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Mr. Beaks Sees Twenty-Five Minutes Of Zack Snyder's WATCHMEN, Says More Than "Hurm"!

Published at: Oct. 2, 2008, 4:05 p.m. CST by mrbeaks



"I am going to look at the stars. They are so far away, and their light takes so long to reach us. All we ever see of stars are their old photographs."

When I read, I have a peculiar tendency to sort of "score the book". In other words, as soon as I pick up on the mood of the piece, a melody presents itself - typically a melody from another composer, but not always. It's a habit I cultivated in childhood, and it grew out of my fierce interest in comic books - and since movies were my other preferred method of storytelling, why not treat the reading of a graphic novel like the unfolding of a film? And so it went: Bernard Herrmann for THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS; Vangelis's "End Titles" theme from BLADE RUNNER for THE UNCANNY X-MEN; running triplets of my own devising for any of the Spider-Man series. Sometimes I hum them. Oftentimes, people think I'm certifiable. For WATCHMEN, it was Prokofiev's "Lieutenant Kije Suite" - or Sting's appropriation of it for his heavy-handed Cold War lament, "Russians" - and it was a purely emotional response to the melancholy origin story of Dr. Manhattan, which begins in Chapter IV, amid the frigid loneliness of Mars, with the above-quoted observation. For me, "Russians" and WATCHMEN have been inextricable since I made that association; it's what I hear every time I revisit Alan Moore's graphic novel (a part of me always wanted to pair the two when I made my brilliant adaptation of WATCHMEN; stunningly, that never happened). I figured it was stuck there for good. Well, now it's gone, replaced by Philip Glass's mournful, organ-tinged "Prophecies" from KOYAANISQATSI. As far as I'm concerned, Zack Snyder is henceforth in full ownership of Jon Osterman's vaporization and glowing blue rebirth as "Dr. Manhattan". And while I hate to make sweeping proclamations based on twenty-five minutes of unfinished footage (unveiled Wednesday evening by Warner Bros. at The Lot in West Hollywood), I'm beginning to sense that he's transformed Moore's "unfilmable" deconstruction of the twentieth-century superhero into indelible twenty-first century cinema. But first, Snyder's got to lock down that Glass cue - which, as of now, is not permanent (though it's certainly been on his mind for a while, seeing as how it accompanied the extended teaser at Comic Con '08). He should also do everything in his power to keep the original recording of Bob Dylan's "The Times They Are a-Changin'" for the opening title sequence (a stirring montage of key events starting with the "Minutemen" period and concluding with that molotov cocktail through the glass storefront), even though he told us that he's going to have to expanded the bridge to leg the three-minute tune out to six minutes. If there's a way to seamlessly mesh the old with the new, I'd much prefer it to a new recording; the original is too loaded with deep societal significance. And, oh, what a sickening feeling to hear it whilst watching an overcranked recreation of JFK's assassination from the vantage point of The Comedian as the second gunman (I literally flinched at this). Moore's tome has not humbled Snyder; it's emboldened him. Whereas Snyder seemed committed to channeling Frank Miller's 300 directly from the page to the screen (with every thrust and decapitation intact), he's bravely added his own flourishes to WATCHMEN. Aside from the music, which adroitly evokes the era (KOYAANISQATSI was very much a 1980s Cold War creation), he's also made reference to the most influential movies of our time. When you see Nixon in the War Room, it's Kubrick's War Room; when Dr. Manhattan is brutally taming Vietnam, it's Coppola's Vietnam (though, according to production designer Alex McDowell, minor stylistic alterations, like the shape of the overhead lights in the War Room, were necessary to avoid legal dust-ups*). Snyder may not be a stranger to audaciousness (he did, after all, remake DAWN OF THE DEAD), but this is the first time I've sensed him in the work. And I think this reconfiguring of classic cinematic tropes is a potentially brilliant idea. Conceptually, it's in keeping with Moore's depiction of pop culture rising up against (or knuckling under) the encroachment of full-blown authoritarianism; hell, I think the notoriously cranky writer might even approve of some of these changes. I do not, however, think he'd be a huge fan of Snyder's pre-credit fight sequence between The Comedian and you-know-who. Though it's an essential (and very well done) capitulation to the demands of the marketplace, purists will almost certainly carp at the idea of a conventional action set piece (probably a minute long) kicking off WATCHMEN. The jailhouse rescue of Rorschach has also been protracted to show off the combat expertise of Nite Owl and Silk Spectre; again, it's invigorating stuff (Snyder subscribes to the full-shot, long-take philosophy of filmic fisticuffs, which is refreshing in our post-BOURNE age), but it's definitely an embellishment of what's on the page. Same goes for Dr. Manhattan casually exploding a bunch of thugs in a night club - though I think we all can agree on the shot of the tough guys' innards plastered to the ceiling from the impact. This is what happens when mere mortals go toe-to-toe with a real-life "Superman". One other fan caveat has been the fetish-y appearance of Michael Wilkinson's costumes. Drop it. On a functional level, they work beautifully within Snyder's (and McDowell's) heightened environment; meanwhile, on a thematic level, they're a smart and, I think, necessary answer to the rubber-suit nonsense of the modern superhero movie. With such heavily deconstructive material, Snyder would be remiss if he didn't comment on the medium in which this version of Moore's narrative is being told. At the end of the day, it's twenty-five minutes of unfinished footage, so I don't want to damn the film with unreasonable expectations by saying it's "epochal" or that it "looks like nothing I've ever seen before" - even though both escaped my lips as I discussed the presentation with Moriarty on the way home. It's too early. And these pre-release, piecemeal hype generators can be misleading. That said, even if Snyder Bathgates the rest of the movie, those opening credits and Dr. Jon Osterman's Glass-scored ascent from man to God are all-timers. Available evidence suggests that these passages won't be isolated glimmers of genius. It's taken two decades, but the light has reached us. People, I think Zack Snyder has conquered WATCHMEN. My apologies, Zack, but you called your shot last night. You've earned the hyperbole. Now finish this fucker right. Faithfully submitted, Mr. Beaks

*Yes, the Fox lawsuit came up, and, no, Snyder had nothing to say beyond a stock "We're focused on finishing the movie" type of deflection.)

Readers Talkback

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  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    Cool

    by Ravyn

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:02 p.m. CST

    cool, part 2

    by Ravyn

    I just read the graphic novel a month ago and now I'm even more stoked to see the film.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:03 p.m. CST

    Huh...

    by toshiro-solo

    Could it be? A decent adaptation of Watchmen?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:05 p.m. CST

    Damn, Beaks you just got me really excited for this.

    by Cameron1

    Imma gon' be pissed if Snyder can't pull this off.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:08 p.m. CST

    It's unavoidable...

    by Octaveaeon

    but your mention of the Glass score and the nod to Kubrick's War Room cannot but heighten my expectations for this movie.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:09 p.m. CST

    sweet

    by rookie116

    sweet

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:10 p.m. CST

    More suggestions for music...

    by The Equalizer

    Opening title sequence (Comedian death) to the tune of 'Ding Dong the Witch is dead'. Manhattan's birth - Walking on sunshine - Katrina and the Waves Prison Break sequence - The Benny Hill Theme. Sounds fucking great though. I was stunned by the teaser trailer so I re-read the comic and I was stunned by that, now I'm just going to loon out until the fucking thing gets released!!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:10 p.m. CST

    Philip Glass

    by catlettuce4

    Philip Glass? FUCK YEAH!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:12 p.m. CST

    Beaks...

    by Nickn328

    Based on what you saw, do you think that this movie will be better than The Dark Knight, or do you think that movie is still gonna be the king a year from now?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:12 p.m. CST

    I Don't Understand... Too Complicated...

    by BojTrek

    Maybe it is because I have been coding files all day. Maybe it is because I just yelled at my daughters to be quiet, so I can finish work. But... Did he like the 25 minutes or no? He is way too wordy for my frame of mind right now. PLEASE NOTE: This is a serious post. Did he like it and was it cool in its unfinished form?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:13 p.m. CST

    Mr. Beaks

    by catlettuce4

    How was the dialog? We didn't see any in the trailer and I felt that that was the the only part that was keeping me from getting excited.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:13 p.m. CST

    Music We Know Is In The Movie

    by mrbeaks

    "99 Luftballons" and "Unforgettable" by Nat King Cole (the latter being in an 80s Calvin Klein-esque commercial which plays in the background as The Comedian gets his ass handed to him).

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:17 p.m. CST

    Hmmmmm...

    by Pawprint

    Can you not go into detail and tell us exactly what you saw?<p> Also, I am still not convinced by the costumes - I think saying that they are an 'updated deconstruction' of modern superhero films is just an easy 'out'. I think they have been done this way in order to lure in the 'casual' superhero film lover - something familiar for the uninitiated to latch onto.<p> Plus - going by the trailer, I don't think the film looks 'grimy' enough - it all looks too vibrant and pristine. I would have preferred an almost documentary-style look to the film.<p> All that said; Beaks' report does fill my hole with soap.<p> Sorry - soul with hope.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:18 p.m. CST

    Great review...and great taste in music but...

    by Mysterious Bones

    I just can't get how you put Watchmen to Prokofiev! Even that composers more sombre works are uplifting to me (and I can't listen to him without thinking about Christmas for some reason). For mine, Watchmen is a little sci-fi and a little gloomy but throught provoking enough to keep you coming back over and over...so my pick is 'The motion of the stars' and 'metallic rain' from Vangelis' direct CD (one of his all time best). I may now be looking forward to this movie more than any other - its definitely up there with Tron2.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:19 p.m. CST

    Extaended Jailbreak? Extended Comedian fight? Good!

    by Movietool

    This is, after all, a movie and NOT the comic itself. Changes should be made in the transition from one medium to the next. <p>I just hope the movie isn't as endlessly melancholy as the comic. It works for literature, but personally I don't want to be depressed when I step out of the movie theater. <P>I'm probably in the minority on that, however.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:20 p.m. CST

    Dialgoue

    by mrbeaks

    Mostly from the comic book. No problems there.<br><br>NickN328: The two sequences that really wowed me destroy anything in THE DARK KNIGHT.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:21 p.m. CST

    I've said it before....

    by superzero

    and I'll say it again, this will be one HELL of a movie! CAN NOT FRIKIN WAIT!!!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:24 p.m. CST

    Pawprint

    by mrbeaks

    I didn't bring a notebook because I didn't want to get stuck analyzing every moment in exact detail. I knew there would be others doing that. I just wanted to sit back and see if it played as a movie.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:27 p.m. CST

    MrBeaks

    by Pawprint

    Fair play Sir - but I didn't mean in exact detail. I just meant could you tell us what sequences you saw and how well they worked, in overview?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:30 p.m. CST

    Thanks, Beaks

    by DennisMM

    But for me it's still going to be a matter of the acting. Can these performers make me believe we're in Moore's milieu? Can they make me care as much about the characters as I did seeing them as lines and patches of ink? The review seems to focus on visuals and music, and while most great films depend upon those, they are, in the end, decoration.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:32 p.m. CST

    Thanks God the title of the article wasn't...

    by Argentino

    "Mr. Beaks watches the Watchmen", otherwise I would have shot myself. Beaks, can you promise us you guys will start avoiding that anoying and overused reference? specially when the reviews start coming, please???

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:32 p.m. CST

    Owl of Minerva...

    by Octaveaeon

    ... Blood From the Shoulder of Pallas [Athene]. Come on Snyder, make a movie on the Peloponnesian War -- make it a trilogy if you want. Plenty of material. Pericles. The Sicilian expedition. The dictatorship of the 400. In a nutshell: The rise and fall of Athenian democracy. Extra points if you end with the death of Socrates. Minerva would be proud.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    Performances Look Spot-On, DennisMN

    by mrbeaks

    Crudup especially. Would've been nice to get more Patrick Wilson, but I enjoyed his behind-the-mask interplay with Akerman. (BTW, Snyder mentioned that the sex scene between Dan and Laurie was "explicit".)<br><br>I didn't mention it in the piece, but someone's going to ask: with credits, the current cut would run 170 minutes. Snyder wants to add in the "Black Freighter" for a comprehensive cut somewhere down the line, so that would kick us up over three hours.<br><br>BTW, Snyder still hasn't seen the finished "Black Freighter" stuff.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    As someone who hated, HATED 300...

    by henrydalton

    You've restored a faint glimmer of hope that this might not be ruined. Thanks Beaks :)

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    Beaks

    by Herewereyouwish

    Thanks for the update, really energized my excitement for this movie after a few weeks of not hearing too much. Way to continue to be my favorite part of Ain't it Cool.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    I'm really looking forward to this, but the JFK thing...

    by Frisco

    ...disappoints me. If I remember correctly, it's based on a throw-away joke where the Comedian replies to some big wigs at a party, something like "Just don't ask me where I was when I heard that Kennedy had been shot." Everyone gets a hearty laugh out of it, and the reader is left wondering if the implication is true or just the Comedian riffing on his own reputation. I like the ambiguity there. It seems like the movie will have a tougher time accomplishing the redemption of that character than the comic did if viewers think (or know) from the outset that he assassinated JFK. Hmmm, it could also make his arc that much greater, I suppose, though I just wonder how the movie will have time for it. Should be interesting!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:41 p.m. CST

    Frisco

    by Pawprint

    The JFK thing worried me too. A bit of departure is expected in transforming a graphic novel to film, but is this going a bit too far?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:41 p.m. CST

    My Watchmen score...

    by Gwai Lo

    Would be about 2/3rds of Michael Nyman's score for A Zed and Two Noughts, hopefully expanded so that it's more of the epic, horn-fuelled bombastic stuff and less of the sped up violiny stuff.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:45 p.m. CST

    No, the JFK thing isn't going too far.

    by Fawst

    It makes sense. And I agree, I think it will make his arc that much stronger.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:46 p.m. CST

    an 80s Calvin Klein-esque commercial

    by Thrillho77

    Ah....Nostalgia....by Veidt....

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:50 p.m. CST

    The JFK line...

    by Thrillho77

    I "get" that it was played as ambiguous in the comic, and that it was said as an off-handed joke. But I, for one, actually read it as the Comedian WAS there and did it, but that he played it off as a joke and everyone laughed at it without considering that it was true. I just felt that it would be entirely fitting for the Comedian's background and attitude, that it would have been true.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:50 p.m. CST

    If this is better than Dark Knight.....

    by The Dum Guy

    I wonder if we'll finally get an R rated Batman?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:54 p.m. CST

    Why does everyone want to see an R-Rated Batman?

    by Gwai Lo

    What do you want to see? Nudity? Swearing? Gore? None of this stuff has any place in Batman. The Dark Knight was one of the hardest PG13s of all time. A man gets a pencil lodged in his brain.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 4:59 p.m. CST

    Anticipation

    by Lost4Words

    This is all very good news indeed. Love the novel can not wait for the movie! Thanks Beaks

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:02 p.m. CST

    mr beaks...

    by Dr.DirtyD

    You know there are a few panels in the comic where Dr Manhattan IS seen casually blowing up guys (or a guy) in a night club. It's in part 4, right after Dr. M becomes a government tool. In fact he laments having to do it, and he questions the morality of his work.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:05 p.m. CST

    an R rated Batman

    by Paul Bucciarelli

    is an absolutely ridiculous idea that appeals to nerds that don't have a clue what real adult storytelling is.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:06 p.m. CST

    Not "A Few"...

    by mrbeaks

    It's *a* panel. And it doesn't hint at the bloody aftermath depicted by Snyder.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:09 p.m. CST

    FUCK SLOW MOTION ACTION SEQUENCES

    by Kapowski

    .

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:14 p.m. CST

    The Watchmen - Moore's deconstruction..

    by Octaveaeon

    of the superhero genre was essentially a veiled deconstruction of the graphic medium as a means for disseminating knowledge but also preserving essentially destructive power structures. I wonder if his reference to the Owl of Minerva is in itself a direct reference to Hegel, namely the famous preface to his 'Philosophy of Right': <p> "A further word on the subject of issuing instructions on how the world ought to be: philosophy, at any rate, always comes too late to perform this function. As the thought of the world, it appears only at a time when actuality has gone through its formative process and attained its completed state. This lesson of the concept is necessarily also apparent from history, namely that it is only when actuality has reached maturity that the ideal appears opposite the real and reconstructs this real world, which it has grasped in its substance, in the shape of the intellectual realm. When philosophy paints its grey in grey, a shape of life has grown old, and it cannot be rejuvenated, but only recognized, by the grey in grey of philosophy; the owl of Minerva begins its flight only with the onset of dusk."

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:35 p.m. CST

    You guys realize...

    by Archive

    ...that before today, I had exactly zero interest in seeing Watchmen. Now, you've got me wondering juyst how Zach Snyder fits into a new generation of filmmakers. Making this kind of leap months before release... Guys, come on. It's cruel, what you're doing to me.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:36 p.m. CST

    Dusk of Western Culture...

    by Octaveaeon

    Considering that more and more movies are depicting different aspects about the end of western culture (and the world), if not the limits and/or consequences of things we've taken for granted in the west (wealth, freedom, security; cf. The Dark Knight) -- themes very prominent in Moore's work, particularly Promethea, which culminates in a true 'apocalypse' (i.e. 'revelation,'; cf. with all the New Age type theories surrounding the date '2012') -- it makes sense to deconstuct the idea of history itself at the supposed 'end of History'. <p>Especially now, with growing tendencies to proclaim the 'end of capitalism,' and that "Marx was right" (Marxism, mind you, was itself based on a messianic view of history, itself a distortion of Hegel's ideas), it is time to reveal the limits of modern thought. Otherwise we risk falling for the same sort of decisionistic trap that Schmitt and Heidegger fell for, and which lead them to side with National Socialism. Allow me to quote once more, this time from Leo Strauss: <p> "But precisely since the West is the culture in which culture reaches full self-consciousness, it is the final culture: the owl of Minerva begins its flight in the dusk; the decline of the West is identical with the exhaustion of the very possibility of high culture; the highest possibilities of man are exhausted. But man’s highest possibilities cannot be exhausted as long as there are still high human tasks—as long as the fundamental riddles which confront man, have not been solved to the extent to which they can be solved. We may therefore say that Spengler’s analysis and prediction is wrong: our highest authority, natural science, considers itself susceptible of infinite progress, there cannot be a meaningful end or completion of history; there can only be a brutal stopping of man’s onward march through natural forces acting by themselves or directed by human brains and hands." <p> And: <p> "[Hegel’s] system of philosophy, the final philosophy, the perfect solution of all philosophic problems belongs to the moment when mankind has solved in principle its political problem by establishing the post-revolutionary state, the first state to recognize the equal dignity of every human being as such. This absolute peak of history, being the end of history, is at the same time the beginning of the final decline. In this respect Spengler has merely brought out the ultimate conclusion of Hegel’s thought. No wonder therefore that almost everyone rebelled against Hegel."

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:37 p.m. CST

    Life isn't fair.

    by DarthCorleone

    I'm in Hollywood. I want to see!!!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:49 p.m. CST

    Can anyone...

    by anyrandomhero

    put me out of my misery and tell me if the squid is in or out? I know it was out in earlier drafts just want to know if Snyder has put it back in. If he has then he's my new hero! Fuck the general public we've honestly seen more ridiculous things happen in films

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:52 p.m. CST

    FUCK YOU SNYDER

    by ominus

    AND YOUR BLASPHEMY FOR A MOVIE i read all the info about the screening and the below statement about ZACK THE HACK SNYDER vision about the film,sums up why alan moore is so right to fart at hollywoods face: -Snyder did not set out to adapt “Watchmen” as a purist, and thusly did not endeavor to include absolutely everything in the movie, rather just what struck him personally as “cool.”-

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 5:53 p.m. CST

    Unfilmable...or just a pain in the ass?

    by RosebudsTheSled

    I forsee this movie being widely loved except for the the three guys who will hate it because it isn't the book...just like the absolutely shitstains that disliked The Lord Of The Rings movies because they didn't get the number of hairs on Frodos left middle toe right...im going to get it out now and just point out that when this movie is released there will be uproar for one reason and one reason only...WATCHMEN By Alan Moore, will not and can not ever be a movie! Now, you can make a Watchmen movie, absolutely, one that is is fucking brilliant and captures great things out of the book, but the book literally has ten page dry spots...just like alot of Moore's work. So when Moore gets pissed off about adaptations of his comics, he's pissed off because he knows you can't take his stuff and turn it into a film, because he's self aware of the pretentious drivel he knows how to create so very, very well. NOW FRIENDS-Alan Moore is a deeply talented man mind you, but I get the feeling he has for years been without professional dictractors, and therefore is a pretty poor editor of himself...like a Mr. Lucas we all know. In conclusion..BRING ON WATCHMEN THE MOVIE! And don't complain about set pieces and action sequences...we're in move land now!...and Alan Moore, get the stick out of your ass and realize you're a damn lucky guy, blessed with an amazing amount of talent, and go out, watch this movie, and realize the greatest you've influenced...

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:06 p.m. CST

    i have heard the squid

    by aestheticity

    is in, from someone claiming this was stated at either this or a very recent panel. or more precisely, ive heard the squid will be seen. make of that what you will.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:09 p.m. CST

    FACT: KOYAANISQATSI IS THE BEST SCORE EVER

    by Proman1984

    AND PRUIT IGOE is the best cue ever. PHILIP GLASS RULES.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:33 p.m. CST

    Music

    by Tony fucknuts

    Yeah, i can't read the funeral chapter without hearing the song quoted at the end, "The Comedians". I wonder if they'll try to incorporate all the songs moore quotes in the book?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:41 p.m. CST

    The JFK bit is in the book....

    by catlettuce4

    ...or at least hinted at. Remember the sequence where the Comedian and G. Gordon Liddy are at a cocktail party talking and Eddie says "just don't ask me where I was when I heard about Kennedy," causing Liddy to crack up at the shared joke.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:42 p.m. CST

    The Squid is OUT

    by Jawa 007

    for real. but the fix is good and within the spirit/universe of the story.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:54 p.m. CST

    Wait. So, Ace Ventura wasn't the 2nd gunman on the Grassy Knoll?

    by thebearovingian

    But he confessed!

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:57 p.m. CST

    what the fuck did i just read... ugh

    by Stengah

    thanks for sharing your thoughts beaks, but something was off with this. worse then moriarty.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 6:59 p.m. CST

    "it's definitely an embellishment of what's on the page"

    by O_Goncho

    It's a movie, Beaks. Srsly though my expectations for this have now sky rocketed which is very bad because up to now they've been very mediated and I thought I was doing so well... I don't suppose you had your camera phone set to record during all this did you?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 7:31 p.m. CST

    Why should we get an R rated Batman?

    by The Dum Guy

    So, it can be even more realistic. Doesn't have any nudity, but we can get realistic dialogue, instead of "That's not good... oh! That's not good" we can get "What the fuck? Oh, that is not good!"<br><br>Instead of cutaways shots of someone getting cut with a knife (and for some reason, there is no blood), we can get a more realistic kill.<br><br>Instead of pandering to the teenage demographic, Nolan can make a picture that is more like in tone with his others, like every other movie he's made (which are all rated R).

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 7:49 p.m. CST

    DUMGUY

    by quamb

    So you want blood and swearing in a batman movie? COOL! That'll make the story telling so much better.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 8 p.m. CST

    quamb

    by The Dum Guy

    Not better, but more realistic.<br><br>Look at The Prestige and tell me that movie would have been better with a PG-13, or Memento. An R doesn't mean crap to quality, but as far as comic heroes go Batman, Punisher, and SwampThing are more inclined for darker (hence R material) storylines.<br><br>I'm not saying Dark Knight would have been better with an R, but I don't think it would have taken anything away from the storyline.<br><br>Alot of Batman's foes lend themselves more to R ratings, like Scarcrow's fear toxin alone could make for some hard R stuff, Killer Croc eats people, Man-Bat eats people, Joker kills alot of people (usually more than what was in DK). I don't see how anyone could argue that having a PG-13 lends itself to having a better story.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 8:29 p.m. CST

    thebearovingian

    by Thrillho77

    Greatest. Callback. Ever. Brilliantly played.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:16 p.m. CST

    Gwai Lo - Stop it w/ the pencil!

    by karatemedia

    All of you - stop talking about how TDK was so intense because it had "the pencil trick" in it! What did you see? Nothing! A pencil on a table, then a guy clutching his eye as he fell over. It's all implied and very PG - stop acting like we saw a pencil sticking out of a man's mutilated eye while streams of blood sprayed out of his face. TDK was not "intense" for a PG-13 movie. If anything, it was accurately rated.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:33 p.m. CST

    More violence and profanity would do NOTHING...

    by IAmJack'sUserID

    ...for a Batman movie. More realistic? What for? There's already the suspension of disbelief in the first place to accept that a man would dress up like a bat and take on criminality. Nah, I'd rather accept that I am watching something highly filtered and instead be moved and excited by the story and characters onscreen.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:39 p.m. CST

    you're all asshats

    by RosebudsTheSled

    Batman is a character that is meant to be widly enjoyed...therefore my friends, a PG-13 Batman is not only the RIGHT way of adapting the character it is the NEEDED way! Imagine yourselves at 8, or 10, or 12...at the height of your comic book infatuation...remember how Batman was your character? Imagine if they'd made a movie that you couldn't even have possibly seen based on YOUR character? It's just fucking mean to go off on the idea that Batman should be made into an R Rated Movie...Watchmen is different dearies...because 8,10, or 12 year old you doesn't have a clue about it, nor is he or she emotionally connected to those characters...

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:58 p.m. CST

    For those of you who think PG-13...

    by DoctorStopMo

    ...was something of a letdown for a Batman movie, you're idiots. No, that's being generous. Would it really have added to the movie to watch blood spurting out of a guy's eye? Oh, that would be "realistic?" As someone who's worked in a trauma center, when you have a penetrating injury like that, the object itself frequently prevents blood from gushing out. So it would actually be LESS realistic to show gushing blood, and again, you're fucking retarded. Why don't you go sit in a corner and think about why you need to see gushing blood to enjoy something and how that makes you a shallow, twisted person?

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:59 p.m. CST

    For some reason, folks thinks all movies...

    by karatemedia

    ...should be rated R. Every time words gets out that a film will be PG-13, there's always a pissed off horde that thinks that not being rated R is some horrible thing. But yes, Watchmen is a film that should be R, based on the source material.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 9:59 p.m. CST

    Oh, and...

    by DoctorStopMo

    If it wasn't PG-13, it wouldn't have done the kind of box office it did, and it wouldn't have changed the superhero film genre the way it did, and so on. So you'd be getting less of what you wanted.<P> And again, you're retarded.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 10:02 p.m. CST

    Oh, and DoctorStopMo

    by karatemedia

    BTW, if that was partially directed toward me (like you even care 'bout me) I wasn't saying that I wanted to see blood spurting out. I'm just tired of everyone saying how intense the pencil scene is - the violence in TDK is very well crafted to imply blood/gore without showing it. Which is not a bad thing.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 10:06 p.m. CST

    ColWTH

    by DoctorStopMo

    I disagree that the public won't get it. I've recommended the graphic novel to many non-comic book friends, and every single one has come back and told me that they loved it. I don't think it takes a particularly deep intelligence to realize that what you have in front of you is a beautiful treatment of humanity, our heroes, our villains, existence, nuclear war, and a brilliantly crafted story.<P> As for your assertion that the material isn't deep - you either missed it or you haven't read it. Trust me - it's deep. There's a lot of visual tonality that you've probably missed. Rorschach's coat buttons for example: pay close attention to them. Look at the scenes of him with the Crimebusters - his dialogue balloon isn't Rorschach's, it's Walter Kovacs'. His coat buttons are all there. Note the scenes of him when he's describing himself as Kovacs in a mask, when he's hunting down the kidnappers of the little girl. Buttons all there. Note the moment when he becomes Rorschach, and every chronological point thereafter: he loses a coat button as he's butchering the dog's head, and he's fully unhinged - he's Rorschach. Do you even know what the Black Freighter represents? Why it's there? I'm guessing no.<P> If you don't think there's depth, buddy, it just flew over your head. Stop criticizing the material and get back on the short bus.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 10:10 p.m. CST

    Karatemedia

    by DoctorStopMo

    Okay, if you weren't implying that the lack of blood was a bad thing, then it's fine. I think the way that Batman treated violence is great. It's there, it's visceral, it's real enough, but not so over the top that it's idiotic (see: Kill Bill) or turns off the general public. Believe me, if you're a comic book fan, you want to see these movies being made, and you want the public in general to love them. As long as it's close enough to the source and not completely mailed in solely for appeal to the masses, my guess is comic book fans will be happier in the long run.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 10:23 p.m. CST

    Wow

    by Brian

    I'm so hard right now. . . I could smash granite with my penis.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 10:25 p.m. CST

    DoctorStopMo

    by karatemedia

    It just depends on the film. The level of violence in TDK is appropriate for that film (and it's to Nolan's credit that people think it's so much more gorier than it really is). But the level of violence in Kill Bill is also appropriate for that film. Watchmen is more of an "R" property - for many reasons, not just violence. Will it work at a PG-13? Probably, but thematically, it just seems like a film for adults, not kids.

  • Oct. 2, 2008, 11:35 p.m. CST

    This is a Watchmen talkback

    by My friends call me Killjoy

    NOT a Dark Knight talkback. I'm so sick of hearing about Dark Knight that my head feels like someone shoved a pencil in my eye.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 12:59 a.m. CST

    Am I missing something? What the hell is KOYAANISQATSI?

    by Chicken Thunder

    Anyone?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:01 a.m. CST

    I just want more movies to be more than kids shit...

    by The Dum Guy

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:06 a.m. CST

    by The Dum Guy

    I'm tired of sitting in a theatre having to see a hundred fucking cell phones being text to each other.<br><br>I'll say this for selling out to the highest demographic, it is as good as it makes a buck. But, saying we should make everything viewable to everyone who might want to see it is pathetic. I saw a lot of R rated movies when I couldn't see them in theaters, and ya know what?... I saw 'em fucking video or I bought tickets to a PG-13 movie and saw an R rated one anyway.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:19 a.m. CST

    My friends call me Killjoy

    by zooch

    I can't wait to buy that The Dark Knight dvd!

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:53 a.m. CST

    ColWTH: "I grew up enough to know comic books were schlock"

    by filmcans

    You do realize comics are a medium and not a genre, right? You managed to not only sound self-important, but also ignorant with that statment.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:58 a.m. CST

    Ha ha ha!

    by Chicken Thunder

    "Turns out, Moore's point was that the USA sucks, it's evil, and it needs to be destroyed. THAT was his message." <br> <br> He wasn't right at all was he? Seeing as half the population of the planet thinks that 20 years on. Not saying that's my point of view (destroy america), but his foreshadowing was pretty spot on. But nevermind, as you say, it's schlock, right?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 2:12 a.m. CST

    "statement

    by filmcans

    typo. sorry.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 2:41 a.m. CST

    KurtLockwood

    by O_Goncho

    I agree completely. Beaks''style' just doesn't do it for me. I want to hear about the movie and what you thought, not your eclectic music taste.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 2:44 a.m. CST

    Ha Ha!

    by drew mcweeny

    I saw five more minutes of the film than Mr Beaks did! Aha! You suck!

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 3:16 a.m. CST

    ColWTH

    by DoctorStopMo

    Again, you're just making yourself out to be stupid. I'm beginning to doubt that you know what "depth" is. There are some of the best characterizations I've read in any medium. There's incredible subtlety in so many of the panels it's sickening (do you know who manufactures the sugar cubes that Rorschach is eating? Who owns the locksmith company that appears at multiple points throughout?) There's a lot of subtext, and an honest examination of the personalities that would put on a mask and costume and go out to hurt criminals. Yes, those people would be messed up. Yes, the truths of their lives, personalities, and deeds would be uncomfortable.<P> Whether or not you agree with Moore's central anti-American theme - and I certainly don't - he crafted a work of substantial depth, emotion, and with an elaborate plot. WATCHMAKER is one of the best single issues I've ever read of anything, ever. I can dig it if non-linear story, perfect continuity backstories for everyone, and realistic portrayals of the psychopaths that would become vigilantes is not your thing. But please, give *ME* a break with your "inch of depth." I'm not the only one that thinks it was more than superficial schlock, and there are an enormous amount of literary critics who would agree with me. Just because you don't like the anti-American themes (and again, I didn't), that doesn't make the work superficial. It actually makes *you* superficial if it's beyond you to enjoy something that doesn't fit exactly within your world view.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 3:49 a.m. CST

    Pencil trick

    by Gwai Lo

    The pencil trick scene WAS harder than most stuff you see in PG13 films. Only big blockbusters get away with shit like that, because they have more leverage with the MPAA. But fine, if a man being killed instantly by a pencil going through his eyeball into his brain isn't enough for you, what about Harvey Dent's face or the high death toll? Jerry Maguire was Rated R for crying out loud. Just to put things in perspective.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 4:38 a.m. CST

    Scweam! it wiw be a fwop SCWEAM!!! *yawn*

    by G100

    Same fucking shit just a different day from someone with an obsessive borderline ceritifiable hatred for this Movie and book.<p> <p>Frankly you have been laughably predicting certain Doom and that the public wouldn't get it for months so why the MASSIVE sales of the Trade paperback ? Odd ?<p> <p>And Yeah, after Dark Knight it's pretty clear the public hates dark Comic book Movies and won't go out to see them in any great numbers.<p> <p>Tell you what just paste "I HATE WATCHMEN!" repeatedly in a single post 50 times and save us all from the tedious repetition every time there's a Watchmen thread. Kay ? Kay.<p> <p>Koyaanisqatsi scoring that's fucking Genius! Love that bit of Music. If only Snyder can keep it in a DVD cut.<p> <p>This is looking more and more promising with every passing day. Squiddy or no.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 4:52 a.m. CST

    When I was in high school I let my english professor read Watchm

    by Jackie Boy

    He's never read a comic book in his life, yet he came back to me practically foaming at the mouth, raving about all the depth of the themes and symbolism. He honestly went out and bought several copies to distribute and even thought about campaigning to put Watchmen in the curiculum.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 5:36 a.m. CST

    ColWTH...

    by Ghostball

    ...apparently one of the world's authorities on 'depth'. Watchmen is apparently not many FEET deep. It's an 'inch' deep. Ouch.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 6:30 a.m. CST

    Well, it can't be worse that the adaptation of Moore's LOEG.

    by OgreYouAsshole

    And I have faith in Snyder. His dawn remake was better than 300 btw.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:02 a.m. CST

    300 was awful

    by Samuel Fulmer

    Just thought I'd like to add that. There was so much slow motion/speed up, I thought I was playing a homoerotic version of Viewtful Joe on the Game Cube.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:04 a.m. CST

    That aside

    by Samuel Fulmer

    Watchmen could be good. Just hope that the fast forward/rewind button isn't pushed by the director/editor this time.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:07 a.m. CST

    Not AntiAmerican

    by WerePlatypus

    Just a deconstruction of nationalism and national identity in general, and how superheroes have been used militarily, covertly, and symbolically in comics to support national agendas. He happened to choose America because that was his audience and the audience of most comics. In the last few issues, the scope widens considerably to human nature in general, with political entities as both an obstacle to peace and an opportuntity to project the collective hostility of humanity through horror and destruction (as opposed to a positive message or any sense of hope). If you want some shallow, four-color propganda, watch a presidential debate. . . Watchman goes a little deeper than that.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:37 a.m. CST

    Watchmen..

    by kingoflight

    Looks great from the trailer i am glad that there is not much screwing with the format. I'd rather it be a complete carbon copy from the graphic novel than a screw up. I am worried that this movie won't do that well because its lack of fan base say in comparison to the dark night.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:56 a.m. CST

    Jawa... give some context for your assertion that the squid...

    by Le Vicious Fishus

    is OUT. Are you one of the many who have read one of the scores of WATCHMEN drafts out there? Or are you a legitimate WATCHMEN insider? I can tell you, no Squid substitution will work. I'll believe it when I see it anyway.<BR><BR>NO SQUID, NO PEACE.<BR><BR>KNOW SQUID, KNOW PEACE.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 9:52 a.m. CST

    Moore is still a chump.

    by Kizeesh

    Despite being an utter utter genius, he offsets his imagination and good writing by being a pretentious up-his-own-ass tom-fool of epic proportions.<p> Then again, what do you expect from an under-educated working class lad, who was suddenly hailled as the messiah of his chosen profession?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 10:02 a.m. CST

    Possibly a better report than Moriarty's

    by zapano

    no offence mori, but this was a really enjoyable piece to read

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 10:04 a.m. CST

    *** Great costume design in a superhero flick! ***

    by JDanielP

    It's just too damn rare. But then, the overall vision of the director needs to support the costume interpretation, if you know what I mean. The costumes need to look right in the picture's environment, in the right settings. For example, if you want an X-men flick that is more faithful than ever, you get the costume (design) department from this flick and combine that with Zack Snyder's vision. I'm sure that Zack would treat it with the same respect as he does with WATCHMEN. And to me, that looks to be something spectacular.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 10:17 a.m. CST

    Regarding Alan Moore: who cares?

    by Le Vicious Fishus

    I don't give a flying fuck what Alan Moore is like as a personality or interviewee. His writing is fucking brilliant, and "who he is as a person" shouldn't affect that fact one iota. I don't know why some folks get so hung up on artists' personal proclivities and character quirks. Why do you give a shit as long as what they produce is of superior quality?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 11:21 a.m. CST

    I won't pay to see this....nor will most people....

    by DANNYGLOVERS_DICKBLOOD

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 11:52 a.m. CST

    Beaks... we need to know...

    by subtlety

    Synder's Achilles heel on this is the speed-up/slo-mo bullshit that comprises 80% of 300. It's in the trailer for this sucker too. I might be OK with a tiny, tiny bit of it (the part of the trailer where Viedt whacks his would-be assassin into a pool is a good example) using it for the majority of the action would be a disaster and would ruin the tone of the book for me. Now, I'm hearing both that he uses the technique frequently (including the the opening sequence) AND that he subscribes to the high-depth long-shot mode of shooting. Does the camerawork lean more towards 300 or The French Connection (btw, my personal preference for how the film should look)?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 12:15 p.m. CST

    still skeptical

    by Dr Eric Vornoff

    but this is starting to sound like it might actually be good. <p> I think it's easy to make any work of art sound 'shallow' when you just boil it down to it's basic themes. I think what makes anything 'deep' is ambiguity, which Watchmen has plenty of no matter Moore's stated intentions. ColWTH's ranting made me think of a right-wing columnist in the UK who once said that anyone over the age of 21 should 'grow up' and only listen to classical music. He thought this made him sound cultured and intelligent but in reality it just revealed him as really, really dumb. I was 'grown up' enough to realise that comics were mostly schlock from a young age. Didn't stop me enjoying them for what they were nor did I dismiss the entire medium as incapable of 'depth' based on that. ColWTH probably thinks An American Carol has depth because it's, you know, pro-American.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 12:15 p.m. CST

    General Crom

    by DANNYGLOVERS_DICKBLOOD

    I'm a moron, and 12 years old because I won't be seeing this? <p> Wow. For the record I don't think it looks bad. Its just that I can give a fuck about these characters and its not attractive enough for someone who is not a fan of the books, to go see. <P> Thanks for being so kind. Cunt.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 12:34 p.m. CST

    DANNYGLOVERSDICKHEAD

    by Paul Bucciarelli

    You don't give a fuck enough to see it but will post comments about it? Remind us again: Why did you even came into this section? Oh right, I forgot. You need the attention. By the way, you really do come off in your posts as being 12 or 13 years old. That's not being kind. Cunt.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1 p.m. CST

    Re: Le Vicious Fishus

    by Kizeesh

    Because he's an annoying cunt. He is also horribly outspoken, and I feel the need to express my contempt for him, precisely BECAUSE he is such a good writer. I'm just sick of people going the opposite way and assuming his opinions are right simply because he can write a good comic.<p> Myself, I have a simple view on it all.<p> Don't judge the Art by the artist, nor the artist by his Art.<p> Which is why I can happily say I think Emin is shite, because you supposedly need to understand her to 'get her art'. Well fine, that just means it's shit art.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:09 p.m. CST

    wow....a lot of love for Watchmen in here....

    by DANNYGLOVERS_DICKBLOOD

    Okay. Fine. I'll be on my way now. I'm gonna go talk about how excited I am for a 300 prequel. That Zach Snyder....what a genius.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:10 p.m. CST

    Kizeesh

    by Paul Bucciarelli

    Since you've proven to be an annoying outspoken cunt yourself, should we feel contempt for you?

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:24 p.m. CST

    Thanks Beaks...

    by Ned Pepper

    I can't wait til March.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 1:41 p.m. CST

    If you must.

    by Kizeesh

    I prefer you use the term 'critic' to outspoken cunt, but yes feel free, just don't judge my art...

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 2:45 p.m. CST

    ColWTH...you ignorant slut

    by bacci40

    the novel is on time's top 100 of the 20th century...the themes from the novel have been used in other media since it was written...it changed the course of the entire comics medium...but its not deep? fuck you

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 4:25 p.m. CST

    Wow you misunderstand Moore more than I thought

    by drturing

    " Conceptually, it's in keeping with Moore's depiction of pop culture rising up against (or knuckling under) the encroachment of full-blown authoritarianism" - if you think Watchmen is about clever pop culture references transcending or submitting to facism, I don't even know what to say.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 5:05 p.m. CST

    ColWTH

    by frozen01

    There's a difference between critisizing America and her citizens for their actions and being "anti-American". <br> For example, while one might think that our Congress is nearly completely filled with mindless idiots who all need to be reelected (save for a few) and who actually pat themselves on the back for doing their job... ONCE... but only after the bill was sweetened with so much pork that Jon Stewart is giggle with glee over his growing job security, that doesn't mean that the person who holds this opinion is anti-American. Cynical, maybe, but anti-America, no.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 5:06 p.m. CST

    by frozen01

    giggle = giggling

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 5:12 p.m. CST

    Yes, drturing

    by mrbeaks

    That's my comprehensive reading of WATCHMEN. It goes no deeper than that. I also think THE GREAT GATSBY is about the color green.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 6:35 p.m. CST

    ColWTH/ Box Office

    by DoctorStopMo

    You make a wrong turn in assuming your sub-100 IQ equates to "convoluted." You're clearly not going to change your opinion (which I put zero truck in), so I'm not going to bother arguing with you; just go back to your crayons, and don't miss the shortbus when it comes for you.<P> As for those of you debating about the box office potential of this movie - are you stupid? That's rhetorical, because you are. Just wait until it comes out, and then you'll see whether it's a flop or a smash. Until then, your prognostications are based on your own hunches, which no one (in their right mind) cares about. Myself, I don't care. This is a one-shot deal for me - for some movies, I'm pulling for it to be a hit because I want to see a sequel, but with this one, I specifically don't. It'd be great for comic book movies in general if it does well, but if not, as a fan of the work, I'm guessing I'll be happy regardless of the box office returns.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 8:27 p.m. CST

    ColWth, you are aware that the US in Watchmen...

    by FluffyUnbound

    ...isn't the actual US, right? I think that Watchmen uses the alternate history of the US to critique comic book conventions and the concept of the superhero, not the other way around. Moore is definitely anti-American, but that's not the main thrust of the story. The main thrust of the story is that if superheroes actually existed, if we could bring into existence the unaccountable power[s] we worship in our juvenile way, the world would be much, much worse than it is. The worst thing that happened to America in the world of Watchmen was that superheroes came into existence - especially Manhattan, who truly had power. "What happened to the American dream?" "It came true. You're lookin' at it." That's the real focus of the novel. Moore politically doesn't think much of the US, or of right-wing parties or politicians, but that's much more central to V for Vendetta than it is to Watchmen. Rorsharch is basically a John Birch Society member, after all, to the point of near psychosis, but there can be no doubt that Moore retains sympathy for him.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 9:29 p.m. CST

    Um...

    by Mockingbuddha

    All youse shut up and Giant Squid!

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 9:31 p.m. CST

    When I hollowed out Watchmen,

    by Mockingbuddha

    filled it with water, and stood in it; it was a bit over an inch deepgiantsquid. Shhhh.

  • Oct. 3, 2008, 10:36 p.m. CST

    Character Ages

    by symon

    Do the characters ages seem appropriate in the footage you saw? From the preview it seemed kind of like the Junior Watchmen to me. Does Nite Owl at least have a little bit of a gut? That's the only thing that has me worried about this movie. These characters are supposed to be a little further past their prime than they appear to be... But this post does have me more excited.

  • Oct. 4, 2008, 1:20 a.m. CST

    symon....you need to use the internets a bit more

    by bacci40

    confirmed....nite owl has a gut....confirmed, all the characters age....confirmed, zach is staying as close to the novel as possible....the reason he cast younger actors was because of the flashback sequences...its easier to age a character than it is to make them younger

  • Because I have nightmares of dumbass motherfuckers practically deifying The Comedian and Rorschach.

  • Oct. 4, 2008, 1:31 p.m. CST

    My favorite bit

    by OnusBone

    is the newsvendor quoting JFK. "...Inna final analysis."

  • Oct. 5, 2008, 11:13 a.m. CST

    Soon as Glass was mentioned i knew Snyder was taking it seriousl

    by workshed

    Sounds like we might get to see the movie we've dreams of but i still think he should get Clint Mansell involved. If it weren't for he i, and many others, wouldn't have discovered Watchmen, or Alan Moore (though i was an avid reader of 'Action' in my youth), so early (through Pop Will Eat Itself's 'Can U Dig It?'). Now, does anyone have the balls to make 'Kids Rule O.K.'.? http://tinyurl.com/4bhj33 - keep clicking to read THE best kids story (when i was eight) of all time. It's the reason the comic was banned.

  • Oct. 5, 2008, 5:37 p.m. CST

    a real-life "Superman"?

    by Dreamfasting

    I know what you were trying to say, but that turn of phrase threw me for a loop ... are we now in an era where there isn't just reality and fantasy, but a whole hierarchy of fantasies?

  • Oct. 5, 2008, 10:42 p.m. CST

    Hey CROM!

    by Falcon7

    I'm one reader of the graphic novel who won't be seeing the movie in theaters. I'll wait until I can Netflix it.

  • Oct. 5, 2008, 11:46 p.m. CST

    The Music for the Trailer blew me away

    by DoogieHowitzer

    Snyder can do no wrong with his musical choices. Hope he can work that Smashing Pumpkins song into the film too - I thought the use of Nine inch Nails for the original 300 trailer was inspired, but that Watchmen trailer and music just KILLED. Can't wait until this comes out.

  • 1. Didn't Mori comment that the Glass track was a temp? 2. "post-Bourne", er, short-attention-span? Identity had some great single shot action setpieces whereas the blurry, spinny, whirlocam of the sequels was shit in comparison (BUT YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE THERE... AND YOU WANNA THROW UP!) 3. HYPERBOLE! You saw 25 minutes disjointedly and it blows away a 2.5hr movie? Right.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 7:21 a.m. CST

    Rorschach

    by papabendi

    Rorschach is basically Steve Ditko's Mr A. Ditko once said " Rorschach , yes he's like Mr A...except he's psychotic" Which is pretty fucking funny.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Snyders use of "when the man comes to town"

    by knowthyself

    In Dawn of the Dead was also great. He's got a real knack for picking the right song for opening scenes that tell alot of story in a little bit of time.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:23 a.m. CST

    I agree the Costumes wrong its too slick

    by talkbackgeek

    Manhatten. Ok. Rorschach. Ok. Comedian. Ok. Nite Owl. Wrong. too Batman and Robin. and the guy needs a gut. Laurie. Wrong. Ackerman doesn't look hot enuff in it. Ozy. Wrong. was there a sale on rubber suits? I'm rooting for this one though!

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:24 a.m. CST

    Yeah I know Rorschach was supposed to be the Question...

    by Kid Z

    ...but I always figured he WAS Steve Ditko... just a little more right-wing and unhinged, but with no artistic talent.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:26 a.m. CST

    Comedian. NOT O.K...

    by Kid Z

    ...wide they replace the leatherboy mask with Chris O'Donnell's old Robin mask?

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:27 a.m. CST

    Actually, I meant "why'd..."

    by Kid Z

    "wide"... shit man... Mondays!

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 11:36 a.m. CST

    KnowThyself.

    by Mostholy

    It's "The Man Comes Around." But point taken.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 3:43 p.m. CST

    Won't work

    by Sithdan

    I just don't see how this grahic novel could translate well into celluoid.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 8:49 p.m. CST

    KidZ

    by FluffyUnbound

    The Comedian has different masks at different times. Check the comic and you'll see that at one point he does, in fact, have a "Robin" mask.

  • Oct. 6, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    Close.

    by Octaveaeon

    Actually, there are no Starbucks where I live. But if there was, I'd regurgite Nietszche and Derrida (and a pinch of Rorty for good measure). Hegel and Strauss, on the other hand, I reserve for the Talkbacks. Meanwhile, Philip K. Dick and Ken Wilber do well in McDonald's, Cornel West in KFC, and the Stoics in Applebee's. I'm also experimenting with Thucydides, Machiavelli, and Hobbes at the local supermarket, but so far I keep getting charged with attempt at inciting a riot (now is not a good time to bring up greed and the desire for glory in the face of scarcity). My dream, though, is to act out the Apology of Socrates (and the Phaedo) while waiting in line for my Souvlaki.

  • Oct. 7, 2008, 3:09 a.m. CST

    hey AICN how bout some straight forward titles

    by sleeptones

    ya fuckin idiots

  • Oct. 9, 2008, 4:45 a.m. CST

    Snyder is an overrated hack that should not do Watchmen

    by chien_sale

    It's crime what Warner did by having him do it, instead of Paul Greengrass.