Cool News
"Deep Space Nine" series finale tidbits
SPOILER ALERT !!
Glen here...
...with a little news about the series finale of Deep Space Nine.
The two hour closing episode will be entitled "Fin de Siècle". This translates to "an apocalyptic
climax...the end of an age", or in French for "end of the century" or "end of an era". ((Glen Note:
why does enumerating these interpretations remind me of Wayne's World?)). If this
interpretation isn't entirely correct, feel free to chime on on the Talkbacks below.
Now, trekweb is reporting the following
rumors about the series finale. Please note, these are rumors. HREF="http://www.trekweb.com">Trekweb identifies them as such, and so do I.
As a side note - I suppose all of this means there's now a script for the big finale. Yes...oh
yes...I would like to see that script - please note the P.O. Box address below. I will be a good boy
with it :-) In fact, the only reason I haven't covered Star Trek more thoroughly is because
Paramount's security is so damn good, and because sites like HREF="http://www.trekweb.com">trekweb have pretty much cornered the market as far as
covering the franchise goes (and have done a magnificent job with their coverage, by the way).
Now, onto those final rumors from HREF="http://www.trekweb.com">trekweb.
THIS IS THE ONLY WARNING YOU WILL RECEIVE
!!!
POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW !!!
IF YOU GO PAST THIS POINT, I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT
YOU SEE!!!
Trekweb says:
Rumor has it that the Enterprise E may make a
cameo. Also, Sloan from Section 31 may be returning (so hints writer Bradley
Thompson), expect the season-long allusions to the Battle of Alamo to "pay off,"
as well as to see Sisko join the leagues of the Prophets.
Glen again...
Glen
Or call:
(512) 347-1992
Mail can be sent to:
Glen Oliver
P.O. BOX 160812
Austin, TX 78716-0812
USA
P.O. BOX 160812
Austin, TX 78716-0812
USA
Austin, TX 78716-0812
USA
USA
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+ Expand All
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Whooptie doo da....I'm thrilled..JOY! Boobieprize "E" will cameo? Actors cameo not spaceships. Sisko joins the leauge of the Prophets? YAY! JOY! Spencer for Hire got picked up for 2 new movies? YAY! JOY!! YAWN....Will DS9 move into the Paramounts STAR TREK movies? probably not. why? Cause nobody cares about this show anymore.... I'm thrilled...whooptie dooo....I'll try and contain my exitment :OP Mck
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this seasons episodes have been for the most part..less than stellar
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Please just put the entire damn franchise on ice for 5 years or so, okay? Voyager has become unwatchable, and DSP is ready for mothballs.
I love the world of Star Trek, but it doesn't need constant exposure if Paramount can't find capable, original writers to do the deed.
red -
Do we really need any more of this bullshit? Why can't they just call it a day and admit that the show is going nowhere - even the finale sounds like trash!?! The writers are the chief dickheads responsible - THEY THINK THEY'RE FUCKING SPECIAL, AND ALWAYS KNOW WHAT'S BEST (Brannon Braga - Voyager's producer - is typical of this). When the next Star Trek show appears (which it will, sooner rather than later) the powers-that-be would be wise to hire some writers that understand Sci-Fi, instead of this bunch of fucking losers. Star Trek in it's current form IS DEAD!!!
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As I reformed Trekkie (I never did buy into that "Trekker" crap), let me agree wholeheartedly that there is no reason to continue with TREK at all. INSURRECTION was the first film I missed in the theaters and both DS9 and V'GER don't interest me in the slightest. With EPISODE I coming out, I think it's a safe bet to say that no one in their right mind gives two shits about the DS9 finale. At least when TMP came out in '79, it had been a good 10 years since we'd seen any new TREK footage. But for the past 12 years (!!!) we've had a NON-STOP barrage of all things STAR TREK... AND IT ALL LOOKS AND SOUNDS THE SAME! I agree: Get out the pick-axe and shovel and just bury it already.
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I came to this Talkback to give my 10 cents worth (Canadian, which IS about $0.02US) about why Trek should be canned... But you... you... "people" have beaten me to it. So just to be contrary I will say something *nice* about Trek. It... Um... Shit I can't think of ANYTHING...
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Jerry Ryan's Tits, THAT's what good about Trek (Granted after you see'em once, there's really no point to continue watching the show...). I personally like Leftie better than Rightie (Just MY opinion I don't want any Trekk(ies(ers(etts) to slam me for picking favorites).
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To mckracken, Interloper, and all others who do nothing but complain about today
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I strongly suggest that Paramount let Trek die a quiet death. DS9 (which has gotten so bad in the last two seasons, it's like watching a loved one die a slow painful death)is just about done. Voyager has never been good, and only once, as far as I recall, ever even approached mediocrity. Cancel it, and no more Star Trek on the tube. After 5-10 years start up a brand new show, with new characters, new producers, and new writers. The writers these days suck.
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Look, I'm sick and tired of people commenting about Jeri Ryan's tits. I mean I agree that she was put on the show as eye candy, but there's more to Voyager than Jeri Ryan's tits! She also has a fine ass.
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Mar 18, 1999 10:54:20 AM CST
Awww, poor wuttle geeks offended by the continued existence and
by ilvenshang
DS9's always been something of a Jack-of-all-trades, master of none. Y'know what, tho?
It can beat any 90's show at its own game. That's more a tribute to the mediocrity of the era than to DS9's quality, but it's true. DS9 - when it bothers - is funnier than any sitcom on the air. It can be weirder than Xfiles (tho XF isn't very weird, at least not if you've ever read Philip K Dick). Its space battles are far more impressive than B5's, and its politics are more believable
because they're rooted in the personalities of nuanced characters played by skillful actors (the intrigues on B5 always played like lectures on political theory). Its romances, though stupid, can whip those of any soap opera. Its family relations stuff is more interesting than Providence or Promised Land, its take on religion not noticeably cruder than Touched by an Angel's.
So shed a tear for its demise, inspite of its flaws. When it goes, the quality of TV programming's gonna drop by 80% or thereabouts -
I'm still a fan of this show. At first it was crap but near the end of season two I started to see some inovative writing. By season three, they ahd written four episodes in a row that didn't involve Kira crying and that's when DS9 won my loyalty.
However, what has really rubbed my ass raw this season is all of the fluff episodes. The producers have seemingly decided that they have a set storyline to lead them to the end of the series and that all other episodes must be pure marshmallow. With a limited number of shows left, I have wanted to absorb each instalment. But what do we get? Baseball!?! Nog's Vegas Rehab?!? Vic Fontaine in general?!!?!?! The geneticly enhanced opera singers?!?!!!?$%*@$%^#$^&$! (WTF were they thinking there? 5 minutes of DO RE ME LA SO DA)
The writers need to be pistol whipped!
(taking deep breaths) Sorry. It just makes my ass twitch to see such wonderful writing opportunities get pissed away. -
Mar 18, 1999 11:13:37 AM CST
DS9 and why they should stop the trek franchise for all time.
by bishop
DS9 is now, without a doubt in my mind, the worst Trek show ever. No I haven't been able to watch Voyager lately (UPN not existing in Rochester), but DS9 has gotten progressively crappier as time has moved on.
For example: Originally, the whole point of the wormhole was for new beings and cultures to be introduced to the show. A main tenant of Trek is "to seek out new life and new civilization." DS9 hasn't found anything new since it's third season. DS9 is too busy trying to be like B5 to get back to what Star Trek is all about. -
Yes I know, like ONE person chimed in in favor of DSNEIN but that person made a comment that ticked me off. Tape Hound had the nerve to say this:
"You constantly gripe about the lack of originality in sci-fi, but do you actually have a solution? I -
You don't have to get rid of Star Trek. Just return to the days of fake planets and cleavage-enhancing mini-skirts. And could we get rid of all the shadows and gray on DS9 and Voyager? I like my Star Trek full of color and life, not everyone wearing the same uniform and bitching and moaning about their angst-filled existences while on sets so poorly lit that you get eyestrain just following the action.
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In my previous post, I meant Star Trek IN GENERAL has no place to go - NOT JUST DS9. But, as you seem to be a bigger dickhead than the writers - you missed the fucking point. Star Trek SUCKS, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA - there, at least I can laugh about it without foaming at the mouth!!
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I have just about had it with all the friggin Trek bashing. Turn it off then. The politics of Ds9 was awesome. They integrated a huge cast of characters for a number of years and managed to tell stories that at times brushed on pure excellence. A friend once puty it to me that it's were not as high as TNG but when they were...Hey I absolutely love B5. And I'm sick about what happend to Crusade. And I also admit that each STAR TREK series had several flawed episodes-Remember Way to Eden? or (not even mentioning Spocks Brain)You take the bad w/ the good and being an independent filmmaker- and writer you do your best and experiment and at times you fail. The characters are cool and the story lines are usually complex. THAT IN ITSELF is anachievement for TV the land of the shitty sitcom.
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Well, I've seens everything.
On comparing B5v.DS9 (a very tired discussion to say the least), one talkbacker said, " Its (DS9's) space battles are far more impressive than B5's, and its politics are more believable because they're rooted in the personalities of nuanced characters played by skillful actors (the intrigues on B5 always played like lectures on political theory)..."
1): Even with the addition of CGI effects to Trek, they don't compare. I could make those effects at home on my PC. Whoopty-Do.
2): Politics more believable? What, did you fail your high-school civics class? Have you had civics? Personality interaction IS key to drama in general as well as political intrigue, but Jeez! Nuanced personalities in Trek? Let's see. In 198x (x=4 to 7), We see Warf, Klingon want-to-be, stoic and unbending, yet a truly interesting character. In 1999, some 15 years later, we see Warf, Klingon want-to-be, stoic and unbending. !zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz! Yeah, there's subtle nuance for ya.
3) How would you know what was being said during a lecture on political theory, anyway. !zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz! -
Heehee, twisted little Behr and his goons have you right where he wants you...don't you know that those lunatic DS9 writers like nothing better than controversy? If you REALLY wanted to insult them and their brainchild, you'd shut up and ignore DS9 altogether. I probably wouldn't like this show as much as I do if it didn't make people soooo hopping mad!
PS - to the guy with the unsold spec script: grow up. Are you the only writer in LA without a shrink? Or is there some other reason why you can't handle rejection? -
Yes, I can't stand DS9 or anything else TREK for that matter, but I'll try to resist the urge to rip into those who think that the show has anything left to offer. But let me just ask this: Does anyone notice how DS9 supporters always seem to readily acknowledge that their show needs work, even when they're trying to defend it? Like, "I know the show suffers from goofy romance plots, but..." Or, "The show could use some work here or there, but that's no reason..." Blah, blah, blah, etc. Face it, DEEP SPACE NINE has earned its criticism because IT'S NEVER BEEN ANY GOOD! Rick Berman and his ilk took an idea that was sub-par to begin with and slapped the STAR TREK name on it while Roddenberry was rotting away and too weak to do anything about it but give it his "blessing." When the show isn't warming over any old, tired TREK plot, it's wallowing in the incredibly dull backstory of Bajorans and Cardassians and Jem'Hadar and whatever new alien race that blows chunks. The entire cast is the worst out of all of the TREK shows (right behind V'GER--TNG being the best). The show was stale from the get-go, the opening credits and theme music stink, and grabbing Worf was an act of desperation if ever there was one. So, enjoy your finale. You certainly have the right to. The rest of us just aren't buying it. (And someone get Avery Brooks to an acting class, pronto!)
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Amen to Berserker and tape Hound! DS9 is, far and away, consistently the best written Trek of all. It's worst episode this season still is far superior to the enjoyable, but HIGHLY OVER-RATED Babylon 5. most of the "criticism"-- and I'm using that term VERY loosely- that I've read of the show on this sight apparently is coming from a bunch of 14 year olds who think they're sophisticated because they say "fuck", "shit", and "sucks" alot. Surely, there are some other adults here who would care to weigh in?
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Mar 18, 1999 12:29:38 PM CST
To the B5 fan who can actually write in complete sentences
by ilvenshang
Uh, no offense, but B5's FX look even more like they come off a home PC than DS9's do.
Secondly, if you want to criticize DS9's characters, why pick out Worf (a carry-over from another, shallower show)? The DS9 writers didn't create him, and are by most accounts rather unhappy with having had to bring him aboard to please the suits.
Thirdly, I'm familiar with the lame idealistic books which put forward the political theories you see on B5. Unlike you, I also discovered somewhat deeper, more cynical materials on the subject (do the name Machiavelli and Disraeli mean anything to you. I thought not) -
FYI, it's not that I can't handle rejection, you missed the point COMPLETELY. I am totally cool with rejection - hell, I'm a GOOD writer in Hollywood - the point was that someone on this board was complaining that they wanted us whiners to put our money where our mouths are - guess what, I have. That was the point - I REVEL in rejection - it's how I know I'm trying hard enough. I'm not bitter in the least. Why do I keep watching DS9? I don't. I just hate to see what happened to it and the rest of Trek. I'll probably watch the finale, but only out of respect for it once having been part of something that was once cool. Oh and FYI, I never swear in my posts and as you can see I can form a sentence and am not a fan of B5. Thanks for reading. -peteski@spinninghead.com
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First of all we know the series has gone down hill since it has been revived. The first few seasons and some episodes here and there of TNG were not that good. Look at Picard and Riker in the first few seasons and then the last few. Crap all I remeber Picard doing in the first few seasons, was that shit eating grin he always had on. Until eventually he became a little more seasoned and got rid of that stupid grimace. Riker was just has bad.
All in all it was a good series, we got to see the Borg, a Kligon serving on the Enterprise, and more developement of the ST "universe", wether it was good or bad.
ST:Love Potion #9
It has had more bad moments than good. The begining of the series was mediocre, with just enough intrest to give it some hope. The series grew more interesting once they actually started going on the other side of the worm hole, then you had the whole Founders and Gem'hadar(sp?) which sparked some really good episodes where everything gets blown to shit!!! This year has been really crappy, some mentioned the 4 Tenors Episode... FUCK I wanted to puke.... what the hell was that shit and the last few episodes all on the damn holosuite shit, the only ones that were any good were in TNG with Moriarty.
ST:Lost In Space
Need I say more.....
I watch the first one.... then watched the last Borg "movie".... They want to kill the whole franchise off don't they?!
I can't accept Janeway for a captian, and the rest of the crew is just as fucking lame as her. and 7-ATE-9 may have some big tits, but they had some way better looking women on TNG, tits and all.
They need to take a break for a few years, come up with some new ideas. Get away from the Federation, possibly look at the other races we have been exposed to. Klingons, Cardassians(sp?), even a series on the Ma'Kee(sp?, something else aside from Federation -
...Is there nothing more amusing than a pissed-off Trekkie? Maybe a tribble with gas?
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Peteski, it wasn
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Sounds like sour grapes to me.
You can't sell your script so you trash the show. Like most things
in life, if you don't like it then
don't watch it.
Why do you even write in if
it's such a bad show? I happen to like the show so I'm interested in
news about it. You don't see me in Dr. Qu..n Medicine Woman chatrooms
bitching.
My guess as to why they didn't read your script..they can tell what type of childish asshole you are and want nothing to do with your boring little script.
Ashikaga
mgoddard@law.fsu.edu -
....this is television you people are griping about. I know this is an entertainment forum. I know it's about that trek thing (you can tell how much I watch TV). But, come on, let's find something new to complain about. With every single article Glenn puts up about most any science fiction show, there are always the people who feel the need to keep beating the dead horse. Find a new arguement, or even find something else to put that energy into, like finding a date.
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The facts about Trek are This: Despite being the flagship Show on UPN, and being MArketed up the wazoo Voyager is NOT getting good ratings. Despite being a part of THE MOST recognizable franchise in TV history, and being cross promoted with 3 other series and 9 movies, DS9 is nowhere NEAR the top of the syndicated market. And finally, despite having an ENTIRE network, two first-run series, 2 in syndication, and a 8 movie legacy, ST:I was a flop (though not a bomb (they DID pull a small profit). Star Trek is dying, due to over-exposure, bad writing, and TERRIBLE management (read: Rick Berman). Star Trek is dead, Jim. PS I agree that Jerri Ryan, in addition to nice tits (of which I STILL favor Leftie), also has a nice ass.
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You know what? Deep Space Nine is perhaps the best out of all the Star Trek series because
it stayed honest with what it set out to do and it all tied together. I dont understand how people can hate this show and say its for geeks and at the same time like really stupid crap like Dr. Who?!! and get all excited over Strange world, now those are shitty shows! -
This talkback is just too damn funny!
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Ilvenshang,
Thanks for the compliment. It is extremely embarrassing when people get so wrapped up that they can't even type anymore. 1) Your right, B5's effects look like they were made on a home PC because they were, and so can DS9's. 2) I choose Worf because he's a main character-not from the beginning but he best illustrates the staleness of most (only most) of Trek's characters. Now believe you me - I'll be there on finale day, VCR on the ready when it shows, as I have been for every ep of Trek (sans Vgr) and am looking forward to it. And many of the actors ARE good at what they do. Avery is THE MAN when it comes to being bad (as in attitude). he's great. But it is not the actors that I complain about, it's the writing. 3) Machiavellian intrigue is at the heart of B5 and even some elements of Trek. But here is the difference. Case in point: Our DS9 heroes bravely fight and fight until they get back their station and control the wormhole and as soon as they're back on board its off to the holodeck for a little sim-whatever. NOTHING HAS A LASTING EFFECT. Everything is neatly wrapped up by the end of the episode or at best one episode later (rarely more than that). Events should cause people to consider themselves. "How does this effect me?" People should change. We all do. Hell, I used to swear by TNG. Not anymore. I will be sad (in a very non-life-effecting-way) when DS9 goes, and I will look forward to some better Trek in the Future, but I will never loose sight of what I expect from a show for it to be classified as GOOD. Don't loose sight of quality.
BlackOmega1 -- OUT -
I can handle the fact that people don't like Deep Space Nine but try to sound like you have some intelligence.
It seems that the only word in their vocabulary is the word "fuck".
You claim that Babylon 5 is an intelligent show so maybe try to make out that there are intelligent people watching it. -
Wasn't Paramount recently proposing yet another Star Trek series about a ship full of Vulcans?
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berserker,
as I said, MOST characters. Odo would BE that exception for me. Odo is the best Trek example of character development. He was DS9's replacement for Data. He is interesting, even though the year-after-year hankering for Kira is a bit drole. She's a babe, no doubt, but when was the last time you patiently waited for a woman to come to her sences and realize, You D' Man. O.K., maybe it's just me, but anyway. Now If I try I'm sure I can pull up a B5 character that was stale. ... ... .... .. . ... .... O.K. How about CMDR Sinclair. No, he's just a bad actor... well, help me out. I'm sure you can come up with one faster than I. I'm a BIT biased. But anyway, again. Address the "wrapped up nicely in a bow by the end of the episode" thing I was talking about. Does it not exist? -
Jesus Christ with a broomstick up his holy ass! People, people, calm y'alls asses down. It's just a TV program. Don't worry so about it. Go outside and enjoy some of that nature and other good shit, read a book, find a half-ass decent looking girl who'll happily fuck you for a free dinner at the Dairy Queen. Help yourselves to a life. They're a really fun thing to have. Trust me. I recommened it wholeheartedly
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Dude, you are so lame - sour grapes indeed. I am not bitter and I have said so. In fact, please see my post above (that you so conveniently DIDN'T READ) that addresses the first part of your argument. As for the second part "why do I try to write for it if I don't like it" here's what I have to say to that: SIMPLE, Trek USED to be cool - now it's not. If you see something that you care about start to suck, wouldn't you do your best to try to get in there so you can help it? Stop being so shallow in your judgement. And this next part is for Tape Hound. Thanks so much for your cool post. You commented "Making one episode less clich
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Of course, it's all pointless.There are many things in life that deserve such fierce debates more than a TV show.But the debate goes on and that's a sign that DS9 writers did something right.Naturally,I do realise that 90% of this page's postings contents is about egos,about a chance to become a TV critic for a while.Myself included,of course.
This said,and,trying to talk about the show and not about "how clever I am" - here's why I LIKE DS9:
Yes,DS9 abandoned the "strange new life in every episode" approach - but I'd rather watch two or three thoroughly thought out alien cultures develop and interact over a few seasons than be subjected to an "alien of the week" with slightly different forehead make up and no depth to the culture and motivations.
Yes,DS9 might not be strictly sci fi.But I've always respected Trek writers attempts at incorporating other genres into the show.There's been some good comedy,mystery,political thriller episodes on DS9.In a sci fi setting they've always been pleasantly weird and often - wonderful.And the holodeck theme was great at exploring the perception of reality and how it could be changed in most surprising ways.
Yes,the characters might not have developed much,but those were interesting characters and good actors from the beginning.And some brilliant ones were introduced later (Eddington,Marritza(Duet), Tain,Sloan,etc).
Yes,the writing was sometimes unoriginal - but the directing always compensated."Sacrifice of Angels",for example,had weaknesses but it was an epic episode that had just the right measure of witty dialogues(Dukat and Weyoun),drama (Dukat & Ziyal)and action (DS9 SFX beat space scenes I've seen in Episode One trailer).
I'm sure DS9 finale will be at least as good as "All Good Things" and though I wouldn't see it,I'd search the web for every video clip and every piece of info available.
Oh,and about DS9 politics - take it from a Russian citizen - it's VERY lifelike.... -
I hardly ever comment myself, but I had to respond to this nonsence.
First, more than half of you are so biased against Star Trek in general that it immposible to have an intelligent conversation with you to begin with. Your use of language such as "sucks, tits, shit, and fuck confirms this.
Second, why must one love B5, and have to hate Star Trek and vice versa? Though B5 is my favorite show of all time, I still loved all of the Star trek series except Voyager.
Third, most of you do not even watch the show, so how can you even have an opinion? You think you can judge a show from the ten or so episodes you have seen? If you take ANY show in existance and see the ten worst shows of that series, you may think it sucks, but that does not mean that it does.
Fourth in response to some of the posts above. Even fans of the show thinks it needs work? Sure, even the very best shows need work. There is no such thing as a perfect show, and if you care to argu, someone would disagree and there for it is not perfect. As far as the "writer" who thinks he can do better, if you are so great, why do we have to go online to read your stories instead of watch them.
Finally, as said before why do you care? I did not like that 2 hour voyager movie, but I did not find it nessasarry to bash the ones who did, or say that the series or franchise "sucks" based on that. No one is forcing you to watch this show, and no one is forcing you to post these messages, so grow up. -
Finally,someone who likes both B5 and Trek.Why such people are so hard to find is one of the greatest mysteries of the Universe.
I've watched both.I've been bored and disappointed by both at different times.I've been thinking of stopping watching both shows.There was always some episode that persuaded me to continue.I'm glad I did.In any case,you can't keep up good quality throughout a series.Filmmaking is not a conveyer - belt industry after all. -
DS9 has been an amazing show to watch for the past seven years. It took the Star Trek premise and went off in a completely new direction. This was something the fans never expected. It has always been exciting with twists and turns all the way. It has come to be my favorite of the four Trek shows because of it's willingness to take risks no other Trek show has taken. We've seen the introduction of the Dominion, The Maquis, The Prophets, and of course the war. It's been like a runaway train: It keeps building speed and the excitment level rises each and every year. I did find some of the episodes in the middle of this year (The Murder, She Wrote episodes with Dax) to be kind of dull and out of place. I mean they have a war to wrap up!! I figure they had the shows written that would wrap up all the shows plot threads and needed "filler" shows before those aired. I mean the Dax/Murder shows werent BAD they just seemed out of place. I mean with only a few months left to go I think most fans were more interested in the war and prophet subplots. In any even I can't wait to see this finale. This show has just been building and building over the course of these past seven years and it all comes down to this. I hope it's worth the wait, but DS9's writters havent ever let me down before. I'm sure they won't now. The idea of the infamous Star Trek: Voyager being the "lone Trek" on TV is a scarey thought, though. If those writers havent gotten it right in 5 years then I have to wonder if they EVER will. Oh, well, maybe some of DS9's writters will jump ship to Voyager. If the DS9 writers can't fix that sorry excuse for a show then no one can!
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The fierce debate on this site is a sign that DS9 did something right? Are you serious? Easily half of Treks longtime fanbase is so upset at being pissed upon, that they vent their frustration to a message board, and this is a GOOD THING? When you read talkbacks like this, its easy to understand why sci-fi is in such a massive decline lately. Trekkies have been swallowing shit for almost 10 years now and BEG for more, X-philes are being jerked around, so that Carter can restructure his show into a neverending film series and they beg for more, BFivers (I am ashamed to say) were subjected to a useless fifth season and 3 truly awful movies and they are FIGHTING for more! And you know what, the general populace, for the most part dismisses it ALL! Baseball fans when faced with greedy Baseball players and owners who striked during quite possibly the GREATEST baseball season ever (1994), y'know what the following couple of seasons THEY STAYED AWAY FROM THE BALLGAMES! MLB had to MAKE IT UP TO THEM! Diddo for hockey (who has YET to make it up to its fans, AND suffers financially because of it). When Basketball locked out its players, did we see a great "SAVE THE NBA" campaigns or Websites? No. People said, go solve your problems and when/if you put a good show on the floor we'll be there. A couple times before, people have posted before about the desperation that Franchise fans (which I distinguish from Science Fiction junkies) and their unbelieveble defensiveness and bunker mentality, when speaking in favor of their preferred shows. Y'know I can call in to my local sports Talk show and say that so and so is a bum and should be traded, WITHOUT being attacked personally as part of someones rebuttal. I can even say (as many HAVE said) in hockeys capital (Montreal) that the team is horrible and should give up on making the playoffs. But here, if I say that Star Trek has lost it's soul, and is giving in to mindless violence and TnA, not only am I open to attack but so is anyone who subscribes to my opinion. When I say that the Montreal Canadiens are horrible, nobody rebutts me by saying "Ya but the Nashville Predators are Worse". But when someone says that the writing is bad on Star Trek, we get people rebutting by saying "Well look at the sfx on B5". Until Franchise fans, learn to DEMAND quality, EVEN if it means having NO sci-fi for a while, then the networks and movie houses will continue to piss, crap, and generally jerk you around forever. Of course for a Sci-fi junkie like me it's a little easier. I can reread 1984, or rent A clockwork Orange (Which I DO intend to see Ctowner1;-) PS I honestly think that Jerry Ryan's left Tit SHOULD be nominated for an Emmy for singletittidly holding up UPN (Although to be fair her right tit and both her but cheeks should also be nominated for their supporting roles)
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Why do we always find ourselves in these stupid debates? As a writer myself, yes it is extremely hard to come up with a completely original concept. Why? because for *Most* stories, there is a basic outline. Good. Evil shows up, kicks good out. Good comes back with better and wins the girl. That's about it. I mean really! It's like people were bitching about the Battlestar Galactica movie reported on a few days ago. Star Wars rip off. How? because it had bad guys with bad troops and good guys with good tropps fighting back in space?
Yep. Suck a rip off. Just cuz that story outline has been used forever. Hell, the Camelot legends! It all comes down to Good and Evil. Whether it's B5, which is a great show, or DS9, which is an equally great show. That's just the way it is. Without these basic elements, there would be no point. Originality comes in taking those elements and adding new ones, which, trust me here and I think the writer gentleman in Hollywood above will agree with me, is NOT easy.
Myself? I'll be there for the finale despite it's being on at 11PM here. Why? because I like good stories and good sci fi. There is one thing about DS9, though. It began as one cohesive story. It began with foreshadowing of Sisko's role in the coming war, which we saw as described only as somethign bad for Bajor. It's been set from the beginning. I know alot of sci fi shows that didn't do that. Hell, Exo-Squad had a better storyline that some sci fi shows out there today. Just leave the discussion, and trek alone. Overall, DS9 was a good show, and a good asset to Sci fi in general. That's all I care about, and if you have any intelligence that's what it all boils down to: the story.
That's my two cents for now.-scone@dycon.com -
please please please lets not forget jerri ryans hips! exquisite!
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Dolphanar, and friends: Dolph, I've debated with you before and I think your a pretty smart guy. You have good ideas and I agree with SOME of your opinions. I, however, am sick of people complaining about EVERYTHING. Is there bad sci-fi out there? Yes. Is it ALL bad as some wopuld have us believe? NO! The fans are screaming for drastic changes in STar Trek, and they say they want the characters to grow and change and not stay the same throughout the series. Well, WAKE UP People!! THAT is EXACTLY what DS9 is!!! DS9 is not your father's Star Trek! This show has BALLS! they have done things that are different, and sometimes VERY risky. They have taken chances with topics other Trek shows havent, such as war. This show has been EXCELLENT and continues to be. If the DS9 writers are pissing on me as you say then damn this darn good piss! I wish MORE writers could piss like this! As an aspiring writer I wish I could piss this good! Stop complaining! when you look at TV and movies and find yourself hating something there might be something wrong with the show or movie, but if you find yourself hating EVERYTHING then maybe the problem ISN'T in the programing. Right now Babylon 5, X-Files, Star Trek, and Star Wars are the four main players in Sci-Fi. We've diveded into little camps and are fighting a silly little battle over which of these four franchises is the best. We throw insults at one another and put down the other shows. I've got news for you: ALl four are pretty good. Some are better then others BUT there is a reason these four franchises have gathered the fans they have: They are all pretty well written. You don't see people shouting Wing Commander is better then STar Trek, do you? there is a reason. That wasn't very good at all. These shows have thier strengths and they have thier weakness, but for God's sakes why do we have to say EVERYTHING sucks?? I don't know why I bother because its going to continue and continue and continue....
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THe fisrst reference is good, but the second annoying. I thought Crusher for a women in her 40's was beautiful in her final years on the show, as good as Troi got in the end with the blue uniform (her other uniforms made her look like shit). Jeri Ryan can't hold their bra's, well actually she can hold 3 times their size. Berserker is a hippocrit, he says that we shouldn't come to this website to rip on DS9 if we don't like it, then why does he stick his nose in the B5 talkbacks to make fun of a nearly perfect show (considering only God is perfect, but knowing trekkies they will attack this point while avoiding the other issues I raise). I like DS9 even now because mostly B5 influenced it heavily (stop acting like ostriches and pull you head out of the stand, that is the truth). It started to go the star trek direction till the 3rd season, but that was awkward because it didn't feel like its style and felt like an imitation o f the previous 2. It finally learned from the master (jms) and realized that it was a space station and had a world to explore right at home. They finally began developing their villains, especially Gul Dukat (as mad as Cartagia and the Regent?). Yes they have had terrible episodes this season, the opera one comes to mind. But it found its own style trying to balance humor eps with serious one (but both sides had seriously boring eps like Nogs stay in the holosuite). This is not a perfect show, but eminently more realistic and entertaining then Voyager. It has shown the dark side of the star trek universe, which TNG disappointed me in. Babylon 5 is a much better show, and star trek knows it. WHy else would Majel Roddenbury (the widow queen of you trekkies) guest star on the show and start developing the shows under her executive authority in the B5 format, especially DS9, Earth:fc and the other shows being created by her. I for one want to see the final eps of DS9, they look interesting, but I hope they decide to stop these candy-ass eps and start with the serious ones. And which politics books have you read, if you think the B5 storylines are not possible or realistic. I won't insult your intelligence by quoting specific storyline because you have already heard all them from others in defence of it. Sad enough it has to defend itself to stay on the air, while crap like Voyager and X-files never leave us. I say Alf and Spaceballs were more intesting sci-fis then they both are currently (the first few seasons were excellent at leastt for X-files). We truly are the children of the damned.
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I've been a big fan of Trek for 27 of my 30 years, and yes it has been quite stale for the last 5 or so, I have but one thing to say:
"Get a life!!! Will you people? I mean for crying out loud, it's just a TV show!!!"
- William Shatner,
Guest Host,
Saturday Night Live
Never hath the man said anything truer. -
I thought about her hips (It's one of the FEW things about Voyager which DOES nake me think), but I felt that they where being too under utilized (As compared to her Tits and her ass). I would also like to see more camera time devoted to her legs, and maybe even get a shot of her feet and belly! Of course shots of actors ACTING and REACTING to INTERESTING situations would be nice, but this is Ttrek were talkin' about... PS If amoung the "daring" storylines you are referring to, is the smooch between Kyra and Dax, sorry bub, Melrose place beat you to it...
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NOT! Outer Limits, Law & Order, and The Practice, are ALL exquisitly written, acted AND produced TV shows. I can say very little bad about ANY of them. Attention to detail, and respect for their viewers and subject matter are Hallmarks of Each of those shows. Also Red Dwarf VIII, has recaptured the fun, which was lacking during the previous series (7). And those are just the shows I like that are still in their first run. PS And for Canucks their is always "This hour has 22 minutes" and the "Red Green show" ;-)
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Have we even touched base on Jeri Ryan's lips? I'm telling you, they should put her in that outfit from I Dream Of Jeannie and have her say "Yes, Master" all the time. The ratings would go through the roof! And would adding a row of buxom lifeguards be so wrong?
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I can't say it doesn't upset me to hear all of this negative enrgy focused towards my favorite show of all time, but I can say it does change my mind in the least. I have seen every ep of TOS, TNG, VOY, B5, 90% of Dr. Who, and 80% of Blake's 7, and 80% of Battlestar... I have loved them all. But of all of them, DS9 is my favorite. Can someone tell me what good sci-fi is? I don't know. I do know a good story when I hear it, however, and DS9 does have many of those. Sci-fi is just the milieu for telling a good story, IMHO. All of these show have had their moments, but I argue that DS9 has done the best. I too am a Hollywood writer - unpublished - and let me tell you this: Everyone in LA is either an actor or a writer, so that means nothing. Finally, many of you are bitching about this year's episodes. I have 2 things to say about that. 1) You are disappointed because you want lasers in space battles and ships exploding. These eps were very well done, just not heavy action and not in the Dominion arc. 2) They probably HAVE to do this becasue they are saving up funds for the finale. Paramount isn't going to give a series huge $ in its last year. I will miss you, DS9!
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Sorry I hadn't noticed them... Funny I can't actually remember the last time the camera panned above her neck line (which is also very nice;-). PS Another good Show is Drew Carey's "Who's line is it anyway?" Which is the first time I have EVER seen a British show brought to the US and end up being better than the original (which I also liked).
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It is fine for everyone to have an opinion, really, it is. Those who have it should feel free to voice it. But please refrain from personal attacks on other people's likes and a lack of any semblance of maturity in what you say. Do you think people are going to take you seriously when the gist of most critiques it "It sucks . . . (add other great colloquialisms here). It doesn't give anyone reading your critique any reason to take you seriously. And please, don't compare and evaluate a genre of TV/Film with another that is completely different in both context and subject matter (SW v Startrek). If you don't watch the show - fine. Calm down. There is worse material on TV, far, far, worse than either Voyager and DS9. Far, Far worse.
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Am I weird?
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What's I'm about to say is going to sound strange to some of you, but although I CAN see how someone can passionately LIKE a TV show, I DON'T understand how one can HATE a show. Generally, I just don't watch the shows I don't like, for example, the Roseanne Show, E.R., or anything on the TRavel Channel. At most, I can become very disappointed with a show that either goes downhill or doesn't live up to expectations.--In my opinion, the first few seasons of DS9 were great, but there have been a lot of bad episodes in the past few years. Voyager started out bad, and is usually not that great, But I have to admit that there have been about 6-10 pretty good episodes. As for Babylon 5, I fell in love with it during its pre-cable days, but frankly, the TNT-era episodes, including the movies, weren't as good. That's just my opinion.
In general, I try to hang on even when a show declines, but when I just don't enjoy it anymore it drops off my radar scope, like Stargate, the Outer Limits, and the Visitor. But I don't HATE them; there's no reason too. They're just a small fraction of the hundreds of shows I DON'T WATCH.
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allow some comments please.....
with regard to all the shows being talked about here, they are like just about everything else in life, some good some bad, some really stinko, and some that if you have the option, you click the remote to the off position and read a book.
there is no point getting your nellies in a knot by sniping at each other. it doesn't help anyone, and it sure doesn't help the shows.
as for what "we" can demand, you have to keep some things in mind:
1)if it's not your money, you may not get listened to.
2) if it's not your story idea, you may not get listened to.
3) even if you do get listened to, there is most likely someone else saying the exact opposite of what you're saying, and the powers that be will most likely listen to THEM.
these shows are meant as entertainment. If you enjoy them, fine. if they make you think, even better. they do not stop wars. they do not cure cancer. they rarely help your bank account. do not treat the shows as sacred objects, or their writers as demi-gods. to do so will imperil your sanity.
and as for jeri ryan.....
as a short dumpy female, i try not to be jealous of those mother nature has spent a lot more time and loving care on. it doesn't always work. but with regard to jr, yeah, okay, she's stacked like a bale of hay never was. and star trek has never shied away from using a woman with a nice upholstery job to create a little heat. but the way they have packaged jeri and the timing was so utterly blatant, well even the men folk drooling all over the place have to admit that it spells desperation in capital letters. -
Hello! I'm a narrow minded obsessive B5 fan so naturally I hate Star Trek. I find TOS unwatchable. I consider TNG a dated, heavy-handed, patronising dinosaur of a series with a lot to answer for. I find Voyager's 'moral' stance downright offensive, particularly in its dealings with alien cultures. But absolutely the worst thing I can find to say about DS9 is that at times it's a little dull. In fact recently I've grown very fond of DS9 and I hope that history remembers it as the Star Trek that deliberately set out to break the Star Trek mold and do something a little innovative. It may not always have succeeded, and it's always had a lot of catching up to do. But the writers have taken a tired, dated format and done the best job they can of overhauling it. Crucially, they've managed to introduce elements of magic, legend and prophesy into a universe of cold technology and silly rubber aliens. In my mind that was always what seperated the Star Trek universe from Star Wars and B5. TNG appealed to impressionable teenage technophiles who weren't put off by the show's lack of imagination, drama and action. DS9, with its magnificent epic space battles, larger-than-life heros and villains and wonderfully sly sense of humour has developed into the kind of show that I don't mind watching. People say that it borrowed from B5 which is true, but it also managed to remain utterly true to its original pilot and developed those original ideas further than anyone could have predicted. Its actually a far better spin-off than TNG deserved and a very worthy series in its own right. I hope the final episodes are representative of the series at its best because at its best it has earned my respect. I know Trek fans don't bother to come here very often which is why there are so many one-sided opinions here at the moment. But if I can say these things as a Babylon 5 fan then Trek fans should be screaming them at the world. DS9 fans stand up and support your show!
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The truth is people hate success. When something is successful EVERYONE hates it. ID4 was a HUGE hit so out of the wood work come the people who have to complain about how Devlin and Emmerich are no talent hacks, blah blah blah. Men in Back's a hit? Well let me tell you that movie SUCKED! Wil Smith can't act to save his life....on and on it goes. Can a bad movie become a success? Yes. Just look at Titanic and Twister. Those movies are unwatchable but they were megahits! BUT Something doesnt HAVE to be bad because it's a success! STar Trek is a HUGE hit! It's spawned 4 shows, and 9 movies. That is a collosal monster hit. So now here come the people who have to talk about how much it sucks, its dead, the writing sucks, blah, blah, blah. ENOUGH all ready. Babylon 5 has a small core of fans. It's at that cult stage that Star Trek was in back in 70s. Remember that? Back before it became successful in the 80s when you only had reruns to watch? It was COOL to like Trek back then. But, UH OH! Now they are actually making MONEY!! They are SUCESSFULL NOW! BANG, now we get talkback after talkback about how bad the series is. I LOVE Babylon 5. It's a good show. DS9 is better. So why is everyone Slamming DS9 and screaming thier support for B5? I don't know, It might be bitterness that B5 isn't as successful. I can't say for sure. Its silly though because I can watch B5 without screaming how much it sucks and DS9 rules. They are 2 different shows, and heres a wake up call to those who say DS9 ripped off B5 in the past few years: They DIDN'T. I've seen every DS9 and every B5. Aside from the fact that both take place on a space station there are FEW similarities. Both shows have taken thier premise and gone in different directions. Both shows are EXCELLENT. DS9, however, it better. And as for Voyager? I make fun of this show a lot, BUT I've got news for yiou. While not NEARLY as good as the other 3 Star Trek, (or B5 or the X-files, or Buffy, or whatever other sci-fi show you want to compare it to) It's still fairly entertaining. Id prefer Voyager to the many dime a dozen cop/lawer/doctor dramas on the networks anyday. Now youll all yell and shout and tell me what an idiot I am and how you "dont hate Trek cause its successful, you ghate it cause IT SUCKS" and all that other crap that we hear again and again. I'm not making ANY excuses for DS9. I dont have to excuse perfection, and as far as TV goes thats what DS9 is. IO have NEVER seen a better TV show in my entire life. Cheers was perfection for sitcoms, The Simpsons is perfection for animated fare, Johnny Carson was perfection for late night, and DS9 is perfection for Sci-Fi. These shows are the molds that all others should strive to be like (while injecting as much originality and new ideas as they can) so go ahead and tell me what a fool I am, I dont care anymore
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OK,Trek can be pointless,boring,stupid.But those descriptions can be applied to any TV show.It's not the series -it's the particular EPISODES that count.Well scripted,directed and acted episodes create the show's image.Everything else is sawed by good SFX,design,music,etc.Trek, especially DS9, is a perfect example.It had it's highlights - everything else is irrelevant.I said it before and repeat it now - don't ever expect more from a TV series.If you need guaranteed quality - watch a good movie or read a good book.
Oh,and about Trek being dead - I recently came across a website created by Russian Star Trek fans.THERE WAS NO TREK ON TV IN RUSSIA,EVER!I've lived abroad for a few years and know TOS,TNG,DS9 and Voyager.People writing for that site only seen the 9 Trek movies and red some translated Original Series novelisations.Not the Trek's finest but,apparently,that was enough to create an interest.I might add that despite my country being in deep s...t politically ,it's more than OK culturally.It's not often our viewers take US TV offerings seriously.The only other example is Babylon 5.So,I don't think a "dead" TV show can prompt people to start searching the web for information on TOS,TNG,DS9 and Voy and organising campaigns to attract attention of local TV companies. -
First off, I'd like to say that I do like both trek(except voyager), and babylon 5. Though I am not impressed with treks current direction, I think the focus of the two is diffrent. Trek is single episodes that explore moral themes, babylon 5 is a continuting saga.
To berserker, you assumed a few things about me, on a prevois talkback, I would like to clarify here. First off, I didn't like B5's fifth season, I think the fourth season was the best, with the exception of the final ep. You say I hate trek, but actually, I liket he orginal series, next generation, and deep space 9(though I haven't recieved it for the past few years.) What I am disgusted with is voyager and the direction the frachise seems to be taking. There is a major difference. All I was saying is that if paramount isn't willing to bring in new writers and try to do something different, it may be best to put it to rest now, before it gets really bad.
Well, since I dont' get DS9, I won't be able to see the final ep, which really sucks. Maybe scif will pick it up someday. -
I can't believe the amount of energy some of you put into bashing Trek. If you hate it so much, why do you watch it? Shatner said get a life, I say get a clue, if you don't like it then let it go and grow the hell up.
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As for the Trek/B5/X-files defenders... If you felt that "your" shows where as good as you claim you wouldn't be as defensive when you're particular relig- sorry "TV show" was threatened by some more than well deserved critisism. As for "Cheers", DS9 ans the Simpsons being the "perfect" examples of each of their particular niches... I don't think so. Cheers may have been decent TV viewing but the perfect sitcom? What about Mary Tyler Moore? The Honeymooners? I love Lucy? How about MASH? (my favorite) As for DS9, I very rarely comment SPECIFICALLY about it but I will admit that it has been the most consistent Trek. TOS was ALL over the place, City on the Edge of Forever MAY be the best single *on screen* sci-fi EVER, while spocks brain MAY have been the worst. TNG was kinda stale and preachy, and rarely really dared *anything*. Voyager is the story of Leftie and his close friend Rightie (who I still think should be nominated for emmys). DS9 had a decent season and a half, but can HARDLY be called perfect, or even *the best*. Trek has NEVER strived to be *the best*, they've always strived to satisfy the Lowest common denominator (a la Walker Texas Ranger). As for The Simpsons, I agree that for a while (the 3 seasons leading up to "Who killed Mister Burns") was great, but recently has begun to simply run out of things for Homer & co. to screw up at. The fact is that many of you are relishing at being *fans* which I may remind you is short for *fanatiks*. You are the Sci-fi equivalent of Religious fundamentalists, the very antithesis of what sci-fi has stood for for centuries...
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I've got some bad news for you:
1. Based on ratings, Trek is more popular than B5.
2. A large percentage of B5 viewers are Trek viewers too.
3. In order for Crusade to pull in enough viewers to keep it alive, it has to win as substantial an audience as possible, and that's going to have to include a lot of Trek fans. -
I don't know about season 7's allusions to the Battle of Alamo but,from what I red about the event,something very similar happens on this forum.Star Trek fans are being besieged by a superior antagonist (a bunch of rude persons with nothing better to do than criticize Trek).And ther's not much hope for victory in the debate for Trek fans because you can't fight aggressive stupidity.You can only ignore it. -
I agree wholeheartedly with Griffen3. Star Trek, Babylon 5,Star Wars, and The X-Files are the main players in the sci-fi realm right now for a simple reason: They do it best. Of these four I think STar Trek does it better then anyone, but that is not to discount the other three. They are damn good too. I think what we are seeing here is a combo of many factors. First we have the DIE HARD TREK FANS who hate ANYTHING but STar Trek. They are going to bash Star Wars, and B5 at EVERY oppertunity. Likewise we have the fanatical B5 fans and fanatical Star Wars fans who do the same thing. These people are FOOLS. They are doinf something VERY stupid. If I don't like ER I dont watch ER, but Im not in an ER forum telling everyone ER sucks and Chicago Hope rules. Thats just plain dumb. ALSO, I think we have a backlash against Trek because A) People resent success. I don't exactly understand why that is but history has shown it to be true. Time and again if a movie/show becomes successful there is someone shouting how much it sucks. and B)Trek is 30 years old and has been airing continuously since 87 without a rest. I think some of it has less to do with the quality of the shows they are producing and more with peoples attention span. It's hard to keep the avarage viewer's interest for 11 years. No one can say say for a second that DS9 has been a failure though. & seasons. Most of its run it was the number one hour long syndicated Drama on TV. It lost the number one spot to Hercules and Xena a couple of times but it since has regained the top spot. This show has been a HIT. When the DS9 crew takes to the big screen (as Berman indicated they would after the last Generation film) the TV show will probobly be "rediscovered" by those who havent been watching. I'm looking forward to the final episode. We have been watching the story of Sisko and company for seven years and our big payoff, the final chapter, is coming soon.
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Why does Berserker criticize B5 in the B5 talkback, but praises DS9 in the DS9 talkback? Inquiring minds want to know...
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they just haven't given me a reason in the last 8 years. I used to consider myself a Trekkie but drifted away the 80's. It's sad that I feel this way about a story I used to love and I want to enjoy it again and I check out an episode every couple of months, but MAN, it just is plain BORING BORING BORING!!! Not that all the Next Gen and Classic Trek was pure gold by any stretch of the imagination, but a good chunk of it was entertaining. Oh well, life goes on...
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I hate to go into a place like this, and see people bashing the topic! If you don't like the topic, then why did you waste your time coming in here to begin with? You just wasted your own time, and our time for having to read your shithead remarks!
I like Star Trek, and I think DS9 was the best trek series of all! If you disagree, great. The world if full of people with different opinions. You don't have to like it, but I do.
But, if you don't like it...stay out! Don't act like an asshole to those who do, you stupid fuckheads! -
I don't like to post messages; but I feel that this is worth the irritation. The entire B5/DS9/sci-fi in general debate is pathetic. Everyone has different tastes, and you can't, for example, say a show is more popular or better based on ratings. Yea, Star Trek MAY have better ratings than B5, but ST has how many shows, and has been around for HOW long? And why can't (most of) you people be fans of two or more shows? If we're talking about ratings as popularity or quality, then ALL of your shows must be bad beacuse Doctor Who was on for almost 27 years, played almost everywhere in the world, and still (sorta) carries on! I'm a fan of B5, Star Trek, Doctor Who and then some, why don't you crucify me for having a variety of interests? You're entitled to your opinions, but you don't have to show them with pathetic comment mostly consisting of shit, suck, etc etc...there is NO "perfect show"-they all have thier flaws and most have very strong points. ST:DS9-models may look better, or thier CG is better, but hey-look at how little CG there is! No wonder it's better! B5:CG may not be AS good, but they can do more, with more, and when did you see so much on Trek with models? Dr. Who: great stories, wonderful characters, originality, but REALLY cheap effects and budget...opinions are opinions, not facts. At least DEBATE it like civilized people, not peck at each other like little children. Thanks to those who can act like adults.
-Kevin Clark -
Well,animosity is part of human nature.This forum is a perfect example of that.Star Trek still tries to depict a future where people rose above this instinct.And does that in a believable fashion.This alone makes the show unique.
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...and was a fan of TOS, TNG, DS9, and yes, even VOY at one time. As such, as a loyal fan, I can say any comment good OR bad. And I happen to think the last 2 years of DS9 were bad. :( That's all I have to say about that...
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"Star Trek" is one of those that will NEVER die.
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"Star Trek" is one of those that will NEVER die.
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To the moron who doesn't want any negative things said about Star Trek (or anything else for that matter). Lemme Explain something to ya, Kid, and I am assuming you ARE a kid, If you're not I wouldn't go around advertising the Fact. This is a discussion Forum, NOT A STAR TREK convention, we come here to discuss AND disagree. If everyone was like *you* and you're ilk, and said "Don't complain", "Be happy with what they give you", we would all be watching season after season after season of crappy pointless sitcoms, ridiculous and exploitive talk shows, and endless and progressively bad spin offs of 60s Sci-fi shows that werent THAT great to begin with... wait a minute...
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funny thing about everyone canning DS9 and voyager is that you would think that ST TOS was great TV all of the time. Lets face it a lot of the TOS episodes were pretty average at best.
with the risk of sounding sacreligious, may I remind people that its just TV. its just a diversion from real life.
if your getting this excited about canning these entertaining shows then you are watching too much TV.
in the words of william shatner in a snl send up of trek conventions, for god sake get a life.
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I agree trek is getting crappy. How about they kill off voyager and DS9 and make a Klingon show??? They could make it about Alexander's (If he's not a whiny brat) station aboard a ship patroling the Cardassian boarder. I'd rather watch a medicore show about Klingons than any voyager or 7th season of DS9.
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I read somewhere in the list of shit that I ended up reading that someone was looking for another adult to post a decent reply, I'm 19. I'll admit (because I'd be lying if I wasnt) that this season has had a pretty hard fall, alot of the episodes this season have been absolute crap (the baseball, nogs vegas vacation and all the vic fontaine stuff), But what most of you are forgetting that DS9 is filled with many talented actors/actresses and the writers have got to be given credit. There have been some absolutlely amazing DS9 episodes in the past and last seasons finale and this seasons premiere were among them. I cant stand Voyager and TNG is entertaining sometimes for me but I would have to say that DS9 is the best of all them all, Instead of most of you whining about crap why cant you just hope for a great finale and a great ending to a great story.
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Star Trek is one of the very few US TV shows that tries to rise above business and be creative and controversial (DS9 especially).That's why there still are Trek fans.That's why some of them posted on this forum.They're excited about the conclusion of a good show.As for everything else that this list contains - it's just the result of desire to see one's words in print.
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1) javaCycle, i am sorry, but you are a misguided perv(this is NOT to be considerd a insult, it is just my personal opinion)
2) VOYAGER RULZ!!!!!!
3) DS9 SUCKS!!!!
GOT IT??
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