Comics

Alexandra DuPont Takes A Break From Her Own Ongoing Superheroics To Appraise THE DARK KNIGHT!!

Published at: July 18, 2008, 1:45 a.m. CST by hercules

I am – Hercules!!
Alexandra DuPont – physician, scientist, model, heiress, funnybook enthusiast, rock musician, one-time movie exec and former congressman’s wife – occasionally stumbles upon a project she feels compelled to examine for Ain’t It Cool News. The latest Batman movie would appear to fit the bill! Here’s Lexi:

'The Dark Knight': FAQ by Alexandra DuPont

Will you, like nearly every other AICN reviewer, open your "Dark Knight" write-up with some kind of masochistic superlative about how the movie abused you? I'm afraid so. It really is that ambitious and well-made. As we've been saying in our opening sentences, "The Dark Knight" is huge, propulsive, epic, knocks you flat on your fanny and kisses your mom and drinks all your bourbon and punches you in the taint, etc. I haven't been this overwhelmed by a genre film's scope since I snuck into a midnight "Fellowship of the Ring" preview screening for theater employees back in 2001, having no idea what to expect. You could easily re-title the movie "City of Gotham." It felt to me like Batman was just one character -- maybe even a supporting character -- in a vast story about a monumentally fucked-up city. It's an ensemble crime drama, and the parallels to "Heat" are blatant: A master criminal and a master detective (the latter with a troubled personal life) embark on a collision course. As in "Heat," detective and criminal even sit down at a table and chat midway through the film. And as in "Heat," the characters surrounding and supporting the two leads get more screen time than you'd expect. In fact, "Dark Knight" spends so much time with so many large and small characters, it sometimes feels like one of those phone-book-thick novels where characters from all strata of society tragically collide. (I've been jokingly calling it "James Michener's Gotham," though of course Frank Miller did the multiple-characters urban-tapestry thing in "The Dark Knight Returns.") Gotham is the object of everyone's affections. And the love is largely unrequited. But what really interests me about "The Dark Knight" is what co-writer/director Christopher Nolan doesn't do. This may be the first superhero sequel that's less outlandish, gadget-heavy and effects-choked than its predecessor. When "Batman Begins" came out, many of us praised it as a crime drama that happened to feature a guy in a bat costume. But that praise was partially in comparison to the Schumacher nipple-disco that had come before. Yes, in "Begins" Bruce Wayne fights gangsters and police corruption (and choppy action editing). But he was also dealing with ninjas and an ancient secret society and Liam Neeson with two names and a Van Dyke beard and the thespian skills of glassy-eyed Katie Holmes as a little girl trick-or-treating in an assistant-DA costume. Also, there was that CGI elevated train and the CGI hallucinations and the sonar-guided bats and that dopey conspiracy involving corporate malfeasance, poisoned water, and a gun that microwaved that water into steam (unless that water happened to reside in a human body). You could almost feel Nolan fighting for his gritty urban Batman against a riptide of studio notes. "The Dark Knight" has none of that. This time, you don't feel Nolan struggling to re-invent anything (not even the language of cinema; this is the first time, unless I'm mistaken, that Nolan has made a movie that isn't structured like a magic trick). The movie is a surprisingly pure writer/director vision, and that vision is ninja-free, with a lot less CGI. When Nolan shows us cityscapes in this movie, they're not fancy desktop-generated panoramas where all the dirtbags are conveniently confined to an island ghetto called "The Narrows" (which is never mentioned in the sequel, near as I can recall); here, the cityscapes are real helicopter shots of Chicago and Hong Kong, captured with a real IMAX camera. And the villains this time around are very human monsters -- gangsters and psychopaths and good men driven mad -- who use real guns, knives and bombs. Some of the villains scare you, some of them make you sad, and some of them are actually the nominal heroes of the story, or at least have good intentions that get seriously corrupted. Nobody gets out clean in this flick. There will be spoilers from here on out.

What's the story? It's a tragedy about three men who conspire to clean up a city, how they fail, and how its wrecks them all in different ways. It's also a 9/11 movie, and a damned good one. The title perfectly reflects the content. The movie starts out with the idea that maybe Batman's coasting a little. He takes the Scarecrow (Cillian Murphy) into custody with ease, even pausing to round up some copycat Bat-vigilantes in the process (a nice idea from Miller's comics that I hope Nolan develops in the next sequel). But then Bruce Wayne (Christian Bale) and Jim Gordon (Gary Oldman) decide to back white-knight DA Harvey Dent (Aaron Eckhart). Harvey has a plan to honestly bring down Gotham's mobsters using RICO laws. For a while, it works. Foreshadowing the awful compromises to come, Batman helps Dent by bending the rules: In one set piece, the Caped Crusader travels to Hong Kong to illegally extradite a mob accountant (Chin Han) using explosives, skyhooks and some elaborate cell-phone sonar surveillance technology developed by Wayne Enterprises engineer Lucius Fox (Morgan Freeman). But their ends-justify-the-means approach is working. The mob's running scared. And then the mob bosses are approached by The Joker (Heath Ledger) -- a terrorist lunatic with outside-the-box ideas and no history beyond his scars. (My pet theory is that he's a bored, brilliant and homicidally insane trust-fund kid. He comes off as a blend of Alex from "Clockwork Orange," the tennis-whites sadist from "Funny Games" and the original nasty-bastard Joker from his first Detective Comics appearance.) The mob has, to put it mildly, misplaced their trust. The Joker wants to burn down every system -- the law, organized crime, faith, economics -- and he operates like a terrorist, employing assassinations and well-placed bombs and ridiculous demands. He's also great at setting up elaborate booby traps that force people to make horrible moral choices. He thinks pain is hilarious, even when it's inflicted on him. The bureaucrats -- and The Batman -- don't handle his disruption of their plans very well. You know most of this from the trailer. What you don't know is how perfectly, how relentlessly, the movie steamrolls into tragedy. By film's end, pretty much every major character is dead, insane, disfigured and/or morally compromised. And that's just the good guys. If they're breathing, they've made plans to lie to the public and each other, and they're mostly convinced they're doing the right thing. But as Batman scampers into the night, it doesn't feel like justice. It feels like something that's going to blow up in their faces down the line. It feels like failure. And as drama, it's totally fucking delicious.

What's good? 1. Ledger. He's every bit as good as you've heard -- he just completely disappears into a performance that feels like a distortion field of tics and unexpected line readings, without pulling any lame "Clown Prince of Crime" schtick. He does damage with pencils and knives and bombs that will probably make even the most hard-core genre hound cringe a little. (I seriously can't believe this movie is PG-13 after the Joker's "disappearing pencil" trick alone.) Rather than pulling out the thesaurus and trying to out-fellate Peter Travers, I'll just name a few of my favorite Ledger moments: (a) The nervous-but-unflinching look The Joker gives a dissenting mobster after crashing an underground meeting. Ledger looks like he's scared the gangster will wreck a good first impression, but Ledger's also thinking on his feet. It's a really complicated look. (b) The weird shuffling walk Ledger does as he exits a hospital he's trying to blow up. (c) The way Ledger says "Hello, Harvey" in the same hospital. (d) The blink-and-you'll-miss-it shot of Ledger without makeup during an assassination attempt at a police funeral. It's the only time you see his naked eyes. If I thought the Academy Awards were anything other than a pointless popularity contest celebrating money and bombast and an industry's vain perception of its own importance, I'd speculate about Ledger's Oscar chances here. 2. Eckhart. The movie's biggest surprise is that Harvey Dent is kind of awesome, and what happens to him breaks your heart. He's smart, fearless, and forthright enough to completely and believably steal Rachel Dawes' (Maggie Gyllenhaal's) heart from Bruce Wayne. After he's disfigured and goes on a murderous rampage, you mostly know exactly why he's doing it -- and, most of the time, you're totally rooting for him to get "heads" on the coin flip so he can pump lead into the cowards who betrayed him. Eckhart mostly chooses to underplay his agony as Two-Face -- even the sinewy CGI Visible Man side looks fairly calm most of the time. It's as strange a choice, in its way, as anything Ledger does. "The Dark Knight" is filled with dread, and most of it gathers around Harvey. 3. Gyllenhaal. Rachel Dawes is still a thankless role, but Maggie Gyllenhaal actually has some light behind her eyes that isn't generated by the power of Xenu. When she scolds Bruce Wayne, you feel it in a way you never did with Mrs. Cruise. 4. The general stripping-out of gadgets and needless special effects. Even the cell-phone-sonar doohickey -- probably the only element of the movie that feels kind of tacked-on, like Nolan got a studio note to "add a gadget" -- is used to explore the dangers of post-9/11 surveillance. 5. I loved, loved, loved the way the movie respected cops and classic cop cinema. I love that the Gotham PD rank-and-file aren't just stooges or foils for Batman; you get to know several of them. There's one truly great action sequence in the movie -- a long assault on a SWAT convoy by the Joker from the back of a semi truck -- and Nolan constantly checks in with the bit-part SWAT guys and lets them react intelligently and sardonically to the chaos. It adds to the texture of the movie, to the sense of a city responding together (and not always well) to the mounting chaos. In addition to the blatant nods to "Heat," the movie image-checks classic cop cinema. Does Bruce Wayne weave through traffic while racing against time under the L-train tracks? He does. 6. The score. Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard employ that same pulsing-dread motif they did in "Begins" -- but they also create themes for the Joker and Two-Face that are basically low-level distortion screeches. I always think of their "Batman" scores as the heartbeat of Gotham as much as anything else, and Gotham is apparently very, very disturbed. 7. The IMAX cinematography. Nolan shot cityscapes and action sequences in IMAX, and it's overwhelming. See this movie on an IMAX screen if you can. (Related story: As we stumbled out into a mall after my screening, a friend said, "It's weird to leave a movie where everything felt so real and enter a real world where everything feels so fake." Exactly.)

What's not so good? 1. I believed Harvey's turn to vengeance against corrupt cops and mobsters -- but his final turns against Batman and Gordon's family felt rushed and chatty to me. There's apparently a three-hour cut of this film floating in Nolan's editing bay, and I'm wondering how much more of Two-Face's final rampage is on it. 2. Nolan frankly isn't that great at frenetic action choreography and editing -- though I was never confused like certain older writers, who seem in their dotage to be overly startled by color and movement. (I also think this is partly behind the way-too-bloodthirsty critical piranha-feed on "Speed Racer," but maybe that's just me.) Editing-wise, things only really get dicey in the final action sequence -- when Nolan rapid-cuts between multiple floors of a skyscraper, SWAT guys, hostages, Batman, dogs, and annoying CGI sonar-vision footage that might as well have been swiped from "Daredevil." It's a testament to Nolan's larger command of the drama that I was happy to sort through it all. 3. The movie's so vast, Christian Bale barely gets a chance to register. More energy is devoted to the problems Batman creates than is devoted to Batman himself. Also, Bale's super-affected Batman voice is fine when he's terrorizing criminals; it's maybe less fine when he's using it during long philosophical discussions with Harvey and Gordon. (Also, some people just plain aren't going to dig those long philosophical discussions.) 4. There are logical slips that will probably become fairly blatant on repeat viewings. Here are two: Dent leaves no stain on his pillow when his face is half-gristle, and the Joker is left alone in a penthouse with several terrified guests after Batman jumps out a window after Rachel, but we never find out what happens to those guests. 5. Finally, this isn't really a problem, but more of a concern: "The Dark Knight" paints itself into such a bleak, high-stakes dramatic corner, I have absolutely no idea how Nolan can top himself in the next film. What villains are left to introduce? The Riddler? Selina Kyle? The Penguin? The Mutant Gang? As characters, none of them feel up to the challenge of helping Nolan escalate what he's done here -- which is to make a superhero film that, as J.V. Last put it, "you can't consider ... by the normal metrics of superhero movies. It aspires to, and achieves, the actual level of film. This is Chinatown and Heat rolled into one." Warmest, Alexandra DuPont
AlexandraDuPont@yahoo.com

Arm yourself to attack my critical judgment! It's easy and fun! Visit The DuPont Bibliography!







Readers Talkback

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  • July 18, 2008, 1:06 a.m. CST

    DARK KNIGHT WILL OWN!

    by eoneon

  • July 18, 2008, 1:09 a.m. CST

    I CAN SEE IT IN 45 MINUTES FOR $13 OR WAIT

    by eoneon

    til tomorrow and see it for $5 hmmm. i think i'll wait. I can't believe some of the harsh critics on Rotton Tomatoes. I can see not liking this film,but bashing it? so not cool. Oh and fuck Bush and McSame even though I live in AZ

  • July 18, 2008, 1:14 a.m. CST

    HOW ABOUT POSTING "SPOILER" FIRST!!

    by eoneon

    that woulds been nice you know... just sayin

  • July 18, 2008, 1:22 a.m. CST

    Can't you fucking read?

    by Gilkuliehe

    I read the article and it clearly states it's going into spoiler territory. Jerks.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:27 a.m. CST

    Look Out Naruse, Here Comes Batman.

    by georges garvaren

    And then I passout from laughing. Another lemming; another cliff to tumble over. Gee golly-wiz, where's Robin when you need him? Probably blowing Schumacher, no doubt.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:41 a.m. CST

    queston

    by acebandage

    Has anyone who has READ a Batman comic featuring the Joker (ie The Killing Joke) reviewed this movie, or is it all just fans of Heat?

  • July 18, 2008, 1:55 a.m. CST

    acebandage:I OWN 'The Killing Joke'....

    by Alexandra.DuPont

    ... and 'Heat' has a lot more to do with 'The Dark Knight''s overall vibe than 'Joke.' Sorry, but the similarities are too blatant not to mention. I love 'The Killing Joke' (the new remastered-colors version is brilliant), but ultimately Moore's idea of the Joker -- and his possible origin story for the Joker -- have nothing in common with Nolan's.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:57 a.m. CST

    Just got in from a midnight showing in Southern Ohio...

    by crashcow

    This movie is PERFECT. It nailed it. ALL of it.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:11 a.m. CST

    Very entertaining review.

    by therobcat

    You often make me choke on giggles. One other thing I liked about the film was the little bit at the begining with the Scarecrow. It made this really feel like Batman's world with Arkham Asylum's revolving door aspect. I'd like to see Batman sent to Arkham in a future film. If they take cues from the Morrison/McKean graphic novel, it'd be amazing. Still though, without Ledger and the Joker, maybe that's not such a cool idea...

  • July 18, 2008, 2:12 a.m. CST

    Hey, I loved that CGI train!

    by GravyAkira

    Only 15 hours left!

  • July 18, 2008, 2:14 a.m. CST

    I agree that it will be hard to top this one...

    by JKrow21

    There isn't another character quite as interesting....although the ending of the movie paints an interesting dilema for Batman in the next film.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:23 a.m. CST

    The Dark Knight

    by ekr1701

    This will Go Down as one of the Best Films EVER,,, GodFather Like Best.....

  • July 18, 2008, 2:27 a.m. CST

    I luv u

    by IAmJack'sUserID

    I luv u

  • July 18, 2008, 2:29 a.m. CST

    There are no words...

    by critch

    They should have sent a poet. Absolutely perfect from beginning to end.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:31 a.m. CST

    Hey, morons

    by JustSomeDude899

    She clearly stated spoilers were coming. Not her fault you scroll down to the bottom of a review.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:34 a.m. CST

    Just got back

    by Montag666

    From the quickest 2 and a half hours I think I have ever spent in a theater. I don't see the point in making any more hero movies or a sequel to this one for that matter. I feel spent and utterly amazed at what I just saw. No pressure Zack Snyder.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:49 a.m. CST

    I am at a loss of words

    by eric haislar

    It was amazing.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:50 a.m. CST

    It turns out Nolan...

    by GregoryHarbin

    ...hated 'Begins' as much as I did. Everything I disliked about the film (which was a lot) was fixed. Bring on Bats 3!<p> With Gordan's son as Robin!

  • July 18, 2008, 2:53 a.m. CST

    Just got in....

    by R L S

    I am tired, but the movie was great. I didn't get the same "wow" factor I got the first time I saw BEGINS, but I plan to see it at least three more times in the theater. You know, let the movie really soak in.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:54 a.m. CST

    HARBIN

    by R L S

    What didn't you like about BEGINS?

  • July 18, 2008, 2:55 a.m. CST

    WOW

    by eric haislar

    I CAN NOT STOP WOW!

  • July 18, 2008, 2:57 a.m. CST

    "Can't be one you can acost for...."

    by R L S

    WTF??

  • July 18, 2008, 2:59 a.m. CST

    ~~~YOU HAVE TO WATCH IT MORE THAN ONCE~~~

    by The Marquis de Side 3

    the film is so rich, you have to take it all in over a period of time. and believe me, you WILL be rocked and haunted at the end...

  • July 18, 2008, 3:01 a.m. CST

    ~~~AND NO...THEY SHOULD STOP NOW BEFORE "DARK KNIGHT 2"~~~

    by The Marquis de Side 3

    I really don't see the point in making a third film. embrace this baby, folks. love it, cherish it, cuz we will never get anything like it again... <br> <br> but if they do make a sequel, call it "Dark Knight 2". enough with the Batman-this or batman-that titles... we finally have a believable comic film, and it is gorgeous.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:02 a.m. CST

    Dent's Pillow had stains on it

    by MetiphisLabs

    How did you not seem them?

  • July 18, 2008, 3:02 a.m. CST

    Your two gripes...

    by davywankenobi

    I did see the stains on the pillow after he becomes Two-Face. Oddly enough, they stuck out to me. You're second gripe is spot on, though. What did happen to the penthouse full of party guests? Fantastic Film. I just want to watch a loop of the Joker scenes. Amazing. The yellow teeth against the made up face, and that walk out of the hospital. I'm glad someone else has mentioned that. What a God damned shame that Heath Ledger slipped away from us. Damn it. The big question is...How can it get any better???

  • July 18, 2008, 3:05 a.m. CST

    Minor thing, but...

    by nascentia

    ...Dent's face actually DID stain the pillow. I specifically noticed that and thought, "Cool. Nice touch."

  • July 18, 2008, 3:08 a.m. CST

    soaking in cinema

    by deanbarry

    The Dark Knight is indeed, a film with som many textures and layers that repeat viewing will be a necessary. I came out so over whelmed by what i had seen, that i wasn't sure how i felt. I enjoyed it, but not on a level I expected. But then, after talking to some friends who had also seen it, about certain scenes, plot twists, the bike...oh wow, the bat pod is so sexy! I am ramping up by respect, love and adulation from this film. It's taking ahwile to digest, but my god, I am a happy movie geek. And, oh yeah, just cause it bugged the fuck outta me, the idiots who were complaining about the lack of "Spoiler Warning", look abovet the pic of Harvey and Rachel, and you'll see A WARNING ABOUT SPOILER TERITORY!

  • July 18, 2008, 3:13 a.m. CST

    they're right...

    by theBigWasted

    there are stains on the pillow. whatever happened to the party guests and more importantly, how did the joker so easily walk right out of the party with batman suited up and waiting downstairs on the other hand...

  • July 18, 2008, 3:16 a.m. CST

    100% disagree that joker is a trust fund kid

    by jason baum

    every comparison she makes, is a wealthy clean cut prick. ledger's joker has no use for heygeine, his teeth are yellow, and you can almost smell his gutter stench off the screen. no, he is not a trust fund kid at all - he is more likely the man from moore's killing joke.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:18 a.m. CST

    FINALLY!!!

    by jdl82

    This was the first Batman film EVER in which Batman did not reveal his identity to anybody new, and the Bat-girl bought it!

  • July 18, 2008, 3:23 a.m. CST

    Stuff

    by jdl82

    We saw Harley's three "babies" from the animated series, so that was cool. But also, what DID happen after Batman went out the window after Rachel??? Anyone?

  • July 18, 2008, 3:23 a.m. CST

    Just got back from my second viewing...

    by The Dum Guy

    And, it is good.<br><br>Although, I kinda want to see it with a large audience (first screening had 8 people watching it, and the second one had me and two other people).<br><br>My biggest complaint is... I wanted more Joker. Not that he isn't used well enough, but we'll never get to see Ledger's Joker ever again, and I must say I love that Joker.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:23 a.m. CST

    Movie was great BUT (SPOILER)

    by JBouganim1

    I didnt like how they rushed the ending with Two-Face. And his face did stain the pillow. Plus, it took me about 15 min to get used to Batmans voice again

  • July 18, 2008, 3:24 a.m. CST

    :::after Bats saves Rachel:::

    by The Dum Guy

    Joker and friends figure they weren't going to have to fuck with the Batman that night, so they decided to scram while the scramming was good.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:24 a.m. CST

    Alexandra, I saw stains on those pillows.

    by greenstyle92

    I remember that because I noted it as a nice detail to include that could easily have gotten over looked.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:25 a.m. CST

    Fantastic movie

    by eXcommunicated

    Just got back from midnight showing. Amazing movie. Just have to see it a few more times to digest it all. Don't go into this movie expecting a "superhero" movie or even a "comic book" movie. Just go in expecting slasher/crime drama with Se7en style twists and turns. Yeah, Joker reminds me a little bit of John Doe.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:26 a.m. CST

    At least it's better than begins.

    by greenstyle92

    Oh, and that accountant guy? I don't know why everyone thinks he's gonna become the riddler. That rumored scene involving him, a photo of Batman, a sharpie, and a question mark? not in the movie. (unless it was an after the credits tease I didn't stay for.)

  • July 18, 2008, 3:26 a.m. CST

    THERE WERE STAINS ON HIS PILLOW

    by master bitchfist

    maybe YOU need to rewatch the movie

  • July 18, 2008, 3:27 a.m. CST

    Is Two Face really dead though?

    by greenstyle92

    On the ground, I at first thought he was just knocked out. Later, they're talking about him like he's dead. But I think Nolan may have left himself some wriggle room here. I think it's possible Two Face is still alive for the next movie, and Gordon just faked his death.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:27 a.m. CST

    After the credits

    by jdl82

    There was nothing. Nada. Zilch.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:29 a.m. CST

    I agree. It'

    by AllPowerfulWizardOfOz

  • July 18, 2008, 3:29 a.m. CST

    Fuck you MS.

    by AllPowerfulWizardOfOz

  • July 18, 2008, 3:30 a.m. CST

    I agree, it's so good it's actually bad because

    by AllPowerfulWizardOfOz

    nothing will ever top it. It's ruined all superhero movies from the past and any that will be made int he future. The bar has been raised to such levels nothing will ever top it. Nolan fucked himself with any future installments. This should be the last film IMO for the Batman series.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:31 a.m. CST

    Maybe the stains aren't in the IMAX cut?

    by greenstyle92

    I went to see the regular old cineplex version and saw those pillows in all there stained glory. But dammit, I will have to catch this again in IMAX. I bet the Hong Kong scene just owns on that format.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:32 a.m. CST

    By the Way, I LOVE the Hong Kong sequence!

    by greenstyle92

    It was like Batman mission impossible!

  • July 18, 2008, 3:33 a.m. CST

    I guess I'll take this opportunity to munch on some crow

    by greenstyle92

    Maybe not the whole bird, but at least a drum stick. But my less than stellar opinion on Begins still stands.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:33 a.m. CST

    "Taa-Daahhh!"

    by Half-Baked-Goggle-Box-Do-Gooder

    ......Now THAT was an ENTRANCE. Fuck ME. In his first 15 seconds on screen, he blows Nicholson's Joker away. Period. Now, MY question about loose ends: Is Harvey dead? I'm not sure........

  • July 18, 2008, 3:33 a.m. CST

    What I liked best was what they didn't do.

    by jdl82

    They didn't kill the Joker, they didn't reveal Bruce's identity to any new major characters, they forwent a happy ending, and they CGI-ed Two-Face. <P>So, who wants to be the one to say that in the next film, we'll be seeing a little kid in green and red tights? C'mon, say it. 'Cause I won't! <P>New question: How did Gordon survive being shot??

  • July 18, 2008, 3:36 a.m. CST

    My bet theory is that Two Face is ALIVE!

    by greenstyle92

    And smuggled into Arkham under and assumed name. No Robin yet, but it did my Bat heart good to glimpse Jim Gordon's daughter. Yes, Batgirl is beyond the scope of Nolan's franchise, but at least her possibility is referenced...

  • July 18, 2008, 3:38 a.m. CST

    What I didn't like

    by jdl82

    Like several others, I felt that Harvey's story was handled well until the very end. <p>I also agree that this movie has set the bar too high to ever top. End the Batman films here and now.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:40 a.m. CST

    Just saw it

    by kungfuhustler84

    I have been worried the entire week that I had hyped myself up too much and my expectations were too high. They were completely surpassed. They willnever be able to top this one. I really, highly doubt that. But once again, I would love another surprise leap over my expectations.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:40 a.m. CST

    Harvey was just fine, his last turn was believeable.

    by greenstyle92

    Within the scope of the film. The real issue is that people just squirm to see good guys go bad, and part of them never truly believes it.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:43 a.m. CST

    HOL SHIT - WATCHMEN TRAILER ROCKS!!!!!

    by DoogieHowitzer

    Generally hate all-caps - but that watchmen trailer made me all tingly in my shorts. Also - the movie kicked all kinds of ass - saw it at a multiplex that had it on 18 screens - all sold out at midnight. And the face-goo stains were on the hospital pillow where I saw the flick. est night at the movies in YEARS. The watchmen trailer was like the fluffer before the money-shot :)

  • July 18, 2008, 3:43 a.m. CST

    Heath Ledger

    by Lashlarue

    I pray you're in Heaven with God, sir. You gave us the greatest villain ever put to film. Thank you.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:49 a.m. CST

    Alexandra, we are calling you OUT!!!

    by greenstyle92

    Your ability to spot and identify pillows stained by melted face goo has been seriously called into question!!!

  • July 18, 2008, 3:53 a.m. CST

    I was quite underwhelmed...

    by cinemixtape.com

    A remarkable film in many ways, yet I can't ignore its significant flaws. Firstly, it abandons the tone and look of "Batman Begins" - this isn't inherently bad, but it's certainly jarring. Secondly, Ledger is so damn good that it makes the rest of th e performances seem painfully average by comparison. This hurts most when the story begins to fall apart in the final 30 minutes. Lastly, the film is generally cruel, humorless, and depressing. Don't buy into the hype or the claims of "masterpiece" - this is merely Chris Nolan's 3rd or 4th best film, as of 2008. See it, and then decide for yourself. ADDITIONALLY, there is no way this group can or will make another film. This is a definite end to the series, at least with this group of creative minds. There's nowhere left to go. AT ALL.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:58 a.m. CST

    Now, that I think about it, my biggest gripe....

    by The Dum Guy

    Comes not from reading the positive reviews, but from the negative ones. Most said that it was TOO dark, nihilistic and that it was almost R-rated material, but I thought not so. The citizens of Gotham didn't turn on eachother like hopeless/crazed jackals and the death scenes weren't graphic and there wasn't exactly a high body count (compared to Batman '89).<br><br>So, not to think I slight the film, I don't think anyone should go into this film thinking that this is pushing any bounds as far as how dark it is, keeping in mind the film is called The Dark Knight.<br><br>Call me crazy, but I want a horror film that has Batman in it... say with Man-Bat and Scarecrow in an R-rated fright fest.

  • July 18, 2008, 4 a.m. CST

    RE: Kid Idi

    by jdl82

    Yeah, they gave the Batman myth what seemed like a proper ending, for lack of a better term. All the loose ends were tied up. <p>Where I suppose I disagree with you is in your judgment that a depressing Batman movie is a bad movie. Batman is a depressing story to those of us familiar with the source material. And as for its having abandoned the look and feel of its predecesor, I have to agree with you there but disagree with your assertion that that makes it a worser film. In my opinion, the new look and feel reflects the crime fiction we've become accustomed to on TV since BB.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:06 a.m. CST

    Wow everyone got fuced in that movie...

    by Cronenfly

    That was by far the best film i have seen all year!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:07 a.m. CST

    fucked*

    by Cronenfly

  • July 18, 2008, 4:07 a.m. CST

    wow im fuckedup

    by Cronenfly

  • July 18, 2008, 4:09 a.m. CST

    by Cronenfly

    It reminded me a lot of the cartoon that was on cartoon network. That also had a very depressing feel to it. and it was great!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:12 a.m. CST

    Alexandra DuPont, go fuck yourself crackwhore

    by Prossor

    do we really need another review saying pretty much thes same ol stuff every other AICN review has done? Really i must have read "ledger's joker is every bit as good as you've heard" like 8 times by now. And i'm very glad that this movie has "fit the bill" for your rare esteemed review to grace us lowly plebes once in a blue moon. No amounts of pics or uses of commas or fucks will make it better. YOR NUMBA ONE.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:24 a.m. CST

    Just tell us if Gordon HAS A BEER AND CHEET ON HIS WIFE?

    by MaxTheSilent

    There's one for the old-school AICN'ers among us!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:36 a.m. CST

    Sequel 'spoiler' in throway line?

    by andymillman

    Did anyone notice the line where Alfred says the Batsuit is indestructible to cats? I definitely think that was a sly hint to the 3rd movie.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:46 a.m. CST

    And still a week until I can see this in the UK

    by palimpsest

    ah well...

  • July 18, 2008, 4:50 a.m. CST

    Alright, but who watches the WATCHMEN?

    by Motoko Kusanagi

    That trailer was brilliant!

  • July 18, 2008, 5:15 a.m. CST

    Catwoman

    by Crewman Number Six

    why has no one mentioned Lucius Fox's comment about the suit? Bruce: "will it protect me from a dog?" Lucius: "maybe a cat". CATWOMAN in the third film!!

  • July 18, 2008, 5:28 a.m. CST

    good review but...

    by mmaddox3

    as some have already pointed out, dents pillow does have some kind of residue or stains on it, and although i havnt watched insomnia in awhile it really goes about in a rather narrative way. good point about the joker being left alone with the guests...i assume its safe to assume that w/o a trace of dent and the bat literally crashing the party the joker would become unintrested with staying.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:38 a.m. CST

    Damn You Michael Bay

    by MCMLXXVI

    Damn You Michael Bay

  • July 18, 2008, 5:48 a.m. CST

    "bored, brilliant and homicidally insane trust-fund kid"

    by Iowa Snot Client

    That line made me think of Brad Pitt in 12 Monkeys... another great performance that blew away expectations.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:01 a.m. CST

    God, this sounds awful.

    by Hooded Justice

    Can people please STOP comparing this movie to HEAT? I actually don't feel like seeing Dark Knight any more - because of the possiblility of having to watch paint dry again.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:03 a.m. CST

    I think, Fox said....

    by The Dum Guy

    I'm putting in my letter of resignation in as long as this "thing" is used, and I won't work here as long as this thing is around....<br><br>I'm saying this in paraphrase, but it seems that since Fox destroyed the machine that only he could command, that his stay at Wayne Inc. is safe for part 3.<br><br>I thought all the major characters where contracted pay or play for 3 movies?

  • July 18, 2008, 6:04 a.m. CST

    re:: Hooded Justice

    by The Dum Guy

    I think thou protest too much.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:04 a.m. CST

    Christ Prosser

    by Lost Jarv

    Did she kick your dog or something?

  • July 18, 2008, 6:07 a.m. CST

    Once again!

    by Orionsangels

    Alexandra DuPont proves why she's the best writer at AICN! I don't think I had more fun reading an article on this site than I did reading this one, Bravo!

  • July 18, 2008, 6:08 a.m. CST

    SPOILERS!!!! About Nolan's direction

    by Monkey Butler

  • July 18, 2008, 6:12 a.m. CST

    SPOILERS!!!! About Nolan's Directions

    by Monkey Butler

    SERIOUSLY - SPOILERS!!!! <p> Saying that this is the first movie Nolan's directed 'that's not like some sort of magic trick' is misleading. Every single scene that the Joker is in ends differently to how you expect. Seriously, every single one gets twisted. From his introduction in the bank heist, to his 'magic trick', to the stories about his scars, to his appearance at the fund-raiser, to the absolutely perfect shot of him in the dark in the interrogation room, to him falling off the building laughing, there's not a single scene that ends in the way that you'd think. Not to mention the swirling camera. So yeah, the narrative's straightforward, but the direction definitely ain't. And that's just one of the many, many incredible things about this movie.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:36 a.m. CST

    knocked you flat on your vagina?

    by ironic_name

  • July 18, 2008, 6:40 a.m. CST

    Just saw it a second time...

    by Finding Forrestal

    The film truly is Nolan's masterpiece.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:44 a.m. CST

    GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!

    by ironic_name

    GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>GORDON HAS A VEST AND LIEES TO HIS WIFE!<P>

  • July 18, 2008, 6:45 a.m. CST

    TDK will relieve your gas cramps

    by Sparhawk38

  • July 18, 2008, 6:46 a.m. CST

    Monkey Butler

    by ironic_name

    c'mon, every scene with joker ended how I thought. <P> especially him baiting the cop and the hospital.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:48 a.m. CST

    TDK will lance your boils

    by Sparhawk38

  • July 18, 2008, 6:49 a.m. CST

    TDK will enhance your "member"

    by Sparhawk38

  • July 18, 2008, 6:50 a.m. CST

    TDK will give your undercarriage....

    by Sparhawk38

    a good "how's your father".

  • July 18, 2008, 6:52 a.m. CST

    TDK will do amazing things to your system

    by ironic_name

    remember that ad? aussies?

  • July 18, 2008, 6:55 a.m. CST

    TDK will shave your back hair

    by Sparhawk38

  • July 18, 2008, 6:57 a.m. CST

    I am going to an Imax today

    by Sparhawk38

    and can NOT wait. Taking my 2 sons ..13 and 8. I am hoping it doesn't scar my 8 year old. I am a good parent...really...but in this case I am going to risk being a little irresponsible.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:09 a.m. CST

    Best.Review.TDK

    by Darth Valinorean

    This is one of the best reviews of TDK I have read. This is one of the best reviews of most any movie I have seen. Great job !! Logical. Precise. Sensible. Thoughtful... EXCELLENT READ. I will be passing the link to this read to my friends

  • July 18, 2008, 7:25 a.m. CST

    Yeah, I'm not sure they can do a third movie.

    by rev_skarekroe

    The villain will either feel toned down after Ledger's Joker or they'll make him so over the top it'll be silly again. The Mutants might work, with Batman fighting the youth of a city that hates him.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:27 a.m. CST

    On the movie's length and Two Face's short shrift...

    by rev_skarekroe

    Nolan could easily have pulled a "Kill Bill" and cut it into two 90 minute movies - a Joker movie and a Two Face movie. But then everybody would have complained that they were getting ripped off. And sure, he could've done a three hour cut, but honestly, my but was completely numb at the two hour mark.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:32 a.m. CST

    ironic_name, square eyes and ears?

    by Mr_Sinister

    Haha nice one! I sure do remember that. How about those freaky 'people' with the huge squarish eyes and ears... I liked The Dark Knight, but have to admit that the stuff phoenixmagi2 mentioned up above kinda bugged me also. Still, very entertaining, and mainly because of Ledger. I'd watch it again just for him. Even just for that one scene of the Joker and Two-Face at the hospital. Excellent.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:36 a.m. CST

    Great flick

    by thebearovingian

    There's no way around it. The hype was met. So much good stuff. Loved hearing and seeing all the viral marketing stuff come up over the course of the film. Ledger was fantastic (this is not post-humous rhetoric, he was simply amazing). Eckhart was fantastic (almost as good as Ledger). Freeman, Caine and Bale were, of course, fantastic. I cannot wait to see it again...and again...and again. I was smiling ear to ear for most of it. My biggest gripe is Oldman having a very hard time disguising his accent when speaking loudly/ yelling. This is THE must see movie of the year.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:50 a.m. CST

    The microwave thing from Begins...

    by Kid Z

    ...simple explanation time... the gizmo generated FOCUSED microwaves and was aimed at the watermain below the streets under the monorail tracks. That's why it didn't boil the ninjas and people around it. Geez, sometimes people nitpick too much. (Me included, of course.)

  • July 18, 2008, 7:59 a.m. CST

    can't write a review without the minutiae of plot detail?

    by Chaucer

    pathetic review. is it really useful to immediately divulge every detail of plot?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:04 a.m. CST

    Hate to disagree, Alex...

    by biggles2_22

    ...But Dent does stain his pillow in the scene with the Joker. Saw it on IMAX this past Moan-day. Also, is it just me, but does the IMAX experience actually make it hard to watch an action flick?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:13 a.m. CST

    why the BB hate

    by darthwaz1

    All of these reviewers are turning their backs on Batman Begins! The microwave gun fires "focused microwaves" they say it! ps - why not bring Ras back for part 3, that would be cool, and we all know he's an immortal anyway, he didn't die on the train..

  • July 18, 2008, 8:18 a.m. CST

    Just letting everyone know...

    by fassbinder79

    Saw Dark Knight in Imax last night. Its the best single piece of pop filmmaking I have ever seen. And dare I say it...I think after Citizen Kane its the best film ever made. Why can I say this? Because everyone and their momma in the industry is going to want to copy Nolan after this. He just changed mainstream cinema FOREVER.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:18 a.m. CST

    On the subject of pillow stains...

    by Alexandra.DuPont

    ... Color me corrected. But I swear I remember seeing a shot of Dent turning away from the pillow and thinking, "Shouldn't there be, like, gravy under there?" <p> Oh, and Chaucer: Sorry you disliked the review. (I'd argue I didn't "divulge every detail," but whatever.) I did go a little further into plot than usual, though, because I wanted to point out that Nolan was developing the tragedy (and his ideas) consistently from the get-go. It's a weirdly well thought-out story for a $180 million movie, IMO.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:20 a.m. CST

    PS

    by fassbinder79

    If you've seen anything like Capturing the Friedmans or Henry Portrait of a serial killer DK isn't scary at all. But it is relentless and consistently suspenseful. And oh yes...BEST FILM EVER MADE.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:30 a.m. CST

    Harvey Two-Face.

    by Finding Forrestal

    ***SPOILERS***<p>After having seen TDK a second time, I'm confident that Harvey is still alive. In the final scene, Gordon and Batman are talking about how damaging it would be if Gotham knew the truth about Harvey's killing spree. Which, of course, is the reason why Batman decides to take the blame for his murders. They then hold a public funeral and proclaim that Harvey "died a hero" when in actuality he "lived to see himself become the villain." Gordon no doubt had Harvey sent to Arkham to maintain this lie.</p><p>Incidentally, I find it interesting that during the press conference Harvey took the fall for Bats by claiming he was the caped crusader and then Batman returned the favor by taking responsibility for Harvey's murders.</p><p>Also, I've read some criticism of the fact that Harvey "suddenly" becomes vengeful towards Batman. To me, it makes perfect sense that Harvey would harbor animosity (however unreasonable).</p><p>Consider:</p><p>While both men share the same goals, they go about achieving them in conflicting ways (two sides of the same coin, if you will). The White Knight works within the justice system while the Dark Knight rejects it outright, preferring instead to become a masked vigilante and fight crime on the street level. Harvey believes that Rachel's death was directly related to Batman methods (in that his existence created a madman like the Joker).</p><p>In addition, Batman was the last person Harvey wanted to see while lying face down in that pool of gasoline. He wished Batman was off saving Rachel and no doubt is resentful of the fact that the caped crusader "chose" to save him instead.</p><p>This, of course, is bullshit seeing as Batman wanted to save Rachel all along. The Joker (who was aware of Batman's affection towards Rachel after witnessing his daring rescue of her at the fund raiser) intentionally told Bats the wrong address because he knew that Harvey would be angry at Batman if he was saved while his girlfriend was left to die.</p><p>Add disfigurement and mental instability to the equation (not to mention the Joker's psychological prodding) and it becomes entirely plausible that Harvey would turn against Batman.</p>

  • July 18, 2008, 8:31 a.m. CST

    Ra's Al Ghul, of course

    by Human Tornado

    Since no one have said it yet, bring ol' Ra's back, with Talia on his side. You cut the Devil's head and it grows right back. Way to rub it to Bruce's face that his crusade is hopeless.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:33 a.m. CST

    I thought this was Elliot Spitzer's girl reviewing it..

    by WickedJester

    That's Ashley Dupree though...

  • July 18, 2008, 8:43 a.m. CST

    Finding Forrestal....

    by Alexandra.DuPont

    I've also been thinking about ... <p> *** SPOILERS *** <p> ... the ultimate fate of Harvey Dent, too, and yeah -- it totally makes sense that Gordon and Bats would conspire to hide him away at Gotham. (I didn't want to get into this in the review for obvious reasons.) It's actually one of the ways I could see a third film upping the stakes -- because if Gordon now has a cover-up of his own, he is in some way as twisted as the cops he used to fight as a sergeant. There are all sorts of ideas about the corruption of power that Nolan could explore.... <p> Also, if the Joker and Harvey were both alive and in a position to escape from Arkham, Nolan could actually jump forward in time a decade or two and actually go ahead with some ideas from "The Dark Knight Returns." But that seems unlikely.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:52 a.m. CST

    It is sad that...(Spoiler Alert)

    by biggles2_22

    ...Rachel doesn't get a funeral.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:52 a.m. CST

    Some fair criticisms

    by Interficium

    Especially the pretty big plot hole with Joker being left all alone in the penthouse and the out-of-place editing in the showdown with Joker in the skyscraper.<br><br>Also agree with the criticism of Bale's Batman voice, it REALLY shows it's limitations when he's forced to say anything longer than a short sentence, like when he's talking with Joker and Gordon at the end. Still think something smoother (IE animated series Batman) would be better.

  • July 18, 2008, 9 a.m. CST

    It's funny...

    by Finding Forrestal

    ...that you mentioned "Dark Knight Returns" because it occurred to me that borrowing from Miller's story would be the only way to make an interesting third film. Particularly since DK ends the way it does. It also makes sense considering how much BB and DK are indebted to Miller's "Year One." If Nolan uses "Dark Knight Returns" as his basis for a third film then we'll have the perfect Batman trilogy.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:01 a.m. CST

    Trust fund Joker

    by terry1978

    That actually makes sense, that he was basically an overprivileged brat that basically decided to start doing shit because he was bored with everything going so well.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:02 a.m. CST

    Schumacher nipple-disco

    by McDee

    I almost ruined my keyboard with that.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:02 a.m. CST

    Interficium

    by fassbinder79

    While I love and appreciate Batman The Animated Series...With the realism that Nolan is striving for in his universe Bale's voice is right on the money. If it was too smooth it would be too obvious that it was Bruce Wayne behind the mask. What Bale is doing with his voice makes his identity less obvious than if he was talking straight like Conroy does on the animated series.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:05 a.m. CST

    FUCK YOU Gilkuliehe and Justsomeguy! ANAL DOUCHES

    by eoneon

    HEY IT'S POLITE AND EXPECTED WHEN AICN POSTS "SPOILER" IN RED AROUND THE STORY POST YOU FUCKING ALBINO BLACK MIDGET LOVING RETARDS! ESSEN MEINE SCHEISSEN SCHLANGE YOU WORLDS GREATEST DAD SHIRT WEARING CHILD RAPIST MOTHERFUCKERS

  • July 18, 2008, 9:08 a.m. CST

    Ras

    by darthwaz1

    although BB doesn't specifically say that Ras is immortal, there's enough little hints thrown in, I'd love to see him re-appear in part 3

  • July 18, 2008, 9:13 a.m. CST

    Bale's "Batman" voice...

    by Finding Forrestal

    Someone hypothesized that the reason his voice sounds the way it does is because it's supposed to be the vocalization of all his pent up rage. I like that explanation because it parallels the Joker's odd pitch shifting (which, apparently, is something a schizophrenic would do with their voice). It also works as a disguise of sorts.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:21 a.m. CST

    Finding Forrestal...*spoilers*

    by Cosmo Nautilus

    You make an excellent point about what Harvey's fate truly could be, and I would be ecstatic to find out that it's true. As well as I think they treated Two-Face in the film I still want more of him. The problem now lies with the Joker. Ledger has proven himself to be irreplaceable. Thank god for no more Rachel, although she was a much better character this time around.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:24 a.m. CST

    In defense of nilhistic bummer movies....

    by cookylamoo

    I went to see JOURNEY TO THE CENTER OF THE EARTH last night, before it got bulldozed by TDK and I was bombarded with feel-good movie trailers for the coming season where poverty stricken Mexican Little League teams win the local title, black football players triumph over prejudice, teenage girls bond over a pair of blue jeans and of course ABBA fest. I'm not putting down these films, but it reminded me that there are hundreds of films each year to make people feel good about life. So even if TDK is a nihilistic, bummer of a movie at least it's different. Maybe we need a few movies that remind us that life is not entirely about empowerment, bonding, personal triumph and love conquers all.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:28 a.m. CST

    I remember way back at the writing stages of this movie..

    by WickedJester

    There was talk that the second and third film would be almost one movie. Second movie dealing with the creation of Two-Face via the Joker and the third dealing with Two-Face and the Joker. It could happen that way still, it would seem.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:31 a.m. CST

    eoneon

    by WickedJester

    It clearly says 'Spoilers ahead...'<br><br> It's called reading. These are words, put them together they make sentences. Go from left to right, up to down. Take Tylenol for any headaches, Midol for any cramps....

  • July 18, 2008, 9:31 a.m. CST

    You're the reason McDonald's Cash-Registers don't have words..

    by WickedJester

  • July 18, 2008, 9:31 a.m. CST

    Also

    by Interficium

    I got a little sad at Joker's line "I feel we are destined to do this for the rest of our lives" (or whatever it was).

  • July 18, 2008, 9:32 a.m. CST

    few questions...

    by johnnyg korrupt

    Why didn't Dent kill joker in the hospital? seems implausible to me. I can understand why Dent would go after the corrupt cops....but why Batman and Gordon?

  • July 18, 2008, 9:42 a.m. CST

    Alexandra.DuPont Needs to be BlackBoxed!

    by kevinwillis.net

    Alexandra, why aren't you blackboxed? It'd make it a lot easier to pick out the things worth reading in the TalkBack and the things I need to skip. Plus, I always find Talkbacks more interesting to read with the author is interacting with the TBers . . . Blackbox Alexandra DuPont now!<br><br>I'm starting a petition.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:43 a.m. CST

    Johnnyg Korrupt...

    by Finding Forrestal

    ***SPOILERS***<p>The Joker warped Harvey's already deranged mind into thinking Batman and Gordon were ultimately responsible. Also, just to clarify, Harvey would have killed the Joker had his coin landed the other way.</p>

  • July 18, 2008, 9:54 a.m. CST

    So if they do a pt. 3 - and I'm gonna post SPOILERS here.

    by rev_skarekroe

    It has to have Catwoman, otherwise there's no female lead. Unless you want to bring back Vikki Vale or something. As for Two Face, yeah he could be alive, but that seems kind of cheap to me.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:58 a.m. CST

    Spoilers RE: Dent & Gordon

    by Starkers

    SPLOIERS <br><br> The reason for Dent going after Gordon makes complete sense. When Batman and Gordon bring Dent into their plan for prosecuting the Mafia they get into a slanging match about which department is more liable to leak or be corrupt. After the money is moved from the banks before the raid the argument is brought up again, but Gordon vouches for the men is his unit. <br><br> Dent trusted Gordon and the men in women in his unit. That trust was violated by his corrupt officers twice (tipping off the mob to move their money from Gotham banks prior to the raids, and the abduction of Dent and Rachel). Gordon's misplaced trust in his men resulted in the Mob getting away initially, Dent having to use himself as bait for the Joker in order to protect Batman, and was directly responsible for his disfigurement and the death of Rachel. <br><br> Harvey was entitled to be enraged with Gordon.

  • July 18, 2008, 10:08 a.m. CST

    That's what I like...

    by DoctorWho?

    "This may be the first superhero sequel that's less outlandish, gadget-heavy and effects-choked than its predecessor". COOL

  • July 18, 2008, 10:12 a.m. CST

    Batman Corrupt? of course

    by Animation

    I havent seen the movie yet ... I will soon. I have always considered Batman corrupt. He doesnt follow the law, and he will lie when needed, even to friends. His whole purpose is to act outside the law. So, I have to say I'm curious how the Joker corrupts him. As a second issue, while I look forward to the film, I hope the Joker is funny as well as horrifying. I am a little nervous about all the 9/11 comments ... I was sorta tired of all the doom and fear mongering in real life about a month after that had happened, so I hope the stuff people keep referring to in reviews isnt eye-rolling material. Also, having been a fan of the Batman for a long time, I've already for years and years (Dark Knight, Killing Joke, and onward) been used to the idea of a dark, morally compromised Batman. If anything, at least in comics, I've become burned out on them pushing the "G*dd**med Batman" more and more to an evil bestial ape. So, in a way, I'm almost burned out on the whole dark batman thing, after, what, a couple of decades of it. Unlike other people, I dont think the ultimate goal of the Batman stuff should be down and down until there is nowhere down to go. I dont agree that this should be the last Batman film just because you cant get any nastier. The nastier you go, the MORE room you give yourself to move in a totally new direction, and it doesnt have to be silly. Anything where people are threatened and the Batman needs to save lives is a place the Batman can go. It doesnt have to be silly. Dont forget the HERO part of the character. FINALLY, yes I hope to and expect to love the movie. I'm just chatting to get some feelings off my chest. :) Thank you for your time.

  • July 18, 2008, 10:22 a.m. CST

    square eyes and big ears.. yep.

    by ironic_name

  • July 18, 2008, 10:29 a.m. CST

    re: AD's speculation about Dark Knight Returns

    by wash

    Hell, it's not even a big stretch now to see the WB letting Frank Miller direct his own adaptation of Dark Knight Returns. Funny how things have moved in that direction. Let Nolan do one more, Do a another Superman flick or 2, and then unleash DKR. DO IT WB!

  • July 18, 2008, 10:35 a.m. CST

    spoilers

    by ironic_name

    look, he's dead. harvey has a eulogy. <P> its over.. in death he became the hero gotham needed.

  • July 18, 2008, 10:37 a.m. CST

    hmmm

    by j2talk

    Watching this i see the late 80 early 90 comic influences from when all the comics went grim and gritty.....does that mean the next batman will be done IMAGE style????

  • July 18, 2008, 10:40 a.m. CST

    IO two face comes back

    by eric haislar

    It would ruin everything that this film was about. He is dead. But Tommy Lee Jones should hang his head in shame for what he did in forever.

  • July 18, 2008, 10:47 a.m. CST

    He look, it's a Newsie

    by rjmacready1055

    I hear that this movie is so good, they're thinking about nominating the wait in line for tickets for an Oscar.

  • July 18, 2008, 10:58 a.m. CST

    Too bad Bale won't let Robin into the mix.

    by riskebiz

    The next film would greatly benefit from a young Dick Grayson. Not someone of the age of Chris O'Donell when he was Robin ... or even Burt Ward age, but someone age 12-14 as Robin like he should be. That would be interesting to add into this film series.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:17 a.m. CST

    TWO-FACE LIVES *SPOILER*

    by tme2nsb

    It's obvious it was a cover up, that is all I am saying.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:18 a.m. CST

    Possible Villains For #3

    by ericinwisconsin

    Louie the Lilac Lord Fogg Catwoman (either Julie Newmar or Eartha Kitt; I ain't picky) <br><br> Seriously, the Joker HAS to be back! Two Face is definitely returning. That's enough.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:22 a.m. CST

    Ms. DuPont

    by acebandage

    Thank you for clearing up the fact that this movie has more to do with Heat than it does the Killing Joke. THAT was what I was wondering. I'm going to see it tonight and everyone has overhyped it so much I was beginning to lose interest. I am a MUCH bigger fan of Killing Joke than I am of Heat and I think Killing Joke got the Joker character exactly right. Everyone was saying that Heath Ledger's Joker was perfect but I didn't see that in the trailers. His Joker may be AMAZING, but it wouldn't be perfect in my opinion unless I got to see the Joker from the Killing Joke. It seems that that isn't the way, so now I can leave that expectation at home and turn a deaf ear to all those people saying that Heath Ledger's Joker is perfect. Thank you.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:26 a.m. CST

    why should they bring back the Joker!!!!!

    by j2talk

    Batman has got enough villian, we dont need another Joker film.....this fim is enuff, next film give us something else

  • July 18, 2008, 11:34 a.m. CST

    Devin Faraci hated TDK

    by billis3811

    Made the mistake of reading D-Wads review. Is this guy always on the rag or what?

  • July 18, 2008, 11:38 a.m. CST

    How come no review yet...

    by Kid Z

    ... from everybody's favorite red-haeaded stepchild? Why the hold up, big guy?

  • July 18, 2008, 11:42 a.m. CST

    In one of the other reviews I posted thatI wanted Bane.

    by tj donkey show

    Here's my idea, bring back Ras al ghul with Tali (love interest for Batman), and Bane as Ras's new disciple. This creative team has the ability to make Bane a monster that even scares Batman.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:45 a.m. CST

    Where to go for Part III.

    by fiester

    I agree it will be near impossible to top this film size-wise--and where to go after Joker and Two-Face is a big problem. The villains that remain unused are B-list at best.<p> It's too bad we already saw so much of Arkham or else they could opt to do a smaller, more claustrophobic film based on the Arkham Asylum book by Grant Morrison that would be a nice contrast to this large-scale film...but an Arkham flick without Joker or Two-Face is kind of pointless.<p> Anyway, I'll be looking forward to Nolan's next Bat installment.<p>

  • July 18, 2008, 11:46 a.m. CST

    re: Academy Awards

    by veritasses

    If only it were limited to just the AAs......

  • July 18, 2008, 11:51 a.m. CST

    Hey Fiester

    by Mel Gibsteinberg

    I have been thinking about part III as well. I wonder about the rumors of Phillip Seymour Hoffman as The Penguin. What if, instead of doing the massive, large scale crime drama of Dark Knight (with touches to Heat) they turn it into a murder mystery psychopathic hunt as Batman has to track down the Penguin and his insane homicides, while confronting a caged Edward Nigman ala Silence of the Lambs? <P>I would think Warners wouldn't have the balls to make a more somber, tonally frightening Batman movie, but hey, they gave this franchise to Noland and look what he has done, why stop trusting now. A Batman meets Hannibal Lecter style movie could be awesome, if handled correctly, and with Nolan, how can you not think it wouldn't be handled correctly?

  • July 18, 2008, 11:53 a.m. CST

    One Complaint

    by Fireball XL-5

    Interesting review, but I could have done without the juvenile reference to "certain older writers, who seem in their dotage to be overly startled by color and movement." We get it, Alexandra, you are NOT OLD. But until you are please try to show some respect.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:57 a.m. CST

    Joker/Batman relationship was taken as far as it could go

    by Dogmatic

    so that is pretty much perfect that even though Joker lived at the end you his final words summed up perfectly the message that KillingJoke was getting across....that both of these men are mad...just on other ends of the spectrum. And Batman will never kill Joker b/c he can't let Joker win that way...and Joker won't kill Batman b/c he has too much fun with him so we can assume in this Bat-verse that Joker will keep breaking out and Batman will keep taking him down over and over and over and we don't need other films to see that....so I think that was handled perfectly. <P> So, for the next Batman film where to go what to do? Gosh, it seems Nolan has so unflinchingly made the best movie he could possibly make that a 3rd film that even has a chance to topping this seems impossible. But we want another one obviously after the whole Batman on the run motif was established....soooo.... <P> Here is my best idea for now...do Bane...redeem that aborration that was B&R's "bane" with a true adaptation...a man who wants to rule the city and has the genius AND the physical power to back it up....have him unleash every crazy upon Gotham and put Bats thru the wringer the entire first half rounding up bad guys....(the only way to do it now is to present these other Bat-villains in a lower spotlight) until he is at his wit's end...then Bane busts him up....and wins....and the last act is Bats finding a way to come back and reclaim his city...finally winning the hearts of its people. I dunno...that is best I can think of right now. THis movie was just literally TOO good.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:02 p.m. CST

    Mel Gibsteinberg

    by WickedJester

    I said something similiar on another thread, but I thought more along the lines of a Se7en type movie with the Riddler being the John Doe character. Morgan Freeman could even reprise his roll!<br><br> Interesting concept that each movie would be of different genre depending on the villian(s). <br><br>Plus, it eliminates the problem of having to keep a director interested for 3 or more movies. Each movie could have a different director based on the genre.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:11 p.m. CST

    Regarding the possible take-home for this weekend...

    by WickedJester

    Not sure if anyone saw this from the Hollywood Reporter..<br><br><i> The film's more than 4,366 domestic playdates is a record, surpassing the 4,362 theaters for May 2007's bow of "Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End." Double- and triple-screening at many venues means "Dark Knight" will play on 9,200 screens in the U.S. and Canada.<br><br> Its engagements include 94 Imax venues -- Nolan shot long segments using Imax-format cameras -- and most of those giant-screen auditoriums were sold out by midweek. A Warners exec estimated that Imax presales totaled $3.5 million, with advance ticketing for other venues adding considerably to that total.<br><br></i> So where's the dickhead (Kai_something) saying the movie would have to 'break the space time continium' to break an opening record. <br><br> 9200 screens for 4 straight days can't break 152m? <br><br>Do the math now, jackass.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:31 p.m. CST

    pillow stains

    by jamestewart007

    ok, I didn't see it in Imax, but I was able to see the stains on his pillow when the joker comes in. Besides, most of his face would have scabbed up by then.... I also think his death is a cover up. I mean if rachel can fall 20 stories and have only the bat to break her fall, then a guy who isn't taking pain killers after having half his face burnt off can survive a 5 story fall. I doubt it was much higher than the building Sal was dropped off of.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:36 p.m. CST

    Harvey Dent had perfectly legit reasons to turn on Gordon...

    by Galactic

    SPOILER:::::::: It was GORDON'S men (& woman) who betrayed Dent to Joker in the first place. (With their incredibly weak pleas of "we didn't know what they were gonna do") And it was Gordon who expressed his complete trust in his officers to Dent. And I can see him becoming so blinded by rage against anyone and everyone responsible for his disfigurement and the loss of his beloved girlfriend that he would turn on Batman, IF ONLY because Batman represented a block to his revenge against Gordon. I find it surprising how many reviewers don't seem to get the fact that Dent's transformation was in no way "rushed". The nearly 2 hours of film that focused on Harvey's life BEFORE the night he became 2-Face WAS the build-up. Harvey Dent, a man whose everyday life was filled with death threats, scum of the earth, and failed attempts to do good got pushed passed his limits, and he fucking SNAPPED, ( BTW, when you hear the term "someone just snapped" does it sound like a long, slow change to you?) his views and morals flipped upside down in one terrible, Joker-induced instant. Every single thing he had to live for, all the people he believed in, the very woman he loved, all gone in one night. And the thing is, he needed someone to blame, because if not he would only be able to point the guild inwards. He started off being furous at the Joker, but when the Joker deflected all that destructive anger in other directions, it was only natural for a guy as smart as Harvey Dent to trace the lines of guilt back to Gordon, who he trusted more than anybody else in the film not named Rachel.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:38 p.m. CST

    Best. Superhero Movie. Ever. (Spoilers)

    by LaserPants

    No further need for discussion.<br><br> Btw, there were stains on the pillow when Dent turns his head. Its all this crust mess. Eww.<br><br> The only thing that felt "huh" to me was after the Joker crashes the party and Rachel and Bats take a swan dive out the window. They land on the car and you reckon, okay, its going to cut back to the party now. Nope. It switches to a scene the next day. I thought that was weird. Hopefully this rumored 3 hour cut will make it to dvd and this scene will be more satisfyingly wrapped up. Other than that small quiblle, I have no complaints. It's a friggin' masterpiece.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:40 p.m. CST

    "Killing Joke" Joker is no longer the defintive Joker

    by wash

    The writers and Ledger created a great new interpretation. I find it cute that people are expecting to be disappointed if this Joker doesn't live up to the Moore version. Cute like those adorable Downs Syndrome baggers at Safeway.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:40 p.m. CST

    Edlestein Betrays His Advanced Age (And Out Of Touchness)

    by LaserPants

    His negative review really was rooted in an almost sad, doddering inability to keep up with the visuals. I hope I never get that old. I'd like to think I'll always have a keen eye for such things, rather than cowering in fear of them. (Btw, he had a similar gripe with the waaaay underrated SPEED RACER -- a movie he didn't like basically because he couldn't follow the action or visuals. I think it might be time to retire, David.)

  • July 18, 2008, 12:40 p.m. CST

    Saw it, loved it, a couple concerns.

    by RandySavage

    While not the second coming as some have proclaimed, it is a fantastic film and is now my favorite comic book movie (Sin City and Batman Begins being 2 and 3). MAJOR SPOILER AHEAD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My biggest concern is how Nolan will handle the Joker in part III. You can't ignore him and an offscreen death or imprisonment doesn't do him justice. I think they are going to have to recast.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:42 p.m. CST

    CAN WE OPEN AN OFFICIAL TDK talkback...

    by trojanwilliams

    .too many separate talkbacks under each review. Oh and where the hell is Harry's review? I can't wait to read about how sweaty his balls got while being trapped in the folds of his mammoth legs or how many times he came in the hair of the person sitting ahead of him..

  • July 18, 2008, 12:45 p.m. CST

    I initially didn't think the movie would be a record breaker

    by greenstyle92

    Based on Begins' good but not great $200 mil domestic. But I was wrong. At my megaplex, they sold out 3 midnight showings and had a fairly full but not sold out fourth showing. I HAVE NEVER SEEN THAT ON A MIDNIGHT SHOWING IN MY AREA BEFORE. So yeah, it'll be big. As for those who think it'll be "Bigger than titanic," I don't know, that requires a very special alchemy, where a movie has a very successful theatrical run over and extremely extended period of time. In order for that to happen, Dark Knight would still have to be a top box office contender all the way into October or November. I'm not saying it can't happen, but it is rare.

  • I know that comes off as bitchy specualtion, but you have to admit it's really strange.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:47 p.m. CST

    *clobbered this weekend at the BO

    by wash

  • July 18, 2008, 12:48 p.m. CST

    Randy Savage, YEAH! That's what I'm thinking!

    by greenstyle92

    This movie definitely ended suggesting the battle between Batman and Joker can and must continue. It would seem weird now if he weren't int it, but what the hell could they do? The worst would be to recast and have the new guy try desperately to do a Heath Ledger impersonation. That would just be a disaster. I think they could recast, but we would have to be open to the new actor doing his own interpretation of the role, and the discontinuity that would have to result from that.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:48 p.m. CST

    Hey where was this scene? Cutting room floor.

    by eric haislar

    http://moviesmedia.ign.com/movies/image/article/831/831903/the-dark-knight-20071031054510442.jpg

  • July 18, 2008, 12:49 p.m. CST

    Next villain?

    by riskebiz

    Catwoman? Black Mask? The Mad Hatter? The Penguin? Hugo Strange? The Riddler? Mr. Freeze? Who will be the next film's villain? Will it just be Two-Face returning? Nolan has said that he doesn't like or get the Penguin, though he makes the most sense as to me as the next in line. Catwoman and the Riddler seem anti-climatic as does The Mad Hatter. Black Mask is a D-list character and the same goes for Hugo Strange. Mr. Freeze seems ridiculous in this world. Two-Face is great, but having him alone seems a let down.......to me.........Nolan needs to talk Bale into having Robin introduced.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:53 p.m. CST

    Both Nolan And Bale Said No Robin

    by LaserPants

    And thank fucking god for that. I LOATHE Robin. His NAMBLA-bait ass should be retconned out of existence.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:53 p.m. CST

    Ledger's "Do you wanna know how I got these Scars?"

    by greenstyle92

    equals Nicholoson's "Did you ever dance with the Devil in the Pale Moon Light?" I don't mean anything either positive or Negative about the comparison, just noting it's interesting they each had a "meme." Though I'm sure someone is about to argue with is lamer/cooler...

  • July 18, 2008, 12:54 p.m. CST

    Devin Faraci is a fat, bitter little cunt.

    by TheLastCleric

    He gave TDK an 8.5 (the same score he gave Spiderman 3) but went out of his way to trash the film. He's got a serious hard-on against Nolan, Ledger and this film in general, which is why I'm laughing my ass off as the critics praise it. What's even more pathetic are the denizens of Chud who actually suck this flabby poser's cock and agree with his nonsense.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:55 p.m. CST

    For all those people who don't think that a third Dark Knight co

    by fassbinder79

    Imagine this: James Gandolfini as The Penguin Daniel Day Lewis as The Riddler And one of the many talented young black actors on The Wire. Yes. Robin should be black in Nolan's Gotham.

  • July 18, 2008, 12:57 p.m. CST

    Geez all this nitpicking about pillow stains...

    by Kid Z

    ...shut up, go home with a copy of pPenthouse and make your own "pillow stains" you nerds!

  • July 18, 2008, 12:59 p.m. CST

    Critics called it a "dark, opressive crime drama"

    by RandySavage

    And that had me worried that it might be a very good film, but be depressing and a bring-down at the same time (like Heat or The Professional). I was really pleased to find it was still a superhero thrill ride of a film (although darker and more realistic) with plenty of excitement and fun. I didn't find it oppressive. The audience applauded in several parts, laughed at many of Ledger's lines and seemed enraptured. Very successful flick.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:03 p.m. CST

    I liked the final conflict.

    by greenstyle92

    Batman having to save the hostages and keep Joker from blowing up the barge was great. I personally always felt in Begins Batman saved the city by giving Gordon the Batmobile, and that Batman's confrontation with Ra's was pointless. Well, luckily this was an improvement.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:07 p.m. CST

    Nolan's Batman will have no SUPER characters

    by hoorayforeric

    There will be a 3rd. But what Nolan is obviosly doing is eliminating any "super-powered/super-natural" type characters (villians or heros). Bringing anyone back from dead won't happen...and don't expect any powers...just strong minded "theatrical" criminals heroes.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:08 p.m. CST

    Greenstyle, recasting the Joker for III

    by RandySavage

    It's a bit of a quandary... do you ask that unfortunate replacement actor to do some of the same idiosyncrasies as Ledger created (voice, toungue-flick, headcock, walk, etc.). I think he should for continuity sake, but it could easily come off as a bad mime job. There will be some tough choices for Nolan to make. By the way, Ledger did an incredible job creating an instant classic movie villain. RIP.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:13 p.m. CST

    No Robin, thank goodness.

    by fiester

    Nolan has said there will be NO ROBIN in his Batman universe. How anyone could see this latest film and think "You know what would be a good idea? Have Batman start palling around with a thirteen year old kid on his crimefighting duties" is on some seriously chronic dope.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:19 p.m. CST

    Riddler in Bat 3

    by billis3811

    Think about it. The Riddler is a liar obsessed with the truth. He gets off on his riddles becuase only he has the answers, and that gives him a sense of power. Now, Imagine that Harvey is still alive, and Gordon did have him comitted to Arkham. If knew about it, he'd be able to hold Bat's and Gordon hostage, because of their lies. If Nolan took the Riddler to a really dark place, he could be a teriffic villain!

  • July 18, 2008, 1:20 p.m. CST

    CecilBenedict, that review is dogshit

    by TheLastCleric

    Another arrogant cunt who basically acts as if the very nature of the material makes it impossible for it to be taken seriously. Every positive comment this ponderous tool writes is followed up with equal measures of condescension and pedantic nitpicking. Basically, TDK is too serious, too grim, and should apparently embrace its origins, though this fuckwad doesn't really know or understand what those origins really are, despite his recent trip to the Wikipedia Batman page. Also, I loathe the term pop-art; it's the smug label elitist cunts give anything they deem lowbrow, which is ironic given that Shakespeare, Jane Austin, and even Charles Dickens were technically pop-artists in their day. What really fucking annoys me however, is how we’re not allowed awe and wonder anymore; we can’t as a society sit back and appreciate something as wonderfully made as the Dark Knight without a certain number of agenda-driven cunts oozing onto the scene and nitpicking it apart with laborious, self-indulgent quips, observations and attacks on a film that these pseudo-intellectual, wannabe artists couldn’t even begin to approach even if they had the genitals to actually create something rather than sit behind a computer screen and dismantle the efforts of others. No doubt this reviewer felt a slight increase in that flaccid little penis of his when he called Nolan a director of limited talent because let’s face it, that’s what most contemporary criticism has become: little people with failure in their hearts making themselves feel important as they ridicule and demean the work of those who have actually succeeded in their ambitions. TDK is an amazing film and even going in with the highest expectations, it literally blew me away. I make no apologies for my enthusiasm and I pity the handful of dissenting voices who can’t see past their own bullshit to appreciate a genuinely great work of modern cinema.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:21 p.m. CST

    Hugo Strange

    by fiester

    Strange actually predates both Joker and Catwoman in Batman comics, so there's a precedent there. Nolan could look to adapt Matt Wagner's "Batman and the Monster Men" which would fit in well with the universe he has created.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:22 p.m. CST

    Time to WAKE UP

    by Earthquake WestCoast

    To the people calling this the BEST FILM EVER!.......think long and carefully. Don't get caught up in the hysteria of the moment. Are you really saying that this film is better than : THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, anything JAMES CAMERON made, and the LORD OF THE RINGS trilogy, etc? Because, even though it was good, it WASN'T A LIFE CHANGING EXPERIENCE that most of you are making it out to be. It's JUST A MOVIE. Instead of giving so much passion and time to JUST A MOVIE, try giving the same passion and time to your family and overall life to better yourself. I'm glad you liked the film! It's a big fun event! But try to stay grounded in reality people.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:23 p.m. CST

    THE ACTING

    by Professor Geek

    We are witnessing one of the greatest acting performances in the history of film - Heath Ledger as The Joker.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:25 p.m. CST

    Earthquake WestCoast

    by eric haislar

    Fine but would you agree with best film of the year so far?

  • July 18, 2008, 1:25 p.m. CST

    Bagpipes and a question.

    by RandySavage

    Final thoughts... the fact the bagpipes were in a comic book film exemplifies Nolan's attention to detail. Here's a question for those who've seen it. Why/how did the bomb go off exactly when the judge looked "up"? One of the few parts when I thought, "huh?" Nitpick, but it's a great movie which I will pay to see again.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:26 p.m. CST

    Earthquake...

    by billis3811

    Piss off daddy.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:30 p.m. CST

    RandySavage

    by eric haislar

    I have no idea all i know is that part reminded me of the end of the godfather. The editing was fantastic.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:33 p.m. CST

    Going in 3 hours

    by Bricktops hammer

    pretty psyched

  • July 18, 2008, 1:34 p.m. CST

    the next film will be lighter in tone

    by j2talk

  • July 18, 2008, 1:34 p.m. CST

    When's Harry going to give his TDK analysis

    by BDuncan

    It'll be good to read Harry's analysis of TDK.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:36 p.m. CST

    Earthquake WestCoast

    by runfoodrun

    This is a um, well, a movie talkback, so people get excited, not sure that means that they aren't putting the same energy to other parts of their lives...Also, I think this film may end up on par with some of Cameron's work, and maybe even Two Towers...(my least fav of the three, although all three were great!

  • July 18, 2008, 1:36 p.m. CST

    Earthquake WestCoast

    by runfoodrun

    This is a um, well, a movie talkback, so people get excited, not sure that means that they aren't putting the same energy to other parts of their lives...Also, I think this film may end up on par with some of Cameron's work, and maybe even Two Towers...(my least fav of the three, although all three were great!

  • July 18, 2008, 1:37 p.m. CST

    the next film will be lighter in tone

    by j2talk

    nolan has made coments to the effect of wanting to show the characters arc....

  • July 18, 2008, 1:38 p.m. CST

    the next film will be lighter in tone

    by j2talk

    nolan has made coments to the effect of wanting to show the characters arc....

  • July 18, 2008, 1:39 p.m. CST

    added scene at the end?

    by bradlm

  • July 18, 2008, 1:40 p.m. CST

    added scene at the end?

    by bradlm

    ok, it was 2:45 when the movie ended, I bolted to the bathroom and to beat the traffic, did anyone stay and check if there was a scene after the credits?

  • July 18, 2008, 1:41 p.m. CST

    bradlm

    by eric haislar

    Nothing there sir

  • July 18, 2008, 1:46 p.m. CST

    Greeeaaat....more leftist 9/11 vomit....

    by msspurlock

    What could've been a great movie experience now threatens to be an unwatchable social commentary and hijack. Typical.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:47 p.m. CST

    Runfoodrun

    by Earthquake WestCoast

    I'm excited about movies too, hence why I'm even posting here. I noticed A LOT of people here seem to gone over to the side of religious cult status in the way they talk about this film. A number of us at work were reading the various forms about this film, and half the people (most who aren't fanboys) were making fun of you people, calling you PATHETIC LOSERS, ETC. I tried to tell them that most of those talkbackers are just movie fans, and how there's nothing wrong, just as there is nothing wrong for being a sport fans. Yet, it was HARD to defend more than half of you talkbackers when you're acting like cult members over JUST A MOVIE. Btw....slow dam work day!

  • July 18, 2008, 1:51 p.m. CST

    Batman 3

    by tyberious25

    I loved The Dark Knight. I got to ask though how are they going to top this? I have faith that Nolan can do it though. I say bring on Riddler and Catwoman. Also I agree with you guys whoever first said it, if 3 is made Harvey will be alive in Arkham under a fake name. I love that Idea and I hope they use it.

  • July 18, 2008, 1:51 p.m. CST

    msspurlock...

    by billis3811

    What the hell! Does everything HAVE to be political? Grab whatever stick is up your ass, and shove it up as hard as you can into your brain!

  • July 18, 2008, 1:56 p.m. CST

    Earthquake=Buzz kill

    by billis3811

    Did anyone ask for your opinion? If people want to get crazy over a Batman movie. Let them! Who the hell are you to tell anyone to grow up? Who gives a fuck what you, and your fellow employees at Buger King think or say? No one douche nozzel! So why don't you go back to filling Fry Pod's, and let us have our fun!

  • July 18, 2008, 2:01 p.m. CST

    msspurlock

    by LaserPants

    Why do you hate America?

  • July 18, 2008, 2:05 p.m. CST

    WHERE is HARRYS REVIEW?!!?

    by TheGoose8

    Where is Harrys review?!?!?! WHERE IS IT

  • July 18, 2008, 2:07 p.m. CST

    Earthquake WestCoast

    by LaserPants

    Are we "cult members" honestly supposed to give a flying fuck about what a bunch of joyless, unimaginative, boring office drones think about us? I'd rather be a raving lunatic fanbot with a vivid imagination who enjoys themselves, than some numbskull jock sports fan office drone beating off to a dog eared copy of Sports Illustrated. Geeks will always be infinitely cooler and more interesting than normals.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:10 p.m. CST

    Billis3811

    by Earthquake WestCoast

    You asked if anyone asked for my opinion. The answer is... YES. "AIN'T IT COOL" asked. The moment they put up these forms they asked for the opinions of everyone here. Hence "TALKBACK FORMS". Btw....the only complaint I have of the movie is....Maggie Whatshername is not an attractive lady. Dam...it was hard looking at that face on the big screen.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:14 p.m. CST

    Maggie G Looked Cute To Me

    by LaserPants

    I never thought she looked all that great before, but she was attractive in this. Also, she was a more believable actress for the role than Katie "Princess Xenu Marries A Closet Homosexual" Holmes.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:15 p.m. CST

    LaserPants

    by Earthquake WestCoast

    You must of worked at an office before, because you've just described most of those guys right on. Ha! Except, they're not looking at Sports Illustrated, they usually have a copy of Maxium.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:17 p.m. CST

    Nolan has adapted Frank Miller's Batman universe

    by Chishu_Ryu

    Which mean Selina Kyle as the Catwoman formally a Gotham prostitute is probably next in line as a villain for a third Batman movie. Lucius Fox even hints to fighting cats in TDK, and with Rach gone, there is room for a new complex love interest. I can also see a possible return of Two-Face or Rhas Al Ghul to complete the character arcs.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:18 p.m. CST

    HOLY SHIT!

    by eric haislar

    Media By Numbers says the new Batman movie from Warner Bros. brought in $18.5 million Friday from its midnight screening in 3,040 theaters.The Dark Knight" figure did not include any of its 3 a.m. or 6 a.m. showings. wowza!

  • July 18, 2008, 2:19 p.m. CST

    Earthquake WestCoast

    by LaserPants

    Yeah, I used to work for an advertising agency before I became a teacher / author / artist. So, I'm well acquainted with the generalized jackassery of supremely boring dumb ass jock office retard alchoholics with no souls.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:21 p.m. CST

    Chishu Ryu

    by LaserPants

    I like where your head is at. I thought the line about the new armor being useful against cats was kinda odd... now I'm wondering, was that a clue?

  • July 18, 2008, 2:22 p.m. CST

    18.5 million Friday from its midnight screening in 3,040 theater

    by eric haislar

  • July 18, 2008, 2:23 p.m. CST

    figure did not include any of its 3 a.m. or 6 a.m. showings.

    by eric haislar

  • July 18, 2008, 2:26 p.m. CST

    Dark Knight is SO dark it made me feel dirty.

    by Veraxus

    I'd say it's up there with Se7en and Silence of the Lambs on the sinister-o-meter... not because of blood and guts (there weren't really any in Dark Knight, but Two Face is FUCKED UP), but because the movie with just that mean. The entire movie was so dark and oppressive that I'm surprised the MPAA didn't give it an R despite the lack of blood or guts, for mood alone.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:28 p.m. CST

    benditlikelucas

    by eric haislar

    This movie is so good it really could have some staying power. I know i plan on seeing it again. This may just become one of the highest grossing movies of all time.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:31 p.m. CST

    Laserpants

    by eXcommunicated

    msspurlock wears a flag pin made in China. Go figure. <br> <br> About this movie. Saw it last night at the midnight showing. This whole afternoon has felt like, "...the day after seeing The Dark Knight." Anyone else have the same melancholy feeling? Like, it's the day after going to a huge concert you've been waiting all year to see? Or the day after your birthday and you have a massive hangover?

  • July 18, 2008, 2:33 p.m. CST

    I'm goging to see it again at 4:10, in Hyannis,MA

    by billis3811

  • July 18, 2008, 2:34 p.m. CST

    Yeah, that's right! GOGING!

    by billis3811

  • July 18, 2008, 2:34 p.m. CST

    eXcommunicated

    by eric haislar

    yes i can not stop thinking about it.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:35 p.m. CST

    I Don't think it would be so bad to have Joker played differentl

    by iamnicksaicnsn

    For anyone to play it like Heath did would, yes, almost just be a parody, or a lame wanna-be performance. We've had "different" Joker's in the comics for years, with everyone having a different take on him, so it wouldn't be too offensive for it to be a little different... BUT NOT TOO MUCH THOUGH. LOVE THAT JOKER! Or this one, that is.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:39 p.m. CST

    TDK will scare the shit out of millions of kids.

    by Uncle Stan

    Dumbass parents who take their kids to this without doing a few minutes research are in for lots of sleepless nights. This film is going to disturb a lot of children.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Best of 2008 Thus Far

    by FilmFan311

    Spectacular on the IMAX Screen!!! Went to the Sold Out IMAX in The Mile High City and it delivered on every level imaginable! From the Joker's Opening "MAGIC TRICK" with the pencil to the rotating camera of The Joker dangling off the building at the end, this is a clusterfuck of chaos that delivers the worthwhile mention to toss your overpriced popcorn in the air! Grade "A" and I can't wait to see it again! The Joker standing outside of the EXPLODING hospital after visiting Two-Face was fantastic! IMAX is BEYOND Worth Your Money to see it! You won't be able to watch it anyway afterwards. Can't believe Rachel DIES. SPOILER ALERT.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:44 p.m. CST

    Nicholson just took it from Heath like Jake did.

    by Cloaker Cobra

    Ok, so first let me tell you why I personally guarantee Heath will win the Academy Award for Best Supporting Actor. 1) He's Really That Damn Good. His stunted verbal cadence, his wounded eyes that are out to inflict an even greater misery upon the unknowing soul that beckons to be made aware of the futility of it all, and how to delight in that, his sheer ecstasy in finding his place in an unwelcome world—even though it is by any means necessary—is a force of nature. This is why acting exists as one of the most enduring art forms of our civilization. This is not caricature. This is a wicked and glorious descent into the primal id that no one should ever have to experience, but damn do we find something out about ourselves if ever we did. Uncompromising. How can expectations on such an icon be so surpassed? Jesus, he actually had nuanced, understated moments as the Joker, for crying out loud! Nicholson just quietly got bitchslapped and reminded that the only real acting he has done in two decades was About Schmidt, which has was probably tricked into doing while he was in-between paddling Thai hookers in his bathrobe. 2) Brokeback Mountain. Heath shoulda won, plain and simple. The Academy has a way of rewarding their talent for prior deserving work a few years down the road; witness Paul Newman, Tommy Lee Jones, Javier Bardem. Phillip Seymour Hoffman, a tremendous actor, beat him a few years ago---but Ledger's Ennis Del Mar was galaxies past Hoffman's Capote in terms of emotional conflict and complexity. Both were transformations, to be sure, but whereas PSH's was more a portrayal of a well documented—and therefore easier to emulate—public figure, Heath's dared to submerse himself in the muddled internal waters of a taboo yet personal journey. Fearless scripts, cinematography and performances are what separate film from American Pie 3. 3) The Industry Needs A Hero Even When He's Playing A Villain; Post a writer's strike last year that crippled the creative arm of the industry for months, the soon to occur Actor's strike that will do the same, amidst a slump in the industry hidden by escalating ticket prices and inordinate production and marketing costs, Heath's win will be the very thing to heal and consolidate the American film business in a very public way. The standing ovation as he is posthumously awarded and Michelle Williams takes the stage on his behalf will be deafening as all parties remember why they do what they do and how their craft can be taken away by mortality and greed outside their accord, least of all themselves. Not to mention you just positioned yourself for the amazing viewership ratings, which leads me to my last point that… 4) … The American Public Demands It; Hollywood can't afford to deny the masses on this one. Not in such a high profile way. They need to build the loyalty of the conventional movie-going public again, and what better way? This film transcends entire genres. And Heath is the centerpiece virtuoso in a film that is a symphony of some of the finest talent working their skills today. Jail cell verbal duel with Bale is your money scene that they will play, for the record. So yeah, don't just pencil him in as the winner. Carve that thing in fucking diamond now. Chris Nolan… to say he has manufactured one of the most grim morality tales, that he has single handedly redefined a modern mythology cinematically and given a previously thought incapable dramatic gravity to the proceedings, it just can't be articulated. It has to be experienced. It's a remarkably well written and directed film that should earn some accolades in their own respect. To pull this off amidst the hype and expectations and ensuing sadness from Ledger's passing, well… he pulled off a Kerri Strug here. And there is NO way he returns to direct the next installment. He's far too smart to know he can't replicate this feat a third time in a row. He'll exec produce—but he's gonna go out on top here and move on now that he has wrote his own ticket for the next 10 years. If we're lucky they'll get Aronofsky to sign while he's dropping acid. Maybe Fincher or even Del Toro if they're desperate for pet project financing. Danny Boyle could possibly pull it off if they script is bulletproof, Ewan as Riddler becomes a virtual lock, but they would have to Se7en that script hardcore. Michael Mann would be a dream choice, but it will never happen because he is one of the most brilliant directors of the last 20 years. God forbid we get stuck with the likes of Tarsem or anyone with the last name of Scott. Actually, God, just let this be the last one. Nothing can top it and anything subsequent will be like watching a hot ex-girlfriend get turned out into crack whore status. Bale—man, it's so easy to overlook him and take him for granted unless you have ovaries. His Bruce Wayne and Batman are both more demonized than one could have thought possible. Maggie Girl-Not-Katie-Holmes-Enhaal was not nearly as insufferable as her predecessor and gives her role sincerity and credibility. Oldman, Freeman, Caine—a triangulation of acting's most capable bastions that anchor the entire film and whose presences are the sole reason why this franchise kicks the living hell out of the Burton-Schumacher interpretations. I am so glad Caine pulled back on the accent a bit more here. Oldman elevates statesmanship to a new level. Freeman has one of the classiest denouements in a personification of real world shades of grey events. Aaron Eckhart is beyond reproach and will be criminally underappreciated here. And I always turn into a 10 year old girl when I get to hear Zimmer / Newton Howard scores… I possess more of their work then any other two composers. Heat was my most treasured personal film experience until this point. It was the film I always wanted to write, or direct, if things had been a different way for me occupationally. I find it fittingly ironic that Nolan refers to that film as his primary inspiration for this one. An audience of guys, girls, and geeks was enraptured continuously. IMAX provides the most visceral effect… see it no other way unless you want to be able to breathe regularly throughout. This is my weak-ass amateur reflection of my most favorite-est film ever. It doesn't have to be your favorite-est film ever, but I hope you give it a chance and see it at least 5 times to find out for sure. This film is why I can point at a screen and say "THAT'S why I collected comic books." If you want a willing partner to view with, I'll go see it with anyone, anytime, even with my most hated enemy who I have yet to encounter but I am sure we can find common ground for 2 ½ hours here. my myspace rant posted here... shared and bared for the world to see and flame.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:49 p.m. CST

    msspurlock

    by Second Try

    That's the same I'm feeling reading the reviews...

  • July 18, 2008, 2:50 p.m. CST

    It's like the end of "Seven".

    by cookylamoo

  • July 18, 2008, 2:50 p.m. CST

    Maggie Whatshername is ugly

    by Second Try

    Katie Holmes > Maggie Whatshername

  • July 18, 2008, 2:51 p.m. CST

    It's like the End of "Seven".

    by cookylamoo

    Where Freeman states he believes people are basically good at heart and the audience says "what exactly do you base that opinion on considering what just happened?"

  • July 18, 2008, 2:55 p.m. CST

    Maggie has a smokin body...

    by eXcommunicated

    ...and a great walk. But her face is mule-ugly.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:56 p.m. CST

    The Joker Can't Come Back.....

    by Imperium74

    Saw it last nite at a midnight IMAX show. (The only way to see it!) It's sad cause the Joker can't come back. Ledger was perfect in this movie. He owns the role now. There isn't an actor out there that could do what he did with the role and to copy it would be a damn shame. My God, that sucking sound he constantly made with his mouth on his scars, gave me the heebie jeebies all nite. I could see Two Face coming back. Perfect movie with a few flaws that don't touch it. By the way, didn't anyone think that the Joker and his boys just got the fuck outta dodge when Bats dove out the window? They couldn't find Harvey so they probably bolted fast. Going to see it again tonight at 7 and Tuesday. Best Comic movie ever, it transcends other comic book movies.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:56 p.m. CST

    Cloaker Cobra

    by eXcommunicated

    Use < br > or < p > tags (without spaces) to make paragraphs.

  • July 18, 2008, 2:58 p.m. CST

    ......AND

    by Imperium74

    The Pencil trick fucking rules.

  • July 18, 2008, 3 p.m. CST

    You've got to love people like Laser Pants

    by cookylamoo

    Why type things like "No need for discussion" on a talkback page.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:01 p.m. CST

    FUCKING WATCH THIS

    by eric haislar

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDxgNjMTPIs

  • July 18, 2008, 3:06 p.m. CST

    You people have some mighty short memories

    by Garbageman33

    I remember the vitriol on these very boards when Health Ledger was announced as the Joker. Most people wrote him off as a pretty boy lightweight and suggested their choices. Crispin Glover, anyone? Probably because they couldn't imagine him doing what Jack Nicholson did. Thankfully, he didn't. He did something all his own. In fact, I wonder if he even watched the original Batman.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:09 p.m. CST

    WELL WELL MISS DUPONT...........

    by SISKOKID

    ...another rooster in the henhouse:-)

  • July 18, 2008, 3:31 p.m. CST

    Here's a pic from a deleted scene...

    by rev_skarekroe

    ...that I demand to see! http://tinyurl.com/59a8f3

  • July 18, 2008, 3:37 p.m. CST

    Thanks For The Love Cookylamoo

    by LaserPants

    I'll let you suck my cock for a nominal fee. The semen is free, though. You can keep that. See how generous I am? Magnanimous even!<br><br> I suppose I was being facetious? Like, "this movie pwns so hard there's no point debating the fact that its the best superhero movie ever made." Not best movie, mind you, but best movie of its kind; best movie of a particular genre. Of course, there are those who will disagree. Opinions, you know, being like assholes (everybody has one) and everybody is entitled to being wrong.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:44 p.m. CST

    I Admit It, I Was Skeptical Of Ledger When He Was Announced

    by LaserPants

    Then we saw the clips, and was intrigued, then saw the actual film and was stunned by the awesome. Its a real shame he's gone, 'cause he knocked it outta the park, a grandslam homerun. See? Thats what happens when you do too much coke and Olsen twins. R.I.P., Heath, you left us too soon.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:46 p.m. CST

    Olsen twins

    by eric haislar

    what a way to go.

  • I knew I saw it before! Yeah.. anyway, nice review/article.

  • July 18, 2008, 3:58 p.m. CST

    "..been swiped from Daredevil"

    by Aeghast

    That's the entire phrase, heh

  • July 18, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    Captain America for Aaron Echart

    by antonphd

    He's the ONLY one who can play Captain America. And my money is on Catwoman for 3.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    Maggie Gyllenhall

    by The Octagoner

    was INCREDIBLY UGLY throughout this movie. Every time the camera showed her face I winced. She has the face of a pug dog, and the only part of the movie that required a suspension of disbelief from me was the idea that these two alpha males would want to go near her.<p>Other than that: great movie. The fight scenes still sucked, but it was a great flick. The Batman movie I waited my whole life for.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    harvey DOES leave a stain on his hospital pillow

    by Jubba

    just not a huge one

  • July 18, 2008, 4:04 p.m. CST

    The Octagone aka Tom Cruise

    by antonphd

    you really are pathetic.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:08 p.m. CST

    Clearly I'm pathetic

    by The Octagoner

    Thanks for clearing that up anton. What'd you get your phd in, Gender Studies?

  • July 18, 2008, 4:09 p.m. CST

    Maybe I should put phd after my name

    by The Octagoner

    Since, you know, I have one. That will lend credibility to my observations about butt-ugly actresses.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:20 p.m. CST

    loved it, but i hope Batman gets more to do in the next one

    by BMacSmith

    i was actually bored when he was onscreen fighting thugs. I wanted more Joker or Dent or Gordon. Bale was kinda left out.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:21 p.m. CST

    Aw Man, She Looked Alright

    by LaserPants

    I used to think she was kinda but-her-face too, but she looked pretty good in this I thought. I'd call her average, not ugly. Holmes is way cuter, but she can't act.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:22 p.m. CST

    And don't forget dental assistant!

    by 0007

    to your long-list of professions. Go Norman Oklahoma!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:24 p.m. CST

    Totally, Erichaislar

    by LaserPants

    If yr gonna go, might as well go whilst plowing the Olsen twins tweaked on some uncut columbian. Oh and yeah, make no mistake, the guy didn't kill himself, he was just partying way too hard. I heard some anecdote on NPR the other day about how he had a hard time sleeping whilst working on the film. Yeah, no shit, thats what happens when you're doing too much coke. It has nothing to do with playing a maniac.

  • I dont know about the rest of you..you all have your comments and I respect that..The dark knight ruled..plain and simple since everyody has already said it. BUT FOR THE NEXT PICTURE..BRING IN TALIA..DAUGHTER OF RAS AL GOUL..DAUGHTER OF THE DEMON..IT WOULD BE PERFECT FOR THE END..IF THIS IS JUST A TRILOGY..THEY EXPLAIN HER PAST WITH BRUCE..BRING IN THE NEW LEAGUE OF SHADOWS..AND HAVE IAN NEESON..COME BACK AS A DEGENERATED RAS AL GOUL.. I have mentioned this before..but never any comments...But no one knows bruce/batman better than Ras..and no I dont mean bring in robin and the love child spoiled brat Damien..but someone needs to take out/over the mob..and talia and ras would be perfect..Course thats just me..I could be wrong..what do you think talkbackers..Peace to ya...

  • July 18, 2008, 4:27 p.m. CST

    Guy's I jsut got back from the doctor!

    by eric haislar

    The Dark Knight Cured my cancer!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:27 p.m. CST

    Retcon Talia & Selina Kyle Into The Same Person Maybe?

    by LaserPants

    That might work in this iteration. Just a thought, please don't crucify me.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:28 p.m. CST

    phoenixmagi2

    by Damage_Inc

    Ha. That's hilarious. BTW, Maggie is awesome!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:28 p.m. CST

    I Just Got Back From The UN

    by LaserPants

    The Dark Knight created world peace! World peace through comic book noir nihilism! Awesome!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:31 p.m. CST

    No I wont crucify anyone..for comments..

    by joker40

    Maybe a dissapearing pencil trick..lol and sorry no...selina and talia the same person no...I can see them being partners or allies though...peace..

  • July 18, 2008, 4:36 p.m. CST

    Here's the paradox of the whole Heath Ledger thing...

    by Kevin Bosch

    I keep going back and forth with that in my head "Heath Ledger did such an amazing job as the Joker, they can't possibly replace him. Such an amazing job in fact, that the Joker has to be in the next movie, even if it means recasting. But they can't. But they must..."

  • July 18, 2008, 4:37 p.m. CST

    New AICN Catchphrase!

    by Damage_Inc

    How did Batman know that the Joker just burst in to Bruce Wayne's Penthouse? Classic.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    Damage_Inc

    by eric haislar

    Because he's god damn Batman!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:39 p.m. CST

    Right on the Money

    by tunafreedolphin

  • July 18, 2008, 4:40 p.m. CST

    Can't stop watching the Watchmen trailer.

    by Veraxus

    And it breaks my heart that I can't see it sooner than March of next year. What a damn tragedy that is. The trailer is un-be-fucking-lievable... and on the big screen you get a clear view of Dr. Manhattan's glowing blue junk. I never thought a director would have the balls to make a proper Batman OR Watchmen movie... and now we have two and both.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:42 p.m. CST

    I'm thinking Two Face and Catwoman for 3

    by VictorNewman

    I think the theory about declaring Harvey dead and sticking him in Arkham is bang on. If he busts out (maybe another Scarecrow cameo)and Nolan introduces Catwoman, I think that would be a good way to end the trilogy.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:44 p.m. CST

    The best joke of all ...

    by Damage_Inc

    was the rumor that Two Face died at the end. I even started to believe that crap myself. I'd like to know how people came up with that.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:44 p.m. CST

    Right on the Money

    by tunafreedolphin

    Screw the haters, this movie fuckin rock's. Any fanboy who has a problem with any of it can blow me. I'm not one to care about who wins awards, but ledger's performance greatly outshines villains such as hannibal lector. Now let's watch as the academy simply disregards him...

  • July 18, 2008, 4:44 p.m. CST

    shit, forgot *SPOILER*

    by VictorNewman

    sorry, sorry , sorry

  • July 18, 2008, 4:45 p.m. CST

    VictorNewman

    by Damage_Inc

    I don't think Warners would be stupid enough to give us yet another Catwoman.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:47 p.m. CST

    Damage_Inc

    by Underdogthe3rd

    I agree, but Fox said something about cats (maybe a hint?). Well, better Catwoman than Robin. I guess.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:49 p.m. CST

    Underdogthe3rd

    by Damage_Inc

    something about cats? What do you mean?

  • July 18, 2008, 4:49 p.m. CST

    Catwoman can be done properly

    by VictorNewman

    ie: Batman: Year One Catwoman plus: it might help erase that piece of cat turd movie from people's minds

  • July 18, 2008, 4:50 p.m. CST

    nah. Two Face was great but he's dead.

    by BMacSmith

  • July 18, 2008, 4:50 p.m. CST

    Daniel Day-Lewis as The Joker if need in the 3rd film.

    by riskebiz

    He publically felt so bad for Heath and it seems to me that if asked to help by taking over the part, he'd do it.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    Damage_Inc

    by Underdogthe3rd

    Yeah, when Bruce asks if the new armor will be dog-proof. Fox respond "Chiuaua or Rorweiller? Cat-proof I can assure".

  • July 18, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    If they had any brains or balls....

    by Damage_Inc

    They would give Eckhardt anything he wants to return, then do a Long Halloween or Dark Victory.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    Why apologize for spoilers?

    by jdl82

    This entire page has a read line around it with the word "spoiler" or something. Spoil away.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    ok, I'll say it,and we'll let it go:

    by VictorNewman

    I drink your bat-shake!!

  • July 18, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    i think the trick to the next one

    by BMacSmith

    is to bring it back to focusing on Batman a little more. Catwoman would be a good vehicle for that. Another villian can be the main threat, but The next villian can't possibly top the Joker, so i think the trick is to make him less central to the movie. am i making any sense here?

  • July 18, 2008, 4:53 p.m. CST

    Oh yeah, I remember now.

    by Damage_Inc

  • July 18, 2008, 4:55 p.m. CST

    oh. and save bringing back the Joker for later. maybe part 4 or

    by BMacSmith

    when people will accept a new actor

  • July 18, 2008, 4:55 p.m. CST

    Step it all up for Batman 3

    by A for Aristocrat

    I hope they bring in Black Mask and the false face society for Batman 3. That way they can bring in alot of Batman villians and show the final gang war between the old criminals and the new freaks. It would also be an easy way to bring in catwoman and minor characters like firefly.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:55 p.m. CST

    enough heat comparisons

    by Prossor

    what a tired bloated mess of a movie that was.

  • July 18, 2008, 4:58 p.m. CST

    $18.5 million in midnight showing only

    by VictorNewman

    not too shabby indeed!

  • July 18, 2008, 5:05 p.m. CST

    phoenixmagi2

    by Damage_Inc

    Dude, are you serious?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:08 p.m. CST

    Didn

    by Tacom

  • July 18, 2008, 5:08 p.m. CST

    Glowing-eyes Bats v. the GPD

    by jdl82

    I'd been one of the ones who'd really wanted to see Batman wear those lenses. But now having seen them, I'm not so sure I'd been right about it. Did anyone else find them a little distracting? <p>Also, as much as I loved the film, I found that to have been one of the worst coreographed fight scences ever. I think that they could have done without the "submarine" sonar cell-phones thing. What about you?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:08 p.m. CST

    Didn't expect them to kill Rachel off like that

    by Tacom

    That was pretty hardcore. I was like "damn".

  • July 18, 2008, 5:09 p.m. CST

    Did anyone notice....

    by Damage_Inc

    how bad some of the CGI was?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:09 p.m. CST

    What was that bit about secret government projects?

    by Duck of Death

    It went by too fast for me to catch what was going on, but it was part of the conversation b/w Lucius Fox and Bruce Wayne, where Fox asks him about Wayne doing some kind of secret R&D for the government, and Wayne says he's keeping it close to the chest. Was that related to the story, or some kind of "throwaway" detail that will be explored in the next film?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:10 p.m. CST

    jdl82

    by Damage_Inc

    Distracting is the perfect word. Yes, that whole thing could have been ditched.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:12 p.m. CST

    How did Gordon survive being shot?

    by jdl82

    Had it been his plan all along to fake his own death? If not, how did he survive?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:14 p.m. CST

    jdl82

    by Underdogthe3rd

    Kevlar.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:15 p.m. CST

    Don't re-use the villians for the next one

    by wash

    Sheesh. Too soon for a recast Joker, and TDK is more effective if Two Face stays dead.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:17 p.m. CST

    To the AICN staff...

    by Damage_Inc

    How about a "What did you think of TDK?" post/talkback like they did with Indy 4. It would be better that people asking questions like "How did Batman know that the Joker just burst in to Bruce Wayne's Penthouse?" And it will give us something to bitch and whine about all weekend long!!!

  • July 18, 2008, 5:22 p.m. CST

    And there is no way

    by Damage_Inc

    that Two Face is dead.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:26 p.m. CST

    duck o death

    by BMacSmith

    i think that was the sonar celphone thing? not sure about that.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:28 p.m. CST

    Has anyone here

    by Damage_Inc

    read Long Halloween or Dark Victory?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:33 p.m. CST

    can someone please answer

    by Damage_Inc

    How did Batman know that Ras Al Ghul broke into Wayne Manor in Batman Begins?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:37 p.m. CST

    can someone please answer

    by Damage_Inc

    How did Batman know that Riddler and Two Face broke into Wayne Manor in Batman Forever?

  • July 18, 2008, 5:42 p.m. CST

    Batman Begins sucked.....

    by Damage_Inc

    And The Dark Knight sucked ass!

  • July 18, 2008, 5:48 p.m. CST

    there were giant plot holes but i didnt care at all

    by BMacSmith

    it was worth it just to see the Joker fuck shit up royally. good job.

  • July 18, 2008, 5:50 p.m. CST

    By now Heath could play Two Face

    by EbertsFatThumb

    without requiring the expensive CGI. Don't wait too long Nolan! He will only be ripe for so long...

  • July 18, 2008, 5:50 p.m. CST

    Screw it

    by Damage_Inc

  • July 18, 2008, 5:57 p.m. CST

    If 3...

    by rbrog77

    ...and if the riddler it has to be Michael Emerson. I still prefer Talia, though.<P> But thinking how it ended, suppose it's not a villian. Suppose it's bats versus the mob and the cops. Gordon would have his hands tied since as far as the world knows bats killed those people. Nolan did say this was always meant to be a story about the bat, not the villans.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:04 p.m. CST

    #3 on IMDB top 250!!

    by malamatijm

    Anyone see this? As of this evening Dark Knight on #3 in IMDb top 250... how far down do you rekon it'll drop?

  • July 18, 2008, 6:04 p.m. CST

    I put it to YOU, Greg!!

    by Hercules

    I know it's kind of an obvious idea to make a guy called The Joker funny, but this Joker was REALLY funny!! <p>Could this Joker be the most entertaining movie villain ever concocted? Does he surpass the likes of Hans Gruber, Clubber Lang, Roy Batty, the "leaning leaning" guy from Night of The Hunter, Tommy Udo and the ED-209?? Oh, and of course Jim Carrey's Riddler. <p> Whom am I forgetting?

  • July 18, 2008, 6:09 p.m. CST

    Was I the only one who saw a stain?

    by Errockk

    It was small, but it still was a stain. harsh!

  • July 18, 2008, 6:15 p.m. CST

    how do you make the penguin a good villian?

    by BMacSmith

    i dont know much about him, but i know Burton didnt get it right.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:23 p.m. CST

    I know Hugo Strange isn't an A List villain,

    by VictorNewman

    but in Nolan's universe, he could probably give Bats a good mindfuck...something to consider

  • July 18, 2008, 6:29 p.m. CST

    Ok so how scary is it?

    by Series7

    I've heard a lot of stories about how disfigured it looks, and how it may not be appropriate for all kids but just how disfigured is Maggie Gyllenhaal in the movie? I mean I've seen Secretary and she was pretty messed up looking in that, but I just heard all sorts of things about how messed up they made her. Like crazy ugly, I'm excited and scared. Excited because I know she dies, but scared because I'll have to see her on the big screen.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:30 p.m. CST

    I think this movie is just a setup...

    by Boo Cocky

    to introduce Deebo as the next Batman villain!

  • July 18, 2008, 6:33 p.m. CST

    Whom am I forgetting?

    by Iowa Snot Client

    Frank Booth, fucker! Feel my muscles!

  • July 18, 2008, 6:34 p.m. CST

    Dancing with the Bat

    by Series7

    In the pale moon light. Is Heath going to do the late night circuit.... If I were Jack Nicholson, I would go around and do it for and and just act like it was me. You know I know everyone is shitting their pants about it, but I feel like Jack will never be beat. Like Ebert said, this isn't Batman, its like a whole other comic book character.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:36 p.m. CST

    eoneon

    by batzilla

    get a job loser

  • July 18, 2008, 6:41 p.m. CST

    I found Dark Knight's Joker more entertaining

    by Hercules

    than Frank Booth.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:45 p.m. CST

    It was good but...

    by Binkysguy

    the best movie some reviewers have seen in several YEARS? Come on. I know people are all butthurt about vicodin boy's untimely death but let's keep shit in perspective. I liked Iron Man better.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:49 p.m. CST

    Snake Oil

    by Goldfingah

    Someone I know who loved the movie verbalized very well what I couldn't; in reference to Batman's cell-phone snooping he said it tried to "sell the snake oil that big brother is good if the intention is good." That hit the nail on the head for me. That scene really and truly turned me off; I liked all the other aspects of Frank Miller's Batman that they brought to the screen, does the quasi-fascist have to make it up there too? With the exception of the Hulk movies (both of them), where the military basically gets bashed for wanting to use Bruce Banner's engine of destruction as a weapon, and Superman Returns, where Perry White excised "the American Way" from the phrase describing what Superman stands for, I've felt my blood curdle at some of the politics pushed, overtly or subtly in a lot of comic-book movies. From the ham-handed "you mess with one of us, you mess with all of us" in Spider Man, to the neo-con chest-thumping, revisionist Barbarians at the gates racism in 300, to the depiction of the military as benevolent but helpless/clueless in Iron Man, to this latest incident of Batman snooping in on everyone to catch a terrorist, it seems that all these comic books are on the same page. This is why, I believe, Captain America cannot and should not and fortunately will not be made in this neocon, Bush climate. Whereas other comic book movies can just classify their politics as incidental, stuff the viewer can glaze over in view of all the other details, Captain America's nationality will ALWAYS be front and center. I'm pretty sure that for years, given the current divide, Marvel has been racking their brains trying to figure out how to make a movie that will please both the red and the blue states, as well as the rest of the world (like us) who subscribe to the belief that America is slowly choking on the bile of its own creation. TDK, whether deliberately or not, has certainly raised some valid questions about terrorism, but I for one wasn't crazy about its "Big Brother" answer. Imagine defenders of the Patriot Act citing this movie as reference.

  • July 18, 2008, 6:58 p.m. CST

    I was speaking from a my Pre-TDK perspective.

    by Iowa Snot Client

    I...I haven't seen it yet... sniff! I also thought Nic Cage in Face/Off was a very good non-Joker Joker.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:13 p.m. CST

    BMacSmith RE: penguin

    by PushTheButton

    I did some research on The Penguin. Apparently in the comics, he was just a really classy and smart mob boss. No gimmicks, no deformities, no "wahh wahh wahh" laugh. It seems feasible in Nolan's Gothom, but maybe he's gone to the mob well too often.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:17 p.m. CST

    Binkysguy

    by Series7

    I've yet to see the Dark Night, but I'm gonna go ahead and put it above Ironman, though I bet it won't be the best movie this year even. It's going to have to be unfuckingbelievable to surpass Wall-E and fucking fantastic to out excite Speed Racer. But it goes above Ironman because come on, I can understand Hulk/Spidy/Hellboy/Ghost/Daredevil pretty much any comic book movie thats come out since movie scores started to suck. But Ironmans retardation use of the single easiest part for that movie is just inexcusable. They got the rights to the damn song, and they it looked like they had at least a 10th grade understanding of the effects of music in the trailer, but to piddle away with some background music in the whole movie to just play the song over the credits like its Hero/Vidicated/Kiss Me Kill Me/That Prince Song/MC Hammers Turtle Power/Set Me Free was absolutely a deal breaker. Ironman (the song) is a fucking beast, and it should've been handled as such, everyone knows it (even your mom) and for them to pussyfoot with it and not play the starting "I AM IRONMAN" right before the end fight,(Was there an end fight, i don't really remember there even being a bad guy) either because they didn't want the song to over shadow the lack of villain (The Dude who was also very wasted in it), or they didn't want to come off as cheesy by using it. If they had come up with some bad ass new theme song then yes, even a kick ass score (Burton's Batman, Superman, even the new Batman score is fucking kick ass)use that. But to not crank up Ozzy, and then lazily play it over the credits like it was the newest billboard topper rock band making a blockbuster summer movie hit tune, just terrible. Huge huge let down.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:19 p.m. CST

    phoenixmagi2

    by Kevin Bosch

    He has like a bunch of surveillance and security equipment hooked up everywhere in the building. I would've been surprise if he DIDNT know the Joker was coming. I'm betting there's a cut scene somewhere showing Bruce checking out a close circuit monitor or being notified of the breach, but i think it was pretty clear in the movie.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:19 p.m. CST

    It is an amazing movie...

    by Sparhawk38

    This review is good...but I have read reviews that really make mistakes about the movie and the Batman universe. One critic complained that the Joker claimed to be completely chaotic, yet meticulously planned the things he did. YES!! When he give that speech he is trying to manipulate Dent! ... How can you miss that.. frustrating.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:26 p.m. CST

    phoenixmagi2

    by Damage_Inc

    The answer is....Bruce Wayne is Batman. I was waiting for someone to cry that Dent is dead. So both Batman and Dent fall about 30 feet. BM gets up and shakes it off. But the same fall killed Dent? Come the fuck on.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:33 p.m. CST

    jesus get over yourself goldfinga

    by BMacSmith

    Ironman had a pretty negative slant on the arms companies that make money (through the US) on war, and as you said Hulk was pretty harsh on the military in general. I dont see what that part in Spidey has to do with Neo-cons People loving their city and protecting their own equates to nationalistic ignorant neo conservatism to you? You sound like the only way you will like a Captain AMerica movie is if its fullblown anti-american.<p>The TDK spying thing is interesting in that Fox was very much against it and the whole thing raises interesting quewstions on the fascist nature of superheroes in general.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:38 p.m. CST

    FUCKIN A' YEAH!! -- Daniel Day Lewis As Joker In Part 3

    by LaserPants

    That is the ONLY way it could be done and not be hopelessly lesser than Ledgers take. And since, after this, Nolan is pretty much going to be able to write his own check, I think its a strong possibility.<br><br> I DRINK YOUR BATSHAKE!!! SLRRRRRP! I DRINK IT UP!!!

  • July 18, 2008, 7:40 p.m. CST

    very nicely written

    by couP

  • July 18, 2008, 7:53 p.m. CST

    Nice review, Ms. DuPont

    by bravogolfhotel

    Very sorry about all the stained pillow kerfuffle.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:54 p.m. CST

    If you need even one little more reason to go see this

    by shitstorm23

    The Joker/Two Face conversation is it. Everything I could have hoped for was right there. Perfectly showed Joker's intellect and cunning with Two Face's misguided rage. Superb. <p> 3 is tough. As much as I've enjoyed this series, it seems like a 3rd would ruin it, because where do you go? Bane is silly. So is Riddler. Catwoman would be interesting, but where is this story going with her? And doing Joker without Heath is risking someone not owning that role. DDL, would be fucking sick though. <p> Batman getting it from crazies, mob, police & civilians would be interesting. The Joker trial going on in the background, with the system failing as he gets put in arkham instead of death/life in prison sentence. Two Face being alive is plausible, Harvey died, but not Two Face would work as their reasoning. But a different overall villain would be tough.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:57 p.m. CST

    Honestly, I'm getting kind of sick of this.

    by NiceGuyEddie19

    It's idiotic. It's a movie. I read today that the Phoenix Sun said that "...examining the Dark Knight's greatness is tantamount to analyzing the curves of Michelangelo's David..." What? I mean I know David is just a fucking statue, but... The implications are absolutely mind boggling. They're saying hundreds of years from now people are going to be looking to the Dark Knight as a piece of art absolutely timeless and masterful that it will inspire generation after generation. What the fuck? I'm gonna go watch fat ass Adam West do the Bat Dance, to remind me of Batman's humble rise to prominence.

  • July 18, 2008, 7:59 p.m. CST

    I just got back from seeing this

    by Turd Furgeson

    I'm actually kinda depressed after it. It really affected me like that. I was only 4 when Empire Strikes Back came out so I didn't get the heavy emotional feel of the end. Now I think I understand... You really do hope and pray what happens to Harvy isn't going to happen even though you know its going to happen, like changing time, but you know it's impossible. For all the praise Ledger gets, and however good you think he's going to be, he's a thousand times better, It really is Harvey Dent's movie. I read that here and didn't buy it. I do now. It truly is a tragedy of Epic proportions.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:03 p.m. CST

    just got back from seeing it

    by BALTIMOREJACK

    it was terrib...ly amazing! just saying its the best comic book movie i have ever seen, doesnt do it justice. it was one of the best movies i have ever seen, period. rarely, if ever, does something like this live up to the hype. this did. it still had surprises for me, even though a couple assholes tried to ruin it in these talkbacks. this made indy 4 look like it was made by a couple first year film students at the local community college; take note messrs. lucas and spielberg. ledger is amazing, bale is great. the fight scenes, i have no problem with. batman's fights are supposed to be brutal, in your face; nolan does that. i cannot wait to see this again on sunday morning. truly a great, great movie. tops of the summer...and the fall.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:04 p.m. CST

    NiceGuyEddie19

    by LaserPants

    The Dark Knight is better than the statue of David, totally. At least I think so because I'm not all that in to looking at naked guys. But yeah, the hyperbole is way over the top. Still, it is a really, REALLY fuckin' awesome movie. You gotta see it. Its a fuckin' masterpiece of awesome.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:05 p.m. CST

    If they're bringing the joker back

    by Turd Furgeson

    Ok I get Daniel Day Lewis, I can see it, but what if you can't get him.. Who then? I can totally see Ben Foster in the role.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:09 p.m. CST

    Just bring

    by Series7

    Nicholson back, I mean why not? There's no way Batman Begins 3: Die Hard With A Vengeance will live up to 2. You know like how Jaws one was the mother and Jaws two was the son or something like that? Friday the 13th?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:09 p.m. CST

    LaserPants

    by NiceGuyEddie19

    Look man, I don't doubt that the movie is awesome and I am going to see it, no doubt at all. But jesus tittyfucking christ, enough! Enough! Enough! This much hype can turn me against almost anything.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:10 p.m. CST

    Forget Heat, and Seven, this was the Unbreakable sequel

    by AntoniusBloc

    With Two Face thrown in. Great film, but not a great typical super hero action film if that's what you are looking for. But this is great drama. Edge of your seat, and tense drama. I didn't find the film depressing ,as through Bruce Wayne's character hope is found in the good he saw not just in Dent earlier, but the common people in the ferry scene, and the Joker perplexed. I still think at times the film can be realistic to a fault, we don't mind a little fantasy and escapism in the fight scenes. Mediocre action aside, the drama was great, and great performances, although i personally was more impressed by Dent. But i agree with a post above, his turn was a bit rushed, although foreshadowed when he almost took out the insane guy. The scarecrow thing, will try to figure it out in second viewing, did seem pointless. But the major characters, with the exception of Dawes, were impressive.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:10 p.m. CST

    NO JOKER RECAST PLEASE!!!!

    by Dogmatic

    DID NO ONE GET JOKER'S LAST LITTLE SPEECH?? It was all lifted from the Killing Joke how Batman and Joker will always be fighting each other....Joker won't devise a plan that Batman can't work around b/c in his subconscious without Batman he has no one to play with...and Batman won't kill Joker b/c it crosses his line and Joker wins....and Joker certainly won't give up...so in this Bat-verse...it was well established in this final speech that the two are destined to forever be Joker breaking out and Batman putting him back in an endless cycle. <P> There is no reason to show this in movie form...and it would be an absolute TRAVESTY to recast Joker! Ledger played this perfect. There simply can't BE another Joker until like 30 years from now when the next Bat-franchise will re-introduce him. <P> That is all.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:11 p.m. CST

    And ANTONCH is dead on about Captain America

    by Dogmatic

    being played by Aaron Eckhart! He has the exposure now...and he has the hair, eyes, jawline, height, build....perfect observation my friend!

  • July 18, 2008, 8:14 p.m. CST

    HEY A LITTLE BITCHING GOES A LONG WAY :)

    by eoneon

    I was upset about AICN not posting "spoiler" in the title,but a few others and I complained and, poof there it is! just got back from seeing it at 11 am for $5 what a great movie! can there really be a sequel to this though?? I'd like one,but don't see how. plus a friend told me Anthony Michael Hall had a cameo,I must've missed it or he wasnt in it?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:17 p.m. CST

    The only problem with Captain America....

    by NiceGuyEddie19

    Is that really, no one has cared about him for about 65 years, and the US' image in the world is at its all-time worst, rendering the goofy fuckin' costume and name and character obselete and stupid. However, if they handle it as a poignant commentary on that state of affairs, it could be pretty well done - really, I think it could. If they make CA's character someone who only remembers when we were the good guys, and is sickened by the fact that we aren't anymore... and does something about it.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:19 p.m. CST

    Next one will be modeled after Dark Knight Returns

    by Dogmatic

    Just wait...you'll see. <P> That is the pattern here. Nolan is using Miller and Moore's works for his inspiration. Batman Begins was totally derived from Miller's Year One and Dark Knight is totally derived from Killing Joke...while Two-Face's part is derived from both Year Three and Dark Victory storylines by Jeph Loeb (where former commissioner Loeb's name came from) <P> So, with Batman on the run, the Batman copycat vigilantes, Joker's last statements about Batman seeing how Gotham will react when they are brought completely low and then for sure will tear each other apart....that all foreshadows not a direct adaptation but definitely Dark Knight Returns as the groundwork for the next film. <P> Still not sure on villain though....I still like the idea of introducing Bane the right way, and it could work in this story. A guy who will take the chaos that is Gotham under Batman's watch and force it into order by sheer force and brutality...take over the city and make it behave....soemthing Batman isn't quite willing to do though in Dark Knight Returns he learns how to find the balance.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:20 p.m. CST

    You know what would be cool

    by Series7

    In order to waver away from fucking up a third, make a What If... movie. Except thats Marvels bag isn't it? Maybe make a Bizzaro Batman? So they can make it an intentional comedy.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:21 p.m. CST

    Well Toby Jones as the Penguin

    by Drath

    And maybe make him a brilliant wealthy guy just like Wayne but who moonlights as a criminal mastermind--like the Kingpin as played by Hannibal Lector--and someone who zeroes in on Bruce Wayne again, possibly figuring out that he is, if not the Batman himself, then deeply involved in funding and arming him. Catwoman is important, but I'll grant you, I don't know how she'd really tempt Wayne away from the driven mission he's on. Possilby she'd be a relief from all the pain, someone one who sweeps in and makes him feel alive. Best thing to do with her is make Bruce and the audience love her. She can't be going around on rooftops fighting him with a whip any more than Harley Quinn can come summer-saulting into a scene or Poison Ivy can arrive with her giant plant beasts. They're all great, but clearly Nolan's Batverse is too serious for that stuff (which I think sucks, BTW). I'm sure Catwoman can still be a cat burgler, sure, and preferrable not one out for revenege again. But if they've killed off the Joker (or even if they didn't considering all things), I don't know how the villains get scarrier or more threatening. The Joker is IT for Batman. Maybe some more obscure guys like Hugo Strange? I think we have to hope they can do it. Penguin deserves a revisit though.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:21 p.m. CST

    NEW RULE: If I wanted to watch 3 hours of Batfag, I'd watch TV

    by Bill Maher

    and save myself a fortune. It's better to watch the old TV show, anyway. When people get punched, the word "POW!" flashes across the screen, just like in comic books. And where the fuck is Catwoman? I realize there are a bunch of big fat fags who love watching overacting from someone wearing a shitload of makeup, but a large percentage of the audience is HETEROSEXUAL and wants to see a leggy babe with a great ass in spandex who purrs. You pickle-kissers should have gotten your fill of overacting and excessive makeup from Mommie Dearest and The Rocky Horror Picture Show. At least those movies were less than three hours. So why put that crap in Batman?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:30 p.m. CST

    New Rule: If You're Gonna Steal Schtick, Make It Funny

    by LaserPants

    Fail!

  • July 18, 2008, 8:34 p.m. CST

    Dammit...

    by ebonic_plague

    There are OTHER good actors out there that would fit the part of an iconic superhero like Cap, rather than a guy who just nailed an iconic role as a supervillain. Everyone scoffed at the casting of Ledger, and now he officially owns the role of Joker... why is Eckhart automatically the fanboy go-to guy for the next superhero adaptation? He's kinda metro for Cap, anyway, but he was perfect as Dent. I say once you play a comic book superhero/villain, you don't get to play another one, at least for a while anyway. Bale's already treading on Keanu territory by jumping directly into John Conner's (arguably another super hero) shoes right after he took off the cowl, and isn't one ubiquitous Keanu enough? Also, don't flame me, I don't really care enough to get into it, but I thought it should be said.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:35 p.m. CST

    Phoenixmagi2

    by ebonic_plague

    A giant lion came in and performed CPR on him at the last second. Weren't you watching?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:36 p.m. CST

    Bill Maher

    by ebonic_plague

    I think Andy Rooney would be a more appropriate talkback persona for you.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:40 p.m. CST

    Phoenixmagi2 pt. 2

    by ebonic_plague

    You know that guy on all the talkbacks with the posts that make everyone roll their eyes? Right now you're that guy.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:44 p.m. CST

    I Still Think Matt Damon For Cap

    by LaserPants

    But he'd probably be too expensive.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:44 p.m. CST

    My Spoiler-filled thoughts

    by Bobo_Vision

    I can finally read the reviews now that I've seen the movie, and so far I've only read Alexandra's, and I agree with most of it, and she did a pretty good summary. The movie was amazing. There are so many good things about the movie that rather than taking the time to list them all, I'll just mention the few minor problems I had, which Alexandra mentioned. <p> I agree that Dent's arc from "white knight" to villain was a bit rushed, and his desire to take vengeance on Gary Oldman's character (the name escapes me right now) was not completely convincing. Batman was the one who dragged him out from where he was held hostage resulting in Rachel's death. Also, he didn't even know that Batman/Wayne made out with Rachel and was trying to get back with her. That would be a more personal reason to turn against him too, but I didn't see enough motive to threaten to kill Commisioner Gordon's (that's his name) family and son. <p> And Ledger was amazing as Joker, it was odd to watch the conclusion of this film. I was left with a feeling that he was sure to be back for the sequel since the Joker doesn't die at the end. I wanted to see more of him, and felt he would be back, even though that's now an impossibility. To recast would be sacrilege, so I don't know where they'll go from here.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:45 p.m. CST

    Man, Bill Maher if Ledger's "fag" Joker

    by Dogmatic

    got ahold of you you would be begging to perform lots of pleasures with a man deemed unnatural in God's eyes just so Joker would make your death faster. <P> Jeez..seriously bro....all heterosexual moviegoers dont give a rip about solid acting and just wanna see skintight females? Go rent Halle Barry's craptacular Catwoman if you want that bro. Rest of us heterosexuals gonna watch an awesome movie with the most frightening movie character in the Joker that has been seen in quite some time. <P> Frack, I just can't take these stupid people anymore...it's just too much.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:45 p.m. CST

    BMacSmith...I said subtle and overt

    by Goldfingah

    I'll grant that maybe my opinion of the Spider-Man films' politics is colored by what I know of Raimi's personal politics (he's a proud Republican who contributed to Bush's '04 campaign) and the rather jarring insertion of the American flag into scenes of Spider-Man 1 and 3, with the latter really taking me out of the story (not that there was much of a story to be taken out of). Okay, so maybe it isn't necessarily neocon, but I didn't care for Raimi's not-so-subtle reminder to the rest of the world that "Spider-Man is an AMERICAN hero and don't you (insert non-American nationals here) forget it!" I felt that was a tad selfish and uncalled for on Raimi's part, and did nothing to push forward the story. You're actually right about Iron Man but what irked me was how the movie seemed to imply that the military has had nothing to do with any of those shady deals, which from what I've read isn't always the case. I apologize if I branded the whole enterprise right-wing but I did have my problems with that depiction. Hulk is, well, like I said I have no problems with that. As for TDK (SPOILER ALERT), well, my big problem with it is that considering that this movie is all about its subtext, I really didn't like that a guy who's depicted as heroic enough to take the rap for murders he didn't commit is capable of spying on the city he has sworn to protect just to catch the one menacing it. The subtext here is: "It's okay that he tapped into 30 million cellphones, even over and above the objections of his confidant as to the ethics of this decision, because it was ONLY through this that he was able to catch the Joker. And anyway he destroyed the machine after using it once." Snake oil, my friend, snake oil.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:45 p.m. CST

    NEW RULE: TINA! BRING ME THE AXE!

    by Bill Maher

    Please. This is Batfag meets Mommie Dearest. At least Frank Gorshin's Riddler was cool. This is fucking LAME! Three hours of this shit?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:47 p.m. CST

    I've said it once and i'll say it again...

    by crazybubba

    No more recycled villians in the batman movies. Reading people write about how they want Daniel Day Lewis to play the joker drives me nuts. Some have mentioned the hint Lucious Fox made about the batsuit and cats or symore hoffman as the penguin. Please God I hope not. Phiffer and Devito nailed those roles. I wouldn't mind seeing more of Two-face, but I would prefer some of Batmans other less popular foes like Man-Bat, Bane or Killer Croc.Pleeeassse.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:48 p.m. CST

    NEW RULE: Dogmatic, it's not "solid" acting.

    by Bill Maher

    It's pure camp and it sucks. I almost expected him to start screaming "NO MORE WIRE HANGERS -EVER!".

  • July 18, 2008, 8:49 p.m. CST

    Bill Maher

    by ebonic_plague

    Your posts would be better if we could hear that nasal whine. I'm sorry to hear you were held against your will in the theater, but at least you got to bitch about the experience so it's not a total loss.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:50 p.m. CST

    A Cap Movie

    by Goldfingah

    As for a Cap/Avengers movie, I'd love to see the first arc of "Ultimates" adapted where he goes up against aliens/skrulls/chitauri or whatever you call them. It'd make for a real thrill ride and would stay true to Cap's origin (except for his kind of being a thug in some issues, but they could smooth that over). And like Hawkeye said in the last issue of that arc "it doesn't get more black-and-white than that, right?" But a truly ballsy movie, that I doubt will ever get made, is the "Grand Theft America" storyarc, where the Ultimates decide, at the end, to break away from the American military machine that's been funding them (like it apparently will in the Marvel movies) because by allowing themselves to be used for less-than-heroic purposes they have mad the American people targets. Some may argue it's an anti-American storyline, but I think one good way to interpret it is that, thanks to the wonders of globalization the superhero mythology now belongs to everyone. Chew on that for a minute, Sam Raimi.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:51 p.m. CST

    New Rule: Do Not Attempt Humor If You're Not Funny

    by LaserPants

    You're now bordering on EPIC FAIL.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:52 p.m. CST

    NEW RULE: Stop the racist attacks on Halle Berry, dogmatic.

    by Bill Maher

    You know, it's been a while but one thing you can count on at AICN is some fanboy douche engaging in coded racist attacks on Halle Berry, a strong PROUD black actress who blazed a trail for other African-American actresses like Charlize Theron to win an Oscar.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:54 p.m. CST

    Do not recast the Joker?

    by NiceGuyEddie19

    What do you think is going to happen in 12 years.... They're going to "reimagine" the Joker... including, obviously, recasting him. What are you, fuckin stupid?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:56 p.m. CST

    Its Not Anti-America, Its Anit-NeoCon / Bushworld

    by LaserPants

    The two must un-American people in he world are Cheney and Bush; two criminal fucks who need to be imprisoned and tortured for the remainder of their lives for ruining the country with their criminally negligent incompetence and straight-up evildoing. Impeach them, imprison them, watch them squirm and writhe in the tormented hell they designed for themselves -- then film it and put in on YouTube. Uppance! Come!

  • July 18, 2008, 8:57 p.m. CST

    3rd Batman Movie Villains

    by jamsun1227

    The direction TDK takes leaves the best possible villains as Catwoman and The Penguin. Penguin -- The city's criminal infrastructure is ripe for a corrupt businessman with financial connections to take over and "legitimize" the system. Oswald Cobblepot is that person. He can challenge Bruce's claim to Gotham while circumventing the RICO cases through legitimate business enterprises that have a dark underbelly. Catwoman -- Not only b/c of Fox's comment, but with the way TDK ended, she's a character who can force Batman to see that he's become both good and evil and how fine a line there is between the two. I expect Nolan to bring back Joker in name only out of respect for Ledger. As in, he broke out and is lying low. We all know the series won't go past 4, maybe 5 tops. Shame, b/c Ledger was fantastic, and that's an understatement. Two-Face will be back because of the duality of the above mentioned villains. Everything is split between good and evil, legit and shady. Would it be so wrong to have Oswald Cobblepot running the public businesses while Two-Face runs his seedier businesses?

  • July 18, 2008, 8:58 p.m. CST

    PUD!

    by ebonic_plague

    Man, sorry, Pud, if I'd known it was you all along, I would have just shut up and let the troll train roll. Hope you come back in character for when the Hobbit starts ramping up.

  • July 18, 2008, 8:58 p.m. CST

    New Rule: Don't Be A Total Douchebag Asshole

    by LaserPants

    Too late! "Coded racist attack"? Are you fucking insane? Bored? Retarded?

  • July 18, 2008, 9 p.m. CST

    NEW RULE: Fuck you, ebonic Plague!

    by Bill Maher

    I got suckered into watching 45 minutes of this crap in exchange for free beer and pizza, just like I was with The Matrix: Retarded. And just like The Matrix: Retarded, I would have slept through the whole fucking movie except for (a) the loud explosions and crashes (b) my friends who thought that because they paid my way that I should stay awake and kept elbowing me (c) falling asleep in the chairs in the movie house hurt my neck like a motherfucker and (d) that cheap ass beer on tap gives me gas likethe Hindenberg and the assholes sitting the next row down started bitching because I snored and farted for half an hour before they woke me up. Assholes. It wasn't me, it was the beer. Oh, but I'm supposed to pretend it was great because when I wasn't asleep, farting or being annoyed by everyone else some guy wore a shitload of pancake on his face and overacted like William Shatner? Fuck you!

  • July 18, 2008, 9:02 p.m. CST

    How Fat Are You, Bill?

    by LaserPants

    All the stuff about free beer, food, sleeping, and farting makes me assume you are at least 100 pounds overweight.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:03 p.m. CST

    About those HEAT comparisons

    by SnootyBoots

    Haven't seen TDK yet, but apparently it has some narrative similarities to HEAT. Well, if you ask me, Michael Mann's first movie, THIEF, is pretty much an urbanized remake of TARZAN'S GREATEST ADVENTURE. And I think Mann acknowledges this by ending his movie with the exact same shot that ends TGA. Having vanquished the foe but lost the girl our hero turns and heads back to his world while the camera cranes up past some tree limbs. Anyway, that's what I think.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    Too many errors this move!!!!

    by ZombieHunter

    <p>#1 Pillow Stains: Where were they? I didn't see any. Made no sense. His face should have left stains all over the pillow.</p> <p>#2 Two Face: How did Dent become Two-Face? They should have written in a scene where his face is some how mangled to explain that part of the story. Or even a reason why he chose the name Two-Face.</p> <p>#3 Rachel: What happened to her? One minute she's in the movie, the next she's just gone. They should have explained what happened to her.</p> <p>#4 Jokers Clothes: What the hell? Forget what happened after Bat-Man saves Rachel, we never see a scene where the Joker buys his clothes and puts them on. How does he get them? How does he put them on? Does he steal them? Is he dressed by clowns? I can't figure that part out. Adding a whole scene to explain that to me, step-by-step, would have picked up the pace of this movie and added so much.</p> <p>#5 Where's Ras Al Ghul?: They had everyone else. Seriously lost on that one. I just saw it twice today and I'm not kidding, He isn't in there.</p> <p>#6 Can someone please explain to me where the Chinaman came from?: Bat-Man needs him for some damned reason or another, and suddenly he's in Gotham. Hello? How did Bat-Man get him? Did he just phone him and tell him to come back? They really glossed over that part.</p> <p>#7 Jokers scars: Did anyone notice that they got the story of Jokers scars mixed up? In one part it was his dad, and the other part it was his wife? WTF? LOL!</p> <p>Anyways, There are spoilers in this post so don't read it if you haven't seen it yet.</p>

  • July 18, 2008, 9:08 p.m. CST

    pretty much

    by nate26322000

    saw the film earlier today, and was in awe the whole time. in my opinion heath has done for the joker what depp did for jack sparrow. the main question here is how many jokers do you expect to see this halloween???

  • July 18, 2008, 9:10 p.m. CST

    NOW I'm offended...

    by ebonic_plague

    ...you couldn't capitalize my christian first name? I know, man, pizza and beer are treacherous gastrointestinal whores, but at least the experience got your troll boner back at full mast. 3 hours is a long time to go without titties but I hope you'll be okay with minimal therapy. Just make sure Pud comes back with the "Fuck PJ, orc is Italian for BLACK!" schtick in time for the Hobbit, and I'll suffer your less-than-inspired shit-kicking in this TB. PS- All the good shit happened after you passed out. That fart was noxious though, so fuck you for that one.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:11 p.m. CST

    AntoniusBloc

    by tonytodd

    "I still think at times the film can be realistic to a fault, we don't mind a little fantasy and escapism in the fight scenes." I agree completely. I LOVED LOVED LOVED The Dark Knight. Best movie of the year. However, at the same time, the negative side to having everything being sooo realistic, is that while we can get great, thrilling drama, we can't get great fun escapism too. Which is a shame, because most of Bat's rogue's gallery needs more suspension of disbelief than this current series will allow. Or, it necessitates them being "toned down" versions, such as the scarecrow. (For instance, Wouldn't it be cool to have seen Scarecrow in full regalia with scythe and everything, instead of a guy in a suit with a paper bag on his head?)Again, I love Nolan and TDK, but it would be nice to have a Batfilm that can have thrilling drama, and a sense of wonder and escapism too.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:12 p.m. CST

    ZombieHunter

    by Turd Furgeson

    Are you just trying to get someone to unload spoilers upon this talkback??? Seriously dude, don't be a douche.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    HEY BILL MAHER WELCOME TO A WORLD WITHOUT RULES!!!

    by Dogmatic

    Tonight we talkbackers are gonna make you break your new rules.....mwa hahahheeheeheeh ka ka ka oo oooo TALKBACKERS UNITE!

  • July 18, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    My TDK thoughts...

    by The Guy Who Slept Through Everything.

    It's the best movie I've ever seen in my lifetime to live up to the hype. It's spectacular and AICN should really create a topic decussion similar to Indy 4's so we can talk about this properly.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    Zombie Hunter

    by Dapper Swindler

    I can't figure out if you are joking or not.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:16 p.m. CST

    Racist?? I love some of Halle Berry's roles! CATWOMAN AINT

    by Dogmatic

    one of them....and I can't think of many others that would agree...coded racist ....what the frack?? Who IS this guy? Can we PLEASE get him banned?

  • July 18, 2008, 9:18 p.m. CST

    ZombieHunter, You're Joking Right?

    by LaserPants

    Either that or you're retarded.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:21 p.m. CST

    Zombiehunter is giving a cleverly sarcastic response

    by Dogmatic

    to all these people that keep complaining about why they didnt go back to the party after Bats saved Rachel when it is obvious they just got the heck outta dodge...that was whole PURPOSE of throwing her out the window...to create a nice escape plan seeing as how Bats just handed them their collective asses. <P> I got it ZombieHunter...funny stuff!

  • July 18, 2008, 9:25 p.m. CST

    One thing definitely improved since "Begins"...

    by ebonic_plague

    ...the suit! The upgraded design (at least the face/cowl part) is, IMO anyway, the best suit yet put on film. They even gave a nod to the real stick-up-the-ass purists with the "white lenses" that such people were screaming about after the first one. Once you get to the torso it's a little more dicey but from the neck up, with the almost silhouetted matte black, that was Batman for damn sure.

  • July 18, 2008, 9:27 p.m. CST

    Eoneon

    by Bricktops hammer

    Anthony Michael Hall is the reporter. He's the host of the talk-show when the weasily Wayne employee is about to expose Batman. Then he's captured by the Joker and hung upside-down on TV. Did you really not notice him?

  • July 18, 2008, 9:34 p.m. CST

    I Gotta Be Honest Dogmatic

    by LaserPants

    I thought the scene you're talking about needed to return to the party in some way. Either showing the Joker leaving, or Bats going back and the finding him gone. Hardly a complaint, because I fucking LOVED the movie. Bring on the rumored 3 hour version DuPont mentioned!

  • July 18, 2008, 9:44 p.m. CST

    Niceguyeddie19 You're kidding right?

    by crazybubba

    If they keep recycling the same villians in the batman flicks I guarantee the material is gonna get stale and no one but the easy to please fans will watch. They at least need to make a few movies with other characters before they start to recycle the old ones. And probably at some point the average moviegoer will get sick of batman and focus on other comic heroes like green lantern, green arrow, wonder woman or that martian guy. The average movie fan is fickle, but they're the bread and butter of the movie industry. Most movie sequels get tired after the third one.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:02 p.m. CST

    Zombie Hunter

    by a rolling stone

    That was fucking funny, man. Seriously. You've captured the essence of some of the idiots in here. Oh, and Ra's Al Ghul doesn't show up in TDK, but if you look close in Batman's workshop, you can see his star-spangled shield on a table in the background. It's quick.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:05 p.m. CST

    3 villians

    by a rolling stone

    I'd be cool with Ra's coming back and bringing his daughter. With Rachael gone, Bats needs a new love-interest. Fuck Vicki Vale, Julie Madison and Silver St. Cloud. Give me TALIA or give me SELINA...or TALIA on SELINA. Now that might top this. And Hugo Strange is a bad mofo, if done proper. He, Selina and Joker were the first 3 baddies introed in #1, after all. Oh yeah, and isn't it time we saw Bane the way he was meant to be seen? As a mastermind bad-ass? Just sayin.

  • July 18, 2008, 11:42 p.m. CST

    goldfinga

    by BMacSmith

    i agree the spying on citizens thing was shady, but i kinda think it was in there to build up to something. As somebody said earlier he's doing a lot of borderline immoral things to get the job done (like kidnapping the chinese guy and sending him back to the US. Maybe one day he will go too far? just a theory. But i can agree that the american flag in Spidey 3 was fucking lame (one of many lame parts)!

  • July 19, 2008, 12:03 a.m. CST

    Daniel Day Lewis as the Joker?

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    PHENOMINAL actor, but it'd be tough to explain why The Joker aged twenty years in-between films...

  • July 19, 2008, 1:39 a.m. CST

    Meeeeehhhhhh

    by Series7

    It was good, biggest flaw Maggie Jill-in-hall was creepier then Two-Face. I've heard they are planning to do a new He-Man movie, hopefully she's not done in Hollywood because she would make a creepy Skaletor. Or Jack the Pumpkin King if they make a live action Nightmare. <P> Also Gary Oldman is seriously getting shafted for his performance, I think he did an amazing job. I really wasn't sold on the film until the interrogation scene, thats when you see how bad ass the movie is going to become. Also didn't like the whole deep voice contest they had going on. <P> I hate the whole OHHH Heath Bars are better then Nickleback's, theres no point. These are two entirely different characters who exist in two entirely different worlds. Thats the magic of comics. I still say Jack was more memorable, but thats probably because I was a much younger girl then. Amazing movie, but not my favorite of the summer. Also they already undeserveablly gave best supporting actor to a midicore villain last year, don't see them doing it again this year. Personally I think Oldman should get nominated, I think if they go to Batman With A Vengeance (And seriously this movie should've put Die Hard with A Vengeance in the 'Thank You' section of the credits) Oldman's role will be a lot more prominent. That man kills it in anything he's in, he was the only good part of Harry's Potter. <P> For those of you not bothering to care about how I feel about the movie, just know that the Heat comparisons are not as relevant as the Die Hard With a Vengeance comparisons that everyone seems to miss.

  • July 19, 2008, 1:40 a.m. CST

    DC COMICS

    by BrightEyes

    FOREVER!

  • July 19, 2008, 3:22 a.m. CST

    Series7...

    by Finding Forrestal

    I don't really see the similarities between TDK and DIE HARD WITH A VENGEANCE. In the latter, Simon makes McClane jump through a bunch of hoops as a distraction whereas the Joker was just causing mayhem for mayhem's sake. I see what you're getting at, but I don't think the comparison makes much sense (at least not in the way you imply).

  • July 19, 2008, 5:54 a.m. CST

    There was a few moments....

    by Bobo_Vision

    ...involving Rachel where I couldn't help feel that a better looking actress would have sold the role better. First, where the Joker says to Rachel, "Oh, you're beautiful", and starts to comb his hair with his knife as Maggie Gyllenhall stared at him with her pug-face. I was thinking, 'He's saying that because its in the script'. It took me out of the film for a moment. Then when Bruce Wayne was still in love with Rachel like the scene on the balcony where he kisses her and makes his intentions known that he wishes to give up being Batman so that he could be with her - again, it was like 'You're kidding, right?' She just didn't seem like the type of girl someone pines over long after the relationship is done. Finally, Dent's fury with her death would have been sold better with a finer looking actress. <p> Apart from that, Gylennhall did a good job.

  • July 19, 2008, 6:02 a.m. CST

    phillip seymour hoffmann

    by BALTIMOREJACK

    for Penguin.

  • July 19, 2008, 7:42 a.m. CST

    Have You Seen There Will Be Blood?

    by LaserPants

    DDL looks to be about in his 20s in the the opening scene, then 30s/40s, then 50s (maybe 60s) at the end. It is possible to make actors look younger than they are on-screen. BESIDES, did you take a gander at the Joker's face? With the pancake makeup, running down cracks in his face? He certainly didn't look like he was in his 20s, he looked like a junkie monster from some circus hell. In short: DDL could definitely pull it off. If not him, it has to be someone of his caliber; someone who can step into the role Ledger sadly left behind.

  • July 19, 2008, 8:58 a.m. CST

    Maggie Gyllenhaal is VERY attractive

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    Yeah, she's not as "Hawt" as Katie Holmes, but she's a MUCH better actress.

  • July 19, 2008, 9:11 a.m. CST

    Maggie

    by The Octagoner

    I'll leave her alone after this, but look, I always thought she was reasonably cute-- an average cute girl. Nothing wrong with her. BUT-- in THIS movie she looked worse than I've ever seen her. I kind of hold the make-up and lighting guys responsible for this, because it was like she was constantly horriby lit and photographed. She had jowls for Christ's sake, JOWLS, and big dark puffy bags under her eyes. I mean, this is Hollywood; they could have made her look decent, but she really does look like she woke up in the ditch the morning of filming. Sorry-- I don't think women need to look like anything-- but in a $180 million dollar movie, the actress playing the love interest of the two extremely powerful main characters... maybe they could help her out a bit?

  • July 19, 2008, 9:11 a.m. CST

    Maggie

    by The Octagoner

    I'll leave her alone after this, but look, I always thought she was reasonably cute-- an average cute girl. Nothing wrong with her. BUT-- in THIS movie she looked worse than I've ever seen her. I kind of hold the make-up and lighting guys responsible for this, because it was like she was constantly horriby lit and photographed. She had jowls for Christ's sake, JOWLS, and big dark puffy bags under her eyes. I mean, this is Hollywood; they could have made her look decent, but she really does look like she woke up in the ditch the morning of filming. Sorry-- I don't think women need to look like anything-- but in a $180 million dollar movie, the actress playing the love interest of the two extremely powerful main characters... maybe they could help her out a bit?

  • July 19, 2008, 9:32 a.m. CST

    We have to wait another week in the UK

    by Smashing

    Take note studio directors I have already downloaded a pretty decent copy but will try and wait another week to see the film in a cinema, this would not happen if you released worldwide on the same day, something to mull over maybe?

  • July 19, 2008, 9:58 a.m. CST

    Jack who?

    by whofan71

    My favorite Joker moment: the funny little walk in the hospital parkinglot in the nurse outfit, fidgeting with the detonator.

  • July 19, 2008, 11:43 a.m. CST

    The "no stain on his pillow" bit was fun

    by Aeghast

    I didn't see that! Good one :)

  • July 19, 2008, 12:03 p.m. CST

    Stain on the pillow

    by Chishu_Ryu

    Two-Face actually left a little stain on the pillow when he turns to Gordon, just a little bit. If the stain had been too big, it would have attracted too much attention to itself and away from what Dent...

  • July 19, 2008, 1:10 p.m. CST

    whofan71,

    by mrfan

    Yeah. Loved that scene.

  • July 19, 2008, 1:21 p.m. CST

    Finding Forrestal

    by Series7

    The hospital scene was just like the school scene in Die Hard with a vengeance. There are a lot of similarities.

  • July 19, 2008, 3:03 p.m. CST

    Fools wanting to see a Joker in the next movie...

    by wash

    You're like people who will happily fork over $40 to see Journey with whatever new sound-a-like singer they found off of YouTube. Ledger, like Perry, just completely owned the part. Don't Stop Believin'

  • July 19, 2008, 4:45 p.m. CST

    There was a stain on Dent's pillow

    by Mr.Krinkle

    There was a visible stain on Dent's pillow for his disfigured side. Not a big one, but a visible one. And the guests left alone with the Joker? How about letting your imagination fill it in. Not a bad review, but honestly, you used those two examples to nit pick. Very lame Alexandria.

  • July 19, 2008, 5:19 p.m. CST

    Um, this movie and Die Hard With a Vengeance?

    by BillEmic

    Could someone please explain how anyone could draw comparisons between The Dark Knight and Die Hard With a Vengeance? :/ Or is this more "Talkback humor"?

  • July 19, 2008, 7:52 p.m. CST

    Future villains

    by CZ

    I'd love to see Nolan's take on Catwoman. It'd be a nice chance to deconstruct the role of women in comics and comic book films - I can just see Selina Kyle as one of Bruce's throwaway bimbos, who turns out to be a lot more than he bargained for. You could reboot most of the Rogue's Gallery to fit the Nolan-verse by fleshing out their human sides and keeping a few quirks. Riddler could be a tragic version of Bill Gates/Steve Jobs, Penguin is easily transmogrified into a corrupt politician or judge, and I'd love to see Clayface as an embodiment of faceless, anonymous crime.

  • July 19, 2008, 8:46 p.m. CST

    Last Villain

    by Loosejerk

    The last villian that made me want to see a movie repeatedly was the T-1000.

  • July 19, 2008, 9:17 p.m. CST

    This talkback

    by Mockingbuddha

    is too long so if some one already said this, sorry. I also had a problem with Dent's big unblinking moist looking eye. But out in the parking lot chatting with my buddy, I figured it must have been a glass eye. Any flames that burn an eye lid off are going to burn the eye too. Did anyone notice if that eye was tracking with the other non-injured eye, cause that would kill my theory. Great movie though.

  • July 19, 2008, 9:58 p.m. CST

    TDK flaws aplenty!

    by SnakePlissken711

    I can see why fanboys and geeks are all in excitement over the latest movie -- it's so damn big and loud and in your face, it's impossible not to be REACTIVE to what it has created before you. But upon closer inspection you will notice quite a few of its major flaws. This is like a 6 hour movie jammed into 2.5 hours. The editing hurts the movie, because it moves so fast at times it appears that content has been left out. This hurts the character motivation and decisions as well as our belief in what and why they should do or not do things. For instance, Rachel's death was a great idea -- there is very little time after that for the characters to register on what just happened. You want to see a movie that did the same exact plot point perfectly: LETHAL WEAPON 2, Rika's death and Rigg's reaction, plus the two scenes following it. But TDK has so many damn plot strnads running through it -- it can't take the time it needs to show the proper emotional drop both men (Bale's Wayne and Eckhart's Dent) would be going through. The movie has the right tone, but the plot is TOO MUCH happening all at once for things to register as A) Believable (even in a comic book universe B) Motivated (did Batman really need to monitor all 30 million cell phones to find the Joker?) and C)Enjoyable. Anyone who finds the last half hour fulfilling if not nati-climactic as hell has something wrong with them. The Joker is not even shown being locked up. Good direction cannot save a script that has it's hands in too many puddings at once. They SHOULD HAVE cut this into two movies -- like MATRIX 2 and 3.

  • July 19, 2008, 10 p.m. CST

    Sequel

    by Mockingbuddha

    I always liked the bits in DKR and Year One where Bats is fighting cops, and also the similar scenes in Watchmen where Rorschach is fighting cops. They should have the Joker, and DDL is a pretty good choice, but in a small role, and the "main" villain should be Ras or Two Face, with Talia or Catwoman also there depending on who the villain is, but the Focus of the story should be that there's a new Mayor or DA or whoever that really genuinely wants to catch the Batman and put him away, with Gordon walking the line of doing his job and protecting his friend. We were lucky to get so much focus on Batman in the first movie, after that you got to put the main focus somewhere else. Gordon is a good spot. I'd say Oldman would make a good Joker, but since he's Gordon, do something with that. Drive him out to a place where he can really do some acting. Or just let Batman kick Superman's ass. That would be cool too.

  • July 19, 2008, 10:56 p.m. CST

    IDEAS FOR THE NEXT MOVIE.

    by Professor Geek

    NO JOKER. Let it be. NO TWO-FACE. He's dead. NO R'AS AL GHUL. Been there, done that. NO PENGUIN. Too cheesy. NO RIDDLER, POISON IVY, or MR. FREEZE. Let's keep Schumacher's movies out of people's minds. Catwoman + BANE (done well).

  • July 20, 2008, 9:33 a.m. CST

    Harvey's face doesn't leave a stain

    by Larry Sellers

    During his conversation with the Joker though, I noticed flesh-flakes on his pillow. It was gross enough.

  • July 20, 2008, 12:19 p.m. CST

    Ledger's zombie walk coming out of the hospital

    by Nasty In The Pasty

    Did anyone think of George Romero when they saw that weird shuffle Ledger adopted?

  • July 20, 2008, 1:27 p.m. CST

    Not A Kid Movie....

    by rickdeckard1

    I'm never scared , but that moment with the Joker and his TV spot w/ the 'Bat' hostage, was really terrifying. Heath was bad ass!

  • July 20, 2008, 1:39 p.m. CST

    Clooney kicks Bale's ass!

    by Sro100

    'Nuff said.

  • July 20, 2008, 2:29 p.m. CST

    It has to be Riddler.

    by Smoke Monster Loves Kate

    Nolan would have a field day with a Riddler-centric plot.

  • July 20, 2008, 9:26 p.m. CST

    The Score: weakness, personally

    by necgray

    I know I'm in the minority on this, but I wasn't blown away. One of the weaknesses for me was the score. That discordant note thing that got pointed out? Almost ruined the tension for me in a couple of spots. If it'd been anyone but Ledger's Joker, I might have flatout been pissed off. I think directors and musicians who score film need to be taught this lesson: LET THE TENSION SPEAK FOR ITSELF!!! I don't need the rising string note to feel uncomfortable with The Joker. He's unsettling all on his own. In fact, if the ONLY thing I could hear was the sound of his tongue flicking in and out of his mouth, that would have been 1000X more effective.

  • July 20, 2008, 9:53 p.m. CST

    Could anyone else

    by GreenGeezer

    see Selina Kyle hitting Gotham like Danny Ocean?

  • July 20, 2008, 11:20 p.m. CST

    Talia:daughter of the demon...although kevin spacey as riddler i

    by joker40

    I'd love to see Talia and ras make a return..I have said it enough..but the comment of kevin spacey as riddler..The way eddie is now..in the books..as a detective himself..would be good..other than that..well if done correctly yes I can see it.. HOWEVER.IF YOU HAD TALIA AND THE LEAGUE OF SHADOWS TAKE ON BLACK MASK AND THE MASKERS...WOW..HOLY SHIT!!! THAT WOULD WORK...WITH RAS SITTING IN WAIT IN THE BACKGROUND.. COULD WORK..What ya'll think... Peace..

  • July 20, 2008, 11:25 p.m. CST

    Maggie

    by thot

  • July 20, 2008, 11:26 p.m. CST

    Maggie G

    by thot

    She actually looked much better in the movie than I thought she would. I actually believed that HD and BW would fall for her. Well done MG.

  • July 21, 2008, 3:20 a.m. CST

    No Old Villains in the Next One, Please.

    by chaplinatemyshoe

    I'd go with Black Mask, Mr. Freeze and Catwoman. Black Mask and Catwoman could have character archs that last for two features while Mr. Freeze only sticks around for one feature. Basic idea would play upon Mr. Freeze back story, only he'd be a scientist working for Wayne whose funding is cut because of the amount of money Batman's extracurricular activities cost. This gives him impetus to hook up with Black Mask, who himself has a bone to pick with Wayne and who is slowly emerging as a kingpin in the underworld. As for Catwoman, that one's more complicated. I think you have to be careful with her character and motivations. If they take their time with transforming her, I think she becomes more believable and poignant. The key with all of these stories is that it brings out the need for Bruce Wayne and Batman to negotiate their duality into the one man they come from. Mr. Freeze would be a great foil too because he's a villain who's motivation is personal and not ideological.

  • July 21, 2008, 9:25 a.m. CST

    Talia al Ghul

    by Nico Toscani

    I second the vote for Talia al Ghul for the next villain. It would tie together nicely with the first film.

  • July 21, 2008, 10:41 a.m. CST

    "This is Chinatown and Heat rolled into one"

    by Luscious.868

    Not it is not. It is a very, very good flick but Chinatown and Heat are great movies and this isn't great. It's very, very good but it's no Heat or Chinatown.

  • July 21, 2008, 1:50 p.m. CST

    Check it again webhead

    by Abominable Snowcone

    The two logical "slips" you point out aren't slips at all. There IS blood on Harvey's pillow, and frankly, when your face has been burned down to the cranium, those vessels have been boiled anyway. As for the guests in the building, no, we don't see what the Joker does to them after Bats jumps out after Rachel. But NOT showing doesn't constitute a slip. Maybe Joker does nothing and leaves, having proved his point (and not found Dent).

  • July 21, 2008, 1:52 p.m. CST

    The villain in the next movie

    by Abominable Snowcone

    should be Killer Croc, with perhaps more Scarecrow thrown in. Those others (Freeze, Catwoman, Penguin) are marquee bad guys, but probably wouldn't work as well in Nolan's grittier Gotham.

  • July 21, 2008, 4:19 p.m. CST

    I didn't like the movie as much as I thought I would (spoilers)

    by successor

    <p>And this is coming from someone who really enjoyed Batman Begins. I liked TDK, but I think it's overhyped and it left me with many questions. For example, how did the Joker get away in the beginning bank robbery? You see all the buses driving away, the police arrive and it just cuts away. The same thing with the party. The cell phone device reeked of deus ex machina. Also, I found the ferry scene unbelivable. In reality, I don't think people are *that* good. If it was real, the prisoners would have blown up the other ferry in two seconds flat. Or vice versa. I think the scene would have had much more impact if they blew each other up and proved Joker's idea that people will turn on each other when things get really bad. Also, the scarring on Dent looked a little fake. And is Dent dead or not? My guess is yes, but why do they have to repeat the same mistake as the first one and kill one of the major villians off. And how did the Joker sneak into the honor guard and remain hidden with those scars on his face? Also, how did they get Gordon out of there when he was supposedly killed? Did he plan to get shot all along or was he just playing along to nab the Joker later? And how could Joker miss killing Dent in the armored truck with all those RPGs?</p> <p>Having said that, I thought Ledger was excellent, the cinematography was great--except for the quick cuts, Bale was intense. I loved the idea of copycat Batmen wielding guns and the way the Joker manipulated the media. Terrific ideas. I really also like how they sacrificed Rachel and pushed Batman towards the edge. Overall, I'm rather ambivalent about the film as a whole. Maybe a second viewing will clear some of these points up.</p>

  • July 22, 2008, 11:12 a.m. CST

    THE RIDDLER

    by DonLogan

    The Riddler is the most likely to be the next villian, simply because he's the most grounded to Nolan's 'Real World' vision. He's not super-powered, doesn't have a ridiculous costume (suit, bowler hat & cane as opposed to question mark laden leotard) or caricatured facial features. I quote: The Riddler is typically portrayed as a smooth-talking, yet quirky, victim of an intense obsessive compulsion. This was first introduced in the "The Remarkable Ruse of The Riddler"in which he tries to refrain from leaving a riddle, but fails. This compulsion has been a recurring theme, as shown in a 1999 issue of Gotham Adventures, in which he tried to commit a crime without leaving a riddle, but fails: "You don't understand. .. I really didn't want to leave you any clues. I really planned never to go back to Arkham Asylum. But I left you a clue anyway. So I... I have to go back there. Because I might need help. I... I might actually be crazy." Given a fantastic actor Nolan could do great things with this theme. The next movie couldn't feature Catwoman surely, I don't see how she could be portrayed convincingly with regards to origins, costume or motives. And she just isn't very threatening. She belongs in the Burton/Shumacher type realm. The pengiun would have to be a mob boss perhaps simply named because of his fondness for Evening suits but that would seem a bit of a cop out wouldn't it?

  • July 22, 2008, 4:36 p.m. CST

    Kevin Spacey as Riddler?

    by MasterBateman

    I think I just came in my pants. Does that make me gay?

  • July 23, 2008, 3:09 a.m. CST

    Riddler and Cat Woman

    by apersonofinterest

    I would love to see these characters in Nolan's Gotham. I'd like to see The Riddler as a twisted unabomber/serial killer type, compulsively driven to creating the perfect Riddle and the perfect crime. A Riddle that can't be solved by The Batman with terrible consequences. People die if The Batman can't solve his riddles. His first Riddle is found cut into the body of his first victim. A Bicycle Messenger. His Calling Card. Meanwhile, Cat Woman , a beautiful but unhinged fatal attraction type, targets Bruce Wayne's penchant for Arm Candy with designs on infiltrating the newly rebuilt Wayne Manor to do a little Cat Burgling but she discovers Wayne's secret once inside. She's intrigued and sets out to seduce Bruce Wayne. But Bruce figures out what she does at night and the relationship turns nasty. I don't really see Freeze working in the new series because he's just a little too fantastic with his freeze ray and space suit. Just my opnion.

  • July 23, 2008, 1:40 p.m. CST

    successor

    by trojanwilliams

    I think you answered your own problems with the film in the way you worded the problem. Your feelings about the ferry scene is exactly why the scene works for me. You naturally assumed that criminals would kill a boatload of people and I wholeheartedly disagree. The Joker got away with the crime because he timed the robbery to coincide with the school buses getting out and he joined the queue of buses. In addition he wasn't exactly trying to avoid being caught - heck he made sure to have his picture taken in the bank. He wanted the cops to know who he was - it was all part of the plan. I honestly believe the people more likely to come closest to pulling the trigger would be the regular citizens.

  • July 23, 2008, 6:41 p.m. CST

    Regarding Mr. Spacey

    by EastcoastAvenger

    The dude had already been given the chance to play one of DC's most iconic villains as Lex Luthor and disapointed a bit. Granted, there is only so much an actor can do with the script he is given. But there were a number of times he played Lex up as buffoonish were he could have instead have played him as something much more sinister. I recently read that DC/WB were interested in smoothing out a DC universe on film ala Marvel. Kudos to them if they in fact do that. However, if they decide to keep the Routh/Singer Superman they better give 'ol Lex some treatment because Nolans Joker would own Singers Luthor as his personal gimp. Seriously!

  • July 24, 2008, 6:44 p.m. CST

    Carrie Ann Moss as Catwoman. Check out Memento

    by CrichtonAstronut

    She was great as the sypathetic bad girl leading Guy Pearsce to the Dark side. She could be a similar temptation for Bale's berieved Batman.

  • July 24, 2008, 8:04 p.m. CST

    Dark Knight Video Review

    by bobsjohnson

    http://tinyurl.com/6xfpaz

  • July 24, 2008, 8:39 p.m. CST

    Eva Green as Catwoman would be good, but...

    by TheBigLebowsky

    JACK BLACK AS KING TUT!!! Now, THAT would be fucking genius!

  • July 25, 2008, 9:24 a.m. CST

    Daniel Day Lewis as The Riddler?

    by MellowNinja

    If anyone has any chance of being on par with Ledger's performance, DDL would be it. If not the Riddler, could he be someone else?