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‘I’m Making The Decisions!!’
Behold The Economist!!
SWEEPS DAY 15!! LOST 4.3!!

Published at: Feb. 14, 2008, 5:36 p.m. CST by hercules

I am – Hercules!!
“A war is coming!!” “Help!!!!” “I believe he can get us off this island!!” “He said the people on that ship were coming to kill us!! Are you??” “Not yet!!” Tonight’s episode, “The Economist,” was scripted by Edward Kitsis & Adam Horowitz (“Birds of Prey,” “One Tree Hill,” “Life As We Know It”). ABC tells us:
Locke's hostage may be the key to getting off the island, so Sayid and Kate go in search of their fellow castaway in an attempt to negotiate a peaceful deal. Guest starring are Ken Leung as Miles, Jeremy Davies as Daniel Faraday, Rebecca Mader as Charlotte, Jeff Fahey as Frank Lapidus, Mira Furlan as Danielle Rousseau, Marsha Thomason as Naomi, Armando Pucci as Italian man and Thekla Reuten as Elsa.
Beware superspoilers. What we think we know about tonight’s “Lost”: * Sayid will propose a deal with angry psychic Miles and bushypilot Frank. * Ben will continue with the taunting. * Locke will fail to find Jacob’s cabin. * Hurley will question Locke’s leadership. * Kate will join Sayid and Miles for a big convergence on Othertown. * Kate will find Sawyer, then leave him, presumably to throw in with Jack. * The flashforwards are Sayid’s. * Sayid is revealed to be, like Jack, Kate and Hurley, a member of the “Six.” * Sayid may be living in snowy Germany and putting the bone to Elsa (played by pale Dutch actress Reuten). * By episode’s end, Sayid may be revealed to be collaborating with the fellow who shot Libby and Ana Lucia to death. Kristin at E! says we will get a six-week break before the season wraps:
The last episode of the current pod (episode seven) will air Mar. 13. Then the show will be off the air for six weeks and return Apr. 24 at 9 p.m. That Apr. 24 episode will be the already-completed episode eight, which was filmed prestrike, but which apparently works much better as a minipremiere than it does as a minifinale.
TV Guide’s Michael Ausiello said Wednesday that “Grey’s Anatomy” will soon return to take back “Lost’s” current timeslot – but “Lost” will not exit Thursday nights. The final fourth-season adventures of Hurley, Locke, Ben, et al, will inherit the 10 p.m. post-“Grey’s” slot formerly occupied by “Big Shots” and currently occupied by “Eli Stone.” Next week: Kate Austen heads to “Eggtown.” 9 p.m. Thursday. ABC.

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Readers Talkback

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  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:48 a.m. CST

    Round and round they go....

    by Aloy

    You know the rest.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:04 a.m. CST

    LOOOOOOOOOOOOOST!!!!!!

    by nalapou

    Thursday at 9pm is my favourite time of the week.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:09 a.m. CST

    Yippeeeee

    by Randy Sims

    Bring on da LOST!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:28 a.m. CST

    No Torchwood talkbacks any more, huh?

    by ZeroCorpse

    But every time Joss Whedon or Sarah Michelle Gellar take a crap anywhere near a movie studio, we get a headline.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:38 a.m. CST

    OCEANIC 6

    by dreamwriter1888

    The identity of each member of the Oceanic 6 has actually already been revealed a couple of months back on some website, don't really remember which. But for any of you who didn't see it, they are: Kate, Jack, Sayid, Hurley, Sun, and Jin. Yeah, only two hadn't been "oficially" revealed yet, but there you go. <P> Man I'm loving this season. Sucks that we only have 5 more episodes until the 6-week break before the final 6 (assuming that they are in fact able to film 5 additional episodes), but oh well, I still love this show! <P> Here's a link to the article I got most of the above info from: http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/detail/index.jsp?uuid=cde3739d-0729-45c2-b6bd-9b28c9f3a06d

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:41 a.m. CST

    Seems the link I posted isn't working, so

    by dreamwriter1888

    So here is a link to the page that holds the article, entitled: The Return of Mother, Life and, Oh Yeah, Lost <P> The new link is: http://www.eonline.com/gossip/kristin/index.jsp

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:44 a.m. CST

    STILL NOT WORKING!

    by dreamwriter1888

    Oh, it's because the copy/paste has inserted a random space before "kristin/index.jsp" in the adress. SO anyway....that's enough posts for now...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:46 a.m. CST

    Isn't it early for this?

    by Napoleon Park

    No real complaint... I know how popular these Lost talk-backs are. It's just that every week I have to scroll and skim through a few hundred posts until I get to the point where people are actually discussing the episode after they'se seen it. Everything before that point is the haters, the crazy-talk, people rehashing their pet theories, some ass posting spoilers and everyone else beyoncing about it and name calling. These chats really get good AFTER the episode airs. I'll shut up now before I nanner on and prove my point.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:49 a.m. CST

    Dreamwriter 1888

    by Napoleon Park

    Right below the talkback box is the statement "If you are going to post a URL in your comment, please go to TinyUrl.com". They even have it hyperlinked in case you don't already have tinyurl bookmarked. Use it, it makes links that don't break or insert spaces. Or don't use it and look silly. Hope that helps.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:54 a.m. CST

    I take it that Herc hasn't

    by Mezzanine

    seen this episode yet. <p> Fuck, I am excited for 9 pm.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:59 a.m. CST

    this season is kickin ass

    by theredtoad

    it just feels.. heavier than the first three.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:14 a.m. CST

    "Why don't they ask more questions?"

    by Dapper Swindler

    Because they are emotional, scared, and confused. But Sayid isn't - he'll ask the questions. Every time he says something Sayid doesn't bullshit, he asks question. Not only in last episode but in every episode he's in. Look at episodes like Enter 77. For people who wish more questions were asked Sayid is your messiah.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:51 a.m. CST

    Ha Eli Stone sucked

    by skywalkerfamily

    ABC promotes the shit out of it, and Lost ends up taking it over.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:05 a.m. CST

    So far Sooo Good. Herc, Do yoiu know

    by Yeti

    If ABC is going to play the initial 8 then another 5 eps or are they going to take a "break" and show the final 5 to coincide with sweeps?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:38 a.m. CST

    LOST schedule

    by Titus05

    ASK Aussielo already revaled this info...they are not going to show 8 episodes in the first group...they will instead show 7 episodes take a 4 week break and then return with 6 new episodes (5 + the 1 carryover episode)...Lindeloff said that Episode 7 has a better break point then Episode 8 so that is why they are doing that

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6 a.m. CST

    So it's been a week and I still have a lingering

    by Itchy

    question from the last issue: Is the chick who plays Charlotte hot ? I don't know - there's something about her....

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:12 a.m. CST

    Cynthia Watros in credits

    by krycek08

    for "Meet Kevin Johnson"

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:26 a.m. CST

    Charlotte's cute

    by I Dunno

    the accent plays.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:46 a.m. CST

    Check this out...naked people

    by jackalcack

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP1QlLmAq1o

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:29 a.m. CST

    You answered your own question, ZeroCorpse

    by Meglos

    Expect another Torchwood TB a few months from now, but only because James Marster's character is returning.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:32 a.m. CST

    Damn that "Gay's Anatomy"!...

    by Kid Z

    ...lame chick-shit knocking Lost back to 10 PM. Eff you ABC!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:53 a.m. CST

    Kristen Bell = moron

    by Epictetus

    Nice career move. Who wants to live in Hawaii and be on the best show of all time? Better to be on the farce called Heroes. <p>Great news about Kane being cancelled. Bring on more Richard Alpert, the immortal ghost pirate of the Black Rock, finder of ancient soul Jacob, he of the people who built the 4-toed statue!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:28 a.m. CST

    holy spoilers

    by tha plow

    i knew i shouldn't have read that.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:43 a.m. CST

    Epictetus, for dissing K-Bell, you win...

    by Pennsy

    both Complete Series dvd's for Viva Laughlin AND Bionic Woman. I give Charlotte 6 weeks before the smoke monster caps her. ;)

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:01 a.m. CST

    "Oceanic 6" sounds like an Aqua Teen Hunger Force rip off...

    by Cletus Van Damme

    ...a dolphin, crab, lobster, starfish, octopus and shrimp fight the forces of evil!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:04 a.m. CST

    K-Bell blew it

    by righteousdude

    Have to agree about Kristen's dubious career choices. Given a choice between LOST and Heroes she picks.... the one aimed at 10 year olds that presents absolutely no thesbianic challenge for her. Guess appearing so smart on Veronica Mars was indeed just an "act". Doesn't she have an agent? She needs to fire that guy for letting her make such an obvious mistake.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:05 a.m. CST

    Airplanes

    by Epictetus

    They have these cool things called Airplanes you can ride to other places.<p> Yeah, Charlotte could die very soon but I'm hoping she can use her Archeologist skills on the 4-toed statue. If she busts that mystery, I'm right about K Bell.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:17 a.m. CST

    I love Kristen Bell

    by MetiphisLabs

    But she made an awful decision not to be on Lost.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:28 a.m. CST

    Spoilers AGAIN - The Six Are and More:

    by Butt Juice

    http://tinyurl.com/37p2eo <br> and http://www.aintitcool.com/talkback_display/35461#comment_1878539

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:45 a.m. CST

    Kristen Bell

    by mthrndr

    Could totally redeem herself in my book if she takes her top off in 'forgetting sarah marshall'. somehow I think that's a long shot, though.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:52 a.m. CST

    Titus05 You're wrong, will be 6 week break

    by dreamwriter1888

    You're wrong about the break time, it's going to be 6 weeks. It's been mistakenly reported several times. Plus Ask Ausiello is a mediocre spoiler site anyway, he makes up the questions himself (based on several weeks worth of blogs, it seems quite obvious)and hardly gives out really good scoop. The mediocre spoiler thing could be said the same about the Watch With Kristin articles, but she also also has tons of interviews with cast members, creators, guest stars, etc. of shows, easily making her a better more reliable source of info. I would trust her news quicker than I would ausiellos any day.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:02 a.m. CST

    Not sure how you missed this

    by Flyer

    Since they end the episode with it, but Kate doesn't leave Sawyer. She stays with him. At the end, Sayid tells Jack she stayed back "with Sawyer". Sucka!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:21 a.m. CST

    The Oceanic Six

    by Zeframillen

    Not sure if this has been discussed, i'm sure it has, but isn't it obvious that kate IS NOT one of the oceanic six?? If she were a well known survivor of Oceanic flight 815, she would be IN JAIL, so: either she IS one of the six and assumed someone else's identity, or she somehow got back undetected! discuss.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:24 a.m. CST

    MetiphisLabs...Kristen Bell's Choice...

    by Cheif Brody

    She probably had help making that choice, ML...Lost is a greuling show to work on...you pretty much have to MOVE to Hawaii to do it...and you get an even shorter hiatus than shows that shoot in LA...which makes it more difficult to go off on your break to do films and other projects. <P> Kristen's agent probably had her weigh these factors in...and considering her big jump into movies...she probably felt Heroes was the easier choice....Not the best choice, perhaps...but it will definetly make her ability to do features a lot easier. <P> God...I started reading those damn invisotext spoilers and I had to stop myself!! I've waited this long for NEW episodes of LOST...I just want the SHOW to surprise me...not AICN. <P> But those spoilers are like sweet Valentine's Day candies...and I just wanna rip open the heart shaped box and eat em all up!!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:26 a.m. CST

    Invisotext

    by Flyer

    Don't worry about reading the spoilers. Some of them are flat out wrong anyway.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:33 a.m. CST

    Thank you gotilk

    by kitkatbar

    Thank you for the Firefox "create a tiny URL" add-on. Saves me a lot of time. A Valentine's kiss for you! <g>

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:50 a.m. CST

    We Are Lovin Some Lost Again

    by Frodo T. Baggins

    So glad they are off the 2nd island now. Last season they were in those fucking cages back and forth for waaaay too long. This season already rocks. And I love the introduction to the "Poles" and other "certain" areas to be time shifters. IE how the polar bears get on the island. Transport spots. North and South pole. And that place in Australia where whats her name, the dentists wife goes to talk to the Shamen for cancer or whatever. Excellent twist. Anyone caught onto that yet?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:01 p.m. CST

    Weird...

    by SlickyVonBoner

    I had a dream last night about the first episode with Michael back and he was Ben's man on the boat, sabotaging the Outsider's plans. Huh, wonder if it'll come true. (I didn't read the invisotext spoilers) Though, I would rather dream about Kate.. or Juliet.. or both.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:04 p.m. CST

    The transport spots

    by Jor-El23

    I think they've been mentioned but not often. I definitely think the place Rose visits in Australia is very important to the overall scheme and that the same type of thing exists on the island. they're vortices. there's a whole page about it on Lostpedia, it's a theory about the island as a dumping ground for various vortices throughout the world.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Even though I hate Lost and everything it stands for

    by Sick Fixx

    I can't wait...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:24 p.m. CST

    I also believe Kristin had more friends on the cast of Heroes

    by hst666

    I also believe Kristin had more friends on the cast of Heroes

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:35 p.m. CST

    Kristen Bell

    by Jor-El23

    who wouldn't want to play someone with superpowers? and at the time she signed on Heroes was HUGE and Lost was sort of floundering in a sea of fan backlash and negative feedback from critics. It was a business decision and she is, if not the Queen of the Dorks, the Princess of the Dorks. She knows her constituency.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:38 p.m. CST

    Very fucking cool.

    by Mezzanine

    Even though I feel kind of bad for Nestor Cardonell about Cane being cancelled, I really wish he had just stuck with LOST. Richard Halpert is obviously going to be an epic character, and he will be HUGE in season five, guaranteed.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:51 p.m. CST

    Richard HALPERT?...

    by Cheif Brody

    Is that Jim Halpert's brother from "The Office"? Oh...I hope Dwight shows up. too!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:53 p.m. CST

    Oops,

    by Mezzanine

    I misspelled that. My bad.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:56 p.m. CST

    Don't weep for Richard

    by righteousdude

    Since Cane has been Cancelled, Nestor is free to return to the Island for these final 5 episodes methinks. Hope so, the creepily ageless Richard Alpert ups the weirdness quotient. And I loves me some weird.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 12:58 p.m. CST

    Is ABC trying to kill Lost?

    by MachThree

    Isn't shuffling the timeslot around over and over again what they do with shows that they're no longer comitted to, and for which they don't particularly care if it keeps its audience? What gives ABC?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 1:56 p.m. CST

    Richard Alpert is able to travel through time

    by SpyGuy

    That's why he appears to be ageless. Either that, or he's actually Satan and everybody on the island is seriously fucked.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:09 p.m. CST

    Kristen Bell knew she'd look like crap next to the other women o

    by ZeroCorpse

    She knew she'd be the least attractive woman on the show, so she passed on it. <p> Vain little blond girl!!! <p> And yes, I know; We'll get a Torchwood talkback when Marsters is back on the show. Otherwise, the only articles we get in coax are when other members of the Whedoniverse or the Veronica Marsiverse wander into the spotlight for a few seconds. <p> No time to post a talkback for other SciFi shows, because someone's too busy yiffing their Buffy/Spike posters.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:20 p.m. CST

    I admit it. I like Kristen Bell.

    by ZeroCorpse

    But my taste is dubious.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:37 p.m. CST

    50 years from now

    by Epictetus

    People will be talking about Lost. Nobody will know what Heroes was. It has no lasting quality, it's like junk food. Lost is ambrosia from the gods.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 2:39 p.m. CST

    Puh-LEEZE, get the frak outta here...

    by Pennsy

    The *most* attractive, you mean. The claws would be Wolverine-esque in length if Bell went on that set; it would be a battle for second place. You know it, too. :)

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 3:30 p.m. CST

    Another reason Kristin didn't take it...

    by Cheif Brody

    ...is that the CS Lewis character is slated to DIE in 5 or 6 episodes? Ana Lucia (MR) & Eko (AAA) only joined Lost BECAUSE they were told their characters wouldn't be around long...but they like the show & characters so much...they fit Lost into their scedules. <P> It's possible Kiristen was looking for something more long lasting. But I have a feeling vainity or jealous castmates had little to do with it...and sounds a bit like 10th grader bullshit to me.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 3:46 p.m. CST

    Howdy folks

    by Shepard Bauer

    long time no see... so I want to get everyone's opinion on the people that "found" Oceanic 815. There were all those webisodes with the guy who's girlfriend was the stewardess... do you think he'll show up anytime soon? He seemed like he'd be a good addition to the show and he's got plenty of motivation, he could kinda be our 'in' to discovering everything about how the others operate... if the others really even matter anymore, now that the Freighter Four are on the island. How do you think that plane got down there?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 3:50 p.m. CST

    where's da spoilers

    by Guy Gaduois

    I got a friggin' business meeting/dinner tonight and have to fly eastward afterward, meaning that I'll have no DVR access til Monday. Somebody give up the goods, have mercy on a poor dumb basta'd who needs a little break. I got two hours to find info, time is short, help me out, brutha.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 4:11 p.m. CST

    I have a real question

    by Napoleon Park

    not about yiffing.<p>What does ABC mean in the ads for the rerun of the previous weeks episode when they describe it as "enhanced"? They're trying to tempt us to watch an episode we already saw and most of us taped or tivo'd. So what is the enhancement?<p>Are they letterboxed? In 3-D with 5.1 surround sound? Psychedlic LSD color with new colors we haven't seen before?<p>Wait, I have a theory but I hope I'm wrong. Is it that stupid pop up video captioning they tried out with the clip show? That sucked. I bet that's what it is, isn't it?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:16 p.m. CST

    Lost to take six-week break

    by Hercules

    According to Kristin Veitch Dos Santos at E!: "The last episode of the current pod (episode seven) will air Mar. 13. Then the show will be off the air for six weeks and return Apr. 24 at 9 p.m. That Apr. 24 episode will be the already-completed episode eight, which was filmed prestrike, but which apparently works much better as a minipremiere than it does as a minifinale."

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:26 p.m. CST

    by AllieJamison

    It's fucking good times if you can just close that window in which an Indy trailer is playing and go right over to an episode of Lost. I didn't read the superspoilers. I hope this ep will have some Desmond. Anyway...I loved last season's Sayid flashback...is this going to be a flashforward?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:31 p.m. CST

    Off-Topic Michael

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    Ok i know this is off topic but the thoguht just popped in my head and i had to get out and let people throw it around. Alot of people seem to think that Michael is Ben's guy on the freighter but i mean at this point its Michael has only been gone for like 30 days so how can that have happened so quickly

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:33 p.m. CST

    Node...CS LEWIS DEATH!!

    by Cheif Brody

    That was a question, Node...NOT a statement of fact. I'm only speculatinbg that her character isn't scheduled to be around very long...I mean...her very first episode she took 2 in the chest!!...But it's possible in her discussions with Darlton that they informed her it will only be an 8 episode gig...and Kristen didn't want to uproot her whole life for an 8 episode stint. <P> JUST ANOTHER THEORY...as to why she may have chosen to be a "Hero" rather than a "Frieghtee". <P> Thanks for the update Herc...I remember Darlton being uneasy about episode 8 being a "finale" when the writers went on strike. Now it makes sense why...Ep 4.7 is the better "break" episode.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:46 p.m. CST

    Cheif Brody did have a ? at the end of that, yes...

    by Pennsy

    So it was just speculation on his part. I kid around about those who dump on KB being heathens and what not, but it's to our mutual benefit that scripted shows like Lost succeed; otherwise we'll have more reality shows like Human Tetris or some other godsfammit crapola :o

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 5:56 p.m. CST

    2 hours and counting!!

    by Cheif Brody

    I'm so tempted to read those spoilers...must...not...read...them....Show....on....in....2...hours!!!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:02 p.m. CST

    Michael...the "man" on the boat?...

    by Cheif Brody

    I doubt it, Stuck. We never saw Ben give Michael any "special instructions" on what to do when he was "rescued" out at sea with Walt. I have a feeling Ben's "Man" on the boat is ON the boat to pick UP Michael...take Walt from him...send Mike off on a helicopter to the mainland...where he can be reassimilated into society with an assumed identity...kill everyone on board...and bring Walt BACK to the island. <P> That's the "mission" I think Ben's "man" is suppose to carry out.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:08 p.m. CST

    I'm thinking Mike IS the man on the boat...

    by Shepard Bauer

    btw, anyone else here find irony in the fact a bunch of guys on the internet keep asking each other 'where the little man on the boat' is? You have to think about the specific words Ben said to Michael: Go to the heading 325 (or whatever**)and YOU WILL FIND RESCUE. Hrmm, interresting.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:18 p.m. CST

    Shep...Sure...Ben gave Mike coordinates...

    by Cheif Brody

    ...but he didn't say..."Now...when you get picked up....I need you to do this...and kill that person...and take someone hostage..." etc. I think Ben's "man" was put on that boat long before Michael & Walt ever left the island. <P> I also don't think Walt ever was allowed to leave the island...he was far too special to just let sail away.... But Ben had to give the "appearance" that he was letting him leave...to look like a "good guy" in front of the spinal surgeon he was about to ask to save his life. <P> The master manipulator strikes again.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:19 p.m. CST

    Do they really need to take six fucking weeks off?

    by The_Squid

    So much for a full, uninterupted season.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:26 p.m. CST

    I'd rather

    by Bloo

    they take 6 weeks off so we can get an almost complete season then they take off till Fall or even January of 09

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 6:58 p.m. CST

    Sorry Kate's Hubby and Dead guy in paper.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Those are two of the "six". <p> Lost has no overall cohesive plot. They pull storyline out of their collective asses as it goes along. <p> Fucking Serenity had a plan. <p> yep I still watch it. But I know they make it up as they go along so I'm not as involved in divining the intent of the show.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7 p.m. CST

    Others were SUPERMEN, now pathetic whiners.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Just making a point about directionless Lost.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:01 p.m. CST

    10 items TB, Reno911 tb.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Where are those? Where is the Nip/Tuck?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:05 p.m. CST

    Cheif...

    by Shepard Bauer

    well, I kinda disagree with you. I think Ben HAD to let Walt go with his dad... did you watch the Missing Pieces? They were all terrified of him... I think that worked to Ben's advantage, just like Locke blowing up the sub also worked to his advantage since he didn't want to let Jack leave. And even if he didn't tell Michael what's going on, he very well may have told Walt what's going on. Walt convinced John to try and stop the Freighters from getting to the island, remember, that's the same objective as Ben... god its good to be back...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:20 p.m. CST

    Cheif, Shepard

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    i concur i just dont see how it can be Michael in such a short time frame its not enough to set all that up for Micahel to be the one. I think Michael will inevitably be the one Jack turns to to get back to the island but its anyones guess isnt it

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:23 p.m. CST

    Cant help but have man crush....

    by chanandler bong

    ...on Sawyer. God is he sexy!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:27 p.m. CST

    I wonder if Michael will show up before episode 8

    by The_Squid

    That would be a nice surprise. I really want to see what happened to him and walt. Good thing Sayid has the flash forward tonight. We don't get nearly enough Sayid on this show.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:32 p.m. CST

    The Oceanic 6 HAVE ALREADY BEEN REVEALED A LONG TIME AGO

    by dreamwriter1888

    And seriously, people thinking Claire is one of them...lol... And if you don't believe my earlier post, and just CAN'T find a site that confirms what I say, think about it this way: the creators said that we would know who the 6 were before these 8 episodes were up, and if you look at who the episodes are about you see Sayid, Kate, Desmond, Juliet, Sun/Jin, and Michael. So lets think about this. Of those names only Sayid, Kate, Sun, Jin, and Michael were on the Oceanic 815 flight. Jack and Kate and Hurley have already been revealed, leaving 3 spots. Tonight we find out Sayid is one of them, leaving only 2 spots. Considering Michael isn't even currently on the island ( and even if his episode is a flash-forward ) he probably won't be considered an oceanic flight member. Also it looks like he will get a new identity, as the title of his episode suggests: "Meet Kevin Johnson", and if he was an Oceanic 6, why would he have to change his name? So that leaves 2 spots and two people...there you go. Yay!!!!!!!! We could be detectives and give Dick Tracy a run for his money!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!!!! <P>Oh and thanks for the update Herc, the one I already posted on here at 1 AM this morning! Post #7 <P> Now I take a bow, return to my lost repeat and await the new episode, while letting the bashing begin.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:36 p.m. CST

    the numbers are the passengers that get off the island

    by Yeti

    That would make sense in a twisted sort of way...question is what of the others?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 7:45 p.m. CST

    so?

    by The Dum Guy

    When will this season end, August?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:06 p.m. CST

    aaaaaaaawww dude, not cool sayid

    by Pipple

    not cool.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:06 p.m. CST

    WHSHDSFH

    by Norm Cascade

    Holy shit. Okay, so what did Sayid say there? "I insist, Mr. ______"

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:07 p.m. CST

    I wish I was Sayid

    by Charlie Murphy

    "what do you do for a living?" "i do nothing" that's the dream right there... GODDAYYYYYYM! just blew that guy away! that was so awesome...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:08 p.m. CST

    Don't fuck with sayid

    by REBEL_SKUM

    Holy shit that was sweet.... sayid is pissed!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:08 p.m. CST

    WOW! Sayid is off the island and an assassin...

    by BrokenHeath

    ...heh, but knowing him he had a reason to off this guy. Couldn't have been scared of Sayid as soon as he mentioned he was one of the Oceanic 6 without a reason.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:09 p.m. CST

    God damn

    by kyle051554

    Sayid is a total badass.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:11 p.m. CST

    Now that's how you start a show.

    by SID 8.0

    I like how he timed it so the sprinklers would come on washing away any forensic evidence.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:12 p.m. CST

    THEY SAID NO BREAKS!

    by v1cious

    that was the whole point of making us wait a whole year. fuck you!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:17 p.m. CST

    Shut up, v1cious

    by Norm Cascade

    Whining fucking maggot.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:17 p.m. CST

    Sayid killed a Mr. Avelino

    by mthrndr

    according to CC. I thought he might be part of the Hanso board, but I checked Lostpedia - no such luck.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:19 p.m. CST

    v1cious - lest yo forget . .

    by Spacejockey426

    . . . there was a writers strike which ended yesterday . . . it is better than getting just 8 episodes, which would have been the case if the strike had continued too much longer. If you don't like it, tape 'em all and watch 'em all in May, back-to-back.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:20 p.m. CST

    help

    by mephista1013

    so i live in the NIU area and the local ABC channel just showed a news conference. Can anyone tell me what happened in the first 20 minutes???

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:27 p.m. CST

    I have Jabba the Hutt fantasies about Kate...

    by Sick Fixx

    Soon she will learn to appreciate me... :licks her face:

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:28 p.m. CST

    @v1cious

    by BrokenHeath

    They had no control over the writer's strike.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:31 p.m. CST

    i understand that...

    by v1cious

    and i know the strike just ended, but they already have the episodes finished. what possible explanation could there be for a break?

  • bad writing

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:36 p.m. CST

    I'm sorry I went with Locke

    by MeshGearFoxx

    there you go...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:37 p.m. CST

    what a fag, hurley

    by Pipple

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:50 p.m. CST

    BLAM!!!

    by Norm Cascade

    "Happy Valentine's Day, bitch!"

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:50 p.m. CST

    real smart lady, just give him time to find a gun

    by Pipple

    this show has jumped the shark for like the tenth time yet I still want to see more. sigh...what the hell

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:51 p.m. CST

    this season kicks friggin ass

    by mthrndr

    And I say that not knowing who the hell Sayid is working for, who that bitch was working for. And I don't care. At this point I'm just going with it.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:55 p.m. CST

    STILL NOTHING HAPPENING

    by Sick Fixx

    They are d r a g g i n g us along!!! LITERALLY NOTHING happened this episode or was revealed!!! Just a bunch of empty rhetoric and innuendo. Hurley betrayed somebody. That's the only thing that happened, and it wasn't even that noteworthy. FUCK, GET ON WITH IT, CHRONICALLY LAZY ASS PRIMADONNA WRITERS!!!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:55 p.m. CST

    v1cious - this should explain the deal with this season of LOST

    by Spacejockey426

    http://tinyurl.com/37phgn

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 8:56 p.m. CST

    5 minutes to go...

    by Sick Fixx

    and they FINALLY dust off and drag out Desmond for what amounts to a cameo. These people are hopeless.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9 p.m. CST

    FINALLY

    by Sick Fixx

    About fucking time something happened!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:01 p.m. CST

    oh yeah

    by MeshGearFoxx

    Ben is not in the coffin

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:02 p.m. CST

    HOLY SHIT!!!

    by Shermdawg

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:02 p.m. CST

    this season

    by MeshGearFoxx

    is kicking ass. I love this show

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:03 p.m. CST

    WOW

    by smutpeddlar

    W O W

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:04 p.m. CST

    I LOVE LOST

    by kyle051554

    That is all.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:06 p.m. CST

    Zeframillen

    by Butt Juice

    Spoilers<br> Next week is Kate's trial. She is not prosecuted because her mom decides not to testify, and no one cared that she killed a mean sum'bitch

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    So at least EIGHT get off the island...

    by Murraypalooza

    I mean, think about it. The 'Oceanic Six' are Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, ???, ???.<br /><br /> Ben and Desmond can't be counted towards that tally, because they were never on Oceanic 815. So hell, maybe even Juliet gets off the island (but probably dies, contributing towards Jacks downward spiral) along with those two.<br /><br /> Fuckin' tasty!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    for those of you always complaining

    by mthrndr

    That "nothing happened" - you really should have stopped watching after like the 3rd episode of season one. This is what LOST is. This was a great, classic episode. I have no sympathy for you.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    Hey Sick Fixx . . .

    by Spacejockey426

    Setup and intrigue. . . more of the puzzle is revealed. Sometimes things click into place, other times we see a fascinating new piece and have a general idea where it could fit . . . The whole show is one big 4 dimensional puzzle. I'll tell you what I told Bryan Burke when I met him in New York - anyone unsatisfied with the pacing of the show show step away from the table and move along. For me, the journey is the thing that matters most - and what a cool trip it continues to be . . . .

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:09 p.m. CST

    Who said nothing's happening?

    by Larry of Arabia

    This show is a runaway train this year. We know what happened to everyone off the island. The reveals are big. I'm loving the show again.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:09 p.m. CST

    so the tracker took 30 min more than it should..

    by mthrndr

    anyone care to guess why? Wormhole? Time warp? Definitely something sci fi.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:10 p.m. CST

    good ep *spoiler*

    by adzigjo

    cant believe ___ makes it off the island

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:11 p.m. CST

    mthrndr

    by catlettuce4

    time just slows down on the island. which is why jack couldn't believe it had only been 100 days. it felt a lot longer.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:12 p.m. CST

    Hurley is an other?

    by skywalkerfamily

    OMG!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:12 p.m. CST

    Hey RyanMurray . . . never thought of that . ..

    by Spacejockey426

    . . . Eight would be the number of people who get off the island . . . the numbers must be satisfied, after all. I suspect Desmond could be the eighth. Perhaps there is something in his flashes that we saw in a few episodes in season 3 that could clue us in to his flashforward destiny . . . .

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:13 p.m. CST

    Best show on television

    by ballyhoo

    Damn. I am always surprised at how consistent Lost is. Quality writing again and again and again. Freaking great show, with yet another great ep.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    nothing happened?

    by Bouncy X

    so finding out sayid becomes an assassin and works for ben is nothing?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:15 p.m. CST

    Trippy Ep/Question for Herc

    by evolution1085

    Never saw Sayid's Boss being ___ Hey Herc, Where did you get that bit about Sayid working with "Michael" from? Did you get swerved by bad intel or was that a foiler to keep us honest?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:19 p.m. CST

    Fuck!?!!

    by ChrisVenom

    That ending shot down my Ben's in the coffin theory

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:19 p.m. CST

    WTF!?!

    by Billyeveryteen

    Seriously, What The Fuck???

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:21 p.m. CST

    I also liked the question about the BoSox

    by mthrndr

    They left it open as to whether it is 2004 or 2007/8 in the outside world...The pilot could have been more upset because of the Red Sox's TWO WS championships. Because of that, it could be either.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:22 p.m. CST

    Don't forget Clair & Baby

    by br1947

    Desmond saw them get on the chopper... whether they get off the island... who knows?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:22 p.m. CST

    Oohh

    by ChrisVenom

    Sorry about my last post westcoasters.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:24 p.m. CST

    Ben!?

    by therobcat

    This is the best season of Lost since the 1st as far as I'm concerned. Every episode adds a new layer and chacters have moved in directions I never saw coming, but still make a strange sort of sense. I thought for sure it would be Ben in the coffin, but this is so much better... so much more interesting! I thought it might be Jack's dad since it ended in a medical setting, but it was so great to see Ben looking healthy and focused... Things haven't been going to well for him of late. I am so happy that the writers made a deal and we don't have to suffer a non-intended cliffhanger. Even if the show does have to go off the air for a while, it's well worth it! Next Thursday can't come fast enough...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:24 p.m. CST

    chrisvenom...

    by mthrndr

    I think westcoasters know to stay off this board until they see the episode.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:25 p.m. CST

    Ben in Coffin

    by arby64

    Ben could still be in the coffin. Sayid's flashforward could take place before Jacks. However, Michael is still the most likely IMO.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:26 p.m. CST

    What was the last thing Sayid said?

    by lbayniner

    Anybody??

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:26 p.m. CST

    Jules just left the diner.

    by BillyPilgrim

    On the way out he gave his Bad Motherfucker wallet to Sayid.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:27 p.m. CST

    I agree with SpaceJockey

    by ProoferFromHell

    I don't care how long it takes to get to the destination, I'm lovin' every minute of the journey there. Haters, go home.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:27 p.m. CST

    hey idiots, ben can still be in the coffin

    by krycek08

    you don't know when in the future this flash was. hurley's was before jack's you people are stupid as shit.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:28 p.m. CST

    Ibayniner

    by catlettuce4

    Sayid said they know that he's coming after them now. as in the guys sayid is trying to kill now know sayid is coming after them. then ben said good.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:30 p.m. CST

    Ibayniner...

    by mthrndr

    Sayid: They know who I am now <br> Ben: Good.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:31 p.m. CST

    one more thing-sayids target

    by lbayniner

    thanks cattle the audio got fuzzy and i thought he said "they'll know i'm coming" but it sounded like 10 different things. also, was ilsa always sayids target or did he just not get a chance to get her boss?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:31 p.m. CST

    Zoe Bell

    by alex138

    so Zoe Bell was in the guest star credits as well as last episodes but was absent. I guess she is Regina back on the boat?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:31 p.m. CST

    Actually Herc's info said..

    by Jonah Echo

    Sayid works for the man who killed Ana Lucia and Libby. Now that is Michael, definitely. But whomever gave that info thought they were being clever because ultimately orders came from Ben to get rid of Ana L, and both were killed for Ben's benefit. Nothing above actually said "Sayid works for Michael" though that's also what I inferred it to mean. Great episode. Cool to see Sayid being 007.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:32 p.m. CST

    The payload fired

    by Jor-El23

    The thing that's most interesting to me about that whole thing with the payload being fired is that according to the woman on the boat it had reached the destination, which I assume is that device Daniel set up. So the island is 31 minutes in the past, right?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:32 p.m. CST

    If Ben was leaving the island on a regular basis

    by Jor-El23

    why couldn't he leave to get surgery?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:32 p.m. CST

    I think we're to assume Sayid got her boss

    by mthrndr

    And went to get fixed up by ben afterward.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:33 p.m. CST

    mephista - it started

    by theBigE

    West Coast - here's how the show started, so skip if you don't want to be spoiled!! <p> Sayid is off Island, playing golf, meets another guy, they talk, Sayid says he's one of the Oceanic Six, then kills the other guy. Then Sayid "bumps into" the blonde chick in Berlin, says he's a headhunter, and they make dinner plans. Meanwhile, back on the island, Sayid, Miles, and Kate go to get Charlotte, while Hurley questions why they are keeping her hostage. Hope that helps.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Ben could still be in the coffin.

    by LOTGA

    Jack seemed pretty okay in Hurley's flash forward, so there's not telling how long before Jack's flash forward from the end of Season 3 it takes place.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Sayid and Ben

    by Yo Yo Ma

    What does Sayid say to ben, before ben says, "good" at the very end of the episode, he kinda of mumbleded. I rewound 5 times, could not make it out.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:36 p.m. CST

    Bullshit, you people aren't paying attention

    by Sick Fixx

    THis was not a runaway train episode. It d r a g g e d and, as I predicted, it once again ended with some cryptic words and a reveal that will not be followed up on next week. It was a shocking reveal, but it probably won't even be touched up on before the break the writers said wasn't going to happen.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:36 p.m. CST

    Ben's not in the coffin

    by therobcat

    If anything, Ben is working with Sayid, and I believe he might be working against the dark forces behind Abadon and Oceanic. because of this, I think perhaps one or two people might have shown up at his funeral.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:37 p.m. CST

    Ben Linus: Hero

    by therobcat

    I guess I'm just holding out hope that Ben turns out to be on the side of the angels. The cruel avenging angels...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:38 p.m. CST

    I'm paying attention

    by therobcat

    I saw no dragging.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:39 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx - are you 12 years old?

    by theBigE

    Because I work with ADHD kids, and they have absolutely no patience. For anything. They want everything now, and they can't prolong anything. They aren't capable of it. And your attitude reminds me of them.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:40 p.m. CST

    Check out Heroes Season 2 if you want dragging

    by therobcat

    And I say that with love because I'm actually a huge fan. I just think they didn't quite live up to their potential.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:41 p.m. CST

    Exactly what pieces of 'the puzzle' were revealed tonight?

    by Sick Fixx

    Aside from Ben and Sayid's little alliance, what else was revealed? Because I saw nothing else of substance unfolding on my television screen.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:42 p.m. CST

    UGHHH

    by catlettuce4

    the island is probably not 31 minutes past. that doesn't make sense. it's probably some proportion. what was the actual time, something like 3 hours? so maybe the island is 1/6 slower than the real world.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:42 p.m. CST

    RE:alex138

    by movieman742

    Zoe Bell was in the guest starring credits because there were scenes with her body. The voice on the phone does sound a little like her though but I'm pretty sure the name is there because of the few scenes they had with the body. It's happened on 24 before.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:44 p.m. CST

    Don't talk to me about ADHD...

    by Sick Fixx

    Talk to the writers of Lost, who concoct dozens of new characters every season to play with and kill off so they don't have to worry about advancing the story they began with. I read Russian novels, Kerouac's Stream of Consciousness works, Japanese Surrealism, political tracts and manifestos. I have a very intense attention span when something of worth and substance is being conveyed to me. I'm just finishing up Dead Souls by Gogol.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:47 p.m. CST

    What was revealed?

    by therobcat

    The island is in a temporal flux, Sayid is a shifty motherfucker, Hurley has more of an affinity for the island than Locke does (he could have found the cabin), Ben is off the island, the bracelet that both Naomi and Elsa had, The passports... what the hell else do you want?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:48 p.m. CST

    Character development!

    by theBigE

    Sick Fixx - have you ever heard about character development? The story is more compelling if you empathize with the characters, watch them grow, see them change. It's not all about hard-core action, but we get our share of that. <p> The show rocked - I loved the surprises, the twists, the reveal! Dragged? Do what I do, DVR it, start it 20 minutes late, and cut the commercials. That might help your ADHD situation. Also Ritalin.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:49 p.m. CST

    Sick fixx and other haters

    by Yo Yo Ma

    The amazing thing about Lost is that people hate the show, Like Sick Fixx, yet still never miss it. That is what is so confusing. If you hate the show so much, hate the lack of "big reveals" or the you believe "they make it up as they go along" why do you watch it? Even more confusing is why after watching a show you hate, post on a forum to talk about a show you hate. Here is some advice, find a new show. of a hobby of something.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:50 p.m. CST

    I agree with Yo Yo Ma

    by therobcat

    100%

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:51 p.m. CST

    theBigE

    by esque

    Sir, you don't understand. Sick Fixx is literate. He is able to read words on paper, some of them even having been written in other languages. He doesn't have time to sit through an entire hour just for a few reveals and some character development. Also, he is a gigantic douchebag.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:52 p.m. CST

    therobcat

    by Sick Fixx

    All those things are intangibles that do nothing to further the plot FOR REAL. Adding or subtracting any of those things does nothing to get the characters of Lost who are plenty developed as they are from Point A to Point B. Ashok0, I've already explained my tastes are more refined than 'Eli Stone'. And I'm not crying for more knockouts and explosions. The knockouts and explosions have increased this season, which most of you people mistake for action. "Never mistake motion for action" - Ernest Hemingway

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:53 p.m. CST

    Thanks esque!

    by theBigE

    I know I should never try to reason with a troll!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:53 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by SuperBurgerBat

    What a pretentious assbag!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:54 p.m. CST

    You people are amazing

    by Sick Fixx

    I dare to think against the Cult of Lost Being Genius Storytelling and you castigate me by calling me a douchebag, a name rendered by the New Millennium Youth just as formulaic and cliche as the writing on your beloved program.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:54 p.m. CST

    Sick Fix

    by therobcat

    You are an odd one. They just don't make shows like Airwolf anymore do they? *sigh*

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Cult of Personality, that is

    by SuperBurgerBat

    Watch out guys, there's a troll under the bridge, and he's reading Gogol...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Where was Michael?

    by Spiny Norman

    I know I saw Harold Parinneau (sp?) listed in the credits. I thought we would see him this episode.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:55 p.m. CST

    Hahaha!

    by Sick Fixx

    Keep going back to your summer blockbusters, what'll it be this year: Thundercats? And reassure yourselves you're intelligent because you watch Lost too.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:56 p.m. CST

    I think it's a love/hate situation w/ the show.

    by GQtaste

    Peopel have such high standards when it comes every week they want to be blown away. And when they're not they get let down. I"Ve done this many, many times myself. I get pissed off and the constant love triangle they pull agian and again and again. And other things too. Also sometimes it appears that they do keep folks hanging on w/ old stuff and introduce new characters w/o ansering the bigger questions.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:57 p.m. CST

    Spiny

    by SuperBurgerBat

    He's been in the credits for since the start of the season, but yet to have been seen.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:57 p.m. CST

    I like the parallel universe thing too

    by therobcat

    I can see that as well. Either way, I'm freakin' loving it.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:58 p.m. CST

    YoYoMa

    by RevengeOfJobu

    YoYoMa could not be more correct.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:58 p.m. CST

    Troll?

    by Sick Fixx

    I have a different opinion than you people. I didn't invite you all to an argument. I stated my case, which is what you do in a talkback. I think most people with controversial opinions that threaten those who are certain of their love for something get branded as trolls. Too bad this talkback can't be as three dimensional as the amazing Super Tuesday talkback. Now THAT had some substance. This one is more one-sided than the graphics on Pong.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:58 p.m. CST

    Sick Fix

    by therobcat

    Are you one of those people who thought No Country For Old Men didn't have an ending?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:59 p.m. CST

    Berlin scene question

    by theBigE

    That "snow" in the streets of Berlin - did they film that in Hawaii? It was rapidly melting, but those watching with me disagreed that it was filmed on the islands.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:59 p.m. CST

    See? Why can't more of you be like GQ?

    by Sick Fixx

    He argued my side without actually turning coat on the 'Til Series Finale Do You Part' crowd.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 9:59 p.m. CST

    Ben

    by RevengeOfJobu

    I'm assuming Ben was the one Kate referred to when she said "He will know I've been gone" or something to that effect in last season's finale. Ben probably has all of them in his pocket off the island...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10 p.m. CST

    I don't make monkeys

    by therobcat

    I just train 'em

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:01 p.m. CST

    Oh, I see

    by Spiny Norman

    Thanks Burger. I guess I missed Harold in the credits all season. I have to say, every Sayid featured ep is a guaranteed home run for me.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:01 p.m. CST

    I will glock the shit out of you, bitch.

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Yeah. Yeah, I like it.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:03 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx!

    by esque

    Ah, good day, sir! Sorry it took so long to respond; I just reached my favorite part of The Stranger and had to rub one out real quick. I'm sure you sympathize. Now, before I begin highlighting the parts of this week's Economist with which I disagree -- that is, if I have time after rereading Sodome et Gomorrhe, a book I have read, consisting largely of impressively difficult French words, which I enjoy reading -- I want to lend you my support. I too find the characters on Lost as developed as they can possibly be, with no further hidden interesting facets. The Island is time-shifted? Sayid works for Ben? Pshaw. I saw those coming weeks ago. I know we both want some more interesting reveals to satiate our big brains. Until that time, I will watch Lost only in protest, not enjoyment. This I do in solidarity with you, my friend. Be strong.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:04 p.m. CST

    Hey, I get pissed off penty watching this show!

    by GQtaste

    I dig the show and look forward to it. But enough w/ the constant cock teases.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:04 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World

    "I dare to think against the cult of Lost is genius etc.," Get over yourself you iconoclastic asshole.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:04 p.m. CST

    esque

    by therobcat

    heh heh heh

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:06 p.m. CST

    I really shouldn't, but...

    by SuperBurgerBat

    See, the thing is, this really isn't the place to discuss the artistic fortitude and merit of Lost and its place in the Pantheon of Culture, Sick. Furthermore, no one really cares that you don't enjoy Lost, and no one participates in these talkbacks for that kind of conversation. We're all pretty much fans. But, fuck, I shouldn't feed the trolls. But I do. Hook, line, and sinker.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:07 p.m. CST

    The deal between Ben and Sayid

    by DougMcKenzie

    Was not struck in the future but in that room tonight. Ben convinced him that even if they got off that island that they would never reach civilization. That fake plane shows the people behind the the new foursome are malicious even if those individual four are not. Also 3 of the four are regular credited but Fahey is still only a guest, which makes me think that he gets iced soon. Makes sense as he knew that crash was faked... what better way to shut him up then killing him.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:08 p.m. CST

    by therobcat

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:08 p.m. CST

    Esque, WHAT CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT!?

    by Sick Fixx

    Hurley was persuaded by Locke into betraying Sayid. But will he be any different for it next week? A BIG NO on that. Character development, at least to me, indicates that people will act differently and be shaped by the experiences of their development, not act the same the next week, sitcom style. Hate it all you want, but Prison Break is constantly moving on and doing so intelligently without talking down to its audience. And that's the truth. I guess I'm just used to Prison Break being like a good lay with foreplay, the act itself and the climax. Lost is like the girlfriend who makes you hold out forever until you're a quivering mess of sexual frustration, then finally gives it up to you, but very very rarely, and she makes you regret it for a long time afterwards.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:09 p.m. CST

    SuperBurgerBat

    by esque

    Nothing wrong with feeding the trolls if they're entertaining. Heck, now I'm psyched for a Thundercats movie this summer! The rest of the New Millennium Youth will probably love it as well. Now, if you don't mind, I seem to have pooped my pants.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:11 p.m. CST

    Fahey

    by therobcat

    I had that same thought, Doug, but I hope it isn't true. He's bringing a different sort of energy to the show and I'm really digging him and Davies in particular.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:11 p.m. CST

    You people just don't give up.

    by Sick Fixx

    First, you say I have a short attention span and can't adequately enjoy the show. I refute this and outline why it can't be so. Then, you nag the shit out of me because I read highbrow stuff. Well, I read Goosebumps books too. When I was in fifth grade. That make ya feel better?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:13 p.m. CST

    People need to read...

    by jccalhoun

    I can't believe how often people post long links on here and don't understand why they don't work. It says right below the text box "If you are going to post a URL in your comment, please go to TinyUrl.com and reduce the size so it doesn't stretch out the TalkBack screen." <br><br>Regarding Torchwood losing a character. In an episode that was all about something that could cure any ailment you really think that someone who is shot is going to stay dead?<br><br>Some nice moments in tonight's episode of Lost. I wish that they would include some flashbacks this season instead of solely flashforwards. As in last season's cliffhanger episode, that would make it a lot more difficult to tell if a scene we were seeing was taking place before or after the plane crash.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Prison Break?

    by therobcat

    Jeasus titty fucking christ. Ok. I simply don't have any more wise ass energy. Congrats, S.F. I'm going to bed

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:14 p.m. CST

    Goosebumps movie?!?

    by SuperBurgerBat

    Come on Sick. You know it sounds good.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:16 p.m. CST

    Only a little.

    by Sick Fixx

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:16 p.m. CST

    Dead Souls > Lost

    by Sick Fixx

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:17 p.m. CST

    The day before yesterday,

    by Sick Fixx

    it was The Dwarf > Lost

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:17 p.m. CST

    And tomorrow, it will be

    by Sick Fixx

    The Walrus was Paul > Lost

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:19 p.m. CST

    Lost's new pace...

    by SuperBurgerBat

    I do kind of worried that Lost's pace is kinda picking up too much steam, if that's fathomable. I know this show cock-teased for a long time, but now it sometimes seems like a totally different show. Yet still awesome, somehow. Tonight was almost like some Al-Jazeera James Bond till Ben tied it all back to the island. Maybe this episode felt different because they LEFT THE FUCKING ISLAND. I just don't know...

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Always remember this:

    by br1947

    http://tinyurl.com/38xs2z

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:23 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by esque

    Character development can work in a number of ways. One of which, of course, is that something happens to them to cause a change, which manifests itself in their actions going forward. But Lost kindly gives us at least two others. We get flashbacks, revealing the hidden pasts of these characters, with which we can reexamine the actions we've already witnessed. The actions haven't changed, but our perspective has, which serves to change the characters themselves. And now we also have flashforwards, showing us how heretofore unseen incidents have affected the characters. Again, this changes how we view the characters in the subjective present, as well as how we interpret their future behavior. How did these occur in this episode? Well, Hurley's behavior reinforces what we've seen of him in his flashforward. We're given a hint of what causes his regret. Ben is revealed as a survivor and a world traveler, which brings into question not only his current behavior and how he'll escape the Island, but also his past behavior and desperation for a spinal surgeon. As for Sayid, we see that his arc is not as simple as we've been lead to believe. He was looking for redemption, for peace, for penance. We know now that his future instead brings a regression, which colors how we perceive his experiences going forward. And we don't even need to stretch to find these examples. They're clear and present, partly because the storytelling framework has been set up so carefully. If you don't like it, that's fine, but I don't see why you would watch. And I certainly don't understand the lauding of Prison Break, a show I enjoy, but which is nowhere near as rewarding. PB hasn't given us a surprise all season (no, not even Sarah's decapitation. If anything, the shock was due to the method, not the event) and proceeds at a snail's pace.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:27 p.m. CST

    br1947

    by esque

    Why the hell aren't we supposed to give turkeys to leprechauns?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:29 p.m. CST

    But we already knew Sayid wants redemption

    by Sick Fixx

    from the flashback where he is tortured by the vengeful husband. Hell, that's all anybody is really after on the island is redemption. And that would be fine if I believed that the writers did that intentionally. But I don't think they even realize the redemption connection between all the Islanders. There are a lot of things that have slipped out of their grasp, these writers. I truly believe that they have lost control of their show. Look at how quickly they abandoned Nikki and Paulo when they realized the characters weren't working. If those characters were not shown in the first season or at any point when we were familiarizing ourselves with the survivors of the crash, then there was no reason to introduce them later with the explanation that they've been there all along unless they were Others. Period.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:32 p.m. CST

    I dunno, something some old chinese guy said...

    by br1947

    something about not after midnight and don't get them wet... i dunno. :-)

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:35 p.m. CST

    That ain't no troll

    by Sick Fixx

    That's a leprechaun. Trolls are big, fierce and go where they please. And they can't go out in the daylight or they'll turn to stone. THAT'S a troll.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:36 p.m. CST

    Okay, so they go where they please

    by Sick Fixx

    EXCEPT the daylight.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:36 p.m. CST

    Farmer's Almanac 2008 > Lost

    by Sick Fixx

    Damn you people. Why did you make me do that???

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:38 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by esque

    Yes, we already knew Sayid wanted redemption, but now we know that it's not in his future, at least not for a long while. It's a doomed quest, and it should change how we see him going forward. Despite being tortured, despite Shannon, despite Nadia, he still regresses. But we don't know why or when it begins. Half of his arc still needs to be filled in, and there are a lot of interesting possibilities. Nikki and Paulo were a mistake, but I enjoyed their ... disposal.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:40 p.m. CST

    Bai Ling arrested!

    by skywalkerfamily

    She was shoplifting batteries and magazines. She was Jack's love interest in that one awful Lost episode.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:41 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by maxwell's hammer

    Hey, I read Gogol AND watch LOST, which makes me doubly better than everyone as ol Sicky.<BR> <BR> And Sicky, I don't think people are calling you a douchebag because you're well read. They're calling you a douchebag because you're name-dropping to convice us of how much more culturally literate you are than the rest of us.<BR> <BR> And did you seriously compare Prison Break with LOST?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:41 p.m. CST

    Bai Ling

    by esque

    Are we sure they were batteries and not just her nipples? There's a remarkable similarity.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:42 p.m. CST

    Sayid in coffin?

    by lordgrimplemort

    Now that we know Sayid is Ben's personal hitman, could it be that he was in the coffin. That would explain why none of the Oceanic 6 wanted to go to his funeral--except Jack, who may be thinking Ben was right by that point. It seems like Sayid's gone back to his pre-island ways. They're going to keep switching the character's personalities and ethics/morals right up to the end. You get to liking a person and then they turn out to be pretty unlikeable or vice versa. One thing I'm pretty sure of---Miles is an asshole no matter what his motives are. Others could go either way depending on what they've been led to believe by the Lockes and Bens and Dharmas of the world, but Miles is just a pure douchebag all the way.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:43 p.m. CST

    Hey Sick Fixx . . . Part II

    by Spacejockey426

    Ok, alright - you are entitled to your view, fair enough. I maintain my puzzle analogy, and add that some pieces are larger and more colorful than others - but all are necessary to the picture as a whole. Let me ask you then - if you were a producer of the show, how would you tell the story - what changes would you make that would make the show as good as Prison Break (which I agree is good stuff)?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:43 p.m. CST

    Sick....

    by seanny_d

    I fully respect your opinion, but Lindelof said explicitly last year that the show is "not about the island" and that these are people who are metaphorically Lost in their lives as well and are looking for redemption. So to say that it's not intentional would be erroneous. <p>As for your other opinions, I'd have to say that I respectfully disagree. I'm rather torn myself with these last couple of episodes because it's just so different than anything the show has given us before. And I have to say, the most shocking part of the episode is when Sayid got shot, and not the Ben reveal at the end. <p> But your Nikki and Paulo argument doesn't hold up very well because the writers heard people saying "well, what about all the other people who are on the island who aren't part of the A-team?" So those two were introduced to kind of give voice to that subset of the population. Unfortunately, it didn't work out and they realized that the main focus should be on the survivors. <p>I sincerely believe that there is a plan for this show, if only in plot. There is still opportunity to make changes in characters along the way, but the plot is essentially set.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 10:50 p.m. CST

    Nikki & Paulo

    by maxwell's hammer

    Those two are the exact reason why its great that the show is now destined to end at the end of season 6. Before the contract with ABC was struck, Cuse and Lindeloff were in the awkward position of dragging the show out indefinitely, not knowing when their finite idea for the show would end. That's why we got filler episodes and new characters like Nikki & Paulo (who apparently had a longer story originally planned for them, but got cut short when the audience hated them so damn much). With diversions like these unnecessary thanks to the new finite, three season contract, I think we'll be buzzing right along to the end.<BR> <BR> Oh, and Sick Fixx knows who Ernest Hemingway is and all about Japanese Surrealism. I just thought you all might want to know.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11 p.m. CST

    Dean Moriarty

    by esque

    To all the literates out there, you should be interested to know that Ben's alias on the Swiss passport is Dean Moriarty.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:06 p.m. CST

    I'm 6 minutes in

    by geraldbeans

    This might be the greatest show ever. WHY CAN'T EVERY EPISODE BE LIKE THIS???

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:11 p.m. CST

    Ben will turn out to be a good guy...

    by JackIsLost

    Or at least to have good intentions, even if he does stuff the wrong way. Make no mistake, if his character ultimately ends up being an out and out villain, it will be a huge disappointment. And if I could just add, even though I am loving this season, it does feel like we have abandoned the Dharma Initiative mystery for sake of the "What happens once they leave" mystery... but maybe it just seems that way b/c we don't have all the pieces of the puzzle yet. I must admit the introduction of flash-forwards is making things pretty frustrating in the near-term, even though I am pretty confident that it will greatly expand the scope and depth of the show in the long run.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:13 p.m. CST

    .

    by Sick Fixx

    I've never considered how I would tell the story of Lost that remains. I do know this. I would make an amputee Locke the person in the casket. It would be the ultimate irony that Jack and Locke were the ones that divided the Island and Jack, the less clingy to his ways of the two, would come to regret his choice even if it was the right one. I would want some light shed on the Jacob mystery, and make it a focal point of the rest of the season. I would draw from the best of the Lost fan theories, because the theories are ultimately more entertaining than most of what Carlton and Damon put out there. I like the Garden of Eden theory as far as what the island is. The skeletons would in fact be Adam and Eve, the original humans, though how this would be deduced, I'm not sure. I would write Cerberus, the Smoke Monster, out of the show. Have someone actually get the best of it, like Locke or Desmond, or have Ben disable it if it's in fact some sort of security program. This would increase the activity of the Whispers and they would start physically manifesting on the island more than they have been, i.e. the horse, Ben's mother. Miles would be so occupied with speaking to the Whispers/Voices, which are all over, that he would miss boarding and returning to America. He would stay behind on the island with the explanation that the Freighties were in a rush due to some conflict with Locke's people. Locke would be arrested for Naomi's murder and forced to go back to civilization with Jack, Kate, Sayid, Ben and whomever else makes it. As soon as he left the island, he would lose his ability to walk again, further demonstrating the island's magnificent healing properties. Faraday would be shot as the Freighties are trying to figure out who the mole is. Evidence would build toward the assumption that he was the mole, though they would soon find out he is not. The four toed statue would be explained as a civilization prior to the Others' attempt at building their own Statue of Liberty. Their project would never be finished due to the encroaching of Dharma into their territory. Marvin Candle would manifest from the Whispers to Juliet and Hurley, out gathering firewood for the coming nightfall. Juliet would recognize Candle right away, saying that he's dead. Candle would warn Hurley and Juliet to ignore the lies of the Orientation videos. He would then disappear. Hurley would ask Juliet how he could be dead if he was right there. Juliet would say that she knows he's dead, because she killed him herself. Miles, secluded away from everyone and following the directions of the Whispers across the jungle, stumbles onto a new hatch, one that runs underground, called The Portal. The Portal has instructional documents detailing what to do in the event that The Swan is destroyed. Miles watches The Portal's Orientation video and, shockingly, sees himself far, far off in the background across a hallway from where Marvin Candle is speaking in the film. This plays on Miles' nerves and he begins to think himself the Chosen One of the Whispers. He connects the dots as far as the island being out of flux, the numbers not being pushed, the Swan being destroyed, the purple sky resulting from such and, for the sake of the Whispers, destroys the Orientation film as well as the contingency plan documents that would set things right for the main group of 815 survivors. That's all I have right now. I'm not big on fan fiction. Damon and Carlton should be making the show this entertaining for us. It isn't my job. But, like someone else quoted McMurphy a few talkbacks ago, 'At least I tried, didn't I?'

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:14 p.m. CST

    I am also betting that Sayid's gf's boss...

    by JackIsLost

    will turn out to be the scary black guy from "The Wire".

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:18 p.m. CST

    DHARMA mystery

    by maxwell's hammer

    What exactly is the Dharma mystery? I thought that was pretty succinctly explained last season. They were a bunch of idealistic social scientists who took over the island to conduct various social experiments and the strange properties of the island. During their stint on the island, the island's native inhabitants decided to get rid of them. So the Dharma people are all gone, and all their shit (hatches and barracks and animal research facilities) is left behind.<BR> <BR> I think the mystery now is who are the original inhabitants, why is Ben so special to them, and who are the people on the freighter looking for the island.<BR> <BR> Now, I'm sure other Dharma stuff will come up (like how are they connected to Hanso and the freighter people and Widmore), but I think Dharma itself has been pretty much demystified.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:20 p.m. CST

    The mystery is...

    by JackIsLost

    what the hell brought Dharma to the island in the first place... I guess that mystery is still in play. Hell, it's the whole show. It's just that the show is so complicated already, that when it introduces new characters/mysteries, I worry it might spin out of control... (but I'm not that worried)

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:21 p.m. CST

    If the show isn't about the island

    by Sick Fixx

    but about the characters' journeys to redemption, then they shouldn't have put them on the island in the pilot.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:22 p.m. CST

    What about Sayid's lover?

    by skywalkerfamily

    Did he ever find her again?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:22 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx's version of LOST

    by maxwell's hammer

    I can't tell if he's joking or not.<BR> <BR> For all you LOST haters, at least Sick Fixx isn't writing the fucking who. As is evidenced by his plot ideas, LOST could be a hell of a lot worse.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:22 p.m. CST

    gotlik, it was a good last line...

    by JackIsLost

    (no pun intended) but the absolute best last line for any episode of Lost was Ben's (then Henry Gale) "Got any milk?"

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:23 p.m. CST

    NOTHING HAPPENED?

    by SkidMarkedUndies

    We learned Sayid is one of the Oceanic Six. We learned that Hurley is in over his head. Faraday confirmed a rumor going around the internet: TIME DILATION FIELD. And lastly, we find out Ben SURVIVES and LEAVES the Island. That's alot of info.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:24 p.m. CST

    And I still say Rose is in the coffin...

    by JackIsLost

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:28 p.m. CST

    This is the first time I've ever thought about

    by Sick Fixx

    what I'd do with the show. Someone asked what I would do, and I answered. I think it was a valiant attempt, but it's not my job to make Lost entertaining. It's the job of the people who are failing at it. Carlton and Damon thought calling the Dharma shark 'Ezra Sharkington' was the funniest thing in the world during one of their podcasts. They giggled like little girls for five minutes. It was shameful.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:31 p.m. CST

    Who was Ben talking about?

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    that will be important someone dies becasue sayid first trusted the freighter people at tt least that is implied and it is a female. question is who?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:33 p.m. CST

    Skid...

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    we dont know ben lives and gets off the island it, im under the theory that ben is still able to get off the island like they showed last week with the picture and hinted at this week with all the passports

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:34 p.m. CST

    PRISON BREAK???

    by DS9Sisko

    I wasn't even going to chime in, but for anyone to make the claim that Prison Break does anything "intelligently" shoots their credibility straight to hell.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:37 p.m. CST

    SickFixx....

    by DS9Sisko

    If you answered this before, please forgive me for asking but ... if Lost fails so miserably at so much on every level as you claim, why DO you watch it as faithfully as you do, right down to listening to the podcasts?

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:44 p.m. CST

    sick fixx's writing

    by ClintsMonkey

    sick fixx, your 'fan fiction' ending for lost was truly awful writing. To quote a line from "A Fish Called Wanda"..."just because you read Nietzsche does not mean you understand him."

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:46 p.m. CST

    Scofield is cunning as a fox

    by Sick Fixx

    Everything he does with calculated precision. They even explained this when Sara visited his psychiatrist who divulged that he saw the structure of everything clearer than most, a condition called 'Low Latent Inhibition'. Scofield always has a plan that's hinging on two or three things he has to do per episode. We see as these things go wrong, sometimes horribly, and he has to scramble for a new plan, one that is tighter and harder to maneuver than his original one. I've had a pulse of 97 after watching an episode of Prison Break. It's that intense. Lost has never done that to me, unless it's out of sheer anger. There's nothing stupid about Prison Break. Its characters have expansive vocabularies, more expansive than Hurley's, for fucking sure. Fox has always been the rogue network compared to the relatively safe venturing ABC, NBC and CBS. They may punish their own creations much of the time (Family Guy, Dark Angel, etc.) but at least they're willing to try something new. Lost isn't new. Too many times, I see Lost compared to Twin Peaks of X-Files, and it's just simply not. Sayid getting shot was not shocking. Any time someone is shot on Lost, it isn't shocking, because you know they're not going to die due to the flashback/flash forward structure of the episodes. How can a gunshot be shocking if you know they won't die? Prison Break plays for keeps. Michael's love interest had her head severed savagely to demonstrate that Gretchen, this season's main villain, isn't joking around. The performance of Robert Knepper as T-Bag, a pedophile/bisexual/looking for a clean slate wherever he can get it with a mind like a thesaurus easily rivals the best work of Michael Emerson as 'Cryptic one-liner at the end of every episode' Ben (terrific actor, not his fault, fault of the writers).

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:47 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx

    by maxwell's hammer

    Okay, I'll give you credit for trying. Sorry for mocking you.<BR> <BR> But I think some of your ideas are rather mundane solutions to the mysteries set up through 3 seasons. To this point, LOST has been a rather elaborate tapesty of interwoven stories, and I think that most of the haters (or at least those who claim the show is directionless) lose sight of how many balls are being juggled as we build toward the overall big picture. And with the exception of a few loose threads (such as Nikki & Paulo) I think there is ample evidence that this has all been pretty intricately thought out.<BR> <BR> As for your insistance that there is little plot development: I don't think you want to see it. If you can't see how learning about Sayid's future effects our perspective of his overall story arc, then maybe you should go back to reading Gogol. If you don't find it an interesting development that Locke has lost his cabin, and that we can now see the beginnings of what Hurley may have been apologizing to Jack about in his last flash-forward...well geez dude. It's like looking up and claiming not to see the sky.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:47 p.m. CST

    I know it was awful

    by Sick Fixx

    but why is it my responsibility to fix what the writers have damaged on their own show? I was asked what I would do, and I answered. I was going very much 'stream of consciousness' at it, 'making it up as I go along' so to speak, which is nothing new for Lost anyway.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:49 p.m. CST

    Prison Break is a $2 whore

    by oisin5199

    sure, it gets your rocks off, but not much depth in that relationship. I agree with the others (not the Others), baaad comparison. So it seems like this is a kind of war (like Ben mentions, or was it Sayid), between Abbadon (and his crew) and Ben. I assume that Greta worked for Abbadon. Of course, we have no idea who Abbadon is or who he's working for (Hanso?). My main question is where the hell is Richard and the other Others (like the stewardess and the kids)?!

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:54 p.m. CST

    you're really sticking to this Prison Break thing?

    by oisin5199

    Wow, I thought you were kidding. I've never seen a show that was so dependent on utter coincidence, either to screw things up for the characters (more often) or to save them. Talk about making shit up as you go along. You CANNOT tell me that the Prison Break writers knew where they'd be 3 years in, with a completely different plot every season, and just killing off one of the main characters (and THE love interest) because the actress obviously wanted out. As entertained as I am by the show, I know it is utterly and absolutely ridiculous. Whereas Lost has always functioned on a completely higher level of intricate plot and character work (and themes) than anything else on tv. And I'm continually amazed by it. Like I was tonight.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:57 p.m. CST

    Ignore Him

    by Ryan30

    Would you people please stop responding to that waste of life. Can't you see that he just wants attention to make himself feel special and you are falling into the trap? What kind of a sick, twisted individual stays on a chat board for over an hour complaining and insulting the very show this board is about, but still seems to have a background on the very thing he supposedly hates? I came here to read about thoughts on the episode. Stay on topic and ignore him! Then he might go away.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:57 p.m. CST

    What if there aren't three seasons left (including this one)?

    by lostlover127

    What if the creators of the show said they have 48 episodes left just so that we'd be impressed by how much information they're giving away right now. What if this is the last season? I know it sounds dumb, but unless the oceanic 6 go back for the others, then I can't see them giving this much each episode for 40-something more episodes. I loved tonight's ep.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:58 p.m. CST

    I disagree

    by Sick Fixx

    I know more about Michael Scofield as a character and what makes him tick in three seasons than ANY of the Losties or Others in Lost's four seasons. I've already outlined why he is such a complex character and why the episodes are more enthralling than what Lost has to offer. Why do I keep watching Lost? Because I want to believe it will show me what it's showed me on those rare occasions, such as 'We have to go back', 'Jacob', 'We found the signal' and 'You don't buy the ring, dummy'. At any job I've ever had, I've believed in offering the same level of output every single day, meaning I strive to be as productive and energetic today as I was yesterday, and last week. Why aren't writers held to that same standard? I believe that the writers of Prison Break earn their paychecks, that they suffer for their art, have migraines, work long nights rewriting dialogue and scenes to eliminate inconsistencies. I don't get that feeling with Lost. I feel like Carlton and Damon use Lost as more of a social instrument for themselves than as an outlet for creative storytelling. People have been calling me pretentious all night for reading Hemingway and Gogol, but I think Cuse/Lindelof are the essence of pretentiousness. Every scene they write, every bit of information they reveal, they hold more back than they give. In real life, when someone shares something, they give a lot more than one cryptic line of dialogue. Example: NEWS ARTICLES. There's a digestible way of processing the information, and I don't know why this has become such a bad way to present information. The only thing I can think of is that everyone has become pretentious by reading interviews of pretentious people who call anyone who wants information in a certain way 'simpletons' or of 'low attention span'. This is just class warfare in an artistic disguise.

  • Feb. 14, 2008, 11:59 p.m. CST

    No, I won't go away

    by Sick Fixx

    Even if you ignore me. Ignore HIM. This is more interesting than one word sentences about how bad ass you think INSERT NAME HERE is anyway.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:04 a.m. CST

    Okay, make a Prison Break talkback and MAYBE

    by Sick Fixx

    I'll go away. You have crow in your mouth, Harry. PB survived even after you buried its pilot episode. It's survived for three seasons and running. Even as it BEGINS to stretch the limits of plausibility here in its third season, it is still riveting television and has far surpassed Shawshank Redemption and Memento, both of which you maintain it borrowed liberally from. PRISON BREAK WILL NOT DIE!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:04 a.m. CST

    Well, at least she didn't leave because of a DUI...

    by Sick Fixx

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:06 a.m. CST

    the actor that plays ben sucks

    by geraldbeans

    Re: Ben. I don't know if anyone is with me here, but I don't like that actor. Every episode he's been on I hoped would be his last. But now he's off the island too?? We're going to have to see more of him?? Ugh. I get the feeling the reason they cast him was because he initially had to seem like a wimp (when he was captured). Now that the story requires him to be a badass, it just doesn't work. The guy doesn't scare me at all. He's not even a killer. He really hasn't done all that much wrong. And we're supposed to believe he can manipulate and control people and is this really scary entity? Man, please get this guy off the show (although now I think we're stuck with him).

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:08 a.m. CST

    Scoffield is an engineer

    by AlwaysThere

    Engineers stick together.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:08 a.m. CST

    characters....

    by maxwell's hammer

    You seriously don't think we know enough about Jack and Sawyer and Locke and Juliet? LOST has some of the most fascinating characters on television, and everytime the show stops to focus on them, we get to see new chapters of their histories that add layers to our understanding of them, without contradicting everything that has come before.<BR> <BR> Watching Jack walk the fine line between sturdy leader and obsessive asshole...watching Locke walk the fine line between depressed loser and empowered hero...watching Sawyer walk the line between being eaten by consumptively pathetic self-hatred and trying desperately to hide it by posing as a hardened badass...watching Juliet transform from a humble and miserable follower to an independant fighter (learning to manipulate people the way she was once manipulated)...<BR> <BR> Again, if you don't see anything interesting in these characters, you need to fix your perscription.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:10 a.m. CST

    Oh come on, I'm not that bad...

    by Sick Fixx

    Freedom of Speech isn't that bad. I'm not telling any of you to go away because you disagree with me. Isn't this the reason of these talkbacks? To discuss our differences? Have I resorted to name calling as you people have? Because if I have, I don't remember it. I passionately stand by what I believe and expect you all to do the same. Where's the harm?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:11 a.m. CST

    Locke is the exception to my statement

    by Sick Fixx

    about Lost characters. I think he is the most fleshed-out individual on the show.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:12 a.m. CST

    So let me get this straight...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...you are now claiming that "Prison Break" is better than LOST, The Shawshank Redeption, and Memento?<BR> <BR> Um.<BR> <BR> I think my brain just broke.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:15 a.m. CST

    Prison Brake

    by oisin5199

    The actress who played Sarah was pregnant, sure. But she was supposed to come back to the show. But there was some contract dispute over the # of episodes, and they were so pissed, they burnt that bridge by putting her head in a box. Despite the fact that the show kills off all its female characters. Here's what Matt Roush of TVGuide had to say about the end of this season: "a show that seems to take pride in being as unpleasant as it is ludicrous. And that's saying something. Prison Break nowadays is less a ticking clock of suspense than an icky, sticky crock. With too many conspiracy theories, hidden agendas and hostage/death threats to count, the show has become a blur of pointed guns, bloodied fists, perspiration and acting worthy of a straight-to-DVD potboiler." <p> And I love Michael Emerson (Ben), just a look and a tone in his voice says it all, even when he doesn't seem to be revealing much. I, for one, think he's a fantastic actor.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:17 a.m. CST

    Bottom line is that Michael Emerson doesn't beat Robert Knepper

    by Sick Fixx

    in terms of acting ability and the gift to convey the gravity of all his remorse not for his past actions, but the fact that those actions continue to stain every fresh start his character, T-Bag, gets. It just doesn't happen.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:19 a.m. CST

    Michael Emerson...

    by maxwell's hammer

    I think you're missing the point of the 'Ben' character if you find his lack of guilt and desire for a fresh-start a problem.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:19 a.m. CST

    I could care less what TV Guide thinks

    by Sick Fixx

    They make television into some socialite event. They're the ones that encourage this nonsense about the nation being 'addicted to Lost'. Cue Dead Robert Palmer for the propagandized Superbowl ad.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:21 a.m. CST

    Minkowski...

    by wirefufighter

    Anyone wondering why Lapidus didnt want Faraday talking to Minkowski on the walkie while he was doing that experiment? Just seemed like one of those odd little "blink and you miss it" details that may hold more significance.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:24 a.m. CST

    The show is moving too FAST!

    by Lashlarue

    Although, when you think about it, they still haven't answered anything. It could all still be interpreted a billion different ways.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:31 a.m. CST

    Robert Knepper/T-Bag

    by Sick Fixx

    I can fire off exemplary dialogue from him all day to prove my point. How about when he's pulling up to his old house where he intends to hide the family he has abducted to give himself a fresh start. He sees graffiti everywhere, holes in the walls. His old stomping grounds are not how he remembers them. As he pulls up the driveway, he mutters 'De-filers. De-spoilers. Mis-creants. Van-dals.' And he mutters each word with such conviction, conviction I have yet to see Ben muster in his hurried vocal stylings.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:32 a.m. CST

    Name dropping?

    by Sick Fixx

    That's simply the cost of having a developed, sophisticated discussion. You have to have something or someone to make comparisons to on most things.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:33 a.m. CST

    Hi all - first post out of many...

    by N-A

    Sick Fixx, You're fucking insane. I feel dirty for giving you the attention you so desperately covet.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:34 a.m. CST

    by SuperBurgerBat

    Jesus Christ, stop falling for Sick Fixx's dirty trixx. He obviously watches enough Lost to write fanfic...DON'T FEED THE LEPRECHAUNS...I also think it is probably Sayid in the coffin. Out of all of the Oceanic 6 so far, he is the prime suspect. Hurley couldn't have fit in there. I think that Sun and Jin will round out the 6, unfortunately...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:35 a.m. CST

    I think part of the reason nothing's a surprise anymore...

    by Playkins

    ...nothing is a surprise anymore because we've had three years now to build theories and ideas around what we think is happening. Sooner or later we'll guess everything br process of elimination. Tonight's major revelation (that the Island does in fact exist outside "normal time") has already been chewed on, digested, and shit back out. When "Smokey the Black Cloud" is revealed to be a security system left by Dharma to protect it's people against the natives, will anyone be shocked?<P> Hell, I remember doing the old "what's in the hatch" with friends and someone suggested it's a leftover Dharma Op that is watching the Losties. Not too far off.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:35 a.m. CST

    LOST

    by SuperBurgerBat

    Jesus Christ, stop falling for Sick Fixx's dirty trixx. He obviously watches enough Lost to write fanfic...DON'T FEED THE LEPRECHAUNS...you took the bait, now he's trying to talk about Prison Break! I also think it is probably Sayid in the coffin. Out of all of the Oceanic 6 so far, he is the prime suspect. Hurley couldn't have fit in there. I think that Sun and Jin will round out the 6, unfortunately...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:38 a.m. CST

    all i wanna know is...

    by the_man_from_Rio

    why did faraday say the time difference between those 2 electronics displays was " not that...that's not good"...and then he later told the lawnmower man to go exatcly in the bearings he came in from...Sayid: "what do u know about friendship?" ben: " i know it's no use keeping them around if u cant trust them" talk about calm and collected, Ben Linus is possibly one of the most interesting characters ever in a TV series...i come off a little exagerated but think about his arc, coming in early in season 2, and then being tagged as the definitive bad guy, and lately, we're seeing why and how everything his does to protect the secret of the island is so calm and collected...Sayid:" they know we're after them" Ben: "Good".

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:41 a.m. CST

    So I'm syphilis, fucking insane, a douchebag,

    by Sick Fixx

    pretentious, a name dropper, a troll and a leprechaun. Anything else, gentlemen?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:48 a.m. CST

    i have chosen team Locke, and here's why...

    by the_man_from_Rio

    Miles: "which side did u land on?" sayid: " i'll let u know when i decide" kate: "because i believe he can get us off the island" sawyer: " that's the difference between you and me" IN LOCKE WE TRUST.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:55 a.m. CST

    AUGH! Mom told me not to feed the Trolls but Sick Fixx....

    by TallScott

    See you next week buddy. You what I do what I hate a show? I dont watch! Nor do I post is piss all over the show and its fans. You will never see me in a JAG Thread. But im betting dollars to doughnuts that you WILL watch next week and spend hours pissing and moaning in talkback for hours. Wow I wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:55 a.m. CST

    AUGH! Mom told me not to feed the Trolls but Sick Fixx....

    by TallScott

    See you next week buddy. You what I do what I hate a show? I dont watch! Nor do I post is piss all over the show and its fans. You will never see me in a JAG Thread. But im betting dollars to doughnuts that you WILL watch next week and spend hours pissing and moaning in talkback for hours. Wow I wish I had that kind of time on my hands.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:06 a.m. CST

    quickly weighing in re: sick fixx

    by necgray

    First of all, Fixx, I think there's a pretty large fallacy inherent in the "Lost" vs "Prison Break" discussion. That fallacy is the age-old "apples and oranges". The two shows are similar only in that they are hour-long dramas. There the similarities pretty much end. Lost is set in a horror/sf/fantasy universe. It attempts to walk the line between these genres while also existing as a compelling character drama. Whether or not it succeeds obviously depends on who you ask. Prison Break is far more straightforward. It's an action procedural. The tone of Lost, the feel that they're attempting to produce, requires a certain degree of holding back information. Some people think it holds back too much. Well, okay, but that's neither here nor there if you compare it to Prison Break. The tone of Prison Break doesn't require it to hold back information. Second, I think it's a little strange that you outright deny comparisons between Lost and X-Files/Twin Peaks but you're not above favorably comparing Prison Break to Shawshank and Memento. And again, apples and oranges, my friend. Prison Break is a TV show. Shawshank and Memento are movies. I'm not even going to get into how crack-headed I think you are for placing a mediocre if sometimes compelling TV show above one of the greatest prison films of all time and one of the most amazing indie films in the past 10 years. Third, there's a certain strident "this is fact" tone about some of your arguments that makes me really wish you'd consider not posting here. Not because I'm against people having problems with Lost. Lord knows the show can piss me off, too. But you obviously have a huge bug up your ass about it and the weird flogging of the show with the Prison Break stick just seems really unnecessary. I mean, look at that last post (at least, last by the time I'm writing this). "Bottom line" and "just doesn't happen". Okay, I get it. You like Prison Break. You wish it had its own talkback. Is it necessary to come in here and obsessively bash Lost while comparing it to your OBVIOUSLY precious baby of a show? I LOVED Freaks and Geeks, but I'm not about to post incessantly about how Lindsay Weir is a more developed character than Juliet...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:08 a.m. CST

    Playkins

    by Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World

    Really, you guessed the hatch was a left over dharma operation? That is amazing man, because the rest of us had not idea what Dharma was until the hatch was shown to us. I guess you ARE going to have everything figured out before the show tells us!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:27 a.m. CST

    Sick,

    by Mezzanine

    The thing that I am not understanding is, if you do not like Lost, why are you in here talking about it? it just seems like a waste of time to me. <p> I have never watched more than a few episodes of Prison Break, but to compare the two is a pretty ridiculous idea. Fortunately, since I don't feel like typing a bunch of (seemingly obvious) shit out, Necgray already has, and has made some excellent points. <p> Now, all the nitpicking and trolling and drama aside, tonight's episode was fucking fantastic.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:42 a.m. CST

    Guy on golf course

    by lordgrimplemort

    At first I thought there was some bad rumor surrounding the Oceanic 6 that made that guy scared when he realized who Sayid was and that Sayid just killed him because he's a scumbag now. But now I see that when Sayid revealed who he was the guy knew Sayid was there to kill him. So who are these people he's after? Did that guy work for Hanso? Also, at the end Ben says Sayid shouldn't trust his heart because the last time he did he saw what happened and Sayid says" you used that to recruit me to killing for you." Is that on or off the island do you think? Does he meet up with his Iraqi woman and she dies because of him? Whatever happened, I definitely don't think Ben's one of the Oceanic 6. I think Ben defeats the boat people or they leave the island and he is still able to come and go at will like we've seen Richard do.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:02 a.m. CST

    So Ben was using the island to hop around

    by skywalkerfamily

    to all those different places in time and screw stuff up. It would explain all his passports.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:03 a.m. CST

    Playkins - I think you are on the money

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    There would not be too many tv shows on at the moment that has been analysed and thought about for the last threee years to the extent that Lost has, it will always been amazing when the creators of Lost are really able to suprise us all. Am loving this season of Lost, hope that than keep up, clearly the best network TV available.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:06 a.m. CST

    Was Faraday in the nut house?

    by skywalkerfamily

    Frank and Miles all say he crazy. Bet Faraday knows Hurley.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:20 a.m. CST

    skywalkerfamily

    by Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World

    That pilot guy didn't say he was crazy, he said everything he said was either above his head or way above his head, meaning he's just a science genius who is eccentric. I mean he could be a crazy guy, but they haven't really said so in the show yet. And that guy is on acid in every role he plays anyway.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:27 a.m. CST

    Kinda Sucks

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    You know its going to be hard waiting for that 6 week gap between episodes. Alot of people know what the 8th episode seems to hold possile answers and revleations and now we have to wait though it is toget 5 more episodes

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:36 a.m. CST

    I want to see Desmond and Penny

    by skywalkerfamily

    get back together, but that pilot said he never met her.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:42 a.m. CST

    sick fixx...

    by wirefufighter

    On Prison Break... it's certainly an underrated show, with an, IMO, excellent second season, but how can you say that the series, on a whole, is any faster paced then Lost? I nearly gave up on it back during the first season because, after a while, it felt like every episode consistd of the writers pulling at straws to both A. Delay the escape, and B. Delay Linc's execution. As one complication topped another, the whole thing began to feel utterly ridiculous. One thing that I felt helped the second season immensely was that it was originally intended to be the final one in the series. Such knowledge at the time clearly gave them greater freedom in plotting their story, allowing for all those neat character resolutions and deaths. Anyways, to tie it in with Lost, I simply don't think that Lost would work if it were played like Prison Break. As I said, part of the appeal of Prison Break's streamlined nature comes from the fact that it's run was originally intended to be quite short. Lost was likely originally intended to be a long-haul shows, and thus would have to space out its character arcs a bit more. What can I say, it is a slower paced show, so I wouldn't hold it against you for saying your pulse ain't ratcheted up during it. Also, I wouldn't say you're being fair by slicing down the character development in Lost. Although some characters have remained practically one note, others have notably evolved due to events in the show. Take Sawyer during this ep, for instance. Wouldn't you say his suggestion of staying in the other's village and living a happy, isolated existance is a far cry from the Sawyer we knew in the beginning? PS: Tbag does indeed rock on Prison Break, as does Mahone.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:54 a.m. CST

    N. I'll always be with you R.G.

    by G100

    Doesn't this point to the "economist" being R.G.? In which case Abaddon may answer to this mysterious R.G. The kind of neighborhood the funeral was in makes me think Michael is still the best candidate for the coffin. What I was curious about.. Was the Golfer before or after the German flashforward ? Because Sayid told the girl he was in the crash willingly and expected and got no reaction whereas Golfing dude was told and knew what it meant. That to me points to the Golf hit being after Ben saying good and Sayid was totally focused and cold unlike at the German hit. If so he learned from German girl.(character development) I think the softhearted mistake Sayid makes is with his girlfriend and Abaddon's goons kill her, but there was the small chance that taking Naomi's body was a softhearted decision that could cost him too. But lets face facts a Great Ep. Anyone who says otherwise is clearly a hater who hasn't been watching it for all 4 seasons as we all know what the "filler" Eps were like and this wasn't one of them. For those who also tried to say nothing happened but Hurley's duplicity because the payoff at the end took them totally by surprise and they forgot about the Time paradox, Jacobs roving cabin, as well as the shifting allegiances I can only say, Prison Break ??? Sweet Jeebus that's hilarious.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:01 a.m. CST

    What would really wow me

    by Sick Fixx

    is if Lindelof and Cuse said that one of the flashbacks we've seen the past three seasons was actually not a flashback at all but a flash forward done less obviously compared to 'Through the Looking Glass'.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:37 a.m. CST

    don't like the "ghost whisperer" element

    by SantiagoAtez

    Worst decision in the series so far, in my opinion.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:50 a.m. CST

    The Freighter People aren't the bad guys!

    by Northridge

    Don't you all get it!? The Lost writers LOVE to mindfuck us to death. With that supposition in mind, it'll be revealed that PENNY WIDMORE is the bad guy, and that the freight people are actually the good ones!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:03 a.m. CST

    I don't know what the "Filler" episodes were like

    by Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World

    Someone please explain to me what these "filler" episodes of past seasons were, I must have missed them.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:36 a.m. CST

    Theory: how Kate could be an Oceanic 6...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    When she returned and was arrested, a famous hotshot lawyer took on her case for the publicity, helped get her a new trial, and she was acquitted of all crimes. Thus, she is a huge celebrity in the flash-forwards, which could also explain why Jack had such a hard time getting a hold of her in last season's finale.<p><p>Ben could still be the corpse in the coffin. But Ben could also have faked his death -- there's nobody in the coffin.<p><p>As I theorized in last week's TB, I think one reason why Jack wants to go back to the island is to rescue Claire and Aaron. He found out from Claire's aunt who Claire's dad is. It would be an even greater dramatic motivator if he learns Claire is his sister after his mother dies, thus, making him feel alone in the world.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:52 a.m. CST

    Ben lives

    by Napoleon Park

    leaves the island and gets to have people killed.<P>The man who regretted being a torturer becomes a hitman.<p>Projectiles fired at the island don't arrive when they should.<p>Hurley doesn't like taking hostages but still sides with Team locke enough to betray his friends. Kate stays with Sawyer. Juliet and Desmond seem to be hitting it off pretty well. That Miles guy is really getting to be a jerk.<p>It was a cliche, but at least someone finaly closed Naomi's eyes befoe they dried up or got eaten by bugs.<p>Oh, and though nobody could or would answer my question for 4:41, I caught a minute of the "enhanced" rerun and it is that stupid pop up video trivia crap.<p>Best episode of "Lost" all week, best season in years... and this was one of the worst and most annoying talkbacks in a while. You know why.<p>The best thing I've ever heard about the show that defied it's own premise by actually breaking its characters out of prison and then showing what happens after, is that next year Fox is canceling it and replacing it with a new version of their 1987 sseries "Women In Prison". Won't be the same without Wendie Jo Sperber and Peggy Cass, though. I hope they can get Kirsten Vangsness for the Denny Dillon role. That would be sweet.

  • OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:37 a.m. CST

    Holy Shit!!! There are a lot of people responding to SickFixx.

    by Executor

    Jesus why this is annoying.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:56 a.m. CST

    other "tailies"

    by jimbohal78

    did they ever explain what happened to the other tail section people? remember when Ana Lucia and her little group were so terrified of the "others" because the first night on the island they were attacked and some of the survivors of the tail section (including all the children) were taken? did they ever explain where those people are? did anyone, with all their interaction with Ben now, even ask?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:16 a.m. CST

    Where the F is Claire !?!?!?!?

    by Itchy

    Jesus. At least give me a 20 second lingering ass shot each episode. Christ.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:46 a.m. CST

    flashforwards

    by jimbohal78

    I have to believe that none of those flashbacks are actually the end of the story. I think they probably will get off the island in the next season and spend the last season trying to return for whatever reason - most likely to save the ones they had to leave behind and were sworn to secrecy not to discuss. Also, did no one else see that ending coming? I knew for sure when Sayid said something like "the day I trust him(Ben) is the day I give up my soul." I am very intrigued though as to the course of events that lead to Sayid working for Ben. However, could future Sayid be deceiving Ben? Remember what else happened in this episode - Sayid learned a lesson about trusting supposed "friends" and ends up getting tricked. Could that be foreshadowing Sayid pulling the same manipulation on Ben in the future? Maybe all the killing he is doing for Ben is a means to an end. I find it hard to believe, with all we've learned about Sayid's feelings of guilt about his past and the man he is now, that he would become that type of man again. Either that or Ben is actually a "good guy" and has been all along and Sayid has joined his righteous cause and is rightfully assassinating people. One thing is for sure, if they don't fuck it up, this has to go down as one of the greatest television series ever.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:51 a.m. CST

    I'll have to scroll back later to read the posts,

    by Grammaton Cleric Binks

    but all I can say is Lost is the ultimate mind screw. Last night was awesome. Hurley playing double agent, who'da thunk it. "Oh great another Sawyer" Ghostbuster is gonna get his. So the question is, is Ben one of the six, or is it two more plus Ben as Ben was not on the flight? Miles is just creepy. Are you hear to kill us? "not yet." Yeah, good way to build trust. This episode is the best so far of the new season, and all this season have been excellent.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:10 a.m. CST

    Thoughts and Comments

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    Haven't read all the posts but <p> Juliet really does have nice cans. Any chance of an on-island remake of Gia with her and Kate? <p> Now I'm thinking it was Sayid in the coffin. Jack knows he was working for Ben and is their only ticket back. <p> Was anyone else expecting Sayid to be working for Mr. Abbadon at the end of the episode? <p> Who is Sayid trying to kill? The rest of Dharma? Maybe those working behind the scenes at Oceanic? <p> Who was Mr. Avelon (?), he has to work for Dharma/Oceanic, right? <p> The more I think about it the more I think Dharma and Oceanic are linked. <p> Anyone else pick up on when Charolette (?) said "I've got work to do" Thats the third time we've heard that phrase. <p> Based on next week's promo, does Kate nail Sawyer in Ben's bed? Thats kind of messed up. <p> Anyone have clarification on the time differential, is the island in the past or the future from the boat. I'm assuming it is running slower than the rest of the world, but what if it was reversed?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:37 a.m. CST

    Anyone else

    by fettskull

    notice Ben's alias on the passport Sayid picked up. Dean Moriarty. Moriarty is a common name, right? heh

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:38 a.m. CST

    time differential

    by BigTexas42

    the thing I don't get about the time differential thing, is why can they talk to the freighter real-time? If they were truly in the past or whatever, they wouldn't beable to talk directly to them. There would be some dely, no? I''m thinking there is some time-shifting barrier that you have to go around or under to get to the islad without passing through some "elongation in time" barrier. I don't know. And it is true: Juliet has nice cans. <P><P>so was Ben the "he" Kate refered to in the S3 finale?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:48 a.m. CST

    Also...

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    What happens if you don't follow the same heading out as you did coming in? Could you possibly be in a different time then you are supposed to be, meaning you could see your past/ future self? <p> Can't wait to see a Ben flashforward now! Is he forced off or can he still come and go willingly? <p> What was up with the braclet? He took it from Naomi and gave it to the pale chick? <p> Is the reason Michael is credited in the last two episodes because he has been referenced in both? (i.e. the man on the boat working for Ben) <p> And yes Prison break is entertaining, and T-Bag is an excellent actor(especially when he does that licking his lips thing) but it is no where near the quality of Lost. Prison Break is the girl you date, fun for awhile, gives you some really exciting times, but not worth marrying. Lost is the girl you take to meet your parents. You can have a good conversation with her. You may have some bad times but there is always the make up sex, that is amazing. Lost is the girl you love, the girl you marry.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:53 a.m. CST

    Ben definately IS in the coffin...

    by Anton Chigurh

    ...Ben has a lot more power than anyone thought (the force is strong with this one). By season 6, Jack and the rest will find this out. Back in the States, Jack will know, for reasons we will find out in the future, that Ben can get them back to the island. Ben probably dies by gunshot from one of the Oceanic 6 or maybe even someone who comes in and says "You left me on that island to rot!" then BAM!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 7:55 a.m. CST

    The time difference might explain the food drops...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    It could explain why the DHARMA food drops were still happening, despite the fact that The Others massacred the DHARMA people. <p><p>What's apparently happening is that time runs slower on the island. That's why it took longer for the rocket to arrive.<p><p>But it also appears that people on the island can communicate in real-time with the outside world. So if someone on the island talks to someone via satellite or radio, then it's the year 2004 still. But in the outside world, it's actually 2008. That means that if someone on the island communicates with someone located far away from the island, the person on the island is altering the past by doing so.<p><p>It becomes a brain bender when you consider this scenario: What if someone on the island (let's say Desmond) communicates with someone in the outside world (let's say Penny). He would be talking to Penny from the year 2004. So how long would it take for her to get to the island? How long was Juliet's trip in the submarine to the island?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8 a.m. CST

    Sick Fixx, can I ask you a serious question?

    by rbrog77

    Dude, I'm confused. You hate how this show moves, you hate not having your questions answered, etc.<P> So please explain to me...why do you watch LOST?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:04 a.m. CST

    Also, we know it's 2004 on the island...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    This was confirmed when Ben showed Juliet the live satellite feed of Juliet's sister.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:05 a.m. CST

    @ mezzanine

    by necgray

    I got practice typing out insanely long tb posts with my pro-WGA strike defenses. That... was tiresome... especially given the level of hatred some people had/have for writers.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:12 a.m. CST

    Put the letter "p" in brackets -- "<" and ">"

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    Do this twice -- once for the carriage return, and the second to insert a space between paragraphs.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:14 a.m. CST

    What was up with

    by ChrisVenom

    Ben's voice at the end of the episode? Thats pretty unusual for them to disguise his voice as a cheap way to fake out the viewers. Before they showed him I thought we were gonna see Jacob in that room. Any thoughts on that?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:14 a.m. CST

    Edit: Not brackets, the "greater than" and "lesser than" symbols

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    It's the standard HTML coding tag for paragraph breaks.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:22 a.m. CST

    ChrisVenom: Yeah I think it was a cheap way to disguise Ben's vo

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    A better way to have presented it would have been to show someone already working on Sayid's bullet wound, a person we're not shown immediately but we can tell is wearing a surgeon's mask. Then when this person finishes stitching up Sayid, Ben then lowers his mask to reveal himself. This way, it'd be more believable that his voice sounded different, because it would have been muffled by a surgeon's mask. This reveal scene could have been staged better.<p><p>When this scene was playing out, there were two other people I was considering that Sayid's boss was: Jack or Christian (but I do believe Christian is dead, and he only possibly still exists as a manifestation of the smoke monster).

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:36 a.m. CST

    Ben's man on the boat

    by jimbohal78

    What if through this supposed weird time/space-warp-scifi thing going on Ben's man on the boat is Sayid (or Desmond)- he just doesn't know it yet! Maybe Ben has some ability to see the future (which we know is not out of the realm of possibility on this show) and knew he would be striking some sort of deal with Sayid (when they were alone together at the barracks) and thats why he said in the previous episode that he had a man on the boat and how he knew the details of the freighter 4 - because in the future Sayid tells him. Of course this is assuming he's not just lying about having a man on the boat. I'm sure he could have gotten that info on the freighter 4 through his off island contacts. But yea its probably just Michael on the boat.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:44 a.m. CST

    awful talkback

    by tristiac

    A great episode of Lost with lots to talk about, yet this whole talkback was a response to sick fixx? Seriously how about we give him a a talkback on a different page and save this one for discussions of Lost if everyone insists on arguing with him. He's not going to stop arguing back with everyone jumping down his throat! I don't agree with him, but anyone would get defensive.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:46 a.m. CST

    chrisvenom

    by jimbohal78

    yeah i thought for a brief second that it was christian also. i think thats what they wanted us to think with the surgery aspect, thus making the Ben reveal even more shocking. However, i was pretty sure it was Ben for most of the episode when Sayid said something like "the day I trust him(Ben) is the day I sell my soul." Either that or Ben would end up being the Economist (he's only in Berlin twice a year and Sayid found all those passports). I think thats what they wanted us to think.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 8:49 a.m. CST

    tristiac

    by jimbohal78

    i just ended up eventually skipping every talkback with his name in it. I suggest all others do the same. Makes it a lot quicker to read all the posts this morning.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:30 a.m. CST

    Michael (Harold) in credits

    by arby64

    He is in the credits because he is a full time cast member. They have their names in the credits regardless of whether or not they are in the episodes. (Like when claire was kidnapped in season one she still had her name in each episode)

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:44 a.m. CST

    what about the temple?

    by BigTexas42

    Anyone ever wonder what happened or is happening with the other others at the temple? what the heck is the temple, anyway? has that ever been addressed in the lost "extended universe"?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:52 a.m. CST

    Dean Moriarty

    by MonkeyAngst

    I think some of the TBers have missed this... Dr. Moriarty is indeed a classic villain, Sherlock Holmes's archnemesis. However, DEAN Moriarty is a character from Jack Kerouac's "On the Road" -- A character based on Kerouac's friend Neal Cassady, he travels the country in search of his father. Make of that what you will.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:55 a.m. CST

    'a headcase'

    by ArcadianDS

    When abadon was discussion the mission to the island with 'dead parachute girl' (forgot her name sorry), she described him as "..a headcase.." so there is some merit to the theory that he might have spent time in a hospital.<p> I believe that Kate works for Ben also, either as another pawn in his operation, or as a mole.<p> The theory that rose is in the coffin works. She is a large woman, but she's short - if her cancer returns, she'd lose a great deal of weight. And her death might hit Jack pretty hard as he and Rose bonded all the way back to the pilot episode. I'm going to propose that the last two of the Oceanic 6 are Rose and her husband.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:57 a.m. CST

    CAN SOMEONE EXPLAIN THE HARRYTOON PLZ?

    by ArcadianDS

    Its just him in an imam getup looking around. Lawrence of Arabia? or The stupid Spurlock film?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:03 a.m. CST

    Harrytoon

    by ToughGuyRizzo

    It's probably Indy from Raiders. I was thiking the same thing too. Why does it look so retarded? Then I was like, you just asked yourself that about Knowles....dickhole.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:04 a.m. CST

    i come to talkbacks

    by redfishbluefish

    for some fun and reading about all the tidbits that people have found that intrigued them inspired them in all their possibilities. i come to read about what people like, love, and are in a quandry about regarding the episode and the characters. i came to this particular talkback because SAYID is the most delicious character and i love seeing him kick butt and looking so tortured himself at the same time. what i got when i came to this talkback was a ridiculous transcript for an episode of the debaters. BORING AND NO FUN. and seriously, if you hate LOST that much just PLEASE go watch repeats of Prison Break and touch yourself all over about your Michael Scoffield and T-Bag fantasies and PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE leave me to watch and enjoy and touch myself all over about how delectable SAYID is and how i would really like them to make him remove his shirt more often. Shallow? perhaps, yes. Truthfully, i love and get annoyed by LOST regularly. but i cannot help but watch and that is part of its' lure. What is my point to all of this? your debate bores the shit out of me and i want the fun back! shoo, fly, you bother me.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:07 a.m. CST

    Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World:

    by Playkins

    Who are you, Columbo? Something bothering you? Got one more question for me?<p> No, I didn't guess it was "Dharma" specifically, but the people that were running what was happening on the island.<p> For fuck's sake, chill out.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:10 a.m. CST

    Rose and Bernard are not part of the 6

    by Jor-El23

    I thought everyone already knew who the 6 were. i don't want reveal it and spoil it for everyone but just go out there and look on the internet, you should be able to find it right away.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:11 a.m. CST

    Lost Valentine's Day cards

    by zooch

    http://tinyurl.com/yrj7cp<br> http://tinyurl.com/248qul<br> http://tinyurl.com/2awrrp<br> http://tinyurl.com/284xfu<br>

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:13 a.m. CST

    When does the 4-toed statue come in?

    by Jor-El23

    we were told it would be dealt with this season.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:14 a.m. CST

    Island is 31 minutes behind

    by Jor-El23

    right? i could be doing the math wrong.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:15 a.m. CST

    Ben vs. the Bad Guys

    by HarrysNemesis

    OK, here's what I deduce: Ben is a good guy in as far as his actions are dedicated to protecting the island. The outside group probably learned of the Dharma initative's work and figured out a way they can use the island for their own gain. The outside group's goal has to be misuse of the island's powers in some way. You don't have a group that pursues it in the way they have in case there is some nefarious reason they are doing it -- IE, they wouldn't be prepared to kill Sayyid and who knows who else if that island weren't incredibly valuable in some way. Ultimately if Ben's actions are viewed as protecting the island, and there is some way for someone with evil intent to misuse the island in some horrific way, then his horrible actions are justified by the end result of what happens if he fails. It is not Sayyid in the casket -- they have given no hint of a reason no one would show up at his funeral. Even if Sayyid became a killer afterwards (which no one else knew since he was working covertly), the other Oceanic 6 (5?) would most likely have gone to his funeral. Ben or Locke make the most sense, but I don't see Locke leaving the island. Ben I see as getting off the island by a) being captured on the island and then rescued by his man on the boat or b) he has another alternate method off the island that will allow him to come back that just hasn't been revealed yet (who know about the submarine until it was revealed?)

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:20 a.m. CST

    Damn, that was a GREAT episode!

    by ccchhhrrriiisssm

    How can someone with an IQ > 80 still not feel that LOST is the best serial drama to ever appear on TV?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:23 a.m. CST

    When speaking to a Flaming Troll

    by Napoleon Park

    please put the name Flaming Troll in the subject line. When discussing a topic a Flaming Troll brings up, such as an irrelevant television program such as "How I Broke Out Of Prison (And What I Did For Two Seasons Afterwards)" please include the phrase FLAMING TROLLS TOPIC in the subject line<p>that way those of us who come here to read, write about and discuss the latest episode of "Lost" can skip over not only Flaming Troll's posts but those from people succumbing to his taunting.<p>The best Hurley and Sayid episodes ever elevate my hopes for the next 4 and give me regrets over what the full season might have been. Though without the strike everyone would still be beyoncing over getting 14 episodes instead of 22. Especially episodes of this quality.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:28 a.m. CST

    Alternate Universe

    by Spiny Norman

    The idea of alternate universes have always intrigued me, weather in real life or in fiction. Although, I believe Lost is dealing only with time travel. I am most intrigued about Walt, he has proven he can astral project himself to other people. So when he appeared at the end of last season he was off the island and had grown up, while on the island only 95 or so days had gone by.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:30 a.m. CST

    Node32774

    by redfishbluefish

    yeah, forgive me, but i had to say something. the pile up of vomit on my shoes was getting to be a bit much. too many spoilers and too many cranky trolls make me annoyed and nauseous. you have to read to know you haven't missed anything already said and it just gets to be a bit much on occasion. i will prevail, however. my SAYID keeps me going....

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:35 a.m. CST

    It's doubtful that Penny is a bad guy...

    by sapno_krei

    Unless the writers really want to piss the viewers off.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:35 a.m. CST

    Time: It's all a matter of perception

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    On the island, it could be considered that time moves at a normal rate, but that it moves faster outside of it. Conversely, in the outside world, time moves at a normal rate, but it appears to move slower on the island. It's all a matter of perception and where you literally are.<p><p>Thus, Locke saw an older version of Walt, because Walt has been living in the outside world (and he can astrally project himself). So from Locke's perspective, Walt has aged faster than normal.<p><p>The rocket came to the island later than expected. Thus, the inverse should hold true if one gets off the island. It should take a person less time than expected to arrive at their destination when traveling away from the island.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:36 a.m. CST

    Napoleon Park > Flaming Troll

    by redfishbluefish

    excellent. this will work greatly to relieve my symptoms.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:46 a.m. CST

    It is all about the Math. It always is..

    by MacFaux

    timelines and junction points..the writers have been reading about higher dimensional polytopes..and every 108 minutes it collapses in on itself and then expands again in a never ending loop..Fascinating. I wonder when the character named 'Hinton' or 'Schlafli' will show up...or Mrs. Whatsit..wait she already has...Ms. Hawking. What a fascinating show.<br><br> "there is such a thing as a tesseract."

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:46 a.m. CST

    not neccessarily just 31 minutes behind

    by Guy Who Got A Headache And Accidentally Saves The World

    I think it's more a 1 minute island time equals half hour in the real world thing, than just a always 30 minutes behind thing. Or it could be that if they had shot the missle thing from a different location it might have come 2 hours late or something, a fluxuating thing maybe. I don't know. I don't think Ben was in the coffin though, they went out of the way to show it was a black neighborhood, the newspaper article that they went out of their way to write up knowing full well people would examine every pixel of it that they could said the dead guy was leaving behind a son. Also I'd think Ben would have the resources to have a better funeral and he seems more like a cremation guy to me anyway.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:54 a.m. CST

    I get where Sick Fixx is coming from

    by _Maltheus_

    <p>Yeah, I agree the writers don't really have any focus and the arc is all over the place, but that was an enjoyable episode nonetheless. At this point in season 3, I was pacing back and forth during the episodes, they were so freaking boring. At least these eps are interesting again, even if it does seem like a different show each season.</p> <p>I'm not sure what to make of the time dilation thing. How is it that radio signals aren't affected? They are either shifted in time or not. And is it a scaling time shift? Could the boats proximity to the island affect the length of the shift? This is the biggest new piece to the puzzle since we had confirmation that the black smoke was pretending to be dead people. Granted, it's probably the only new piece to the puzzle, but I'll let that slide for now.</p> <p>Also, I don't think that 'Dean Moriarty' means anything other than the writers like to screw with the fans. Or maybe Ben is a speed freak into boosting cars and sleeping with underage girls? Who knows?</p>

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:04 a.m. CST

    Farraday's rocket: time

    by Shigeru

    someone want to figure out what the exact proportion was (1 minute = 30 minutes?) and calculate how long 95 days (the amount of time the losties have been on the island) out?? please?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:06 a.m. CST

    Not trying to spoil

    by Jor-El23

    which is why I didn't post any spoilers. well i did say that Rose and Bernard aren't part of the 6 so i guess that's a spoiler by default. apologies. I guess I just have a different view of a spoiler. I don't care who's part of the 6, i just care how they got off, why they're lying, who's in the coffin etc...I guess if someone told me who's in the coffin I'd consider that a spoiler but again that's just my definition.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:11 a.m. CST

    Kristen Bell said

    by Toby___Wong

    in an interview that she would rather star in something she enjoys than something that is popular. Seems to me Heroes seemed more fun to her than Lost. Who can blame her ?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:12 a.m. CST

    the warped time theory...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...with the exception of the 'Walt growing up too fast' thing, I don't think evidence really supports time progressing differently outside the island.<BR> <BR> 1) ben was able to do a live video feed with Richard when showing Juliet her sister in the part with her child<BR> <BR> 2) Daniel was able to talk in real-time with Regina on the boat when she launched the 'payload'.<BR> <BR> 3) The Others apparently used the sub to travel back and forth rather easily between the island and the real world.<BR> <BR> Its more likely that there is some kind of barrier with causes a time delay (which perhaps the submarine can travel under) which also acts as some kind of protective shield which keeps the island invisible to outsiders, and wreaks havoc with anything that runs into it (such as helicopters and Oceanic airlines).

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:14 a.m. CST

    Lost vs Prison Break?

    by Mr. Profit

    Are you kidding? Prison Break doesnt compare. Prison Break was good for the 1st set of episodes that aired in the fall. When it came back from the break, it sucked. And it still does. Wentworth Miller acts the same way he acted when he was a gay highschool sociopath on Popular. I can't take him seriously. As for Lost, great episode. Hopefully this level of quality can last all season.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:15 a.m. CST

    by atrapatodo

    Surprised to mention that Dean Moriarty is the Neal Cassady character from On the Road... hmmm. Great freaking episode.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:16 a.m. CST

    I have a strong suspicion

    by Shigeru

    that Daniel Farraday was introduced in order to explain all this time/physics shit to us

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:18 a.m. CST

    Childbirths

    by FakeTHulce

    Maybe the crazy time difference is what causes women who concive on the island to have childbirths.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:20 a.m. CST

    And I was referencing season 1.

    by Mr. Profit

    Again I love Lost season 4 so far. It will suck with the mini break in April.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:29 a.m. CST

    Has Anyone Suggested This About the Man in the Coffin?

    by DKT

    Possible Spoiler -- Sayid is the one who put the man in the coffin.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:30 a.m. CST

    Toby__Wong, you read you your Comic Foundry #1

    by Pennsy

    Well done, sir. :) Note that this interview was before she was approached by Heroes, I'm guessing, since there is zero mention of it in the piece. <p> "I'm trying to find the next best project, not just a good career move, but something that will make me happy. Something that I'll enjoy the people I’m working with. As lucky that I've been in my career, I'm still a human being. I'd rather take a shitty movie job that I had a lot of fun on, than work on the best movie of the year and be miserable. That's one thing I've learned from working so hard. You gotta stay happy." <p> That's not a bad attitude to have sometimes.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:43 a.m. CST

    I know Moriarty was in On the Road...

    by _Maltheus_

    ...but I was disappointed to see that his character was going by the name of Cody Pomeray in Kerouac's "The Dharma Bums." It might have been more funny if they chose a character from that book instead.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:47 a.m. CST

    Maxwell

    by Jor-El23

    Based on what we saw in Daniel's experiment yesterday it doesn't seem like transmissions to the island are affected by the time disruption. Regina on the boat was talking to Daniel as the payload supposedly landed. But it didn't get there until a half hour later. maybe you can apply the same idea to the video juliet was watching of Richard Alpert at the playground or the new coverage of the crash

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:50 a.m. CST

    Node32774

    by mthrndr

    Could it be that Miles is really looking for Jacob? What else would be the purpose of a clairvoyent guy who can talk to spirits??

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:50 a.m. CST

    Moriarty

    by Shigeru

    also wrote mortal kombat 3

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:50 a.m. CST

    Node32774

    by mthrndr

    Could it be that Miles is really looking for Jacob? What else would be the purpose of a clairvoyent guy who can talk to spirits?? And he needs Ben to bring him to Jacob. That would sync up with Lindelhof's hints.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:53 a.m. CST

    I thought Frank

    by Shigeru

    was gonna say something about the US being at war with Iraq

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:03 p.m. CST

    Time Zones

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    I haven't worked this out quiet right yet but imagine the area around the island having time zones similar to those around the world. The "payload" came through a different time zone area and that is why it was late (was anyone expecting it to show up on time?). As long as you comunicate through the right area or zone you can talk in real time. You may also enter the island through this channel/area and arrive in real time. Maybe Walt entered through a different channel and appeared older. The radio song Sayid and Hurley heard may have come through another channel. Maybe it is so hard to get back to the island because you have to find the right channel to avoid the time difference. Just a thought.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:15 p.m. CST

    Man in the Coffin

    by Sanotaro

    Lance Reddick

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:25 p.m. CST

    The man who takes his pulse after Prison Break ...

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    ... is a dangerous man indeed.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:28 p.m. CST

    You have yer hotties confused, I think, node32774

    by Pennsy

    ;) HaLo are still going strong.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:33 p.m. CST

    Yeah let's talk about Prison Break

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    after one of the best episodes of Lost I've seen. Makes sense. I used to like Prison Brake. I enjoyed the utter suspension of disbelief it required, it was good stupid fun. I can't believe anyone thinks that show is some kind of clockwork-like machine. It is one of the most illogical bullshitty ever. God bless it, but come on - a perfectly designed puzzle it is not. I was thrilled when they found the hellish second prison at the end of season 2. It seemed the show would go to new heights of ridiculousness - which it did, but eventually I just got bored. The actors suck, that may have something to do with it.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:39 p.m. CST

    walt's "aging"

    by Bouncy X

    i still dont get why they're trying to connect that into the story or whatever. many kids have huge growth spurts in a very short period of time, personally i shot a foot within one year and about 4-5 inches of those within one summer and this was back when i was 11ish. so i dont see why they cant just ignore it and hope not everyone is a moron and realizes some kids shoot fast. if i can grow 4-5inches within 2 or 3 months why cant he?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:50 p.m. CST

    The reason Michael and Walt left had nothing to do with Ben

    by smackfu

    The actor who played Michael was dissatisfied with his role on the show and the kid who played Walt was growing up too fast and they didn't know how to deal with it, so the combined factors lead to a plot device to exit michael and walt from the show. THe moment you start attributing things caused by events that occured in real life to the characters on the show, you start to lose your grip on reality.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 12:59 p.m. CST

    Node, MP, pa, BigE, etc

    by rbrog77

    I think this was a holy shit episode. I know my mouth gaped open at least twice. There's so much to say and analyze, but work work work. <P> Hopefully tomorrow.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:01 p.m. CST

    The island isn't lost in time - its moving

    by ArcadianDS

    Communications are real-time. Aging is real-time. But the rocket still took 30 minutes longer to arrive.<p> Maybe the island is actually moving and its now 30 minutes further from the boat at the time it was launched?<p> I think they're on the back of a giant tortoise.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:07 p.m. CST

    michael & walt

    by maxwell's hammer

    While the exit of Michael can be attributed to the actor wanting to leave, they've pretty much stated from the beginning that they would factor Walt's growth spurt into the plot. They've said that since season 2.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:11 p.m. CST

    Read Entertainment Weekly's recap

    by skimn

    of Lost to delve deeper into the detail and allegory in each episode..that reviewer does their homework. I do expect Fahey in every scene to say "Damn thats good Bar-B-Q", though.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:12 p.m. CST

    Time calculations

    by thenatureboy

    If 1 minutes of island time = 30 minutes of real world time then by my calculations 100 days on the island would = 8.22 years of real world time. So if Walt has been off the island for roughly 30 island day then that would = 2.47 years of the real world. This would at least explain his growth.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:12 p.m. CST

    This was a short talkback

    by GimpInMyPants

    Compared to past Lost talkbacks this one was short, which is confusing since last night's episode was one of the most enthralling. I guess skipping the bullshit the Lost talkback is before the episode airs things like this tend to happen.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:14 p.m. CST

    Holy fuck Holy fuck Holy fuck

    by Maximus Prime

    just saw it there now...fantastics episode...who said this show doesnt give answers...<p> we find out something is fucked up timewise with the Island and we find out that SAYID IS KILLING FOR BEN...GREAT, THATS ME CONTENT FOR ANOTHER WEEK<P> Sayid seems to be after the people who are after them..aka Abaddon...asking Hurley are they still alive..great, well yes but Satid maybe planning a bullet for ur head dicko so watch out <P> could Ben be a good guy all along like he said he was....he seems to be protecting them, this would add creedance to the theory he is in the coffin cauxe if he is dead no one is left to protect Jack and all,<p> I still think we will get a flash forward death, bit like Pulp fiction, teh character will die mid story but when we last see him he maybe alive and well

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:14 p.m. CST

    Which leads me to add

    by skimn

    how kick ass would it be to have Michael Biehn cast sometime before the series ends...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:17 p.m. CST

    def rb

    by Maximus Prime

    I was just in lost gloryville throughout...and Hurley the decieving bastard...I near forgot about that..what a dam good episode..

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:21 p.m. CST

    I've already explained why I watch the show

    by Sick Fixx

    Because I keep hoping they'll blow me away like they did with moments like 'Jacob', 'We have to go back', 'We found the signal' and 'You don't buy the ring. Give it back'. But those moments are few and far between. I might not watch next week. I think it's insane that I'm being viewed as a pariah in this talkback for having different opinions than the rest of you. I'm not stopping anyone from discussing the merits of this episode. More than one conversation can go on at once in a talkback, you know. And the people still calling me 'retarded', 'unintelligent' have a learning problem. I already outlined why I am not a stupid person because I have a strong comprehension of the things I read and watch. So, if we're going to argue, at least abandon those straw arguments. I might not even watch next week, to answer most people's questions as to why I do. I mean, I can only take so much jerking around before I'm done for the season. I might check back in to the show with the season finale. Another reason I watch is because Kate gets into bondage scenes so often on the show, and that's a plus for my tastes. Seriously, handcuffs, shackles, gags. She's done it all and she's very prolific when it comes to producing a good DID scene. She'll probably be tied up at least two more times this season.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:36 p.m. CST

    new theroy of mine on the time phenomena

    by logicalnoise01

    So after a bit of research I found the little detail that desmond had a printout on the day he forgot to press the button that had the same day as 815's crash. meaning when the plane crashed time was still in sync between the island and the outside world. Well this time distortion now points to the button actually controlling something. What if the hatch imploding really did mean catastrophic consequences not just on the island but off it?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:40 p.m. CST

    Sanotaro

    by DKT

    That's what I'm thinking, and I'm thinking Sayid is the one who put him there. It makes perfect sense to me -- and who wants to go to his funeral?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:46 p.m. CST

    What if the island moves around like Jacob's

    by skywalkerfamily

    cabin? Maybe it moves around on Earth, and that's why the probe couldn't find it?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:49 p.m. CST

    yeah guys!!

    by maxwell's hammer

    Sick Fixx likes Japanese Surrealism, so leave him alone!<BR> <BR> Or he'll get all...surrealistic...on you!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:57 p.m. CST

    Sick Fixx & Sick Fixx Haters

    by maxwell's hammer

    The point of Talk Back is to argue, and if everyone agrees, then how much fun can the arguing possible be? So for this reason, I welcom Sick Fixx.<BR> <BR> To Sick Fixx: the reasons you give for not liking the show include a plot that goes no where and one-dimensional characters. These are absurd reasons for not liking the show, as the plot is quite intricately complicated (in a way that suggests a cohesive larger picture) and the characters have layers upon layers upon layers that keep getting revealed to us in subsequent flash backs and flash forwards.<BR> <BR> And I'll say it again, sticking up so vehemently for Prison Break is killing your credibility. The few times I've watched that show, it floors me with its corniness and kewl factor. Saying it is better than LOST is like saying football is a better sport than chess because nothing happens in chess. Its just that the pace is much slower and more deliberate, with strategy depending on setting things up in a specific way so as to bring about an airtight finishing move. Every maneuver is well thought out and quite deliberate, but you may not realize what the strategy is until you actually see the endgame. This is LOST.<BR> <BR> As opposed to 'Prison Break', where they blow the whistle and everyone hits each other. Both are engaging in their own way, but my preference is the slow methodical approach of LOST, which yours is the high octane brainlessness of Prison Break.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:57 p.m. CST

    Hey listen, fuckers

    by Sick Fixx

    You are all blowing that shit way out of proportion. I said all that in SELF DEFENSE because someone accused me of having a short attention span. You all took my 'reading list' as an insult probably due to your own insecurities. I mentioned everything I read in response to someone who accused me of being an ADHD case, not to insult anyone as you all have done to me. Geez, you fuckers are pushy and vindictive. You'd make excellent housewives.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 1:59 p.m. CST

    So I'm pretentious for reading highbrow literature

    by Sick Fixx

    but stupid for watching Prison Break. Make up your fucking minds.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2 p.m. CST

    edit feature

    by maxwell's hammer

    Seriously, I know some of you think we're idiots when we suggest this, but we really need an edit feature in the Talk Backs. that last entry of mine reads like a teenager on x wrote it. Oh how I long to modify it!!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2 p.m. CST

    Okay, I'll watch

    by Sick Fixx

    With the hopes that she is hobbled with leg irons heading into the court room. But after that, I'm tuning out until the last two episodes of the season.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2 p.m. CST

    100 days = 8 years

    by rbrog77

    Approximately...if it's true. In that case, for every year you are on the island about 28 years pass by for the outside world. A baby born on the island with a life expectancy of 80 would see well over 2000 years of world history.<P> So if the hostiles were originally born on the island and reached 80 around now they would possibly know the exact history of Jesus, Mohammed, the founding fathers, etc.<P> As furvent as some people are regarding just these 3 topics, I think I'd want to keep it hidden too.<P> Either that or expose the hell out of it.<P> Or would I want to keep it a secret so I could see the next 2000 years?<P> hmmmmmmmm...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:01 p.m. CST

    pretentious idiots.

    by maxwell's hammer

    Hey, i know a lot of pretentious stupid people.<BR> <BR> Not that you're one of them.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:02 p.m. CST

    Figght Fight Fight !!!!!

    by picardsucks

    You girls better change the pons !!!! Another great episode!!!! begining to think that Jeff Fahey is indeed Louis Sypher or Beardy McBeard and Sayid as James Tali-Bond (just kidding) was very cool. How can they possible wrap this thing up????

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:08 p.m. CST

    WHAT!?

    by Sick Fixx

    Where did I suggest that!? What the fuck are you talking about? Check your reading comprehension because I didn't say that.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:10 p.m. CST

    You people need to chill the fuck out

    by Sick Fixx

    I'm going to watch Morel Orel on dvd and forget you people even exist. :D

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:21 p.m. CST

    100 posts in not even about the show anymore

    by skywalkerfamily

    Way to argue with yourselves Jr. Highers. Go back to your shitty Myspace pages and post pics of you drinking.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:27 p.m. CST

    Ouch that's harsh. Forget to take your meds

    by skywalkerfamily

    this morning?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:28 p.m. CST

    time dilation

    by maxwell's hammer

    You guys keep forgetting, 6 people actually go back to the real world and become celebrities. Nothing in any of the flash-forwards indicate that they've been gone from reality for 8 years. Island time and real-world time seem to be the same, with some kind of anomoly being needed to explain the funky delay for the 'payload' and the crashing of everything that tries to approach the island by air.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:30 p.m. CST

    If not pressing the button = bad bad things

    by ArcadianDS

    then how did the island not = bad bad things prior to the invention of the computer.<p> or buttons?<p>

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:31 p.m. CST

    No Stormare on Lost

    by Sick Fixx

    But he was on Prison Break for a season and two episodes.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:32 p.m. CST

    The day Kate wears a ballgag

    by Sick Fixx

    I will take back everything bad I've EVER said about the show and even buy stock in it, if that's possible.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:34 p.m. CST

    arcadian

    by logicalnoise01

    it's possible the the original island inhabitants had another way of dealing with the magnetic/time distortion. The button was purposefully left as a manual device. yes it could have been part of a dharma experiment but if dharma knew it was for real they'd never purposefully risk losing control over the distortion.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:35 p.m. CST

    Node

    by rbrog77

    Here and reading, but dealing with UK issues at work. I can't wait to post my thoughts, but as much as there was last night I'm imagining the DVR will be on pause quite a bit during rewatch.<P> Was a fucking great episode though, huh?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:35 p.m. CST

    Back to watching Morel Orel now

    by Sick Fixx

    Continue to handjob Carlton and Damon, sheeple. Man, I miss the Super Tuesday talkback. THAT was awesome.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:40 p.m. CST

    so guys...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...I'm with Sick Fixx. I'm going to take a break from the TalkBacks to watch Godfrey Reggio's intellectual trilogy (Koyaanisqatsi, Powaqqatsi, and Naqoyquatsi) then I'm going to parse some Latin nouns and read Ulysses (unabridged!). Catch all you illitete doucebags later!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:53 p.m. CST

    lulz at 'zomg its a missle!!'

    by ArcadianDS

    it was a glorified model rocket made out of balsa wood and cardboard tubes. get a solid grip on yourselves.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 2:55 p.m. CST

    LOL, Very true Xiphos

    by Spiny Norman

    His character has been quite unstable since we met him. One tiny little detail he did not think of there.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:08 p.m. CST

    answers to my questions = more questions

    by ArcadianDS

    Okay so if this island was so horribad dangerous, to the point that you had to use a computer to regularly 'resync' to actual time (which I assume is what was being done), then why keep that a secret from the person(s) pressing the button and risk one or more of them revolting ala John Locke and preventing the button pushing from ever happening. If you just said, "look if you dont push this button, the planet will spin itself into the sun." then I bet you'd probably not have to worry about any John Locke epiphanies about button revolutions.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:09 p.m. CST

    Those kinds of questions will never be answered

    by Sick Fixx

    Because of the restrictive dialogue present in the show. No one ever elaborates on things at length because of the five minute rule in Hollywood.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:12 p.m. CST

    The "temporal anomaly" isn't consistent....

    by Playkins

    Obviously, the temporal anomally isn't consistent on the island. The Statue, the Black Rock, Adam & Eve, The seeming "agelessness" of the Others, the dilapidation of some of the Dharma stations and not others...<p> That's why Jeff Fahey was told to follow a certain course back to the ship. Go a different route one way or the other, and it'd put you into the past or future.<p> This could also explain Ben being off the island and also knowing all about what's going to happen.<p> The button Desmond was pushing was holding the island in one place. That's why the crash happened when it discharged the first time: for that instant the plane was in the same place as the island.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:13 p.m. CST

    I like Daniel

    by Maximus Prime

    He is quietly analising ever little thing about teh island and setting up wee experiments when at the same time shitting himself about the fact Miles seems to be a nutter and jack et al have guns...im also loving Frank, he's had nothing to do so far but he seems to be just a nice guy..there is no more nice guys on this show..everyone has a bad point or two..<p>cant wait to get too Fisher Stevens as well...JOhnny 5 is still alive

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:18 p.m. CST

    arcadianDS

    by Shigeru

    bad things wouldn't happen because DHARMA building the Swan/Button created the possibility for bad things to happen. The electromagnetic energy was always there, but the Swan dammed and harnessed it. So it built up behind said Dam.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:21 p.m. CST

    Not alot of time, but I'll say this:

    by Novaman5000

    Fucking awesome. What a great ep, amazing ending. This show is a fucking powerhouse, 4 seasons later.<p> Ben is not the man in the coffin. I think it might be michael.<p> Speaking of Michael, the Mike-centric ep is ep 8, but the creators felt that ep 7 would be a bigger shock/better breaking off point. I'm thinking that's because michael will be revealed in the final moments of ep 7. Just spec on my part, though.<p> Also, I think the island has only been out of sync with world time since the sky went violet. I don't have anything to back that up with, though, so it's possible it's always been like that, BUT!! If desmond's been on the island for 3 years, wouldn't that make everyone off the island significantly older, as many years would have passed? I think this time change is a new phenomenon. As possibly evidence by Tom, when he mentioned why they couldn't leave the island, "because ever since the sky turned purple..."<p> I love the new mysteries of the season, and this new "list" might be the best one yet. It seems that the two organizations are trying to kill each other off, and that's crazy. It amazes me how far this story has come, from the first days of season one. The show changes gears with each passing season, but still manages to be as good as what's come before, and still feel like LOST. I'm so satisfied with this ep. Bring on Eggtown!

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:27 p.m. CST

    I'm laughing my ass off ...

    by Luscious.868

    I'm laughing my ass off at all of the tools who bitch about the show but obviously tune in every week. How pathetic do you have to be to watch a show you "claim" to dislike then bitch about it on a message board? If you really don't like the show, stop fucking watching it. It's not fucking rocket science.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:34 p.m. CST

    Episode thoughts

    by Maximus Prime

    Sayid for Bond.his badassness is great...<p> also he is not a bad golfer, did he play with Hurley and all<p> I love his cockyness and arogance when he was about to kill that man..great,,<p> Sayid gets outfoxed by Locke and Hurley...didnt see that coming..<p> Bens secret room, he was just about to open the porno cupboard when Kate called<p> Love Sayid bringing Miles along just to trade him...<p> Miles's mouth and over anxoiusness seems to get him in shit<p> so there is a time anomoly....mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm<p> no jacobs hut...so much for the dust keeping jacob confined, his house is popping up everywhere..<p> Sayid was getting some good loving for a while...any woman Sayid is shaggin seems to die or get sentenced to death...<p> didnt see her shooting him coming...wonder who the economist is..a man in charge of money maybe hiring hitmen or something to wipe out the survivors of the Island, well find out inside the next 40 or so episodes...<p> Sayid and Ben...slap my face 3 times with a stinking wet fish...blew my fucking mind off, great..<p> also seeing Desmond on teh plane was such a smiling scene for me, Des ahs been there for longer than anyone without getting out taht we know of, well him and Juliett..just to see him on teh copter was great...<p> a fantastic episode, I really loved it<p>

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:34 p.m. CST

    zoe Bell

    by StuckinthePresentPaused

    Does anyone know if the voice of the girl that they call on the satellite phone sounds like zoe bell or not because then we could possibly know her character since she is on the ship

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:36 p.m. CST

    interesting internet theory

    by ArcadianDS

    found this theory earlier today: as Dharma monitored experiemented with and controlled the time anomoly on the island, they learned how to pinpoint and control it - so that all the food drops were actually launched at once, during their stay, and were done in such a pattern that they would arrive to various parts of the island over a long period of time.<p> no real evidence of this in the show so far, but I thought it was a great theory.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:38 p.m. CST

    Dammit Gang...I wanna post my thoughts...

    by Cheif Brody

    On last night's episode...Fuckin MIND blowing shit! But I'm too bust at work today. I'll try and get back later tonight. <P> Man...glad I missed that Sick Fixx nonsense. What a huge waste of bandwidth...Happy I could just skip through all that bullshit today. That would have driven me to a nosebleed reading all that.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:40 p.m. CST

    Zoe Bell & Fisher Stevens

    by maxwell's hammer

    the only times these two have been credited are when we've talked to people over the walkie talkie. I don't think there is any doubt at this point that Fisher Stevens is playing Minkowski and Zoe Bell is Regina.<BR> <BR> Okay, back to my German Expresionist film retrospective and high tea with Sick Fixx.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:40 p.m. CST

    did they change the logo *again*?

    by ArcadianDS

    I know they already changed it so that we see a reflection of a city in the water, but I noticed for the past 2 episodes that the big mountain in the middle now looks like a large man-made structure - like the ruins of the temple of Agamemnon or something like that - the right side of the mountain clearly has sharp 90 degree angles in it that look like a large building or the ruins of a large building. was this always there?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:47 p.m. CST

    StuckInthePresentPaused

    by ChrisVenom

    Lostpedia said that that was her.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 3:52 p.m. CST

    the picture of Ben

    by Maximus Prime

    could be him in an airport much like Locke's sweat tent vision.....<p> gotta love the creepy bug eyed bastard

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:06 p.m. CST

    The episode with Sayid was just like the Kate

    by skywalkerfamily

    episode last year, but Kate just drugged her husband. Snooze.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:09 p.m. CST

    great

    by zooch

    Am I going to have to understand quantum mechanics to know what the island really is?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:13 p.m. CST

    jeremy davies

    by redfishbluefish

    i love his character, Daniel. i've been waiting for him to pop up in a great role ever since his hilarious turn in SECRETARY.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:21 p.m. CST

    WOW...

    by BLIND ALBINO PENGUINS

    Sayid and Ben. I didn't see that coming...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:22 p.m. CST

    Creepy bug eyed bastard

    by skimn

    Almost forgot Sawyer calling Ben "Gizmo"...nice Gremlins reference..

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:26 p.m. CST

    31 minutes

    by smutpeddlar

    the island is not 31 minutes behind the frieghter..."the payload" took 31 minutes longer to travel a trip that should have only lasted a few seconds > 100 days of island time = ? off island time? ok for shits and giggles there are 1440 minutes in a day, lets round off the lag to 1 minute =31 minutes 1440 x 31 = 44640 lagged minutes devided by the 1440 minutes in a off island day = 31 every day on the island is 31 off island days.. jack thinks they have been there 100 days x 31 = 3100/365=8.5 years(roughly)

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:31 p.m. CST

    Just like the kate episode?

    by Novaman5000

    I don't remember kate being revealed as working with the villain of the show in the future at the end of that ep... Nor do I remember kate and her husband both working for shadowy organizations trying to kill eachother. Wow maybe I should go back and rewatch that...

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:41 p.m. CST

    When they get back to the freighter

    by skywalkerfamily

    everyone will be 100 years old.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 4:43 p.m. CST

    I feel like a moron...

    by RevengeOfJobu

    I just realized Sawyer called Ben "Yoda" because of his looks and not his knowledge... I now like that line.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:29 p.m. CST

    Am I the only one who thinks they have seriously sabotaged the s

    by DarthCorleone

    The assured survival of Jack and Kate was one thing, but between the "Six," Ben's just-revealed evil shadow supervillain omnipresent powers, the fact that we know there are people still left alive on the island during the flash-forwards, and the fact that we all know Locke is never leaving that island dead or alive, we're running out of people to kill off.<br><br>I'm not saying we absolutely need to kill people off; perhaps they can compensate for the decreased suspense with increased plot and character development. But it seems to me the show was originally built on the strength of mortality and danger, and the opportunities for that are rapidly dwindling. What would be the point of seeing the vaunted Smoke Monster chase around anyone at this point? You know it's not going to kill anyone. (The possible exception would be in season six, which I theorize could occur after the flash-forwards and center around a return to the island. Perhaps then we'll have the bloodbath.)

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:30 p.m. CST

    sabotaged the suspense, that is.

    by DarthCorleone

    Yeah.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:36 p.m. CST

    And one thing about the time displacement...

    by DarthCorleone

    ...If they are now years out of whack, then it was awfully convenient that Jack and the pilot's conversation about the Red Sox did not go into more detail.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:49 p.m. CST

    Darth

    by Jor-El23

    I think the suspense is still there. We don't know how much longer The Oceanic remain on the island. We don't know how long it takes them to get back to the island. I know that the flash forwards we're seeing are not the end of the story. I sort of thought they might be at the end of season 3 in that very last scene with Jack. But now that we've seen Hurley's flash-forward with Abbadon and Sayid and Ben hunting down and killing people, there's more story to be told. I also don't think the sub has been destroyed. I think the suspense of survival is still very much alive (no pun intended).

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 5:53 p.m. CST

    Maybe Michael shoots Sayid

    by skywalkerfamily

    Michael is probably on the boat, so when Sayid gets there, he finds out about Ben and Sayid's meeting.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:28 p.m. CST

    Jor-El23...suspense...

    by DarthCorleone

    Yes, of course there is still suspense with respect to how the story will play out. I'm not debating that. I'm talking about the very specific suspense related to mortal danger on the island. Until we catch up to the flash-forwards, that particular brand of suspense has mostly disappeared, and I think I miss it. <br><br>Regardless, I might end up liking the show even better with this twist on the narrative. It's just a stark difference from the days of the first three seasons. Those moments when it seemed that the Smoke Monster would eat/crush everyone, the times that the Others threatened our heroes, and - hell - even the upcoming times in which the folks from the freighter inevitably will threaten our heroes...there just won't be much doubt or freedom to the threats.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:32 p.m. CST

    smutpeddler: 1 day= 31 days??? lmao

    by Executor

    So, Desmond has been on the island for a few years...does that mean he's been gone 60 years???? So when he was in Jack's flashback...he was 19 and jack was 79?? Your theory makes no sense. When the Oceanic 6 get back to the real world, it'll be around 10 years since the crash...and no one will notice they're not older? lmao. <p>The island is just 31 minutes behind the "rest of the world".<p>...on THAT trajectory at least.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:39 p.m. CST

    I thought the most important plot point...

    by I Hope You Die

    ...was Miles' throw away line at the beginning that indicated they had no personal interest in Ben. They've simply been sent there to get him by someone else. My theory is still that they're all (except Naomi) people who would have been on the plane but weren't for whatever reason and that's why they were chosen for the mission.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:45 p.m. CST

    Darth

    by Jor-El23

    I see what you're saying. The show has definitely changed. In season 1 it's like we were completely blind and clueless. we had no idea what was happening, only that something was happening. i guess it's just inevitable in the course of the show that the brand of suspense will change. when i first started watching this show, from the first episode, i loved the entire universe that was unfolding and was completely engrossed in theories and literary references and all that. and that continued on into season 2 and still now. but all along I could have never imagined that this would happen...Dharma, Hanso, the Hatch, Desmond, all the deaths, the Tailies, Walt and Michael, the Incident, the map, the purge, the others, the natives, flash forwards...i could go on and on. not really directing this at you, just rambling. it's a great f'ing show and although the tone and mood seem to be changing, the danger and suspense taking us to new places on and off the island, it's still totally on and it always has been. marathon, not sprint.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 6:57 p.m. CST

    Series Finale

    by pre-sequitur

    The series will end with everyone who gets off the island (not just the "oceanic 6") coming back and reuniting with those left behind. This, of course, is after everyone finds out what the island is and all that it entails, ie. jacob, smoke monster, magnetic fields, blah blah blah. They all get back and start to live a happy existence together because they all realize the island is where they belong. Just as this happens another plane crashes (or something like that) requiring the survivors to protect the island and its secrets and in turn become the "New Others".

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 9:17 p.m. CST

    The Economimist...he said laughing...thoughts

    by rbrog77

    So, it’s Friday night, I’ve been to the executive’s bored meeting at the ale house, and now it’s approaching 8 PM EST and I’m watching it again. Forgive the typos. I’m drunk.<P> It’s curious they keep playing the same “previously on LOST” sequences. <P> At the beginning it’s curious Sayid’s pose. Of all the things going on he’s focused on Naomi’s dead body, How that plays in at the end is somehow related, but I’m not sure how. And even though we find out later that Miles is not there necessarily for Ben, he sure is intent on it at the beginning...as he closes her eyes<P> "N, I’ll always be with you. RG". And she doesn’t have a sister. hmmm<P> There was something I noticed in the last episode. Jack said in response to Dan asking if they would help him find the freighters said Absolutely...which is the exact word the pilot said when Sayid asked if he get Charlotte back. Of course Sayid’s words were a con while Jack’s words were...hmmmm...never mind.<P> Before I had an accident/incident I used to play golf about 3-4 times a week. Most carts were electric, some were gas. The sound the cart made as it drove up to Sayid was neither. <P> Sayid is very calm/relaxed/nonchalant speaking about privacy on that golf course. I never realized he was left handed. The comment about doing nothing...815...6...really made the guy sweat. And now we see why. <P> BANG...you’re dead...and Sayid walks away. <P> Perfect...but why? <P> We’re 8 minutes into the episode, and people say nothing happens. *sigh* <P> The door on the bar? Syiad walked into said (I think) Die Mauer, which apparently means The Wall. Keep that in mind. <P> And the ass on the chick walking out that door...YEAH!! <P> Told you I was drunk. <P> MP – is it true everyone In EU speaks English? <P> The voice on the phone was not Ben. <P> Without any bloodshed is not a mission for Jack in regards to Locke. Classic. <P> Best line at the 10 minute mark was Locke’s “Because we’d have to carry him.” <P> I spent a while looking at the “ash” and it’s not ash. Looks more like gray sea-salt. Grains are too big for ash. <P> Locke. How long can I go on about Locke? Ben says John’s looking for someone to tell him what to do next. Now, Ben, tell me when that’s not the case. <P> One of the best, most misleading things about this episode was the scene where Locke found the ash, was confused, said something about keeping Charlotte hostage, and Hurley said he didn’t sign up for this. What a great way to “use” Hugo against us later on. <P> The Kate/Jack conversation about know what it’s like to be me then the go because Sawyer won’t let them hurt you was better than I could write. You? <P> For some reason at that scene I fixated on Sick Fixx’s Kate/bondage comment. The I went to his Prison Break fixation.<P> <P> As the song Starry starry night goes, “Now I understand”. <P> I absolutely loved the camera work when Jack told Lapidus Sayid was a torturer. Watch him as he walks into the camera and it shoots too black. <P> These guys are great. <P> “Actually”, Miles said, “I do care about Locke. Maybe you can tell me how he managed to split your happy little family apart.” There was a fundamental debate about whether you people were coming to rescue us or kill us. Which side did you land on? I’ll let you knew when I decide. Besides absolutely perfect, maybe a bit of foreshadowing? <P> I didn’t notice this until the rewatch, but the scene where Sayid picks up the beeper he says something about the girl should tell her employer about new technology. She says he’s old fashioned. <P> Didn’t Jacob hate technology too? <P> Curious. <P> Onto the experiment. First thing, why does Dan need to hang up if it MukawskI? Next, when the payload didn’t make it when Regina said it was there she said it was weird. Dan’s reply was it was far more than weird. <P> Curious curious curious!! <P> Then it lands and the rectangular clock he pulls out of the payload says 03:15:22 while the one on the tripod says 02:45:03...about 30 minutes off in actual time. But if you listen to Regina do the countdown it takes seconds to apparently deliver something that did not arrive until hours later. Even then the time annomily was 30 minutes off.<P> <P> So, the question really is, what seems to get there instantaneously, then appears to take over 3 hours but actually takes more than that. <P> So the equation we tried to work out before is a lot more complicated than the 30 minutes to 1 minute scenario. It’s more like looks like 30 seconds, takes over 3 hours (195+ minutes) but shows less than that on the island by about ½ an hour (165 + minutes). So I’m not sure at this point how to formulate that algebraic equation...but I’m pretty sure Sick Fixx can explain it to us....and Dan since he thinks it’s “not good”.<P> <P> ;-> <P> Hard to believe Hurley could con Sayid, but there it is. The “great, they sent us another Sawyer comment was GREAT!! <P> For those saying the Red Sox comment was a time thing (2004 versus 2007), I think you may be on to something. Jack says something about 100 days, then nothing else. That’ll come up again, mark my words. <P> Okay, so I had to pause it. But did anyone notice the big green book on the bookshelf in Ben’s house was “The Holy Quran? <P> BTW – nice hidden closet...for my room 23 and it’s hidden closet friends. <P> Sometimes you’d think I know what I’m talking about. <P> ;-> <P> Break dancing thing you do with your legs. I love Hurley!! <P> I lost a $ you know. I bet John you wouldn’t be stupid enough to fall for your friend as bait. Someone please tell me a more classic Ben line. <P> Honestly, I hated the Sawyer/Kate scene....except the “so let’s play house” lines. Awwwwwwww.... <P> Okay, Sayid made a deal with the pilot that was a con because he agrees with Locke that the rescuers are liars. Then he says the day he starts trusting Ben is the day he would sell his soul. <P> More on that later. I did say there was a lot in this one, right <P> Someone tell me who is the group and what is the song playing while Sayid and strawberry blond Elsa are in bed together. <P> Cons. Sayid cons her to get to her boss only to find out he was conned/set up. Cons. One of these days we have to list all the cons in this show. <P> Point here – bitch had no titties. NONE!! Nice skinny legs though. <P> Did Sayid fuck up? If you read the sub-titles she agrees to take him to the person on the other end of the phone. Then he shoots her. She dies. And he hurts...at least 2 different ways...broken skin due to a bullet and broken heart...due to a bullet. <P> Nice dying scene though...including fixed and dilated. <P> Spec...the Des/Frank/tell me you’ve ever heard of Penny scene will end up being BIG!! <P> I could make more of the Dan/Frank conversation about staying on the same course, but I think that’ll be seen again down the road. <P> Sayid’s expression(s) as he leaves the island.........words won’t do justice. <P> And now, shot, he shows up at the kennel. Watching it again, knowing what we know now, it’s easy to hear the voice as who it is. There was a clue we all missed. That sweater vest or plain vest...I dunno which it was. Who else do we know in the show that wears that? <P> Need I remind you what happened last time you thought with your heart instead of your gun. Anyone else think that’s a reference to the Iraqi chick now being dead? <P> Good. We focused on Ben’s last line. But maybe the line he uttered before that was more revealing. I have another name for you. If it’s Whidmore or Hanso, wouldn’t the names be known? Or did they take aliases? Was the reason the guy on the golf course was so shocked because Sayid called him by his real name? <P> Okay, Sick (if you are reading this), I’ll give you one thing. Although IMO they revealed a lot in this episode, they asked a lot too. Thing is with me, I like that. There are 40+ more episodes for them to tell me things I don’t know. In the meantime, I can rack my feeble little mind to try to figure it our. My Room 23 friends...yes, those of us locked up in the brainwashing room...will not only agree with me but will be there with me. <P> In regards to those questions, I’ll be back tomorrow. <P> See, sometimes anticipation is the sweetest part.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:02 p.m. CST

    Last week's enhanced ed?

    by theBigE

    Anyone catch the "new enhanced" episode? When Dan is watching the TV footage of the sunken plane, we're told that the woman in the house with him is not his wife, but rather his caretaker. What are we supposed to make of that? Why does he need a caretaker?

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:05 p.m. CST

    Lost Time formula

    by theBigE

    Ok - I teach Calculus (not trying to brag, like others who list their reading lists on this site!), so I should be able to figure out the time conversion of Dan's rocket. But there are too many variables to consider. Was the actual time 3:16? Or was that a chronograph that started timing when the rocket was sent? Did the rocket travel for all of that time - that's some initial velocity! <p> I'll try to tackle it tomorrow when I'm rested.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Time Formula...

    by maxwell's hammer

    Stop trying to figure out the funky time dilation thing! Remember:<BR> <BR> * Ben had a real-time uplink to the real world when he showed Juliet her sister and her child...<BR> <BR> * Dan had real-time communication with Regina on the freighter...<BR> <BR> * Jack had real-time communication with Minkowski when he first contacted him with the walkie-talkie...<BR> <BR> Time is the same on and off the island, but there is some funky anomoly that causes a 31 minute delay and fucks with anything that tries to approach the island by air (such as helicopters and jet-liners).

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 10:44 p.m. CST

    Miles gets to use his Ghostbusting on Jacob!

    by skywalkerfamily

    Now that he's on Locke's team.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:30 p.m. CST

    This is what sucks...

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    I've been working late so I don't get to see the new episode until Friday when its online. I miss the initial discussions/reactions.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:33 p.m. CST

    Eh, the inital reactions are still here.

    by skywalkerfamily

    Ranging from WTF to WTF.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:38 p.m. CST

    sick fixx writes for prisonbreak

    by coffeeandpie

    ...that's why he's so resentful of lost's superior writing. sorry buddy, the strike's over. time to get back to writing your shitty show again. don't take it out on damon and carlton, they're just better than you. but you fought really hard...good job buddy.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:41 p.m. CST

    moving on...

    by coffeeandpie

    i appreciate other's ability to ignore sickfixx and other assholes who try to ruin something great. i just can't help but acknowledge it. let's move on to theories and unexplained phenomenon (of the best show ever)....

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:51 p.m. CST

    Are you fucking kidding!?

    by Sick Fixx

    Don't answer that. I'll answer for you. Of course you are. Go back and read the strike talkbacks. I was against the strike bullshit from the beginning.

  • Feb. 15, 2008, 11:58 p.m. CST

    My initial reactions:

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    ...DAMN, Sayid just capped that motherfucker! THAT is how you open a show! He drops that he's one of the Oceanic 6 and the dude gets scared as hell. What is Sayid's game? OMG, he's working for Ben! Sayid tells Ben they know he's coming and Ben goes "good.", that's badass!...*crickets chirp*. See, this is why it sucks missing out on the initial reactions.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, midnight CST

    I think it needs to be pointed out

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Elizabeth Mitchell has nice cans.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:01 a.m. CST

    Ghostbuster guy is gonna die pretty soon.

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    But I think we all know that. He'll at least have a crack at Jacob though.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:04 a.m. CST

    The Coffin

    by SlickyVonBoner

    its Sawyer. He's a conman and has no friends, all enemies. Michael I'm sure had some friends back in the real world. Kate didn't go to the funeral because of him going with Locke and other shit we have yet to see. Why he left the island though, I don't know. Will be a cool flash-forward to see how he dies.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:06 a.m. CST

    And I agree with the person who said

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    It's good to see Ben back on his game. The constant beating of that poor soul got pretty old. I was all for it at the beginning when he was still Henry Gale, but now it's just getting sadistic. Either kill him or restrain him better.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:38 a.m. CST

    kate would definatly be at the funeral if it was Sawyer

    by skywalkerfamily

    I still think the person inside the coffin is someone we don't know.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:46 a.m. CST

    a WAR is coming we will both be powerless to stop!

    by Maniaq

    Herc you forgot to mention the truly GREAT lines of this episode! <p> "if Minkowski gets on there you hang up right away!" <p> "oh awesome - the ship sent us another Sawyer" <p> "yeah I saw you snap that guy's neck with that breakdancing thing you do with your legs... think I'll hang back here..." <p> "forgive me but the day I start trusting him is the day I would have sold my soul" <p> "you just kill people because they're on a list??" <p> <p> that last one was truly poignant... <p> anyhow, just got time for some quick stand up philosophy... WHO IS R.G.?? Is that the Economist? I kinda got the impression the Economist was someone like Hanso who used the island's "time dilation" properties - back in the 80's - to look into the future and make a fortune - no doubt Ben has done the same and that's how he can afford to send a fake 815 to the bottom of an ocean - nowhere near the island... <p> So I guess the time-dilation people were right - surely this has only started "since the sky turned purple" ?? <p> whoever said they altered Ben's voice - get your ears checked! I remember watching and of course they wouldn't show the guy's face but as soon as I heard the voice I thought OMG IS THAT BEN!? <p> So the shack DOES move around but you gotta know how to use the bug powder dust to pin it down...? <p> Oh - I have a question! If you haven't already figured it out, I'm not American. Seems the RedSox won the World Series (Superbowl?) more than once recently - was it against NEW YORK both times? Frank mentioned he was a Yankees fan, I believe - and I think from memory the footage they showed Jack featured Yankees - could BOTH wins have been against the same team? <p> PEACE

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:56 a.m. CST

    The woman Sayid shot wore a bracelet

    by skywalkerfamily

    similar to Naomi if you look close enough. That's why I think Sayid took out Naomi's bracelet. Did the woman ever say her name?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:07 a.m. CST

    The Coffin is a Conundrum

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    At first I thought Rose, then Sawyer, and on down the line. I've come to the conclusion it's either Michael or a haven't-seen. Of course, the drama increases so much more if it's someone we know. Ooooh that coffin. It's a nice little device to sustain the tension and I'm out of ideas.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:14 a.m. CST

    31 minute... DELAY???

    by Maniaq

    OK rb I read your (marathon) post and I thought - hang on, the clock in the rocket has been ticking LONGER than the one on the tripod? That can't be right... so I take another look and it's true! <p> So.. how does that work? The numbers must be the TIME - as in a quarter to three and a quarter PAST three in the afternoon! <p> It's the only way it can makes sense - the trip was supposed to be reasonably quick - back at some time before 2:45pm but instead takes some undivulged amount of time that turns out to be 31 minutes less than the subjective time on the rocket... <p> It's been a while since I heard Einstein's famous thought experiment on Relativity but isn't that BACKWARDS?? It would have made a lot more sense if the rocket's clock was running SLOWER than the other one - if it said 3:16 and the other one said 2:45... <p> As for the real-time conversations via radio - I believe radio waves travel at the speed of light, which Einstein reminds us is the only constant in the universe... <p> Wow Einstein this Einstein that! You'd think I was a scientist or something - oh wait...

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:16 a.m. CST

    damn lack of an EDIT button!

    by Maniaq

    I meant the rocket clock said 2:45 and the tripod said 3:16...

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:38 a.m. CST

    Meh

    by blondeman

    Most reviewers got screeners for the first 4 eps, I wonder why Herc wasn't able to get ahold of them. His inviso-text spoilers suck.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:38 a.m. CST

    We still don't know how far away the freighter

    by skywalkerfamily

    is. Is it miles or close to shore? Why can't we see it on the horizon?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:21 a.m. CST

    Great Episode

    by blondeman

    Wow, this season is awesome so far...really loving the flash forwards. Anyone wanna bet that the R.H. on the bracelet is a descendent of Alvar Hanso?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:22 a.m. CST

    Good(e)?

    by MisterE

    At the end, did Ben say "good" or "Goode"?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:34 a.m. CST

    I was offended

    by Napoleon Park

    As the moderator of a BDSM group I was offended by the person who accused Flaming Troll of enjoying the S&M aspects of "Lost" as if there was something wrong with that. I defended last years opening salvo six part Lost mini-season on the basis that it appealed to the small but relevant BDSM demographic. Kate and Sawyer kept captive in cages, having their captors voyeuristicly spy at their mating, forcing Jack to watch. That's some sick, twisted shit there, kiddies. What's not to like? You think there's something wrong with appealing the sado-masochist market? There'd be no Emma Peel without us.<p>Play safe.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:40 a.m. CST

    whiskey is the worst drunk

    by BobPalpatine

    fuck, what happened guys, someone explain it to me, holy shit, i guessed it was ben in charge, but when it was ben i was like wtf it's fucking ben, wtf, holy shit. do youguys think the writers ebven know what they're doing or jus tmaking shit up as they go, i'll be damnewd if i do but daaammnn son, sayid wokring for ben when i saw ben shoot that guy at the first i said dammnnn son is this a flashforward or a flashback holy shit. these wirters are just making shit up as they go, tstrike got nothing o nthem huh? ahhh fuck.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:47 a.m. CST

    Maniaq

    by ChrisVenom

    I wasnt thinking about the hatch implosion until you brought it up just now. That could explain the time delay. And it already sent Desmond back in time. The final discharge from the hatch could still be lingering over the whole island. Or what if the hatch itself was some type of time machine?... sorry if im not making sense, my good buddy jack Daniels is speaking through me.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:48 a.m. CST

    when you're drunk, so is everyone else

    by BobPalpatine

    just reading these posts i can tell you all had a good dose of Glenfiddich, what's everyone drinking tonight?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:49 a.m. CST

    chrisvenom, jack daniels, FTW!

    by BobPalpatine

    I just had 2 manhattans made per jack's request, how do you take yours?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:50 a.m. CST

    gotik, what are you on?

    by BobPalpatine

    you said somethign about drunk, id din't follow the rest

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:51 a.m. CST

    gotik, what are you on?

    by BobPalpatine

    you said somethign about drunk, id din't follow the rest

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:53 a.m. CST

    ok ok ok i guess i misunderstood

    by BobPalpatine

    i had a sickly combo tonight, not to mention mixed with the latest Lost, which is how i ended up here. BAD MOVE. if i do say so myslef, i didn't follow a damn thing. let me ask you gotik, do you think there's any rhyme to this reason or is it just off the cuff?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:54 a.m. CST

    so weird

    by BobPalpatine

    grotik i just read your post, saw my name, and thought i posted it, i sat here and stared at the toaster while tryign to remember if i had indeed posted it, only to realize it was your post. a man ahead of his time.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:55 a.m. CST

    put some bitters and some sweet vermouth and there

    by BobPalpatine

    and you'll be riding high along side me, but back on topic, what is ben doing guys? someone mention it ok?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:57 a.m. CST

    3 questions

    by BobPalpatine

    1) Why is ben hiring sayid, 2) wtf did i not stop at number 5, and 3) why in the name of fuck am i downloading No Reservations on Itunes rentals?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:59 a.m. CST

    just u and me gotik

    by BobPalpatine

    althouh i'm sobering up so it'll soon be you just left

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3 a.m. CST

    who is darlton?

    by BobPalpatine

    i only know that JJ and Damon are old bedfellows, like that old Ishmael and that intimidating Harpooner.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:07 a.m. CST

    gotik, you've just blown my brain

    by BobPalpatine

    you make very good point, points i wonder if the writers realize you know? bigger question: what was the 3 toed statute? you know of any myth that includes such a figure? i[m glad to read your post because it satiates my largest complaint of this season: ben has been innocuous, just a bitch, but even tied down and blood we know he's up to nothing but his own machinations. Here's a question: the last scene in the 3rd episode: was that on the island, or in the real world?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:11 a.m. CST

    i don't blame you gotik

    by BobPalpatine

    leave it to me to be the guy who does a search for "matrix reloaded" and be the one who leaves the last talkback.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:11 a.m. CST

    BobP

    by ChrisVenom

    Darlton is what the guys over in that big Lost tb from a few months ago, call Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse. They call'em Darlton just to be lazy!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:13 a.m. CST

    CATCH ME IF YOU CAN

    by BobPalpatine

    BOYS, I JUST MADE A POST IN A LONG DEFUNCT TALKBACK, IF YOU CAN FIND IT, YOU GET 10 DOLLARS VIA PAYPAL. WHOEVER MAKES THE FIRST POST AFTER THE POST I MADE IN THAT LONG DEAD TALKBACK GETS 10 BUCKS VIA PAYPAL!!!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:14 a.m. CST

    btw

    by ChrisVenom

    Im taking Jack Daniels with pepsi. Oh the hangover I see in the near future looks painful but its sure as hell worth it now.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:15 a.m. CST

    but would Ben ever leave the island?

    by BobPalpatine

    i mean really, isn't his identity nothing if not the island? isn't it safe to assume that in teh flashforwards, there is SOME WAY to get back to the island

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:18 a.m. CST

    hint: the clue to the talkback

    by BobPalpatine

    is in one of my posts, that 10 dollars is waiting boys!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:20 a.m. CST

    So your answer

    by BobPalpatine

    Leads to more questions. Can you really imagine ben leaving the island? Think about it, ben has allof his powre in the island, in the real world he is nothing! Unless he found a way to harness that power in the real world, but i doubt it. He knows noone in the real world... my my my

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:26 a.m. CST

    passports?

    by BobPalpatine

    in what scene did you see a slew of passports?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:38 a.m. CST

    Prison Break > Lost

    by Toby___Wong

    There is a higher entertainment factor in Prison Break than in Lost I think. I tried watching the first four episodes of Lost and couldn't understand why it is so popular. Now, if you watch the first four episodes of Prison Break it's like "Woa." With Prison Break you know you are always on the edge of your seat. With Lost it's like :"Get to the point." Lost is full of wimps while even Bellick could kick the ass of the strongest person in Lost (if there is such a person, which I doubt). And let's not talk about Susan B. Anthony. That bitch is bad to the bone. Find me any character in Lost who is as bad as she is.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:39 a.m. CST

    is noone interested in my own Lost sidequest?

    by BobPalpatine

    surely the appeal of solving one mystery can't evade you all, 10 dollars is to be had, and with little insight i might add.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:51 a.m. CST

    Prison Break is still on the air?

    by BobPalpatine

    Last I saw they were breaking out of the prison, but a pipe was in teh way fo their tunnel? Then there was a long break, and I didn't watch anymore. what could possibly be the plot now. PS. Brett Ratner is the mastermind behind that show is he not?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:56 a.m. CST

    My thoughts on The Economist.

    by Cheif Brody

    Holy fuck...Sayid is a badass...He's a badass's badass! <P> So...why was Sayid's golfing buddy, Mr. Avellino, so jittery upon finding out Sayid is one of the Oceanic 6? Like he knew his ass was grass at that exact moment? Ice cold shot of Sayid walking off in those sprinklers. <P> Speaking of Sayid making a great James Bond...But...Does it make much sense that you would use a "famous" plane crash survivor as a super secret hired assassin? It seems to me Bond's anominimity is used to his advantage. If Bond's face was plastered all over the news...it might make it harder for him to be a "secret agent", no? Is it a "hide in plain sight" tactic on Ben's part...using Sayid's lethal skills to hunt down people on a "list"....Ben and his lists! Is Sayid hunting down people who are looking for the island?...or know too much about the island? Perhaps Avellino knew something about the Flight 815 cover up? <P> Poor Sayid...every tall blonde he falls for gets two bullets in the gut. Not very lucky in love, is he? And where is Nadia...his one TRUE love? Is it possible Ben has her held hostage somewhere...and will kill her if Sayid refuses to do his "head hunting" chores? <P> "I have work to do"...Hmmmm...Charlotte quoting Walt? What's an anthropologist going to "dig up" on the island? And why did she have on that bulletproof vest, anyways. Not standard issue garb for an anthropologist. And...I guess some type of deal has been struck so that she won't tell her fellow frieghtee's Ben's secret about his "man" on the boat...but why? Does she care about Miles enough that she wouldn't blab to save his life? Is it possible Ben WANTS her to blab his secret so that the "mole" on the boat will be exposed?...Trouble is...there IS no mole....he just wants to create suspicion...as he knows these people know very little about each other....and the infighting will create a distraction and possibly thwart any more rescue attempts? Is he THAT good? <P> So...for a guy so committed to the island, seems like Ben is quite the world traveler. Recruiting trips?...or something even more sinister? Or...could he have flown all over the world trying to find a doctor that could remove the tumor on his spine...only to be told he would be dead in 6 months? That is...until he found his "miracle" doctor...in Jack Sheppard? A doctor noted to have healed the unhealable...a doctor who could "fix" the "unfixable"? <P> Where does Ben's little hidden room lead? What's he hiding down THERE if he's leaving his passports out in near plain sight? <P> Why did Frank tell Daniel to hang up on Minkowski if he answers? Better yet...why didn't Jack ASK Frank why he wanted him to hang up on his "frieghter friend"? <P> Hmmmm...more questions...I purposely put 23 questions in this post to piss off Sick Fixx. <P> Yes...Lost is all about the QUESTIONS, my Sick friend. I'm in no hurry to find out the answers....Because when we find out ALL the answers...the show is over...and shows this good...well, I just don't want to see end.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:04 a.m. CST

    I'm still not convinced the writers are in control

    by BobPalpatine

    While repeat viewings of seasons 1-3 reveal some breadcrumbs scattered throughout, I'm convinced the writers are maybe 5 episodes ahead of us at any given time. damn sobering up sucks.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:09 a.m. CST

    Hey Got...

    by Cheif Brody

    You damn near pulled off a triple negative with that post! You should write for LOST! <P> I realize those could have been "planted" for the Losties to find...but it only bolsters resentment that Ben just keeps piling on lie after lie upon the Losties...something that won't help his case very much...But, then again...That's Ben! <P> That said...if the passports are planted...what's he got "planted" in that room? You might make the arguement that he knew Sayid would find that room, too. <P> My guess for what's in that room...Richard Alpert...holding a gun to Nadia's head.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:22 a.m. CST

    thanks Xiphos

    by Maniaq

    so the "Yankee blue" blood reference is actually no help whatsoever.. now that you mention it, I think I do remember they were playing the Cardinals... <p> btw I'm pretty sure the "runway" was being built BEFORE the sub blew up - before Jack fixed Ben's spine and got his friends freed from captivity and nearly got off the island. I wonder if they were going to ask him to drink some orange juice at the start of the journey? <p> So why is Sayid working for Ben? I think he's feeling the same guilt the rest of the "6" seem to be feeling and has decided to "sell his soul" and go along with some plan of Ben's, that is no doubt all about protecting the "big lie" that everyone else is dead. <p> oh yeah I'm sipping a glass of red (just to be pretentious) but only because I'm out of vodka - although I daresay I'm the only one left at this party tonight

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:29 a.m. CST

    Xip...The writers in control...

    by Cheif Brody

    Let's see there, Xip...Locke loses his kidney in "Deus Ex Machina", the 19th episode of Season 1...and 3 seasons and 56 episodes later...the reason he survives a gunshot wound is BECAUSE of that missing organ. <P> In the 9th episode of Season 1, "Solitary", Sayid finds a mysterious cable running from the island out into the water. And in episode 21 of Season 3, "Greatest Hits", Des & Charlie use that very cable to locate the Looking Glass station to disable the jamming device that will let them be able to contact the outside world. <P> There are more examples of seeds being sewn long before their actual "usefulness" is revealed in the storytelling...But C'mon... <P> 5 episodes ahead? Surely you jest.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:31 a.m. CST

    My Bad Xip!!! I was directing that last one at...

    by Cheif Brody

    Emperor BobPalpatine. Sorry to get you involved, my friend!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:05 a.m. CST

    Hey Brody

    by Maniaq

    how can you be so sure Ben doesn't really have a mole on the ship? where else would you suggest he gets his information from? <p> also what are your thoughts on the rocket "losing time" like an alien abductee - on top of arriving late in the first place?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:14 a.m. CST

    You guys are still speculating who Ben's mole is?

    by BobPalpatine

    Isn't it obvious that the man Ben has on the ship is none other than: Michael?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:17 a.m. CST

    5 episodes indeed my good red bubbly drinking friend

    by BobPalpatine

    I appreciate the thoughtfulness of your post, but any number of events can be conjured up and tied to others to give the show that cohesiveness we love so much.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:33 a.m. CST

    Hey Bob...

    by Maniaq

    gotilk may have beat me to the punch - but I CAUGHT YOU - if you know what I mean ;-)

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:44 a.m. CST

    Maniaq..

    by BobPalpatine

    I'm a man true to my word. You were the first to find it. The 10 bucks is yours. What email should I send it to?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 6:07 a.m. CST

    Congrats Bob!

    by Cheif Brody

    You are the 10,000 poster to say Michael is Ben's "man" on the boat in this thread alone! But...you'd be wrong. <P> The next time we see Michael...it will be in the future...and he won't be one of the "Oceanic 6"...and he will not have his son with him. <P> What makes you so sure Ben DOES have a "man" on their boat? Ben gets his information on the Frieghties from the same place he got all the detailed files on the Losties. Imagine the chaos that will be on that boat when Charlotte tells them..."By the way...watch yer back...one of you on that boat isn't whom he seems". All these people have limited knowlege of each other, or how they were "chosen" by this creepy Abbadon dude...they'll be so busy trying to figure out who the "mole" is...that it may lead them to start killing each other...which would further delay any further rescue missions. <P> Ben is trying to AVOID there ever being an "Oceanic 6" in the first place...he doesn't want ANYONE getting off that island...let alone "survivors" of a plane crash that was supposed found at the bottom of the ocean with all on board dead. Once Locke figures THAT out...he'll make it his mission to get those 6 safely home...to kind of "make it up to" Jack for blowing up the sub and knifing Naomi. <P> BTW...Ben is getting his detailed info FROM Abbadon if you must know. <P> And Maniaq...please explain how the time differential on the beacon rocket has anything to do with "aliens"!! <P> And please remember...Friends don't let friends post drunk.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 6:48 a.m. CST

    Ahhhh...that's the rub there Cheif

    by rbrog77

    I had left my friends at the bar. So they weren't here to stop me from posting.<P> Gin and Tonic, BTW.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 7:21 a.m. CST

    Questions

    by rbrog77

    Technology. Jacob doesn't like it. Elsa's employer doesn't like it. Ben got off the island and has hired Sayid to hunt some group down one-by-one an kill them. If Ben got off the island then maybe Jacob did too. Maybe the war is between Ben (along with his new friends) and Jacob. There was spec last year that Ben was keeping Jacob locked up. Remember the Help Me.<P> Regarding the more complicated equation, it seems I was mistaken. The 2 time pieces do appear to be clocks on second look. And Dan clearly says "31 minutes". So I think we can go back to the simpler 30 minute equation for time...or can we? Do we have to take into consideration how long it seemed to take from Regina's perspective?<P> Maniaq?<P> The day I start trusting you (Ben) is the day I sold my soul. So has Sayid sold his soul? If so, it must be for a greater good. So if he sold his soul for a greater good and he's working for Ben, then were we wrong about Ben? Is Ben really one of the good guys?<P> Ben as he removes the bullet is giving Sayid his next assignment. That's some cold, single-minded shit. <P> On that, still seems to me that we'd know the names of people like Whidmore and Hanso. But Ben has a name. I think the people Ben is going after are in hiding. Using aliases. That's why at the end of this episode we should now know the guy on the golf course was startled when Sayid called him by name. Not because he hadn't said who he was, but because Sayid knew his real name.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:05 a.m. CST

    They should do an episode on Danielle...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    I was thinking how they should do an episode focused on Danielle. So I came with this: They should tell it in sequential order, from the time she arrived on the island and the final scene should be her death as an old woman in the future.<p><p>You start with a young actress as Danielle, pregnant, and we finally learn what exactly was the sickness that took down her crew. The story eventually syncs up with the crash of Oceanic 815 and with the events in the prior episode. But then the following scenes flash forward and we're shown things we don't have all the backstory for yet. (For example, perhaps one of the flash forwards reveals that Danielle is not living on the island.)<p><p>After this episode, we would resume watching the series to see how the storylines will eventually sync up with the events we saw in Danielle's life story.<p><p>Anyways, that's my suggestion to Damon and Lindoff. Since Danielle is an unconventional character within this group, and her story has not been told yet, I figure they should tell her story in a different format and in a format which will reveal more questions about not only her but events that are to come.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 9:06 a.m. CST

    the french woman flashback

    by jccalhoun

    That has really been one of the glaring omissions of the show. She has been around since season one and we haven't had any flashbacks from her yet? We had one from Desmond and Ben and the tailies but not Rousseau? Grrrrr...

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 9:53 a.m. CST

    Actually, you are.

    by Sick Fixx

    Just saying that doesn't make it so. And I've already proven myself not to be, without insulting anybody at that. I'm just too controversial in my ideas for you people is all. Now please stop bringing me up and get back to your Lost discussions. I said my peace without the intent to offend anybody, and I will probably say my peace next week, but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy the episode for whatever reasons you enjoyed it.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 9:56 a.m. CST

    Myths with four toes

    by Sick Fixx

    Actually, a troll has four toes and, oddly enough, has a reputation of stealing young and throwing their voices.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 10:24 a.m. CST

    It's funny I get called a flaming troll

    by Sick Fixx

    When I'm not the one doing all the flaming, but just expressing an opinion and defending my intelligence by stating my reading aptitude. It's called self defense. That's the only reason I brought anything up. The only reason. It is you people who are flaming. I wish you'd stop bringing my name up. In the future, when I watch Lost, I will probably stop by here to express my satisfaction or discontent and none of you are going to stop me. I can express my dislike same as you can express your happiness with the show. It's not that difficult a concept.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 10:29 a.m. CST

    What's even funnier

    by Sick Fixx

    is that you should all be calling Carlton and Damon pretentious name droppers as well, because they flaunt what they read more than you claim I have. Third Policeman, Percival, Carrie, Our Mutual Friend and all other kinds of books make little cameos in the series which, let's be honest, have NOT in fact led to any great revelation that would further help you understand the evasive plot any better. Dostoevsky and, oddly enough, Hemingway have also been referenced on the show. I mean, get fucking real and stop being so intelliphobic.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 10:55 a.m. CST

    Either Charlotte is the mole

    by rockness

    or it's bad writing. Why else would she allow the frank/sayid/desmond helicopter to take off for the freighter without revealing what ben said while she was with that camp? Seems like vital info...

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 10:56 a.m. CST

    Big E

    by Jor-El23

    The time thing...i think it's safe to assume that the times on the watches were actual times of day and not chronograph's started at zero...i'm thinking more along the lines of Back to the Future when Doc sends Einstein 1 minute into the future. it wouldn't take the payload 2 hours and 45 minutes to get to the island, plus another 31 minutes for this supposed temporal imbalance or whatever it's called. right? i'm no physicist or calculist or even someone who's good with numbers so I could be way off.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11 a.m. CST

    So if the trip out takes 31 minutes longer...

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Won't the Helo run out of gas?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:16 a.m. CST

    Prison Break > Lost

    by mrbong

    which is saying something, considering how badly PB lost it mid-season 2, and how awful season 3 has been so far. Lost just never had anything of interest and has perpetuated this approach. fools who fall for simple sleight of hand tricks seem to think their is something deep, meaningful and symbolic in it, but it's just mock existential wank. the makers must piss themselves laughing when they see how many people they have conned.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:34 a.m. CST

    Sayid should be the next James Bond.

    by Lashlarue

    Cold as ice!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:46 a.m. CST

    Then you're an idiot

    by Sick Fixx

    for chastising me for mentioning what I read in the context of being accused of being an idiot with a short attention span when I and others know I am not.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:47 a.m. CST

    You name-dropped a Dostoevsky novel

    by Sick Fixx

    The Idiot. You are pretentious. And an idiot.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:03 p.m. CST

    Desmond tried to sail off the island

    by zooch

    but ended up back where he started. How?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:12 p.m. CST

    Ahem

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    I won a Proust summary contest, ya'll. Bam. Dropped it like it's hot.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:15 p.m. CST

    Desmond is just a bad sailor zooch

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Just kidding. As much as I'm trying to figure out what he was REALLY doing those two weeks he was gone, I'm pretty sure now he did just like he said and couldn't get out of the island's netherzone because he wasn't on the right bearing.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:15 p.m. CST

    Kelvin

    by Sick Fixx

    Kelvin is still alive. Bank on it. It was mentioned somewhere in this talkback before this episode was actually shown that Desmond killed him on the beach. But someone else correctly remembered that when Desmond came back through, Kelvin's body was not there. Kelvin lives.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:18 p.m. CST

    Sick

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    You remember which episode that was? I don't recall Kelvin's body being gone. I hope he is alive, though.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:23 p.m. CST

    Rumblings from the Lab...

    by Wingnut1A

    Apparently, there's only one bearing from the Island that will actually get you back to the real world. The chopper had to fly that exact same bearing, and Michael had to stick to it in his boat to get home. If you stray off that course, you wind up back at the Island. =) *** I think Ben's man on the boat is Walt. Wether Walt is knowingly working for Ben or not, I don't know. *** Also, it looked to me like both Elsa and Naomi were wearing the same sort of bracelet. Perhaps whoever The Economist is sent Naomi and her team to get Ben, and in the future, Ben is seeking revenge.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:30 p.m. CST

    Leave Sick Fixx Alone!

    by Ribbons

    So he hates the show, it's not that big of a deal (and this is coming from someone who loves the show). Unless he's posting because he wants attention. In which case... give him a whole lot of it!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:32 p.m. CST

    Marvel Comics

    by Dazzler69

    I notice in the M.U. comics that they put up billboards for Oceanic airlines. It would be great if a monthly comic came out. Maybe with real Lost writers to fill in some gaps.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 12:56 p.m. CST

    Danielle's Flashback....

    by Cheif Brody

    Everytime a Rousseau flashback has been mentioned in the past...Darlton have said..."Yeah...that's a story we are really looking forward to getting to..."...over and over they have this same response...since Season 2. <P> I have a feeling that delaying Danielle's story has got nothing to do with them concentrating on the "core" Losties...or the core "Others" flashbacks first...but rather...her flashback MUST wait...as it will reveal things that will drastically answer questions that can't be revealed until a certain point in the story. Questions like... <P> Why is her clothing/actions/equipment primarily military in nature if her "routine expedition" was scientific/medical? <P> Has she been wearing the same clothing for 16 years? <P> Where is the ship that she and her expedition came on and why was her team following the "numbers" transmission? <P> Why have the Others left her in isolation if they outgun and outnumber her by far? <P> How could she know nothing of Flight 815's crash? <P> Her arrival on the island would now seem to pre-date the purge based on her having been on the island longer than Mikhail Bakunin. Why has she said nothing about it or DHARMA? How did she survive the purge? <P> How much of the information she has given the survivors is true? <P> Why was she so certain that Ben was one of the Others? <P> Why did she say the Others controlled the Radio Tower when it was in fact abandoned? <P> What kind of scientific expedition was a 7-month pregnant woman participating in? Was she double crossed by her lover, Robert, and was brought to the island BECAUSE she was pregnant...and her D.O.C. pre-dated her arrival on the island? <P> Why did she not know of the Flame station or any other of the DHARMA stations if she's been on the Island for 16 years? <P> Why wasn't SHE affected by "the sickness" that claimed the lives of her team? <P> I have a feeling Rousseau encountered Ben & the Others the day her daughter was taken from her. SHE named her daughter Alexandra...yet Ben decided to KEEP that name rather than change it to something else when Alex was removed from Danielle a week after her birth. <P> I believe Ben made a deal with Rousseau..."Stay away from us...do not cross the line...and we will return Alex when we are finished with her"...much like they did with Walt after taking him. But Ben became attached to Alex...and "lied...for a very long time" about returning her daughter to her. <P> It's also possible Robert was in cahoots with Ben...bringing this pregnant woman to the island...and Danielle killed Robert for his betrayal when he finally fessed up about his tue intentions...and his involvement with Dharma. <P> There's so much potential for juicy answers...that Danielle's flashback MUST wait until a specific time in the storyline's overall arc.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:11 p.m. CST

    Kelvin/Joe Inman ALIVE???

    by Cheif Brody

    You can bet yer sweet ass he is. A lil scuffle with Des...and a well hidden packet of boar's blood...a "fall" on the hard rocks... <P> The mercenary for hire fakes his death and lives on to "spook" another day. <P> Count on it.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:11 p.m. CST

    Cheif Brody

    by Ribbons

    Your primary suspicion is pretty on-the-mark... I listened to some podcast that the Lost guys did and they said they had to hold off on Rousseau's flashbacks because it would reveal certain things -- interestingly enough, I think they said "about someONE else" -- that they weren't ready to reveal just yet.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:12 p.m. CST

    I do not want attention

    by Sick Fixx

    I have asked you to stop bringing my name up! But I will continue to respond in my own defense, no matter how many of you people there are attacking me! Same as it would be in real life. And the school shooting comment was so tasteless and unnecessary. You people trivialize life and death now! Over a tv show talkback and one man's dissenting opinion! It's not for you people to decide if I'm pathetic or not. Let me repeat again, since most of you people don't care to actually speak truthfully. I DON'T WANT ATTENTION unless I have made a comment or asked a specific question. I am only responding now out of defense. STOP BRINGING MY NAME UP UNTIL I CALL UPON YOU TO RESPOND TO SOMETHING I SAY OR ASK.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:13 p.m. CST

    re: Kelvin Lives

    by Sick Fixx

    I'm pretty sure it was the Season 2 finale.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 1:43 p.m. CST

    Pre-Sequitar Re: "Series Finale"

    by greenstyle92

    Interesting, but what you fail to realize is that THE LOSTIES ALREADY ARE THE NEW OTHERS! At least locke's group is. Look at it from the F4's perspective. They land on this mysterious island and find these people they didn't necessarily expect to find. And these survivors are xenophobic and violent, don't want to leave, and protect the island at all costs. Hurley's betrayal is indicative of the old Other's "plant a man in their ranks" ploy. And now the losties have invaded the Barracks and taken them over as their living space. If locke's group isn't quite the "others" yet, they sure as hell are getting close to it.<br> <br> Even Jack's group didn't take long to get the F4 at gunpoint and negotiating on their terms.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:06 p.m. CST

    bracelet

    by necgray

    It looked to me like Sayid pocketed Naomi's bracelet. I thought, and I could be wrong, that Sayid gave his future boo the bracelet he pocketed. Also, I know this is silly, but I'm amused by it. Could the bracelet be a device of some sort? An NRG bracelet? Okay, that's stretching and silly, but it amuses me...

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 2:59 p.m. CST

    lol

    by slkboxrman

    just read part of the whole sick fixx posts ....is this guy for real ? he says he only watches till he cant take gettin jerked around by the story anymore and only checks back in at the season finale ? but says that anytime kate is in cuffs and in bondage thats when he'll watch cuz its more "to my taste" sounds like one sick perverted sociopath with an attention disorder problem.......rip him to shreds guys..lol....ill check the progress later.... but i loved the episode, and this season has been kickin all kinds of ass and i love it,, but then again i loved every season and every epidode of lost, every episode matters, and factors into whats going on on that island...no such thing as "filler" in the lost universe....and if people think there is , then yes u have attention problems.... sorry to bust ur bubble.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:12 p.m. CST

    hi octane my ass

    by bernard

    the producers claimed that they were going to kick everything into high gear because they have an end date, but the show continues to be as slow and painful as pushing out a kidney stone. <p> i think the problem is that they just keep introducing new questions and concepts, but never really follow through on any of it. it's like jerking off, and right before cumming, just stopping and saying nevermind, i'll try this again next week. <p> and to prove my point... <p> they give us a polar bear on a tropical island, but never truly explain why they're there or explore that angle...instead it's off to a pirate ship. <p> with the pirate ship, they decide they'll reveal that to be magnus hanso's ship...but instead of going into that on the show, it's explained on a freeze frame moment because "it's something we'll probably never get to." why? because this show is king of the bait and switch...in fact it survives on it. <p> they give us the others, but the others know nothing...oh but wait... ben knows something...but he still doesn't talk. <p> they give us dharma and the videos, but they never explore what dharma found on the island...except that the island is special...well no fucking shit. <p> they tell us walt is special, but they never follow through with that...other than a mobisode with some birds flying into a wall and him showing up as a ghost from time to time. <p> they give us jacob, but they never follow through with it. <p> they give us a man who doesn't age, but they don't follow through with it. <p> they give us a four toed statue, but they don't follow through with it. <p> they give us a monster noise, and after 2 years show it to be black smoke...but guess what...it'll be another year before they follow up with that. <p> they give us a supersoldier named mikhail and a house that has technology that can grab shit off the island and probably has some really cool things to explore, but they blow the house up and kill mikhail. <p> they give us time travel with desmond, but instead of following up on it, desmond has lame premonitions for 4 or 5 episodes that "charlie's gonna die" ... which gets to the point of being laughable...and then...wait for it...charlie dies! and desmond's premonitions just go away and we don't care about desmond anymore. <p> they give us an "incident" but never follow up on it. <p> they give us rousseau, who has a story about how she got there...and the fact that she's been on the island at least 16 years...but guess what...she doesn't offer shit. <p> i could go on forever. and it's not about having patience here, its the fact that lost is so disjointed and unfocused, that it only pretends to be a narrative. they bait and switch from character to character weekly, and it ends up just being a big pile of shit and by the time we actually get to any "payoff", no one will care. there are no "arcs", there is only one arc that has taken WAY too long to get through. <p> i'll still watch the show, which is all they care about...but damn i wish they'd give us more than 40 minutes that end up being "sayid got off the island and works for Ben"...and i'll put a hundred bucks on the fact that they don't follow up on that for another year. <p> this show has zero replay value and i guarantee that however it ends, i will feel like i wasted a lot of time rather than feel like i've been entertained and gone on a great adventure. <p> fuck lost.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:21 p.m. CST

    greenstyle92

    by bernard

    about your post above regarding the losties being the "new others". i see your point, but how does that offer anything progressive? isn't that just more repetition on a show that seems to already be walking in circles? <p> has jack and locke's relationship really changed at all in the last four years, or are they still fighting the same battle over and over and over and over and over again? <p> maybe it's just me, but i like a story that takes you on a roller coaster ride. lost is really good at going up the tracks and they even go so far as to show you the giant hill you're about to fly down...but they never follow through. instead you're just stuck floating around in space. <p> check out WEEDS...it is brilliant storytelling and a really fun rollercoaster ride. Dexter is cool too.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:25 p.m. CST

    Darkocity

    by bernard

    i'm not pissed at real life...i'm just pissed at myself for being duped into watching the show every week. in that regard, i do have some sort of psychological issue i guess, so i am sorry to rant and ramble. <p> and don't get me wrong...there are things i love about lost too, and maybe that's why i get frustrated with it, because i think it has a lot of potential and a really talented cast...possibly the best cast on a television show ever.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:38 p.m. CST

    seriously people...

    by maxwell's hammer

    leave Sick Fixx alone. Talk Back's are for arguing, and Sick Fixx brings to the table a person to argue with. Not to hurl ad hominim attacks against. Argue with his points...debate their merits, provide evidence to support why you're right and he's wrong. Don't name call.<BR> <BR> Also, I for one am massivly impressed with his ability to read books with no pictures. Usually when people bring up all the fancy books they've read to show how intelligent they are, they sound like a complete tool. But when Sick Fixx does it, I want to be his VBFF.<BR> <BR> So lay off my VBFF!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:46 p.m. CST

    bernard...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...you seriously don't see the progression in Locke and Jack's relationship? Go back and watch season 1 when they're working together (albeit with a little friction), then season 2 where they start to actively snipe at each other and bristle in each other's presence, then season 3 where they step away and have their own life-changing experiences on the island (Locke basically being offered a place among the others, only to be shot by Ben; Jack making a deal with the Others to escape, only to have it taken from him by Locke), and season 4 where they seem to actively hate each other, to the point where Jack puts a gun to Locke's head to shoot him.<BR> <BR> Then look at how things appear to have played out off the island, with Jack coming to see the wisdom of Locke wanting to stay. I seriously have no frame of reference to understand the people who say that nothing happens on the show. I think you're confusing plot movement with the revalation of the many mysteries, which, though they are plentiful, all seem to be tied together somehow.<BR> <BR> I'll say it again, the show runners have never given me any reason to suspect that there isn't a big picture.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:48 p.m. CST

    I think...

    by Ribbons

    ...I've already posted variations on this several times before so I probably should just quit while I'm ahead, but somebody I know recently said "You either like Lost or you don't," which to me sounded weirdly confrontational at the time. Only now do I think I understand what he meant. Because I think the way Lost works either appeals to people or repels them on a fundamental level (not to say it doesn't have other storytelling problems). Referencing that Magnus Hanso owned the Black Rock on the blast door map but then not cutting right to the chase and making it into an "arc" immediately on the show might piss some people off... and even if they finally discover that, say, Charles Widmore found bout Magnus Hanso's journal in an auction and that's how the freighter people know about the island, they'll still be annoyed that they had to wait two and a half seasons to find that out. That's something about the show that will never change. The most basic mysteries have never been structured to be directly addressed. They're either answered with more mysteries, or in little pieces throughout the series, or indirectly, sometimes. And I can understand how that might piss some people off, but that's one of the things I love about the show. I don't know if I can explain it right, but it's sort of how it'd work if you or me got trapped on the island. We wouldn't be able to go "Okay, mysterious monster. Time to figure out what it is." You'd do what you had to do to survive and sometimes external conditions would get you a little closer to the truth. It just... I don't know. I prefer it that way. And I'm sure there's all sorts of exceptions to this theory. I was hooked from the pilot, which was all about mystery and the promise of more mystery, so maybe that's why I've never had a problem with the pace of the show.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:48 p.m. CST

    node

    by maxwell's hammer

    chill dude...see my second to last post.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:56 p.m. CST

    attention seeking

    by maxwell's hammer

    Yeah! I'm with node! I hate attention seekers! Why would any dumbass pay attention to those fuckers and post angry tirades calling them 'cunts' and 'sick fucks'? Am I right, node? Am I right?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 3:58 p.m. CST

    hey bud...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...sarcasm is for pussies!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:01 p.m. CST

    How about we put a big ass sign up that reads:

    by ChrisVenom

    DONT FEED THE TROLLS!!....seriously pay those people no mind, if theres anything in the world that I hate, its attention whores. Just stop man, just stop.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:08 p.m. CST

    STOP BRINGING MY NAME UP UNTIL I CALL UPON YOU TO RESPOND TO SOM

    by redfishbluefish

    okay, you didn't ask, but that comment alone certainly does seem like an open invitation for ridicule. f&cking hilarious. you don't bother me so much now since the topic is still mostly LOST, now you're just kind of silly. it's really the general arguing that i am in opposition to. post your dislike all you want, but plese don't get pissy that someone disagrees with you and feel like you have to defend yourself. that goes for everyone. let it go...peace be with you. now i am going back to my vcr to see SAYID with no shirt again. ooh, yes, he would make a most delicious BOND.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:10 p.m. CST

    UNTIL I CALL UPON YOU TO RESPOND TO SOMETHING I SAY OR ASK.

    by redfishbluefish

    PLEASE. excuse the typo

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:19 p.m. CST

    You will not get the last word on what

    by Sick Fixx

    kind of person I am, Node. Period.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:20 p.m. CST

    This will be fun. Let's address some of Bernard's points.

    by Novaman5000

    "hey give us a polar bear on a tropical island, but never truly explain why they're there or explore that angle...instead it's off to a pirate ship." <p> Actually, they explained that the bears were there to be experimented on. The characters even get to see where the bears were kept.<p> "with the pirate ship, they decide they'll reveal that to be magnus hanso's ship...but instead of going into that on the show, it's explained on a freeze frame moment because "it's something we'll probably never get to." why? because this show is king of the bait and switch...in fact it survives on it." <p> The ship being hanso's explains how the dharma initiative stumbled upon the island and how they began their set up there. I would imagine it will be touched upon again when the organization's history is explained. <p> <p>"they give us the others, but the others know nothing...oh but wait... ben knows something...but he still doesn't talk." <p>The other's don't know things about what the dharma initiative was doing because they killed them all. They're not dharma, so what would they know about the experiments? Its a legitimate reason for not giving us answers. <p> they give us dharma and the videos, but they never explore what dharma found on the island...except that the island is special...well no fucking shit. <p> "they tell us walt is special, but they never follow through with that...other than a mobisode with some birds flying into a wall and him showing up as a ghost from time to time." <p> Seeing as how walt will be back this season, I'm thinking walt's special-ness will be further explored. <p> "they give us jacob, but they never follow through with it." <p> They JUST introduced Jacob at the end of last season, and he's been an important part of the new season. They're obviously going somewhere with it. Alot of your points are simply you being impatient. <p>"they give us a man who doesn't age, but they don't follow through with it."<p> And again, impatience. <p> "they give us a four toed statue, but they don't follow through with it." <p> Are you the type of person who flips to the last page of the book in book stores because you can't be bothered to read it? <p> "they give us a monster noise, and after 2 years show it to be black smoke...but guess what...it'll be another year before they follow up with that."<p> Wrong, they showed us it was black smoke at the end of season 1, and gave us a full on view of what it is and how it works by the middle of season 2. We don't know what it is yet, obviously, but don't act like the monster isn't still on the lostie's minds. Locke even just asked ben was it was last week. <p> "they give us a supersoldier named mikhail and a house that has technology that can grab shit off the island and probably has some really cool things to explore, but they blow the house up and kill mikhail." <p> Sure, that was frustrating, but it was supposed to be. It was designed to continue to strain the lostie's relationships, and set up locke's eventual split. And Mikhail wasn't a super soldier, he was just lucky. <p> "they give us time travel with desmond, but instead of following up on it, desmond has lame premonitions for 4 or 5 episodes that "charlie's gonna die" ... which gets to the point of being laughable...and then...wait for it...charlie dies! and desmond's premonitions just go away and we don't care about desmond anymore." <p> Uh, seeing as how desmond's getting a flashback episode in a couple weeks would suggest that he hasn't just "gone away". The time travel and his flashes are going to come into play in an intriguing way in his ep, if you read the synopsis for it. <p> "they give us an "incident" but never follow up on it." <p> Gimme an I! Gimme an M!... <p> "they give us rousseau, who has a story about how she got there...and the fact that she's been on the island at least 16 years...but guess what...she doesn't offer shit." <p> Besides bringing them to the black rock? Which has come in handy multiple times over the series... And capturing "Henry Gale"? Danielle's more than proven her usefulness. <p> i could go on forever. and it's not about having patience here, its the fact that lost is so disjointed and unfocused, that it only pretends to be a narrative. they bait and switch from character to character weekly, and it ends up just being a big pile of shit and by the time we actually get to any "payoff", no one will care. there are no "arcs", there is only one arc that has taken WAY too long to get through. <p> No, it is about impatience. This is not the type of show that can have season long arcs that just resolve neatly every may. It's a massive story. If you took the time to watch the show from the beginning, you'd see that alot of questions raised in the beginning have been answered, and they set so much up that will only begin to pay off now as we move towards the end of the series. <p> "i'll still watch the show, which is all they care about...but damn i wish they'd give us more than 40 minutes that end up being "sayid got off the island and works for Ben"...and i'll put a hundred bucks on the fact that they don't follow up on that for another year. <p> "this show has zero replay value and i guarantee that however it ends, i will feel like i wasted a lot of time rather than feel like i've been entertained and gone on a great adventure. <p> "fuck lost." <p> That's pretty fucking sad, no? That you hate something so much yet keep coming back to it? There's really nothing else to say. If you hate it so much, I'm pretty sure your TV gets other channels. Or you could always just turn it off. But you don't, and that says alot about you and the other haters.<p> It says that you and the other haters who come here every week bitching about the show simply like to complain. And that's fine (kind of sad, but fine). You can complain as much as you like, but don't expect us to give a shit. Especially when it's as vapid and baseless as most of the nonsense you posted above.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:22 p.m. CST

    I don't give a damn what you're sick of

    by Sick Fixx

    Stop bringing me up and I'll stop. It is you people who are the attention seekers. I am willing to let this die. But first, you have to stop with the ridiculous name calling and egging on. I must be the Most Controversial Talkbacker of All Time to have garnered this much heat. And I don't want it. But you people won't let this die. I will continue to post as often as I see fit. I will take you all on if need be. I will post every 108 minutes the same way Desmond and Locke pushed the button if I have to to ensure that you do not have the final say and the high ground on me, even if I have to drive home from work every 108 minutes. I'll just tell the boss to suck ol' woofer. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:23 p.m. CST

    missed one

    by Novaman5000

    "they give us dharma and the videos, but they never explore what dharma found on the island...except that the island is special...well no fucking shit."<p> They explored 4 dharma stations. Granted, it would have been nice if they got out more, but <p> 1) They've only been on the island 90 days<p> 2) The jungle is a dangerous fucking place.<p> 3) Sticking to the beach makes sense. These people just want to be rescued. The viewers want answers more than they do.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:23 p.m. CST

    I'm only watching next week

    by Sick Fixx

    because Kate will be shackled and leg ironed. Then I'm done.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:29 p.m. CST

    Sicky...

    by maxwell's hammer

    you're the kid who gets shoved around in the playground during recess. Not "THE MOST CONTROVERSIAL TALKBACKER OF ALL TIME". (I know you were being sarcastic, but it was almost that kind of sarcasm you see when a guy flirts with a girl, then when she's visibly disgusted, he says he was just joking). <BR> <BR> When you're arguing your opinions about LOST, we're cool, but aside from that, you have some serious ego problems.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 4:29 p.m. CST

    Oh and node, I don't know if anyone else

    by Novaman5000

    mentioned this but above you said ben used "the girl" to get sayid to become an assassin, but Sayid actually says something along the lines of "you used what happened". Basically, something terrible is going to happen on the island. Bad enough to make Sayid decide to begin assassinating the boaties people when he gets back.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:03 p.m. CST

    Brody, rb, and Bob...

    by Maniaq

    Chief - please don't take me too literally when I say "alien abductee" - I'm talking about the phenomenon of "lost time" often reported by people who reckon they've been abducted by aliens - as in "where did that 31 minutes go - it felt like just a moment?" - that's the beginning and end of what the rocket has to do with "aliens"... <p> rb, I couldn't agree more and did FF Ben remind anyone else of the evil dentist from Marathon Man? I kept waiting for him to ask "is it safe?" <p> Bob - send the ten bucks to your favourite charity... <p> anyone who's interested, I'm *still* unclear about this rocket thing - seems there are three conflicting perspectives to reconcile - the clock in the rocket, Regina (for whom the initial experiment took 30secs), and Faraday/the clock on the tripod. WHY OH WHY did Faraday not call Regina when the rocket finally arrived and ask her what time she's got???

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:31 p.m. CST

    Maniaq...No problem, brotha...

    by Cheif Brody

    I'm not familiar with the the "time missing" parts of the story that "alien abducted" persons seem to recall...Usually the "Ow! My ass hurts" story jumps out at me. <P> But yes...Regina's account of the time missed might have been off a tad, too...which would further complicate how "off" the time is on the island...Why Daniel didn't jump on the radio the moment that thing landed and ask..."Regina....what time do you have?" to see if it matched his records is beyond me. Or how about..."Regina...what time is it where you are"...I'm sure the physicist will shed more scattered light on this anomoly next episode. <P> Or...not. It matters not to me. Because I watch LOST knowing that at SOME POINT...that question will get answered...and if not...I will still enjoy "the ride". I still contend that people who watch this show for answers are masochists.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 5:36 p.m. CST

    Best episode for a long time

    by MontyPigeon

    Possibly in the top 5 episodes of Lost ever.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 6:50 p.m. CST

    time differential and coffin

    by jimbohal78

    I don't think their is a time differential on and off the island. Jack saying he hasn't seen a game in 100 days would have gotten some sort of "but you've been gone for 8 years" type of comment from Frank. Also, I would wager that the person in the coffin is NOT black. I think its a red herring. It just seems too obvious with the neighborhhod they showed. I think possibly Locke since we know he has no family is not very wealthy. Maybe ironically in the future he has an accident or cancer or something that forces the amputation of his legs and thus the smaller coffin.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 6:51 p.m. CST

    Sick Fix is only watching one more week

    by Yo Yo Ma

    This is a lock..Sick Fix is hurting for attention..he is getting it from us. He will watch next week, make his dopey comments, say he is never watching again, and he will be back week after week after week. Lost talkbackers are his family. He finally feels loved. (Again my question still stands, if you hate a show why watch it. I hate Fox's Moment of Truth, I promise I will not tune in. I swear. I believe at 9:00 on Thursdays Celebrity Apprentice is on. Watch that and join their talk back.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:04 p.m. CST

    Thank ya verry much

    by Napoleon Park

    I noticed that Skin Flix thanked me for calling dubbing his ilk flaming Troll and said it was funny. Or maybe he was being sarky, I didn't read the rest of his poopst. I'm glad you enjoyed it.<p>I did notice someone else quoted someone as dubbing himself "the most controversial talkback shitter-on ever". As that person said, not even close. I forget his name, but there was a fellow a year or two ago that called himself Gabriel something. Then there was that guy that used to post a fully detailed Lost episode synopsis before the episode aired. They might be in the top ten, but I only drop in here now and then, so I wouldn't know 4 shur.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:15 p.m. CST

    Time slip

    by samsquanch

    I think they're trying a clever plot device on for size. This has probably already been mentioned, but When Walt appears he's not going to be 11 years old anymore, the show has been on for what, three years? Three and a half? Also, that means it's still 2004 or whatever in the Lost universe, or at least on the Island itself. Jack's "100" days comment might have been deliberately ignored by the pilot, we still don't know what the freighties agenda is, it might be that they're aware of what the Losties know and don't know about this 'time differential', assuming it exists. The only thing that really makes me question it is that since there are flash forwards to the "Oceanic 6', and none of the 6 have yet made mention of the fact that they've been gone for years rather than months seems to suggest that this isn't the case. But then again, not definitive. Personally, I hope they do play with this, I don't know of another series that has, and if handled properly it could explain a lot and be kind of cool.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:48 p.m. CST

    Sam...

    by Cheif Brody

    There are other factors to consider, too. Frank hasn't seen any of the 815 fuselage yet...perhaps he figures Jack meant that they got to the island by fashioning rafts from the plane wreck at sea and just landed on the island 100 days ago...and not that the plane actually crashed ON the island 100 days ago. <P> I also don't think the frieghtees know anything thing about the time anomoly....until Daniel did the Clock Rocket test. But, I'm in agreement that I don't think this time shifting nonsense will amount to much...other than it explains how Malcolm David Kelly & Walt appear to be aging so fast...as darlton said at Comic-Con last year..."We have always had an explanation for why Walt is aging faster than he should be on the island". <P> MDK was 11 years old when they shot the pilot episode for LOST. He's now well over 15 years old...and is cruising swiftly through puberty...so an explanation HAD to be established soon. Especially with Michael's episode looming.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:54 p.m. CST

    Time Question - JorEl

    by theBigE

    Sorry, I was working all day, and I'm still exhausted, but that whole time thing is tough for me to figure out! I also agree it's a clock, not a chronograph. But there are 2 things that I'm trying to figure out: <p> #1 Ok, say the "payload" arrives when Regina says it should - would the clocks be on time then? <p> #2 Maybe the "payload" did arrive exactly when Regina thought it did. That means the freighter is already ahead, timewise, somehow. Now their phone is a satellite phone, those rely on radio waves, right? Somehow, those travel ok, but physical objects get distorted? I'm still trying to sort this out in my head! There is no way it's as simple as a 1:31 time ratio.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 8:58 p.m. CST

    You may be right, Cheif B

    by theBigE

    I don't think the time anomoly is going to be anything concrete with all the rules carved in stone, but it exists nonetheless. Mostly to help the writers out with the age of the actors!

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 9:32 p.m. CST

    BigE

    by Jor-El23

    I think if the payload arrives when it's supposed to, there's no time difference. I think that traveling to the island causes physical objects to go back in time by 31 minutes. I think that explains why the island cannot be found by satellites or even passing ships or whatever. it's not there when you are. it's not there when the satellite is looking at it, it's always 31 minutes behind. I'm still not prepared to say that the outside world has progressed 8 1/2 years past the time of the Losties though, but there has to be some connection between the 31 minute difference and Walt's aging.

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 9:54 p.m. CST

    Time Anomaly is physical barrier

    by G100

    Might the Time Anomaly be the barrier around the Island that keeps it nigh on invisible and prevents safe entrance and egress only under the very specific heading that Michaels boat took, the Underwater beacon heading for the Sub and now the Helicopters exit bearing ? <p> <p>That the Pilot was told to keep on his heading "no matter what" tells me that if you stray from that heading Bad things will indeed occur with strange sh*t visible. Desmond also got nowhere without the heading.<p> <p>Maybe it's just me but I can't figure out why if the Anthropologist chick heard Ben tell them he had a spy on the boat then why wasn't this immediately relayed to the Pilot and scientist ? Unless Locke threatened to kill Miles if she did I suppose... meh. I'm fairly sure we'll find out who Kate's mysterious HE is from Looking Glass Eps and maybe even why the 6 Losties must say nothing. I'm thinking it's either old Cop Hubby, Abaddon or Ben and blackmail of some sort would seem to be the obvious reason why they are "sick of lying".

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:43 p.m. CST

    Got...

    by Cheif Brody

    If said super fancy phones were designed to "correct" for this time anomoly...and were provided by Abbadon...who hoped that the time anomoly would never be noticed by the team he sent..as to protect the island's real "secret" location even from them. <P> If Abbadon told them..."Sail to this exact coordinate. Take the helicopter from there due west at exactly these coordinates"...then the "frieghtees" may not ever realize that their helicopter actually "lost time" as they travelled. <P> Just a theory. I don't think they are giving out any info on the island to ANYONE. It's all "need-to-know" basis. <P> The question remains...If the Frank piloted the helicopter following the proper coordinates...why did the instruments still freak out...and he had to make an emergency landing? <P> Another question is...Danielle and her team, 16 years ago...arrived to the island by a boat...crashing ashore...IN A STORM. <P> In 2001, Desmond arrived by sailboat...IN A STORM. <P> In 2004(ish)...Frank and his team arrive by helicopter...IN A STORM. <P> In 1821...The Black Rock crashes onto the island...IN A STORM? <P> I see a pattern here...But what of Flight 815? It crashed on a beautiful sunny day. That happened because Desmond failed to enter the code in time...and the electromagnetic shockwave brought it down. No storm required, huh?

  • Feb. 16, 2008, 11:47 p.m. CST

    Did you notice Ben was wearing the same clothes

    by skywalkerfamily

    at the end that he was wearing in Miles' picture?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:29 a.m. CST

    I have Lost figured out:

    by Playkins

    I'll make this as short as possible.<p> It is now CONFIRMED that the island exists outside of normal time. It is also suggested that different routes away from and to the island can result in different degrees of displacement.<p> Therefore, people can travel to and from the island, but not necessarily to the same time. Benjamin Linus has the place figured out, and comes and goes to and from the island, arriving at different times and places back into the world. This is why there is the photo of him, it is also why he is in the "flash-forwards" as Sayid's boss. This is also what explains the "Magic Box", (which is highly metaphorical). He knows the future, and can therefore respond to any situation by leaving and setting events in motion that will bring what he wants to the Island.<p> Flight 815 was an accident that happened during the first discharge at the Swan resulting in the crash. The Losties are a wildcard that Benhas had to deal with by changing strategies. His manipulations have increased in order to deal with the new threats to the island that would come because of the crash.<p> The smoke monster is a artifact of the island that exists because of the strong "psychic vibrations" of the island. They have manifested as a sentient being that "evens things" out as it feels is necessary. Should a person not need to be there, or is putting something else on the island out of whack, they are dealt with. Jacob is the embodiment of the island itself, visible only to people that are "sensitive" enough to see him.<p> I've left alot out that I think has been pretty much explained (DHARMA, The Others), but I think it's solid, and everything fits.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:15 a.m. CST

    Explain this then, Playkins...

    by Cheif Brody

    How is it that Sawyer met Jack's dad in a bar BEFORE the island? How did he also passed right by Boone in the Austrailian police station? <P> Speaking of Boone...How is it that Jack's ex-wife was in a car accident with Boone's stepfather (Shannon's father) and Jack chose to "fix" her instead of letting him die? <P> Speaking of Jack...How is it that he accidently runs into Desmond training in an empty stadium...and then runs into him again inside the Swan hatch? <P> Speaking of Desmond...How is it he accidentally ran into Libby at a coffee shop and took her up on her sailboat offer? <P> Speaking of Libby...How is it she just happened to be a patient at the same mental ward as Hurley? <P> Speaking of Hurley...How is it that he had the same boss as Locke...and owned the box factory that John worked in? <P> Speaking of Locke...How was it that he inspected the very house that Sayid's love Nadia was hiding out in? <P> And speaking of Sayid...how is it that he just happened to be on the TV set in the background at the same time Kate was visiting her stepdad at the Army recruitment office? <P> And speaking of Kate...how is it that she would accidentally run into Sawyer's girlfriend and father of his child Cassidy? <P> Have we come full circle yet?...I could continue...But let me know when you get all that figured out...Playkins.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:23 a.m. CST

    Oh...here's the real mind fuck...

    by Cheif Brody

    How is it that Jack is Aaron's UNCLE?!! <P> Please...get back to me on your theory!!

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:27 a.m. CST

    sick fixx

    by Mundungus

    "I'm just too controversial in my ideas for you people is all" <p> Damn, how racist.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:39 a.m. CST

    Brody...

    by Mundungus

    "How is it that Jack is Aaron's UNCLE?!! " You see Jacks Dad was putting to Claire's Mom for a while, which makes Jack & Claire half-siblings, which makes Jack an Uncle to any of Claire's offspring. <p> ... or did you just mean in sort of a sychronistic shit happens kind of way?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:43 a.m. CST

    ...putting "it", I meant to write

    by Mundungus

    You know, like banging, shagging, or making fig fig.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:46 a.m. CST

    Oh...NOW I get it...

    by Cheif Brody

    Christian and Claire's mom had sex? THAT makes perfect sense now!! <P> God...I'm such an idiot! Thanks for settin me straight, Mun.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:22 a.m. CST

    Also when we saw Ben's backstory on the island

    by skywalkerfamily

    how come the French Lady was never mentioned or seen? She was there fifteen years.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:25 a.m. CST

    Wow, am I late to this party...

    by stereochad

    ... (and off topic too) but here's my 2 cents (until next weak). <br><br> I am digging the mystery and hoping for a satisfying as much as the next person. It's what has me glued to the screen every effin time. <br><br> But.... <br><br> I am having the same problem with this show as I have (eventually) had with just about every other show that an an element of the fantastical within. This would be the writer's pattern of - after a succesful formula has been established - forgetting to have the characters act: A) Consistently baffled every time that an event - that anyone sane person would have to define as batshit - unfolds in front of them. and B) With reactions to these events that mirror their objectives and motivations. <br><br> Like? <br><br> Like why the fuck are team Jack even going off on new missions (instead of holding guns to these "rescuers" heads until the bird is in the air) and not demanding to know every godamn thing there is to know about these new visitors to begin with? <br><br> Like why didn't Archer's crew (on the Enterprise) soil their pants every time they met an alien race or witnessed a astronomical phenonema (for the first time in human history)???? <br><br> That's all I got (very tired)!

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:27 a.m. CST

    ;-)

    by stereochad

    "weak"

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:27 a.m. CST

    Cheif Brody: Are you serious?

    by Playkins

    Because that's all pretty self-explanatory... especially Jack being Aaron's uncle. So either you're shining me on, or you're really that dense. If someone is pulling the strings (Uh.. Benjamin Linus), and that person is able to travel back and forth to different time-periods, who's to say he wouldn't be able to orchestrate things to happen, so other things happen a certain way?<P> Or, you could say it's a six-degrees of separation kind of thing, and all the Losties fates are intertwined. Doesn't change my theory about the island.<p> Besides the fact, it's a broad strokes kind of thing. How the fuck should I know every little detail?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:35 a.m. CST

    Also..

    by stereochad

    The final island scenes with Jack and Ben (and all) would be a textbook example of what I think a person would act like (in the face of 100 days of crazy island antics). So we know the writer's can bring it, they just seem to be lazy these first 3 epps.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:07 a.m. CST

    jeremy davies...

    by BigTexas42

    is the new Crispin Glover.<P><P>and I mean that as a compliment...<P><P>oh, and if Zoe Bell IS Regina, I'd like her to fire MY payload...er,I'd like to fire my payload into her...er, I mean...I'd like to fire some payload with her...shit, I'm tryin to make a payload=ejaculation joke here...someone help me out...I'm gonna have another drink before i pass out...

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 4:07 a.m. CST

    6 weeks break

    by bkpark1

    Why are they breaking for 6 weeks? If they started filming right now, wouldn't that be plenty of time to comeplete 5 episode by the time episode 4.8 aired?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:14 a.m. CST

    Playkins...I'm putting you on...

    by Cheif Brody

    Your little "theory" solves about 10% of the show's mysteries...the character's previous connection is only a small part of it. <P> Also...ben is one man...and, as you speculate, he's able to "time travel" all over the place from his "magic box"...he still would have been recognized immediately by the Losties once they caught him in Rousseau's trap. "Hey...you're that guy who got me to go to Austrailia and get on that plane"...Ben had LOTSA help there...These people had NO connection with each other...strewn all over the world. <P> So...maybe Ben was onto Christian...and his son and abandoned daughter...Your telling me he went to all the trouble of getting BOTH of them on that exact plane...at that exact time...just so it could wreck...and IF they survive the crash...this half brother and sister...who have no knowlege of each other...will be reunited and forced to survive on this crazy island? <P> Just coincidence? Or Ben orchestrating things from a remote island he doesn't ever seem to want to leave. <P> Ben had to have mucho help on the outside to get all these folks in the same place at the same time...and that still doesn't explain half the connections I listed...like Sawyer and Boone crossing paths in the police station. How completely random is that? <P> Ben had help...Malkin...Hibbs...Leonard...Kate's Mom...Jack's Dad...Sun's Father...Helen & Cooper...Liam...Widmore...Nadia...all potential "steering forces" that ben had to orchestrate over many years to culminate on September 22nd, 2004? <P> I wish you luck on your theory, my friend...but claiming you have LOST "all figured out"...you are opening yourself up to scrutiny. <P> If you had said..."I have about 10% of LOST figured out"...I'd have cut you some slack. <P> "Do you really think all this... is an accident? That we, a group of strangers survived, many of us with just superficial injuries? Do you think we crashed on this place by coincidence, especially this place? We were brought here for a purpose, for a reason, all of us. Each one of us was brought here for a reason". - John Locke

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:33 a.m. CST

    "Clock Rocket"

    by Napoleon Park

    Permanent addition to the lexicon, right up there with blanderize and blipvert.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:37 a.m. CST

    bkpark1...The delay...

    by Cheif Brody

    We are stopping at ep. 7 for a six week break because we are losing 3 episodes out of this season. You would think that would speed up the process...but it actually slows it down, at least initially. <P> Now...the two scripts they had 90% finished...and the other two that were 50% finished BEFORE the strike, have to be all but thrown out to condense the story line down from 16 episodes to 13. <P> In other words, they want to cover the same amount of ground in LESS episodes. Which means a lot of re-writing and juggling of scenes has to happen BEFORE they can even start filming. <P> If we are lucky...the cast & crew is back in Hawaii by now (Evangeline Lilly was in New York & LA all last week doing the talk show circuit)...and are prepping to go before the cameras this week. But it may not be til the following week before they have a final "approved" ep. 9 shooting script. <P> It takes a week to shoot an episode...another week to edit and score it...You do the math and you can see why we only want them to give us FIVE un-rushed, well planned out episodes to finish off Season 4...than eight slapped-together-on-a-crisis-deadline ones. <P> Darlton has said that they plan on making up the "lost" episodes in seasons to come. <P> Now we just have to hope that a SAG strike doesn't rear it's ugly head this summer and delay us any further.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:32 a.m. CST

    My cock is on the Island....

    by Lashlarue

    And it's looking for Kate right now.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 8:09 a.m. CST

    Biggest Cliff-Hanger Mystery

    by Itchy

    And the one they are not following up on at all ... why did Claire ever go back to blond ? She was infinately hotter as a black-haired Goth Claire. They better go back and explore that mystery or I'm done with this show for good.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 8:23 a.m. CST

    Suugestion for my room 23 friends

    by rbrog77

    Sick Fixx says "Stop bringing me up and I'll stop. I am willing to let this die."<P> So for us, at least the Room 23 graduates, can we stop egging this attention-seeking, LOST hating, hentai porn faces of death troll who's suffering from a recto-cranial inversion on?<P> I for one would like to grant him it's wish.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:29 a.m. CST

    to really annoy Sick Fixx

    by Maximus Prime

    just do a few wrong spellings, he went apeshit on me when I spelt the wrong....not my fault I read old age English literature and the scroll writing through my monacle say teh instead of the....however, when assholes come on and start talking constant shite we forget taht this is all about Lost....<p> Sayid's episode was fantastic, just the kinda episode Sayid fans want...aka him being all badass, you gotta love losts endings, its pure 'give me the next episode now'material....love it love it love it

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:33 a.m. CST

    sorry rb

    by Maximus Prime

    I didnt read ur comment before I posted.........consider it done mate

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 10:28 a.m. CST

    Fucking ABC...

    by micturatingbenjamin

    Man, abc.com has every episode from the beginning. This last episode was the fucking swinging tits, man. Sayid...Should have his own fucking movies. Although, the time differential theory seems to have proven true for the island. Weird.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 10:44 a.m. CST

    A Theory...

    by micturatingbenjamin

    The theory has to do with the Valenzetti Equation that would reveal the end of the world. Possibly there's a permutation developed by the Dharma Initiative, the thing that resists the Equation that can predict with nearly 100% accuracy what's going to happen, so that it's preventable. However the running of this equation, and it's solving within the 'Magic Box' happens over a period of time that in the 'real world' would be useless, because the equation would solve, and the event would happen in real time as its solution proved itself out. But because the island exists outside of temporal flow by about a half an hour, (which may be the result of the button not being pushed, I have a feeling that the differential was greater when the button was being used), and because of the greater difference between the island and the rest of the world, the Hostiles/Others/Natives were able to use the Dharma 'Magic Box' to get things to the island.<p>Things like predicting with accuracy where Locke's father would be. Benjamin tells the truth when its verity would cause the most psychological impact. So I believe him when he reveals to Locke that the Others were trying to get him to come to them, which means that they yanked Locke's dad and brought him to the island before they stopped pressing the button anticipating Locke finding them, which is why Ben wanders to their side of the island (which isn't true, he headed into the trap to get them to grab him, IMO).<p>I really like this show more than I thought that I would. It's got me now, and this new season added things that are really tweaking my 'superheroes' bias, I REALLY like the ghost buster and the wacked out physicist.<p>My theory's merits are that Daniel gets weirded out by the differential, but because of the lack of differential he was expecting. Though, the woman on the ship says it's weird that he doesn't see it, they're aware that there's a 'speaker' function on the mic, and if he set up those two cameras (I worked in security, those two things on top of his little Chinese Plate Spinner Tripod were small IR cameras), she can see him just fine. I don't have the physics or math to explain why the video or satellite phone work outside this dynamic of 'temporal difference'...<p>That's my theory anyway. My other theory is that Jacob's the guy that found the 'Magic Box' equation realizing that those on the island when he 'opened the box' must do certain things to ensure the 'Magic Box' equation's proper functioning.<p>Along comes Ben, and he damages the fundamental equation by killing everyone off in the Dharma Initiative. Doesn't anyone else find it strange that the guy from that Brooke Shields sitcom has been on the island (pretty much unchanged) since Ben was 11?<p>Theories...Damn, I like this show.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 11:50 a.m. CST

    4we8have15to16go23back42, that's exactly what it means.

    by Novaman5000

    Michael's sailing out at a precise heading, and faraday's advice to the pilot are both suggesting that the only way to get out is to come in a particular way, that's why desmond couldnt get off the island when he had the boat.<p> And honestly, i thought that the music with sayid and hurley was just a sort of joke for the fans when it first aired, but then they had it in the recap special, and the more we get into this time travel stuff, it makes me wonder if there isn't something more significant there.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:10 p.m. CST

    Darkocity

    by mrbong

    i would be delighted to try any new herbs, mate, thanks for the offer. if they allow me to appreciate this "Lost" business (i clearly do not and so many do), well, so much the better!!

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:13 p.m. CST

    Nova, you mean the radio line?

    by theBigE

    When Sayid and Hurley got the short wave radio working, and they said the music could be coming from anywhere, or anytime? I definitely agree that it wasn't a throw away line. Especially if you got started late on the show (like me.) I didn't see that episode (season 1?) until after watching all of season 3. It is significant, for sure.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:16 p.m. CST

    rb - it's always good advice

    by theBigE

    Unfortunately I was one of the original antagonizers on Thursday night. But skip the posts by such an individual completely, don't respond, and you'll notice that the talkback is much more enjoyable! Hope you're over your hangover!

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:24 p.m. CST

    Hey micturatingwhatever...The Hostiles.

    by Cheif Brody

    Yes...it bothers me that it wasn't Judd Nelson who becomes the ageless mystery man...instead of Nestor Carbonell. <P> But speaking of 'Ol Rich Alpert...so...he appears not to age...at least not very quickly...Now...we know thru one of the Lost ARG games...that The Hanso Foundation is fond of their little orangatan Joop...who also doesn't age very quickly due to the Hanso "life extention project". Lost-Pedia has Alvar himself listed as being possibly 112 years old... <P> So...is it possible that Richard and the rest of the Hostiles, weren't so much the island's "original inhabitants"...but rather...were Hanso's earliest human "guinea pigs" for all types of experiments, including the life extention project. These people "volunteered" to be test subjects for The Dharma Initiative...long before Ben ever arrived with Roger as a curious bug eyed boy on the island. This was fine...for a while...until these test subjects decided they had had enough...and demanded to go "home". <P> But because Hanso never had any intention of ever letting this "special folk" just leave the island...and be free to blab to the world about this crazy magical island they lived on...where secret...and possibly harmful experiments were being conducted on them, that clearly stepped over the boundries of legitimate scientific research control guidelines. <P> So these "test subjects", well, they got tired of being strapped into chairs and being forced to watch weird films (ala 'A Clockwork Orange') in Room 23...and spending large amounts of time being exposed to god knows what kind of electromagnetic radiation...when some of them decided they had enough. <P> They began revolting against their Dharma "captors". Some violently...and some "covertly"...by using the Dharma micro computer processors to try and contact the "outside world"...to possibly let their loved ones know they were being held against their will...leading to "incidents" that threatened to shut The Dharma Initiative down. <P> Many broke free from their "top secret research" captors...and ran off to live in the jungle...But found that the scientists had harnessed the island's mystical properties to create massive sonic fences...and a strange smoky security system...that could hunt and track them...scanning them for their identity...based on how "special" it deemed them to be...and dragging them back to the scientists through elaborate tunnels all across the island. <P> But these "guinea pigs" were determined to leave this place...and outsmarted the Dharma scurity systems...mounting attacks on the Dharma people every chance they could get. <P> But Dharma had special weapons at their disposal...including gasses that would make everyone on the island be affected with a "sickness" that would drive them mad...and eventually kill them if they did not take a special vaccine that Dharma created to combat said "sickness"...But then Dharma had another problems... <P> A few of the Dharma scientists began sympathizing with these renegade "hostiles" who were attacking them...trying to steal their boats and overtake their communication stations. These scientists also were finished working on this island far from their loved ones back home... and joined the hostile's ranks, bringing them the life saving vaccine they needed to overcome the sickness. They had inside knowlege of many of the stations...and where the Dharma weapons and gas cannisters were stored. <P> The other side affect of this Dharma divide crisis...the gas they used to keep the hostiles at bay caused a reaction in the fertility of the women on the island. Soon...the women scientists and their infants began dying at childbirth...possibly as a result of the secret gas...or by the vaccine meant to save them. <P> Soon enough, the Hostiles were ready to finally take control of the island, but they needed someone on the "inside" someone they could trust to "purge" this island of Dharma forever. <P> Over the years...the effects from the gas used in the earliest assaults became dormant...except in some concentrated areas...which would have a small effect on humans who came in contact with it...hallucinations...whispers...visions....but nothing life threatening. <P> Okay...what did all that explain? <P> 1. The hostiles were Dharma test subjects who rebelled. <P> 2. They were responsible for "the insident" Candle speaks of. <P> 3. They caused the creation of "smoky" and the sonic fence. <P> 4. They are the reason the Flame had an Enter 77 code. <P> 5. The sickness was man made...not island made...and eventually caused the fertility problem. <P> 6. Richard Alpert doesn't age for the same reasons Joop doesn't age. <P> 7. Some of the Losties weird contact with whispers and hallucinations are from coming into contact with areas still ripe with the gases effects. <P> 8. Smoky does scan people, for what exactly, is unknown...but it can drag a man like Locke into a hole...as it was programmed to do. <P> 9. Rousseau's lover and her team went crazy with the sickness...but not Rousseau (well...not too crazy!)...is it because she was pregnant with a D.O.C. that predated her island arrival? Which is why pregnant women are of such interest to Ben & The Others/Hostiles. <P> It probably explains a lot of other things I'm forgetting...but the question is. If the Hostiles were rebelling to get OFF the island...why didn't they leave after the purge? Obviously Ben knows the coordinates off the island and had the keys to the sub. Is it possible ben convinced them that they all really had nothing to go home to...that when they all volunteered...either as a test subject...or as a scientist...they were all chosen EXACTLY because they wouldn't be missed in the outside world...that this island is special...and could be the ideal Utopian society...when the Valenzetti Equation finally takes it's course...that they could remain on the island...much like a modern day "Noah's Ark". An invisible sanctuary where they would be safe...and could continue some of the Zoological studies Dharma was working on to insure a wide variety of species would survive the outside world's destruction. <P> In other words...they could become "The good guys". They would leave the island to recruit new members...members they needed to insure the safety of all on the island. Except now...the cycle is repeating itself...the hostiles are now the Losties...joined by sympathizers like Juliette..and they are out to purge the Others to get their asses off the island...when in fact...many of them have nothing back in the outside world to return to. <P> Just a theory...your miles may vary.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 12:46 p.m. CST

    Oh...#10 I left off...

    by Cheif Brody

    Rousseau called the smoke monster a 'security system' because she once captured a hostile in one of her traps and asked him what it was...and he/she possibly told her how to avoid it.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:16 p.m. CST

    possible answer

    by necgray

    I think I know the answer to a couple of things. Given the superspy Sayid and his undercover agent girlfriend, and given that this is a JJ Abrams show, the man who is hunting Benjamin Linus is........ Arvin Sloane!!!! And the island is one giant Rambaldi device!!!! I know, I know, I'm a genius. You can thank me later.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 1:19 p.m. CST

    Xiphos

    by Mundungus

    "blah blah blah you people " is a cliche that reveals someones racism in bad writing, that's why you never hear a politician say it in the real world. It is really all about tone and circumstance which I why I found the statement ridiculous at the time.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:18 p.m. CST

    The Losties are so not like the Others...yet

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Even looking at it from the point of view of the freighter four--these people are going in there with an agenda. They meet the Losties, who tell them flat out why they are suspicious i.e. they have ulterior motives for being on the island and do not have their best interests in mind, and this is the reason why they are being "hostile" to the F4. The Others just starting showing up and fucking with the Losties out of nowhere for their own purposes without trying to explain themselves. Losties are still acting rationally, are still the underdogs, are still the "victims" (though they are fighting back, god bless 'em).

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:28 p.m. CST

    novaman

    by slkboxrman

    well said breakdown of bernards comments, yes ur right, its just impatience..too bad u cant go after SIKK like that...lol...but then again the only thing he wants out of life is to see kate in bondage and shackled.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 2:49 p.m. CST

    MP - BigE and more

    by rbrog77

    Hangover went away pretty fast yesterday. Usually Friday we do the after work thing, I come home for a bit and head back out. I didn't head back out this week...probably for the best.<P> And I'm guilty too. But we were given a way out...a way to not have to deal with it anymore, and I thought it a good idea if we take him up on it.<P> There are some really interesting theories posted this week. Now that we have some sort of confirmation of a temporal/time annomoly, we see the "throw away line" about the radio waves being from another time in a different light.<P> But I would caution us about 2 things.<P> 1 - The answer to LOST's mysteries will not go over the average viewers heads. Seems to me we have a pretty smart lot here, and because of that we may be "writing" into it more than they can write into it.<P> 2 - Don't get too pigeoned-holed into not looking at the big picture. We talked about this during the watchback...some of the characters being to single minded to see the big picture. Let's not fall into that same trap.<P> That being said, we know there's the time thing. We don't know if it's constant or relative. We know Hurley and Jack think at some point it was mistake that they left. We know Sayid and Ben are working together after Sayid said he'd sell his soul first. We know that the war that was mentioned/anticipated actually is going on in the future since Sayid was an assassin and apparently so was the German chick. And I'll make the leap that if Sayid is doing this he's doing it for a damned good reason.<P> Throughout history men on the side of "good" have done terrible things. The hard thing is determining which side is the good side until you can look back and judge.<P> So maybe it's time to start cutting that bugged eyed lying sack of shit some slack.<P> Then again, maybe not...

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:08 p.m. CST

    hangover

    by Maximus Prime

    well I am dying today....drank £90 (about $180) worth of guinness and rum last night at the charity gig I was playing at and partied with an unbelievable blond til 5 this morning..... I am now in tatters,near dead...hardly move...gotta love the charity events..haha

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:10 p.m. CST

    Name dropping

    by Thunderbolt Ross

    It makes sense for the creators of the show to talk about books and films that they've seen and read. #1 People more likely than not ASK THEM about their influences, and #2 They are running the show, so it's interesting to know where they are coming from. It's not the same as name-dropping in a doomed attempt to lend your opinions credibility. I'm not saying they're not credible, just that they're not more credible than anyone else's just cause you read this that or the other thing.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:20 p.m. CST

    Cholera...

    by Cheif Brody

    I'm not saying the "Losties" are the "baddies" now...they have every right to want to leave the island...or STAY in some of their cases. <P> I'm just comparing them to the "hostiles" who may have been abused by the Dharma folk...and were once the "underdogs" themselves. I'm just saying...the cycle keeps repeating itself. <P> The Dharmites thought they were "the good guys"...got purged by the hostiles...who became "the good guys"...and now that the Losties have the upper hand (it would appear)...THEY are trying to become "the good guys" by killing off those how kidnapped and murdered them...and possibly getting of that godforsaken rock. <P> But Ben is trying to keep them there...just as he did when he got the hostiles it was better to stay on the island after the purge. <P> He's trying to convince them that "they have work to do".

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:22 p.m. CST

    Sorry for the missing words...

    by Cheif Brody

    Typing fast as I'm late for an appointment! Throw an "off" and a "to" in there somewhere and it should make sense.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:30 p.m. CST

    So as long as we are spouting thoeries...

    by rbrog77

    Ben "takes orders" from Jacob who can move his cabin who calls on you rather than you visiting but who apparently had something to tell Hurley.<P> I'm going to take a leap here and compare the hostiles/others to the templar knights. They are there to protect Jacob and his secrets.<P> I know we don't know this for sure yet, but I'm going with the time is slower on the island exponetially rather than there's a 31 minute constant difference. That would mean after 100 days they would have been there 8+ years.<P> That would mean a middle aged man on the island could have lived a couple of thousand years in outside world time.<P> So could we be dealing with a DaVinci Code type thing here? Could Jacob be a direct descendant, or maybe even the son of God himself. Or maybe the incident was an opening of a portal to the afterlife and the others are there to protect the secrets of God...who is now trapped by Ben somehow while Ben uses him to his advantage.<P> Remember, even though men on the side of "good" have done terrible things, bad men did things for what they thought was the greater good...and still had good men follow them in a single minded manner.<P> So how does that apply to our story?<P> I read a book last year called Another Roadside Attraction. It dealt with the 2nd coming...except the 2nd coming was finding his dead body in the vatican and getting it out and to a roadside hot dog stand/petting zoo. If you had the body what would you do?<P> Would you exploit it? Would you hold it up to the world to prove religion/christianity a lie? If you did, would people believe you, hunt you and it down, castigate you, kill you? And what would bringing the truth to light accomplish? As the haters here prove, no matter what you say to some people they keep on believing what they want.<P> I'll not tell you the book's answer. But I will tell you two things I think would happen if Jesus was around today.<P> 1 - He'd turn the tables over in the temples...especially the temples of govt.<P> 2 - They'd crucify him.<P> So that's my latest theory. Dharma found something they weren't supposed to find. A child born of the island (Ben) led the protectors of this finding against Dharma. That same child of the island became the lead protector and ended up misusing his power. While Ben was using the power to get a Dr. to help him, the rest of the losties...the ones of faith...were placed on the plane by the true protectors who have grown weary of Ben. The finding now calls upon the losties of faith to Help Me. And now there is a war between true faith, false faith, and science.<P> That wouldn't go over the average viewers heads, would it?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 3:42 p.m. CST

    Flashbacks I'm waiting to see..

    by SlickyVonBoner

    The french chick coming to the island and the supposed 'sickness' her crew had. Richard's flashback, how did he get to the island? Was he on the Black Rock? If Patchy isn't dead, which I hope he isn't, I'd like to see his story.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 4:24 p.m. CST

    Funeral Neighborhood

    by wellaware1

    Surely the creators wanted to throw us off when they showed the neighborhood the funeral was held in. It could be anyone in that coffin. It could even be a veterenarian who practiced in the neighborhood. I also think the "he" K8 refers to in looking glass is her son. She may have just left the island so she would not lose the baby. Wasn't there some hints to k8 being pregnant? And wouldn't it be cool if Richard had four toes.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:07 p.m. CST

    Kate's 'he'

    by maxwell's hammer

    As I already know who the 'he' is, I think those of you who haven't read that spoiler will find it a little bit interesting.<BR> <BR> And yes, I assume I'm better than you all because I a)read some spoilers you haven't, b)read high brow literature such as 'War & Peace' and 'Les Miserables', and c)I actually wrote 'The Sound and the Fury'.<BR> <BR> Top that, Sick Fixx!!<BR> <BR> Also, based on what we've seen on this show, there is no evidence that there is any time dilation (with the one glaring exception of Walt's growth). With all the communication that goes on between the island and the real world, and the fact that the Ocean 6 and others have traveled back and forth between the two without any apparent ageing issues, I think the Time Delay Theory is the one that actually holds water.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:20 p.m. CST

    by bkpark1

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:38 p.m. CST

    Makes sense, Chief Brody

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:41 p.m. CST

    time theory... it's not the island, but the barrier

    by turketron

    The time weirdness might not be a property of the island, but of whatever barrier/shield/field that keeps the island hidden. Time spent in the barrier and not on either side of it is probably accelerated. Otherwise, as someone else said, why doesn't Faraday just ask the operator what time it is on her end?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:52 p.m. CST

    Whoa - crazy Lost dream!

    by theBigE

    Just woke up from a wonderful 3 hour Sunday afternoon nap. Crazy Lost dreams! I dreamt I was watching episode 4 early, and weird stuff was going down. The Losties dug up a dead body that was mainly a brain and a skull, and Jacob started talking through it. Turned out he was an evil demon, and the Losties were doomed to do his bidding. Then people started flying. So my question is ... what did I take yesterday that caused this? Any dream analyzers out there want to tell me what's going on?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:52 p.m. CST

    rbrog re: jacob

    by necgray

    I don't know as there's any proof for this, but I've enjoyed thinking (not a theory, just a thought) that Jacob is a fallen angel. I just like the idea that an angel's real, physical presence on earth would cause a lot more horrible chaos than cutesy TV shows and movies would lead us to believe. It's actually one of the things that annoys me about the presence of angels in TV/movies. If proof of God and/or Heaven actually came into your presence, wouldn't that absolutely horrify you? Real, physical, living proof of Christian dogma? It should be terrifying! It should cause insanity! And why not mess with time and bring back spirits with it and heal the sick/wounded? Again, not a real theory that I would espouse as an answer to the enigma of Lost, just a fun little nugget.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 5:57 p.m. CST

    interesting thought indeed necgray. and there's always...

    by turketron

    God loves you as he loved Jacob. (from the screen in room 23 when Kate and Sawyer rescued Carl from the Others).

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:07 p.m. CST

    I'm down with the angel theory

    by theBigE

    There could definitely be some spiritual / celestial happenings at work on the Lost island.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:08 p.m. CST

    "loved"

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    past tense. Lucifer! By the way I always thought Lucifer was a cool name. It's too bad people would give me the stink eye if I named my kid that.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:14 p.m. CST

    Fallen angel is good

    by rbrog77

    Nice spin on my theory. So we would now have faith in a fallen angel versus faith in god versus science.<P> Nice...

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:25 p.m. CST

    Nice pa

    by rbrog77

    Nice deleted scene.<P> I was just thinking about the show with my theory, The phrase "he works in mysterious ways" might go along way to explaining why all answers are not immediately known.<P> If it does take on a more religious tone, I hope it goes dark.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 6:48 p.m. CST

    "one of the larger scarier breeds of fighting dog."

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Lucifer the Pit Bull.<p>Awe. Some.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 7:43 p.m. CST

    Interesting Deleted scene

    by theBigE

    So that means Miles is aware of sub-conscious frequencies and types of waves, not just spirits?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 8:02 p.m. CST

    Xiphos.... dude

    by Mundungus

    I thought my last post spelled it out that it wasn't serious post. Relax, really. It was humor. And yes it was about parsing words and going to ridiculous lengthts to take a shot at someone, especially someone that wears such a bright target. I'm pretty sure that sickfix and 90% of other readers understood it was in jest, whether or not they found any humor there. Can we drop this now?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 8:38 p.m. CST

    please, let it not be some religious thing

    by samsquanch

    That would be about as cool an ending as Jack suddenly waking up next to his wife and saying "I just had the craziest dream..." <p> I call bullshit on any and all angel/god/demon/garden of eden/limbo bullshit. it's not 'heavy' or 'badass', it's childish and silly. We're headed for some really neat science fiction, why ruin it with fairytales?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:02 p.m. CST

    Xiphos.... Humor

    by Mundungus

    Two cannibals are eating a clown and one says to the other,"Does this taste funny to You?" <p> Better?

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:05 p.m. CST

    A Deep Thought about Humor

    by Mundungus

    To a shark, the funniest thing in the world must be a seal trying to swim away after its been bit, because - "Just where does he think he's going?"

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    watched this episode 5 times

    by krycek08

    and it is really not that good. the flash forward was extremely more interesting than the island story. Frank didn't even require Sayid to get Charlote until Sayid offered. crappy writing.....

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 9:14 p.m. CST

    On topic...

    by Mundungus

    My biggest question about lLost this season is how long are the Six going to be off the island and how and when are they going to tell parralel stories about the oceanic six and the those that remained on the island. What's going to be the terrible situation for the the ones left behind that has Jack and Hurly in a tizzy? Sounds like they will be worse off then they are presently some how.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 10:52 p.m. CST

    I am also with you gotlik, samsquatch

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    It would be lame.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 11:07 p.m. CST

    The Faith thing will happen

    by theBigE

    I don't see how it will be any more fantastic if there are angels/demons on the island than it would be if there is time travel / worm holes / parallel universes to explain the mysteries of the island. We've already got ghosts and and smoke monsters - and a religious explanation will be a disappointment for some of you? Get ready for disappointment, folks. As long as it's not a Deus ex Machanica solution.

  • Feb. 17, 2008, 11:57 p.m. CST

    Oh, God.

    by samsquanch

    Gotilk, thanks for the support, and lending a diplomatic tone. theBigE: If your argument was truly sound, why the hell wouldn't it be just as ok with you if it wasn't a judeo-christian religious angle? What if there were a few hindu gods in there pulling the strings? What if it was all based on Zoroastrianism? Or some aboriginal myth? Because to me, and probably most people that watch the show, to have it be about angels or eden would be about as believable as it being about the North Pole, and the Others are a sect of rebellious elves, Jacob is Santa Claus, and Ben is the leader of the Elf resistance or some shit. See my point? That would FUCKING RUIN IT. And to answer your question- I do believe that wormholes are more likely to exist than angels. IMHO.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 12:43 a.m. CST

    Missing the point, guys

    by theBigE

    They've already put fantastical elements in the show - ghosts, time anamolies, the personification (or anthromorphization, if that's the correct term) of the "island" itself, prophetic dreams, miracles, etc... If you're expecting the writers of the show to explain it all through a completely scientific explanations - to me, that is as disappointing as having it being simply explained as it being Eden or Heaven or Purgatory, and the Hostiles are angels or demons. <p> Samsquanch, you sound downright hostile to the possibility that it might end up that way - with any type of religious explanation. Why so negative? Remember, the show is a work of FICTION! I'm just saying, the writers have already filled it with fantastic events and numerous Judeo-Christian references and names (Jacob, Christian Shephard, it goes on and on..). So why would you be surprised if part of the whole mystery of the Island has that sort of element as part of the answer?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 12:54 a.m. CST

    And Samsquanch

    by theBigE

    I'm not trying to pick a fight at all here, I'm just saying that the religious element is there already. The writers have put it there. That's why I'd be disappointed if that is not touched on when we get to the bottom of the mystery - if all is ever truly revealed. I'm not familiar enough with Zoroastrianism and aboriginal myth to know if the writers have put those elements into the show. Have they? Because if they have, then I would expect them to be part of the ultimate answers and solution to the Island also! <p> By the way, I'd like to hear some of this evidence for wormholes existing here on Earth, please. Controlled by the magnetic field of a magical island. With a ghost in a moving cabin.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 12:58 a.m. CST

    Angels and Wormholes..I am so stealing that

    by MacFaux

    Science fiction represents the modern heresy and the cutting edge of speculative imagination as it grapples with Mysterious Time---linear or non-linear time.<br><br> -Frank Herbert

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 1:30 a.m. CST

    theBigE knows.

    by MacFaux

    IMHO, one of the better scenes in the whole ding dang series was the moment of peace Sayid had while praying before he closed Naomi's eyes...it felt almost Desmond flashes before your eyes in its certainty..<br><br> That typed.."Science Fiction is speculative fiction in which the author takes as his first postulate the real world as we know it, including all established facts and natural laws. The result can be extremely fantastic in content, but it is not fantasy; it is legitimate--and often very tightly reasoned--speculation about the possibilities of the real world. This category excludes rocket ships that make U-turns, serpent men of Neptune that lust after human maidens, and stories by authors who flunked their Boy Scout merit badge tests in descriptive astronomy."<br><br> -Robert A. Heinlein<br><br> Religion is Science Fiction and vice versa...and for those some such amateur math-a-magicians trying to sum the sounding rocket..don't jump to calculus..start with the algebra: Rate=Distance/Time and Time=Distance/Rate..ya gotsta know the variables. Flight time was 27 seconds. Distance was under 100km. The average SR goes about 750 meters per sec. Calc away.<br><br> The island had to catch up to rocket..whether that was a function of time or distance is unknown. But wouldn't that island be the most ultimate thing in the history of ultimate things if it gave one a 31 minute head start on the world. I would have bet the proverbial family farm on halftime prop of the NY Football Gints and the under. Someone could get rich and powerful, Keyser Soze style, like hmmm, Ben...sheesh, 3 episodes, 4000 posts and not one mention of the Orchid and the magical duality of bunnies that must not touch. WTF. Marvin Candle is not pleased.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:43 a.m. CST

    "clock rocket"...

    by BigTexas42

    made dr. pepper come out of my nose.<P><P>mini-theory:the opening scene from "the economist" comes after the events of the rest of the flash forward. That is why the golfing guy got so nervous when Sayid said who he was - because he knows Sayid was coming for him. Eh? Not bad considering the hangover.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:55 a.m. CST

    oh no, the WORST sf religious experience

    by necgray

    Far and away the single event in television history that most made me hate the showrunner or writer or producer or WHOEVER was responsible: the series finale of Quantum Leap. I HATED that finale. That was the biggest steaming pile of horseshit EVER. And not because it ended up being about "God", but because it ended up being ONLY about "God". Sam's science had nothing to do with it. And I called bullshit on that ending. So yeah, if Lost turns out to be completely judeo-christian based in the end, I'd be pretty pissed. But if it was a total science atheism suck-off, I'd be equally pissed. I prefer a "nobody has the answers, so shut the fuck up" approach to that little schoolyard scuffle.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 6:15 a.m. CST

    i think they'll kill off faraday soon

    by couP

    he was meant to point us in the right direction with this time dilation thing, but if he hangs around for much longer, I think he'll give too much away. Most likely Ben will kill him when he hears him mention something in passing.<br /><br /> Heh, still remember the "only fools are enslaved by time and space", all coming together now.<br /><br /> was there any other mention of faraday in his flashback being attented to by a "care taker" and not his wife. When I originally saw the ep, I thought his was a flash forward, but it didn't make much sense after seeing the other three.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 6:30 a.m. CST

    Re: "God loves you as he loved Jacob"

    by couP

    I think ben put together that fun video to brainwash everyone into thinking that HE is now the most powerful only the island and knows what's going on as jacob is talking to him, even though he is dead according to ben, but I think that ben has somehow trapped jacob, which i'm sure many have said, and is using the island for.<br /><br /> I just want to know how jacob/smokey are connected. with that cabin moving around, it's like the cabin WAS smokey and jacob was inside it, but then having hurley see christian shepherd just confused the heck outta me. had hurley seen jack's dad before then, and did he even recognise him?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 7:22 a.m. CST

    My only question re 4.3 is:

    by newc0253

    if Jacob's cabin moves, how come the circle of sand/ash/whatever doesn't?<p> if the cabin appears at multiple locations, does that mean there are multiple circles dotted round the jungle?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 7:31 a.m. CST

    Science and religion

    by rbrog77

    First, can I stir it or what?<P> Even considering all I said about religion and LOST last night, there is still a scientific (or scifi) element to the show. Smokie. Time. Electromagnitism. Add to that they sent from the freighter an anthropologist, a physiscist, and a paranormal ghostbuster type (okay, so that last one may be a bit of a scientific stretch). <P> I'm not sure I emphasized what I meant about the battle, though. I believe, and I think it's been indicated in the show, a war is coming...maybe a final battle type war. The waring factions will be faith and science. But within those factions there will be splinters. <P> Faith splinters. That's why there are so many religions in the world. What I believe you may think heretical. But does not science also splinter. Did it not take Darwin decades to have his theory taught? Part of the reason was religion, part was science wanting more evidence. Same with astronomers. <P> IN a republican primary here in the states CNN asked if anyone in the debate did not believe in evolution. I believe about 1/3 of the candidates rasied their hands. <P> Wait, rb, what does that have to do with science and religion?<P> Science has been misused by governments throughout time. Hitler did it. The US did it with black men and syphillis. Even today, though it seems the science behind stem cell research and climate change is sound, factions of the government spin the findings or restate and/or hide evidence that doesn't fit their agenda.<P> So if the war theory is correct, and if the splinters thing is followed, might not the govt. be in the middle of everything? Pulling strings. Using and misusing both science and religion to their advantage.<P> So if you saw the adverts for a movie saying a battle wages, and the final battle of a war that's been waged for centuries is about to begin. And that war had scifi elements in it, religious elements in it, and govternmental forces in it too, would you be jazzed to see it?<P> Now, someone tell me again how long the pitch to ABC execs was.<P> So I may like to stir it, but you gotta see my reasoning is usually preety sound. I may be totally off base with this...hmmmm...analysis. But at least to me, looking at the big picture, this makes sense.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:02 a.m. CST

    I have no idea how it will end

    by theBigE

    I'm just confident (I have faith?) that the island can't be explained with either a 100% scientific or 100% supernatural explanation. Either extreme would be extremely disappointing to most viewers, I'd assume.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:07 a.m. CST

    couP - no news about the caretaker

    by theBigE

    I haven't seen any other mention of Daniel's caretaker, other than what the "enhanced" episode said. Someone upthread speculated it might be Elsa, but there was no noticable accent that I detected. So I doubt it. <p> I love the theory that Sayid's shooting on the golf course was chronologically AFTER the Berlin/Elsa incident. That explains Mr. Avalon's concern when Sayid identifies himself.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:09 a.m. CST

    Love the pitch, gotilk!

    by theBigE

    Except, in reality, I thought it was ABC that went to JJ Abrams and said "give us a Pilot for a tv show about people surviving on a island." And that was pretty much it.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:17 a.m. CST

    Another "clock rocket" thought

    by theBigE

    I mentioned earlier that I teach Calculus - not to be snooty or try to brag like some posters/trolls, just to identify that I should have enough of a math background to figure out the time differential, if it is constant. But MacFaux correctly pointed out that only Algebra is needed to decipher it. Well, that's assuming everything is linear and solved with ratios, and that there are no acceleration/deceleration factors. It's driving me nuts that the clock time was AHEAD on the clock rocket rather than BEHIND. I think most theories of time travel in space would say that if you were in a rocket traveling faster than the speed of light, and you had a watch on, that watch would appear to tick normally on you wrist. Seconds would appear to be seconds. But when you returned to Earth, and normal time, everyone else's watches would be ahead of yours. You would through time, relative to the rest of the universe. So I was expecting the rocket time to be behind the Island, not vice-versa. That means something else is a factor here.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:23 a.m. CST

    Well...There's a strange little non-throwaway line...

    by micturatingbenjamin

    In the episode 'Not In Portland' where the ageless stranger says "You'll be amazed how time flies on the island." to Juliette.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 9:27 a.m. CST

    To coin a line from Animal House, THIS IS GREAT!!

    by rbrog77

    Someone way way above said talkbacks were supposed to be about arguing. Moriarity praised the S# finale talkback becasue it was what talkbacks were meant to be...a discussion of the topic at hand...not an virtual arguement playground.<P> Dark, I'd say it might be all 3. In discussing LOST one day with a coworker he made the point that American TV writers aren't that smart. So maybe this is stupid to think they could "provoke" such discussion as this talkback has eveolved into. Maybe it's insanity that we could pull so many aspects of society/history/science and religion into a discussion about a lowly TV show. Or maybe...just maybe...the writers tricked us into being smart. Into using our brains. Into doing research. Into reading. Into thinking. Into talking about this type of stuff in public. Maybe we are onto something after all...whether it actually be what the show's about or not.<P> Or I could just be stirring the pot to see what boils.<P> ;->

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 9:28 a.m. CST

    Oh, forgot to mention

    by rbrog77

    Dark - loved that post.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 10:28 a.m. CST

    ooh

    by redfishbluefish

    now this is getting very, very interesting....... who knew that ain't it cool-er's were philosopher's, too? this is why i find science fiction fascinating. it's all about ideas and possibilities and taking the viewer/reader on a journey of thought. keep it going. i am thoroughly enjoying this read.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 10:35 a.m. CST

    Yes - why I love the show too

    by theBigE

    Good stuff, dark. Keep stirring, rb!

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 12:40 p.m. CST

    I'm sure I will BigE

    by rbrog77

    Just waiting on node, pa, MP, CV, Cheif, et al to chime in. Hell, it might even be interesting to get DarthMrB's opinion...or even see if this grabs the attention of the sick one.<P> Just so everyone knows, I have no agenda in this discussion. I'm at best an agnostic and at worst an atheist...or did I get that backwards. But religion has always facinated me. And we have to admit, as we have, there are religious aspects to this show.<P> I don't know if this is what they are planning anymore than we know what changed Sayid's mind about trusting Ben...if he indeed does. But even if they aren't, this sure was/is an interesting field excursion, huh?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 1:10 p.m. CST

    Creepy Barefoot Others?

    by Tman2626

    I may have missed the boat on this but was it ever addressed that the others were intially shown as creepy whispering people walking barefoot in the woods who killed people with a boomerang I believe??? Was it all of a sudden just decided they would be normal people living in a community on the island without ever address the prior incarnation? <br>Love the show but that is something that has always bothered me.</br>

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 1:49 p.m. CST

    Tman...That's the whole issue...

    by Cheif Brody

    Why didn't Ben, Ethan, Mr. Friendly and Goodwin just waltz up to the 815 survivors with their button down shirts and Dharma GAP slacks...and reach out...shake their hands...and say.."Welcome, ya'll...looks like you had a bit of a crash there. We live on this island...we have food, electricity...and running water. Let's go back to our barracks so we can call someone to alert them your plane crashed, Ok?...You guys like hamburgers?"... <P> This is what NORMAL people would do...God loving peaceful people would offer out their hands in friendship and trust... <P> Not running around in raggedy clothes and fake beards barefoot...or sending in a team to blend in with the Losties and kidnap and murder these poor crash victims. <P> Which is why I think Jacob being some kind of "angel" is poppycock. No doubt LOST has had allusions to faith, religion and a 'higher power'....and may even carry those themes even further before it's all over... <P> But if Ben is getting his orders to kill and kidnap from Jacob...I don't think he could possibly be of devine descent...even if he's a "fallen" one. <P> Sorry gang...I'm a man of science. And Jacobs strange powers, while on the mystical and magical side right now...WILL all be explained by fucked up Dharma super science gone horribly wrong. Science aided by the island's magnetic anomolies, that would have otherwise never been discovered.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2 p.m. CST

    the reason this show's finale will disappoint everyone is...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...that you all come up with these wierd theories that aren't in any way backed up by anything on the show. Then, when things get revealed, it has nothing to do with anything you dreamed up, thereby disappointing you.<BR> <BR> I enjoy the hell out of this show, and its mostly because I accept it for the mystery it is. I enjoy speculation, but "Michael is the Mole", "Parallel Universe!", "Ben is a time traveler!" are all inane ideas that are being given weight by way too many people.<BR> <BR> Just sit back and chill and let things unfold. All will be revealed.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:10 p.m. CST

    pictures on the wall

    by maxwell's hammer

    Actually, most of those pictures are of a young Alex (Ben's adopted daughter).

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:13 p.m. CST

    The end of Lost

    by Maximus Prime

    should ahve an answer taht both sastisfies the scientific and religous fans...I dont think we are going to get one clear cut thats it answer..that would be no fun...<p>with so much time being invested into the man of science and man of faith I think with all teh answers we have to get they will be split between religion and science..there is no point offering a wide range of questions and answering them all the same...<p> give Smokie a scientific answer and give Jacob a religous answer and I'll be happy...then make some answers shocking and some emotional and some obvious..mix her up

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:20 p.m. CST

    Bens picture

    by Maximus Prime

    The picture Miles has of Ben seems familiar...does anyone remember the Locke sweat tent..and Ben was working for Oceanic airlines and doing the securtiy check...can we get anymore relevance out of this?? also think he was wearin the same clothes as in the vision...I know timeline suggests that Ben was finding out he had cancer and was on the Isalnd the day of the crash but it seems odd if it is the same clothing...I have lent out my season 3 so if anyone has it check to see if im right or well off the mark.......

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 2:43 p.m. CST

    Since we are speculating

    by rbrog77

    The end will be...I wrote a great big long thing here about the war between science and faith...and then deleted it. Truth is, they could go science, faith, myticism, a combo of any of it...whatever. I'm along for the ride. <P> But it has to be said that part of the ride is also how this show, more maybe than any other show ever, makes our brains work.<P> So while I'm watching, I'm going to think about science, religion, fantasy and the big picture...and probably about 1000 other things they decide to throw at us.<P> No way are American writers are that smart, becuase their audience(s) can't be.<P> ...can we?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 3:44 p.m. CST

    another fine quote from this ep

    by Maniaq

    "what's with the swing set - you guys have Day Care??" <p><p> btw CG - Lucifer, bringer of the light, illuminator... call your kid Luke, or Lucas or Lucius or just plain Luc and it's pretty much the same thing - and if it's a girl, call her Lucy...

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 3:47 p.m. CST

    btw those that believe nobody ages on the island

    by Maniaq

    Rousseau looks pretty damn AGED to me - and her daughter is supposed to be 16 right, not 125? <p> could all this "not aging" speculation simply be a matter of BAD WIGS - Ben's wig was TERRIBLE!

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 4:30 p.m. CST

    Dr. Uwe Boll's FARCRY trailer online

    by Vesuvio

    http://tinyurl.com/2oh286

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 4:44 p.m. CST

    This show is starting to get that X-Files vibe

    by ArcadianDS

    Remember the X-Files where each season promised to give you answers to the big mysterious alien conspiracy, and instead of actually doing that, they simply gave you brand new mysteries in their place? I remember one season ender that specifically said, 'all your questions will be answers' and instead of answers, they give us black eye-tar from Russia.<p> Lost seems to want to move on from the smoke monster, the loud, tree smashing monster (presuming that smoke can't make loud chain noises and topple huge trees), and just make us content by introducing new and fresh mysteries. What happened to Mike and Walt? Why was Walt special? How did a boat get stuck in the MIDDLE of an island?<p> Its just wearing me out that the list of mysteries is fastly approaching overwhelming levels. I cannot even remember the questions I was asking after Season One - there are so many new questions now.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 5:10 p.m. CST

    Maniaq...The only person NOT aging...

    by Cheif Brody

    at regular speed Is Richard Alpert. He looked exactly the same age (albeit with crazy Tarzan hair) when Ben was 12...as he does on the island today. That's why I think he was experimented on in the "life extention project"...the very one that Joop was involved in....and the same reason Alvar Hanso is reportedly 112 years old but looks like a man in his early 60's. <P> Alex could pass for 16 I believe, even though the actress portraying her is 20. I can't wait to see Rousseau's flashback...simply cuz I wanna see the makeover Mira Furlan gets to "pretty her up" for the scenes prior to crashing on the island.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 5:50 p.m. CST

    not remembering questions

    by Maximus Prime

    means there are bigger more important questions since..like this season im wondering who the fuck is after the 815's??...the islands mysteries are being somewhat overshadowed by the off island mysteries....not a bad thing to do in my opinon..absence makes the heart grow fonder...we will yearn so much when they drop an answer in unepectatly I think my underwear may explode

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 5:55 p.m. CST

    Arcadian...Questions after Season 1?

    by Cheif Brody

    Hmmm...What's inside the hatch? <P> What's with all those "whispers" they keep hearing?" <P> Why is there a polar bear on a tropical island? <P> Why is there a cable running out to sea? <P> God...there were so many questions after Season 1...Including...what the hell is that smoke monster thing? <P> SOME have been answered...some have...and, yes, more questions keep piling on...(Did that bird really call out Hurley's name?)...But unlike X-Files...I believe we WILL get satisfactory answers to MOST of these questions. <P> I could care less...actually. I'm just enjoying the ride.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 5:57 p.m. CST

    Sorry..."some have NOT"...

    by Cheif Brody

    was what I was I suppose to type there.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 6:25 p.m. CST

    Weird coincidence!

    by theBigE

    Check out this story from cnn.com. Note the name of the killer! <p> http://tinyurl.com/2854jl

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 6:47 p.m. CST

    unanswered questions...

    by maxwell's hammer

    I think most of the questions fall into two categories: a)those central to the overall mystery of the islnd (The Black Rock, The Smoke Monster, The Numbers, The Manifestations of people and animals, The Deal with Walt), which can't be answered until the show ends; and b)those that help push forward the plot, which have either been answered, or soon will be (who are The Others?, what's in the hatch?, Polar Bears?, etc).<BR> <BR> The only way LOST is comparable to The X-Files is that they were both shows with an intricate overall mystery. The difference is that The X-Files didn't know when the show would end, so they had to keep prolonging the mystery, far beyond when it needed to conclude. The LOST producers specifically negotiated a finite run and a definite end date so they can end the show exactly when it needs to end. That single maneuver persuedes me to give them all the trust for which they ask.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:52 p.m. CST

    BAD WIG

    by Maniaq

    OK so I think we're agreed that Alpert is the only one who *appears* to have not aged so there's no magical mystery time warp that's stopping time on the island or slowing it down or whatever... <p> Now this may be a matter of opinion but I thought Ben's wig for when he was supposed to be younger ("Purge" time) was atrocious but necessary to show that "yes he's the same actor but the character is younger" - now ALL I'M SAYING is maybe the costume dept also made a bad choice of wig for RICHARD ALPERT as a way of saying "yes it's the same actor but the character is younger" in his case, too - and in fact made such a godawful terrible mess of a choice that they got people (who are only too happy to come up with a crazy theory - yes I do mean me too) thinking hey his hair's shorter now but he hasn't aged a day! <p> In other words, Richard Alpert is actually SUPPOSED to have aged just like everyone else and we've all been thrown off by a bad wig - sort of a red herring, of sorts... <p> All I'm sayin

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 8:59 p.m. CST

    re: more stirring

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Sorry 4we18 etc. etc...I don't want to get into a divisive evolution debate talking about a favorite show, which I guess is fortunate because THERE IS NO DEBATE. Not scientifically anyway, in any major sense. We evolved. End of story.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 9:07 p.m. CST

    BigE and Node--is it Calvin or Kelvin?

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    or are you talking about someone else entirely?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 9:13 p.m. CST

    Brody - you like hamburgers?

    by Maniaq

    I think you're right that the Hostile's reaction to the plane crash was.. ahem... less than friendly - and I think it is becoming clear that the reason for this is because the survivors of that crash were likely to - dare I say destined to - bring more people to the island in their wake, only their would-be rescuers would not necessarily be as benevolent as we would all like them to be. <p> Seems to me the antagonism between the Hostiles and the Boatpeople has been going on long before the crash and continues to go on after it - the plane crashed right in the middle of it - and Ben's initial reaction was "observe only"... <p> I think if there was a way for the crash survivors to co-habit the island, that was the preferable option and possibly Jacob's list represented people who were more likely to be happy to stay and not want to be rescued - like children, for example? <p> I must admit I'm kinda leaning towards Jacob being either a literal or more likely a kind of telepresence of someone from the future - but I'll leave him out of this. <P> Point being the Hostiles wanted to keep the crash survivors away from any "rescue" and their paranoia about a freighter that could well have been sitting offshore this entire time (six months now?) has infected the relative newcomers to the island - who are, ironically, just as big a threat to the boatpeople as the hostiles were to them... <p> hmm... infected... sickness? <p> <p> anyway that rocket still baffles - could something that small even carry enough fuel to fly around in circles for an extra half an hour?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 9:20 p.m. CST

    next weeks episode looks interesting

    by zooch

    We get to see Locke's group "play house" as Sawyer put it. We get a Kate flash-forward, so we can find who "he" is she was refering to at the end of last season's finale, and hopefully run into more castaways off the island. Maybe we'll get to see what happens to Sayid and Desmond when they reach the freighter.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 10:19 p.m. CST

    Kate's he ? - Possible Spoiler

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Does anyone think its not a grown up Aaron ? Other sugestions

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 10:23 p.m. CST

    ABC and Lost

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Any theories on how ABC managed to greenlight a decent show like Lost in the first place, instead of the other tripe it keeps producing, Knight Rider for instance. Supernatural or Science related ?

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 11:17 p.m. CST

    Calm down, CG...Calm down...

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    THERE IS NOT A DEBATE SCIENTIFICALLY!!! The only "Debates" are on the how, not the if!<p>I'm sorry. It's just that this happens to be an issue I care deeply about. Agree to disagree, fine. Back to Lost:)

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 11:19 p.m. CST

    That's what you get

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    fer stirrin' the pot.

  • Feb. 18, 2008, 11:37 p.m. CST

    miyamoto

    by slkboxrman

    ummm KNIGHT RIDER is on NBC, not ABC and the premier was pretty decent, if u wanna bash knight rider, theres another talkback for it

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 12:19 a.m. CST

    Miyamoto

    by Ribbons

    Ironically, Lost went through a lot of trials before it got made. Steve McPherson, the president of entertainment now (but not at the time), hated the show so much that he wasn't even allowed to sit in on meetings where Lost's fate was determined because he went nuts whenever he talked about it.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 3:50 a.m. CST

    slkboxrman

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Not so much about knocking Knight Rider, as talking about the general quality of network tv, in my opinion the quality of Lost seems to be closer to some of the Cable Network shows. Smart, character driven, requiring a level of committment by the viewer. And as shown by this talkback and other Lost talkbacks a really intelligent, thought provoking discussion.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 5:49 a.m. CST

    CG - Kelvin/Calvin

    by theBigE

    The character is named Kelvin, according to imdb. The cnn story featured a Calvin. Close enough for a weird coincidence! It's not like the character was named Bob Johnson or Mike Smith - it was a little more obscure.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 6:58 a.m. CST

    ULTIMATE LOST ACTOR SPOTTING!

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    So I was flipping channels yesterday and came across an old Ben Stiller movie from the late 90's. It was called Keeping the Faith, and stars Ben Stiller as a rabbi and Edward Norton as a priest, both fighting over the same girl. Anyway, the two of them go into an electronics store to but a karaoke machine. Guess who the salesperson was. None other than Mr. Miles "I see dead people" Straume! He walks out with this horrible cheesy chinese accent and start doing a bad karaoke cover of Jesse's Girl by Rick Springfield. It was so funny to see him do something so corny, I laughed for over an hour. He had that same bug-eyed expression that he has on Lost. It was great.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:02 a.m. CST

    Lost: the end

    by ChrisVenom

    I think that the note that the show should end on, should be one that satisfies everyone who is apart of the different camps of science and religion. I believe , in the end it will, and we all will be happy with the way it turns out. Religion and science is one of the shows main pillars, the end cant have one without the other.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:06 a.m. CST

    BigE heres something even weirder

    by ChrisVenom

    My dads name is Kelvin and he used to be in the army. He even went to the middle east. And has been to Kuwait and wait for it....Iraq. LOST

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:10 a.m. CST

    And

    by ChrisVenom

    my dad named me Christian, is that weird?

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:18 a.m. CST

    CV - is your last name ... Inman? Or Shephard?

    by theBigE

    If not, Venom is pretty close to Inman.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:53 a.m. CST

    My take on religion/science...

    by Desmondo

    Someone may have already have mentioned this, but I have avoided reading most of the talkbacks because of fear of spoilerage... there just seems to be way too many people that know how the next few episodes pan out. <br /> With regards to religion/science - ultimately these two forces ARE the show.. even Miles/Faraday illustrate it further. <br /> The question is how can this show actually end? So many crackpot theories are based on obscure science - there is no way they could end the show by explaining it all through some stephen hawking equation. Similarly they can't just put it all down to God, or ghosts etc, and leave fans frustrated. Realistically and ending for a show like this has to be poignant, and probably mysterious - maybe not to extremes like Soprano's did though. <br /> Like Chris Venom says above it will satisfy both camps, I suspect it will end in a way that they give both a science explanation and a faith one, and in some ways we are left to choose. If they want Lost to have any replay value they have to leave mystery - we can go back years after the finale and freeze frame our Blu-Rays (or HD-downloads :-) ) and still debate on what is going on - like is it solution A or solution B. <br /> It's a bit like Donnie Darko - you can watch that movie, and argue it is all in his head and he is crazy, or that he actually is time travel. <br /> Just my random thoughts though...

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 9:33 a.m. CST

    Nice Des

    by rbrog77

    Loved your post, man. I agree with most of it, they can't have God/religion be the ultimate answer, nor can they have science be. I even agree that they will give both a science explanation and a faith one, and agree we will probably be left to choose. <P> But I think those issues will not be the end, but the lead up to the end. The end will be the war waging on...that there is no exact answer, faith or science. <P> Think back to Jack on the bridge, at the funeral home and sitting in the midst of maps in his appt. IMHO, he wants to get back to the island because of the casualties the battle is apparently taking....to end the war...to fix things. But this is a battle that cannot be won. No matter how much evidence there is on a topic there will be doubters because they have faith in their beliefs. <P> But that doesn't mean it has to be a somber ending. It could be Jack realizing he can't fix everything. That there are somethings that just must be. Charlie's death. Boone's. Locke searching to find value in his beliefs. Sawyer and Kate...maybe. And maybe in that realization, Jack finds peace in deciding to protect the secrets no one was supposed to know in the first place. Sorry to get all philosopher on you all this morning...or any morning. There's very few things that draw that out in me...a book or movie here and there...but this show keeps the wheels spinning in this noggin of mine.<P> Yours too, I see.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 9:35 a.m. CST

    Nodebert!!

    by rbrog77

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa..........

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 11:51 a.m. CST

    LOL@Nodebert

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 12:46 p.m. CST

    Loving the names..

    by Maximus Prime

    Was thinking of calling my first born 'Maximus Length'..after his dad's large tool...its a crude joke but worth a try to get a laugh

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 12:50 p.m. CST

    I'm pretty sure that Richard Alpert doesn't age, and here's why.

    by Novaman5000

    Ben says to Richard: "You remember birthdays, don't you richard?" <p> That's something you'd say to someone who lived so long, birthdays began to have less significance. It wasn't a bad makeup job, Richard was supposed to look the same age, just with a different hairstyle.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 1:08 p.m. CST

    The secret behind Richard's youth

    by ArcadianDS

    under-eye man-mascara tattoos. They make you dark and young for all of eternity.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 1:17 p.m. CST

    Is it christmas day

    by Maximus Prime

    on the Isannd yet...counting from a normal non time fucked up timeline...I remember season 3 ending on the 22 of December or something like that...pa your the man to answer this one

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 1:21 p.m. CST

    Just to throw gas on the flame

    by rbrog77

    From MSNBC.com - A Gallup poll released in June said America is about evenly split over whether evolution is true, despite decades of overwhelming scientific evidence that it is.<P> Like I said, no matter how much proof you have on some things, people will believe what they want to.<P> Go figure. Entire article is here.<P> http://tinyurl.com/2lkc9r

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:07 p.m. CST

    A note on DI

    by thekylegassproject

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:07 p.m. CST

    a note DI

    by thekylegassproject

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:08 p.m. CST

    GODDAMMIT

    by thekylegassproject

    SORRY bout those two. let me see if i can get this out with the proper subject line. jesus haha

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:21 p.m. CST

    OK. A note on the DI in relation to Cerberus the Smoke Monster

    by thekylegassproject

    I still read theories (one I read in this TB above) that suggest Cerberus the Friendly Smoke Monster is a function of the island created by the DI. I think the DI knew only how to control it with the sonar fence. Ben was working as a DI man for years before the purge and would have some how found out what Cerberus was if any of them knew, but they didn't. So when he was asked he replied he didn't know honestly. Neither did Juliet. You see, in the intitial orientation film you see back in season two, you are put under the impression that the DeGroots had the idea of the island and Hanso funded it. But I have a small theory that Hanso approached the DeGroots about the Island. An Island he knew to have mystical properties because somehow (don't know how yet) word was passed down through his (Hanso's) family of his great grandfather"s time spent there when he crashed on the Black Rock (somehow he was able tell his son, Alvar's father about his time there). In summation, Hanso knew about the Island and what it was before the DeGroots ever set up camp there. Hanso and Degroots set up the DI under the guise of a free scientific research compound, but really they were trying to crack the mysteries of the island. The first one they cracked was how to control this black smoke anamoly that existed there BEFORE they ever got there.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:29 p.m. CST

    a small edit.

    by thekylegassproject

    juliet wouldn't have known in any case. so that's irrelevant

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 2:55 p.m. CST

    Scary and funny, node

    by rbrog77

    In that order on your last posts. Loved the Christmas one.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 3:37 p.m. CST

    Kyle Gass...

    by Cheif Brody

    Having a hard time believeing that Smokie is anything but "man made". Ben lied when he was asked what it was...as he's prone to do. I believe Juliette may not know what it is...But Ben certainly does.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:08 p.m. CST

    1000 in a week?

    by theBigE

    pa - you shoot for the stars! If we had done 1000 per week in room 23, we'd have had 30000 posts - before the sky turned purple. Ah, memories. I think gotilk's going to get 10000 on Journeyman. <p> OT - what is the origin of the name Zenas? Greek?

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:11 p.m. CST

    Best way to get 1000

    by theBigE

    Let's get the old evolution debate going! Just kidding. We almost had a riot started with the very possibility of a religious explanation for Jacob. I always find it humorous when the anti-religion crowd is more dogmatic than the pro-religion crowd. Which is frequent.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:13 p.m. CST

    4We8have15to...

    by Novaman5000

    I live in the Valley, have for about a year and a half after moving here from the East Coast. I honestly don't know the sights of the city that well, but have you checked out the Los Angeles County Museum of Art (LACMA)? What about the Grove? They have a pretty cool farmer's market, and it's a nice shopping area in general. Universal Studios / Citywalk is a fun (expensive) place to take the family. I don't have kids myself but you could go there, or the LA zoo... Sorry I don't know more... I'll try to think of others.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 7:23 p.m. CST

    Ben's not lying about not knowing about smokey.

    by Novaman5000

    I think it was a very high level dharma experiment that only the upper echelons knew about before the purge.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 9:29 p.m. CST

    theBigE, I can help us get to 1000

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    The difference between the dogmatism of the anti-religion crowd vs. dogmatism of the pro-religion crowd is that anti-religion crowd is right. Anything to help the 1000 post cause. Now,<p>Flame war in 5...4...3...

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 9:38 p.m. CST

    I feel like it's the Cuban Missile Crisis

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    I can feel the tension building as both sides feel the urge to push the button, as we edge closer to the Religion/Evolution Debate--the most destructive subject of internet flame wars.<p>Hold the line, fellow talkbackers! Don't give in! Peace in Our Time! Peace in our Lost Talkback!<p>By the way, as a "man of science", I am more a fan of the "men of faith" in Lost and find them more compelling. I agree with gotlik entirely.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 9:51 p.m. CST

    smokey & Ben

    by maxwell's hammer

    You have to remember, Ben was pretty low on the Dharma totem poll, and only came to prominence on the island after he helped kill them all. So its reasonable that he knows OF some of Dharma's goings-on, but not about stuff like The Smoke Monster.<BR> <BR> Although come to think of it, who knows how much he could have learned about Dharma reading all those manuals in the Flame Station that Locke blowed up.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 10:31 p.m. CST

    Am an Athesist but prefer the Religious take

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    Well I think I would describe myself as a Secular Humanist rather than an athesist. Anyway think the religious take involves more mystery and interest for me. From a story point of view most religions, whether they be the old one like Norse or Egyptian or the new ones like Christianity or Islam, have a huge amount of characters and mythology to them. They are the stories that fascinate us on a grand scale, and in many cases have had thousands of years of rewrites.

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 10:37 p.m. CST

    Religion and Science

    by Miyamoto_Musashi

    And further to my last post, like a Babylon 5 (amongst other Sci-fi)view of religion, as far as these stories go. What we perceive as God(s) is(are)just older more technologically advanced aliens. For those who havent seen Babylon 5 - strongly recommend season 2-4

  • Feb. 19, 2008, 11:41 p.m. CST

    I had an idea that the flashforwards

    by CherryValance

    might actually have involved time travel into the past. It didn't totally work out but some of the stuff with Sayid being an assassin just didn't seem current or futuristic. Like the styles of clothing/hair/etc. seemed slightly dated so I thought that perhaps in the future after the Oceanic 6 make it back to civilization, Ben gets Sayid to travel back in time with him to try to prevent the crash of flight 815.</p> My big question at the end of "the Economist" was why in the world would Sayid ever agree to work with Ben. Then I was thinking about all those passports and clothes in that room and I started to think that maybe Ben was using them to travel back and forth in time to manipulate things. Ben didn't want the losties on the island. So if he could go back in time and maybe kill the people (Dharma? Widmore? Mittelos?) who orchestrated the crash (assuming it was orchestrated) it would never have happened. That would appeal to Sayid because then Shannon wouldn't die. So that seemed like a good motive for Sayid joining up with Ben and it would also save all the other losties. So Sayid would save his chick and be a hero (at least he'd know he was). She'd go back to not being his chick and never having heard of him but still. </p> Like I said that theory didn't really work. But I still can't help thinking that something wasn't right about that flashforward. I mean once they can time travel, if that's what the purple sky heralded, then they could go bananas with it. And how could a control freak like Ben not use it? I don't know. I think that episode was full of things we can't even recognize yet.</p> One thing about Miles though. His power is talking to the dead. He didn't need to sense whether the pylons were on or not. One of the numerous dead people walking around the island could have just told him.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:37 a.m. CST

    fuck evolution...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...(which I fully believe in, btw)...<BR> <BR> If you want controversy, keep bringing up time-travel as if that has anything to do with LOST. I'm gonna bust a cap in the ass of the next person who talks about time travel in a sincere manner.<BR> <BR> Actually, i'm not really the cap-busting type. But I might give you a mean look from across the room. But only from far enough away that you probably wouldn't notice me.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:58 a.m. CST

    Third option

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Relience.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:17 a.m. CST

    Time Travelers

    by Mundungus

    I like how the guys from Dethclok learned to time travel. They put paper bags over their heads and discovered when they took them off they had moved forward in time. Of course the only went 1x the speed of time, but they still thought it was an accomplishment.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:19 a.m. CST

    Time travel doesn't exist and here's why

    by 'Cholera's Ghost

    Time doesn't exist. Not really.<p>Think about it.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:32 a.m. CST

    I hate to hijack but....

    by SlickyVonBoner

    Lost is my favorite show, but speaking of time-travel... why isn't there a Terminator talkback? That show is really starting to kick some ass. In 7 days theres only 6 new topics in the coaxial section. Seriously, how long does it take to type up a quick episode preview and open up a forum for discussion? Every episode of a crappy season of Heroes will get attention, but a newer, better written, better acted show will get ignored. This site is just starting to get lazy.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:03 a.m. CST

    time travel has been done beautifully in film

    by Maniaq

    if Lost featured time travel like in 12 Monkeys then Ben could be trying to prevent the crash while the whole time he'd actually be a part of it happening in the first place - possibly even right down to the LIST of people meant to be on the flight - in fact it could even be the fact the wrong guy ended up flying flight 815 is the reason the whole thing turned to shit <p> well ok let's not too carried away but a complex structure like in this show lends itself perfectly to interesting time travel stories like that

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 5:21 a.m. CST

    Time travel!

    by theBigE

    Well, we still don't know the story behind Ben's "box" from which Locke's dad appeared. Could it make sense that time travel was used to snatch poppa Locke? No one bust a cap in me now!

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 5:23 a.m. CST

    Was Ben wearing a wig in Berlin?

    by theBigE

    Was Michael Emerson wearing a wig when he started to patch up Sayid at the end of the Economist? It sort of seemed he was. I thought this was to indicate that it was a different time period. Some "parallel" time period, if you will.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 8:24 a.m. CST

    I'd love to see Moriarity's face when he reads this

    by rbrog77

    Science or religion - Gotilk asked for a 3rd choice. How about the religion of science.<P> Carl Sagan said "Because science is inseparable from the rest of human endeavor, it cannot be discussed without making contact, sometimes head on, with a number of social, political, religious and philosophical issues."<P> Sagan considers religion to be sociological in origin; it is a construct created to bridge the gaps in our understanding of our world and ourselves. Religion has three dimensions in which it bridges gaps (I found the 3 dimension thing intriguing). <P> First, it is a cultural mortar manifesting itself in a spectrum of benevolent and malevolent social influences. <P> Second, religion contains a resonating mystic core, a touch reaching to the depths of every human's inmost self. <P> Third, religion provides a means to explain the great mysteries, from the mechanisms of nature to the purpose of humanity. <P> According to Sagan, science is the next step in the evolution of our species--it is our latest and best adaption for survival. It can empirically answer the questions which religion, as a social construct, served only temporarily to bridge. As a result, today's science is replacing much, though not all, of religion's role in society. <P> However, this purest core is ultimately subject to rational inquiry, for religion shares it with science. There is something religious, in a broad sense, about scientific investigation because we are drawn to it by what appears to be its awesome beauty and intricacy. <P> So how does that apply to us here?<P> "It is not too much to expect that we will soon have firm observational answers to questions once considered the exclusive preserve of philosophical and theological speculation. . . it may be that in the next few decades we will, for the first time, rigorously determine the nature and fate of the universe. "<P> Did Dharma find something that was protected by "the hostiles"? Did science make that religious break through? <P> Are we/am I "writing" too much into a lowly TV show? Or am I just stirring the pot to get to 1000?<P> See Mori - talkback does work.<P> ;->

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 9:24 a.m. CST

    Chief Brody

    by thekylegassproject

    I don't know...I don't feel at that moment when Locke confronted Ben about it that Ben had any motivation whatsoever to lie. At the time, he was trying to barter information for his life and you could see the defeated look in his eye when John asked him the one question he doesn't know the answer to: what is the smoke monster. Also, clues are beginning to indicate that the black rock people weren't even the first inhabitants of the island. The four-toes statue, the "old place" (ruins) where Ben tied up Anthony Cooper, and also references to a temple somewhere on the island, which I think will be archaic and related to the statue and the ruins. I'm calling it right here and now: a new structure will come into play on the show. I'm talking about this temple that has been referenced. And this is wild speculation, but in this temple, we will see evidence of a smoke monster that pre-dates dharma. (i.e. drawings, mosaics, something)

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 10:11 a.m. CST

    time travel...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...i just don't think they've set up enough clues to indicate time travel. This show is pretty intricately plotted, and even though I know there are still things to be revealed, Time Travel would just be way too out of the blue.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 11:34 a.m. CST

    All you Miles fans...

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    Check out my post above about the ultimate lost spotting, or just rent Keeping the Faith with Ben Stiller. You will laugh your asses off.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 11:38 a.m. CST

    Smokie

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    I am starting to agree with some of the others that said Ben does not know about the smoke monster. What if the others don't control it. How great would it be to see a flashback (Ben's or Juliet's) in which one of the Others leaves the sonic fence of by accident and the smoke monster comes into the Barracks and starts raising hell. It would be like watching one of those animal videos of a moose or deer that breaks into a store and just crashes around. It will probably never happen, but i would love to see it.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 11:51 a.m. CST

    Treat it like the H8rs

    by rbrog77

    I skip their posts, node...when I can. Might be better not to listen to the podcasts...when you can. Surely if something interesting is in one it'll be all over the place.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 11:52 a.m. CST

    Flashes Before Your Eyes

    by maxwell's hammer

    I don't think this was actual time travel, but something a little more metaphysical. Desmond meeting Charlie busking in the rain didn't actually seem to suddenly make Charlie recongize Desomd all those years later, so I'm not thinking that was time-travel in the traditional sense.<BR> <BR> I don't really have a great explanation for WHAT it was, but I don't think there was anything there that could lead people to start assuming Ben is traveling around in time killing people and manipulating the past or future.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:08 p.m. CST

    Time travel or annomoly?

    by rbrog77

    Desomond "knows" what's happening by "seeing" events yet to come. Does he "travel" to the future to see these things? My guess is no.<P> Des had his past "revisited" with Penny in FBYE. But was it a true flashback (as in this happened before), a flashback with new material (as in this didn't happen last time), a dream, or time travel? Dunno. It was surely different than what we've come to know as falshbacks, though.<P> At the time the payload landed, there was a 31 minute difference between the payload and island time. Did it time travel or is there some sort of annomoly to the island that shifts time? <P> Point is, we don't know yet exactly what the time issue is, but we know there is one. My guess is Dan will answer that question somewhere down the line.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:20 p.m. CST

    Charlie just didn't remember meeting desmond.

    by Novaman5000

    Do you remember every person you've met briefly in your life?<p> 4we8have... I'm in Sherman Oaks, in the San Fernando Valley.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:22 p.m. CST

    Flashes was confusing

    by CherryValance

    because I originally thought that Desmond's body never left LOST island. I just thought that his awareness went back into that time. Like present time Des' mind possessed past Des' body. But then he showed up in the forest naked. And I thought that was meant to be our signal that it was indeed time travel because Arnold was naked in the Terminator when he showed up. And they know that we know that they've seen all the same movies that we have. That's what all the references are about and I thought that reference was saying 'yeah his naked butt time travelled'. In fact Locke very nearly said "come with me if you want to live" in the Season 4 premiere. They could be dropping hints to throw us off too. Who knows?

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:52 p.m. CST

    Desmond's body certainly didn't travel in time, because when he

    by maxwell's hammer

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 12:55 p.m. CST

    yay! for putting messages in the title line!

    by maxwell's hammer

    Let's try that again...<BR> <BR> Desmond's body certainly didn't travel in time, because when he arrived in his apartment, he was clean shaven, and when he returned to the jungle, he was all beardy again.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:43 p.m. CST

    Kate...

    by maxwell's hammer

    ...i think they gave that away when they featured Kate in a courtroom during one of the preview for the next episode.<BR> <BR> If it turns out that was a time-traveling Kate clone/smoke monster manifestation, I'll eat crow.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:47 p.m. CST

    The Church of Babylon-5

    by ArcadianDS

    anyone whose views on faith and religion are formed, even in part, by a television show = total dumbass.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:49 p.m. CST

    Desmond popped into his own body, only years earlier

    by Novaman5000

    The way I see it is like this: Desmond had lived this moment before. So it seems like Lost suscribes to the time theory that time flows once, and any travel back doubles back. So he didn't pop into the original timeline, he doubled back after he had already lived it. I don't know, this shit is confusing. Also, we know that time travel can't really change anything in the lost universe, end points are the same, it may just take a while to course correct.<p> FINALLY, what if he never really time traveled. What if it was just some sort of vision? Visions are nothing new on the island. Smokey could have easily been manipulating desmond for its own ends.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:54 p.m. CST

    apropos of nothing....

    by BigTexas42

    Damn him! That Bay! That Michael, Michael Bay! http://www.theonion.com/content/news/cgi_team_creates_realistic_oscar

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:55 p.m. CST

    a bad wig?

    by ArcadianDS

    Richard Alpert was, from the looks of it, in his late 30s to early 40s when Ben was a CHILD.<p> Ben is now in HIS early to mid 40s, and Richard is not<p> bald<p> grey<p> wrinkled<p> dead<p> one bad wig doesn't really cover that.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 1:58 p.m. CST

    Desmond is a liar and still works for Dharma

    by ArcadianDS

    all we know about how he got to the island or how he wound up pushing the button is based on his own testimony. Beyond that, whose to say that he isn't lying from the start, and whose to say that he wasn't a Dharma boy who somehow missed the purge because he was down in the station.<p> At the very least, I believe for whatever reason, he's working for/with Ben and has been a plant among the survivors from the very start. HE is the man on the boat. Oh not yet but very soon - because both he and Ben no longer see time as linear but as a flat mosaic, they dont have any sense of 'then and now', so Desmond IS the man on the boat despite the fact that from our perspective, he's not there yet.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:20 p.m. CST

    BEN'S MAN ON THE BOAT

    by thekylegassproject

    is actually Ben's woman on the boat. Charlotte. He totally knew about her bullet proof vest.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:21 p.m. CST

    Faith in science...

    by BigTexas42

    It is my personal belief that "religion", that is, organized religion as we know it and the beliefs they teach as truths, evolved out of a need to understand the world around us. People were given answers as to why the sun moved across the sky, why the seasons change, what happens when we die, etc. and people who had faith in that religion accepted those answers and moved on. When these answers weren't good enough anymore, people started relying on what they could observe and began a knowledge system based on that to answer their questions. Thus science was born. However, science, as we know it now has two limiting factors that are often overlooked <P><P>1. science, as the scientific process is set up NEVER proves anything - it can only disprove theories. After a theory fails to be disproven for a certain amount of time, it is generally regarded to be true. <P><P>2. science is limited by what we can observe. If we are basing all of our knowledge based on direct observations, we are limited by our sense of perception. <P><P>so science is a religion - we have faith that we can perceive everything, and that there is not some confounding factor that we do not know about in terms of disproving our long accepted theories. <P><P> But I could also argue that faith is science based on observations that we can't directly perceive. That is, there are things we are sensing and are aware of, but not consciously, and we use these "extra-sensory perceptions" to test our theories. When something doesn't "feel right", it could be our extra sensory perceptions disproving a theory as to what is right. So when Locke has all this faith in the island, he is experiencing something that even he can't define. But maybe someone can...like perhaps Dharma or the natives or smoky. its that concept of understanding perceptions that we don't realize we are perceiving that makes religion more scientific. <P><P>so what the hell is the point? being "of science" or "of faith" are two sides of the same coin (or backgammon chip, if you like). <P><P>So I guess it sound like I'm agnostic or atheist by saying all religion will eventually be solved by science, but I personally believe that even God or Allah or Yahweh or The Universe or Great Spirit or whatever, operates under the laws of physics within the physical universe. Whatever happens beyond physical creation...well, who knows. Thanks for reading - hope that made sense.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:32 p.m. CST

    Man of Science Man of Faith

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    I cant help but laugh everytime I hear someone mention science vs faith because it reminds me of that movie Nacho Libre, with Jack Balck. He always makes fun of his tag team partner because he "only believes in science". Its just funny the way the guy says it. makes me laugh every time. <p> I am not religious at all but i do beleive things happen for a reason. But I tend to side with Locke despite being a man of science. I think it is mainly because I want to know what is going on with the island. <p> The ending has to be a mixture of faith and science. I dont think it is possible to explain everything that has happened using one or the other.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:38 p.m. CST

    Desmond

    by maxwell's hammer

    We've seen Desmond's life in flashback, including him crashing on island, why he was sailing in the first place, his fear and confusion at being taken in by Kelvin, and his complete freak-out when the Losties show up. Plus, his life as a monk, meeting Penny, the horrible break-up, and Ms. Hawkings (whether she was real or part of Des's subconcious) telling him that pushing the button is the most important thing he'll ever do. Oh, plus his constant deperation to be reuinited with his Penny.<BR> <BR> If he's a plant from ben, that's oen hell of an elaborately concocted and staged back-story.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 2:44 p.m. CST

    We Have To Go Back!

    by Youguysgotanymilk

    Still trying to figure out why Jack wants to go back. Obviously based on the finale he was desperate to go back. But Kate was not concerned with it. Hurley tells Jack they have to back, but I dont think Sayid was concerned with going back in his flash forward, was he? If they want to go back to help the others what is happening that is so bad. Locke and Sawyer want to be there. Who else could be left that they would be so desperate to help? If it has something to do with how their lives are affected in the future, then why aren't Kate and Sayid concerned with going back?

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 3:16 p.m. CST

    going back

    by maxwell's hammer

    At a point in Hurley's flashback, we see a Jack who is not that concerned with going back. So just because we saw Kate being nonchalant about it, doesn't mean anything. in fact, I got the sense that Kate 100% agreed with Jack, but realized it was impossible, and so decided to live with it. Getting midnight phonecalls from a ranting Jack probably bugs the shit out of her, because deep down, she wants to return as well.<BR> <BR> And Sayid, the ever faithful soldier, is probably in on the plan of protecting the island, and I wouldn't doubt if he returned with a much different mind-set than the other five. While they are happy to go about trying to claim their old lives, Sayid has been recruited and returns with alterior motives.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 3:19 p.m. CST

    Node

    by BigTexas42

    "Many of the Truths we cling to depend greatly on your point of view." a Jedi I knew said that once. <P><P>for the most part I agree with you - I guess what I was trying to say is everything we "know" and "not know" is based on what we are able to directly perceive. Which, in most cases, pretty much covers what you would need. But when we are talking about the special "powers" the island has, there may be things going on beyond our realm of perception, or at least beyond the realm of our conscious perception. I then theorize that the faith that those who have faith in the island have IS based on empirical evidence, it's just empirical evidence that they can't identify or describe. They are experiencing something just as real as an experience of seeing something that is red or tasting something that is salty, they just can't identify it as "red" or "salty". Thus science and faith overlap. Perhaps that helped, perhaps it confused things even more. <P><P>Thanks to all in this discussion group for getting me thinking about this topic again. Viva la Talkback!

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 4:51 p.m. CST

    See...

    by rbrog77

    If you plant a seed, nurture it right, something grows.<P> I have no idea if we will continue this theme, or if the show will allow us to. But I've got to tell you folks, it's been a hell of a ride this week. <P> I guess that's a thanks.<P> ;->

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 4:52 p.m. CST

    So tomorrow...

    by rbrog77

    Enhanced at 8 EST and new Kate episode at 9, right?

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 4:54 p.m. CST

    I'll do it

    by rbrog77

    1000!!!

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 4:56 p.m. CST

    Great post, BigTexas42

    by theBigE

    Liked your "science" and "religion" post. Maybe I can add more to that ... after dinner.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 4:57 p.m. CST

    Ah - you snatched it from me, rb!

    by theBigE

    I was busy reading talkbacks, and you stole 1000 from me! Oh well, there's always next week's TB.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 6:05 p.m. CST

    Jack needs to save people

    by CherryValance

    That's his thing, really. He kinda forgot about it because he just wanted to get off the island. So it seems that in becoming one of the Oceanic 6, they have to make some kind of deal to never tell that there were other survivors. This in effect leaves the other losties stranded forever because now no one will ever look for them. The fact that Des is already off the island takes Penny off the case immediately, so who else is there? Jack probably can't deal with the guilt of leaving them behind after a while. He probably has a lot of feelings for them, especially for SIS-ter. j/k. I had to do that. He needs to save them eventually. It's just who he is. That's why he has to go back.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 9 p.m. CST

    Dr. Marvin Candle sighting

    by rbrog77

    He was wearing a lab coat. too. He played a hearing specialist on this week's Medium. Small part, but still him.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 9:04 p.m. CST

    Maxwell's Hammer...

    by Cheif Brody

    Couldn't disagree with you more strongly about kate's desire to return to Craphole Island. <P> These flash forwards are NOT in chronological order. Jack's, I firmly believe was the "middle" FF...Hurley's came months or a year later...and chronologically came first. <P> Kate did NOT want to go back...just as jack did not want to go back in Hurley's...and even repeated phone calls from Jack begging her...she still thought Jack was crazy for even suggesting it. <P> That's because the "weight" of her freedom has not caught up with her yet in the future. Abbadon may have been the 4th or 5th mysterious "vistor" to visit Hurley at that mental hospital...trying to get him to want to go back. Charlie appearing to him was the last straw. <P> Jack did not have any mysterious visitors that we were shown in last season's finale...but I have a feeling he has been getting similar visits as Hurley by the time he met with Kate at the airport runway...and it's obvious he was shaken by the funeral he attended. Which may have been not the ONLY funeral he's attended in the future for a fallen fellow "island mate". <P> I think Kate will eventually have things start to unravel for her, too. Things that get her thinking that maybe Jack...and Hurley before him...may be right...that they DO need to go back. It's just that at the time of Jack's FF, she hadn't been "touched by the consequences" of leaving the island yet...but that time WILL come. <P> But not tomorrow nite I believe...Tomorrow's FF will merely show us how she became possibly the most famous "Oceanic 6" member...as she returns to the states as a (pregnant?) fugitive wanted for the murder of her father. I think we'll see how she was able to "beat the wrap" on her murder charge and allowed her to be able to meet with Jack...and we'll find out who the "he" is she referred to in Jack's FF. <P> It might wrap up with a "hint" that things aren't so great in her new "off island life"...but I don't see hear agreeing with Jack's desire to go back until next season. But once she finally DOES agree...then we will move into the final act of the LOST story.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 9:25 p.m. CST

    extra content vs necessary content

    by necgray

    wehavetogoback, is that video of the rabbit transporting a nice addition or do you feel that it's necessary to follow what's going on in the show? I ask because I know that Lost produces all sorts of extra shit outside of the actual show. Heroes did that, too, with the comic book. I'm all for enhancements outside the show, but I start to get a little pissed off when people imply that these extras are necessary elements to fully understand what's going on. When I watch a TV show, I'm watching a TV show, not signing on for a full interactive fucking experience. And it's bullshit storytelling to require me to seek information outside the framework of the story. If you can't give me all the information I need within the frame of the story you're telling, then you're a shitty storyteller.

  • Feb. 20, 2008, 10:44 p.m. CST

    Brody...

    by maxwell's hammer

    So you think Jack went crazy insane wanting to get back to the island, then found his sanity and visited Hurley later?<BR> <BR> That's pretty obviously not the case. They dropped two pretty big bits of foreshadowing in Hurley's flashforward that show that Jack is just now getting on his road to crazytown. a) him calmly making himself a cocktail (his first step toward turning into a drunken jukie), and b) his comment about thinking about growing a beard.<BR> <BR> Debating Kate's feelings about the island is fair game. But I think it was pretty firmly established that Jack started off normal and accepting of his role off the island, then turned all nutso obsessive by the time of the funeral with they mystery coffin.

  • Feb. 21, 2008, 12:44 a.m. CST

    Wow, Max...

    by Cheif Brody

    I don't know how you possibly misconstrued my last post so badly. Thought I was pretty clear...Hurly's FF is the EARLIEST one we've seen to date...then Sayid's (which could be debateable, his may have been earlier for all we know)...then Jack's chronologically speaking. But I think tomorrow...uh...TONIGHT'S Kate FF will eclipse Hurley's as the earliest..as I believe this one will take place right after the "Oceanic 6" are paraded before the world...which, no doubt, pre-date any we've seen so far. <P> But Jack's FF definitely showed Jack LONG after the "Oceanic 6" initial return...he seemed pretty jazzed about signing autographs when he spoke with Hurley in his FF...but was denying any involvement when the guy recognized him at the pharmacy while trying to fill prescripts for Oxy. <P> Perhaps you confused my "Jack's was the 'middle' FF" line...but I was referring to <P> 1. Hurley's wanting to go back FF <P> 2. Jack's wanting to go back FF <P> 3. Kate's wanting to go back FF...(which I don't think we'll see until late next season). <P> I hope that clears up any confusion...my real point was...at the time of Jack's FF last season...I do not think Kate was "hiding" her desire to return to the island from Jack...I think she really thought he was a crazy talking, sad, shell of the Jack she knew on the island.

  • Feb. 21, 2008, 2:53 a.m. CST

    We are now walking on Jesus' Ranch...the end.

    by MacFaux

    In mentioning 'Time Flux' in their podcast and specifically 'Time Flux'(integrals of vector fields..how much stuff goes through your thing), coupled with things known, Darlton offered up the foundational mechanics of the story. The grand unifying theory of the mythology and science. It is possible to explain the island, the numbers, the ruins, the foot, why Locke can walk, the whispers, Shannon speaking backwards, Walt reappearing, Desmond remembering tomorrow, the advanced sat phones, the common special nature of Walt, Locke, Ben, and Hurley, the aging, the healing, the reason for sending a physicist, anthropologist, and medium..the dharma logo, the dharma purpose, the experiments, why polar bears and sharks, the black rock, the crash, the 31 minutes, the 108 minutes, the rocket, how juliet's sister was cured, and on and on..all of the big questions answered..ultimate spoilering..collating it gives me tired head. It's like staring at the floor tiles in the Basilica of St. John Lateran and then pow! wow. They have definitely come upon a silver, striped mushroom..<br><br>...Lagaguinggligagiggagoogwayogo.

  • Feb. 21, 2008, 3:46 a.m. CST

    as Maxwell Smart would say

    by Maniaq

    the ol' Science vs Religion bit eh? <p> I don't understand why people continue to insist that the two are at odds. Religion is the whole REASON Science was invented in the first place! Trust me - if we didn't have Religion, there would be no Science! <p> What we call Modern Science, the collection of Knowledge that continues to be gathered over thousands of years, began as a way of better understanding God. The very Scientific Method itself, by which all good Science is conducted, can be found in the pages of the Koran. Universities were practically invented by the Catholic Church and Catholic Universities continue to exist today. <p> Science is essentially a refinement of Religion and in fact some believe it transcends it. For a start, it has its own language - Mathematics - which leaves no room for "interpretation" but the fact remains they are still about the same thing. <p> Looking for Truth, for greater understanding of the Universe, of any universe, is to trying to understand God's Creation - even if you don't personally happen to believe in Him (which isn't required and ironically irrelevant!) or any god, One True or otherwise. <p> <p> jus sayin...

  • Feb. 21, 2008, 10:12 a.m. CST

    Sorry about the confusion...

    by maxwell's hammer

    "These flash forwards are NOT in chronological order. Jack's, I firmly believe was the "middle" FF...Hurley's came months or a year later...and chronologically came first."<BR> <BR> When you say Jack's was in the middle, then say 'Hurley's came months or a year later', it sounded like you meant his flash-forward came months or year after Jack's.<BR> <BR> I can sympathize with being misunderstood. When I post online, I somehow go from being a college educated English teacher to a incoherent nincompoop.<BR> <BR> Not that you're a nincompoop. Oh dear. I see I've offended you.