Cool News
The transcript is in from Peter Jackson and Guillermo del Toro's HOBBIT webchat!
Ahoy, squirts! Quint here. I had a last minute lunch here in Austin... the amazing BBQ of the Salt Lick... and when I got home I realized I missed the Hobbit chat at the Weta website with Peter Jackson and Guillermo del Toro. I signed up and everything, but being the dumbass I am, I totally forgot about it.
Luckily for me, those rascally Weta folks have a complete transcript. I'm just starting to read now, but wanted to throw the link up now rather than after I finished.
Chat transcript here! The greatest of adventures is about to begin!
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Can't wait to see this...
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Not much news made, except to say that all LotR characters will get right of first refusal. So, that means McKellen, Serkis, and Weaving are prob. definites, and Lee would seem to be likely, if they go the Dol Guldur route.
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He's put it off this long. But if there's one project epic enough to warrant it, then it's definitely this. Although I'm a little surprise PJ isn't pushing for them to use those new 'Red' HD cameras he's been working on.
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Good Lord, that seems like a long time or am I just crazy... a YEAR of pre-production?
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GDT confirmed he will have some role.
It is an interesting transcript. I kind of like del Toro's comments. He seems like he understands Tolkien and has a strong vision for these films.
In his comments, PJ seemed to me to be a little too cocky about of LOTR. I mean, it is still the best fantasy epic ever made (by far), I just don't think it's quite the flawless masterpiece PJ seems to see it as.
McKellen's Gandalf the Grey was the best part of the trilogy. It will be great to get that character back for two more films.
I'm excited.
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SWEET! They used it! I feel pretty happy right about now....
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Hellbo Baggins: Hobbit with the Big Hand
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Good question, Gotham. In comedies or light films I don't have problem with cameos. But for more epci films like these, I don't care for them. I really didn't like PJ's repeated shoving of his kids (and his own plump visage) into the 3 LOTR films. Now PJ is hinting he wants another cameo in the Hobbit. I'm happy GDT doesn't do cameos... less egomaniacal.
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That's great of them.
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To The Hobbit coming out and everyone screaming "Oh ma gaw... Jackson is insane... this movie blows... he raped my childhood... LOTR was great... this blows... blah blah blah.. Del Toro is terrible... blah blah blah.."
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man i miss Austin
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It looks like I'm the only one who thought of that.
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Damn You Michael Bay
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Harry can't eat!
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..After surgery? you must hate yourself, man. Talk about a death wish. You're like leaving Las Vegas except with pulled pork.
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but i like what I have read. Particularly the stuff about Smaug. Cause it's true he is "the dragon."
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Awesome.
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And thus ate the BBQ. Learn to read people.
PJ can't help talking up LOTR, he's only had 5 years of most of the world telling him he's the shit. That stuff can go to your head.
Ron Perlman for Beorn! -
Learn to bloody READ will ya? Quint is not Harry. Not yet at least.
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And I would have asked whether GTD got the gig after going on the PJ diet. It sure looks like it.
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May 24, 2008 8:38:00 PM CDT
Okay, the "two Hobbits"are officially my second most anticipated
by tht3000
The first being The Dark Knight.
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Ron Perlman will be in it. But at this stage he will not be voicing Smaug.
Howard Shore will return to score.
Hobbiton will be rebuilt in the exact same location. According to PJ "bigger and better than in LOTR."
A Blu-Ray release of the original trilogy is being worked on. But the release "certainly won't be this year."
Everyone's thrilled to have Gandalf the Grey back.
Guillermo is currently sharing sketches with John Howe and Alan Lee.
PJ cameo? Probably not. Guillermo? "I studiously avoid cameos…"
PJ would happily shoot second unit if Guillermo asked him too.
Guillermo will be writing the scripts along with Pete, Fran and Phillipa.
Guillermo will finally shoot in 2:35.1.
And it will be shot on film, not HD.
Why didn't PJ direct? He didn't want to "compete" with his own movies. -
Yay! One more movie that I should be able to take my kids to, that I can't. Thanks guys! Sounds really faithful to the book that was meant as a children's story.
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May 24, 2008 8:44:59 PM CDT
del Toro - 'location will be favoured, I love REAL sets'
by performingmonkey
The way things are going, what with Crystal Skull looking like it was 90% shot on a fucking stage, I was hoping Jackson and del Toro would set out to retain the BIG location feel of LOTR. Even if they're on the backlot it really helps to just GET OUTSIDE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!! Jackson's Kong was much more of a soundstage affair because that was the style Peter wanted. He really wanted a movie set feel for Skull Island. But The Hobbit needs the wide open spaces, showing Middle-earth (aka New Zealand) in all it's glory.
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Just read he has 'other plans' for Perlman, which obviously means he won't be voicing Smaug but he's lined up for another role. Could it be Beorn? Or a Laketown guy.
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My god, no wonder del Toro said he will be living in New Zealand for 4 years, he really meant it! How old is Ian Mckellen? If they don't watch out he may be too old to play Gandalf and make it believable that he's YOUNGER than in FOTR! And Christopher Lee needs to be involved too for the second movie. Recasting Saruman would be crap. They should shoot scenes with him this year, if possible. Just pull out the Orthanc interior set and SHOOT!!
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Del Toro wants a sprightlier actor. Right on! McAvoy is the one they must choose.
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But why the Delay for Blu Ray ?
Is it simply because of all the versions and extras ? I would have thought even a vanilla no frills Blu Ray of the Cinema Version would have been a Good idea just to tide folks over till the no doubt "Mammoth" version appears. (which may tell take some time)
Smaug, yeah that's gonna be tricky, but I think they can pull it off and produce something eyepopping in the same way Gollum was. -
del Toro seriously is the MAN for saying that! He knows that's what we're all thinking about the title of the second flick.
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no bloody zombie orcs like Jackson made.
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i hope.
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May 24, 2008 9:19:04 PM CDT
They should get Tom Waits for Gandalf
by guy who got a headache and accidentally
Forget Ian McKellen, it's going to feel pretty different from LotR anyway I imagine, as it should, since the books do anyway.
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Del Toro has much better judgement!
No cheezy conventional hollywoodness. -
Forget the beard and grey robes, just let him wear his fedora and suit and tie or whatever.
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I was nervous as hell to have Peter Jackson a part of The Hobbit at all. The Hobbit is a VERY different and awesome story. I wanted them to be faithful to the book and it sounds like that is what's going to happen. This "2nd movie" they are making seems to be where they'll go all LOTR Redux on us and thats fine. I'll just ignore the existence of that 2nd film like I ignore X3. I'm in for this Hobbit adaption though! I'm officially interested.
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since it will largely show what he was up to behind the scenes of the Hobbit.
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Peter Jackson wants to spend time with other creative endeavors. He seems exhausted and not motivated with the idea of spending another five years of his life in middle earth. At the same time, like everyone else, wants to see it be made and done right. And not by just anyone, but by someone he can trust and be excited about. Staying faithful while bringing a fresh new vision to it. Enter Guillermo Del Toro.
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he must be jumping up and down...we're gonna get the dragon to beat all the other dragons ever made
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directors. I can't think of anyone more dedicated to birthing an amazing set of Hobbit movies for us, their grateful public.
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i thought one of the most interesting things about this chat was the emerging idea that they don't really know what the second movie is going to be. Sounds like they've got several ideas, and are working out what to do, and therefore they can't make all the decisions on the hobbit without knowing what f2 will be.
Also, has Christopher Lee forgiven Peter for cutting him out of Return of the King? I know he strongly disagreed with that choice at the time. -
Just look at the Tale of Years in the LOTR appendix. It's amazing how many ideas Tolkien threw in there. You could do a whole movie on old Rohan, for instance, or Gondor and the massive Corsair battles. But they will probably focus on events that happen at the same time as The Hobbit and then in the few years later. This involves the White Council, led by Saruman (who's slowly turning into a bad guy) discovering Sauron has returned in another guise and they drive him out of Dol Guldur, he then returns to Mordor. No doubt they will change the dates of events in Tolkien's timeline to create a more interesting film. Gandalf and a young Aragorn could be the focus. Aragorn actually served in armies of Gondor and Rohan when he was young but no-one knew who he really was. They could create a narrative where Aragorn thinks he's just another soldier but then Elrond tells him about his true lineage and shows him the shards of Narsil. They could have a massive battle at Dol Guldur. What would be GREAT about this is that for once the good guys would be attacking the bad guys. In LOTR the good guys are just trying to stay alive holed up in Helm's Deep or Minas Tirith. Here the good guys led by Gandalf, Saruman, Elrond, young Aragorn (here they would have to change the timeline) would assault Dol Guldur and drive Sauron out along with the Nazgul that are also around.
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Beorn can not be exempted!
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About Lee and McKellen. You never know with that stuff. I mean some kid who had a part in The Half Blood Prince got stabbed to death today at 18 years old. So you could take all kinds of precautions and then something shocking happens. Or maybe Christopher Lee will still be acting 20 years from now. Who knows?
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with the prequels. Perhaps they wouldn't have sucked!
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Film 2 is supposed tie the films together, however I think it's also important that it needs to have it's own story to tell and not just be a bunch of exposition.
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But who is Doug Jones going to play?
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The whole reason I signed up was because I just wanted to get Martin Freeman's name out there for Bilbo... but I tried strategically wording it but the mods cock-blocked me.
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As much as I want to know all there is to know about the PJ/GTD collab, I would give my left nut for some Salt Lick brisket right about now. I haven't had that shit in YEARS!
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After reading all this, it sounds like they're on the PERFECT path for how these movies will be made. The Hobbit story will be contained to one movie (so no Matrix Reloaded ending) and the second one will be all the cool shit that happened in the books that we never saw, from the sound of it - Gandalf going to the Necromancer tower, the White Council, Gollum's torture, maybe Aragorn watching The Shire.
This sounds AWESOME, and GDT definitely seems like he knows exactly how to do it right. -
Straight from the horse's mouth. Interesting read. Looking forward to a more whimsical approach to the same universe.
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Performing Monkey, your conjecture sounds very convincing. I've no doubt that a lot of your ideas will turn up in Film 2. However, they should really try to write and shoot Christopher Lee's scenes as soon as possible. The man is in his mid-eighties, and can you imagine anyone else playing Saruman?Darth Melkor, I sincerely doubt you will hear people complaining that Jackson raped their childhoods in the way Lucas did with Star Wars/Indiana Jones. Del Toro and Jackson are at the height of their powers and are not tired old men who are out of touch. They are passionate about this project; they have a strong work ethic and a desire to respect the integrity of their franchise - unlike Lucas' lazy 'good enough' approach. If The Hobbit fails to deliver, it won't be for lack of trying.
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everyone knows he'll have multiple parts...everyone.
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And I am stoked that PJ finally came out and said that Film 2 is NOT "The Hobbit," that Film 1 is "The Hobbit" in it's entirety.As for Film 2, if anyone has read the Appendix at the end of "Return," it's easy to figure out what it will be about, in fact, I believe a scene from "Two Towers Extended," gives it away:Film 2 will be about Aragorn fighting in Rohan and Gondor under the name of Thorongil, fighting with and for Theoden and Denethor's fathers, only leaving Gondor due to the jealousy of Denethor (how cool would it be to get Sean Bean to come back to protray the young Denethor?)And it should also contain Aragorn's meeting with Arwen in Lothlorien after those battles, and later, Gandalf and Aragorn's chase and capture of Gollum.That's what Film 2 should be.
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PJ made some almost inexcusable errors in the first three films that could be corrected in the second film. First of all, Glamdring, like Sting is an elvish blade, so it also glows blue with Goblins around. Also, the Rangers and Aragorn's character. I think trying to give him an arc in LOTR, which didn't really exist in the books, was pointless, not really even noticable. He was already supposed to have 'found himself', in other words he was already a 'superhero' to put in terms many on this site will understand, LOTR wasn't his origin story. So he should never have been conflicted about being King, should already have had Anduril, and PJ should have emphasized what a badass he was and how Orcs were scared shitless of him, and others were in awe of him when they realized who he was,like Tolkien did in the books, his fist meeting with Eomer comes to mind, much better in the books. By screwing up Aragorn, PJ left out some characters that had a lot of potential to be expanded on film, Aragorn's band of Rangers. They would have been cool characters, esp. in the Two Towers. So, maybe PJ can correct some of these mistakes in the second film, and come to think of it del torro can be perfect already experienced with the superhero genre. Rangers fit that role, and Aragorn(Strider) was the leader, keeping the lands safe against evil, secretly and thanklessly.
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For he's a jolly good fellow!
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I love the hobbits, I love the elves...but the fallen realm of man always held a special place in my heart. Show me the wars that Theoden fought before his mind was leeched by Saruman. Show me the birth of Eeowyn and Eeomer where THEIR community knows that their future ruler is one of these two children, fulfilling a prophecy.
Helms Deep has seen many battles, and while they might not live up to THE battle at Helm's Deep, I think it'd be fun to revisit. Or...show the reason for it's creation. -
Read what Del Toro says about Smaug's design. He seems to hint at him reflecting his environment. Maybe not, but it would be very cool to look at...
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"Middle Earth."
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... is composed of the jewels and gold coins of his plunder from the Lonely Mountain, because he's been laying on it for years.Think of that stupid shit woman who sat on her boyfriend's toiled for two years without getting up and he skin actually attached to the toilet seat.It's the same principle.In fact, it is seeing the one space where these is not golden-jeweled "armor" that let's Bilbo know to tell Bard where to shoot his arrow to kill Smaug.
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I could totally see that on a t-shirt.
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Damn you IndustryKiller
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I started coming here way back in the dawn of faint LotR movie rumors--early enough to snag "Boromir" as a screen name (but not "Beorn", dammit--that would still be my top choice).At the time, I was working offshore, and caught up on LotR via AICN whenever I could get to a computer. During filming of LotR, I quit working offshore, moved on to dispatching trucks, and finished a Bachelors degree. By the time FotR came out, I was in graduate school, and sitting in the theatre for each of those three films felt like the culmination of so much I'd been hoping for and working towards for years.Now that The Hobbit and F2 are just beginning to get rolling, I am working on my Ph.D. dissertation, and by the time the films come out I'll have moved once again and be (hopefully) settling down, finally. When the lights go down in the theatre on the night The Hobbit opens, that same feeling is going to be there all over again. The development of these films--films based on books that as a child I thought were so good that they practically proved the existence of God--feels like a tracing of my life since the mid-90s.Lots of things will happen before The Hobbit premiers, but whatever the world and my life are like then, I'll be there, and I can barely stand to have to wait.
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...better and better the more we hear about it. I'm sure haters will still find ways to bitch about it even before a single frame is shot.
At this very moment, somewhere out there, ringwearer9 is going over this transcript with a fine-toothed comb looking for chinks in the armor. Hell, he's probably even listening to the recording trying to tune into variances in PJ's and Del Toro's voices which might indicate when they're "lying".
Like the talkbacker above said, it's so great to be talkbacking about a new Tolkien project, and especially one which looks so promising.
The subsequent flame wars will surely shake the pillars of heaven. I think that the crushing disappointment of Indy 4 will, unfortunately, give haters more wind in their sails.
Let them come! -
No not really
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TB recognition! TomBodet must be so proud!
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...yesterday and awake to find this news! Happy days. Although I see the flaws in the original trilogy I am not a huge fan of the books so therefore enjoyed the movies a lot regardless of the changes. I see the making of these 2 movies as a gift to all of us fans. I am not naive enough to think that it is anything other than a cash cow for a huge number of people, but who would have thought they would make more Tolkien movies? Not me thats for sure and I sure can't wait for them.
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Not to turn this thread into one big nostalgia fest, but it was trolling the internet for casting news on Fellowship that led me to AICN in the first place all those years ago. I was just out of high school, didn't really have much of a plan, and following the making of these movies really gave me something to be excited about.
Last week I got my MFA in film production from USC thanks in some small part to the inspiration I got from Lord of the Rings and the passionate community of assholes here on AICN.
And now I'm reading an article about another Hobbit movie and things really have come full circle. I gotta say, it's good to be back.
(And by the way, Del Toro's little speech about Smaug gave me my biggest geek boner in at least a year.) -
I mean, it looks like crap but nonetheless it's T4 news.
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But those of you who live, breathe, eat and shit this until it's released are probably the same ones who will post after the release screeching that "Peter Jackson raped my childhood!" or whatnot when the final product simply fails to live up to your expectations (having been in full swing for X number of years.
Try going to the gym, developing hobbies & social skills, talking to people..you know LIVE. -
"...the passionate community of assholes here on AICN."
That should be the subtitle for the Talkbacks! -
Interesting to hear that both directors have used that phrase of The Hobbit being a lighter toned film, which people seemed desperate for.
Also changing the creatures, talking trolls, wargs, different goblins, different elves. Hmm. Sounds like they'll be more faithful to the book than even the bookbores wanted. I really wasn't expecting that. -
"What are your plans with the casting of Bilbo Baggins? Is Ian Holm still an option?
Guillermo del Toro The fact that Ian Holm is SO memorable means that PJ, Fran and PB did their job right. We will utilize him in some fashion for sure but the difficulty of th erole will be better assesed after we do the script (s)."Good. I'm glad he will likely be involved to some extent. However, I think this answer marks the only time that GDT was off-base: "The fact that Ian Holm is SO memorable means that PJ, Fran and PB did their job right. " Bullshit. Holm was so memorable because he is one of the best actors alive and was born to play Bilbo Baggins and his performance was one if not the best in the films (which is saying a LOT). Jackson & Co had precious little to do with that. Other than this gaffe, I thought GDT's answers were beautifully insightful (especially in addressing his general dislike of the "sword and sorcery" genre. I feel better, in fact, about GDT than I ever did about Jackson. -
I think GDT was referring to the trilogy teams casting choices. The conversation was generally around casting choices.
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"We will utilize him in some fashion..." You either cast him as Bilbo or you don't have him in the movie at all. Anything else would undermine the actor they DO cast in the role. If GDT's referring to some ropey future-flashback scene featuring Holmes, that would make even less sense.
I guess it's a possibility he's referring to Holmes featuring in the second movie, but going to the lengths of selling us on a new actor, and then swapping them around for the second movie wouldn't exactly be the wisest move.
Other than that incredibly anal fan-gripe, that Q&A left me with nothing but high expectations for The Hobbitses movies. -
It does sound, obviously this is way before they've clearly even got a structure yet, but Bilbo won't be playing a major role in film two, so it could conceivably have Holm return to link it to the Trilogy. Not to read too much into it but by the tone of what they were saying it could be that Ian Holm just isn't physically up to the demands of the first film. Or maybe doesn't even want it.
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May 25, 2008 9:41:03 AM CDT
"maybe Christopher Lee will still be acting 20 years from now"
by carmillavondoom
From your mouth to Gods ear, CherryValance. Listen to his performance reading "Children of Hurin." Amazing.
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Could even be titled ARAGORN. It could be Aragorn's origin story.
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...Smaug. Wow, very in-depth. And while Smaug may have been rather low on the scale of Tolkien dragons, it's true that he should be the end-all, be-all of cinematic dragons. I'm glad to see that they're thinking big on that one.
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Quote: "In his comments, PJ seemed to me to be a little too cocky about of LOTR. I mean, it is still the best fantasy epic ever made (by far), I just don't think it's quite the flawless masterpiece PJ seems to see it as."I disagree. I think PJ would probably be the first to point out that his LOTR is not without its flaws. But the man spent an incredible amount of time bringing those films to light; I don't begrudge him one bit for feeling a sense of pride about their overall accomplishment.
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The signs I'm getting are that GDT wants to take an uber-faithful approach to the adaptation - talking animals, shape-shifting bear-men and all. I'm not optimistic that this is going to work at all. Jackson would have the balls to look at alternatives to these sorts of elements - elements that pose problems if you're trying to keep this within the same world as LotR. Conversely, it takes balls to keep these elements in - but it's a different type of balls. Del Toro has his own set of balls, different to those of Jackson's. I can see their balls banging together at several points during this production. Who will emerge the victor? Who's bollocks are bigger, hairier, sweatier and danglier than the other's? Is it necessarily gay if they touch? Only time will tell.
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"The Ranger" would be a better title if you're going down that route.
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"The Hobbit". "The Wizard". "The Ranger".
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If it's so much a symphony 5 film movement will it end up LOTR: The Hobbit and LOTR: The Reunion of Actors?
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He befriends Gandalf. Guards the Shire and the Hobbits (Bilbo). He lives with Elrond and the Elves and falls in love with Arwen (and possibly meets Legolas). He serves at Rohan and Gondor fights few battles to counter the growing threat of Sauron. He even journeys through the mines of Moria and meets the Dwarves (Gimli) and then goes on a search with Gandalf to find Gollum.
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or maybe just commando? I have to know.
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PJ and GDT have got this shit under control. 2011 can't come soon enough, and I'm glad that I will at least have one thing to look forward to through 2012 (or 2013 if you count the film 2 extended edition haha)
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because i've analyzed the time line of each chapter of the book to the movies, and figured out that each chapter without a gap would equal 4 hours of time passing, and in the movies its quite clear that Peter jackson only has 3.7 hours passing, and the scene where merry and pip set off the fireworks at the party..well that happens BEFORE dinner in the books, but Jackson has it happen AFTER dinner!! can you believe he would make a HUGE mistake like that? it totally ruins the arc that pip's character goes through for the rest of the movies!! I cant help but punch my 4 year old son every time i watch those shitty movies (which is up to 27 seven times now.. a few times i put it on just so i could punch my son.) in closing the LOTR movies might have been near perfect cinema as far as stand alone film goes, but they're actually shit and Peter Jackson is a hack because in the books gollum has a scar on his right thumb, and ive goes over every freeze frame of him in the films, and i cant see it there on sceen. (maybe thats WETA's fault.. so they suck too.)
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film 2 is obviously going to be about aragorn and his dinner party with Figlem the green, and Searamin, (the neutral wizard of latrinamore) as described in appendix C: of the unwritten chapters of the Rhines of book 12 of the story of middle Earth.anyone who doesnt realize that is just a dumb jerk that hates all books.
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May 25, 2008 11:46:49 AM CDT
How Holm could be used without playing young Bilbo...
by le vicious fishus
Simple. He's writing the first part of the Red Book of Westmarch in Rivendell as the events of LOTR are unfolding (which would be accurate according to Tolkien). After all, Bilbo WAS the ostensible author of at least part of that (fictional) manuscript. Holm's involvement could be sprinkled throughout the first movie and might he might be used minimally (if at all) in the second movie. This actually would work as the older Bilbo (by Holm) could describe Bilbo in any way--close but not necessarily exactly like a younger Holm''s Bilbo would look. This would solve the "frail, increasingly ancient Holm" problem, as Holm's Bilbo without the Ring is aging rapidly in Rivendell as he writes. I think this cinematic device (THE HOBBIT as flashback as Bilbo writes it) would be a stunning, poignant cinematic conceit if filmed sparingly and wisely.Of course, I'd love to see Holm reprise the role, but I understand that Holm's age does pose possible problems in an action packed adventure like THE HOBBIT.BTW, if GDT was referring simply to good casting when he wrote "The fact that Ian Holm is SO memorable means that PJ, Fran and PB did their job right" then he mangled that statement badly. Holm in point of fact did HIS job right (and the CASTING DIRECTOR did his/her job right secondarily). The actor himself is more responsible for his perfect, memorable performance than the screenplay writers or directors are. Hell, film-Bilbo is more like Tolkien's Bilbo than any other character in the films, so one could also give a little credit to the professor himself! Like I stated earlier, though, this is a minor gaffe, and I'm more excited than ever to have Del Toro guiding the ship.
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Terrific transcript by the way. I am so psyched up for this. Ian Mcallen will look the same and does not have to look younger because, its easier to believe the wizards live very long . Bilbo is in his 50s during the hobbit so Ian Holm should still be ok to play it as in the FOTR flashback. The bridging the gap film sound awesome now. Wow more significant movie events to look forward to in future.
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Shock horror. On a web chat of all things. Ha. No, oh okay. But as a matter of point, they really were discussing casting options, and it's an odd and unusual side note of the LOTR trilogy that PJ, Fran etc got more or less free reign on casting decisions, when most films of that sort of budget would have had studio control imposed on a casting director. Casting Ian Holm was a stroke of brilliance, but by no means a wise commercial decision. Much like many of the casting decisions made.
Ian Holm and Ian McKellen more or less brought all the gravitas to the films that other actors would have lost. Ian Holm is a perfect Bilbo, and I totally agree with the idea of using him in flashback almost as narrator. I know PJ often stated his preference for the Cinematic versions of the Trilogy but does anybody really think the opening with Bilbo, concerning hobbits, writing in his book was adequately replaced with an opening shot of Frodo? Of course not. It'd work perfectly in these films too.
But seriously, the questions were around casting decisions and saying that the team that hired Ian Holm did their job right is spot on! You can ruin a film by putting the wrong person in a role. Forget crappy CGI, or poor editing, or script problems...pick the wrong actor and you might as well shut the film down. The original casting of Aragorn a case in point. -
How can 6000 fans ask 4000 questions? That doesn't even make sense. Did they mean 4000 fans and 6000 questions?
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I was pleased to read how Del Toro went on and on about how cool Smaug has to be. And it's a good sign that he mentioned the dragon from Dragonslayer. That was a pretty wicked Dragon. IMHO the best ever depicted on film. The sad thing is that with all the new technology available to them, no one has bested a dragon brought to life with the tools that existed 27 years ago when Dragonslayer was released in 1981.
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both have such a great sense of humor. I hope they have fun with this.
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he might make a fine Bilbo (assuming he could get the accent right). He even looks a bit like Ian, and definitely still has the acting chops (he was sadly underused in The Good Shepherd, but made the most out of what was essentially a cameo). I also can't really recall a memorable Pesci character who wasn't Italian, so it would be nice to see him do something completely different. Goodfellas-era Pesci could have pulled it off. Unfortunately, Pesci looks almost as old as Holm does, even though there's 12 years between the two.
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were very well done, both on the ground and in flight. Much better than Eragon, IMHO. Reminded me of Vermithrax, actually. I can totally see Smaug as an amalgamation of Maleficent, Vermy, and the RoF dragons.
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They didn't really address which Tolkien material they are adapting for Film 2.
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You, sir, are a genius!
I hope Pazuzu's right and PJ really does read these talkbacks. As it would be a crying shame to exclude Holm from this one, and you just contrived the perfect way of satisfying everyone. -
But that goes without saying.
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May 25, 2008 2:14:00 PM CDT
6000 fans asking 4000 questions
by mynameisnickpappageorgioandthisisarealbo
Several people asked the same question I would imagine. Stuff like are the same actors coming back and such.
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...but I agree with SepKu. Fishus, that's a great idea. Haven't read enough of the additional Tolkien stuff to know if it's possible, but maybe one could have a small scene of Gandalf and Bilbo together in the second movie which would not invalidate that moment in FOTR when Gandalf says: "Why, you haven't even aged a day!"
Is there a loophole where such a scene could be shot for the film without fucking the canon too much? -
Since nearly every answer was "We don't know yet, we're still writing". Then why have people submit questions?
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they're a merry little bunch, they are
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Thanks for proving that this message board can still stimulate intelligent debate, I was beginning to lose hope. That's a great idea and one I hope Jackson and del Toro seriously consider. Let's just hope they read these comments (or are smart enough to think of it themselves, at least). Ian Holm's involvement would only be to the betterment of the films - as separate entities, and as companion pieces to Jackson's trilogy. I've been thinking about how I feel about the Martin Freeman idea and ultimately I think he's a very bad choice for the part. It all comes down to baggage. Sure Freeman might look the part (and even that is debatable), but he has already starred in THE HITCHHIKER'S GUIDE TO THE GALAXY (which he was perfect for, even if the film wasn't as amazing as it could have been... Mos Def as Ford Prefect... seriously?) and I for one would feel like I'm watching Martin Freeman on screen, not Bilbo Baggins. I guess what I'm trying to get at is that he wouldn't disappear into the role like Holm did. I suggest they think carefully about who they cast, because an unknown actor might be the best option in the end.
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you and yer kids have more than enough films, and are currently close to ruining spike jonze wtwta. i guess you cant tell a dark childrens story when you read it, but now that we are lucky enough to get some films our way, i got no sympathy for yer bullshit - and it sounds like the filmmakers don't either!
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And it seems like an elegant compromise to the Holm dilemma. I can even envision a bit near the beginning where Holm's Bilbo imagines himself in a wig (as in the FOTR flashback under the Misty Mountains) and scraps that image, opting for a slightly different version of himself (conveniently played by a younger actor that somewhat resembles Holm but who doesn't need to be a dead ringer). At any rate, the whole literary conceit (which JRRT himself used) fits in nicely with the idea of all five films coming from Bilbo's original manuscript. I love metafiction, and this narrative device would certainly be in the spirit of the professor's own creation. It's a nice tip of the hat to both Holm's brilliant performance and JRRT's brilliant "translation" of the Bilbo's/Frod's/Sam's first hand report of the events surrounding Sauron's rise to power and the hobbits' sudden relevance late in the 3rd Age, and--of course--the War of the Ring. And there are fine opportunities to jump from past events (from and after THE HOBBIT) to "present" interruptions and even poignant scenes between Bilbo and old friends in Rivendell. This would have to be handled carefully, of course, but I think it could potentially be beautifully filmed by the likes of GDT, who is such a master of pacing and character interaction in his past movies.
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Is there room or basis for a scene - however small - in film 2 where McKellan can interact with a somewhat older Bilbo played by Holm which wouldn't make the comment "you haven't aged a day" seem too weird in FOTR?
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There actually would be a perfect moment: Balin comes to visit Bilbo a good many years after the events in THE HOBBIT. It was "long ago" when remembered by Frodo in "The Council of Elrond" in FOTR, but it would've fit nicely into the events of the coming second film and would be a good opportunity for Gandalf to note Bilbo's appearance (and for it later to make sense when Gandalf observes that Bilbo hasn't "aged a day"). This might also work nicely if after the first film the filmmakers have dispensed with Holm-Bilbo's literary conceit--what we have in that case is the "real" Bilbo unaltered or adapted by the "author" (i.e., Bilbo himself). Does that make sense?
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Sounds great! From your keyboard to PJ's and BDT's eyes, let's hope.
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it would be a great opportunity to deal with Balin's decision to repopulate Moria, Gandalf's strong disapproval of the idea, and the awakening of the Balrog. Yeah, and if you've read all the HISTORY OF MIDDLE EARTH BOOKS, you know that there is PLENTY of great material to flesh out that JRRT himself wrote at least in outline and usually in a good bit of detail (with dialogue)! I'm completely stoked about these films.
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...GDT's eyes.
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was sort of throwing around the idea for doing the Hobbit some time back. He was quite big on the fact that Tolkien himself had planned an exhaustive re-write of the Hobbit to make it more in line with the tone of his more serious LOTR. There was some vague talk of ressurecting the evidence of these re-writes to make the Hobbit film. Clearly GDT really didn't latch onto that idea at all. Interesting he's the one into the more canonical aspect for the Hobbit film.
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Viggo is in his prime, an awesome actor, and he didn't kick enough ass in the three LOTR films. PJ got the story right about the Hobbits and rings, and got the look right, the tone, and almost flawless effects, great epic feel, but he just misfired on Aragorn, but has a chance to redeem himself with the second Hobbit film, with Del Torro's help. Actually, by correcting the mistakes about Aragorn's character, its kind of inconsistent with PJ's version in the movies, but i know fans of the book could care less about the film conitinuity issues if you get the character right, with someone like Viggo playing him. Again, the character arc of Aragorn in the first three films a non-factor in the drama in the film, just as in the book, the story around the ring dominates, as it should. But Aragorn should have been a confident character, kicking ass, with people fearing and in awe of him. And he should have had his mysterious Rangers with him. This was all almost forgivable with the great images at the end of the film of Aragorn being crowned, but the final march to draw Sauron seemed really rushed, and puzzling why the mouth of Sauron was only in the extended version. And the braveheart ripoff of Aragorn cutting his head off just didn't work, I like the book version of Gandalf showing his great power, and he picks his spots. Yes, Mckellan was perfect, but please also show Gandalf doing more than whacking orcs with his staff! And how could PJ leave out two classic lines by Gandalf "it will be my turn to get angry soon, then you will see Gandalf the Grey uncloaked", to Bilbo and "for he who breaks a thing to find out what it is has left the path of wisdom" to Saruman. Ok, i've strayed from my point about Aragorn. Yes, focus on Aragorn, good idea, and he would have to be in the first movie as well. As far as the talking animals, and talking trolls, those were all PJ's doing, in the book, the eagle's conversed with Gandalf, and the trolls are supposed to speak. I think i remember a talking fox too in LOTR. The non-talking animals is only a movie characteristic, and i thought was a mistake.
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But I hope they don't go overboard with the design. We may have seen cgi dragons with familiar designs before but I can't think of a good movie with a cgi dragon to my recollection. I guess Dragon heart was ok. Anyway I hope he looks elegant and is not to out there as far as a traditional dragons go. Actually so long as he doesn't look like this I'll probably like it:
http://tinyurl.com/67953q
man was that cartoon disappointing when I was a kid after reading the Hobbit. Ha ha. -
Is that it's being interpreted through the "author," Bilbo, himself so it makes sense that the tone and some of the content (e.g., talking monsters and other beasts) are so different from LOTR (at least as Jackson & Co interpreted them). I can even imagine Weaving's Elrond looking over the manuscript and raising his eyebrow incredulously to "talking trolls" to which Holm's Bilbo indignantly replies, "Authors prerogative" or something to that effect. I'm certain GDT and Company (that feels good to write) will come up with something much better than I could think up, but maybe we're generally on the right track here.
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Anyone got a copy of the transcript? Linky no worky.
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No more emotional close-ups of Frodo, please god.
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When I find myself counting out Harry Potter sequels and LOTR prequels to see how much more movie fun can be had before I reach 40, that pretty clearly illustrates a level of Geekdome I'm not ready to accept.
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Linky working again.
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May 25, 2008 4:26:53 PM CDT
Rufferto: I don't know--some of the old cartoon designs
by le vicious fishus
of Smaug were pretty damned cool. I'd be pretty happy if Smaug looked something like this: http://tinyurl.com/6j66jg. There were some terrible missteps in that production, but some notable successes (e.g., Brother Theodore as Gollum). I was seven at the time it came out, so it actually had a big impact on me and led me to the books.Oh, and dalemurphy: be careful You're here reading and responding to these messages. Maybe you're closer to this level of Geekdom than you think...
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But not as awesome as this:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=E1xjw9Kzb5o -
Some ass hole way at the top was pissed this was going to be PG-13. I hate these fucking people they are a huge part of why most movies suck ass. Your kids have loads of movies they can see: Panda fu or whatever the fuck that's called and like every Pixar movie. I want movies that live up to what they should be and it sounds like these two films will. You don't like violence or reality okay go watch WallE 100 times, I'm not saying I won't do that either but there are movies for kids out there.
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I tried to ask if they will use The Lord of the Rings prefix for The Hobbit and the sequel but it didn't get through (and I doubt it's been considered yet). But I can see The Lord of the Rings: The Hobbit causing nerd uproar so I think tey'll have non-LOTR titles. Still, to link them together, the 2nd film will have to be obvious enough for casual filmgoers to notice it and yet also be descriptive. The Shadow of Middle-Earth, something like that. Sets up the transition between The Hobbit and LOTR and is obvious enough to be part of the franchise.
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How about THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW? That was Tolkien's initial title for LOTR so it's got gravitas, and it concisely describes the events leading up to LOTR quite well.
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How about THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW? That was Tolkien's initial title for LOTR so it's got gravitas, and it concisely describes the events leading up to LOTR quite well.
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I like that title, but it's a little too close to THE RETURN OF THE KING if you ask me. Maybe THE RISE OF THE SHADOW would be better.
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How about THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW? That was Tolkien's initial title for LOTR so it's got gravitas, and it concisely describes the events leading up to LOTR quite well.
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which includes every bathroom break GDT and PJ take (including step by step online diary of the events)
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Having the Eagles and Trolls talk in the Hobbit movies wouldn't really contradict or create some sort of a dichotomy with the LOTR movies. The reason is that we didn't really see much of the Trolls or Eagles in PJ's movies.
We saw the Eagles just twice in the LOTR trilogy - 1) when an Eagle rescued Gandalf from Orthanc, and 2) when the Eagles fought the Ring Wraiths at the Battle of the Black Gate. We saw more of the Trolls but we only really saw them while they were in battle. I'd hardly think either of these 2 species would talk or start a conversation during a fight.
So really, the fact that we don't see any talking Eagles or Trolls in the LOTR movies is perfectly understandable and therefore wouldn't conflict with any such talking creatures in the Hobbit movies. -
Over at theonering.net, he said that he liked Vermithrax from "Dragonslayer" and the Maleficent Dragon from "Sleeping Beauty". He thought they were the best cinematic dragons he had seen.
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How about THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW? That was Tolkien's initial title for LOTR so it's got gravitas, and it concisely describes the events leading up to LOTR quite well.
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How about THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW? That was Tolkien's initial title for LOTR so it's got gravitas, and it concisely describes the events leading up to LOTR quite well.
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I have no idea why it's happening. THE SHADOW RISES would work.
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a sequel to that Adam Baldwin movie, The Shadow.
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that sauron was only referenced once and only as "the necromancer" in the hobbit. i wonder if that could be worked into the title of the 2nd film.
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Toby Jones IS a hobbit. And Bryan Cox as Thorin Oakenshied would just kick all kinds of unholy ass in my humble opinion. As for Ron Perlman, there are several options for him. Beorn and the Goblin King have already been mentioned, but I could also see him playing the "grim" Bard. I have faith in GDT and PJ. Good luck gentlemen!
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It's probably an unintentional "teh", but I found that line to be meme-worthy.
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though probably not b/c he'll think its too similar to jaunt in chronicles of narnia. still think he'd be perfectly nifty as bilbo.
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someone had to do it.
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why do this chat now when they have virtually no answers to give?
plot details? not sure yet, we'll see.
actors? too early to say
designs? we're working on it
titles? um...we don't have any yet
seems like the the only piece of hard information is that the first one is coming out in like 3 years. this all just seems a little premature. is that just me?
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No one ever pays attention to my talkbacks, and when I saw someone wrote "BDTs eyes..." I was puzzled, but happy. My 2 seconds of joy/bewilderment, dashed away by a corrected typo. Anyway, best of luck to PJ and GDT.
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Those of you who think that Film 2 is useless, and nothing more than a shameless cash grab: YOU'RE FUCKING RETARDED. Yes. You read that right. FUCKING. RETARDED. That is all.
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Sorry Bodet, but you can't claim that one. We've been using that for ages-- Since Breakin' 2 came out, actually. I can point to plenty of times on my own BBS or on Q-Link when that joke was made whenever a questionable movie sequel came up. I remember discussions about a sequel to E.T. in the late 80s, and the inevitable "E.T.2: Electric Boogaloo" joke that followed.
I'm sorry, dude. The world, and that joke, is older than AICN Talkbacks. -
That is unique to AICN, and probably my favorite of all time.
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He meets all the qualifications :
1) Fat
2) Has a beard
3) Has a wierd accent (does lisp count?) -
Ron Pearlman is playing Beorn
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May 26, 2008 12:50:01 AM CDT
Bringing back actors 10yrs later to play 20yrs younger of themse
by tedbundy
Yeah, I'm aware that most of these races probably didn't age that much in that 10yrs, but still... can't believe nobody asked that question. I guarantee the actor's have aged.
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The at the beginning of Fellowship had a line of thinking in English (Westron, whatever), but not a speaking role. But it isn't that great a leap that some animals could speak from the Eagles and the wargs.
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May 26, 2008 1:56:36 AM CDT
Hobbit 2 and the Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robe
by pirateemery
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Also, I do have to laugh at the fact that the full title of "Assassination" is cut off by AICN's newfangled subject cutter upper.
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I'm surprised that with all this talk of dragons, no one has mentioned the golden dragon from Beowulf. Though the look was definitely in the thick TSR style of dragon, I thought the gold was a really nice touch that referred back to his mother, and father. Oh, and he got his heart ripped out. That's awesome. Major ups to GDT though for mentioning my two favorite dragons. The scene from Dragonslayer where the girl tears up her hands trying to get out of the cuffs still gives me chills.
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or do these two guys come off as entirely genius?? when they talk you can tell how excited they are for this. and frankly, i am too. EXTREMELY
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willow will still shit on these two movies...
unless they get ron howard and warwick davis back and call it WILLOW 2: the return of the peck -
was and is the shit. looking forward to these 2 as a team on hobbit.
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I demand that movie!
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that PJ gave Aragorn an "arc". PJ wanted to make his adaptation be the best it could be for film. Cinema is a much different language than print.
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and how it brings back memories of LOTR from his childhood....
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As folks (including PJ and GDT) have figured out, there are two obvious directions for F2: a) behind the scenes of The Hobbit, with Gandalf, the White Council, and the attack on Dol Guldur; and b) Aragorn's back story, including his betrothal to Arwen and his service for Thengel and Ecthelion.
The problem is, these happen at completely different times.
2941: The Hobbit; attack on Dol Guldur
2951: Aragorn learns his identity and meets Arwen
2953: Last meeting of White Council; Saruman retreats to and fortifies Isengard
2956: Gandalf meets Aragorn
2957-80: Aragorn serves in Rohan and Gondor
2980: Aragorn and Arwen bethrothed; Gollum meets Shelob
GDT says they don't want to a 60-year epic but rather want to pick one moment in time during the interim and create a story that incorporates as much as possible from the Appendices.
My guess? They move the attack on Dol Guldur to 2953 and move the meeting of Aragorn and Gandalf back five years. And it’s something like this:
In conjunction with the last meeting of the White Council, Elrond introduces Aragorn to Gandalf. Gandalf and Elrond expect Aragorn to help them in their designs against Sauron, but Galadriel, suspecting Saruman’s treachery, convinces Aragorn to go to Rohan and serve Thengel.
The Council meets and decides to attack DG; Saruman dissents and withdraws.
Succesful attack on DG; Aragorn helps Thengel defeat an attack by Dunlenders who are secretly in Saruman's service (since this would be easy in terms of manpower, the help would have to be strategic, inspirational, etc.). The latter storyline, of course, would have to be wholly invented, since Tolkien says nothing about Aragorn in Rohan, and of course it would integrate Arwen in flashback.
The biggest challenge to integrating the two stories is the now-established obliviousness of Gandalf to Saruman’s treachery. If Galadriel or anyone else suspects it in 2960, why is Gandalf unaware of it years later? But if no one suspects it, there goes the easiest way of integrating the stories.
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Is to have the Council send Aragorn to Gondor, where he could help defeat the Corsairs of Umbar as told in Appendix A. His story arc would be very different from the one in the book; rather than already being the great leader, this would be about “finding himself.” It would be the tale of the first time he found the hero within himself as he does something brave, bold, and clever to turn defeat into victory. And that would give him enough confidence to propose to Arwen!
The biggest challenge, of course, will be to make the attack on DG interesting, and different from Helm’s Deep, the Pelennor, and the Battle of Five Armies.
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about Balin's tragic mistake in immigrating back to the dwarves' ancestral Khazad-Dum (aka Moria), which stirred up the quiescent Balrog again. This would make for an exciting sub-plot and would tie in to Gandalf's movements (he and Balin could be visiting Bilbo thirty or more years after the events of THE HOBBIT). Also, consider this: in the first drafts of FOTR, the ranger Aragorn (the then hobbit Trotter or Peregrin Boffin) was captured by the Enemy in Moria and taken back to Mordor to be tormented by the Nazgul (which is why he knows their number and knows how "terrible" they are). Aragorn was tracking Gollum through Moria at the time he got captured. And there's nothing Tolkien writes later that contradicts this back story (and, in fact, the text of FR as it stands now supports the subtext that Aragorn was captured and tortured and later escaped). To be sure, Film 2 will have quite a lot to do with Aragorn and Gollum. Now that I think of it, Balin and Gandalf's visit to Bilbo would make for a rather serene opening of THE SHADOW GROWS (or whatever they decide to name it) which would mirror the serene post-prologue opening of FOTR). The HISTORY OF MIDDLE EARTH is chock full of amazing ideas regarding the period of time between THE HOBBIT and FOTR that are little known or considered but much of which is actually Tolkien canon. For everyone thinking there's not enough supporting material to create a film to help fill that gap of 60 years, I urge you to pick up the HOME books.
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The timeline and events would have to be mixed and matched, which won't prove to be a problem considering how Jackson & Co successfully modified the timeline of FOTR.
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And Needs Giant Robots is pretty good. I miss the oldies, though. The new ones seem to supersede the old ones as they're created.
For the record, AFAIK mine is "Herc is a 14-year-old girl." and let me tell you, that shit never gets old! Sometimes you can even insert another name in there (but Herc just makes it so easy to keep using his).
Back when Malexandria was the scourge of the art of the movie review, there were a few good ones that came out of her ignorant reviews. I can't remember any at the moment, but I remember the furor that arose over her review of Fellowship of the Ring.
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It's just that anybody who has tried to read Lost Tales or The Silmarillion or any of the stuff Christopher Tolkien produced from his father's notes would argue that a lot of it is just plain BORING and wouldn't make a good movie.
The trick here is to take all that stodgy history and boring elvish lore and eons-long tales of who begat whom and turn it into something that doesn't put audiences to sleep, while following the three-act formula, within a two-hour time frame.
The other trick is to stick with the characters that are established and familiar. It would probably be jarring for audiences to introduce a lot of extra characters for the Hobbit sequel.
So they'll have to pick and choose, and while the end result won't be the Silmarillion thrown up on the screen for your viewing pleasure, it will probably contain elements of that book-- and others-- for the final result. -
I'm not talking about THE SILMARILLION or any of the HOME First or Second Age volumes. I'm talking about the three volumes that begin with THE RETURN OF THE SHADOW and assorted others that deal with Third Age stories and earlier, unedited drafts of LOTR (and Tolkien's own follow ups with THE HOBBIT and LOTR characters). The work I'm referring to is neither stodgy nor boring, and they are usually not notes at all--this is usually real manuscript material (often with dialogue), and they DO refer to characters that anyone who has seen the movies (plus THE HOBBIT) will already be familiar with. I'm also not suggesting the filmmakers take this various relevant work straight from the page and put it on film. They should use it for source material, though.Incidentally, I thought THE SILMARILLION and some of the early Tolkien mythological/history works were boring, too, until I reread them as an adult and realized they were absolutely brilliant (they just weren't written in contemporary novel form). I assure you, though, that the material I'm referring to would be engrossing for any reader (or, in this case, movie audience member) who liked THE HOBBIT or LOTR.
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There shouldn't be a problem with the talking trolls in The Hobbit. I doubt audiences will be enraged by it. If I recall correctly the trolls in The Hobbit also turn into stone if exposed to daylight so possible there are different species of beastie.
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That was a great read, they confirmed a lot of questions I had about the movie (Del Toro's vision workining with the LOTR trilogy, cart returning and direction of the second movie. And if Harrison Ford can still play Indy, I'm sure Ian "you haven't aged a day" Holm could reprise Bilbo. If not, James Maclevoy is my choice. They did say no recasting though!!!
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when I was younger (high school) and haven't given it a chance since. Maybe I'll try again, after I get through my current stack of books.
I used to manage a bookstore, so it's quite a stack. . . -
...as the Goblin King, and even as Bard, but not Beorn. I'd see someone like Brendan Gleeson fit that part better.
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And will shooting the Hobbit films have the same slimming effect on Del Toro as it did on Jackson?
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This was made a while back, but it's not bad for a fan-made trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTHDy9OFudg&feature=related
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Maybe a Kingly one?
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There are many movies that could be made from the nearly endless source materials. I can think of three more trilogies with ease, and I'm not a film maker. That's not even part of the problem they're facing. The problems, as have been pointed out, is WHAT material they choose to adapt and film, how it will tie-in to the first film and the trilogy, and most importantly, will the Tolkien fans accept it? Unless The Hobbit sucks troll balls, which I doubt, the public at large will be there for the second film. Most of them won't even care where the material comes from if the first film works properly. They'll just be excited to see their favorite characters on screen one more time. But if they screw up the second film, for the hard core Tolkien heads (raises hand), it will sour all the other films. Leave an impossible to remove tarnish on the armor, as it were. That's really all I'm worried about at this point. I've actually been convinced I was wrong about a lot of my original thoughts on somebody other than PJ directing these films - I think GDT will do a fine job. ....... the new ST film is still going to suck, though. (siiiiiiiiigh)
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You might as well say Greek mythology is boring or the Old Testament is boring. These stories aren't written like an action novel, but rather as mythology. Now I love Tolkien, but he wasn't actually that great of a writer, stylistically speaking. But as a mythic creator, he was brilliant and second to none. Any of his stories are eminently filmable, because of their epic nature. But you'd need a good script writer to adapt them.
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What are the details of THAT part of the deal? Is New Line still gonna be called New Line after it's been bought out? Is there a bigger budget for The Hobbit and F2 now because New Line is under new, richer owners?
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talking animals are for Disney films, please don't overuse it or make it cute.
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The creation story is just f-ing beautiful!! I, too, tried to read this in junior high, but thought it was boring. It was so awesome when I finally read it a few years ago. The scope, the fantasy, the emotions! All it needs is for someone with vision to flush it out for the big screen. Trust me, people, this would be very awesome and has the possibility to be better than the original trilogy on screen.
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you could easily make 2 or 3 films with the material from the silmarillion
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That and Gaiman's Sandman are the only two projects that I would rather NOT see undertaken at all. Really they just can't be done imo.
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Please find a role for Sean Connery. He'd be perfect for this kind of movie.
hey Hobbit fans, check out this crazy new movie blog on blogspot. it's called: thebitterproducer -
That Q & A rocked my face. I need some more of this Hobbit shiznit.
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I agree that the talking animals must NOT be Disney-fied -- though after seeing Pan's Labyrinth, I'm not really worried about that possibility as much.
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. . . than CAVE trolls from the trilogy films. They even show that in Fellowship when we see the 3 trolls from The Hobbit, still turned to stone. Nobody will give a crap if they talk. Same goes for the eagles, although I think they could leave them speachless. My vote is for Clive Owen as Bard.
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...that GDT seems like he's going to do Smaug justice. As long as he gets the voice right, he should have it in the bag (Please god not vin diesel).
To be honest I think I could grit my teeth through some pretty big screw ups if they just get Smaug right.
I doubt there's much of a worry of the talking animals being cute, we aren't talking bunnies and mice here, we're talking huge fucking eagles and bloodthirsty wolf type creatures.
Oh, and ricardomontalkhan-Connery's retired. -
///through his mouth. that alwasy takes me out of a mobvie seeing an animal talk. it should be a psycic mind talking like Erogon but sound evil and disjointed like Sauron in felloship. How bad ass would that be? if animals start talking its gonna look like that crappy Narnia movie.
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May 27, 2008 2:39:03 PM CDT
If anyone can make talking dragons, eagles, wargs, spiders...
by le vicious fishus
and the like look cool, it's Del Toro. Case in point: PAN'S LABYRINTH. I think there is zero chance that we'll get a lame Narnia rehash (along with the fact that the source material for THE HOBBIT is ten times better than all the mostly shitty Narnia books put together).
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May 28, 2008 2:05:25 AM CDT
As long as I get to see Arwen fighting at the battle of the 5 Ar
by conanreturns
I'll be one happy chappy... :) Cheers!
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Arabs, Arabesques, Arabians, Arachnids, Aragorns, Araldites, Arandas, Arapahos, Arawakans, Aurocanians, Arbalesters, Arbiters, Arbitrageurs, Arbitrators, Arbitresses, Arblasters, Arborists, Arboriculturists, Arboviruses, Arboretums, Arborets, Arbours, Arbuscles, Arbuti, Arcs, Arcades, Arcadians, Arcana, Arc-boutants, Arches, Archaeans, Archaebacteria, Archaeologists, Archaeopteryxs, Archangels, Archbishops, Archdeacons, Archdukes, Archduchesses, Archegonia, Archers, Archetypes, Archiaters, Archiepiscopaciea, Archilochians, Archesporia, Archimandrites, Archipresbyters, Architects, Architraves, Archives, Archlutes, Archons, Archpriests, Arcubalists, Ards, Areas, Areads, Arecolines, Arenas, Arenites, Areolas, Areometers, Areoparetalogists, Aretalogists, Argalas, Argans, Argands, Argentinians, Argives, argols, Argonauts, Arguers, Arguments, Arguses, Argyles, Arhats, Arias, Arians, Ariels, Arimasps, Aristarches, Aristos, Aristocrats, Aristolochinas, Aristotelians, Aritans, Arithmeticians, Arizonians, Arjuns, Arks, Arkansans, Arms, Armadas, Armadillos, Armatures, Armchairs, Armenians, Armigers, Armillas, Armoires, Armoicans, Armourers …
Ar stuffit!
Harry, you gotta fix this "Subject-line cut-off" torture. -
"As long as I get to see Arwen fighting at the battle of 5 Armies, in place of Beorn or Bard (ONE of those MEN has to go) I'll be one happy, chappy"... :)
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because Liv Tyler was apparently a total klutz with a sword.
But after Cate Blanchett's fencing scenes in the new Indiana Jones movie maybe we'll get to see some Galadriel Smackdowns. -
The cool thing about a possible Galadriel smackdown is that it's Tolkien canon. She DOES throw the walls of Dol Guldur down according to Tolkien. It would be an easy (and not out of the question) adaptation to make her smackdown scene come in film 2 (driving Sauron out of Mirkwood) rather than at the end of film 5 (where it would canonically belong). Bring it on I say.
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But she did replace Glorfindel (and even Frodo, from a certain point of view) and I felt the need to make a joke in my "come back" post in an AICN Tolkien related thread...
So there! :) -
...I always thought Cate was a bit on the waifish side to be playing Galadriel (based on Tolkien's Unfinished Tales characterization). Having her do some actual fighting just didn't jibe. However, after watching Cate in Elizabeth: The Golden Age, I can easily picture her Galadriel in a suit of armor doing some damage with a sword...she looked great (convincing) and was every bit as inspirational to the gathered troops as Bernard Hill was on the Pellenor with the Rohirrim. As for canon, no, Tolkien's female Elves rarely ever did any fighting (just not Elvish at all) EXCEPT for Galadriel though I count Luthien as a primo ass-kicker for humbling Sauron. Now that would make one helluva scene in a movie (hint, hint for all those contemplating any Silmarillion movies)!'ere now, might that be our own ConantheHumble I see here? Haven't you heard? Arwen is to replace Thranduill as the Queen of the Woodelves so there'll be at least one female character. Eh, y'know those Elves are hard to tell apart anyway so male/female, what's the difference...they're all pansies!Finally, how could you leave out "argle-bargle" in your ar roundup, irritable?
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...the beastie from Dragonslayer would be a great model for Smaug. I caught that movie some months back and it still holds up pretty well today...especially the dragon. That said, the guy who plays the dragonslayer got on my nerves just as he did when I saw the thing in theaters.
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Where were you?! Be sure to read all my posts above regarding Holm's involvement. I think I figured out a simple way GDT & Co. can use him to play older-narrator-Bilbo in THE HOBBIT to make everyone happy...
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Apparently my former moniker no longer works on this ere site... So I've had an unfortunate change...
Laugh if you will MorGy, it would NOT surprise me at all to see some female characters swapped into the Hobbit. A female dwarf or 2 perhaps? Then you really COULDN'T tell the difference... Cheers.
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... don't forget Your Eye drops, dear. And could you be a sweetie and bring home some Kine of Araw?
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but wouldn't mind if the movie audience discovered that one of the lesser known dwarves in THE HOBBIT (e.g., Bofur) was--in fact--a dwarf female. As they say, it's impossible to tell them apart (Tolkien's idea, not Jackson's). Sounds like an amusing bit to me and could be handled well... I'm pretty positive that GDT, who likens himself to a dwarf, will not demean the film dwarves with the Gimli-treatment. In fact, I'm hoping that Thorin, Balin and Dori especially are respectfully and intelligently handled.
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...keep PJ away from any of the Dwarves in the Hobbit. Heavens, I can just imagine him going on advising delToro to have Thorin "Now, when Thoo-ryn steyups into the Elves firelit circle, have him announce his presence with A REALLY BIG FAHT!" Brrr and shudder.Lawks, according to an article (search James McAvoy) over at IMDB, Jack Freakin' Black is actually being considered for Bilbo! "A source tells British newspaper the Daily Express, "A number of names have been doing the rounds, including Daniel Radcliffe and Jack Black, but James (McAvoy) is the one the film's bosses really want."...so goes the quote. I will unconditionally state right now that I will NOT be going to see ANY Hobbit movie with Jack Black in it. Not even as a Dwarf!BTW, read your post above concerning Holm's role and I like the idea. But, erm, are you implying the Red Book of Westmarch is, is...f-f-FICTION?!!!
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...brutha Conan {[:^) Hey, I were only half joking...nothing PJ does surprises me anymore. Well, I must say the bit about Jack Black, if true, would be truly (and dispicably) surprising. Hmmm, maybe they'll make the Master of Laketown a woman. Still think my idea of having Goldberry as beorn's wife would be the ticket. Yes, then you could sort of have Bombadil included.On another note, anyone can tell the difference between Dwarves...just look for the hairiest of the two, that would be the female. Think Cousin It.
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...after hanging up his cell phone, "Bugger. Kine yesterday, kine terday an' it looks like it'll be kine tomorrow! Why can't we have a little manflesh every once in a while?Sauron's gaze falls upon the scrap of parchment he pulled from his Westkit, " Dammit! Burnt the grocery list again!"
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Mrs Sauron: Look what the Fell Beast has done on the family room floor! It’s going to take an Age of MiddleEarth to clean it up.”
Sauron: Would you please, shut the fuck up, please?
Mrs Sauron: No need to be a potty mouth, dear. As I used to say to dear old Mrs Gorthaur, what’s the point of being a Dark Lord if you can’t relax after work and have a nice conversation.
Sauron: Look, actually, I’m quite busy at the moment with this whole … er… darn Pelennor thing. Apparently the bloody Witchking has been quite seriously stabbed by some midget and his Scandinavian girlfriend. Turned him into another useless spirit of malice crying impotently in dark places. Fat lot of help he turned out to be.
Mrs Sauron: Goodness me. Does that mean that nice Mrs Angmar won’t be coming to lunch tomorrow. And I invited Shelob too!
Sauron: Um, dear, I think there may be a little problemo there as well.
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Mrs Sauron: Sauron! SAURON! Hello!!! I’m talking to you. The Fell Beast got into the trash again.
Sauron: Give me a goddamn break! I’m busier than a one-legged orc in a dwarf kicking contest, WORKING MY BUTT OFF to cover the world with a Second Darkness and you’re bitching about entrails on the lawn?
Mrs Sauron: “Lawn” is a teensy overstatement isn’t it? It looks like Anfauglith out there. I’m so embarrassed. My front yard is the roofless grave of the charred bones of the slain. Nice! I don’t suppose you could, like, rake the frikking ashes instead of watching OrcSports on the damn Palantir all day.
Sauron: Yeah, that’s right. Bitch, bitch, bitch. Get Gothmog to do it! What the hell do we have a Foul Lieutenant for anyway? Why don’t you try bending your whole malice, will and power on like, throwing out my charred rainments, finding my goddamn prosthetic finger and GETTING OUT OF MY FACE. And by the way, where are the fucken' EYE DROPS?
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