Chekov wasn't on the bridge in season 1 doesn't mean he was on the ship. Khan remembered him in Wrath of Khan, so obviously he WAS already on the ship.
And your bitching about the transporter killing Scotty makes no sense whatsoever. Does the transporter normally fuse you with air? No. So why would it fuse you with water? The water was displaced, just as the air always is. There's absolutely no issue there whatsoever.
It's people like you that the new film made obsolete--the whiners who take the show WAY too fucking seriously.
Offended. By a Star Trek film. Two weeks after seeing it. Honestly, that's just ridiculous. Get some perspective, dude. -
Spock Prime should tell his younger self to make sure to not let Kirk get caught up in the Nexus and that maiden voyage of the Enterprise B. And if he should fail at that somehow and these events still lead up to Generations then Spock should still make sure he's on Veridian three at the right time to stop Dr. Soran from blowing up the bridge that breaks free and sends Kirk plummeting to his death. Then Spock, Kirk, Scotty and Bones if he is still alive seven or so years from his appearance in the first episode of TNG can reunite and get into trouble again.
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Even if you had a time machine that travels into the past. You would be incapable of altering your own future. All you would have done is created an alternative timeline. It would be born of those alterations and it would exist, but it wouldn't change your future which would also still exist. Lets' say you have a scar on your face, and you went back in time to the moment this injury was created. Your scar would not disappear. But you would have created an alternative future you that does not have this scare. This unscarred you does not live in your future either. It lives in it's future.... Your future would remain un effected. Stop thinking in terms of back to the future. We are all living several lives right now based on desicions we me that offer more than one choice. Did you answer the phone when it rang did you decide to get up when you first opened your eyes. you did and you didn't one of you is here reading this now and an alternate you who did something else is not. So this whole changing the timeline thing sure it changed things. it birthed a new future that didn't exist. Now it does alongside the one that already did and still does.
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In the new Trek universe, Vulcan is gone and Kirk and Spock haven't yet done any of the TOS things that make them "Kirk" and "Spock." I'd love to see it dovetail, but don't see how.
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Wow, somebody's pissed. Why don't you actually try to defend that piece of shit movie instead of just hurling insults? Oh that's right, you can't.
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I don't HAVE to give any reasons. A million have already been given. My point was that you said it was beyond you, which means you don't understand it. If you don't understand it, then you ARE limited in intelligence. So fuck you, too, kid.
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...I can't even see his character being in the series from here on in.
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As with the Kirk/Chekhov age thing, Christopher Pike was also said in the original series to be the same age as Kirk, so there's another discrepency for you.As for the movie, it was mindless fun with Star Trek. I'm not gonna loathe it cause it isn't a traditional Trek story because it had a lot more shine(lens flare?) than just about any other action/franchise movie I've seen so far this summer.
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Off subject, I know, but could you explain the line break in more detail, I'm a bit dense this morning, having trouble through all the tears I'm crying over my sacred 40 years of lost canon, getting my mother's basement floor all wet, you know how it is. :-) Seriously though, what do I do to make the line break?
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Badly written Star Wars ripoff, worst production design of ANY of the movies, inept direction...
In Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek, NOBODY HAD DESTINIES. The fact that anybody is discussing the concept of destinies at all in relationship to Trek shows how far off course this movie was, turning a humanist space drama into a Harry Potter wish-fulfillment fantasy. (Which I think is all fine and brilliant in the Harry Potter universe, or even the Star Wars universe, just not in the Trek universe.)
It's been painful to watch Trek deteriorate over the years. I really thought it had hit bottom with Star Trek Enterprise (and Nemesis.)
But this new film is just Star Wars dressed up as Star Trek, and the clothes don't fit, and there is no soul there.
Please, just let Star Trek die already! Invent something new! Stop redesigning the ship with stupider, bigger nacelles! Stop redesigning the phasers and making them with stupid rotating bits.
If you can't make Trek about boldly going out into the unknown universe and discovering new things and new alien races - well, it ain't Trek. If it ain't going where nobody's gone before, it ain't Trek.
A Trek movie that's supposedly inspired by 9-11 with George Bush as Kirk and Dick Cheney as Spock? That ain't Trek.
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Then you're obviously not read any other talkbacks, despite your claim to the contrary.
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"Commanding a starship is your first, best destiny. Anything else is a waste of material." --Spock, Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
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Kudos. I kinda doubt Abrams is too interested in rehashing old storylines. That would be the perfect way of sending that message as well as getting a huge laugh, right at the beginning of the sequel.
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Pike and Kirk were never said to be the same age in the original series. Where did you get that idea? Pike had commanded the Enterprise for 13 years before Kirk came along, so obviously they were NOT the same age.
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They've already defiled Star Trek. Next up in the "reboot" parade: "Alien"! Yep, a classic high watermark of sci-fi, horror, and modern cinema which was pretty much flawless the first time is gonna get a make-over treatment for the 2000's, (it'll be the 2010's by the time it comes out, but whatever), directed by some commercial-making putz,(and I don't mean Ridley Scott), and starring Paris Hilton as Ripley and 50 Cent as Dallas, with the tagline, "In Space, No One Can Hear You Smack Your Bitch, Yo"! And what's sad about that is it's probably fucking true. Fuck reboots; I wish someone would reboot Hollywood so these slimy fucking walrus-looking motherfuckers would actually come up with some ORIGINAL FUCKING IDEAS. Good Christ!
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Isn't it said on The Mengarie Part 1? I was kind of half asleep when I was watching the bluray of it last week, so I may have misheard, but I could've swore the commendant said they where the same age.
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Yes, I am offended by it, sorry to speak my true feelings, but it is what it is. I'm sure I do take it more seriously than I should, but I love my Trek and it bothers me. As for the Chekov/Kirk age thing, if I was incorrect it what I remember in the film, so apologies, thanks for pointing out the numbers. However, I do stand by my issue about Scotty in the water, as objects have been fused when teleported incorrectly before in Trek. Now I understand that it's just water and the human body is made up of mostly water, but at lease his lungs should have been instantly filled with water or something. ;-) Also, it was done for a silly joke, I mean, come on . . .
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And the new Trek can't escape it. See Enterprise. Those Borg have already called home. HAHAHA.
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Here are the titles for the next films:
Star Trek II Yes we Can
Star Trek III Search for McCoy
Star Trek IV: Search for Enterprise's keys
Star Trek V : Spock and Uhura make a porno
Star Trek VI: Kirk and Carol make a porno
Star Trek Generations (a new timeline is opened with an old Jean-Luc Picard helping a young Worf. Subplot : young Picard and young Dr Crusher steamy hot sex scene
Star Trek: Second Contact. The enteprise crew travels centuries in the past to prevent Cloverfield monster to attack New-York city.
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into the past. It already happened. He exists. Think about it for a second. Someone can kill Kyle Reese in the future before he goes back, and John will be all fucked up thinking "Ohhhhhh shit... I'm going to disappear like Marty Mcfly Fuckkkkkkkkkkkk" and yet
Nothing will happen. Because Reese was already sent into the past. The event in past that created that future already happened therefore it already existed even if it never happens in the future. It's quite possible that an alternate future John sent Reese back in time and it created the John we have now who can not send shit back into the past to affect his future. It will only create and affect alternative futures that he will never be a part of but will exist all the same while his real future treks on. -
I think people are reading way too much into this. Its like a two or three sentence statement. It could mean anything or nothing.
That being said, one thing I do know about Abrams' work is that he will do exactly what he wants. If he's planning something connected to TOS he will make it fit. All we can really do is sit back and speculate for the next couple of years.
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OK so here's how it works. Below is a line break.
This was achieved by doing the same thing you would do in a normal Word document i.e. return twice. However, in the line break instead of just leaving it blank you need to put in (but without the spaces i.e. ).
This creates a paragraph line break. It's something to do with this site not changing since 1997. -
Listen - we all know that Prime pock is fully capable of violating all kinds of Starfleet Protocol if he's passionate about an issue, deep to his core. (See the Menagerie) So it's safe to assume that he wants to try to save Vulcan, and his own mother, from destruction. He knows about the Guardian of Forever - so why wouldn't he get his ass there and try to fix things? Maybe with Young Spock as his accomplice?
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..because the first was the most underwhelming movie since Indy 4. Seriously, Wrath of Khan is better. Fuck, Undiscovered country is better than that flash-cam'd self referential pile of cgi bullshit.
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You can also create one with a code instead of a code (again, no spaces). As Cedar_Room points out, it's because this site is so lamely coded.
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haven't yet seen this anywhere. Why not just an older actress? The old age makeup was distracting.
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And the time shift changes all the technology into painted cardboard cutouts.
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Thanks for the pagebreak info.Also, the reason I didn't post all this quips in the original Talk Back was because the original Talk Back was a nightmare of fighting, I actually like that this one is a little more subdued as the film's almost run it's course. I'm just glad to be able to talk Trek, good or bad (in this case, oh so bad).
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....MY LEGACY EVEN FURTHER."
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That film was the Never Say Never Again of Star Trek.
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God, this isn't one of those days where they accidentally recycle an old news story, like Ridley Scott directing a Hannibal Lector movie, is it?
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Somewhere (probably near-earth orbit), the old 'sarge is probably dancing a jig.
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. . . a voice would call out "End Program" and we'd find Riker & Troi in the holodeck, then Riker would say "That's how it might have happened." and they both would leave the holodeck. Hey, it worked on ENTERPRISE.
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Greenwood is playing a character who was written out of the show immediately after the pilot. He just wants them to take their time getting to the point where he wouldn't play a part in the series anymore (i.e. where the show begins)
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Welp, lookings like this Talk Back has about run it's course. Been fun talking with you all about Trek.
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I'm just gonna say destiny would probably be again true Roddenberry Doctrine but so is internal conflict and religion and both were shot to hell with DS9. I have been watching star trek for a lot of years and I think it's been going to shit since the next generation movies. TNG was great but every movie sucked, yes even first contact. That movie is overpraised. Whether you like JJ's trek is personal but don't say he ruined canon or Roddenberry's vision cause that was already done a long time ago.
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should read "be AGAINST true Roddenberry Doctrine" sorry
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to think shit through, and their story will use a plot devices that use a time travel machine and an alternate reality machine combined.
It's not like the time traveller can change the events in his/hers own life with it, but he/she could assume the life of someone else in a period of time that he/she wants. Unless of course you also add a way to transport your essence/being/soul/ into the being of the alternate past, or future, or current existence reality you go to. Sort of like downloading yourself into the better version of an alternate you created after altering the past and birthing them.
Like you go to the past you stop that incident that made the scar, and you tell the past version of yourself the winning lottery numbers that will be played that night. Now- You travel back to the future using an alternate universe machine, so the future you arrive in is actually the alternate other you's future you just made.
You'd need one more machine/device to transfer your "inner essence/being/soul/whatever it is that is essentially the you, you are" into the unscarred richer alternative version of yourself. It would have to destroy the original "essence/soul/whatever it is thats you" contained in the original alternate you. After this transfer a dead original you would remain while you took on a new life inside the other alternate you. Capeshe???? -
I figured the Klingons could be crippled from losing 47 ships in the fight against Nero, Maybe the Klingons and Federation will join forces against the Romulanss.
Whatever I just hope they do it the same, but better, Free of the set up there's room for more depth. -
I didn't say the new film ruined canon, I said it wiped it out. Big difference. As you said, whether you like the new film is personal, but the fact is with the new film ALL inerations of Trek that take place past it are now wiped clean.As far as Roddenberry's vision, I don't really care about that. Gene has a good vision, but it was carried out by a lot of other people that don't get nearly the credit they deserve.And yes, First Contact is overrated. The scene where Picard gets "angry" and smashes his display ships is horribly directed, and the Borg Queen, while fun, makes no sense.
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and no more time travel por favor.
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I don't consider Wrath of Khan true Star Trek. Roddenberry didn't either - that's why he went on to create TNG. And Leonard Nimoy didn't consider it to be true Trek either- or else why undo everything great about TWOK in the next film? Spock should have stayed dead - bringing him back to life robbed TWOK of its climax. Killing Kirk's son reset the status quo as well. All of the Trek movies have sucked, in my opinion, though numbers 2 and 6 stand as two of the better entries.
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yeah I guess that's where the problem lies, the wiping out of the canon and shows. I guess since the latter trek shows for me were mediocre at the very most I don't mind but I can see your point. I hate the fact First Contact had the space battle in the first act when it should have been in the third...probably due to budget. That really pissed me off.
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...the TOS?
The original series, for which there is so much love and adoration, is what this movie was based on. I have recently been rewatching Season 1, and I really don't get the complaints here - in the first few episodes of the TOS the looks/costumes of the characters vary, and there are at least two episodes (Charlie X and Where No Man Has Gone Before) that deal with virtually the same plot.
My point is that the complaints about Star Trek lack merit. It's never been about science or reality. My Zeus, those early episodes are full of plot holes, bad acting, and rediculousness, but you know what? They're fun! They're cheesy fun, which Star Trek is SUPPOSED to be, not a punch of emo philosophers sitting around in a briefing room that looks less like a starship and more like a conferance room at Days Inn.
Seriously, who cares if the characters don't look the same, or if the canon is disturbed? What I gathered is that all of those old stories still exist in the Prime timeline, and that in this new timeline anything is possible - could there eventually be a new Next Generation? Maybe, but who cares, because that's boring! We have a lot of new adventures with Kirk and Spock and that alone should be something to be excited about.
Also sokitome, I totally agree about First Contact - people complain about time travel in Star Trek, but forget about First Contacts lame time travel/helping out with Cochran plot, which is entirely ludicrous. I agree that TNG films sucked, especially since they did an total injustice to Kirks character in Generations. Kirk went out like a total punk bitch against Dr. Loomis, and wound up under a pile of rocks. Real nice sendoff. -
Nothing has been wiped clean; it ALL still happened. This is an ALTERNATE timeline created at the point history changed; basically it's an alternate universe skewed off from the established one. This is also in line with current quantum thoery.
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to molest his own child self. True story, that.
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sorry, quantum "theory"
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The way that Kirk went out was a travesty.... The sad part is that him falling was a rewritten ending.... He originally gets shot by Soran...
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Those two assclowns are an abomination to writing. That being said at least JJ Abrams made a bright shiney fairly entertaining movie.
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I actually do agree that the canon hasn't been wiped out but I don't think we can definitely say that for sure. I wouldn't fault people like KISS YOUR PAST GOODBYE
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Pon Farr, shirtless fencing, 'splosions. Otherwise the door's wide open.
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Honestly, why mess with the Khan story? Just leave Khan alone and deal with young Kirk coming into his own as captain.
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as I was saying I wouldn't fault people like Kiss you past goodbye for believing so. Quantam Theory I was just thinking about that pLUS if they went through singularity couldn't it HAVE transported NERO and SPOCK through TIME AND SPACE? There another dimension? I guess this is all geek theory..lol
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equals going out like a bitch.
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about the alternate reality point. Maybe the original way thing have happened are moving alongside, and it's a matter of shifting between the two perhaps.
Regardless..this is just a bit of an offhand comment, and nothing to really be taken seriously, seeing as how there are no scripts. -
Buried aliiive...
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I think he's just saying he wants the next couple of movies will take place before the time when they would logically start adapting stories from the show.
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Keep it simple fellas my head is hurtin
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that happened in JJs Trek movie. Totally forgettable.
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There's nothing "NEW!" or "revolutionary" about this splintered "Dawson's Trek" timeline. All of the same stories - y'know, the ones the born-again Trekkies call "baggage" - will all be re-hashed all over again. It's inevitable. JJ's Trek essentially assures us that there will never be another original Trek storyline. As I've said countless times before, this is a remake-machine kicked into overdrive. They might mash-up a few elements here or there for zing, but the powers-that-be won't dare fuck with the tried-and-true classics. We will get a Nu-"TWOK" and a "Best of Both Worlds" redux, guaran-fucking-teed. What's old is new again, round and round and round we go.
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So they are outside his original timeline. Hence, alternate reality. It's probably why they used a black hole instead of the normal super warp speed method of time travel. The writers probably saw "The Black Hole" the weekend they anged out the script.
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Just saying, he is floating around out there.
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It's a fucking actor just talking. He doesn't know a goddamn thing about the rules of this new universe or the plans the writers have.Yeesh.
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May 29, 2009 12:41:19 PM CDT
Greenwoods hair wasn't black enough to play Pike
by joker gordon levitt
wah...
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... I'm not against the Borg being used. It's an alternate timeline, our favorite futile-to-resist cyborgs could show up in the Trek Alterverse sooner than they did in the minstream Trekverse. Bearing that in mind... What if the Borg overran and assimilated the Klingon Empire? What if the Klingons proved difficult to assimilate and it was a matter of the Klingon assimilating the Borg as much as vice versa? You end up with the super tech of the Borg combined with the extreme warrior ethics of the Klingons. How could the Federation possibly stand up against an invasion by such an overmatched foe? Just throwing stuff out there to consider, is all.
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May 29, 2009 12:47:00 PM CDT
Merrick: proving he's a functional retard with every story
by tallboy66
It's a throwaway, somewhat gibberish comment from Greenwood that's poorly phrased and you think it's a story? Don't you have to give away Terminator books to anti-Catholic bigots and chuckle over HOW GODDAMN EDGY YOU ARE! Ugh.
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....THIS TIME. AND THE TIME TRAVEL STUFF. AND SPECKWAYPASTHISPRIME. AND NEW PIKE. AND NONSENSICAL PLOTS. AND COMPLETELY RIDICULOUS RUSSIAN ACCENTS...."
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"SHE AND HER PRETTY LITTLE ASSHOLE CAN STAY."
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I have the answer, and JJ needs to work on locking him in now, regardless of if he's in the sequel or the ... sequel to the sequel: Javier Bardem. Game over, I fucking win.
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They could've poked fun at some of Star Trek's lamer moments by having old spock tell young Spock/Kirk about some of the cheesier moments in the show's history that they can now avoid with the new timeline.
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...time travel into the past by its very nature splits off alternate timelines. After all, in the past you remember, your older self never suddenly popped up out of nowhere in a Time Bubble to prevent you from getting a scar and giving you next week's Lotto numbers. When your time-travelling future self returns to your present/future, you return to the timeline you previously existed in, while your alternate self goes on to be a completely scarless millionaire. Too bad for you. But, it's quantum theory, what can you do?
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and stock with cast offs from So you think you can dance and Dancing with the Stars. I want to see Kirk hoofing it to Let's do The time Warp Again.KidZ, your Borg/Klingon idea sounds like it could be niffty. They need to get anybody but Orci and Kutzman to write it.
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you all know this.
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All praise be on to JJ Abrams and his gay writers for they made a Star Trek movie. Tell me again why red matter black holes destroys planets but not space ships unless its the villains space ship and its the end of the movie. Why did Nero just sit back and watch as the crew of the Kelvin escaped. So now Nero waits 25 years. Does some stuff and kills some Klingons (Nobody read the prequel comic to me before I saw the movie) and Nero the miner.. knows that black holes just destroy planets and not ships and that prime Spock will be back 25 years later. Meanwhile Kirk is an asshole and a punk and they shove this character trait down my throat the whole movie in case I can't remember after the first 30 mins of them reminding me. Kirk is a buck toothed ugly punk kid. Now he is a arrogant asshole teenager I get it and he will remain that way the whole movie. Now the ship is leaving and they need to Kirk on board... comedy ensues. Blah Blah blah Nero is back now... Spock is Captain Kirk and Sulu go on a action pack adrenaline rush skydiving mission to Planet Vulcan WHY is it that Vulcan can not find some sort of a laser gun to shoot the drill? It only took Kirk a few rounds to disable it.So in all of Vulcan there are no weapons what so ever no defense force or anything. Nero has Spock and leaves him on Ice planet watches his people die goes in a cave to make a fire. Kirk shows up after that AWESOME ACTION PACK MONSTER CHASE Kirk then pretends to get emotional for a few seconds about billions of Vulcans dying. OH wait here's Scotty with random midget monster whoopy deee dooo! Look at me I'm Nero I have 0 character development I am the main villain. My wive died I hate Spock for trying to help my people but good thing I left the SPOCKS alive so they can kill me later on. LENS flares, extreme face close ups, shaky cam while the actors are just talking!
Scooty is stuck in a tube OH NOES. Spock is mad, Kirk gets to act like a dick head again hurray. Blah blah blah red matters goes in the front of Nero's ship but the black hole is behind Nero's ship now ..so they can survive long enough for last words. OH wait a big explosion will save us now from the black hole good thing Nero and prime Spock never knew that. Scooty and the rest of the crew is now where they need to be and 10 years of history has been crammed into 2 hours. The best movie ever made! All praise and worship Jar Jar Dicknose and his Gay writing Duo for they made a boring movie for dumb kids that had terrible story logic and was an ACTION PACKED JOYRIDE! With horribly shot space ship battles, extreme skydiving, butthole monster chases. Terrible acting, poor direction, pandering comedy, little character development (other than Kirk is an asshole and Spock a bully), insane amount of convenient story telling, glossed over genocide, the movie had on heart and was completely forgettable. SO everybody cheer and congratulate JJ and company for turning Star Trek into Fast and Furious: Mall Cop the greatest movie of the year. I mean it's better then Watchmen, Wolverine, and T4 so it must be a GREAT.... right? I hope AICN continues to post more articles about the greatest movie ever made. I just love how they took Trek dumb it down and made it accessible to ADHD retard generation. The action, plot, directing, acting, music, dialogue, emotional impact, pacing, lens flares, shaky cam, was all very platitudinous. -
How about just making a Star Trek movie with Bruce Greenwood wheeling around and commanding a star ship? I love that guy.
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Javier Bardem.
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If these continue to be good, they should make 4 or 5. Shoot a couple simultaneously. Why the hell not? God knows it's popular.
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... Where Mr. Fantastic invented a cure for Ben's Thingness, but unfortunately it would only have worked on poor old Ben back when he first became the Thing. So of course the Thing then stole Doc Doom's time machine to go back in time and give his past self the Thing-cure when it would have done some good. Of course both Things then fought, (this was a Marvel comic, after all) but finally present-Ben managed to force the Thing-cure down past-Ben's throat and past-Ben immediately changed back to human form. Present-Ben then happily returned to the present but was dismayed to find he was still the Thing. WTF? Then Mr. Fantastic did his Basil Exposition thing and explained that Ben had just split off an alternate timeline where he had been Thing-cured, leaving his own "home" timeline unchanged. Disappointed, but happy to have at least saved one Ben Grimm from his own curse, Ben went off to the rec room to smoke a cigar and get into a fight with Johnny, what else?
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Then maybe Volcan will reappear in the past.
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...he's just an actor speculating on the series. He has nothing to do with it's direction, and never said any of this comes from on high. Dismissed.
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"BUT WHEN SPECK GETS HIM BEHIND CLOSED DOORS I'M WILLING TO BET MAJEL'S FALSE TEETH THAT HE TURNS INTO A SERIOUS NELLY POWER BOTTOM."
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Please read Drew's piece on Hitfix re: TPM 10th anniversary
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"Kirk, my old--errrrr, young friend...How about some nice Tranya?"
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May 29, 2009 1:14:09 PM CDT
BEAKS YOU'RE READING TOO MUCH INTO GREENWOOD'S COMMENTS
by bringingsexyback
But thanks for a new Trekback.
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He needs the money and the trania.
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Once Abrams is done Perry is going to step in and give us all a fat old black guy as kirk, a percoscious young savant (who will be black) as Spock, and a crazy uncle as Bones, who will be black too, and probably dance a lot. The bridge will look like a kitchen, and they will BBQ a lot, and stand out on the deck of the ship and make jokes about how white people walk funny. It's be awesome. And "space" will become Atlanta.
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Except everybody in the real world liked it (see exit polls) and it continues to make money. So, scream all you want, doesn't change the fact that it IS a well received film. Bring on the sequels.
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Tigh gets some
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Are some of you forgetting that they used the transporter to transport a freakin' whale in ST IV???? and guess, what..whales live in water.
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More cliched references to keep the fans happy!
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I loved it too.
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Doesn't matter.
The new timeline has water sensitive transporters. -
After Perry is done, Damon will direct his first film, and make Trek far more sarcastic and ironic. Everyone will frown and give each other sideways looks. Kirk will be Josh Holloway, Spock will be asian, and Sulu will be from Iran, and always talk about how he hates war, then he will kill all the children in the movie, but it will be written in such a way that we will STILL love him. Bones will be a time traveller from Mars who can shape shift, but only when his eyes are closed, do he never knows what shape he takes. And lets not forget, the sarcasm. It will be called Star "Trek" and everyone who says it has to cock an eyebrow, because you know, it's sarcastic to do that. haha.
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Things like V'ger, the Doomsday Machine,the Probe from ST IV, the Borg, are all still out there in the new timeline, so some stories will still happen in some way or another.
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popularity does not equal quality.
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And that is why the general public are idiots.
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I'll see your Transformers and raise you a Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves.
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That should have been a "I'll "match" your Transformers
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#4 - Shrek 2
#6 - The Phantom Menace
need I go on? If I have to, let me just add that #20 is Transformers and #21 is Iron Man. Is anyone in the entire world prepared to say that Transformers is a better film than Iron Man??? -
The movie is a critical success as well. It really pisses you guys off that Abrams made a good Star Trek movie, doesn't it?
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They hate air. Why is it always around? It is so unoriginal. It was better when they were kids. It should just go away, eat a dick, and die in a fire. Fuck air! No one likes it!
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Is Home Alone still in the top 20 grossing films of all time?
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You are my new favorite person.
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LOL!!!
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Two weeks after the film opened?
Do you see the flaw in your argument there? -
Spock Prime would've briefed Starfleet on Khan, VGer, whale probe, Borg, Chang, etc. to avoid unnecessary bloodshed and destruction. Face it. TOS is wiped from reality.
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this is all non-adjusted for inflation though.
and no, I take no pleasure in knocking Star Trek just for the sake of it. I have nothing against JJ, I actually thought MI:3 was pretty good and unfairly maligned. I just think Star Trek was good, rather than GREAT which seems to be the prevailing view of AICN writers. -
going out like a bigger bitch=getting killed by a bridge collapse.
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LET'S TRY NOT TO FORGET THAT.
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I was just thinking yesterday that he really isn't getting the praise I feel he ought to receive for his work in the film.
"You are relieved."
"I am relieved." -
May 29, 2009 1:56:04 PM CDT
I've been waiting for a big budget version of The Menagerie...
by rbatty024
since never. I don't want this timeline to turn into a series of remakes. Instead I want new adventures and new stories. No Khan, no space lizard, no floating Lincoln.
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There's your sequel right there.
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As you start to get into the alternate realities and their ability to concurrently exist, It's starting to sound oddly like what's happening in Fringe. Not an entirely new concept, but interesting none-the-less. Personally I'd like to have them take the Trek universe on it's own path and let the first film and it's Spock/Nero storyline be the end of the ties back to the original...
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But why is everyone suggesting Latino actors for a guy named KHAN SINGH? Montalban got the part in the 60's because they needed a swarthy exotic type and there were no Indian actors on the radar in Hollywood besides, uh, Sabu? I'd love to see Javier Bardem in such a role, but can't we actually cast someone of Indian or even Middle Eastern descent for someone named Khan? It would also make the part more relevant to the real world...after all, Khan was viewed as a terrorist, but in his mind "WE OFFERED THE WORLD ORDER!"
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remakes/reboots/reimaginings are total horseshit. Invent something NEW that people will still be talking about in 20 years time.
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"Indian, Asian, or even Middle Eastern descent."
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Different sci-fi worlds have different models, and what you describe is not how the Star Trek model of time travel has ever worked. There have been countless episodes about time travel, and it's always the same. When you make changes in the past, your old time line is gone. The only person who remembers it is you, and there's no way to get back to it except to fix the changes. It doesn't continue to exists. The reason you don't lose a scar is because you're outside of the timeline already when the change happened.It's not necessarily a better model than what you describe, but it is the established one that has been used in kajillions of Star Trek episodes already.
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May 29, 2009 2:08:04 PM CDT
i wondered why spoke didnt just go back in time to save romulus
by castiel
it's not as if he's not done it before. i'd love to see a mirror image universe on the big screen. it might end up being a bit confusing a cheesy though. an evil mirror universe of an alternative reality. my head hurts just thinking about it. no Klingons stick with romulans as the bad guys. the only other thing i wanted to see was all crews on the big screen togther, but that will never happen. without the aid of Q....
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That the "alternate reality" theory was described by the Enterprise bridge crew and not by Old Spock? Time Travel was a logical conclusion. Adding the "alternate reality" line was pointless exposition and should have come from the future Spock who would actually know the timeline was wrecked up. Finally, hot as Saldana was, Abram obviously changed the triangle dynamic from Kirk-Spock-McCoy to Kirk-Spock-Uhura and the characters suffered a bit for it. Yes, yes, girl power, give Uhura something to do. Whatever.
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No. But then I was in the UK when I was at "High school".
Thanks for the concern though.
I don't judge a films popularity by visiting a web site. It's currently rated HIGHER than Slumdog.
Do you see?
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Just remember, when any situation does not have a logical or scientific explanation they will rely on good ole Q.
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Slumdog is a great movie, but I don't understand why they make all the commercials filled with horrible dancing, like it's some sort of musical Bollywood flic. There wasn't even any dancing in the actual film. That was something they had as the credits were rolling.
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Are you bleeding nuts? Yes you are reading a ton of crap into that.
He has no say about whats going to happen, he probably knows nothing, nor do they most likely. And nothing is written.
Perhaps he personally thinks, like a lot others, that vulcan shouldn't have been destroyed, but he says nothing of value, only vague rubbish.
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I think that was done to appeal to audiences in the east. They love a good song and dance.
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..The Death Star will destroy the rebel base with Luke on it, and Leia will become a lesbian.
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...after being dropped off on an ice planet during which she will bump into yoda, who just happened to be on a fishing holiday.
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Just put Star Trek in the headline and the TB explodes. Even if there's NO INFORMATION WHATSOEVER in the fucking article. Seriously, what's the point??
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He has nothing to do with writing or developing the scripts. His only input is delivering lines somebody else wrote in front of the camera. His opinions on where the story will/should go from here carries as much weight as a forum poster's does.
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Little late, but sir you summed it up perfectly. Very well said. All, if you missed his post, read it, and if you read it, reread it. Perfect. Alas, the film is making major bank, so JJ's universe WILL go on, canon be damned (or in this case, erased). At least we'll always have the DVD's.Again, not to repeat myself, but WHY was TNG, DS9, VGR, TOS, and all the movies wiped clean yet freakin' ENTERPRISE remains canon??? ENTERPRISE!?Also, I do understand that Spock's line about this being an alternate reality/timeline is there to say that technically somethere the old canon is still going, but really, for all intents and purposes, it's gone and that line was thrown in there as basically a way to tell us diehards (or, geeks, or nerds, whatever you prefer) to "Shut up, your 40 years of canon are still there! It's just that they'll never be mentioned again . . . but they're there!!!" Just my thoughts.Oh, and lens-flares rule, even indoors on the bridge!" :-P
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it makes NO SENSE WHATSOEVER that the characters (especially Spock, Spocklet *LOL* and Kirk) wouldn't want to reset the timeline. there have been countless episodes (and STAR TREK: FIRST CONTACT) where the characters did everything they could to restore the original flow of time. so why would they suddenly NOT CARE??? I can only HOPE that Spock is already developing a plan to reset time at the end of the new movie. perhaps, when he's saying "thrusters full ahead" to himself, he's seeing the first stages of that plan happening, with Kirk becoming captain. anyway, if they go on MAKING the characters simply ignore the changed timeline CONTRARY to their natural behavior, then the writers simply suck.
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You going to make a top-level post next time you take a dump? Seriously, what's the point of this? Some tertiary cast member mused a bit, and you've gotta post this? Who the fuck gave you the keys to this site?
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I certainly don't have a problem with new actors playing the "classic" roles, and it's possible ninety-nine percent of the new cast could have acquitted themselves nicely (except Yelchin, who was just terrible) had they been given a script that didn't require them to behave like a bunch of semi-retarded teenagers, or a director who wasn't hell-bent on reaching today's youth. The main problem, as discussed above, is that they lacked the balls to actually REBOOT "Star Trek" and instead tried to be all things to all people. Putting Nimoy in the movie did two horrible things: remind us that the new cast isn't the original cast and try to actually justify the existence of the new film by tying it to the other films. Plus, now, you have some kind of Vulcan super-genius from the future, even an "alternate" future, whose previous meddling wiped out Romulus and Vulcan, plus killed Kirk's dad ... Christ only knows what dumb shit he'll introduce to these guys to make things worse. In my opinion, the movie would probably have been both palatable and made more sense if they'd just bit the bullet and started "Trek" over from scratch. No ... I take that back. It still would have been lousy. Carry on, then.
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Honestly, how could anyone think this is some sort of inside information? Someone asked Greenwood where he thought potential sequels would go and he GUESSED! DUH! he even says he HOPES the connection between Pike and Kirk continue. If he had some inside scoop....wouldn't he KNOW THAT already? My god you guys are starving for any spec of news, even when it's not remotely news!
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You beat me to it. That's one of my pet peeves.
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Hi Merrick,
I was one of the winners of the Star Trek CD contest you handled with Varese through this website back on May 5 (Enrique Guemez from Cincinnati).
As of today, May 29, I have still not received the CD. Was there a problem?? I have sent you two previous e-mails without response.
I am looking forward to your response.
Thanks -
This has probably been explained on here before but I've not seen the answer. Anyway, so Nero destroys Vulcan to show Spock how it feels, and then wages a war on the federation so that the Romulan homeworld will be safe in the new timeline.... but didn't his planet get taken out by a Supernova? No art of his plan seemed to have anything to do with preventing a supernova! OK so he was 150 or so years prior to the event but he didn't actually do anything to stop it happening again?!
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You guys did see the movie right?
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... this was the best Trek movie since Khan.
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That is all.
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Face it, JJ Abrams, his writers, and Paramount execs, seriously screwed-up. All they had to do to reset the timeline, is have the Enterprise either jump to Nero's future/present and stop him from launching his mission in the first place, which should have been the drive of the story, or jump back into the past and attack Nero and ship...when they first arrived in the past, or third, jump to the future/present and stop older Spock from interceding in saving Romulus, or help him to succeed in saving Romulus. It would have taken JJ Abrams and his writers the same amount of screen time to do it, as they spent giving us a lousy conclusion to their lousy film, which played like a flawed tv movie? However, this kind of story has been handled brilliantly elsewhere. Again, as I have, in the past, I refer all of you to Stargate: Continuum, you should rent it, or buy in on DVD. Oh boy, that was a smart piece of writing and direction!!! Why? Because clearly, the writers and producers of that series clearly understand science fiction and fantasy...where as JJ Abrams and his writers take science fiction cliches parot them and throw them around without really understanding the rules of the science fiction and fantasy genre, and that is what killed the new Star Trek film dramatically.Abrams and Paramount got away with selling this film through an avalanche of media hype, but there is a growing backlash, much like there was with Superman Returns, Twilight, Star Wars: Phantom Menace, and Attack Of The Clones. Now, Paramount got away with luring people to the theaters this time, we know that, but I suspect as this movie reaches full DVD, cable, and satelite saturation levels with first time, and repeat audiences...the gospel view on this film will shift to a majority opinion that the new Star Trek film is horribly flawed...and painfully, and plainly, a bad film. It's just an uneven blend of Star Trek: Generations meets Star Trek: Nemesis, Star Trek: Insurrection, and Star Trek: First Contact--the first three, all being lousy films. Now, JJ Abrams, because of his unrepaired Star Trek timeline, is facing the same issues that Superman Returns, and any potential sequels face with the super kid, who intrudes on any further stories...and of course, the issues of Superman being made to appear to be a super stalker, all elements that you just can't steer around in a sequel...and this is the problem with Abram's Star Trek...he has now opened-up a can of worms for himself regarding the alternative timeline...and that will dog any future Star Trek sequels that he, or anyone else, tries to mount.
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First thing I thought when they blew up Vulcan was: Well there goes Amok Time, Journey to Babel, Balance of Terror, and certain plot points from a half dozen other episodes (like the Vulcan ship in Immunity Syndrome) not to mention tons of TNG episodes as well... Frankly I think I'd have missed this stuff less if they'd just done a straight up reboot like Casino Royale and left out all the time travel. All of this is still quibbling though. Still love the movie. That said what i don't want is a trilogy about old Spock reversing things again to save Vulcan with the genesis wave or something..
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i forget who said that but ummmm, just see the look on Spock's face when he saw him in the cave,aside from the fact he called him Jim right away, he clearly immediately recognized him. They aren't pretending anybody looks different because its an alternate timeline, as someone else said, we're supposed to believe they are the same people but younger.
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so far, this was the BEST film in the last 6 months.It was better than my expectations(unlike TERMINATOR SALVATION and WATCHMEN)_-and i look forward to the sequel, and OLE Bruce-shut your old face up! You don't know jack, and shouldn't tease...you old fucker!
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TRUE STORY, THAT.
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IF THE terminator's dodgy rubber head will made a CAMEO?
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this whole alternate timeline thing wont cause problems, it solved them. they can now do whatever the hell they want, like blow up vulcan for example. they have no history or canon to adhere to, they started their own universe. they dont have to avoid things, change things, walk on eggshells because "such and such happened this way on the series or the older movies". of course as others have mentioned, they didnt even really need the alternate timeline for that, thats why they call it a reboot. i mean i doubt anybody is gonna complain because Nolan's Batman movies are doing things different than the first 4. so yeah they didnt NEED to do it but they did and that was the point.
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The film has taken in a new generation who found TOS boring, without thinking about the moral tales it told. Original Trek always tries to make you think what would be the best course of action for the characters to take, and what will be the implications of their actions?
The new Trek seems like a future where genocide and mutiny are throwaway plot devices.
Spock saw his entire race almost reach extinction. What does he do? He goes off into retirement. -
"SERIOUSLY. WE ARE SITTING HERE TOGETHER MAKING MAJEL DO UNSPEAKABLE THINGS WITH A HORSE, AND CHATTING ABOUT THE NEW TREK."
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May 29, 2009 3:33:08 PM CDT
TITBAG WOULD GO BACK IN TIME AND BUGGER HIS FATHER AS A CHILD
by bringingsexyback
I read that in his journal. True story.
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YOU ARE COMING UP WITH SOME SCREENPLAY GEM IDEAS TODAY, YOU WELSH GIT.
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by Titbag Sr. .Co.uk perhaps?
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Quite the opposite. He went off to start a new vulcan colony... which will take a lot of work. If you want to criticize a movie, you should probably get your facts straight.
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and no Kurtzman and Orci. Imagine how cool ballroom dancing would be in low gravity.
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Wouldn't it already have been colonized by some Federation culture by this time? I hope this doesn't turn out to be some Israel/Palestine deal. Or ... if it was, would make a great sequel plot.
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May 29, 2009 3:41:59 PM CDT
ONE THING'S FOR SURE: GONNA BE A WHOLE LOT OF PON FARRING
by bringingsexyback
on New Vulcan.
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Enjoy that shitty Voyager series losers!
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Titbag Sr.: "Expanding your colony."
*Unzips pants* -
Hopefully it's not seti alpha 5...
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Whatever. He saw Romulus destroyed, then saw his home world wiped out. Then he raised an eyebrow. It doesn't matter. You're boring me now, and I'd take this outside with you but I'm afraid I don't live in your care home.
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... I just assume that transporters have some method of clearing away any gaseous or liquid matter in the space into which a person is beamed. I mean, when they beam down onto a planet, the space into which they are transported is still filled with matter, it's just matter in the form of the various gasses which make up an atmosphere. The person being beamed would still fuse with this matter and be killed, so obviously the transporter needs to clear a space (probably through the use of some kind of force field that projects down sort of shoves this matter aside, making a brief "hole" an instant before the person's molecules are beamed down). This method would work on gaseous matter and be just enough to do the same with liquids (a safety precaution in case someone gets beamed into a pond or puddle or, hell, even a rainstorm). Doing the same with solid matter, however, would be too difficult and energy-consuming so it only works on gasses and liquids. Solved this dilemma, then. Harry! Where's my goddamn No-Prize?!
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I enjoyed Star Trek, but it was so flawed had some dumb moments. I think people are overrating this film at this time. Media Messiah is right.
Voyager was passable. Waitaminute, where were the Federation Timeships when Vulcan blew up? -
....much like many other fans (and much to the dismay of the fat, disgruntled STAR TREK haters).
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It was 25 years from the time that Nero appeared to when Jim Kirk takes over, so isn't ENTERPRISE the TV show also altered?I just hope that the writers put more thought into incorporating some TOS into the newer scripts. The possibilities are endless. I'd like to see what else had changed because of the events in ST. Lastly, weren't there temporal/time cops to make sure that the timeline isn't altered? Where are they? Next movie?I thought the new Trek was a fun ride, but I'm hoping the next one is better. Orci/Kurtzman have a lot of work to do to explain what else has changed.
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What a keen intellect.
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For not remembering Spock's farewell exactly, I will rewatch it when it's shown on the BBC.
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SHUT THE FUCK UP
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WE ARE HAVING A SERIOUS TREK DISCUSSION IN THIS TB AND YOU ARE NOT WELCOME.
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Nero's appearance is after that series, so it's still there. The only thing that's changed are everything TOS and past it.
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Obviously this is all made up crap becasue so far as we in the real world know, time tarvel is still made up crap, but since we're all geeking out over here about made up crap, I thought I would put forth my made up crap.
Since almost all of the time travel we have seen before hase been in starships with active warp fields (that have been explained as warping time as well as space) being slingshot or some such to achieve time travel, maybe that keeps their movement along one timeline, where everything they do is part of the secret history of that timeline anyway. Nero and spock coming back through an artificially created short-lived singularity (is that any different from a black hole) put them back into a point in histiry where a real change could be made, thereby splitting off a new timeline in accordance with current quantum theory.
Wondergeek powers, DE-Activate!!! -
AND I WILL BE CREATING MY OWN REBOOT USING MY OLD CAMCORDER AND I GUARANTEE THAT IT WILL BE BETTER THAN THAT HORRID FUCKING PIECE OF SHIT MOVIE THAT WE WERE JUST MADE TO SUFFER THROUGH.
MY SURPRISE ENDING? I'M GOING TO LIGHT THE CHEKOV BOBBLEHEAD ON FIRE AND TELL IT YAKOV SMIRNOFF JOKES WHILE THE CREDITS ROLL.
I KNOW YOU'RE ALL EXCITED. ME TOO. -
"but there is a growing backlash..." Uh, no, there isn't. It's still holding at 95% on rottentomatoes, is the best reviewed of the summer blockbusters so far, is the highest grossing domestic picture of the year so far, is about to cross the $200 million dollar mark this weekend, and is catching up to The Voyage Home as the 2nd most successful film in the franchise. Yeah, that's some backlash, genius. Unlike The Phantom Menace, this movie had a charming cast that performed very well. And unlike Superman Returns, it was not depressing. The Star Trek sequel, in case you haven't heard, is due in 2011 (where's that Superman sequel?). And it will be an even bigger hit than this one. Your comparisons are completely invalid.
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Holy crap. That was actually funny.
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I felt the Trek film was very enjoyable and sufficiently respectful to the source material. I'd certainly go see any additional Trek films that Abrams makes.
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..that Spock had simply accepted the new timeline and carried on with life with an indifferent attitude.
I watched it once and forgot about it. Sue me.
My use of "whatever" was for your benefit I'm afraid. I don't normally use it. -
...WILL FEATURE UHURA LICKING KIRKS BUTTHOLE WHILE HE WATCHES OLD JEAN COCTEAU FILMS. IT'S GONNA BE WORTH THE PRICE OF THE DVD ALONE. TRUST ME.
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comparing trek to superman returns is proof that u dont watch the movies u talk about ....returns was not a "reboot", it was a supposed sequel to superman 2, ignoring 3, 4..and the reason that failed was that it plain ol sucked plotwise and scriptwise...kent in smallville with glasses, superkid, dumb superman...trek is a complete reboot..if the plot was what u described it woulda been pointless to have the events that did happen, happen at all...nero blows up the kelvin with kirks dad, blow up vulcan...and the enterprise goes back in time and stops it from happening, end of movie??? and you think that is a good movie ?? just to preserve your precious trek timeline...no one wants to see the events flow out of supposed trek cannon....u geeks wanted that for "enterprise" and it essentially killed a great show that has the exact same premise as this movie..i love the stargate mini movies as well but there is no comparison...stargate in general has always maintained the status quo by the end of a movie or episode, they dont hav the balls to do anything else ,like kill off a major character, thats why t'lk is like 150yrs old or something with a wierd patch of grey..no balls "gonna fix everything by the end of the movie" mentality is boring, im sooo glad u want that for future installments of trek... predictable, boring, fixable....no wonder u post here alll day long...u are boring, closed minded, and unbendable.....and genrations, insurrection, and nemesis were not "lousy" films...were they super films? no, but ive seen far worse come out of hollywood the last few years...and u should really detail these supposed "rules" of science fiction sometime...id love to hear the RULES. geez man..are u serious ??? are the SCIFI RULES sitting right next to TREK CANON on your GEEK BOOKCASE, in the aisle called MUST NEVER MESS WITH THIS ??? i bet it is.
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2011 until the sequel? Cool! I'm really looking forward to it. I may see Star trek a third time in the forthcoming days.
As to theories for the next film, as much as the writers would love to play with the Khan character, I don't think they should. They visited a similar theme in Enterprise, no need to go back there.
They've brought new life to the series, no need to rehash. -
Star Trek will not be returning to the Roddenberry universe.
Stop acting as if it's all meant to tie together at the end of some reboot trilogy.
The next ep may focus on Spacefleet Kindergarten. -
The original universe was huge and had almost infinite potential. A Firefly type series would have been great. A different view of the Federation perhaps?
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when I looked.
I'd lambast you for that, but I'm above that sort of criticism. -
This movie kicked the shit out of your cookie cutter, safe, sci-fi.
Star Trek owns you. -
please tell me how sticking to canon would have made for a more enjoyable movie going experience?
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Probably not, given the quality of the script.
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I MISSED YOU AND THOUGHT YOU'D NEVER GET HERE.
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I know you missed me, my posts are epic and informative. I guess it's time to school the kiddos again eh Shitbag? Well let's snap to it.
PUNCH IT. -
arguing with Christian Bale... if Bale sat on his ass in his mom's basement and ate donuts and pizza all day.
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Khan, the Borg, and Klingons for the sequel. They are too expected and predicted. Since you've successfully rebooted and the skies the limit, let's play on that and bust out some serious shit that has never happened before in Trek. Now that it has a budget and large scope, let's see the next film live up to the potential premise without re-treading on stock villains and old concepts.
You guys have unlimited freedom to imagine so go for it. -
It's all in good fun, and livens up the discussion
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I'M THE SWEETHEART OF THE TB'S.
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I went with my wealthy software genius nerd brother in law, who own every DVD of every series and can recite a plot when told the name of an episode. He loved the movie. What is lost for me the passive fan by not sticking to canon? I think just baggage.
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Where's those tired ole whores Bones, Asimov lives, Industry shitter, and the other fucks?
Come on you guys the games a foot. -
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php? term=titbag
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How many times have we been shown that the Federation of Planets knows how to travel through time, not withstanding future/present Spock's understanding of such rules, he did it himself in the new movie, but none of them, the cast of characters, including Spock, young or old, thinks to say, "Hey, we can save the lives of 6 billion Vulcans...and how many billion Romulans...and their planets, and even a sun BTW, by just traversing to the future/present and making sure that Romulus and its sun survive? Now that is just lousy writing at its worst...and lazy at that.It is the new Star Trek that makes no sense, not me. JJ Abrams and team could have simply repaired the timeline, and shown that a few minor things are still off...by showing future Spock with a wife maybe, a future, and older Uhura? They would have still been able to play with the timeline, but things would have had something of an order to them--now, however, it is just a complete mess? Like Kirk would not have reason to save his father's life if he could, and Spock, he wouldn't want to save his mother and his home planet...and all those billions of people of two separate but related worlds? They have trime travelled in the Star Trek universe in the past for a lot less reason before, why not now with a all those lives on the line?Lastly, JJ Abrams could have simply shown us the Star Trek adventures that we have never seen before. The same old crew, just starting out as young people on their first missions. The timeline would not have affected that either way, nor would it have affected set Star Trek histories, as we would not be getting into any of that lore as this would be pre-original Star Trek. For instance, it would have been nice to see James Kirk square-off with Finagin, his old Star Fleet Academy foe, or his past loves. It is these types of moments and characters, that Abrams missed a great opportunity to exploit.
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Did you make enough money lap-dancing to see Trek a couple more times? You still haven't broke my record, 5 showings. Now that's what I'm talking about.
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TRYING TO EXPLAIN THE FUCKING NONSENSICAL PLOT THAT WILL NO DOUBT ACCOMPANY THE NEXT JJ TREK JUST LIKE IT DID THIS ONE. YOU CAN START NOW, IF YOU'D LIKE.
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Spock and Nero didn't use conventional time-travel to alter history. Suppose the crew travels back in time to try to save Vulcan? So what? It would still end up the same result because what could they do, the Narada was a sophisticated 24th century ship that would decimate the Enterprise or even a fleet if they assembled it. So tell me O' barrel of monkey nuts and inspirer of original ideas, what exactly could Kirk and crew do to prevent the Narada from annihilating Vulcan? Time travel isn't supposed to be used a crutch every time an event plays out that no one likes the outcome. Otherwise if Kirk banged a blue chick and her taint stunk to high heaven he would just start traveling back in time every week to avoid the bitch.
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of non-consentual ass-to-mouth.. Mea culpa.'
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Well I'm hoping they avoid what's expected- Klingons etc. They have an opportunity to boldly go where no man has gone before and do something spectacular with a large budget and epic scale.
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I'd buy that for a dollar!
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"JJ Abrams could have simply shown us the Star Trek adventures that we have never seen before." Yeah, right, and been limited by all the existing canon? No thanks. I don't want to know that Kirk is going to someday die by falling off a rock. A fresh start is a good thing; it was time. And I see you're backing off comparing this movie to Superman Returns, now that I've pointed out how wrong you are. Good. One was a failure, the other a success. No comparison.
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OMFG. MAYBE WITH ALL THE MONEY YOU'VE GIVEN JJ SO FAR HE'LL BE ABLE TO AFFORD A DECENT WRITER NEXT TIME OUT.
*TITBAG DUCKS AS EVERY FUCKING DOUCHEBAG FAILED WRITER IN THIS TB RAISES THEIR HANDS AND YELLS 'ME, ME!'* -
It's simpler than that. They shouldn't have touched time travel at all. I also would have loved to see Kirk's early days to see how he became the man he is in TOS. We sort of see it, but are persuaded to believe in a dumb "destiny" idea. Even though Voyager is below par Trek, perhaps Abrams should have listened to Janeway's original philosophy?
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They basically dispensed with the routine and episodic aspects with a kickass reboot giving you the quintessential essence of the Trek concept.
"Hi Finnegan, I'm Jim you cock. Hi Ruth, bang me. Hi Ariel Shaw, bang me. Oh, Ben you left the plate off that atomic generator so you get demoted. Oh you are naming your daughter after me? nice. Hi Carol, wanna have a son? "
We didn't need to see all of this shit talk about slowing the narrative down. All of this still occured we can assume between scenes and while Kirk was accelerating through the academy. We simply didn't need to see such drivel. -
May 29, 2009 4:51:42 PM CDT
Slkboxrman: Superman Returns Was A Sequel And A Reboot Of Sorts
by media messiah
Superman Returns was a re-imaging meets a sequel...and it did not work because its vision was all over the place? Bryan Singer was too afraid to steer it too far away from the original, fearing fans and critics, and yet, he was attempting to add new elements...and new motivations for the characters, therein, and due to his, and the studio's, reluctance to chose a clear path, the film failed to have a clear voice for itself, and the same is true of the new Trek, this isn't a reboot, per say, it is a prequel/sequel, and the timeline issue was only JJ Abrams and the studio trying to hedge their bets on a reboot...just in case of a fan backlash, just as they used time travel to get them into the predicament, they could always use time travel, as a story device to get them out of any issues with fans and critics, if they arose, without being penned in.It's just like with Lost, there is really no story there, JJ Abrams was asked by the network to rip-off Survivor and make a scripted drama version of it. JJ is always good at starting a concept, but he is sloppy on its completion, because with him, it is all about duping his audiences and the studios (that he works with), into thinking he knows where he is going with a concept, when the truth is, he is just like most people, willing to lie to get a job--end of story.
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I suppose if that doesn't happen in the new timeline, I can sortof accept the film.
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Who is still talking about the Star Trek movie? It was the hot topic for 2 weeks. Nobody has mentioned it since.
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I haven't given J.J. enough money yet! I'm going to stipen my paycheck and send him and Bob a weekly allotment. I'm still gunning for that reference to crewman Joshua Vance in the sequel. I'm a dirty Trek whore you know.
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May 29, 2009 4:57:01 PM CDT
Alan_Moore: The Only Things Abrams Couldn't Touch Are...
by media messiah
...the Romulans, The Borg, The alternate Mirror Universe, and Khan...if he were to respect the original time line, but there are plenty of stories to tell elsewhere, with the Klingons...and even alien races that were never referenced on the original series, or were only slightly touched upon.
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Are you serious? What in God's name else are we gonna discuss ad infinitum? Terminator: Apologisation? Gi Hoe? Fatatar?
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He takes a throwaway comment from Greenwood and actually somehow manages to spin it in his functionally challenged brain and think that he means it would reset the reset continuity, which is a fucking absurd notion. Also, Merrick is a flat-out biggot who dropped a ban for being CALLED out on it, yet he gives away free prizes to people who hate on religion and keeps Titbag going and posting who clearly spews bile with every post. Merrick is a hypocrite and a horrible human being. Period. The end. And this story is absolute bullshit.
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...because you TALKBACK too much. Seriously, 500 posts a day on the same topic is wayyyyyyyy too much, my little fat friend. We know that you hated this movie...because you told us more than 15,000 times this month. If you can't get a job, maybe you should take up a hobby OUTSIDE of your mother's basement. The sunshine-induced Vitamin D and a little exercise might do you some good. Who knows? You might actually meet people who aren't typing on a keyboard. However, something tells me that you are going to stick around and mock anyone who disagrees with your disgruntled opinion.
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They should have just given us prequel adventures without the time travel business. Harve Bennett, a former Trek producer, had a wonderful Star Fleet Academy script that was written about 16 years ago. It was largely stripped for it parts to form the script for the new movie which is now in theaters. The film script had a bookend story featuring the older Kirk and Spock reminiscing about their past, when we flash back to that past, and witness their first adventures together and how they met. The screenplay, concludes as it began, with the two older men in conversation about their past...which trails off to their present day concerns.
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Shatner as evil mirror universe "Tiberius" with the Starship Tiberius, against Pine as young hot rod Kirk and the starship Enterprise? Epic fucking screen machismo and testosterone!
I'd buy that fucking shit for a dollar! -
...have a basement where children live? If you believe this site, there's bloody millions!
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It wasn't wonderful. I've read it.
God dammit it was written by David Loughery. Did you like Star Trek V's script? -
Are you making fun of LOST now? Wow...it is one of the best shows on television in my 20+ yrs of life. This new TREK movie will pass $200 Million this afternoon. It is (so far) the highest grossing movie of the year and will finish with TWICE the box office gross of WATCHMEN (and FIRST CONTACT, for that matter). It is so funny that the guys who hated this movie spend their lives away spreading their hate...over and over again. WE HEARD YOU ALREADY. The 10 guys who repeat their strong hatred for this film in these talkbacks (over and over again) have made their point: They represent a small minority of people who watched the film. Most people actually liked the movie -- and they hate the fact that the VAST MAJORITY of fans feel that their opinion is irrevelant.
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It's really no different than me spreading and professing my undying delight and joy with the new movie over and over. It stirs discussions after all otherwise we'd have nothing to talk about except how dreadful and awful Shitinator was.
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Abrams could have given us that script, and still relaunched the franchise successfully. As it is, the CORE of the original idea is lost. Wagon train to the stars.
It's a shame that Enterprise failed, but I'm hoping that the old Trek isn't dead, and that someone will present something new to us set in that timeline. -
"They should have just given us prequel adventures without the time travel business." Nah. I am a 20 year Trek fan, but I'm fine with the idea of open ended storytelling opportunities. Like I said, I don't want to know what's going to happen to all these characters eventually. And if they had gone with a straight up prequel, every nerd in the world would have ripped them apart for the sets and costumes not looking exactly as pre-1966 Trek should, and you know it. As Kirk once said, "Young minds, fresh ideas." After four decades of the Prime timeline, it was time.
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boring and stupid.
But today, you people are entertaining me.
Feud on. -
No, every home doesn't have a basement where fat, tact-deficient fanboys live. However, the talkbacks at AICN seems to have been attracting them for about a decade. Ever since some "witty genius" cried about George Lucas "raping" their childhood, the intolerant basement dwellers have shown up in force. They spew their hatred for anyone who has an opinion that differs from their own. They fling their disgusting hate-poo at anyone who disagrees with their opinions. They get very angry when people call them out for what they are: lonely, fat, disgruntled 30+ yr olds who couldn't make a living for themselves...or find someone who will love them for their chronicly BIPOLAR personalities. They make medication for their condition...but there doesn't seem to be a cure yet.
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It's actually now finally, BACK to where it should be.
It simply took a film to get us there.
Star Trek as a concept has demonstrated over time it needed to be reigned in back to what worked. Captain James T Kirk of the starship Enteprise on a 5 year mission of exploration.
The Rick Berman era series diluted the Star Trek concept and it lost it's bearing.
So how do you basically get back to where you should be , what audiences identify with, and yet try , at least try to honro what's come before?
You make a movie about the original core characters, update the technology a bit, not step on canon by having it in another reality, yet end up all ready to go with the five year mission baby.
That's a monumental fucking task to even take on and J.J. and Bob have Kirk swollen bloated hand size sacks even attenpting that shit.
So now we are ready to go, the Enterprise under Kirk is ready for it's 5 year mission. -
JJ could have updated the look of Trek without having to create an alternate timeline. Look, most of the casual viewers will not give a damn about that, they will simply say, 'Hey it was non stop action dude. Yeah, so stupid plot, but it was non stop action dude.' And that is exactly the attitude JJ banked on. On these and other boards we can bebate the merits of faults of what he did - and I think it was indeed lazy writing and bad direction and vision for the most part. Although I will admit that the movie did not offend me and I was entertained while I watched it. But it has severe and stupid faults that could have very easily been corrected with just a little thought. And that is the maddening thing.
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I saw this with a bunch of Star Trek fans and they didn't even mind that the alternative timeline technology was different. They accepted it and understood that the original series was dated. They couldn't have stayed true to the original sets and costumes anyway.
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"This is not you father's JJ Star Trek" will be the slogan. You can purchase the tickets online and the movie will be downloaded into your brain.
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However, with a 40 year legacy you start stepping on canon. The new film gives us a chance to revisit the core Trek characters and not violate canon by putting it in another reality.
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First off, this isn't news. Secondly - after reading AICN for over ten years I've finally got a login because, entertaining and hilarious and interesting as it is - the volume of spleen being vented by joyless fucks who couldn't enjoy Star Trek FOR WHAT IT WAS - that is a successful endeavour in taking a franchise that NO ONE CARED ABOUT anymore, and giving it a shot in the arm and bringing it screaming back into the public consciousness - boggled my mind. No, it wasn't Next Generation, DS9 are (thank fuck) anything like Voyager, so I understand the hardcore thinking they've somehow been betrayed. But after watching the boxset of the Original Series' first season - you know what it was? It was far more true to the spirit of adventure prevalent in all those episodes. A little less nuanced, louder, faster, yes - but say it with me.... It was truer to the original Trek than anything that came after. The Original Trek being THE ONLY TREK THAT ANYONE EXCEPT THE HARDCORE FANS GAVE A FUCK ABOUT. EVER.
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Well said.
Apart from my spat with MattMan (no offence intended, I was caught up in the debate) I like the talkbacks. People intentially post to get a reaction, and that's part of the fun, but some go too far.
Josh, you've given me food for thought there. I came out of the cinema a little deflated, but apart from the problems, it was a solid sci-fi film. If old Trek is dead, so be it.
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YOU FUCKING NANCY-BOYS. AND I'M A PRODUCT OF PARTHENOGENESIS SO I HAVE NO MUM AND DAD.
NEXT. -
I love the original series, dug most of the original crew movies, enjoyed the Next Generation for a while, even DS9.... but Trek had been hammered into the ground. The new crew have kicked it in the arse and put it back into gear. Live with it. Star Trek belongs to everyone again. Sorry 'bout that.
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Wow. Well said. Too bad the TB apes will fling their hate-poo at you for sharing your opinion.
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Thanks pal, someone had to say it. Figured after reading the TBs since '97 and never saying anything.... May as well make an entrance.
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but I'm ok with the movie, dumb as it is. Well cast, well shot, pretty consistently thrilling (to a fault at times). Could've done without 'Planet Coincidence/Expostion', Scotty in the tubes, and a few other things. But the way they changed the timeline from Kirk's birth on allows for any number of changes in the ST Universe, and so I'm ok with it. Eric Bana still sucks, tho. Bring on Kahn!
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You would like to believe that, wouldn't you? In reality, you are a worthless, fat 30+ yr old guy with no future, no friends and no hope for human interaction...except to throw hate-poo at those who disagree with your peculiar opinions. Don't worry. We do feel sorry for you. Now take your medication like a good, little fat 30+ yr old disgruntled basement dweller. It might take you to a "happy place."
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May 29, 2009 5:39:38 PM CDT
Anyone else hear that Leonard Nimoy is under contract...
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
...to do at least one more STAR TREK film? I think that I read that in a JJ Abrams interview on some LOST fansite. It would be good to see him again...or maybe even have him onboard the Enterprise as a consultant during the next great space catastrophe.
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I'm a life-long Trek fan, and when even "I" have to tune Trek out, there's a fucking problem, and over time Trek seriously lost all of it's allure. It became diluted, safe, predictable, and entirely lost it's own meaning and purpose. Star Trek works best when it's condensed down like any other entertainment property to it's core precepts. Star Trek is about a man named Kirk, aboard a starship called Enterprise. Case closed, end of story. If you make Star Trek about any ole Captain aboard any ole ship or space station, what's the fucking point?
It was getting dangerous there awhile with some of the ideas coming out, a series about Federation marines, Section 31, time police, FUCK. ALL. OF. THAT. SHIT.
Star Trek will endure now because it has shed the bullshit and has been re-invigorated back to its essence. Kirk. Spock. Enterprise. 5 year mission. -
He's suitably scary/cool with lightning flashing around him and his "Welcome back, Spock!". And I love his final scene as the camera shakes around him while the black hole eats his ship.
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It was cool seeing a working class blue collar Romulan without all of the pmop and formality that typically accompanies Romulan military commanders.
This guy was out driving the truck and his homew blew up. -
Bang on. Loved the early scene on the viewscreen. "Hi Christopher. I'm Nero." Someone the other day on here intimated that there's a "New Hope" effect going on with the new Trek. I'd second that. People who'd avoid it like the plague are going. And going back. Hell, one of my friends, a 40 year old woman who'd usually give ANY sci-fi a very wide berth, was dragged kicking and screaming to see it, and then raved about it being the best time she'd had at the cinema in years.
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I also remember reading that JJ Abrams considered a Shatner cameo, but decided against it. He said that it would not vibe with the tone of the film. However, is it possible that Abrams is open to negating the pointless "death" of Kirk from Star Trek 7: Generations? Regardless, I think that the sun is once again rising on the TREK franchise. Too bad the basement dwellers won't just sit back and enjoy it...preferring to watch the old sunrise (and sunset) on DVD. $5 says that Dr. Carol Marcus shows up in the next film though. ;-)
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He could seriously mess with the potential new future this film has created. Or could he? He's the lynchpin of the new reality. Personally I hope he lives out the rest of his days with green skinned girls on a remote planet.
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If you follow the argument that "time travel is easy so we should save Vulcan" - why not erase a lot of other story lines thereby saving a lot of lives.
When we have reversed the Timeline we should have Kirk going back in time to warn Chekov not to visit Botany Bay in ST2. that will save Spock and Kirks son.
And Picard could go back and atop himself from being sent to the delta quadrant meeting the borg in Q Who" - thereby saving a lot of people from Wolf 359 and himself from getting assimilated.
And so on and on and on.....
Of course they shouldn't reset the storyline. That story would only interest a few ultra hardcore fans. -
No movie without the OG crew would or could be considered canon. And that is fine. It is well past time to move on. I do not believe JJ cared about canon - yes, they threw a few sops to the old timers, and Spock was included to hedge bets, but in reality it was not going to be 'your fathers Trek' or your father who would be paying to see it, so the canon argument holds no water. He was going to do his thing no matter what, and I totally agree with that. But his thing was dumb and not well thought out. That is the sticking point. Like I said, while watching the flick, I was entertained, and did not see anything that offended me until Kirk got kicked off the ship - and no one has yet to explain why that needed to happen. I have heard ' oh he was too charismatic and resourceful he could have started a mutiny or escaped'. Really? I happen to know a thing or too about the military and no real military has mutiny, not in this day and age, not in the last generations day and age, and certainly not in the free love Federations day and age. Throw him in brig, and put guards around if so insecure. But marooning on a planet? Just so the writers could introduce him to Spock? Then they realize, 'oh snap, Kirk is on a planet, and the Enterprise is at maximum warp! Hmm, ok, lets have him meet Scotty on same planet, and then have scotty dream up a Trans-warp transporter that makes starships obsolete! Yeah, that'll work, good one!' Just plain lazy. And why oh why did engineering in the 23rd century look like a steel mill?
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..the new film. Let's get Kirk out of that Nexus and have him meet his maker in a more honorable fashion ;)
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or better, some sticky green matter. That stuff resets my timeline all the time!
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was one of the dumbest parts of the film, that JJ put in knowing that new fans would believe in. If he could transport people to a ship from that distance, then a reboot of TNG would be like Stargate!
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For any of the scenarios above to be borne out in any sequels would defeat the entire purpose of what new new flick achieved. There will be NO Shatner cameo. It would be pointless and only done to appease the whiners, and create whole new knots in the timeline. The whole point of this new film was to get rid of all that. Nimoy Spock probably won't appear either. It wouldn't serve a purpose, and I douby Nimoy would do it anyway, somehow. He's passed the torch, and seems happy with that. Abrams and Co have distilled Trek back to its brilliant basics, as said above by joshuavance. Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Enterprise, fucking off on really cool adventures. Keep it that way. And to that end, no Khan, no whales, no Guardian On The Edge Of Forever... None of that. New voyages. New adventures. Preferably with some really pissed of Klingons.
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So get some good Indian actor instead of a Spaniard (bardem, banderas) with a spray-on tan
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My wife doesn't really like sci fi. She hates the old STAR TREK films and TV shows...and loathes anything from STAR WARS. She does, however, like to watch LOST (after begging her while we were dating during the second season). Like your friend, my wife liked this film quite a bit. She actually watched it TWICE with me (and enjoyed it). She even talked with me about it...in conversations that SHE brought up. My wife is very picky about what she watches. She is highly educated and really dislikes shallow plots. Yet she thought that this one was good enough to watch twice. Last night, she asked me if I wanted to watch it one more time before it leaves the big screen. She said that she wanted to watch it again because some students brought something up at the college where she teaches. Needless to say, we will be going for at least one more trip to STAR TREK over the next week.
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Thanks. Part of the reason for coming here is to talk about films. Whether we agree or not. No one will be 100% right but a few knuckle draggers can be 100% wrong! I have certainly had my share of heated discussions and all out brawls - but those are reserved for the right wing motards in political TB's. So I like hearing other points of view, it is only when the trolls emerge that it gets silly -but entertaining!
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... but I don't get why everyone freaks about Kirk just "happening" to end up on the same ice planet as Old Spock. It's explained pretty clearly. It's just straightforward plotting. Nero dumps old Spock there so he can look into the sky and see his home reduced to nothing. The Enterprise under Pike races there to stop it, but is too late, they turn round, Kirk's kicking off, they decide to dump him on the nearest rock. Maybe I'm missing something. And yeah, very conventient Scotty was there too. But hey, that's like saying it was "very convenient" that a certain Mr Solo happened to be having a beer in a dodgy bar when the old bloke and whiny kid walked in.
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"Your father's TREK" would have a budget of about $7 Million...but would still end up in the hole. The old TREK fanbase is collecting social security now. The hardcore TREKKIE fanbase is still unemployed and living from convention to convention. This attempt to reinvigorate the franchise was ingenious. For once, the sun is rising on the TREK franchise...and, to quote Kirk in WRATH OF KHAN, it feels "young." I'm just disappointed that a few old TREKKIES are too preoccupied with the past to enjoy the future.
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Luke meeting Han and 3 big players being on the same PART of the same PLANET
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dammit I'm a tb'er not a stenographer
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No, it was bad writing that put him there. That is what is so irritating. Look, those type of 'convenient' plot devices - bad writing, crop up in almost every movie. But when they are so egregiously bad, and unnecessary, is when they draw the kind of fire and ire that that one did. Kirk did not have to be kicked off ship - that is what started the whole ball of wax, because the writers could not think of any other way for him to meet Spock. That simple. And then how do we get him back on the ship? It was as if a grade school'er wrote it, and patted himself on the back for his ingenuity, without realizing how dumb it really is.
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You are so right! If people want to complain about "convenience" in regard to the plot, isn't it "convenient" that the Enterprise had a major conflict in EVERY SINGLE EPISODE?!? That is pretty darn "convenient," if you ask me. ...or, maybe, it is simply "interesting." How many times does the Enterprise and its crew have to save humanity (Earth, the Universe, etc...) before we start realizing that no other ships or crew in STAR TREK weren't important because the MOVIES and TV SHOWS weren't about them? It is, after all, only a show. Too bad that some people can't understand that.
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Yeah, everyone harps on the coincidence thing, because that's the only complaint that is actually sort of valid. However, that's not enough to ruin a movie. And coincidences DO happen in real life. Dumb.
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Nothing wrong with a re-imagining, just do it well. JJ did not.
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Well yeah, guess you have a point about there being no need for Kirk to be marooned. But the alternative would be, I guess, Spock simply beaming himself onto the Enterprise or something for an on-the-hush one-to-one with Kirk. As it stands, it gives Kirk another "hero moment" with the ice monster (yeah yeah, all a bit extraneous but let's face it, they were retooling Kirk into an Indy-in-space at some points, and I can't say I disagree with that when they're trying to win over a modern audience). I understand the flaws in the film, I really do. But I can't understand the absolute "fire and ire" being directed at it. I really think that any other approach to Trek, in the state it had got itself into, would've been a monumental fuck-up that would have buried the entire franchise.
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I think that JJ did a great job with this movie. Of course, this is only my opinion...the opinions of 95% of professional movie critics...and the opinion of $200 Million worth of American movie goers so far.
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...but it sure does pay the bills. After all, this is a movie INDUSTRY (and not a Trekkie charity).
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Could compare it to a movie that nailed both Character development and action - Starship Troopers, which is in every way superior to Trek. Could say those things, but in the end, as I have said before, I was entertained while watching it, but have no interest in seeing again. Whereas I will watch Starship Troopers anytime anywhere. Why not demand more from movies. Cloverfield was massively disappointing as well, so I am thinking that is JJ's trajectory. Oh, yeah teh cloverfield monster did have a bigger appearance in this flick than in his own movie
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... People seem to get REALLY pissed that Kirk gets a commendation and command of the Federation's flagship at the end, after being involved in one situation out of the Academy. Well, again with the Star Wars parallels (which I point out because it was, as we all know, very close to A New Hope in the beats it hit, but A New Hope is the sacred text we all love) ... If I was in charge of attacking an evil Empire's massive unstoppable doomsday weapon, I sure as shit wouldn't give an expensive X-Wing to a farmboy with no previous experience - other than bullseyeing womp-rats and technically fucking up the rescue of a Princess so she had to all the work!
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No, not really. Hey look, Trek begins and ends with Shatner for me, but that opening scene sucked me in, and after that I was just along for the ride. And so I enjoyed it. But that's not to say I didn't have major problems with it as well. And not as a trekkie, just someone who likes going to movies and expects a certain intelligence from the filmmakers. And that's where they failed. Man, I am so conflicted on this one. I'm really just trying to work it out in my head.
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There are ways to make cameos that aren't necessarily the result of time travel. I thought that a nice cameo...set in the distant future...could show that Kirk didn't die on the Nexxus planet. Of course, I don't want to see a 300 lb Kirk in the next movie either. I don't know if they make a girdle that large...and we don't need any reminders about how pathetic TREK became.
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That they creating this alternate history, that leads up to the moment where the reset the last three movies and put it back on track where the original series was. It's also probably the reason they picked Winona Ryder to play an old woman, they are going to have go back to the point of Kirk's birth, and perhaps meet her when Spock's mom was a younger woman.
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May 29, 2009 6:25:39 PM CDT
Transformers made a quite a bit of money ccchhhrrriiisssm
by toadkillerdog
So it was very popular. Good? Uh, nope. And critics liking a movie, well what happens when you like a movie that 95% of the critics hate? Does that mean you are wrong? Tell me, have you seen Tron? Critics are merely people whose opinions are distilled to an audience. If you follow critics opinion's instead of your own, then I am sure you never need a wool coat in the winter time.
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The guy's a fucking legend. One of a kind. He really is. The world will one day be a worse place without him. But his ego is a big as his waistline these days (and always has been). The guy just wouldn't cut it onscreen anymore, that has to be said. And, just my opinion, but Pine fucking NAILED it Kirk in my eyes. I was as worried as anyone when those promos were coming out. "Ugh! 90210 Trek! Pretty boy!" But for all his bluster about "not really watching much of Shatner, just doing a new thing", I think he really got some mannerisms and inflections down pat. He definitely didn't crap all over the character and the guy who originated him. Plus, he did a year at Leeds University and ate pasties and drank Tetleys Bitter. So the kid's okay in my book.
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"I want to see more mentoring!!!"yeah, I bet you do...you want to mentor all over a big paycheck!
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In an alternate timeline some of the events will happen, some will not. So you can dove tail into the original mission but some things will be the same some won't. As far as I'm reading here Greenwood doesn't say the original stories have to be reset to exactly the same so there no reset required. For example Kirk and CO. could encounter the Doomsday machine but in a different way. Maybe Decker dosn't have to die in this one. Maybe the machine goes on to destroy Rigel. The possibilities are endless. That's the beauty of this concept. We've already had a reset so everything from here out can be slightly different. Hence you can tell the stories again but in a new way ( with possibly a new outcome ).
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Star Trek is and always has been a commentary on the human condition. As long as Abrams, Orci, Kurtzman, et al deliver compelling and exciting stories, the issue of canon is irrelevant. Roddenberry, for example, cared more about an actor's ability to communicate then he did about the apparent authenticity of the actor's make-up.
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I really hope we don't see ANYTHING revisited from the old shows or movies. I mean, broad conflicts and different races of course, but not revisiting actual plotlines and messing around with them. I'd almost like any new movies to act as adventures that could well have happened between original series episodes, if you know what I mean. Stand-alone stories. And if Abrams and Co are reading this, for the love of GOD please don't try to back-engineer this into a trilogy and pretend you had that plan all along. Learn from the Matrix and Pirates. Don't let this disappear up its own arse like they did.
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I addressed the writers and director in an AICN talkback. My bad, I came off like the MediaMessiah dude. He's a giggle at times, ain't he!
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The only thing Starship Troopers nailed was the coed shower, but I'm not complaining. The novel is great dystopian fiction, on par with 1984 perhaps, and I'd love to see it done properly.
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The box office tally indicates if the general public thought the film was good. STAR TREK has made $200 Million. Obviously, quite a few people (like me) thought it was good. Believe it or not, there are plenty of people out there who thought TRANSFORMERS was pretty good too (contrary to the fuzzy memories of fans of the old boring TV show). It is funny that you can't admit that MANY people thought that this was pretty good (or that most people found the older TREK series to have grown very, very stale and boring). It is just a movie, you know.
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Spock Prime and Nero traveled back in time......to a parallel universe in the 23rd Century??? It's entirely possible (and what I'm telling myself so I know that the original timeline STILL exists somewhere). We know from STNG that there are millions of parallel universes, after all!
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Sorry for the delay in getting back to you; I've heard from several people who haven't received their CDs and I'm waiting to hear back from Varese re: why this is happening. The names/addresses of CD recipients were delivered to Varese **before** I posted the results. Do me a favor please & resend your name/address to me as I'm currently working from a different computer (w/o acess to recent e-mails). I'll re-send your info directly to Varese.
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... they didn't. But it still does exist. In DVD box sets. Comics. Novels. Your imagination. They'll still do stories where Vulcan never got nuked-into-itself, and where the NCC-1701 looks like it was made out of plywood in the '60s! Fuck, thinking about it, I wouldn't be that surprised if there actually IS some kind of crossover in comics or novels at some point. You know, New Kirk meeting Original Series-era Kirk Prime and comparing notes. Asking about his father. "You served on the Farragut for how long? Fuck, dude. I got in the big chair after a few days. Sucks to be you!"
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After all these years, Starship Troopers is a better film.
It's on tonight, and i'm enjoying it again after seeing it 4 times. Trek will NEVER hold up as well as this.
It's on TV right now. Shame they didn't make a worthy sequel. -
My oldest sister loved watching INTERPLANET JANET to me when I was a kid. Sure, the science is off...the animation is bad...but that tune is just so darn catchy! In fact, they are still making plays in schools around America using that premise. Likewise: You can argue about this film until the Klingons come home...but it doesn't change the fact that it has made a fortune for Paramount...and has made STAR TREK credible once again -- and to a new generation of moviegoers. The movie passed $200 Million today (after three weeks)...and will end somewhere above $250 Million or more. Someone...somewhere...liked this movie. Please don't spit on those of us who did.
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typo She SANG to me INTERPLANET JANET.
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Tooie!
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... (I think it was Total Film) made a really good point. It was a balanced review, not overly gushing, pointed out the flaws from a fan's point of view... But it said that, at the end of the day, playgrounds up and down the country would be full of young boys running around going "pew pew!" with pretend phasers and acting out as Kirk and Spock... getting interested in sci-fi... and science... and space exploration. And that, fans and haters, can only be a good thing. One very positive thing about the new Trek is that the heroes are intelligent. Top of their class. Eager. Adventurous. They're not dark and conflicted. And at the end of the day, that's what we had with our Skywalkers, Solos, Joneses and McFlys. It's high time that kind of thing was brought back. And if it stops kids wanting to go on fucking Britain's Got Talent or American Idol, or be Zac Efron poncing around in High School Musical.... all to the better.
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WHEN SOME OF YOU ASSHOLES KEEP COMMENTING ON HOW 'CHICKS LOVE THE NEW TREK' AND 'MY GIRLFRIEND LOVED THE NEW TREK'. YOU PONCES JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND DO YOU? THAT'S A SURE SIGN OF A FUCKING FAIL - WHEN SOME BROAD LIKES A SCI-FI FLICK. OMFG
IF SOME OF YOU FAGGOTS WEREN'T SO PUSSY WHIPPED YOU'D BE ABLE TO SEE HOW FUCKING FUNNY THAT IS. FFS -
I sort of enjoyed the movie too. I just can't figure out how to articulate my feelings on ST yet. Unlike the movie, they are very complex.
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No, you retard. We're saying how it appealed to EVERYONE, right across the board. NOT, for once, a very niche audience who can quote that fucking cringeworthy, embarrassing wedding scene from Nemesis word-for-word. "When some broad likes a sci-fi flick". Fuckin' hell - women issues, much? As you were, dipshit.
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Once again...you TALKBACK too much. Do you really have to throw hate-poo at those who disagree with your peculiar opinions. Awwww....poor Titbag. But don't worry: We do feel sorry for you.
Now take your medication like a good little fat 30+ yr old disgruntled basement dweller. It might take you to a "happy place." In the meantime, you TALKBACK too much. -
WHAT IS IT WITH YOU AND YOUR INABILITY TO COMPREHEND THAT I LIVE IN A NICE LITTLE PLACE OVERLOOKING A POND IN SWANSEA.
AND TALK ABOUT TB TOO MUCH. OMFG. EVERYTIME YOU GET THE MOST MUNDANE AND PEDESTRIAN THOUGHT IN THAT TINY BRAINPAN OF YOURS YOU COME ON A TB AND FEEL THE NEED TO BORE THE EVER LOVING SHIT OUT OF EVERYONE.
AND CUE CCCOOCKK IN 5, 4 , 3, 2, 1.... -
..THAT YOU NO LONGER HAVE A PAIR OF BALLS.
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That explains a lot.
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...NO FUCKING CLUE ABOUT SCIFI AND SHOULD SKIDADDLE OVER TO THE LATEST GAY SOUNDTRACK TB. RUN ALONG NOW, GIRLS.
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... it doesn't explain why you use phrases like "taking a chick", "some broad", and "pussy-whipped faggot". You're not in Noo Yawk, pal. You're in Wales. You poor, poor bastard.
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..A SCIFI MOVIE IS A TOTAL PONCE."
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The problem with the way they reset this movie is they haven't removed themselves from the already established universe. They have already explored the complex social structure of the Alpha, Delta and Gamma quadrants and the majority of history up to a certain point in time and the way the universe is constructed will not change. The further this new series pans out the less novel the idea will become as they begin to boldly go where years of Star Trek have already gone before. And thats maybe one of the problems that sunk Star Trek at the end of the previous series - they had explored most of that universe and there wasn't a great deal more to go. When people talk about what they want to see in the new Trek chances are they already did that. You want a Klingon war? Oh maybe go and watch DS9!
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...TO PASTY WHITE ENGLISH YOUTH DESPERATE TO BECOME DJS. NEXT. FFS. CAN'T ANYBODY READ? I'VE SAID THIS LIKE 50 TIMES ALREADY.
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I don't care whether you liked the movie or not. Stop whingeing. The world does not revolve around whether you or anyone else liked or disliked it. People have different opinions, and are free to express them The ironic thing is you come off exactly like the whiny fanboys you are constantly berating and saying that they live in their mothers basement. And every time you say how much money it has made, you sound even moreso like a fanboy who needs the validation of others opinions 'see, see it made lots of money i'm not alone, i'm not a geek, i'm not'
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I get what you're saying, but I'm just going from the point of view that Star Trek is now reset. It's Year Zero. DS9, all the other stuff, is (whispers it) rendered null and void in this new Universe. At least from the point of view of the huge new general audience and fanbase the new film has generated. The majority probably won't have seen frame one of DS9, have a clue about Q, or know practically anything about Trek other than "Kirk Spock Bones Enterprise". At the end of the day, that's who this whole reboot was geared towards. Raising hell with the long-standing uber-fans was an occupational hazard for it.
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He doesn't have any friends. Do you think that it is because he SPEWS HATE at them? Wow...this little fat man needs to grow up. Take your bipolar meds, little fella. You might try to get out in the sunshine...instead of posting 500 times a day about how much you hate everyeone who disagrees with your warped opinions.
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It's quite clear you're a cock, but as I've always had a sneaky desire to get into it with a Talkback fucktard on here, I'll bite. I haven't really read most of your posts before, because when someone's called "Titbag" and WRITES IN TERRIBLE SENTENCES IN CAPITALS LIKE A REMEDIAL, I tend to just skim over it, taking it as the inane angry ramblings of a dribbling fuckwit. (And if you truly are a teacher, God fucking help us, I'm beginning to understand why the kids round here are turning into ill-educated feral little bastards.) I only read the part where you asked why we couldn't comprehend that you live in Swansea, which - as I had PROPER teachers at school, I know is in Wales. You then said you live in Newcastle. Now it's the good ol' 'Pool. Wherever you're from, I can't say I care. Star Trek was great. You, sir, are not.
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...I liked the movie. A majority of professional critics liked the movie. A majority of fans liked the movie. Are we supposed to change our minds because you will mock us if we have a different opinion? Grow up. Do you really feel the need to dismiss anyone who holds a different opinion from you? Perhaps you and TITBAG should get together and make your own TREK movie. I'm sure that AsimovLives will show up.
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I WANT Q. I want Q to come in just put everyone in there place except for Spock who just owns Q and shows what the universe can do when together as one.
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... AsimovLives. Haven't seen him in a while. Did he self-implode thanks to the acute sense of personal betrayal wrought upon him and his life by JJ Abrams? Heh.
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May 29, 2009 7:45:33 PM CDT
TITWIG...do you treat students like you treat TBers?
by ccchhhrrriiisssm
No wonder you are *really* unemployed. There just aren't any people who can stand to be around you...which explains why you spend so much time behind a keyboard. But I'm sure that your bipolar meds will take you to a "happy place" (like outside amongst the people of Nottinghamshire). There is no need to go postal, buddy.
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May 29, 2009 7:48:46 PM CDT
No, it is you ccchhhrrriiisssm who feel the need to dismiss
by toadkillerdog
Like the whiny fanboy's you mock. And learn to read, I never said I disliked the movie. My exact words were 'it entertained me while i was watching it'. My criticism, which you seem to be taking very personally - which is yet another sign of the fanboy-mommas-house-cellar-dweller syndrome that you rail against in others, is about lame and lazy writing and direction that could have easily been fixed. JJ is not a good director. Star Trek entertained me, I did not dislike it, I just did not fall in love with it like some fanboys who can overlook the wildest and most motarded plots convenience devices and plain bad writing and who want to wage talkback jihad against anyone who has the temerity to point them out! 'Nooooo, we love Trek, it is greatt, stop saying bad things about it you bad man or I tell ma!'
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and is all "What did you monkeys do to the universe?" And Orci & Kurtzman are all "I love your work on Breaking Bad, dude."
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HE CAN STAY. FOR NOW. THE REST OF YOU? ON YOUR FUCKIN' BIKES, MATES. THE LOT OF YOU.
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To be fair I think ccchhhrrriiisssm (and me for that matter) have pointed out its far from perfect. It's got its faults. But as a Star Trek film, its light years ahead in entertainment value than any of the others (and I'm a huge fan the Khan/Search/Voyage trilogy and the original series as I've said). As a Summer blockbuster, in the midst of the utter shit that gets shat onto screens year in year out (G.I. Joe?), it's the only one I can recall in years with a modicum of intelligence (yes, I said it!), heart, soul and wit. If they changed the name of the ship and the characters and called it something else entirely, I'd still go with that. In the end, I'm glad Star Trek is BACK, and it belongs to everyone again. I truly think the ones who are taking this film as a personal betrayal to them and their whole way of life (I don't include yourself in that) are the kind of people who backed Star Trek into the corner it was in, and killed it. Brannon & Braga held the gun, but Christ, the whole thing just became so self-important and exhausted.
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Actually, I am just tired of guys like you who flood the TBs with ridicule toward anyone who disagrees with them. Read your own posts. That is EXACTLY what makes this place so tiresome. You feel the need to mock anyone who disagrees with your opinion. It just so happens that, this time, the vast majority of people disagree with your opinion. You have a right to disagree with people. You can hate this movie. You can mock the director. You can mock the acting. You can point out what you perceive to be flaws or plot holes (without referencing the thousands of other TREK plotholes over 40 years). But at what point do you cross the line of decency by rhetorically spitting upon anyone who disagrees with you? Contrary to your post, I did not fall "in love" with this movie. Why? Because it is JUST A MOVIE! However, it is a movie that I (and millions of others) enjoyed tremendously. I don't need apologize to you (or any Trekkie) for that. This movie has breathed new life into a franchise that was on life support. In the end, it will be the most profitable TREK film to date. This is what it was created for. STAR TREK is not a charity for a few disgruntled, hardcore TREK fans. It is supposed to make a profit (which is why THE CAGE was rejected to begin with). Finally, the studio has created a film that will actually grow fans...instead of watching them die off.
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There are too many talkbackers whose names start with 'T' on this TB. I suggest one of us leaves. And jumps off a bridge.
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POT. KETTLE. BLACK.
FFS.
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Star Trek was never about Shinzon's coup or politicking or technobabble or having an army of Continuity Police poring over every line of dialogue and costume and haircut.
It was about a cool-as-fuck starship captain, his pointy-eared mate, and an irascible doctor, bounding round the stars, getting into scrapes. They'd defeat the bad guys, Kirk would get it on with some alien chick, after outwitting his enemies with cunning, bravado, skill, and sheer bullshitting - and off we went again.
Maybe, just maybe, if they slip some of the original Trek's social commentary, whatever you want to call it, into the next film, and give people something more to think about afterwards than "shit, that Chris Pine will be big after this..." ... we'll all be happy.
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I have zero problems with people who enjoyed the flick and defend their reasons. I do have issues with people who have knee-jerk reactions to any criticism about it and who seem to take it personally (yes I am talking about ccchhhrrriiisssm ). You on the other hand are a fan of the flick and but not obnoxious about it. I have loved movies that others have hated, and hated movies that others have loved. In most instances, that is 100% subjective. Ok, I was going to take you to the woodshed about rating this over Khan - which in my humble opinion is the best Star Trek movie by light years, but then again, that is just my opinion.
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DOOR.
FUCK.
OFF. -
In all honesty, I can't really choose the new one over Khan. It's been a favourite of mine since I was six years old. I'll call it a tie. There is one similarity though: even without the Star Trek name on it - it's just a solid, good movie.
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That Q gag was pretty good. You guys just having a private little war, huh? That's cool. Ok, I'm gonna go out and watch some bands play. Maybe have a gin and tonic. Toodles!
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Well, when TITBAG makes fun of my wife and my intellect simply because we liked this film...should I NOT tkae it personally? I don't take the criticism of the film personally (because I really don't care what YOU think). However, some people have evolved from mocking the film to mocking the people who liked the film. There is a difference. Just read your own posts in order to determine if you strayed from criticizing the film to mocking the people who liked it. And you talk about being "obnoxious?!?" All I am saying is to keep your comments directed at the movie and not at the people who liked it. Is that too difficult?
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... said he's off to have a G&T and "toodles". I picture him as Lorne. For that reason, he's a good guy.
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...people have to "defend" themselves simply because they liked a particular movie. Once upon a time, the TalkBacks weren't so angry. I know that it was a long time ago (before some idiot talked about "raped" childhoods). TommyGavin remembers it. We mostly discussed upcoming movies...and what we liked and didn't like...without straying to personal attacks that tried to outdo someone else's attacks. It's been a while. With people like TITBAG camping in each and every TB (and flooding it with his HATE), I don't know that it will change anytime soon.
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LOL! Too cool, bro!
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Flood TB's, really? Wanna take a crack at how many posts I have on this TB and all other Star Trek TB's combined vs your own chumley? No, didn't think so. You are a troll ccchhhrrriiisssm. I have come across you many times in the past, and full disclosure: I do not like you. We have dusted it up a few times because of your penchant for shall we say 'hyperbole'? No, lets just call it flat out lying, distortion, and general asinine behavior towards anyone who has an opinion counter to your own. The ironic thing is your very behavior is that of the trolls and fanboys you decry! Perhaps not so ironic considering you really are a troll/fanboy. Jump into the way back machine - say about a year or so ago, when you made the most ridiculous statement about how 'half of the United States hates Lincoln.' I gave you ample opportunity to retract that stupidity, but you dug in. Then I simply pointed out that the Current population of the United States is north of 330 million, so that would mean - if we believed you who bandied about the 50% statistic and would not back down, that more people hate Lincoln today than existed in the country during the civil war. You then admitted 'well I made that number up'. Yeah. That was only one occurrence, there were plenty others. You are a jackass. But at least some things never change.
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... Part of the reason I finally got a log-in. No one seems to like ANYTHING anymore, it's just hate spewing across the boards, and directed at each other. There's a real joylessness descended over this place. People thinking they could write and direct better movies then some perfectly decent ones. I agree there's tons of shit out there these days, but as a fellow fanboy and geek (obviously not of the same, er, evangelical nature as some here) I really couldn't give a flying fuck if Optimus Prime looks a bit different than he did in the cartoons; or G.I. Joe has a different uniform, or whatever. I just want to see some decent movies. The second reason, on the other hand, is that I've seen this place go downhill fucking FAST from the rather-large-neck down, thanks to some of our Bearded Ginger Fuhrer's recent antics (Wolverine et al.)
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Dude...you really need to grow up. You are beginning to display your true colors. I visit this thread (and STAR TREK threads) because I liked the movie. You are visiting it because you like to make fun of those who liked it. There is a difference, you know. And, please don't call me a jackass. BTW, I don't have a clue to what you are talking about "concerning "hating Lincoln). I never said such a thing. Is this a straw man, little man? Either you have me confused with someone else...or you are REALLY stretching. Grow up.
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I extend an invitation to you to join the Church of Chang group, otherwise known as the CoC. We congregate daily over on the Twitch International TB. Just a group of true film lovers. Lots of Brits and Aussies and Amurricans, subjects are all over the place, but we always come back to pure movie love. The daytime crew has the most prolific posting, but the nighttime crew does pretty good too. You must love schlocky movies as well as mainstream, and be prepared to defend, and have a thick skin and sense of humor. I think you will fit right in. No trolls allowed, we even have a resident troll killer by the name of Liberal_Warrior - he and others keep the place clean from infestation. Take a gander, and join in.
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As it's 2.30am here, and I am tragically sober for a Friday night, I'll take that offer up tomorrow.
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You are a jackass. A lying one as well.
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Yes, I am heading out to the local establishment soon for a libation of six.
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I keep telling myself that Timeline B is made possible by the arrival of Prime Spock. The orginal timeline (A) DID happen. The presence of Prime Spock confirms that. I keep having to remind myself of that, and that's what annoys me more than anything.
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Or does the phrasing of Greenwood's statement not infer that The Original Series somehow unfolds/exists as a separate point in time/distinct events from the current Abramsverse hereby making such timeline co-exist as a parallel and/or alternate universe directly propotional and/or adjacent to the Neutral Zone far from the city on the edge of forever in the Shatnerverse/Roddenberryverse?
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Despite the time-travel bullshit, we are still dealing with the same crew on the same ship. Chances are this lot will be sent out on that 5 year mission, encounter Kahn, etc...
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Sounds about right. Farewell Timeline-A, for that shall never ever be seen onscreen again. Hello Timeline-B, which will, hopefully, rock the shit. No Next Generations. No Deep Space stations. No technobabble and annoying furry-faced chefs (or whatever the fuck Neelix was). Hello Kirk and his buddies galloping around the cosmos. In short, welcome back Star Trek. And, I'm out.
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... Se7en's post up there actually sounds like dialogue from an episode of Voyager. Which is part of the reason we got here.
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... for Abrams and Co to go anywhere NEAR Khan in this new universe. I hope they realise that. Jesus, the uber-fans are railing against this film to the Nth degree. I love it, and even I know that no-one could top Montalbahn and the brilliant cat-and-mouse caper between him and the Shat. Leave it be. We've seen that battle. It happened. It was fantastic. Give us NEW voyages. New adventures. New battles. New lifeforms and, er, civilizations and stuff. As I said a while back - give us stuff that could, timelines be damned, conceivably slot inbetween original series episodes.
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You hit it right on the head when you talked about how the new ST parallels Superman Returns. You'll notice that SR was critically acclaimed when it first came out, but then the stealthy aspects of its mediocrity came back and bit it in the ass. The same will happen with this ST film--its legacy, over time, will die a quicker death than SR or even Episode III (and it's taken people almost five years to realize what a horrible mess III is; ST will go in two).
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To be fair, I think Superman Returns was more acclaimed as a tribute to Donner's original, and as a good-looking film more than anything. I remember myself and everyone I knew liking it for THAT, but having that really deflated feeling of "fuck - is that IT?" And also the general movie-goers, the non-Supes fans, were just distinctly non-plussed by it. A giant case of "meh" (which sums the whole film up to be fair). In the case of Trek, it's not the critics that are driving its success. It's general, non-geek, non-scifi, non-Trek fans seeing it, enjoying it, telling their friends, and going back again.
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... it is, for the most part, more of a Star Wars flick than a lot of Jedi and Menace, pretty much all of Clones... it's just a shame that neither Christensen or Portman could act worth a shit. Honestly, there's not one line reading from them that rings true. But then, I guess that's what happens when you stick your actors in a green room and tell them to talk to thin air. Cameron, Spielberg and Jackson - take note.
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Two years. It's not a good film, people. Two years, I promise you.People's opinions of the film will start to change; critics and the cast will start backpedaling, JJ will start talking shit about how he "listened to the fans" and how he's going a "somewhat different" direction with the sequel, etc.
All of this will happen in two years.Or less.I promise you.
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Just get to work on the next one damn it!!!!!!!!!!!!
Star Trek is back.... -
People dig it. And this needs saying... As great as it is to be a fan, and fun as it is to back-and-forth in places like this, NO ONE... Abrams, Bay, ANYONE in charge of a screen adaptation of a geek property, really and truly gives a toss about what we think. They're playing to the masses - the money-spending masses. Thinking otherwise is a throwback to years gone by, when sites like this were white-hot and could - Batman & Robin-style - really fuck up a film's chances. Those days are done. And in the case of Trek, I know a load of you disagree, but I pat them on the back for at least trying to placate long-term fans and putting a gleaming, shit-hot new engine into a machine that was spluttering its undignified last breaths.
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Good:Score.Production design.Bad:Superboy.Lois Lane--The Girl Everyone Wants To Bang, But No One Wants To Hang Out With.Luthor--terrible. He wants to steal a bunch of crystals because land ain't getting any cheaper; all of this predicated on the crystals growing or some bullshit, God, who the fuck cares?Three hour runtime.
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Make it a Star Trek that grandparents will limp to see with their grandchildren. You can take a PG-13, but don't make it too intense or scary like PG-13 Terminator Salvation or PG-13 Wolverine or PG-13 Angels and Demons.
Softest movie with PG-13 wins. -
I can recall when I said Return of The Jedi was lousy, and the Star Wars prequels were lousy, as well as The Matrix sequels, Twilight, The Hulk, Star Trek: Generations...etc., and Superman Returns. I was roundly criticized for daring to be out front with a contrary opinion to the critics...and the masses when I bashed those films...and now, you can hardly find anyone who supported those films, and who is willing to admit it openly??? The same will be true for the new Trek film. I think this movie will come back on Paramount, and bite them in the rear, when it comes to any Star Trek sequels...as audiences won't be too eager for a return trip to see yet another possibly bad Star Trek film, or films after being burned by the media white wash, and...bait and switch, which is the new movie.
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Cool handle, one of the better ones I've seen lately.
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"Please, I humbly beseech thee, in the name of all geekdom please let audiences forget this film and how fun and good it is, please let them turn on it so that we may finally have our shot at a shitty Voyager or Enterprise movie. Please Lord God audiences are so fickle, they loved this movie so much so let them recanttheir point of view and realise we lowly three bastards that hated it were right all along."
fucking pathetic and sad. -
You heard it hear first, AICN Talkbackers!!!!
I hate to be the one to crush your spirits like Rorshach stepping on the testicles of an unarmed man, but there you have it!!!! Wesley Crusher will be in the Next Movie, our very own Jar Jar!!!!! -
But you are still a paltry minority.
Revenge of the Sith fucking kicked ass. Hell Attack of the Clones was awesome, and I even like The Phantom Menace. The product never changed bucko, you simply did. You grew and became a smarmy "sofisstikayted" asshole. -
People "dig" a lot of stuff, often for the wrong reasons. This film performed its intended function adequately. But so does McDonalds, toilet paper, 6/10 chicks, etc.
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People dig things for the right reasons as well. Like being entertained, having fun, enjoying a positive inspiring film, seeing legends again, you know, things of consequence.
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I mean, you speak, you get paid more than Scale. His agent saw that he was one of the guys who carried that film, so he's going to impress on JJ the need to have "Admiral" Pike around as a presence to be Kirk's "mentor".
No Vina. No Beep Beep. -
...I realized that JJ Abrams had no real solid story arc for the Rimbaldi storyline. It became obvious that he was making it all up as he went along, and as a result, the show began to fall apart. I felt like punching the tv screen as I saw the final episode of the show. It was just thrown together junk. I liked Mission Impossible 3, so I am not a JJ Abrams basher, but Lost is being made-up as it goes along, the same is true of what was Alias when it was on the air, as I said, and now, the new Star Trek timeline. JJ Abrams is known to have a pattern for this, and Star Trek is the latest example of his inability to come-up with fluid, linear story arcs, that make sense, from start to finish, and consistantly throughout his work, at that. He is seriously lacking quality controls in that regard.
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It's not so much that the powers-that-be aren't going out of their way to make films based on what "we think," it's that they're going out of their way to make films based on what THEY think "we'll think." Which beautifully sums up the philosophy of marketing and advertising departments. Not true visionaries like Roddenberry, Lucas, and Cameron.You brought up the analogy of dropping a new, souped-up engine into a tired old beater. I don't think that's valid here. Star Trek isn't about going 0 to 60 in whatever. It has always been counter-programming to whatever else that was going on at the time. That's why the original TV series didn't catch on until a decade later.
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'nuff said
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with its flaws, is actually a better film tnan II or III. Take away all the hype and expectation and shit-talking, and you can see some good shit that ages well. Liam Neeson carries the whole thing with class, the impact of Jar-Jar is much less offensive, and there are two really great action set pieces that, by themselves, are better than anything else in the prequel trilogy (those of course being the Podrace and the Maul duel).Episode II and III do not age well. At all. II completely fails to build on the intriguing ideas of I, and III is a patched-together mess full of forced plot devices and some lame-ass attempts at humor. The Duel sucked complete ass and remains a huge letdown.
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What DO you guys like? I mean really.
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I personally like flicks that manage to entertain me and that have quirky, wierd, out-of-left-field elements that make me think..."what the fuck was THAT shit?"Like the original trilogy, Episode I, Ang Lee's Hulk, Iron Man, Khan coming back in II, the whale plot in IV,etc.Unlike JJ's Trek, The Dark Knight, Lord Of The Rings, etc. All predictable, all based on what "they" thought "we" wanted "them" to make.
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Its just about as reworked as possible. The cast, the timeline, the esthetics, the you name it. There's barely a kitchen sink that isnt redone a la Nokia (wink wink). The new movie was funny. I laughed at it. I got to give it that much. Then I laughed at it.
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Judge for yourself if Revenge of the Fallen is one of the best films this summer: Jetfire WAS a Decepticon that shifted allegiance to the Autobots. He was one of the original Seekers of the Allspark that reached earth thousands of years ago, like B.C. times. When his “batteries run out,” it must be that he is automatically programmed to retain the ability to copy any machine from a cart to whatever technology that existed throughout history while he lay dormant (not sure if this would be explained in the movie, which could be a source of a plot hole). The blonde that Sam meets in college is a Decepticon disguised as a girl. "Alice" is her name, since it was a copy of a human-like Honda robot (This blonde seduces Sam, and as a probe (its “tongue” ) is being inserted into his mouth to "hack" his brain, Mikaela enters his room and sees the girl on top of her boyfriend, and that pisses her off. Optimus Prime goes into stasis (he's not really dead, but it would take like hundreds or thousands of years for his body to repair itself) after being stabbed by Megatron (Optimus goes mano-o-mano with both Starscream and Megatron in that forest in the trailer). Sam ACTUALLY DIES, and while he is being revived, he sees a “heaven” vision of the original 13 Primes murdered by the Fallen, and further telling him that they choose him to own the Matrix of Leadership (the dagger-like thingy that Sam picks from the ground in the trailer, produced by the AllSpark thousands of years ago as a key to a machine atop the Pyramid of Giza that destroys a star (our sun in this case) to produce Energon, a secondary energy source if the AllSpark gets destroyed). He hears Mikaela tell him “I love you.” And when he finally wakes up, his first words are “I love you.” It sounds cheesy but it isn’t. A minor plot involves the fact that they haven’t said “I love you” to each other and each were challenging the other as to who should say it first, which complicates matters since Mikaela witnessed first-hand Sam’s propensity to be disloyal to him when he is far away from her. Sam uses the Matrix of Leadership crystal to revive Optimus' Spark. Before dying, Jetfire gives Optimus Prime his wings so that the latter could get to the Giza Pyramid fast, to stop the Fallen from activating a machine that could destroy the sun. Simmons has a major role in the film and becomes a hero of sorts. After being fired from Sector 7, he spends his time in his mother's deli, and he keeps a secret attic above his mom's restaurant, blogging with the name "Robo Warrior" who happens to be discovered by Sam's geek dorm mate. Simmons is responsible for helping out a U.S. Carrier with coordinates to destroy Devastator by sneaking under the biggest Decepticon ever. And Mikaela gives Simmons a kiss (well, a flying kiss that is, for helping her and Sam). Yes, it has a happy ending. I'm not sure how they would explain why Arcee is a girl, or the concept of trans-dimensional travel. Two Decepticons defect to the Autobots: Jetfire and Wheels, that small Decepticon who ends up enamored by Mikaela. Like he hugs her and burrows his head into her cleavage, but she didn't mind since she senses that the robot isn't really aware of what sex is.
At the end of the movie, once The Fallen is defeated by Optimus, Megatron and Starscream escape through a portal, a continuum (trans-dimensional travel, and enter another dimension where the ship called the Nemesis is located. (Megatron summoned the Fallen from this place). His last words are "Arise!" as he wakes up the other robots in sarcophagi in this ship. Megatron wanted to be a Prime,which is why he promised to work for his Master, but Primes are born, not made, according to Optimus. Optimus Prime is the last of the Primes. He was an orphan and his "Prime" ancestors were murdered by the Fallen. There's no clue about Unicron, however.
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I think this would be a great way to get Shatner a cameo without having to twist continuty into a pretzel.
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and what the movie will hinge upon, is do they still look like metallic vaginas and Ents?
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I got most of my bile out about Star Trek in the Quint/JJ Inverview talkback...so don't look for any real venom here.
It is heartening to see more and more people posting who didn't like the film--and as always, my man JoshuaVance is there to squash them as much as he can!
Dude--JJ won't hire you JUST for being a stalwart TREK Talkback defender who spends all day attacking anyone with a dissenting opinion. He is a filmmaker, not a Scientologist.
Blowjob is absolutely right about Episode I in comparison to the other Star Wars prequels--it is the best of the bunch, even with Jar-Jar in it. It actually has a story and some real editing, wheras Episode II has an IDEA for a story (and would have been a kick ass sci-fi detective story if Lucas would have let it be one) and Episode III was nothing but NOSTALGIA wrapped around an overlong sword fight that had no real emotion to it since it was just video game characters fighting in a video game envirionment.
Revenge of the Sith is a lot like the new Trek, actually--it is a nearly constant barrage of impressionistic incidents of Nostalgia that requires the audience to link it together into a coherent plot, rather than actually fleshing out a story.
Yeah, I said it. ROTS sucked--just like Trek.
NOW, that that is over--I really hope that the Trek-makers just go their own way and do not retell any stories--they should try to make this new Universe as different as possible to the old one.
How awesome would it be if Klingons were the ones to find Khan and company in stasis? Or if the opening shot is a Federation survey team finding the Botony Bay, with Khan and everyone in stasis...only to be completely destroyed by a Klingon attack?!!
It would set the stage for what everyone would like to see--a Huge Klingon/Romulan/Federation War--which would be the fallout of Nero's attacks in the new film.
Plus, it would just be amazing to watch all the fans wet themselves thinking that they would get Khan in this new universe, only to see it get wiped clean by a new storyline! -
Organic alien robots, suck. There's nothing wrong with boxy utilitarian robots. Nata all nata all. It's like pizza, and tacos. Comfy food.
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Watchmen, Wolverine, and Terminator: Shitvation Bones.
Revenge of the Sith was absolute spectacle and delivered. I waited 25 plus years for the duel to end all duels and it was the epitome of epic. The mood, lighting, velocity, it was everything this fanboy ever dreamnt of and more.
It's comforting knowing the Aint it cool talkbacks are the fortress of solitude and refuge for the "dissenters." That means I don't have to encounter them in my daily life. You know what they say, misery loves company, if you guys find solace , all three of you, bandeying together to swap out sand for sand vaginal cavities, my God Bones, knock yourself the fuck out, meanwhile...the rest of the world, and fandom...moves on. -
Thanks for bringing up Humanism, which is something I talked about in my posts in the other talkbacks.
Now that "Star Trek" has been turned into Star Wars, it can allow "Magic" to save the day, as with Spock's Magic Transporter Formula.
Also, "Destiny" seems to be directing the events of all the characters, rather than just having the characters do the best that they can. Kirk succeeds BECAUSE he is destined to be Captain Kirk, rather than Kirk becoming Captain based upon his years of experience. This is similar to Anakin Skywalker getting into all his shenanigans because he is THE CHOSEN ONE and he is Destined to bed Padme, have children and become Darth Vader--because we all know it is coming.
It is a form of predestination paradox in all Prequels (or Reboots that follow a basic structure about where a character is heading) and it is a sign of the level of filmmaking if you feel that the "Destined" outcome is earned.
In the Star Wars prequels, for many people the events seemed to be forced because the outcome is already known--and Lucas never bothered to build in red herrings or blind alleys for the characters to follow--and there is a general lack of drama because of it.
With "STAR TREK", they have the freedom to have things play out absolutely different than the original show or Universe. Whether they have the courage to do that has yet to be seen. -
I highly suggest to illuminate your perceptions on what constitutes the spirit of Star Trek , reading Stephen Whitfields "The Making of Star Trek," Bjo Trimbles "The Star Trek concordance," and "The making of Star Trek-The Motion picture" by Susan Sackett and Gene Roddenberry. It;s really fine reading for new Trek fans such as yourselves that aren't yet fully informed on all the ins and outs of tv production, motion picture production, story breakdowns etc.
These books will certainly inform you on why the new Star Trek film perfectly celebrates everything, everything that Star Trek represents.
I can understand being inundated with inferior Trek under the Berman heirarchy tainting your perceptions, I completely understand. That's why it's so important to educate yourselfs and GET A FUCKING CLUE. -
I actually really enjoy chatting back and forth with you. I like seeing where you and others are coming from and then presenting my side of the argument.
Wouldn't it have been better for Lucas to have found a way to keep the Luke and Leia's identities a secret, so that there is at least one mystery when you watch the films in chronological order?
Shouldn't he have found a reason for there to be Wookies in the movie, other than to have Chewbacca cameo? Why didn't he move General Grevious's base to Kashyyyk, so then Yoda and Obiwan could interact with the wookies before Obi-Wan goes to hunt Grevious? Why didn't they just keep Dooku as the main villain, and kill him off a bit later in the story (possibly being the last step in Anakin becoming Vader--which was really weak to a lot of people)?
And why didn't he stage the battle between Anakin and Obi-Wan with a better ending than Obi-Wan miraculously cutting off three of Anakin's limbs in one swordstroke? I mean, a protracted ending would have really been powerful, with maybe a couple slices on Obi-Wan which would explain why he and Vader dueled so simply in A New Hope...
The less said about the dialogue, the better--in all THREE Prequels. The dialogue got worse as the films went on. The original Trilogy sounds like Shakespeare in comparison! -
As far as speaking as a voice of authority on ANY subject matter, you won't in your LIFETIME, produce a thing as poignant, moving, touching, inspiring, and celebratory of the human condition or the aspirations, courage, valor, and INTEGRITY inherent in humanity as the first 10 minute prologue and sacrifice of George Kirk in the new Star Trek film. So that being an axiom, if you do infact create something half as meaningful, THEN come around here trying to speak as an authority on what constitutes drama. Until then, no one in all candor gives a fuck what you think.
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As well as The Making of Star Trek II, The Star Trek Companion, TNG Companion, Making of Deep Space Nine, The Art of Star Trek, Star Trek Sketchbook (TV), Star Trek Sketchbook (Movies), The ST Encyclopedia and Chronology, dozens of Trek novels--and the Star Trek TMP soundtrack that came with the extra disc of '70s Star Trek convention conversations...I am a huge Trek Geek!
As well as having hundreds of Star Wars reference books, comics, RPG material and all kinds of goodies that I use for work...believe me, I am well versed in both universes.
I am really sorry that we have a fundamental difference of opinion of what Star Trek is.
For you it is simply the original show and characters, no matter what the story is, who the actors are or who is playing them--for me it is the UNIVERSE, the worldbuilding, the ideas behind the stories, the message of the shows and the episodes/movies.
To be honest, I didn't need any more Kirk or Spock--I have all their amazing "real" adventures anytime I want to watch them.
I want more of that Universe.
And to be honest--I want something NEW--a New franchise to be excited about that isn't Star Trek or Star Wars or Battlestar Galactica...
Where are the new stories and storytellers? -
Obi-Wan lopped three limbs off Anakin with one swing because A. He's Obi-Wan Kenobi- the consummate Jedi-Master and second only to yoda, and B. It was a thematic reversal of the Phantom Menace duel. The point was arrogance , blind arrogance is your detriment. Maul had the high ground, he was arrogant, he lost. Obi-Wan had the high ground, he didn't gloat and wasn't arrogant, he dispensed with Anakin.
By arbitrarily filming the movies out of sequence, Lucas eliminated inherent drama, that just goes with the territory of making Prequels. You can't have much drama with any character that shows up in a later episode. People can debate the wisdom of Lucas having filmed the trilogies out of sequence, but as far as the execution and success, you couldnt have asked for much better given we know the fate of Vader, Obi-Wan, Yoda, and the droids.
Far too often people concern themselves with could have or should have been, rather than what was or is. That's the problem, people need to learn to accept a thing on it's own merits. The dialogue of the Prequels was no more insipid or juvanile than the original trilogy. You were simply 5 when you first saw the oeiginal trilogy and the characters and situations were larger than life. Can you or anyone else honestly with a straight face tell me an 8 foot dog named "Chewie" is anymore ridiculous than a 7 foot lizard named "Jar Jar?" or that "you look strong enough to pull the ears off a gundark" is more eloquent than "you arent rough like sand?" Come on people lets get your heads out of your ass and use some perspective here. When you are a kid, you arent an asshole film critic analysing a film, you are enjoying it. -
It isn't a movie, but a number of people seem to like it:
http://tinyurl.com/nvg5tc
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sorry--I was typing fast. Sorry, Josh.
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but I trust any direction Abrams decides to take with this franchise. He's proven himself in my book.
A little shameless self promotion:
www.squidoo.com/themoviebible -
http://www.advocacysupportcenter.com/joshuavance.asp
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I haven't had time to do real paintings for a few years now. I am trying to get a break in my schedule this summer between Origins and DragonCon.
When I get something good, I'll send it your way. -
No one that didnt enjoy Revenge of the Sith could have created such a piece. Very exquisite.
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I actually did the initial drawing ten years ago, then that version in 2002...The best part for me is the "Mad Fold-In" jack-o-lantern...See it?
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as it is, do you know what I think would have cemented it? Rather than anger being expressed by the legions of fallen Jedi, a somber, quiet sadness. Anakins guilt is perfect though.
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And actually do some sort of tally, of how many Jedi Anakin actually killed personally. It may be listed in some sort of manual somewhere but, I haven't seen it.
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So, they are reflective of the Anger he feels they would have--they themselves wouldn't have any anger towards him, just sadness...it is also the reason why they all have Sith sabres.
Feel free to check out the rest of the site and let me know what you think. -
Because he is being swallowed by his own guilt.
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The reason I love Episode I and hate both II and III is that the latter films completely fail to address the concept of Anakin's slavery, which would have lent some weight to his downfall.Lucas's decision to drop the slavery angle ran completely opposite to where the story was naturally headed--if for no other reason than the enormous amount of screen time that was invested in the idea (remember the Episode I dinnertable discussion about "freeing all the slaves" and his implanted transmitter/bomb/house arrest device?)A rough sketch of how II could have gone: Anakin, now age 20, is a respected Jedi hero. He continues to grow in the Force; accompanying his mentor, Obi-Wan, on missions of great importance to the Republic. However, he continues to be haunted by premonitions of going back to Tatooine and "freeing all the slaves;" and having witnessed firsthand the effects of injustice in his travels throughout the galaxy, he plans to return to Tatooine and make good on what HE thinks is his destiny. Obi-Wan gets wind of this, and reminds Anakin of his Jedi role as an objective, non-political peacekeeper--which puts the two squarely at odds. Anakin decides to go anyway.Returning to Tatooine, Anakin stages a slave revolt. However, he naively underestimates the Hutts' determination to continue their economic dominance of the system. Reprisals ensue, and just as Obi-Wan and Padme arrive to collect Anakin, Shmi Skywalker is killed. Anakin blames Obi-Wan for her death. Obi-Wan is regretful, but remains committed to the Jedi order. Anakin refuses to be swayed by Obi-Wan and is formally censured.Padme offers Anakin asylum on Naboo, which he accepts. In his self-imposed exile, Anakin cultivates a friendship with now-Chancellor Palpatine at his Camp-David-style retreat. He also grows closer to Padme. They fall in love and marry. They have vaginal, oral, and anal sex.
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It's nothing at all. All Merrick has here is vague speculation by an actor with no power over plot or inside information.
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It is the one we will be watching from now on. Fans of TOS can believe that their original dudes are still in one universe/alternate timeline. If you will kindly recall, there was the TNG episode with Q when the Enterprise was at a disturbance causing all sorts of Enterprises from different universes to coincide? One Enterprise had a crazed Riker trying to escape a Borg-controlled galaxy, and got shot to bits for it. Friggin sweet episode.
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One of the reasons I got a log-in here. Each to their own, obviously this little space adventure film is contentious bugger, but your posts are so blinded by out-and-out hate and bile, they're actually hilarious. Did JJ Abrams wrong you in a former life? Right. Where's that LaserPants while we're at it...
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I think you are combining elements from the Next Gen finale "All Good Things..." and "Parallels" where Worf gets thrown between multiple realities--Q wasn't in that episode.
I keep hoping that The Powers That Be recognize that there is still a market for the old Star Trek Universe, albeit in the form of Direct-to-Video movies. If StarGate can do it, why not Trek? -
... surely we would have got a movie based in that Universe instead of this? Not having a go, just saying - by and large, that well ran dry with Nemesis, Voyager and Enterprise. No one seemed to care anymore. And on another note, I find it chucklesome that people moan about the new Enterprise engine room looking like a brewery. I bet they never complained about the bridge of Voyager looking like a plush hotel reception.
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Fine, McDonalds and toilet roll "serve their purpose" or whatever, as I said the new Trek does... but the analogy doesn't really hold - those are conveniences. People at large are going out of their way to see this film again. It's not often movies like this get repeat business. And yes, the original Trek was admirably "outside the box" for its day, and took a good long while to catch on as you say. But I doubt Paramount or anyone else involved are in the business of making movies which won't find their audience until years after release.
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It is clearly an altered timeline and not an alternate universe.
Look at how time travel has worked in Trek before. In "The City on the Edge of Forever", when McCoy went back in time, the universe changed instantly - no more Enterprise, etc. He was able to go into the past and change his future, not just create an alternate universe.
"Tomorrow is Yesterday" has Spock determining that they must make sure the pilot is returned so that his son will still lead the first mission to Saturn (I think it was Saturn) so that their timeline isn't altered.
In "Time's Arrow", they go back in time, they go back and leave Data's head in the past, find it in the future and put it back on his body.
Obviously in the Star Trek universe, time travel does not create alternate universes, it alters the timelines. -
This is fanboy reporting at its best. I thought I was reading STARLOG back in its heyday with this article. Oh the possibilities that Greenwood alludes to.
If there is some sort of continuation of the "Prime" versus "Alternate" universe issue, then it's reasonable to anticipate Nimoy's return at some point. And possibly Shatner's as well.
Personally, I would have preferred a clean reboot a la James Bond or BATMAN BEGINS, but since they've chosen this route instead, a resolution to this split realities might make for a pretty cool trilogy. But eggads, more time traveling? Don't make it so! -
"Alternate reality" as damage control for this film?
You could say that Trek lost it's way as the actors got older. But this film didn't "save" Star Trek. Paramount got hard-ons over Batman Begins and every other re-booted franchise (Galactica anyone) and had Abrams create a dumb, but enjoyable film.
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Remember this post?
http://www.aintitcool.com/?q=node/39239
Robert Downey Jr. made a simply analergy about "spinning plates", and Merrick made a whole post about it saying it was the funniest thing of the year. Now Merrick has done the same thing: he'd found a simple piece of speculation from a cast member, and has made a uneeded and misunderstood post. This guy adds nothing to value to the site, why does he even bother? If somebody could please explain I'd be genuinely grateful. He literally does not understand when he writes Is just some friend of somebody important who they felt sorry for? Is he an intern? A person with a severe learning disorder? -
Greenwood qouted what "he would like" not what is in the works. If there's even a story written or an idea on paper it hasn't even been fleshed out yet. Trust.
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Suck it haters. The old Trek is dead. Gone. Lives only in your memories and DVDs.
This is a new starting point for new adventures and shit. JJ brought sexy back. Deal with it. I fucking love the new crew. I want everyone on the bridge given full involvement in the future movies.
Chekov is funny. Hahaa!! Uhura is sexy!! Sulu stabs people for realz!!! McCoy is an annoying curmudgeon!!! Spock knows Vulcan Fu and does not hesitate to kick ass!!! Great! And new Kirk is a fucking MAN, not a caricature. Fuck you Shatner!! You got negotiated out of the new franchise!!! BWAHA!! Eat it haterz!!!!! Scotty: I'm giving it all she's got!!! hehe brilliant!!! -
You may be right. There was the finale with Q. But I remember one where there was a spacetime distortion that initially was very small near the start of Earth that stymied evolution. Then by the end, the thing was huge. It was causing some sort of rift. And I remember like 100 Enterprises all materializing around it from different universes. They had to work together to close it and seal of the universes from each other. Each universe had been following its own timeline. Or am I totally off??
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The crew find Khan's ship Botany Bay like they did in the original series, only this time it’s more like the Space Shuttle from Buck Rogers in the 25th Century. They unfreeze Khan (played by Ben Afflec) and he gets Uhura to fall in love with him making Spock go insane with jealously. Khan then takes control of the Enterprise, marooning Spock & Kirk & crew on City Alpha 5 or 6. Khan takes the Enterprise back to Earth...six months later, Kirk & crew escape city Alpha (thanks to Scotty and some Tribble hilarity "Get down from there!") and head back to Earth where they find Khan has become emperor and Uhura is his bitch. In fact, all Earth women are his bitches, and so are some of the men (cameo by token fag Martin Short). But Kirk doesn't give a fuck, and just rocks up to Khan's palace and unzips his trousers and whips out his todger. Scotty ya see has been filming this and when all the women of the world see Kirk's diggler, Khan's mind control over them breaks, and they rise up and follow Kirk (even the guys do, except Martin Short who tries to kill him but Sulu strips to the waist and sword fights Short until Short gets impaled and green spunk cums out of his dying mouth). Even Khan can't compete with Kirk's manhood and offers to be Kirk's bitch instead. Kirk kicks that genetically modified cunt in the throat and then Spock puts the beetle he found hiding in his pants on City Alpha into Khan's ear to make him go mad because he is now a hard bastard. Yeah. That's how it's going down this time. Kirk has the biggest cock in Starfleet, at least he thinks until Uhura has a private joke to Spock about how much bigger Spock’s is. Very funny scene.
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THAT WOULD BE YOUR MUM'S WOMB YOU FUCKING PONCE SISSIES. OMFG. I SWEAR, ALL OF YOU TOOLS LAMENTING THE GOOD OLD DAYS OF WARM FRIENDLY TB'S HAVE A RATHER NASTY CASE OF REVISIONIST HISTORY. THE TB'S ON AICN WERE NEVER WARM AND FUZZY. YOU GIRLS SIMPLY NEED TO MAN UP, AND MAN UP QUICK. CHRIST.
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"TITBAG CALLED ME A PENIS IN ONE OF THE TALKBACKS AND IT MADE ME CRY. IS THERE ANYTHING YOU CAN DO? I FEW OF US WOULD LIKE A WARM SOFT PLACE IN WHICH TO DISCUSS FILM, BUT ME MUM'S WOMB FELL OUT OF HER ASSHOLE AFTER HER 12TH RETARD BIRTH. THANKS HARRY. KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK AT JJCOOLNEWS."
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A Brit like you speaking like some kind of fucking Bronx homeboy is pretty tragic. Just an FYI. Man up? Fuck off.
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... I'll indulge you, whether you're from Cork, Newcastle, Swansea or Hartlepool. How would you, with your vast wisdom, impressive literacy, boundless imagination and expansive creativity, have made Star Trek a better film? And bear in mind, if you wrote in screenplay entirely in capitals like a backward child, it wouldn't get read.
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... if he is from Hartlepool, he's from a place where the locals once tried, sentenced and hung a MONKEY because they thought it was a French spy. True story.
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You are the consummate shit salesman. It's no wonder to me that you basically peddle advertising to pay for you dinner; if that's to even be believed. You'll have us all believe the sky is red, people fly not walk and the star wars prequels were nothing short of genius.
It's amazing really.
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Is it an alternate timeline or an alternate universe? IT'S BOTH. Nero and Spock Prime travelled through Space AND Time. Nero traveled into the past in an alternate universe and his actions altered that universe's timeline. He and Spock Prime are unable to return to their universe and their timeline.The Film says this. The Filmakers have said this. How can you people bitch about the intelligence of a film and the people who enjoy it, when YOU DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THE PLOT? Your 40 years of Trek canon have not been erased. Do you really think Paramount would let them do that? This is a New Universe for them to explore in the movies. There will still be novels, comics and games set in the old universe.
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I liked the new Abrams film...
It just wasn't Star Trek.. -
... The Next Generation. Or Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. Or Star Trek: Voyager. Or Star Trek: Enterprise. It was, however, STAR TREK.
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... you enjoyed it. That's good. A lot of people on here are going out of there way to say it's one of the worst things ever committed to celluloid. Which goes to show how sheltered and blinkered some Trek fans can be, because that is simply a bullshit statement with no basis in reality.
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First... there's no long desert road in Iowa (Kirk born and raised local).
Also.. no ginormous cliffs with which to drive cars off of.
Kirk could very well have been (and likely WAS) immature and selfish as a boy, but there is NO WAY you're going to convince anyone he was a whiny, petulant, snot nosed little shit who would steel his foster dad's car and then intentionally destroy it for no particular reason.
I don't are how 'brilliant' your performance was in the commission of your duties, if you receive a field promotion, you don't get to KEEP the command when everything is all said and done like a prize at the summer fair.
Spock just relinquishing his duties after being provoked by Kirk, and everyone just having sat back and letting it all just happen? Yeah.. umm.. I think not..
Syler isn't fooling anyone ... we know he's still eating brains -
Brace yourself for a lot of weak, shitty explanation.
I fear this will end in stalemate, like arguing with a schizophrenic. -
I'm sure that wasn't the intention - more to show him as a reckless little bastard who craved adventure. As for Kirk keeping his commission - well, it's a sci-fi flick. As I said before - for some farm boy with no previous experience getting given his own X-Wing and sent into a do-or-die battle is stretching credibility, if that's your criteria. And yes, Spock relinquishing his duties, but let me say this: Had Spock, after witnessing the death of his mother, the complete destruction of his homeworld and virtually entire race, stepped up and commanded the ship and the mission for the rest of the film... I guarantee there'd be people on here bitching about the ludicrousness of THAT.
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This is kind of ridiculous, because STAR TREK is somehow addicted to timeline altering hijinks anyway, but I think they should maintain the integrity of the universe they've created. Let them play with it and with their new actors. Let them burn the flame of its popularity for a few decades, with constantly dwindling returns as all franchises do. Then they can "reboot" it again however they like (including a return to the former timeline). The time is passed for a TOS or even NG series. ENTERPRISE was a flop to begin with. You could prolly sqeeze a movie or two out of the DS9/VOYAGER characters/actors, but then you'll be stuck in the same limbo of needing to "reboot" the franchise because of the turnover in actors, to say nothing of dearth of storylines for the same ole characters.
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... does it matter anyway? In a week or two this place will be aflame with the cries and mewling of fanboys who've had their delicate sensibilities offended by Transformers 2 not adhering to the (frequently inconsistent, often contradictory) canon laid down by a shitty 20-year old cartoon, and venting their completely unwarranted hatred for LaBeouf, insisting that the movie-going public would rather see a film with no human beings in it at all, and robots that defy the laws of physics to change into blocky robots in no way the same dimensions as their disguise. Whilst in this case, the actual arses-on-seats will watch the pretty explosions, have no opinion either way on LaBeouf 'cos he's simply "meh", think the robots looked really cool, and forget about it when they're out of the door.
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Their is a lot of potential and limitless potential for these future Trek films. I don't care to see any Klingons.
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that people point out Spock booting Kirk off the ship, or Kirk taking command, as "unrealistic". I saw some of "Insurrection" on the TV the other night. To my mind, even worse than Nemesis - and a film in which Picard STOPS TIME WITH HIS MIND. Yep, realism right there...
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Kirk's foster pop has a vintage 'vette, FOUR HUNDRED YEARS OLD, that's still in prime operational condition.
Let's think about that..
FOUR
HUNDRED
YEARS
OLD
Now.. I don't know about YOU guys.. maybe you're not car nuts like me... but considering fossil fuels probably ran out 200 years ago... and the guy living next door to me is a mechanic with a 18 year old Honda CRX he can't keep running for more then a month at a time..
*cue scene directly after little Kirk petulantly screams his FULL NAME at a cop like it's going to mean something*
--Interior--Hospital ICU--
Little Kirk ha tubes and lines leading into his body, most likely for the rest of his life, as foster dad gave him such a horrific and biblical beating that Jesus himself came down from Heaven weeping, and begged foster Dad to stop.
[Nurse comes in and checks on little Kirk, but as leaving, accidentally steps on ventilator power cord, unplugging it]
"BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP!"
The End -
No weak shitty explanations from me. I'll just let you weak shits go back to your weak, shitty whining about continuity & canon that turned Trek into a weak, shitty franchise in the first place. Go watch your last few weak, shitty TNG films that struggled to make their COST back at the box office, much less a PROFIT. Have a shitty weekend you weak shit.
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had/have/will have no appreciation of the original Roddenberry concept as presented in TOS.
JarJar's Star Trek may be the most entertaining movie with a Star Trek label, but it should not be considered as part of the Star Trek canon. -
Very funny. Yes, there is the question of the car. But in a movie where planets can get sucked into nothingness, and people can be teleported with pretty-pretty shimmering lights, it's not exactly a hop-skip-and-a-jump to fill in the blanks. Maybe the car ran on future-fuel? Maybe it was just a 50-year old reproduction of an old Earth classic???? Or does everything have to spelled out all the time...
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I'm gonna beat on you till you forgot how to shit!!
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I tend to forget about insurrection, and Nemesis. You're right though, Insurrection was probably the worst and should have killed Trek, as well as Berman's career.
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... JarJar's Trek (as you lot very annoyingly insist on calling it) distills the premise back to EXACTLY what the Original Series was. Take off your rose-tinted specs. It's injected optimism, adventure, fun, and wonder back into it. Something not seen since Kirk and Co headed for the second star to the right, and straight on til morning... You're welcome to your boxsets of the Brannon Braga years. All that's happened here is that fresh, objective eyes have come in and recognised what made Star Trek work to start with. I might add, the same happened with Wrath Of Khan. Nicholas Meyer had never seen an episode of the series. They needed that to (effectively) reboot from the monumental fuck-up that was The Motion Picture, a film that made the mistake of believing Star Trek was a deep and philosophical piece in the first place.
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When I said weak explanations I was looking squarely at you and Josh. You're the king and queen of'em.
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I really would like to see a few more done with the same care and continuing on with the newly established continuity.
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As of May 27th. And only $24,519,502 comes from the UK, Ireland and Malta.Some Highlights: Germany: $7,466,106 Australia: $6,627,544Russia: $5,428,428South Korea: $5,428,428 France and Algeria, Monaco,Morroco and Tunisia: $4,955,042People who don't even understand ENGLISH have an easier time following and enjoying this film than Spazimov Lives, Industry Swiller and Dr._ Pooper Spray.
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You're fucking tedious. Go do something.
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This review will contain heavy spoilers so anyone that hasn't seen the film you are doing yourself a dis-service by not being surprised during the film.
I want to preface this by saying as a life-long Star Trek fan I went into the new film with a certain degree of trepidation, after all how could new actors fill the roles made famous by the likes of William Shatner or Leonard Nimoy? - Not to mention the lackluster performance of the last few films in the series. 40 years of legacy consisting of multiple film and television incarnations is quite the burden for any attempt to reboot or re-launch a series.
The successful re-launching of the Batman , James Bond, and Star Wars franchises have been said to be the model for this films approach. In short they nailed it. This film represents everything the Star Trek concept ever stood for without the 40 years of baggage associated with the franchise that over-time alienated casual fans , perplexed long-time fans, and forced the Star Trek property to collapse under the weight of it's own history.
With this film, it's back to core basics. A simple, fun, by the books origin story that chronicles how James T. Kirk, Spock, and the crew of the U.S.S Enterprise came together to begin their adventures. Star Trek at it's best has always been about the characters and relationships, their humanity, saying something grand and positive about mankinds future, and special effects ideally came secondary to the story.
I believe this film represents a return to positivism and a hopeful outlook on the future in the wake of 9/11, and resulting fear-mongering. The era of the anti-hero such as a Batman or James Bond with their moral ambiguity and questionable ethics is eclipsing. This spirit of positivism and fun has long been missing from the Star Trek series, clear indicators of the times we live in and reflections of the era each series was made.
In keeping with that notion what immediately stands out about the characters in this film is that they are each heroes and champions. Here you have people from diverse backgrounds and beliefs all coming together united in spirit and purpose for a common cause, yet each thrive maintaining their unique individuality. That is the central theme of Star Trek- diversity. That regardless of your background you have the opportunity to stand up and shine , contribute towards a common future.
In the film we see big ideas expressed and none more prevalent than self-sacrifice for love. This concept is the quintessential heart of the film and best illustrates the capacity fully actualized human beings can aspire to. Honor, character, integrity, duty, a strong moral fiber, and consistent ethical code all represent the best of humanitys abilities when individuals conquor their own failings and trappings.
During the Prologue of the film , when George Kirk dutifully steps up in the face of impossible odds without a moments pause and elects to sacrifice his own life so that his wife and newborn child may go on and continue, he demonstrates what is best in humanity and what is unfortunately all too often forgotten in our society - the capacity for - and power of good. Simple, elegant good. That capacity is what defines the human spirit at it's best.
Metaphorically this birth at the beginning of the film also represents the ideas and concepts the entire Star Trek legacy is born from. It's a stunning and moving sequence, surprisingly emotional and intense for a science -fiction film. But that is the inherent beauty of this film, when stripped of science fiction, laser beams, and space battles, it is about what the individual can strive to achieve if they dare. That is the heart of the story - a wandering, lost, bar-hopping young man that indulges in his own self-pity and failings, never connects with those around him, and squanders his own gifts and talents , but when given a challenge by a mentor - "Your father was Captain of a starship for 12 minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your Mothers - and yours. I dare you to do better. " - that young lost man sheds the failings, accepts the dare and begins the journey toward his destiny.
So we see firsthand It is in this dare then, this dare to be better, to DO better, that we can LIVE our dreams- and in doing so be some of these finer brighter things to.
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NO TIME TRAVEL WAS NECESSARY. YOU COULD HAVE HAD ALL THE TOS CREW MEMBERS AT ACADEMY. A CRISIS IN A DISTANT PART OF THE QUADRANT BRINGS THEM ALL TOGETHER ON DIFFERENT SHIPS. PIKE IS COMMANDING THE ENTERPRISE.
THE ENEMY COULD HAVE BEEN KLINGONS; WITH SOME OTHER GROUP ACTUALLY PULLING THE STRINGS. WHO CARES, REALLY. BUT THE ROMULANS GUIDING EVERYTHING WOULD HAVE WORKED JUST FINE.
ONE BY ONE, AS EVENTS UNFOLD, THE CREW BEGINS TO MEET EACH OTHER. SOMETHING HAPPENS THAT KILLS PIKE AND MOST OF THE BRIDGE CREW; LEAVING KIRK AND CO TO STEP UP AND TAKE COMMAND.
THE END WOULD LEAVE PIKE ALIVE AND WELL. STILL IN COMMAND - READY FOR THE EVENS OF THE CAGE. THE FUTURE TOS CREW GETS THEIR RESPECTIVE ASSIGNMENTS.
THE SEQUEL COULD HAVE BEEN ELEGANT AND SIMPLE: A FEW YEARS HAVE GONE BY OR WHATEVER AND FINALLY THE TOS ASSIGNMENTS ARE HANDED OUT THAT FIND THEM ALL TOGETHER AGAIN ON THE ENTERPRISE - LEAVING THE SPACE DOCK TO BEGIN THEIR 1ST 5 YEAR MISSION.
NOW.
ANY FUCKING QUESTIONS YOU PATHETIC MONGS? DON'T TALK ALL AT ONCE, AS YOU ARE ALL LOATHE TO DO. -
...THE BRIDGE CREW. THAT'S WHAT I GET FOR SPEWING FORTH SO MUCH GENIUS WITHOUT TAKING A BREATH.
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That's......basically what happened in the movie. The time travel elements were simply the framing device, if you eliminate the Nero/elder Spock framing story, it's still an origin story that occured. Only in contrast to your proposal, it was interesting.
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Brilliant!! You should copyright that straight away!!
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GIANT PIG!!!
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Amateur.
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I nearly fell asleep reading it.
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You plagiarized that from a retard didn't you?
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Some janitors just aren't meant to be screenwriters.
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on the Kate and Jon situation. Make that shit into a movie.
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Beats Titbag's idea that's for sure.
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that the next ST movie would use their situation. You could have Spock and Uhura make an agreement on their relationship. It could be an open one. She would have a fling with all the other crew members. Imagine young virgin Chekov getting a hold of that beauty. Never heard anyone screaming in Russian before. She would eat him alive.
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He forgot this is an alternate univere. No more,no less. I think it would be a complete waste of time to rehash an old episode on the big screen. Even "if" it could wind up different than what happened in the other universe.
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...just merge Star Wars and Star Trek so we can bury these franchises. We'll call it Star Wrek.
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Because this is prequel film it must only lead to the events in the 60s tv show! It can't tell any other story, it can't change anything whatsoever because it must conform to their remembering of this old tv show. Even though this is what Enterprise was supposed to do but because cell phones today are more compact than communicators in the original show they chickened out and didn't do it. That show was supposed to tell us how everything in the Kirk/Spock time line came to be and it didn't. So, now there is new movie set in the Trek Universe past so it will tell us how that all came to be. Wait, they aren't telling that story. They want to try something new, they want to change how things work in the Trek universe. This is unacceptable! I want you to tell the story that I want and you can't change anything. All future movies must be retellings of old tv episodes and my favorites characters must be included in them.
If you do not do all these things I will bitch and whine and spew hate all over the internet and try to convince people that you ruined my beloved tv show. Also, girls are yucky and if they like sci-fi I might have to talk to them. -
If you have followed the talkbacks on the subject of Trek, and examine the dichotomy of supporters versus dissenters of this movie, you quickly begin to see the pattern- It's the pessimists, tech whores , and perpetually self-righteous killjoy failed movie-makers that dropped out of New York film academy that had a problem with the movie, whilst anyone that has a pulse seems to have enjoyed it.
Terrible to be an automaton isn't it cunts? -
...TAKE A MOMENT TO PAUSE AND REFLECT ON THE TOTAL BANALITY OF BSEXYB'S POSTS. HE NEVER FAILS TO REACH THE LOWEST COMMON DENOMINATOR.
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... when you take your caps lock off and get a clue, cockstain.
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May 30, 2009 1:59:19 PM CDT
JJ Star Trek awful, simplistic, boring, NOT Trek at all
by thelastboyscout
nuff said
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It's a film paced like Raiders Of The Lost Ark! Say what you like, but boring it is not.
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... the pace could do with being slackened during the second act. The ice monster (extraneous, I grant you, but there so Old Spock gets to make an entrance) and Scotty trapped in the tubes (which I'll grant you I could've done without)... lift those out and the movie wouldn't have sufferred from a lack of pacing. At all. Boring? Fucking hell. Wait for Inglourious Basterds if you want to see boring.
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"Does the phrasing of Greenwood's statement not infer"
No it doesn't. It implies. You infer. Geez. Basic english -
To return the universe as it was supposed to be. JarJar Abrams sucks!
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I fucking hope not. This one's better.
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Raiders and ST. Just shows how much you really don't know about movies.
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I'm comparing the pacing. Nothing else. Breakneck pacing. In my opinion - NOTHING compares to Raiders. NOTHING.
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I hated that cunt and I hate you as well.
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You lying sack of shit. Star Trek has gotten by far the best reviews of any Trek film ever in countries outside of the U.S. You think that because most of us here are Americans that none of us have a handle on what's going on abroad so you tried slipping that lie past us.
Your endless arrogance as BladeRunnerUnit and Memories-of-Murder seems to going just as strong in your latest guise. -
TNG is obliterated now. Sorry n00bs. TNG takes place 70 years after TOS. That means none of them will ever exist(Daddy Picard may never meet Mommy, even if they do chances are their lives are affected just slightly enough that the second Jean-Luc is conceived will be different, a different sperm hits the egg and the kid they name Jean Luc is a dense, cowardly man with a full head of hair or perhaps Jeanne-Louise Picard).
They aren't going to do a big war. They do need to find a story big enough to not feel like a TV movie though. That's been the problem with about half the Star Trek movies. -
STAR TREK II: THE ATTACK OF THE KILLER TRIBBLES.Make it so.
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When you refer to "your old Trek", do you mean the Original Series and movies, or the stuff that came after? Because most of us are GLAD that the latter has been buried for good, and the NEW Trek absolutely and completely fucking IS in the spirit of the 60s show. I'll grant you, some of its nuances have (for now) been sacrificed for pacing, action, and grabbing a new audience - but what's to say the next flick might now be a bit darker, a bit deeper, a bit more thoughtful? You never know. Just stop labouring under the illusion that the original Star Trek was Shakespeare channeled through, I dunno, Chomsky via Kafka via Baudrillard via Flash Gordon, or some such shit. It wasn't. It was adventures in space.
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how are you figuring that AsimovLives is MoM? did he take a shit load of English courses during his last banning? because at the very least AL can write a readable post unlike MoM.
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is the village illiterate these days. Thank God he's shut his trap.
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Yer right on da money. Giant Robots and all that. How's live in Sveden these days-? this is a rare cameo appearence by The PaZoozoo--
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*yawn*
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Ok. There you go. Doesn't change the fact you clearly have a blinded unfathomable vendetta against what is, whichever way you cut it, the best event movie in recent years.
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..but the movie was still painfully stupid as well as a awkward rip off of Star Wars and no box office numbers or gushing from you is really going to change that.
Btw, I just saw UP and really enjoyed it..so I must have a heart in there somewhere. -
You never answered my question about what you consider "your" Star Trek. Seriously, I'm interested.
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and by got lover I mean goat fucker and soccer is for fairies.
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I wouldn't put Trek in the same category as those. Most people I know thought Crystal Skull was weak and underwhelming, that seems to be the general concensus. No one other than we geeks cares one way or another about Transformers. And I don't even think Transformers was THAT well liked by critics (can't be bothered looking right now). So I really don't agree they were received with a whole load of praise and then sufferred a backlash. I honestly doubt there'll be a backlash against Star Trek. I think it will crop up in a good number of "best of '09" lists and sell like hot cakes on DVD come Christmas.
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He's from Gloucester in the South of England. Granted, his Scottish accent left a bit to be desired. Then again - *whispers it* so did James Doohans, being a Texan and all.
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That was my only gripe with the new flick. Hopefully we can just get on with some fresh material/characters/aliens etc.. from here on in. Wasnt that the whole point?
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... I misread your comment. My bad. I only rewatched The Menagerie quite recently, I didn't hear the bit about Pike being the same as Kirk. I'll have to look again. Call it dramatic licence - I can see why they did it: give Kirk the internal conflict of having no true father figure, off the rails, and Pike (to appease the FANS) appears to provide guidance. Whatever, I'm thinking aloud. One thing, though: The new flick spurred me to go and buy the box sets of the original series, having only caught episodes when I could on repeats. Think how many fans, new to Trek because of this film, will be doing the same. Surely you can't say that's a bad thing?
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... is that Star Trek has, to the masses, been an absolute laughing stock, a pariah, for years and years. People at large would rather spoon out their eyes than sit down and watch Voyager or DS9 or whatever. Star Trek has carried a horrible stigma with it for the best part of two or three decades. In the case of Crystal Skull, many may have drank the Kool-Aid because, fuck it, INDY was back. A beloved franchise which no one really says a bad word about. In the case of Trek, people are amazed that it is a genuinely good film.
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I just got through WATCHING the whole of the original series! It's a show that consistently contradicts ITSELF for fuck's sake! And work it out: If Kirk was supposed to be the same age as Pike... Pike commanded that ship for what, twelve years before Kirk, according to The Menagerie (I think I'm in the ballpark there)... Kirk was supposed to be 35 during the original series... so that means Pike was captaining the Federation's flagship at TWENTY THREE YEARS OF AGE?! That's even younger than Kirk is in the new film, an age issue which you and others seem to take great umbrage with! So basically, either Pike was NEVER meant to be Kirk's age, or it was yet another continuity balls-up in a series and franchise already riddled with them. Live with it.
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you insipid ignorant cocksucker. Mendez was reffering to how old Pike was when he commanded the Enteprise "about Kirk's age." Spock also states in the episode how many years he served with Pike and it was over a decade so how could Pike be Kirk's age, use common sense you fucking twat.
That's what kills me about these fuckers relentlessly slamming the new Trek movie, look how utterly STUPID they are. Yet they critique?? Get the fuck out of here with that mickey mouse shit. -
... but I still say that you may be surprised in a sequel. I hope you are. But I can honestly say that I do think, continuity flaws or slight embellishments notwithstanding, each of the characters in the film were played brilliantly and true to the originals. I'm just glad there's a great new version of a great old TV show, and Star Trek is being talked about it again, minus the snickering and finger-pointing. That said, the British press had a field day at the Leicester Square premiere, picking on the old faithful all dressed like Picard.
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out of their fat little skanky ass is this bitch Asimov. Mother fucker you clearly don't know a GOD DAMN thing about Star Trek or even science fiction. Little turds like you wouldn't know what constitutes entertainment if it slapped you in the face with it's dick. Fuck off man go jerk off to a Shitinator or Avatar talkback you fucking uninformed little troll. My left ass cheek knows more about STAR TREK than your entire fucking cansanguinous biological line. Fuck off.
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"Stupid retard untalented hack?"
The lady Asimov doth protest too much me thinks. Hey whore, you are projecting. It's isn't pretty.
This fucker can't even get his facts straight and he's trying to lecture someone on what "good" Trek is, you are a God damn joke Asimov. -
before you start criticizing someone elses art fucker. It makes you a sad hypocrite. It's BLATANTLY clear Star Trek is NEW to your ass, go jerk off to your Enterprise DVDs and leave true Trek to the true Trek fans. Star Trek was around 30 years before your ass was even born kid.
This movie ISN'T the shitstorm of Voyager and Enterprise and that's why morons like you can't deal with it. It PERFECTLY exemplifies the spirit and precepts of the original series and if you are downing this movie you simply don't like the original series so piss off and find your way back to Janeways quantum phase anomalous cunt. -
My left ass cheek has FORGOTTEN more about Star Trek than your banal little ass will ever know. "I" said the movie perfectly represents Star Trek and that's all you need to know. If someone requires your opinion I'll give it to you.
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portraying Jose' Mendez , who also voiced the Talosian magistrate in the unbroadcast "The Cage", and played Senator Pardek in "Unification" on the Next Generation. You've got nothing Asimov. Nothing.
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go get back to your DVD you uniformed little prick. Hey Asimov shithead, is it the United federation of planets or the United earth space probe agency as the operating body of starfleet? Is it James T. Kirk or James R. Kirk? What's Spock's unpronounceable first name shithead?
Is it Vulcans or Vulcanians?
Is it 300 years in the future or 800 years?
Don't you ever come around here again trying to lecture someone on Star Trek or inconsistencies you sophist mentality little shit. -
finally
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_yyhm9rZHo -
An honestly mistaken review. Clearly we have a generational divide going on here with the film. Ah well, kids. Fuck em.
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Those reviewers. It's not a generational thing. Most "kids" as you call them, loved this movie.
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It must be the teen angst emo crowd in a ruffle over this film, OR, more likely, the pigment challenged puffy types because in my many travels and adventures, save THIS website chat forum, I haven't encountered anyone that had anything but praise for this wonderful film. How ironic.
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it's more the fact that people accept the serious plot holes and blatant lazy writing in this because it is "supposed to be fun".
I don't care about Star Trek cannon or how it ties into the TV show or movies. I care about good story telling. This movie is badly written. Saying that it's "fun" so it doesn't matter is the biggest problem with Hollywood these days. -
That's the irony of it and why I am such a fervent supporter of the film in the talkbacks, primarily, to point out the hypocrisy of arm-chair couch critics.
This film is no more badly written than anything else these fucks who attack the film cite as "good" films, especially Star Trek history itself. Is the screen play worthy of the Nebula award? Hell no, but it shouldn't have to be to be admired.
This film succeeded where no other Trek film, AND many other genre films don't, it has drawn in a mainstream audience and reignited a dead franchise.
That is the douche in the taint of most of the detractors, they cite bad plotting, dialogue, but the truth is they resent the film because it's popular. You see they are anti-populist, because they themselves are not popular as people. It's simple Psychology, it's called cognitive dissonance.
THEY like the unpopular, the niche', the sub-genre, because it gives them a sense of entitlement and ownership. They PRAISE and HAIL a piece of shit like Watchmen and Wolverine, and Terminator, because everyone else and their fucking bother could care less about it. It's sad, but a reality. -
These same fucks would be saying it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
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Don't get me wrong. Terminator, Wolverine etc... are much MUCH worse than this movie. This is one of the worst summers in history.
But, as you've just admitted, this film leaves much to be desired plot wise. Saying it's on par with that other crap isn't giving it much praise at all.
Whatever happened to great writing like Star Trek II? Now there is a good Star Trek film.
I'm glad the series is revived. I hope they show a little more respect to our brains next time around. Instead of just giving us "fun" -
critique the writing of Star Trek, then if they are intellectually fair and rational, they must critique the writing of ALL films Hollywood is releasing.
Star Trek II was written by a novelist, Nicholas Myer is a novelist first and foremost- well versed in literary irony, symbolism, structure, anecdote, etc. There are very few screenwriters in Hollywood today that are by trade novelists.
If we really want to attack the root of the problem, it isn't Star Trek, but rather a generational issue. An age issue.
You see all of the great screen-writers of cinema, they led storied, intriguing lives. They were world war II veterans, policemen, physicians, etc etc, what you see now in Hollywood, is a generation of directors and writers, basically, that haven't lived or experienced enough to convey true emotion in a script. It's the Mtv video game generation calling the shots now, generation X. This problem is nothing new with Star Trek, it's about 10 years old. Contrast ANY film from say the 70's, in both direction and writing, with ANY film today.
Apples and oranges. But don't single out Star Trek is all I'm saying. The true problem is much deeper. -
You're absolutely right about writers these days. (there are a few, Nolan springs to mind)
My side of the issue is; don't single out Star Trek, but don't forgive it either. -
Good ones that spring to mind I meant to say.
It's just that we can't forgive bad writing in any film, no matter how much we love the subject matter. Do we forgive Star Trek V?
(Granted that film has a lot more than just script problems) -
Is another parallel example of a film that critics fell all over themselves hyping and drooling over for false, self-serving reasons.In reality, though, King Kong sucks and is completely forgettable.Just like this new ST film.
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Joshua and Asimov are attacking each other with relish, I see.
It is like a standoff between the irresistable force and the immovable object--You can keep yelling till you are blue in the face--YOU WON'T CHANGE EACH OTHER'S OPINIONS.
There have been a few posts about how people's perceptions change over time, how films that were lauded upon their release as being FUN and EXCITING are now looked at as utter crap.
I had a revelation last night, while the original version of E.T. was playing on HBO while I worked (Yay for HBO showing the original version of the film before it was tampered with and has an Overacting E.T. and no guns!):
I will be 36 years old in a few days. And when the summer of 1982 happened, I was Nine--I was Elliot's age (and in fact looked almost exactly like him) and now I am the age of "Keys", the leader of the Government Scientists who remains faceless until the last act.
I used to take everything on faith, liked movies whether they were good or bad simply because they were "Fun" and never thought I would grow up...now I am very caught up in my work, have little if any time to go to the movies every week and don't enjoy "Mindless Fun" movies they way I once did.
I grew up somewhere or grew old depending on how you look at it.
And the Epiphany I had while watching the end of ET was that "Keys" was Elliot when he was his age. Had ET come to "Keys" when he was a little boy, the same story might have been told and if ET came to earth now, Elliot would be like "Keys".
Not liking the new "Star Trek" doesn't make you a killjoy or a snob. Liking it in spite of it's faults because it is "Fun" doesn't make you an idiot.
Everyone is at different stages of their development and tastes very widely--so, if we have opposing viewpoints, we should try to stop attacking other people. Focus our energies on defending our points of view and try to communicate them clearly--Not simply regurgitate the same arguments over and over ad nauseum.
Each side in this argument seems to think the other sides are sheep in that they are following someone's opinion rather than make up their own minds. Bullshit, I say.
The people who try to present their ideas as clearly as possible are the freethinkers while the constant attackers on both sides are the sheep. I, Myself will try to keep personal attacks to a minimum--hopefully we all will.
Flame on! -
I agree with you in theory Bones.
But can't these writers do both? Like in Batman Begins or Spiderman 2 or X2 just to name a few. People are happy because it's fun and people are happy because it has respect for its audience and its characters.
Too often, recently, Hollywood just wants you to watch cool shit and smile brightly while screaming "It's fun, it's not supposed to be smart"
So, in essence, we're not asking anyone to do any thinking. Unlike in films of the past where we were challenged WHILE having fun.
Film is way too strong a form to be wasted solely on fun.
I think I once heard Sean Penn say something like "If you want fun go get a hooker and an 8 ball....that's not what movies are supposed to be"
I paraphrase... -
Your comments about screenwriters of old vs. today--all exactly right.Add to that the fact that the movie studios are more often than not owned by gigantic conglomerates not primarily concerned with moviemaking, whereas in the 70s and 80s this was often not the case.These days, entire studios, not just film productions, are but one line-item on the balance sheet--right next to the snack food, soda, and toilet paper. And if the soda companies are up and the films are down, then why not use the same marketing techniques for soda on films?This is the main problem with the new ST film. All the creative people involved could have very well made the ST to end all ST, but they didn't do that. It was strategically marketed to a younger audience. It's not a terrible film, it just plays young (and by extension, a little dumb), and ST was never about that.
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They raise good points about the difference between modern writers and films and the stories being told by people who are a Generation or so older than us.
In a weird way, I think we are losing our ability to create.
So much effort is put into recreating what someone else has done or retelling old stories that anything new is seemingly scary or strange. Hollywood especially is only taking safe bets these days and if there isn't a BRAND to tie their films to, they don't seem to want to make them.
There are even sequels being made to films that were one-off stories made 25 years ago--I mean, even if it is good, do we really need Tron 2?
What if the trend continues? What cinema will we be left with in a world where the now adult culture reveres the remakes of Day the Earth Stood Still, Halloween and Texas Chainsaw Massacre? Or who think that Family Guy made up all the little jokes that they reference?
Sequels used to be exception, not the norm--and they used to re-release movies so new audiences could discover truly great films. Remakes always happened, but usually it was to make a color version or a musical version of a previous film--and oftentimes they would actually take the original script and adapt it.
Now, Hollywood has to rely on the business model of BIG OPENING WEEKENDS and Home Video. -
I noticed that AsimovLives never responded to joshuavance's pointing out that "The Menagerie" says that Pike was close to Kirk's age when he captained the Enterprise NOT when the trial is going on. He's obviously older than Kirk. I seem to recall his hair being grey at the temples when he's shown in his chair? And as josh pointed out, he had the ship for 12 years before Kirk got it. If you're going to nitpick Asimov, make sure you're RIGHT before you start typing. I'm tired of correcting people who aren't paying attention to what's actually said and shown.
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I enjoy our tet-a-tets and talking to Joshuavance as well. And Bob Orci--I owe him a beer if I ever meet him in person!
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AT THE END, IF WARP DRIVE WAS THE ONLY THING KEEPING THEM FROM BEING SUCKED INTO THE BLACK HOLE-- EVEN IF THEY ARE GOING BEYOND WARP 1, WHY THEY COULD NOT DISTANCE THEMSELVES IS BEYOND ME, BUT HEY IT'S MOVIES.
STILL, THE INSTANT THE WARP DRIVE WENT OFFLINE, EVEN BEFORE THE CORE WAS EJECTED,THE SHIP SHOULD HAVE BEEN INSTANTANEOUSLY SUCKED INTO THE BLACK HOLE, RIGHT?
AND BLOWING UP A CORE??? WHEN YOU ARE POINT BLANK?? AND ONLY GOING SUB-LIGHT (IMPULSE) DOESN'T DESTROY YOU?
WHERE ARE THOSE CONTINUITY SUPERVISORS WHEN YOU NEED THEM. -
I for one thought that OVERALL, the Dominion War arc was excellent. The last several episodes especially were great. However, the final episode with "red eyed" Gul DuKat and the Kai, etc.. was stupid. However, I like that she finally died, that bitch.
Voyger's last 2 episodes were great
Enerprise?? well, I think I saw some Vulcan nipples, otherwise, it was a bomb.
TNG-- great for what it was.
TOs-- politically and socially groundbreaking. period.
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There used to be a clear division between movies targeted to family audiences and movies targeted only to adults. And it was understood that R rated films were not going to be huge at the box office for the most part. Altman and Coppola and Scorsese were not making films for teenagers in the 70's.Lucas and Spielberg killed the 70's and inaugurated the blockbuster mentality where everything has to be huge right out of the gate. And Hollywood assumes the PG13 crowd doesn't care about a good story.As a defender of this new movie, I think the film is actually better written than some of you guys give it credit for. It moves so quickly that you miss some of the nuances if you've only seen it once. And remember how excited we were to hear an Academy Award nominated screenwriter was doing a Star Trek script? We ended up with NEMESIS.
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I am rewatching all of DS9--am almost finished with the 3rd season.
Much better than I remember it being...there are a few "bad" episodes here and there, but overall I love it. I totally agree with you about the end--Dukat was completely misused as a character in that last season.
Enterprise only exists as it's third and fourth seasons in my eyes--and even then, really only the 2-Part Mirror Universe episodes were really fun! But on the whole it was a wash(well, outside of whacking it to Jolene Blalock's pouty lips and augmented hooters).
Voyager was hit and miss...I feel like they missed a real opportunity with that show to be really relevant--they could have shown how to very different groups would have to function together, from having two sets of officers, politics on the ship, and having to incorporate alien technology as they went along. I also believe the show was much better before Seven of Boobs showed up.
TNG was great for what it was, and still has a few of the finest Trek hours in it's episodes, but yes indeed it is set on a flying Ramada Inn.
And the Original show is still the king, even though DS9 is my favorite. The fact that most of the episodes still work well, 40-odd years on is a real testament to it's quality--but imagine how mind-blowing it would have been to see it when it was first on? I mean, compare it to Lost in Space!
I still think this is the best Trek Tribute of all time:
http://tinyurl.com/psomfu
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...But like Transformers before it, I will wait for HBO. It just wasn't a film that I wanted to see a second time.
Again, I think it was not so much the writing (although in the one time I did see it in the theater the writing didn't strike me as being particularly good) it was the way the film was directed, shot and edited as well as my many afore mentioned aesthetic problems with it.
But, I will see it again, I am sure. As a side note, I watched Transformers partially on HBO and then sat down and rewatched it all the way through. I will not be seeing it again, nor the Sequal. If I want Transformers, I will watch the 1986 cartoon film--maybe followed by some Galaxy Rangers or Dungeons & Dragons episodes... -
If anybody could write an interesting Trek script for the big screen it would be Ira Steven Behr, Ronald D. Moore and those guys. DS9 gets lumped in with the other shows but it really was its own odd little animal. The quirkiest cast, the most offbeat writing. Definitely the best since TOS.
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And maybe sloooow down...just a bit. I would love a 2.5 hour EPIC Star Trek story, one with internal logic and a well-defined threat.
But, I think that the "Supreme Court" (God I hate that title--although, it is telling that they think so highly of themselves) have gotten so used to the style of storytelling that they do on LOST, which is very DESTINY and MYSTERY based and often times self-contradicting (and don't get me wrong works great for the type of show that LOST is) that they aren't looking toward other ways to tell a story.
My, that was a helluva run-on sentence!
I really really really really really hope that they don't retell any Original Series stories--they need to go their own way and make sure that they come up with a crackerjack story--and that everything exists to support the story, not to shoehorn references to Old Trek or characters that are unnecessary.
I also think that if this is going to be going it's own way, they could kill off one of the core seven characters--it would be so shocking and unexpected that people would lose their shit in the same way that we all did when they originally killed off Nimoy!
And, no I am not joking. If this is a different universe, let it play out completely different--be Bold. -
Are you kidding me?
1) From Portugal.
2) Rants endlessly about his hate for Bay and Abrams -- even in unrelated TBs.
3) Refers to them and their movies with "funny" joke names.
4) Has a hardon for Korean cinema.
5) Has a hardon for Blade Runner.
6) Uses expressions like "hem" and "as it were" -- even where they don't fit.
7) Is extremely condescending to Americans yet becomes indignant when perceiving "xenophobia".
8) Makes odd, creepy, cack-handedly asexual remarks about women when trying to be "one of the guys".
I could go on and on. As for his English skills, they're only as good as he is level-headed. As soon as he starts losing it, his posts become more and more disjointed. Watch him fall apart in the first Alien remake/reboot TB.
He's the same fucking tool he always has been. -
...let's not forget ignoring replying to posts where he gets his ass handed to him or when he's exposed as being either ignorant or a lying asshole.
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With singularities you get into that weird twilight zone of physics where reality begins breaking down.
Black holes aren't a favorite term for physicists because the term doesn't adequately convey what goes on with a blackhole. Hollywoods depiction of them typically doesn't help either. A "black hole" isn't a hole at all, like some cosmic whirlpool that sucks in everything around it, it's actually an object. If the sun were instantly replaced with a black hole of sufficient mass, our Earth would still orbit around it like nothing happened, with the exception of freezing into a ball of ice.
Star Trek doesn't depict a black hole at all like they are postulated to be so, there's no sense splitting hairs on that issue, let's just say it was a unique red matter created singularity. heh -
Ronald Moore wrote Generations.
I say thee, nay. Onward and forward yon Trek. -
He's done that for YEARS. He'll come into a TB, make asinine, poorly thought out proclamations or provide a list of Aspbergian and erroneous nitpicks. He will then more or less say that anyone who disagrees with him is a subhuman moron. When someone then has the nerve to point out his errors or lies, he will simply ignore them.
He did it as BladeRunnerUnit, he did it as Memories-of-Murder, and now he's doing it as AsimovLives. -
Really fast in Star Trek and redo anything?
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... the more it becomes clear that the new movie could've been a line-for-line, shot-for-shot remake of The Menagerie, Where No Man Has Gone Before, Space Seed, City on the Edge of Forever, Spock's fucking Brain... and he would STILL be having conniptions just because the names Kurzman, Orci and Abrams are on the credits. Cleealy Asimov's problems lie with the people involved, not the film at all. His unfathomable ire and hate directed at those guys is baffling, and not a little Aspergersey.
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... especially when I read, way back when, they were NOT doing a clean reboot / remake. I thought it smacked of a lack of courage, but understood they were tailoring it to the established universe just to TRY and keep the likes of Asimov happy. By not completely nuking everything that has gone before. And I guaran-fucking-tee you, had they HAD done a clean reboot, the haters would be using THAT as another reason to hate blindly. Bones and cymbalta - good points made by both.
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... good post.
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Deal with it. You're outvoted. World 1 / Haters 0
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... with no evidence other than "JJ Abrams is a hack", and being utterly unable to understand or respond to a counter-argument is pretty damned Aspergersy to me. Or just thick-headed. I just threw Aspergers in there to kick up a stink, cos y'know..... it's a talkback.
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and the logistics of paradox and time-travel, what's so difficult for people to understand? This is NOT an alternate Universe. Nero changed history. He arrived at a certain point in time, revealed himself, and committed an act which change the flow of history completely. It's not the same as in TV episodes, or The Voyage Home, where the crew travelled back in time and crept around surreptitiously, completing their mission without revealing themselves, and therefore not interfering with the original flow of events. There is no alternate UNIVERSE, just an alternate TIMELINE. Please refer to Doc Brown's handy chalkboard diagram in Back to the Future Part II.
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May 31, 2009 8:48:32 AM CDT
THE SCI-FI UNIVERSE DOES NOT REVOLVE AROUND STAR WARS
by bringingsexyback
Not to mention there is nothing epically mythological about Yoda and Luke. The first 12 minutes of New Trek has more emotional punch than anything since Luke dragged dead Vader onto the ship. And the whole of New Trek rivals or bests ANH - easily.
JJ may not have made the Trek of your dreams, but it's the new classic. It raises the bar that the SW prequels knocked down time and again.
Rejoice! And praise Bale.
For we could've gotten yet another stinker made by the likes of Titbag or some shitass hack. -
May 31, 2009 8:54:10 AM CDT
TITBAG SR.: "IF TIT'S TREK HAS ANY ASSRAPE IN IT ... "
by bringingsexyback
"... I'll sue that bitch for royalties."
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this is a non-story if I ever read one.
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....ON A 23RD CENTURY STARSHIP TELLS ME THAT THE WRITERS DIDN'T GIVE FUCK ALL ABOUT SCIENCE FICTION AND THAT THEY REALLY JUST WANTED TO WRITE AN EPISODE OF PARTY OF FIVE.
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"BY THAT HACK JJ. AND I'M STILL NEVER GOING TO FORGIVE THAT PRICK NIMOY FOR TAKING PART IN THIS TRAVESTY. THAT FUCKER. GUESS HIS SHITTY ART CAREER OF TAKING BLACK AND WHITE PHOTOGRAPHS OF OIL DRUMS AND COCKTAIL NAPKINS DIDN'T PAN OUT.
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May 31, 2009 9:19:24 AM CDT
TITBAG THINKS WATER PURIFICATION SYSTEMS AREN'T NECESSARY
by bringingsexyback
in the 23rd Century. That's nice.
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"BY REFUSING TO TAKE PART IN THIS MESS OF A MOVIE. BLESS YOU, BILL. I'M ALMOST READY TO FORGIVE YOU FOR PILEDRIVING MAJEL BEHIND MY BACK YOU SHORT FUCK."
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....WATCHES STAR TREK AROUND HERE AND IS A FAN? FFS. BACK TO THE DOLLHOUSE FOR THE LOT OF YOU FUCKS.
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Titbag Sr.: "Energize!"
*Strokes cock* -
BSEXYB, IF YOU NEED TO UNBURDEN YOURSELF ABOUT HOW YOUR DADDY USED TO DIDDLE YOU WHILST SINGING THE NATIONAL ANTHEM IN A SUPERMAN CUSTOM, FEEL FREE.
AND MY NAME IS ALL CAPS MUTHERFUCKER. HOW MANY BLOODY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT? FFS. -
...ACTOR CHRIS PINE WOULD LOOK LIKE WITH A DIRTY SANCHEZ? I SURE AS HELL DO. WOOF! MAYBE IT WOULD HAVE HELPED HIM GET INTO CHARACTER A BIT MORE.
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IN THE FUTURE THEY HAVE GIANT TUBES OF WATER ON A STARSHIP POWERED BY ANTI-MATTER REACTION, SO IT STANDS TO REASON IN THIS NEW TREK WORLD WITH NO LOGIC THAT THEY DON'T HAVE ANY EYEBROW TRIMMERS.
THOSE FUCKERS WERE AS THICK AS SIGORNEY WEAVER'S SUBSTANTIAL BUSH. -
...THESE DAYS DOES IT SEND CHILLS DOWN YOUR SPINE OR GIVE YOU A HARD ON?
"OHHH OH SAAAY CANNNN YOUUUU SEEEEEEEE-EEEE-EEEE!!!!" -
Plagiarism is amateur. I thought you would be cleverer than that. Don't prove me wrong.
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Be funny about it.
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Oh don't get me wrong... There may well be a backlash right here in the AICN Talkbacks, courtesy of the throngs of too-school-for-school fuckwits who seem to want to hate everything just be different, or edgy, whatever. At least you, Asimov, have hated it from the outset. But I'm sure some people - not in this talkback, but others over the last few months - just switch-reverse their opinions just to piss people off. But at the end of the day, we here are a tiny, tiny minority. The days of us making a difference or the actual filmmakers even given us a second thought are long, long gone. There will be no backlash from the movie-going public at large. The vast majority love this film. Those that don't won't even have the inclination to actively say so. To them - it's just a movie. And TITBAG WILL YOU PLEASE FUCK OFF.
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Smart move!
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... clearly shouldn't be allowed near a keyboard. That said, as much as I love that film - a towering acheivment if you ask me - it's not without it's huge lapses in logic, of the same sort you accuse Trek of having. I mean, for someone who was an "agent of chaos", the Joker sure was fucking organised and forward-thinking.
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Funny how you picked the three least telling aspects of your personality out of the lengthy (yet incomplete) list of things which you have in common with BladeRunnerUnit and Memories-of-Murder. You neglected to mention, for example, your interminable rants regarding Bay and Abrams and the wording of the same which is more or less identical in all three "different" talkbackers. One, two, or even three "tells" aren't enough, to be sure, but put all of them together? No question. You might as well have said "But all my friends have fingerprints, so how can the fact that I also have them tie me to this crime?" It's not the fact that you have fingerprints per se, toolbox, but HOW those fingerprints look.
What you refuse to understand is that you have a style and behavior which is instantly recognizable. In fact, your stance is about as insulting as it would be if the good Sal_Bando denied that he used to be known as GoatZinger and TomBodet ("All my friends want giant robots in movies!").
I'm still waiting for you to explain how I was being "xenophobic" towards you yesterday, by the way -- or are you going to bitch out on that as well as your lie about Trek reviews abroad? -
... (as well as the rest of the ship, to protect the rest of the fleet I might add) is called drama and characterisation. To tell us that George Kirk was a great man. To make us, the audience, realise that the bar-fighting, shitkicking Jim Kirk has a proud heritage to live up to, if he can step up. It's screenwriting 101. It's - I admit - simple "hero's journey" stuff. But that never makes it any less stirring.
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Go back and read his posts leading up to the day he finally went and saw the movie. He had made up his mind WEEKS ahead of time about what it was going to be like. Every single nitpick -- and I mean EVERY SINGLE ONE -- is tailored, tucked and squeezed to fit every endless post of bile he was spewing before the film even opened.
He set himself up to be some sort of prescient, expert science fiction genius. At least moviemack had the decency to temporarily make himself scarce once it turned out that Batman Begins rocked.
AssLives is a cheap, patronizing bullshit artist with a shockingly average intellect. -
Your description of the opening scene is not what happened. It's something you made up to fit your preconceived notions. I'd detail the scene for you but ... why bother?
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Good to see you back.
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Oh, that's great -- post links to talkbackers whose entire mass of posts have been erased at the time of their banning? That was pretty safe, wasn't it?
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But unless he tells us what he thinks of it, we'll never know.
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I completely agree. I'm sure Asimov made up his mind to hate this flick as soon as the director and writers were announced. Let's not forget too, Paramount approached them for IDEAS on how to revive the franchise. They never stipulated "reboot / remake". Abrams and Co, being more "casual" fans (ie thankfully detached from the whole contuinity clusterfuck Trek had become) realised, as everyone who is remotely subjective about it, that Trek is about Kirk, Spock, Bones, and the Starship Enterprise. I'm rambling a touch there, but it seems to be that Asimov's hated JJ and the screenwriters are more in tune with what makes Trek tick then Asimov can ever hope to be. And with that, fellow talkbackers, I am off to drink pints in the sunshine. Not often it's so hot within these here shores, one must make the best of it.
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And I was supposed to feel sorry for him? Talk about a device.
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I'm going out for lunch too. Meanwhile, Titbag continues to lick his wounds ...
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Watch this honest review.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_yyhm9rZHo
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Sorry
It's THE MOVIE WALL STAR TREK
but here's the link again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_yyhm9rZHo
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you have to fix the spaces that Aintitcool inserts in links for some reason
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The proof is plain for anyone who has ever had the misfortune of encountering you as BladeRunnerUnit or Memories-of-Murder.
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Box Office Chart of the top 10 movies this week Top Movies Weekend Gross* Number of Screens Per-Screen Average Weeks in Release Gross to Date* 1 Up Buena Vista $68.2 3766 $18109 1 $68.2 2 Night at the Museum: Battle of the Smithsonian Fox $25.5 4101 $6218 2 $105.3 3 Drag Me to Hell Universal $16.6 2508 $6630 1 $16.6 4 Terminator Salvation Warner Bros $16.1 3602 $4481 2 $90.7 5 Star Trek Paramount $12.8 3507 $3650 4 $209.5 6 Angels & Demons Sony $11.2 3464 $3233 3 $104.8 7 Dance Flick Paramount $4.9 2459 $1993 2 $19.2 8 X-Men Origins: Wolverine Fox $3.9 2263 $1723 5 $170.9 9 Ghosts of Girlfriends Past Warner Bros $1.9 1450 $1314 5 $50.0 10 Obsessed Screen Gems $0.7 679 $979 6 $67.5 See movie grades from critics and readers
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Again -- the proof, for anyone with at least half a brain and prior experience with you, is in every fucking talkback you've posted in since returning as AsimovLives.
Just for the hell of it, I'll add one other thing to that list of tells: your snooty SF position. Both BladeRunnerUnit and Memories-of-Murder had serious hardons for literate SF -- especially Isaac Asimov. -
...perhaps you'd defend your erroneous statement regarding Trek reviews and also how I'm being "xenophobic" towards you.
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Are you dense?
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I think the problem is a question of semantics. You have been arguing sematics incessently. No doubt this is attributable to english not being your first language. When English is a persons first language they understand all of the eloquence of the language such as situational context, hyperbolic rhetoric, metaphors, allegories, all things you clearly lack an understanding of.
Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against those home-schooled such as yourself, but the problem is you are missing out on a fundamental dynamic of the educational process, i.e. social interaction and the capacity to speak of the human condition.
Only a Trek newbie would such as yourself would make such an erroneous claim, THEN have the unimitigated ignorance to repeate it over and over for all the world to see. I'm speaking of course of your "claim" if you can call it such, that Pike is Kirk's age.
Within the same episode you claim to be watching (do you have english subtitles turned on?) a illusory representation is created at Spocks trial that shows a MUCH younger Spock and Pike, years before the events of the episode itself. Pike as played by the late great Jeffery Hunter is mid 30's in age bucko, years, years before Kirk. Spock served with Pike for 11 years before Kirk.
When you finally learn the subtle ambiguity of the English language, don't worry, you'll understand the reference Mendez makes you are reffering to.
Addtionally, "The Cage" is canonized, and depicts the early voyages of the starship Enterprise under Pike- YEARS before James Kirk. You got nothing pal. Nothing but a sophist mentality. There's nothing worse in life than someone that knows just enough to be an asshole. Go back to school. -
Kirk was 28 in the film, far older than yourself. Additionally, within canon Kirk was ALWAYS one of the youngest individuals to assume captaincy of a starship. The accomplishment is due to him being a prodigy.
Like I said before kid, before you try to speak with an informed opinion on a subject such as Star Trek, get informed. -
He's home-schooled and has a sophist mentality. It's actually a form of mental illness where an individual has a precept of beliefs that defy general consensus.
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the boy in the plastic bubble syndrome essentially.
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You admit the original series has flaws and glaring inconsistencies, yet attack the new film as having glaring inconsistencies. Not only are you of a sophist mentality, but you are also a simple hypocrite then.
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May 31, 2009 3:15:21 PM CDT
Asimov--fair enough..sometimes i forget which TB im in.
by six demon bag
my point for that was to slap down the crazies STILL talking shit about TREK while giving a pass to T4. TREK is holding strong after 4 competitive weeks. this weekend really separarted the men from the boys in my opnion. i see wolverine has fallen off the radars, i expect to be gone next week, with T4 the week after.and since this is not about quality, since T4 forsaked that in hopes of big BO, they have failed even more.
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... after a SHITLOAD of pints in the sunsheee-ine... BUT.... Asimov's defence of the logic gaps in Dark Knight (hoo boy, sorry if I picked at a wound there) are exactly the same, in essence, as my defences of the logic problems with Trek. Sorry, Asimov. And I love the wat Asimov purports to "know" the character of Spock better than anyone else. For fuck's sake, it's called creating character dymamics, creating character flaws! Spock would be BORING AS FUCK if he was COMPLETELY cold and logical; if he'd immediately seen the LOGICAL need to step down from command... he HAD to have that internal conflict, that RASH decision to kick Kirk off the ship, to (a) create the character clash between him and Kirk; and (b) give him a character arc. So that that we SEE him journey from the little pointy-eared twat who lost his rag at school, to a man capable of taking station on the Federation's proudest flagship. Fucking HELL Asimov, do you understand NOTHING about... well... ANYTHING?!?!?
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... must be completely and coldly LOGICAL all the time, goes against EVERYTHING we see in the original series. A hell of a lot of those stories relied upon Spock wrestling with the emotions he shouldn't be feeling. Hell, even a lot of the cheesy "epilogue" bits relied on Spock betraying his very human traits and 'flaws', if you will.
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What else is new?
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The proof is in the eating of Titbag's pudding by his father.
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manifested in Kirk's highly emotional reaction to the mindmeld.
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But leave Terminator Balevation out of it.
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... the Spock in "The Cage" is very much more emotional creature, given to smiling, being alarmed, and so on? Perhaps then, the Spock we see in the new film - set as it is "between" the events of The Cage and the original series - is in a period of transition between the emotional and the more steadied Spock we all know? I'm thinking of, and writing this, from the point of view of someone like yourself - who seems to be so caught up in the constantly contrary, frequently inconsistent canon and characterisations, that they can't see the need to shake things up a little.
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... because Nero's actions render The Cage null and void. But you know what I mean. Spock at that age, still wrestling between his human and Vulcan sides. Anyway! I enjoyed a fair few pints, good sir, and I shall now have a quick coffee and round of the evening, quite fittingly, by watching the the last half hour or so of Wrath Of Khan, I am now entering the Mutara Nebula. See you next time.
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Re: "sunsheee-ine..."Are you really Liam Gallagher?
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but these guys are at least honest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_yyhm9rZHo -
and rated PG.
Pitch that to Paramount and they'll call you JarJarJenius.
Yeah, that's like "genius," but it's to indicate disrespect and sarcasm and stuff.
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Mirror Universe evil"ghoatee" Trek cross over. Abrams Trek slips into the future of Mirror Evil Trek where Old Shatner Evil Kirk is Emperor. Young Good Kirk vs. Evil Mirror "Ghoatee" Kirk. Could even have more of the orginal crew in evil verse, Spock, Sulu, etc.
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May 31, 2009 11:10:59 PM CDT
"28 days, 6 hours, 42 minutes and 12 seconds, the world will end
by flim springfield
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It is a monumentally epic and exciting adventure that re-introduces James T. Kirk, Spock, and the crew of the starship Enterprise to the public consciousness.
The film is unabashedly fun and goes out of it's way to unashamedly drive the point home we are witnessing the exploits of bonafied heroes.
From the moving humanity of the prologue to the driving, in your face title sequence, the film fires on all cylinders and is precisely the type of film audiences adore.
Nobody gives a fuck what a few ass hats think, this movie is the type of film that is the sole REASON movies are made- pure, unadulterated entertainment.
Wishing and hoping for a popular backlash? That's a God damn joke. There will be no backlash, on the contrary people are repeatedly going to see this film for the positive spirit and heart it has. The positivity of the message coupled with the chemistry and dynamics of the actors and characters makes Star Trek the kind of epic genre film fanboys and studios WISH their genre pictures were.
A 95 percent critical approval rating, over 200 million dollars for a STAR TREK film thus far- unprecedented,with powerful legs week after week, and multiple, multiple repeat business makes this movie a fucking champion so you all can go burn and rot in the darkest deepest recesses of hell with your morose, colorless, souless, joyless genre films nobody gives a fuck about.
Star Trek owns you, owns the summer, and you three assholes know it. Bow to Star Treks swollen, bloated , heroic, epic fucking nutsack asshats. -
The answer is simple, and easily read from what Greenwood is saying. Just as the changes in time DIDN'T CHANGE THE CREW ALL COMING TOGETHER ON THE ENTERPRISE, there is clearly a "plan" or a "path" the universe is on - and the characters will eventually come to the point they were in when the tv series started - a bit like "fate" or destiny. Example - the colony of Vulcans will be named New Vulcan, abbreviated to Vulcan, so all references to Vulcan will reference the colony, not the original planet, but all the people in TOS talknig about Vulcan were discussing the colony. Pike is now in a wheelchair, like in TOS ... but he's not burned. He'll GET burned somehow ... so that the events of TOS will make sense. It's so easy - why do fanboys have no imagination. TEAM JACOB 4EVER!
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Buddy your taste in film is dubious, questionable at best. Star Trek kicks major ass. See that's the wonderfully humourous irony I love about this website. THIS website is the ONLY place you find bitches. I've nevr once in my life met ANYONE, ANYONE that disliked the Star Wars prequel trilogy. Only on Aint it cool. It's the same for Star Trek, everyone loves it but a few arm-chair couch critics that failed film school on Aint it cool news message forums. Star Trek will be the Hey check out my blue ray player film everyone pops in pal, you can take that to the bank.
See, while you Asimov, and shitbag, and Bones, and a couple more on these forums cry because the film kicks the shit out of your poor film taste, people are STILL going to see it, kids are STILL buying the toys, tickets are SILL being sold. You've got absolutely nothing on the movie Ass imov, absolutely nothing. -
with mediocrity, stale bland mediocrity. You aren't a Star Trek fan. You would be content having Star Trek relegated to the national archives as a product of a bygone era. I'm a Star Trek fan, I want it forefront of attention and culturally relevant. Sharp, sexy, modern. It deserves it you hack fuck. It's a worthy concept to maintain and continue on to posterity. Star Trek is important enough to preserve idiot, not relegate it to irrelevant niche' market.
If you call yourself a Star Trek fan, you should be PRAISING J.J. Abrams from rescuing the concept from abysmal mediocrity. Kirk, Spock, Bones, the original crew are back on the big screen and you cunt cocksuckers cry about it?? Fuck you Assholimov, fuck you very much. You are no Trek fan turgid wannabe you are a blase' erroneous little person that Leonard Nimoy called a DICKHEAD. Bravo Mr. Nimoy. Bravo. -
Star Trek just passed The Wrath of Khan in box office revenue ADJUSTED for inflation. It's about to pass The Voyage Home, and will sail past The Motion Picture for highest grossing Star Trek film EVER. How do ya like dem apples champ? Clearly....SOMEONE likes this movie. Bwwwah hah hah hah.
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...raving about how much he loved Long Kiss Goodnight and Renny Harlin and hating Slither when he was known as Memories-Of-Murder.
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The Fillion. Michael Rooker. Slimy grossout '80s body-horror and genuine laughs. It was the true geek-fest and deserved cult hit of that year. But Snakes On A Plane got all the attention (and still failed). No justice. "I swear to God, if I turn into a fucking MOLLUSC, I'm gonna sue. And you should too! I don't care if you are a lesbo, you don't deserve this shit!" Great flick. And no, I never did see Night Of The Creeps.
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All this over some actor's casual remarks in an interview. You just have no idea what you've gotten yourself into with these fans, Bruce.
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See what happens when you try to please old fans and new audiences? This should've just been a "reboot" without a story-based explanation for why it's different. I would've enjoyed either way.
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"If you call yourself a Star Trek fan, you should be PRAISING J.J. Abrams from rescuing the concept from abysmal mediocrity."
Uh, no. Sexy and modern. Check! Sharp? Ehhh, not so much. This was not so much a reboot that would do Trek Justice so much as it was a way to make a few bucks for the studio. If it says "Trek" on it however, Josh will be there to convince us this polished rat turd is actually a diamond despite the eyes we have for ourselves.
Praising JJ? Good god man, just because he took it off the shelf?
Bah!
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CHRIST YOU JUST DON'T GET ANY FUNNIER OR SMARTER DO YOU? I KEEP WATCHING YOU LIKE PAINT DRYING ON THE WALL, BUT YOUR MOUNTAINOFFAIL IS EXTREMELY HIGH AND SLOWGOING.
YOU DON'T AND NEVER WILL UNDERSTAND TREK. CASE CLOSED YOU FUCKING TOOL. NOT WITH COMMENTS LIKE "KIDS LOVE THE NEW TREK AND SO DO CHICKS." FFS. -
Citizen Kane. Casablanca. The Godfather. Plenty of Films NEVER get a backlash. There are just too many people who like them. Maybe 40 years from NOW, when the new universe created by this movie has gotten stale, and Paramount Holograms Inc decides to reboot Star Trek AGAIN there'll be some talk about how this movie isn't so great.And You'll be a cranky old man in a Floating Wheelchair complaining to your great grandchildren that Pike and Kirk are supposed to be the same age because of some badly translated Portuguese Subtitles you misread back in 2009.
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In the old show like in Lexx there was a mirror universe(dark zone) and the one that they lived in. Or is this the same universe only slightly different with a slightly different evil parallel universe? My brain hurts.
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Well, basically half of Next Generation, , most of Deep shit nine, All of voyager, All of Enterprise, The Final Frontier, Generations, Nemesis, Insurrection,First Contact, three or four episodes of the original series, and of course you, but since we are discussing Trek I'll refrain from pointing out any other tarnished turds. Oh woops!
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My mountain of fail is pretty high, but then again, so is Trek's attendance and box office.
Keyboards are 10 bucks at Wallace Mart Shitbag, invest in one. -
When someone is banned at AICN, their post history is removed from the site. Therefore, all previous postings made by you as BRU or M-O-M are erased. So, if this is the proof you are referring to, then you know full well that you're not going to get it. How convenient for you!But we don't need. We know who you are despite your efforts to play coy. It's like I told you before, it wasn't that hard to figure out.
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...you better run for your fucking life!
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KILL ME NOW
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Jun 01, 2009 8:48:56 PM CDT
For those who don't think ST was the second coming...
by theewokthatdied
I agree with this guy http://roddysrockinreviews.wordpress.com/2009/05/22/ star-trek-2009-marcs-review/ remove spaces obviously
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It's an alternate timeline in an alternate universe. That universe was ALREADY going to be different from TOS, but Nero's arrival changed it as well. They've removed themselves from 40 years of pedantic canon and continuity. Noone can say Kirk wouldn't say that or Spock wouldn't do that, because THIS IS A DIFFERENT KIRK AND SPOCK. And with Spock Prime's advice to this Spock at the end, a more emotionally integrated Spock.These are "new" characters in a new universe with new stories to tell. Spotting the similarities and differences should be part of the fun.How can dogmatic people who refuse to accept change and new ideas call themselves Star Trek fans? Star Trek is Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations. Not Everything must Remain the Same.
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And the people saying this film is not doing well overseas are LYING. With the 2.2 million from the Japanese opening, it has now passed 100 million which no previous Star Trek film has EVER done. In less than a month this is already the Most Successful Star Trek Film Ever Made in overseas box office. And in the next few weeks it will be the most successful domestically as well. Even Gene Roddenberry's son enjoyed it. No one is listening to the haters. NO ONE.
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STAR TREK HAS ALWAYS BEEN INCONSISTENT. The science has never been perfect, there are instances of different actors playing the same character, there are SO MANY FUCKING TIME TRAVEL STORIES, including many in the original series, the effects are awful more often than not... I could go on. And I love Star Trek. The only thing missing from this film was Trek's habit of plots that served as metaphors for something deeper. This movie was just Kirk making his way to the captain's chair. I hope the best for the sequels, and I loved this one, even with that one major flaw. Other than that, there's nothing about this film that some form of Trek hasn't done in a hundred inconsistent permutations already.
We're talking about preserving the canon of a series where Shatner regularly got into extremely poor fistfights with dudes in foam lizard suits. Where entire races of aliens look different from one series to the next. It's not about canon, it's about you being a whiny shit about the fact that Star Trek is for "them" now.
(As if Wrath of Khan wasn't a take on Star Trek that was tailored for a larger audience. And look how that turned out.) -
Would you assholes really have preferred a continuation of the type of series bloat that led to the amazing TNG cast getting their swan song in the pile of feces that was NEMESIS? Christ.
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