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Dave Arneson, father of the Role Playing Game and co-creator of Dungeons & Dragons, fails his last save
Hola all. Massawyrm here.
It’s hard to imagine a world without Dave Arneson. His name isn’t one most of you are familiar with – and if you are one of those who are familiar with it, you might not fully grasp his significance. Most people think that the ‘creator’ of Dungeons & Dragons passed away last year. That was Gary Gygax. The CO-creator of Dungeons & Dragons. He was the money man, a game creator in his own right who understood how to make D&D a hit. But Arneson? He was the guy that said Hey, you know what would be cool? If we played a game in which a group of heroes went into a dungeon and fought monsters. And then he made it cool.
Gygax and Arneson first met at the 2nd annual GENCON in 1969. At the time Arneson was a big military wargamer, his passion naval battles. After a while his interests turned towards “what if” gaming – where you play alternate versions of history like a Pearl Harbor in which the Americans detected the attack early enough, just to see who would have won. But after Gencon things changed and Arneson began working on a game he called BLACKMOOR, the world’s first role playing game. Incorporating miniature wargaming rules into a setting in which characters would delve into dungeons and fight monsters, he would create what many of us would recognize as the very first RPG. It was here that he would create the notion of “hit points” and “armor class”, adapting them from a set of civil war naval wargaming rules.
As he developed it, he would borrow elements from Gygax’s tactical wargame CHAINMAIL and would marry the two games into something he and Gygax would first call THE FANTASY GAME. Turned down by publishers, Gygax raised the funds to start a small company called TACTICAL STUDIES RULES (what we would come to know as TSR) and they published the new, retitled rules in 1974. That’s the game you know. DUNGEONS & DRAGONS. It was an instant hit. Arneson would become most famous however for publishing the very first D&D setting, Blackmoor.
Arneson and Gygax would later have a falling out that would lead to Arneson leaving the company and suing it in 1979. The terms of the settlement were never openly discussed. But Gygax and Arneson would later reconcile and be known as good friends by the time Gygax passed last year. My close friend, writer and Dungeon Master, Ari Marmell had this to say earlier this week.
Dave I knew, although certainly not well. We met several times, during the course of the work I did on the 3E and 4E updates of Blackmoor--Dave's campaign setting, and the first published setting for D&D--including (briefly) sharing a booth with him at GenCon. While I'm not sure he appreciated my sense of humor, he was always exceedingly friendly and polite, and he really struck me as enjoying his interaction with the fans. Even when his health first took a turn for the worse, he made every effort to attend GenCon in order to remain a part of the community.
He never really got the credit he deserved, as one of D&D's co-creators, and that's a shame--and hopefully a mistake that history will correct as time goes on. But the man had an incredible imagination, and he helped create not only a game, but an entire hobby, that has now outlived him. Like I said, I didn't know him well, but I'm not sure he'd have asked for much more than that.
Rest in peace, Dave. And thank you.
What can I say? I don’t know what kind of guy I would be had I not developed the passion for gaming that I had – what friends I would have spent time with were it not the dorks who joined me for delves into forbidden shrines and unholy castles. And what would today’s video games be like were there no RPG model to draw from? This was the guy who thought it would be cool. And it WAS cool. The guy was a giant. A beloved member of the community and the creator of something so big that it will outlive us all. I can only echo my good friend’s sentiments. Dave, thanks for everything. It wouldn't have been the same without you.
Until next time friends,
Massawyrm
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When someone passes, especially when we didn't know to give them credit for something that brought us so much fun when we were younger (if not even still now). Still, articles like this help rectify the situation just a little at least, so it's a good start.
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He was one of my favorite teachers in college. He introduced me to Settlers of Catan dammit! R.I.P.
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I think Harry would still win these most of the time.
My first contact with D&D was being taken to the Roleplaying game club at school by a friend.
I found it really scary and intimidating, mainly because I was shy, 11, had turned up late and they had already started and were all really excited about things I was not in a position to understand.
Never did get into it, but I did end up being friends with a lot of the guys.
I know how much pleasure it brought them, and probably still does for some.
That is a nice legacy for anyone.
I mainly appreciated the multi-sided dice. -
Steve Jackson, you might want to get your affairs in order... well, if you believe that these things happen in threes (I don't). I'm a white box baby, so Dave Arneson's name has been as familiar to me as Gary Gygax's. I cannot separate my idea of Gygax the person from that florid prose of his. I knew nothing of the TSR politics, lawsuits, and other shenanigans, so all I knew about Dave Arneson was what you write here, Massawyrm: he came up with the idea. He also came up with the content that Gygax's hardware delivered. And while hardware is neat, it's all about the content. It is probably impossible to really understand the influence that Arneson has had on everything from CRPGs to fantasy fiction. So many of the great inventions and ideas seem in hindsight to have been inevitable, but that's an illusion. Sometimes these are once-time-only inspirations. The world without Arneson's creation would still be interesting, and geeks would still have a place in it. But just think of that: gaming solely in the third person, without the concept of creating and identifying with characters and using them collaboratively with others to tell tales that never end. That's a world that I'm glad I don't have to live in. Rest in peace, Mr. Arneson.
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But you have to give credit to somebody that made a worldwide phenomenon.
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d&d...i just couldnt figure out what was going on...and i have a good imagination i remember being on a bus trip with a youth group and a bunch of guys were playing it in the back of the bus...i watched for a bit, and got bored...and i felt like an idiot, because i didnt get it but all is well that ends well, i ended up with a gf on that trip...and she was a hottie
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i remember being 13 and i had some friends who tried getting me into d&d. my mom thought it was satanic and burned the rulebook/guide my friend had lent me.... wow. my mom was nuts! that was probably my last experience with d&d... that and that god awful movie with that wayans brother.....
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Now cue all the tasteless and unoriginal saving throw comments that followed in the wake of Gygax.
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The man who gave us hit points and armor class. Goodbye you glory boy.
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barbarian with an axe named Blarg. Blarg fights an ogre. Blarg rolls better numbers than the ogre, slays it, then loots the body, and steals the ogre's girlfriend. The End. It's pretty much like every rpg video game, except you don't have a computer rolling the dice and crunching the numbers for you. And you get to make up what your character grunts, and there are no invisible borders.
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questions last year: http://tinyurl.com/dxlab2There are probably more out there. I imagine the Kenzer & Co. board will have remembrance threads, as well.The Blackmoor forum is here: http://tinyurl.com/cgw8z3
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As was said above, it's always sad to see someone we barely knew leave us. Goodnight and Godspeed
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I, like many others I guess, grew out of D&D. I moved on to computers, consoles, models, films. Equally geeky but different. But I remember very fondly the time round at friends playing the game or creating my own quests and settings, looking up the rules and building my charector to higher levels. If I drop a D&D reference into conversations like D20, HP or even armour class, I still smile at the confusion in others because I'm in a club that you stay in for life. Thanks for the memories.
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It gave those pimply nerds something to spend their money on.Instead of meals with a date,Movies with a date,gifts for a date/girl friend,condoms..these two guys knew the potential for the influx of unending nerd cash;). Hey Massa,way to belittle Gygax "the money man".. you're a dick.
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Arneson had the idea - Gygax made the idea work and added quite a bit to it. No disrespect meant to Gygax - but we eulogized him last year. This is about Arneson's (often far too overlooked) contribution for which people often ascribe Gygax all the credit.
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Is "cool" in geeky terms, still geeky in the real world? Think about it...
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...for being a D&D geek, they were all worth it for the many nights of sleep-deprivation and fun with my fellow gamers.
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encounters, stats, lists, and various detail minutiae; he was never really interested in the roleplaying/voice-acting/characterization aspect of the game -- that was Arneson's contribution. They were the two sides of the gold piece. Here is an interesting article on Arneson and the beginnings of roleplaying being added to wargaming: http://tinyurl.com/5sbtwo and http://tinyurl.com/cm34a6
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No one creates something like D&D by himself. Early TSR was group effort, and by thoughts and prayers go out to Dave and his family. Thanks for the hours of good times.
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When my parents split in the early 80's I found all my dads D&D stuff I was about 7 or 8, loved the old monster manual with harpy that showed her tits. I used to just read the books and imagine my stories till I met a group of dorks just waiting for there heads to be filled with my discoveries- I moved on from D&D later in middle school and then moved away, sometimes I really miss those days and am forever greatfull for those days. Sorry that to here his hit points ran out.
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but not at the expense of Gygax. Sometimes people try to swing the balance too far to compensate. Arneson was part of an amazing team that created an entire genre of games, which doesn't happen often. He is the co-father of the RPG. Gygax made it happen, and those guys usually get the bulk of credit because it's the more difficult part. As Edison said, genius is 1% inspiration and 99% persperation. Then again, he stole credit from a lot of inventors!
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world of warcraft generates over a billion dollars a month, Arneson and Gygax invented a lot of the ideas
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Apr 09, 2009 7:31:48 AM CDT
Dice and Paper RPGs so much less pathetic than Console/PC games
by catothecensor
I think what haters don't get is that D&D was fun BECAUSE it was social. You got together with your friends, had some chips and sodas, played the game seriously but also joked around a lot and had plenty of laughs. When not gaming you'd argue about your characters, whose was better etc. When these kinds of discussions got particularly heated, the DM could break out the dice for a grudge match (I still remember the day my Lord Erudite the Unpleasant, 12th level wizard, beat Garret of Thiapore the 13th level Druid, who loved to talk shit, in one turn.)
It's why we still played in college. The chips and sodas turned into chips and cases of beer, but the laughs and the memories were the same.
Console RPGs? Diablo? Everquest? WOW? talk about sad. Sitting for hours and hours on end staring and a screen, alone, wasting away. -
I've only played a few times and loved the game. I played with a co-worker. I left the job and lost touch and haven't played since. I'll have to find some group that plays in this town. It's a one of a kind experience to play a table top RPG. It's cool to see visuals in a video realize something out of your imagination, but I find live game play to be much more fun.
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We´ll miss you.
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I *do* appreciate the contribution he made. R.I.P.
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How many famous board games are there since the seventies?
D and D, Trivial Pursuit, Settlers of Cataan - which by the way has sold more than Halo.
This effort is appreciated. -
My brother and I used to play D&D with a few guys up the street.
Never really understood what the fuck I was doing most of the time, but I guess it was fun anyway. -
for making my childhood a little more geeky, and far more richer for the worlds you inspired me to dream of.... and the evil dungeons i made to put my friends through.
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Thanks for the many many enjoyable nights. Just moved appartment a month ago and found a bag with my old rulebooks and character sheets/note in. brought back some good memories.
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I agree with you. I find it amazing how one type of geek can looks so down on another type. I HATED d&d. I tried it when I was young but found it very boring. HOWEVER you have to give props to someone who was able to create a new genre in gaming. D&D was the precursor to all the online RPG's of today.
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Reports of his death..... Nice reporting there Massa. Apply to FoxNews quickly.
http://grognardia.blogspot.com/2009/04/dave-arneson-is-still-with-us.html -
People will be playing rules-driven "role playing games" for a thousand years. RIP (or "get better soon", I guess, if Bagel13's link is right).
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Yes, he did pass on. Later link on Grognardia than yours (today, instead of Tuesday): http://tinyurl.com/c2vdtz
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Thanks for D&D.
No thanks to every TB'ing tool who is taking this opportunity to shit on D&D and pretend they are a higher geek-form than the rest of us.
D&D is and or was cool to a bazillion of us. This guy deserves some snark-free props. -
You were the unsung hero of the 1970s imagination revolution.
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Thanks Dave.
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Hey Mass, if you're gonna correct the typo, can you take out my post about the typo too?
Thanks. -
...of bongrips and laughter all due to this bloke. RIP mate. Anyone who thinks that D&D is for nerds didn't play with us.
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but i really do want to try one day
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Good post, mate.
My Friday night game will be in his honor.
Geeky & proud. -
...devoted to old school dice-throwin'.
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Apr 09, 2009 10:44:19 AM CDT
Make a new movie based on the old Dungeons n Dragons cartoon
by hellcametofrogtown
in his honor. I loved that cartoon, and all the characters and stories are already developed so perfectly. Fix what was ruined back in 2000.
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thanks for the game!
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Depending on the gamemaster, a fun, imaginative game. I miss the days of THAC0. Cato, rep to you.
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Is the invention of the IDEA of the RPG. He was the one who welded wargaming rules to a "god" player who was much more than a traditional referee. Everything else in RPGs is refinements of that creation. It was very sad that he was so little known for that major contribution to human culture.
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let Whedon remake the series as live-action. I'm no 'Whedonite' but if you look at his character dynamic for groups of friends (ie. Buffy) it fits perfectly with the D&D cartoon.
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Well said, those were the halcyon days, great times. On a side note, try not to be a stranger eh?
RIP Mr. Arneson -
Apr 09, 2009 11:17:58 AM CDT
So what IS cool to you dweebs? Big plastic action figures?
by feralangel
D & D WAS and IS cool. It's like playing chess. It involves strategy, tactics and warfare. Also imagination and inspiration. It's a million miles away from crap like Grand Theft Auto. It was a positive offshoot of the works of Tolkein. I say more power to it and I hail the memory of those who created it.
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With the passing of both Gygax and Arneson, the forces of good have no champions. The Dark Lord Hasbro will be free to release a new edition every few months. One Game Company to Rule Them All!!! MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
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I spent my life since first discovering D&D in 4th grade reading the books, drawing and later writing my own dungeons, and trying to think about other things because I've only had a couple of friends with whom to play D&D over the decades, and have played only a handful of times. Somehow I think this has been a waste of my time to devote so much energy to planning and preparing for something I'm incapable of participating in due to my almost complete inability to communicate with others.
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Who held his bachelor party at a gaming store he worked at. No,no strippers dressed as elves or big titty bitch popping out of a huge eight sided dice. They just played D&D all night and ordered Pizza. And no,The delivery person was not a stripper either....Just D fucking and D ..all fucking night.
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That sucks. I'm just starting a new game after not playing for a few years; makes all the more bittersweet.
*raises glass* To Gary and Dave, slinging dice up where they're always Crits, and the XP flows like wine. Save me a spot at your table, fellas. -
D&D was awesome in its first and second editions. Even Basic D&D was good, and DUNGEON was passable. Then it got all stupid, and now it's not even D&D anymore. The races are all stupid. The classes are all dumbed down. The abilities are all generic. 4e sucks, and I'm sure it had something to do with the deaths of Gygax and Arneson!
Rest in Peace, Dave. -
When somebody cancels at the last minute for our weekly RPG session and we don't have enough people to play, we often walk down to the local strip club instead. We often joke about bringing our books, dice, maps and minatures with us and playing D&D in the corner.
I'm totally up for it, but the others are too chicken. They think the strippers respect them, or something, and D&D would cost them that respect! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! -
wintocha67, I feel your pain. I didn't know anyone who played D&D but really wanted to play (I was also a huge Tolkien fan, natch). I used to go into my local game shop after school and buy Citadel miniatures and Tunnels & Trolls solo dungeons. I was ashamed of my nerd tendencies and desperately wanted to be 'cool'.
A few years ago I discovered WoW and met lots of great people online (all of which proves CatoTheCensor wrong of course - have you not heard of TeamSpeak?).
Like many WoW addicts however, I realised it had taken over my life and quit the game for good. It was fun for a while though. -
Frankly, my friend, neither option will get you laid. That said, if you find it works for you, then vaya con dios....
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I say both, at the same time.
and... goodbye to a legend. -
Know that you and your friend Gygax have created something that will live looooong after you both have turned to dust. I wouldn't have the memories I do of all the great times my group and I had playing your game. As much as I hate 4E, it IS keeping the next gen of gamers involved with it and we have you and Gary to thank for that. You will be missed.
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with all respect, what kind of loot did he drop?
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I met Dave a few times, while working with those who ran the worldwide shared campaign based on his Blackmoor setting. A really fun man to talk to, and sharp as a whip even to the end.
RIP Mr. Arneson. I shall roll dice this weekend in your honor.
And Nix? D&D is awesome in any incarnation. Choose whichever ruleset you want, but it always comes down to the social aspect. Hanging out with friends, telling inappropriate jokes, role-playing, dice rolling and taking the monsters' loot. None of that has changed. -
Apr 09, 2009 3:35:06 PM CDT
Massawyrm, D&D is Dead. Accepting it is the 1st step.
by leafar the lost
This is a sign that all D&D players should see. D&D is dead. The game that is currently calling itself "D&D" has no resemblence to the great game that was created by E. Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson. Massawyrm, those two men have passed on, and it is time for you to let go of D&D. It was difficult for me to stop playing over 12 years ago, but I knew I had to in order to live a "real" life. It is possible to live without it, but the longer you play the harder it will be. You may relapse a few times, but that is just part of recovery. The first step is to admit that you are completely powerless over your addiction to D&D, and it is definately the hardest. However, once you have taken the first step, the others become easier. Join us, Massawyrm, and we will take the first step together...
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...And God-fucking bless it for that. Fuck "cool", the established status quo that so many try to jump on. "Cool' is the reason we have douchebags: guys in their Ed Hardy shirts, spiked hair, spray on tans and unearned dog-tags.
And I hate qualifying myself, but I used to play D&D and I get laid all the time. I also was All-Metro in Football, and in our regular D&D group included four starters from the football team, the star from the hockey team, the cool high school rebel who could score the best weed, two hot chicks, and our DM was All-State in Football, All-Conference in Basketball and had set the state sack record. We also had nerds and "geeks" playing with us, and we thought they were pretty damn cool because they spent extra time painting the damn lead figures. And the majority of us have since gone on to successful careers and lives.
Cool is when you don’t give a fuck and do something because you like it anyway.
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And the game people are playing now is not the same game as the one Gygax and Arneson made. But I have no problem with people still playing any sort of RPG today, as long as they don't become obsessed with it.
Once a year I go back to my home state and me and my friends have a one day D&D reunion playing the old rules. To me it is like having poker night with your friends. -
What a huge, fat pile of douchbaggery.
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Apr 09, 2009 4:12:28 PM CDT
Somewhere a lonely virgin is crying over his 8 sided die...
by googamooga
Even the average, garden variety nerds think D&D players are losers.
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I kid, I kid, but seriously that is a shame, talk about a father of modern geekdom! wow...
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Guess he got his ticket out of this shithole tho.
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It's alive and well:http://tinyurl.com/chw6k2Now, the later WOC/Hasbro versions are indeed overpowered, final fantasy-esque cartoonish/steampunk/munchkin bastardizations, yet, as far as evolved versions go, the spirit of OD&D ended up in Castles & Crusades:www.trolllord.com (where Gygax spent his later days contributing)and Hackmaster over at Kenzer & Co. (plays like 1st edition and the cover art is a tribute)and Arneson still has Blackmoor stuff going.
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Why do so many obit threads on AICN insist on using the same "witty" sorts of headlines as all the other idiotic stories? At least it didn't end with multiple exclamation points. Please, grow a bit of class.
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that doesn't take away from how important Latin was in the development of language and literature.
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and i mean it in a good way, because my life was always a 'read white dwarf (u.k. kid here), never play the games' life, and the more of massa's stuff i read, the more i wish i'd paid more heed to what i was reading.
good writing massa, and good roaming dave. -
it's kind of an accepted obituary rule to quote what they did and go for a joke. it's the laughing past the graveyard thing... i like massa's pun to be honest. :o)
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last i heard it a was a +3 pillow of bashing snarky twits... and thusly, i use it upon thee. *WHOMP!*
i kid, i kid.
the most fun i had with d&d was dreaming up the dungeons, maps, and items. some of the maps i created on graph paper spanned to 5-6 sheets across on the x and y axis (god am i a dork). sure gaming with the guys rocked, but i loved being able to create my own immersive world, complete with fabulous items... and deadly traps for the unwary. -
The creator of Chutes and Ladders slides off the mortal coil...The creator of Scrabble lays down a E,A,T,H on an open D.
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...damn straight.
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rolls off into the great hippopotamus in the sky
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At least the creators of those board games made something of an impression upon culture, something you are unlikely to do. Now, if you don't think D&D and roleplaying games are significant, especially to a geek site such as aintitcool, you really need to go fuck off. We don't need your feeble lack of respect, here.
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did a touching tribute strip about Arneson, here:http://tinyurl.com/daunwd
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Rest in Peace. D&D was what helped me grow out of my shell as a kid, develop my imagination, and have fun for years! My friends and I get together every two weeks for a game, and its something I always look forward to. Dave and Gary brought something fun and cool into this world and all the haters can just suck it.
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Thanks for all the fun
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If a character you are playing in ANY video game gets better the more you play it, "levels up", or has stats that increase - you can thank Arneson and Gygax.That goes for everything from the Grand Theft Auto series to the Fallout series to the freaking Tiger Woods PGA Tour series.You may not think you are a "D&D fan" just because you don't play pen & paper games or MMORPGs, but if you play almost any modern game - you owe at least part of your fun to Arneson and Gygax in one way or another.
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I'm making light of the witty obituary headlines, not the people. Grow a sense of humor jackass.
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that clear. Nevertheless, your humor was the true jackassery in a memorial thread.
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what Arneson accomplished with crappy board games. This is why it is a bad idea to try to be funny in these circumstances.
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Very sad news to me. I will always be grateful to both Gygax and Arneson for what they have given to me and to the world. I don't know if I would have survived the 80's growing up without RPG's like D&D and others. Great thanks to them both for helping us to use are imaginations, teaching us a lot about life, and saving some of us from some of the dreadful life and times we were surrounded by as young teens. In short. They helped us grow up. Thanks. R.I.P.
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