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Our first review of Kevin Smith's ZACK AND MIRI MAKE A PORNO cums in!

Published at: May 14, 2008, 3 a.m. CST by quint

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here. We got our first review in from a test screening of Zack and Miri Makes a Porno from Kevin Smith. It's a really positive review, but he has an issue with some of the drama. When reading the below review (spoiler alert, by the way) I get the feeling that the gut punch and anger was intended. I'm excited to see this flick. Enjoy the review, but again... beware of spoilers and keep in mind this film is most likely still being shaped and probably will be a bit different when it hits theaters.

Not sure who to send this sort of thing to, so I'm gonna hit Quint, Moriarty AND Harry just in case. So I managed to get into a very early test screening of Kevin Smith's latest thing, "Zack & Miri Make a Porno," in a certain midwestern city tonight. The story takes place around the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays, and I'm sure you know the scoop: Zack (Seth Rogen) and Miri (Elizabeth Banks) are platonic pals living in an apartment with no electricity and no water and are about to default on their rent until, lo and behold, circumstances involving a cell phone camera and a high school reunion provide Zack with a revelation: They should make a porno film to solve their monetary woes. The enthusiasm quickly overtakes him and even infects Miri until they even agree to do a scene together. Of course, once they wind up actually facing the reality of sex together, years of pent-up feelings rise to the surface and make them fall in love. If I had to describe it, I'd say it's similar to "The 40-Year-Old Virgin" - it's a raunchy sex comedy that also wants to have a sweet romance at its center. As such, there are really two merits that must be examined here: The comedy and the romance. The comedy? It's pretty much great, and it's all thanks to some hilarious dialogue. Some of the strongest stuff I've heard from Smith in years comes out here, and he even manages to avoid going down a road of heavy pop culture influence. The cast of supporting characters, which includes Jason Mewes playing someone who's NOT pot-dealer Jay for once plus real porn star Katie Morgan as a dense but sweet stripper, is pretty much spot-on. Despite the fact that they're making a porno together, these people manage to seem endearing and sweet. A cameo turn from Justin Long is particularly hilarious. Zack's best pal, played by Craig Robinson, is a little more hit and miss: Some of his dialogue is among the strongest in the movie, but the jokes about his wife (and her eventual appearance towards the end) are just depressing and unpleasant. The situational comedy stuff is mostly good, too, with lots of hilarious beats during the porno shoot. However, this is also where weaknesses start to crop up: While some of it is great, some of it's just way too obvious. Miri goes to her high school reunion and spots her old crush and immediately wants to seduce him. Quick, what do you think she'll find out during this scene? Your first guess is likely correct. A girl is complaining of constipation shortly before shooting a sex scene: Quick, what do you think will happen next? It's so predictable that it elicits groans. Which brings us to the main problem with the film: The romance. It's not the fault of the actors: Seth Rogan actually gets to do some real serious emotional stuff here, and I was surprised by how affecting he is. Elizabeth Banks proves that she deserves to be a headliner with how damn good she is at hitting those emotional notes. The problem is that, although I buy into the relationship and the chemistry they share, I don't root for it. I believe these two have feelings for each other, but ultimately, I don't want them to get together. No, instead I root for them to go their separate ways, learn lessons from their mistakes and never speak to one another again. Why? I was actually on-board during the film's middle, but there's a big scene where the shit hits the fan and Zack and Miri have it out in the back room of a coffee shop: Sadly, this is the scene where Miri goes beyond the pale and reveals herself to be scheming, manipulative and vicious. It would be more understandable if she the situation wasn't entirely her own fault, but her own manipulations get her here and she shows no sign of remorse as she viciously rips Zack in two. After this... she vanishes for 15 minutes and has only two or three lines of dialogue for the entire rest of the movie. She never gets any chance to redeem herself. Instead, the last act deals - unbelievably - with ZACK hunting her down and apologizing for, um, the fact that SHE betrayed and used him and assumed things about him? Waitaminute... that's... As the lights went up, I wondered if my lack of sympathy for Miri after this scene was, perhaps, a "guy thing" because of how she manipulated Zack. So I talked to my girlfriend about it, who also attended with me, and we agreed completely: We hated Miri after her bullshit in that scene, and unfortunately she never gets any chance to apologize, to show that she really cares about him. She just sits teary-eyed on a toilet, then delivers a couple more lines in the last seconds of the movie and we're supposed to somehow accept her again. Neither I nor my lady friend did so. The "happy" ending is unearned. Maybe it sounds like I'm taking this too seriously - it's a sex comedy, right? - but Smith obviously wants us to take the relationship seriously, given how seriously he presents their big emotional scenes together. The good news is that, even though the heart of the movie doesn't really fly, the comedy pretty much does. It's all about the dialogue, and the dialogue is some of the best stuff he's done since his mid-90s work for me. That, and the chance to enjoy a great ensemble and some strong performances, make it worth seeing. It's just a damn shame that the emotional core didn't work. It's not too late, though - he's got plenty of months left to give Miri another new scene or two where she expresses plenty of remorse to make her seem less like a stone-cold bitch. If you get some use from this, call me "Snake Oiler."

Readers Talkback

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  • May 14, 2008, 3:05 a.m. CST

    First?

    by Hamish

  • May 14, 2008, 3:05 a.m. CST

    1st!!!!

    by surprider

    porn rocks!!!

  • May 14, 2008, 3:06 a.m. CST

    Thought it would never happen.

    by Hamish

    And in a Kevin Smith thread. Does this mean I came first at Zack and Miri's porno?

  • May 14, 2008, 3:07 a.m. CST

    Plant!

    by photoboy

    Seriously, he has a girlfriend, he can't be real.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:14 a.m. CST

    FIFTH!!!!!

    by TheGoddamnSiege

    I fucking rule.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:15 a.m. CST

    I had a Feeling...

    by Redfive!

    This was trying to be the 40 Year old "unofficial" Virgin sequel. Kev even said he first noticed rogen in virgin and thats what made him write the part for him. The lower the expectations the bigger the reward.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:20 a.m. CST

    Snoogans!!

    by sheathledger

    Kevin Smith always gives HIS audience what they want. even when going for a new audience he satisfies his regulars. it takes less to retain customers than it does to attract new ones and i hope Zack & Miri will open up the world of Mr Smith to those who have previously shyed away from it. Jersey Girl like a motherfucker!!

  • May 14, 2008, 3:31 a.m. CST

    Smith/Spielberg

    by Fineus Fog

    liek is bearded idol Smith has a lot of trouble wrapping up his films - dont get me wring I love the guy - but nearly everyone of his films has had a rushed/badly timed ending. I stil sit and watch the damn thing tho. I would watch Rogen read the phonebook. As long as this doesnt inspire his uglier, less funny doppelganger Jonah Hill to put try and put his fat, ugly fave in a Smith movie I'm happy

  • May 14, 2008, 3:33 a.m. CST

    Kevin Smith

    by bender7

    He confuses me. I really liked Clerks, but didn't really like any other movies in what is I guess the Jay and Silent Bob saga. But I saw Clerks II recently and thought it was freakin hilarious.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:38 a.m. CST

    bender7

    by Fineus Fog

    dare I say it - I enjoyed Clerks II alot more than I do the first Clerks - it has not aged well at all

  • May 14, 2008, 3:45 a.m. CST

    katie morgan is a cutie

    by bacci40

    both she and kimberly kane prove that not all chicks in porn are stupid sluts...just sluts...but the whole premise is stupid as shit...this is the age of the internet...making a porn tape wont make you shit in terms of real dollars...the premise is 10 years too late...unless smith placed it during the 90s...which he didnt...kevin smith is the fat version of woody allen...funny as hell in person, filled with tons of talent, but keeps making movies that no one will go see...go back to writing the script for green arrow, you fat fuck

  • May 14, 2008, 3:54 a.m. CST

    I dont get it

    by hum noises for the Beast

    Every KS talkback has people saying how good Clerks 2 was, Im a fan of smith and his films even Jersey Girl had its charm but Clerks 2 was one of the biggest let downs when it came out, I just cant see the appeal!!

  • May 14, 2008, 3:55 a.m. CST

    Good point.

    by MaxTheSilent

    There are scores of site offering MAYBE a couple hundred bucks for home porn. It's not exactly a fertile ground for making a killing. But I'm a huge Kevin Smith fan, so I'll still be first in line to see it.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:58 a.m. CST

    A one way chat with Kev...

    by the funking prink

    "Hi everybody, I'm Kevin Smith. What was that? Yes, I did direct 'Clerks', and yes, it was very funny, thank you. What? 'Mallrats'? Yeah, I directd that too! I know it flopped, but some people liked it, some people even say it has a 'cult following' which means in the history books, I'll be seen as a cool guy forever. What? 'Chasing Amy', yup, guilty! That was me too, and thank you, it probably is the most interesting thing I've ever done. 'Dogma', yeah that was me too. What? It wasn't that good? Oh, I thought you guys loved it? It was a bit of a mess and required the deleted scenes on the DVD to make real sense of it? Ok, I can accept that. That's kinda why I vowed to not make any more Viewaskewniverse flicks after my next film, 'J&SBSK'. Pardon? It was pretty awful? Not really a film but actually a series of in-jokes? Ok, whatever you say dude. Well, my next flick was a departure, something new and real. What? 'Jersey Girl' was a story done many times before and I added nothing new to it and somehow made Affleck even less popular? Fuck you!! Well I decided to go back to my (de)grass(i) roots for my next piece. It was called 'Clerks II'. What? It was a steaming pile of shit? The 'ABC' dance sequence made no sense and ranks up with Spidey's dance in Spiderman 3 as one of the worst ever commited to film? But it was crude and edgy remember? It had donkey sex in it!! WHat? Donkey sex isn't funny? Well, I got Rosario Dawson to say she goes 'ass-to-mouth', so fuck you!! I somehow made that unsexy and not even remotely funny? Ok, I guess I should probably pack it in eh? I'm not cut out to make films. I've said all I have to say on celluloid. ...wait!! I saw this film the other day, it was called '40 yr old virgin', it had this fat guy in it who'd be perfect to replace my fat-ass as a staple character and maybe rejuvinate my career, as everything he touches seems to turn to gold right now. What was that? No this film is an original idea, it's all mine baby. 'I want candy'? No i haven't seen that. 'The girl next door'? Nope, never heard of it. Excuse me, I have to get back to my edgy horror film 'Red state', it's going to blow people away and change people's minds about my capabilities as a director. It won't be influenced by Eli Roth or anything like that. It's going to be scary. What?? 'Clerks II' was scary enough? Go fuck myself?? OK...

  • May 14, 2008, 3:58 a.m. CST

    Constructive criticism! Wow, that's rare.

    by V'Shael

    Does Kevin Smith love or hate this site right now? I can't keep track.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:02 a.m. CST

    Watch Kevin Smith post here soon

    by Orionsangels

  • May 14, 2008, 4:15 a.m. CST

    Smith is a very funny writer

    by RobFromBackEast

    All his films have their merits (even Jersey Girl). Give the guy a break - he's bagged an awesome cast for this as well. Fuck you all very much.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:19 a.m. CST

    I'd be interested to see what Kevin Smith makes

    by Lemming

    of this review...

  • May 14, 2008, 4:25 a.m. CST

    Kev Blows

    by Iamagoodguy

    Kevin Smith is the special Olympics of film making. Also his spoken word shit is super unfunny and lame and stop bitching about Superman the reason they did not move forward with your script is because it fucking sucked.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:27 a.m. CST

    Bless You Kevin Smith

    by DamnMichaelBay

    Damn You Michael Bay

  • May 14, 2008, 4:35 a.m. CST

    Damn You Michael Bay

    by MCMLXXVI

    Damn You Michael Bay

  • May 14, 2008, 4:35 a.m. CST

    Remember when sex comedies actually had nudity in them?

    by Sledge Hammer

    Instead of just "raunchy" language and "adult situations"? I miss those days.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:39 a.m. CST

    Agreed, good review

    by tomdolan04

    I'd go as far to say...it was awesome. Let's face it thats about as indepth as other reviews go isnt it? The rest just seem to think a running commentary of what happened in the film constitutes a review.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:57 a.m. CST

    Wait a minute, well argued reviews...

    by filmcoyote

    on AICN, surely not. Smith should actually take note of this. I've thought for some time that this site no longer had much relevance to filmmakers because the reviews are so rarely well thought out and examined, this review is actually a breath of fresh air. Well done sir. Let's hope Kevin takes note.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:20 a.m. CST

    I fucking hate kevin smith

    by jamazio

    He's such an overrated ltd director who makes tarantino look like an artist. I don't think he's ever moved on or tried to progress in his career. He lacks any range whatsoever and all he can do is make sex comedies. Fair enough you say but I don't remember any directors of the carry on films and sex screwball comedies of the 80s being as famous as him. Why on earth this guy is so well known is such a huge mystery to me.....

  • May 14, 2008, 5:27 a.m. CST

    Kevin Smith is O V E R R A T E D

    by The Gospel According to Bastardface

    He cannot write a good story. He seems to have no control over himself and his work always comes off as amateur beyond belief. I won't be seeing this. Oh, and I'm Fucking Seth Rogen was crap and embarrassing.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:31 a.m. CST

    I Dont Fucking Hate Kevin Smith

    by sheathledger

    I Like him. He is funny and articulate and proves that given the combination of talent and luck the dream is achievable whatever that dream may be. His movies entertain and if its not your cup of tea than dont watch them. just stop hating on someone who has made a career out of providing his core audience with what they essentially look for in each movie while trying to attract new ones. I wish i had the ingenuity and guts to do what he has done but like most talkbackers i have not written a screenplay, gone to movie school, dropped out of said movie school and maxed out credit cards to make my dreams come true. He had a goal, achieved it and has repeated his success since. I love everything he has done to date, in particular Mallrats & jersey Girl. Why? cos i just do cos its my tastes and preferences and opinions. As an irishman i dont want to visit new york or las vegas. i wanna go to Jersey(not the shit tax haven off the uk)

  • May 14, 2008, 5:37 a.m. CST

    it would be awesome to if kevin responds to this

    by angrykirby.tk

    will he defend his ending or will he agree he's screwed up and wabble into the editing room? only time will tell.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:41 a.m. CST

    ENDING

    by sheathledger

    the ending is probably true to life...when the woman is more relatively attractive than the man he will end up apologising no matter what has gone down. better looking one in the couple always holds the power.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:43 a.m. CST

    I'm Kevin Smith

    by UMAGA

    You dudes like my flood pants? I gotta be on Degrassi dude I was like so stoked it was radical. Fuck where's my Twinkie? Cowabunga.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:43 a.m. CST

    I STILL fucking hate Kevin Smith

    by jamazio

    I think one of the biggest problems I have with him is the fact that a.) He's almost as famous as many other far better directors out there and b.) like you say, He had a goal, achieved it and has repeated his success since. I would've admired him more if he at least even tried to move on and do something different instead of remake the same fucking movie but with different characters. Imagine if PT Anderson never moved on from Boogie Nights (a mixture of Altman and Scorsese with quite a bit of Kevin Smith style dialogue thrown in) and never ended up making the masterpiece that is There Will Be Blood. I just think that if you have any sense as a director and any real passion for proper movies then once your well known you'll use that to your advantage and at least attempt to make something different. All his films rely heavily on sexual dialogue and pop culture references with a crap attempt at making a love story yet he remains well known. Why I'll never know.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:45 a.m. CST

    jamazio

    by sheathledger

    if it aint broke then dont fix it

  • May 14, 2008, 5:46 a.m. CST

    Kevin SMith should listen to this and

    by ingloriousjedi

    Reshoot some scenes so that Zack realizes that he doesn't even like Miri, and this realization makes him happy. (But he still jacks off to scenes of them having sex together) Then we see Miri ends up doing bukkake porn for other directors as a total skank.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:48 a.m. CST

    sheathledger

    by jamazio

    I'm not too sure what you mean by that statement...

  • May 14, 2008, 5:49 a.m. CST

    Yet another Kevin Smith flop...

    by Karl Childers

  • May 14, 2008, 5:50 a.m. CST

    How can Kevin Smith be overrated?

    by Razorback

    He doesn't get huge build-up from anyone but his fans. The critics and journalists like him, sure, but that is because he is a likable guy. But overrated? No way.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:54 a.m. CST

    Jamazio

    by sheathledger

    his formula works for him,so he doesnt really deviate from it, its not broken so he doesnt need to fix it. he hates on his own movie jersey girl because the popular concensus is that it sucks. so he went back to the tried and tested. granted he didnt push himself far out of the askewniverse but enough to know that people want the familiar stuff from him when he does with red state i will prob be oh this isnt what i signed up for because whn i go to a kevin smith movie i know what i am getting. Let him do his thing and let others do theirs i say.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:06 a.m. CST

    Likeable, ha!

    by jamazio

    I do admit he has some kind of sense of humour and should be relegated to being a stand up comedian, but I have a serious issue with him as a director. He's writing is slightly better, but I honestly do believe that its the internet that has kept his career alive for so long. As for writing witty pop culture references etc Simon Pegg wrote him under the table with that in spaced and even he in some ways has progressed as a writer with films he wrote with Edgar Wright. And I don't think being 'likeable' should mean he should be as bafflingly successful as he is as a 'film maker', and btw alot of critics and journalists think he sucks, too.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:07 a.m. CST

    I liked Clerks II best

    by FILMFUNK

    I liked Chasing Amy, Jersey Girl, but didn't get Dogma or J and silent Bob Strike Back and Mallrats was OK. I worked with a kid who was Smith nuts and wouldn't hear any criticism of any kind against anything he's done so he obviously has a loyal to the death fanbase of mostly slightly younger audience members than he actually is which i think is a feat in itself and this sounds no diff. Anyway I don't hate him or his movies so i guess i'm a cock too!

  • May 14, 2008, 6:08 a.m. CST

    Jamazio

    by sheathledger

    I agree 150% I love spaced and have had my box set for 3 years.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:14 a.m. CST

    sheathledger

    by jamazio

    Glad to see that spaced is a far better example of the kind of thing smith keeps on doing and it was a fucking tv series!

  • May 14, 2008, 6:15 a.m. CST

    That ending reminded me of the end of

    by OBSD

    Pretty In Pink. When Molly Ringwald is completely dissed and ignored by Andrew McCarthy because he can't reconcile having a poor girlfriend,. Then they run into each other at the prom at what happens? She apologizes to him! For what? She did nothing wrong! That shit always pissed me off. It didn't make sense and was obviously a sloppy reshoot that had nothing to do with the rest of the movie and everything to do with actress Molly Ringwald not wanting her character to be with Ducky. But I digress. I hope Kevin Smith is paying attention. Your characters have to earn their happy endings. Most movies don't have that, but I feel like Kevin is smart enough to realize that his film needs to reshoot an ending that makes sense.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:25 a.m. CST

    Good review

    by LeSange

    It sounds like yet another entertaining film from K. Smith. Awesome.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:29 a.m. CST

    THAT, unlike some certain Dr. Jones reviews, was great.

    by beastie

    It's a little disappointing that the reviewer didn't consider the film to be great, but his reasoning was sound. </p><p>This is pretty much what these test screenings are for. To me, it sounds like the majority of these problems can be fixed by opening. If not, I'll go, most likely enjoy the dialogue, but still pine for the days of Clerks and Chasing Amy (no matter what Smith does, and he's done some stuff I consider AWFUL, those movies will always be my 90's comedies.) </p><p>What's most disappointing to me is the Craig Robinson stuff. That guy has, hands down, the funniest and dryest stuff on The Office and I've really been looking foward to seeing him in this and Pineapple Express.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:59 a.m. CST

    Stop the presses. People hate Kevin Smith...

    by SilentJonBob

    Wow big surprise. I love when the haters talk about how crappy his movies are. It makes me love them more. Not everybody's going to like everything. I enjoy his work and if this movie is anything like the reviewer said it was. I am going to love this one as well. If you guys hate KS movies fine. But posting on the talkback just makes me want to see this movie more now.

  • May 14, 2008, 7:04 a.m. CST

    sounds really lame

    by BrowncoatJedi

    and no naked Elizabeth Banks = pass

  • May 14, 2008, 7:10 a.m. CST

    hating on Kevin smith

    by j2talk

    hating on Kevin smith is like hating on oh i dont know say (gasp) heath ledger either you like what he does or it comes off to you as the same shit each time and you dont buy it....its all a mtter of tasteof course even if you hate the guy you've got to admit once in a while they get it right.....

  • May 14, 2008, 7:14 a.m. CST

    Love him or hate him,

    by Darth WickedChicken

    Kevin Smith is living a dream. I for one love him. His style of humor favors me. I didn't see Jersey Girl, but love everything else. From the original Clerks down to my autographed copy of Chasing Amy.

  • May 14, 2008, 7:34 a.m. CST

    Kevin fuckin' Smith?

    by Motoko Kusanagi

    That pathetic jerkoff needs to stay away from movies. He can't fuckin' act (DIE HARD 4.0 anyone?) and after the great CLERKS he proved that he can't fuckin' direct, too.

  • May 14, 2008, 7:54 a.m. CST

    No nudity in these flicks...

    by BizarroJerry

    While I wasn't really a fan of that Dewey Cox movie, I was pleased that they included nudity, and just for the sake of being funny. Lotsa topless ladies in it. Of course, they also threw in the gratuitous look at some guy's pee-pee... Wait! Forgetting Sarah whatever also showed us some guy's junk. What the hell? The guys are now willing to show us a penis but most actresses these days won't even take off their top? Damn "integrity".

  • May 14, 2008, 7:55 a.m. CST

    Kevin Smith has done some great work.

    by jimmay

    I still get a kick out of Mallrats and Clerks, and Clerks II was just the right medium between drama and comedy that he's been trying so hard for with all his other movies. That said, Dogma is an obnoxious, juvenile mess that thinks it's far more clever than anyone else will rightfully ever give it credit for, Jay and Silent Bob was, is, one of the dumbest movies released in a long time, and Jersey Girl was sappy, trite, and reaked of pandering to the mainstream.

  • May 14, 2008, 7:58 a.m. CST

    So the guy does nothing wrong and apologizes anyway?

    by rev_skarekroe

    Sounds like Smith's most realistic film yet.

  • May 14, 2008, 8:14 a.m. CST

    Dogma

    by Series7

    Is probably one of the top five comedies of all time. Anyone knocking KS obviously hasn't seen it. Also all the controversy surrounding it from the Christian community who really missed the boat when it came to the point of the movie. Which all in all was almost a pro religious movie. I did enjoy the shit out of Clerks 2. But Dogma will be KS best work, he'll always be known for Clerks (animated show rocked as well, the fact that he got Alec Baldwin (while Matt and Trey opted not to use him in Team America) is classic as well). <P> j2talk<P> I don't really see your KS/Heath Ledger comparison. I don't think there is that much hate/love for Heath Bar. I don't think people REALLY HATE Heath like people REALLY HATE KS. They may not like him but they don't hate him.

  • May 14, 2008, 8:21 a.m. CST

    Jason Mewes, Katie Morgan, and Kevin Smith

    by BobParr

    Three of the most untalented people on the planet all in the same film. I'M THERE!!!!!!!

  • May 14, 2008, 8:24 a.m. CST

    heh-heh... Snake Oiler..

    by malificus

    Let's all bash Kevin Smith...it's fun! Nah, really the guy tries hard with all he's got, he just ain't got enough to carry an entire movie. Much like Sir Macca who has no Johnny Conscience to tell him when he sucks, he's cranking out The Girl Is Mine over and over when he could be blasting out a Let It Be. He should get smart get himself a Matt Damon to hang out with, worked for Ben Affleck, right?

  • May 14, 2008, 8:33 a.m. CST

    I like Kevin Smith.

    by Knuckleduster

    But the dude has to move on. Can't just do the same shit over and over again. Then again, I watch his shit over and over again, so maybe he knows best. Chasing Amy is my favourite.<p> One thing that bugs me, though. The dude didn't like Magnolia. Sad. I wonder how he feels now that PTA has (once again) proven himself to be the great filmmaker that he is.<p> Also, I wonder if he's jealous that his buddy Ben has proven himself to be a better director than Smith.

  • May 14, 2008, 8:39 a.m. CST

    Is kevin smith still having his characters use $10 words?

    by Jugdish

    God thats annoying to see high school graduates use big words...cause they never do in real life

  • May 14, 2008, 8:40 a.m. CST

    A review that made sense!

    by David Cloverfield

    I love reviews that filmmakers could actually use to improve their work. On Dogma: My first exposure to Kevin Smith was when I rented DOGMA, I had no idea it was from a "cult director" but the cover looked interesting. It was awesome. Kevin Smith is someone who you can enjoy more without preconceptions. I don't give a shit about his personality or his other movies, Dogma, Clerks and Chasing Amy were great. That's enough for me.

  • May 14, 2008, 8:59 a.m. CST

    Knuckleduster...

    by beastie

    I think Keven Smith said that he generally enjoys P.T. Anderson. I think he said that he really enjoyed Boogie Nights, just not Magnolia.</p><p>I am in agreement with people who didn't like Dogma, though. Not entirely. I do somewhat enjoy it, but I have read the third draft of the script and seen the movie, but the third draft felt more developed than what ended up on the screen. To me. I thought that some of the immature humor actually pulled the audience away from the point that the film tried to make. More attention needed to be payed to the fallen angels and their plight than Jay trying to fuck Bethany. Also, Azrael's point and reason was really muddled.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:05 a.m. CST

    Dogma

    by Knuckleduster

    It was fun. The only major flaw, in my opinion, is that half the film seems to consist of characters explaining the plot to one another. That movie is exposition-crazy.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:08 a.m. CST

    I heard he was doing Schindler's List 2

    by wazza

    That would kick ass

  • May 14, 2008, 9:23 a.m. CST

    Damn you Pillow Pants

    by Dr Gregory House

    Damn you to HELL!!!

  • May 14, 2008, 9:27 a.m. CST

    Jersey Girl was a glorified TV pilot

    by CarmillaVonDoom

    Other than that his resume is pretty solid. Not exciting, or revolutionary, but solid. This one seems a little desperate, but compared to Red State, it sounds like Citizen Kane. Word to KS....lock the script to Red State in a trunk and toss it into the Atlantic.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:48 a.m. CST

    BobParr

    by Series7

    How would you know that Katie Morgan is untalented as an actress? In a REAL movie?

  • May 14, 2008, 10 a.m. CST

    I hate Kevin Smith fans

    by messi

    fucking annoying cunts.

  • May 14, 2008, 10:04 a.m. CST

    Dogma is brilliant...

    by The Grug

    And I really dug Chasing Amy too, not so keen on the rest of Smith's films, but 'hating' on them seems pretty stupid to me - there's so much worse stuff out there...

  • May 14, 2008, 10:09 a.m. CST

    mixed feelings?

    by pocketlint59

    his movies really do swing to the extremes of funny... I'll most likely give him the benefit of the doubt, or at least hear something more about this movie before a decision is made

  • May 14, 2008, 10:18 a.m. CST

    messi

    by Series7

    I never understood hatred for Kevin Smith. I mean the dude got lucky and he knows it. He knows he is not that great as well. Also he had the oppertunity to make a couple of comic book movies and either he passed or didn't get it. Which says a lot, he respects source material and knows his limits. I mean could you imagine Tim Story telling executives that he was not cute out to make a good Fantastic Four movie? No, he probably got offered it and was hell yeah. If there is anything to hate about Kevin Smith its that none of us have as much motivation to get off our lazy asses and even attempt to do what he did. And I bet he's had many a oppertunity to sell out, and the one time he kind of did (Jersey Girl) he get shit on so hard for. And i think he realized his mistake. So why are we annoying for being fans of him?

  • May 14, 2008, 10:23 a.m. CST

    A movie is good whether or not you like the characters?

    by messi

    huh?

  • May 14, 2008, 10:55 a.m. CST

    I don't like Smith's work as much as I used to

    by myspoonistoobig

    But they've endured as enjoyable longer than some of the other stuff I've liked. Clerks, Chasing Amy and Dogma are his best, Mallrats is okay, Clerks II is pretty mediocre EXCEPT for the scene in the jail, which is clearly the movie's point and the strongest part of the whole film, and Jersey Girl was all over the map. Although given Kevin and Tim's history, I think its really funny that Kevin put Sweeney Todd on the big screen before Burton.

  • May 14, 2008, 10:59 a.m. CST

    Dogma sucked royal monkey dick.

    by Motoko Kusanagi

    Only good thing: Alanis as Gawd. That was pretty cool. But the rest was just terribly, terribly boring.

  • May 14, 2008, 11:08 a.m. CST

    As long as he doesn't try to write another comic...

    by DallasGoodbar

    we'll be fine. I hate that fat douche bag!

  • May 14, 2008, 11:10 a.m. CST

    Zack and Miri make a

    by skimn

    Snuff Film. Now that would get them out of debt.<p>BTW, I hope this raises Banks' profile in the industry. I thought she was one the best things in Slither, and she makes even Laura Bush look hot (hotter?).

  • May 14, 2008, 11:13 a.m. CST

    Because amateur porn is so rare in this day and age . . .

    by davida4348

    you can make a ton of money by just making one.

  • May 14, 2008, 11:17 a.m. CST

    Series7

    by j2talk

    Series7 my comment was about the way people feel about Kevin smith and Heath ledger......Some people love kevin smiths work others cant stand it or view it as 1 hit Clerks- and the rest just rehashes for Ledger you got 1 remarkable film-Brokeback - and a pile of .....and he when he died suddenly he's "the Greatest actor of his generation" spare me.....look back at the posts after he died... Me i have enjoyed All of Kevin smiths work..i dont understand the hate- you got to accept his films for what they are- 1hr and half 2 hrs amusement on a saturday afternoon...they are not great art but entertainment.... It the HATERS and the rapid FANS who make more out of it than what it is a MOVIE you spent your 7 buck wacth it and are entertained for a while then you back to everday life....

  • May 14, 2008, 11:25 a.m. CST

    take all the women out of clerks 2

    by MrScientist

    a u have a good movie. both female leads were casted wrong and writte lamely.

  • May 14, 2008, 11:27 a.m. CST

    skimn

    by Series7

    You know she's in the new W. movie right? That'll probably get her more spotlight then this.

  • May 14, 2008, 11:28 a.m. CST

    I love Elizabeth Banks.

    by Novaman5000

    That is all.

  • May 14, 2008, 11:55 a.m. CST

    I don't understand the Kevin Smithe hate

    by liljuniorbrown

    I've never met the guy but he comes across as very "unhollywood" and he seems to be doing projects that he really has alot invested in. I ugess it's just nature, everybody's got to hate somebody.

  • May 14, 2008, 12:47 p.m. CST

    Banks as Bush

    by skimn

    Yup, current cover of EW..

  • May 14, 2008, 12:47 p.m. CST

    People hate Smith

    by Magnum Opus

    because they want to be him, which they hate themselves for and refuse to admit.

  • May 14, 2008, 12:58 p.m. CST

    FilmCoyote

    by brian_orion

    FilmCoyote is Totally Kevin Smith! I should totally get a cookie for figuring that one out. Indeed it was an excellent review, do you agree with his comments about how the Miri character winds up? It would be so cool if the final release had a different ending. The internet is bad for films in some ways, but seeing films through like this is totally awesome.

  • May 14, 2008, 1:02 p.m. CST

    I must confess. I am Snake Oiler.

    by NinjaRap

    Yeah, that's my review. I'm glad you guys liked it, and I thank Quint for posting it. I tried to avoid spoilers as much as possible. I wanted to keep this review vague, because really, the dialogue is something you should experience for yourself. Sadly, I'm sure you're going to see a lot more spoilers in all of the trailers and commercials. I did want to to share my opinion of the Miri issue because the studio-type lady at the end of the screening managed to choose everybody sitting on BOTH SIDES of me and my girl to be part of the focus group, but didn't choose us because we were "too old" to fit what she was looking for, supposedly. If it helps you get any perspective, I'm 28 and she's 32, so maybe we're a LITTLE older than the target demographic here. The studio had us rate the film either Excellent, Very Good, Good, Fair or Poor. The girl gave the film "Excellent" and I gave it "Very Good" overall. She said that even though she never really forgave Miri for the fact that her manipulations nearly destroy her relationship with Zack, she still found the final scene too adorable to stop herself from giving it an "Excellent"... which, you know, fair enough. Ironically, as the movie starts, we both kept thinking that Zack was the one who didn't deserve Miri, who clearly seemed the more mature of the two of them whereas Zack was just kind of a tool. They ended up on an equal playing level for us around the middle, then things flipped the other way after the infamous "coffee house back room" scene and suddenly we had trouble liking Miri anymore. If it helps you get any MORE perspective, my favorite Smith film is probably Clerks 2, even though I think his strongest dialogue stuff was more like the Mallrats/Chasing Amy period. Anyway, I look forward to seeing what the final film looks like in October. So it's not like I didn't like it enough to watch it again. I'll definitely go again. It's very funny.

  • May 14, 2008, 1:17 p.m. CST

    Smith makes flawed films.....that are hilarious!

    by g-ride9000

    fuck magnolia

  • May 14, 2008, 1:17 p.m. CST

    I like Smithy

    by Col. Tigh-Fighter

    And am looking forward to this one. Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back and Dogma are 2 of my favourite comedies. And he seems like a decent fella, standing by his best mate Jay whatever happened. Go Kevin. I'll be there :)

  • May 14, 2008, 1:19 p.m. CST

    oh katie morgan

    by Bouncy X

    she had such a nice, good pair of real boobs...then she went and got fakes, and ugly ones at that. way to ruin your sexiness. but her face is still cute and her voice too.

  • May 14, 2008, 1:41 p.m. CST

    I don't hate Smith

    by ZeroCorpse

    I like the guy.

  • May 14, 2008, 2:17 p.m. CST

    great review!

    by quadrupletree

    i hope Kevin Smith sees this and makes some changes. I'm probably going to see his movie either way but this review sounds reasonable and level headed as constructive criticism and not a fan boy or hater emotional diatribe.

  • May 14, 2008, 2:58 p.m. CST

    Snake Oiler

    by mr.brownstone

    Why apologize for taking the movie too seriously. It's pretty obvious Smith takes himself very seriously even if his public persona is self deprecating. That ending sounds like more of the contrived bullshit we get at the end of almost all his movies.

  • May 14, 2008, 3:18 p.m. CST

    wow...are there some people here who hate smith

    by slappy jones

  • May 14, 2008, 3:20 p.m. CST

    wow...are there some people here who hate smith??

    by slappy jones

    thats incredible. I never would have guessed. Its not like every single time a smith related story pops up here and the same tired lonely voices pop up to explain how they hate him the most and that he is the worst film maker in the world. Its not predictable and pathetic at all.

  • May 14, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    Endings?

    by enderandrew

    Chasing Amy has one of the best endings to a rom-com of all time. And I'm not necessarily talking about a proposed three-some, but rather the painful and honest truth that two people can be madly in love with each other, fuck it up, and end up apart. I can't wait to see this personally.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:07 p.m. CST

    Hey Imagoodguy...

    by bradyboulanger

    "Kevin Smith is the special Olympics of film making. Also his spoken word shit is super unfunny and lame and stop bitching about Superman the reason they did not move forward with your script is because it fucking sucked." We've all seen An Evening With Kevin Smith to mother fucker.

  • May 14, 2008, 5:28 p.m. CST

    I like Kevin

    by hallmitchell

    His comics are fantastic. I always get laughs out of his films. I even shed a tear in Clerks 2 because it related to my own situation a few years back. B.T.W. I have slagged him off when I felt he deserved it. Yet he always gets my money except on Jersey Girl.

  • May 14, 2008, 6:16 p.m. CST

    I miss Kevin Smith.

    by EARTH

  • May 14, 2008, 6:18 p.m. CST

    I miss Kevin Smith.

    by EARTH

    Haven't really been blown away by anything he's done since Chasing Amy quite frankly. I had such high expectations for Clerks II and it just missed the mark for me. I also don't get why he's pissed at Howard Stern. Stern thinks it's because he said he didn't understand/like his movies?!? If that's the case, he'd hate my guts! Come back Kevin. Write that funny as shit dialogue!!!!

  • May 14, 2008, 7:39 p.m. CST

    oh man, finally a kevin smith thread

    by birdy birdman

    he is incapable of writing actual characters, only thinly veiled versions of himself waving his fat finger as societal archetypes for twenty five minute beats, he sucks, and he talked shit about PTA for making the anti-smith film, i know it's about 10 years old at this point but fuck it, fuck it he sucks bad CLERKS II PEOPLE...CLERKS II

  • May 14, 2008, 8:19 p.m. CST

    A buddy of mine was at this screening last night.

    by Rev. Slappy

    He said he got to listen to Harvey Weinstein berate somebody over the phone.

  • May 14, 2008, 8:45 p.m. CST

    Fat, ugly smartasses hate seeing fat, ugly smartasses succeed.

    by Flim Springfield

  • May 14, 2008, 8:57 p.m. CST

    Ah yes, Harvey.

    by NinjaRap

    I got to hear him saying "Shut the fuck up! Shut the fuck up!" on his hone on the way out of the screening, too. Sounded to me like he was joking around rather than actually berating somebody, though. By the way, nice line of black vans guarded by huge goons, guys. Not at all conspicuous.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:18 p.m. CST

    Out Kevin Smithing Kevin Smith

    by hallmitchell

    Is Judd Apatow whose movies I will see if I see his name on any credit. There's no reason why Kevin couldn't have made a Superbad or a Knocked up. And my gut feeling tells me he knows it.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:19 p.m. CST

    DVD extra for Z and M

    by hallmitchell

    Would be Seth Rogen and Kevin Smith riffing on comics and the Green Hornet project.

  • May 14, 2008, 9:49 p.m. CST

    Never been a hater or lover of his work.

    by mrfan

    It never really got me excited. I have watched a few of his movies and never been that excited about his them. Seems to be the same thing in every movie. Maybe someday he will blow me away from something he has done. Favorite movie of his is Mallrats. Least favorite is Clerks 2. I also thought one of the best things about Dogma was getting Alan Rickman. Love that man's work.

  • May 14, 2008, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Where is all the Smithy hate?

    by slugbat

    I only read Smith talkbacks for the hate, because aside from Lucas bashing, this is some of the best comedy on the internodes. There are too many people these days reflexively defending Smith as they would if you made fun of a retard; you can never make fun of the retarded because someone will always be offended you picked on the dumb and helpless (even if its 100% true). Now these KS talkbacks now attract more defenders than if you were to start kicking a retarded puppy on the street. <p> There are usually a few clever moments in KS films, but you will eventually be smacked by a scene that is so awkward and embarrassing it makes you break into a sweat. Clerks 2 was probably the worst offender in that category for me; anything with his wife onscreen is absolutely intolerable to me. I remember watching J&SBSB before I knew who his wife was (or that he was even married), thinking how out of place that "actress" was with the other two chicks. That's about as generous as I can put it.

  • May 15, 2008, midnight CST

    I guess Sir Smith's decidedly unreceptive.

    by NinjaRap

    Apparently you can read his reaction to this review over at the View Askew board. He seems awfully defensive and angry about the review considering how positive the review really is, I thought, but it's hard to read vocal tone on the Interwebs, so maybe he's not really that bugged about it. His assertion that a groan of "EWWWW" is actually a good thing is not understood by me, but hey, whatever. I suppose it is for some people, they sure make enough gross-out comedies these days. To me, spraying poop isn't really funny, but I guess I'm not the right audience for that sort of joke.

  • May 15, 2008, 4:14 a.m. CST

    Roeper and Smith At the Movies

    by crazybubba

    Hey did anyone see Kevin Smith review movies with Richard Roeper? He was gutbusting, rolling in the aisles like the Def Comedy Jam funny. His directing career seems to be dead and he even admits that technically he is not a very strong director is strength is his writing and dialogue. Roger Ebert dies Smith should take his chair, but instead of being the well articulated liberal fat guy he could be the stereotypical blue collar comedic inexplcably married to a hot wife fat guy.

  • May 15, 2008, 4:17 a.m. CST

    Oh Yeah

    by crazybubba

    ....by the way, why the hell am I blogging at 3:30am about some dumb fat guy?...oh yeah my life sucks.

  • May 15, 2008, 4:38 a.m. CST

    Series7

    by messi

    I don't care if you like the movies, it's those specific myspace/livejournal fans who under fave movies list all his movies and say "they're amazing" but they don't really watch movies, but it's cool to like kevin smith movies. those fans.

  • May 15, 2008, 7:47 a.m. CST

    Sorry crazybubba.

    by mrfan

    His wife isn't hot.<p>Just my opinion. I know. Beauty is in the eye.