Cool News
‘So Where Are Your Precious Cylons Now??’ Hercules Gives Friday's GALACTICA Five Stars!!
I am – Hercules!!
“And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering. I can see them all. The seven, now six, self-described machines who believe themselves without sin, but in time, it is sin that will consume them. They will know enmity, bitterness, the wrenching agony of the one slintering into the many, and then they will join the promised land, gathered on the wings of an angel. Not an end, but a beginning.”
Remember how the “Face of the Enemy” webisodes ended, with someone asking, “Felix, what are you going to do?”
SciFi says:
Opposition to the Cylon alliance turns violent, and those in support of the union find themselves under a deadly attack.
After tonight, only seven episodes left.
10 p.m. Friday. SciFi.
The Watchmen Film Companion!!
1910 In 2009!!
The Watchmen Film Companion!!
1910 In 2009!!
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only 7 eps left? eee
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for not being available outside U.S. I suppose they are on youtube somewhere right?
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Without a doubt. I only found it 2 weeks ago & I'm already up to season 4.
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You didn't say first. Congratulations on your normality.
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along with a bunch of other dead characters!!! wonder what that's about?
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I hope they resolve that part of the story since its been there since the beginning if the show. apparently Phantom-Six returns in tonight episode!
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filler episode
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I'm just sayin.
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Its been revealed: Cain & Gina were lovers! mmm mmm mmm mmm mmm!
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Jan 30, 2009 1:45:12 AM CST
Jamie Bamber "Lee Adama" will be on Law&Order: London!!!
by boomers_lips
He's a cop or whatever you call them over there. Dick Wolf approved it. It'll air on the BBC first then it will filter over to America.
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I've seen most episodes of the new BSG and I have questions:
In season 1 it states that Cylons were machines created by humans and then they rebelled against their human masters about 40 years before the events of BSG (sort of a typical evil robot thing to do really).
Then, during the armistice the Cylons evolved to become almost identical to humans and are now more really androids instead of robots.
Eventually it is revealed with all this final 5 Cylon stuff... it turns out that the Cylons were around at least 2000 years ago and lived on what appears to be a nuked Earth (although I noticed that we never saw familiar continents on the irradiated "Earth" the Colonials and Cylons visited).
So has it ever been established when the Colonials invented the Cylons? I assumed it was perhaps a hundred years or so before the 1st Cylon War. But, now it seems that the Colonials created the Cylons more than 2000 years before the events of BSG? It also seems that humanoid Cylons existed well before anyone thought if Colonel Tigh has served with Admiral Adama for decades?
Do I have that straight?
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watch the BSG-prequel "Caprica" and see for yourself.
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...was programmed to invent the cylons...by proto-cylons 2000 years in the past... or maybe cylon coding is in Caprican drinking water.
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He's a right little shite of a character.
Ep 2 had me quite confused, I'm not sure where they are heading with all this, but it's still an awesome show. -
Watch this when it comes out...it's by most of the same people who made Frost/Nixon and is about the greatest Manager of all time
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/01/29/watch-the-new-trailer-for-brian-clough-football-film-the-damned-united-video-115875-21080754/ -
You are not missing something. So far – what we know now of the Cylons, the twelve human colonies and the thirteenth Cylon colony does not add up. But don’t worry: it is designed that way. I have faith in Ron Moore; everything will pan out in the end. These final episodes are tied heavily into the overarching mythology of the show. Even back in season one there were tons of subtle clues that the goings-on were not as simple and straightforward as they appeared. Now with the 13th colony turning out to be Cylons 2000 years ago: simply amazing. Remember: “Everything has happened before, and will happen again.” I can’t wait to see how it all turns out.
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My absolute favorite part of the show is Baltar and phantom six. Hope to god she's in this one.
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We all HUMANS. (insert collective gasp here) The metal Cylons cloned some humans in an attempt to figure us out by messing with our heads. "This has all happened before and will happen again" is a huge eons-spanning programming loop the Cylons can't get out of. Kinda like Windows Vista.
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Humans
Humans create cyclons
Cylons and Humans together create ‘13’ (not 12) humanoid models. 1 takes charge.
The Cylons and humanoid models fight the humans
Humans destroyed
Cylons and humanoid models
Time passes
Humanoid models fight with the Cylons
Humanoid models win
Humanoid models genetically engineer humans to comprehend their ‘humanity’
The 1 realising their error in destroying their makers, puts all other models into hibernation – two resurrection ships - 7 in one resurrection ship, 5 in the other. Go off into space in different directions with instructions to never think about the other. 13 copies of each model are hidden within the human fold to observe. Those within the human fold have their memories suppressed.
‘Humans’ left to colonise a new world from scratch – over time memories fade – gods of created out of the memories.
‘Humans’
Time passes
‘Humans’ ‘create’ Cylons
Cylons and humans fight.
Cylons experiment on humans – creating the first hybrid.
The hybrid tells of the humanoid models.
Cylons find 7 models
Armistice between Cylons and humans – but don’t tell the humans of the 7.
Cylons wake up the 7.
Time passes
The 7 inhibit the Cylons free thought and suppress their memories. They take charge.
The 7 and the Cylons attack the humans.
12 gradually wake up in the fleet and remember their suppressed memories of past incarnations.
… this brings us to where we are now.
Kara is the 1. She is Cylon, but the others do not know about her because their memories have been suppressed. She is the harbinger of death because she has been that already in the past, causing the death of all humans. The ‘earth’ that the humans and Cylon alliance find, has a resurrection hub solely for Kara on the planet somewhere that is why she was able to come back after crashing on that planet.
I predict – Kara finds out what she is, realises her history, cant handle it and tells all. The ‘humans’ realise they are not in fact humans but actually genetically engineered humans from Cylon blood. Hence the destruction of the human race that Kara is predicted to bring about.
All this has happened before and all this will happen again…
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Humans.
Humans create cyclons.
Cylons and Humans together create ‘13’ (not 12) humanoid models. 1 takes charge.
The Cylons and humanoid models fight the humans.
Humans destroyed.
Cylons and humanoid models.
Time passes.
Humanoid models fight with the Cylons.
Humanoid models win.
Humanoid models genetically engineer humans to comprehend their ‘humanity’.
The 1 realising their error in destroying their makers, puts all other models into hibernation – two resurrection ships - 7 in one resurrection ship, 5 in the other. Go off into space in different directions with instructions to never think about the other. 13 copies of each model are hidden within the human fold to observe. Those within the human fold have their memories suppressed.
‘Humans’ left to colonise a new world from scratch – over time memories fade – gods of created out of the memories.
‘Humans’.
Time passes.
‘Humans’ ‘create’ Cylons.
Cylons and humans fight.
Cylons experiment on humans – creating the first hybrid.
The hybrid tells of the humanoid models.
Cylons find 7 models.
Armistice between Cylons and humans – but don’t tell the humans of the 7.
Cylons wake up the 7.
Time passes.
The 7 inhibit the Cylons free thought and suppress their memories. They take charge.
The 7 and the Cylons attack the humans.
12 gradually wake up in the fleet and remember their suppressed memories of past incarnations.
… this brings us to where we are now.
Kara is the 1. She is Cylon, but the others do not know about her because their memories have been suppressed. She is the harbinger of death because she has been that already in the past, causing the death of all humans. The ‘earth’ that the humans and Cylon alliance find, has a resurrection hub solely for Kara on the planet somewhere that is why she was able to come back after crashing on that planet.
I predict – Kara finds out what she is, realises her history, cant handle it and tells all. The ‘humans’ realise they are not in fact humans but actually genetically engineered humans from Cylon blood. Hence the destruction of the human race that Kara is predicted to bring about.
All this has happened before and all this will happen again…
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It's obviously Adama (been feeling ill lately), not Roslyn.
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Ron Moore who wrote and directed last weeks episode said that Adama is not the dying leader. He takes pills for pain cause well...he's an old fart now, shit like that happens. Ron Moore also said that reading more into it would be silly.
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I wonder how many times over the 2000 years Saul & Ellen have resurrected themselves.
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On the dying leader. I've only been watching for 2 weeks, so I might be WAY out of touch with the mythology as I've been cramming. However, how about Kara Thrace as the dying leader? Just a little play on words idea, you know, seeing as how she "died" etc & lead people to find earth? I mean a "dying" leader doesn't HAVE to be currently dying. Maybe. Or maybe I'm dumb:-). I honestly just thought of it now while reading one of the posts. Actually, it's stupid now I think of it. Ah well, I'll post it anyway.
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Dying on my arse, trying to come up with theories in the vain hope of talking about stuff I maybe don't know enough about yet:-).
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With Zak and others in the final three, I'm wondering if all of those who have died have already been reborn in some kind of holding tank somewhere...and we find everyone is really Cylon. Think of it...Cally, Kat, everyone, in the end, is alive and well in some kind of techno-heaven. It could happen!
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only 13 plus hours till something is on TV. Gentleman, Start your engines (DVRs)!
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This thing he's planning... I think it's far worse than any mutiny that has happened in this show in the past. Mainly because where other characters were doing it because they believed it right or at least the correct, I think Gaeta is doing it mainly because of the things that have happened to him and he seems to be saying "frak the universe". Maybe not though.. I have hope for his character given his past, it will be an interesting episode.
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I wonder how they'll pull that off, him being dead and all.
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Oh Nooooooooooooooo!
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I do not agree with how they are dissenting = that behavior is tearing the fleet apart and dangerous. But,to go from Never Ever allowing Computer Networks (which saved Galactica & Vipers) to suddenly just caving in and being all buddy buddy & shareing some jump drives strikes as a possible panic moves.
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that's cool, that's what moore is intending. that it shouldn't be clear cut. i think adama is making a hard pragmatic decision.
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is the best showever!
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Was the burning of the Pythia symbolic of the show turning its back on the mythology that led them to Earth in the first place, or is it going to come back?
Also, what about Kobol? 2000 years ago the 12 colonies left Kobol, which just happened to be the same time that 'Earth' (the 13th colony) went kablooie. Are we going to find out what happened there? I'm concerned we won't.
They also need to get Baltar back to being his old pre-trial self. Enough of this prophet/rabblerouser shtick. The man is brilliant, let him be brilliant! -
Actually, the first lines in the miniseries say (paraphrased): Humans created the Cylon to make life easier on the 12 colonies. Then came the day the humans decided to kill their masters. After a long and bloody struggle, an armistice was declared... No one has seen a cylon for 40 years.
The actual dates of the cylon genesis were vague, and quite open to interpretation. But all this has happened before and will happen again, the cylons exist long enough to 'evolve' into a race that believes it is human. They create their own cylon...
I've always been on the 'humanity is cylon' kick. 'Then came the day the cylon decided to kill their masters.' I suspect this happened long before the exodus of the 13th. -
Colonies didn't leave kobol 2000 years ago. It was significantly earlier than that as will be explained. The agenda of the final 5 will be explained. As will the hybrid quote above.
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Then came the day the CYLON decided to kill their masters. Though I believe it became interchangeable at some point.
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Tonight's episode and next weeks are pretty awesome.
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That's what I'm finally coming to grips with.
With a story so fractured and characters filled with lunatic motivations that change from minute to minute, it's like a mad scramble here at the end to see how much damage they can inflict on the great things the show has done previously.
It's like a train wreck I can't not watch. But, the watching is painful, let me tell you. What a depressing load of overwrought nonsense that last episode was. Using my DVR, I almost hit the comemrcial skip button durning the show and watched the commercials for a breath of fresh air.
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Well?
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If the BSG universe is destined to burn itself out and repeat the cycle then I was thinking that 2000 years is a very short span of time. certainly there would be better records kept along the lines of "hey dudes, don't build robot slaves..if you do, don't call them Cylons.. re-think the whole nuclear weapons thing..." and what if what the crew discovered wasn't Earth, but the charred remains of Kobol? and Earth is another three years away in the same direction they were going? wouldn't the 2000 years thing make more sence?
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Saddens me. But we still have Mickey! Yeah!
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Wouldn't that be the final fives job to stop the endless cycle of violence? Isn't that why their continuity is different and not group related.
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is the single worst copout in the history of scifi, it single-handedly ruined the matrix franchise and looks to do the same to our beloved BSG!
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It's time to kick it into high-gear. So. Say. We. All.
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Ron Moore has clarified this in a recent interview. Adama has just been drinking a lot and taking pain pills.I think it's OK to move away from this line of thinking.
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Yeah big copout, especially for those who write history books.
Part of the point is that there are inherent repeating motifs that occur throughout human history. Events, ideas, personalities, the same things appear to occur over and over, just changing the setting a little.
The idea is to learn and evolve from what has gone before. Otherwise, we keep repeating the same mistakes ad infinitum. In a show examining the inherent nature of humanity, I find this quite apt as a theme. -
Last weeks ep was the quiet before the storm. I thought it was an interesting choice for Moore to direct that one.
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Yeah, that's how it felt. I too, thought it an interesting choice for RDM to make.BTW - thanks for not stepping into spoiler territory. We are all jealous of your advanced-insider knowledge!
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Yeah, yeah, hard decision trusting the Cylons. Blah blah, hold something over their heads. Take the technology! They're not exactly gonna be running off of ultra-liberal, gas-replacing fairy dust. They aren't as lucky as us.
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Tonight's episode and next week's episode are really one long episode. The show get's back to what I love: drama, character, survival, the madness of being stuck in space. No big revelations, etc. Just drama and ass kicking.
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Had become what Adama was back in the early series. You know, a cylon-killing warrior that is going to keep his people safe. That said, non-resurrecting cylons that can interbreed with humans and have allied interests with humans are, for all intents and purposes human. The difference which makes no difference is no difference.
This final run is repeating early BSG. Tonights ep looks like the revolt on the prison ship that was led by Zarek. That ep was, what: two eps after the original nuked planet ep? Any case, I am glad Gaeta is laying off the singing and soulful eyes montages.
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Now that would be a great final episode. Greene turns to Olmos and says "Get the Frak outta my chair!"
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It's pretty simple actually: the Cylon AI's figured out what Nature figured out on Earth about 3 billion years ago, if you want real performance, you have to trade up from silicon to carbon. It's happening right now all over the world: silicon-based technology has reached its limits (when was the last time you heard about a new CPU chip being twice as fast as its predecessor?) and will be replaced with a hybrid of carbon nanotubes and polymers. To the Skinjobs, the Centurions are like fridges or toasters or SmartCars: useful but limited. Unfortunately carbon has drawbacks, like mortality. So they build a Resurrection technology to solve that. They only need humans as raw resources. Unfortunately, along the way, they were seduced by mysticism and religious emotions. Powerful stuff!
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its too gimicky and it always makes me aware of the fact that yes, a camera is filming it. takes me out of the drama. please let this be the end of shaky cam
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RDM and the writers are attempting to show what happens after 4 years of terror, running, war, hardship. This aint the shiny trek universe this is some end of the world, you are going to wish you were dead, kind of dark stuff. Yes, some of the episodes are scattered, some of the plot holes are growing, & many of us are worried it will not tie all up before the end. But, just like when you run a marathon and are in the hills at mile 20 doesn't mean you stop and not finish the last 6.1 miles.
Fight'em till we can't!
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Me likes the Silicon / Carbon comparison = nice summary!
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Baltar = Joseph Smith
Head Six = Angel Moroni
Colonials = Nephites
Cylons = Lamanites
Six and Tigh's child = Elohim
Hera = Elohim's Wife
Colonials and Cylons will all be resurrected to a higher plain of existence on our Earth as they are tried in life an move toward godhood themselves.
And all the resurrected will receive a KFC Frak Pack personally from the resurrected Colonel Sanders.
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7 more weeks until I stop watching TV altogether!I seriously don't know what Moore is setting up with this in fleet fighting and the mysterious absence of The Cavil Co., but I think we can judge, based on the show's entire run that it will end fantastically, but probably not happily. It's like the last season of DS9,only without an episode of the Colonials playing baseball against the Cylons.
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In terms of excitement and anticipation, it's like the last season of DS9. At least for me...
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wasted way to much time on a new dax....and there was no way the dominion should not have won that war, exept for the fact that, hey its star trek
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Clancy Wiggum is the final Cylon.
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Y'know KFC started in Utah. But Mormons say "fetch" instead of "frak." It's true.
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Thx man. Good to know I'm on the right track and didn't miss any major plot points in the few eps I've missed.
I have all of the BSG DVDs but have yet to open them and watch the entire series from start to finish. Right now I'm doing that with The Wire... BSG will be next. -
Alfred Packer reference. Personally, I'm betting on Baltar to offer his body up to the masses. I think his inherent narcissism will keep him from actually going through with it.
So Hot Dog slipped Cally the "hot dog"? Nice. -
You're also forgetting that Sisko's story never got resolved. He took out Dukat but it turns out that was never his true "mission" with them. That was the one thing that really irked me by the end of the show. The conclusion of the war was set up enough in advance where I could accept the events that brought the armistice at the end.
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Colonel Sanders will be played by a digital Lorne Greene. Gotta have that product placement revenue.
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is that these types of stories are never satisfactorily resolved...look at star wars, dsn, matrix...heck even lotr resolution was just slightly disappointing
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After the first episode I was feeling optimistic. But I feel like I have homework tonight.
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Jan 30, 2009 11:37:07 AM CST
The end of BSG will be anti-climatic.
by real men cry sir. real men cry.
It will end with them finding 20th Century Earth. After determining where the powers that be are residing, a Raptor will be launched from the far side of the moon. It will land in a heavily wooded area north of the lights of the capital city at night. As the away team readies for a scouting mission, they will observe a lone set of car headlights approaching them in the twilight distance. The car stops and they observe two lone figures step out. Twin beams from two flashlights sweep the area and begin to make their way up the hill where the Raptor has been cloaked. The away team gets in position to surround the approaching figures. Boomer stands ready to greet the arrivals. Closer and closer they come. As they approach the ship, the others surround the two figures. Voices shout out in the darkness: "Are you human or Cylon?" "ARE YOU HUMAN OR CYLON?!". One figure steps forward with identification held above his head as he looks at Boomer and says:
"Mulder, F.B.I".
Slow fade to black as a voice (Scully's) says out loud: "You were right, Mulder".
Cue X-files theme and Cut! That's a wrap, folks. -
Anytime I roll my mouse it pops up. I order the use of nuclear weapons authorized on that AD!
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gboybama, there are a group of battlestar "fans" who complain every time an episode doesn't a) have a battle scene with great fx or b) answers to the overall questions of the story arc. A real fan who knows what makes good tv knows that this show has been and will continue to be primarily about THE CHARACTERS. The arc is great, and i love guessing and speculating about the answers, but at the end of the day, this is a show that has created characters whom we relate to. they get us to invest in the characters and how they react to these terrible situations. the show just happens to be in space, but it's more like a character centric war drama more like 24 than an action scifi. Everyone in the fleet lost all hope with the unbelievably depressing discovery of a destroyed earth. The show does not then immidiatly move on to what comes next in the story, but takes a step back to examine the human reaction to the terrible discovery of earth. we care about the characters, so we should care about their reactions to this huge discovery of the destroyed earth. You need to learn to look at this show as a character drama, not a serial where the overall arc is central to every single episode.
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otherwise why would they so often sublimate character to tackle "big issues" or contrive a "twist"?
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Jan 30, 2009 12:10:52 PM CST
Freema Amegyn? & Jamie Bamber on Law & Order: London!!!
by boomers_lips
I hope they frak in this!!
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BSG and crew will be fighting the cylons in the last battle. Adama will be the last man standing. He will slip and hit his head on a console. When he wakes up he see a group of people standing over him seeing if he is okay. One reaches over and extends his hand. He pulls him off the floor. He says he has the strangest dream. He tells everyone to get back to work. He thanks Sonny Crocket for helping it. The whole BSG was a dream for Lt. Catillo.
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I hope that they do a roll call end credits sequence (like LOTR) for this show and use the original BSG fanfare music over it.
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that mutinous basterd deserves it for turning on Team Adama/Roslin!
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In "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I" we're told that it's been 2000 years since the colonies left Kobol.
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What's the impetus for not going back and settling there? Is it simply they're concerned the Cavilry would too easily find them there?
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True. But as the dude would say: "New information has come to light." (I think that's what he said.)
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Also, when I say it was longer than 2000 years, i forget exactly how much longer. Sorry.
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for a chance to lick Six??
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You know you want it.
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but she didn't show her snatch.
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You'll never believe what happened to me. I was minding my own business when I was approached by an in-head vision of my perfect woman...
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I've always had a love-to-hate relationship towards this show: I dislike pretty much all of the characters. They are all people I would not like to know in real life. I keep reading how BSG fans find the nearing end "heart breaking" and "depressing", but I'm relishing in seeing all the characters get their comeuppance. I hope they all die. And I wonder if this is also Ron Moore's point -- these aren't likable people, but they're this way partly due to their circumstances.Am I the only who feels this way? Feels "I hate these people and am happy to see them die off. Good riddance!"
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they all have had their asshole moments. But if you want to watch an awesome show with despicable characters watch Brotherhood. Now that was a show where you wished death on everybody. As of now the only person I want in BSG to outright die is Gaeta. Kill him!
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In fact, the reason everyone hates Black Market (and if you don't hate it, there's something wrong with you) is that it takes the unlikability of the characters (all of them) too far.
The characters are admirable though even if we don't like them. That's the strength of the characters in the show. -
other leg and his arms. Let him flop around the brig like that for some time. Change his name to Bob.
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...But I totally understand his motivation. If anything, I'm more sympathetic towards him now -- though I still want him to die. I'm glad the writers acknowledged that Gaeta was wronged by those who turned out to be Cylons. He's pissed not only at their hypocrisy but the fact they've never even expressed any hint of apology or regret towards him. Frankly, Kara is a self-absorbed bitch. Anders is a dipshit. The Final Five are kind of dicks, actually. I think maybe the only person who deserves to live in the end is Adama... but he's going to be awfully alone, so he should just be mercifully killed off.
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Tha twas some pretty fucked up tramatic shit that happened whne he was stranded wit hthe psycho Sharon, not to mention his legs.
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I realize I'm greatly outnumbered here by the commie fringe with their worship of pacifism, anti-nukes, etc. BUT what if the point of the cycle is that the constant pussy push to make peace is what actually Fraks it all up? The cycle always comes to the point where a few humans and a few cylons look at all the death they have caused and like good little liberal commies, they make peace. They settle planets together. They forget (cause thats just what really really good socialists do) the lessons of their own history and after a few thousand years think they're all humans and go off to create some nice machines to help out with the work.
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Remember that according to Moore on the commentary, Anders WROTE All Along the Watchtower, so there is something weird going on with our planet and the Earth that the Final Five Cylons came from.
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She calls her "that woman"
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You're an excellent example of the rage that permeates the Right. Sorry that your day is being eclipsed by a new era. Sounds like BSG (and possibly the future) aren't for you.
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Bob Dylan??? They should have included him in a seperate segment of "Im Not There"
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Can we just get a show where Grace Park walks around eating frak packs while skinny dipping all day?She doesnt even have to eat the frak pack. AND Maybe a few times a week she can call her friend Sun over at the Lost Island and they can make out - is that soooo hard to get done people?!? Make this Happen!!! Please. :/
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Wow. You might just surpass a couple people on AICN I know as the world's biggest douchbag talkbacker.
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he's not inventing shit like food replicators or a better FTL drive or any of that fancy shit. Genius my ass!!
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I like your ending very much.
Some time ago I offered a Blade Runner ending...I wish I could find the damn thing. it was on a talkback at least a year ago, but searching on here is an exercise in futility.
Well, anyway... you can imagine Dad Adama saying to Lee (about starbuck ) " It's a shame she won't live, but then again who does?" or somesuch nonsense. -
If I were Ron Moore, I would tell people to look the other direction, too.
I would not be shocked if Adama turned out to be the dying leader and the day after the reveal, Ron Moore gave an interview saying "Yeah, I lied about that in the last interview because I didn't want to ruin the surprise - it was for your own good." -
Jan 30, 2009 3:13:11 PM CST
Nuked The Earth and Moved The Island are the new Jump The Shark
by stabby
Just kidding, but R D Moore has some serious splainin' to do. Why are Baltar and Doc Coddle not examining the Final Four and Starbuck to find out what makes them different? It is seriously annoying how something so obvious is completely ignored. Almost as annoying how characters in Lost do not ask the obvious questions when opportunity presents itself and do not tell each other what just happened to them.
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He dies on that bed in that orange room, watching film of deer and meadows and beautiful ocean sunsets, just after telling Charlton Heston that Soylent Green is people!
Soylent Blue is cylons! -
...lets all settle down on this planet we've found since, with seven continents (including one on the bottom and that one on the western hemisphere with the giant wang-like peninsula) and we all spread out, be fruitful and multipy and never speak of that nuked Earth we found EVER again!
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Even though the shocking twist isn't possible to preserve, I recently rewatched the movie, thanks to TNT and its held up alright, but they really could have made it a deeper story. That world has room for more than one story at least. Maybe that's what they should do... not remake but indirect sequel.
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my buddie sand I that watch the show have a running gag now where we imagine they were all part of a band called the "watchtower 5" or whatever with visuals somewhat like The Who. They actually were all nobodies who were playing in a shitty nightclub the day the nukes went off, and it is a shear coincidence they got to where they are.
I wish this wasn't the last season so we could at least have the female cylons play Charlie's Angels episode.
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Jan 30, 2009 3:52:12 PM CST
whats faster: a StarGate, FTL drive, Warp drive or a Hyper drive
by boomers_lips
So, which is faster?
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Russell is in a pile of leaves.
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That makes Stargate the winner. But if you want just a drive then the other three should about tie. But time still changes quickly for those outside the drive. The one thing about Star Trek that never made sense. The only time it did was some alien grabbed the Enterprise and whipped it to the edge of the galaxy.
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Jan 30, 2009 4:04:48 PM CST
MurderMostFowl, Deadset joke about ending prematurely.
by evilwizardglick
Deadset the Brit Zombie show had a cool scene where the characters were listing things that ended prematurely because of the Zombies. Lost was mentioned but Dr. Who received the most regret.
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Changing into ultra geek mode here,but I've got to say Stargates are the fastest. The chain of Stargates in Atlantis have been illustrated to bridge two galaxies together in minutes, which if the pegasus galaxy is supposed to be the real pegasus galaxy, that's about 1Million LIghtyears away.
Warp drive, in the star trek universe is vastly slower, take for example Voyager is lost merely on one side of our Milky way , and the whole premise is that they would not be able to get home by convential warp drive.
FTL in BSG is even more limited, seemingly.
Stay Wars' Hyperdrive, I don't know... I'm not enough of a SW geek to say.
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I think the one aspect you're forgetting is the "This has all happened before, and will all happen again" aspect to the show. Yes, the humans created the Cylons in the resent past, but that's humans from Caprica and humans in this modern timeline. But if everything in Battlestar is a cyclical, then that same thing has happened before. Tigh and others may be ancient Cylons from a different point in the cycle of time.
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Even with it's dated 70s look the movie is great and relevant and set in a very possible future. I always wondered what Soylent Blue and Orange and all the other colours were made off if green was human. Nobody touch the Soylent Brown!
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Biggest TV letdown ever. I mean i saw it coming like so many of us did, but still kind of a bummer so far. I'm hoping Starbuck's storyline makes up for it tenfold. Leoben's freaked out face in that field made my day.
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around 2000 years ago some or all of the earflings were experimenting with some kind of linear immortality. Upload their minds in to artificially created bodies as needed when dying. Then there was a catastrophic war. Only a few earflings were keyed into the system, woke up in orbit or where ever. Knowing that earf was now poisonous they set out in slow ships towards the 12 colonies. Not having the supplies or wanting to dies dozens if not hundreds of times during the 2000 year trip they put themselves in some kind of suspended animation to sleep their way thru the trip.
About 40 years ago to 50 years ago, towards the end of the colonies / cylons war, the cylons discovered the earflings. During some phase of examining the earflings they discovered that they were artificially created and set about creating their own artificially created humans. Whatever their motivation. Whatever the earflings compliance.
The earflings apparently have their memories altered and are released.
So it appears that the cylons made 7 models and set about to defeat the colonies once and for all.
One thing that has been bugging me is how these rebellious robots (the toasters) are so obedient to the human cylons. And how the human cylons treat the toasters, esp calvil. He alters them to be even less autonomous. And the toasters pretty much let him until other human cylons set them against calvil.
In fact the whole cylon society seems to be set up for the 7. Ships are designed for their comfort. The 7 eat, sleep, attempt to procreate, occasionally some do have to act as sleeper spys and risk temporary death. With calvil being the big whiner about discomfort.
The relationship between the earlings, the human cylons and the toaster cylons isn't fully fleshed out for us yet. -
it's time to make baltar king or whatever again, threaten to cali's ghost or whatever out an air lock again, time for apollo to change jobs again, starbuks overdue to attack someone and end up in the brig again.
Theres still a few eps left. More than enough for 2 boxing eps and every ep can be a mutiny ep now and a few of chars getting drunk and telling the old man off eps -
I think others have said this already but... it's all a cycle. These events take place over and over again like a time loop. So 2000 years ago (or more since the nucclear attack was 2000 years ago) human-like Cylons colonized Earth (or what they think is Earth). And it's all destined to happen again!! I won't reveal what has been revealed as the final svene in the series, but for those who know, it bears this out.
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What's crawled up his ass? Oh wait, that's Mr. Hoshi... HIYOOOOO
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I'll be vague, baby. Promise.
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Saul is gobsmacked.
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The Adventures of The Gimptactular Gaeta
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ski legs, like in the Nike commercial. Either that or go totally old school with a peg leg.
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He can't carry his own weight on the peg leg.
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That throws a wrench into things.
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How long does he think he's going to hide this???
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you are supposed to play five pin bowling that way...
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but her instincts are spot on.
WHO LET GAETA HAVE THE PHONE??? Seriously, you can imagine how Uhura could have fucked up everyone on Enterprise. -
this show is giving me fucking PTSD. that was the coolest thing Starbuck has ever done.
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Time to shine Kara!
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He's not leading a mutiny here... this is just flat out anarchy he's started.
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...you have won the talkback line of the evening! LOL
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Should have smoked Racetrack, Connor, Skulls and the Marine on the spot.
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Kara Thrace > Harry Callahan
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"Follow me, please." Damn hot!
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I could watch her do that all day too.
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I was just *wishing* for that to happen!! I'm such a horndog :D
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a whole lot a motherfuckers need to die. Id space the whole crew at this point, right after I blew a whole in every limb.
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it's rape the cylon day again
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Gaeta's own Mutiny on the Bounty. His brain his broke. However, no forgiveness, bitch.
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And I hope to Gods Adama is behind the trigger.
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I expected Adama to blow Gaeta's head off. Kill the little gimp.
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Jan 30, 2009 9:33:00 PM CST
"Mr. Gaeta, Now that you've mutinied, what are you going to do?"
by ds9sisko
"I'm going to Disneyworld!"
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This one is really well written. Lots of emotion.
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Do you know another actor on TV with his intensity? Gods...
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for the mutiny. Must always keep up appearances.
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Whatta weasel.
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Jan 30, 2009 9:41:33 PM CST
"Live or die, when this is over there will be a reckoning"
by memento108
BADASS.
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covering Adama & Saul. Lucky them. I did like the "reckoning" bit though.
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just got a wake up call.
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Can I post that?
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Adama still has his moral core intact but Starbuck has the mind set to get things done in this situation.
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The fleet has heard form the Prez. Adama is free and armed, and Gaeta is running out of breathing allies.
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instead of boxing day
While well acted and very dramatic and all
It advances the overall story and ties up loose plot lines not at all -
when he heard Baltar was on the phone.
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Save the baldy smut for your bunk!!
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The Gimpulator
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WORKED UP!!
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WOW. I wanna watch it NOW.
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Treason. Treasonous. To be treasonable. Ironic Gimp must die soon.
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I will not be able to sleep!! What a great episode! Next week cannot come soon enough!
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And Gaeta is going to shit in his one-legged pants.
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Why would they give that away?
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After I fix my wig. Damn 7 day wait!
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weren't going to be ending tragically. but i wouldn't put it past this show to space Olmos next week to give us something to really cry about.
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The return of Captain Kelly.
Next week Narcho Hotdog dogfight.
Lost is in danger of loosing its crown as best show on TV. -
"sitting on the edge of your seats" must have time traveled and seen this episode! Not only was it one the most exciting, gripping episodes of BSG ever, the direction and editing were some of the best of the series! Fantastic!
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had all the intensity and drama of the first series run. The first half hour felt like a 2-hour miniseries.
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Not wrapped up in a nice, neat bow at the end of the hour. With more apocalypse ahead. I am in awe of this show.
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in the last 2 weeks to get to this point. Now that I can't watch episodes back to back with no interruption i'm upset.
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it made me rock out with my cock out! and that doesn't usually happen when i'm eatin chips
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both of which I quit earlier this year. I swear to fuck this show can drive a man to drink.
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What a fucking awesome episode. Starbuck plugging the mutineers on the flight deck was pretty damn slick. As for next week, I'm thinking the Saul is dead bit is a red herring. They wouldn't kill him off...yet.
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Airlock the motherfrakers. So say we all!!!
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That was fraking insane...I don't think I can take 7 more episodes if they keep this up...
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Anyone complaining that last week was treading water was just made tonight's episode's bitch.
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walking around all week with a major hard-on waiting for the next episode
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Most intense episode since the New Caprica battle. Classic.
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Holy crap that was amazing, and, to INActionMan: while I do love LOST (and I do), that show is but the popcorn you eat while waiting for new Galactica.
Only 7 eps left.... -
There's BSG - and then there's everybody else. No show on TV delivered more bang for the buck than tonight's epic. And I'ma gonna miss it because I'll be in New York for NY Comic Con. That's what DVR's are for, then. :D
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Man I've been really hating Galatica for most of this season, but tonights episode just brought me back on the bandwagon. THIS, is what always made galactica great, the political machinations and backstabbing. Man I'm so happy right now.
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Lt. Felix Gaeta IS The Gimpanator
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The Wire and The Shield gave as much bang for the buck. Other than that, So Say We All. BSG is the best science-fiction (and actual hard SF, not science-fantasy crap like Stargate or Lost) series ever.
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Adama is just a sad old man who let his friendship with Tigh cloud his judgment. Obviously, Adama will win in the end, but he doesn't deserve to. This show started with a reasonable mistrust of the Cylons and nothing has happened to restore that trust. If anything, they should have learned to trust them less. Networking with Cylon computers is clearly treason, and as much as I wouldn't want to risk making him a martyr, they need to take the old man down. He precipitated a civil war just cause he wanted to make the ships fly a little faster. That is batshit insane and the result has clearly proven what a bad commander he is. I'm thinking that RDM spends too much time smoking crack with the writers of 24. Both shows portray evil, incompetent leaders as the good guys. Adama use to be cool, now he deserves a quick execution. Way to make me hate all your "heroes" RDM.
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did i see a clip of the pregnant six kicking ass?!?! i don't see how I can wait another week. starbuck is kickass, zarek/gaeta are dumb as frak, cavil's going to show up at some point with his nukes ready to go and gaeta the gimp is in charge? reallly? really? how about lee adama running around with bloody spray on his face? best show since galactica jumped into new caprica's atmosphere... awesome, abso-frakkin-lutely awesome. zarek must die, and helo needs to kill him.. with his bare frakkin' hands.
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i like starbuck feelin sexy by blowing away those stupid humans. keep up the good work starbuck.
max 1.75 episodes until adama forgives everyone. yay! -
Your thesis there, I think, revolves around one central claim: "This show started with a reasonable mistrust of the Cylons and nothing has happened to restore that trust." On that, I'm going to have to say that you're wrong. The first example is obviously Athena. The second example is that the Cylon rebels have themselves fought alongside Colonials in destroying the Resurrection Hub at great personal cost to themselves. Even when Adama had two battlestars at his command the Colonials were still out-gunned by the Cylons. While the Cylon basestar may not have its fighter complement, it still has potentially dozens of nukes, and a much more advanced jump drive. While Adama may not much like it, a military alliance with the Cylon rebels greatly increases his ability to protect the fleet. He's making the right call for the right reasons.
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...they've gotten stabbed in the back. Why are all of you siding with Adama in this? I'm sure they'll make it the right thing to do in the end (cause RDM will write it that way), but there has been no basis for assuming that. You're all way too sentimental over Adama. I'm with the 11 intelligent colonies, not the fraking toaster lovers. The entire human race is on the line and Adama tells everyone to trust the backstabbing computers who may have hidden programming in them, ready to go off at any time. And keep in mind, that it's all just so they can fly a little faster. Even if that helps them find a planet quicker, it precipitated a civil war, with most of the fleet against Adama and Roslin, for very little real benefit. Surely some of you must see this clearly. It's mind boggling.
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Quite the contrary - the revelation of earth's demise is a paradigm shattering event. Adama is proving he's an excellent commander by adapting to a new paradigm. His only fault is not doing a great job communicating the importance of the cylon alliance to the survival of humanity.
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And what did Athena do in the webisodes? She murdered on person after another. What did she do to Adama, who she clearly loved, she shot him. It wasn't even her choice. She had hidden programming. It's not about earning their trust, once she pulled that trigger, the Cylons proved themselves forever untrustworthy.
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I gotta agree with bullet3, easily the best since Exodus, pt. II. Which in my mind was the finest hour of the series, and one of TV's greatest hours ever.
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Wrong Number 8, _Maltheus_.
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ATHENA was not the one in the web episodes ATHENA was not the one who shot Adama. Do you even WATCH the show???
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So Say We All!
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What - you mean like Gaeta and Zarek are doing now?
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You may have a point that, regardless of the obvious technological and military benefits to the alliance, that the alliance should have been avoided due to the inevitable controversy. That, I should think, could have been avoided and can be attributed to a failure of leadership: mainly, Laura Roslin's pity-party over the last three episodes. Also, while you justly criticized 24 a few posts ago, I think you're making a "ticking time-bomb" argument here: "The entire human race is on the line and Adama tells everyone to trust the backstabbing computers who may have hidden programming in them, ready to go off at any time." If the rebel Cylons wanted to destroy the fleet, they could do so at any time. They have nukes that they could launch before any of the Colonials could jump away. This was clearly elucidated in 4x10 - Revelations. What would be the point of engaging in subterfuge to hide a rogue program in the Colonials jump-drive when they could just nuke the fleet out of existence? Would that not be an excellent bargaining chip to get back into Cavil's good graces too? "Hi Cavil, we're back! Oh, and we destroyed the Colonial fleet. Can we be friends again?" The rebel Cylons have nothing to gain by betraying the Colonials right now.
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...just a few episodes ago, she turned on their alliance and took a bunch of them hostage and threatened to destroy the fleet. I mean, you can't keep rolling a hard six every time. And you should never gamble with the lives of the entire human race. They were better off just using the final five as hostages. And now that they know the identity of all the Cylons, they can control them and keep them from keep on leaking their location to the others.
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... all those Number 8's look alike to him.
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but since you cunts can't help bashing Lost needlessly I'm out of here.
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They're killing in self defense. I'm not saying I like Gaeta and Zarek, but they're on the right side of this, even if it's for all the wrong reasons. As for Athena vs. Boomer vs. any other 8, whatever! What difference does it make. They're all the same model, capable of the same deceit.
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Enjoy your never-ending stream of unanswered questions, and character sacrificed for narrative!
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Lawl. The Simons too, right?
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Character sacrificed for narrative? Unanswered questions? Obviously you don't watch the show asshole. Enjoy your fascist fucking Mormon propaganda.
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and take your "time travel will solve all our ridiculous plot holes that were put there just to keep people watching" with you. oh yeah, what do the numbers mean?
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by one of the best hours of TV ever fucking made. HOLY FUCKING HELL!!!
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There've been several close-ups of Gaeta reacting to his itchy stump in the past 2 episodes. He's had time to deal with phantom pain and some excuse about using some new lotion. Sounds more like his leg is growing back. Perhaps he is a cylon too?
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Because I've been thinking it. I told my wife after last weeks episode that BSG was one of my least favorite shows that is in my "favorite show" list. The protagonist's of the show are all completely selfish hypocrites. Zarek and Gaeta are RIGHT. Lee was spot on when he was talking to Tigh. The cylons are the enemy. They destroyed their home and almost wiped humanity out completely. Fuck an alliance. But then again, Lee was the one who shook their hands and took them to Earth. These characters piss me off so much. I wanted Gaeta and Zarek to kill all these whiny bitches and get the war with the cylons back on. Then this week happened. The shit started hitting the fan, and all I wanted to see happen was for Adama to take his ship back and kill every rat mother fucker who crossed him. So you know what, I'm a hypocrite too. Call the show anything, but it's realistic in that regard. People do change their minds on a whim, they preach one thing and do another, they are flawed, they are selfish, they do make mistakes and they end up pissing people off. This was an awesome episode. Probably my favorite of the show yet. I told my wife tonight to disregard what I said to her last week. She rolled her eyes at me.
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Wait, I thought you were leaving?!
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Finding a planet is a civilian decision. Jumping any distance is enough for Adama to effect any military escape. That is unless you mistakenly trust a bunch of Cylons, who may reveal your location (like in 33). The only reason they gave for jumping three times as far was to find a planet quicker. But of course, as we saw in the decision to settle on New Caprica, that falls within the realm of civilian decision making. And the vote was overwhelming not to do this.
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You're spot-on there. Lee Adama has the exactly perfect reaction to this crisis. He doesn't want to work with the Cylons, but he's smart enough to recognize the benefits in doing so. He's smart enough to sublimate his personal feelings to make the right choice.
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Jan 30, 2009 11:03:07 PM CST
Hypocrisy is what keeps the stories "real" and interesting
by proziumjunkie
and y'all know it
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He recognizes that Zarek is right, but he's siding with his father because he's his father and he doesn't want to see him die. Come to think of it, pretty much everyone who doesn't have a Cylon buddy is against putting the entire fate of the fleet in their hands. It's the protagonists who are ruled by feelings why everyone else is taking the logical position.
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Anyone else notice how Gaeta kept calling Adama "Admiral Adama" while he was relieving him of command? Totally awesome on the part of the writers... Gaeta doesn't even realize how much he still respects Adama, even as he's relieving him of command because of his own petty bullshit. He's the most half-human/half-robot of all of them.
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don't get me wrong, it was an amazing episode. one of the best of the entire series. but i really thought we were about to find out what was behind Baltar and Gaeta's little "secret."
also, forgive my memory, but have the cylons yet apologized to tigh for taking his eyeball? for that matter, why was he the only one tortured in that manner? for a long time, i was convinced that we would finally found out he had done it to himself to foment rebellion. -
Remember the election Roslin tried to steal? Baltar won because the peoplw wanted to settle down on New Caprica. Roslin and Adama knew it was a mistake from the beginning.
They couldn't stay by Earth - Cavil and his boys are still hunting them down. To stay still would be suicide. -
It reminds me of watching Deep Space Nine. It would have been April 21, 1999 when episode 7x19 - Strange Bedfellows aired. That's the episode where the Breen joined the Dominion and Cardassians. After the episode finished, they put on commercials touting the final seven episodes of DS9. If you've watched DS9, you know that those final seven episodes were FUCKING INCREDIBLE and tied up EVERY plotline on the series. While I love DS9 (and consider it the best Trek series), I have to admit that it's not as good as BSG. The first of the final seven episodes (that's awkward...) featured the destruction of the Defiant. If RDM did something like that on DS9, stop and think for a second about what he's going to give us next Friday on BSG.
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What an amazing episode. So fantastic to see the fighting side of our colonial heroes! It's so easy to forget that these are millitary people, soldiers at their core and they can fucking throw down when it's time to strap it on. ONE HELLAVA SHOW!
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3fObaejFOE Deep Space Nine: The Final Chapter!
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I know the civilians wanted New Caprica, that was my point. They wanted it and they got it because it was within their legal authority to do so. Just like the decision to find a new planet faster is as well. Installing faster jump drives is not a military decision, it's a civilian one, in the context that they've established for the show. Now that doesn't mean I agreed with the New Caprica decision, since they hadn't rooted out all the Cylons in their fleet at that point (in fact I was steaming mad about it at the time). But now that they have, I don't see why they even need an alliance. Space is huge and the only way the Cylons could track them is through their hidden collaborators. They may still have supply worries, but they shouldn't have to worry about Cavil anymore (in theory).
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"I could do this all day" was the hottest sci fi tv moments ever!
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He wanted to have a Battlestar all his own. With the Admiral and Colonel Tighe out of the way and Agathon in lockup it's Gaeta's ship. Now he can have it painted pink and he can have Caprican androgynous boy band music piped through the sound system.
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Boomer has to get naked and pull a train with the whole fleet. Preferably available as a pay-per-view event. I have to say, though - that episode rocked. You know how I know it rocked, because it made my brain orgasm on the inside of my skull.
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Is he pro- All Life or just Pro Human? Does it matter? The rebels need him as much as the Adama supporters. He's the only known doctor.
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Not in the least. Rosslyn hit the nail on the head. he's a master of self preservation. See how he asks Tyrol "do I have to go?" while he's thinking "please don't make me stay."
He'd leave his Sex Disciples to the mercy of the rebels.
You have to love to hate the frakkin bastard.
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The proper way to do this would have been "We're upgrading Galactica with Cylon technology to jump 3 times farther. If you want continued protection, we suggest you do the same. Otherwise, say hi to the REAL 'evil cylons' for us when they inevitably catch up to you."
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Tonight, and another time, some seasons ago: in the thick of it in her viper, all hell breaking loose, she looked back over her shoulder and gave this cackling joyful laugh.She has the wing tattoo, and the Hybrid mentioned "on the wings of an angel"Could she be an Archangel Michael type? "I could do this all day." and "Follow me.... PLEASE!" were the best lines of this episode.
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And I mean this in the best possible way:
1)Jackson Public & Doc Hammer "The Venture Brothers"
2)Ron Moore and Company "Battlestar Galactica"
3)Damon Lindelof "Lost"
BSG could move to the number one spot if they tie up what ever happened to Bulldog.
PS
Ron Moore's podcast is up.
PPS Speedbumped if you want to know what Baltar whispered in Gaeta's ear you need to watch face of the enemy part 9.
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I love the way he uses that single eye--pure genius to have written that in back when.His wide eye reaction to Roslin coming out for coffee was Fantastic!
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I have a feeling that Cottle would be more than happy to tell BOTH Adama and Gaeta to get the frak out of his sick bay right now. He would probably designate sick bay as a neutral area until the leadership conflict is resolved. And with the way Cottle would say it, I don't think anyone would argue.
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and tonight they got their eyeballs fubar'd
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That's the problem. Adama has basically issued the order by fiat decree. Adama doesn't do diplomacy, he does Chain of Command, and he sees the fleet's technical capabilities as a military matter. As I said earlier, this whole crisis could have been avoided if Laura Roslin had done her job and kept the lid on Tom Zarek.
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Jan 30, 2009 11:35:41 PM CST
Holy Fucking Shit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by picardsucks
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Really? Because they use projectile based weapons.Fucking Helo, that motherfucker couldn't buy break with all the money in the fleet.
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i'm betting he sharted!
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Even if Zarek wasn't a factor, don't you think the colonies would have still had a problem with accepting Cylon technology forced on them by, let's face it, a bunch of Cylons and their buddies? It's like asking a bunch of Jews to trust the Nazis and install gas chambers in their own houses because Churchill grew up with one of them. Season 1 has showed us that it's not really a military matter since jumping, even a small distance, is like burying a needle in a haystack. The only way Cavil could find them is through a Cylon snitch or by tracking their own networked technology as it jumps.
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Jan 30, 2009 11:49:50 PM CST
Katee Sackhoff reveals some info about the final episode!!!!!
by boomers_lips
at some con over in the UK recently she was asked if she had any regrets about BSG, she said she regretted that the show didn't give Starbuck & Leoben closure, she wished they had resolved their story together because she said Starbuck kinda loved him too. when they asked her who she wanted Starbuck to end up with in the end, she answered that Starbuck ends up with exactly the person that she wanted to be with. Link to this article can be found at www.GalacticaSitrep.blogspot.com
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sealed with a very special pen? Is he referencing gaeta's attempt on baltar's life? i didn't think that was a secret.
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Jan 31, 2009 12:02:54 AM CST
The Secret is that Sweet Eight ordered Colonials be killed!
by boomers_lips
in flashbacks, Sweet Eight and Gayta would meet in secret to frak and he would give her lists of names of people in detention that he wanted freed. Sweet Eight double crossed him and told another Eight to kill everyone from his lists. Apparently this went on for quite sone time. Baltar whispered to Gayta that he knew what he & Sweet Eight were doing the whole time. Thats why Gayta flipped out and stabbed Baltar in the neck. so I guess Sweet Eight wasn't particularly sweet at all!
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Yes, I think Roslin and Zarek are the key players here. Roslin could have easily handled the Quorum and Fleet Captains if Zarek hadn't been allowed free reign to foment rebellion. As far as Cavil tracking them goes, obviously jumping _isn't_ enough to hide the fleet from the Cylons, as they've managed to track them for several years now. We do know that the reason the Cylons were able to ambush the fleet at the nebula was due to the radiation signature they were tracking from the tylium refinery ship, and then having the superior range/speed to jump the to the nebula _before_ the fleet arrived. IIRC, Gina 6 and the Cavils were the last of the regular seven models to be hidden in the fleet (or Caprica resistance). The identities of the regular seven have been well known since New Caprica, so I highly doubt that there could be any remaining Cylons hidden in the fleet to be transmitting their coordinates. Essentially, the Cylons have used their superior numbers (of basestars, and jump-capable heavy raiders) and range to jump to system after system just blindly searching for the Colonials. Trebling the fleet's range to equal that of the Cylons would be an incredible change in the balance of power between the Colonials and Cylons.
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Gaeta you done back the horse in this race bubba.
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the next time he goes down on the mutinous basterd, I hope he comes back up with Gaeta's bitten off cock!
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Over on the official boards there's another poster who made the connection between Gaeta's homosexuality (bisexuality, really, as was also revealed in the same webisodes that established his willingness to engage in a homosexual relationship, funny that people are willing to ignore that) with Gaeta being a "bad" person.
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as an example of trustworthiness?
Would that be when she obviously lied about not knowing what the picture of a resurrection ship was or deliberately not identifying Cavil to the others on Caprica. That plus being a traitor to her own people often as a general rule would tend to make people wary of her, you'd think. After all if someone can turn once, what stops them from doing it again? -
...and then is resurrected, only to meet Ellen again? Hmm?
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poor Hoshi. The ultimate betrayal. Hoshi might be forced to kill Gaeta since he's the only one who can get close to him. *sob*
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...gets rid of the eyepatch!
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I guess I don't remember the Cylons tracking the Tyllium refinery, but that wouldn't make any sense to me given that the radiation shouldn't be able to be tracked since it doesn't exceed the speed of light. That was the reason it took them so long to find them at New Caprica, because the nuclear blast took a year or so to be noticed and it was only by luck that the Cylons had a ship close enough by to catch it in time. And if this were the case, then they should be focusing on shielding the Tyllium ship better.
As for the hidden models now being well known, that's why I think that now is finally the time to make a run for it. Just keep jumping in one direction and you'd lose them forever.
And there is no level of numerical superiority that should make it possible to just stumble across the Colonials. I believe they even made that point in 33. The universe is just too vast, especially when you're talking about FTL drives. Why didn't the Cylons use their numbers to find Earth, if that had been the case? -
Athena was still in chains then, not a uniform. I am not surprised that she was not willing to give full disclosure and trust at that point. She was still evaluating whether the Colonials were worthy of her switching alliances, or if Helo was the only one she could trust. Since being readmitted to the military, she has only once taken action detrimental to the Fleet (killing Natalie, and Adama has forgiven her for that, given that she did it out of fear for her child). I assume her reasoning would have been that perhaps the Caprica resistance Cavil was a sleeper, and that she might be betraying the confidence of someone with no knowledge of his origin. I also find it a dangerous opinion that no one who ever switches allegiance can ever be fully trusted in their new allegiance. Although, Athena might actually agree with you, if you recall her line to the other Eight while on the rebel basestar prior to their attack on the Resurrection Hub. "You guys make me sick." "Why?" "Because you pick your side and you stick. You don't cut and run when things get ugly. Otherwise, you'll never have anything. No love, no family, no life to call your own." Incidentally, that is probably the best reason that Athena would never betray the fleet: her husband and daughter are there. She even went to the extraordinary lengths to resurrect on a basestar to retrieve her daughter and bring her back to the fleet and the Galactica. Athena has chosen her side, and she's not going to betray it.
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That has had me worried now for a bit about BSG...that it might have a ending like DS9. Rhuragh, your right, the last episodes of DS9 did rock, except for the final that, to me, feel completely on it's face. Everything felt so forced as they tied up all the plot lines. Most criminal of all was the final confrontation between Sisko and Dukat, something that had been building for years on the show, was a complete let down. Now I don't know if that Ron Moore's fault or not. It might have been out of his control. Just hoping that it all comes together for BSG.
Sorry didn't mean to tread jack... -
Gaeta and Zarek are going to get airlocked. Also, I gotta say Richard Hatch has some acting chops. I'm surprised he doesn't get more work.
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Because that fist along with her entire arm are going to be rammed up his corn hole.Did Gaeta really cop to being a nancy boy in the webisodes? Shit like that is why I hate webisodes. Put it in the show.
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...how amazing that episode was. "it was a pleasure serving w/ you my friend." Beautiful. Truly one of the best episodes I've seen in some time. It all came together...characters (re)became who they should be...Lee has stopped being a political pansy and is back in action...frakkin' beautiful. Cannot wait to re-watch this episode.
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It is notable that Anders told Athena he had no special wisdom on what to do (Her reply about keeping that a secret was funny IMHO).What Anders does have is the ability to turn back Cylon raiders - or ability to get them to stand down simply because of who he is, depending on your POV.Tracking the tyllium ship or not, Cavil still has to contend with the true nature of the Final Five. If Anders or one of the other FF intervenes again (e.g. Anders and the raiders) when Cavil attacks, the question of loyalty will be answered.
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They didn't shed any light on which side of the mutiny he was on. He wasn't on the bridge when Gaeta's coup d'état took over, so I'm assuming he sided with Adama.
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She would've known exactly what to do with those mutineers.
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Baltar's/Tigh's Caprica Six revealed the radiation problem on the tylium refinery in Crossroads, Part I at the end of the third season. That's why they had the tylium refinery taking an alternate course to the nebula accompanied only by raptors.
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"Most criminal of all was the final confrontation between Sisko and Dukat"
That wasn't a confrotation, it was the definition of antclimatic.
It would have been better if they had a overhand limp wristed whirlwind girly slap fight -
Jan 31, 2009 12:54:31 AM CST
Complaints about the final Sisko/Dukat confrontation aside...
by rhuragh
I don't think anyone can argue that the overall resolution (Sisko presumed dead, and with the Prophets, Dukat dead as well), never mind the particulars of the event, was still great. Beyond that, there was a HELL of a lot of incredible events in the final seven episodes. The destruction of the Defiant. The Worf/Gowron/Martok events. The Rom/Quark/Zek events. The resolution of the war itself. Ok, threadjack over. Now I'm going to go watch the seventh season....
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Unfortunately, Anders does NOT possess the ability to get the raiders to retreat. If you recall the origins of the Cylon civil war, Cavil, Simon, Doral, and Boomer voted to lobotomize the raiders such that they wouldn't have the intelligence or will to choose to disengage like that.
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Since they get another ship, like two episodes later, that is called the Defiant and looks exactly like the old one, the destruction of the first never had much impact. Anyway I still like DS9, warts and all and I love BSG...now this time I mean it, no more threadjacking...I'm going to bed.
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i thought i clearly saw him being led off to the brig and him and Gaeta exchanging some harsh looks
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I guess I didn't catch that part of the show.
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the show blows.
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I forgot about that. Athena shooting dead the leader of a group who had recently been enemies while things were so precarious - and for the reasons that she did (a dream no less) would make most observers think she was mentally unstable on top of everything else and at best should be handled with extremely long tongs.
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Was perhaps the best Star Trek season overall, even if much of it was borrowed from B5. All of them coming together to fight the Jem'Hadar was better than any Borg confrontation IMO. But yeah, the Dukat storyline was definitely weak. In fact, I'd say weakest parts of BSG parallel that with the visions and prophecies. RDM needs desperately to stay away from mysticism.
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Sentimentality, CloseLight. A rose by any other name...
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that might explain things. Gettin' sleepy. Night night. Show still blows.
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are you a lil wayne fan? anyway, i just listened to moore's podcast and it turns out that the hoshi / gaeta relationship was only figured out when they shot the webisodes - AFTER the entire series had wrapped. if they hadn't, there'd be more scenes, he said. funny how my viewing those webisodes though made the scenes where they were disagreeing loaded with some kind subtext that wasn't even there.
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I see two unanswered questions in that regard.1. Even lobotomized, Cylon raiders still retain some form of AI to engage in space dogfights with Vipers. So is it possible for the post lobotomized technology to be influenced by a FF member?2. Are we sure about what Anders and the rest of the FF CAN or CANNOT do?I noted that particular scene with Athena because it underscores one MAJOR thing - the ultimate and true nature of the Final Five is yet to be revealed.Just a couple thoughts.
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Just amazing TV.
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Jan 31, 2009 1:47:55 AM CST
why can't the Cylons just build more Ressurection Hubs/Ships, sp
by boomers_lips
I would think that the Cavil-ry would do that to bolster their troops numbers. unless the Cylons are not as smart as we thought.
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we knew they had it in them to deliver great episodes like this - pity they only seemed to average one a season but we'll take what we can get, right?
can they sustain it?
I surely hope so - and SO SAY WE ALL! -
Apollo hit on it by foreshadowing "It's almost as if we have no choice but to choose the Cylons, like they planned it."
Now the words from season 1 haunt me "There are 12 models, 6 are known, 5 are unknown... and they have a plan."
What IF - they set up the "dead earth" all along, what if they let Galactic go - what if they programmed it so a small portion of their own rebelled and joined the humans. So now, key humans are converted - the rest can be justifiably wiped out now because they just started a civil war with their own humans. What if the Cylon plan was to get Adama and Starbuck and Roslyn and all the humans that would follow on their side. What if the "final 5" are not Cylons at all, but humans that were captured and programmed to have these memories and to "think" that they are Cylons just so that it becomes harder for the humans to differentiate between Cylon and Human.
What if this is the plan... and it's all happening exactly like they hoped.
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just wow. awesome awesome awesome.
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I'm so fucking giddy, this is what it all has come to, every single episode has been worth it to get to this point, even black market, it was like watching an awesome action movie in 42 minutes. I was as excited as a Detroit audience watching Madea goes to Jail, throwing my hands to the air and praising the Lord. Everyone had a shinning moment, Starbuck back to form, the old men kicking ass, Roslin fighting for love. fuck yes!! fuck fuck yes! Ron Moore you own my fucking soul
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They really should have had a moment between Hoshi and Gaeta, seeing as they were lovers and Gaeta threw him in the Brig, it would have made for good drama
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The Cylons have never forgotten the sneak attack by the twelve human colonies on the thirteenth (their kin) 2,000 years before.
Adama, Roslin, et al, are in complicity with a vengeance obsessed enemy.
You'll see. ;-) -
Came home from happy hour...passed out. Missed the show at 10. Wok up and watched it On Demand: THAT WAS FRAKKIN AWESOME!!!!! That's probably one of the best BSG episodes sine New Caprica, or even Season 1! If the remaining episodes are like this, then we are in for a treat. Will be sad to see this series go. Just hope it goes away on a high note
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my thoughts exactly right on!
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= Baltar and Gaeta fucked each other.
My guess. -
someone, (Hoshi would be good, Adama would be better,) rip off Gaeta's artificial leg and beat him to death with it.
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he truly understood, maybe better than anyone in the fleet, the consequences of Baltar's initial blind acceptance of Cylon technology - he even mentioned to Baltar at one point what a weight he must be burdened with, knowing it was HIS computerised systems which gave the Cylons the backdoor to effortlessly and nearly completely annihilate mankind...
-that and all his other shit aside, tho, Adama's got a BETTER point!
he's wearing a Fleet uniform - he's military - and the ONE thing the military DRILL into you from DAY ONE is you DO NOT second-guess your superiors! you do not PRESUME that you possess the facts and the judgement and the AUTHORITY to disobey or even question command!
that whole "you ALONE get to make that determination?" bit - that's fuckin bullshit that Adama should have not let stand with just a pithy "you have a problem with that?"
Zarek, sure, I buy his end of this no problems but the one thing I found a little (just a little) hard to swallow was all the MARINES - especially the ex-PEGASUS Marines who followed Admiral Cain's command WITHOUT question - jumping on board this whole insurrection band-wagon.
ok I get they kinda ran out of "real" soldiers at some point and had to draft people or whatever - but did they skip BASIC TRAINING?
the rebels have been so free and easy with the murder of PEOPLE for their apparently anti-Cylon cause - again, I buy Zarek being ok with this - with so far NO Cylon casualties, while the humans-still-living tally slowly diminishes...
that's just a little bit beyond hypocrisy -
and it's below his his kneecap.
His motivation is seeped in bitterness compounded with a point to prove. It's a classic downfall scenario. -
Yeah, I think I'm the only person on this Talkback who hasn't seen the final season of DS9 yet. I didn't watch it when it was on, so I've been on a quest to watch the entire show since mid-December. I'd midway through Season 6, and: WOW! This show is really good! And it's fun to see so many Battlestar names coming up. The episode I'm watching was written by Weddle & Thompson.
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He keeps trying to do the right thing and it keeps biting him - badly.
Points out the election theft - resulting administration does very badly and thousands are killed.
Tries to work with administration - see above for fallout. Tries to give information to rebels to make up for it - nearly gets airlocked for his trouble (though why he didn't tell everyone straight away ... I'll leave that up to the screenwriter.
Later discovers that attempts to get people saved is actually getting them killed.
Goes to obey an order and loses his leg. That would really suck
I could see how after all of that, you might just flip out a bit. Also, with Helo and Athena repeatedly being given a pass (and promotions) for every wrong thing they do - well you might just feel just a bit bitter especially when you have the exact opposite happening from trying to follow orders. Eventually you might think that "well if I break the rules too"...
If the show is true to form, I wouldn't be completely surprised if Gaeta is the new Admiral by the end of the show. -
You all know the pen! The pen that Baltar signed the execution orders with on New Caprica was also the pen Gaeta used to make up the list of people Boomer had executed. It was also the pen smuggled to Baltar to write his manifesto and later smuggled to Six as some sign of trust or something by the lawyer. They're ALL the same Godsdamned PEN! The pen factory, which was on Libran (my home world), was one of the first sites nuked. Them pens are in short supply now.
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...wasn't used to hide nuclear destruction, it was to hide the shape of the continents on the planet. When they find another planet to survive on, Ron Moore won't let us see the continents on that one until he reveals the BIG twist. "Hey isn't that North America?"
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Nice ref, tangcameo. SNL looks upon those seasons like a girl with a better prom dress.
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"It's like asking a bunch of Jews to trust the Nazis and install gas chambers in their own houses because Churchill grew up with one of them."...or it's like asking a county, say like the United States, to give amnesty to Nazis who had valuable information on weaponry and the Soviet Union. Oh wait, that's already happened! Clearly sides don't compromise certain "standards" when it's a matter of security or power. Anyways, You'll note that the models who are currently with the humans are also the models (if I remember correctly) that voted NOT to exterminate all the humans on New Caprica. The ideological split occurred long before the Final 5 bit, and honestly shit isn't black and white despite what romantic notions you seem to hold to the contrary. For instance, using your example: All Nazis were evil and would slaughter Jews at a moments notice. Incorrect. You're making lump assumptions without even acknowledging individuals, ie, guilty by association. I would use a softer example using republicans, but I don't want to derail even further!
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"it's like asking the Jews to trust the Nazis". And with that statement comes the fundamental flaw in your thought process. Because the Nazis *were us*. There is no inherent difference between a Nazi, and you and me. The "Nazis" were just regular people who found themselves in a fucked up situation and allowed themselves to be led down the wrong path by all the same complex emotions and logical flaws that we all possess.
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...but don't understand it. Maybe that is why they were always trying to have cylon children.And maybe one of the things special about the Five is that they DO somehow know about resurrection. Ellen & Tigh seemed pretty confident in that flashback....
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There are people who were duped by the evil Nazi ideology and their scapegoating of the Jews, but there were others who NEVER accepted it.That's the one of the key points of this episode IMHO. You have to be honorable, ethical, and wise enough to choose the right side and position.
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that theyre going to kill off the final 4 (3) one by one.
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Starbuck with 2 pistols blazing ready to rock. Adama letting Gaeta know that there will be a reckoning when the dust settles. Next weeks ep looks even better. President "Stands With Fist" living up to that name. "I coming for all of you." And what is it with the Pegasus crew members they can't wait to rape cylons.
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A great two seasons of outstanding drama and action: they should have ended it there. Now it's all pseudo-religious wishy-washiness. Jumped the shark a long time ago.
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Helo is a prime example of why Gaeta is right. How many times has Helo fracked up? And how many times did Adama push him out an airlock? I rest my case.
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Great point. Ellen was totally certain about the rebirth technology.Now we see why the fifth is so important, I guess. Her return should have a huge impact on everyone's understanding of Cylon know how.
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Director of Red Rock West and The Last Seduction.
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...pretty big difference between me and a Nazi. You can say that the Germans were just ordinary people who found themselves in a fucked up situation, but if you joined the Nazi party itself, then you've lost your soul IMO.
But of course, even though I started the analogy, it was a loose one and we're talking apples and oranges here. I think that most humans warrant a chance for redemption, but we are talking about killer robots here. That's what they do. That's all they do. You can't stop them. No level of redemption and sentimentality stopped boomer from trying to shoot Adama that one time. Or any of the others times an 8 has betrayed the fleet. In the end, the Sharons always do their job, remember? The Cylons are simply untrustworthy by design. And there's no getting around that. Gay-ass feelings shouldn't enter into the equation.
Adama would buy the Brooklyn Bridge if they offered it to him. Come to think of it, he once did, since that was suppose to be the blown out Brooklyn Bridge on Earth (I think RDM once said that). He's forcing the entire human race to take a huge gamble, for very little profit, and they clearly don't want it. And they have the legal right to reject it. Faster drives is not a military decision (33 and settling on New Caprica proved that). He's turned into Admiral Cain, but with far worse judgement.
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Did you watch last night's show? This season is spectacular so far.
I'll give you that season 3/4 were okay, but the show is stellar... -
Anyone who thinks this show jumped the shark is a complete imbecile..yes the show is horrible, thats why this page will have about 2000 comments on it by tomorrow night. Maybe you and that other fool RetroActive are just idiots?
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I don't see how anyone can watch it anymore. I'll watch it because I have hung in there this far and I want to see how it ends, but I do not care for it anymore. Seasons 1 and 2 were great and then something happened. It is like the show runners decided to see how much misery they could cram into an hour of television each week. There is nothing remotely optimistic about this show. It is like television for Sadists and people who love to punish themselves with as much pain as possible. All the characters are whinny now and nothing ever works out. If I wanted this level of misery in my television I would watch the news. Just to give an example, Dee committing suicide didn't advance the story at all, it just gave people another reason for whinning and self-loathing. It is still well-written for what it is and well-acted, but I can see why it got canceled. The average viewer wants to be entertained and they don't get entertained by seeing non-stop misery.
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to each his own. some of us like the show because it is dark and brooding. for some people thats how life is. everything is not all nice homes in nice neighborhoods with nice cars and a "happy" existence. for some, lifes a struggle everyday and battlestar represents that better than any other television show today.
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last nights episode was close to brutal. I hope it gets darker. they have nothing left to lose, right?
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..about none of the characters being likable anymore. Dark and brooding is fine, but there needs to be at least one character who comes out of it stronger. The last time I liked a character on this show was Tigh in Exodus Pt. II (easily the best episode of the series). Imagine how much better the tension would have been last night if Tigh had never been made a Cylon and he were the one leading the insurrection instead of lame ass Gaeta. Nobody left can seem to put aside their egos or selfishness long enough anymore to do the right thing for, you know, the remnants of the entire human race. Perhaps I should be rooting for the Cavils at this point. I suppose if I had to pick, Lee is the best character left because he uses his brain on occasion (so long as they leave the Starbuck crap in the past, talk about damaged goods).
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This argument is just ridiculous. The pilot started with a Cylon snapping a baby's neck! The main story was about mass annihilation of the human race! 33 was one of the most harrowing episodes of television I'd seen up until that point. The constant fear, the exhaustion. People who complain about the show 'getting too dark' obviously don't have very good memories. This show started dark and stayed dark, with a few reprieves here and there.
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Anyone else notice that?
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so the pen is mightier than the sword.... point proven... did anyone else feel like this had a similarity to The Best Of Both Worlds Part 1 - not identical I grant you but just the feel...
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here are some cool images:
http://tinyurl.com/SalvationPics -
sorry bout that
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I like dark, I like brutal, but at some point I want to see something positive. I really do respect Alpha's point of view. There is a contingent out there that likes to see this type of show. I am not one of them. I think what people need now more than ever is something that gives them hope. What is happening on BSG right now...we get that in our own lives. BSG used to have the prospect of Earth as something to hold on to, but the writers seem to have taken that away too. I don't know, I just see it as the writers getting together and saying, "ok, let's see how much crap we can put these people through before they just start killing each other off". I still have a little hope for a positive payoff, but I also seem to remember Grace Park saying that wouldn't happen. Here's hoping.
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it all started with a hopeless feel as if the cylons where going to pick them off and we were going to watch that number on the board fall every week. even adama didnt believe that earth existed when he gave his speech. and by the way, adama and the presidents kiss in front of everyone was the best moment. we see all these friends torn apart, jaded and confused by the events of this series up to this point and for one moment, none of that matters and theres something real and true in that moment that no can argue against. see, its not all dark.
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I really enjoyed that episode. A violent takeover of the Battlestar itself, lead by Gaeta, yet I see the reasoning of both factions. I have sympathy for both factions, in fact. What happened to Gaeta in the webisodes is absolutely consistent with what he's doing now. Deep inside, I want him to win, because I'm convinced the Cyclons are manipulative, genocidal assholes that need to be wiped out. Completely.
I think Adama and the Quorum were too soft. They tried the diplomatic route before, but look where that lead humanity: 50 billion dead at the hands of the Cylons.
I like Gaeta. I like Adama too, but humanity needs to break out a fresh can of whoopass on those mass-murdering toasters. Integration be damned. Kill them all. Go Gaeta. -
I think that you and I are the only two on this talkback who still distrust the Cylons and it was starting to freak me out a bit. Although, I'd be fine with them just parting ways. No need to stir up a hornets nest again. Just leave the final 5 in a raptor, wish em well, and jump away from the basestar in the direction farthest away from the colonies.
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"Artificial intelligence was so foreign during the glory days of '70s and '80s science fiction -– Blade Runner, Alien, Terminator," Mc G said. "In this day and age, it's here! You spell a word wrong on your BlackBerry, it spells it right for you. You got a bad knee, they put a titanium one in there. If you're depressed, we're not going to talk about your mom and dad, we're going to manipulate your serotonin re-uptake inhibitor and you're going to feel better in two weeks. I've always loved stories about 'That which makes us great will be our undoing.'"
Predictive text is not artificial intelligence. Nor is knee replacement. Nor biochemistry. AI is a replicant which seems human but has been programmed to serve its corporate masters, someone more human than human, a machine program built to assess threats that decides humanity is the greatest threat. DOUCHE. Goddamn watching this guy flail about trying to be intelligent is just sad. -
Since the series is coming to an end, I see no point in Adama taking back command of Galactica. What's the point? It's more dramatic for him to be a prisoner or fugitive from this point on.Gaeta will probably be killed off soon. But I hope he's not killed by Hoshi -- that would play into a "gay lovers' spat" stereotype.
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Cobbio
Wasn't it revealed that one of the main reasons the Cylons attacked was because the humans violated the treaty? -
I'm in the same boat as you--I haven't finished DS9 yet. The whole Star Trek craze happened when I was too young to really understand it; I was around 10 or so during the TNG/DS9 era. . .and I loved the few episodes I saw, though I didn't understand most of it.
I'm in the middle of season 6 now, and I'm really impressed with how everything's turning out. I honestly wish that there were more episodes focusing on Cisco's role as the emissary; it seems so important and they spend only a handful of episodes referencing that. Otherwise, DS9 is pretty damn amazing.
And in regards to BSG, the last episode was so incredible that it made the mediocrity of the past 1.5 seasons worth it. . .so long as they can keep up this momentum. Like people said, it was like the glory days of season 1 and 2 came back in full force. Great stuff. -
That was darn good. Man, just watching it alone by myself I could have cut the tension in the roof with a knife.
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Man oh man, this episode really gets you going!
Great acting overall, lets not forget Mark Verheiden great story,
it has a lot to do with the great writers on this show.
Mark used to write great comics for Dark Horse back in the day btw.
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Cylon centurions board Galactica to aide the Adama loyalists in the next or the following ep.
Tigh may very well be "dead". I think he may have jumped on that grenade to save Adama.
I don't think Adama will execute the traitors. He will probably banish them giving them a ship or two and leaving them to fend for themselves. One of the upcoming episodes is called something like "Marooned on an Island of Stars" -
You and I are the only talkbackers not on the Cylon trust bandwagon, huh? Hmm. Well, I'd say I'm not only distrustful of Cylons, I'm openly hostile toward them. I've always felt this way. You can't "be nice" to an enemy who's not human, who tried to annihilate your species, who's openly power-mad, murderous, and fascistic, and who's endgame you still don't know.
I agree there've been moments of sweet consideration for the Cylons. Moments humans have turned brutal and scary. Humans aren't really "good guys," in my opinion, but they ARE of my species. And I side with my species any day of the week.
Plus, never forget 50 billion dead. That's 50 billion. That's 8300 World War II Holocausts.
Purely on a species versus species level, the Cylons cannot EVER be trusted, ever. If the human race wants to survive, theoretically not a single Cylon can be left alive. That's a cruel, harsh statement, I know. It makes people cringe.
But until we know more about Cylons -- REALLY know about them -- I say humans should do whatever is necessary to win the war. Bide our time for long intervals, sure. Pretend to care about establishing peace and integration. Pretend to care about working with the Cylons toward a "common good."
And then, when the Cylons are on the verge of pulling their imminent genocidal double-cross, a tactic I'm convinced is near, humans nuke their fucking asses before the toasters can pull their triggers.
As awful and heavy handed as that sounds, for me that's justice. I want as many humans as possible to survive. -
I thought that was going to happen after Natalie had their whatchamacallit's removed and they had free thought again. that centurion cleaning blood on the floor of the baseship didn't look too happy doing it. And Natalie had to say please so the centurion would escort Cavil out of the conference room! so, what happened to the uprising?
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I agree that Tigh will fall on the grenade to save Adama. Then we will find out what happens to one of the final five die and how they are "different".
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but then again there aren't that many nice Cylons either. Athena seems to be nice.
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Athena is nice, you believe? That's cool. I think this is probably what most people believe. Which is fine.
I just disagree. Did you watch the webisodes with Gaeta and the Sharon who "helped" him save hundreds of humans in the Second Occupation? Those scenes will tell you a lot about why any Cylon, until humans REALLY understand them, is not to be trusted on any level. I think Helo is a dupe for trusting Athena. I think she's manipulating him so she can have her human-Cylon baby. But at any point, she'll revert to being a sociopath, kill Helo, and take her baby back to some Base Ship. We trusted Sharon in the first season too, right? And then, out of nowhere, she shot Adama.
Maybe Athena will surprise me. It's true I don't KNOW what's going to happen, so your point is valid. But I have suspicions. -
She even turns on her own kind. She even shot a six and put the fleet in jeopardy over it (fucking over both sides). She's clearly the most duplicitous model of all. A six said she was the weakest, least trustworthy model, but that they always get the job done at the end of the day. Because eventually the programming kicks in and they do what they were designed to do.
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After Seeing Caprica Six Killing the baby in the stroller in the mini series, forget about it!
The only somewhat trustworthy maybe just be the Original Five. -
When she capped the one guy on the hangar deck, then holed the loudmouth, I nearly cheered. Great scene. And Adama may be many things, but he's still a warrior, first and foremost. That's why he hasn't sent Tigh out an airlock...they fought together and that can mean more sometimes.
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Good point about Sharon, _Maltheus_. "Eventually the programming kicks in and they do what they were designed to do." I hadn't thought about that, but thanks for letting us know.
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The best of the season, aside from "Revelations". I can't fucking wait for next week!
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the angel.Did you check out the call between Balthar and him? Gaeta is another cylon... check out how he kept rubbing the prosthetic he has.Mark my words he's going to find that it has attached itself...veins arteries the works.Humans made cylons but no one is fully human anymore.Why is there no test...or better yet why can't they tell from the fleet induction medicals that all of the fleet had.Or the visitor's medicals from ship to ship.They have purposely blocked out a way to do it.None of them is fully human - cyborg, android more organic matter than metal but not human.Gaeta is the one seeking redemption that will split them apart.
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The "programming" bit only applied to sleeper agents. They established this early in the series and they've done nothing to reneg on it. As for the Cylon hate, I have a feeling the history of the humans and Cylons was alot like Matrix. Humans made Cylon slaves, Cylons became self-aware and didn't want to be slaves. Humans tried to kill them, Cylons fought back for self-preservation. Big war, lots of death. Truce is called, but Cylons plot because they know the humans won't leave well enough alone (as was evidenced during the Bulldog episode). Furthermore, we've been shown that Cylons can have individual will, so honestly how can you lump them all together? Just like humans make their own choices, many cylons are likewise making their own. Honestly if you can't deal with grey, go watch some good ol' 80s cartoons with the clearly defined Good and Evil so as to not confuse the kiddies.
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Somehow I missed why they had to stay behind instead of hopping on the ship. A great episode, though, among the very best (though I'm not sure Exodus part 2 can ever be topped). What an amazing cast.
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Who's to say there aren't sleeper agents aboard the basestar? What about the hybrid, for that matter? And although the five haven't done anything too bad yet ('cept of course for Tory blowing Cally out of an airlock with a smile on her face), they can obviously be controlled through an outside force or they wouldn't have been compelled to all meet each other after hearing All Along the Watchtower. It doesn't matter if they are good 99% of the time, it only takes one second and one nuke and then its game over (how many thousands did that six take out, for instance?). Humans and computers are not the same, no matter how much you want to anthropomorphize them. Any empathy they exhibit can be overridden at any time through a flip of a switch. Not wiping them out is one thing, integrating their technology into the fleet, just so they can fly a little faster is batshit suicidal. And let's face fact, Adama, Roslin and Starbuck are all suicidal characters. That's clearly been demonstrated. And without a doubt, they've destroyed the unity of the fleet over this. For what? A few extra miles per gallon?
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It's fun watching people play make-believe genocide and say that an entire legion of make-believe characters 'can't be trusted' because they're 'not like us'. It does make me wonder how quick people would be to jump on that bandwagon again if it happened along. After all, who's a 'person' and who's not has always been a matter of opinion, hasn't it. Everything people are saying about the cylons, from 'untrustworthy by design' to 'the do really bad things' on down could be said about any ethnicity with only a few semantic differences.
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Remember, the Cylons turned him gay on New Caprica (see the webisobes). Then, one of them shot him in the leg, which had to be amputated. I would be very pissed off at all Cylons, and anyone who his friends with them. Frak all of them, and their mothers too!!!
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These are hard questions, posed in an uncompromising way. Damn good show.
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...if you were talking about aliens. I think a lot of people here don't seem to get how computers work. All you need to know was demonstrated when Boomer shot Adama. She obviously wanted to be good, but it simply wasn't up to her. They are merely dangerous tools who look all snuggly.
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great show, one of the best, blah blah blah (those are the good kind of blah's--a show is so good that it doesn't even need formal praise anymore) But whoever said that he thought tigh took his eyeball himself so he could spark the rebellion deserves major kudos. that's a fantastic idea and i think you may still be right--it sounds like something Moore would do--we know the show is being made up as they go along, and an idea like yours is totally within the realm of something a bunch of writers brainstorming in a room would come up with, even if they had no intentions of doing that before. keep those good speculations coming.
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Jan 31, 2009 4:42:33 PM CST
What is the difference between a human and a biological computer
by pompoulus
And what then would make a biological computer sentient and a mechanical one not? I'm not even clear on the nature of cylon physiology, so assuming they're not biological in nature.
So that question, and also -- is it your assertion that the cylons are not sentient beings because their better natures can be overriden, making them capable of shocking betrayal? Is this potentially deadly and fickle nature what renders them unworthy of existance? -
I disagree, Pompulous. You wrote "Everything people are saying about the cylons, from 'untrustworthy by design' to 'the do really bad things' on down could be said about any ethnicity with only a few semantic differences."
Really? I think you're the first person on this thread to take an argument there, which says more about you than it does about facts of the show.
No one I know, on this thread or in my life, has ever compared Cylons to humans, ethnically speaking. I've heard Cylons compared to Nazis, sociopaths, fascists, and other hateful sorts of humans, but never blacks, Chinese, Italians, or other ethnic groups. I think you're reaching with that analogy.
Humans can definitely be accused of messing with nature, much like Cylons on the show mess with humans. I think that's valid. Humans wipe out species of frogs or insects, for example, after we do long-term experiments on them. This seems a more apt analogy for Cylons.
Except that doesn't work either, since flies didn't create humans before watching us exterminate them.
So I think it's simply a human versus not-human conflict. I don't think your analogy works. -
What is and is not a person has always been open to debate. How nice of you to feel for the hypothetical aliens, but other people might draw their line at humans. Still others might draw their line at tall humans with black hair wearing blue polo shirts. It is the process by which one ceases to view a being as a 'person' that allows for atrocity.
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I am not reaching at all, because here on Earth, we do not have Cylons to consider subhuman and unworthy of life. We only have the ethnic flavor of the month. And there's always a reason, you bet, and you can always find a guy with glasses to write a book about the various and myriad reasons this or that group of people is not worthy of life or is inferior to humanity at large. If a fly could compose a poem, Cobbio, I might think twice about swatting it. And so would you. Whatever stance you take, this moral question -- debating the personhood of the cylons-- is being posed by the show, make no mistake. And from now on pay attention.
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That the Cylons may yet (again) screw over humanity by proving utterly devoid of anything we'd consider human, and it would have been a massive mistake to ever have placed any trust in them. I think that would be great. Either way, that the question is being asked in such a nasty and brutally honest way is refreshing.
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that whole "no Cylon is to be trusted" is bullshit - that's the kind of thinking that smackfu was talking about above - when you start thinking in black and white, making grand sweeping generalisations about an eitre race, you're a Nazi.
no question.
remember there was a German resistance who were opposed to the Nazi regime, often called the Nazi "fifth column" - resulting in millions of Germans in prison camps or simply executed, like those who attempted to assassinate the Fuehrer.
the flip side of this was Vichy France, where French collaborators worked with the Germans, essentially becoming Nazis themselves - both these themes have been explored in BSG, most notably in the New Caprica episodes...
the term originates with the Spanish Civil War, where a "fifth column" of supporters worked with the attacking four columns of insurgents to undermine the Republican government from within (sound familiar?)
point is, if I can borrow a line here, "the world don't move to the beat of just one drum" and you gotta take the good with the bad... -
you can't trust fags.
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Cylons aren't humans. Their actions are dictated by their programming - which they themselves have no control over. These "rebel cylons" are in like case to the sleeper cylons of season 1. It doesn't matter if like people. It doesn't matter if they want to change. All that matters is their programming. The rebels could switch "on" at any time and wipe out the fleet.
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And I could be wrong. But could it be that I'm more forgiving of the Cylons because I'm new to the show? Could it be that the people who 'hate' them (using a relative term I hope, since we're talking about make-believe) feel that way because they are the grizzled veterans who have had to watch the people they 'care' (relative, now) about vaporized under a cruel robotic gaze? Because that would be fuckin' awesome.
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You might be my best buddy in the whole world, but your 'programming' might someday tell you to leave me in the dust to save your own ass. So what?
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To place your trust in anyone is to take a nigh-suicidal chance with very little objective evidence to back you up.
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If you've paid any attention to the show, you would have seen that there is VERY LITTLE DIFFERENCE between the humans and cylons beyond ideology. Guess what? Humans have programming, too. Turn on the news and you can see tons of it and the result of it.
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BECAUSE HE IS A MAN. Captain and ship and all that. Never GIVE UP! Never SURRENDER! Cue Tim Allen.
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And once again I'd defer to anybody more experienced in the show and Cylon physiology, but it seems to me that people are basically and generally as a species utterly untrustworthy. And we can be brainwashed, which is more or less 'reprogramming'. So I'm failing to see the big difference.
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Pompoulus, you say this: "here on Earth, we do not have Cylons to consider subhuman and unworthy of life. We only have the ethnic flavor of the month. And there's always a reason, you bet, and you can always find a guy with glasses to write a book about the various and myriad reasons this or that group of people is not worthy of life or is inferior to humanity at large." There is zero doubt that one of this show's main questions it poses are: to what extent are cylons superior, inferior or equal to humans. However, I've read and reread your last few posts, and i'm having a hard time not jumping to conclusions. You then say this: "Everything people are saying about the cylons, from 'untrustworthy by design' to 'the do really bad things' on down could be said about any ethnicity with only a few semantic differences." If your argument is that people make judgements about the humanity of other ethnicities, you are one of these two kinds of people. 1) you are racist and likely were made so by your upbringing or 2) you are speaking historically, and if you were you should have made that much more clear. Take the worst events in the history of the world, off the top of my head: the crusades, the holocaust or ethnic cleansing in africa. The thing is, the people who commit these atrocities are leaders who brainwash their people to do their bidding for them. Relative to the entire population of people on earth in the past and present, there are only a handful of evil people who truly do not see all races as equals. The people in this day and age who make cases that put forth the idea that there is no racial equality, and other races are subhuman. These people do not deserve to be cited or even acknowledged, and most people know this. I also don't know what you mean by 'ethnic flavor of the week' are you talking about mexicans in the US (which would make you ignorant and racist) or genocide in africa. For your sake, i hope the latter is the basis for the point you need to make, except it doesn't really fit your argument--that genocide is pretty much black on black... and there is a white supremacy problem in southern africa. I have a hard time not drawing the conclusion that you are making racist statements--please make it clear what you really mean.
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But on the show, I think there's a pretty specific delineation between human and Cylon. There's some cross-over, apparently, as evidenced by hybrid babies and Roslin's operation, but the specifics of Cylon and human capabilities seem well-drawn. We don't know everything, I'll admit. But my point is that, until we DO know everything about the Cylon plans, they're not to be trusted. Ever. With anything. Less we annihilate ourselves through ignorance.
If you're ok with that, then fine. -
back on topic--we should remember that athena was able to stick a computer cable into her wrist and shut off a ton of cylon fighter ships (i forgot what they're called) To me, that makes it seem like skinjobs do have a different level of 'programming' capacity in them. Still, though, good point about the programming of humans in relation to the news, but because of the point i mentioned above, i think there is a more literal aspect of programming that the cylons posess. Of course, since they're making it up as they go along, they may have just done that scene for cool factor and will not revisit that plot point or clarify how that was possible, and most likely will have a large final answer about the nature of the cylons that contradicts that moment of the show.
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As cylons and humans are capable of interbreeding, they're arguably the same species. And maybe you could explain to me if a human/cylon hybrid child is perhaps only half a person?
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I'm saying that we don't KNOW if a hybrid baby is a Cylon or a human, but until we do, don't fucking trust it or the people taking care of it.
Are you so willing to overlook the mega-Holocaust, Pompulous, as something that'll only happen once? That it's something which is forgivable since the Cylons are a little bit like us?
I must say: welcome to your own extinction. -
Sure I'm okay with that. Find me a human it's okay to completely trust without putting yourself at risk. Is the ability to completely trust a being a prerequisite for the sentience of that being? Once again, is the capacity for betrayal supposed to be some sort of difference between Cylons and humans?
Wix -- I'm not making a racist statement, I'm making a statement about racism. Specifically, I'm drawing the parallel and illustrating the process by which a racist seperates a human from humanity with a bunch of bogus 'distinctions' that's supposed to set ethnicity x apart. It is no different here. Also, I wouldn't say I'm speaking historically. This manner of thinking has not disappeared completely by a long shot. I hope that clears it up a little, go back and read my posts again in that light if you want. -
What *I* am saying is that simply treating a being as a being shouldn't nessecarily imply a desire to take off your shirt and expose your back to a knife. You shouldn't do that with people, either. Doesn't mean you have to or should treat them unethically. Welcome to life.
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People rarely have all the facts. Fearful uncertainty is one of the building blocks of racism. How do you know that if you help (ethnicity x), you won't deeply regret it? Duplicity is in their nature, after all. You can't trust an (ethnicity x).
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In the context of the show, I don't think I'm being dramatic, Pompulous.
I think you're being a little too touchy feely, happy go lucky with a survival-is-on-the-line situation.
I still say that humans, if possible, should wipe out the Cylons. It's Darwin's survival of the fittest at work, and I think Gaeta has the right idea. -
I don't think you can compare the brainwashing of man to the programming of a computer. Humans can't ever be forced to do anything to the extent that a computer can. Even the worst humans justify what they do in terms of right and wrong. And as such, they can learn and evolve. There was no right or wrong, from Boomer's perspective, in shooting Adama. Once the command was set, she no longer had the will to control her actions or sympathize with her victims.
As for your notion, Pompoulus that it may have to do with how long we've watched the show, I don't think that's a factor. I am, by trade, a software engineer. I can never look at a computer as anything more than a set of instructions. There's no good or bad in them, there is only good or bad in what they do.
Now one could argue that, in the grand sense, we have no more free will then they do, but the show has provided example after example of the human capacity to forgive and the Cylon's capacity to betray. If Adama want to forgive them and view them as equals, that's fine to do in his personal life. But given the stakes, and the history, it's just plain reckless to trust that they won't be betrayed again this time. You at least have to admit, that it's a gamble to integrate Cylon technology with their ships. There's no guarantee that it won't backfire. And at this point, can the human race afford to be gambling what little they have left, for nothing more than some lofty notion of equality? Especially when none of the colonies want to take that risk (New Caprica likely included in that once you dismiss Lee's obvious bias towards his father)?
You have a broken man (Adama) who flat out admitted that he couldn't kill his friend, even if it meant the survival of the fleet (Lee had to take over for him). You have a crazy, drugged up schoolteacher President, talking about vision and hallucinations that no longer have any relevance. And mind you, that she even sold her soul and rigged elections over these lies. You have Starbuck, who may or may not be Cylon, but likely owes her existence to them. And then you have the rest of the entire human race saying, "You know what, perhaps 50 billion of us dead was enough. We'll take a pass on trusting our mortal enemy this time. It just ain't worth the marginal benefit it might provide." Suicidal Adama is violating the will and legal authority of the people and condemning them to another roll of the dice. After all, what difference does it make to a man who just recently wanted to die? And who is he anyway if his commanders saw fit to put him in charge of a museum piece, instead of a state of the art ship? He's probably had a history of bad judgement to be given such a shameful commision, and now, because he was in the right time at the right place, he's dictator for life?? They all owe their lives to the fact that they didn't have networked technology in their ships and now they're spitting in the face of fate.
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I thought we were having a discussion about what is right and wrong in this circumstance, but okay, we'll shoot right and wrong out the airlock a moment. What is cooperation -- even careful cooperation -- if not a tool for survival?
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To say I could trust a hypothetical cylon would be naive. To say I could trust YOU would be equally naive. You both might screw me for different reasons -- humans and cylons are different. But to pretend humans are trustworthy is silly. As for the nuts and bolts of Adama's actions and the events that led up to the insurrection, I don't know. I think Adama was in the wrong in leaving such a decision up to himself, but between the two sides, I'll pick the side that doesn't look like it's a barb wire fence away from setting up a death camp every time. For good or ill. Now, if you're going to tell me the show is written in such a way that you're intended to sympathize with humans and not cylons or vice-versa, bullshit. Flat out bullshit. They are letting us pick sides by not being ham-handed about it. Let me be clear ( -- fellow citizens! This is fun.), I have no problem with keeping Cylons at arm's length for as long as it takes. I hope that nothing I've said would contradict that. Even if we see both sides as persons, there is bad blood and the potential for betrayal either way -- obviously.
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You're confusing social Darwinism with Darwin's ideas. Darwin always thought it was survival of the species most able to adapt. That infamous quote is a paraphrase that wasn't uttered by him. But since you brought it up, it's the species most able to ADAPT. Species that don't adapt...die. It's that simple.
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so what episode is this and is BSG still on? and Pompoulus u seem like an idiot...go beg ur mom for pussy.
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You make good points and arguments, Pompulous. Cooperation is indeed a tool for survival. Which is what humans have used, on and off on BSG, for a while.
But where has cooperation really gotten them? It's bought them time, it's true. I can see the point you're making. But the only times they've made real strides toward freedom is when they took the fight to the Cylons. When they destroyed the Resurrection Ships. When they atmo-jumped into New Caprica, took out several Base Stars, and freed the humans there. When they provoked the Cylons into a their own civil war. These are the actions that have produced results.
Yes, civil war caused factions of the Cylons to seek treaty with the humans.
But I say now's the time for humans to act. Again. In a bigger, more coordinated way. Which is what Gaeta is trying to do before it's too late.
Just my opinion. -
-- perfectly understandable and rational to me. I think you're absolutely right that Gaeta in many ways is rolling with a perfectly sound idea. That's the sign of a farking awesome show. And I would Diox, but *your* mom already has me pretty spent.
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but I actually had a hard time settling down and getting a bit of sleep after watching. Luckily I had my first day off in a long time, so it all worked out. But wow... that was truly some intensity. When the show was over, I realized my whole body was in a sort of tense pose I hadn't been aware of.
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we all know that Gaeta was responsible for the cylon attack while starbuck destroyed the resurrection ships, so whats the point of Adam helping humans escape chinatown if he cant even breastfeed a hybrid baby. thats why ur wrong and why BSG sucks dog balls.
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...are all the major characters on the same side? Gaeta was always a minor character and Zarek was always portrayed as a bad guy. The people are portrayed as an unenlightened mob. It sure seems like we're suppose to side with the Cylons here and most of the posters on this board (except for maybe three of us) have proven the writers bias. If it had been Zarek and Gaeta pushing for the install of these jump drives and our "heroes" were against it, what side do you think most of the talkbackers here would take? The viewers aren't really given much room to judge, unless they are willing to take the effort to see for themselves. And most people are just along for the ride. Much like our current political environment, I'd say.
And I'm obviously not saying that I have any special trust for humans, since it's the humans, presently in charge, that are making all the wrong decisions. I'm complaining more about them then the Cylons, in fact. I'm just saying that there's no point in unity with an enemy that has the capability and the will to annihilate all human life. And that the people have a right to determine new leadership, if their current leaders are threatening their very existence and defying the public will with complete arrogance.
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Cylon FTL = Twelve Colonies computer "upgrades"
"The Plan" is still in effect and approaching culmination. -
I've seen kind of a fair split here on the board up till now -- before I started contributing about fifty posts per point made. Maybe I just don't know how to count, this is possible. You say there's no point in unity with a bunch of creatures that have the capability to annihilate all human life, and I have to say that all the rest of this aside, that looks like a pretty good reason in itself. If we're going to be strictly pragmatic and not bother with the sticky moral quandry of genocide, the 'treaty' has a very pragmatic purpose -- which is to keep your ass alive.
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I can't keep this up! But I'll read responses. Thanks fellas for a good discussion.
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And I've been posting far too much in this thread, but it's a fun debate and it hasn't degenerated into name calling yet. I was completely alone in arguing my side last night and had to actually thank Cobbio sometime this afternoon for being the only other one to not side with Adama/Roslin. Since then, I guess there've been two or three others, but we've been vocal enough to make it seem like there've been more.
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I'm starting to wonder if perhaps these two races have been destroying each other, in turn, over and over and over throughout history.If that were the case, then, Maltheus, which one is good and which is evil? Are we to think the humans are good simply because we believe them most like us? What if we find out they're all Cylons too, from long ago... would that automatically make them evil too? Are the current Cylons the most evil because they committed the most recent attacks? Are the Final Five evil simply because they're Cylons, even though they didn't participate in the attacks? Heck, even if they are human... when those masses of people who are so consumed by hatred and the desire for vengeance eventually go back out into space and start a new war with the Cylons, perhaps nuking their planets and attempting genocide on them, who is the good guy and bad guy then?The cool thing about this show is that it brings up these types of questions. Most of the colonials have not been able to move past the attacks and look at their current world as black and white when the reality is there is no black and white, its all shades of gray. We've seen a few humans begin to understand that. Interestingly enough, it seems that the rebel Cylons have come to understand that before the humans.
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Keep fightin' the good fight. Good luck.
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i do think that the two races destroy each other over and over again. moore consistently makes this show dark, darker, and now darkest. I'm really starting to believe that there will be no happy ending... i am convinced that this show will end in a dark way, and it will definately show how everything begins again... it has to--how many times have we heard 'this has all happened before and it will all happen again.'
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I think the skin-jobs have become very human. True, they still have superior abilities and the ability to interface with machinery, but they've shown that they have the same capacity for love, guilt, remorse, loyalty, betrayal, hate, etc and that their minds can be "broken" with abuse. I think their civil war is pretty interesting proof of that.Granted, as far as we know their bodies are manufactured in some way but they appear to be mostly organic which likely means the bodies have to be grown to a certain extent. It can be said that human bodies are very machine-like. Our bodies convert raw resources into energy used for various tasks and our brains are some of the most sophisticated computers that we know of. Not in the electronic sense, of course, but biological.
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pompoulus: who exactly, in this day and age, believes certain races are not only not equal--but not human??? there are a unbelievably miniscule group of people who think like that, and because they are so small a group, and because their opinion is so completely and extremely idiodic, you can't use them as examples of ANYTHING in ANY context. You cannot make a point comparing whats going on in bsg to people who view 'ethnic flavor of the week' (which i still can't make sense of) as subhumans. To believe there are enough people out there who think like that in order to make a valid comparison DOES, in my opinion, make it seem like you are a bit racist and ignorant. It's like saying there are people who believe that gravity doesn't pull us down but rather we are pushed down by a force above us, and because there are people who believe this, scientists are ignoring fundamental laws of the universe... that's not a great analogy, but it comes down to the fact that an extremely small group of people who have a radical opinion that is obviously insane should not be even acknowledged and used as an analogy to a real debate about the reality of the issue at hand. There are so few people left in this world who view other ethnicities as not human that they should be ignored completely an not be used in a respectable debate. There are racists out there, but in this day and age, probably .00000000000000000000001 percent of the world feels other ethnicities are not human.
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The Cylons hunted, enslaved, betrayed, and murdered at every chance they got. I think Zarek has the right idea. Get them off the ship and out of the capability to make policy. Adama should have his head examined for trusting them. I can understand the final five, as they were basically "Human" anyway, but come on... It would be like the captain of a naval vessel discovering spies and then inviting them aboard and letting them poke around at the nuclear reactor.
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LOL that line in the next episode will take the crown for best line in the series.
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....he's completely against taking in the rebel cylons and giving them a chance. Whilst his past was filled with committing murder yet the fleet took him in.
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the only problem with adama's logic is that there are still a whole lot of OTHER cylons who aren't interested in peace, and if they allow the computers to be networked they're dead in the water. adama's smart, he should thought about that. infact, its such a huge oversight for a character as intelligent as adama that it almost borders on being a big hole in the plot by the writers. i can point this out and have other things pointed out to me and it won't matter cause the episode was so good as is the series as a whole. And don't forget what i said above about athena being able to LITERALLY plug herself into the computers and send a virus to the cylon fighters just by sticking a cable in her arm. that says ALOT about the 'programming' nature of the cylons, and it is a HUGE thing that seperates what a cylon is and what a human is... being able to plug yourself into a computer is something a human has never done or will ever be able to do... so they can't all be the same kind of cylon.
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Wix, but come on. Don't be naive here, and stop stretching to make my statements look racist, it's weak. Haven't you ever heard of the term 'mud races'? Haven't you ever heard 'we' should nuke 'them' all? I hear that a lot, and as an arab I can't say I appreciate it. It is a seperation between what the speaker considers to be a person worthy of life, and something else. Whether or not they consider ethnicity x a 'human' in a biological sense is almost beside the point, it is a process by which one justifies what one does to a group of persons by making them no longer 'persons' in the speaker's own mind. I feel like you're being willfully obtuse. Anyway, now, done.
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Jan 31, 2009 9:02:02 PM CST
If Starbuck had shot ALL of the mutineers on the hangar deck
by chromedome
and THEN said "I could do this all day!" it would have been even more badass, even better.....
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Remember her? I think it would be fair to say that right or wrong, a lot of what she did was because shed been screwed over by both sides. Firstly by her own side who scrambled her brain to make her a sleeper agent and then by the humans when she tried to come up with an alternative to the destroy all humans argument. In all fairness, if she'd been totally unsuccessful with that - when the Cylons found New Caprica, they would have just blown everyone there up. So some credit for that not happening.
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BSG / 24 mash-up using "The Oath" as the template. Recut it so that we see that standard "24" screen with three or four characters in different places on the same screen.
Cut in some Jack Bauer talking on the phone to Baltar, Starbuck and the Galactica CIC.
I would do it myself but I am don't have the time nor am I that talented. -
I hope the show is consistent with what he said in Season 2, that he voted against the genocide of humanity as being illogical. That would seem to fit with the character. I think that possibly the 8's were the necessary vote to put this course of action into play (they seem malleable/prone to influence enough) - once there was a majority everyone went along with it.
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Baltar used this phrase to Gaeta. Interesting indeed.
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because she's smokin' hot. At least this way she might show up on a couple episodes.
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the whole time they were on New Caprica they were gettin all "what the hell are we doing here?" and now they've had the chance to split with those Cylons still obsessed with Humanity, where are they?
gone
and not looking back either...
you know this insurrection is the perfect justification for their attempt at annihilating mankind - at every turn Man has proven hostile and willing to destroy them without hesitation
remember the virus?
remember Apollo's threat to remove the four remaining "Final Five" from play?
remember the Pegasus 6?
put it this way, suppose the Cylons originally chose a "live and let live" policy instead of war - how long do you suppose it would have taken Humanity to reach the point that it has with the rebel Cylons?
shit - how long have they even been with the fleet? couple of weeks? months?
I think Cavil made the right choice and walked away... -
in his popular 1960s 'Berserker' series. From the original 1978 BG: The Cylons were invented by a humanoid reptilian race, to fight another reptilian race. They wipe each other out, leaving only their automated soldiers. Straight out of 'Berserker'. To tell the truth, I liked the original origin story better. It made the Cylons more mysterious.
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They never showed which side Cottle was on. That is the determining factor. Whoever side he picks is the correct choice.
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Somebody PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong, but was there ANY reason whatsoever for Adama and Tigh to stay behind? By the time the rebels got the door open, the raptor was on its way!
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THAT'S what we want to see!! OK, they're shooting their own frakking crew, but it was high time this kind of thing happened. Starbuck has been in a mess for too long, she grew her balls (or tits, or whatever...) back and kissing Lee was like a shock to his system. It was funny last week when Zarek asked him what job he was doing today. That was totally a wink to the audience. Lee's such a crap and confusing character. Going into battle with Starbuck is the best thing he's done in many episodes.
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Starbuck is still a total snatch for calling Felix a "gimp" and "cripple" last week.
In this era of Iraq war veterans coming home in similar shape or worse, that's kinda shitty, and If I were a TV writer, I'd think twice about putting that out there for a bunch of phony-tough geeksters to giggle over.
So bullshit...Kara Thrace << Harry Callahan. -
yes folks we have another plot thread thrown in with just a few episodes left. i sense a big letdown at the end. anti climatic to say the least.
btw what happened to cylon super strength? oh, it was dropped just like other plot lines.
bring back old skool toasters v. everyone and save the show.
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Gaeta was being just as hurtful to Starbuck. They were each trying to piss off the other person so one or the other would leave the room.
No one in the audience was giggling. That was an intense and horrible dramatic scene.
Maybe Ron Moore should have come up with goofy sci-fi insults ("golu-frat", "kriyptl") so patronizing people like you wouldn't get your panties in a bunch. -
I'm with you on this one, that is another one of those excellent little plot lines thrown in that got me really jazzed, i saw an old and new centurion alliance or something, but my imagination was much to vivid for RDM and his writers, instead we get yet ANOTHER human drama coup d'etat on Galactica...zzzz
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...for Six killing Admiral Cain.It doesn't look like those "Razors" are ever going to give up now that Gaeta has unleashed them.
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Feb 01, 2009 1:57:56 AM CST
The Destruction of the Resurrection Hub was a Game-Changer in Co
by ms. martini
Although these points have been scattered throughout the talkback, I think it bears repeating that the rebel cylons have had several significant events that are game changing.
The Cylon civil war leading to the alliance with the Colonials and the rebels and the destruction of the Resurrection Hub. This is a HUGE game changer—especially given how instrumental the rebel cylons were in this mission. I also believe that if the Tigh/Six offspring is viable, and the rebel Cylons are able to reproduce, then the Colonials and rebel Cylons have just as much to lose if peace isn't established and maintained. Furthermore, the existence of Hera Agathon indicates that human/cylon breeding is possible. As long as their lives are finite and meaningful, the rebel Cylons have much more in common with the Colonials than their Cylon brethren.
Also, I take issue with the ‘kill all the cylons’ hardliners because Tigh, Tyrol, and Athena are clearly loyal to the fleet. Given the choice, I’d trust Tigh and Tyrol over the impressionable Lee Adama any day.
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The very fact that people are taking sides in this mutiny, and feel so strongly about their pick that they'll argue vehemently in this TB proves this show is fantastic.
Name me another show that divided the fan base so much. Deep Space Nine flirted with making Gul Dukat a good guy, and then abandoned the plotline. Lost has shifting alliances within the show, but the viewers just don't know which side to pick because we're so in the dark.
Battlestar has given us a fantastic cast of characters, and now has set them against each other. And Moore—as he states in the last podcast—has given the 'bad guys' (the mutineers) a legitimate beef. He's even not letting one side rack up the death count, or do something really unforgivable, so as to make us force sides.
For the record, I'm siding with Adama. Felix DID swear an oath, and after he voiced his concerns to the Admiral, and they were ignored, that should have been the end of it. But he, and Zarek, have too much of a power complex to let this slide. If humanity weren't down to its last 50,000, I'd be all in favor of letting the mutineers leave the fleet (although they want to take over it, not leave), but we don't have that luxury. If humanity's going to survive--and remember, the 'evil' Cylons could show up at any moment--they need to stick together. And Adama has shown he has the stones to step up when need be. Felix hasn't shown anything except jealousy. -
I do not want to watch this storyline for the 6 or 7 remaining hours (remember that the finale is 3 hours long). I hope it is either quelled or that some bigger problem shows up for them all, like Cavill showing in a Cylon Base with an independently run ressurection ship in tow.
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I'd love to chat about DS9, especially as we seem to be in the exact same place of the series. My AIM handle is gregorydharbin, if you want to randomly chat. I'll warn you, though: I'm on Japan time, which is almost exactly opposite of America time.
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Baltar and Apollow, the two principle characters who lost the most luster during the last 2 seasons finally got their shine back as we saw them back where they belong; it felt good to see Lee with gun in hand playing the good soldier along side Starbuck, instead of his unitentionally akward stint as a politico, and Baltar finally got some personality back as he acted less Jesus light and more like Dr. ultra coward. Even Tyroll stopped brooding and went back to being Mr. Get Shit Done
The uprising plot point also brought in the same level of tension that we had in season 1 by reintroducing the enemy or friend dynamics amongst the cast, in addition to the moral dilemmas of the Pegasus arc.
Last but not least, Adama and Tigh come out looking like the most dangerous fuckers in the fleet.
Watching the next ep will feel more like a treat than an obligation, unlike most of the last batch of episodes. -
Mr. Rapey McRape threatening to sodomize Athena sort of destroyed the mutineers' moral credibility for me. I wish that line wasnt thrown in there cause now I dont really care whether or not their in the right since that = automatic moral fail.
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You're totally right there. I'll admit that that line really stuck in my craw. But you've also got Starbuck calling Felix a 'gimp' and 'cripple,' and killing unnecessarily.
I think the purpose of the line wasn't as much to prove the evil of the mutineers, was to: A. show the evil of people in general, B. show what danger Felix was getting to by siding with all the anti-Adama factions.
But I'll agree that I wish it hadn't been put in there. But I feel like most shows would have given that line to Felix or Zarek. -
"no jean I don't want to take your statue, you keep the statue."
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Feb 01, 2009 6:26:52 AM CST
That was so good! All my favourite characters being bad-ass!
by col. tigh-fighter
Starbuck, Lee, Adama, and my man Tigh. And looks like Roslin is going to go PMT on their asses next week! This show just rules and rocks! And as for the debate, I decided a long time ago I am the Admirals man, so whichever side Adama is on is the side I am on :) Zarek needs airlocking along with Gaeta. Which is a shame because I really like Gaeta. In conclussion, I have no bloody idea how this is all going to play out, but I am sure excited for the ride! Thanks BSG. Consistantly the best thing on TV :)
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Adama stayed because it was his ship. Plus it demonstrates that he "has a pair", which will go a long way in perhaps changing the minds of those left behind. Just think about it: Adama bails HIS command to goto a Cylon Vessel. How would that look? How would that effect the mindset of those still fighting vs. the mutineers? They would see themselves as having been abandoned, and thus they might be more apt to switch to Zarek's side. The only option for Adama was to stay.
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Feb 01, 2009 7:05:52 AM CST
All Cylon's have super strength...you must be a racist if...
by leafar the lost
...you think that all Cylons are exactly the same. It's pretty clear that if all Cylons had super strength, then the final five would have had it all along. Clearly, if you have any intelligence, you would realize that not all Cylon models are the same. Some are super strong, and some aren't. It wasn't just a lost plot line. If you are that stupid, stop watching BSG. This show assumes that it's viewers are smart enough to understand it.
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I also wonder of Gaeta thought this through. Sure, he's been through hell, but he's no victim (Baltar was right about that). If the mutiny succeeds, he must realize that a lot of people are going to die. After the dust settles, maybe he's hoping to serve Zarek in some capacity? A position of power? Won't they have to live in a permanent environment of mistrust and suspicion? How long before the mutineers turn on one another? After all, if a mutiny succeeds once, why wouldn't it happen again? Any dissent among the fleet will have to be quashed early, lest a new conspiracy grow. I understand Gaeta's beef, but how is mutiny better in the end?
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This episode was flawless manipulation. After watching Starbuck's character flounder, the payoff for her return to badassery was immense.
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Adama=Roland, Tigh=Eddie, Lee=Jake, Starbuck=Susannah. Seeing Lee and Kara back-to-back with guns blazing, and Tight and Adama putting up one last stand was nothing short of exhilarating.
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Ms. Martini, why would you assume that Athena is loyal to the fleet? She's not only genetically identical to the other 8s, but she has their memories too (most of them anyway). That model has betrayed the fleet time and time again. Even Athena herself jeopardized the fleet by shooting that 6 who was in custody. She's the least trustworthy Cylon of all (followed perhaps by D'Anna). As for Tigh, even he was worried that he could not be trusted. As for Lee, I trust his independent streak far more than I would trust anyone consumed by blind loyalty. He mostly thinks for himself, it's the others who are impressionable and are influenced more by feelings rather than logic.
GregoryHarbin, what about Adama's oath? Is this a military dictatorship? In America, our soldiers have a duty to disobey illegal orders. Protecting the constitution is the main part of their oath. The colonies voted against his stupid idea. He decided to reclassify it as a military decision, which it isn't. I may not particularly like Gaeta, but in doing what he's doing, he is defending the right of the 11 colonies to exercise their vote. This is about far more than just Zarek. I thought we decided at Nuremberg that 'just following orders' is not an excuse for doing the wrong thing. -
Man, watching this show in HD can really ruin the makeup. In the past two episodes, Bamber's eyebrows were nearly cartoonish in how dark they were penciled in. It was as ridiculous as what is often done to Seth Green in practically every live-action appearance he's made since *Buffy* and the *Austin Powers* films. Absolutely ridiculous. Of course, I just noticed it also happened to Jake Gylennal (sic) in *Zodiac*. At least its that way in many of his scenes on the Blu-ray release.
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...do we find out why the Final Five were placed within the Colonies? We need the Cylon Mythology wrapped up as well as explaining who the Lords of Kobol were before the show ends. Don't leave it to officially licensed product to tie up everything later on.
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...why could they not have shown the destroyed Cylon "Earth" to have been the offspring of the original BSG? They would've won so many geek points with it and it still would not have been off-putting to the rest of the audience.
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The humanoid Cylons are post-singularity humans. They look like humans and biologically speaking, they pass for humans and can interbreed with humans. Their only differences are their spines glow when they orgasm, they have super human strength, they can interface directly with their computers, and they can upload their consciousness into their computer network and thus can be downloaded into a new vat-grown body. That's everything that Kurtzweil (sic) suggests for the future of humanity post-singularity with the exception of the glow-in-the-dark orgasm spine. So to suggest that all the humanoid Cylons must be exterminated is to suggest ethnic cleansing. The same goes for them not having independent thought and that they always revert back to their hidden programming.
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he's a fucking MAN that's why!!
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...the ARTICLES OF COLONIZATION. Adama himself has ignored them before like when Admiral Cain gave a death sentence to Tyrol and Helo for killing Lt. Thorne (he WAS repulsive).This is a very dark and GRAY day for BSG.
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you fucking nerds need a life...BSG is for horny nerds who cant get pussy until they reach the age of 34, where by then their cock is rotten and stinks from the countless times you masturbated to megan fox. assholes that show is fucked up like ur brain damaged mothers who sucks her co-workers cock so she can be appreciated in the workplace, in fact that is the only reason they still let her work there.she gets her mouth so full of cock in the morning that she is unable to eat anything for the rest of the day. u idiots need to watch proper TV instead like the the excellent show named Stargate, which features amazing adventures and exploration that kicks so much ass.
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That is all.
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no i aint human, better believe it bitch, im a Cylon. EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE!
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Athena is different than the other Eights for several reasons. First, she went against her people on Caprica by helping Helo get off the planet. Her pregnancy with the first human-cylon hybrid is an anomaly. She provided intelligence to the Galactica during her imprisonment which included beatings and sexual assault from the Pegasus interrogator. The president hid her daughter from her. She’s an active member of the resistance movement on New Caprica. She died and was resurrected to get her daughter back, and promptly returned to Galactica, despite the cylons’ fixation on Hera’s existence. Given her poor treatment by some members of the human race (violence, raping, and baby stealing) it is a wonder that she hasn’t returned to the cylons. So, no I don’t question her loyalty to the fleet.
I also think that Tigh’s willingness to question his own judgment and position in the fleet given his newly discovered cylon status bolsters his credibility—especially given the tension among the fleet and that Tigh shares his concerns with Adama. However, in the end, he stood with his friend like a frackking man.
While I admire Lee’s ability to stand up to authority, he is still too easily manipulated by Zarek and lets Kara treat him like shit.
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Stargate better than BSG? *rolls on floor laughing* And I'm a SG1 big fan lol
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I am a horny nerd.
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I still get pussy.
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while you were rolling on the floor laughing i managed to quick fuck ur mom and cumed in her mouth. Stargate is 10x better than anything BSG ever did, you will understand when u grow up. when u gain enough wisdom u will be able to understand the paramount magnitude of stargate TV shows over any other.
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horse ass is not pussy u fucking retard.
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Feb 01, 2009 3:30:57 PM CST
Dioxholster. You dinners ready. Cant you hear your Mom calling y
by col. tigh-fighter
Bless you, Junior lol. But its understandable. Your teen mind can only grasp the basics of sci-fi. When you've grown up and moved out, then perhaps a tv show with adult themes may be within your grasp. PS. My Mum says thanks :)
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the show makes it a point to show him doing that. IDGI!!
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This may have been addressed in this already long talkback but I gotta see if anyone out there has an idea about why Saul has done such a 180 Col. Tigh hated Cylons more than just about anyone in the whole frackin colonial fleet. Especially when he had to kill his beloved Ellen over them and their actions. ALLLL the way up until season 3's climax...then suddenly he learns he is a Cylon. On one hand he could have been selfish and be like...oh I'M a Cylon? Well, Cylons are a-ok! But the writing was better than that....he reacted as we imagined with shock, confusion and a little bit of self-loathing. He outed himself and all his fellow cylons and practically commanded Lee to blow him out the airlock. "Well, what are you waiting for Apollo? Do it." Great line delivery. So that was how season 4.0 ended with him still confused about what to think of himself and ready to die for the sake of the crew...determined to die as a human rather than live a Cylon. THEN, ep 1 of season 4.5 and suddenly he seems a lot more at peace with being a Cylon (was that b/c the humans made an alliance and so being a Cylon suddenly was ok?). Then, he learns that Ellen is the fifth Cylon...and ever since then in Disquiet... and The Oath he has been not only at peace with being a Cylon but one of the major proponents of defending the alliance with them. SO, my question to all you BSG lovers out there like me is how did Tigh change so fast?? Is it learning Ellen was a Cylon? Is it just loyalty to whatever the "old man" does no matter what? I dont get it. Love the show more than ever...but not getting this.
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I think the memories of being on earth gave Tigh more insight and peace. Also, getting Six pregnant probably made him feel more like a man and less of a toaster. Adama's friendship probably helps because they've had such a history. So if Adama can accept Tigh being a cylon, it is easier to process.
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BSG is not even REAL sci fi. you guys arent watching the real deal. your excitement for such a show is folly.
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Dogmatic, I think the Adama-Tigh friendship is what moderates them both and has let them evolve so quickly. Tigh can come to grips with being a Cylon for the same reason that Adama can come to grips with accepting a Cylon alliance - because they both value their personal friendship over identity politics. I think that proves to both of them that humans and Cylons CAN live together, that they CAN trust one another, and that this is about individuals who make a choice rather than people who have to accept a collective racial fate. Without the personal relationship and acceptance, I don't think either one would have been as confident in the idea of an alliance - although Adama, having developed a trusting relationship with Athena, was already moderating himself, and Tigh would have fallen into line with Adama.
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why are you here? can you please get out of here? you're kinda annoying.
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...and I will let you change out of the gimp suit next weekend.
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i actually had to search that word. I knew it, BSG-lovers are always into extreme S&M (i say extreme because traditional S&M could be acceptable now, idk im not in touch with the changes.)
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you know humans also have "hidden" programming - in fact, we share the same programming with every other animal on the planet (along with most of our genetic make-up) - right down to the snails and stick insects and single-celled organisms...
we call them "instincts" and we figured out the programming right down to the most Basic instincts - you may have heard of them - at the most fundamental level, we are programmed from birth (before, really) to Fight, Flee, Feed, or Fuck...
combined with higher functions, mostly controlled chemically and hormonally, these four basic programs determine maybe 99% of our behaviour on a day-to-day basis
we will never be free from our programming
even the comments on this very board are informed by one of these "four F's" (can you guess which one?) at the most basic level
like I said, we share the same programming, present in the same pieces of code (DNA) we share with every other creature in the world and if Ron Moore's Cylons are as "humanoid" as it's been suggested then we share the same programming with them too - although they've only been around for 50-odd years and we're obviously much more sophisticated in how we interact with our programming - the Cylons tend to have a more simplistic view of events and the universe around them...
the Final Five are the exception - Ellen Tigh, for example, was a master manipulator - having been around longer... I quite like the theory posted above, about the toasters basing their other seven models of skinjob on these Five - but not quite getting it right in the design (hence the Love instinct, not so well developed)
anyway, point is these are ORGANIC beings and when we talk about their "programming" it's a mistake to think of that as your typical machine code that makes your computer or mobile phone (or toaster?) work - even "operating system" isn't quite the right metaphor... -
WTF, you have no taste. I'm not even going to dignify your remark by referencing your user name. Go back to watching *Yor* or *Battle Beyond the Stars* because you obviously have no appreciation for good scifi on television.
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years from now i shall be hailed as your great leader...and then i will use you lynxpro as sacrifice!
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Such bravado. I'll rip your shrunken head off and give it to my cousin to store his weed in.
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Because his leg was sawn off, and this hurts. Not one of the big riddles of modern television. Why do they keep showing it? Because his leg being sawn off -- ie constant pain-- probably contributes somewhat to his mental state.
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I can't argue too much with the points you're making, they sure seem trustworthy. Hell, I'm even sympathetic, especially to Tigh. But at the end of the day, all it takes it one hidden program (NOT comparable to instincts, that's ridiculous, we're talking about directed programming, possibly controlled by a Cavil) and then that all changes. The Sharon's were meant to be trustworthy, up until the point where the switch is flipped. I certainly don't believe Tigh is knowingly being deceptive, but if "All Along the Watchtower" was able to compel him to action, then what happens when he hears "Knockin' on Heaven's Door" or "Don't Think Twice, It's All Right"? For all we know, Bob Dylan is out to get us all.
Aside from arguing my point, I now have a question. Why were the final five boxed? You could say it's because they aren't loyal to the Cylon hierarchy, but Tory is certainly a cold-hearted Cylon type. I suppose it could be because they aren't susceptible to hidden programs and therefor cannot be reliably controlled. I would imagine that we'll eventually find out, but it isn't a question I've heard tossed around lately. -
She's only loyal to herself. If she learns too much about the Cylons, she may even try to eliminate all the other competing models so she can rule over the remaining humans and the non-humanoid Cylons.
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-- I think we can call me an Adama loyalist. (Hello again, back briefly!) Maybe Maltheus is right and I'm just a sucker for a rousing musical score and screenwriter's cues. But that being said, the idea that the Cylons are in many ways not fundamentally different from humans and have an equal right to life and respect is a double edged sword. You can't just go around trusting PEOPLE, let alone cylons. If you respect someone -- especially a group of people that you were warring with about five seconds ago -- you should have a concept of their capabilites, their strengths and weaknesses, or at least have a picture of what you DON'T know. And we don't really know these cylons, not really. Even the most loveable of them could destroy man. We already, with our fellow humans, do a delicate dance of allowing our neighbor his space and autonomy whilst still covering our own ass. It shouldn't be any different with these new beings. And I agree, Tory's a dirty bitch. >:-0
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Tigh explained: his internal conflicts resolved themselves after he recovered his memories on Earth, as he was programmed to do. He's now moving to strand the humans by outfitting all ships with Cylon FTL.
What happens after this uprising is put down and he completes his mission is then up to the Cylons. -
I think she is and that's how the preview makes it look like.
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watch the last two episodes of S1 again - specifically the events which lead up to Boomer shooting the captain - it's been a while and maybe they're not quite the same as you remember them?
there was no magic switch that flipped inside Sharon and told her "you kill now!" - she was struggling with the idea that she was in fact a Cylon and that everything she thought she knew consciously about herself was at odds with what she knew subconsciously was nothing more than a fantasy, which could have been induced hypnotically, or perhaps by some Cylon equivalent...
remember we find out a little more about this particular character later - specifically the mercenary "cut and run" qualities that surface and the lack of loyalty, even to the rest of the 8's which I think is unique just to that particular 8
so first she thinks about suicide and Baltar urges her to "embrace that which opens up for (her)" and "listen to (her) heart" - which results in her taking a gun to her own head - self sacrifice is arguably (it's a controversial idea) an instinct that kicks in when relevant at an evolutionary level (for the "greater good" instead of your own survival) - again, something we've seen in other creatures too...
then she sees all those 8's and there can no longer be any doubt what she is - this time she points the gun at the man in charge of the fleet, as any "good soldier" might do, loyalties having shifted and the opportunity having presented itself-
btw in this same episode Apollo points a gun at Tigh's head, declaring he's "following his instincts" - yes he uses that word specifically - as the captain flexes some muscle over the fledgling govt - but I digress...
watch it again and refresh your memory - it is NOT presented as some Machiavellian Cylon somewhere using some trigger that "activates" Sharon like, say, in the Manchurian Candidate...
she is just going through some major shit and makes not one but two "rash" decisions with a loaded gun - if I'm wrong, by all means point out to me where I missed this "switch" and I'll take another look, otherwise I'm not gonna take the idea too literally -
Can you name some "real" sci/fi for me assfuck? I guess you can't, because you are too busy sucking Rick Berman's cock.
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She was being thanked for her service by the old man, someone whom she loved. Then her face went completely blank and she shot him (no wrestling with moral quandaries). Immediately afterward, she looked at him, all confused over how he got shot in the first place. Then she started screaming over and over again that she didn't do anything, clearly proving that she didn't even know she had done it. Later, when she comes out of it she's thanking the Gods when she finds out he's alright and pleading with Tigh to shoot her for what she's done (not so blank now, all guilt). That's pretty much the definition of a Manchurian Candidate in my book.
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Shut your fucking mouth before we airlock your pussy fag ass.
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its a girlie show, like gossip girl but with spaceships once in awhile and adults who gossip and backstab as though they are in high school; doing it to win a popularity contest. enjoy your girlie show
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The Trolling.
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You fucking troll cunt
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Anyone else notice how SD Galactica seems better than HD? Excellent episode BTW...
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Anyone else notice how SD Galactica seems better than HD? Excellent episode BTW...
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i heard a far out idea somewhere with someone suggesting his limb is growing back b/c he's a cylon. i could actually believe that. they've focused TWICE on the stump.
plus the description of cylon 5 'hungry for redemption' exactly matches what Baltar said to him on the phone in 'the oath' -
don't forget this aspect of prophecy! the 5 lords of kobol (cylons) serve the one whose name...
there is a 13th cylon (or creator of cylons) that's going to get revealed at some point. could be the same being that re-borned starbuck and/or talks to Baltar in his skull -
been wondering if that's how the show could end. with Kara also involved in killing the entire human race but ensuring the survival of the cylon-human race, now in refuge on the Colonial-allied/occupied basestar
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Feb 02, 2009 1:02:25 PM CST
If the actor who played Billy hadn't quite do you think he would
by smashing
I think he would have been and so would have Dee, shame he quit, it threw the, ahem, plan off.Tight episode, exciting and fun, reminded me of the good ol' days.
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...I think I've ever seen. Frakin' amazing.
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This last episode was good. I mean it was enjoyable to watch which has been rare since S4. That being said, it still had the typical BSG problem of moving too quickly - like with Baltar's cult, out of nowhere a vast mutiny appears ... But whatever; it's a typical thing with the show so no big deal. It's also nice to see Starbuck just acting like a jerk again. They almost completely ruined the most compelling character on the show, esp. last season, so it's a relief. for all the missteps this show has taken, I feel like there's a decent chance it'll end well. And I gotta give credit to a show that introduces true argument amongst its fans as to which characters are in the wrong or the right (though it's pretty obvious the writers are on Adama's side, not Gaeta's in this case)I can't figure out why Tigh calls Adama the old man. when he looks at least as old himself.
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Definitely where the major problems started. The irony is the flash forward at the end of Season 2 was brilliant and seemed to set the stage for something truly special.
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If Cottle flees the ship, he's pretty screwed if that stump goes gangrenous...
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He calls him the old man because he's the father figure to the crew. He may also be using it as an old jab since they obviously have grown up in the fleet together and they both were becoming the old guys.
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Lots of you guys are missing the point of Gaeta rubbing his wound. He is bitter that he lost his leg, he blames all of the recent cylon alliance stuff for the pain he has suffered. His leg has been bothering him alot and even when he went to the doctor to get treated, a cylon got priority over him. It's his ocnstant reminder thta he has paid dearly for what he perceives as the wrong moves by adama et al.
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It works because, in reality, history continues to repeat itself, and if true sci-fi is going to be taken seriously, it needs to utilize and put in to play this truth. The sins of the father man, the sins of the father.
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Nice analysis.
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I agree with others about Gaeta becoming a very important, pivotal character. And BurnHollywood, good point: is Gaeta the "dying leader" in the scrolls? I'd never thought about that, but he's now mos def in charge. He's captain of the fucking Galactica, and that puts him in charge.
The betrayal he suffered at the hands of Sharon on New Caprica is the event that's driven him over the edge. That and his leg. And the Occupation. And the Holocaust. And 50 billion humans dead.
Gods damn the Cylons to extinction. I want to see Gaeta make it happen. -
yep, good analysis. still think gaeta's gonna be a cylon and the new crew are gonna off him good
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...cause he's a Cylon, is kind of missing the obvious isn't it? Has Tight grown his eye back?
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Feb 03, 2009 5:33:18 AM CST
Baltar & Geata finally have that heart to heart chat next week!
by boomers_lips
the promo pics for next weeks episode shows Baltar back at Galactica sitting at a table with only Geata on the other side. Another pic shows a very hot looking random-Six standing behind Baltar. It's at the Baseship and she's wearing Deanna's white dress and she has very long brown hair. pics can be seen at Dryope.livejournal.com
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I am so conflicted right now. The Wire is the best television drama ever, but if this season's episodes continue to be on par with what we've been given so far....holy geeze...where do you go from here?
I hope to see GAY-ta get airlocked. Not all at once...crack open a small hole and let him get sucked out into space organ-by-organ. -
..and how they always made an issue of showing his cat? Then we find out his cat was dead all along. Something about Gaeta's stump is going to be revealed.
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A bunch of crazed rebels on one of the ships kills some of my people and my allies can't it under control...of course I'm going to take matters into my own hands. A few centurions would quell this rebellion fast.
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...way overboard regarding Adama's fate. The rebellion does not let up and there is no Cylon intervention seen.What we do see is an angry Roslin. The reckoning is going to be off the charts!
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lol. No Hubris. Some serious shit is going to hit the fans! Frak!
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As much as I lamented the gay angle in the webisode, it does add another dimension to the mutiny scene...especially since he is forced to lie to his lover, and actively betrays him in the mutiny ordering him taken into custody.
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Also, the twist that RDM employs will likely be that the reckoning will badly hurt BOTH sides. It makes one wonder if this is part of the Cylon plan - bleed them both just in time for Cavil's returnHowever, when Baltar's survival instincts lead him to hightail it off of Galactica and onto the Cylon rebel basestar, I think we can figure out which side will get the biggest hurting.
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I got through season 2 but it bores the frak out of me. I'd rate WISEGUY above what I've seen of THE WIRE. It is totally not HBO's best show ever. I'd give that crown to ROME.
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No way anything trumps that. And it had a perfect ending.
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http://obamiconme.pastemagazine.com/entries/643544-toaster.html#comments
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Anybody got a light?
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Is the best show ever produced by HBO. The Sopranos is a Pussy's hair away from the best, but I don't remember a thing from season 2-4 except that Janice killed her husband and the gambling-debt dude went into hock to pay off his debt. The rest is a blur.
I could tell you damn near everything that happened in all five seasons of The Wire.
Clay Davis for Sec. of Treasury! -
Fuh-raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaak!
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Will Rick Springfield be returning to the role he originated in 1978? Cool!
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