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A Review Of The Latest Cut Of Rob Zombie’s HILLBILLYWEEN And A Rant On Screenings!
SPOILER ALERT !!
Hey, everyone. ”Moriarty” here.
There’s a review down below, but this first guy wanted to send a review and was frustrated by one of the quirks of the test screening process. I tried sending a lot of people to this one, and several of them were turned away for various reasons. What was this guy’s story? Check it out...
Harry,
Originally, this was to be my first review submission to your website (of which I have been an avid fan and reader for years), it is now a rant (I am fairly certain it won’t make it on the site, it’s more of a cathartic excresise for me)
Typically when I am asked by a person with a clipboard at the local theater “do you want to see a free movie?”, it is usually some lame Ben Stiller comedy where he is with a girl too pretty for him, but damn it she falls for him anyway.
So you can imagine my surprise and delight when I got a flyer for and advanced screening of “ROB ZOMBIES: HALLOWEEN” I almost peed my big boy pants.
Submitting a review to Aint it Cool News with the possibility of seeing my moniker on your site next to yours, mirajeff, Capone, moriarty…. It was to be one of the crowning achievements in my geek life (to date they are 1. Marrying my wife 2. the birth of my son, 3. meeting Bruce Campbell at Comic-con )
I was 10 when the original Halloween came out. I remember it vividly for 2 reasons- first, my birthday was 3 days after its release (thus making the holiday “my holiday”), and secondly, the local twin cinemas(former Jerry Lewis Twin Cinemas) had the coolest lobby decorations for Halloween. There was even controversy over the working guillotine in the lobby that was secured behind only a velvet rope.
I made it my mission to sneak into see Halloween back then, and succeeded. To date it is still one of my favorite horror movies of all time. I still get chills watching it.
Fast forward to last night in lovely Chatsworth CA , where I was in line with my fellow geek buddy eagerly waiting to get in to see if Mr. Zombie did it up good. I have no hard fast rule when it comes to remakes, other than “make it good, make it your own”.
Everything was perfect up until I heard those 6 little words. “You are not our target demographic’.
The woman who spoke those words to me never asked my age (okay I am 38, but look 30… no really) or bothered to inquire anything about me. She looked me up and down and advised me “You are not our target demographic” It was a swift kick in the man sack
I get that studios want feedback from test audiences and they want a diversity of people, but there were people visibly in their 40’s getting in (the flyer was for 17-34 year olds), as well as a group of teenage girls who, by the way, actually stated in the presence of Movie Woman “God, I don’t even like horror films” “I probably won’t be able to even look at the screen” “Why are we even seeing this?”. They made all of these statements right in front of Movie Woman and were still given a wristband and let into the movie. I equate that to a record company calling me for my opinion on a Country album- I don’t listen to it, don’t own any country albums why would you give a shit what I think.
I inquired with Movie Woman exactly how I am not their target audience; her reply was “We need more girls in the theater”. At the time she was saying this, there were about 200 people still waiting to get in, and at best 25 were female.
Basically what it came down to is Movie Woman had a clipboard and literally was just “checking the boxes” when it came to letting people in. You would think for any film, you might want a little more information on your test audience than just a visual once over. I can only imagine the feedback the teen girls were able to provide Movie Woman- “Um .. like it was totally, like, scary and stuff… I dunno really… I like had my face in my hands the whole time… didn’t they like make this movie before…. I would have totally had Lindsey lohan play the babysitter, and instead of killing people, maybe she could have like given Mikey a makeover like she got in Mean Girls and like they could be roommates and have cool adventures”
My point is, I have worked for companies where it is just the “check the box” attitude and you almost never get the quality results you require. Studios spend millions to make movies; shouldn’t they have a better system for “target audiences” than just literally looking at someone? Isn’t this the same system that said “Ace Ventura: Pet Detective” sucked (I’m sure you can list more movies they’ve missed on than I can, that was the biggie that came to mind)
I can’t imagine Rob Zombie typing away at this screenplay and wondering if teenage girls will dig it. He is gunning for the fences on this one and trying to make the kind of movie that guys like me will watch and say “fuck yeah” when all is said and done. Your site is my source for reviews when it comes to movies. I may not agree 100% of the time, but your sites batting average is better than most. I am the guy in the office and with my friends who people look to for advice on movies like this.
But none of that matters. It’s 2007 and the best system the have to cull a “target audience” is “check the box”, which is why studios will continue to put out half ass movies and not be overly concerned with quality.
Pixar is the only studio that comes to mind that actually seems to put quality first. They don’t put it ahead of profits, because they know that if they put out the quality the profits will come. The rest seem to just want to fling shit at the walls and see what sticks.
Well, I am about out of steam… not that you will use this, but I do feel a bit better and bit less bitter…
You can call me irrelevant elephant
Awwww... you’re not irrelevant. You’re just old.
As am I. It’s weird realizing that you’re no longer part of the “most desirable demo,” isn’t it?
Here’s the review, and it seems to be an even-handed, fiar look at the film as it stands right now:
Moriarty,
I saw Rob Zombie's Halloween last night at a screening in Chatsworth, Ca. and wanted to share my thoughts before it gets cut down to an R rating.
(Light Spoilers Ahead)
It is impossible to judge this film on it's own, as I'm sure Zombie knows, so I won't try. The film is basically the same as the previous NY screening (as described), with the exception of no rape scene. I'm not sure what said scene entailed, but it must have disturbed enough people that it was removed. The successful points of the film inevitably mirror the failings: Yes, the casting of the leads is great (Malcolm McDowell, Tyler Mane, Scout Taylor-Compton, etc.), however, the film is cameo HEAVY! Beyond Zombie's usual suspects, he has cast so many horror/sci-fi icons and just film personalities, that it takes you out of the story each time one pops up. I'm not spoiling here... it's on IMDB... two words: Clint Howard.
The film is very erratic in it's pacing. Where the best moments are the quiet, character-developing scenes between Michael and Dr. Loomis or Michael and Ismael Cruz(Danny Trejo), which add pathos to Michael and are actually kind of sad, the scenes involving Michael's family are over the top and continue to explore Zombie's fascination with "Redneckdom". The good characters just aren't given breathing space, so when it happens, you just don't care that all three teen sex scenes end in them being ripped to shreds. There is virtually no suspense or atmosphere in the film. As one of the previous reviewers pointed out: you ALWAYS know where Michael is and what he is about to do. On the other hand the film is beautifully shot, with some really fresh angles and lighting.
Lastly, the violence is brutal and unrelenting. Michael is in no way subtle in his killing. I'm a grown man, and even I was getting overwhelmed by the carnage. I have to go back to the original for a moment. One of the great things about the 1978 film(forgetting the sequels a moment), is that the killings (apart from the dead guy in the field) were all isolated to the teens in the story. This not only launched a genre, but it also made the goings on seem like a dream world within the town of Haddonfield. Where this monster is walking around doing these horrific things, but only this small group is affected by it. That is not the case here where everyone in Michael's general vicinity gets murdered in a real "action-packed" way(I don't know if this showing included the newly-shot scenes).
Bottom line, the film will make money because it's coming out at the end of summer, though opening in October would have helped the lack of atmosphere. Rob Zombie has proven that he can be a great filmmaker, but as it was pointed out in a previous story, he should have reinvented the genre, rather than unnecessarily reinventing a classic.
Bandit Darville
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+ Expand All
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He couldn't even make a good album and that was his so called profession.
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nearly
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Totally
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Don't get me wrong I like to read reviews(after i've watched a movie....don't know why?) but who gives a fuck if people like the movie don't?
If I wanna see a movie i'll see no matter how good or bad the review is. -
It was like Saw. Except, like not as good.
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not ever
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This movie is going to suck so hard.
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Movie is still going to suck, but I'll be there. Gotta get high before I go though, that's a given.
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my mate had to beg me to watch it and afterwards i couldnt thanks him enough for opening my eyes to a seriously fucking cool take on the horror genre, that film was the doggs big knackers
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Awesome,....Another feather in that cap for a mans mediocre career.Anything else good about this film we can falsely attribute to this "director".In a weird way-This film reminds me of those kids from college we called "trustafarians"Trust fund kids who blew money on pot like there was no tomorrow.Way to blow your inheritance Zombie
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You sound like a good guy and all, but couldn't you just... you know... bitch slap Movie Woman?
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Let me get this straight. I just want to be clear. You think DEVIL'S REJECTS is "one of the best films of the 21st Century" and (with the same eyes and brain that make you feel that way) you also think that Spielberg is a hack? OK. Just making sure.
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haha, thats great. Anyways, I just read a review for this yesterday and the person LOVED it (you can find it at creature-corner.com). I dont know why Mori posts neutral/negative reviews for, at least give some of the fanboys hope Mori, dont punch them in the nuts when they might actually gain an erection from the flick.
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It's just nice to be able to reboot this movie and do away with all the bullsh*t from the other sequels. Like that Thorn stuff or whatever it was. Hopefully they'll put some effort into these sequels. I look forward to friday the 13th rebooted as well. Dawn of the dead was amazing, I don't care what people say. The bottom line is people bitch and complain about movies because they think they can do better or they think what THEY say matters. I don't see people looking at the mona lisa thinking "this would be a better painting if she was hot, otherwise not a bad effort". People need to take things as they are. Like when I saw Terminator 2 and my friend said "ahh it was boring" holy crap people, 100 million dollar movies with amazing special effects and you worry about character development? What does it take to educate you? Also when I read things like "maybe a 2 minute scene dedicated to giving some personality to bumblebee in the transformers would have helped" and the next minute they are saying "I've seen this sort of movie a thousand times, time to be original". Well let me ask you this. If you've seen it a thousand times, and you are SO USED to this type of movie... than just maybe the director knows this and assumes you understand this type of rehashed character SO WELL that he doesn't NEED to bore us with the "wow I LOVE THE SAME MUSIC AS YOU" scene, ya know? I'm just babbling, I'm goinna love this halloween movie for what it is, a tribute and a reimagining. I won't bitch about how cool it COULD have been, but take it for what it is. People just need to relax a bit. Movies ARE A BUSINESS not an art. You want art write a poem.
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I didn't mean "what does it take to educate you" I meant, "what does it take to entertain you" ha ha oops.
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Reject's I liked also.
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These movies are for teenagers growing up today, not emotionally stunted old men.
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If they're not making it then at least give us what you wrote dammit!
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personally assured me this was going to be a good film so rest easy chumps. By the way, I respect all of you.
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makes a Halloween movie and doesn't drop the damn thing anywhere close to fuckin Halloween!
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and Sheri´s got a nice ass
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The man likes classic horror and has some knowledge of it. He likes some of the same films I do. He occasionally has shown a slight spark of talent. He casts genre favorites. SO WHAT. What does that have to do with him being able to make a Halloween film? A few points to consider:
*The movie is now about poor little Michael. That's not what Carpenter envisioned. He envisioned the Shape, not some hulking redneck fuck who tore people limb from limb and then snapped them in half over his knee. Don't care about the other characters, focus on Michael's horrible past at the chicken shack hoedown with Momma the whore beating him with a razor strap while he jerks off to animal killings and Foghat blares on the radio.
*The gore is OTT and ridiculous. Yeah, when I think John Carpenter's films, I think OTT gore!
*Suspense? A good script? Who needs it? We have KEN FOREE, DANNY TREJO AND CLASSIC ROCK! The fanboys will love it!
Making a "fan favorite" film from Rob Zombie has become paint by numbers, rote. Cast old favorites, plug in old music, pay some lip service to classic cult films in a couple interviews, and then do whatever the fuck you want, and the fanboys will fall all over themselves to explain how "Rob" (like they know him) really means well and understands horror, not like those other sellout pussies. Fucking PLEASE. Give me a break. The man makes incoherent tripe and this sounds like a disaster on ice. -
War of the Worlds and Munich are good stuff.
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Shot on pixelvision through a sepia filter, set in the Inland Empire, with Sheri Moon as the Headmistress.
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I despise cameos in anything but a comedy. When you're allegedly making a scary film it's even stupider. They're onscreen for 2-3 min at best, no time at all to develop a real character. Zombie made a good film with TDR, but he's gonna be back to square one after this one. GO SEE DEATH SENTENCE ON AUGUST 31
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You're absolutely right Gottaeat, there's no point in worrying about what COULD have been. Especially because douche bags like you say, "What could have been doesn't matter!" "Movies aren't art!" Pull your head out of your ass and get with the program. Movies make up some of the ONLY art left that anyone comes into actual contact with. Why do you even bother reading Talkbacks on a fan website? Just to tell us how stupid we are? Transformers COULD have been better. As it was, it was okay, but it COULD have been great if people like you didn't go, "Uh, it's only a movie." Halloween is a remake, and remakes blow, so it CAN'T be any good. You'll like "for what it is" but it will blow just the same. But they'll keep making shitty movies because of people like you. People like you are the cause of moviemaking to the lowest common denominator: You and your wallet.
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For real suspense and terror, you geeks only need to know to words "Swim Fan"!!!
Oh, and I am 24th, bitches!! -
A little help?
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Test screenings are like that. You'll be turned away because of your age or your race if you don't fit into the demographic they're looking for. A friend of mine used to work for one of those companies and he told me that some screening recruiters have been known to give out fake passes to certain people. If they're handing them out and someone outside of their demographic, whether it be age or race, happens to approach them to ask for a pass they will often times be given a fake pass with a particular code (it won't be accepted when you try to RSVP) so that the recruiters don't use up any of their legit passes.
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teen, money-making schemes under the guise of film.
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the only way to save this film is to Tarantino it. As it stands, the first half is unrelated to the second half and grants the latter part absolutely nothing. Cutting the film so that it is no longer linear would greatly improve things. However, the movie would still be subpar.
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Seriously, how in the fuck can this be worse than the sequels? Busta Ryhmes kicking Michaels ass in H8 was the low point of the previous continuity, so I welcome Zombies take with open arms. I love that he's making Michael a tough physical threat again and not going for mimicking an scary atmosphere he knows he cannot duplicate (as did every director since Tommy Lee Wallace has failed to do in a Halloween film, including Carpenter himself). I always knew someone was going to remake Halloween eventually, and I for one love the fact that Zombie is doing his own thing and making with his own Halloween mythology. Thats what the series needs to bring in new audiences.
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Jul 13, 2007 6:14:15 PM CDT
When has "zombie" proven he can be a great filmmaker?
by jackpumpkinhead
When has "zombie" proven that he can be an average filmmaker? When has "zombie" proven that he can be a mediocre filmmaker? Can anyone tell me? Yes, how about you, crickets?
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Supporters of this film hold it up like a rosary! Busta Rhymes and that horrible sequel is not an excuse for another piece of shit. Zombie's same old tired redneck jamboree cliches are not what is needed to bring in a new audience.
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Zombie should make A CHILD CALLED IT.
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....complain about this film anymore...I mean from what Ive heard Zombie (and even he fact that its bein hemed by a dude as unsubtly named as Zombie)has taken everything that made the original good, robbed the monster (and thats what Myers is supposed to be -a monster. Like the Boogyman, remeber?)of the mystery around him the thing that made him scary in the first place and degraded a classic film (just the one-the sequels did suck balls with the exception of Season Of The Witch) to the level of average banal horror. And the thing is it'll make money, and spawn a sequel and it will go on and on...guaranteed.
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that is the simple answer. Kills the franchise every time you get a singer/rapper/whatever-er involved.
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This movie will be a "hit" just like the idiotic Freddy vs. Jason: Scary Movie crossover was. Hopefully it doesn't suck sweaty dick like that film did. Worst movie of '03.
Zombie knows he can't imitate the original, so why bother... At least it won't be made in a "Dawson's Creek motif" like the equally bad Halloween: H20 was. The most I expect out of this film is a relentless fun ride, because thats all it's going to be. If he succeeds at that alone, he still passed up seven other boring films.
Halloween 2 does suck and we all know it. It's own creator hates it and had to write it drunk just to get through it. It's lead hates it. No passion behind it and never was. At least Zombie actually wanted to make this movie. -
So far we've gone from "I look forward to Rob's unique, cutting edge vision of John Carpenter's original classic" to "It's just a movie, it can't be all the same before, the silent elegant Shape was boring, give Rob a chance to do a new story!" and now to "those other movies all suck, I don't expect anything more than a fun stupid ride." LAME. I thought he was supposed to be a horror genius!
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Deal with it. If you need to masterbate to fantasies of the original film from when you were a tyke shittin' his pants, feel free... I could care less about living in the past. If this movie sucks, I'll see it once and move on. It won't taint the original anymore than Psycho '98 tainted Psycho '60. People knew it sucked and moved on. Same thing happened with the even worse Black Christmas remake. If this film sucks, it will happen here too.
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I would've been happy with any number of current filmmakers taking on this project, who I'd be happy to name, if they delivered anything vaguely resembling John Carpenter's Halloween. From what I can see and hear and read (including the script), Rob Zombie just lifted the name and a few characters and transplanted them into his same old tired grindhouse retread pastiche shit - trailer parks, strippers, and lots of cameos. All this while keeping an emphasis on heavy violence, and demystifying the character whose mystique defined the films and kept him from being a total joke like Freddy and Jason even when he was being played by an overweight drunkard in H6. Zombie has also been pissing all over the original for months and months, talking about how its big "mistake" was writing about other characters and not focusing on Michael and showing him to be an abused human figure like Dahmer or Gacy - HELLO?! The whole point of the series is that Michael is a THING, not human! I'll be damned if that hack tells anyone about how John Carpenter "made a mistake."
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I don't understand the point. Aren't horror films supposed to be sold on their new gimmick rather than name recognition of an older film? Sure, maybe you'll get a few more people to see Holloween because of the name, but The Hills Have Eyes and Black Christmas? Who went to see those because they recognized they were remakes? If anything some people stayed away because they felt they would taint the original. It's been a long time since I was actually interested in watching a new horror film, and it looks like that's not going to change anytime soon.
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1. i didn't bitch slap movie woman because i'm sure she was just following company policy (and security was standing next to me)
2. to misquote (slightly) monty pythons holy grail "i'm not old, i'm 37"
and lastly- when are they going to remake "my bloody valentine"!!!
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Seriously, his films some visual style but the characters and stories are shit. House of a Thousand Corpses is the biggest blatant rip off of a film I have ever seen! It's practically note for note the origial Texas Chainsaw Massacre. I remember seeing HOTC with my friends and them gushing over how awesome it was and all I could do was shake my head. The Devils Rejects was only slightly better cause a least Zombie TRIED to insert some kind of original story. Why is Zombie so obsessed with rednecks and what the hell is up with all the remake of classic films barley 20 years old? I refuse give Zombie and co my hard earned bones for this. If I want to watch Halloween, I'll pop in the definative Carpenter version. One.
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Worry Not Ol' Buddy...Titties Aplenty..."See anything you like?...Three Times?"
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I dont think this movie needs 2 40-minute dialouge scenes.
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Period.
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Is it just me or are all these horror remakes/re-imaginings just a lame excuse to fill a movie with over over the top groos special effects.I like a good horror movies as much as the next man but seeing a woman being attacked and raped by crazy rednecks while her baby is held at gun point and the hillbillys drink milk from her tits is a little extreme(hills have eyes remake).You dont have to come up with the most sickening,gut churning idea to make a horror film,but it seems these days thats all thats beeing marketed.
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I bet they don't kill Myers off afterall.
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thats seems to be what passes for horror these days. Fuck suspense or terror, just get reaaaaalllly violent and gorey. Cos violence and gore is scary right? And how come all srial are dirty grimey gits nowadays?
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is next... I can feel it
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It's like this, I wouldn't buy an album that had the same song over and over again. You need to mix in the slower or more experimental stuff in there to give it texture. The MTV gorefest horror movies are just the same tired note over and over.
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It's called "Chaos." One of the best talkbacks EVER on this site is devoted to it. If there was ever a 'hall of fame' for classic tb's....that should be in there.
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I just saw that reference elsewhere for remakes of last house..
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I don't think I'll be bothering with it at this point.
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Jul 13, 2007 11:51:26 PM CDT
DEMON DAVE + INSANE CLOWN POSSE = ROB ZOMBIE, FILMMAKER
by daddylonghead
I hate this movie and the retard responsible for it with the burning heat of the sun itself.
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in Rancho Cordova. GOOD TIMES and yes we showed HALLOWEEN too. It's now a 99cent store today : ( . Dont feel bad. I was doing a voter phone poll and halfway through a 15 minute poll they hung up on me because they didn't like my answers( I gave two no's on a yes or no question because I thought both choices were bad ones) so that just goes to show that all these polls and previews are "FIXED" to give the answers they want to hear. Sorry you didn't get in after going to the trouble to show up on time.
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The cheap but inexact campiness, the confused visual approach, and then just throw a silly cameo at the audience to get an easy laugh... Compare Zombie's blue turd of a trailer with the others, by filmmakers who not only understand the history and genre of horror filmmaking, but appreciate it, and have enough creative ability to actually be able to recreate aspects of it in a fun-loving and intelligent way... and then look at Rob Zombie, who never, ever, has a clue what the fuck he's doing.
But don't worry, I hear the SOUND DESIGN on this new halloween movie is really stellar, props to zombie for that, good job.
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http://www.bloody-disgusting.com/film/861
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is what disqualified you. People who are not mildly retarded and functionally illiterate fall outside the target demographic for this film. People who have ever even heard the name "john carpenter," people who aren't having babies at 14, and also people who don't talk on cellphones in the theater all fall outisde the target demographic for this film.
Like Frank-N-Furter said, "I didn't make him for YOU!"
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I am totally against these remakes. For every Dawn of the Dead or the Hills Have Eyes, there are plenty of Hitchers, Texas Chainshaw Massacres, The Fogs, When a Stranger Calls, etc. that shit up the screen. I would rather have a sequel myself just because the expectations for a sequel are far lower because you can separate it easier from the main source. That said. If Zombie was going to do remake, Friday the 13th was always the franchise that was all about upping the gore and being more creative with the killing. Zombie's fascination with hillbilly trash would probably fit in better with that franchise. I think you can buy the cook of a camp and her mentally challenged son being rednecks better than Michael Myers. Halloween was all about the Boogeyman coming to a Mayberry type of town. It was all about suspense, not gore. Not what Zombie likes to do.
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It's the nouveau-Bronson flick that's opening opposite Halloween... Kevin Bacon goes after gang of punks who hurt his family. trailer here: http://tinyurl.com/3yspfz
That's the ticket I'LL be buying on august 31... -
And I agree with everything you've said here. Sit tight, hold the fort and keep the home fires burning. ¡Sé quiénes usted es!
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So you are saying that Eli Roth is "[a] filmmaker- who not only understand[s] the history and genre of horror filmmaking, but appreciate[s] it, and have enough creative ability to actually be able to recreate aspects of it in a fun-loving and intelligent way".Is that what you are saying?
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i will see this without paying for it, and i fully expect to hate it. having said that, i fully expected to hate the dawn of the dead remake and loved the fuck out of it, zombie baby and all. so you never know. (but i do know i'll hate it)
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(1) It won't affect the original. You can always go back and watch it.
(2) It's Rob Zombie's reinterpretation. We should let Rob be Rob and take it for what it is: Rob's take on HALLOWE'EN.
(3) It's gotta be better than the sequels.
(4) It's like, you know, FOR THE KIDS! Yeah!
(5) Movies are a business, not an art form.
REBUTTALS TO THE ABOVE:
(1) So if the original is held in such high regard, why remake it if you don't believe that your version is going to be better than the original? THE THING may be a remake, and the original was good for its day, but it sure as shit ain't better than Carpenter's remake!
(2) No arguments there, if by letting Rob be Rob you mean "remake it by redneckifying EVERYTHING". Let's see him remake JASON X: HICKS IN SPACE!!!
Seriously - Rob Zombie isn't competent enough as a filmmaker to do a considered remake - all he can do is put dungarees on the fella and have a family of related redneck fuck-ups that are all a variation on the family in the original TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE. Which, let's face it, is the only movie he COULD have remade properly, since everything he's done is in some way creatively related to it.
(3) Oh, THERE'S an objective way of looking at the movie. "It's shit, but it could've been shittier." Move along, nothing to see here.
And no-one's denying that Busta Rhymes vs Myers is the dumbest thing in horror history (yes, dumber than the final act twists in SCREAM 2 & 3). But if you don't think your remake will be better than Busta vs Myers.. hell, don't do it.
(4) It just shows how the lack of appreciation for anything resembling good writing, good acting, good cinematography, good lighting, good direction, good atmosphere etc has given way to trying to squeeze as many trust fund airheads into a theatre as possible. The way kids today seem to judge a movie as "good" equates to how similar it is to a slick movie video. Michael Bay knows this.
Old man rant: kids today don't appreciate good horror. At least, most of 'em don't. Old man rant over.
(5) Not entirely true. Movies are works of art designed to make money. Yes, they are treated like a business, but have you noticed that the DVDs that sell of movies that are 20 years old or more are of movies generally considered to be classics? Ergo: if you concentrate on making an exceptional movie, approaching it as an artist would their masterpiece, you will (a) make a great movie (hopefully) and (b) make something that will (hopefully) stand the test of time. It's not ALL about the money for film-makers. We hope.
As William Goldman once said: "Nobody knows anything."
Rob Zombie is limited to making movies about murderous redneck families. If you like movies about murderous redneck families, great! Knock yourself out. Those of us who remember the original HALLOWE'EN as a movie set in the quiet, tidy suburbs of Haddonfield (as far from redneckville, USA as you can get) will look at this film for what it is: Rob Zombie's redneckificated HALLOWE'EN. And probably a big steaming pile of shit to boot.
Note to Rob: If you fucking loved TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE THAT much, why not just ignore Marcus Nispel's sexed up glossy remake and do a Rob Zombie's TCM remake instead? It's the one movie you cannot fuck up, since EVERY film you've done so far has been exactly that!
This soundeth like suckage. Here endeth the lesson. -
"The way kids today seem to judge a movie as "good" equates to how similar it is to a slick movie video."
Of course I meant "slick MUSIC video". My typing sucks. -
Maverick, a man who doesn't conform to the system man (yeah!) then why is he allowing the studio to play this "You're outside my target demographic" bullshit game with the audience? The least he can do is publicly denounce this shit!
Rob Zombie has sold out. End of. -
The story about Movie Woman ticked me off, its just one more reason we should be allowed to bring billy clubs to the movies. The first reason is PEOPLE DELIBERATELY TALKING LOUDLY TO RUIN OTHER PEOPLES EXPERIENCE. Im sorry, but if you plunk down 10.25 to see a movie, not counting snacks, etc, and some punk kids are trying to be all MST3K with it, it should NOT be a crime to beat the living shit out of him, right there in the theatre. Both Hulk and The Others were ruined because of little pukes like that. Granted I saw them both in lovely Bellingham, MA; the only problems with that theatre is 1) Its a Regal (which means poor sound and print quality) and 2) People from Bellingham are allowed to go there. In fact people from Bellingham shouldn't be allowed to leave the porch of their mobile homes. And if anyones from Bellingham and got someone to read this to you and you got offended, go fuck a cousin. You know, like you did 10 minutes ago.
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Why give him a shitty I'm-so-sensitive-please-cry-me-a-river backstory? That's not what made the Shape scary in the first place. I have no beef with Zombie. I liked Rejects and I'm willing to give this remake a shot, but I'm not sure about this redneck angle (besides, nobody does redneck better than Garth Ennis). This is starting to sound like Texas Chain Saw Massacre: The Beginning.
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How bout Bergman, Fellini, Polanski?....fucking morons...Get a clue. Spielberg tries to make interesting pictures each time out, not a remake of a fucking horror movie...not slagging zombie b/c i dig his tunes, but if he was not a brand name already we would not even have these films made...
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LORD RANDO STRIKES!!!!
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aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=24309
These two - "Zombie" and "David the Demon" - should definitely (re)make a film together. Maybe "Faces of Death"? Oops, sorry - that's already being remade. But wait... part II isn't! It's still free for the taking! Go get it, boys! Rob can write, Dave can direct! Or vice versa. The result will be the same, anyway. -
Your taste is horrible and people don't like you because of it.
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all 'style' and no content thats why all his movies actually look like they are made by someone who imagines they can make films just by paying cheap homage to the genre and 'being gross' without any sense of drama or for that matter even ability to shock effectively
theyre just spastic, and i love a huge variety of horror..his stuff doesnt even qualify as movies to me, let alone horror -
These maketing assholes just don't get it. "We don't want you to judge our movie because you're not the right age or demographic." Fuck you! Who are you to think what I like or don't like? If they didn't want me someone see a film, then why were they given a ticket? You don't want me to see your film? Then I won't spend my cash at the snack bar, which concession sales are a major part of income or even buy the DVD when it comes out. Its assholes like these that walk about with their clipboards and pens stuck up their ass trying to justify their bullshit job through statistics. They ruin the movie-going experience at a sneak preview. They don't get that you shouldn't piss-off the movie-going public that supplies the cash that drives the machine. The public doesn't have to see "Halloween" and the studio doesn't have to make money either.
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Since I'm a geek, I've been buying up as many old (pre-1986) issues of Heavy Metal magazine as I can find on EBay. In the November 1985 issue is an interview with John Carpenter. Most interesting and relevant to this discussion are the first two questions:
Heavy Metal: With the exception of Starman, all your films deal with evil, but you never give this evil a human face. Why? It seems to me that the human mind is more evil than anything...
John Carpenter: I don't think that human villians are as frightening as an "it," which in a film like Halloween is human yet isn't. I dehumanize the villians in my films, strip them of motivation and character and make them all the more frightening. Even when the villians are human, as in Assault on Precinct 13, they're faceless. It's a youth gang that forms one unit. We don't get to know and understand them. They're just evil.
Heavy Metal: Is it because once you relate to what the evil is, you're prone to start making excuses for it?
John Carpenter: That's true. You get to know them and they become less frightening. If they remain faceless, you're forced to identify with the victims. Imagine a real-life situation in which someone is trying to break into your apartment and you have no idea who he is. All you know is that there's someone out there and he's coming after you. To me, that's frightening. Now, they do say that most murders take place within the home, but that doesn't terrify me. That's another movie and it's a sad one. A family drama. What frightens me is what I cannot see. If somebody you love plans to murder you, if you can see his face, it seems to me that you would be able to see what he's up to. The personal contact gives you a clue, something to hang onto. But when it's faceless, it becomes the essence of paranoia. A formless, horrible thing is out there, trying to get you, and there's no escape. You may be able to talk a friend out of killing you, by reminding him of your past friendship, but when something like The Fog comes out of the water with one intention - to kill - what do you do? -
Since I'm a geek, I've been buying up as many old (pre-1986) issues of Heavy Metal magazine as I can find on EBay.
In the November 1985 issue is an interview with John Carpenter. Most interesting and relevant to this discussion are the first two questions:
Heavy Metal: With the exception of Starman, all your films deal with evil, but you never give this evil a human face. Why? It seems to me that the human mind is more evil than anything...
John Carpenter: I don't think that human villians are as frightening as an "it," which in a film like Halloween is human yet isn't. I dehumanize the villians in my films, strip them of motivation and character and make them all the more frightening. Even when the villians are human, as in Assault on Precinct 13, they're faceless. It's a youth gang that forms one unit. We don't get to know and understand them. They're just evil.
Heavy Metal: Is it because once you relate to what the evil is, you're prone to start making excuses for it?
John Carpenter: That's true. You get to know them and they become less frightening. If they remain faceless, you're forced to identify with the victims. Imagine a real-life situation in which someone is trying to break into your apartment and you have no idea who he is. All you know is that there's someone out there and he's coming after you. To me, that's frightening. Now, they do say that most murders take place within the home, but that doesn't terrify me. That's another movie and it's a sad one. A family drama.
What frightens me is what I cannot see. If somebody you love plans to murder you, if you can see his face, it seems to me that you would be able to see what he's up to. The personal contact gives you a clue, something to hang onto. But when it's faceless, it becomes the essence of paranoia. A formless, horrible thing is out there, trying to get you, and there's no escape. You may be able to talk a friend out of killing you, by reminding him of your past friendship, but when something like The Fog comes out of the water with one intention - to kill - what do you do? -
If I see this movie it will be on dvd, i'm just not interested in a Halloween remake from the guy who brought us HO1C and DR. What Lux and others said is true, horror writers,directors now seem to think the only way to get asses in the seats and make a really scary flick is to have it filled with atleast two or three rape scene's and several torture scenes. The reason nobody paid to see THHE2 remake and or the Hostel sequel is that people are tired of the same shit and they didn't want to see two hours of American Millatary men and women being raped and murdered or young girls being tortured and mutilated. Try talking your date into seeing some shit like that, it ain't happening. On the same note I took my wife to see 1408 and there was a line around the theater of couples going to see that movie.You can always make money on a good horror film,it just has to be original and scary which is something few and far between today. Dying to see "Cloverfield" and the new Romero flick thats being filmed the same way. Sounds interesting and original.
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DEVIL'S REJECTS is crap (extremely lame crack at appending sympathy to the rapists/serial killers; the film is a mess)...a HALLOWEEN remake is Zombie most shameless conceit to date (it'll make a ton of money on the opening weekend and then word-of-mouth will kill it)...but Zombie is Orson Welles compared to Eli Roth (may his career R.I.P.).
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There was no reason to remake this. Rob Zombie makes trailer trash horror films. They suck. Just like Eli Roth horror films suck. It won't be getting my money. I guess I am not the demographic either for that matter becasue of my opinion and that's perfectly fine.
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Funny how if this would be a positive review, everyone would be screaming plant. But since it's negative, it just shows the bias of some people on here.
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I meant to say fake instead of plant. But my statement stands.
I really doubt this guy saw the movie. -
That we get a movie adaption of the computer game series, "RedNeck Rampage", up next from Rob Zombie?!
Good Grief folks, i bet
"Halloween" turns out to be cool!
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I used to be a big Rob Zombie fan.
I really did.
Swore up and down I'd be there for anything the man made. Loved House and Rejects and was there on opening nights both times. Saw em several times in the theater and bought em when they hit DVD. Have watched em so many times it makes me ashamed to mention it.
When I heard he was helming the remake of Halloween I was pretty much thrilled. I was thinking "Here's a chance to show Hollyweird how a remake should be made." I was one of the very few of my friends who was really thrilled about him remaking the movie; I added his music profile and Halloween movie profile to my friends on MySpace and read any and everything that came out of the Zombie-Machine. I was all juiced up thinking about how he was going to make it his own while keeping it true to the original. I knew it was a hard rope to walk, but he could do it if he kept his head straight.
Then the first review of the script popped up on here... and doubt started slipping in.
No, fuck that. Doubt came flooding in.
I was pretty much sure the script had to have been a fake... there's no way Zombie would do that... he's an admitted fan of the classic film and promised fans that he'd keep the movie tightly adhered to its roots.
Next thing I know, he's posted a RANT on his MySpace blog about how the AICN people had unfairly slammed his movie. When anyone would comment on his blog anything other than flowery, gushing praise of the film, he'd make a personal appearance and comment back that the guy was a douchebag of the highest calibre and pretty much demolish them in the comments. Then his army of sycophant zombiephiles would sytematically tear down any opposition to his gospel. It was like watching a dictator mad on power. I guess this is typical of what happens when a rock star becomes a movie-maker. Their own cult props them up so highly that they truly believe they can do no wrong. When AICN reported about Zombie's rant, Zombie promptly deleted all blogs that predated the AICN report. If you check now, he's removed any blogs before Wednesday, January 03, 2007. His Sunday, March 11, 2007 blog states:
"funny stuff
I just read an AIN'T IT COOL NEWS story that says that I was in A RAGE after reading their review of the HALLOWEEN script. They heard this from some close friends or something like that.
Well, I fell off my chair laughing. First off I never read their review since I knew whatever they were reviewing was some old script and I certainly wouldn't be in a rage about anything. I'm too exhausted from working on the film to have any RAGE left over. It's all good times over here.
I tell ya this internet stuff gets funnier and funnier. I don't normally ever look at this stuff, but someone send it to me and I thought it was really a hoot."
Uhhh... yes, Rob. Yes, you did. Then you covered your tracks. Ass.
At any rate, I've divorced myself from Rob Zombie fandom until he gets his head back in gear and makes something that is his own. But then, what are the chances that he'll ever get his head straight again? As long as this movie does gangbusters at the box office (and it will... God, I hate kids) and his army of drones keep going down on him every time he farts he'll never get in touch with what made his first two movies enjoyable. It's kinda like the way George Lucas will NEVER listen to the long-time fans of his classic movies... why should he? We funded his movie-machine so he could play, and now he has a new army of Lucas-Loonies who'll buy anything he shits out on a whim. I halfway expect Rob Zombie's Halloween 2 and Rob Zombie's Halloween 3 to follow this. Ugh.
I'll no doubt be flamed to death by the Zombie Zombies who live on his blog, but hey... I take that as a mark of pride. Flame away, Zone-Dweebies. The real movie lovers know highly polished hogshit when we see it. -
A plant would talk about the movie like it is the next 2001. This guys says that it is a shakey piece of shit. I am sure that it will make a lot of money and Eli Roth will form a metal band. Fuck em both.
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FREE test screenings are just that "free" and intended to "test." They never guarantee you a seat in the theater and the research group hired to do the testing needed to know what a certain group thought of the movie. NOT a 37-year-old horror fan. They KNOW 37-year-old horror fans are going to go see this. They need to know if it appeals to the lucrative teen girl audience and the general movie-going crowd.Thus, you grab more "non-horror fans" and teenage girls (probably women in general) because THAT'S what they're looking for.It's not as if you bought a ticket and were then denied entry to the film because of some prejudicial attitude towards your type, they knew that the theater was filling up for their test screening and they needed to make sure they got enough people in that represent the folks whose opinion they needed.To put it in the simplest terms: Test screenings are for THEM, not for you.
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it will go away. seriously.
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if you can't appreciate that "Thanksgiving" trailer, then you're a very different kind of horror movie fan than I am.
In an unrelated note, man, I haven't seen Uncapie on a talkback in years, it seems like. There's a name from AICN's distant past... -
that was just a 2-second video loop of Harvey Fierstein with no shirt on going "HEYY," nothing else, just the one loop of him yelling "HEYY" over and over and over for three hours, I would rather sit through that movie every single day for an entire month than see Rob Zombie's SHALLOWEEN even once.
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that was just a 2-second video loop of Harvey Fierstein with no shirt on going "HEYY," nothing else, just the one loop of him yelling "HEYY" over and over and over for three hours, I would rather sit through that movie every single day for an entire month than see Rob Zombie's SHALLOWEEN even once.
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the one Quint and a bunch of others reviewed. Seems pretty much exactly what these reviews describe, only they dropped the tape recorder and added Danny Trejo (and the recent reshoot stuff, obviously). I particularly love how everyone denounced the rape scene and he filmed it anyway, only to FINALLY listen when people saw it and said the same thing (i.e. its pointless and stupid). If he was REALLY anti-studio and all that like he says he is, the scene would still be in there, there would BE no reshoots, and he'd have only himself to blame if the movie sucked. Now he can point fingers. Fucking pussy.
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It was better than House Of 1000 Corpses, but so is anything with a remotely coherent narrative. DR expects us to feel for these caricatures who talk in sub-Tarantino, sub-Tobe Hooper wisecracks and are as broadly written and acted as possible. Oh, look at them torture Priscilla Barnes! Look at them kill that other dude! But it's okay in the end, as we play "Freebird," because ALL THEY REALLY WANT IS TO BE TOGETHER! Give me a fucking break. Rob Zombie's work is like a tourist trying to make a grindhouse film - it's always the same cliches, and by trying to 'delve into Michael' and bring him down to earth he ruins Halloween. The whole purpose of Halloween is that Michael is inhuman, a spectre. I agree that most of the sequels are dreck, that a new vision is needed for the franchise, but not a remake and not THIS bullshit. Rob Zombie loves to name-drop serial killers and blather on about how much he knows about Ted Bundy or Gacy or blah blah blah, he thinks it makes him sound hard, so he relates every single movie slasher back to his real life "heroes." But just because you know about those guys doesn't mean they have ANY BEARING on Michael Myers.
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Roth may be an arrogant ass high on himself, and his films may go all over the map and I understand why Hostel 2 failed (I preferred it to the original but JESUS it is hard to fucking watch) , but the fact is the man can invoke a sense of dread and unsettlement in his films. I don't care if that disqualifies every other comment I make in some people's eyes, he may be a pissy Flavor Of The Month but he's a damn sight more competent than this shit.
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my mommy was a stripper. now i'm gonna go chop some bitches.
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a referendum on Eli Roth. I didn't see Hostel II, probably won't, but Hostel I was amazing. The man is good at what he does, and of course he's a better filmmaker than Rob Zombie; Uwe Boll, Master P, and any random pallid, obese Youtube videoblogger are all better filmmakers than Rob Zombie.
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The HOSTEL films may have shown glimpses of the real lives of the killers, but we were NEVER expected to admire or sympathize with them. I also don't see Roth's films as blatant, obvious, & practically plagiaristic, checklists of his favorite movies. Hate on Roth all you want, but he's not 1/4 the definition of hack that zombie is.
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The build in his films thus far is always great, the creepy setup, in Cabin Fever, in Hostel 2. Using that Wicker Man song with the woman singing while they were at the hot springs was scary as shit.
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He doesn't even know the difference between rip-off & homage.
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director hack" he's "some adverts/MTV HEAVY METAL music video director hack". For all the difference it makes. Please stop telling us to be "thankful" for another useless asshole getting a shot because he's a fucking fan-boy with a built-in prepube fan base, when there are people with real talent out there struggling to get ORIGINAL work off the ground.
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I spent years hearing about the "lost masterpiece" "House Of 1000 Corpses" and how great it was and how the studio shat on it and wouldn't release it. I supported the man's efforts to put it out, thinking it might mean the future of the genre. What I got when I saw it was an incoherent, childish piece of drivel. I hated it and so did my friends and we was only 19 or 20 at the time. It just made no sense and was ridiculous. It was an amateur parading his fetishes onscreen and pandering only to himself and a niche audience who loves his music videos, with no regard to narrative or coherent writing or characterization. I still have no idea what happened in the last fifteen minutes of that film. I could not tell you.
We've seen stories about "victims who become monsters" A THOUSAND TIMES in the horror genre. Zombie is far from the first and he will not be the last. There is nothing unique about telling a "gritty true to life story," not that this story he is telling is that at all. It's just a grindhouse pastiche - I love grindhouse, but not like this. He has stripped everything away from this character that made him even remotely better, scarier, or more mysterious than the larger than life caricatures (though fun) that Freddy Krueger and Jason have become, and turned Michael Myers into this gigantic redneck beast who talks and beats the living fuck out of people.
You talk about "MTV hacks" - for many of us, THAT IS WHO ROB ZOMBIE IS. Do you really think the idiots who directed dreck like The Hitcher remake or Halloween 6 were not influenced by that '90s MTV jump-cut, stroboscopic video generation that Rob Zombie HELPED CREATE? Do you not remember what his music videos were like? HE WAS ONE OF ITS PIONEERS!
The crap sequels are not excused by the existence of this film, but nor is this film excused by the crap sequels. And the merely so so ones are, frankly, better than this script. You can piss on Halloween II or 4 and they at least have the Shape. If this was the Pang Brothers or even Roth, we would be seeing a fresh take on the story without violating that thin white ghost that freaked the shit out of people. -
maker of what a good movie is?"The Devil's Rejects is a good movie, regardless if you like it or not?" Plenty of people think it's a piece of shit, but since you think it's great, it must be, huh? Asshole. And now you think we should feel sorry for little robbie for his (also idiotic- have you read it?)Crow sequel getting scrapped? Oh boo hoo.
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for every project he DOESN'T have a hand in.
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for a seff-professed non-horror fan, ain't it?
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...John Ryder would have been a redneck family.
By the way, I'm surprised someone who likes "zombie" doesn't like the Hitcher remake. It's the same kind of soulless, worthless, unwatchable shit. Except more coherent and without zombie's "music" on the soundtrack. So, at least there it's a little better. -
Jul 14, 2007 6:34:05 PM CDT
By the way, can someone elaborate on "the rape scene"?
by jackpumpkinhead
What was it, when was it described, how did it end up cut? I must have missed it, that's the first time I'm hearing of such a thing.
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and the Hitcher remake, and so on. By making another remake that completely spits on the original in favor of ripping off the grindhouse and playing on the same old Tobe Hooper/Wes Craven "Hills Have Eyes" tropes (which I love in the originals, but not today, save for the work of Alexandre Aja or the guy responsible for Wolf Creek) , Zombie is simply perpetuating this cycle of "fuck original ideas" horror.
The work of the guys who made "Memories Of Murder" and "The Host" is great. THEY could potentially make a good "Halloween." Rob cannot make a good anything so far. There is more to a movie than honky-tonk dialogue and cult stars hamming it up as broadly as possible. I love Ken Foree and Danny Trejo but come fucking on. -
came from - Zombie himself. Ask yourself if there are no similarities between his music video work and those "hacks" that made the later Halloween sequels, or Marcus Nispel (also a music video director first) , or whoever. Then I think you have your answer to what you're asking me.
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What IS the big difference between zombie & every other hack out there. Please. Two HIGHLY derivitive "originals"(HA!) and now a remake and that assclown zombie is supposed to be revered for them and his failures with unrealized projects lamented? The guy is stuck in the 70's and as soon as this retro-grindhouse fad has run its course zombie will be left choking on the dust.In 10 years no one will even remember your precious DEVIL'S RETARDS.
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Zombie's already a millionaire. He could never make another film again and it wouldn't matter. His entire career could collapse and he could still retire tomorrow. He won't be eating kibble out of a garbage can anytime soon.
Devil's Rejects will be remembered as a minor cult classic (on the level of films like The Hills Have Eyes), but it won't be remembered on the level of Saw which is basically the new Friday the 13th series. Or Scream... Or Friday the 13th... Or Halloween... Etc. -
Roth has killed his own career. Never mind that the HOSTEL films are absolute shit. This creepy fratboy shoots himself in the nuts every time he functions as a talk show guest. I recall one major flub that occurred right on the heels of CABIN FEVER's debut (an extremely derivative platitude; thank God for Cerina Vincent and Jordan Ladd, though their characters were mired in Roth's misogyny): Roth was invited on a panel with Stuart Gordon, Tobe Hooper, John Carpenter, et al. In no time at all, he's started to showboat (the veteran directors camouflaged their disgust behind "What an asshole!" grins). Zombie's drones remind me of the inflexible STAR WARS stooges. When STAR WARS was "spoofed" on ROBOT CHICKEN, the stooges lauded the lame comedy as "classic" because George Lucas was ass-kissed by the show's "irreverent" writers--any sort of stinging satire, about Lucas' commercialism, was forefeited because Lucas participated in the production. Likewise, Zombie will seek solace in his parasites because he doesn't want to hear the truth. Zombie's old lady is the new millennium's Nancy Allen--tallying jobs, lack of talent notwithstanding, because her spouse is "the boss" (hence, she is heir to the legacy of the T-shirt: "I fucked the director"). Turning Michael Myers from an enigma--and into another "child abuse" textbook case--is another of Zombie's shameless conceits. What an asshole, indeed.
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I don't have a problem with Roth at all, in fact I was just making a query as far what you see as "good" horror. I liked Hostel 1, and Cabin Fever (the friend I saw it with was tripping on 'shrooms, and he was freaked by that movie), and I thought the Thanksgiving trailer was hilarious.I just don't get all the hate Zombie gets slung his way, I didn't really like "House-OATC", but I loved "Rejects", not as a horror film, but as a pseudo-slasher/road trip movie. I hated, no maybe, loathed The Hitcher re-make, I didn't really like the new Hills Have Eyes (haven't seen the 2nd), but I did sorta like the re-make of TCM (not its' sequel though).I don't know what to think of all these new horror movies that have been coming out, in fact I haven't really been creeped out by any movie since, maybe, The Ring and that wasn't scary, just creepy like Blair Witch. The last movie that really disturbed me was Cannibal Holocaust, but only for the animal scenes.
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but, it's a franchise that will still be remembered 10 years from now.
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Jeez, the guy knows more about Zombie than Zombie does himself and argues Zombie's case more than Zombie would. The fact of the matter either Zombie doesn't get (apparently neither does Memories-Of-Murder) or chooses to ignore what Carpenter was trying to achieve with Halloween. There were some distinctive themes that made Halloween what it was and Zombie apparently threw them out the window. What is left is the character names and a very basic outline of the overall movie. Zombie kept nothing of what made Halloween very unique. Personally, I think all he did was set himself up for failure. He basically made his own movie that has nothing to do with the original Halloween at all, but forced everyone to judge this movie with a lot of prejudges because everyone would compare it to the original. From everything I read about this movie, Zombie could have changed the character names and a few scenes and few people would ever draw the comparisons to the original Halloween. I personally have no problem with a movie with a humanized killer, but that was exactly the opposite of what Carpenter was trying to achieve. The movie Halloween is about the Boogeyman killing random teenagers in Anytown, USA. Not a serial killer stalking his sister (as stated in other TBs, the sister angle was a plot devise used in Halloween II to explain why Michael would continue to stalk Laurie). As for the PG-13 horror movies, I think Gore Verbinski has caught more of the overall theme of what Carpenter was trying to do than any other horror director in recent years when he made the Ring. I am not the biggest fan of The Ring, but it did capture the Hitchcockian tone that Carpenter used so brilliantly in Halloween. The Ring is far closer to the original Halloween than anything Zombie has ever done.
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I think at the time of the interview, yes killers without motivation and pure evil were far more scary. But movies like Silence of the Lambs (both Hannibal Lecter and Buffalo Bill) and Seven have made pure serial killers (granted we never found out what Kevin Spacey's character did what he did or chose the seven deadly sins as his murder choice which added to the fright of his character) proved that serial killers could be just as frightening. I think humanized serial killers work better in drama based thrillers like that than slasher horror flicks. The first Scream worked, but I felt the revelation of the killers was the weakest part of the movie (and revelations of the killers in the sequels were downright pathetic).
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You don't have to entirely faithful remake, but to make a remake you need to keep at least the overall basic themes of the movie. Better yet, if you respect the original so much, you don't do the remake at all. I don't think anyone has less respect for the original than Zombie. If Zombie had so much respect for Carpenter's movie, he would throw out every arching theme of the movie in favor of his own personal style of filmaking. Maybe it is because Zombie just doesn't have the writing talent write outside of his trailer trash universe he has used in all of his movies. It is either disrespect or lack of creativity that has Zombie Hillbillizing Halloween. There is no way around it. People talk Carpenter's "remake" of the Thing, but Carpenter didn't mess with the overall themes of the book (which is what he used as his source materials) and didn't just take the story and force fit it in his style of filmmaking. Carpenter didn't have the same type of characters in Halloween as he did in the Thing or Escape from New York or Assault on Precint 13 or any of his early works before he washed out. He approached each film as a unique work. So far, Zombie can't get the Firefly family out of his movies. All those cast members are even in this movie apparently playing similiar types of characters. His wife unfortunately doesn't have the acting range to pull off the one character in her repetore.
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At least the actors and from most descriptions at least Zombie's wife plays a very similiar character. She might not be a psychotic killer, but she plays the trailer trash mother of Michael Myers. Basically the same character without the killer streak which she apparently passes onto her son in this one. I guess Sid Haig, Bill Moseley, and Leslie Easterbrook (and non Firefly Devil Rejects alumn like Danny Trejo, William Foresythe, Ken Foree, and Lew Temple) could have different types roles in Halloween than Devil's Rejects or House of 1,000 corpses. But I am betting that at least most of them have similiar roles.
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that Devils Rejecs was an "okay" horror at best-too much of a throw back to be original and too "same old"for Zombie to be worth watching....but apparently he's defaced Halloween...I dont pity me, I pity all those children who will not be be able to expereience the original messed up physche....
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all Im saying is-Carpenters Halloween broke new ground,shaping modern horror Zombies is a retread.....a waste of time...
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The reveiling of the killers in all three Scream films were the worst parts of each film. When Jackie showed up in part 2, I wanted to throw my popcorn at the screen. Lame...
I almost would have rather had it be a supernatural Ghostface killer. Any tension the first film garnered went straight out the window near the end. And it had one of the best beginnings of a horror film probably ever. Top 20. Oh well... -
What if you met Michael Myers and just gave him a big hug and said "It is okay Michael, you don't have to be so angry". I'm pretty sure he'd stab you, or maybe he'd so freaked out at someone doing that to him, that he'd just walk away confused.
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It's a well known fact that if enough slack-jawed teenage idiots go out to see HALLAWEEN opening weekend, the studios will greenlight Rob Zombie's next project: An awesome backwoods-style remake of "Memories of Murder."
In an interview with NUTLICKER MONTHLY, Zombie is quoted as saying "Yeah, I originally wanted to remake this other film my handlers told me was hot... OLDBOY, except my remake was going to be called GOOD-OL'BOY, about two CRAZY TWISTED REDNECK MOTHERFUCKERS who went to the same HILLBILLY RAPE CAMP together. But then one of my staffers told me about this other Korean movie that was already conveniently set in the countryside, and it just seemed like a natural fit for my talents. I'm stunt-casting R LEE ERMY as the CRAZY BALLS-OUT PYSCHO SHERRIFF who investigates and the other cops in his department are going to be DANNY TREJO, RON PERLMAN and MICHAEL BERRYMAN, and they're going to drink moonshine and gang-rape my wife while listening to SKYNYRD. And that's not even for the MOVIE, I just want them to do that cause it would be awesome!"
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Jul 14, 2007 9:54:10 PM CDT
Dum Guy -- That already happened in Halloween 5..
by spongebobs pina colada
Not exactly, but close enough.
The Dr. Loomis mellow moment of brining Michael down to earth before getting stabbed, and Michael's sad crying moment. -
You know, I really don't get the rape fetish in so many movies. I love women, I love all kinds of sex, I love kinky stuff, and I love breaking taboos, but even setting aside feminist principles, seeing a woman get raped does NOTHING for me. It's not even intense, it's just unfortunate and ugly in a tiresome way. I mean in "Crank" there's that semi-consensual scene, that qualifies to me as edgy, disreputable fun within an edgy, disreputable fun movie, but the epidemic of sexualized violence against women that is such a mainstay of not only older horror films but a lot of 80s action movies, where the bad guys are shown to be bad by a lovingly detailed depiction of a rape scene... is this just a USA yankee thing, where our puritan legacy leads us to hate our own attraction to women and want to punish them for being attractive? I know there is plenty of stuff out there that I will never understand, but the cultural fixation on rape will forever be a mystery to me.
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Jul 15, 2007 12:33:24 AM CDT
Maybe people can't imagine women having consensual sex
by daddylonghead
with them? Maybe it's a low self-esteem thing, where even in their fantasies guys can't concieve of a situation in which an attractive woman would want to fuck them, so there has to be a force and compulsion for the fantasy to work for the guy?
I don't know, I just can't think of anything I like less than a rape scene in a movie. I even dislike it more than use of real-life war-atrocity footage in a montage, or freeze-framing main characters while their names appear onscreen, or a wise indian giving advice, or Rob Schneider... -
maybe not more than Rob Schneider.
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Thanks for the laugh. Stop getting high.
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Maybe, if you'd ever been raped, you would see the horror in it.Just imagine a large basset hound humping you while you are half-way awake... Now that is horrible.Well, now, I kinda see where you wouldn't find that erotic, or Rob Schneider.
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What more does a 13 year-old know about movies than a 37 year old? And is the new "Halloween" rated PG or PG-13 so that legally a 13 year- old will go see it? I doubt it with Zombie's track record of gore(Motto:more gore, less story.). If its an R rating, then the survey group is guilty of pimping the product. They do that anyway, so that's a moot point. But, if I was Rob Zombie and wanted to make sure my film was going to be somewhat successful, I'd have made sure that EVERYONE, no matter what age, would go see this movie if they're horror fans. That's the demographic they should have been aiming for. That's why "Blair Witch" was so successful. "Want to see the movie? You're 65? Like horror films? Step right up and enjoy the show!" I agree with Chris Rock's comments about "Blair Witch;" "This movie was made for $7,000? Somebody is walking around with $6,000 in their pockets!"
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'Cause Chris Rock knows how to make a good movie?Remember back when Chris Rock was supposed to be funny, and Jamie Foxx was so-so? See, how life treats an artist, you master what you can do, and Chris Rock can't do good film.
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I heard that Rob Schneider really loves comedy too.
Ergo, by your reasoning, every comedy starring Rob Schneider should be great BECAUSE HE REALLY LOVES COMEDY!!!
That's THAT misconmception shot down, then. Got any more? -
Glad someone else realised that too. I have spent hours wondering how the genius who gave us THE CROW and DARK CITY (which is absolutely awesome) can then produce the lukewarm, insipid, "aw-HELL-no" filled I, ROBOT.
I just don't get it. Still have love for the Proyas, though. -
Please tell me you were not serious about DEVILS REJECTS? That was a terrible movie that unjustly ripped Skynard's 'FREEBIRD' at the end - laid over a scene that killed the protagonists that I didn't give a s**h about! NO WAY! RZ should work in a 24/7 so he can't make anymore crap.
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One review which wasn't one and one review which was lame (as in plant lame).
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I must say that I LOVE the original Halloween, liked Halloween 2, Hated Halloween 3 thought Halloween 4 and 5 were O.K., hated Halloween 6, thought H2O was the best sequel yet still lacked the punch of the original and I thought Halloween 8 was really lame. I was 13 years old in 1978 when the original came out. I went to the movie with a friend of mine at the time who was also 13. This friend was a redneck hillbilly type who was into the killing and the tits, but totally missed the quality of the film in terms of atmoshphere and suspense. Of course, he missed the quality in everything in life and ended up serving hard time for drug dealing and became a crack head. For all I know he is dead now. Anyway, everything I read about this movie makes me think that my crack head buddie from the 1970's would enjoy this, while I would not. I don't think it takes any talent to write curse word dialogue and film graphic death/killing scenes. Any hack can do that with a little budget and that is what Rob Zombie is. A hack with a budget and an undeserved reputation. He is not qualified to wipe the sweat off John Carpenter's back side. I will be saving my money on this. What a waste of Malcom McDowell (my favorite actor and a perfect choice to play Loomis).
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any day of the week.
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'Pathos' or 'sympathy,' it still undermines the character. He's still evil, but now we can 'understand' where he came from. No Thanks, John Carpenter is, was, and will forever be, at least twice the filmmaker Rob Zombie could ever hope to be. Now, to be fair, Rob Zombie will always be twice the rock star John Carpenter could ever hope to be, that's just how life works out sometimes. However, Alice Cooper 'pwns' Rob Zombie. Back to the subject, different is always better just because it's different. A 'Halloween' re-make was unnecessary, whether we are 'lucky' to have someone like Rob Zombie directing it or some advertising/MTV hack (the likes of which have included Mark Romanek, David Fincher, Ridley Scott, Adrian Lyne, Michel Gondry, Spike Jonze. Just trying to say that making a music video or commercial shouldn't always damn a director to fanboy hell.)
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How great would a remake of 'The Shining' be if it was directed by Rob Zombie? The material seems perfect for him.
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just because it's different.
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Zombie or a music video hack? Dawn of the Dead and The Hills Have Eyes were very good remakes. Both movies also stayed very true to the source material. Yes, characters,situations, and endings changed, but what the original directors were trying to achieve with the orginals were not lost in the translation in the remake. By the way, Fincher, Scott, and Lynes have all made classic movies. Movies like Alien, Blade Runner,and Se7en are far better than either of Zombie's other movies and are considered classics.
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If Ridley Scott could stay true to his "Alien" roots, he would have been a far better choice than Zombie to make this movie. Scott has had a few clunkers a long the way, but Alien was basically a an incredible slasher movie (just substuting a knife wielding murders with an alien and setting it in space, but the story structure is the same as slasher movies). Scott showed in that movie that he he has what it takes to make a horror movie that is suspenseful and entertaining.
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All that is fine and good. I actually can agree with you. I'm not worried about a remake of 'Halloween' at all. I like the original, it's good, great, whatever, but it's not my favorite John Carpenter film. ('The Thing' will always be superior, to me, and it's fine if nobody else feels the same way.) I liked 'House of 1,000 Corpses' more and 'The Devil's Rejects' less. I wasn't particularly frightened of the trailer trash in the unnecessary 'Texas Chainsaw' remake. All that is to say I am not particularly interested in Rob Zombie's 'Halloween,' thats fine, I'm not the target demographic. There is going to be plenty of people with cash inside that demographic to make this film a success, so, the Zombie producers don't need to lose any sleep. I posted the interview with John Carpenter from over 20 years ago because it seemed that he had a pretty good understanding of the material which he created. Rob Zombie, horror fan, rides on the name of the original (which he loves), takes his own approach (commendable, but if his own approach involved making it into a rock opera like 'Tommy,' how many people on this site would be defending him?), and shows that he has a complete lack of understanding in what made the original film a classic. If Rob Zombie wanted to do something far away from the concept of the original and play the auteur, then he should have written his own film, with his own characters and use a title that isn't known to many, many people. By posting the interview, I was trying to bring John Carpenter's point of view (from a long time ago, yes, I know) into the discussion, since it seemed that some people have brought up similar points in their objections to this film. Actually, I got that issue in the mail the other day, and thought it was strangely coincidental that all this hubbub about the remake was going on, and here was an old interview in which the original filmmaker himself addresses those same issues.
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Ken Russell's "Halloween" with music by Rob Zombie? Now that would be worth $10 and drinks!
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Still, he did play "Pookie" in "New Jack City." Plus, he's got a bigger bank account than you or I, so he must be doing something right.
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Because at this point, there are cheap whores who, most likely, have bigger bank accounts than me.Of course, they may be good at what they do. As for me, I'm late to work right now (it was supposed to be my day off, FUCK YOU Corporate America), so TTFN.
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When he does it's all the same bullshit. Rednecks, women talking about their anatomy for his amusement, and classic rock.
I would rather have a man who is competent and makes intelligent films remake it if it absolutely had to be remade, as opposed to just saying "well, this idiot loves horror, let's let him make it, and then apologize if he pinches out another loaf onscren by saying ROB LOVES HORROR." When will people who are NOT his longtime fans stop trying to cover his ass on his films? -
Here's the thing: those screenings are meant to gauge reactions from certain groups. They are deliberately organized to figure out whether or not certain demographics are going to be interested in seeing the movie. They have a quota of certain types.There's a demographic that is already in line for this movie. Practically already have tickets in hand. Don't need to know what they think for the purposes of this test.We need to know what 17-to-21 year old females think. The theater is filling up, we don't have enough of them in here, but there's already a lot of guys in their thirties wearing glasses and black T-shirts. Could you go out into the line, Mable, and pick some of that group out? While you're there, ask them if they are a.) non-horror fans, but regular movie goers, who might be intrigued enough to go see a remake of HALLOWEEN or b.) goth chicks whose money has already been spent because Rob Zombie is god.Skip the goth chicks, they're already gonna be there on opening weekend. Find enough of those "average" teenie-boppers to fill the quota of 17-to-21 year old chicks and then we can fill the seats with whomever else we need.They strategically NEED to get the opinions of certain types when they're putting these screenings on. It's all about who to market to when the TV, radio and print ads start to roll out. They need to know who to appeal to.See if they decide to do a TV spot or two focusing solely on Laurie and her friends and the jeopardy they get into...or do they just show Michael slashing through everyone he sees (the current ad campaign).They will have made (or not made) those TV spots because they knew whether or not they could appeal to teenage girls. And they will have known that because they went through the line and picked out the teen girls over the 35-year-old dudes in their MIchael Myers T-shirts.It's not about whether or not "everyone thinks it's good," it's about whether or not certain key groups of people would tell their friends to go and see it.
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I still would like to see a group of Catholic high school girls attend a Rob Zombie screening(In uniform, no less.) and fill out those cards. Herein lies the conundrum; would they be offended or would they go wild over it? The mind boggles! And Dum Guy, I hear you! I get a day off today (Hallalujah!), but tomorrow I get to go back to Mr. Man's Salt Mines. Ain't life grand?
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it is
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Mammaries and Gerber for all the crying over zombie you do. Who cares what trials & tribulations zombie has getting his "films" made? Stuart Gordon, for one, has made plenty of VERY low budget films (no quotes needed there) and managed to overcome those limitations and created quality work that zombie could NEVER hope to equal, even with a Spielbergian budget. When it comes to budget, it's more the man than the money. And another thing, I know that I, and most others on this site prefer to think of ourselves as "good movie fans" rather than limiting ourselves to being simply "horror fans", but to humor you I will wear that title for the sake of arguement. How can "horror fans" be spoiled when the most we can usually hope for is to get at least 2 decent to good ones a year? It's not like there's been a flood of great horror films lately (at least not since the 80s)to "spoil" us. And please stop asking us if we prefer some music video director to zombie when zombie IS ONE! It's been pointed out to you before, but it seems that little nugget hasn't soaked in yet.
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Ok, let me just say that when I hear Rob Zombie was going to “reimagine” (remark in other words) I was very worried. It’s no secret that Rob is a big fan of the horror genre and his first attempt –HOUSE OF A 1000 CORPSES- sucked elephant balls. Rob himself said it suck and wasn’t happy with the end product. I have to give Rob an A for effort. The DEVIL’S REJECT was a lot better than 1000 Corpses, but in no way, shape or form does garner Rob a notation of a potential “great filmmaker.” It takes years and years of filmmaking and trial-and-error to hone in your skills of storytelling and visional presentation. Now back to Rob, have done 2 films; 1 miss and 1 hit, Rob is batting a 1 for 1, THAT alone should make him ineligible for a remake for a film of the caliber of HALLOWEEN. HALLOWEEN is a classic for all horror fans, and is a huge and monumental task to take on for some one such as Rob to be given the ok to play with. Rob is barely wet behind the ears with making a movie, and to give him HALLOWEEN to remake and play around just makes me think that the studios really don’t give a shit and disrespect the movies they are tampering with and more importantly REALLY don’t fucking care about their REAL audience. . . the horror fans. The horror fans have been outspoken and most times than not right as to how a remake is going to turn out. Who better to listen to? The horror fans! Who better to target for a horror movie? The horror fans! But Rob is in NO WAY! to the level of a Carpenter or Romero to tackle a remake; especially on a movie that has cemented its legacy in the horror genre as HALLOWEEN. Why not have Rob cut his teeth on some movies that sucked in the past and try to make them better. The 80’s were filled with sucky ass movies. Hell, why not remake all those GOD AWEFUL video game movies. When I was watching Street Fighter II: the Animated Movie; the live action came to mind and how horrible it was really screams to be done right. Movies like STREET FIGHER, MARIO BROS. and DOUBLE DRAGON came to mind, and that is just the fucked up video game movies. Don’t even get me started on the shitty ass horror movies that were being cranked out by the bundle. But for Rob Zombie presents HALLOWEEN, I’m really think the studios made a mistake on giving it to Rob. Your messing with an iconic character and a memorable movie for a legion of horror faces. Your dancing in a mine field here Zombie and no matter what you do you will step on a mine. I see no way to actually make this movie your own and still not get your ass chewed. They should have given Rob some thing else to do instead of this. I really hope that he does as least some justice to the movie, but its seems that the studio is already on the path to “fucking it up” before Rob is even give a chance to fuck it up himself.
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And anyone who says "Rob Zombie is the real deal" is a fucking tool. There is nothing real about Rob Zombie. From his name to his dreadlocks to his facepaint to his redneck-horror aesthetic, the man is as CONTRIVED as it is possible to be.
You say 'i'm not stuck to the "rules" and conventions'--- no, you're apparently stuck to the KNOT in Rob Zombie's DOG DICK instead, so fuck off! -
infantile crying over rob zombie's career.As in "Boo hoo, robbie worked SO hard on his (shitty,read the plot outline)CROW 3 script.WAAAH!DEVIL'S RETARD'S is a great film! Why are you picking on robbie? I don't understand how people don't think zombie's as good or worse than (any other) music video director." I don't see how the joke slipped by you. Where you get a "TORTURE PWN1" hates tits vibe out of it I don't know. I suppose you're just grasping at straws.
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I think you guys are really missing the point and getting off topic... I got cockblocked at the screening... what the fuck!
really though MOM"In an interview, Rob Zombie said he decided to accept to direct a remake before anybody else did (he was one of the very first directors approached for that project) so that at least soembody who actually cared for the original was doing it. "
I don't know about you, but if i'm a director in Hollywood and someone comes to me with the idea of a remake- if it's a film that was done right the first time (as in it's a classic), i'm passing on it. even if it means someone else who cares less about the original than i do might direct it. let some other jackass be associated with making a lame ass remake for the rest of their career, then in interviews i can tell everyone how i passed on it cause it never should have been remade.
by the way, you're all wrong on the jj abrams trailer... watch it again... he's remaking "attack of the killer tomatoes"
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i enjoyed parts of transformers- the action sequences and megan fox. don't know if that puts me in the "michael bay dick sucking category", but maybe more the "michael bay ball-fondling category(outside the shorts)"... i would like to remind everyone, opinions are like assholes- some are for shitting on others and some are filled with dick, but yours always smells better to you than the guy in the next stall... and in response to mr monkey... yeah i almost pee'd my big boy pants cause the last 3 screening offers i got were "license to wed", "you me and dupree" , "night at the museum" i have shit luck when it comes to these things. regardless if "halloween" was good or blew retarded midgets with b-acne, there would at least be tits and gore and no ben stiller.
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transformers is like a dried cow turd- sure, it's technically shit,but you can have fun tossing it around as long as you wash your hands afterwards. as opposed to say a "ghost rider"or "van helsing". they are the shit pile where you trip and fall with your mouth open and the taste seems to never leave you- in fact if you think hard enough about it, you can still taste it. and, for the record- i love tits...love em love em love em.
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childish you've gotten after you've had your ass handed to you?
I know you're stumped for comebacks, but to make up things?
I like tits just fine, but I'm surprised you're not defending Gerber, your other favorite food source, with equal vigor! And I suppose imagining I'm a Michael Bay fan helps you sleep at night. Whatever stories you can have your mommy to tell you at nigh-night time, I suppose. -
after the detailed shot breakdown of Devil's Rejects a few posts up. Jesus Christ.
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with all the spelling errors. There's a difference between an honest typo or two and someone who doesn't know the difference or give a shit. I'd love it if he WERE zombie. He needs his ego to be taken down a peg or two.
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what i was doing is what is referred to as "ranting". you must either work in the industry or just enjoy pointing out the obvious.....
my whole point is that studios don't give a shit if they make a quality product, just what the opening weekend box office is. i get that it's a business, money is the end all be all. but where is it written you have to sacrifice quality to get box office? don't you want more overall quality in your film viewing choices, or do you want to have to decide between seeing "fantastic four 2" or "ghost rider"? it's like the episode of south park, do you want a giant douche, or a turd? and as for being guaranteed my ticket money, very few movies are guaranteed my money at the box office-least of all a a remake of a classic like halloween. pixar is 7 for 7 in box office and quality, they are guaranteed my money. anything with natalie portman nude, my money in their pockets. but you keep towing the company line... keep doing business as usual -
and increasing craziness. I think we're actually witnessing a "Rob Zombie Asslicker" meltdown. Guess what Mammaries; unlike you, I didn't even go SEE Transformers. Who's the fucking Bay fanboy now? So you not only tongue the corn out of Rob Zombie's shit, you also support Michael Bay... awesome.
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As a matter of fact I don't think I've sat through ANY Michael Bay directed film in its entirety EVER. Seen all of THE ROCK, just not all in one sitting. Thanks for inspiring this moment of self-analysis Daddylonghead!
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I saw BAD BOYS at the drive-in, lo these many years ago, as a double feature with some other retarded movie.
In fact, while I don't remember it happening during BAD BOYS specifically, I tended more often than not to get blowjobs from my girlfriend while at the drive-in... it was one of our "things," ah youth... so that means I may have actually EXPERIENCED ORGASM WHILE VIEWING A MICHAEL BAY MOVIE.
Damn you, TORTURE PWN, for inspiring that terrible realization! -
Just had to go & catch TRANSFORMERS again didn't you?
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What the hell was that?
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And I gotta hang the stuff somewhere!
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What is it? What ISN'T IT?
It's so much. It's a product sold on late-night infomercials. It's a bluegrass song (to the tune of Turkey in the Straw). It's an ultraviolent Manga reviewed on AICN-Anime. It's the platinum-selling follow-up to "Trapped in the Closet." It's a shocking headline from the year 2037. It's... time for me to go get beer. DDYLNGHD U A TITS-HATTER 2? -
Fuck you rob zombie. You fucking suck.
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