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KUNG FU PANDA sweeps WALL-E at the ANNIE Awards...
Hey folks, Harry here... Wow. Ya know, when WALL-E didn't pull down a Best Picture nomination at the Oscars (along with DARK KNIGHT's snub) I wasn't shocked. I am frankly a bit shocked about how things went at tonight's ANNIEs, the animation industry's own personal Oscars. Dreamworks' KUNG FU PANDA sweeped WALL*E for 13 wins. Beating WALL*E in every category.
Now I've already received 5 emails, 2 Myspace messages and 3 Facebook messages about this - and they all have a theory that DREAMWORKS ANIMATION is a larger sponsor of the event, thus they BOUGHT the awards. Frankly, I don't know if this is true at all, but frankly I don't buy the conspiracy.
I love WALL*E. It is easily one of the very best films made this year - no matter the category. However, I do think I have a sense of what happened here. You see, while I loved the subtlety of the animation of the robotic Wall-E and Eve, and the other robots. The economic use of motion to give a gateway to the character's soul was exquisite. That said, WALL*E was not as traditionally expressive as the animation in KUNG FU PANDA, in which the characters were built for more obvious expression. That isn't to denegrate the work in KUNG FU PANDA. That film was exceptional. Both of these films are excellent animated movies. But it seems to the voting body of the folks that decide the ANNIEs... well, KUNG FU PANDA was the superior ANIMATED effort.
Whereas to a lot of us, WALL*E is the better out-right film. I know a lot of people that preferred KUNG FU PANDA as the more fun and entertaining film. Frankly, these sorts of awards contests can always go in oddly weird directions. This time they chose the exceptional, more traditional animated film. That's not a crime, that's just how the voting body came down this time out. At least that's how I see it. For the full results, check out Variety's Story Here
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Total BS and First
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i mean who can tell ?
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ok not that bad, but cmon wall*e is hands down a better movie. The annies r now considered a joke in my books.
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Let's burn down Hollywood.
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Wall-E got its 2 years of pub before a frame of the movie was seen. Then Kung Fu Panda comes out and is much better. Once Wall-E hits the ship, it becomes a bouncy mindless kiddie film.
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Wall-E will walk away with more Oscars then any other movie.
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Although I can see why Wall-E is a better movie.. I liked KFP more. Sue me.
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I mean.. the sci-fi aspect of the show was OBLITARATED when they put Hummers on Caprica in Season 2. How can people forgive that I'll never understand.
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Thank you sir. After season 1 BSG sucked. Still sucks, even though you fan boys are waiting around YEARS for the final nine episodes. Enjoy. Oh, haven't seen KFP. I'm getting kind of sick of Jack Black. Loved Wall*E tho.
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Wall-E is a grand scale MasterPiece with far superior story and animation.Once they kick out KFP 2,3,4,5,6,7,8 and nine is will be looked upon like the new Shrek.
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but the detail in the characters movements in kung fu panda, the styles of fighting and the general malleability of the characters does lead itself towards a more obvious choice for good animation technically than a moving box, no matte how soul filled the characters are. It's tricky though. I would still think getting that much life into objects that can't bend or change expressions would warrnet some kind of recognition. But i liked the technical animation in both. I loved the background in kung fu panda and i loved the realism of the cinematography in walle.
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Wall-E, TDK, and Slumdog Millionaire top the most overrated movie list of 2008. KFP was fun and beautiful, more enjoyable than Wall-E. Didn't care for Wall-E's plodding second half.
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Jan 31, 2009 2:39:26 AM CST
Strange. Wall-E is carried purely by the animation and sound fo
by mr nicholas
20 minutes. If that's not a feat worthy of award recognition, I don't know what is. Not that KFP wasn't gorgeous.
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perhaps the voters were swayed by the first actually, legitemately, good DWA film. the first time a dreamworks animation picture didnt make you want to change the channel or eject the disc 10 minutes in. wall-e deserves those gongs...but kung fu panda was dreamworks best effort to date.
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Jan 31, 2009 2:45:01 AM CST
Walle-E's just too challenging and disturbing for the fatties
by pipergates
Even as the kids enjoyed it, if it wasn't too slow and subtle for their cartoon-network-challenged little heads, a lot of parents must have been really disturbed by the serious ecological and anti-materialistic content. Not to mention all the uncomfortable overeaters. Much easier to enjoy some cute animals doing Kung Fu.
Still, KFP is a great movie, specially a great looking movie. The kinetic action must be about the best ever done in animation, and the characters and backgrounds look spectacular. I can watch KFP a lot more often than Wall-E, same with my daughter.
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I don't believe this.
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Jan 31, 2009 2:51:57 AM CST
People that like KFP over Wall-e are Mentally Retarded.
by the outlander
Wall-e actually had an storyline and character development. It wasn't just vehicle for Jack Black to tell funny one liners. Please!
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If you actually believe that Wall-E was that smart, then you're the retard. It's not 2001.. it's a Robot love story.. cute but flimsy.
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Kung-fu Panda was an entertaining and engaging film with a SOUL and a clear narrative, about a "loser" who wouldn't give up his dreams... while Wall-E was a boring, rambling and poorly-conceived "eco" film starring a mute, robotic Woody Allen who shuffled cubes of garbage all day on a dead planet.In other words: WALL-E SUCKED!!! >:O
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There. I said it.And now, please shut the fuck up and stop whining about Wall-E not being nominated. Thanks.
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with you people.. are all of your brains so binary.. 0s and 1s? different shades of grey anyone?
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a sweep is absolutely a crime. I don't care what Harry says. Wall-E should have won something. And Daveyf, if you think that Wall-E wasn't a brilliantly told story it's time for your Mom to take away your sippy cup and tuck you into your Thundercat covers.
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Wall-E started out as something singular and brilliant even for the singular and brilliant Pixar, and then turned into a so-so Disney movie, with its silly cartoonish pink humans and the triteness of the way the themes were handled in the second half and all tied up at the end with a dated-sounding Peter Gabriel song. Kung Fu Panda was what it was from beginning to end, and that was solid, imaginatively rendered, well-acted, and populated with colorful characters who had meaningful interactions. Sure, at its best, it didn't approach the heights of that first 40 minutes or so of Wall-E, or some of the other amazing, Chaplin and Keaton-rivalling moments throughout the rest of the movie (not to mention the INCREDIBLE robot characters), but Panda was as good as it promised to be ALL THE WAY THROUGH. And that was very good. Consistency should be a factor in judging the quality of any movie against another, if people really find it necessary to pit works of creativity against one another in the first place. So I guess I'm saying that Wall-E maybe forfeited the award for being a disappointment; for not ending up as great or as bold as it starts out, in spite of the visual beauty of it all. Also -- for animators -- I'm sure the fluidity of the forms and their movement and the unity of the design in Panda were a big plus. For CG to appear so organic and also to have such a high-concept kind of production design is quite a piece of work. Anyway, I guess this is all something to pass the time until The Incredibles hits blu-ray. Amen!
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Jan 31, 2009 3:12:53 AM CST
I'm seriously scared of visiting cartoonbrew.com today.
by derlanghaarige
They always have this "Every CGI cartoon sucks and is evil because it is made with computers, unless it's from Pixar"-attitude and I'm seriously not in the mood for another rant about how Dreamworks eats our babies or something like that.
(Don't get me wrong. I love cartoonbrew. It's one of the most interesting things for animation lovers on the web, but they are horribly biased when it's about CGI animation.) -
Especially in terms of animation, directing and art direction. Not to mention that the prison break scene was one of the most inspired action scenes (not just for an animated movie!) of the last 10 years!
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I didn't say it wasn't brilliantly told (thought the third act wasn't all that great) I said I liked KFP more. I've seen both movies only once.
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I really dug that movie it was a lot better then I thought it would be. I say its just as good as KFP and the random Animie part was very funny. My problem with KFP and Horton was the use of popular actors (save for David Cross? I guess Jack Black owes him money?) for like 1-5 lines. Johan Hill was in Horton Hears a Who and he has like 2 lines. Did Lucy Lu's character actually say anything? Did Jackie Chans? Seth Rogan was in both and had about as much dialog in both of them as Jack Black had in 2 minutes of KFP. It was just shameless celebrity promotion for BO gross. Now I know Pixar tried to get really big name actors like Carry other big names at the time to star in Toy Story and ended up with probably the best voice casting ever in a movie, but you can tell that Pixar actually cares about its voice casting. I mean seriously Seth Rogan and David Cross? Its like they bought Jackie Chan to say, "HEY he is like the most famous Kung Fu guy and he's in OUR movie! And so are these popular people!" Wall-E was a work of art. Kung Fu and Horton were really good and very well done. All of the main leads (Hoffman/JB and Bruce and Evan) were great as well. Just its obvious that Dreamworks and Fox are mainly focused on money with its animated films. Yes I knew Disney is the biggest sinner of them all, but at least they don't try to just throw big names at you to get your money. Also Wall-E has been in development for over 10 years. I don't think the same could be said for Kung Fu Panda.
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The film shows us the extremes of our trading industrialism and consumerism for a better ecological way of life. It takes a construct that has been left to clean up our planet, to show us the responsibility we should have undertaken ourselves. It's beyond your average animated flick, KFP is your average animated flick and so it was enjoyed by every joe-average! Its takes a far more understanding mind to actually enjoy Wall-E as a whole for the artistic and excellence of its technical achievements and visual narrative. Half of Wall-E will appeal to the norm, the entire movie will appeal to those above the norm. There is no place for a film of this credibility in your average assessment award shows so it won't be getting accolades left, right and center. What it will be getting is a lot of revists on home video in years to come for those who grow up a little smarter and gow out of less mature view points they have now. Let the Panda have its day, it's a short lived thing, true excellence outlast any award!
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Harry, don't know you but respect your passion for film.
However, I completely disagree with your possible explanation of why WALL - E was snubbed. My only explanation is that the people who snubbed it have stinky taste and foresight or they are corrupt. Maybe both. These are the only 2 options, not, "Well maybe they still made a good choice." Kung-Fu Farta will be forgotten and WALL-E will endure. And I know that you know this.
I was just watching a brief documentary on Fantasia. I learned that back in the 40s there were some that thought Fantasia lacked real art and imagination. Couldn't believe it but it happened. Really though, I should not have been surprised that this happened. I've heard this sort of tale many times. Shawshank Redemption anyone?
Kung Fu Panda is the opposite of what happened to Fantasia. It is Overpraised. That movie will only be remembered as entertaining, while WALL-E will rightfully always wear the badge of masterpiece. YOU CAN CALL A LION A KITTEN BUT LET IT OUT OF ITS CAGE AND YOU WILL LEARN THE DIFFERENCE. While reading your post I just felt like you were almost lessening the quality of Wall-E to Kung-Fu poopa. I do not know if that was your intent but it felt like it. Like when a guy fluffs up the context of things to explain his girlfriends unruly behavior. It was like you were making excuses for your girlfriend hollywood when she was clearly in the wrong.
Finally, will somebody, anybody on this site, please stand up and DEFEND THE DARK KNIGHT WITH CONVICTION PLEASE?! I am so tired of hearing whispers and whimpers, "Oh, I am surprised that it wasn't nominated for best picture. Didn't see that one coming." Really, thats all you have to say, is it? I feel like (maybe I'm wrong) many of you have strong detest for the fact that TDK was not nominated, and yet nobody is saying anything, at least not any of those running this site that I am aware of. I would just like to hear somebody on this site say, "This time, you suck for not acknowledging what was worthy."
Is there punishment or something for saying such things? Will you lose money?
Whatever, nobodyS gonna read this. HA hA ha Ha Ahee Aho........... yada yada yada -
Wall-E was incredible. It was beautiful and meaningful. Kung-Fu Panda was just all out fun. I think Wall-E is the better film overall, but Kung-Fu panda is the more enjoyable.
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Should have won
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I liked both of them but KFP will be forgotten 30 years from now. Every Pixar movie will be standard viewing for most children for many generations to come. I've never even heard of these awards to begin with so I'm guessing most of America hasn't either. But I'm guessing Pixar has their fair share of these awards from the past ten years. And in the end what does it really matter? If the Dark Knight had been nominated for best picture and won would it have translated into even more cash? But if The Reader would pull out a win it would put a few more asses in the seats and probably boost it's take significantly. Not that it should be about money either. There's plenty of best picture winners that haven't held up or never deserved it in the first place and most have taken second place in the public's opinion to who should have won.
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Yeah the silent stretch at the beginning was all very clever and everything, but for the most part it was just Pixar by numbers. Not massively substantial, and not even that entertaining. Not that it's terrible - I'd rank it somewhere in the middle of their catalogue. I haven't seen KFP but I wouldn't be that surprised if was more of a success on its own terms. Even Charlie Kaufman liked it better!
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Though I enjoyed it but felt somewhat disappointed that it wasnt as great as previous Pixars. Kung Fu Panda was the film I watched more often and never got bored of. I got bored with Wall-E on my second viewing. o inm opinion KFP deserved to win best animated film. But a clean sweep? Fuck, I aint so sure about that. Wall-E had a daring storyline which deserves some something. The sound editing should have won something. Thats about it though.
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KFP was the best film of last year by a country mile..Wall-E was great TDK was ok.. overly long and bloated but good..
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Jan 31, 2009 6:05:36 AM CST
I'm guess that most people that refer KFP a little on the heavy
by the outlander
KFP’s message is that fat people are funny and Wall-e message is that fat people should get of there lazy asses and do something. Mystery solved.
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Except for you yanks who are the fattest people....but just not funny!!
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Wall-e is ridiculously over-rated. Its good yes, but a possible best film oscar nod?! Don't you think its a bit dull? No matter how good the animation, a film stands alone on how interesting it is. I cant see myself ever watching that movie again, it'l be as hard as tryna get through eraserhead again...
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ive got to disagree with you harry. As an animator, i can tell you that Wall-e is the very pinnicle of animation, in terms of character expression. Kung fu panda wasnt 'more animated', it just moved more. Animation isn't a word for making things move, its giving objects life. i love both films, but Wall-e is clearly better in terms of animation. when you're watching wall-e you're watching a crew at the absolute top of their game, doing the hardest thing possible perfectly. making a cuddly cute panda appealing is a hell of a lot easier than telling a love story with machinery.
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Jan 31, 2009 7:10:12 AM CST
Wall-E was about a black man from the ghetto falling in love wit
by chrismata
...A white woman with blue eyes from uptown.
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Too many awards for movies. Takes the meaning away from it if there are so many.
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Loved both films and got both books... And even though it pains me to say it... THE ART OF KUNG FU PANDA is WAY more interesting than THE ART OF WALL-E. Seriously. Character design alone is fucking outstanding, and the environments are awesome... I think KFP deserves all praise it can get. That opening sequence! The prison escape! I honestly think WALL-E is the better movie, but for fuck's sake, people, KUNG FU PANDA was amazing.
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I don't care that KFP beat Wall-E per se, but it does offend my sensibilities that KFP won any awards whatsoever. I guess I'm talking about the movie itself, not the animation. The animation was good. So I guess if it's going to win awards, it should be these.
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Agree w/ Obscura- Wall*E's team was at the top of the game...but KFP WAS an entertaining, beautiful animated flick too, just an easier-to-like -by-the-masses movie. of course it was beautiful, it was in some fantasy, Asian setting. the "boring", quiet scenes of Wall*E were some of the most beautiful put to film. the fact it was in an apocalyptic environment made it more amazing.
Sure, KFP had more "fun, entertaining" character designs...but they were all variations on cartoon animals we've seen a million times. Wall*E had fairly believable robots that could show emotion w/o being over the top. genius. -
That prison escape sequence might have been the most bad-ass thing in movies this past year. Incredible. I dug Wall-E as much as the next guy, but I can't really say this is BS. I could argue both ways, and truthfully, if I had to watch either of them again right now, I'd watch KFP. Maybe its not as deep, but its way more enjoyable. It was sooo badass, and funny, I couldn't believe it.
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Temple of Doom meets CT,HD. Amazing.
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I think Kung Fu Panda (not Kentucky Fried Panda for those confusing the acronym) was more entertaining. It deserves as much recognition as it can get for being one of the few CGI animated films to be as good as Pixar's work. While cuties like Monster House and Igor come out every now and then, they're not in the same league.
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I think the animation scene is getting tired of Pixar the Holy Cow, and this is probably evidence of that. Granted, CARS was the movie to deserved to be snubbed, but kids loved that thing and they didn't really go as hog wild for Wall*E. More importantly, since so much live action footage (Fred Willard and Hello Dolly) was in Wall*E, and the look of the movie was so close to photorealistic, I think the guys who still love traditional animation were a lot happier with the more whimsical drawn-look appeal of Kung Fu Panda's design. It is certainly a strong movie visually (and it's not crap for story either really). I can try to explain it all away, but in the end I think Wall*E was the stronger movie and really think it's a shame that it would be the target of the inevitable anti-Pixar sentiment. Pixar more or less controls the creative at Disney now. They are THE MAN now. Is it any surprise they're going to get some shit for that? They could give notes to Obama on this. "Die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain." Holy shit I did not just quote that.
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I think you'd have to trust their judgment. WALL-E still might be the better film in the traditional sense of story, etc. (?)
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This was a great action sequence too, but the whole art direction of the prison break, the colors, the camera angles, the lighting, make it my favourite scene of the whole movie.
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KP is an awful film.
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Jan 31, 2009 8:45:16 AM CST
As much as I love Wall-E, Kung Fu Panda will get more views
by soylentmean
at my house. It's just more fun to watch. Think of it like this. Wall-E is like watching literature. Kung Fu Panda is like watching a summer beach book that just kicks ass.
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That's my problem with Kung Fu Panda right there. It's made for the sole purpose of 'kicking ass', and thus feel incredibly fake to me. I'm not asking for astounding depth from every animated film, but this film pissed me off so much that I left the cinema after thirty minutes.
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It doesn't matter if WALL-E wins a single award. It was the best movie of the year. Period.
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http://tinyurl.com/dl2uw2
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When you only saw 30 minutes of it then you really shouldn't judge it.
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Jan 31, 2009 8:55:51 AM CST
And why the hell are people so obsessed with Paul Blart?
by derlanghaarige
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Erm, it's more or less explicite that Po's desire to succeed is because he wants to be something more than just a noodle chef, that he was depressed about being a fat loser and wanted something more from his life. As in the character actually says this. Not massively subtle but it's right there, the characters motive. Nothing to do with him being told he's the dragon warrior.
As for the characters being 1 dimensional...you list 3 characters that aren't, and I'd argue that Po is at least 2 dimensional, if nothing radically amazing, so that's most of the main cast as 3 dimensional characters. :-/ Yeah the furious five were sorely underused and nothing more than cameos, but then it's a 90 minute kids film. There wasn't time to give them anything more without taking away from the main storyline.
KFPis one of the best kung fu action films of the last 10 years. Brilliant action scenes, fantastically animated and inventive. And 'shot' so well. Not spazzy shakey cam. It's also pretty funny and has some great voice acting. Gets better with each viewing tbh. Wall-E was great, and should have got more Annie nominations...
but KFP is a fantastically entertaining film and a better action film than the majority of summer blockbusters of the last 10 years. -
Course I should. I paid £5 to go and see it in the cinema. I saw the opening thirty minutes, it wasn't for me, so I left. This 'stay for the entire film length' concept always eluded me. If the film sucks, why would I sit through another hour?
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They make an AMAZING film and get no awards for it. Hope they don't suddenly think 'oh, we need to make more crazier films like Dreamworks just to get that vote' They need to stick to their guns because Wall-E is sublime brilliance and everybody knows it. Maybe the backlash would be because too many fat fucks were offended by how they were portrayed in Wall-E. Suddenly they all felt guilty about shovelling their third box of popcorn into their greasy gobs, that the human race doesn't need that kind of crap and will fail in the future due to it! I'm just messing, but perhaps the fact that Wall-E had a message that was a little different to the norm pushed people away from it. Why that means it can't win technical awards I have NO idea. Like has been said, Dreamworks went all out to BUY the awards because they knew they had a half-decent movie for the first time ever.
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for little kids. Next step is real kung fu films. Besides, it's the best animated film that Dreamworks has ever produced and will hopefully replace Shrek as the poster child for that animation studio.
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Apples and oranges, right? I'll never understand the urge to choose a side. I mean, preferences are one thing. If I have to choose, I prefer DC over Marvel. But, in a way, it's like choosing which son you're more proud of. You STILL love them both. THE DARK KNIGHT and IRON MAN are my two favorite superhero flicks. (What a year '08 was!) As for KUNG FU PANDA and WALL-E? I purchased them on Blu-ray, too.
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Not for me. I'm not bashing KFP to make Wall-E better... I'm bashing KFP because I thought it was horrible. For the record, I dig both Iron Man and TDK.
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Did we, all of a sudden, forget about the Aardman films or (my personal choice for best Dreamworks animated film) THE ROAD TO EL DORADO?
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Because there are millions of movie out there that start weak but then turn out to be great. And I gotta say that if you only saw 30 minutes of KFP, you didn't see anything.
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Fucking RETARDED. "Mankind is shortsighted enough to ignore his own trash & feces until he kills the planet. After he is rescued by his machinery, he will de-evolve into fat-cattle status until FORCED to re-evolve." BULLSHIT. First: Sorry, environmentalists... But we can't kill the planet with anything short of a global thermonuclear exchange. All ths 'Carbon Footprint' nonsense is an attempt to create mass hysteria by folks who then want to rush in and rescue you; the nanny-state types will want you to trade essential liberty for perceived safety. SCIENCE LESSOn #1: The eruption of Mt. St. Helens released an amount of hydrocarbons into the atmosphere which was 10,000 times what man has generated since the discovery of fire... And the Earth cleaned herself up pretty quickly and efficiently. I know that some folks won't acknowledge this, becuse they view Global Warming as an article of faith... But their non-belief doesn't make it any less true. But I digress...
Kung Fu Panda was simply a better film. Pretty basic sports-fantasy, loser-triumphs-through-hard-work story but VERY well told and with excellent voice work. Plus which, Po was incredibly fun to watch bounce. -
Wall-E is a great example of a movie that snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. The first part of the movie was intriguing and successful..... until characters opened their mouths and spoke. Then the script was revealed in all its by-the-numbers predictability and awfulness. And to top it all, they didn't have the balls to follow through with the logical, poetic ending that the movie was SCREAMING OUT FOR. The robot coming back to life was a demeaning cop-out that cancelled out any point there was to the movie in the first place. A waste of time that irredeemably diminishes Pixar's status.
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You even left before the prison escape! And then you are going to tell me that the whole movie is bad?
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Jan 31, 2009 10:08:08 AM CST
I own KFP and not Wall-E, and yet I find those results mind-bogg
by chewtoy
I was honestly surprised at how good Kung Fu Panda was... I'm not a huge fan of Dreamworks' prior flicks (Shrek is amusing enough, but hardly what I would consider a masterpiece of a film... The rest have been "C+" efforts or worse for me.) Panda, however, was beautiful to look at and, while the story was slight, it at least kept the balance from tipping too far into being all about the funny voice actors.
That said, looking over that list of awards in the Variety article, it actually comes across as embarrassing for the ANNIES to not have even acknowledged Wall-E's existence. Wall-E took a great many more risks than Panda did, and had some truly magical sequences to it. The sheer art of the film is something I have to respect, regardless of which movie I got a bigger kick out of. -
Does it mean that too many people liked the film for it to possibly be anywhere near as good as they think it is? What does it mean? Someone tell me.
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Although in my brain I separate the Pixar films from the Disney films, and the Aardman films from the Dreamworks films. But I'll give credit to "Road to El Dorado", which while I was obviously able to forget about it, and think it's got its flaws, I did enjoy.
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"Hi mr schneider! please don't ring the cops, OK?"
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Except most those films don't annoy me as much as this one did. If I saw potential, I would have stayed. I got to the Prison Break sequence, and while it was technically awesome I just didn't care.
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My family has watched Kung Fu Panda three or four times since we got the Blu-Ray...Wall-E once. I loved both, but on a pure entertainment level Kung Fu Panda wins. Wall-E is superior in every way as art, but Kung Fu Panda is just fun. Seriously, what would most of you spend more time doing...staring at the Mona Lisa or playing Call of Duty? Plus, the colors of Kung Fu Panda are awesome! So bright. Wall-E, especially on the dreary landscape of post-human-inhabited earth is dark. Again, I know that's part of the art and commentary of the film. I know Wall-E will be put into a time capsule and buried or sent digitally on an orbiter to the far reaches of space in the hopes that an alien civilization will find it and want to know about us humans, but for now I'll still be popping Kung Fu Panda into my Blu-Ray player three times for every one of Wall-E.
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A film that confirms the idea of the American Dream, that you can be the best just because you have a 'dream' and beat all the odds is more popular than a film telling you to lose weight and stop your overconsumption is more popular... what a shock. Wall-E is so superior as a film it hurts, but KFP did look nice, even if I don't buy its fake story for a second.
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http://tinyurl.com/6znp7n
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I'm an idiot and movies that make me think bother me. Entertain me with fat jokes and slapstrick humor, for I understand or care for nothing else.
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futurama and robot chicken also won
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I guess the lowest common denominator really is the wave of the future. Welcome to the "American Idol" schlock future of entertainment.
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ooops
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but I LOOOOOOVVVVVVEEEEDDDDDD Wall-E!!!! If I actually cared about award decisions this might bug me.
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but bought the special edition of Wall-E. People will buy into any kind of feel good hokum. I guess it is why the empty promise of "The Secret" is so popular. Well, I never did put much stock in popular culture.
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Jan 31, 2009 11:01:15 AM CST
WowI see here there are peopel who do not believe the prmise of
by spiral115
...or something similar could ever occur. GW deniers are the same folks who smoke cigars, eat bowls of bacon, and live in their own crap while blindly asserting that cancer, high cholesterol, or diabetes is real or could kill them. They deny until they are in hospital beds with tubes stuck in various places keeping their delusional asses alive. Weak minded people with no ability to control themselves should and would perish if natural selection were left to run it's course.
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...just give them a KFP plush toy to curl up with and everything will be OK.
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because it really made you believe... that pandas could come from ducks.
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Jan 31, 2009 11:29:24 AM CST
Yeah...make excuses why people are turning on WALL-E......
by dannyglovers_dickblood
....you can't accept the fact, maybe people just don't fucking like it?
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Sorry Pixar fanboys, it's true. Wall*E was just sort of meh.
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Jan 31, 2009 11:31:28 AM CST
And why didn't people see Wall-E in the theater?
by dannyglovers_dickblood
Oh yeah...they were paid off by Dreamworks too.
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I think KFP was pretty fucking awful, but I'm well aware my tastes aren't mainstream.
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Shrieking, accusatory "you insulted my faith and must be punished!!!" kind of claptrap. Try a fact or two instead, like: global warming and cooling have been occurring on Mars at the same rate they have on Earth since we started probing... But there are no SUVs on Mars. This is because global warming/cooling cycles are largely dictated by solar activity. But that'sa cool, ignore the facts and take everything on blind faith...
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Jan 31, 2009 11:51:50 AM CST
Wall-E wasn't great, but Kung Fu Panda was painfully mediocre.
by kid idioteque
I slept through most of it in the theater.
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While I loved both movies I thought sure that all of the award show would pick Wall-E just because of its Eko message. Usually you can make a movie and if you slap an Eko, anti-war or some other message Hollywood will just eat it up and say that its the best thing thats ever been made no matter how horrible the movie is. (Don't get me wrong Wall-E was a good movie) But that how H-wood rolls. So Im glad that the Annies didn't fall for that. I personally left both movies feeling that they were great. But over time and over extra veiwings of the DVD screeners, (Im an Annie voter and in the industry) I felt that Panda was better.
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I'm not arguing that the movie was bad because of the science... I'm arguing that I disliked it because it didn't connect with me emotionally. It failed, for me, to generate any gut-level emotional appeal because it was based on absurd notions. It's not a simple issue of suspending disbelief; it's more like asking someone to willingly suspend disbelief and swallow a handful of rabbit turds by imaqgining that they're Raisinets.
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While Kung Fu Panda was a simpler, more straightforward story it connects emotionally with anyone who has ever had that 'I'm Waaaaay Out of My League" feeling...
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And then, hilariously, they insert a 'but he's fat... don't you see?' joke for Panda Jack Black.
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Was simple self-defense against Spiral115's shrill, Body-Snathers-esque shrieking against a nonbeliever...
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And then he learned to 'run what he brung,' to use the NASCAR-ism. Being fat is the nature of the beast (no pun intended) for his species; the idea is that conventional wisdom is sometimes wrong and we can use what is at our disposal to our benefit. Besides, as a guy who was once in great shape as a member of USAF Special Ops (but has put on a good 40 pounds after multiple surgeries and rehab therapy), the fat jokes didn't really bug me. Nature of the beast.
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I don't know enough about animation to argue one way or another on which movie should have won those ANNIE awards, but as for story and emotion--it's the Wallster all the way. Kung Fu Panda was funny, but forgettable. I still think about images and scenes from Wall-E, and have re-visited it a number of times. They are both great movies and I won't give a shit either way come Oscar night which one takes home a statue. BTW: Label me what you will, but seeing 'The Dark Knight' in IMAX multiple times was one of the best cinematic experiences of my life. It is so disappointing to not see that movie in the Best Picture category. 'Forrest Gump 2' and NOT 'The Dark Knight'? Bollocks.
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They bother me because they're easy. Kung Fu Panda could've been something more than a 'look, Jack Black's playing a Panda' flick.
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But WALL-E was about as deep as a Yorkie's vagina and as subtle as an Annie Sprinkle performance piece. I go to films to be entertained, enlightened or persuaded; WALL-E was closer to indoctrination... And not even particularly good indoctrination at that.
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I do agree with you on that one; I think that the writing could have been more clever while still not losing the younger audience. I think I connected emotionally with the film because I really identified with Po for personal reasons; after that connection, I freely admit that I let some things slide. From that point on, it's just like Socrates said: "There is no arguing in matters of taste." Totally open to discuss the merits, though...
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The first year the Oscars had an animated category they gave the award to Shrek over Monsters Inc. I had a feeling the same thing would happen again this year with KFP. Now with this nonsense of KFP sweeping WALL-E at the Annie's it's looking more likely.
I though KFP was decent but the movie is nowhere on the level of any Pixar film, let alone WALL-E. It's not even on the level of some of the Dreamworks or Fox movies from past years.
"Badass" doesn't make a good film. If that were the case FFVII Advent Children (which I liked also) would've swept the awards a couple years ago.
Whether you enjoyed WALL-E or KFP more is a personal preference, but I don't think anyone could seriously make the case that KFP deserved to sweep WALL-E. The animation in WALL-E was light years beyond KFP (I thought the stylized intro to KFP was the best looking part of the movie, I was disappointed when it switched over to the generic looking CG).
13 Categories and WALL-E doesn't win any? You simply can't take those votes seriously.
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All valid points on the technical issues; I will say that WALL-E's animation was far superior. I think the snubbing is too complete to be coincidental... I suspect a conspiracy led by Carol Channing and her most rabid fans, bitter over Disney choosing to use the Barbra Streisand version of 'Hello, Dolly!' Just my theory.
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I agree with skullivan. 'Monsters Inc.' is one of the best Pixar films ever made and better than any Dreamworks movie. It's almost as if it's understood Pixar will always put out quality, and the moment one of the competitors creates something that isn't ultimately dogshit... award-time. 'Cars' was weak, but didn't deserve to lose to a tap-dancing penguin-global warming movie.
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It's peculiar that Wall*E didn't win anything at all. It's a beautiful piece of work, and it's always great to see the critics who usually sniff at animation treating a cartoon with some respect.
However, as much as I like Wall*E, I adore Kung Fu Panda. It's a perfectly constructed machine that transcends its potential limitations. Maybe the Annie judges are just glad that Dreamworks are actually treating the form seriously, instead of using it as a way to deliver instantly dated pop-culture jokes and relentless crash zooms. Congratulations to everyone who worked on KFP! It's made my day to see it get the notice it deserves. -
I'm not saying that you can't get anything out of it; I'm saying that the major brickbat-over-the-head defines how I view the rest of the film... and that I don't wanna spend the brain cells digging for it. One's actions defining their 'humanity;' the perils of passive consumerism; the gift of self-determination; ultimately the individual as responsible for making his own fate... It's all there. But it looks almost accidental when compared to the retard-level overt symbolism.
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It's kind of like the Downey's explanation in Tropic Thunder: When WALL-E went 'full-on retrd,' it stopped being accessible for me...
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Jan 31, 2009 12:39:40 PM CST
In order to really judge the 'greatness' of these films...
by biggusdickus
...you've got to be a parent. Yes, WALL-E is beautiful, layered and nuanced, but after a dozen viewings you really do not want to see it ever again.Kung Fu Panda, while not being as technically accomplished, still provides an amusing diversion and the odd smile from this particular dad.Logevity? No contest. Po wins with his sheer awesome awesomeness...
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Hence, I'm not viewing them as 'awesome for the kids' - but as films in their own right. Wall*E is a far better film.
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Kung Fu Panda gets two more theatrical sequels... possibly a fourth--then we get endless 'Land Before Time' entries and a horrible Saturday morning cartoon. By the end of it you'll want to kill pandas like Ben Stiller in Tropic Thunder.
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Not to mention some of the great fanboy lines, jokes for 'us.' I almost pissed myself when Po spotted "Master Flying Rhino's Armor... WITH AUTHENTIC BATTLE DAMAGE!!!"
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The last thing I want. We do that enough here, why would I want to pay to see that? You want me to geek out, make a film that kicks ass but doesn't pander.
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You are quite right sir, it is indeed a far better film. Just nowhere near as much fun...
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Aladdin.
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"Legend tells of a legendary warrior whose kung-fu skills were the stuff of legend."Damn thing had me with the first line...
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While nowhere near classic, Emperor's New Groove is pure fun with lots of self-referential humor. Dug it.
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When the Genie does Rodney Dangerfield: "I can't believe I'm losing to a rug.." Shit myself every time.
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They almost lost me with that line. It's just so damn goofy - like they couldn't even create a character rather than have Jack Black play himself as a Panda.
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Jan 31, 2009 12:57:34 PM CST
its simple really - kung fu panda won because its better.
by slappy jones
wall -e has to be the most over rated film of the year. everyone has been blinded by the wonder of the amazing first half so much so that they seem to be fine to give a pass to the painfully boring and flat out bad last half/third act. the film becomes so dull and mediocre that for me it ruins the film. the first half is unmatched. its amazing but they were not giving out awards for best half film. kung fu panda is great from beginning to end. the set pieces are some of the best of the year and at the end of the day if it had pixars name on it no one would have a problem. everyone just has a massive bone on for anything pixar does.
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Rewatch it, chaps. It's still a terrific kids film. And they manage to have a silent character in The Magic Carpet whose got more personality than most other animated characters.
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Not really - if KFP had Pixars name on it, I'd be chiding the film more than I am. Least with Dreamworks their output is so shit that this is merely the latest poor film.
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Jan 31, 2009 12:59:06 PM CST
and doesn't anyone find wall-e's message a little undercut
by slappy jones
by the fucking thousands of tonnes of wall - e merchandise and crap i see stuffed onto the shelves and bargain bins of shops everywhere??
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Winston, all of these animated movies play to the strengths of the actor voicing the character. I love that first line, especially if you're a fan of the D.
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Did you guess I'm not a fan of the D?
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Not everyone loves the D.
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A movie about a cute cuddly fat panda doing kung-fu and learning to believe in himself. Ya, that's not the most cliched, unimaginative, derivative idea ever.
And then a studio goes and makes a movie like Wall-E, that takes chances and has actual ideas in it, that you have no idea where it's going 10, or 20, or 30 minutes in.
But sure, go ahead, if you want more recycled for the massed pop-entertainment, keep saying how Wall-E is overrated and Kung-Fu panda is more "Fun". I bet Kill Bill is more "Fun" than the Godfather, that doesn't mean it deserves to win best picture. -
Believe me... I'm not defending Panda with reference to Tenacious. It's just that much more fun for fans of Black's other ventures to hear a line like that at the start of a big animated film.
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Only in small doses. And if they have to play themselves, I wish they'd be as awesome as Robin Williams was in Aladdin - he improv'd left, right and centre and STILL had a compelling character arc.
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Harry, for the love of all that is narrative film, get over the raving fanboy infection that is the TDK Oscar "snub". TDK is fraught with script problems. Whereas The Visitor AND The Wrestler were amazing films that deserved a nom far more than The Self-Important Cookie-Monster Man in the Rubber Batsuit.
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I hear you. I loved Wall-e, but one of the first thing that sprang to my fat, consumerist mind was the hypocrisy of it all. Still loved it though. Long live consumers.
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Yep - but at least he does do some evil things. It's not just puns, he does try and kill almost everyone who opposes him.
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Haven't seen 'Visitor' yet, feel 'Wrestler' got back-doored, but TDK got fucked as well. men in rubber bat-suits are no less silly than wizards and goblins and midgets on horseback crying over a ring. Loved that movie as well.
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Turns into a fucking cobra and tries to eat all of the main characters. I miss the cliches of the villain transforming into a mega-huge threat in the climax.
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But ROTK felt like The Academy was giving Peter Jackson an overall Oscar instead of just for that film.
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I miss the hero outwitting the villain using logic.
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Agreed. ROTK was a powerful film on its own as well though.
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Jan 31, 2009 1:18:59 PM CST
holy shiiit, how many messages? I just spit my fucking coffee
by stengah
cue the trolls 2 OH MY GOOOOOOOOODD
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Still holds up as one of the best. If you watch it, please explain to me why Jafar's face and neck are different colors.
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That's why I like Aladdin, the sense of humour is childish without being pandering. Kung Fu Panda just felt like geek-speak churned into a film.
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The same reason why a Tiger is best friend to a Princess.
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I hope the Princess and the Frog makes a shitload of cash so we can see some more 2D features.
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I have taken to telling my wife, "There is no charge for awesomeness, or attractiveness." All Wall-E had was, "Beep, beep, squeeeak."
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Wall*E is an example of good writing, in that we can see character without dialogue.
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I just want to see good animated flicks. In saying that, Aladdin hasn't aged badly and neither has Bambi.
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I work in the industry. We all thought Wall-E was boring and lackluster in all regards. The Wall-E lovers are in the distinct minority vs. the KFP lovers. KFP had phenomenal characters, character design, voice work, environmental design, and a much more entertaining story. Wall-E was pretentious, had boring characters, a boring story arc, and frankly, was unmemorable in every way except in the way that critics fell over themselves to praise it. Kung Fu Panda's win is the true statement of what everybody in the animation industry feels, and to say that they won because of any Dreamworks bribing is Harry looking through his rose-colored Pixar glasses. Kung Fu Panda is a GENIUS movie.
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That's what everyone in the field feels? Well, I don't this often, but you're wrong. And if that's what we're going to be getting more of in the future, then I may come to loathe animation industry.
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That's just comic gold.
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I'm sure alot of people in the industry HATE Pixar..the same way people secretly loathe the girl with the PH.D who also has Playmate looks.
I think KFP is the more "Entertaining" film...but as "Art" Wall-E was sublime. The amount of pure sweetness, emotion, and heart the guys at Pixar put onto that canvas, while using so few brushstrokes, shows pure genius.I call sour grapes on this one. -
So what's the buzz on Puss & Boots? Is it also 'genius movie'?
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in KFPs favor i would say he is right zeddemore.
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Jan 31, 2009 1:47:05 PM CST
Sadly being controversial is what awards is all about.
by damien chowder
And also politics as well. Just like drugs... Say no to Disney.
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Then the field is comprised of utter cretins. If you prefer KFP, fine - but to overwhelmingly hate on Wall*E does reek of jealousy. Not liking it is one thing, but an entire industry bagging on it does reek of 'fuck Pixar.'
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Your analogy doesn't quite work. Kill Bill is not more 'fun' than the Godfather on account of Kill Bill being shite.The fact remains, however, that Kung Fu Panda is indeed still fun after a dozen watches while the more worthy, more accomplished WALL-E tends to feel extremely WEAR-Y. But hey, go ahead, buy the Blu-Ray. Bet you don't spin it more than three or four times ever, though!
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Other than Black (who was on his game), Hoffman and Randal Duk Kim...it seemed as if people were sleepwalking their parts...what little there was of them. I mean..did Chan or Liu have more than 3 or 4 sentences in the whole movie? And Jolie put more effort into stealing husbands than she did reading this part..although to be fair...she didn't have much to work with.
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I never understand why they cast so many 'well-known' actors for these things. In Aladdin, save for The Genie EVERYONE was unknown. And so we buy into the world more instead of going 'oh, Jack Black's a PANDA?'
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The minute a film goes so heavy-handed and hot-button as to get my shields up, it breaks the contract that makes me want to give it a break. In the final analysis, I don't care to go in depth with all of the "What The Movie Is REALLY About" stuff that you go on about.
As for me dismissing any film that proposes that man can do damage to the planet... Wrong-o, Mary Lou! Two of my favorite dystopian films are Soylent Green and Silent Running: They start out with a ruined earth, but only so as to tell very important stories ("How far are you willing to go to survive?" and "How hard are you willing to fight for what you believe in?" respectively. Just because I don't like the same films as you does not make me a simpleton... -
and the admittedly wonky eco-angle. I remember leaving the theater..walking outside into the courtyard., and noticing dozens of people...all of whom had their heads buried into a cellphone texting, or zoning out and lost in an iPod, and thinking..."My God...it isn't so far from the truth". We have become a little less human..haven't we. And thats another reason WALL-E is art...it is different thing to different people...like any good painting...it allows each of us to see in it what we desire...it allows for freedom of interpretation.
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Dustin Hoffman was great. Ian McShane was great. Randall Duk Kim was great. And using Jack Black was absolutely perfect for Po--to call that stunt casting is unfair. Maybe the Furious Five voices weren't memorable, but they were minor characters and didn't speak much anyway. And no, I don't, and never have, worked for Dreamworks. But I have friends all over the industry, and to a person they all loved KFP. And almost nobody EVER talked about Wall-E. In fact, it's well-known that Wall-E rewrote their ending only a few months before completing production because nobody had any idea how to finish that movie. Even internally at Pixar the movie was considered disappointing, but isn't it amazing what the Disney hype machine can do to make a movie seem like such a classic? Animators weren't fooled. Kung Fu Panda excelled in all phases of the game and was a delight. Wall-E was a mess.
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I saw both at home on BluRay, which nowadays rivals, if not bests theatrical presentations in color and vibrant picture. And although WallE was the more artistic in the rendering, especially the first half, Panda just popped from the screen.And I echo the opinion that WallE suffers once they enter the spacecraft, filled with the "marshmallow man" shaped humans. And honestly there are quite a few Pixar titles that I think are stronger than WallE. But as the old saying goes, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.
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Sorry, had to steal a Darth Vader quote at the mention of Happy Feet...
Not saying that everyone has to agree with my assessment; films and their reception are inherently subjective. That said, your continued insistence that I "just don't get it" is coming off as kind of accusatory, hence the simpleton remark... -
I'm not sure it's possible to animate a large chunk of a film 'a few months before release.'
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If you, after calling KFP a 'genius movie' can then go 'well, okay, that didn't work' - then it's not really a genius movie. Me? I find no fault with Wall*E at all. So I can call it genius.
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Let everyone in the animation industry say KFP was a better 'animated' film. Wall*E can be just a 'good film' period.
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Wall*E has a an incredible opening 40 minutes but once they get into space, it starts crumbling apart, with leaps of logic and some fairly lazy animation (the humans.) Anyone who thinks ANIMATORS (who actually vote for the ANNIES) aren't the best judges of the best animated movie of the year are deluded (which describes 95% of talk backers so I'm not exactly surprised.) This is maybe the 4th best Pixar film to date. Panda is very likely the best Dreamworks animation so far, so it deserves the accolades and it will fully deserve the little golden man is gets next month.
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Jan 31, 2009 2:43:55 PM CST
Panda is very likely the best Dreamworks animation so far...
by mr. zeddemore
... yes, but that isn't saying much now, is it? Yes, they've finally ditched pop-culture references. But no - they still haven't figured out that animated films require a tight structure and not casting every celebrity whose currently 'in.'
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So by that logic, the Oscars are never wrong because they're voted by people who make films?
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But I do get your points. I respect what you're saying, just disagree. I'm a northeasterner myself (from Jersey), relocated to Texas by the service...
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I don't buy it... Wall E conveyed more emotion in a single gaze than all of the characters in Kung Fu Panda put together.
Don't get me wrong- I loved both films but Wall E was *REAL*- something the Panda couldn't touch. Something here is most definitely foul... -
So his arguments and opinions on this matter are worthless you should shut ip really
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Worthless? Really? I'd say they were worth £5, actually. Which is what I paid for the film. And as mentioned above, most people have said that the Prison Break sequence is the best of the film. I stayed through that and STILL wasn't digging on it. Does something amazing happen after that, that makes the film the best thing ever?
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not 'shut ip.' If you want to school someone, spell properly.
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Next time a film sucks halfway hour in, I'll sit through the whole thing just so I don't get 'pwned' by someone who probably didn't pay to watch the film in question.
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Jan 31, 2009 4:31:22 PM CST
As for the Furious Five being "wasted" in Panda...
by nasty in the pasty
...check out the "Secrets Of The Furious Five" disc that was bundled with the Panda DVD. Adds a lot of back story to the characters that would have been welcome in the movie itself, and the 2D!!! animation is in the same awesomely stylized look of the Panda credits. And as for Aladdin, while the basic story still holds up, and the action/adventure scenes are tremendous, a lot of the Genie's pop-culture riffing is HORRIBLY dated by now (he imitates Arsinio Hall, for God's sake!). A great movie, but it falls into the same pit as a lot of those Spielberg-produced TV cartoons of the early-90's period (Tiny Toons, Animaniacs, ect.), where the then-topical movie and TV references are now positively archiac. But at least the gags were folded into the storytelling to a degree, unlike those whiplash-inducing "Remember the time...?" cutaways on Family Guy. It's also wild to remember that Aladdin's only celeb voice was Robin Williams (unless you count the now-forgotten Gilbert Gottfried), whereas now, every mamber of the FF in Panda had to be a "name" voice, although, aside from Jolie's Tigress, they probably had a total of three dozen lines between them.
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And I would rather watch a movie about animals and kung fu than about machines and fat people. Call me crazy.
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Because the Australian short film awards was won last year by an animated film (claymation?) called Duck Of God (I think) by Frank Woodley. Haven't heard anything about it anywhere on the net. Not to mention Waltz With Bashir not getting any ANNIE love, while Jar Jar did and so did Futurama's Beast With A Billion Backs which IMHO was not their finest work by a looooooong way.
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I actually think the voice casting of Williams in Aladdin ruined that movie. Talking about an overrated animated Disney movie. Sorry, but that film is not a "classic". Also, that very movie kickstarted the modern pop-referencing schtick in animated movies. And yes, it is kinda silly how you beat on a film from which you only watched the first third. Wall-E might be a fine film (but it's not without major flaws), but Panda sure has a whole lot going for it, it's actually perfect.
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1) Eve is a robot searching for signs of life on Earth but she blasts at anything that moves unexpectedly with her laser zapper.
2) Humans have becomes soft balls of flesh because Pixar did research on the effects to humans of ZERO gravity but there seems to be regular Earth gravity on the ship, e.g. when they fall off their chairs. -
...could you use the word "frankly" one more time? You've been writing in a public forum for how many years now? The fact that I even noticed it, frankly, is absurd.
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...its called Kratzenberg wants digital 3-D no matter what! Yes, PANDA wasn't digital 3-D, but, it would be kinda hard to sell the industry that YOU know what the future of animation is when you keep losing to the other guys who don't need 3-D, big-name voices, constant pop-culture references, and all the other crap Dreamworks obviously does need to make their mediorce movies. Kratzenberg bought off these awards. He needs SOME kind of positive attention considering how Pixar has been consistently kicking his ass over the years. People are starting to see what a hack he really is. Sure Jeffery, digital 3-D is for creating higher art, not for saving your ass from being out-thought, out-talented, out-gifted, and just plain ole out-experienced by Pixar. Great job Annies, you've given yet another carrot to the biggest dumbass in Hollywood.
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...what the fuck is all this hate for WALL-E? Have we've become such a fucking dumb, lazy country that people can't even appreciate a fucking cgi children's film "because, like, its all serious and shit?" Ooh, animals talking! Hahaha!! *claps hands* Jesus, grow the fuck up. And before anyone even thinks "elitist", just think how fucking pathetic we have gotten as a society if liking a movie like WALL-E, over one where Jack Black is a fucking panda, makes you an elitist.
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having seen both films. Wall-e was one of the most hypocritical films I have seen in a very long time. I know that Pixar makes messages movie. I understand that. I even got very suspicious of Ratatouilles villain. what were pixar trying to say about critics other than we are biting the hand that feeds. Ratatoiulle was a great looking film and very funny. technically it was the best film they had done up till then. Wall-e didnt win because Disney were caught out. IF the film was all about the admittly outstanding animation. there would have been no problem. but this film was not about the outstanding animation. the message was in the future people kill the planet and get really fat. on the surface thats ok. But the movie was made By one of the biggest coporations on the planet. The message was here is a movie about the humans do the planet and ohhh look heres a wall-e toy you can buy for your kids at your local Burger King with BK whopper meal and fries. and why not buy a wall-e toy in our disney store. I saw kung fu panda and I have to say I was stunned by how beautifull it looked. the only movie of Pixars that I didnt like was the incredibles.
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2d animation. the movies went all souless. KFP looked great. normal service will resume and we will get more souless stuff from Dreamworks. I saw the trailer for the princess and the frog. not that impressed. I saw the teaser.
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I agree with everything Harry just said and ever says! And I hate everything and everyone else! I use swears and "clever" imagery to point out just how much I am deeply in love with [whatever Harry's talking about.]
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I loathe everything Harry just said and ever says! I use swears and "clever" imagery to point out just how very deeply I despise [whatever Harry's talking about.]
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God I hate the comments on this site. I should probably stop reading them.
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IT IS ANIMATED!!!!!! It doesnt matter if it a fucking billion times better than every live action movie. The bottom line, it is animated, therefore it is 100% IMPOSSIBLE to not be nominated for Best ANIMATED Picture. Why is that so hard to understand.
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Just as a film can be nominated for both Best Foreign Language Film AND Best Picture, so too can a movie be nominated for Best Animated Film as well as Best Picture. It just hasn't happened yet. But going by the guidelines of AMPAS -- the people behind the Oscars -- I'm going to choose their ruling over yours.
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Jan 31, 2009 7:54:54 PM CST
EmeraldBoy, Pixar is one of the biggest corporations on the plan
by lenny nero
No, sir. Pixar made the movie, a small studio in the heart of NorCal. Disney is distribution, but Pixar is completely autonomous.
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..."EmeraldBoy, Pixar is one of the biggest corporations in the world?"
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that had me almost on the floor in the theater.
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I hope that doesn't make me a bad guy. The wookie mentioned SILENT RUNNING, which is exactly the type of movie they set out to make with WALL-E. It just so happens to take place in a world overrun by garbage, so the story springs out of that. If you ever run across an interview with the director, you will see that he has to explain this over and over again that he never set out to make an "ecological message". He just wanted to make a story about the loneliest robot in the world, which would be a robot still cleaning up garbage hundreds of years after humans gave up and left. But even without him saying that it's clear that the saving the world part is just one part of the story - Wall-E himself never even has any clue that there's anything wrong with the world or that he is having an effect on it. He's just trying to be with his girl. To me it seems weird and off-base to turn every discussion of this movie into a global warming discussion. It's like if I tried to talk about Mad Max and a bunch of weirdos had to argue about nuclear disarmament instead.
Kung Fu Panda was okay, I didn't regret seeing it once but it seems to me like choosing the panda over the robot is like choosing ROBIN HOOD over PINOCCHIO. Not that bad vs. timeless classic. It seems like they are being held to two different standards: KUNG FU PANDA excels because it is not nearly as terrible as all the previous garbage released by that studio, WALL-E is damaged by beginning as a flawless transcendent masterpiece and ending as merely great. So it's totally uneven!
The post by "Snow Dogs" actually really opened my eyes because I always thought these animation studios were churning out all this mediocre generic shit with the celebrity voiced talking animals because that's all the executives would let them get away with for now. They would rather tell a personal story and break the rules and not throw in a bunch of sitcom jokes and shit, but if they have to make Madagascar then it least they are paying the rent and they will try to do the best job they can. That's what I always figured, but if Snow Dogs is right then maybe they make that kind of shit because that's really how they choose to spend their lives, that is actually the type of thing they intentionally want to watch. If that's the case I guess I can't blame them. They should do what makes them happy and although you could argue that making stupid movies does harm people, it's not on the level of being a crack dealer or something. There are worse crimes than mediocrity, though none as boring.
By the way, Snow Dogs, did you work on the movie Snow Dogs? Or are you a fan of the movie Snow Dogs? Normally I wouldn't ask but it actually is critical information for understanding where you're coming from in this discussion. -
I didn't mean to call those movies "shit" like they're worthless, I just have a filthy mouth. I haven't watched most of those movies because it's not really my thing. But it seems like most of those talking animal movies follow a formula which Kung Fu Panda only partially stepped out of.
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an example of cinematic achievement. It shows us that animation can be mature, artistic, deep, thought provoking, powerful and in the right hands, can easily and legitimatley compete with live action films as a "serious" film. It's a movie that hopefully opens the eyes of Hollywood and educates the movie going public that animation isn't just a medium for kids.
However, Wall-E's cinematic accomplishment doesn't necessarily mean that it's a technical/animation spectacle. I don't think it unreasonable or wrong that KFP won in any of the categories... except for perhaps, directing but I think I could be convinced otherwise. -
... infinitely better than Wall-E. I'd even go so far as to say it's the best film in the past year (yes, that includes Dark Knight, Gran Torino, etc.).
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... maybe "least bad film of the past year" is a bit more accurate.
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Even watched KFP in IMAX (He's too AWESOME!) and I have no regrets that I purchased both movies on Blue-Ray. Do you know why? Because they are BOTH excellent films.
Wall-E is a terrific romantic movie about an obsolete lonely little guy who falls in love with a tough, sleek state-of-the-art girl with a hair trigger. I loved how Wall-E's interactions with other robots seeme do spark a kind humanity in each of them as well. Much the same way McMurphy brought Chief Bromden out of his shell in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.
KungFu Panda was a cool flick with martial arts and celebrity voices. I'm not really much of a Jack Black fan, but I felt his voice suited the roll. As did Dustin Hoffman and Ian McShane. The action was great. And the message "Believe in yourself" is definitely a good one.
For all of you Wall-E and KFP haters around here, maybe family movies or animated stories aren't your thing (shrug).
I WOULD like to see a KFP sequel, IF they make it about Tai Lung deciding to go on a quest for redemption. Maybe with one of more of the other Five (and maybe Po) lending him a hand if/when things get too difficult. -
Funny ass quote about those movies. Funniest thing I've read on this site in a while.
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Is yes, KFP and Wall-E are both amazing animated films (and so is Horton Hears a Who). While most years there is really only one clear winner as to what is the best animated film, and usually its Pixar. But finally Dreamworks got there act together and hired a good director (check out Mark Osborne's short Oscar Nominated film More. Its a claymation film and its on that Tube of Yours its really worth it) and BLAME we've got two amazing animated films. While one is a little more contemplative and the other one was a little silly fun they both are good. But come on for Kung Fu Panda to beat Wall-E at everything is a bit ludicrous. It should've been a 50/50 split.
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Which is why I thought it'd win everything. I hoped it would. I did like Kung-Fu Panda a lot. It was so cute and I just love that part when the Furious Five battle Tai-Lung ... But gosh, Wall-E was beautiful. I'm really surprised/in disbelief in how the Annies went. *sigh*
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Come on how cool is that going to be? Also check out that short film on that tube of yours.
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I love both these flicks with a passion. I couldn't choose one over the other. I'm happy to just watch them back to back on my blu ray player.
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Went to Kung Fu Panda? Even though Gamespot nominated Wall-E for a best of something in 08. And no it wasn't best movie video game. Also Kung Fu Panda winning best score? Really, no.
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won probably because it was an animator's award, and Kung Fu Panda was so much MORE animated.
I mean look at all those wacky faces, bulging eyes, and exaggerated responses every moment a character is on screen. Those animators earned their pay!
Ok, that was sarcasm. I think one of the greatest (and most common) flaws in most animated movies (and cgi characters) is a tendency to over-animate. Not every facial muscle needs to be in constant oscillation, guys! -
As mentioned in previous comments, Wall-E is a demo reel for a master class in anthropamorphic (sp?) animation techniques, but the story is weak and the storyTELLing is confused and directionless.
Kung-Fu Panda on the other hand has supposedly more familiar animation (Wall-E isn't actually all that ground breaking - Short Circuit showed how to make a robot cute and expressive and that without the aid of CGI let alone animation), but more importantly the story telling in Kung Fu Panda has a firm grip on it, the characters serve that story and the story delivers the necessary gravitas and meaning to the audience to justify the effort put into the animation and writing in a way that Wall-E simply fails to do.
I am surprised with this news only in so far that TRUE quality seems to have been recognised, rather than lazily using ticket sales as the "quality" indicator as is usually the case in this business. -
As I mentioned earlier, when you sit through these things in the cinema with a five year old, you get a different perspective.My daughter sat gazing spellbound through the first (Earthbound) part of WALL-E (as did I), but got a bit fidgety during the latter (humans/spaceship) bit. With KFP, she laughed a whole lot more. Now we have both on DVD, WALL-E is out-viewed three, maybe four to one by KFP because it is simply the more enjoyable watch.Yes, Pixar made the 'better' film. The critics all agree that 'Citizen Kane' is a 'better' film than (insert your own guilty pleasure here), but which would YOU rather be stuck on a desert island with?
in a WALL-E box - enjoy!
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see the i is next to the p on the keyboard??
but i am amazed your a stickler for details when your whole argument is based around a film YOU HAVEN'T ACTUALLY SEEN. dick. -
Feb 01, 2009 12:59:25 AM CST
i just think people are over reaching in the praise for wall e
by slappy jones
it isn't that deep. it isn't that original and it isn't that good. the last half is not just mediocre its out and out bad and boring
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SnowDogs, I haven't read all your posts, but from what I can tell, I agree with you. I am quite a fan of Pixar, but not as much as I used to be. I was suprised how dissapointed I was with Wall-E, it was a pretty empty movie, I was expecting something terrific. It scarcely appealed to my love for Science Fiction, and the main two robots did not feel like living characters the way that most people seem to claim they did. I was suprised by what a shallow movie Wall-E was, but not nearly as suprised as by the overwhelming gushing all the reviewers and everyone else was giving it. I flet Rattatouille was among the best animated movies ever made, and was certainly Pixar's best, with Incredibles trailing not far behind. But Wall-E may have been the least of Pixar's movies. It wasn't exactly bad, but it was heartless I felt. There was some empty relationship between these two robots which was based on positively nothing that I could see. There was a little bit of a postapocalyptic story which I was most interested in, but that part of the movie was brushed aside quickly to make room for a far less interesting story aboard that spaceship. And the spaceship was completely uninteresting. It was filled with uninteresting robots, and uninteresting lazy fat people, neither of which had any personalities. And the laziness of the people was actually quite insulting and thus untrue of the human race, because under no circumstances would the vast majority of people live their lives this way- this made for bad science fiction because it was untrue. It satisfied nothing more than a trendy desire to criticize ourselves, and the criticism simply doesn't fit. Throughout the whole movie, I was constantly perplexed by the contrived motivations of the characters. I could scarcely understand why one character or another from scene to scene suddenly cared about the goals he or she was seeking to achieve for any reason more than to further the plot along and somehow get the movie to it's ending, which was forgetable and for me is almost forgotten. Indeed the script was rough when they decided to start animation on it- they clearly were not sure where to go with this story idea which truly was a good initial idea. The movie felt lacklaster, and unfinished, and I thought that this much was obvious. This is why I am so suprised by the reverberating hype of this, one of Pixars weakest. I'm not sure why people love this movie so much other than they are deluding themselves because they got two of three things that they really wanted and needed. Those three things were they wanted a Pixar Movie, which was a fairly hardcore science fiction story, and was terrifically executed. They only got the Pixar part and the science fiction part, but the execution was flubbed on despite the visuals being very strong. Now I still haven't seen Kung Fu Panda, but it looked terrific to me. I fully expect to love it (even though I am really getting sick of CG animated movies nowadayss). The movie looks to be beautiful, with just the kind of story that I would like, and an unusually strong level of quality from Dreamworks PDI. For this reason, I have been wishing for the success of Kung Fu Panda at the Oscars, and these Annie awards please me greatly. I can tell that this is the superior film to Wall-E. This year, Pixar showed us that not everything they do is gold, and gave us their weakest movie yet (more will be coming, count on it- they can't be perfect forever), and this year Dreamworks broke their almost perfect record of poorly made movies by making their very best movie: Kung Fu Panda. I know that Dreamworks will get back to making low quality movies in no time, and that Pixar will give us more gems again, but this was a year of exceptions.
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Now I really Liked Kung Fu Panda, However compared to Wall-E --- COME ON! It's Like comparing Karate Kid to The Searchers or 2001. It is something completely different and original and amazing. KFP - enjoyable and awesome but really no comparison to Wall-E and if you are going to say the animation is better in KFP then you need to get yourself to Lens Crafters! It's funny because if Wall-E was made by a foreign studio-- 90% of the people that say they hate it would change their tunes in a heartbeat.
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You've not seen KFP, so your argument is moot. Lets face it, animation isn't for everyone, you've grown up. Soon you'll start saying, what are you a child why are you watching cartoons? You should be watching a bunch of men in tight clothes play a sport your perfectly capable of playing outside with all your friends.
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After reading your post, because like you I judge something right off the bat without actually experiencing the whole thing. I've some to the conclusion that you are either foreign, an idiot, or so much of a nerd that you really don't have much interpersonal experience to understand typical day to day human train of thought thus concluding that what ever you think to be correct. I'm hoping for the third one, because at least in that respect you may just be really smart and into something smart I would not be able to understand. But that would mean you probably don't post on AICN. That being said, your problems with Wall-E are pretty fucking lame. "I could scarcely understand why one character or another from scene to scene suddenly cared about the goals he or she was seeking to achieve for any reason more than to further the plot along and somehow get the movie to it's ending" Really? I mean did the concept of M-O really perplex you? Or did the fact that Wall-E is a robot and should not have emotions therefore you were expecting a movie in which a robot gathered and stacked trash for 98 minutes, would have made more sense to you. I mean if you had such arduous errors with the plot of Wall-E, I really don't want to be in the room with you for Kung Fu Panda. Because if you can't suspend your belief for 98 minutes for Wall-E, your mind is just going to fucking explode the second you hear an animal talking in Kung Fu Panda. The whole movie to you will be like a David Lynch film on steroids (Yes I have seen Bigger, Faster, Stronger and I think about that all the time when I use the stupid phrase) and you are just not going to get it. Wall-E was a love story at its heart and if you missed that then you've probably been single most your life. Now if you had said something that it was more of a last resort sort of desperate attempt thing then I can kind of see that, being that Wall-E hasn't seen anything in 500 years except a cockroach and then immediately falls in love with the first thing he comes into contact with. But have you ever seen a Woody Allen movie? Its kind of the same thing. There is so much depth and soul to Wall-E that it makes me believe that you've experienced less in life then that fake, made up robot has in his 98 minutes of life. And you sit around and say how The Incredibles and Ratatouille are the best pieces of animation ever made first off just make you sound like a Brad Bird suck up. Secondly yes they are great films. But while I'll put The Incredibles in the same vein as KFP, great action animation adventure. Its nothing more then that, yeah there are some family values added in while there is really nothing gained from KFP, its just a great solid movie. While Ratatouille I do need to go back and watch, it was more of just an interesting movie. A movie about doing what you want and love in life rather then what is the norm. The animation was not that breathtaking, it was good but no better then anything before it. Wall-E takes animation to the next level and there was so much originality in its decisions, and all of it felt real. I think you need to go back and watch Wall-E and Ratatouille back to back. Everyone sat around and told everyone else why isn't Ratatouille getting more love and respect, while everyone realizes that Wall-E is great. There is no overhype about it. The second anyone's ass touch the cushion of the movie theater chair and bought into the fact that they enjoyed the hell out of this robot was all you needed. Everyone joined the bandwagon of well this is going to be Pixar's first mistake, a movie with no talking for the first 40 minutes? Whats that about? But all were proven wrong, because that is the part everyone can't stop talking about. As for KFP, Dreamworks FINALLY made a movie that didn't suck balls. And still Pixar won in the Box Office, and beat Ratatouille at the same time.
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Your speculations on me were perfectly 180 degrees off. Don't get so pissed off, but seriously, I'm glad I get a chance to pick the brain of someone who defends Wall-E so vigorously, because I truly don't understand what it is you see in that movie- and more truthfully, I think that you don't understand what you just saw. First of all, when you think that I am close to not even enjoying cartoons anymore, that is actually really funny to hear about myself. Actually I spend every single day drawing cartoon concepts for video games, and specifically because this is the style I love beyond all else. So don't worry, we are are on the same side, we just don't see eye to eye on this particular movie. Trust me, my wife would laugh at the idea that I am somehow in danger of losing my inner child- she wishes I would lose it probably. First of all, let me point out that I didn't say that Rattatouille and Incredibles are the two best animated movies- they are not. There are old Disney movies that these two aren't touching. These are just the two best Pixar movies, and thus the two best animated movies to come out in some time, at least the last decade. And yeah, I am pretty much a Brad Bird fanboy. I don't just praise every movie that comes out by him just because he made it. I praise them because he simply keeps on giving the best there is. That guy is a film making machine- as soon as he misteps, I will be the first to call him on it, just as I called Pixar on their first mistep with Wall-E. I'm glad to see you so pissed off about my comment, just because I can at least see that you and I are not too different in our tastes. I'm seriously not that far from liking Wall-E almost as much as you. The basic story idea was quite good, especially the begining- the character designs of Wall-E and Eve are excellent, and the animation is top notch as usual. The problem is the movie is overall poorly written like I said, and that is almost the only problem really. Yes I get it that Wall-E and Eve were supposed to be in love with each other, I just didn't buy it- it was so empty and based on nothing. And what is so important about making robots have human emotions anyways? I thought they were robots, why cant we have fun exploring what kind of personalities a robot would have instead of just throwing a human personality into him and her. Make a movie about an actual robot, not just a human mind with a robot body. That might have had more meaning to me. Robots in love with human emotions just seems like such shallow territory. And the animators did a fine job conveying human personality into the manerisms and behavior of these two, but the writers dropped the ball on that and failed to deliver robots with believable feelings- instead they simply came across as two objects moving through the movie perfectly devoid of personality whatsoever, neither human nor robot personalities- just hollow. Yeah I will watch Wall-E again, but I sure wasn't rushing back to see it. Rattatouille delivered perfectly, I couldn't wait to see it again. That movie had a rock solid story where this one didn't. But they were both very good looking movies. Oh, and I am neither foreign nor an idiot, nor a nerd. But I will say I am a geek, as is everyone here. But trust me, this is no attack on cartoons, I'm pretty sure I love them more than you do. But I am glad to have you helping me defend them, just please recognize this particular movie for the impefection it is.
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LOTR... SW... ST... maybe even BSG... But does Kung-Fu Panda really require such economy to need an acronym? Or on another level, does it deserve one? Pet Peeve, I guess.
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I'm going to have to side with the folks who preferred KFP over Wall-E. I'm a huge Pixar fan, but Wall-E left me flat. I loved the first 40 minutes (like so many others), but the human story just seemed trite and the decision to use live action Fred Willard footage just punched me right out of the story (Hello Dolly I was OK with). I have watched KFP half a dozen times on Blu-ray, but I don't even own Wall-E -- and that hasn't happened since Cars. KFP was beautiful to look at and relentlessly entertaining. C'mon, it was the best kung fu movie we've had in ages! I loved little details like the first "shadow" appearance of Po's dad -- he's carrying sacks of produce and his shadow looks like a panda! Later in the film he seems to hug his son and it looks like they're going for the cheap emotional moment but instead he ties an apron around his waist and they get a joke out of it. I loved the fact that Po was the only one who could withstand Tai Lung's nerve attack because of all his extra padding. I loved every scene Oogway was in -- my only regret is he won't be in the sequel (please make him an Obi-Wan ghost!). Wall-E was (really) trying to be the more important film, but for me KFP ended up being much more satisfying. Seems strange to say that now, because at the beginning of the summer I thought the idea of KFP was stupid and I couldn't WAIT for Wall-E to open.
I guess we all have different tastes and there are those who loved Wall-E with the same intensity I enjoyed KFP, but for me, the Annies got it right. -
That is exactly how I feel, even though I haven't actually got around to see Kung Fu Panda yet. But I have seen enough of it's art to really be expecting something wonderful. This is a big step over my typical disdain for Computer Animated movies (That is non-traditional animated movies)and especially my disdain for non-Pixar movies. I have been hoping that award shows would overlook the empty acclaim of Wall-E towards the stronger Kung Fu Panda, and so this is all good news. Now I am really sure that I am going to love that movie, I can only be dissapointed from here. The simple fact is that Kung Fu Panda has a story that follows a far more traditional and typical story for modern day animated movies, and this is why people might question it's value in contrast to Wall-E which is far more revolutionary in it's basic idea. But a good movie is a good movie is a good movie, and it really doesn't matter that Kung Fu Panda has a typical story idea- just look at that artwork- it stands out as exceptional, as an artist myself I can recognize it's uniqueness. Again, looking forward to seeing it. Oh and I hate the live action Fred Willard parts too- truly pointless. To have live action within the movie like that was nothing more than just distracting and visually illogical. It's retreading a weird artsy fartsy bullshit gimmick that I was first rolling my eyes to when I saw it happen in Lilo and Stitch. It smacks of the influence of some moron working for these studios who is trying to stick his nose where it doesn't belong. The live action parts call attention to themselves without actually delivering any conceivable improvement to the movie. Pure pointlessness.
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Disney is one of the biggest corporations on the planet. I dont think you can call them autonomous. You will notice that every pixar film is released under the title. Disney pixar. that is hardly an autonomous studio. every pixar film in the past before it left the mouse house was stamped with disney brand. beautiful animated films with a wholesome story. Making a movie where the story is that we fat and greedy humans destroy the planet. would be ok. except that disney is one of the biggest corporations in the world. go into any BK out let and you will see youll get a walle toy with your BK meal and you can buy a walle toy in the disney store. the message is hypocritical.
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pixar runs disney animation. so they can no longer be called autonumous.
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no one would be complaining so it goes both ways. and emaraldboy is spot on. I have a hard swallowing one of wall e's biggets themes messages when i have seen a billion tonnes of wall e merchandise and crap everywhere.
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Shrek was Dreamworks I forgot about that. This explains a lot actually. The first time I saw Shrek I was sitting at my friend's house waiting for it to be funny. Then the movie ended.
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I am a hard core skeptic. I have no faith and don't believe in it. I read science journals, skeptical journal look at both sides of issues. Yes there are variances in global temperature, but the thing we are talking is that the thresholds for these natural fluctuations have been blown out of the water by man's activity.
The Fourth Assessment Report (AR4) of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), issued in November 2007, states “Most of the observed increase in globally averaged temperatures since the mid-20th century is very likely due to the observed increase in anthropogenic (human) greenhouse gas concentrations. Anthropogenic warming and sea level rise would continue for centuries due to the timescales associated with climate processes and feedbacks, even if greenhouse gas concentrations were to be stabilized”.
~suite101.com
Most scientists agree that the global temperature increase is due to man made activity and will have harmful affects on the ecosystem and our ability to sustain the large population increase in people on our very small world.
Again I take nothing on faith. I reject faith as idiocy. -
and critics noticed that there was reticence when John Lassetter appeared at the Paris launch of Ratatouille. He usually loved the press. but why then have the main villain as a critic. Maybe Lasseter doesnt care what the critics think anymore and maybe they believe they are critic proof. Peter o toole was outstanding. The whole thing that critics were mean, nasty, that could be made nice if you give someething nice. I was thinking what on earth are pixar trying to say. especially since erm the main villain was a critic. I couldnt get my head around that. I agree there were too many plot things going on in Cars. all that stuff with wills and dna was unnecessary. But I loved Ian Holm in that film. thought the opening film was hilarious. I really thought that it was the best film that they had done up till then.
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then 90% of the internet would be crying out how overrated it is. Look in your heart - you know this to be true.
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Lasseter does, but Pixar does not. Disney Pixar means the movies are made by Pixar and released by Disney. I work five blocks from Pixar and have lunch with many of its employees almost every day, and they are adamant about the distinction between the two companies.
Pixar. Makes. Their. Own. Movies. -
on the horizon. It may appear trivial. But it is far from it. Rumours are swiriling around the software industry about the health of Steve Jobs. Im not uptodate with all the coporate shennigans. but isnt jobs on the board of Walt disney company as a senior exec. if he is as sick as he supposed to be and I have no idea what his ailment is. Much was made of the link between Apple and the deal that allowed Lassetter and catmulls to run Disney feature animation. if Jobs dies. and if there is some sort of shake up in the board what happens then.
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Feb 01, 2009 1:39:36 PM CST
Everyone at Apple is keeping extra-quiet about Jobs' health.
by lenny nero
It does put Disney's future in strange circumstances. Not only that, it actually affects how the rest of the technology companies in the San Francisco Bay Area do business. Many companies had to completely retool their CES products and presentations due to the fabled new openings left in Apple's/Job's wake (not literally, he's still alive) and everything's just a little bit quieter.
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Firstly, if you're trying to admire WALL-E as some kind of art-house movie about the loneliest robot in the universe, well this has ALREADY been done - and done FAR more effectively - in Wallace and Gromit's A Grand Day Out. And that WAS a genuine art-house flim. WALL-E was never going to be a great movie because there was no way Disney were going to spend $150 million on a soulful Art-house film. Which is why it descends into predictable family-friendly fare once WALL-E is on the spaceship. The studio just didn't have the guts to follow through on the mood and premise established in the first part of the movie. Nowhere is this failure better illustrated than the ludicrous cop-out ending where the robot miraculously comes back to life - totally out of synch with what the story demanded, both from a structural and an emotional point of view. A very disappointing movie that didn't even try to reach its potential.
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if jobs does die how will his death effect the deal between disney and pixar. Because, remember, though it was founded by Lucas. He sold the company to Steve Jobs.
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there is only one company that will target apple. Google. The brains behind google are super ambitious. and would love to take share control in a studio which as access to technology. Jobs is on the board of the walt disney company. it would be a very tempting offer to take control of apple and disney. Google are moving into the hardware side of things and planning to launch a desktop computer. plans to do this are very well advanced
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As junk science. Your pull quotes encapsualate perfectly why: "very likely due to the observed increase?" This is a SCIENTIFIC REPORT, whatever happened to SCIENTIFIC METHOD... You know, like how one goes from hypothesis to proof? And, "Most scientists agree that the global temperature increase is due to man made activity and will have harmful affects..." Umm, science is NOT based upon concensus, but upon valid experimentation (i.e., experimantation adhering to scientific method) proving/disproving a hypothesis. If this had been done with Anthropogenic Global Warming Theory, there wouldn't be over 20,000 scientists calling it out as junk science...
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We all know that the real threat is from ManBearPig. True, nobody has ever seen him, but Al Gore says he exists so it must be true...
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I really don't care with whom you agree... Nor do the motivations or intentions of the fimmakers matter worth a fetid pair of dingos' kidneys to me. As I said in my discussion with Vader... Film viewership is subjective and a matter of taste. We discussed our ideas and opinions, and pretty much agree to disagree. I'm notlooking for a black-boxed blessing to validate my opinion...
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the eco message in wall e is about a billion times more prominent in wall e then any nuclear message is in mad max. so your comparison is utter nonsense.
and the entire idea of pixar making a film with such a strong eco message and all the stuff in the film showing humans mass consuming of crap leading to the world being rendered inhospitable when every pixar film fills the shelves of toy stores around the world with the exact same crap is a bit rich to me.
but don't get me wrong. I have loved every pixar film...and i like wall e i just think some of the hyperbolic praise it is receiving is undeserved. i think people have been blinded by how wonderful the first half is because the second half is really standard. name one special moment or thing that happens in that last half that is astounding or groundbreaking or original?? -
I'm not sure where all this vitriol for one or the other is coming from... I just can't wrap my head around how anyone who appreciates CG animated movies could dislike either of them. If I had to choose one over the other, it would probably be Wall-E, but does that really matter? There will always be room on my shelf for both.
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I remember reading that Kungfu Panda's animation was built with some new motion tech. Couldn't it be that the animation geeks, geeked out for this tech? I mean the action looked incredible. Also, I found the lack of a B story (i.e. Po didn't fall in love, he wasn't trying to save his father's noodle shop from the triad, etc.) really refreshing. It was all right there in the title, why would you watch a movie called Kungfu Panda if you didn't want to see a "Kungfu Panda"?
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po and Schifu. Were astonishing. Really very fluid. I think the reason why people dont like either film. is the whole concept of the message movie. as long as the filmmakers arent trying to shove the message down your throat. like the shreck movies. or the hypocritical way disney did with wall-e. I stand over my views about wall-e.
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The animation is so dazzling that blinds people away from the messages of thier movies. Finding nemo is very good example. the story of a father losing his son and heroically trying to find him, encountering all sorts of obstacles along the way. What pixar was trying to say in that film was kids eat less fish, fish belong in the sea and not on your plate.. Same can be said for that shoddy dreamworks film with Will smith and Brangelina. jack black voiced a vegetarian shark in that one. who couldnt eat meat. While I liked the first hour of the incredibles. the rest of the movie bored me rigid. the message of the movie was family. family must pull together. america is like a family. and it will pull together at a time of crisis.
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It's great animation and a wonderfully crafted character, but as Science Fiction, the movie fails horribly. The Pixar folk wussed out by tacking on the insipid human subplot instead of trusting in their ability to make us care about the robots. As Harry pointed out when he reviewed it, Kung Fu Panda works as a Kung Fu movie. My kids watch it constantly and have actually asked to watch other Kung Fu movies since then. They asked to wastch it multiple times in the theater. They lost interest in Wall*E 40 minutes into the film and have never asked to see it again. For all their relative artistic merit, KFP succeeds brilliantly as entertainment, as story, and delivers it's moral effectively as well. Wall*E's moral is muddled and it's illogical goals and absurd technology distract from the story.
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There is an envirnomental message built into finding Nemo. one of the sharks called Bruce is a vegetarian shark. cant stand meat. Environmentalists pushing people to becoming more vegetarian to cut down on climate change. Pixar did have a schools educational campaign. to educate kids on the environment. oh and for whats its worth I thought Finding Nemo was there masterpiece. But Ratatouille took my breath away.
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I wasn't looking for you to be looking for my validation. I was just disagreeing with you, didn't think that was a big deal. I'm sorry that the color of my box is so threatening to you and your way of life but you better get used to it. Before long all boxes will be black due to global climate change.
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Wasn't feeling in the least threatened--- just kind of amused at the "I have spoken and chosen my side; All will now attend" tone of your post. Sounded a bit out of place for a guy who is into Steven Seagal, arguably the junk food of entertainment. Besides, Global Warming would mean hot chicks wearing less clothing... So I'm down with it. Gotta go idle my SUV for a few hours...
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and nobody mentioned Seagal. What are you REALLY mad at me for? Is this about ON DEADLY GROUND? Let's work this out buddy.
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I watched On Deadly Ground ofmy own free will... If I'm irritated with anybody it's Steven Seagal. He owes me 99 cents for the rental...
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I think kung fu panda won because it was a perfect example of animation. It was wild it was impossible and it was something that everyone should enjoy. Whereas Wall-E was about a mute robot that made cubes and has emotions. Clever. You see? Pixar continues to make over the top dramatic movies whereas I think animation should be fun, silly and make everyone feel like a kid. Kung Fu panda did just that.
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