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Updated! That Crazy TERMINATOR 4 Rumor? Turns Out It Might Be A Crazy Giant Spoiler...
Hey, everyone. ”Moriarty” here.
Okay. So CHUD.COM is now confirming this as a spoiler and not just a rumor. That's news to me, gang. I published this as one of those random crazy mailbag spoilers that almost never turn out to be quite true. They turn out to be one person's misunderstanding of one part of something, or they're just fanboy invention. From time to time, marking something as a big fat "rumor" and publishing it as such is fun. All the way back to the STAR WARS days. And, yes, from time to time, one or two of those rumors have panned out to be something pretty close to the truth, or they've kicked loose someone who knows the truth and wants to correct us... that's just the fun of movie rumors. Speculation runs wild as fan-favorite films head into production. Here's what I said to one of our talkbackers, who was reacting to another talkbacker's post that was pretty much just "Yeah, well, you're fat and stupid and you suck and you're a baby and fuck you." Which I sort of expected, I guess: "... I'm not remotely surprised to see someone show up and just launch a personal attack. It's an easy way to make it about me instead of about the rumor that's being discussed.
This isn't a personal article. I'm the guy who saw the original TERMINATOR in the theater when it came out. 40-something times. Because I was 14 and a friend's brother was the guy at the door five nights a week including weekends and let us in for free as much as we wanted. We saw the original two or three times a week the whole time it was out. And back then, a film that was making money just stayed around... making money... all summer long...
I love THE TERMINATOR. I love TERMINATOR 2: JUDGMENT DAY. I remain unconvinced on everything else. If it's been released, I've seen it, and I haven't published huge pissy rants about any of it. It's just not for me. I'm not buying. TERMINATOR 3? Not buying it. SARAH CONNOR CHRONICLES? Not buying it. Sorry. But that's my opinion. And that's exactly how I offered it. Opinion.
So if someone's going to make it personal, that's their business. I'm writing as I've always written... as someone who loves good films. If I thought they were making new TERMINATOR films as anything other than product, I'd be more interested. That's not me attacking the director or the producers or Christian Bale or saying anything personal or mean about them. That's a TERMINATOR fan saying, 'Sorry, but that's just not for me. I'm not asking you for more TERMINATOR. I'm happy with the story that was told. I don't need more. I don't really want more. I'd like it more if you'd just... stop. Please. That's my vote. That's all it is.'
I'll change the title to reflect that this is evidently a spoiler. I ran it as a crazy rumor because, frankly, I didn't think it would pan out. Then Devin at CHUD reported that it matched what he knows, so I'll mark it as a potential spoiler." Sorry I didn't mark it as a spoiler the first time around. I'm still not sure it is one, but I'm going to mark it just in case. Now here's the original piece I ran yesterday afternoon:
I’m not much for the nerdstalgia that has turned every single studio in town into a remake/reboot factory. I think it’s short-sighted and stupid, and in the long run, we’re cannibalizing our business by only indulging this pathetic need to destroy every single franchise we ever cared about. It’s all driven by marketing departments and research groups, and there’s nothing honest or organic about it. My biggest question to the studios is this: what are you going to be remaking in 20 years? If you refuse to greenlight original visions right now, and all you’re doing is this cinematic grave-robbing over and over and over and over again, then what are you going to do 20 years from now? At some point, this cycle has to end. Either that, or we’re on our way to being the music industry, and that’s fucking terrifying. For those of you who feel like there are still unanswered questions about the world of THE TERMINATOR, or who just can’t get enough of seeing James Cameron’s original story expanded way past the breaking point, you’re going to finally get your wish and see the future war in the upcoming TERMINATOR: SALVATION, which is meant to kick off another trilogy of films. Will it? Well, if the ending that today’s spy sent us is any indication of what to expect, I don’t think a sequel is going to be something anyone needs to worry about. Instead, the filmmakers might want to consider the Witness Protection Program. Why? Oh, man, just read the following, and keep in mind: this is a rumor. I don’t have the T4 script here, and I’m not saying that this IS the ending. Just that this rumor is so batshit crazy I had to share it with you guys, and I’ll start digging to see what I can come up with. If this is how it ends, then the destruction of this franchise is complete, and James Cameron can rest assured that he remains the only person to ever make any TERMINATOR films I give a shit about. Take it away, Dr. Silberman:
"Alright so the main character is a cyborg named Marcus. For some background, Marcus was a criminal who was executed in 2003. He donated his body to Project Angel which was involved with SkyNet. They take his body and make a terminator out of him so he's a terminator skeleton but has living muscle/skin and a beating heart too. At the end of the movie John Connor is fighting a T800 model 101 and loses. He dies and the top resistance people come up with a plan to help the resistance keep fighting on. The resistance feels that it's important to keep the image or idea that John Connor is still alive so the resistance keeps going. So they rip off Marcus' skin and put John Connor's on the skeleton so now Marcus is John Connor."
Readers Talkback
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Hope this isn't even close to the story, because this will not only drop off my Theater list but right off the DVD list as well!
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...kay. I don't know what I think about this...except: I would not have done it that way.
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Arnold Kills him in the future? Thats what he says? This is retarded.
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from a PG-13 McG terminator movie.
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Yeah, the Arnold Terminator says he killed John... ...in 2032. And Terminator Salvation takes place in 2018. So something doesn't add up. Also, it's Silberman, not Silverman. I am a geek.
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why can't they make a "black hole" remake....
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I like it, I hope it's true.
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I'm not watching this. I'm not going to read any more about this. This is the living end. Make something original, tinseltown or lose my valuable dollars.
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and this sounds fucking dull.
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Very strange...
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...is do an alternate reality thing that ignores T3, with John finally overthrowing the machines and becoming a tyrannical, Kurtz-like dictator and a bunch of humans have to take him out, Caesar-style. That would be awesome.
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i agree. this geek pandering shit needs to end. new ideas please.
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June 2, 2008, 4:24 p.m. CST
i agree. this geek pandering shit needs to end. new ideas please
by BMacSmith
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Man trapped in a machine vs man trapped in a machine trapped in a man... huh
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Thats what the tv show is, it ignores t3 and does it's own thing.
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does this sound like the BuffyBot to you, too?
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I knew the TV show ignores T3 for its own reasons, but I don't think Thomas Dekker's murder is being plotted by his inner circle, unless Sarah Connor kills John, which would make no sense.
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I think it would be awesome if having your skin ripped off and putting it on a robot body became trendy. That might make the show interesting. Mommy, I wanna be a suburban war droid!!! And a Pony! And Motley Crue to play for an hour!
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No to fuck up the timeline if at all possible. Like something with John that would conflict his growing up in chronology of events.<p> I will see T4 regardless because I want to see the war and Bale in that role.
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..sorry... Preacher flashback...
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If done right, it may not be so bad. I mean the whole point of T2 was that a Terminator could learn to love and protect, so the idea of a Terminator leading the resistance sounds like the next logical step. However, it would have to be handled EXTREMELY well and McG still doesn't seem like a great choice so I'll remain very very cautious.
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Sarah Connor comes to the future she isn't dead we never saw her body. Just a cache of weapons. Sarah comes back to help John fight the war.
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this is the kind of thing that probably sounds cool when two geeks are shooting the shit about ideas, but i don't see how it could possible work out. not in any satisfying way, anyway... i mean, come on, the whole "I become what I hate most" story device has been done to death. oh wait... i just re-read it... so John Connor is actually dead, it's just his skin??? i thought it was john's mind uploaded into a cyborg... okay, the skin idea is even dumber than i initially thought... just to keep christian bale around for three movies? FUCK
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http://youtube.com/watch?v=uuwfHvNyedw
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book called Spectre of the Past.
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Really? Like really? No way that is the dumbest thing I have read in a long fucking time. I started laughing out loud. First off how is this going to be pg-13 if they are pulling Face/Off type of shit and secondly... WTF! Fans will hate this and regular movie fans will probably just be confused or turned off by this. STUPID! Drop this idea before it starts! Stop production now this is going to be a failure! T3 will be remembered as a classic if you do this lol.
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and he doesn't give a fuck either.
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Officially now have zero interest in this. In fact I've had it for fucking remakes for a very long time. Cant remember the last time I paid to see a remake and even if was free I'd have to think what else I could do instead. No original thought in LA-LA land now. Moriarty's right. What the hell are the going to do in 20 years time? Pushing Up Daisies: The Movie!!?? Fuck that!
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They'll just keep remaking the same movies in 15 year cycles. The only way this will not happen is if 14 year olds stop going to see the terrible films Hollywood keeps putting out. And since 14 year olds are relatively new to movies and simply don't know (or don't care) that if they *didn't* go to these movies that Hollywood would be forced to actually put more effort into making quality and possibly even ORIGINAL films, it's way easier for the studios to do it this way. Throw something out there that people know, market it to death, teenagers show -- But you guys aren't helping things with your promotion of films like Tranformers, Speed Racer, Hulk (they just goddamned MADE this movie 5 years ago!), and yes, even Iron Man. Those are all things that ALREADY EXIST in other mediums and do not need to be made into movies. If you want to make a difference, heavily promote movies like Wanted (I think that's original, right?), The Fall, The Happening (yes, I know it's M. Night but it's original), ANYTHING that does not exist in another medium. We need to get the 14 year olds to not show up to terrible films. That's the key. They have no idea what a good movie is because they keep supporting shitty movies.
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They'll just keep remaking the same movies in 15 year cycles. The only way this will not happen is if 14 year olds stop going to see the terrible films Hollywood keeps putting out. And since 14 year olds are relatively new to movies and simply don't know (or don't care) that if they *didn't* go to these movies that Hollywood would be forced to actually put more effort into making quality and possibly even ORIGINAL films, it's way easier for the studios to do it this way. Throw something out there that people know, market it to death, teenagers show -- But you guys aren't helping things with your promotion of films like Tranformers, Speed Racer, Hulk (they just goddamned MADE this movie 5 years ago!), and yes, even Iron Man. Those are all things that ALREADY EXIST in other mediums and do not need to be made into movies. If you want to make a difference, heavily promote movies like Wanted (I think that's original, right?), The Fall, The Happening (yes, I know it's M. Night but it's original), ANYTHING that does not exist in another medium. We need to get the 14 year olds to not show up to terrible films. That's the key. They have no idea what a good movie is because they keep supporting shitty movies.
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The Resistance beats Skynet but John Conner is kidnapped by the last remaining vestiges of Skynet who model a Terminator after him. That Terminator, is sent in to the human citadel to destroy the unsuspecting resistance fighters from within, like a Trojan Horse. But here is the twist, Arnold Schwarzeneggar is the future John Conner. A younger version of Conner, played by Christian Bale learns of the plan from a time traveling survivor who dies after informing him of the scheme. Bale then sends a time traveller of his own to the future to protect his older self...played by Arnold. We later learn that the surviving aspect of Skynet begins to create multiple models of the Connor/Arnold Terminator, sending them to earlier times in history to try and wipe-out John Connor because the machine thinks like the real John Connor and knows his military strategies...making him the ultimate foil for the real John Connor's past selves as well as for the resistance movement as a whole.<BR><BR>Well, McG, if you want to buy the story from me...I'm open to offers.
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We find out that the man called Kyle Reese is actually... wait for it... John Connor! He went back in time under the Reese alias to fuck his mother and thus create himself, the saviour of mankind! John Connor is his own father! I'm a goddamn genius.
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The terminator John Conner would still be a terminator and wouldn't fool anyone who personally interacted with the robot.
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actually would have been a cool idea if it didn't fly in the fucking face of already established storylines!!!!
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But I'm not as awesome as Gary Scott Thompson.
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Let me guess, Grando Calrissian has a cameo, too - right?
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...to describe how utterly GAY the film will be if that is the actual ending...
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I don't see why the filmmakers would neet to enrol in the WPP
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Will Vin Diesel return as an aging agent in XXX ala Harrison Ford? Will we see remakes of Pulp Fiction and the Matrix? It's kind of sad to think of what will become a classic out of today's new films.
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Thats a huge goddamn spoiler if its true
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WHats wrong with it exactly?:P
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And Hollywood sinks even lower into the primordial soup. Ah well.
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<p>I'm still there opening weekend. It certainly doesn't effect the quality of Terminator 1 or 2 in the slightest.</p> <p>IMPORTANT RELATED QUESTION: did people bitch decades ago when in the 3rd Pink Panther sequel Clouseau become a complete parody of who he was in the original and Shot in the Dark? When did the incessant bitching of fanboys actually originate?? It's certainly reached it's zenith in the last couple years.</p>
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Remember the first time you watched Terminator? Or Terminator 2? Remember the mythology built up around John Connor and what he will one day become? The Leader of Men. The grown-up John Connor, to me, is a fucking legend. Someone to be in awe of. None of us have ever really seen or experienced the future Connor. So our expectations are really fuckin high. Insanely high.<p> It might just be time McG realized this. Step up, man. Goddamnit.
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Err, I mean AWFUL!!!
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In T3 Connor was killed in the future, so perhaps they're going to follow through on that? Although IIRC the T850 said he was the one who killed John, which means they'd need Arnie...<br><br> Of course I think it might be more interesting if Connor himself is converted into a Terminator, requiring some Robocop-esque soul searching of who and what he is. And I think you could come up with quite a cool scenario where Connor/Terminator himself is somehow responsible for inadvertently creating Skynet all along, and therefore the only option is for young John Connor to commit suicide to prevent Skynet ever existing.
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June 2, 2008, 5:23 p.m. CST
Finally...An Explanation For Reese Being John Connor's Father!!!
by Media Messiah
In a side story, one designed to answer questions as to why the resistance can't wipe-out Skynet before it is/was created. John Conner as played by Bale, goes to the past to handle the destruction of the first version of Skynet as it is being constructed. Arriving in the past, he interrupts the first time travel experiment...but here's the twist, Reese, is the inventor of the project. But before he gets a chance to kill him, he learns that his Mom Sarah Connor has been set-up on a blind date with Reese, only then does he realize, this is to be his father. When a Terminator shows up to stop John Conner from interfering with the creation of Skynet, he is forced to grab Reese and pull him into the future...creating an alternate reality. Reese, having disappeared from the past, has only delayed Skynet's creation. In this future present, John Connor begins to die as his parents never got together in the past. He is fully aware that his future will become unglued and cease to exist unless he sends Reese back in time to fulfill his role in becoming his father. Blanking his memory, he implants Reese with a false memory of a life spent in the future as a resistence fighter, absent his, Reese's knowledge of the past role in creating Skynet, and his life therein. This will serve to explain the paradox of Reese being John Conner's father, a plot point (plot hole) question mark, that has long dogged The Terminator films and left fans puzzled, including me, as well as critics of the franchise. Well, I just solved it. Again...McG, et al, if you want to buy my story outline from me...I'm open to selling it...along with various other interesting ideas!!!
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Would that be like wearing another man's sack?
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Marcus is actually John Connor from the past?
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...and after the credits roll, a studio exec is in the theater lobby who summarily kicks everyone in the nuts.
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The world just got that much smellier.
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I usually try not to be a cynic and judge movies before they come out, but damn that sounds absolutely god awful, I hope it's just a rumor and has no truth to it whatsoever.
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And i agree, stop with the fucking remakes.
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Wow- that would be sooooooooooooo fucking craptacular!
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<p>Nope. People just enjoyed stuff more back in the day and didn't constantly need to find something to endlessly bitch about.</p> <p>Just did a cursory internet search, too. Seems the critics thought some of the later Pink Panther sequels were some of the funnier entries in the series. Illumination, my ass.</p>
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wtf.
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They should Lucasify the whole thing, go back and replace that other guy who played John Connor in the brief future glimpses with Bale, and rerelease them as megadeluxe super special editions... and since his wife is getting recast too, they might as well do the same with the entire movie of T3... *rolls eyes*
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THAT editorial is what we need more of on this site and less wholesale accepting of these fucking assholes insisting on destroying everything we love about genre filmmaking. Give that memo to Harry.
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June 2, 2008, 5:58 p.m. CST
I've been a Government Employee for over 30 years...
by Half-Baked-Goggle-Box-Do-Gooder
......and that is STILL stupider than any idea I ever heard while on the job.
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It's Ballsy. I'll Give Them That.
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is here doing exactly what hes saying noone did. 30 years later and hes complaining about pink panther sequels. slone, people always thought X movie/sequel sucked. the internet just gave an ever-more sedentary, ever more leisurely western audience a voice when their ass is in front of a computer like nearly everyone is these days. aicn's been on the net since '96, 12 years ago, and it started OFF based on that exact premise. go back and look.
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'Wanted' is an adaptation of a comic book mini-series. It was optioned before it had even all been published.
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ugh... that is dumb.. why not just make a connor robot?
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Waaaay too out there to be true, even if it is consistent with the off-screen future events of T3 - which says it all really....
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I seriously hope this is not what they are intending to do with this series. This is a bad idea that goes way beyond anything I could have imagined happening in this series. If Cameron still has his producer's credit on this film, I fully hopes he intends to see that this is not how this classic series gets treated. HARRY - you have somewhat regular contact with Mr. Cameron - can you ask him about this!? Plead that he not allow his legacy to get McHUMPED like this!?
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Screamers
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It's a great film and a great sequel and then a bunch of shit barrel scraping that isn't by the original creator and has nothing to do with anything.
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Gehd to da CHOPPA!!!!!!
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Isn't Moriarity attached to a Race With The Devil remake?
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This sounds like a sci fi version of El Cid. El Cid (Heston in the film)died before a huge assault on the Moors, so his body was propped up on his horse to inspire the Spanish forces and his followers in their battle (only a few knew he had died). So this idea has a real world and cinematic precident and perhaps not so bat-shit crazy.
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that's how bad it's gotten with studios. that people pitching original movie ideas have to actually go create a graphic novel, write a quick book, or a comic, in order to get it considered. It's like these suits won't even listen to you unless your idea is based off of something that already exists. Even if not a single soul on the planet has heard of said material.
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Kill the guy the entire film series is about saving before he wins the war that he was being saved to win. On the other hand maybe this is a plan to end the series by making it completely unwatchable.
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His only excuse I would accept would be that he has never seen the Terminator films. That rumour is the stupidest thing i have ever heard.
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WOOT!
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Terminator + T2 are the reason I follow the movie business. Turning John Connor into a Terminator and basically a political puppet is WRONG WRONG WRONG. Unreal.
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Duh.
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There's more then one Model 101.
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I never thought science fiction could get any more ridiculous than when I saw Dune...but I was heavily mistaken.
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it's time to get a regime change over there. it's a scorched black land in there overrun by evil machines known (studios and execs) and writers and directors quivering in holes and caves!! bring lots of Ak-47's and rounds, and body armor as well. Hopefully after this is all over we'll be back to a 70s style era where studios will take gambles and new filmmakers bringing their ideas instead of the same cookie-cutter junk that's been happening.
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June 2, 2008, 6:31 p.m. CST
A cyborg named Marcus? What are you trying to do, scare me?
by Jeff_Fries
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...None of the executives in charge of making today's blockbuster movies will still be in the business in 20 years. They'll be too busy lounging around in their underwear somewhere in Coldwater Canyon, collecting their meaningless board member salaries and paying top dollar for Cleveland steamers.
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...summer corporate blockbuster. I'm not saying I love it or anything, but this does have balls. It reminds me a bit of the Dune sequels with Ducan showing up again and again as a clone, losing a little more of himself with every incarnation....
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And the new SHIT-1000 model oozing from the assholes of these moronic Research Anaylsts & Marketing pricks to travel back through time to 1984 to systematically take out an up and coming directing bad ass named J. Cameron then and terminate what could have been a great franchise. There's a good one you douchebags, where's my paycheck?
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why doesn't someone go ahead and make the connection between the terminator franchise and the matrix franchise?
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<p>Aestheticity, you are mistaken. I consider the 5 Pink Panther movies made while Sellers was alive to be some of the best comedies every put to celluloid. I celebrate them all. Same with the Indiana Jones movies. And the Terminator movies. (Yup, even 3). I found Clouseau's odd character "development" from bumbling detective to slapstick cartoon character over the course of the 15 years those movies were made to be quite enjoyable myself.</p> <p>Brunomac, as for the reviews I found, Google finds everything, sir. I guess we differ on "true fans" and what they love to do. I choose not to waste any of my energy or time truly hating anything. Certainly in this day and age, when there are far more important things to actually be concerned with (like $5 gallons of gas) than a RUMOR about whether or not John Connor ends up becoming a Terminator. (Something I think sounds oddly intriguing now, the more I keep thinking about it...)</p> <p>NOTE: I don't consider any of the Panther films that came along after Seller's death (Trail, Curse, Son) or the "remakes" with Martin to be worth any real discussion. Same goes for the one where Alan Arkin played Clouseau.</p>
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and yes it is destroyed. Music is worth nothing. If you can't make a living off of it why bother. Labels used to spend a fortune on fringe acts only one in ten ever made any money but that one could be the next zeppelin or van halen. I ran into someone the otherday saying the labels were making more now than they ever did. Looser . Anyway I see the studios going the same way fast I have friend who used togo see movies every week now all they do is file share and go to movies 3 or 4 times a year never giving a dam what they are doing.
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Someone is excited for this project? I bet money that right now Christian Bale is having serious second thoughts about this franchise.
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I will say I certainly admire your passion.
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Whilst I love the terminator movies as much as the next guy, I'm not about to throw my toys out of the pram over a story direction I don't like. There will be plenty of people who enjoy this film with this ending and will think it is brilliant. Hollywood need to stop remakes, but taking franchises in never before heard of or uncomfortable directions is a good thing. Reading it on a page is one thing, but seeing it happen is another. Hell, I bet most people here would have hated Lost had they read the script. Imagine reading Iron Man and never seeing what it became with the little bits of improv and CGI? Being a visual medium greatly enhances certain things. Hell, for all we know, it could turn out to be the coolest thing in the terminator franchise since T2!
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i never believe reports like this
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I guess he's both. OMG this is fucking stupid I want to kill someone.
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Only this time ignore everything that happened after the original movie. Restart it many years after Taylor saw the Statue of Liberty, he's settled into a home built on the other side of the Forbidden Zone and fathered children with Nora, and they have formed a new tribe of smart humans, thus realizing the very thing that Dr. Zaius feared. Now the Apes have called in their big guns, summoning the armies of a larger Ape city, which would resemble both the city from the Return to the Planet of the Apes cartoon and the more primal yet large city of the 2001 remake. General Urses is a real monster, a Gengis Kahn of apes, and he's aiming to kill this famed "speaking man" and his tribe of advanced humans--the perfect adversary for the Gorilla nation that has been itching to fight SOMEBODY. Meanwhile during all this hubbub, another astronaut lands, the rescue party sent after Taylor. He is horrified not just by the Planet of the Apes, but also by Taylor, who has gone all Heart of Darkness on us and has slowly been driven to the conclusion that, right or wrong, he wants him and his children to survive and if that means killing apes then so be it (in a way mirroring Heston's embrace of the NRA). Meanwhile the pacifists Zira and Cornelius and their young children are caught in the middle, the tolerant apes who are loathed by their own yet not exactly trusted by the humans. Everything converges on the lost human city in the Forbidden Zone, where the very weapons that destroyed the human world could be used in the new war brewing between Taylor's Children and the Gorillas. Forget fucking time travel shit or killing everyone off after one damn movie or sucky Ape Lincoln cliffhangers--this'd be the Lord of the Rings high fantasy meets Sci-Fi but continuing with the morality play that the original presented. Get the guys who jacked up Battlestar Galactica to write it and you'd have a winner! I could even see people like Galactica's Mary McDonnell as Zira and Anthony Hopkins or Max Von Sydow to play Dr. Zaius, and maybe someone like James Earl Jones as Urses and Bruce Greenwood as Taylor and people like Ryan Gosling and James McAvoy as Taylor's sons, and get Michael Giacchino to write the music. I'm telling you it could be great!!!!! Okay, so that and wishing hard enough will give me powers like the Flash, right? Yeah, whatever.
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But you need to make sure it's done realistically. Take a lesson from Noland and give us half an hour of the resistance guys learning how to skin people, and show us how they manufacture the scalpels and syringes they'll be using for the skinning procedure.
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I call shenannigans.
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I'll be back chap!
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In the beginning of T2, when we see future John Connor, he totally moves his head like a robot. He moves more machine-like than any of the terminators. I always wondered if James Cameron somehow had the idea that - should he ever make more terminator movies - John Connor himself was a machine.
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yes!
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sigh...
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yes sir!
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Come on, do the math. McG + no Arnold = shit.
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This idea sounds so fucking dumb. But in a way it makes sense. Why would Bale sign for the trilogy? He would have seen "something" that caught his interest. He saw potential as an actor behind the whole Robocop-esque formula. I may start hating McG more than Paul Anderson and Michael Bay after this one.
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If that is the ending it will kill the new trilogy, Was Bale on Crack when he signed up for this!
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Damn You Michael Bay
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just love it!
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slashfilm and coming soon have it
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valid points, all around. Funny thing is, I wouldn't mind another terminator sequel -- if it came from cameron. it's his baby, and he can do with it as he pleases, as far as im concerned. same went for indy, and the same went for star wars. doesn't mean they were good films, but i legitimately don't think they intentionally ravaged their respective franchises. this terminator crap is diarrhea on film. god. help. us. all.
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I like, I like.
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Makes it all the more pathetic.
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T2: Judgment Day. It's the last one I saw and the last one I care to see. The future was saved and the story was over and it was all wrapped up with just enough hint that things might not be perfect to make it interesting.
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So here's my question. Can a Terminator made from real john connor skin have sperm for babies? Because he could go back in time to fuck Sarah first, and be his own father. And of course the child would be a 1/4 cyborg, on his father's side.
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Don't worry it wasn't Bale, it was the twin from The Prestige that accepted the role.
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June 2, 2008, 7:30 p.m. CST
Do you really think that Christian Bale would have any part of t
by abovo
Christian Bale is the guy that had the foresight to bring dignity back to Batman. With his other outstanding performances in such films as American Psycho, Rescue Dawn, The Prestige, 3:10 to Yuma, let's give the guy a little credit until we see T4.
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Seriously :>
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When I saw the grown up John Connor in T2, I always thought he moved like a robot, not human. So this could be Cameron's original idea. Who knows.
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Hoo boy. Bale has picked some really great projects but Terminator 4, 5, & 6? Ouch.
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It kind of reminds me of the ending from that unused script for 'Escape From LA' in which the climax reveals that the Snake character from 'Escape from NY' was really a clone of the original Snake, who dies at the end.
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based off the fact that the first movie centers around a man sending his friend back through time to impregnate his mother and create him. Where did John Conner pre-Terminator come from then? My brain hurts.
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in my wallet.
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June 2, 2008, 7:43 p.m. CST
Oh, good grief, please may this turn out to be just be a rumor..
by Wldmk
Thing is, i would have thought freck like this could ONLY belong to the "crappy rumors" department, but these days you just can't tell anymore. This is just frikkin' stupid and bad on so many levels...
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June 2, 2008, 7:43 p.m. CST
Extremely stupid....can't fuckin believe it
by all.right.we.waste.him.no.offense
this is looking more and more on "Street Fighter" and "Batman & Robin" level, and yeah.... this will put McG on par or lower than Paul "Writes Shit" Anderson.... he may reach Uwe Boll level by the end of the new trilogy
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after he reprograms him. Sends this new one back to T2 era. Arnold Terminator and Grammaton Cleric Terminator double team to destroy T-1000 in five minutes. New timeline created....cut to original ending Connor becomes a senator, SCC, T3 and beyond never happened.
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you said this was supposed to kick off another trilogy? i think it did - and in classic timetravel style, we've already seen it. This leads right into it too. The Matrix.
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I always thought that scene in T2 (I think) where they show John Conner with binoculars looking over the battlefield... he looked very Terminator-like. Kinda emotionless and stiff. But maybe that was just the acting.
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June 2, 2008, 7:48 p.m. CST
oh and of course....Flames on the endoskeleton please....
by all.right.we.waste.him.no.offense
you KNOW you want it
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STUPID!
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hahahahahhaahah. damn, i needed that. thanx.
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The writers should be hung. Unreal. Looks like I'll be saving myself a trip to the movies. Dumb people.
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a Black Hole remake might not be such a bad idea... right along the lines of the new Battlestar G. humph. nah, lets not screw up any more classics (like clash of the titans, land of the lost, etc)
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No fate but what we make, McG.
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Does anyone know what the word "rumor" actually means. This sounds like complete BS...it's just funny how many people are freaking out at a "rumor"
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I've been a big Genesis fan ever since the release of their 1980 album, Duke. Before that, I really didn't understand any of their work. Too artsy, too intellectual.
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June 2, 2008, 8:03 p.m. CST
I honestly believe they are dumb enough to come with an idea lik
by Fenrisulfr
And therefore I have the feeling this rumor is true.
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Then the franchise could just fuckin end. Great idea, let's make the leader of the resistance to destroy robots...drum roll please...a robot. ZING! And Moriarty is absolutely right about the need for new material and less franchises and remakes. Sooooo right. what happened to the old days when guys like Spielberg made Raiders simply because they wanted to tell their story the best way they could and entertain people? The movie industry should be about more than money. So sad.
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but still, T4 is sounding worse every day. What pisses me off is that T2: Special Edition is probably my favourite all-time movie. And all these sequels and spinoffs lessen its impact...
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I'm still waiting for this from Dark Horse..
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if this turns out to be true. Skynet should send a Terminator back in time to kill McG and prevent this movie from ever being made. In fact, just waste him at birth so none of his crap movies will ever exist.
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Fuck McG and the cretins behind this project.
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I just talked to McG and in the latest script Arnold fights McBain at the end. Its partially animated.
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It was simply excellent...some of the best work Dark Horse has ever released (based on a licensed property), and a perfect way for the franchise to end.
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...or "Kid-Terminator!"
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I used to be on board for this film. Even with McG, it sounded like it could be interesting. But after the PG-13 and now this, my interest has been killed. Your mini-essay on this cannibal holocaust was eye-opening, Mori.
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reminding him to post "Damn You, Michael Bay" in every single thread?
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...I don't think this particular idea is that horrifying, especially if you buy into the Deckard-as-replicant theory. But what's this PG-13 garbage?
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I'm not in denial or anything due to the craziness of that idea, but it really doesn't add up. The T-800 model 101 (i.e. the Ahnold model) killed John at the end of the war. The remaining Resistance led by John's wife, Kate Connor, reprogrammed that Ahnold Terminator and sent it back for T3. John can't be killed in Salvation, it's way too early. This is just someone's crazy idea. Either that or this is the end of the TRILOGY that someone's somehow found out about.
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this doesn't sound like the stake in the coffin, hell it doesn't even sound that bad..It's eve kind of interesting that the future persona of John Connor is more of a legend ( even sythenthic) than a human..HUUGGEEE FAN speaking here, and many other things sound worse than this... Other stuff that might not make sense and/or pointless is why this new actor Sam Worthington even play Marcus when his character who donated his body to be a robot would get switched again for basically another body lol?.....
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Thus spoke the screenwriters with original ideas...
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June 2, 2008, 8:34 p.m. CST
John Conner is the Holy Grail of Terminator Mythos.
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
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Arnold is sitting on a thrown of human skulls as the one original human made to be the T-800 ruling over the cyborg race. The refuse to let him die thinking him the Creator (ala v'ger) and it takes John on a mind-fuck odyssey to figure out just what came first.
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McG is not necessarily good, this piece of news is not necessarily bad
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you, my friend, are a fucking moron.
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June 2, 2008, 8:35 p.m. CST
Killing John Conner = Saying the previous movies didn't matter.
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
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I forsee the cycle of remakes getting shorter and shorter until one summer will end in August with remakes of the films that started off that season the previous May.
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June 2, 2008, 8:36 p.m. CST
THERE ONCE WAS FRANCHISE NAMED TERMINATOR...a little limerick...
by The Marquis de Side 3
"There once was a franchise named "Terminator", <br> shitting all over it -- McG! the perpetrator! <br> he smears and smells twice, <br> as studios say "Nice! <br> We'll remake THIS shit for later!" <br>
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Nipples on Batsuit... Flames on Optimus....and now John Connor cyborg
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...if you wanted T4 to suck balls!!!!
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When they're sent back to 1984. That's how the movie ends. If ya wanna see what happens next. Watch the original Terminator.
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June 2, 2008, 8:40 p.m. CST
Franchises that are awesome if you pretend they end at this poin
by DarthScotland
Aliens. Predator2 (AVP). Terminator2. Die Hard3. Highlander. Robocop. Beverly Hills Cop2(no.4 really? really?!?!). Spiderman (2 made me fall asleep and 3 was just gash.)X-Men2. must stop too angry now.
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love u man(one of fav writers on this site, who i almost follow blindly in reviews ), but great way to officially create a bandwagon for the opinionated impaired masses....I know the lack of hope was there already, but you just deemed an semi interesting bit of news as bad. This plot point in itself is not that stupid. How it's pulled off is what'll make it fly.
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Sounds like a Bay ending to me...
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good...
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A line has been crossed here. This a half assed "scoop" on what is potentially the main cool concept regarding three pictures. I'm not even from Hollywood or connected to the game and I think this was mishandled. I can only imagine what McG must be thinking right now. Your the kid in 2nd grade that told me there was no Santa Claus, he was right but I still think he's a prick.
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It depends on how it's executed in the movie, but it could turn out less shitty than it sounds on paper. I always imagined the John Conner legend to be larger than life than the actual man, that he was a neccesary figure for the human resistance to rally around, but that no one man could live up to the superman they made him. Anyway, I think the machine-conner idea could work if it is done very carefully, but yeah it could really suck too.
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we get what we deserve. and you wonder why this shit gets greenlit?
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Summer 2:<P> a McG film
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Haven't seen T3 or the TV show and I won't watch this either. I don't care that Bale is in it. Without Cameron, without Arnie, I ain't going.
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Oh wait, no, it really can't. Hopefully this is just a rumor.
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the summer movies you're talking about have now become big fall/winter movies......superhero movies the downfall? If you remember correctly, the summer movies before the superhero craze were all Bruckheimer, now if you want more Tony Scottripoffs and Roland Emmerich(wish granted) end of the world fare, hey you and the cap'n can make it happen.
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But then again I like any movie that has someone skinned. Oscar nomination if they really skin the actor alive.
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Okay, I really am not interested in people being skinned. But if this rumour is true (likely not) then the franchise is becoming like Alien. I sure wish they had taken Alien franchise down the Alien Hive book route. Oh wait! They did! It is called Gears Of War!
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June 2, 2008, 9:02 p.m. CST
btw what do remakes have to do with this movie?
by T 1000 xp professional
wrong article to complain 'bout that...if you're complaining about original ideas then please don't let me see you in the MUCH ANTICIPATED 22ND James Bond flick.
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Don't you dare, end up like the music business. I used to love both measures of art 50/50. Then the mid nineties came. Music sucked. I stopped buying albums. And no I wasn't downloading either. Be careful Hollywood. You haven't gone that way yet. Remember guys. The best way to hurt this material is don't show up.
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Was a really good book. Unfortunately the binding on the trade paperback was shit, most of the pages fell out after 3 or 4 reads.
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...will be a different Hulk reboot.
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The bug wearing the Edgar suit.
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June 2, 2008, 9:13 p.m. CST
Flames on Optimus = John Conner Cyberbetic Organism
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
"John Conner Cybernetic Organism" has a better ring than "John Conner Cyborg" sorry, all.right.we.waste.him.no.offens e.
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Shouldn't it just be "skin on Connor"
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Say it aint so.
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It's clever to me. The first 3 movies were about ensuring John Conner's survival at any cost. The robots kept trying to go back and kill him, but it really didn't matter because the first of their kind was actually what defeats them.
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don't countries have look-a-likes for the president all the time in case something happens? Like that movie Moon Over Parador? I'm not saying I like it. It's just not completely unheard of.
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You know...that's not nearly as terrible as I was led to expect. Kinda stupid, yeah, but I won't be all heartbroken and horrified if this turns out to be the truth.
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Why is that a big deal? I thought you were going to tell me they were just going to re-make T1-3. So John Conner is really a Terminator in the future? Why is this the end of the world? <P> Its not half as bad as the end of Kung Fu Panda were Dreamworks closes the door and won't let you leave until you give them all the money in your wallet. <P> ALSO NEVER GIVE UP! NEVER SURRENDER! Whats are motto around here fellow TB'ers? If it has Christian Bale, it will not suck! Just keep saying it over and over in your head, and watch it come true July 18th.
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let's all just hope for the best here. hope is all we have (DAMN YOU McG!!!! DAMN YOU TO HELL!!!!)
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then I doubt it has an ending as shitty as that.
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That is a really fucking bad idea.
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I could definitely see a movie where this plot could be used to propel a series...but why does it have to be Terminator? For me, the Terminator movies were all about a war that happened in the future that caused a machine to wreak havoc on our modern world. I don't particularly care to see the battle against the machines since the fact that John Connor defeats the machines is what adds to the suspense of the original films. We know he wins...that's why the machines want to kill him. But, as has been noted, Hollywood likes an established premise and a franchise people already know. You know, they don't need anything new since new things are risks. Of course, The Matrix proved that something new could be a hit. As did The Sixth Sense, Kill Bill, anything from Pixar...the list goes on and on. I love the first two Terminator flicks. And I think T3 is fun but definitely pushing its luck. This, however, is truly an attempt to milk a franchise far past its expiration date. The presence of Bale was an early vote of confidence for me...but now I wonder if he's the new Johnny Depp.
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so this is the plot for salvation?i dont understand...i dont think i want to understand.
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could no one involved in this hold up their hand and say..."hang on, this is a shit idea". These people are in the movie business, some of them must have an inkling of what "bad" is. I'm no against remakes, sometimes great ideas are ruined by poor realisations and their potential "can" be truly realised if revisited. However, taking a revered cinematic story, tieing it to a table and raping it up the ass till bloody and torn is not a way for any studio to endear itself to the movie watching public. And if Christian Bale has attatched himself to this then i'm very disapointed, he's been carving himself a great choice in parts over the last few years, maybe all that rapid weightloss/gain has finally damaged his brain.
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Let the McG ass raping begin. *Sigh*
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June 2, 2008, 10:07 p.m. CST
Completely Impossible to be even ranked 3rd best sequel
by Stormwatcher
Prefer tv show version of future so far. Liked that they used turbines. Love the Shirley Manson casting more than anything on this movie.
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What a scrawny dork with no shoulders. Hope he put on 30 pounds for Avatar and T4.....i have no idea how this guy is the next big action star. By the way....Rogue was crap
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.. i meant to say...holy crap..shut the hell up ...it might work. let them make the fuckin movie then you can judge
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I hate to be the disagreeing blackbox guy but I don't understand the reason for getting worked up about this. It could be bad or it could be good. If it's real I feel stupid for having read about it already. I don't feel ready to judge if it's good or bad since I don't know this character or the plot or tone or world of the movie or how well it will be executed. All I know is it would be a crazy fucked up twist that should make you say "I didn't see THAT coming" and get excited to see what happens in the next one. But, uh, whoops. Should have had more self control than to read it I guess. And the dude should've had more self control than to leak it. I blame him.<p> I'm more concerned about the other rumor that Bryce Dallas Howard will play the wife. Not that T3 is sacred but I don't see how they go from the two being schoolmates to having a 7 year age difference. (Okay, I thought it was gonna be more than 7 years before I looked it up. Still, they do not seem like they're the same generation.)
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can we all agree that T3 wasn't the abomination some make it out to be. Sure it doesn't hold a candle to the first two, but it's actually pretty great.
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That motherfucker. Now the studios think a bastard amalgam of characters, even sworn foes, is what we're all hankering for. Next up, Hans McClane, Indiana Beloch, and McCauley Pesci.
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So far new films seem to be dummed down for the idiot generation who can't read and write, hang around in gangs and bark at people who are different, i.e. the majority of todays youths. Cos they like John Connor SMASH! xXx 3 extreme to the ZEEE!!!! Fuck this shit up the arse.
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how'd shit go down?
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I hope it's bullshit.
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If it can work there.. why not here?
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Just send somebody out to stop that from happening! DUH!!!!!
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Why do they feel that they just don't need to do a T4...they need T4-6? Why can't they say "we're going to do a big action movie and see if that works" instead of doing a drawn out story with a lame twist meant to basically just ensure more movies? Remember when movies used to just be one-shot entertainment and sequels were a gift, not an inevitability?
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Well it's been about ten years since I read it, but basically you see the rag-tag future army dudes doing some cool sabotage missions, then they decide to hell with it, let's storm skynet and smash those metal motherfuckers. So they storm the place, loads of people get wasted and they turn off skynet. Then a lone termintor eye blinks back on. Duh duh duuuuh!!! It was better than that synopsis though, the art was great too, definitely recommend getting it. In fact, I'm off to ebay right now!
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My good movies...stop raping them in the ass. Please please PLEASE. No means no.
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Un fucking believable that anyone could think this was a good idea
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It's bad in the same way Padme dying and having Luke and Leia talk about their mother in Return of the Jedi is bad. We are told John Connor leads the revolution against the robots. JOHN CONNOR!!!! Not some fucking other guy who everyone thinks is John Connor. And yeah you could have it be that way without destroying continuity, but it makes the convos about John Connor in Terminator 1 and the ENTIRETY OF TERMINATOR 2 seem like a joke because it's not actually the fucking guy who does it. It's one of the worst ideas to ever be introduced into a major franchise. Absolutely horrible.
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I'm pretty glad that the internet, in some small way, could fuck you back for your crimes against cinema. Fucking wanker.
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So its a comedy!! cant wait.
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Morons...
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June 2, 2008, 11:13 p.m. CST
I still wish Bale would play the original Arnie-Terminator.
by Flim Springfield
He could totally pull it off.
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Humans Versus Robots. <p> You'd think that simple fucking premise is enough to fuel a series of great movies starting with the original. We already have the backstory about John Connor. WHY OH WHY OH WHY do they have to fucking complicate it with such contrived bullshit like this?!? <p> I know why! To sell fucking John Connor cyborg action figures!! AHHHHHH FUCK YOU McG and everyone involved in this shit!!!! <p> IRON MAN 4EVER!!! You'll never take that away from me!!!
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Starring Danny Glover as leader of the Resistance and Rihanna as the Terminator.
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A remake of Them, but with Terminators.
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Sweet story! Except Lars gets terminated by his love.
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It's Ross Perots' Giant Sucking Sound! And it's louder than ever!
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Non-stop titty action, except for the pair that counts - Jessica Alba's. Go figure.
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I mean, it's not compulsory. The movie-police are not going to come to our houses and force us to watch.<p>If a movie looks/sounds unfeasibly shit, then I tend to simply save my money. Worked for me with 'Speed Racer' and it'll work again here. When enough of us start thinking the same, then the suits will wake up...
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Eh? Well that's um... weird as shit.
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OK, enough with the negative vibes towards this project! You're all judging it before it's even been shot, let alone gone thru a director's cut and first preview. The script is VERY GOOD -- and McG is a quality director, much to the chagrin of many of you (We Are Marshall should be required viewing). I'm with Vern on this one. Give it a chance and don't bag on it. If you want to skewer it after a preview that YOU have actually attended, well then, that's your right.
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GEDD DOO DAH CHOPPAH!!! AND BRING MY FACE WIT YOO!!! DOO EEED NEEEOOOWWWW!!!! CONSIDERDETADIVORCE!!!
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are the money-people behind the movies to start having the following conversations with the writers, directors etc:<p>"Ok, so you want to do WHAT with this franchise? And you want MY money to do it? Have you been sniffing the old Bolivian marching-powder again? You have? And the screenwriter? Ok, you're fired. Take your Red Bull off my desk and disappear."
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Makes as much sense as ... PUTTING JOHN CONNOR'S FACE ON A ROBOT.
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That explains everything. Who actually drinks that bull piss?
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I'm of the mind that Edward Furlong and the guy from T3 were totally wrong for John Connor. I don't watch the TV show, but I'm 100% sure he's wrong there too. I'm in support of Bale being Connor, but with McG at the helm, and this face/off thing, this movie is gonna be PANTS. PANTS!!!!
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GEDD DOO DAH GUNSTAR ONE!!! DOO EED NEEOOWWW!!!!
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That's like...the worst idea ever. I'm no TERMINATOR whore. But even I can sit here and objectively say that's horrendous.<P>Devin's write-up on this story over at CHUD is pretty cut and dry. (And I don't think we need the well-worn philosophical theme of what it means to be human in a Terminator movie either.) But he makes it sound like Moriarty dropped the bomb that's gonna NUKE THE FRIDGE!
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Discuss.
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and then she sold them, which si why it made no sense when she refused to be in T3 complaining that she won't do it if it's not Cameron. YOU PUT HIM IN THAT POSITION YOU UGLY DOG!
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T4 IS NUKING THE SHARK!
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Seriously. Who came up with this idea? Who wrote the script? Did ScriptGirl report on this?<P>Somebody better get Philbrick on the line...
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That's nasty!
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It's like Han shooting first, if what Han shot were a million tiny turds shaped like Catwoman Special Edition DVDs.
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Set Terminator on vibrate and .... GO!
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June 2, 2008, 11:46 p.m. CST
IF YOU WERE SARAH CONNOR, WOULD YOU HAVE FUCKED KYLE?
by BringingSexyBack
His pants must've stunk! He stole them off the homeless guy!
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Seems there've only been like what, three? Terminator, Matrix and possibly i am robot... But c'mon give me a day and I can think of something new...
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"I'm too rusty for this shit!"
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Kinda..
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sequels aside, now I know how you all old fogeys feel. i think i'd feel personally offended seeing some random new young bastard trying to be Neo (even if I hate Keanu, he's still Neo) or having someone else even dare attempt Morpheus or Smith.<p>it's different with comedies or some other films. i can't imagine someone remaking Back to the Future, but a Ghostbusters remake sounds like a cool idea. i'd rather see that than something 'original' cuz the original idea would probably be lame.
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June 2, 2008, 11:55 p.m. CST
THE ASSASSINATION OF TERMINATOR BY THE COWARD JOHN CONNOR
by BringingSexyBack
There are layers of meaning in that title. You've got to see the movie to understand.
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That's so weird we did the Blade Runner reference at the same precise moment. Are you reading my mind? You FREAK!!!!!
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and creating a bunch of shit out of their ASS. Fuck it, remake "Taxi Driver" while you are at it Hollywood.
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And McG is driving the boat!
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Will anyone be able to tell the difference?
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He must be having a seizure from my Capslock overload.
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That's the STUPIDEST thing I've ever heard.
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I drink your oilpan! I drink it up!
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Gedd. Doo. Dah. Choppah. Doo. Eed. Neow.
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This is horse hockey!
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The end of the Super Hero bubble that's been hanging over hollywood since Spider-man 1's opening weekend. Because, honestly, that's a big part of it. recognition with built in fans. Studios are in love with mining the comics, and when they aren't doing that they're mining previous genre films. Having Superhero films fail and go out of style will be a big signal that we're all grown up and ready for something new.<br> <br> And it would have to be a big failure. A flop from a huge franchise. Something unbearably bad. The next Batman and Robin. Probably only a Spider-man film is high profile enough to produce an epic fail.<br> <br> Problem is, we're not ready for it yet, going by this summer. "That's well and good, but I want an Iron Man 2 and an Avengers film before we see the end of Superheroes! That and a third Nolan/Bale Batman and that'd be it! the genre can rest! ooh, but a Green Lantern Movie would be cool too..." and it never ends.
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Is it some random asshole in a Terminator Body wearing a John Connor skin suit? or is it gonna be John Connor in a Terminator body? Wait, those are equally stupid, never mind.
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I REFUSE to support the inane attempt to make "Nuking the Fridge" the new "Jumping the Shark." Oh, you thought the nuked fridge seen had questionable physics, boo fucking hoo.
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a Harry Potter reboot. Each movie will be given 2 films a piece and there will be an overbloated and mis placed pre-occupation with "doing it right this time." And they'll get Daniel Radcliffe to do one of the following: 1) make a cameo as James Potter in the mirror, or age him up to be Dumbledore or if they're really screwing with us make him the new Snape! Then, even though I love the current movies I'll say, "These new movies are sooooo much better! those old movies totally suck!" Until the do the new version of "Order of the Phoenix" and it's long and overblown and boring and I go "These new ones don't get it! Harry Potter was done right the first time!" Just like what's about to happen to Batman...
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john connor kept alive as a cyborg would be cool. but if the cyborg doesn't bear any semblance to the character of john connor aside from "wearing his skin" then what's the fucking point.
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It hasnt raped my childhood, but it is dismissing the first 2 Terminator movies because the whole focus was to keep JOhn Connor alive. If he dies in this proposed storyline, makes those movies so insignificant. THe mythos of John Connor was what everyone was interested in. Not this Marcus fella.
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we'll destabalize the movie industry and suffer a "false Vacuum" collapse of a sort where films just aren't profitable and stuff like Sci-fi channel originals is the best we can hope for. Oh, and google "false vacuum collapse."
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It became comical long ago that the ONLY good news in this whole project was that Bale was starring in it. Every single other detail that has been revealed has been a strike against it. EVERY SINGLE OTHER DETAIL. This is astonishing. I almost have to see this film because my mind is working overtime doing the calculus of its potential shittiness. It's like the SOAP hype in reverse.
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Seriously, how in the fuck is a Human going to defeat an Army of superior cyborgs? Because he used their weapons against them by becoming a cyborg himself.
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It's not about superhero films per se. Hell, people love "heroes" in their movies and comic book characters are simply a prime example of that. This is not about a superhero bubble that has to be burst and THEN movies will be new and original. I'd argue that a movie like Iron Man IS original simply because we've NEVER seen Iron Man on the big screen, and best of all...in this case...they actually did a good job of producing an entertaining movie.<p>Superhero movies like IRON MAN aren't the problem. Hell, part of the reason IRON MAN is such a hit is because it DOES feel fresh to so many. No, the REAL problem is what Moriarity was alluding to: it's all these damn remakes and minings of older things THAT WE HAVE SEEN. Remember the talkback from a few months ago? When it was announced they were going to do a remake of FAME? That's a good example of this bullshit going on. Who the hell is clamoring for a REMAKE of fucking FAME? It has it's time and place in history, so just leave it there. It's NOT a story or even a concept that warrants someone sitting down and saying "Boy, I bet millions of people want to see bad, egotistical high school performers filmed onstage using current film technology!" And hell, if they do want that, they can watch AMERICAN IDOL or HIGH SCHOOL MUSICAL, which are at least "new" creative properties.<p>So don't blame it on the superheroes. I hate to geek out here, but even going by your post I have news for you: there are LOTS of us even here who absolutely, positively HATE all these remakes (PROM NIGHT, THE FOG, RED DAWN, FAME...blah, blah, blah), but at the same time I'd love to see a live action GREEN LANTERN movie simply because I think it could make for a cool and NEW franchise since, again, we've never seen Green Lantern on the big screen. I don't care if Hollywood wants to make an ERAGON movie -- sure, take a chance. It was a huge, huge hit book that teenagers loved and scooped up by the millions. I know, my niece was one of them. In its own way, it makes good business sense to roll the dice and make that...I haven't seen THAT yet. But don't give me RED DAWN again and think that just because you've switched out the Russians for the Chinese that somehow now it's more relevant and insightful and thus it warrants a remake. Fuck that shit. It's teens using guns to fight off an invader. There, THAT'S your core plot -- so what Moriarity is saying is right again. Even if you want to use a core concept like that, at least write a fucking original script AROUND that idea and TRY to make something new. For crying out loud, I'm sure there are talkbackers right here, right now who could come up with great pitches for "why" a band of high schoolers or young college kids have to take up arms and fight off an aggressive invader WITHOUT it being RED DAWN.
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June 3, 2008, 1:11 a.m. CST
Nipples on Batman = John Connor "learning computer"
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
Chicken Thunder, Connor already has skin. How about Termie-ater in John Connor?
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June 3, 2008, 1:12 a.m. CST
Flames on Optimus = Termie-ater in John Connor
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
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If you thought it was boring in Jordan<P> Then come out here for a day<P> And by the way, the name is Marcus<P> But if you like, you can call me Sensei<P> Well the emperor is in the pig sty<P> And the geisha is in the shack<P> And you better believe I'll hold them there<P> Till the feds, they pay me back<P> <P> Kamikaze backbone<P> Nine iron spitfire<P> Continental samurai<P> Oh my lord<P> Brown sugar, sweet potato<P> Sourmash, baby back<P> Redneck romance<P> Bless my soul<P> <P> Hari Kari and combines,<P> Come dancin' with me<P> Hari Kari and combines,<P> Won't you come dancin' with me?<P> <P> Yes, I'm a New World Samurai, and a redneck nonetheless<P> Yes, I'm a New World Samurai, and a redneck nonetheless<P> Yes, I'm a New World Samurai, and I can read your mind<P> Check it out, I'm like a buzzbomb<P> Yes, I'm a New World Samurai,<P> Check it out, I'm like a buzzbomb<P> <P> So Beebopalloobopawopshamboo<P> And domo arigato if I got to<P> Bebopaloobopawopshamboo<P> And domo arigato if I got to<P> Bebopaloobopawopshamboo<P> And domo arigato if I got to<P> Bebopaloobopawopshamboo<P> And domo arigato if I got to<P> <P> Song and lyrics by the almighty CLUTCH.
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June 3, 2008, 1:24 a.m. CST
Bet on it: T4 will be the SHOWGIRLS of the sci-fi film world
by Big Dumb Ape
I have to agree that the sheer magnitude of shittiness that this movie could possibly reach continues to escalate almost daily. Seriously, ASIDE from the initial casting of Bale, I have yet to hear anything...literally, not ONE single thing...that has been positive about these films as they finally go into production. And how you fuck up something like the future war of man versus Terminators for the survival of the species is beyond me since this should practically write itself and be a total balls out action trilogy. But for crying out loud, as others instantly pounced and noted, even the very first piece of pre-production art that they released to try and jazz up the fans was laughably wrong since they toned it green instead of the future war, washed out, blue tint that Cameron clearly established in his films.<p>As for this rumor, regrettably Ganymede3010 above is probably closest to the truth. That probably IS what the brain-dead writers are thinking. "Hey, we gotta find a way to give John an endoskeleton, too, because THAT would explain how he can fight super strong robots AND even cooler now HE can punch his fists through concrete and toss heavy shit around too. This is gold, baby! GOLD!!!"<p>So here's what we could end up with: this movie could actually be the SHOWGIRLS of the Sci-Fi world. A film sooooo unbelievably shitty that it will actually be its very own episode of MYSTERY SCIENCE THEATER on the night it premieres and as you are watching it...
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We already know the ending. Connor wins. If you do these movies, you gotta make it interesting. And I like that there's more to Connor's story than meets the eye. Also, this way, they exchange someone who knows the future and is born to be a great leader to someone who doesn't know what the fuck he is doing and has to grow up to the responsibility. Also, this way Marconnor can be surprised by shit like T1000 or time travel.
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June 3, 2008, 1:38 a.m. CST
HKiller: "The script is VERY GOOD and McG is a quality director"
by Big Dumb Ape
Wait a minute, Hkiller. How do you know the script is VERY GOOD in all capital letters? Have you read it? Do you have a copy of it?<p>If so, and if you're so willing to back this shitty idea, then why not forward a copy of the script to Mori and let him post a full review of it, much like he took a look at J.J. Abrams "reimagining" of SUPERMAN back in the day.<p>As for McG beign a "quality director" I don't care how good WE ARE MARSHALL is -- he's still the same man who also helmed CHARLIES ANGELS 2 and bragged about how great that was going to be, a film which turned out to be such utter shit that it clogged toilets all across the world.
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i liked it but brain hurt, i have enough continuity problems with DC comics right now.
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fucking shit we want to reach a bigger audience, hope you enjoy your gold swimming pool you greedy WB Cunt.
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That's who I would have done it, hardcore future sci fi meets guerilla brutal war style. But I'm too smart for these cunts. Also if WB doesn't step up with their marketing like they fail in every movie(ironically the exception being The Dark Knight which is the best marketed movie ever) then this film will fail. i've never seen a film studio so inept at selling it's product, and it's probably the major studio that puts out the most quality. How hard is it to sell Speed Racer, well they found a fucking hard way, Assassination of Jess James, a masterpiece? Fuck that we don't want you to see it. The Fountain, a mindfuck of an art movie that would get all teenagers into it, how hard can it be to market that? We'll show you. Fucking idiots.
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June 3, 2008, 1:57 a.m. CST
Im not a hater like most of the idiots on this site....but...
by nalapou
worst idea ever.
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June 3, 2008, 2:14 a.m. CST
Who the fuck cares? This project was already fucked...
by Motoko Kusanagi
...from the moment Joseph McGinty Nichol (aka McG) signed on.<p>Plus the decision to make it PG-fucking-13.
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Boycott this shit. If any reader of AICN goes to see this travesty you lose your cool card. Keep the money for Avatar folks, that's the real deal.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7414024.stm
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Right after T3, I was coping with both the fact that T3 was unsatisfying and the fact that T3 wrapped up the circle without exposing the obvious chicken/egg paradox that's been around since the end of the first movie. John's father is Kyle Reese from the future. Kyle was sent back in time to protect John's mother, but he actually becomes John's father. But if there was no John Connor, then there was no reason for Skynet to send the first Terminator or Kyle Reese back in time. That brings up 2 scenarios. One scenario is that THE ORIGINAL John Connor was fathered by someone other than Kyle Reese. By sending back Kyle, it altered the timeline, but the idea of John Connor and his destiny was passed on by Kyle; and it fueled John's mother's determination to name her son John and mold him/his future. The actual resolution to the story is really an almost Donnie Darko of an ending. Since I did NOT love T3, I thought...why not remake the movie right after it came out? Except this story involves a 3rd and possibly even 4th party interloping. It's FAR too late now, but T4 could have started out the same, or even started halfway through T3. My idea was to have John's own son come back in time, avoiding his future father's advice against time travel and another wacky idea, yet following his father's No Fate But What We Make motto. John's son is originally less like his father, because John sheltered him and kept him working behind enemy lines. While living his entire life underground in bunkers, sewers, and caves, John's son becomes a super-techie. John Jr. is the first to reverse engineer and reprogram Terminators. Then despite John Sr. constantly sheltering John Jr., his son becomes the victim of an air strike on a bunker, and is permanently paralyzed from the waste down...and hell, let's throw in a gimpy arm...totally fuct. BUT how does John's son plan to help prevent Skynet's reign by going back in time himself...when he's handicapped? I'll get to that. But I'm sure you've figured out where I'm going with this. Years after John Connor's death, when the tide had turned against Skynet, the Earth is still an environmental hellhole with nearly no hope of a longterm human survival given the state of the planet...Skynet had still won because humanity has no way to replenish the ravaged Earth. That's when John Jr. gets all Dr. Frankenstein meets Six Million Dollar Man...on himself! John Jr. essentially becomes a living Terminator. It's Robocop 2, brain & spinal cord (maybe heart & lungs) but with a Terminator endoskeleton sheltering those organs. Now John Jr. sets out on a quest to prevent the events of the last half of T3, meet his young father, and save the franchise from a sad ending. But it would be too easy for Arnold to have an equally badass Terminator-ish human from the further future help him kick the Terminatrix's sweet, tight, thighmaster-loving ass. That would happen in 15 minutes worth of movie. Oooh...but wait. I didn't say Skynet was no more in the future, just down & out. In a last ditch attempt, Skynet sends another badass terminator...fuck it, an army of Terminators of varying models to totally fuck up John Jr., his dad John Sr., his mom Kate Brewster, and even Arnold...cuz you gotta fuck up Arnold's face for some chrome to show! Of course John Jr. narrowly fulfills his mission to prevent Judgement Day...but upon final victory John Jr.'s human insides are hurt...John Jr. dies in his younger father's arms. However, John Jr. understood the paradox and tells his father it's going to be okay because all of this madness will soon be over because he and John Sr. will both be together forever. In all his despair, John Connor Sr. doesn't understand his son's dying words. But as soon as his son dies/Skynet is shut down before launching worldwide...the still living John Connor and his dead son both fade away while mom Kate Brewster looks on...then her surroundings dissolve into everyday life years earlier at the animal hospital...and she doesn't even remember it ever happened...because it didn't. Therefore the entire Terminator timeline undoes itself...or does it just revert back to the original timeline? That's when the sickly (cancer), former weekend warrior/army reserve mom, Sara Connor (Linda Hamilton), walks into the animal hospital with her aging German Shepard & young son, John. This John Connor is younger in this original timeline because he was born later to a different father who was also in the army but died in Iraq. So the audience is left knowing that Judgement Day will eventually come, this original John Connor will fight Skynet, and together both John & Skynet will totally fuck with the timeline more than either of them will ever know. Kind of Twighlight Zone-ish with almost an infinite Butterfly effect/Neo in the Architect's office subtext of an ending...but hey...it would have redone T3!!! And it might have explained why 2 different actors played John Connor between 2 & 3 in a weird sort of way (the real reason being that the insurance company for T3 said Eddie Furlong was too much of a risk because of all his shenanigans). Between T2 and T3, you were really watching two different incarnations of John. Instead we get yet another slap in the face, with yet another actor playing John Connor. My idea would have still shown a LOT of future war including the death of John Connor but would have included the time travel to the present storyline just like the first 3 Terminator films. PLEASE, someone comment on whether my idea was more OR less gay.
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but please watch the video above - the producers are a right pair of wankers.
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June 3, 2008, 2:24 a.m. CST
Put all that trilogy budget into 'the sarah connor chronicles'
by BendersShinyAss
and let that show grow into the future wars. man, I wish people would listen to me!!!
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This smells like donkey ass.
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June 3, 2008, 2:30 a.m. CST
why has there been no story about universal buring down?
by BendersShinyAss
40,000 film reels, back to the future set, all gone. <p> what do you reckon it was an insurance job?
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and McG. So it doesn't really matter to me what they do with this franchise anymore. Hopefully, Bale has the good sense to jump ship.
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Leave Terminator alone, you bastards! Bad enough they made T3.
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I dunno about that. Seems like every time they attempt to 'pander to the geeks' they do the exact opposite and manage to alienate all of us and guarantee short shelf lives for their products. (See: Transformers, Ghost Rider, and coming soon G.I. Joe.) On the rare occasion that they don't 'pander' and just make a product that we like (Nolan's Batman franchise, Iron Man, Narnia, LOTR) they reap a harvest of cash unrivaled regardless of whether it's an original idea or a pre-existing entity. The lesson? This isn't 'pandering'. That suggests they're trying to cater to our desires. Instead, they're catering to whatever 12-year-old may be willing to pay $10 to talk with their friends and text message during the latest rehashed pop culture remnant. They pay lip service to us, but never actually deliver shit. And, like Mori says (in a way), that chatty 12-year-old won't support their franchises come next decade when they're not-so-chatty 20-somethings who actually want to be entertained.
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I even have an explanation for the picture that Reese carries of Sarah Conner...sure we know how he got it, and we know how and where it was taken, but it was in the context of a time paradox, hence it doesn't work. My idea eliminates, or at least, explains the time paradox making it a linear plot point. I think with clever direction it can play on screen without it ever being hard to follow or inducing headaches--a director just has to be willing to be brave enough to challenge the audience and trust that they want more out of a story than just bad CGI and endless, mindless chase scenes, the later being the reason Indy 4 fail to Sex In The City last weekend. Audiences want filmmakers to take them to a higher level, like with the original Star Wars and the original Terminator, the rest is just fun, or should be...but it all begins with a good premise, and a good story!!!
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http://tinyurl.com/3p5w9q </p> Thanks to kwisatzhaderach for originally posting the link. I went to www.tinyurl.com to make it...tiny! Anyhow, kwisatzhaderach described the T4 producers in this video as a "right pair of wankers". I'm writing from the good, ole, U-S of A...so that phrase comes off sounding negative, however I don't really understand the true meaning. After watching the video of T4 producers answering MANY questions, revealing more by saying they're not saying certain things...I think kwisatzhaderach meant to say that the producers seem like a real pair of FAGGOTS! That's how Trey Parker and/or Matt Stone would put it. Mr. Garrison would definitely call those guys FAGGOTS! My apologies to all gay people who have *not* buttfucked the entire Terminator franchise. Since these guys are in bed with McG, they're McFaggots...with cheese! In France, they're called Faggots-Royale with cheese.
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June 3, 2008, 3:02 a.m. CST
you know it seems like mori is just trying to piss on this for p
by ampersand110
"Hey guys you excited for this movie?? well this is how its going to be fucked up." Of course he'll respond with "No no i want this movie to be great its just not what i hear from "people". Then he'll probably pick some movie that his kid has gone ape shit over, "All you guys will be with me when you see Space Chimps, it's like space camp but with monkey's! My little kid screams Ass Chimp all day and night watching that trailer, its going to rule!" It's got that buzz"! But in reality mori is right and im just a pissed off guy who couldn't take a job at the universal tram guide because i live an hour away and the price of gas is to high. I envy you mori.
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Geeks are a fuckle err fickle bunch aren't we. Weather its movies or video games we sway our fan-boy hypocrisies quicker than Joan Crawford's bi-polar disorder. So you want new ideas... well the last huge risky new idea that hit Hollywood were the Matrix franchise and everyone bashed that. So plan B was raping your childhood. Assholes get what ya deserve for flip-flopping. :)
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but if this is true, I would rather jerk off with a cheese grater and then dip my cock in a pile of salt.
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I thought this site was for film fans? Where's the joy in revealing an ending, even if it sucks? Where's the love of film? The people who run this site need to have a good long look at themselves. They have lost their innocence. Just read that diatribe by Mori-who? at the top again if you are unsure.
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You fucker.
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If after reading it you still didn't want to know ahead of time then you deserved to have it ruined.
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...of why connor would sign up for 3 movies: It gives the Connor character an impressive arc over the trilogy - Pt1 = good guy; Pt2 = good/bad; Pt3 = bad, bad ultimately good. Actors love that stuff, believe me. Of course the idea shits on the love and momentum of the first two, but i guess T3 already pissed on them (though it's ending was the tricky, good bit). Guess they think they're being tricky again, but guess what...
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1. Moriarty hates it. And I've recently decided that Moriarty is not only the crappiest writer on this site, but also that he has fucking terrible taste in movies, and a tendency to get quite histrionic in his writing, like some sort of whiny girl. </P> <P>2. Because, my gut instinct, after all Moriarty's hyperboles, was that this is a cool interesting plot idea. That, and I have my own mind. </P> <P> 3. Because the only readers here who chime in to agree with Moriarty's remarks seem to be weak-minded sheeple who want to ingratiate themselves with the most immature writer that AICN has to offer.
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June 3, 2008, 4:30 a.m. CST
in 20 years ill be too old to care what hollywood is putting out
by bacci40
in fact, im too old right now...its all pretty much shit...who cares about the terminator...
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That's such a fucking stupid hyperbolic statement that it isn't even debatable. I disagree with him at times, often in fact when it comes to summer films which I feel he goes far too easy on, but his writing is always eloquent in it's pattern. I defend him because on a site that is read by the industry, where you have writers like Harry and Massawyrm regularly lowering the bar, I feel the need to defend integrity. If only for stories like this where he not only nails the topic, but gives a solid editorial on exactly why this franchise pilfering is going to have to come to a screeching halt.
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... I'm not remotely surprised to see someone show up and just launch a personal attack. It's an easy way to make it about me instead of about the idea. <P>This isn't a personal article. I'm the guy who saw the original TERMINATOR in the theater when it came out. 40-something times. Because I was 14 and a friend's brother was the guy at the door five nights a week including weekends and let us in for free as much as we wanted. We saw the original two or three times a week the whole time it was out. And back then, a film that was making money just stayed around... making money... all summer long... <P>I love THE TERMINATOR. I love TERMINATOR 2: JUDGMENT DAY. I remain unconvinced on everything else. If it's been released, I've seen it, and I haven't published huge pissy rants about any of it. It's just not for me. I'm not buying. TERMINATOR 3? Not buying it. SARAH CONNOR CHRONICLES? Not buying it. Sorry. But that's my opinion. And that's exactly how I offered it. Opinion. <P>So if someone's going to make it personal, that's their business. I'm writing as I've always written... as someone who loves good films. If I thought they were making new TERMINATOR films as anything other than product, I'd be more interested. That's not me attacking the director or the producers or Christian Bale or saying anything personal or mean about them. That's a TERMINATOR fan saying, "Sorry, but that's just not for me. I'm not asking you for more TERMINATOR. I'm happy with the story that was told. I don't need more. I don't really want more. I'd like it more if you'd just... stop. Please. That's my vote. That's all it is." <P>I'll change the title to reflect that this is evidently a spoiler. I ran it as a crazy rumor because, frankly, I didn't think it would pan out. Then Devin at CHUD reported that it matched what he knows, so I'll mark it as a potential spoiler.
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The terminators get taken down by one of their own terminators. It seems like one of those time paradox ideas. The terminators HAD to exist in order for them to be destroyed.....or something.
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That is utterly insane drivel but I can imagine the franchise going in that direction now. And no, Moriarty is by far the most interesting writer on this site.
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I'm with you on the whole Terminator issue- 2 films, that's it. This whole 'He was a terminator all along' feels like a cheap Battlestar Galactica rip off
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I really could not agree more about this film simply being a product. And for that reason, this does not spoil anything to the point where I was gutted that I read the Lost season finale spoiler (about 10 minutes before I watched it too! dammit!). HOwever, I am going to be stupid here and say I am holding out for a good mindless action film. Stay positive guys! And talkbackers, stop the needless hate!
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...this is becoming the laziest form of plot device. I can almost see them sitting there in the "think" tank, tossing ideas about: <p> McG: "Yeah, and then we could like... like... MAKE JOHN CONNOR A FUCKING TERMINATOR, MAN!!!" <p> Yes man 1: "Awesome, dude! It's like... like... we make him turn into WHAT HE HATES THE MOST!! It's like profound and shit!" <p> Yes man 2: "Awwwww, YEEEEEEAAAH, boy!!" <p> McG: "Yeah, cuz like, if we don't know what the hell is going on then nobody else does and they can, like, interpret and shit!" <p> Philbrick: "I'll alert the plant team and have them standing by for internet deployment. We are now at DEF(icate)CON One, people." <p> McG: "Yeah, deploy that shit, bro!"
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I liked T3...Ha! Another 3 films...why bother? The story isn't that profound or complex. Silly humans make powerful machines that destroy the human world...brave humans fight back and destroy bad machines...bad machines are poor losers and bend time to save on futuristic sets and go back to the late 20th century to kill the brave human leader..the end There's loads of good Sci-fi books out there. So you lot out there in Studio land...try using some of the many good stories instead of playing safe and underestimating the film fans. We can cope with new ideas
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to not get that a rumour is going to turn out to be a spoiler if it's true. God there are some whiney fuckwits on here!
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Everything since has been a lazy cash-in.
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June 3, 2008, 5:35 a.m. CST
To make things personal...Massawyrm is easily the worst writer o
by MMacKK
I can't stand the way he writes reviews. Just so hyperbolic, repetitive, and covered in wank that it makes me think twice about a film. That Halloween review? Horrific. Moriarty has my vote.
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Seriously. Ram this shit-headed idea right up their PG-13 asses!<p>@ kwisatzhaderach: You're perfectly right: TERMINATOR ended in 1991.
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My issue here is that you are revealing a rumoured ending because you have an agenda. The agenda you push is to prove that the Terminator films are no longer interesting. This rumoured ending, is according to you, evidence that the films are rubbish, post Cameron and void of creativity. In the free market, fans can vote with their feet. If this latest Terminator is crap, word of mouth spreads and the film will die a quiet death. I put it to you, to let the fans decide when the film comes out. Don't lecture movie fans, or press agendas, or complain that films aren't what they used to be. That is a little tired...Let the free market decide the fate of the film. And the free market will be able to judge it better if it doesn't know the ending! For the record, I don't look forward to this film any more than you, but I am a movie fan first and leaking stuff a full year before the film is due to come out does not have a movie fans' best interest at heart. This is not a personal attack. I think all the writers at Aint It Cool do a fine job. They just lose their way sometimes.
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Come on, you don´t have to see this shit (and it will most likely end up being shitty), refuse to take more sequel/prequel/remake-garbage. It pisses me off that nobody, no studio, no writer, no director seem to be able to pull anything new out of their collective asses. For what do we give money to that bunch of unoriginal idiots by buying tickets to the theatre or buying 3 different versions of One an the Same freaking movie on DVD if they put not the slightest bit of effort in their work? Sorry, Hollywood stinks!!!
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Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo retarded!
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Number of previous posts on AICN: 0 <p> Status: deployed
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sucked ass too. T1 was great, T3 was fun, and T2 was a disappointing and unintentionally hilarious piece of shit. Its really awful. My girlfriend (at the time) and I both hated it when it came out. This T4 sounds awful, but it can't be any worse than T2: WE WUV WOO ROBODADDY.
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He's not ranting. The one anomaly in the is production that made fans stop and think, hey, maybe this could be good, was Christian Bale joining the cast. Now, sadly, it all makes sense. Such a story arc for a character over 3 films, as is suggested here, would be hard for any actor to turn down. Bale's task here is fraught with great challenges - to make discover the transformation to machine, and then, i imagine, discover the humanity and original character within it by the third in the trilogy. However, as much as this presents a great role for the actor, it's presents pitfalls for story, when told over all 6 movies. The trick of the first trilogy is the play on narrative timelines (exploited, rather than expanded in the third). To replace this with a play on character (will he/won't he be the good guy in the end), is far more conventional. Many films already do this very well. Terminator stands out because it says, hey, the good guys are good, the bad guys are bad, but this is a 21st century fairy-tale and the way it's told is post-modern - is cut up, re-arranged, so we begin at the end, end at the beginning, so to speak. It's self contained. Now, the genius that Cameron is, he managed to expand on this self contained universe and make it even more interesting, in T2. So, what we have here, in T4, is either a more conventional movie that replaces the narrative timeline complexity device, which is what makes it a Terminator movie just as much as cyborgs do, with character development complexity. That's really only a Terminator movie in name. Alternatively, they may have included narrative-timeline complexity along with the addition of Character development complexity. This is more ambitious than the previous trilogy, and If this is pulled off, and i'd love to see that, it would be triumph - a true Terminator movie (Narrative-timeline complexity that comes up to scratch) with a fascinating character development study at it's heart. Now i don't doubt that Bale can deliver. But forgive me McG for wondering if you can step up to the plate for this. Going on what he's made so far, i'd have to say no. But my fingers are crossed that there really was genius being held-back in Charlie's Angel. T1 was a rare beast - a progressive, thought provoking, complex study of narrative explored by means of time-travel paradox, cleverly disguised as an action sci-fi with visceral thrills and romance (Hitchcock would have been proud). It introduced the intellectuals to visceral thrill seekers, and visceral thrill seekers to the intellectuals - it spawned 'the film geek', it laid the road to Ain't it Cool News. It said action films can be smart and provoke discussion. Good luck MgG!
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This sounds absolutely right, because when Bale was cast the general thought was, "He should be a Terminator!"
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I love movies, but Jesus Christ, man, that's pathetic. Read a book for crying out loud.
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Still bitching about T2? Still loving SPEED RACER? Still imagining a girlfriend? <p>Hilarious!
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This is the dumbest shit I've ever heard. I'm glad he ran this, because if I had paid to see the film in theatres (and like I would have), and THAT was the ending, I would be pissed. Why can't Puffy McG, or whatever he calls himself, go "reimagine" something else? Anyway, I'll catch this one 10 years from now on TV.
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Maybe gingerella is wearing the flesh of another talkbacker too!<p>Why is that dog barking?
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I'm telling you people, this piece of news is growing on me..The fact that the robots keep going back in time to destroy a "legend/myth" is verryyy interesting and adds to the story.........Guys pleeeaaassseeee let's wait it out..The worst news i've heard about this movie so far has been the pg-13.. They've never been that gory or violent but the whole point of the 1st three movies were to stop to the gore and violence of the future war...I'm holding out.. I guess i might be the one who you might say is setting himself up for dissapointment. Just give me a good Terminator war movie with Christian Bale. He said accepted, this marriage must have somehope, at least some....
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But not quite.
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No one gives a fuck about some hokey criminal skin job! Killing off Connor dilutes the potency of the previous films and his legendary status as the human saviour in the future war against the machines. To be replaced by a deathrow criminal is an affront to all the hard work James Cameron did in the first two Ts in establishing the John Connor mythos. These were well developed characters, you gave a shit about, spurring on the desire to see how Connor actually wages war in the future. This is just some coke addled McFuck's notion of a 'cool' plot twist. God I wish they'd left this franchaise well alone or allowed James Cameron to veto the scripting. What a fucking travesty.
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Wait a minute...
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T2 was spectacular but contains some of the cheesiest shit you ever did see! <P>T3 was alright and what I've seen of the Chronicles things was, well, very made for TV so it looked cheap by comparisson to the Movies.<P>Anyway Why's the main character a Criminal Cyborg? and not just John Connor? Why do people care if They put Connors skin on an endo Skeleton? they had Arnies on one and no-one bothered? it's science fiction and Stan Winston would make it look totally believable.<P>Biggest question is why are they letting some guy called McG direct movies?
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You do realise you're the only person in history that thinks T3 is better than T2? The shot of the endolskeleton skull leering through the fire in the T2 title sequence is better than the whole of T3. T2 is a masterclass in sci-fi action. You may not have the sufficient irony to appreciate Cameron's narrative arc but that doesn't mean it's a bad movie i'm afraid. T3 is the very definition of a bad movie, in fact it's more a parody of T2 than anything else, especially Arnie wearing the Elton John glasses in the 'hilarious' opening. T3 sucked.
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Nothing's as bad as that!
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if you're gonna take a shit on the series, that's the sure-fire way to make sure the turd is steamy hot and corpulent, riddled with peanuts and striations
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June 3, 2008, 7:27 a.m. CST
Swapping skins? Bit like Face Off then? Sounds cool.
by HarryBlackPotter
Although kinda seen that before, it could work. If John is dead at the end of part one, then having a T-800 being dressed in John's dead skin and being programmed to act like John then I don't see why that would be a bad idea. In fact I think it's kinda cool.
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the T800 that kills Connor resembles Schwarzennegger. Without him as the cyborg, you can't kill Connor.
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I wonder if Cameron doesn't care to step in or the studios have told him they aren't interested.
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It's not a given that this will suck. If it is poorly written or executed badly, it will absolutely kill the franchise. But if handled properly, it could actually be quite intriguing. It's not an undisputable fact that this plot development is bad, so it's definitely too early to say how this will pan out. Bale has showed a good nose for scripts before. I hope we can trust his judgment this time too.
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What's the other Cameron franchise?
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Sarah connor died at the end of T2 of cancer right so the robots got her body on ice and use her skin to make a Sarah Connor Terminatrix who they send back to kill the real Sarah Connor in the original Terminator. So there's Sarah Connor Borg after Sarah Connor instead of Arnie(no need to get him back he's too old) and just re-shoot T1 with her instead of the Austrian Oak but at the end have them both go through a time hole to the future where she meets her grown son - Christian Bale but doesn't know it's her son and they fuck and have a little mutant connor baby who grows up in the ruins to become a new breed of Freedom fighter a bit like Toxic Avenger but with grafted on Endo enhancements. This sets up another franchise - Termutants 1, 2 and 3.
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Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you must realise that you are almost a minority of one when it comes to not thinking T2 was one of the best scifi films ever made... Now, by all means continue to not enjoy it, but have some respect for the vaste majority of people who do...
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Does he in someway make you go to the cinema to watch these films? Sheeesh! Get over it...
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I tend to feel like Moriarty; the Terminator saga ended with T2 and what else that's been done since never felt like it was part of the cannon. That said, I always wanted to see the future war with the machines and if it was done right, it could add to the cannon. This plot point is.... different which I suppose is why the filmmakers are doing it: To try and offer up something fresh and put their own twist on things. But when filmmakers come in and play with another filmmaker's creation, they tend to do this sort of thing and it almost always ends up shitty.
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Moriarty's right on this one. This new movie is becoming scarier and scarier and...
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dumb
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Alien(s) is not so much of a Cameron franchise as Scott directed the first, but I know he expressed interest in coming back but Fox told him they had a better script (AvP). Considering Cameron was able to make a sequel to one of the greatest movies ever made and do complete honor to the series, one would expect the studio to want him to return for more.
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...is if John Connor sacrifices himself to become part machine in a some weird "giving up my humanity so that I can think like my enemy" type of thing. He soon realizes he has to understand the machines in order to defeat him. And hell, Bale got enough practice holding back emotions in "Equilibrium". Might as well put that skill to some use.
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This is a retarded backlash of Star Wars proportions. Since when have Terminators 1 or 2 been anything other than good action films? It's fantastical bullshit sci-fi. So why some of you should find the John Conner switch so unbelievable, I don't fucking know. If anything it gives Bale, the films one saving grace, more to work with.
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so in effect it would still be John Connors heart and sole, just with a metal endo? This could actually be cool!:) Please remain the title to possible ending spoiler! Wish I never read it now!
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T1, T2 were complete. Everything else is simply milking the franchise without offering anything groundbreaking, fresh or even worth fricking talking about.
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Seriously, this is what was intended. Go watch T2 again. The very beginning where it shows the future war and we see Humanity overruning skynet. We move to a close up of John connor surveying the battlefield and he is moving and acting JUST LIKE A TERMINATOR. When I saw that I thought thats what T2 would be about. John Connor actually dying and a terminator programmed to BE john connor taking his place. If you don't believe me go rewatch the very beginning of T2 and tell me you don't see that.
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That is the dumbest fucking thing I have ever heard. They should do it where they take John Connors skin and organs and put em in a robot and call him RoboCop 9000. Then after the New Trilogy they can make RoboCop vs. Terminator.
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Pants.
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That's the best industry shockwave story we've had in a looong time.
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1)HKiller<P>2)gingerella <P>Expect more.
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Is this a joke?
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You're absolutely on the money KillaKane. Terminator is about John Connor. John Connor, not Marcus: Man of Steel. I don't give a fuck how compelling this new creation may be, Marcus is not the character we have followed and are invested in. Killing Connor and replacing him with a character who has to assume the ROLE of John Connor is just a twist for twist's sake and nowhere near as interesting as John himself. A man struggling to live up the legend he has been told he will be his entire life; a man who fights alongside his eventual father but must keep the truth from him. This is interesting material to explore, the tv show gets that and they've at least played with this stuff as much as they could. But these filmmakers are going to abandon all that in favor of a shock? You're going to tell me the John Connor who sends back Reese isn't actually John Connor, but a robot imitation? If there is any moment we have been waiting to see since the first movie it's that one. Pardoxes aside, John Connor sending his father to what he knows will be his death so that he can be born is the moment that brings everything full circle. And now that's going to occur on screen in this trilogy (if it even does) with a robot imposter in Connor's stead? What kind of bullshit is that. Guess I'll just keep watching the tv show and hope for more future war flashback episodes if I want anything approaching satisfaction.
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I don't give a fuck about whether Moriarty still likes the Terminator franchise or not. I don't care whether he wants them to stop or whether he thinks this is a good idea or not. WHAT I DO CARE ABOUT IS SPOILING A POSSIBLE TWIST. Why wouldn't a 'crazy-ass rumor' about a possible end of the movie be marked spoiler to being with. I would've stayed away, and then not had the (possible) ending ruined for me. It's just common sense. For shame, Moriarty.
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Imagine that if you will.. So the people that are asking what is wrong with this stupid rumour... well that is the equivalent.
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Photosynthesise much?
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Truthfully, anyone who thinks this is a good idea is just kidding themselves. I might enjoy it depending on how it plays out, but I doubt it. I won't watch THE SARAH CONNOR CHRONICLES for the same reason (just like I won't watch ABC's absolute deconstruction of one of the greatest BBC series ever, LIFE ON MARS...DAMN YOU CLEAR CHANNEL!!!...ahem...) Anyway, I loathe, and I mean loathe, the way Hollywood keeps trying to recapture "lightning in a bottle" (almost as much as I hate that phrase.) It can't be done. I enjoyed INDY IV, but it wasn't the same. THE OMEN blew. TRANSFORMERS wasn't like watching TRANSFORMERS at all no matter what people tell themselves. HALLOWEEN was competent as a piece of film, but utterly unnecessary, and suffered from the self-indulgence that comes from the unnecessary. And, of course, no one needs to mention the debacle of the "Holy Trilogy." Those things were great the way they were sans remakes and sequels, and prequels,and TV or movie adaptations. The reason they were great was their originality and their freshness. I don't want to see a remake of WHEN A STRANGER CALLS. I want to see THE STRANGERS! I don't want to see SUPERMAN RETURNS--and repeats everything he said when he was around the first time.--I want to see IRON MAN. I don't want to see a HIGHLANDER redux, or a TV show, or a sequel. I just want them to let the damn MacLeods die already! They've had enough. How many lifetimes and plotholes can one Scottsman take? Who wants to suck forever? Well, that's my take anywho.
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changing skins like you'd change the skin on your mp3 player. Just kinda dumb. And really, what's the advantage of having a cyborg that looks like John Connor UNLESS you're the bad guy, and you're using it to infiltrate a core resistance who aren't aware John is dead (and therefore buy the deception)?
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Unlike you, I actually saw SPEED RACER (aka CHIMP-THE MOVIE), and judged it accordingly. I loved it! It didn't matter that it bombed, because I loved it, and so did everyone (or most everyone) nwho actually bothered to see it. You, on the other hand, hated it even though you never saw it! how is that possible?<br><br> Oh, and rest assured, unlike you, I do have a girlfriend, do very well with the ladies, and am not, like you, a morbidly obese virgin who lives in his mothers basement and jerks off to T2: WE WUV WOO ROBODADDY nightly.
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I don't mind the idea of John Connor being replaced by a terminator double. Infact, I'm suprised Skynet didn't trying and create doubles of him in order to discredit him. As for the skin swap idea, I don't think that would actually be how it would occur. It'd more likely be they program a computer to produce a terminator version of John in a lab. Handled right, this could be a sci-fi version of El-Cid. Shame they're wanting to do it in part one, not part three.
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The advantage is you keep your figurehead. It's a moral thing.
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Are you seriously asking me to belive that because John Conner had a grim expression on his face as he coldly surveyed the battlefield he was a Terminator all along and this is what Cameron intended?!!! In other words this news isn't a spoiler at all!!! It's been there since T2, we just all missed it.
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You didn't miss much with Sarah Connor Chronicles. I reckon theres no more than 10 minutes of Terminator and SFX through out the whole season. Low budget bargain dvd crap. Lena Heady was the only good thing there.
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It just can't. Its just too stupid even for Hollywood.
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They could just fabricate a T1 with Connor's resemblance. This makes NO sense. Way to honor your fallen leader - cut his face off and put it on his enemy. Quit the Red Bull Hollywood. Christ.
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As soon as RoboConnor arrives the dogs would be barking!!! Does McG even know canon? Christ, these people are morons.
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fuck his own mother, and become his own father.
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Discuss.
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That may represent a minority opinion, but at least its a valid one based on actually viewing the movie. See, I was a big fan of T1, and was really excited for T2. Then, it came out and I was shocked at how awful it was, how insipid, how unintentionally hilarious. Geeks, by and large, worship at the altar because of the massive hype campaign that surrounded it. Have you watched it recently? It really doesn't hold up, and is really, really awful. T3 was much more fun, exciting, and funny than T2. And it managed to have a darker ending! T2 was shit that you all loved because the advertisements told you to love it. I mean Guns N's Roses? Is there anything more uncool than Guns N' Roses? They are the very definition of posuer bullsh*t hair "rock". <br><br>Cameron made two good movies -- T1 and ALIENS -- everything else he did was shit. Straight up shit.
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T2 does not hold up as well as T1. It's not a bad movie, but it's not a timeless classic. <p> My fave movie of Cameron's though, is Titanic. I know why people hate it, but I really love that movie.
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You said you've watched everything Terminator. So what's your opinion of the Universal Studios attraction? Written and directed by Cameron, staring Arnold, Linda Hamilton, Edward Furlong. What do you think?
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June 3, 2008, 9:04 a.m. CST
Better idea: he gets horrible injuries repared with cyborg parts
by BenBraddock
That'd be cooler! Think of it, the only way to save his life after he gets half disintegrated is to cannbalise a defunct terminator that the resistance have kicking around. Jojn Connor is half-human half-robot! Or is that too Robocop?
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Claire Danes and Terminator do not go together. At all.
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Yuck. Cameron's worst, by a long fucking way. <P>I've got a soft spot for the Abyss personally, but it will never top Aliens or T1. <P>T2 is good, but not classic.
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Is this what happened to Speilberg and Lucas?<p>Oh, and "No sir. I don't like it."
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Will this Connor be the Connor in T1 currently fighting the war -or- will it be the updated COnnor now with childhood memories of a terminator helping him. Before the time travel thing there was a Connor doing his thing with no memory of a terminator in his personal life. Or did I just rip a hole in the space-time continuum.
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I know I bash the hell out of it, perhaps I'm too severe, but, T2 is emphatically NOT a classic movie. Its mediocre at best.
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None of you have even seen the movie yet but you've already tagged and bagged it. What a crowd of miserable childish aresholes. Moriarty included. You should know better than to pan a movie that hasn't even been made yet, as a 'staff writer' for this webshite, you hysterical goon. </P> <P> As for all of you Beavis and Buttheads who are using such articulate responses as "dude that is so retarded"..... think about this: If the internet has existed back in 1982, you lot probably would have been reading a rumour about Darth Vader turning out to be Luke Skywalker's father, and you would have been typing things like "How can they make Darth Vader the father of Luke? That is so fucking retarded man!"
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but that ending sounds absolutely ridiculous, and insulting. Call me a turncoat, but I seriously consider not seeing it now. Looks like they went for the cheap shock ending, lame twist that'll alienate most fans. Shame. <p> On the onther hand, most of my faith in this project came from the enthusiastic script review on CHUD. Why this garbage ending turned Devin on is beyond me.
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IT DOESN"T MAKE ANY SENSE GOD DAMMIT!!! THEY WOULD KNOW HE"S A TERMINATOR. THIS SHIT IS GOING TO SUCK
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Listen, go watch t2 again, watch John Connor (adult) at the beginning. Watch out Cameron has Arnold and patrick act and move and look. John Connor the adult acts EXACTLY like arnold and robert patrick do. I don't like the idea myself, but I'm just sayin it may not stray to far from Camerons canon.
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--I can forgive that you like Speed Racer. (I didn't see it. So, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.) I can accept that you and your inner circle didn't like T2. Most people I know liked it, though, including me. Still, I never could get past how atrocious Eddie Furlong was in that flick. I can even deal with the idea that you enjoyed T3. Despite all my problems with it (even the logistical ones--like the garish, yellow color palette) I enjoyed watching the merciless slaughter near the end of it. But ripping on G n'R goes too far. Posers? Uncool? Either you're confusing with them Poison or you are sans any true musical taste, Boyo. I can't even imagine what you listen to. My tastes vary from late 60's to early 70's rock, Motown, Funk, 80's Pop, "HAIRBANDS", Grunge, Alternative, etc. And one thing I can tell you is that Guns and Roses changed the face of the metal scene. It was the logical step from Glam/Pop metal to Nirvana. Without them, along with the Metallica "Black" Album, we wouldn't have had the Seattle scene because the general listening audience wouldn't have been ready for them.--BTW, I'm married, and do EXTREMELY WELL with women. (I won't say "the ladies" because I prefer not to sound like Larry from "Three's Company.")
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T-X? Gold! Resizable roboboobs? Gold! Gigantic Truck Smash Up Part? Gold! Skynet freakout? Gold! Darker ending? Gold! Protracted domestic abuse-y, nearly grindhouse/exploitation level bathroom fight between DER AHHHHRNULD and incredibly hot Kristina Loken? FRIED FUCKIN' GOLD! <br><br> What, on the other hand, does T2 have? Whiny dipshit John Connor, ending taken right from Old Yeller, terrible butch-lesbo method acting from Sarah Connor, unintentionally hilarious dialogue from all involved and laughable level of barely pre-adolescent gravitas. A mediocre movie at best with some okay parts. How lucky that they managed to hijack a truck of liquid nitrogen! Yeah, cause every time I turn around I see a giant truck filled with liquid nitrogen is driving down the street. Btw, how come Early 90s CGI Man bothers to torture Sarah Connor into calling for her son when he can mimic her body and voice? A trick he pulls not more than 30 seconds later? DUMB.
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But not fake ass posuers like Guns n' Roses. In terms of metal, I like everything from Black Sabbath to Napalm Death. I also enjoy japanese avant noise bands like Boredoms, Melt Banana, and Merzbow. In addition, I like groups like Sonic Youth, Big Black, and Butthole Surfers (bands I was into in the 80s before people were even aware they existed) I even like girlie pop like Lily Allen! In terms of the 60s, most of it I have no time for, but I love Captain Beefheart, Frank Zappa, and Velvet Underground (the most important music of the decade came from them). Also, easily the best band of the 90s was My Bloody Valentine. Right now my fave group is probably Crystal Castles -- they strike the perfect balance between electro and noise in a way that is both accessible to the dance crowd and the noise crowd.<br><br> I like using words like "ladies" because its funny.
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<p>That is the single worst idea I've ever heard. Fuck McG, whatever idiot (or more likely ... idiots) came up with that idea and put it on paper and fuck the fools who gave this thing the greenlight!</p> <p>How fucking stupid do you have to be to think something like this is a good idea?</p>
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That Ending Should Be the begining of ACT 1 OF T4 NOT THE END
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I haven't seen T2 in a long time, but I watched T1 the other day and IMO it hasn't aged well. IMO Aliens still holds together (mostly) but it was never a favorite of mine. Abyss, True Lies and Titanic I never cared for. <p><p>Like a lot of people have already said, it would be nice if Hollywood would stop remaking/extending franchises and start doing more original stuff.<p><p>And if you are going to remake something, reboot LOST IN SPACE and do it right this time.
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I've seen LOTS of bad premises, but sorry, this is one isn't even in the same universe. Whoever came up with the idea should be boiled alive, tarred and feathered and then shot into the sun! ALong with whoever green-lighted it. We're fucked!
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is the point that new episodes in an established franchise should stick to canon. I agree with that. If you're gonna make a new movie in any established series, you have to NOT contradict the backstory, unless it is to introduce a clever twist. </P> <P> I would argue that Lucas' introduction of 'midichlorians' in the prequels was a good example of how to kill a perfectly lovely piece of mythology in your previously-established universe.
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June 3, 2008, 9:31 a.m. CST
Devin calls this the "Lukes father of T4" but I'm glad you spoil
by Oski
Because it is fucking stupid. Terminator isn't about "what it means to be human" it isn't I Robot, etc.
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...but 17 years later it's T1 that's the better movie. T1 has a rougher, darker edge to it whereas T2 is a bit too slick and shiny.
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Discuss.
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even though he liked that piece of shit matrix sequel, and also like Transformers, he's still a pretty good writer, its just his taste in movies goes all crazy and he needs to be slapped around a little.
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Let's go apocalyptic! Let's get nuts!
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Dance battle!
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I really hope that rumor proves false.
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Let me ask you a question, point blank: do you really give a shit about adult John Connor? Like, at all? Is he a character you're invested in? Does he define the franchise for you? Seriously, what's the point of the vitriol? I see some problems with it, but honestly, the "future war" is hardly sacred ground. I'd be more pissed with a flat-out remake of the original Terminator. This I'm just "eh" on and I fail to see the point of getting worked up about it.
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That the next project from the director of Piranha 2 was a sci-fi movie about a robot who came from the future to kill the mother of the future leader of the human resistance of a war between men and machines, I would have laughed. I prefer to wait until seeing this in proper context before passing judgment.
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...I actually DID see CHIMP-THE MOVIE. So, since I had to sit through that steaming pile of ape shit, I'm kind of a veteran now.<p>It's really hilarious that you always manage to make yourself even more pathetic than you already are. Now you start bitching about Guns'n'Roses. And you love the resizable T-X boobs? Well, congratulations! You've just reached a new low.<p>Now, I want to point out some of the great and brilliant scenes which make T2 so genius:<p>opening future war battle sequence<p>title credits<p>Arnold's bar introduction<p>T-1000 introduction<p>galeria fight and shootout<p>truck vs. motobike chase<p>T-1000 infiltration of Pescadero state hospital<p>escape scenes from that hospital<p>Cyberdyne shootout<p>bike vs. helicopter and truck vs. helicopter action sequences<p>overall cinematography<p>editing<p>score<p>achievement in special effects<p> I could go on forever. Granted, even a masterpiece as T2 isn't free from flaws. But it's full of stunning things and simply and action masterpiece. So, FUCK YOU, LaserPants and thanks for listening.
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..all I wish is they hired a different director, BUT since they're making the movie anyway, um I don't know--about this story, um.. let me think.. you know, I'm confused right now--Gimme 5 minutes and I'll come back
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1. McG 2. the name "terminator salvation" 3.Rapper casted 4.PG13 5. John connor not the focus, but Marcus 6. Connor skin on robot am i missing something?
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I think he usually has good points to make and he expresses himself in a manner that is both understandable and enjoyable. Plus, if you are familiar with his work, you'll know that he's an accomplished screenwrtiter, not to mention the fact that he's one of the driving forces behind this very site. Why bite the hand that feeds you (information)? I really don't get it. People like the obnoxious talkbacker are why I stay the hell away from XBox live...
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Do you know from your source if this is from the script drafts from a few months ago? Devin said that they have reworked a lot of the script since then, so it's possible that things have changed. Otherwise we're fucked.
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Meaning, the movie no one wants to see getting done
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If you're going to fuck a once-great franchise into the ground, THERE'S your motherfucker. Get Lucas to gizzard-rape that franchise into the twitching, cadaverous carcass it so obviously will become. Or already is, depending on what you think of everything post-T2.
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I'm right there with ya, buddy - TEMRINATOR is by far the superios movie - leaner, better performances, much better story (except the stupid paradox/babydaddy thing) and much more menacing. T2 was a Terminator film for girls - flashy, lots of explosions, rilly rily cute Eddie Furlong - except that he was, in fact, a whiny bitch way before Anakin Skywhinger was a twinkle in Uncle Lucas' gizzard - and was, in every way except for the SFX, the inferior film to its predecessor. Sarah was too OTT hard. Furlong whinged all the way through it. His friend was a bitch. Robert Patrick gets a free pass because he's the best performance in the movie. BECAUSE HE'S A FUCKING ROBOT!<P> I have no idea how many times I've defended T1 over T2 with my mates. They all think T2>T1. It's just not true. And for anyone who loved T2 but HATED T3 - hey, you got the nuclear holocaust dream sequence in T2, right? Enjoyed the hell out of it? Well, you got to see the proper Judgment Day at the end of T3. WHY the fuck was that a bad thing?<P> And anyone who didn't like Loken as the T-X... You must be gay. Or female. Or blind. Loken is teh sexiest beanpole hotness. With ROBOBOOBS!!!
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sorry for the foul language, but it had to be said.
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We gots to agree to disagree there. Wembley, England, USE YOUR ILLUSION tour, 1992. Still the greatest gig I have ever experienced - Soundgarden, Faith No More, then GUNS N ROSES, with Brian May joining them for an impromptu jam. Fucking awesome.
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Got to agree to differ- T3 was shit with a good ending. <P>T1 is comfortably the best. <P>And GnR Were of their time. Criticising them now is like ripping on any other movie that uses contemporary music 20 years later. Pointless.
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June 3, 2008, 10:57 a.m. CST
This kills the thematic premise of Cameron's films
by seniorspeilbergio
IMO the first 2 films (and even the lackluster third) were about the tenacity and persistence of humanity to never give up and eventually triumph over their own methodical and calculated extermination by cold, relentless machine intelligences. To me it was always about these machines' vast resources and superior intelligence still being no match for the independent thinking and indomitable spirit of the human soul. Even though he's basically knocked back down to the social level of the cockaroach, mankind just will not lie down and give up. It IS a modern farie tale, told in a very straightforward fashion with the John Connor character as the central archetype of everything I've mentioned. To make him a cyborg takes away from the HUMAN victory and detracts, rather then adds, to the legend of this character established in the first two films (fuck T3. It sucked and wasn't cannon). I see what some people are getting at about his terminator-like movements in the T2 prologue but to me this just meant that he thought like his enemy in order to defeat him (just like Sun Tzu wrote) and in so became slightly "Terminator" in his soul which is a lot more interesting than literally making him a terminator. This I think, was meant to be a parallel to Sarah Conner's character arc in T2 where she basically becomes the Terminator in a psychological sense, in order to kill Dyson. That is until John brings her back. The idea that John "looses" his humanity in order to save it is a nice ironic twist and informs the naive attitude of the 14 year old Connor in that film. What would be more interesting is if he turns into a tyranical dictator after the machines are defeated and they have to reactivate a terminator yet again in order to end his destructive reign. Once again a cyborg is sent to kill John Connor but this time it's for a good reason. But all of this is just hyperbole and mute. This is nothing more than a geekboy money grab by hollywood with a second unnecessary sequel to a time travel story that exists in a paradoxical time loop. I guess these guys never saw any Planet of the Apes sequel past Beneath.
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ok it wasnt terribly original or anything, but i have the biggest crush on Clair Danes!!
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Have you got tattoos of trucks on your arms and a backwards Limp Bizkit baseball cap on? I just sort of, picture you...
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agreed
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John and Kate survive Judgement Day by exiting a fridge
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Funniest shit I've seen in a while!!!
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The point is not that T1 > T2. The point is that Mr. Fuckface (aka LaserPants) says that T3 > T2.<p>Your comment?
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You can just rip off skin, mainly a face, and then just PUT IT ON someone else. Skin doesn't work that way.
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And good job as well. Leave it alone you cocksmears!
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i hearby grant T4 TOTAL FUCKING DESTRUCTION.
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Good thing I wasnt even giving the guy a chance otherwise I could have been really disappointed with this...but it sounds like the kinda crap Id expect from him...but Bale? This isnt a return to equilibrium and reign of fire kinda fare is it? I assumed he did those to get a foothold, but God knows maybe he occasionally just likes crap ideas
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ala The Andromeda Strain remake, because that improved the plot sooooo much.
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Because this film really deserves a dose of TOTAL FUCKING DESTRUCTION- and he just gave it a bad wedding pun.
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it enough to sign on for 3 movies he doesnt seem the type to go for the money not when hes such a fantastic actor, he doesnt need to derail his momentum in a shit trilogy, besides this hate a fucking movie before its released is becoming a bit of bore with you lot
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I applaud you sir. <p> This is why I come to AICN. To read movie spoilers, rumors, etc. For those who don't like it- GTFO.
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I thought he was a great method actor who's filmography was getting better and better. I thought he knew better, but after signing on to this phony crap makes me wonder what the fuck he was thinking. Oh yeah.. $$$
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I can only assume that what the author of the story meant as an end to the franchise was that people probably wouldn't see another film of this after this ending, therefore stopping sequels. Because it seems to me they would be making other films with the terminator version of John connor. And maybe the ARnold in T3 killed the terminator John connor. I don't know and I don't really care. Also Josh Brolin is supposedly in this as well as Bale, so yes, either this is a bad decision for both or maybe there is something redeeming about this that we don't know.
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That's what they're for isn't it? And, honestly, I never feel as though any real contributers to this site talk down to anyone. Seems to me, it's pretty much all honest opinion, and I can respect that. Plus: It's their fucking site. The people in charge can do whatever the hell they want. If you don't like it, or feel slighted in some way, why the hell are you here? It's not like there aren't a million other places you could turn for entertainment information. Me, I like this one, and I'm stayin'.
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Not an inherently bad idea - JC the myth was always the point of all the Terminator movies, not necessarily the whiny man he is/was. As for cannon - doesn't the fact that all the movies feature time travel mean that a "new" timeline is created whenever someone travels back? The only concern I have about this movie is the PG-13 rating, but I'm still looking forward to it, and will judge it on it's own merits once I've actually seen it...
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I don't WANT to see some robo-dude walking around *pretending* he's JC! I wanna see the real deal - what's been the point of investing all this time in him if all he amounts to is a nice new suit for some metal dude? That said, it at least sounds like this movie's got more balls than T3.
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The first two Terminator movies were great action flicks--that's it. There was nothing profound story-wise. Aside from Cameron's gifts(for action, pacing, comedic-timing) as a director and use cutting-edge technology, there were no great, mind-bending ideas explored. I liked the third film and I like the idea for the fourth. I just hope it isn't wasted and they deliver a film in the tradition of its predecessors.
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We missed you.
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General Grievous. I know Grievous didn't have the skin, but the organs and brain, etc...
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<p>So they're saying Kyle Reese was befriended and sent back by a terminator with John Connors skin covering it? Count me out.</p><p>I bet that they felt like they had to work in the whole stupid "death of john connor" thing from T3. This is what I was afraid of when they said they were referencing all three movies. Why couldn't they have just forgot T3 and made a true prequel to the first one? Who the hell watches T1 and thinks this up.</p>
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I just learned Robert Patrick has appeared in every one of McG's movies. I PRAY that it's a tradition that continues into this movie - me likey some T-1000 (even if he looks suspiciously older).
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Now the movie is totally ruined you douche. Nah, I kid. The ending itself would already be spoiled in a different way, by its pure shitness.
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Robert Patrick could play whoever they modeled the T1000 on, only they took the blue print years before, then he escaped them somehow. Sounds as shit as the spoiler above but I wouldn't put it past them to shoe horn him in somehow.
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not mute. I've been up since 5 am, so sue me. And what's wrong with Connor becoming a tyrant after the war? You're telling me he wouldn't have a problem stepping down and wouldn't put everyone in some sort of extreme situation "for the good of humanity"? This doesn't sound believable, really? Check your history. It's happened before. Dictators always start out with the best of intentions. Hitler didn't wake up one day and say, "Hey, I think I'll be an evil asshole today". And the second film was always about transposing the conventions of the first, hence the "bad" terminator becomes the "good" terminator; so why not killing Connor becomes the right thing to do? It's better than Connor the meat puppet.
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it's just a good movie. and hype is the stupidest excuse ever. i was a kid when it came out and i could care less about commercials or any hype, i just watched the movie and loved it and you can watch it now and be entertained. Laserpants, everyone you know must be a cunt.
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He typically chooses roles where characters are one thing on the outside and another on the inside. This time literally. American Psycho -- he was a yuppy on the outside, serial killer on the inside. Equilibrium -- he was Cleric on the outside, resistance fighter on the inside. Batman Begins -- Bruce Wayne outside, Batman inside. So the idea of Bale having to play a terminator pretending to be human doesn't seem so far off.
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It's a good show that built up nicely. It's certainly leagues better than T3, and frankly, I never thought T2 was all that. It's OK, but it relies so heavily on the gimmick of the year (CGI) that it looks stupid when you go back and watch it today. Add to that Eddie Furlong's histrionics, and a pretty straightforward plot that gets bogged down in chase scenes (the whole movie is a chase scene, actually) and it's not the piece of genius everyone says it is. <p> I much prefer the first one. It's a HORROR movie, not a slam-bang action chase flick. <p> Actually, the same can be said for "Alien" versus "Aliens" -- I prefer the first one because it's a moody horror flick, and I dislike "Aliens" because it's just a lot of shouting and shooting with little else to redeem it. Sure, it's badass, but it sacrificed every ounce of tension and horror for the switch in theme. <p> But I understand why those two sequels are considered holy by a lot of geekdom. You guys were younger (or not born) when "Terminator" and "Alien" were released (with hard "R" ratings) and you probably saw the sequels in theaters when you were young, but saw the originals for the first time on TBS, or on VHS, or some other crippled format that made it seem less theatrical. Plus, you knew Sarah/Ripley would survive, so there was no tension. <p> I wish they'd get back to treating these movies like the horror films they started out as, and not as the cheesy 80's action flicks they turned into.
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This Marcus character worries me. I just don't like any of this... Also the pg-13 just makes it impossible for the movie to have epic battle scenes so fuck it! I have a theory that McG did something to Bale's family to make him do this movie! We must save Bale!
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but that doesn't make it Moriarty's fault. He didn't say he was going to tell us about the set design. He said he was telling us about a rumored ending. So why read it if you don't want to be spoiled? They must be having a big ol' fat fit over at McG headquarters though. When I read it, I did think it was the ending. It made sense, like it or not.
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Actual human skin slipped onto a metal endoskeleton would eventually rot and decay without being attached to nerve endings and whatnot, right? Unless "John Connor that isn't John Connnor" is supposed to look like a fucking zombie...
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What would make more sense would be John Connor getting mortally wounded and then having no choice but to become a cyborg putting his brain inside of a T-800. A real one with Arnold's face. So the story comes funn circle. John Connor IS the Terminator. They could have done that with the third movie. Oh well.
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nice use of a Friends quote there with the moo thing, made me laugh outloud.
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Is where it should have ended. I enjoyed T3, but it wasn't a necessary movie, it really didn't add to the story it was just an excuse to make another Terminator movie. Some things are better left alone, but that's Hollywood for you, milk every dime out of a product until it lays there bleeding and no one care about it anymore. I'm sure I will go see T4 in the hopes that it wont be as bad as it is shaping up to be, I never try to pass judgement on anything before I see it, but it ain't looking good so far.
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I have no idea if he's in the first CA movie, and haven't seen either of them so why it wouldn't make sense for him to appear in the first one is lost on me. I'm just repeating what I read in some interview with McG, the one where he was talking about 'Josh Brolin types'.
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The whole idea of the movie is stupid and obnoxious but if you have to make a sequel to these movies (and these suits would rather do that then pick up that original story they have sitting on there shelves that's better than anything they've made in the last decade) I don't think you can avoid the dark thing with this universe. The future in Terminator is pretty damn dark. But, I think maybe you misunderstood me. I don't think Connor should literally be a Terminator like they're proposing in this script but mentally become one by the time the war is won, like his mother did in T2. There's an existing basis for this in the already established film cannon is all I'm saying. I can see this guy wanting to reshape humanity in his own image, since they have to start again from square one anyway. But in the end I agree with one of the other TB's who said he would rather see one of the many good sci-fi novels turned into a movie rather than another one of these fucking things. I'd rather see Revelation Space than Terminator 4 any day of the week.
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The sequel.
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..and expect to be taken seriously?
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Are they going to fuck up Terminator now? They already fucked up Aliens, Predator and Star Wars (which is slavagable still). PLEASE don't screw up this franchise too. I can only pray that they don't make Ghostbusters 3 at this point.
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i must be dreaming. this sounds horrible...
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It's more interesting than just a trilogy of us-against-them war movies with humans and robots. John Connor leading humans against machines is one movie, at best. But, if they do this, they could conceivably take the fight into a future even more distant than what we've already seen. There's no guarantee that they can pull it off, but the potential is there to do something really fresh and imaginative.
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Thank you for your condemnation of this soon-to-be crapfest
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June 3, 2008, 12:51 p.m. CST
So, John Connor was led to believe that HE will save mankind...
by Mike_D
..but in fact, he doesnt? Its a cyborg wearing his skin?! WTF?!
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he better be in the third one. That guy was the best replacement for a series lead I've ever seen. Reyes was a drag though. They could at least mention what happened to him if nothing else.
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....and I actually dont mind this idea at all.
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...at least with a loose reference during that scene in the RV when Terminator tells John that he ends up killing him. I forget the specific details but it has something to do with John preferring that from the Terminator because of his boyhood experience with the robot.
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June 3, 2008, 1:07 p.m. CST
We all know that he dies, but a robot wears his skin to replace
by Mike_D
thats a bit...i dont know...i wonder if he will fuck john's wife.
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I erased it from my memory. Although Nick Stahl was okay.
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June 3, 2008, 1:09 p.m. CST
"sorry john, you dont actually save mankind. a fake you does."
by Mike_D
sorry to mislead you for the past..well, since you were born.
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...so they can take his skin and put it on a robot?!
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"Do I look like I'm negotiating?" <p> *Unloads 900 rounds into Tilda Swinton*
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June 3, 2008, 1:15 p.m. CST
And then, he tries the time travel thing: ends up on Kobol
by chromedome
and is the Original Cylon<p>This does open the door for an explanation about how Cameron (Summer Glau) has a special relationship with John in the TV series: she was his girlfriend/wife, and then got skinned and stretched over a robot frame.<p>And it is also Stooooopid. Seems like they are going for an opening to endlessly sequel this thing: he does die, but sort of not really......
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The perfect name for a corporate hack. It's almost like he planned it.
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Those sly devils. [rolls eyes]
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what's with this new trend of stretching franchises to the breaking point by having a tv show and a movie out at the same time that are completely unrelated to each other thereby confusing the audience more. First Superman then this. And the funny part is, tv show or movie, none of it is really any good.
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and this movie is good to go!
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There goes another one. Damn.
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That, plus a happy-fucking-ending, would make it the total test-audience pleaser!!!
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Or a few fart jokes, test-audiences love that too.
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Two exceptions: 12 MONKEYS and SLAUGHTERHOUSE 5. (And SLAUGHTERHOUSE 5 was more about being unstuck in time. Pool Billy.)
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Throw in a couple of gophers too.
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Damn you no-editor-ability talkback board! And you-know-who.
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June 3, 2008, 1:45 p.m. CST
I really hope nobody thinks that I was attacking Mori
by IndustryKiller!
Because it might seem that way if you just read his post, which was very good. The headline to my post above was actually a paraphrase from somebody elses post and I was actually defending Mori. Just wanted to clarify that.
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That got you looking at my post. In all seriousness. Whether this idea works or not, this pussyfying of the franchise is what bugs me the most and the motivation behind it, not in the sense that ohh we don't have to go R to tell a good story, but more "we want to reach a wider audience". Fuck you. Like I said it should be Saving Private Ryan set in a dystopian future. Warner I am available anytime, especially to direct Green Lantern, sorry but you need a guy with huge cock and balls to direct DC's manliest hero and not a homosexual pansy from brothers and sisters. It would be like some mysogynistic male directing Sex and the city, wouldn't that suck...for women?
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Moreso even than I am to young John Connor. Adult John Connor is sort of like the myth you were told about as a child and always seemed to bad ass and cool. I mean he single handedly leads the fight against a robot apocalypse. A ROBOT APOCALYPSE!!! It's common knowledge that robot apocalypses make zombie apocalypses look like their for pussies. And having John Connor die early on completely negates the first two films. I don't see how that can be argued. Kyle Reese doesn't come back and say "Your son dies but acts as a symbol for the robot that takes his place so we can fight the robots." No. John Connor fights the fucking robots. John Connor. Not some cloak and dagger replacement.
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Why are you being so mean to Moriarty?
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3:16
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it's just the way it is.
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100 000. That what you are in the US and online. Speed Racer opening week end. None of you represent the general moviegoer, let alone directors who can pull movies that put bums into seats. Praise the new Hollywood, let Cameron and all these old people retire, just like the 90's, let's live for LOBOTOMY !
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not even Back to the Future? in these days of mourning?
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12 MONKEYS, SLAUGHTERHOUSE 5, BACK TO THE FUTURE. I haven't seen IN THESE DAYS OF MOURNEY.<p><p> And this chair!
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That is what I consider all Terminator stories post T2. Bad fanfiction. I have a friend of mine who debated that both T3 and T:TSCC are as good if not better at T1 and T2 and I have to admitt this makes me question his sanity. If, he reads this and thinks it is cool, I will question if he is retarded or not. That is how bad this idea is. John Connor robot? Why can't we just have a series of movies chronicalling the march to Reese's trip to the past? IS THAT SO HARD!!!!! Sorry...didn't mean to roid out with nerd rage there its just that this franchise is very close to me and it upsets me to see how shitty it has become.
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We will miss you clocktower.
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Keep in mind, it's a time travel movie. They can always hit the re-do button.<p>In fact, if this turns out to be true, I guaran-damn-tee you they'll hit it.
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That was funny. It had an atom bomb and home appliances. But no fridge. Wow! It was better than Indy 4.<p><p>And it had a cool robot burried for centuries. Wow! It was better than Transformers!
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... not at all. I don't respond to people only because of attacks. You brought up some valid points, and I just happened to respond to several points in one big post to you. <P>And Krack... the only time I treat talkbackers with contempt is when they start it. I've said before that at its best, I love talkback. Go check out the current LOST talkback and see if it sounds like I have contempt for them. Or even re-read this one and tell me where I came out spewing bile at everyone here. Didn't happen, man.
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June 3, 2008, 2:37 p.m. CST
Terminator timeline has been "A Sound of Thunder"ized ridiculous
by riskebiz
If they want to make this storyline with Bale, who is to say it doesn't work? Connor has changed his history to the n'th degree that it's a wonder there aren't apes on horseback in this film.
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June 3, 2008, 2:41 p.m. CST
Doc, we better back up. We don't have enough road to get up to 8
by Flying Spaghetti Monster
Roads? Where we're going we don't need roads.
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some talkbackers here are too young to remember when there was no internet to spoil them and rip them to shreads....T2 was one amongst many...if u wanted to see the trailer u had to goto the movies, no clips online, no rumors to the level they are now ....in fact the trailer to T2 was horrible....all i can say is that sometimes i wish it was like it was back then, no rumors, spoilers, etc.... would be a much better world of movies i think....
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June 3, 2008, 2:47 p.m. CST
Oh he went that way. I think he took your wallet!
by Flying Spaghetti Monster
I think he took his wallet!
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Sounds a bit shit.
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What kinda skins is them? What's that writing mean? <p> "Nee-kay"? What is that, some sorta Injun talk or something?
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http://rss.warnerbros.com/ terminatorsalvation/ McG: "By the way, there are only three people who know the ending."
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is us.
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The series was fine as a power duo IMO. But was it any good? maybe I could check it out. I just couldn't understand how a normal robot could actually up the ante of the liquid steel (read:awesome!) terminator in T2. Like what could possibly top that?
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"By the way, there are only three people who know the ending. The unknown future rolls toward us. -McG"<p>WHy did people give CHUD credibility? I only believe it if it has merricks14yearoldson's approval.
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http://rss.warnerbros.com/terminatorsalvation/
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All of your critiques were based solely on the trailer, hence you decided to hate it without even seeing it. If you actually saw it, tell me about something that wasn't in the trailer that you didn't like. ANYTHING. You can't. Why? Because you NEVER SAW THE MOVIE.
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June 3, 2008, 4:10 p.m. CST
Yo we need to stop bullshitting and start Aint It Cool Films!
by Robo-Obi
For real yo, we all could just throw in 5 or ten bucks each to start a new studio that makes low budget kick ass films!
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June 3, 2008, 4:11 p.m. CST
Yo we need to stop bullshitting and start Aint It Cool Films!
by Robo-Obi
For real yo, we all could just throw in 5 or ten bucks each to start a new studio that makes low budget kick ass films!
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June 3, 2008, 4:11 p.m. CST
Saying "only three people know the ending" means nothing
by IndustryKiller!
it's bullshit anyway. THREE people know the ending? That would leave McG, the writer, and Christian Bale, who I hope to god wouldnt be naive enough to sign without seeing a whole script. So the producers don't know the ending? The studio doesn't know the ending?? Bullshit. The only proper response to this from McGs end would be "Of course that isn't the ending. John Connor is an iconic character and we would never disrespect that in such a way. The savior of humanity is John Connor, not some android." Oh also not casting Anton Yelchin as Kyle Reese would help.
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Respect the source. If you shit on the work of those who handed you the reigns (willingly or not) then fandom has every right to shit all over you. <p> Aliens? Respected the source. Good movie, it gets to be part of the series. <p>Alien 3? Shits all over everything Aliens established - Good movie, but as an Alien sequel it was shit and we should all just stop trying to convince ourselves otherwise. <p>Terminator 3? Shits all over Terminator 1 & 2 and was a crapfest to boot. <p> My point is, once a "franchise" produces an entry that shits all over its predecessors, we as the audience get to boot it from the series and ignore that it ever happened. No Alien 3 or 4. No Terminator 3 or beyond. No Highlander 2 or beyond. Etc.
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You have so much fucking pull in this world why aren't you crusading for more things!!!! Why the fuck aren't you going crazy on Warner Bros for not hiring Geoff Johns and Dave Gibbons on Green Lantern, Johns being the only human being in history to make Hal Jordan interesting, why aren'y you getting it through their heads that if they did it right with a visionary director and Geoff Johns they could have the next Star Wars. WHY!!! Why aren't you saying how ridiculous it is to get a gay guy who directed a gay guy romantic comedy who is the showrunner of a pansy show like brothers and sisters to direct DC's Manliest hero. FUCK!!! Why do i scream this in a scottish accent.
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What if I don't?
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June 3, 2008, 4:18 p.m. CST
"Beatles, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Caddyshack & Rolling Stones"
by LaserPants
1) Beatles -- Didn't get cool until they got weird. Best album? The WHITE ALBUM. A work of genius.<br><br> 2) Raiders of the Lost Ark -- Great throwback to 30s serials and a classic of modern american pop cinema. A film followed by 3 more or less terrible (and unnecessary) sequels featuring outstanding theme music and mediocre everything else.<br><br> 3) Caddyshack -- Of course its great. A comedy classic. <br><br> 4) Rolling Stones -- Their best albums were Let It Bleed, Beggars Banquet, and Exile on Mainstreet. More or less everything after these albums gets progressively worse until today in which they stand as a kind of grotesque mockery of a bygone age that seems less and less relevant as time marches inexorably onwards towards entropy. Love those 3 albums though. Classics.<br><br> But, riddle me this, how the fuck can any sane individual class Guns n' Posuers and T2: WE WUV WOO ROBODADDY as anywhere near as good as anything of the things mentioned above? You would have to be either a) addicted to model airplane glue, b) retarded, or c) very young and very dumb.
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Fuck what a classic line.
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Why the discussion? This movie is going to be a load of gash, end of. Okay, so it may not stink as much as, say, Batman & Robin, but if you think it'll be fit to rub shoulders with T1 and T2 then you're a fucking idiot who needs to regain a sense of perspective. Get out from your mother's basements, go outside, and get a girlfriend. You'll soon see I'm right. I have a girlfriend. And my parents like me. This means my opinion matters more than ALL OF YOU PUT TOGETHER! MUAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
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you make my misanthropy even more intense. seriously you must be a fucking boring cunt if you can't enjoy T2. And to say the indiana jones sequels are unnecessary is just indicative of someone who is a boring cunt. your girlfriend must be one too. Enjoy things man, have fun. By the way. The beatles suck.
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The Star Trek reboot....now THAT'S going to be a movie! Is it true the Kazon will be in it?
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June 3, 2008, 4:24 p.m. CST
I LOVE How Upset Motoko Gets When I Bust On T2: OLD YELLER
by LaserPants
Its like he physically feels pain from the attack. You do realize, Motoko, that the things you enjoy are separate entities from who you are, right? if you don't, then that means you are schizophrenic and should seek help. Or, you know, dream of the operation when you can magically transform from the pasty fat guy crying in his mom's basement to the ivory skinned female cyborg bad ass Motoko Kusanagi. Actaully, you'll still be fat and crying, just with lady parts.
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hello hello. King of the castle.
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Just not things that suck as hard as T2. For instance, I really love Green Lantern / Green Lantern Corps comics. Especially the whole Sinestro Corps War story. I understand you enjoy them too? I also enjoy fucking my girlfriend, drawing, writing, playing music, reading, and watching movies that don't suck. How about you? Do you enjoy things?
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June 3, 2008, 4:28 p.m. CST
Again. Star Wars and Back to the Future 2 = most quotable movies
by messi
ever. Seriously. Godfather is pretty famous but not to the small niche extent of back to the future part 2 and of course star wars.
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...THE BIG LEBOWSKI.
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and you know my feelings towards the greatest superhero story ever : SINESTRO CORPS WAR. But T2 is entertaining and you can watch it over and over again. Latest things I love from that movie, that shot following Conner in the future where all the soldiers salute him and that music playing at the same time. Amazing. And Arnold's snap reaction when he gets hit with the pool que. That's why it's a classic.
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That post was in reference to another post made above in which someone accused me of not liking things that are popular -- you know, like being contrarian? I'm not being contrarian, I just don't like things that suck.
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Nah i mean in a large cultural sense. I doubt people into sneakers would be quoting the big lebowski. but back to the future 2 yes.
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your jacket is now dry.
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Nonsense. There is no way that a studio greenlit a $180 million SF tentpole sequel without the marketing departments and every major exec and development folks all weighing in on every part of it, INCLUDING THE ENDING. Especially if it's a big giant twist that is supposed to "polarize" fans. <P>Again... this isn't personal. I liked the CHARLIE'S ANGELS films for what they were. Even when I wrote about MCSPACED, I wasn't attacking McG. I'm not hopping on some fanboy bandwagon to make fun of his name or attack him as the end of cinema. Far from it. I just don't see how this rumored plot point does anything BUT disrespect the central idea of the first two movies, which was that John Connor, a single, specific human being, had to survive in order to guarantee the survival of humanity as a whole.
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You also forgot Pulp Fiction
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Anybody who craps on The Beatles may as well just wear a big button that says "I HATE ROCK AND ROLL" so the rest of us can move on and talk to someone else who does.
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It's all about the man the myth the legend John Fucking Connor. Who cares what they said in T3. All fans of the first 2 films know the importance of this character. Fuck this spoiler.
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Why don't we wait to see the movie before saying its complete shit. You fucking nerds are uppity, man. Maybe I'm an eternal optimist, but come on.....you all act like McG killed your fathers and raped your mothers. Get a fucking grip.
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... the movie was shit. In fact, I never made any declarations about the quality of the film. I said two things. "This is not a film I'm interested in," and "This rumored plot point baffles me."
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The concept that the Marcus character is supposed to already be some sort of hybrid human, so he may not be completely AI, he may be chosen to be the new John COnnor because he is still human, He's just got a metal skeleton...wait a second, dear god, the main character of the new Terminator movies is Wolverine! Anyways, I've heard worse ideas, and the line of humanity within the terminators IS a constantly evolving idea. Now I hate McG as much as the next guy (McSpaced...shudders) but I'm not putting up a wall against the movie until I at least see a trailer. This isn't Cameron's vision anymore, and as much as that could potentially suck, there's always a glimmer of hope. I'm sure if they do see this idea through it will go through a great deal of reconstruction before being filmed. As I said, the rules of the Terminator mythology have never been set in stone, mostly because the only glimpses of the future we get are through biased eyes (Reese, T800) and once we get an entire movie dedicated to the war, there will probably be a whole new set of rules we never considered before. Like if it were the future and machines weere winning against regular humans, of course they would start using the machine's tech against them, that includes (for alack of a better word) Bionics. Just remember that the descriptions we're getting so far is that Marcus is at least mostly human, so we can't rule out the possibility that this might work. Oh and PS. Everyone bashing Christian Bale should calm down a bit, to consider him a bad actor in any respect is a wholly ignorant statement. I've never seen him in a movie were I thought, "Wow, this guy sucks!" I think you fellas just have such a hate-on for anything happening with this new project, that you'll shoot at everything that moves, and your shots are getting sloppy. It's a movie, calm down. If you don't like it, rewatch the first two and stay away from opening night.
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in the way you did Mori. I like you. When we met in person, you seemed like a swell guy. For a while we chatted on IM periodically. I have no qualms with you. It's just that posting this story without a spoiler tag, and to me from the first time I read it it seemed too detailed to be total hogwash...it was poor form. There's no real news value to it if it's wrong and if it's right...it's not news, it's just a spoiler.
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It was cool when Captain Beefheart and Zappa made fun of them. It was NOT cool when wacked out ultra right wing christians bashed them after Lennon said they were "more popular than Jesus", which was and is true -- the Beatles are more popular than Jesus. Also, unlike Jesus, we actually have proof that the Beatles existed.<br><br> As for me, I like the Beatles. Don't love em, but they definitely have written and recorded some amazing songs. More on topic, even the worst of the Beatles songs looks like pure genius compared to the catastrophic 'meh' of the waaaaaaaaaaay overrated T2: WE WUV WOO ROBODADDY.
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Take it in stride man, you don't live in your dad's basement, so you already have a one up on like 80% of these militant movie buffs. You reported on film news on a film news site, Dear god man, how could you do such a thing to us
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June 3, 2008, 5:03 p.m. CST
Moriarity, for as many times as you say it's not about you...
by haiku tunnel
you provide as many explanations and platitudes about why anything remotely related to a Terminator news tidbit orbits around you. This isn't an attack - you are a working writer in film, you are an excellent reviewer and I always can count on your taste when assessing whether to see a new movie or not. <br> But for fuck's sake already, you don't need to tell us about your personal Terminator viewing history. You don't need to take Talkbacker bait every single time. Just let it go. It's your continuous trudging through the muck on this site that will prevent you from being taken seriously. Just post your reviews and then shut the fuck up, believe me, it will serve you well.
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Chill out people. this site is all about knowing what the staff think. thats the damn point. people who dont just take movies seriously, but also personally. and its for people who do the same. you've heard a rumor thats turned out to be probably true... if a friend had told you this as a rumour, and then a year later when you see the film, would you hunt him down to insult him because he turned out to be right?
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He'd rip through us like we were tin foil.
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DO NOT WANT
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Let's give 'em back their heroes Max!
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June 3, 2008, 5:21 p.m. CST
Sarah Connor became "iconic" in T2; John Connor never did.
by Mosquito March
The only iconic characters in the Terminator series are the T-800, T-1000, Sarah Connor (in T2) - and on a good day, maybe Kyle Reese. John Connor never made it to icon status. In T1, he only exists in dialogue given to us by Reese, and in T2, he's a squeaky-voiced little kid, and a single shot of a middle-aged actor with a scarred face who we will never see again. In T3, he's a serviceable protagonist played well enough by Nick Stahl, but still unconvincing as the major bad ass we've been told he will become, and played by yet another actor we will never see in the role again. Essentially, all of the good will people have toward the character of John Connor is because of dialogue spoken about him by other characters long before we ever see him do anything he's noted for. As a result, Future John is not a sacrosanct, "iconic" character until we actually SEE HIM ON FILM DOING SOMETHING COOL. Unfortunately, he's been spoken of about as much as people spoke wistfully about the Jedis and the Old Republic in the OT, and like those concepts, the Connor we get will likely never, ever live up to the expectations fans have had for 25 years. But, in truth, there's really no truly iconic depiction of John Connor anyway, so I really couldn't care less if they throw in a twist like this one; he's just a cipher, anyway. I just want them to tell me a good Terminator story. And, I like the idea of Bale playing a Terminator playing a leader of humans. It would be boring if all John Connor had to do was play everything out the way we've been told that it plays out in the past. There's no inherent drama in "Human John Connor leads the rest of the human rebels to victory over the machines - the end." This premise means the character(s) Bale plays might actually have some depth and some genuine conflict, instead of just, "rah, rah, kill the motherfucking machines".
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And John Connor is actually a likable, troubled, interesting, engaging character in T3. Claire Danes was kinda... whatever, but Loken more than makes up for her semi-lameness by bringing the hardcore campy fetish value. Admittedly, its trashy, but it was FUN (and funny... on purpose!) and cool and featured great action set pieces. T2 was also trashy, but joylessly so, and so overwrought, but in such an inept way, that most of it comes off as pathetic and laughable; worse of all corny and maudlin.
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jumping the gun a bit aren't we, would everyone just take a fucking pill until we at least see one frame of footage. Mosquito March is right, the name John Connor is 10 times more important than any ideation of the character we've seen so far.
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I saw the first Terminator in the theater and afterwards discussed the plot with my friends. I asked them how can John Connor exist in the future (the original timeline)if he hadn't sent back Reese yet? Reese is the soldier sent to protect Sarah Connor & revealed to be father of John Connor. So again, how could John Connor send his father back in time, when he couldn't have even been born yet? And please no crap about having a different father, & then having a Reese as his father in the new timeline after the trip back in time.
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T2 messed things up. T3 even further. Ditto the TV series. So what does it matter if John Connor is killed at the end of T4, and then turned into a terminator? They can (and probably will) re-do, contradict and/or reboot events in T5.
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I can't explain it either.
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Because, if enough people get high before all these sequels/prequels, we (they) will not really care about what was established prior to the film they are watching, since they will not be able to have a good short-term memory.<br><br>Wait, some people enjoy T3 more than T2?
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Its a paradox, thats the point. thats what makes him so important, and you almost end up in Matrix levels of complexity about who John Connor actually is, and how he seems to be born of war itself. You could make a good argument for Terminator being a futurist bible story. John Is born of the evil he is destined to defeat. Without War there would be no purpose for a Saviour.
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June 3, 2008, 5:45 p.m. CST
Anyone justifying this simply is not fucking listening
by IndustryKiller!
It negates the first two films. FACT. That isn't an arguable point. The whole point is to keep John Connor alive so he can save humanity. John Connor, not someone else. You can say that you don't mind that it negates the entire purpose of the first two films, but it doesn't mean it doesn't negate the first two films. hell it even negates the third film, but really who cares about that?
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...I think I would just chuckle a WTF?, shrug soon afterwards, and forget about it (along with the rest of the movie) the next day. As somebody else above pointed out, the continuity of this series is so screwy that there's very little emotional impact left for the audience to feel or to be surprised by.
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...in the sense that there was never any way to avert Judgement Day. All paradoxes aside, T3 acknowledged that major fundamental problem and gave us the Judgement Day that was inevitable. T2 wanted us to go on believing all that fairytale "the future is not set" horseshit that Cameron was feeding us since the first movie, even though the fucking robots can't exist if Judgement Day doesn't happen. Cameron never really thought that deeply about his time travel story in the first place, and T3, however people feel about it in the end, was a measure of damage control, done to keep a profitable franchise alive.
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That's becoming something of a habit with you. It doesn't matter one fucking bit if we haven't seen John Connor the adult fighting machines. We are told firsthand the reality of the situation and shown glimpses of it. And unless kyle Reese is lying or a patsy, that's the way it has to be done. What you're saying is that just because we never saw young Anakin Skywalker in the OT that it's ok he was portrayed as a sniveling, obnoxious bitch who never displays one iota of the power we are told he is supposed to have. And I fail to see how making John Connor someone else pretending to be John Connor automatically give him more depth. That dog just won't hunt. And if anyone could deliver in spades the John Connor we've always wanted to see it's Christian Bale, that is of course unless he isn't John Connor, that's just a novelty ruse.
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the robots start their own revolution via the robot they sent back in time. Which is an even crazier time paradox than anything Cameron came up with. But since you're a metaphysics expert I suppose you know this already.
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It's not a FACT that the John Connor that sends Kyle Reese and the T-800 back in time is human - it's a theory you're basing on a character's recollection. Kyle Reese was just a soldier. There's no reason to assume that Kyle Reese would have known whether he was taking orders from John Connor or a cyborg that was wearing his skin. Connor's humanity makes no difference in the context of the story at all. There was never a single shred of evidence AGAINST a cyborg Connor theory. The idea just never came up.
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Your right, but if it's a robot that sends Reese back, well that's just dumb.
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That makes Kyle Reese a patsy. I never said that you couldn't fit this ridiculous novelty into continuity, but if you do you make the first two films into a joke since basically they are talking about the wrong guy the whole time. It's not actually John Connor that leads any revolution, at least not to it's apex. And since that's the guy we've been told for the last 20 some years did it, it's preposterous to change it now because it makes everything that came before it look ridiculous and trite.
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If that was the case it would still be stupid because it lessens the theme of machine vs. man, but I could accept it if the rest of the film lived up. No, what we are talking about here is that it isn't even John fucking Connor. We are having some other character forced one us that makes the first films bullshit and it isn't even remotely as interesting.
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ahem.
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June 3, 2008, 6:07 p.m. CST
The whole point of these films is to watch Connor fulfill his de
by IndustryKiller!
It's not watching THAT it unfolds, but HOW it unfolds. How this character finally does what he was born to do. That's drama on mythical levels. What a fucking wasted opportunity.
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...without the above-the-title star returning? I can't think of any.
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thats some mighty fine nail hitting there.
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There is a surprising twist in every movie nowadays. It's the bit where you watch the movie and it has nothing more exciting in it than the bits you already saw in the trailer. ...Surprise!
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I take your geek zealotry about as as seriously as I take religious zealotry - that is, not at all. Time and time again, your prejudices completely overpower your ability to reason, and your reliance on irrational, histrionic straw-man arguments makes you an exceedingly tiresome debater. I can only imagine what it's like for the people in your life to have to listen to you froth at the mouth about even the most mundane shit every time something doesn't go your way.
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John is going to die and she's going to take over. This should not come as much of a surprise to anyone. I think whether it's cool or shitty will depend entirely on the execution of the concept, so i'll reserve judgement.
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June 3, 2008, 6:28 p.m. CST
But I don't think it flies in the face of the original 2, either
by Novaman5000
I mean, all we know is that this icon, john connor, is the leader of the resistance. Ultimately, he's going to become as much a symbol than an actual human being. If he were to die, but they were to continue on with this terminator made to look like him, I think that could be an interesting twist. Again, all depends on how it's handled... but I was one of the guys who liked how they couldn't stop Judgement Day in part 3, and how John became so important merely because he was in the right place at the right time.
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June 3, 2008, 6:30 p.m. CST
it figures you wouldn't actually have a counter argument mosquit
by IndustryKiller!
Nope. just personal attacks. And if my arguments are so thin it's amazing that others seem to agree with me and you have nothing tangible to say in response.
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If the original john connor had never been saved in parts 1 and 2, the rest of the future would have been totally different. Even if he ends up dying and being replaced, his survival up to that point was still necessary.
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i was refering to jesus in the same way you were, biblically. i have no doubt that there was someone called Jesus which kick started the stories that we now called the bible. however i dont believe the "Son of God aspect" as you put it. that must have been what you were comparing them to, surely. otherwise, you're just comparing a historical figure, with no real relevence. im sure we all believe in John Lennon, and you dont need to like him to do that. I like how this has cropped up in a Terminator talkback... belief is at the core of the story. you could argue that sarah connor is the catalyst for the entire thing.... if she stopped fighting, let john die, then the war would never happen. wether its bad writing or brilliant planning, the terminator time line throws up some very interesting ideas.
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"how can John Connor exist in the future (the original timeline)if he hadn't sent back Reese yet?"<p> Suspension of disbelief, I guess. Or approach the highly debatable argument of: "it was all meant to be, pre-destined". You can argue either side.
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Not even in nearly the capicity that we have been told. And since the whole thing has been about john Connor up to this point, I feel like we've been following the wrong story. And like I said, the reason any of us are excited about this is to see John Connor, savior of humanity, struggle to fulfill his destiny. it's just a far more interesting and classically dramatic tale than "John Connor and some other guy". it's an artistic dead end unless somehow this Marcus character is so incredible we like him MORE than John Connor, which is impossible. it also makes the first two films look ridiculous because they are TALKING ABOUT THE WRONG GUY! While they are talking about Connor the leader of the savior of humanity, we will be thinking "Actually.....no".
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Did I read that somewhere? I know McG and JC talked extensively, and it was him that recommended Sam Worthington for the Marcus role - doesn't that mean he's in fact in favour of this movie too?
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paradox. take a donnie darko approach. converging timelines and illusion of destiny.
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the pre-destined view would also mean you have to disagree with the characters... the future IS set.
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go check it out.
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But there still is no proof that Jesus existed. Great novel, though, really. Later on, a neo nazi actor turned the story into a shockingly graphic torture porn movie with a strong anti-semetic subtext and hardcore gay bdsm overtones called The Passion of the Christ! It made a mint! <br><br> And no, I seriously doubt Lennon felt sheepish when leaving this mortal coil. Least ways, not in relation to a being blacklisted from entry into an illusory magical fairy land in the sky presided over by a tempermental and deeply sensitive cosmic deity / despot who demands that you worship him or else he will send you to a lake of fire for all eternity because he loves you. A creature that simply does not exist, but continues to terrify abused children, and the psychologically damaged adults they matured into. Rather, he was probably terrified because some wacko christian serial killer guy -- Mark David Chapman -- shot him to death outside of his home.
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Regardless of what you choose to believe, I'm not the only person here who's saying what I've said. You just haven't read everybody's comments prior to your arrival on the scene. And, the fact remains that there ARE a lot of gaps in the John Connor story - largely because Future John is still a nebulous figure at best - that make it possible for people to come in and construct new mythologies around the existing one. Is it perverting something that you feel strongly about? That is not in question. But, if you need a real target for your anger, aim it at Jim Cameron. If he'd stuck around and made a fully-fleshed-out future war movie where Connor is irrefutably human, this wouldn't be happening. He didn't do that, though, and the studio wants to keep making Terminator movies, and somebody came in and figured out a way to turn the franchise on its ear and squeeze three more out of it. That is business. That is life. Your hostility changes nothing.
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Your presence here means I can go home. Keep fighting the good fight. You can't win against a zealot, though.
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It's six posts above yours. And since it seems I have to reiterate this. I'm NOT arguing that you can't fit this scenario in continuity. you can, but it makes the first two films look ridiculous and it's an incredibly weak storytelling choice for reasons I've explained. Take on the real issue if you're going to argue. Straw man indeed.
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"John Connor leads the resistance to victory." So yes john Connor is killed but it's implied that it happens after the fight is more or less over. And since A. This is part one of a trilogy and B. Kyle Reese is MUCH younger in this film than he is when John sends him back in time and the war is still raging, I don't think that is the time line this film is following. So it actually isn't in continuity of T3. or once again the Terminator in T3 was simply talking about the wrong guy, but you would think that when he killed Connor he would have seen that he is in fact also a robot.
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"There are only three people who know the ending..." So, thoughts on this, everyone?
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Check mori's post above. it's bullshit.
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I liked T1 alot. T2 had it's moments, but I'm not getting the pedestal it's put on. T3, the only good thing was the ending. They should leave well enough alone. Do we really need to see the future war? Besides, no matter how good the script is (and it sounds terrible at this point) it's not going to live up to the expectations of fandom. They should just let it go.
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think about it for a second, if T4 and beyond are PRE-QUELS, then John is necessary (this is excluding the T3 debacle of course)...but even in that horrible movie, the bombs did fall, so he'd even be necessary there too... Anyways, I thought T3 was crap, but had hope with Bale on board...now I am back to thinking it'll be crap...oh well - I just hope they blow it (like its looking) so that the idiot studio execs will realize that the audience is not as stupid as they think (people who actually liked T3 are excluded from that assessment)...
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You don't want to see the future war? C'mon! Remember how cool it was when we finally got to see the clone war...uhh, point taken.
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I did not see it above (scanned the posts but did not read them) and, yeah, Mori is right. McG is doing some type of spin/damage control. Either this IS the ending and they are figuring out how to rewrite the last act OR it is so close they are... figuring out how to rewrite the last act. I think this is the ending. And if so, I am done with this series. Done. Finished. And yeah, my $10 at the box office is just a drop in the ocean, but I'm not the only one. Everyone, link to this spoiler on your site. Spread it out like dandelion seeds on the wind. Help put a stake in the heart of this misguided venture.
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Otherwise, wouldn't we all be frolicing in space with magical unicorns, rainbows, and giant bearded men? Oh, wait, not, because those things are fairy tales. It is a really comforting thing, though, to think that Superman is going to come and save us all from some red leotarded Sinister Agent of Cosmic Evil and that all the people who agree with your politics go to HappySmileLand in Space, while everyone else burns in a cartoonish hellscape out of a Slayer song.
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to laser pants, i saw t2 a few months ago and im 15. after seeing it i believed it is the greatest action film of all time. i had no hope in the movie and i thougt it was going to be some cheap/dirty action flick but it was not. it was a movie full of OH SHIT moments. it brought real thrills. And what is with the speed racer hate? IT BECAME THE SUBJECT. it was amazing and i can only compare it to one other film "I'M NOT THERE."
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Only let's have John Connor wake up on a planet ruled by Apes and then at the end he sees the original exoskeleton, super-sized and holding a torch, decaying on a beach...
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to laser pants, i saw t2 a few months ago and im 15. after seeing it i believed it is the greatest action film of all time. i had no hope in the movie and i thougt it was going to be some cheap/dirty action flick but it was not. it was a movie full of OH SHIT moments. it brought real thrills. And what is with the speed racer hate? IT BECAME THE SUBJECT. it was amazing and i can only compare it to one other film "I'M NOT THERE."
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Now that's funny.
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The movie sounds like it will suck sweaty balls, and I can pretty much guarantee it will. 3rd wasn't that good, but this one sounds ludicrous.
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Serious question: Do we hate sequels that are, say, more than 5 years removed from their previous entries just because they exist?<p>Think about it. We generally hated the prequels, we hated Crystal Skull, we hated Alien cubed, we hated T3, and now we're preemptively hating T4.<p>Once 5 years or more pass, are these movies canon, with more detail viewed as blasphemous?<p>Am I wrong? Is there a sequel that came more than 5 years after its predecessor that anybody likes?
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Which one of those movies was actually good?
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T4 needs wire-fu! HAI-YAHH!!!
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I can think of only one... Terminator 2. Released 7 years after the first one.
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Aliens. Also released 7 years after the first one. Hmm. What do those two have in common, I wonder?
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None of them, at least I think so. That's kinda my point: how objective can we be about a pre-existing franchise, especially one that we're emotionally invested in?<p>Sure, we THINK they suck. In fact, we feel pretty strongly about their suckitude. But, while we're all bitching about how bad Attack of the Clones is, we still go see it 5 times and it makes 400 million bucks.<p>If AOTC came out in a Star Wars-free world, would we think it was any good?
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Any sequel made more than 5 years after its predecessor, given that either a) Cameron leaves or b) Lucas stays, sucks.
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I agree.
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According to EW anyway. That sucks.
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Moriarty and the guy from CHUD.com for President and Vice President of these United States. No, really. They’ve got a realistic perspective and a degree of common sense that has eluded both politicians and film studios executives from time immemorial. Give ‘Em Hell – Mori!
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You convinced me this idea has potential.
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Doesn't look like it, but he's the best trader on the Street.
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I'm ready for duty!
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If they do anything less than hire Geoff Johns to write it and... somebody awesome (who???)... to direct it will be a disappointment.
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Straight to the White House!!! WOO HOO!!!
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RoboCop meets Hellraiser...lame.
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Sometimes I feel like the studios have colluded on a bet like the Dukes did in TRADING PLACES. As if one studio exec bet another that they could make a shitty installment of a popular franchise and that it would STILL make money. <p> How many great films have had increasingly shitty sequels? All of them!
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thank you for giving me hope.
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The only reason they are making John Connor into a John Connor looking cyborg is so he can fight and battle like a terminator can.
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seriously.
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best
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So sue me.
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The non-creative studio executives that are making remake after reboot after reimagining are going to miss out on the BIG money. The kind of money that comes in when you create a film franchise from the ground up. Then some soulless non-creative executive in 20 plus years could pay them to use their franchise. <p> MAKE SOMETHING ORIGINAL AND GREAT and watch the money come in like a tidal wave. Studio exec is happy because he has money. Film geeks are happy because we have something original.
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So that should be fun to watch. Fox News is going to be HILARIOUS for however long Obama's career as President is going to last. <br><br> So, anchorite, in addition to being a "christian", are you also a member of the ku klux clan, or just your average garden variety bigot? Funny how often christianity and racism go hand in hand. Ironic even! Given the moral tenets of the doctrine as written in the novel seem much more progressive / tolerant than neocon / racist. Its also pretty anti-capitalist too. Did you know that your space-god was some kinda a pinko progressive socialist hippy?! And that he most likely brown skinned too?!?! HOLY SHIT!!! You better get down on thine knees and praaaaaay to Jeebus! YOU ARE YOUR OWN ENEMY! AIEEE!!!
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I am founding a new country called BringingSexyBackistan. I formally invite you to immigrate to my new country. Now kneel, before holy BSB.
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Terminator Salvation: The Future Begins director McG has posted an update on the sci-fi action-thriller on the film's official Blog, including what looks like a debunking of the rumor that is spreading about the film's end: One Possible Future We're in the middle of week five. The New Mexico wind is kicking the shit out of the crew but providing a perfect backdrop for our post-apocalyptic world. Sam tore a muscle on the left side of his ribs in a fight sequence. Neither of us wants to use a stunt double. This movie takes place several years after Judgment Day, but prior to 2029. Just like it took a long time to get an HD plasma screen in our world, it took Skynet a lot of research and development to get to the T-800, and this movie explores that "space between." We have all been fascinated with the world after Judgment Day. Here it is. In this film, there are Hydrobots that patrol the water, Transports that move human prisoners around, Harvesters that collect human beings as lab rats for Skynet and Aerostats that survey all that is going on with the resistance the world over. We've started shooting the T-600 - the bigger, grimier, nastier version that preceded the T-800. Like Reese says, they're easier to spot but they pack a mini gun and carry kick ass fire power. They're eight-foot tall killers that prowl the badlands looking for anything with a heartbeat to terminate. Stan Winston, Production Designer Martin Laing and ILM came up with the designs and that thing is on Kyle Reese's ass throughout the entire picture. Wanted to achieve that bummer, rubbery skin, prosthetic look that cloaks an unrelenting machine with a singular focus of killing. More to come... Also, I realize my name is ridiculous. I was born Joseph McGinty Nichol. McG is short for McGinty. I have been called this since the day I was born to create separation from my Uncle Joe and Grandpa Joe. I realize it sounds like some Hollywood nickname, hip-hop choice. But the truth is, this is simply my name - for every day of elementary school, every zit-filled day of high school. I have been taking shit for it ever since. I get it, I would think it's lame too. But it's just a name, and to change it now would seem fraudulent. Oh yeah, don't get too uptight about the prospect of the film being PG-13. We have entertained the idea of a PG-13 rating largely because Batman Begins, in my opinion, was made compromise-free. So we'll see. The movie comes first and it will be protected at all times… By the way, there are only three people who know the ending. The unknown future rolls toward us.
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'Tis a great night for the party, and for the nation.
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that band he founded in Portsmouth that sounded a bit like Sabbath and a bit like Hendrix. He should stick to that.
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and Obama won.
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...He'd write "sorry guys, but the John Connor is a robot ending is not the real ending. I don't know how that got started, but it ain't it." Instead we get some weird non-commital answer. Yeah, so what if only 3 people know the ending? One of them or their assistants or their cabana boy or a valet who found the script in the car could have leaked it. McG must think everyone is as dumb as he is.
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Not that it really matters of course, but I think being a famous Hollywood director should distinguish him from Uncle Joe and Grandpa Joe enough so that he can use his full name.
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wtf... maybe everyone call you like that man but you need a real name, not a nickname to be taken seriously, but well....who cares actually...make a great T4 movie and we'll call you "King of the world" if you want.......oh wait thats Cameron lol
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Who the fuck is this Guy? Yes, This is an angry geek rant. But Honestly, who the fuck is this shit director to think hes the bees knees. 'Ooohh three people know the ending!' 'its me, Cameron Diaz and Drew Barrymore" Because, all i know this asshole from is Charlies fucking Angels, Great. Cameron is the Terminator Franchise. T2 was the last entry in the Terminator cannon. End of Story.
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Well, half the nation (and those of us who don't vote, including me).
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Why Bale decided to sign on to this franchise. He gets to be a Terminator. Right? Or am I missing the point of the spoiler. I couldn't quite get my head around why he wanted to do this role. Connor is not an iconic character, but being a Terminator is something else entirely. Bale is, remember, the guy who took a role in Shaft primarily for a fight scene with Samuel L. Jackson that was ultimately cut from the film. He seems to like cool stuff like being a Terminator. All this being said, jesus christ does this sound like an awful film!
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"I wouldn't be surprised if the Trinity church congregation sings the theme song from The Jeffersons like a hymn for his inauguration." Yes! And Robert Downey Jr. can join Obama on stage wearing his make-up from "Tropic Thunder". Idiot.
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"Moriarty just gave this film a real kick in the balls." I'll be watching this film, when my naiive cousin buys it on Value DVD
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One for all and I'll be bock!
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Are you trying to stir up a race war?
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Which Terminator do you most identify with?
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... is that it seems like a cheap, revisionist sort of stunt writing. It's a plot twist for somebody who can't expand the territory of the Terminator universe without resorting to a highly implausible twist.
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and he will give you your hearts desires.
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That's devolving back to Rove-like dirty politics, man. I've no doubt the Reps will pull shit like that, but the country has had enough of it. We have real, serious problems that are more important and meaningful to the voting citizenry than swiftboat smearing. You will see a different campaign. Obama will keep this shit on track. And the next 8 years will be brighter despite McGerminator.
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then there was Nuke the Fridge. <p> Now, McG presents: Switch The Face.
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I hate to break it to you, but I think it's a pox on both your houses. But I do believe Obama will win. McCain can't appeal to the middle without losing his base. It's that simple. <br>As for religion? I am a Christian. There are those who call themselves Christians, call themselves Observant Jews, and those who call themselves Pastafarians who don't live up to their high ideals, and represent their self-professed faiths poorly.</br> But to be quite frank about your joke, I think it demonstrates either an ignorance or an insensitivity to how blacks really live. It's a cheap joke that doesn't reflect well on you.
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But is somebody suggesting that McCain has a plan in place to end shitty sequels and remakes if elected? If so, I'd like to subscribe to his newsletter.
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Dude stop giving out personal details man! We been down this road before. Just looking out for you bud.
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Not only would it completely ruin the francise but it would also ruin the show, which I actually have gotten to like. For the series you would have John Connor going through his adventures and all the things he's doing on the show and in the back of your mind thinking it doesn't matter you are just going to die be skinned and replaced. If that is the ending the writers seriously need to re-think it.
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Seriously, when you break down the rumor...why does it cause such an uproar? <br /><br /> Is it because James Cameron isn't directing it? Is it because the director isn't one of AICN's typical 'fan favorites' or what not? A year and a half ago, many of you were crying foul when Michael Bay put a different PAINT SCHEME on Optimus Prime. Regardless, the movie is still considered to be fun and pretty much something that most transformers fans adore, even with Optimus looking slightly different because the HEART of the character and story remained fairly the same. <br /><br /> Now, so back to the John Connor becomes a Terminator rumor. SO FUCKING WHAT?!?!? <br /><br /> Seriously, so what? I'd love to hear opinions why it is a horrible choice without someone claiming that it ruins your memories of the first movies. Or without someone saying it shit all over what James Cameron had created 20 something years ago. <br /><br /> When Bob Kane invented Batman, he probably had no idea that his vision would turn into what we now see as The Dark Knight, roaming around Gotham with some unending bad attitude and somber outlook on life. But the fact remained that he created a character and a universe that promoted so much storytelling possibilities that his concept grew into what we now know and love today. Howcome nobody is bitching and complaining for the old KA POW Batman heydays? Is it because they tweaked the character into something that just resonates a hell of a lot better with the world he lives in? <br /><br /> With this John Connorator rumor, it's just storytelling. I love writing, throwing in twists, creating characters. More often than not, they grow as you write the story and end up surprising the author him/herself. How do you know that when James Cameron created The Terminator storyline so many years ago that he didn't have this planned? (Granted, he didn't. Haha. Even I can't bring myself to admit that) The best part about Batman Begins was the fact that they filled in the gaps between when Bruce Wayne was this emotionally distraught teenager and when he became the Batman. With the Terminator storyline, pretty much after Judgment Day happens there is next to NOTHING known about that particular universe. Only that Kyle Reese is sent back in time, ends up fathering John Connor, who is the leader of th resistance. <br /><br /> We don't know that he doesn't become a Terminator. <br /><br /> We don't know that how old he ends up living. <br /><br /> We don't know where the Resistance is centered, and what their actual goals are. <br /><br /> We don't know what happens two dozen years after John Connor dies (terminator-ified or not) <br /><br /> We don't know a million other things that can be turned into potentially intriguing and fascinating stories. <br /><br /> Again...so what? <br /><br /> This movie might come out and be a true representation of what James Cameron had created in his mind for the future of the Terminator, post-Judgment Day. The fact is, those characters were created and were intriguing enough to jumpstart someones mind with a possible scenario that happens, and that person put it down on paper, the paper was turned into a script, and the script into a movie. Who is to say that these next three movies won't be equally as impressive, fleshing out the Terminator mythos even further into the future? <br /><br /> It's nothing but an open ended story with a different author taking over. Personally, I like the 'rumor' because it shows that there are many different roads these characters can all possibly take. My childhood doesn't feel raped, nor when I watch T2 do I look at Edward Furlong any different because you know he's going to endup as some Cylon skinjob. This isn't George Lucas starting with the middle chapters of a story and then going back to tell the first three. This is the middle three chapters of what could be (but I doubt it) a much longer story, except it was started correctly. <br /><br /> Oh yeah, this isn't Ryan speaking, this is his maid.
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I mean, think of it- this is how the humans are inspired- they don't know that John Connor- who is doing all this ass-kickery- is actually a robot.
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I understand your point of view (and went north to read your previous post, which I had not before my post) and I fully understand Moriarty's...but you two simply saying "Don't do it because I'm not interested as a fan" isn't really an excuse or a reason to NOT make them, like Moriarty pointed out...it's just a personal opinion.<br /><br /> And I fully understand there are a ton of people who don't like it. I'd probably put it at a 70/30 split for Anti/Pro, respectfully.<br /><br /> But what happens AFTER John Connor's death should be equally as important as what happens during his life, simply because if he was built up to be this savior of mankind, a revolutionary, then it certainly DOES matter what happens after his life ends. (And I don't mean this Cyborg John Connor either, I mean when he is publically acknowledged to be dead)<br /><br /> I think it's fascinating to have the possibility of mankind's savior be John Connor with some machine in him. Here is someone who was only conceived because of this machine war, raised as someone that hates these machines for what they might bring in the future, and then he ends up becoming one.<br /><br /> Granted, this is like LostFan108's condensed Season Finale spoilers. Taken out of context, they seem silly and trite (Sawyer jumped out of a helicopter to save fuel, only to have the helicopter pick up Sun/Aaron? Ohhhhhhh wait, there were scenes in between, refueling, etc.) and I get the feeling that if this spoiler is true it'll come off the same way. It's bits and pieces passed from ear to ear until it was posted here, no doubt with huge chunks and gaps in the process of exactly HOW this happens. <br /><br /> I understand where everyone is coming from, but the rumor has triggered my imagination as a storyteller. I love that shit. I love the fact that there was this universe that, much like Moriarty, I was completely content with after T2. I've seen 90% of T3 (oddly, I missed that Connor death scene) and while I wasn't overjoyed with the product, I wasn't dismayed either. I felt underwhelmed. But for the first time, I really like that there will be another Terminator film, especially if this rumor turns out to be true.
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It isn't John Connor. It's Marcus with John Connor's skin. It'd be like following a different character that is now the savior of mankind. This, right here, is a waste. That's why it's a completely useless twist. The concept behind it is fine, but Connor being involved is a risk I would never take. It's alienation of a severe kind. That's why I don't believe it's true.
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Cuz damn, it's fucking great. http://fanedit.org/483/
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Simply because of Doc Brown's time paradox. :) Since the Terminator killed him in the future, that means he was already successful at saving him in the past. OH NO I'VE GONE CROSSEYED.<br /><br /> Definitely a tricky plotpoint that will probably be ignored. <br /><br /> But that's what I love about these talkbacks, especially on polarizing issues/rumors and the fact that awesome opinions erupt from them. I might like pepperoni on my pizza, you might like chicken and pineapple. But in the end, we both love the pizza underneath. :D <br /><br /> (And remember, it was my maid typing. Errrr, and still is. HI! I suck at metaphors.)
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I do hope this is just some evil joke. This is almost as bad as Indy IV and Kingdom of the Crystal alien head....
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if this rumor is true. God I really didn't mind the basic premise of these films or even a little revisioning to make it work. But this is crazy. I could maybe see Connor himself being turned into a cyborg to keep him alive but this just to crazy.
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If this Marcus was executed, donated his body to SkyNet, and he was subsequently turned into a cyborg, why don't the resistance just turn the dead Connor into a cyborg using Marcus' hardware?
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I once read/heard that the producers and writers of Alien 3 once had a concept of a planet made enitrely of wood --the planet that Ripley crashed on. Of course, it didn't work or make it into the movie. At least they had enough vision to NOT do that. Now, I always thought that they must have beed doing some massive cocaine while brainstorming to even come up with something like that. This "supposed" ending to T4 is so stupid and juvenile, that I must accept that it is... 1) a drug induced brainstorm idea 2) a leaked idea of an alternate ending created to do nothing more than generate BUZZ 3) a hoax I just can't see people being paid that much money to come up with such a stupid idea, as bad as the John Woo "Face Off" concept. Don't get me wrong, "Face Off" was a great action flick, but the concept was completely ridiculous. I know in real life a lady had a face transplant a few years back, but she didn't *BECOME* the woman whose face she donned. She didn't have an identical physique. ANYway... I'm hoping that this ending is a hoax or a leaked brainstorm that was discarded. Hey, just my humble opinion.
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...make paragraph breaks?
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...actually, I just hang around and read what my fellow geeks have to say about movie news and whatnot. But all this controversy lead me into thinking... well, the whole purpose of the first two movies and even the third one was to guarantee John Connor's survival at all costs. I mean, it IS a sucky ending if this turns out to be the true ending but, if we twist a little bit, I think it's coherent with the other movies and somewhat cool. Let me explain, if I lose a leg or something, there're prothesis and things to make me walk again. John Connor lives in a age of robots able to emulate human beings. I think it'd be actually a logical step if he uses the tech of his time to keep his war against the robots. So, I'm not agreeing with this kind of twist plot in the end, but I'd be all over if he actually turns into a cyborg. But now I'm a little bit spoiled, and eh, that's the price when you read spoilers anyway. Well, my two cents.
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Why don't you drink a nice tall glass of SHUT THE FUCK UP?! To your already hilarious list of pathetic comments concerning T2 comes the topping of the cake in form of "The Robot War Sequences In T3 Are Better" than those in T2. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! That cheesy future war sequence in T3 had no thrills, no sense of pace or editing and it was just a few seconds long. So it obviously sucked. <p>Your pathetic attempt to insult me due to my alias kinda entertains me, too. Laser. Pants. <p>So, you want me to describe a scene from CHIMP-THE MOVIE that was not in the trailer? Okay. Final chase. Fat kid in front of tv who watches Speed Racer gets so excited that it jumps behind the sofa/armchair, covering his fat eyes. That stupid fucking chimp follows and does the same. That stupid scene wasn't in one of the trailers, you fucking monkey. I could give you more (Speed Racers car scratches over the finishing line with one tire; Inspector Detector watches fireworks through lounge window; the whole fucking familiy joins Speed Racer in the award ceremony; Speed Racer uses all of the car's gadgets we got explained in extenso at the beginning of the movie) but I just don't want to write too much about that steaming pile of ape shit movie.
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I mean honestly... who cares. at least they're trying to makea story that isn't just going to rehash terminator 1 and 2 *cough* rise of the *cough* machines
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MCG just said that only 3 people know the ending, and its save to assume Moriarty's "source" isn't one of them! Read more here: http://rss.warnerbros.com/terminatorsalvation/
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Judas takes Jesus' place on the cross. Then he jumps off and teaches folks how to smash those Jew motherfuckers into junk.
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That latest blog post reeks of knee-jerk reaction to reading, well, this talkback really - the amount of shit being thrown at him here is clearly a bit disheartening. I'd suggest laying off and letting the man work before we end up crucifying him, but I'm pretty sure this post'll be either lost in the ether or plain ignored.
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June 4, 2008, 4:53 a.m. CST
I am a re-animated cyborg criminal wearing the skin of John Conn
by smackfu
So I am really getting a kick out of some of these replies...
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Yes, you are the reason Rollerball was reedited, and many movies rewritten hastily, because Hollywood have gone so low they now fear the 10 000 guys browsing this site, over the general public. And this poison does not affect crap like Rush Hour 3, but all the movies we would dig like Escape NY or T4. You guys are poison, MCG is the cure.
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June 4, 2008, 5:59 a.m. CST
The Majority Of US Manufacturing Jobs Are Already Gone, Anchorit
by LaserPants
You can thank Republican policy and rampant laissez-faire capitalism for that -- allowing gigantic corporations (subsidized by US tax dollars no less) to move their companies overseas where they can exploit cheap labor (for a fraction of the cost they did here in the US) leaving american workers jobless, hungry, and desperate. The damage has already been done -- started in teh 80s by Reagan / Bush -- and here we are today at the end of US's short reign as superpower, now little more than a province of China who pretty much own us now after they subsidized our war debt for the past 8 years. Btw, why are we fighting this war again? <br><br> But, anyways, thats funny that you, as a Jew, would direct such hatred at Obama, coloring him as some kind of raging stereotype. I would think that, given your people's history, you would be more sensitive to such things. Glass houses and all that.
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Its really fuckin' hilarious how upset you get. The endless spew of various forms of profanity (clearly the result of morbid obesity, perpetual virginity, and living in mothers basements across this great dying nation) and sputtering invectives directed at a guy who didn't like a movie that you liked. You do understand, dear morbidly obese virgins, that what you like is not who you are? That the things you like are separate from yourselves? If you don't realize this, you may want to seek professional help for you are showing early signs of schizophrenia.
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I read the plot of Crystal Skull in a feedback a while ago which mentioned aliens, flying saucers and 'the fridge'. Finally last night I saw the film for myself and realised it was all true. I wish it hadn't been so and I hope the same is true of this T4 rumour/spoiler. What's wrong with the movie business these days? The hype machines mean it's more fun to read about what's coming out than it is to actually watch it. Sounds like the comics industry back in the mid 90's and look what happened there.
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i.e. the second half of this movie will be an hour of giant CGI things zooming around blasting each other while the audience falls asleep.
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...the fact that you keep repeating yourself over and over again and that you don't respond to the points I make (even if you demanded them), says everything.
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lol frigging classic. does anyone think McG is feaking out? i know i am.
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I don't know about freaking out, but I'm guessing he's feeling like he just got smacked by the fan-boy freight train when he took a little look over here. Poor bastard. I hope he pulls it off.
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Get it? Derm, skin, epidermis ...
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lol yeah some of the posts in this talkback and the other one with the promo shot is pretty brutal, but you have to laugh. A lot of it is hilarious. Poor bastard.
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June 4, 2008, 9:39 a.m. CST
Nipples on Batman = Termie-ater in John Connor
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
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June 4, 2008, 9:41 a.m. CST
PG-13 Terminator = The Big Lewbowski without swearing
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
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June 4, 2008, 9:43 a.m. CST
I never should've compared McG with the COENS!
by Stereotypical Evil Archer
I regret that.
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How many more watered down & bastardized versions of Cameron's original movies can you people take?
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What happens after it completely dries out. Is this where jerky comes from?<p><p>This whole ideal is jumping the shark in a nuclear fridge.
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When this movie's out on DVD in it's XXX-Treme version for $4.99 at WAL*MART you guys will all look back at this TB and wonder what you could have better spent your time on.
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...revealed in the first film, or one of the others in this new trilogy? Hopefully the movie doesn't hinge entirely on this bit of info like the ending of an M.Night film, but I never had enough enthusiasm about the project to care one way or another. But if its a major plot point, its sure to spread like wildfire amongst Terminator fans which could make the movie even more anti-climactic.
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...its a very interesting idea, and I can see why Christian Bale would be attracted to it. The notion of needing an inspirational leader to inspire a mass movement or revolution, by any means necessary. It has a lot of possibilities.
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OMG PLEASE someone out there tell me that isn't true. So it's going to be PG-13 with that BS crap in the script? Good god. Horrid. Will definitely just wait til it hits cable.
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they can't even show the process of skin being removed or put on with the PG-13 rating. The creation of the John Connor robot will be cut like shit. The S. Winston "under the skin" effects in teetwo were one of the things I missed the most!
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3rd installment and show
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DAMN YOU, George Lucas! Damn you to hell!
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Would you believe Todd Bale? Seriously...this has got "Should be DTV" all-fucking-over it and Bale is still involved? Did Bale get his fame and fortune from the Crossroads? Did he make a deal with Scratch/Legba? I mean what the fuck? How can this be anything but bad for his career? It's like Al Pacino doing Friday the 13th Part 6 or some shit. Stepping into a 2-film franchise that's been mutated and corrupted into a shitty what...8 film...10 film? (why ever stop right?) franchise seems implausible even for someone of far less talent and name than Bale. I don't get it. <p>Did you guys see McG explain his name? "To go by anything other than McG would be fraudulent." oh fuck off douchebag. I had a nickname too from the time i was a little rat...my guess is all of us had nicknames at some point...some of us our whole lives...and I don't expect people to call me that nickname. Asshat. Try again. If your name was Mergatroid and you went by Jack instead...that would be one thing...but you go by a nickname that has no vowels in it...and that is bullMcShit and you fucking McKnow it.
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So I actually watch Terminator:TSCC and they had a future flashback (yeah ponder that next time you have a few margaritas nancy) and in the flashback the soldiers kept John under lock and key. No one was allowed to see him and he had his own personal terminator body guard. Soooo, I thought that in the movie they would tell us why this is the case...apparently I was right about that but I thought that John was going to be some sort of terminator/human hybrid that kept himself sealed away so that people wouldn't realize they were actually following a machine (albeit a human one)...i would much prefer this to the spoiler above...crap i'm going to have to wait until the movie comes out then read the recap somewhere just to see if it turns out this way...double crap...
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Your comments to the TB'er about not buying yet another frail extension of a once great franchise perfectly crystalize my own thoughts on the subject. I too was about 14 when TERMINATOR came out and dragged everyone I could think of to the theatre to see it! HELL, I was pissed that Cameron was even making a sequel! HOW DARE HE! That ending was PERFECT... and endings like that make a permanent impression on your imagination. My friends and I were buzzing about the film for weeks afterwards as to the possible outcomes over those mountains on the horizon. Needless to say, the sequel beautifully augmented the original. A superb 'organic'...as you said...extension of the first. The mere sight of a TV comercial for the Sarsh Connor Chronicles leaves me cold. As to your question of what the industry will remake 20 yrs from now if they don't greenlight anything new...well, NOTHING. That may be the turning point...maybe a new era...like we grew up with. An era where kids will be lucky enough to enjoy theire own BIG TROUBLE IN LITTLE CHINA, TRON, RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK, FLASH GORDON, BLADE RUNNER, etc...type films.
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Not tits McGee. Tits Ethel.
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absolutely... anyone is allowed to post their feelings here.... however, when everyone jumps on the bandwagon of how shit this film is going to be because a site reporter got hold of a spoiler and didn't like it... well... it gets pretty boring fast reading the same shit. <p> personally, I love terminator, 1 & 2 and sarah connor .... not too keen on No. 3.... <p> that said, this news doesn't exactly bother me. they're making 3 films. count em, 3 films. if john connor is going to be killed and replaced with a terminator, well, that could be interesting. it's certainly hardly worth the venum everyone is expressing here
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June 4, 2008, 1:22 p.m. CST
As JOHN has cut a hole in the cloth of the truck
by I started clapping and tears of fucking joy ran down my face
– and sunlight blazes through it… he shoots Kyle Reese a look… that look… that goddamn JOHN CONNOR look and he says in that voice… that world weary, seen everything, been everywhere JOHN CONNOR voice and he says, “Yeah, but they all had the same problem.” Kyle says, “Yeah, what’s that?” And on his way to do shit that only John Connor could do – he says, “They weren’t you baby!” – and I started clapping and tears of fucking joy ran down my face.
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June 4, 2008, 1:23 p.m. CST
Ain’t that the truth.
by I started clapping and tears of fucking joy ran down my face
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This sounds so bad that if it did end like that i will throw my coke at the screen... are you freaking kidding me... please re-write, please re-write, or bale please drop out, oh and terminator 3 was a theatrical disaster on steroids... and i think it almost gave cameron a heart attack hence why we haven't seen him around in so long
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Who gives a shit? Seriously. It's a fucking name. More ridiculous than people who are known professionally by a single name are people who BITCH about people who are known professionally by a single name. Critique his directorial talent all you want, that at least has some relevance to the conversation. His name means fuck-all.
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While I do not agree with your characterization of Obama, I do think you make some very valid points about ANWR, and Dems and Republicans. <p> Nothaving read the entire TB, I have no idea how that relates to Terminator 4, but if you sheck out the Recount TB, you will see we have veered way off course there too!<p> My two cents on Termy 4. I loved the first two movies, and after seeing how wimpy Connor was in number 3 -really, this is the man who inspires such loyalty, and is such a great commander that others will go back in time to save/kill? I know he might 'grow' into his role, but some things are set at an early age, and him turning into soem legndary commander, just does not seem likely. So reboot the character, give him a backbone, and if that backbone needs to be made of metal, so be it.
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...20 years from now, James Cameron will have perfected time travelling technology which will allow him to go back in time and prevent these new Terminator movies from ever getting made. You thought his 3-D film technology that he spent 85 years perfecting in a secret underground laboratory was going to be neat? Wait 'till get get a load of this time travelling shit. He made it when he wasn't busy groping Linda Hamilton. True story.
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this is the AICN i love, the one shaking up the industry and fucking up bad ideas.
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...we should change it to "Demon Dave" instead. It's far more reputable.
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I always liked T2 JC as a brash, irresponsible punk. It seemed realistic for a kid to become delilnquent after his mom is sent to a mental ward for trying to destroy a computer lab. <br><br> I even liked T3 Connor, as a burned out, detached wanderer. Seeing him step up to the mic and initiate contact the human soldiers helped the end of T3 sooo much. <br><br>But I always thought that when John Connor reached full adult-hood, the pressure of leading the war, combined with the influence of his childhood mentor, would make him WANT to be more terminator-like. <br><br> I imagine him leading his troops into battle, risking life and limb to inspire his soldiers. And if an arm gets shot up, or his leg gets blown off by a bomb, he would simply replace it and move on. <br><br>Eventually much of his body would be replaced, and by the end of the war he would be the soul of a man, in the body of a machine. <br><br><br> NOT a meat suit.
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If they have a robot that doesn't look like Bale, then they just put his skin on it, wouldn't it look alot different?<br><br>Like, if they got one of Arnies terminators and put someone else's skin on it, wouldn't it look alot like Arnold with a different color of skin....
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"In order to fight the machines, he has to BECOME a machine!"
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...by flirting with the cyborgs at the local gay disco. When they find one with comparable cheek bone structure, they bop him over the head when his pants are down in the men's room after they lure him there for a gay cyborg quickie.
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YES, Variety just reported on their website that after the buzz around "Handcock" that "Wil Smith was the right cock to hand the job." The deal was sign by Marvel Executives and Dreamworks animation. The 3-d computer graphic adventure is said to change little from the Farvru film, with the one change of Pepper pots being changer to a chipmunk that can talk.
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Po-tweet.<p><p>"Give me your bones."
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According to DarkHorizons this story is bogus, and McG's name isn't an indication that he's an asshat.<br><br>http://tinyurl.com/5f8xmz<br><br>Maybe, there is hope yet.
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Something about this premise just sounds 80's as hell to me, in a good way. The retarded idea of an artificial intelligence waging a holocaust war with robotic skeletons in the future was 80's enough, but now we're dealing with real cyborgs, improbable-ass six million dollar man shit. It fits in with the first two movies in a way that 3 never did. The question is unclear-does the cyborg then get Connor's memories as well, or is it just a figurehead thing? I guess the latter, but they should really just make it so Connor is a robot. If you have good guy grunts waging a war against a vastly superior enemy, the natural next step is to become that enemy. Quake 4 taught me that. Let me guess, since Skynet didn't perfect the T-800 technology, the enemy bot is going to look like an older, less buff version of Guvernator. Just give him Lazer nipples and everything will be fine.
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Yeah....let's bury Terminator 2 as the last of the franchise.I haven't posted on this site in years and I'm surprised I still rememebered my password. "Holy batshit....Batman can they really get away with this??"
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Spend your time watching real filmmakers like Gaspar Noe, Johnnie To, Dario Argento, Andrew Lau and Alan Mak and check out the Hong Kong, Japanese and French film industires cos they shit all over Hollywood for original ideas. Hollywood wouldn't have the courage to remake say, films like Irreversible or BATTLE ROYALE cos they are too symbolically realistic and say too much about modern society that cuts to the bone. All the above filmmakers are astoundingly talented and brilliant directors. They wouldn't touch a remake with a barge pole. Hatchet is the best horror film America has made in 20 years. Kids like Adam Green are your filmmakers of tomorrow and should be embraced by these studios. Remakes and sequels are only important if they are a section of a larger story and not an add on like this T4 rubbish.If you want it to stop then do not go and see unnecessary sequels. Turn your back on them.
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The audience has spent so much time watching Connor reluctantly embracing his destiny, why abandon all that story by making him a meat suit?
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Which begs the question, now that Bale will be a Terminator will he have Batman Begins muscles or will he be skinny man like in the Dark Knight?? Regardless this film promises to be the Highlander Quickening of Terminator films.
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It should read "That crazy Terminator 4 rumor. Have some respect for the language.
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seems like a clear spoiler warning to me....
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Apparently McG blogged about the spoiler and says that only 3 people really know the ending. http://movies.ign.com/articles/879/879064p1.html
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I love it when people throw the hack that is Dario Argento's name around as greatness. And Battle Royale is a simple and obvious movie. Kinda like Narnia in the way it tries to beat its message into the audience.
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If you were referring to my post, I was pointing out that "That crazy Terminator 4?" that prefaces "turns out it might be a crazy giant spoiler" doesn't make any sense. That crazy Terminator 4 what? It only makes sense if you insert "rumor" there.
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Okay, I read Moriarty's clarifying post, but it still doesn't make much sense. At least he should have put a blank space there: "That crazy Terminator 4 __?" This site desperately needs a proofreader/editor. Say, I'm qualified! And I work pretty cheap!
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Motörhead is from London, not Portsmouth. And Lemmy is God, not his bastard son. <p> Seriously, what metal band were you talking about?
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just any random 70's metal band since every singer and guitarist looked like jesus and/or come from portsmouth.
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...to start launching new and original visions.<p>There has to be some "suit" at the studios who wants to be known for finding the next Matrix and Star Wars while everyone is lost in the black hole of remakes.<p>Hate to say so but Underworld 3 is going to be better than this.
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We already know he posted in his blog. Scroll up!!!
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Regarding you updates, I think you take the Talkbacks WAY too personally and spend a bit too much time defending yourself from unreasonable criticism or inflammatory personal attacks. <br> <br> People rag on other contributors even harder than you, but those guys seem to ignore it (probably the best approach), laugh it off (also good), or spar for fun (another decent way to go, if not time consuming). I don't think you do yourself any favors in terms of stress or intellectual stimulation by bothering with the attack dogs. <br> <br> Just my observation and opinion.
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Why can't he be an admirable human character? He doesn't need to be a robot. Seems like a lame twist for the sake of a twist.
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I'm going to send myself back in time, get a hold of Christian Bale, and warn him to stear clear of this project entirely. Let them cast Tom Cruise and just sink the thing completely. None of you will remember this post of course, because once the past is changed and Batman, er, Christian, is safe, this pale comparasion to the mythology we all love and respect will have nothing appealing to it at all...although I have read at latinoreview this is a rumor, and only 3 people know the true ending to the movie.
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..it's a rumour about a sci-fi movie. It just isn't that important but..this forum response has been fun to read....chill folks..it's just made up stuff about made up stuff
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This idea is terrible, if I was at all tempted to like this new series, this is the kind of thing that makes me disown franchises. This is like when they killed Robin of Locksley and made up some other Robin to be Robin Hood. It's wrong. It's stupid. It's the kind of thing someone does when they don't really like the original material enough to care if the hero isn't really the hero. If John Connor doesn't do all the things that they said he will in the original movies, it's ruined. You might as well not make Krypton explode in Superman...oh wait, they tried that too! Hollywood, this is why you should stop remaking stuff, you've gotten to the point where you can't even honor the mythos to these franchises you keep zombifying. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.
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...while the script writers eat shit and die.
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He also sets straight the backlash and spleen venting over his moniker, turns out it's short for McGinty (his family name) I'm actually warming up to the notion that he gives a shit over the concerns of various fan postings after reading his current blog (PR dmage control aside). Fuck it gonna cut the guy some slack til I see how T4 develops, hopefully if he delivers the goods he can reconsider changing his name to Iron Balls McGinty!
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"...and at the end theres a TWIST! hahahahahahahahaha! EVERYONE is a robot! HAHAHA!" "Awesome outline. Heres a bazillion dollars! Go to it!"
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http://www.darkhorizons.com/news08/080604j.php
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Terminator franchise ends at T2, or T2:3D arguably, but that's IT. 3 was awful and nothing else will come close to Cameron's movies.
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the film still will suck and I won't see it, but at least they're not ignoring the "holocaust" allegory I thought they would in a PG13 P.O.S. Could do without all the surviving plants in that concept art on the official site though...
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SUPPORT THENIPPOLESOFGOD! WAS WRONGFULY BANED FOR SAYING NUKED THE FRIDGE
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June 5, 2008, 7:05 p.m. CST
The title of the thread is fixed! And there is much rejoicing.
by jimmay
Cool to know you guys read the comments on these threads. Now if only Herc would pay heed to my bitchings over in Coaxial.
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You post here ranting about how fucking lame the possible ending is as though you **WANT A REMAKE OF T1 or T2!!!** You're the fucking losers who the execs listen to. Give McG and whoever else is involved a fucking break man, at least they're trying to inject some life into the franchise. Sure, everyone wants a big-ass future war, but it can't JUST be that. Whoever says that this doesn't fit the 'canon' of the Terminator films is blind, deaf, and a fucking moron. If Cameron had made this, and used this ending, you'd all be bumming the living shit out of him. Sure, McG has made some fucking pieces of shit, but as far as this 'spoiler' goes - I like it. Stop fucking whining.
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June 6, 2008, 1:25 p.m. CST
Please add a musical montage where John connor tries hats on
by brodiebruce_405
and also, a talking pie as the sidekick. and more gay jokes like T3 please.
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He's pounding nails in the coffin of the franchise.
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Seriously...McTry it....<p><p><p>Put a "McG" randomly between syllables in any random sentence you write or speak.<p><p><p>If you get the speaking trick down enough you'll notice it takes on a 'pig-latin' quality of inserting or tweaking a normal language to make it gibberish to those 'normal' language speakers. It's McAwesome McYo!<p>Yes, single name "nick" names are pretentious and yes McG is a stupid nickname he's had his whole life blah blah but I wouldn't give a shit if he made a good movie. I haven't been interested enough to watch "We are Marshall" and sentimental sports movies can't be that hard but I do know that, other than the unstoppable hotness of Lucy Liu and the unending batshit-madness of Crispin Glover, the Charlie's Angels movies were undiluted gopher shit. I fucking hate that quasi-kung fu pose they make too and I think all of them are capable actors and beautiful women (especially Lucy Liu) but that fucking *KARATE!!!* pose just annoys me. But if it was McG who had made one of my favorite comedies "Snatch" and then went on to direct an Aliens-like movie where the female hero is badass without being a fucking caricature of badass then maybe I'd not pick on the guy's name and not slam this fucking shit idea of a movie. I don't care if the "crazy spoiler ooohhh!!" is real or not. This thing has shit all over a whole movie prior to it from the word "sequel to T2" and that's not all G's fault either (Lookin at you Johnny).<p>But at least McG has given us a great new alternate pig-latin English. Though I still McThink that his McTerminator movie is going to McSuck no matter how much they McTry. I'll be McGlad to stand corrected trust me....while I don't think further Terminator stories are remotely necessary and I think theyre talking about a group of chest-bumping fat kids at a McDonald's birthday party when they say "Eagerly anticipated movie AFTER Judgement Day!! The one you've been dyin to see and why? Cause I fucking said so!"
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Nobody wants a remake of Terminator. Nobody wants a remake of Terminator 2: Judgement Day. Sure as fuck nobody wants a remake of Terminator 3: Termanitrix Jenny Sizzzzzlaaaar!<p>And more importantly, nobody wants a further sequel to the Terminator franchise. If you do...good for you...let us know when you grow hair on your balls and kiss a girl for the first time (or your desired kiss preference). And no we won't buy any fucking beer or cigarette for you...that's what the old man's liquor cabinet and Kool cartons are for!
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...McG = McSUX!!
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June 7, 2008, 2:42 a.m. CST
Why not kill all our dreams and tell us UWE BOLL is now directin
by chadiwack
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Everyone is talking the new Terminator movie way way too seriously. Fans did the same with the Star Wars movies. If you don't like something, or don't agree with something, just don't see it. I don't think it somehow 'lessens' the movies of the past. I still have good memories of Terminator 1 & 2 and Cameron can make more until he dies, and even if they stink, it can't take away how awesome 1 & 2 were. Why do people have such personal investments in these movies? Enjoy what you like and skip the rest. Geez.
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This is going to fucking suck. God damn it.
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in case you haven't noticed , you are in a site full of movie crazy fanatic people....of course we care if one of our beloved movies is being ripped to pieces
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Gotham, I'm looking at you!
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Nice work!
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Hold onto your dildos!
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You know, to keep up appearances
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Wow. Just... wow. Three pussified PG-13 movies of this?<p> Wow.
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And I say that having carefully considered it.
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It's up there with Tim Burton's Planet of the Apes twist.