Movie News

Moriarty vs SHERLOCK HOLMES part 1

Published at: March 9, 2009, 7:12 p.m. CST by mrbeaks

Hey folks, Harry here... Jesus Christ! You know. There's many things that I've come to expect from Moriarty over the years. But kissing SHERLOCK HOLMES' ass wasn't one of them! These two have serious history. I'm not talking about Vegas hotel room kinda history, but... You see, Sherlock stalked Moriarty for years. He even employed kids to track him. Moriarty moved to California to leave that sad, and frankly scary, part of his life behind him. However, Sherlock reached out to Moriarty one last time... and like some crazy abused woman wanting more, MORIARTY FLEW TO LONDON TO SPEND MORE TIME WITH HIS STALKER... Sherlock Holmes! And now. Now he's going to share that loving reunion with all of you. Here ya go...





Hey, everyone. “Moriarty” here. Two thick paperback books. Every word Arthur Conan Doyle ever wrote about his flagship creation, Sherlock Holmes. The great detective. One of the most oft-adapted literary creations of all time. And, of course, the source of the nickname I’ve used as my alter ego here on Ain’t It Cool News for over a decade. That’s all I packed for reading material on my flight from Los Angeles to London at the start of December. I figured I’d immerse myself in the world of Holmes so that when I stepped on the set, I’d know what I expect based on the one true expert, Doyle, and I’d see how it compared. Because with Holmes, more than almost any other character except for maybe Superman, you are dealing with audience preconceptions. And that means that whatever you do, whatever form your Sherlock Holmes takes, it’s going to be different than someone expected, and that sets up the possibility of disappointment. You get a huge amount of built-in audience recognition when you work with a character like this, but you also have to accept a certain amount of baggage. Worth it? Warner Bros. will find out this Christmas when they bet a tidy sum of money on Guy Ritchie, Jude Law, Arthur Conan Doyle, and a newly-minted juggernaut named Robert Downey Jr. He’s had a few hits now. But is he consistent? Is the audience hungry for his take on the classics? Are they in love with him, or him as one particular thing? These are big questions, and right now, there’s no answer. We haven’t seen any real tests of Downey’s new-found commercial power. This’ll be the big one, since no matter what, “The Soloist” isn’t the sort of film that makes $250 million domestic. But done right… and sold right… “Sherlock Holmes” might be. It was at a “Watchmen” preview event that one of the lovely ladies of Warner rolled up on me and said, “So who do you think should visit the set of ‘Sherlock Holmes’ in London… Mr. Moriarty?” She had that huge publicist “I’ve got you and you know I’ve got you so don’t even pretend I don’t got you” smile on, the one they get when they know you and they know what you’re interested in, and they’ve got something that is a dead-perfect fit and they figure it out. In this case, that headline you’re seeing at the top of this page… well, that’s been dying to be written since I first joined Ain’t It Cool News and started contributing material under this byline. Harry was the one who named me. When I first wrote to him, I was a loudmouth know-it-all, correcting something he’d run, and he thought it was funny. “You’re like an evil genius… you know just enough to be trouble.” And in those early pieces I wrote for Ain’t It Cool, I reeeeeally played up the mad scientist/evil genius shtick. How much fun is that? Pretending to have laboratories and henchmen and an underground network of spies and pneumatic tubes and surveillance gear. For someone who is just making his way through the trenches of this business like everyone else, that’s liberating. I was working well before there was an Ain’t It Cool. I was a WGA Member in 1994, and you have to work to become a Guild member. I’ve been working since. I think a common misconception is that I became Moriarty to try to get something out of it. Wrong. I became Moriarty because I was worried that having an opinion would cost me in this town. And I’m right about that, of course. I’ve lost work and burned down some contacts in the film industry, and I’ve frustrated my managers and agent many times over the past decade. But I found that I love the conversation so much… and I love the education I’ve gotten by traveling around the world and visiting film sets and watching some of the most interesting people working today… and I love sharing that with people so that they get the benefit of those experiences as well. “Moriarty” became a really great job, a very surprising job, and it led to me meeting some of the most important people in my life. It gave me a network of friends in a city I’d never visited until I became “Moriarty,” and even now, I’m gearing up for a week in Austin and I can’t wait. “Moriarty” became something I’d put on when I left the house, a persona that I created through well over 3.5 million published words under that byline. That’s a staggering amount of work, and I loved doing it. Every single bit of it. So you can imagine how I felt as I was sitting on the plane on the way to London, reading volume one of the Sherlock stories, and realizing suddenly that this trip, this face-to-face with my arch-enemy, was going to be the very last thing I ever did as “Moriarty.” I mean, I knew on some level before that, when I made the decision that I was going to be leaving the site and joining HitFix to run my own blog and my own film coverage… I knew that it would change things and that I’d leave the “Moriarty” name here at Ain’t It Cool, because I consider it a particular privilege to have had a spy name here for over ten years, and because of the history of what that spy name has meant for me, what it’s cost me, what it earned me, and what experiences are tied to it. And knowing that is one thing… but it started to feel real as I landed at Heathrow and headed for my hotel. I’ve been to London enough times now that I feel fairly comfortable getting around on public transportation, and I ended up walking a grand total of two blocks from a tube stop to my hotel, The Zetter in St. John’s Square. Checked in. Did some work. Read some more Holmes. Finished the first book. Started the second. Did some more work. Took a walk. Ate a bit. And the whole time, it kept sinking in, and I was struck with a really ferocious case of melancholy. I had a hard time focusing on anything, even when a friend e-mailed me the latest draft of the “Sherlock Holmes” script, allowing me to read it before I headed to the set in the morning, because I was hit by all these complex feelings of “I’m making a mistake” and “Can I even pull this off?” and “Why haven’t I done this already?” and any number of other conflicting emotions. So when I met my driver the next morning and headed to set, I wasn’t feeling evil; I was feeling subdued. When I arrived on location, the building had been dressed as a slaughterhouse. And dressed convincingly, too. If they didn’t tell me that everything had been brought in, I would absolutely have believed that this building was always designed for this particular purpose. It took most of the day for me to get the full tour of the set, several major parts of which had been earmarked for different parts of an action set piece. And it wasn’t only functional and well-dressed, it was complete. If you went through the whole thing, start to finish, it worked. Pig carcasses hanging everywhere, and blocks of ice set up all over one room. Smoke thick in the air. And amidst all of that, Lionel Wigram comes walking up, smile on his face, introduces himself. Lionel’s a former Warner executive who has become a producer on the Harry Potter series, and it was his idea to try a new spin on how to bring Sherlock Holmes to life onscreen. What’s most radical about his idea is just how loyal to the source material it is, something that has already proven to be oddly controversial. See, with Sherlock Holmes, the idea of how he’s portrayed on film has been defined over the years by the Basil Rathbone version and the Jeremy Brett version, and there are certain ideas that have set in that have nothing to do with Arthur Conan Doyle. Chief among those is the idea of Watson as a chubby dolt, a bumbling rotund sidekick. That has certainly become the standard take on things, but originally, Watson was written as a former military man who was quite good with the ladies, dashing even. He was prone to handling things physically if a situation went south, but he wasn’t stupid. He just wasn’t trained the way Sherlock was. At the time, no one was. Deductive logic as a form of crimefighting wasn’t something that was in common practice in Sherlock’s day. Science and police work were uneasy bedfellows at best. And Sherlock was a genius, way ahead of the curve, driven by his fascination with problem solving. When he was working on something, he was alive, a ball of energy, but when he was between cases, when he didn’t have something to occupy his mind, he would fall into near-chemical depressions. That version of Sherlock and Watson… we haven’t seen that on film yet. And now we’re so used to the deerstalker-and-opera-cape and chubby-nincompoop-sidekick version that this is going to feel like a reinvention. Lionel talked to me about his approach for a while and I asked him some specific questions about the script for the film. He told me more than I think he planned to tell me at first, and then introduced me to one of the film’s other producers, Susan Downey. Yep… that Downey. As in, Mrs. Robert Downey Jr. She’s an executive for Joel Silver, which is how she met Robert in the first place when they were working on “Gothika.” She’s very smart, very funny, and she’s one of those people who make sense as a producer… when you talk to her, you can tell that shit is getting done. And it is because of her. Together, Lionel and Susan are an enthusiastic cheerleading squad for the film. Where we’re sitting as we talk, I can see the monitors. And on the monitors, I keep getting glimpses of Robert and Jude, amidst the smoke, behind sheets of flame. Just glimpses. It’s a huge tease. Lionel can see me watching the monitors, can tell I’m getting antsy. “Want to see a few scenes?” He gets his laptop. Gets some headphones. Finds me a quiet corner and a director’s chair. He gives me a bit of preamble. “The first sequence comes early in the film. Watson is getting married, and he wants her to meet Sherlock, and vice-versa. And Sherlock… he’s dealing with it.” Okay. That all fits right into what Doyle wrote. That particular turning point in the stories is significant. “And the second sequence is a big moment in the investigation, an action scene at and around a giant boatyard.” So we’ll see a bit of the scale of the film. Great. The first scene has been described several places now. It’s the first thing they’ve shown everybody. And there’s a reason. It’s a great sequence, an absolutely pitch-perfect way of putting you inside Sherlock’s head. Sherlock meets Watson and his wife-to-be for dinner. Mary (played by the ridiculously gorgeous Kelly Reilly), and as much as he wants to be happy for his friend, he can’t. He just doesn’t like the world that Watson’s opting into, the world of social engagements and evenings out and domestic responsibility. It’s a slow death to a mind like Sherlock’s, and he can’t imagine what Watson sees in it. Even if Mary is charming, it just seems suffocating to Holmes. And as he practically crawls out of his skin during the meal, ready to get out of there –- -- it cuts to a boxing ring. In some basement club somewhere. It’s the still that everyone’s seen at this point. Shirtless Sherlock. And the guy he’s with in the ring is probably a foot taller than him and another 60 pounds heavier. And Sherlock’s sort of dancing around the guy, bitchslapping him up a bit, making him look bad, and you can tell that it’s a work-out for him. A chance to blow off some steam. But he’s not going to really hurt the guy. As Sherlock dances around, he scans the crowd. More out of habit than any particular interest. And he sees a face go by. The face of Irene Adler (Rachel McAdams). And if you know your Holmes, your Doyle, then you know that Irene Adler is the one. She’s the one criminal who ever out-thunk him. The one woman who ever got past his defenses. She’s the one who got away in all regards. Holmes may not be built for love, but he may be built for her. And the last time he saw her, she was in disguise and on her way out of town. So it’s a shock. And it draws his concentration just long enough for the big guy to take all of that frustration, all of the little humiliations of being in the ring with Sherlock… and he puts it all behind one monster punch that knocks Sherlock to the ground. Sherlock knows he let that happen, so he stands up and smiles. “Thanks, Big Guy. I think that’s enough for today.” He turns to walk away. And the Big Guy spits on the back of his head. When Sherlock stops, he looks up into the camera, and everything freezes. “Let me tell you how this is going to go,” he says. And what we see is a positively autistic break-down of the big guy’s defenses, and what hits would do the exact damage needed to put him away, probably in the hospital. It’s slow-motion. It’s medical in how detailed it is. And as soon as it’s done, we return to that frozen shot of Sherlock, the Big Guy standing behind him. And he turns around and, in real time, does everything he just said he was going to do. Perfectly. And he destroys the Big Guy. It’s just awful. Guy goes down hard. And Sherlock walks away. That’s how he approaches a fight. That’s how he approaches a mystery. That’s how he approaches someone walking into the room. That’s the world through the eyes of Sherlock Holmes, and I think Downey and Ritchie have come up with an idea that really captures the nature of how this guy thinks. How he processes things. That Sherlock-vision, that slowing-down and considering of details and options, is something that evidently will play into a few moments in the film, as he investigates crime scenes or deals with threats. I like it. It feels like a Guy Ritchie move, but a perfectly-deployed one. And we talked a bit about the size of the film between clips, with both Lionel and Susan emphasizing that this is a big movie. London’s a character, and because it’s changing from old London to modern London, and bridges are being built and new buildings are going up behind and around and instead of old ones, it’s got to be a big film. They’re showing all of that. They’re recreating that particular moment in London, and to do that, they’ve used parts of London and a lot of locations and exteriors in Liverpool. And, of course, lots of CGI. This is going to be the largest-scale Guy Ritchie film by a significant degree. The second sequence I watched spoke to that. What starts as a cleverly-staged close-quarters fight between Watson and Holmes and a handful of thugs escalates whem Holmes realizes he can’t outfight the biggest guy in the group. He has no choice but to run, and that chase ends up in a shipyard, where giant ships are being built. Bringing that environment to life and then making it part of the action… that’s what Ritchie and his team are up against. This may be the biggest thing Sarah Greenwood, the film’s production designer, has ever done as well, and I like that… she’s certainly got the period credentials. She’s just never worked on this scale until this film, and it’s a great canvass to play with. What I didn’t get to see much of in the footage I was shown was the interplay between Holmes and Watson, and since that relationship is the heart of the film, that’s what I asked about when I was handing back the laptop. Lionel started to tell me what it is about the chemistry between Jude and Robert that he likes, when we were interrupted by an A.D. who had a question: were we ready to talk to Jude and Robert? We weren’t, actually. Everyone had to hustle to find a room upstairs that had a heater in it where we could sit and talk. Did I mention how brutally cold it was in the entire location? Because it was insanely cold. Painfully cold. And I really wasn’t dressed right, because I’m from LA and even my warmest clothes aren’t that warm. But we were told that the room upstairs would be warm. And as we walked up, we ran into Robert and Jude, and I was introduced to both of them. Jude recognized me from when we met during “Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow,” and he was nice about it. And Robert just smiled at me. “So… my esteemed foe,” he said. “Professor Moriarty. At last we meet.” He seemed very entertained by the moniker. I couldn’t resist. I reached into my book bag and took out a small hardcover book and handed it over to him. He read the title and laughed. “Sherlock Holmes Was Wrong, by Pierre Bayard.” I explained to him how the title struck me as a brash grad-student joke, but the premise of the book is that Arthur Conan Doyle was so irritated to be writing a new Holmes story when composing “Hound of the Baskervilles” that he managed to solve his own mystery incorrectly. Bayard digs into the details laid out in the story in an effort to prove that Holmes reaches the wrong conclusion in the story. It’s a great piece of literary criticism as pop gameplay, and Downey tucked it away into his own bag as we reached the room where we sat down for our first interview… … which you’ll read here on Wednesday, in part two of our three-part “Sherlock Holmes” set visit. You’ll read both of those Downey/Law interviews in full on Wednesday, and you’ll read my chat with Rachel McAdams on Friday along with my talk with Guy Ritchie. Today was just the start of some really great coverage with the full team, but already, you should have some sense of where Ritchie and everyone else are hoping to take this new incarnation of Sherlock Holmes. In the meantime, stop by and see me at my new home, the Motion/Captured blog at HitFix.com.


Drew McWeeny, Los Angeles

Readers Talkback

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  • March 9, 2009, 5:40 p.m. CST

    Hooray a Drew article!

    by chrth

    Of course, everyone knows Moriarty was actually Holmes, but still.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:40 p.m. CST

    Harry, that intro was terrible, mate

    by IAmMrMonkey!

    It was really difficult to read and didn't make much sense.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:41 p.m. CST

    It's Brett, not Brent

    by Alfred_Packer

    Man I miss the old London. Shame its going totally V for Vendetta as of late. Cameras in pubs? No photograhy of policmen permitted? Makes the USA look like a Oregon hippie commune by comparison these days.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:42 p.m. CST

    I'm seriously excited to see the movie.

    by DerLanghaarige

    Not nearly as much as I wanna see The Wolf Man, but yeah, I'm looking forward to the movie that will make all the Guy Ritchie haters shut the fuck up. (Although I gotta say that many Ritchie-haters were right at several occasions over the last few yewars.)

  • March 9, 2009, 5:43 p.m. CST

    Welcome back, esteemed foe!

    by YackBacker

    I love the book hand-off to RDJ. I'm not the world's biggest Guy Ritchie fan, but this looks like an interesting stretch for the director. And of course it means we'll get something (hopefully) intellectually stimulating in terms of story. I'm pretty happy this movie is happening.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:43 p.m. CST

    Guy Ritchie...

    by NeilMcCauleysBrother

    ...is talentless.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:43 p.m. CST

    This whole site needs an edit button

    by SomaShine

  • March 9, 2009, 5:44 p.m. CST

    Did Moriarty

    by MetiphisLabs

    Always put his nickname in quotes lie that or is it a sign that he wants to go by his real name now but has to abide by Harry's nickname rule?

  • March 9, 2009, 5:45 p.m. CST

    RDJ looks a little like Hugh Laurie in that photo

    by chrth

    COINCIDENCE? I THINK NOT!

  • March 9, 2009, 5:45 p.m. CST

    Hey Moriarty....

    by mojoman69

    wipe yer chin, there's still some Sherlock spooge on yer lips!

  • March 9, 2009, 5:46 p.m. CST

    Harry doesn't have a nickname rule

    by chrth

    It's a vestige of the old days on the Interwebs when spies thought they were cooler to use fake names/identities when reporting info (and also because they didn't want to get caught if they were an insider).<p> I do miss Mongo though

  • March 9, 2009, 5:48 p.m. CST

    baskerville Hall in wales

    by Mr_X

    Apparently Doyle wrote the hounds whilst staying at this place. Never go there. It's an absolute dump! Nice piece, looking forward to part 2

  • March 9, 2009, 5:48 p.m. CST

    Glad to hear Ritchie's signature style will still be there.

    by CreasyBear

    I was afraid the Big Money behind all this would neuter him. Kinda like I was expecting something bold and stylistic when I saw Burton's Planet of the Apes, but it was the same would-be summer blockbuster bullshit that any director could have churned out. Some directors I don't want to be invisible, because their particular sensibilities and skills are a big part of the fun.

  • March 9, 2009, 5:51 p.m. CST

    Is it more or less Orwellian if you can see the cameras?

    by chrth

  • March 9, 2009, 6:02 p.m. CST

    HitFix rocks Mori!!!!!

    by Yoda's Ball Sack

    Good luck and god bless.

  • March 9, 2009, 6:03 p.m. CST

    "crazy abused woman wanting more"

    by menstrual_blitz

    Are you fucking kidding me?

  • March 9, 2009, 6:05 p.m. CST

    It's about time

    by menstrual_blitz

    I've been wondering about this movie...Love me some Sherlock Holmes, but can't tell if this will turn out to be a travesty or not...

  • March 9, 2009, 6:07 p.m. CST

    Moriarty FUCKING LIVES!

    by DANNYGLOVERS_DICKBLOOD

  • March 9, 2009, 6:17 p.m. CST

    and now that I've read the article

    by menstrual_blitz

    I still don't know!

  • March 9, 2009, 6:18 p.m. CST

    COME BACK!!!!

    by Nickn328

    Come on man! We haven't always agreed, but I'd really like to here more of your perspective. to me, Drew McWeeny is just your real life name, and on Ain't It Cool, that means nothing!

  • March 9, 2009, 6:20 p.m. CST

    I like the casting.

    by Sal_Bando

    Law and Downey Jr. together. Cool. They could even figger out a way to stick some Giant Robots into this somehows I'd imagine....paging Henry Daniell!

  • March 9, 2009, 6:33 p.m. CST

    What's the article about?

    by Flip63Hole

  • March 9, 2009, 6:34 p.m. CST

    pot kettle black much?

    by Himbo

    Harry, I like the site and all, but should you really even jest about anybody kissing anybody else's ass?

  • March 9, 2009, 6:40 p.m. CST

    Flip63Hole, lol

    by dr sauch

    I know, what is going on here?

  • March 9, 2009, 6:42 p.m. CST

    There something about this

    by Dancingforever

    That strikes me as painfully boring. I would hope they focus on Holmes taste for a little "bump" now and then. Other than that I just can't get excited about this.

  • March 9, 2009, 6:44 p.m. CST

    Hopefully they do this great character and stories justice.

    by Lovecraftfan

  • March 9, 2009, 6:55 p.m. CST

    I am a Holmes FREAK!

    by Charlie_Allnut

    God I hope this is good... the Jeremy Brent version is the closest we'll ever see Doyle's stories on screen - they are exact in almost every detail and every word, the only flaw being Jeremy and the actors playing Watson are a tad bit older then in the stories (I think Holmes is around 30 or so in the first). I've got my fingers crossed for this, but I'm a little nervous as I just watched Rock n' Rolla and thought it was a complete mess...

  • March 9, 2009, 6:55 p.m. CST

    where the hell is my post??!?!

    by supercowbell4therequestformorecowbell

  • March 9, 2009, 6:56 p.m. CST

    Mori forever. It makes the site complete.

    by Silverglade

  • March 9, 2009, 7:02 p.m. CST

    So...Downey breaks the 4th wall in the fight scene?

    by theredtoad

    When Sherlock stops, he looks up into the camera, and everything freezes. “Let me tell you how this is going to go,” he says. So what is that all about?

  • March 9, 2009, 7:02 p.m. CST

    Ritche's Revolver commentary

    by loafroaster

    Now that's fucking funny.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:03 p.m. CST

    Great,hollywood fucks another one classic

    by ominus

    book character.excellent,keep going like that holywood,rape everything.without lube.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:05 p.m. CST

    Kelly Reilly rocks

    by loafroaster

    Watch Eden Lake, great horror flick

  • March 9, 2009, 7:08 p.m. CST

    goodbye Mori

    by Maniaq

    I think over the years, your words tended to be the ones I was most interested in whenever I visited this site and I can only imagine there will be an almost tangible loss felt on here, once you're gone... <p> seems like all the cool kids are leaving - let's hope it's more of a Star Trek next generation, rather than a Degrassi one! <p> come back and visit some time

  • March 9, 2009, 7:10 p.m. CST

    Pink Panther

    by dioxholster

    looks french. looks awful.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:14 p.m. CST

    ANYWAY IM ON HITFIX AND

    by supercowbell4therequestformorecowbell

    have no idea whats going on. its an alternate universe. no crappy independence day backround. no studio plants! no 1992 style talback backs! WHERE ARE THE PLANTS!?!?!?!

  • March 9, 2009, 7:15 p.m. CST

    breaking the 4th wall?

    by supercowbell4therequestformorecowbell

    gay

  • March 9, 2009, 7:15 p.m. CST

    YACKBACKER

    by southafricanguy

    Sorry to dissapoint you dude, but your hope for an intellectual story is going to leave you dissapointed. Iv read the script (dated March 2008, movie started shooting late 2008, and I recognize the scenes described by superherohype.com, so I can assume the script has nt been changed too much) And intellectual the story aint. In fact its quite dumbed down, I could figure out what the explanation for the 'mystery' was before Holmes (and im not someone really good at figuring out movie mysteries). The villain was fairly boring, one dimensional and really just a cartoon (hope they have managed to improve that). And his plan is something we have seen sooo many times (think Shanghai Knights, the Zorro movies) The only interesting thing is that he is meant to basically be Alistair Crowley. I liked the portrayal of Holmes and Watson though, it seemed accurate to the portrayal in the books (which i must admit I read a good few years ago). And there is a nifty action sequence or two

  • March 9, 2009, 7:17 p.m. CST

    Christ on a Cracker

    by HoffmanPasander

    Classic McWeeny, this. "Pretending to have laboratories and henchmen and an underground network of spies and pneumatic tubes and surveillance gear. For someone who is just making his way through the trenches of this business like everyone else, that’s liberating." Ha ha! "Checked in. Did some work. Read some more Holmes. Finished the first book. Started the second. Did some more work. Took a walk. Ate a bit. And the whole time, it kept sinking in, and I was struck with a really ferocious case of melancholy." Ha ha! Man leaves behind nickname; sinks into pit of despair. Although it's not as good as his ADAPTATION review. The one when he had to be walked from his car to the house because he was so upset.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:18 p.m. CST

    MORIARTY? MORE LIKE LESSIARTY

    by Stengah

    Fuck you McTeenyWeeny penis!! wait... is it still cool to diss moriarty?? its always fun.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:19 p.m. CST

    AND THEN THERE IS GUY RITCHIE

    by southafricanguy

    LSATSB AND Snatch were fun if unexceptional movies (his stuff always comes oof as trying too hard to emulate Tarantino's wit for me) But did anyone see revolver and *shudder* swept away (aka vanity project:the movie)..god were those films painful. Im sorry but I dont trust ritchie to make this movie work, maybe if he had a really damn good script to work from,but considering how mediocre it is...yikes.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:21 p.m. CST

    Actually..im really confused by why Moriarty

    by southafricanguy

    thinks this movie will be so good. Anyone want the script? If so give me your email and I will send it to you. I would be interested in seeing what the rest of you all think.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:23 p.m. CST

    The script

    by Hackish

    Excellent report, thanks. Is that latest version of the script avaiable online anywhere? There is, or was, an early draft flying around, but things sound to have changed quite a lot. H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 7:32 p.m. CST

    i dont know hackish, but I really hope so

    by southafricanguy

    because otherwise this script will piss off real holmes fans as its really not particularly clever

  • March 9, 2009, 7:35 p.m. CST

    The script

    by Hackish

    Southafricanguy, is there any way of contacting you without posting my email address on here? I'd really rather not do that. H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 7:40 p.m. CST

    Breaking the 4th Wall...

    by Sixtyhurts

    ...if used artistically is cool. Especially if used to represent Holmes' inner dialogue. His thought process. Rather then RDJ brooding into the distance while the "biddly-boo biddly boo" flashback music plays, which is, in fact, lame. <p> Hey if Ferris Bueller can break the 4th wall, then it's legit.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:41 p.m. CST

    "...and like some crazy abused woman--"

    by Sal_Bando

    Harold must be up on his Rihanna news. Nice timing there, ummm Harold.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:43 p.m. CST

    The script

    by Hackish

    OK, I've found it: that March 2008 revision *is* online. But it doesn't have the sequence Moriarty describes, where Holmes speaks to camera about how he's going to take out the big bruiser, so there must have been at least some revision since then. I imagine the latest version is being pretty closely guarded (unless you're M's chum, that is...) H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 7:44 p.m. CST

    Moriarty's always been my favorite writer here.

    by JayWells87

    Harry's a push over and Quint and Capone are a bit too clinical. Mori's got soul and brains. I really like his work on HitFix.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:45 p.m. CST

    Uh oooo. It's gonna get all EPIC in here

    by THE KNIGHT

    I'll read the article tomorrow while I'm on the train... can't wait!

  • March 9, 2009, 7:47 p.m. CST

    is holmes going to be a junkie?

    by ominus

    but with cocaine,not heroin.heroin is so underclass.

  • March 9, 2009, 7:55 p.m. CST

    Will this movie be competing with the Eyeball Fucker?

    by CreasyBear

    How much of a gap between this release and Avatar will there be?

  • March 9, 2009, 8:03 p.m. CST

    CREASYBEAR

    by southafricanguy

    ONly one week dude..Avatar Dec 18th...Holmes 25th Dec Ouch! If Avatar turn out to be a huge monster, Holmes will get overshadowed. But it will probably still do well, but con sidering the timing I dont think it it will a real blockbuster

  • March 9, 2009, 8:04 p.m. CST

    I dint care what you think, but when you are talking about compe

    by southafricanguy

    with Cameron (considering his bo track record) the smart money is nt on the other guy lol

  • March 9, 2009, 8:07 p.m. CST

    HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    GLAD you found it dude. I am sure there have bben changes made, for the better i hope. But if you go to superherohype.com and read their descriptions of the scenes they saw being filmed you will recognize them from the script. So this script will still be a fair idea of what we will be getting. I think this is the type of script that will require the director to really bring something to the table, i think its all about how its presented.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:09 p.m. CST

    and is Ritchie a good enough director to

    by southafricanguy

    really reinvent classic material like this?

  • March 9, 2009, 8:10 p.m. CST

    HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    when you are done dude let me know what you think of the script (even if it is a bit out of date)

  • March 9, 2009, 8:15 p.m. CST

    Okay, I'll give you a fuckin riddle Sherlock Homes

    by Kenny_Fuckin_Powers

    Why the fuck does Jude Law get any work? He was all busted up n shit as that robot gigolo.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:20 p.m. CST

    Riddle me this Holmes

    by ominus

    is camerons avatar going to fuck our eyeballs out,or not?

  • March 9, 2009, 8:21 p.m. CST

    The script

    by Hackish

    Southafricaguy, I agree with your assessment: the Holmes/Watson relationship is very well done and true to Conan Doyle, but the plot is hackneyed and the mystery (such as it is) is unworthy of H&W. Good grief, the villain is so shallow he doesn't even make it as far as being *one* dimensional. I hope there *have* been changes, and changes for the better... H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 8:27 p.m. CST

    That was an absolute joy to read

    by ballyhoo

    Thanks. Can't wait to hear more.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:34 p.m. CST

    ballyhoo

    by ominus

    where did u find the script? i would like to read it,since holmes is one of my favs and need to know how this movie is going to shape.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:39 p.m. CST

    The script

    by Hackish

    Ominus, check out Drew's Script-o-Rama. H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 8:43 p.m. CST

    tx mate

    by ominus

  • March 9, 2009, 8:43 p.m. CST

    This site does not need an edit button.

    by beastie

    Just skim to the parts that sound interesting if you get bored. It's one of the many things that seperate sites like this from traditional journalism. Personally, I like a bit of both.</p><p>Great to see a new Mori article.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:49 p.m. CST

    Length

    by Hackish

    Bored? It's not long enough tio get bored! What's happened to reading habits? How do people who can't cope with an article like that manage when it comes to a whole book? Hxxx

  • March 9, 2009, 8:50 p.m. CST

    Moriarty: "I QUIT! Oh wait no I don't"

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    He's a professional.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:55 p.m. CST

    Avatar will not be as widely accepted by the...

    by TheMarineBiologist

    ...movie viewing public as this movie will be. I'm sorry, but compared to a Sherlock Holmes movie starring RDJ, Avatar looks like a joke.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:56 p.m. CST

    Re: Sherlock Holmes

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    I have a bad feeling about this movie. I was really into Sherlock Holmes when I was younger, and I love the vibe of the stories, though the later ones were inferior. Anyway, what I did read about this smacks of revisionism but maybe I'm wrong. The perfect Holmes on screen has already been created; it was that 80s version that was on PBS. It was great and I highly recommend it.

  • March 9, 2009, 8:56 p.m. CST

    The Brett version

    by kuryakin

    Is by far the best and I have to take issue with Mori here about Watson, he doesn't come off as a buffoon at all. <p> Yes he certanly does have a lot of "I say, Holmes!" moments but more importantly, he is portrayed accurately as an upright and moral man and it is made clear that Holmes needs this, as well as his friendship, since Holmes himself has a tendency to go doolally. <p> Apparently Jeremy Brett was an absolute fiend for authenticity, used to keep copies of the original stories on set and make sure they stuck rigidly to them. <p> Also, dunno if any of you lot are able to access them but BBC7 ran some really good radio versions of Holmes stories a few months back, much better than this guy Richie shit

  • March 9, 2009, 8:57 p.m. CST

    Plus

    by kuryakin

    Remember "Young Sherlock" or whatever that film was called? <p> This film will be worse

  • March 9, 2009, 9:01 p.m. CST

    The BBC audio versions

    by Hackish

    Those UK BBC versions are available to buy, I think. And yes, they're very very good. But I'll not judge the Ritchie movie on the basis of a set report and an out of date script. H xxx

  • March 9, 2009, 9:15 p.m. CST

    Seriously....I don't give a fuck about this movie.

    by DANNYGLOVERS_DICKBLOOD

    NO BALE = NO DICE

  • March 9, 2009, 9:33 p.m. CST

    Your Lost write-ups are boss, Moriarty!

    by iamnicksaicnsn

    Good to see you back, even if it sounds like this really is the last time.

  • March 9, 2009, 10:02 p.m. CST

    Brent Spiner was the best Holmes

    by lockesbrokenleg

  • March 9, 2009, 10:12 p.m. CST

    ominus

    by ballyhoo

    I don't have the script. I just meant it was a joy to read Mori's article here. Sorry about getting your hopes up.

  • March 9, 2009, 10:40 p.m. CST

    loserguy3000

    by Le Vicious Fishus

    Man, I never do this-- but...<BR><BR>LOL!

  • March 9, 2009, 10:41 p.m. CST

    And Mori...

    by Le Vicious Fishus

    Always good to read anything from you here in the backwoods of AICN.

  • March 9, 2009, 10:53 p.m. CST

    What happened to the Sherlock Holmes vs Dracula script?

    by hallmitchell

    You guys were raving on about years ago. With two Holmes movies coming out can't they shake the dust of that one script?

  • March 9, 2009, 10:55 p.m. CST

    Loserguy...

    by drew mcweeny

    ... you're free to your opinion of me and HitFix, of course, but you're incorrect about one thing: no one stole any user information from Ain't It Cool. Ever. The only e-mail that went out en masse went out to people who were in my personal e-mail address book, meaning they wrote to me and I wrote back to them at some point. That's the only way those addresses ended up in there. So if you got an e-mail from me, it's because you e-mailed me about something and I took the time to write you back. That's not "stealing" anything, so why don't you tone down the tearful accusations a notch, eh?

  • March 9, 2009, 11:03 p.m. CST

    Moriarty you magnificent bastard!!!

    by southafricanguy

    I actually really miss your writing here at aicn. Hitflix is ok, but I get that its still in the process of evolving. Mori..seriously dude what do your inside sources tell you about Avatar? Whats the word on the grapevine so to speak?

  • March 9, 2009, 11:04 p.m. CST

    And since I actually respect your opinion on things

    by southafricanguy

    what do you think Avatar will be like? Have you read the old scriptment? If so, what did you think of it?

  • March 9, 2009, 11:11 p.m. CST

    Hackish

    by southafricanguy

    Yeah interesting that we both found it to be the same, its really bad when as the reader you are several steps ahead of Sherlock Holmes!!?? But like you I hope they have seriously improved the script. Just how cliched is the plot? And Lord Blackwell, as yiu say, is below one dimensional. So hackish what do you think of Guy ritchie directing Holmes? Do you think he is a good match to the material? What director would you hav epreferred take a crack at it, I wouold go with Fincher or (i no he is almost forgotten so it would never happen) Nicholas Meyer.

  • March 9, 2009, 11:14 p.m. CST

    Marinebiologist

    by southafricanguy

    yeah you are right, Avatar will look like a joke because it will be the only freah, original thing we will get all year. Never mind that making a new Holmes movie is indicitave of how bad Hollywood plays it super safe, you know..becos there has never been a holmes movie before. And we need all the remakes/prequals/sequals/adaptations we can get.

  • March 9, 2009, 11:19 p.m. CST

    *AHEM* ON A SERIOUS NOTE

    by southafricanguy

    Marinebiologist i respect your opinion, even though I think it is based in wishful thinking as opposed to actual fact that you know about both projects. But I am willing to bet you any amount of money that you are going to be dead wrong. Lets agree to meet back here in talkback in December and we will see who gets to say "I told you so". Alternatively I would be very interested to hear your reasoning behind your statement. I love to discuss future movies, especially with someone that has a very different view.

  • March 9, 2009, 11:38 p.m. CST

    "When I first wrote to him, I was a loudmouth know-it-all"

    by Fletcher_Hanks

    "When I first wrote to him, I was a loudmouth know-it-all.." Nothing much has really changed, right?

  • March 9, 2009, 11:46 p.m. CST

    Fletcher...

    by drew mcweeny

    ... nope. Sort of the point.

  • March 9, 2009, 11:47 p.m. CST

    HITFIX bites off more than it can chew, imo.

    by Fletcher_Hanks

    It seems like those guys are trying EVERYTHING just in hopes that something will stick. Also, no one there has ever heard of the word "brevity."

  • March 10, 2009, midnight CST

    IS THIS THE SEQUEL TO YOUNG SHERLOCK HOLMES??!?!

    by BringingSexyBack

    I've been waiting 20 years for this fucking thing. Should've cast Christian Bale as Sherlock. <P>

  • March 10, 2009, midnight CST

    The background is Independence Day

    by Maxer

    I always wondered.. never knew. But now I can see it. Overexposed picture of the White House blowing up. Wow.

  • March 10, 2009, midnight CST

    SHERLOCK BALES

    by BringingSexyBack

    What don't you fucking understand, Watson?!?! It's elementary you fucking amateur!!!

  • March 10, 2009, 12:07 a.m. CST

    My point: That's not something to aspire to, is it?

    by Fletcher_Hanks

    Your stuff would be much better if you knew something about editing. It often seems as if you never reread anything you write.

  • March 10, 2009, 12:43 a.m. CST

    southafricanguy

    by YackBacker

    Thanks for the script intel. Alright, I will cautiously adjust my expectations downward!

  • March 10, 2009, 12:46 a.m. CST

    I don't go there, but at least I get the name right...

    by nomihs

    For all of you "haters" of Moriarty and his band of film geeks at the new website, please for the love of GOD get the damn name right. His website is called H I T F I X.com. Not H I T F L I X.com. There is no L in the web address. I hate it when people rant about shit, or complain or bash or whatever the fuck and then get a few details wrong, blatantly wrong. You just look like a jerk-off when you do. <p> Also, proper English and sentence structure is a plus. I'm not saying I'm perfect, just better than some of you. Mike Judge was on to something with Idiocracy. Society is dumbing itself down. Pick up a copy of an Arthur C. Doyle book and pay close attention to the language. It's not filled with mindless drivel that passes for English, it actually has substance and meaning. Writers 100 years ago used some big words to be sure, intercourse anyone?, but today those are laughable and not many under the age of 35 have picked up a book of that caliber. <p> Shit, not many people even pick up a book anymore do they?

  • March 10, 2009, 12:53 a.m. CST

    YACKBACKER

    by southafricanguy

    LOOK..who knows, there have probably been some revisions to the script. But as I said I RECOGNIZE THE SCENES Moriartys talking about. So it cant have changed too much. As I said above, I think a lot will depend on what Ritchie brings to it. I really believe that a great director can elevate a mediocre script, but ultimatly its all on the page, isnt it? And no matter how good a director is, his skill wont overcome a hackneyed plot or simplistic mystery (two things that should be unforgivable in a Sherlock Holmes story)

  • March 10, 2009, 12:56 a.m. CST

    Thats why i think that ultimatly this movie is

    by southafricanguy

    going to piss off hardcore Holmes fans. This movie seems to be an attempt to "sexy up" the character to make him appealing to a young/modern audiance. And part of that is dumbimg it all down (god knows why...i have never found dumb sexy) but anyway...

  • March 10, 2009, 12:56 a.m. CST

    Moriarty...

    by BiggusDickus

    The first part of your article explained a lot. Perhaps if you'd have written it before jumping ship the fanboys here wouldn't have thought so badly of you.<p>As far as Sherlock Holmes is concerned, I'm not so sure it needs a Guy Ritchie-esque makeover. For me, Jeremy Brett's version is the quintessential Holmes and is going to be a really tough act to follow...

  • March 10, 2009, 1 a.m. CST

    And we are talking about guy ritchie here

    by southafricanguy

    Can anyone tell me in a purely objective manner, if they are really fans of his movoes/directing and if so, why? I have nothing against him, think he has some ability, but i have seen nothing that would suggest he knows how to make something really fresh or original. He mostly just copied Tarantino and when he has tried to get away from that he made Swept away, which I defy anyone with an iota of taste to defend.

  • March 10, 2009, 1:03 a.m. CST

    Can he do action set pieces? Can he do things

    by southafricanguy

    without all that super ironic dialouge and "bad ass kewl" vibe? I guess we will just have to wait and see. I wish him the best of luck becos he seems to want to evolve as a filmaker and make bigger productions.

  • March 10, 2009, 1:05 a.m. CST

    btw

    by southafricanguy

    the description of the scene where we get inside Holme's mind as he explains how he's going to fuck that guy up does sound pretty cool...

  • March 10, 2009, 1:06 a.m. CST

    HAVE TO ADMIT...:)

    by southafricanguy

  • March 10, 2009, 1:06 a.m. CST

    HAVE TO ADMIT...:)

    by southafricanguy

  • March 10, 2009, 1:31 a.m. CST

    MORI: A question, and some great obscure viewings...

    by Admonisher

    Hi Mori! Great to see you pulling a return from Reichenbach, if only a brief one! I do have one question. Was it your intention to lump Brett in with Rathbone in portraying Watson as a "chubby dolt, a bumbling rotund sidekick"? As "kuryakin" observed, the Brett series' Watson (particularly the first actor in the role) did have the stray "I say, Holmes!" moment, but essentially Watson was everything you indicate he should be. He was certainly never chubby or bumbling. The most you can say is that his "dashing" way with the ladies, while present, was downplayed -- the series chose not to dabble in Watson's marital entanglements. You go on to say, "And Sherlock was a genius, way ahead of the curve, driven by his fascination with problem solving. When he was working on something, he was alive, a ball of energy, but when he was between cases, when he didn’t have something to occupy his mind, he would fall into near-chemical depressions." This describes Brett's take on the character perfectly, in my opinion. And, of course, the Brett series made very limited use of the Deerstalker costume (unlike "Murder by Decree," where Holmes wears it everywhere from the opera to a funeral). I also commend to you Peter Cushing's turn as Holmes ... and I'm not just talking about the Hammer version of "Hound of the Baskervilles," which I presume you've seen. A handful of old BBC series episodes have survived with Cushing as Holmes (the BBC's Watson was unfortunately nudged towards the Bruce interpretation, but not fatally so), and have been released ... but the real gem is the little-seen TV movie "The Masks of Death". A brilliant film, not out on DVD and quite hard to find ... but WORTH tracking down! Inspired thematically by "His Last Bow," it's one of the most faithful pastiches I've ever seen. Cushing owns the role of a retired Holmes, and the film also features John Mills as a simply outstanding Watson, and Anne Baxter as a gracefully aging Irene Adler. You may also want to investigate "Murder Rooms" and "The Dark Beginnings of Sherlock Holmes," featuring Ian Richardson as Dr. Joseph Bell -- the real-life inspiration for Holmes -- with Conan Doyle in the Watson role. I'd love to know if you've seen any of these projects.

  • March 10, 2009, 1:48 a.m. CST

    ADMONISHER

    by southafricanguy

    You could not be more right than what you say about the Brett series. Damn good and damn faithful to the books

  • March 10, 2009, 1:50 a.m. CST

    ADMONISHER

    by southafricanguy

    what would you recommend as the ultimate Holmes movie thus far (as you appear to be seriously clued up on your Holmes media) I only really know the books (which I read quite a while ago, and not all by any means) and the Brett series.

  • March 10, 2009, 2:29 a.m. CST

    Mori: You should have invited Jeff Wells.

    by Rev. Slappy

    He's already decided to hate the Holmes film for the reasons you laid out -- his idea of what Holmes is has nothing to do with Doyle. I feel sorry for Wells sometimes....

  • March 10, 2009, 2:32 a.m. CST

    RDJ is brilliant casting

    by lockesbrokenleg

    I will see this dammit. Besides, Bale is in two other movies this summer.

  • March 10, 2009, 2:33 a.m. CST

    Klinger vs. Brett

    by Steve Young

    Since when did Mori piss in all your oatmeal and kill your pets? Jesus. Grow up. Message board flaming is so 1996. You're like a bunch of pug-nosed bullies with crew-cuts. FIRSTLY. I am a Holmes aficionado, but was frankly annoyed by the Annotated Sherlock Holmes, which continues (in the editor's own words) the "Gentle Fiction" that Sherlock Holmes was a real person. Thus ALL of Klinger's footnotes are not historical document, nor do they examine Doyle as a writer of fiction, but rather speculate on the "real" Holmes and his historical comings-and-goings. It's like reading fan fiction in the footnotes of your favorite novel - just terrible. Besides, Leslie Klinger, the editor of this (admittedly monumental) piece of work, in the preface refers to Brett's performance as unfaithful to Doyle's character (a fair enough statement - Brett can be downright shrill and aggressive in the role) but neglects to give any analysis of this opinion. THIRDLY. I don't have a great feeling about this movie. I love the casting, love the fresh take, but intuition tells me that Guy Ritchie can handle character, but he's too flashy for Holmes. Do we need a flashy Sherlock Holmes? Mori's description of the boxing scene in particular seemed a little too cute, like something out of "RockNRolla" (which for the record, I kind of enjoyed). Hope this is good. Cheers, Mori, for braving the imbeciles once more.

  • March 10, 2009, 2:36 a.m. CST

    southafricanguy

    by Admonisher

    A damn tough question. In chronological order by production date, here are Holmes and Holmes-related films that I think are worthy of your attention. ----- THE TRIUMPH OF SHERLOCK HOLMES (1935) Arthur Wontner stars as a dry, laconic Holmes, while Ian Fleming (not the author) makes a decent Watson. This isn't the best of Holmes films by a long shot ... Moriarty is more of a 1930s gangster, and the finale loses a bit of coherence for the sake of tacking on an unearned "final confrontation." Nevertheless, this is the ONLY serious attempt to adapt "The Valley of Fear" (another film borrowed the title, but not the plot). As the film is in the public domain, this is very hard to find on DVD in a good transfer ... that is, I haven't found one yet! ----- THE HOUND OF THE BASKERVILLES (1959) Although this film takes generous liberties with the original tale, and has a distinctly "Hammer" tone, Cushing shines as Holmes (his first appearance in the role). Addionally, André Morell is a very respectable Watson, and Christopher Lee is very good as the last of the Baskervilles. ----- A STUDY IN TERROR (1965) Starring John Neville as Holmes and Donald Houston as Watson. For a Holmes vs. Jack The Ripper tale, this is actually rather lighthearted in spirit at times. The Holmes/Watson dynamic is energetic and playful, and the plot isn't bad. Ultimately, character depictions and plot fall shy of canonical, but the filmmakers obviously had a fondness for the original stories (the script is loaded with quotes and references), and everyone has a good time without straying too far from the spirit of the source ... I'll certainly take this over "Murder by Decree" any day. ----- SHERLOCK HOLMES (1968) This is the aforementioned BBC series starring Peter Cushing, several surviving episodes of which are available on DVD in Region 2. The adaptations are quite faithful, although the production values are rather low and it's obvious they didn't have many takes to film. Minor shortcomings aside, this series well worth viewing. It contains the only English-language adaptation of "A Study In Scarlet" that I've been able to find (the title has been pilfered a few times for other productions), and in a few cases (such as "The Blue Carbuncle" and "The Hound Of The Baskervilles") the series either equals or arguably exceeds the Brett versions ----- THE ADVENTURES OF SHERLOCK HOLMES AND DR. WATSON (1979-1986) This 11-telefilm series was produced and shot in Russia -- and in Russian! That said, there's a reason devoted Sherlockians have been tracking down imports and bootlegs for decades now. It's phenomenal! The episodes are shot with such reverence and delight for the original stories, and Vasili Livanov and Vitali Solomin make such a sharply characterized, appealing Holmes and Watson that you will be happy to forgive the occasional weirdness and Russian-isms that creep in from time to time. Really, I cannot recommend this series enough ... it's required viewing for Holmes fans, IMHO. Livanov's portrayal of Holmes even earned him membership in the Order of the British Empire, if that tells you anything! Look him up on Wikipedia and YouTube. ----- THE MASKS OF DEATH (1984) The aforementioned TV movie. A wonderful swan song for the Holmes character, and for Peter Cushing's acting career (it was his last starring role). If I were to program a film festival of Holmes cinema, this would be the final entry. ----- THE ADVENTURES OF SHERLOCK HOLMES, ETC. (1984-1994) This is the aforementioned Jeremy Brett series. Although it flagged towards the end, and Brett's gradual physical decline is painful to watch, this is still the definitive English-language Holmes. Sure, there was the occasional misstep ... but on the whole, the series was brilliantly adapted, with gorgeous cinematography, music, and overall production values ... and, of course, Brett's brilliant performance in the title role. ----- THE DARK BEGINNINGS OF SHERLOCK HOLMES/MURDER ROOMS (2000-2001) These tales of Arthur Conan Doyle and Dr. Joseph Bell (Ian Richardson) are inspired, and a fitting companion to any Holmes collection. Richardson's Bell is one of his greatest performances, bar none. ----- Not much more to say, at the moment. I'm not a huge Rathbone fan (all but the first two of his films aren't even set in Victorian times, and Bruce's Watson quickly becomes a joke) but his original HOUND is worth watching. I have an admitted soft spot for Disney's THE GREAT MOUSE DETECTIVE, although it hews much closer to the Rathbone films than the Doyle canon. I dislike revisionist fare in general, although THE SEVEN PER-CENT SOLUTION certainly has spirit. Spoofs like THE ADVENTURES OF SHERLOCK HOLMES' SMARTER BROTHER do nothing for me. I found THE PRIVATE LIFE OF SHERLOCK HOLMES surprisingly overrated, although I love many of the players involved. I loathed MURDER BY DECREE for too many reasons to list here. SHERLOCK HOLMES AND THE BAKER STREET IRREGULARS is to be avoided at all costs (poor, poor Jonathan Pryce), and SHERLOCK HOLMES AND THE CASE OF THE SILK STOCKING was a sad attempt and a waste of Rupert Everett. There were several films that starred Christopher Lee as Holmes; sadly, I felt none of them were worthy of him (the earlier ones even dubbed over Lee's voice) or of the source material. Peter O'Toole voiced Holmes in some anemic, low-budget animated versions that aren't really worth hunting down. Ian Richardson starred as Holmes in a few telefilms, but again ... the films themselves weren't terribly good. Perhaps I'll think of more commentary later, but that's all I've got for now. I'm leery of this new 2009 film, but of course I hope to be pleasantly surprised. Nothing would make me happier than a worthy Holmes on screen once more.

  • March 10, 2009, 2:54 a.m. CST

    "Let me tell you how this is going to go"

    by Boba Fat

    That scene description in which Holmes addresses the audience over a freeze frame confirms that this isn't the Homes adaptation for me. Ritchie's bag of tricks leaves me cold and seems at odds with a period film like this. Time will tell and I'd like to be wrong, but now I've officially got my geek grump on.

  • March 10, 2009, 3:49 a.m. CST

    ADMONISHER

    by southafricanguy

    Holy shit dude, i bow down to your knowledge! Geez you really know your shit. Thanks for those recommendations, The Russian ones sound fascinating, are they really that good? Because I think they would be hard to come by, but possibly worth it. For the record I like the character of Holmes (but I am by no means an expert or a Sherlockian), and I like Doyle's writing style, but I have never seen a holmes movie that i Thought was truly good. Even young sherlock holmes is nt particularly good when you watch it now (though it amazingly predicts Harry potter..think about it)

  • March 10, 2009, 3:51 a.m. CST

    and i have not really liked any of the tv shows I have

    by southafricanguy

    seen other than the early Brett series. So I would love to see some truly great Holmes.

  • March 10, 2009, 3:56 a.m. CST

    Admonisher

    by southafricanguy

    I think you will be dissapointed in the plot and mystery of this new Sherlock Holmes. For someone like you who knows the character and his world so completely, You probably expect a clever mystery that is truly baffling, thus the point of it being only the genius of Holmes that can solve it, right? Well when you read the script as the reader it feels like you are several steps ahead of Holmes, yeah..its that bad. And the plot is just...well we have just seen it too many times..

  • March 10, 2009, 4:01 a.m. CST

    Jeremy Brett's version didn't have a bumbling Watson

    by V'Shael

    Have you seen it, or are you just going by assumption or hearsay? <p> There's a reason Brett's version is considered definitive. It was the most true-to-the-source-material versions ever made.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:02 a.m. CST

    BOBA FAT

    by southafricanguy

    i feel the same way about Ritchie. He is one of those hipster directors that uses tricks to make a film look edgy. But I feel edge should come from the plot,performances, and action. But it just seems that Ritchie will direct this the way he made his Brit gangster movies. I just think that style is kind of very 1990s. Fuck man..even Tarantino does nt make those kind of movies any more or use that exact style anymore (i will leave you all to deciede wether that is a good thing or not). So far I have seen no evolution to Ritchie. While I think that scene sounds cool, it does worry me that the movie is going to feel like all of his other movies.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:03 a.m. CST

    BTW MORIARTY....THANKS FOR THE UPDATE

    by southafricanguy

    on Avatar...as in thanks for nothing.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:03 a.m. CST

    The script is BRILLIANT.

    by Darth Fart

    I read it a while back. This will clearly be Guy Ritchie's best work. By far. The script nails Sherlock so well. I CANNOT WAIT.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:06 a.m. CST

    I UNDERSTAND YOU ARE MOST LIKELY

    by southafricanguy

    just damn busy. Oh well, if you have the time to waste my email is allanlmb37@yahoo.com would just really like to know what you have heard, and/or your opinions

  • March 10, 2009, 4:13 a.m. CST

    DARTHFART

    by southafricanguy

    Brilliant?? Seriously?? You are right that the script nails sherlock and Watson,and there are some potentially cool action scenes. But the mystery is pathetic! ARE you really telling me you did nt know what the truth to it would be?? And the villain is a cartoon, no motivation or character, and his plan (which also has no real motivation) its the same as Shangai Knights for fucks sake! Its all just too unimaginative and dumbed down for Sherlock Holmes.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:16 a.m. CST

    I would really like to know in more detail why you think its

    by southafricanguy

    such a great script.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:39 a.m. CST

    Why I liked it.

    by Darth Fart

    I got sucked into the world and I thought there was a "mystery". Mind you, the script captures less of the overall aesthetics of the book; it's more situated in the realms of a comic book. The action at the end is very comic booky. The film is really centred on Sherlock's isolation, which I liked. Isn't this script based on a Sherlock comic? I've never seen Shanghai Knights so I can't comment.

  • March 10, 2009, 4:44 a.m. CST

    No matter how this movie turn out I will see it

    by bigmoney

    It will be a great Christmas Present !

  • March 10, 2009, 5:03 a.m. CST

    please be good

    by Mr Gorilla

    PLEASE! BTW, the TV show was ace. As was the Billy Wilder film.

  • March 10, 2009, 5:17 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    One interesting thing about the script is that it describes both Holmes and Watson as "around thirty" - considerably younger than either RDjr or JL. As someone else said, both Holmes and Watson are almost always played too old - they were their mid- to late twenties in the first novel (when they met), and Holmes *retired* before he was fifty. But are there any bankable mid- to late twenties stars at the moment? Your rundown of different Holmes and Watson incarnations was fascinating. In movies, I'd put Muredr by Decree at the top of the list by far: there are things wrong with it, but there are so many more things right. And yes, the Russina TV series is great, despite, again, some things that strike English-speakers as odd: Sir Henry Baskerville as a rootin-tootin shoot-'em-up cowboy for one, and a Baker Street that looks like a Transylvanian village backstreet from a Dracula movie. But Holmes and Watson are like the Marx Brothers: they've never been in a movie that's as good as they are. H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 5:21 a.m. CST

    There is no good reason to be upset

    by Dingbatty

    that this version doesn't resemble the Jeremy Brett. Since the Brett version is considered definitive, it makes sense that you'd wantthe Ritchie/RDjr/Law adaptation to have it's own ambience and aesthetic, instead of trying to be something it can't achieve?

  • March 10, 2009, 5:24 a.m. CST

    BiggusDickus

    by Mr Gorilla

    Is right about Jeremy Brett. It felt kind of definitive. Basil Rathbone and Nigel Bruce were great but the stories often weren't. I enjoyed Plummer and Mason. Peter Cushing was pretty cool. The guys in Billy Wilder's version were fantastic - and didn't Chris Lee make a great Mycroft! And I actually loved Young Sherlock Holmes too. I think the casting here is great - I really trust Downey Jn to come up with the goods - but I can't help but be worried about Guy Ritchie. I think if they had got someone really special, they could have had a go-er. Like putting Ang Lee onto Hulk, or Alfonso Cuaron onto Harry Potter.

  • March 10, 2009, 6:02 a.m. CST

    Really looking forward to this. Had a friend who worked on it

    by Col. Tigh-Fighter

    said it rocked. <p> Great cast

  • March 10, 2009, 6:04 a.m. CST

    Without A Clue with Michael Caine and Ben Kingsley

    by Col. Tigh-Fighter

    best Holmes/Watson combo evah! lol <p> "He was beaten to death with a blunt excrement!"

  • March 10, 2009, 6:15 a.m. CST

    Sure Guy Richie is Consistent

    by Youngdog

    Consistently making the same film! B'dum dum tsh. I'm here all week - try the veal

  • March 10, 2009, 6:55 a.m. CST

    Youngdog

    by southafricanguy

    my fucking point exactly dude. The only time Ritchie made something different was Swept Away, and we all know how that turned out

  • March 10, 2009, 6:59 a.m. CST

    Hackish

    by southafricanguy

    Cool man, yeah i think you are right holmes has never really had a truly great movie. In that way holmes is a lot like star trek, they have both always fared much better on tv. So how would you recommend to go about seeing the Russian Holmes Hackish?

  • March 10, 2009, 7:19 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    I think you can probably download them from the torrent sites if that's your thing, but I bought the DVDs. They have English subtitles, which are really essential to get the best out of them, but the titles do take a bit of getting used to: they were translated from the Russian dialogue by someone who doesn't know the stories, so for instance, in the best-known short story of all, The Speckled Band, the desperate dying words of the first murder victim are rendered as "It was the ribbon! The motley ribbon!" Which isn't the same, somehow... But the shows are great and they have one of the best Watsons I've ever seen. H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 7:40 a.m. CST

    I totally forgot about this film!

    by ricarleite

    Are they still releasing this?

  • March 10, 2009, 7:59 a.m. CST

    HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    What about the production values? And so all the stories are taken from the novels? And does it take place in Russia, or do they pretend its in England?

  • March 10, 2009, 8:09 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    The production values are high. The stories are all taken from Conan Doyle, and yes, it's supposed to be England. Have a look at http://tinyurl.com/chlkwc for some stills and descriptions. H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 8:11 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    Sorry, this might be a better URL: http://alek-morse.livejournal.com/tag/screen+caps H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 8:15 a.m. CST

    OK, COOL, THANKS A BUNCH HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    just out of interest..what other great fictional detectives do you like? All the many that have in some part or other been inspired by Holmes. Personally I like Monk, though thats more for the character and Shaloubs acting, the myteries are nt all that great, and his powers of deduction are kind of unrealistic. But the character sure is a lot of fun. Also love Batman, at least in the comics where he does a lot of detective work. As much as I love nolan's movies (and they are great) the one aspec tof Batman that is still underutilized is his detective skills

  • March 10, 2009, 8:24 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    Agreed about Batman: we've never really seen him as a detective. Do you know the Brother Cadfael stories? He's a mediaeval monk who solves crimes. They were done on TV but with Derek Jacobi totally miscast in the lead. Monk's a bit cosy for my taste. Did you know that there are other Holmes and Watson projects on the horizon? Another film, with Sacha Baron Cohen, and (in the UK) a TV series set in the present day, with H&W as contemporary characters. Odd idea, but it might be fun. H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 8:32 a.m. CST

    HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    I know about the will ferral/cohen holmes comedy (at least I hope to god its a comedy lol). Did not know about the contemporary Holmes though. Yeah it would be interesting and could work, the character is versatile enough. Have never heard of Brother Cadfael, but it sounds like an interesting setting for a dectective series. Do you like Star trek:the undiscovered country? I always loved how Spock basically plays Holmes. Useing logic and deductive reasoning. Holmes and Spock would definatly qualify as two of the most intellectual and intelligent fictional characters of all time.

  • March 10, 2009, 8:43 a.m. CST

    Mori

    by OptimusCrime

    I haven't read the above talkback, and you probably won't read this. However, I'd like to take a moment to express my appreciation for what you've brought to this site.<P>I've been coming here for about seven years, and the site itself has made me a bigger film geek than I ever was before I started coming. You haven't been my favorite writer for the site, but your enthusiasm and knowledge of film has always been entertaining. I've enjoyed reading you over this period and wish you luck in the future. Good job, Drew McWeeney, and may Moriarty rest in peace. Cheers.

  • March 10, 2009, 8:47 a.m. CST

    Sorry optimuscrime

    by southafricanguy

    Mori only seems to answer talkbackers that insult him and/or hitfix.com lol. Just joking dude, I completely agree with everything you just said. Hope Drew is happy where he is now, and I hope Hitfix is successful for him. Thanks for everything Mori :)

  • March 10, 2009, 8:51 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    Apart from that Trek movie (which I did like, yes) did you know that Nimoy has actually played Holmes, both on TV and on the stage? I wish I'd seen that. One of the writers of the contemporary Holmes show, Steven Moffat, did a similar thing with Jekyll and Hyde last year and that worked very well. H xxx

  • March 10, 2009, 9 a.m. CST

    “It is a capital mistake to theorize before you have all the evi

    by Scenester_Intern55

    As a huge Homles nut, both in book form and other film form, I am as giddy as Russell Brand at the Moonlight Bunny Ranch to see a very true to character adaptation of Holmes on screen.

  • March 10, 2009, 9:06 a.m. CST

    HACKISH

    by southafricanguy

    Yeah i did know about Nimoy, geez he would have made a great holmes. So what do you think of the new trek trailer Hackish. Since trek is also getting a big makeover like Holmes. And do you like cyberpunk film noir like Strange days?

  • March 10, 2009, 9:13 a.m. CST

    Bitter much loserguy3000??

    by DoctorWho?

    Did Mori like...kill your dog or something?

  • March 10, 2009, 9:25 a.m. CST

    "We haven't seen that on film yet"

    by J.B.M.A.

    Yes, yes we have.<p>As Admonisher and V'shael have correctly pointed out, the Jeremy Brett Holmes portrayed the characters EXACTLY like this.<p>Did you actually watch them? Really?

  • March 10, 2009, 11:05 a.m. CST

    SHERLOCK HOMIES - STARRING 50 CENT

    by BringingSexyBack

    "It's elementary, bitch."

  • March 10, 2009, 11:40 a.m. CST

    Isn't that Fiddy Cent?

    by Xiphos_2

    I thought that was the proper nomenclature.

  • March 10, 2009, 11:44 a.m. CST

    Good work, Mori...

    by Nix_Cadavre

    Hey, you remember when you were banhappy, and I came back as Sherlock Holmes in Talkback? Yeah. Good times. <p> Downey's a pip. I always love to watch him. I'll be there for this flick.

  • March 10, 2009, 12:12 p.m. CST

    Jeremy Brett

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    If I knew the actor's name maybe I would get all the accolades for bringing it up as the definitive Holmes on film. Instead, I'm a nobody, a nothing.

  • March 10, 2009, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Russian Holmes

    by menstrual_blitz

    http://tinyurl.com/by4pva <p> Vasiliy Livanov as Holmes, directed by Igor Maslennikov....in case you can't find it elsewhere.

  • March 10, 2009, 1:18 p.m. CST

    danny trejo as watson

    by crazybubba

    odelay holmes, que pasa?

  • March 10, 2009, 2:54 p.m. CST

    75% of this article was pointless

    by jarjarmessiah

  • March 10, 2009, 3:34 p.m. CST

    YES, BUT WILL THERE BE VOMIT?

    by LupinDa3rd

    http://tinyurl.com/c7rndx

  • March 10, 2009, 8:52 p.m. CST

    No mention of Elementary Dear Watson in article?

    by lockesbrokenleg

    for shame

  • March 10, 2009, 9:45 p.m. CST

    NEEDS GIANT BASKERVILLE ROBOTS

    by Sal_Bando

    just to keep w/ the theme of the thing ya know

  • March 11, 2009, 3:50 a.m. CST

    Anyone who knows anything about Sherlock Holmes...

    by JonJonB

    knows just from that "Big Guy" scene that this AIN'T Holmes. I've got nothing against Guy Ritchie like some people (loved Lock, Stock and Snatch - LOVED THEM...tho Revolver was ass. He said it was for "smart people" - the smartest people were the ones who avoided it) however just from that description this sounds like Lock, Stock and the Case of the Bullshit Adaptation. Maybe there's an audience for this, but personally I don't want a "new take" on Holmes. A faithful transition to screen is all that will satisfy me when it comes to Sherlock Holmes. And that includes the lead character getting doped up out his tits likes it's no big thang. Also if loserguy3000 is telling the truth...damn that was major pwnage. Mori got beasted.

  • March 11, 2009, 4:58 a.m. CST

    Doped up

    by Hackish

    The March 2008 script has, as far as I remember, no drug taking scenes at all. Holmes is shown dead drunk on a settee, surrounded by empty bottles though. H xxx (PS: How do you do paragraph breaks on here?)

  • March 11, 2009, 5:02 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    Sorry, didn't answer your questions. I haven't seen the new Trek trailer yet, though I'm greatly looking forward to the film itself. And cyberpunk isn't really my thing; Strange Days has kind of passed me by too, I'm afraid. H xxx

  • March 11, 2009, 7:55 a.m. CST

    southafricanguy...

    by drew mcweeny

    ... honestly, what I know for a fact about "Avatar" is almost nothing. I'm waiting to see stuff just like everyone else. I'm fascinated, but I sort of love that we're all in the dark still. It's fun.

  • March 11, 2009, 7:59 a.m. CST

    Loserguy...

    by drew mcweeny

    ... you're wrong. I don't have access to the AICN mail server files, and I've never had access to them. I didn't take a single database from this site. Ever. You had to have e-mailed me at some point to have gotten the HitFix e-mail that was sent out. That's all there is to it. And unless you can prove otherwise, I suggest you drop it. You've made a mistake, and I'm sorry if you didn't want me to ever use your e-mail to reply to you, but what you're suggesting I did simply wasn't something I ever had technical access to. Feel free to e-mail Roland@aintitcool.com and ask him if it's even possible for me to do what you're accusing me of doing. I'll expect your apology here when you learn how wrong you are.

  • March 11, 2009, 8:01 a.m. CST

    THANKS MORI

    by southafricanguy

    Yeah i know it is frustrating but at the same time i really love that Cameron has managed to keep it all so secret. I think that will play hugely in its favour, its going to comeout of where for the mainstream movie audiance. And it will really be like the old days when you knew something big was coming but you did nt know exactly what..

  • March 11, 2009, 8:04 a.m. CST

    BUT MORI..YOU REALLY HAVE HEARD NOTHING

    by southafricanguy

    From anyone you know in the industry? Im talking about opinion on wether its looking any good ornot as opposed to specific info. You mentioned on Hitfix that you had heard too much about it (I think on your movies to watch 2009 list) to think it would be anything but a major cultural event. But you never elaborated....

  • March 11, 2009, 8:05 a.m. CST

    THAT WHAT I WAS WONDERING ABOUTIN

    by southafricanguy

    terms of what you had heard.

  • March 11, 2009, 8:06 a.m. CST

    OH...AND HOW DAMN COOL DOES THAT RUMORED

    by southafricanguy

    12 minute first person pov sequence sound? That could be fucking awsome (im thinking like the opening scene in Strange Days)

  • March 11, 2009, 8:10 a.m. CST

    HACKISH...DUDE, YOU SHOULD SERIOUSLY

    by southafricanguy

    check out Strange Days, I promise you wont be dissapointed (even if you dont like cyberpunk). And there is a cool mystery to the story, its a 'what did they do' than a 'who done it'. Is not Shrlockian, but if you appreciate murder mystries I really think you may like this Hackish

  • March 11, 2009, 8:13 a.m. CST

    MORI, PLEASE IGNORE LOSERGUY, SOME PEOPLE

    by southafricanguy

    are just always looking for an axe to grind. Its obvious he has a personal problem with you and is ust looking for a way to take his own anger and frustration in life out on you. Some people just are nt worth your time or energy dude.

  • March 11, 2009, 8:25 a.m. CST

    JONJONB

    by southafricanguy

    I am afriad you will almost cetainlynot like this Sherlock Holmes if that is your viewpoint. Based on the March 2008 script,the relationship between Holmes and Watson is faithful and done well, as are other certain details. But the story and mystery are fairly dumbed down, and just not really like what you would get out of the books (just my opinion). And it reads more like an action adventure than strictly a mystery story.

  • March 11, 2009, 9:09 a.m. CST

    Southafricanguy

    by Hackish

    Strange Days it is, then. Thanks. Forgive this experiment... <br> <br> H xxx

  • March 11, 2009, 9:10 a.m. CST

    Ha! It worked!

    by Hackish

    And now I can break up any longer posts. Good. <br> <br> H <br> xxx

  • March 11, 2009, 2:43 p.m. CST

    Well, there's Mori's life story...

    by JT Kirk

    Fuckin' A, dude! 3,329 words; 17,355 characters. That's over twice as long as the Declaration of Independence. At least have the respect for your readers to break it up into sections, so the reader knows that part of the tale has an end point and isn't just an endless run-on concept the way this article feels. I was so annoyed that I stopped reading before you even left the country! Sorry sport, but I gotta talk it back like I see it.

  • March 11, 2009, 10:59 p.m. CST

    Will Samuel L. Jackson play Moriarty in the movie?

    by mojoman69

    One can only hope

  • March 13, 2009, 8:33 a.m. CST

    Orcus is Glad Mori didn't leave for the new digs yet

    by orcus

    You still will be a part of AICN,right? Won't leave Orcus Hanging :)